# Help me out Clips fans!



## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

Full disclosure, I'm a big Celtics fan who's suddenly very intrigued by the young core of Griffin, Gordon, and Thornton (apparently Clips fans love Deandre Jordan also, I'll have to check him out). If the Clips stay away from Iverson and focus on playing and developing the young players, I intend to watch them pretty intently this coming season to see how they develop together. If watching the Clips means Baron and Iverson taking turns going one-on-one, however, then I'm going to actively avoid them. (and before anyone even asks, no, I'm not Bill Simmons)

Assuming that Iverson stays away from the team, what can you guys tell me about the players on the team, most notably Thornton, Gordon, and Jordan? I'd like to know what to expect from these players and what to look for. Who's a slacker, who plays defense, things like that. I'm still a C's fan first and foremost, but if Dunleavy wasn't running things I'd say the Clips have a very bright future.


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## bootstrenf (May 24, 2006)

*thornton*: he will be a third year player this season, but he is very old....if i recall correctly, he turned 25 during the middle of his rookie season......very athletic, can jump out of the gym.....no significant injuries so far......takes way too many stupid shots......loves the turn around fadeaway midrange jumper.....i hate it......always gets beat on defense.....no lateral quickness......one of the dumbest players on the clippers roster......one of my least favorite players on the clippers.....he is a streaky player and can get hot in a hurry, he can score in bunches......but his bad days far outnumber his good days.....absolutely does not play defense......let me correct myself, he plays defense, but not at the level needed from a starter in this league......with all the high scoring talented swingmen in this league, thornton is not going to cut it......would best be suited to come off the bench as the 6th man.......an offensive spark off the bench......he is not good for much else......



*gordon*: probably the best draft pick in clippers history.....well, that's not including their buffalo days......i mean their LA history.....


and undersized SG.....needs to work on his ball handling and passing if he wants to log minutes at the point.....people might call him a combo guard, but that's only because he is the same height as most of the combo guards in this league......lacks true PG skills.....undersized is the wrong term, underheight would be more accurate......at 6'4" 222lbs, he is built like a tank......he makes up for his lack of height with his brute strength......a very good defender on the ball.....he needs to work on his off ball defense, but then again, he is a young player, and that will come in time.....can get into the lane at will and also has unlimited range on his jumper.....can get almost any shot he wants on the court.....is now working on his post up game.......is very suited to the post up game because of his build......with his power, he can back in on any other SG in this league......so strong that dunleavy once told him to *stop* working out.....lol....is not on the level of josh smith in terms of pure athelticism, but very few are, if any......but he is still in the upper tier......derrick rose has a max vert of 40", so does eric gordon.....derrick rose has a no step vert of 34", eric gordon 32"........so gordon is in fact one of the most athletic 2 men in the league....also has one of the purest strokes in the league when it comes to 3 pointers.....there isn't much that gordon can't do on a basketball court.....is a very efficient scorer....

is a great free throw shooter and will only get better.....in his rookie year, he was hacked so many times and refs would just swallow their whistles.....got the typical rookie treatment, and it was compounded by the fact that he is on the clippers......the refs never give calls in favor of rookies, and even less so if that rookie happens to be a clipper......would only get to the foul line if he was absolutely mugged, and the refs had no other choice than to blow the whistle.....

once he gets more respect from the refs, and they actually call games impartially, he should be one of the leaders in the league in terms of free throws made.....

besides his defensive limitations due to lack of height, and general inexperience, there are no real negatives about his game.....any negatives there are can be considered temporary because they can all be remedied through more experience and practice......



*jordan*: so much potential in this kid.....not a true seven footer, but his length and athleticism makes up for it.....has a wingspan of 7'6" and a 30" max vert......is already a good rebounder, but could be great......already a decent defender, but could be great......offense is his weakness.....has no real go to moves to speak of.....shot around 63% last year.....not because he was such a good shooter, it was because all his points came off of dunks, alley oops, put backs, etc...has a lot to learn on both sides of the ball, offense and defense......on defense, he still doesn't know when to switch on pick and rolls, when to trap, when to stay home, when to help, etc......good thing about this, is that all of these negatives can be remedied by more experience and learning.....he has all the natural abilities to be great......on offense, he is very mechanical......nothing smooth about his game.....once he gets a midrange jumper, and a soft touch around the basket, he will be good enough to be a starter on most teams in the nba.....he was projected to be a lottery pick during his final year in college, but character issues arose and he slipped to the clippers in the second round......it was one of the biggest steals of the draft....all the character issues people were worried about seem to be a non issue, now that he is in the league........i really have high hopes for this kid......



hope that helps.....



i see the future core of the clippers to be gordon, griffin and jordan......and also possibly whoever we pick with minnesota's unprotected first rounder in 2011.....but i don't think thornton should be included in this group......he better improve drastically this year if he wants to be part of the clipper's longterm plans....right now, he is just not a very good basketball player.....


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## LA68 (Apr 3, 2004)

Dunleavy doesn't play young players unless he has to. So you will rarely see this group on the court together unfortunately. 

And by the time they show what they can do, they will be playing somewhere else.

And don't forget Mike Taylor !


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

Interesting, I'm very surprised that you're _that_ down on Thornton. I've heard that he doesn't have the best shot selection, but his percentage was almost the same as Gordon's, and much, much higher than Baron Davis'. Additionally, he actually turned 25 this past season, so he's not as old as you believed. He put up pretty good stats last year, I'd want to keep him around if I was a Clips fan. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't build a team around him, but I think that he could be a pretty good third option to go with Griffin and Gordon.


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## matador1238 (May 3, 2006)

Stats dont mean everything, unfortunately. I wouldnt put Thornton in when the game is on the line. He is not very smart with the basketball.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

Fair enough, but keep in mind it's only his second year in the league. I'm not saying that he's going to be a great closer or anything, but I just can't see being that down on an obviously talented player who hasn't hit his prime yet.


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## matador1238 (May 3, 2006)

I think Thornton needs to concentrate his game on defense and take good shots. He can be a very good defensive stopper.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

If you've been a regular Clips fan then you probably know better than I do, but I was thinking something similar. I'm not under the impression that he's going to be a franchise guy, but he's a decent player that the Clips could potentially hold onto. Gordon and Griffin are you're cornerstone guys and Baron's a talented player that's not going anywhere, but Thornton has the ability to be a highly capable 3rd/4th option on offense while playing pretty good wing defense on the other end. 

The team should look into moving Camby for some depth/someone who'll actually stick around.


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## joser (Nov 29, 2005)

Bogg, I believe Thornton led the nba in the most (-) in the +/- category. Thornton is one of the most ineffecient bball player. I do hope that he will improve on his game because he has alot of potential based on his athleticism.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

The Clippers were also tied for the worst point differential in the league, so I can't imagine that anyone who played a significant number of minutes for them last year had a great +/-. I'm not claiming to be an expert, but I honestly can't imagine that the team would be better off without a young guy who put up good numbers. I'm really looking forward to watching some Clips games now just to get a bead on Thornton.


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## bootstrenf (May 24, 2006)

matador1238 said:


> I think Thornton needs to concentrate his game on defense and take good shots. He can be a very good defensive stopper.


i agree, he has the base tools to be a good defender, the light just hasn't clicked on yet in his head on what he needs to do....


he gives full effort on the defensive side of the ball, he's just not that good.....with his athleticism and length, he could be a josh smith/andrei kirilenko type help defender at least, but he just sucks.....


he settles for the midrange jumper way too often...he should really work on his ball handling skills so that he could take full adavantage of his athleticism......he is a good finisher when he gets to the rim, it's just that he doesn't get to the rim with regularity because of his poor handles.....


some good handles would open up a lot more options for him on the offensive end, and it would allow him to get higher percentage shots...it would really facilitate his strengths as an athletic finsiher around the rim.....in college, he actually jumped over a pretty tall dude to dunk the ball.....


check out *1:49-1:53*


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## Showtime87 (Jun 27, 2005)

In all fairness to Al, we must keep in mind that he played the most minutes per game of anyone on the team *(37.4 mpg)* and that a bulk of those minutes came while on the court with second unit players, who were forced into action due to the myriad injuries the team suffered. Thornton wasn't always consistent, but at season's end had posted some pretty respectable per/game numbers for a SF. *(16.8 pts, 5.2 reb, .446 FG%)* while also tallying nearly 1 block and 1 steal per outing. Now, his shot selection certainly could use some improvement, along with his often awkward-looking jumper, as could his overall rebounding and assist numbers. But, all things considered, I think AT had a better-than-average sophomore campaign for a team that was riddled with injuries and apathetic play from start to finish. Almost all of his numbers across the board were improvements over his rookie year on a per-48 basis, with the exception of rebounding, 3-pts made and assists. 

Obviously he's never going to be a franchise player, but you can count on him to provide consistent, productive minutes and show up with a willingness to learn and unselfish attitude. I'm anxious to see how he adapts to more of a clean-up/sixth man role this season and how much he'll benefit from having an entire cast of healthy teammates surrounding him. My only concern is that he'll likely be forced to use his perimeter game a bit more, so hopefully he's tightened up his jump shot in the offseason.

As for the OP's original statement about Iverson joining the team, I couldn't agree more. You aren't the only one scratching their heads and wondering why Donald Sterling is apparently determined to ruin what appears to be a good thing by inviting the NBA's version of TO into the fold. There's no way this is a Dunleavy idea, even he knows enough not want anything to do with AI at this point in his career. All I can say to you Bogg is this: be glad that the Celtics are your team, being a Clippers fan is not good for your mental health.


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## BobbyDigital32 (Mar 16, 2003)

I like Al Thornton being a spark off the bench. Start Novak. If they're running & gunning we wont have to worry about Stevie's piss poor defense.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

bump bump bumpbump. Do I get to act like a Clips fan(secondary to the C's of course) without having the bandwagon tag now, after taking an interest in 2009 and staying a little active on this board? I need an opinion from a Clips fan.


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