# Raptors @ Pistons, Nov. 5th



## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

<center>
















*Toronto Raptors* (0-2) @ *Detroit Pistons* (2-0)
November 5th, 2005, 7:30PM EST
TSN

<IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="JAMES, MIKE" TITLE="JAMES, MIKE" SRC="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v129/speedythief/raptors/mjames0.jpg"> <IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="ROSE, JALEN" TITLE="ROSE, JALEN" SRC="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v129/speedythief/raptors/jrose0.jpg"> <IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="GRAHAM, JOEY" TITLE="GRAHAM, JOEY" SRC="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v129/speedythief/raptors/jgraham0.jpg"> <IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="BOSH, CHRIS" TITLE="BOSH, CHRIS" SRC="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v129/speedythief/raptors/cbosh0.jpg"> <IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="WOODS, LOREN" TITLE="WOODS, LOREN" SRC="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v129/speedythief/raptors/lwoods0.jpg">
*Mike James, Jalen Rose, Joey Graham, Chris Bosh, Loren Woods*

<IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="BILLUPS, CHAUNCEY" TITLE="BILLUPS, CHAUNCEY" SRC="/img/headshots/100x150/pistons/BILLUPS, CHAUNCEY.jpg"> <IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="HAMILTON, RICHARD" TITLE="HAMILTON, RICHARD" SRC="/img/headshots/100x150/pistons/HAMILTON, RICHARD.jpg"> <IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="PRINCE, TAYSHAUN" TITLE="PRINCE, TAYSHAUN" SRC="/img/headshots/100x150/pistons/PRINCE, TAYSHAUN.jpg"> <IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="WALLACE, RASHEED" TITLE="WALLACE, RASHEED" SRC="/img/headshots/100x150/pistons/WALLACE, RASHEED.jpg"> <IMG WIDTH=100 HEIGHT=150 BORDER=0 ALT="WALLACE, BEN" TITLE="WALLACE, BEN" SRC="/img/headshots/100x150/pistons/WALLACE, BEN.jpg">
*Chauncey Billups, Richard Hamilton, Tayshaun Prince, Rasheed Wallace, Ben Wallace*</center>


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Probably better to face a team like this than to face one like Atlanta, New Orleans, or whoever. After last night's game we have no choice but to "play hard, play as a team", otherwise we'll be getting embarassed even worse.


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## bigbabyjesus (Mar 1, 2003)

Another game I'm going to miss because of work. Goddamnit. I'm not used to this.


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

vigilante said:


> Another game I'm going to miss because of work. Goddamnit. I'm not used to this.


lol,
I have to go out so I'm taping it and trying to avoid hearing the score. I'll bet we lose, but I still don't wanna know the score...

yipee 0-3!


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## ColinBeehler (Oct 14, 2003)

all i care about is that our players develope... i dont care at all whether we win or lose really...


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## Turkish Delight (Mar 17, 2004)

I have three essays due in the next three weeks so I'm going to stay at home tonight most probably. It looks like I'll be able to watch this one. Any hope on getting our first win will be very low. I expect us to keep very close with the Pistons as we normally do, but our Pistons Killer - Donyell Marshall is no longer with us which is bound to make things even more difficult.


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## Copper (Dec 9, 2004)

It will be interesting to see the Raps without Marshall. I dont think the Raps have enough talent to get the W but after our lackluster play last night versus the Celts? anything is possible.


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## nwt (Apr 24, 2005)

Washington, NJ, Detroit and Cle are our first four games? 

Oh man


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## Divine Spammer (Jul 11, 2005)

Yay, we're 0-3! 
Hey, maby it's the opposite of the last season? 
Instead of winning the first three games of the season, we lose them, win the fourth, lose the next, and then we have a nice streak of wins. 
And in the end of the season we have franchise's best record ever: 49-33!


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## bigbabyjesus (Mar 1, 2003)

ColinBeehler said:


> all i care about is that our players develope... i dont care at all whether we win or lose really...


I don't care about wins as much as I care about our young players developing, BUT I would like to see our team develop more of a tough minded defensive mentality and get away from the chucking as the season goes on. Unfortunately, as long as Jalen Rose is here, that mentality won't be reached.


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## Mr_B (Mar 6, 2004)

Raps are gonna get hammred pistons got a new offense too there somewhat of a running team now


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## ColinBeehler (Oct 14, 2003)

vigilante said:


> I don't care about wins as much as I care about our young players developing, BUT I would like to see our team develop more of a tough minded defensive mentality and get away from the chucking as the season goes on. Unfortunately, as long as Jalen Rose is here, that mentality won't be reached.


ya, i agree with you there... the atmosphere we develope is key. gotta get our players thinking defense first, and inside-outside rather then chucking it. but, if we play the game the right way, make mistakes, get messy!!!, im alright if we fail.

-lata


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## MonsterBosh (Feb 9, 2005)

I suspect we are going to see a lot of the Piston's bench playing tonight .... and I hope that Darko gets lots of minutes so the game can be entertaining.

What would it take to get Darko from the Pistons ... ??!!


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## madman (Oct 20, 2003)

going to be a tough game and i actually like how we have had to play 3 straight good teams, it lets the rooks know what they have to do to be succesful.

Lets hope that bosh can get it going again


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## Chris Bosh #4 (Feb 18, 2005)

This is only good for our work ethic.


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## MonsterBosh (Feb 9, 2005)

Tonights matchups ....

Mike James vs Chauncey Billups ..... no contest :clown:

Jalen Rose vs Richard Hamilton .... schooltime :dead:

Joey Graham vs Tayshaun Prince ... are you kidding me?!  

Chris Bosh vs Rasheed Wallace ... that's gonna be tough !!! :eek8:

Loren Woods vs Ben Wallace .... give him a golf club and call him Tiger !!! :laugh:


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## undefined_playa (Oct 23, 2005)

I really wanna see Rose get blocked like 3 times in a row and then blame it on the team :laugh: 
I'll say Billups and Ben have monstrous nights and Raps lose 108-93


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## Copper (Dec 9, 2004)

Its gonna be nice to see James again, he is one of the bench players from our championship that I think gets overlooked when people think of that team. He is a high energy guy and is a pitbull on defense. If more of your team takes after his lead instead of Roses, I think your team will get things turned around. As the Pistons and Spurs have shown, defense and chemistry win trophys.


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## MonsterBosh (Feb 9, 2005)

Q1 -- Pistons - 25 ... Raps - 12
Q2 -- Pistons - 22 ... Raps - 15
Q3 -- Pistons - 19 ... Raps - 18
Q4 -- Pistons - 30 ... Raps - 25

Final- Pistons - 96 ... Raps - 70​


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

Both teams on tail end of back to back so figures to be a low scoring affair (Detroit's D helps too of course). Will be interesting to see how Mitchell and his squad rebound from a pretty bad loss against one of the best teams in the league.


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## Turkish Delight (Mar 17, 2004)

MonsterBosh said:


> Q1 -- Pistons - 25 ... Raps - 12
> Q2 -- Pistons - 22 ... Raps - 15
> Q3 -- Pistons - 19 ... Raps - 18
> Q4 -- Pistons - 30 ... Raps - 25
> ...


Toronto is more likely to score 110 points than 70.


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## [email protected] (Sep 27, 2005)

hamilton for the win


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## kindred (Dec 26, 2004)

i just wish to see some more actions from jose calderon and charlie v...screw loren woods, hoffa, rose and james.......


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## Turkish Delight (Mar 17, 2004)

I want to see Charlie get a big game, but against a froncourt like Detroit's, I don't think tonight will be his night to shine. I could be wrong though.


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## madman (Oct 20, 2003)

god i hate the stupid bar at the bottom

bad way to start with Hamilton getting to the line


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## madman (Oct 20, 2003)

Good to see bosh get involved early


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## crimedog (Jun 3, 2003)

oooo...we're bad


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## Mr_B (Mar 6, 2004)

CV gave Woods a nice feed and woods blows the lay up smh


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## Mr_B (Mar 6, 2004)

mo pete looks bigger this year


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## crimedog (Jun 3, 2003)

this is like KO era painful. 

jalen rose is not a good presence on our team. 

we just don't compete. i didn't think we would look like this. 

i realize it will get better, but this really isn't fun to watch.


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## Chris Bosh #4 (Feb 18, 2005)

PLEASE KEEP CALDERON IN THE GAME! PLEASE! PLEASE MAKE CALDERON A STARTER FOR THE NEXT GAME!

I'm done.


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## nwt (Apr 24, 2005)

72 - 45

Things are really looking good for us.


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## dtron (Jun 11, 2004)

i was already to support the raps through a losing season cause i thought they might actually try but after last nite and 3 quarters of tonite, its over for the raptors, if they get 20 wins this season ill be shocked, iam predicting a 11 game losing streak before they get their first win
the critics were right,espn was right,toronto sun was right, we were wrong, the raptors are the worse team


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## undefined_playa (Oct 23, 2005)

I don't know how many times I have to say this...but ROSE ****ING SUCKS ****!!!!! Every time he gets the ball all he does is stand around and then jack it up....he doesn't get his teammates involved, all he takes are contested jumpers. The guy is 10X the cancer Lamond ever was. He's my least favourite player in the NBA. **** JALEN ROSE!!!!!! :curse: :curse: I don't care about the swearing, i just hate rose soooo much i'm sure many of you guys feel the same way


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

Doesn't look like a missed much tonight.


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## nwt (Apr 24, 2005)

I*


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## Chris Bosh #4 (Feb 18, 2005)

Bosh was getting the touches in the first then after that they isolated him again. Rose ****ing sucks I hope he gets traded!


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## [email protected] (Sep 27, 2005)

that happened to be the most boring game i've ever watched...


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Just an ounce of excitement would've been nice. That game was a drag.

I officially don't know what Sam Mitchell is doing. Does anyone?


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## kirk_2003 (Jun 23, 2003)

speedythief said:


> Just an ounce of excitement would've been nice. That game was a drag.
> 
> I officially don't know what Sam Mitchell is doing. Does anyone?


working his way out of Toronto... can anyone say Doug Collins?


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## undefined_playa (Oct 23, 2005)

Regarding that other guy's post...even when Rose made shots, they weren't good ones. He's honestly really horrible...i don't know what to say. Bosh should honestly say "trade Rose or i'm gone." You can also tell that Bosh doesn't like Rose...BOSH NEEDS MANY MORE TOUCHES! Calderon is SUCH a better pg. And yes both of you guys are right. It's actually not Rose's fault for being a horrible team player, but Mitchell for leaving him on like an idiot even after every chucked up shot. I'm really starting to hate Sam and would really like to see him gone. If I ever see Sam, I'm gonna spray mustard all over his suit until he throws me onto a table or something.


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## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

speedythief said:


> I officially don't know what Sam Mitchell is doing. Does anyone?


Well, apparantly he has Jalen Rose and Jose Calderon on his fantasy team. 40+ minutes for both in a 30 point blow out on the tail end of a back to back. Way to ride them into the ground.

I don't understand the Jalen Rose hate. He was clearly the best Raptors player on the floor tonight. Drew about 20 fouls on his own. He was the only reason the game wasn't a 50 point blowout.


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## undefined_playa (Oct 23, 2005)

^ he's only thinking about himself, which is what this team definitely does NOT need...most of his possessions once they get him the ball, that's it he's not gonna pass it back to anyone unless the other team dbl. team's him (which they're smart enough not to)


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## Copper (Dec 9, 2004)

Rose does seem to be the Black hole on offense, when the ball goes near him it is never seen again. He is gifted as an offensive player at drawing fouls, however if he doesnt learn to get his teammates involved he will be a player noone wants on their team.


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## charlz (Jun 9, 2003)

Copper said:


> Rose does seem to be the Black hole on offense, when the ball goes near him it is never seen again. He is gifted as an offensive player at drawing fouls, however if he doesnt learn to get his teammates involved he will be a player noone wants on their team.


Rose is being show cased - if the season keeps going the direction everyone says it is - I would fully expect the Raps to dump him for an expiring contract or 2 - so might as well get those numbers up there.


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## Firesale (Oct 30, 2005)

charlz said:


> Rose is being show cased - if the season keeps going the direction everyone says it is - I would fully expect the Raps to dump him for an expiring contract or 2 - so might as well get those numbers up there.



I think you're bang on with that Charlz. I was mentioning something similar in the "Rose increased role" thread. He's clearly not part of the long term plans here, and the sooner he's out the better. But he's not going to get traded for anything remotely close to equal value if he's glued to the bench. This is nothing but a showcase. You'll see a more upbeat, exciting team after the trade deadline as a result.


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## vi3t_boi11 (Aug 14, 2004)

Bosh played alright in the first half, but he barely got any shots in the second half, didn't played at all in the 4th, and i didn't know why Rose and Peterson were still playing when we were down by like 30


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## trick (Aug 23, 2002)

i died a little inside after the game.


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## MonsterBosh (Feb 9, 2005)

Turkish Delight said:


> Toronto is more likely to score 110 points than 70.


Ummm ... well no .. that didn't happen .. did it ..!!

I predicted a final score of 96 - 70 for a 26 point spread .... while the final score was 117 - 84 for a 33 point spread .... close enough to validate part of my prediction.

Interestingly, at the 10 minute mark of the 4th quarter, the score was 91 - 66 and a 25 point spread .... then the Pistons pulled their starters from the game and put in their bench ... and from then on we had garbage time ... so I don't really count that as part of the real game ... and I think you will agree with me on that .....!!

So I predicted 96 - 70 .... and the real game ended at 91 - 66 .... not bad eh .... !!!!

The half time score comparison is also interesting in that it was 58 - 40 with 18 point spread ... while I predicted 47 - 27 and a 20 point spread ... virtually spot on. I was expecting more defence from the Pistons but they just went at it offensively because they expected they could beat the Raptors without much of a defence ... Even Vic Rautens commented before half time that he was surprised that the Pistons were so loose on defence.

So there you have it .... my prediction .... on a quarter by quarter analysis .... AND THAT IS HOW GAMES SHOULD BE PREDICTED PROPERLY .... NOT JUST MAKING EMOTIONAL JUVENILE GUESSES WITHOUT ACCOUNTABILITY .... SO NEXT GAME EVERYBODY MUST GIVE THEIR DETAILED PREDICTION BY QUARTERS TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY .... !!!


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## undefined_playa (Oct 23, 2005)

^ thanks for the advice dad


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## [email protected] (Sep 27, 2005)

MonsterBosh said:


> Ummm ... well no .. that didn't happen .. did it ..!!
> 
> I predicted a final score of 96 - 70 for a 26 point spread .... while the final score was 117 - 84 for a 33 point spread .... close enough to validate part of my prediction.
> 
> ...


ya you're my hero now :joke: 
do you feel great that you predicted nicely? maybe you should call up ms. cleo, she'd love to hear from you



a piece of me died in auburn hills and it will not be revived ever again


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## wind161 (Jun 19, 2005)

LOL.. what did he say this time? something about predictions? how bout tell him to piss off


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## toiletscrubber (Sep 22, 2002)

the brightest spot of the game must be seeing Alvin back on the court again
and I think everyone can tell he's no where close to being 100%
and did anyone see him dove for the loose ball?...this coming from a guy who just come bak from a knee surgery. Alvin should be everyone's favourite raptors, not Matt Bonner

by the way, I don't know what is sam thinking by putting Bonner on Prince in the second quarter. If I am Bonner I would honestly just go to the bench and tell Sam, "I suck and I can't guard anyone in the league but Scalabrine and Mark Madsen". And just to confuse me more, sam started the second half with a small lineup, and the immdiate result: mo pete jacking up more wild shots than he never needs too, and the raptors got own at the board.


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## madman (Oct 20, 2003)

i almost threw up when they showed aaron's fingers


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## Turkish Delight (Mar 17, 2004)

madman said:


> i almost threw up when they showed aaron's fingers


Ah man I missed that part.


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## dtron (Jun 11, 2004)

thats true about aaron fingers, i thought that aaron came into the game ready to play with more passion then any of the raps. and he would of been the centre for the raps if he didnt get hurt there. the block he had right before he got injured showed that he cared. and then he came back and sat with the team after his injury. besides jose, aaron was the only player i wasnt upset at after last nite game


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## lucky777s (Nov 13, 2003)

Charlz,

I just posted the same thing about Jalen being showcased in the EWill thread.

I think its a definite possibility and that EWill and Rose both know it. That would explain why EWill is so content.

Does everyone realize that Loren Woods has more rebounds per game in 10mpg than Charlie does in 30mpg? So far we would be better off with Taft or Frye at 7 than Charlie.

Can't understand Hoff and Loren only playing 13 combined minutes. Hoff held Ben Wallace off the O boards in his minutes, and Woods is a far better rebounder than Charlie or Bonner this year. Sam seems more worried about offense when we get down. Four scorers should be plenty.


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## Turkish Delight (Mar 17, 2004)

Charlie and Bosh need to step it up. They need to go out there and get those rebounds. I remember last night Carlos Arroyo got an offensive rebound for god sakes. Mitchell tried to compensate for Bosh and Charlie playing at the same time, by inserting Bonner into the SF position, but that obviously didn't work. There's something wrong with Matt right now. During the summer he's been working a lot on his handles, but he's gone away from what's made him an NBA player in the first place, his shooting. I know it'll take some time to adjust, but if Charlie and Bosh can box out and get those defensive rebounds, we should be all right.


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## foul_balls (Jun 25, 2004)

Mike luvs KG said:


> I don't understand the Jalen Rose hate. He was clearly the best Raptors player on the floor tonight. Drew about 20 fouls on his own. He was the only reason the game wasn't a 50 point blowout.


The play that really angered me was the pick and roll with Charlie. Rose got double teamed, Charlie was wide open under the hoop and Jalen jacks up a 3pt shot while double teamed. He is a great offensive player (anyone should be able to get points if they jack up 20 shots) but doesn't play smart team basketball or good defense. 

I don't like his game, but that is not why I think he should be traded. He doesn't fit Toronto's 3-4 year plan and has a bad rep for being a locker room cancer (like the jab at Bosh for having no fouls or blocks yesterday). The raps are going nowhere so they should trade him IMO.

The worst team in basketball race is alot closer than I had expected. The raptors have had a brutal starting schedule and it is _only 3 games_ into the season, but the following stats are interesting:

Toronto last night: 4-16 on 3PTs, 21 total Assists, 14 TO, 3 offensive rebounds
New Orleans vs. Hou: 0-0! on 3PTs, 23 total Assists, 8 TO, 13 offensive rebounds

New Orleans FG% differential so far: +3.2
Toronto FG% differential this season:-7.8
NO Rebounding Differential: +0.7
TO Rebounding Differential: -9.7

So far anyways, it seems New Orleans is playing better basketball and better defense, as they are crashing the boards and not shooting wild 3's. For Toronto, nothing has changed from last season, jacking up alot of 3's and no rebounding.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

I can't understand why Mitchell wouldn't find a few minutes for Hoffa in a blowout loss. Give the guy a break for crying out loud. I thought he was performing in practice? Why doesn't that at least translate to a couple garbage minutes?


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

Anyone care to fill me in on what Hoffa did so wrong to start the game?


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## undefined_playa (Oct 23, 2005)

SkywalkerAC said:


> I can't understand why Mitchell wouldn't find a few minutes for Hoffa in a blowout loss. Give the guy a break for crying out loud. I thought he was performing in practice? Why doesn't that at least translate to a couple garbage minutes?


Exactly...another one of the reasons why I think it's time for a coaching change. Mitchell is just all shouts & screams but no strategy.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

undefined_playa said:


> Exactly...another one of the reasons why I think it's time for a coaching change. Mitchell is just all shouts & screams but no strategy.



I'm sorry, but I think it's way too soon to be thinking about a coaching change. Ugh, the thought sickens me. So does Mitchell not developing Hoffa but still. The last thing this organization needs right now is for the youngins to be ripped away from Sam.

I don't know about Hoffa (cause I don't know how Sam will use him) but expect pretty big games from the rooks to be upcoming and that's really what this season is about. These boys will be fine pros before long. 

Sam deserves at LEAST this season to work with.


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## realist (Nov 6, 2005)

raps big brake will be if they get the #1 draft pick ... so 0-3 start is a perfect way towards achieiving that goal (not saying raps are purposely doing it)


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## superdude211 (Apr 3, 2004)

MonsterBosh said:


> Ummm ... well no .. that didn't happen .. did it ..!!
> 
> I predicted a final score of 96 - 70 for a 26 point spread .... while the final score was 117 - 84 for a 33 point spread .... close enough to validate part of my prediction.
> 
> ...


Man you are taking this way too seriously


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## MonsterBosh (Feb 9, 2005)

superdude211 said:


> Man you are taking this way too seriously


Not really ....
:allhail:​


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## JL2002 (Nov 30, 2003)

what happen to Aaron after then? dislocated or broken? sorry if its posted already.


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## bigbabyjesus (Mar 1, 2003)

Ugh...

My buddy told me Graham had a nice dunk in the fourth. Thats the only thing that had me intrigued. And of course, the play of Jose Calderon.


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