# Toronto sun:Vince for Eddy???



## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

*Toronto Sun : Curry for Carter*

RUMOUR OF THE DAY 

There's a movement in Chicago to have Bulls centre Eddy Curry traded to Toronto for Carter. 

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Basketball/NBA/Toronto/2004/12/01/751261.html','311'


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

RUMOUR OF THE DAY  

There's a movement in Chicago to have Bulls centre Eddy Curry traded to Toronto for Carter. 

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Basketball/NBA/Toronto/2004/12/01/751261.html 

I'm not sure how it works but it might work:

Chicago trades: PF Othella Harrington (5.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SG Eric Piatkowski (6.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SF Andres Nocioni (10.0 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 1.8 apg in 25.4 minutes) 
C Eddy Curry (13.7 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 0.9 apg in 28.7 minutes) 
Chicago receives: SF Vince Carter (16.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 3.3 apg in 31.1 minutes) 
Roger Mason (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
PF Pape Sow (1.0 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 7.3 minutes) 
Change in team outlook: -17.5 ppg, -10.4 rpg, and -0.8 apg. 

Toronto trades: SF Vince Carter (16.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 3.3 apg in 31.1 minutes) 
Roger Mason (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
PF Pape Sow (1.0 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 7.3 minutes) 
Toronto receives: PF Othella Harrington (5.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SG Eric Piatkowski (6.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SF Andres Nocioni (10.0 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 1.8 apg in 25.4 minutes) 
C Eddy Curry (13.7 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 0.9 apg in 28.7 minutes) 
Change in team outlook: +17.5 ppg, +10.4 rpg, and +0.8 apg. 

TRADE ACCEPTED


after Dec 15th , or with Bonner instead...


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

better option:

Chicago trades: C Eddy Curry (13.7 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 0.9 apg in 28.7 minutes) 
PF Othella Harrington (5.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SG Eric Piatkowski (6.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SF Andres Nocioni (10.0 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 1.8 apg in 25.4 minutes) 
Frank Williams (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
Chicago receives: SF Vince Carter (16.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 3.3 apg in 31.1 minutes) 
Roger Mason (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
PF Matt Bonner (8.0 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 0.3 apg in 17.9 minutes) 
PF Pape Sow (1.0 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 7.3 minutes) 
Change in team outlook: -9.5 ppg, -6.6 rpg, and -0.5 apg. 

Toronto trades: SF Vince Carter (16.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 3.3 apg in 31.1 minutes) 
Roger Mason (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
PF Matt Bonner (8.0 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 0.3 apg in 17.9 minutes) 
PF Pape Sow (1.0 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 7.3 minutes) 
Toronto receives: C Eddy Curry (13.7 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 0.9 apg in 28.7 minutes) 
PF Othella Harrington (5.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SG Eric Piatkowski (6.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SF Andres Nocioni (10.0 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 1.8 apg in 25.4 minutes) 
Frank Williams (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
Change in team outlook: +9.5 ppg, +6.6 rpg, and +0.5 apg. 

TRADE ACCEPTED


Or better:

Chicago trades: C Eddy Curry (13.7 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 0.9 apg in 28.7 minutes) 
PF Othella Harrington (5.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SG Eric Piatkowski (6.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SF Andres Nocioni (10.0 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 1.8 apg in 25.4 minutes) 
Frank Williams (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
Chicago receives: SF Vince Carter (16.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 3.3 apg in 31.1 minutes) 
C Rafael Araujo (0.7 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 8.2 minutes) 
Roger Mason (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
PF Pape Sow (1.0 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 7.3 minutes) 
Change in team outlook: -16.8 ppg, -8.4 rpg, and -0.8 apg. 

Toronto trades: SF Vince Carter (16.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 3.3 apg in 31.1 minutes) 
C Rafael Araujo (0.7 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 8.2 minutes) 
Roger Mason (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
PF Pape Sow (1.0 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 7.3 minutes) 
Toronto receives: C Eddy Curry (13.7 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 0.9 apg in 28.7 minutes) 
PF Othella Harrington (5.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SG Eric Piatkowski (6.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
SF Andres Nocioni (10.0 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 1.8 apg in 25.4 minutes) 
Frank Williams (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
Change in team outlook: +16.8 ppg, +8.4 rpg, and +0.8 apg. 

TRADE ACCEPTED


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## 7thwatch (Jul 18, 2002)

If those are the two main facets of a trade (the rest being just salary cap filler) I say heck ya, do it. Carter is not a perfect player by any stretch of the imagination but he's a lot better than anyone we have right now.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

I'd litterallly give up the WHOLE team to get him...EXCEPT for LUOL DENG

G
G CARTER
F DENG
F
C

I'd build JUST like that for next year...


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>7thwatch</b>!
> If those are the two main facets of a trade (the rest being just salary cap filler) I say heck ya, do it. Carter is not a perfect player by any stretch of the imagination but he's a lot better than anyone we have right now.


I agree he Ain't perfect - he has injury history and he's signed for 4 more years , which will mean we'll carry his max contract for a long time - but when he plays , he's worth the money , and definately a 1st option for us.
If all we need to give is Eddy - hell yeah , Nocioni is the one I hate trading but in this case it might be worth it.

Risky - but I'd go for it.


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

I bet this "rumor" was from Sam Smith and/or the Daily Herald.



> - The Arlington Heights Daily Herald says the Bulls are being patient, but that one or both of Eddy Curry and Tyson Chandler could be on the move. Names like Denver's Nene, Memphis' Mike Miller and even Toronto's Vince Carter are mentioned as possibilities.


http://www.tsn.ca/nba/news_story.asp?ID=106524


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

...a movement???

Can the writer be any more vague?

I thought we lived in Chicago, not Kiev.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

I know the Bulls drafted Bonner and traded him to TOR... but I think he'd be a nice fit with us. Heck, I think he'd breakout if given enough minutes. He could start for us at the 4. Seriously. OH yeah, and Vince is okay too.

Gordon, VC, Deng can bring the scoring
Hinrich, TC, AD, Bonner will grind

I would do a trade of Curry and filler for VC. I guess I'm in the minority.


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## Ice Nine (Apr 3, 2004)

Anyone who'd trade Vince Carter for Eddy Curry shouldn't be permitted to operate a motor vehicle, let alone manage an NBA franchise. Can we trade Sam Smith to Toronto instead?


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

You guys can hate me all you want.. but I'd do the following in a NYM:

Curry/Othella/Pike/Frankie/Griffin
-for-
Vince/Bonner

WHY CHICAGO DOES IT: We stink, have nothing close to a franchise player much less All-Star, FA's aren't coming here, we might certainly lose Eddy for nothing, superdave says Bonner can hold down the 4 quite well 

WHY TORONTO DOES IT: Pending Eddy's salary increase it saves them cap money on Vince's deal (we give them 3 expiring and 1 extra year of Pike), MoPete can start and be a cheap effective replacement, VC is getting booed and ain't helping at the box office any more

As coach and GM for the day, I would start:
Gordon/VC/Deng/Bonner/Chandler
(bench) Duhon/Hinrich/Nocioni/AD

Thank you and good day :yes:


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## Ballishere (May 24, 2003)

I love the idea of the Vince Carter for Curry Trade from a Toronto stand point but I don't think that Toronto would give up Matt Bonner (he is being hailed as star in Toronto) without an another young prospect (eg: Ben Gordon or maybe Chris Duhon).


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> Curry/Othella/Pike/Frankie/Griffin
> -for-
> Vince/Bonner


Not including Eddy's contract extension, the deal saves TOR approximately 42M over the last 3 seasons of Vince's contract.

It would actually put TOR a little under the cap for this offseason, including Eddy's QO of 5.1M. If they can do something with Alvin Williams' cap number, it would be even better


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> You guys can hate me all you want.. but I'd do the following in a NYM:
> 
> Curry/Othella/Pike/Frankie/Griffin
> ...


Bonner has been doing surprisingly well - I'd do it to , no hating here , but I think we can keep Griff and take a minimum salary big man like Pape Sow to get 2 bigs back.

Bonners numbers - 1st in FG% and 13th in FG per 48 - high efficiency.With his Numbers I'm not sure the Raptors won't prefer to keep him and trade Arujau...

Edit : I just realised no Chapu in your deal - hell Ya , give Grif...


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

Can anyone tell me what's the deal with Vince recently? Has he lost his desire? His athleticism? Both?


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## SPIN DOCTOR (Oct 31, 2002)

3 words...

JUST DO IT!

Bulls fans need a reason to get excited again.


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

To me Vince is Jalen plus more Sportscenter attention. I'm not too enthused.


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## Odomiles (Mar 23, 2004)

I get to see a lot of Raptors games so I'll throw my opinion of Bonner out there.

The Raptors are not going to simply "throw in" Bonner for any deal. Especially when they'd be getting ripped in the first place. Bonner is signed at a ridiculously low price and is probably the best value for the money in the league. He shows up to play every night and actually plays smart out there; a rarity in today's NBA. He leads the league in FG%. Pretty amazing since the majority of his attempts are jumpshots fron the outside. He's going to be a great role player for many years to come so don't expect him to get traded any time soon. Besides, Toronto fans love the Red Rocket. He's not going anywhere.


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SPIN DOCTOR</b>!
> 3 words...
> 
> JUST DO IT!
> ...


last time we "just did it" we got rose.


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Odomiles</b>!
> I get to see a lot of Raptors games so I'll throw my opinion of Bonner out there.
> 
> The Raptors are not going to simply "throw in" Bonner for any deal. Especially when they'd be getting ripped in the first place. Bonner is signed at a ridiculously low price and is probably the best value for the money in the league. He shows up to play every night and actually plays smart out there; a rarity in today's NBA. He leads the league in FG%. Pretty amazing since the majority of his attempts are jumpshots fron the outside. He's going to be a great role player for many years to come so don't expect him to get traded any time soon. Besides, Toronto fans love the Red Rocket. He's not going anywhere.


I too have watched almost all raptors games. I doubt they would just throw in the man with a 100 nick names. this deal aint going down though.


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## SPIN DOCTOR (Oct 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>spongyfungy</b>!
> 
> 
> last time we "just did it" we got rose.


Yep, lets compare.

VC - All-star past 4 years (3X as starter)

JR - Still waiting for the call.

Jalen, Travis, for Artest, Brad, Mercer, fill

vs 

Vince, fill for Curry, scrubs, fill

OK, I just compared, and if that is the deal I would execute it quickly. More likely, Toronto is asking for Gordon or Deng instead of scrubs, which would make this a very tough call and likely kill the deal.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Odomiles</b>!
> I get to see a lot of Raptors games so I'll throw my opinion of Bonner out there.
> 
> The Raptors are not going to simply "throw in" Bonner for any deal. Especially when they'd be getting ripped in the first place. Bonner is signed at a ridiculously low price and is probably the best value for the money in the league. He shows up to play every night and actually plays smart out there; a rarity in today's NBA. He leads the league in FG%. Pretty amazing since the majority of his attempts are jumpshots fron the outside. He's going to be a great role player for many years to come so don't expect him to get traded any time soon. Besides, Toronto fans love the Red Rocket. He's not going anywhere.


We heard the same things about JYD from Raptors' fans at the time we got him.


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## Showtyme (Jun 24, 2002)

Carter's sick of losing. He wants to contribute, and be the star, while he's still near his prime, to a contender. They are on their way to be a long shot to a low seed or to miss the playoffs again.

Why hasn't Antonio Davis been included in these talks?

Lamond Murray + Vince Carter

for

Antonio Davis + Eddy Curry + Adrian Griffin

This should work. I suppose we could throw in Jared Reiner if our salaries come up short.

Davis wasn't hated in Toronto, they just needed a better player. Now they are getting Curry back, and to re-sign Curry and have a Bosh-Curry frontcourt... could be hot stuff. They know that Rose has an affection for Curry, too, and that Curry played his best basketball of his career when Rose was working it into him.

Alston/Rose/Peterson/Bosh/Curry

Marshall/Davis/Woods/Griffin/Araujo/Bonner/Palacio

It's not a brilliant lineup but it boasts a lot of frontcourt depth and should help them rock the East. They get a promising big man and move their complaining player. Rose, Marshall, Davis, and Griffin are a serious veteran core that Curry and Bosh grow in.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

Here's my view of VC.

Vince Carter, that is (I'm sure RLucas gets it).

He has the skills still. He can easily be the best player on the Bulls since Jordan retired. Maybe better than Pippen in a lot of ways. Probably one of the 5 best Bulls ever.

I saw him in the all-star game last year. He looked like the VC of old. Alley-oop dunks, flashy dunks, played with enthusiasm. The works. Worthy of being an all-star.

I saw a lot of Raptors games, too. VC looks like a guy with Jordan-like skills who also got hurt and who's not willing to risk another serious injury for the Raptors franchise.

So...

If we trade for him and he's enthusiastic about joining a team that would win 4 games out of 82 without him, then we score bigtime.

If we trade for him and he's going to mail it in like AD does, he'll still be our best player but won't carry us very far. Certainly to 20+ wins if we get him early enough.

It's a gamble. But a gamble either way. Keep Curry and bet on him becoming a consistent regular player, let alone a dominating C that he's shown in rare flashes. Or bet on VC, who's PROVEN to be able to score 25 PPG and fill out the whole box score.

Will Curry ever score 25PPG and fill out the box score like VC? Maybe. Will VC do it like he is capable? Maybe. If I were a betting man, I'd rather bet on VC than Curry.

Go figure.


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TripleDouble</b>!
> Can anyone tell me what's the deal with Vince recently? Has he lost his desire? His athleticism? Both?


No he's just playing in Toronto


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

And

Kirk
Vince
Loul
Bonner 
Tyson

With:
Chapu. Ben coming from the bench is great


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## unBULLievable (Dec 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!
> Here's my view of VC.
> 
> Vince Carter, that is (I'm sure RLucas gets it).
> ...


Quality POST Dabullz

Not to mention that VC will benefit from Hinrich and Deng also.

I think if a trade is to be made we should be looking for a third team a


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## SPIN DOCTOR (Oct 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!
> Here's my view of VC.
> 
> Vince Carter, that is (I'm sure RLucas gets it).
> ...


EXACTLY

And where is the next opportunity going to come from (to get a star) if we are offered Vince in an acceptable package and decline? Thats right, were the Bulls, every stud wants to play in Chicago on the big stage right?

I see the shareholders losing the fan base. They need to make a impact move, Vince is still only 27 folks, and his injuries have not been that serious. Not to bring up an old subject, but FA will consider Chicago much more serously if we had a real marqee name. Oh thats right, Pax thinks the League should be marketing teams and not players.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SPIN DOCTOR</b>!
> 
> 
> EXACTLY
> ...


Seems to me that Vince will be our FA and marquee name. Seems like that's how the CBA will make it work for us.

But what are the real alternatives?

It may well be that Pax learns the lesson that Krause learned:

If you can't sign an FA to big $$$, you trade for a similar player who's already signed to a big $$$ long-term contract.

IMO, where Krause failed, was to do it again.


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## Showtyme (Jun 24, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!
> Here's my view of VC.
> 
> Vince Carter, that is (I'm sure RLucas gets it).
> ...


Terrific.

MY view of VC is that it has ruined our financial markets, largely because of the irrationality that is associated with the bubble-bursting investments of the late 90's.



Vince Carter? Oh.

He's a damn good player and we'd be getting way more than Curry's worth to get him.

I wouldn't believe for a second, though, that other teams with overpaid players aren't looking to acquire Vince. We have less to offer than others.

Imagine Minnesota offering Latrell + Ebi for Vince + Araujo. Oh they definitely WOULD do it. Vince Carter and Kevin Garnett on the same team? Holy cow.

The Raptors get a young talent that's ready to explode. They would bank on Ebi ready to make somewhat of a Jermaine-like jump. They'd also get a pretty rugged vet in Latrell, someone that they might think about extending but is for the most part cap fodder. It puts them instantly under the cap for next season, SIGNIFICANTLY under the cap (assume the cap to be about $44 mil, Toronto would be about 7 mil under in committed salaries). $7 million to throw at someone is no small potatoes.

$7 mil could probably buy, say, Larry Hughes.

Alston/Hughes/Ebi/Bosh/Woods

Young, exciting, and with some serious talent.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

tired of losing and he comes to Chicago? 

I have been consistant with Carter. Nothing against him, but he is not the player he once was. I still remember last year and Wennington carrying on how Vince "settles" for jump shots and does not take it to the hole anymore. 

Would he help us? Yes, but so would a inspired Curry. I have been saying no to a Carter since bulls fans have been posting it this season. I still say no. 

Knowing my luck, we do the trade and he catches fire with a reknewed desire to compete again. Make me look bad. That would be ok. 

Nice Dabullz.


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## son of oakley (Dec 24, 2003)

Carter is invovled in a power play. He was made promises by management that the team would acquire talent, to get back it's winning ways. He asked to be given veto authority on GM or coach selection and then they didn't make moves he found worthy, and didn't solicit his opinions. He feels like a marginalized "superstar", so he's requested a trade, and now he's playing "half-man, half-effort".

The problem for the Bulls is whether they are on his short list of acceptable destinations. Sure he's worth more than Curry, but I don't think raptor management is out to disgrace him and dump him somewhere he doesn't want to go, (no offense, he may want to come to Chicago, I'm just addressing the problems IF he doesn't.), and Chicago isn't going to want a sulking prima donna. The task for Chicago then would be to convince VC that YOU have winning intentions, that the luxury tax is not a concern, that a plan for additional talent acquisition is in place, and that he will be afforded the respect that other "franchise players" of his calibre are afforded elsewhere.

Is that Paxon's style? We don't know, as he's yet to have a franchise player to see. But so far Pax/Skiles seems to be management first, then team, then players. Looks like a tough sell for them.


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## son of oakley (Dec 24, 2003)

One other thing, the best offers for VC will involve taking Rose along with him. Unless Bulls can involve a third team for a 3-way, I don't see that happening here.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Ticket to mediocrity and being stuck with an injury prone max player.

Well hopefully the Bulls would win just enought games after that to get the 4th pick.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>son of oakley</b>!
> One other thing, the best offers for VC will involve taking Rose along with him. Unless Bulls can involve a third team for a 3-way, I don't see that happening here.


That sure would be a LOT of salary to match.

And no, I don't think having Rose back would be good for either party.


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## Ice Nine (Apr 3, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Amareca</b>!
> Ticket to mediocrity and being stuck with an injury prone max player.
> 
> Well hopefully the Bulls would win just enought games after that to get the 4th pick.


You do realize that a "ticket to mediocrity" would be a 20 game improvement for the Bulls, right?


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## SPIN DOCTOR (Oct 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>son of oakley</b>!
> Carter is invovled in a power play. He was made promises by management that the team would acquire talent, to get back it's winning ways. He asked to be given veto authority on GM or coach selection and then they didn't make moves he found worthy, and didn't solicit his opinions. He feels like a marginalized "superstar", so he's requested a trade, and now he's playing "half-man, half-effort".
> 
> The problem for the Bulls is whether they are on his short list of acceptable destinations. Sure he's worth more than Curry, but I don't think raptor management is out to disgrace him and dump him somewhere he doesn't want to go, (no offense, he may want to come to Chicago, I'm just addressing the problems IF he doesn't.), and Chicago isn't going to want a sulking prima donna. The task for Chicago then would be to convince VC that YOU have winning intentions, that the luxury tax is not a concern, that a plan for additional talent acquisition is in place, and that he will be afforded the respect that other "franchise players" of his calibre are afforded elsewhere.
> ...


Oak, good to see you stop by.

I hear your concerns and agree to a point, but then I remember that Pax put on an all-out shoot the moon play for Kobe this year, one that Kobe said was "very very tempting". That also seems out of character for Pax to offer, so maybe there are really two sides to Pax. One set of guidelines for mere players and an exclusive set for superstars. That would not be too surprising considering John's experience on the Bulls, maybe in his mind, its the natural order of things.


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## mgolding (Jul 20, 2002)

This would go completely against the Paxson scheme of how to GM.


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

A trade for Carter would be evidence to me that Paxson is absolutely lost and in a panic about what the hell to do.

I mean, is there any single guy in the NBA right now who appears to less fit every word that's come out of Pax's mouth since he took over than Vince Carter?

Objectively speaking, I think DaBullz is right about it being a gamble that may or may not pay off (I think it wouldn't if I had to guess), but overall it's just a total non-starter of an idea, right up there with re-uniting Kidd and Skiles.


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## Jim Ian (Aug 6, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>mgolding</b>!
> This would go completely against the Paxson scheme of how to GM.


God if that's not a sign we should do it ASAP, I don't know what is....


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Amareca</b>!
> Ticket to mediocrity and being stuck with an injury prone max player.
> 
> Well hopefully the Bulls would win just enought games after that to get the 4th pick.


Considering he play 75+ last season and he's ok so far hes not having injuries problems


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> A trade for Carter would be evidence to me that Paxson is absolutely lost and in a panic about what the hell to do.
> 
> I mean, is there any single guy in the NBA right now who appears to less fit every word that's come out of Pax's mouth since he took over than Vince Carter?
> ...


After 1-10 start and no progress by Curry or Tyson sounds like time to made a deal and Vince can bring people to the united Center and be in a team with history can help tou get back to his game


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## son of oakley (Dec 24, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SPIN DOCTOR</b>!
> 
> 
> Oak, good to see you stop by.
> ...


Thanks Spin, nice to feel welcome here. You guys have the best forum of any team, on any board, bar none.

I would agree with that management philosophy to, conceptually anyway. However, you see Isiah court players as he does, and give a press conference to little guys, like Crawford and JYD, and before you know it, the little schmoozer (Isiah) has guys like Dampier, Carter, Curry, etc, bucking to play for him. And it's not just the NY market they seek, under Layden no one wanted to come here.

So sure, nobody likes to see players getting over paid, or given too much power or slack, but on the other hand, word gets around about management, and if a GM wants his team to be a magnet to quality players he needs to show support to the little guys too. 

Sure Pax shows love to guys like Kirk, but a lot of blame elsewhere, and what star wants to come to a losing team and then get blamed for keeping them down?

I think you guys have a dangerous situation overe there. A couple of years ago people believed in the 3 Cs and things were looking up, but now there's not a lot of belief going on. I think you need to stop waiting on those guys to be stars and get something more modest but solid for them. Guys like Sweetney, Nene, and Swift come to mind. Some solid pieces to build on, to build up the credibility again. Get something positive going. Forward momentum is essential to nabbing FAs.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Mike McGraw gets into the Carter talk! Maybe there is something to all of this talk after all. 

http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/col_rozner.asp?intid=38323187


*...The reason they're(Chandler, Curry) still here is Bulls GM John Paxson understands you can't teach size, and he's waiting as long as possible before he pulls the trigger, hoping they find their games in Chicago and he never has to deal them.

He says he will not wait forever.

But Paxson also says the Bulls will not contend until they have a dominant player other teams must double-team consistently, someone who scores during "meaningful" minutes down the stretch.

Could that player be Vince Carter?


That was the whisper making the rounds Wednesday at the house that Michael Jordan built, and if your first thought was, "Don't do it," join the club.

It's a huge longshot, because on the surface, Carter doesn't seem like a Paxson-Scott Skiles player, but the more you think about it, the less ridiculous it becomes.

Carter will be only 28 in January, and when he's not miserable, he can still play. But amid threats to his safety, coaching changes, injuries and simply wanting out, Carter doesn't find much peace in Toronto.

The talk is that leg injuries have robbed him of his ability to attack the basket and leap tall players in a single bound, but prior to a 5-point effort in Miami on Tuesday, Carter had averaged 23 points, 4.5 rebounds, 4.5 free-throw attempts and had shot 52 percent the past two weeks. And he did come back with 21 points Wednesday at Orlando.

So the first question is, could a rebirth occur in Chicago, which has so much to offer Carter?*


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

We have talked about this before. It seems that this team is being built for 2006 and some major FA then. But will we be successful in luring one or two here, that is the question. 

Now rumor has it Chicago is in the running for the services of Carter, via a trade. I am sure John did not count on that when he put this team together. However, he did try and lure Kobe here and he gave us serious consideration.(If you can believe the press) 

What should John do? Hold the course and let this young team develop or pull the trigger on a 28 Carter who may or may not find him all-star game again? 

I have said no. I still do. But there is always the risk of no FA coming here in 2006. On the flip side, a young and upcoming team compared to Jk's gutted team could be appealing.


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

First, watching every Raps game this year, Carter shows signs of his old self, and the times where he does not, it really looks like he is just not interested. So...If Carter is motivated, and he fits well in the system then he will be an all star player again. If Deng is as good as you say he is, then Carter playing with Deng would definetely work, as Carter wont have the pressure of driving to the basket on every play, because Deng is willing to do it. Not to mention, Deng could probably learn a lot from VC and that should be worth somthing to Pax

For the Raps, taking Curry alone i dont think they would do it, a deal would have to include Gordon, especially if they cannot gaurantee Curry resigning. 
So if the deal looks like
Curry, Gordon, Piat, and Harrington
for
Carter, Mosio or Aruajo, and Palacio(who has been playing great)
I would do it

Do you think there is any chance that there could be talks around whether the deal is Curry or Chandler? or is Chandler worth more then Curry?


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## crimsonice (Feb 27, 2003)

As a Raptors fan.. as well as a VC fan, I would love to see him in Chicago. There's a great history there, and a hungry Carter is very scary player. He's still one of the most explosive players in the league (even after the injuries), he plays huge in crunch time and he is a very underated shooter and defender. I'm looking for him to produce 25+/5/5 wherever he goes. (he averaged 23/5/5 last season for a very defensive minded coach)


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>pspot</b>!
> First, watching every Raps game this year, Carter shows signs of his old self, and the times where he does not, it really looks like he is just not interested. So...If Carter is motivated, and he fits well in the system then he will be an all star player again. If Deng is as good as you say he is, then Carter playing with Deng would definetely work, as Carter wont have the pressure of driving to the basket on every play, because Deng is willing to do it. Not to mention, Deng could probably learn a lot from VC and that should be worth somthing to Pax
> 
> For the Raps, taking Curry alone i dont think they would do it, a deal would have to include Gordon, especially if they cannot gaurantee Curry resigning.
> ...


You are right. Gordon would have to be included. I mean the Bulls won't get Carter for nothing. 

Who is worth more? Depends on what you are looking for. Curry can score and score in spurts. His rebounding has improved but he cannot play the entire game yet. Chandler can and Tyson gives you 100% energy. He can rebound and change shots. 

I just have a felling about getting Carter here that it will be a mistake. If he is truly disinterested that is one thing, but what if his injuries is also a factor?


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## bulls (Jan 1, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> We have talked about this before. It seems that this team is being built for 2006 and some major FA then. But will we be successful in luring one or two here, that is the question.
> 
> Now rumor has it Chicago is in the running for the services of Carter, via a trade. I am sure John did not count on that when he put this team together. However, he did try and lure Kobe here and he gave us serious consideration.(If you can believe the press)
> ...


well what you need to ask is this,who is most likly going to be a FA in 06 what will they most likly cost,and how much money will we have b4 or after a VC trade then go from there..

now going by hoopshype VC makes 12.6 this year then 13.8 and 15.2 the next 2 years after that.if we were going to be able to sign 1-2 high priced FA's in 06 along with resignin TC and EC this offseason then i beleave we will save money if we do a VC.

curry wanted the max and i beleave thats 11mill right? so lets say 10mil would have kept him here.

TC whould get close to about 60-75% of what curry would have made so that comes out to around 6-7.5mil.

add those together and you can see we would be payin them about $16-18 mil per so VC would save us $2.2-4.2 mil,and if we were able to sign both of them + go after 1-2 FA's in 06 then we should be able to do a VC trade + keep the 06 plan..

some will say this and that about VC but the man can flat out consistanly score and the same cant be said about TC and EC and what has everyone been *****in about? *consistency*


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

well the other thing that would throw up a red flag for me from the Bulls point, would be that Carter has always hated and really never performed consitently under pressure, and i cant imagine any more pressure then he will get playin in Chicago, and being constently compared to Jordan, which already was a theme early in his career. But if he embrasses that for some reason which he didnt in TO, he would be an awsome player

The Raps need a guy who will work hard and dominate under the net, so if what you said about Chandler is true, he would be the guy the Raps would want. Eventhough, Bosh and Curry would work well, with Bosh stretching out the interior defense, and then getting down low to Curry, but if its Currys rebounding vs Chandlers scoring, the Raps go with Chandler

so Chandler, Gordon, Piat, Harrington for
Carter, Mosio or Aurjo, and Palcio
is that a good deal for the Bulls? or do they need more, like Bonner or a pick


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## CrookedJ (May 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> 
> 
> You are right. Gordon would have to be included. I mean the Bulls won't get Carter for nothing.
> ...


Personally ( I have watched pretty much every game in his career) VC still has it. Right now he's just miserable in Toronto. He's playing for a coach that he demanded a trade because he was unhappy with his hiring. Theres bad blood despite their denials.

The nights he's on, he is dominant still, he's just not motivated. In the loss to Washington last week he was playing inside and was scoring the way he used to. Last night he got 21 with almost no effort. I think if he gets a change of scenary he'll be a star again.


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## sKiP~2~mY~BLUTH (Aug 11, 2004)

i dont want carter to be traded, but if hw will i want a Chandler & Curry...

Chandler, Curry and Gordon
for
Vince, Donyall, Woods and palacio

but im only dreaming, right? that wont happen...


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>sKiP~2~mY~BLUTH</b>!
> i dont want carter to be traded, but if hw will i want a Chandler & Curry...
> 
> Chandler, Curry and Gordon
> ...


Salaries don't match. We won't trade both chandler and curry. One or the other will be in a package. More than likely it will be Curry.


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

^ sorry, your dreaming 
thats like trading an injury prone, non interested, max player, a non gaurenteed contract, and two journy men for 3 first round picks

but hey maybe Paxon will go down in a ball of flame
go raps


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## sKiP~2~mY~BLUTH (Aug 11, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> 
> 
> Salaries don't match. We won't trade both chandler and curry. One or the other will be in a package. More than likely it will be Curry.


yea ok, i know, but thats what *I* want..:uhoh:


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Speaking about Curry, the same thing can be said about him. A change of scenery could do him wonders. He is home here and all the distractions that a young man can think of. In Toronto, he can focus on basketball for once. I think he has the ability to be a star. He needs to play an entire and complete game.


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

How would Curry react to Sam Mitchell's a.k.a Shaft style of in your face, nothin but the truth, work hard and you will be rewarded, dont work hard and you will sit style of coaching. Will Curry be like Mosio and end up getting defensive and start disapearing? not that you know Curry personally, but what do you think?


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

There isn't a ton of interest for VC right now.

The hottest rumor for a while was for SAR straight up. Kind of peculiar to add a 4 when you have Bosh there. Maybe just a salary dump then for Vince's last 3 years, since SAR is an expiring contract? I guess Minny might offer Wally but his contract is way baaaaddd. Ray Allen? No way. Perhaps Portland offers DA, Patterson, and some semblence of players.

I still think a Curry and cap relief package is the best offer going for Toronto, if they are intent on trading him.

Curry/Othella/Pike/Frankie/Griffin
-for-
Vince/Bonner

Pending Curry's extension, the Raps are relieved of almost 42M over the next 3 seasons. Curry can team up with Bosh.


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>pspot</b>!
> How would Curry react to Sam Mitchell's a.k.a Shaft style of in your face, nothin but the truth, work hard and you will be rewarded, dont work hard and you will sit style of coaching. Will Curry be like Mosio and end up getting defensive and start disapearing? not that you know Curry personally, but what do you think?


I think Sam Sistem can help Curry game pure offense...


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## MagillaGorilla (Jul 8, 2004)

I don't know if I'd be willing to trade Gordon right now. He looks like he could explode in another year or two from what I've seen this last week of games. He'd be a real risk. 

I'd rather lose Nocioni, even though I really like him.


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

Personally I would not trade Eddy and Ben for Vince...

but if we do send Ben then it'd have to mean we get more then the long contract of VC.

Like:

Chicago trades: PG Frank Williams (0.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 2.0 apg in 6.0 minutes) 
SG Eric Piatkowski (6.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
PF Othella Harrington (5.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
PG Ben Gordon (11.2 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 1.6 apg in 22.6 minutes) 
C Eddy Curry (14.1 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 0.8 apg in 29.0 minutes) 
Chicago receives: SF Vince Carter (16.4 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 3.3 apg in 30.8 minutes) 
C Rafael Araujo (1.3 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 0.3 apg in 7.9 minutes) 
Roger Mason (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
PF Matt Bonner (7.8 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 0.4 apg in 17.2 minutes)
1st rounder 
Change in team outlook: -11.4 ppg, -5.6 rpg, and -1.8 apg. 

Toronto trades: SF Vince Carter (16.4 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 3.3 apg in 30.8 minutes) 
C Rafael Araujo (1.3 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 0.3 apg in 7.9 minutes) 
Roger Mason (No games yet played in 2004/05) 
PF Matt Bonner (7.8 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 0.4 apg in 17.2 minutes)
1st rounder 
Toronto receives: PG Frank Williams (0.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 2.0 apg in 6.0 minutes) 
SG Eric Piatkowski (6.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 1.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
PF Othella Harrington (5.2 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 0.2 apg in 16.6 minutes) 
PG Ben Gordon (11.2 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 1.6 apg in 22.6 minutes) 
C Eddy Curry (14.1 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 0.8 apg in 29.0 minutes) 
Change in team outlook: +11.4 ppg, +5.6 rpg, and +1.8 apg. 

TRADE ACCEPTED

Bonner,Arujau and a pick , and I'm still not sure I'd send Ben too.


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

I dont think Tor could include a 1st, because they already have one out there owing to Cle i think.
but for discussion sakes, to add Bonner, Aurujo, and a 1st
Bulls would have to switch Piat with Noci, and i probably Chandler instead of Curry


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>pspot</b>!
> I dont think Tor could include a 1st, because they already have one out there owing to Cle i think.
> but for discussion sakes, to add Bonner, Aurujo, and a 1st
> Bulls would have to switch Piat with Noci, and i probably Chandler instead of Curry


I know the pick u sent is conditional - any idea wht turms??


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

I think it depends on where TO finishes
if its a lotto pick its protected
but i remember people were talking about whether that protection runs out after a few years, and they werent sure either. 
so im not to sure about that


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>pspot</b>!
> I think it depends on where TO finishes
> if its a lotto pick its protected
> but i remember people were talking about whether that protection runs out after a few years, and they werent sure either.
> so im not to sure about that


OK thanks , cause conditions rn't writen in nbadraft either.


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

Your link says its protected through 2008. so even with those conditions they would have to wait until later in the season to make sure they could or couldnt use a pick in a trade

man that was a bad trade


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## :TorontoRaptors: (May 25, 2003)

The TSN broadcast says Carter to Chicago for both Eddy Curry and Tyson Chandler. 

Deal to take place either Friday or the start of next week.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>:TorontoRaptors:</b>!
> The TSN broadcast says Carter to Chicago for both Eddy Curry and Tyson Chandler.
> 
> Deal to take place either Friday or the start of next week.


'

Anyone have print confirmation ??? !!!


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## T.Shock (Feb 11, 2003)

Wow that'd be the worst deal ever. We'd need Araujo to come with Carter and that makes it impossible salary wise. Trading both of these guys will come back to haunt us especially if its for Vince.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>:TorontoRaptors:</b>!
> The TSN broadcast says Carter to Chicago for both Eddy Curry and Tyson Chandler.
> 
> Deal to take place either Friday or the start of next week.


Hmm, why do they want both when they have Bosh?

This doesn't jive with what Paxson is saying in the other thread, but oh well.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> 
> 
> Hmm, why do they want both when they have Bosh?
> ...


bosh could play sf. i'm not saying the trade has gone down -- just that stranger things have taken place.


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## jollyoscars (Jul 5, 2003)

id definitely do a deal for vince if it was tc instead of eddy. i say HELL NO to trading eddy because he will definitely be a superstar in this league.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

Looks like we have a winner of the GB award. :TorontoRaptors: didn't even bother to post this information on his home board. . .:no: :no: :no:


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jollyoscars</b>!
> id definitely do a deal for vince if it was tc instead of eddy. i say HELL NO to trading eddy because he will definitely be a superstar in this league.


:| 

Eddy isn't even better than Tyson NOW. And frankly, I don't think he'll ever be.


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## Killuminati (Jul 30, 2002)

Trading a soft player for another softie? Hell I'd do it just because VC is a proven all-star.... something we haven't had in a long time. Every Rap game I've watched this year Vince looks miserable and desperately looks like he wants out. 

I'd rather keep Tyson though, I still have hopes that he could turn into a good player.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

I dont see us trading both Curry and chandler for Carter. Unless Skiles thinks Nocioni is a pf. AD Harrington and Nocioni is thin up ft. Reiner would get a lot more playing time.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

http://www.suntimes.com/output/banks/cst-spt-banx03.html

*The Bulls are willing to deal Eddy Curry and/or Tyson Chandler before the Feb. 24 deadline for the right offer, but Carter's contact has four years and almost $60 million remaining.

The Bulls want a star player and a go-to guy when the game's on the line, but Carter is averaging career lows in nearly every category, including scoring, although he recently has been on an upswing. There's a theory that a change of scenery will lead to a rebirth in Carter, but it's an expensive risk to take.

The Bulls would have to include other contracts with Curry and/or Chandler. The Raptors likely would want one of the Bulls' young guards. Kirk Hinrich is considered the closest thing to an untouchable on the Bulls, and Ben Gordon is beginning to round into form. Toronto reportedly also is interested in dumping Jalen Rose's huge contract in a package with Carter, and that would end any talks with the Bulls.*


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> I dont see us trading both Curry and chandler for Carter. Unless Skiles thinks Nocioni is a pf. AD Harrington and Nocioni is thin up ft. Reiner would get a lot more playing time.


I agree giving up both our Bigs is too much - unless we get Bonner/Arujau back.we'd be too thin - Chapu can play some 4 - he's a good rebounder and can draw a big defender out of the paint - but I can't see it as a longturm solution.anyway - he won't have a problem with the physical ability needed to gaurd 4's in the league in turms of strength and aggressivness - but Hight would be a problem...


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## lorgg (Dec 8, 2003)

Anyone know what the word on Carter's work ethic is?


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

Expensive risk? 

The Bulls have led the f'n NBA in f'n attendence for 6 seasons while having the <b>f'n worst 6 year W/L record in the history of the NBA</b>... and we're worried about adding salary?

Time to wake up. Elite FAs aren't coming here, no need to save for a rainy day because it ain't coming. To repeat, FAs aren't coming here. If you want one, you trade for one. I conjure re-signing Eddy would be a more 'expensive risk' than trading for Carter. JMHFO.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

http://www.nypost.com/sports/35584.htm



> Since the summer there have been all sorts of offers, counter-offers and rejections. Within the last week, the Raptors declined a straight-up deal involving Shareef Abdul-Rahim for Carter and two others consisting of a first round draft pick and either Damon Stoudamire or Nick Van Exel.
> 
> Again, the Raptors insist Rose be included. From what I'm told, the Blazers are seriously thinking about it, to the point of scouting Carter scrupulously against the Heat and the Magic. Sources say Babcock was asked a few days ago if he'd accept Derek Anderson's 3-year ($8.4M/$9M/$9.7M) pact along with Shareef ($14.6M) and Van Exel ($11.9M; next year's $12.8M isn't guaranteed) or Stoudamire ($12.5M) as part of the package.


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## spuriousjones (Apr 24, 2004)

*...latest trade rumours...[carter] to chicago for young big men tyson chandler and eddie curry. the contracts would fit with a couple throw-ins from the bulls...*
video link (rumour near end of clip)

if it doesn't work (may need to be registered/logged-in) go to http://tsn.ca/nba/ and scroll down to "raptors report".


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>spuriousjones</b>!
> *...latest trade rumours...[carter] to chicago for young big men tyson chandler and eddie curry. the contracts would fit with a couple throw-ins from the bulls...*
> video link (rumour near end of clip)
> 
> if it doesn't work (may need to be registered/logged-in) go to http://tsn.ca/nba/ and scroll down to "raptors report".


Do they make it sound like something imminent or just one of those totally unfounded rumors?


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> Time to wake up. Elite FAs aren't coming here, no need to save for a rainy day because it ain't coming. To repeat, FAs aren't coming here. If you want one, you trade for one. I conjure re-signing Eddy would be a more 'expensive risk' than trading for Carter. JMHFO.


Agree 100%. This is exactly the type of trade Paxson needs to look long and hard at. If we're going to get a "star" player...its going to be this kind of guy. A superstar, magic bullet, elite FA is not going to come traipsing through the door via FA.


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## spuriousjones (Apr 24, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> 
> 
> Do they make it sound like something imminent or just one of those totally unfounded rumors?


it doesn't sound imminent to me. give it a listen. it closes talking about carter regaining his oomph in the house that jordon built.

if a follow-up of something like gordon for nene can be done, imo, the bulls are in a better place. a thick bigman would definitely be helpful as moiso or woods is probably the best that could come from toronto.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>spuriousjones</b>!
> 
> 
> it doesn't sound imminent to me. give it a listen. it closes talking about carter regaining his oomph in the house that jordon built.
> ...


I'd give it a listen if I had a soundcard on my work computer lol!


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

Wow - TC and EC , we'd be so thin (through thick ) up front.

This works:

EC,TC and Pike 

for

VC and Pape sow


Our bigs would be Othella,AD,Sow,Reiner and maybe some Chapu at 4...

I sure hope that if both bigs leave we'd get one of Arujau/Bonner , otherwise wer'e small.


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

Man, giving up both of those guys would make it very tough on our frontcourt. I have a hard time seeing how that move would work


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## spuriousjones (Apr 24, 2004)

sow has promise but he's really raw. think very young/inexperienced jyd

toronto's bigs: bosh, marshall, woods, araujo, bonner, sow, moiso

i would not look to toronto to replace lost depth in the middle

you wouldn't guess it from PT but toronto's best centre is jerome moiso. coach mitchell is on him for not practising hard enough ergo no game pt. moiso's response is that things look so easy to him that it appears he's not trying when he is


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

I fail to see why we would ever consider adding <i>both</i> Chandler and Curry to a deal. Its not like teams are breaking down the doors in TOR with great offers to get Vince.

Curry and some cap relief is the best offer out there IMO. That is, unless Portland steps up and is willing to take on Jalen Rose's salary too.


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## InPaxWeTrust (Sep 16, 2002)

Wow Curry and Chandler for Carter& Sow! That surprises me since they have Bosh. But if this happened we would then see Gordon,filler(Frank?) for Wilcox,Rebraca IMO. Not saying I endorse this but I would be willing to be that would be what would happen.

Hinrich,Duhon,Pargo
Carter,Griffin
Deng,Nocioni,Smith
Wilcox,Harrington,Sow
Rebraca,Davis,Reiner


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## bulls (Jan 1, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> I fail to see why we would ever consider adding <i>both</i> Chandler and Curry to a deal. Its not like teams are breaking down the doors in TOR with great offers to get Vince.
> 
> Curry and some cap relief is the best offer out there IMO. That is, unless Portland steps up and is willing to take on Jalen Rose's salary too.


no matter what any of you say VC is a star and in most ppls minds a top 5-10 player look at the alstar votein for a good ex of this..we'd be lucky to be able to give TC and EC for VC but if we could save one of them then that just makes the deal that much better..

also you need to remeber carter him self even has said he's not givein tor everything he has,soo ill put money on if we give him this team he will start givin us close to what Tmac gave orl last year about 30ppg 5-6rpg and 2-3 ast.. he's gettin 16 4 2 in 30mins of not givin his all and not being the #1 guy so he could easly jump to 25-30ppg in 32+ mins of havin all the stots he wants.

on top of all of this do you know just how much pressure this would take off BG?VC could be the MJ and BG could be the M Finley.


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## SecretAgentGuy (Jul 15, 2003)

TC and EC for VC? eh..... I'm really on the fence. I'm pretty sure Vince could probably come in and average about 25+ for us but we're gonna have to rely on AD on Harrington for some very heavy minutes. Say good bye to Pargo and hello Baxter or Austin. Maybe we can make a serious run at Stromile this summer?

What the heck, this is the best chance we would ever have of acquiring a star. Not like anyone is offering up Kobe or TMac right now.


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## bulls (Jan 1, 2004)

also i was looking at their roster and i see about 3-4 good big men that we could get in return if a trade happend. in order i think they are..so its not let we would be stuck useing G"s at C or anything..

Loren Woods
Jerome Moiso 
Matt Bonner
Pape Sow
Rafael Araujo


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>bulls</b>!
> also i was looking at their roster and i see about 3-4 good big men that we could get in return if a trade happend. in order i think they are..so its not let we would be stuck useing G"s at C or anything..
> 
> Loren Woods
> ...


Personally I would love to get Woods, Bonner and VC. That being said...it ain't likely.


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## spuriousjones (Apr 24, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Basghetti80</b>!
> Wow Curry and Chandler for Carter& Sow! That surprises me since they have Bosh. But if this happened we would then see Gordon,filler(Frank?) for Wilcox,Rebraca IMO. Not saying I endorse this but I would be willing to be that would be what would happen.
> 
> Hinrich,Duhon,Pargo
> ...


that's a great follow-up trade. not the lineup i'd use, but really helps balance the team.

it'd be easier to get nene


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>:TorontoRaptors:</b>!
> The TSN broadcast says Carter to Chicago for both Eddy Curry and Tyson Chandler.
> 
> Deal to take place either Friday or the start of next week.


Thats Wrong is Tyson or Curry just one and filler for Carter


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

Hey Guys now with Skip mad with Sam Mitchell Would you trade something like

Curry
Ben Gordon
Expiring contracts
1st Round Pick

for

Vince
Rafer Alston


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

^ the only problem with that
is that Alston hasnt come out and said it, but everyone is understanding that what he has been saying, and whats made him so frustrated was about Vince.
so to be traded with Vince probably wouldnt work


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

He will play in the NBA he may not ask for a trade But he will play in the NBA for yrs to come


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