# Nate will be great... I wish I could say the same about our GM



## Brad (Jul 2, 2005)

Written By: Jeff - ThePhxSuns.com

This is getting ridiculous.

Well Suns fans, Bryan Colangelo did it again. Are we really surprised? I wasn't convinced when Colangelo won Exec of the Year. He likes his little cover up about the Marbury trade, and how it all led to Nash. It didn't. He just likes his money. And now they are going to prove that again by dumping Q. I'm sorry, but didn't the labor deal just lower the luxury tax? Ok, so the man has made 2 good moves in his career. He signed Nash and took a gamble on STAT. But past that, we have sat through a complete tear down and re-build every off-season, and I am sick of it. Daddys out, so why is Bryan still around? 

Why on earth did we trade Nate Robinson? Last time I checked, Kurt Thomas sucks. His career averages include a whopping 10.8 PPG, 7.6 RBPG (isn't he a center) and a 48% FG shooter. We don't need a center, so I don't see how a crappy one is going to help. I know he won't be able to run the floor with these guys. We proved we don't need a big man, and I am dissapointed Colangelo was intimitated by the Spurs enough to make such a unnescessary move. Q won the 3-point title, in a half-court offense that consists of Nash driving, and kicking it back to Q or one of the JJ's for a 3, and Nate would have fit beautifully into a high-octane system. 

The craziest thing of all though, is that this trade won't even help the Knicks. Trust me, the last thing they need is another shooter. I really thought we could follow up such a great season with finally, a great draft and off-season. I guess that would have been a little to much to ask, Mr. Colangleo..

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Honestly, I don't see why BC is such a bad guy. I know he's made some mistakes.. But we all have...

Source: http://www.thephxsuns.com/boards/viewthread.php?tid=2


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## BootyKing (Apr 7, 2005)

I can slighty very slightly see what he is saying, but overall i disagree with all of it . Yes the suns traded Q and yes he was 3 point champion and very much apart of the suns run n gun. However did this win us a championship no. If we didn't make a change then we wouldn't be champions next season. The trades and free agent suns have picked up will help our team imensly. For a very good article on the new suns outlook and trades

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http://suns.realgm.com/articles/71/20050703/suns_shine_when_the_bell_tolls_in_phoenix_/
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Booty King


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

He's not tearing it down. He's trying to sure up our D and get better depth. Kurt Thomas doesn't need to do THAT much. Just rebound and play some defense. Hit an open shot sometimes. He won't be our center, he'll be our PF with Amare at center. Also, Q may have won the 3 pt contest but his % was easily replaceable with a guy like Bell who could prolly hit more wide open shots and who plays some perimeter D. This isn't panicking. It's just us tweaking it a bit to get where we want to go. We will still run and can still run. And we were close to the Spurs, just they were deeper and more efficient. We saw how easily it is for other teams to get rebounds, along with how thin our front court is when we actually tried to stop them. Other teams we got away with it. We need a bench, some size inside, and we're doing it. We're not done yet either.

As for Nate Robinson, he wasn't our pick. Isiah Thomas wanted him so we took him. If we stay at 21, Nate Robinson is not our pick. Even so Nate Robinson isn't that great of a player to impact us to where we go to the Finals.


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## Brad (Jul 2, 2005)

All very good points, all completely agreeable. I agree ten-fold.

The traders/signings have broughten us more depth and defense, without losing offense.


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

Brad said:


> All very good points, all completely agreeable. I agree ten-fold.
> 
> The traders/signings have broughten us more depth and defense, without losing offense.


Exactly. We have our scorers in Amare, JJ, Marion.....what we needed was those role players lol. But don't get me wrong. Seeing Lil Nate in a Suns Uni would have been awesome lol.


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## Tiz (May 9, 2005)

dissonance19 said:


> He's not tearing it down. He's trying to sure up our D and get better depth. Kurt Thomas doesn't need to do THAT much. Just rebound and play some defense. Hit an open shot sometimes. He won't be our center, he'll be our PF with Amare at center. Also, Q may have won the 3 pt contest but his % was easily replaceable with a guy like Bell who could prolly hit more wide open shots and who plays some perimeter D. This isn't panicking. It's just us tweaking it a bit to get where we want to go. We will still run and can still run. And we were close to the Spurs, just they were deeper and more efficient. We saw how easily it is for other teams to get rebounds, along with how thin our front court is when we actually tried to stop them. Other teams we got away with it. We need a bench, some size inside, and we're doing it. We're not done yet either.
> 
> As for Nate Robinson, he wasn't our pick. Isiah Thomas wanted him so we took him. If we stay at 21, Nate Robinson is not our pick. Even so Nate Robinson isn't that great of a player to impact us to where we go to the Finals.


Exactly! 
:clap:


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## ShuHanGuanYu (Feb 3, 2005)

I want to continue to post here out of loyalty to BBB.net, so here's a copy of my post from that new site. After reading through this thread, turns out I tend to like...totally agree with dissonance19. 


_Originally posted by Chris_
I wholeheartedly disagree, my friend. To say a GM should never make a mistake is to say he should be inhuman. He makes the best decisions based on what he and his team of assistants know, and thus far I'd say he has a good track record. "Just" signing Nash and "just" gambling on Amare are the two things that led to the Suns competing for a championship. That's what their main goal always is, to either put a championship caliber team on the floor or ensure that one will be there in the near future.



> He just likes his money. And now they are going to prove that again by dumping Q.


Most GM's are frugal, especially when they are playing with someone else's money. Simply put, they overpaid the role that they asked Q to undertake. I love him as a player, but let's be real here. We could not use Q to his full potential, and we payed a lot of money to have someone trail and shoot threes. The Suns run a pick and roll offense most of the time that they actually get into the halfcourt, not the full post isolation offense that Q would do well in. Q is good, but Raja Bell will fill his role for much less money.



> Last time I checked, Kurt Thomas sucks. His career averages include a whopping 10.8 PPG, 7.6 RBPG (isn't he a center) and a 48% FG shooter.


Don't go by career stats. Just like Joe Johnson's career stats are not flattering and wouldn't tell the story, for Kurt we should go by what type of player he is lately. As of last year, he's a double double guy who rarely misses a game and can post-D-up better than anyone the Suns have had in quite awhile. And this is on a weak lackluster NY franchise where he was not exactly swarmed with help. He has a sweet mid range game, which is nice because his jump shot is pretty consistent. He'll get open shots on this team, and as a veteran he'll make players pay for sneaking toward Amare. He's not going to run a team out of the building obviously...but we don't want a 62 win team that almost couldn't win a game in the WCF. We want a team built for the rugged playoffs, built for a championship. We probably will win in the high 50's this year, but when the game is on the line in the playoffs and we need a big inside stop or a big rebound, Kurt is going to be there to help. How can the Suns run in the playoffs when they give up endless offensive rebounds?



> we have sat through a complete tear down and re-build every off-season, and I am sick of it.


What season are you talking about? Tell me which season under B.C. we tore down the team that we might have won something big with. Opening your eyes and realizing that the team is going nowhere (like under Steph), is a gift not a curse. A good GM must know when to rebuild and when to force wins now. It wasn't gonna happen then, and look where it got us now.



> Nate would have fit beautifully into a high-octane system.


Nate would have been fun to watch in the regular season, but I don't think he's the answer to the Suns problems in the playoffs. He has potential, but how good do you think he would have been in his rookie year? Nash isn't getting any younger, we need to shoot for it this year. His size would also come back to bite us when it really counted. If it were actually the Suns pick they would have drafted someone else anyways, not Nate the Great.



> Q won the 3-point title


Nice achievement...but 3's are much harder to come by in the playoffs. If your role is basically to be a volume shooter (at mostly low %'s), then your role will be easy to counteract in the back and forth chess game that is the playoffs...and it was. They knew all they had to do was stay close to him and he would be rendered inneffective. At least when Bell is out there and not hitting, he will give us some solid defense. Not a knock on Q, but again I don't think the Suns were right for him.

With the way big men are vastly overpaid these days, the Suns got about all they could get. Nene, Dalembert, etc. would have been nice in theory, but it would have cost us JJ. Kurt Thomas, while old, is still solid at what he does...and the Suns are not asking him to do anything more than rebound, play defense, take the ball out, hit the open shot, and then try to keep up. Even if this move turns out to be a bust, I still applaud Bryan Colangelo for not standing pat when he and most of their fans knew they weren't going to win it all with the weaknesses they had. They tweaked a bit, brought in some defense. There will still be times of small ball for Suns 2006, but at least now they have the option of playing interior defense if the need should arise...and it will.


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## tempe85 (Jan 7, 2005)

If anyone watched the Suns this year and thought we had enough defense to win the championship they are freaking blind. Bryan is doing what he can to shore up our defense. No matter how you slice it we weren't going to far without more defense. We traded away possibly our worst defender (he did take charges... that was about the extent of his defense) and got a quality one in return. What's wrong with that?


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

That guy is talking out of his ***. Keeping Nate while not executing the trade would make PHX even more offensive-heavy and farther away from a championship. Even if they did intend to keep the pick, I would guess they wouldn't have taken Nate.


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## tempe85 (Jan 7, 2005)

RebelSun said:


> That guy is talking out of his ***. Keeping Nate while not executing the trade would make PHX even more offensive-heavy and farther away from a championship. Even if they did intend to keep the pick, I would guess they wouldn't have taken Nate.


Yeah no way we'd have got Nate. Possibly Petro because of this Hunter situation but not Nate.


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

tempe85 said:


> Yeah no way we'd have got Nate. Possibly Petro because of this Hunter situation but not Nate.


Nate would have been good I don't see why we couldn't have used him. Trade Barbosa and let Nate play. Q for Thomas. So it would be

Nash/Nate Robinson
JJ/Bell
Marion/Jackson
Amare/FA/Barbosa trade
KT/Hunter

with BO, Jake....SMUSH!!!


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Kekai23 said:


> Nate would have been good I don't see why we couldn't have used him. Trade Barbosa and let Nate play. Q for Thomas. So it would be
> 
> Nash/Nate Robinson
> JJ/Bell
> ...


Amare will be our C not Thomas. And I've said it many times. Screw Hunter. We can do a lot better with the money. If he didn't opt like a jack-*** than I wouldn't mind him.


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

dissonance19 said:


> Amare will be our C not Thomas. And I've said it many times. Screw Hunter. We can do a lot better with the money. If he didn't opt like a jack-*** than I wouldn't mind him.


LOL ok man, but you gotta say thats a pretty good lineup right?


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Kekai23 said:


> LOL ok man, but you gotta say thats a pretty good lineup right?


damn straight.


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## shazha (Nov 20, 2002)

Firstly, why am i hearing the word "trade"

Why trade Barbosa.

Why did we trade Q.

Just because we didnt make the finals this year doesnt mean we wont make it next year. One or two trades for mediocre big men or drafting a young point guard is not going to get us into the finals. Even if they are decent players who knows what the chemistry will be like with new people.

Q is young, he can only get better. So is the rest of our team. With time Q's consistancy would have come. I dont understand why we couldnt play another year and let Stoudamire get better. Everyone would thrive off Amare's play.

All we needed was another year together I think. Build on the chemistry and let the young guys get better. All they needed to do was draft a decent player and sign a cheap free agent to strengthen their bench.

Are we forgetting that we played without JJ for part of the Spurs series. With a healthy team and another year for your young guys to improve their skills and mesh, i think we would have had a good chace to make the finals.

The trades we made will not help us make the finals. Book it.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

shazha said:


> Firstly, why am i hearing the word "trade"
> 
> Why trade Barbosa.
> 
> ...


With the roster they have now, they can still run at the same tempo and probably score as much. I'm not sure if replacing Q w/ Jimmy will hurt their offensive production significantly. Jackson and Leo will fill in the minutes and really don't think Q will ultimately be missed that much. What they now have is a legit post presence that changes their attitude when he can come in the game, something this nucleus has not had.


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## Tiz (May 9, 2005)

shazha said:


> Firstly, why am i hearing the word "trade"
> 
> Why trade Barbosa.
> 
> ...


The moves that have been made will most definitely help out the team in the near and long term.

1. The addition of Thomas and Bell brings some defensive minded players that were desperately needed in the playoffs. Thomas' extra size will help Amare out alot under the boards. Bell's presence on the perimter will help out against guys like Ginobli and Barry.

2. Exchanging Thomas' contract for Q's will help free up some dollars for Amare and JJ who are the future of this squad.

3. Of the 6 guys who played the majority of the minutes in the playoffs 5 will be returning, so the movement of Q will not be that big of a disruption to the team chemistry.

4. While Q's 226 3pters were nice, he came up short in the post season. His looks will now go to JJ and Bell, both of whom shoot higher percentages. Thomas does not need to score alot all he needs to do is grab boards and create oppty's with his defense. As long as he can pull down 10-12 boards a night he will be fulfilling his role.

All of these things give us a much better chance against the Spurs or whomever we end up meeting in the Western Conference Finals next year.


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## Jammin (Jul 3, 2005)

Kind of regretting giving away Nate. He dropped 20 against the Blazers today in Summer League.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Jammin said:


> Kind of regretting giving away Nate. He dropped 20 against the Blazers today in Summer League.


Not sure if you read but he wasn't our pick. Isiah had us take him. So, not like we gave him away.


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## PhatDaddy3100 (Jun 16, 2002)

THink about this, Trading Q allows us to keep the guy many GMs would consider to be the number 1 FA this year if he wasnt a Restricted FA. That is how good JJ is. JJ is a great all-around player and can do a lot of things. So we trade Q, and keep a guy some consider to be better than Ray Allen and Michael Redd, wow our gm is stupid!


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

hey all..knick fan....just watched the second summer league game for the knicks.....

never saw Nate play before but looks like the second coming of AI...hes definetly a scoring point guard and unbelieveably athletic...

Now i know why Zeke wanted him so badly...


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

dissonance19 said:


> Not sure if you read but he wasn't our pick. Isiah had us take him. So, not like we gave him away.


Yeah. We wouldn't have picked him if we could have.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

Kekai23 said:


> Yeah. We wouldn't have picked him if we could have.


he would have fit in great with you guys.....though he is definetly a score first


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