# Rudy Fernandez signs with Barcelona



## Blazer4ever (Feb 1, 2003)

It looks like RF has signed (or is about to sign) a 3 year deal with Barcelona in Spain.

I don't understand this move. If he's able to terminate his contract, why not sign with the Blazers?


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## Samuel (Jan 1, 2003)

He's still coming over next season.


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## Stepping Razor (Apr 24, 2004)

Samuel said:


> He's still coming over next season.


What makes you think that? If he really signs a long-term deal with Barca, he may not come for a long time. Noooooooo!

Stepping Razor


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## Reep (Jun 4, 2003)

This may not be bad news. Knowing that he has a chance to play in the NBA, he likely had a clause in his new contract which allows him to exit, without a big buyout. If fhe locked himself in for three years with no exit then that was a very bad move on his part. I would be quite surprised if there isn't a reasonable exit or buyout provision.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

Fernandez would make 873,200$ on a rookie contract.Since the Blazers can only contribute 500K to his buyout he'd have to personally pay at least half a million(I've read that it'd be a million also...And a million euros which is more than a million dollars).European teams are allowed to pay the entire buyout and in Spain Rudy would make at least two or three times what he can be paid on a rookie deal.So long as he can make more money in Spain he's not going to play for Portland.Not unless he's really stupid.As a spaniard he'd probably rather stay at home also.
If all this weren't true someone would have drafted him in the late teens probably.


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## Blazer Freak (Jul 11, 2004)

Reep said:


> This may not be bad news. Knowing that he has a chance to play in the NBA, he likely had a clause in his new contract which allows him to exit, without a big buyout. If fhe locked himself in for three years with no exit then that was a very bad move on his part. I would be quite surprised if there isn't a reasonable exit or buyout provision.


My guess is his buyout is smaller after the 2nd year, when he'll most likely come over.


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## B_&_B (Feb 19, 2004)

Blazer4ever said:


> It looks like RF has signed (or is about to sign) a 3 year deal with Barcelona in Spain.
> 
> I don't understand this move. If he's able to terminate his contract, why not sign with the Blazers?


Where are you getting this info?


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

Uh-oh, Fran Vasquez anyone?

Good thing this can't **** over the Trailblazers like it did the Magic. The team should have enough depth to absorb the blow.


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## Samuel (Jan 1, 2003)

And I read somewhere that the article only mentions that he's been offered a contract, not that he's accepted.


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## Sug (Aug 7, 2006)

The team would like to re-sign him to a three year deal. His current contract has no buy-out after next season, so I assume he will let his current contract run it's course, and then come over to the NBA next year. That is what KP said, and that is what all of the evidence points to.

I assume that all of this will be cleared up after the 11th of July. So let's just relax and try not to jump to conclusions 

Things are not always what the appear! :lol: 
http://youtube.com/watch?v=a1qKmRF6SSE


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## fer (Dec 6, 2006)

that is false, probably barcelona has offered a contract like that, but rudy isn't gonna accept it... he want to play for other team like barcelona or madrid because his team (dkv) wont play the eurolegue next year, but only for a year, as he wants to come to the nba as soon as posible. Furthermore, the president of dkv has said a few hours ago if anyteam want him they have to pay the buyout, and it's 3 mill € for a no-nba team, so no one is paying that for just a year.


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## B_&_B (Feb 19, 2004)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXAucLSrYv8


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

If it is true that he signed a contract that makes it so he can't come here for 3 years, than I guess thats his choice. But he's moronic if he thinks that making it big in Spain is the same as making it big in the NBA.

He could reap dividends after 2 years in the NBA basically. Plus, as for the "buyout" coming out of his own pocket..if the Blazers pay 500K for the pick and he pays the rest, unless he's a complete tool and blows every penny he makes, you'd think he'd have something to pay it with.

And I think if he WAS going to sign with another team and not come here for 3 years, I wonder if it would be with us when he did. That's a lot of cheddar for a team to pay for a player that basically snubbed them in the process.

So thats why I bet this isn't what it sounds like.


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## Bwatcher (Dec 31, 2002)

Thanks very much fer. Please let us know if anything real happens with Rudy.


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## Samuel (Jan 1, 2003)

The longer he waits to come over, the longer it takes him to get to that second contract.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

Diable said:


> So long as he can make more money in Spain he's not going to play for Portland.Not unless he's really stupid.


The logic there is not quite right, IMO. While he can earn more in Spain than a rookie NBA contract, he can make much more on his second NBA contract, if he plays well. He'll always have to play those first few years to get to that big contract...it's not like in a few years, he can avoid it and jump straight into a big NBA deal. So those first few years, where he'd be making less than in Spain, still have intrinsic value in establishing his NBA value for a bigger deal than he can get in Spain.


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## graybeard (May 10, 2003)

What if another European team bought out Rudy's contract from his current team. What if the new contract had an nba opt out clause that would allow Rudy to come over here now. I know it's a stretch, but does anyone think Paul Allen has any "pull" in Europe?


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

That's an interesting idea. Maybe immediate buyouts aren't legal over there? I wonder if there are any rules against Paul actually buying a Euroleague team for this purpose? 

I don't quite understand the $500K limit on buyouts. Whose rule is that? Is it an NBA rule, or a Euroleague rule? Why does it exist? Who benefits from that limitation?

barfo


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## graybeard (May 10, 2003)

barfo said:


> That's an interesting idea. Maybe immediate buyouts aren't legal over there? I wonder if there are any rules against Paul actually buying a Euroleague team for this purpose?
> 
> I don't quite understand the $500K limit on buyouts. Whose rule is that? Is it an NBA rule, or a Euroleague rule? Why does it exist? Who benefits from that limitation?
> 
> barfo


 Come to think of it, why doesn't Paul Allen just buy Spain?:biggrin:


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## Verro (Jul 4, 2005)

barfo said:


> I don't quite understand the $500K limit on buyouts. Whose rule is that? Is it an NBA rule, or a Euroleague rule? Why does it exist? Who benefits from that limitation?
> 
> barfo


It's in the CBA, I assume it's there so that wealthy teams won't have a significant advantage in bringing over foreign players.

Since there's also a rule that 3 years after a foreign player is drafted he can be given up to the full MLE, I wouldn't be surprised if he does sign with Barcelona and then comes over in 3 years.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

Verro said:


> It's in the CBA, I assume it's there so that wealthy teams won't have a significant advantage in bringing over foreign players.
> 
> Since there's also a rule that 3 years after a foreign player is drafted he can be given up to the full MLE, I wouldn't be surprised if he does sign with Barcelona and then comes over in 3 years.


Actually, according to the **** FAQ, there isn't a $500K limit. But if a team pays more than that, it counts as a signing bonus and thus reduces the player's salary. So, effectively, the player pays the over-$500K portion of the buyout out of his future NBA salary. 

I haven't found the second rule you refer to. It appears to me that after 3 years, he'd still be subject to the rookie salary scale, assuming that he continued playing professionally in the meantime:



Larry **** said:


> When a team signs a first round draft pick in a year other than the year in which he was drafted, the player is signed using the salary scale for the year in which he is signed, not the year in which he was drafted.


Maybe there is an exception to that for foreign players somewhere?

barfo


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## Verro (Jul 4, 2005)

barfo said:


> Actually, according to the **** FAQ, there isn't a $500K limit. But if a team pays more than that, it counts as a signing bonus and thus reduces the player's salary. So, effectively, the player pays the over-$500K portion of the buyout out of his future NBA salary.


Since it's the max a team can contribute to a buyout and if they pay more than that figure it's effectively coming out the player's salary, It has the same effect. It doesn't allow wealthy teams to draft lottery level talent much later than they should be available, only because they can afford to make massive buyouts.



barfo said:


> I haven't found the second rule you refer to. It appears to me that after 3 years, he'd still be subject to the rookie salary scale, assuming that he continued playing professionally in the meantime:


The current CBA (art. 8, Section 2: Rookie Contracts for Later-Signed First Round Picks) provides that, if a rookie does not play in the NBA for three full seasons after the draft, then he can negotiate as much as an MLE contract for a minimum of three seasons.


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## graybeard (May 10, 2003)

It's time for Larry Miller to use some of his pull at Nike. Have them cough up a $4 mil shoe contract to Rudy if he comes to play in the nba. Problem solved.


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## Ukrainefan (Aug 1, 2003)

In an article on overseas free agents, it is speculated that Barcelona might use the 2-3 million dollars they get when Juan Navarro buys out his contract to then buy out Rudy Fernandez and sign him; and if they spend that much they surely will not sign him to a contract that allows him to opt out after a year. The Blazers need to think how to head this one off at the pass!

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=2159


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## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

graybeard said:


> It's time for Larry Miller to use some of his pull at Nike. Have them cough up a $4 mil shoe contract to Rudy if he comes to play in the nba. Problem solved.


That's an interesting idea. Not only is Fernandez probably a good investment (he'll almost certainly sell shoes well overseas right out of the gate) but his presence on the team might very well help the Blazers, and the more wins the Blazers have, the more people are paying attention to Oden. Likewise, with Fernandez playing along side Oden, his name recognition will rise here quickly, too.


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## Verro (Jul 4, 2005)

PorterIn2004 said:


> That's an interesting idea. Not only is Fernandez probably a good investment (he'll almost certainly sell shoes well overseas right out of the gate) but his presence on the team might very well help the Blazers, and the more wins the Blazers have, the more people are paying attention to Oden. Likewise, with Fernandez playing along side Oden, his name recognition will rise here quickly, too.


Even if Nike gave him a deal it wouldn't be enough to justify a buyout. Oden only got 1 mil/yr from Nike, Rudy would be lucky to get $150k/yr.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

Verro said:


> Since it's the max a team can contribute to a buyout and if they pay more than that figure it's effectively coming out the player's salary, It has the same effect. It doesn't allow wealthy teams to draft lottery level talent much later than they should be available, only because they can afford to make massive buyouts.


Agreed... although a player could agree to pay the buyout without starting out rich. He just wouldn't be making much money until he got his next NBA contract. 



> The current CBA (art. 8, Section 2: Rookie Contracts for Later-Signed First Round Picks) provides that, if a rookie does not play in the NBA for three full seasons after the draft, then he can negotiate as much as an MLE contract for a minimum of three seasons.


First time I've seen someone quote the actual CBA. Guess I'll have to go read it now. Damn 

-----------------------------------------
Edit: Ok, I've read it. No, not all of it... 
But a few bits, including VIII.2: 



CBA said:


> Section 2. Rookie Contracts for Later-Signed First Round Picks.
> Except as provided in Section 3 below, a First Round Pick who does not sign with the Team that holds his draft rights for any portion of the three (3) Seasons following the NBA Draft in which he was selected (and who did not play intercollegiate basketball during such period) may enter into either (a) a Rookie Scale Contract in accordance with Section 1 above, or (b) if the Team has Room in excess of the applicable first-year Rookie Scale Amount, a Contract covering no fewer than three (3) Seasons that provides for Salary plus Unlikely Bonuses in the first Salary Cap Year up to the amount of the Team’s Room and increases or decreases in Salary and Unlikely Bonuses in subsequent Salary Cap Years in accordance with Article VII, Section 5(c)(1).


It is certainly possible I'm missing something from having not read most of the rest of the document, but it seems to me that option (b) in the paragraph above seems to be allowing teams under the cap to sign old rookies to amounts up to the cap, but it doesn't seem to say that any of the salary cap exceptions (MLE included) apply. 

barfo


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

I hope he comes over here to play since I have wanted him on our team for 3 years now!


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

ANyone think maybe Rudy and his agent are trying to pressure Portland into stepping up to the plate?


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## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

Schilly said:


> ANyone think maybe Rudy and his agent are trying to pressure Portland into stepping up to the plate?


I don't see what more Portland could do, without getting really _really_ clever anyway, and I'd think the wouldn't need extra motivation for that at this point. I mean really, who's backing up Roy at SG? Webster and Udoka? Neither can stay in front of NBA SGs. Jones? Maybe, but I'm picturing him starting at SF and playing big minutes there (though I suppose he could slide over with Webster or Udoka covering SF). Koponen? I'd certainly like to try that, but I'm not sure _he_ can stay in front of NBA SGs and I'm even less sure he'll be on the roster at all.


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## Verro (Jul 4, 2005)

barfo said:


> It is certainly possible I'm missing something from having not read most of the rest of the document, but it seems to me that option (b) in the paragraph above seems to be allowing teams under the cap to sign old rookies to amounts up to the cap, but it doesn't seem to say that any of the salary cap exceptions (MLE included) apply.


While, trying to find whether the MLE would apply (I couldn't find anything conclusive one way or the other), I came across something slightly troubling:

http://www.nbpa.com/cba_articles/article-VII_4.php 

“In the event that a First Round Pick signs with a non-NBA team, the player’s applicable Rookie Scale Amount shall be excluded from the Team Salary of the Team that holds his draft rights, beginning on the date he signs such non-NBA contract or the first day of the Regular Season, whichever is later, and shall be included again in his Team’s Team Salary at the applicable Rookie Scale Amount on the following July 1 or the date the player’s contract ends (or the player is released from his non-NBA contractual obligations), whichever is earlier, unless the Team renounces its exclusive rights to the player in accordance with Article X, Section 4(f). If, after such following July 1, or any subsequent July 1, the player signs another, or remains under, contract with a non-NBA team, the player’s applicable Rookie Scale Amount will again be excluded from Team Salary beginning on the date of the contract signing or the first day of the Regular Season commencing after such July 1, whichever is later, and will again be included in Team Salary at the applicable Rookie Scale Amount on the following July 1 or the date the player’s contract ends (or the player is released from his non-NBA contractual obligations), whichever is earlier, unless the Team renounces its exclusive rights to the player in accordance with Article X, Section 4(f).” 

As I understand this, in each NBA off season Rudy will be a deduction in our cap space in the amount of the 24th pick of that year, until he eventually joins us or we renounce/trade his rights.


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

Yep Cap hold.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

Verro said:


> As I understand this, in each NBA off season Rudy will be a deduction in our cap space in the amount of the 24th pick of that year, until he eventually joins us or we renounce/trade his rights.


The same, I guess, is then already true of Joel Freeland. But it doesn't matter much until we actually have cap space, which is a couple years off at best.

barfo


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## Spoolie Gee (Feb 3, 2005)

I cant imagine Pritchard and co. didn't fully understand the situation with Fernandez before drafting him. I know it's a hard thing to do but maybe we should just trust that they have a plan?


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## yuyuza1 (May 24, 2006)

Edit: Never mind, someone mentioned my thoughts above.

Man, we need a delete post option.


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## mgb (Jun 26, 2004)

barfo said:


> The same, I guess, is then already true of Joel Freeland. But it doesn't matter much until we actually have cap space, which is a couple years off at best.
> 
> barfo


So the only thing it means is more luxury tax? Nice to have PA as a owner and him being willing to spend again.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

Spoolie Gee said:


> I cant imagine Pritchard and co. didn't fully understand the situation with Fernandez before drafting him. I know it's a hard thing to do but maybe we should just trust that they have a plan?


I can't speak for anyone else, but I trust that Pritchard has a plan, very likely a good one. I just enjoy trying to figure out what it is. 

barfo


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

mgb said:


> So the only thing it means is more luxury tax? Nice to have PA as a owner and him being willing to spend again.


I don't think we've been paying luxury tax for the last couple of years, and we presumably won't be next year either. Our payroll is about the league median.

barfo


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## dudleysghost (Mar 24, 2006)

I think the $500k rule is in place to prevent Euro teams and players from colluding to extort big payments from NBA teams. Without that rule, if a Euro plans on getting drafted by an NBA team, he can negotiate a more lucrative contract with his Euro team, installing a large buyout. The player makes more money, the Euro team gets paid big in the buyout, and hte NBA team absorbs the cost. By making a blanket $500k limit, the NBA is using it's monopsony power to limit its member's expenditures. If it was just for parity, they could have put it higher (even the poorest team could afford $1mil, for example). Even more important than parity is cost control.


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## mgb (Jun 26, 2004)

barfo said:


> I don't think we've been paying luxury tax for the last couple of years, and we presumably won't be next year either. Our payroll is about the league median.
> 
> barfo


That's even better! :clap:


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## fer (Dec 6, 2006)

dudleysghost said:


> I think the $500k rule is in place to prevent Euro teams and players from colluding to extort big payments from NBA teams. Without that rule, if a Euro plans on getting drafted by an NBA team, he can negotiate a more lucrative contract with his Euro team, installing a large buyout. The player makes more money, the Euro team gets paid big in the buyout, and hte NBA team absorbs the cost. By making a blanket $500k limit, the NBA is using it's monopsony power to limit its member's expenditures. If it was just for parity, they could have put it higher (even the poorest team could afford $1mil, for example). Even more important than parity is cost control.


that's ridiculous, in europe big football teams spend about 60 mill € EACH season only in buyouts, medium teams spend about 20-30 mill €, and you have to add the contracts of 20 players. Nba has the money to pay more than 500k $, much much more, that's a joke, many southamericans, specially argentines and brasilians come here to play football, and europe clubs have to pay their buyouts, and yes, the south america clubs put pressure on the deal to get as much as possible, but it's the european team who puts the limit, and you can take it or refuse it, so at the end the player is always sold and come over here, simple as life.

About rudy, who knows right now... I think blazers can do something more, his buyout isn't big, but we don't even know if they want him.


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## Baracuda (Jan 10, 2007)

fer said:


> that's ridiculous, in europe big football teams spend about 60 mill € EACH season only in buyouts, medium teams spend about 20-30 mill €, and you have to add the contracts of 20 players. Nba has the money to pay more than 500k $, much much more, that's a joke, many southamericans, specially argentines and brasilians come here to play football, and europe clubs have to pay their buyouts, and yes, the south america clubs put pressure on the deal to get as much as possible, but it's the european team who puts the limit, and you can take it or refuse it, so at the end the player is always sold and come over here, simple as life.
> 
> About rudy, who knows right now... I think blazers can do something more, his buyout isn't big, but we don't even know if they want him.


Of course NBA teams could afford to pay more, but they are limited to $500,000 by NBA rules. If Rudy came over next season he'd have to pay most of the buyout himself. He'd essentially be paying just for the privlage to play in the NBA next year. The NBA team cannot, by rule, pay more than $500,000. Even Paul Allen. I belive the NBA made the rule so European teams could not pressure the NBA teams into more cash. Rudy will be fine playing in Spain next year.

Peace!


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## andalusian (Jun 29, 2006)

I seem to remember that if a draft pick stays for 3 years or more away after his pick - when he comes in he is not limited to the rookie pay scale - so in theory Rudy can go for 3 years to Barca and come to the NBA to Portland where he can negotiate his contract. Am I wrong?


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

andalusian said:


> I seem to remember that if a draft pick stays for 3 years or more away after his pick - when he comes in he is not limited to the rookie pay scale - so in theory Rudy can go for 3 years to Barca and come to the NBA to Portland where he can negotiate his contract. Am I wrong?


See post #27 in this thread 

barfo


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## andalusian (Jun 29, 2006)

barfo said:


> See post #27 in this thread


Ah, the old memory thing still works. Good news. 

Thanks for the reference. I thought I did read all of this thread as it went along, but apparently I did not.


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