# Martell Webster has tattoo of Jesus



## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

The more I hear about this kid, the more I like him. Not only is he a great athlete with tremendous potential, he's a devoted Christian. There's a good story at O-Live about Websters' tragic childhood and his religious faith. Here's a quote about Webster pleading with his 80-year-old grandmother Ms. Walker (who raised him) to get another tattoo:



> Walker balked, but Webster pleaded that he wanted a picture of Jesus on his other shoulder.
> 
> "He told me, 'With Jesus on one side, and your eyes on the other, there is no way the devil could touch me.' " said Walker, who helped pick out the picture of Jesus to be drawn.


http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/sports/1119607615304840.xml&coll=7


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## B_&_B (Feb 19, 2004)

Thanks for the link... but curse you for making me click on a link to the Oregonian. 

GREAT ARTICLE... even if it is by Quick. I now want Webster more than before. Not because he's a religous guy (I only worship the NFL church on Sunday's), but he seems like he's got a VERY good head on his shoulders and is grounded. I'll bet he REALLY wants us to pick him, so he'd be close to his family. 

Funny how I was all hyped on Green a few weeks ago, now its Webster. :clown:


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## Trader Ed (Jun 17, 2002)

Very impressive article

I think its more possible that a #3 for #5 can be done, and we can get a bonus some how. Martel should be there at 5 if that is who they want. He sounds very sound


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## crandc (Sep 15, 2004)

STUPID STUPID COMPUTER

I hope it did not accidentally post in mid sentence. Yes I am at work and the idiot laptop they gave me jumps all over the place. 
After venting I will try again...

I had to enter a fake zip code, DOB and the wrong sex to read the article. I would not ever say that professing Christianity or any other faith automatically makes someone a better person (think of the Mississippi ordained minister finally convicted, 40 years late, for a triple murder). But this young man does seem to have his head on straight. 
And no way was Paul Allen being there an accident. No way. 
Damn. This draft is getting really really interesting and it's only the beginning since they may trade their pick! I am SO glad no lockout!


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## B_&_B (Feb 19, 2004)

more on Webster:

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1018



> What’s up with Webster?
> 
> Martell Webster pulled out of his second workout in a row yesterday, this time with the Orlando Magic. As in his previous workout which he had to pull out of in Toronto, Webster still met with the coaching staff and did everything besides actually showing what he has to offer on the court. The official reason for pulling out was a sprained ankle, the same ankle that he had surgery on as a junior last year. He hurt it in Charlotte back on the 14th and it is still bothering him right now apparently. Webster is another player who is extremely tough to peg down in this draft. Many previously thought that he may have a promise at #11 in Orlando, but the fact that he is still traveling around the country to meet up with teams (especially Orlando) make you wonder about that. If a couple of trades go down on draft night and someone in his new area doesn’t have a great handle on his game, is he going to regret not playing through a sprain for ten crucial days right before the draft? This is especially considering that he didn’t do any workouts before Chicago. We’ll have to wait and see. It’s still quite possible that he did get a promise and just did a short round of workouts to throw teams off the scent. Orlando previously (and still might) looked good, but they are now talking about making a trade. Antoine Wright could be there at their pick. The Clippers appear to be committed to Korolev if Antoine Wright isn’t on the board. The Bobcats could be a great spot to pick him up, but both of their picks are in play as well, while certain scenarios could see them picking up Gerald Green with the #5 pick, which would make Webster redundant at #13. The good news is, all of our questions will be answered in just four short days.


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

> I would not ever say that professing Christianity or any other faith automatically makes someone a better person (think of the Mississippi ordained minister finally convicted, 40 years late, for a triple murder).


For every Mississippi minister who commits a triple murder, I can show you 100 guys who have changed their lives for the better after becoming Christians. Citing an exception to the rule does not disprove the rule. 

Have you noticed the guys in the NBA in recent years who have "professed" to be Christians? They're a pretty impressive bunch. David Robinson, Avery Johnson, Sean Elliott, A.C. Green, Alan Houston, Mark Jackson, Dion Glover, Ervin Johnson, Sean Bradley, Derek Fisher, Hubert Davis, Jake Voshkul, Lawrence Funderburke, etc. Not a one of them has a criminal record, and they all represent themselves and their team with honor and distinction.


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## CelticPagan (Aug 23, 2004)

Great! Another bibleman, just like our friend DEREK ANDERSON. Seriously, why does him having a picture of Jesus mean anymore than Damon's pic of his grandma, or Rasheed's tatto of the Egyptians.


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## Reep (Jun 4, 2003)

CelticPagan said:


> Great! Another bibleman, just like our friend DEREK ANDERSON. Seriously, why does him having a picture of Jesus mean anymore than Damon's pic of his grandma, or Rasheed's tatto of the Egyptians.


After all the trouble that Damon and Rasheed got into I can't even believe you are asking that question. Maybe you should have picked other examples.


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

He seems like a great young man , It always nice to see people talk about being a Christian its a beautiful thing .


I would rather pick Gearld Green I just think he has more upside , but Martell will be a player as well


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## dkap (May 13, 2003)

It wasn't too long ago we were praising DA for similar qualities, now most of us want to run him out of town. I'm going with Ed O's usual stance on this one ... just focus on what the player can do on the court.

Dan


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

> Just focus on what the player can do on the court


I guess you missed the memo. The Blazers are looking for players who are good citizens on and OFF the court. It's actually part of their new corporate philosophy, and something they take very seriously.


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## BBert (Dec 30, 2004)

Reep said:


> After all the trouble that Damon and Rasheed got into I can't even believe you are asking that question. Maybe you should have picked other examples.


I think you just made CelticPagan's point.


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## Reep (Jun 4, 2003)

Blazer Bert said:


> I think you just made CelticPagan's point.


That, or you missed mine.


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## Stepping Razor (Apr 24, 2004)

Talkhard said:


> For every Mississippi minister who commits a triple murder, I can show you 100 guys who have changed their lives for the better after becoming Christians. Citing an exception to the rule does not disprove the rule.
> 
> Have you noticed the guys in the NBA in recent years who have "professed" to be Christians? They're a pretty impressive bunch. David Robinson, Avery Johnson, Sean Elliott, A.C. Green, Alan Houston, Mark Jackson, Dion Glover, Ervin Johnson, Sean Bradley, Derek Fisher, Hubert Davis, Jake Voshkul, Lawrence Funderburke, etc. Not a one of them has a criminal record, and they all represent themselves and their team with honor and distinction.


There are good Christians and bad Christians, just like there are good people and bad people among any subset of the human population.

As Talkhard says, it's absolutely true that many people have changed their lives for the better through being saved by Christianity. Others have found that improvement in Islam, Buddhism, or Rastafari, or secular ideologies like Marxism, small-r republican citizenship, or whatever... Others were good people all along and don't need to turn to any one universal ideology to make them live their lives right.

It seems to me that the true measure of a person's goodness is something that just is, that doesn't need to be advertised. Thus I find Derek Anderson's sanctimonious, self-promotional style of Christianity, when juxtaposed against his constant whining, backbiting, and lack of heart, to be really off-putting.

Were Terry Porter, Clyde Drexler, and Buck Williams Christians? I suspect so, but I honestly have no idea. That's because they were people of real character, and they didn't need Jesus tattoos for us to know that.

Martell Webster? The tat makes me slightly nervous, but he genuinely does sound like a great kid. He and Travis and Bassy would make a fantastic young nucleus -- measured in on-court talent *and* off-court character -- for the future of the team. I'll be sad if he's not on our team at the end of draft day.

Stepping Razor


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

I don't remember who suggested it, but if you don't want to give all the info about yourself (even faked) just click the "outside of US" option.


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## BBert (Dec 30, 2004)

Reep said:


> That, or you missed mine.


I didn't mean to imply that you missed his point, or even whether you agreed or disagreed with it, only that highlighting the problems of Mini Mouse and Devil Sheed reinforced to me what I interpreted his point to be (although I could be wrong about that :biggrin: ).

On another note, Nash has given the impression that he is really enamoured with Webster. It seems there is a reasonable probability the Blazers will try to get him over Green. Webster may be a great, compassionate, selfless guy. That would be a major bonus for our team, no doubt. Or he could be a turd. I've known plenty of "christians" who were turds, and others who practiced what they preach. I've known plenty of non worshippers who were kind and honest and others who were turds. I fail to see the correlation one way or the other. 

Anyway, that's the last thing I'm interested in debating, so I'm done with that. It's beginning to sound like Webster is a great prospect with a good attitude. If his religion helps him "stay on the path," that's a good thing.


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## Foulzilla (Jan 11, 2005)

I still want Green. However, I will admit to not being particularly dissapointed if we end up with Webster + another first round pick instead.


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## dkap (May 13, 2003)

> I guess you missed the memo. The Blazers are looking for players who are good citizens on and OFF the court. It's actually part of their new corporate philosophy, and something they take very seriously.


Yeah, just as seriously as climbing to the top of the lottery. Like I said, I'm siding with Ed O's stance on this one, because there's not much evidence that management's path is leading us the right direction. The Spurs are obviously the role model, but that system works because they have Duncan to build around and seemingly great international scouting. Character isn't the starting point, it's something demanded within the team framework. Stephen Jackson and Rod Strickland and even Glenn Robinson have been good citizens there, which should tell you something.

Dan


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## crandc (Sep 15, 2004)

Hey, Razor, you spared me the trouble 



> It seems to me that the true measure of a person's goodness is something that just is, that doesn't need to be advertised. Thus I find Derek Anderson's sanctimonious, self-promotional style of Christianity, when juxtaposed against his constant whining, backbiting, and lack of heart, to be really off-putting.
> 
> Were Terry Porter, Clyde Drexler, and Buck Williams Christians? I suspect so, but I honestly have no idea. That's because they were people of real character, and they didn't need Jesus tattoos for us to know that.
> 
> Martell Webster? The tat makes me slightly nervous, but he genuinely does sound like a great kid. He and Travis and Bassy would make a fantastic young nucleus -- measured in on-court talent *and* off-court character -- for the future of the team.


 :clap: 

IMHO, a decent person is a decent person regardless of religious preference of lack thereof. A bigoted, hate-filled vicious person is a bigoted hate-filled vicious person also regardless. Unfortunately, sometimes bigoted hate-filled vicious people who can only do limited harm alone get together and decide that "god" is behind them. So all the evil they do is really righteous because it is for "god". And we get the Inquisition. The Holocaust. September 11. The Army of God. The Westboro Baptist Church. Yep, I'm wandering. 
As for a list of good people in the NBA, well, I find Houston to be an intolerable bigot. And Funderburke said he was not worried about how he played because the world was going to end anyway. How about Hakeem Olajuwon? Did Hank Greenberg show less character than John Rocker? Is Pat Tillman less heroic because he was a professed atheist? Doesn't it have a LOT more to do with the quality of one's character, as Martin Luther King said, than religion?

If Webster is what the Blazers need as a player, if he has talent, if he's willing to work hard, understands success takes time, listens to his coaches, stays out of serious trouble, then he's got all the character I need and his personal views are just that. His business. They neither increase nor decrease his value.


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## sa1177 (Feb 18, 2005)

> Have you noticed the guys in the NBA in recent years who have "professed" to be Christians? They're a pretty impressive bunch. David Robinson, Avery Johnson, Sean Elliott, A.C. Green, Alan Houston, Mark Jackson, Dion Glover, Ervin Johnson, Sean Bradley, Derek Fisher, Hubert Davis, Jake Voshkul, Lawrence Funderburke, etc. Not a one of them has a criminal record, and they all represent themselves and their team with honor and distinction.



cute list....but not accurate. For instance Sean Bradley has been a Mormon all his life. Remember he was plucked off his Mormon mission in Australia to come to the NBA. 

Do your homework before you post rubbish!


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

sa1177 said:


> cute list....but not accurate. For instance Sean Bradley has been a Mormon all his life. Remember he was plucked off his Mormon mission in Australia to come to the NBA.
> 
> Do your homework before you post rubbish!



isn't mormonism just an off shoot of christiananittnananianity like lutherans, episocoopopsicles, and methodists? They just believe some, um..._different_ aspects of stuff?


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

> IMHO, a decent person is a decent person regardless of religious preference of lack thereof. A bigoted, hate-filled vicious person is a bigoted hate-filled vicious person also regardless. Unfortunately, sometimes bigoted hate-filled vicious people who can only do limited harm alone get together and decide that "god" is behind them. So all the evil they do is really righteous because it is for "god". And we get the Inquisition. The Holocaust. September 11. The Army of God. The Westboro Baptist Church. Yep, I'm wandering.
> As for a list of good people in the NBA, well, I find Houston to be an intolerable bigot. And Funderburke said he was not worried about how he played because the world was going to end anyway. How about Hakeem Olajuwon? Did Hank Greenberg show less character than John Rocker? Is Pat Tillman less heroic because he was a professed atheist? Doesn't it have a LOT more to do with the quality of one's character, as Martin Luther King said, than religion?
> 
> If Webster is what the Blazers need as a player, if he has talent, if he's willing to work hard, understands success takes time, listens to his coaches, stays out of serious trouble, then he's got all the character I need and his personal views are just that. His business. They neither increase nor decrease his value.


I appreciate what you're saying, and I even agree. But my point is that a player who professes to be a Christian and gets a tattoo of Jesus is probably a guy who is going to work hard, keep his nose clean, and represent the Blazers with class and dignity--and that's the kind of guy we want. End of story.


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## Trader Ed (Jun 17, 2002)

Alright... lets be careful here and get back to the discussion of Martel Webster the player

if this continue to evolve to a religous discussion we are going to have to close the thread. There are other places/areas to discuss this.


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## mediocre man (Feb 24, 2004)

Hap said:


> isn't mormonism just an off shoot of christiananittnananianity like lutherans, episocoopopsicles, and methodists? They just believe some, um..._different_ aspects of stuff?



Mormonism is a cult by definition.....I know there go all my prestige points, but hear me out. I could care less what someone believes as long as they don't go around killing people and stuff like that. I mean OJ is a self proclaimed Christian, so there you go. 

Anyway, Mormanism believes in the Bible and all, it's just that whole other book they believe in that's the cult part of it. Anyway pile on all you Mormon's, but that's what I believe to be true.


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

Talkhard said:


> I appreciate what you're saying, and I even agree. But my point is that a player who professes to be a Christian and gets a tattoo of Jesus is probably a guy who is going to work hard, keep his nose clean, and represent the Blazers with class and dignity--and that's the kind of guy we want. End of story.


Haven't you ever seen a show on the US prison system? 90% of the guys locked up have tattoos of jesus somewhere on their body. That doesn't mean anything.


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## Stepping Razor (Apr 24, 2004)

Talkhard said:


> I appreciate what you're saying, and I even agree. But my point is that a player who professes to be a Christian and gets a tattoo of Jesus is probably a guy who is going to work hard, keep his nose clean, and represent the Blazers with class and dignity--and that's the kind of guy we want. End of story.





Talkhard said:


> I appreciate what you're saying, and I even agree. But my point is that a player who professes to be a Christian and gets a tattoo of Jesus is probably a guy who is going to work hard, keep his nose clean, and represent the Blazers with class and dignity--and that's the kind of guy we want. End of story.


Five minutes on google finds the following NBA players with Christian tattoos (either Jesus, the cross, or chapter:verse):

Jalen Rose
Kobe Bryant
Allen Iverson
Dennis Rodman

JR Rider used to wear a WWJD bracelet.

I think I'd rather have a guy who acts like a Christian than one who's inked up like one.

(Not saying Martell can't be both.)

Stepping Razor


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Stepping Razor said:


> Five minutes on google finds the following NBA players with Christian tattoos (either Jesus, the cross, or chapter:verse):
> 
> Jalen Rose
> Kobe Bryant
> ...


ah, but JR's bracelet stood for "what would JR do"


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

Stepping Razor said:


> JR Rider used to wear a WWJD bracelet.
> 
> Stepping Razor


Clearly JR believed that Jesus would smoke weed out of a coke can.


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## handclap problematic (Nov 6, 2003)

I find this conversation highly interesting and entertaining. I would have to side with Crandc on this one. I think character is character. I have known some complete jerks who were big-time christians...and I have known really nice ones. And the same thing goes for every other religion, or lacktherof. 
But the part I find really funny about this is that people can read a person by their tattoos. I just find that kind of rediculous. Ok Talkhard, I have a tattoo of a piano keyboard on my chest and I don't beleive in a god.... does this make me a bad person.....? Does it signify that I might be prone to crime or trouble? not trying to bait you or anything, just honestly wondering. If you can read the inked tea leaves, then I would like to know about myself...haha

And Martell, part of me wants to pick him up , and part of me thinks he will be a bust. But, hoestly, I think the Blazers saw something in him during their workout. Supposedly, they had never had a better workout, ever. That really says a lot to me. I guess now we play the waiting game. 
Prunetang


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## CelticPagan (Aug 23, 2004)

Reep said:


> After all the trouble that Damon and Rasheed got into I can't even believe you are asking that question. Maybe you should have picked other examples.


That was precisely my point though.


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## Charlotte_______ (May 18, 2003)

Anyone else feel hes the second coming of Ron Artest?


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## Stepping Razor (Apr 24, 2004)

Charlotte_______ said:


> Anyone else feel hes the second coming of Ron Artest?


Uhh, no.


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## crandc (Sep 15, 2004)

I don't have any tattoos. Don't know what that says about me except maybe
1. I'm not really into self display
2. I'm a coward about wilfully subjecting myself to pain
3. I'm old. Women in my younger days did not get tattoos and I think most of us tend to keep to styles we used when we were young (until Nature forces otherwise).

I hope Martell is a good player/person. 
But this is like the flip side of the troll who said he "knew" Green was a thug and we'd be able to tell by his clothing and car. Baloney. Clothes, cars, tattoos, religious paraphernalia tell us nothing of character. That's all.


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

Hey I Just think he's a good kid. A commitment to spirituality is something that IMO should be commended, regardless of faith, as it shows a commitment to better ones self.

The Christianity thing is only really important to Christians., and aside from his religous beliefs he sounds very level headed, and thinks things through carefully.


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## hasoos (Jan 3, 2003)

I would be more impressed if he had a Tattoo which said "May the Dark lords of Hell take me to an NBA title" with a picture of Satan dunking the ball.


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## handclap problematic (Nov 6, 2003)

> Hey I Just think he's a good kid. A commitment to spirituality is something that IMO should be commended, regardless of faith, as it shows a commitment to better ones self.


To quote The Big Labowski, " But that is just like, your opinion, man". 

I don't commend people for "spiritual commitment". I am trying to type this without saying anything that would piss people off....or eventually close the thread..haha.....hmmm.
I guess I was born with a highly scientific and analytical mind. I personally don't believe in any kind of spirituality. I just don't see it evidenced in any way shape or form. And if there is a "god", well he created me with this mind. He created me to doubt. Which is kind of a contradiction in itself...haha
Anyways, so when I see someone with a "spiritual commitment", I don't commend them. I honestly see it as someone who is wasting their time and energy believing in something of a fairytale. Please don't take this the wrong way... I know I shouldn't have posted this.....but, well, if you can show your opinion, then well, I can too. So, cheers to diversity among us eh.

Prunetang


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

Prunetang said:


> To quote The Big Labowski, " But that is just like, your opinion, man".
> 
> I don't commend people for "spiritual commitment". I am trying to type this without saying anything that would piss people off....or eventually close the thread..haha.....hmmm.
> I guess I was born with a highly scientific and analytical mind. I personally don't believe in any kind of spirituality. I just don't see it evidenced in any way shape or form. And if there is a "god", well he created me with this mind. He created me to doubt. Which is kind of a contradiction in itself...haha
> ...


No I am a lot like you in you r opinion. The key in my statement my have been lost when I referred to commitment....The key was this...

* it shows a commitment to better ones self.*

I don't think that any person should be frowned upon for commiting to bettering onself....We all have different techniques, but is that's whats important? or is it the Final result that is important?

Example if a Kid simple commits to walking the straight line and stays out of trouble by simply making good choices, he';s a good kid right? Now what if a kid makes the same choices in his life but it is spiritually motivated....Still a good kid no? Results the same, method different.

So who cares?


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## e_blazer1 (Feb 3, 2004)

Prunetang said:


> I guess I was born with a highly scientific and analytical mind. I personally don't believe in any kind of spirituality. I just don't see it evidenced in any way shape or form.
> 
> And if there is a "god", well he created me with this mind. He created me to doubt. Which is kind of a contradiction in itself...haha


Prunetang, as far as I can tell regarding this very off-topic subject, one can choose to believe one of three things:

1. There is no god. The universe, through some set of processes that we have not yet (and probably never will) figured out, was created out of nothing and at some time, through another set of processes that we don't understand, life began on at least this one planet in a small corner of a minor galaxy.

2. There's a god (or I suppose gods) who set the above processes in motion who sits back and watches this toy spin around and who cares nothing for the little lifeforms who inhabit portions of this universe.

3. There's a god who set the processes in motion, who happens to have a personal interest in the beings that inhabit portions of this universe.

None of the above theories can be proved scientifically. It's our individual choice as to what we believe (theologians refer to this as "free will"). That decision is called "faith".


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## crandc (Sep 15, 2004)

Well, your option #1 does not really represent the scientific viewpoint, e_blazer, but we are getting too far off topic.
Hell with tattoos. What I want to know about this kid is...

Does he like chocolate???


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## e_blazer1 (Feb 3, 2004)

crandc said:


> Well, your option #1 does not really represent the scientific viewpoint, e_blazer, but we are getting too far off topic.


Hmmm. I was trying to be pretty generic, crandc. Perhaps you don't agree with my use of the phrase "out of nothing". I just Googled "origin of the universe" and found a refernce to an article in Scientific American where one scientist describes the Big Bang as "The explosion from zero volume at zero time of a corpuscle of energy equivalent to the mass and radiation that now constitute the Universe." OK. I can go with that.

Even Billy Graham was willing to amend Genesis to read, "In the beginning, _with a Big Bang_, God created the heavens and the earth. :biggrin: 




> Hell with tattoos. What I want to know about this kid is...
> 
> Does he like chocolate???


Personally, I'm more interested in his cross-over dribble and 3-point shooting percentage.


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

> I just Googled "origin of the universe"


I'm curious. Does "Google" as a verb mean to type in a word and do a search for it on a search engine? Or is it more than that? 

Do people use the term "Google" when they are doing searches on Yahoo or Alta Vista or some other search engine?

Questions from a computer clutz . . .


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## Sambonius (May 21, 2003)

Webster seems like a genuinely good kid but the Jesus tattoo doesn't do it for me at all. That always struck me as really odd and wierd. You can praise whoever you want but do it really require you to get a tattoo of them on your body? Didn't think so.


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## e_blazer1 (Feb 3, 2004)

Talkhard said:


> I'm curious. Does "Google" as a verb mean to type in a word and do a search for it on a search engine? Or is it more than that?
> 
> Do people use the term "Google" when they are doing searches on Yahoo or Alta Vista or some other search engine?
> 
> Questions from a computer clutz . . .


Oh, well now you're just getting waaay too deep for a basketball message board. Try to stick to the topic. :biggrin:


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## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

Oh, thank God he's a Christian. Then we know he's not like the rest of us Satan-worshipping *******s who will burn in hell-fire for eternity.

I was more intrigued by the article because it showed his unselfishness. I could care less about the Jesus tattoo. The fact he's a Christian really doesn't prove anything to me. Christians are just like anyone else - they come in all shapes and sizes of *******s. Going to church on Sunday and having a bible in your book collection doesn't make you a great person.

I think Schilly nailed it. If anything, it shows he has a commitment to something above self. That fact that commitment is to Christianity doesn't say anything more to me than if he had a commitment to something else deemed "good" by society.

-Pop


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

> That fact that commitment is to Christianity doesn't say anything more to me than if he had a commitment to something else deemed "good" by society.


So . . . he might as well be committed to dental hygiene, or combing his hair, or eating three solid meals a day. Right?

Yep, that's all about the same as committing yourself to Christianity.


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

For as many fish-weilding *******es on the road who cut me off every day, I'd say it's not quite as useful as commiting to dental hygine. Which, by the way, DA could stand to commit to as well.


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