# Ivan Chiriaev Update



## jdg

Link 

Nothing really new on Ivan, but kinda interesting. Nice to see he is bulking himself up real good! Growing up in Russia and goign to high school in Canada may be the best combo. You get teh skills of the Euro players and you are forced to bulk up for the Canadian winters, which let's you play down low!

I just wish he didn't live and die by the three so much... Just throw it down big man!


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## BagFullOTreez

I read that he hit 16 3pts in a tournament recently attend by scouts from Memphis, Clippers, Milwaukee and a couple of others , if i find the link ill post it.


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## jdg

> Originally posted by <b>BagFullOTreez</b>!
> I read that he hit 16 3pts in a tournament recently attend by scouts from Memphis, Clippers, Milwaukee and a couple of others , if i find the link ill post it.


I already did!


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## SheriffKilla

that's intersting
im really routing for the kid
i think he has the potential to become a good player


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## Zalgirinis

> Originally posted by <b>fjkdsi</b>!
> 
> i think he has the potential to become a good player


And I think he has the hype now from nowhere which will lead exactly to being the bust.

I havent seen him and I think none of us did, but Im from Europe and I usually know most European players. This Chiraev kid was unheard for me before he said "Im better than Nowitcki" or whatever like that. Does that make him a draft pick at once? Can I say Im the next AI and Im a draft project?

I compare this situation with the one, which was with Tsikishvili. Well, I knew Tsikishvili, because he was taken by one of the best team in Europe, but anyway he was nothing, nothing here, a zero and he was so hyped in US, taken highly in drafts and whats next??? few minutes in every second game...

Well, as I've heard some of you still think Skita still can get it done, dont call him bust yet, hes bulking up and so on (I can say just "yea sure"), but I doubt that his current situation fills your expectations before the draft...


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## AMR

I think he's the basketball version of T.A.T.U.

they appeared with all the 'hey look us, we're lesbians' stuff and tried to win Eurovision contest, after it, they said that they were just posing...

I think T.A.T.U's manager just found a 7'0 guy in Russia and said 'hey, maybe you can steal some money to a stupid franchise', so they sent him to America instead of developing correctly and seriously in Europe.. but wait, US high schools are too hard, so let's send him to Canada...to a ****ty league in which he'll dominate...and let's see what kind of players are getting drafted...wow... 3-pt shooting european 7-footers, so, come on, Ivan, you've got to shoot a lot of threes here and you'll be hyped...

i was joking..  ..or not...

he may be drafted..but he'll be a bust


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## Zalgirinis

> Originally posted by <b>AMR</b>!
> 
> he may be drafted..but he'll be a bust


I sign on that :yes: 

And I couldnt think of better description of him and his agent as you did with that T.A.T.U. thing :laugh:


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## Big John

> Originally posted by <b>AMR</b>!
> I think he's the basketball version of T.A.T.U.
> 
> they appeared with all the 'hey look us, we're lesbians' stuff and tried to win Eurovision contest, after it, they said that they were just posing...
> 
> I think T.A.T.U's manager just found a 7'0 guy in Russia and said 'hey, maybe you can steal some money to a stupid franchise', so they sent him to America instead of developing correctly and seriously in Europe.. but wait, US high schools are too hard, so let's send him to Canada...to a ****ty league in which he'll dominate...and let's see what kind of players are getting drafted...wow... 3-pt shooting european 7-footers, so, come on, Ivan, you've got to shoot a lot of threes here and you'll be hyped...
> 
> i was joking..  ..or not...
> 
> he may be drafted..but he'll be a bust


Great post-- and probably 100% accurate. I have no doubt the European agents are saying "If the Americans are dumb enough to give money to Slavko Vranes, they'll give it to anyone."

Pavel Podkolzine probably has the same agent.


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## Matiz

> Pavel Podkolzine probably has the same agent


...if he is smart

AMR - really good comparison with tatu....


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## Kmurph

This draft is looking to be full of guys who are overhyped: Chiriaev, Podkolzine, Seung-Jinn...and guys who COULD be included in that group in Perovic, Biedrins. All these guys are prjected lottery picks...are you kidding me? I wouldn't touch ANY of them with a lottery pick. I hope they do go lotto though, and I hop my team (POR) can benefit by picking up a better player who drops b\c of the hype on these guys.


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## Matiz

I think Perovic and especially Biedrins don't belong to that "bust" group. I haven't seen Biedrins but his stas are quite impresive for 18 years old... Perovic is far from ready to play in nba (although he is better than Vranes ) but in few years he could became a solid nba center...


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## rebelsun

I think Ivan would be nuts not to declare. Nice to see he put on some weight.


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## JNice

Funny, everyone is calling him a bust but most people are basing that off of like two articles on the kid. You don't have 20 NBA teams go visit you while in HS for no reason. If he does have the skills they say he does for a 7-footer, no reason to believe he couldnt become a very good player.


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## JuniorNoboa

> Originally posted by <b>AMR</b>!
> but wait, US high schools are too hard, so let's send him to Canada...to a ****ty league in which he'll dominate


High School Basketball in the City of Toronto is better then many cities in the United States. While his regional league (which is only about 15 games a year is subpar) the team plays strong opposition at top tournaments across Ontario.



But keep the generalizations coming, hypocrite.


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## ATLien

> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> 
> 
> High School Basketball in the City of Toronto is better then many cities in the United States. While his regional league (which is only about 15 games a year is subpar) the team plays strong opposition at top tournaments across Ontario.
> 
> 
> 
> But keep the generalizations coming, hypocrite.


When you say many cities do you mean like Salt Lake City? Cause I'll give you that one.


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## speedythief

I'm not sure why everyone has to hate on this kid. Very few people on this board have ever seen him play. I think most people read those Dirk comments and think he's some kind of egomaniac, but the comments themselves weren't really all that bad--and it's not like the press has ever gotten anything out of context.

Talking to people that have seen him play, he seems to have a lot of potential. He really needs to go to a D1 college to get the highest quality coaching, though. If he enters the draft, I really don't see anyone taking a chance on him in the first round, let alone the lottery.

And for the people saying he has no competition playing in Toronto, remember that he has played against American high-schoolers too, and done pretty well. And you can get some pretty good basketball teams in a city of over 4.5 million people.

The problem is that the city just doesn't invest much in basketball. If they tried to focus just 1/10th of the attention they spend on hockey on basketball instead, you'd see many more D1 and NBA players coming out of the t-dot.


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## AMR

> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> 
> 
> High School Basketball in the City of Toronto is better then many cities in the United States. While his regional league (which is only about 15 games a year is subpar) the team plays strong opposition at top tournaments across Ontario.
> 
> 
> 
> But keep the generalizations coming, hypocrite.


generalizations??? Russian League is 100 times better than the HS competition..., come on, he just went there to put his name in the draft being close to the states and dominating...


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## JuniorNoboa

> Originally posted by <b>AMR</b>!
> 
> 
> generalizations??? Russian League is 100 times better than the HS competition..., come on, he just went there to put his name in the draft being close to the states and dominating...



Thanks. I was wondering why several thousands of Russians immigrate to Toronto each year. Now I know - they are looking to fool NBA scouts. Trying to have a better life has nothing to do with it. Thanks again for increasing my knowledge.


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## CrookedJ

Yeah some good players have come out of the T. system - such as Jamal Magloire, and Denham Brown currently at UConn.

I still think he should forget the draft and take the free pass to NCAA for at least a year or two, and imporve his game, but I' rooting for him.


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## Big John

> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I was wondering why several thousands of Russians immigrate to Toronto each year. Now I know - they are looking to fool NBA scouts. Trying to have a better life has nothing to do with it. Thanks again for increasing my knowledge.


In some cases, it is because they are trying to have a better life by fooling NBA scouts.


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## SheriffKilla

its funny how half the people hate on him without even seeing him play and barelly even reading anythin on him
just because he is confident and a little cocky doesn't mean he is a bad player

i have yet to watch him play
so i can't say if he is gonna be a bust or a new revolution in the game
but i am really hoping he will become great and we will see a 7 footer dominate the game from the PG position


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## Matiz

> its funny how half the people hate on him without even seeing him play and barelly even reading anythin on him


I believe it's funny to you- I actually feel the same way when I'm reading some posts about Podkolzine or Vranes here! 
I actually have a reason to believe Ivan is a bust:I haven't seen him play, it's true. But I draw some conclusions, since me and some "haters" are following european under-18 or even under-16 championships quite closely and nobody has ever heard of Chiriaev- he could have been in such selections- but he sure wasn't noticed. Just a question: Why wasn't he noticed by any european clubs? most of talented 7'1 DO get noticed and signed by 14 or 15. My answer would be he isn't anything special - could be wrong though.
There are just to many over hyped 7 footers... Nowitzki and Gasol worked out really well, but not every european 7 footer will be like them!


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## AMR

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> 
> I believe it's funny to you- I actually feel the same way when I'm reading some posts about Podkolzine or Vranes here!
> I actually have a reason to believe Ivan is a bust:I haven't seen him play, it's true. But I draw some conclusions, since me and some "haters" are following european under-18 or even under-16 championships quite closely and nobody has ever heard of Chiriaev- he could have been in such selections- but he sure wasn't noticed. Just a question: Why wasn't he noticed by any european clubs? most of talented 7'1 DO get noticed and signed by 14 or 15. My answer would be he isn't anything special - could be wrong though.
> There are just to many over hyped 7 footers... Nowitzki and Gasol worked out really well, but not every european 7 footer will be like them!


:clap: 

Nemanja Aleksandrov is a proyect of a good player
Ivan Chiriaev is a proyect of a good NBA contract..


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## rebelsun

7'1 players w/ real ball skills are very rare.


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## Bball_Doctor

I have planned to try to watch Ivan this year since his highschool is a mere 20 minutes from my home but I have been extremely busy. However, I have local friends who have given me their own scouting reports, some of who have managed to watch Ivan in person and others who have children that attend or attended highschools in Oakville.

From what I can gather and this is from their perception...Ivan has added weight this season but still plays as if he is afraid to go into the post and bang. He is a very versatile big man who can put the ball on the floor but he isn't KG. Has solid quickness for a man his size and has range extending pass 20 feet but his accuracy is better suited 17-18 and in. Ivan has improved a lot from last season in which I have accounts of him being outscored and sometimes abused by guys 7 inches shorter than him. Infact a lot of people admit that if it was not for his hype last year nobody would even know his name even when competing against him. But he has taken the hype seriously and is working hard to improve all aspects of his game. He isn't extremely athletic but he can get off his feet on and off the ground better than most prospects his size. He is also prone to turnovers but a lot of players he plays against are 7-8 inches shorter than him so it is understandable how the ball could get swiped from his hands so easily. Speaking about his hands...Ivan has "soft" hands around the basket. As many scounting sites have indicated, Ivan's most intriguing strengths are his perimeter ability, versatility and age but he needs to work on bringing his game closer to the paint and to improve his defensive intensity. He isn't a strong rebounder or blocker (most of it is collected due to his size and not skill) but he passes the ball quite well for his size. Many people I have talked to believe that Ivan will be a defensive liability in the NBA much like Dirk but worse (right now). Ivan's game doesn't really have a defined position right now. He is too soft to play inside to be an everyday 5 or 4 and too much of a defensive liability to play an everyday 3. He is a project but he works hard and will probably continue to add muscle. Ivan on all accounts has advanced a lot from the player he was in 03'. Some people have told me that he reminds them of a Jonathan Bender with less athletic ability who has the potential to be the next Dirk or another Slava. To me although I have not watched him in person...his game sounds like Lampe down a couple notches due to difference in professional experience and size...but I would say has equal potential but with less merit...hence more risk.

Make no mistake about it...any team that drafts Ivan will recognize him as a project who probably will not contribute right away. His potential is immense enough to be a lottery pick but so is the risk. My guess is that once draft time arrives and pre-draft camps are played out...Ivan will be more accurately projected as a late first rounder or second rounder (if he declares) unless if a team makes a promise to take him early. Either way he will make history for Canadian basketball.  Hopefully I will get a live glimpse of Ivan playing in a competitive game before the draft. If I do I will definitely post my own opinions.


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## jsm27

Bball_Doctor,

Thanks for the great scouting report. I have been wanting to get a good picture of what this kid has to offer for a long time. This has been the most complete analysis of him I have seen yet. If you get more information or reports, I would be glad to hear if he begins to show improvement in his areas of weakness. Again, thanks for the insight.


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## Zalgirinis

> Originally posted by <b>fjkdsi</b>!
> its funny how half the people hate on him without even seeing him play and barelly even reading anythin on him
> just because he is confident and a little cocky doesn't mean he is a bad player


What has word "hate" to do with this?  

I have nothing but to agree with Matiz. I think me, AMR, Matiz (and some others which I of course forgot) are following European basketball very closely and we know most of European guys. If me or other one guy alone wouldnt have heard of him before that article, that would be smth, but everybody in Europe heard of him for the first time just when his agent started hype campaign.

I even talked with one Russian journalist working for CSKA after the fact. He said that he knew Ciraev's name, but nobody ever talked in there about any of his chances in pro-basketball. He was very little known in his own country and never played for any Russian youth team. He said that his going to Canada was a big shock in there. So it just makes suspicion about his agent stronger, thats all.


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## Bball_Doctor

> Originally posted by <b>jsm27</b>!
> Bball_Doctor,
> 
> Thanks for the great scouting report. I have been wanting to get a good picture of what this kid has to offer for a long time. This has been the most complete analysis of him I have seen yet. If you get more information or reports, I would be glad to hear if he begins to show improvement in his areas of weakness. Again, thanks for the insight.


I will be sure to do that as I indicated.:yes: 

And Zal is right. Ivan on the accounts I have heard has improved tremedously since last season. I won't even dare imagine how he played in Russia but players who played against Ivan last year have said that they didn't even know who this kid was nor did they think he was special...considering he was being outscored and outplayed by players 7 inches shorter than him. But his game has improved a lot and his hype is unprecedented for a Canadian HS product. He has shined in his last couple tournaments and I believe he was named MVP in a couple of them.


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## falsestart

> Originally posted by <b>Zalgirinis</b>!
> 
> 
> I even talked with one Russian journalist working for CSKA after the fact. He said that he knew Ciraev's name, but nobody ever talked in there about any of his chances in pro-basketball. He was very little known in his own country and never played for any Russian youth team.


He was called up to the Russian 1984 team, but he was much shorter(approx. 6'4") and a bit worse then other guards(Panin, Chevel). He was in deep bench, and, one day, he disappered...and appeared again in Canada


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## MentalPowerHouse

> Originally posted by <b>JNice</b>!
> Funny, everyone is calling him a bust but most people are basing that off of like two articles on the kid. You don't have 20 NBA teams go visit you while in HS for no reason. If he does have the skills they say he does for a 7-footer, no reason to believe he couldnt become a very good player.


Yup and the funny thing is they actually think the GM's read these 2 articles and were like "wow! we gotta go get this kid", what a bunch of fools at this site. 

The only hype GM's buy into are the hype from their scouts, not articles written in local newspapers in distant cities.


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## Big John

> My guess is that once draft time arrives and pre-draft camps are played out...Ivan will be more accurately projected as a late first rounder or second rounder (if he declares) unless if a team makes a promise to take him early.


Players like Chiriaev and Podkolzine do not attend the pre draft camps. Instead they schedule "private workouts" where they can look good running up and down the floor and dunking a few times, and making shots over the outstretched arms of their agents.

That's when you smell a rat.


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## Carl English

I've seen the kid play about 10 times this year and I also played against him. He's the kind of player that can impress in a workout but he can't do squat in the game. There's a lot of uninformed people who sit there and just assume he's kickin' butt and dominating because it's Canadian High School ball but that could not be anymore false. I've never seen him score more than 15 points in a game. And yes, he does often post up but he still gets pushed around and doesn't score. My high school team's barely above average and we killed his team by 22 and held him to 5 points. Body him up and he's got nothin' cuz' all his skills have been honed on his own with no defence. If my 5'10, 155 lb team mate can lock this kid down and hold him to 5 points......... well, u can draw ur own conclusions when someone like Doug Christie is on him. 

Worst of all, his attitude is garbage. He plays for himself and screams at his team mates and coach over nothing. He left the team at certain stints in the year and got himself suspended for fighting the day before the first round of playoffs.


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## patticus

ooh, scandalous! still i dont know if he's as bad as you make him sound, there's a lot of people out there pushing the hype machine, probably for a reason.. we'll see at that nationwide high school all-star game in may i guess...


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## Carl English

Most people up here are pretty sure he doesn't have the papers to leave the country. At least not yet....


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## rebelsun

> Originally posted by <b>Carl English</b>!
> Most people up here are pretty sure he doesn't have the papers to leave the country. At least not yet....


Just send him in a huge box marked "prescription drugs."


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## prerak

JuniorNoboa, don't forget the experience US HSers get in AAU competition and other large tournaments. Guys such as Josh Smith have played Marvin Williams, Dwight Howard has played Randolph Morris, etc.

Who is the second best player in Canada? Tristan Blackwood? :| 

Granted, I'm sure Chiriaev has played semi-tough teams, but actual games against hardnosed prospects that are going to Div1 teams or the NBA itself? Not many, if any at all.


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## butr

What would any of you know about Toronto Highschool ball? You probably think they're all running around with hockey sticks up here.


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## Carl English

> Originally posted by <b>prerak</b>!
> JuniorNoboa, don't forget the experience US HSers get in AAU competition and other large tournaments. Guys such as Josh Smith have played Marvin Williams, Dwight Howard has played Randolph Morris, etc.
> 
> Who is the second best player in Canada? Tristan Blackwood? :|
> 
> Granted, I'm sure Chiriaev has played semi-tough teams, but actual games against hardnosed prospects that are going to Div1 teams or the NBA itself? Not many, if any at all.


Tristan Blackwood along with tons of other players are considered better than Chiriaev. Blackwood was a first team all-star at the global games and won the three point shoot out there. Chiriaev has not done anything other than show flashes of potential and talk a lot of smack.


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## AMR

> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> 
> 
> High School Basketball in the City of Toronto is better then many cities in the United States. While his regional league (which is only about 15 games a year is subpar) the team plays strong opposition at top tournaments across Ontario.
> 
> 
> 
> But keep the generalizations coming, hypocrite.


do you want more generalizations?


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## Sigma

Anyone know where is Chiriaev playing this year?


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## SheriffKilla

to Zilgrinis and Matiz 
i follow European basketball too
i am usually im america but i go to russia for certain parts of the year so i watch from there a lot and i follow all the stats and all the games i can from online
if i really want to see a player/team play
i can ask my dad to sent me a tape from europe he travels all over there and he has sent me tapes of milicic and other players before they played in NBA
im sure you guys know about it more than me, but dont act like ur so cool and you know it so well while everyone else is idiots about european ball


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## AMR

> Originally posted by <b>fjkdsi</b>!
> to Zilgrinis and Matiz
> i follow European basketball too
> i am usually im america but i go to russia for certain parts of the year so i watch from there a lot and i follow all the stats and all the games i can from online
> if i really want to see a player/team play
> i can ask my dad to sent me a tape from europe he travels all over there and he has sent me tapes of milicic and other players before they played in NBA
> im sure you guys know about it more than me, but dont act like ur so cool and you know it so well while everyone else is idiots about european ball


I don't think we act like we're cool, and you've proven that you know about european basketball, of course I respect you, and anyway I don't think that if someone doesn't know about european basketball is an idiot
the only thing that upsets me when an american speaks about an european player is 'he sucks, look at his stats, 12 points 5 rebounds'


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## JHG722

Carl English said:


> I've seen the kid play about 10 times this year and I also played against him. He's the kind of player that can impress in a workout but he can't do squat in the game. There's a lot of uninformed people who sit there and just assume he's kickin' butt and dominating because it's Canadian High School ball but that could not be anymore false. I've never seen him score more than 15 points in a game. And yes, he does often post up but he still gets pushed around and doesn't score. My high school team's barely above average and we killed his team by 22 and held him to 5 points. Body him up and he's got nothin' cuz' all his skills have been honed on his own with no defence. If my 5'10, 155 lb team mate can lock this kid down and hold him to 5 points......... well, u can draw ur own conclusions when someone like Doug Christie is on him.
> 
> Worst of all, his attitude is garbage. He plays for himself and screams at his team mates and coach over nothing. He left the team at certain stints in the year and got himself suspended for fighting the day before the first round of playoffs.


You're wrong; Ivan Chiriaev is the best player in the world! :whiteflag:


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## R-Star

I was wondering what the hell happened to this guy yesterday. What a coincidence.


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## Dre

This takes me back....


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## JHG722

R-Star said:


> I was wondering what the hell happened to this guy yesterday. What a coincidence.





Dre™ said:


> This takes me back....


I apologize for bumping a 5 year old thread; it's usually something I criticize others for, but I felt compelled to bump this. Someone mentioned this dude and I found this thread.

:whiteflag:


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## Nimreitz

He's the guy who ruined nbadraft.net and created draftexpress. At least in the eyes of dorks like us.


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## Wade County

Man, epic fail.


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## jayk009

This was nbadraft.net's biggest blunder ever, and it showed that their site was a joke. 

What's funny is they never admitted to ****ing up and pretty much deleted any articles they're ever written about Ivan Chiraiev, there was one that proclaimed he would be a lottery pick in the NBA, I think they had him projected to be a top 2 or 3 pick without ever even seeing him play, just based on what they read on the internet and/or from the guys agent. 

I'm really interested to see what this guy is doing today, mean if he's 7'1 he gotta be playing basketball somewhere..


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## Drewbs

the nba wants ivan chiriaev, the nba needs ivan chiriaev.

LOL


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