# Vince wants to trade bosh.



## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

Vince wants to put kiBosh on Raptors' pick 

By LYDIA HINSHAW 
EYE ON SPORTS 

Last update: 01 July 2003 


Vince Carter wasn't exactly gung-ho on his newest teammate, Chris Bosh, the No. 4 pick in the NBA draft last Thursday night.









"I would prefer to trade him and get a veteran," Carter said Friday at the Mainland reunion game at the Ocean Center. "We need to win right now, not in a couple of years. We need experience."

Bosh has a lot of "onlys" about him. He is only 19, only 210 pounds, only spent one year in college, at Georgia Tech. He hopes to add 15-20 pounds to his 6-foot-11 frame prior to training camp in the fall.

As for a trade, the Raptors brain trust isn't talking that way. New coach Kevin O'Neill and general manager Glen Grunwald have both spoken effusively about their plans for Bosh. Which, of course, is what all coaches and GMs say in the early days after the draft.

Bosh, Carter and several other Raptors were to meet Monday for an informal workout in Bradenton. Next week, Bosh will play for the Raps' entry in the Los Angeles summer league.

Carter spoke highly of O'Neill, who will be his third coach in six seasons in the NBA.

"I love his attitude," he said. "He's a fun guy too, but he wants to win. That's what I like about him."


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## chrisbosh (May 23, 2003)

hes just indimidated by bosh because he will eventually be the number 1 opton.


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## bigbabyjesus (Mar 1, 2003)

Whats with people and still not knowing Bosh, is 225?
But I understand why vince wants to trade him, but still he's the only future we have on this team


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

vince really shouldn't be a gm... cause he would suck.. and he's not our gm.. maybe he'll change his mind about bosh in the future.


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## icehawk (May 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>chrisbosh</b>!
> hes just indimidated by bosh because he will eventually be the number 1 opton.


Maybe, but more likely he wants somebody to help the win more games a la Sprewell or better yet, Rasheed Wallace.

However, our youth movement isn't too great. We really only have Bradley and Jefferies, neither looking to be our savior in the future. Bosh is our guy.

Man, I hope Bosh doesn't read this article 

Very good Vince, step one of breaking your predecessor's confidence


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## ATM (Jun 23, 2003)

i know vince is our star player and a damn good one at that
but he is a huge glory hog
he pushed t-mac out and encourages the raptors signing decent players (davis, JYD) rather than letting them get marquee players, he is obviously threatened by bosh knowing that bosh will eventually be an all-star, this is supposed to be vinces team, why doesnt he act like it


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## Vinsanity (May 28, 2002)

he is ****in jealous and afraid of what bosh might become


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

grow up guys, vince carter is jealous of bosh? that's just ignorant. vince wants to win now and bosh probably won't make that kind of impact next year. 

also, expect him to have been taken out of context here. as far as next year is concerned, the raps might be better with a trade. that doesn't mean that vince isn't drooling at the future that bosh might give the raptors....it's just a very uncertain thing at the moment. 

GG needs to keep his options open. don't worry, he's not going to give bosh away, he knows what he COULD be.


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## RaptorDynasty (May 30, 2003)

I question the integrity of this report.

VC wanted to trade the pick before the draft. That might be what he is talking about.

When it became apparent that GG wasn't going to deal the #4, VC was the most outspoken fan of Bosh... remember?

Vince isn't the type of person to go and slam someone in the media. I mean, who knows more about bad press than Air Carter??? He never even responded to the Keon comments. He easily could have gotten into a pissing contest over those, but he played it cool and professional. Love it.

I really think this is a typical out-of-context report. The media really goes out of their way to make VC look like an ***, so take my advice and just ignore this BS.


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## Bulls Free Press (Jul 1, 2003)

how about trade vince and win in a couple years.


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## RaptorDynasty (May 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Bulls Free Press</b>!
> how about trade vince and win in a couple years.


How about keep Vince and let him drop 30 a game this season?

VC would never get enough touches with Lenny as head coach. When he played this past season, he might as well been sitting on the bench in the 4th 'cause the gameplan was "give the rock to AD in the post," or "Let Mo jack up threes and go 1/8 in the game."

It wasn't long ago when VC was putting up 26+ ppg's and if he stays healthy (knock on wood), he can easily do that again.

VC should be a first or second team all-NBAer this season, God willing.


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## Shadows (Jun 8, 2002)

I'm not gonna make much of a reply till I get the total scoop. I'll wait for an article/report from fan590, waymoresports, tsn, ect........


If it's true I'd be finally willing to deal VC if the right deal comes along. It's definetly overreacting but as a dedicated fan of the team the last person who should be acting as GM is a player who led his team to a 25 win season (injuries or no injuries no excuses)

VC needs to start thinking before he speaks. God knows he has enough pressure to live up to after his self proclaimed MJ comparison.

Kwame
Curry
Tyson
Melo
Darko

^^I'd be more then willing to deal a package of VC for any of these future stars.

(and YES I'm overreacting)


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

he said it on thursday maybe he changed his mind.. that was the day of the draft. and this is not a bull sh!t article...


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## macro6 (Jul 23, 2002)

vince said Raptors should draft Chris Bosh and develope him. Vince spoke highly of Chris. I dont believe that article


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## Kid_kanada (Jun 23, 2003)

Maybe Vince should worry about playing a whole season for a change if he wants to win. Glad to see he's being a team leader and building team unity. Enjoy the IR in about 20 games Vince, and then tell the fans how if healthy the Raps are a great team.


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## mvp15vc (Jun 24, 2003)

vince is not jealous of bosh

he is just thinking about now rather than the future... sure bosh woould be great for the raps in couple of years so bosh can get use nba style of ball... however vince wants to win now and a trade for a veteran would help them win more games

eventhough i want bosh to stay cuz raps need a big time big man and with bosh's work ethic he is surely to achieve sucess way before many expect


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>mvp15vc</b>!
> with bosh's work ethic he is surely to achieve sucess way before many expect


that and kevin o neil up his *** bosh will probably surprise everyone in the nba.. that's for sure.


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## -inVINCEible- (Jul 22, 2002)

vince wants to win, and bosh will help us win


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## bigbabyjesus (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>-inVINCEible-</b>!
> vince wants to win, and bosh will help us win


not now, unless he totally suprises us


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## Vince Carter (Jan 9, 2003)

Trust me Vince Carter will be happy in the long run that the Raptors selected Chris Bosh. He'll be at trainning camp and say this guy as really a lot of talent and he will be glad that he was a great pick at number four and they did the wise choice.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

You never talk about trading a player when you draft him. Carter should shut his mouth it aint his team anymore.


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## -inVINCEible- (Jul 22, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BabyBlueSlugga7</b>!
> You never talk about trading a player when you draft him. Carter should shut his mouth it aint his team anymore.



true, it isnt his team anymore

he shouldnt have been part of making decisions in the first place

he shouldnt even have rep'd us at the lottery


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## charlz (Jun 9, 2003)

IF Vince really did say that I am worried.


Because he would really think too highly of himself - and frankly Vince needs to shut up and learn how to be a leader like AD by playing hurt.



I see no reason whatsoever to get Vinces opinion on things especially when he has proven so little and has lost most of the respect among his peers over the past 2 seasons.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>charlz</b>!
> IF Vince really did say that I am worried.
> 
> 
> ...


uhhhh, why would you think vince has lost the respect of his peers? most of them really like vince and are probably VERY sorry that he has been struggling with injuries. did grant hill lose the respect of him peers when his injuries started to mount up? i should hope not.


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## . (Jun 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SkywalkerAC</b>!
> 
> 
> uhhhh, why would you think vince has lost the respect of his peers? most of them really like vince and are probably VERY sorry that he has been struggling with injuries. did grant hill lose the respect of him peers when his injuries started to mount up? i should hope not.


vince himself is in no position to make any comment at this moment, for him to make comments like that is just PATHETIC, did he provide any help to the team ?? NO he didnt, so he should just shut da hell up and let the management do whats best for the team, he hasnt even contribute anything to the team lately, so who give him the right to make any comment especially about any player's movement ?? he has no right to demand the organization to trade bosh, because they drafted bosh in hope to develop him into a quality player one day to replace vince, the raptors should trade vince while they can and get some good players or another star in return while he still has value.


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

I have to agree with the view that Vince is in no position to talk. And still, even if he were, what _good_ can come out of saying something like that?


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## bigbabyjesus (Mar 1, 2003)

Holy Sh*t people your overreacting, he said this BEFORE they drafted Bosh, so whats the big deal, The MLSE told Glen they want the raptors to win now opposed to losing now and winning in the future, So trading the 4 pick for a vet is the first thing that comes to mind


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## bigbabyjesus (Mar 1, 2003)

*my bad*

_"Vince Carter wasn't exactly gung-ho on his newest teammate, Chris Bosh, the No. 4 pick in the NBA draft last Thursday night. "I would prefer to trade him and get a veteran," Carter said Friday at the Mainland reunion game at the Ocean Center. "We need to win right now, not in a couple of years. We need experience." ' *Daytona Beach News-Journal*_


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>.</b>!
> 
> 
> vince himself is in no position to make any comment at this moment, for him to make comments like that is just PATHETIC, did he provide any help to the team ?? NO he didnt, so he should just shut da hell up and let the management do whats best for the team, he hasnt even contribute anything to the team lately, so who give him the right to make any comment especially about any player's movement ?? he has no right to demand the organization to trade bosh, because they drafted bosh in hope to develop him into a quality player one day to replace vince, the raptors should trade vince while they can and get some good players or another star in return while he still has value.


why did you quote me on that? our posts have very little to do with each other.

vince isn't demanding anything. he was answering questions about his preference that i'm sure were taken out of context. MANY people here were hoping to trade bosh. GG himself was hoping to trade bosh but the right deal has not come along yet and that's what is important. therefore, you'll see that even if vince was not misquoted, his feelings are analogous with those of the organization- you make moves that will benefit the team.


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

ya vince needs to think more about trying to stay healthy.. he's been a big waste of dollars... he's in no postion to make comments like this..


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

ppl are reacting way to much to his comments, vince obviously has the same sorta thoughts that everyone has going on in their heads, at one point he was thinking well if we keep the pick, Bosh is a good player to get, and obviously he is also thinking that it would be nice to win now.......his mistake is letting his thoughts out into the media, and he should know better by now, but it was just stupid on his part to tell the media what he was thinking, that doesnt mean now suddenly he should be traded or its not his team or whatever.......


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## charlz (Jun 9, 2003)

> origonal post by*skywalkerAC*
> uhhhh, why would you think vince has lost the respect of his peers? most of them really like vince and are probably VERY sorry that he has been struggling with injuries. did grant hill lose the respect of him peers when his injuries started to mount up? i should hope not.


dude get your head out of you a$$ don't you watch anything otherthan Brian Heaney's pathetic game notes? 

Shoot even Leo Ruetins said "..I can't comment on what player on the team are saying about Vince ... all I will say is look at the facial expressions of his team mates on the bench next time Vince is rolling around on the floor for 10 minutes..."

Barkley has ripped him, Keon Clark has torched him to name a few even the mild mannered good guy Kevin Willis had some strong words for him during this weeks play-offs.

your lost - your membership to this board should be revoked skywalker.


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## TMOD (Oct 12, 2002)

Davis and Oakley also said things about Vince in the past. As for the post before this - I just think that yourself and SkywalkerAC are on a different page here, you both have your own points.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>charlz</b>!
> 
> 
> dude get your head out of you a$$ don't you watch anything otherthan Brian Heaney's pathetic game notes?
> ...


and a couple of ppl represent EVERYONE in the NBA???


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## charlz (Jun 9, 2003)

you said


> and a couple of ppl represent EVERYONE in the NBA???





> most of the respect among his peers over the past 2 seasons




I said he has lost the respect of most players in the NBA and stand by it. 2 years again he was bonified all-star and dream teamer. 

Do I think most of the players in the NBA would say so now?

NO WAY! If you do you are just blindly loyal to Vince to the point where you are in denial over anything someone might say bad about him.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>charlz</b>!
> you said
> 
> 
> ...


did you read what skywalker said?? what he said was right, most of the players do probably respect Vince and feel sorry bout his injuries......


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## tinygiant (Sep 10, 2002)

Just because he isn't the superstar of the league doesn't mean that he has lost respect. People realize that his sub-par play the last two years has been as a result of injuries. If people's respect level is directly related to how well they perform, then ever retired player would get no respect at all. Obviously this is not the case.


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## charlz (Jun 9, 2003)

The problem is not injuries it is how he deals with them. AW has played through some serious pain - when he gets hurt - he pops up and gets off the floor.


Vince (and anyone who is well-read knows this) is a prima donna a drama queen. 

"Hey everyone look at me I am hurt..." how does a guy writhe around in pain every 9th game of the season and often times he comes back and plays in the same quarter.

It is totally un-neccasary and it make people sick including his team mates. Go to a game and if you see it happen watch the bench - you don't need court side seats to see his team mates are tired of his routine.

I have never seen Alvin Williams or JYD do that floor pounding -face grimacing crap that VC does. People have the perception that if he is that soft on the court for pain then - how hurt is he?


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## -inVINCEible- (Jul 22, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>charlz</b>!
> Vince (and anyone who is well-read knows this) is a pre-madonna a drama queen.



isnt it a 'prima donna'?


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>charlz</b>!
> The problem is not injuries it is how he deals with them. AW has played through some serious pain - when he gets hurt - he pops up and gets off the floor.
> 
> 
> ...


give me a break. you're hating on him for displaying pain? he doesn't live up to your vision of "a real man" or something? obviously you've had certain expectations of him (ie him conducting himself in the manner that would make you happy) and he's failed to live up to them. well guess what, EVERYBODY'S disappointed. he tried playing hurt and that didn't work out. you can't risk your career trying to make playoffs for crying out loud. injuries are a sad part of life in sports and i am disgusted how people develop hatred rather than pity when things aren't going their way. vince has always conducted himself well in the nba- i think it's plain to see that he's one of the great personalities in the league. but hey, hatred blinds. right now we just have to wait and see, i predict that vince is going to suprise a lot of people next season...except it won't really be suprise now will it? they already knew how good he was and what a class act he is...they just let a little fear and hatred make them forget.


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## trick (Aug 23, 2002)

i'm with Skywalker on this one. do not hate Vince for his injuries. you may think he's soft, but let's see how you guy can deal with his injuries. how many of you can actually still play with his injuries? i admired how he played hurt 2 seasons ago, and now people are giving him crap for 'not being strong' for that? 

Vince has a lot of heart: 
-held private workouts
-represents the raps well throughout the communities with his vast amount of charity help
-and the look of disappointed he held when raps got the 4th pick showed how badly he wanted to get the team better

did we forget how HE took the raps almost to the ECF 3 years ago? was it not him who put the raps as a contender in the east during those days? do you actually think that with all he's been through, all the crap he endured, all the injuries he's suffered, that he'll bounce back just like that? it's takes time, and WHEN that time comes, you people (our own raptors fans, i can't believe it) will eat your words.


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## charlz (Jun 9, 2003)

> you're hating on him for displaying pain?


can you please read what I am saying???

*IT IS NOT ABOUT PLAYING IN PAIN* 

it is the routine of rolling around on the floor, grimacing, pounding the floor which he does once a month or so during the season. I have watched alot of ball in my days and I never see players carry on like that - and make the game stop for 5 minutes.

When I see that I think the following:
1. He likes sympathy and attention
2. He is showing weakness (other players have the same injuries and keep it to themself)
3. He gives in to pain easily.

Now I may make the wrong assumption there but that is what I THINK. and he does not do much to disuade it.


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## djmyte (Jun 10, 2002)

I think a lot of fans are scared to support Vince because if they do and he fails, they think it will somehow reflect poorly on them. It's easier to attack him because if he fails they can say they were right all along where as if he succeeds, all is forgiven. A win-win situation.


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

Vince has got to worry about himself and what he does.. He has to come back next year with something to prove to the world. Play with a chip on his shoulders..


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## RaptorDynasty (May 30, 2003)

There is a certain amount of theatricallity to the way Vince get's injured. I don't think anyone would say he couldn't stand to suck it up just a little. But there are other factors at work here.

The pounding of the fist is mostly a frustration thing, if you ask me. He put a lot of pressure on himself at the beginning of last season. He planned on going out and proving every doubter wrong. Then, very early on, he knee buckles and *poof*, his plans are monkeywrenched.

I think it is a pretty universal human trait that the more upset you are, the more you let it show. And keep in mind, these are serious injuries he has had, not little bumps and scrapes. I've felt the kind of injury he has had, and it isn't easy to just grit your teeth and walk off.

Also, remember when he came back the second time and he got punched in the face in the paint? I remember saying to myself, "ohh god, here we go again" when he went off with his face in his hands. But he had a nasty black eye and cut on his face the next day.

I think we should forget about everything that has happened and just let him reshape his image this season. We owe him a second chance.


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## LetsGoLampe (Jun 13, 2003)

Thing is, Vince was not misquoted...he said it in the Q & A at his camp in Daytona...a kid asked him what he thought of the draft and he said word for word what he was quoted in the Toronto papers. Word is that the Raptors organization is not too happy with him over this, friend of mine works for them and told me this just yesterday.

1. If he felt this way, that is something you discuss in private. If Grunwald felt the same it would have been done but now if Grunwald trades Bosh it will look like VC runs the team, and Grunwald can't lose the respect of the league.

2. You should support your teammates in the public 100%, and he should remember that Bosh is now a teammate, weather he has played with him or not.

3. Tons of rookies have made valueble impacts, see Amare last year.


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>LetsGoLampe</b>!
> 
> 1. If he felt this way, that is something you discuss in private. If Grunwald felt the same it would have been done but now if Grunwald trades Bosh it will look like VC runs the team, and Grunwald can't lose the respect of the league.
> 
> ...


bam he hit it right on the head


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## charlz (Jun 9, 2003)

> LetsGoLampe!


hey finally someone who knows what the heck they are talking about! 

exactly what I have been saying - you don't rip a guy publicly it is totally arrogant and classless


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## MadFishX (Jun 28, 2003)

what does carter have to be worried or jeallous about? losing the spot light, not being the number 1 player on the team anymore, losing respect of fellow nba players?
damn, hez already lost all of that


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## CrimsonShadows (Jun 12, 2003)

*Can't believe all this hating*

The man gets hurt, gets upset, and gets emotional about the future of his team and so called raptor fans are all over him.

:no: 

let me remind you of what Vince has done for us. 

1) He was the first and only big time superstar to ever give our team, our city, and our country a chance. Every other big name we drafted ran the first chance they had (Mighty Mouse, T-mac comes to mind). And if he didn't most likely the Raptors would be playing in some half baked American city just like the Grizzlies.

2) He singlehandedly put our team on the map, making the playoff and then all the way to the ECF. Losing I might add only by a missed last second shot.

3) He has represented our city, and our nation with pride, and works for our community like few other superstars in the league. (Has there ever been a Sprewell charity game?) He has brought basketball back to us as a sport to be watched and enjoyed. You could even say that he is to Canadian basketball what Tiger is to Golf in the States.

With all that said, he was been injured the last two years, and he did try to played through it the first season, but it didn't work, in fact it probably did more damage to his knees. 

Many of you mock and berate him for his comments but to me it shows that he cares. It shows that he is thinking about his teams future and preformance, and he wants very baddly to be a winner again. In fact I think that with all that he has invested in our team and our community that he has every right to think and say whatever he wants, GG doesn't have to do it, but vince has earned the right to say it.


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## Kid_kanada (Jun 23, 2003)

I can't believe all this crap I'm reading about VC. The fact that you have to defend Vince should be a sign to you. Orlando doesn't have we hate T-Mac posts, SA doesn't rip Duncan, Where is the I hate Jermaine O'Neal threads?


1) Vince doesn't work hard. When Vince got hurt last season against SA (first injury last year), the doctors clearly said Vince didn't work hard enough on his rehap and so he re-injured his knee. Thanks for almost trying last summer Vince. BTW I enjoy watching you play in Nike commercials instead of in games. Compare his first season to his last, the numbers are very similar except points, but Vince is a much better 3 point shooter now, hence the diff. Glad to see 5 season didn't make you better all around. You're FG didn't improve yet you're hitting 10% more from behind the line. You actually became a worse overall shooter. Maybe if you went to the hole you might get an easy two. Way to learn and study the game, evolve as a player. Keep jacking 3 Steve Kerr.

2) For every good thing he says, the next words out of his mouth are STUPID. The Chris Bosh thing is just the last dumb thing to come out of his mouth. Here's a little tip Vince, say the good things out loud, then SHUT THE F UP!!! Praise your organization in public and say what every want to your Mommy. Just make sure your Mommy doesn't talk to the media either. If you said the Bosh thing to GG it wouldn't be an issue, just don't say it to the press.

3) If you get a boo boo it's ok to cry just don't act like you got shot. There is nothing worst then wathcing you roll around for 10 minutes and then the game comes back from commercial and your leading a fast break. (wait the raps didn't have any fast break points last year because thoses come from playing defense.) Willis McGhee didn't seem nearly as hurt as you, and you just jammed you finger on the ball.

4) Stop telling the media you don't care about what other players say about you, as long as your teammates respect you. You obviously care, because you keeping telling us you don't. Work hard and show up next season and then the rest of the league will respect you and then you can tell us how happy that makes you feel, and will we all believe you then.

5) Vince is 6'6, and I'm pretty sure athletic, so why don't you play D. I know it's Lenny fault, but when you are covering a 6'4 2 guard I'm pretty sure he shouldn't be coming down with the board. It's soo frustrating because you are soo athletic that if you tried you could be close to MJ on D. WHY don't you try. When the Raps need to play Zone to hide you weakness it shows how lazy you really are on D. Let me guess Vince is an underrated player on D. No he's lazy and that is why he always seems to be in foul trouble when he guards someone his own size. I know those fouls aren't coming from charges, because that would require Vince actually going to the Net.

6) Amazing how this leads me to my last point. 38% from 3, glad to see you work on you shooting, too bad the rest of you game got worst. I know I kind of covered this already, but a lay-up is worth two points, just like an 21 footer. Try the lay-up it's a higher percentage shot. The reason people call you soft is because the last time I saw you drive to the hoop, Vancouver was an up and coming franchise, and Big Country was just maybe a stiff.

I know I know I hate on Vince, but hey Oh well, and don't try to give me that crap that we almost made it to the ECF. I almost was voted class president in grade 4, doesn't mean it happened. Vince saved the Franchise cause he stayed and everyone else left. T-Mac was mad for not getting the playing time until the last half of his last season, and Damon was traded because Isiah left. Way to listen to Isiah and wait a year to sign the deal Damon great job. Opps lost a little money there. If vince left some star would have come here. You think it would sounded like this "Hey NBA star I'll sign for 5 mill, or you can go to the Raps for 12. I think I'll sign for 5 cause I don't want to go to TO." Sure that's exactly what would have happend. Vince didn't save the Raps he just put them on Sportscenter, so we could all go, hey the Raps are on ESPN, they must be good because ESPN told me so. Vince if you keep you mouth shut, and play hard all this "hating" goes away really fast, if you continue to do what you did last year, enjoy the steep slide down to the bottom, it won't be an easy climb out of there.

I enjoyed my Vince "hating" and you can all tell me how I'm not a Raps fan because I ripped them, but where does it say I have to cheer when then suck.


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## . (Jun 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>djmyte</b>!
> I think a lot of fans are scared to support Vince because if they do and he fails, they think it will somehow reflect poorly on them. It's easier to attack him because if he fails they can say they were right all along where as if he succeeds, all is forgiven. A win-win situation.


so which side are you on ehhhhh ?? he he he he he


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## . (Jun 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> I have to agree with the view that Vince is in no position to talk. And still, even if he were, what _good_ can come out of saying something like that?


i couldnt agreed more, he better keep his mouth shut and try to come back as soon as he possibly can because this franchise is his franchise, will live and die with him wheather its beyond the glory or beyond the tragedy :rofl:


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## MadFishX (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Kid_kanada</b>!
> 
> 1) Vince doesn't work hard. When Vince got hurt last season against SA (first injury last year), the doctors clearly said Vince didn't work hard enough on his rehap and so he re-injured his knee.
> 
> ...


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

uhh lol everyone needs to cool down.. lol i personally think that vince needs to work hard this off season so he's fully prepared for the road ahead.


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