# Tim Duncan the greatest ever?



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

In his sixth season Tim Duncan is already 12th on the all time HOF monitor list, which combines MVP awards, efficiency and championships etc...

I will throw it out here, you guys discuss. Oh and did I mention he is a head of Shaq and Hakeem. The only recent players ahead of him are MJ and Karl Malone. 

http://www.basketballreference.com/leaders/leadershof.htm


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## n0body (Sep 22, 2003)

I guess I have two responses....

First I don't agree with the HOF formula...it's subjective....I mean any one of us could draw up a few categories, assign values to them, and rank players (which I'm sure a lot of us do).....that really doesn't lend any kind of credibility to the rankings we end up with....and more often than not, the manner in which we rank players corresponds directly to who we like better....it's basically just an attempt to inflate an opinion with statistics.

And that kinda leads into the second thing...which is what do you mean by greatest ever? The guy with the best stats in certain categories? The guy who's done the most for the game as a whole? The guy who's been on the most championship teams? The guy you enjoy watching the most? The guy with the best basketball skills? Or something else entirely?

In terms of pure basketball skill and talent, I'd definately say Tim Duncan is in a very elite group of players...at the same time I think it's jumping the gun a bit to even put him in the running for "greatest ever" after 6 seasons.

just my 2 cents


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## ToddMacCulloch11 (May 31, 2003)

He's gonna go down as one of the greats...but I'm still not sure about greatest ever. He's a great player, but I want to see what his over all career is like when its all done with. And most people would say that as of now, that either Wilt or MJ is the greatest player ever. And both of them change the way the game was played. Tim needs to do something big like that.


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## KokoTheMonkey (Aug 4, 2003)

Tim Duncan IMO would have to win at least a couple more championships, and a couple more MVP's to even be considered the greatest ever. He's already the best PF ever, but to say he is better than MJ is pushing it.


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

the hof monitor is biased against centers in that it's easier to be 1st team all-nba at g or f than at c. duncan's been 1st team every year of his career - he certainly wouldn't be if he was a center, and shaq/robinson/hakeem etc are penalized because they're competing amongst themselves for 1 spot. it's doesn't consider era, and competition in winning mvp. 

he has a LONG way to go before he's top 10 ever, imo. if he keeps up his pace, he'll probably get there, but he still has alot to do. he may be ahead of hakeem and shaq on the hof monitor, but he's not ahead of them as a player.


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## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

He could be the best ever, who knows. If he continus playinfg like this for another 10 or so years, he will go down as one of the best if not the best ever


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## Charlotte_______ (May 18, 2003)

Although Tim isn't the most enthusiastic player to watch, he is a top 3 on which I like to watch. 1. Tracy McGrady 2. Tim Duncan 3. Kevin Garnett. Rohawk i agree with you.


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## jsa (Jul 16, 2002)

Duncan is no Wilt, but he could move in the best PF slot ever before long. K. Malone has probably moved out Pettit easily by now, but duncan is coming on fast. Being considered as potentially the best at your position of all time is high honor enough.


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

coming from a spurs fan, i dont think he will ever be considered the greatest ever b/c he didnt change the game like magic or michael or wilt but i believe by the end of his career he will be a top 5 player of all time right behind wilt, michael, magic and maybe larry. he def will be best pf by the end of his career and imo he already arguably is. only one close is malone


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## Schottsie (Jun 25, 2003)

It is way too early to decide if he will be the best ever, but he is the best right now and had one of the best Finals performances ever last year (even considering the outmatched opponent)

Almost a quadruple-double in the Finals, and leading his team in every major statistical category. Legendary stuff-


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## Joker (Aug 7, 2002)

to early to tell. what if he gets in a serious injury ending his career... he'll b remembered as Larry Bird II. i doubt he'll be 12 in the HOF after then.


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Schottsie</b>!
> It is way too early to decide if he will be the best ever, but he is the best right now and had one of the best Finals performances ever last year (even considering the outmatched opponent)
> 
> Almost a quadruple-double in the Finals, and leading his team in every major statistical category. Legendary stuff-


certainly a great finals performance, but there've been many better.


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## johnston797 (May 29, 2002)

Interesting site, but that HOF evaluation was incredibably weighted towards being named MVP. This is a problem b/c the league has up periods and down periods. Certainly, when Bird and Magic were at their peak, it was harder to be MVP than now IMHO.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

If Duncan retired today, I believe hed be remember as a top 15 player of all time. If he plays the next 6 seasons with the same success as hes had so far, he'll be a top 5 player, MAYBE top 10 of all time.


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## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

Not yet...


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## Pistolballer (May 9, 2003)

Tim Duncan is good, very good, but I agree that we should wait til his career is done to rank, and compare him.

(and don't even compare him to Shaq, hes WAY above that walrus-swinging-his-elbows)


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## LakerMania (Aug 29, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Pistolballer</b>!
> Tim Duncan is good, very good, but I agree that we should wait til his career is done to rank, and compare him.
> 
> (and don't even compare him to Shaq, hes WAY above that walrus-swinging-his-elbows)


Please.  I agree Duncan had a good year and should be considered the best player as of right now. But no way in any form is his career as a whole above Shaqs. Crap, Shaq had just as good or better stats than Duncan his rookie year. Duncan did take a team to the championship by being the only superstar, but his team has also just been a mere pause between the true NBA dynastys in history. If he can beat this Laker team with all of it's talent by himself, he will be a lock in top 10 players of all-time, his legacy in one year will forever be secured even if he never played another game. If he doesn't, or even worse takes a first round exit, then people will come back to earth regarding his status among the greats.


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## jericho (Jul 12, 2002)

I think Duncan is on track to establish himself as one of the 50 greatest players of all time, but needs to continue on his current trajectory for another 3 years or so to really cement that status. He could end up in much more rarefied territory than that--maybe top 10. But that's an awfully select group. There are a lot of very accomplished players, some of whom really changed the game or whose game had no real peer, who probably don't belong in that group, like Julius Erving, Moses Malone, Isiah Thomas and John Stockton. 

Is Duncan going to end up being "better" than Chamberlain, Russell, Jordan, Magic, Kareem, Karl Malone, Oscar Robertson, Elgin Baylor, Hakeem Olajuwon, Larry Bird, or John Havlicek? Will he deserve mention in the same breath. Maaaaybe. Too early to tell. 

But arguments about what single player is "the best ever" never go anywhere, since it's such a subjective determination.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>LakerMania</b>!
> 
> 
> Please.  I agree Duncan had a good year and should be considered the best player as of right now. But no way in any form is his career as a whole above Shaqs. Crap, Shaq had just as good or better stats than Duncan his rookie year. Duncan did take a team to the championship by being the only superstar, but his team has also just been a mere pause between the true NBA dynastys in history. If he can beat this Laker team with all of it's talent by himself, he will be a lock in top 10 players of all-time, his legacy in one year will forever be secured even if he never played another game. If he doesn't, or even worse takes a first round exit, then people will come back to earth regarding his status among the greats.


Duncan's career has not measured up to Shaq's but he career after 6 season has. I'd say TD first six years in the league have been greater than Oneals first 6, without a doubt.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

Right now I think Duncan is one of the top 20 players of all time. If he wins a few more rings and MVPs then he MIGHT crack the top 10. Anyone who is saying he has a chance to be the best ever is really doing a disservice to all of the NBA greats. That list is damn near impossible to crack, especially the top 6-7, and I can't see Duncan ever making it. Sure, he has great stats and credentials but I don't think he dominates a game the way MJ, Wilt, Magic, or Bird did. I think Shaq has been a more dominant players over the last 5-6 years and he's not cracking the top 10. Duncan might not either.


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Pinball</b>!
> Right now I think Duncan is one of the top 20 players of all time. If he wins a few more rings and MVPs then he MIGHT crack the top 10. Anyone who is saying he has a chance to be the best ever is really doing a disservice to all of the NBA greats. That list is damn near impossible to crack, especially the top 6-7, and I can't see Duncan ever making it. Sure, he has great stats and credentials but I don't think he dominates a game the way MJ, Wilt, Magic, or Bird did. I think Shaq has been a more dominant players over the last 5-6 years and he's not cracking the top 10. Duncan might not either.


personally, i think shaq's top 10 (i've got him around 8). i've got west at 10 and hakeem at 9. duncan has a realistic chance at passing both if he continues to do win awards and championships. who knows how it will play out. right now duncan's on top. but not long ago he had question marks and kobe and shaq were rising up the ladder. it fluctuates at this point, with the limited time he's had in the league (still only 6 seasons). although he's certainly accomplished alot in that time.


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## The Ballatician PDM$ (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Duncan's career has not measured up to Shaq's but he career after 6 season has. I'd say TD first six years in the league have been greater than Oneals first 6, without a doubt.


I disagree with you on dat one family. You have to remember cuzzen. Shaquille O'Neal came into the NBA with HOF Center's playing near their prime or in their prime already (David Robinson,Hakeem,Ewing & Brad Daughtery who would have been in that group if it was not for injuries). Oh and there was guy named Michael Jordan who completely dominated the hoop world during that period. You still had Larry and Magic (Off & On) in the NBA. And even with all that..Shaquille O'Neal managed to take the Magic to the NBA Finals in his 3rd year!!! Think about that!! That is an amazing feat! They even knocked off Jordan's Bulls and Jordan openly admitted in a press conference at the end of game 7 that Shaquille O'Neal was the ONLY player ever who he felt intimidated by and would be the most unstopable player if his development continued (it did) Remember..Shaq made it to the Finals before David Robinson and a lot earlier than Hakeem or Patrick Ewing did (who played each other in the Finals the year prior) you think Timmy D could have taken his team to the Finals during that time? nope. You think he would have two MVP's? Nope! And with Karl Malone and Charles Barkely in their prime at the time..would he even be considered the best PF in the game?? Nope. Look...check Shaq's stats out and Timmy D's stats out. No Contest. Shaq in every category! Also..check the success he had and what players were in the NBA at the time. Shaq's Magic...could have taken out the Spurs team in 1999 and especially the one in 2003(that was the worst championship team I have ever witnessed.) and there would be no debate. Don't get my twisted playa. When it all goes down Timmy D will be a top 10 player all-time w/o question. But higher than Shaquille's--the most unstopable player in history? Nope. And I saw this one homeboy rant about Duncan's Finals performances. No doubt..He played EXCEPTIONAL!! But if you wanna take a look at what Shaq did in 2000,2001 and 2002..now that is SUREAL!! Damn..thse youngsters have a short memory. 

But yeah..peep game.


Chuuuuuch!


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## bender (Jul 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>The Ballatician PDM$</b>!
> I disagree with you on dat one family. You have to remember cuzzen. Shaquille O'Neal came into the NBA with HOF Center's playing near their prime or in their prime already (David Robinson,Hakeem,Ewing & Brad Daughtery who would have been in that group if it was not for injuries). Oh and there was guy named Michael Jordan who completely dominated the hoop world during that period. You still had Larry and Magic (Off & On) in the NBA. And even with all that..Shaquille O'Neal managed to take the Magic to the NBA Finals in his 3rd year!!! Think about that!! That is an amazing feat! They even knocked off Jordan's Bulls and Jordan openly admitted in a press conference at the end of game 7 that Shaquille O'Neal was the ONLY player ever who he felt intimidated by and would be the most unstopable player if his development continued (it did) Remember..Shaq made it to the Finals before David Robinson and a lot earlier than Hakeem or Patrick Ewing did (who played each other in the Finals the year prior) you think Timmy D could have taken his team to the Finals during that time? nope. You think he would have two MVP's? Nope! And with Karl Malone and Charles Barkely in their prime at the time..would he even be considered the best PF in the game?? Nope. Look...check Shaq's stats out and Timmy D's stats out. No Contest. Shaq in every category! Also..check the success he had and what players were in the NBA at the time. Shaq's Magic...could have taken out the Spurs team in 1999 and especially the one in 2003(that was the worst championship team I have ever witnessed.) and there would be no debate. Don't get my twisted playa. When it all goes down Timmy D will be a top 10 player all-time w/o question. But higher than Shaquille's--the most unstopable player in history? Nope. And I saw this one homeboy rant about Duncan's Finals performances. No doubt..He played EXCEPTIONAL!! But if you wanna take a look at what Shaq did in 2000,2001 and 2002..now that is SUREAL!! Damn..thse youngsters have a short memory.
> 
> But yeah..peep game.
> ...


I couldn't agree with you more!


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## Tom (Jul 15, 2002)

He is a top 10 player....the guy is a joy to watch and should be appreciated regardless of his lack of flair. His biggest detriment is
free throw shooting down the stretch,


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