# Rudy Fernández



## AMR (Oct 5, 2003)

Today, he helped his team DKV Joventut winning against one of the best teams of ACB, Etosa Alicante.
Here is his statline:

29 minutes
24 points
4/5 2pt shots
4/6 3pt shots
4/5 free throws
6 rebounds (5 def + 1 off)
3 assists
3 turnovers
2 committed fouls
7 received fouls
and 31 of index rating.


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## MagnusPinus (Aug 27, 2003)

Not bad:laugh: great production with few shoots..a game a la Manu.. If he can find continuity is going to be awesome..


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## AMR (Oct 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>MagnusPinus</b>!
> Not bad:laugh: great production with few shoots..a game a la Manu.. If he can find continuity is going to be awesome..


Look at his game-by-game stats 

He's averaging 13.2 points per game. Navarro only makes 0.8 ppg more than him.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

I saw the game and he has been so good. Everytime he touches the ball he creates game, either for himself or for his teammates. His basketball IQ is not used to see in a guy his age, he plays like a veteran, and he can do everything. He can score, he can rebound, he can pass the ball, he can defend... and he's still physically raw.

He's a sure lottery pick for me, I can't see him going down the 13th spot. He's so good to go under that...

PS: Oh! and take a look at him at the Euro champ, he can even be our starting SG, I wouldn't put my money on Navarro being the starting SG, I think the possibilities are 50/50.


Bye.


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## AMR (Oct 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>yomismo</b>!
> 
> 
> PS: Oh! and take a look at him at the Euro champ, he can even be our starting SG, I wouldn't put my money on Navarro being the starting SG, I think the possibilities are 50/50.
> ...


I think Rudy has an advantage over Navarro. It looks like Rudy really loves basketball and tries hard to improve, but JC... he hasn't got much better and he's not as exciting as he was before. Anyway Navarro had a good game today (21 points)


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

I cant wait to see this kid in the league. I hope he plays for a contender, like the wolves! They have him 19th right now to the wolves at nbadraft.net. YOu guys have an idea why he has dropped out of the lottery?


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>sheefo13</b>!
> I cant wait to see this kid in the league. I hope he plays for a contender, like the wolves! They have him 19th right now to the wolves at nbadraft.net. YOu guys have an idea why he has dropped out of the lottery?


it would probably be to his advantage not to get drafted by a weaker team. i saw him play in limited action over in athens and he looked really good. some mocks like draft city(they're good by the way) have pg's like felton,jack and gilchrist going ahead of rudy. from what i've seen those guys arent in his class as a basketball player. besides you dont usually see a bunch of pg's going that high. regardless rudy looks like he's going to be a good one.


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## MagnusPinus (Aug 27, 2003)

There is no doubt that this guy has class.. 
A 1985 born guard being already a protagonist in one of the best(if not the best) leagues in Europe is incredible..but I don't know if he could already be a factor in the Nba... Maybe he should make an year or two in a team that plays the euroleague... so he could be super ready... but I don't think he is gonna wait.. 
Sincerly I've never seen an entire game of the guy(just something in the Olympics) but I can say he is still skinny... and in Europe there are better guards at this point... The talent is there, the potential too, but are we sure he can contribute right away?
What is your idea AMR?


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## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

I'm an NCAA guy so this question is going to sound a little stupid, but could somebody tell me who is who between Sergio Rodriguez and Rudy Fernandez? I know one of them dominated the world juniors last summer and is considered a potential top 5 pick, but I can never remember which one is which.


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## MagnusPinus (Aug 27, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>blabla97</b>!
> I'm an NCAA guy so this question is going to sound a little stupid, but could somebody tell me who is who between Sergio Rodriguez and Rudy Fernandez? I know one of them dominated the world juniors last summer and is considered a potential top 5 pick, but I can never remember which one is which.


the one that dominated the world juniors is Sergio Rodriguez..Rudy is already part of the "senior" national team


http://www.euroleague.net/plantillas/jugador.jsp?id=CVM
He plays for estudiantes... also in the euroleague.. he is already a member of the rotation, and has impact... Doesn't contribute every game but I think is enough for a guy that age:yes:


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## AMR (Oct 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>MagnusPinus</b>!
> There is no doubt that this guy has class..
> A 1985 born guard being already a protagonist in one of the best(if not the best) leagues in Europe is incredible..but I don't know if he could already be a factor in the Nba... Maybe he should make an year or two in a team that plays the euroleague... so he could be super ready... but I don't think he is gonna wait..
> Sincerly I've never seen an entire game of the guy(just something in the Olympics) but I can say he is still skinny... and in Europe there are better guards at this point... The talent is there, the potential too, but are we sure he can contribute right away?
> What is your idea AMR?


It's a good question.. can he contribute now? His only weakness is that he's skinny. Even in defense, technically he's very good, he knows what to do, but he's still very skinny. In ACB, sometimes the players push him and he's like a feather... in NBA he'd have to play against strong guys like LeBron James or Corey Maggette, but I repeat, that's his only weakness. He's an athletic guy who just loves this game (if I'm not wrong, in an article, someone called him a basketball nerd), and has coached young teams being 17 years old. That says a lot about him. I'm sure he'll improve and he could repeat what Ginobili did, but maybe he's scared of repeating 'Navarro's way' and get stuck in Europe.
I don't know what he could do in NBA right now, I only know he played well against the American NT.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

I was talking to him this summer and he just wants to win everything, he's a hard competitor and I'm so sure he'll end up in the NBA after this summer.

But I don't expect him having a great first season in the NBA. Offensively he can perfectly do a good job, but in defense he'll struggle due to his weak body, he's still underdeveloped, but strenght is the most easy thing to develop. He'll have more limited action due to his defensive weakness (he's a good defender but he can perfectly have his weight under the 90 kg and that's a problem to play defense in the NBA).

But once he gets an absolute adult body he'll be a very good player, I think he can perfectly be better than Manu, my thought is that he has a higher potential (he's a better shooter and feels the game better than Manu).


PS: Rudy plays for Joventut, from Badalona, next to Barcelona. The guy who plays for Estudiantes is Sergio Rodriguez.

PS2: Oh! that game has made him the best national player of the week.


Bye.


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>yomismo</b>!
> I was talking to him this summer and he just wants to win everything, he's a hard competitor and I'm so sure he'll end up in the NBA after this summer.
> 
> But I don't expect him having a great first season in the NBA. Offensively he can perfectly do a good job, but in defense he'll struggle due to his weak body, he's still underdeveloped, but strenght is the most easy thing to develop. He'll have more limited action due to his defensive weakness (he's a good defender but he can perfectly have his weight under the 90 kg and that's a problem to play defense in the NBA).
> ...


i dont know that much about rudy but manu has a tremendous feel for the game of basketball. he is a guy that doesnt have to put up big numbers to be successful. if rudy has that kind of vision then he should be talked about in a weak draft as going much higher than the mid first round that some suggest.


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## ChrisCrossover (Sep 27, 2004)

From what I know of him, he is a much better shooter and decision maker than Manu. In the NBA, the Argentinian sometimes goes head-through-wall while succeeding thanks to his athleticism. I think Rudy is ahead of him in his basketball IQ. That's why I prefer Brent Barry as a comparison. But I know you Spanish guys have better judgment on this comparison being adequate or not. Either way, He will be a top-10 selection. I'm very optimistic when it comes to that.


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## AMR (Oct 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>ChrisCrossover</b>!
> From what I know of him, he is a much better shooter and decision maker than Manu. In the NBA, the Argentinian sometimes goes head-through-wall while succeeding thanks to his athleticism. I think Rudy is ahead of him in his basketball IQ. That's why I prefer Brent Barry as a comparison. But I know you Spanish guys have better judgment on this comparison being adequate or not. Either way, He will be a top-10 selection. I'm very optimistic when it comes to that.


You've got a good point. Yes, maybe Barry is a better comparison. I think Rudy is compared to Ginobili just because they're Europeans.


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## ChrisCrossover (Sep 27, 2004)

Um, you mean "internationals", don't you? 

I think the problem with the Barry comparison is that many people see rather an old veteran in him, who cannot compare to a young gun like Rudy, but they ignore how Barry used to be earlier in his career. He was a slam-dunk champ after all.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

I've never seen Rudy as a player like Ginobili. While Ginobili depends a lot on his athleticism (and that includes quickness, strenght, leaping ability...) Rudy has a good body but he has still no strenght, he just uses his quickness (nice first step). Rudy should be a more technical player while Manu probably is a more physical player.

I've always seen Rudy more similar to Kerry Kittles (a guy who can do almost everything, good shooter, good defender, can pass the ball, maybe a better scorer than Kittles), even both have the same kind of body.

I don't think he'll be a top 10 pick, but sure he'll be a lottery pick.


Bye.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

And again we had the opportunity to watch another good game by Rudy. Thisweekend he has been more "all around". Here you are his statistics:

9 points (3/5, 0/0, 3/5), 9 rebounds (3+6), 4 assists, 3 steals and 7 received fould for an efficiency of 22.

It's not easy to have 22 efficiency points with just 9 points scored, and it's even more difficult being a 6'5'' SG.


Bye.


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## ChrisCrossover (Sep 27, 2004)

There can be no doubt that we are dealing with a special player here. Still, there are two questions that come up, and both are hard to answer:

1. Could he be one of those early bloomers who never become much better than they are at an early age? 

2. Does Fernandez have the competitive fire that drives someone like Ginobili and that is absolutely necessary to thrive in the NBA, especially as a foreign wing? 

I guess only time will tell, but the answers to both questions are crucial for his success on the highest level. Normally, I'm more interested in centers, but this time, I'm really anxious to see how Rudy will cope with NBA basketball.


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## ChitwoodStyle (Oct 9, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>ChrisCrossover</b>!
> 
> 1. Could he be one of those early bloomers who never become much better than they are at an early age?


Why is this usually a question when it comes to European players why is Rudy Gay a superstar and Rudy F. maybe a good player?

This isn't a question to you I am not jumping your case for asking it, but I just never have understood while there are always questions when it comes to nonamericans.


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## ChrisCrossover (Sep 27, 2004)

No offense taken. 

As a matter of fact, I wasn't thinking of Fernandez as an international player. It was more in the Luol Deng, Al Jefferson tradition of players who are already very good at a very young age. Considering his qualities as a 19 year-old, I can't help but ask this question when it comes to Rudy Fernandez. Where exactly lies his potential? 

BTW: In terms of game development, he is years ahead of both Gay and Marvin Williams.


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## ChitwoodStyle (Oct 9, 2003)

Well I am glad you didn't get upset.

I can't wait for Rudy to lose his childish fat, and grow into an adult body, because when he does he will be one of the best players in the world. I wonder if he will try and stay in Badalona for another year, because he really seems like he wants to win in Spain for his hometown/childhood team.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

I hope you're able to see this dunk:










He jumped from out of the paint and got the 2 points being fouled.

The gift is not so impressive but the people who saw it live say it was an amazing dunk.


Bye.


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## Toxicity (Jul 21, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>yomismo</b>!
> I hope you're able to see this dunk:
> 
> 
> ...


Well, seeing this pic Fernandez seems in the paint when started to jump not out... but it's a nice dunk anyway!


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## ChrisCrossover (Sep 27, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>ChitwoodStyle</b>!
> Well I am glad you didn't get upset.


No, not at all. Why should I be? In fact, I understand and share the concern you uttered. A lot of European players have to face these doubts (sometimes even prejudices), perhaps because American basketball fans cannot judge them as well as college players they get to see regularly? I'm just guessing, since I don't know this situation myself.

BTW: Sorry, but the dunk down there seems anything but spectacular to me. Looks like the regular stuff even old and injured Bob Sura will give you on a daily basis. As a matter of fact, judging by Rudy's level of elevation, he looks like a six footer on this dunk. Really nothing spectacular.


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

possibly brent barry? dunk contest.....
no thats over board but if he becomes as talented as he is supposed to be, he will be one of a kind.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

Hopefully the raptors take a long look at him with their second pick. 

Is he a future NBA point guard or would he be more effective at the 2? Is Kirk a good comparison?


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## Perfection (May 10, 2004)

He's goin to the Blazers. Watch and see.

I mean c'mon. Us fans got what we wanted in telfair. We'll get Fernandez if our pick is above the top 5. 

We want a shooter and he appears to be a great one. Also, I think that with this explosive speed and great handles...etc, which I've read about, he could be an outstanding combo guard to fill a future POR rotation of Telfair/Rudy/Monia (or Outlaw if he gets there). 

Anyways, I think that he could turn out to be a good player and I like the versatility in the backcourt. 

So, I really want him to be a Blazer. With the way we're playing...we'll be in the right spot to grab him. So don't be surprised to see another great young player to round out the Portland core. 

Exciting...drafting...isnt' it.


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## ChrisCrossover (Sep 27, 2004)

Notoriously, the Blazers aren't the best place for young talent. I don't even want to start a list of athletes who joined them at a young age and were never seen again until years later, when another team actually gave them a chance to play. Plus, there is the infamous Jailblazers tradition. I think Portland is one of the least suitable places for Fernandez to go. 

Personally, I'd like to see him in San Antonio. To me, there isn't a better team for him than the Spurs. He would absolutely thrive anlongside Duncan (well, who doesn't?). Other choices would be the Jazz because of Jerry Sloan and Raul Lopez, the Mavs for their international tradition, and the Cavaliers, since Rudy would form a heck of a duo with LeBron. 

But please, not the Knicks, Blazers, Warriors or teams like that. We might as well beat him up ourselves, yell at him and not let him play right now, and leave him in Spain, where he would wind up again in the long run after a career start with one of those three teams.


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

> Plus, there is the infamous Jailblazers tradition. I think Portland is one of the least suitable places for Fernandez to go.


That whole Jailblazers thing is so lame and cliche.....If you watch some ball they traded away most of their cancerous "jailblazers" and are cleaning up their image.....

They have just as many troublemakers on this team now as anyother team in the league.....


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## ChrisCrossover (Sep 27, 2004)

Maybe, but the reputation is there and they deserve it. Fernandez's agent wouldn't be doing his job if he didn't pay attention to things like that. Plus, look at the combined minutes guys like Outlaw and Woods actually spent on the court in their rookie seasons and tell me that Portland is the right place for Rudy to start his career. I just don't see that coming.


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

> Maybe, but the reputation is there and they deserve it.


I dont think that the reputation is still there...much of the media realized that we no longer have that target on their back ever since the new management came in and has cleaned up house.....

What the Pacers did in an NBA arena THIS YEAR should be something more to look at then a Blazer team that has cleaned up their image.......



> Fernandez's agent wouldn't be doing his job if he didn't pay attention to things like that.


If his agent was doing his job he would realize that Portland is a rebuilding team with great young players and three veterans with expiring contracts and going seperate ways....DA will most likely be gone and Fernandez could come in and start....



> Plus, look at the combined minutes guys like Outlaw and Woods actually spent on the court in their rookie seasons and tell me that Portland is the right place for Rudy to start his career. I just don't see that coming.


Maurice Cheeks is the reason that young guys dont get minutes on the Blazers....Thats not going to be a problem because Mo will be lucky to make through the season and if not he will definetly be canned in the offseason......


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## Perfection (May 10, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>ChrisCrossover</b>!
> Maybe, but the reputation is there and they deserve it. Fernandez's agent wouldn't be doing his job if he didn't pay attention to things like that. Plus, look at the combined minutes guys like Outlaw and Woods actually spent on the court in their rookie seasons and tell me that Portland is the right place for Rudy to start his career. I just don't see that coming.


And look at the teams during that time. When we drafted woods we still had a pretty solid team...and he just didn't see minutes cause he wasn't good enough. 

with outlaw, he was also extremely "raw" and had a bunch of SF's in front of him. With Fernandez it will be different, as with teh loss of NVE and Damon in the backcourt...and DA sucking it up..., there will be lots of minutes to play. Sure, he might have to compete with Monia...but if he can't beat him out then I guess he doesn't deserve THAT many minutes or start immediately.


The whole JailBlazers thing is so incredibly stupid. 


Oh, and I'm sure he's just looking to go to a great team like SA. Good luck in them getting them, as they'd have to trade quite a ways up. 

How often does a player not go to where he was drafted.


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## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>yomismo</b>!
> And again we had the opportunity to watch another good game by Rudy. Thisweekend he has been more "all around". Here you are his statistics:
> 
> 9 points (3/5, 0/0, 3/5), 9 rebounds (3+6), 4 assists, 3 steals and 7 received fould for an efficiency of 22.
> ...


 22 EFF? Wow.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

As most of you know, here in Spain, teams plays once a week. Yesterday Rudy's team played again and he played another good game. His team, Joventut, won a road game at Tenerife 70-83.

Rudy scored 15 points (4/4, 2/3 and 1/2), grabbed 4 rebounds (all 4 in defense), dished 4 assists and has one steal and one block. And all that for an efficiency of 21.

He's increasing his numbers lately, now is in a very good moment of the season, and I hope he keeps on playing that hard.



Bye.


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## ChrisCrossover (Sep 27, 2004)

I've got a question to our Spanish colleagues here: 

Has Fernandez played great wing competition (guys like Madrid's SF Gelabale for example) this season and if so, how did these match-ups end? Thanks in advance.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

First of all, we've gotta say Rudy is now in his best moment this season. He didn't started so good this season, but as the games has passed his level has increased week after week.

Against Unicaja (JR Bremer) he scored 19. Against FC Barcelona (Navarro, Bodiroga...) he scored just 9 points but had an efficiency of 15. Against R.Madrid (Gelabale) he scored 15 points for an afficiency of 18. Against TAU (one of the hardest teams in ACB if not the hardest) he struggled and just scored 10 points for an efficiency of 9. Against Breogan he faced Charlie Bell, one of the best scorers in Europe and scored 9 points for an efficiency of 16, but he let Bell in just 8 points and an efficiency of 0 (Bell was in foul trouble that game).

If you want to know how does he plays in important games (which I supose you really want to know) I'm just gonna tell you he was the most exciting player in last year King's Cup (a very nice and hard competition where losing a game means go home) and he took his team to the Final and was nominated MVP despite his team lost.


PS: Gelabale is not really great competition for the level we have in the spanish league. He's just an average player, who plays with heart, is a good defender and always does his job, but not a star of the league. He has great potential, but nowadays he can't be considered a star, Rudy is way better than him.



Bye.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

Oh! I forgot he scored 24 for an efficiency of 31 against 1st classified of ACB three games ago as Rudy's team won.


Bye.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>SkywalkerAC</b>!
> Hopefully the raptors take a long look at him with their second pick.
> 
> Is he a future NBA point guard or would he be more effective at the 2? Is Kirk a good comparison?


I think he is the prototipical SG. He's not a combo guard, no way. If needed he can play PG, cause he has very good handless and a high basketball IQ (he averages 4 assists per game), but he's a pure SG.

He's a good shoter, he can score in any way, he can pass like the best SG's, he can defend nicely... No way he was a combo guard. I supose you said it because he's 6'5'', but despite being 6'5'' he has very long arms, a good leaping ability and can perfectly defend a SG. He's skinny and that can be a matter to play SG, but despite being so skinny he doesn't have many strenght problems. He's too skinny, but he can penetrate thought the traffic without any problem.


Bye.


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## ChitwoodStyle (Oct 9, 2003)

Someone already posted it, but Rudy had a great game this weekend and has been playing great lately.


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

would you compare him to Crawford...body type? skills?


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

idk, i wouldnt. He doesnt seem to have the 'take you off the dribble" mentality. I would say kidd to ginobli range......


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

Kidd? No way. Rudy is 100% a SG, nothing in common with a PG. He played SG, he plays SG and he'll play SG. He can play PG if needed (think about injury problems on the team, for exemple), that's for sure, but he's a SG, has the game of a SG and the body of a SG.

The comparison to Jamal Crawford is not so bad at all. Both have a similar height, both are a bit skinny, both are good scorers... but Rudy is not really the combo guard Crawford is, as I said he's a pure SG. Rudy's also a better defender than Crawford (well, probably not yet, but he will) and Rudy is much more consistent than Crawford. I'm not meaning Rudy can't have a bad day, cause that wouldn't be true, but even when he has a bad day he can minimize the effects of it. If he's not scoring as he uses to score, he'll shot less that day and take a bigger effort at defense and search a better option on the offensive side. When Crawford has a bad day he still shots and shots, no matter about his FG%.

Crawford lacks concentration at times, Rudy's mind is all the time on the court. Rudy will be a better contributor than Crawford at both ends of the court.

In my opinion the more suitable Rudy's comparisons are probably: 

- A better shooter Manu Ginobili, with a better scoring ability and a bit less defensive.

- A potential rich man Kerry Kittles, since he can hit the three, defend nicely, score and pass the ball (then, I would say Rudy can be a better scorer than Kittles).

- A poor (not a lot, just a bit) version of Ray Allen with a worse shooting ability.

In his best seasons Rudy can perfectly average something like 18-20 points, 5-6 rebounds, 5 assists and 2 steels. I think that's realistic.




Bye.


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

well i know you know all this first hand since you live in spain, but from all the other scouting reports i have read, he is supposed to be a combo guard....

BTW, he hurt his ankle which is having his stock drop? He is out 6-8 weeks. He went from lottery to late first round. I bet it will go back up when he works out for teams.


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## yomismo (Feb 29, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>sheefo13</b>!
> well i know you know all this first hand since you live in spain, but from all the other scouting reports i have read, he is supposed to be a combo guard....
> 
> BTW, he hurt his ankle which is having his stock drop? He is out 6-8 weeks. He went from lottery to late first round. I bet it will go back up when he works out for teams.


As I said he's a pure SG, not a combo guard. However, due to his height and the fact he can play PG if needed (he's so skilled and has good basketball IQ, but he's a way better contributor from the SG spot) many internet scoutings say he's a combo guard. No one who has seen play would say that (in fact I can't remember him playing PG...). Despite being 6'5'' he's a SG with very long arms and a good leaping ability.

Take a look at his draftcity.com profile, it's pretty accurated.

And about his draft possibilities, either Denver (perfect compliment for Melo), Philly (think about Iverson-Rudy-Iguodala) or Indiana (specially since Miller retires. Minnesotta can be another possibility, but I'd put my money on Denver drafting him.


Bye.


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## josegr (Jun 12, 2003)

In the last 2 years, I've seen Rudy playing in 30 games at least. He never has played PG as a pro. When he was younger he always played as a PG, at 16 years he switched to SG. Because of this he has very good handles. He's comfortable carrying the ball to the offensive side and is a good passer, but I don't see him as a point guard in the future.

The most important for him if he wants to play in the NBA is to put on some weight. Now he has a Shawn-Bradley-type of body ...


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## ballstorm (Nov 30, 2003)

> Gelabale is not really great competition for the level we have in the spanish league. He's just an average player, who plays with heart, is a good defender and always does his job, but not a star of the league. He has great potential, but nowadays he can't be considered a star, *Rudy is way better than him*.


Sorry , but this last comment was biased , to say the least.


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## The Mad Viking (Jun 12, 2003)

ballstorm said:


> Sorry , but this last comment was biased , to say the least.


I don't think so. I think it was completely fair and totally factual.

Gelabale may very well end up a better NBA player. But right now, he is very limited as a hoopster; effective in being a great athlete and smart enough not to do too many things that he isn't able to YET.

Gelabale is scoring 7.7ppg 4.1rpg with less than 1apg.

Fernandez is scoring 13ppg with 3.7apg (5th in ACB) and 1.8 spg (3rd in ACB)

Gelabale's team also plays Euroleague, so overall his competition is a bit tougher, but the two teams are roughly equivalent in the ACB. I can't find Gelabale's stats for ACB competition only.

Should also mention that Mickael is 21, and Rudy is 19.


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

Rudy is definately a better prospect, but he definately isn't already way better player than Gelebale.
Gelebale is a role player in a strong team, while Fernandez is the 2nd option (behind Arnold) in a relatively weaker team (definately Joventud is weaker than Real)... not to mention all the hype Rudy is receiving... just like Navarro has at the age of 18/19...


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## Zalgirinis (Feb 18, 2003)

I am surely gonna be biased in ballstorm's eyes, but I still can have an opinion, right? 

IMHO if to talk about both players playing in Europe now or in the future I think that Rudy is way better player. That doesnt mean that Gelabele is bad or anything, just Rudy already shows his skills and still has big upside. He really fits the European style of basketball and would shine for long if he had stayed here.

Now about playing in NBA. Gelabele is very athletic and thats a big plus in NBA for young Euro players. Though I still think that Rudy would become a better player, but with NBA you cant be sure in what team, with what coach or with what players you gonna be stuck in your first years. So if lets they both come next season and Gelabele gets playing time while Rudy sits on the bench everything could easily change.


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## AMR (Oct 5, 2003)

Rudy is better than Gelabale. And I'm not attacking Gelabale, maybe I'm just hyping Rudy, but I prefer him to Navarro. I love the way Rudy understands basketball, he creates things.
On the other hand, can become a very effective NBA player. He has the tools, and will probably develop them.


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## ballstorm (Nov 30, 2003)

The Mad Viking said:


> I don't think so. I think it was completely fair and totally factual.
> 
> Gelabale may very well end up a better NBA player. But right now, he is very limited as a hoopster; effective in being a great athlete and smart enough not to do too many things that he isn't able to YET.
> 
> ...


I've attended many cholet's games and have seen lots of gelabale's games . He was a member of a small french team and did not received as much hype as rudy . Now you can compare the stats , that's a very pleasant hobby but you should know that it does not give any serious idea of what exactly the player looks like . Coming straight out of a small french club and becoming a starter in the Real Madrid without struggling alot , that should give you an idea of the talent of the man . Gelabale has not assert himself as soon as Rudy , but that does not imply that he is a worse player .

Now I admit that i'm biased too (  ) . I've seen Rudy many times and he is without a doubt a very talented player . he might end up playing better than gelabale . Saying such a thing is absolutely not an heresy . Everybody is entitled to have an opinion , and this one is very defendable .

What upsets me from time to time , is reading things like : " right now, he is very limited as a hoopster; effective in being a great athlete and smart enough not to do too many things that he isn't able to YET".

So a 21 years old _limited hoopster_ can play as a starter in ACB for the great Real Madrid (ranked first in ACB)? Do you exactly know what he can do and what can't? Do you have any idea of the difference that might exists between what he can actually do and what he is asked to by Bozidar Maljkovic?


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## ChitwoodStyle (Oct 9, 2003)

ballstorm said:


> the great Real Madrid (ranked first in ACBQUOTE]
> 
> Ah that hurts the ears to hear.
> 
> I do agree with your analysis of Gelebale's ability to join a top team and perform right away, however in what I have seen of both of them, Rudy looks better, plus he gets props for being able to mentally take on the role of top player at such a young age.


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## Genjuro (Jul 17, 2002)

I do think Rudy is better than Gelabale now. I can see Rudy having at least a similar role like Gelabale has in a team like Real Madrid, but I still don't see Gelabale as a possible go-to guy like Rudy is in Joventut's perimeter. Beyond what Maljkovic may ask Mickaël to do, the feeling you get watching them is that Rudy has a significantly better feel for the game and that he's more talented.

And I've personally liked Gelabale from day one in Real Madrid. Many people in Spain thought he was just an athlete with basically no skills (still some people do, as odd as it might sound).


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## ballstorm (Nov 30, 2003)

Genjuro said:


> I do think Rudy is better than Gelabale now. I can see Rudy having at least a similar role like Gelabale has in a team like Real Madrid, but I still don't see Gelabale as a possible go-to guy like Rudy is in Joventut's perimeter. Beyond what Maljkovic may ask Mickaël to do, the feeling you get watching them is that Rudy has a significantly better feel for the game and that he's more talented.
> 
> And I've personally liked Gelabale from day one in Real Madrid. Many people in Spain thought he was just an athlete with basically no skills (still some people do, as odd as it might sound).


Good post Genjuro . Even if I'm not utterly convinced that Rudy is a more talented player than Gelabale , I do appreciate your objectivity and your evident knowledge of the players .

And for what matters , I generally don't feel the necessity to compare 2 players when there is no obvious reason to do so . In this case , both of the players will likely be drafted this year (I hope so) but there is no reason to stretch this compariason out . 

I do not like to see Gelabale depicted as an "athlete with no skill" , which made me react (and possibly sound a bit provocative) .


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## Kmurph (May 7, 2003)

POR is a team that NEEDS Rudy Fernandez....

Not just for his shooting, of which POR is SEVERLY devoid of...but for his bball IQ, another areaa POR has been SEVERLY lacking in.

I think it is unfair to label POR as a bad place for a young player to go to, this team isn't the team of several years ago...there isnt going to be a playoff run....there are not going to be a lot of veterans standing in his way either...

And POR has cleaned house with the knuckleheads...

Ruben Pattersen will be the only one left...

But I cannot stress the bball IQ enough for POR, it is an issue that has hurt POR over the years...but help is on the way....Telfair has a high bball IQ IMO, as does Monia and Khryapa, and Pryzbilla...The much maligned Darius Miles has good bball IQ as well IMO. Zach is lacking, but is a hard worker and at least working on it, same goes for Outlaw...

That is 7 players 23 or younger, with this years draft pick being #8, and POR 2nd roud pick last year Sueng-Jin Ha being #9...that only leaves veteran holdovers DA, Ruben and Theo Ratliff.....

and I dont think Ruben or DA are long for the Blazers. 

Telfair\Fernandez\Miles\Zach\Pryzbilla is a young team that has somedecent bball IQ, something that cannot be said of past POR teams...


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## riehldeal (May 11, 2003)

Kmurph

dude i dont know about your assertion that darius miles has a good bball IQ...i dont know i have a hard time accepting that considering his stretches of consecutive tournovers...but yes monia VK and telfair have good bball iq's


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## Matthew Maurer (Oct 17, 2002)

I gotta disagree I think Gelabale is a better all around player than fellow countryman Pietrus. Now if I had to choose between him and Rudy??? I don't know if would also have to depend on my team.


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

Darius Miles, has probably the worst basketball IQ on the Blazers.....Not to mention probably the laziest players in the NBA....

I think most European players have extreme basketball IQ's, they most often times arn't extremly athletic, so they make up for it by playing smart fundamental basketball.....


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## Kmurph (May 7, 2003)

> Darius Miles, has probably the worst basketball IQ on the Blazers


That is flat out not true.... 

Miles shows very good recognition out on the floor...better defensively, but still good offensively....He passes well, has good recognition of double teams, good anticipation defensively...knows when to cut to the hoop, when off the ball....

He makes mistakes, but a majority of his turnovers are of the dribbling nature, and I say have more to do with the anemic offense (can it even be called that?) that POR runs than Miles himself...the guy is absolutely misused as a player for POR...and often he is just standing around...while damon & nve play hot potato with each other...so when he does get the ball he presses sometimes and tries to make things happen...or settles for a jumpshot...

Miles is not a low IQ ball player though...not at all...he is careless at times with the ball...but this is more dribbling than passing related....he settles for jumpers instead of posting up at times ...but in his defense I have seen VERY few plays run for the guy, and rarely if ever do they run him on screens....and his greatest assest (running the floor...as well as SEVERAL of POR players for that matter) is not played to either....

See, Mo's idea of offense is to have everyone else set screens for Damon or NVE...and then let them create....and bail out if they can't make anything happen...it is truly a pathetic spectacle to behold....


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

zagsfan20 said:


> Darius Miles, has probably the worst basketball IQ on the Blazers.....Not to mention probably the laziest players in the NBA....
> 
> I think most European players have extreme basketball IQ's, they most often times arn't extremly athletic, so they make up for it by playing smart fundamental basketball.....


I wouldn't even call it a IQ, it's just a part of fundamentals they get to learn in europe... it also has to do a lot with the rules- shorter three pointer, stricter with first step... so athleticism is not as important in europe as in NBA.


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## ballstorm (Nov 30, 2003)

Matthew Maurer said:


> I gotta disagree I think Gelabale is a better all around player than fellow countryman Pietrus. Now if I had to choose between him and Rudy??? I don't know if would also have to depend on my team.


Gelabale is a better basketball player than Pietrus IMO . Pietrus is a good defensive player who like to shoot threes (not that well) . His FG% is poor , his shoot selection is poor , his balhandling is suspect and his passing skills just average (at best) . I'm not saying that he is a bad player , but Diaw is better , as well as Gelabale . 

Gelabale lacks weight , but his shoot selection in the very competitive EL is uncommon (66% 2pt fg !) , he always plays under control , his overall fundamentals are very solid ( ballhandling) . And he is one of the best athlete in the ACB . (won the Dunk contest in the ACB's preseason "Showtime"tournment). 

videos here : http://www.acb.com/menu.php?id=83


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## Matthew Maurer (Oct 17, 2002)

> Gelabale is a better basketball player than Pietrus IMO . Pietrus is a good defensive player who like to shoot threes (not that well) . His FG% is poor , his shoot selection is poor , his balhandling is suspect and his passing skills just average (at best) . I'm not saying that he is a bad player , but Diaw is better , as well as Gelabale .
> 
> Gelabale lacks weight , but his shoot selection in the very competitive EL is uncommon (66% 2pt fg !) , he always plays under control , his overall fundamentals are very solid ( ballhandling) . And he is one of the best athlete in the ACB . (won the Dunk contest in the ACB's preseason "Showtime"tournment).



Yeah I agree with you I think Gelabale is an excellent player. I don't know if you saw my scouting reports on Diaw and Pietrus but I said all of that last year about him being a poor shooter from the perimeter. What's funny is after I wrote that Chad Ford was saying he could shoot !!!!   I still like Diaw and I think if he can become more aggressive offensively he could be a top small forward. He has the other skills in passing, defense, rebounding..


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## The Mad Viking (Jun 12, 2003)

ballstorm said:


> Good post Genjuro . Even if I'm not utterly convinced that Rudy is a more talented player than Gelabale , I do appreciate your objectivity and your evident knowledge of the players .
> 
> And for what matters , I generally don't feel the necessity to compare 2 players when there is no obvious reason to do so . In this case , both of the players will likely be drafted this year (I hope so) but there is no reason to stretch this compariason out .
> 
> I do not like to see Gelabale depicted as an "athlete with no skill" , which made me react (and possibly sound a bit provocative) .


Hey, I never said with no skill, and I never knew that "effective, in being a great athlete" and "smart enough not to do too many things" were insults!

"Very limited" I admit is unfair. Similarly "way better player" (not my words) is overstating it. Gelebale starts, and plays for a better team in a tougher league. I still think he has a limited game, but he is by no means unskilled.

Fernandez IMO (biased!) is a MAGICIAN with the ball, and is playing against teams like Real Madrid. He will be an NBA point guard, and I think, a very, very good one. To me, he is very special. To me, the NBA has a ton of athletic 6-6 wingmen who can jump out of the room.


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## Genjuro (Jul 17, 2002)

The Mad Viking said:


> He will be an NBA point guard, and I think, a very, very good one.


He won't. He's no point guard.


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## ballstorm (Nov 30, 2003)

The Mad Viking said:


> Hey, I never said with no skill, and I never knew that "effective, in being a great athlete" and "smart enough not to do too many things" were insults!
> 
> "Very limited" I admit is unfair. Similarly "way better player" (not my words) is overstating it. Gelebale starts, and plays for a better team in a tougher league. I still think he has a limited game, but he is by no means unskilled.
> 
> Fernandez IMO (biased!) is a MAGICIAN with the ball, and is playing against teams like Real Madrid. He will be an NBA point guard, and I think, a very, very good one. To me, he is very special. To me, the NBA has a ton of athletic 6-6 wingmen who can jump out of the room.


Geabale is not 6'6 , he is an effective 6'7 forward/guard .

How many Gelabale's games did you see?


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

Rudy Fernandez has a stress fracture and is out for 4-6 weeks...I wonder if this will effect his draft status....


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## The Mad Viking (Jun 12, 2003)

Genjuro said:


> He won't. He's no point guard.


:yawn:

Just because there is a shorter guard on his team doesn't mean he is not a point guard.

Thats what everyone said about Kirk Hinrich and Dwyane Wade, too.

He's 5th in the league in assists, leading his team. He's been a PG all his career until this season.

Has Gelebale scored 7 straight points in the last minute to overcome a 6 point deficit and lead his team to victory? Fernandez is very special. His injury may drop him a few positions in the draft, though.


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