# If the lakers don't make the playoffs . . .



## 7thwatch (Jul 18, 2002)

or lose early in the playoffs, what would you like to see happen? 

1)Start rebuilding?

2)Call it an off year and make no changes?

3) Hope to aquire a good free agent or two?

4) change coaches?

5) trade Kobe or Shaq for Lebron James 

6) other


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## JYD (Sep 3, 2002)

3


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## 7thwatch (Jul 18, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JYD</b>!
> 3


I don't know your guys cap situation. Is that realistic?


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## Raptor Fan 42 (Sep 20, 2002)

I believe the Lakers are 5 million over the cap.


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## JYD (Sep 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>7thwatch</b>!
> 
> 
> I don't know your guys cap situation. Is that realistic?


We would have to spend the 2.5 million. And let Shaw go.


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## TheRifleman (May 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JYD</b>!
> 
> 
> We would have to spend the 2.5 million. And let Shaw go.


The Lakers should do that - get rid of Shaw and sign a free agent with what money they would then have available.


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

there is differant levels of rebuilding,from the jerry krausse model where you just blow everything up and start over to the other extreme where you tweak the reserves and keep the big two.one could argue that they have two of the five best in the game but i think that at shaqs' age and weight etc, he isnt likely going to be around a whole heck of a lot of years.my take would be to try to draft a guy you actually have plans to play,maybe a kirk hinrich or a nick collison,these guys could come in right away and put up good numbers and you wouldnt have to wait 3 years for them to develope.free agency is tough when you dont have a lot of cap room.i think some new blood there would do wonders,fox,horry,shaw are over the hill and guys like walker,george and medvedenko just arent any good.


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## Lakers_32_4ever (Dec 30, 2002)

*What Lakers should do...*

I know it won't happen, but, let us suppose that we trade Samaki Walker to either Denver, Toronto, Memphis, etc. and hope to land someone like Bosh, or Milicic to fill his spot, make us much younger, and get some "potential" on the team. *Then Kobe and Shaq, hoping to achieve true dynasty status, take about 5 to 7.5 million dollar per season cuts, and have their teammates follow suit, each with about a 20% reduction, to clear future caproom, and open up the market, with about 20 million to shop around (putting even a third superstar in sight).* Then we ship Tracy Murray to Portland for their second rounder this year, and take someone like Dahntay Jones. Also with our first rounder we should take Hinrich, or even Collison, or Marvin Stone. Then we ship Madsen to Sacramento, Dallas, Indy, or NJ for their first rounder and pick up Chris Marcus. Then we trade George and a 2004 first rounder, and maybe some other draft pick and acquire Battier from Memphis. Also cut either Brian Shaw or Jannero Pargo. Maybe both.

Here would be the changes (thinking that we acquire Kidd in the offseason with that new money)

Gone:
2004 1st round
2004 2nd round (Maybe)
Devean George
Samaki Walker
Tracy Murray
Mark Madsen
Jannergo Pargo
Brian Shaw (Maybe)

In:
Jason Kidd (Free agent) 
(VERY IFFY, hoping he will take 5-7 million less for a title)
Chris Bosh (Via trade of Walker)
Kirk Hinrich (Our number 1 pick)
Shane Battier (Via George and '04 picks trade)
Chris Marcus (Via Madsen trade)
Danhtay Jones (Via Murray trade)
Josh Howard (our number 2 pick)


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## thrice911 (Jul 15, 2002)

WOW...if that happened I think the fans of all the other NBA teams would start riots and protests against all of the GMS who gave the Lakers those draft picks for our crap players.


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## Petey (Aug 23, 2002)

You expect the whole team to take cuts? Interesting imagination you have got there.

-Petey


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

If the Lakers don't make the playoffs ALL HOPE IS LOST. Bust up the team. Trade Shaq and Kobe to the Portland Trailblazers. They will fit right in with all those "names making millions". The attitudes and egos of Shaq and Kobe are holding the team back.  

Seriously, the proposals above to make trades with the Blazers (or any other Pacific Division rival) or not very realistic. Especially the Blazers and the Kings will do everything they can to avoid anything that might possibly help the Lakers. Do not expect any help from them.

Also, hell will freeze over before Shaq or Kobe take less money from the Lakers. And even if the other guys were to accept less money, it will not change the cap situation of the Lakers one bit. The old contract amounts will be what counts against the cap. That idea is a non-starter.

The Lakers can easily skirt the cap however, by trading for players with big, next year increases in their contract, always using their mid-level exceptions, signing FA's to minimum salary deals, and re-signing their own free agents. Buss has refused to take advantage of these, hoping to stay very close to the luxury tax limit. His willingness to spend some more money will be a HUGE factor in determining what Kupchack can do the next couple of years. I will assume (which is a big assumption) that Buss will sign off on a few extra million above this years level, due to immense pressure from Shaq and Kobe if the Lakers miss the playoffs this season.

Shaq, Kobe and Phil are the key components to the Lakers.

The experienced role players (Fisher, Fox & Horry) as a group are also important. Ideally they should be retained for continuity, especially when dealing with the triangle. But, the depth of talent surrounding the stars is thin and needs to be shored up. Every player (bar Shaq and Kobe) should be in play, and none untouchable, if needed to make a deal or room for an increase in talent. After 2 years of neglecting the roster, it will take more than one summer to fix. The Lakers may have to take a chance and move one or two of their veteran role players. One step backwards to take two steps forward.

Problem is, the Lakers have little value to trade with, so don't expect any dramatic trades.

Robert Horry: has more value to the Lakers than other teams. Would still be very valuable coming off the bench. Possibly would refuse to be traded to any other team. BUT, will have an ending contract. Some teams might trade for him knowing he would retire just to dump salary. And Horry would probably agree to a trade to Houston - they would love to dump Mo Taylor and his big contract - yech - but wonder if they would do Eddie Griffin?) . Horry's $5mil salary may be too tempting to flip into another player. Or, the Lakers save the "slot" so they can sign another mid-level free agent in 2 summers and not increase their salary level.

Rick Fox: with 2 years, $10mil, I just don't see any team trading for him, coming off his worst season, unless it is for a player, who is also disappointing, with a much longer contract, and I don't see Buss doing that.

Derek Fisher: with 3 years, $13 left, and the season he just had, Fish would return very little if anything of value. Might as well keep him. Just need to change the roster so he comes off bench like he should.

Devean George: was mistake to sign him and many other teams may agree. May still be able to be pawned off on some other team based on "potential". Shop him and see.

Kareem Rush: Should try to hang on to him. He has looked pretty good in his limited time. Being on a rookie contract, he could be a screaming bargain for the Lakers in 2 years. Likely that every trade the Lakers try to make, the other team will demand that Rush be included.

Stanislav Medvendenko/Samiki Walker/Madsen: I don't like any of them. Med can't defend and takes bad shots. Walker has hands of stone and gets abused in the post. Madsen doesn't belong in the NBA. I say dump them all. Do not exercise the team option on Madsen. Kick him off the team. Let Walker walk or package in a sign and trade. Med has to be traded or let him play out the last year of his contract.

If anything left in the tank, re-sign Shaw to another one year minimum contract.

Murray, Walker and all the other free agents are available for sign and trades, but it will probably be easier for the Lakers to pick up a quality player with the mid-level exception. Do not keep any except those that PJ really wants and only at min salary.

As has been discussed over and over and over the last year or two, the Lakers could really use a solid big man (a young Horace Grant type would be ideal) and a solid guard (a Ron Harper type would be PJ's preference).

This summer PJ Brown is a free agent. There is a chance he could be available for the mid-level exception. That would be a huge pickup to solve the front-court depth problem.

The draft this summer should be chock full of point guards. If the Lakers are able to pick up one they like, that can shore up that hole.

If both PJ Brown and a good PG rookie are obtained, the Lakers should see if they can somehow work a trade for a 3rd scorer. Doesn't seem likely though. So, then they can work the end of the summer trolling for quality veterans at minimum salary to fill out the roster. Should bring only big men. Fisher (who Lakers are stuck with), Kobe, Rush, Rookie and Shaw are plenty of guards. Dept chart could look like this:

C: Shaq/FA (min sal)
PF: PJ Brown/Horry/FA (min sal)
SF: George/Fox
SG: Kobe/Rush
PG: Fisher/Rookie/Shaw

The next year Horry retires or stays on at minimum salary. Fox is traded as an ending contract. Shaw retires. The drafted PG moves into the starting lineup. And the Lakers can use their mid-level exception to snag a real good free agent to fill the holes.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

If that happens, I'd like to see them alter the team a little. Shaq nor Kobe are getting traded. But we could get rid of some access bagagge like Fox, or Walker, maybe even Fish. 

Even if they dont win the title again this year, all is not lost. The team still has what it takes they just need to make it happen!


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## Sean (Jun 7, 2002)

nice post masbee, welcome to BBB.

The only place I can see Horry going is Houston, and that's if he wants to. The situation with his daughter almost dictates that he's not going to be willing to go far away from home again. Fox has stated he would retire before being traded, but I could envision a NY/NJ destination since his wifey and kids are already out there. In the end, the lakers aren't looking good this year. Can they still pull it off? Maybe. If they don't are there going to be changes? More than likely.


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## JoeF (Jul 16, 2002)

*Random thoughts on some proposals*



> Originally posted by <b>Masbee</b>!
> The Lakers can easily skirt the cap however, by trading for players with big, next year increases in their contract


See my response to this in the other post of it.
http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14422




> Then Kobe and Shaq, hoping to achieve true dynasty status, take about 5 to 7.5 million dollar per season cuts, and have their teammates follow suit, each with about a 20% reduction, to clear future caproom, and open up the market, with about 20 million to shop around (putting even a third superstar in sight)


This isn't allowed by the CBA



> Then we ship Tracy Murray to Portland for their second rounder


I think Portland has to be under the cap to do this. They are 60M+ over the cap.



> Some teams might trade for him knowing he would retire just to dump salary.


Contact still counts against salary cap till it is satsified whether he retires or not. Someone might be able and willing to buy it out and speed up the salary cap hit.



> Then we ship Madsen to Sacramento, Dallas, Indy, or NJ for their first rounder


No one will give you a 1st rounder for Madsen. 



> I believe the Lakers are 5 million over the cap.


These are what RealGM.com has.
L.A. Lakers
02/03 committed - $64,527,959 
02/03 capspace (actual) - -$24,256,959
02/03 capspace (max) - -$22,147,939
I don't think you have much coming off after this season do you?


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## Lakers_32_4ever (Dec 30, 2002)

Dallas is pissed with Raef. We should try to get him. He could be very valuable to the Lakers, and give Shaq help in creating a dominant frontcourt.


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## QBF (Jul 22, 2002)

If the Lakers fail to make the playoffs this year, it would be a terrible blow to the franchise. Nevertheless, if it did happen, I would scrap the current team and rebuild around Kobe.

The Lakers have two valuable assets - Shaq and Kobe. Shaq is 31 and appears to be declining somewhat physically. Certainly, his production has been steadily declining since the Lakers 67-15 season in 1999-2000, and their record has been declining accordingly. Meanwhile, Kobe's game and his production has been on the ascent, and he is a healthy 24. His best days are in front of him.

Trade Shaq this offseason, while he still has value as a player and as a ticket-seller, and get Kobe the complimentary superstar necessary to rebuild the Lakers for the next decade. Offer Shaq to the Timberwolves for Kevin Garnett. His all-around game would blend perfectly with Kobe's. Kobe would be freed up to be the pure scorer, as Garnett would do all of the little things that consume so much of Kobe's energy. Garnett would finally have the teammate who could create his own shot and dominate the basketball at the offensive end in the final two minutes. They would be the league's top defensive duo. The Lakers would then use their lottery pick to draft or trade for a third player to add to their young core.

This is how I would begin.


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## Sha-Kobe O'Bryant (Jan 3, 2003)

Hello everyone. This is my first post here. Outstanding site. Ive been a Laker fan since i could crawl. Im here to tell you all, no worries. The Lakers will be in the playoffs. They are about to begin a heck of a roll!


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Great first post*



> Originally posted by <b>Sha-Kobe O'Bryant</b>!
> Hello everyone. This is my first post here. Outstanding site. Ive been a Laker fan since i could crawl. Im here to tell you all, no worries. The Lakers will be in the playoffs. They are about to begin a heck of a roll!


Right on man! and welcome to the forum. One thing we need as laker fans is positivity. I like your style!


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## <<<D>>> (Jul 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Sha-Kobe O'Bryant</b>!
> Hello everyone. This is my first post here. Outstanding site. Ive been a Laker fan since i could crawl. Im here to tell you all, no worries. The Lakers will be in the playoffs. They are about to begin a heck of a roll!


Welcome Sha-Kobe O'Bryant!!
Good attitude, just like all of us, we know what our team is capable of, once they bring it all.


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

I'd be willing to deal away shaq for milcic or lebron + cap filler....


Kobe has to stay though...

I'd prefer horry and rush to stay, anyone else is open game.


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