# The Cavs have made JR Smith an offer. He turned down.



## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

What is the market value for JR?

http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2015/08/cleveland_cavaliers_having_ter.html

How often the teams give two max contract to one position (PF or other positions)?


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

Quite honestly, Cleveland doesn't even need him that badly after bringing Mo Williams on board and JR doesn't really have much in the way of other options. If Cleveland plays hardball they can probably get him back on a one-year deal in the range of the taxpayer MLE.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

This shouldn't surprise anyone. He made a big deal about how other teams were trying to sign him to big deals and he turned them down because he wanted to win. No one made him any offers, the guys a joke. New York wouldn't even take him back for free. That's saying something.


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## jayk009 (Aug 6, 2003)

JR Smith is a joke...

Another boneheaded move by him..He had a real chance to carve out a nice role on the team and show he can be a winner and then cash in next season with a nice extension...but of course he would mess that up...I hope he signs for the bi-annual this year...

JR Smith is probably a good candidiate to go broke after he retires...I know nothing about his financials but he seems to be really good at making many many bad decisions in a row.


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## jayk009 (Aug 6, 2003)

JR Smith is a joke...

Another boneheaded move by him..He had a real chance to carve out a nice role on the team and show he can be a winner and then cash in next season with a nice extension...but of course he would mess that up...I hope he signs for the bi-annual this year...

JR Smith is probably a good candidiate to go broke after he retires...I know nothing about his financials but he seems to be really good at making many many bad decisions in a row.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

He should sign with the 6ers and teach their young kids how to be men.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

I will never understand why Smith thought declining his player option was a good idea. He has no one to blame but himself for being in this situation. 



Bogg said:


> Quite honestly, Cleveland doesn't even need him that badly after bringing Mo Williams on board and JR doesn't really have much in the way of other options.


I wouldn't go that far. Mo Williams will give them a lot of offense but Smith could be useful as a body to have come off the bench at the SF position. I mean the only guys they have that can back up LeBron at that position are Jefferson and Jones. Jones is the only one who will be able to do much, having Smith be the guy to play back up for LeBron, even if he's out of position, is a big upgrade over Jones. 

What I'm saying is, Williams brings in a lot of offense off the bench but he doesn't make up for the other things Smith can offer.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

XxIrvingxX said:


> I wouldn't go that far. Mo Williams will give them a lot of offense but Smith could be useful as a body to have come off the bench at the SF position. I mean the only guys they have that can back up LeBron at that position are Jefferson and Jones. Jones is the only one who will be able to do much, having Smith be the guy to play back up for LeBron, even if he's out of position, is a big upgrade over Jones.
> 
> What I'm saying is, Williams brings in a lot of offense off the bench but he doesn't make up for the other things Smith can offer.


I'm not saying that Cleveland can't find a spot for him in the rotation, just that Williams offers a lot of the same "instant offense off the bench" value that Smith does, meaning that Cleveland doesn't _need_ Smith out there to carry the second string. If Smith sticks to a demand above what Cleveland's willing to pay then the Cavs could easily punt on him and look to pick (a likely more well-rounded) someone up at the trade deadline with the exceptions they have.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

JR Smith really should have played in the late-1970s, early 1980s NBA.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

jayk009 said:


> JR Smith is a joke...
> 
> Another boneheaded move by him..He had a real chance to carve out a nice role on the team and show he can be a winner and then cash in next season with a nice extension...but of course he would mess that up...I hope he signs for the bi-annual this year...
> 
> JR Smith is probably a good candidiate to go broke after he retires...I know nothing about his financials but he seems to be really good at making many many bad decisions in a row.


JR Smith has already gone broke while the checks were still coming in. I think his father went to the media urging him to opt into a one-year contract a few seasons back because he didn't have any money.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

Bogg said:


> I'm not saying that Cleveland can't find a spot for him in the rotation, just that Williams offers a lot of the same "instant offense off the bench" value that Smith does, meaning that Cleveland doesn't _need_ Smith out there to carry the second string. If Smith sticks to a demand above what Cleveland's willing to pay then the Cavs could easily punt on him and look to pick (a likely more well-rounded) someone up at the trade deadline with the exceptions they have.


I'm not saying he can't find a spot in the rotation, I just think his value in regards to being a guy who can fill the SG/SF spot means more to the team at this point than his offense. Considering the amount of playing time LeBron was forced to play last season, I think that's a huge need on the part of the Cavaliers, and Smith is a valuable player to have fill that need.

I mean, imagine having Williams and Smith out on the court with Love stretching out the offense. A scoring trio of those three along with Love's passing will help not make the Cavs look like a walking disaster when LeBron sits (this is assuming Blatt goes with having Love and in this case Mozgov out on the floor at the start of the second quarter like he did at the beginning of last year with Love and Varejao.


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## JT (Mar 1, 2004)

JR Smiffs tagline


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

XxIrvingxX said:


> I just think his value in regards to being a guy who can fill the SG/SF spot means more to the team at this point than his offense.


JR Smith's value _is_ his offense.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Bogg said:


> JR Smith's value _is_ his offense.


He literally brings nothing else. 

Spark plug offense with the perpetual threat of making a bad decision. That's JR Smith to a T.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

Bogg said:


> JR Smith's value _is_ his offense.


His offense is valuable, but he showed through out the season that he can be useful in other areas. And, hopefully, he won't have to be in a position where he's the second option for the Cavs offense.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

XxIrvingxX said:


> His offense is valuable, but he showed through out the season that he can be useful in other areas. And, hopefully, he won't have to be in a position where he's the second option for the Cavs offense.


I mean, I don't like doing the "everyone pile on Irwin" thing, but I just can't agree that Smith is a plus player anywhere other than scoring the ball. He's, at best, a reluctant defender who's only okay even when engaged and he's a top-flight "bad decisions with the ball" guy, so he's certainly not going to be playing point guard in the second unit. I wouldn't call him a veteran leader or a locker room glue guy. His value derives from going off for thirty and generally looking like an all-star twice a month, not from making hustle plays and smart defensive rotations. He's like Jamal Crawford - fantastic player when his shot's dropping, but doesn't bring much else to the table (and even then Crawford used to be able to play some point guard in a pinch).


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## JT (Mar 1, 2004)

I'll tell you this right now--if the Cavs re-sign him, they will not win the title.


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## Ma Baker (May 12, 2015)

Smith is an okay player, sometimes he never helps to the team and sometimes he become as the team leader but he should have accepted the offer because thats a good offer but of course he knew he was gonna sit on the bench and maybe be the sixth man or not so maybe thats why he turned it down because he wants to start in first five


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

KvnGates said:


> Smith is an okay player, sometimes he never helps to the team and sometimes he become as the team leader but he should have accepted the offer because thats a good offer but of course he knew he was gonna sit on the bench and maybe be the sixth man or not so maybe thats why he turned it down because he wants to start in first five


Good grief.


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## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

According to new york daily, it is massive pay cut. 

according to internet chatting, one year deal $3.5 million


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## Bubbles (Nov 12, 2005)

Per JR Smith's Instagram:


> Happy to say that I am returning to the Cavs! It’s been a long ride this summer but I can say for sure, well worth the wait. When I opted out of my contract, I wanted to understand the landscape of the NBA and where I fit best. The Cavaliers had things they needed to do in order to piece together a championship caliber roster. I ended up deciding that instead of potentially securing a larger deal elsewhere, I wanted to rejoin an incredible organization in pursuit of the ultimate goal, an NBA championship. Thank you to the Cavaliers for making this happen. Can’t wait to get started!


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## MojoPin (Oct 10, 2008)

There's no way he wrote that himself lol. At least he has hired a publicist, I suppose. Only smart thing he has ever done.


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## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

JR is already a Cav.

one year deal 5 million or 2 year deal 5 million?

Chris Haynes of the Cleveland Plain Dealer reported it's a two-year deal with $5 million being earned next season with a player option on the second year. Haynes also reported the deal included a no-trade clause.


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## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

JR's opt out is to win the championship, not for signing a long term contract. Reporters misunderstood.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

MojoPin said:


> There's no way he wrote that himself lol. At least he has hired a publicist, I suppose. Only smart thing he has ever done.


I can say with 100 percent confidence that was not written by Smith.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

I love that he keeps saying he could have made more elsewhere. No one wants Smith. The ****ing Knicks traded him away at a loss just to dump him. And anyone stupid enough to trade for him? They'd be immediately scared away after a face to face. Guys dumber than JaVale, who can't even land a job now.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

Bogg said:


> I mean, I don't like doing the "everyone pile on Irwin" thing, but I just can't agree that Smith is a plus player anywhere other than scoring the ball. He's, at best, a reluctant defender who's only okay even when engaged and he's a top-flight "bad decisions with the ball" guy, so he's certainly not going to be playing point guard in the second unit. I wouldn't call him a veteran leader or a locker room glue guy. His value derives from going off for thirty and generally looking like an all-star twice a month, not from making hustle plays and smart defensive rotations. He's like Jamal Crawford - fantastic player when his shot's dropping, but doesn't bring much else to the table (and even then Crawford used to be able to play some point guard in a pinch).


Maybe when he wasn't in Cleveland this was the case, but when he came to Cleveland I saw that he was capable of doing things well in other areas. Did he do it on a consistent basis? No, and I'm not saying he does. But there were definitely times where he made smart choices in terms of passing and made good plays defensively. But otherwise, he makes a lot of bad choices defensively and one of my biggest complaints about him is his tendency to get lost on defense.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

XxIrvingxX said:


> Maybe when he wasn't in Cleveland this was the case, but when he came to Cleveland I saw that he was capable of doing things well in other areas. Did he do it on a consistent basis? No, and I'm not saying he does. But there were definitely times where he made smart choices in terms of passing and made good plays defensively. But otherwise, he makes a lot of bad choices defensively and one of my biggest complaints about him is his tendency to get lost on defense.


So..... what exactly are you saying then? Other than this is yet again another Irwin back pedal post.


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## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

R-Star said:


> So..... what exactly are you saying then? Other than this is yet again another Irwin back pedal post.


"He's not a good defender, but he has value as a defender because this one time I saw him make a good defensive play. He's not a good passer, but this one time he made the right decision to pass the ball so he has value as a passer."


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## jayk009 (Aug 6, 2003)

One thing I can say is that when he was on the Cavs he did try on defense..It's just that he's too boneheaded and would often zone out and be caught in the wrong spot and out of position. Then there are the times where his low IQ really showed when he committed the worst fouls known to man kind. IMO that's something you can never fix, especially someone with a low IQ like Smith. 

Offensively he is useless when his streaky jumper is not on. Again, he is low IQ so he tries to "shoot his way" out of his slump and will take awful shots. 

He is simply a bonehead and is not what you would call a winning player. Like I've been always saying...If the Cavs win it will be in spite of him playing and not because he contributed. 

At this point of his career he is a lost cause...I have no faith in him.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

jayk009 said:


> One thing I can say is that when he was on the Cavs he did try on defense..It's just that he's too boneheaded and would often zone out and be caught in the wrong spot and out of position. Then there are the times where his low IQ really showed when he committed the worst fouls known to man kind. IMO that's something you can never fix, especially someone with a low IQ like Smith.
> 
> Offensively he is useless when his streaky jumper is not on. Again, he is low IQ so he tries to "shoot his way" out of his slump and will take awful shots.
> 
> ...


Agreed 100%. There were plenty of times on the Cavs where I thought "Wow, he's really trying out there." and he didn't look bad at all defensively. It's just too bad that he'd outweigh that with "What the **** is he thinking" type plays where it was clear his basketball IQ, and just IQ in general is brushing up against retardation. The guy just can't think out a play, and doesn't understand the fundamentals of the game. He'll purposely draw a foul for no reason on a play mid second quarter where the Cavs are already up 20. Like the guy just doesn't get it. 

But I agree, he did try last season, which is admirable. He just is so dumb that it almost does more harm than good when he's out there trying to make plays on either end of the floor. He's almost more useful when he plays brain dead chucker.


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## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

jayk009 said:


> One thing I can say is that when he was on the Cavs he did try on defense..It's just that he's too boneheaded and would often zone out and be caught in the wrong spot and out of position. Then there are the times where his low IQ really showed when he committed the worst fouls known to man kind. IMO that's something you can never fix, especially someone with a low IQ like Smith.
> 
> Offensively he is useless when his streaky jumper is not on. Again, he is low IQ so he tries to "shoot his way" out of his slump and will take awful shots.
> 
> ...


This is bad JR Smith.

Good J.R. He's shooting 39.5 percent from three. 
He was always solid as a role player with the Nuggets in the playoffs.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

R-Star said:


> Agreed 100%. There were plenty of times on the Cavs where I thought "Wow, he's really trying out there." and he didn't look bad at all defensively. It's just too bad that he'd outweigh that with "What the **** is he thinking" type plays where it was clear his basketball IQ, and just IQ in general is brushing up against retardation. The guy just can't think out a play, and doesn't understand the fundamentals of the game. He'll purposely draw a foul for no reason on a play mid second quarter where the Cavs are already up 20. Like the guy just doesn't get it.
> 
> But I agree, he did try last season, which is admirable. He just is so dumb that it almost does more harm than good when he's out there trying to make plays on either end of the floor. He's almost more useful when he plays brain dead chucker.


So you agree with him b...oh fuck it. It's not worth the effort.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

XxIrvingxX said:


> So you agree with him b...oh fuck it. It's not worth the effort.


No please, do elaborate. Because it's clear you don't even understand the post.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

R-Star said:


> No please, do elaborate. Because it's clear you don't even understand the post.


Thanks for the irony, because it seems you don't understand my post (I understood the post very much btw). Although I can't say I blame you given how vague I made it, I would change that, but again, you're not worth spending on time on having reasonable conversations with because you aren't a person who can be reasoned with. No matter how this goes, you'll still be an idiot in my eyes and I'll still be an idiot in your eyes, so what's the point of trying?


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

XxIrvingxX said:


> Thanks for the irony, because it seems you don't understand my post (I understood the post very much btw). Although I can't say I blame you given how vague I made it, I would change that, but again, you're not worth spending on time on having reasonable conversations with because you aren't a person who can be reasoned with. No matter how this goes, you'll still be an idiot in my eyes and I'll still be an idiot in your eyes, so what's the point of trying?


So every person who responded to your post saying you're an idiot didn't understand?

Also, please feel free to elaborate on how that would at all affect me saying I agreed 100% jayk009's post. His post said JR tried last year on both ends of the floor but was so stupid IQ wise that he hurt the team more often than not. 


You honestly just seem too dumb to understand what people are talking about. We used to kid glove you because it's mean to pick on someone who just isn't all that intelligent, and you seemed like a nice enough kid. But your recent act of strutting around like you're the smart guy on this forum has rubbed everyone the wrong way for long enough.


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