# Trade for Rudy Fernandez!



## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

> Upset Fernandez has European suitorsComment Email Print Share By Chris Sheridan
> ESPN.com
> Archive
> Portland's pursuit of a certain player from Turkey has infuriated the Trail Blazers' lone remaining Spanish player, Rudy Fernandez, to the point where he'd prefer to play in Greece, Russia or even Spain again, ESPN.com learned Tuesday.
> ...


http://http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4300407


----------



## ChosenFEW (Jun 23, 2005)

those are some of the negatives when you have a lot of talent on your team. Players are bound to be unhappy with their roles


----------



## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

ChosenFEW said:


> those are some of the negatives when you have a lot of talent on your team. Players are bound to be unhappy with their roles


Their negatives can become our positives. Fernandez, in my opinion, is a starter in this league. The guy does everything well and has enough length, agility and grit to play both backcourt positions AND the SF spot. I want him on the Knicks but never though he'd be available. I think he'd be the kind of guy that can compliment anyone well.


----------



## knicksfan (Jan 4, 2003)

Yeah, I agree, I think Rudy would be a solid fit in Mike's system.


----------



## Gotham2krazy (Nov 22, 2005)

Who would we trade for?? Surely if we ask for Rudy, Blazers will want Lee, but will that work?


----------



## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

Gotham2krazy said:


> Who would we trade for?? Surely if we ask for Rudy, Blazers will want Lee, but will that work?


Sure it will. We could demand them give up Fernandez and one of their smallforwards (preferably Outlaw), the consequent trade exception from the difference in salaries and future draft picks. I think the Knicks can do better for Lee but it's a start.


----------



## Gotham2krazy (Nov 22, 2005)

TwinkieFoot said:


> Sure it will. We could demand them give up Fernandez and one of their smallforwards (preferably Outlaw), the consequent trade exception from the difference in salaries and future draft picks. I think the Knicks can do better for Lee but it's a start.


I'm definitely not opposed to this since it will allow New York to have cheap, good, young talent that have yet to hit contract years making it a great incentive for lebron to come sign with us


----------



## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

i think at this point this becomes a serious discussion.

lee for fernandez ...straight up.


----------



## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

Da Grinch said:


> i think at this point this becomes a serious discussion.
> 
> lee for fernandez ...straight up.


I think Lee is worth more than Fernandez and a trade exception. I'm not sure what else from Portland we can really use but I wouldn't be comfortable making that sort of deal straight up.


----------



## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

TwinkieFoot said:


> I think Lee is worth more than Fernandez and a trade exception. I'm not sure what else from Portland we can really use but I wouldn't be comfortable making that sort of deal straight up.


well then we probably differ on Lee's worth. i dont see him as a starter on a good team but a top 6th man for just about everyone...in d'antoni's system i could easily see fernandez as a starter. even on a good team.

also you have to consider rudy gets paid on the rookie scale for 3 more years...while lee is getting his new contract now.


----------



## alphaorange (Jul 2, 2006)

*I like Lee*

But I'm with Grinch all the way on this. I have seen Fernandez limited time but I think he can be a solid starter at the 2. Because of Lee's lack of defense, I think he will be (should be) a big minute bench player.


----------



## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

Gents, there is a big difference between a player's actual worth and his trade value. For example, expiring contracts attached to ****ty players get moved all the time for quasi all-star caliber players. Meanwhile, players with legitimate abilities to make an impact on a game ie Zach Randolph might be worth less in a trade than those expiring contracts. As much as Fernandez might be a bonafide starter at the 2 spot for us, I don't think he's worth a double-double big man that's still very young and still capable of improving some of the minor flaws in his game.


----------



## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

TwinkieFoot said:


> Gents, there is a big difference between a player's actual worth and his trade value. For example, expiring contracts attached to ****ty players get moved all the time for quasi all-star caliber players. Meanwhile, players with legitimate abilities to make an impact on a game ie Zach Randolph might be worth less in a trade than those expiring contracts. As much as Fernandez might be a bonafide starter at the 2 spot for us, I don't think he's worth a double-double big man that's still very young and still capable of improving some of the minor flaws in his game.




defense is not a minor flaw. The lack of acceptable defense is what prevents Lee from recieving his insane contract demand...if he defended on the level of lets say anderson V in cleve. he would have already have his 10-12 mil a season possibly more...but because his defense is usually like seen in the clip below he is a bench player on most teams ....if this were 2010 and he were a ufa i think he'd get his 10 mil. as a consolation prize to some team that missed out on the really big stars.

http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=1604

zach's main flaws are defense and selfishness...but on the knicks he was clearly a better player than lee and even so the grizzlies chose randolph at 17 mil over lee at a much lower price less than a month ago.

on a fully healthy knicks squad Lee might not even start, he could still but its not a definite ...Gallo could easily be better than him fully healthy at the 4 and so could curry at the 5...and if he is a quick study Hill too at either spot since his strengths are supposedly mirroring Lee's with better defense(although from his summer league display its not at all something I would bet on).


its all moot at this point anyway as miller has taken up the bulk of the blazers cap space ...and i for one believe it will go down as a mistake since he doesn't at all fit in with their style of play..although he is a very good player.


----------



## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

Da Grinch said:


> defense is not a minor flaw. The lack of acceptable defense is what prevents Lee from recieving his insane contract demand...if he defended on the level of lets say anderson V in cleve. he would have already have his 10-12 mil a season possibly more...but because his defense is usually like seen in the clip below he is a bench player on most teams ....if this were 2010 and he were a ufa i think he'd get his 10 mil. as a consolation prize to some team that missed out on the really big stars.
> 
> http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=1604
> 
> ...


The problem with Lee's defense I believe has a little to do with the fact that he's playing out of position. If you look closely at the clips you submitted me, there is more than meets the eye. Against Dwight Howard, a player both bigger and more athletic than himself, Lee was was forced to play him pretty close. Should he switch, the Knicks likely would not rotate to pick up Dwight and even if they could probably would not be able to stop him from dunking it. I guess it's sort of a pick your poison kind of deal. I also disagree with the "rollercoaster" comment made by the commentator of the clip. The league today is filled with ticky-tack fouls and given the Knicks lack of big man depth, Lee could not afford to be in foul trouble. As much as Lee might not be a good defender, I don't recall him being a bad man defender when he was playing the 4 in the past.

And about Miller, I think he's a better fit than you think. He has experience playing in both a halfcourt and uptempo system and has the ability to score with his back to the basket, a dimension the Blazers lack as a team. I also think the team has enough long distance shooters for Miller to operate, although at his age, I'm not sure how much longer he'll be the player we have come to know.


----------



## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

TwinkieFoot said:


> The problem with Lee's defense I believe has a little to do with the fact that he's playing out of position. If you look closely at the clips you submitted me, there is more than meets the eye. Against Dwight Howard, a player both bigger and more athletic than himself, Lee was was forced to play him pretty close. Should he switch, the Knicks likely would not rotate to pick up Dwight and even if they could probably would not be able to stop him from dunking it. I guess it's sort of a pick your poison kind of deal. I also disagree with the "rollercoaster" comment made by the commentator of the clip. The league today is filled with ticky-tack fouls and given the Knicks lack of big man depth, Lee could not afford to be in foul trouble. As much as Lee might not be a good defender, I don't recall him being a bad man defender when he was playing the 4 in the past.
> 
> And about Miller, I think he's a better fit than you think. He has experience playing in both a halfcourt and uptempo system and has the ability to score with his back to the basket, a dimension the Blazers lack as a team. I also think the team has enough long distance shooters for Miller to operate, although at his age, I'm not sure how much longer he'll be the player we have come to know.


it was lee's job to rotate plain and simple , its obvious why he didn't but if no one picked up howard its whomever was supposed to rotate over in that scheme's fault....not lee's, the rule is the same regardless of who is defnding the center spot whether its lee, curry, jeffries or whomever.

also there were some plays in which he did rotate and did little to prevent a basket also shown in the clip...which to me is just as damning.

the blazers actually play at the slowest pace in the nba , and the way they play their offense they basically get alot of 3's at the end of the shot clock ...my question is when teams start to leave miller open out there and his career 21% 3 point shot (28.3 last season), how good are they gonna be?

the incumbant pg steve blake shot 42.7 from deep...its an important part of their team , they shot 38.3 as a team from there.

if he comes inside after they swing it around he risks alot of 3 second calls...if he shoots it he will likely miss.

his playmaking, defense, and post up game may help but when they run their usual offense i see an issue. ...i think they would have been better off going after ben gordon....or leaving blake as the starter.


----------



## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

Da Grinch said:


> it was lee's job to rotate plain and simple , its obvious why he didn't but if no one picked up howard its whomever was supposed to rotate over in that scheme's fault....not lee's, the rule is the same regardless of who is defnding the center spot whether its lee, curry, jeffries or whomever.
> 
> also there were some plays in which he did rotate and did little to prevent a basket also shown in the clip...which to me is just as damning.
> 
> ...


It may be Lee's fault but when the matter rests more on his inability to trust his teammates on defense (a legitimate beef) than his own talents defensively, you have a completely different story. If I had to force Courtney Lee or Dwight Howard to make a layup, I'm letting Courtney take the shot since Howard is automatic from 5ft in (remember Lee missing that allyopp in the playoffs against the Lakers). And as I've said before, in the clips he did rotate he was put in a position where he could only really distract the shot at best from fear of fouling; as a result of a growing trend for referees to call ticky-tack fouls. I'm not saying that Lee is capable of stopping anybody. I am saying that I don't recall him being a hopeless defender before this season when he was defending players significantly bigger than he was.

I think the Blazers brought in Miller to help provide the team with quality shots. If that's his main agenda, he's going to be the facilitator in those final seconds and not the recipient. I also think he runs a team much more proficiently than a Steve Blake could, which would allow for better shots earlier in the shotclock. His shooting may be considered a concern but it has never really hampered his ability to improve teams throughout his entire career and I doubt that will be the case in Portland. Old age, however, may become a concern because he is going on 34 years old and not getting any younger.


----------



## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

TwinkieFoot said:


> It may be Lee's fault but when the matter rests more on his inability to trust his teammates on defense (a legitimate beef) than his own talents defensively, you have a completely different story. If I had to force Courtney Lee or Dwight Howard to make a layup, I'm letting Courtney take the shot since Howard is automatic from 5ft in (remember Lee missing that allyopp in the playoffs against the Lakers). And as I've said before, in the clips he did rotate he was put in a position where he could only really distract the shot at best from fear of fouling; as a result of a growing trend for referees to call ticky-tack fouls. I'm not saying that Lee is capable of stopping anybody. I am saying that I don't recall him being a hopeless defender before this season when he was defending players significantly bigger than he was.
> 
> I think the Blazers brought in Miller to help provide the team with quality shots. If that's his main agenda, he's going to be the facilitator in those final seconds and not the recipient. I also think he runs a team much more proficiently than a Steve Blake could, which would allow for better shots earlier in the shotclock. His shooting may be considered a concern but it has never really hampered his ability to improve teams throughout his entire career and I doubt that will be the case in Portland. Old age, however, may become a concern because he is going on 34 years old and not getting any younger.


be4 the season D.Lee was not a hopeless defender ...but he was far from a good one ...as his role on offense grew and his minutes increased , his defense got pretty bad, by the end of last season it was pretty obvious he was just awful....as the link showed.

D.Lee's lack of trust in his teammates is nothing new , curry usually didn't have it either in fact i remember him as a bull blaming his teammates saying he would rotate faster if he believed he was gonna get backed up sufficiently.

and just like lee he was wrong for not rotating or not getting there sooner, its not the center's as well as the power forward's job to let players drive the lane with impunity ...its actually the opposite they are supposed to have an impact down there by making opposing players miss and turn the ball over down their by providing a defensive presence .

the blazers actually led the league in offensive efficiency last season ...they get pretty good looks as it is , in fact maybe the best in the league, miller could strengthen that even further , but in my opinion its probably not worth it if can make the team worse just as easy.

http://www.knickerblogger.net/stats/2009/o_oe.htm


----------

