# Offseason thread



## Gonzo

Got a lot of work to do


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## RollWithEm

I don't think you have a lot of work to do. You guys are one Deron Williams away from contending in the East.


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## Pacers Fan

This off season could be kind of rough. I have no doubt that we'll re-sign Roy HIbbert, but we're going to lose a lot of depth.

We're probably losing Barbosa, Foster (already), Lou, and maybe Lance. George Hill is the key, but I'm not sure how much we'll be willing to spend on him after committing ~35 mil to 3 players for next season.

With the 26th pick in the draft, I hope we go after some size (Leonard/Melo/Moultrie/Ezeli), but it's hard to say we'll get anyone more effective than David Harrison. Other players I like that might be available include Darius Miller, Marquis Teague (although everyone in the Bloomington area hates him), Terrence Ross, Dion Waiters, John Jenkins, and Jae Crowder.

But yes, Deron Williams, first and foremost.


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## Knick Killer

So if we re-signed Roy Hibbert to a max deal and let the rest of our FA's walk, would we have enough money to offer Williams max or no?


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## Gonzo

RollWithEm said:


> I don't think you have a lot of work to do. You guys are one Deron Williams away from contending in the East.


1) A real point guard
2) Role players (3 pt shooter, big rebounder/defensive big)
3) Paul George dribbling and passing camp
4) New offense

About a month ago I was against ever trading Danny. I enjoyed his chippiness during the Playoffs and I think he's found out how he's going to play the rest of his career, but I really think Paul George needs to play at the small forward position.


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## Pacers Fan

Knick_Killer31 said:


> So if we re-signed Roy Hibbert to a max deal and let the rest of our FA's walk, would we have enough money to offer Williams max or no?


I'm not exactly sure how cap holds work in the NBA, but I'm assuming that the QO's we offer Hill/Hibbert are all that count against our cap space. So, we'd be smart to sign Williams before Hibbert, otherwise it wouldn't work. If Hibbert were on anything other than a rookie contract, this wouldn't be possible, though.



> About a month ago I was against ever trading Danny. I enjoyed his chippiness during the Playoffs and I think he's found out how he's going to play the rest of his career, but I really think Paul George needs to play at the small forward position.


I haven't had the chance to watch as many playoff games as you have most likely, but every time I've seen Paul George, he looks like a natural SG out there with how skinny and fluid he is. Problem is that when we run that big starting lineup of ours, everyone's a poor ball handler except George Hill.

If the end of the season and playoffs are any indication, no way we can trade Granger to make room for George. Granger scores. George is incredibly timid to the point where sometimes he resembles Brandon Rush.


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## Gonzo

Pacers Fan said:


> I haven't had the chance to watch as many playoff games as you have most likely, but every time I've seen Paul George, he looks like a natural SG out there with how skinny and fluid he is. Problem is that when we run that big starting lineup of ours, everyone's a poor ball handler except George Hill.
> 
> If the end of the season and playoffs are any indication, no way we can trade Granger to make room for George. Granger scores. George is incredibly timid to the point where sometimes he resembles Brandon Rush.


I'm just curious how Paul George would play at his normal position, perhaps he wouldn't have to handle the ball nearly as much. 

Hopefully George finds a way to produce this offseason, too bad he doesn't have a mentor other than Brian Shaw to teach him how to score. Knocking down 3's is great and all, but at 6'9'' he really needs to use his size effectively.


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## clownskull

barbosa was useful in the regular season however, he fluctuated between useless and worse in the playoffs most of the time. he can walk.


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## Knick Killer

Yeah I can live without Barbosa.


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## RollWithEm

http://www.eightpointsnineseconds.c...-1-how-much-money-do-they-have-to-add-player/

We can shut this thread down... or maybe open it wide up, depending on how you look at it. That article pretty much covers all the possibilities.



>


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## RollWithEm

That Nash/Ilyasova combo suggested in the article sounds quite intriguing (along with a resigned Hibbert and Hill). Don't know if it's possible, but I like the idea.


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## Gonzo

Sounds like Bird is staying...


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## Gonzo

Snoop Dog is a Granger fan


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## Luke

Best case scenario is Deron Williams, obviously. If that doesn't work out then try to convince Nash that you're one piece away from a contender.

Nash would really work wonders with Paul George.


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## R-Star

Luke said:


> Best case scenario is Deron Williams, obviously. If that doesn't work out then try to convince Nash that you're one piece away from a contender.
> 
> Nash would really work wonders with Paul George.


Roy Hibberts stats would go through the roof with Steve Nash.

I don't think Nash or Deron are a reality though. But I hope I'm proven wrong.


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## Luke

American Dad isn't funny.

And I don't think that Nash is out of the question. He wants to go to a playoff team, and the Pacers are the only second round team that really has any need for his services. I can't see him going to Miami.

Deron is probably a reach though.


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## R-Star

Luke said:


> American Dad isn't funny.
> 
> And I don't think that Nash is out of the question. He wants to go to a playoff team, and the Pacers are the only second round team that really has any need for his services. I can't see him going to Miami.
> 
> Deron is probably a reach though.


Like **** it isn't. 

And while Nash wants a playoff team, No one ever wants to come to Indy as a free agent. David West is like the first dude in forever.


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## Luke

R-Star said:


> Like **** it isn't.
> 
> And while Nash wants a playoff team, No one ever wants to come to Indy as a free agent. David West is like the first dude in forever.


It's like a crappy episode of family guy with all of the funny parts taken out. I've tried many times, but that show is terrible.

Nash isn't a normal free agent though. I could see him fitting in well in Indiana. And, like I said, he wants to go to a playoff team. What are his other choices? Like I said I can't see him going to Miami. OKC has Westbrook. San Antonio has Parker. Boston has Rondo. L.A. can't afford him and the other L.A. already has Chris Paul. Memphis appears to be content with Conely, as does Denver with Collison.

So what does that leave? Atlanta? Maybe. Orlando? I don't know why anyone would want to sign there during the Dwight saga.

This could be Indy's chance to make a play.


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## R-Star

Luke said:


> It's like a crappy episode of family guy with all of the funny parts taken out. I've tried many times, but that show is terrible.
> 
> Nash isn't a normal free agent though. I could see him fitting in well in Indiana. And, like I said, he wants to go to a playoff team. What are his other choices? Like I said I can't see him going to Miami. OKC has Westbrook. San Antonio has Parker. Boston has Rondo. L.A. can't afford him and the other L.A. already has Chris Paul. Memphis appears to be content with Conely, as does Denver with Collison.
> 
> So what does that leave? Atlanta? Maybe. Orlando? I don't know why anyone would want to sign there during the Dwight saga.
> 
> This could be Indy's chance to make a play.


If you watch the Hot Tub episode of American Dad and don't laugh, I'll ****ing kill you. You probably watched a few episodes from the first season, which was garbage for the most part. 

And again, if we make a play for Nash and get him, awesome. We're an instant contender. But outside of David West I can't think of the last big name FA to ever go to Indy.


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## Luke

That is possible. But if I watch this Hot Tub episode and it sucks, which is probably will, then I'm calling my business associate and he *actually* will ****ing kill you. Once he gets back from Thailand you're a dead man.

Would Indiana fans rather have Nash or Eric Gordon? Nash makes you better next year but I'm assuming that the popular choice around these parts would be Gordon, considering that he could be part of the core for years to come.


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## R-Star

Luke said:


> That is possible. But if I watch this Hot Tub episode and it sucks, which is probably will, then I'm calling my business associate and he *actually* will ****ing kill you. Once he gets back from Thailand you're a dead man.
> 
> Would Indiana fans rather have Nash or Eric Gordon? Nash makes you better next year but I'm assuming that the popular choice around these parts would be Gordon, considering that he could be part of the core for years to come.


The only person who will ever kill me is Alcohol Jones. 

You watch the hot tub episode. If you don't like it I'll kill you and DoctorDrizzay.


As far as Nash or Gordon, I pick Nash easy. This team is full of guys who can score, and no one whos any good at setting players up. Plus you bring Gordon in and its going to get tough keeping that young core together.


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## Knick Killer

Nash over Gordon by a mile. Gordon would be a huge addition to us but we don't really need him as much as we need Steve Nash. Nash takes us from a good team, to a really good team.


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## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> Nash over Gordon by a mile. Gordon would be a huge addition to us but we don't really need him as much as we need Steve Nash. Nash takes us from a good team, to a really good team.


Yep. Plus I'm not sold that George would be ok being our 6th man.

Although if we get Nash I assume we have to let Hill walk. Either that or run a guard rotation of:

Nash/Collison
George/Hill

That doesn't leave many minutes for Hill or Collison, who are both used to starter minutes.


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## Gonzo

I'll take Nash over Gordon, not really sure how healthy Gordon's future looks like.


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## Tom

Nash will never go to Indy...I'd go Gordon and get rid of West. His days are numbered.


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## Knick Killer

Tom said:


> Nash will never go to Indy...I'd go Gordon and get rid of West. His days are numbered.


You never know with Nash. And get rid of David West? Are you ****ing nuts? Did you watch a Pacers game this year? Besides, if his days really are numbered we only have him under contract for one more year anyways.


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## Tom

No i'm not nuts...They weren't any better with him. They could go with PF by committee and get more scoring in other areas. He is Carlos Boozer and always will be. IMO of course.


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## Gonzo

Tom said:


> No i'm not nuts...They weren't any better with him. They could go with PF by committee and get more scoring in other areas. He is Carlos Boozer and always will be. IMO of course.


Starting Tyler Hansbrough would have been a disaster last year.


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## Tom

They werent' that much better if at all than last year. They also didn't have the same passion.


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## Pacers Fan

Tom said:


> No i'm not nuts...They weren't any better with him. They could go with PF by committee and get more scoring in other areas. He is Carlos Boozer and always will be. IMO of course.


This is absurd. David West is one tough mother****er. He was incredibly helpful this year as a motivator, leader, and off-the-court presence, let alone that he makes mid-range jumpers like layups and can score in the post.


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## Knick Killer

Tom said:


> No i'm not nuts...They weren't any better with him. They could go with PF by committee and get more scoring in other areas. He is Carlos Boozer and always will be. IMO of course.





Tom said:


> They werent' that much better if at all than last year. They also didn't have the same passion.


You're a clown. I'd love to hear how many Pacers games you watched this year(if any).


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## Tom

He will help make you the same team they are right now.


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## Knick Killer

That's what I thought...none. Move along now.


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## Tom

Hibbert and him together...that will help them and their young players. They aren't going anywhere that way. They are just going to waste talent.


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## clownskull

Tom said:


> Nash will never go to Indy...I'd go Gordon and get rid of West. His days are numbered.


west is the only reliable pf the pacers have.
getting gordon would not help there.
and i'm just not sure what to say if you think a tyler/lou tandem can give you what west did.
west played a significant role in getting the pacers the 3rd seed and a 2nd round appearance in the playoffs.
without him- there is very little production at all from the 4 spot.


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## R-Star

David West could be argued as the Pacers best player this past season. I'm a big Tom fan, but he has no clue what he's talking about here. People look at Pacer players numbers and fail to recogize we play a more team oriented game than anyone else in the league. All 5 starters are our go to guy.


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## Gonzo

Brandon Roy is a possibility with Kevin Pritchard. 



> As ex-Portland Trail Blazer Brandon Roy plans his comeback to the NBA, the Chicago Bulls, Dallas Mavericks, Indiana Pacers and Minnesota Timberwolves have emerged as serious suitors to sign the former All-Star guard, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.
> 
> Pacers executive Kevin Pritchard made a draft day deal for Roy in 2006 as Blazers GM, and his relationship could play a pivotal part in Indiana's recruitment of Roy, sources said. Roy trusts Pritchard, and values the fact that he brought him to Portland. Nevertheless, Roy hasn't begun the process of narrowing his list of possibilities. After Thursday's draft, more teams could express interest in him.


http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--b...--mavs--pacers-and-t-wolves--sources-say.html


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## R-Star

I don't really want him, but I'm loving that we're now front runners on a lot of shit now. People actually want to play here now. Its an exciting time to be us boys. Enjoy knowing that we're the real fans when all these new Pacer "fans" show up here in the next few years.


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## Knick Killer

R-Star said:


> I don't really want him, but I'm loving that we're now front runners on a lot of shit now. People actually want to play here now. Its an exciting time to be us boys. Enjoy knowing that* we're the real fans* when all these new Pacer "fans" show up here in the next few years.


Says the guy who was never here when the Pacers were shit for years....



But anyways, I'd be cool with taking a chance on Brandon Roy. If it's not a lot of money it would be low risk VERY HIGH reward.


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## King Joseus

R-Star said:


> I don't really want him, but I'm loving that we're now front runners on a lot of shit now. People actually want to play here now. Its an exciting time to be us boys. Enjoy knowing that we're the real fans *when all these new Pacer "fans" show up here in the next few years.*





Knick Killer said:


> Says the guy who was never here when the Pacers were shit for years....


I thought this was the funnier part myself...


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## R-Star

Are you idiots kidding me? Either of you want to show more posts than I did during that time? I have more posts in the Pacer forum than both of you combined. Easy.

You two calling someone else a fair weather fan is pretty rich though. I made this Pacers forum.


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## King Joseus

If I'm one of those two, not a lot of sense is being made. Perhaps it's just late, or something.

All poking the bear aside, it's good to have somebody else in the Central Division that isn't a mess. More interesting that way.


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## R-Star

King Joseus said:


> If I'm one of those two, not a lot of sense is being made. Perhaps it's just late, or something.
> 
> All poking the bear aside, it's good to have somebody else in the Central Division that isn't a mess. More interesting that way.


Shut up and get out of my forum.


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## King Joseus

Get out of your forum, eh?


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## R-Star

Get out of my forum, ya'll.


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## King Joseus

Sure thing, bro.


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## R-Star

Bro is my word, **** head. I don't steal Skelator and He-Man jokes. 

R-Star does bro. That's my thing. Dick slapping is my thing.


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## King Joseus

Sorry, friend. I'll cool it on the infringement.


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## Gonzo

The real fans are over at PacersDigest bitching and whining about every loss. We keep it pretty casual over here.

I couldn't watch that JOB team we had a few years ago, but now that he's gone this team is a lot more enjoyable.


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## Gonzo

http://www.basketballforum.com/nba-forum/469748-report-two-teams-offer-roy-hibbert-max.html



> Sam Amick ‏@sam_amick
> Source: Portland GM Neil Olshey & team prez Larry Miller visited restricted free agent center Roy Hibbert tonight in DC, offered max deal





> Sam Amick ‏@sam_amick
> Indiana did not offer a max deal, and Hibbert is now leaning to Blazers unless Pacers match. One other unnamed team offered max.



https://twitter.com/sam_amick


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## R-Star

Gonzo said:


> http://www.basketballforum.com/nba-forum/469748-report-two-teams-offer-roy-hibbert-max.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://twitter.com/sam_amick


There's no way we don't match. This is one of those situations though were we know Roy though. Can you see him ever leaning towards the Blazers over staying here? Really?

We'll pay Roy whatever it takes. He knows that. There's no story here.


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## R-Star

Gonzo said:


> The real fans are over at PacersDigest bitching and whining about every loss. We keep it pretty casual over here.
> 
> I couldn't watch that JOB team we had a few years ago, but now that he's gone this team is a lot more enjoyable.


I hate other forums so I don't even try. That sounds like one of those forums where guys are arguing that Paul George is a top 3 young SG in the league, and if you disagree you're banned. I posted in a forum like that about hockey and it did not last long at all.

As far as watching the Pacers, I quit watching ball all together for about 5 years and watched hockey instead. It was just tough to watch when half your team is suspended and you know the seasons over. We don't get any Pacer games up here unless they're playing the Raptors, so it took until last season for me to decide to get League Pass and follow the boys 100% again.

Knick Killer calling someone out on that is pretty funny. If you click back to the first threads on the Pacer forum, it was a ton of R-Star. At one point I had this forum as the 3rd most busy team forum and that's when a lot more people posted on this site. Those were the days. Although it was a lot of "Tinsley best past first pg in league?" and "Bender finally coming back from injury. Look out NBA!"


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## Knick Killer

R-Star said:


> I hate other forums so I don't even try. That sounds like one of those forums where guys are arguing that Paul George is a top 3 young SG in the league, and if you disagree you're banned. I posted in a forum like that about hockey and it did not last long at all.
> 
> As far as watching the Pacers, I quit watching ball all together for about 5 years and watched hockey instead. It was just tough to watch when half your team is suspended and you know the seasons over. We don't get any Pacer games up here unless they're playing the Raptors, so it took until last season for me to decide to get League Pass and follow the boys 100% again.
> 
> *Knick Killer calling someone out on that is pretty funny. If you click back to the first threads on the Pacer forum, it was a ton of R-Star. At one point I had this forum as the 3rd most busy team forum and that's when a lot more people posted on this site. Those were the days. Although it was a lot of "Tinsley best past first pg in league?" and "Bender finally coming back from injury. Look out NBA!"*


I was just buggin you man don't take it so seriously. For a couple years this team was really difficult to stay passionate about and I get that.



But anyways, theres no way we let Hibbert walk. I'm not too worried about other teams making him offers because I know we'll just match it.


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## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> I was just buggin you man don't take it so seriously. For a couple years this team was really difficult to stay passionate about and I get that.
> 
> 
> 
> But anyways, theres no way we let Hibbert walk. I'm not too worried about other teams making him offers because I know we'll just match it.


The damage has been done, former e-friend.


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## R-Star

But nah, I'm just playing as well. Not much to do in the offseason other than stirring the pot. 

Agreed. No way we let Hibbert walk. We're maxing him out and moving forward. Next decision, Hill. Although I think we're talking to Nash today or tomorrow as well. Wouldn't that be an unexpected surprise if he came on board.


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## Gonzo

I hope we don't offer Hill too much, need to have a shot at Nash.


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## R-Star

Gonzo said:


> I hope we don't offer Hill too much, need to have a shot at Nash.


We probably should have a pretty good idea about Nash by the end of the week I'd assume. 

If he has no intention of playing here I think he'll let us know.


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## Knick Killer

It sounds more and more like Nash will be a Raptor so don't get too excited.


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## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> It sounds more and more like Nash will be a Raptor so don't get too excited.


We'll see. I doubt he'll come here, but I'm also not sold he goes to Toronto either.


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## Ben

@MikeWellsNBA



> The Pacers have agreed to a 5 year deal with George Hill, according to a source.


No numbers yet.


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## R-Star

Ben said:


> @MikeWellsNBA
> 
> 
> 
> No numbers yet.


Unless the numbers are crazy that's very good news. I like Hill and he wants to be here.

I still wish we had a better starting point guard, but you can do a lot worse than Hill and Collison.


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## Pacers Fan

5 years/35-40 million would be reasonable, if not too high. I don't generally like giving out 5 year contracts because it demotivates players, but as long as Hill keeps working on his game, I'm fine with it. A 5 year deal really signifies his role as our starting PG of the future.


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## Knick Killer

http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/summer-league-roster-2012

Summer league team announced.


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## Knick Killer

Orlando Johnson


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## Knick Killer

> NEW ORLEANS — Former Central Michigan University star Chris Kaman met with the Indiana Pacers, according to nola.com.
> 
> Kaman played last season with the New Orleans Hornets after he was traded along with Eric Gordon, Al Farouq Aminu and a draft pick as part of the Chris Paul deal with the Los Angeles Clippers.
> 
> The Pacers would be interested in signing Kaman if they do not match Portland's offer to Roy Hibbert, which is reportedly for $58 million over four years. If Hibbert signs Portland's offer on July 11, the Pacers would have two days to match it.


http://www.mlive.com/chippewas/index.ssf/2012/07/chris_kaman_meets_with_indiana.html



> The Indiana Pacers have been looking for answers through free agents and NBA trades, but the latest rumors have the team targeting second-tier players to fill out the roster. It looks like the Pacers will meet with guard Gerald Green and center Ian Mahinmi, possibly looking to take a cheaper route in free agency this offseason.
> 
> This is a departure from the names that the Pacers have been linked to in past rumors, including Eric Gordon, Chris Kaman and restricted free agent Roy Hibbert. If the Pacers decide to match the offer extended to Hibbert by the Portland Trail Blazers, the team may have no room under the salary cap to pursue the likes of Gordon or Kaman.


http://sports.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474981448730


I know Gerald Green doesn't get a lot of love on here but I wouldn't mind having him on the team.


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## Knick Killer

Well at least Nash stayed in the West.


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## Knick Killer

Anyone else starting to get a little nervous about the Roy Hibbert situation?


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## Gonzo

> David Aldridge
> ‏@daldridgetnt
> 
> League source says Pacers still have not decided if they will match proposed max offer sheet by Portland over the weekend to @Hoya2aPacer.


..


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## Knick Killer

$14 million a year is a lot of money...

But in other news, according to this assclown, Orlando Johnson has the potential to be the next Dwyane Wade. :laugh:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1235977-orlando-johnson-best-and-worst-case-nba-player-comparison


Gotta love the bleacher report...


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## R-Star

Other than hearing all this doom and gloom about Hibbert its been pretty quiet. 

I'm confident we'll keep Roy, but every day I have to wait to hear something you start to form just a tiny kernel of doubt. If for some reason we let Roy walk and replace him with Chris Kaman in Indiana's dream to field an all white frontcourt, I'm not sure what my feeling towards this team will be.

We've all been through stupid trades, not going after free agents you want, questionable draft picks, etc. That's part of being a small market fan. But if you let a guy like Roy Hibbert walk because he doesn't take the 2 mil or so discount you think you deserve, I can't really cheer for that team. That's the straw as far as I'm concerned.


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## Pacers Fan

OJ's going to be a lot better than Miles Plumlee. And by a lot better, I think he'll be a rotational player in the NBA. I'm still not worried about the Hibbert situation. I'm just worried that we're going to go into the off season with significant cap space and wind up re-signing our own guys and maybe get some 3 mil/year filler, semi-rotation guys.


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## R-Star

Pacers Fan said:


> OJ's going to be a lot better than Miles Plumlee. And by a lot better, I think he'll be a rotational player in the NBA. I'm still not worried about the Hibbert situation. I'm just worried that we're going to go into the off season with significant cap space and wind up re-signing our own guys and maybe get some 3 mil/year filler, semi-rotation guys.


Our only options right now to improve the team are Kaman as a backup, which I really like, or Mayo either as the starting 2 or our 6th man. 

I don't think we're going to look a whole lot different going into next season, which isn't terrible but I don't see us as a contender without some improvement.


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## R-Star

On the bright side, Tyler Hansbroughs little brother is playing summer league for us, so if we're lucky we'll add another white roster player this summer.


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## Luke

R-Star is going to flip his ****ing shit if y'all don't resign Roy.

And for the record I'm pulling for you guys. Occasionally I find a small market team that I enjoy watching when they're not playing the Lakers, Indiana is one of those teams.

But then again I *apparently* hate this team and have never watched a Pacers game so there's that.


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## Knick Killer

> And then there is the not-so-small matter of the future. Maxing Hibbert would raise the financial bar for every other contract the Pacers negotiate.
> 
> Consider a year from now when David West is an unrestricted free agent; how can the Pacers make an argument West should make even a dollar less than Hibbert? How about in two years, when Paul George comes due? If the big contracts start piling up, they'll be right back where they were a few years ago, with an overstuffed payroll and an understaffed roster.


The Words of Conrad Brunner. He raises an interesting point...


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## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> The Words of Conrad Brunner. He raises an interesting point...


Not sure I agree. We can spend pretty much all next season trying to work out Wests next contract with him, and get him to agree to sign instead of hitting FA. He doesn't get to have offers thrown at him like Hibbert.

As far as George, if he gets to RFA as basically the same player and someone offers him max, we wish him the best and hope we can maybe sign and trade him. Hibbert is the 3rd best center in the league. George is a talented young 2/3 who hasn't proven he can reach his potential yet. 

We're the Pacers. We can't play hardball with our own drafted talent. 

We need to keep Hibbert.


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## Gonzo

God damnit Conrad, shut up.


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## R-Star

Gonzo said:


> God damnit Conrad, shut up.


Surprisingly he was where I got all my Pacers info from prior to joining up to this forum.


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## Gonzo

R-Star said:


> Surprisingly he was where I got all my Pacers info from prior to joining up to this forum.


I just don't see how this team can get into the Playoffs without Roy. That to me is more important than anything, Paul George isn't going to want to stay on a borderline Playoff team, or anyone else.

I hope that Conrad was just spitballing ideas and not agreeing with it.


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## R-Star

Gonzo said:


> I just don't see how this team can get into the Playoffs without Roy. That to me is more important than anything, Paul George isn't going to want to stay on a borderline Playoff team, or anyone else.
> 
> I hope that Conrad was just spitballing ideas and not agreeing with it.


Even if we do make the playoffs without Roy, what's the point? You don't move forward as a team and get better if you let a guy you've grown into the 3rd best center in the league walk.

I can pretty much guarantee the rest of the team says **** the Pacers and gives up on us if we let Roy go. 

We were 3rd in the East last year. The fact this is even a discussion is bullshit. I'm just hoping its wild speculation by reporters since the Pacers aren't talking.


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## Gonzo

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/b...lionaire-owner-partly-blame-article-1.1109705



> Larry Bird flew the coop in Indiana and the Pacers' billionaire owner is partly to blame
> 
> *Pacers owner Herb Simon turned down the NBA legend's request to add a scorer, even after the Pacers had problems generating offense against the Miami Heat in their second-round playoff loss.*
> 
> The old Celtics players network was buzzing after Larry Bird stepped down as Indiana’s president and not because Bird quit after nine seasons in the team’s front office.
> 
> *Bird told some old teammates that he was actually leaning toward staying on and had indicated that in a meeting in late June with owner Herb Simon when they met to assess the Pacers’ needs. During the sit-down, Bird told Simon he liked the team a lot, but “we just need to add another piece.’’
> 
> Nothing doing.*
> 
> Simon turned down Bird’s request to add a scorer, even after the Pacers had problems generating offense against the Miami Heat in their second-round playoff loss. Bird was thinking about getting into the Eric Gordon sweepstakes to make a run at the Hornets’ restricted free agent and former Indiana University star.
> 
> Between health concerns about his shoulder and back and the fact that he doesn’t see himself as a lifer like other execs, including his successor Donnie Walsh, Bird likely used Simon’s rejection as an additional reason to hang it up, one old Celtic said.
> 
> Simon, the shopping mall czar, could have easily picked up another big deal, even as the Pacers decided to re-sign point guard George Hill for $40 million over five years, and are expected to match Portland’s bloated $60 million offer sheet to retain starting center Roy Hibbert. According to Forbes, Simon, the chairman and director of the Simon Property Group, the largest publicly traded real estate investment trust in the U.S., had a net worth this past March of $1.8 billion.
> 
> But Simon is also known to oppose paying the NBA luxury tax. After leaving, Bird shed some light on what he had to put up with, when asked about making the Pacers better.
> 
> “Small market,’’ he said. “It’s tough.’’


Well we better hope the team works their ass off this offseason because we're going to be pretty mediocre for a while.


----------



## R-Star

That's horse shit. We have ****ing cap space.

I was so excited about this offseason. Now its turning into a ****ing nightmare.


----------



## Knick Killer

Plumlee starting at center for us next year...now thats a ****ing nightmare.


----------



## Gonzo

> @MikeWellsNBA: The Pacers are matching Portland's 4-year, $58 million offer to Roy Hibbert, according to a source


Good.


----------



## Knick Killer

Gonzo said:


> Good.


----------



## R-Star

Gonzo said:


> Good.


Well I can tell you that made my day.

Was getting pretty tiresome coming here every day and searching to find news on Hibbert and finding none.


****ing Pacers. The smart move would have been to come out and say you're going to match right after Portlands offer. Not **** around and "think on it". 

I still hope we pick up Kaman as our backup. That would be a huge move. This team got its ass handed to them any time they put Amundson in for long stretches.


----------



## Knick Killer

> The Indiana Pacers have renounced their rights to restricted free agent guard A.J. Price, making him an unrestricted free agent. Via Rotoworld: “The Pacers are set at PG with Darren Collison and George Hill under contract, they still have faith in backup guard Lance Stephenson, and they’re said to be targeting SGs like O.J. Mayo and Courtney Lee in free agency. There’s simply no space for a marginal guy like Price on the roster.”


http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba/2012/07/indiana-pacers-renounce-rights-to-aj-price/


I liked AJ Price to be honest. I thought he played very well off the bench against Chicago in last years playoffs. Hopefully someone picks him up and he can continue his career.


----------



## Pacers Fan

AJ's also pretty terrible. He's regressed every year in the pros. He's simply a shooter who can't shoot. If he finds his shot, he'd be a great 3rd string PG somewhere, but that's asking a lot.


----------



## Gonzo

I liked AJ just because it seemed as though he was a good locker room presence for Stephenson and he always looked as though he was having fun even while parked on the bench for the entire season.


----------



## R-Star

Pacers Fan said:


> AJ's also pretty terrible. He's regressed every year in the pros. He's simply a shooter who can't shoot. If he finds his shot, he'd be a great 3rd string PG somewhere, but that's asking a lot.


You really, really like George Hill don't you?


----------



## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba/2012/07/indiana-pacers-renounce-rights-to-aj-price/
> 
> 
> I liked AJ Price to be honest. I thought he played very well off the bench against Chicago in last years playoffs. Hopefully someone picks him up and he can continue his career.


Yep. He was a decent third sting PG who could step in as backup if someone was injured. 

No room for him though. Best of luck to him wherever he lands.


----------



## Ben

Wow....



> *Marc Stein* ‏@*ESPNSteinLine*  RT @*DraftExpress*: Ian Mahinmi (4 yrs, $16M) to Indy in sign-and-trade w/Dallas. Darren Collison and Dahntay Jones to Mavs


----------



## R-Star

We get our backup big man, but lose our backup point guard.

I sure hope Stephenson can step in and play decent in the big minutes he'll be getting.


----------



## 29380

> WojYahooNBA Indiana is pursuing a trade with Charlotte for restricted free agent point guard DJ Augustine, sources tell Y! Sports.
> 
> WojYahooNBA Pacers have considered offer sheet, but prefer to make a trade for Augustine. As @DraftExpress reports, Indy traded Darren Collison to Mavs.


...


----------



## R-Star

Knicks4life said:


> ...


R-Star likes where this is going. 

Collison was too good to be a backup behind Hill, but Augustine would be a very capable guy to bring in.

If that goes through without giving up much, count me as happy.


I assume Dahntay Jones is gone to make room for Orlando to get a little burn with the team.


----------



## Pacers Fan

R-Star said:


> You really, really like George Hill don't you?


Indeed. I don't know if he's a perfect fit for this team and his game is certainly flawed, but he's one of my favorites.


----------



## R-Star

Pacers Fan said:


> Indeed. I don't know if he's a perfect fit for this team and his game is certainly flawed, but he's one of my favorites.


I don't think he's any better than Collison. 

I hate this trade the more I have time to think about it.


----------



## Pacers Fan

R-Star said:


> I don't think he's any better than Collison.
> 
> I hate this trade the more I have time to think about it.


We'll see. Collison's going to have the ball in his hands even less with Rick Carlisle than he did in Indy. The only time he's been a very effective player in his career was when he took over CP3's role of dominating the ball in N'awlins. I'll be interested to see if Collison can beat out Roddy Beaubois for the Mavs' starting PG position.

Trading Collison for Mahinmi is certainly a major drop in talent level, but keep in mind we did get a decently athletic, 6'11" backup Center, and big men are worth a lot even if they're not very talented. Remember all those times last year with 6'7" Amundson and 6'9" Hansbrough on the floor at the same time? Now we'll have size all game.

Simply put, Collison's replaceable, and now the team is much more well-rounded.


----------



## R-Star

Pacers Fan said:


> We'll see. Collison's going to have the ball in his hands even less with Rick Carlisle than he did in Indy. The only time he's been a very effective player in his career was when he took over CP3's role of dominating the ball in N'awlins. I'll be interested to see if Collison can beat out Roddy Beaubois for the Mavs' starting PG position.
> 
> Trading Collison for Mahinmi is certainly a major drop in talent level, but keep in mind we did get a decently athletic, 6'11" backup Center, and big men are worth a lot even if they're not very talented. Remember all those times last year with 6'7" Amundson and 6'9" Hansbrough on the floor at the same time? Now we'll have size all game.
> 
> Simply put, Collison's replaceable, and now the team is much more well-rounded.


We don't know if Collison is replaceable until we see who our backup PG is.

If we get Augustin for something small like Amundson I'll be happy enough with this trade.

Having a better backup big is good, but Collison was too steep a price to pay for Mahinmi.


----------



## Hatrik

R-Star said:


> We don't know if Collison is replaceable until we see who our backup PG is.
> 
> If we get Augustin for something small like Amundson I'll be happy enough with this trade.
> 
> Having a better backup big is good, but Collison was too steep a price to pay for Mahinmi.


I agree completely. We got ripped off in the deal, but if we follow up by ripping off someone else to get his replacement, then it's a fair deal. So i'll wait to pass judgement. However, if we dont get Augustine, i'm not happy with this trade at all.


----------



## Gonzo

So we got Mahinmi for Collison and Jones? Ugh


----------



## Knick Killer

If we end up getting Augustin, then this was a fine trade. Lot's of people are disappointed with the offseason so far but we desperately needed some depth in the front court and so far we have addressed that need by adding Green, Plumlee, and Mahinmi. I liked Collison, but he wasn't the point guard of the future and I think he's replaceable.


----------



## Knick Killer

Also I heard if we do a sign and trade for DJ Augustin, were probably trading Tyler Hansbrough.


----------



## Pacers Fan

Knick Killer said:


> Also I heard if we do a sign and trade for DJ Augustin, were probably trading Tyler Hansbrough.


I'd probably do that if we could get a backup 4 along with Augustin. I want no part of Lou Amundson or Jeff Pendergraph playing 20 mpg, or Danny Granger playing for the 4 for 10 minutes in small ball. I don't think we have the cap room left to absorb Tyrus Thomas, so maybe bring DJ White back to Indiana?

But really, Hansbrough's been terrible since apparently he stopped chugging Red Bulls before every game. He has little to no defensive or rebounding abilities, his jumper is shaky, he still has no left hand, and his post game is just about nonexistent.


----------



## Knick Killer

I wouldn't say terrible, but he definitely didn't show enough last year to prove that he could be a starter in this league. I'd like to keep him to be honest.


----------



## Firefight

I'm not sure how this trade can be defended by saying either.."well, it's good if we make another move..." ...or, "at least we have a back-up center." 

This is a bad trade for the Pacers. If the trade was closer in talent, you can hinge your decision on future moves surrounding this one...but in this case, you trade a PG with starters ability for an overpaid back-up center? 

I'm a Chicago fan, and although I never really saw the Pacers as much of a threat, this trade definitely has you guys taking a step back. I understand Collison was expendable, but you most definitely could have done better than a back-up center with a bad contract.


----------



## Gonzo




----------



## R-Star

Pacers Fan said:


> I'd probably do that if we could get a backup 4 along with Augustin. I want no part of Lou Amundson or Jeff Pendergraph playing 20 mpg, or Danny Granger playing for the 4 for 10 minutes in small ball. I don't think we have the cap room left to absorb Tyrus Thomas, so maybe bring DJ White back to Indiana?
> 
> But really, Hansbrough's been terrible since apparently he stopped chugging Red Bulls before every game. He has little to no defensive or rebounding abilities, his jumper is shaky, he still has no left hand, and his post game is just about nonexistent.


So every guy that you don't like on the team sucks?

Collison sucks.

Hansbrough sucks.

Who else sucks?


----------



## Hatrik

Augustin had his qualifying offer rescinded today. He's a straight up UFA today.


----------



## Dissonance

You guys signed him already


*Pacers agree to 1-year deal with D.J. Augustin*


----------



## R-Star

Dissonance said:


> You guys signed him already
> 
> 
> *Pacers agree to 1-year deal with D.J. Augustin*


Good. I needed some good news after being upset about the Collison trade.

If you look at it as Collison and Jones for Mahinmi and Augustin it seems fair.

I'm "meh" on the Green pickup, if anything I'm not liking the direction we're heading this offseason.

We aren't a better team than we were last season.


----------



## Pacers Fan

R-Star said:


> So every guy that you don't like on the team sucks?
> 
> Collison sucks.
> 
> Hansbrough sucks.
> 
> Who else sucks?


You've inversed the relation. If you don't perform, I won't be a fan, unless your name is Eddie Gill. I used to despise David West and Roy Hibbert until they started performing well on my team. Now they're two of my favorites. There's a certain ratio of talent:expectations:worthlessness that you need to have for me to like you as a player.

But to answer your question, Pendergraph and Plumlee. Lou, Barbosa, Fesenko, and AJ Price aren't coming back, so I don't have to worry about them anymore. Lance is kind of worthless, although I'm pulling for him to finally have a productive season.


----------



## R-Star

Pacers Fan said:


> You've inversed the relation. If you don't perform, I won't be a fan, unless your name is Eddie Gill. I used to despise David West and Roy Hibbert until they started performing well on my team. Now they're two of my favorites. There's a certain ratio of talent:expectations:worthlessness that you need to have for me to like you as a player.
> 
> But to answer your question, Pendergraph and Plumlee. Lou, Barbosa, Fesenko, and AJ Price aren't coming back, so I don't have to worry about them anymore. Lance is kind of worthless, although I'm pulling for him to finally have a productive season.


Problem is Collison is a much better player than you lead on. Handbrough was a let down last year, but I still like having him come off the bench and energy it up.


----------



## Pacers Fan

R-Star said:


> Problem is Collison is a much better player than you lead on. Handbrough was a let down last year, but I still like having him come off the bench and energy it up.


Sure, Collison's talented, but he's on my shitlist right now after that abysmal performance against the Heat. As far as I'm concerned, he's a good backup PG on a decent team, and we just slightly upgraded him with DJ Augustin.


----------



## R-Star

Pacers Fan said:


> Sure, Collison's talented, but he's on my shitlist right now after that abysmal performance against the Heat. As far as I'm concerned, he's a good backup PG on a decent team, and we just slightly upgraded him with DJ Augustin.


I don't think Augustin is an upgrade at all. But time will tell.


Collison to me was part of our core. Sure you can trade away core guys, but not for Ian Mahinmi.


----------



## Hatrik

R-Star said:


> I don't think Augustin is an upgrade at all. But time will tell.
> 
> 
> Collison to me was part of our core. Sure you can trade away core guys, but not for Ian Mahinmi.


Augustin might surprise you here. I think a big part of his only so-so statistics is the lack of talent he's played with his whole career. He's getting 6.5 assists playing with basically no-one who can score. Now that he gets to play with one of the better NBA starting centers and a 3pt gunner like Granger he might be putting up 7.5 apg. And his %'s will probably go way up, since defenses will focus significantly less on him now that he's in indy.


----------



## clownskull

i was curious if anyone knows much about gerald green?
i haven't seen anything of him and was wondering if he is any good at driving and creating his own shot?
we could use a guy who has that ability. hopefully he can do some of that as that skill has been something this team has historically lacked.
we have had a few but, not many over the years.


----------



## Knick Killer

Glad to hear that the Wizards picked up AJ Price. Hopefully he gets a chance to show he can play.


----------



## Pacers Fan

clownskull said:


> i was curious if anyone knows much about gerald green?
> i haven't seen anything of him and was wondering if he is any good at driving and creating his own shot?
> we could use a guy who has that ability. hopefully he can do some of that as that skill has been something this team has historically lacked.
> we have had a few but, not many over the years.


Not very good. He has the handle of Paul George in the summer league last year or rookie Danny Granger. He'll hit open jumpers, make a few cuts, and maybe get some straight line drives for some dunks. That's good enough for me. But yes, I'd love to have someone who can create off the dribble.


----------



## Knick Killer

Well I can guarantee Green will be fun to watch. I don't really know what to expect from him but I am excited we picked him up.


----------



## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> Well I can guarantee Green will be fun to watch. I don't really know what to expect from him but I am excited we picked him up.


Seems to me Paul George does everything he does better, and is younger with more potential. 

Not sure why we needed this guy. If you look at his history in the league, he's had a very short time showing he can play, and that was with the Nets. Not hard to score on that team.

Hopefully I'm wrong, but I don't like this signing at all.


----------



## Knick Killer

We needed a backup wing. I'm not expecting this guy to have a huge impact but he will bring some athleticism off the bench for us and I think we needed that.


----------



## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> We needed a backup wing. I'm not expecting this guy to have a huge impact but he will bring some athleticism off the bench for us and I think we needed that.


I have a feeling sometimes I'll miss having Barbosa. Regular season Barbosa that is. Not playoff Leandro.


----------



## Knick Killer

Andrew Bynum and J-Rich to Philadelphia in Dwight Howard deal...not good for us I'd say. It feels like the East is getting better by the day.


----------



## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> Andrew Bynum and J-Rich to Philadelphia in Dwight Howard deal...not good for us I'd say. It feels like the East is getting better by the day.


I'm looking forward to Hibbert vs Bynum. In all reality though Philly just takes Chicago's spot.

I still think we're the better team over Philly. People will start to realize that losing Iggy is a pretty big deal.


----------



## Knick Killer

True. Iggy was a big part of that team but for whatever reason never got a lot of love. 

In other news, Jermaine O'Neal signed with the Suns. Not that we need an injury prone big guy but it would've been cool to see him end his career here. 

Also did anyone hear about Roy Hibbert going down to Sacramento to visit a kid who's dying wish was to meet Big Roy only for him to pass away one day before Hibbert got there? That broke my heart hearing that.


----------



## Pacers Fan

Yup Knick_Killer, heard about that one. Really depressing. Roy tries his hardest to reach out and having that happen must be a huge letdown.

As far as Philly goes, I'm not afraid. Andrew Bynum is very talented one-on-one, but he's very lazy defensively and sometimes on the glass. They got some shooters in Young, J-Rich, and to an extent Dorell Wright, but they also lost Jodie Meeks and their defense on the wing. Thad Young might be a tough matchup for either Granger or West, but I'm fairly confident in our ability to beat them in a 7-game series, especially since we've signed Mahinmi for when Hibbert gets in foul trouble. I don't think the Sixers will be much better than the Nets.

Here's how I see the East this season:

1. Miami
2. Boston
3. Indiana
4. New York
5. Philly
6. Chicago
7. Brooklyn
8. Bucks

I think we could take the #2 spot, but that depends on if Roy get stronger and if Paul George finally develops a consistent, aggressive offensive game.


----------



## Gonzo

Looks like we're trying to get an All-Star game with our new 50 ft scoreboard.


----------



## Knick Killer

That's awesome but unfortunately don't see that helping our attendance problems. I really hope it improves this year because theres no way a basketball team from Indiana should have the lowest attendace in the league.


----------



## Gonzo

I see it bringing the casual fans in if they hear about it. Everyone is going to want to see that thing, similar to a lot of people wanting to see the new Lucas Oil Stadium...


Sent from my iPhone using VS Free


----------



## R-Star

Hope so. I mean I can see people not going when we sucked, but we're one of the most exciting young teams in the league right now. Where the **** are the fans?


----------



## Gonzo

R-Star said:


> Hope so. I mean I can see people not going when we sucked, but we're one of the most exciting young teams in the league right now. Where the **** are the fans?


Crying on their couches because Peyton Manning left, but now we have Luck. Also, the Pacers are a bunch of thugs. Where's Reggie?


----------



## Gonzo

http://blognbasketball.com/2012/08/s...trade-granger/



> You heard it here first…Danny Granger will not be a Pacer at this time next year.
> 
> According to people close to the Indiana front office, management will actively look to move Granger this upcoming season if not next offseason.
> 
> There are numerous reasons behind their thinking, both financial and basketball.
> 
> Danny Granger is due $27 million over the next two seasons. Yes, he’s the team’s leading scorer and spiritual leader (see altercations with Lebron James and Dwyane Wade…oh and even Larry Sanders). However, he is no longer the face of the franchise, Roy Hibbert is. Roy, coincidentally, just signed a maximum contract (courtesy of the Portland Trail Blazers).
> 
> It is conceivable to pay both players that much money, but the real issue is the future of swingman Paul George. While Danny is a finished product and one-time All-Star, Pacers management feels that Paul can exceed that in the coming years. His contract will be up in 2014 and Indiana is simply not going to let another team come in and outbid them for their homegrown stud. Also, George has been playing SG the past two seasons despite being more of a small forward. The longer Granger is occupying that SF spot in the starting lineup the more Paul’s growth is hindered. It’s time he assume his rightful position and grow into a star role, much like Danny once did.
> 
> The Pacers have a lot of things they can accomplish with Granger’s money. The team still needs to improve their depth on the frontline to tangle with the rim-attacking Heat and the new Bynum-led Sixers. Power forward David West is on the decline (and will be a free agent next summer) while Tyler Hansbrough and Miles Plumlee are merely a step up from Jeff Pendergraph. Indiana lost Darren Collison this summer and replaced him with…D.J. Augustin, hardly an upgrade. Then they lost Leandro Barbosa while netting the mercurial Gerald Green. Other than keeping Hibbert, it’s been a very average summer in Indiana as they hope to grow from within. I agree, but you still need depth to get through an 82-game season and deep into the playoffs.
> 
> Much the same way that Philadelphia recently traded Andre Iguodala and that Memphis continues to gauge interest in Rudy Gay, so will Indiana try and move Danny Granger in the near future. All three guys are talented star-caliber players…..but they are not the face of their franchises.
> 
> To sum up: Roy Hibbert is the present, Paul George is the future…..and Danny Granger is just a well-paid scorer.
> 
> That “star” money can be spent better elsewhere for a team hoping to take the next step.


----------



## R-Star

That's a ****ing terrible article. 

I believe in loyalty especially with players who have player their while career with you. Paul George has given me no indication that he could just step in and be a 20ppg scorer next season at the 3 spot. 

And the way he downplays our team is ridiculous. David West is far from a guy I'd considered to be on the decline. He's filled out his potential, but I don't see him having a drop off in production any time soon. Talks about how Augustin is hardly an upgrade, yet doesn't even mention Mahinmi. 

Calling it an average summer for the team who finished 5th in the league last year shouldn't be an insult.

I for one think we're going to make noise once again next year. Conference finals are my goal and I would assume its the same for Indys front office.


----------



## Knick Killer

Not knocking you Gonzo I'm glad you posted that, but that might be the worst article I've read in my ****ing life. There isn't anything else out there on the web(that I can find) that says we plan on getting rid of Granger. I can't believe it said we need to add some depth to compete with the "Bynum-led Sixers"...what a ****ing joke.


----------



## Knick Killer




----------



## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> Not knocking you Gonzo I'm glad you posted that, but that might be the worst article I've read in my ****ing life. There isn't anything else out there on the web(that I can find) that says we plan on getting rid of Granger. I can't believe it said we need to add some depth to compete with the "Bynum-led Sixers"...what a ****ing joke.


I've read a lot of terrible shit out there. Another article was claiming the Bulls were still going to be #2 in the East, and explained how we had no chance mathematically of passing them. Called the guy out on twitter. No response.


----------



## R-Star

Paul George to me could be like TMac. I just don't see it all ever coming together at that level though.


----------



## Gonzo

Knick Killer said:


> Not knocking you Gonzo I'm glad you posted that, but that might be the worst article I've read in my ****ing life. There isn't anything else out there on the web(that I can find) that says we plan on getting rid of Granger. I can't believe it said we need to add some depth to compete with the "Bynum-led Sixers"...what a ****ing joke.


Yeah, I didn't post it because it was a good article, moreso just getting it flowing a bit in here. We'll see what happens this year with Paul George. If he becomes a consistent offensive threat, I don't see a need of having Granger and we could pick up some good role players for him. If Paul George hovers around 15ppg we will definitely still need Granger and I wouldn't mind keeping him. If Paul George plays like last year, I'd say he would be a good trading chip. Need to get better sometime.


----------



## Gonzo

R-Star said:


> I for one think we're going to make noise once again next year. Conference finals are my goal and I would assume its the same for Indys front office.


We really have to improve because we won't be flying in under the radar. We have more national tv games this year than we've had in the past 7. Finals are my goal, but maybe that's a little agressive.


----------



## R-Star

Gonzo said:


> We really have to improve because we won't be flying in under the radar. We have more national tv games this year than we've had in the past 7. Finals are my goal, but maybe that's a little agressive.


People say shit like that, but who cares? What game last year would we have lost if we didn't fly under the radar?

We're an equal team to last year, I expect equal results.

People recognizing our skill shouldn't change that.


----------



## clownskull

R-Star said:


> Paul George to me could be like TMac. I just don't see it all ever coming together at that level though.


yeh, i think one of the big differences is tmac's ballhandling/driving abilities were better.


----------



## Knick Killer

> The Indiana Pacers filled up their roster for training camp as the team announced the signings of forward Sam Young and guards Sundiata Gaines and Blake Ahearn.
> 
> Young is 6-6 wing heading into his fourth NBA season after three years with the Memphis Grizzlies and Philadelphia 76ers. Young averaged 6.6 points per game and 1.8 rebounds per game in his first three seasons. No doubt there is some lingering admiration for Young at the Fieldhouse from his rookie workout with the Pacers when he showed up ready to work after injuring his arm the day before in Toronto when this happened.
> 
> Gaines is a 6-1 point guard who was undrafted and made splash in his rookie year when a playing opportunity arose in Utah. Since then Gaines has bounced around with stints in Minnesota, Toronto and New Jersey. He played in 57 games last season with the Nets, averaging 5.1 points, 2.2 assists and 1.8 rebounds.
> 
> We already knew about Ahearn, the small shooting guard who has displayed exceptional shooting and scoring ability in the D-League.
> 
> These signing max out the Pacers roster at 15 heading into camp which doesn't include second round pick O.J. Johnson. Obviously, nothing is guaranteed with these three players, however these are some quality camp signings of players that can play in the league


http://www.indycornrows.com/2012/9/6/3298960/pacers-announce-signing-of-sam-young-sundiata-gaines-and-blake-ahearn

I watched a lot of Sam Young in college but haven't seen much of him since he's been in the NBA and I couldn't tell you a damn thing about the other two guys.


----------



## Knick Killer




----------



## Pacers Fan

Really hoping Sam Young makes the cut. I'm not sure how effective he'll be in our lineup with his lack of a jumpshot, but I like his athleticism and I think he has some defensive potential. We'll see, but him playing with DJ Augustin, Paul George, and/or Gerald Green could be really fun.


----------



## Gonzo

Paul George is changing his number



> Paul George ‏@King24George
> NEW NUMBER!!! #PacerNation
> 
> Paul George ‏@King24George
> Not this season tho next season..! #WorldwideP #PacerNation


PG-13?


----------



## Knick Killer

> The Indiana Pacers enjoyed being the overachieving, blue-collar team that went toe-to-toe with the NBA's heavyweights last season.
> 
> It was that mindset -- and coach Frank Vogel's sometimes over the top optimism -- that helped the team finish with the fifth-best record in the league and brought back a buzz in the city that had not existed for years.
> 
> The optimism has carried over to the upcoming season. Training camp commences later this week.
> 
> "Our ticket sales are going very strong," Pacers Sports and Entertainment President Jim Morris said. "At this point, we've had more ticket package sales than we had the entire season last year. *Our ticket sales across the board are 27-28 percent higher than last year at this point.* The renewal rate has been going very well."


http://www.indystar.com/article/20120929/SPORTS04/209290332/Great-Expectations-Pacers-fans-plan-watching-winner-season?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Indianapolis%20Sports&nclick_check=1

Now that's what I like to hear.


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## R-Star

Good news.


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## Knick Killer

Pacers are playing a preseason game tonight in Fargo, North Dakota. Fargo is only a couple hours away from Winnipeg so I was seriously considering making the trip but it just didn't work out. Luckily it didn't as apparently Granger, Hill and West aren't even playing.


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## Gonzo




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## Knick Killer

I was just about to post that. He's going to be fun to watch this year.


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## Knick Killer

Any of you guys catch a Pacers preseason game yet?


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## R-Star

Nope. League Pass isn't showing any. Porn hooked me up with a link but the one game I was going to watch, I passed out right when it started at 5. Having a newborn makes you run on some pretty weird hours.


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## Gonzo

First preseason game is aired on tv tonight so I'll be watching. Sounds like they've given the keys to Paul George this preseason so we'll see how improved his handles are.


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## R-Star

Man I don't like Lance Stevenson.

Not only does he suck, but he walks around the court after plays like he's some sort of bad ass. I want this scrub off the team.


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## R-Star

Maybe I was wrong about Gerald Green. Great showing in the first game I've seen him in. Also seems like a pretty nice guy in the post game interview. Hope he continues to prove me wrong.

Couple of nice dunks, one was just sick.


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## Gonzo

I'm glad we have Green locked up for three years, we're going to see a bunch of highlights from him. 

And Ian Mahinmi is 10x better than Amundson, huge upgrade there. We really could have used a decent backup Center last year, looks like we finally have one.


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## R-Star

Gonzo said:


> I'm glad we have Green locked up for three years, we're going to see a bunch of highlights from him.
> 
> And Ian Mahinmi is 10x better than Amundson, huge upgrade there. We really could have used a decent backup Center last year, looks like we finally have one.


Yea, I was thinking about how I never mentioned that after I posted last night. He was solid. Plus pairing both him and Hibbert out there on the court for stretches makes for some pretty tough D in the paint.

Happy with the Mahinmi addition so far. Still think I'll miss Collison this year though.


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## Gonzo

R-Star said:


> Yea, I was thinking about how I never mentioned that after I posted last night. He was solid. Plus pairing both him and Hibbert out there on the court for stretches makes for some pretty tough D in the paint.
> 
> Happy with the Mahinmi addition so far. Still think I'll miss Collison this year though.


I hope we get more Mahinmi and Hibbert than Hansbrough and Hibbert. 

I'm glad Collison is gone, he just never looked like he wanted to be part of that second unit.


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