# Booing Carter



## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

I was wondering if you guys think that everytime Carter steps on the court at the Air Canada Center he'll get booed till his career is over?

Personally I think the boos are childish, and yes some people are angry that he didn't get his 100% at the end of is tenure in Toronto. But you also forget that he lead the Raptors to the playoffs, and he brought them to respectibility in the NBA. If he never been a Raptor, I have a feeling that the Raptors franchise would of been moved a long time ago.

Thoughts?


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

The real question is who's more childish? The crowd or Carter?


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

The only Raps fan that thinks logicly about Vince.


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

That's an easy one Deezy that would be the crowd, because it's obvious that they don't really know what Carter did for this franchise, because like I've mentioned before he brought them to respectibility, and he almost brought them to the Eastern Conference finals. I don't understand why they only remember his last season, and not his five years before that.


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## adhir1 (Dec 28, 2004)

Ka-Bosh said:


> That's an easy one Deezy that would be the crowd, because it's obvious that they don't really know what Carter did for this franchise, because like I've mentioned before he brought them to respectibility, and he almost brought them to the Eastern Conference finals. I don't understand why they only remember his last season, and not his five years before that.


bad deeds stand out...how many times do u hear about a good samaritan vs hearing about a murderer? Its human nature to assume the worst in someone...


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

Yeah, but this is basketball not Charles Manson. Yes he didn't play 100% during his last season with the Raptors, but he has moved on to another city, I believe it's time that the fans move on as well. He's not the only player to demand a trade, and not play 100% for a team. I know I won't change peoples mind here, and I am not trying to do so. I am just wondering if you guys think if the booing will stop any time soon?


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## Timbaland (Nov 18, 2005)

I gave up booing him awhile ago. I respect his game, but I don't respect his demeanor. He's just another player to me now, at the end of the day if the Raptors get the W, that's all that should matter. Toronto fans are notorious for their booing though, and I think it's a bit tired. The franchise is on the come up, let the past stay in the past.


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## adhir1 (Dec 28, 2004)

Ka-Bosh said:


> Yeah, but this is basketball not Charles Manson. Yes he didn't play 100% during his last season with the Raptors, but he has moved on to another city, I believe it's time that the fans move on as well. He's not the only player to demand a trade, and not play 100% for a team. I know I won't change peoples mind here, and I am not trying to do so. I am just wondering if you guys think if the booing will stop any time soon?


to answer ur question...no...its not gonna stop...people hate him...they loved him to an extent that..Carter was a GOD in this city. and he cheater on us.


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

Wow, sorry but your taking this a little to harsh, yes I agree he should of played 100% everytime he stepped on the court, but everytime i think about Vince Carter, I can only think of the good things, like bringing them to the playoffs for the first time,helping them winning their first playoffs series. The dunk contest gave the Raptors a lot of exposure. Winning rookie of the year, putting this team on a national network, and so many other great things.


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## Knick Killer (Jul 16, 2006)

I dont care what he did with his first years in Toronto...its all about his last couple years. He quit on the Raptors and the fans now quit on him. He deserves to be booed every city he goes to. He's a terrible role-model and brings down whatever team hes on.


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## Turkish Delight (Mar 17, 2004)

If he's an opponent and it's throwing off his game, why not? This is the NBA, not the first day of school where we all need to make friends.


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

I am not saying to like him, but why is he the only player that your booing, because if you want to throw all the superstars in a funk why not boo them all.

Also Knick Killer, I don't agree with you that he's a bad role-model because he has done a lot for charities in the past, especially in Toronto, so you have no right to say he's a role model.

And he doesn't bring teams down that he plays for he had good years with the Raptors, and good years with the Nets, and would have another one this year if everyone was active.


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

If he continues to do stupid things and act the way he did last night, then no, I don't think the booing will (or should) stop.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Sounds like sour grapes to me. You can't expect Carter to be well-received or forgotten.

I don't think the boos are childish. I think it requires a bit of perspective: these are men playing a game for a living. You can't take that too seriously or you wind up like some of the warped fanboys on this site and IRL.

Cheering for the home team is only half the fun.

I never understood the idea of booing _any_ former player, Mike James for example. But sometimes a harsh crowd reaction (Mourning in Jersey, Boozer in Cleveland, to name a few) is necessary. Its part of pro sports.

At the end of the day it isn't about the player in question, it is about supporting the home team.

And yes, Carter will always get booed.


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

Oh I dont mind the fans cheering, I think the Raptor crowd is one of the best in the NBA, and I love them, because they support this team in a lot of different ways.

No it's not sour grapes, and you brought a good example. Mike James, a lot of people here are saying that why are they booing him, well he did insult this franchise in a news conference when he joined the Timberwolves, so why are people saying not to boo him? If they boo Vince then they should boo every old Raptor that left the franchise. 

Carter didn't see the franchise going in the right direction with Babcock, and he was right so he demanded to be traded. If Colangelo was there instead of Babcock, then Carter would still be in a Raptor uniform.


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## Knick Killer (Jul 16, 2006)

Ka-Bosh said:


> I am not saying to like him, but why is he the only player that your booing, because if you want to throw all the superstars in a funk why not boo them all.
> 
> Also Knick Killer, I don't agree with you that he's a bad role-model because he has done a lot for charities in the past, especially in Toronto, so you have no right to say he's a role model.
> 
> And he doesn't bring teams down that he plays for he had good years with the Raptors, and good years with the Nets, and would have another one this year if everyone was active.




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Thats all i gotta say about that...and how doesnt he bring a team down? He whines...he quits...and chucks up horrible shots. Like seriously....i would never take this bum on my team.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Ka-Bosh said:


> Carter didn't see the franchise going in the right direction with Babcock, and he was right so he demanded to be traded. If Colangelo was there instead of Babcock, then Carter would still be in a Raptor uniform.


Revisionist history is not a good way to make a case.

June, 2004: Raptors hire Babcock
June, 2004: Raptors hire Mitchell
August, 2004: Carter asks to be traded
December, 2004: Carter traded

Carter made his public demand well after his private demand.

Carter did not bail based on Babcock--Rob had been on the job for less than a whole summer at the time. And Vince did not bail based on Mitchell--he hadn't played a regular season game for him yet.

In fact, Babcock was hired to build around Vince, not break the team up. That's why he wasn't traded that summer, when he first asked for it.


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## Junkyard Dog13 (Aug 9, 2003)

Leo just ripped Vc to Shreds.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

I think Toronto's hate of Vince has a lot to do with Canada's hate of America. I totally agree if Vince wasnt on the Raps they would face the same fate as the Grizzlies they would be moved. Vince did not quit on you. You quit on Vince.


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## trick (Aug 23, 2002)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> I think Toronto's hate of Vince has a lot to do with Canada's hate of America. I totally agree if Vince wasnt on the Raps they would face the same fate as the Grizzlies they would be moved. Vince did not quit on you. You quit on Vince.


Vince is America...:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

This stuff is gold.


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## ATM (Jun 23, 2003)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> I think Toronto's hate of Vince has a lot to do with Canada's hate of America. I totally agree if Vince wasnt on the Raps they would face the same fate as the Grizzlies they would be moved. Vince did not quit on you. You quit on Vince.


How old were you when Vince played for the Raptors? 9? 10 maybe? You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

Vince is a little punk ***** that quit on his team and demanded a trade, and people have forgotten about the allegations that Vince tipped off other teams to Raptors plays (allegations made by players on the Sonics).


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## streetballa (Dec 5, 2006)

I actually enjoyed it when he was booed everytime he touched the ball. Oh and vincedunkedonzo2 we didn't quit on Vince, he quit on the team.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

Its pathetic I mean its like Rap fans are obsessed. Every detail of what he said how he said it what he did is pointed out. I mean somebody actually spent their money on a jersey which said Quitter on the back. The Raps quit on Vince because he did everything for him and thay gave him nothing. I garuntee without his ticket sales the franchise would have been sold just like Vancouver's.


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## trick (Aug 23, 2002)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> *Its pathetic I mean its like Rap fans are obsessed.* Every detail of what he said how he said it what he did is pointed out. I mean somebody actually spent their money on a jersey which said Quitter on the back. The Raps quit on Vince because he did everything for him and thay gave him nothing. I garuntee without his ticket sales the franchise would have been sold just like Vancouver's.


:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

It's funny because he's serious.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

You annoy me more and more. Please keep me out of your signature. And why do Raptors fans care about him. If I thought someone quit on me I wouldnt give them attention.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> You annoy me more and more. Please keep me out of your signature. And why do Raptors fans care about him. If I thought someone quit on me I wouldnt give them attention.


If that person came to your house a couple times a year you would.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

Yes but why make signs and repeat his quotes and by jerseys. Just say we hate Carter and Boo a little bit.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Because it's FUN. It's a GAME.

Seriously, dude. There are more meaningful things you could be whining about.


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## ABargnani (Dec 16, 2006)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> I think Toronto's hate of Vince has a lot to do with Canada's hate of America. I totally agree if Vince wasnt on the Raps they would face the same fate as the Grizzlies they would be moved. Vince did not quit on you. You quit on Vince.


lol, you got to be kidding me.. right?


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## Knick Killer (Jul 16, 2006)

speedythief said:


> Because it's FUN. It's a GAME.
> 
> Seriously, dude. There are more meaningful things you could be whining about.



edited. we don't need that. speedy.


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## anniebananerz (Jan 8, 2006)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> Yes but why make signs and repeat his quotes and by jerseys. Just say we hate Carter and Boo a little bit.


Geez. We're not buying his jerseys *now*. We bought his jerseys back when we didn't think that he would leave the team. In my case, I saved up money for a heckuva long time just to buy his jersey and before I knew it, he was traded. His jersey was bloody expensive and hey, you gotta get some use out of it, don't you? Taping "QUIT"ter on the back is so much better than throwing it out.

And since you suggested it, "I hate Carter".

Oh, and I booed a little bit during yesterday's game. :cheers:


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

As much as I dislike Carter, I think it's probably time we stop booing him that harshly. It's not that we should forgive him, it's just that he's had karma bite him in the rear already. You know, playing for a lottery team and all and about to get traded again. Come to think of it, if Carter gets moved to Orlando, will the Nets fans boo him? I'm pretty sure they will, that makes 2 cities that will hate VC

Hate America? lol, I thought I have seen all of the retarded things you wrote already, but I was wrong. The next thing you know you will be saying Toronto hates Vince because he's black, or not black enough, maybe half-half.

Do you even know where Vancouver is? You were like what, 7 when the Grizzlies left Vancouver? Don't talk about things you have no idea about.


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

by the way, for all the mods reading this, please don't remove that Nets kid from posting here. He has become one of the things I look forward to when I come home from work. I haven't seen a funnier poster in months.


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## lucky777s (Nov 13, 2003)

You boo him to remind him what a weak loser he really is.

You boo him to let him know how selfish a person he really is.

You boo him to say we should have just taken Antawn Jamison and stuck with him. Built the team a little slower and not been forced into cap hell by signing the guys VC and his mom wanted. Vince stunk it up in both playoff series versus the Knicks. His teammates dragged him into the second round that year and he responded with the 'graduation day' scandal. Those Raptor teams were loaded with veteran talent and leaders. Lots of other scorers would have looked great in his spot.

These 2 games each year in Toronto are his reality check. The only thing he has ever won is a dunk contest. No scoring titles, no first team all-nba honors, no playoff success. And as soon as he won that slam dunk title he coasted. He chose celebrity over greatness and decided he didn't have to work on his game anymore. Well now he is 30 and his best years are behind him. He could have been one of the best ever but decided it wasn't worth the effort. Even his marriage was a total failure and he didnt' tough it out for very long. The easy way is the only way for VC.

He took the max contract and gave us nothing in return after that. He milked this city for everything it was worth.

Rarely do you see a player at the height of his success being called out by teammates for not stepping up. Oakley had to do it routinely with Vince. Players around the league began laughing at how soft a player he was. When he was put on the market nobody stepped up with a decent offer. And even now, when he is again available and playing harder no team is going nuts trying to land this guy. Not like when Kobe or TMac were available and teams lined up with offers.

Did anyone see the statue ceremony last week? Vince was all in tears saying 'you didn't have to do this'. Uhhh, yeah they did Vince. Your mommy made it a condition of the donation and had the thing made herself.

He needs this reality check. Keep booing.


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## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> I think Toronto's hate of Vince has a lot to do with Canada's hate of America. I totally agree if Vince wasnt on the Raps they would face the same fate as the Grizzlies they would be moved. Vince did not quit on you. You quit on Vince.


:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


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## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

lucky777s said:


> You boo him to remind him what a weak loser he really is.
> 
> You boo him to let him know how selfish a person he really is.
> 
> ...


Excellent post. Repped.


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> Yes but why make signs and repeat his quotes and by jerseys


because we can


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> I think Toronto's hate of Vince has a lot to do with Canada's hate of America. I totally agree if Vince wasnt on the Raps they would face the same fate as the Grizzlies they would be moved. Vince did not quit on you. You quit on Vince.


If one hates America does it mean they hate New Jersey? Don't most Americans consider New Jersey a laughingstock and not really consider it a part of the US anyway.


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## streetballa (Dec 5, 2006)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> I think Toronto's hate of Vince has a lot to do with Canada's hate of America. I totally agree if Vince wasnt on the Raps they would face the same fate as the Grizzlies they would be moved. Vince did not quit on you. You quit on Vince.


:chill: You are just mad because we are 5 games over .500 and ahead in the division, and please stay out of the raptors forum.


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

lucky777s said:


> You boo him to remind him what a weak loser he really is.
> 
> You boo him to let him know how selfish a person he really is.
> 
> ...


This should be the post used in every Carter agrument regarding his time with the Raps from now on. Keep this one bookmarked kids, it'll save a lot of time in the future.


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## flushingflash (Jan 4, 2006)

Junkyard Dog13 said:


> Leo just ripped Vc to Shreds.



so much for being a neutral commentator.personally i loved it. i can forgive t-mac, but i cant forgive vince. if he wanted out(thats fine) but quitting is inxcusable.


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## Benis007 (May 23, 2005)

booing of carter will never stop. ever.

i wouldn't trade anyone on this roster for vince carter, salary match or not.

guy is a loser drama queen. have fun with the bobcats vince.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

Can't say i'm usually a fan of booing but it has really grown on me in the case of Carter. 

We were forced to trade Vince Carter for peanuts and as a franchise we've still won out. We have the superior team, the superior franchise. We've got far superior character and work ethic and chemistry than we ever had with Vince. 

The booing is all part of the fun. We all know that the more noise you (as a spectator) and the crowd make, the better the experience. It sets the scene for drama or even comedy. It can potentially get in a player's head or make them elevate their game. 

In the case of Vince, it lets him know he's a *****. And that's important. There needs to be some kind of penalty for treason. You don't give up on any team but you most certainly don't give up on OUR team.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

First of all, what have I said that is inccorect about the Grizzlies. My age is irrelivent, they were just like Toronto horrible at drafting and signing. The NBA decided to give Canada two franchises. One failed whilet he other one made it beacause they wanted see who, Vince Carter. I cannot think of one good draft pick Toronto has had. Vince was drafted by GS then traded for Jamison and money. Bosh was taken over Wade.
And why is Jersey the laughing stock of America? It was an original colony. It has produced the light bulb. Shaq was from Jersey. The corn you eat is from Jersey. Jersy is next to NY so many tourists come here. Jersey has produced many celeberties. 
Without Vince you would have no fans, and probably would move to Vegas or something. Vince has never had succes because he is stuck in bad situations. Toronto had a lot of bad signings and drafting. If Toronto really "let Vince choose who he wanted" they are foolish for not letting the pros handle it. Jersey has been hit with injuries even last year, when we had no bench RJ got injured at a crucial time. 
Vince has had no scoring titles because he is not as good as Kobe or as selfish as Kobe once was. And I hate it when people say Vince didnt work on his game. What you think he was sleeping while everyone attended mandatory workouts and practices? Vince has reached his potential. The only reason people say he didnt because of their stupid MJ comparsions. MJ had retired people were hungry for another player like him. Vince was a great dunker like him and came from Carolina like him. But sorry there will never be another MJ. 
Vince is having the best assist season of his career when some of his best players are out so calling him selfish is foolish. Vince will not leave NJ and when he doesnt I will bring these posts back up and laugh. 
Vince is not soft he drives a lot but you wouldnt know that cause you not the Net fan. He is a lot better than before, and again you speaking with ignorance. Lots of players get divorced including MJ. Nothing was offered because of the injuries, and bad labels you put on Vince. Again it was your own fault, you could have stayed with T Mac but you chose Vince over him. 
If Vince is so selfish why does he consistantly donate to charity. And the only reason your good now is because you actually got a GM. Last year we saw a 27 win season. Rarely do players ask their teamates to step up? WTF players ask other players to step it up all the time. Im sure his mother threatned to not make the donation because of the statue. The statue was a gift from his school who he has done so much for. This is a hateful post from a hateful Raptors fan.


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## streetballa (Dec 5, 2006)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> First of all what have I said that is inccorect about the Grizzlies. My age is irrelivent they were just like Toronto horrible at drafting and signing. I cannot think of one good draft pick Toronto has had. Vince was drafted by GS then traded for Jamison and money. Bosh was taken over Wade. And why is Jersey the laughing stock of America? It was an original colony. It has produced the light bulb. Shaq was from Jersey. The corn you eat is from Jersey. Jersesy is next to NY so many tourists come here. Jersey has produced many celeberties. Wihout Vince you would have no fans and probably would move to Vegas or something. Vince has never had succes because he is stuck in bad situations. Toronto had a lot of bad signings and drafting. If Toronot really "let Vince choose who he wanted" they are foolish for not letting the pros handle it. Jersey has been hit with injuries even last year when we had no bench RJ got injured at a crucial time. Vince has had no scoring titles because he is not as good as Kobe or as selfish as Kobe once was. Vince is having the best assist season of his career when some of his best players are out so calling him selfish is foolish. Vince will not leave NJ and when he doesnt I will bring these posts back up and laugh. And the only reason your good now is because you actually got a GM. *Last year we saw a 26 win season*.


Actually last year was a 27 win season, so get your facts straight before you start posting.


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## streetballa (Dec 5, 2006)

lucky777s said:


> You boo him to remind him what a weak loser he really is.
> 
> You boo him to let him know how selfish a person he really is.
> 
> ...


This was the best post i have read in a while, you are repped!


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## ballocks (May 15, 2003)

the jeering of carter was so audible the last two times that i'm wondering if it _will_ ever stop. and i think it would be fascinating if it never _did_- would that be unprecedented? i don't know.

i mean, yes, t-mac's still booed whenever he comes to town, for example, but it doesn't have the same volume and/or passion. it's just a mumble of boos for the first few minutes, and then typically tunes out for the rest of the game. these games with carter have been different, though- he's been booed mercilessly throughout the games, _every_ time he's touched the ball.

can the people win this war? if the fans manage to sustain the same energy for the duration of vince's career, i think they will win it (or they'll think they will). it could be as soon as ~2 to 3 years down the road when i think vince could become petrified of returning to toronto: "because they still boo like crazy." i don't know how many athletes could handle that- let alone vince carter, a relatively weak and nostalgic personality (imo) who checked out of town on controversial terms. he'd probably have a tougher time than most having to constantly face reminders of past mistakes.

i don't expect it to last but if it does, that would be some story. it could set a precedent for the north american sports world, in general, and give recourse to a normally helpless fanbase in any similar situation: "boo him forever... don't ever let him forget." imagine a 40 year-old carter, coming off the bench for garbage mins with the orlando magic to a chorus of boos from the acc faithful. that would be incredible (not 'good' or 'bad'; just incredible).

peace


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## anniebananerz (Jan 8, 2006)

lucky777s said:


> You boo him to remind him what a weak loser he really is.
> 
> You boo him to let him know how selfish a person he really is.
> 
> ...


Total ownage right here! :cheers:

Repped!


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

Man this guy is obviously a Vince hater. Cant wait for more and more posts congatualting him of this nonsense.


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## Junkyard Dog13 (Aug 9, 2003)

way to go 777 awsome post I wish a Oak like player could still be here.
Bosh made it very clear to Bargs of what he needs to do and Bargs has responded well but still quite raw.

I think the player who wanted to be not named responding to Carter's reaction to the crowd who said it just adds more fire to the riverly was Mo can anyone confirm?.


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## RC06 (Jan 30, 2007)

lucky777s said:


> You boo him to remind him what a weak loser he really is.
> 
> You boo him to let him know how selfish a person he really is.
> 
> ...


Awesome post bro. That's one of the truest **** ever written. Repped.

:cheers: 



vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> Cant wait for more and more posts congatualting him of this nonsense.


What now? :kissmy:


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

lucky777s said:


> You boo him to remind him what a weak loser he really is.
> 
> You boo him to let him know how selfish a person he really is.
> 
> ...


Vince didn’t have much success in his first playoff series I agree, but he did have a good series the next time they faced the Knicks. I wouldn’t say that his teammates carried the team to a playoff victory. If he got injured during the first game of the Knicks series, there’s no way that the Raptors would of won a game, they would of lost in three instead of winning in five.

Now you bring up the 76ers series, where Carter had a great series, in one game he had 50 points. Yes he did have the graduation scandal, but he played an awesome game during that day, and he just missed the last shot to win the game, and once again if he missed that series there’s no way that the Raptors would have been close to win that series. 

I wouldn’t say that he never won anything except a dunk competition because he did win two playoff series, and was one shot away to make the Eastern Conference finals. He won a lot of games for the Raptors to make those playoffs, and if they kept Antawn instead of Carter then they would of never had the same success that they had, and a lot of Vets wouldn’t of join the Raptors because they would still be at the bottom of the league, and those Vets would never want to play for Toronto because they would be one of the worst teams in the league.

What does his marriage have to do with anything he does on the court?

So when Carters contract was up, and he signed that max contract you guys were disappointed, and you wanted him to leave to free agency just like McGrady did? I think not, all of you were jumping in joy that he signed that contract. If any of you say otherwise are most likely lying?

I wouldn’t say that there was no team interested in Carter because during the off season, rumors were that the Sonics were offering Allen for Carter. It’s Babcock who said yes on the first call; he should have just done what Bird did with Artest. Wait till he gets a good deal, and then pull the trigger. 

What reality check are you talking about? 

He saw that the Raptors organization was going in the wrong direction, and he didn’t feel that Peddie made the wise choice of picking Babcock has GM, and he also wanted Igudola instead of Hoffa, and he was right there as well. So if they did listen to him which they should because he was the face of the franchise. If they did listen to him then he would still be wearing a Raptor uniform, and they would be one of the best teams in the NBA.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

The Iceman said:


> What now? :kissmy:


Wanna know my reaponse go to page 3 at the bottom. Good job Ka-Bosh for YOUR good post.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Ka-Bosh said:


> He saw that the Raptors organization was going in the wrong direction, and he didn’t feel that Peddie made the wise choice of picking Babcock has GM, and he also wanted Igudola instead of Hoffa, and he was right there as well. So if they did listen to him which they should because he was the face of the franchise. If they did listen to him then he would still be wearing a Raptor uniform, and they would be one of the best teams in the NBA.


Where do you come up with this stuff?

Carter wanted the Raptors to hire Dr. J to be general manager. Look at all the teams that have fallen over themselves since to hire Erving. Carter didn't know anything about Babcock (or the other candidates) and didn't say **** when he was hired.

Carter wanted Iguodala? Care to back that up?

Keep in mind Carter wanted to trade #4/Bosh for veteran help.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> First of all, what have I said that is inccorect about the Grizzlies. My age is irrelivent, they were just like Toronto horrible at drafting and signing. The NBA decided to give Canada two franchises. One failed whilet he other one made it beacause they wanted see who, Vince Carter. I cannot think of one good draft pick Toronto has had. Vince was drafted by GS then traded for Jamison and money. Bosh was taken over Wade.
> And why is Jersey the laughing stock of America? It was an original colony. It has produced the light bulb. Shaq was from Jersey. The corn you eat is from Jersey. Jersy is next to NY so many tourists come here. Jersey has produced many celeberties.
> Without Vince you would have no fans, and probably would move to Vegas or something. Vince has never had succes because he is stuck in bad situations. Toronto had a lot of bad signings and drafting. If Toronto really "let Vince choose who he wanted" they are foolish for not letting the pros handle it. Jersey has been hit with injuries even last year, when we had no bench RJ got injured at a crucial time.
> Vince has had no scoring titles because he is not as good as Kobe or as selfish as Kobe once was. And I hate it when people say Vince didnt work on his game. What you think he was sleeping while everyone attended mandatory workouts and practices? Vince has reached his potential. The only reason people say he didnt because of their stupid MJ comparsions. MJ had retired people were hungry for another player like him. Vince was a great dunker like him and came from Carolina like him. But sorry there will never be another MJ.
> ...


Here you go heres what I said.


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

Wow you calling yourself a Raptor fan, and you don't recall Carter saying that he wanted the Raptors to draft Iguodola, I don't have any documents proving it, but hopefully someone can back me up that knows a little bit about the Raptors, because I am not making this up.

No he didn't say anything when he got hired, I recall him saying I want to be traded, I don't think that's keeping his mouth shut. 

Also yes he wanted Dr. J has the GM, and I not sure about this, but I don't think he could of done worst then 
Babcock.

Yes Carter to trade the pick for Vet help, but can you blame him, he thought he was a couple of pieces away from doing something good with the Raptors, he didn't think this team needed to rebuild.

Also I come up with this stuff by paying attention to the Raptors.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Ka-Bosh said:


> Wow you calling yourself a Raptor fan, and you don't recall Carter saying that he wanted the Raptors to draft Iguodola, I don't have any documents proving it, but hopefully someone can back me up that knows a little bit about the Raptors, because I am not making this up.


I feel so emancipated now. I'm not a fan, I don't pay attention. I can go out into the world and live my life.

I just went through about a hundred threads leading into the 04 draft and not only did Carter not have an opinion that was noted, most of the fans didn't know who they wanted, either.



> No he didn't say anything when he got hired, I recall him saying I want to be traded, I don't think that's keeping his mouth shut.
> 
> Also yes he wanted Dr. J has the GM, and I not sure about this, but I don't think he could of done worst then
> Babcock.
> ...


If you recall, when Vince was trying to steer the franchise in the summer of 04, one of the models he pointed to were the New York Knicks.

He was also a major proponent of signing guys like Milt Palacio and Shammond Williams.

And, of course, he was the biggest factor in the Raptors being handcuffed to Alvin and Jerome Williams and Hakeem Olajuwon, all signings he not only endorsed--but demanded by holding the team ransom. He refused to re-sign with Toronto otherwise.

As for Dr. J, he tried to flex his muscles a second time and force MLSE to hire Erving, who had/and still has no front office experience aside from a cosmetic role with the Magic one year. Little did Carter realize that he wasn't in a contract year and couldn't act as president/GM without the threat of leaving.

Here are some newspaper quotes for you (June 22nd, 2004):

*"I'm definitely committed to Toronto," Carter said. "That's why I'm here, to help them win, and hopefully Mr. Babcock can find some guys who are committed and ready to make a playoff push."*

And on the same day, this story was also printed...

*" According to league sources, Carter quietly has demanded a trade. The demand was made through Carter's representatives, although Carter likely reiterated his position personally when he accidentally ran into new Raptors general manager Rob Babcock at the Air Canada Centre last week.*

Carter's mouth has two sides and he speaks from both.

His public demand came one week after the draft, three weeks after Babcock's hiring. It was in the works privately beforehand. Nothing the Raptors did that summer--from hiring Babcock and Mitchell, to drafting Araujo and Bonner, and signing Alston--were of any importance. He had already made up his mind.

PS. Carter wanted Nash AND Magloire that summer as well. To him all it took was dollars to get it done.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

speedythief said:


> I feel so emancipated now. I'm not a fan, I don't pay attention. I can go out into the world and live my life.
> 
> I just went through about a hundred threads leading into the 04 draft and not only did Carter not have an opinion that was noted, most of the fans didn't know who they wanted, either.
> 
> ...


I refuse to believe Carter held the franchise ransom. Show me proofof this. If Carter "demanded signings" the Raps should not have agreed. Carter was commited to the team. Until he realized they wanted to rebuild. Probably thats when Carter found out and demanded a trade.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> I refuse to believe Carter held the franchise ransom. Show me proofof this. If Carter "demanded signings" the Raps should not have agreed. Carter was commited to the team. Until he realized they wanted to rebuild. Probably thats when Carter found out and demanded a trade.


Believe what you want. That part of my post was 0% speculation. It is common knowledge that Carter was willing to stay in Toronto only if that team was kept intact that summer.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> I refuse to believe Carter held the franchise ransom. Show me proofof this. If Carter "demanded signings" the Raps should not have agreed. Carter was commited to the team. Until he realized they wanted to rebuild. Probably thats when Carter found out and demanded a trade.


Here you go. Free education for you.

_*"This is the biggest decision of my career so far, and I just wanted to sleep well at night knowing I had given it the consideration it deserves," said Carter. "I love living in Toronto and being a Raptor so when it came down to actually making the decision, it wasn't very hard.

"A huge part of the decision for me was the direction of the team. 'Are we putting ourselves in a position to contend year after year?' With the job Glen did this summer, I think we've done that. It sends a message to the rest of the league, and I wanted to reinforce that message today.*_

http://www.nba.com/raptors/news/carter_release_010801.html?nav=ArticleList

The summer he is referring to is the recent re-signings of Davis, A-Williams, J-Williams, Bradley, and Olajuwon.


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

How can you say that Carter didn't have an opinion about the 2004 draft, your facts rely on the posters on these forums. Well I wouldn't rely on them to much, because none of them work for the front office, or know Carter personally. I am not saying that I know him because I don't but, I remember him saying in an interview that he wanted Igudola at the eight spot, and if I remember correctly Igudola played in his charity game that year. Does that mean anything? I believe it does in a way.

Also concerning the signings of Jerome Williams and Hakeem, don't tell me known of you were happy when you saw he resigned, or when Hakeem signed a contract with the team. The reason why he said that he wouldn't resign if he got those players is because the Raptors had a reputation of not keeping there stars. T-Mac, Stoudamire, Camby. So he knew that he had to scare them a bit. It might not be the right move, but it worked. Williams was a great player, he had passion for the game, and could of been a great point guard in this league if he stayed healthy. So all those signings where good at the time, they just didn't pan out.

Like I've mentioned before he didn't believe this franchise was going in the right direction, so he demanded a trade, and if you guys disagree with him, and you think the franchise was going in the right direction well your wrong, he drafted Hoffa, yes we needed a big man, and yes he put up the numbers in college, but lets be honest he wasn't suppose to be in the top 15. 

Erving didn't have to much experience in the head office, but Babcock didn't have experience in has a general manager either. So work in both ways for that situation.


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## narrator (Feb 11, 2006)

Raptors fans should boo Carter forever. Or at least until he retires. And maybe if you see him in his Orlando gated community on vacation, boo him there, too. Just for fun.

I agree with the notion that McGrady can be, if not forgiven, at least treated like any other opposing player. But not Carter. Carter is, as mentioned, a whiner and a quitter. And that's that with that.

Keep booing Raptors fans. Boo loud and long.


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## streetballa (Dec 5, 2006)

I dislike vince carter!


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## narrator (Feb 11, 2006)

Ka-Bosh said:


> Like I've mentioned before he didn't believe this franchise was going in the right direction, so he demanded a trade, and if you guys disagree with him, and you think the franchise was going in the right direction well your wrong, he drafted Hoffa, yes we needed a big man, and yes he put up the numbers in college, but lets be honest he wasn't suppose to be in the top 15.
> 
> Erving didn't have to much experience in the head office, but Babcock didn't have experience in has a general manager either. So work in both ways for that situation.


Nobody forced Carter to take the contract. He could have played out the last year of his rookie deal (if I recall correctly) and signed later. Instead, Carter took the max contract and ran. With that contract, he became the face of the franchise. There are responsibilities and one of those responsibilities is asking for team improvement. Another is playing through the lean times. But he wouldn't do that. Instead, he showed himself to be a greedy, childish whiner. And for that, he'll be booed for the rest of his career. And he brought it on himself. He can't handle responsibility. He wants to be paid like the Man but he doesn't want the responsibility of being the Man. He's a second fiddle. He's nothing more than a mercenary without passion. Give me Bosh and Calderon, both of whom exhibit pride and passion and responsibility, any day of the week. Carter will never win a championship. And that thought makes me happy.

None of us fans abandoned the Raptors during the lean years. Sure, we complained and griped and moaned but we never abandoned the franchise. And now we have a team on the rise without Carter the quitter. And that makes me happy, too.


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## Babe Ruth (Dec 6, 2006)

How do you know that Vince Carter will never win a Championship? 

Also yes I totally agree with you that he should taken resposibility of being the face of the franchise, but at the end of is tenure with the Raptors he didn't really have anyone to help him out to do so. Yes he had Chris Bosh but he was still a young player, and Mo Pete is very consistent, and in six years he had four coaches I believe how can you build a team, if you have a different system and coach every year? It's not possible. 

Wow saying that you rather have Calderon over Carter is pretty bad, don't get me wrong I love Calderon he's a great player, but come on choosing him over Carter is just ridiculous.

Streetballa, that's all nice that you hate Vince, but can you say why you hate him?


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

WTF the quote you just gave me said he wasnt sure in the derection the team was going in. This means he didnt know if the team was going to make smart descisions and if they wanted him. Carter tried to be the face of the franchise but thats just not who he can be. Carter possibly didnt know what came with this title. Still I agree he should have put more thought into this. Carter is not a second fiddle he can be a main scoring option just has a problem with being a leader. Carter was supposedly one of the best playrs in the leaugue he could have easily signed with another franchise for the max. He chose to be loyal to the Raps. Thats why he isnt commenting on NJ. He doesnt wanna make the same mistake twice. He obviusly realized the Raps were rebuilding and he was stuck in this contract he signed. You cannot be the man and still make a lot of money. Is Shaq the face of Miami's franchise no but is he paid the most yes! Toronto would not have a franchise if not for Vince its blatintly obvious. As for VC haters I know they will always exist. In reference I turn to a quote posted by our own Shaq-Deisel "A true sign of greatness is when people start hating you. If he wasn't great, you wouldn't hate."


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

I Love #4!


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

No sound on my computer what did he say?


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## swurv (Feb 26, 2005)

As a Toronto fan, i hope we keep booing Carter forever. Its good for a team to know you got their back and if the players play hard, they will get love back (JYD) 

And whats wrong with building a rep as a nasty fanbase?, every time I hear about philly fans I am kinda envious WE can't be as passionate. I think its just awesome, and funny too.


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## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> Man this guy is obviously a Vince hater.


Lol, no ****. Most of us are.


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

Ka-Bosh said:


> Also concerning the signings of Jerome Williams and Hakeem, don't tell me known of you were happy when you saw he resigned, or when Hakeem signed a contract with the team. The reason why he said that he wouldn't resign if he got those players is because the Raptors had a reputation of not keeping there stars. *T-Mac, Stoudamire, Camby *. So he knew that he had to scare them a bit.


1/3... not too credible


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> "A true sign of greatness is when people start hating you. If he wasn't great, you wouldn't hate."


But your not great???


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## anniebananerz (Jan 8, 2006)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> "A true sign of greatness is when people start hating you. If he wasn't great, you wouldn't hate."


So George Bush is now great?

Well that's news to me.


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## trick (Aug 23, 2002)

Shaq is obviously one smart mofo.


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## vincedunkedonzo2 (Jan 29, 2007)

I never said I was great I said Vince was great. I mean of course in basketball.


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## narrator (Feb 11, 2006)

Ka-Bosh said:


> How do you know that Vince Carter will never win a Championship?


Karma. She be a motherf-----.



Ka-Bosh said:


> Also yes I totally agree with you that he should taken resposibility of being the face of the franchise, but at the end of is tenure with the Raptors he didn't really have anyone to help him out to do so. Yes he had Chris Bosh but he was still a young player, and Mo Pete is very consistent, and in six years he had four coaches I believe how can you build a team, if you have a different system and coach every year? It's not possible.


If you're the man, you ask for changes. You don't quit. The Man doesn't quit. He had 4 coaches in 6 years? Then he should have waited and signed the contract after he knew which way the wind was blowing, so to speak. But instead he took the money. He's got nobody to blame but himself for that. And maybe his overbearing mother.


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## narrator (Feb 11, 2006)

vincedunkedonzo2 said:


> WTF the quote you just gave me said he wasnt sure in the derection the team was going in. This means he didnt know if the team was going to make smart descisions and if they wanted him. *Carter tried to be the face of the franchise but thats just not who he can be. Carter possibly didnt know what came with this title. Still I agree he should have put more thought into this. Carter is not a second fiddle he can be a main scoring option just has a problem with being a leader. Carter was supposedly one of the best playrs in the leaugue he could have easily signed with another franchise for the max. He chose to be loyal to the Raps.* Thats why he isnt commenting on NJ. He doesnt wanna make the same mistake twice. He obviusly realized the Raps were rebuilding and he was stuck in this contract he signed. You cannot be the man and still make a lot of money. Is Shaq the face of Miami's franchise no but is he paid the most yes! Toronto would not have a franchise if not for Vince its blatintly obvious. As for VC haters I know they will always exist. In reference I turn to a quote posted by our own Shaq-Deisel "A true sign of greatness is when people start hating you. If he wasn't great, you wouldn't hate."


And then he abandoned the Raptors. Thank you ever so much for agreeing with me.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

I think everything has been said, here.


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