# What makes Kevin Durant that much a better prospect then Melo



## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

Every one likes to cite his accomplishments... which were about the same as Melo, except Melo got it done in the tournament.

I think it's commonly accepted that Durant is more of an elite prospect, a bigger "franchise player" then Melo was. Why?

I don't necessarily disagree, I just think it makes for good discussion.

Interestingly, with basically the exact same numbers, and with Melo being on a better team then Durant (3 seed vs 4 seed), Durant was almost a unaminous National Player of the Year, while Melo was not even first team all-american, and they gave the positions to sluff like Hollis Price and TJ Ford!!

Its quite obvious that freshmen are getting much more hype now then 4 years ago. Is this why Durant is viewed as a much better prospect?

Ignore my avatar, I'm playing a little devils advocate here. Basically why is Durant seen as a much superior prospect to Anthony?


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

You simply don't see people with Durant's height who still are athletic have his skillset of ballhandling and shooting. He's also able to be a good rebounder because of the height. He's got the physicial freak tag on him


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

He hit on what I was going to say, just pure size. If Durant can bulk up without losing his speed he could become scary.


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## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

JuniorNoboa said:


> I think it's commonly accepted that Durant is more of an elite prospect, a bigger "franchise player" then Melo was. Why?


I don't find it commonly accepted as far as their pre-draft status. On the other hand, there is certainly a large group of NBA fans that don't care for Melo, especially after the incident in the Gardens


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

cpawfan said:


> I don't find it commonly accepted as far as their pre-draft status.


Maybe your right.

All I know is that Durant the college player got alot more hype then Melo, and they were about equals numbers and team wise. One was the National Player of the Year, one was not an all-american. 

I think this additional hype has extended to his elevation as a much superior prospect




> On the other hand, there is certainly a large group of NBA fans that don't care for Melo, especially after the incident in the Gardens


Missed that, what happened at MSG........


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

He isn't. Although I don't think anyone would consider Kevin Durant a failure if he was putting up 21/6/3 in his rookie year and 29/6/4 in his 4th season.


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## Mogriffjr (Mar 5, 2005)

JuniorNoboa said:


> Maybe your right.
> 
> All I know is that Durant the college player got alot more hype then Melo, and they were about equals numbers and team wise. One was the National Player of the Year, one was not an all-american.
> 
> ...


Incident with the Knicks where Anthony I believe hit Mardy Collins then started running like a scoulded dog.

Anywho, I believe with Durant, your seeing a freshman with a damn near complete offensive package. He can shoot 3's, shoot from mid range, get you down low and hit you with a series of fakes, spins, etc.

If I'm not mistaken, Melo wasn't as dominant as he is now in the post. Right now, I can't say one person who can contain Melo in the post right now. Also, Melo isn't a 3pt shooter...but Melo is a top scorer in the league...Melo essentially improved on what he did in college...


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

Another thing to point out is the fact that Durant had more hype because while Oden is a great talent, he didn't have the Lebron level hype going for him. He is too quiet to eat up all of the media.


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

Mogriffjr said:


> If I'm not mistaken, Melo wasn't as dominant as he is now in the post. Right now, I can't say one person who can contain Melo in the post right now. Also, Melo isn't a 3pt shooter...but Melo is a top scorer in the league...Melo essentially improved on what he did in college...


Melo scored more points from the post position then Durant did as a freshmen. 

Durant is a better shooter and shoots many more 3's, while Melo can score in as many ways inside the stripe,


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## Mogriffjr (Mar 5, 2005)

JuniorNoboa said:


> Melo scored more points from the post position then Durant did as a freshmen.
> 
> Durant is a better shooter and shoots many more 3's, while Melo can score in as many ways inside the stripe,


I agree with that...Durant is more perimeter oriented IMO...

but with Melo, I don't remember him being such a bull in the post...Whether you credit this to strengthening up or what, but he's a monster in the post.


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## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

Sir Patchwork said:


> He isn't. Although I don't think anyone would consider Kevin Durant a failure if he was putting up 21/6/3 in his rookie year and 29/6/4 in his 4th season.


Who considers him a failure up to this point ?


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

Two things make Durant a better prospect in this day and age (only a few years after Melo):

1. Height

2. Recency effect

That is it.


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

croco said:


> Who considers him a failure up to this point ?


I'm saying that it shouldn't be an insult to Durant that he compares to Carmelo pretty well. Carmelo is a great player, and if Durant is as good as Carmelo in the league, he won't be and shouldn't be considered a failure. 

The only reason why the comparison seemingly shortchanges him is because players are usually compared to players a lot better than them. That's the nature of comparisons, to provide an absolute best case scenario, but Melo is a _realistic_ comparison for Durant in terms of impact (their games are different obviously).


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## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

Sir Patchwork said:


> I'm saying that it shouldn't be an insult to Durant that he compares to Carmelo pretty well. Carmelo is a great player, and if Durant is as good as Carmelo in the league, he won't be and shouldn't be considered a failure.
> 
> The only reason why the comparison seemingly shortchanges him is because players are usually compared to players a lot better than them. That's the nature of comparisons, to provide an absolute best case scenario, but Melo is a _realistic_ comparison for Durant in terms of impact (their games are different obviously).


Then I agree with you although I'm convinced that he will be even more unique than Melo. Of course that doesn't mean he'll be better when it's all said and done, but his ridiculous length will work wonders for him in the NBA.


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## The Truth (Jul 22, 2002)

They didn't have the same exact numbers, Carmelo averaged 22 and 10 and Durant averaged 26 and 11. Also, Durant was a far more efficient scorer than Melo. Durant averaged 1.38 points per field goal attempt and Melo averaged 1.27 points per field goal attempt. This is a result of Durant being a better shooter in each shooting category (field goal: 47% to 45%; 3 point: 42% to 34%; free throw: 81% to 71%).

Also, Durant averaged 1.9 blocks and Anthony averaged .9.


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## Like A Breath (Jun 16, 2003)

Durant has much more defensive potential and 3 point ability. Other than that, he isn't a better prospect than Melo...but Melo is a scoring king candidate, so what's wrong with being Melo? Most of Melo's criticism deals with his perceived attitude and off-the-court actions.


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## NJ Grand NJ (Feb 22, 2005)

JuniorNoboa said:


> Every one likes to cite his accomplishments... which were about the same as Melo, except Melo got it done in the tournament.
> 
> I think it's commonly accepted that Durant is more of an elite prospect, a bigger "franchise player" then Melo was. Why?
> 
> ...


Durant's numbers are a lot better actually. From what I recall, Melo was in the 19 and 8 range, while Durant is about 26 and 11.

I don't necessarily agree with all these reasons, but here are some that make sense.

Durant is a year younger.

Even now, Carmelo is looked at as just a scorer. I mean, he was compared to Glenn Robinson coming out of the draft. Durant's comparisons range from Rashard Lewis, TMac, to even Dirk.

Carmelo's hype was overshadowed by the hype of Lebron (and Darko's too). 

Height and length are a big thing, potential wise. KD is a solid 6'10 with a monstrous wingspan. Carmelo is average SF height.

Carmelo was helped out by the fact that he was physically more mature than everyone else. I, honestly didn't see him much, but looking at videos, I don't see how anyone could contain a SF that was that strong and fast. KD still has a lot more room to bulk up, I'm sure GM's are drooling at the sight of a bulked up Kevin Durant.

Yeah, but like someone else said, you're comparing a college freshman to the scoring leader right now. People just see a 6'11 small forward with a huge wingspan, can score from anywhere, and is ACTUALLY producing at the college level and get excited.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

I think Carmelo and Durant have the same general skillset and production potential...I see Durant on his level in the pros, a lot of people think he can get better because he's taller...but I don't agree. I don't think it's as simple as merely bulking up, you have to have a semblance of a post game, and aside from a fadeaway, I don't really see much from him. I don't really see too much KG/superior post play in his game at all.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

_Dre_ said:


> I think Carmelo and Durant have the same general skillset and production potential...I see Durant on his level in the pros, a lot of people think he can get better because he's taller...but I don't agree. I don't think it's as simple as merely bulking up, you have to have a semblance of a post game, and aside from a fadeaway, I don't really see much from him. I don't really see too much KG/superior post play in his game at all.


They dont even have the same skillset. Carmelo can play in the post quite effectively, no one would dream of playing KD in the post as of now.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

HB said:


> They dont even have the same skillset. Carmelo can play in the post quite effectively, no one would dream of playing KD in the post as of now.


Carmelo is a smart scorer who can work his matchups in the post to his advantage at times. I see no reason why Durant can't learn to take advantage of the matchups he'll get at the 3. He'll automatically have a headstart on Anthony on size alone.

For the most part, they're both above average shooters, good penetrators, and can use their size to their advantage on offense. Durant looks to be a better rebounder, and neither is much on defense as of yet. Close enough. 

And Karl never _plays_ Carmelo in the post, but when he wants to exploit a matchup, he can go there. The same will ring true for Durant, Anthony's not so much better as a post player that it renders their skillsets incomparable, because they very much so are. Where Anthony has the advantage in speed and moves Durant will have in size, and he can still gain the moves.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

He wont be better than Melo, go ahead and quote me on it. He will never be better than Melo.

For never never.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

R-Star said:


> He wont be better than Melo, go ahead and quote me on it. He will never be better than Melo.
> 
> For never never.


Nice rationale.


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## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

durant put up better college numbers. and he is a very good 3 point shooter, while carmelo isn't.

pretty much i think the best case for durant is that he ends up being a similar player to carmelo, but also shooting 40% from 3.


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## Jesus of CopyMat (Feb 14, 2004)

I don't think he is considered "that much better" of a prospect than Anthony. Coming out of college, Carmelo was considered the 2nd or 3rd best prospect in a very good draft class. If they were in the same class, with Anthony just having won the Championship and Durant having the year he did, I think Durant would go a slot ahead of Anthony, but there would definitely be a contingent who would favor Anthony. He's not "that much better" a prospect. Just a tad bit better. Both could have been #1 overall picks had Anthony not been in the LeBron draft and if Durant isn't in the Oden draft.


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

I think Durant sort of benefited from being a part of a very good class, and he was a guy that because of the new rules went to college. My guess is others, like Dwight Howard and Josh Smith to name a couple, would have got a ton of ink by going to college.


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## 1 Penny (Jul 11, 2003)

Durant has the potential to be more impactful than Anthony.

First off, he has the size... height wise and length wise.

Obviously, he is skinny at this point, but once he gets a bit of muscle, probably around 20 pounds or more. He will be a top 10 rebounder.. or potential to be.

Scoring wise, he has the range but with a bit of size he should be able to finish and/or get to the line a lot more.


But those are all assuming he lives up to his current reputation.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

_Dre_ said:


> Nice rationale.



Thanks Dre, its so nice when you reply to my posts.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

They're about equal. You can go as far as saying Durant is just a more athletic Luol Deng with 3 point shot. Players always get hyped up when they enter the league.


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## DavidCain (Nov 22, 2006)

hes not that much better of a prospect then melo

thats why you have to pick oden over durant, as good as durant can be theres a decent amount of durants in the nba,great wingmen arent that rare to find at all i nthe nba unlike big men


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## Blazed (May 24, 2006)

Easy answer. Durant has superior size, attitude, athleticism, production, handles, offensive and defenssive skills. That's why he's considered a much better prospect than melo.


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## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

I think Durant has the type of length and ability to develop into a face up 4 that Anthony never did. He's also a better shooter right now than Anthony ever has or ever will be.


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## woodsboy (Aug 17, 2006)

My question is, will either of them win you a championship? Look at the teams who've won championships since the Jordan era. Lakers with Shaq, Spurs with Duncan, Heat with Shaq, and the Pistons, utilizing a team offense that played big, and taking advantage of a tired and disintegrating Lakers team. Had the Lakers played their A game, it would have been 4 for Shaq and 3 for Duncan. 

Without that Pistons win, which in many ways was a fluke, the only teams who have won championships in the new century had the dominant frontcourt player. 

The only player in this draft who will win your team a championship is Oden. Durant will be a great scorer for your team and will probably put them in the playoffs every year. You might even make the finals and lose to a superior team. But championships? Durant is going to need too many shots and will keep your team good enough for 12 years to insure that you won't get the next Shaq or Duncan. 

For Durant to win championships for your team, he'd need to be Bird/Magic/Jordan good. THere's been a lot of hype over athletic, long, versitile 3/4s for a while, but none of them win you championships so far.

What you really want out of a long, versitile, athletic 3 is Shawn Marion / Tayshaun Prince. A guy who can hit from the outside, post up smaller guys, play D, and fight for the boards but won't take 15+ shots a game and will be happy as your 2nd or 3rd scorer.


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## Jizzy (Aug 24, 2005)

Durant sort of plays like Keith Van Horn in his prime but Durant will be light years better. Similar styles though. Both guys were long, could shoot, both can post up but don't do it often. Durant, however, will be tougher and have balls unlike KVH.


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## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

First of all, Durant IS considered a better prospect right now than Melo was when he was coming out. Melo was reguarded hands down as the best player in college basketball, but he also had a LOT of doubters about his ability to translate his success to the NBA. There are a number of reasons people are higher on Durant than they were on Melo.

For one, Durant is in college because he has to be. Melo was in college because he chose to be. If it weren't for the age limit Durant would probably have been the #2 pick in the draft last year (after Greg Oden). Carmelo wasn't quite so highly reguarded coming out of high school. As a result, people were paying attention to Durant much earlier in his freshman season than they were paying attention to Melo and I think they probably know his game better as a result. Plus he produced more.

Durant also has a much prettier game and more physical gifts. He's tall, long, and smooth. Coming out of college, a lot of people mistook Carmelo's bulky frame for him being overweight. Carmelo also basically had the exact same game as Glenn Robinson and Antoine Walker who people were also becoming increasingly sour on at the time.

Carmelo's defense was also a major question. Syracuse hid him in a zone his entire freshman year and because of his perceived weight issues people didn't think he would be able guard NBA small forwards. This turned out to be a reasonable concern as he was a very poor defensive player his first couple years and even now could only be considered average on his best day.

Because Carmelo's game was so dependant on out-quicking and out-muscling people, there were a lot more questions as to whether he would be as effective as a pro. Durant's game leaves a lot less to question. He's a lights out shooter and he's big enough and quick enough to get his shot off over anyone so there isn't a lot to worry about.

I don't know if it's so much that people consider Durant to be a much better prospect as it is they consider him to a much safer one.


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## Deng101 (Jan 13, 2005)

The only reason Melo didnt get the same amount of hype is because Lebron was the next "Michael Jordan" Any prospect, even Oden would be 2nd fiddle to lebron coming out.


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## swift88 (Jul 4, 2004)

Two completely different players. Durant = Deng++. Melo has the best fundamental basketball skills of a small forward in a long time, he reminds me of Danny Manning + Pierce.


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## The Krakken (Jul 17, 2002)

c_dog said:


> They're about equal. You can go as far as saying Durant is just a more athletic Luol Deng with 3 point shot. Players always get hyped up when they enter the league.


He doesn't have Luol's Strength, Bulk or Defensive intensity. That's a pretty bad comparison, IMHO, even if he is a much better shooter, quicker, and has a height advantage.


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

better Rashard Lewis=Durant thats the obvious comparison


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

The Krakken said:


> He doesn't have Luol's Strength, Bulk or Defensive intensity. That's a pretty bad comparison, IMHO, even if he is a much better shooter, quicker, and has a height advantage.


Yeah that's what I'm thinking too, the Durant to Luol Deng comparison needs to stop. Deng was a tough Power Forward in College, Durant has length and height, but no where near the power or post presence of Deng or Melo for that matter. I understand that he rebounded more, but he was also the tallest guy on his team in the middle of a zone. Melo had Forth and Warrick eating up a lot of rebounds. Deng had Williams and I believe Shavlik. If you keep PJ Tucker (not even a true post player) on that Texas team, Durant would average much closer to Melo's rebounds, or lower.

I don't think Durant is a better player. Durant is a better jumpshooter, but in terms of both player's two point field goals in college, they are almost identical. Melo scored much more points in the paint, and Durant got more on mid-range jump shots. I think Durant has not shown the ability to score in the post as well as Melo did in college. I don't think that makes him a bad player, but considering his smaller frame I think it's going to be more difficult for him to find a place banging in the NBA. I think Rashard Lewis or T-Mac are better comparisons, and people are assuming too much because of his height. He could really be anything depending on what he does with his body, but at this point he is a very perimeter oriented player.

I can't say who I would draft if they came out in the same year, but Melo is a favorable comparison because he's an elite player in the league. He's not really a better prospect, most people considered Melo to be a legitimate #1 pick had LeBron (and Darko) not been in the 2003 Draft.


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## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

Nimreitz said:


> I think Rashard Lewis or T-Mac are better comparisons


i really do not understand the tmac comparison at all. durant simply can't handle the ball like tmac can. and without the handle, he can't be tmac.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

Fair enough, but he can create his own shot off the dribble, and he's a perimeter oriented, yet extremely long and tall wing. He won't just take over and run the team at crunch time like a T-Mac or Kobe though I agree.


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## lw32 (May 24, 2003)

MLKG said:


> For one, Durant is in college because he has to be. Melo was in college because he chose to be. If it weren't for the age limit Durant would probably have been the #2 pick in the draft last year (after Greg Oden). Carmelo wasn't quite so highly reguarded coming out of high school. As a result, people were paying attention to Durant much earlier in his freshman season than they were paying attention to Melo


Durant would not have gone 2nd overall at this time last year, sorry. There was serious debate involving Thad Young being the best SF in the class, especially after his HS all-star game showings. His stock has improved significantly during his time at UT. If you can find a respectable source with a statement, anywhere, that Durant was projected to go 2nd last year I'd love to see it. Durant was considered a top 10 pick, not a top 2 pick out of HS. There were a lot of question marks about his ability to handle the physicality at the next level because of his weight. He's obviously answered these questions now, but hadn't at this time last year.

As for Carmelo's hype out of HS, it was certainly large. He came from leading the top high school team in the nation and had a few duels with LeBron in the Oak Hill-SVSM games. He was ranked 2nd overall in the HS class of '02. Same position as Durant. I'd say the hype surrounding Durant and Carmelo out of HS was similar. Carmelo was the Parade and Basketball America POTY, he only lost the USA Today POTY award to some junior named LeBron. Perhaps it was just you that was sleeping on Carmelo out of HS? The scouts and colleges certainly weren't. The average fan, perhaps. Carmelo certainly improved his stock by attending Syracuse for a year, but he would have been a lotto pick out of HS.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Remember Amare went #9 in 2002. He would have went higher had he went to college for a year. Durant is definitely more highly regarded out of HS, but that's because the 2002 HS class was slept on tremendously.


Chris Bosh, Carmelo Anthony, Raymond Felton, Jarrett Jack, Andre Iguodala, Amare Stoudemire, Deron Williams, Rashad McCants, Sean May. Some pretty good players there from that class (and I am too lazy to look up the rest right now).


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## lw32 (May 24, 2003)

HKF said:


> Remember Amare went #9 in 2002. He would have went higher had he went to college for a year. Durant is definitely more highly regarded out of HS, but that's because the 2002 HS class was slept on tremendously.
> 
> 
> Chris Bosh, Carmelo Anthony, Raymond Felton, Jarrett Jack, Andre Iguodala, Amare Stoudemire, Deron Williams, Rashad McCants, Sean May. Some pretty good players there from that class (and I am too lazy to look up the rest right now).


The only reason Amare dropped to #9 is because he was flagged. He was labeled a problem child by many franchises because of the circus surrounding him and his bouncing around from HS to HS. It wasn't because he couldn't play, it was because he was a definite question mark in the character department. And when you think of Leon Smith (which wasn't so long ago back then), many GMs didn't want to waste a top 10 pick on a possible Smith re-enactment. Amare had barely played HS basketball because of the problems surrounding him with his mother, coaches, teams, etc..

Carmelo was going to come out, Mom squashed his plans though.


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## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

Lachlanwood32 said:


> Durant would not have gone 2nd overall at this time last year, sorry. There was serious debate involving Thad Young being the best SF in the class, especially after his HS all-star game showings. His stock has improved significantly during his time at UT. If you can find a respectable source with a statement, anywhere, that Durant was projected to go 2nd last year I'd love to see it. Durant was considered a top 10 pick, not a top 2 pick out of HS. There were a lot of question marks about his ability to handle the physicality at the next level because of his weight. He's obviously answered these questions now, but hadn't at this time last year.


What you're missing in your analysis is how he would have improved his draft stock in workouts. I agree that the consensus was top 10 in the draft, but he was co-MVP of the McD AA game and co-MVP of the Jordan. I have no doubts that he would have tremendous buzz around him if was working out for teams.


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## lw32 (May 24, 2003)

cpawfan said:


> What you're missing in your analysis is how he would have improved his draft stock in workouts. I agree that the consensus was top 10 in the draft, but he was co-MVP of the McD AA game and co-MVP of the Jordan. I have no doubts that he would have tremendous buzz around him if was working out for teams.


Agreed, cpaw. He would have improved his stock with individual workouts. But I don't believe we should undermine his vast improvements THIS year. Durant took a lot of steps with his game during his freshman year, he is a much better player now and has proven he's able to play at his current weight against bigger opponents. He's also proven that he will be a perimeter player. At Montrose he was all over the place at times. I just couldn't see him going 2nd last year, not without his monster freshman year. Too many unanswered question marks about his size.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

I still think the reason Melo wasn't going higher had to do with the fact that the entire 2002 HS class was not respected as much as it should have been. Look at '04, they had 8 first round picks, then Marvin Williams, LaMarcus Aldridge and Rudy Gay all taken in the lottery the following seasons. 

If GM's were really red-flagging Amare, then that would be stupid because as we know not every case is the same. Leon Smith is a person who grew up with no parents. Amare just had a rough background due to his parents being screwups, not to mention a coach trying to screw him over. Amare had much more basketball talent than Leon Smith, without the psychological baggage.


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## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

You guys are forgetting that Amare faked an injury so he couldn't work out for other teams as he wanted to go to the Suns. If he had actually worked out for more teams, he would have been drafted higher.


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## ChiSox (Jun 9, 2004)

Amare, went 9th because he only had two workouts for teams, got hurt and didn't workout anymore. If he would have worked out he probably would have gotten drafted a lot earlier.


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## EGarrett (Aug 12, 2002)

c_dog said:


> They're about equal. You can go as far as saying Durant is just a more athletic Luol Deng with 3 point shot. Players always get hyped up when they enter the league.


Considering Deng is average 18 and 7 this year...a taller, more athletic and better shooting version of him would be nasty.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

Not as physical as Deng, but a much better shooter and is quicker.


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