# No more hating out Outlaw



## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Seriously. This guy is emerging as a real force.

GO BLAZERS


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## dwood615 (Jul 20, 2004)

hahahahah yeah last week i hated him for his horrible game but lately he has been stepping up....he proved me wrong...i admit...not i believe in him


maybe it just took a bad game to get him going


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

the thing is, he has been effective all year. If his shot wasn't falling, he was still an awesome defender and rebounder.


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## RipCity9 (Jan 30, 2004)

Thank the Lord for that one! Finally!


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## Public Defender (May 5, 2003)

I've been pretty tough on Outlaw, too, and today, he really really showed some stones down the stretch. He took - and made - two huge shots in the final minute. Although, wasn't Rudy Gay his man? That putback never should have happened. But I'm in no mood to pick nits, this was a very important win, done in a very convincing way when the Blazers were down by eight points in the middle of the 4th. The Blazers pulled out the kind of win that opponents have been pulling on Portland. 

Great win. Good job, Travis. But next time - box out!


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

He hit the last THREE shots I believe. One bounced around and fell. Then the game winning three. But no, Gay scores so Travis hits ANOTHER game winning shot. Amazing.

Uh on. With Outlaw and Jones playing so well, Webster's gonna lose minutes.


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## LameR (Jan 4, 2004)

I think the hate will come when he plays poorly, as it should for any of the players who try to do too much when being ineffective. However, I think it's only appropriate to a point.


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## Public Defender (May 5, 2003)

I just went back and checked the official "play-by-play" on nba.com, and yes, Outlaw hit three shots in the last minute to rally the Blazers from four down, to a one point victory. 

I would have to say that was an outstanding performance. I'd say it was the most clutch minute of offense from any Blazer so far this season.


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## ThatBlazerGuy (May 1, 2003)

He is playing better as of late, but I am not ready to join in the love fest. He has a habit of stringing a few great games together before returning to mediocracy. 

His recent play is intriguing though.


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## chairman (Jul 2, 2006)

ThatBlazerGuy said:


> He is playing better as of late, but I am not ready to join in the love fest. He has a habit of stringing a few great games together before returning to mediocracy.
> 
> His recent play is intriguing though.


True. And there is nothing wrong with that. You guys crack me up thinking players should be great every night. Even super stars have bad shooting games every few games. They just have more of a chance to shoot themselves out of it. And Travis as we all know is no super star. Just let him be him.


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## BenDavis503 (Apr 11, 2007)

Ok ok no more hating Outlaw

He is officially out of the Outhouse


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## ProZach (Oct 13, 2005)

ThatBlazerGuy said:


> He is playing better as of late, but I am not ready to join in the love fest. He has a habit of stringing a few great games together before returning to mediocracy.


Name one of our bench players who doesn't fall into that category. He's not a max contract guy, he's not even a starter. And let's face it, it's either him, or play Frye and Raef more... That should help you appreciate him, at least a little.



ThatBlazerGuy said:


> His recent play is intriguing though.


Your word choice is anomalous, yet stimulating.
:cheers:


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## wastro (Dec 19, 2004)

Outlaw's done a lot to help this team this year. His defense has improved tremendously, and it looks like he's broken out of that shooting slump that plagued him earlier this season.

But I don't think you can say "No more hating on Outlaw" until he does this over a few weeks, not just a few games.


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## majic_sean (Dec 22, 2004)

He is also attacking the rim more. When that happens he gets dangerous. Thanks Jeff Foster for getting the cowbwebs out. His phone game interview on the radio was classic too.

"I was hoping to get fouled, but they didn't call anything,'' Outlaw said of the game-winner. "Then, it went in anyway, and I was like 'Oh!'''


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)




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## Ukrainefan (Aug 1, 2003)

I'm still not convinced. As some have pointed out, his weakness and strength are the same; he's never afraid to take a shot. Seems likely maybe he was a little lucky tonight


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

Once again, I was right about a player and 90% of the board ripped me for it. No need to go into specifics.

Outlaw is only 23. We still have time to trade him for Anderson ****ing Verajao.


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

What a beast of a line for T-law though.

21 pts, 8-13 shooting, 3-3 from range, 7 rebs 2 assists 2 blocks AND no turnovers.

You guys have no room to ever doubt me again. He is a perfect 6th man.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

c_note said:


> Once again, I was right about a player and 90% of the board ripped me for it. No need to go into specifics.


I invented basketball, the Internet, the internal combustion engine, and sex. No need to go into specifics.

barfo


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

barfo said:


> I invented basketball, the Internet, the internal combustion engine, and sex. No need to go into specifics.
> 
> barfo


In other words, C_note, you were right, I was wrong, I'll just insult you 'cuz there's nothing else to say.


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

the reason he shoots so much is because he's always open. with insane vertical like that who is going to block him? 

he's had ups and downs. he'll vanish for several games, lock down Nowitzki for a half, vanish again, then do something like tonight. that's what you expect out of a pretty good bench player.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

c_note said:


> In other words, C_note, you were right, I was wrong, I'll just insult you 'cuz there's nothing else to say.


I have no idea what you are talking about. I haven't memorized all of my own previous posts, much less yours, so whether you are right or wrong about Travis is unknown to me. And I didn't insult you in any way. 

If you want to provide a link to a thread where you were right and I was wrong, I will cheerfully salute you for being right and I will admit I was not. 

barfo


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## mgb (Jun 26, 2004)

majic_sean said:


> *He is also attacking the rim more.* When that happens he gets dangerous. Thanks Jeff Foster for getting the cowbwebs out. His phone game interview on the radio was classic too.
> 
> "I was hoping to get fouled, but they didn't call anything,'' Outlaw said of the game-winner. "Then, it went in anyway, and I was like 'Oh!'''


That's what he needs to do more often, take the ball to the basket, instead of just settling for jump shots. Then even if his shot is off he's going to get a foul or be able to pass it to someone that's open.


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## wastro (Dec 19, 2004)

The thing about Travis taking a jump shot is that he can get it up on anyone. He has what Martell lacks -- the ability to create his own shot.

Don't get me wrong -- I love to see Travis attack the rim, but even if he's taking jumpers (and nailing them at a 45% clip), then I'm okay with that. 

The next stage of his development will be attacking the basket when his shot isn't falling. Right now, he doesn't attack if he's having a bad game. That will come with experience, though.


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

People have had 1st half of the 1st round starter expectations from him. If you take him in context of what he is a reserve, then he is very good at what he does.


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## JAFO (Jul 2, 2006)

I want to gratefully thank Jeff Foster for smacking TO in the face and Yahoo Sports for using Bo Outlaw's photo on Travis' write-up. Both of which undoubtedly pissed Travis off and left him feeling like he had to prove something to get some respect.

I like a fired up TO! Keep it going.

JAFO


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## ryanjend22 (Jan 23, 2004)

not ready to jump on the outlaw bandwagon but i am proud of him tonight thats for sure.


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

barfo said:


> I have no idea what you are talking about. I haven't memorized all of my own previous posts, much less yours, so whether you are right or wrong about Travis is unknown to me. And I didn't insult you in any way.
> 
> If you want to provide a link to a thread where you were right and I was wrong, I will cheerfully salute you for being right and I will admit I was not.
> 
> barfo


Why are you mocking me in the first place? Are you just an *******? I didn't do anything to you. I don't remember any certain threads involving you, I was talking to the board in general. I assume you were one of the Outlaw haters because of that last post you made.

It's threads like these that just piss me off though, so I have to say "told you so" because most posters are clueless.

http://www.basketballforum.com/portland-trail-blazers/383425-im-sorry-but-i-hate-outlaw.html
http://www.basketballforum.com/portland-trail-blazers/360198-what-i-would-do-if-i-were-portland.html

There has been so much Outlaw hating this year, it's ridiculous. And before his final 2 games last year, hardly ANYONE was defending him, but rather demanding we trade him for nothing. Martell has a very similar story-line as well.


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

A couple more. Some are about Webster too.

http://www.basketballforum.com/portland-trail-blazers/357650-blazers-sonics-trade.html
This one is just outrageous. Everyone pretty much supporting the trade.

http://www.basketballforum.com/portland-trail-blazers/354307-travis-outlaw-jermaine-oneal.html
http://www.basketballforum.com/port...1-travis-outlaws-one-dimensional-offense.html

There's so much more out there, I'm not gonna waste any more time than I already have.


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## ThatBlazerGuy (May 1, 2003)

I simply dot understand the TO love. For every game he is an above average reserve he is a slighly below average reserve. I think he is a talented kid, but if he is putting up 11ppg when this Blazer team is contending for a playoffs spot I will be suprised. 

Name the last time this kid won this team a game. Seriously. This sunday/monday Sergio was the next Nash and now TO is the next 6th man of the year. Lets get a grip. Most likley neither will be regular contributers on a above average team.

Its like the people that say Jarrett Jack is a crappy player vs the people that think he is the next Ben Gordon.

Is there no in-between?

OT: I was, and still am, in favor of the Zach trade.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

c_note said:


> Why are you mocking me in the first place? Are you just an *******?


No, I'm not just an *******. I'm that plus much, much more.



> I didn't do anything to you. I don't remember any certain threads involving you, I was talking to the board in general. I assume you were one of the Outlaw haters because of that last post you made.


Well, that would be a bad assumption on your part, then. 



> It's threads like these that just piss me off though, so I have to say "told you so" because most posters are clueless.


Looking over the threads you quoted, I'd have to say a surprising number of things piss you off. 

Nevertheless, I think you did prove that you are a staunch supporter of Travis Outlaw, and for that, I salute you! 

barfo


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Dude, he just hit huge shots to help us win. That's what it's all about. And he's done other great things for us. Why hate on our own players? I don't get it. And I LOVE that photo of him taking the last shot. Gosh, he is SO high off the ground. Amazing.

I just don't get it when Blazer fans bash their own guys. Tonight's shot will go down as one of my all time favorite Blazer memories. Great, great shot to lift a HUGE monkey off our back.

Go Blazers


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## ThatBlazerGuy (May 1, 2003)

I dont get it when Blazer fans are expected to trip over their own mediocre players.

If your 'Love all Blazer players' idea was correct, all terrible Blazers like Raef would be loved.

Travis Outlaw is an interesting player, but until I see some sort of consistency I refuse to jump on his bandwagon. At the same time, I value him more than Jack. Either way, Outlaw hit a nice buzzer-beater and will never be truly remembered for this above average game unless he plays somewhat like this while this struggling team is vying for a decent playoff spot; something I wager he wont be involved in,


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

Outlaw was playing in front of his parents and friends from Mississippi whom he had given tickets to. This was probably the biggest game of the year for him. I'm not surprised he played well--he was clearly pumped up and ready to go. 

It reminds me of the game in New York in Telfair's rookie season when he put up 27 points against his cousin Stephon Marbury and in front of his family and friends. It's always easier to perform well when you're playing in front of loved ones and friends from home.

It should also be noted that Outlaw has had a few big games for us in the past, particularly those two games at the end of last season. But it's completely fair to point out that his "big games" are too few and far between. I'm hoping that his game-winning shot last night is a turning point in his career, and that it makes him realize he can be a big-time player in this league. Last night's performance may give him the confidence that he needs to take his game to another level.


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## mgb (Jun 26, 2004)

c_note said:


> A couple more. Some are about Webster too.
> 
> http://www.basketballforum.com/portland-trail-blazers/357650-blazers-sonics-trade.html
> This one is just outrageous. Everyone pretty much supporting the trade.
> .


Checking out just the first page of that thread most was against it. A couple, including the person that made the post was for it, but most of the replies said it was way to early to give up on Webster and/or that he shouldn't be in the trade.

I know I've defended Webster in the past. I'll admit some were ready to give up on him, but just as many were not.

Same goes with Outlaw. He's had just as many posters defending him as not. Maybe you notice the negative posts more.


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## mediocre man (Feb 24, 2004)

I'm fine with Outlaw shooting as long as it's not a quick jumper with a foot on the line. Travis seems to be able to get to the rim if he wants to. When he does this he is then able to jab step at the free throw line for an easy jumper. He also seems to be trying really hard on defense and hustling this season.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

I think barfo is just being barfo. I don't think he's ever (outside of certain posters, but even then he's pretty tame) made things serious when it comes to things.

Take it with a grain of salt, as he means no harm. After all, he lives in the land of super models, is a commie pinko and is probably the coolest guy on the board.

All your base are belong to barfo.


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

Hap said:


> All your base are belong to barfo.


Huh?


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## Iwatas (Aug 3, 2003)

People have compared Outlaw to Ruben Patterson in the past. Both are hard/bone-headed SFs capable of doing something breathtakingly stupid, especially when their synapses cannot keep up with their hands and feet.

I guess the big difference between them is that Ruben is a first-rate defender, and Outlaw actually is a decent shooter. ??

iWatas


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## wizmentor (Nov 10, 2005)

wastro said:


> The next stage of his development will be attacking the basket when his shot isn't falling. Right now, he doesn't attack if he's having a bad game. That will come with experience, though.


This really hits the mark. For me, it's about shot selection. He needs to
use his athleticism to get better shots. If he does that he's capable of
being an above average player. If he doesn't, he'll be stuck with the
"potential" tag forever.

BTW, for him to be better than above average, he must commit less errors
on the court, and improve his defense.


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## ProudBFan (Apr 29, 2003)

I was really REALLY proud of Travis last night. To hit the FOUR biggest shots of the game (dont forget the shot at the end of the 3rd to pull the Blazers within 4th-quarter striking distance) with his Dad in attendance was just a very special night for the kid. Thats the kind of thing that reassures us parents that we did a great job raising our kids. I couldnt suppress the huge grin that plastered itself to my face for about 45 minutes after the game (even if I wanted to), and it was for his Dad every bit as much as it was for Travis and the team.

Travis has shown flashes of both solid and clutch play up to this point. No, not consistently, but he seems to be there when the team needs him more often than not. He also still makes the occasional low-basketball-IQ mistake (like not attacking Stro a lot more often last night, like Wheels pointed out), but those mistakes are fewer and farther between than they used to be.

Point is, the kid IS learning. And - to me anyway - has proven his value to the team on many occasions (I have never once hated on him). Not everyone has to - or can - be a superstar. And even IF Travis is destined to be a role-player in this league, I say its a DAMN good thing he is on our roster while he is young, that he understands and accepts his role, that he has such GREAT chemistry with the rest of our young squad, and that he is a genuinely good person.

Man, I cant WAIT to see Travis, Brandon, Lamarcus, Jarrett, Martell, Sergio, Przy, Fernandez (fingers crossed), et al in action with Oden next season.

PBF


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## hasoos (Jan 3, 2003)

When Travis Outlaw steps up and becomes consistent, I will like him. But until then, he is going to be one of those guys that I hold my breath and cringe when he has the ball. Maybe this game will help him out in his developement.


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## yakbladder (Sep 13, 2003)

Ahh leave it to schizophrenic Blazer fans. Either we MUST hate him or we MUST love him. There will be no variance!!!

Travis has always had a world of potential but there are other offsetting factors that limit him reaching that potential. 

Yes, he shoots great. But he also shoots a ton - at least in the games I've seen he's a mini-black hole. I suppose on our team that's necessary at times.

Yes, he can really block shots and hustle on D. The problem is he's often out of position or makes some weird rotations. I don't know if that's Nate or Outlaw or his teammates or him trying to do too much or what. 

I'm happy he won the game for us. I don't expect him to break out as a starter anytime soon and I have absolutely no expectations he'll ever be 6th man of the year. He is what he is and sometimes it works. He played a great game last night but to read anything else into one game (positive or negative) is just ridiculous.


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

c_note said:


> A couple more. Some are about Webster too.
> 
> http://www.basketballforum.com/portland-trail-blazers/357650-blazers-sonics-trade.html
> This one is just outrageous. Everyone pretty much supporting the trade.
> ...


In my case, no, I did not comment on the trade. You can't say I supported the trade. I don't advocate making "lateral" trades for young teams. Since I am part of the group "everyone" (who posted in that thread), your assertion is false.

I did claim that Webster hadn't shown to be even an average player his first two seasons, and that history says that makes for low odds he will ever become an above average player.

You are using the current play of Outlaw and Webster to support an "I told you so", that they would make leaps in ability if we just waited longer than we already had.

I think you claims are unsubstantiated.

The team is losing, and losing a LOT. A win against another bottom feeder does little to change the equation of this season. If the young guys are improved, why do we still suck?

PER numbers (15.0 is average for the league)

Webster:
05-06: 11.6
06-07: 10.0
this season so far: 11.88

Outlaw:
04-05: 15.4
05-06: 12.9
06-07: 15.3
this season so far: 14.22

Gee, guess they haven't really improved (yet). Hope springs eternal. Might want to put that "I told you so" back in your pocket.


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## ProZach (Oct 13, 2005)

barfo said:


> I invented basketball, the Internet, the internal combustion engine, and sex. No need to go into specifics.
> 
> barfo


:lol:


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## ljm (Jan 17, 2006)

My favorite, and what I took to be the biggest step in Travis' development was after he hit the 3, he was actually yelling while running back down the court (probably something like "That's what you [email protected]#$%$#@[email protected][email protected]'s get for leaving me open!"). To see the normally shy guy do something like that is huge IMO. I'm happy for him, what a night. 

Also, on the replay, the reason he was out of position for the box out on Rudy was that left to help Blake on Navarro's drive/shot. Not sure if that was necessarily the right move (not in retrospect of course), but it actually seems like a defensable help rotation.

-ljm


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

c_note said:


> In other words, C_note, you were right, I was wrong, I'll just insult you 'cuz there's nothing else to say.


Basically. :lol:

it is nice to see players increasing their trade value, Outlaw might still be a Blazer next year, if he keeps up the play I'm down with that too.


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

mgb said:


> Checking out just the first page of that thread most was against it. A couple, including the person that made the post was for it, but most of the replies said it was way to early to give up on Webster and/or that he shouldn't be in the trade.
> 
> I know I've defended Webster in the past. I'll admit some were ready to give up on him, but just as many were not.
> 
> Same goes with Outlaw. He's had just as many posters defending him as not. Maybe you notice the negative posts more.


For that particular trade, 50% of people were saying it wasn't quite worth it. But I can assure you they would've pulled the trigger if a slightly better offer came along


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

Masbee said:


> In my case, no, I did not comment on the trade. You can't say I supported the trade. I don't advocate making "lateral" trades for young teams. Since I am part of the group "everyone" (who posted in that thread), your assertion is false.
> 
> I did claim that Webster hadn't shown to be even an average player his first two seasons, and that history says that makes for low odds he will ever become an above average player.
> 
> ...


Obviously they are not producing consistently night in and night out, but my original intent was to just prove that it would be foolish to dump them for next to nothing.

And I think this year thus far proves it. Of course, it is not over yet, they are both still extremely young, but I think everyone realizes now they are much more valuable than originally thought. And what does stats have to do with it? Can't you tell that they both have improved drastically since the beginning of last year?


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

Looking back through the old threads, it was mostly dudleysghost that I was arguing with about Martell and Travis.
So I'm sorry if I accused others of the same thing. I couldn't remember who it was.

What up dudley!


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Talkhard said:


> Huh?


here is a somewhat reasonable explanation. I think. Kind of.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

ThatBlazerGuy said:


> I dont get it when Blazer fans are expected to trip over their own mediocre players.
> 
> If your 'Love all Blazer players' idea was correct, all terrible Blazers like Raef would be loved.
> 
> Travis Outlaw is an interesting player, but until I see some sort of consistency I refuse to jump on his bandwagon. At the same time, I value him more than Jack. Either way, Outlaw hit a nice buzzer-beater and will never be truly remembered for this above average game unless he plays somewhat like this while this struggling team is vying for a decent playoff spot; something I wager he wont be involved in,


Never be remembered? I will always remember that finish. I've watched the Blazers since 1989 and I consider that finish by Outlaw to be one of my all-time favorite highlights. Have you ever seen anyone on our team finish a game with a shot like that? Such moments are few and far between.

As for Raef, I don't think he's a terrible player. And I root for him to do well.

Go Blazers


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

hasoos said:


> When Travis Outlaw steps up and becomes consistent, I will like him. But until then, he is going to be one of those guys that I hold my breath and cringe when he has the ball. Maybe this game will help him out in his developement.


Are you going to wait for Roy to be consistent before you like him? How about Oden? Will you be waiting for consistency before you like him?


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Another clutch performance by Travis vs the Heat tonight.

GO BLAZERS


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## dudleysghost (Mar 24, 2006)

c_note said:


> Looking back through the old threads, it was mostly dudleysghost that I was arguing with about Martell and Travis.
> So I'm sorry if I accused others of the same thing. I couldn't remember who it was.
> 
> What up dudley!


I said Martell wouldn't be more than an ordinary player. Is that so far off? Don't remember what I said about Outlaw, but probably about the same thing. Both have been pleasant surprises for me, but neither is ever going to be a real star like you seem to think. Is that what you wanted?


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

dudleysghost said:


> I said Martell wouldn't be more than an ordinary player. Is that so far off? Don't remember what I said about Outlaw, but probably about the same thing. Both have been pleasant surprises for me, but neither is ever going to be a real star like you seem to think. Is that what you wanted?


I never claimed both would be "Stars". You were repeatedly passing both of them off as worthless and I attempted to show you how you were wrong. I guess the only thing that did convince you was the passing of time, like all the other haters here.


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

Talkhard said:


> I'm hoping that his game-winning shot last night is a turning point in his career, and that it makes him realize he can be a big-time player in this league. Last night's performance may give him the confidence that he needs to take his game to another level.


Hey, I'm quoting myself!!  Last night's game was only one step, but my Lord, Outlaw looked good. That monster dunk and the reverse slam, not to mention his good outside shooting and aggressive rebounding make me wonder if he didn't turn the page on his career against Memphis. He looked like a real pro out there last night, and you can actually see the difference in his body language and attitude. This guy doesn't just think he belongs in the NBA--He knows it!!


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## dudleysghost (Mar 24, 2006)

c_note said:


> I never claimed both would be "Stars". You were repeatedly passing both of them off as worthless and I attempted to show you how you were wrong. I guess the only thing that did convince you was the passing of time, like all the other haters here.


I never said they were worthless. I compared Martell to role players and talked about how his skill set was too limited to be a star, and you went ape. But you go ahead and remember it however you want.


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## It's_GO_Time (Oct 13, 2005)

Travis put a string of good games together last season, with some characterized as possibly his break out game . . . so I think it still too early to know if this is the Travis we will see most nights.

But the big differnce this year, is Travis has put toghether two big games with the starting unit. If I recall right, last year his big games came at the end of the season with Zach, Aldridge, Joel and others done for the season. Travis was basically called upon to be the offensive scorer and had the green light all game. This year he has to fit in with the starters . . . so I think things are as bright as they ever have been for Traivs.


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## BuckW4GM (Nov 2, 2005)

it's great to see that travis is trying to take it to the hole more and is finishing stronger. the last few games of last season, he really made an effort to take it to the hole, and it paid off. i was disappointed that he didn't continue to have that mindset earlier this season. but he seems to be getting back to that. i hope he keep it up. go travis!


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## PapaG (Oct 4, 2004)

I've been pro-Travis as well, argued at length here in favor of his resigning both before and after it, and admit that his start to the season concerned me. That said, I hope that Travis now sees that this current roster CANNOT win without his contributions. I'm not sure he is ready to give consistent 15+ point games, but let's face facts here. Roy and LMA both now have confidence in Travis at the end of games. For a 6th man playing outside of San Antonio, that is pretty remarkable.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Yea, Outlaw's performance at the end of last season meant nothing to me. So many were out with injuries and we lost those games. But what Outlaw is doing now is very impressive. It is not too late for him to be a star in this league. In fact, I can say that about almost all of our players. They're all sooo young.

Go Blazers


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

NathanLane said:


> Yea, Outlaw's performance at the end of last season meant nothing to me. So many were out with injuries and we lost those games. But what Outlaw is doing now is very impressive. It is not too late for him to be a star in this league. In fact, I can say that about almost all of our players. They're all sooo young.
> 
> Go Blazers


Two huge games came against two of the very worst defensive teams in the NBA while longtime matadors like Ricky Davis and Mike Miller where checking him. That to me is very much like the garbage time games at the end of last season.

I won't put a lot into this until Travis has a couple of games like this against teams with better team defense and better individual defenders at the forward position. These games do give us hope that he has turned a corner.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

But the fact that he is doing what he's supposed to against teams/players who aren't that good.... that makes him one of the good guys. Just like Boston. They haven't played anyone yet, but you can't fault them for trashing the losers that they are playing.

Go Blazers


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## 2k (Dec 30, 2005)

Masbee said:


> Two huge games came against two of the very worst defensive teams in the NBA while longtime matadors like Ricky Davis and Mike Miller where checking him. That to me is very much like the garbage time games at the end of last season.
> 
> I won't put a lot into this until Travis has a couple of games like this against teams with better team defense and better individual defenders at the forward position. These games do give us hope that he has turned a corner.


When Outlaw is on, individual defense doesn’t seem to matter much. Lets not forget he scored more in the Indiana game than the last two games.


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## PapaG (Oct 4, 2004)

Masbee said:


> *Two huge games came against two of the very worst defensive teams in the NBA* while longtime matadors like Ricky Davis and Mike Miller where checking him. That to me is very much like the garbage time games at the end of last season.
> 
> I won't put a lot into this until Travis has a couple of games like this against teams with better team defense and better individual defenders at the forward position. These games do give us hope that he has turned a corner.



Memphis is horrible on defense, but Miami ranks in the Top 10 in points allowed. You have a flawed premise.


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## majic_sean (Dec 22, 2004)

The two pictures posted of Travis are so good. First that close up dunk then him yelling with the veins popping out of his head as Wade looks on...

Go Blazers

Go Outlaw

On a side note, ESPN highlights have the announcer calling him "Tracy Outlaw".

I'm so glad we held on to Travis. Ime Who-Doka? I was calling for Travis as 6th man of the year early but once the season started I quieted down about it. Looks like the Outlaw of the Wild West is back in the runnings. Whoot!


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

Masbee said:


> Two huge games came against two of the very worst defensive teams in the NBA while longtime matadors like Ricky Davis and Mike Miller where checking him. That to me is very much like the garbage time games at the end of last season.
> 
> I won't put a lot into this until Travis has a couple of games like this against teams with better team defense and better individual defenders at the forward position. These games do give us hope that he has turned a corner.


Garbage time games? 

Travis scored his 36 against G State, a team playing for their playoff lives. If they lost that game, they were out of the playoffs. It was a must-win situation, so don't you think they were trying just a tad harder than normal? I would say they were playing as hard as they possibly could, and Travis still dropped 36 and 10. Golden State still won, but Travis was unstoppable.

To me, that was the definitive moment for Outlaw. That's when I realized, wow, he's gonna be a great player for us someday. That Golden State game was nothing short of amazing for a 22 year old bench player.


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

dudleysghost said:


> I never said they were worthless. I compared Martell to role players and talked about how his skill set was too limited to be a star, and you went ape. But you go ahead and remember it however you want.


Umm k. I already provided the links, go read them yourself.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Cnote- I think the point was that it was a garbage game for US. We had nothing to win or lose so there was ZERO pressure on Outlaw. We were playing for nothing. And we lost.

I'm a HUGE Outlaw supporter as many of you have read on the board, but it's probably impossible for Outlaw to win 6th Man of the Year as long as Barbosa and Ginobili come off the bench. Manu had like 37 pts tonight!

Go Blazers


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

c_note said:


> Garbage time games?
> 
> Travis scored his 36 against G State, a team playing for their playoff lives. If they lost that game, they were out of the playoffs. It was a must-win situation, so don't you think they were trying just a tad harder than normal? I would say they were playing as hard as they possibly could, and Travis still dropped 36 and 10. Golden State still won, but Travis was unstoppable.
> 
> To me, that was the definitive moment for Outlaw. That's when I realized, wow, he's gonna be a great player for us someday. That Golden State game was nothing short of amazing for a 22 year old bench player.


Outlaw - who is designated as a scorer, that is his role - has a huge scoring game against a team that is poor defensively and plays the fastest pace in the NBA - and that said to you Travis is going to be "great"?

Did you think Tony Delk was going to be great when he dropped 50?


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## dudleysghost (Mar 24, 2006)

c_note said:


> Umm k. I already provided the links, go read them yourself.


Ok, I did say we should move him in that trade, but I recanted, saying that there was no imperative to since the risk was low. Webster has definitely improved his game since last year. He's gotten in better shape, improved his defensive footwork, is a better rebounder and is generally more aware of what's going on in the game. There were rumors last year that he had a really bad attitude with the coaches (one of the major reasons I was down on him), and reportedly he has worked that out as well. His game definitely looks like it.

That said, he's still less productive almost across the board than Damien Wilkins, who you said is crap. What exactly do you think Webster has proven this year? He's shown enough improvement that I can believe he will be better than Wilkins, I'll definitely admit that, but still, how good do we really think he will be? I'm still expecting the kind of journeyman player who can contribute, but who is replaceable. We don't have to move him, because it's still a low risk/low reward move doing so. But I still think that KP's talk about "A-list" players stands, and that if we get the chance to get an A-list PG or SF and we have to give up Webster to do it, we should, because I don't think Webster is going to be one.


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

PapaG said:


> Memphis is horrible on defense, but Miami ranks in the Top 10 in points allowed. You have a flawed premise.


Points allowed is not an indicator of defense as much as it is of pace.

Did you watch Miami play? They are not good defensively this season, and they came to Portland in the middle of a slump - a defensive slump - as indicated by coach Riley. Making their defense pitiful.


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## PapaG (Oct 4, 2004)

Masbee said:


> Points allowed is not an indicator of defense as much as it is of pace.
> 
> Did you watch Miami play? They are not good defensively this season, and they came to Portland in the middle of a slump - a defensive slump - as indicated by coach Riley. Making their defense pitiful.


I go by the numbers, and a 6th man who you think is terrible putting up 20 on a Top 10 team in defensive scoring is impressive IMO, especially considering both Shaq and Wade were playing.


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## ThatBlazerGuy (May 1, 2003)

He is playing well, but I am still not ready to annoint him a essential part of this Blazer teams future. I want to see a quarter of a season's worth of reasonably consistent play before I do that.


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

PapaG said:


> I go by the numbers, and a 6th man who you think is terrible putting up 20 on a Top 10 team in defensive scoring is impressive IMO, especially considering both Shaq and Wade were playing.


Where did I EVER say Travis is "terrible". Quote me.

"Impressive." No, it isn't. Wade is hobbling, and Shaq is playing like he has cement shoes. Riley has no choice but to play them to see if they can play their way back into shape. Watching that game, I can tell you, it would have been a dogfight if Riley had Shaq and Wade in streetclothes and he had gameplanned a different way. Miami kicked our *** running a small lineup.

As I have already said, PPG, either scored or allowed has very little to do with the quality level of the offense or defense. You can repeat it 100 times if you like. Still won't change the fact that it is more indicative of pace. And Miami is NOT a good defensive team.

If you think it is impressive, that's cool. People delude themselves about lots of things. Mostly little harm comes of it. Little harm will come of you thinking Travis is a proven stud scorer that can drop on anyone and any team.

Me, I will wait until Travis actually looks good against a couple of quality opponents before I call him something other than what he has been the last couple of seasons.


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## PapaG (Oct 4, 2004)

Masbee said:


> Where did I EVER say Travis is "terrible". Quote me.
> 
> "Impressive." No, it isn't. Wade is hobbling, and Shaq is playing like he has cement shoes. Riley has no choice but to play them to see if they can play their way back into shape. Watching that game, I can tell you, it would have been a dogfight if Riley had Shaq and Wade in streetclothes and he had gameplanned a different way. Miami kicked our *** running a small lineup.
> 
> ...



Outlaw put up 18 points and 11 rebounds on San Antonio. What is the excuse for that game? Why not give the guy some credit for his solid 5 game stretch?


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

I'm very happy for Outlaw, but let's remember this: in 1992 (iirc, maybe have been 1991 or 1993) even Mark Bryant had a 5 game stretch where he was scoring 20 a game.


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## BlazerDog (Jul 18, 2004)

BlazerCaravan said:


> I'm very happy for Outlaw, but let's remember this: in 1992 (iirc, maybe have been 1991 or 1993) even Mark Bryant had a 5 game stretch where he was scoring 20 a game.


Link? 

Mark Bryant was 23 yrs. old when he entered the league. Here's a link of Mark averaging 20 for 6 games when he was almost 31 yrs. old.

http://www.databasebasketball.com/players/playerlog.htm?yr=1995&ilkid=BRYANMA01

Unlike alot of this board I like Travis alot and don't believe he's destined to be a career backup.


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## PapaG (Oct 4, 2004)

Outlaw - 20 pts and 14-16 on FTs against the Bucks.

16 FT ATTEMPTS!!! :yay:


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

BlazerDog said:


> Link?
> 
> Mark Bryant was 23 yrs. old when he entered the league. Here's a link of Mark averaging 20 for 6 games when he was almost 31 yrs. old.
> 
> ...


It might have been 1990-91. Sorry, but I know he had a great streak as a Blazer for a few games.

Travis? He's really showing some moxie. I love what he's doing.


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

Masbee said:


> Little harm will come of you thinking Travis is a proven stud scorer that can drop on anyone and any team.


Umm, he CAN drop on anyone and any team. There isn't a guy in the NBA who can stop his jumper. If Travis wants to gaet his shot off, it will happen, and he will be able to get a decent look at it. The question is, will it fall or not.

He's doing great with his consistency lately, which has always been his major knock, so that is still his biggest problem even though he's improving tremendously.


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## c_note (Jan 30, 2007)

PS

I hate being right, there is nothing left to argue about on these boards!!

(not directed towards anyone specific)


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## PapaG (Oct 4, 2004)

c_note said:


> PS
> 
> I hate being right, there is nothing left to argue about on these boards!!
> 
> (not directed towards anyone specific)



I am right there with you. Outlaw will be one of the top 5 scorers in the NBA off of the bench. With his rebounding thrown in and his contract, what a bargain!


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Another great night by Outlaw. His shot wasn't falling but he got to the line and he made his shots there. 14-16!! Woohoo!!! 

Go Blazers


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Is he consistent enough yet? No more "Travis Outhouse" folks. Also-- the thread was supposed to be called "No more hating ON Outlaw" but I'm liking the way it is now.

Go Blazers


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## wastro (Dec 19, 2004)

Travis has arrived.


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

I didn't see the game, but just looking at the stat line Outlaw had a very nice game. And this came against a team that plays very good defense especially when Jackson is in the lineup. Props to him. And for the other good games he has had.

I hope he keeps it up.


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## PapaG (Oct 4, 2004)

21 points on 10 shots with 6 rebounds/2 assists/2 steals/+15 for the game in under 28 minutes.

He stinks. :lol:

I am sure all of the experts here will change their opinion in due time.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Amen.

Outlaw is for real. 

Enjoy.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

By the way, did I hear correctly that Travis Outlaw is 4th in 4th quarter scoring in all of the league? That didn't sound right. Still--- he is 100% responsible for this win streak. It all started with is clutch shot in Memphis and he's been kicking a$$ ever since. He's the new Mr. 4th Quarter.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

The dude was SERIOUSLY clutch tonight. Unbelievable. 9 in a row.


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## Oldmangrouch (Feb 11, 2003)

The kid is making progress.

In the past, if he had started that cold, he would have faded away. Tonight, he kept playing hard, and some good things happened.


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## wastro (Dec 19, 2004)

Outlaw didn't have his shot going early on, but what I love about his game this year is that he isn't letting that get to him. He stuck around, pulled down some boards, got that crucial offensive rebound, blocked a shot and kept the ball moving. He was amazing tonight, even if his shot wasn't falling.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

You mean Outlaw.


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## wastro (Dec 19, 2004)

Yeah, my bad. There's just so much love go go around tonight!


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