# The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!



## SausageKingofChicago

Annoint yours here people ..ours and the Knicks pick 

I don't think we will have a shot at a top 3 pick and I am presuming we pick with ours and the Knicks somewhere between #8 to #14 ( IE two picks in the back half of the lottery )

Selections ( in order of preference and who I think will realistically be available ):

Ronnie Brewer
Nick Fazekas 
Paul Davis 
Josh Boone


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

If the Knicks go in the tanker, its Aldrige then Gay for us. If Paxson is willing to work the world a little bit, then Marcus Vinicius de Souza from Brazil a real versatile 2/3 who can play some one in a stretch, Andrea Bargnani from Italy, Tiago Splitter from Brazil and the biggest sleeper, and remember where you heard it hear first Alexis Ajinca from France http://nbadraft.net/profiles/alexisajinca.asp.

A guy to look out for either late in round 1 or early in round 2 is Kosta Perovic. He really has alot of the same skills as Nenad does for NJ. 

I like Adam Morrison alot and he probably fits the "right way crowd" desires to a tee, but he is a 3, and anyone who thinks he is a 2 doesnt know what they are talking about. 

One guy I like but we need to stay away from is Shelden Williams. This club just doesnt need another undersized 4 with limited athletic ability. He will have a nice career in the NBA but doesnt provide anything we already dont have. 

Someone mentioned James White on another thread. Man, he wouldnt fit the "right way" crowd at all. But I really like his upside. I would be totally onboard with drafting him.


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## shagmopdog

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SausageKingofChicago said:


> Annoint yours here people ..ours and the Knicks pick
> 
> I don't think we will have a shot at a top 3 pick and I am presuming we pick with ours and the Knicks somewhere between #8 to #14 ( IE two picks in the back half of the lottery )
> 
> Selections ( in order of preference and who I think will realistically be available ):
> 
> Ronnie Brewer
> Nick Fazekas
> Paul Davis
> Josh Boone


Get anyone with.............. SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE SIZE


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## DaBullz

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Size!


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



 rlucas4257 said:


> If the Knicks go in the tanker, its Aldrige then Gay for us. If Paxson is willing to work the world a little bit, then Marcus Vinicius de Souza from Brazil a real versatile 2/3 who can play some one in a stretch, Andrea Bargnani from Italy, Tiago Splitter from Brazil and the biggest sleeper, and remember where you heard it hear first Alexis Ajinca from France http://nbadraft.net/profiles/alexisajinca.asp.
> 
> A guy to look out for either late in round 1 or early in round 2 is Kosta Perovic. He really has alot of the same skills as Nenad does for NJ.


I always do enjoy reading your impressions of the euro/foreign players. For the most part, they seem pretty accurate (as accurate as these things go - trying to extrapolate how a young man is going to make it in the League). On Ajinca - what do you like about him? He's pretty young and would he even declare for this draft? I suppose technically he's eligible, but would he come out and would it be worth taking him and letting him mature a couple more years in France? The other guy I know zip about is Bargnani. What are your impressions of him? Are we talking Darko/Skita type hype or possibly more like Gasol-ish potential? (or something different).


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



fl_flash said:


> I always do enjoy reading your impressions of the euro/foreign players. For the most part, they seem pretty accurate (as accurate as these things go - trying to extrapolate how a young man is going to make it in the League). On Ajinca - what do you like about him? He's pretty young and would he even declare for this draft? I suppose technically he's eligible, but would he come out and would it be worth taking him and letting him mature a couple more years in France? The other guy I know zip about is Bargnani. What are your impressions of him? Are we talking Darko/Skita type hype or possibly more like Gasol-ish potential? (or something different).


Hey Flash

On Bargnani, he really does appear to be a star in the making. He is big, mobile, can shoot with range and contributes now for his European team. He isnt the star of his team but really made an impact in the games that I have seen play. Really crafty. Here is my question mark. The guy is Italian. If he makes it to the NBA he is really a trailblazer (and not a Portland Trailblazer though they might be interested) for Italian basketball and culture. There just hasnt been an Italian player in the NBA, so he would be an original. My guess is that he is far more like Gasol then Skita (Darko I still believe will make it though it wont be Detroit) but maybe not as good as Gasol. However, I like the kids lift, his offense and his reach. I think he is worth the look

On Ajinca, I have to admit my info is all second hand. I dont do any scouting anymore so I just dont get to see the players. But the contacts I talk to who are in French basketball or know the french game are saying he is the absolute real deal. Tenacious, versatile, can handle the ball, can shoot with range, plays with passion and desire and versatile/long (7-1 with a 7-6 wingspan) as all heck. You and I have spoken for awhile so you know my love for rangy, long athletic ball handling types who can play multiple positions. Well, from what I hear, this kid is that and then some. My french contacts say he will put Petro, Pietrus, Parker and Ian Mahinmi (the French kid San Antonio took who is looking like a major steal) to shame. This kid is really young. And to be frank I am not sure he is eligible for this draft or not. However, I hope he comes because the usual activity is that big European kids get hyped before the draft (and some would accuse me of being the one hyping them) only to fall in the week before the draft. Petro for instance was slated for the top 15 before falling to 25 on draft day (and what a steal he has been for the Sonics). So I would expect that would happen to Ajinca, which would enable the Bulls to take him at 15-19. But France is producing real basketball players and I suspect this kid, with some seasoning, could be an impact player. He currently plays for a French academy in basketball so I would draft him around there with the idea of leaving him a year or 2 to learn the game. But from what I hear, this kid is just going to be a real star. Though I cant comment on the KG comparison NBAdraft.net made until I see him with my own eyes. Though a guy I know who plays in France says Chris Bosh or Channing Frye wouldnt be a bad comparison for a kid who is 18 years old. That comparison comes because of his ability to get his own shot at that size and to make shots with range.


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Thanks RLucas. Good stuff. Ajinca interests me. I've seen the stuff on him from NBADraft.net (which I always read with a grain of salt - every single player evaluation has each draftee as the next so-and-so *insert applicable hall of famer*). I believe he turns 18 about a month and a half before the draft. I don't know if the rules have changed for non-american players on age. I would tend to think you'd have to promise this kid to get him to declare (if possible).

I too like the long, rangy type of player. That's why he interests me. Just hearing that he plays with a passion and has what may appear to be a good skill-set is all the more intriguing. Sounds like he's everything Chandler was supposed to be... I know the Spurs must have some pretty good French Connections and I'm hoping that with Pax and his staff taking an interest in Pietrus, they possibly made some inroads into the French recruiting scene. It's all about who you know and what gyms you can get yourself into.

I appreciate the info and if you ever get some tidbits about these guys - post em here!


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

2 words:

Shelden Williams.

The answer to all our problems. I would give up both our pick and the Knicks pick (within reason) if that's what it takes to trade up and draft him.


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## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Out of all the big men projected to go in the 1st round , certainly the lottery , Fazekas may well be the best passer - and that's what we need upfront ..guys that can make passing plays 

Davis has that capacity as well and has really lifted this season so far ..putting in big contributions over fair opposition such as Gonzaga, Georgia Tech and Boston College

Similarly Fazekas kicked into another gear against Kansas, a bit green at the moment to be sure , but still two very interesting and talented prospects in Giles and Kaun - both with size at 6'10 and 6'11

Both Fazekas and Davis are solid rebounders , execute at a high FG% - with Fazekas possessing college 3 point range and both execute very well from the free throw line - and Davis in particular , like Brad Miller , seems to have a knack in getting to the free throw line 

Whilst Aldridge is athletically superior and is a genuine shot blocker ..he doesn't pass the ball much and for a go to go his free throw shooting is awful.

Davis has genuine size at 6'11 and 260 and Fazekas is 6'10 230 and could use another 15 pounds

I think both could be good fits for us


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## rlucas4257

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fl_flash said:


> Thanks RLucas. Good stuff. Ajinca interests me. I've seen the stuff on him from NBADraft.net (which I always read with a grain of salt - every single player evaluation has each draftee as the next so-and-so *insert applicable hall of famer*). I believe he turns 18 about a month and a half before the draft. I don't know if the rules have changed for non-american players on age. I would tend to think you'd have to promise this kid to get him to declare (if possible).
> 
> I too like the long, rangy type of player. That's why he interests me. Just hearing that he plays with a passion and has what may appear to be a good skill-set is all the more intriguing. Sounds like he's everything Chandler was supposed to be... I know the Spurs must have some pretty good French Connections and I'm hoping that with Pax and his staff taking an interest in Pietrus, they possibly made some inroads into the French recruiting scene. It's all about who you know and what gyms you can get yourself into.
> 
> I appreciate the info and if you ever get some tidbits about these guys - post em here!


I know that about NBADraft.net. I mean they called DeShawn Stevenson the next Michael Jordan which was crazy. Chad Ford, who I actually think does a pretty good job looking at these guys, gets carried away with his comparisons too, calling Pietrus the Euro Jordan (though I still think if turned loose he could be the west coast version or Artest minus the insanity). I think the KG comparison came because, and this again is second hand info, he was basically running the point for his french jr team in some jr championship. He was handling the ball, leading the fast break and doing that KG thing from the western conference finals from 2 years ago, being the PG and the center in the same possesion. From everything I read, his range is just phenomenal. I read that his father is from a french island while his mother is from France. I have to believe that island is Guadelope, the home of Pietrus brothers, Petro, Gelabale (a tremendous french prospect, i forgot to mention in the last post, taken by Seattle last year in round 2) and Mahinmi. Apparently that place is turning into a basketball haven from what I hear. Anyway, I will do some more digging on him. He interests me too. I just love versatile, tall, long players with handles and athletic ability and the ability to guard multiple spots (Pippen-like). Thats what drew me to Pietrus in the first place. Everything I read and hear about this kid leads me to believe he fits the mold.

The one thing that does scare me about him and Im not sure how big a deal it is, is his lack of weight. He is 205 at 7-1. If he doesnt get stronger then he could be toast. But Reggie Miller never had problems so I never know. He has a 7-6 wingspan and from what I hear a 40" inch plus vertical leap so it might not matter. But its a concern. 

Anyway, Flash, Ill try and find some other scouting reports on him and see what they say. Ill post them in here. I think this should be stickied. And I agree, I bet San Antonio will be all over this kid if they get a chance at him. When I scouted in France, it seemed to me that GS, San Antonio and Denver were everywhere I went. Those 3 teams seem to really have made inroads into the French game. And to counter that, the games I saw in Russia always seem to have Portland, GS, Utah and LAC scouts there. I guess teams just find a country and garner their contacts there and that leads to certain teams having better contacts then others. My guess is Pax is more Spain focused. I know he liked Rudy Fernandez a couple of years ago and we know he got Nocioni and almost got Macijauskas. So that might be a sign that Pax has made his contacts in that league.


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## rlucas4257

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Flash, It doesnt appear that Jonathan, who does a good job, has any scouting done on Ajinca. 

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=534


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## JRose5

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Being in Big 10 country, I've always liked what I've seen from Davis.
I haven't had a chance to see much of Fazekas, only in the tournament, but I don't know about his size.
I agree with the point that we don't need any more undersized PFs or skinny C's.
Do you think he has the size we need?

I think Davis is big enough, especially if we also pick up a decent big (ie. not Malik Allen) in free agency to help ease the burden.


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## SausageKingofChicago

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JRose5 said:


> Being in Big 10 country, I've always liked what I've seen from Davis.
> I haven't had a chance to see much of Fazekas, only in the tournament, but I don't know about his size.
> I agree with the point that we don't need any more undersized PFs or skinny C's.
> Do you think he has the size we need?
> 
> I think Davis is big enough, especially if we also pick up a decent big (ie. not Malik Allen) in free agency to help ease the burden.


I see Davis as a guy who can come in and contribute straight away as a back up Center maybe playing around 18 to 20mpg initially - at 6'11 and 260 he fits the need 

Fazekas is probably more a 2 year project who needs to get stronger . He is a spin and fade away shooting type that scores a lot on face up jumpers from both post flanks ..where Patrick Ewing got a lot of points . I'm not saying he's a Patrick Ewing far from it..just offensively he has that spin and face up J move ..but to do that / have that as your bread and butter at this level you need to be able to take the hits and execute - which is why he really needs to get stronger and fill out around the 245 to 250 mark

I see him with capacity to have a nice interior passing game ..I've seen him play twice now and he does seem to have good awareness - whereas Aldridge almost seems to be a bit automatic ... Williams too ..but I guess when your the studs like those guys are your role is to look for your shot first time every time 

Seems to be because Fazekas and Davis have not been developed as "the stud" that they have a different ( maybe more holistic ) approach to the game


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## rlucas4257

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Flash, here is some more stuff fyi

http://nbadraft.net/2005berlin006.asp
http://www.fibaeurope.com/cid_f43ul...aFH1.season_2005.roundID_3779.teamID_282.html
http://www.nba.com/bwb/practice_makes_perfect.html
http://www.fibaeurope.com/cid_f43ul...id_LIIPu5mgJx6a6uIKNwiBx1.articleMode_on.html
http://www.eurobasket.com/events/ecu16/ecu1605.asp?NewsNo=29
http://www.federicobuffa.com/INT'L.2005.htm


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## The Krakken

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Just out of curiosity, why on earth would we consider drafting Gay? Is he projected to be THAT much better than Deng? I don't see it. ANd I doubt he could play the 2 or 4, so it seems Gay would be a wasted pick for us no matter HOW badly the knicks tanked.

Get a big with the Knicks pick, and go after Ronnie Brewer, Marco Bellini, or Mardy Collins.


My big 5 as far as realistically obtainable assets that might fit well here are:

Brewer, Bellini, Collins, Splitter, Fazekas.

I don't consider Aldridge obtainable unless he drops or the Knicks TANK AND get lucky.


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## rlucas4257

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The Krakken said:


> Just out of curiosity, why on earth would we consider drafting Gay? Is he projected to be THAT much better than Deng? I don't see it. ANd I doubt he could play the 2 or 4, so it seems Gay would be a wasted pick for us no matter HOW badly the knicks tanked.
> 
> Get a big with the Knicks pick, and go after Ronnie Brewer, Marco Bellini, or Mardy Collins.
> 
> 
> My big 5 as far as realistically obtainable assets that might fit well here are:
> 
> Brewer, Bellini, Collins, Splitter, Fazekas.
> 
> I don't consider Aldridge obtainable unless he drops or the Knicks TANK AND get lucky.


I think the reason for Gay is that he really looks like a special player. Deng is going to be good, but Gay is probably going to be significantly better due to his versatility within his spot (for instance, I think its his handles that really seperate him from Deng). But all in all, I do agree. The SF spot doesnt make alot of sense for the Bulls to be focused on. The hope is that Aldridge is the pick. But I would really like to look at Ajinca as the second pick if he is available (there is some doubt about that) and/or Vinicius. Vinicius can play 3 spots, the SG, SF and PG spot. He is athletic, versatile, long. Sort of like a 2 guard version of Tayshaun Prince. The Bulls need a 2 guard and to get more athletic, along with size on the front line. This kid would be a nice addition to the 2 guard spot.


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## yodurk

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The Krakken said:


> Just out of curiosity, why on earth would we consider drafting Gay? Is he projected to be THAT much better than Deng? I don't see it. ANd I doubt he could play the 2 or 4, so it seems Gay would be a wasted pick for us no matter HOW badly the knicks tanked.
> 
> Get a big with the Knicks pick, and go after Ronnie Brewer, Marco Bellini, or Mardy Collins.
> 
> 
> My big 5 as far as realistically obtainable assets that might fit well here are:
> 
> Brewer, Bellini, Collins, Splitter, Fazekas.
> 
> I don't consider Aldridge obtainable unless he drops or the Knicks TANK AND get lucky.


Yeah, rlucas pretty much said it for me. It's bad news to pass up the can't miss star prospects just because their position is filled already. I know that the Bulls screwed up taking Fizer when Brand was here, but Fizer was not a special player; there are scores of guys like Fizer, but there's only a handful of guys like Rudy Gay. The most obvious example is the Blazers passing up a certain North Carolina product in 1984, because they already had their guard position filled by Drexler. I'm sure they would've loved to terrorize the NBA for 10-15 years with a wing combo of Jordan and Drexler. Regardless of what "position" they play.


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## SausageKingofChicago

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The Krakken said:


> Just out of curiosity, why on earth would we consider drafting Gay? Is he projected to be THAT much better than Deng? I don't see it. ANd I doubt he could play the 2 or 4, so it seems Gay would be a wasted pick for us no matter HOW badly the knicks tanked.
> 
> Get a big with the Knicks pick, and go after Ronnie Brewer, Marco Bellini, or Mardy Collins.
> 
> 
> My big 5 as far as realistically obtainable assets that might fit well here are:
> 
> Brewer, Bellini, Collins, Splitter, Fazekas.
> 
> I don't consider Aldridge obtainable unless he drops or the Knicks TANK AND get lucky.


I hear ya 

I think Splitter will likely go top 5 with Gay, Bellini , Aldridge and Gibson 

Collins ..yeah he's interesting but is he another Reece Gaines ? 

Brewer has really come out this year and is kicking butt.. I'm seeing him at an Igoudala level which is why I want him with a first pick if we're high enough 

I mean ..with the way it looks at the moment- if we came out of the draft with Brewer and Davis I'd be pumped


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## SausageKingofChicago

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You know if Luol had of stayed in school 2 more years and had the luxury of developing his outside shot more and handles at this easier level down..he would be all over Gay and ( in my mind ) an absolute slam dunk #1 pick

No doubts

We have our horse . Noc too

If we pick up a swing prospect in Brewer and add a younger swing vet like Salmons or Welsch in free agency ..we really have no use for Rudy Gay other than to trade the pick for another need


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## SausageKingofChicago

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And I don't think Deng gets the love from some quarters on this board that he deserves

To me ..it feels he really is on the cusp of being quite a special player - it was true before he went down with his wrist injury and he is just starting to find his rythym again right now 

By the 2nd half of this season I think we all may be gobsmacked at the player he's becoming 

You can see it in him


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## The Krakken

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rlucas4257 said:


> I think the reason for Gay is that he really looks like a special player. Deng is going to be good, but Gay is probably going to be significantly better due to his versatility within his spot (for instance, I think its his handles that really seperate him from Deng).


Does he really look that special. Admittedly I haven't watched him alot, but in the little bit I have watched, I've seen absolutely nothing that makes me go "WOW"........yet.

Gay may indeed be "McGrady" to Deng's "Artest", but the only way I take him, EVEN with the FIRST PICK, is if Deng or Nocioni develop to such a tremendous degree as to make the other expedable entirely. I don't see Gay coming in and dominating at this level right away, as he doesn't appear to do so even at the college level yet even as a sophomore (something Deng clearly did as a freshman). And so Ironically, my desire for GAY may indeed be linked to Dengs (or Nocioni's) ability to clearly demonstrate that he (pick one) is better than Gay RIGHT NOW (or when Gay is drafted). I'm not interested in throwing someone in the starting lineup who clearly isn't a starter yet in the NBA, and I'm not convinced he will be as a rookie.

What impresses me most about Deng was his ability to dominate the college game without taking a ton of shots. Its a trait that is BEGINNING to be expressed in his NBA game and IMHO will continue to do so increasingly as he finds his post game in the pros. AFAIK, Gay is an unknown commodity, because while he is clearly a super athlete, he seems to lack intensity at times and gets lost in the game (oddly enough, similar to gordon last year and early on this year).

Maybe its just me.

The other thing to consider is that the current guard trio of hinrich/duhon/Gordon is not likely to exist in its current form long term. If Gordon is unable to rest the starting job from Duhon or Hinrich, he is likely to be traded (I don't think this will happen though). If he DOES wrest the starting job away, hinrich or duhon could be on the block. This means we will either need a) a dominant scorer who is a threat to score every time he touches it (if gordon is traded) and maybe Gay can be that guy, OR we will need b) a BIG playmaker that can handle to ball to offset Gordon's scoring ability and lack of defensive size (assuming hinrich or Duhon is traded).

And lets not forget we need size on the front line.

I think this draft is almost exlusively dependent on two factors: The development of Deng and Gordon (if they take MAJOR leaps forward, it will allow us to look at this draft a bit differently), and how poorly the knicks do, and how lucky we are with the lottery balls.

We'll see.


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## rlucas4257

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SausageKingofChicago said:


> You know if Luol had of stayed in school 2 more years and had the luxury of developing his outside shot more and handles at this easier level down..he would be all over Gay and ( in my mind ) an absolute slam dunk #1 pick
> 
> No doubts
> 
> We have our horse . Noc too
> 
> If we pick up a swing prospect in Brewer and add a younger swing vet like Salmons or Welsch in free agency ..we really have no use for Rudy Gay other than to trade the pick for another need


There can be no doubt that the Deng is going to be a very good playter. But have you seen Gay play? I mean, he is more athletic, has those handles and is more polished offensively, IE can get his own shot, break down his guy and create for others. Deng is a better defender. I think Gay ultimately will be the better player but its not like the Bulls need a 3, but you dont pass easily on a guy who has some skills reminiscent of Grant Hill. And no, Deng will never be as good as Hill was at the top of his game IMO. I dont think your either giving Gay his just due or know enough about him to say Deng is the better player. But I dont disagree that Deng will be a good to very good player in the NBA. My hats off to Basghetti for going to bat very hard for Deng that year.


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## rlucas4257

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The Krakken said:


> Does he really look that special. Admittedly I haven't watched him alot, but in the little bit I have watched, I've seen absolutely nothing that makes me go "WOW"........yet.
> 
> Gay may indeed be "McGrady" to Deng's "Artest", but the only way I take him, EVEN with the FIRST PICK, is if Deng or Nocioni develop to such a tremendous degree as to make the other expedable entirely. I don't see Gay coming in and dominating at this level right away, as he doesn't appear to do so even at the college level yet even as a sophomore (something Deng clearly did as a freshman). And so Ironically, my desire for GAY may indeed be linked to Dengs (or Nocioni's) ability to clearly demonstrate that he (pick one) is better than Gay RIGHT NOW (or when Gay is drafted). I'm not interested in throwing someone in the starting lineup who clearly isn't a starter yet in the NBA, and I'm not convinced he will be as a rookie.
> 
> What impresses me most about Deng was his ability to dominate the college game without taking a ton of shots. Its a trait that is BEGINNING to be expressed in his NBA game and IMHO will continue to do so increasingly as he finds his post game in the pros. AFAIK, Gay is an unknown commodity, because while he is clearly a super athlete, he seems to lack intensity at times and gets lost in the game (oddly enough, similar to gordon last year and early on this year).
> 
> Maybe its just me.
> 
> The other thing to consider is that the current guard trio of hinrich/duhon/Gordon is not likely to exist in its current form long term. If Gordon is unable to rest the starting job from Duhon or Hinrich, he is likely to be traded (I don't think this will happen though). If he DOES wrest the starting job away, hinrich or duhon could be on the block. This means we will either need a) a dominant scorer who is a threat to score every time he touches it (if gordon is traded) and maybe Gay can be that guy, OR we will need b) a BIG playmaker that can handle to ball to offset Gordon's scoring ability and lack of defensive size (assuming hinrich or Duhon is traded).
> 
> And lets not forget we need size on the front line.
> 
> I think this draft is almost exlusively dependent on two factors: The development of Deng and Gordon (if they take MAJOR leaps forward, it will allow us to look at this draft a bit differently), and how poorly the knicks do, and how lucky we are with the lottery balls.
> 
> We'll see.



I agree with the hope that Aldridge is the pick. I just think he makes more sense for what the Bulls need. I really like Ajinca, if he is available or Vinicius. Among the reasons I like those 2 with the second pick is that Bulls could have the option of keeping them overseas and letting them develop. Ajinca, probably, would need it. I think Vinicius can play now.


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## rlucas4257

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SausageKingofChicago said:


> I hear ya
> 
> I think Splitter will likely go top 5 with Gay, Bellini , Aldridge and Gibson
> 
> Collins ..yeah he's interesting but is he another Reece Gaines ?
> 
> Brewer has really come out this year and is kicking butt.. I'm seeing him at an Igoudala level which is why I want him with a first pick if we're high enough
> 
> I mean ..with the way it looks at the moment- if we came out of the draft with Brewer and Davis I'd be pumped


I dont know anything about Brewer, can you tell me something about him?


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## SausageKingofChicago

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rlucas4257 said:


> I dont know anything about Brewer, can you tell me something about him?


Come now 

A draft addict such as yourself..I find that hard to believe..someone that watches every known game of basketball being played on the planet and who is a Scout himself with mega contacts ?


In short ..I don't believe you 

Anyway..Arkansas aren't hard to find on ESPN if you want to learn more of the guy


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## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Having watched Gay in a few games, I don't see what makes him so special.

Dwyane Wade, at Marquette... you got the feeling he was going to be really special. 
Okafor coming out of UConn... he played on a completely different level. 
Carmelo Anthony, for sure, was going to be an undoubtedly huge hit... you could see it all through that magical season for them. 
Chris Paul, most people could tell was seriously special, despite his size (I didn't actually see that specialness, but I didn't fully appreciate his raw speed). 
Richard Jefferson, at Arizona, looked like he'd become one of the premier defenders in the pros. 
Jason Richardson looked like a serious pro while at Mich State, by the way he jumped out of the gym and played physical, if not skilled, in every other aspect of the game.

Guys that DIDN'T look special but seem to be good as pros: 
Deron Williams (so solid, great team success, easily could have been terrible)
Elton Brand (dominant at Duke but who knew what that meant back then?)
Shawn Marion from UNLV, etc.

Guys that DID look a little bit special but aren't terribly awesome: 
Eddie Griffin at Seton Hall
Juan Dixon at Maryland
Wally Szcerbiak at Miami of Ohio (does anyone remember how insane he was? he was a completely sick ball of physical energy for that team, way way more than just a shooter)
Kenyon Martin at Cincy (what a terribly weak draft)
Erick Barkley from St. John's (I thought that this kid might have been the best PG in the whole draft).

Rudy Gay looks like he's in the category of looks sort of special but might not be terribly awesome. The kid is really skilled and has good athleticism, but I'm not so sure that he'll become a McGrady like player. And in my book, Deng is on his way to being a really solid starting SF, like a Mashburn.

If we had the #1 pick, I'd definitely trade it. Look for the Hornets' picks, as they'll end up in the late lottery and mid-round as they own Milwaukee's pick (Magloire trade). If we can trade down to get #10 and #16, for our #1 and a future second rounder or something, then we might be able to grab Shelden Williams at 10, Josh Boone at 16 and Mardy Collins at 17 (although they say that Mardy is on his way to the lottery with the way he's playing ball).


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Come now
> 
> A draft addict such as yourself..I find that hard to believe..someone that watches every known game of basketball being played on the planet and who is a Scout himself with mega contacts ?
> 
> 
> In short ..I don't believe you
> 
> Anyway..Arkansas aren't hard to find on ESPN if you want to learn more of the guy


Real nice answer. I dont understand the need to mock me. Just a simple question. I am not much of an Arkansas fan. I really turn on to see some Pac 10, some ACC, some Big East and some select teams who play a style I like, such as Gonzaga. I dont follow the SEC, Big 10 or the Big 12 (with the exception of seeing Texas play a few times due to my interest in Aldridge). I guess I thought I could learn something from you about a player alot of people find appealing, but I guess your above sharing your info with a guy like me.


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## JPBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> I really like Ajinca, if he is available or Vinicius. Among the reasons I like those 2 with the second pick is that Bulls could have the option of keeping them overseas and letting them develop. Ajinca, probably, would need it. I think Vinicius can play now.


There´s no way Vinicius will play overseas. He bought him out of a contract with an Italian Team so he could go to the US in the start of the practices for the draft. He is playing now in Brazil just in waiting mode. He had an amazing year last year almost leading his team to the italian first division, the last time I saw him play was 1,5 years ago, I think one game of his team will go in cabel next week, but I think he is more a 3 than a 2 right now. Its too bad he had a fight with the brazilian NT coach and didn´t play for Brazil this year ( and probably wont play in the World Championship 2, for 2 reason the fight and another more complex about the division that is occuring in the basketball scene in Brazil right now).

I was in love with his game when I could see him playing, he probably improved a lot, I would like to see if he is able to guard SG now. If I remember correct Rlucas once said that "if he had a gun in his face to choose betwen Marcus Vinicius, Deng and Iggy he would choose Marcus Vinicius", well I wouldnt go so far now, but that was a hell of a compliment especially after how good Deng and Iggy are playing.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JPBulls said:


> There´s no way Vinicius will play overseas. He bought him out of a contract with an Italian Team so he could go to the US in the start of the practices for the draft. He is playing now in Brazil just in waiting mode. He had an amazing year last year almost leading his team to the italian first division, the last time I saw him play was 1,5 years ago, I think one game of his team will go in cabel next week, but I think he is more a 3 than a 2 right now. Its too bad he had a fight with the brazilian NT coach and didn´t play for Brazil this year ( and probably wont play in the World Championship 2, for 2 reason the fight and another more complex about the division that is occuring in the basketball scene in Brazil right now).
> 
> I was in love with his game when I could see him playing, he probably improved a lot, I would like to see if he is able to guard SG now. If I remember correct Rlucas once said that "if he had a gun in his face to choose betwen Marcus Vinicius, Deng and Iggy he would choose Marcus Vinicius", well I wouldnt go so far now, but that was a hell of a compliment especially after how good Deng and Iggy are playing.


Hi JP.

I cant recall saying that but perhaps I did. I really liked the kid. I made up my mind prior to that draft that I was for Iggy. But it was close, and I still think its far closer then the draft intelligensia has it. He has such a smooth game, so versatile, athletic, skilled, that you cant but help by being impressed with him. He has never seemed to find the spotlight that his game deserves however. Ill be in Brasil in January for a week so I hope to catch a game of his. The last I saw of him was last season, and you could see his game came a long ways. I rate him as the best Brazilian prospect in this draft, over the highly touted Tiago Splitter, whom I also like. I also think he can reach the level achieved by Nene and Barbosa. And by the way, Barbosa, before his injury, was looking like a flat out stud. I loved him prior to his draft. But take my love of Brazilian players with a grain of salt. My mother was brazilian so I tend to be 100% supportive of the country in general.


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## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> There can be no doubt that the Deng is going to be a very good playter. But have you seen Gay play? I mean, he is more athletic, has those handles and is more polished offensively, IE can get his own shot, break down his guy and create for others. Deng is a better defender. I think Gay ultimately will be the better player but its not like the Bulls need a 3, but you dont pass easily on a guy who has some skills reminiscent of Grant Hill. And no, Deng will never be as good as Hill was at the top of his game IMO. I dont think your either giving Gay his just due or know enough about him to say Deng is the better player. But I dont disagree that Deng will be a good to very good player in the NBA. My hats off to Basghetti for going to bat very hard for Deng that year.


My point was was that Deng could have stayed and developed more and had he have done so , without definitive proof being able to be offered conclusively , I think he would have been more highly regarded than Rudy Gay

Deng has come to the pro's and like his time at Duke plays in a tight system with controlling taskmasters like Coach K and Skiles - different in persona - but very controlling in how they puppeteer their players . He where he has had a defined role at both stops along the way which is perhaps kept the lid on his overall skill showcase in what he is "allowed" and "not allowed" to do 

Had Luol stayed at Duke , as is the Duke way , I think he would have undoubtedly been the featured player the last 2 years and consequently would have been able to refine and showcase his skills better 

I mean 2 years ago ..Shelly Williams was poo poo'ed as scrubola and thought he had severe limitations as a pro . If he had of come out 2 years ago who would have picked Shelly above Nick Collison , David West or Mike Sweetney ? Collison and West were Seniors ..but now that Shelly is a Senior and is beasting it up in the post in the ACC he is an absolute lock for the first half of the lottery ....call it a Carlos Boozer styled cautionary tail

Anyway back on track ...Jim Calhoun seems to be a bit more freewheeling and if the skill is there he turns his guys loose who may get to showcase and develop earlier in his program compared to the "under wraps" approach of some of the Duke talent 

Deng has a greater base skill level than what a lot of people realise IMO..he will just develop his a little more gradually in the pros ..but I do think you undersell him some ..just as you think I don't give Gay his due - which is not to say I don't think he's a talent. He is . 

I see him a bit like a Marvin Williams talent ( not precisely per se ..but in terms of impact ) 

I think Deng could make a bigger difference on a crappier team than what a Marvin Williams ( and I suspect ) a Rudy Gay could 

Fact is - Deng did


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Guys ... Marco's surname is Belinelli, not Bellini :raised_ey


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Real nice answer. I dont understand the need to mock me. Just a simple question. I am not much of an Arkansas fan. I really turn on to see some Pac 10, some ACC, some Big East and some select teams who play a style I like, such as Gonzaga. I dont follow the SEC, Big 10 or the Big 12 (with the exception of seeing Texas play a few times due to my interest in Aldridge). I guess I thought I could learn something from you about a player alot of people find appealing, but I guess your above sharing your info with a guy like me.


Well given your past history this is all very poor victimised me of you 

But anyway.... on form he is probably the best on ball and lane hawking guard /swing player in the draft 

He can handle ...drive and kick and his shooting - always considered a bit suss ..has really improved this season so far

He's doing it against quality opposition on this level - UConn, Kansas, Missouri..every game 

He's got it all going on ...plays controlled ..and has all the physical tools with real length and speed

Unfortunately I think he'll be gone by the time the Knicks and Bulls come around to pick


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> And I don't think Deng gets the love from some quarters on this board that he deserves
> 
> To me ..it feels he really is on the cusp of being quite a special player - it was true before he went down with his wrist injury and he is just starting to find his rythym again right now
> 
> By the 2nd half of this season I think we all may be gobsmacked at the player he's becoming
> 
> You can see it in him



Well there you go

We're short handed with Kirk and Tyson down tonight and Deng just takes this game by the scruff of the neck and goes off for a few assists , a couple of steals .. 10 + boards and 20 something points

Plus Turkoglu is a 13 ppg scorer and a 40% 3 point shooter who gets held to 12 and 20% from 3

That's stepping up folks


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> My point was was that Deng could have stayed and developed more and had he have done so , without definitive proof being able to be offered conclusively , I think he would have been more highly regarded than Rudy Gay
> 
> Deng has come to the pro's and like his time at Duke plays in a tight system with controlling taskmasters like Coach K and Skiles - different in persona - but very controlling in how they puppeteer their players . He where he has had a defined role at both stops along the way which is perhaps kept the lid on his overall skill showcase in what he is "allowed" and "not allowed" to do
> 
> Had Luol stayed at Duke , as is the Duke way , I think he would have undoubtedly been the featured player the last 2 years and consequently would have been able to refine and showcase his skills better
> 
> I mean 2 years ago ..Shelly Williams was poo poo'ed as scrubola and thought he had severe limitations as a pro . If he had of come out 2 years ago who would have picked Shelly above Nick Collison , David West or Mike Sweetney ? Collison and West were Seniors ..but now that Shelly is a Senior and is beasting it up in the post in the ACC he is an absolute lock for the first half of the lottery ....call it a Carlos Boozer styled cautionary tail
> 
> Anyway back on track ...Jim Calhoun seems to be a bit more freewheeling and if the skill is there he turns his guys loose who may get to showcase and develop earlier in his program compared to the "under wraps" approach of some of the Duke talent
> 
> Deng has a greater base skill level than what a lot of people realise IMO..he will just develop his a little more gradually in the pros ..but I do think you undersell him some ..just as you think I don't give Gay his due - which is not to say I don't think he's a talent. He is .
> 
> I see him a bit like a Marvin Williams talent ( not precisely per se ..but in terms of impact )
> 
> I think Deng could make a bigger difference on a crappier team than what a Marvin Williams ( and I suspect ) a Rudy Gay could
> 
> Fact is - Deng did



Good point on the coaching. Deng has been held back and might have seen his growth accelerated if given more of a chance to develop rather then having to play in a system.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Yo Rlucus,

Care to make and predictions about the French national team in 2008. Arg will have basically the same team and the USA will try to put together the next dream team but it seems that France will be able to put together quite an experienced team as well with along of both NBA and internional experience.

david


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giusd said:


> Yo Rlucus,
> 
> Care to make and predictions about the French national team in 2008. Arg will have basically the same team and the USA will try to put together the next dream team but it seems that France will be able to put together quite an experienced team as well with along of both NBA and internional experience.
> 
> david


I mean the French team is interesting in that itll be as athletic as any team in the world. Parker, the Pietrus brothers, Mahinmi, Diaw, Gelabale, Petro and maybe this Ajinca kid can compete. I dont think they win the gold medal however because there are too many chiefs and not enough Indians so to speak. But as I have been saying for 2-3 years, France is a hotbed for basketball talent. And its coming mostly from Guadelope. Its sort of like what Croatia and Serbia Montenegro were 5-8 years ago. Alot of this might also be due to the high african population there. Basketball is growing by leaps in Africa and most of their players end up in the french league. There is a kid there whose name skips me now who is openly compared to Dominique Wilkens who is a couple of years away who is from Senegal. I guess the world is getting smaller, not just in basketball but for lots of things. But in terms if basketball, it does appear that the Frenchies are embracing these other kids to develop in their league. So far its working for them.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> There can be no doubt that the Deng is going to be a very good playter. But have you seen Gay play? I mean, he is more athletic, has those handles and is more polished offensively, IE can get his own shot, break down his guy and create for others. Deng is a better defender. I think Gay ultimately will be the better player but its not like the Bulls need a 3, but you dont pass easily on a guy who has some skills reminiscent of Grant Hill. And no, Deng will never be as good as Hill was at the top of his game IMO. I dont think your either giving Gay his just due or know enough about him to say Deng is the better player. But I dont disagree that Deng will be a good to very good player in the NBA. My hats off to Basghetti for going to bat very hard for Deng that year.


I wonder if the lackluster performance of Marvin Williams (assuming it stays at least somewhat lackluster) will scare teams off Gay a little. I haven't seen a ton of him but the knock you hear from people as that he's very gifted but not very assertive - basically the same thing people were saying about Williams last year...


----------



## JPBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Hi JP.
> 
> I cant recall saying that but perhaps I did. I really liked the kid. I made up my mind prior to that draft that I was for Iggy. But it was close, and I still think its far closer then the draft intelligensia has it. He has such a smooth game, so versatile, athletic, skilled, that you cant but help by being impressed with him. He has never seemed to find the spotlight that his game deserves however. Ill be in Brasil in January for a week so I hope to catch a game of his. The last I saw of him was last season, and you could see his game came a long ways. I rate him as the best Brazilian prospect in this draft, over the highly touted Tiago Splitter, whom I also like. I also think he can reach the level achieved by Nene and Barbosa. And by the way, Barbosa, before his injury, was looking like a flat out stud. I loved him prior to his draft. But take my love of Brazilian players with a grain of salt. My mother was brazilian so I tend to be 100% supportive of the country in general.


After I saw Spliiter play with the NT I became in love with his game... His man to man defense is just AMAZING!! Having a chat with him after a practice he had with the NT in a club that i´m associeted helped the cause too, but he is a hell of a player... But he really need to work his FT shoot, i think he is having those kinds of block like Duncan sometimes have, ( he was a 80% shooter 3 years ago). 


And a lot off topic: Barbosa was just playing amazing, he is a SG with some PG skills, if the Suns continues to let him play SG they will have a 17/20 PPG player no latter than next year. And yes, i´m suspect too to talk about brazilian players...


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JPBulls said:


> After I saw Spliiter play with the NT I became in love with his game... His man to man defense is just AMAZING!! Having a chat with him after a practice he had with the NT in a club that i´m associeted helped the cause too, but he is a hell of a player... But he really need to work his FT shoot, i think he is having those kinds of block like Duncan sometimes have, ( he was a 80% shooter 3 years ago).
> 
> 
> And a lot off topic: Barbosa was just playing amazing, he is a SG with some PG skills, if the Suns continues to let him play SG they will have a 17/20 PPG player no latter than next year. And yes, i´m suspect too to talk about brazilian players...



Splitter certainly has a chance at being a very high quality big in the NBA. Brazilian or no, that can not be denied. He is just really a smart player with good strength and athleticism. But I really like his motor and his intelligence. His offense has a ways to go, but itll come.

A couple of years ago I did have the gall of saying that I would rather have Barbosa then Hinrich. And I got laughed off the board for saying that. Now, I admit Hinrich is a better well rounded player but the difference, atleast early this year, wasnt as great as some may think. Certainly not 20 draft spots. This kid plays in your shirt D, has a world class range and speed. But he doesnt play with Hinrichs head yet. If he did, I would be willing to revisit my original argument. But man, he really improved this year. He would be on my FA wish list, even if we are stacked with players like him, because he is right now a better shooter (Gordon can get him on some nights, but 52% from the floor and 41% from 3pt land early this year) and defender then any of our 3 little guards. Though he really needs to learn how to play controlled basketball and learn how to take advantage of the athletic advantage that he has on just about everyone in the league at his spot. With his length, speed and hops, he shouldnt have to settle on 3pters every time, even if he has a good 3 pt stroke. He said he learned alot playing with Nash. Lets see if he can apply that beyond ten games. But the early results were encouraging. 

There was some brazilian pg last year and im not sure if he was drafted or not. jp, do you remember his name cause its skipping me now?

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/leandro_barbosa/index.html?nav=page


----------



## Swan

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Marcelo Huertas?? is the only Brazilian pg I can think of that you might be thinking about. I don't think he ended up declaring though.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Swan said:


> Marcelo Huertas?? is the only Brazilian pg I can think of that you might be thinking about. I don't think he ended up declaring though.


Bingo. Thanks. That was killing me. I couldnt think of his name. 2 years ago he declared then pulled out and I thought he was in last year but apparently not. Can you tell me whats going on with him? I only saw tape of him but he certainly looked no worse then competent in the stuff that I saw.


----------



## JPBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> There was some brazilian pg last year and im not sure if he was drafted or not. jp, do you remember his name cause its skipping me now?


I think you are talking about Marcelo Huertas, he is really a nice guy, i talked about 10 minutes with him (he didn´t have any jornalist looking for him, everybody wanted Barbosa, Splitter and Varejão), but he was really unimpressive playing with the NT 3 months ago. He had a couple of big night playing at the ACB this year but at least for now he isn´t a NBA player, i dont think he can be considered a project too, he will probably continues to play in Europe. And he is small, he is just a little higher than me, and I´m about 6´tall (1,85 m).

Off topic too: You said earlier that liked to see Gonzaga games, any word on JP Batista?? ( He is called the same name as me, João Paulo) He is having a great stats season, i know that he is small and not athletic enough for NBA standarts, but can he help the Brazilian team and have a good career in Europe?? Or even dream with making the end of the bench for some NBA team???


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JPBulls said:


> I think you are talking about Marcelo Huertas, he is really a nice guy, i talked about 10 minutes with him (he didn´t have any jornalist looking for him, everybody wanted Barbosa, Splitter and Varejão), but he was really unimpressive playing with the NT 3 months ago. He had a couple of big night playing at the ACB this year but at least for now he isn´t a NBA player, i dont think he can be considered a project too, he will probably continues to play in Europe. And he is small, he is just a little higher than me, and I´m about 6´tall (1,85 m).
> 
> Off topic too: You said earlier that liked to see Gonzaga games, any word on JP Batista?? ( He is called the same name as me, João Paulo) He is having a great stats season, i know that he is small and not athletic enough for NBA standarts, but can he help the Brazilian team and have a good career in Europe?? Or even dream with making the end of the bench for some NBA team???


Before talking about Batista, how is Anderson Varajao doing? Is he over his injury yet? I just havent followed his progress to closely.

As for Batista, my hunch is that he will bounce between Europe and the league for a couple of years and then settle in either or. As much as I love Gonzagas style and Morrisons and Batistas game, I always take players in those systems with a grain of salt. Its so free flowing, so unconstrained, so quick that when you take them out of systems like that and slow things down in more of a set environment then they arent the players that you thought they were cracked up to be. I think Morrison would be tremendous for a team like Phoenix, or Seattle or even GS. But put him on Chicago or Houston, where everything is controlled, and I see a Luke Jackson bust. Same thing happened to Luke and to Dan Dickau, other players from that system or similar. Morrison is good, but I just dont think he is good enough to transcend styles to succeed. Batista is the same way. I dont know if he is that good because it might be the system. But something tells me he could adapt to a slower game. I certainly will be watching.


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## JPBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Before talking about Batista, how is Anderson Varajao doing? Is he over his injury yet? I just havent followed his progress to closely.


I saw the game were he injured, it was such a bad luck. ( That all brazilians are facing in the NBA this season, Nene is out for the season in a contract year, Barbosa injured when he was playing the best ball of his life, Rafael Araujo is just a bust...) He started doing no contact drills last week I think, he is scheduled to come back in February. He would fill nicely in the Bulls, we could really use his rebounding. What a steal for the Cavs him and Gooden for Battie.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

This thread needs more James Augustine love. He's underrated and would be a good player to have with our 2nd pick (which I anticipate being lower than many of you guys think).

As far as Ronnie Brewer, I'm partial to Corey Brewer myself.


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Frankensteiner said:


> This thread needs more James Augustine love. He's underrated and would be a good player to have with our 2nd pick (which I anticipate being lower than many of you guys think).


2nd pick in the first round?
It seems like most places are talking about him going in the 2nd round.
http://draftexpress.com/mock.php?y=2006

I'd love to pick him up, I'm a big fan, though admittedly somewhat biased.


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Nah, I don't think Augustine's game is going to translate. He's also a little small in size to be an NBA center. I don't think he's got the NBA goods, and I certainly don't see him as a first rounder.

Paul Davis, on the other hand, would be a real good pick in the middle of the first round. I still can't tell if I think he is lotto worthy just yet.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JRose5 said:


> 2nd pick in the first round?
> It seems like most places are talking about him going in the 2nd round.
> http://draftexpress.com/mock.php?y=2006
> 
> I'd love to pick him up, I'm a big fan, though admittedly somewhat biased.


I don't agree with pegging him as a 2nd rounder. He's better than many of the PF/C guys listed.

Augustine will be a Nick Collison/Reggie Evans-type player IMO, and since Augustine is a better athlete than Collison, I think he'll be successful in his role. Guys like Paul Davis (who's ranked ahead of him according to that site) may have a better skill set (i.e. a back to the basket game) but no one is going to depend on them for scoring anyway, and Paul Davis isn't a great athlete.

Nick Fazekas? He's a skinny version of Darius Songaila. Nothing special.


----------



## Babble-On

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Is Randolph Morris any good? He's now considered a free agent. I only saw him play against Dwight Howard in high school, and he looked pretty good.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Nah, I don't think Augustine's game is going to translate. He's also a little small in size to be an NBA center. I don't think he's got the NBA goods, and I certainly don't see him as a first rounder.
> 
> Paul Davis, on the other hand, would be a real good pick in the middle of the first round. I still can't tell if I think he is lotto worthy just yet.


LOL. Well, we totally disagree. :cheers:

EDIT: When I look at Paul Davis, I just see someone like Sean May or Wayne Simien, better college players than pro-players. Augustine is a way underrated athlete (great run & jump athlete for a PF) and he'll be more useful in his NBA niche.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Frankensteiner said:


> LOL. Well, we totally disagree. :cheers:


Augustine is listed at 6'10" 235lbs. Davis is listed at 6'11" 270 on ESPN. One of these guys is a true NBA center and one is not. That alone changes their value dramatically. Meanwhile, Davis is averaging 20/10 while Augustine is averaging 16/9. Augustine certainly brings some energy, but he doesn't have the skill set to really thrive in a league full of Duncans, Garnetts, and Brands. Meanwhile, Davis has a nice skill set and the size you really want, and I could see him being a legit starting center in the league. I wouldn't expect great things from him, but he has the potential to be very solid. 

The more I look at Davis' production, the less I feel we would be likely to find him available with a late lotto pick that we might have.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Augustine is listed at 6'10" 235lbs. Davis is listed at 6'11" 270 on ESPN. One of these guys is a true NBA center and one is not. That alone changes their value dramatically. Meanwhile, Davis is averaging 20/10 while Augustine is averaging 16/9. Augustine certainly brings some energy, but he doesn't have the skill set to really thrive in a league full of Duncans, Garnetts, and Brands. Meanwhile, Davis has a nice skill set and the size you really want, and I could see him being a legit starting center in the league. I wouldn't expect great things from him, but he has the potential to be very solid.
> 
> The more I look at Davis' production, the less I feel we would be likely to find him available with a late lotto pick that we might have.


I'm not saying Augustine is a starter, he's a backup rebounding/running the court type PF (not a C) player. Paul Davis, OTOH, yeah he's got a better skill set in college, but I don't see it as being good enough for him to use in the NBA. He certainly has good size but so does Rafael Araujo, and he isn't doing so well in Toronto.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Frankensteiner said:


> I'm not saying Augustine is a starter, he's a backup rebounding/running the court type PF (not a C) player. Paul Davis, OTOH, yeah he's got a better skill set in college, but I don't see it as being good enough for him to use in the NBA. He certainly has good size but so does Rafael Araujo, and he isn't doing so well in Toronto.


Davis has faced considerably higher competition than Araujo as being a four year player at MSU as opposed to BYU, no? Can't we trust his stats a little bit more?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

The first pick should definetely go towards size, and hopefully polished size at that. The second pick should be a bit of a flyer. I want big upside, high ceiling, athletic and hopefully versatile. He could be another big or a 2 guard. This kid from MSU doesnt really fit that mold IMO.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> The first pick should definetely go towards size, and hopefully polished size at that. The second pick should be a bit of a flyer. I want big upside, high ceiling, athletic and hopefully versatile. He could be another big or a 2 guard. This kid from MSU doesnt really fit that mold IMO.


Wait, who are you talking about (the kid from MSU)? Davis has great size? Are you speaking of Ager with our second first rounder?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Wait, who are you talking about (the kid from MSU)? Davis has great size? Are you speaking of Ager with our second first rounder?


Hey DMD

Im talking about Davis. We can be more exciting then him with our second first rounder. He doesnt deserve a whiff with our first rounder, IMO. I dont know Ager so I cant comment. With the second first rounder, I want to be a little exciting/different. Get a guy like Ajinca, or Marquinhos, or for a less gambling, someone like Splitter if he is still there. I want James White in round 2. Pax has proven that he likes the proven college player. But he needs to go for the home run with his second first rounder. He needs to think outside of the box. Ideally, I want length, athletic ability, someone with a real high ceiling and someone with versatility.


----------



## Swan

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I don't think we have a second round pick this year, just to clarify for discussion. It's owed to Utah from Houston from the ill-fated Bryce Drew Trade. Two seconds in 07 though.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Just looking at the composition of this draft vs 2007s crop, would there be any way we could take NYs pick and deal it for a 2007 pick, similar to what Phoenix did? More size and ability in the 2007 draft. Lots of European guards in this draft who wouldnt bring what we need at that spot.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Babble-On said:


> Is Randolph Morris any good? He's now considered a free agent. I only saw him play against Dwight Howard in high school, and he looked pretty good.



Yeah he has some size and some skills for his size, still a bit of a project in the NBA I think but I was just thinking this morning that the Bulls should try to ink him to a 3year deal, worst case scenario he is a back up big, best case he is soft or a David West like guy.


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## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Hey DMD
> 
> Im talking about Davis. We can be more exciting then him with our second first rounder. He doesnt deserve a whiff with our first rounder, IMO. I dont know Ager so I cant comment. With the second first rounder, I want to be a little exciting/different. Get a guy like Ajinca, or Marquinhos, or for a less gambling, someone like Splitter if he is still there. I want James White in round 2. Pax has proven that he likes the proven college player. But he needs to go for the home run with his second first rounder. He needs to think outside of the box. Ideally, I want length, athletic ability, someone with a real high ceiling and someone with versatility.


And basketball IQ would be handy too


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Just looking at the composition of this draft vs 2007s crop, would there be any way we could take NYs pick and deal it for a 2007 pick, similar to what Phoenix did? More size and ability in the 2007 draft. Lots of European guards in this draft who wouldnt bring what we need at that spot.


This is a sound idea although 2007 looks like a bigman motherload ..while 2006 looks light on 

I wouldn't be surprised if some bigs projected for 2007 declare early to ensure better positioning in a weaker big man draft which 2006 is shaping as

Kaun and Giles could go early..Hibbert too

If they put up decent seasons the 3 of them could well be lottery this year at the expense of guys like Reddick, Tomas , Belinelli , Carney , Fazekas , ..and maybe even Rondo - although Gibson and Rondo are the only points at this stage that may come out and have a run and be legit enough to be lottery picks

If Kaun, Giles and Hibbert come out early it will really weaken the true big man depth of 2007 IMO


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> This is a sound idea although 2007 looks like a bigman motherload ..while 2006 looks light on
> 
> I wouldn't be surprised if some bigs projected for 2007 declare early to ensure better positioning in a weaker big man draft which 2006 is shaping as
> 
> Kaun and Giles could go early..Hibbert too
> 
> If they put up decent seasons the 3 of them could well be lottery this year at the expense of guys like Reddick, Tomas , Belinelli , Carney , Fazekas , ..and maybe even Rondo - although Gibson and Rondo are the only points at this stage that may come out and have a run and be legit enough to be lottery picks
> 
> If Kaun, Giles and Hibbert come out early it will really weaken the true big man depth of 2007 IMO


Good observation. I was thinking the same thing. Not only on size, but on talent, 2007 looks really good. But some of that, if possible, could find itself in 2006. 

Fazekas is a player mentioned alot in draft intelligensia and I cant say I have seen him play. How would he fit into the Bulls and does he have the athleticism that this club could use along the front line?


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Just looking at the composition of this draft vs 2007s crop, would there be any way we could take NYs pick and deal it for a 2007 pick, similar to what Phoenix did? More size and ability in the 2007 draft. Lots of European guards in this draft who wouldnt bring what we need at that spot.


Lucas, something that was stirring in my brain, the other day.

If our NY pick lucked out and turned into something pretty high, do you or anyone else think a deal for our pick to Phoenix for Boris Diaw and one or both of the 1st round picks that they got from the Atl trade might work? 

If Phoenix thought that our pick might give them a good shot at LaMarcus Aldridge or or the Italian guy, the temptation to put one of them next to Amare I would have to think would be pretty tempting. 

And for us, Diaw would play great with any of our guards, and fills our hole at the 2 guard adequately and cost effectively, and losing the draft pick maximizes our cap flexibility this year, and the pick we'd be getting later would probably forecast to somewhere around the mid-lottery in a big heavy draft.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Good observation. I was thinking the same thing. Not only on size, but on talent, 2007 looks really good. But some of that, if possible, could find itself in 2006.
> 
> Fazekas is a player mentioned alot in draft intelligensia and I cant say I have seen him play. How would he fit into the Bulls and does he have the athleticism that this club could use along the front line?


First off..let me say that I have only seen a DVD of packaged clips where he features and I have not seen him play a complete game 

Bulls brass tend to go with guys with other attributes other than crazy athleticism and not much else

Maybe the Corey Benjamin era prohibits James White type signings 

Anyway... Fazekas is not uber athletic but he doesn't strike me as deficient either. He moves fluently off the ball and offensively he likes to pivot and pop J's on fades. He has a decent enough face up J in a mid range game . Can pass well enough ..although passing is more well decisioned / kick out based ( well coached ) but I wonder whether he is a guy who can create plays from the paint with a kick arse interior passing game - like Bogut can , like Chris Webber can , Shaq, Brad Miller, Kukoc, Longley, Divac ..big men like this who can/could really pass and create from the paint

We play such a pick and roll type mid range offense which extends out deeper when our guards are on . 

Sweetney has shown good things as a guy who can create a load upfront and kick out..although I think we're under using Sweetney here given that the majority of our offense is coming from our guards - but that's another story

Songaila is more a high post passing / pick and roll player 

Fazekas is somewhere between the two ..I think he is a guy that can make passing plays like these two can but he's not a guy that I don't think has anything close to the array of pure back to the basket post moves that Sweetney has got and I doubt will be strong enough to hold his own in the paint right away

His spin and pop move ...is he strong enough to take the contact ? crisp /quick enough in its execution at the next level for it not to be fodder for oppositions with strong shot blockers? Will he have to develop as a face up shooting big man to complement someone that is more a pure post player like Sweetney?

Bottom line..he's not a highlight reel / above the rim fantasy player but he's a guy that appears to be well coached , seems to makes good decisions about passing and taking his own offense .. can shoot facing up and can move with the ball on the run ( IE catch on the move and dribble and take it in )

He's got some basketball skills but at the NBA level I don't see him as dominant but will get :

1.Catch/Run/Dribble n Flip or Dunk opportunities 

2.Face up opportunities 

Because he can dribble and likes that spin and pop move ..I wonder how that will work out for him at the NBA level and whether he will be strong enough to take the contact and quick enough in his feet and J release ???

Gets a lot of rebounds at this level because he is a legit 6'10 guy ( don't know what his wingspan is but he seems quite gangly with his arms ) but positions himself well and seems to kind of have an innate feel for where he needs to be 

He's a guy that should come out this year because I don't see him as Top 5 pick quality even if he stays all 4 years . He's putting up good numbers this year and he will fall into the back half of this lottery ..but likely the same position next year if he stays 

So why not now ? He would be crazy not to

NB : Went off on Kaun and Giles for 35 and 8 with 2 assists a week or so ago..Kaun was best for the Jayhawks with 19 and 9 ..Giles more a non factor in that game


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rosenthall said:


> Lucas, something that was stirring in my brain, the other day.
> 
> If our NY pick lucked out and turned into something pretty high, do you or anyone else think a deal for our pick to Phoenix for Boris Diaw and one or both of the 1st round picks that they got from the Atl trade might work?
> 
> If Phoenix thought that our pick might give them a good shot at LaMarcus Aldridge or or the Italian guy, the temptation to put one of them next to Amare I would have to think would be pretty tempting.
> 
> And for us, Diaw would play great with any of our guards, and fills our hole at the 2 guard adequately and cost effectively, and losing the draft pick maximizes our cap flexibility this year, and the pick we'd be getting later would probably forecast to somewhere around the mid-lottery in a big heavy draft.


Diaw is turned out nice but he's not worth a lottery pick IMO


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Sorry if it's already been discussed in here, though I didn't see any mention, but what do you guys think of Redick with one of our picks? (assuming its in the teens somewhere)

He's playing like a madman against Texas right now, in the middle of the second half he has 28 points and the rest of his team has 29.

I believe he's about 6'4", 200 pounds, so he's got the height to play SG.

Anyone interested?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Rose,

Shooting is a premium in this league, and this guy is among the alltime greats in college ball. Reminds me of 3 guys. Glen Rice, in terms of shooting. Rice had a nice career. Steve Alford, didnt have much of a career. Rodney Monroe, no career. But this kid will make it. He might have problems creating his own shot at this level, but as a spot up guy or coming off a screen, he is absolutely deadly. His timing also couldnt be better. When Alford and Monroe were coming through the ranks, they got hurt by the NBAs desire to get bigger. But with the league getting smaller, Redick could definetely be a 2 guard in this league. He will make it, IMO, and have a nice 10 year career.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rosenthall said:


> Lucas, something that was stirring in my brain, the other day.
> 
> If our NY pick lucked out and turned into something pretty high, do you or anyone else think a deal for our pick to Phoenix for Boris Diaw and one or both of the 1st round picks that they got from the Atl trade might work?
> 
> If Phoenix thought that our pick might give them a good shot at LaMarcus Aldridge or or the Italian guy, the temptation to put one of them next to Amare I would have to think would be pretty tempting.
> 
> And for us, Diaw would play great with any of our guards, and fills our hole at the 2 guard adequately and cost effectively, and losing the draft pick maximizes our cap flexibility this year, and the pick we'd be getting later would probably forecast to somewhere around the mid-lottery in a big heavy draft.


I think Phoenix would want the kid from Italy with D'Antonis ties to the area. However, if we luck into that high a pick, we take Aldridge and call it a day. I like Diaw. I have been watching him for 5 years now. He is an intersting player in that he epitomizes 2 things, versatility and unselfishness. He really is a true PG. In fact, his weakness is that that he doesnt want to score. On defense, Phoenix has been using him everywhere, including the center spot. Yes, Im not kidding about that. All the Pau Kids are taught defense in a big way, dispelling the myth Euros dont D up. However, I dont think they would take Diaw for our second first rounder. However, he would be a high priority target when he goes to RFA in a years time.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ace20004u said:


> Yeah he has some size and some skills for his size, still a bit of a project in the NBA I think but I was just thinking this morning that the Bulls should try to ink him to a 3year deal, worst case scenario he is a back up big, best case he is soft or a David West like guy.


Worst case he's David West? David West is averaging 16 and 7. 

I don't like signing guys like Morris to be backup bigs because what you generally want from reserve frontcourt guys are things like rebounding and defense, which talented/raw/questionably motivated youngsters do not generally supply.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

OK, I'm starting to believe Morrison is the second coming... I have no idea how a guy with no speed, no knees, and no lift can be that good, but he'll figure out a way to do it.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JRose5 said:


> Sorry if it's already been discussed in here, though I didn't see any mention, but what do you guys think of Redick with one of our picks? (assuming its in the teens somewhere)
> 
> He's playing like a madman against Texas right now, in the middle of the second half he has 28 points and the rest of his team has 29.
> 
> I believe he's about 6'4", 200 pounds, so he's got the height to play SG.
> 
> Anyone interested?


Not me 

He's a guy at the college level that has been able to be negated at times with big ball pressure 

I agree with Frankensteiner 's comments on the Redick / Gordon thread that this will be a bigger problem at the NBA level 

I think he's a late first round pick for a team like the Mavs, Pistons , Suns and he would be a nice specialist


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Mikedc said:


> OK, I'm starting to believe Morrison is the second coming... I have no idea how a guy with no speed, no knees, and no lift can be that good, but he'll figure out a way to do it.



I like him too. But that system does have a way of making players look better then they are. Dan Dickau for instance. If he can play in the west on a wide open team (Phoenix, Seattle) he will thrive. But I think playing in the slug it out east (except NJ) he could struggle. But I tend to like players who thrive in space and this kid can do it. I would gamble on him, but with 2 legit big time prospects at the 3, I would probably pass


----------



## DaFuture

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

we wont draft him, and we dont need him but Jeff Green is going to be a great player out of Georgetown.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Thought I'd ask this question here. Has anyone seen Nick Fazekas play? Thoughts/opinions?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Eric Boateng sounds interesting? Thoughts?


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> Thought I'd ask this question here. Has anyone seen Nick Fazekas play? Thoughts/opinions?


Very skilled, good court sense, great touch. But he's extremely slow, doesn't have much lift, and could do with putting on a few pounds.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Somebody on realgm has pointed out that Reddick can create his own shot. They posted a link to several clips. I have noticed that this ability has increased during his Duke tenure. That being said, it's not a strong enough ability that I would expect him to be able to do it against NBA defenders. My guess is that he would revert to pretty much spot up shooting. 

Anyhow, check the clips out and see what you think:

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=447875&sid=188245ffb668e67d50b63d3b28c4f4f4


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> Thought I'd ask this question here. Has anyone seen Nick Fazekas play? Thoughts/opinions?


You needed to read 3 or 4 posts above your question


----------



## DaBullz

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Can he stand in the corner and make 3's?

Good enough.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Sounds like he would need to turn into a Rip/Reggie clone... and by the comments of his shooting ability it sounds like it could work. I don't see how that would be bad.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> I see Davis as a guy who can come in and contribute straight away as a back up Center maybe playing around 18 to 20mpg initially - at 6'11 and 260 he fits the need
> 
> Fazekas is probably more a 2 year project who needs to get stronger . He is a spin and fade away shooting type that scores a lot on face up jumpers from both post flanks ..where Patrick Ewing got a lot of points . I'm not saying he's a Patrick Ewing far from it..just offensively he has that spin and face up J move ..but to do that / have that as your bread and butter at this level you need to be able to take the hits and execute - which is why he really needs to get stronger and fill out around the 245 to 250 mark
> 
> I see him with capacity to have a nice interior passing game ..I've seen him play twice now and he does seem to have good awareness - whereas Aldridge almost seems to be a bit automatic ... Williams too ..but I guess when your the studs like those guys are your role is to look for your shot first time every time
> 
> Seems to be because Fazekas and Davis have not been developed as "the stud" that they have a different ( maybe more holistic ) approach to the game


I would have a big problem with drafting Davis or Fazekas(with our first pick). Niether of these guys have a shot at being above average starters in this league. Yes we need size but if these guys are all thats left for us we have to go best player available (which I am a firm believer in doing anyway).

I would take many other NCAA bigmen ahead of these two (and probably a bunch or foreigners too)
Aldridge
Williams
Kaun
Giles
Hibbert
Tyrus Thomas
Jason Smith

and Maybe also
Boone
Kone
Horford


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Somebody on realgm has pointed out that Reddick can create his own shot. They posted a link to several clips. I have noticed that this ability has increased during his Duke tenure. That being said, it's not a strong enough ability that I would expect him to be able to do it against NBA defenders. My guess is that he would revert to pretty much spot up shooting.


I agree but as spot up shooters go he is hands down the best. 

I was having a hard time coming up with a player to compare to him, but came up with this. Redick's key attributes- undersized, great shooter, not a great athlete. Best comparision I could think of Veshon Leonard. Compared to Leonard I would say JJ is slighty better at everything including outside shooting which is mind boggling. Leonard has never had any muscle tone in his life and has never worked very hard at his game but he can shoot lights out and has had an decent career. JJ on the other hand has a slightly better touch from the outside, his midrange game is world's apart from Leonard (which makes him a shooting god), and has twice the conditioning of a Leonard.

Leonard's career #'s
12.1 PPG
2.1 APG
.415 FG%
.385 3PT%
.789 FT%
.7 SPG

Leonard has been fortunate enough to never get stuck behinde a good SG which has helped his #'s (PPG mostly), but I still have a hard time thinking that Redick won't have better career #'s and an even harder time thinking that he won't have much more success.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> I agree but as spot up shooters go he is hands down the best.
> 
> I was having a hard time coming up with a player to compare to him, but came up with this. Redick's key attributes- undersized, great shooter, not a great athlete. Best comparision I could think of Veshon Leonard. Compared to Leonard I would say JJ is slighty better at everything including outside shooting which is mind boggling. Leonard has never had any muscle tone in his life and has never worked very hard at his game but he can shoot lights out and has had an decent career. JJ on the other hand has a slightly better touch from the outside, his midrange game is world's apart from Leonard (which makes him a shooting god), and has twice the conditioning of a Leonard.
> 
> Leonard's career #'s
> 12.1 PPG
> 2.1 APG
> .415 FG%
> .385 3PT%
> .789 FT%
> .7 SPG
> 
> Leonard has been fortunate enough to never get stuck behinde a good SG which has helped his #'s (PPG mostly), but I still have a hard time thinking that Redick won't have better career #'s and an even harder time thinking that he won't have much more success.


That's probably the best comparison I've seen yet (and I'm always partial to well chosen black/white comparisons!). Reddick is clearly going to be a better free throw shooter then Voshon. The thing that scares me about JJ is his rather pedestrian FG percentage. I know he shoots a lot of 3's, but I wish a guy regarded as perhaps the best college shooter ever shot more than about 42% for his Duke career. I do see that Reddick is shooting 49% for the year this year. If he can keep that percentage up, I'll be quite a bit more impressed.

Lenard was the 46th pick in the 1994 draft. Reasonably, I think considering JJ's height, lack of athleticism, and overall lack of versatility, I see him going in the low 20's. I still think he's a first round talent, but not quite a lotto talent.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I think the 2 big Duke kids, McRoberts and Boateng, are worth a look. I like Shelden alot but he really doesnt fit what the Bulls need if the roster stays the same.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> I think the 2 big Duke kids, McRoberts and Boateng, are worth a look. I like Shelden alot but he really doesnt fit what the Bulls need if the roster stays the same.


I think that's interesting. I think Shelden is exactly what the Bulls need, if the roster stays the same.

I mean hey, we're starting Mike Sweetney at center these days. We could sort of dismiss Shelden as a starting center, I suppose, because of his 6-9 size. But Ben Wallace does it, as well as other less defensively monstrous guys. Shelden Williams is one of those physical players that really has the strength to matchup well against bigger, non-Shaq centers.

I'd feel more comfortable with Shelden Williams guarding, say, Eddy Curry, than any guy on our roster today. Like, today. If we transplanted Williams from Duke and gave him a Bulls uni the next time we play the Knicks, I think he'd do a better job guarding Curry or almost any other big post threat than anyone we have on our roster.

He scores inside, too, with quickness in the post and a lot of athleticism. He's not just a "legit inside threat"... he's put together an arsenal of post moves and is actually good at it. He rebounds as hard as Sweetney but is in much much better shape.

If he were on almost any other team in the nation, he'd be their first option on offense.

Shelden is a true F-C, in the cut of Emeka Okafor (not as cereral a shot-blocker but still very defensively strong). He's a B+ version of Elton Brand (if Brand is an A).

Defense and scoring in the frontcourt with high basketball IQ and good physique that keeps him on the floor... that sounds like exactly everything that the Bulls need right now. McRoberts is better for flashy purposes, rangy shooting, a more interesting skill set, but if Shelden is the B+ Brand, McRoberts is the B+ Nowitzki and I'd actually rather have the B+ Brand instead. Difference of opinion, maybe.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> I think that's interesting. I think Shelden is exactly what the Bulls need, if the roster stays the same.
> 
> I mean hey, we're starting Mike Sweetney at center these days. We could sort of dismiss Shelden as a starting center, I suppose, because of his 6-9 size. But Ben Wallace does it, as well as other less defensively monstrous guys. Shelden Williams is one of those physical players that really has the strength to matchup well against bigger, non-Shaq centers.
> 
> I'd feel more comfortable with Shelden Williams guarding, say, Eddy Curry, than any guy on our roster today. Like, today. If we transplanted Williams from Duke and gave him a Bulls uni the next time we play the Knicks, I think he'd do a better job guarding Curry or almost any other big post threat than anyone we have on our roster.
> 
> He scores inside, too, with quickness in the post and a lot of athleticism. He's not just a "legit inside threat"... he's put together an arsenal of post moves and is actually good at it. He rebounds as hard as Sweetney but is in much much better shape.
> 
> If he were on almost any other team in the nation, he'd be their first option on offense.
> 
> Shelden is a true F-C, in the cut of Emeka Okafor (not as cereral a shot-blocker but still very defensively strong). He's a B+ version of Elton Brand (if Brand is an A).
> 
> Defense and scoring in the frontcourt with high basketball IQ and good physique that keeps him on the floor... that sounds like exactly everything that the Bulls need right now. McRoberts is better for flashy purposes, rangy shooting, a more interesting skill set, but if Shelden is the B+ Brand, McRoberts is the B+ Nowitzki and I'd actually rather have the B+ Brand instead. Difference of opinion, maybe.



I understand all of your points but why would we need another 6-8 undersized F/C? I mean, he is a good player but at some point the Bulls need a real 6-11, 7-0 center who has some athletic ability. Williams is probably closer to 6-8 then 6-9 and is only slightly above athletically. I agree, he will be a nice pro but eventually one team can have too many of one kind of player. The Bulls have a ton of Shelden Williams on their roster right now. And with Tyson not looking like a player who can log heavy minutes at the 5, the Bulls are going to have to look to acquire a player who atleast can. Williams, IMO, is a 4. He will have a nice career but it has to be in the right situation. 

If the Bulls pick falls around 8-12, I would seriously consider dealing it to Seattle for Johan Petro. Petro has shown flashes this year and at 7-1 can be that real center. But Seattle is only sporadically using him now. And they dont seem sure that they want to commit to him or to Robert Swift.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> If the Bulls pick falls around 8-12, I would seriously consider dealing it to Seattle for Johan Petro. Petro has shown flashes this year and at 7-1 can be that real center. But Seattle is only sporadically using him now. And they dont seem sure that they want to commit to him or to Robert Swift.


Why wait for Petro if he can be had? Why not deal a pick and a player for him right now?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> Why wait for Petro if he can be had? Why not deal a pick and a player for him right now?



Cause I just dont know where the pick will land. If the pick is top 3 and we can get Aldridge then its a no-brainer. But if the pick comes in at 8-12 it would be interesting to see if Seattle would have someone in mind at that spot. Petro early on was playing pretty well for them but then has moved down the bench and sometimes is even de-activated. But by all accounts, the Seattle fans are convinced that the kid should be playing alot and that his future is bright. But with Robert Swift there already, who knows?


----------



## bullsville

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm leery of trading away either of our first round picks as Paxson has shown to be outstanding in the draft so far in his tenure. 

Even at the trading deadline in February, it's still early enough that nobody knows which collegians and (especially) international players will be entering the draft. For that reason, I would rather see up keep the picks at least until draft night, and then if you need to make a deal to get the player you want, you do it.

And I want to add that this is an outstanding thread, I don't really have the time to watch much college ball and I am learning a lot about next summer's prospects. And the same thing applies to our international posters with those players.

Keep up the good work everyone!


----------



## Bulls96

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> ... I like Shelden alot but he really doesnt fit what the Bulls need if the roster stays the same...




Oh man...you already mentioned that … like 5000000 times


----------



## BULLS23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Hey guys, let me first say that this is an awsome thread . . . I don't ever hear about the international guys, and you guys keep me in the loop.

That said, I really think the Bulls should check out Paul Davis with the second 1st rounder. I think he is more of what we need in terms of his size and how he plays the game. He's got a true Center's body at 6'11" 270 and if we pair him with TC and Deng, would have enough help on defense that I think he would be OK. A guy of his ilk would for certain take some of the offensive pressure off of Tyson. I know that people have been saying that we should get Aldrige if the first pick is high enough, but really, if you've seen LaMarcus play over these last two years (and I really hope he stays in school) he is still getting routinely outmuscled on the block and we need a guy on the block who can command a double team consistently against Centers, not a 7-footer who comes in at 215 pounds. But this is just my opinion, and I trust Pax to do the right thing.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I agree. Aldridge is going to be a 4 in the league, probably would be just as out of position as Chandler at the 5. But I would still love to get him. His defensive game should be about as good as Chandler's and his offense is leaps and bounds better. If we could get our hands on him Tyson would then be expendable, Aldridge would be a good upgrade, especially in the future.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Just as a hypothetically question, if we draft Brewer, how do people seem him fitting in minutes wise.

What's his D like? it's reported to be good?

this is just an example, but as you can see there's not alot of minutes to go around. Though getting to bring along a rookie slowly for a change would be nice. 

Duhon 24 Hinrich 24
Hinrich 8 gordon 24 Brewer 16


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Is this also the official the Knicks are tanking thread, 6-17 w/ SA coming up. In *second to last place in the league* over a quarter a way through! Maybe Aldridge will be in reach after all.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/standings?season=2006&group=conference&seasontype=2


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## MKazz

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

This is slightly off topic, but I haven't heard any mention of Adam Morrison, who is undoubtedly one of the elite college basketball players currently. The comparisons are somewhere between Wally and Larry, and while I think it's unreasonable to call him Larry, I think the kid has more of a mean streak and just generally more ability than Wally ever has had. Not too mention Wally hasn't been a horrible NBA player by any stretch of the imagination. 

Anyways, the fact of the matter is while I realize that our need for a big man is much more pressing, in the situation where we were to either trade for one or try to sign one as a free agent, I feel like Morrison might be too good to pass up (assuming NY's pick is around the 5 spot). I understand his defense is a significant liability, but offensively he is an absolute terror. Plus, it'd be nice to finally have a SG taller then 6'3'' who could really hit the boards a little bit. 

I'm not saying he's my ideal pick, but I'm curious as to whether or not anyone else here would be happy to see him in a Bull's uniform next season.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

To ask another question, say new york pick wins the lottery, do we only consider Aldridge? Is he just a lock for our pick if his on the board.


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## MKazz

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Well obviously it's very early to speculate and much is left to be seen, but at the given moment is seems to be the most prudent move we could make, considering his level of skill and our significant lack of true big men. Little is known about any of the foreign big men, but I suppose Splitter or Bargnani are potential choices...


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## dsouljah9

If New York somehow wins the lottery, then I'm sure that we will take Rudy Gay with that first pick.


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## butr

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I think Sheldon Williams will have a tremendous impact on his new team. If he gets decent minutes he can get 10 8+ and 1.5 out of the gate.

I personally have campaigned in the Raps forum for him as well as on Toronto Radio.

Problem for me is that the Raps will probably draft too high with their own pick and too late with the Denver pick.

If the NYK pick does not go top 3, I think he would be amazing for you.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



blowuptheraptors said:


> I think Sheldon Williams will have a tremendous impact on his new team. If he gets decent minutes he can get 10 8+ and 1.5 out of the gate.
> 
> I personally have campaigned in the Raps forum for him as well as on Toronto Radio.
> 
> Problem for me is that the Raps will probably draft too high with their own pick and too late with the Denver pick.
> 
> If the NYK pick does not go top 3, I think he would be amazing for you.


I know everybody and their mother disagrees with me about Shelden Williams (ok, maybe not quite everybody)...but I think he's gonna be a real player in the pros. He's just a bull around the basket and the fact that he scores at nearly 60% plus 10 boards and well over 3 blocks just shows you he plays bigger than 6'9. It's hard to find quality big men, and with the apparently "weak draft" coming up I foresee his stock soaring around draft time. I think he goes 5th overall. Call me crazy, but that's my bold prediction.


----------



## butr

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> I know everybody and their mother disagrees with me about Shelden Williams (ok, maybe not quite everybody)...but I think he's gonna be a real player in the pros. He's just a bull around the basket and the fact that he scores at nearly 60% plus 10 boards and well over 3 blocks just shows you he plays bigger than 6'9. It's hard to find quality big men, and with the apparently "weak draft" coming up I foresee his stock soaring around draft time. I think he goes 5th overall. Call me crazy, but that's my bold prediction.


I agree. We saw a run on bigs starting with Charlie Villanueava in 2005. His size, defence and rebounding will be at a premium for somebody. I can't believe he slips out of the top ten, and I agree he could go at 5 depending on the slotting.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



blowuptheraptors said:


> I agree. We saw a run on bigs starting with Charlie Villanueava in 2005. His size, defence and rebounding will be at a premium for somebody. I can't believe he slips out of the top ten, and I agree he could go at 5 depending on the slotting.


The other thing I'm noticing is that GM's have really cooled on the super raw players. There's a countless number of high schoolers and unskilled athletes who have gone in the lottery but never panned out to anything. Shelden is seasoned and he's an example of what good college ball can do. For a team who needs a big guy and doesn't want to gamble with a foreigner, he's your guy. We saw a run on point guards in the 2005 draft which vaulted Deron Williams and Ray Felton into the top 5; I never thought that would happen, but they're seasoned college players. The trend is shifting back to college prospects, IMO.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> The other thing I'm noticing is that GM's have really cooled on the super raw players. There's a countless number of high schoolers and unskilled athletes who have gone in the lottery but never panned out to anything. Shelden is seasoned and he's an example of what good college ball can do. For a team who needs a big guy and doesn't want to gamble with a foreigner, he's your guy. We saw a run on point guards in the 2005 draft which vaulted Deron Williams and Ray Felton into the top 5; I never thought that would happen, but they're seasoned college players. The trend is shifting back to college prospects, IMO.


For sure 

Unless they are as can't miss as Lebron or Amare 

All the other high schoolers that have come out in the last 5 years have been underwhelming with the exception of Dwight Howard


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

In fact Amare's stock probably got hurt by Kwame, Eddy and Tyson


----------



## dkg1

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm a little leery about Sheldon after seeing Indiana's Marco Killingsworth shred him to the tune of about 34 points a couple weeks ago. IU played that game with one post player (DJ White was out w/ an injury) and he still tore Duke up inside. When Sheldon got into foul trouble Killingsworth then got McRoberts into foul trouble. We'll see, maybe it was an off game for Williams.

Does anyone know anything about Charlotte's DeAngelo Williams? He's got good size (6-5) and athleticsm for a 2 guard. He's a transfer from Oklahoma. Any word on where he is being projected at this stage of the game?


----------



## hps

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

If Shelden Williams can average a double-double, then he'll probably be the Bulls best big man certainly worth drafting.

Draft Shelden with the NY pick
Trade Gordon, Chandler, and Chicago pick for Paul Pierce
Sign Al Harrington
Sign a free agent Center like Nazr

Hinrich, Duhon
Pierce
Deng, Nocioni
A.Harrington, Songalia, Sweetney
Sheldon Williams, Nazr


----------



## andras

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

hi guys, great thread! since we have draft picks this year I'm again much more interested in the draft!

I was just surfing a little bit on nbadraft.net and saw we could go italian with both our picks! 
:eek8: does anybody have some reliable info on both Bargnani and Belinelli? according to their draft profiles they actually seem pretty good fits for the Bulls

I'd appreciate any info on these guys


----------



## butr

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dkg1 said:


> I'm a little leery about Sheldon after seeing Indiana's Marco Killingsworth shred him to the tune of about 34 points a couple weeks ago. IU played that game with one post player (DJ White was out w/ an injury) and he still tore Duke up inside. When Sheldon got into foul trouble Killingsworth then got McRoberts into foul trouble. We'll see, maybe it was an off game for Williams.


Marco's a load. He's short but huge. He was the only real option that day. They just kept going at him. There's only so much you can do. The refs are brutal. They don't let you play. He always gets 1 or 2 BS fouls per game. I think he'll be able to play better straight up in the A where there is an extra foul and somewhat better officiating. Sean May gave him problems too in the same way. Leaner athletic guys, guys that are in the league are actually a better matchup.


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



andras said:


> hi guys, great thread! since we have draft picks this year I'm again much more interested in the draft!
> 
> I was just surfing a little bit on nbadraft.net and saw we could go italian with both our picks!
> :eek8: does anybody have some reliable info on both Bargnani and Belinelli? according to their draft profiles they actually seem pretty good fits for the Bulls
> 
> I'd appreciate any info on these guys


I can just say two quick things :

This evening SG Marco Belinelli was the top scorer of his team playing Vs Tau Vitoria in Euroleague; the kid is 19y old ...
Plus he did a monster jam from the free throw line just under the eyes of Larry Bird :cheers: 

This last sunday PF Andrea Bargnani collected 11 points (4-4 from 2, 1-1 from 3, 3 dunks), 5 rebounds, 3 blocks, 2 steals in just 21 minutes playing Vs Virtus Bologna.

Belinelli so far: 26.4 mpg, 11.7 ppg, 48% from 2, 46% from 3, 1.2 rpg, 1 spg, 1.2 apg
Bargnani so far: 19.9 mpg, 12.8 ppg, 70% from 2, 47% from 3, 5.1 rpg, 1.7 blocks

Gretz


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



italianBBlover said:


> I can just say two quick things :
> 
> This evening SG Marco Belinelli was the top scorer of his team playing Vs Tau Vitoria in Euroleague; the kid is 19y old ...
> Plus he did a monster jam from the free throw line just under the eyes of Larry Bird :cheers:
> 
> This last sunday PF Andrea Bargnani collected 11 points (4-4 from 2, 1-1 from 3, 3 dunks), 5 rebounds, 3 blocks, 2 steals in just 21 minutes playing Vs Virtus Bologna.
> 
> Belinelli so far: 26.4 mpg, 11.7 ppg, 48% from 2, 46% from 3, 1.2 rpg, 1 spg, 1.2 apg
> Bargnani so far: 19.9 mpg, 12.8 ppg, 70% from 2, 47% from 3, 5.1 rpg, 1.7 blocks
> 
> Gretz



Sounds good to me,

Let's grab em both and callit a first round. Sign Pryz or Nazr to man the center spot; if Tyson continues to SUCK. Hope that Tyson, Gordon, Duhon and the rest for that matter, work on elevating their games in the off-season. Next season could be our year........hey wait, is that the tagline for the 2nd half of the season......?

Thanks for the international flavor.


And oh yeah, we had Sheldon Williams in Lonny Baxter. Williams is better, but agree with earlier statement ofnot what we need, especially at the center position. PF - we have most of what he brings already and it's not enough of a difference maker.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Any one have info on Brewer or seen him play?


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> Any one have info on Brewer or seen him play?


 I am assuming you mean Ronnie Brewer of Arkansas, but also keep your eye on Corey Brewer at Florida. 
I only saw Ronnie play one half so I am no overly familiar with his game, but one thing struck me right away, he has the body and the moves of a pro already. His ability to handle the ball and make plays at his size are very impressive, he just might be the perfect third guard to play alongside with Gordon, who struggles to efficiently make plays passing.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> I am assuming you mean Ronnie Brewer of Arkansas, but also keep your eye on Corey Brewer at Florida.
> I only saw Ronnie play one half so I am no overly familiar with his game, but one thing struck me right away, he has the body and the moves of a pro already. His ability to handle the ball and make plays at his size are very impressive, he just might be the perfect third guard to play alongside with Gordon, who struggles to efficiently make plays passing.


Might be worth it if can play along side gordon and let hinrich move back to point guard more.


----------



## dkg1

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> Might be worth it if can play along side gordon and let hinrich move back to point guard more.


I've been very impressed by Brewer. I mentioned in another thread that he has the length to be a good shutdown defender at the next level. I believe he's averaging around 4 steals per game. I like his passing and ball handling too. He's shooting 36% from the 3 point line.

The Brewer from Florida is an inch taller (6-8) than the Arkansas Brewer. His outisde shot looks suspect as he is only hitting 28% of his three's.

How about Tyler Hansbrough? Is he expected to stick around at UNC? I think there's going to be several young big men entering the draft to avoid being in the Oden draft of '07.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

draft brewer. We need to get bigger everywhere except sf. Our back court wouldn't be midgets then


----------



## TripleDouble

*James White*

James White has really been flying under the radar for a player who is as athletically gifted as he is. He was all the rage at the McDonalds dunk contest years ago and rightfully so: I thought he was a more impressive dunker than an in-his-prime Vince Carter. 

He went to Florida and stunk and now he's in Cincy and is quietly having a very nice season. He's putting up 17.6 ppg, shooting .395% from 3 and averaging 1.7 steals. Aditionally, he's displayed solid playmaking skills in the past, putting up 3.6 assists per game one season at a respectable A/TO ratio. 

Draft sites have him projected as a mid-second rounder but I cannot believe NBA people will wait that long on such a good athlete who has put up solid numbers in D-1. I suspect he'll end up being picked in the late teens or early twenties and at that spot would represent great value for the Bulls. He would also fill the need the Bulls have for a long athlete on the perimeter. 

Admittedly, I haven't watched college ball in a while. Has anyone watched Cincy enough recently to have a feel on this guy's ability?

edit: The guy has also done 4 years of college which may make him more of a Paxson type.


----------



## thebizkit69u

*Re: James White*



TripleDouble said:


> James White has really been flying under the radar for a player who is as athletically gifted as he is. He was all the rage at the McDonalds dunk contest years ago and rightfully so: I thought he was a more impressive dunker than an in-his-prime Vince Carter.
> 
> He went to Florida and stunk and now he's in Cincy and is quietly having a very nice season. He's putting up 17.6 ppg, shooting .395% from 3 and averaging 1.7 steals. Aditionally, he's displayed solid playmaking skills in the past, putting up 3.6 assists per game one season at a respectable A/TO ratio.
> 
> Draft sites have him projected as a mid-second rounder but I cannot believe NBA people will wait that long on such a good athlete who has put up solid numbers in D-1. I suspect he'll end up being picked in the late teens or early twenties and at that spot would represent great value for the Bulls. He would also fill the need the Bulls have for a long athlete on the perimeter.
> 
> Admittedly, I haven't watched college ball in a while. Has anyone watched Cincy enough recently to have a feel on this guy's ability?


 I dont think hes going to be drafted in the first round at all. Hes a poor mans version of Rodney Carney who is projected to go mid round so i doubt any team will pass up on Carney for White.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: James White*

Another HS player that has underwhelmed his expectations. He IS having a good season at Cincy but I don't think it's that big a deal. Could be a big surprise if he gets a chance in the league, but from what I remember from seeing him last year (and he might have matured a lot since then), he hasn't become a really polished player... still sort of a collegiate jumping athletic type.

Do you mind if I merge this with the Draft thread stickied above?


----------



## yodurk

*Re: James White*

FYI - NBAdraft.net has a new profile for Patrick O'Bryant, the 7'0, 250 lb center from Bradley.

http://nbadraft.net/profiles/patrickobryant.asp

I grew up a huge Bradley fan in Peoria and I still follow them pretty closely. I've seen O'Bryant in person about 5 times. He was suspended for 8 games this season for an overblown NCAA violation, but he's a pretty good jib guy and has some pretty big potential.

At the college level, you can't ask for a much better center. He makes a huge impact on both ends of the floor. He draws double-teams yet doesn't turn the ball over...and he's only a sophomore. NBAdraft.net is right that he needs to gain more muscle weight, but he's got more beef than Chandler by far. He's got great hands and is a good (not great) athlete. 

If you ask me, his niche in NBA will be defensively in the mold of a Brendan Haywood, except with slightly better offensive skill (Haywood has rock hands, whereas O'Bryant has very soft hands). Physically speaking, O'Bryant is a carbon copy of Haywood; both are above-average athletes but won't blow anyone away like Amare or Dwight Howard. Both will play physical and impact the game defensively. I don't think he'll contribute for about 2-3 years in the NBA, but he's got too much skill to not eventually pan out. I think he'll one day be a 12-14 ppg, 8 reb, 2 block type of center once he gains some more muscle and masters his mid-range jumper (which still needs some work). He'd be a good backup center from the get go though, so I'd be willing to spend a mid-to-late lotto pick on him.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: James White*



yodurk said:


> He was suspended for 8 games this season for an overblown NCAA violation,


I'm not sure how overblown it was; I mean, the guidelines for that sort of infraction are detailed to the dollar in the NCAA rulebook. (He was caught red-handed getting paid for work he didn't actually do.)

I'm not going to hold it against him, but the Bradley people should have apologized and moved on, not contested it.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: James White*



ScottMay said:


> I'm not sure how overblown it was; I mean, the guidelines for that sort of infraction are detailed to the dollar in the NCAA rulebook. (He was caught red-handed getting paid for work he didn't actually do.)
> 
> I'm not going to hold it against him, but the Bradley people should have apologized and moved on, not contested it.


All I'm saying is that he's been a hard worker and a good locker room guy ever since he joined Bradley, and people shouldn't let this incident be a knock on his character. 

Any thoughts on O'Bryant as a player/pro prospect/potential Bull?


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: James White*



yodurk said:


> All I'm saying is that he's been a hard worker and a good locker room guy ever since he joined Bradley, and people shouldn't let this incident be a knock on his character.


Well, it does speak to his character to SOME degree, doesn't it? 



> Any thoughts on O'Bryant as a player/pro prospect/potential Bull?


This is one area -- a late-bloomer who played what was (I'm guessing) not the most competitive HS situation in the world who then went onto a mid-major -- where I'm more than willing to let the pros do the handicapping. I also can't remember the last time I had access to a televised Bradley game.

Here's one thing that worries me, just from poring over his stats -- how come he goes to the line so infrequently?


----------



## yodurk

*Re: James White*



ScottMay said:


> Well, it does speak to his character to SOME degree, doesn't it?


Perhaps...I'm a little hazy on the details, but the story is that he had a legit summer job at Bradley, and over the course of the _entire_ summer he was allegedly overpaid by just over $1000 (not a whole lot to be fussing about, IMO). Jim Les (the coach) defended his players pretty adamently that they didn't do anything wrong. From what I heard and read, this was not a clear-cut case of a player receiving free money, ala Michigan scandels. It sounds more like one of those college jobs where you're getting paid to basically do nothing. My two-cents, take it for what it's worth. Bottomline, O'Bryant has a good reputation, works hard, and the fans love him.



> This is one area -- a late-bloomer who played what was (I'm guessing) not the most competitive HS situation in the world who then went onto a mid-major -- where I'm more than willing to let the pros do the handicapping. I also can't remember the last time I had access to a televised Bradley game.
> 
> Here's one thing that worries me, just from poring over his stats -- how come he goes to the line so infrequently?


That's why I'm here, Scott...to fill you guys in on this diamond in the rough. Like I mentioned, I think his niche in the NBA will be defensively. He's got a very long body (7 feet + long arms), he's agile for his size, and he appears to always work hard defensively. I watched him last week against a very good Northern Iowa team (#17 in the RPI) and he clearly intimidated them from going to the basket after some early game shotblocking. 

I'm not sure why he doesn't draw fouls more. He thrives on the low block. He will be limited somewhat in the pros offensively though...his only consistent move is a right-hand hook which works for now, but won't at the next level. He's got a nice touch, so hopefully he works on the midrange J. I'm sure Pax & co will make a trip or two to Peoria to watch him. If we draft him, he'll make an immediate impact defensively as a backup center, and after a few years he'll be a solid starting center with a good all-around game.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: James White*



yodurk said:


> That's why I'm here, Scott...to fill you guys in on this diamond in the rough. Like I mentioned, I think his niche in the NBA will be defensively. He's got a very long body (7 feet + long arms), he's agile for his size, and he appears to always work hard defensively. I watched him last week against a very good Northern Iowa team (#14 in the RPI) and he clearly intimidated them from going to the basket after some early game shotblocking.
> 
> I'm not sure why he doesn't draw fouls more. He thrives on the low block. He will be limited somewhat in the pros offensively though...his only consistent move is a right-hand hook which works for now, but won't at the next level. He's got a nice touch, so hopefully he works on the midrange J. I'm sure Pax & co will make a trip or two to Peoria to watch him. If we draft him, he'll make an immediate impact defensively as a backup center, and after a few years he'll be a solid starting center with a good all-around game.


Northern Iowa's a tiny team (just two players over 6-6, and they're only 6-8 and 6-10), though. Size is garden variety at the NBA level (well, for everyone but the Bulls). Will O'Bryant's size in relation to his athleticism translate to the next level?

The offensive descriptions worry me. This is a bit of a side note, but bear with me. A few nights ago I was watching a late-night Clippers game, and it suddenly struck me how excellent Chris Kaman's basketball skills are. Think about it -- he is literally ambidextrous from about six feet and in. He has a picture-perfect drop step move and a very solid jumper and turnaround shot. He sets excellent, precise screens. He's a capable passer. He's not the staunchest defender in the world, but he manages to block shots and clog the middle and rebound and stay out of foul trouble.

My point? Even though he's actually a pretty good athlete with a fantastic skill set, Kaman has to play like a mad dog every night in order to have an impact in an NBA game. If O'Bryant's not particularly athletic and isn't bringing those sorts of skills to the table, then what's his place at the next level? 

If you see him as the second coming of Brendan Haywood, then we should not be considering him with our own pick, which as of today would be sixth (ugh) if the lottery held to form. He kinda sounds like a late first-round flyer unless Bradley accomplishes something in the tourney or he wows people with his predraft measurements/drills.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Yes, I find it interesting that NBADraftnet has him listed so high. I mean, who IS this guy?

I don't see Bradley as a better team than University of Denver, honestly. So why isn't Yemi Nicholson considered a top prospect? That guy is 6'11", averaging 18/11 and 3 blocks. I can't imagine that he's much worse looking than O'Bryant, whose team is 2-3 with him in the lineup.

Aaron Gray plays for Pittsburgh, for that matter... an UNDEFEATED college team that matches up against pretty tough talent. He's a legitimate 7-footer that gets 12/10 and 1.9 bpg on a great team.

Neither of those guys showup as being drafted even in the SECOND round of nbadraft.net's mock. It's pretty difficult to believe, especially knowing that Gray is getting national exposure and playing for one of the best teams in college basketball.

So while I haven't seen O'Bryant play, the skill set you've described and the nbadraft.net profile don't really describe a lot that piques my interest. Bradley doesn't play amazing talent and in general they aren't a great team this year, so I don't know that I'll really be convinced of his talent unless he somehow plays among better competition.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Yes, I find it interesting that NBADraftnet has him listed so high. I mean, who IS this guy?
> 
> I don't see Bradley as a better team than University of Denver, honestly. So why isn't Yemi Nicholson considered a top prospect? That guy is 6'11", averaging 18/11 and 3 blocks. I can't imagine that he's much worse looking than O'Bryant, whose team is 2-3 with him in the lineup.
> 
> Aaron Gray plays for Pittsburgh, for that matter... an UNDEFEATED college team that matches up against pretty tough talent. He's a legitimate 7-footer that gets 12/10 and 1.9 bpg on a great team.
> 
> Neither of those guys showup as being drafted even in the SECOND round of nbadraft.net's mock. It's pretty difficult to believe, especially knowing that Gray is getting national exposure and playing for one of the best teams in college basketball.
> 
> So while I haven't seen O'Bryant play, the skill set you've described and the nbadraft.net profile don't really describe a lot that piques my interest. Bradley doesn't play amazing talent and in general they aren't a great team this year, so I don't know that I'll really be convinced of his talent unless he somehow plays among better competition.



Those are good points. I've never heard of the guys you mentioned, but they don't sound a whole lot worse than O'Bryant (if at all). There's a real good chance he gets drafted outside of the lottery. If the Bulls bounce back from their losing ways and make the playoffs, perhaps drafting him with a mid-1st rounder would be an option. So would Yemi Nicholson and Aaron Gray, for that matter (or maybe with a 2nd rounder if available). These things usually clear up more the closer we get to draft time.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Everytime I read stuff about LaMarcus Aldridge it gets brought up that the guards on his team don't pass it to him enough and aren't good at feeding the post. How much do people think this hinders his game and restricts him showing exactly what he can do?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Wow, somebody posted some video on Bargnani. There's no post moves, and maybe he doesn't have any, but a real nice move to the right and a dunk, a nice move to the left and a dunk, and pretty jumper, and a block. Could he be the perfect player to put next to Chandler?

http://realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=459345


----------



## lgtwins

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> Everytime I read stuff about LaMarcus Aldridge it gets brought up that the guards on his team don't pass it to him enough and aren't good at feeding the post. How much do people think this hinders his game and restricts him showing exactly what he can do?


Actually i think that it's the other way around. Every time the guard has the ball, aldridge always tend to post in no men's land and asking for the ball, the PG with right mind would force the ball to him at that point. Aldridge tent to try posting opposite side of the ball, not toward the PG with the ball.

His position and post play reminds me of Haywood at UNC couple of years back. Not impressive at all. His offensive game is average at best. I wouldn;t pcik him even if we get the 1st pick. Especially when we still have Chandler.

I would go wither Morrison or Rudy Gay regardless of our need in roster. You can always fill the hole through trade and FA. With draft pick you have to go with the talent, period.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



lgtwins said:


> Actually i think that it's the other way around. Every time the guard has the ball, aldridge always tend to post in no men's land and asking for the ball, the PG with right mind would force the ball to him at that point. Aldridge tent to try posting opposite side of the ball, not toward the PG with the ball.
> 
> His position and post play reminds me of Haywood at UNC couple of years back. Not impressive at all. His offensive game is average at best. I wouldn;t pcik him even if we get the 1st pick. Especially when we still have Chandler.
> 
> I would go wither Morrison or Rudy Gay regardless of our need in roster. You can always fill the hole through trade and FA. With draft pick you have to go with the talent, period.


Yes, but sometimes drafting for talent gets you Marvin Williams instead of Chris Paul when what you really needed was a point guard.


----------



## lgtwins

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Yes, but sometimes drafting for talent gets you Marvin Williams instead of Chris Paul when what you really needed was a point guard.


Of course. :biggrin:


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

What do you all think of Tyrus Thomas?

http://nbadraft.net/


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Is it just me or does Aldridge move/play like Bill Cartwright ? (when he was playing ) 

I was watching the Texas/Iowa game yesterday and it seemed so to me ..


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Electric Slim said:


> What do you all think of Tyrus Thomas?
> 
> http://nbadraft.net/


Sounds like a skinny Ben Wallace with some offense, so I don't agree with the Stromile Swift comparison. I guess it's becsue he goes to LSU.

Positves: Nice 10-15ft jumper, long arms, good shot blocker and rebounder.

Negatives: Only 217 pounds. Needs to bulk up to at least 235-240lbs.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Is it just me or does Aldridge move/play like Bill Cartwright ? (when he was playing )
> 
> I was watching the Texas/Iowa game yesterday and it seemed so to me ..


Yeah, he is weirdly stiff and mechanical at times. 

I want to watch a few more Texas games closely before I arrive at anything further, but I watched just about all of that one, and at no point was the phrase "That guy is going to be a dominant interior player in the NBA" even close to being on the tip of my tongue.

Hey, yodurk, can you give us a heads-up if Bradley's scheduled for any national TV?


----------



## lgtwins

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> Yeah, he is weirdly stiff and mechanical at times.
> 
> I want to watch a few more Texas games closely before I arrive at anything further, <b>but I watched just about all of that one, and at no point was the phrase "That guy is going to be a dominant interior player in the NBA" even close to being on the tip of my tongue.</b>
> 
> Hey, yodurk, can you give us a heads-up if Bradley's scheduled for any national TV?


First thing for everything. I agree with you Scott 100% on the above bolded part. I was also wondering why his name came up as possible NO. 1 pick after watching some of his games. Not impressive at all.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> Yeah, he is weirdly stiff and mechanical at times.
> 
> I want to watch a few more Texas games closely before I arrive at anything further, but I watched just about all of that one, and at no point was the phrase "That guy is going to be a dominant interior player in the NBA" even close to being on the tip of my tongue.


Well, Im sure many said the same thing about Frye. Im not comparing Aldridge to Frye, in fact, I havent watched LaMarcus play, but I wouldnt draw big and definite conclusions so early.


----------



## Cyanobacteria

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I agree: tough to get a read on Aldridge from the Iowa State game. He wasn't the first or second option, Texas didn't run much on offense, just double-stack low stuff. He and the 4 pretty much just camped out on the blocks, occasionally cross-screened for each other and that was it. Their offense reminded me of the Clips with Brand and Candi (not comparing any players here, just the offense)when both posted low and wouldn't budge. The old 'let the players make something happen' offense. The team I played on in 7th grade had more movement.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> Hey, yodurk, can you give us a heads-up if Bradley's scheduled for any national TV?


Unfortunately, Bradley played the Chicago area schools (DePaul, Loyola, and Chicago State) at the very beginning of the season. I think only the DePaul game was televised in Chicago, and O'Bryant was ineligible that game.

All their games are on Peoria local stations, so the only chance to see them is if they make the MVC championship game which I think is on CBS nationally (I wouldn't rule it out), or make the NIT or maybe even the big dance if they get hot during the conference tourney. They're only 2-3 in the conference so far, but they also have 5 of their next 7 games at home. We'll see.

Edit: It should probably be mentioned that O'Bryant has battled some major foul trouble in his 5 games so far. He's blocking shots like a mad man, but he might be playing too aggressively. My theory is that he knows the scouts are watching and he's pressing too hard.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Great game by Paul Davis tonight.

He just took over in the 2nd half and played with an controlled intensity. Showed a bit of aggression in a tangle when he was trying to set up position in the post and then re-focused and punished them inside.

Big game from Marco Killingsworth

Also have to say that Maurice Ager looked the goods tonight. Very impressive . Shot it well - took it in hard , took hits - adjusted - finished . He looked real good.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I noticed Davis and Killingsworth's big games.

But right now I'm watching Duke-Maryland, and Shelden Williams looks like the Ben Wallace of college basketball. He's been consistently dominant all year, and tonight he has a triple double and counting...something around 17 pts, 10 boards, and 10 blocks.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> I noticed Davis and Killingsworth's big games.
> 
> But right now I'm watching Duke-Maryland, and Shelden Williams looks like the Ben Wallace of college basketball. He's been consistently dominant all year, and tonight he has a triple double and counting...something around 17 pts, 10 boards, and 10 blocks.


If we have the chance, I am leaning towards taking the undersized Shelden over someone like Aldridge or Davis simply because Shelden looks like the better overall prospect. I don't care if he's not 6'11 like the other two, he looks more impressive whenever I watch him. Plus you can tell just by looking at him he has freakishly long arms to go along with that upper body strength. 

I do not like the way LaMarcus Aldridge "moves" on the court. He does not look like a great athlete for his size, and he doesn't look particularly smooth either. When he "sprints" downcourt it looks like there's a rope tied around his waist and he's dragging a heavily weighted object across the floor. On defense, when he closes out on a player on the perimeter, he does a hand-check with both hands to prevent them from driving, and I'm amazed at how often he gets away with that. 

Paul Davis looks like a decent player, nothing special. I wouldn't spend a lottery pick on him. 

It seems to me our hopes for a big man via the draft rested on us getting Aldridge, but he has not impressed me at all. Right now I would take Rudy Gay or Shelden Williams before Aldridge. That Bargnini (sp) kid looked great in his little 30 second highlight clip, I was more impressed by that little clip than I was seeing Aldridge play entire games.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Also have to say that Maurice Ager looked the goods tonight. Very impressive . Shot it well - took it in hard , took hits - adjusted - finished . He looked real good.


:yes:

He would be a good pickup with one of our picks (hopefully non-lottery).


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Paul Davis is a lottery pick..or at least he should be 

The guy will be a Brad Miller type NBA Center . May not have the crazy athleticism - granted , but he is a very well rounded bigman with real fundamentals

He's the only legit Center that has a chance of going in the lottery 

He may not go top half of the lottery but if our pick is in the 10 to 14 range we would be nuts not to take him


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Shelden Williams?

Any big man getting 10 blocks in any game is showing me something...point blank.


Looking like Elton Brand Lite.


----------



## narek

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Paxson scouted the Connecticut/LSU game Saturday:

http://www.thejournalnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060111/SPORTS01/601110432/1108



> HARTFORD, Conn. — Hilton Armstrong once showed up for a sectional tournament game at the County Center with two left sneakers in his bag.
> 
> Then there was the time everybody at Peekskill High knew he had spray-painted graffiti outside the gym because it was seven feet above the ground and nobody else in school was that tall.
> 
> Now there's a new message being written on the wall and it's getting bolder with each passing game he plays: the goofy kid has grown up and is headed for the NBA.
> 
> A marginal prospect when he arrived at the University of Connecticut in 2002, Armstrong now starts at center for the fourth-ranked Huskies and is averaging 9.7 points, 6.7 rebounds and 2.6 blocks on a team so loaded with talent that 31 pro scouts were courtside for a recent game.
> 
> *"I think a lot of us came to watch other guys and left talking about Armstrong," Chicago Bulls general manager John Paxson said Saturday after watching Armstrong score 11 points against LSU. "He opened some eyes."*
> 
> Armstrong turned a close game UConn's way by scoring three important baskets in the final four minutes, one on a quick spin to the basket that resulted in a thunderous dunk.
> 
> Give me the ball, the 21-year-old senior demanded, and I'll score on whomever is guarding me. For a player who averaged 2.9 points in his first three seasons, it was a remarkable bit of evolution.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> Shelden Williams?
> 
> Any big man getting 10 blocks in any game is showing me something...point blank.
> 
> 
> Looking like Elton Brand Lite.


Ready to jump on the bandwagon? The guy is posting 18 pts on over 60% shooting for the best team in the nation. 75% free throw shooter is good for a big man. But what jumps out at me are his Big Ben like defensive stats and the intimidation factor he brings in the lane...9.3 rebounds (over 11 reb/game last year), 2.0 steal, and 3.7 blocks. Aside from the 10 block game last night, he also has a 9 and 7 block game this season. 

I don't care if he's not 6'11, the arm length, strength, and athletic ability all seem to be there. I think he'll be an excellent PF/C type at the pro level, and I'm boldly predicting he cracks the top 5 as draft day approaches.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Everyone knows our needs are a shooting guard and a center. Right now, the top prospects for each position are:

Shooting Guard 

1. Rudy Gay

2. Adam Morrison

3. Ronnie Brewer

4. Rudy Fernandez

5. JJ Redick

Darkhorse: Corey Brewer


Big Men 

1. Andrea Bargnani

2. Shelden Williams

3. LaMarcus Aldridge

4. Tiago Splitter

5. Patrick O' Bryant

Darhorses: Tyrus Thomas and Hilton Armstrong


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

If we draft Williams, we will have gone from twin towers...........to small wonders....Bring back Lonny Baxter and every other overacheiving short dude. His wingspan better be that of an 8 footer.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Josh Boone sure didn't help himself out at that UConn game. Someone must have told Hilton that the scouts would be there. Although, for being elite big men, neither of them grabbed more than 3 rebounds, while Gay and Rashad Anderson yanked 8 and 10.

Tyrus Thomas helped himself out too, with 15 and 13 and seven blocked shots (SEVEN!?). Is he a mini-Shelden, waiting to happen? He's projected pretty high; does anyone know anything more about him?


----------



## JayRedd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dsouljah9 said:


> Everyone knows our needs are a shooting guard and a center. Right now, the top prospects for each position are:
> 
> Shooting Guard
> 
> 1. Rudy Gay
> 
> 2. Adam Morrison
> 
> 3. Ronnie Brewer
> 
> 4. Rudy Fernandez
> 
> 5. JJ Redick
> 
> Darkhorse: Corey Brewer


Adam Morrison cannot play the 2 in the NBA


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JayRedd said:


> Adam Morrison cannot play the 2 in the NBA


Probably not, but he sure can try. When you watch him play, he's not really at the rim or creating off the dribble as much as he is attacking from the perimeter. He rebounds okay and would make a decent SF but the guy just shoots the lights out. 

He could line up well at SF or SG but I don't think it's impossible for him to play the 2. He has a lightning quick stroke and can handle the ball as well as most 2 guards.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Probably not, but he sure can try. When you watch him play, he's not really at the rim or creating off the dribble as much as he is attacking from the perimeter. He rebounds okay and would make a decent SF but the guy just shoots the lights out.
> 
> He could line up well at SF or SG but I don't think it's impossible for him to play the 2. He has a lightning quick stroke and can handle the ball as well as most 2 guards.



No one questions his offense.

It's his lack of any semblence of defense that won't work for the Bulls. Hell, Ben can light it up, but No D means no playing time for Skiles and Paxson's team. No, if getting Morrison means ending the Skiles and Paxson reign of terror.......I might listen.

Morrison is just not a very good fit for us at all. We would need a much better defensive presence than we have. Please don't say Tyson will pull his head out after an off-season. He's having a kid and will find other excuses to suck.


----------



## tbp82

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I find it amazing how people here say that Aldridge doesn't have an offensive game. I know some of you guys are looking for Morrison to have that great white hope Larry Bird type but to say Aldridge is not impressive is ridiculous. I've seen him play against Duke, TN, Memphis, Iowa, West Virginia, Villonova, and the tournaments at the beginning of the year. IF the knicks when the lottery he will be your guy. The guy is incredibly long. Runs the floor as good as Tyson does. Has a turnaround jumper that is great. Decent jump hook, Block shots, rebounds I have said this before and I will say it again he is Tyson Chandler with offense. Almost a bigger stronger Chris Bosh. He is the only guy in the draft with real all-star potential anyone who is not impressed by LA is blind. Remember there is a reason a lot of scouts have him ranked number #1. Remeber when we said Orlando should take Okafor over Howard who won that draft. Aldridge is the missing piece to the Bulls. If you get the number #1 pick this should be your lineup next year

PG-Hinrich
SG-Gordon
SF-Deng
PF/C-Tyson Chandler
C/PF-Larmarcus Aldridge.


----------



## dsouljah9

You put up a very good argument about Aldridge tbp82, provided 1. He leaves early and 2. Ours or New York's pick is in the top 5.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dsouljah9 said:


> You put up a very good argument about Aldridge tbp82, provided 1. He leaves early and 2. Ours or New York's pick is in the top 5.


Aldridge declared for the draft right out of high school before withdrawing his name and joining Texas. So it wouldn't surprise me to see him jump since he's a practical lock for top 3.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Undersized or not...I don't care what anyone says...We need to get Sheldan Williams....

Aldridge?..He's my first choice clearly...Fits everything we need...


James White?...He's another one i have targeted...we'd have to get a 3rd pick possibly in the late 2nd rd.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Sorry Mouf, but unles we are picking late with both picks (10-18 range, Williams isn't going to be a Bull. I would imagine we tried really hard to package the pick/s.

Williams is a great coolege player, but a mystery to the NBA because of his size. Not effort or production in college, but still a concern. Plus, we read he's 6-9, but you never really know until the official measurements come out at the camps.

Aldrige, Gay, Bargnani, Splitter, Morrison, Brewer before Williams.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Going out a year but there is a 7 footer in the Sam Dalembeurt mold called Sane? He is from Senegal. Over the next 5 years the influx of kids with African origin is going to be huge. Deng was among the first of this wave but this kid has to be looked at. Apparently great speed, length and height. Born in 86 so I believe he might be eligible for this draft. The feedback I got has been extremely interesting. Another Ian Mahinmi, the Spurs shock pick of last years draft. Apparently they have seen this kid as well.

http://nbadraft.net/profiles/mouhamedsene.asp


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> Sorry Mouf, but unles we are picking late with both picks (10-18 range, Williams isn't going to be a Bull. I would imagine we tried really hard to package the pick/s.
> 
> Williams is a great coolege player, but a mystery to the NBA because of his size. Not effort or production in college, but still a concern. Plus, we read he's 6-9, but you never really know until the official measurements come out at the camps.
> 
> Aldrige, Gay, Bargnani, Splitter, Morrison, Brewer before Williams.


There are plenty of excellent NBA big men who measure in at 6'8 or 6'9. If Sheldon is 6'9 with long arms like he appears to be, I think he'll be fine.

The Bulls desperately need interior defense. It's our biggest weakness at the moment, IMO. Sheldon Williams would immediately fill this need. He's strong, tough, rebounds, blocks a ton of shots, and somehow swipes 2.1 steals a game as well (rarely seen from interior players). It's not just the numbers though...from the 6 games or so I've seen Duke this year, he brings a certain intimidation factor in the lane.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Going out a year but there is a 7 footer in the Sam Dalembeurt mold called Sane? He is from Senegal. Over the next 5 years the influx of kids with African origin is going to be huge. Deng was among the first of this wave but this kid has to be looked at. Apparently great speed, length and height. Born in 86 so I believe he might be eligible for this draft. The feedback I got has been extremely interesting. Another Ian Mahinmi, the Spurs shock pick of last years draft. Apparently they have seen this kid as well.
> 
> http://nbadraft.net/profiles/mouhamedsene.asp


How cool would it be for us to sign Nene this off-season, then draft Sene?

Our frontline of the future would be Nene and Sene. Has a nice ring to it.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> There are plenty of excellent NBA big men who measure in at 6'8 or 6'9. If Sheldon is 6'9 with long arms like he appears to be, I think he'll be fine.
> 
> The Bulls desperately need interior defense. It's our biggest weakness at the moment, IMO. Sheldon Williams would immediately fill this need. He's strong, tough, rebounds, blocks a ton of shots, and somehow swipes 2.1 steals a game as well (rarely seen from interior players). It's not just the numbers though...from the 6 games or so I've seen Duke this year, he brings a certain intimidation factor in the lane.



Williams will not intimidate any big men, except Chandler and Allen. Sorry, he'll be fine, but I'd rather target Nene or Gooden with FA money than draft Williams. Williams won't eb a difference maker on the Bulls.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Nene, Sene and Skileee. 

Yeah, that would work.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



RLucas said:


> Going out a year but there is a 7 footer in the Sam Dalembeurt mold called Sane? He is from Senegal. Over the next 5 years the influx of kids with African origin is going to be huge. Deng was among the first of this wave but this kid has to be looked at. Apparently great speed, length and height. Born in 86 so I believe he might be eligible for this draft. The feedback I got has been extremely interesting. Another Ian Mahinmi, the Spurs shock pick of last years draft. Apparently they have seen this kid as well.


I read the scouting report, 7'0" with a *7'8" *wingspan?!!! I like Alexis Ajinca because his game a bit further along(a rail-thin 205 though) , but this kid also sounds like he's worth a look. If he's there with our pick, you've got to take him in the first round. Hopefully, Pax and company are scouting this kid closely...

I don't have the access that you do rlucas, so I guess that you will be able to learn more about this kid.

oh yeah....

MY 800TH POST!!!!!


----------



## andras

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Going out a year but there is a 7 footer in the Sam Dalembeurt mold called Sane? He is from Senegal. Over the next 5 years the influx of kids with African origin is going to be huge. Deng was among the first of this wave but this kid has to be looked at. Apparently great speed, length and height. Born in 86 so I believe he might be eligible for this draft. The feedback I got has been extremely interesting. Another Ian Mahinmi, the Spurs shock pick of last years draft. Apparently they have seen this kid as well.
> 
> http://nbadraft.net/profiles/mouhamedsene.asp


apparently he's playing for Pepinter, a Belgian team. I'm Belgian but not really watch any domestic ball. my brother covers some basketball for television (exclusively Euroleague, I think, not sure). I'll ask him if he knows about this kid


----------



## dsouljah9

*Cool,Andras..* 

It looks like 2007 is the year to get a big man. I expect the kikd to be a bit raw, but there's nothing wrong with drafting the kid and letting him develop in Europe.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Havent seen him play myself. But I still chat with contacts that know the European game well and they marvel at this kids athleticism and reach. Andras if you could get some info on him I would appreciate it. Thanks in advance


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

You know, perhaps the Bulls should pull a Phoenix and trade this years pick for next years pick. And then draft Sene and Ajinca or Oden next year.


----------



## dsouljah9

rlucas...

Seriously,why aren't you a scout for the Bulls? You seem to do a better job or scouting than the current Bulls scouting staff. There's got to be someone here with connections that can get in someone's ear and tell the right people about you. That's if you mind of course.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dsouljah9 said:


> rlucas...
> 
> Seriously,why aren't you a scout for the Bulls? You seem to do a better job or scouting than the current Bulls scouting staff. There's got to be someone here with connections that can get in someone's ear and tell the right people about you. That's if you mind of course.



Thanks for the kind words souljah. I scouted for 18 months for one team (who then cut their european dept by 50%) and did some part time scouting for a team last year. However, the investors in my fund had some real problems with my part time job paying 28k a year when they entrusted me with their investments. So while it was a hobby and an interest of mine I had to honor my fiduciary responsibility to my investors and dropped scouting. Also, thats was also when I was living in London, I expect to be back there this summer when my kids get a little older, and I was in charge of France (Mickael Pietrus, Florent Pietrus, Johan Petro and Ian Mahinmi are all players that I know and have scouted) and the second division of Spain for 2 teams. I have some pretty good contacts in the European game so my recent recommendations of Ajinca and Sene are 2nd hand recommendations, but from sources that are very good. I get some video occasionally on players and I like certain traits. I love athleticism, reach, versatility and height. The interesting trait, and I believe the trend in NBA over the next 5-10 years will be drafting Africans directly from Europe. The European teams actually are better at scouting then the NBA though they cant compete on money. They are in Africa and the Carribean (the Pietrus brothers, Gelabale and Petro) in a big way trying to find players and players to develop. Sene is that player but he is one one of a 100 now. I think it would behoove the Bulls to be ahead of the curve there rather then being behind it. Under Krause the Bulls were ahead of the foreign curve for awhile and then ignored it totally during the explosion. Pax has been lukewarm there in that market though getting Noc was brilliant. Africa, and China, are the new fronteir. And whoever can establish good relationships there and an understanding of the talent that exists in that market will remain competitive in the NBA for a long time. Ill tell you right now that Tony Ronzone of the Pistons and RJ Buford of the Spurs are there in a huge way.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> Williams will not intimidate any big men, except Chandler and Allen. Sorry, he'll be fine, but I'd rather target Nene or Gooden with FA money than draft Williams. Williams won't eb a difference maker on the Bulls.


You're not giving a whole lot of reasons to try and convince me, but whatever.  Williams is pretty much identical to what Okafor did for UConn, and they're pretty darn close size-wise too. Okafor was the #2 pick in the draft. I'm not sure what the difference is. Everything I've seen of Shelden indicates that he's a gifted athlete with quite a knack for rebounding and playing interior defense. It sure seems like the Bulls could use that, especially with the massive points in the paint we've been giving up lately.


----------



## dsouljah9

*rlucas...*

Must have been cool to be a scout; I wish I could do that, even if it's part-time. To me at least, Paxson seems to prefer American college players over European scout, and he is short changing himself and the team IMHO. As much as I disliked Krause, he was always on top of the European scene. There's nothing wrong with drafting talent and stashing them away in Europe(that's what the Spurs did with Manu and the Jazz did with Kirilenko). That way, you rely less on free agency to overpay for a player and rebuilding is less drastic. That's much better than looking in the CBA for bench fodder.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dsouljah9 said:


> *rlucas...*
> 
> Must have been cool to be a scout; I wish I could do that, even if it's part-time. To me at least, Paxson seems to prefer American college players over European scout, and he is short changing himself and the team IMHO. As much as I disliked Krause, he was always on top of the European scene. There's nothing wrong with drafting talent and stashing them away in Europe(that's what the Spurs did with Manu and the Jazz did with Kirilenko). That way, you rely less on free agency to overpay for a player and rebuilding is less drastic. That's much better than looking in the CBA for bench fodder.



It was fun. Occasionally I would have to go to the former Yugoslavia and that was real intersting. Also, it was nice watching teams practice, which I did often on days before games. Pax, I think, was going to get himself into that market and then backed off. He is hurting the Bulls, even though alot of the European born talent has been bled dry. However, like I said, the African, S American talent seems to be finding the European game BEFORE the NBA and it really behooves Pax to learn about that talent. A kid like Marquinhos needs to be looked at closely.


----------



## dsouljah9

Marquinhos, I've heard that name mentioned before and I think you were the person that mentioned it. But, I remember persons saying that the kid was talented. There's no doubt that the talent's there, the Bulls just need to see it, so it's also up to the persons around Paxson to tell him about talent tht he doesn't necessarily know about. Personally, Paxson should have at least one scout in different areas such as South America, and Europe.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dsouljah9 said:


> *rlucas...*
> 
> Must have been cool to be a scout; I wish I could do that, even if it's part-time. To me at least, Paxson seems to prefer American college players over European scout, and he is short changing himself and the team IMHO. As much as I disliked Krause, he was always on top of the European scene. There's nothing wrong with drafting talent and stashing them away in Europe(that's what the Spurs did with Manu and the Jazz did with Kirilenko). That way, you rely less on free agency to overpay for a player and rebuilding is less drastic. That's much better than looking in the CBA for bench fodder.


Other than Kukoc, I don't think Krause did anything notable in drafting foreign players. Bagaric and Tarlac immediately come to mind as Krause Euro stiffs.

Paxson is said to be scouting abroad recently, and I'm sure he's got a close eye on Splitter and Bargnani. Through his 2 drafts (since he had 0 picks last summer), there's not 1 Euro player I would've taken over Deng, Gordon, Hinrich, or Duhon given our draft position.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> Other than Kukoc, I don't think Krause did anything notable in drafting foreign players. Bagaric and Tarlac immediately come to mind as Krause Euro stiffs.
> 
> Paxson is said to be scouting abroad recently, and I'm sure he's got a close eye on Splitter and Bargnani. Through his 2 drafts (since he had 0 picks last summer), there's not 1 Euro player I would've taken over Deng, Gordon, Hinrich, or Duhon given our draft position.


My guess is that in 2 years there will be a handful of foreign players you would have rather wanted then those 4.


----------



## DaFuture

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Jeff Green, Jeff Green


remember the name.


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Reddick with another 40+ game.
Duke loses though.


----------



## DaFuture

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

are you a mod on niketalk.com


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



DaFuture said:


> are you a mod on niketalk.com



Me? Nope I've never even checked the site out.



Anyone watching the end of the WVU game?
That swipe that Gansy just had to seal the game was pretty sick.


----------



## andras

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Havent seen him play myself. But I still chat with contacts that know the European game well and they marvel at this kids athleticism and reach. Andras if you could get some info on him I would appreciate it. Thanks in advance


Ill try to get some more info on the kid. Might take a couple of weeks since I'll be abroad for work and extremely busy. It's actually funny: I'm producer of a television reality show about six Zimbabwean kids trying to make it in the typically Western European sport cyclocross (that's cycling on a closed track in the mud). There's a lot of resemblance with a kid like Sene, since they're all extremely new to the sport and try to compete against far more experienced European athletes

Right now all I know is Sene's hardly getting any minutes which doesn't say a lot given his lack of experience. DJ Benga hardly played either in Belgium, even when he was temporarily on the roster of a lower division team. There're just not enough incentives to really invest in these kind of raw projects for a European team. At least not in terms of giving them plenty of playing time. Their team's always playing for playoffs or fighting against relegation. Anyway, I'll try to dig a little deeper and let you all know...


----------



## dsouljah9

Regardless, the Bulls ought to give the guy a look. There's nothing wrong with stashing talent away and letting it develop. 

For this yearrs draft I think that we'll end up with Gay/ Brewer and Hilton Armstrong.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm really starting to lose my reluctance to thinking *Adam Morrison* is a special player. How many guys have ever lit up the scoreboards like him in a good program? 8 games over 30, 3 over 40!!
*
In five games against Top 25 competition he is averaging 32.6 Points!!* 28.3 as is.

As for the worries about his defense, there are a lot of prolific shooters that aren't great defenders Carter, Allen, Stoyakovich, Redd.....


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Who is this Tyus Thomas guy?? I've never heard of him up until a few days ago?? How would he fit in with us?? 

And has anyone but Yodurk seen Patrick O'Bryant play? And if so, what would you have to say about him??


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rosenthall said:


> Who is this Tyus Thomas guy?? I've never heard of him up until a few days ago?? How would he fit in with us??
> 
> And has anyone but Yodurk seen Patrick O'Bryant play? And if so, what would you have to say about him??



This Thomas guy is really climbing. Your right about that. I have an LSU game recorded and will try to get to it. I love athletes and this kid is rumored to be Hakim Warrick like in his athleticism. If he is tall enough there might be something there.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> This Thomas guy is really climbing. Your right about that. I have an LSU game recorded and will try to get to it. I love athletes and this kid is rumored to be Hakim Warrick like in his athleticism. If he is tall enough there might be something there.


Honestly, the phrase 'Hakim Warrick like' really doesn't do anything for me. From the looks of it, he has the body of Hakim Warrick as well. Who knows though.

Also, looking at nbadraft.net, a few things jump out at me:

They have JJ Reddick listed at number 7, which seems kind of unreal, and then even better, they list Steve Kerr as his NBA comparison. Riiiiiiiiiight.

Patrick O'Bryant isn't even on the draft board now. What's up with that??

And also, just how legit is the site anyways? Is it run with people who actually have any scouting experience or NBA connections? It seems people like to conveniently use it as the be-all-end-all gauge of what's going on, but I often wonder how reliable it is.


----------



## The Krakken

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dsouljah9 said:


> Regardless, the Bulls ought to give the guy a look. There's nothing wrong with stashing talent away and letting it develop.
> 
> For this yearrs draft I think that we'll end up with Gay/ Brewer and Hilton Armstrong.


After watching Gay tonight, getting him would be an absolute steal. He'll be the best player in this draft. I'm almost certain of it. His abilities and talents are off the charts.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> And also, just how legit is the site anyways? Is it run with people who actually have any scouting experience or NBA connections? It seems people like to conveniently use it as the be-all-end-all gauge of what's going on, but I often wonder how reliable it is.


The site is pathetic, earlier on they had us selecting 2 PG's with our picks... I stopped going there ever since.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

NBAdraft.net has its goods and bads. But its getting bashed for the wrong reasons here. First off, they are not doing a mock draft right now. They are simply placing players in the order they think they should be drafted irregardless of the teams drafting them. Plain and simple. Second of all, they have the big kid from Bradley going in 2007 if you look closer. So they are not excluding him. I also have Reddick rated high. I think #7 is about right. Heck, if I am dying for some shooting I might take him higher.


----------



## Swan

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rosenthall said:


> Honestly, the phrase 'Hakim Warrick like' really doesn't do anything for me. From the looks of it, he has the body of Hakim Warrick as well. Who knows though.
> 
> Also, looking at nbadraft.net, a few things jump out at me:
> 
> They have JJ Reddick listed at number 7, which seems kind of unreal, and then even better, they list Steve Kerr as his NBA comparison. Riiiiiiiiiight.
> 
> Patrick O'Bryant isn't even on the draft board now. What's up with that??
> 
> And also, just how legit is the site anyways? Is it run with people who actually have any scouting experience or NBA connections? It seems people like to conveniently use it as the be-all-end-all gauge of what's going on, but I often wonder how reliable it is.


I haven't seen Thomas either, but one of the interesting things about him (from what I read) is he was primarily a guard in high school (around 6 foot) until his final years when he had a ten inch growth spurt. This is the same deal as James Posey when he was a Xavier, except Thomas is taller and more of a post player now. It'd be interesting to see how much of his little guy game he has maintained, which probably won't come out until private workouts but bodes well for the intangibles, if he can prove to be a big guy with the potential to get bigger and stronger.


----------



## superdave

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Too lazy to sift through 20+ pages but...

I like Hilton Armstrong with our later 1st round pick. Looks likes the best big man this season in UConn.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> NBAdraft.net has its goods and bads. But its getting bashed for the wrong reasons here. First off, they are not doing a mock draft right now. They are simply placing players in the order they think they should be drafted irregardless of the teams drafting them. Plain and simple. Second of all, they have the big kid from Bradley going in 2007 if you look closer. So they are not excluding him. I also have Reddick rated high. I think #7 is about right. Heck, if I am dying for some shooting I might take him higher.


You're definitely correct. I've browsed nbadraft.net ever since their message board era about 6 years ago. They never did an official mock draft until the couple weeks leading up to the draft. Until then, they merely rank players by draft stock, not by how teams will pick them.

And yes, Patrick O'Bryant (the Bradley center) was bumped to the 2007 draft board for some reason. But there is still a good chance he enters the draft this year. Especially if he's projected to be top 10 like they say he could be.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> You're definitely correct. I've browsed nbadraft.net ever since their message board era about 6 years ago. They never did an official mock draft until the couple weeks leading up to the draft. Until then, they merely rank players by draft stock, not by how teams will pick them.
> 
> And yes, Patrick O'Bryant (the Bradley center) was bumped to the 2007 draft board for some reason. But there is still a good chance he enters the draft this year. Especially if he's projected to be top 10 like they say he could be.


OBryant would be stupid to NOT ENTER THIS DRAFT. 07 looks like he would be one of about 17 first round prospects who are 6-9 or taller. In this draft, he would be about the only 7 footer of any note. Its about the law of supply and demand. No supply this year drives up his stock. I cant remember the big kid from Western Kentucky (Chris something or other), who passed up the draft and then hurt his knee. The kid needs to think about his future and his stock, and its an obvious choice. Come out. This year he is a top 7 pick. Next year, somewhere in the top 15, plus he risks injury. Not a hard choice.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> OBryant would be stupid to NOT ENTER THIS DRAFT. 07 looks like he would be one of about 17 first round prospects who are 6-9 or taller. In this draft, he would be about the only 7 footer of any note. Its about the law of supply and demand. No supply this year drives up his stock. I cant remember the big kid from Western Kentucky (Chris something or other), who passed up the draft and then hurt his knee. The kid needs to think about his future and his stock, and its an obvious choice. Come out. This year he is a top 7 pick. Next year, somewhere in the top 15, plus he risks injury. Not a hard choice.



I think his name was Chris Marcus and I remember seeing him during March Madness and was like 'Wow, who is this guy?" 

I agree, O'Bryant would be making a bad decision passing up an inflated value cause of next year, which will see some tremendous value available for big men in the mid of round one.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Its just as much or a risk to come out too early 


OK your say a #7 - #10 pick and your get paid a guaranteed $5M over 3 years 

You get on a team and your not ready and the Coach believes you have to earn your minutes , your not good enough yet so you don't , the team sends you down to the DL and you have punks taking shots at the NBA guy that got sent down and you have big injury concerns there ..you don't make it back and develop and the team doesn't pick up your option and then its like C'ya.

Chris Duhon could have come out after his Soph campaign and he probably would have been a lottery pick but he stayed when 4 year college players had a stench.

This tide has turned 

But anyway he stayed went 2nd round and played him into a $10M contract over a similar period of time and made more money then what he may have if he came out too early. I think he always would have made it anyway - he's just one of those guys

But by staying and being honest with yourself as to whether you are ready as a basketballer and as a competitor is crucial if you are going to have a career and make a lot more money over the course of that career as opposed to someone who's just playing the lottery to get their 3 year gteed and hope they develop and stick thereafter even if deep down within themselves they know they are not right yet


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> You're definitely correct. I've browsed nbadraft.net ever since their message board era about 6 years ago. They never did an official mock draft until the couple weeks leading up to the draft. Until then, they merely rank players by draft stock, not by how teams will pick them.


My personal view is that Hoopshype mock is more on the money then nbadraft.net

I have no dramas with nbadraft.net's top 10 - 12 but I think they are a bit flaky after that

I can't be convinced that Foye, Gibson and Collins are ranked higher than Ager

And those players plus Boone , Roby , Gray and Milsap - plus a couple of Euro's I haven't seen are ranked ahead of Paul Davis - probably one of the most if not the most effective and productive Center in College basketball

Gimme a frickin break

On ranking and on team need Davis goes late lottery.

Book it

Hoops Hype have him at #12 and Armstrong at #15 which I think is about right


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Its just as much or a risk to come out too early
> 
> 
> OK your say a #7 - #10 pick and your get paid a guaranteed $5M over 3 years
> 
> You get on a team and your not ready and the Coach believes you have to earn your minutes , your not good enough yet so you don't , the team sends you down to the DL and you have punks taking shots at the NBA guy that got sent down and you have big injury concerns there ..you don't make it back and develop and the team doesn't pick up your option and then its like C'ya.
> 
> Chris Duhon could have come out after his Soph campaign and he probably would have been a lottery pick but he stayed when 4 year college players had a stench.
> 
> This tide has turned
> 
> But anyway he stayed went 2nd round and played him into a $10M contract over a similar period of time and made more money then what he may have if he came out too early. I think he always would have made it anyway - he's just one of those guys
> 
> But by staying and being honest with yourself as to whether you are ready as a basketballer and as a competitor is crucial if you are going to have a career and make a lot more money over the course of that career as opposed to someone who's just playing the lottery to get their 3 year gteed and hope they develop and stick thereafter even if deep down within themselves they know they are not right yet



For every Chris Duhon there is 10 Chris Marcus's or 10 Randy Livingstons. If your stock says lottery pick, and you know the next draft is very heavy in your position, then there is not an advisor in the world who would tell the kid go back to school. The contracts are guaranteed, you take care of your family and yourself and you learn the game still. I think being on an NBA bench or the NBDL, IMO, is better then the competition Bradley faces.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> For every Chris Duhon there is 10 Chris Marcus's or 10 Randy Livingstons. If your stock says lottery pick, and you know the next draft is very heavy in your position, then there is not an advisor in the world who would tell the kid go back to school. The contracts are guaranteed, you take care of your family and yourself and you learn the game still. I think being on an NBA bench or the NBDL, IMO, is better then the competition Bradley faces.


I just think in a lot of cases there is a self serving short term view of "The Advisor" that isn't necessarily in the best interests of the player

For every Chris Marcus or Randy Livingston there are thousands of DeAngelo Collins , Jamal Sampsons , Will Avery , Kedrick Brown's , Skita's etc etc 

Of course a lot of kids get advised that they are first round picks too y'know and end up doing a Rashard in the green room 

All I am saying is that its not a lay down mesare in every case that its the right thing to do - because common sense and history proves otherwise 

You just have to be honest with yourself ( if you can ) and figure out what's best for you and what you need .

Unfortunately a lot of these boys are not well advised and are motivated by other things and other people that takes the focus away from where they actually are in their development and their basketball career right now 

Big ups to Charlie Villanueva and LaMarcus Aldridge who could have gone straight from high school and were honest enough with themselves with the right people around them to help them make the decision they needed to make 

And their stock when they were out of HS had them both as 1st round picks 

As a result of doing what they did they are the better basketballers for it which I think will give them a very solid base for a more prolonged NBA career , thereby earning more money , rather than being fed to the Wolves too early


----------



## The Krakken

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> My personal view is that Hoopshype mock is more on the money then nbadraft.net
> 
> I have no dramas with nbadraft.net's top 10 - 12 but I think they are a bit flaky after that
> 
> I can't be convinced that Foye, Gibson and Collins are ranked higher than Ager
> 
> And those players plus Boone , Roby , Gray and Milsap - plus a couple of Euro's I haven't seen are ranked ahead of Paul Davis - probably one of the most if not the most effective and productive Center in College basketball
> 
> Gimme a frickin break
> 
> On ranking and on team need Davis goes late lottery.
> 
> Book it
> 
> Hoops Hype have him at #12 and Armstrong at #15 which I think is about right


Morrison at #3 to the bulls? :nonono:


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The Krakken said:


> Morrison at #3 to the bulls? :nonono:


Well like it or not he's a consensus top 3 pick


----------



## DaBullz

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Well like it or not he's a consensus top 3 pick


Yeah, but how's his DNA test results?


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> Yeah, but how's his DNA test results?


Oh hilarious.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The Krakken said:


> Morrison at #3 to the bulls? :nonono:


I think it's been said twice in this thread that nbadraft.net does not have a mock draft right now. They're merely ranking the players by draft stock. Their real mock doesn't come until the draft lottery is completed in May.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

If the Bulls pick 4th, Aldridge and Barganini are off the board, and they don't get a good enough deal to trade the pick I'd take Tyrus Thomas. It's a gamble, but to get a superstar you have to be lucky. To me, he's the bigman with the best chance of being a star after the aformentioned two.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> If the Bulls pick 4th, Aldridge and Barganini are off the board, and they don't get a good enough deal to trade the pick I'd take Tyrus Thomas. It's a gamble, but to get a superstar you have to be lucky. To me, he's the bigman with the best chance of being a star after the aformentioned two.


I have some tape on him and plan to watch him tomorrow some. I have heard a huge range of comparisons. Hakim Warrick and Stromile Swift have been mentioned. But I have also had heard Amare Stoudamire and Andre Kirilenko. So that is a wide range. I would love to him matched up against Aldridge or Williams to get a better feel for how good he is. But apparently he played very well against UConn and killed Boone. 

Sausage mentioned a guy earlier in this thread that I have seen who I think is special, unfortunately at a position we dont need. Shawnee Williams of Memphis. I mean, he really appears to be a cross between Pip and Schrempf. Point forward with all the athleticism you can want. Definetely falls into the rlucas realm of what I think the perfect player is. Getting him and maybe Thomas would increase the athleticism on this team tremendously. Without knowing where we pick, those 2 in some combination or along with Aldridge, Morrison, Gay and Reddick (I confess, I like the kid) would be good for me.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> I have some tape on him and plan to watch him tomorrow some. I have heard a huge range of comparisons. Hakim Warrick and Stromile Swift have been mentioned. But I have also had heard Amare Stoudamire and Andre Kirilenko. So that is a wide range. I would love to him matched up against Aldridge or Williams to get a better feel for how good he is. But apparently he played very well against UConn and killed Boone.
> 
> Sausage mentioned a guy earlier in this thread that I have seen who I think is special, unfortunately at a position we dont need. Shawnee Williams of Memphis. I mean, he really appears to be a cross between Pip and Schrempf. Point forward with all the athleticism you can want. Definetely falls into the rlucas realm of what I think the perfect player is. Getting him and maybe Thomas would increase the athleticism on this team tremendously. Without knowing where we pick, those 2 in some combination or along with Aldridge, Morrison, Gay and Reddick (I confess, I like the kid) would be good for me.


I haven't seen Williams but the comparison I've read the most is to Rashard Lewis. I didn't know that he had a point forward's floor game.

Do you like Carney? 

Unless there is a guy who the Bulls think can be a big-time player, I think the Bulls should go big with both picks. It gives them a better chance of landing a good one. I would be happy (right now at least) with Thomas and Splitter.


----------



## ztect

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> For every Chris Marcus or Randy Livingston there are thousands of DeAngelo Collins , Jamal Sampsons , Will Avery , Kedrick Brown's , Skita's etc etc


In defense of Chris Marcus, the guy had a bad foot/ankle and that's why he went undrafted. 300lbs on a bad foot/ankle is not a good thing.

If Marcus had left school a year earlier, he would have been a lotto pick


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

btw, I don't think the Trajon Langdon or even Steve Kerr comparisons are good for Reddick. The guy moves much better without the ball and can shoot on the move. In fact, he's kind of like a shorter, less athletic Rip with more range (or a short Reggie Miller -- minus the D).


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> btw, I don't think the Trajon Langdon or even Steve Kerr comparisons are good for Reddick. The guy moves much better without the ball and can shoot on the move. In fact, he's kind of like a shorter, less athletic Rip with more range (or a short Reggie Miller).



A smaller Glen Rice in my opinion, maybe not the athlete.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I haven't seen Williams but the comparison I've read the most is to Rashard Lewis. I didn't know that he had a point forward's floor game.
> 
> Do you like Carney?
> 
> Unless there is a guy who the Bulls think can be a big-time player, I think the Bulls should go big with both picks. It gives them a better chance of landing a good one. I would be happy (right now at least) with Thomas and Splitter.


I like Carney TD. But he is a true SF. And he will be a real good one, but I am not convinced he is an upgrade to Deng. My thesis on Shawnee Williams is that Williams provides an element to the club that we dont have. At 6-9 1/2 225, with handles, athleticism and the ability to create for himself or others, he gives the Bulls a player, atleast in year one, who can come off the bench and play alot of different positions and roles while he develops his game and maturity. The Bulls, as I have stated, dont get alot of easy dunks or fast break points. The guards cant finish at the rim and the bigs are not athletic enough to finish. So Williams can help out there. The Bulls certainly can use his reach and versatility. 

Here is his NBAdraft.net profile for reference. They compare him to Walt Williams which I dont think does his much justice. I really see some of Pips type of game in a more Detlef Shrempf type of body. And before I get roasted, I am not saying he will be in the same ballpark as Pippen, but clearly his game is modeled some on #33

http://nbadraft.net/profiles/shawnewilliams.asp


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ztect said:


> In defense of Chris Marcus, the guy had a bad foot/ankle and that's why he went undrafted. 300lbs on a bad foot/ankle is not a good thing.
> 
> If Marcus had left school a year earlier, he would have been a lotto pick



And he screwed himself by not taking the millions. Same with Randy Livingston or a guy like Terrence Morris from Maryland. When your stock is high, sell. In the stock market there is this little saying. Bulls make money, Bears make money but Pigs get slaughtered. Players who are first round picks, even out of HS, are stupid to not take the money. To stay in school for a year to help your draft stock when your guaranteed millions are pigs. And pigs, sometimes, do get slaughtered. Often times now that I think about it.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> I like Carney TD. But he is a true SF. And he will be a real good one, but I am not convinced he is an upgrade to Deng. My thesis on Shawnee Williams is that Williams provides an element to the club that we dont have. At 6-9 1/2 225, with handles, athleticism and the ability to create for himself or others, he gives the Bulls a player, atleast in year one, who can come off the bench and play alot of different positions and roles while he develops his game and maturity. The Bulls, as I have stated, dont get alot of easy dunks or fast break points. The guards cant finish at the rim and the bigs are not athletic enough to finish. So Williams can help out there. The Bulls certainly can use his reach and versatility.
> 
> Here is his NBAdraft.net profile for reference. They compare him to Walt Williams which I dont think does his much justice. I really see some of Pips type of game in a more Detlef Shrempf type of body. And before I get roasted, I am not saying he will be in the same ballpark as Pippen, but clearly his game is modeled some on #33
> 
> http://nbadraft.net/profiles/shawnewilliams.asp


Well we agree on Shawne Williams lucas

Walt Williams ?

WTF ?

Not even remotely close IMO 

This guy glides and Walt lumbered 

Before we get all Pip ga' ga'd ... I'm actually thinking a smoother more polished Andre Igoudala with more natural scoring ability..dare I say approaching a TMac type upside

I think he can be that good and I like him a lot more than any other swing wing in the draft


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> And he screwed himself by not taking the millions. Same with Randy Livingston or a guy like Terrence Morris from Maryland. When your stock is high, sell. In the stock market there is this little saying. Bulls make money, Bears make money but Pigs get slaughtered. Players who are first round picks, even out of HS, are stupid to not take the money. To stay in school for a year to help your draft stock when your guaranteed millions are pigs. And pigs, sometimes, do get slaughtered. Often times now that I think about it.


Your opinion seems weighted toward it all being about the money in the short term and to hell with basketball 

I think your stock analogy is off and too simplistic 

But let's take stocks right now in the analogy ... dot come stocks from 4 or 5 years ago 

Any of those prematurely list before they were fundamentally ready and then crawled up their own arse and die when they couldn't cut it

Depends where your integrity and long range vision is and whether you want to be shearing that sheep ( while doing the Dr Dolittle farmyard metaphor thing as well ) for 10 years or do you want to skin it and be gone in 3 ?

I'll tell you now if you do it honestly and right you'll make more money over 10 then what you'll make over 3 if your a firecracker


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ztect said:


> In defense of Chris Marcus, the guy had a bad foot/ankle and that's why he went undrafted. 300lbs on a bad foot/ankle is not a good thing.
> 
> If Marcus had left school a year earlier, he would have been a lotto pick


In the year he was thought to be coming out he started off projected high because of his size and then as he got scouted more his footspeed and athleticism became came to the fore and he was hovering in the mid first to late first round 

But whether he and his advisers got their noses put out of joint because they had an initial buzz and then they were being told that they weren't lottery guaranteed and for the reasons why ( re : he was too slow and unathletic ) ...and as to whether this made them sit and wait.. who knows ?

My memory is that he was already sliding before he got injured and that just pretty much decided it


----------



## lupa_bulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> Shelden Williams?
> 
> *Any big man getting 10 blocks in any game is showing me something...point blank.*
> 
> 
> Looking like Elton Brand Lite.


Check out tihs guy, Justin Williams. He is from Chicago, went same high school as Eddy Curry, now playing for Wyoming. This year stats: 11.3 PPG, 10.3 RPG, 5.8 BPG, 50% FG, 55% FT in 29 MPG. Not bad if you ask me. Link: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=22585 
He plays as PF at 6-10 and 225. Has a great wingspan and is great defender, good rebounder, good work ethic. Maybe we should consider this guy. www.nbadraft.net and www.draftexpress.com rank him in mid second round.


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## lupa_bulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I like LaMarcus Aldridge very much and we should trade up to get him. He'll be star. He will add 20 pounds, has great work ethic, great potential and skills, high bball IQ, is willing to learn and is coachable. I'd trade both this year's picks + Sweetney to get him. If we can't get him, lets get two bigs and hope one of the will pan out, in this order:
Splitter
Shelden
Paul Davis
Tyrus Thomas
Josh Boone
Nick Fazekas
I would also consider Hilton Armstrong, Justin Williams, Yemi Nicholson
I wouldn't draft SG, our backcourt is set, we just need big defensive SG for spot minutes, we could get that through FA


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Your opinion seems weighted toward it all being about the money in the short term and to hell with basketball
> 
> I think your stock analogy is off and too simplistic
> 
> But let's take stocks right now in the analogy ... dot come stocks from 4 or 5 years ago
> 
> Any of those prematurely list before they were fundamentally ready and then crawled up their own arse and die when they couldn't cut it
> 
> Depends where your integrity and long range vision is and whether you want to be shearing that sheep ( while doing the Dr Dolittle farmyard metaphor thing as well ) for 10 years or do you want to skin it and be gone in 3 ?
> 
> I'll tell you now if you do it honestly and right you'll make more money over 10 then what you'll make over 3 if your a firecracker



This is about the person, plain and simple. There have been way too many guys who might have made it who waited because some coach in college needed them for self serving purposes who really screwed themselves. Chris Marcus, Randy Livingston, et al. You talk of all the advisers who tell kids to come out and how they got screwed. Well, those guys simply were not good enough to make it anyway. Or they felt, due to family concerns (which apparently you dont take into account, like Deangelo Collins for instance) to go for it now, which I would agree isnt good long term thinking. And if they were smart they would have known that, but who are we to tell them it was "wrong". We dont walk in their shoes. And it works the other way as well. Coaches telling kids to stay when in fact they make guaranteed money in the NBA. The point is, college isnt for everyone. And anyone who thinks that it is pretty mindless. If a kid can make a good living in the NBA right now, take it. Dont risk it. And if you love the game, and work at it, youll benefit far more practicing against NBA people (or playing in the NBDL) everyday then playing against college kids who have no hope for the next level. Thats just the truth. Eventually the cream rises to the top, college development or not. I mean, would college have made Lebron any better? Or Kobe? Or KG? Probably not. It wouldnt help them. And I truly believe someone like Elton Brand would be as good today learning on an NBA bench then going to Duke. Its about passion for the game and good headskills. Does anyone really think Kwame Brown would have been helped by college? I dont.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> If the Bulls pick 4th, Aldridge and Barganini are off the board, and they don't get a good enough deal to trade the pick I'd take Tyrus Thomas. It's a gamble, but to get a superstar you have to be lucky. To me, he's the bigman with the best chance of being a star after the aformentioned two.


If that's the case, that meas that either Gay or Morrison are there at four in which case I'd take one of them over Thomas.


----------



## JPBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Splitter would look so good in the Bulls. Our frontcourt with him and Chandler would be one of the best defensive frontcourts in the NBA, he is just amazing defending his man. In his last 6 games he started to receive regular minutes and is having amazing stats. He is avaraging 15,2 pts and 8,5 rebounds, 1,3 blocks and 1,1 steals hiting 67% of his FG. Everybody that ever follow the european games know how amazing this stats are, and stats doesn´t even show his amazing defensive impact on the games.

And I dont think his stock will go sky high because of the Vasquez problem last year, so I think he could easily fall in our lap. And his defense wont let him be a bust in the NBA, it alone will make him play 25 minutes per game. He should be gaining more atention, he is almost everything we need , if he had a better ofensive game (although he is an underated ofensive player), he would be perfect.

Pax need to travel to scout him, and he clearly has the jib!!


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JPBulls said:


> Splitter would be so good in the Bulls. Our frontcourt with him and Chandler would be one of the best defensive frontcourts in the NBA, he is just amazing defending his man. In his last 6 games he started to receive regular minutes and is having amazing stats. He is avaraging 15,2 pts and 8,5 rebounds, 1,3 blocks and 1,1 steals hiting 67% of his FG. Everybody that ever follow the european games know how amazing this stats are, and stats doesn´t even show his amazing defensive impact on the games.
> 
> And I dont think his stock will go sky high because of the Vasquez problem last year, so I think he could easily fall in our lap. And his defense wont let him be a bust in the NBA, it alone will make him play 25 minutes per game. He should be gaining more atention, he is almost everything we need , if he had a better ofensive game (although he is an underated ofensive player), he would be perfect.
> 
> Pax need to travel to scout him, and he clearly has the jib!!


I saw Tyrus Thomas today and Id put them in the same boat. Tyrus Thomas could really shore up alot of things for this club. Splitter as well. It depends on where we draft. But if they walk away with Thomas/Splitter and Shawnee Williams I would be impressed. Given time, they could be the core of a good team


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> This is about the person, plain and simple. There have been way too many guys who might have made it who waited because some coach in college needed them for self serving purposes who really screwed themselves. Chris Marcus, Randy Livingston, et al. You talk of all the advisers who tell kids to come out and how they got screwed. Well, those guys simply were not good enough to make it anyway. Or they felt, due to family concerns (which apparently you dont take into account, like Deangelo Collins for instance) to go for it now, which I would agree isnt good long term thinking. And if they were smart they would have known that, but who are we to tell them it was "wrong". We dont walk in their shoes. And it works the other way as well. Coaches telling kids to stay when in fact they make guaranteed money in the NBA. The point is, college isnt for everyone. And anyone who thinks that it is pretty mindless. If a kid can make a good living in the NBA right now, take it. Dont risk it. And if you love the game, and work at it, youll benefit far more practicing against NBA people (or playing in the NBDL) everyday then playing against college kids who have no hope for the next level. Thats just the truth. Eventually the cream rises to the top, college development or not. I mean, would college have made Lebron any better? Or Kobe? Or KG? Probably not. It wouldnt help them. And I truly believe someone like Elton Brand would be as good today learning on an NBA bench then going to Duke. Its about passion for the game and good headskills. Does anyone really think Kwame Brown would have been helped by college? I dont.


All fair points and I agree 

Its a horses for courses type of thing for the individual

All I'm saying just because someone has been told they are a "lock" to get drafted doesn't mean they necesssarily have to go or should go.

Some guys wwould be amde not to because they are ready .

Some aren't and get eaten ,chewed and spat out and they would have been better off preparing better on the next level down.

I say again Aldridge and Villanueva are very good examples of this point 

And yeah I here you that College ain't for everyone ..like the Amare's and Lebron's etc. Agree wholeheartedly.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JPBulls said:


> Splitter would look so good in the Bulls. Our frontcourt with him and Chandler would be one of the best defensive frontcourts in the NBA, he is just amazing defending his man. In his last 6 games he started to receive regular minutes and is having amazing stats. He is avaraging 15,2 pts and 8,5 rebounds, 1,3 blocks and 1,1 steals hiting 67% of his FG. Everybody that ever follow the european games know how amazing this stats are, and stats doesn´t even show his amazing defensive impact on the games.
> 
> And I dont think his stock will go sky high because of the Vasquez problem last year, so I think he could easily fall in our lap. And his defense wont let him be a bust in the NBA, it alone will make him play 25 minutes per game. He should be gaining more atention, he is almost everything we need , if he had a better ofensive game (although he is an underated ofensive player), he would be perfect.
> 
> Pax need to travel to scout him, and he clearly has the jib!!


The draft express website clearly thinks highly of Tiago Splitter. He's definitely an option for the Bulls that has not been discussed much on this board. He seems like a good, long, all-around skilled big man with alot of defensive intensity. We could use that for sure.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> The draft express website clearly thinks highly of Tiago Splitter. He's definitely an option for the Bulls that has not been discussed much on this board. He seems like a good, long, all-around skilled big man with alot of defensive intensity. We could use that for sure.



I though Rlucas adopted Splitter a few years ago. Splitter would be a very good option.

I think we are realistically looking at a choice between Gay, Splitter and Thomas. Right now, I think all three would be a benefit. Gay cause of his future (damn P word). Splitter and Thomas cause they would be an immediate upgrade over the current roster slot holder.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> I though Rlucas adopted Splitter a few years ago. Splitter would be a very good option.
> 
> I think we are realistically looking at a choice between Gay, Splitter and Thomas. Right now, I think all three would be a benefit. Gay cause of his future (damn P word). Splitter and Thomas cause they would be an immediate upgrade over the current roster slot holder.


I'd edit that to say that Thomas would not only be an upgrade now but also has that "damned P word."


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Looks like the bulls have some SERIOUS decisions to make for this up-coming draft.

The only players I'm concerned with are :

Tiago Splitter
Rudy Gay
LaMarcus Aldridge
Adam Morrison


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Looks like the bulls have some SERIOUS decisions to make for this up-coming draft.
> 
> The only players I'm concerned with are :
> 
> Tiago Splitter
> Rudy Gay
> LaMarcus Aldridge
> Adam Morrison



You'd be missing some real talent by not looking at Bargnani and Thomas.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> You'd be missing some real talent by not looking at Bargnani and Thomas.


true, but really all the talk is premature..

the BULLS pick could could fall anywhere between 14 and 1 if we miss the playoffs or make the lottery...

even new york's pick could land at some unlucky number for us..

so while we're thinking top 5 and top 10 pick..we could wind up with the 12th and 13th pick of the balls bounce the wrong way...


----------



## remlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Can someone who has seen Morrison play extensively give me an opinion on his defense? I have seen him for about a game and a half this season and wasnt really paying close attention to his defense.

The reason i ask, is i heard Rick Majerus commenting on Morrison saying he couldnt guard anyone even if he had a "gun and a night stick"


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

One reason why I don't like nbadraft.net -


> 11. Chicago Rajon Rondo 6-2 171 PG Kentucky So.
> 12. Golden St. Tiago Splitter 6-11 236 PF Brazil 1985


Anyone have more reasonable places to look at mock drafts?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



step said:


> One reason why I don't like nbadraft.net -
> 
> Anyone have more reasonable places to look at mock drafts?


It's not a mock draft. It's a value board transposed over the current team rankings.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



remlover said:


> Can someone who has seen Morrison play extensively give me an opinion on his defense? I have seen him for about a game and a half this season and wasnt really paying close attention to his defense.
> 
> The reason i ask, is i heard Rick Majerus commenting on Morrison saying he couldnt guard anyone even if he had a "gun and a night stick"



His defense isn't that bad, but it isn't very good either. Tough to tell if it's because of lack of athleticism, indifference or the fact that he's carrying the offensive load. Even Kobe falters ont eh defensive end when he's carrying the offensive load.

Even still, I'm not a fan of Morrison on the Bulls. Morrison in the NBA, yes. but not for us.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I posted this in a different thread, but thought it was more appropriate here.

Let me say, I'm no Rlucas, but I am following this draft carefully because of our chances of two lottery picks. Last time that happened we had the Fizer/Crawford debacle.

If we got the Number one pick - Paxson would look to trade down a slot or three. I wouldn't blame him really. There is no clear cut Number 1 and in the top six you have six very good players who will contribute to their teams. 

Here is my current order:

1 - LaMarcus Aldrige - Steady and has alot more potential. He can man the center position for the next 10 years for us. He's not spectacular, but will show those occassional times of taking over the post position. He'll struggle early as he adjusts in the NBA, but should be very solid to very good for a long time. He's number one on my list because of our desperate team need and he does have a lot of talent on both ends of the floor. I wish he showed more fire.

2 - Bargnani - No, I haven't seen him. I've read everything I can get my hands on about this guy and what I read makes me salivate. if Chandler were to continue to be consistently strong ont he defensive end and develop more agressiveness on the offensive end of the floor; Bargnani might be the besst choice. He appears to be the real package that can excel on both ends of the floor and will open up the entire floor for the inside and outside. Very intriguing, just wish we could see what the scouts are seeing in person. Gotta put your faith in the scouts on this guy.

3 - Rudy Gay - We've all been clamoring for a Superstar type player. This guy shows those flashes and more. If he was more consistent he'd be a lock. However, he's on a very good team and can be a bit laid back during games. Almost too content to be a superstar. Still, he is talent oozing everywhere. If somehow we ended up with say 2 and 5 he'd be a definite target. I think his individual workouts will turn up the buzz machine big time on him.


4 - Tiago Splitter - This guy is Rlucas' find from a year or two ago. Since then I have read everything I could about him. Another player I wish we could see, but have to rely on scouts for. His overall game is ready for the NBA and he fills mutliple needs. He is gonna make some team, and Rlucas, very happy.

5 - Tyrus Thomas - Yes, before Morrison. The reason is simple. The guy is an insane specimen of athleticism and will immediately be a defensive presence. He has good hands and seems to have good BB IQ (two things Chandler has little of). He and Chandler would be an insane defensive duo..........but equally poor offensive duo. Tough one, but he definitely fills a need and if he grows another inch or two (he grew 2 inches last summer) and continues to develop his offensive game.....he'd be insane.

6 - Adam Morrison - yes, he is a scoring machine. Dead eye with coolness running through his veins. He can score at will (atelast at the collegiate level) and has great court vision. He is instant offense. Hoever, on the defensive end, he is very average when he tries. When he doesn't try, a coach like Skiles will bench him. I have a really hard time seeing Morrison fitting in our team system and meshing with our team philosophy. Again, we have no inside presence and have a pourous defense. Two things I think a team picking him must excel at.

Honorable mention - Brewer, Carney, Williams and Williams. 

Overall, I am very happy with having the knicks pick and think we are gonna get a valuable piece of the puzzle with that pick. If we make make the playoffs (and I hope we do) there is still plenty ofvalue in the middle of the first round. Plus, Pax may be able to package it for another piece.

Alot really depends on CHandler showing us consistency and development to be locked in as a starter at either the C or PF position.


I really believe our Knicks pick will be int he top 6. Thus any one of these guys would be great by me for the Bulls; except Morrison, but I think he will be great trade bait.


----------



## fleetwood macbull

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

ya I also posted in the other thread my concerns about Morrison, and his diabetes, and the way he sometimes fades in second halves. No way to tell if he has to conserve energy on the defensive end because of diabetes, if hes just bad, or a combination of both. For coach Skiles, he's have to coach around that. Morrison's such a poor defender for some reason. Don't be generous about it, he's not just "not good". He's poor on D. He's always in the right spot....but he's a poor individual defender with lateral movement issues.
Anyway, he and Reddick are by far the most fun to watch in college to me so far

Yeah, to bypass some of these big players, things have to be unequal, Like Gay comes on very strong in the end (ahh thats the **** reference i was looking for :biggrin: ). All things being equal, you take the best graded big. I really haven't seen enough of these players yet to form a great opinion. Let alone the foriegn guys. Wait till tourney time


----------



## fleetwood macbull

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I have seen a couple Memphis games, and Carney strikes me as a better Pro than college player (and he's good) with those tools he has. Would be a great coup for Pax to find a way to get him. Too bad the Bulls pick may end up being too low, as i think his stock will rise somewhat after the tournament. I don't care about his position. We need long athletic players on the wing. He could be a Marion type


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I have to say, Rudy Gay looks EXACTLY like Luol Deng did in college, except with more athleticism. Think a hybrid between Deng and Iguodala, but as raw as both were when they entered the league.

He goes into the post like Deng did, works in the open court with his length like Deng did, steps out for outside shots like Deng did. I really think there's a new genereation of "pure SF" type player emerging that we haven't seen for a while. Guys that really play the 3 position with all its versatility, not just as SG/SF's or SF/PF's. Deng, Iggy, Gay, Marvin Williams, and a few others. They are TRUE SF's.

With Jamal Mashburn and Ron Artest paving the way and other less talented but very pure SF types (Shane Battier is a great example), the NBA has more of these valuable types. We still don't see one at the ultra-elite level (T-Mac's a true SG in a long body, Garnett is a positionless PF, and Shawn Marion is actually a SF/PF), but we may soon.

I digress. Rudy Gay is going to be in that class of players too, but somehow, I think we've got a talent almost exactly as good in Deng.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

And gosh, can Aaron Gray finally get some love?! I've been talking about this guy for the last three weeks, and he's made a blip on no one's mock drafts. The big guy can actually play, competing against studs like Boone and Armstrong, essentially carrying his team's hopes of winning that terrific Conn/Pitt game last night. I wish I could have watched it, but the commentators kept mentioning Gray.

This is a guy I'd love to get in the 2nd round. He'd make a terrific, tough, backup big with great size.

If we HAD a second rounder, that is.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Hoopshype.com has us taking Morrison with the #3 pick & Shelden Williams with the #10 pick.

not bad.

If Aldridge can play the C fulltime in the NBA, we NEED to take him.


----------



## narek

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

A Pax scouting sighting at a Bradley game: http://www.pjstar.com/stories/020206/BRA_B8SADTDU.077.shtml



> Braves briefs: Eight NBA scouts representing six teams were in attendance at Carver. Chicago Bulls general manager John Paxson was among the group


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Good to see Pax scouting Patrick O'Bryant. I think if he were to declare this season he'd be Mid First where we will pick if we make the playoffs.

That's being proactive. Good job by Pax and his guys to be ahead of the curve.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

draft.net has us taking Thomas at 4 and Rajon Rondo at 11:hurl: *over* Tiago Splitter


----------



## Showtyme

*Let's Start Thinking About Trading Our Pick*

We pulled off a nice deal to trade up to the #7 spot that year to get Deng. I think we should be looking for a reverse trade this year. 

Why? Mainly because not only is 2007 a juicier FA class, from watching college ball a lot more this season I'm convinced that 2007 is a better big man class as well. Sasha Kaun is impressive sometimes, Josh McRoberts will pan out pretty well at Duke, Patrick O'Bryant may come out in 07, Jason Smith from Colorado looks like a stud, Roy Hibbert from Georgetown looks like a manbeast, Aaron Gray is a winning 7-footer.

How many big men can we really legitimately point to in this year's draft? A few, but how many are 6-10 or over? Even my guy, Shelden Williams, is admittedly going to be a full-time PF and couldn't take too many minutes at C if we needed him to.

How about trading our own pick + Sweetney to Houston for 2006 2nd rounder and their 2007 first rounder, top 5 protected? Houston is in desperate need for more guys in the roster. Sweetney could help them out right now and our pick will give them a good shot at a much better player this year when they need the depth.

I just feel like Houston is so starved for talent right now that they'd be interested in this deal, and I'd much rather have two first rounders next year than two first rounders this year (the Knicks pick I like but our own pick I feel might not be all that valuable).


----------



## darlets

*Re: Let's Start Thinking About Trading Our Pick*



Showtyme said:


> We pulled off a nice deal to trade up to the #7 spot that year to get Deng. I think we should be looking for a reverse trade this year.
> 
> Why? Mainly because not only is 2007 a juicier FA class, from watching college ball a lot more this season I'm convinced that 2007 is a better big man class as well. Sasha Kaun is impressive sometimes, Josh McRoberts will pan out pretty well at Duke, Patrick O'Bryant may come out in 07, Jason Smith from Colorado looks like a stud, Roy Hibbert from Georgetown looks like a manbeast, Aaron Gray is a winning 7-footer.
> 
> How many big men can we really legitimately point to in this year's draft? A few, but how many are 6-10 or over? Even my guy, Shelden Williams, is admittedly going to be a full-time PF and couldn't take too many minutes at C if we needed him to.
> 
> How about trading our own pick + Sweetney to Houston for 2006 2nd rounder and their 2007 first rounder, top 5 protected? Houston is in desperate need for more guys in the roster. Sweetney could help them out right now and our pick will give them a good shot at a much better player this year when they need the depth.
> 
> I just feel like Houston is so starved for talent right now that they'd be interested in this deal, and I'd much rather have two first rounders next year than two first rounders this year (the Knicks pick I like but our own pick I feel might not be all that valuable).


I'd go with this. I think also it be better to add two rookies in 2007. We're young enough already. Adding one this year and two free agents will be enough to adjust to.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Let's Start Thinking About Trading Our Pick*



Showtyme said:


> We pulled off a nice deal to trade up to the #7 spot that year to get Deng. I think we should be looking for a reverse trade this year.
> 
> Why? Mainly because not only is 2007 a juicier FA class, from watching college ball a lot more this season I'm convinced that 2007 is a better big man class as well. Sasha Kaun is impressive sometimes, Josh McRoberts will pan out pretty well at Duke, Patrick O'Bryant may come out in 07, Jason Smith from Colorado looks like a stud, Roy Hibbert from Georgetown looks like a manbeast, Aaron Gray is a winning 7-footer.
> 
> How many big men can we really legitimately point to in this year's draft? A few, but how many are 6-10 or over? Even my guy, Shelden Williams, is admittedly going to be a full-time PF and couldn't take too many minutes at C if we needed him to.
> 
> How about trading our own pick + Sweetney to Houston for 2006 2nd rounder and their 2007 first rounder, top 5 protected? Houston is in desperate need for more guys in the roster. Sweetney could help them out right now and our pick will give them a good shot at a much better player this year when they need the depth.
> 
> I just feel like Houston is so starved for talent right now that they'd be interested in this deal, and I'd much rather have two first rounders next year than two first rounders this year (the Knicks pick I like but our own pick I feel might not be all that valuable).



Im waiting for this to get bashed. I have said this a dozen times and morons keep saying that its a dumb idea or that itll never happen. But Show, I guess you have more goodwill then I do.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Let's Start Thinking About Trading Our Pick*



rlucas4257 said:


> Im waiting for this to get bashed. I have said this a dozen times and morons keep saying that its a dumb idea or that itll never happen. But Show, I guess you have more goodwill then I do.


I'm not averse to trading one of our picks for a first in '07. I don't like the idea of holding our cap room for 07 though.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

How can people use the Pheonix deal as an example of the kind of trade the Bulls should do? Phoenix traded the 7th pick for the 21st pick. Maybe that's unlikely to happen but it is a risk and by allowing a team (Houston in the earlier example) to top 5 protect the pick next season the Bulls limit their reward. The Bulls take all the risk.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Let's Start Thinking About Trading Our Pick*



rlucas4257 said:


> Im waiting for this to get bashed. I have said this a dozen times and morons keep saying that its a dumb idea or that itll never happen. But Show, I guess you have more goodwill then I do.



Well Mate, I'm hoping you don't include me in the "MoooooRON" category. I don't think anyone's said it's a dumb idea. I think we've said it's too risky and there has been no difinitive cap number given for the question of what's left if we wait. (Again, I've seen numbers from 9 Million if we renounce Nocioni and Sweets, to 14 Million cause of cap increase).


But dealing with the trade the Bulls 1st round pick. In fact, I'd love to see us trade our pick for a pick next year, with ONE caviat. There's always a catch.

Let's wait until draft night and see who's off the board when we are picking. Let's say we're picking 12 or 13 and Splitter is there. Well, I would advocate keeping the pick and taking Splitter. Also, let's say, a few of the bright spots from next year declare this year as they get the advice that next year is the draft of Big Men. COming out this year would make more sense. Take a guy like O'Bryant. Again, we're drafting around 12 and he's there. Wouldn't it be reasonable to expect we'd be drafting similar to what a trade next year likely brings? Again, I am so thankful we got Deng. IMO Phoenix made a very bad decision. They should've waited to see how the draft fell to that point.

However, the reverse is also true. Let's say Tyrus Thomas and Patrick O'Bryant don't come out this year. Well, drafting at 10-12, I'd be trying to deal as fast as possible. Again, I think I and the MoooRON crowd are saying everyone needs to see what happens at the end of the year before suggesting we abandon Pax's "Moves like a Glacier GMing" and his vision. Let's be honest, Paxson is not the most creative when it comes to GMing. Yes, he got the #7 (because Phoenix chose us over the Celts), but there have been opportunites to get 2nd round picks for money, trade a future second for a desperately needed serviceable big man, etc..........

One reason I also hesitate to wait or advocate manuevers, is I don't think there are that many Isiah Thomas' as GM's. It takes two to tango. If we see it, it's reasonable to expect everyone else sees it. That is, afterall, what they're paid for. Not to mention, that's also why they pay scouts and advisors like you, Rlucas. If you were still working for a team, wouldn't you be pointing out all of this to that team? 

In my dream (or nightmare world since I want to make the playoffs), we get the 3 and 7. We luck into Bargnani cause someone takes Morrison. At 7, we grab Splitter. In FA we get a HEALTHY (must be convinced he can return to form) Nene and then John Salmons for a tall SG. We then have next year's early pick (Thank you Isiah and Eddy), a ton of assets to work with, and you know what, the SIGN and Trade route is usually what gets you that elusive superstar. Put together a sign and trade to Chicago, or I'm signing with the Hawks for Nothing.............

But, I may just be another Mooooe Ron.

Keep the faith Mate..........


Go Bulls!


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

draft article (amusing)


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> draft article (amusing)



Not worth the read..........Not funny or amusing.......just space filling.

Glad to see Draft Express step it down to another level.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Let's Start Thinking About Trading Our Pick*



Showtyme said:


> We pulled off a nice deal to trade up to the #7 spot that year to get Deng. I think we should be looking for a reverse trade this year.
> 
> Why? Mainly because not only is 2007 a juicier FA class, from watching college ball a lot more this season I'm convinced that 2007 is a better big man class as well. Sasha Kaun is impressive sometimes, Josh McRoberts will pan out pretty well at Duke, Patrick O'Bryant may come out in 07, Jason Smith from Colorado looks like a stud, Roy Hibbert from Georgetown looks like a manbeast, Aaron Gray is a winning 7-footer.
> 
> How many big men can we really legitimately point to in this year's draft? A few, but how many are 6-10 or over? Even my guy, Shelden Williams, is admittedly going to be a full-time PF and couldn't take too many minutes at C if we needed him to.


Show, I like the concept just fine but I guess I'm one of the morons that think it will never happen or at best has a very low percentage chance of happening 

If it is universally agreed that 2007 is the shaping as THE big man draft ..maybe a type of big man draft you get every once in a blue moon , then with the dearth of genuine size and quality around the league ..I am of the belief that must rational , sane front offices would keep their powder dry

Phoenix moved their pick for cap room to accommodate Nash and Richhardson ( and then inexplicably lost Joe Johnson )

We would not be moving a pick to free up cap space ( although this would be a by product of the move ) we would be moving a draft pick in 2006 in recognizance of what is likely to be a significantly more significant draft next year 

And doesn't the rest of the league realise this too?

I think so 

The teams that could likely want an extra draft pick this year are team's that are in a stage of building through the draft right now and out of those teams we should only be wanting to draft teams that will likely suck next year so the pick is high and where the team's already have some assets upfront 

And those teams are :

Atlanta ( ZaZa and Barganni/Aldridge )
Charlotte ( Brez and Okafor )
Portland ( Pryz (if retained ) Ratliff and Randolph )

Knicks ( but we already have rights to their pick via the swap anyway )

Other teams that could suck but aren't a lock to suck and do have some assets upfront ( of differing development and quality ) are :

Houston ( as you rightly point out with Yao, Howard and Swift..although disappointing )
Boston ( Jefferson, Perkins and LaFrentz )
Sacramento ( Miller + I believe they will take the best big on the board out of this draft in a Tyus Thomas or Shelden Williams )
Sonics ( Swift and Petro - projects as they are however )
Toronto ( Bosh and free agency / draft additions )


I think all of those teams above represent a risk in doing such a deal if they were of a mind to do it in the first place as they all have vet talent ( with the exception of Toronto ) but they just haven't been able to put it together . 

They very well could out it together and with the addition of a rookie crew like ours last year that screwed Phoenix or a Chris Paul type player that puts you into playoff contention ..you could find yourself surrendering a really good player this year for someone that could be mid to late first round next year 

And in these circumstances, IMO, its not worth the risk and its a trade that has just as much of a chance of backfiring than what it has of working..and I think probably more

And that's just from our perspective 

From the other team's perspective ..in the chance that they suck ..why would they want to take say JJ Redick now with our pick to surrender theirs next year when if they do suck they might have a shot at a Sasha Kaun ?

I mean the simple question is ; Would you ?

I wouldn't 

And that's from their perspective 

So I kind of think for team's like that its kind of a low percentage type trade for both sides

If you are going to do it and pursue it .. I think it has to be with Charlotte .

They will suck and suck bad and be in the top half of the lottery next year .

Atlanta and Portland will suck too but they will need further assets upfront and as this is more of a swing player draft ..both Atlanta and Portland don't need those types of assets in addition to what they can already buy in this draft and what they have already got on their roster ...at the expense of surrendering a great position to pick up a genuine big in next year's draft 

You could make that argument with Charlotte too but they have a nice balance upfront with Brezec and Okafor and I think they will retain Ely or Voshkul to pair off with May at the back up spots. They got talent and balance upfront but could do with more assets on the wings to support Gerald Wallace 

So I could see it as something that would be of interest to Charlotte - conceptually

But for us ?

Dunno

I mean if its Top 3 or Top 5 protected and Charlotte are likely to be in that range ( and if it becomes unconditional in 2008 ) then what's the point of doing the trade ?

Its a risk for us on the other end of things in the risk analysis provided against the so so sucky teams

Charlotte could suck so bad that with the protective provisions we could miss out all together ..so from this point of view I don't like it from Chicago's perspective 

Plus .. we don't have to take these types of risks to participate in the big man bounty of 2007 because we already have a seat at the table with the Knicks pick swap provisions from the Eddy Curry trade and the Knicks ( IMO ) are a lock for the lottery for awhile yet 



> How about trading our own pick + Sweetney to Houston for 2006 2nd rounder and their 2007 first rounder, top 5 protected? Houston is in desperate need for more guys in the roster. Sweetney could help them out right now and our pick will give them a good shot at a much better player this year when they need the depth.
> 
> I just feel like Houston is so starved for talent right now that they'd be interested in this deal, and I'd much rather have two first rounders next year than two first rounders this year (the Knicks pick I like but our own pick I feel might not be all that valuable).


Houston have the talent ..they just have had a bad run with injuries of their two main men and key support players like Sura - plus Swift didn't work 

They need to regroup and consolidate ..have a solid draft and add a piece or two in free agency or trade and they will be just fine 

Your thinking is good but Howard is getting on , Swift hasn't worked and I think they need future assets at the big spots to complement Yao as well as a running mate for TMac on the wing ( which I think would be their most immediate priority but with what they can get with their own pick ) 

They could possibly be interested in our lottery pick to get the bets big available but who is going to be there at our likely position of #12 to #15 ?

Is it worth taking a big at their higher lottery pick and getting their wing player at #12 to #15. Yeah maybe it is from their POV 

So I think it could be something Carrol Dawson could at least contemplate as it is kind of rationale and makes sense - plus they are probably more impatient as they have the building blocks to build around now - TMac annd Yao . 

But if we give up #12 to #15 this year and the Rox smoke it up next year and fall into say a #20 to #25 range with a healthy team and a rejuvenated team.. well I don't know whether it such a great deal for us


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

To be way out ahead, there is a kid in Nigeria that has everyone talking, particularly in the European community professional community. Now, he doesnt figure for us since the kid can not be eligible til 2009 and who knows where we will be then, but it does look like that my theme of Africa being the next big frontier is starting to gather some legs. The kid is 15 I believe, is 7-1, and has been tearing up kids in the international game from other countries. So, just to be ahead of the curve, his name is Salomon Alabi, something like that. Just want to get on the record about this kid.


----------



## Bron_Melo_ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> To be way out ahead, there is a kid in Nigeria that has everyone talking, particularly in the European community professional community. Now, he doesnt figure for us since the kid can not be eligible til 2009 and who knows where we will be then, but it does look like that my theme of Africa being the next big frontier is starting to gather some legs. The kid is 15 I believe, is 7-1, and has been tearing up kids in the international game from other countries. So, just to be ahead of the curve, his name is Salomon Alabi, something like that. Just want to get on the record about this kid.


No, Solomon Alabi is currently in America and playing basketball at Montverde Academy in Florida. He's currently a JR meaning he'd be eligible for the 2008 NBA Draft. He's a very athletic yet raw, which is typical of African players in America. He just needs some time and confidence in himself...NIGERIA IN DA BUILDING!!! :biggrin:


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Let's Start Thinking About Trading Our Pick*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Show, I like the concept just fine but I guess I'm one of the morons that think it will never happen or at best has a very low percentage chance of happening
> 
> If it is universally agreed that 2007 is the shaping as THE big man draft ..maybe a type of big man draft you get every once in a blue moon , then with the dearth of genuine size and quality around the league ..I am of the belief that must rational , sane front offices would keep their powder dry
> 
> Phoenix moved their pick for cap room to accommodate Nash and Richhardson ( and then inexplicably lost Joe Johnson )
> 
> We would not be moving a pick to free up cap space ( although this would be a by product of the move ) we would be moving a draft pick in 2006 in recognizance of what is likely to be a significantly more significant draft next year
> 
> And doesn't the rest of the league realise this too?
> 
> I think so
> 
> The teams that could likely want an extra draft pick this year are team's that are in a stage of building through the draft right now and out of those teams we should only be wanting to draft teams that will likely suck next year so the pick is high and where the team's already have some assets upfront
> 
> And those teams are :
> 
> Atlanta ( ZaZa and Barganni/Aldridge )
> Charlotte ( Brez and Okafor )
> Portland ( Pryz (if retained ) Ratliff and Randolph )
> 
> Knicks ( but we already have rights to their pick via the swap anyway )
> 
> Other teams that could suck but aren't a lock to suck and do have some assets upfront ( of differing development and quality ) are :
> 
> Houston ( as you rightly point out with Yao, Howard and Swift..although disappointing )
> Boston ( Jefferson, Perkins and LaFrentz )
> Sacramento ( Miller + I believe they will take the best big on the board out of this draft in a Tyus Thomas or Shelden Williams )
> Sonics ( Swift and Petro - projects as they are however )
> Toronto ( Bosh and free agency / draft additions )
> 
> 
> I think all of those teams above represent a risk in doing such a deal if they were of a mind to do it in the first place as they all have vet talent ( with the exception of Toronto ) but they just haven't been able to put it together .
> 
> They very well could out it together and with the addition of a rookie crew like ours last year that screwed Phoenix or a Chris Paul type player that puts you into playoff contention ..you could find yourself surrendering a really good player this year for someone that could be mid to late first round next year
> 
> And in these circumstances, IMO, its not worth the risk and its a trade that has just as much of a chance of backfiring than what it has of working..and I think probably more
> 
> And that's just from our perspective
> 
> From the other team's perspective ..in the chance that they suck ..why would they want to take say JJ Redick now with our pick to surrender theirs next year when if they do suck they might have a shot at a Sasha Kaun ?
> 
> I mean the simple question is ; Would you ?
> 
> I wouldn't
> 
> And that's from their perspective
> 
> So I kind of think for team's like that its kind of a low percentage type trade for both sides
> 
> If you are going to do it and pursue it .. I think it has to be with Charlotte .
> 
> They will suck and suck bad and be in the top half of the lottery next year .
> 
> Atlanta and Portland will suck too but they will need further assets upfront and as this is more of a swing player draft ..both Atlanta and Portland don't need those types of assets in addition to what they can already buy in this draft and what they have already got on their roster ...at the expense of surrendering a great position to pick up a genuine big in next year's draft
> 
> You could make that argument with Charlotte too but they have a nice balance upfront with Brezec and Okafor and I think they will retain Ely or Voshkul to pair off with May at the back up spots. They got talent and balance upfront but could do with more assets on the wings to support Gerald Wallace
> 
> So I could see it as something that would be of interest to Charlotte - conceptually
> 
> But for us ?
> 
> Dunno
> 
> I mean if its Top 3 or Top 5 protected and Charlotte are likely to be in that range ( and if it becomes unconditional in 2008 ) then what's the point of doing the trade ?
> 
> Its a risk for us on the other end of things in the risk analysis provided against the so so sucky teams
> 
> Charlotte could suck so bad that with the protective provisions we could miss out all together ..so from this point of view I don't like it from Chicago's perspective
> 
> Plus .. we don't have to take these types of risks to participate in the big man bounty of 2007 because we already have a seat at the table with the Knicks pick swap provisions from the Eddy Curry trade and the Knicks ( IMO ) are a lock for the lottery for awhile yet
> 
> 
> 
> Houston have the talent ..they just have had a bad run with injuries of their two main men and key support players like Sura - plus Swift didn't work
> 
> They need to regroup and consolidate ..have a solid draft and add a piece or two in free agency or trade and they will be just fine
> 
> Your thinking is good but Howard is getting on , Swift hasn't worked and I think they need future assets at the big spots to complement Yao as well as a running mate for TMac on the wing ( which I think would be their most immediate priority but with what they can get with their own pick )
> 
> They could possibly be interested in our lottery pick to get the bets big available but who is going to be there at our likely position of #12 to #15 ?
> 
> Is it worth taking a big at their higher lottery pick and getting their wing player at #12 to #15. Yeah maybe it is from their POV
> 
> So I think it could be something Carrol Dawson could at least contemplate as it is kind of rationale and makes sense - plus they are probably more impatient as they have the building blocks to build around now - TMac annd Yao .
> 
> But if we give up #12 to #15 this year and the Rox smoke it up next year and fall into say a #20 to #25 range with a healthy team and a rejuvenated team.. well I don't know whether it such a great deal for us


All your points well-taken. I just thought that if they saw a big SG available this year, they could really use a guy like that to be in the backcourt with Alston and have Head as a third guard off the bench. With McGrady at SF, this could really work out; when McGrady inevitably gets injured, Head starts at the SG and the draft pick gets SG/SF duties.

Say, a Rodney Carney were to slip to 13 (not too impossible), where we are, or more like a Ronnie Brewer (even more likely). They could trade their unknown value of next year's pick for another impact player this year. If they drafted Splitter with their own pick, getting Brewer with 13 might make a lot more sense.

Alston/Brewer/T-Mac/Splitter/Yao
Head/Howard/Swift/etc.

That's a super solid lineup. Really balanced out.

Because their frontline, while not terrific, is not the only need. I think it's at the SG/SF position, in addition to the PF position. Splitter and Carney could be serious answers to those needs.

I think their pick next year is still mid-1st rounder at the worst, and possibly way higher. Houston might get better but too many Western teams are also getting better.

Charlotte as a trading partner is very, very interesting.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Bron_Melo_ROY said:


> No, Solomon Alabi is currently in America and playing basketball at Montverde Academy in Florida. He's currently a JR meaning he'd be eligible for the 2008 NBA Draft. He's a very athletic yet raw, which is typical of African players in America. He just needs some time and confidence in himself...NIGERIA IN DA BUILDING!!! :biggrin:



Thanks for this info. I had heard he had done very well in some camps against American kids and was considering HS in the US but was not aware that he already had chosen a HS. The word I heard was that rather then going to college in the US (UNC, Florida, FSU, Duke are all in for him) he would ply his trade in Europe for a year or 2 and then come out. But the reports I hear is that there is some similarities of him to Amare Stoudamire, yet he is 3 inches taller already and not done growing. I think he could be 7-3 by the time he is done.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

We're sittin' top 3 right now.

Does Atlanta take LaMarcus Aldridge with the 2nd pick? or will they go after Gay or Morrison in hopes to convert one to SG? Marvin Williams is their SF of the future right?

with the number 1 pick, Charlotte's going after Morrison or Gay EASILY.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> We're sittin' top 3 right now.
> 
> Does Atlanta take LaMarcus Aldridge with the 2nd pick? or will they go after Gay or Morrison in hopes to convert one to SG? Marvin Williams is their SF of the future right?
> 
> with the number 1 pick, Charlotte's going after Morrison or Gay EASILY.


Atlanta will stay away from a swingman in this draft. I can guarantee that. They just dont need one. In fact, I think Marvin Williams might move to the 4 with Harrington leaving. Morrison to Charlotte makes sense to me. He and Gerald Wallace would be a nice combo, and different kind of players, at the wings. They have size upfront and a nice PG combo. That team is taking shape. We pray for Aldridge at this point. But if not, I think we pass on Gay. He has the skills of a great player but he hasnt gotten hugely better year over year. I suggest we look hard at Tyrus Thomas in the top 3. The kid is a total freak. A total freak. And he has really improved cause he was on no ones radar last year. A Tyrus Thomas, Shawnee Williams/Tiaggo Splitter/Andrea Barghani draft works for me in a big way. Players to stay away from would be Davis, Boone, Foye who I see as adequate at best and not worthy of a lottery pick in this draft and would probably not be first rounders in any other draft. 

The wild card is Fazekas. He has great offensive skills. GREAT. But doesnt play D and might have bad knees. He looks like he is limping all over the place. No one has him as a lottery pick right now but if the Bulls could trade down and grab a pick in the 16-20 range, Fazekas would be value there.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> I suggest we look hard at Tyrus Thomas in the top 3. The kid is a total freak.


I've heard some call him a stromile swift clone...other's say he's a la kenyon martin...

so i'll go somewhere in between..if he's not BETTER than kenyon, we don't need him..cuz kenyon's not THAT good himself


----------



## The Krakken

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I've heard some call him a stromile swift clone...other's say he's a la kenyon martin...
> 
> so i'll go somewhere in between..if he's not BETTER than kenyon, we don't need him..cuz kenyon's not THAT good himself


reputation forthcoming.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm watching Morrison for the first time and I have never seen a 21 year old SF run more like Arvydas Sabonis in my life. He runs a little bit better on offense but he will be the worst defensive player in the NBA.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I've heard some call him a stromile swift clone...other's say he's a la kenyon martin...
> 
> so i'll go somewhere in between..if he's not BETTER than kenyon, we don't need him..cuz kenyon's not THAT good himself



Wow, that's great analysis. 

I heard someone call Morrison something between Dalibor Bagaric in a SF body and Luke Jackson stuck in mud.....


I'm all for the Dalibor types.


Come on..not everyone is gonna be LeBron James right away in the NBA. It's so easy to tear apart every player in the draft. None of us know how they will perform in the NBA. No one knows if someone will get an injury that screws their NBA career.

Thomas is a very valid consideration for our pick considering our biggest needs.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

All I know about Tyrus Thomas is that his rebounding & shotblocking rates (on a per 40 minute basis) are absolutely through the roof. Far better than Stromile Swift's when he played at LSU, and I think they're right on par with Kenyon Martin. The kid is only a freshman for the best team in the SEC, and is a big reason for what they've done this year. Not to mention the scouting report that he's a 6'9 freak athlete of a forward.

Now if only I could see the kid play.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> All I know about Tyrus Thomas is that his rebounding & shotblocking rates (on a per 40 minute basis) are absolutely through the roof. Far better than Stromile Swift's when he played at LSU, and I think they're right on par with Kenyon Martin. The kid is only a freshman for the best team in the SEC, and is a big reason for what they've done this year. Not to mention the scouting report that he's a 6'9 freak athlete of a forward.
> 
> Now if only I could see the kid play.


Ironically enough, concerning Tyrus Thomas, I think the crux of the matter could come down to the cut of his jib. If he's got Amare's approach to the game and work ethic, I think he'd probably be a strong candidate for the NY pick, but if he's a mental flake like Stromile, I'd guess Pax won't even look twice. 

Of course, I've never seen him play ever, so I really can't say anything with any certainty.


----------



## lgtwins

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I'm watching Morrison for the first time and I have never seen a 21 year old SF run more like Arvydas Sabonis in my life. He runs a little bit better on offense but he will be the worst defensive player in the NBA.


He just looks awkward running because of his steps. But when I saw him playing, despite of all the bashing on his defense, he stays in front of his man pretty well. 

Sure he is not a stopper but I didn't see anybody totally abusing him on defense either.

He isn't that bad at defense as some said he is.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I dont see Morrison as a Super star. His total game doesnt equate to that. Plus that Gonzaga system scares me a bit. But I am 90% certain he will be to score in droves in the NBA and I absolutely love his attitude. I think its funny, alot of people will look at this white boy and think he is a choirboy. But he has much more ghetto in him then a guy like Jason Richardson. He talks trash at coaches, including his own, has been in fights with teammates and opponents and has thrown up 30 foot shots and then turned to his coach and said "heat check". I love **** like that. It shows confidence. He is a tough kid. He is a leader. But I seriously doubt Skiles, after a few weeks with him, would like him. And again, thats fine with me.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> I dont see Morrison as a Super star. His total game doesnt equate to that. Plus that Gonzaga system scares me a bit. But I am 90% certain he will be to score in droves in the NBA and I absolutely love his attitude. I think its funny, alot of people will look at this white boy and think he is a choirboy. But he has much more ghetto in him then a guy like Jason Richardson. He talks trash at coaches, including his own, has been in fights with teammates and opponents and has thrown up 30 foot shots and then turned to his coach and said "heat check". I love **** like that. It shows confidence. He is a tough kid. He is a leader. But I seriously doubt Skiles, after a few weeks with him, would like him. And again, thats fine with me.




Thank God, his Jib isn't a Skiles/Pax Jib........Phewww. Skiles would hear that once and he'd be sitting in NY at Tim Thomas' old workout gym.

Guys got mad offensive game, but come on, his defense is on par with Malik Allen.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> Thank God, his Jib isn't a Skiles/Pax Jib........Phewww. Skiles would hear that once and he'd be sitting in NY at Tim Thomas' old workout gym.
> 
> Guys got mad offensive game, but come on, his defense is on par with Malik Allen.



Malik Allen? Well, trying to find defensive person to compare him too is a little difficult? Can I say Glenn Robinson there? Thats about the defense I am expecting

But offensively is a totally different story. Peja/Drazen Petrovic/Paul Pierce. I mean, this kid can flat out score. I LOVE THE KID. I really do. I love his attitude. I love his interests. I love his skills. I am scared off that he is a system kid (gonzaga has this run and shoot thing going, how does he do in a halfcourt structured offense?). I am scared by his D. I think Pax and Skiles, based on color, college and the ilk would think HE IS THEIR TYPE OF KID. But he isnt. This kid has major balls. He isnt a yes man like Skiles needs. And he wouldnt back down from Skiles like the players on the Bulls. And those are the type of guys who do well, guys with leadership skills. This isnt some dumb yockle from the woods of Washington, the kid is smart and well versed in a ton of topics, but he isnt going to take **** either and he will dish some of it out. Could be a bit of a Kobe like character in that way, though SOME (not all) of his teammates love him


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## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Shelden's on tonight against a very serious PF, Tyler Hansborough. Marquee matchup. I'll be looking to see if Shelden collapses against big NBA-ready players like some have suggested.

Besides, Duke v. UNC... who could miss it? Some part of me feels more enjoyment out of the few times these teams meet than out of Super Bowl XL.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

FWIW, the Charlotte Observer's NBA/Robertcats guy, Rick Bonnell, thinks they would take Morrison with the #1. He stressed that this is not based on anything he's actually heard or seen, just his personal hunch. Still, he's very plugged-in regarding the 'Cats, so his opinion deserves consideration.

(I e-mailed him today to ask a crass rotisserie-related question, and I threw in a second question about their draft plans just to ease my conscience for having wasted his valuable time.)


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Malik Allen? Well, trying to find defensive person to compare him too is a little difficult? Can I say Glenn Robinson there? Thats about the defense I am expecting
> 
> But offensively is a totally different story. Peja/Drazen Petrovic/Paul Pierce. I mean, this kid can flat out score. I LOVE THE KID. I really do. I love his attitude. I love his interests. I love his skills. I am scared off that he is a system kid (gonzaga has this run and shoot thing going, how does he do in a halfcourt structured offense?). I am scared by his D. I think Pax and Skiles, based on color, college and the ilk would think HE IS THEIR TYPE OF KID. But he isnt. This kid has major balls. He isnt a yes man like Skiles needs. And he wouldnt back down from Skiles like the players on the Bulls. And those are the type of guys who do well, guys with leadership skills. This isnt some dumb yockle from the woods of Washington, the kid is smart and well versed in a ton of topics, but he isnt going to take **** either and he will dish some of it out. Could be a bit of a Kobe like character in that way, though SOME (not all) of his teammates love him


I'm not sure he can beat his man off the dribble from the perimeter in the NBA and he's not yet strong enough to create space for himself in the mid-range and post game.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Shelden's on tonight against a very serious PF, Tyler Hansborough. Marquee matchup. I'll be looking to see if Shelden collapses against big NBA-ready players like some have suggested.
> 
> Besides, Duke v. UNC... who could miss it? Some part of me feels more enjoyment out of the few times these teams meet than out of Super Bowl XL.


Hansborough is sort of owning Shelden so far. This isn't making me feel very good about Shelden.

This is an intense game and I'd like to see Williams do more, but I think UNC gameplanned around him... he draws more double teams than Redick is.

What I don't really like is that Shelden is getting outrebounded.

What I do like is that UNC seems to have a lot of cute girls that are making the camera at this game. I really need to find a way to get to Carolina.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Hansborough is sort of owning Shelden so far. This isn't making me feel very good about Shelden.
> 
> This is an intense game and I'd like to see Williams do more, but I think UNC gameplanned around him... he draws more double teams than Redick is.
> 
> What I don't really like is that Shelden is getting outrebounded.
> 
> What I do like is that UNC seems to have a lot of cute girls that are making the camera at this game. I really need to find a way to get to Carolina.


Holy freakin cow. Actually, McRoberts is having a really tough time too. UNC has some great interior defense...

Hansborough is looking like Dwight Howard out there.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Is Hansborough even a blip on the nba draft radar?


----------



## Jesus Shuttlesworth

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

What a thriller! Duke blew a 17 point lead in the 2nd half, but J.J Reddick brought them back in time. Damn, he sure looked like a superstar. I just don't know if he will be able to shoot that easily in the NBA. 
Shelden Williams was outhustled by Hansborough, particularly on the boards. He scored a clutch ft though, but I wasn't impressed at all with him tonight. 
He seems to have poor games when the other team has competent post players, and that can't be a good sign.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

OK - Rlucas and other Morrison supporters. Who are you sitting in favor of him? Who are you getting rid of him so that he can play major minutes? Not only am I not a believer for him in a Bulls uni or the Bulls system, but I wouldn't play him over Hinrcih, Gordon or Deng.

Now, as for this game, what a game.

Ummm, Sheldon Williams, not impressed again. Hansborough, very impressed with. It's likely neither is as good or bland as they played. But wow.

Maybe it goes back to this not being a clear talent draft. Everyone one we argue (errr, discuss) has some major flaws in their game. I guess that's what's so maddening and driving us to pull for one guy and discount another.

So..............I still keep my order so far as Aldrige, Bargnani, Thomas, Gay, Splitter, Morrison (only as trade bait).

Come on draftees, step it up and grab hold of the game.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Jesus Shuttlesworth said:


> What a thriller! Duke blew a 17 point lead in the 2nd half, but J.J Reddick brought them back in time. Damn, he sure looked like a superstar. I just don't know if he will be able to shoot that easily in the NBA.
> Shelden Williams was outhustled by Hansborough, particularly on the boards. He scored a clutch ft though, but I wasn't impressed at all with him tonight.
> He seems to have poor games when the other team has competent post players, and that can't be a good sign.


I think I have to start agreeing with this, although I think it's important to remember that Shelden Williams draws double-teams like crazy. However, great college big men can overcome double-teams somehow, like Randolph Morris did tonight on several occasions.

Shelden has been my main guy for this team for a while now, and I still think he has the skill set and the mentality to be a strong big man addition on this team. I do think he's still at the level of a LaMarcus Aldridge, who plays much softer but has a lot more upside. A part of me is sort of happy, actually, because I think Shelden DOES still have an inner beast... he had a seriously nasty block on Hansborough tonight (called a foul but on the replay you could see that it was all ball) and he looked really comparable in size when they were standing side by side, meaning he looked closer to 6-10 than 6-9 (or Hansborough is shorter than 6-10, which might make sense because McRoberts looked a little taller than them both). 

But the fact is, I think Williams will be there at our own pick and that's actually good news to me. If the Knicks pick ends up not being top 4, I'm pretty happy with looking at Rodney Carney or I guess Tyrus Thomas to give us some more strength at that PF spot for us.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

We're getting a TOP 3 pick from NY (GIVEN) & probably a top 5-10 pick on our own since we're utter crap right now. Let's work something out for GARNETT with these two picks and other players. This draft is WEAK!! The 2006 FA market can't help us either. Let's PUT ALL ON THE LINE!

Tim Thomas (Expiring)
Andres Nocioni
Knicks Lotto Pick (Top 3)
Bulls Lotto Pick (Top 5-10)

for 

Kevin Garnett (3 yrs left)

Not only do they get to rebuild with TWO lotto picks but they also get rid of the last 3 years of Garnett's BLOATED contract & add a GOOD SF in Nocioni.

G Hinrich
G Gordon
F Deng
F Garnett
C Chandler


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

James White!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> OK - Rlucas and other Morrison supporters. Who are you sitting in favor of him? Who are you getting rid of him so that he can play major minutes? Not only am I not a believer for him in a Bulls uni or the Bulls system, but I wouldn't play him over Hinrcih, Gordon or Deng.
> 
> Now, as for this game, what a game.
> 
> Ummm, Sheldon Williams, not impressed again. Hansborough, very impressed with. It's likely neither is as good or bland as they played. But wow.
> 
> Maybe it goes back to this not being a clear talent draft. Everyone one we argue (errr, discuss) has some major flaws in their game. I guess that's what's so maddening and driving us to pull for one guy and discount another.
> 
> So..............I still keep my order so far as Aldrige, Bargnani, Thomas, Gay, Splitter, Morrison (only as trade bait).
> 
> Come on draftees, step it up and grab hold of the game.



Chifanica

I like Morrison alot, but where did I say I supported that the Bulls focus on him? Im just curious because I am not sure I said that. What I believe I said was that I like Morrison, liked his attitude, and wouldnt back down from Skiles but probably wouldnt be a good fit for him. I also expressed concerns that he might not make it in a system predicated on halfcourt disciplined offense, which is the boring **** we play. So when calling me out here, please just be informed that I never said what your calling me out for. If we drafted Morrison, I would have the same question you do. But I would support the drafting of him cause I like his game and I like his tude. But he clearly isnt the best pick. I think I have been very clear that I like Morrison and Reddick, but cant see us drafting either. I think Gay has huge potential, as does Carney, but cant see us drafting either. Paul Davis is a major reach as is Fazekas though Fazekas does intrigue me. Bargani is a good player but wont contribute for his first year. I am lukewarm on Shelden Williams because I dont see him providing what the team needs, which is athleticism on the front line. I have been on record as saying if we cant get Aldridge, who is the obvious guy, that I think Tyrus Thomas and Shawnee Williams will be the best picks.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> We're getting a TOP 3 pick from NY (GIVEN) & probably a top 5-10 pick on our own since we're utter crap right now. Let's work something out for GARNETT with these two picks and other players. This draft is WEAK!! The 2006 FA market can't help us either. Let's PUT ALL ON THE LINE!
> 
> Tim Thomas (Expiring)
> Andres Nocioni
> Knicks Lotto Pick (Top 3)
> Bulls Lotto Pick (Top 5-10)
> 
> for
> 
> Kevin Garnett (3 yrs left)
> 
> Not only do they get to rebuild with TWO lotto picks but they also get rid of the last 3 years of Garnett's BLOATED contract & add a GOOD SF in Nocioni.
> 
> G Hinrich
> G Gordon
> F Deng
> F Garnett
> C Chandler


I'd do that deal in a heartbeat, but I don't think the Wolves will want to trade Garnett for Noc, capspace and picks. I think they want a superstar in return for Garnett if he is traded, he means too much for their whole franchise.


----------



## ballafromthenorth

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



LegoHat said:


> I'd do that deal in a heartbeat, but I don't think the Wolves will want to trade Garnett for Noc, capspace and picks. I think they want a superstar in return for Garnett if he is traded, he means too much for their whole franchise.


Unless Garnett and the Wolves somehow had a falling out and he was unhappy there.. Although he'd probably not be keen on coming here, particularly if this season turns out to be a bust and we wind up with a lotto pick.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Rlucas...........

Sorry if I implied he was your first choice, as I know you didn't say that. My problem with Morrison is that I don't see him as a fit at all for the Bulls...except for trade purposes. UNLESS, we are scrapping our system, our coach and going to endeavor on another rebuilding plan. If so, this is the year to do it, since we have 2 picks top 10, FA crap space, and some tradeable assets. I wouldn't, but maybe some would.

For me, Morrison just doesn't fit. Yeah, I can appreciate any team can use his scoring ability and grit. I like that too. I'm just not going to put him ahead of Hinrich, Gordon or Deng minutes wise. He's that bad on defense IMHO. I get perplexed by those advocating drafting him, but not wanting to trade Hinrich or Gordon or Deng (Who I wouldn't part with short of a blockbuster). Gordon wasn't getting burn, not cause he can't score, but because his defense was poor and he got into quick foul trouble. I see Morrison as an even bigger case of that. His heart, talent and wisdom are flying high.............his defensive ability is not.

Since I don't see him as a hall of famer, it's one of the few times, I'd rather draft a player of need (Bargnani, Splitter, Splitter - Aldrige obvious) over a telent like Morrison. Frankly, I'd also take Gay over Morrison because of his overall telent and it frees us up to trade Deng or Gay in a blockbuster.

Free Agency occurs after the draft. To assume we can get big men in FA, is wrong. We should be able to, but nothings ever a lock. See (Eddie Jones and the Bulls) for proof.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ballafromthenorth said:


> Unless Garnett and the Wolves somehow had a falling out and he was unhappy there.. Although he'd probably not be keen on coming here, particularly if this season turns out to be a bust and we wind up with a lotto pick.


Garnett said two years ago, and i quote "they got a nice lil' team there, they get the right pieces and they could be serious"

No matter where he gets traded, it doesn't mean they'll win a ring..he just needs to get out of minne and go somewhere with a GOOD future.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



LegoHat said:


> I'd do that deal in a heartbeat, but I don't think the Wolves will want to trade Garnett for Noc, capspace and picks. I think they want a superstar in return for Garnett if he is traded, he means too much for their whole franchise.


true..

i think TWO lotto picks & capspace would GREATLY help them out though. They get to rebuild with draft picks of their choices and they'll also have some money to put the right pieces around them. They won't be a GOOD team any time soon wheather garnett is there or not. Hell, I'd give em' deng intead of noc if they wanted.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> Rlucas...........
> 
> Sorry if I implied he was your first choice, as I know you didn't say that. My problem with Morrison is that I don't see him as a fit at all for the Bulls...except for trade purposes. UNLESS, we are scrapping our system, our coach and going to endeavor on another rebuilding plan. If so, this is the year to do it, since we have 2 picks top 10, FA crap space, and some tradeable assets. I wouldn't, but maybe some would.
> 
> For me, Morrison just doesn't fit. Yeah, I can appreciate any team can use his scoring ability and grit. I like that too. I'm just not going to put him ahead of Hinrich, Gordon or Deng minutes wise. He's that bad on defense IMHO. I get perplexed by those advocating drafting him, but not wanting to trade Hinrich or Gordon or Deng (Who I wouldn't part with short of a blockbuster). Gordon wasn't getting burn, not cause he can't score, but because his defense was poor and he got into quick foul trouble. I see Morrison as an even bigger case of that. His heart, talent and wisdom are flying high.............his defensive ability is not.
> 
> Since I don't see him as a hall of famer, it's one of the few times, I'd rather draft a player of need (Bargnani, Splitter, Splitter - Aldrige obvious) over a telent like Morrison. Frankly, I'd also take Gay over Morrison because of his overall telent and it frees us up to trade Deng or Gay in a blockbuster.
> 
> Free Agency occurs after the draft. To assume we can get big men in FA, is wrong. We should be able to, but nothings ever a lock. See (Eddie Jones and the Bulls) for proof.



Chifa

Understood. And agreed on a lot here. My opinion, as of now, is that Morrison is a systems player. If he plays in the right system, which means run and gun, he will be a star and all of us will be saying why didnt we draft this kid. But in the wrong system, with the wrong coach (a coach who wont put up with comments like "heat check", which, as a coach, if I were one, I would love) and the kid might be a bust. Not a Luke Jackson level bust, but a bust nevertheless. I clearly think Luke Jackson was garbage, is garbage and was 100% right about him from the get go and there are some similarities here. But Jackson was full of himself in one way, this kid is full of himself in a different kind of way. Its hard to explain, but I doubt Morrison calls a guy out in public like Jackson did with Iggy prior to their draft. Morrison plays the game for fun. He is a character. He will be a Barkley type with the microphone, always cracking jokes and making the news reel with comments. For that, I think he would add something to the most boring basketball team in the league. But I do agree SF isnt position we need to be upgrading, and inspite of what I believe Pax and Skiles think of this kid now (I am sure they see a white kid, in college, and think PERFECT), I dont think he fits their description of a yes man or a solid soilder. Morrison is a bit too wacky for the Bulls. But Ill root for him wherever he goes. Its too bad our organization doesnt allow characters to play for it.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Don't know if you'll see this or not RLucas (or anybody else for that matter!) but what happened to Nemanja Aleksandrov (did I get the spelling correct?)? He's kind of fallen off the face of the earth. NBADraft.net has him on their 2007 mock going somewhere in the 20's of the first round. This guy was hyped up there as the Euro answer to LeBron. Was it just unknown Euro hype? Injuries? Something else. I'm kind of curious as to how he could go from can't miss prodigy to an average joe.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



fl_flash said:


> Don't know if you'll see this or not RLucas (or anybody else for that matter!) but what happened to Nemanja Aleksandrov (did I get the spelling correct?)? He's kind of fallen off the face of the earth. NBADraft.net has him on their 2007 mock going somewhere in the 20's of the first round. This guy was hyped up there as the Euro answer to LeBron. Was it just unknown Euro hype? Injuries? Something else. I'm kind of curious as to how he could go from can't miss prodigy to an average joe.



Hi Flash, I just shake my head. This guy was the consensus early #1 pick for atleast last year and might have been the year before. Similiar to Yi Jianlin from China. The story on Nemanja is this. He has had all sorts of nagging injuries. Ankle, Knee, Wrists, etc. But nothing earth shattering or career threatening. But for whatever reason, and I dont know if its the injuries or the hype (which I am partly responsible for) but he has lost his game. A couple of years ago he was the best European prospect, outside of Sabonis, EVER. Better then Dirk, better then Kukoc, better then Pau etc. He was part Kukoc/Lebron, part Petrovic. But his 3 point shot abandoned him and then the rest of his game fell apart. Total loss of confidence. Maybe he is playing tentatively cause he knows his big bucks are in the NBA, but right now I hear he goes 15-25, which is a far cry from 1-3. On talent alone, he is the best player in this draft. But his production predicates a much lower number. Some team, however, might hit the jackpot, get this kid at 18 or so and have the player of the draft. Its possible. But right now, it appears this kid might have maxed out at 16-17 years old, and that is a sad thing.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Hi Flash, I just shake my head. This guy was the consensus early #1 pick for atleast last year and might have been the year before. Similiar to Yi Jianlin from China. The story on Nemanja is this. He has had all sorts of nagging injuries. Ankle, Knee, Wrists, etc. But nothing earth shattering or career threatening. But for whatever reason, and I dont know if its the injuries or the hype (which I am partly responsible for) but he has lost his game. A couple of years ago he was the best European prospect, outside of Sabonis, EVER. Better then Dirk, better then Kukoc, better then Pau etc. He was part Kukoc/Lebron, part Petrovic. But his 3 point shot abandoned him and then the rest of his game fell apart. Total loss of confidence. Maybe he is playing tentatively cause he knows his big bucks are in the NBA, but right now I hear he goes 15-25, which is a far cry from 1-3. On talent alone, he is the best player in this draft. But his production predicates a much lower number. Some team, however, might hit the jackpot, get this kid at 18 or so and have the player of the draft. Its possible. But right now, it appears this kid might have maxed out at 16-17 years old, and that is a sad thing.


At least he'll finish better at the draft than the Euro the Spurs drafted LY. "Needs to improve: overall skills."


----------



## YearofDaBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I cant stand Othella.


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## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



YearofDaBulls said:


> I cant stand Othella.


IMO Othella is underrated, he was doing much better earlier in the year but he provides the only veteran presence on this team... he does things similar to what AD did in the locker room, and has been pretty solid on the court for us, does all the little things. He was vital for us last year down the stretch without Curry. His size hurts him though.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> At least he'll finish better at the draft than the Euro the Spurs drafted LY. "Needs to improve: overall skills."


Ian Mahinmi? That kid is an absolute beast. Just a freak of nature athlete who has totally improved this year. The Spurs made a huge steal. Alot of people in the international community agree with that. They did their homework, found a raw athlete but with big work ethic and it looks like itll pay off for them in a year or 2.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Ian Mahinmi? That kid is an absolute beast. Just a freak of nature athlete who has totally improved this year. The Spurs made a huge steal. Alot of people in the international community agree with that. They did their homework, found a raw athlete but with big work ethic and it looks like itll pay off for them in a year or 2.


Good to hear, they've always had luck with those kind of European "steals." I've never heard anything about him, I just thought it was funny how they slapped the "overall skills" thing on him. That's a burn.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Ehh..watched Rudy Gay tonight...not really impressed...he doesn't seem to have much of a presence on the floor....I'd pass on him...


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Would much rather trade our picks (think of what we could get for Tim's contract, and two first-rounders, including a top 5) than draft any of those guys, especially the pillow also known as LaMarcus Aldrige. I know I've said that twice, but he's way too soft.

I agree with The ROY; I've never been impressed with Rudy Gay.Can be a very good player when he feels like it, but nowhere near the "consensus #1" we were hearing about in preseason.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> Would much rather trade our picks (think of what we could get for Tim's contract, and two first-rounders, including a top 5) than draft any of those guys, especially the pillow also known as LaMarcus Aldrige. I know I've said that twice, but he's way too soft.
> 
> I agree with The ROY; I've never been impressed with Rudy Gay.Can be a very good player when he feels like it, but nowhere near the "consensus #1" we were hearing about in preseason.


Rudy seems more like the type that just DOESN'T want to lead but just be a good team player, which is FINE but with a TOP 3 pick we need someone that can lead by example at whatever position they play. Right now Morrison would be my choice but we already have Noc & Deng so *shrugs shoulders*

If we could move DOWN and draft Riddick, I'd be fine by that...him backing up Gordon at the 2 would be INSTANT offense ALL GAME.

G Hinrich / Duhon
G Gordon / Riddick
F Deng / Nocioni
F Martin / Songalia
C Chandler / N. Mohammed

:clap:


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Rudy seems more like the type that just DOESN'T want to lead but just be a good team player, which is FINE but with a TOP 3 pick we need someone that can lead by example at whatever position they play. Right now Morrison would be my choice but we already have Noc & Deng so *shrugs shoulders*


agreed. Like I said he can be a very good player when he shows up and he's got the talent for #1 overall but I agree that he doesn't want to lead, in fact it seems like he never even wants the ball. He has the physical #1 qualities bu tnot the mental ones. Needs to be much more aggressive.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm much more interested in an interior offensive player. After watching tonight's game, I AM impressed with the way the Bulls run the ball but I know that in games to come, against superstars inside, they will give up more points than they can score.

Tyson's continued improvement is a start, but he's got to be the most offensively raw player in the entire NBA. Seriously. We are in desperate need of a big man inside that can post up. If Othella was 25% quicker and a centimeter taller, I'd be really excited about him. As it turns out, that 25% of quickness makes the entire difference.

That's why I'm thinking a lot more about this Gooden trade, then taking the best available talents in the draft. If it's Morrison, great, but I think we'd want to move one of him, Deng, or Noch, and I think we've just invested too much into all of those guys. If it's Aldridge, even better; that will add to our frontcourt scoring. A four-man rotation of Aldridge, Gooden, Songaila and Chandler is really very balanced and pretty big on both ends of the court; I'm especially interested in the way Gooden and Aldridge can pass out of the deep post.

And you know what's weird? The next biggest need, if we were to trade Duhon for Gooden... would be at POINT GUARD. I'm a big Pargo fan but he's sort of a defensive liability. And around that range is where the Party Hardy Mardy Collins should be... I've seen him play a few times and WOW. He's a solid playmaker and a very quick and good defender.

As of today, my ideal picks, if we had #3 and #15 in the draft, would be Aldridge and Collins.

Hinrich/Collins/Pargo
Gordon/Collins
Deng/Noch
Gooden/Aldridge/Songaila
Chandler/Aldridge/Songaila

I like this squad a whole lot. A WHOLE lot. And this is before we add a single FA, although we'll have to extend Gooden this summer if we get him (probably something like 6 years/$52 mil).


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> Good to hear, they've always had luck with those kind of European "steals." I've never heard anything about him, I just thought it was funny how they slapped the "overall skills" thing on him. That's a burn.



He was a professional world class volleyball player who started playing basketball only 3 years ago. The last couple of years he just got by on easily being the best athlete on any court that he showed up on. From what I hear this year, he is blowing by people, has added a dribble and a 15 foot jump shot. San Antonio said they had the next Shawn Kemp when they drafted him. I am not sure if I would go that far but the kid could be a Samuel Dalembert in 2-3 years.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I just found out that on Yahoo Sports online, you can stream some archived SEC games for free. I'm going to watch Arkansas vs. LSU to check out Tyrus Thomas and Ronnie Brewer.

http://sports.yahoo.com/top/collegebroadcast/teams/jps


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I just found out that on Yahoo Sports online, you can stream some archived SEC games for free. I'm going to watch Arkansas vs. LSU to check out Tyrus Thomas and Ronnie Brewer.
> 
> http://sports.yahoo.com/top/collegebroadcast/teams/jps


Nice find


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Today on NBA TV, during "basketball international" there will be a special about Bargnani and Belinelli.


----------



## club101

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Knicks gm is an idiot


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

If LaMarcus Aldridge is on board when we select, DO WE TAKE HIM?

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=55

there's his profile...sounds like we should take him...ESPECIALLY if he can play center and give us atleast 12 & 8 his first year..

I'm really liking RONNIE BREWER with our second selection...a 6"7 SG that can play the point and is unselfish? sounds like a great back-up to Ben

G Hinrich / Duhon
G Gordon / Brewer
F Deng / Nocioni
F Chandler / Songalia
C Aldridge / Mohammed


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Maybe it's just me but, Shelden Williams reminds me of a YOUNG Antonio Davis.


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Maybe it's just me but, Shelden Williams reminds me of a YOUNG Antonio Davis.



I can see that.
Williams is having a great game today, every time I look he's involved in the play, whether it's on offense or defense.

The more I watch Redick the more I want him on the Bulls. If not, I'm going to be a fan of his where ever he ends up.
Which means it will probably be the Knicks, just to further taunt me.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JRose5 said:


> I can see that.
> Williams is having a great game today, every time I look he's involved in the play, whether it's on offense or defense.
> 
> The more I watch Redick the more I want him on the Bulls. If not, I'm going to be a fan of his where ever he ends up.
> Which means it will probably be the Knicks, just to further taunt me.


not only is he a YOUNG antonio davis, he also runs like him, dunks like him and has the same build.

he looks to be no more than a bench player in the nba though.

reddick's a GREAT shooter but I'm not seeing much of ANYTHING else in his game.


----------



## hoops

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JRose5 said:


> The more I watch Redick the more I want him on the Bulls. If not, I'm going to be a fan of his where ever he ends up.


DITTO.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> If LaMarcus Aldridge is on board when we select, DO WE TAKE HIM?
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=55
> 
> there's his profile...sounds like we should take him...ESPECIALLY if he can play center and give us atleast 12 & 8 his first year..
> 
> I'm really liking RONNIE BREWER with our second selection...a 6"7 SG that can play the point and is unselfish? sounds like a great back-up to Ben
> 
> G Hinrich / Duhon
> G Gordon / Brewer
> F Deng / Nocioni
> F Chandler / Songalia
> C Aldridge / Mohammed


Yeah, at this point I'm thinking Aldridge and Brewer is the dream draft. With maybe a #2 overall pick right now, I think it might be more likely we got Aldridge than Brewer with our pick.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

In a Dream draft we land the #1 pick from the Knicks and after narrowly missing the playoffs also luck into #2. Shawne Williams and Aldridge. :biggrin:


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Maybe it's just me but, Shelden Williams reminds me of a YOUNG Antonio Davis.


I agree, that's why I want him as a mid-to-late lotto selection. A young Antonio Davis provided a strong interior presence for a contending Pacers team. Shelden brings the same toughness, hustle, and athleticism.

I'm still not sure about Lamarcus Aldridge...he could be anything from Joe Smith to Chris Bosh. 

I'm starting to lean toward Tiago Splitter if we have a pick in the 3-5 range. He's really picked up his game in Euro league, and brings size, athleticism, and strong defense all in one player. And he's skilled offensively as well.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I really think Morrison will be a bust if he's drafted too high. The guy has no impact on the game other than scoring and I don't think he'll be an elite scorer at the NBA level.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> I agree, that's why I want him as a mid-to-late lotto selection. A young Antonio Davis provided a strong interior presence for a contending Pacers team. Shelden brings the same toughness, hustle, and athleticism.


You know what, you're right...actually he's pretty average right now but in the right system, he could be a 12 & 12 type of player just like antonio...I just think we need MORE than that. He had 26pts, 13rebs & 7blks today and he was all OVER the place, he's just not about finesse but hustle.

Watching Gonzaga vs. Stanford today, I'm not incredibly impressed with Adam Morrison. He had 34pts, 6 rebs and a CLUTCH blk but they were raving about him like he IS the next Larry Bird which I'm having a VERY hard time seeing myself. He's slow and nowhere NEAR athletic. He gives me a Mike Dunleavy type of feel, I'm thinkin' he'll be no more than an average SF in the nba. Ron Artest or Bruce Bowen are faster and would KILL him.

I missed Texas's game today so I can't comment on Aldridge. He had 21pts & 12rebs though.

Rudy Gay is INCREDIBLY athletic. Today vs. Seaton Hall, he had some MONSTEROUS Vince Carter type dunks. Watchin' him on the fastbreak is a THING OF BEAUTY.

Right now, this is a VERY weak draft though.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Which players would ya'll take regardless of positional need?


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> Which players would ya'll take regardless of positional need?


None from this sad excuse for a draft.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Anyone else familiar with MSU?

If so tell me if this is not the best comparision ever 

Shannon Brown= Smush Parker.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> Which players would ya'll take regardless of positional need?





giantkiller7 said:


> None from this sad excuse for a draft.


That is ridiculous. How about any, that would give us the best player available, which to me seems even more important to do the weaker the draft is.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> Which players would ya'll take regardless of positional need?


Having not seen the European players, my top 3 players from this draft would be Gay, Aldridge, and Shelden Williams (in that order). Tyrus Thomas looks good on highlights but I've never seen him over the course of a full game.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I really think Morrison will be a bust if he's drafted too high. The guy has no impact on the game other than scoring and I don't think he'll be an elite scorer at the NBA level.


 I agree, he's a great shooter, but aside from that doesn't do much of anything. There is certainly room for a shooter like him in some starting rotation, but probably not ours, and I feel like where ever he is picked, he won't be the best player available.

I've mentioned this before, but I would call this *a huge sleeper stat

Carney is averaging more PPM than JJ or Morrison.* His game looks like it would translate better than those 2 as well and I would expect him to be a top 5 pick.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Good stat on Rodney Carney. I haven't seen him play in at least a year, but looking at the numbers, he scores in high volume and has low turnover numbers. 18 ppg in only 26 minutes is impressive, regardless of a 44% FG%. Sounds to me like he's plenty athletic to play the 2 and could be a very good defensive player as well. I wonder how he would fit for the Bulls.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Is it just me, or does Adam Morrison look at the ball when he dribbles?


----------



## Bron_Melo_ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rosenthall said:


> Is it just me, or does Adam Morrison look at the ball when he dribbles?


It sure looked like it when he wuz dribbling at da end of the Stanford game


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> Good stat on Rodney Carney. I haven't seen him play in at least a year, but looking at the numbers, he scores in high volume and has low turnover numbers. 18 ppg in only 26 minutes is impressive, regardless of a 44% FG%. Sounds to me like he's plenty athletic to play the 2 and could be a very good defensive player as well. I wonder how he would fit for the Bulls.


Actually I just did the math and that stat is false, I got it from Sportscenter a few days ago, but he is close which also says quite a lot.

His teamate Shawne Williams may be a better fit. I think he will be better than Carney in almost every way, especially with ball handling and passing ability. He will probably also be a better shooter long term, but like his shot the rest of his game will take some time to catch up with Carney.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Too early to be married to anyone but this Ronnie Brewer is impressing me.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Bron_Melo_ROY said:


> It sure looked like it when he wuz dribbling at da end of the Stanford game


 Missed his last 13 points to end the game, but watching up to that point he wasn't very impressive last night, even with the 21 points I saw him score. Undoubtably he will be a great shooter, but he has very little athletism, very little, and had a hard time against smaller unathletic Stanford players at times. At the next level I don't see him having any ability to create his own shot or create well for others. The Larry Bird comparisions are way off. My comparision is a poor man's Dirk Nowitski. Same touch, with less height, size, speed, and strength.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Too early to be married to anyone but this Ronnie Brewer is impressing me.


He sure is interesting. The best 2 guard with size hands down, I'm hoping we can scoop up either Sheldon, Ronnie, JJ, Lowry (thats right a point guard), or possibly Splitter with our pick.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I was curious how some of the top college players stars stats this year compared with the bulls of yesterday year.

Scottie College Career


Code:


                +-------------------------------------------------------------------+------------+------------------+
                |                               Total                               |  Shooting  |     Per Game     |
                +-------------------------------------------------------------------+------------+------------------+
 Year College   |  G   MP   FG  FGA  3P 3PA   FT  FTA  TRB  AST STL BLK  TO  PF  PTS| FG% 3P% FT%| MP  TRB  AST  PTS|
+---------------+---+----+----+----+---+---+----+----+----+----+---+---+---+---+----+----+---+---+---+----+----+----+
 1984 carkansas | 20        36   79           13   19   59   14  10      26  36   85|  46      68|     3.0  0.7  4.3|
 1985 carkansas | 19       141  250           69  102  175   30  35      60  61  351|  56      68|     9.2  1.6 18.5|
 1986 carkansas | 29       229  412          116  169  266  102  70     111  87  574|  56      69|     9.2  3.5 19.8|
 1987 carkansas | 25       231  390  23  40  105  146  249  107  78      94  77  590|  59  58  72|    10.0  4.3 23.6|
+---------------+---+----+----+----+---+---+----+----+----+----+---+---+---+---+----+----+---+---+---+----+----+----+
 4 Seasons      | 93       637 1131  23  40  303  436  749  253 193     291 261 1600|  56  58  69|     8.1  2.7 17.2|
+---------------+---+----+----+----+---+---+----+----+----+----+---+---+---+---+----+----+---+---+---+----+----+----+

Horance Grant


Code:


                +-------------------------------------------------------------------+------------+------------------+
                |                               Total                               |  Shooting  |     Per Game     |
                +-------------------------------------------------------------------+------------+------------------+
 Year College   |  G   MP   FG  FGA  3P 3PA   FT  FTA  TRB  AST STL BLK  TO  PF  PTS| FG% 3P% FT%| MP  TRB  AST  PTS|
+---------------+---+----+----+----+---+---+----+----+----+----+---+---+---+---+----+----+---+---+---+----+----+----+
 1984 clemson   | 28  551   64  120           32   43  129   49  21  21  34  65  160|  53      74| 20  4.6  1.8  5.7|
 1985 clemson   | 29  703  132  238           65  102  196   32  19  12  52  83  329|  55      64| 24  6.8  1.1 11.3|
 1986 clemson   | 34 1099  208  356          140  193  357   62  28  24  67 108  556|  58      73| 32 10.5  1.8 16.4|
 1987 clemson   | 31 1010  256  390   1   2  138  195  299   63  36  25  67  81  651|  66  50  71| 33  9.6  2.0 21.0|
+---------------+---+----+----+----+---+---+----+----+----+----+---+---+---+---+----+----+---+---+---+----+----+----+
 4 Seasons      |122 3363  660 1104   1   2  375  533  981  206 104  82 220 337 1696|  60  50  70| 28  8.0  1.7 13.9|
+---------------+---+----+----+----+---+---+----+----+----+----+---+---+---+---+----+----+---+---+---+----+----+----+


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

If Aldridge and Gay are gone with the Knicks pick (assuming Morrison's gone too), I'd feel compelled to take Carney that high. The guy's a serious defender, an efficient scorer (averaging less minutes than his sophomore year, but 5 more ppg!?!). He's extended his range and more than his stats can say, you see him make these plays in important games against great teams and it's like, gosh. My jaw drops.

I think that we DO have the minutes for him available on this team, too. I don't see why he can't get 10-15 mpg behind Gordon and some minutes behind Deng/Noch when we go to a small lineup... and we KNOW that a trade is coming at some point with some of these assets. Carney can either BE one of those assets or step into a role when one of them gets traded.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> I'd feel compelled to take Carney that high. The guy's a serious defender, an efficient scorer (averaging less minutes than his sophomore year, but 5 more ppg!?!). He's extended his range and more than his stats can say, you see him make these plays in important games against great teams and it's like, gosh. My jaw drops.


I like him too, that much I'd almost take him over Gay. That and I see him being able to play the 2 more effectively than Gay.

Hmmm boy I'd like to take both.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I think Gay is someone we seriously need though mainly because of how great he finishes on the fastbreak...our team has to be the WORST in the nba on scoring on the fastbreak...

he's also TALL, has the potential to be a SERIOUS piece of a contender and he's still LEARNING..atheltic as all hell & unselfish..

sounds like a young pippen to me...

I'd take gay & Shelden Williams....those two can be serious pieces in the next couple years...add two big men in free agency and we're set

G Hinrich / Duhon
G Gordon / Gay
F Deng / Nocioni
F Chandler / S. Williams / Songalia
C ?


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

We certainly need some good big men, but at the same time, Gay is an interesting possibility because he would instantly become our best (and probably only) player at taking the ball to the rim. As much as I like Lu's overall game, he seems more and more content with shooting jumpshots.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I think Gay is someone we seriously need though mainly because of how great he finishes on the fastbreak...our team has to be the WORST in the nba on scoring on the fastbreak...
> 
> he's also TALL, has the potential to be a SERIOUS piece of a contender and he's still LEARNING..atheltic as all hell & unselfish..
> 
> sounds like a young pippen to me...



We have to be dead last in dunks in the league. Gay would help out there. I loved him at the beginning of the year but he looked so disinterested that he fell in my eyes. But recently he has been nothing short of dominant. If he keeps it up, he might be the consensus #1. If the Bulls get that pick, Gay would have to be seriously considered, regardless of our good SF production. I dont see Gay as a 2 at all, so Deng and/or Noc would have to be moved. I would be sorry to see either go, but would rather keep Deng based on potential myself.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I think Gay is someone we seriously need though mainly because of how great he finishes on the fastbreak...our team has to be the WORST in the nba on scoring on the fastbreak...
> 
> he's also TALL, has the potential to be a SERIOUS piece of a contender and he's still LEARNING..atheltic as all hell & unselfish..
> 
> sounds like a young pippen to me...
> 
> I'd take gay & Shelden Williams....those two can be serious pieces in the next couple years...add two big men in free agency and we're set
> 
> G Hinrich / Duhon
> G Gordon / Gay
> F Deng / Nocioni
> F Chandler / S. Williams / Songalia
> C ?



Good post by the way


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> We have to be dead last in dunks in the league. Gay would help out there. I loved him at the beginning of the year but he looked so disinterested that he fell in my eyes. But recently he has been nothing short of dominant. If he keeps it up, he might be the consensus #1. If the Bulls get that pick, Gay would have to be seriously considered, regardless of our good SF production. I dont see Gay as a 2 at all, so Deng and/or Noc would have to be moved. I would be sorry to see either go, but would rather keep Deng based on potential myself.


Rudy Gay - 16 PPG, 6.5 RPG, 2.3 APG, 2.0 SPG, 2.0 BPG, .45% FG

and he's DISINTERESTED! lol imagine if he was more assertive and agressive. His team is #1 in the nation because of HIM and he's not even giving it his ALL?! LOL

I don't have a problem moving Deng or Noc for the RIGHT piece.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Frankensteiner said:


> We certainly need some good big men, but at the same time, Gay is an interesting possibility because he would instantly become our best (and probably only) player at taking the ball to the rim. As much as I like Lu's overall game, he seems more and more content with shooting jumpshots.


I absolutely HATE when Luol catches it wide open with NONE guarding him and he opts to shoot a 18footer instead of taking it strong...hell Nocioni drives to the basket more than Deng..

We are SOOOOOOOOOO weak in that area, it's pathetic...even the WORST teams (charlote, atlanta) have players that will KILL u if u let them (gerald wallace, josh smith etc.). WE have NONE of that.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Rudy Gay - 16 PPG, 6.5 RPG, 2.3 APG, 2.0 SPG, 2.0 BPG, .45% FG
> 
> and he's DISINTERESTED! lol imagine if he was more assertive and agressive. His team is #1 in the nation because of HIM and he's not even giving it his ALL?! LOL
> 
> I don't have a problem moving Deng or Noc for the RIGHT piece.



Yep ROY, that was the knock on him. Scouts and GMs openly wondered if the kid even liked basketball. I dont know the stats off the top of my head but I believe over the last 9-10 games his PPG is up around 22 or 23. Thats a big lift off the numbers you posted. So basically a disinterested Gay is merely a good to great player while an interested Gay is unstoppable. Sausage and I argue about this on another thread, but my gut after these last 10 games or so is that this kid is totally wasting his time in college. He probably plays down to the level of his opponents because he is bored, and therefore not improving his game much. But if he gets challenged, like the scouts and GMs did with those comments, he could be great. I just dont think this watered down college game helps him as a better player. Here is a kid who might have been better off leaving UConn last year, not risking injury, and learning against the best in the world everyday rather then playing Providence. I think you could be onto something. If he does turn out to be best available when we pick, its certainly going to be an interesting debate, not only here, but in the Bulls draft room. I am sure they want size but Aldridge is the only guy with size who really can compete with Gay IMO. A Gay/Tyrus Thomas draft with a trade of Noc/Deng would certainly be a nice day.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Yep ROY, that was the knock on him. Scouts and GMs openly wondered if the kid even liked basketball. I dont know the stats off the top of my head but I believe over the last 9-10 games his PPG is up around 22 or 23. Thats a big lift off the numbers you posted. So basically a disinterested Gay is merely a good to great player while an interested Gay is unstoppable. Sausage and I argue about this on another thread, but my gut after these last 10 games or so is that this kid is totally wasting his time in college. He probably plays down to the level of his opponents because he is bored, and therefore not improving his game much. But if he gets challenged, like the scouts and GMs did with those comments, he could be great. I just dont think this watered down college game helps him as a better player. Here is a kid who might have been better off leaving UConn last year, not risking injury, and learning against the best in the world everyday rather then playing Providence. I think you could be onto something. If he does turn out to be best available when we pick, its certainly going to be an interesting debate, not only here, but in the Bulls draft room. I am sure they want size but Aldridge is the only guy with size who really can compete with Gay IMO. A Gay/Tyrus Thomas draft with a trade of Noc/Deng would certainly be a nice day.


I agree 100%


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Skiles has commented a couple of times they'd like to try deng at SG later on.
Maybe we can have all three, Gay, Deng, Nocino. 

If he outplays those two to win the starting spot at SF that's a good problem to have.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> I dont know the stats off the top of my head but I believe over the last 9-10 games his PPG is up around 22 or 23.


FYI He's averaging 16 ppg over his last 10 games.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Too early to be married to anyone but this Ronnie Brewer is impressing me.


Are you concerned about his shooting style? It's a bit of a short stroke that seems like it would be difficult to get off in the NBA when in traffic. Still, he wouldn't disappoint me. He's got everything else we need for a player in that role.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Just to clarify on Gays stats, this is a sentence or 2 from Insider. Not quite 10 games. Sorry

Who's No. 1? UConn's Rudy Gay began the season as the consensus choice as the No. 1 NBA draft prospect. After a disappointing start to the season, will he end up back on top?

Gay finally is living up to his potential of late, averaging 21 ppg and 9.3 rpg while shooting 54 percent from the field over his last three games.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> Just to clarify on Gays stats, this is a sentence or 2 from Insider. Not quite 10 games. Sorry
> 
> Who's No. 1? UConn's Rudy Gay began the season as the consensus choice as the No. 1 NBA draft prospect. After a disappointing start to the season, will he end up back on top?
> 
> Gay finally is living up to his potential of late, averaging 21 ppg and 9.3 rpg while shooting 54 percent from the field over his last three games.


I would not be disappointed if the Bulls got Gay. He strikes me as the player in the draft with the best chance of being an elite player. I don't think the Bulls are good enough to bypass talent for need.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I don't think the Bulls are good enough to bypass talent for need.


agreed


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I think this is why this draft may be the one where we finally turn it around:


In the draft we Have to get atleast ONE Big Man. However, we have two high picks (likely). So theoretically, we could go One Big, One G/F combo.

Let's say we are at 3 and 12:

Aldrige is top 2, so depending on who drafts ahead of us we are selecting from:

Gay, Bargnani, Morrison, Splitter, Thomas, Brewer and Carney. 

Let's say Morrison goes 2 - I'd take either Bargnani or Splitter.


Let's Say Bargnani goes 2 and it's between the rest. I'd take Gay.

then at 11, we likely have a choice of whoever falls from the following:

Splitter (I hope), Sheldon Williams, Brewer or Carney, Josh Boone (will be there still)

or we trade down or out of that pick.


Then in Free Agency we go hard and fast at every big man still breathing:

Nene (confirmed healthy)
Harrington
Pryzbilla
Nazr
etc.........

The thing is, we don't ahve to get both big men in the draft. If the right two big men we're there absolutely. However, Gay or BRewer may make more sense as a pick if we KNOW we are willing to way overpay for either Nene, Harrington or Pryz.

In the end, I'd love to see us get Alridge/Bargnani with the top 3 pick and luck in to Brewer or Carney at 10-12.

Then in FA, all out press on Nene and Harrington. 

PG - Hinrich, Duhon, Pargo
SG - Gordon, Brewer/Carney
SF - Deng, Nocioni
PF - Al Harrington, Bargnani, Sweetney
C - Chandler, Pryz (i know a stretch)


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Anybody else think JJ might fall in the top 5? especially if he wins player of the year....


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

An option for the Bulls pick depending on where it is is Brandon Roy of Washington. He's a big guard with playmaking ability and defense.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> An option for the Bulls pick depending on where it is is Brandon Roy of Washington. He's a big guard with playmaking ability and defense.



Great call TD, espescially if we make the playoffs and are in the 16-18 range. So would Fernadez at that range (even though he is said to be a home run or Strike out pick).

Other options for Bigs at that point are also Hilton Armstrong, Josh Boone, Paul Davis, Fazekas and Pittznoggle.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Brandon Rush is another swingman with versitility. I think this draft is a bit underrated. There may not be any surefire stars but there's some pretty solid depth, depending on who declares.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> I think this is why this draft may be the one where we finally turn it around:
> 
> 
> In the draft we Have to get atleast ONE Big Man. However, we have two high picks (likely). So theoretically, we could go One Big, One G/F combo.
> 
> Let's say we are at 3 and 12:
> 
> Aldrige is top 2, so depending on who drafts ahead of us we are selecting from:
> 
> Gay, Bargnani, Morrison, Splitter, Thomas, Brewer and Carney.
> 
> Let's say Morrison goes 2 - I'd take either Bargnani or Splitter.
> 
> 
> Let's Say Bargnani goes 2 and it's between the rest. I'd take Gay.
> 
> then at 11, we likely have a choice of whoever falls from the following:
> 
> Splitter (I hope), Sheldon Williams, Brewer or Carney, Josh Boone (will be there still)
> 
> or we trade down or out of that pick.
> 
> 
> Then in Free Agency we go hard and fast at every big man still breathing:
> 
> Nene (confirmed healthy)
> Harrington
> Pryzbilla
> Nazr
> etc.........
> 
> The thing is, we don't ahve to get both big men in the draft. If the right two big men we're there absolutely. However, Gay or BRewer may make more sense as a pick if we KNOW we are willing to way overpay for either Nene, Harrington or Pryz.
> 
> In the end, I'd love to see us get Alridge/Bargnani with the top 3 pick and luck in to Brewer or Carney at 10-12.
> 
> Then in FA, all out press on Nene and Harrington.
> 
> PG - Hinrich, Duhon, Pargo
> SG - Gordon, Brewer/Carney
> SF - Deng, Nocioni
> PF - Al Harrington, Bargnani, Sweetney
> C - Chandler, Pryz (i know a stretch)


Good post!

I know alot of people disagree with me, but I'm sold with Al Harrington as our starting 4, but ONLY if we surround him with alot of BIG big guys. We already have Chandler who's back with a vengence. I'm also really hoping for Tiago Splitter...the guy is nearly 7 feet and physically ready, strong defensively, athletic, and brings competent offensive skills (along with some excellent Euro-league experience). That would make our 4-man rotation of bigs be Chandler/Splitter at center, and Al/Songaila at PF. Maybe Nene could fit somewhere as well, especially if Songaila doesn't pick up his option. Chandler/Splitter/Al/Nene is also pretty sweet...alot of size and athleticism from that set of big guys.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Check out Brandon Rush on ESPN now.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

well this is one less guy to look at 



> *Thomas* is actually the antithesis of what we’ve become accustomed to from many of the big time early entry candidates over the past few years. He’s a great student who might even be able to accomplish the amazing feat of graduating as a redshirt sophomore next summer, he comes from a basketball family who is more concerned about education and keeping his feet firmly planted on the ground rather than cashing in on an 8 figure shoe deal, he has a great motor and what appears to be an excellent feel for the game, and most importantly, he is telling anyone and everyone who is willing to listen that he will absolutely not enter the draft this year. *According to people close to him, as well as sources at LSU, he knows that he is nowhere near ready to contribute and hold his own at the very tough power forward position in the NBA next year, and has no interest in being practice fodder until he does add enough strength to do so.* DraftExpress.com


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I didn'twant him anyway--just another undersized PF.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1194

There's some pretty critical stuff on Ager in here. Looks like he hasn't been living up to his early season billing.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Good for Tyrus Thomas to make that kind of decision...not many in his place would have the guts to stay in school and be honest with themselves like that. 

The bad news is that it shallows the lottery by 1 player; the good news is that if the Knicks stink next year, we'll be able to use the swap rights to have a chance at him once more! 

I'd rather have Splitter, Aldridge, Bargnani, or Shelden Williams anyway...Tyrus Thomas would probably be my 5th choice out of these bigs if he chose to enter.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

The more I'm thinking about it, Paxson must be looking hard at Sheldon Williams. Watching him against Maryland recently, I was thinking about how much he has in common with Okafor. Okafor has a little size on him and greater athleticism, but Williams also shares Okafor's quick jump, which is part of what makes them both talented shot blockers. Williams probably has a few more post moves and seems healthier. I'll be looking for those predraft measurements on him. If he's closer to 6' 10" then 6' 8", he might even be able to play a little NBA center.

I can imagine Paxson wanting Sheldon with the Bulls pick, which may be possible. Paxson tried to go for a home run with the Gordon pick (he wanted star power), and he'll do it again with the Knicks' pick, should we keep it. If Williams looks like he might noto be available with our pick, I wouldn't be surprised if Mr. Pax tried to trade up for him. He's just got Paxson all over him.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

http://www.youtube.com/w/Rudy-Gay?v=iufzhFl1VGI

Did I miss this video of Rudy Gay highlights somewhere on the board? It's pretty fun.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Tyrus Thomas is a guy worth looking into next year. Apparently the weight he has put on up until now has all been added very recently, so by this time next year, he could be around 230, which would probably be a good playing weight for him. I haven't seen too much of him, but he sounds like he's turning into a legit blue chip prospect. He's an explosive athlete who apparently has a decent offensive repetoire, but doesn't even bother to show it, because he just tries to dunk the hell out of the ball every chance he can get, which, I think is a really good thing. If you have a dominant skill, there's no need to go away from it. And from the sounds of it, he's pretty well rounded and has a decent head on his shoulders, so he shouldn't flake out like Stromile Swift. 

If he does stay, here's hoping he has another great year in college and we'll have a decent shot at him in 07.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

"He’s a great student who might even be able to accomplish the amazing feat of graduating as a redshirt sophomore next summer"
Can some explain to an ignorant Aussie, what Redshirt means please? Just curious


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> "He’s a great student who might even be able to accomplish the amazing feat of graduating as a redshirt sophomore next summer"
> Can some explain to an ignorant Aussie, what Redshirt means please? Just curious


If you "redshirt," you are not allowed to play during that season (you can still practice, etc.) but you retain a year of your eligibility. There aren't any specific requirements as to being able to do it, but for example, if you're a freshman on a loaded team, or you need more experience before you're ready to play, and you probably won't play much at all, you can redshirt and still play four years after your true freshman year. That's why you see the terms "fifth-year senior," "true freshman," etc. Also, there are medical redshirts for injuries sustained--if you get injured in the beginning of the year, you can redshirt that season. IIRC the NCAA is in charge of granting some medical redshirts, and I'm pretty sure in some cases you can have both a medical redshirt year and a regular redshirt year, this is how Jason White was in college for six years, correct me if I'm wrong; I know Brian Randle's redshirt after breaking his hand in preseason last year wasn't NCAA granted and therefore wasn't a bonus redshirt, so I don't know how that works. You don't have to be a freshman to redshirt. Redshirts can be removed in midseason but you don't get that redshirt year back. Aside from the previously mentioned NCAA-granted medical redshirts, you can only redshirt once during your college career.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> well this is one less guy to look at



How many times have we heard this only to see the guy declare? I think there is an 80% certainty he will declare personally. He is a top 7 pick. You can be in college all you want, but why risk it when you can get to the NBA and get the money?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> How many times have we heard this only to see the guy declare? I think there is an 80% certainty he will declare personally. He is a top 7 pick. You can be in college all you want, but why risk it when you can get to the NBA and get the money?


He's been slumping of late and is dreadfully skinny. Perhaps he's getting word that he won't go so high this year?


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Good for Tyrus. One more year at LSU will be a huge attraction for recruiting and it'll be fun to watch his team for another collegiate season. If he gets that degree, it'd be a great accomplishment as well. Why give up the college life if you don't have a family that has dire financial needs? Enjoy campus time while you've got it.

With regards to some of the Shelden Williams comments, I have to agree that he's had Okafor-like flashes and he's shown that he's got the ability to stay with elite big men, but I think they seem to take advantage of the fact that he and McRoberts don't complement each other very well in the frontcourt defense. As a result, Shelden is often defending two big men by himself, or is being defended by two big men (McRoberts doesn't get enough touches, although he's definitely a threat to blow up).

However, it's been said that Shelden disappears in big games against solid big men, and I've sadly found that to be somewhat true. He had a solid game against Nik Caner-Medley against Maryland, but gosh. Al Thornton went 37 and 15 against Duke. Marco Killingsworth had like 31. It seems like good big men blow up against Duke, and that doesn't speak highly for Shelden.

Nevertheless, I like how he looks on the floor. He's extremely active, and when he times his shot blocks, they look straight up ferocious. He's athletic, he's got very decent post-up moves, and he has high basketball IQ. He's the sort of consistency that the Bulls need right now, a 11 and 8 guy that will make his FT's and bring a second frontcourt defensive dimension. If he's there with our pick, we have to grab him (unless Splitter's there too). If the Knicks pick somehow falls to 5 or 6, and Bargnani and Aldridge are gone, it'd be not overshooting to take Williams right there too (again, either him or Splitter, who I've always been pretty high on).


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1194
> 
> There's some pretty critical stuff on Ager in here. Looks like he hasn't been living up to his early season billing.


Yeah--aside from the fact he's second in the Big Ten in scoring...


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> If you "redshirt," you are not allowed to play during that season (you can still practice, etc.) but you retain a year of your eligibility. There aren't any specific requirements as to being able to do it, but for example, if you're a freshman on a loaded team, or you need more experience before you're ready to play, and you probably won't play much at all, you can redshirt and still play four years after your true freshman year. That's why you see the terms "fifth-year senior," "true freshman," etc. Also, there are medical redshirts for injuries sustained--if you get injured in the beginning of the year, you can redshirt that season. IIRC the NCAA is in charge of granting some medical redshirts, and I'm pretty sure in some cases you can have both a medical redshirt year and a regular redshirt year, this is how Jason White was in college for six years, correct me if I'm wrong; I know Brian Randle's redshirt after breaking his hand in preseason last year wasn't NCAA granted and therefore wasn't a bonus redshirt, so I don't know how that works. You don't have to be a freshman to redshirt. Redshirts can be removed in midseason but you don't get that redshirt year back. Aside from the previously mentioned NCAA-granted medical redshirts, you can only redshirt once during your college career.


Thanks for that.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> Yeah--aside from the fact he's second in the Big Ten in scoring...


Yes, but if he's not good defense, do we really want him?


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Yes, but if he's not good defense, do we really want him?


No--never said we wanted him. Just pointing out he's second in scoring in the league. he was doing very poorly in the beginning of the year, which was probably what he article was alluding to, but has really picked it up as of late.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

This is just a request for general info on this guy as I really don't follow the college game much anymore... What's the story with Tyler Hansbrough? I look through the mocks on both Nbadraft.net and draftexpress and he's not listed on their 2006 or 2007 mocks. The guy is tearing it up for Carolina and at 6-9 with decent rebounding stats, he'd seem like a lock to come out this year or next. Has he flatly declared that he's not comming out for the next couple of years? I gotta believe that his stock is pretty damned high right now. As RLucas pointed out with Thomas of LSU, why would a young man pass on a guaranteed $10 mil. or so. Especially in this draft that is rather weak on size. Wait till next year and they'll just be part of a group of a dozen or so quality bigs. UNC is a top-flight program and the ACC is still one of the best conferences out there.

For those of you that have seen him play (admitedly - not me!) if he were to declare this year, where would he fall? Top 5 pick? Top 10? Lottery? Would it be a mistake for him to come out now? Does he have it athletically? I'm just not understanding why he's not listed on any mocks for the next two years.

thanks!


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Rudy Gay just played well in a big game.

Worth pointing out.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> No--never said we wanted him. Just pointing out he's second in scoring in the league. he was doing very poorly in the beginning of the year, which was probably what he article was alluding to, but has really picked it up as of late.


Actually, his play at the beginning of the year is what got him some attention, particularly in the Maui Invitational, after which his draft stock vaulted up.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Actually, his play at the beginning of the year is what got him some attention, particularly in the Maui Invitational, after which his draft stock vaulted up.


Weird. You're right. I had it backwards. He's actually doing pretty awful as of late.

http://scoreboards.aol.com/basketball/ncaab/player/68004/player_gamelog.aspx

I thought I had remembered it the other way around...


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Anyone catch Adam Morrison's 2nd half today against LMU ?

Holy freaking Crap


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

37 points in the 2nd half, ouch.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Adam Morrison!!!!!!


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Having only seen a limited amount of Gonzaga basketball this year, my impression of Morrison is that he's primarily a jump shooter. It would appear his skills would be somewhat redundant on the Bulls. But looking at his season statistics, he's shot many more free throws than either of Gay, Carney, or Aldridge (3 players expected to get to the free throw line).

Is Morrison's ability to draw fouls only a product of playing in college and against some less than stellar competition? Or could this ability translate to the NBA?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Didn't Bo Kimble average a ton in college?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm watching the Duke game and once again I'm not so impressed with Williams. He'll be somewhere between Okafor and Etan Thomas IMO.

Diaz for Miami will be a very good third guard IMO. The guy is like Nate Robinson + half a foot.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Frankensteiner said:


> Having only seen a limited amount of Gonzaga basketball this year, my impression of Morrison is that he's primarily a jump shooter. It would appear his skills would be somewhat redundant on the Bulls. But looking at his season statistics, he's shot many more free throws than either of Gay, Carney, or Aldridge (3 players expected to get to the free throw line).
> 
> Is Morrison's ability to draw fouls only a product of playing in college and against some less than stellar competition? Or could this ability translate to the NBA?


But he's one of those really really special jump shooters that can hit 18-footers blindfolded and has a really quick and high release. I don't like to say it, but it IS sort of Bird-like. If he can be 70% of the player Bird was, he'd be incredible.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> But he's one of those really really special jump shooters that can hit 18-footers blindfolded and has a really quick and high release. I don't like to say it, but it IS sort of Bird-like. If he can be 70% of the player Bird was, he'd be incredible.


Additionally, his size and bulk allows him to get spacing from his defender... he's one of the best shot creators in college hoops

And he has that killer instinct Gay doesn't--Morrison always wants the ball.

LOL, there was one practice--this was in SI--in preseason, where they were teaching a frosh PG the ropes, and Mark Few was yelling at the PG, telling him what to do on the play, saying something like, "this play has a ton of options, make sure you identify them all," and Morrison tells the PG, "don't worry, there's always only one option" (referring to himself).


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> Additionally, his size and bulk allows him to get spacing from his defender... he's one of the best shot creators in college hoops
> 
> And he has that killer instinct Gay doesn't--Morrison always wants the ball.
> 
> LOL, there was one practice--this was in SI--in preseason, where they were teaching a frosh PG the ropes, and Mark Few was yelling at the PG, telling him what to do on the play, saying something like, "this play has a ton of options, make sure you identify them all," and Morrison tells the PG, "don't worry, there's always only one option" (referring to himself).



I remember this. My first thought was, No way is this guy going to get along with Skiles or Pax. I think because he is a college player and a white kid, people are going to think of him as a guy with good jib. But that isnt the case. He has a huge ego, he is a loose cannon (during games he talks trash WITH HIS OWN COACHES). But he also has a competitive streak that I love and I happen to love his cockiness. But he isnt a yes man, and probably means he cant play for the Bulls. But I freaking love stories like this. He will be a success somewhere. He vs Gay will be interesting to look at over their careers. I prefer Gay, but only by a smidge.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I'm watching the Duke game and once again I'm not so impressed with Williams. He'll be somewhere between Okafor and Etan Thomas IMO.


Shelden Williams = Antonio Davis Pt. II


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I don't think he's as athletic as Davis was.


----------



## Bron_Melo_ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I don't think he's as athletic as Davis was.


I do...



rlucas4257 said:


> I remember this. My first thought was, No way is this guy going to get along with Skiles or Pax. I think because he is a college player and a white kid, people are going to think of him as a guy with good jib. But that isnt the case. He has a huge ego, he is a loose cannon (during games he talks trash WITH HIS OWN COACHES). But he also has a competitive streak that I love and I happen to love his cockiness. But he isnt a yes man, and probably means he cant play for the Bulls. But I freaking love stories like this. He will be a success somewhere. He vs Gay will be interesting to look at over their careers. I prefer Gay, but only by a smidge.


I've noticed that a little bit as well but I don't think that it'll affect the way scouts perceive him. They'll just look at it as confidence.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> Additionally, his size and bulk allows him to get spacing from his defender... he's one of the best shot creators in college hoops


At the college level he's guarded by 6'5" 200 pounders. In the pro's he'll be covered by 6'8" 225 pounders and won't be able to use his bulk to create seperation. Unless his team runs a ton of screans for him, I really don't know how he'll score.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Bron_Melo_ROY said:


> I do...
> 
> 
> 
> I've noticed that a little bit as well but I don't think that it'll affect the way scouts perceive him. They'll just look at it as confidence.



White College Player = Confidence
Black HS Player = Part of that element

That bothers me. But it isnt Morrisons fault that I am sure he percieved as a choir boy by GMs etc. He is a tough nose player who actually has a bit of a personality, something no one on our club does (have you ever seen 12 more boring people in your life?). But I dont think Skiles and Pax want guys who have opinions or independent thoughts, guys with a little life to their games, they want yes men, robots. Morrison doesnt fall into that category. But I would love to have him on the Bulls anyway. I think he will be a success and certainly would add some spunk to the most boring group in sports history.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> Unless his team runs a ton of screans for him, I really don't know how he'll score.


I don't see that as a bad thing, many players made that their bread and butter. When utilized properly I have no doubt Morrison will be an exceptional player, when you try and force the issue, much like Sacramento did with Stojakovic, you'll just end up asking for too much. 
Given he's competitive nature, I don't see him ever becomming complacent, unlike some of our previous acquisitions, which is one of the main reasons why I think he'll be successful in the pros.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> Unless his team runs a ton of screans for him, I really don't know how he'll score.



Yeah I agree with this 

Whilst I think he is one of the few possible exceptional players in this draft ...he really needs the right system to suceed

And that system has :

An equal first option big man poster that can score inside and pass ( and knows when to pass )

A speed guard that can penetrate and dish ( and does it often and generously )

Everyone else screening and crashing the boards 

Put him in a situation like this and he will be unfreaking stoppable 

The Minnesota Timberwolves are the perfect situation for him if they can get position high enough in the lottery 

Garnett as the post scorer/passer who knows when to pass

Hudson as the speed /penetrating dish guard 

Move Jaric to the 2 where he is better suited and where he can push in transition but where he's not suited to handling the half court sets 

Bring Ricky Davis and Rashard McCants from the bench. Hasselll is a role defender

You have Mark Madsen and Mark Blount as the rebounder/screen setter and you need another couple of vet guys like them through MLE and LLE free agency to deepen the front court + a vet back up point guard 

Wolves would be set IMO

*

Blount
Garnett
Morrison
Jaric
Hudson

bench

Cato ( free agency )
Madsen
Davis
McCants
Hassell
Vet point gaurd addition with the MLE 
2nd rounder 

*


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Yeah I agree with this
> 
> Whilst I think he is one of the few possible exceptional players in this draft ...he really needs the right system to suceed
> 
> And that system has :
> 
> An equal first option big man poster that can score inside and pass ( and knows when to pass )
> 
> A speed guard that can penetrate and dish ( and does it often and generously )
> 
> Everyone else screening and crashing the boards
> 
> Put him in a situation like this and he will be unfreaking stoppable
> 
> The Minnesota Timberwolves are the perfect situation for him if they can get position high enough in the lottery
> 
> Garnett as the post scorer/passer who knows when to pass
> 
> Hudson as the speed /penetrating dish guard
> 
> Move Jaric to the 2 where he is better suited and where he can push in transition but where he's not suited to handling the half court sets
> 
> Bring Ricky Davis and Rashard McCants from the bench. Hasselll is a role defender
> 
> You have Mark Madsen and Mark Blount as the rebounder/screen setter and you need another couple of vet guys like them through MLE and LLE free agency to deepen the front court + a vet back up point guard
> 
> Wolves would be set IMO
> 
> *
> 
> Blount
> Garnett
> Morrison
> Jaric
> Hudson
> 
> bench
> 
> Cato ( free agency )
> Madsen
> Davis
> McCants
> Hassell
> Vet point gaurd addition with the MLE
> 2nd rounder
> 
> *



But isnt Morrison similar to Wally in alot of ways? And when you add in the fact that KG couldnt get along with Wally, and Morrisons ego might be bigger then Wallys, it might be a hard to make it work out. Atleast off the floor. On the floor, I thought KG/Wally played well together but they only were able to advance past the first round once as a team. I think Minny addressed some of their issues with Ricky Davis. They need athleticism at the other spots away from KG. They could also use another big body on the front line and a top level PG.


----------



## Machinehead

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rlucas4257 said:


> But isnt Morrison similar to Wally in alot of ways? And when you add in the fact that KG couldnt get along with Wally, and Morrisons ego might be bigger then Wallys, it might be a hard to make it work out. Atleast off the floor. On the floor, I thought KG/Wally played well together but they only were able to advance past the first round once as a team. I think Minny addressed some of their issues with Ricky Davis. They need athleticism at the other spots away from KG. They could also use another big body on the front line and a top level PG.


All fair points 

And this is the classic crux of the problem surrounding the Wolves ..is KG able to accommodate other strong personalities on the team 

There were times where Wally was isolated in Minnesota as the vortex of KG's star power drew players into his orbit ..and for the fact that Sczcerbiak was a strong personality who believed in his ability and didn't defer to the appropriate degree required to King KG ... and openly demanded more shot opportunities - their on court chemistry was OK at times but IMO wasn't maximised - it really should have been a whole lot more 

Sczcerbiak was even further marginalised with Spree and Cassell on the team 

Its a great point you make about Morrison who is openly more challenging than Sczcerbiak was/is 

Can KG handle that if from a basketball standpoint with what they already have in a post productive/ passing big man ( KG ) the speedy push and dish guard ( Hudson ) and a couple of athletic wings ( Davis / McCants ) and wing defenders ( Jaric/Hassell ) 

A big man screener , shotblocker like Cato and maybe a Danny Fortson type acquisition to screen and board could fortify them upfront

Earl Watson could also be a trade target that makes sense . * Maybe Jaric for Watson and DerMarr Johnson with Johnson going with Hassell to Seattle for Danny Fortson *

Wolves would have Hudson, Watson and Banks as ball handling guards with Davis and McCants at the other guard spots and Morrison at the other wing backed up by a LLE vet signing .

Upfront the Wolves would have KG and Blount backed by Cato, Fortson and Madsen ( a good 3 man bruise team to work the boards and screen up - not only for Morrison's shooting game but McCants and Davis's slashing games ) 

Morrison is palapable though ... he is a killer . Just oozes from him 

You are spot on though regarding the chemistry fit with KG and KG being able to accommodate him and Morrison being mature enough to recognise his basketball situation which would give him best chance to dominate


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

If anyone here saw Texas-OSU, I'd love to hear his or her thoughts. Kind of a red-flag game for me regarding Aldridge.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> If anyone here saw Texas-OSU, I'd love to hear his or her thoughts. Kind of a red-flag game for me regarding Aldridge.


Would you care to expand on that please? I'm curious how our potential draft picks are going.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> Would you care to expand on that please? I'm curious how our potential draft picks are going.


9 pts on 2-7 FG and 5-8 FT, 10 reb (5 offensive), 3 blocks, 2 TO...


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> Would you care to expand on that please? I'm curious how our potential draft picks are going.


giantkiller posted his stat line, which isn't dreadful or anything. What made it a red flag for me was the fact that it was against a lousy team with nothing even approximating an NBA player in the frontcourt. The game wraps made mention of Aldridge short-arming shots and being bothered by smaller, aggressive players.

I have been very unimpressed when I've seen Aldridge, and I was hoping for an eyewitness account of this stinker.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> giantkiller posted his stat line, which isn't dreadful or anything. What made it a red flag for me was the fact that it was against a lousy team with nothing even approximating an NBA player in the frontcourt. The game wraps made mention of Aldridge short-arming shots and being bothered by smaller, aggressive players.
> 
> I have been very unimpressed when I've seen Aldridge, and I was hoping for an eyewitness account of this stinker.


Could you name a couple of players you'd look at drafting with the knicks and bulls pick? 

If we can't get a quality big with our first pick are we better off going "Best Player Available"?


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> giantkiller posted his stat line, which isn't dreadful or anything. What made it a red flag for me was the fact that it was against a lousy team with nothing even approximating an NBA player in the frontcourt. The game wraps made mention of Aldridge short-arming shots and being bothered by smaller, aggressive players.
> 
> I have been very unimpressed when I've seen Aldridge, and I was hoping for an eyewitness account of this stinker.



OK, I watched this game hoping to be convinced without a doubt that Aldrige was our guy. Unfortuantely, OSU handed Texas their arses. It was quite embarrasing. I will say each time I've watched Texas (4 times now) they really have a horrible offensive plan or just don't execute much.

Aldrige seems to have the skill set, the height and the ability. However, the same knock on Gay (heart and desire to destroy opponents) seems to be lacking.

Bottom line on the effort against OSU is that OSU ran every Longhorn out of the game. Out hustled, out witted and Out played. One note - OSU is a sleep come tourney time. Quality team. Still, Aldrige should've made some noise and didn't.

Disappointing game. Aldrige, lilke Gay is gonna make or break their spot at #1 in the tourney.


At this point, I'd take best available and or look for the stunning trade (ala Brand for pick to grab Chandler). It only takes one desperate GM who thinks they are smarter than the rest. Hello, Jerry West, wanna part with Gasol?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I think the passion knock is overrated. There are plenty of players that have been successful while playing cool. Tim Duncan comes to mind, as does Charlie V when he was at UConn.

However, I am a bit concerned that Aldridge is only averaging 0.4 assists per game.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I think the passion knock is overrated. There are plenty of players that have been successful while playing cool. Tim Duncan comes to mind, as does Charlie V when he was at UConn.
> 
> However, I am a bit concerned that Aldridge is only averaging 0.4 assists per game.


It's not about playing cool, it's about wanting to take shots, and the desire to win, etc.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> It's not about playing cool, it's about wanting to take shots, and the desire to win, etc.


Its hard to judge desire from the outside. Also he's a sophmore playing with some very ballhogish guards. I can't hold it against him if he's not pulling a


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



darlets said:


> Could you name a couple of players you'd look at drafting with the knicks and bulls pick?
> 
> If we can't get a quality big with our first pick are we better off going "Best Player Available"?


I don't know for sure who I'd take with a #1-3 pick. There isn't a clear-cut answer, and I'm not sure things are going to be much clearer on draft night. Right now, I'd take Gay.

That's why I'm advocating using the Knicks 2006 pick and Tim Thomas's expiring contract to trade for an established NBA star before the deadline. I think that this is a weak draft at the top, but there are probably lots of quality players who'll be available outside of the top 5. If the Bulls finish with, say, the 12th pick, it wouldn't shock me if we could get a player there who'll be as good as or better in the long run than whoever is selected with the Knicks' pick.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> OOne note - OSU is a sleep come tourney time. Quality team.


I don't follow college basketball that closely, but I thought that OSU was barely top-100 RPI, 4-8 in the Big 12, bunch of 6-6/6-8 guys across the frontline, etc. Wouldn't they need to win the Big 12 tourney to make the big dance?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Aldridge put up 22 on Sheldon Williams (not that uncommon) and put up 22 against what is supposidly a very tough Oklahoma front line. I think inconsistancy in common in young players and I'd by more impressed by him putting up good games against good talent than I would be concerned by him having a bad game vs. bad talent.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> I don't follow college basketball that closely, but I thought that OSU was barely top-100 RPI, 4-8 in the Big 12, bunch of 6-6/6-8 guys across the frontline, etc. Wouldn't they need to win the Big 12 tourney to make the big dance?



OSU would need to win the rest of their games and pray for a miracle, but they are a helter skelter mix. They almost beat Gonzaga (lost on last second shot by Morrison I believe), Pushed Oklahoma, now destroyed Texas (though got destroyed by Texas last time). Had some bad losses too. OK, probably won't get in. Capable of the big game though, against top rated teams.

Bottom line is that Aldrige should be dominating or atleast putting up more consistent numbers. Whoever said the Guards are ball hogs are correct.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> Aldridge put up 22 on Sheldon Williams (not that uncommon) and put up 22 against what is supposidly a very tough Oklahoma front line. I think inconsistancy in common in young players and I'd by more impressed by him putting up good games against good talent than I would be concerned by him having a bad game vs. bad talent.


Remember, I haven't been impressed by him even in the games I've seen where he's performed well vs. good opponents. I don't think he's anything special from an athletic standpoint, nor is he a highly skilled player.

If he struggles mightily against a bad team with centers and power forwards the size of NBA twos, I'm sorry, to me, it's a red flag. We're talking about a guy we're considering taking 1 or 2 in the draft. I don't want a player like that to have many warts.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> Its hard to judge desire from the outside. Also he's a sophmore playing with some very ballhogish guards. I can't hold it against him if he's not pulling a [me-shawn]


lol @ the pic.

still though, when they give him the ball he usually passes it off. I'm just going by what I hear, how Calhoun is pissed at him because he doesn't take enough shots, isn't aggressive enough... we've been hearing the same things all year, and they've got to have substance somewhere. I mean what we want on the Bulls is someone that wants to have the ball in their hands, right?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> Remember, I haven't been impressed by him even in the games I've seen where he's performed well vs. good opponents. I don't think he's anything special from an athletic standpoint, nor is he a highly skilled player.
> 
> If he struggles mightily against a bad team with centers and power forwards the size of NBA twos, I'm sorry, to me, it's a red flag. We're talking about a guy we're considering taking 1 or 2 in the draft. I don't want a player like that to have many warts.


One thing that I do agree with you is that I think he's overrated as an athlete. I think he's a Channing Frye type athlete which is OK, but not elite for a skinny bigman. 

I do think he's got pretty advanced post moves for his age. His fadeaway is pretty sweet.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> One thing that I do agree with you is that I think he's overrated as an athlete. I think he's a Channing Frye type athlete which is OK, but not elite for a skinny bigman.
> 
> I do think he's got pretty advanced post moves for his age. His fadeaway is pretty sweet.


I think Frye's a better run-jump athlete than Aldridge. Aldridge looks like he might have the capacity to put on more muscle down the road.

In any case, it's tough for me to consider athleticism and skill separately with big men. Unless you're Yao's size and/or have Kevin McHale's arsenal of post moves, you're gonna need excellent athleticism to be a star 4/5 in the NBA. There are just too many athletic freaks at those positions.

I guess I should put myself in the "draft the best player available" camp after all. Even though we need a big. And if Aldridge is generally thought to be one of the best 2-3 players available, I don't think it's unfair to label this as a weak draft.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> I think Frye's a better run-jump athlete than Aldridge. Aldridge looks like he might have the capacity to put on more muscle down the road.
> 
> In any case, it's tough for me to consider athleticism and skill separately with big men. Unless you're Yao's size and/or have Kevin McHale's arsenal of post moves, you're gonna need excellent athleticism to be a star 4/5 in the NBA. There are just too many athletic freaks at those positions.
> 
> I guess I should put myself in the "draft the best player available" camp after all. Even though we need a big. And if Aldridge is generally thought to be one of the best 2-3 players available, I don't think it's unfair to label this as a weak draft.


I don't think Brand was a great athlete or had great moves when he came into the league. I also don't think Zach Randolph is great athlete and his moves can't be compared with McHale's. However I think your point is valid for the most part. 

I also am begining to agree with your point regarding the questionable top of the draft talent and the advantage of trading the Knicks pick. Rudy Gay intrigues me but I'm not sure he's a sure enough thing to be worth either playing out of position or trading one of the teams best and most promising players (Deng). 

Assuming the right star isn't available would you be adverse to trade down and pick up a pick next year (giving the Bulls a better shot in a better draft).


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I don't think Brand was a great athlete or had great moves when he came into the league. I also don't think Zach Randolph is great athlete and his moves can't be compared with McHale's. However I think your point is valid for the most part.


I think Brand actually does possess a pretty unique combination of size, speed, agility, and length. Randolph isn't a good athlete, but he does have a big stable of moves and a great jumpshot for a man his size (I wouldn't consider him a star, though).



> I also am begining to agree with your point regarding the questionable top of the draft talent and the advantage of trading the Knicks pick. Rudy Gay intrigues me but I'm not sure he's a sure enough thing to be worth either playing out of position or trading one of the teams best and most promising players (Deng).
> 
> Assuming the right star isn't available would you be adverse to trade down and pick up a pick next year (giving the Bulls a better shot in a better draft).


Those types of trades are really risky -- witness what happened to Phoenix in the Deng trade. But I'm open to any suggestions involving the Knicks' pick.


----------



## RSP83

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm watching the Alabama vs. Arkansas game on ESPN. Ronnie Brewer is looking like the type of player our backcourt need. He's not shooting very well tonight; but, he knows how to contribute in different way other than scoring. His defense and team oriented play help Arkansas get back in the game. Definitely jibberific! He's making some clutch plays too, at both ends.

If we draft him, I think he will get along with our guys very well. He looks comfortable handling the ball and unselfish. He always look to pass first. But, he's not afraid to take the last shot. HE JUST DID. He won the game for Arkansas. You guys gotta love his game. He's like Julius Hodge, but he plays more under control and look to pass more. Better defender too IMO.

Arkansas won the game 65 - 63. They came back from 14 point deficit. And Brewer hit the game winning layup. and one. and made the FT to seal the game.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



RSP83 said:


> I'm watching the Alabama vs. Arkansas game on ESPN. Ronnie Brewer is looking like the type of player our backcourt need. He's not shooting very well tonight; but, he knows how to contribute in different way other than scoring. His defense and team oriented play help Arkansas get back in the game. Definitely jibberific! He's making some clutch plays too, at both ends.
> 
> If we draft him, I think he will get along with our guys very well. He looks comfortable handling the ball and unselfish. He always look to pass first. But, he's not afraid to take the last shot. HE JUST DID. He won the game for Arkansas. You guys gotta love his game. He's like Julius Hodge, but he plays more under control and look to pass more. Better defender too IMO.
> 
> Arkansas won the game 65 - 63. They came back from 14 point deficit. And Brewer hit the game winning layup. and one. and made the FT to seal the game.


Not to mention he's freakin 6'7! I wouldn't quite compare him to Hodge, because he can't do as much--Hodge led the team in points, rebounds, assists, steals, FG%, was their best defender...--but hey, I would take him in a heartbeat. We could then deal Duhon for a big man possibly. Good call.

I wish I had watched more of this game for that sole reason.

Only thing I'm worried about is that it may be too early for him with the Knicks' pick and too late with ours.

I would take him over Carney.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> Not to mention he's freakin 6'7! I wouldn't quite compare him to Hodge, because he can't do as much--Hodge led the team in points, rebounds, assists, steals, FG%, was their best defender...--but hey, I would take him in a heartbeat. We could then deal Duhon for a big man possibly. Good call.
> 
> I wish I had watched more of this game for that sole reason.
> 
> Only thing I'm worried about is that it may be too early for him with the Knicks' pick and too late with ours.
> 
> I would take him over Carney.


Brewer has unorthodox shooting form, but that is a result of a broken arm he suffered as a child that didn't heal correctly. He can't fully bend his right elbow. I wonder how much that limits his shooting ability. His shooting percentages are decent: 43% for the field, 34% from 3, 75% from the line.

He might be a great long term fit next to Gordon, but then again he's never averaged 4 assists per game in any of his three years in college. That being said, his all around game looks very strong. He looks like one of the great fits for our team in the draft this year.


----------



## giantkiller7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Brewer has unorthodox shooting form, but that is a result of a broken arm he suffered as a child that didn't heal correctly. He can't fully bend his right elbow. I wonder how much that limits his shooting ability. His shooting percentages are decent: 43% for the field, 34% from 3, 75% from the line.
> 
> He might be a great long term fit next to Gordon, but then again he's never averaged 4 assists per game in any of his three years in college. That being said, his all around game looks very strong. He looks like one of the great fits for our team in the draft this year.


About the assists- we could play him at the 2. He's the kind of athletic guy we need. That's the great thing about him. He's so versatile, we could play him at either guard spot--it could be like last year, when we had Chris and Kirk out there both as just guards, instead of specifically the 1 and 2. As long as we have him out there.

Many guys as athletic and talented as he is in college don't take the time to develop their shot much because they don't need it. I doubt his stroke will limit his long-term shooting ability. He'll have to develop his shot a little maybe, but hey, the last thing we need is another mid range shooter, right? He fills basically all our needs at guard, and wouldn't come at the price of a FA and could grow with the team.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



giantkiller7 said:


> Not to mention he's freakin 6'7! I wouldn't quite compare him to Hodge, because he can't do as much--Hodge led the team in points, rebounds, assists, steals, FG%, was their best defender...--but hey, I would take him in a heartbeat. We could then deal Duhon for a big man possibly. Good call.
> 
> I wish I had watched more of this game for that sole reason.
> 
> Only thing I'm worried about is that it may be too early for him with the Knicks' pick and too late with ours.
> 
> I would take him over Carney.


But we could pick for another team with one of our picks and they pick brewer for us. We could even do our pick player for their pick and player, so a big + brewer for duhon and our pick. I'd have to double check who has picks and big guys between our two picks.


----------



## RSP83

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I think Brewer in his rookie year won't shoot solid percentage like he does in college. But, he's never a shooter anyway. He's more of a slasher who can get to the FT line or kick out to find an open man. And at 6'7" and long arms like that, he's really going to add size to our backcourt lineup.

I'm not really concern about how he's going to score in the NBA, cause we have Ben and Deng as our go to scorers in the future. I'm excited about his potential to become a very good defender one day. He doesn't look like a lazy player on the court. He'd try so hard to stay in front of his man. With that attitude plus his physical attributes, man Ben Gordon is going to be happy playing alongside him. Plus he's unselfish. He'll get the ball to our go to scorers. He can play a little PG. But nowhere near Joe Johnson level yet. A very interesting prospect who looks like a great fit for our team.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

he reminds me of marquis daniels..


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



RSP83 said:


> I think Brewer in his rookie year won't shoot solid percentage like he does in college. But, he's never a shooter anyway. He's more of a slasher who can get to the FT line or kick out to find an open man. And at 6'7" and long arms like that, he's really going to add size to our backcourt lineup.
> 
> I'm not really concern about how he's going to score in the NBA, cause we have Ben and Deng as our go to scorers in the future. I'm excited about his potential to become a very good defender one day. He doesn't look like a lazy player on the court. He'd try so hard to stay in front of his man. With that attitude plus his physical attributes, man Ben Gordon is going to be happy playing alongside him. Plus he's unselfish. He'll get the ball to our go to scorers. He can play a little PG. But nowhere near Joe Johnson level yet. A very interesting prospect who looks like a great fit for our team.


I agree I like him more and more. Another positive, his body is NBA ready right now and impressive at that. He also bring some versatility the rest of our young core doesn't have, being able to play from 1-3.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I was not impressed with Brewer. He was too content to just pass the ball around the perimeter against that zone. He never really broke his man down off the dribble. Combine that with his so so shot and I don't think he has enough offensive talent to be a lottery pick.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I was not impressed with Brewer. He was too content to just pass the ball around the perimeter against that zone. He never really broke his man down off the dribble. Combine that with his so so shot and I don't think he has enough offensive talent to be a lottery pick.


I noticed some of that too last night. I still haven't seen enough of him to know for sure. It was nice to see that he drove to the rack and finished despite getting fouled when the game was on the line.

For people who have watched him more that the three games I have seen, does he play above the rim much?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Anybody else besides me afraid that the Knicks trades might turn out top 3 pick into something around 5-13??

It looks like they're definintely going to pull off the Francis deal and after that, either the Kenyon (Larry wants him) deal or the Ratliff/Miles deal.

I'm not saying they'll GREATLY improve but hell, they COULD go on a run.

I want Rudy Gay


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

The way Josh McRoberts moves reminds me of Rasho Nesterovic


----------



## Jesus Shuttlesworth

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Wow, McRoberts has some handles!!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Bulls need SHELDEN WILLIAMS

right now he has 25 & 8 vs GA Tech. 11-16 from the field. I like this kid alot. best bigman in college


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Note: Carney and Shawnee Williams on tonight on ESPN 2 at 10.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Shelden finished with 26pts & 11rebs on 11-17 shooting...


----------



## truebluefan

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Bulls need SHELDEN WILLIAMS
> 
> right now he has 25 & 8 vs GA Tech. 11-16 from the field. I like this kid alot. best bigman in college


I have yet to be impressed with Aldridge. I am not convinced he is the center we need. 

Sheldon has always looked good when I see him play. He looked great tonight. But I am concerned about his size. Is he big enough to help us? From what I see now he is another short big....we have enough of them already.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



truebluefan said:


> I have yet to be impressed with Aldridge. I am not convinced he is the center we need.
> 
> Sheldon has always looked good when I see him play. He looked great tonight. But I am concerned about his size. Is he big enough to help us? From what I see now he is another short big....we have enough of them already.


6-9 with a great nba body..i think he can help..he's definintely a bulls type of player...

i'm seriously SOLD on him with our pick....i think it's a must that we get this kid...especially with tiago's status being up in the air of him even COMING to the nba...heard we'd have to buy him out


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I watched Carney for the first time today and I was really impressed with his athletic ability and motor. He's not just a guy who dunks big, he's fast and quick as hell. He could be the defender, fast breaker the Bulls need.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> 6-9 with a great nba body..i think he can help..he's definintely a bulls type of player...
> 
> i'm seriously SOLD on him with our pick....i think it's a must that we get this kid...especially with tiago's status being up in the air of him even COMING to the nba...heard we'd have to buy him out


From what I read, I think it could work. A couple of people comment on his lack of footspeed away from the basket, but I think Tyson would normally cover the quicker big guy and Williams the stronger one.


----------



## ChicagoBullsFan52

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I've seen some mock drafts having the Bulls picking Adam Morrison with their first rounder from the Knicks but why would they do that? Is Deng suddenly not good enough anymore? Because I definately think that the Bulls need a big man with offensive game along with Tyson.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ChicagoBullsFan52 said:


> I've seen some mock drafts having the Bulls picking Adam Morrison with their first rounder from the Knicks but why would they do that? Is Deng suddenly not good enough anymore? Because I definately think that the Bulls need a big man with offensive game along with Tyson.


Since Andrea Bargnani is the so-called next Dirk Nowitski...wonder why there's hasn't been much talk of him..

he's a projected top 5 pick..

i just don't see pax wasting that pick on a project


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Since Andrea Bargnani is the so-called next Dirk Nowitski...wonder why there's hasn't been much talk of him..
> 
> he's a projected top 5 pick..
> 
> i just don't see pax wasting that pick on a project



Hmmm, let's see. Maybe because March Madness is rapidly approaching, the media in the US knows very little about him and you're notion of "Wasting" a pick doesn't inspire editors to have research done on him.


Don't worry, you'll read plenty about him as the season comes to an end.


As for Wasting.......every pick in the draft has a chance of being a wasted pick. Eddy Curry, Jamal Crawford, Elton Brand, Dalibor Bagaric, Marcus Fizer and Jay Williams, etc....have all been wasted picks for the Bulls as none of them are still around, the players we received for them have been less than spectacular and in some cases we have absolutely zero to show for them.


SOOOOOOOOoo, before you label any pick a "Success" or "Waste", why not give it a few years.

However, if your Crystal Ball is working, I'd love to have the winning numbers of Mega Millions drawing in California this week.

I promise to fund the website for 3 years for free!

Oh wait, that might be a "Waste" also.


Go Bulls. Go Paxson's scouting guys seeing everyone numerous times!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> Hmmm, let's see. Maybe because March Madness is rapidly approaching, the media in the US knows very little about him and you're notion of "Wasting" a pick doesn't inspire editors to have research done on him.
> 
> 
> Don't worry, you'll read plenty about him as the season comes to an end.
> 
> 
> As for Wasting.......every pick in the draft has a chance of being a wasted pick. Eddy Curry, Jamal Crawford, Elton Brand, Dalibor Bagaric, Marcus Fizer and Jay Williams, etc....have all been wasted picks for the Bulls as none of them are still around, the players we received for them have been less than spectacular and in some cases we have absolutely zero to show for them.
> 
> 
> SOOOOOOOOoo, before you label any pick a "Success" or "Waste", why not give it a few years.
> 
> However, if your Crystal Ball is working, I'd love to have the winning numbers of Mega Millions drawing in California this week.
> 
> I promise to fund the website for 3 years for free!
> 
> Oh wait, that might be a "Waste" also.
> 
> 
> Go Bulls. Go Paxson's scouting guys seeing everyone numerous times!



i don't know jack SHYT about the guy..i'm not saying the kid will be a BUST or a success but we're not exactly at the BEGINNING stages of rebuilding to TAKE THAT CHANCE...

pull your skirt up man...


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> i don't know jack SHYT about the guy..i'm not saying the kid will be a BUST or a success but we're not exactly at the BEGINNING stages of rebuilding to TAKE THAT CHANCE...
> 
> pull your skirt up man...



Dude or Dudette,

You're the one crying about wasted picks. I was pointing out nothing is a sure bet.

Nice talking with ya..............and thanks for admitting you don't know JACK! :cheers:


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> i'm not saying the kid will be a BUST or a success but we're not exactly at the BEGINNING stages of rebuilding to TAKE THAT CHANCE...


I have to agree with Chifanica on this one, the reasoning for not taking him just doesn't compute.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> Dude or Dudette,
> 
> You're the one crying about wasted picks. I was pointing out nothing is a sure bet.
> 
> Nice talking with ya..............and thanks for admitting you don't know JACK! :cheers:


do u have a problem man? 

how exactly am I CRYING about wasting picks? I don't know SHYT about the kid. You didn't point out SHYT about a sure bet. If anything, I know I'm more than rigiht about Paxson not wasting a potential top 3 pick on a kid that doesn't even average 7 points a game. He's a PROJECT, period. I didn't say he couldn't ball, I said I don't seem him taking time on ANOTHER PROJECT.

you're seriously showing your panties right now on this forum. you're pms'ing about NOTHING.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Anybody else besides me afraid that the Knicks trades might turn out top 3 pick into something around 5-13??
> 
> It looks like they're definintely going to pull off the Francis deal and after that, either the Kenyon (Larry wants him) deal or the Ratliff/Miles deal.
> 
> I'm not saying they'll GREATLY improve but hell, they COULD go on a run.
> 
> I want Rudy Gay


13? : :reporter: 

New York has 29 remaining games(18 of which are .500+, 15 are road, 6 are back to backs). Seattle improved more with Watson than NY did with Francis. Toronto looks like an improved team w/o Jalen. I personally don't see them being able to do any better than fifth worst team in the league. It's all money in the bank to me, I never would've expected NY to struggle this badly and I didn't think much of them to begin with. These are the games ahead or in back of NY as of 2/24. 

8. Boston 5.5 
7. Seattle 5
6. Toronto 4.5
5. Orlando 4
4. Portland 3
3. Atlanta 1.5
2. *New York ---*
1. Charlotte -1.5


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> do u have a problem man?
> 
> how exactly am I CRYING about wasting picks? I don't know SHYT about the kid. You didn't point out SHYT about a sure bet. If anything, I know I'm more than rigiht about Paxson not wasting a potential top 3 pick on a kid that doesn't even average 7 points a game. He's a PROJECT, period. I didn't say he couldn't ball, I said I don't seem him taking time on ANOTHER PROJECT.
> 
> you're seriously showing your panties right now on this forum. you're pms'ing about NOTHING.



Whatever.

In an irony, it appears we would both pick the same guy anyway - Rudy Gay with a top 3 pick.

My disagreement or miscommunication with you was that, IMHO, every guy in this draft is a project. Unfortuantely, without rehashing this entire thread, each guy in this draft has serious questions about his game.


As for the Knicks getting ebtter, I do think it's possible for them to win a game or two they would've lost, but I don't see a huge improvement and only more of a media circus and distraction extravaganza. The Knicks have done the Bulls a HUGE favor by sucking so bad. 

If only they can suck this much again next year. I am banking on the Bulls being in the playoffs, so if we want a chance at one of the Plentiful Bigs from next years draft, we need NY in the lottery again.

With the schedule remaining, NY is probably no worse than the 6th pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> Whatever.
> 
> In an irony, it appears we would both pick the same guy anyway - Rudy Gay with a top 3 pick.
> 
> My disagreement or miscommunication with you was that, IMHO, every guy in this draft is a project. Unfortuantely, without rehashing this entire thread, each guy in this draft has serious questions about his game.
> 
> 
> As for the Knicks getting ebtter, I do think it's possible for them to win a game or two they would've lost, but I don't see a huge improvement and only more of a media circus and distraction extravaganza. The Knicks have done the Bulls a HUGE favor by sucking so bad.
> 
> If only they can suck this much again next year. I am banking on the Bulls being in the playoffs, so if we want a chance at one of the Plentiful Bigs from next years draft, we need NY in the lottery again.
> 
> With the schedule remaining, NY is probably no worse than the 6th pick.



agreed.........

RUUUUUUUUUDY


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I also agree. He still may be the concensuous #1.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

In other news, I love Mike Gansey. For some reason I see him transitioning into a Hinrich-like NBA player.

If his stock rises in the draft, I wouldn't be surprised, even to the point where we might consider him with our pick. Gritty defender, great range on his shot, just love him in his system. I sort of love West Virginia this year, in general. Pittsnogle is a Wang Zhizhi type of guy that could do more than that and really blossom into a solid big up front; if we had a 2nd rounder, I'd be really interested in him.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> In other news, I love Mike Gansey. For some reason I see him transitioning into a Hinrich-like NBA player.
> 
> If his stock rises in the draft, I wouldn't be surprised, even to the point where we might consider him with our pick. Gritty defender, great range on his shot, just love him in his system. I sort of love West Virginia this year, in general. Pittsnogle is a Wang Zhizhi type of guy that could do more than that and really blossom into a solid big up front; if we had a 2nd rounder, I'd be really interested in him.


Totally agree with you on Gansey. He's really fun to watch play. Reminds me of a shorter Matt Harpring.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm officially OFF the J.J. Redick bandwagon.

And ON the Mardy Collins...What was I thinking?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> I'm officially OFF the J.J. Redick bandwagon.
> 
> And ON the Mardy Collins...What was I thinking?


one bad game and you're off the wagon?

i noticed after the game before dukes last..if his shot is off, he can't do ANYYYYYYYYYYTHING else...he only had 22 points the game before last cuz he hit like 13 freethrows...they took him completely out of the offense until the end of the game, and he hit a couple of buckets and got his confidence back...

the jury is still debating on him...


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Is it bad, that I likely want the Bulls to miss the playoffs. This way we can end up with a potential of two top 5/6 picks? I know playoff experience helps, but it's not like we are going anywhere the next two years. We'd get swept easily. I feel playoff experience helps when you are a team in CLE's shoes. You make it, teach LBJ and crew what it takes to win, and next year you advance to the 2nd round/ECF.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



theanimal23 said:


> Is it bad, that I likely want the Bulls to miss the playoffs. This way we can end up with a potential of two top 5/6 picks? I know playoff experience helps, but it's not like we are going anywhere the next two years. We'd get swept easily. I feel playoff experience helps when you are a team in CLE's shoes. You make it, teach LBJ and crew what it takes to win, and next year you advance to the 2nd round/ECF.


I'm not even mad that we're losing cuz I want the same thing as you LOL. Don't get me wrong, i feel BAD that we're losing but I just think somtimes u need to take a step back to take TWO steps forward.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Yeah same here man. I really think this season is a wash, and next year we should make a run to get playoff experience. Then, good things are to happen.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> one bad game and you're off the wagon?
> 
> i noticed after the game before dukes last..if his shot is off, he can't do ANYYYYYYYYYYTHING else...he only had 22 points the game before last cuz he hit like 13 freethrows...they took him completely out of the offense until the end of the game, and he hit a couple of buckets and got his confidence back...
> 
> the jury is still debating on him...



It's the way he was held to a bad game.

Temple was really physical...I can see defenses doing the same thing to him in the NBA...Unless he goes to a team in the playoff picture...Then he'll be a nice contributor.

But he's not looking like lottery material.








Ronnie Brewer........Great handles and court vision, a 6'7 guard we can pair with Ben...This draft is looking better and better every week.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> Ronnie Brewer........Great handles and court vision, a 6'7 guard we can pair with Ben...This draft is looking better and better every week.


Indeed, it doesn't look too shabby even without a sure pick.
As for Brewer, you have uncanny timing, I was about to mention him for our pick, as I'm starting to believe we'll need to consolidate some of our talent, exploring possibilities for Deng, Hinrich and Gordon respectively.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Ronnie will be a good roleplayer in the nba...i'll give him that

nothing more than marquis daniels with court vision..he's 6"7, plays great d and is unselfish..but he's not gonna take us to the next level


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Ronnie will be a good roleplayer in the nba...i'll give him that
> 
> nothing more than marquis daniels with court vision..he's 6"7, plays great d and is unselfish..but he's not gonna take us to the next level



Marquis Daniels?...Sheesh...U can't tell me you wouldn't want him on your squad...

You're nameing all the attributes that a player that plays the right way has...AND this kid fills a need.

the next level IMO is guaranteed playoff births....NOT, fighting for playoff births...I think he can get us to the next level...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> Marquis Daniels?...Sheesh...U can't tell me you wouldn't want him on your squad...
> 
> You're nameing all the attributes that a player that plays the right way has...AND this kid fills a need.
> 
> the next level IMO is guaranteed playoff births....NOT, fighting for playoff births...I think he can get us to the next level...


we shall see...............


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> I'm officially OFF the J.J. Redick bandwagon.
> 
> And ON the Mardy Collins...What was I thinking?


Bad call. Collins game is translates great in college. But his lack of quickness, and speed will limit him at the next level. Oh wait was that my defense of JJ? Damn it.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Ager has a big game, with 30 points and counting, but MSU looks like they're going to lose to Indiana. Did anyone see this game?

Next on CBS: Connecticut vs. Villanova. Gay, Boone, Armstrong, Williams, Foye, and Ray -- all in one game. I'm going to have to watch while I try to write my paper.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

This is some funny ****. 6' 4" Randy Foye guarding 6' 11" Hilton Armstrong??? How did Nova beat UConn last time starting four guards?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Gay has been doing a good job on Foye since I've been watching.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Wow, Hilton Armstrong has seven blocks! I may have to reevaluate my opinion of him. Although if he and Chandler were our front court, we would never score.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Joachim Noah is talented but he has to have the skinniest shoulders I've seen on a big man.


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

According to insider

--the Bulls and Hawks would lean toward Aldridge--


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



GB said:


> According to insider
> 
> --the Bulls and Hawks would lean toward Aldridge--


Insider ESPN or other insider? If its ESPN's Insider, this is coming via whom? Im asking since they are a paid version of Hoopshype, for example.

Any quotes or is it ESPN just following a rational thinking?


----------



## dkg1

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm not sure if anyone has brought his name up (I don't have the time to look through 30+ pages in this thread), but has anyone seen much of Brandon Roy of Washington? http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=11305 He seems like he has the size at 6-6 to help at the 2. He is shooting over 50% from the field and 40% from the 3 point line. Mike Decourcy of Sporting News speaks highly of Roy's ability to defend all the perimeter positions in his article today. http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=66714 I haven't seen him play but he sounds like an intriguing prospect.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Roy looks very good. He's not an elite athlete but he's pretty quick and pretty strong and can get to the rim off the dribble.

He reminds me of a tougher Jalen Rose with better defense.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

The draft is not as devoid of big men as I originally thought. If Aldridge is not available at the Knicks pick, I'm very big on trading that pick to a team that might really need that stud wing that will be available (if not Gay or Morrison, then Carney or Brewer). I'm really impressed with Pittsnogle, who has been trying to show off his post game and doing so successfully. Paul Davis, Tiago Splitter, Aaron Gray, Armstrong and Boone all look to be available in the mid-1st round.

We always gab about trading down the pick, because it fits our fantasy drafting very nicely. But this time around, there really are several teams with multiple picks that we could trade down to, or even a pick + player. If we traded the #4 pick overall (with Gay, Morrison and Aldridge gone), to say Phoenix, who owns a very complicated Joe Johnson trade pick (probably a mid-1st rounder) and their own pick, the Suns could add a guy like Carney, Brewer or Redick to give them immediate help. Redick, especially, would be such a perfect fit for the Suns...

New Orleans owns Milwaukee's 1st rounder unconditionally. They might be interested in finding a JR Smith replacement. Both Milwaukee's pick and New Orleans' pick would be great for us as well.

With our own pick, we take the best available talent. With Milwaukee's and New Orleans' picks, we take big men. I feel like depth in that area would be more beneficial than trying to squeeze a logjam of talent, causing a disruption in the team flow and impeding the growth of both players (see JC vs. Jay Will), when we could get plenty of value in TWO players out of it.

I like Mike Gansey or Brandon Roy with our own pick, then Pittsnogle and Armstrong or Splitter with the lower picks. 

Hinrich/Duhon
Gordon/Gansey or Roy
Deng/Noch
Al Harrington/Songaila/Pittsnogle
Chandler/Armstrong or Splitter/Pittsnogle

Looks solid and deep to me. I absolutely love the idea of Gansey coming off the bench for us. And Armstrong and Pittsnogle are both very good at specific things. Harrington and Chandler make a great starting duo, and we have the big man depth that is always needed to advance deeper into the playoffs.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

from chad ford's draft chat today on espn:


_Andrew, Chi-Town: Yo Ford aka Ford F-350, I was just wondering who you think the Bulls will be targeting in this upcoming draft. Will they trade one or both of them? _

*Chad Ford: They need a low post scorer and a bigger two guard to pair in the backcourt with Kirk Hinrich. LaMarcus Aldridge is at the top of their list. Tyrus Thomas is awfully young, but has tremendous upside. Ronnie Brewer's another possibility. He's not a great shooter, but he brings size, defensive intensity and great ball handling to the backcourt. *



espn now has a mock draft/lottery generator feature like the new trade machine.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/lottery2006/mockdraft


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I don't think Lamarcus can handle the NBA center position with his frame. I want Gay & Shelden Williams but if we wind up with Aldridge & Williams, i'll be happy also. I guess if you consider the fact that he may be just as GOOD as Chris Bosh, u can't really pass that up.

If you take a look at the 14 lotto positions, only about 6 of them have the potential to be bulls :

Andrea Bargnani
Adam Morrison
LaMarcus Aldridge
Ronnie Brewer
Shelden Williams
Rudy Gay
Brandon Roy

I left off a few, and here's the reasoning :

Rodney Carney - Impressive athelete, but he's a SF in the nba, if we're lookin' for a SF in this draft, it WILL be Rudy Gay
Randy Foye - he's a 6"3 SG, he can shoot the lights out but we need SIZE in the backcourt, not more of the same

J.J. Reddick - SEE ABOVE
Tiago Splitter - They say his buyout could keep him overseas another year or two, I don't see Paxson taking that risk

Tyrus Thomas - his circle says he's not entering yet, he's not ready
Rajon Rondo - WHO? he's a pg, NEXT
Al Horford - WHO?? NEXT

HONESTLY, I'd take Charlie Villanueva over any bigman in this draft. He'll be a 18 & 9 player as soon as he starts. Trade our NY pick to Toronto, and they'll potentially have two top 5 picks. It's a win-win for everyone.


----------



## Bolts

*How about this draft?*











EDIT: Bolts, i resized the pic, cause WHOA, it was too big!

also - i am going to merge this into the sticky draft thread at the top! thanks - miz


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

man, if we got Aldridge & Bargnani...

:eek8:

I think Pax would trade em though...


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I like looking @ worst case scenerios.


NY's pick 5th. pick

Our pick 11th. pick

That's what I plan on working with.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Anyone check out Bargnani's profile on the draft simulator. He looks less than unimpressive in stature.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> Anyone check out Bargnani's profile on the draft simulator. He looks less than unimpressive in stature.


It's a PICTURE man..

what the hell


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> It's a PICTURE man..
> 
> what the hell


uhhh, isn't tv just very frequent pictures? I don't see what your getting at. Are you saying it's just one picture and maybe he looks different in other picture, or a picture isn't worth a thousand words. Because in that picture he really looks weak as hell..


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> uhhh, isn't tv just very frequent pictures? I don't see what your getting at. Are you saying it's just one picture and maybe he looks different in other picture, or a picture isn't worth a thousand words. Because in that picture he really looks weak as hell..


how the hell can you look WEAK in a STILL photo man???


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> how the hell can you look WEAK in a STILL photo man???


dude are you serious? Look at the guy he has no muscle tone, and I mean none. You can't tell where his shoulder ends or his bicep starts and his forearm looks frail to be specific. Sure in a still photo he could just be strong and out of shape but thats not the case here(like it is with Aaron Gray), there is no mass period. Take a look at Sheldon Williams and that will show you a still photo can also show strength.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/lottery2006/mockdraft

and to further strengthen my point look at what Bargnani is listed at.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> Take a look at Sheldon Williams and that will show you a still photo can also show strength.


That's like comparing apples to oranges, people have different physiques, ie Tyson is only 235, which by looking at Bargnani (225) seems to have the same body type, tall and lanky. If he can get up to the range of Tyson and Dirk (245), he'll be fine.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I have to say, Pau Gasol didn't look like much coming into the league either. If Bargnani can come up with Pau-like game, I'd be ecstatic.

In any event, I have a feeling that our pick is going to be around 4 or 5, which is where there's sort of a big drop off in talent. Could we turn that 5 pick and say, Nocioni, into New Orleans' pick and David West? 

With our pick we take Shelden, and with the Hornets' pick we take either Pittsnogle or Paul Davis. Those guys would be adequate as backup C's, and Shelden and David West would make a serious PF combo.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

After NBADRAFT.net put JOSH mcROBERTS in the LOTTO (top 5) and actually had the NERVE to compare him to Chris WEbber

I could NEVER take that site seriously again


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> With our pick we take Shelden, and with the Hornets' pick we take either Pittsnogle or Paul Davis. Those guys would be adequate as backup C's, and Shelden and David West would make a serious PF combo.


Shelden Williams has a GOOD NBA body and he's a hustle player but he's no more than a bench player. He has NOOOO offensive game at all besides putbacks and dunks. I know I was talking a big game about him, but I don't think he'll do much in the nba besides provide some toughness & rebounds.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Anybody watching Aldridge on ESPN2?

Kid has to be the most unimpressive college ELITE bigman I've ever seen. Is he even a BIGman!? At times it looks like he SHY's away from actually getting the ball.

Are we SERIOUSLY considering taking him with this lotto pick!?

Two words : Rudy Gay

He's our best bet in this draft, I'm telling ya'll.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I've NEVER seen Andrea Bargnani play but he HAS to be better than Aldridge. I want no parts of that kid.

This here is who we need :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5kVpF7mAMo&search=rudy gay


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm sorry, I just can't see Paxson sittin at home watching texas saying "I HAVE to have aldridge on my team"...

this kid NOT that good...he looks NERVOUS 95% of the time he's on the floor


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Hehe ROY, dont hate :biggrin: 

IMO so far, it has to be (for the Bulls):

1 Aldridge
1a Bargnani

Come draft day, it might be Bargnani all the way...


----------



## mgolding

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Im in Australia so I admit I have very little chance to see college games which annoys me to no end. I was looking over at hoopshypes Mock draft to see a player I havent seen mentioned on this board, Brandon Rush. They have him going at 11.

http://www.hoopshype.com/draft.htm

Whats his deal?
Yay or nay?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: How about this draft?*



Bolts said:


> EDIT: Bolts, i resized the pic, cause WHOA, it was too big!
> 
> also - i am going to merge this into the sticky draft thread at the top! thanks - miz


So it is possible. This answers the question of another thread. If that were to happen, I'd go Gay, Aldridge.


----------



## step

*Re: How about this draft?*



> Im in Australia so I admit I have very little chance to see college games which annoys me to no end.


ESPN so far has been showing more college than NBA, but mostly in the arvo.


----------



## mgolding

*Re: How about this draft?*



step said:


> ESPN so far has been showing more college than NBA, but mostly in the arvo.


Cheers for that


----------



## Greg Ostertag!

*Re: How about this draft?*

Would the Bulls swoop upon Josh McRoberts if he entered, which is now rumoured? (Sorry if this has been discussed earlier in the thread, I didn't bother reading back)


----------



## The ROY

*Re: How about this draft?*



Greg Ostertag! said:


> Would the Bulls swoop upon Josh McRoberts if he entered, which is now rumoured? (Sorry if this has been discussed earlier in the thread, I didn't bother reading back)


Josh McRoberts is GARBAGE so far...why would u even entertain the thought?

AL Thornton of FSU is a better prospect that Roberts and Aldridge...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



El Chapu said:


> Hehe ROY, dont hate :biggrin:
> 
> IMO so far, it has to be (for the Bulls):
> 
> 1 Aldridge
> 1a Bargnani
> 
> Come draft day, it might be Bargnani all the way...


don't hate? ON WHAT? Aldridge isn't GOOD enuff to be hated on. he shouldn't even be a lotto pick


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

LOL @ Aldridge not being good enough to be a lotto pick.

I don't know how to argue with someone that can say that with a straight face.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> LOL @ Aldridge not being good enough to be a lotto pick.
> 
> I don't know how to argue with someone that can say that with a straight face.


I don't know how to argue with someone believing this kid ISSSS a lotto pick..he is NOT...he's only a lotto pick cuz this draft is WEAK AS HELL

I don't even believe ya'll watch texas play...

I've been watching the nba since the late 80's and I've NEVER seen a kid projected to be a lotto pick as GARBAGE as him...


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I don't know how to argue with someone believing this kid ISSSS a lotto pick..he is NOT...he's only a lotto pick cuz this draft is WEAK AS HELL
> 
> I don't even believe ya'll watch texas play...
> 
> I've been watching the nba since the late 80's and I've NEVER seen a kid projected to be a lotto pick as GARBAGE as him...


Size alone gives him lotto consideration.

the fact he runs the floor and has polished offensive skills inside AND outside adds to that lotto consideration.

i haven't even mentioned the fact that he rebounds and blocks shots...

all this for a top program

are u seriously questioning why people consider him a lotto pick?

and man...

the cherry on top..

HE DID A FREAKIN' SKY HOOK!

i'm sold.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I don't know how to argue with someone believing this kid ISSSS a lotto pick..he is NOT...he's only a lotto pick cuz this draft is WEAK AS HELL
> 
> I don't even believe ya'll watch texas play...
> 
> I've been watching the nba since the late 80's and I've NEVER seen a kid projected to be a lotto pick as GARBAGE as him...


I've watched Texas play at least three different times. He looks like a poor man's Rasheed or a Shareef. Shareef, skill-wise, is a lot of what you can ask for in a big man; he's just got that terrible stigma of not being a winner.

That being said, we could use a poor man's Rasheed or a Shareef badly to plug that PF spot. The question is, would you rather have Aldridge or would you rather have Al Harrington? Because if we're going to target Al, then Aldridge makes less of an impact. I'd much rather trade the pick down and pick up two solid backup bigs in the draft, and use our pick to grab a solid, taller wing.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> The question is, would you rather have Aldridge or would you rather have Al Harrington? Because if we're going to target Al, then Aldridge makes less of an impact. I'd much rather trade the pick down and pick up two solid backup bigs in the draft, and use our pick to grab a solid, taller wing.


I'd rather do EITHER of those ideas than draft him for our team.

I'd rather throw as much as it would take to nab Nene than to draft this kid.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> Size alone gives him lotto consideration.
> 
> the fact he runs the floor and has polished offensive skills inside AND outside adds to that lotto consideration.
> 
> i haven't even mentioned the fact that he rebounds and blocks shots...
> 
> all this for a top program
> 
> are u seriously questioning why people consider him a lotto pick?
> 
> and man...
> 
> the cherry on top..
> 
> HE DID A FREAKIN' SKY HOOK!
> 
> i'm sold.


yeah, i saw him do a sky hook...really wasn't that impressive either

i don't think you've see him play...sounds like word of mouth...

that kid isn't worth a top 3 pick...

i saw him play again last night and he did NONE Of the stuff u mentioned besides one sky hook..he wasn't even a FACTOR in the game..matter of fact, if he was NEVER deemed a high lotto pick in the draft, I woulda never even paid attention to him being on the floor.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> I've watched Texas play at least three different times. He looks like a poor man's Rasheed or a Shareef. Shareef, skill-wise, is a lot of what you can ask for in a big man; he's just got that terrible stigma of not being a winner.
> 
> That being said, we could use a poor man's Rasheed or a Shareef badly to plug that PF spot. The question is, would you rather have Aldridge or would you rather have Al Harrington? Because if we're going to target Al, then Aldridge makes less of an impact. I'd much rather trade the pick down and pick up two solid backup bigs in the draft, and use our pick to grab a solid, taller wing.


I think hes got a better low post game than those two. I really think the whole issue with him is how he'll be able to put on weight. He's no a freaky enough athlete to be effect as skinny as he is. It all about his ability to hold low post positon with him; he certainly has the moves, touch, length, coordination and hands to be effective if he can establish low post position.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> yeah, i saw him do a sky hook...really wasn't that impressive either
> 
> i don't think you've see him play...sounds like word of mouth...
> 
> that kid isn't worth a top 3 pick...



LOL..

I don't operate under word of mouth.

The kid has range.

He isn't the focal point in the offense, because Texas plays like a guard orientated team.

But he is definatly skilled...Are you denying that?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> LOL..
> 
> I don't operate under word of mouth.
> 
> The kid has range.
> 
> He isn't the focal point in the offense, because Texas plays like a guard orientated team.
> 
> But he is definatly skilled...Are you denying that?


he's 6-11 playing college ball..he should have SOME sort of skill

have i seen any of his skills? not in the 6 or 7 games i've seen so far.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> he's 6-11 playing college ball..he should have SOME sort of skill
> 
> have i seen any of his skills? not in the 6 or 7 games i've seen so far.



In your opinion

Who's a better prospect @ 6-11?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> In your opinion
> 
> Who's a better prospect @ 6-11?


there aren't any more in this draft...that's the PROBLEM...

I don't know ANYTHING about andrea bargnani so i won't say anything about him.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Here is Chad Ford neutral opinion (Aldridge, Bargnani, etc):

Bargnani is suffering a bit from the Euro backlash. A few years ago he'd have been in the mix for the No. 1 pick. At this point he's a more proven European player than Darko was ... his production reminds me a lot of what Pau Gasol was doing in the Euroleague before he came over. If Darko continues to play well in Orlando it will really help Bargnani's stock. I like him a lot but would like to see more of him. I've seen him in person several times and on tape another 10 games or so ... *I think if the Bulls don't get their hands on LaMarcus Aldridge, Bargnani might be a good fit in Chicago*. 

*I think Aldridge would be a great fit in Chicago*. The problem comes from having too many inexperienced young kids on the floor together. The Bulls need a mix of young players and veterans who have lots of playoff experience to take the next step. Adding more young players does help the talent base ... but I'm not sure how many more wins it actually gets you.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I've NEVER ever even seen andrea play, but right now...I'd TAKE him over aldridge without even seeing his game..


----------



## Jesus Shuttlesworth

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Does anybody here have an opinion about LSU's Glen Davis ? He's definitely big at 6'9' and 310, and he's putting up good numbers, 18.5 PPG, 10.0 RPG and 1.5 APG. 

He's a sophomore and won't probably declare this year, but if he somehow decided to leave school early, what do you think about him?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Jesus Shuttlesworth said:


> Does anybody here have an opinion about LSU's Glen Davis ? He's definitely big at 6'9' and 310, and he's putting up good numbers, 18.5 PPG, 10.0 RPG and 1.5 APG.
> 
> He's a sophomore and won't probably declare this year, but if he somehow decided to leave school early, what do you think about him?


I didn't watch him closely last night but that kid Al Thornton is NICE...he put 27 on shelden EASILY


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I've NEVER ever even seen andrea play, but right now...I'd TAKE him over aldridge without even seeing his game..


Here is where you show some hate towards Aldridge, but dont take me wrong ROY. I respect your opinion.

Bargnani is surprising a lot of people, but I dont know if Pax is willing to wait for him.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

here's a piece on foxsports site by jwalters :

LaMarcus :

Where Aldridge was once looked at as a potential Chris Bosh clone, he now looks more like a Dwight Howard type of big man that can play either post position. Aldridge will need to continue improve his feel for the game, or he could end up much like a Tony Battie. Still, there is more than enough upside and recent development in LaMarcus’ Aldridge’s game for him to hear his name called first this June.

IMO, he's more Tony Battie than EITHER of those two names mentioned. Actually tony battie is PERFECT.

ANDREA :

This one is simply, actually. Andrea Bargnani is actually producing over in Europe. While a guy like Tskitishvilli barely even played for his team, Bargnani has developed into one of the more explosive players in Europe. He plays a bit less in the Euroleague, but still recently put in three consecutive impressive games of 16, 15, and 20 points. His play in the Italian league has been shockingly efficient. After a 19-point performance last weekend, Bargnani is averaging 12.1 ppg in under 20 mpg, while shooting a stunning 69% from the floor. The only reason Bargnani hasn’t emerged as a true European superstar is his coach’s strange reluctance to give him full-time minutes. This is the kind of production we need to see before crowning the next European super prospect.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> ANDREA :
> 
> This one is simply, actually. Andrea Bargnani is actually producing over in Europe. While a guy like Tskitishvilli barely even played for his team, Bargnani has developed into one of the more explosive players in Europe. He plays a bit less in the Euroleague, but still recently put in three consecutive impressive games of 16, 15, and 20 points. His play in the Italian league has been shockingly efficient. After a 19-point performance last weekend, Bargnani is averaging 12.1 ppg in under 20 mpg, while shooting a stunning 69% from the floor. The only reason Bargnani hasn’t emerged as a true European superstar is his coach’s strange reluctance to give him full-time minutes. This is the kind of production we need to see before crowning the next European super prospect.


His last performance in Euroleague wont be overlooked by any GM in the lottery. This guy is having some great games in the toughest competition outside the NBA, and that includes the NCAA.
So we have some good value for the pick, if we have Gay, Morrison, Aldridge and Bargnani on the board. If the Knicks end up being the worst team, we have a shot at one of those players (If it is Gay or Morrison, trade).


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

here's a video on andrea :

http://rapidshare.de/files/11369647/clip.rm.html

why u would show a clips on him at the foul line and getting fouled is BEYOND me LOL

he can shoot..he's got a good strong body...not as skinny as i thought..moves more like pau gasol than dirk..but has the range of dirk..he's definintely a project..


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Sounds like a good find. I wonder if he's really all that. If he is, then I'd extend my happy range into the top 4 picks, not just the top 3. But at #5 or #6, I'd trade the Knicks pick to any takers. At #7 or 8, I'd just keep it and go with Shelden and take Splitter or Gansey with our own pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Sounds like a good find. I wonder if he's really all that. If he is, then I'd extend my happy range into the top 4 picks, not just the top 3. But at #5 or #6, I'd trade the Knicks pick to any takers. At #7 or 8, I'd just keep it and go with Shelden and take Splitter or Gansey with our own pick.



who's gansey?

there's little belief that splitter's coming to the nba this year


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Sounds like a good find. I wonder if he's really all that. If he is, then I'd extend my happy range into the top 4 picks, not just the top 3. But at #5 or #6, I'd trade the Knicks pick to any takers. At #7 or 8, I'd just keep it and go with Shelden and take Splitter or Gansey with our own pick.


Hm...Gansey THAT high?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

don't know if anybody noticed but the knicks currently have the WORST record in the NBA.

this was DESTINED to happen for the bulls to go to the next level, i truely believe that lol.


----------



## Like A Breath

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I didn't watch him closely last night but that kid Al Thornton is NICE...he put 27 on shelden EASILY


Everyone lights up Shelden Williams. He's a crap man-to-man defender, he can't guard spin moves or drop steps AT ALL. He's like a statue when isolated.

Mike Gansey is not a top-ten pick, he's a fringe first rounder. He's an unathletic 6-4 swingman with no point guard skills. He's a tough player, but the Bulls have enough undertalented character guys as it is. I'm also not sold on his NBA range.

I'm very disappointed in Aldridge's inability to put his mark in the A&M game. However, if he gets a weight program like Dwight Howard he still has monster potential, it'd be foolish to write him off.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Like A Breath said:


> I'm very disappointed in Aldridge's inability to put his mark in the A&M game. However, if he gets a weight program like Dwight Howard he still has monster potential, it'd be foolish to write him off.


I'm not getting these dwight howard comparisons at ALL.

he's closer to tony battie than dwight...


----------



## WestHighHawk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



mgolding said:


> Im in Australia so I admit I have very little chance to see college games which annoys me to no end. I was looking over at hoopshypes Mock draft to see a player I havent seen mentioned on this board, Brandon Rush. They have him going at 11.
> 
> http://www.hoopshype.com/draft.htm
> 
> Whats his deal?
> Yay or nay?


I'd say nay for this year. 

Brandon isn't quite ready for the big league just yet. He tends to disappear in games. When KU landed him all we heard was how selfish Brandon is. He is so far from that it's unbelievable, a good team player.

Give him one more year and he's going to be ready for the NBA...the kid has a ton of talent! :clap:


----------



## Rodman

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

before I ask my question I really want to say that I enjoy reading this thread everyday, thanks for a lot of great posts guys!

so here's my question: I kinda like Rodney Carney from all I read from him (can't really watch much collegeball) is it possible that he's sort of like Wade? or is that way off?


----------



## narek

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Found this: http://nuno.typepad.com/nbafanblog/2006/03/andrea_bargnani.html for anyone who has never seen him.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



narek said:


> Found this: http://nuno.typepad.com/nbafanblog/2006/03/andrea_bargnani.html for anyone who has never seen him.



Thanx a TON

That looked REALLY promising..

Does he have a contract issue?


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Nice clips of Bargnani. He looks to have a pure shooting stoke, great looking form and very smooth on his drives.

The thing that clips won't show is how he rebounds, passes, or defends. Those are very important qualities for the Bulls.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Rodman said:


> before I ask my question I really want to say that I enjoy reading this thread everyday, thanks for a lot of great posts guys!
> 
> so here's my question: I kinda like Rodney Carney from all I read from him (can't really watch much collegeball) is it possible that he's sort of like Wade? or is that way off?


He doesn't have Wade's passing or handling skills, which makes Wade what he is, so I would call the comparision way off. He does have Wade's unbelievable explosiveness. Wade is more of a 1-2, where as Carney is more of a 2-3. I think the R. Jefferson comparision is about as good as it gets. Offensivily he can shoot from anywhere court with good effectiveness, not great. He of course can finish with the best of them (maybe not Gay though). But defense is where he is going to have to shine to be a allstar caliber player, his combination speed and length is really special. Jefferson is a little stronger, Carney is a little better of an athlete, and looks to me to have a longer reach. Rodney has a big time wing span, and his hands are humungous. I'm really impressed with him, but doubt we will really consider taking him top 4. And I doubt he will fall to our pick either which right now I'm thinking will be 9 at lowest, but he is a senior so who knows maybe he'll get the shaft.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



narek said:


> Found this: http://nuno.typepad.com/nbafanblog/2006/03/andrea_bargnani.html for anyone who has never seen him.


His movement and size is very similiar to Gasol. That wasn't much but I was impressed by his combination of size and mobility.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Bargnani >> Aldridge

EAAAAASILY


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Bargnani >> Aldridge
> 
> EAAAAASILY



I was really impressed with the dribble move.

He was playin' like a 3 though.

I really wish I could see more.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> I was really impressed with the dribble move.
> 
> He was playin' like a 3 though.
> 
> I really wish I could see more.


we will when we DRAFT him

paxson was over there scouting him a few months ago I remember. I think he'll make the right decision in June.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> Nice clips of Bargnani. He looks to have a pure shooting stoke, great looking form and very smooth on his drives.
> 
> The thing that clips won't show is how he rebounds, passes, or defends. Those are very important qualities for the Bulls.


He isnt Toni Kukoc while dishing the ball, but he is a good defender and rebounder. Obviously its not the same when you are defending some guy in Italy (one of the best leagues in Europe) than in the NBA, but he is tough and plays with intensity.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



narek said:


> Found this: http://nuno.typepad.com/nbafanblog/2006/03/andrea_bargnani.html for anyone who has never seen him.


By that clip, he seems to have a bit of that Nocioni-like toughness in him. I'll take it for what it is though--a clip.

I'm definately not against drafting him, I just don't have a solid opinion on the kid as I've only seen him play in a few minutes of action in one game.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> His movement and size is very similiar to Gasol. That wasn't much but I was impressed by his combination of size and mobility.


Similar builds, but I think Pau looked a bit stronger coming into the league. Not that strength isn't an area that could be worked on.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> He doesn't have Wade's passing or handling skills, which makes Wade what he is, so I would call the comparision way off. He does have Wade's unbelievable explosiveness. Wade is more of a 1-2, where as Carney is more of a 2-3. I think the R. Jefferson comparision is about as good as it gets. Offensivily he can shoot from anywhere court with good effectiveness, not great. He of course can finish with the best of them (maybe not Gay though). But defense is where he is going to have to shine to be a allstar caliber player, his combination speed and length is really special. Jefferson is a little stronger, Carney is a little better of an athlete, and looks to me to have a longer reach. Rodney has a big time wing span, and his hands are humungous. I'm really impressed with him, but doubt we will really consider taking him top 4. And I doubt he will fall to our pick either which right now I'm thinking will be 9 at lowest, but he is a senior so who knows maybe he'll get the shaft.


This closely follows my own opinion on him as well. 

However in terms of draft strategy, I'm not against taking Carney with the NY pick if we aren't completely sold on one of Bargnani or Aldridge (especially if we feel like there is a good chance that one out of Bargnani, Aldridge, or Williams will slide to our pick). It would be sort of like the draft strategy we used last year where we took Gordon and knew that one of Iggy, Deng, or Luke Jackson would be available with our second pick.

I like Carney with the NY pick better than Gay because he fills more of a need, and I don't think one of them has clearly established themselves over another. Even though Gay's ceiling may be higher than Deng, we already have a solid budding prospect at the three. Drafting Carney would be putting him in a situation to succeed. He could be our primary SG backup and also get minutes at SF when one of Deng or Noc isn't playing well. Carney does have the athleticism and strength to become Artest-like, and could be a superstar if he learns to love taking the ball strong to the hoop.

I'm not against drafting Gay either if Pax believes he is clearly better than Carney. I just hope that Luol is included in a package for a solid big already lined up before a Rudy Gay draft selection. Gay just seems a repetitive and "safe" choice. I expect Gay to end up in Charlotte, Portland, Toronto, or Orlando, unless some late lottery team gets lucky in the lottery.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Rhyder said:


> This is my opinion on him as well. If we aren't completely sold on Bargnani or Aldridge, I like Carney with the NY pick better than Gay, especially if we feel like there is a good chance that one out of Bargnani, Aldridge, or Williams will slide to our pick.


why Carney over Gay? I haven't seen much of Carney which is why I ask.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> why Carney over Gay? I haven't seen much of Carney which is why I ask.


Sorry, I was in mid-edit in my post to add more info. Read again.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Rhyder said:


> This closely follows my own opinion on him as well.
> 
> However in terms of draft strategy, I'm not against taking Carney with the NY pick if we aren't completely sold on one of Bargnani or Aldridge (especially if we feel like there is a good chance that one out of Bargnani, Aldridge, or Williams will slide to our pick). It would be sort of like the draft strategy we used last year where we took Gordon and knew that one of Iggy, Deng, or Luke Jackson would be available with our second pick. I like Carney with the NY pick better than Gay because he fills more of a need, and I don't think one of them has clearly established themselves over another. Carney does have the athleticism and strength to become Artest-like, and could be a superstar if he learns to love taking the ball strong to the hoop.


I saw him take the ball to the hop last night VERY vince carter like, he missed though lol.

Wouldn't Carney be a SF in the league though?

I'm kinda sold on Bargnani with the NY pick myself. As much as I love Rudy Gay, we need some serious size & scoring. Those are MY only to options for that pick personally.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I saw him take the ball to the hop last night VERY vince carter like, he missed though lol.
> 
> Wouldn't Carney be a SF in the league though?
> 
> I'm kinda sold on Bargnani with the NY pick myself. As much as I love Rudy Gay, we need some serious size & scoring. Those are MY only to options for that pick personally.


I see Carney as a combination of T-Mac and Artest athletically. i.e. he could easily play the two or the three.

I am highly intrigued with Bargnani as well, I just haven't seen him play much.

I feel our only options with NY's pick are Aldridge, Bargnani, Gay, and Carney (unless some sort of trade is already pre-arranged). I think Carney is the better fit for this team if Pax isn't sold on either Aldridge or Bargnani, or feels one of them is likely to slip to our second pick (Shelden Williams included).

I'm just really high on Carney because we could bring him along slowly behind Gordon and Deng, and Carney and Gay are the only players I see in the draft with Superstar potential. Gay is close behind in my eyes, but fills our team needs much less in my eyes.

That said, I'm sure Skiles would prefer Gay if it were up to him.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I have faith in Paxson come draft day.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Rhyder said:


> I see Carney as a combination of T-Mac and Artest athletically. i.e. he could easily play the two or the three.
> 
> I am highly intrigued with Bargnani as well, I just haven't seen him play much.
> 
> I feel our only options with NY's pick are Aldridge, Bargnani, Gay, and Carney (unless some sort of trade is already pre-arranged). I think Carney is the better fit for this team if Pax isn't sold on either Aldridge or Bargnani, or feels one of them is likely to slip to our second pick (Shelden Williams included).
> 
> I'm just really high on Carney because we could bring him along slowly behind Gordon and Deng, and Carney and Gay are the only players I see in the draft with Superstar potential. Gay is close behind in my eyes, but fills our team needs much less.


the reason I feel like Gay is a better candidate is cause of his ability to finish in the low-post and finish WELL on the fastbreak. we're probably last in the league in both catagories, if not very CLOSE. Alot of players on our team can't finish under the basket to save their lives & on fastbreaks we look completely un-organized. We need easy baskets & Gay's more than capable of providing that.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> the reason I feel like Gay is a better candidate is cause of his ability to finish in the low-post and finish WELL on the fastbreak. we're probably last in the league in both catagories, if not very CLOSE. Alot of players on our team can't finish under the basket to save their lives & on fastbreaks we look completely un-organized. We need easy baskets & Gay's more than capable of providing that.


How much playing time do you see Gay getting on the Bulls his rookie or sophomore seasons?

My concern is that we will give him Deng's or Noc's minutes just to give him minutes and experience. We could get Carney in the regular rotation and upgrade in an area we have been lacking.

With Carney, think every time we see Pike, Pargo, our three-guard lineup, or Gordon's shot not falling replaced by putting Carney in the rotation. We'd also not be stuck with Deng guarding the best offensive wing option every time defensively (think of situations like Deng on Vince with Hinrich on Jefferson or Duhon getting stuck on Dirk in the low post on a defensive switch). There's minutes to be earned there as well.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Rhyder said:


> How much playing time do you see Gay getting on the Bulls his rookie or sophomore seasons?
> 
> My concern is that we will give him Deng's or Noc's minutes just to give him minutes and experience. We could get Carney in the regular rotation and upgrade in an area we have been lacking.
> 
> With Carney, think every time we see Pike, Pargo, our three-guard lineup, or Gordon's shot not falling replaced by putting Carney in the rotation. We'd also not be stuck with Deng guarding the best offensive wing option every time defensively (think of situations like Deng on Vince with Hinrich on Jefferson or Duhon getting stuck on Dirk in the low post on a defensive switch). There's minutes to be earned there as well.


very good points...


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Rhyder said:


> This closely follows my own opinion on him as well.
> 
> However in terms of draft strategy, I'm not against taking Carney with the NY pick if we aren't completely sold on one of Bargnani or Aldridge (especially if we feel like there is a good chance that one out of Bargnani, Aldridge, or Williams will slide to our pick). It would be sort of like the draft strategy we used last year where we took Gordon and knew that one of Iggy, Deng, or Luke Jackson would be available with our second pick.
> 
> I like Carney with the NY pick better than Gay because he fills more of a need, and I don't think one of them has clearly established themselves over another. Even though Gay's ceiling may be higher than Deng, we already have a solid budding prospect at the three. Drafting Carney would be putting him in a situation to succeed. He could be our primary SG backup and also get minutes at SF when one of Deng or Noc isn't playing well. Carney does have the athleticism and strength to become Artest-like, and could be a superstar if he learns to love taking the ball strong to the hoop.
> 
> I'm not against drafting Gay either if Pax believes he is clearly better than Carney. I just hope that Luol is included in a package for a solid big already lined up before a Rudy Gay draft selection. Gay just seems a repetitive and "safe" choice. I expect Gay to end up in Charlotte, Portland, Toronto, or Orlando, unless some late lottery team gets lucky in the lottery.


Another plus about Carney is that he is a little more animated and vocal something I think we need. Gay just has the size I would have a hard time passing up, at the same time he's such a bad fit. If Paxson determines Gay is the best player available he has to take him though. Carney on the other hand may be the perfect fit, if he can handle and pass a little better to make the transition to OG. I'm still looking at Brewer as a guy that may surpass Carney in terms of draft stock and need for us.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I've heard Carney has really poor basketball IQ.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> Another plus about Carney is that he is a little more animated and vocal something I think we need. Gay just has the size I would have a hard time passing up, at the same time he's such a bad fit. If Paxson determines Gay is the best player available he has to take him though. Carney on the other hand may be the perfect fit, if he can handle and pass a little better to make the transition to OG. I'm still looking at Brewer as a guy that may surpass Carney in terms of draft stock and need for us.


Brewer probably would be the better fit, and one I would strongly consider if I was about to become a contender or already was one. In our situation, I don't think you can pass on Carney's upside. It is a relatively safe gamble to go for potential here because we already have three solid guards in Kirk, Ben, and Du.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

9 blocks today against Louisville.

I might have to change my opinion of Hilton Armstrong. I would consider him with our mid first-rounder. Sure, I don't expect him to score, but if we can pick up a good offensive player with either the Knicks pick or in free agency, I think Armstrong would make us that much better of a defensive team. Dominant skills are always useful.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Bargnani continues to impress

Italian rader


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Bargnani played again this saturday, this time in the italian league (his team lost 75-72 against Bodiroga's team).

Numbers:
29 MINUTES
13 POINTS
1-5 2PT FG
2-5 3PT FG
5-6 FT
*11 REBOUNDS (4 OFF)*
*4 STEALS*
1 ASSIST


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

During Fortitudo Bologna Vs Naples

Marco Belinelli
37 minutes
25 points
6-10 from 2
3-7 from 3
5 rebounds
0 turnovers
5 steals
5 assist


----------



## SkywalkerAC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Man you guys will be stacked if you end up with Bargnani or Aldridge.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SkywalkerAC said:


> Man you guys will be stacked if you end up with Bargnani


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Once again, I'm very impressed with the Bargnani stats in the Euroleague. He seems to be a strong rebounder and a good player. It wouldn't surprise me to see him overtake Aldridge at some point, if he doesn't have buyout issues and if he comes and impresses in workouts.

This guy looks like the real deal.

By the way, so does Tiago Splitter. He could easily come in and be a really solid PF for us. I'm not sure why he's dropping so much in the mock drafts, but he's certainly a viable pick at our pick. 10.2 and 5.2 in 20.5 mpg in Euroleague play, he's had several impressive outings, and he's more or less living up to expectations. He's only 21 years old and has an array of offensive abilities, according to the scouting reports.

He's got stronger build than Bargnani and plays with that Brazilian fire. Draftexpress has a terrific read on a matchup between Splitter and Bargnani a little over a month ago in Euroleague competition.

LINK 

Splitter appears to inject a ton of defensive energy for his team, and gets it done on offense. At this point in their careers, it seems that Tiago has the upper hand over Andrea. Here's an interesting quote:



> Defense is a department where Splitter is way ahead. It's not that Bargnani is a liability for his squad, but the Italian lacks a bit of activity, particularly when it comes to team defense. Even if not as clear-cut, rebounding is a similar story, as Andrea is not consistent enough in his effort. What's odd is that he currently gets 2.7 rebounds in about 18 minutes per game in the Euroleague, while his averages dramatically rise to 5.1 rebounds in 19 minutes in the Italian League.


The article is a good read. Splitter is also noted to be not as offensively gifted but a good passer. He's a very good rebounder and team defender, even if not an insane shot-blocker. 

Bargnani's probably still the guy to take if the Knicks pick can't be traded, but Splitter is becoming more and more the right guy for our own pick in my mind. Two 7-footers that are energy maniacs and mad rebounders? Hey, I think Splitter would be the ideal 6th man in the frontcourt, even if we do end up looking at Al Harrington for our starting PF and consistent scorer.

Hinrich/Duhon
Gordon/Brewer (Knicks pick)
Deng/Noch
Al Harrington/Splitter
Chandler/Songaila/Splitter

Let's keep an eye on this guy as the season winds down and the offseason begins to get more interesting. If Splitter somehow manages to be around at our pick (anywhere from 11 to 14), what I'm reading about him makes me think about him over Shelden Williams, if available, who I've been a big proponent of throughout (although I don't feel good that he couldn't stop Tyler Hansborough).

I digress. Tiago Splitter has been getting draft buzz since two years ago; people were talking about Splitter like they have been about Bargnani back in 2004. Now, it should be noted that Splitter's progression as a player has gone as expected, and he really is one of the best big men in international ball.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Splitter is a lot more experienced than Bargnani, has played many international games. Bargnani is starting to see more minutes and while Splitter is a better defender at this point, Andrea isnt a bad defender. But when it comes to the other side of the ball, Bargnani is way superior to Splitter. Bargnani can add scoring punch to our frontcourt and help in defense without being a black hole. Obviously he will develop his game (and body), so the better is yet to come. 
Bargnani will be a top 3 selection IMO, and Splitter will be taken in the 8th/12th range.

And as I said many times, I dont know what Pax thoughts regarding Bargnani are, but I have no doubts that he loves Splitter. IMO his "ideal" draft, without trading, would be Gay and Splitter.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Splitter's game (today):

27 MINUTES
*18 POINTS*
7/11 2PT FG
4/8 FT
*7 REBOUNDS* (1 OFFENSIVE)
1 ASSIST
1 BLOCK


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

went with 2 highschool bigs.

how bout 2 euro bigs?


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> went with 2 highschool bigs.
> 
> how bout 2 euro bigs?



Smartmouf you said what I've been thinking for a few weeks now.


Bargnani and Splitter (Bargnani with the #2 pick and Splitter at 12 (Since he may fall due to contract buyout issues). THat would be an insane draft.

Additionally, in FA we'd still get a instant starter like Harrington and Nazr or Harrington and Salmons for big guard depth.

Our team would look like this:


G - Hinrich, Gordon, Duhon, Salmons, Pargo
F - Deng, Nocioni, Al Harrington, Splitter, Sweetney
C - Nazr, Chandler, Malik Allen, A. D. (for the AD lovers).

That is a seriously deep team with the ability to send wave after wave of talent at opposing teams. Additionally, it gives Paxson the real ability to trade an asset or two for the remaining missing piece and not create another hole.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Splitter & Bargnani would be a great draft for me also.

I'm a big Rudy Gay fan but he's the most inconsistent POTENTIAL #1 pick I've ever seen.

I'd sign Al Harrington use him as trade bait as SOON as Bargnani was ready to man the PF position full time. I'd also sign demarr johnson, 6"9 athletic SG? you can't beat that, you guys are sleeping on him.

C Chandler / Songalia
F Harrington / Bargnani / Splitter
F Deng / Nocioni
G Gordon / Johnson
G Hinrich / Duhon

Playoffs easily..2nd round, big possibility.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> Splitter & Bargnani would be a great draft for me also.
> 
> I'm a big Rudy Gay fan but he's the most inconsistent POTENTIAL #1 pick I've ever seen.
> 
> I'd sign Al Harrington use him as trade bait as SOON as Bargnani was ready to man the PF position full time. I'd also sign demarr johnson, 6"9 athletic SG? you can't beat that.
> 
> C Chandler / Songalia
> F Harrington / Bargnani / Splitter
> F Deng / Nocioni
> G Gordon / Johnson
> G Hinrich / Duhon



Great call on Johnson, especially since he's making the minimum and anytime would be an increase right now. He's not a defensive stopper, but would be a positive in case Salmons wouldn't come.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



chifaninca said:


> Great call on Johnson, especially since he's making the minimum and anytime would be an increase right now. He's not a defensive stopper, but would be a positive in case Salmons wouldn't come.



Yeah, he's definintely not the BEST defensivly but he's not bad. One thing I like about him his ability to get above the rim. The year Melo first came, guys on that team were throwing the kid alley oops like he was kenyon martin or somethin. I watched them closely that year and he was very valuable to them...I Don't know what's happened to him recently though.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Bargnani and Splitter, the next Curry and Chandler, haha. Just had to throw that in there. 

Lets hope they don't take as long to develop, and are superior players.


----------



## The Krakken

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



El Chapu said:


> And as I said many times, I dont know what Pax thoughts regarding Bargnani are, but I have no doubts that he loves Splitter. IMO his "ideal" draft, without trading, would be Gay and Splitter.


I'm beginning to lean that way.

Draft: Gay
Draft: Splitter
Sign: Nene (provided he's healthy).

Call it an offseason.

Starters:

*Hinrich
Gordon
Deng (for now)
Nene
Chandler*

1st reserves:

*Duhon
Gay* (for now--I believe he'd eventually become our starting SF, and either Deng would become our 6th man or be traded).
*Songaila
Nocioni
Splitter*

That's a nice team.

After watching this team, I'm convinced we need some players with a Mean streak and some toughness, and while Gay doesn't address that, Nene, and Splitter DEFINITELY do.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The Krakken said:


> After watching this team, I'm convinced we need some players with a Mean streak and some toughness, and while Gay doesn't address that, Nene, and Splitter DEFINITELY do.


Couldn't agree more, which is why I'm not as high on Gay as I want to be. If Nene is healthy he's got to be the first one called. The Brazilian Duo would bring some nastiness.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

As much as I like Rudy, replacing Deng with him or stocking THAT position isn't the answer. Deng still has a TON of potential and is basically still a kid. If we start winning next season, I doubt Nocioni will want to leave at the end of 2007. We really just need to get BIGGER, get some TOUGHNESS & get some EASY scoring in the middle. Songalia's brief stinct of looking like a star last night should show all how much we could benefit if we had that type of production on a regular basis. We need a big 2-guard that can defend against the star guards in the league & has good ball-handling skills so he could free up gordon and hinrich and let them bomb away. Another reason WHY I do think we need Ronnie Brewer. Like I said before, I wouldn't put my money on Splitter unless I knew 100% that he was coming to the nba next year so I don't even think about drafting him. I'm not convinced with Aldridge with ny's pick, I'd rather let Atlanta draft and develop him. At this point, Bargnani has shown me alot more and in a shorter span. I think we benefit the most from these combinations of draft picks :

Bargnani & R. Brewer
Bargnani & S. Williams
Bargnani & B. Roy

I like Roy over Brewer cuz of the atheleticism and the fact that Roy actually has STAR potential but I'd be fine with either personally.

Also, like him or not, Al harrington would take alot off Chandler & our backcourt. If he's in ATL and averages 18 & 9 and HATES it there, imagine what he could put up per game in a winning situation. Sign Nazr for a couple of years and we're STOCKED.

C Chandler / Mohammed
F Harrington / Bargnani / Songalia
F Deng / Nocioni
G Gordon / Roy-Brewer
G Hinrich / Duhon

If that team doesn't put you in the 2nd round ATLEAST, fire the coach. Also, if the team doesn't PAN out, you got a ton of trade bait and alot of stars in the 2007 FA market. Any combination of those players should be able to nab SOMEONE valuable.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Does anyone know what Tiago's current contractual situation is with his team?? And how likely he is to make it to the NBA this season?? (Or for that matter, whether or not he even plans to enter this draft??)

I'll be the first to admit that I've never seen him play, but from what I read about him, he'd seem like a natural fit with our second pick, but it seems like the guy's been about to enter the draft for about 3 years now, and I still hear about issues w/ his contract w/ Tau Ceramica?? 

Could any of our Euro buddies like El Chapu or italianbball fan give us a scoop on this??


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'm not saying these are my guys, but the contrasting styles of Splitter (being an inside presence) and Bargnani (perimeter player) looks very enticing if we can grab both. This COULD become what Curry and Chandler SHOULD have become from an offensive standpoint. I believe this is why Brand was traded. Chandler at the High Post, Curry in the Low Post. I still want Aldridge at this stage because I think at worse he can be like Fyre, but I'm hoping for him to become Bosh-like. However, if we can grab Bargnani, I hope we can grab Splitter or Nene in FA.


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



rosenthall said:


> Does anyone know what Tiago's current contractual situation is with his team?? And how likely he is to make it to the NBA this season?? (Or for that matter, whether or not he even plans to enter this draft??)
> 
> I'll be the first to admit that I've never seen him play, but from what I read about him, he'd seem like a natural fit with our second pick, but it seems like the guy's been about to enter the draft for about 3 years now, and I still hear about issues w/ his contract w/ Tau Ceramica??
> 
> Could any of our Euro buddies like El Chapu or italianbball fan give us a scoop on this??


Mmm, about the contract of Tiago I don't know nothing, while about the Bargnani's one I can say that Benetton Treviso is one of the most "NBA-friendly" team in Europe.
For sure there are no contract/buyout issue in the Bargnani's case.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I saw a clip of Bargnani and I liked what I saw, especially his ability to put the ball on the floor and drive to the hoop. He does need to add on some muscle in order to play the four in the NBA though, but definetly a guy to look at with top three pick. As for Splitter, I 've heard about him for about 2 or 3 years, but his contract has always been an issue, so I don't know about him. If he's there with our pick, I'd definetly take him(Williams won't go lower than 7 IMO). I'm also hearing Hansbrough's going to declare as well...


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



theanimal23 said:


> Bargnani and Splitter, the next Curry and Chandler, haha. Just had to throw that in there.
> 
> Lets hope they don't take as long to develop, and are superior players.


I'm thinking they wouldn't (take as long to develop) since they are both 20 years old, not like Darko and Tskitishvili, who were 17 and 18, respectively, on draft day. Also notable is that Pau Gasol and Dirk Nowitzki were both 20 on draft day.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

How long do people think Brandon Roy is going to stick around in the draft? I like him a little more than Brewer, though I haven't seen a ton of either. He's averaging 20, 6 and 4 for a team in a big time conference with just 5 losses. Gets after it on the defensive end, has good size for a 2 and shoots a good percentage. Doesn't shoot a ton of 3's, but he's been decent from long distance - 38.5% on 78 tries this year. His game logs look extremely consistent, he's been held under 10 just twice this season, and as a senior he should be pretty NBA ready. Will he be there if we pick in the 10-13 range?


----------



## southpark

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Roy should be availalbe in the 10-13 pick range. He doesnt have all that much upside but as you said, he seems to be putting up solid numbers and he has long arms/should be an adequate defender for the 2 guard level in the NBA


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

James White of Cinn is a projected 2nd rounder..I wish we had a chance to land him

he's 6"7 SG senior with range..I really like his game...surprised he isn't going in the 1st


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> James White of Cinn is a projected 2nd rounder..I wish we had a chance to land him
> 
> he's 6"7 SG senior with range..I really like his game...surprised he isn't going in the 1st



He developed that range which is a good thing...Shows he can get better.

But man...His athleticsm is off the charts.


Did you see him go between his legs from the free throw line?

Just sick...

The media would blow that kid up if he came to Chicago


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> He developed that range which is a good thing...Shows he can get better.
> 
> But man...His athleticsm is off the charts.
> 
> 
> Did you see him go between his legs from the free throw line?
> 
> Just sick...
> 
> The media would blow that kid up if he came to Chicago



Im just not understanding why he's a projected late 2nd .rounder...or a 2nd rounder at all for that matter

if we don't land brandon roy or brewer, he'd be the next best thing IMO...


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

So after a few seasons of inconsistency and huge letdown (James White was supposed to be the next NBA superstar coming out of h.s.), he has one decent season on a team that has struggled on and off, and suddenly he's the 3rd best G/F out of the draft?

I'd much rather have Mo Ager (who has been solid and an NBA talent for two seasons now), Mike Gansey (the second coming of Kirk Hinrich, IMO), and Richard Roby (stud SG that will be a bunch better than Antoine Wright). James White, nevertheless, can be near the top of the 2nd round or the bottom of the 1st round. He's a crazy athlete that has added a nice shot, but he looks sort of Jamal Crawford-like except with worse handles, more explosion but less quickness. The bad defense remains similar.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Was listening to Tom Tolbert on the radio today, he loves Pac-10 hoops. Anyway, he was raving about Brandon Roy. Said he could do it all on the court. Offensively, can hit the three, post up, get to the line, set up his teammates. Said on the defensive end he can lock down the 1, 2, or 3 spots. Said he is going to be a great pro. 

Is he really that good? Never seen the kid play. What was interesting was that Tolbert claimed Roy is projected to go between 13 and 17 in the draft. That seemed way too late to me, especially with the way he was gushing over him. Could someone who has seen him play give me a player comparison? Who does he remind you of? Thanks.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



SALO said:


> Was listening to Tom Tolbert on the radio today, he loves Pac-10 hoops. Anyway, he was raving about Brandon Roy. Said he could do it all on the court. Offensively, can hit the three, post up, get to the line, set up his teammates. Said on the defensive end he can lock down the 1, 2, or 3 spots. Said he is going to be a great pro.
> 
> Is he really that good? Never seen the kid play. What was interesting was that Tolbert claimed Roy is projected to go between 13 and 17 in the draft. That seemed way too late to me, especially with the way he was gushing over him. Could someone who has seen him play give me a player comparison? Who does he remind you of? Thanks.


He reminds me of a tough Jalen Rose who plays defense.


----------



## Like A Breath

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I don't think Roy is the ball-handler Jalen Rose is, but he's a far better inside player. He scores in the lane very, very well. But, his athleticism is not fantastic. He's probably an average athlete on the NBA level. His touch on long-range shots isn't that great either, though it has improved.

I would call him a poor-man's Carmelo Anthony with a little Bonzi Wells sprinkled in.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

How do people feel about Jokaim Noah? Sophomore, 6'10'', just dropped 37 on Georgia...any shot he's coming out?


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



jbulls said:


> How do people feel about Jokaim Noah? Sophomore, 6'10'', just dropped 37 on Georgia...any shot he's coming out?


Some are saying he's the third or fourth best big in the draft. I like Davis and Pittsnogle myself, but I think Noah's right there. Reminds me a lot of Anderson Varejao, who I also like a ton, and for more than the crazy hair. A ton of energy, a good rebounder, but Noah is a wiry, energy forward/center and not really a big strong one.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Some are saying he's the third or fourth best big in the draft. I like Davis and Pittsnogle myself, but I think Noah's right there. Reminds me a lot of Anderson Varejao, who I also like a ton, and for more than the crazy hair. A ton of energy, a good rebounder, but Noah is a wiry, energy forward/center and not really a big strong one.


I think Noah has more parimeter offensive ability than Varejao.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Brooks from Oregon is a complete thug. He just blatantly forarmed a Washington player in the mouth. It was a Marcus Vick play and I hope he's kicked off the team.

Every time I watch Roy I am more impressed. I think he has a game that will translate very well in the pro's. He can score from everywhere on the court and has very good basketball instincts.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Aldridge just had his first dominating preformance I have seen, putting up 20 and 17, including a nice power dunk and a turn around 18 footer.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> Aldridge just had his first dominating preformance I have seen, putting up 20 and 17, including a nice power dunk and a turn around 18 footer.


yeah..

um..

damn


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Justin Williams on Wyoming is going nuts on Utah, single-handedly demoralizing them.

He's got like 6 points, 7 blocks and 8 rebounds with 3:20 left to go... in the first HALF.

I've mentioned him in the "sleeper" thread a long time back, never got a chance to see him, and now I'm really really liking what I see. This guy is really intuitive with the shotblocking... I mean, he looks better than Chandler, even, because he's had some really sick blocks on guys just one-on-one as WELL as the help-defense block. Chandler tends to have his best blocks by patrolling the paint and giving help defense.

You can never have too much rebounding and shotblocking, and Williams has fairly soft hands near the hoop, although he doesn't have a go-to move on offense. He's essentially an equally ferocious version of Chandler, at 6-11. I'd love to see us try and acquire a high 2nd rounder to grab him.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Williams now has 8 points, 10 blocks and 11 rebounds. One basket from a triple-double with 12 minutes left in the half.

The guy is just going insane tonight. I'd love to see Wyoming make the big dance by winning this conference, just to see Justin Williams go up against better college competition. From what I see now, this guy is crazy mobile. Gotta be the best big man defensive performance I've seen in the college game this season.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Leon Powe !

Tell me why I think Ron Artest when I see that kid play.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> Aldridge just had his first dominating preformance I have seen, putting up 20 and 17, including a nice power dunk and a turn around 18 footer.



I watched the game as well and this was definitely his highlight game. He took ti strong, demanded the ball from his teammates, played mad d..............if only he showed this every night. Again, is it him? Is it his teammates being selfish (I do think it has an effect). Is it his crappy coaching? How they don't use Aldridge more is beyond me.

Glad to see him ahve some good games. If nothing else we need him to dominate so he enters the draft and makes it that much deeper.

I would still be fine with him. Just wish he showed this all the time.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

James White > Rodney Carney


----------



## dkg1

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

What do you guys think of Vincent Grier, a 6-5 guard from Minnesota? He dropped 29 the other night in the Big Ten tourney and looks like an incredible athlete. His downside is he is a poor outside shooter. Where are the various draft sites having him drafted?


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> James White > Rodney Carney


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



smARTmouf said:


> James White > Rodney Carney


This one might actually have some merit, but I think Carney has a lot more in the way of fundamentals. James White just makes plays happen; he'll be a great scrapper on both ends in the NBA. But Carney has the ability to be something special.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Hey would anyone trade down the #2 overall pick for the #15 and #20?

Let's say that Tiago Splitter was available at 15 and Hilton Armstrong at 20, and let's say that with our own pick we've taken Brandon Roy. Basically, would you rather have Splitter, Armstrong and Roy? Or Morrison and say, Shelden Williams?

Even if Splitter's not available, say it's Aaron Gray and Kevin Pittsnogle. Gray + Pittsnogle + Roy? Or Morrison + Shelden?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Hey would anyone trade down the #2 overall pick for the #15 and #20?
> 
> Let's say that Tiago Splitter was available at 15 and Hilton Armstrong at 20, and let's say that with our own pick we've taken Brandon Roy. Basically, would you rather have Splitter, Armstrong and Roy? Or Morrison and say, Shelden Williams?
> 
> Even if Splitter's not available, say it's Aaron Gray and Kevin Pittsnogle. Gray + Pittsnogle + Roy? Or Morrison + Shelden?


No way. This team needs a star far more than it needs big man depth, and it needs big man depth pretty badly.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> This one might actually have some merit, but I think Carney has a lot more in the way of fundamentals. James White just makes plays happen; he'll be a great scrapper on both ends in the NBA. But Carney has the ability to be something special.


It's not even close White is extremely unconsistant, weak, not as good a shooter or finisher, and not as good defensivily as Carney. White is a phenomenal athlete but doesn't do anything extrodinary, he can throw it down something fierce, but not in traffic.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> No way. This team needs a star far more than it needs big man depth, and it needs big man depth pretty badly.


Yeah. We should be able to get some depth from FA, also 2 rookies is more than enough(no need to develope guys just to have to trade them). But that said if we can't get Aldridge or Bargnani, I think we should probably trade that pick, but not for a pair of rooks. 

Morrison's scoring doesn't make up for his d when compared to Luol. And as for Gay, I just don't know. His potential is certainly superstar, but he has no fire or emotion period(after the Syracuse game he looked disappointed and a little upset, after seeing that I realized how little emotion I have seen out him, because I did notice that and it wasn't much), and besides Duncan, I can't think of any stars with that kind of demeanor. Another thing I haven't seen from Gay is him taking over games for significant periods of time, which is another indicator of a future star. He looks a little lost or like he's resting on the floor too much of the time. Considering we have a nice 3 of the future already I wouldn't be at all thrilled if Pax drafted him.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

How about McRoberts today. 13 and 8 isn't overly impressive, but he outplayed Williams, hit a 3 and had an ESPN top play of the day dunk put back.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Hey would anyone trade down the #2 overall pick for the #15 and #20?
> 
> Let's say that Tiago Splitter was available at 15 and Hilton Armstrong at 20, and let's say that with our own pick we've taken Brandon Roy. Basically, would you rather have Splitter, Armstrong and Roy? Or Morrison and say, Shelden Williams?
> 
> Even if Splitter's not available, say it's Aaron Gray and Kevin Pittsnogle. Gray + Pittsnogle + Roy? Or Morrison + Shelden?


I think if you were to look at the history of the draft you'd find that trading the #2 pick for the #15 and #20 would pretty much always be a losing bet...

This isn't a strong draft, but logic dictates that this just isn't a smart percentage play.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Hey would anyone trade down the #2 overall pick for the #15 and #20?
> 
> Let's say that Tiago Splitter was available at 15 and Hilton Armstrong at 20, and let's say that with our own pick we've taken Brandon Roy. Basically, would you rather have Splitter, Armstrong and Roy? Or Morrison and say, Shelden Williams?
> 
> Even if Splitter's not available, say it's Aaron Gray and Kevin Pittsnogle. Gray + Pittsnogle + Roy? Or Morrison + Shelden?


No way. That would be a losing deal. Consider the Richard Jefferson deal as a model. Houston traded the 13 the 18 and the 23 picks for the 7th pick.


----------



## dkg1

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

How would you guys rank the 2's so far (obviously we don't know who is coming out for sure)? I've seen several guys in tournaments who are under the radar that intrigue me. Two guys from the Big Ten I really like are JJ Sullinger (OSU) and Vincent Grier of Minnesota. Both are around 6-6 and can jump out of the gym. Both seem to be athletic guys who will be able to defend at the next level. Sullinger doesn't have offensive numbers that will make your jaw drop but part of that is due to playing on a very balanced OSU team. He has shown he can stick the outside shot and looks like he has a decent all around game. Grier can't shoot a lick but is able to get the ball in the hoop. I think these guys will move up the charts as the draft nears. I'm curious to see how they do in the draft camps and how they measure out. I know there are a lot of other 2-3's ranked higher than these two, wanted to hear if anyone has an opinion on either one. 

Someone compared Leon Powe of Cal to Artest. He's got the Artest-type body at 6-8 240. He seems to play inside quite a bit at the college level. Has he shown the ability to get out and guard on the perimeter like Artest can? If he can, he's possibly a guy to look at to have another guy to throw at Lebron.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Anyone watching Duke BC? Redick just hit a three from about 5 feet beyond the NBA line!(the shot clock wasn't expiring, he's just sick, he just hit 2 more, 3 in a row) McRoberts is doing a little bit of everything, great passing, fouled on a made dunk misses the FT, gets his own rebound, throws it down again and gets fouled again. Sheldon ripping down a rebound with one hand, blocks a shot a foot and a half over the basket. Paulas with 5 steals. Duke is such an entertaining team.

*Dick Vitale "Call the Fire Chief, call the Fire Chief"*


----------



## andras

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> No way. That would be a losing deal. Consider the Richard Jefferson deal as a model. Houston traded the 13 the 18 and the 23 picks for the 7th pick.



Unless I'm badly mistaken, you're actually giving a rare example of a team trading down for multiple picks getting the upper hand. Houston (trading up) ended up with Eddie Griffin, hardly the star Jefferson is these days. Jason Collins and Brandon Armstrong were only extras for the Nets (the team trading down)


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dkg1 said:


> How would you guys rank the 2's so far (obviously we don't know who is coming out for sure)? I've seen several guys in tournaments who are under the radar that intrigue me. Two guys from the Big Ten I really like are JJ Sullinger (OSU) and Vincent Grier of Minnesota. Both are around 6-6 and can jump out of the gym. Both seem to be athletic guys who will be able to defend at the next level. Sullinger doesn't have offensive numbers that will make your jaw drop but part of that is due to playing on a very balanced OSU team. He has shown he can stick the outside shot and looks like he has a decent all around game. Grier can't shoot a lick but is able to get the ball in the hoop. I think these guys will move up the charts as the draft nears. I'm curious to see how they do in the draft camps and how they measure out. I know there are a lot of other 2-3's ranked higher than these two, wanted to hear if anyone has an opinion on either one.
> 
> Someone compared Leon Powe of Cal to Artest. He's got the Artest-type body at 6-8 240. He seems to play inside quite a bit at the college level. Has he shown the ability to get out and guard on the perimeter like Artest can? If he can, he's possibly a guy to look at to have another guy to throw at Lebron.


Those guys have some skill, but considering how high our icks will be, they aren't worth giving too long of a look. Not sure if Carney will be an overly effective 2, but R Brewer has really played well of late and he was already on top of the list.

Leon Powe isn't as strong(he's very strong but Artest is a tank), fast(for a 4 he is decently fast), and doesn't have the lateral quickness Artest has(again good for a 4 though). He is a power forward, if he was 2+ inches taller, he would probably be the fit for us(great moves in the post) and the top pick, but he's not. If I had to make a comparision I guess I would say he's a smaller, poor man's version of Karl Malone.


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> Anyone watching Duke BC? Redick just hit a three from about 5 feet beyond the NBA line!(the shot clock wasn't expiring, he's just sick, he just hit 2 more, 3 in a row) McRoberts is doing a little bit of everything, great passing, fouled on a made dunk misses the FT, gets his own rebound, throws it down again and gets fouled again. Sheldon ripping down a rebound with one hand, blocks a shot a foot and a half over the basket. Paulas with 5 steals. Duke is such an entertaining team.


Agreed, I was impressed with all of them today. 
JJ is just crazy, 26 points, on 7-11 3PTs.


----------



## dkg1

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> Those guys have some skill, but considering how high our icks will be, they aren't worth giving too long of a look. Not sure if Carney will be an overly effective 2, but R Brewer has really played well of late and he was already on top of the list.
> 
> Leon Powe isn't as strong(he's very strong but Artest is a tank), fast(for a 4 he is decently fast), and doesn't have the lateral quickness Artest has(again good for a 4 though). He is a power forward, if he was 2+ inches taller, he would probably be the fit for us(great moves in the post) and the top pick, but he's not. If I had to make a comparision I guess I would say he's a smaller, poor man's version of Karl Malone.


Thanks for the input Hustle. I really like Brewer's game too. I was just trying to get some discussion going on the 2 guards fully aware that the two guys I mentioned probably wouldn't be slotted to go as early as our picks. Maybe second round? 

Leon Powe sounds a lot like Al Harrington to me. I'm fired up for the tourney, can't wait to see some of the guys I've not been able to see so far this year, especially the west coast players.

Shawne Williams of Memphis is also another good looking prospect. He looks like he can really stroke it from the outside.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dkg1 said:


> *Shawne Williams* of Memphis is also another good looking prospect. He looks like he can really stroke it from the outside.


Everytime I see memphis he's kind of quiet, his stock has fallen a bit in recent weeks because of inconsistant play. Don't know if he would crack the top11 (where our pick would be today), right now I'd say he's just outside of that, but it would probably be a good thing for the Bulls for him to enter and give some more depth to the draft. Workouts could mean a lot for a guy as young as him playing second fiddle to a great college player in Carney. I have a feeling he'll test the waters, and then pull out if he's not given a top 10 promise. Next year he would be the man in Memphis and would likely improve his stock. His overall ability at 6'9" is impressive, he will be able to play some 2 in the NBA, however the 3 spot may be his best position, if I'm wrong about that his stock will skyrocket.



> I was just trying to get some discussion going on the *2 guards*


If we still had Eddy and didn't have Gordon, I would be very high on* Redick.* Defenders cannot leave him (well known fact). If he is drafted by a team with good post up scorers he will be a huge difference maker, which is why I seriously doubt he'll drop past Houston and Minesota (currently 12 and 10 respectivily).

Mark my words *Mardy Collins* will be a bust. He's 6'6-7 and plays point, but it won't translate in the pros, he's not athletic enough and for every matchup where he can out muscle someone he will get burned twice maybe three times by a faster, quicker guy. He's also a pretty poor shooter.

You never know about the tweeners coming into the league, but *Randy Foye* is a very talented guy, He can score every which way and is very strong for a 6'3" guy (like Gordon). Not quite the shooter or scorer Gordon is, but is a little bit bigger, and will probably be a slightly better defender, passer and ball handler. Because of his size he's probably a bad fit for us.
*
Brandon Roy* is good at everything, but not great at anything, which is why I don't see star potential. He will be able to contribute right away, which may be needed if we draft Aldrigdge or Bragnani both of which will need a little time. I consider him the worst case scenario with our pick and I'm very comfortable with that, I have a feeling Pax is really high on this kid, he's a right way kind of guy.
*
Brandon Rush* is very intrigueing to me. I've seen quite a bit of him, but I just can't get a feel for him(that goes for all of the Kansas guys actually). As a freshman he's got an NBA body and is the best player on a team full of NBA prospects. Right now I would say the mocks are sleeping on him, he is one of the top 5 freshman(I would call it a weak class) in the country with a game that is more likely to translate in the pros than some of the guys ahead of him(Hansbrough).


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

After an unimpressive performance in Euroleague, Bargnani started for Benetton this weekend and did fine:

29 Minutes
18 Points
8-10 FG (1-3 3PT)
3-4 FT
11 Rebounds (6 offensive boards)
3 Blocks
1 Steal
1 Turnover

Pretty good.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

take the two B's 
Bargnani 
and Brewer

And then get a centre in free agency (o.k might be abig ask)

Captain Kirk/Duhon
Gordon/Brewer
Deng/Nocino
Chandler/Bargnani
centre/ A. Davis/ Chandler


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> Anyone watching Duke BC? Redick just hit a three from about 5 feet beyond the NBA line!(the shot clock wasn't expiring, he's just sick, he just hit 2 more, 3 in a row) McRoberts is doing a little bit of everything, great passing, fouled on a made dunk misses the FT, gets his own rebound, throws it down again and gets fouled again. Sheldon ripping down a rebound with one hand, blocks a shot a foot and a half over the basket. Paulas with 5 steals. Duke is such an entertaining team.
> 
> *Dick Vitale "Call the Fire Chief, call the Fire Chief"*


McRoberts was awesome against BC. He's a good ball handler for a PF, can make great passes, has a good high post game, and is willing to dunk any time he can. He does seem to need some work in the low post on both ends of the floor, but I consider him the third best big man talent in the 2006 draft, if he does declare.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

after one game!?

he's been less than subpar all season..


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> after one game!?
> 
> he's been less than subpar all season..


He's stepped up his game the past month and a half (not including the two Florida State games), and he's playing alongside two All-Americans. It could be debated that if McRoberts was in Hansborough's situation he would be freshman of the year. McRoberts has always liked to dunk everything, a la Amare without as much devastating power.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



El Chapu said:


> After an unimpressive performance in Euroleague, Bargnani started for Benetton this weekend and did fine:
> 
> 29 Minutes
> 18 Points
> 8-10 FG (1-3 3PT)
> 3-4 FT
> 11 Rebounds (6 offensive boards)
> 3 Blocks
> 1 Steal
> 1 Turnover
> 
> Pretty good.


I LIKE THAT KID

I hope we get the 3rd pick and morrison n gay get taken 1st and 2nd...we'd have no choice but to take him...


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> I LIKE THAT KID
> 
> I hope we get the 3rd pick and morrison n gay get taken 1st and 2nd...we'd have no choice but to take him...


I wouldn't be opposed to take him with the #1 overall pick if Paxson felt that strongly about him. I know Paxson's been over to Europe on scouting trips, but is there any word on how much Paxson has seen of Bargnani. Which players was Paxson looking at, and how long were his stints in Europe for? Has he spoken with Bargnani in person, etc?


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



andras said:


> Unless I'm badly mistaken, you're actually giving a rare example of a team trading down for multiple picks getting the upper hand. Houston (trading up) ended up with Eddie Griffin, hardly the star Jefferson is these days. Jason Collins and Brandon Armstrong were only extras for the Nets (the team trading down)


Actually, this is the only time in recent memory where there's even been a trade down from a high pick, and this is EXACTLY why it's a good deal. If I'm not mistaken, Collins is a solid backup big for that team and Richard Jefferson is the young star for years to come. Eddie Griffin basically became a shot-blocker with attitude problems.

And in most deals involving draft picks, a player is involved. So what if we got both 1st rounders from NO/OK (now sitting around 13 and 16, not 15 and 20), and we also took Kirk Snyder from them? And in return, we gave them the #2 pick overall and Nocioni? They could use the #2 to draft Aldridge, and we could take Splitter and Shelden with 13 and 16. 

Paul/Claxton
J.R. Smith/Mason
Nocioni/Mason
David West/Whoever (Marc Jackson? Jackson Vroman? Aaron Williams? Chris Andersen?)
P.J. Brown/Aldridge (to take over)/Chris Andersen

Nocioni would be a great glue guy for them and Aldridge would give them much needed star power to be the future frontcourt mate for David West. He's a special talent and with Paul, West and Aldridge, things could look really good. Or make it Bargnani, if you want. Sure.

We could take Splitter (in my opinion, Splitter -> Bargnani as Nocioni -> Ginobili, if you know what I mean) and Hilton Armstrong. We can still sign Al Harrington, as Splitter will need time and Baby Al can play the 3 now when Deng's not on the floor.

Hinrich/Duhon
Gordon/Snyder (NICE)
Deng/Al Harrington
Al Harrington/Splitter/Songaila
Chandler/Armstrong

That's a lot more size in Splitter and Armstrong, scoring in Harrington, length at guard in Snyder... gosh.

I'd like to draft Mike Gansey, of course, just to do it and show everyone else up, so if we took Mark Jackson instead of Snyder, then we could draft Gansey instead of Armstrong. Armstrong and Snyder is better than Jackson and Gansey, though, but I just really like Mike Gansey as an NBA player... there's a lot of Hinrich in him.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> Actually, this is the only time in recent memory where there's even been a trade down from a high pick, and this is EXACTLY why it's a good deal. If I'm not mistaken, Collins is a solid backup big for that team and Richard Jefferson is the young star for years to come. Eddie Griffin basically became a shot-blocker with attitude problems.
> 
> And in most deals involving draft picks, a player is involved. So what if we got both 1st rounders from NO/OK (now sitting around 13 and 16, not 15 and 20), and we also took Kirk Snyder from them? And in return, we gave them the #2 pick overall and Nocioni? They could use the #2 to draft Aldridge, and we could take Splitter and Shelden with 13 and 16.
> 
> Paul/Claxton
> J.R. Smith/Mason
> Nocioni/Mason
> David West/Whoever (Marc Jackson? Jackson Vroman? Aaron Williams? Chris Andersen?)
> P.J. Brown/Aldridge (to take over)/Chris Andersen
> 
> Nocioni would be a great glue guy for them and Aldridge would give them much needed star power to be the future frontcourt mate for David West. He's a special talent and with Paul, West and Aldridge, things could look really good. Or make it Bargnani, if you want. Sure.
> 
> We could take Splitter (in my opinion, Splitter -> Bargnani as Nocioni -> Ginobili, if you know what I mean) and Hilton Armstrong. We can still sign Al Harrington, as Splitter will need time and Baby Al can play the 3 now when Deng's not on the floor.
> 
> Hinrich/Duhon
> Gordon/Snyder (NICE)
> Deng/Al Harrington
> Al Harrington/Splitter/Songaila
> Chandler/Armstrong
> 
> That's a lot more size in Splitter and Armstrong, scoring in Harrington, length at guard in Snyder... gosh.
> 
> I'd like to draft Mike Gansey, of course, just to do it and show everyone else up, so if we took Mark Jackson instead of Snyder, then we could draft Gansey instead of Armstrong. Armstrong and Snyder is better than Jackson and Gansey, though, but I just really like Mike Gansey as an NBA player... there's a lot of Hinrich in him.


I don't know. I don't think Shelden Williams is going to be around at #16. And Tiago Splitter's buyout situation is cause for some concern. I think Snyder is okay, but I think Nocioni is a better player. None of these guys project to anything more than league average starters. The #2 pick is a chance to get an impact player, a potential All-Star. If we trade it, I'd like to get more than this. I think New Orleans would deal those picks to get up to #2 in a heartbeat, I just can't see why we'd do it. Maybe if they dealt West instead of Snyder.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



jbulls said:


> I don't know. I don't think Shelden Williams is going to be around at #16. And Tiago Splitter's buyout situation is cause for some concern. I think Snyder is okay, but I think Nocioni is a better player. None of these guys project to anything more than league average starters. The #2 pick is a chance to get an impact player, a potential All-Star. If we trade it, I'd like to get more than this. I think New Orleans would deal those picks to get up to #2 in a heartbeat, I just can't see why we'd do it. Maybe if they dealt West instead of Snyder.


But West would be a tough guy to deal. I mean, don't get me wrong, I think David West has a really bright future in this league. He's a powerful beast inside, and he's developed a VERY strange penchant of making clutch jumpshots this season. That's never a bad thing to have on your team.

But he's also their leading scorer and an integral part to their core. It's like us trading Hinrich.

I'd absolutely LOVE to get West, #13 and #16 for our #2 overall and Noch.

Splitter's going to be more than an average NBA player... he matches up against Bargnani extremely well and last time they met, he outplayed Andrea. The buyout issue might be big, but dude, this guy is going to be a really serious player. I only know what I've read and seen in pictures, but he looks like the next Pau. He might not even be there at #13.

Shelden, I feel, will drop in the draft. He just doesn't come up big against good teams, he matched up just okay against Hansborough, etc. His tournament performance will affect his stock greatly, but there's definitely enough questions about him for him to be a dubious pick.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> But West would be a tough guy to deal. I mean, don't get me wrong, I think David West has a really bright future in this league. He's a powerful beast inside, and he's developed a VERY strange penchant of making clutch jumpshots this season. That's never a bad thing to have on your team.
> 
> But he's also their leading scorer and an integral part to their core. It's like us trading Hinrich.
> 
> I'd absolutely LOVE to get West, #13 and #16 for our #2 overall and Noch.
> 
> Splitter's going to be more than an average NBA player... he matches up against Bargnani extremely well and last time they met, he outplayed Andrea. The buyout issue might be big, but dude, this guy is going to be a really serious player. I only know what I've read and seen in pictures, but he looks like the next Pau. He might not even be there at #13.
> 
> Shelden, I feel, will drop in the draft. He just doesn't come up big against good teams, he matched up just okay against Hansborough, etc. His tournament performance will affect his stock greatly, but there's definitely enough questions about him for him to be a dubious pick.


I wish we could get a good idea of what's going on with Splitter. By all accounts, he seems to have some game and could probably help any team that drafts him right off the bat, but there doesn't seem to be any good information out there concerning his draft status (it seems like he's been about to come out for the past 4 years now) and his contract buyout as well. I mean, I think his buyout was an issue 3 years ago. How long does this thing run? I'd really like to know, because he seems like he'd be a great pick around the 10-12 range.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Bargnani >> Aldridge & Williams


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Vincent Vega,

Is there any chance Julian Wright would enter the draft this year? I really like the cut of that guy's jib.

Sincerely, 

ScottMay


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Shelden Williams just had his shot stuffed down his gullet by a 6-7 player from someplace called Southern.

Suffice it to say, I've had significant reservations about Shelden all year long. This may have been the last straw.


----------



## Cyanobacteria

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

How many times has abuyout prevented a player from getting to the NBA? I can't think of any right now. It seems like it's mentioned as a serious problem for 2 or 3 guys every year, but they always seem to make it. Leads me to believe it's just language from the other team saying, "you're gonna pay up!" in an attempt to drive up the buyout price. 

I have no clue what Splitter's situation is, I'm just saying...


----------



## JPBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Cyanobacteria said:


> I have no clue what Splitter's situation is, I'm just saying...


Splitter doesn´t have a buyout, if TAU decides that they want him for one more year thats nothing he can do. But next year is the last year of his contract and I think TAU will negotiate a buyout because next year he can leave for free, this year is the last chance for them do make some money with him.

If he declares without the buyout and somehow don´t go in the lottery the team that draft him will have a great steal, even if he stays in Europe one more year. He will instantly become one of the best man to man defenders in the NBA, he is arguably the best PF/C defender in Europe.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

anybody see that kid Joakim Noah's statline from FLA? dude had krilenko numbers

16pts 8rebs, 7asts, 5blks and a couple stls..

off the BENCH


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> Shelden Williams just had his shot stuffed down his gullet by a 6-7 player from someplace called Southern.
> 
> Suffice it to say, I've had significant reservations about Shelden all year long. This may have been the last straw.


Ok...

But perhaps it's also worth mentioning Shelden's 29 pts, 18 rebounds, and 4 blocks?

I'll admit, I've cooled on Shelden the past month, but I'm not ready to write him off. He's about the only reliable big that Duke has (although McRoberts has been coming around), and I'm having a hard time deciding if we should really blame him for those big performances against him (e.g. Hansbrough, Killingsworth, etc). I have a gut feeling that Chandler and Shelden defending the paint together could be something amazing defensively, even if it leaves something to be desired on offense. But for the record, I'm really having a hard time forming my opinion on Shelden's NBA potential.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> Ok...
> 
> But perhaps it's also worth mentioning Shelden's 29 pts, 18 rebounds, and 4 blocks?
> .


lol exactly


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



yodurk said:


> Ok...
> 
> But perhaps it's also worth mentioning Shelden's 29 pts, 18 rebounds, and 4 blocks?
> 
> I'll admit, I've cooled on Shelden the past month, but I'm not ready to write him off. He's about the only reliable big that Duke has (although McRoberts has been coming around), and I'm having a hard time deciding if we should really blame him for those big performances against him (e.g. Hansbrough, Killingsworth, etc). I have a gut feeling that Chandler and Shelden defending the paint together could be something amazing defensively, even if it leaves something to be desired on offense. But for the record, I'm really having a hard time forming my opinion on Shelden's NBA potential.


The 29 pts, 18 boards, and 4 blocks are dynamite, but because you expect a big-man All-American candidate from the best basketball program in the nation to put up huge numbers vs. 16 seed, 132 RPI team from the SWAC, they don't reassure me at all in terms of his NBA prospects. At least not enough to offset the visual image of a guy from Southern University swallowing his shot.

Like I said, I had plenty of reservations prior to that play. If he's a horrible individual defender at the college level, it stands to reason he'll be an even worse individual defender in the pros. Despite the gaudy numbers, I don't see him as a volume rebounder or shot-blocker at the next level. I don't like his size at the 4 in the NBA, and I don't think he necessarily complements our current personnel. 

It basically boils down to this. I could see the argument for Shelden with our pick if you believe that he'll be a rock-solid Battier type at the 4. But I see him struggling even to do that much, and I think there will be much better upside plays at the end of the lottery.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I'll be PO'd if the bulls draft Shelden with the Knicks pick. If they must, they should take a steady, limited upside player with their pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



TripleDouble said:


> I'll be PO'd if the bulls draft Shelden with the Knicks pick.


who wouldn't lol


----------



## Cyanobacteria

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



JPBulls said:


> Splitter doesn´t have a buyout, if TAU decides that they want him for one more year thats nothing he can do. But next year is the last year of his contract and I think TAU will negotiate a buyout because next year he can leave for free, this year is the last chance for them do make some money with him.
> 
> If he declares without the buyout and somehow don´t go in the lottery the team that draft him will have a great steal, even if he stays in Europe one more year. He will instantly become one of the best man to man defenders in the NBA, he is arguably the best PF/C defender in Europe.


I wasn't referring to players having options for a buyout, I was referring to all foreign players under contract getting bought out by the NBA club that drafts him. Were teams really that scared of Lampe's contract situation when he slipped to the second round or did they just not want him? Maybe it's just something for TNT analysts to talk about when they (like me) don't know jack about a player except what they've read on the internet. It seems like it gets mentioned every draft, but I 've never cared enough to see if it has ever prevented anyone from coming over because the Bulls haven't drafted _that guy _ (yet?).


----------



## andras

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I was just scrolling through NBA Draftnet's mock draft and Richard Roby looks like a guy that might interest us. just watching his profile that is: http://www.nbadraft.net/profiles/richardroby.asp

I can't recall reading about him up here. can I anybody share his thoughts about this guy? thanks and keep this thread up, guys, I love it!


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



ScottMay said:


> Shelden Williams just had his shot stuffed down his gullet by a 6-7 player from someplace called Southern.
> 
> Suffice it to say, I've had significant reservations about Shelden all year long. This may have been the last straw.


Shelden is OK for a late lottery / mid first round pick 

The guy I have the most significant reservations about making it on the NBA level is J squared Redick


----------



## SPIN DOCTOR

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

*
Brandon Rush* is very intrigueing to me. I've seen quite a bit of him, but I just can't get a feel for him(that goes for all of the Kansas guys actually). As a freshman he's got an NBA body and is the best player on a team full of NBA prospects. Right now I would say the mocks are sleeping on him, he is one of the top 5 freshman(I would call it a weak class) in the country with a game that is more likely to translate in the pros than some of the guys ahead of him(Hansbrough).[/QUOTE]



Big props. this is the Brandon I want real bad! Roy will be very solid and steady, but Brandon Rush has the skill and pedigree for superstardom. Imagine the driveway games in that family? I have not heard any indication thaat he is coming out, although did'nt he declare out of high school b4 signing with Kansas?

I'm surprised he never gets mentioned, but if he's there 10-20 he could be a great value!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

he already delcared he's going back to school...


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The ROY said:


> he already delcared he's going back to school...


that means nothing. But I think he will stay, probably won't crack the lotto this year. Tournament sure didn't help. Impressive workouts and measurements could be big for him.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Hustle said:


> that means nothing. But I think he will stay, probably won't crack the lotto this year. Tournament sure didn't help. Impressive workouts and measurements could be big for him.


it means somethin to me..

until they declare..i'm not thinkin about em...

i'm not big on rush anyway...

i'm startin to think about tyrus thomas if he comes out...kid looks like kenyon and plays like kenyon and swift...well not EXACTLY but he's the same mold as them...


----------



## narek

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Sam Smith has a long piece on the draft in today's tribune:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...story,1,4451093.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines



> Who's No. 1?
> 
> Darned if anyone in the NBA knows.
> 
> 
> "This isn't like last year," said one NBA general manager, "when you knew Chris Paul was going no later than No. 5 and Deron Williams no later than No. 6. It's one of those years you don't know where anyone is going to go."
> 
> To come up with a consensus on the first round in the NBA draft, interviews with almost a dozen executives and personnel were done on the basis of confidentiality. (NBA officials are not permitted to comment on underclassmen.) They were asked to ignore whether the player would make himself eligible and assume everyone in the world is eligible.
> 
> But as NBA general managers and scouts fan out across the country to watch basketball this month, even the top talent evaluators cannot agree on who might be the top pick. There was so much indecision, in fact, that not one executive was confident to declare any player worthy of being the No. 1 pick.
> 
> "There's not one guy in this draft you can comfortably say he's going to be a great player," one general manager said.
> 
> Still, the feeling was perhaps a dozen of the top players could be solid contributors and starters on good teams almost immediately. To offer a perspective on the talent, one executive said someone like the Bulls' Luol Deng could be the No. 1 overall pick if he were still in college based on his contributions at this point.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> 2. Tyrus Thomas, LSU, 6-8, 230
> 
> Freakish athlete who can run and dunk. He'll give some team the next version of Shawn Marion.


Next Shawn Marion, sign me up!


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Shawn Marion he isn't; i'd say Stromile Swift.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



dsouljah9 said:


> Shawn Marion he isn't; i'd say Stromile Swift.


hyeah, he's nothing like shawn...i can't even value sam smith's opinion..he just doesn't seem very knowledgable imo...


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I have clearly been sleeping on Brandon Roy.

To those of you who have watched him, how good is this guy? In many mock drafts I have seen, he's the first shooting guard taken. 

Here's what I've heard about him:

He looks like a good athlete, not a great one. His primary offensive skill is taking people off the dribble. He seems to have a real knack for penetration and good finishing, if not thunderous dunks. His shooting percentage is very high, and he's improved dramatically as a 3 point shooter over his career. He doesn't turn the ball over much, and he plays smart. He has a good handle, and he's got a little combo guard in him. He's 6' 6" or 6' 5", good size for the 2 guard position. He's a solid defensive player who gives maximum effort. He's a consistent competitor. He's a four year college player, and his coach loves him. I've also heard he's had some health trouble with one of his knees that required some small surgery already. 

Might we consider taking him with the NY pick? Has he worked his way into contention for a top 5 pick? Would he be the missing link -- the perfect third guard in a rotation with Kirk and Ben?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

DMD -- 

I've seen him on a handful of occasions and he's always really impressed me. He's being downgraded because of athleticism, but I think many people have a tendency to confuse "athleticism" with "hops." The guy is plenty quick, looks to be a legit 6'6" with long arms and very good balance/strength finishing in traffic. He may not have the athletic advantage over most NBA shooting guards, but he certainly won't be at a significant disadvantage.

Offensively he is probably the most diversely skilled player in the country. He can shoot from distance, hit the pullup, postup, or take it all the way. Also, he often plays PG for Washington and is very adept at leading the fast break. 

He also seems to have a very high BBall IQ and plays with savvy on both sides beyond his years (he leans into guys to draw fouls, plays decent D even w/4 fouls, makes the right pass, etc.). 

I see some Paul Pierce in his ability to work his way to the basket despite not being a great athlete, some Jalan in his ability to handle and play point, and some Doug Christie in his defensive ability (Disclaimer: I'm not saying he'll be as good as the sum of those three players!).

My only reservations with him are his knee problems in the past (which I know nothing about) and the fact that he seems to float a little on off-the-ball defense. Also, his J seems to get released from a pretty low trajectory. Finally, I suppose there always will be a little doubt about a slasher who isn't a superb athlete, despite what PP and a couple others have accomplished.

I'd take him with the Knicks pick if big man was not such a glaring need. He'd be great with Ben and Kirk, except I could see the coaches falling in love with him and demoting Ben back to the bench, resulting in him eventually not resigning here.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I have clearly been sleeping on Brandon Roy.
> 
> To those of you who have watched him, how good is this guy? In many mock drafts I have seen, he's the first shooting guard taken.
> 
> Here's what I've heard about him:
> 
> He looks like a good athlete, not a great one. His primary offensive skill is taking people off the dribble. He seems to have a real knack for penetration and good finishing, if not thunderous dunks. His shooting percentage is very high, and he's improved dramatically as a 3 point shooter over his career. He doesn't turn the ball over much, and he plays smart. He has a good handle, and he's got a little combo guard in him. He's 6' 6" or 6' 5", good size for the 2 guard position. He's a solid defensive player who gives maximum effort. He's a consistent competitor. He's a four year college player, and his coach loves him. I've also heard he's had some health trouble with one of his knees that required some small surgery already.
> 
> Might we consider taking him with the NY pick? Has he worked his way into contention for a top 5 pick? Would he be the missing link -- the perfect third guard in a rotation with Kirk and Ben?


I'm a big Brandon Roy fan. He's not Dwyane Wade, but he's a decent enough athlete. His game is extremely well rounded and I would be shocked if he didn't at least turn out to be a pretty good pro. I think he'd fit in great as a third guard (though I don't think he'll last until our pick). Washington draws UConn next, it wouldn't surprise me at all if Roy was the best player on the court. He's the best player in the Pac 10 and it's really not even close - though I do like Aaron Aflalo, a guy nobody talks about who could be a late first round steal if he comes out.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

I've been a big Roy fan this season too, but I don't know about a top 5 pick. Is he better than Ronnie Brewer? He certainly has more of a stage to perform on, as he's still in the tournament, but it's not entirely his fault that Arkansas stinks.

But then again, in all, this isn't a terrific SG draft, so it's totally possible that a team with a need could be looking at Brandon Roy with a top 8 pick.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

More reasons to like Brandon Roy...


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



Showtyme said:


> I've been a big Roy fan this season too, but I don't know about a top 5 pick. Is he better than Ronnie Brewer? He certainly has more of a stage to perform on, as he's still in the tournament, but it's not entirely his fault that Arkansas stinks.
> 
> But then again, in all, this isn't a terrific SG draft, so it's totally possible that a team with a need could be looking at Brandon Roy with a top 8 pick.


I haven't seen enough of Brewer to say definitively. I'm not sure that Roy will go that high, but he was considered a late lottery guy pre-NCAA's, he must've moved up into the middle now. It's also worth noting that Washington is neither talented nor deep, the Sweet 16 is no small achievement for them. Losing Conroy, Robinson and Simmons has left Lorenzo Romar with a pretty short rotation.

To echo something ScottMay said a couple days ago - Rudy Gay does look scared out there at times (and Josh Boone looks downright petrified). Gay had the ball at the top of the key with about 6 to go on the shot clock at one point vs. Kentucky and you could just see that he didn't want it. He couldn't find anyone to pass to and ended up not getting a shot off in time. I was shocked that when he recognized the shot clock he didn't immediately try to create something for himself. On the plus side, he did make his FT's at the end of the game. Marcus Williams is really the engine that makes that team go. He's been fantastic and, in the immortal words of Scottie Pippen, he's got big balls.


----------



## InPaxWeTrust

*The two best fits for our two draft picks...*

Hey guys it has been awhile. Hope everyone is well. The closer we get to the end of this season and then the all important offseason I see two GREAT fits for our ball club in the draft. Ronnie Brewer and Tiago Splitter. Brewer brings the athletic defensive guard with size we so desperately need. He is a good fit as well because of his ability to play quite effectively in the backcourt with Hinrich or Gordon. Splitter is exactly the kind of big I think Pax will love and he will mesh very well with our style of play as well. That leaves with us FA where I see one of Harrington,Gooden, or Nene(in that order) and then a lower level big like Ely,Battie,etc. Songalia I also believe will be back. I see no big Pierce,Garnett type trade and frankly I am okay with that. I am fine going to war with this:

Hinrich,Duhon,Pargo
Gordon,Brewer
Deng,Nocioni
Harrington,Songalia
Chandler,Ely,Splitter


----------



## step

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*

Did you have to create another thread on the draft picks?


----------



## Pippenatorade

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*

I wish people would stop talking about "fits." We need to draft the two best players, regardless of how they "fit" the "way" we do things. I'm tired of "good fits" and good methodology. I just want good results. I honestly don't care if the player who makes us the best team after ALL factors are considered shows up looking like Pedro Cerrano with Jobu in his briefcase and tells every player, coach and fan to take a walk.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*



step said:


> Did you have to create another thread on the draft picks?


step, meet Basghetti. Basghetti, meet step.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*



step said:


> Did you have to create another thread on the draft picks?


thank u...this coulda of easily been posted in 2 or 3 other threads on the front page...


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*



The ROY said:


> thank u...this coulda of easily been posted in 2 or 3 other threads on the front page...




But it's basghetti80!


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*



Pippenatorade said:


> I wish people would stop talking about "fits." We need to draft the two best players, regardless of how they "fit" the "way" we do things. I'm tired of "good fits" and good methodology. I just want good results. I honestly don't care if the player who makes us the best team after ALL factors are considered shows up looking like Pedro Cerrano with Jobu in his briefcase and tells every player, coach and fan to EDIT.


AMEN! :clap:


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Next years draft is the year of the giants...SHEESH!

How bout swinging a deal so we have 2 1st rounders NEXT year instead?

1. Get our much needed size in the BACK COURT now...With drafting Brewer OR Roy.

2. Address the issues in the front court through free agency and that cap space that was coveted so much by the HNIC.
...I'd rather have the experience and savy a vet would bring to the front court rather than a green experiment we'd draft....By next season...Our core, which is primarily in the back court, should continue there strides to adding that knowledge of the game to make them better players overall.

Next year...Imagine 2 7 foot monsters that were undoubtly chosen because they play the right way...Yep...I have faith in Pax when draft time comes around.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*



smARTmouf said:


> But it's basghetti80!


who?


----------



## Pippenatorade

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*



LegoHat said:


> AMEN! :clap:


IMO we're just not good enough to draft based on fits. Jordan's Bulls, Detroit, San Antonio. They can draft a player like Beno Udrih whose the best "fit" and let him marinate for two years while they go to more conference finals. We need the player who brings us most quickly and for the longest term to the best RESULTS.


----------



## 4door

*Re: The two best fits for our two draft picks...*

I like brewer's length and size but his shot looks pretty bad to me. His shooting style is very bad. Spitter might be a stud but have anyone of you guys ever watched him play? I haven't so i can't really say what big man we should take. I think Shelden Williams would look really nice in a bulls uniform along with Adam Morrison, IMO.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



jbulls said:


> I haven't seen enough of Brewer to say definitively. I'm not sure that Roy will go that high, but he was considered a late lottery guy pre-NCAA's, he must've moved up into the middle now. It's also worth noting that Washington is neither talented nor deep, the Sweet 16 is no small achievement for them. Losing Conroy, Robinson and Simmons has left Lorenzo Romar with a pretty short rotation.
> 
> To echo something ScottMay said a couple days ago - Rudy Gay does look scared out there at times (and Josh Boone looks downright petrified). Gay had the ball at the top of the key with about 6 to go on the shot clock at one point vs. Kentucky and you could just see that he didn't want it. He couldn't find anyone to pass to and ended up not getting a shot off in time. I was shocked that when he recognized the shot clock he didn't immediately try to create something for himself. On the plus side, he did make his FT's at the end of the game. Marcus Williams is really the engine that makes that team go. He's been fantastic and, in the immortal words of Scottie Pippen, he's got big balls.


Good post. Washington was so dominant last year, now they've basically just got Roy and they're riding it to the Sweet 16. Freakin ruined my bracket is what they did.

I'm against taking Gay altogether. Looks like Darius Miles with a better jumper and less attitude, which actually might not be a good thing.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If some of these guys having super tournaments (O'Bryant, Hibbert, Noah) enter the draft, this draft improves by leaps and bounds.


In the top 16 (where we would have two picks) these are the guys projected:

Bargnani, Gay, Aldridge, Morrison, Noah, Roy, Splitter, Reddick, WIlliams, Collins, Brewer, Carney, O'Bryant and Armstrong. 

All of these guys (except Reddick, Carney and Morrison) would fill a hole the Bulls have and be an immediate upgrade over the current starter if it were a big man (that pains me, but I feel that way about Chandler and any of PF).

My point is, these two picks are looking more promising every game that goes by. Friday is huge - Hibbert Vs. Noah. Can't wait for this game to see them both show there wares.

Go Big men!


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

My prefered scenario:

1) Draft Tyrus Thomas. He seems to me as the most likely to be a contributing big man. I see him as a Kenyon Martin / Amare Stoudamire type of player. Would be great to have him down low.

2) Get Brandon Roy. Provides us with a sound 2-guard with size who does everything well. Could become our Ray Allen or Rip Hamilton.

Drafting these 2 guys could enable us to get players who are ready to contribute soon, and fit a need with us.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



laso said:


> My prefered scenario:
> 
> 1) Draft Tyrus Thomas. He seems to me as the most likely to be a contributing big man. I see him as a Kenyon Martin / Amare Stoudamire type of player. Would be great to have him down low.
> 
> 2) Get Brandon Roy. Provides us with a sound 2-guard with size who does everything well. Could become our Ray Allen or Rip Hamilton.
> 
> Drafting these 2 guys could enable us to get players who are ready to contribute soon, and fit a need with us.



I like both those guys alot and wouldn't be unhappy if we drafted them. However, that does mean that Tyson will become our full time Center, unless we can grab an Ely or Nazr in FA.


Also, I feel confident we will grab Harrington, Nene, or Gooden in FA. Thomas would be the back up for a year or two (which I'm fine with). 

As for Roy, I like him alot and am wondering who's minutes he'd eat in to. Gordon obviously, but how much of his minutes? If we get Roy, and he becomes the player he appears to be, does that make Gordon expendable?


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

PF rotation I'd like next year: Shelden Williams and Al Harrington. Defense AND scoring, even if it's not in the same player. And both are not terrible at the other's skill, either.

C rotation: Chandler, Schenscher/Pittsnogle, and Nazr Mohammed. Enough alternatives to make up for inconsistency, which is Chandler's biggest problem.

SF: Deng and Noch. We talk about trading each all the time, but I really want to just keep both. This is definitely our best position.

SG: Gordon and maybe Roy or Brewer?

PG: Hinrich and Duhon, good enough to be the guys for this team.

Somewhere in there I'd like a deep veteran player, like maybe Antonio Davis instead of Nazr.

If I'm going to have my way, we'd have to pick up a late 1st rounder or an early second rounder to try and get Pittsnogle, or else just stick with Schenscher. The draft would be Roy and Shelden Williams.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

blah...roy's overrated on this board

nazr just put up 30 and 14 a couple days ago..

give me that over a.davis's 38 year old a** any day of the week...


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> blah...roy's overrated on this board
> 
> nazr just put up 30 and 14 a couple days ago..
> 
> give me that over a.davis's 38 year old a** any day of the week...


I agree that Roy is overrated, and we'd be taking him too high, but rather than get caught up in who is worthy of what pick, why not just draft for needs? Taking Morrison or Aldridge and then trying to pawn him off to some other team while Roy's stock rockets after the regular season starts... that's not so easy to do.

I didn't know that about Nazr. I'm actually a big Nazr fan, but I just really like Davis' leadership and I think he was responsible for more of those 47 wins than people want to give him credit for. Of course, losing Curry hurt (it's well established by now), but losing Davis might have put us out 3-5 wins. I don't know that Nazr can do that for a young club, although if he could, I'd greatly prefer him.

The other thing, which is intriguing, is that the more seasons our young club gains experience with, the less they'll sort of need this "veteran presence".


----------



## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

how come everybody wants shelden williams so bad ? his career numbers will be 8 points per game and 8 rebound per game, those are pretty mediocre numbers for a top ten pick. a player we should consider is joakim noah.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> I didn't know that about Nazr. I'm actually a big Nazr fan, but I just really like Davis' leadership and I think he was responsible for more of those 47 wins than people want to give him credit for. Of course, losing Curry hurt (it's well established by now), but losing Davis might have put us out 3-5 wins.



I saw AD on tv the other day and he had TWO forks stuck in him. One by his NBA Career and the other was from his wife. He's done. Hire him to coach the new big men we bring in. Give him 4 minutes of anyone's time, would be another waste of space in a uni.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mr.ankle20 said:


> how come everybody wants shelden williams so bad ? his career numbers will be 8 points per game and 8 rebound per game, those are pretty mediocre numbers for a top ten pick. a player we should consider is joakim noah.


Noah will either blow up or be terrible. A lot of his NBA future will depend on how far his momentum and growth as a player will carry over into his first few years in the league. He's not raw, per se, but he's got a long way to grow. He's been growing at an incredible clip, though, and if he continues to get better at that speed, he may be the best big man coming out of this draft.

But Shelden Williams is a mature basketball player that is really quick for his size and plays active defense. He's not a terrible scorer if he was a 3rd or 4th option. Teams have been frustrating both Shelden and J.J., and ignoring much of the rest of the team's offense (except McRoberts, when he's on the floor). He won't be getting triple-teamed in the NBA, and I think he has great skills and footwork in the paint.

He does have a tendency to disappear against great opponents, as someone mentioned to me earlier, but him disappearing isn't even necessarily all that terrible. For Shelden to get those types of numbers at a place like Duke speaks very highly for him, even if it's as a role player.


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## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

the main reason I'm against getting williams its easy to find a player. If given the minutes look at chuck hayes. Remember he outplayed the bulls entire frontcourt


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Rodney Carney is....

IMPRESSIVE

wish he was an SG though....if we grabbed him...Gordon would seriously be trade bait


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Rodney Carney is....
> 
> IMPRESSIVE
> 
> wish he was an SG though....if we grabbed him...Gordon would seriously be trade bait


I think he has the lateral footspeed to play defense at the 2. He has the potential to be a perimeter lock down defender. He just needs to learn how to internally motivate himself. Out of most of the prospective draft class, I think this kid has a real shot at becoming a superstar.

He'd come in behind Gordon and also be able to play some SF if Deng or Noc have a bad game or Skiles wants to use Noc at the PF more.

I'm as high on this kid as anyone else in the draft. However, I don't think we should select him with NY's pick unless it falls down to the #5 and #6 range and Pax isn't impressed by any available bigs at that slot. I'm hoping he falls to the Bulls second pick, as there is a large quantity of size that teams might take a gamble on.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> I think he has the lateral footspeed to play defense at the 2. He has the potential to be a perimeter lock down defender. He just needs to learn how to internally motivate himself. Out of most of the prospective draft class, I think this kid has a real shot at becoming a superstar.
> 
> He'd come in behind Gordon and also be able to play some SF if Deng or Noc have a bad game or Skiles wants to use Noc at the PF more.
> 
> I'm as high on this kid as anyone else in the draft. However, I don't think we should select him with NY's pick unless it falls down to the #5 and #6 range and Pax isn't impressed by any available bigs at that slot. I'm hoping he falls to the Bulls second pick, as there is a large quantity of size that teams might take a gamble on.


yeah...i wouldn't take him with that pick either unless he DRAMATICALLY took over this tournament...

he looks the most nba ready out of most of the top 5 though...

and i'd trade gordon to get him...


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

McRoberts is a stud.

Added: ...and so is Shelden Williams.


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mr.ankle20 said:


> the main reason I'm against getting williams its easy to find a player. If given the minutes look at chuck hayes. Remember he outplayed the bulls entire frontcourt


Were you down on Carlos Boozer as well? Shelden and Boozer are about the same build and the same by-the-book playing style, with Williams being a better shot blocker than Boozer when he was at Duke.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

We NEEEEED Rodney Carney..I'm sold on this kid...he's outstanding...

he rebounds, defends, can shoot the 3, atheletic as hell, will dunk on u in a second, can post up...

he's everything Ben Gordon isn't...

why he's not a better prospect than rudy gay is BEYOND me


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> We NEEEEED Rodney Carney..I'm sold on this kid...he's outstanding...
> 
> he rebounds, defends, can shoot the 3, atheletic as hell, will dunk on u in a second, can post up...
> 
> he's everything Ben Gordon isn't...
> 
> why he's not a better prospect than rudy gay is BEYOND me


Good to have someone else on the bandwagon. It felt lonely


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> McRoberts is a stud.


I was becoming a fan of McRoberts until that last play..

he was WIDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDE open..so instead of dunking it like he'll USUALLY does on people..he went for a damn FLOATER and missed the whole basket...wow

ugly play..they coulda went up


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> Good to have someone else on the bandwagon. It felt lonely


Honestly, I"d take him over Morrison and Gay...

he has EVERYTHING they both lack...


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Honestly, I"d take him over Morrison and Gay...
> 
> he has EVERYTHING they both lack...


I would as well. I was more high on the kid than either of those two, because Carney has the ability to play the 2. That and Morrison's lack of defense doesn't really excite me either.


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Tyrus Thomas is a stud, too, but if he can't put on any more muscle he'll need to develop a perimeter game.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Tyrus Thomas is a stud, too, but if he can't put on any more muscle he'll need to develop a perimeter game.


9pts, 13rebs & 6blks

clutch free throws..he has the same energy kenyon martin has

i definintely think he'll put on the weight

damn, i'd love to have him now..but i do feel like he needs another year or two..


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm a Carney fan, too, since he's also an Indiana native, like McRoberts.


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## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Were you down on Carlos Boozer as well? Shelden and Boozer are about the same build and the same by-the-book playing style, with Williams being a better shot blocker than Boozer when he was at Duke.



boozer had some offensive moves , it seems williams get his points of off putback's baskets

williams is average player thats it . I don't hate duke players. I'm still mad we traded elton brand for tyson chandler. I think people overrate certain duke players , like williams , battier , duhon , jay will


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mr.ankle20 said:


> boozer had some offensive moves , it seems williams get his points of off putback's baskets
> 
> williams is average player thats it . I don't hate duke players. I'm still mad we traded elton brand for tyson chandler. I think people overrate certain duke players , like williams , battier , duhon , jay will


I don't care if Shelden Williams put up 50/20 on a nightly basis -- I wouldn't take him with our own pick


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Just watched Bradley vs. Memphis. 

Rodney Carney was very impressive. I'm not sure if we're in position to draft him (Knicks' pick will be too high, ours will be too low), but he's a super athlete and can seriously put points up. 

My boy Patrick O'Bryant was doing his thing defensively as usual. Dominated the boards, manned the paint...but once again, Bradley's guards were swarmed and couldn't get the guy touches offensively. All but a few of his shots were created off tips and put-backs. I'm seriously interested to see what he could do with the Bulls' solid corps of guards. 

And Shelden with another big performance of his own; I still haven't given up on this guy despite all the skepticism.


----------



## jordanwasprettygood

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> 9pts, 13rebs & 6blks
> 
> clutch free throws..he has the same energy kenyon martin has
> 
> i definintely think he'll put on the weight
> 
> damn, i'd love to have him now..but i do feel like he needs another year or two..


I was impressed by Thomas and Davis tonight...if they could somehow meld thier bodies and skill sets into one, and the Bulls drafted this Big Baby Thomas monster, we'd be set!

But seriously, hopefully the Knicks will suck alot next year and we at least consider drafting Thomas with thier pick.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> JAnd Shelden with another big performance of his own; I still haven't given up on this guy despite all the skepticism.


Shelden Williams was a total non-factor during the last five minutes of the game. He and McRoberts allowed LSU to ***-**** Duke on the offensive glass, and he couldn't convert multiple point-blank shots. 

Even if we win out our schedule to go 43-39 and end up with a #18 pick, I wouldn't draft Shelden Williams. He will do nothing to fix what ails us.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



ScottMay said:


> Even if we win out our schedule to go 43-39 and end up with a #18 pick, I wouldn't draft Shelden Williams. He will do nothing to fix what ails us.


Gotta disagree. I'd jump up and down if we can get Sheldon with our pick. That guy is going to be solid in the Pros.

p.s. Does anyone still think JJ is going to be better than Gordon in the pros?


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## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I really like Thomas. What a game.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> p.s. Does anyone still think JJ is going to be better than Gordon in the pros?


HELL no...and anybody would be a fool to think other wise...

gordon can get his shot off against anybody...if jj isn't coming off a screen, he struggles HEAVILY...


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## spongyfungy

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

well in Illinois, I couldn't watch the Duke-LSU game, they just kept it on Bradley-Memphis. Carney looks like the entire package. He can shoot, he has a turnaround jumper, he can fly.

Looks like JJ stunk it up as well.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The Texas guards are either incredibly stupid or they're just trying to rise thier stocks in the draft. LaMarcus finds a way to get open PLENTY during they game and they won't throw him a lob or NOTHING. Anybody else notice, Aldridge seems to have gained a bit more muscle since the earlier part of the season. I do like the fact that he creates space to get his shot but I hate the fact that he's a FINESSE forward instead of someone trying to bang down low. I think he'll be a hell of alot better once he gets outta texas and away from those selfish guards.

An Aldridge/Chandler frontline is thin and would get battered but I could see Aldridge putting up atleast 16ppg his rookie season. That being said, if we have the opprotunity to get him (if he declares), we gotta take him. No matter what I THOUGHT earlier this year. At best he'll be the next Bosh, at worst he'll be the next Joe Smith.

If we could draft Aldridge & trade Gordon for Carney & a 2nd Rounder, we'd have a hell of a future. I'd take Denham Brown (Uconn) or James White in the 2nd Round.

G Hinrich / Duhon
G Carney / Brown or White
F Deng / Nocioni
F Aldridge
C Chandler


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Tyrus Thomas was amazing tonight. Those pivotal back-to-back moments that sealed the deal (the dunk/block combo) were electrifying!

I think he really does need at least another year of college seasoning, but, that being said, we have two picks this year, so I want as much talent in the pool as possible. Pax will definitely need options.



> The Texas guards are either incredibly stupid or they're just trying to rise thier stocks in the draft. LaMarcus finds a way to get open PLENTY during they game and they won't throw him a lob or NOTHING. Anybody else notice, Aldridge seems to have gained a bit more muscle since the earlier part of the season.


I agree wholeheartedly. I have sagged in my interest in Aldridge, but, seeing him so far tonight, I found myself feeling the same things you are -- how could we pass this kid up if he's available when we pick? I'm seriously doubting that Pax would.

I get blown away by players like Thomas and Noah, but I bet we're more likely to go with an Aldridge or an O'Bryant.


----------



## eljam

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> 9pts, 13rebs & 6blks
> 
> clutch free throws..he has the same energy kenyon martin has
> 
> i definintely think he'll put on the weight
> 
> damn, i'd love to have him now..but i do feel like he needs another year or two..


He did put some big plays together tonight, didn't he? I knew he had some talent but he was a nice complement to Glen Davis, like what we had here with Tyson and Eddy for a while. What stood out for me was when they inbounded the ball to him and he took up the sideline, crossed over to his left at full speed and finished the play in the lane. I just thought he was a good 10 ft. and in. This at least showed that he *might* his enough athleticism to put the ball on the floor and take his man, like Bosh.

However, I agree with ROY and think he's still young and raw. Plus, we haven't been the best at developing big men.

If he comes out, I think he's top five due to Amare factor and potential alone.

Eljam 
(back to lurking...)


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I have never seen a player at the collegiate level get away with an illegal move as regularly as Adam Morrison does with his off-ball forearm to shield his drive. It's absurd.


----------



## eljam

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> Gotta disagree. I'd jump up and down if we can get Sheldon with our pick. That guy is going to be solid in the Pros.
> 
> p.s. Does anyone still think JJ is going to be better than Gordon in the pros?


Williams might be solid, but he won't be a star. We aren't a playoff team looking to fit players into roles because our talent base is so high, like Detroit. We need a stud. We're going to have a top five pick possibly. We need the biggest stud we can get. Period. Williams says solid, average pro - IMHO. You don't take that with a top five lottery pick.

The problem is, there isn't much of a guarentee with any of the top palyers being considered.

If JJ could be taken out of his game in college, what will that say about a possible pro career against bigger and better talent?


----------



## eljam

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> Good to have someone else on the bandwagon. It felt lonely


got room for another?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



dogra said:


> I agree wholeheartedly. I have sagged in my interest in Aldridge, but, seeing him so far tonight, I found myself feeling the same things you are -- how could we pass this kid up if he's available when we pick? I'm seriously doubting that Pax would.
> 
> I get blown away by players like Thomas and Noah, but I bet we're more likely to go with an Aldridge or an O'Bryant.


Aldridge had 26 & like 13rebs..11 of 15 fromt he field...

tonight he proved to me that he was SERIOUS and that we need him...he looked like a men amongst boys out there

The papers said Pax already had him as his number 1 choice..hopefully it stays that way

I can't see him staying there for another year with those texas guards


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> boys out there
> 
> The papers said Pax already had him as his number 1 choice..hopefully it stays that way


Where did you read that?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Where did you read that?


well, they didn't say PAX said he was his number one choice

they just said lamarcus would be the top choice for paxson...and that he had his eye on him....i mean they coulda taken a wild guess

it was in a few articles earlier this year...


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Damn tough loss for Gonzaga.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

All those who advertise Morrison as a prototypical cold-blooded winner might reconsider after Morrison started to cry with 1.8 seconds left to play down by 1.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> All those who advertise Morrison as a prototypical cold-blooded winner might reconsider after Morrison started to cry with 1.8 seconds left to play down by 1.


yeah, that wasn't a good look for him. LOL you're supposed to cry after the game, not when u still have a chance lol.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Two great finishes. What a double header.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I was sitting here looking at the lotto list..and out of the top 5 teams, we'd really only have to battle atlanta for aldridge

bobcats don't need him, will likely go after morrison or gay
portland doesn't need him, will likely go after morrison or gay, randy foye or roy
hawks do need him since i supposed marvin williams is their future sf and harrington will walk
toronto doesn't need him, i suppose they'll ago after morrison or gay or carney, randy foy or roy

we'd likely lock him up anywhere in the top 5 as long as we pick before atl...

shame, if okafor was playing this season, ny would have the worst record by far


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



eljam said:


> Williams might be solid, but he won't be a star. We aren't a playoff team looking to fit players into roles because our talent base is so high, like Detroit. We need a stud. We're going to have a top five pick possibly. We need the biggest stud we can get. Period. Williams says solid, average pro - IMHO. You don't take that with a top five lottery pick.


I basically agree. I said I would take him with our pick, not the Knicks pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

LOL read some of these outrageous comments by NBA SCOUT Arnie Nimoty...he thinks this draft is trash :

http://www2.kusports.com/news/2006/mar/23/best_whos_left/?ncaa_2006

He says Lamarcus will only succed in the league if he goes to a running team like sac, dallas or phoenix..

He says Josh McRoberts will be the best player in this draft years down the line

He says Tyrus Thomas is only a first rounder cuz this year's draft class is weak

He doesn't think Rodney Carney is special at all and wonder's what's so GOOD about him?


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> yeah, that wasn't a good look for him. LOL you're supposed to cry after the game, not when u still have a chance lol.


I'm gonna defend Adam "Jim" Morrison as much as I can because I'm very biased towards him. Him on the verge of tears was shocking since the game wasn't yet over, but it's a sign of his competitiveness. I remember when Kobe was bawling after the Lakers were eliminated in the second round against the Spurs, and most of us know how competitive he is.

Okay; so Morrison is weak on defense. Wasn't that Carmelo's weakness when he was drafted? Is that not still Carmelo's weakness in his game? Supposed chemistry issues aside, would you not want Carmelo on your team if you could?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> I'm gonna defend Adam "Jim" Morrison as much as I can because I'm very biased towards him. Him on the verge of tears was shocking since the game wasn't yet over, but it's a sign of his competitiveness. I remember when Kobe was bawling after the Lakers were eliminated in the second round against the Spurs, and most of us know how competitive he is.
> 
> Okay; so Morrison is weak on defense. Wasn't that Carmelo's weakness when he was drafted? Is that not still Carmelo's weakness in his game? Supposed chemistry issues aside, would you not want Carmelo on your team if you could?


I like Morrison man, no need to defend him.

I just want Aldridge....


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> LOL read some of these outrageous comments by NBA SCOUT Arnie Nimoty...he thinks this draft is trash :
> 
> http://www2.kusports.com/news/2006/mar/23/best_whos_left/?ncaa_2006
> 
> He says Lamarcus will only succed in the league if he goes to a running team like sac, dallas or phoenix..
> 
> He says Josh McRoberts will be the best player in this draft years down the line
> 
> He says Tyrus Thomas is only a first rounder cuz this year's draft class is weak
> 
> He doesn't think Rodney Carney is special at all and wonder's what's so GOOD about him?


Thanks for the link. The guy sounds a bit grumpy. He does like O'Bryant though.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Him on the verge of tears was shocking since the game wasn't yet over, but it's a sign of his competitiveness. I remember when Kobe was bawling *after* the Lakers were eliminated in the second round against the Spurs, and most of us know how competitive he is.


I think the word "after" is key. I have never seen a player breakdown while a game was still in reach.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

What a great night of basketball. 

My 2 cents on different guys FWIW:

Adam Morisson: Don't cry with a chance to tie or win the game. His offensive game is predicated on him getting star treatment (no offensive calls against him). Numerous elbows. His defense continues to suck and at times he was just chucking up shots. No thanks. He just doesn't give us anything we are desperate for. He's not so special we couldn't pass on him.

LaMarcus Aldridge - Texas has the worst guard tandem in college. All night he was beating his man down the court and open for easy buckets only to be ignored. He was 8 for 8 in the first half and was playing tough d and providing help as well. I would be as happy with guy as anyone else mentioned. He brings a very well rounded game. He's not a sexy pick, but he is very fundamentally sound and who knows what he could do if he had unselfish guards.

Tyrus Thomas - Guy is a defensive machine. Offensively, he's still a few years away. Unfortunately, he really could use another year or two of college development. If he did that, he's top 3, if not number 1.

Patrick O'Bryant - Good potential. Hard to judge since his teammates couldn't get him the ball against alot of tough teams. Would be a good pick if he fell to our pick.


JJ Reddick - Dude's game was majorly exposed. Atleast he didn't cry like a Baby at the end of their game like another national college player of the year candidate. He's Steve Kerr version 2006. He needs screen after screen to get open, not great at creating his own shot. Tries on D, but is Ben Gordonesque on defense.

Sheldon Williams -ALways puts up good numbers, is a tireless worker. Good positiioning and he would be a great pick after 12. Won't be a star, but will be dirty work guy.


In the end -

for tonight - Give me Aldridge.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Aldridge was a stud tonight, though against a very perimeter-oriented team like West Virginia, it should have been expected. 

I think my Bulls draft board is looking like this (for the Knicks pick): Aldridge, Morrison, Bargnani, McRoberts, Gay, Thomas.

I said that Thomas would have to develop a perimeter game if he couldn't gain any more weight. I guess I would give him the benefit of the doubt, since Bosh came out weighing 210 pounds, but I still think Thomas will need to establish a good midrange jumper. I wouldn't give Thomas the Amare factor, though. Amare was already a chiseled 245 pounds with an aggressive nature to boot.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> shame, if okafor was playing this season, ny would have the worst record by far


Sadly I see this as true, if it weren't for all their injuries, Charlotte would be miles ahead of where they are now.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> Adam Morisson: Don't cry with a chance to tie or win the game. His offensive game is predicated on him getting star treatment (no offensive calls against him). Numerous elbows. His defense continues to suck and at times he was just chucking up shots. No thanks. He just doesn't give us anything we are desperate for. He's not so special we couldn't pass on him.


Is star treatment not another thing we are looking for? How many questionable calls go the Bulls' way? Morrison will get some star treatment his rookie year because he'll be a marketing magnet the minute he steps on an NBA court, perhaps as much as Lebron and Carmelo had their rookie seasons.


----------



## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think we have some good big men to choose from. Aldridge has to be the guy we pursue with our top pick. Morrison and Gay don't do us any good with Deng and Nocioni holding the wings pretty well. 

I'm honestly impressed with Aldridge, Williams and O'Bryant. If we could walk away with Aldridge and one of Williams/O'Bryant, I'd be extremely pleased. I have a feeling that Williams and O'Bryant will both end up in the top 10 though, closer to being top 5. Probably in the 5-7 range. Aldridge will obviously be top 5. 

Redick is not even on the radar as far as I'm concerned. Redick makes Ben Gordon look like Scottie Pippen in terms of versatility and athleticism, plus I would wager that Gordon is on the same level as a shooter.


----------



## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Is star treatment not another thing we are looking for? How many questionable calls go the Bulls' way? Morrison will get some star treatment his rookie year because he'll be a marketing magnet the minute he steps on an NBA court, perhaps as much as Lebron and Carmelo had their rookie seasons.


Morrison is closer to Wally Z than Melo, which is to say not even on the same planet with LeBron. You have to be a star to get star treatment, and not a college star. An NBA star. I'm not speaking of his game or how well it will translate, but he isn't going to get the benefit from officials unless he is really really good.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm not saying this because I'm disappointed by Gonzaga losing, but after watching Jordan Farmar in the press conference he looks like Prince's (the musician's) nephew.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Us taking Morrison would remind me of The Clippers MESSING up the draft for everyone else..

it seemed like they used to just do for the heck of it...

Aldridge is our pick in the top 3...by far...

we need a big 2guard...atheleticism and BIGS...

I don't see exactly how adam morrison fits into the picture


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> LOL read some of these outrageous comments by NBA SCOUT Arnie Nimoty...he thinks this draft is trash :
> 
> http://www2.kusports.com/news/2006/mar/23/best_whos_left/?ncaa_2006
> 
> He says Lamarcus will only succed in the league if he goes to a running team like sac, dallas or phoenix..
> 
> He says Josh McRoberts will be the best player in this draft years down the line
> 
> He says Tyrus Thomas is only a first rounder cuz this year's draft class is weak
> 
> He doesn't think Rodney Carney is special at all and wonder's what's so GOOD about him?


Odd article. He has JP Batista on the list, but no Brandon Roy...


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Is star treatment not another thing we are looking for? How many questionable calls go the Bulls' way? Morrison will get some star treatment his rookie year because he'll be a marketing magnet the minute he steps on an NBA court, perhaps as much as Lebron and Carmelo had their rookie seasons.



yeah, that was true about Jwill and Ben Gordon and Kirk Hinrich.........Oh wait no it wasn't. You don't get treated like a star till you earn it or are hyped as the heir apparent to Michael Jordan in High School. You have to have a Posse and you can't ever be seen crying. OK, Morrison's probably got a posse but the guys at the 70 Porn star like conventioni don't count in the NBA. J/K

I posted this in another thread, but it fits here moreso:

Aldridge is what we need out of a post player. He brings a skill set that no one on our roster comes close to (unfortuantely). He would likely be a starter from day one. His ability is also yet to be realized since the texas guards are so bad and selfish. He's already everything Chandler should be but isn't. Outside of being a shot blocker, he's a better player than Chandler now.

Morrison is a very good shooter and has a fire you love to see in a guy. But again, does he really bring what we are lacking? Does he bring such a complete game that we would move an existing starter and be able to win with the current holes? I keep answering no. He a good, not great player. I'm sorry, but I've watch 6 or 7 of his games this season and he is given the benefit of calls that he's not gonna get in the NBA (just ask Kirk Hinrich). Also, his defense really is poor. Ask Ben Gordon what happens - doesn't matter how good your offense is, you give up too many points on the other end and get your frontcourt in foul trouble. Can Morrison be a all-star caliber player - maybe, if he's only judged on offense. Would he be an NBA top 100 all-time player - No. I don't see anyone in this draft of that caliber. So if there are a number of guys close in talent and impact range, gotta fill a need. Getting Morrison causes us to have to move Deng and he's our best player and a much better two way player than Morrison. Yeah, we might be able to bulk up Deng and get him minutes at the PF spot, but ask Kirk Hinrich how well that works in the long run.

Also, I think Carney would be a better pick than Morrison. Carney has NBA player written all over him. Guy plays tough on both ends and is a leader. Has an NBA body and can play a position of need for us. 

For me, Top 8 right now it's:

Aldridge, Bargnani, Carney, Gay, Thomas (though he would benefit from 2 more years in college), Noah, Roy, Morrison


Again, Morrison may be better than Roy, but not that much better and Roy + Deng is better than Morrison + Deng trade (of course depending on what we got back - but I'd keep Deng over Morrison).


----------



## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I wouldn't pin it all on the Texas guards. It's hard for college big men to thrive period, because the game is played from the college three point line in, and zone is legal. That gives big men almost no space to operate. 

College big men who are good enough to make the NBA, tend to be better players in the NBA simply because guys can shoot all the way out to 25 feet, and zone isn't allowed fully so you can't just sag two guys on a dominant big men and cover the rest of the court with three guys and get away with it because they play within a smaller space (it's easier to recover to a player spotted up at the college three point line than the pro three point line). That makes a huge difference, three feet all around. 

It's also why athletic guys who thrive on getting to the rim end up being better in the NBA too, because the lane isn't as congested. 

Good post Chifaninca, Aldridge is the guy for us.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm less high on Aldridge than some around here, but the more I've seen of Morrison the more I'm convinced that he's going to be a serious defensive liability. IMO, Morrison's going to have a really tough time hanging with most NBA 3's, and that's the only position I can see him even trying to defend. Skiles loves Peja though - so maybe he won't mind. If Morrison is truly special at the offensive end this is fine, but is he? I'm not totally sure.

It's a given that we're going to have two picks in the first half of the first round, and it seems to be a given that we'll be drafting a 4/5 and a 2 (unless of course, Paxson feels that a 3 or 1 could be genuinely special, in which case I'm all for drafting talent over need). Given that I think Tyrus Thomas and Brandon Roy might be my guys at this point. Hmm.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> The Texas guards are either incredibly stupid or they're just trying to rise thier stocks in the draft. LaMarcus finds a way to get open PLENTY during they game and they won't throw him a lob or NOTHING. Anybody else notice, Aldridge seems to have gained a bit more muscle since the earlier part of the season. I do like the fact that he creates space to get his shot but I hate the fact that he's a FINESSE forward instead of someone trying to bang down low. I think he'll be a hell of alot better once he gets outta texas and away from those selfish guards.
> 
> An Aldridge/Chandler frontline is thin and would get battered but I could see Aldridge putting up atleast 16ppg his rookie season. That being said, if we have the opprotunity to get him (if he declares), we gotta take him. No matter what I THOUGHT earlier this year. At best he'll be the next Bosh, at worst he'll be the next Joe Smith.
> 
> If we could draft Aldridge & trade Gordon for Carney & a 2nd Rounder, we'd have a hell of a future. I'd take Denham Brown (Uconn) or James White in the 2nd Round.
> 
> G Hinrich / Duhon
> G Carney / Brown or White
> F Deng / Nocioni
> F Aldridge
> C Chandler



EASILY

Now...for your sudden love for Carney...I haven't seen what I needed to see yet.


STILL...I think James White > Carney........I really wanna like the kid though...Just not sold yet.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> With the lottery weak, teams might want to fall back to get an extra pick. One mid-lottery selection the Knicks have interest in is LSU's 6-9 athletic shot-blocking forward Tyrus Thomas, who faced Duke last night in the Sweet 16. In fact, Brown has told confidants he thinks Thomas should be considered for the No. 1 pick, though most scouts see the freshman as *mid-to-late-lottery choice*.Brown is on record saying he'd rather have Eddy Curry than either of the *top players mentioned for No. 1, Adam Morrison or J.J. Redick.*


NY Post


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Sir Patchwork said:


> I wouldn't pin it all on the Texas guards. It's hard for college big men to thrive period, because the game is played from the college three point line in, and zone is legal. That gives big men almost no space to operate.
> 
> College big men who are good enough to make the NBA, tend to be better players in the NBA simply because guys can shoot all the way out to 25 feet, and zone isn't allowed fully so you can't just sag two guys on a dominant big men and cover the rest of the court with three guys and get away with it because they play within a smaller space (it's easier to recover to a player spotted up at the college three point line than the pro three point line). That makes a huge difference, three feet all around.
> 
> It's also why athletic guys who thrive on getting to the rim end up being better in the NBA too, because the lane isn't as congested.
> 
> Good post Chifaninca, Aldridge is the guy for us.


Good points...case in point, look at Channing Frye right now. He's worlds better in the NBA than anyone thought he would be.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> EASILY
> 
> Now...for your sudden love for Carney...I haven't seen what I needed to see yet.
> 
> 
> STILL...I think James White > Carney........I really wanna like the kid though...Just not sold yet.


did u not watch him yesterday???

he played like TODAY's version of vince carter, posting his man, shooting the three, slashing when he needs to with a dunk here and there...dude is sick...I like James White too, but not over Carney....

I got sold on Aldridge & Carney yesterday


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> NY Post


LOL @ NY hoping those players fall anywhere NEAR that low


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> yeah, that was true about Jwill and Ben Gordon and Kirk Hinrich.........Oh wait no it wasn't. You don't get treated like a star till you earn it or are hyped as the heir apparent to Michael Jordan in High School. You have to have a Posse and you can't ever be seen crying. OK, Morrison's probably got a posse but the guys at the 70 Porn star like conventioni don't count in the NBA. J/K
> 
> I posted this in another thread, but it fits here moreso:
> 
> Aldridge is what we need out of a post player. He brings a skill set that no one on our roster comes close to (unfortuantely). He would likely be a starter from day one. His ability is also yet to be realized since the texas guards are so bad and selfish. He's already everything Chandler should be but isn't. Outside of being a shot blocker, he's a better player than Chandler now.
> 
> Morrison is a very good shooter and has a fire you love to see in a guy. But again, does he really bring what we are lacking? Does he bring such a complete game that we would move an existing starter and be able to win with the current holes? I keep answering no. He a good, not great player. I'm sorry, but I've watch 6 or 7 of his games this season and he is given the benefit of calls that he's not gonna get in the NBA (just ask Kirk Hinrich). Also, his defense really is poor. Ask Ben Gordon what happens - doesn't matter how good your offense is, you give up too many points on the other end and get your frontcourt in foul trouble. Can Morrison be a all-star caliber player - maybe, if he's only judged on offense. Would he be an NBA top 100 all-time player - No. I don't see anyone in this draft of that caliber. So if there are a number of guys close in talent and impact range, gotta fill a need. Getting Morrison causes us to have to move Deng and he's our best player and a much better two way player than Morrison. Yeah, we might be able to bulk up Deng and get him minutes at the PF spot, but ask Kirk Hinrich how well that works in the long run.
> 
> Also, I think Carney would be a better pick than Morrison. Carney has NBA player written all over him. Guy plays tough on both ends and is a leader. Has an NBA body and can play a position of need for us.
> 
> For me, Top 8 right now it's:
> 
> Aldridge, Bargnani, Carney, Gay, Thomas (though he would benefit from 2 more years in college), Noah, Roy, Morrison
> 
> 
> Again, Morrison may be better than Roy, but not that much better and Roy + Deng is better than Morrison + Deng trade (of course depending on what we got back - but I'd keep Deng over Morrison).



My Bulls draft board looks like the following at the moment:

Aldridge
Bargnani (I haven't seen a lot of the guy so I'll have to trust Pax on this one)
Noah
Splitter (if not worried about contract issues)
Carney
Thomas
O'Bryant
Gay
Morrison
Armstrong
Glen Davis
Williams
McRoberts
Brewer
Roby
Roy
Fernandez
Reddick
Collins

Assuming we get a big with our first pick move Brewer, Roby, and Roy up a bit on the depth chart. Although I wouldn't be entirely unhappy drafting two bigs.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1237

Here's draft Express's daily STOCKUP/STOCKDOWN college players.

My top 5 with the NY pick would have to be :

1. Aldridge
2. Carney
3. Bargnani
4. Noah
5. Tyrus Thomas


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> Good points...case in point, look at Channing Frye right now. He's worlds better in the NBA than anyone thought he would be.



I actually read someone say yesterday that he'll have no more impact leaguewide than Juwan Howard...you know...solid.

Know why he faded? Teams took his jumper away and he didn't have anything left to play with.


----------



## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Us taking Morrison would remind me of The Clippers MESSING up the draft for everyone else..
> 
> it seemed like they used to just do for the heck of it...
> 
> Aldridge is our pick in the top 3...by far...
> 
> we need a big 2guard...atheleticism and BIGS...
> 
> I don't see exactly how adam morrison fits into the picture



Morrison could be a best player availble , I think in time it would be a better player than luol .
I hope the bulls learn their mistakes from the past , see the 2002 draft


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mr.ankle20 said:


> Morrison could be a best player availble , I think in time it would be a better player than luol .
> I hope the bulls learn their mistakes from the past , see the 2002 draft


Jay Williams was the consensus #2 pick in that draft.

Heck, we should have drafted Amare, Prince, or Boozer with that #2 pick. In fact, we should have realized that Jay would have gotten on a motorcycle come draft time and drafted anybody else. Hindsight is always 20/20.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> yeah, that was true about Jwill and Ben Gordon and Kirk Hinrich.........Oh wait no it wasn't. You don't get treated like a star till you earn it or are hyped as the heir apparent to Michael Jordan in High School. You have to have a Posse and you can't ever be seen crying. OK, Morrison's probably got a posse but the guys at the 70 Porn star like conventioni don't count in the NBA. J/K
> 
> I posted this in another thread, but it fits here moreso:
> 
> Aldridge is what we need out of a post player. He brings a skill set that no one on our roster comes close to (unfortuantely). He would likely be a starter from day one. His ability is also yet to be realized since the texas guards are so bad and selfish. He's already everything Chandler should be but isn't. Outside of being a shot blocker, he's a better player than Chandler now.
> 
> Morrison is a very good shooter and has a fire you love to see in a guy. But again, does he really bring what we are lacking? *Does he bring such a complete game that we would move an existing starter and be able to win with the current holes? I keep answering no. He a good, not great player. I'm sorry, but I've watch 6 or 7 of his games this season and he is given the benefit of calls that he's not gonna get in the NBA (just ask Kirk Hinrich). Also, his defense really is poor. Ask Ben Gordon what happens - doesn't matter how good your offense is, you give up too many points on the other end and get your frontcourt in foul trouble. Can Morrison be a all-star caliber player - maybe, if he's only judged on offense. *Would he be an NBA top 100 all-time player - No. I don't see anyone in this draft of that caliber. So if there are a number of guys close in talent and impact range, gotta fill a need. Getting Morrison causes us to have to move Deng and he's our best player and a much better two way player than Morrison. Yeah, we might be able to bulk up Deng and get him minutes at the PF spot, but ask Kirk Hinrich how well that works in the long run.
> 
> Also, I think Carney would be a better pick than Morrison. Carney has NBA player written all over him. Guy plays tough on both ends and is a leader. Has an NBA body and can play a position of need for us.
> 
> For me, Top 8 right now it's:
> 
> Aldridge, Bargnani, Carney, Gay, Thomas (though he would benefit from 2 more years in college), Noah, Roy, Morrison
> 
> 
> Again, Morrison may be better than Roy, but not that much better and Roy + Deng is better than Morrison + Deng trade (of course depending on what we got back - but I'd keep Deng over Morrison).





nice post chifan. i hope pax stays the hell away from morrison. i just don't think he fills our needs (nor would he be the best available, frankly). we don't need another one dimensional player. we need balance. we need a frontcourt stud!

give me aldridge!

(i loved what i saw out of thomas last night, but agree he could use another year in school.)

and at least JJ Redick waited to start crying until he was taken out of the game!












so wrong, on so many levels.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mr.ankle20 said:


> Morrison could be a best player availble , I think in time it would be a better player than luol .
> I hope the bulls learn their mistakes from the past , see the 2002 draft


I don't...taking Morrison would be our BIGGEST mistake...I'm a big fan of his but I don't think he'll be the best player in the draft a few years down the line....On top of the fact that he has Diabetes, I don't think Pax will risk that.

there's NO reason why Deng can't be our SF for the next 10 years. He has EVERYTHING u want in a SF and he's only 20 and getting better. Fill another hole, don't replace something good already.


----------



## Showtyme

*Big Men*

I think this draft is underrated in terms of big men. People see the star power of Morrison, Gay, Redick, Foye, Carney, Roy, Brewer... and don't get me wrong, there IS a lot of potential superstar power there... but the bigs that fill in the gaps are plentiful and appear to be really good.

Aldridge looks extremely solid, Bargnani looks like one of the safer bets in international players of recent memory, Josh McRoberts might throw his name in this year and he looks like he's got a ton of potential, Tyrus Thomas is a defensive maniac and does look like the next K-Mart, people are loving Patrick O'Bryant, Shelden Williams is around, Tiago Splitter is someone no one should be sleeping on, Hilton Armstrong and Josh Boone are going to be serviceable big men, and the list goes on. Glen Davis, Kevin Pittsnogle, Nick Fazekas, Paul Davis, Taj Gray.... gosh. If Tyler Hansborough throws his name in, it'll be nuts.

Star power:
Aldridge
Bargnani
McRoberts
Tyrus Thomas

Extremely solid starters:
O'Bryant
Shelden
Splitter
Armstrong

Assets in the rotation:
Pittsnogle
Boone
Paul Davis
Glen Davis

I'd actually say that this draft is LOADED with big men, and a good percentage of them will probably be contributors in the League.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Big Men*



Showtyme said:


> I think this draft is underrated in terms of big men. People see the star power of Morrison, Gay, Redick, Foye, Carney, Roy, Brewer... and don't get me wrong, there IS a lot of potential superstar power there... but the bigs that fill in the gaps are plentiful and appear to be really good.
> 
> Aldridge looks extremely solid, Bargnani looks like one of the safer bets in international players of recent memory, Josh McRoberts might throw his name in this year and he looks like he's got a ton of potential, Tyrus Thomas is a defensive maniac and does look like the next K-Mart, people are loving Patrick O'Bryant, Shelden Williams is around, Tiago Splitter is someone no one should be sleeping on, Hilton Armstrong and Josh Boone are going to be serviceable big men, and the list goes on. Glen Davis, Kevin Pittsnogle, Nick Fazekas, Paul Davis, Taj Gray.... gosh. If Tyler Hansborough throws his name in, it'll be nuts.
> 
> Star power:
> Aldridge
> Bargnani
> McRoberts
> Tyrus Thomas
> 
> Extremely solid starters:
> O'Bryant
> Shelden
> Splitter
> Armstrong
> 
> Assets in the rotation:
> Pittsnogle
> Boone
> Paul Davis
> Glen Davis
> 
> I'd actually say that this draft is LOADED with big men, and a good percentage of them will probably be contributors in the League.



I like McRoberts on a collegiate level, I just don't see him being a great pro. His lack of footspeed is what concerns me most. That was evident last night when he air balled what should have been a wide open dunk because he was worried about the help defense rotating over and layed the ball up instead. I see his upside as a Troy Murphy type player, but nothing really more.

If he declares, I would add Noah to the star power category above Thomas. I would also move Splitter to the top of the extremely solid starter, with McRoberts being about equal to both O'Bryant and Williams. Big Baby belongs in the solid starter category most likely as well.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



Rhyder said:


> That was evident last night when he air balled what should have been a wide open dunk because he was worried about the help defense rotating over and layed the ball up instead. QUOTE]
> 
> That was by far the UGLIEST PLAY OF THE NIGHT


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Big Men*



Showtyme said:


> I think this draft is underrated in terms of big men. People see the star power of Morrison, Gay, Redick, Foye, Carney, Roy, Brewer... and don't get me wrong, there IS a lot of potential superstar power there... but the bigs that fill in the gaps are plentiful and appear to be really good.
> 
> Aldridge looks extremely solid, Bargnani looks like one of the safer bets in international players of recent memory, Josh McRoberts might throw his name in this year and he looks like he's got a ton of potential, Tyrus Thomas is a defensive maniac and does look like the next K-Mart, people are loving Patrick O'Bryant, Shelden Williams is around, Tiago Splitter is someone no one should be sleeping on, Hilton Armstrong and Josh Boone are going to be serviceable big men, and the list goes on. Glen Davis, Kevin Pittsnogle, Nick Fazekas, Paul Davis, Taj Gray.... gosh. If Tyler Hansborough throws his name in, it'll be nuts.
> 
> Star power:
> Aldridge
> Bargnani
> McRoberts
> Tyrus Thomas
> 
> Extremely solid starters:
> O'Bryant
> Shelden
> Splitter
> Armstrong
> 
> Assets in the rotation:
> Pittsnogle
> Boone
> Paul Davis
> Glen Davis
> 
> I'd actually say that this draft is LOADED with big men, and a good percentage of them will probably be contributors in the League.



I don't think Armstrong belongs with your second group. I think O'Bryant belongs in the first group. I also think Aldridge is unique because I don't think there is too much downside with him. I have a hard time imagining him not being a solid starter.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Big Men*



TripleDouble said:


> I don't think Armstrong belongs with your second group. I think O'Bryant belongs in the first group. I also think Aldridge is unique because I don't think there is too much downside with him. I have a hard time imagining him not being a solid starter.


I think O'Bryant is overrated on this board. Bradley showed their stuff on his shoulders in the tournament, which is when it counts and when everyone is watching, but I've seen Aaron Gray come up with huge nights for Pitt, and he was doing it for a better team. Of course, Pitt lost to Bradley, so that doesn't help, but I just don't think he's really all that people are cracking him up to be. I think he's got crazy talent and is a late bloomer, and I think that another year in college will help him reach his full potential and give scouts a better taste of what he can do, but I haven't seen enough of his consistent performances to put him in the "star" category. 13 and 8 with 3 blocks in the MVC don't tell the whole story, I know, but they do tell SOME kind of story.

Armstrong, I think, highly impressed me throughout the season. He peppers his statline with 8 blocks, 9 blocks regularly and has done more for the defense of the Huskies than Josh Boone. He's an offensive liability but I think he could very much become a Sam Dalembert type player.


----------



## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Big Men*

Luol Deng would be a junior this year if he stayed in college. Adam Morrison is a junior. I think Deng is better than Morrison, and always will be, and has more upside. 

We need big men. We're so set at the wings. 

I like Aldridge, Williams and O'Bryant. The kicker with O'Bryant is that he is a center. Aldridge is more of a combo who can play both but probably best at power forward. Williams is undoubtedly a power forward exclusively. If we could grab Aldridge and O'Bryant, we'd have done really well, in my opinion. Infact, if we can get two of those three with Aldridge being one of the two, I'd be happy.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Big Men*

Aldridge seems to provide the most of what we might need: a back-to-the basket scoring machine. However, I think it's up to debate on what the Bulls need more. Do the Bulls desperately need a potential star inside presence or just a decent one? Do the Bulls need a go-to scorer more than a great inside presence? 

The Bulls are actually third in the NBA in rebounds per game and lead the NBA in opponent's FG%. The real difference-maker is the huge discrepancy in free-throw attempts per game, with the Bulls attempting 7.1 less free throws than their opponents. Guess what? Adam Morrison is second in the entire Division I NCAA in free throw attempts per game at 9.4. Not only is he the focal point of every opponent's defense (facing double and triple-teams that fellow lottery players like Rudy Gay, LaMarcus Aldridge, and Rodney Carney never have to deal with because of the talent levels of their other four teammates on the floor), but he managed to lead the entire NCAA in scoring despite that and still score big against major conference opponents. Imagine him being on the floor with capable scorers like Ben, Kirk, Luol, and (insert future PF/C here). Do you think he'll be double and triple-teamed in the NBA? And with that, he will have the energy to bring defensive effort in the NBA because he will no longer be facing double and triple-teams. There is a place for Adam Morrison on the Bulls. He wears his passion for the game on his sleeve and Skiles will admire him for that.

Like I said, it's just a matter of what's more important: inside presence or scoring capability. It's either Aldridge or Morrison for me.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



Showtyme said:


> I think O'Bryant is overrated on this board.


I like him too..but this is very true...


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Big Men*



Sir Patchwork said:


> Luol Deng would be a junior this year if he stayed in college. Adam Morrison is a junior. I think Deng is better than Morrison, and always will be, and has more upside.


Kevin Garnett and Tim Duncan are less than a month apart in age. Garnett went to the NBA straight out of high school. Duncan spent four years in college before going to the NBA. Garnett has no championships. Duncan has three championships. 

Don't get me wrong; I still think Deng is the best all-around player on the Bulls along with Hinrich. If the Bulls do get Morrison I don't think it would be necessary to move Deng at all. My point is that players develop at different times in their lives. Some players peak early and decline early; Penny Hardaway and Antonio McDyess come to mind. Some players peak late: Hakeem Olajuwon and Steve Nash come to mind. Garnett and Duncan are both great, great players, and if Garnett and Duncan switched places the Spurs may still have been champions.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Big Men*

Not that I would want the Bulls to purposely tank, but a #9 draft slot is looking to be a heck of a lot better than #12 or #14.

Might be time to feed Chandler in the post and let him work on his hook shot and see if Gordon can run PG with Deng as a SG. If it works, cool and good to know. And if it doesn't, it doesn't.


----------



## GB

*Re: Big Men*



> After talking with several NBA scouts, ESPN.com draft guru Chad Ford projects Noah to be the No. 4 pick, 6-foot-9 center Al Horford No. 14 and 6-foot-8 small forward Corey Brewer No. 16. A first-round selection guarantees a player a three-year contract worth millions.
> --
> A little-used reserve during the 2005 post-season, Noah appeared on the cover of this week's Sports Illustrated. In the magazine, one scout proclaimed Noah, who had 33 points, 15 rebounds, 13 assists and nine blocks in two NCAA Tournament wins, to be a top-three pick.
> 
> "There's nothing like a couple of good games when everyone's watching," said another NBA source, who requested anonymity. "Right now you're at the eye of the storm with him.
> 
> "People rise, people fall, things happen. But with a guy who's 6-11, with his athletic ability, you can take it to the bank."


http://www.palmbeachpost.com/sports/content/sports/epaper/2006/03/24/a1b_uf_0324.html


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Big Men*

I barely got any of the Bradley Memphis game, but from what I saw, I WANT CARNEY!

It was a play that was broken, and a foul called. But he crossed someone over, did a spin move, and went up to dunk it hard, but got fouled. The guy is explosive, quick as hell, and aggressive. I saw what I like, and he can shoot decent. Not great, but not bad. Few players can shoot lights out anyway.

O'Bryant didn't have a great game. I do not like his frame. I think he needs to add a lot of bulk. He also doesn't seem WIDE as a big man.

Aldridge prolly has the best arsenal of moves. I am confused on who we take with the first pick. I really think we got to move up and take Carney. I think he has the speed to be a big 2 guard. I am very sold on him. He is a senior, has experience, and is very talented.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



theanimal23 said:


> I barely got any of the Bradley Memphis game, but from what I saw, I WANT CARNEY!
> 
> It was a play that was broken, and a foul called. But he crossed someone over, did a spin move, and went up to dunk it hard, but got fouled. The guy is explosive, quick as hell, and aggressive. I saw what I like, and he can shoot decent. Not great, but not bad. Few players can shoot lights out anyway.
> 
> O'Bryant didn't have a great game. I do not like his frame. I think he needs to add a lot of bulk. He also doesn't seem WIDE as a big man.
> 
> Aldridge prolly has the best arsenal of moves. I am confused on who we take with the first pick. I really think we got to move up and take Carney. I think he has the speed to be a big 2 guard. I am very sold on him. He is a senior, has experience, and is very talented.


The only way we should take carney is if lamarcus doesn't declare...i love rodney but u can't take that over aldridge...we need a scoring big in the worst way


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> The only way we should take carney is if lamarcus doesn't declare...i love rodney but u can't take that over aldridge...we need a scoring big in the worst way


Aldridge is probably the safe pick. I think its who we should choose. I don't see any of the other big men becoming superstars, but solid guys. I don't know if O'Bryant comes out, but he is who I get w/our second pick. I think he would be alright, but with Aldridge, I really see a 2nd Chris Bosh (minus the 3 pt shooting).

My draft, 1. Aldridge 2. Carney

Sad thing is, I feel Carney will go up to a top 5 pick after workouts. The guy is fast enough to play the 2 in the league. He has great size, 6-7 205, and can shoot reasonably well. And he is one hell of an athelete. A guy who is not afraid to go to the rim, unlike every other player on our team.

Now, here is an outrageous question. Would anyone trade Gordon to move up in the draft to get a guy like Carney. Then, trade our pick for a future 1st or a big man? I love Gordon, but in my gut, I really think he will be traded down the line (not now, maybe S&T when he hits FA) b/c of his 'tweener' positioning and his ability to only shoot.

Don't burn me with comments guys (about Benny) I just wanna know your opinions. 

I will be watching a lot of NCAA games this weekend, especially focusing on Texas and Memphis. Lets see how Aldridge does with Tyrus Thomas defending him.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Draft Express Article About Draft Stock (Aldridge, Carney, and more)


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Big Men*



theanimal23 said:


> Now, here is an outrageous question. Would anyone trade Gordon to move up in the draft to get a guy like Carney. Then, trade our pick for a future 1st or a big man? I love Gordon, but in my gut, I really think he will be traded down the line (not now, maybe S&T when he hits FA) b/c of his 'tweener' positioning and his ability to only shoot.



I wouldn't trade Gordon to only trade up. I would only trade Gordon to get an established NBA player but in no way do I want to see a known commidty traded for more potential, I am still pissed off about losing Brand. It's a good thing an Elton Brand Update thread was never started here, I 'd be bumping that thing daily  

If you trade Gordon in a package w/ one of the Bulls 1st rounders, you better be coming back with an All Star.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



L.O.B said:


> I wouldn't trade Gordon to only trade up. I would only trade Gordon to get an established NBA player but in no way do I want to see a known commidty traded for more potential, I am still pissed off about losing Brand. It's a good thing an Elton Brand Update thread was never started here, I 'd be bumping that thing daily
> 
> If you trade Gordon in a package w/ one of the Bulls 1st rounders, you better be coming back with an All Star.


I'd trade Ben Gordon for WHOEVER drafts Rodney Carney & their 2nd round pick..in a HEART BEAT

he's everything Ben Gordon is NOT...


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Big Men*

In theory, a trade for a guy with higher ceiling should pay off, but there is no guarantee shown in the infamous Brand-Chandler trade. But, I'm a believer, without high risk, there is no great reward. 

I honestly would trade Gordon for Carney and a 2nd rounder or something. If Memphis goes to the final four, don't be surprised if Carney replaces Morrison or someone in the top 3 picks. It could go Gay, Carney, Aldridge in some order, with us or Atlanta getting Aldridge.

I don't see Pax passing up Aldridge. He is big, has great moves, seems to have jib, comes from a great program, and is young with potential. 

I will watch the UConn - Wash game to watch Roy. 

I have seen a little of Carney, but from what I saw, I was taken captive. He is my SG/SF of the draft. 

The question is, how do you get BOTH Aldridge and Carney?

Edit: Answer to my question, pray that both our lottery picks are in the top 5


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> I'd trade Ben Gordon for WHOEVER drafts Rodney Carney & their 2nd round pick..in a HEART BEAT
> 
> he's everything Ben Gordon is NOT...


But he is something that we all ready have and that's a SF. I believe Gordon has alot more value at this point than just a top 5 pick in this years draft.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Big Men*



theanimal23 said:


> I barely got any of the Bradley Memphis game, but from what I saw, I WANT CARNEY!
> 
> It was a play that was broken, and a foul called. But he crossed someone over, did a spin move, and went up to dunk it hard, but got fouled. The guy is explosive, quick as hell, and aggressive. I saw what I like, and he can shoot decent. Not great, but not bad. Few players can shoot lights out anyway.
> 
> O'Bryant didn't have a great game. I do not like his frame. I think he needs to add a lot of bulk. He also doesn't seem WIDE as a big man.
> 
> Aldridge prolly has the best arsenal of moves. I am confused on who we take with the first pick. I really think we got to move up and take Carney. I think he has the speed to be a big 2 guard. I am very sold on him. He is a senior, has experience, and is very talented.


Agree 

He's a Jefferson type player .

He won't be top 5 but he definately goes 6 , 7 or 8 in my opinion 

Maybe a trade down of the Knicks pick with a player and look at Splitter with our pick

Carney and Splitter fit the profile of a "safe" draft but where he retain big upside with both these guys - probably moreso with Carney however 

He's the big athletic above the rim wing we're looking for 

And he's a defender who can hang with the bigger athletic wings where I see Deng and Nocioni as the guy that hang with the combo forwards


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> I'd trade Ben Gordon for WHOEVER drafts Rodney Carney & their 2nd round pick..in a HEART BEAT
> 
> he's everything Ben Gordon is NOT...



so, so foolish.

Ben can and has carried teams...Uconn in college AND the Bulls...What has Rodney carried?...Besides his gym bag of course.

You gotta give me more then an unproven, soft, skinny, athlete for Ben.

Something about the kid...He looks like he'll have problems staying healthy....I don't know what it is...

I'm just soooo not sold.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Big Men*

I would not mind trading Ben for an established star, but I do not want to take on a contract like Lafrentz's or something. That would do us no good.

The thing I am disappointed with our team, other the lack of the big man, is the team is passive. The team is not aggresive on offense. We can blame the refs all we want, but if you go for tear drops, and not dunks/layups, you will not go to the line. It is critical to go to the line. Gets us more free points, and puts other teams good big men on the bench.

With this draft, I know we go to fill a need, but it hard to pass up on talent. I have always felt get talent, fill your needs later. But it's hard to pass up a great big man in Aldridge. Gordon is progressing well as a scorer, but I still think we need a solid SG. Imagine how much better our team D with Kirk guarding PGs with his pesky defense.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



smARTmouf said:


> so, so foolish.
> 
> Ben can and has carried teams...Uconn in college AND the Bulls...What has Rodney carried?...Besides his gym bag of course.
> 
> You gotta give me more then an unproven, soft, skinny, athlete for Ben.
> 
> Something about the kid...He looks like he'll have problems staying healthy....I don't know what it is...
> 
> I'm just soooo not sold.


i don't EXPECT everyone to be sold....

you sound like I did before I realized Aldridge was answer....

fact of the matter is, Carney is EVERYTHING we need at the 2...Ben Gordon is everything we DON'T need at the two...he's an undersized STREAKY shooter...and he'll ALWAYS be that way...he's not the answer long term at the two and skiles has been subliminally saying so all season...

Rodney just carried his team YESTERDAY to the elite eight...it doesn't even look like you've watched him enuff to say the things u are saying....what exactly is SKINNY about rodney? he has an NBA body if i've ever seen one...

it's cool, i'll give u time...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



theanimal23 said:


> I still think we need a solid SG. Imagine how much better our team D with Kirk guarding PGs with his pesky defense.


You and the rest of Chicago.

We ALL love Ben Gordon to some degree but there comes a time when u have to face reality and realize that he's not the answer at the 2guard and he never will be.

for every 5 games he'll LIGHT the league up, he'll go on a five game streak and become a liabilty every second on the floor...


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If Toronto are in say #6 position and we're in say #10 position - I wonder whether Toronto would take Chris Duhon in a pick swap where they have a chance to get Brandon Roy 

We take Carney off the board at 6 

Instead of having a Hinrich , Gordon , Duhon backcourt - we have a Hinrich , Carney , Gordon backcourt 

We could go big with Hinrich , Carney and Deng with Nocioni alternating between both forward spots , Gordon as the explosive bench scoring game winner and we pick up a big ball handling guard/forward such as Welsch or Salmons in free agency to round it out

Say the Knicks pick is top 2 - we auction it for the best mature big available and failing that its probably Aldridge I guess 

Plus two of Chris Wilcox / Drew Gooden / Al Harrington / Nene 

One thing we do need though is leadership


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> You and the rest of Chicago.
> 
> We ALL love Ben Gordon to some degree but there comes a time when u have to face reality and realize that he's not the answer at the 2guard and he never will be.
> 
> for every 5 games he'll LIGHT the league up, he'll go on a five game streak and become a liabilty every second on the floor...


Is Carney that much better than Brewer? Is Carney worth trading Gordon for him, if Brewer could still address the need for defensive 2? Crap, Hassell is a great defensive 2 but I don't want him shooting from deep. A defensive 2 is alot easier to get than a 2 that can actually shoot in today's game. 
The fall back combination of Brewer and Gordon would be better than having Carney alone.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> If Toronto are in say #6 position and we're in say #10 position - I wonder whether Toronto would take Chris Duhon in a pick swap where they have a chance to get Brandon Roy
> 
> We take Carney off the board at 6
> 
> Instead of having a Hinrich , Gordon , Duhon backcourt - we have a Hinrich , Carney , Gordon backcourt
> 
> We could go big with Hinrich , Carney and Deng with Nocioni alternating between both forward spots , Gordon as the explosive bench scoring game winner and we pick up a big ball handling guard/forward such as Welsch or Salmons in free agency to round it out
> 
> Say the Knicks pick is top 2 - we auction it for the best mature big available and failing that its probably Aldridge I guess
> 
> Plus two of Chris Wilcox / Drew Gooden / Al Harrington / Nene
> 
> One thing we do need though is leadership


I like the way you think!


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> If Toronto are in say #6 position and we're in say #10 position - I wonder whether Toronto would take Chris Duhon in a pick swap where they have a chance to get Brandon Roy
> 
> We take Carney off the board at 6
> 
> Instead of having a Hinrich , Gordon , Duhon backcourt - we have a Hinrich , Carney , Gordon backcourt
> 
> We could go big with Hinrich , Carney and Deng with Nocioni alternating between both forward spots , Gordon as the explosive bench scoring game winner and we pick up a big ball handling guard/forward such as Welsch or Salmons in free agency to round it out
> 
> Say the Knicks pick is top 2 - we auction it for the best mature big available and failing that its probably Aldridge I guess
> 
> Plus two of Chris Wilcox / Drew Gooden / Al Harrington / Nene
> 
> One thing we do need though is leadership


Does Larry Legend deal JO'N for the Knicks pick ?

If we dealt Duhon in the pick swap and the top pick we carve off $7M - giving us $22M but we take back O'Neal which leaves us $8M 

This money should net us one of Welsch / Salmons and one of Lorenzen Wright/Antonio Davis

*

Chandler
O'Neal
Deng
Carney
Hinrich

bench

Wright
Songaila
Nocioni
Welsch
Gordon

*


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> i don't EXPECT everyone to be sold....
> 
> you sound like I did before I realized Aldridge was answer....
> 
> fact of the matter is, Carney is EVERYTHING we need at the 2...Ben Gordon is everything we DON'T need at the two...he's an undersized STREAKY shooter...and he'll ALWAYS be that way...he's not the answer long term at the two and skiles has been subliminally saying so all season...
> 
> Rodney just carried his team YESTERDAY to the elite eight...it doesn't even look like you've watched him enuff to say the things u are saying....what exactly is SKINNY about rodney? he has an NBA body if i've ever seen one...
> 
> it's cool, i'll give u time...


I have a stickler for Indiana guys like a said before, so I'm a fan of Carney, too. I'll be more sold if he can at least match Adam Morrison's performance against UCLA. I would expect Carney to light it up against teams like Oral Roberts and Bradley. I've talked about different players having different developing times, too, so I'll give some credit to Carney despite the fact that he is a SENIOR. And with that, I'll make the question of why some can be in love with Rodney Carney on one hand and not be in love with Shelden Williams on the other.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



L.O.B said:


> Is Carney that much better than Brewer? Is Carney worth trading Gordon for him, if Brewer could still address the need for defensive 2? Crap, Hassell is a great defensive 2 but I don't want him shooting from deep. A defensive 2 is alot easier to get than a 2 that can actually shoot in today's game.
> The fall back combination of Brewer and Gordon would be better than having Carney alone.


Carney is DEFININTELY better than Brewer IMO

Brewer's strength's are defense and ball handling and finding the open man

Carney's strength's are pretty much EVERYTHING else...He's not a better passer than Brewer and probably not a better defender but he's a better shooter, slasher, finisher he's more atheletic and he's bigger. I'd say he reminds me of the 2006 Vince Carter. Brewer is another Marquis Daniels, which isn't bad at all but Carney has a hell of alot more upside.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> Carney is DEFININTELY better than Brewer IMO
> 
> Brewer's strength's are defense and ball handling and finding the open man
> 
> Carney's strength's are pretty much EVERYTHING else...He's not a better passer than Brewer and probably not a better defender but he's a better shooter, slasher, finisher & he's bigger.


Brewer is listed as 12 pounds heavier than Carney and are the same height.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Does Larry Legend deal JO'N for the Knicks pick ?
> 
> If we dealt Duhon in the pick swap and the top pick we carve off $7M - giving us $22M but we take back O'Neal which leaves us $8M
> 
> This money should net us one of Welsch / Salmons and one of Lorenzen Wright/Antonio Davis
> 
> *
> 
> Chandler
> O'Neal
> Deng
> Carney
> Hinrich
> 
> bench
> 
> Wright
> Songaila
> Nocioni
> Welsch
> Gordon
> 
> *


Once again, he's an INJURY PRONE big who's SOFT as hell in the playoffs..

no thanks, I'll take my chances with the picks...


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> Carney is DEFININTELY better than Brewer IMO
> 
> Brewer's strength's are defense and ball handling and finding the open man
> 
> Carney's strength's are pretty much EVERYTHING else...He's not a better passer than Brewer and probably not a better defender but he's a better shooter, slasher, finisher he's more atheletic and he's bigger. I'd say he reminds me of the 2006 Vince Carter. Brewer is another Marquis Daniels, which isn't bad at all but Carney has a hell of alot more upside.


I don't see how you can say he has more upside when he is a senior and is almost 22 years old. He didn't improve much from his junior to his senior year, except for his shooting. I say what you see is what you get.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



TwinkieTowers said:


> I don't see how you can say he has more upside when he is a senior and is almost 22 years old. He didn't improve much from his junior to his senior year, except for his shooting. I say what you see is what you get.


I hate that arguement that if you're a senior, u don't have anymore upside left...that's crazy

No matter how much "upside" he does or doesn't have, he's better than Brewer which I don't see having THAT much upside himself.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> I hate that arguement that if you're a senior, u don't have anymore upside left...that's crazy
> 
> No matter how much "upside" he does or doesn't have, he's better than Brewer which I don't see having THAT much upside himself.


I hate that argument as well, but people can't just say that someone like Shelden Williams has no upside because he's a senior and then go ga ga over Rodney Carney when he, too, is a senior, and he's not even a starter on his team.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Big Men*



TwinkieTowers said:


> I hate that argument as well, but people can't just say that someone like Shelden Williams has no upside because he's a senior and then go ga ga over Rodney Carney when he, too, is a senior, and he's not even a starter on his team.


wha? since when is rodney not a starter on memphis? if that's true, i honestly didn't know that. he's started when i've seen him play.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Big Men*



The ROY said:


> wha? since when is rodney not a starter on memphis? if that's true, i honestly didn't know that. he's started when i've seen him play.


Check out the box score in the bradley game. LINK 

He did start in the Oral Roberts and Bucknell game. I think Calipari creates starting lineups according to matchups. More often that not, though, Carney has been the sixth man for the Tigers.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Big Men*

TwinkieTowers, 

I'm a Duke fan, and was so amazed from Shelden yesterday. I've seen him do that for 4 years, but I finally got to see him do it against a 'larger' guy, and a guy with great help D (Tyrus). I would not mind taking Shelden with our pick, and he would be a solid role player. I do see him as a career 14 + 10 guy in the NBA. But it really depends who else is on board at the time too.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Big Men*

Brandon Roy with an incredible defensive play, faking on way and that changing directions in the backcourt in an instant, stealing the ball from Williams (I think) and driving in for a thunderous, uncontested dunk. 

Right now, my hopes for the Knicks' pick are as such:

1. Aldridge
2. Roy

Each one of these guys would help us a ton, and each one, IMO, will be a very good pro.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Big Men*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Right now, my hopes for the Knicks' pick are as such:
> 
> 1. Aldridge
> 2. Roy


I take it Roy has been impressive tonight.


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Big Men*



TripleDouble said:


> I take it Roy has been impressive tonight.


Roy is either Jimmy Jackson or  Roger Mason Jr.

RMJ's senior statline: 01-02 Virginia 36.1 40.9 36.7 88.1 3.2 4.1 3.0 0.4 0.9 18.6

6'5 200lbs

Nbadraftnet on Roger Mason Jr.:

Strengths: Extremely skilled combo guard with the size to play the 2 and ball handling and passing ability to man the 1. Was thrown into the point guard position at Virginia and played very well. Has very good ball handling ability. Creates well off the dribble and has an excellent jumpshot. Shoots close to 90 percent from the free throw line which will be among the elite on the next level. Very heady player with great vision and strong fundamentals. Has great consistency, does everything well, but nothing outstanding, 

Weaknesses: Not a phenomenal athlete but very solid. Wont bring down the house with rim rattling dunks but his passing ability can raise some eyebrows. 

Brandon Roy 6'5 195

2005-2006 31.6 20.2 5.7 4.1 2.3 1.76 1.3 .8 2.4 .513 .814 .400 1.50 

nbadraft.net on Roy:

Strengths: Roy is a no nonsense 2-guard with excellent all around skills ... Very cerebral player, makes excellent decisions. Understands the game ... Very polished, great experience with four years at Washington under his belt ... An excellent shooter who steps up in big situations. Hit a number of huge shots at the end of games this year ... Has worked hard on his outside shot which has improved each year ... Great competitor ... Excellent ball handler with the ability to create shots for himself and others ... His midrange game is relatively impressive and his range has really improved this year ... Really stepped up in his senior year assuming a leadership role and taking over as the go to player for the Huskies ... Has spent time at the point guard position this year, and played admirably ... Not afraid to take the ball inside. Utilizes the spin move in the paint well ... Good free throw shooter at 81% ... Has great composure and confidence. Never gets rattled ... Good one on one skills with the ability to shoot off the dribble and get by his man to the basket ... 

Weaknesses: Does everything very well but nothing out of this world ... On the small side. Lacks tremendous size and length at just 6-5 and average wing span ... A good athlete, but nothing extraordinary. Not a great leaper or thunderous dunker ... Lacks great body strength. His body is solid but not overpowering ... Foot speed and quickness is strong but wont stand out on the next level ... Defensively he is just average giving solid effort, but lacks the foot speed to be a lock down defender ...



NO, i don't think Roy will be RMJ, but I think he's a good worst case scenario.

Actually, now that I think of it, maybe Bob Sura is a good comparison.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm really digging Noah.

He's like Tyrus Thomas with a couple more inches and a little more polished on offense.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Big Men*



TripleDouble said:


> I take it Roy has been impressive tonight.


Roy is the best player on the court so far. He's so patient offensively. He attacks off the dribble, but when he's cut off, he stops and passes to an open man. He's an extremely heady player. He also hit an early 3, and he has a nice looking jumper. He's been impressive defensively taboot. I'm very impressed.

I'm keeping my eye on the other game. Noah really can run the floor. He's extremely agile. He's not a gifted scorer either, but he's rangy, and right now I think he's capable of more on the offensive end than Tyrus Thomas. He's got an ugly looking jumper, but he's a decent passer, and for sure he can rebound and block shots.

Horford has been really impressing me. He's got the athleticism plus some skills. I think I like him better right now than Noah or Thomas.

Foye was also pretty damn impressive tonight. He really did look very Dwyane Wade-esque.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Big Men*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Brandon Roy with an incredible defensive play, faking on way and that changing directions in the backcourt in an instant, stealing the ball from Williams (I think) and driving in for a thunderous, uncontested dunk.
> 
> Right now, my hopes for the Knicks' pick are as such:
> 
> 1. Aldridge
> 2. Roy
> 
> Each one of these guys would help us a ton, and each one, IMO, will be a very good pro.


I'm not opposed to taking our tall guard with the Knicks' pick, but Carney is the one that makes more sense, at least at that spot. He gives us size and athleticism whereas Roy just gives us size (Roy might be more skilled though).


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Big Men*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Roy is the best player on the court so far. He's so patient offensively. He attacks off the dribble, but when he's cut off, he stops and passes to an open man. He's an extremely heady player. He also hit an early 3, and he has a nice looking jumper. He's been impressive defensively taboot. I'm very impressed.
> 
> I'm keeping my eye on the other game. Noah really can run the floor. He's extremely agile. He's not a gifted scorer either, but he's rangy, and right now I think he's capable of more on the offensive end than Tyrus Thomas. He's got an ugly looking jumper, but he's a decent passer, and for sure he can rebound and block shots.
> 
> Horford has been really impressing me. He's got the athleticism plus some skills. I think I like him better right now than Noah or Thomas.
> 
> Foye was also pretty damn impressive tonight. He really did look very Dwyane Wade-esque.


I'm impressed with the kid as well. I just don't see him having more than a Duhon type role but as a SG. Does a lot of little things well and will generally be very consistent. He's good at getting to the hoop and finishing. He's not really a game changer outside of playing passing lanes pretty well.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Big Men*



Rhyder said:


> I'm impressed with the kid as well. I just don't see him having more than a Duhon type role but as a SG. Does a lot of little things well and will generally be very consistent. He's good at getting to the hoop and finishing. He's not really a game changer outside of playing passing lanes pretty well.


Again, he's been the best player in this game against a team of future NBA players (and maybe stars). But he's got four fouls and is spending time on the bench. Let's see if UConn makes a run.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Noah is BEASTING right now...

15pts, 7rebs, 3blks...and that was like 8 mins ago

anybody see that play in the play in the first half where he blocked a kids shot twice in a row then ran down the court, posted up and did the nice little hook off the glass?

somebody also blocked his shot and instead of being scared to take it back up after gettin the offensive board, he just turned around DUNKED on the kid amare style...

that kid is naaaaaaaaaaaaasty


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

He now has 15pts, 8rebs & 4blks

I think he just played his way into the TOP 5 tonight.....


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Noah is BEASTING right now...
> 
> 15pts, 7rebs, 3blks...and that was like 8 mins ago


Yes, but I haven't seen much in the way of NBA quality moves. One time he got an putback when fouled, but it was a Tyson Chandler fling-from-the-side-of-the-head shot.
And god his free throw is hideous.

I'm not convinced he'll be a scorer on the next level.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Yes, but I haven't seen much in the way of NBA quality moves. One time he got an putback when fouled, but it was a Tyson Chandler fling-from-the-side-of-the-head move.
> 
> And god his free throw is hideous.
> 
> I'm not convinced he'll be a scorer on the next level.


i have seen nba quality moves....not this game cuz they haven't showed the florida game much but his last two games he had nice fadeaway jumpers and an array of other moves in the low post

i've also seen him shoot 18footers with EASE

i AM convinced


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Yes, but I haven't seen much in the way of NBA quality moves. One time he got an putback when fouled, but it was a Tyson Chandler fling-from-the-side-of-the-head shot.
> And god his free throw is hideous.
> 
> I'm not convinced he'll be a scorer on the next level.


But I should add that in almost every other respect: rebounding, hustling, passing, blocking, running the floor, Noah looks like a stud. He is indeed beasting tonight.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

15pts, 13rebs & 5blks for the kid....he may have MORE stats but that's all their showing LOL

Joakim Noah is the TRUTH

they're gonna take villnova


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Roy has missed some crucial free throws. 

Great hesitation move and (lefty) layup though.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Man, am I the only one impressed with Roy? I'm watching him for the first time vs UConn. 

Things that stick out:

Can shoot, has range
Can post up
Drives to the hoop
Can dribble, plays some point

D - Is aggressive, seemed to do alright with Gay, got in some foul trouble

Competitive, got in an arguement w/Gay

I like this in a player. 

I like Carney, and think he has a very high ceiling. But if we cannot execute a trade to get Carney, or do not have the opportunity to get him, I would be very content with Roy.

1. Aldridge
2. Carney/Roy 

My choices so far

Rashard Anderson is a kind of guy who I wouldn't mind gambling on with a 2nd round pick, if we could get one.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Some pretty bs calls against Washington.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*




theanimal23 said:


> Rashard Anderson is a kind of guy who I wouldn't mind gambling on with a 2nd round pick, if we could get one.


I love Denham Brown too personally...both those guys can KILL u...

I gotta say, Roy probably would be perfect in chicago, but I'm not really big on him like I am with Carney mainly cuz he has star potential...

oh and Rudy Gay is GARBAGE, he's a NONFACTOR out there..he just took his man off the dribble and went up OVER his man and couldn't even get the ball RIM level...


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Yeah, def. goaltending on Armstrong on Roy's shot


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I love Denham Brown too personally...both those guys can KILL u...
> 
> I gotta say, Roy probably would be perfect in chicago, but I'm not really big on him like I am with Carney mainly cuz he has star potential...
> 
> oh and Rudy Gay is GARBAGE, he's a NONFACTOR out there..he just took his man off the dribble and went up OVER his man and couldn't even get the ball RIM level...


Roy, like Aldridge seem like very good fits for our team. I am impressed with Roy. The fact that he can handle the ball, makes it seem logical to have him in our rotation with Gordon. 

I agree with Carney's star potential. I am not a fan of Brewer as much. 

Carney Watch Tomorrow


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

How tall is Roy? On ESPN.com, there is a pick of him and Gay confronting each other. He looks almost as tall as Gay, who is 6'9".


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> Roy, like Aldridge seem like very good fits for our team. I am impressed with Roy. The fact that he can handle the ball, makes it seem logical to have him in our rotation with Gordon.
> 
> I agree with Carney's star potential. I am not a fan of Brewer as much.
> 
> Carney Watch Tomorrow


Roy would NEED to start in chicago...I don't see Gordon coming off the bench PERIOD..we'd have to trade him...

Hinrich & Roy would definintely be a interesting backcourt..


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Yeah, I agree. Gordon is better suited as a scoring punch off the bench. Roy is a very complete player. 

I honestly think, Pax will likely go for Aldridge and Roy. Both guys fit our teams' needs. Aldridge is the best big man currently available. Roy has proven he can be the guy on his team in college. Both seem jibbish.

I like the star potential of Carney, but I don't think we have a shot at getting him. That's not to say Roy won't be a great player. I think Roy can be solid. I just think Carney can be like Vince or JRich


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The Bulls definitely don't need a point guard, but Marcus Williams is really stepping up. At the least, he should be able to sell a few more laptops.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Roy would NEED to start in chicago...I don't see Gordon coming off the bench PERIOD..we'd have to trade him...
> 
> Hinrich & Roy would definintely be a interesting backcourt..


I don't think Roy would have to start right away. He could come off the bench as a rookie, and we could see how it all shapes up. Hell, throw Duhon in the mix and see who is the best comination, or who end up being the two best players.

Hinrich/Gordon/Roy is VERY intriguing, but doesn't solve our big man problem. I really like LaMarcus with the Knicks pick, but if he's gone, I'd be interested in Roy. I haven't seen Carney much, but I get the idea I'll be seeing a lot of him and Memphis as the tournament continues.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://espn-att.starwave.com/media/ncb/2006/0324/photo/a_roy_gay_412.jpg

Roy looks 6"8 to me!


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> http://espn-att.starwave.com/media/ncb/2006/0324/photo/a_roy_gay_412.jpg
> 
> Roy looks 6"8 to me!


Yeah, that was the picture I was referring to on ESPN.com. I don't know how to paste quotes or pictures. Anyone mind PMing me how to do so?


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Brandon Roy is my guy. I am sold on this kid. He simply has "it" and you don't need to read any box scores to see the impact he has on the game. He has such command handling the basketball, he would be perfect next to Gordon or Hinrich. I like how he's always looking to draw contact, something Ben and Kirk tend to avoid. Seriously, we've all been looking for a "bigger" guard who could handle the ball and defend... this guy can do those things in addition to everything else. 

And he was robbed on that final minute of OT. Bucket should have counted. Might have changed the outcome of that game considering the swing in momentum that non-call provided. 

Boone + Gay = PASS. 

Hilton Armstrong would be a decent pickup with our own pick.


----------



## Premier

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> Yeah, that was the picture I was referring to on ESPN.com. I don't know how to paste quotes or pictures. Anyone mind PMing me how to do so?


[img*bold*]URL of picture[/img*bold*]

Delete the "*bold*"'s and you should be all set.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> Yeah, that was the picture I was referring to on ESPN.com. I don't know how to paste quotes or pictures. Anyone mind PMing me how to do so?


i got that from another message board..just copied and pasted


----------



## Premier

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

About that picture, Roy is obviously closer to the camera. Look at their arms.

Wait until the Chicago Pre-Draft camp. We'll get measurements. Patience.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> Brandon Roy is my guy. I am sold on this kid. He simply has "it" and you don't need to read any box scores to see the impact he has on the game. He has such command handling the basketball, he would be perfect next to Gordon or Hinrich. I like how he's always looking to draw contact, something Ben and Kirk tend to avoid. Seriously, we've all been looking for a "bigger" guard who could handle the ball and defend... this guy can do those things in addition to everything else.


Exactly. I want to watch some more of Carney tomorrow. These two are my choices for SGs right now. I was very impressed with Roy. He also posted up, and was doing that w/o being intimidated by UConn's shotblockers and the longer Rudy Gay.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I don't think Roy would have to start right away. He could come off the bench as a rookie, and we could see how it all shapes up. Hell, throw Duhon in the mix and see who is the best comination, or who end up being the two best players.
> 
> Hinrich/Gordon/Roy is VERY intriguing, but doesn't solve our big man problem. I really like LaMarcus with the Knicks pick, but if he's gone, I'd be interested in Roy. I haven't seen Carney much, but I get the idea I'll be seeing a lot of him and Memphis as the tournament continues.


I think Roy is the kind of player who could start right out of the gate. He's so well rounded that even if it takes him a little while to figure out how to get his shot in the pros he'll still be valuable. He and Hinrich would play some serious defense. Gordon could come off the bench and light it up. I think Gordon's PG skills are decent enough where he can play minutes with a good handling SG like Roy.

I'd use Nocioni and/or Duhon as bait to trade up and get him. Then sign Harrington to replace Nocioni as the backup 3/4. Get a vet PG (Lue) if Duhon is traded.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Big Men*



Frankensteiner said:


> Carney ... gives us size and athleticism whereas Roy just gives us size


Yea, I agree...Roy is sweet but we have to go big on our first pick. Now if I was Orlando or Toronto, I would be lusting after the kid. 

I guess the best thing about Roy is that any two of him, Gordon and Hinrich could be on the court at the same time. So if JR is ok with a mammoth payroll and is willing to throw down huge money at Nene and Gooden and re-sign just everyone, we could have a killer 9 or 10 man rotation.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Big Men*



johnston797 said:


> Yea, I agree...Roy is sweet but we have to go big on our first pick. Now if I was Orlando or Toronto, I would be lusting after the kid.
> 
> I guess the best thing about Roy is that any two of him, Gordon and Hinrich could be on the court at the same time. So if JR is ok with a mammoth payroll and is willing to throw down huge money at Nene and Gooden and re-sign just everyone, we could have a killer 9 or 10 man rotation.


I like Aldridge and am not sold on Noah yet. If LaMarcus is there with the Knicks pick, I want him, but we wind up with pick 4 or 5 and he's off the board, with what I know of the draft prospects I'd be interested in Roy. I haven't seen enough of Bargnani, Splitter, or even Carney, so I may change my mind as I learn more about the two of them.

I think we do have the flexibility to go for a two guard with the Knicks pick considering our cap room. We could take Williams, Splitter, or O'Bryant with our pick, and then we could make a strong offer for Harrington, Nene, or Gooden -- the player of Paxson's choice -- right off the bat on the first night of free agency.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> Yeah, I agree. Gordon is better suited as a scoring punch off the bench. Roy is a very complete player.
> 
> I honestly think, Pax will likely go for Aldridge and Roy. Both guys fit our teams' needs. Aldridge is the best big man currently available. Roy has proven he can be the guy on his team in college. Both seem jibbish.
> 
> I like the star potential of Carney, but I don't think we have a shot at getting him. That's not to say Roy won't be a great player. I think Roy can be solid. I just think Carney can be like Vince or JRich


If our pick is 10+ I doubt Roy will be available. I've been extolling his virtues for a while now and I think the NCAA's have made him a 5-9 lottery pick.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> I honestly think, Pax will likely go for Aldridge and Roy. Both guys fit our teams' needs. Aldridge is the best big man currently available. Roy has proven he can be the guy on his team in college. Both seem jibbish.


Aldridge and Roy would be a dream draft for us, but Roy is playing his way up the board in this tournament, and I'll bet he will end up being a top ten pick.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

From an <a href="http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/ncaatourney06/news/story?id=2373279">ESPN article on Roy</a>



> Truth be told, the demonstration shouldn't have been much of a surprise. For that's what it has taken for people outside the Pac-10 to appreciate Brandon Roy. And even then, he might be the most underrated Pac-10 Player of the Year in history.
> 
> *For nobody else this season came close to being ranked among the conference leaders in 10 of the 13 individual statistical categories.* Nobody else scored 20 or more points in 17 games. And no one else earned a record-tying three player of the week honors while leading his team in points and assists and finishing second in steals and rebounds.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Aldridge and Roy would be a dream draft for us, but Roy is playing his way up the board in this tournament, and I'll bet he will end up being a top ten pick.


I think Roy will go reasonably high (around the 6 mark), with due reason. I just hope he's high on Paxson's radar and does what's needed to make it happen.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Roy looks 6"8 to me!












Funny how much a picture can show. In this confrontation you can see the weak/questionable knock on Gay(leaning away, slouching) and on the other hand the leadership/toughness Roy is known for(looking very confident, standing up straight). Roy's calm demeanor(no worries) to Gay's eyes squintin/mean muggin(nervousness).

Roy looks taller in the picture than he really is, 6'6 tops, but his wing has to be bigger, look at his arm compared to Gay who is freakishly long. I am getting very high on him, before the year he was a borderline 1rst round/early 2nd round pick, by the start of the tourney a lotto pick, and now I'm thinking top 6.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> If we want Brandon Roy, we might well have to take him with the NY pick. I wouldn't be surprised if Orlando scoops him up with their first rounder.


Starting to think this is more likely. I'd make all efforts to trade our pick up, Atlanta looks like the most reasonable partner.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Rudy Gay looked pretty awful last night. The commentators were really giving it to him, and with good reason. Did anyone else see him YAWN at the start of the 2nd half?!

UConn as a whole really looked disinterested for much of the game, and they were 1 miracle shot away from losing. I'm really swayed away from drafting Gay after last night; from all things I've heard, this is not an isolated instance. He sounds like a good kid, but why in the world doesn't he play harder?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Rudy Gay is garbage..I Could see him drastically falling in the draft this year....

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1238

stockup/stockdown reviews for last night

mcroberts says he staying at duke next season

aldridge says he's still thinking about joining the draft ))


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> Rudy Gay looked pretty awful last night. The commentators were really giving it to him, and with good reason. Did anyone else see him YAWN at the start of the 2nd half?!
> 
> UConn as a whole really looked disinterested for much of the game, and they were 1 miracle shot away from losing. I'm really swayed away from drafting Gay after last night; from all things I've heard, this is not an isolated instance. He sounds like a good kid, but why in the world doesn't he play harder?


There are kids that are just much better in the pros than college and I think Gay is going to be one of those guys. 

He is a soph and his very talented team is juniors and seniors. His coach is clearly not laying the team at his feet ala Roy and Morrison. 

Sure, there is some concern about his head, but there isnt' a guy in the draft that this isn't some legit concern. I really don't think his stock is affected much assuming he can bounce back and play even slightly better from here on out.

p.s. He ain't a 2, however. Pure 3.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Tyrus Thomas with the NAAAASTY putback...

geez...kid is sick

UPDATED :

Tyrus Thomas with the alley oop

disgusting...he shows signs a bit of Amare once in a while...

UPDATED :

another SICK *** alley oop dunk by Tyrus....


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> There are kids that are just much better in the pros than college and I think Gay is going to be one of those guys.
> 
> He is a soph and his very talented team is juniors and seniors. His coach is clearly not laying the team at his feet ala Roy and Morrison.
> 
> Sure, there is some concern about his head, but there isnt' a guy in the draft that this isn't some legit concern. I really don't think his stock is affected much assuming he can bounce back and play even slightly better from here on out.
> 
> p.s. He ain't a 2, however. Pure 3.


I pretty much agree with this. I think he could guard 2's regularly, though he doesn't have the perimeter game to play the 2 offensively (kind of like Gerald Wallace in this regard). Gay did by far the best job of any of UConn's guys on Brandon Roy.


----------



## Bulls4Life

*Narrowing the field (the best choices for the Bulls choices)*

If the lottery doesn't have any major surprises, the Knicks pick should fall 1-4 and the Bulls will be 10-11. With that in mind I will list the 4 players I would be most satisfied with at those picks. I reserve the right to change my mind at any time! :laugh:

1-4
LaMarcus Aldridge (great basketball name, BTW)
Andrea Bargnani
Joakim Noah
Tyrus Thomas

I like Rudy Gay, but not with that 1st selection. Bulls need to get bigger in a hurry.

10-11
Rudy Gay (should he slip for whatever reason)
Rodney Carney
Brandon Rush
Ronnie Brewer
Patrick O'Bryant
Tiago Splitter

Don't like Roy. His lack of hops will hinder him at the next level, IMO. And please, no more players under 6-3!!!

The perfect combination IMO would be Bargnani(4) & Splitter(5). That would be 2 big men with experience. If Pax wants guys that have done it in college, I say go with Noah(4) & O'Bryant(5). We need 2 big men that can put Chandler, Harrington, etc. on the bench. Guys that can score and play defense. Either way, Pax would have a better chance trading for a decent big guard than trading for a decent center so I say take the best 2 big men you can get. I think the best guards will be Carney and Rush, but they'll be gone before 10-11. And I'm not a fan of Morrison or Reddick, not because their not good, but they would just replicate what the Bulls already have too much of. Lack of athleticism and size at EVERY position is what is hurting them now. The loss of C & D exposed the rest of the team. Now Bulls need size & athleticism. That's why I say no to Morrison, Reddick, Roy, etc. 

What do you think?

:whoknows:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Narrowing the field (the best choices for the Bulls choices)*

there's a COUPLE of threads u coulda posted this in..

no offense..

also, nobody here has seen enuff of Bargnani or Splitter to say they'd be the perfect combo...


----------



## Bulls4Life

*Re: Narrowing the field (the best choices for the Bulls choices)*



The ROY said:


> there's a COUPLE of threads u coulda posted this in..
> 
> no offense..
> 
> also, nobody here has seen enuff of Bargnani or Splitter to say they'd be the perfect combo...



Sorry, maybe someone could move this. I can't come here that often anymore so I am not up-to-date about what has been discussed lately.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

SMH

another alley oop dunk by Thomas..

he has 8pts and 7rebs and ALL his points on dunks...

damn, NASTTTTY block by thomas...

that kid needs to DECLARE!


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Aldridge... I still haven't changed my opinion on him. He is not our guy. Tyrus Thomas > Aldridge, by far. God I hope Thomas declares this year. :gopray: 

I love Big Baby but he's just too short. He has so much skill for his size.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think you're wrong...aldridge is alot more skilled offensively than Thomas...although thomas is a hell of alot better defensively...we need a player that can do more than catch alley oopss..which is thomas's ONLY offense to date...

we'll wind up with aldridge..sorry


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I think you're wrong...aldridge is alot more skilled offensively than Thomas...although thomas is a hell of alot better defensively...we need a player that can do more than catch alley oopss..which is thomas's ONLY offense to date...
> 
> we'll wind up with aldridge..sorry


Aldridge is all jump shots. He looks soft to me. He doesn't look very athletic either. We have enough big men who take jumpers. I like Thomas better because of his superior defense and athleticism. He will have a much bigger impact on games.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> Aldridge is all jump shots. He looks soft to me. He doesn't look very athletic either. We have enough big men who take jumpers. I like Thomas better because of his superior defense and athleticism. He will have a much bigger impact on games.



You don't see the kids post moves?...you don't see the potential?...

just cause those moves aren't droppin' now DOES NOT mean he's all jump shots....Come on now.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

now Thomas is showing range....I'm impressed.

he adds low post moves and he's good to go.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

yeah, he just hit the nice lil 12fter....

aldridge is BACK!! hit the kg turnaround joint...

4pts, 11rebs & 3blks for him so far...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

it's official...

Tyrus is the most impressive young big in college ball...

he took it coast to coast for the layup over two defenders...

wow..now i see what LB was talkin bout


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

OK, quick question (cause I'd be happy with Thomas also):

If we ended up with Thomas, who plays Center for us? Thomas can't play center he's too short. Chandler? Chandler's guy will be able to double all night long since the spacing will be 5 feet. Sorry, but if we get Thomas, I think Chandler has to be replace din the starting line up. Do we throw mad money at Nene?

Again, I'd be happier with Thomas, than I am with Chandler.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> OK, quick question (cause I'd be happy with Thomas also):
> 
> If we ended up with Thomas, who plays Center for us? Thomas can't play center he's too short. Chandler? Chandler's guy will be able to double all night long since the spacing will be 5 feet. Sorry, but if we get Thomas, I think Chandler has to be replace din the starting line up. Do we throw mad money at Nene?
> 
> Again, I'd be happier with Thomas, than I am with Chandler.


if we get thomas...we need to trade chandler...go after nene...

hell if we get NOAH we need to trade chandler


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Thomas is hitting from 12ft. Damn, if he can hit that consistently, he can be the number 1 pick.

his draft status is sky-rocketing.


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## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> You don't see the kids post moves?...you don't see the potential?...
> 
> just cause those moves aren't droppin' now DOES NOT mean he's all jump shots....Come on now.


He just hit a picture perfect fadeaway jumper from like 20 feet. I'm not doubting his shot. He just seems like the type of player that tries to avoid contact by relying on the fadeaways all the time. He's not going to draw any fouls like that. When his jumper isn't falling I think his impact will be limited. He's not going to back anyone down in the paint, and he can't put the ball on the floor to attack the rim either.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

CBS just flashed the points in the paint totals for the game so far - LSU has 28, Texas has 6. I understand that Aldridge may hit more of his fadeaways than this usually (he's 2-12), but if that's not falling try and take it inside. He's been either unable or unwilling to do that so far. I'm not too impressed.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> He just hit a picture perfect fadeaway jumper from like 20 feet. I'm not doubting his shot. He just seems like the type of player that tries to avoid contact by relying on the fadeaways all the time. He's not going to draw any fouls like that. When his jumper isn't falling I think his impact will be limited. He's not going to back anyone down in the paint, and he can't put the ball on the floor to attack the rim either.



point taken....and i definatly agree.

they reported him saying' he's not looking forward to banging down low with big baby...i didn't like that at all.

i feel he has a great foundation with all those moves he has...experience will teach the kid how to draw fouls...time and the weight room will teach him to be better perpared to bang.

sure...i'm real optimistic...but i can't see why that wouldn't happen.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

*dribbles ball up court*

*notices Aldridge fighting for position*

*thinks to myself...why does he have his arm up waving like he's gonna get the ball?...i'm open too and i feel i have a hot hand*

*takes 3 pt. attempt 10 seconds into the shot clock*


Yeah...no wonder they losing the battle in the paint.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I don't think ya'll understand how excited Tyrus is getting me...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I love aldrdige..I do

but I WANT TYRUS THOMAS

did anybody just see him take his man off the dribble wit that explosive lay in? did u see the intensity??? then on the other end got ANOTHER blck?

he got like 19pts, 9rebs & 3blks

WOW

#1 pick indeed


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I love aldrdige..I do
> 
> but I WANT TYRUS THOMAS
> 
> did anybody just see him take his man off the dribble wit that explosive lay in? did u see the intensity??? then on the other end got ANOTHER blck?
> 
> he got like 19pts, 9rebs & 3blks
> 
> WOW
> 
> #1 pick indeed


how he welcomed the contact is what got me out my seat.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Davis is beasting against Lamarcus...Aldrige blocked some of his shots but that kid won't give up..he's doing EVERYTHING Lamacrus is SUPPOSED to be doing in the low posts...

If Tyrus doesn't come out this year and ATLEAST give a chance to grab him...I'll be heartbroken LOL


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Davis is beasting against Lamarcus...Aldrige blocked some of his shots but that kid won't give up..he's doing EVERYTHING Lamacrus is SUPPOSED to be doing in the low posts...
> 
> If Tyrus doesn't come out this year and ATLEAST give a chance to grab him...I'll be heartbroken LOL


Aldridge's could temper his anemic offensive showing by clamping down defensively on Davis, but he's really not. Davis has 19 points, most of which came in the post against Aldridge.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

This Is A Great Game!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Aldridge's could temper his anemic offensive showing by clamping down defensively on Davis, but he's really not. Davis has 19 points, most of which came in the post against Aldridge.


and that's the problem...

a aldridge/chandler frontcourt would get BRUTILIZED...

does ANYBODY think Tyrus Thomas MAY come out this year? I know his people said he wasn't ready but DAMN


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Thank you Jay Bilas. He just repeated what I've been saying all along, everything Aldridge puts up is fading away from the basket. Bilas said he won't draw any fouls that way. I guess Aldridge would be the perfect pick for us if we want to continue leading the league in fewest FT attempts.

Overtime again!

I love March Madness!!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> Thank you Jay Bilas. He just repeated what I've been saying all along, everything Aldridge puts up is fading away from the basket. Bilas said he won't draw any fouls that way. I guess Aldridge would be the perfect pick for us if we want to continue leading the league in fewest FT attempts.
> 
> Overtime again!
> 
> I love March Madness!!


damn...point well taken...

I know i've been flip-floppin' but Tyrus Thomas is the PERFECT player for us. Aldridge is finesse, Thomas is just all-around BEAST.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> and that's the problem...
> 
> a aldridge/chandler frontcourt would get BRUTILIZED...
> 
> does ANYBODY think Tyrus Thomas MAY come out this year? I know his people said he wasn't ready but DAMN


I think he probably will, yes. He was already thought of as a top 5 to 10 pick going into the tournament, and his stock has to be skyrocketing. Bilas and Enberg are going on about him as if he's superhuman.

I wonder, if Texas loses this game, if Aldridge will end up staying. He's been totally outclassed inside by Davis and Thomas on a pretty big stage.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Wow...Big baby can hit 3's?

poor mans Barkley?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think Tyrus Thomas is a franchise player....

The only thing I think that could keep him in college is if they DON'T win the tournament...cuz they say his team is so close to him...I think they could possibly convince him to stay...


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> I think he probably will, yes. He was already thought of as a top 5 to 10 pick going into the tournament, and his stock has to be skyrocketing. Bilas and Enberg are going on about him as if he's superhuman.
> 
> I wonder, if Texas loses this game, if Aldridge will end up staying. He's been totally outclassed inside by Davis and Thomas on a pretty big stage.


It's funny, before the tournament the talk was Tyrus needing to stay in college and Aldridge projected as the possible #1 overall pick. Now I wouldn't be surprised to see Tyrus declare for the draft (and be taken #1, or at least top 3) and Aldridge decide to stay in college. Aldridge's stock went down after this tournament. He'll probably still declare, but it seems like Thomas, Noah, and maybe even O'Bryant could challenge him for first big man taken in the draft. Then there's Bargnani over in Europe too.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

*sets attention on Carney*


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> It's funny, before the tournament the talk was Tyrus needing to stay in college and Aldridge projected as the possible #1 overall pick. Now I wouldn't be surprised to see Tyrus declare for the draft (and be taken #1, or at least top 3) and Aldridge decide to stay in college. Aldridge's stock went down after this tournament. He'll probably still declare, but it seems like Thomas, Noah, and maybe even O'Bryant could challenge him for first big man taken in the draft. Then there's Bargnani over in Europe too.


I don't think he stock went down HEAVILY..mainly cuz he put up 26 and 13 in his last game...

today, he just..i dunno...he still had 10rebs & 4blks but he got beasted all evening...

anybody hear the HUNGER in tyrus in the post game interview?!?! that kid's gonna be a superstar in the nba


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> It's funny, before the tournament the talk was Tyrus needing to stay in college and Aldridge projected as the possible #1 overall pick. Now I wouldn't be surprised to see Tyrus declare for the draft (and be taken #1, or at least top 3) and Aldridge decide to stay in college. Aldridge's stock went down after this tournament. He'll probably still declare, but it seems like Thomas, Noah, and maybe even O'Bryant could challenge him for first big man taken in the draft. Then there's Bargndani over in Europe too.


True. Even Davis looked better than Aldridge today.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> *sets attention on Carney*


Yeah, that's not going well either. On the bench with 2 fouls early, his team down by 10...


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> anybody hear the HUNGER in tyrus in the post game interview?!?! that kid's gonna be a superstar in the nba


What did he say? Yeah, you can tell the kid has passion and is very competitive. 

I was not happy to see LA settling for turnaround J's and hook shots. Be a little aggressive please!


----------



## ztect

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I have only seen 3 or 4 Texas games this year, but each and every game I've seen, Aldridge has always struck me as soft. Buckman has been the Texas player willing to bang.

In today's game against LSU, everything bad about Aldridge I had seen before was showcased. Aldridge is soft. Can't even imagine him going against even more physical players in the NBA. All turnarounds and fade aways, nothing strong, nothing aggressive. 

He may be 6'11, but his size won't help the Bulls. Definitely a player the Bulls don't need. Tyrus Thomas on the other hand was a beast. First time I really got a chance to see him.

Didn't get a chance to see O'Bryant, but of the players I've seen in the tournament thus far, Brandon Roy, Tyrus Thomas, Al Horford and Joakim Noah have impressed me the most.

Even though Noah's rail thin, his energy and his ball handling skills have been really impressive. Heard in a SEC tournament game that he had a late growth spurt, so he played more guard before which accounts for his passing and ball handling skills.

Roy's defense and his sharing of the ball were as impressive as his ability to attack the basket with either hand. Unlike Gay, he didn't take a play off. Roy was clearly the best player on the floor against UConn. Gay had some exceptional moments, and I've seen him a lot. But this game was typical. Gay seems to come and go in games and doesn't really seem like he'll ultimately be a go to guy despite his great athleticism. Roy definitely looks like he could be a go to guy.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Tyrus Thomas would be my first choice. Coming out of this draft with a combo of Thomas and Gay would give the Bulls the 2 things they need most, size and athleticism. No easy buckets for this team and they get killed inside


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



ztect said:


> I have only seen 3 or 4 Texas games this year, but each and every game I've seen, Aldridge has always struck me as soft. Buckman has been the Texas player willing to bang.
> 
> In today's game against LSU, everything bad about Aldridge I had seen before was showcased. Aldridge is soft. Can't even imagine him going against even more physical players in the NBA. All turnarounds and fade aways, nothing strong, nothing aggressive.
> 
> He may be 6'11, but his size won't help the Bulls. Definitely a player the Bulls don't need. Tyrus Thomas on the other hand was a beast. First time I really got a chance to see him.
> 
> Didn't get a chance to see O'Bryant, but of the players I've seen in the tournament thus far, Brandon Roy, Tyrus Thomas, Al Horford and Joakim Noah have impressed me the most.
> 
> Even though Noah's rail thin, his energy and his ball handling skills have been really impressive. Heard in a SEC tournament game that he had a late growth spurt, so he played more guard before which accounts for his passing and ball handling skills.
> 
> Roy's defense and his sharing of the ball were as impressive as his ability to attack the basket with either hand. Unlike Gay, he didn't take a play off. Roy was clearly the best player on the floor against UConn. Gay had some exceptional moments, and I've seen him a lot. But this game was typical. Gay seems to come and go in games and doesn't really seem like he'll ultimately be a go to guy despite his great athleticism. Roy definitely looks like he could be a go to guy.


Agree with all of this 

I have firmed to Thomas and Roy for us . Carney a flip of the coin with the Roy pick .

The Motor on Thomas and Roy , just hits you right between the eyes.

Thomas made plays today that just weren't about energy .. they were about serious , supreme athletic skill that has a capacity to impact on games in "difference maker" type status 

After starting this thread .. I am now comfortable in following college hoops throughout teh year and locking in on the tourney to annoint my two picks 

Tyrus Thomas with the Knicks pick 

Roy or Carney ( in that order ) with the Bulls pick ( and use Duhon and/or Songaila ) to trade up to 6 - 8 space to get them where I believe they will be

One thing I do know .. Rudy Gay plays small . Stay the hell away .


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Agree with all of this
> 
> I have firmed to Thomas and Roy for us . Carney a flip of the coin with the Roy pick .
> 
> The Motor on Thomas and Roy , just hits you right between the eyes.
> 
> Thomas made plays today that just weren't about energy .. they were about serious , supreme athletic skill that has a capacity to impact on games in "difference maker" type status
> 
> After starting this thread .. I am now comfortable in following college hoops throughout teh year and locking in on the tourney to annoint my two picks
> 
> Tyrus Thomas with the Knicks pick
> 
> Roy or Carney ( in that order ) with the Bulls pick ( and use Duhon and/or Songaila ) to trade up to 6 - 8 space to get them where I believe they will be
> 
> One thing I do know .. Rudy Gay plays small . Stay the hell away .


I don't think Duhon or Songalia are good enough players to trade up the territory where Carney and Roy will be available.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I like Thomas, and would be happy if the Bulls take him, however, given a choice I would still prefer Aldridge because of his considerable skill advantage. Yes, he had a poor game today, but getting outmuscled by a 310 pounder isn't a red flag imo. For comparison's sake, that's 40 more pounds than Sweetney's listed weight. There's no super heavyweights playing PF in the NBA.

As far as Thomas' pro prospects, best case scenario he's the next Amare. Worst case, he's a 6'9" version of Chandler (much like Chandler, Thomas already celebrates every decent play as if he just won a championship). Realistically, the Kenyon Martin comparison is a pretty good one.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Carney is a stud tonight, LOL. I really wished the best for him if he could go to the Final Four in his hometown, but so far, Carney is showing me just how much behind Morrison he really is, skillwise and mentally. I may lay off of him if he makes a game winner, but there is no doubt that the best SF in the draft will be Morrison or Gay.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm just wondering if everyone who lost faith in Aldridge for a poor game today has also lost faith in Carney? And Aldridge managed to contribute 10 boards, 5 blocks and 2 steals? What did Carney do besides hit a three when the game was out of reach?

I don't actually know enough about Carney to think one way or another about him (unfortunately), but despite my previous paragraph, I wouldn't think too much less of any player for a bad tournament game.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Somebody tell me the difference between James White and Rodney Carney.

I really wanna like this guy cause alot of posters I respect like him...But I'm not seeing anything that warrant such immense praise.

Roy > Carney....EASILY


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I'm just wondering if everyone who lost faith in Aldridge for a poor game today has also lost faith in Carney? And Aldridge managed to contribute 10 boards, 5 blocks and 2 steals? What did Carney do besides hit a three when the game was out of reach?
> 
> I don't actually know enough about Carney to think one way or another about him (unfortunately), but despite my previous paragraph, I wouldn't think too much less of any player for a bad tournament game.


Scouting reports have mentioned that one of Aldridge's weaknesses is his soft nature. He's had not so great games against players with more strength than his own. That's something he'll have to work with if he wants to go pro, but I read reports that his gain in muscle last offseason did boost his aggressiveness this season. Maybe adding another 20 pounds of muscle will help him shed his soft reputation.

I only saw about six total games of Carney, including three from this tournament. It's unfair to judge players for one bad game, but a lot of people on this thread are doing this, so I can say that a poor five-point performance (even with foul trouble) against a defensive-minded UCLA hurts his current stock greatly, especially since fellow SF Adam Morrison put up 24 against that same Bruin squad.

Pre-draft camp measurements and performances can do wonders for both Aldridge and Carney that could easily make up for their poor final game performances.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Somebody tell me the difference between James White and Rodney Carney.
> 
> I really wanna like this guy cause alot of posters I respect like him...But I'm not seeing anything that warrant such immense praise.
> 
> Roy > Carney....EASILY


i was sleep so i suppose he had a bad game...

too bad you couldn't see their game before they played ucla....he was playing like vince carter the whole game..just beasting.....

no way i'd take roy over carney, that's just me...

though i suppose, roy fits the mold of the current bulls more..

mainly cuz we have NO atheleticism or star potential...

the thing i WILL give roy is, he's a leader & he makes incredibly smart decisions with the ball...overall, he's a GOOD player but a star he'll never be....if we did happen to grab him...i'd think that would make ben gordon pretty expendable...especially if we got tyrus thomas


----------



## jordanwasprettygood

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Tyrus Thomas would be my first choice. Coming out of this draft with a combo of Thomas and Gay would give the Bulls the 2 things they need most, size and athleticism. No easy buckets for this team and they get killed inside


Thomas has been playing like a man possesed in this tournament. I'm rooting for LSU to win it all, that would greatly increase the chances of him declaring. He needs to put on a few pounds definitely but I would be really excited to see him in a Bulls uni.

I must say, Davis impressed me too. He definitely needs a little bit more work in college, but I'm really suprised at how agile he is.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I don't think Duhon or Songalia are good enough players to trade up the territory where Carney and Roy will be available.


If Toronto are at say #6 and we're at #10 - and given their lack and need for a true point guard - a breed lacking in this draft - you would have to think that given they pitched Duhon in last season's free agency , that Duhon and our #10 for their #6 would warrant fair consideration


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Frankensteiner said:


> I like Thomas, and would be happy if the Bulls take him, however, given a choice I would still prefer Aldridge because of his considerable skill advantage. Yes, he had a poor game today, but getting outmuscled by a 310 pounder isn't a red flag imo. For comparison's sake, that's 40 more pounds than Sweetney's listed weight. There's no super heavyweights playing PF in the NBA.


Its not just nominal weight 

Its muscle and strength and getting intimidated with that which has always been my question mark 

He will struggle with physical NBA post defenders that also have a sweeper to further mess with him when he has to revert to hooks and turnaround J's

I think he can be an NBA player but I see him with limitations 

Thomas has the bigger upside . By a considerable margin IMO



> As far as Thomas' pro prospects, best case scenario he's the next Amare. Worst case, he's a 6'9" version of Chandler (much like Chandler, Thomas already celebrates every decent play as if he just won a championship). Realistically, the Kenyon Martin comparison is a pretty good one.


I actually see him as closer to bigger , longer Shawn Marion


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> i was sleep so i suppose he had a bad game...
> 
> too bad you couldn't see their game before they played ucla....he was playing like vince carter the whole game..just beasting.....
> 
> no way i'd take roy over carney, that's just me...
> 
> though i suppose, roy fits the mold of the current bulls more..
> 
> mainly cuz we have NO atheleticism or star potential...


A Vince Carter against the greatest program in the country...Bradley. Like I said: Carney had five points against UCLA. Morrison had 24 against UCLA. Carney is a great athlete but currently lacks the offensive skill to score against great defensive teams. Roy put up an admirable 20 against an equally defensively capable team in UConn, just a little more than Morrison scored against them in the Maui Invitational. I'm one of the bigger Morrison fans on the Bulls board, so if they don't draft a big man first, I'd love for them to get Morrison, but I wouldn't be disappointed if they drafted Roy. Carney is a project.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Carney's greatest issue tonight was that he rushed his game and was bit too anxious that led him to play a bit out of control

But the guy can play and has major jets + hops to be a top notch NBA wing


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I'm just wondering if everyone who lost faith in Aldridge for a poor game today has also lost faith in Carney? And Aldridge managed to contribute 10 boards, 5 blocks and 2 steals? What did Carney do besides hit a three when the game was out of reach?
> 
> I don't actually know enough about Carney to think one way or another about him (unfortunately), but despite my previous paragraph, I wouldn't think too much less of any player for a bad tournament game.


I think the difference is that we really can't afford to screw up the Knicks pick, which is putatively going to be spent on a big man. If the tables were turned, you'd see much more criticism of Carney.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Carney's greatest issue tonight was that he rushed his game and was bit too anxious that led him to play a bit out of control
> 
> But the guy can play and has major jets + hops to be a top notch NBA wing


Why was he too anxious? He should be more composed considering that he is a senior. That's the same knock on JJ Redick's game against LSU: out of control and anxious.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> A Vince Carter against the greatest program in the country...Bradley. Like I said: Carney had five points against UCLA. Morrison had 24 against UCLA. Carney is a great athlete but currently lacks the offensive skill to score against great defensive teams. Roy put up an admirable 20 against an equally defensively capable team in UConn, just a little more than Morrison scored against them in the Maui Invitational. I'm one of the bigger Morrison fans on the Bulls board, so if they don't draft a big man first, I'd love for them to get Morrison, but I wouldn't be disappointed if they drafted Roy. Carney is a project.


Carney's isn't a project, you're overexaggerating....he's one of the best young players and most NBA ready in the entire country...he had a bad game...whoopty doo...half the lottery had bad final games in the tournament...

there's NO way we're gonna take adam morrison..he does NOTHING for our team...no way pax will pass on a big of the likes of thomas or aldridge for him...NO WAY


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

ROY, I just want to thank you, because you are my favorite debate partner on these boards.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

What was that guys name...Richard Dumas?...played for phoenix and dallas i believe.


yeah...that's who Rodney Carney reminds me of right now.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> What was that guys name...Richard Dumas?...played for phoenix and dallas i believe.
> 
> 
> yeah...that's who Rodney Carney reminds me of right now.


Phoenix and Philadelphia. I remember him in the Finals against the Bulls. By looking at his college and professional career, it seems he kept on getting worse. LINK 

Let's hope Carney's career isn't as injury prone as Dumas'.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Phoenix and Philadelphia. I remember him in the Finals against the Bulls. By looking at his college and professional career, it seems he kept on getting worse. LINK
> 
> Let's hope Carney's career isn't as injury prone as Dumas'.


The one thing that's kind of difficult to account for in a Dumas-Carney comparison is Dumas's heavy cocaine habit.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> I actually see him as closer to bigger , longer Shawn Marion


Doesn't have the strength or shot, but that will come in time. I think the Marioncomparision is just unavoidable because of his length, athleticism, and sheer explosiveness. Thomas is a little bit longer with a tad less athleticism, making him more of a 4 than a 3. 

Swift+Matrix/2=TT


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I would like to say that today, and this NCAA tournament as a whole, has produced extremely interesting discussion. This board remains a fantastic way to "waste time," and I greatly enjoy reading posts here everyday.

Kudos, folks. 

:cheers:


----------



## Bulls4Life

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Carney reminds me of Larry Hughes.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Bulls4Life said:


> Carney reminds me of Larry Hughes.


He reminds me of a hybrid of Hughes and Vince.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

As I posted in another thread that seemed very fitting here as well:



> I have seen a different Carney in this tournament. He is stepping up and being a leader out there. He is demanding the ball, getting to the rim, and being extremely active defensively. Unfortunately in the game against UCLA, he kept being in the wrong place at the wrong time and kept picking up fouls when he was matched up with big men in the low post.
> 
> I see signs of him turning around what is probably his greatest weakness--the will and leadership--and am even higher on the kid than I was before the tourney. I was actually hoping he had a bad tournament statisically so he could potentially fall to our second pick. Then, hoping that Paxson saw the same things that I did.
> 
> Roy seems to be Dwayne Wade without the explosiveness. I think this lack of explosiveness is what will keep him from being a great NBA player. I see him as a quality starter, but the guy reminds me more of Bobby Sura (whom I think is one of the most underrated players) than Wade.
> 
> My guard favorites from a Bulls perspective. I wouldn't draft any of these with the NY pick unless it fell to #5 or #6 in which case I'd consider Carney there if Aldridge, Bargnani (according to draft reports--not my opinion), Noah, and possibly Splitter are all off the board.
> Carney
> Brewer
> Roy (very close behind Brewer)
> Roby


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Is there any way to watch the games live online or download them afterwards? It really annoys me that I can't see these guys play before they get to the league.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> Is there any way to watch the games live online or download them afterwards? It really annoys me that I can't see these guys play before they get to the league.


Yes:

www.ncaasports.com/mmod

Streaming live games only, I believe, but yes, there they are!


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Hilton Armstrong with our pick?

He's already been on the cusp of my radar...But he's showing me he in fact does have some offensive cababilities...Hmmmmmm


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

hilton's no more than a career bencher...


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> hilton's no more than a career bencher...


You say that like the kid is garbage.

His defensive instinct alone will land him a starting job.

If Greg Ostertag can start...I don't see why Hilton can't.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> You say that like the kid is garbage.
> 
> His defensive instinct alone will land him a starting job.
> 
> If Greg Ostertag can start...I don't see why Hilton can't.


I didn't say he was garbage...but he's not that GOOD either...


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I didn't say he was garbage...but he's not that GOOD either...



I don't recall me slurpin' the dood...I'm just saying...he's better than a career bench player....Got some Elden Cambell in him...that's solid.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Hustle said:


> Doesn't have the strength or shot, but that will come in time. I think the Marioncomparision is just unavoidable because of his length, athleticism, and sheer explosiveness. Thomas is a little bit longer with a tad less athleticism, making him more of a 4 than a 3.
> 
> Swift+Matrix/2=TT


Marion didn't have a shot when he came to the league and developed that 12 year old girl in the famil driveway heave into his 3rd year


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

LOL!!!!

I TOLD YA'LL DENHAM BROWN was sick...

I TOLD THE WORLD!


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm so tired of UCONN coming back against low ranked teams and acting like the won the championship.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

It is mind-boggling how Rudy Gay shies away from the ball in crunchtime.

When GM missed their FT, he got the rebound, shuffled to Williams, and then is barely crossing the halfcourt stripe as Denham Brown started his drive.

Appalling.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> I'm so tired of UCONN coming back against low ranked teams and acting like the won the championship.


Are you kidding me? How could you not go nuts if your team was in those circumstances and hit those shots?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Thank God UConn lost

I'm sick of them coming back from behind and winning games against teams that most of us would claim are inferior


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

in the BLUE hell is foye guarding noah?! LOL

he'll have 20, 10 and 5 today..


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> in the BLUE hell is foye guarding noah?! LOL
> 
> he'll have 20, 10 and 5 today..


Yeah, I hope Wright switches up the matchups. We're not going to get another important game to really evaluate him if he's posting up a midget.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Hilton Armstrong with our pick?
> 
> He's already been on the cusp of my radar...But he's showing me he in fact does have some offensive cababilities...Hmmmmmm


I'm sure he is on Paxson's list. I can't quite figure out if I like him enough at that spot. Probably depends on the board.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Are you kidding me? How could you not go nuts if your team was in those circumstances and hit those shots?


UCONN has 4 or 5 NBA players. It's like me going crazy after hitting a shot to tie the game against a 11 year old (perhaps a little hyperbole).


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> UCONN has 4 or 5 NBA players. It's like me going crazy after hitting a shot to tie the game against a 11 year old (perhaps a little hyperbole).


I can't agree with you at all. Them making overtime was nothing short of a miracle.

And George Mason is no bunch of 11 year olds. They just knocked off MSU, UNC, and UConn to make the final four. They're playing great ball.

This is the tournament, man. Every game you win is extremely exciting.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> I'm sure he is on Paxson's list. I can't quite figure out if I like him enough at that spot. Probably depends on the board.


You catch Hilton pullin' away from his teammate like a little kid cause he was called for a foul.

I don't know...I didn't like that...I'm hoping he's not a knuckle head.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think Horford could be better than Noah.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I can't agree with you at all. Them making overtime was nothing short of a miracle.
> 
> And George Mason is no bunch of 11 year olds. They just knocked off MSU, UNC, and UConn to make the final four. They're playing great ball.
> 
> This is the tournament, man. Every game you win is extremely exciting.


True. But that was every game this tournament for UConn. They consistently played sloppy basketball for the first two thirds of games and turned it on at the end. You can't help but be a little dissapointed by their tournament showing, they're incredibly talented but seemed content to coast an awful lot of the time. Marcus Williams bailed them out at the end of every game.

George Mason is a great college team. Their guards can stick it from outside and play really tough defense - Skinn in particular is a nightmare on the defensive end. They've got two guys who can score down low. They've been really, really impressive.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> I'm sure he is on Paxson's list. I can't quite figure out if I like him enough at that spot. Probably depends on the board.


I don't dislike Armstrong, but I can't see him being anything other than an Ervin Johnson-Tony Battie-Chris Mihm-Joel Pryzbilla type rotation big. I'd rather address our need for a big guy with the NY pick and look at Carney/Brewer/Roy with ours.

Any thoughts on where Marcus Williams might get drafted if he comes out? Is he better than Rondo? I think he could be a top 10 guy at this point.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> I think Horford could be better than Noah.


yeah it's possible but for noah's size...he's an OUTSTANDING prospect...he does so much more than horford...

18pts, 14rebs & 5blks and this is probably the LEAST impressive he's been all tournament


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

21pts, 15rebs & 6blks....kid is a monster...

LSU vs. FLORIDA will be LOVELY...too bad Al Horford isn't on the level's of Thomas or Davis...


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Any thoughts on where Marcus Williams might get drafted if he comes out? Is he better . than Rondo? I think he could be a top 10 guy at this point.


I think he's surpassed Rondo for sure he will be the first PG drafted, unless you want to consider Foye a PG. I hope both of those guys are picked before our pick, that would leave a couple of better options. It looks more and more like the Sixers is going to tank, and drag our pick down along with them. At 16 there is going to be slim pickin's. Not a bad thing :meditate:


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Any thoughts on where Marcus Williams might get drafted if he comes out? Is he better than Rondo? I think he could be a top 10 guy at this point.


Marcus Williams led the NCAA in assists last season, I believe, and he led for a reason, besides the fact that most of his teammates are NBA-caliber players. His scouting reports say that he has great court vision. He could be a top 10 guy, except he decided to enter the stolen laptop dealership industry. If his predraft interviews come out favorable, he probably will be a top 10 guy.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

he's top 10 IMO

best pg in the draft by far...


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I haven't seen any George Mason until the tournament, but Will Thomas showed a good array of post moves against UConn and is crafty at keeping the shotblockers at bay (Hilton Armstrong). He also has good awareness of kicking out to the shooters and is a fighter for rebouds. He doesn't have the body strength of similar small inside players Craig Smith and Marco Killingsworth (though teammate Jai Lewis does), but he still has two years left of school to develop. However, I don't think he's going to get any more exposure to raise his stock than he's getting right now, unless George Mason intends to have back-to-back Final Four seasons. I wonder if either Jai Lewis and Will Thomas have a chance to be late second rounds picks or undrafted free agent signings.

Does George Mason remind you of the Bulls right now?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Does anyone else get the feeling that one of our two picks will likely get traded? When do we end up with capspace, is it after the draft?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> Does anyone else get the feeling that one of our two picks will likely get traded? When do we end up with capspace, is it after the draft?


i personally don't think he's gonna trade em...

all the good young teams with great foundations have gained greater drafting their talent

cleveland - lebron
phoenix - amare
miami - dwayne
orlando - dwight
toronto - bosh
charlotte - okafor

we just need to stick wit this rebuilding plan and get those bigs and call it a day...let em develop...we already have probably the best young core in the nba...


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> we just need to stick wit this rebuilding plan and get those bigs and call it a day...let em develop...we already have probably the best young core in the nba


I have to agree, as the players I would love to obtain are pretty much impossible to get: Wade and Bosh. And I really doubt I'd be willing to part with both our picks and one or two of the "3" for anyone else.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> I have to agree, as the players I would love to obtain are pretty much impossible to get: Wade and Bosh. And I really doubt I'd be willing to part with both our picks and one or two of the "3" for anyone else.


yep....it could ONLY be the type of young caliber players IMO

if indiana or minne got offered tyrus thomas, luol deng, future firsts and filler or JO or KG...they'd jump all OVER it..

and we'd lose...HORRIBLY in any deal like that..


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

just to update you guys on where these guys are falling in the insider Top 100 prospect list from chad ford.

prospect ranking and where they are projected to get picked. here are the TOP TWENTY as of today.



1	*LaMarcus Aldridge* - Top 5

2	*Tyrus Thomas* - Top 5 (chad notes he wasn't even in the top 100 before the season)

3	*Andrea Bargnani * - Top 10

4	*Joakim Noah* - Top 10 (noah wasn't on the top 100 either)

5	*Adam Morrison* - Top 10

6	*Josh McRoberts* - Lottery

7	*Rudy Gay* - Top 10

8	*Brandon Roy* - Lottery

9	*Randy Foye* - Lottery

10	*Al Horford* - Lottery to mid-first round

11	*Shelden Williams* - Lottery to mid-first round

12	*Rodney Carney* - Lottery

13	*Ronnie Brewer* - Lottery

14	*Marcus Williams	* - Lottery to mid-first round

15	*Patrick O'Bryant* - Lottery to mid-first round

16	*Tyler Hansbrough * - Lottery to mid first round

17	*J.J. Redick* - Lottery to mid-first round

18	*Julian Wright* - Lottery to mid-first round

19	*Rajon Rondo* - Lottery to mid-first round

20	*Mardy Collins* - Mid to late first round


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

On Thomas (from insider):

"watching him this weekend, it's getting difficult to come up with reasons why he shouldn't be considered the No. 1 pick in the draft. Eight teams passed on Amare Stoudemire in 2002 because they believed he was too raw to make an impact in the league. There won't be more than two, maybe three teams at most, who'll pass on Thomas this year."


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

OK, this year I'm trying to put together a system to rate out how I feel about the possible draft picks, and my first cut on the important guys is about done.

Basically, I'm giving each guy a 1-4 rating in 4 categories:
* Stats, using my statistical rating system. 4 is a guy who rates out at Superstar or quality star production. 3 is a guy who rates out as a marginal star. 2 are guys who just rate out as starters. 1 is guys who seem to get worse statistically (they take more minutes to get the same stats, seem relatively inefficient, etc).

* Age/Experience. 4 is a Freshman or equivalently aged foreign player. 3 is a sophomore. 2 is a junior/senior. 1 is typically not given, but strikes me as a guy who's a senior and really has little upside. For example, I'm going back and trying to rate some previous players and I gave Lonny Baxter a 1. The basic idea is I believe (and I think it's a solid belief) that older guys "appear" better than the younger guys due to age/experience, etc, and you have to give extra weight to a younger guy who's putting up equivalent numbers.

* Physical Skills. This is very anecdotal at this point. It'll get better when the combine results come out, but at this point it's my judgement of whether a guy has the ideal size/athleticism/physical skills to play in the NBA. Ideal gets a 4. Fairly confident size/athelticism, but not quite prototype gets a 3. Marginal but probably capable (if the other qualities are good enough) gets a 2. Questionable NBA physical skills gets a 1.

* Head. Again, this is a judgement call, but I'm trying to assign a basic value to basketball IQ, general intelligence, leadership and "clutch" abiilty, and work ether. 4 is an unusually good player in this regard. 3 is a guy I'm confident in. 2 is a guy that is probably ok but has questions. 1 is Loren Woods or Leon Smith.

---------------------
So put all that together and take the average:
S/A/P/H/O (Call it the lesbian index)

*Bigs*
Bargnani:2/4/4/3 *3.25* (Very hard to judge since most of this is word of mouth)
Thomas: 3/4/3/3 *3.25* (Thomas' head quotient could go up... I like the quotes I've heard from him)
Aldridge: 3/3/3/3 *3.00*
Williams: 3/2/2/4 *2.75*
O'Bryant: 2/3/4/2 *2.75*
P.Davis: 3/2/3/2 *2.50*
Boone: 2/2/3/3 *2.50*
Armstrong: 2/2/3/2 *2.25*


Gay: 3/3/3/3 *3.00*
Morrison: 4/2/2/4 *3.00
*Roy: 3/2/2/4 *2.75*
Brewer: 3/2/3/3/ *2.75*
Carney: 2/2/4/2 *2.50*
Reddick: 3/2/1/3 *2.25
*M.Collins: 2/1/2/3 *2.00

----------------------

Some previous guys I've tried to grade out using this system (I've tried to be objective and considered only what I thought about about the guy leading up to the draft, but obviously it's not perfect. Those are guys that I just sort of thought of).*

Lebron: 3/4/4/4 3.75
Melo: 4/4/3/3 3.50
Wade: 4/3/3/4 3.50
Brand: 4/3/3/4 3.50
Hinrich 3/2/3/4 3.00
Boozer: 3/2/2/3 2.50
Frye: 3/2/3/2 2.50
Baxter: 2/1/1/4 2.00
L.Woods: 1/2/3/1 1.75


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> OK, this year I'm trying to put together a system to rate out how I feel about the possible draft picks, and my first cut on the important guys is about done.
> 
> Basically, I'm giving each guy a 1-4 rating in 4 categories:
> * Stats, using my statistical rating system. 4 is a guy who rates out at Superstar or quality star production. 3 is a guy who rates out as a marginal star. 2 are guys who just rate out as starters. 1 is guys who seem to get worse statistically (they take more minutes to get the same stats, seem relatively inefficient, etc).
> 
> * Age/Experience. 4 is a Freshman or equivalently aged foreign player. 3 is a sophomore. 2 is a junior/senior. 1 is typically not given, but strikes me as a guy who's a senior and really has little upside. For example, I'm going back and trying to rate some previous players and I gave Lonny Baxter a 1. The basic idea is I believe (and I think it's a solid belief) that older guys "appear" better than the younger guys due to age/experience, etc, and you have to give extra weight to a younger guy who's putting up equivalent numbers.
> 
> * Physical Skills. This is very anecdotal at this point. It'll get better when the combine results come out, but at this point it's my judgement of whether a guy has the ideal size/athleticism/physical skills to play in the NBA. Ideal gets a 4. Fairly confident size/athelticism, but not quite prototype gets a 3. Marginal but probably capable (if the other qualities are good enough) gets a 2. Questionable NBA physical skills gets a 1.
> 
> * Head. Again, this is a judgement call, but I'm trying to assign a basic value to basketball IQ, general intelligence, leadership and "clutch" abiilty, and work ether. 4 is an unusually good player in this regard. 3 is a guy I'm confident in. 2 is a guy that is probably ok but has questions. 1 is Loren Woods or Leon Smith.
> 
> ---------------------
> So put all that together and take the average:
> S/A/P/H/O (Call it the lesbian index)
> 
> *Bigs*
> Bargnani:2/4/4/3 *3.25* (Very hard to judge since most of this is word of mouth)
> Thomas: 3/4/3/3 *3.25* (Thomas' head quotient could go up... I like the quotes I've heard from him)
> Aldridge: 3/3/3/3 *3.00*
> Williams: 3/2/2/4 *2.75*
> O'Bryant: 2/3/4/2 *2.75*
> P.Davis: 3/2/3/2 *2.50*
> Boone: 2/2/3/3 *2.50*
> Armstrong: 2/2/3/2 *2.25*
> 
> 
> Gay: 3/3/3/3 *3.00*
> Morrison: 4/2/2/4 *3.00
> *Roy: 3/2/2/4 *2.75*
> Brewer: 3/2/3/3/ *2.75*
> Carney: 2/2/4/2 *2.50*
> Reddick: 3/2/1/3 *2.25
> *M.Collins: 2/1/2/3 *2.00
> 
> ----------------------
> 
> Some previous guys I've tried to grade out using this system (I've tried to be objective and considered only what I thought about about the guy leading up to the draft, but obviously it's not perfect. Those are guys that I just sort of thought of).*
> 
> Lebron: 3/4/4/4 3.75
> Melo: 4/4/3/3 3.50
> Wade: 4/3/3/4 3.50
> Brand: 4/3/3/4 3.50
> Hinrich 3/2/3/4 3.00
> Boozer: 3/2/2/3 2.50
> Frye: 3/2/3/2 2.50
> Baxter: 2/1/1/4 2.00
> L.Woods: 1/2/3/1 1.75


Very interesting, Mike. I would make add another category called skill, which is based on whether a player can shoot, dribble, or pass. In general, I think those attributes don't have so much to do with run/jump athleticism, and whereas skill is somewhat covered in stats, I think it deserves its own category.

I have no major quibbles with most of your stats, but I'd give Rudy Gay a 2 for his head but a 4 for his phyisical skills, which comes out the same. I would also give my man Brandon Roy a 3 for athleticim. I think a 2 is doing a fine athlete a disservice, but he's definitely no Rudy Gay (who, again, I think should be a 4).

I also have to wonder about the system when I see John Boone being rated above Hilton Armstrong. Maybe if you add a skill category, that will cover it. Armstrong clearly seems like a better prospect to me.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mizenkay said:


> just to update you guys on where these guys are falling in the insider Top 100 prospect list from chad ford.


Thanks. That's pretty close to how I have them. McRoberts excluded. We can't use the SFs or small guards, of course.


----------



## ztect

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

2's = Roy, Collins , and Reggie ROby

4 or 5's= Thomas, O'Bryant, Bargnani(?)

Draft is starting to look better with a 4/5 from Knicks pick
and one of the two's from the Bulls pick, the Bulls will be a better team

Add Nene or even Mohamed for depth, and the Bulls will have 
a lot of assets to work with


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> OK, this year I'm trying to put together a system to rate out how I feel about the possible draft picks, and my first cut on the important guys is about done.


Nice job Mike! :greatjob:


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> I haven't seen any George Mason until the tournament, but Will Thomas showed a good array of post moves against UConn and is crafty at keeping the shotblockers at bay (Hilton Armstrong). He also has good awareness of kicking out to the shooters and is a fighter for rebouds. He doesn't have the body strength of similar small inside players Craig Smith and Marco Killingsworth (though teammate Jai Lewis does), but he still has two years left of school to develop. However, I don't think he's going to get any more exposure to raise his stock than he's getting right now, unless George Mason intends to have back-to-back Final Four seasons. I wonder if either Jai Lewis and Will Thomas have a chance to be late second rounds picks or undrafted free agent signings.
> 
> Does George Mason remind you of the Bulls right now?


George Mason didn't, but the UCLA does to me. They fall into a lull at times, but when they step it up, they're good enough to beat anyone.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> OK, this year I'm trying to put together a system to rate out how I feel about the possible draft picks, and my first cut on the important guys is about done.
> 
> Basically, I'm giving each guy a 1-4 rating in 4 categories:
> * Stats, using my statistical rating system. 4 is a guy who rates out at Superstar or quality star production. 3 is a guy who rates out as a marginal star. 2 are guys who just rate out as starters. 1 is guys who seem to get worse statistically (they take more minutes to get the same stats, seem relatively inefficient, etc).
> 
> * Age/Experience. 4 is a Freshman or equivalently aged foreign player. 3 is a sophomore. 2 is a junior/senior. 1 is typically not given, but strikes me as a guy who's a senior and really has little upside. For example, I'm going back and trying to rate some previous players and I gave Lonny Baxter a 1. The basic idea is I believe (and I think it's a solid belief) that older guys "appear" better than the younger guys due to age/experience, etc, and you have to give extra weight to a younger guy who's putting up equivalent numbers.
> 
> * Physical Skills. This is very anecdotal at this point. It'll get better when the combine results come out, but at this point it's my judgement of whether a guy has the ideal size/athleticism/physical skills to play in the NBA. Ideal gets a 4. Fairly confident size/athelticism, but not quite prototype gets a 3. Marginal but probably capable (if the other qualities are good enough) gets a 2. Questionable NBA physical skills gets a 1.
> 
> * Head. Again, this is a judgement call, but I'm trying to assign a basic value to basketball IQ, general intelligence, leadership and "clutch" abiilty, and work ether. 4 is an unusually good player in this regard. 3 is a guy I'm confident in. 2 is a guy that is probably ok but has questions. 1 is Loren Woods or Leon Smith.
> 
> ---------------------
> So put all that together and take the average:
> S/A/P/H/O (Call it the lesbian index)
> 
> *Bigs*
> Bargnani:2/4/4/3 *3.25* (Very hard to judge since most of this is word of mouth)
> Thomas: 3/4/3/3 *3.25* (Thomas' head quotient could go up... I like the quotes I've heard from him)
> Aldridge: 3/3/3/3 *3.00*
> Williams: 3/2/2/4 *2.75*
> O'Bryant: 2/3/4/2 *2.75*
> P.Davis: 3/2/3/2 *2.50*
> Boone: 2/2/3/3 *2.50*
> Armstrong: 2/2/3/2 *2.25*
> 
> 
> Gay: 3/3/3/3 *3.00*
> Morrison: 4/2/2/4 *3.00
> *Roy: 3/2/2/4 *2.75*
> Brewer: 3/2/3/3/ *2.75*
> Carney: 2/2/4/2 *2.50*
> Reddick: 3/2/1/3 *2.25
> *M.Collins: 2/1/2/3 *2.00
> 
> ----------------------
> 
> Some previous guys I've tried to grade out using this system (I've tried to be objective and considered only what I thought about about the guy leading up to the draft, but obviously it's not perfect. Those are guys that I just sort of thought of).*
> 
> Lebron: 3/4/4/4 3.75
> Melo: 4/4/3/3 3.50
> Wade: 4/3/3/4 3.50
> Brand: 4/3/3/4 3.50
> Hinrich 3/2/3/4 3.00
> Boozer: 3/2/2/3 2.50
> Frye: 3/2/3/2 2.50
> Baxter: 2/1/1/4 2.00
> L.Woods: 1/2/3/1 1.75


Interesting stuff. I think you may be short changing Thomas a bit in regards to physical skills. He could, perhaps, use 10 or 20 pounds but he's a total athletic freak. He's got a to get a 4 there, doesn't he? Particularly with Bargnani getting one. I'd probably bump Gay and Roy up to a 4 on 3 on physical skills, respectively. And I don't think Paul Davis will be better than the UConn bigs. Still, the results are pretty consistent with how I feel about most of these guys relative to each other...


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Guys, thanks!

A couple comments on particulars. 

Thomas- I've mentally told myself I'll be moving him up to a four for physical skills down the line but I want a more accurate gauge of his weight and strength. When the official measurements roll around and he's comes in at like 225lbs and still jumps out of the gym, he'll be a four.

Bargnani- Yeah, that's questionable to give him a 4 in terms of physical skills I guess, but I actually think it'll prove out. Everything I've read and seen suggests he's got a prototype body - about 6'11" and 240, is quick as a deer, and can pass the ball. That's one prototype for a PF/C body. 

The other is Tyrus Thomas is he's like 225-230lbs. Yeah, I know weight doesn't perfectly equal strength, but one figures a guy who's that size at least ought to be able to get it done most of the time if he's got the other tools to do it. A 215lb Tommy Smith like waif may not be able to.

So in summary, yeah, I'm guessing more on Bargnani, but I think I'm right. He could go down. I'm hedging on Tyrus for the moment, but I _expect_ in the final rating he'll be a 4. At this moment, I have little question that Bargnani has the right blend of size and athelticism to be a Dirk/Gasol type player. I have a somewhat bigger question that Thomas will be a KMart/McDyess style guy, just because I don't think we can be sure how his body will develop. I think it'll go in the right direction, but I want to be sure.

--------

Gay - I dunno if Gay is truly unusual in his physical abilities. Maybe he is... I just after watching him quite a bit, I don't see him as easily distinguished from the average young NBA 3. It's not that he's a bad athlete or anything, I'm just trying to measure him up compared to other top-flight guys. And compared to the average guy in the NBA, I don't know that he's obviously that great. 

Put another way, the seperation between "special" and "average" physical abilities at the 2/3 positions, I think, is a fair amount smaller than the seperation at the big spots and maybe the PG spot too. I can look at a guy like Bargnani or maybe Thomas and see how they might pose a matchup problem for another team based almost on their body alone. If you look, the only wing guy I've given a 4 to is Lebron, who at 6'8 and 240, and quick as greased lightning and with superb skills, is unusually good.

I don't see that for Gay. He'll be perfectly capable, even above average, but it's not like a team with Richard Jefferson or Corey Maggette or even Luol Deng is going to look at a team with Gay and go "uh-oh, we're gonna have a problem with this guy".

Roy - I didn't see as much as I'd like of him, but he just doesn't strike me as at quite the same level as a guy like Brewer or Gay or Carney (who's got absolutely superb physical attributes but the proverbial $0.10 head). He'll probably be capable of playing in the league, but think he'll be below average as far as physical attributes as his position. And that's worth considering.

*Edit:* A couple more things: On skills, I believe skills are reflected in stats and mental ability. Most should be reflected in stats, and those few "non-stat" based skills tend to be highly correlated with leadership and effort.

Joakim Noah: I'm not sure about. Right now I want to give him a want to give him a 2.5 for his physical ability. I've read... and looking at him bears it out, that lots of people think he might have trouble putting on weight and strength, but he's defintely not nimble enough to play outside either. As it stands, he gets pushed around a lot. But like Chandler he's generally effecive. I dunno.

as it stands, call him 3/3/2.5/4 = 3.13


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



ztect said:


> 2's = Roy, Collins , and Reggie ROby
> 
> 4 or 5's= Thomas, O'Bryant, Bargnani(?)
> 
> Draft is starting to look better with a 4/5 from Knicks pick
> and one of the two's from the Bulls pick, the Bulls will be a better team
> 
> Add Nene or even Mohamed for depth, and the Bulls will have
> a lot of assets to work with


I'm increasingly opitimistic about this draft but with some reservations.

All I'm expecting from these picks (if paxson doesn't trade them) is a big guy and a big guard that can give us solid 24 minutes a game. I think people have unrealistic expectations of what high picks produce. For every super star there's 5 guys that are solid.


----------



## Babble-On

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> Gay - I dunno if Gay is truly unusual in his physical abilities. Maybe he is... I just after watching him quite a bit, I don't see him as easily distinguished from the average young NBA 3. It's not that he's a bad athlete or anything, I'm just trying to measure him up compared to other top-flight guys. And compared to the average guy in the NBA, I don't know that he's obviously that great.....
> 
> I don't see that for Gay. He'll be perfectly capable, even above average, but it's not like a team with Richard Jefferson or Corey Maggette or even Luol Deng is going to look at a team with Gay and go "uh-oh, we're gonna have a problem with this guy".


Did you see that youtube highlight tape of Gay? I saw him do things on there that are beyond what I've seen Deng do defintely, and that would put him at least in the same category as Maggete and Richardson, maybe above them. Given, I haven't seen him do any of the things he did in that video when I've seen him live, so if thats what you're going off of, I'd understand that, because he doesn't seem to use his athletic ability to its fullest extent often enough. If you're going off his athletic abilty I think you gotta give him a 4. If you're going off how he integates those abilities into game situations, maybe the 3 is justified.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=H5kVpF7mAMo&search=rudy gay


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

This the bottom line.

Give me some guys that can finish..

I'm sick of seeing a fast break and STILL hoping we score on it.

I wanna see a fast break and brace myself for a crazy dunk that'll get the crowd going crazy...And energize our players THAT much more.

I don't wanna be thinking...man...please don't lose the ball...or don't travel...don't blow the lay-up...it drives me insane....

Give me someone that'll dunk they own momma if she was in the paint.

The dunk may be shrugged off by some basketball purist...But man...The underlying effects a dunk has can be huge.


----------



## Babble-On

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> This the bottom line.
> 
> Give me some guys that can finish..
> 
> I'm sick of seeing a fast break and STILL hoping we score on it.
> 
> I wanna see a fast break and brace myself for a crazy dunk that'll get the crowd going crazy...And energize our players THAT much more.
> 
> I don't wanna be thinking...man...please don't lose the ball...or don't travel...don't blow the lay-up...it drives me insane....
> 
> Give me someone that'll dunk they own momma if she was in the paint.
> 
> The dunk may be shrugged off by some basketball purist...But man...The underlying effects a dunk has can be huge.


I feel you. Thats why sometimes I think that maybe one of Deng or Gordon has to go, because I think you need a better finsher than either those guys are at one of those positions.


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## lgtwins

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Babble-On said:


> Did you see that youtube highlight tape of Gay? I saw him do things on there that are beyond what I've seen Deng do defintely, and that would put him at least in the same category as Maggete and Richardson, maybe above them. Given, I haven't seen him do any of the things he did in that video when I've seen him live, so if thats what you're going off of, I'd understand that, because he doesn't seem to use his athletic ability to its fullest extent often enough. If you're going off his athletic abilty I think you gotta give him a 4. If you're going off how he integates those abilities into game situations, maybe the 3 is justified.
> 
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=H5kVpF7mAMo&search=rudy gay


I also saw the highlight clips and pretty impressed with him. So I started to watch UConn games closely and Gay utterly let me down. It was an eye opening and learning experience. NEVER JUDGE A PLAYER ONLY BASED ON HIGHLIGHT CLIPS. He never showed that type of moves in games that I saw (total of 6 games). At all. More than often he disappear both offensively and defensively. He wasn't a game-maker at the college level and I am beginning to doubt that he will in NBA. He will probably more than a average NBA player but I don't see him being allstar or franchise type of player. Gain, at all. 

I really hope that Paxon won't pick him. But that's just me. 

My pick of now are Bargani, Morrison, or Thomas (If we indeed get Thomas, I think basically Tyson become expendable.)


----------



## lgtwins

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Babble-On said:


> I feel you. Thats why sometimes I think that maybe one of Deng or Gordon has to go, because I think you need a better finsher than either those guys are at one of those positions.


I couldn't agree with you more in that we need a finisher. But I am not sure Deng or Gordon has to go for us to get a finisher. And your guy, Gay, isn't a finisher that we need.


----------



## Babble-On

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



lgtwins said:


> I couldn't agree with you more in that we need a finisher. But I am not sure Deng or Gordon has to go for us to get a finisher. And your guy, Gay, isn't a finisher that we need.


Whoa Whoa Whoa Whoa Whoa. Gay is *NOT* my guy. I do not want him. I was just stating that I consider him to be very athletic, moreso than MikeDC thinks.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> Guys, thanks!
> 
> A couple comments on particulars.
> 
> Thomas- I've mentally told myself I'll be moving him up to a four for physical skills down the line but I want a more accurate gauge of his weight and strength. When the official measurements roll around and he's comes in at like 225lbs and still jumps out of the gym, he'll be a four.
> 
> Bargnani- Yeah, that's questionable to give him a 4 in terms of physical skills I guess, but I actually think it'll prove out. Everything I've read and seen suggests he's got a prototype body - about 6'11" and 240, is quick as a deer, and can pass the ball. That's one prototype for a PF/C body.
> 
> The other is Tyrus Thomas is he's like 225-230lbs. Yeah, I know weight doesn't perfectly equal strength, but one figures a guy who's that size at least ought to be able to get it done most of the time if he's got the other tools to do it. A 215lb Tommy Smith like waif may not be able to.
> 
> So in summary, yeah, I'm guessing more on Bargnani, but I think I'm right. He could go down. I'm hedging on Tyrus for the moment, but I _expect_ in the final rating he'll be a 4. At this moment, I have little question that Bargnani has the right blend of size and athelticism to be a Dirk/Gasol type player. I have a somewhat bigger question that Thomas will be a KMart/McDyess style guy, just because I don't think we can be sure how his body will develop. I think it'll go in the right direction, but I want to be sure.
> 
> --------
> 
> Gay - I dunno if Gay is truly unusual in his physical abilities. Maybe he is... I just after watching him quite a bit, I don't see him as easily distinguished from the average young NBA 3. It's not that he's a bad athlete or anything, I'm just trying to measure him up compared to other top-flight guys. And compared to the average guy in the NBA, I don't know that he's obviously that great.
> 
> Put another way, the seperation between "special" and "average" physical abilities at the 2/3 positions, I think, is a fair amount smaller than the seperation at the big spots and maybe the PG spot too. I can look at a guy like Bargnani or maybe Thomas and see how they might pose a matchup problem for another team based almost on their body alone. If you look, the only wing guy I've given a 4 to is Lebron, who at 6'8 and 240, and quick as greased lightning and with superb skills, is unusually good.
> 
> I don't see that for Gay. He'll be perfectly capable, even above average, but it's not like a team with Richard Jefferson or Corey Maggette or even Luol Deng is going to look at a team with Gay and go "uh-oh, we're gonna have a problem with this guy".
> 
> Roy - I didn't see as much as I'd like of him, but he just doesn't strike me as at quite the same level as a guy like Brewer or Gay or Carney (who's got absolutely superb physical attributes but the proverbial $0.10 head). He'll probably be capable of playing in the league, but think he'll be below average as far as physical attributes as his position. And that's worth considering.
> 
> *Edit:* A couple more things: On skills, I believe skills are reflected in stats and mental ability. Most should be reflected in stats, and those few "non-stat" based skills tend to be highly correlated with leadership and effort.
> 
> Joakim Noah: I'm not sure about. Right now I want to give him a want to give him a 2.5 for his physical ability. I've read... and looking at him bears it out, that lots of people think he might have trouble putting on weight and strength, but he's defintely not nimble enough to play outside either. As it stands, he gets pushed around a lot. But like Chandler he's generally effecive. I dunno.
> 
> as it stands, call him 3/3/2.5/4 = 3.13


You might want to increase your scale to 10 if you start doing fractions


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> This the bottom line.
> 
> Give me some guys that can finish..
> 
> I'm sick of seeing a fast break and STILL hoping we score on it.
> 
> I wanna see a fast break and brace myself for a crazy dunk that'll get the crowd going crazy...And energize our players THAT much more.
> 
> I don't wanna be thinking...man...please don't lose the ball...or don't travel...don't blow the lay-up...it drives me insane....
> 
> Give me someone that'll dunk they own momma if she was in the paint.
> 
> The dunk may be shrugged off by some basketball purist...But man...The underlying effects a dunk has can be huge.


Rodney Carney seems to be the best wing and Bargnani seems to be the best big at finishing in a fast break or semi-fast break situation. Not saying we need both either... just an observation.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Whoa Whoa Whoa Whoa Whoa. Gay is NOT my guy. I do not want him.


Whew!; I thought that we were going to have to refer to you as "Brokeback Babble-On" :biggrin:


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> OK, this year I'm trying to put together a system to rate out how I feel about the possible draft picks, and my first cut on the important guys is about done.
> 
> Basically, I'm giving each guy a 1-4 rating in 4 categories:
> * Stats, using my statistical rating system. 4 is a guy who rates out at Superstar or quality star production. 3 is a guy who rates out as a marginal star. 2 are guys who just rate out as starters. 1 is guys who seem to get worse statistically (they take more minutes to get the same stats, seem relatively inefficient, etc).
> 
> * Age/Experience. 4 is a Freshman or equivalently aged foreign player. 3 is a sophomore. 2 is a junior/senior. 1 is typically not given, but strikes me as a guy who's a senior and really has little upside. For example, I'm going back and trying to rate some previous players and I gave Lonny Baxter a 1. The basic idea is I believe (and I think it's a solid belief) that older guys "appear" better than the younger guys due to age/experience, etc, and you have to give extra weight to a younger guy who's putting up equivalent numbers.
> 
> * Physical Skills. This is very anecdotal at this point. It'll get better when the combine results come out, but at this point it's my judgement of whether a guy has the ideal size/athleticism/physical skills to play in the NBA. Ideal gets a 4. Fairly confident size/athelticism, but not quite prototype gets a 3. Marginal but probably capable (if the other qualities are good enough) gets a 2. Questionable NBA physical skills gets a 1.
> 
> * Head. Again, this is a judgement call, but I'm trying to assign a basic value to basketball IQ, general intelligence, leadership and "clutch" abiilty, and work ether. 4 is an unusually good player in this regard. 3 is a guy I'm confident in. 2 is a guy that is probably ok but has questions. 1 is Loren Woods or Leon Smith.
> 
> ---------------------
> So put all that together and take the average:
> S/A/P/H/O (Call it the lesbian index)
> 
> *Bigs*
> Bargnani:2/4/4/3 *3.25* (Very hard to judge since most of this is word of mouth)
> Thomas: 3/4/3/3 *3.25* (Thomas' head quotient could go up... I like the quotes I've heard from him)
> Aldridge: 3/3/3/3 *3.00*
> Williams: 3/2/2/4 *2.75*
> O'Bryant: 2/3/4/2 *2.75*
> P.Davis: 3/2/3/2 *2.50*
> Boone: 2/2/3/3 *2.50*
> Armstrong: 2/2/3/2 *2.25*
> 
> 
> Gay: 3/3/3/3 *3.00*
> Morrison: 4/2/2/4 *3.00
> *Roy: 3/2/2/4 *2.75*
> Brewer: 3/2/3/3/ *2.75*
> Carney: 2/2/4/2 *2.50*
> Reddick: 3/2/1/3 *2.25
> *M.Collins: 2/1/2/3 *2.00
> 
> ----------------------
> 
> Some previous guys I've tried to grade out using this system (I've tried to be objective and considered only what I thought about about the guy leading up to the draft, but obviously it's not perfect. Those are guys that I just sort of thought of).*
> 
> Lebron: 3/4/4/4 3.75
> Melo: 4/4/3/3 3.50
> Wade: 4/3/3/4 3.50
> Brand: 4/3/3/4 3.50
> Hinrich 3/2/3/4 3.00
> Boozer: 3/2/2/3 2.50
> Frye: 3/2/3/2 2.50
> Baxter: 2/1/1/4 2.00
> L.Woods: 1/2/3/1 1.75


Overall good estimation of the players listed above. There are some adjustments I think you could make:
I think you short-changed Redick in the stats and head category.
Bargnani's age/experience should be one point less, since he is 20 years old and will be 21 on opening day.
Thomas' stats is one point too high (not enough scoring), and his physical skills are one point too low.
Boone's head is one too high.
Armstrong's head is one too low. 
Gay's physical skills is one too low.
Roy's stats is one too low.

That's all I can think of. Good job though.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

My updated draft board (from a Bulls perspective):

Aldridge
Bargnani (I haven't seen a lot of the guy so I'll have to trust Pax on this one)
Noah
Splitter (if not worried about contract issues)
Thomas
Carney
Gay
Morrison
Brewer
Roy
O'Bryant
Armstrong
Williams
Glen Davis
Horford
McRoberts
Roby
Fernandez
Reddick

I'm assuming we go big with the NY pick, else I would slide O'Bryant and Armstrong ahead of Brewer and Roy.


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm not so sure how I feel about Noah. I love his game, and he's been one of my favorite players to watch in this tournament, if not my favorite, but I don't know how well it will translate to the big leagues.
I guess he is 230, 6'11", as a sophomore, but just from watching him, he doesn't strike me as having the bulk or physical play to make a big impact in the league.
I hope he can make it though, I love his attitude, and some of the plays he's made have been great, in the games I've watched. He has a great reach, which you can see from his aptitude for blocks, and from some of the insane dunks he's had.
He reminded me of Hakim Warrick from the past few years, he takes off and you don't think he can possibly get to the rim, but he extends those long arms and throws it down. I've seen a few of those in the tournament that just make you say Wow.

He does have a strange release, somewhere around his nose, which may cause problems with bigger, quicker defenders.

I didn't see much of Florida during the regular season, and missed their last tournament game, so I may be off-base on some of these comments.

On the whole, I don't know which direction to go as far as a big guy, to be honest.
Aldridge didn't really impress me all that much, but I think he has some promise. I don't know anything about the foreign prospects, and Thomas has really shot up quick, I don't know what to make of him either.
Should be interesting.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



JRose5 said:


> I'm not so sure how I feel about Noah. I love his game, and he's been one of my favorite players to watch in this tournament, if not my favorite, but I don't know how well it will translate to the big leagues.
> I guess he is 230, 6'11", as a sophomore, but just from watching him, he doesn't strike me as having the bulk or physical play to make a big impact in the league.
> I hope he can make it though, I love his attitude, and some of the plays he's made have been great, in the games I've watched. He has a great reach, which you can see from his aptitude for blocks, and from some of the insane dunks he's had.
> He reminded me of Hakim Warrick from the past few years, he takes off and you don't think he can possibly get to the rim, but he extends those long arms and throws it down. I've seen a few of those in the tournament that just make you say Wow.
> 
> He does have a strange release, somewhere around his nose, which may cause problems with bigger, quicker defenders.
> 
> I didn't see much of Florida during the regular season, and missed their last tournament game, so I may be off-base on some of these comments.
> 
> On the whole, I don't know which direction to go as far as a big guy, to be honest.
> Aldridge didn't really impress me all that much, but I think he has some promise. I don't know anything about the foreign prospects, and Thomas has really shot up quick, I don't know what to make of him either.
> Should be interesting.


The only major concern with Noah in my eyes is growing into his body. He played PG in high school and his passing ability is amazing, and might be an area easily overlooked if you have only seen a few games of his. If he adds bulk and strength, the sky is the limit for him in the NBA.

However, if we draft a guy such as Noah--which really doesn't address the low post scoring need--we have to have confidence in Gordon and Deng's ability to be consistent offensively. If two out of Hinrich, Deng, and Gordon average 18+ ppg (i.e. consistency), Noah would make a lot of sense. I think he is a great fit in a pick and roll scheme, or in sets at the top of the key. This is a guy that can get to the basket or spot an open man if the defense collapses. He would be a great fit if Tyson can learn a baby hook, as Tyson would probably play on the weak side low post much more than he currently is. Our offense would still be guard oriented, but we would have size in Noah, Chandler, and Deng to create an interior defense nightmare and would more than make up for having a small backcourt.

He does have a strange shooting stroke, but he is no Tyson offensively. He hit 73% of his free throws this season and showed confidence in hitting a jumper when wide open (out to about 12 feet). His baseline jumper seemed the most consistent, and we don't have a reliable guy to hit that shot outside of Deng. Most of his buckets came on putbacks and defensive interior lapses, but that is a great fit with a guard-oriented offense. A Tyson and Noah frontcourt could wear out teams both offensively through rebounding and also defensively, assuming they both play to their potential and are consistent. Another fire an energy guy is much needed as well. We have been falling asleep way too often this season (i.e. the leadership issue).

We could keep a Songaila and/or Allen, and sign Harrington in FA, so we can get big perimeter scoring if teams are playing the pick and roll well and we need to open something up.

Although I haven't seen much of him, this is why I have Bargnani rated ahead of Noah. A good offensive athletic big who can play above the rim seems like exactly what the Bulls need, although the strength and weight issue arises here the same as Noah. Aldridge is like Noah with a NBA frame and a little more polished offensively. Again, the strength and weight are a concern, but his size and skillset is why I still have him #1, although not in a runaway race.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I am posting this post from Ztect in here because so many have asked for clips of Bargnani and having this in this thread may be easier to find latter.


Watched these videos earlier today (not sure why they are not currently available)
and though not sure what you can really tell from "best of" clips, but Bargnani
does seem to really move well for his size, has a really nice stroke with range,
and attacks the basket. May not be the banger the Bulls need like Thomas,
but he doesn't like another Tskita either.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6131822744621417810&q=bargnani
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6413229403014366549&q=bargnani&pl=true
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8507760607728565556&q=bargnani&pl=true


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Some excerpts taken from Hoopshype:


> Brazilian forward Tiago Splitter will soon meet with his agents to decide if he enters the draft this year.





> Quincy Douby and his high school coach Jack Ringel will have a meeting with Rutgers head coach Fred Hill on April 6 to discuss the future of the Big East's top scorer, Ringel told HoopsHype.com. "As of today, it looks like he will declare,"


No idea who that is, someone else might share their view on him.



> An NBA scout told me Friday that he thought Texas’ LaMarcus Aldridge would be the best pro in the 2006 draft, but that whoever drafts him will need a ton of patience. If you watched Aldridge against LSU, you saw precisely what the scout meant. He’s thin, bordering on frail, which means he gets pushed around constantly. But add 25 pounds of muscle and a couple of years, and you might have Marcus Camby with better offensive skills.





> They all professed an affection for Marcus Williams from UConn, which surprised me a bit, since few people considered him a big time prospect before the season started. But two different guys told me that they feel like he’s the guy in the draft pool who could have the biggest impact on an NBA team because of the position he plays (a true, pass-first point guard in the Mark Jackson mold), his size (6-3, 205) and the fact that he’s left handed and extremely physical.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

marcus camby with better offensive is the most OFF comparison i've ever heard for aldridge


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

NY's draft pick

1) Tyrus Thomas
2) Aldridge
3) Bargnani
4) TRADE
5) Rudy Gay?

Our Pick
1) Brewer
2) Roy
3) Carney
4) O'Bryant
5) S. Williams


----------



## mr.ankle20

*The bulls should draft two big men in the upcoming draft*

Tyson chandler is really a bench player who should play 12-24 minutes a game. His lack of offense and his inconsistent defense really hurts the team . I thought it was embarassing watching him getting outplayed by darko. I think the bulls should draft two big men in this upcoming draft and let tyson come of the bench


----------



## jnrjr79

*Re: The bulls should draft two big men in the upcoming draft*

I think Tyson can contribute more than 12 minutes a game. However, I don't think you can count on him as your starting C, so I don't have a problem with drafting 2 bigs if we don't trade one or both of the picks. However, it's probably naive to think both would come in and start above Tyson right away. Tyson might get moved to the bench though through the draft and free agent signings, I suppose.


----------



## step

*Re: The bulls should draft two big men in the upcoming draft*

And yet another thread


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: The bulls should draft two big men in the upcoming draft*

yes, i am gonna merge it into the sticky draft thread. it's there for a reason.

work with me people, we're losing the light.


----------



## windy_bull

*Re: The bulls should draft two big men in the upcoming draft*



mr.ankle20 said:


> Tyson chandler is really a bench player who should play 12-24 minutes a game. His lack of offense and his inconsistent defense really hurts the team . I thought it was embarassing watching him getting outplayed by darko. I think the bulls should draft two big men in this upcoming draft and let tyson come of the bench


I tend to agree .... for the future 

for next year I don't see two bigs that are better than tyson right away. But if we come away with something like Aldridge and Sheldon/Splitter I see the rotation as being proposed ... in their second or third year in the league.

for 2005/2006 I would go with:

Hinrich/Gordon/Duhon
Deng/Gordon/Hinrich
Nocioni/Deng
Aldridge/Splitter or Sheldon/Nocioni
Chandler/Splitter or Sheldon/Aldridge

with some veteran ( 6'6 ) FA SG to be added in 2007 this group of youngsters should be able to go deep into the playoffs


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> I think Horford could be better than Noah.


I agree with this


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: The bulls should draft two big men in the upcoming draft*



mizenkay said:


> yes, i am gonna merge it into the sticky draft thread. it's there for a reason.
> 
> work with me people, we're losing the light.


miz

just out of interest - when did Pax utter that quote contained in your sig ?


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: The bulls should draft two big men in the upcoming draft*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> miz
> 
> just out of interest - when did Pax utter that quote contained in your sig ?


 Pax was quoted in an article in USA Today that ran yesterday.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/nba/bulls/2006-03-27-hinrich_x.htm


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: The bulls should draft two big men in the upcoming draft*



mizenkay said:


> Pax was quoted in an article in USA Today that ran yesterday.
> 
> http://www.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/nba/bulls/2006-03-27-hinrich_x.htm


Thank you m'am


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

How much is the difference between a top 3 pick and the 6-7 pick worth?

I was thinking about the idea of trading both our picks for a lower pick (to take Roy) and get a big in the trade.

I think we need two bigs, one of which can score, a big guard and to get older in general. One of these position, at least, has to be filled by F.A.

The mock drafts have Roy going about 6-7. 

For instance would Seatle do our two picks for their pick and Swift or Collison.

You'd end up with
C/PF F.A (Nene), Chandler, Big from trade
SF Deng, A.N
SG Roy, Gordon
PG Kirk, Duhon


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

we could get bigs in the draft better than BOTH those players


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

as far as building around KIRK and getting players for how he runs the team. it looks like their definintely going back to him being a pg fulltime which may mean a trade for gordon is looming. Deng is perfect along side hinrich IMO. Kirk, Deng & possibly Chandler (off the bench) are the only players I see longterm bulls.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> as far as building around KIRK and getting players for how he runs the team. it looks like their definintely going back to him being a pg fulltime which may mean a trade for gordon is looming. Deng is perfect along side hinrich IMO. Kirk, Deng & possibly Chandler (off the bench) are the only players I see longterm bulls.


Yep. 
I'd consider Nociono and Duhon resigning with us as a bonus. They are both luxaries coming off the bench.

This is why I get confused when people say "our core". Really, in my mind our core is Kirk and Deng, two guys the contribute both ends of the floor.

Whether you're a Skiles fan or not, I think people have to admit our unbalanced roster and one dimensonial nature of some of our players must be a major pain to juggle.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



darlets said:


> Yep.
> I'd consider Nociono and Duhon resigning with us as a bonus. They are both luxaries coming off the bench.
> 
> This is why I get confused when people say "our core". Really, in my mind our core is Kirk and Deng, two guys the contribute both ends of the floor.
> 
> Whether you're a Skiles fan or not, I think people have to admit our unbalanced roster and one dimensonial nature of some of our players must be a major pain to juggle.


DAMN! lol I never looked at it like that. Deng & Hinrich are truely our best players. I do agree with you about Duhon & Nocioni being luxaries off the bench also. Chandler & Gordon both have incredibly visible flaws, which is why I've NEVER considered them a serious part of the core. They're both bench players too IMO. If we could add Tyrus Thomas to that Deng/Hinrich core, I'd be estatic about the future of our team.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> DAMN! lol I never looked at it like that. Deng & Hinrich are truely our best players. I do agree with you about Duhon & Nocioni being luxaries off the bench also. Chandler & Gordon both have incredibly visible flaws, which is why I've NEVER considered them a serious part of the core. They're both bench players too IMO. If we could add Tyrus Thomas to that Deng/Hinrich core, I'd be estatic about the future of our team.


I'm curious about Tyrus Thomas after reading his draftexpress scouting report. I'm interested in how he goes in individual work outs in the skill department because he is a late bloomer that grew heaps. So I'd like to know what other skills he MAY have developed along the way playing other positions whilst growing.

I'd be happy if we got Thomas and Roy but we'd have to trade someone (Gordon) and our pick to get Roy.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



darlets said:


> I'm curious about Tyrus Thomas after reading his draftexpress scouting report. I'm interested in how he goes in individual work outs in the skill department because he is a late bloomer that grew heaps. So I'd like to know what other skills he MAY have developed along the way playing other positions whilst growing.
> 
> I'd be happy if we got Thomas and Roy but we'd have to trade someone (Gordon) and our pick to get Roy.


Honestly, I believe Roy could be the future at SG for us. As much as I like Carney, Roy was a leader & one of the best players in college all season. I prefer the atheletic Carney but Roy & Hinrich are born winners.

I honestly don't know much about Tyrus besides seeing him a few games this year and his last 3 in the tournament. From watching the last game though he showed me alot more than I believed he was capable of. I also believe he's a more well-rounded PF than Aldridge is.

K. Hinrich
B. Roy
L. Deng
T. Thomas

that's a HELL of a core and they're all above average defenders. Another thing is, one of the two out of the Carney/Brewer bunch WILL fall to our pick if it's in the 10-14 range so we'll end up with a good SG in this draft if paxson chooses one.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



darlets said:


> Yep.
> I'd consider Nociono and Duhon resigning with us as a bonus. They are both luxaries coming off the bench.
> 
> This is why I get confused when people say "our core". Really, in my mind our core is Kirk and Deng, two guys the contribute both ends of the floor.
> 
> Whether you're a Skiles fan or not, I think people have to admit our unbalanced roster and one dimensonial nature of some of our players must be a major pain to juggle.


I always viewed our core as Hinrich, Deng, and Chandler with Gordon getting a very good chance to be.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*




The ROY said:


> Honestly, I believe Roy could be the future at SG for us. As much as I like Carney, Roy was a leader & one of the best players in college all season. I prefer the atheletic Carney but Roy & Hinrich are born winners.
> 
> I honestly don't know much about Tyrus besides seeing him a few games this year and his last 3 in the tournament. From watching the last game though he showed me alot more than I believed he was capable of. I also believe he's a more well-rounded PF than Aldridge is.
> 
> K. Hinrich
> B. Roy
> L. Deng
> T. Thomas
> 
> that's a HELL of a core and they're all above average defenders.


The more I read about Roy the more he sounds like a Paxon type of guy.
Skiles would be beside himself if he got to use those four on the defensive end.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



darlets said:


> The more I read about Roy the more he sounds like a Paxon type of guy.
> Skiles would be beside himself if he got to use those four on the defensive end.


I rank the SG's :

1. Roy - the undisputed LEADER of the bunch, he never dissapears and he does EVERYTHING well but not one thing great, DEFININTELY a paxson/skiles player.
2. Carney - probably the best athlete in college basketball, has the most star potential but can dissapear at times, he's also the most explosive of this group. he's my favorite.
3. Brewer - He has the weakest shot out of the group, but the best ballhandling skills and maybe the best defender of the bunch, I don't really view him as an SG that could replace Gordon, but obviously he has size over Ben. He seems more like a bench guy IMO.

any combination of Aldridge/Thomas/Roy/Carney should be fine. one big and guard are atheletic (thomas/carney) while the other big and guard aren't (Aldridge/Roy). We need atleast ONE athlete though.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The more I think about it, the more scenarios it appears there are. My prefered scenario remains as I wrote a few days ago to pick T thomas with the knicks pick and Roy with ours. This would give us two athletic energetic players to fill our most glaring need: inside presence and a big 2 guard.

However, i would also be happy with Bargnani with the Knicks pick, and wouldn't be too upset if we get Aldridge, since scouts all seem to say he is a talent (although I am not wild about him).

Finally, I think I would also be OK with seing a big-time scorer like Morrisson or a super athletic wingman like Carney or Gay. There may be still some questions about how Morrisson's game will translate in the pros, or about whether Gay and Carney are still way too rough for the NBA, but they also all have intreaguing potential.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I can't even speak on Bargnani for two reasons :

1. I don't know much about his game besides a few video clips, and while they appear to show some skills, they don't show ENUFF.

2. He's a big euro forward that likes to shoot from the outside, isn't really good defensively and doesn't block many shots. He doesn't really seem like the player we need. Adding him would make us even LESS athletic if that's even possible LOL.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I can't even speak on Bargnani for two reasons :
> 
> 1. I don't know much about his game besides a few video clips, and while they appear to show some skills, they don't show ENUFF.
> 
> 2. He's a big euro forward that likes to shoot from the outside, isn't really good defensively and doesn't block many shots. He doesn't really seem like the player we need. Adding him would make us even LESS athletic if that's even possible LOL.



Roy - You can't comment on Bargnani??? Seems like point was not only a comment, but completely off base as well. 

I enjoy your posts, but it's posts like these that make no sense. I won't comment on someone I know very little about, but here's my comments and they prove I know very little (if not nothing) about the guy.

I do agree with your Roy, Carney, Brewer break down. However, I think Brewer will be a bigger contributor than just a defensive guy.

Keep the faith, things are looking up................Next season LOL


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> Roy - You can't comment on Bargnani??? Seems like point was not only a comment, but completely off base as well.
> 
> I enjoy your posts, but it's posts like these that make no sense. I won't comment on someone I know very little about, but here's my comments and they prove I know very little (if not nothing) about the guy.
> 
> I do agree with your Roy, Carney, Brewer break down. However, I think Brewer will be a bigger contributor than just a defensive guy.
> 
> Keep the faith, things are looking up................Next season LOL


I mean, what can any of us REALLY say about bargnani? I'm not hating on the guy, I think he has talent. If Paxson drafts him, obviously he knows more than us. But until then, I can only speak on what I've seen in a couple minutes of tape. A few long outside jumpers, a couple of slashes to the basket, a block or two and some free throws. I've seen no post up game, no athleticism, not even any really good defensive plays displayed.

what do u want me to say?


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I mean, what can any of us REALLY say about bargnani? I'm not hating on the guy, I think he has talent. If Paxson drafts him, obviously he knows more than us. But until then, I can only speak on what I've seen in a couple minutes of tape. A few long outside jumpers, a couple of slashes to the basket, a block or two and some free throws. I've seen no post up game, no athleticism, not even any really good defensive plays displayed.
> 
> what do u want me to say?



I'd prefer you leave it at "I don't know enough about him to make derogatory comments about him to support the guys I want instead".

Still, 

I understand where you are coming from.

It's frustrating to to read people rip or prop guys for no reason.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I mean, what can any of us REALLY say about bargnani? I'm not hating on the guy, I think he has talent. If Paxson drafts him, obviously he knows more than us. But until then, I can only speak on what I've seen in a couple minutes of tape. A few long outside jumpers, a couple of slashes to the basket, a block or two and some free throws. I've seen no post up game, no athleticism, not even any really good defensive plays displayed.
> 
> what do u want me to say?



Yo...You witness A 7 FOOTER taking it HARD to the rim from 20 ft. out AND dunk it in traffic....And manipulate his body around the basket to manufacture a circus shot.

THAT'S athleticism.

Everything else I'll co-sign.

Exactly why I say he's more of a 3....Closer to Dirk than Gasol...

BUT...Those skills with his body type...It's not normal....That's a huge advantage for anyone that picks the kid.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> I'd prefer you leave it at "I don't know enough about him to make derogatory comments about him to support the guys I want instead".
> 
> Still,
> 
> I understand where you are coming from.
> 
> It's frustrating to to read people rip or prop guys for no reason.


durogtory? don't u think you're going a little to...um...FAR chi? I never dissed the kid, if paxson took him I wouldn't be ANGRY, I haven't pubically trashed any parts of his game....

I prefer Thomas over every player in the draft but this isn't ABOUT supporting thomas..

This is the 2nd time you've done this regarding Bargnani, you seem a bit too emotional over him for NOTHING....


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I can't even speak on Bargnani for two reasons :
> 
> 1. I don't know much about his game besides a few video clips, and while they appear to show some skills, they don't show ENUFF.
> 
> 2. He's a big euro forward that likes to shoot from the outside, isn't really good defensively and doesn't block many shots. He doesn't really seem like the player we need. Adding him would make us even LESS athletic if that's even possible LOL.


I can't go with your last statement. Perhaps the only thing I can see from the Bargnani clips is that he's incredibly athletic. The speed with which he makes it from the top of the key to the hoop on the dunk clip I've seen is guard fast. He looks extremely athletic for his height.

But I don't see any post moves, and I don't know if he's the guy we need either.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Carney = NO HEART...I smell the summers eve.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Carney = NO HEART...I smell the summers eve.


He was stepping up and being an inspirational leader throughout the tournament. Then he got in foul trouble against UCLA and didn't have much of a chance.

For all the knocks about his outside shot and leadership, he has shown vast improvement in both areas last season to this, and then continuing to improve all season.

His basketball IQ/learning curve is more what I'm worried about with him, which is why I think he'll be a great fit here. Gordon will be in front of him taking off a lot of pressure while he learns offensive sets and learns how to play team defense from Skiles (which I think is one of his best teaching areas). Assuming Gordon continues to only improve marginally, Carney could eventually step up when he feels comfortable. Else, a Kirk, Gordon, Carney could be a great backcourt of the future.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> He was stepping up and being an inspirational leader throughout the tournament. Then he got in foul trouble against UCLA and didn't have much of a chance.
> 
> For all the knocks about his outside shot and leadership, he has shown vast improvement in both areas last season to this, and then continuing to improve all season.
> 
> His basketball IQ/learning curve is more what I'm worried about with him, which is why I think he'll be a great fit here. Gordon will be in front of him taking off a lot of pressure while he learns offensive sets and learns how to play team defense from Skiles (which I think is one of his best teaching areas). Assuming Gordon continues to only improve marginally, Carney could eventually step up when he feels comfortable. Else, a Kirk, Gordon, Carney could be a great backcourt of the future.


All that's well and good.

But did you see his FACE during that college dunk contest?

I mean..Yeah...That was disgusting how he nearly got the dunk for a foot BEHIND the freethrow line.

I just didn't like his facial expressions....Looked to whither under pressure...Didn't like the focus on him...Just had this look on his face like..."FORGET IT"...I didn't like that one bit..


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> All that's well and good.
> 
> But did you see his FACE during that college dunk contest?
> 
> I mean..Yeah...That was disgusting how he nearly got the dunk for a foot BEHIND the freethrow line.
> 
> I just didn't like his facial expressions....Looked to whither under pressure...Didn't like the focus on him...Just had this look on his face like..."FORGET IT"...I didn't like that one bit..


I missed the college dunk contest. I'll just say that if facial expression made the player, Tracy McGrady would never have made the league.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> I missed the college dunk contest. I'll just say that if facial expression made the player, Tracy McGrady would never have made the league.


What exactly has Tracy McGrady won?


That's my point.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> What exactly has Tracy McGrady won?
> 
> 
> That's my point.


This year and last have been the only two situations he has been put in to possibly contend for a championship. He wasn't winning anything in Toronto and Orlando with Grant Hill's injuries.

What has Brand, Artest, Miller, Crawford, Curry, Rose, or any of the other players a lot of us miss won either--we should be clamoring that we won all of these trades because they haven't won a championship. If anything, Artest is the worst among them because he was one of the principles that cost Indiana a legitimate shot at getting to the title game.

Point being, I don't think winning a championship should be a qualification of whether a guy would help a team out or not. If it were, players like Steve Kerr and Robert Horry should be a hot commodity, no? Is Shareef Abdur-Rahim is the worst player in the league because he has the most games played without postseason experience?


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> This year and last have been the only two situations he has been put in to possibly contend for a championship. He wasn't winning anything in Toronto and Orlando with Grant Hill's injuries.
> 
> What has Brand, Artest, Miller, Crawford, Curry, Rose, or any of the other players a lot of us miss won either--we should be clamoring that we won all of these trades because they haven't won a championship. If anything, Artest is the worst among them because he was one of the principles that cost Indiana a legitimate shot at getting to the title game.
> 
> Point being, I don't think winning a championship should be a qualification of whether a guy would help a team out or not. If it were, players like Steve Kerr and Robert Horry should be a hot commodity, no? Is Shareef Abdur-Rahim is the worst player in the league because he has the most games played without postseason experience?



you're taking the discussion to a distant land.

I made a character judgment on Carney from what I saw in his face.

You brought up Tracy and basically proved my point for me....

In a climate of so much talent...One has to look at intangibles which seperate the men from the boys...a lot of mental aspects show themselves on one's face...i see it..

I think I just have this gift...I need to better explain this gift so you guys can see what I see


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> you're taking the discussion to a distant land.
> 
> I made a character judgment on Carney from what I saw in his face.
> 
> You brought up Tracy and basically proved my point for me....
> 
> In a climate of so much talent...One has to look at intangibles which seperate the men from the boys...a lot of mental aspects show themselves on one's face...i see it..
> 
> I think I just have this gift...I need to better explain this gift so you guys can see what I see


You must not have seen Carney in the Bradley game where he was fired up, slapping teammates when getting back on defense and yelling at other teammates when they made a boneheaded play.

I don't think McGrady proved your point at all. The guy is a competitor in every sense of the word despite his demeanor on the outside. What you made it sound like to me is that if you have a quiet demeanor on the outside, you're not worth anything unless you have been on the Pistons, Spurs, Lakers, or Bulls in the past 15 years. Brand never had that face of a competitor when on the Bulls, he has not won anything, yet he has MVP consideration this year...

I just find your retort to your original statement (what has he won?) illogical, not proving your point.

Note--this isn't aimed as an attack on you, just your argument


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> You must not have seen Carney in the Bradley game where he was fired up, slapping teammates when getting back on defense and yelling at other teammates when they made a boneheaded play.
> 
> I don't think McGrady proved your point at all. The guy is a competitor in every sense of the word despite his demeanor on the outside. What you made it sound like to me is that if you have a quiet demeanor on the outside, you're not worth anything unless you have been on the Pistons, Spurs, Lakers, or Bulls in the past 15 years. Brand never had that face of a competitor when on the Bulls, he has not won anything, yet he has MVP consideration this year...
> 
> I just find your retort to your original statement (what has he won?) illogical, not proving your point.
> 
> Note--this isn't aimed as an attack on you, just your argument



okay...we wanna win though...

you wanna compare facial expressions to a player who is so great he can't get out of the 1st round of the playoffs?

that just proves my point as to why i got turned off even further to Carney after the contest....that face i saw..was a face of a loser..to put it quite blunt about it


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> okay...we wanna win though...
> 
> you wanna compare facial expressions to a player who is so great he can't get out of the 1st round of the playoffs?
> 
> that just proves my point as to why i got turned off even further to Carney after the contest....that face i saw..was a face of a loser..to put it quite blunt about it


I think he has this perimeter shooting and leadership knocks weighed so heavily against him, that he is viewed as one of those guys who is tremendously athletic with no skills, so is likely to be a bust. I've seen improvement in his game all season long, and I think he had a terrific tournament--the foul trouble against UCLA aside. His perimeter shooting is good, he really stepped it up on the defensive end this season, and his ball handling seemed light years ahead of where it were his Junior year (my biggest knock on him coming into this season).

Leadership and basketball IQ were my two largest knocks on him entering the tournament. Even though the ball was in Washington's hands, Carney was the leader out there. His passing ability is marginal and his shot selection is questionable, but these are both things that can be learned--I'm not saying that he will ever be tremendous at setting up teammates, but he certainly can learn not to be a liability.

He needs a teaching type coach, and I think Skiles and the low pressure sitution (in terms of expectations of immediate production) will be low here and be a great fit.

I understand the skepticism, and I think all that skepticism will make his stock fall in the draft. If that does happen, I think he is most likely one of the steals of the draft and really hope he will be available with the Bulls pick. Out of everyone in the draft, I think Carney is one of the relative few with Superstar potential... simply projecting, of course.

I think he is good enough to start for some NBA teams already (Denver, Charlotte, Orlando, etc), although I don't think that will be the best for his long-term career.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm really liking Skinn on George Mason, he could be a good backup point guard. He has lots of speed, and I like how he attacks the rim, kind of reminds me of Allen Iverson, and he seems to get it in the hole good too.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> He needs a teaching type coach, and I think Skiles and the low pressure sitution (in terms of expectations of immediate production) will be low here and be a great fit.


What has Skiles taught any of our guys on O?

Skiles strikes me as a guy that can leverage player's skills (ala Othello Harrison) but I can't think of a single player that has really added to their skills under Skiles. Some guys like Noch and Gordon seem more comfortable, but more skilled? Wierd since we have so many young players. You would think someone would just naturally improve.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Is Thomas still a top 2 pick?


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

For this game it looks like as Glen Davis goes so does Tyrus Thomas.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Watching all these prospects playing a defensively-intensive UCLA, it looks like Adam Morrison is still the best player out there.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Is Thomas still a top 2 pick?


I think so 

The whole LSU team wasn't in rythym today - they were impatient with their offense which put them into panic mode in their whole game 

Thomas , like Carney when Memphis bowed out , were out of the flow of the game and were pressing

You still saw snippets here and there of Thomas's athleticism and he even flashed a nice post move in the opening where he nudged right like half a drop step before swinging back the other way off the glass

They use him at the back on defense for obviosu reasons but there were some plays early where he looked good covering the perimeter and then rotating back for help

I see him as an extremely versatile defender that has a couple of offensive moves there already and a guy with a huge motor that is going to be effective in his first season 

He has the mindset and the skills to be able to achieve this and a guy that looks like he can carry another 15 to 20 pounds pretty easily that would pull him up around 6'9 - 240 

I'd be more than happy over time seeing he and Luol at forward and Roy or Carney at guard with Kirk with Chandler and Gordon from the bench supported by Songaila, Nocioni and Duhon

Now just to get a big bodied Center that doesn't have to be allstar but is at least a moderate 2 way player ( with more an emphasis on body up man to man defense ) 

Add to that the Knick pick swap next year with the bounty of genuine Centers in next year's draft and we're in good shape for a fringe playoff team that can and will get better through organic growth / improvement with what we got


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

BTW - LSU sure suck as a perimeter shooting team 

I thought they were lucky to get by Texas but against a team with a quality guard attack and athletic big men that can smother Baby..LSU were going to struggle 

Florida will take it over UCLA though


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The Bulls would have been better off had LSU won. Getting humiliated might motivate Thomas to return to LSU next season. 

Likewise Bulls fans should be pulling for Florida to win it all and give the draft more depth.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

...with the #1 pick in the 2007 NBA draft, the Chicago Bulls select Greg Oden from The Ohio State University.

Anyway, it looks like Joakim Noah might be the pick for this season. Unless UCLA shuts him down as well.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I got this from another thread. These are highlights from a recent college dunk contest (this year? last year?)

Man, it's too bad we don't have a very late first rounder/early second rounder to use on James White. Who knows, maybe he'll work himself into the mid-first round. It's happened before. Luke Jackson rose way up the draft boards after the tournament ended. 

And sweet Jesus, Carney almost dunked the ball from a foot behind the free throw line. :eek8: 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwxA-pHhVwI&search=james white


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> What has Skiles taught any of our guys on O?
> 
> Skiles strikes me as a guy that can leverage player's skills (ala Othello Harrison) but I can't think of a single player that has really added to their skills under Skiles. Some guys like Noch and Gordon seem more comfortable, but more skilled? Wierd since we have so many young players. You would think someone would just naturally improve.


I think Hinrich, Duhon, Deng, and Nocioni are all improved on the offensive end. Our team offensive efficiency is much improved over last year as well.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I got this from another thread. These are highlights from a recent college dunk contest (this year? last year?)
> 
> Man, it's too bad we don't have a very late first rounder/early second rounder to use on James White. Who knows, maybe he'll work himself into the mid-first round. It's happened before. Luke Jackson rose way up the draft boards after the tournament ended.
> 
> And sweet Jesus, Carney almost dunked the ball from a foot behind the free throw line. :eek8:
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwxA-pHhVwI&search=james white


James White is the best athelete in pro or college basketball IMO. He's so fast and gets so much air. However, he rarely uses his athleticism in games.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

James White is a skywalker!!! :eek8: :jawdrop:


----------



## narek

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

A new column from Mike McGraw on the draft:

LSU’s Thomas may have elevated to the top of NBA draft  



> It’s interesting that two NBA draft sites (NBADraft.net and DraftExpress.com) and the McGraw Casual College Observer Ratings (available only in this paper) came to the same conclusion last week — LSU’s Tyrus Thomas is the top pick of this year’s draft.
> 
> The 6-foot-9 power forward turned in monster performances against Duke and Texas in the two regional games last week. Due to foul trouble, he only played 17 minutes in Saturday’s semifinal loss to UCLA, but that one game shouldn’t hurt him.
> 
> It’s still a tight race, but the New York Knicks have so far shown no interest in relinquishing the NBA’s worst record. If it stays that way, the Bulls will be guaranteed a top-four selection in the June 28 draft, since they own the Knicks’ pick from the Eddy Curry trade.
> 
> There could be three promising big men available for the Bulls — Thomas, Texas center LaMarcus Aldridge and Florida’s multi-talented Joakim Noah — though there is no guarantee that any of them will declare for the draft. All three are in their second year of college.
> 
> Early entries have until April 29 to declare for the draft and can withdraw before June 18. In recent years, very few players destined to be one of the top 10 picks have opted to stay in school, but there are always exceptions.
> 
> Most every NBA scout I’ve spoken to has nice things to say about Aldridge, though they doubt if he’ll contribute much right away.
> 
> While Aldridge is a nice player, Thomas could be a force of nature. Thomas’ athleticism and shot-blocking ability in the NCAA Tournament brought forth visions of him growing into some sort of cross between Shawn Marion and Ben Wallace. LSU legend Bob Pettit called Thomas a “young Bill Russell.”


and



> Another player who hit the Bulls’ radar screen during the tournament is 6-foot-6 Washington guard Brandon Roy. If the big men aren’t there, Roy might be a logical choice to pair in the backcourt with Kirk Hinrich, leaving Ben Gordon in the sixth-man role.
> 
> Roy, a senior, has all the skills and is remarkably efficient with the ball. *The popular knee-jerk reaction that the Bulls must trade Gordon if he’s not a starter is misguided. There is plenty of room for three solid guards on any roster.*
> 
> Italy’s 7-foot Andrea Bargnani is generally accepted as the European prospect with the best chance of cracking the top five draft picks. One scout compared him to Orlando’s Darko Milicic, who played well against the Bulls last week.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Al Horford would not be a bad gamble if we had to choose a big man with our pick. I think Shelden would be long gone by then. I do hope Pax investigates the situation with Splitter's buyout.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> James White is the best athelete in pro or college basketball IMO. He's so fast and gets so much air. However, he rarely uses his athleticism in games.


That was a really entertaining dunk contest, I have never seen anyone throw it down with two hands from the free throw line, that is nuts. White was clearly the best athlete, but Carney was a close second. The one dunk Carney missed he jumped from a foot behinde the FT line, the two he made were impressive.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> Al Horford would not be a bad gamble if we had to choose a big man with our pick. I think Shelden would be long gone by then. I do hope Pax investigates the situation with Splitter's buyout.


I'm beginning to think if N.Y pick is lower than expected 3-5, paxson won't be able to trade our picks, which I think is his first option.

In that case, I can see Paxson taking Roy with the Knicks pick and Horford with our pick. And trying to address size in free Agency. They come across as Paxson type players. Who we draft is a question of who Paxson wants and likes not who we like.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

According to the commenators during this game tonight, they say Donavan has said that Horford has the highest BBall IQ of any player he has ever coached = JIB


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## BG7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I've been thinking about our offseason, and this is what I think we should do.

Draft: Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah

Free Agency: Bonzi Wells, Flip Murray, and Joel Pryzbilla

PG-Kirk Hinrich/Chris Duhon
SG-Ben Gordon/Flip Murray/Bonzi Wells
SF-Luol Deng/Andres Nocioni
PF-Tyrus Thomas/Joakim Noah
C- Tyson Chandler/Joel Pryzbilla


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

LOL, u don't start chandler over Noah..c'mon man..

bonzi? FLIP? NEXTTTTTTT!

anyway...LOL @ ya'll with your horford over Noah's crap..

horford's a REGULAR big man, Noah is a SPECIAL player...stop kidding yourselves

that's why the bulls suck now...


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> bonzi? FLIP? NEXTTTTTTT!


What do you expect, we're after a backup 2 guard, not MJ.

I happen to think both would be suitable backup guards, Bonzi especially. I'm not sure if that's what he would want, but if you could manage to swing that, he would be a nice pickup.


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## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> Al Horford would not be a bad gamble if we had to choose a big man with our pick. I think Shelden would be long gone by then. I do hope Pax investigates the situation with Splitter's buyout.


Horford is that traditional back-to-basket low post offensive option, and he's got really great hands. You could see the way he and Noah were working the ball back and forth.

I'd be really happy with one of these Florida guys, mainly because they've matured THIS SEASON. The Gators were definitely not in championship form earlier in the season, not at all. I remember thinking to myself that this is a team that can execute on both ends, but doesn't have the talent to really keep up. 

But they started clicking a few weeks before the tournament. Their frontcourt started getting more fierce and more creative; their backcourt started operating much more fluidly. And now, those guys have emerged as players not just from temporary spurts of success, but from maturation as players. I really like seeing actual player development and adaptability, not just selfish players that try to do what they already do even better. Florida, as a team, demonstrated such development and flexibility, so I'd feel good about taking players from their program.

Noah isn't going to be a beast but he looks like a wily international-style player, while still fierce enough to block shots and sky for rebounds. Don't be deceived, though; there's no way he stands a full 6'11", as listed. If we take Noah in this draft, it would be with our Knicks pick, not with our own, simply because I'm almost positive that his tournament performance got him into the top 10 picks.

Horford is really quick for someone so powerful, like a young Larry Johnson. Great hands, terrific quickness. He might be around at our pick, but I'd be more interested in Splitter, Shelden, even Hilton Armstrong.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



sloth said:


> I've been thinking about our offseason, and this is what I think we should do.
> 
> Draft: Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah
> 
> Free Agency: Bonzi Wells, Flip Murray, and Joel Pryzbilla
> 
> PG-Kirk Hinrich/Chris Duhon
> SG-Ben Gordon/Flip Murray/Bonzi Wells
> SF-Luol Deng/Andres Nocioni
> PF-Tyrus Thomas/Joakim Noah
> C- Tyson Chandler/Joel Pryzbilla


Fun names, but we can't play all these guys. The reality is that on most teams 7 to 8 guys play 20 plus minutes, you've got 11 names here. Bonzi Wells and Joel Pryzbilla are nice players, but they aren't the 10th and 11th men on anyone's team. Time to consolidate.

Also, no way are we getting Thomas and Noah, and if we did who the heck is posting up? None of the four bigs you have listed has anything close to a developed post game.


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The thing about Noah is that there is a 25/75 split about his draft position, with the majority projecting him to be a late lottery pick. If some people on this board think Noah is worthy of the Knicks' pick, I think it would be a waste. Why not trade for a slightly lower pick, then draft Noah there? Or, they can go for the "true" stud prospect with the Knicks' pick (Aldridge, Thomas, Morrison, whoever) and use their own pick on Noah.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Did anyone see Charles Barkley on ESPN talking with the college basketball crew? There was a discussion about J-Red and A-Morr. Sir Charles said that JJ should help his pro career by working on his point guard skill, and he said that Morrison is athletic and will be a stud in the league.

I know most of the people on this board don't want the Bulls to become the second coming of the Atlanta Hawks or the 2004 US Olympic Basketball Team (overabundance of small forwards), but I'll still be a big fan of Morrison's no matter what team he is on.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Did anyone see Charles Barkley on ESPN talking with the college basketball crew? There was a discussion about J-Red and A-Morr. Sir Charles said that JJ should help his pro career by working on his point guard skill, and he said that Morrison is athletic and will be a stud in the league.
> 
> I know most of the people on this board don't want the Bulls to become the second coming of the Atlanta Hawks or the 2004 US Olympic Basketball Team (overabundance of small forwards), but I'll still be a big fan of Morrison's no matter what team he is on.


I like Morrison, but I wouldn't take Sir Charles too seriously. As far as I cant tell via his commentary during TNT broadcasts, Barkley's watched the best five teams in the league play and is totally clueless past that. If Pax thinks Morrison is genuinely special I'm all for taking him and figuring things out subsequently, but I don't think Charles Barkley is a source worth listening to when it comes to the draft...


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm sorry...I don't see Noah being more than an energy player....Now, he has some great instincts in place CURRENTLY...I just don't see them translating to star skills in the league YET....I like the kid...Just not enamoured...He's another one of those players I want to be wrong about.

Horford plays so strong...Really...That kid is nice...Looks to have an intense work ethic...Touch around the basket...ARE YOU KIDDING ME?...Anyone who likes Horford OVER Noah in the league, isn't dumb...They're just looking beyond...


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## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

a journalists article on who he'll think will stay in college or go to the nba

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/bj_schecter/04/04/stay.go/index.html


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## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



darlets said:


> a journalists article on who he'll think will stay in college or go to the nba
> 
> http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/bj_schecter/04/04/stay.go/index.html


We would be good if that's how it turns out.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

horford is a BASIC pf with a high b-ball iq...WHOOPTY FRIKIN DOO...vin baker pt 2

Noah does so much more than that kid..it's not even worth arguing over...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The KNICKS are a full game up on Charlotte & Portland for the leagues worst record.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> horford is a BASIC pf with a high b-ball iq...WHOOPTY FRIKIN DOO...vin baker pt 2
> 
> Noah does so much more than that kid..it's not even worth arguing over...


FYI. Before Vin had alcohol problems he was a very good player. His best season he averaged 21 and 10.


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> horford is a BASIC pf with a high b-ball iq...WHOOPTY FRIKIN DOO...vin baker pt 2
> 
> Noah does so much more than that kid..it's not even worth arguing over...


Noah is able to do alot of the things he does because he has Al Horford watching his back. 
I believe Noah benefits greatly from having a front court mate like Horford. Noah might be a better player but I am not sure Horford wouldn't be a better fit with the current Bulls team.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> I'm sorry...I don't see Noah being more than an energy player....Now, he has some great instincts in place CURRENTLY...I just don't see them translating to star skills in the league YET....I like the kid...Just not enamoured...He's another one of those players I want to be wrong about.
> 
> Horford plays so strong...Really...That kid is nice...Looks to have an intense work ethic...Touch around the basket...ARE YOU KIDDING ME?...Anyone who likes Horford OVER Noah in the league, isn't dumb...They're just looking beyond...


Horford does look really strong and plays with polished game. But I think Noah's more than an energy guy. He makes some really sweet passes, and he knows how to position himself to be in a great spot to receive passes too. He blocks shots not only out of his length but out of great timing and at least on the college level, absolutely changes the game in the paint. He has very good physique and athleticism, which coupled with smart defensive instincts, makes him a very good defender that won't be as foul-prone.

Being an energy guy alone is one thing. But having some skills and general sports sense as well as the athleticism and energy to make those abilities come alive... that's something else completely. I thought of Noah as just an energy guy for most of the season, but he's shown that he can handle and pass the ball in the open court and in the halfcourt, and that he can make a huge difference on both ends of the court.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> Horford does look really strong and plays with polished game. But I think Noah's more than an energy guy. He makes some really sweet passes, and he knows how to position himself to be in a great spot to receive passes too. He blocks shots not only out of his length but out of great timing and at least on the college level, absolutely changes the game in the paint. He has very good physique and athleticism, which coupled with smart defensive instincts, makes him a very good defender that won't be as foul-prone.
> 
> Being an energy guy alone is one thing. But having some skills and general sports sense as well as the athleticism and energy to make those abilities come alive... that's something else completely. I thought of Noah as just an energy guy for most of the season, but he's shown that he can handle and pass the ball in the open court and in the halfcourt, and that he can make a huge difference on both ends of the court.


Noah reminds me of a 7' Nocioni without the perimeter shot. Looks out of control, but is strangely effective. I definately see some of what he has been able to accomplish in college translating to the NBA.

As for the Kukoc comparison, Noah signed on with Florida as a PG before he grew 6-7 more inches. i.e. a 7-footer with PG skills--and I still think he will catch up to his body athletically. The largest knock I have on him is his strength and the ability to put on muscle. However, if he can maintain his drive to compensate his strength, then he should be fine.

I'm definately higher on him than on Thomas, although I don't think either would be a bad selection for the Bulls.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

*Jack (Chicago):* You're the Bulls GM. What do you do this summer if you can't get Garnett from the Wolves? Trade the picks for a scoring 2 guard (who?) or who do you take in the draft with their two picks? 



* Chris Broussard: (2:03 PM ET )* _If I'm the Bulls, obviously you can market your picks and see what trade value there is. But I don't think you'll be able to do that. Most likely, you'll keep those picks. *If I'm the Bulls, I'm looking at Joakim Noah, if he comes out. He's committed. He brings energy. He has great skills. He has some moves down low, though he'll have to bulk up. I think he'll have a decent post game. That's a team built to play fast in Chicago. They're athletic.* I think Noah would be strong for them in that system. HE could be a guy that would be strong in the future. Without studying the draft in depth, I would say Noah would be a good fit. A guard, I don't think that's their most pressing need. I like Ben Gordon, he could be a very good player in this league. Hinrich is more than solid. I think the Bulls' perimeter is OK. They really miss *Eddie Curry*._


espn chat 



not sure how much actually he knows the Bulls needs. a big SG is a pressing need, imo. in addition to help upfront, obviously.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

lol...he said we're athletic


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> lol...he said we're athletic


As a team, we are very athletic. Allen, Songaila, and Harrington are really our only below average athletes. The rest of our team is average to good athletes

As individuals, about the only player you could say is uber-athletic is Chandler, which I think is why it's difficult to view our team as athletic. When you break everything down piece by piece, he's the only one that stands out.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Chad Ford tidbit about Bargnani and who would the Bulls take if they were to land #1:

"*Bargnani* is putting up solid numbers in the Euroleague, like Gasol was. He's *probably more ready for the NBA than scouts are giving him credit for*. I just can't figure out which team is going to pull the trigger for him at No. 1. Of all the teams out there, the *Bulls* might make the most sense, but *from what I hear, Tyrus Thomas is their guy if they get the No. 1 pick*."
And more Bulls stuff:

"My thinking for the last month was that Aldridge was a better fit. He's much more polished offensively. However, *I've got a pretty good source in Chicago that says Thomas is the guy*."


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Chad Ford tidbit about Bargnani and who would the Bulls take if they were to land #1:
> 
> "*Bargnani* is putting up solid numbers in the Euroleague, like Gasol was. He's *probably more ready for the NBA than scouts are giving him credit for*. I just can't figure out which team is going to pull the trigger for him at No. 1. Of all the teams out there, the *Bulls* might make the most sense, but *from what I hear, Tyrus Thomas is their guy if they get the No. 1 pick*."
> And more Bulls stuff:
> 
> "My thinking for the last month was that Aldridge was a better fit. He's much more polished offensively. However, *I've got a pretty good source in Chicago that says Thomas is the guy*."


Very interesting, although I don't necessarily agree.

Could it be Chicago blowing smoke so everyone thinks we want Thomas when we have another target in mind to make a trade more valuable (i.e. seeing that other teams would draft Thomas #1 than any other player). Are they trying to downplay a player we really want (Aldridge/Bargnani) so if the ping pong balls dont go our way they might be more available at the #3 or #4 pick?

As much as I love the season, the offseason is always such utter chaos. I love watching it develop.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Thomas would provide a ton of athleticism AND defense up front, at the same time. But it just seems like a dubious pick.

In any event, the draft is still months away, and we haven't seen a single draftee workout yet. Chad Ford is full of crap.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> As a team, we are very athletic. Allen, Songaila, and Harrington are really our only below average athletes. The rest of our team is average to good athletes
> 
> As individuals, about the only player you could say is uber-athletic is Chandler, which I think is why it's difficult to view our team as athletic. When you break everything down piece by piece, he's the only one that stands out.



maybe your definition of athletic and my definition of athletic are different.

kirk hinrich
tyson chandler
ben gordon

are the only athletic players imo


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> maybe your definition of athletic and my definition of athletic are different.
> 
> kirk hinrich
> tyson chandler
> ben gordon
> 
> are the only athletic players imo


I guess I'm looking at things like strength (Noc), endurance (Duhon/Noc/Hinrich), body control (Deng and a little bit of Duhon), not just footspeed and hops. I'd rate Duhon, Noc, and Hinirch at above average with Deng being good athletically.

If you are looking at the term "athletic" in terms of high flying fast guys, then it's really only Chandler and Gordon.

Guys like Allen, Sweetney, and Pargo are simply average to me. They do some things well athletically and others not so well.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> Thomas would provide a ton of athleticism AND defense up front, at the same time. But it just seems like a dubious pick.
> 
> In any event, the draft is still months away, and we haven't seen a single draftee workout yet. Chad Ford is full of crap.


Ugh. I can't say I like hearing this. Man, I want somebody with more scoring skills than Thomas.

But yes, Showtyme, I genuinely believe Paxson will really consider his workouts. It's not clear to me that Ben Gordon was one of his primary candidates before the group workout he had with Devon Harris. I remember Paxson saying that this workout was the best one he had seen so far. Paxson will again want to be impressed in workouts.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I know Thomas has college experience, but Amare was the same case (at least for scouts): he was an athletic freak with limited offensive game. Some said that he was a jumper away from being a Karl Malone-type. And although Phoenix's offense can inflate numbers, Amare showed many weapons when it came to scoring. 

Not comparing both, but Tyrus cant be that limited (offensive-wise) for the Bulls to avoid picking him. But obviously if the Bulls are high on him, its not because his arsenal when it comes to scoring.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I know Thomas has college experience, but Amare was the same case (at least for scouts): he was an athletic freak with limited offensive game. Some said that he was a jumper away from being a Karl Malone-type. And although Phoenix's offense can inflate numbers, Amare showed many weapons when it came to scoring.
> 
> Not comparing both, but Tyrus cant be that limited (offensive-wise) for the Bulls to avoid picking him. But obviously if the Bulls are high on him, its not because his arsenal when it comes to scoring.


I'm looking forward to the pre-draft measurements. My guess is that Amare has about 3 or 4" of wingspan on Thomas, added on to the couple of inches taller that he already is. I don't know who was stronger entering the league, but that would be another interesting thing to compare.

I guess I'm saying that I don't really like the Tyrus Thomas to Amare comparison. I think K-Mart is much closer, although Thomas is probably a little better polished defensively whereas Kenyon was more polished offensively entering the league.

Also remember, undersized high fliers are usually a bit more injury prone than guys who play more on the ground.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

from today's *chad ford* chat:


*Kenny (Chicago): *_Would Tyrus Thomas be a good complement to Chandler? I'm not sure that he is, Wouldn't Aldridge be a better fit for the Bulls? _


* Chad Ford:*_ My thinking for the last month was that Aldridge was a better fit. He's much more polished offensively. *However, I've got a pretty good source in Chicago that says Thomas is the guy.* _







of course a few questions earlier he said:

*Steve Chicago:* _Is it more beneficial for a team such as the Bulls to make the playoffs, or miss the playoffs and get a lottery pick? _



*Chad Ford:* _Playoffs. Bulls have a young team and the playoff experience will be good for them. Besides there's not that much difference between the 12th pick in the draft and the 20th. Lots of parity this year. *I honestly think that the Bulls will try to package their picks this summer in a trade if they can.* They have enough young players. What they need right now is some veteran balance._






oh that chad. 




http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/chatESPN?event_id=11310


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> Thomas would provide a ton of athleticism AND defense up front, at the same time. But it just seems like a dubious pick.
> 
> In any event, the draft is still months away, and we haven't seen a single draftee workout yet. Chad Ford is full of crap.


Chad Ford certainly is full of crap. Thomas' raw offensive game is cause for concern, but so far Paxson has been an excellent draft talent evaluator - I trust him to figure out via workouts whether or not Thomas has the ability to contribute offensively any time soon.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mizenkay said:


> from today's *chad ford* chat:
> 
> 
> *Kenny (Chicago): *_Would Tyrus Thomas be a good complement to Chandler? I'm not sure that he is, Wouldn't Aldridge be a better fit for the Bulls? _
> 
> 
> * Chad Ford:*_ My thinking for the last month was that Aldridge was a better fit. He's much more polished offensively. *However, I've got a pretty good source in Chicago that says Thomas is the guy.* _
> 
> 
> oh that chad.


He has to BE the guy. He brings everything we lack in a BIG, TOUGHNESS, easy baskets, a will to win, defensive stopper & heart.

hey, chad's word isn't gold but it's better than NOT knowing at all.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If the Bulls draft Thomas I bet they'll look to get two starting bigs in FA and bring Thomas along slowly.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> If the Bulls draft Thomas I bet they'll look to get two starting bigs in FA and bring Thomas along slowly.


possibly..

so you're saying they'll also bench tyson too then right?

I think us getting Nazr is already a done deal mainly cuz he brings championship experience to the table.

Nene is also a gamble worth taking IMO. He really hasn't had the minutes to prove anything in the NBA yet & he definintely has upside. Gooden would be a SAFE bet but Nene could possibly be a top 10 big in a few years.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> possibly..
> 
> so you're saying they'll also bench tyson too then right?
> 
> I think us getting Nazr is already a done deal mainly cuz he brings championship experience to the table.


That seems a little strong. What makes you think that San Antonio won't outbid us for Nazr?
And if they don't, why should we be so hot to get him?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



McBulls said:


> That seems a little strong. What makes you think that San Antonio won't outbid us for Nazr?
> And if they don't, why should we be so hot to get him?


When Nazr's on, he's ON...he put up HUGE double double games the last few years...also one recently where he had 30pts and 14rebs...

Nobodies saying we need him to start or be the KEY but in the FA market of 2006, I don't see why he wouldn't be a good PIECE to pick up. He's a legit 7ft center who can do it on both ends of the floor, why not?


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



McBulls said:


> That seems a little strong. What makes you think that San Antonio won't outbid us for Nazr?
> And if they don't, why should we be so hot to get him?


The needier teams overpay. How else does any free agent ever go from a contender to a still growing program, if not for the money? And it has to be substantial money difference too.

The fact is, we will overpay for our free agent this summer, unless it's Al Harrington, and that's because we're actually a BETTER franchise than Toronto, Atlanta or New York, his other main options.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I was reading that McRoberts is considering to come out. I'd like him w/our draft pick.

Regarding the Tyurs Thomas info, we might want him, but it could be a smokescreen. I really think Pax will push very hard for a trade draft day for an established lowpost guy such as Gasol/JO/KG. However, I doubt any of those deals will get done, and we will end up drafting Aldridge (safest pick) and best player available at our pick.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> I was reading that McRoberts is considering to come out. I'd like him w/our draft pick.
> 
> Regarding the Tyurs Thomas info, we might want him, but it could be a smokescreen. I really think Pax will push very hard for a trade draft day for an established lowpost guy such as Gasol/JO/KG. However, I doubt any of those deals will get done, and we will end up drafting Aldridge (safest pick) and best player available at our pick.


I really like Hilton Armstrong if we want to draft two bigs (Carney, Roy, and Brewer off the board I'm assuming). I'd even prefer Shelden Williams unless we nab Aldridge--I think Shelden would pretty much replicate what we would have in Aldridge only shorter. I'm real skeptical how McRoberts will make any hay in the NBA. I was real down on Mihm when he entered the draft, and McRoberts reminds me of Mihm light except for having a better jumper.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

He doesn't project anywhere near the Bulls' pick -- yet -- but is anyone here intrigued by Hassan Adams? Man, is he an athlete. Much like Dwyane Wade and Tony Allen, he's a 6' 4" guy that you don't worry about guarding any taller 2-guards. He's built like a truck, and he's a tremendous athlete who attacks the rim, playing nothing like any of our Bulls. Probably his greatest weakness is that he insists on taking 3-pointers, despite shooting a terrible percentage. Still, I have to wonder if a player like him, with a skill set totally absent from our team, could help.

I also know he's very jibby. But he's an Arizona Wildcat, what can you do? (I'm at school at ASU).


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Does Adams have the handles to play on the perimeter?


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> He doesn't project anywhere near the Bulls' pick -- yet -- but is anyone here intrigued by Hassan Adams? Man, is he an athlete. Much like Dwyane Wade and Tony Allen, he's a 6' 4" guy that you don't worry about guarding any taller 2-guards. He's built like a truck, and he's a tremendous athlete who attacks the rim, playing nothing like any of our Bulls. Probably his greatest weakness is that he insists on taking 3-pointers, despite shooting a terrible percentage. Still, I have to wonder if a player like him, with a skill set totally absent from our team, could help.
> 
> I also know he's very jibby. But he's an Arizona Wildcat, what can you do? (I'm at school at ASU).


He looks like he could have some promise as a late first rounder, but I'd rather sign a qualtiy FA if we can't solve our big defensive-oriented SG in the draft than take a kid slated as a late first rounder or early second rounder using our own pick. If he had a couple more inches I'd be more inclined, but I think his stock would be higher too and would make more sense. Now if we make some sort of consolidation trade and end up with a later pick, then he would definately be highly considered.

There should be a number of quality role player type bigs that we could take with the Bulls pick if our preferred guard solutions are all taken (Roy, Carney, either Brewer, and maybe even Roby). Horford, Armstrong, or O'Bryant (maybe even Bargnani or Splitter too) could all be there, and is especially more likely if all the quality wings start dropping off the board.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> He looks like he could have some promise as a late first rounder, but I'd rather sign a qualtiy FA if we can't solve our big defensive-oriented SG in the draft than take a kid slated as a late first rounder or early second rounder using our own pick. If he had a couple more inches I'd be more inclined, but I think his stock would be higher too and would make more sense. Now if we make some sort of consolidation trade and end up with a later pick, then he would definately be highly considered.
> 
> There should be a number of quality role player type bigs that we could take with the Bulls pick if our preferred guard solutions are all taken (Roy, Carney, either Brewer, and maybe even Roby). Horford, Armstrong, or O'Bryant (maybe even Bargnani or Splitter too) could all be there, and is especially more likely if all the quality wings start dropping off the board.


The funny thing about him is I see him having a bit of star quality. He has the athleticism and the killer instinct, and he also has flair.

TripDub, Adams doesn't have good point guard type handles. You wouldn't want him to play point, even for spot minutes. However, he's very good at a couple quick dribbles to attack the rim. With his fantastic leaping ability, he doesn't even need to move that close to the rim to dunk it.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

BTW, I finally got a copy of Arizona vs. Washington from New Years Eve. I'm at halftime now, and I'm about to watch the second half. Roy can play! So can Hassan. But Roy gets up way more than he's given credit for. This camera angle may make exaggerate the air he got, but you can still tell he gets up pretty high.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Didn't Hassan Adams get suspended from the Pac-10 tournament for getting charged with DUI? That doesn't sound all that jibby to me. He IS a hardworking player, but off-court issues probably loom large in Pax's mind.

By the way, the Portsmouth Invitational started. Draftexpress has summaries up:

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1252


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> Didn't Hassan Adams get suspended from the Pac-10 tournament for getting charged with DUI? That doesn't sound all that jibby to me. He IS a hardworking player, but off-court issues probably loom large in Pax's mind.
> 
> By the way, the Portsmouth Invitational started. Draftexpress has summaries up:
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1252


Yup. Adams has had some jib issues.

However, he does have hops. He takes the jump balls for Arizona at the beginning of the game. He's 6' 4". They have a 6' 10" center. LOL!


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> I really like Hilton Armstrong if we want to draft two bigs (Carney, Roy, and Brewer off the board I'm assuming). I'd even prefer Shelden Williams unless we nab Aldridge--I think Shelden would pretty much replicate what we would have in Aldridge only shorter. I'm real skeptical how McRoberts will make any hay in the NBA. I was real down on Mihm when he entered the draft, and McRoberts reminds me of Mihm light except for having a better jumper.




u say Aldridge and Shelden are redundant?

you must explain, cause i don't see simlarities that go further then their skin tone.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Noah was pretty darn impressive in the last three games. I think he's moved up to my #1 guy based on his skills.

Except it sounds like he might stay in school :|


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> Noah was pretty darn impressive in the last three games. I think he's moved up to my #1 guy based on his skills.
> 
> 
> He's my #1 too! A true difference maker... And I wouldn't be surprised if he grows a couple more inches.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> u say Aldridge and Shelden are redundant?
> 
> you must explain, cause i don't see simlarities that go further then their skin tone.


Skin tone comment aside...  

I didn't mean redundant in that their games are similar or that Williams is Aldridge light or anything of that sort. Aldridge is obviously taller, has a softer touch on his jumper, and is much better defensively than Williams, while being less refined in the low post.

Redundant in the sense that if we nab Aldridge first, he is the guy that is supposed to be our low post scorer. If we expect Aldridge to be our guy that plays mostly near the basket and in the low post, I don't see Williams adding much. Why put two guys who don't complement each other very well? Now if a low post scorer was all we are missing, then it might make sense to take both and see who turns out to be the better pro, but not so much when we have more than one hole to fill.

Now if we grabbed Thomas, Bargnani, or Noah with the NY pick, Williams would make a lot more sense with our pick.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I was also duly impressed by Noah's energy and skills. The kid is something else out there on the court and a heck of a lot of fun to watch. 

But doesn't it seem that he has a small frame -- very narrow shoulders for a man who's supposed to be around 7 feel? Some are saying he's shorter than advertised. I don't know. But his shotblocking seemed to be more about tremendous instincts and timing rather than eye-popping athleticism or freakish wingspan. Not that that's a bad thing at all, but it makes me wonder how effective he will be on the pro level.

One other thing, related to this.

Am I the only one who, after watching Noah play several great games in the tournament, walked away thinking, "Can this kid jump at all?"

It seemed I never saw his feet more than 6 inches off the ground. I found that very odd. A person could argue, "He's good enough that he doesn't need to jump very high." Maybe. But I will be watching his pre-draft vertical leap measurement very closely. Even on dunks he looked fully extended and like he was JUST getting over the rim.

Was I hallucinating?


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



dogra said:


> But doesn't it seem that he has a small frame -- very narrow shoulders for a man who's supposed to be around 7 feel? Some are saying he's shorter than advertised. I don't know. But his shotblocking seemed to be more about tremendous instincts and timing rather than eye-popping athleticism or freakish wingspan. Not that that's a bad thing at all, but it makes me wonder how well his ability will allow him to be on the pro level.


Actually, it's the reverse. The announcers were saying throughout the tournament that while Noah was listed at 6'10" or 6'11" and Horford was listed at 7'0", that Noah looked taller out on the court. I do think his style of play on the court makes him play shorter than his actual height. He plays very low to the ground with his knees bent. 



> Am I the only one who, after watching Noah play several great games in the tournament, walked away thinking, "Can this kid jump at all?"
> 
> It seemed I never saw his feet more than 6 inches off the ground. I found that very odd. A person could argue, "He's good enough that he doesn't need to jump very high." Maybe. But I will be watching his pre-draft vertical leap measurement very closely. Even on dunks he looked fully extended and like he was JUST getting over the rim.
> 
> Was I hallucinating?


This sort of relates back to him playing low to the ground again. I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing, as he is probably trying to establish a low base to counteract his lack of strength. It could be a very good thing for his shotblocking as well as he is in good position to jump immediately--timing will be the obvious key here (and he seems to have very good instincts in that regard). However, playing this style will make it more difficult to alter shorts when not jumping, and he won't get a lot of spring in his jump as he will be constantly jumping off of two feet without much momentum.

As such, I see him as being a very good man defender, but I don't think he'll ever be a great help defender in terms of trying to stop people driving to the hoop. His help defense on the perimeter should be fine.

I did see a few wide open dunks where he seemed to get up just fine. While not comparing in style at all, I think he has the hops of an Eddy Curry. Not great, but not a detriment.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> Skin tone comment aside...
> 
> I didn't mean redundant in that their games are similar or that Williams is Aldridge light or anything of that sort. Aldridge is obviously taller, has a softer touch on his jumper, and is much better defensively than Williams, while being less refined in the low post.
> 
> Redundant in the sense that if we nab Aldridge first, he is the guy that is supposed to be our low post scorer. If we expect Aldridge to be our guy that plays mostly near the basket and in the low post, I don't see Williams adding much. Why put two guys who don't complement each other very well? Now if a low post scorer was all we are missing, then it might make sense to take both and see who turns out to be the better pro, but not so much when we have more than one hole to fill.
> 
> Now if we grabbed Thomas, Bargnani, or Noah with the NY pick, Williams would make a lot more sense with our pick.



numbers wise...shelden looks to be far more superior defensively.

i for one think they would go great together.

aldridge likes to shoot jump shots....shelden does his dirty work downlow.


nice combo imo


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> He doesn't project anywhere near the Bulls' pick -- yet -- but is anyone here intrigued by Hassan Adams? Man, is he an athlete. Much like Dwyane Wade and Tony Allen, he's a 6' 4" guy that you don't worry about guarding any taller 2-guards. He's built like a truck, and he's a tremendous athlete who attacks the rim, playing nothing like any of our Bulls. Probably his greatest weakness is that he insists on taking 3-pointers, despite shooting a terrible percentage. Still, I have to wonder if a player like him, with a skill set totally absent from our team, could help.
> 
> I also know he's very jibby. But he's an Arizona Wildcat, what can you do? (I'm at school at ASU).


If we had a second rounder I'd be more interested, but I think our pick will be too high to go with Adams. 6'4'' is a little short, but with his long arms and athleticism he could become a fantastic defender. Offensively, I can't see him scoring much in the NBA. He's explosive but he doesn't have the handle to beat NBA defenders off the dribble - they'll be sagging off him a ton...


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> numbers wise...shelden looks to be far more superior defensively.
> 
> i for one think they would go great together.
> 
> aldridge likes to shoot jump shots....shelden does his dirty work downlow.
> 
> 
> nice combo imo


I might be biased by my own evaulation of Duke's team this year (I had them losing to LSU in my bracket), but Duke's greatest weakness was their interior defense. As I'm sure you know the argument, blocks and rebounds can be nabbed without being a good defender or rebounder.

I haven't scouted Williams as much as I have Noah, Aldridge, or Thomas. I think a lot of people are discounting Aldridge as a low post player. He already has some NBA-ready go to move including a hook shot, a drop step, and a turnaround jumper (that he only slightly fades away on--which is a good thing for a big man IMO).

Aldridge didn't have a lot of opportunities to show off his post moves because the Texas guard tandem were good ball handlers but terrible interior passers. Aldridge would pop out when a guard/forward drove and got most of his looks from the outside. I don't know if that was generally his preference, however.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> If we had a second rounder I'd be more interested, but I think our pick will be too high to go with Adams. 6'4'' is a little short, but with his long arms and athleticism he could become a fantastic defender. Offensively, I can't see him scoring much in the NBA. He's explosive but he doesn't have the handle to beat NBA defenders off the dribble - they'll be sagging off him a ton...


Good point on the handles. He is definately (Roy - 1), so I can see why you are a fan, DMD


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Adams will be a really strong defender, for sure, but I agree with his offensive liabilities. He's a Tony Allen twin, which is never a bad force to have on your bench. Allen's been playing well as of late, and will continue to grow as a player. Adams may be like that, if he gets a chance.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

bobby jones!

who?

bobby jones?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> Adams will be a really strong defender, for sure, but I agree with his offensive liabilities. He's a Tony Allen twin, which is never a bad force to have on your bench. Allen's been playing well as of late, and will continue to grow as a player. Adams may be like that, if he gets a chance.


I think Adams will get taken in the late first round, even though he's projected as a second rounder by most right now. I think somebody's going to take a shot with an athlete like that, jib issues and all. I think James White also might go a ways earlier than he is currently projected for the same reason.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

ESPN.com and ESPNEWS say Noah, Horford, and Brewer are coming back to Florida


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

As long as Tyrus enters, that's all that really matters to me.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

From what I read over at ESPN.com by no means they said they wont declare. And from Noah (who was the one that spoke for the other 2), you cant expect anything else in front of that many people.


----------



## TM

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> numbers wise...shelden looks to be far more superior defensively.
> 
> i for one think they would go great together.
> 
> aldridge likes to shoot jump shots....shelden does his dirty work downlow.
> 
> 
> nice combo imo



Aldridge > Williams, and that's from the biggest Duke homer on these boards.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> From what I read over at ESPN.com by no means they said they wont declare. And from Noah (who was the one that spoke for the other 2), you cant expect anything else in front of that many people.


Anthony said he was going back too. To the crowds and the media. So bear that in mind

Though, after reading all five of their starters share a flat together, are close and the Noah doesn't exactly need the cash, I'm about 50/50 on whether nominates or not.

On a different note,
there's going to have to be a heap of work outs for the draft, cause it's so open. Event the top players well have to work out for 4-5 teams. Normally they work out for 2-3


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I found a nice read on the NBA draft. Some of you may say "Duh!" after reading it, but still, for anyone who's interested in reading about stuff like this it's not bad at all.

http://nbadraft.net/prevenas064.asp


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Just wondering, has anyone seen/heard anything from the underclassmen about who might declare?

IMO, as long as Tyrus Thomas and Aldridge both declare, not to mention Bargnani, my feeling is that we'll get someone who fills a huge need for us. I'd just really like to make it official.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

NY is ******* it up for us! they've moved to the 3rd worst record in the league since going on their little 2-3 game win streak.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=2403280

Aldridge to declare for the draft! Good news. 

Now let's see if Noah changes his mind and hops in.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

According to <A href="http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1257" target="_blank">this article from Draftexpress.com</A>, Tyrus Thomas is expected to declare for the draft. His stock isn't going to be any higher next year, so he should come out this year.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

word has it, O'Bryant is about to hire an agent also.

Damn, too bad he probably won't fall as long as 14-15


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=2403280
> 
> Aldridge to declare for the draft! Good news.
> 
> Now let's see if Noah changes his mind and hops in.


:laugh:

So much for those comments he made several weeks back.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

i like how jose juan barea sounds....

never seen him in my life but he sounds like he could give us what duhon gives us...thus making duhon expendable..

just thinking out loud


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Mohammed Saer Sene might put his name in the hat this summer? From theDarftexpress website. He's an intriguing prospect. This would be an RLucas player. African. Freak of nature. Very raw. Too much of a risk to take with our pick if it's in the middle of the first round? If he does committ, I hope Pax at least takes a good long look at the kid (or maybe not so much a kid as his age is not truely known - go figure!). I'd take a shot at the guy. One of the benefits of drafting a "euro" (read non-american or foreign) player is that you're not on the hook for their salary if they don't pan out if they decide to stay overseas. The downside being that they may never pan out or decide to stay outide the NBA. It's a risk either way, but I'd like to see Pax take a gamble in this draft.


----------



## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

It's too bad Paxson is in love with college heroes, because I think Andrea Bargnani is going to be the best player in this draft class. He is getting overlooked because of Skita and Darko being complete failures. We need offensive firepower, I think Bargnani is the big man to give us that, even if he plays the perimeter more. 

I actually think Shelden Williams is probably the best natural big man for us in this draft. He really can give us everything that Antonio Davis did. He is just pure strength in the middle, and Williams is a better shotblocker. 

Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah aren't strong in the middle. They are more in the form of Tyson Chandler. Great shotblockers, but if you get a body on them, they become a lot less effective. 

With the first pick, LaMarcus Aldridge and Andrea Bargnani would suit my needs. Both are offensively gifted and could score some points for us. With the second pick, I'd go with Shelden Williams or Patrick O'Bryant. Two big guys who stay in the middle and clog the lane.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> Mohammed Saer Sene might put his name in the hat this summer? From theDarftexpress website. He's an intriguing prospect. This would be an RLucas player. African. Freak of nature. Very raw. Too much of a risk to take with our pick if it's in the middle of the first round? If he does committ, I hope Pax at least takes a good long look at the kid (or maybe not so much a kid as his age is not truely known - go figure!). I'd take a shot at the guy. One of the benefits of drafting a "euro" (read non-american or foreign) player is that you're not on the hook for their salary if they don't pan out if they decide to stay overseas. The downside being that they may never pan out or decide to stay outide the NBA. It's a risk either way, but I'd like to see Pax take a gamble in this draft.



Hi Flash, I bet San Antonio or Detroit are all over this kid. He isnt a lottery pick. And he might be a bit of a reach at 13-15. Now, if the Bulls could trade down I would take this kid at 20. He has serious athleticism and reach, two things the Bulls dont have. And this kid has a real motor. He is sort of a poor mans Tyson Chandler, but will probably round out as a physically stronger player within a year. Huge upside. But I dont think Pax has the huevos, cahones, or guts to be open minded enough to take a flier like this kid. Much more of a Krause type kid. But he will make someone proud. Thanks for the headsup

If the Bulls want a low level FA this summer to fill out a roster spot like Malik Allen had done, I highly recommend DJ Mbenga from Dallas. Probably could be had for a mil or 2, for 2 years. Not going to be a star, but might be able to give a Diop like effort off the bench. 

Thats my African minute, see you guys next month!


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Hi Flash, I bet San Antonio or Detroit are all over this kid. He isnt a lottery pick. And he might be a bit of a reach at 13-15. Now, if the Bulls could trade down I would take this kid at 20. He has serious athleticism and reach, two things the Bulls dont have. And this kid has a real motor. He is sort of a poor mans Tyson Chandler, but will probably round out as a physically stronger player within a year. Huge upside. But I dont think Pax has the huevos, cahones, or guts to be open minded enough to take a flier like this kid. Much more of a Krause type kid. But he will make someone proud. Thanks for the headsup
> 
> If the Bulls want a low level FA this summer to fill out a roster spot like Malik Allen had done, I highly recommend DJ Mbenga from Dallas. Probably could be had for a mil or 2, for 2 years. Not going to be a star, but might be able to give a Diop like effort off the bench.
> 
> Thats my African minute, see you guys next month!


Yea, San Antonio and Detriot (and Dallas) are the teams that came to mind. It really doesn't impact them much to take a flyer on a 28 - 30 pick. I also don't think Pax has that gambler gene in his body. Too bad too. Sene could make things interesting in this draft. If he's available for workouts this summer, you know he's going to impress GM's with just his raw athleticism. From what I read, he sounds like Tyrus Thomas with an additional 3-4 inches in height. Might not be exactly what the Bulls need, but it seems like he's got decent hands and like you wrote, a very good motor. We'll just have to see!


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Sir Patchwork said:


> It's too bad Paxson is in love with college heroes, because I think Andrea Bargnani is going to be the best player in this draft class. He is getting overlooked because of Skita and Darko being complete failures. We need offensive firepower, I think Bargnani is the big man to give us that, even if he plays the perimeter more.
> 
> I actually think Shelden Williams is probably the best natural big man for us in this draft. He really can give us everything that Antonio Davis did. He is just pure strength in the middle, and Williams is a better shotblocker.
> 
> Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah aren't strong in the middle. They are more in the form of Tyson Chandler. Great shotblockers, but if you get a body on them, they become a lot less effective.
> 
> With the first pick, LaMarcus Aldridge and Andrea Bargnani would suit my needs. Both are offensively gifted and could score some points for us. With the second pick, I'd go with Shelden Williams or Patrick O'Bryant. Two big guys who stay in the middle and clog the lane.


All good points. I think Noah looks like a serious talent, but it's true that he doesn't really play big and bulky. I can't decide whether he's what we'd want at the PF spot, since it's made me cringe to look at us resorting to Mike Sweetney as our only really wide body on both ends of the floor. 

But the NBA's got me wondering. The exceptions to the must-have-size rule have surfaced recently (the Nets, the Amare-less Suns, the Nuggets), and when you look at Miami, Cleveland (Z isn't strong but he's really really long), the Pistons (Ben Wallace plays with the strength of a 7-foot, 285 pounder in the post)... you see some parity.

I'll be watching the Nuggets especially closely. Without Nene, they are not that big-and-strong of a frontcourt. K-Mart and Camby could very much resemble what we'd have if we took on Noah and started him next to Chandler. Noah puts the ball on the floor, plays with a lot of athleticism, and uses his quickness for the most part. Chandler-Camby comparisons have abounded for a while on this board. I'd like to see how they stack up against teams with important size up front.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Sir Patchwork said:


> It's too bad Paxson is in love with college heroes, because I think Andrea Bargnani is going to be the best player in this draft class. He is getting overlooked because of Skita and Darko being complete failures. We need offensive firepower, I think Bargnani is the big man to give us that, even if he plays the perimeter more.
> 
> I actually think Shelden Williams is probably the best natural big man for us in this draft. He really can give us everything that Antonio Davis did. He is just pure strength in the middle, and Williams is a better shotblocker.
> 
> Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah aren't strong in the middle. They are more in the form of Tyson Chandler. Great shotblockers, but if you get a body on them, they become a lot less effective.
> 
> With the first pick, LaMarcus Aldridge and Andrea Bargnani would suit my needs. Both are offensively gifted and could score some points for us. With the second pick, I'd go with Shelden Williams or Patrick O'Bryant. Two big guys who stay in the middle and clog the lane.


I think this makes a lot of sense. I think we need to consider the possibility as well of drafting Roy with NY's pick if Aldridge is off the board (and if Bargnani doesn't look like a star in Bulls individual workouts). He'd be the perfect third guard for us, dare I say better than Iguodala? With our mid first rounder, I think we need to look at Ronnie Brewer, especially if Roy is not available. Roy and Brewer (and John Salmons in free agency) are players who could really complete our guard rotation, giving us a big guard with serious ball handlings skills. I was hoping we'd look into Marko Jaric last offseason for that very reason, but Roy and Brewer at least have much higher upside and could be had on the cheap with a rookie scale contract.

If Paxson his clever, he can fill ALL of our holes this offseason and majorly upgrade our talent.


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## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Showtyme, I think big men are mostly for defensive and rebounding purposes in today's game. When it comes to offense, anything goes. You used the Pistons as an example and they're perfect for what I'm saying. Ben Wallace and Rasheed Wallace on defense are amazing. They both play great man defense, help defense and rebound the ball. They protect the paint better than anyone in the league together. Offensively, you have one of them get froze out of the offense because he is by far the least gifted offensively (Ben), and his job is to crash the offensive boards. The other one roams the perimeter and averages like 5 three point attempts per game. That doesn't sound like typical big man stuff. They do their typical big man thing on the defensive end. 

Your point is good one about trends around the league. 

I look at it this way. The league leaders in points in the paint are actually guards and wings. Tony Parker, Dwyane Wade, LeBron James and so on. You can get extremely efficient inside scoring without having a great interior scoring big man. Gordon, Hinrich and Deng would do a whole lot better at the rim, if they had a perimeter shooting big man like Bargnani, and a finisher like O'Bryant to kick off to. 

So basically, when it comes to offense, positions aren't that important. If you have a guard who scores at the rim and a big men who shoots three pointers, fine. If you have a small forward who posts up, fine. I think the trend we are seeing on offense is that spacing, balance and talent are the keys to success. Trying to pidgeon hole players just doesn't benefit the team. 

Defense is where you do need to pidgeon hole players though. You need big guys protecting the paint and rebounding, and you need all your players staying in front of their man and contesting shots.


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## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I think this makes a lot of sense. I think we need to consider the possibility as well of drafting Roy with NY's pick if Aldridge is off the board (and if Bargnani doesn't look like a star in Bulls individual workouts). He'd be the perfect third guard for us, dare I say better than Iguodala? With our mid first rounder, I think we need to look at Ronnie Brewer, especially if Roy is not available. Roy and Brewer (and John Salmons in free agency) are players who could really complete our guard rotation, giving us a big guard with serious ball handlings skills. I was hoping we'd look into Marko Jaric last offseason for that very reason, but Roy and Brewer at least have much higher upside and could be had on the cheap with a rookie scale contract.
> 
> If Paxson his clever, he can fill ALL of our holes this offseason and majorly upgrade our talent.


We would need to strike it rich in free agency with big men, but this plan sounds good also. I think we need more than one big man added to our team. Chandler is alone on an island right now. He is a great big man to have in a trio. If we got an offensively gifted big man, a strong post defense stiffen up the lane big man (like AD), and a helpside shotblocking big man (like Chandler), that creates a really nice balance among our bigs inside. 

For me, the draft is all about adding assets though. I would take the best player available 100% of the time even if I had a player at that position. You have to add the best players you can and sort it out later. 

I just think given Bargnani's talent, and O'Bryant's positional value (I think he can be an above average center), they would be the best assets.


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> According to <A href="http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1257" target="_blank">this article from Draftexpress.com</A>, Tyrus Thomas is expected to declare for the draft. His stock isn't going to be any higher next year, so he should come out this year.


What the heck is the guy doing on vacation? He still has to go to class! Some student-athlete he is.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Sir Patchwork said:


> I just think given Bargnani's talent, and O'Bryant's positional value (I think he can be an above average center), they would be the best assets.


how would Bargnani be the best availible big for us in your opinion? I'm curious


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## 7RINGS?

*Aldridge to declare for the draft??????????*

Barnes gets a raise but loses Aldridge, sources say
BY CHIP BROWN
The Dallas Morning News

Sorry, you can't post articles in their entirety, even non-Insider articles, due to copyright restrictions. Excerpted portions accompanied by the link would be acceptable. Thanks. -Showtyme


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This was in the mercurynews.com website

I think its a plus for us the more big that declair the better shot we have of getting something good! :clap:


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## Showtyme

*Re: Aldridge to declare for the draft??????????*

I'm also merging this into the draft thread.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> Yea, San Antonio and Detriot (and Dallas) are the teams that came to mind. It really doesn't impact them much to take a flyer on a 28 - 30 pick. I also don't think Pax has that gambler gene in his body. Too bad too. Sene could make things interesting in this draft. If he's available for workouts this summer, you know he's going to impress GM's with just his raw athleticism. From what I read, he sounds like Tyrus Thomas with an additional 3-4 inches in height. Might not be exactly what the Bulls need, but it seems like he's got decent hands and like you wrote, a very good motor. We'll just have to see!



Phoenix comes to mind as well. GS and Utah are probably not going to reach for him but have big international staffs who might know the kid well. I think we have a kid who is probably going somewhere from 20-35 in this draft but could be a real steal. The kid he reminds me of, based on my one little viewing of him (and on heresay from people who have seen him plenty) is Ian Mahinmi. Who?!!? The Spurs number one draft pick last year. And that guy looks like a HUGE steal for whenever he comes to the NBA. Sane, from what I hear, played soccer growing up, like Hakeem, so we know the footwork is good. He also, until recently, was a big time volleyball player, like Mahinmi. Thats timing. So there are good pieces to build on. He isnt going to do it right away. But these kids, from places like Africa, are hungry. They havent had anything given to them and they want to succeed. You take a look at a player, a legit 7 footer, who is simply a freak, and you roll the dice around 20 and youll be rewarded. I havent looked to see who has multiple picks, but perhaps the Bulls can change Sweetney into a 20-25 pick and grab him. As a developmental player or a kid you leave in Belgium (or try and find him a team in a very good developmental league like France), you could do worse. Who knows, he might surprise and be able to defend and rebound right away at this level. Patchwork talks about that for big guys in this thread, and therefore I would then argue that Patchs kid should be this kid. 

I saw alot of Noah in the tournamet, on a side note, and liked him. I dont see a superstar but someone who could help. But with his family upbringing, I doubt he declares. I have actually had the pleasure to see Bargnani some recently and he is the real deal. I still like Gay though Carney is there. Aldridge is the obvious choice. Morrison is a player I will pay to watch but I cant see him getting along with our church-going, republican, family-values leadership. Depends on where the Bulls pick, but a draft of Aldridge and the big kid out of Bradley or one of the athletic wings makes alot of sense. Though Bargani would be a good backup plan if Aldridge is off the board. Noc and Deng have been good, we just need a big 2/3, who can flat out finish at the rim, to complement them, Gordon and Hinrich. As good as those 4 are, none are going to get to the line or finish at the rim with anything resembling a James Worthy like %.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

rlucas = GOAT


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## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I think this makes a lot of sense. I think we need to consider the possibility as well of drafting Roy with NY's pick if Aldridge is off the board (and if Bargnani doesn't look like a star in Bulls individual workouts). He'd be the perfect third guard for us, dare I say better than Iguodala? With our mid first rounder, I think we need to look at Ronnie Brewer, especially if Roy is not available. Roy and Brewer (and John Salmons in free agency) are players who could really complete our guard rotation, giving us a big guard with serious ball handlings skills. I was hoping we'd look into Marko Jaric last offseason for that very reason, but Roy and Brewer at least have much higher upside and could be had on the cheap with a rookie scale contract.
> 
> If Paxson his clever, he can fill ALL of our holes this offseason and majorly upgrade our talent.


I've also been leaning towards Roy with NY's pick and Brewer with our own pick. I'm sold on Roy, and Scottie Pippen really seems to be sold on Brewer. Probably because he reminds him of himself. Roy and Brewer in the draft and we're looking very good on the perimeter. Target bigs in free agency. Maybe get one via trade if Pax can pull one off.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> I've also been leaning towards Roy with NY's pick and Brewer with our own pick. I'm sold on Roy, and Scottie Pippen really seems to be sold on Brewer. Probably because he reminds him of himself. Roy and Brewer in the draft and we're looking very good on the perimeter. Target bigs in free agency. Maybe get one via trade if Pax can pull one off.


what exactly is the point of having brewer AND roy?


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> I've also been leaning towards Roy with NY's pick and Brewer with our own pick. I'm sold on Roy, and Scottie Pippen really seems to be sold on Brewer. Probably because he reminds him of himself. Roy and Brewer in the draft and we're looking very good on the perimeter. Target bigs in free agency. Maybe get one via trade if Pax can pull one off.



Roy has a little Mitch Richmond in his game, and that is a good thing. Going to be a good player. I would say though we absolutely need a freak. There was a thread in here called Bring on the Freaks. Whoever started it got it right. The Bulls are the geekiest team in the league. They have all of these cerebral types. But eventually you need a kid, an Amare Stoudamire type, who will grab the damn ball, rise up 40 inches, and punch it through someone for a dunk. That gets the crowd going. That brings momentum. Those are things the Bulls lack. They are boring. I cant even watch them anymore really. Its a yawn fest. Roy is going to be a good player, maybe even great. But is he going to get anyone excited? I dont think so. The Bulls eventually will need to get that athlete. You need easy buckets in this league, ie dunks, and the Bulls have to be dead last in the league on that category.


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Roy has a little Mitch Richmond in his game, and that is a good thing. Going to be a good player. I would say though we absolutely need a freak. There was a thread in here called Bring on the Freaks. Whoever started it got it right. The Bulls are the geekiest team in the league. They have all of these cerebral types. But eventually you need a kid, an Amare Stoudamire type, who will grab the damn ball, rise up 40 inches, and punch it through someone for a dunk. That gets the crowd going. That brings momentum. Those are things the Bulls lack. They are boring. I cant even watch them anymore really. Its a yawn fest. Roy is going to be a good player, maybe even great. But is he going to get anyone excited? I dont think so. The Bulls eventually will need to get that athlete. You need easy buckets in this league, ie dunks, and the Bulls have to be dead last in the league on that category.


Is that player available in this draft? Gay and Carney are freaks, I suppose, but they seem to defer an awful lot. Of the bigs available, only Tyrus Thomas seems to have that kind of athleticism - unless I'm underestimating Bargnani's physical skills. Is it possible that we could fill that need via free agency with Wilcox, Wallace, or Nene?


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Is that player available in this draft? Gay and Carney are freaks, I suppose, but they seem to defer an awful lot. Of the bigs available, only Tyrus Thomas seems to have that kind of athleticism - unless I'm underestimating Bargnani's physical skills. Is it possible that we could fill that need via free agency with Wilcox, Wallace, or Nene?



Tyrus Thomas would be an excellent pick. A draft of Thomas and Gay/Carney would help the Bulls a ton. Im still of the opinion that Gay wasnt used right at UConn and will be a better pro then college player. Better suited to his game. I still think taking Sane, in round 2 or trading into late round 1, would also help front line athleticism. Obviously a frontline that features, Luke, Malik, Sweets is one that lacks athletes. Fact is, the Bulls probably need 2 freaks upfront, not just one.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

NY's pick

1. Tyrus Thomas
2. LaMarcus Aldridge
3. Andres Bargnani
4. Adam Morrison
5. Rudy Gay

CHI's pick

1. Ronnie Brewer
2. Brandon Roy
3. Rodney Carney
4. Patrick O'Bryant
5. Shelden Williams
6. Hilton Armstrong


give me a guy from each list and Bobby Jones!!....It's terrible, but I hope he don't get drafted...LOL..


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> what exactly is the point of having brewer AND roy?


I know what you're saying. But outside of Thomas or Bargnani, I think Roy would have a much bigger impact on our team. I'm not impressed with the other bigs, at least not to the point where I would take them over Roy. 

Brewer would simply be best player available. Maybe someone takes a dramatic slide and falls into our lap with our own pick. But are the bigs projected to go between 10-15 going to help us any more than Wilcox, Nene, Gooden, or Harrington would? I doubt it. Could Shelden fall this far? Maybe. Splitter might be there but he supposedly has a nasty buyout clause with his current team. Realistically, we're talking Hilton Armstrong / Paul Davis types that will be available with our own pick. I'd rather go hard after the bigs available in free agency over a guy available at 15.


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## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> how would Bargnani be the best availible big for us in your opinion? I'm curious


I think he is the most offensively gifted big man in this draft. So for the same reason people want to take Aldridge over Noah, Thomas and Williams for example, is the reason I want Bargnani. 

I'm not a believer that you have to have a big man who scores, a guard who passes, a shooting guard who shoots, and a small forward who does a little of everything. I think roles can be shared and switched. 

As long as Bargnani can rebound and defend like a power forward, it doesn't matter if he scores from the block or the three point line. If he can score the ball, it'll work out. 

Our small forward, Luol Deng, likes to play in the middle enough to offset a power forward wanting to play the perimeter, right?


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> I know what you're saying. But outside of Thomas or Bargnani, I think Roy would have a much bigger impact on our team. I'm not impressed with the other bigs, at least not to the point where I would take them over Roy.
> 
> Brewer would simply be best player available. Maybe someone takes a dramatic slide and falls into our lap with our own pick. But are the bigs projected to go between 10-15 going to help us any more than Wilcox, Nene, Gooden, or Harrington would? I doubt it. Could Shelden fall this far? Maybe. Splitter might be there but he supposedly has a nasty buyout clause with his current team. Realistically, we're talking Hilton Armstrong / Paul Davis types that will be available with our own pick. I'd rather go hard after the bigs available in free agency over a guy available at 15.


Paul Davis would be a typical Paxson pick. But the guy shouldnt be picked anywhere near the first round. I know this is big 10 country, but this guy epitomized the great white hope. He would be a MAJOR reach for anyone north of 25. MAJOR.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> NY's pick
> 
> 1. Tyrus Thomas
> 2. LaMarcus Aldridge
> 3. Andres Bargnani
> 4. Adam Morrison
> 5. Rudy Gay
> 
> CHI's pick
> 
> 1. Ronnie Brewer
> 2. Brandon Roy
> 3. Rodney Carney
> 4. Patrick O'Bryant
> 5. Shelden Williams
> 6. Hilton Armstrong
> 
> 
> give me a guy from each list and Bobby Jones!!....It's terrible, but I hope he don't get drafted...LOL..



Couldn't agree with you more, except I'd put a trade down or package for immediate star level guy after Bargnani.

We should come away with one of:

Aldridge, Thomas, Bargnani as for our pick if we make the playoffs - we're lucky to see a guy like O'Bryant slip. If we don't, we're probably picking between Brewer, O'Bryant, Williams and Splitter.

If paul Davis is what we get with our pick, then the playoffs would be a waste. However, I think at 16 someone will slip to us. Or, we trade down and grab a second and loterry protected 1st next year.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Rlucas, good to see you posting. I'm hoping you will share more or your thoughts on these guys from your point of view (former part-time scout, always full-time basketball lover). 



Especially the top 16-20 guys, especially the Euros - Bargnani, Splitter, Fernandez, etc....

I'd also love to see a list of the guys you think would really be the best for the Bulls to achieve the level of Championship status.


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## 7RINGS?

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

OK thanks show ,that was something I didn't know. :banana:


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Roy has a little Mitch Richmond in his game, and that is a good thing. Going to be a good player. I would say though we absolutely need a freak. There was a thread in here called Bring on the Freaks. Whoever started it got it right. The Bulls are the geekiest team in the league. They have all of these cerebral types. But eventually you need a kid, an Amare Stoudamire type, who will grab the damn ball, rise up 40 inches, and punch it through someone for a dunk. That gets the crowd going. That brings momentum. Those are things the Bulls lack. They are boring. I cant even watch them anymore really. Its a yawn fest. Roy is going to be a good player, maybe even great. But is he going to get anyone excited? I dont think so. The Bulls eventually will need to get that athlete. You need easy buckets in this league, ie dunks, and the Bulls have to be dead last in the league on that category.


Of all the guards/swingmen in the draft, Roy takes it to the rack the most. He's not the highest flyer, but he does have the ability to hand in the air and adjust his shots. We've had some guards on our team who have been able to jump higher than Roy (Gordon, Jay Williams), but none of them have been able to adjust and think in the air like Roy can. 

But I agree, we need freaks. I really love this Roy kid, so maybe for me the ideal offseason, even though it won't happen, would be to draft Roy, get the best big with our pick, and then go full blast after Wilcox. 

As for Pippen liking Ronnie Brewer, keep in mind Pip went to Central Arkansas and Brewer went to Arkansas. Ronnie seriously intrigues me, and although I don't think he's going to be the player Roy is, he might have it in him. He is an extremely interesting prospect: athletic, long, with point guard handles. If we draft a big with the Knicks, I'd really be into Brewer with our pick, if he's still around. Ronnie, like Roy, could be the perfect big guard we need to go in a 3 guard rotation with Kirk and Ben (sorry Du).

Just say no to Tyrus Thomas. Not enough size, not enough offensive skills. I love the energy, but he could pull a Hakim Warrick on us in the league.


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## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Just say no to Tyrus Thomas. Not enough size, not enough offensive skills. I love the energy, but he could pull a Hakim Warrick on us in the league.


Your whole post was good Darius. I'll just say that I agree on no to Thomas and also to Noah. They remind me too much of Tyson Chandler reading their draft bios, and when I picture Tyson Chandler in college basketball, I see him impacting the game in the same exact ways those guys did. 

Granted, we should work everyone out and see how they do first hand. Judgements shouldn't be made solely on their college careers and international careers. 

You guys are putting up some good information on the wing players in this draft that I'm kind of in the dark about. Keep it up.


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## laso

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Roy has a little Mitch Richmond in his game, and that is a good thing.


I think Roy has a little Rip Hamilton in his game. Fundamentally sound all around, good athlete although not a freak, good mid-range, good jumper... He is definitely the type of player we need on the team.

I still have hope that with the Knicks pick we'll get a good inside player. I like Noah a lot. He's shown the ability to completely dominate big games. He is tough and long and will be an impact with the pros as well. An improved version of Mutombo. I am also intrigued by Thomas, Bargnani and to a lesser degree Aldridge. But if Pax does not find anything special in these players and gets us two taller wing players, we will have addressed another of our problems: lack of athletic wing players...


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

My Bulls draft board hasn't changed much:

Aldridge
Bargnani (more based off of scouting reports I've read than actual time spent watching)
Noah
Carney
Thomas (I'm not as high on him as most)
-----
Splitter (as long as they are comfortable handling the buyout clause)
O'Bryant
Williams
Gay
Morrison
Brewer
Roy
-----
Armstrong
Roby
Glen Davis
Collins
Reddick

The guys in the middle group are all relatively equal in my estimation. Depending on who we take first would change who we would take with our second pick.

I don't think Williams makes much sense with the second pick unless we draft Noah, Bargnani, or Carney with our first pick. O'Bryant or Splitter would make sense with anyone in my top 5 as long as Pax feels one of them is the best available talent. I'd only look at the wings if we draft big with the NY pick--or if we are confident (or willing to spend) the money to acquire two of the best ones in FA or have a big for small trade lined up.

I do think Gay & Morrison are likely to be taken higher than where I have them slated. I just see both of them as unnecessary duplication at the SF.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Right now I'm leaning towards Bargnani, I think he'll be a gret fit alongside Tyson next season. After him I like Noah, Aldridge, Splitter and Thomas in that order with the Knicks pick.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> Mohammed Saer Sene might put his name in the hat this summer? From theDarftexpress website. He's an intriguing prospect. This would be an RLucas player. African. Freak of nature. Very raw. Too much of a risk to take with our pick if it's in the middle of the first round? If he does committ, I hope Pax at least takes a good long look at the kid (or maybe not so much a kid as his age is not truely known - go figure!). I'd take a shot at the guy. One of the benefits of drafting a "euro" (read non-american or foreign) player is that you're not on the hook for their salary if they don't pan out if they decide to stay overseas. The downside being that they may never pan out or decide to stay outide the NBA. It's a risk either way, but I'd like to see Pax take a gamble in this draft.


<A href="http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1263" target="_blank">New Draftexpress article on Saer Sene</A>


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

hey flash 

here is another report 

Mouhamed Saer Sene, C, Senegal
A dominant performance in the 2006 Hoop Summit game (15 points, six boards and nine blocked shots) had scouts buzzing Saturday. Sene plays in Belgium and is just starting to see playing time there, so the Hoop Summit was a real coming-out party for him in front of NBA executives.

Sene is a big-time athlete with a freakish 7-8 wingspan. He has the size and frame to be a legit center in the NBA someday. Sene is an aggressive defender who can dominate a game by rebounding and blocking shots. He's quite agile for a big man and he's great in the open floor. Perhaps most important, he has added some much-needed strength since we saw him last spring at the Reebok Eurocamp.

On the downside, he's very raw offensively. Most of his points come from dunks and offensive rebounds. He's relatively inexperienced -- he began playing basketball only three years ago -- so scouts see big upside. But he's not going to come in and contribute right away. He also needs to continue to add muscle -- another 20 pounds or so seems possible, given his frame.

Sene represents the type of player David Stern tried to get rid of with the age restriction -- a young, inexperienced athlete with upside too big to ignore.

The draft doesn't have a lot of bigs, and Sene has the type of upside teams look for in late first-round steals. It's a risk for someone, but as long as Sene doesn't go too high, it would be a calculated one


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I like everything I'm reading about Sene. But he seems like a Tyson Clone for now. Will he get better offensively, who knows. However, Pax will not take a gamble on him. He would pick a guy such as Hilton or Paul Davis with our pick over this guy. It would depend on who is taken by this pick, whether or not to gamble on him. 

If Roy and Carney are gone by our pick, and guys such as O'Bryant, Shelden, etc are taken, I would gamble on this kid. He has the size, it's a matter of adjusting to the game.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> I like everything I'm reading about Sene. But he seems like a Tyson Clone for now. Will he get better offensively, who knows. However, Pax will not take a gamble on him. He would pick a guy such as Hilton or Paul Davis with our pick over this guy. It would depend on who is taken by this pick, whether or not to gamble on him.
> 
> If Roy and Carney are gone by our pick, and guys such as O'Bryant, Shelden, etc are taken, I would gamble on this kid. He has the size, it's a matter of adjusting to the game.


I agree that Pax will not take this kid. But I ask, does that make it right? Paul Davis is a joke. Hilton Armstrong is ok but probably not going to be much either. I would argue that Davis is no safer than this kid. Armstrong is. But neither Armstrong, or Davis, seem to have anywhere near the chance to be a top line player then this kid does. If Pax could get a pick in the 20s, he should finally take a shot on a kid who could be great for once. Safe doesnt get you very far in the NBA. Was San Antonio safe picking Tony Parker, Manu Ginobili or even signing a guy like Glenn Robinson last year?


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

<table x:str="" style="border-collapse: collapse;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" height="984" width="298"><col style="width: 48pt;" span="2" width="64"> <col style="width: 52pt;" width="69"> <col style="width: 48pt;" span="3" width="64"> <tbody><tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl25" style="height: 12.75pt; width: 48pt;" height="17" width="64">*Rank*</td> <td class="xl25" style="border-left: medium none; width: 48pt;" width="64">*Rating*</td> <td class="xl26" style="border-left: medium none; width: 52pt;" width="69">*Name*</td> <td class="xl27" style="border-left: medium none; width: 48pt;" width="64">*Gut feeling comments*</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">1</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="3.38"> 3.38 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Noah</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Combination heart, size and skills gives him a slight bump above the others</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">2</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="3.25"> 3.25 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Bargnani</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Appears to have everything we're looking for except experience. Projects as a nice offensive force.</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">3</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="3.25"> 3.25 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Thomas</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Skills looked a bit more suspect as time went on. Projects as a defensive force still.</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">4</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="3.25"> 3.25 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Gay</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Quality all around game in a hyper-athletic package</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">5</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="3"> 3.00 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Aldridge</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Good at everything, doesn't appear especially hungry or aggressive. Kiss of death.</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">6</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="3"> 3.00 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Morrison</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Super scorer, all-heart, less clear what else he can do (defend, distribute)</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">7</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="3"> 3.00 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Roy</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">All-around player, but with only ok size and athleticism going into a league with crazy athletes.</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">8</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="2.75"> 2.75 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Brewer</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">My favorite wing prospect. Does everything well and would seem to match our guys well.</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">9</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="2.75"> 2.75 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">S. Williams</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">A solid base hit. Maybe a double. Can't miss, but won't hit it out of the park.</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl29" style="border-top: medium none; height: 12.75pt;" x:num="" height="17">10</td> <td class="xl30" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;" x:num="2.69"> 2.69 </td> <td class="xl31" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">Foye</td> <td class="xl28" style="border-top: medium none; border-left: medium none;">A crazy pick for the Bulls, but another big strong combo guard might make for nice flexibility.</td> </tr> </tbody></table>
That's my board at the moment.


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

rlucas,

What have you witnessed from Splitter if anything? I haven't read anything by you on Tiago, which leads me to believe that you can't be too high on him.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



L.O.B said:


> rlucas,
> 
> What have you witnessed from Slpitter if anything? I haven't read anything by you on Tiago, which leads me to believe that you can't be too high on him.



I like him but try to stay away from commenting on him. My mother was born in Brazil so I am always going to be outlandishly bullish on Brazil. Whether that is soccer or guys like Barbosa, Nene, Marcus Viera de Souza (aka Marquinhos, a guy I have talked up before). Rather then having a guy like Sausage come on and personally insult me over this, I decided to not say much about those kids. I will say Splitter is a good player. Im high on him. I prefer Nene as a FA however. Im not sure what differentiates Splitter from the real good bigs in this draft. Thats my question. But Splitter would absolutely destroy Paul Davis or Hilton Armstrong at the next level. So Splitter could work at 13-17. And thats about where he would go. But Nene, IMO, maxes out as the better player. Though Splitter should be slightly better then Joachim Noahs twin, Anderson Varajao, another Brazilian.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I agree that Pax will not take this kid. But I ask, does that make it right? Paul Davis is a joke. Hilton Armstrong is ok but probably not going to be much either. I would argue that Davis is no safer than this kid. Armstrong is. But neither Armstrong, or Davis, seem to have anywhere near the chance to be a top line player then this kid does. If Pax could get a pick in the 20s, he should finally take a shot on a kid who could be great for once. Safe doesnt get you very far in the NBA. Was San Antonio safe picking Tony Parker, Manu Ginobili or even signing a guy like Glenn Robinson last year?


I totally agree with you. I am a believer, high risk = high reward. Safe picks will help you if you are looking for a role player a la Battier, in that draft. 

This is what makes me unsure on whom I want to draft. I see superstar potential in a guy like Carney. Superstar talent in Gay, but do not see the desire. Maybe it is hidden like Charlie V? Aldridge seems the most polished and fits our need the best, but I don't see that hunger. 

Could Pax land a late 1st rounder for Sene? It would not take much and maybe a team would do that for Sweets and a 2nd?

I think we have to go hard for big bodies in FA, and go for the best player overall with the NYK pick. Pick for need with our pick. If it is too high for a Gay/Carney/Roy, trade down a spot or two. We got the money to get Nene, Gooden, Wilcox, etc. Coming away w/2 of those guys in FA will make us a very solid team.


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## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I give rlucas credit for Sene. I was touting him as well for us to look at as a prospect for next year's draft (along with Alexis Ajinca), but if he comes out this year, I'd love for the Bulls to look at this guy with our pick, provided it's not lottery. 14-20, hell yeah!!


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> hey flash
> 
> here is another report
> 
> Mouhamed Saer Sene, C, Senegal
> A dominant performance in the 2006 Hoop Summit game (15 points, six boards and nine blocked shots) had scouts buzzing Saturday. Sene plays in Belgium and is just starting to see playing time there, so the Hoop Summit was a real coming-out party for him in front of NBA executives.
> 
> Sene is a big-time athlete with a freakish 7-8 wingspan. He has the size and frame to be a legit center in the NBA someday. Sene is an aggressive defender who can dominate a game by rebounding and blocking shots. He's quite agile for a big man and he's great in the open floor. Perhaps most important, he has added some much-needed strength since we saw him last spring at the Reebok Eurocamp.
> 
> On the downside, he's very raw offensively. Most of his points come from dunks and offensive rebounds. He's relatively inexperienced -- he began playing basketball only three years ago -- so scouts see big upside. But he's not going to come in and contribute right away. He also needs to continue to add muscle -- another 20 pounds or so seems possible, given his frame.
> 
> Sene represents the type of player David Stern tried to get rid of with the age restriction -- a young, inexperienced athlete with upside too big to ignore.
> 
> The draft doesn't have a lot of bigs, and Sene has the type of upside teams look for in late first-round steals. It's a risk for someone, but as long as Sene doesn't go too high, it would be a calculated one


Thanks for the additional article RLucas. Sene has piqued my interest. 

From a draft strategy standpoint, I hope Pax swings for the fences on one of his two first rounders this year. Make a safe pick on the other one. The safe pick with the Knicks selection would be Aldridge (if he's available). A swing for the fences-type pick would be Bargnani. (He's my guy though!). With our pick (could be anywhere from 11-15 at this point in the game) your safe picks are guys like Hilton Armstrong, Ronnie Brewer, Aaron Gray, etc. The swing for the fences pick here would be a kid with huge upside like Sene. It might be too risky to take him with a mid-first round pick, but like you said, if he grades out better than Armstrong or Gray or Davis, then why not take him? I just can't ever see Pax taking Bargnani and Sene as his two picks. That's just waaayyyy too risky and not in line with what Pax has professed he's looking for. Is Sene another Keon Clark in waiting? Possibly he's more like a more athletic Macus Camby? Hard to say and that's the risk with drafting him.

I, personally, view Bargnani as a pretty safe pick. The main risk being: will he come over. I'm not worried about his ability to play the game as he's been going up against men and putting up solid stats for about a year and a half now. He's gonna be a good pro in the NBA. Aldridge, Thomas and Noah (if he even comes out) all have question marks surrounding them. Bargnani may well be the safest bet of the bunch.

With Sene, the HoopsSummit put him on the map. What he does with it from there is up to him. He' definatly gotten the attention of scouts by holding his own against some top-notch competition. Is he any worse, right now, than Hilton Armstrong? Can he get better than Armstrong and if so, by how much? Gm's become legends or lose their jobs over such decisions.

It's going to be an interesting summer - that's for sure! At least this summer we've got picks and free agency to talk about - unlike last summer and all there was to hash over was Currygate.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think it will be easier to get Gooden vs Wilcox, since Seattle's management seems to want to keep him. 

Does anyone see any Bobcat basketball? Ely has had a solid year, and would be a great guy off the bench. How is his game? Would it fit w/us?

How much capspace do we have? Does Songalia's contract have a player option or team option?Would we have enough to go after Nene and Gooden pretty hard? I

I would love this lineup:
Hinrich/Duhon
Gordon/NYK Pick (Carney/Roy)
Deng/Noce
Gooden/Chicago Pick
Nene/Chandler/Allen

If we can land a frontline like that in FA, I say we go for the best player with the NYK pick.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I was reading onn Hoopshype, where they posted a quote to Draftexpress, that Sene's buyout is about $425,000.


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## southpark

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Does anyone think with the Knicks mini win streak (and for now since we are no longer guaranteed a top 4 pick) that we should draft Roy with the first pick? Assuming it falls around 5-6, I would take him over Carney and Gay but if a big were availible (Bargnani, Aldridge, Noah, Tyrus) then I'd still take Roy for sure. I really think Roy will be solid in this league and we could always sign someone like Gooden, Al Harrington, Nene, Nazr, etc to fill our big man need for this year and draft one next year (allegedly the 2007 draft is filled with big men).

With our pick we could go for someone like Shelden Williams or HIlton or Aaron Gray. Thoughts?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The thing about Sane, and I can already hear Pax say this, is that one game, against one of the best HS classes in history, doesnt mean much. Sure, Sane was dominant, apparently. But the counter is Noah. Noah was a borderline player who basically dominated a big tournament against the weakest college group in history. Can we really declare such great things from Noah? Now, having said that, I like Noah. Im being consistent here. The answer to both is Yes. But I believe the Bulls would say the answer to Sene is No and the answer to Noah is Yes. Either way, I like Sene. I see him as a Diop, Bynum, Petro level type pick. He isnt going to do much for a year or two, but someone could get rich on him. Kids with his athletic attributes (7-0 feet tall, 230 pounds, 40 inch vert from what I hear and a 7-8, YES 7 Frickin 8 Wingspan), desire, and ability to pick up the game (only played 3 years) are worth a very long look. And he already has said he isnt afraid to put himself up against Aldridge. So we ought to take a long look at him. He is a reach, but occasionally, you need to make those reaches. Pippen was a reach at 5.


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## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Noah said that he's staying in school; his family's well off, and he likes college. As for Sene, the Bulls should at least bring the guy in for a workout if he indeed does declare and make a decision from there. His buyout isn't bad at all and at worst, you can let send him down to hte D-League and continue to let him develop there. This team lacks size, and if we were to come out of this draft with Bargnani and Sene(if he comes out), I'd consider that a really good draft.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



dsouljah9 said:


> Noah said that he's staying in school; his family's well off, and he likes college. As for Sene, the Bulls should at least bring the guy in for a workout if he indeed does declare and make a decision from there. His buyout isn't bad at all and at worst, you can let send him down to hte D-League and continue to let him develop there. This team lacks size, and if we were to come out of this draft with Bargnani and Sene(if he comes out), I'd consider that a really good draft.


I would too, though I suspect he would be lambasted for the draft. It would show that he can think outside the box some. 

Dont read too much into what these kids say. 9 out of 10 kids say they are going to stay and then the vast majority leave. Noah might be a case of a kid who could stay because of his families situation (though I have no idea how Yannick Noah is rich still after all of these years of living hard, but I believe the mother was a super model or something). However, Sean May was well off, supposedly staying, supposed to be in love with college, and fresh off a championship and still declared. There are alot of similarities there. Since Noah apparently doesnt need the money (neither did Bosh apparently) he might stay. But he would be very foolish to, from a career perspective to not come out.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The thing about Sane, and I can already hear Pax say this, is that one game, against one of the best HS classes in history, doesnt mean much. Sure, Sane was dominant, apparently. But the counter is Noah. Noah was a borderline player who basically dominated a big tournament against the weakest college group in history. Can we really declare such great things from Noah? Now, having said that, I like Noah. Im being consistent here. The answer to both is Yes. But I believe the Bulls would say the answer to Sene is No and the answer to Noah is Yes. Either way, I like Sene. I see him as a Diop, Bynum, Petro level type pick. He isnt going to do much for a year or two, but someone could get rich on him. Kids with his athletic attributes (7-0 feet tall, 230 pounds, 40 inch vert from what I hear and a 7-8, YES 7 Frickin 8 Wingspan), desire, and ability to pick up the game (only played 3 years) are worth a very long look. And he already has said he isnt afraid to put himself up against Aldridge. So we ought to take a long look at him. He is a reach, but occasionally, you need to make those reaches. Pippen was a reach at 5.




7 feet...40 inch vertical??!!!!....7-8 WINGSPAN?!!!!...........40 inch VERTICAL?

is the kid an alien?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> 7 feet...40 inch vertical??!!!!....7-8 WINGSPAN?!!!!...........40 inch VERTICAL?
> 
> is the kid an alien?


a 7-8 Wingspan would be the longest in the NBA. Longer then Yao, Mutombo, Chandler etc


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Cedric Simmons declares, per realgm board.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Noah might be a case of a kid who could stay because of his families situation (though I have no idea how Yannick Noah is rich still after all of these years of living hard, but I believe the mother was a super model or something)


He is a pretty successful singer in France. My sister lived there for a year, and she's brought home a couple of his cd's, so he must be doing alright.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> He is a pretty successful singer in France. My sister lived there for a year, and she's brought home a couple of his cd's, so he must be doing alright.


Didnt know that. thanks. I always figured he was famous for his French Open title, I believe the only grand slam he ever won. I could never figure out how you could live off one of those. But this does explain it.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

He was there at Live 8, as well. He is pretty popular, money is not an issue.

J. Noah is the classic NBA player I would totally hate if he doesnt wear Bulls' red and black. Im not a big fan of his attitude, demagogy, etc.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Tyrus Thomas = Josh Smith @ the 4?

the both cause mayhem around the bucket.

any input?


----------



## highlite2nice2nice

*LaMarcus Aldridge*

just saw on espn.com that LaMarcus Aldridge is entering the draft,do u guys still think we should consider drafting him or do you guys like Tyrus Thomas.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*

Welcome to last week

I dunno, I think Aldridge does not seem physical, and he doesn't show much emotion. Maybe he can bring the quiet storm like Duncan? Who knows. Tyrus shows the heart, but his game is not polished. However, it looks like he has to drive to succeed. He could be anywhere from a Stromile Swift to a KMart to Amare. But, he lacks the size we need. He would be a tiny PF for now. If I had to pick right now, I'd go Aldridge personally. But I rather have Carney or Roy over either of them, and get our big men through FA and our pick.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*

Any moderator ready to merge this thread?

Welcome to the boards, by the way, highlite.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Tyrus Thomas = Josh Smith @ the 4?
> 
> the both cause mayhem around the bucket.
> 
> any input?


I think that's a good comparison defensively. I just don't trust that his offensive game is anywhere near NBA ready. While liking him as a player, I don't see superstar potential out of this kid and I think possible injury is a concern that should be looked at as is with all players who play above the rim (and I do think we need to add more players who play above the rim, but this is why I like Carney better than Thomas within our offensive system--it's also why I have Bargnani so highly rated).


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Tyrus Thomas = Josh Smith @ the 4?
> 
> the both cause mayhem around the bucket.
> 
> any input?


Yeah, but Tyrus has less of a jumpshot, less handles, no real post moves, and not enough bulk to play his position (yet). 

I really liked Josh Smith out of HS. What a talent.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Yeah, but Tyrus has less of a jumpshot, less handles, no real post moves, and not enough bulk to play his position (yet).
> 
> I really liked Josh Smith out of HS. What a talent.


Didn't Bilas totally lay into the Smith with Smith in attendance on ESPN at the draft? Good to see Smith have the last word.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



theanimal23 said:


> Welcome to last week
> 
> I dunno, I think Aldridge does not seem physical, and he doesn't show much emotion. Maybe he can bring the quiet storm like Duncan? Who knows. Tyrus shows the heart, but his game is not polished. However, it looks like he has to drive to succeed. He could be anywhere from a Stromile Swift to a KMart to Amare. But, he lacks the size we need. He would be a tiny PF for now. If I had to pick right now, I'd go Aldridge personally. But I rather have Carney or Roy over either of them, and get our big men through FA and our pick.


NONE of the FA's this year have the potential of Aldridge or Thomas IMO maybe except Nene and he hasn't shown MUCH since he's been in the league....

NONE of the FA's have the scoring ability of Aldridge or the defensively ability of Thomas.....

as far as thomas, the kid is 19, 6"9" and he's probably not done growing yet....

I like Aldridge cuz he's instant offense, Gordon & Hinrich would have a field day passing it to him in the post...But ALSO, I'm sure they'd love gettin' a ton of easy baskets with Thomas around the hoop...PLUS he's an enforcer, something we coulda used LAST night getting PUNKED by the soft atlanta hawks...


----------



## step

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



> I like Aldridge cuz he's instant offense


Instant offense, he scored alot against LSU. Now just imagine him in the NBA.

I'm starting to sour on the bigs in this draft, they'll be projects and a half, and who knows which one will pan out or not.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



step said:


> Instant offense, he scored alot against LSU. Now just imagine him in the NBA.
> 
> I'm starting to sour on the bigs in this draft, they'll be projects and a half, and who knows which one will pan out or not.


Every single college player gets abused defensevely, or has a dissapointing offensive performance. One game is small sample. After LSU advanced (beating Texas), Tyrus Thomas dissapeared. Should we consider that last game or the one against Texas? Or his entire college carrer plus his skills, body, size, potential,etc?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



step said:


> Instant offense, he scored alot against LSU. Now just imagine him in the NBA.


ONE bad game man..GEEZ, get over it

everybody knows those are the same shots Aldridge usually ALWAYS hits


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*

People...Is Tyrus even a 4?

I hope he grows 2 inches and gains 25 lbs of muscle.

He is such an intriguing prospect, but I just kept seeing Josh Smith and was thinking Tyrus with inferior perimeter game...I mean...Yeah Tyrus showed range...Shows intensity down low...But really...We need a man in the paint that's gonna command a double team...I don't know if we need a "big man" that's gonna face up all the time.

Aldridge is getting the edge for these reasons...He has moves...he has touch...he's quick...he could be a nightmare for opponents...I have no doubt Skiles wouldn't allow Aldridge to NOT be fed in the post...


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



The ROY said:


> NONE of the FA's this year have the potential of Aldridge or Thomas IMO maybe except Nene and he hasn't shown MUCH since he's been in the league....
> 
> NONE of the FA's have the scoring ability of Aldridge or the defensively ability of Thomas.....
> 
> as far as thomas, the kid is 19, 6"9" and he's probably not done growing yet....
> 
> I like Aldridge cuz he's instant offense, Gordon & Hinrich would have a field day passing it to him in the post...But ALSO, I'm sure they'd love gettin' a ton of easy baskets with Thomas around the hoop...PLUS he's an enforcer, something we coulda used LAST night getting PUNKED by the soft atlanta hawks...


So someone should have fought Childress back with only 4 games to go and our playoff lives on the line?

I thought it was smart, not that we got punked. Childress' swipe at Nocioni was more a Pike punch than anything else.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



Rhyder said:


> So someone should have fought Childress back with only 4 games to go and our playoff lives on the line?
> 
> I thought it was smart, not that we got punked. Childress' swipe at Nocioni was more a Pike punch than anything else.


you don't have to FIGHT to enforce....

Chandler acting like he was gonna punch zaza was just so corny lookin'...he wasn't gonna do JACK...

Nobodies scared of the bulls, we have the softest frontline in the NBA....when Kirk Hinrich is the TOUGHEST player on your roster, your team is SOFTTTTT


----------



## Sir Patchwork

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*

So aside from personal opinions on who we should take, who does everyone think Paxson will take?


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



Sir Patchwork said:


> So aside from personal opinions on who we should take, who does everyone think Paxson will take?


I really don't have a good read right now. My best guess at this point is that it's Aldridge if he's available with the NY pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I still stand by my stance of wanting Tyrus Thomas.

After watching him have two leg injuries in the SAME game and not wanting to leave the game although they had a damn 15 point lead with 2 minutes was just HEART, he fought thru it although he didn't have to. I love his attitude, on and off the court. He's a winner.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

NBA Commissioner David Stern thinks Joakim Noah will be a star in the NBA but will probably return to the University of Florida for his junior season. 

"I think that he is going to be a star in the NBA," Stern said during a wide-ranging conference call Thursday with reporters.
"I think that he is most likely going to return to college for another year, a decision that I applaud for him because he's going to get to enjoy another year of college, which is not just about basketball, but about life."

"But from our perspective, we think it's fine that somebody decides to enjoy another year of college."


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

guys...i split the entire "who is TOUGH" discussion into a new thread as it was kinda polluting the draft discussion here in this thread.


if you don't like it, you can beat me up....tough guys!






:smilewink


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



Sir Patchwork said:


> So aside from personal opinions on who we should take, who does everyone think Paxson will take?



Depends on the pick Patch. 

I really think Aldridge is the guy. Though Ford pointed out that there are whispers that Thomas is Paxs guy. Either would be a good addition.

I also think the Bulls rate Morrison. But he wouldnt fit into our culture. Pax and Skiles want "Yes Men", not people with an actual personality. The one consistent thing about Pax has been that he has taken real duds, in terms of personality, with his picks and his FA guys. Morrison is too excitable, too flamboyant if Skiles in particular is going to be around for awhile. For Morrison to succeed, its going to take a coach to allow him to be a free thinker. That wouldnt be the case here. Having said that, I like Adam alot and think, if given the right environment, he will be a good player.


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



rlucas4257 said:


> Depends on the pick Patch.
> 
> I really think Aldridge is the guy. Though Ford pointed out that there are whispers that Thomas is Paxs guy. Either would be a good addition.
> 
> I also think the Bulls rate Morrison. But he wouldnt fit into our culture. Pax and Skiles want "Yes Men", not people with an actual personality. The one consistent thing about Pax has been that he has taken real duds, in terms of personality, with his picks and his FA guys. Morrison is too excitable, too flamboyant if Skiles in particular is going to be around for awhile. For Morrison to succeed, its going to take a coach to allow him to be a free thinker. That wouldnt be the case here. Having said that, I like Adam alot and think, if given the right environment, he will be a good player.


Now that your bias is known when it comes to Splitter, can you tell me if the scouting report is close http://draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=25 

If he's half as good at the pick and roll as the report states and he understands team defense, he seems like a perfect fit for the Bulls even with the Knicks pick. The scouting reports leads one to believe that he might even have incredible jib


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



L.O.B said:


> Now that your bias is known when it comes to Splitter, can you tell me if the scouting report is close http://draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=25
> 
> If he's half as good at the pick and roll as the report states and he understands team defense, he seems like a perfect fit for the Bulls even with the Knicks pick. The scouting reports leads one to believe that he might even have incredible jib


Draftexpress, and Jonathan Givoney (outside of Luke Jackson, but oh well) in particular, do a great job scouting. The report is right on.


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



rlucas4257 said:


> Draftexpress, and Jonathan Givoney (outside of Luke Jackson, but oh well) in particular, do a great job scouting. The report is right on.


Then he's my #1 choice for the Bulls. What's not to like other than that buy out? He's addresses the need for size, he's good at what the Bulls like do both offensively and defensively and he would be perfect opposite of Chandler. They even mention his high basketball IQ.


----------



## Swan

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



rlucas4257 said:


> Depends on the pick Patch.
> 
> I really think Aldridge is the guy. Though Ford pointed out that there are whispers that Thomas is Paxs guy. Either would be a good addition.
> 
> I also think the Bulls rate Morrison. But he wouldnt fit into our culture. Pax and Skiles want "Yes Men", not people with an actual personality. The one consistent thing about Pax has been that he has taken real duds, in terms of personality, with his picks and his FA guys. Morrison is too excitable, too flamboyant if Skiles in particular is going to be around for awhile. For Morrison to succeed, its going to take a coach to allow him to be a free thinker. That wouldnt be the case here. Having said that, I like Adam alot and think, if given the right environment, he will be a good player.


In all honesty, do you really believe that when Pax, Skiles and the rest of the front office group get together and talk about their draft board, they're really that concerned with player personality? I will agree that the current group is not the most emotionally outwardly expressive group, but I don't see them eliminating any prospect on the basis of "personality." Traits such as on-court behavior, and work ethic, maybe. Paxson and Skiles, unlike everybody who post here (I'm assuming...) actually played in the L, and Paxson especially went through the experience of winning 3 championships with a roster that was certainly not homogenuous with respect to player personality and talent. Unless he had his eyes closed that entire time, I'm sure he took something away from that.

If small forward wasn't our position of greatest depth and strength, Morrison might be on the board (and still could be, for I know). Not drafting Mo has more to do with Deng and Noch than the fact that he talks trash or bangs his head with the ball after defensive rebounds.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



L.O.B said:


> Then he's my #1 choice for the Bulls. What's not to like other than that buy out? He's addresses the need for size, he's good at what the Bulls like do both offensively and defensively and he would be perfect opposite of Chandler. They even mention his high basketball IQ.


I've seen Splitter play a lot this year as well, and I agree completely with Rlucas. He is as good as advertised, and he would be a good fit for the Bulls, not to mention that Skiles and Pax would like him as a player as well. I hope he'll continue to fly under the radar, then maybe we'll have a chance to take him with our own pick, that would be a great pick in my opinion.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



Swan said:


> In all honesty, do you really believe that when Pax, Skiles and the rest of the front office group get together and talk about their draft board, they're really that concerned with player personality? I will agree that the current group is not the most emotionally outwardly expressive group, but I don't see them eliminating any prospect on the basis of "personality." Traits such as on-court behavior, and work ethic, maybe. Paxson and Skiles, unlike everybody who post here (I'm assuming...) actually played in the L, and Paxson especially went through the experience of winning 3 championships with a roster that was certainly not homogenuous with respect to player personality and talent. Unless he had his eyes closed that entire time, I'm sure he took something away from that.
> 
> If small forward wasn't our position of greatest depth and strength, Morrison might be on the board (and still could be, for I know). Not drafting Mo has more to do with Deng and Noch than the fact that he talks trash or bangs his head with the ball after defensive rebounds.


Yes, I think there is a 90% chance that they discuss it and rate it almost has high as talent. The history of Paxs drafting 100% shows this. Even his second round picks have been considered good people first. And if they show a whiff of not being easy to deal with then they get no chance of run on the club (who was the kid on CSKA Moscow?). Also Skiles has a history in the league of not being easy to deal with. That has to be in Paxs mind. Skiles wasnt overly successful in Phoenix in dealing with personalities. My guess is that they look at Morrison, a white college player, and love him. But when they dig a little deeper I think they will find a guy who talks trash with his own coaches, has been in fights, would rather talk politics (he is a big liberal while Skiles is a widely known republican) and occasionally throws up bad shots just to get a "heat check". Does this sound like a Skiles type of kid? Now, I admit Skiles has done a good job, but he certainly limits the type of player that the club can target. But to answer your question, the Bulls have said they want guys who not only play the right way, but live the right way, so yes they consider personality very important. Unfortunately, the guys they have assembled really dont have any personality, at all.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



LegoHat said:


> I've seen Splitter play a lot this year as well, and I agree completely with Rlucas. He is as good as advertised, and he would be a good fit for the Bulls, not to mention that Skiles and Pax would like him as a player as well. I hope he'll continue to fly under the radar, then maybe we'll have a chance to take him with our own pick, that would be a great pick in my opinion.


Euros always drop the day of the draft. If he goes top 10, I would be shocked. He will be available with the Bulls other pick. And he would be a good pick there. I like him. He fits a need. I would applaud the pick. But I would be more intriguided by taking Sene if he continues to impress in his workouts. Bigger upside, so I hear.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



rlucas4257 said:


> Euros always drop the day of the draft. If he goes top 10, I would be shocked. He will be available with the Bulls other pick. And he would be a good pick there. I like him. He fits a need. I would applaud the pick. But I would be more intriguided by taking Sene if he continues to impress in his workouts. Bigger upside, so I hear.


Sene looks like he has an amazing physique and athleticism, that's for sure. No one in the draft has as much upside as him in my opinion, but it's a big risk taking him with a first round pick. I wouldn't be against it if we aquired a player like Nene in free agency, then Sene would have time to develop and learn the NBA game without too much pressure.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



LegoHat said:


> Sene looks like he has an amazing physique and athleticism, that's for sure. No one in the draft has as much upside as him in my opinion, but it's a big risk taking him with a first round pick. I wouldn't be against it if we aquired a player like Nene in free agency, then Sene would have time to develop and learn the NBA game without too much pressure.



Sene is big risk vs big reward. It would be foolish to take him and expect anything for a year or two. But the curve seems to be there and his physical attributes are the most exciting I have ever seen. I would consider him at 15 if the Bulls feel confident that Nene (who should be the #1 fa target) will sign or if they get a ready made prospect with the first pick (Aldridge).


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



LegoHat said:


> I've seen Splitter play a lot this year as well, and I agree completely with Rlucas. He is as good as advertised, and he would be a good fit for the Bulls, not to mention that Skiles and Pax would like him as a player as well. I hope he'll continue to fly under the radar, then maybe we'll have a chance to take him with our own pick, that would be a great pick in my opinion.


I don't see how Tiago falls to the Bulls pick if he's as good as the scouting report would indicate. This year's draft lacks a clear #1 pick so the Bulls have to address team need more than best player. Other than Aldridge, Splitter and Obryant I don't see any bigs that address the need for interior post presence.

I am gathering from the report, that when Tiago is successful at the pick and roll, he's actually moving toward the basket and not popping from 12 feet? That sure would add a nice facet to next years offense.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I have said it all along: Pax loves Splitter, he is his kind of guy. I cant imagine the Bulls avoiding Splitter with their own pick. He plays defense, is pure jib, and can score some. He has the right profile, so I can see Pax being all over this guy. Hopefully he doesnt get too much press come draft time, if he decides to put his name in.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I have said it all along: Pax loves Splitter, he is his kind of guy. I cant imagine the Bulls avoiding Splitter with their own pick. He plays defense, is pure jib, and can score some. He has the right profile, so I can see Pax being all over this guy. Hopefully he doesnt get too much press come draft time, if he decides to put his name in.


Pax and the Bulls dont scout Europe. Its very possible they have a college player in mind. Thats who they tend to favor. I agree with you, Splitter works for the Bulls. Unfortunately, its quite possible the Bulls dont know much about him. 

If the Bulls pick Paul Davis in round 1, then Im done with them.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I have said it all along: Pax loves Splitter, he is his kind of guy. I cant imagine the Bulls avoiding Splitter with their own pick. He plays defense, is pure jib, and can score some. He has the right profile, so I can see Pax being all over this guy. Hopefully he doesnt get too much press come draft time, if he decides to put his name in.


pax recently said there's too many complications with some players over seas cuz of their buyouts....he said that on the radio...

we don't want another situation like orlando had last season


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> pax recently said there's too many complications with some players over seas cuz of their buyouts....he said that on the radio...
> 
> we don't want another situation like orlando had last season


There was no complication, that kid just decided he wanted to stay. That team was willing to let him go and instead he went to another team. 

That scares me about Bargani. He doesnt seem too high on coming to the US. That is one reason to be scared of him.


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Pax and the Bulls dont scout Europe. Its very possible they have a college player in mind. Thats who they tend to favor. I agree with you, Splitter works for the Bulls. Unfortunately, its quite possible the Bulls dont know much about him.
> 
> If the Bulls pick Paul Davis in round 1, then Im done with them.


Well someone should forward the draftexpress link to Paxson then.  

I am hoping Nocioni has told Paxson a thing or two about Tiago from his expirences with him. Sounds like Splitter started playing professionally as early as Andres did. Sounds like someone should look into Tau for child labor practices  

I am Spartan fan but if the Bulls draft Davis, I am eating my msu hat.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



L.O.B said:


> Well someone should forward the draftexpress link to Paxson then.
> 
> I am hoping Nocioni has told Paxson a thing or two about Tiago from his expirences with him. Sounds like Splitter started playing professionally as early as Andres did. Sounds like someone should look into Tau for child labor practices
> 
> I am Spartan fan but if the Bulls draft Davis, I am eating my msu hat.


In Europe, they dont have the same BS attitude to kids that we have here in the states. People in the states blame the kids for the game, but dont realize that its the guys like KG, AMare, Kobe, Lebron, Tmac who have saved it. In Europe, in the soccer leagues, it all kids. My team, Arsenal, are in the final 4 of the worlds biggest club competition, the champs league. They have a 19 year old left back, an 18 year old central midfielder, a 20 year old central defender and a huge amount of teenagers on their bench. They just bought a kid for 12 million pounds (20 million bucks). This kid, Theo Walcott is 16 years old. So in Europe, they tend to embrace youth. The kids are pros. They are taught in private schools but are brought into practice against the men. This helps them in a big way and its why the gap has closed to the point where the US isnt the best basketball country in the world. And its something the NBA needs to look at. A kid like Lebron, or more timely, Oden, is wasting his time in HS and college. He should be in one of these pro academies, getting an education and practicing against men, not boys. Tau, and basketball in general in europe, do this. And they have taken that from the soccer.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Pax and the Bulls dont scout Europe. Its very possible they have a college player in mind. Thats who they tend to favor. I agree with you, Splitter works for the Bulls. Unfortunately, its quite possible the Bulls dont know much about him.
> 
> If the Bulls pick Paul Davis in round 1, then Im done with them.


Pax went over Europe many times already. And regarding Splitter, you must remember he was Nocioni's teammate. So if there is someone that knows him better than almost any GM, for having shared many many practices, court time, etc is Andres. And Nocioni talks with the team's management, so I wouldnt be surprised at all if Pax and Noc discussed Splitter before. 

The buyout is another issue, but Splitter wants to play in the NBA. Fran Vazquez just wanted to stay in Europe.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Pax went over Europe many times already. And regarding Splitter, you must remember he was Nocioni's teammate. So if there is someone that knows him better than almost any GM, for having shared many many practices, court time, etc is Andres. And Nocioni talks with the team's management, so I wouldnt be surprised at all if Pax and Noc discussed Splitter before.
> 
> The buyout is another issue, but Splitter wants to play in the NBA. Fran Vazquez just wanted to stay in Europe.



The Bulls presence overseas is very light. There is no denying it. Now, its possible that Noc and Pax have discussed Tiago, I hope so. But lets also remember, that was now more then 2 years ago and Splitter is far ahead in that time. When Noc was there, Tiago was a deep bench player. Noc could comment on Tiago in practice and his work ethic, but Noc knows about as much of his game as I, or you, or anyone does. What the Bulls need is a scout there who watches these games all the time. And like I said, I hardly ever came around a Bulls scout during my time in that area.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

"LOS ANGELES -- The Trail Blazers on Thursday told Darius Miles to leave the team and return to Portland, one day after the troubled forward took off his uniform and changed into street clothes at halftime of Wednesday's game against the Los Angeles Clippers.

"We are not going to accept that type of behavior," coach Nate McMillan said.

Blazers general manager John Nash said further disciplinary action was levied, but he refused to specify the penalty, and McMillan said harsher penalties could follow once he and Nash meet Saturday in Portland with team President Steve Patterson and Miles. McMillan said that as of Thursday, Miles had not been suspended."

GOOD! :banana: They should DEFININTELY be going after MORRISON with the 1st pick if they get it.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The Bulls presence overseas is very light. There is no denying it. Now, its possible that Noc and Pax have discussed Tiago, I hope so. But lets also remember, that was now more then 2 years ago and Splitter is far ahead in that time. When Noc was there, Tiago was a deep bench player. Noc could comment on Tiago in practice and his work ethic, but Noc knows about as much of his game as I, or you, or anyone does. What the Bulls need is a scout there who watches these games all the time. And like I said, I hardly ever came around a Bulls scout during my time in that area.


I dont agree. Im sure Pax has a formal opinion about Splitter and knows about him much more than what you could speculate. So if he is there when the Bulls draft, and Pax doesnt take him, its going to be because he isnt the player he wanted all along or there are better on board. But as I said, Pax knows Splitter and his potential. 

How many times did he scout Nocioni before signing him to a contract? Did he cross the Atlantic 10 times? I dont think so. And it was a homerun.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I dont agree. Im sure Pax has a formal opinion about Splitter and knows about him much more than what you could speculate. So if he is there when the Bulls draft, and Pax doesnt take him, its going to be because he isnt the player he wanted all along or there are better on board. But as I said, Pax knows Splitter and his potential.
> 
> How many times did he scout Nocioni before signing him to a contract? Did he cross the Atlantic 10 times? I dont think so. And it was a homerun.



Agree or not, but the Bulls are not overseas in a big way. Thats simply a fact which can not be denied. And to answer your question on Nocioni, I believe our Bulls insider said he went to see Arvydas Macijauskas 4 or 5 games and then when he couldnt get him he decided on Noc. Noc wasnt even his main target. Home run or not (taking the fact that your from Argentina I could say it was home run, but I think Dirk is a homerun, or your other boy Manu, Id call Noc a solid double, or maybe even a triple) it was sort of luck (seeing as Macijauskas hasnt done anything in OCity). It was during the European final 4. I doubt they know Splitter or his potential better then 25% of the teams. Its an area the Bulls need to beef up but an area they havent. Their international dept, compared to say San Antonio, Detroit, or Dallas, is a joke.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

One thing you could say about the Krause era: He may not have had success with the players, but at least he scouted Europe. Might not have come away with good players, but at least he scouted. I too have this feeling that Pax takes Davis with our pick. If Splitter's there and he _still_ takes Davis, then I give up.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



dsouljah9 said:


> One thing you could say about the Krause era: He may not have had success with the players, but at least he scouted Europe. Might not have come away with good players, but at least he scouted. I too have this feeling that Pax takes Davis with our pick. If Splitter's there and he _still_ takes Davis, then I give up.



Exactly. Krause wasnt the first guy in Europe (Portland was) but he was close. Krause gets blamed for a lot of things, some rightly, some wrongly. But he, and I think its fairly clear, was a superiorly harder worker then John Paxson. With Krause, you knew he was covering Junior High Basketball Games. He had been watching Corey Maggette and Eddy Curry since their sophomore year in HIGH SCHOOL. He was in China looking at Ming 3 years before Ming or China would let him declare. The results were 6 titles with him. Sure the post dynasty was on him, but there was good there. I mean, would Pax find a Scottie Pippen in central arkansas or a lanky Tony Kukoc in Croatia? So far, Pax has gone to Europe, and yes, done very well in getting Nocioni. But he wanted Macijauskas and neither guy was exactly hidden as they were vet players who were FAs in one of the biggest leagues in Europe. I am looking for Pax to do something outside of the realm of the college ranks. He cant pigeon hole himself into there. And this is as good a draft to do it. College sucks now. Its watered down due to all the HS and early entries for the years. And now we dont have the Darko was a bust excuse to not pick Euros again. There have been very servicable international players picked the last 3 years. And I am willing to bet that youll find 10-15 international players with bigger upsides then say a Paul Davis. But does anyone really think Pax would consider a Sene, or a Splitter, over Paul Davis? I dont. My challenge to him is prove me wrong. Ill give him the props when he does, as I have done before.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Agree or not, but the Bulls are not overseas in a big way. Thats simply a fact which can not be denied. And to answer your question on Nocioni, I believe our Bulls insider said he went to see Arvydas Macijauskas 4 or 5 games and then when he couldnt get him he decided on Noc. Noc wasnt even his main target. Home run or not (taking the fact that your from Argentina I could say it was home run, but I think Dirk is a homerun, or your other boy Manu, Id call Noc a solid double, or maybe even a triple) it was sort of luck (seeing as Macijauskas hasnt done anything in OCity). It was during the European final 4. I doubt they know Splitter or his potential better then 25% of the teams. Its an area the Bulls need to beef up but an area they havent. Their international dept, compared to say San Antonio, Detroit, or Dallas, is a joke.


Getting Nocioni basically for 3M per year is a Home Run here and everywhere. And we werent the only suitors for him, so that Macijauskas or Nocioni argument isnt valid since many teams could have offered more than what the Bulls put on the table. So if Pax wasnt high on Noc, he would be a Celtic or Spur by now. 

I wont argue our international scouting department because I agree with you there, but I have no problems with the Bulls not having 10 guys in China, Africa or Russia.

And I applaud Detroit for scouting Milicic heavily and taking him over Anthony, Wade, Bosh, Hinrich and others. And giving up on him shortly after. That speaks about their special eye for foreign talent.

Delfino is next.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Getting Nocioni basically for 3M per year is a Home Run here and everywhere. And we werent the only suitors for him, so that Macijauskas or Nocioni argument isnt valid since many teams could have offered more than what the Bulls put on the table. So if Pax wasnt high on Noc, he would be a Celtic or Spur by now.
> 
> I wont argue our international scouting department because I agree with you there, but I have no problems with the Bulls not having 10 guys in China, Africa or Russia.
> 
> And I applaud Detroit for scouting Milicic heavily and taking him over Anthony, Wade, Bosh, Hinrich and others. And giving up on him shortly after. That speaks about their special eye for foreign talent.
> 
> Delfino is next.



I totally agree on Delfino. He is going to be a 13-15ppg scorer in this league and efficient at that. Detroit is just so well balanced that there isnt a place for him or Darko on that roster.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> And I applaud Detroit for scouting Milicic heavily and taking him over Anthony, Wade, Bosh, Hinrich and others. And giving up on him shortly after. That speaks about their special eye for foreign talent.


They had the right idea, but they should have taken a note what San Antonio did and let them stay overseas to develop their game.


----------



## truebluefan

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



Sir Patchwork said:


> So aside from personal opinions on who we should take, who does everyone think Paxson will take?


What do I think he will do with the NY pick? Not what I want him to do or what I think he should do, but what I suspect he will do?

Many of you will not like this, he will go for a SG of SF with the NY pick. If Morrison is there he is ours.(or someone else, Roy? Reddick?) Then he takes some of our assets, and this summer, he tries to shoot for the fences. I have a feeling that is what he will try and do. Then with our pick he will address the big man problem. 

What do I want him to do? Thomas. Though, I am not a fan of Aldridge, he may be better than what we have. So I woiuld not cry if he was chosen. 

Our pick could be another big man. Williams? A Euro? Or he could do take a SF/SG. 

Whatever he does, will have an impound effect on the team for next year and years to come. This draft/summer is very important.


----------



## step

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



> If Morrison is there he is ours.(or someone else, Roy? Reddick?)


I really don't see this happening at all, unless we do a trade, and then I think he'd chose Harrington over Gay / Morrison any day. Paxson won't bother causing a log-jam on the wing when we have such pressing needs elsewhere.



> So aside from personal opinions on who we should take, who does everyone think Paxson will take?


Alot depends on where the pick lands and is he able to make a trade.
If we do hold onto the pick (which I believe would be around the #3 mark), I see him going for Roy. I just don't see him relying on a rookie to be our post presence. Who he gets to fill that void is another story.


----------



## truebluefan

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*

speaking of a rookie being out post presence next season, you guys do understand that Pax can and should address that after the draft. Just because we draft a big man, does not mean the job is his. Most good teams let the best player play that spot.


----------



## step

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



> speaking of a rookie being out post presence next season, you guys do understand that Pax can and should address that after the draft. Just because we draft a big man, does not mean the job is his. Most good teams let the best player play that spot.


Yes but if by chance the pick isn't traded, it means we're most likely looking at free agency or the draft to fill the post scoring need. The only player to me that would provide it is Wilcox (I have my concerns on Gooden, and Al Harrington has been discussed ad nauseam) and even that is a bit of a stretch to me. 
Now looking to the draft, the only big players that interest me are Aldridge or Thomas, given that they'll probably go in the top 3, we'll need lady luck on our side. I actually expect these two to go 1-2 in the draft, as I don't see Morrison's hype carrying over too well in the draft workouts at all.

Unless we trade for a "_tainted_" big, or stick to free agency, I don't see us able to hold onto the Knicks pick. So I don't see this as much of an issue really.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



step said:


> Alot depends on where the pick lands and is he able to make a trade.
> If we do hold onto the pick (which I believe would be around the #3 mark), I see him going for Roy. I just don't see him relying on a rookie to be our post presence. Who he gets to fill that void is another story.


I disagree..simply because none of the FA bigs have the potential as Aldridge, Thomas or Bargnani...

no way he'll take roy with a top 3 pick..that would be silly


----------



## The ROY

*Re: LaMarcus Aldridge*



truebluefan said:
 

> What do I think he will do with the NY pick? Not what I want him to do or what I think he should do, but what I suspect he will do?
> 
> Many of you will not like this, he will go for a SG of SF with the NY pick. If Morrison is there he is ours.(or someone else, Roy? Reddick?)


there is absolutely NO WAY Morrison will be a bull....there's barely ANY reason for him to even come and work out in chicago...UNLESS he can play 2guard which he can't

I don't think pax is DUMB enuff to do taht


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Lets say we can draft from 1 to 6, this is how I see it:

1- Aldridge
2- Aldridge/Thomas
3- Aldridge/Thomas/Bargnani
4- Aldridge/Thomas/Bargnani/Roy
5- Aldridge/Thomas/Bargnani/Roy/Morrison
6- Aldridge/Thomas/Bargnani/Roy/Morrison/Gay

This is just an assumption. If we cant get the player Pax wants, we can easily explore trading the pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bulls are currently #2 on ESPN and are projected to take Tyrus Thomas. I can't WAIT to May 27th so we can get this lotto over with. Portland WON'T win another game this year solidifying them with the worst record. NY is a full game behind Charlotte so they'll probably end up #2 worst record. We WILL be able to land Aldridge or Thomas (should he declare).


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Lets say we can draft from 1 to 6, this is how I see it:
> 
> 1- Aldridge
> 2- Aldridge/Thomas
> 3- Aldridge/Thomas/Bargnani
> 4- Aldridge/Thomas/Bargnani/Roy
> 5- Aldridge/Thomas/Bargnani/Roy/Morrison
> 6- Aldridge/Thomas/Bargnani/Roy/Morrison/Gay
> 
> This is just an assumption. If we cant get the player Pax wants, we can easily explore trading the pick.


If we aren't in position to draft Thomas, Aldridge, or Noah (if he declares), I think Pax will try to trade the pick down a few spots.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> If we aren't in position to draft Thomas, Aldridge, or Noah (if he declares), I think Pax will try to trade the pick down a few spots.


I tend to agree. Although I think we may get out from the lottery to get our new players, instead of trading down.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I believe we should workout everyone....

what if Morrison just snaps in the workout...kinda like Ben did?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> I believe we should workout everyone....
> 
> what if Morrison just snaps in the workout...kinda like Ben did?


True, but with the recent emergence of Andres & the incredibly high upside of Deng, WHY even bother? Unless he can play the 2.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> True, but with the recent emergence of Andres & the incredibly high upside of Deng, WHY even bother? Unless he can play the 2.


why did we draft a sg in a pg body when we had a starter already?


I just don't want to miss the boat on the next potential superstar...push comes to shove...Deng can guard the 2 on defense if we picked morrison.

i just like to cover all my bases when conducting any sort of business...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> why did we draft a sg in a pg body when we had a starter already?
> 
> 
> I just don't want to miss the boat on the next potential superstar...push comes to shove...Deng can guard the 2 on defense if we picked morrison.
> 
> i just like to cover all my bases when conducting any sort of business...


Morrison is good, he probably COULD be a superstar. Problem is, we have that position COVERED, probably one of the best wing combo's in the NBA. Why not fill a position of need instead?


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Morrison is good, he probably COULD be a superstar. Problem is, we have that position COVERED, probably one of the best wing combo's in the NBA. Why not fill a position of need instead?



of course....but just cause we have other obvious positions of need...it don't mean we should ignore at least looking at the crazy dood in a workout...that's all i'm saying.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> of course....but just cause we have other obvious positions of need...it don't mean we should ignore at least looking at the crazy dood in a workout...that's all i'm saying.


Nothing wrong with that.

I just don't see the point, especially with Deng & Nocioni already having an array of ways to score. They're both good defenders & never take off plays. Nocioni improved a ton this year & I expect the same from Deng next year. Last thing I'd want to do is stunt that kid's growth with another SF.

13 ppg 6 rpg & 2 apg for Nocioni in 2006

14 ppg 7 rpg & 2 apg for Deng in 2006


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If the Knicks pick is #4 and Aldridge, Thomas and Bergini are gone, what do you do?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> If the Knicks pick is #4 and Aldridge, Thomas and Bergini are gone, what do you do?


wow....

well, if I'm Paxson and workouts went exceptionally well with one of the bigs to the point where we MUST have the player, I'd take the bulls later pick and trade both up to get em.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bulls second pick could be (a likely Krause pick) the next DeSagana Diop: Saer Sene. Extremely raw, but with the ability to touch the rim flat-foooted, high mobility, good work ethic, and good hands, he would be a good project, though probably will be a Tyson Clone with bigger hands.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Bulls second pick could be (a likely Krause pick) the next DeSagana Diop: Saer Sene. Extremely raw, but with the ability to touch the rim flat-foooted, high mobility, good work ethic, and good hands, he would be a good project, though probably will be a Tyson Clone with bigger hands.


I've been hearing ALOT about that kid recently. I've never seen him play though.

I'm hoping O'Bryant falls to our pick. I doubt he will though.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> If the Knicks pick is #4 and Aldridge, Thomas and Bergini are gone, what do you do?


DMD and I would be thrilled, because then Pax could take this guy...










(image taken from DMD's avatar)

:cheers:


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

How is the lottery affected if the Knicks and Bobcats end with the same record? Coin toss? Same number of ping pong balls? Some kind of tie breaker?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> wow....
> 
> well, if I'm Paxson and workouts went exceptionally well with one of the bigs to the point where we MUST have the player, I'd take the bulls later pick and trade both up to get em.


I might try to hold a team desperate for a SF hostage (maybe Minny or NO), trade down and pick up some other assets.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

NY PICK top 3 (ONE of them will be availible) :

1. Thomas
2. Aldridge
3. Bargnani

BULLS PICK top 3 (ONE of them SHOULD be availible) :

1. Splitter
2. O'Bryant
3. Brewer


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Bulls second pick could be (a likely Krause pick) the next DeSagana Diop: Saer Sene. Extremely raw, but with the ability to touch the rim flat-foooted, high mobility, good work ethic, and good hands, he would be a good project, though probably will be a Tyson Clone with bigger hands.


Did you get this from somewhere? 

I would like to see Sene or Obryant or Splitter in the middle of the first round. That would be appropriate places for those kids (Maybe Splitter and Obryant could go higher). Sene has the upside. We will see. Sene would take care of one thing for sure, the Bulls lack of freaks. Eventually they need to get a freak. Brewer makes a ton of sense with the second pick as well.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Did you get this from somewhere?
> 
> I would like to see Sene or Obryant or Splitter in the middle of the first round. That would be appropriate places for those kids (Maybe Splitter and Obryant could go higher). Sene has the upside. We will see. Sene would take care of one thing for sure, the Bulls lack of freaks. Eventually they need to get a freak. Brewer makes a ton of sense with the second pick as well.


I'd say Chandler is a freak. He's the most athletic 7'1" guy in basketball.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> I'd say Chandler is a freak. He's the most athletic 7'1" guy in basketball.


I dont know about the most but he is up there. But all indications are that this Sene kid is freakier. 7-8 wingspan, 40 inch vert, 7-0 tall. Thats FREAK-ING nuts.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I dont know about the most but he is up there. But all indications are that this Sene kid is freakier. 7-8 wingspan, 40 inch vert, 7-0 tall. Thats FREAK-ING nuts.


That is crazy. His head is 4" above the rim on dunks. 

I'm all for gambling on talent with one of these picks.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> That is crazy. His head is 4" above the rim on dunks.
> 
> I'm all for gambling on talent with one of these picks.


I think OUR pick is best to gamble with personally. Since we traded Curry, we need to get a BIG with upside with the NY pick to replace that potential.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> That is crazy. His head is 4" above the rim on dunks.
> 
> I'm all for gambling on talent with one of these picks.



I spoke to one of the draftexpress people at the Sene game, the one he dominated Durant, Henderson and Brandon Wright, and they all say he has Kemp-like explosion, except longer and taller. But he doesnt have Kemps offense, yet. Rumored to be a very hard worker (Most africans are since they havent been given anything). If this kid can learn offense, forget it. Even with no offense, I think he had 15 pts against one of the best HS classes of alltime.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I spoke to one of the draftexpress people at the Sene game, the one he dominated Durant, Henderson and Brandon Wright, and they all say he has Kemp-like explosion, except longer and taller. But he doesnt have Kemps offense, yet. Rumored to be a very hard worker (Most africans are since they havent been given anything). If this kid can learn offense, forget it. Even with no offense, I think he had 15 pts against one of the best HS classes of alltime.


so is he your personal choice with the bulls pick?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> so is he your personal choice with the bulls pick?


Leaning towards it, but will need to learn more. Ill contact someone who scouts Belgium over the next few weeks and get an opinion. Ill also talk to Jonathan over at Draftexpress for more detail and report back. Its early days for me in this but here is where I stand

Knicks Pick
1 Thomas
1 Aldridge
Thats a tie just in case people think I got the numbers wrong
3 Bargnani

Bulls pick
1a Sene
1 Splitter
1 Obryant
4 Brewer

I am leaning towards Sene cause I want to see the Bulls do something outside the box for once. This Sene looks like a great gamble. But I have him only a fraction of a hair ahead of the other two.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If Aldridge & Sene are the Paxson era version of Curry & Chandler......That doesn't sound too bad @ all.


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Talking about clutch ...

Bargnani scored the last 7 points of his team in a 89-91 win ... (3 pointer + layup + 2 free throws)


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Complete Stats for Bargnani:

30 Minutes
19 Points
2-5 2PT FG
*4-4 3PT FG* (5 short from Ben's NBA Record :biggrin: )
3-3 FT
5 Rebounds (1 Off)
0 Steals
0 Blocks
1 Assist
1 Turnover


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Complete Stats for Bargnani:
> 
> 30 Minutes
> 19 Points
> 2-5 2PT FG
> *4-4 3PT FG* (5 short from Ben's NBA Record :biggrin: )
> 3-3 FT
> 5 Rebounds (1 Off)
> 0 Steals
> 0 Blocks
> 1 Assist
> 1 Turnover


Yea, today no blocks (weird thing for him, being the first shot blocker of the italian league !)


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I spoke to one of the draftexpress people at the Sene game, the one he dominated Durant, Henderson and Brandon Wright, and they all say he has Kemp-like explosion, except longer and taller. But he doesnt have Kemps offense, yet. Rumored to be a very hard worker (Most africans are since they havent been given anything). If this kid can learn offense, forget it. Even with no offense, I think he had 15 pts against one of the best HS classes of alltime.


If he's there with the Bulls pick I'd take him based on what you're telling me. The only thing that gives me a little pause is if the Bulls draft Thomas with the Knicks pick. Having two incredibly raw players might be less than ideal.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> If he's there with the Bulls pick I'd take him based on what you're telling me. The only thing that gives me a little pause is if the Bulls draft Thomas with the Knicks pick. Having two incredibly raw players might be less than ideal.


Yeah agreed. 

On Bargnani, looks like a great game. I hope the Bulls are giving him serious consideration because he might be the most ready kid in this crop, even though I think he will have a cultural adjustment to make.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I wouldnt be surprised if Pax doesnt know about Sene. And I would have a hard time figuring Sene on the Bulls radar screen. 

For those who watched this kid, are there any differences between him and Diop? And Im not talking about the 2006 version of Diop, if not when he first entered the league. 

And Pax is a big fan of seasoned rookies, guys with college experience and good track record. I cant see him going with a project that appeared in front of him two months before the actual draft. And by this Im not taking anything away from Sene, I have only read positive things about the kids albeit the "P" word.

But the Bulls do have the luxury of two first rounders, plus tons of cap space. You could very well draft Sene and bring him along very very slowly, without putting him any pressure. However, it would be a very anti-paxesque move by all acounts.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I wouldnt be surprised if Pax doesnt know about Sene. And I would have a hard time figuring Sene on the Bulls radar screen.
> 
> For those who watched this kid, are there any differences between him and Diop? And Im not talking about the 2006 version of Diop, if not when he first entered the league.
> 
> And Pax is a big fan of seasoned rookies, guys with college experience and good track record. I cant see him going with a project that appeared in front of him two months before the actual draft. And by this Im not taking anything away from Sene, I have only read positive things about the kids albeit the "P" word.
> 
> But the Bulls do have the luxury of two first rounders, plus tons of cap space. You could very well draft Sene and bring him along very very slowly, without putting him any pressure. However, it would be a very anti-paxesque move by all acounts.


Sene doesn't sound anything like Diop to me. He's a skinny ultra athletic guy. Diop was/is a huge guy with solid athleticism for his size.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Sene doesn't sound anything like Diop to me. He's a skinny ultra athletic guy. Diop was/is a huge guy with solid athleticism for his size.


If I posted this draft scouting report, you could very well say it belongs to Sene:

*Strengths*: Sagana Diop is a very athletic big man. he's close to 300 pounds and runs the floor like a small forward. he's very fast. coming from senegal, africa, he's only been playing competitive basketball for a few years so he figures to get a lot better. right now his best asset is his defense. he can hold opposing centers virtually scoreless with his smothering style of defense. he is a very good shot blocker, and can also help out and block other opposing players shots.

*Weaknesses*: he is not super polished offensively. he has soft touch around the basket but just hasn't developed the post moves to where they are automatic. there are very few centers in the nba game with his combination of strength, speed, and athleticism.


Amazingly agile and athletic for a 7 foot 310 pound center. Runs the floor very well. Still very raw offensively but the makings are there. Shows soft touch around the cup. Super strong, very good defender with great shotblocking instincts. Guarded Tyson Chandler twice last season and ate him up the first matchup, Chandler had a much better game the second time around but rarely scored over Diop. (Pronounced JOP).


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Sene would be a wasted pick, imo. He won't be ready to contribute until after his rookie contract expires, at which point he could be signed through free agency. Let some other team develop him.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Sene doesn't sound anything like Diop to me. He's a skinny ultra athletic guy. Diop was/is a huge guy with solid athleticism for his size.


FWIW, I used to think Diop was huge too but when I watch him play, he looks like he's not carry much weight considering his frame. Looks more in shape than Curry does.


















But the reports on Sene are that he actually is really skinny, both in frame and in mass.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> FWIW, I used to think Diop was huge too but when I watch him play, he looks like he's not carry much weight considering his frame. Looks more in shape than Curry does.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But the reports on Sene are that he actually is really skinny, both in frame and in mass.


Diop has lost a lot of weight since he came into the league.


----------



## spongyfungy

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Blazers lose. STOP TANKING!

I hope they just take Adam Morrison off the boards.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Draft Express is reporting that Thomas will hold a press confrence Monday to declare he's going pro.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Draft Express is reporting that Thomas will hold a press confrence Monday to declare he's going pro.


Here's the link:

http://www.draftexpress.com/dedaily.php?p=645


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

For all the people talking about drafting 2 big guys, for example Aldridge/Bargnani/Thomas with the Knicks pick and Splitter/Sene/O'Bryant with our own pick, don't you think the need for a big guard is big enough to address it in the draft? I think the smart thing to do would be to draft an athletic wing with one of the picks, one of either Roy, Carney or Brewer. Are there any notable guards in free agency, or are you thinking about trading for a guy like Maggette or something completely different?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> For all the people talking about drafting 2 big guys, for example Aldridge/Bargnani/Thomas with the Knicks pick and Splitter/Sene/O'Bryant with our own pick, don't you think the need for a big guard is big enough to address it in the draft? I think the smart thing to do would be to draft an athletic wing with one of the picks, one of either Roy, Carney or Brewer. Are there any notable guards in free agency, or are you thinking about trading for a guy like Maggette or something completely different?


Thing is, our backcourt isn't really the main problem. Yeah we do need a big 2guard, but not more than we need some BIG men. Chandler, Songalia, Malik Allen & Othella Harrington isn't exactly a nba frontline IMO.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

looks like with Portland's loss...

we're STUCK with the #2 worst record now...


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Thing is, our backcourt isn't really the main problem. Yeah we do need a big 2guard, but not more than we need some BIG men. Chandler, Songalia, Malik Allen & Othella Harrington isn't exactly a nba frontline IMO.


I agree the main focus should be on the frontcourt, basically getting Tyson some help in order to make him even more effective at what he does best. However, I keep seeing our two small guards getting killed by the athletic guards in the league, I know Hinrich does an amazing job on most guys, but sometimes it just isn't enough. A player like Arenas for example, is constantly killing us from the perimeter. If we draft one big man, and also go big in free agency(preferably Nene), then we should draft an athletic wing. If we completely ignore the backcourt, we'll have yet another season of match up problems with the best guards in the league(Kobe, McGrady, Arenas etc.)

A solution would be to go big in the draft with both picks, and then pursue Pietrus with everything we've got. He would be a great addition to our team in my opinion, not to mention that he would solve our defensive backcourt problem right away.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> A solution would be to go big in the draft with both picks, and then pursue Pietrus with everything we've got. He would be a great addition to our team in my opinion, not to mention that he would solve our defensive backcourt problem right away.


Would prefer to draft one _bigger_ guard and one big man. Then sign / trade for our main post presence. Plus I'm not sure what it would take to get Pietrus aswell.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> I agree the main focus should be on the frontcourt, basically getting Tyson some help in order to make him even more effective at what he does best. However, I keep seeing our two small guards getting killed by the athletic guards in the league, I know Hinrich does an amazing job on most guys, but sometimes it just isn't enough. A player like Arenas for example, is constantly killing us from the perimeter. If we draft one big man, and also go big in free agency(preferably Nene), then we should draft an athletic wing. If we completely ignore the backcourt, we'll have yet another season of match up problems with the best guards in the league(Kobe, McGrady, Arenas etc.)
> 
> A solution would be to go big in the draft with both picks, and then pursue Pietrus with everything we've got. He would be a great addition to our team in my opinion, not to mention that he would solve our defensive backcourt problem right away.


is he a RFA? if not, who would u trade for him? I'm not diggin' trading ANy of the core for him. I wouldn't mind him as a backup two though.


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Lego hat,

Who are you going to get to stop Arenas? I don't see that player in the draft or on a current NBA roster. BTW Arenas is only 6'4" so if the trio of Kirk,Chris and Ben have problems with Gilbert, it isn't because he's too tall.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



L.O.B said:


> Lego hat,
> 
> Who are you going to get to stop Arenas? I don't see that player in the draft or on a current NBA roster. BTW Arenas is only 6'4" so if the trio of Kirk,Chris and Ben have problems with Gilbert, it isn't because he's too tall.


VERY true...it's not like Vince, Kobe etc. actually STOP him from getting his 29 a game...he STILL gets those numbers no matter who's guarding him..


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> VERY true...it's not like Vince, Kobe etc. actually STOP him from getting his 29 a game...he STILL gets those numbers no matter who's guarding him..


Indeed and I think people tend to forget this. Players like Kobe, Arenas etc will always get their points, you just have to try and make them less efficient as much possible. Easier said than done though.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Sene vs Diop

Diop is just huge. He might not look it but he is. 7-1, 300lbs. Diop really understands his size, length, athleticism. And he has become a very good center in this league, IMO. Last summer, I had a thread that said we ought to sign him and I was totally bashed for it. I have been wrong about a lot of things, but there was some egg on face for alot of people in that thread. Diop probably adds 5-7 wins to this club. 

Diop and Sene might get you the same result, but they are going to take different routes to get there. Sene, who I have seen tape of one really good game so not much to go on here, appears to use speed and length whereas Diop uses strength, to get the job done. Diop can probably come up and clog lanes better. But Sene appears to be a weakside shotblocker and his body, due to evenly distributed weight over unbelievable length (7-8 wingspan would be the longest in the league by 2 inches), would be impossible to put a body on. He is a solid 230 now. He looks like a young Theo Ratliffe with that body. Everyone says he works hard and where he has come from to where he is now is just amazing. Its not unreasonable to think he can get to 250-260 in that body, and if he does, it will look like David Robinsons body. On offense, who knows. Sene got 15 pts against one of the best HS classes of alltime (minus Oden). He hit a few jump shots but most of it was because he was very active off the ball. He is just raw there. I dont think he will be a player you can just throw the ball too in the post and he turns into Kevin McHale. But he might be a 15 foot and in player. Learns to put the ball on the floor, maybe a face up J, and then he could, like David Robinson, drive around opponents where his length and explosion would be nearly impossible to handle. Maybe. He isnt there yet, its projection.

So same result, but different routes there. But what can not be denied is that this kid is the interesting sleeper of this crop. Every year there is one, and Sene clearly could be that guy this year. We need more scouting to come to a better conclusion. If he goes to NY to workout, I will go and check him out first hand. 

On Pietrus, Pietrus would fit the backcourt needs of the Bulls to a tee. But you have to worry about injuries. He can not seem to stay healthy. He basically is going to miss half this year and I would say the last 15-20 games he shouldnt be playing anyway and is just gutting it out. Thats worrysome. Also, GS simply doesnt know what to do with him. They are in a quandry. They really like him but he doesnt fit there and they know it. They would like cap relief and might be willing to throw him in to get it. If he were healthy I would trade a core player for him, but since he can not prove to stay healthy over any real stretch, the Bulls ought to see if they could move Sweetney and perhaps a future #1 for him. But with GS so loaded in #1s, it might take us taking back an Adonal Foyle, which wouldnt be terrible since I think Foyle is actually better then most give him credit for. Or maybe a Murphy, which would be just great. Pietrus would fit, but its very complex to make a deal work for him right now. Might be better to wait a year on him and throw the MLE at him as a FA, cause thats all he probably stands to get due to his injuries.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> is he a RFA? if not, who would u trade for him? I'm not diggin' trading ANy of the core for him. I wouldn't mind him as a backup two though.


Like Rlucas said, a package of Sweetney and a future no. 1 pick could possibly do it for Golden State. It's obvious that he doesn't fit in very well in their system, but in my opinion he would be a great pickup for us. 



L.O.B said:


> Who are you going to get to stop Arenas? I don't see that player in the draft or on a current NBA roster. BTW Arenas is only 6'4" so if the trio of Kirk,Chris and Ben have problems with Gilbert, it isn't because he's too tall.


Arenas is a special player, there is no doubt about that. I didn't mean that Pietrus could shut him down completely, but he could give him problems all game long and force him to take bad shots. Hinrich can do this as well, but not effectively over the course of a whole game. Pietrus isn't going to be a saviour by any means, but he could help us out a lot, also with the other big guards in the league. The point is he'd be a huge upgrade over our current backup guards, like Duhon, Pargo and Basden.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

QUESTION :

Now that we are in the playoffs, the bulls can't get lower than a #15 pick in the draft right? or is it #16?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> QUESTION :
> 
> Now that we are in the playoffs, the bulls can't get lower than a #15 pick in the draft right? or is it #16?


I would think that we would be able to pick no higher than 15. I think each seed we move up higher, we will move down another pick, because I don't think we will match the record of the 8th seed in the West.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I would think that we would be able to pick no higher than 15. I think each seed we move up higher, we will move down another pick, because I don't think we will match the record of the 8th seed in the West.


u're right, the lotto stops at #14

*slaps self*


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm still going 1a. Carney, 1b. Roy with the NYK pick, and picking the best talent with our pick. Preferably a guy like O'Bryant.

I say we attack the FA's immediately to bolster our frontline. Primary targets Nene, Gooden, and Wilcox. Secondary options Pryz, Nazr, Ely.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> I'm still going 1a. Carney, 1b. Roy with our pick, and picking the best talent with our pick. Preferably a guy like O'Bryant.
> 
> I say we attack the FA's immediately to bolster our frontline. Primary targets Nene, Gooden, and Wilcox. Secondary options Pryz, Nazr, Ely.


I don't agree with your choices of the NY pick...

if you traded eddy curry, u should DRAFT A BIG with atleast as MUCH potential as the player you let go.

I do agree with the FA targets tho..


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I don't agree with your choices of the NY pick...
> 
> if you traded eddy curry, u should DRAFT A BIG with atleast as MUCH potential as the player you let go.
> 
> I do agree with the FA targets tho..


I like Aldridge's skill set, but I don't see him as a banger down low. I would be happy with him using our NYK pick, but I feel that Carney has that superstar skill set. I know he would be redundant somewhat, but I feel he has the speed to play the 2. Yrus Thomas, I would only choose him we can get the FA's I listed. Thomas is not big enough yet, his offensive game is Raw, but he shows the love for the game.

Aldridge would be a Fyre-like player his rookie year. I would be happy with that.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think there almost no chance the Bulls take a player not named Bargnani, Thomas or Aldridge with the Knicks pick. If they are all gone, then you know a trade is coming unless Pax falls in love with Roy or Carney. Carney is more of a 3 than 2, so he wouldnt make much sense. 

Im not Thomas biggest fan, but I love players that have passion for this game. And I like his non-sense attitude as well. 

IMO Pax already has his favorite among the 3 bigs. And theres no certainty you are signing Gooden, Wilcox or Nene, so its all messed up. It would be cool to have free agency first and then adressing needs in the Draft. 

My offseason order would be:
Lottery
Free Agency
Draft


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## truebluefan

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I think there almost no chance the Bulls take a player not named Bargnani, Thomas or Aldridge with the Knicks pick. If they are all gone, then you know a trade is coming unless Pax falls in love with Roy or Carney. Carney is more of a 3 than 2, so he wouldnt make much sense.
> 
> Im not Thomas biggest fan, but I love players that have passion for this game. And I like his non-sense attitude as well.
> 
> IMO Pax already has his favorite among the 3 bigs. And theres no certainty you are signing Gooden, Wilcox or Nene, so its all messed up. *It would be cool to have free agency first and then adressing needs in the Draft.
> *
> My offseason order would be:
> Lottery
> Free Agency
> Draft


Why cant we do both? The way I see the summer unfolding is, we draft a big with the NY pick, we either get a SG or draft another big with our pick. Then we go after a big in FA. If that does not work out, why not a trade? We can draft big and still get another veteran big that may need to play in front of the draftee for a while. 

If we do not draft a sg with our pick, we can sign a FA this summer.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm almost 100% sure Richard Roby will be availible with the bulls pick at #15/#16.

So we will be able to fill our holes regardless.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Adam Morrison Declaring for NBA Draft, Hires Agent
By Jonathan Givony

Multiple sources confirmed to DraftExpress.com Sunday night that Gonzaga Junior Adam Morrison will be announcing his intentions to enter the 2006 NBA draft.

According to them, Morrison will hire the services of Chicago based Mark Bartelstein and his agency Priority Sports, and thus void the possibility of returning to Gonzaga for his senior year.

Bartelstein, who has around 40 NBA clients, represents numerous former Gonzaga players including Blake Stepp and Dan Dickau, as well as Chicago Bulls guard Jannero Pargo, brother of current Gonzaga freshman Jeremy Pargo.

Morrison is considered a likely top 5 pick and possibly #1 overall depending on how the ping-pong balls play out.

Morrison is expected to conduct a press conference in the next few days to announce his decision.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I'm almost 100% sure Richard Roby will be availible with the bulls pick at #15/#16.
> 
> So we will be able to fill our holes regardless.


I haven't gotten to watch Roby, but I hear he's quite a talent.

That being said, his stats concern me. He's known as a shooter and a scorer, but he only shot 42% from the field this year. Could he be a more efficient scorer in the pros?

I like the gene pool though (he's Kenyon Martin's half-brother).


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I haven't gotten to watch Roby, but I hear he's quite a talent.
> 
> That being said, his stats concern me. He's known as a shooter and a scorer, but he only shot 42% from the field this year. Could he be a more efficient scorer in the pros?
> 
> I like the gene pool though (he's Kenyon Martin's half-brother).


Honestly, I've never seen him play lol. I just read a few good things about him on draftexpress.com


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## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I totally agree with this "I think there almost no chance the Bulls take a player not named Bargnani, Thomas or Aldridge with the Knicks pick". With the knicks losing today i think they are now a fix for the 2nd worst record in the nba. I think the bobcats want bargnani and portland does not need thomas or Aldridge since they spent 60 million on ZR last year. It seems logical that they go with Morrison for many reasons including the that that Miles is history in Portland after his last bone head move to put his cloths on at half time and get suspended for the rest of the season. Portland now nees a SF bad. That leaves Aldridge and thomas and the bulls IMHO will end up taking one of them if they get one of the four top picks which now seems really likley. I also think pax trades their 2nd first rounder for a big SG and with the rest of the cash i think pax brings in a 3rd big man to give us TC, (Thomas or Aldridge), and Nene gets the rest of our monies IMHO.

david


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

QUESTION regarding the 2007 pick swap.

Do we get to request the swap before or AFTER they draft?

Cuz if they draft ODEN, does Pax just call Zeke like "yeah, we'll swap our 20th pick for him" LOL

how does this work? Who's done a pick swap before?


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



giusd said:


> I totally agree with this "I think there almost no chance the Bulls take a player not named Bargnani, Thomas or Aldridge with the Knicks pick". With the knicks losing today i think they are now a fix for the 2nd worst record in the nba. I think the bobcats want bargnani and portland does not need thomas or Aldridge since they spent 60 million on ZR last year.
> 
> david


Brezec
Okafor
Bargnani
Wallace
Felton

what a damn starting 5. 

I also don't believe Portland will take Aldridge or Thomas, mainly cause I could see the new owners making Morrison the future face of the franchise.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I agree i think if it was not for the injuries the bobcats would have won 30 somthing games this year. I like what that teams is doing.

david


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## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

DELETE


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



giusd said:


> I agree i think if it was not for the injuries the bobcats would have won 30 somthing games this year. I like what that teams is doing.
> 
> david


Yep, they definintely woulda been in better position. If they draft right, they'll be SERIOUS in the east in 2 years TOPS.

Felton's looking like the 2nd best PG out of last year's draft. Some of his recent statline's have been insane.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



giusd said:


> I also think pax trades their 2nd first rounder for a big SG....


Have any scenarios in mind? Who are you thinking of, when you say this?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Is Cedric Simmons another big we should consider with OUR pick?

http://nbadraft.net/profiles/cedricsimmons.asp

Does anyone know anything about him? NBADRAFT.net compares him to Nene.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> QUESTION regarding the 2007 pick swap.
> 
> Do we get to request the swap before or AFTER they draft?
> 
> Cuz if they draft ODEN, does Pax just call Zeke like "yeah, we'll swap our 20th pick for him" LOL
> 
> how does this work? Who's done a pick swap before?


I'm curious how that plays out as well. Can you imagine? Let's assume Pax decides to swap picks AFTER the draft lottery is held... that means the Knicks would have to send a team representative to the drawing. The whole thing would be set up as if the Knicks were going to keep their pick. So if the Knicks "win" the lottery, they'll open up the envelope, everyone sees the "Knicks logo" on the card, and we immediately cut to a closeup of the Knicks' team rep. Everyone in the building would know that pick will be turned over to the Bulls, but they'll end up having to interview the Knicks rep anyway. What in the hell is he supposed to say? 

This has Bill Simmons written all over it. 

:banana:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> I'm curious how that plays out as well. Can you imagine? Let's assume Pax decides to swap picks AFTER the draft lottery is held... that means the Knicks would have to send a team representative to the drawing. The whole thing would be set up as if the Knicks were going to keep their pick. So if the Knicks "win" the lottery, they'll open up the envelope, everyone sees the "Knicks logo" on the card, and we immediately cut to a closeup of the Knicks' team rep. Everyone in the building would know that pick will be turned over to the Bulls, but they'll end up having to interview the Knicks rep anyway. What in the hell is he supposed to say?
> 
> This has Bill Simmons written all over it.
> 
> :banana:


LOL!!


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Actually If Im the Knicks and stink next season, I boycott the whole lottery and send no representatives. Or send both Larry Brown and Marbury, with IT sitting in between.

Seriously, I dont see the Bobcats taking Bargnani. Blazers and Bobcats seem more Morrison oriented to me, with the Bobcats having Gay as a 1a option. There is also Carney.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Seriously, I dont see the Bobcats taking Bargnani. Blazers and Bobcats seem more Morrison oriented to me, with the Bobcats having Gay as a 1a option. There is also Carney.


It's tough to tell, but I wouldn't rule out Charlotte taking a big. Okafor has been out for quite a while, May is nothing to brag about. Jesus they have had Jumaine Jones starting at PF for quite some time.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Actually If Im the Knicks and stink next season, I boycott the whole lottery and send no representatives. Or send both Larry Brown and Marbury, with IT sitting in between.
> 
> Seriously, I dont see the Bobcats taking Bargnani. Blazers and Bobcats seem more Morrison oriented to me, with the Bobcats having Gay as a 1a option. There is also Carney.


Charlotte's recent articles suggest they want a SF with range...Morrison & Bargnani both have this...

If they draft Alrdige or Thomas, then Okafor's injuries may be worst than we think


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> It's tough to tell, but I wouldn't rule out Charlotte taking a big. Okafor has been out for quite a while, May is nothing to brag about. Jesus they have had Jumaine Jones starting at PF for quite some time.


May was out the last 2-3 months of the season. I don't know what he did PRIOR to that though. It really doesn't make much sense for them to add another PF when they have Brezec, Ely, Okafor & May IMO. That would just be drafting to mess up the damn draft for everyone else lol. They need a shooter more than ANYTHING.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> May was out the last 2-3 months of the season. I don't know what he did PRIOR to that though. It really doesn't make much sense for them to add another PF when they have Brezec, Ely, Okafor & May IMO. That would just be drafting to mess up the damn draft for everyone else lol. They need a shooter more than ANYTHING.


I still think Morrison makes a lot of sense for Charlotte. They might also consider Carney or Roy. Keep in mind though that Ely could move on. He's an RFA.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I am pretty sure Portland will take Morrison regardless of where their pick ends up, I think they will do everything to trade Darius Miles this offseason to make room for Morrison along with the rest of their young core(Telfair, Webster, Khryapa etc.).


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> It really doesn't make much sense for them to add another PF when they have Brezec, Ely, Okafor & May IMO. That would just be drafting to mess up the damn draft for everyone else lol. They need a shooter more than ANYTHING.


While I do agree they need a shooter, but when you consider how many games their big men have missed, it still makes sense for them to draft another. Many fans over at the Bobcats board have given up on Okafor, basically believing that he'll never stay healthy enough to contribute.


----------



## CrackerJack

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

i have just been looking through alot of 2006 draft sites and have noticed that unless New York finish in the top 5 record wise, which is impossible you guys will receive their 1st round pick, so this pick will be very high meaning you get yet another young superstar to add to your line-up


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



CrackerJack said:


> i have just been looking through alot of 2006 draft sites and have noticed that unless New York finish in the top 5 record wise, which is impossible you guys will receive their 1st round pick, so this pick will be very high meaning you get yet another young superstar to add to your line-up


We get their pick regardless of their record, it's not protected in any way.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Yi Jianlian?

What's the word on him?...Is he trash?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://www.realgm.com/src_feature_article/90/20060417/realgm_mock_draft_version_101/

check the link out, it's realgm's mock of the top 10. they give really good indepth reviews of each player's strength's and weaknesses. They also bring up some REALLY good points.


----------



## truebluefan

*Yi Jianlian Cleared to Enter NBA Draft*

Aaron Smith t NBADraft.net

* Our friends at HoopChina.com have informed us that there is breaking news out of China. Forward Yi Jianlian, considered the top prospect out of Asia since Yao Ming has been given consent by his team, the Guangdong Tigers, and the Chinese Basketball Association to explore this year's NBA draft.

This is significant news because the CBA made a rule in 2004 that Chinese players could not enter the draft until they turned 22. Yi is officially listed as 1987 born. *

*Yi is easily the most athletic prospect to emerge out of China. Unlike most Chinese players, he has an American style of play with high flying dunks and use of supreme athleticism. Yi's team is currently playing in the CBA finals. On the year, Yi's averages are: 20.5 PPG, 57.41 FG %, 75.08 FT%, 9.6 RPG, 1.3 BPG, 1.2 APG, 2.0 SPG.

Yi is **7-0 230. 
*


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> http://www.realgm.com/src_feature_article/90/20060417/realgm_mock_draft_version_101/
> 
> check the link out, it's realgm's mock of the top 10. they give really good indepth reviews of each player's strength's and weaknesses. They also bring up some REALLY good points.


It's strange that they mention the mock is in order of the team's record, yet they have Charlotte at the #2 pick even though they have two more wins than NY.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Yi Jianlian Cleared to Enter NBA Draft*



truebluefan said:


> Aaron Smith t NBADraft.net
> 
> * Our friends at HoopChina.com have informed us that there is breaking news out of China. Forward Yi Jianlian, considered the top prospect out of Asia since Yao Ming has been given consent by his team, the Guangdong Tigers, and the Chinese Basketball Association to explore this year's NBA draft.
> 
> This is significant news because the CBA made a rule in 2004 that Chinese players could not enter the draft until they turned 22. Yi is officially listed as 1987 born. *
> 
> *Yi is easily the most athletic prospect to emerge out of China. Unlike most Chinese players, he has an American style of play with high flying dunks and use of supreme athleticism. Yi's team is currently playing in the CBA finals. On the year, Yi's averages are: 20.5 PPG, 57.41 FG %, 75.08 FT%, 9.6 RPG, 1.3 BPG, 1.2 APG, 2.0 SPG.
> 
> Yi is **7-0 230.
> *


Yowzers!!!! If Yi enters the draft, that certainly puts another twist on things. Is he eligable or is he a little too young? Much as he is also an interesting talent, I have a hard time with Pax taking what would amount to a huge gamble on this guy - especailly with the Knicks pick and I doubt he'd last to our pick. Another quality big certainly would increase the chances that we'll get _someone_ that'll help us out!


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I know absolutely nothing about Yi Jianlian, but he does sound interesting though. I doubt he would be on our radar though.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

How about our 2nd first rounder for Michael Pietrus? Dogra!

david


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I don't know about this one, I'd much rather have Sene, simply because of his athleticism and size. I also think I've heard rumours that Yi is actually older than his listed age, but I don't know how much you should put into that...

He could definitely be a good player though, I don't know who the other guy in this picture is, he could be some random scrub for all I care, but Yi is taller than him so he must be better right? :biggrin: 










Picture courtesy of "kisstherim" from the Rockets forum.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



giusd said:


> How about our 2nd first rounder for Michael Pietrus? Dogra!
> 
> david


That might be something I'd consider, but, like others have said, I wouldn't want to make the trade before I knew who was on the board for our pick.

Also, Pietrus's health record scares me. He has been injured a lot in his brief career.


----------



## dkg1

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Rudy Gay is supposed to announce that he's coming out (no pun intended) for the draft today.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Tyrus Thomas is expected to have a news conference today to announce his intention to declare (sans agent, apparently).

Also, Morrison is finally ready to officially declare for the draft. He has hired an agent (same agent as PARGO!)


----------



## eljam

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

FYI: Link to the Tyrus thomas and Glen Davis Press conference blurb & a link to watch it live... if that's your sort of thing.

http://www.lsusports.net/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=27826&SPID=2166&DB_OEM_ID=5200&ATCLID=268568


----------



## eljam

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Not sure if this has been posted yet or not... just some more fat to chew... 

http://www.probasketballnews.com/mock_draft.html

Some interesting thoughts... some are not really evaluations but possibilites. Some appear to be really off as well.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



eljam said:


> Not sure if this has been posted yet or not... just some more fat to chew...
> 
> http://www.probasketballnews.com/mock_draft.html
> 
> Some interesting thoughts... some are not really evaluations but possibilites. Some appear to be really off as well.


Has Josh McRoberts officially declared? I don't think I'd touch him with the NY pick, but he'd be a decent gamble with our pick in the 15-17 area, especially if Splitter and O'Bryant are already off the board when we're on the clock.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rosenthall said:


> Has Josh McRoberts officially declared? I don't think I'd touch him with the NY pick, but he'd be a decent gamble with our pick in the 15-17 area, especially if Splitter and O'Bryant are already off the board when we're on the clock.


he's not declaring this year..


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

With the lotto, do they put all 14 teams in? or do they put 11 in? they do a sperate drawing for the top 3 worst?

Being that it's a lotto, isn't there a chance we possibly may NOT land a top 5 pick?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Getting the 5th pick is the Bulls worst case scenario. They cant drop any more since the Knicks have the second worst record. Same as the Blazers cant drop below 4th.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Getting the 5th pick is the Bulls worst case scenario. They cant drop any more since the Knicks have the second worst record. Same as the Blazers cant drop below 4th.


thanks


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'd almost be willing to select Yi Jianlian with our pick (if he falls that low) just from a pure marketing standpoint. The limited description on him is interesting and I wonder how his workouts will go, but either way whichever team selects him will make a boat load of money.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> I'd almost be willing to select Yi Jianlian with our pick (if he falls that low) just from a pure marketing standpoint. The limited description on him is interesting, I wonder how his workouts will go, but either way whichever team selects him will make a boat load of money.


But you wont see a single penny or even the Bulls, for that matter. Its all for Uncle Jerry and his White Sox. But the Bulls?


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> But you wont see a single penny or even the Bulls, for that matter. Its all for Uncle Jerry and his White Sox. But the Bulls?


Who knows, maybe seeing the Bulls pulling all this extra revenue might allow him to open his wallet a bit further. I too doubt that, but it doesn't phase me much either.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I have seen Jianlian play and he is certainly an interesting player. Very versatile, very long. Id say Larry Nance, for those of you old enough to remember, would be a legit comparison, atleast as a style. Yi is not a sure thing, but very, very interesting. A couple of years back, he was hailed as ESPNs the Next Big Thing. He has fallen a bit since then. Its very hard to get a handle of him because the China League is not good, though he has had good games against former NBA players playing there. Whats interesting is all the respectable scouts figured he would declare in 2 years, after the Olympics, so he is not on one mock. But based on talent, he probably goes top 8. But when you throw in the issue of negotiating with the govt, the level of competition, the question of his age, he might fall to 15-20. Someone, maybe Houston, will gamble on him. The returns on him, from both a marketing and playing point of view, could be huge. But he isnt a sure thing.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Another good big man in the draft with potential is always a good thing.

Would I want him top 10, probably not. With our pick at 15-18, sure. I would grab one of (Splitter, Jianlian, Sene, O'Bryant - whoever falls). Bottom line is that with FA and a top 5 pick, we can go for the fences with our pick..........AND WE SHOULD!

Put him in the mix. He also gets a huge edge because of revenue he'd generate. Still, I really think that Houston becomes a very likely candidate to grab him. Not just because of the Yao thing, but because he could help their team and they KNOW (which is important) what comes along with drafting him and dealing with the Chinese government.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

So, Rlucas, the bulls are on the clock with their pick (15 - 18 range). Yi and Sene are both still available - whom do you choose (if either)? I'd tend to lean towards Sene just as he seems more ready to contribute at least from a defensive and rebounding standpoint. He also seems to want it more, and I'm alluding to a shot at the NBA. Gotta love a guy who's willing to go head to head with any and all commers.

Of course, I truly think this kind of speculation is somewhat mute as I just can't see Pax taking a gamble on either guy. He'd go with Williams of Duke or someone relatively safe.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I have seen Jianlian play and he is certainly an interesting player. Very versatile, very long. Id say Larry Nance, for those of you old enough to remember, would be a legit comparison, atleast as a style. Yi is not a sure thing, but very, very interesting. A couple of years back, he was hailed as ESPNs the Next Big Thing. He has fallen a bit since then. Its very hard to get a handle of him because the China League is not good, though he has had good games against former NBA players playing there. Whats interesting is all the respectable scouts figured he would declare in 2 years, after the Olympics, so he is not on one mock. But based on talent, he probably goes top 8. But when you throw in the issue of negotiating with the govt, the level of competition, the question of his age, he might fall to 15-20. Someone, maybe Houston, will gamble on him. The returns on him, from both a marketing and playing point of view, could be huge. But he isnt a sure thing.


Larry Nance was a pretty darn good player and a great athlete to boot. If he's got that kind of game, the Bulls should be all over him at their pick


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> So, Rlucas, the bulls are on the clock with their pick (15 - 18 range). Yi and Sene are both still available - whom do you choose (if either)? I'd tend to lean towards Sene just as he seems more ready to contribute at least from a defensive and rebounding standpoint. He also seems to want it more, and I'm alluding to a shot at the NBA. Gotta love a guy who's willing to go head to head with any and all commers.
> 
> Of course, I truly think this kind of speculation is somewhat mute as I just can't see Pax taking a gamble on either guy. He'd go with Williams of Duke or someone relatively safe.


I have seen tape of Sene and have actually seen Jianlian once, a few years ago at that Nike Basketball camp. Sene was the far more impressive player. Jianlin struggled in that game 2 years ago. Both could be nice players. Yi is more ready is my guess. Both are hard workers. But Sene has intangibles, that frankly no one in this draft have. The Bulls need a freak. Sene is a freak. Yi is more heady. Both are projects. One will emerge has a truly great player while I think the other will be marginable. I will go with Sene due to the freak factor. We need freaks.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> Another good big man in the draft with potential is always a good thing.
> 
> Would I want him top 10, probably not. With our pick at 15-18, sure. I would grab one of (Splitter, Jianlian, Sene, O'Bryant - whoever falls). Bottom line is that with FA and a top 5 pick, we can go for the fences with our pick..........AND WE SHOULD!
> 
> Put him in the mix. He also gets a huge edge because of revenue he'd generate. Still, I really think that Houston becomes a very likely candidate to grab him. Not just because of the Yao thing, but because he could help their team and they KNOW (which is important) what comes along with drafting him and dealing with the Chinese government.


Chi, I 100% agree with you on Houston. Without knowing Houstons draft situation, if they are picking I think they would take him. They have a need at his position, they have Yao and they have dealt with the Chinese before. There is some talk that the Chinese are pissed off with Houston about Yaos foot but they seem to have a good relationship overall. Id have to take a hard look when I do my mock, unfortunately my mock here will be about 10 days before the draft as I will be at the World Cup, but Yi to Houston might be one I can put in with pencil unless Houston cracks the top 3. Wouldnt even surprise me if Yi is declaring cause he has a promise.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Chi, I 100% agree with you on Houston. Without knowing Houstons draft situation, if they are picking I think they would take him. They have a need at his position, they have Yao and they have dealt with the Chinese before. There is some talk that the Chinese are pissed off with Houston about Yaos foot but they seem to have a good relationship overall. Id have to take a hard look when I do my mock, unfortunately my mock here will be about 10 days before the draft as I will be at the World Cup, but Yi to Houston might be one I can put in with pencil unless Houston cracks the top 3. Wouldnt even surprise me if Yi is declaring cause he has a promise.


I've heard of him before, but I just saw these clips for the first time. The kid is a serious athlete for his height.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5733820517329789196&q=Yi+Jianlian&pl=truee


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Ugh, Ronnie Brewer might stay another year and not enter the draft this summer:

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1268

Scroll to the bottom.

Depending on who we take with the NY pick, Brewer could be an excellent choice with our pick.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I've heard of him before, but I just saw these clips for the first time. The kid is a serious athlete for his height.
> 
> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5733820517329789196&q=Yi+Jianlian&pl=truee


You think? I got the opposite impression. While he seems pretty quick laterally, he was finishing far too weakly because he could hardly jump.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Ugh, Ronnie Brewer might stay another year and not enter the draft this summer:
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1268
> 
> Scroll to the bottom.
> 
> Depending on who we take with the NY pick, Brewer could be an excellent choice with our pick.


It's looking more an more like the best value at 15 or 16 will be a big. 

I'm not too keen on the FA swingmen, but a Stevenson might not be a bad pickup at backup big guard.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I've heard of him before, but I just saw these clips for the first time. The kid is a serious athlete for his height.
> 
> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5733820517329789196&q=Yi+Jianlian&pl=truee



Great Music!!!!

You can see he is a quick jumper. He can do some stuff facing the rim. He goes up aggressive. What I think TD is alluiding too is that he isnt a rim rattling dunker, but he isnt very strong. He shows he can put the ball on the floor and get around his guy from 18 feet out. The one highlight that we need to find out if it was a one off or something he has added in the last 2 years was the fade away jump shot out of the post. If he has that show as part of his arsenal then he wont last til the 15th pick. Cuase with his length, athleticism and touch, thatll be a an indefensible shot. But I am not convinced that its a real part of his offense. But the ability is there. Thats clear. Now as Stephen Colbert would say, Does Pax have the balls to take him?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Now as Stephen Colbert would say, Does Pax have the balls to take him?


Probably not, I can easily see him picking Paul Davis or Hilton Armstrong before Jianlian or Sene...


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I've heard of him before, but I just saw these clips for the first time. The kid is a serious athlete for his height.
> 
> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5733820517329789196&q=Yi+Jianlian&pl=truee



Thanx for the video.

I'm not impressed AT ALL and I WON'T be too excited if we picked him.

I think Bargnani is WAY more athletic for his height.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> Probably not, I can easily see him picking Paul Davis or Hilton Armstrong before Jianlian or Sene...



if its paul davis then i am no longer a bulls fan. period


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> if its paul davis then i am no longer a bulls fan. period


...until next year...

(I'm very low on Davis myself, but sacrificing team loyalty over a draft pick is very knee-jerk)

I said the same thing about Mihm about possibly drafting him with the #4 pick in the 2000 draft. Then we drafted him #7. I was going crazy that draft until... we traded him for Crawford and I couldn't stop cheering.

Little did we know that Mihm at the #4 and Crawford at the #7 was probably one of the better scenerios we could have ended up with in that draft.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> ...until next year...
> 
> (I'm very low on Davis myself, but sacrificing team loyalty over a draft pick is very knee-jerk)
> 
> I said the same thing about Mihm about possibly drafting him with the #4 pick in the 2000 draft. Then we drafted him #7. I was going crazy that draft until... we traded him for Crawford and I couldn't stop cheering.
> 
> Little did we know that Mihm at the #4 and Crawford at the #7 was probably one of the better scenerios we could have ended up with in that draft.


I have been a Bulls fan and the season ticket holder for longer then most of you have been alive. But I no longer live in Chicago and frankly dont like this ***** footing around attitude by the top guy. He needs to show some balls. And Paul Davis, who is a mid second rounder at best, would be the final string. I think I have gotten to a age where I support people rather then a team. I support Lebron James, or Pietrus or Ronaldinho, but I am not a Cavs, Warriors fan or Barca fan per se. The people on the Bulls work hard, but dont really entertain me. They are boring, both on and off the court. Now, I grew up with Jordan, so my basis is hugely tainted, but this is ridiculous. I think there is alot to be proud of this season for the Bulls, but still they are an afterthought in the city of Chicago and frankly to most of the people who go to the UC, who would rather catch a T-shirt or get a pic with Benny. This is because the Bulls are boring. And if the GM continues to be safe, not only will we never win a title (people make it sound like 50 wins is a big feat, when you grow up with 6 titles, thats the only thing that matters) but we will never be entertaining. Applaud Pax is all most do, he has delievered a better team, but a far less entertaining team. And for me, both are essential. Call me spoiled, but I am not a forgiving person and demand the highest standard. If I dont feel like I am getting it, then I walk. So Pax, take a chance for Gods sake. Grow some balls and do something a bit out of the box. Championship teams are not built on wasting the 15th pick on a guy like Paul Davis.


----------



## 7thwatch

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Thanx for the video.
> 
> I'm not impressed AT ALL and I WON'T be too excited if we picked him.
> 
> I think Bargnani is WAY more athletic for his height.


Same here. I've not seen either of them except for highlights like that, but Bargnani has impressed me in my limited exposure to him.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Good thing some people that post here arent the Bulls' GM. Maybe they could stay during the west coast trip and have some fun with the circus at UC.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Good thing some people that post here arent the Bulls' GM. Maybe they could stay during the west coast trip and have some fun with the circus at UC.


Is this a dig at me?


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> ...until next year...
> 
> (I'm very low on Davis myself, but sacrificing team loyalty over a draft pick is very knee-jerk)
> 
> I said the same thing about Mihm about possibly drafting him with the #4 pick in the 2000 draft. Then we drafted him #7. I was going crazy that draft until... we traded him for Crawford and I couldn't stop cheering.
> 
> Little did we know that Mihm at the #4 and Crawford at the #7 was probably one of the better scenerios we could have ended up with in that draft.


Actually , in retrospect Mihm would have ended up a better pick than Crawford

Crawford netted Othella , Piatowski and Griffin - the latter who is no longer with us and Pike who won't be after this season .. and maybe not Othella either 

Mihm , right now , would be quite valuable to us 

I have no problem with drafting Davis in the mid first round at #15 to #16 with our pick 

In fact at the start of this thread ( which I started ) I had proclaimed him way back when 

I'm sticking to it 

He's going to have a solid pro career ..may not develop quite as good as what Brad Miller did but he has that type of upside IMO 

And even if he doesn't develop as Brad Miller did his downside is probably a Michael Doleac type with one or two legitimate post moves - and Doleac had a solid career as a back up big 

Very solid pick as a scoring back up big with legit Center size that may end up an effective ( if not stellar ) man / body defender in the post - as Brad Miller is and as Michael Doleac was

What does one expect with a a #15 / #16 pick ?

Franchise player ?

Or as my man El Chapu says..maybe someone to shoot out of the cannon under the bigtop 

There is such a fine line these days between mid to late first round picks and 2nd rounders 

It really is a crap shoot 

Of course if we draft Aldridge ..we don't take another big in the mid first round and we take whatever swing player is available - which may be Brewer ( I doubt it ) but more likely Mardy Collins - or we could trade that pick and pick up Jiri Welsch or John Salmons in free agency 

With our position now clearer what I would like to see happen is to 

1. Take Brandon Roy with the Knicks pick

2. Take Paul Davis at #15 

Take Gooden and Pryzibilla in free agency 

*

Pryzibilla
Gooden
Deng
Roy
Hinrich

bench

Davis
Chandler
Nocioni
Gordon
Duhon

Schenscher
Allen
Songaila
Basden
Pargo

Cuts :Harrington , Sweetney

*


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I have been a Bulls fan and the season ticket holder for longer then most of you have been alive. But I no longer live in Chicago and frankly dont like this ***** footing around attitude by the top guy. He needs to show some balls. And Paul Davis, who is a mid second rounder at best, would be the final string. I think I have gotten to a age where I support people rather then a team. I support Lebron James, or Pietrus or Ronaldinho, but I am not a Cavs, Warriors fan or Barca fan per se. The people on the Bulls work hard, but dont really entertain me. They are boring, both on and off the court. Now, I grew up with Jordan, so my basis is hugely tainted, but this is ridiculous. I think there is alot to be proud of this season for the Bulls, but still they are an afterthought in the city of Chicago and frankly to most of the people who go to the UC, who would rather catch a T-shirt or get a pic with Benny. This is because the Bulls are boring. And if the GM continues to be safe, not only will we never win a title (people make it sound like 50 wins is a big feat, when you grow up with 6 titles, thats the only thing that matters) but we will never be entertaining. Applaud Pax is all most do, he has delievered a better team, but a far less entertaining team. And for me, both are essential. Call me spoiled, but I am not a forgiving person and demand the highest standard. If I dont feel like I am getting it, then I walk. So Pax, take a chance for Gods sake. Grow some balls and do something a bit out of the box. Championship teams are not built on wasting the 15th pick on a guy like Paul Davis.


I don't want us to pick Paul Davis at 15, but I think the Bulls have been pretty entertaining of late. When Ben Gordon's on there aren't many guys more fun to watch, especially in the 4th quarter. You must have quite the hard-on for Pietrus if you consider Golden State more fun to watch than the Bulls...


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I have been a Bulls fan and the season ticket holder for longer then most of you have been alive. But I no longer live in Chicago and frankly dont like this ***** footing around attitude by the top guy. He needs to show some balls. And Paul Davis, who is a mid second rounder at best, would be the final string. I think I have gotten to a age where I support people rather then a team. I support Lebron James, or Pietrus or Ronaldinho, but I am not a Cavs, Warriors fan or Barca fan per se. The people on the Bulls work hard, but dont really entertain me. They are boring, both on and off the court. Now, I grew up with Jordan, so my basis is hugely tainted, but this is ridiculous. I think there is alot to be proud of this season for the Bulls, but still they are an afterthought in the city of Chicago and frankly to most of the people who go to the UC, who would rather catch a T-shirt or get a pic with Benny. This is because the Bulls are boring. And if the GM continues to be safe, not only will we never win a title (people make it sound like 50 wins is a big feat, when you grow up with 6 titles, thats the only thing that matters) but we will never be entertaining. Applaud Pax is all most do, he has delievered a better team, but a far less entertaining team. And for me, both are essential. Call me spoiled, but I am not a forgiving person and demand the highest standard. If I dont feel like I am getting it, then I walk. So Pax, take a chance for Gods sake. Grow some balls and do something a bit out of the box. Championship teams are not built on wasting the 15th pick on a guy like Paul Davis.



It seems a bit unfair to bash Paxson because a poster suggests drafting Paul Davis.


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I have been a Bulls fan and the season ticket holder for longer then most of you have been alive.


older fans > younger fans

[/QUOTE]


> But I no longer live in Chicago


I see.



> and frankly dont like this ***** footing around attitude by the top guy. He needs to show some balls.


I'm sick of Paxon's wishy-washiness too. It seems every late february he trades one his young players for an over-the-hill veteran.



> And Paul Davis, who is a mid second rounder at best, would be the final string.


When I saee those trib headlines on how Pax is interested in Paul Davis, I get sick too.



> I think I have gotten to a age where I support people rather then a team.


Just wait until college, it gets a whole lot tougher (but you can skip class w/o the dean calling your mother). What was your age again?



> I support Lebron James, or Pietrus or Ronaldinho, but I am not a Cavs, Warriors fan or Barca fan per se.


I can't believe that John Paxon passed on those three studs.



> The people on the Bulls work hard, but dont really entertain me. They are boring, both on and off the court.


Motorcycles must have simply gone out of style, I guess.



> Now, I grew up with Jordan, so my basis is hugely tainted, but this is ridiculous. I think there is alot to be proud of this season for the Bulls, but still they are an afterthought in the city of Chicago and frankly to most of the people who go to the UC, who would rather catch a T-shirt or get a pic with Benny.


Benny is a pimp. Must be that he's hugely tainted.



> This is because the Bulls are boring. And if the GM continues to be safe, not only will we never win a title (people make it sound like 50 wins is a big feat, when you grow up with 6 titles, thats the only thing that matters) but we will never be entertaining.


I can feel the boredom on this board. Mariotti must have written a positive article yesterday because the baseball season hasn't started yet.



> Applaud Pax is all most do, he has delievered a better team, but a far less entertaining team. And for me, both are essential. Call me spoiled, but I am not a forgiving person and demand the highest standard. If I dont feel like I am getting it, then I walk. So Pax, take a chance for Gods sake. Grow some balls and do something a bit out of the box. Championship teams are not built on wasting the 15th pick on a guy like Paul Davis.


Sweet Jesus. What must it take for a team to be entertaining? What players have Pax passed up that would have made this team BOTH more entertaining competitive?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Is this a dig at me?


Not exactly, although I consider yourself one of the smartest guys here.

I will admit I was shaking my head after reading your latest posts though


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

In defense of outlandish statements.................Being a Bulls fan is a desease that occassionally gets the best of all of us. I can remember swearing I'd never root for the Bulls again if they let John Starks on the court in a Bulls uni.............Wait, that wasn't so outlandish???? LOL.


In any case, I think the real point or atleast how I feel is that this off-season will determine what we have to sink, swim or fly with. Guys like Paul Davis are all over the NBDL. So to use your mid level first round pick for someone like him is saying that I'd rather not fail, than going for the big score. 

I would be disappointed in taking Davis because I believe there are clearly more talented players (Splitter, O'Bryant, Sene, Jianlin) that will be available at that pick that could be starters for us in a year or two where as I don't think Davis is anything more than a back up. Albeit a good back up for a long time. 

Also, I think this is the prerfect year for us to go for a homerun pick because we have FA to address gaping holes and guys with high potential always have more trade value than they should.
As for Roy with a top 3 pick, I'd be disappointed we couldn't trade down to 6 or 7 if he's the guy we want. Also, I think Aldrige/Bargnani/Thomas could start if needed next season, whereas the other bigs need a season or two of development. I do agree Roy would be able to contribute right away and would welcome him.

However, I think we could grab Nene and John Salmons. we'd be in great shape.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If we get Ty Thomas and JJ Reddick I wouldn't be dissapointed, but if Noah decides to enter, and drops to us for our 2nd pick, I'd take Noah, and then have a front court of Ty, Tyson, and Joakim.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

OK, quick update on the CHinese star Jianlin:

Yi not to enter NBA draft this year confirmed 

So you can add him to possibiklities for next year.

As for Reddick - I'd take Paul Davis before him.....Hope that shows how much I think he'd fit on this team. He gives us zero of what we need - Size - Nope, athleticism - nope, defense - not likely - pass................

Seriously hurt your own credibility when you suggest that Noah (should he enter) would fall to 15, when many say he's a top 1-5 pick.


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I have been a Bulls fan and the season ticket holder for longer then most of you have been alive. But I no longer live in Chicago and frankly dont like this ***** footing around attitude by the top guy. He needs to show some balls. And Paul Davis, who is a mid second rounder at best, would be the final string. I think I have gotten to a age where I support people rather then a team. I support Lebron James, or Pietrus or Ronaldinho, but I am not a Cavs, Warriors fan or Barca fan per se. The people on the Bulls work hard, but dont really entertain me. They are boring, both on and off the court. Now, I grew up with Jordan, so my basis is hugely tainted, but this is ridiculous. I think there is alot to be proud of this season for the Bulls, but still they are an afterthought in the city of Chicago and frankly to most of the people who go to the UC, who would rather catch a T-shirt or get a pic with Benny. This is because the Bulls are boring. And if the GM continues to be safe, not only will we never win a title (people make it sound like 50 wins is a big feat, when you grow up with 6 titles, thats the only thing that matters) but we will never be entertaining. Applaud Pax is all most do, he has delievered a better team, but a far less entertaining team. And for me, both are essential. Call me spoiled, but I am not a forgiving person and demand the highest standard. If I dont feel like I am getting it, then I walk. So Pax, take a chance for Gods sake. Grow some balls and do something a bit out of the box. Championship teams are not built on wasting the 15th pick on a guy like Paul Davis.


I guess the "Bulls aren't exciting" argument is what I don't understand. Sure they don't have anyone resembling a superstar yet, but when they are playing good ball, it's almost a thing of beauty to watch.

Phoenix, Memphis, and Chicago have all brought a very refreshing, and entertaining, brand of basketball to the league the past couple of years. Maybe it's my PG mentality, but I enjoy watching a team share the basketball instead of watching isolation after isolation of a superstar offensive player.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I tend to agree that "the excitement" is a tough situation.

Honestly, with all the times we've come back this season to win ( and lose) i'd say that most games I was glued to my seat to the end. If we could've put the teams away I would've gladly sat through blow outs. LOL.


I can only assume that the"excitement" some want is the up and down action and high flying fast breaks. While a few teams get that kind of play, i don't see an abundance of it these days.

my real criticism is that we are not a complete team (i.e. - we have no starter quality PF or C). Chandler is an excelent defensive replacement, but until he can catch a pass and shoot from mroe than 2 feet away from the basket, he's a pogo stick with defensive instincts.

Excitement - could be more. A more complete team - is the only way we get to the championship level.

One other point - Many very good TEAMS, make it to the championship but don't win. Their star doesn't come through or the supporting cast just isn't enough. Right now, I still fear we lack a go to guy (though Gordon, Deng, Hinrich and Nocioni are slowly getting to that level).


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## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

How about Richard Roby w/ our pick? Anyone seen this guy play ? (I haven't)


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## Machinehead

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Its important not to confuse excitement with excrement 

Re : the Clippers of a few years ago with Cheech Odom , Miles , Q and Maggette

And in latter times the Warriors with all the names and early buzz but are still a 30 somethin win team. Yay .

The Spurs are probably the biggest yawn in the NBA closely followed by the Pistons 

I'm not saying you can't be a winner and play exciting ball ... the Suns are a testament to that in the NBA at the moment ...its rare for winning teams to preference bigtop basketball over winning basketball

Remember how boring the triangle was for many ?

Me .. I like my team to be winners and have no complaints and therefore don't feel a particular compulsion to hire Kevin Bacon as a scout to do the Air up There thing and bring us Bubble Butt from Belize 

Frankly we don't need it


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## mgolding

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I am not ready to make a definitive decision on who the bulls should draft with the NY pick regardless of where it lands. What I do think is that regardless of its position (1-5), I do not think the best available big man is necessarily our best option. While it is critical the bulls do at one stage land a big guy I do not think that this draft pick is the only option. For example I would be more than happy for the bulls to draft Roy if he shows himself to be the best player for this team. This is the NBA, with the amount of player movement that occurs I think it is irrational to believe there is one and only one chance to fill a particular need. To come back to Roy, he seems like he would be a good fit beside both of Hinrich and Gordon which is a reasonably unique attribute given Gordon’s miniature SG status.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

you don't trade one of the best low post scoring big men in the league only to draft a shooting guard in the draft. UNLESS that SG has dwayne wade type potential which none of the guys in the draft have.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> you don't trade one of the best low post scoring big men in the league only to draft a shooting guard in the draft. UNLESS that SG has dwayne wade type potential which none of the guys in the draft have.


Just because we traded Curry for a draft pick, doesn't mean we have to look for his replacement in the draft.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> Just because we traded Curry for a draft pick, doesn't mean we have to look for his replacement in the draft.


with the potential of the bigs in this draft, i'd think that would be the FIRST place we'd look


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## rwj333

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Can someone post a summary of the espn insider article about Tyrus Thomas? Anything interesting?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> if its paul davis then i am no longer a bulls fan. period


You can do whatever you want, rlucas, but what if the Bulls took Davis with their pick but took a risk with NY's pick, like Thomas or Bargnani? That would be half way to outside the box, no?

And how about a year down the road, if Davis turned out to be decent? Then would you come back?

:biggrin:


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

"I do know this: There are at least five very good players in this draft." 

We haven't discussed this quote yet. It's from the article about Paxson losing faith from yesterday.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...bulls,1,1853698.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines

That's probably the first really encouraging thing I've heard him say about the draft. I wonder who he likes.


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> You can do whatever you want, rlucas, but what if the Bulls took Davis with their pick but took a risk with NY's pick, like Thomas or Bargnani? That would be half way to outside the box, no?
> 
> And how about a year down the road, if Davis turned out to be decent? Then would you come back?
> 
> :biggrin:


I think Davis at 15 would be seriously outside the box.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> "I do know this: There are at least five very good players in this draft."
> 
> We haven't discussed this quote yet. It's from the article about Paxson losing faith from yesterday.
> 
> http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...bulls,1,1853698.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines
> 
> That's probably the first really encouraging thing I've heard him say about the draft. I wonder who he likes.


There are 5 very good players in this draft? And the Bulls cant drop below 5, right? Coincidence! 
Good job, Pax!


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> you don't trade one of the best low post scoring big men in the league only to draft a shooting guard in the draft. UNLESS that SG has dwayne wade type potential which none of the guys in the draft have.


That's generally how I feel. I like Brandon Roy alot, but I think we'd be missing a golden opportunity to land a much-needed big man if we use the Knick's pick on a guard/wing. If it were a Carmelo/Wade caliber of player, I would reconsider, but I don't think Adam Morrison, Rudy Gay, or Brandon Roy are at that "must have" level.


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> "I do know this: There are at least five very good players in this draft."
> 
> We haven't discussed this quote yet. It's from the article about Paxson losing faith from yesterday.
> 
> http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...bulls,1,1853698.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines
> 
> That's probably the first really encouraging thing I've heard him say about the draft. I wonder who he likes.


Good catch, I overlooked that one.

If there are at least 5 very good players, my guess is that group includes at the very least, LaMarcus Aldridge, Tyrus Thomas, Adam Morrison, Brandon Roy, and Rodney Carney. All of which are guys who are battle tested at the college level, and belonged to teams who went deep into the tourney.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Great. The Knicks won. 

If Portland loses tonight, they tie New York for second worst record.

Unbelievable.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

There wont be any changes, it doesnt matter if Portland wins. They have the worst record in the league, followed by New York.


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## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Oh, then I misunderstood what I read.

The Knicks are locked in with the second worst record?


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



dogra said:


> Oh, then I misunderstood what I read.
> 
> The Knicks are locked in with the second worst record?


yep


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

So our pick is pick 16, right?


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> So our pick is pick 16, right?


i think that would be milwaukee...

i think we have 17 or 18


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Tomorrow (21st) we'll officially be 1 month away from the draft lotto. The closer we get, the more nervous I get. I really don't wanna wind up with the 4th or 5th pick. I know it depends on draft needs & pre-draft workouts but 4th or 5th still isn't a good position for us IMO. Especially having so many players with question marks about their game.


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> i think that would be milwaukee...
> 
> i think we have 17 or 18


Well, there are 14 teams that didn't make the playoffs. They comprise the lottery. The team with the worst record that made the playoffs was Milwaukee, so they'll be picking 15th. At that point, there are two teams with identical 41-41 records, us and the Pacers, so do we get the better pick because they got the better seed, or is there some coin toss later?


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

You know, it's nice to move up to a higher seed and all that, but I'm not sure we're not going to be kicking ourselves when it comes draft time. Milwaukee should be drafting right in front of us (unless Indy somehow gets in front of us as well - see the question in my previous post). Milwaukee's pick is parlayed to the Hornets due to the Magloire trade. Guess what positions they need to address in the draft? You got it: shooting guard and center. How much do you want to bet they pull someone off the board that we really like?


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> You know, it's nice to move up to a higher seed and all that, but I'm not sure we're not going to be kicking ourselves when it comes draft time. Milwaukee should be drafting right in front of us (unless Indy somehow gets in front of us as well - see the question in my previous post). Milwaukee's pick is parlayed to the Hornets due to the Magloire trade. Guess what positions they need to address in the draft? You got it: shooting guard and center. How much do you want to bet they pull someone off the board that we really like?


They have two picks right before us, their own included. Utah needs a SG/SF more than anything as well.

It could mean that they could start the SG frenzy, in which case we may see a lottery projected big slip down to us.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> It could mean that they could start the SG frenzy, in which case we may see a lottery projected big slip down to us.


I highly doubt that, as size usually trumps all, but if all the decent 2 guards are gone by the time we're up, I'd rather look at projects like Sene, White or even someone like Adams before I'd consider many of the bigs projected to be in the middle (O'Bryant pretty much the only exception).


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## truebluefan

*Rlucas*

Know anything about Gabriel Colon? 

He is a 6-7 swingman from Puerto Rico. Draft Express giving him a paragraph at their site, said he is making noise.


*javascript:newwind('http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1269','481')*


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## step

*Re: Rlucas*



> Know anything about Gabriel Colon?
> 
> He is a 6-7 swingman from Puerto Rico. Draft Express giving him a paragraph at their site, said he is making noise.


Heh, Colon, making noise. I'm laughing irl here, oh how immature I really am.


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> I highly doubt that, as size usually trumps all, but if all the decent 2 guards are gone by the time we're up, I'd rather look at projects like Sene, White or even someone like Adams before I'd consider many of the bigs projected to be in the middle (O'Bryant pretty much the only exception).


If Roy, Carney, and Brewer are all off the board by the Bulls pick, I would think one of Splitter, O'Bryant, Williams, or Armstrong would be available. NOH having two picks may mean they take a chance on Splitter with one of them, which is why he may be a candidate for our second pick as well (we could afford the risk that he may not join the team this season as we still have another pick and C. Space).

It all sort of depends on who Paxson is targeting in FA, or who he thinks he is likely to get. If he's confident we can land one of Gooden, Nene, or Wilcox, then drafting a project guy with upside would make a lot more sense. If he's not supremely confident, then I think Paxson would lean towards one of the aforementioned.

Collins is mildly interesting if the bigs and other SGs are gone, but I'm not sure if he would be a good NBA man-to-man defender. I don't really see anything NBA ready in his game outside of his ball handling.

Sene and Sefolosha are very intriguing assuming Paxson thinks our team is set, and from everything I have read, I'd lean more towards Sefolosha. Sene seems like the project of all projects, and I would shy away from him because we are already young enough as a team. I don't see anyone on the roster that could teach a very raw 7'0" how to play the game, unless we rope AD or someone of that nature back into the organization. I would sort of lean towards Jianlian over Sene. However, take my comments on these two with a grain of salt as I hadn't even heard of either of them until about three weeks ago. I have yet to see either play.

One European prospect I really like is Rudy Fernandez. While not the tall defensive-guard we are looking for, he is a penetrator, which is something we have been lacking for the most part (although we have seen improvements in this area from Noc, Deng, Kirk, and Ben--so it's not as large a problem as I thought it was last season). I still think he could end up being a good pro, even though he's not the best of fits for our club.

White would be a guy to look at with a second round or late first round pick. Outside of his leaping ability, there's really nothing about his game that excels. He is a hard worker from everything I read so he definately could have a future in the league. That said, I would rather take a chance on White or Fazekas over Davis or Millsap, but I don't see it coming down to that sort of situation at pick #16.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> At that point, there are two teams with identical 41-41 records, us and the Pacers, so do we get the better pick because they got the better seed, or is there some coin toss later?


That's a damn good question.


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## narek

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> That's a damn good question.


how they did it last year:

http://nbadraft.net/2005tiebreakers.asp


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



narek said:


> how they did it last year:
> 
> http://nbadraft.net/2005tiebreakers.asp


Although each tiebreaker was for non-playoff teams or playoff teams from opposing conferences.

You would think it would be fair that the higher seed get the lower pick if two teams are tied from the same conference.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> They have two picks right before us, their own included. Utah needs a SG/SF more than anything as well.
> 
> It could mean that they could start the SG frenzy, in which case we may see a lottery projected big slip down to us.


I would think Utah would take Redick if he's on the board when they pick, right (unless they move up into the top 3).


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Draftcity is reporting that Splitter will indeed enter his name in the draft. He has no buyout option yet, but his agent is trying to negotiate one with his team.

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1269


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If Splitter doesn't have a buyout he will be long gone before our own pick, probably top 7.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> If Splitter doesn't have a buyout he will be long gone before our own pick, probably top 7.


I think DMD meant that he hasn't bought out of his current contract (hence the agent working on one with his team part)., not that there isn't the buyout question.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I would think Utah would take Redick if he's on the board when they pick, right (unless they move up into the top 3).


I really haven't followed Utah too closely, but I thought they were trying to trade Boozer and land a 3/2 mold type of player.

Is shooting really their problem? I was under the impression it was more defense and turnovers.


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> I think DMD meant that he hasn't bought out of his current contract (hence the agent working on one with his team part)., not that there isn't the buyout question.


Yes, thank you Rhyder, I meant to say he doesn't have a buyout option in his contract, but his agent is lobbying for one with the team.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Yes, thank you Rhyder, I meant to say he doesn't have a buyout option in his contract, but his agent is lobbying for one with the team.


Sounds like the agent is trying to do the leg work to make Splitter more appealing, smart man.


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> I really haven't followed Utah too closely, but I thought they were trying to trade Boozer and land a 3/2 mold type of player.
> 
> Is shooting really their problem? I was under the impression it was more defense and turnovers.


Utah got very little production from the shooting guard spot this year. They get good 3 point shooting from Deron Williams and Okur, but AK47 and Boozer aren't really shooters. Redick would give them some more offensive punch from that position, and he also fits the mold of players that Utah usually targets in the draft and free agency (white American players and foreign born players).


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

It's starting to look like the Bulls' core has been set, and I don't think they will be changing their offensive system much next year, lest they go through early season growing pains like they did this season. I expect the Bulls to go with size with the Knicks' pick, since those big men are also very mobile (a big plus for a very well-conditioined and intense team like the Bulls), and I think the Bulls will go with the best shooter whose talent is reasonably within their draft range (so, Steve Novak will not be picked here). Teams like the current Suns, the Dirk/Nash/Finley Mavericks, and the championship Rockets thrived so much because they have/had some of the most effective inside-outside offenses. I now expect John Paxson to draft JJ Redick or sign a great shooter .


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> I now expect John Paxson to draft JJ Redick or sign a great shooter .


You're jokin' right?


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> You're jokin' right?


No. The Bulls rely on the pick-and-roll a lot to make their offense work, hence the reason why Deng and Noc have been able to penetrate so much lately. The pick-and-roll offense starts to look much better when there are great shooters on the floor; ask the Steve Nash Suns or the Stockton-Malone-Hornacek Jazz. Duhon is very effective when he is the point guard on the floor but becomes an offensive liability when his role on offense is as a spot-up shooter. If the Paxson and Skiles want to keep the same offensive system they should pick the best shooter within their draft range.


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bargnani Vs Virtus Bologna 
27 minutes
11 points (3 dunks)
10 rebounds
3 steals
3 blocks


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> No. The Bulls rely on the pick-and-roll a lot to make their offense work, hence the reason why Deng and Noc have been able to penetrate so much lately. The pick-and-roll offense starts to look much better when there are great shooters on the floor; ask the Steve Nash Suns or the Stockton-Malone-Hornacek Jazz. Duhon is very effective when he is the point guard on the floor but becomes an offensive liability when his role on offense is as a spot-up shooter.  If the Paxson and Skiles want to keep the same offensive system they should pick the best shooter within their draft range.


I don't think that's the way Paxson is looking at it, though. He's said we need more size at the 4/5 and a big defensive shooting guard, and he's said it more than once.

However, I would not put it past Pax to take Reddick with our pick if he really thinks he's the best player on the board. Since I feel pretty confident JJ will get taken in the late lottery, I don't think it will be an issue.


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## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



italianBBlover said:


> Bargnani Vs Virtus Bologna
> 27 minutes
> 11 points (3 dunks)
> 10 rebounds
> 3 steals
> 3 blocks


Those are some nice #'s that he put up for the amount of minutes that he played. He's definetley a guy that Paxson has to look at. I would have to say that he's probably #3 on Pax's depth chart(unless he impresses in his workouts) behind Aldridge and Thomas.

As for Splitter, he could be there, but I wouldn't bank on it though. If he is, Pax ought to take him or Sene if he isn't


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

...


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Time to make a Bulls top 16 value board:

1. Aldridge
2. Thomas
3. Bargnini*
4. Roy
5. Gay
6. Carney
7. Morrison
8. Splitter*
9. Brewer
10. O'Bryant*
11. Simmons*
12. Sene*
13. S. Williams
14. Collins*
15. Rondo*
16. M. Williams

note: * = someone I haven't seen play.

What's your list?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



dsouljah9 said:


> Those are some nice #'s that he put up for the amount of minutes that he played. He's definetley a guy that Paxson has to look at. I would have to say that he's probably #3 on Pax's depth chart(unless he impresses in his workouts) behind Aldridge and Thomas.
> 
> As for Splitter, he could be there, but I wouldn't bank on it though. If he is, Pax ought to take him or Sene if he isn't


I think his value will depend a lot in his buyout. If he gets his way and could leave relative cheaply for the NBA, I would say he is taken in the 7/12 range. 

BTW: His last game was wednesday, and he played decent ball

32 Minutes (Not starting)
18 Points
5/10 2PT FG
8/10 FT
2 Rebounds 
2 Assists
1 TO
0 Steals 
0 Blocks

Only 2 rebounds, thats not good considering his game. No blocks. He had a good scoring game, but overall it wasnt a typical Splitter game. The game top rebounder only got 6, go figure.

Edit: Someone that is having a good season in Spain is Curtis Borchardt, drafted by Utah from Stanford. I think he was in the Celtics squad during the preseason, but didnt play much. Given his size, I could see him returning to the NBA soon. He is averaging close to 16 points, 9 rebounds and 2 blocks. If Luke has a place in the NBA, Curtis could as well. It would be a nice addition to our summer league squad.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Time to make a Bulls top 16 value board:
> 
> 1. Aldridge
> 2. Thomas
> 3. Bargnini*
> 4. Roy
> 5. Gay
> 6. Carney
> 7. Morrison
> 8. Splitter*
> 9. Brewer
> 10. O'Bryant*
> 11. Simmons*
> 12. Sene*
> 13. S. Williams
> 14. Collins*
> 15. Rondo*
> 16. M. Williams
> 
> note: * = someone I haven't seen play.
> 
> What's your list?


I don't think Rondo or Williams should even be on the list. They might be among the top 16 players in this draft, but there's just no possible way in which the Bulls take another short point guard. I would probably move any capable big man (Armstrong, Boone, etc) ahead of those two. I would also switch Carney and Roy but otherwise our lists would look the same.

I'm still hoping McRoberts declares as he would instantly enter my top 5.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://www.insidebayarea.com/warriors/ci_3734360



> NOTES: Because the Warriors finished the season tied with the Rockets for the eighth-worst record in the NBA at 34-48, *the teams will be one of several pairs involved in a random drawing today to determine their position in this summer's draft and draft lottery.* If the Warriors win their drawing with the Rockets, they would be slotted eighth in the first round, and for lottery purposes and in the second round would have the 39th overall pick; if Houston wins, Golden State will be ninth and 38th.


Hmm. I found this today at the bottom of an article about Barron Davis. It's the only thing I've found yet on the topic of tiebreakers. Personally, I think it's pretty annoying that we're going to have to do a coin toss to determine who gets a better pick between us and the Pacers when they got a better playoff seed than we did. I'm not 100% sure that's how it works, but this is the only source I have on the issue.

We might be picking 17th instead of 16th.


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/tiebreaker_060421.html

*Update: Chicago won the two-way tiebreaker between the Bulls and Indiana Pacers. The Utah Jazz, despite also finishing with a 41-41 record, will select before both teams due to not making the NBA Playoffs. The NBA Draft Lottery will be held on May 23.*


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mizenkay said:


> http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/tiebreaker_060421.html
> 
> *Update: Chicago won the two-way tiebreaker between the Bulls and Indiana Pacers. The Utah Jazz, despite also finishing with a 41-41 record, will select before both teams due to not making the NBA Playoffs. The NBA Draft Lottery will be held on May 23.*


Sweet, so we're picking 16th. 

Honestly, I think that's a crappy rule. If both teams are in the same conference, and the other team wins a tiebreaker over you for playoff seeding, than you should pick before them.

It looks like the coin flipped our way. One pick can make all the difference. That being said, it's possible to draft a major talent at 17 like Josh Smith.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Sweet, so we're picking 16th.
> 
> Honestly, I think that's a crappy rule. If both teams are in the same conference, and the other team wins a tiebreaker over you for playoff seeding, than you should pick before them.
> 
> It looks like the coin flipped our way. One pick can make all the difference. That being said, it's possible to draft a major talent at 17 like Josh Smith.


yep, Tayshaun Price & Danny Granger were picked around that range also.

Bad part about it is, if O'Bryant falls that far, Utah may take him, especially since Ostertag retired.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mizenkay said:


> http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/tiebreaker_060421.html
> 
> *Update: Chicago won the two-way tiebreaker between the Bulls and Indiana Pacers. The Utah Jazz, despite also finishing with a 41-41 record, will select before both teams due to not making the NBA Playoffs. The NBA Draft Lottery will be held on May 23.*


So Utah gets the better pick for not making the playoffs and we have a tiebraker with Indy in spite of having a lower seed? Makes no sense. 

At least we won it and pick ahead of them.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

OK, here's a list of players who were recently drafted with the 16th pick, and a list of a few good players that got taken after each pick:


2005: Joey Graham (Danny Granger - 17, Gerald Green - 18, Nate Robinson - 21, Luther Head - 24)
2004: Kirk Snyder (Josh Smith - 17, Jameer Nelson - 20, Tony Allen - 25, Chris Duhon - 39)
2003: Troy Bell (David West - 18, Boris Diaw - 21, L. Barbosa - 29, Josh Howard - 30)
2002: Jiri Welsch (Tayshaun Prince - 23, Nenad Kristic - 24, Carlos Boozer - 35)
2001: Kirk Haston (Z. Randolph - 19, G. Wallace - 25, S. Dalembert - 26, T. Parker - 28, G. Arenas - 30, M. Okur - 38, B. Simmons - 42)
2000: Hedo Turkoglu (D. Mason - 17, Q. Rich - 18, J. Magloire - 19, P. Brezec - 27, M. Redd - 43)
1999: Ron Artest (James Posey - 18, Jeff Foster - 21, Andrei Kirilenko - 24, Manu Ginobili - 57)
1998: Bryce Drew (Ricky Davis - 21, Al Harrington - 25, Rashard Lewis - 32)
1997: Brevin Knight (Bobby Jackson - 21, Stephen Jackson - 43, God Shamgod - 46, Mark Blount - 55)
1996: Tony Delk (Jermaine O'Neal - 17, Zydrunas Ilgauskas - 20, Derek Fisher - 24)

History would prove there are some pretty good players that have been available at pick 16. Surprisingly, there have been quite a few bigs that were available.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> OK, here's a list of players who were recently drafted with the 16th pick, and a list of a few good players that got taken after each pick:
> 
> 
> 2005: Joey Graham (Danny Granger - 17, Gerald Green - 18, Nate Robinson - 21, Luther Head - 24)
> 2004: Kirk Snyder (Josh Smith - 17, Jameer Nelson - 20, Tony Allen - 25, Chris Duhon - 39)
> 2003: Troy Bell (David West - 18, Boris Diaw - 21, L. Barbosa - 29, Josh Howard - 30)
> 2002: Jiri Welsch (Tayshaun Prince - 23, Nenad Kristic - 24, Carlos Boozer - 35)
> 2001: Kirk Haston (Z. Randolph - 19, G. Wallace - 25, S. Dalembert - 26, T. Parker - 28, G. Arenas - 30, M. Okur - 38, B. Simmons 42)
> 2000: Hedo Turkoglu (D. Mason - 17, Q. Rich - 18, J. Magloire - 19, P. Brezec - 27, M. Redd - 43)
> 1999: Ron Artest (James Posey - 18, Jeff Foster - 21, Andrei Kirilenko - 24, Manu Ginobili - 57)
> 1998: Bryce Drew (Ricky Davis - 21, Al Harrington - 25, Rashard Lewis - 32)
> 1997: Brevin Knight (Bobby Jackson - 21, Stephen Jackson - 43, God Shamgod - 46, Mark Blount - 55)
> 1996: Tony Delk (Jermaine O'Neal - 17, Zydrunas Ilgauskas - 20, Derek Fisher - 24)
> 
> History would prove there are some pretty good players that have been available at pick 16. Surprisingly, there have been quite a few bigs that were available.


GEEZ, surprisingly, BETTER players were damn near taken AFTER the 16th pick LOL. THANKS for posting that, it always seems like after pick 10, talent falls off but that definintely showed u what u could add after the middle of the first.

Draftexpress has us taking Tyrus with the 2nd pick & O'Bryant with the 16th


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> GEEZ, surprisingly, BETTER players were damn near taken AFTER the 16th pick LOL. THANKS for posting that, it always seems like after pick 10, talent falls off but that definintely showed u what u could add after the middle of the first.
> 
> Draftexpress has us taking Tyrus with the 2nd pick & O'Bryant with the 16th


Paxson has had several picks in the top half of the lottery and a few second rounders, but he's had no first round picks to work with. I'm very curious about #16.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> GEEZ, surprisingly, BETTER players were damn near taken AFTER the 16th pick LOL. THANKS for posting that, it always seems like after pick 10, talent falls off but that definintely showed u what u could add after the middle of the first.
> 
> Draftexpress has us taking Tyrus with the 2nd pick & O'Bryant with the 16th


I purchased the game highlights of LSU/Texas on iTunes to watch Thomas again. He really did look like a million bucks in that game. After watching again, I thought his form on his jumper looked better than I thought. However, I still don't see any post moves. 

Rewatching much of this game gave me a higher opinion of Thomas' potential. He's clearly a serious talent. That being said, I still prefer Aldridge and Roy, at least for now. 

edit: The taller and heavier Thomas measures out at (good weight, of course), the more I may be swayed.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Frankensteiner said:


> I don't think Rondo or Williams should even be on the list. They might be among the top 16 players in this draft, but there's just no possible way in which the Bulls take another short point guard. I would probably move any capable big man (Armstrong, Boone, etc) ahead of those two. I would also switch Carney and Roy but otherwise our lists would look the same.
> 
> I'm still hoping McRoberts declares as he would instantly enter my top 5.


I think Williams and Rondo are too talented to pass up for guys like Boone and Armstrong. They could bring back more value in a trade than those players have.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

OK, here's an excerpt from an informative article that just got posted on realgm. It has the lottery order after the tiebreakers and the order of non-lotto picks after the tiebreakers:



> Lottery Chances out of 1,000
> 
> Portland: 250
> New York (To Chicago): 199
> Charlotte: 138
> Atlanta: 137
> Toronto: 88
> Minnesota: 53
> Boston: 53
> Houston: 23
> Golden State: 22
> Seattle: 11
> Orlando: 8
> New Orleans/Oklahoma City: 7
> Philadelphia: 6
> Utah: 5
> 
> The order for the remainder of the first round picks is as follows:
> 
> 15. Milwaukee (To New Orleans/Oklahoma City)
> 16. Chicago
> 17. Indiana
> 18. Washington
> 19. Sacramento
> 20. Denver (To New York via Toronto and New Jersey)
> 21. LA Lakers (To Phoenix via Atlanta and Boston)
> 22. LA Clippers (To New Jersey via Denver and Orlando)
> 23. New Jersey
> 24. Memphis
> 25. Cleveland
> 26. Miami (To LA Lakers)
> 27. Phoenix
> 28. Dallas
> 29. San Antonio (To New York)
> 30. Detroit (To Portland via Utah)
> 
> 2006 SECOND ROUND DRAFT CHOICE ORDER*
> 31. Portland
> 32. New York (To Houston)
> 33/34. Atlanta
> 33/34. Charlotte (To LA Clippers)
> 35. Toronto
> 36/37. Boston[1]
> 36/37. Minnesota
> 38/39. Golden State[2]
> 38/39. Houston
> 40. Seattle
> 41. Orlando
> 42/43. Philadelphia (To Cleveland)
> 42/43. New Orleans/Oklahoma City
> 44. Milwaukee (To Orlando via Cleveland)
> 45. Indiana
> 46. Chicago (To Utah via Houston)
> 47. Utah
> 48. Washington
> 49. Denver
> 50. Sacramento (To Orlando via Utah or to Charlotte)
> 51. LA Lakers
> 52. LA Clippers
> 53. Memphis (To Seattle)
> 54. New Jersey
> 55. Cleveland
> 56. Miami (To Toronto via New Orleans/Oklahoma City and Boston)
> 57. Phoenix (To Minnesota)
> 58. Dallas
> 59. San Antonio
> 60. Detroit


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

With the second most lottery balls what are the chances that we'll wind up picking 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th or 5th overall?


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Alright, so one of Ty Thomas and Lamarcus Aldridge will be a Bull.

Now that thats pretty much settled, who to take at 16?

For me, I basically think it comes down to JJ Reddick and Shelden Williams, hope one of them is still available, honestly don't know who else to pick, unless one of the big guns slip.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



sloth said:


> Alright, so one of Ty Thomas and Lamarcus Aldridge will be a Bull.
> 
> Now that thats pretty much settled, who to take at 16?
> 
> For me, I basically think it comes down to JJ Reddick and Shelden Williams, hope one of them is still available, honestly don't know who else to pick, unless one of the big guns slip.


the chances of us drafting redick are about as slim as the detriot pistons winning the lotto


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



sloth said:


> Alright, so one of Ty Thomas and Lamarcus Aldridge will be a Bull.


Thats not true.


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I posted this earlier, but has anyone seen Richard Roby play? We could nab him at #16 (nbadraft.net has him at #19).

Even if you haven't seen him play, thoughts?


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

it seems as if NOBODY has seen him play on here LOL


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## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Electric Slim said:


> I posted this earlier, but has anyone seen Richard Roby play? We could nab him at #16 (nbadraft.net has him at #19).
> 
> Even if you haven't seen him play, thoughts?


I haven't seen him play, but if he's the shooter as scouting reports say he is, then he is a tempting draft pick (at 16).


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> I haven't seen him play, but if he's the shooter as scouting reports say he is, then he is a tempting draft pick (at 16).


he's Kenyon Martin's half brother. I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Electric Slim said:


> he's Kenyon Martin's half brother. I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing.


Half the brother, half the flagrants.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

JJ redick @ 16 wouldn't be SO terrible.

if he dropped that far..i wouldn't be too pissed if we drafted him.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> JJ redick @ 16 wouldn't be SO terrible.
> 
> if he dropped that far..i wouldn't be too pissed if we drafted him.


What EXACTLY do we need J.J. Reddik for? That would be a TERRIBLE pick.

We're already a jump-shooting team, we don't need another guy like that.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> What EXACTLY do we need J.J. Reddik for? That would be a TERRIBLE pick.
> 
> We're already a jump-shooting team, we don't need another guy like that.


What's wrong with depth? :clown:


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> What's wrong with depth? :clown:


Mehmet Okur (center)
Carlos Boozer (forward)
Andrei Kirilenko (forward)
Deron Williams (point guard)
Devon Brown??? (shooting guard)

It's pretty clear what position the Jazz should address with their 1st round pick, which is almost sure to be #14. Again, being that their M.O. is often to pursue white American players and European players (I think the reason is that there are a lot of black people who would not feel particularly comfortable living in Utah), and considering the fact that Utah could use another scorer and shooter, I think Reddick is a natural fit at #14.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> What's wrong with depth? :clown:


J.J. Reddick = Not athletic, Not a big, Not a defender.

What do we need this kid for?


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> What EXACTLY do we need J.J. Reddik for? That would be a TERRIBLE pick.
> 
> We're already a jump-shooting team, we don't need another guy like that.



Value.

He could be drafted only to be traded...So that's just my thinking in not thinking it's terrible.

Right now I'm leaning towards Hilton Armstrong.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Right now I'm leaning towards Hilton Armstrong.


Why?


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Why?



Why not?

I don't believe anyone else worthy would be available.

More size can't hurt...can it?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Why not?
> 
> I don't believe anyone else worthy would be available.
> 
> More size can't hurt...can it?


I mean like Why, what do u like about Hilton's game?


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I see Elden Cambell when I watch the kid..

I like his size...6'11'' long wingspan...The more size on this current Bulls team the better.

I like his pedigree...Coming from a program like UCONN...You must have developed some good habits....He's produced solid numbers against high level opponents.

Now watching him...He defends the paint...Looks like he can get even stronger...And he does have post moves and a tenacity around the basket that I like to see in a big man...

I mean...He feels a need for our team better than anyone else IMO that might be taken @ the 16 spot.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If we take a guy with our pick who can pan out to be as good as Elden Campbell, I would be very satisfied. Guys like Elden Campbell and PJ Brown are damn good players. They are guys who you can rely upon for 8-10 years to get you about 14 + 8. They are big bodies who make their presence felt. Tenacious on D, offensive skills Tyson would die for, and would fit our system well.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

There's an interesting site I just discovered that will tell the odds that each lotto team has of getting each possible pick. 

http://www.geocities.com/benschuarmer/draftlotto.html

Here's the odds he calculated for the Bulls to get pick 1-5 with the NY pick.

1: 19.9%
2: 18.8%
3: 17.1%
4: 31.9%
5: 12.4%

It is hardly a guarantee that Paxson will be able to draft his player of choice with the Knicks pick -- at least before the lottery, that is.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

FWIW Hilton Armstong is absolutely nothing like Elden Campbell

Keon Clark is a better comparative IMO


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The Bulls need a big man and a shooter (yes, another shooter). I mentioned JJ Redick, but someone brought up Richard Roby, and he would be an excellent pick since he's more athletic than JJ.


----------



## superdave

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> There's an interesting site I just discovered that will tell the odds that each lotto team has of getting each possible pick.
> 
> http://www.geocities.com/benschuarmer/draftlotto.html
> 
> Here's the odds he calculated for the Bulls to get pick 1-5 with the NY pick.
> 
> 1: 19.9%
> 2: 18.8%
> 3: 17.1%
> 4: 31.9%
> 5: 12.4%
> 
> It is hardly a guarantee that Paxson will be able to draft his player of choice with the Knicks pick -- at least before the lottery, that is.


I think he has a couple targets with the top pick and I don't think he's locked into anyone one player per se. Especially since there's no can't-miss players in this draft. So let's say odds-wise its looking like #4 and #16.

#4 Carney or Roy should be available
- Tonight just highlights the need for another big guard. Hinrich is solid and to a lesser degree Duhon though both on the smallish side. However with some size in the backcourt we can make it difficult for guards to easily shoot over us. After all, Wade and LeBron will be running in the Eastern Conference for the next decade. Wade with his mid range game (which I can envision becoming an effective post up game eventually as well) and Lebron's monster game in general. We need some size and athleticism to throw at these guys. Should the Bulls land a higher pick, perhaps they pick up Aldridge and wait for Roby/Collins with our later pick.

#16 Armstrong, Boone, Simmons or another player who slips.
- Perhaps we catch an Artest type who slips down the draft. The big man we pick here will definitely be raw offensively, so we can't expect much of an upgrade in our post offense (our second apparent glaring weakness as evident tonight). But a Simmons or Armstrong would give us another good post defender and some needed size down low. We would not be so dependent on Chandler to give us all the defensive presence in the stretch of games.

The way I see things, the Bulls are very close to maximizing on its current talent. Our defense has basically kept us in games for 2 years now... and our offense can look downright efficient at times even though we have basically one guy who can create his own shot consistently. I think the draft and free agency can really upgrade this team and address its two biggest needs. Its completely up to Pax, and this offseason is uber important. We are one _great_ move from being a top 3 team in the East IMO.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TwinkieTowers said:


> The Bulls need a big man and a shooter (yes, another shooter). I mentioned JJ Redick, but someone brought up Richard Roby, and he would be an excellent pick since he's more athletic than JJ.


Roby's also 6"6...I've NEVER seen him play and I'd take him over Reddick.

We don't need a shooter, we need an atheltic big 2guard who can defend, draw contact in the paint and get to the line. They attempted 18 more free throws than we did.

After tonight, I wouldn't be upset if Bargnani, Aldridge or Thomas were a bull. We need some HELP on the frontline in the worst way. I honestly was leaning towards Aldridge while watching this game. His offense would of helped us GREATLY.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Here's the odds he calculated for the Bulls to get pick 1-5 with the NY pick.
> 
> 1: 19.9%
> 2: 18.8%
> 3: 17.1%
> 4: 31.9%
> 5: 12.4%


How exactly can the Bulls' chances decrease at #2 and later when there are technically less ping-pong balls after the first pick? Isn't it technically:

Bulls' Chances @1 = (# of Bulls balls) / (Total # of balls)
Bulls' Chances @2 = (# of Bulls balls) / (Total # of balls - # of 1st team balls)
Bulls' Chances @3 = (# of Bulls balls) / (Total # of balls - # of 1st and 2nd team balls)
Bulls' Chances @4 = 50%
Bulls' Chances @5 = 100%
?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Did any of ya'll see Paxson at the game? He looked like he's already PLANNING what he'll do this offseason. EVERYTHING our team lacks is being exposed THIS series.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Saw this over ESPN.com:
_"A recent rule change by the NBA will affect international players -- like Brazil's Tiago Splitter -- in future drafts. Insider Chad Ford explains in his blog"_

What rule is he talking about?


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I wonder if Atlanta would consider Roy, considering he's big, fits the mold of the team and is able to run the point (albeit not at the Chris Paul level). I just don't see them picking Bargnani.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> I wonder if Atlanta would consider Roy, considering he's big, fits the mold of the team and is able to run the point (albeit not at the Chris Paul level). I just don't see them picking Bargnani.


If both Bargnani and Roy are on the board, I see the Hawks taking the italian first. Also, I dont expect them to be much improved next season. You take a project like Bargnani and hope you get Oden next fall.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> If both Bargnani and Roy are on the board, I see the Hawks taking the italian first.


But why would they be taking Bargnani? They seem pretty set at the 3 and 4.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Saw this over ESPN.com:
> _"A recent rule change by the NBA will affect international players -- like Brazil's Tiago Splitter -- in future drafts. Insider Chad Ford explains in his blog"_
> 
> What rule is he talking about?


Chad was talking about a rule concerning international players entering the draft and then taking their name out. American players - such as college undergraduates - can only do that one time. In the previous CBA, foreign players could do it as many years in a row as they wanted. Now, in the new CBA, they are only able to do it two times. But what if, in the case of Splitter, they had already done it before? Does that count? The league office clarified this week that each international player gets a clean slate, so they could enter and pull out two more times. 

However, and this is bad news, Ford also mentions that Splitter is having no luck with Tau Ceramica in negotiating a buyout for the big Brazilian, so he really might not be able to enter the draft this year.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> But why would they be taking Bargnani? They seem pretty set at the 3 and 4.


I dont see them set at the 4. They lack size, although Bargnani isnt your standard PF. 

They might lose Al Harrington. To put it clear, they only have Zaza as a serviceable big man. At SG they can use Joe Johnson or Childress, at moments. 

Hawks need either a big talented F/C or a pure PG. And given this year crop, I see its more plausible for them to get a productive power foward.


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bargnani today
28 minutes
22 points
6 rebounds


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If Brandon Roy is only a inch or two taller than Hinrich and perhaps not as athletic, is he really the anwser in our backcourt. (p.s. I do like how he gets to the line and can create a bit- I think he helps out more on O than D)

I think Aldridge, Thomas and Bargarini (if he declares) are all firmly above him on my boards for the Bulls.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> But why would they be taking Bargnani? They seem pretty set at the 3 and 4.


They desperately need a point guard to run the team, Lue just isn't cutting it, maybe they think Roy can play at the point permanently. Marcus Williams is another possibility, but he's probably a bit of a reach where they are drafting.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> If Brandon Roy is only a inch or two taller than Hinrich and perhaps not as athletic, is he really the anwser in our backcourt. (p.s. I do like how he gets to the line and can create a bit- I think he helps out more on O than D)
> 
> I think Aldridge, Thomas and Bargarini (if he declares) are all firmly above him on my boards for the Bulls.


I'm leaning heavily towards Bargnani right now, he is the real deal in my opinion. I saw some highlights from the game italianBBlover metioned, and I'm extremely impressed with this guy. I think he is the player in the draft with the biggest chance to be a star in the league, followed by Thomas and Carney. I don't want the Bulls to miss out on a potentially great player because we're afraid to take the risk of him not panning out.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> They desperately need a point guard to run the team, Lue just isn't cutting it, maybe they think Roy can play at the point permanently. Marcus Williams is another possibility, but he's probably a bit of a reach where they are drafting.


Good points. Williams would be a very nice fit with the Hawks. If he has good pre-draft workouts it wouldn't shock me to see them take him. He was awfully impressive in the NCAA tournament - by far the best player on the court for a Huskie team with 5 or 6 potential first round picks...


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I dont see them set at the 4. They lack size, although Bargnani isnt your standard PF.
> 
> They might lose Al Harrington. To put it clear, they only have Zaza as a serviceable big man. At SG they can use Joe Johnson or Childress, at moments.
> 
> Hawks need either a big talented F/C or a pure PG. And given this year crop, I see its more plausible for them to get a productive power foward.


Either Marvin Williams or Josh Smith will be playing the 4 for Atlanta before too long, IMO.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

From the Draftexpress NBA Draft Chat with Jonathan Givony:



> Question: Tyrus Thomas VS. Lamarcus Aldridge, please! Which one should the Bulls pick?
> 
> Answer: I think Aldridge personally. He compliments Chandler better. Thomas will be a very nice player down the road, but Aldridge is way more skilled offensively and you don't want to have two athletes that can't create offense for themselves in the post.


Nothing revolutionary about that answer, although I don't agree that Thomas can't create for himself in the post, he had some good moves in the NCAA Tournament in my opinion. He uses his speed and explosiveness very well, and with the right coaching he'll be just fine.

Givony likes Roy much better than Carney because of his versatility and leadership, and he also feels Noah is making a big mistake if he doesn't enter the draft, says he has everything to lose next year.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Good points. Williams would be a very nice fit with the Hawks. If he has good pre-draft workouts it wouldn't shock me to see them take him. He was awfully impressive in the NCAA tournament - by far the best player on the court for a Huskie team with 5 or 6 potential first round picks...


He was very impressive indeed, and I think he would make Joe Johnson much more effective if the Hawks drafted him. Johnson has way too many responsibilities right now, and you can see that in his play and especially his turnover numbers. He is much better coming off screens and shooting the ball, just like he did in Phoenix with Nash.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Patrick O'Bryant is officially in the draft

http://www.startribune.com/511/story/387506.html


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Either Marvin Williams or Josh Smith will be playing the 4 for Atlanta before too long, IMO.


Thats good news for the rest of the league.


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Patrick O'Bryant is officially in the draft
> 
> http://www.startribune.com/511/story/387506.html


Great news. The more the merrier.


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Thats good news for the rest of the league.


Why's that? I imagine they'll both turn out to be pretty nice players.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Patrick O'Bryant is officially in the draft
> 
> http://www.startribune.com/511/story/387506.html


Great news for the Bulls, deepening the quality of the draft. Apparently though, he is not hiring an agent and will return to Bradley if his stock is not high enough.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Why's that? I imagine they'll both turn out to be pretty nice players.


Sure, but not at the 4 spot.


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://www.pjstar.com/stories/042306/SPO_B9K5MRP5.037.shtml

O'Bryant says he wants to be a lottery pick, top 14, which is basically what he's projected for right now. Hopefully the Bulls have a shot at him.


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Sure, but not at the 4 spot.


Huh. Interesting that the biggest Andres Nocioni jock-rider going is criticizing the idea of undersized 4's...

Smith is 6' 9'' 225 lbs and 20 years old. Williams is 6'9'' 228 lbs and 19 years old. Both are still filling out. Smith is already a good rebounder and a great shotblocker. I see no reason to believe that one of these two won't be a seriously good NBA power forward in a couple years time.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Smith is 6' 9'' 225 lbs and 20 years old. Williams is 6'9'' 228 lbs and 19 years old. Both are still filling out. Smith is already a good rebounder and a great shotblocker. I see no reason to believe that one of these two won't be a seriously good NBA power forward in a couple years time.


Indeed, Smith has been handling the role quite well as of late, he's one of the main reasons why you see Harrington on the perimiter. Which is why I think it's too early for them to be looking for another 4 considering they already have 2 options there.

I'm just not sold they'll be looking at Bargnani, let alone many of the bigs in this draft.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Smith is 6' 9'' 225 lbs and 20 years old. Williams is 6'9'' 228 lbs and 19 years old. Both are still filling out. Smith is already a good rebounder and a great shotblocker. I see no reason to believe that one of these two won't be a seriously good NBA power forward in a couple years time.


Deng could develop in the same way, he sure has the length to do so.


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://www.euroleague.net/
http://www.euroleague.net/finalfour06/noticia.jsp?temporada=E05&jornada=23&id=901


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

http://www.draftexpress.com/mock.php?y=2006

here's the UPDATED verison of their mock with teams NEEDS taken into account (except for the top 10 portion of the lotto). It's pretty good too

11. jj reddick - magic
12. ronnie brewer - hornets
13. rodney carney - sixers
14. randy foye - jazz
15. patrick o'bryant - hornets
16. cedric simmons - chicago
17. rajon rando - pacers

all pretty accurate choices besides that rodney carney pick. unless they plan on getting rid of iggy and korver.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I really hope O'Bryant can fall that one slot lower!


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Huh. Interesting that the biggest Andres Nocioni jock-rider going is criticizing the idea of undersized 4's...
> 
> Smith is 6' 9'' 225 lbs and 20 years old. Williams is 6'9'' 228 lbs and 19 years old. Both are still filling out. Smith is already a good rebounder and a great shotblocker. I see no reason to believe that one of these two won't be a seriously good NBA power forward in a couple years time.


Yes, but this Nocioni jock-rider wants the Bulls to draft one of Aldridge, Thomas, Bargnani. Nocioni isnt a full-time 4.

But as I said, I wish the Hawks believe in your theory and go for anything but a big man.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



italianBBlover said:


> http://www.euroleague.net/
> http://www.euroleague.net/finalfour06/noticia.jsp?temporada=E05&jornada=23&id=901


Euroleague Rising Star Trophy:

1: Andrea Bargnani
2: Tiago Splitter 
3: Sofoklis Schortsanitis 

That is some serious talent right there, the Euroleague has so many talented young players that actually play key roles for their teams. These guys are drafted for their potential, but they can already contribute in the NBA. Bargnani is going to be a star, man would he look good in a Bulls uniform!

And Diamantidis continues to play excellent defense winning the best defender award for the second year in a row, I seem to remember bullet talking about him a while ago.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> http://www.draftexpress.com/mock.php?y=2006
> 
> here's the UPDATED verison of their mock with teams NEEDS taken into account (except for the top 10 portion of the lotto). It's pretty good too
> 
> 11. jj reddick - magic
> 12. ronnie brewer - hornets
> 13. rodney carney - sixers
> 14. randy foye - jazz
> 15. patrick o'bryant - hornets
> 16. cedric simmons - chicago
> 17. rajon rando - pacers
> 
> all pretty accurate choices besides that rodney carney pick. unless they plan on getting rid of iggy and korver.


Korver was coming off the bench at the end of the season, and Kevin Ollie was starting. Besides, you don't not draft the best player available just because you have Kyle Korver. The Sixers have a horrible bench, and it's not a bad idea to have someone on the bench who can provide an offensive spark. I think Carney would get agreat value pick for them at 13. 

Ugh, it's just such a shame that the Hornets are picking twice in front of us. Their primary needs are bigs and a shooting guard, just like us.

Here's nbadraft.net's profile of Cedric Simmons. They have his height at 6' 10" instead of 6' 9". If he's a legit 6' 10", he might be able to play some center. I definitely like the 7' 4" wingspan, but clicking on his player stats, I see that he's not a tremendously productive player yet, only getting about 12/6. Who here is seen this kid play? Can he really ball?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I hope Carney drops to us, and the Sixers pass on him b/c they got Iggy.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Just throwing some stuff, since Im a little bit bored: Would you trade (traduction = is it possible) Chandler plus our own first rounder for another top 3 pick and draft, say, Thomas and Aldridge? Or Bargnani and Thomas? Since this guys are different (LA, TT, AB) and could complement each other, would you go for it? I know none of them are legit centers, but Aldridge will be able to play that position in the pros most of the time. Bargnani could see time at the 3. Get the point?

Some things to consider:
- Who would trade for an overpaid Chandler when they could get, say, Tyrus Thomas in a rookie contract? It takes two to tango.
- Getting younger. We always hear about the Bulls needing to take the next step. Well, under this scenario we would be getting younger, a little more inmature. 
- Our capspace. If we pull something close to this, we should get at least two guys from the big men crop, including Nazr, Nene, Gooden, Wilcox, etc.
- Bring back AD, any capacity. He would be ideal to have around.

Well, thats it. Opinions?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



theanimal23 said:


> I hope Carney drops to us, and the Sixers pass on him b/c they got Iggy.


Bargnani and Carney would almost be too good to believe, I'll be very surprised if he drops to our pick, but I'll be keeping my fingers crossed.

And it rhymes as well, it's meant to be: Bargnani and Carney! :biggrin:


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> 11. jj reddick - magic
> 12. ronnie brewer - hornets
> 13. rodney carney - sixers
> 14. randy foye - jazz
> 15. patrick o'bryant - hornets
> 16. cedric simmons - chicago
> 17. rajon rando - pacers


I'm not sure I completely agree with this. I see Carney being chosen instead of Brewer by the Hornets ( they really don't need a combo guard), and as for the Jazz, I find it hard to stomach Sloan and co selecting a flashy and 1 style guard.

All i can say is, damn those Hornets!
If I didn't like Roy so much I would be willing to trade down and get their picks.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> Euroleague Rising Star Trophy:
> 
> 1: Andrea Bargnani
> 2: Tiago Splitter
> 3: Sofoklis Schortsanitis
> 
> That is some serious talent right there, the Euroleague has so many talented young players that actually play key roles for their teams. These guys are drafted for their potential, but they can already contribute in the NBA. Bargnani is going to be a star, man would he look good in a Bulls uniform!
> 
> And Diamantidis continues to play excellent defense winning the best defender award for the second year in a row, I seem to remember bullet talking about him a while ago.


Interesting. Anyone have any info on Schortsanitis? Last I heard of him he'd had ballooned to what looked like about 450 pounds. We're talking fatter than Oliver Miller and Stanley Roberts combined - morbidly obese. Has he dropped enough wait to be considered an NBA prospect again (I believe the Clippers own his rights) or is he just bowling over smaller EuroLeague competition?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Ugh, it's just such a shame that the Hornets are picking twice in front of us. Their primary needs are bigs and a shooting guard, just like us.


I think their war room is the one we need to worry about MOST. They could potentially snag BOTH the guys we'd want by the time we get to 16.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Texas junior forward P.J. Tucker will announce later Monday that he is putting his name in the NBA draft, but will not hire an agent, ESPN.com has learned.

Tucker led the Longhorns in scoring (16.1 points per game) and rebounding (9.5). Despite that productivity and improving his overall versatility, the 6-foot-5 inside player is considered a tweener by NBA standards.

Per ESPN.COM


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Interesting. Anyone have any info on Schortsanitis? Last I heard of him he'd had ballooned to what looked like about 450 pounds. We're talking fatter than Oliver Miller and Stanley Roberts combined - morbidly obese. Has he dropped enough wait to be considered an NBA prospect again (I believe the Clippers own his rights) or is he just bowling over smaller EuroLeague competition?


He has been playing very well in the Euroleague this season, doing his best Shaq impersonation every time he stepped on the floor. He has also lost a lot of weight, but he is still enormous. He has been named the Player of the Week in the Euroleague this season, and that's definitely not an easy task. His stats in the Euroleague this season were 10 points and 5 rebounds in 20 minutes with a field goal percentage of 62%, he has just been too big and strong for anyone in Europe to handle this season. He's also stronger than almost anyone in the NBA, but he needs to work on his defense, as he tends to bite on every pumpfake and get stupid fouls that way. His offense in the NBA will be much like Shaq's in my opinion, he bullies his way to the basket and he has very good hands. He measured out at 6'10 in shoes before the 2003 draft with a 7'2 wingspan, so his size shouldn't be a problem. 

The Clippers own his rights, and I'm sure they are looking at him after his improvement this season, but I think he'll need one more year in Europe where he can get in even better shape and play solid minutes.

Here are some pictures from this season I posted in another thread, as you can see, his arms are Shaq-sized:


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> He has been playing very well in the Euroleague this season, doing his best Shaq impersonation every time he stepped on the floor. He has also lost a lot of weight, but he is still enormous. He has been named the Player of the Week in the Euroleague this season, and that's definitely not an easy task. His stats in the Euroleague this season were 10 points and 5 rebounds in 20 minutes with a field goal percentage of 62%, he has just been too big and strong for anyone in Europe to handle this season. He's also stronger than almost anyone in the NBA, but he needs to work on his defense, as he tends to bite on every pumpfake and get stupid fouls that way. His offense in the NBA will be much like Shaq's in my opinion, he bullies his way to the basket and he has very good hands. He measured out at 6'10 in shoes before the 2003 draft with a 7'2 wingspan, so his size shouldn't be a problem.
> 
> The Clippers own his rights, and I'm sure they are looking at him after his improvement this season, but I think he'll need one more year in Europe where he can get in even better shape and play solid minutes.
> 
> Here are some pictures from this season I posted in another thread, as you can see, his arms are Shaq-sized:



So i'm guess his conditioning should be horrible.

he should be averaging 30 pts 20 rbs.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Texas junior forward P.J. Tucker will announce later Monday that he is putting his name in the NBA draft, but will not hire an agent, ESPN.com has learned.
> 
> Tucker led the Longhorns in scoring (16.1 points per game) and rebounding (9.5). Despite that productivity and improving his overall versatility, the 6-foot-5 inside player is considered a tweener by NBA standards.
> 
> Per ESPN.COM


I like Tucker's tenacity and relentless hard work, but if you look at his size combined with his style of play, he'll have a hard time finding a place in the NBA. He is a great rebounder for his size though, and I liked how he played against LSU in the Tourney.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> So i'm guess his conditioning should be horrible.
> 
> he should be averaging 30 pts 20 rbs.


He has not been capable of playing effectively for more than 20 minutes or so this season without getting winded, but he seems to want to be a better player and eventually get to the NBA. His conditioning is leaps and bounds improved from last season, and I don't see why it shouldn't improve during the cause of this summer as well.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Texas junior forward P.J. Tucker will announce later Monday that he is putting his name in the NBA draft, but will not hire an agent, ESPN.com has learned.
> 
> Tucker led the Longhorns in scoring (16.1 points per game) and rebounding (9.5). Despite that productivity and improving his overall versatility, the 6-foot-5 inside player is considered a tweener by NBA standards.
> 
> Per ESPN.COM


blah, i'd rather draft craig smith from boston college if i'm going after a tweener...


----------



## Dornado

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> He has been playing very well in the Euroleague this season, doing his best Shaq impersonation every time he stepped on the floor. He has also lost a lot of weight, but he is still enormous. He has been named the Player of the Week in the Euroleague this season, and that's definitely not an easy task. His stats in the Euroleague this season were 10 points and 5 rebounds in 20 minutes with a field goal percentage of 62%, he has just been too big and strong for anyone in Europe to handle this season. He's also stronger than almost anyone in the NBA, but he needs to work on his defense, as he tends to bite on every pumpfake and get stupid fouls that way. His offense in the NBA will be much like Shaq's in my opinion, he bullies his way to the basket and he has very good hands. He measured out at 6'10 in shoes before the 2003 draft with a 7'2 wingspan, so his size shouldn't be a problem.
> 
> The Clippers own his rights, and I'm sure they are looking at him after his improvement this season, but I think he'll need one more year in Europe where he can get in even better shape and play solid minutes.
> 
> Here are some pictures from this season I posted in another thread, as you can see, his arms are Shaq-sized:




Those are large arms... but I'd the Shaq Diesel has the advantage....


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Shannon Brown declared for the draft today, though he didn't sign with an agent. I believe he's projected as a borderline first round guy right now, but it wouldn't shock me if he moved up during workouts. He's a fantastic athlete and a decent shooter (39% from 3 PT range last year), and scored 17 points a game. IMO, he and fellow Spartan Maurice Ager should be on our radar. I like both and would be surprised if at least one didn't move into the mid-first round...


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Shannon Brown declared for the draft today, though he didn't sign with an agent. I believe he's projected as a borderline first round guy right now, but it wouldn't shock me if he moved up during workouts. He's a fantastic athlete and a decent shooter (39% from 3 PT range last year), and scored 17 points a game. IMO, he and fellow Spartan Maurice Ager should be on our radar. I like both and would be surprised if at least one didn't move into the mid-first round...



I'd take James White before Shannon...But that's just me.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> I'd take James White before Shannon...But that's just me.


me too...Chicago would love James White...

This may sound silly, but if O'Bryant, Brewer, etc. (the players we expect to get with our pick) aren't there, I WOULD draft James White with the 16th pick or atleast trade down for someone's pick in the 20's and a 2nd rounder. I just don't understand how he's even a 2nd round selection, he should go late FIRST at the worst. He can shoot the 18 footer with CONSISTENCY, he's atheltic as HELLLL, he's a pretty good defender and he's like 6"7, 6"8. He might not shut down Kobe, TMac etc. but he can stay in front of em and put a hand in their face.

Hell can't we trade Sweetney for a 2nd rounder? I want that guy on my team. He's one of those guys that are gonna make you WISH you didn't pass up on him in the 1st round.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

TAKEN FROM INSIDER on TIAGO SPLITTER



> Splitter doesn't have a buyout in this contract this year and his team, Tau Ceramica, has made clear it doesn't want Splitter heading to the NBA this year. The negotiations between Rudoy's firm, Interperformance, and Tau have led nowhere, and Rudoy told me that it was "unlikely" that he'd get the situation resolved.





> If Splitter had a buyout price set and it were reasonable, he'd be a likely lottery pick. He and Andrea Bargnani are the most polished young prospects in Europe at the moment. But without a buyout in place, teams can't be certain when Splittler would be available to come to the NBA. Therefore, teams might be unwilling to take Splitter in the lottery. That's why Rudoy said it was unlikely that Splitter would stay in the draft if he were to declare.


We DEFININTELY can't take a chance on this.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I talked with a guy that knows about Tau's organization and he told me that Splitter extended his contract this past offseason, giving him a higher buyout clause. At some point we didnt believe Nocioni would be able to "escape" Vitoria and we know how that one ended. Obviously there is a big difference between a free agent (Noc) and a potential draftee (Splitter). 

They are hard to deal with those guys over Vitoria. Also, they might lose Scola to the Spurs, so that leaves them a big hole in the frontcourt. But dont fool yourself: they are all about money. If Splitter can secure a big NBA contract in order to pay a good chunk to Tau's FO, it might be possible.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> me too...Chicago would love James White...
> 
> This may sound silly, but if O'Bryant, Brewer, etc. (the players we expect to get with our pick) aren't there, I WOULD draft James White with the 16th pick or atleast trade down for someone's pick in the 20's and a 2nd rounder. I just don't understand how he's even a 2nd round selection, he should go late FIRST at the worst. He can shoot the 18 footer with CONSISTENCY, he's atheltic as HELLLL, he's a pretty good defender and he's like 6"7, 6"8. He might not shut down Kobe, TMac etc. but he can stay in front of em and put a hand in their face.
> 
> Hell can't we trade Sweetney for a 2nd rounder? I want that guy on my team. He's one of those guys that are gonna make you WISH you didn't pass up on him in the 1st round.



Me and you are neck and neck on this one....Cause I swear...I was thinking the SAME thing when looking @ would be available...

That would be crazy to most...But I'd pull that trigger too...lol.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> I'd take James White before Shannon...But that's just me.


James White's just a more athletic Jamal Crawford with a bad jumpshot. He's too afraid to play in traffic despite his athleticism and hasn't dominated the way he should have. Getting kicked out of the Florida program hurts, too. It's a shame, though. If he came out of high school he probably could have been at least a first round pick.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'll say this, though: he could possibly be a late-bloomer a la Sam Cassell.

It could be a good decision to sign him as an undrafted free agent should it come to that for him.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

James White has NBDL written all over him.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Anyone think Bobby Jones could climb his way up to our pick?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Me and you are neck and neck on this one....Cause I swear...I was thinking the SAME thing when looking @ would be available...
> 
> That would be crazy to most...But I'd pull that trigger too...lol.


yep..these folks on here talking NBDL are crazy....

anybody think we could trade OUR pick + Sweets for NO's 12th pick? I doubt it but anything could happen


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Josh Boone vs. Hiltong Armstrong...

What's the consensus on this around here? I've noticed a lot of mocks have Armstrong going before Boone, and I'm not sure I understand why. Armstrong is a year older and, until this year, had been nowhere near as good as Boone. This season Boone was a little disappointing relative to expectations after his 12.4/8.5 sophomore campaign, but he still scored more points than Armstrong and grabbed more rebounds. Armstrong blocks more shots, but Boone is no slouch at 2 per game. Hilton is a little bigger, but not much. What am I missing?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Armstrong's game has improved each year, while Boone's has gotten worse. Armstrong is the better player, but neither is special. I'd gamble on Armstrong if I had to choose. Neither has a good offensive game, but Armstrong's is better. I don't know if he can hit the J, but Boone's is similar to Tyson's.


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## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> TAKEN FROM INSIDER on TIAGO SPLITTER
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We DEFININTELY can't take a chance on this.


Actually, I think you could actually interpret that as being beneficial to us. Splitter's been projected as a lottery pick for the past three years, and if he could drop to us because of his contract, I'd be happy to get a player that's head and shoulders above everyone else we might be able to get with the pick otherwise, even if it means some delayed gratification on its returns. And we did alright with Nocioni's buyout, which I believe was rather difficult, so I don't think the window is completely shut on us being able to negotiate something with his team. 

And even if he doesn't come over this year, we'll most likely draft a big man with the NY pick, and not having Splitter around this season could make us more appealing to FA big men this offseason that we were looking to sign anyways.


----------



## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



jbulls said:


> Shannon Brown declared for the draft today, though he didn't sign with an agent. I believe he's projected as a borderline first round guy right now, but it wouldn't shock me if he moved up during workouts. He's a fantastic athlete and a decent shooter (39% from 3 PT range last year), and scored 17 points a game. IMO, he and fellow Spartan Maurice Ager should be on our radar. I like both and would be surprised if at least one didn't move into the mid-first round...


Really? I think both guys are about 6'3". And while they play taller because of their athleticism, neither is what we're looking for IMO. Marcus Williams from Arizona sounds interesting although I haven't seen him play a single game. Hope he stays in.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rosenthall said:


> And even if he doesn't come over this year, we'll most likely draft a big man with the NY pick, and not having Splitter around this season could make us more appealing to FA big men this offseason that we were looking to sign anyways.


Difference is, Noc was a Free Agent...

I don't think we have the time to wait for a big to come from over seas like the OLD bulls did with Kukoc


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> James White has NBDL written all over him.


Definitely, but he's one of those players if they put it together they could be something special. He's definitely worth the risk of a 2nd rounder or even a late first.



> This may sound silly, but if O'Bryant, Brewer, etc. (the players we expect to get with our pick) aren't there, I WOULD draft James White with the 16th pick or atleast trade down for someone's pick in the 20's and a 2nd rounder.


I like the idea, I wouldn't mind trying to trade down and get Sene and White. I'd also consider Hassan Adams.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Difference is, Noc was a Free Agent...
> 
> I don't think we have the time to wait for a big to come from over seas like the OLD bulls did with Kukoc


If you don't expect to be a contender within a couple of seasons, then we can definately afford to wait for Splitter.

One question I have is if he does hold out (thereby retaining his rights), does the first year of his two guaranteed years start the first year he plays in the NBA, or is he on the same rookie scale as everyone else even though he theoretically would not be playing in the league?


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## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> If you don't expect to be a contender within a couple of seasons, then we can definately afford to wait for Splitter.
> 
> One question I have is if he does hold out (thereby retaining his rights), does the first year of his two guaranteed years start the first year he plays in the NBA, or is he on the same rookie scale as everyone else even though he theoretically would not be playing in the league?


I think Splitter will make some immediate impact as well. Don't pay attention to that Google video clip; it's terrible. I can't say that I've seen anything better, but that video doesn't align with any of the reports out there on Splitter.

As for the holdout question, Larry **** says this:

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#42



> * If the player is already under contract to, or signs a contract with a non-NBA team, the team retains the player's draft rights for one year after the player's obligation to the non-NBA team ends. Essentially, the clock stops as long as the player plays pro ball outside the NBA. Players are not included in the team's team salary while the player is under contract with a non-NBA team.


So, the clock stops as long as the player is outside of it. And the first year of a contract is the first year a player is signed. I think that a player that doesn't agree to a buyout would remain unsigned for a year and therefore does not yet have a contract; the team that drafted him simply holds onto his draft rights.

I wonder what will happen with Fran Vasquez.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

In regards to Splitter - It's not like he doesn't want to play in the NBA....He does. He just doesn't have a buyout negotiated. I honestly think, if he's the best player at 16 (and that may be the case) you have to take him regardless of waiting another year. So the Fran Vasquez worries are muted.

The reality is no matter wo draft at 16, we aren't counting on big minutes from them anyway. SO can we cover the 15-20 mintues he might receive, yes. One thing about grabbing two big men in the draft and atleast one in FA is that you have to still develop them in your system. I actually think it might be a benefit.

In reality, assuming Brewer, Carney and O'Bryant all go before us, Splitter is better and more talented and developed than guys likely to be available: (Sene, Boone, Armstrong and Roby).

I've got no problem with taking him and seeing him sit overseas for a year. It doesn't cost any cap space or a roster space either. Do we need help in the frontcourt, yes. Again, I'm not expecting 30 minutes a game from our #16 pick. 


Go for the best player at 16 (who's not a PG or SF). If you want to take a big flyer - maybe that Thabo Sefalosha SG/SF might be a guy.


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> I think Splitter will make some immediate impact as well. Don't pay attention to that Google video clip; it's terrible. I can't say that I've seen anything better, but that video doesn't align with any of the reports out there on Splitter.


I actually have seen Splitter play about 8 games or so (thank you NBATV and their international coverage). If there were no buyout issues, I have Splitter behind Aldridge and Bargnani, but ahead of Tyrus Thomas on my Bulls wishlist. Since that concern is valid, I would definately stay away from him with the NY pick, making Thomas in my top three.

He definately could slip to our second pick, although NOH has two picks before our second pick, and I think Splitter would be a good gamble for them with one of the picks.



> So, the clock stops as long as the player is outside of it. And the first year of a contract is the first year a player is signed. I think that a player that doesn't agree to a buyout would remain unsigned for a year and therefore does not yet have a contract; the team that drafted him simply holds onto his draft rights.
> 
> I wonder what will happen with Fran Vasquez.


Many thanks for looking that up.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Memphis Tiger's Shawne Williams & Darius Washington are also declaring for the draft.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Memphis Tiger's Shawne Williams & Darius Washington are also declaring for the draft.



nice....that just raises the possibility of a good prospect @ 16


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Chad Ford (Insider) reporting "Next Yao" considering this year draft.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Hopefully Paxson stays away from Reddick. He should draft Steve Novak instead. He is one of the best shooters I've seen in awhile. He's 6'10" so he won't have a tough time getting his shot off. Consider this, he shot over 90% every year in college, as well as shooting above 43% from three every year (actually, 43 was his lowest, about 48-49% would be his average). Guy has game, and could so a nice solid, 10-12 minutes of damage for us. Not with the 16th pick, but maybe trade down for a lower pick or something with someone.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> I'm leaning heavily towards Bargnani right now, he is the real deal in my opinion. I saw some highlights from the game italianBBlover metioned, and I'm extremely impressed with this guy. I think he is the player in the draft with the biggest chance to be a star in the league, followed by Thomas and Carney. I don't want the Bulls to miss out on a potentially great player because we're afraid to take the risk of him not panning out.


I agree completely. I keep reading as much as I can about these guys, and no one seems to have any doubts about Bargnani, or has raised any real red flags. Not true of Aldridge or Thomas. 

I'm not decided on Thomas yet, but I'm very wary of taking Aldridge. No one seems enthusiastic about this guy- pretty much everything I've read has the undertone of mediocrity.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> I agree completely. I keep reading as much as I can about these guys, and no one seems to have any doubts about Bargnani, or has raised any real red flags. Not true of Aldridge or Thomas.
> 
> I'm not decided on Thomas yet, but I'm very wary of taking Aldridge. No one seems enthusiastic about this guy- pretty much everything I've read has the undertone of mediocrity.


Im on Bargnani's bandwagon as well, but I wish I knew Pax's thoughts on him. Im sure there is a lotto team crossing fingers to get Bargnani.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> I'm not decided on Thomas yet, but I'm very wary of taking Aldridge. No one seems enthusiastic about this guy- pretty much everything I've read has the undertone of mediocrity.


I agree completely with this, I like Aldridge's skillset and he has good NBA size, but when I watched him in the NCAA Tournament he seemed to totally lack the competitive fire I want from a young player. The complete opposite of Thomas in terms of on-court personality.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> I agree completely with this, I like Aldridge's skillset and he has good NBA size, but when I watched him in the NCAA Tournament he seemed to totally lack the competitive fire I want from a young player. The complete opposite of Thomas in terms of on-court personality.


Kind of like... Tim Duncan? :clown:


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Anyone else watching Euroleague's final on friday? Another chance to "scout" some interesting players, incluing Splitter.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Anyone else watching Euroleague's final on friday? Another chance to "scout" some interesting players, incluing Splitter.


Thanks for alerting me. I'll definately record it if it's on.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Kind of like... Tim Duncan? :clown:


not really, cuz when duncan's fired up, he WILL scream..it's very rare but I've seen him pumped up...

lamarcus just looks SCARED on the floor..like he's gonna get a whooping after the game


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## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Kind of like... Tim Duncan? :clown:


No, more like Joe Smith or Chris Mihm. :clown:


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> not really, cuz when duncan's fired up, he WILL scream..it's very rare but I've seen him pumped up...
> 
> lamarcus just looks SCARED on the floor..like he's gonna get a whooping after the game


...and Noc's face makes him look confused...
...and McGrady's face makes him look like he doesn't care...
...and Skiles face makes him look like he has a brain tumor...


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## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'd be thrilled to get Splitter at 16 even if it broke out something like this:

20% - He plays next year
40% - He plays in fall 2007
30% - He plays in fall 2008
10% - He never comes

I'm not saying he is Bird, but delayed gratification worked out great for the Celts (and Spurs with Manu and Bulls with Kukoc) and we are not going to have any lottery picks after this year except for the possible nyk swap next year


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> I'd be thrilled to get Splitter at 16 even if it broke out something like this:
> 
> 20% - He plays next year
> 40% - He plays in fall 2007
> 30% - He plays in fall 2008
> 10% - He never comes
> 
> I'm not saying he is Bird, but delayed gratification worked out great for the Celts (and Spurs with Manu and Bulls with Kukoc) and we are not going to have any lottery picks after this year except for the possible nyk swap next year


You and me both! My ideal draft for the Bulls would be Bargnani and Splitter with my main reservation being that both those guys might not be available this year. In which case, we get nothing out of this draft. I'm pretty confident we'll get at least a servicable big in free agency this summer and so having to wait a year or two on Splitter might not be a bad thing. He's still very young and if we can get his rights and have him mature further overseas, in a year or two it'll be (like your wrote) like getting another lottery pick in 2007 or 2008.

I just don't think Pax would ever take that kind of a risk with his drafting (going after two foreign players with the risk of not having either of them play this next season due to buyout issues). I could see him going with Aldridge (safe pick) and then possibly Splitter but I just can see him risking both picks.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The Chad on Bulls Draft Needs from Insider 




_*Projected first-round picks: Second, 16th

Team needs: Power forward, big shooting guard*

Analysis: The loss of Eddy Curry last summer left a gaping hole up front for the Bulls. Curry was the team's best low-post scorer, and no one on this year's team has been able to provide that type of production. Tyson Chandler can handle the rebounding and defense, but someone has to be able to get a bucket with his back to the basket.

*There's no perfect fit for Chicago in the draft -- Texas' Aldridge comes closest -- which means the Bulls might just take the best players available. Sources say they're high on LSU's Thomas as well as Euro star Bargnani.*

The team also needs a big, physical player to put in the backcourt with Kirk Hinrich and Ben Gordon. *Washington's Roy makes the most sense, but taking him in the top three might be a little high and there's no way he'll be on the board when the Bulls draft again at No. 16.* Arkansas' Ronnie Brewer and Temple's Mardy Collins could make some sense with the second pick.

The best course for the Bulls might be a trade. They have plenty of young players to build around. Tyson Chandler, Kirk Hinrich, Ben Gordon, Luol Deng, Mike Sweetney, Chris Duhon and even Andres Nocioni fit that category. What the team really needs are a few veterans who can show the young guys how to win.

If the Bulls could package one or two young players with their top pick and get a superstar like Kevin Garnett in return, I don't know how they could pass that opportunity up._






***

IMPORTANT sidenote: after recently revisiting the *terms and conditions* of posting INSIDER articles - see FAQ - Article Posting Guidelines i have determined that *it is OK to post PARTIAL Insider content as long as it does not exceed 50%* of the article as stated in the FAQ. please keep this in mind. 



> Copyrighted Material – The posting of links to entire articles is appropriate, but posting articles from other sites and sources is in violation of our Board Guidelines as well as Copyright Laws. *It is also illegal to post more than 50% of a pay site's article (i.e., ESPN Insider). Please use your best determination since you have agreed prior to our Board Guidelines* you will be legally responsible for your own posts on this system. Crediting of the source is also always a must.


thanks!


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> I just don't think Pax would ever take that kind of a risk with his drafting (going after two foreign players with the risk of not having either of them play this next season due to buyout issues)


I wouldn't be worried about Bargnani, his team is one of the friendliest. One thing I see with Splitter, if he is unable to work out an agreement this year, he'll definitely will work out one next year, as I'm believe the buyout is not as crazy as it is now.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> If the Bulls could package one or two young players with their top pick and get a superstar like Kevin Garnett in return, I don't know how they could pass that opportunity up.


If it involves two of your core and the Knicks pick, count me out.
If it were one player, one fill in and the Knicks pick, sure.



> The team also needs a big, physical player to put in the backcourt with Kirk Hinrich and Ben Gordon. Washington's Roy makes the most sense, but taking him in the top three might be a little high and there's no way he'll be on the board when the Bulls draft again at No. 16. Arkansas' Ronnie Brewer and Temple's Mardy Collins could make some sense with the second pick.


One of the things that makes Roy so appealing to me is that we'd add quite alot of variety to our backcourt. 
Hinrich, Roy
Hinrich, Gordon
Roy, Gordon
Duhon, Roy
Duhon, Hinrich
We'd no longer be handcuffed to Hinrich anymore. Oh and another thing, with Duhon being rumoured to be having back surgery in the offseason, having another guy being able to run the point is a must.



> Arkansas' Ronnie Brewer and Temple's Mardy Collins could make some sense with the second pick


I don't see either of them falling to our pick, especially Brewer. Collins I really couldn't care for much, as I really don't like him that much, I'd rather look at a project big instead if he were the only option.

How many people would be opposed to trading up our pick to obtain O'Bryant?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> If it involves two of your core and the Knicks pick, count me out.
> If it were one player, one fill in and the Knicks pick, sure.
> 
> 
> One of the things that makes Roy so appealing to me is that we'd add quite alot of variety to our backcourt.
> Hinrich, Roy
> Hinrich, Gordon
> Roy, Gordon
> Duhon, Roy
> Duhon, Hinrich
> We'd no longer be handcuffed to Hinrich anymore. Oh and another thing, with Duhon being rumoured to be having back surgery in the offseason, having another guy being able to run the point is a must.
> 
> 
> I don't see either of them falling to our pick, especially Brewer. Collins I really couldn't care for much, as I really don't like him that much, I'd rather look at a project big instead if he were the only option.
> 
> How many people would be opposed to trading up our pick to obtain O'Bryant?


Trading with what?


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mizenkay said:


> *Projected first-round picks: Second, 16th
> 
> Team needs: Power forward, big shooting guard*
> 
> Analysis: The loss of Eddy Curry last summer left a gaping hole up front for the Bulls. Curry was the team's best low-post scorer, and no one on this year's team has been able to provide that type of production. Tyson Chandler can handle the rebounding and defense, but someone has to be able to get a bucket with his back to the basket.
> 
> *There's no perfect fit for Chicago in the draft -- Texas' Aldridge comes closest -- which means the Bulls might just take the best players available. Sources say they're high on LSU's Thomas as well as Euro star Bargnani.*


That's the first I've heard that the Bulls are positive on Bargnani. Is Paxson hiding his true wishes by talking up Aldridge and Thomas moreso than anyone else? We shall see...



mizenkay said:


> The team also needs a big, physical player to put in the backcourt with Kirk Hinrich and Ben Gordon. *Washington's Roy makes the most sense, but taking him in the top three might be a little high and there's no way he'll be on the board when the Bulls draft again at No. 16.* Arkansas' Ronnie Brewer and Temple's Mardy Collins could make some sense with the second pick.


No mention of Carney here or the possibility of drafting another big.

There also lies the possibility of us drafting a PG with our second pick, that is assuming we have something in the works giving Duhon away in a S&T (Nene, Wilcox, or Gooden). If we do draft a PG with our second pick, look for Duhon to be shipped out.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Trading with what?


No idea, I'm having a tough time trying to gauge where he'll end up on draft day, so far he's around the #12 mark but I don't think he will be for long. Idealy I would like to use Duhon in conjuction with our pick, maybe try to work with the Sonics or the Warriors (comparing with draftexpress, which supposedly has "team needs" taken into account).


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> No mention of Carney here or the possibility of drafting another big.


As much as I would like to have Carney, I think we need to get a combo guard. We just rely on Hinrich way too much and I don't see Gordon getting any burn at the PG spot.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> No idea, I'm having a tough time trying to gauge where he'll end up on draft day, so far he's around the #12 mark but I don't think he will be for long. Idealy I would like to use Duhon in conjuction with our pick, maybe try to work with the Sonics or the Warriors (comparing with draftexpress, which supposedly has "team needs" taken into account).


Honestly, I don't think Du will help us move up in the draft, especially with his back surgery and all. However, for some reason I do believe that Du would be enough to work a sign and trade for Gooden. This is because I do not believe Cleveland is really high on Gooden, while they need someone just like Duhon. Anyhow, the Sonics don't anymore due to the acquisition of Watson, and GS doesn't need a pg either.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Ugh. Yi Jianlian is not entering the draft after all. This might weaken our 16th pick.

http://www.draftexpress.com/headlines.php#1904


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> As much as I would like to have Carney, I think we need to get a combo guard. We just rely on Hinrich way too much and I don't see Gordon getting any burn at the PG spot.


We still have Duhon. Theoretically, Carney would get more of Duhon's minutes allowing Kirk to play exclusively at PG.

Carney could also get SF minutes so Skiles can have Noc and Deng out on the floor together more without worrying about foul problems or rest. He would be taking the Piatkowski/Griffin & three-guard lineup minutes. I don't see how we couldn't get him 20 mpg his rookie season assuming he deserves the time. Then depending on who develops more could make himself or Gordon a hot commodity in trade (maybe to pair up with Chandler in the future depending how our bigs work out) for that proven star.

Balanced lineup
PG Hinrich
SG Gordon
SF Deng
PF rook/FA
C Chandler

All-Defense lineup:
PG Hinrich (or Duhon on the quicker guys)
SG Carney
SF Deng
PF Nocioni (or a rook/FA)
C Chandler

Run and Gun lineup:
PG Hinrich
SG Gordon
SF Carney
PF Deng
C Chandler

Small Ball
PG Hinrich
SG Gordon
SF Carney
PF Noc
C Deng


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

A few notes - It's improssible for any draft site to take into consideration Team needs at a particular spot, since the Lottery hasn't been done yet. One it'sdone and positions are set, I think it will get a little more clear who might realistically be available for us.

I am very excited to hear Paxson or the organization might like Bargnani - but anything and everything should be considered propoganda and smoke screens right now.

Roy gives us flexibility, but we are then taking a HUGE gamble that we can get who we want as big men in FA. There are no guarantees in FA this off-season. Paxson has to draft atleast one big guy. I deally, you want to grab the big first, since they are usually harder to get. Unfortuantely, Roy is probably a better player and ready to contribute quicker than any big we get.

If Brewer, Carney, O'Bryant or Splitter fall to 16 - they have to be chosen. I can see Brewer or Splitter falling that far. Carney will go between 10-14, as will O'Bryant. O'Bryant on potential and the fact he is a big man, Carney on talent.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Sam Smith answered my PICK SWAP question 



> THE ROY : I'm curious to how this works because I've never heard of it before. So if
> NY is as BAD as they are NOW & wind up selecting Greg Oden with the FIRST
> pick, does John Paxson just give Isaiah a call and say "cool, we'll swap our
> #20 for him, thanks"? How does this work, EXACTLY? When do we actually
> CONFIRM the swap?
> 
> SAM SMITH : yes, you've got it


LOL very simple answer but..oh well, it's answered


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

THESE ARE CHAD FORDS WORDS FROM INSIDER :

atlanta has a "JONES" for Andrea Bargnani. THey also say Randy Foye could be a good guard to run with Joe Johnson but obviously they prolly won't be picking that low.

Boston probably will trade the pick because of Pierce's DESIRE for vet's. But they also say Rajon Rondo would be the perfect PG for their system. I seriously doubt they add any more young guys.

Charlotte would love to add Morrison or Bargnani but don't be surprised if they get another big. He says the Jury is out on their frontline & Thomas has more upside than both Okafor & May.

Chicago's best bet is LaMarcus Aldridge but "sources" say Paxson is high on Thomas & Bargnani. He says we'd be better off packaging up some player sfor "KG" though, he doesn't see how we could pass that up LMAO. whatever


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

So it looks like everyone wants Bargnani but no one would say it openly.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I want Bargnani!


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> THE ROY : I'm curious to how this works because I've never heard of it before. So if
> NY is as BAD as they are NOW & wind up selecting Greg Oden with the FIRST
> pick, does John Paxson just give Isaiah a call and say "cool, we'll swap our
> #20 for him, thanks"? How does this work, EXACTLY? When do we actually
> CONFIRM the swap?
> 
> SAM SMITH : yes, you've got it


So we don't have swap rights before the actual draft according to Sam Smith??? That makes absolutely zero sense to me at all, because then we'll be drafting against each other.

NY could take the most talented SF/PG because those are our deepest positions, even if they land the #1 and should take Oden (because they don't want us to have him). We then could draft some guy not even projected to make the NBA and say here you go NY, we'll take the talented guy.

While not knowing for sure or having a source, I would say there is about a 99.9% chance that he is wrong and that the swap happens before the actual draft and that it would be Chicago's decision.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Sam Smith is wrong. Its a pick swap, not a player swap, and once the player is selected its no longer a pick. What a douche bag.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



sloth said:


> Sam Smith is wrong. Its a pick swap, not a player swap, and once the player is selected its no longer a pick. What a douche bag.


I agree Smith has it wrong if that's truely a quote. It's alll moot anyway. NYK wouldn't even pick Oden in that situatuation. They would probably pick a guy they like but thought might get picked a spot or two in front of the Bulls.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Also, it would be the stupidest situation ever for the Knicks.

If Knicks take some really ****ty player who probaly wouldn't be drafted, Paxson would just choose not to swap and take a decent guy. And if Isiah took a pretty decent guy, Paxson could take the guy that wouldn't be drafted, and then swap him to Isiah. 

I don't know where Sam Smith thought up of that, I think he was just answering yes that there is a pick swap because he's lazy.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The 2007 lottery will play out as any other. If the Knicks suc* next year and land the very first pick, a NYK logo will come out from that envelope. 
If the Knicks get the third pick and the Bulls get, say, the 16th, we can have some mercy and dont exchange positions whatsoever. Its up to us. 

Obviously Pax will decide on this matter between the lottery and draft night. The Knicks wont pick for the Bulls.

And dont forget the Knicks might get a better pick than us, so we might not need to call the league to swap picks.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Duke freshman Josh McRoberts has decided to return to school. He was believed to be a first round pick in the NBA Draft this June - ESPN

Not good news, even if you dont like JMc.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Duke freshman Josh McRoberts has decided to return to school. He was believed to be a first round pick in the NBA Draft this June - ESPN
> 
> Not good news, even if you dont like JMc.


Nope, the more lottery potential players there are, the better chance we have at landing someone good at #16.

(I'm not high on McRoberts at all)


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> (I'm not high on McRoberts at all)


He DEFININTELY wasn't ready for the NBA. He needs atleast another year in college. He has some skills & a white guy that LOVES to dunk on anybody in sight is always intriguing lol.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> The 2007 lottery will play out as any other. If the Knicks suc* next year and land the very first pick, a NYK logo will come out from that envelope.
> If the Knicks get the third pick and the Bulls get, say, the 16th, we can have some mercy and dont exchange positions whatsoever. Its up to us.
> 
> Obviously Pax will decide on this matter between the lottery and draft night. The Knicks wont pick for the Bulls.
> 
> And dont forget the Knicks might get a better pick than us, so we might not need to call the league to swap picks.


There's only two scenerios I see where NY could end up with the better pick where we wouldn't want to swap.

#1. NY picks directly in front of us, so we want to free up a couple dollars at virtually no risk (unless there is a date we have to decide to exercise our swap or think that NY is remotely considering someone we are after).

#2. If our projected pick's rookie contract (which we will know the amount after the lottery) and all other salaries on our books add up so that we have more than MLE dollars to spend. Swapping with NY could either put us below the MLE or give us less over the MLE to spend than if we just kept our pick. This obviously depends on who we sign in FA this year and is contingent on how much Hinrich and Noc would command. There would also have to be a UFA that we want that is around a MLE player for this to make sense.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Duke freshman Josh McRoberts has decided to return to school. He was believed to be a first round pick in the NBA Draft this June - ESPN
> 
> Not good news, even if you dont like JMc.


I think McRoberts is helping his stock greatly by this move. He can come back next year and prove to everyone that he IS as good or better than his rival, Hansbrough, and maybe become a top 5 pick. Even if he doesn't, at the worst he'll be like a lottery/mid-first rounder, which is where he's projected to be this year, so nothing much to lose.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Pittsburgh's Aaron Gray plans to the draft

He has not signed with an agent yet. He is huge, but I don't want him for this team, too slow and unathletic, not really what we need.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Chad Ford repeating for the 6326486th time that the Bulls' guy is Tyrus Thomas.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

He probably won't be the PLAYER he WILL be for about 2 years. We get a few bigs this year then he doesn't have to try to do it all. He can take his time.


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> Pittsburgh's Aaron Gray plans to the draft
> 
> He has not signed with an agent yet. He is huge, but I don't want him for this team, too slow and unathletic, not really what we need.


Gray's better than you think. It's hard to average a double-double in non-extensive minutes for a really great basketball team.

He's not going to amaze anyone, but he can be a David Harrison someplace: make the occasional play and be a tough everyday guy when needed. I think he'll get re-signed after his rookie contract someplace.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

For those who missed one of my posts, dont forget tomorrow we have the Euroleague's final four:

Maccabi Tel Aviv vs TAU (11.30 PM ET) 
CSKA Moscow vs Barcelona (14.30 PM ET)


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> For those who missed one of my posts, dont forget tomorrow we have the Euroleague's final four:
> 
> Maccabi Tel Aviv vs TAU (11.30 PM ET)
> CSKA Moscow vs Barcelona (14.30 PM ET)


Any prospective NBA players in the second game? My DVR is going to be filled with basketball to watch/"scout" once the playoffs are over.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> Any prospective NBA players in the second game? My DVR is going to be filled with basketball to watch/"scout" once the playoffs are over.


I dont think theres a lot to watch. Personally, Im going to pay more attention to Splitter, Scola (Another big man to target this offseason; belongs to San Antonio) and Navarro. But prospect-wise, dont get pumped up.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I would love to get Scola, but I think the Spurs want him over next season. He has been one of the best big men in Europe for the past few seasons and he needs his NBA chance now, and I hope he'll succeed. Oberto hasn't made the impact I expected, but he will be better with a full NBA season under his belt.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> I would love to get Scola, but I think the Spurs want him over next season. He has been one of the best big men in Europe for the past few seasons and he needs his NBA chance now, and I hope he'll succeed. Oberto hasn't made the impact I expected, but he will be better with a full NBA season under his belt.


Scola was mad at San Antonio for not signing him this past offseason, and although I dont believe he wants "out", Im sure he would be much more excited to join Chapu in Chicago where there is a big hole at the PF/C spots. 

Still, they wont be able to get everyone: Nazr, Oberto, Scola. I would take the odd man out for the Bulls (probably NM).


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I know someone talked about this earlier, just thought I'd post the transcript :



> John (NYC): Do you think Aldrige would complement Chandler's game in Chicago or does he have too little size?
> 
> Chad Ford: I think Aldrdige would be a great fit in Chicago next to Chandler. He's a pretty skilled offensive player which is what they need. He'll also have plenty of size. He's got a freakishly long wing span. However, from what I hear, the Bulls like Tyrus Thomas. If I were Paxson, Aldridge, Andrea Bargnani or Brandon Roy would be my guy.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I dont think theres a lot to watch. Personally, Im going to pay more attention to Splitter, Scola (Another big man to target this offseason; belongs to San Antonio) and Navarro. But prospect-wise, dont get pumped up.


What do you think about Anthony Parker? Will he ever come back to the NBA? Would he fit in well with the Bulls? I wanted to bring him in a few years ago.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> What do you think about Anthony Parker? Will he ever come back to the NBA? Would he fit in well with the Bulls? I wanted to bring him in a few years ago.


He would fill a need but there is no place for him here. I would be absolute shocked if he plays again in the NBA.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Ronnie Brewer FINALLY declares 

http://www.draftexpress.com/headlines.php#1918

says, if he's a LATE first, he's going back to school. He's late lotto to mid first round..he should be fine.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> He would fill a need but there is no place for him here. I would be absolute shocked if he plays again in the NBA.


Agree completely, he is a big star and he is making too much money in Europe to go back to the NBA.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Chad Ford did a mock draft taking into account team needs, pity i'm not able to become an insider 
Anyone kind enough to paste the top 16? or whatever we're able to do so within the guidelines.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Does anyone know the deal with Cedric Simmons?? I've seen him go in the mid-lottery on some mocks, and I've never heard of him until he declared? What kind of game does he have? Could he help us out next year? Anyone want to give us a prognosis on his game??


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> Chad Ford did a mock draft taking into account team needs, pity i'm not able to become an insider
> Anyone kind enough to paste the top 16? or whatever we're able to do so within the guidelines.


I'll bump this request, always nice to hear what the Chadster has to say.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

TAU-Maccabi about to start.


----------



## f22egl

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

According to the Chad Ford Lottery game, the Bulls board looks something like this

1.	Tyrus Thomas
2.	Lamarcus Aldridge
3.	Andrea Bargnani
4.	Brandon Roy


----------



## f22egl

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Summary of ESPN Insider

1	Joakim Noah	PF	6-11	230	21	Florida *Not declaring *
2	Tyrus Thomas	PF	6-9	229	19	LSU	
3	LaMarcus Aldridge	PF	6-10	240	20	Texas	
4	Andrea Bargnani	PF	7-0	225	20	Italy	
5	Adam Morrison	SF	6-8	205	21	Gonzaga
6	Brandon Roy	SG	6-5	195	21	Washington	
7	Josh McRoberts	PF	6-10	230	19	Duke	*Not declaring for 2006 draft*
8	Rudy Gay	SF	6-9	222	19	Connecticut	
9	Al Horford	PF	6-9	235	19	Florida	*Not declaring for 2006 draft*
10	Randy Foye	SG	6-4	205	22	Villanova
11	Ronnie Brewer	SG	6-7	220	21	Arkansas
12	Shelden Williams	PF	6-9	250	22	Duke
13	Marcus Williams	PG	6-3	205	20	Connecticut
14	Rodney Carney	SF	6-7	205	22	Memphis	
15	Patrick O'Bryant	C	7-0	250	19	Bradley
16	Julian Wright	PF	6-9	220	18	Kansas
17	Corey Brewer	SG	6-8	185	20	Florida	*Not declaring for 2006 draft*
18	Tyler Hansbrough	PF	6-9	225	20	North Carolina	*Not declaring for 2006 draft*
19	J.J. Redick	SG	6-4	190	21	Duke	
20	Luc Richard Mbah a Moute	SF	6-7	215	19	UCLA
21	Tiago Splitter	PF	7-0	240	21	Brazil
22	Shawne Williams	SF	6-9	225	20	Memphis
23	Marcus Williams	SF	6-7	207	19
24	Kyle Lowry	PG	6-0	185	20	Villanova


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



f22egl said:


> According to the Chad Ford Lottery game, the Bulls board looks something like this
> 
> 1.	Tyrus Thomas
> 2.	Lamarcus Aldridge
> 3.	Andrea Bargnani
> 4.	Brandon Roy


Yep, that seems about right. Tried to tell these guys, there was no way Morrison or Gay is on Paxson's radar.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



f22egl said:


> According to the Chad Ford Lottery game, the Bulls board looks something like this
> 
> 1.	Tyrus Thomas
> 2.	Lamarcus Aldridge
> 3.	Andrea Bargnani
> 4.	Brandon Roy


Thanks! I have Bargnani first and Thomas second on my list, but I do think these are the guys we should be looking at with the Knicks' pick.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> but I do think these are the guys we should be looking at with the Knicks' pick.


Agreed.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



f22egl said:


> Summary of ESPN Insider
> 
> 1	Joakim Noah	PF	6-11	230	21	Florida *Not declaring *
> 2	Tyrus Thomas	PF	6-9	229	19	LSU
> 3	LaMarcus Aldridge	PF	6-10	240	20	Texas
> 4	Andrea Bargnani	PF	7-0	225	20	Italy
> 5	Adam Morrison	SF	6-8	205	21	Gonzaga
> 6	Brandon Roy	SG	6-5	195	21	Washington
> 7	Josh McRoberts	PF	6-10	230	19	Duke	*Not declaring for 2006 draft*
> 8	Rudy Gay	SF	6-9	222	19	Connecticut
> 9	Al Horford	PF	6-9	235	19	Florida	*Not declaring for 2006 draft*
> 10	Randy Foye	SG	6-4	205	22	Villanova
> 11	Ronnie Brewer	SG	6-7	220	21	Arkansas
> 12	Shelden Williams	PF	6-9	250	22	Duke
> 13	Marcus Williams	PG	6-3	205	20	Connecticut
> 14	Rodney Carney	SF	6-7	205	22	Memphis
> 15	Patrick O'Bryant	C	7-0	250	19	Bradley
> 16	Julian Wright	PF	6-9	220	18	Kansas
> 17	Corey Brewer	SG	6-8	185	20	Florida	*Not declaring for 2006 draft*
> 18	Tyler Hansbrough	PF	6-9	225	20	North Carolina	*Not declaring for 2006 draft*
> 19	J.J. Redick	SG	6-4	190	21	Duke
> 20	Luc Richard Mbah a Moute	SF	6-7	215	19	UCLA
> 21	Tiago Splitter	PF	7-0	240	21	Brazil
> 22	Shawne Williams	SF	6-9	225	20	Memphis
> 23	Marcus Williams	SF	6-7	207	19
> 24	Kyle Lowry	PG	6-0	185	20	Villanova



Down Carney stock, down! All the way to #16. :biggrin:

I think it would be a really tough decision (for me) between he and Splitter if they are both there at #16.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> Down Carney stock, down! All the way to #16. :biggrin:
> 
> I think it would be a really tough decision (for me) between he and Splitter if they are both there at #16.


Yeah, but if we were sure we could get two of Nene, Mohammed or Gooden in free agency, then Carney at #16 would be an absolute steal!


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Ugly game between TAU and Maccabi, for those first time watchers of Scola, Splitter (injured), it was not good. But both are NBA material.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Ugly game between TAU and Maccabi, for those first time watchers of Scola, Splitter (injured), it was not good. But both are NBA material.


Was Splitter:
injured during the game and playing?
injured during the game and out?
injured previously but playing?
injured previously and had to miss the game?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

He injured his shoulder before halftime.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Remember I talked about Curtis Borchardt? Well, it looks like San Antonio is inching closer to get a deal done for next season. Another big man for them. Ugh.

My advice to Pax: trade for Scola. "Now".


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Remember I talked about Curtis Borchardt? Well, it looks like San Antonio is inching closer to get a deal done for next season. Another big man for them. Ugh.
> 
> My advice to Pax: trade for Scola. "Now".


What makes u think they'll trade for Scola?

And what is it about this guy tha has you guys thinking we NEED him?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> What makes u think they'll trade for Scola?
> 
> And what is it about this guy tha has you guys thinking we NEED him?


Two words: post offense. 

Scola can score in the post with the best of them, and we desperately need a guy like that.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> What makes u think they'll trade for Scola?
> 
> And what is it about this guy tha has you guys thinking we NEED him?


They will trade FOR Scola? Who is going to trade FOR Scola?

I think Scola would help the Bulls. I think people confuse the "we need to get him" or "trade for him Pax" with a player that is the next Garnett. Scola wouldnt be our saviour, but indeed a nice pick for us. He is a good scorer, solid rebounder albeit foul prone. But if San Antonio doesnt want to consider him, I would like to trade for him.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bargnani officialy declares for the NBA Draft. 

http://195.56.77.208/news/?id=64092&redi=


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Randy Livingston of the Bulls will be down in ORLANDO helping Tyrus train for the predraft camps. Good thing about that is, Paxson gets to hear EVERYTHING before everybody else on his development.



http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1284


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I thought he did already, well glad to see he's on the list finally.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

With the 1-4 pick draft one of these guys: Bargnani, Aldridge, Tyrus, O'Bryant (Trade down to get him if we get the 4th pick and these 3 players aren't available)

Trade the 16th pick to Minn. for 36 & 37: Draft Bobby Jones & James White

Sign 2 of these guys: Nazr, Wilcox, Gooden & Jackie Butler



C: Nazr, Jackie Butler, Sweetney
PF: Bargnani, Chandler, Songaila
SF: Nocioni, Deng
SG: Gordon, Bobby Jones, James White
PG: Hinrich, Duhon


This team addresses EVERYTHING we need and would make us a 50 win team.

Hinrich or Nocioni (or BOTH!!) represent us on the Eastern Conference All-Star Team

James White would win the Slam Dunk competition

Bargnani would win the ROTY

Gordon would win the 3 pt. Shoot-out

And to top it off...We snag a player from the Knicks that Larry Brown actually likes, which would force him to play Curry way more, thus giving our chances at a great lottery pick in 07'....Ha....If we get Greg Oden??!!!....We have ALL the pieces we need to be perennial CHAMPIONSHIP contenders

I just got REALLY excited....We are SO close


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Trade the 16th pick to Minn. for 36 & 37: Draft Bobby Jones & James White


What about trading it to Portland, for the 30th and 31st? I think they would be interested in that. We could still go James White, but I wouldn't mind taking Saer Sene aswell if he's still there.

Bobby Jones sounds interesting aswell, but how much better is he defensively compared to Basden?


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> What about trading it to Portland, for the 30th and 31st? I think they would be interested in that. We could still go James White, but I wouldn't mind taking Saer Sene aswell if he's still there.
> 
> Bobby Jones sounds interesting aswell, but how much better is he defensively compared to Basden?



Hey....What ever would net us 2 lower picks....And for those that think we DON'T need MORE youth....I think how this regime runs this team...Younger players are the majority of the players that would respond....Their aren't many established star veterans that would go for some of the stuff Skiles pulls...

Sene...I really gotta SEE this kid...All those measurements are insane...If I see what i need to see in some sort of video...Then...Of course...But really...If I see what I need to see...Undoubtly some other team official saw what they needed to see and they'll snag him much earlier

And who knows how much better Bobby Jones is compared to Basden...We didn't really get a long look at the kid Basden...But I do know Bobby has the backcourt size we need and excels at defense...6'3/4 Basden or 6'7 Bobby Jones...

Size is the issue this offseason...We don't need any more undersized players for their position unless they are special.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> And who knows how much better Bobby Jones is compared to Basden...We didn't really get a long look at the kid Basden...But I do know Bobby has the backcourt size we need and excels at defense...6'3/4 Basden or 6'7 Bobby Jones...


I was just curious, as nbadraft.net came up nothing for Basden, but the following for Jones:


> NBA Comparison: Bruce Bowen
> 
> Strengths: Big, athletic guard that can really defend on and off the ball...*One of the best defensive shooting guards in college basketball*...Tough as nails...Excellent rebounder for his size...Led UofW in rebounding last season...Gifted athlete who runs and jumps with the best of them... Tremendous lateral quickness...Great basketball IQ "Plays within himself" and a motor that doesn't stop... Great in transition and finishes well at the rim... Rapidly improving his jump shot and outside game...Wants the ball in crunch time and hit many big shots for the Huskies...An all out hustler who plays with the kind of intangibles that coaches love.
> 
> Weaknesses: Ball handling needs to improve to play the 2 at the next level...Moving without the ball... Free-throw shooting...Often foul prone, may be because of his aggressive defensive style, but still fouls out too often...Needs to continue to improve outside shot... Not enough attempts to determine how well he really shoots from the perimeter yet and does not have NBA range at this time.
> 
> Notes: Played High School ball with Chicago Bulls Tyson Chandler and were declared National Champions.


He could make a decent backup for defensive purposes, but offensively I wonder if getting someone like Hassan Adams might pay off.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Alright, draft eligibility is officially OVER (as of last night). Our big 3 for the NY pick (to fall in the top 5) :

LaMarcus Aldridge
Andrea Bargnani
Tyrus Thomas

Honestly, if we grab anyone of them, it'll be an upgrade in our frontcourt. I want Tyrus Thomas the most but wouldn't be mad with the addition of any of these guys. They all bring something extremely different to the table as players but all IMO would be good in a Bulls uni. This SELECTION is the BIGGEST and most IMPORTANT step in the future of the Bulls. All of these guys are projects in their own right and probably won't be looked at to be major factors next season also.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Yeah I still want Tyrus the most too ...not as a guy to come in straight away but as a guy who can play behind Drew Gooden and Joel Pryzibilla in the short term - with Chandler Songaila and Sweetney rounding out the bigs 

We need starters and contributors in the front court straight away and that is in free agency rather than the draft ..therefore I kind of think we can go with the guy with the most upside which is Thomas


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Yeah I still want Tyrus the most too ...not as a guy to come in straight away but as a guy who can play behind Drew Gooden and Joel Pryzibilla in the short term - with Chandler Songaila and Sweetney rounding out the bigs
> 
> We need starters and contributors in the front court straight away and that is in free agency rather than the draft ..therefore I kind of think we can go with the guy with the most upside which is Thomas


Yep, read this kid's profile from Draftexpress.com

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=511

I know these are just OPINIONS but it's a pretty good breakdown of his talent and how good he COULD be in the NBA.

It's funny when u think about the big three, how one likes to shoot from the outside (Bargnani), one prefers 10-15 ft jumpers (Aldridge) & the other just LOVES dunks & put-backs in the paint (Thomas). I think we benefit the most from Aldridge & Thomas's games more-so than Bargnani's but he'll probably be a hell of a player regardless of where he prefers to get his points from.

But I can just IMAGINE Tyrus Thomas on a Fastbreak with our backcourt. He'd litterally bring down the United Center with his dunks & we're HORRIBLE on the fast break. We'd get size & athleticism with Thomas, that would address two things we seriously lack. Perfect pick IMO.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Tyrus Thomas is a young Antonio McDyess. And that is a good thing. Give him a few years to bulk up and for him to improve his face up game and he will be an absolute load.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> It's funny when u think about the big three, how one likes to shoot from the outside (Bargnani), one prefers 10-15 ft jumpers (Aldridge) & the other just LOVES dunks & put-backs in the paint (Thomas). I think we benefit the most from Aldridge & Thomas's games more-so than Bargnani's but he'll probably be a hell of a player regardless of where he prefers to get his points from.


Well, Bargnani could fit in here quite nicely, since we already are a perimeter orientated team and all. Teams would actually have to go out and defend him, freeing the paint moreso for the others to penetrate.

I'm having a tough time deciding myself, I've narrowed it down to Bargnani or Thomas, but I can't make my mind up at the moment. Aldridge is a distant third, if the other two are already gone, I'd rather choose Roy.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Tyrus Thomas is a young Antonio McDyess. And that is a good thing. Give him a few years to bulk up and for him to improve his face up game and he will be an absolute load.


I haven't seen Tyrus display anything close to Dice's J yet.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> I haven't seen Tyrus display anything close to Dice's J yet.


That is true, but I wonder how much he'll improve under Randy Livingston's tutelage :clown:
I can already see the benefits of having an undercover brother.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

*My net is borked, ignore*


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> I haven't seen Tyrus display anything close to Dice's J yet.


McDyess didnt have his J until after he started to get hurt. Give TT a couple of years. Its in there.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Yep, read this kid's profile from Draftexpress.com
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=511
> 
> I know these are just OPINIONS but it's a pretty good breakdown of his talent and how good he COULD be in the NBA.
> 
> It's funny when u think about the big three, how one likes to shoot from the outside (Bargnani), one prefers 10-15 ft jumpers (Aldridge) & the other just LOVES dunks & put-backs in the paint (Thomas). I think we benefit the most from Aldridge & Thomas's games more-so than Bargnani's but he'll probably be a hell of a player regardless of where he prefers to get his points from.
> 
> But I can just IMAGINE Tyrus Thomas on a Fastbreak with our backcourt. He'd litterally bring down the United Center with his dunks & we're HORRIBLE on the fast break. We'd get size & athleticism with Thomas, that would address two things we seriously lack. Perfect pick IMO.


Yup. As Pax said :

_ We're going to build with Kirk _

Thomas fits the bill perfectly long term IMO 

Gooden fits with Kirk and holds the fort as our go to guy on the frontline and Pryzibilla fits as the banging man on man post defender and the space zapper that Big Baby gave Tyrus at LSU 

Tyson will likely remain as a defensive specialist only but the aforementioned 3 and hopefully a high pick in next year's draft with the Knicks pick should be our future on the frontline for when we're seriously contending in 3 + years from now when this team will be starting to approach its peak


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Pax isn't taking Roy with that NY pick...get over it LOL...if none of the big three are availible, i'm PRETTY sure he'll trade...

as far as Antonio's jumper....he didn't have that til YEARS down the line when he was injured....

Jordan didn't have a jumper when he entered the league either...what is that really SAYING?


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## Frankensteiner

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> Yup. As Pax said :
> 
> _ We're going to build with Kirk _
> 
> Thomas fits the bill perfectly long term IMO
> 
> Gooden fits with Kirk and holds the fort as our go to guy on the frontline and Pryzibilla fits as the banging man on man post defender and the space zapper that Big Baby gave Tyrus at LSU
> 
> Tyson will likely remain as a defensive specialist only but the aforementioned 3 and hopefully a high pick in next year's draft with the Knicks pick should be our future on the frontline for when we're seriously contending in 3 + years from now when this team will be starting to approach its peak


How would you break down the minutes for Thomas, Gooden, Noc, Przybilla, Chandler, and Songo?


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Although I love the idea of Tyrus Thomas running the fast break in a Bulls uniform, I want Bargnani more. Get Nene and Gooden to play on the inside, and then let Bargnani strectch the defense to the three point line, we'll be in business.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Pax isn't taking Roy with that NY pick...get over it LOL...if none of the big three are availible, i'm PRETTY sure he'll trade...


Yes lets trade the pick, eventhough the player would fill a need. You fail to realise that even with the big 3 up on the board, he could take Roy over them, anything can happen between now and draft day. Some will sink, some will swim, but the workouts play a big role in where a player gets chosen.
But then again, all I was doing was _stating my opinion_, not what Paxson will do.


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## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Frankensteiner said:


> How would you break down the minutes for Thomas, Gooden, Noc, Przybilla, Chandler, and Songo?


We probably have one too many out of free agency , but , we need Gooden's versatility in scoring and we need true bulk on the front line in the form of a strong man on man defender which is why I see Pryzibilla as a fit 

I don't see Thomas playing much at all for the first year or two..strictly odd developmental minutes ..we really don't need to is the truth of it . Let him mature into his body work on his game against established NBA players in practise and beat them out when he's strong enough and skilled enough 

Songaila is off contract at the end of the year and whilst he's a nice player to have I can't see him being kept . If I were him I would not take up the option and go back into the free agency market this year ..he's probably good enough to get a term deal at $3M per on a decent team 

If Songaila stays he likely won't see the court 

Here is how I would see it shaking down upfront 

Pryzibilla ( free agency ) - 22mpg
Gooden - ( free agency )30mpg
Chandler - 20mpg 
Nocioni - 24mpg 

Reserves : Tyrus Thomas and Mike Sweetney ( on the assumption that Darius Songaila does not take up his player's option - if he does then he too will sit in a reserve role ) 

At the small foward spot - Deng plays 30 Nocioni 10 , Welsch 8 ( free agency )

At the guards : Hinrich 35 , Gordon , 34 , Duhon , 18 , Welsch 9

Reserves : Pargo , Brewer ( draft )


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Why Noah decided to stay in school:

http://www.deadspin.com/sports/college-basketball/nba-who-needs-the-nba-170658.php


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> Although I love the idea of Tyrus Thomas running the fast break in a Bulls uniform, I want Bargnani more. Get Nene and Gooden to play on the inside, and then let Bargnani strectch the defense to the three point line, we'll be in business.


I'd personally rather have a CAPABLE scorer in the low-post...not another BIG that likes to shoot if from 25 feet out. Unless he's an amazing shooter, I just don't see how that helps much.


----------



## RayAllenIverson

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Forget about signing those Free Agent Power Forwards like Gooden, Harrington or Nene, when we already have one in place, who could provide exactly what we need. His name is Michael Sweetney. He needs to slim down to 260 pounds and we have our Elton Brand lite version in place. He provides us with pure post scoring beside the offense, which our draft pick (Bargnani or Aldridge) will provide. We would just need a true center like Przybilla, who would be my personal favorite because his mentality conforms with the prevailing standards of Paxson and Skiles. If Paxson indeed signs Gooden to a lucrative long-term deal, he would be in a tough position to resign our own players like Hinrich, Sweetney and Nocioni. Przybilla, Chandler, Aldridge, Sweetney, Nocioni (Songaila, Allen, Davis, Harrington and Schenscher) is deep and expensive enough.

So here's my scenario:

Draft Aldridge with our Top5 pick as Plan A. If he ain't available, Paxson ought to draft Bargnani (Plan B).
Draft BPA at #16 (Brewer, Splitter, Williams or Collins, if they slip to our spot).
Resign Randy Livingston, pick up Basden's option and sign washed up veteran guys for chemistry reasons like Kukoc, Griffin or Davis. Luke Schenscher should get considerations as well.

In 2007, we may still draft a Power Forward (who would be that much cheaper than the 2006 Free Agents) or Oden in order to round up a very deep front court rotation. Hopefully, Paxson will stay as patient as he has been in the last three years and not sign a free agent for the sake of spending money.

My wish for the 2006 / 2007 season:

1) Kirk Hinrich - Chris Duhon - Randy Livingston
2) Ben Gordon - Pick (Mardy Collins or Ronnie Brewer) - Eddie Basden
3) Luol Deng - Andres Nocioni - FA (Toni Kukoc or Adrian Griffin)
4) Andres Nocioni - Michael Sweetney - FA (Schenscher, Allen, Harrington, Songaila or Davis)
5) Tyson Chandler - Joel Przybilla - LaMarcus Aldridge

In 2007, Paxson will evaluate whether the team needs a superstar or if he simply drafts the best frontcourt player available (assuming, that the pick swap option secures us another top5 pick). :banana:


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Maybe I have my stuff wrong, but if the Bulls dont use/waste their cap room this offseason, they wont be able to use it after the 2006/07 campaign. Im not claiming use it just for the sake of it, but we can add some pieces. You can always pull some trades in the future.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Serious question.

Can we use our cap space NOW to extend Hinrich, Noc...ect...

?

I'm sure that would be BAD business in an agents eyes...But would it even be possible or am I missing something...LOL.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Serious question.
> 
> Can we use our cap space NOW to extend Hinrich, Noc...ect...
> 
> ?
> 
> I'm sure that would be BAD business in an agents eyes...But would it even be possible or am I missing something...LOL.


I think its been explained, we only have this summer with cap space. We deal with Kirk, Noc, and anyone else next year. Kirk and Noc will get somewhere between 7-9 a piece, especially if they keep this up


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If the Bulls get to the ECF this season, I think it would be a smart move to try to extend Hinrich and Noc, especially if both were to break out statistically the next season. They could be cheaper this season than the next.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> If the Bulls get to the ECF this season, I think it would be a smart move to try to extend Hinrich and Noc, especially if both were to break out statistically the next season. They could be cheaper this season than the next.


Or either of them can easily suffer a serious injury next year, anything can happen. But in the end I'd rather tie them up as quickly as possible, just thinking about having them on the market just sends shivers down my spine.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

We have a ton of capologists on this board. Im not one of them. I dont believe the Bulls can do anything with Nocioni this summer. I dont think they can extend him. They can extend Kirk this summer, but I think it would be a logistic mistake. Kirk is going to be a Bull and will get his 7-9 M. But we need the cap room to add players. Let Kirk wait a year, his reward will be coming. He knows it, Pax knows it, we all know it.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> but I think it would be a logistic mistake. Kirk is going to be a Bull and will get his 7-9 M. But we need the cap room to add players. Let Kirk wait a year, his reward will be coming. He knows it, Pax knows it, we all know it.


Extending him this offseason won't impact our cap space this year.


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> We have a ton of capologists on this board. Im not one of them. I dont believe the Bulls can do anything with Nocioni this summer. I dont think they can extend him. They can extend Kirk this summer, but I think it would be a logistic mistake. Kirk is going to be a Bull and will get his 7-9 M. But we need the cap room to add players. Let Kirk wait a year, his reward will be coming. He knows it, Pax knows it, we all know it.


I'm about 90% certain that extending Hinrich has zero effect on our cap room this summer. Reason being, Hinrich makes the same salary for '06-07 no matter what (somewhere around the $4M range). His extension doesn't technically kick in until his 5th season, after his rookie contract has expired. Hence, the $7-9M he'll get will only effect our cap situation in '07-08. IMO, Hinrich is LOCK to get extended this summer, but I suspect it'll be one of the final items of business (following free agency).


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Makes absolute zero sense to extend Hinrich this offseason, even if his new contract has no impact whatsover on our cap room this summer.


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Makes absolute zero sense to extend Hinrich this offseason, even if his new contract has no impact whatsover on our cap room this summer.


If Hinrich will take an extension starting at $6.5mil per, I think it makes a lot of sense. Tie him up now to a lower deal than you think a team will offer him as a RFA. I'd suspect a lot of teams would offer Hinrich a deal at $8mil per. Of course Hinrich knows this and will have to weigh potential injury risk vs. his long-term security.

Noc might be in a similar scenerio as is Hinrich, although much less proven. Sign him to a cheaper extension than you think he's likely to command as a RFA. Assuming he carries over this strong play throughout next season, I'd think he command in the $7.5 - $8mil range. I'd offer him a full MLE type extension since there is more risk here than Hinrich (in terms of consistent, proven play).

Of course it's up to the player to weigh the risks, but I think both extension offers are fair and might be something either player would consider. If not, move on and reweigh your options again next season. With extensions, you have to "lowball" players because there's always risk of injury or a player slump that would knock their potential contract down. This is not mangement "dumping" on a player. It's up to the player to decide if he wants to take such risks or take the sure money.

In terms of cap space and financial flexibility because of cap rules, we do not have to do anything with either player (which is what I think you meant). If we don't sign them to extensions, we are likely paying them more money than the extension amount would be (unless they completely flop next year). If we plan on keeping all of our guys with Reinsdorf as an owner, we're going to have to get lucky and retain some players at lower contracts. The only way to do this is to offer them extensions before they can test the open market.

This of course assumes that you could envision both players in a Bulls uniform for the next 4-6 years and have a low likelihood of flopping next season. I don't think either is the case with Kirk and Noc. Players like Sweetney and Gordon you hold out on, because you'll gladly pay them if they perform or tie them up at smaller deals if they don't. Hinrich, Noc, and Deng should be our extension targets out of guys on their rookie deals.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

When talking money, there isnt much difference between paying 8M or 9M. So I think Pax should go ahead and let them play their contract years out (another plus for any player. Although I dont expect Noc or Hinrich to get lazy after signing a huge contract) and take care of this issue at the right moment. If Kirk has a heck of a season, makes the All-Star team and earns All-Defence recognition, you wont be kicking yourself for having to pay 10M for a very good coachable player. 
When factoring risks, injuries, flops, etc, paying an extra 1M is a no brainer. And the Bulls balance is green (positive), dont fool yourself.


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## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> When talking money, there isnt much difference between paying 8M or 9M.



I gotta find somebody wealthy to give me that 1 million difference since it's no big deal...

Wow. Raja Bell has to get suspended for what he just did.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



GB said:


> I gotta find somebody wealthy to give me that 1 million difference since it's no big deal...
> 
> Wow. Raja Bell has to get suspended for what he just did.


There are a bunch of idiots in this league.


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> There are a bunch of idiots in this league.


He let Kobe get into his head.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



GB said:


> I gotta find somebody wealthy to give me that 1 million difference since it's no big deal...
> 
> Wow. Raja Bell has to get suspended for what he just did.


GB, not for us. By NBA standars, theres not much difference between paying 7 or 8 millon. And cheap owner (more or less) aside, we are talking the Chicago Bulls here.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



GB said:


> He let Kobe get into his head.


Did Hinrich get into Posey's head too?


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Did Hinrich get into Posey's head too?



No, he's just an idiot.


----------



## Toxicity

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Hi guys, i've made a little mix on Andrea Bargnani with new footage:

http://www.sendspace.com/file/wqri60

Hope you enjoy! :banana:


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Thanks for the mix Toxicity! Everytime I see footage of Bargnani, I'm surprised at how fast he is for a 7' footer. You can tell that his shooting touch is there, and he should have no problems hitting the NBA 3 pointer. He is still my number one choice with the Knicks pick, I simply don't see how we can pass up a chance to get a player that can be truly special. Nice putback dunk too, I liked how fast he got off the ground on that play.


----------



## andras

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Hi Flash, I bet San Antonio or Detroit are all over this kid. He isnt a lottery pick. And he might be a bit of a reach at 13-15. Now, if the Bulls could trade down I would take this kid at 20. He has serious athleticism and reach, two things the Bulls dont have. And this kid has a real motor. He is sort of a poor mans Tyson Chandler, but will probably round out as a physically stronger player within a year. Huge upside. But I dont think Pax has the huevos, cahones, or guts to be open minded enough to take a flier like this kid. Much more of a Krause type kid. But he will make someone proud. Thanks for the headsup
> 
> If the Bulls want a low level FA this summer to fill out a roster spot like Malik Allen had done, I highly recommend DJ Mbenga from Dallas. Probably could be had for a mil or 2, for 2 years. Not going to be a star, but might be able to give a Diop like effort off the bench.
> 
> Thats my African minute, see you guys next month!


that's your BELGIAN minute!!


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Toxicity said:


> Hi guys, i've made a little mix on Andrea Bargnani with new footage:
> 
> http://www.sendspace.com/file/wqri60
> 
> Hope you enjoy! :banana:


Thanks for the work, Toxicity. The first move reminds me of Nowitzki. 

BTW, remember when Aleksandrov was a lock for the very first pick? Well, since he declared elegible for this year's draft, it wouldnt be a bad investement with a second round pick. Too bad we dont have one. However, I read he had some injuries and that his future isnt as bright as we once thought. Opinions?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> BTW, remember when Aleksandrov was a lock for the very first pick? Well, since he declared elegible for this year's draft, it wouldnt be a bad investement with a second round pick. Too bad we dont have one. However, I read he had some injuries and that his future isnt as bright as we once thought. Opinions?


Yep, I remember that. If we had a second round pick, I would be all for taking a chance and drafting him. If you can get a player once considered a number one pick in the second round, you have to take that chance. I hope he gets a shot in the league, too bad about the injuries though.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Toxicity said:


> Hi guys, i've made a little mix on Andrea Bargnani with new footage:
> 
> http://www.sendspace.com/file/wqri60
> 
> Hope you enjoy! :banana:


Awesome. I especially liked the couple where he was grabbing rebounds in traffic and then dunking it.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Nice vid...

He def looks alot more NBA ready than Aldridge, he's also more agressive offensively and actually LOOKS like he could be a special player.

Thomas is still my #1 though but u can't deny Bargnani's offensive superiority.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Nice vid...


What he said....

Well, I hope the Knicks pick is at least #3. I can deal with the consolation prize of this guy, Aldridge and Thomas.

Bargarini just might be *my guy*. He sure doesn't look like Tskivviditch (sp). Skiles is drooling about landing this guy.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> Skiles is drooling about landing this guy.



And this based on what?


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> And this based on what?


Skiles likes skilled players, shooters and guys that can pick and pop and pick and roll. Don't you think?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> Skiles likes skilled players, shooters and guys that can pick and pop and pick and roll. Don't you think?


There are many players that can fit that description. I think its a little bit early to say Skiles is on Bargnani's bandwagon.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> Skiles likes skilled players, shooters and guys that can pick and pop and pick and roll. Don't you think?


But he also likes hard-nosed defensive players. European players are not known for that.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> But he also likes hard-nosed defensive players. European players are not known for that.


He looked fine in that video. He closes out quickly on help D.

p.s. Look at the bigs picked up last off-season. Allen and Songaila. And the NBDL pickup this season - Schenser. Who do they have more in common with: Bargani, Thomas or Aldridge?


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> There are many players that can fit that description. I think its a little bit early to say Skiles is on Bargnani's bandwagon.


Who else fits that description out of the bigs? 

If it makes you feel better, I was just meant that Skiles must be drooling at this kids skills. Skiles is probably drooling at getting a shot at any of the top bigs given he is playing Malik Allen and Luke Schenser significant minutes.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



johnston797 said:


> He looked fine in that video. He closes out quickly on help D.
> 
> p.s. Look at the bigs picked up last off-season. Allen and Songaila. And the NBDL pickup this season - Schenser. Who do they have more in common with: Bargani, Thomas or Aldridge?


I'd say they have more in common with Bargnani, but only in a shooter from the outside similarity. Bargnani has size over them, seems like he rebounds better, plays better defense, plays above the rim, and has range out to the NBA three. Unless Bargnani totally loses confidence in his outside shot, he will definately be more solid a pro than Allen or Songaila, although maybe a bit worse until he adjust to a new style of game.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Positive from the video: I LOVE the fight for the rebound and dunk in traffic.

Negative: No half court post presence.

I need to see that before he'll be my LOCK for our pick....He's currently my favorite, but Aldridge my serve a better need..MAY...and Tyrus is just so damn intriguing, you just can't teach how he changes the game defensively.

If we don't have a top 3 pick....THEN WHO?!


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

What's the word on Rudy Fernandez?

They make him sound like Manu-lite.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Let's talk about Aldridge again. Who does Aldridge actually remind people of?


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> What's the word on Rudy Fernandez?
> 
> They make him sound like Manu-lite.


Offensively, he plays similar to Manu with probably better handles. He's not a good defender though and only weighs about 180 or so. I was very interested in him before we had Gordon, but not so much any more. Unless we acquire a second rounder and he slips to that pick, I see a number of better options ahead of him for us.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> Let's talk about Aldridge again. Who does Aldridge actually remind people of?


He reminds me a lot of Brand with more length and less size coming out of school.

His scouting profile...
http://nbadraft.net/profiles/lamarcusaldridge.asp

...actually looks quite similar to Chris Mihm...
http://nbadraft.net/profiles/chrismihm.htm

...but I think that only represents a floor type career for Aldridge. I thought Mihm was overhyped and a lot of the positives they were saying about him were a reach. Mihm's athleticism did not impress me at all translating to the NBA game (much like I think with McRoberts). Aldridge's positives sound much more thought out and I pretty much agree with all of them. I fully expect him to be better than Mihm, especially on defense.

The main knock I have on Aldridge was sort of the same knock everyone had on Brand. I don't think he has the potential to be a franchise player (Bargnani is the only big I see with that potential in this draft). Brand is certainly close to if not already at that level this year, however. Add solid pieces to the core or go for a home run... that's the question.


----------



## Toxicity

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bargnani today against Cantù:

18 points (7/14 FG - 4/6 3p)
8 rebounds
2 steals
2 assists
1 block
28 minutes

Finished as 1st scorer and rebounder of Benetton Treviso...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> Let's talk about Aldridge again. Who does Aldridge actually remind people of?


most of the time, Joe Smith

other times, he can remind you of channing frye and chris bosh


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Toxicity said:


> Bargnani today against Cantù:
> 
> 18 points (7/14 FG - 4/6 3p)
> 8 rebounds
> 2 steals
> 2 assists
> 1 block
> 28 minutes
> 
> Finished as 1st scorer and rebounder of Benetton Treviso...


I really hope Pax gives Bargnani a GOOD hard look, if he hasn't already. This kid is not like Darko or Tskitishvili. He's been a regular contributor on a good Euro team...one of the best in Europe if I"m not mistaken. The former two were nothing of the sort, right?

I also fear the Aldridge pick to be another Joe Smith. I think going with him is tempting, but the bust potential is totally there. With Bargnani, at the very least you have an athletic 6'11 guy who can shoot the 3. My ever-changing draft board now goes #1 - Thomas, a very close #2 - Bargnani, #3 - Aldridge. The few video clips I've seen of Bargnani, not to mention the expert analyses and the fact that he's played well against good competition, has really sold me on him.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

And Bargnani also did well in Euroleague. Dont forget that Europe BBall >>> NCAA Hoops. The Italian league is one of the toughest, and this kid hasnt show any signs of being that, a kid. 

If we get the #1 pick, its going to be tough for Pax to pick his guy, among the consensus Top 3 plus Morrison. However, Im sure he already has an idea more or less of what to do with it.


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> And Bargnani also did well in Euroleague. Dont forget that Europe BBall >>> NCAA Hoops. The Italian league is one of the toughest, and this kid hasnt show any signs of being that, a kid.
> 
> If we get the #1 pick, its going to be tough for Pax to pick his guy, among the consensus Top 3 plus Morrison. However, Im sure he already has an idea more or less of what to do with it.


If Pax clearly thinks one guy is the best, I don't see him having any trouble at all pulling the trigger. He has made unpopular decisions before (Curry, Crawford, Rose). 

Also, this draft is so crazy that everyone's board will have a different order. You can't trade down and have any idea of what you will get.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> I really hope Pax gives Bargnani a GOOD hard look, if he hasn't already. This kid is not like Darko or Tskitishvili. He's been a regular contributor on a good Euro team...one of the best in Europe if I"m not mistaken. The former two were nothing of the sort, right?
> 
> I also fear the Aldridge pick to be another Joe Smith. I think going with him is tempting, but the bust potential is totally there. With Bargnani, at the very least you have an athletic 6'11 guy who can shoot the 3. My ever-changing draft board now goes #1 - Thomas, a very close #2 - Bargnani, #3 - Aldridge. The few video clips I've seen of Bargnani, not to mention the expert analyses and the fact that he's played well against good competition, has really sold me on him.


By the way, Darko looks like a stud to me.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> By the way, Darko looks like a stud to me.


The inclination to marvel at Dumar's genious is tempered by the fact that he couldn't convince two coaches to give this guy a little quality time on the floor to show what he has. Maybe the Wallaces made him look bad in practice. Anyway, he's going to look pretty stupid if Darko continues to develope and the draft choice he got in return doesn't compare well. 

Good for Orlando for having the guts to take a chance on him.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> By the way, Darko looks like a stud to me.


Right now, I agree. I'm more referring to Darko from the first 2 seasons of his career.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



McBulls said:


> The inclination to marvel at Dumar's genious is tempered by the fact that he couldn't convince two coaches to give this guy a little quality time on the floor to show what he has. Maybe the Wallaces made him look bad in practice. Anyway, he's going to look pretty stupid if Darko continues to develope and the draft choice he got in return doesn't compare well.
> 
> Good for Orlando for having the guts to take a chance on him.


I dont know why Darko didnt make it in Detroit. And I am not giving Dumars credit or blame. If I were going to take a guess as to why he didnt make it, it might be that he played on a guard dominated team. Brown and Saunders geared the offense towards getting the guards good looks with the versatile Rasheed as the third option. When he got to Orlando, he and Howard were the focus, so he got more touches where he was useful, gained confidence, and knew he would play through mistakes. Basically, they believe in him whereas Detroit didnt. But I can say one thing, Darko and Howard are the PF/C combo for the next millenium. If Orlando get it right on the wings, they are going to be unstoppable.


----------



## Dornado

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

how did Tyrus Thomas become most peoples unquestioned first choice?

Does he really weigh 218 pounds? At 6'9"? 

I understand he's a freak athletically... but does he have enough of an offensive game? Can he guard anybody big in the post or will he just get shoved around? Seems like a risky pick to me considering where we are and what our needs are... (a legitimate PF or C)


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Dornado said:


> how did Tyrus Thomas become most peoples unquestioned first choice?
> 
> Does he really weigh 218 pounds? At 6'9"?
> 
> I understand he's a freak athletically... but does he have enough of an offensive game? Can he guard anybody big in the post or will he just get shoved around? Seems like a risky pick to me considering where we are and what our needs are... (a legitimate PF or C)


Those are my worries about him as well, especially since we already have Chandler.

1a. Aldridge
1b. Bargnani
2a. Splitter (if his buyout can be worked out)
2b. Thomas
3a. Williams
3b. O'Bryant

Those are the only bigs I would take with the NY pick, and there are definately some wings I would think very hard about ahead of Williams and O'Bryant. If we get Aldridge, Bargnani, or Thomas with the first pick, then I think Williams drops way down our draft board below other guys who can play Center (O'Bryant & Armstrong).


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Dornado said:


> how did Tyrus Thomas become most peoples unquestioned first choice?
> 
> Does he really weigh 218 pounds? At 6'9"?
> 
> I understand he's a freak athletically... but does he have enough of an offensive game? Can he guard anybody big in the post or will he just get shoved around? Seems like a risky pick to me considering where we are and what our needs are... (a legitimate PF or C)



People are simply playing chess with the notion of choosing Tyrus.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Dornado said:


> how did Tyrus Thomas become most peoples unquestioned first choice?
> 
> Does he really weigh 218 pounds? At 6'9"?
> 
> I understand he's a freak athletically... but does he have enough of an offensive game? Can he guard anybody big in the post or will he just get shoved around? Seems like a risky pick to me considering where we are and what our needs are... (a legitimate PF or C)


Too many question marks for me, I'd much rather have Bargnani. However, I loved watching Tyrus play in the tournament. His defensive presence was out of this world, people knew that if they tried to drive to the basket he was there ready to stuff the shot. Can he be that kind of difference maker in the NBA? That's another story...


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think measurements and workouts are gonna impact alot of these guys.


Thomas - is he that tall, is he still growing, does he have any offensive game beyond 5ft and dunking.

Bargnani - Is he that good, is he soft, does he have any post game, is he more than a Euro league lover's dream?

Aldrige - Does he have a pulse, is he commited to being a pf or C, is he able to mix it up down low?



Right now, if I'm on the clock at 1, I'm picking between Bargnani and Aldridge. They are two guys that we can't duplicate with the signing of a FA. Thomas is a defensive monster, but we already have a defensive monster and we need alot more than that. Aldridge is a mix between the two and Bargnani would need to mix it up down low a bit more for me.

I feel we do need more athleticism, but we need more than an athletic freak in our backcourt. If we had Curry, I'd be screaming for Thomas. However, we have Chandler and you can't count on singing anyone, so.........Aldridge or Bargnani for me. Neither are the athletic freak that Thomas is (few are), but both do bring athleticism, size and skillz on both ends of the court.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Foxsports Mock

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/5566904?GT1=8192

"if blazers pick 1st, Morrison is their guy"


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Foxsports Mock
> 
> http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/5566904?GT1=8192
> 
> "if blazers pick 1st, Morrison is their guy"


I'd have no gripes at all with Morrison going to the Blazers.

That's an interesting draft board. Bargnani going 8th seems to be stretching it.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Foxsports Mock
> 
> http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/5566904?GT1=8192
> 
> "if blazers pick 1st, Morrison is their guy"


I agree with the mock about the fact that the Blazers probably will select Morrison, but there is no way Bargnani falls to 7... Marcus Williams at 4 seems crazy at first, but what Atlanta desperately needs is a distributing point guard, and Williams is just that. 

I'm a bit puzzled about this:



> O'Bryant is a 7-foot-2 legit big man


What, a legit 7'2!? That's surely a misprint, Hibbert is 7'2, not O'Bryant.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> What, a legit 7'2!? That's surely a misprint, Hibbert is 7'2, not O'Bryant.


Yeah, it's a misprint.  O'Bryant is 7-feet even.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

My french sources like this kid, not as much as Sene long term, but I notice he seems to be quietly, but consistently, climbing up everyones mocks. 

http://nbadraft.net/profiles/oleksiypecherov.asp


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> I'd have no gripes at all with Morrison going to the Blazers.
> 
> That's an interesting draft board. Bargnani going 8th seems to be stretching it.


ESpn has Bargnani going 7th or 8th about a month ago..

that won't happen tho


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I read that Alexis Ajinca, from France, had a very good tournament in Mannheim, displaying great defense and a solid/decent (nothing spectacular) offensive game. Great Wingspan as well. 

NBADRAFT.net compares Ajinca to Garnett, maybe its a stretch, but he seems to be a very interesting prospect. 

Nicolas Batum, from France, was named the MVP of the competition. Great hoops, terrific athletic abilities.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

For the our 1-5 pick...Where does everyone want to pick?

I think picking 3rd is the safest...Less likely to mess up on choosing from 1 of the big three.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> I think picking 3rd is the safest...Less likely to mess up on choosing from 1 of the big three.


Less likely to get the player you'd really want.

I preferably would want like the 4/5th pick, just so we get Roy. But I won't be upset if we get a big.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> For the our 1-5 pick...Where does everyone want to pick?
> 
> I think picking 3rd is the safest...Less likely to mess up on choosing from 1 of the big three.


1rst of course, yeah there is pressure but since there is 4 candidates for the top pick and one doesn't fit, we need to have a choice a t which big will be best, and I trust Pax to at least grab one of the top 2 players in the draft.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> For the our 1-5 pick...Where does everyone want to pick?
> 
> I think picking 3rd is the safest...Less likely to mess up on choosing from 1 of the big three.


I want the first pick, and I'm not sure I understand the rationale for wanting to draft lower.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I read that Alexis Ajinca, from France, had a very good tournament in Mannheim, displaying great defense and a solid/decent (nothing spectacular) offensive game. Great Wingspan as well.
> 
> NBADRAFT.net compares Ajinca to Garnett, maybe its a stretch, but he seems to be a very interesting prospect.


He definitely sounds intriguing, but at 7' feet he only weighs in at 205... He makes Tyson look like Oliver Miller.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I read that Alexis Ajinca, from France, had a very good tournament in Mannheim, displaying great defense and a solid/decent (nothing spectacular) offensive game. Great Wingspan as well.
> 
> NBADRAFT.net compares Ajinca to Garnett, maybe its a stretch, but he seems to be a very interesting prospect.
> 
> Nicolas Batum, from France, was named the MVP of the competition. Great hoops, terrific athletic abilities.


On about page 10 of this thread, myself and flash spoke about him. My sources in France think this kid is just going to be tremendous. He has range on his J, can put the ball on floor and can post up smaller opponents. Though his problem is getting post position against stronger players. He is very long, and like most french players (whose origins are Africa or the Carribean) tend to be mostly athletic and quick. Right now, draft.net has him around 13 next year, id be shocked if he didnt go in the top 7.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> For the our 1-5 pick...Where does everyone want to pick?
> 
> I think picking 3rd is the safest...Less likely to mess up on choosing from 1 of the big three.


#1. Outside of it being good for the franchise, everyone will know who Pax's #1 target is. Unless we have #2 and Morrison is drafted #1, we'll never find out.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> On about page 10 of this thread, myself and flash spoke about him. My sources in France think this kid is just going to be tremendous. He has range on his J, can put the ball on floor and can post up smaller opponents. Though his problem is getting post position against stronger players. He is very long, and like most french players (whose origins are Africa or the Carribean) tend to be mostly athletic and quick. Right now, draft.net has him around 13 next year, id be shocked if he didnt go in the top 7.


And what about Nicolas Batum? I read from a guy that covered this event that there is no way he isnt playing in the NBA down the road. He is an athletic freak, do you agree?

Wow, I think France is becoming, slowly, one of the best ballers producers in the entire world. I know some of these guys arent 100% french, to put it some way, but they have a bright future there. Their National Team should be a lot of fun to watch!


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> And what about Nicolas Batum? I read from a guy that covered this event that there is no way he isnt playing in the NBA down the road. He is an athletic freak, do you agree?
> 
> Wow, I think France is becoming, slowly, one of the best ballers producers in the entire world. I know some of these guys arent 100% french, to put it some way, but they have a bright future there. Their National Team should be a lot of fun to watch!


Yep, they have a lot of talented young players on that team, and they should be competing for the gold at the next olympic games. Just look at this team: 

PG: Tony Parker 
SG: Mickael Pietrus
SF: Mickael Gelabale
PF: Boris Diaw
C: Johan Petro 

That's already a pretty scary lineup, and when you add young players like Alexis Ajinca and Nicolas Batum to that squad, then you've got a great team for the next ten years. The future is bright for French basketball.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> I want the first pick, and I'm not sure I understand the rationale for wanting to draft lower.


Lol.

I don't even know.

I just don't know who'll be better...So I was hoping someone just falls in our lap....Yeah...It's a terrible way of thinking...But I had to have been thinking that when I posed the question.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Lol.
> 
> I don't even know.
> 
> I just don't know who'll be better...So I was hoping someone just falls in our lap....Yeah...It's a terrible way of thinking...But I had to have been thinking that when I posed the question.


I have faith in Paxson's drafting abilities, he will draft Bargnani, the Bulls will win the championship and everybody will live happily ever after. Bulltastic!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The ROY's Big Board :

1. Thomas
2. Bargnani
3. Aldridge


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> And what about Nicolas Batum? I read from a guy that covered this event that there is no way he isnt playing in the NBA down the road. He is an athletic freak, do you agree?
> 
> Wow, I think France is becoming, slowly, one of the best ballers producers in the entire world. I know some of these guys arent 100% french, to put it some way, but they have a bright future there. Their National Team should be a lot of fun to watch!


100% agree on the french team. And they have some nationalized africans on the team that are coming up who are in academy who can compete with anyone at the U16 Level.

I will learn more about Batum. Ill be in Paris for the Champs League final on May 17 and will make a point of snooping around a bit. I have heard the name mentioned more then once as a very exciting prospect, but I cant say I have ever seen him play.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> The ROY's Big Board :
> 
> 1. Thomas
> 2. Bargnani
> 3. Aldridge


That sums it up for me as well.

However, I've been going back and forth on Bargnani. The draft express guys, who from what I've heard are reputable sources, seem to like Splitter more than Bargnani. They've seen alot of both guys, too. I just find it sort of baffling though, because Bargnani is a highly efficient player on a very good Euro-league team. I can only imagine the damage he would do at the NCAA level. Surely alot more than what Aldridge did at Texas.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> That sums it up for me as well.
> 
> However, I've been going back and forth on Bargnani. The draft express guys, who from what I've heard are reputable sources, seem to like Splitter more than Bargnani. They've seen alot of both guys, too. I just find it sort of baffling though, because Bargnani is a highly efficient player on a very good Euro-league team. I can only imagine the damage he would do at the NCAA level. Surely alot more than what Aldridge did at Texas.



Im pretty tight with a few of those draftexpress guys and they are all good guys, and frickin thorough in their research and presentation. I am a bit perplexed on their liking of Splitter over Bargnani, and then again they LOVED Luke Jackson 2 years ago, but I think it comes down to body and athletic ability rather then their game. It does seem that Splitter is "hungrier" for NBA competition where as Andrea could really care less and seems happy in Italy. Thats the only red flag. But any of the 3 picks would be great picks. Cant go wrong. Aldridge is the most ready, Bargnani is probably a year away, more on cultural transition then basketball, and Tyrus can help now on one end of the court and might need 2 years to learn the other, to achieve that McDyess potential we have spoken about.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Im pretty tight with a few of those draftexpress guys and they are all good guys, and frickin thorough in their research and presentation. I am a bit perplexed on their liking of Splitter over Bargnani, and then again they LOVED Luke Jackson 2 years ago, but I think it comes down to body and athletic ability rather then their game. It does seem that Splitter is "hungrier" for NBA competition where as Andrea could really care less and seems happy in Italy. Thats the only red flag. But any of the 3 picks would be great picks. Cant go wrong. Aldridge is the most ready, Bargnani is probably a year away, more on cultural transition then basketball, and Tyrus can help now on one end of the court and might need 2 years to learn the other, to achieve that McDyess potential we have spoken about.


So if we keep our pick, you would draft Aldridge?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> So if we keep our pick, you would draft Aldridge?


I would almost rather have the 3rd pick then the first pick. If I had the first pick I would choose between Thomas and Bargnani. Im not the instant gratification type. I think Bargnani is going to be a match up nightmare in the league. I absolutely love his game. Buuuuuuutttttttttt, the Bulls need freaks. I think Thomas is going to be a total freak. But he cant score, I love scorers, Thomas or Bargnani as a coin flip, but I like Aldridge as well. Frick, its a tough call. All will be good players. Frankly, Im more interested in the 16th pick. I would love to turn that into two picks in the 20s and take Sene and maybe Jianlian.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I would love to turn that into two picks in the 20s and take Sene and maybe Jianlian.


if we can't get the players we want at 16..i'm with you


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> 100% agree on the french team. And they have some nationalized africans on the team that are coming up who are in academy who can compete with anyone at the U16 Level.
> 
> I will learn more about Batum. Ill be in Paris for the Champs League final on May 17 and will make a point of snooping around a bit. I have heard the name mentioned more then once as a very exciting prospect, but I cant say I have ever seen him play.


You're going to the Champions League final? I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little bit jealous, it looks to be a great game with Ronaldinho and Henry showing off their stuff.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I would almost rather have the 3rd pick then the first pick. If I had the first pick I would choose between Thomas and Bargnani. Im not the instant gratification type. I think Bargnani is going to be a match up nightmare in the league. I absolutely love his game. Buuuuuuutttttttttt, the Bulls need freaks. I think Thomas is going to be a total freak. But he cant score, I love scorers, Thomas or Bargnani as a coin flip, but I like Aldridge as well. Frick, its a tough call. All will be good players. Frankly, Im more interested in the 16th pick. I would love to turn that into two picks in the 20s and take Sene and maybe Jianlian.


I think Jianlian didnt declare for this year's draft. Maybe Im wrong.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I think Jianlian didnt declare for this year's draft. Maybe Im wrong.


I thought I read he did. But I do confess, he showed up on next years nbadraft.net board so maybe not. If the Bulls went international with all their picks this year, Id be happy


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I would almost rather have the 3rd pick then the first pick. If I had the first pick I would choose between Thomas and Bargnani. Im not the instant gratification type. I think Bargnani is going to be a match up nightmare in the league. I absolutely love his game. Buuuuuuutttttttttt, the Bulls need freaks. I think Thomas is going to be a total freak. But he cant score, I love scorers, Thomas or Bargnani as a coin flip, but I like Aldridge as well. Frick, its a tough call. All will be good players. Frankly, Im more interested in the 16th pick. I would love to turn that into two picks in the 20s and take Sene and maybe Jianlian.


Why would you rather have #3 than #1? 

It could very well be 2 foreigners for us, but the only scenario possible under those cirmustances IMO is Bargnani and Splitter. 

There is an interview with Sene over Hoopshype.com, nothing interesting but if you want to hear from him....He will be training in Orlando later this month.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Plus if you had the 1st pick you could just trade down for the third pick and pick up something else.


----------



## rlucas4257

My reasoning for #3 over #1 was sort of a joke and sort of serious. With the #1 pick, and 3 obvious guys there, which would be the case, there is alot of pressure to get it right. You take Aldridge and he turns out to be the next Doug Smith while you pass on Bargnani and he turns into Dirk part deux and you loose your job. If your at #3, you take whoever is left and pay them less. Clearly TD is right, trade down to #3 and that might be the best solution. Its a tough choice at #1. 3 good choices. I dont think any are sure things however, and that makes it tricky


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> My reasoning for #3 over #1 was sort of a joke and sort of serious. With the #1 pick, and 3 obvious guys there, which would be the case, there is alot of pressure to get it right. You take Aldridge and he turns out to be the next Doug Smith while you pass on Bargnani and he turns into Dirk part deux and you loose your job. If your at #3, you take whoever is left and pay them less. Clearly TD is right, trade down to #3 and that might be the best solution. Its a tough choice at #1. 3 good choices. I dont think any are sure things however, and that makes it tricky


But IMO its way better to make your selection and not let others dictate who to take. Obviously you can get it wrong, but it would be your own mistake.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I have this funny feeling that Sene will end up being drafted by Isaiah Thomas and the Knicks.

My dream draft right now is also Bargnani and Splitter. 

But I think Splitter will only drop to 16 if teams are really scared off by his contract situation.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> But IMO its way better to make your selection and not let others dictate who to take. Obviously you can get it wrong, but it would be your own mistake.



Ofcourse your right. And you understand that my comment was slightly tongue in cheek. But you get it wrong, you loose your job. Picking third removes some of the pressure. Thats my comment.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

My ideal draft would be Thomas and O'Bryant... but I won't be upset with Bargnani and Sene.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> My reasoning for #3 over #1 was sort of a joke and sort of serious. With the #1 pick, and 3 obvious guys there, which would be the case, there is alot of pressure to get it right. You take Aldridge and he turns out to be the next Doug Smith while you pass on Bargnani and he turns into Dirk part deux and you loose your job. If your at #3, you take whoever is left and pay them less. Clearly TD is right, trade down to #3 and that might be the best solution. Its a tough choice at #1. 3 good choices. I dont think any are sure things however, and that makes it tricky




See....This was what I was sayin'...But I definatly could not put it into words...LOL.

Good to know I'm not half retarded.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

In a draft w/o a surefire #1, I'd probably rather pick 2-5, too, assuming we can still get Pax's favorite guy. Part of it is what rlucas and smartmouf are saying -- making a mistake at #1 hurts a hell of a lot worse than making a mistake even at 2 (note: if we do get the 1, I'm with El Chapu -- take your guy and get the hell out of there, even if all the mocks have him at #3).

My biggest worry about the #1 is the pressure it puts on the incoming player, not Paxson. It's an awful lot to live up to, and it's even worse when we don't imagine the guy is going to be a world-beater right away. 

I'm hoping for #2. Of course, the last time I hoped for #2, it was 2002 and I didn't want the Bulls to get involved with Yao because we seemed set with our front line and we had enough trouble negotiating with NBA agents, never mind the Chinese government. That all didn't turn out well for us.


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## PC Load Letter

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I can understand the logic behind wanting the #2 pick instead, for the reasons stated already. However, there is no way I want to drop past that, for the decent chance that both Thomas and Aldridge would be gone. If we don't come out of this draft with one of them, I will be extremely, extremely disappointed. 

Furthermore, if Roy is next on our list of preferrables, as has been rumored, and we end up taking him that high, I think that's a horrible outcome. Not because I don't like Roy as a player (I think he'll be ok), but because he's not a 3rd -5th overall pick-level player, regardless of the weakness of this draft (partly because I'm willing to put money on the fact that Roy will measure no taller than 6'4").

If we end up with #2, I'd be happy, because I'd be satisfied with either Aldridge or Thomas (I'd prefer Thomas). I think that's as good as you can hope for, by far, in this draft.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



PC Load Letter said:


> Furthermore, if Roy is next on our list of preferrables, as has been rumored, and we end up taking him that high, I think that's a horrible outcome. Not because I don't like Roy as a player (I think he'll be ok), but because he's not a 3rd -5th overall pick-level player, regardless of the weakness of this draft (partly because I'm willing to put money on the fact that Roy will measure no taller than 6'4").


AGREED

I like Roy alot, but any other year in the draft he'd be ranked 7th or higher. Now if we KNEW he'd be a star coming out of college like Melo or Wade, then that wouldn't be so bad. Right now he just looks to be a GOOD player coming into the league, but nothing special.

Thomas, Aldridge or Bargnani will be had come draft day.


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## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



PC Load Letter said:


> I can understand the logic behind wanting the #2 pick instead, for the reasons stated already. However, there is no way I want to drop past that, for the decent chance that both Thomas and Aldridge would be gone. If we don't come out of this draft with one of them, I will be extremely, extremely disappointed.
> 
> Furthermore, if Roy is next on our list of preferrables, as has been rumored, and we end up taking him that high, I think that's a horrible outcome. Not because I don't like Roy as a player (I think he'll be ok), but because he's not a 3rd -5th overall pick-level player, regardless of the weakness of this draft (partly because I'm willing to put money on the fact that Roy will measure no taller than 6'4").
> 
> If we end up with #2, I'd be happy, because I'd be satisfied with either Aldridge or Thomas (I'd prefer Thomas). I think that's as good as you can hope for, by far, in this draft.


I disagree. Aldridge blows. I'm not just basing that on his horrible game vs LSU. I've just never been impressed by him. He is soft. He prefers fadeaway jumpshots over getting physical in the paint. He's not that athletic. I even hate the way he runs. 

Roy will be a better pro than Aldridge, IMO. The fact Aldridge is 6'10-6'11 means nothing to me.

There are only two players in this draft I'd take over Brandon Roy, and they are Thomas and Bargnani. 

Thomas
Bargnani
Roy

Those are the only 3 players I'm interested in with the Knicks pick. If we don't get one of them, I'll be disappointed. I'd rather trade our pick if those 3 are gone.


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SALO said:


> I even hate the way he runs.


Lol. I thought I was the only one to notice his bizare running style. He kind of prances down the court with his arms flapping uselessly by his side.


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



PC Load Letter said:


> I can understand the logic behind wanting the #2 pick instead, for the reasons stated already. However, there is no way I want to drop past that, for the decent chance that both Thomas and Aldridge would be gone. If we don't come out of this draft with one of them, I will be extremely, extremely disappointed.
> 
> Furthermore, if Roy is next on our list of preferrables, as has been rumored, and we end up taking him that high, I think that's a horrible outcome. Not because I don't like Roy as a player (I think he'll be ok), but because he's not a 3rd -5th overall pick-level player, regardless of the weakness of this draft (partly because I'm willing to put money on the fact that Roy will measure no taller than 6'4").
> 
> If we end up with #2, I'd be happy, because I'd be satisfied with either Aldridge or Thomas (I'd prefer Thomas). I think that's as good as you can hope for, by far, in this draft.


Hmm, I'd wager that Roy is at least 6' 5.5" with shoes.


----------



## Greg Ostertag!

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I like the cut of Brandon Roy's jib.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



PC Load Letter said:


> I can understand the logic behind wanting the #2 pick instead, for the reasons stated already. However, there is no way I want to drop past that, for the decent chance that both Thomas and Aldridge would be gone. If we don't come out of this draft with one of them, I will be extremely, extremely disappointed.
> 
> Furthermore, if Roy is next on our list of preferrables, as has been rumored, and we end up taking him that high, I think that's a horrible outcome. Not because I don't like Roy as a player (I think he'll be ok), but because he's not a 3rd -5th overall pick-level player, regardless of the weakness of this draft (partly because I'm willing to put money on the fact that Roy will measure no taller than 6'4").
> 
> If we end up with #2, I'd be happy, because I'd be satisfied with either Aldridge or Thomas (I'd prefer Thomas). I think that's as good as you can hope for, by far, in this draft.


If Roy measures out under 6'5, I'll be even more opposed to drafting him with the Knicks pick than I am now. The need for size and scoring in the frontcourt is much larger than the need for a big guard in my opinion, and I would still love to get Pietrus with the #16 pick if the Chris Mullin is crazy enough to pull the trigger. I liked what I saw from Roy in the NCAA tournament, but I'm not sure he's going to be anything more than a good player. When you factor that in with the fact that we have the opportunity to draft a couple of players with absolute superstar potential, then I think it's a no brainer. Bargnani and Thomas are still the two players I think we should go after, and I think Pax feels the same way.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

El Chapu pointed out the Sene interview on hoopshype and thought it would be pertinent to post it here. 3 Things I got from this short interview:

Look at the picture of the kid in the interview. Its a relatively small picture so not alot can be determined by it, but it does appear his arms go on forever. Its been said that he would have the biggest wingspan in the NBA, that little picture proves its atleast close.

Second thing, the kid has only played basketball for 3 years and one year was basically pickup ball in Senegal. For him to be the most dominant player against one of the best HS classes in history, particularly upfront, is mouth watering. Hakeems greatest strength coming out of the University of Houston was that he had only 4 years of organized basketball (3 in Houston and one in Nigeria), this kid, while not Hakeem, could have a huge upside because of it. Proper coaching could mold him. 

This kid seems like he is all about hard work. He was going to become a mechanic before he became a basketball player. He talks about challenges and how he is ready for anything. He talks about adapting to life outside of his country. Its not about the money for him as his family apparently isnt poor. Sounds like he just wants the challenge of the league and is willing to work hard at it. And there is apparently no buyout issues with Chaleroi. 

http://hoopshype.com/interviews/sene_sierra.htm


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## unBULLievable

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

ummm.......Sene does not play for Charleroi

Pepinster is the team he plays for


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



unBULLievable said:


> ummm.......Sene does not play for Charleroi
> 
> Pepinster is the team he plays for



I believe he is under contract to Charleroi and was loaned to Pepinster this year, which is not uncommon in European sports. Usually done to give younger players a chance to gain experience for a team that might be lesser or could provide playing time for that player. For instance, early in David Beckhams career, Manchester United loaned him to some rinky dink little club just so he could get field time. The interview talks about the buyout with Charleroi, not Pepinster, so that has to be the only explanation.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> Second thing, the kid has only played basketball for 3 years and one year was basically pickup ball in Senegal. For him to be the most dominant player against one of the best HS classes in history, particularly upfront, is mouth watering..


That performance was definitely eye opening, not that I saw it anyways. But considering everyone has been talking about it, he's definitely somebody we should consider with our pick. I'm not even worried if he doesn't develop any offensive moves, I can easily see him being more of a factor on the defensive end than Chandler.


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## Toxicity

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Im pretty tight with a few of those draftexpress guys and they are all good guys, and frickin thorough in their research and presentation. I am a bit perplexed on their liking of Splitter over Bargnani, and then again they LOVED Luke Jackson 2 years ago, but I think it comes down to body and athletic ability rather then their game. It does seem that Splitter is "hungrier" for NBA competition where as Andrea could really care less and seems happy in Italy. Thats the only red flag. But any of the 3 picks would be great picks. Cant go wrong. Aldridge is the most ready, Bargnani is probably a year away, more on cultural transition then basketball, and Tyrus can help now on one end of the court and might need 2 years to learn the other, to achieve that McDyess potential we have spoken about.


1) "draftexpress guys seem to like Splitter more than Bargnani": what does this sentence mean?!? Are you referring to posters, draftexpress scouters or whoever? Anyway n their mock they have Bargnani as 4th man picked and Splitter as 7th.

2) Splitter is probably better as real big man and play better defense right now but about upside there's no doubt who's better and also Draftexpress shows it.

3) "It does seem that Splitter is "hungrier" for NBA competition where as Andrea could really care less and seems happy in Italy." I don't know about Tiago but i can safely say Andrea Bargnani WANTS to play in NBA next year, so no problems here.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Toxicity said:


> 1) "draftexpress guys seem to like Splitter more than Bargnani": what does this sentence mean?!? Are you referring to posters, draftexpress scouters or whoever? Anyway n their mock they have Bargnani as 4th man picked and Splitter as 7th.
> 
> 2) Splitter is probably better as real big man and play better defense right now but about upside there's no doubt who's better and also Draftexpress shows it.
> 
> 3) "It does seem that Splitter is "hungrier" for NBA competition where as Andrea could really care less and seems happy in Italy." I don't know about Tiago but i can safely say Andrea Bargnani WANTS to play in NBA next year, so no problems here.


1) they might have Bargnani higher, but they tend to be far more critical of Bargnani then Splitter in their commentary. They have Splitter higher then just about everyone else

2) See #1. 

3) Read Bargnanis comments. He doesnt seem all that excited about the U S of A and was undecided to declare until fairly recently, saying he was unsure. Splitter has made his intentions known for 3 years, by declaring.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> El Chapu pointed out the Sene interview on hoopshype and thought it would be pertinent to post it here. 3 Things I got from this short interview:
> 
> Look at the picture of the kid in the interview. Its a relatively small picture so not alot can be determined by it, but it does appear his arms go on forever. Its been said that he would have the biggest wingspan in the NBA, that little picture proves its atleast close.
> 
> Second thing, the kid has only played basketball for 3 years and one year was basically pickup ball in Senegal. For him to be the most dominant player against one of the best HS classes in history, particularly upfront, is mouth watering. Hakeems greatest strength coming out of the University of Houston was that he had only 4 years of organized basketball (3 in Houston and one in Nigeria), this kid, while not Hakeem, could have a huge upside because of it. Proper coaching could mold him.
> 
> This kid seems like he is all about hard work. He was going to become a mechanic before he became a basketball player. He talks about challenges and how he is ready for anything. He talks about adapting to life outside of his country. Its not about the money for him as his family apparently isnt poor. Sounds like he just wants the challenge of the league and is willing to work hard at it. And there is apparently no buyout issues with Chaleroi.
> 
> http://hoopshype.com/interviews/sene_sierra.htm



This Sene guy sounds tempting with 'the game' and his ridiculous wingspan, but I must say, I"m usually pretty skeptical these types of draft prospects. 

I mean, he's obviously built like a condor, which is great, but can the guy even play basketball? Outside of his one game at the hoops summit, it looks like he's a very marginal player on a lower level European team. His situation kind of strikes me as a cross between Jonathan Bender and Skita. He's a guy who's doing very little for an insignificant european team, and his draft stock shot up disproportionately due to one performance at an all-star game. 

Also, didn't Olumide Oyediji become a draftnik darling by dominating at the Hoops Summit? And Vladimir Radmonovic? 

And over the past five years, there doesn't seem to be a particularly good track record of taking these uber-unpolished 'diamonds in the rough' from far away lands. I think people like to fall in love with the fact that these guys have only played basketball for X amount of years, or that they come from some esoteric African tribe, or weigh so much, or have necks that are so long that they wind up not being able to see the forest for the trees with these kinds of guys. 

Obviously Sene is his own player and needs to be evaluated objectively, but without having seen him play, I'd say that there's a bit of evidence and past trends that are working against him. He sounds like he's more Sagana Diop than Hakeem Olajuwon.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rosenthall said:


> This Sene guy sounds tempting with 'the game' and his ridiculous wingspan, but I must say, I"m usually pretty skeptical these types of draft prospects.
> 
> I mean, he's obviously built like a condor, which is great, but can the guy even play basketball? Outside of his one game at the hoops summit, it looks like he's a very marginal player on a lower level European team. His situation kind of strikes me as a cross between Jonathan Bender and Skita. He's a guy who's doing very little for an insignificant european team, and his draft stock shot up disproportionately due to one performance at an all-star game.
> 
> Also, didn't Olumide Oyediji become a draftnik darling by dominating at the Hoops Summit? And Vladimir Radmonovic?
> 
> And over the past five years, there doesn't seem to be a particularly good track record of taking these uber-unpolished 'diamonds in the rough' from far away lands. I think people like to fall in love with the fact that these guys have only played basketball for X amount of years, or that they come from some esoteric African tribe, or weigh so much, or have necks that are so long that they wind up not being able to see the forest for the trees with these kinds of guys.
> 
> Obviously Sene is his own player and needs to be evaluated objectively, but without having seen him play, I'd say that there's a bit of evidence and past trends that are working against him. He sounds like he's more Sagana Diop than Hakeem Olajuwon.



The Olumide comparison and story is valid. And your right, he needs to be judged on his own merits. I think if he were a Diop then we would be happy, since Diop has actually developed into a competent big guy in the league. Radmonovic too. And Id also like to point out that his production for his club is getting stronger everyday. But this might be the case of a guy who had a good weekend in the US and parlays it in a big contract. But then again, Joakim Noah was a second round pick before 6 games made him into a near franchise player, so there should be that fear there as well. But I agree, the odds are against him and that the draftniks, like me, love guys like this. But when one of these guys hit, like a Scottie Pippen, or a Joe Dumars, or a Pau Gasol or Dirk Notwizki (who came from a very poor league), the returns can be huge. The kid has the physical qualities and it sounds like he has it between the ears. He needs to be studied and very diligently so. Right now, he is going 20-25. But I think he shoots way up, or way down, on his workouts. He will either be picked 40, or 10. His stock will be volatile.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

does he really have a 40 inch vertical with that ridiculous wing span? AND height....NO WAY he lasts til the 16th if he does...lol


----------



## Toxicity

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> 1) they might have Bargnani higher, but they tend to be far more critical of Bargnani then Splitter in their commentary. They have Splitter higher then just about everyone else


It doesn't mean Splitter is a better pick than Bargnani for draftexpress. Simply Tiago is readier right now (probably but i'm not so sure)...



> 3) Read Bargnanis comments. He doesnt seem all that excited about the U S of A and was undecided to declare until fairly recently, saying he was unsure. Splitter has made his intentions known for 3 years, by declaring.


I'm from Italy, i think to know his situation better than you...

The fact Splitter has declared 3 times and Bargnani 1 can be the sign that Andrea wanted to improve in Euroleague before going in NBA while Tiago thought to be ready 3 years ago (or just wanted to show his name to scouts)... after many busts in recent years i totally agree with Bargnani's decision.

But, believe me, NBA is Andrea's great dream. In fact he's italian but doesn't like soccer... i've said all!


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Toxicity said:


> It doesn't mean Splitter is a better pick than Bargnani for draftexpress. Simply Tiago is readier right now (probably but i'm not so sure)...
> 
> 
> 
> I'm from Italy, i think to know his situation better than you...
> 
> The fact Splitter has declared 3 times and Bargnani 1 can be the sign that Andrea wanted to improve in Euroleague before going in NBA while Tiago thought to be ready 3 years ago (or just wanted to show his name to scouts)... after many busts in recent years i totally agree with Bargnani's decision.
> 
> But, believe me, NBA is Andrea's great dream. In fact he's italian but doesn't like soccer... i've said all!


Tiago's declared three times, pulled out three times, but the main issue each year has always been buyout issues. Teams were willing to take him as high as the lottery in 2004 (and he'd probably be way better than Robert Swift or Kris Humphries), according to pre-draft reports (I think), but it was the buyout issues that scared teams away in the height of the luxury-tax era. 

The fact is, he's going to be a real defensive presence. It might sound like a bad comparison, but I think he could be a Zaza except with more intensity. But Zaza was almost 12 and 8 in his first season of significant minutes, and is still getting better. I think Splitter could come in averaging 10 and 8 in 26 mpg from the PF spot, much more impressive than Songaila's 9 and 4 in 21 mpg, and I think Songaila's our best PF.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Toxicity said:


> But, believe me, NBA is Andrea's great dream. In fact he's italian but doesn't like soccer... i've said all!


An Italian who doesn't like soccer... Now I've heard it all, I bet he reads Playboy for the articles as well? :biggrin:


----------



## Toxicity

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> An Italian who doesn't like soccer... Now I've heard it all, I bet he reads Playboy for the articles as well? :biggrin:


You're right... :biggrin: 

Seriously, it's also strange because he's from Rome (with 2 big soccer teams like Lazio and Roma in the city!)... but i'm with Andrea because it seems we have only soccer in Italy (media attention, tv rights, etc.) but it's not true! :curse:


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> An Italian who doesn't like soccer... Now I've heard it all, I bet he reads Playboy for the articles as well? :biggrin:



The italians which don't like soccer are many more than someone can think oversea.

Basketbal lovers are 8-9 milions, not a bad number (on 58 milions souls) :banana:


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Just looking at the latest nbadraft.net mock. They have us selecting Aldridge at 2 and Brewer at 16 which would be great, but they also have Splitter fall lower than 16.

If we were to draft Aldridge and Splitter, I think this would be an awesome draft. That would do a lot to beef up our frontcourt for the years to come.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



laso said:


> Just looking at the latest nbadraft.net mock. They have us selecting Aldridge at 2 and Brewer at 16 which would be great, but they also have Splitter fall lower than 16.
> 
> If we were to draft Aldridge and Splitter, I think this would be an awesome draft. That would do a lot to beef up our frontcourt for the years to come.



Gotta agree - Aldridge and Brewer, Aldridge and Splitter, or Aldridge and Sene (After a trade down maybe possible)?

Would all be very good drafts (atleast on paper).

I'd also be happy with Thomas or Barganani instead of Aldridge.


----------



## Cyanobacteria

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Hmm, I'd wager that Roy is at least 6' 5.5" with shoes.


What if Roy grows out a Gumbi fade for the draft camp and measures anywhere from 6'4" to 6'6" depending on which side of his head you measure, then where do we take him? :biggrin: 

I'm afraid it's a bad sign when I'm leaning towards wanting the guys that I've never seen play.

One word for this draft: nebulous.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I read that Alexis Ajinca, from France, had a very good tournament in Mannheim, displaying great defense and a solid/decent (nothing spectacular) offensive game. Great Wingspan as well.
> 
> NBADRAFT.net compares Ajinca to Garnett, maybe its a stretch, but he seems to be a very interesting prospect.
> 
> Nicolas Batum, from France, was named the MVP of the competition. Great hoops, terrific athletic abilities.


I just read a new Draftexpress article about the tournament, that has this picture of Ajinca. He has extremely long arms and he's also very skinny, but he's definitely someone to keep an eye on for the future:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> I just read a new Draftexpress article about the tournament, that has this picture of Ajinca. He has extremely long arms and he's also very skinny, but he's definitely someone to keep an eye on for the future:


it look liike that guy weighs no more than 46 1/2 lbs soaking WET


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> it look liike that guy weighs no more than 46 1/2 lbs soaking WET


:rofl:


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> it look liike that guy weighs no more than 46 1/2 lbs soaking WET


cmon, atleast 51.28 lbs!


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> it look liike that guy weighs no more than 46 1/2 lbs soaking WET


He definately makes Noah not look so small, or Chandler for that matter.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

So that's Ajinca eh? He is damn skinny, but look at those hands. He makes that basketball look like a softball and it looks like he does have really long arms. He's kinda thin in the shoulders and I'm not sure how much weight he'll be able to add, but he's definatly one to watch over the next year or so to see how he progresses.

As an aside, when do workouts start? All the non-lottery spots are already known and even teams like the Trailblazers (who pick no worse than fourth) and the Bulls (no worse than fifth) could start looking at lottery and non-lottery players now. Also, if there are any Bulls employees who might wander across this, I'd really like to see something more from Bulls.com this summer in terms of the workouts being run. Maybe some short clips of the players running drills and such and maybe a quickie interview asking them softball type questions. Actually, pretty much anything from Bulls.com would be better than what has historically been available. C'mon guys - at least get into the 90's with how things are presented on your website!


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> So that's Ajinca eh? He is damn skinny, but look at those hands. He makes that basketball look like a softball and it looks like he does have really long arms. He's kinda thin in the shoulders and I'm not sure how much weight he'll be able to add, but he's definatly one to watch over the next year or so to see how he progresses.
> 
> As an aside, when do workouts start? All the non-lottery spots are already known and even teams like the Trailblazers (who pick no worse than fourth) and the Bulls (no worse than fifth) could start looking at lottery and non-lottery players now. Also, if there are any Bulls employees who might wander across this, I'd really like to see something more from Bulls.com this summer in terms of the workouts being run. Maybe some short clips of the players running drills and such and maybe a quickie interview asking them softball type questions. Actually, pretty much anything from Bulls.com would be better than what has historically been available. C'mon guys - at least get into the 90's with how things are presented on your website!



The one thing about that article in terms of Ajinca was that the writer, who works for Spanish newspapers or TV, said Ajinca had no weakness outside of strength. I think he said all of his weaknesses were strength derived. They talked about his ability to play facing the basket, his tremendous versatility and coordination and his ability, with a condor like wingspan, to block a ton of shots at the rim. Obviously Oden is the guy to focus on next year (I agree with draft.net, he is the next David Robinson), but Ajinca moves to that list of other guys to keep a serious eye on


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The one thing about that article in terms of Ajinca was that the writer, who works for Spanish newspapers or TV, said Ajinca had no weakness outside of strength. I think he said all of his weaknesses were strength derived. They talked about his ability to play facing the basket, his tremendous versatility and coordination and his ability, with a condor like wingspan, to block a ton of shots at the rim. Obviously Oden is the guy to focus on next year (I agree with draft.net, he is the next David Robinson), but Ajinca moves to that list of other guys to keep a serious eye on


Looks like he plays for the worst team in the french league - by far the worst team. From what I could gather from looking at the boxscores he looks like he holds his own, for the most part. Shoots a decent percentage, rebounds well and blocks shots. He's getting minutes, that's for sure. OK at the line and even hits the occasional three pointer. All that at 17/18 years old against men. It also looked like he missed a chunk of the season (at least he wasn't listed in the boxscores)... Was he hurt and if so, what was the injury? I'm gonna try and make a point of following up on this guy next year and see if he has picked up his game and also picked up his team in the process. (And hopefully he's picked up a few pounds also!)


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> Looks like he plays for the worst team in the french league - by far the worst team. From what I could gather from looking at the boxscores he looks like he holds his own, for the most part. Shoots a decent percentage, rebounds well and blocks shots. He's getting minutes, that's for sure. OK at the line and even hits the occasional three pointer. All that at 17/18 years old against men. It also looked like he missed a chunk of the season (at least he wasn't listed in the boxscores)... Was he hurt and if so, what was the injury? I'm gonna try and make a point of following up on this guy next year and see if he has picked up his game and also picked up his team in the process. (And hopefully he's picked up a few pounds also!)



INSEP is a basketball academy. Basically it serves as a youth team and they play against men in the league. They are always at the bottom of the league. But Tony Parker got his start there, and so did Mickael Gelabale I believe (this guy is awesome, how he lasted to the 2nd round last year is beyond me). They have a good reputation for teaching. I am sure their intent is to win games, but not above training their players. I think you are right on the stat lines, I havent really checked. And we will have to figure out why there is a dark period of no PT on his record (after seeing that picture, we can be sure he wasnt suspended for steroid use). Certainly one of the 5-8 guys who come after Oden next year however. Looks like a versatile young kid.


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## mw2889

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*









Why does it look like that ball was donated to them, lol.


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## Rodman

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> Also, if there are any Bulls employees who might wander across this, I'd really like to see something more from Bulls.com this summer in terms of the workouts being run. Maybe some short clips of the players running drills and such and maybe a quickie interview asking them softball type questions. Actually, pretty much anything from Bulls.com would be better than what has historically been available. C'mon guys - at least get into the 90's with how things are presented on your website!


I had a thread about that last year and there was an answer from this 'Flick' guy who told us basically to wait and see a lot would happen to the side... I guess he's still working on it though, b/c nothing seriously happened and the site is still boring as hell. Maybe we should SPAM the hell out of them to finally do something about the site. 

And yes it would be real nice to see some stuff about the workouts and the players working out!


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

if the search function was working i would bump *"bulls.com is boring"* cause it is still a total snoozefest, just so archaic in design and functionality...anyway...i am hoping that we get reports on the guys working out prior to the draft (in addition to reports thru the summer about our players).


*i ask the same question flash does - when do individual draft workouts begin?*


also - some KEY dates to mark down are *May 23rd* draft lottery, *June 6-10* draft camp in Orlando, and *June 28th* NBA Draft at MSG.


when we get reports on individuals working out at Berto, i think a separate thread should/will be created.


----------



## Toxicity

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bargnani yesterday (easy win against Snaidero Udine):

15 pts (6/10 FG - 2/4 3p - 1/1 FT)
3 rebs
3 ast
2 stl
21 min

Foul troubles prevented him to play more minutes and better as too often happened... anyway a good game with a couple of outstanding moves for his size (baseline dunk, jump shot off the dribble)...


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Draft Express has an article on Marquinhos. Do you look at a guy like this at #16? Don't know much about him. Sounds like he needs the ball quite a bit to be effective. From what I've read over the past year or so, he seems like a scorer who isn't all that interested in defense. He's bulked up quite a bit though. Sure would add length to the team and one of his strong suits is that of a skilled ballhandler (at 6'10" to boot!). Might be the type of player that allows someone else to drop a bit?


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> Draft Express has an article on Marquinhos. Do you look at a guy like this at #16? Don't know much about him. Sounds like he needs the ball quite a bit to be effective. From what I've read over the past year or so, he seems like a scorer who isn't all that interested in defense. He's bulked up quite a bit though. Sure would add length to the team and one of his strong suits is that of a skilled ballhandler (at 6'10" to boot!). Might be the type of player that allows someone else to drop a bit?


He is really a versatile player. When you look at him, the guy who he reminds you of right away is Detlef Shrempf. Same size, at that same age. Great handles. Great shooter. More athletic then Detlef. I wouldnt really call him a scorer or a guy who dominates the ball (he really is pretty good at shooting off screens and spotting up). Always have to question defense, I agree. But he has the tools to be a very damn good defender. Long, moves his feet well, and that Brazilian pedigree. Almost all of the Brazilians are atleast competent defenders. Nene was pretty good, Barbosa is tremendous, Varajao is good, even that kid up in Toronto is ok. I think this kid is a major sleeper. He isnt getting any first round love at all. Only two teams have gone to scout him. This is the type of place where value might be found. I am fond of the kid, partially cause of my mother being from there. But as I always say, the perfect Rlucas player is long, midsize, versatile and athletic and this kid fits that to a tee. With a little more weight, he could play 4 spots for you in limited minutes and be a poor mans Boris Diaw, though I like my Detlef comparison for now.


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## laso

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Did you see the bit on "Morro" that's under? 6'11, big wingspan, good shotblocker, nasty... That sounds like someone I'd like on my team.


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## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Rlucas...

You forgot one thing about Brazil: THE HOT WOMENZ!!!!!!! :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: 

Oh, yeah Marquinhos is a nice player too :biggrin:


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Just a couple of draft rumors that I have heard

Golden State, if they dont luck out and pick in the top 3, would go with Patrick Obryant based on the info they have today. Though there is some consideration there for Marcus Williams which would lead to a Baron Davis trade. If they are in the top 3, they will probably go with Aldridge because they still believe in Biedrins and last years #1, Ike Diogu, at the 4

Marcus Williams is shooting up on draft boards and if the right team is there, might crack the top 3. 

Redick, so far, might be heading lower. 

The Clippers, who are not in the lottery, really like Brandon Roy and would put him next to Shaun Livingston next year. They are serious about dealing Maggette and are super high on Yaroslev Karolov, last years number one. Also, dont be surprised if they are among the teams who do make a run at GS's pick and Mike Dunleavy as part of a blockbuster trade

Seattle is committed to keeping Wilcox but with his stock up, and financial problems appearing on the surface this year (how can Howard Schultz have financial issues?), dont be surprised if they go big with their pick and allow Wilcox to leave if his price is to high. If in the top 3, its Aldridge and Thomas and if not, its probably Shelden Williams or Tiago Splitter. 

Minnesota is also looking at size on the front line first and foremost. They want to improve their versatility across the roster, and might go with a guy like Bargnani if in the top 3 or could settle for Carney or Simmons if not. 

stocks up based on some limited workouts and european play are Oleksiy Pecherov, Shawnee Williams, Saer Sene and Marquinhos and Marcus Williams (in a big way)

Stocks down Rajon Rondo, Josh Boone,, JJ Redick


----------



## Rodman

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

thanks rlucas, very interesting read... you know anything about the Bulls right now? Would they go big or are they not high enough on any of the bigs? 

Interesting is where the hell will all of the Williamses go, Marcus and Shelden and Shawne.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rodman said:


> thanks rlucas, very interesting read... you know anything about the Bulls right now? Would they go big or are they not high enough on any of the bigs?
> 
> Interesting is where the hell will both of the Williamses go, Marcus and Shelden.


I have absolutely no connection with the Bulls, so no idea. I spoke to Kismet about 5 months ago and he is the closest person I know, outside of the kid on realgm, to having a connection with the crowd. I used to call Kismet Matt Lloyd and I still think it might be him. Great guy. His presence is missed.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Based on what are those players' stock fluctuating? No games, no workouts...


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Meanwhile in Europe...

*Splitter*

21 Minutes
16 Points
6 Rebounds
2 Steals
1 TO


*
Bargnani*

27 Minutes
14 Points
4 Rebounds
6 Steals 
1 Assist
1 TO


Playoffs starting this week in both leagues, so we better send some people down there to scout these two players and many more. Do your homework, Pax!

:banana:


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Andrea's updates

http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?t=204942&page=10


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Nice to see both Bargnani and Splitter doing well. 6 steals for Andrea in just 27 minutes is amazing.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I know its not draft related, but since I talked about him...

*The Spurs have learned that Luis Scola's buyout price tag from his Spanish team has dropped from $15 million to less than $5 million.*
It's still unknown if the 6-9 forward will ever play in the NBA, but now that his buyout is reasonable, the Spurs, who hold his NBA rights, can make a move for him if they decide they want him. He averaged 15 points and 6.6 rebounds last season and the Spurs may want him since they don't have a first-round pick this year.

*Source: *Rotoworld


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Based on what are those players' stock fluctuating? No games, no workouts...



Agents have been holding informal workouts for weeks and have been attended by NBA scouts and GMs. Most workouts have been in LA but a few have been in Orlando


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Agents have been holding informal workouts for weeks and have been attended by NBA scouts and GMs. Most workouts have been in LA but a few have been in Orlando


And how are these informal workouts like? So an agent is helping his client to lower its stock?


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> And how are these informal workouts like? So an agent is helping his client to lower its stock?



Quite the opposite Chapu. Most of the times it helps a client. Look at Marquinhos. He is working out for NBA types in Cleveland through his agent and doesnt it appear to be working for him? He is now in most Mocks first round after not being in anyones draft 2 weeks ago. From what I understand, Redick had an informal workout where he did nothing but shoot 3 pointers and when asked to do other things, didnt do that. There is some Gerald Green talking surrounding him right now, as a guy who might be hiding something. Rajon Rondo apparently looked a little loss running some games compared to Marcus Williams. Dont believe me? Look at the various mocks. Rondo was in the top 7 a month ago, now alot of mocks have him 20ish. Same with Boone. Some guys have benefitted. Shawnee Williams, Marcus Williams, and Marquinhos mostly. Its just the beginning of the workout season, but that is the buzz. Take it or leave it.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Quite the opposite Chapu. Most of the times it helps a client. Look at Marquinhos. He is working out for NBA types in Cleveland through his agent and doesnt it appear to be working for him? He is now in most Mocks first round after not being in anyones draft 2 weeks ago. From what I understand, Redick had an informal workout where he did nothing but shoot 3 pointers and when asked to do other things, didnt do that. There is some Gerald Green talking surrounding him right now, as a guy who might be hiding something. Rajon Rondo apparently looked a little loss running some games compared to Marcus Williams. Dont believe me? Look at the various mocks. Rondo was in the top 7 a month ago, now alot of mocks have him 20ish. Same with Boone. Some guys have benefitted. Shawnee Williams, Marcus Williams, and Marquinhos mostly. Its just the beginning of the workout season, but that is the buzz. Take it or leave it.


I would understand the purpose if Im Sene, or Marcos Vinicius, but not if you are almost a lottery lock. 

And what do you mean with that "Redick was hiding something"?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I would understand the purpose if Im Sene, or Marcos Vinicius, but not if you are almost a lottery lock.
> 
> And what do you mean with that "Redick was hiding something"?


Apparently I am not the only one who things Redick isnt helping himself. 

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1300


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Apparently I am not the only one who things Redick isnt helping himself.
> 
> http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1300


Hey man, no doubting you, I think you are the guy that manages the best "inside" info in here, with some legit sources.

But I still dont understand the Redick hiding something.

Edit: Read DraftExpress and get the point. But see, I would rather wait until the team workouts. Good thing he didnt go one-on-one against Roy.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Hey man, no doubting you, I think you are the guy that manages the best "inside" info in here, with some legit sources.
> 
> But I still dont understand the Redick hiding something.


Its early in the process, he has plenty of time to right himself. But I think these LA workouts Tellem are putting on have hurt him early in the process. But there is 6 weeks til draft day so there is more then enough time for him to make it right and not pull a Gerald Green. Too bad Ill be at the World Cup rather then watching the draft. Ill be winding up my coverage of the draft around June 15 when my wife and I will head over.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

man...Rudy Fernandez sounds GOOD.

that profile on draftexpress makes this guy a no-brainer @ 16

I'm starting to lean towards an all-euro draft.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Nice info Rlucas :clap: . It sounds really interesting what other teams are doing and looking for and ae planning to do. Kind of disappointed to hear nothing from the Bulls, especially how they have a guaranteed top five pick, but I guess they're being "tight lipped" about it. I'd like them to make run at Maggette with our pick and Sweetney. He'd be the big guard we need and he gets to the line. But, I gues the Bulls draft board is Thomas, Aldridge, Bargnani, Williams, O'Bryant, Gay, Carney(all with NY's pick). Splitter might crack the top 5 provided he gets his contract situation ironed out.


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Just a couple of draft rumors that I have heard
> 
> Golden State, if they dont luck out and pick in the top 3, would go with Patrick Obryant based on the info they have today. Though there is some consideration there for Marcus Williams which would lead to a Baron Davis trade. If they are in the top 3, they will probably go with Aldridge because they still believe in Biedrins and last years #1, Ike Diogu, at the 4
> 
> Marcus Williams is shooting up on draft boards and if the right team is there, might crack the top 3.
> 
> Redick, so far, might be heading lower.
> 
> The Clippers, who are not in the lottery, really like Brandon Roy and would put him next to Shaun Livingston next year. They are serious about dealing Maggette and are super high on Yaroslev Karolov, last years number one. Also, dont be surprised if they are among the teams who do make a run at GS's pick and Mike Dunleavy as part of a blockbuster trade
> 
> Seattle is committed to keeping Wilcox but with his stock up, and financial problems appearing on the surface this year (how can Howard Schultz have financial issues?), dont be surprised if they go big with their pick and allow Wilcox to leave if his price is to high. If in the top 3, its Aldridge and Thomas and if not, its probably Shelden Williams or Tiago Splitter.
> 
> Minnesota is also looking at size on the front line first and foremost. They want to improve their versatility across the roster, and might go with a guy like Bargnani if in the top 3 or could settle for Carney or Simmons if not.
> 
> stocks up based on some limited workouts and european play are Oleksiy Pecherov, Shawnee Williams, Saer Sene and Marquinhos and Marcus Williams (in a big way)
> 
> Stocks down Rajon Rondo, Josh Boone,, JJ Redick


Sweet. Good stuff rlucas.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I like hearing that Marcus Williams' stock is rising, if he gets picked in the lottery a big guy will probably fall and make our #16 pick even better.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> I like hearing that Marcus Williams' stock is rising, if he gets picked in the lottery a big guy will probably fall and make our #16 pick even better.


Well most had him going roughly in the top 12 anyways, he's just rearranging the order a tiny bit. I was suprised he was that low to begin with.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

It seems like the big guards (Brewer and Roy) might be pushed back a little bit by Williams and other players emergence. I wonder what the Bulls could offer to move up five or so spots and nab one of them.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Just rummaging around. The Belgium season came to an end for Pepinster. Saer Senes likely last game in Europe. For his last game, against Royal Atomia Brussels, he had 10 points, 3 blocks, 2 assists and 16 rebounds (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) in 22 minutes (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!). Not a strong league but 16 rebounds in 22 minutes? Could Eddy Curry get 16 rebounds in 22 minutes in Belgium?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Just rummaging around. The Belgium season came to an end for Pepinster. Saer Senes likely last game in Europe. For his last game, against Royal Atomia Brussels, he had 10 points, 3 blocks, 2 assists and 16 rebounds (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) in 22 minutes (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!). Not a strong league but 16 rebounds in 22 minutes? Could Eddy Curry get 16 rebounds in 22 minutes in Belgium?


The thing is that Curry and Sene are like black and white, so theres no point in arguing if Eddy could get 16 rebounds in 22 minutes playing in Belgium.

Why is it that he played only 22 minutes? 

BTW: Anyone knows if Pax is making the trip to Europe to scout some players? I dont want to hear the "I didnt watch him personally enough to draft him" BS.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> The thing is that Curry and Sene are like black and white, so theres no point in arguing if Eddy could get 16 rebounds in 22 minutes playing in Belgium.
> 
> Why is it that he played only 22 minutes?
> 
> BTW: Anyone knows if Pax is making the trip to Europe to scout some players? I dont want to hear the "I didnt watch him personally enough to draft him" BS.


100% agree on your BTW

I dont know why he played only 22 minutes, but it isnt uncommon for young big men to only play that long. 

I was sort of making a joke regarding Curry. I was going to say could Curry get 16 rebounds in 22 minutes against a bunch of midgets but thought that would label me a hater, and I am not. I just think 16 rebounds in 22 minutes when your this inexperienced is exemplary at any level.

Ill be off the next 2-3 days due to the Champs League Final. Good luck to your guys Chapu. Should be one of the best matchups this competition has seen in the final.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> 100% agree on your BTW
> 
> I dont know why he played only 22 minutes, but it isnt uncommon for young big men to only play that long.
> 
> I was sort of making a joke regarding Curry. I was going to say could Curry get 16 rebounds in 22 minutes against a bunch of midgets but thought that would label me a hater, and I am not. I just think 16 rebounds in 22 minutes when your this inexperienced is exemplary at any level.
> 
> Ill be off the next 2-3 days due to the Champs League Final. Good luck to your guys Chapu. Should be one of the best matchups this competition has seen in the final.


Im not a Barca guy, in fact, I support mainly teams that have argentinean players. So its a shame if we dont get to see Barca playing at full strength (Without Messi). But yeah, its going to be a lot of fun cause they are maybe the two teams that play the best soccer and Im not talking results/scores here. And with Henry and Ronaldinho, the two best players in the world, there is going to be plenty to talk about after the game. 

Good luck in your trip.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

You know, just thinking out loud here. Saer Sene sounds like a slightly larger Tyrus Thomas. If Pax has decided that you go big with both picks, and is sold that Sene could give athletic interior defense and rebounding to the Bulls, then you move up Bargnani to the top of the draft board because he can provide an element that the Bulls dont have, a scorer on the front line who can create points for himself and others, or Aldridge, a post scorer with Sene taking up the Tyrus Thomas elements of the game. I am a TT fan, but perhaps you can get those elements with Sene but at 16.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> You know, just thinking out loud here. Saer Sene sounds like a slightly larger Tyrus Thomas. If Pax has decided that you go big with both picks, and is sold that Sene could give athletic interior defense and rebounding to the Bulls, then you move up Bargnani to the top of the draft board because he can provide an element that the Bulls dont have, a scorer on the front line who can create points for himself and others, or Aldridge, a post scorer with Sene taking up the Tyrus Thomas elements of the game. I am a TT fan, but perhaps you can get those elements with Sene but at 16.


I think we tend to underrate Tyrus Thomas offensive game, saying he doesnt have one. I think he will be a much much better offensive force compared to Sene, but obviously Sene has the length and size advantage. 

This being said, I agree with your line of thinking (?). Sene and Thomas are somewhat similar to what they bring to the table, and Bargnani is a totally different player. Obviously drafting Thomas and Sene would seem redundant, especially with Chandler already playing for us.

And I still cant see Pax thinking Sene with our pick. Dont ask me why, but its a feeling I have. 

So rlucas, from the info you gathered, complete this line: Sear Sene can go as high as _ _ _ _


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> I think we tend to underrate Tyrus Thomas offensive game, saying he doesnt have one. I think he will be a much much better offensive force compared to Sene, but obviously Sene has the length and size advantage.
> 
> This being said, I agree with your line of thinking (?). Sene and Thomas are somewhat similar to what they bring to the table, and Bargnani is a totally different player. Obviously drafting Thomas and Sene would seem redundant, especially with Chandler already playing for us.
> 
> And I still cant see Pax thinking Sene with our pick. Dont ask me why, but its a feeling I have.
> 
> So rlucas, from the info you gathered, complete this line: Sear Sene can go as high as _ _ _ _


12

Can go as low as 32. 

I think as of right now, he has the largest range of any player in the draft. But I really see someone like Phoenix or San Antonio not letting him fall out of round 1. But then again, San Antonio has Scola and Mahinmi (who is a carbon copy of this kid and looking like a flat out stud) on the sidelines waiting to come over.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> 12
> 
> Can go as low as 32.
> 
> I think as of right now, he has the largest range of any player in the draft. But I really see someone like Phoenix or San Antonio not letting him fall out of round 1. But then again, San Antonio has Scola and Mahinmi (who is a carbon copy of this kid and looking like a flat out stud) on the sidelines waiting to come over.


LOL, its not fair. Why cant we get a FO like that? J/k. 

I think second rounders are so overlooked by some teams, like they dont mind giving them away.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> LOL, its not fair. Why cant we get a FO like that? J/k.
> 
> I think second rounders are so overlooked by some teams, like they dont mind giving them away.


I look at what Pop and Buford have done and I shake my head. I mean, in Scola and Mahinmi, for all intent and purposes, are their 16 and 17th men. And thier 16-17 men would start for a very high amount of teams in the NBA. Scola certainly would be in everyones rotation. Mahinmi has gotten so much better this year and with his frame and athletic ability, the future could be scary for him. I guess thats the art of stashing players overseas. I compared Sene to Mahinmi early in the process, Ill stick with that comparison. I agree though, Paxs conservative nature would keep from Sene, which is a pity. But hopefully he wouldnt pass on Bargnani. I think any of the big 3 bigs would be nice, but Bargnani does have a different dimension to his game.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> 12
> 
> Can go as low as 32.
> 
> I think as of right now, he has the largest range of any player in the draft. But I really see someone like Phoenix or San Antonio not letting him fall out of round 1. But then again, San Antonio has Scola and Mahinmi (who is a carbon copy of this kid and looking like a flat out stud) on the sidelines waiting to come over.


I think his workouts will determine where he gets drafted, if he does well against quality opposition he could end up a high lottery pick. Was it Sene who said he would play against anyone, or was that someone else?


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

After the "MVP under22" award of the Euroleague 2005-2006, today Bargnani won the italian A1 league's "version" of the prize.

Congrats Andrea :cheers:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Anyone think Paxson should do whatever he can to trade for Patrick O'Bryant? He's a top 6-7 big in this draft. I can't see New Orleans passing on him at all (if he even falls THAT low).


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

:banana: 

http://195.56.77.209/top5/2-10657-dsl.wmv

http://195.56.77.208/top5video/


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The Draft Lotto is 6 days away!!

If our pick falls anywhere between 3-5, I'll be pretty sad


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> The Draft Lotto is 6 days away!!
> 
> If our pick falls anywhere between 3-5, I'll be pretty sad


We have an appreciably better chance of ending up 3-5 than we do 1-2, so say your novenas, cross those fingers, avoid black cats, etc.

EDIT: In case anyone's interested, here are the full odds.

#1: .199
#2: .188

#3: .171
#4: .319
#5: .124

So we have a 38.7 chance to end up 1-2, and a 61.4 chance to end up 3-5. 

It doesn't make sense to me that the team with the second-worst record would end up with a greater than 50% higher chance to end up with the #4 as opposed to the 1 or 2. I think the lottery process needs serious reform, but I haven't heard any rumblings about that.


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

This draft thing is boring...no one to get excited about...no way of predicting the effect any single player would have on the team next season.

I trust Paxsons draft instincts, but I dearly hope he trades the pick. I know, I know...blasphemy to college and draft fans...but I really think that a good veteran would be the best thing for this team.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



GB said:


> This draft thing is boring...no one to get excited about...no way of predicting the effect any single player would have on the team next season.
> 
> I trust Paxsons draft instincts, but I dearly hope he trades the pick. I know, I know...blasphemy to college and draft fans...but I really think that a good veteran would be the best thing for this team.


I would rather use the pick to gamble on star potential (Aldridge, Thomas, Bargs) than settle for a known quality player (through trade) who will be worse than the upside of the draft pick.

The Bulls can and should hedge this bet through free agency.


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## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> I would rather use the pick to gamble


I wouldn't.

We have a base. The time for gambling is past.

We'll be calling for his head if he loses the gamble. Gambles make for good message board fodder...


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



GB said:


> I wouldn't.
> 
> We have a base. The time for gambling is past.
> 
> We'll be calling for his head if he loses the gamble. Gambles make for good message board fodder...


Who do you realistically think the Bulls could get back for the Knicks pick?


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Anyone think Paxson should do whatever he can to trade for Patrick O'Bryant? He's a top 6-7 big in this draft. I can't see New Orleans passing on him at all (if he even falls THAT low).


I'm a big Bradley fan, so I'm biased. But I think O'Bryant is a lock for the lottery, and might even shoot up to the top 6 or 7 overall. He's absolutely huge. Seven feet tall with super long arms, and good skill and athleticism to boot. He's a bit of a project offensively, but defensively he'll be solid from day 1, IMO. Heck, if we end up with the 5th pick, I would seriously consider taking him there. I know, I'm nuts. :krazy:


----------



## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



GB said:


> This draft thing is boring...no one to get excited about...no way of predicting the effect any single player would have on the team next season.
> 
> I trust Paxsons draft instincts, but I dearly hope he trades the pick. I know, I know...blasphemy to college and draft fans...but I really think that a good veteran would be the best thing for this team.



I would hate to trade a draft pick for a mediocre 
do you remember kobe bryant for vlade divac


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> Who do you realistically think the Bulls could get back for the Knicks pick?


Don't know...I am not an NBA insider and you never, ever know who is available until draft time comes around anyway.

I'll bet the Clippers are glad now that they waited till the last minute and found Elton Brand suddenly available...


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mr.ankle20 said:


> I would hate to trade a draft pick for a mediocre
> do you remember kobe bryant for vlade divac


Yes, but I also remember a team getting Elton Brand for the number 2, and another team offering us Jermaine O'Neal for our two draft picks.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

That Bargnani steal and dunk was pretty impressive. Shoots the passing lane, takes it the length of the floor, crosses over his defender and finished while taking some contact. I'd have liked it even better if he'd have finished with his left hand, but, damn! C'mon Pax! This guy _is_ the safe pick!

As an aside, Nemanja Alseksandrov still has his name in the hat. Anybody think it might not be a bad idea for Pax to acquire a second rounder (for "future considerations") to take a flyer on this kid? Top-5 talent before his injuries. I don't think he's played ball in over a year and has questions on his level of motivation. Strictly and all or nothing type pick, but with a second rounder, why not?


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Italian A1 league play off

Quarter of Final - Game 1

Benetton Treviso Vs Armani Milan (Clash of the clothes :biggrin: )

83-76

Andrea Bargnani

28 minutes
20 points
1-2 from 2
2-4 from 3
12-14 free throws
5 rebounds
1 block
2 steals
10 fouls drawn

:angel:


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bargnani's stats, Italian League playoff game #1

20pts. (game's high scorer) 5 rebounds, 1-2 from 2pt, 2-4 from 3pt, 12-14 from the line. Committed four fouls and was fouled _10 times_ (the guy can get to the line!) in 28 minutes of play.

Get this guy Pax! Not your low-post scoring big but he can get it done. 20 years old, Best euroleague under 22 yrs. I hope all of Pax's not looking too hard at the european leagues is simply a smokescreen. This guy can play. Getting better and better game by game.

Edit: ItalianBBlover - ya beat me to it!


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

You're really selling the kid well...


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

*All the talk is that if the Bulls get the first pick, they'll choose either LaMarcus Aldridge or Tyrus Thomas. Best-case scenarios seem to indicate Aldridge could be Chris Bosh/Jermaine O'Neal-esque and Thomas could be Andrei Kirilenko-esque. Wouldn't Aldridge, because of his size and scoring ability, really be the better option? Although a wonderful athlete and defender, Thomas is no bigger than Luol Deng and doesn't provide low-post scoring. If the Bulls get the first pick, who would you rather see them take, Aldridge or Thomas? Also, why don't Utah and Denver just work out a change-of-scenery deal, outright swapping Carlos Boozer and Kenyon Martin? -- Josh J., Hartland, Mich.*



_I'd probably go with Aldridge for the reasons you say. Though Tyson Chandler is tall, too. I think there's a deep division on the Bulls staff about what to do if they get No. 1 and it will be interesting to see. I think they'll first see if they can auction the pick and eventually use it. Kenyon Martin in Salt Lake City with Jerry Sloan? That would provide a lot of humorous notes material for next season._



http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...e=2&cset=true&ctrack=1&coll=cs-home-headlines


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## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I know that anyone can look good in a highlight reel, these Bargnani clips have me really intrigued. He's a premiter guy, but he seems like he's hungry to dunk it. I like his swagger.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> I think there's a deep division on the Bulls staff about what to do if they get No. 1 and it will be interesting to see. I think they'll first see if they can auction the pick and eventually use it.


This is quite interesting, I wonder who's on what side. One deciding factor for me is can Thomas show up with much added bulk to his frame.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I don't know how deep that division is, he also said he THINKS theirs a division, guy doesn't sound to SURE to me.

Chad ford said John Paxson loves Tyrus & he also said Skiles envisions Thomas as the type of forward he wants to run up and down with his guards.

Of course this was over a month ago, thoughts may have changed since then.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mizenkay said:


> *All the talk is that if the Bulls get the first pick, they'll choose either LaMarcus Aldridge or Tyrus Thomas. Best-case scenarios seem to indicate Aldridge could be Chris Bosh/Jermaine O'Neal-esque and Thomas could be Andrei Kirilenko-esque. Wouldn't Aldridge, because of his size and scoring ability, really be the better option? Although a wonderful athlete and defender, Thomas is no bigger than Luol Deng and doesn't provide low-post scoring. If the Bulls get the first pick, who would you rather see them take, Aldridge or Thomas? Also, why don't Utah and Denver just work out a change-of-scenery deal, outright swapping Carlos Boozer and Kenyon Martin? -- Josh J., Hartland, Mich.*
> 
> 
> 
> _I'd probably go with Aldridge for the reasons you say. Though Tyson Chandler is tall, too. I think there's a deep division on the Bulls staff about what to do if they get No. 1 and it will be interesting to see. I think they'll first see if they can auction the pick and eventually use it. Kenyon Martin in Salt Lake City with Jerry Sloan? That would provide a lot of humorous notes material for next season._
> 
> 
> 
> http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...e=2&cset=true&ctrack=1&coll=cs-home-headlines





> Sam, I am quite shocked that you and some other sources think Shelden Williams probably will be available for the Bulls´ second pick. I am by no means a Duke fan, but I believe Shelden will go in the top 5 selections. The Bulls should pick him with their first pick. No more 215-pound forwards who get pushed around, except maybe Tyrus Thomas with those hops. This is what the Bulls should do: Do not trade Ben Gordon. He is a scoring machine, and would fit perfectly in a three-guard rotation ala Vinnie Johnson. Get Bruce Bowen or his likeness (is he available next year?), Shelden and free agent Drew Gooden and I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. -- Fausto, Quito, Ecuador
> 
> *I'm betting you know the Bulls better than they know the location of your country.* I don't agree Williams will go that high. He's a little on the plodding side and I think will have trouble against NBA athletes. But, yes, they need some more bulk. Yes, Ben, love him or hate him. Bowen is under contract through next season and will be too old after that. The Bulls even had him in a trade six years ago and let him go. But don't worry. I see the Bulls meeting several needs and being much better next season.


WTF?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Its sad but true.

Speaking of the Bulls, my feeling is the Bulls are really considering Bargnani. We hear a lot of Aldridge and Thomas, but he might be Pax's guy. And he started really well in the Italian League playoffs.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Speaking of the Bulls, my feeling is the Bulls are really considering Bargnani. We hear a lot of Aldridge and Thomas, but he might be Pax's guy. And he started really well in the Italian League playoffs.


I hope you're right. My final wishlist is either Bargnani or Thomas, and if we fall to where both are off the board, then Brandon Roy. I don't want any part of Aldridge.


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## SALO

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



ScottMay said:


> I hope you're right. My final wishlist is either *Bargnani* or *Thomas*, and if we fall to where both are off the board, then *Brandon Roy*. I don't want any part of Aldridge.


 :cheers: 

My thoughts exactly. A few months ago, all I knew of Bargnani was one small video clip someone provided on the internet. That little highlight reel impressed me more than an entire season of watching Aldridge. Since that time there have been more video clips released of Bargnani and they just keep getting better. The kid draws a ton of fouls by attacking the basket. I believe he'll be successful attacking the rim in the NBA as well because teams will have to respect his outside shot, which also seems to be terrific. 

Thomas
Bargnani
Roy

These are the only 3 players I'd consider taking with the Knicks pick... if I hear anybody else's name on draft night (Morrison, Aldridge) I'll be crossing my fingers that Pax has a trade lined up.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Its sad but true.
> 
> Speaking of the Bulls, my feeling is the Bulls are really considering Bargnani. We hear a lot of Aldridge and Thomas, but he might be Pax's guy. And he started really well in the Italian League playoffs.


We've heard NOTHING about the bulls considering Bargnani. I just don't understand how you could think he IS the guy.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think I'm leaning towards Bargnani and Aldridge this week. I'd be happy with either of them for now. They both fill a need.

Of course I'm likely to change my mind next week... When someone posts a highlight real of Thomas, Roy, Gay or Morisson!


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> We've heard NOTHING about the bulls considering Bargnani. I just don't understand how you could think he IS the guy.



Roy,

you don't tip your hand unless you have the number one pick. Then you tell everyone in the world it's available for the rediculous asking price of a NBA superstar. If that doesn't work, you take the guy who will have the greatest impact on your team.

Also, until individual workouts, it's very difficult to put an order of who's better. If Thomas doesn't show an offensive game beyond dunking - I want nothing to do with him. If he does show an offensive game, he shoots way up. Same thing with Aldridge and Bargnani, if they show a mroe complete game, they shoot up. I think Pax shoots himself if he ends up with the 5th pick - though I think Roy would be a very option at that point.

Everything I'm reading and hearing seems par for the course, The Bulls and Paxson are saying the right things and spreading the right disinformation. Remember, one of Krause's best attributes was he was secretive as hell.

I rarely believe that a team is gonna take the guy that their local media is hyping. And I never believe what the national media is hyping.


If it were today - me on the clock - Bargnani, Aldridge, Thomas, Roy.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> Roy,
> 
> you don't tip your hand unless you have the number one pick. Then you tell everyone in the world it's available for the rediculous asking price of a NBA superstar. If that doesn't work, you take the guy who will have the greatest impact on your team.
> 
> Also, until individual workouts, it's very difficult to put an order of who's better. If Thomas doesn't show an offensive game beyond dunking - I want nothing to do with him. If he does show an offensive game, he shoots way up. Same thing with Aldridge and Bargnani, if they show a mroe complete game, they shoot up. I think Pax shoots himself if he ends up with the 5th pick - though I think Roy would be a very option at that point.
> 
> Everything I'm reading and hearing seems par for the course, The Bulls and Paxson are saying the right things and spreading the right disinformation. Remember, one of Krause's best attributes was he was secretive as hell.
> 
> I rarely believe that a team is gonna take the guy that their local media is hyping. And I never believe what the national media is hyping.
> 
> 
> If it were today - me on the clock - Bargnani, Aldridge, Thomas, Roy.


Yeah but, Krause isn't running the show, and Paxson doesn't seem to share ANY of his traits so....

As far as the media is concerned, bottom line is, they're in position to know ALOT more than us. Hell it's their job, especially a guy like Chad Ford who specializes in reporting College B-Ball news. If he said Bargnani was the bulls #1 choice, I'm pretty sure YOU'd bring it up also.

I don't have a problem with Bargnani, he's #2 on my list. I just haven't heard MUCH about the Bulls being interested, that's all. I'm pretty sure they ARE though, he'd be a GOOD bigman to have.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

This is how I look at it...

The player that is LEAST talked about by an organization is the favorite in that organization.


----------



## BenDengGo

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

i want bargnani real bad, i think he'll the closest thing to dirk.
after i've several clips, i'm convinced that he's special.
that atleticism, ballhandling, passing, the will to driving to the lane and is incredible ranch....

the bulls just have to pick him, he'll be a nightmare mismatch for other teams.

plus he'll build an xcelent inside outside duo / high low offense with oden.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



ScottMay said:


> I hope you're right. My final wishlist is either Bargnani or Thomas, and if we fall to where both are off the board, then Brandon Roy. I don't want any part of Aldridge.


Pretty much my thinking. I've made no secret that Bargnani is my guy. I'm not sure what kind of defender he is (i'm thinking below average) but he's a matchup nightmare on offense. I'd be allright with Thomas but his overall rawness is something to be concerned about. But he's a freak and this team needs some top notch athletes on it. Don't know much about Roy, but he sounds like an ideal 2-guard who does it all. I should be OK with Aldridge but there is just something about his game/demeanor that rubs me the wrong way. Can't put my finger on it because he's got some very nice skills but of Thomas/Bargnani/Roy/Aldridge - Aldridge is last on the list. I'd take Morrison or Gay over him at this point.

Draft Lottery is only a few days off! C'mon ping-pong balls!


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> Pretty much my thinking. I've made no secret that Bargnani is my guy. I'm not sure what kind of defender he is (i'm thinking below average) but he's a matchup nightmare on offense. I'd be allright with Thomas but his overall rawness is something to be concerned about. But he's a freak and this team needs some top notch athletes on it. Don't know much about Roy, but he sounds like an ideal 2-guard who does it all. I should be OK with Aldridge but there is just something about his game/demeanor that rubs me the wrong way. Can't put my finger on it because he's got some very nice skills but of Thomas/Bargnani/Roy/Aldridge - Aldridge is last on the list. I'd take Morrison or Gay over him at this point.
> 
> Draft Lottery is only a few days off! C'mon ping-pong balls!


The way I look at it, Bargnani is the most skilled big available (and a capable athlete to boot). Thomas is the most athletic big available (and as machinehead has been pointing out, he's far from unskilled). Aldridge is kind of a mishmash -- decent skills, okay athlete. I'm not denying the possibility that he could have a longer, more successful career than either Bargnani or Thomas, but I'm fairly certain he won't be good enough to push the Bulls over the top. We need this pick to turn into a tremendously good player if we're going to compete with LeBron and Dwight Howard over the next ten years.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



BenDengGo said:


> i want bargnani real bad, i think he'll the closest thing to dirk.
> after i've several clips, i'm convinced that he's special.
> that atleticism, ballhandling, passing, the will to driving to the lane and is incredible ranch....
> 
> the bulls just have to pick him, he'll be a nightmare mismatch for other teams.
> 
> plus he'll build an xcelent inside outside duo / high low offense with oden.


Why talk as if Oden is already on the team? Even if NY ends up being the worst team in the league, we only have a 25% shot at the #1 pick. I expect NY to be bad next year, but I think they'll improve from this year.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> Why talk as if Oden is already on the team? Even if NY ends up being the worst team in the league, we only have a 25% shot at the #1 pick. I expect NY to be bad next year, but I think they'll improve from this year.


I think we'll get a lotto pick out of them...just not #1, somewhere 5-10 sounds about right. But that's fine, cuz their are a TON of big's to choose from in that draft in that whole lottery.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Here's first impressions from Patrick O'Bryant's workout

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1302

I'm telling ya'll, we SERIOUSLY need to make a trade for this kid. He may not be a superstar in the league, but he's gonna help some team out tremendously in the future.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I think we'll get a lotto pick out of them...just not #1, somewhere 5-10 sounds about right. But that's fine, cuz their are a TON of big's to choose from in that draft in that whole lottery.


That's a reasonable guess, but it's not hard to see how they could be a lot worse next year.

-- It's very unlikely that their draft choices will help them in any way next year.

--If Curry hold true to form, he'll report this fall to the Knicks even more out of shape than he did last year.

--Last year the Knicks were lucky not to have any major injuries. That may not hold for two years in a row.

--The Knicks won many of their games early last year with AD providing stability in the middle. 

--Without LB as coach it's likely that the Knicks defense will be worse; i.e., nonexistent.

--As is, the team is obviously overstocked at the small guard positions (that includes Jamal, who is tall, but plays small). The imbalance will cause dissent unless it is corrected with a trade. But trading any of them for something of worth is easier said than done.

-- If the team gets off to a slow start the NY press and fans will tear them to shreds. NY is a very tough place to lose unless you are cute as well as hapless. Nate is cute, but that's probably not enough, since Marbury, Rose, et al. are not very cuddly players.

-- Finally some of their competitors for the bottom slots in the league will be better next year. Atlanta, Charlotte and Orlando are all going to improve. Only Portland seems a chinch to be terrible again.

So wishing for another top 5 choice is not unreasonable.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



McBulls said:


> That's a reasonable guess, but it's not hard to see how they could be a lot worse next year.
> 
> -- It's very unlikely that their draft choices will help them in any way next year.
> 
> --If Curry hold true to form, he'll report this fall to the Knicks even more out of shape than he did last year.
> 
> --Last year the Knicks were lucky not to have any major injuries. That may not hold for two years in a row.
> 
> --The Knicks won many of their games early last year with AD providing stability in the middle.
> 
> --Without LB as coach it's likely that the Knicks defense will be worse; i.e., nonexistent.
> 
> --As is, the team is obviously overstocked at the small guard positions (that includes Jamal, who is tall, but plays small). The imbalance will cause dissent unless it is corrected with a trade. But trading any of them for something of worth is easier said than done.
> 
> -- If the team gets off to a slow start the NY press and fans will tear them to shreds. NY is a very tough place to lose unless you are cute as well as hapless. Nate is cute, but that's probably not enough, since Marbury, Rose, et al. are not very cuddly players.
> 
> -- Finally some of their competitors for the bottom slots in the league will be better next year. Atlanta, Charlotte and Orlando are all going to improve. Only Portland seems a chinch to be terrible again.
> 
> So wishing for another top 5 choice is not unreasonable.


Good post, I completly agree. ESPECIALLY with Charlotte & Orlando being improved. Don't forget about Boston which pushes NY even FURTHER down the ladder. They do have some tradeable assets since they have four expiring contracts but at THIS moment, they're top 5 worst again next year.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

FWIW: Chad Ford chat @ ESPN --- 12 PM ET


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Here's first impressions from Patrick O'Bryant's workout
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1302
> 
> I'm telling ya'll, we SERIOUSLY need to make a trade for this kid. He may not be a superstar in the league, but he's gonna help some team out tremendously in the future.


I really liked O'Bryant when I saw him in the tourney and still like him. I do think if we get a top 3 pick, we gotta take Bags or Aldridge. Bags would be a better fit for our system, and is unlike any PF not named Dirk. Honestly, I wish we can trade up from 16 using some 'garbage' player on our roster (i.e. Sweets), or those 2nd rounders we have from NYK, and try to grab O'Bryant at 10 or something. However, rumor is (posted by rlucas? I don't remember), that GSW like O'Bryant. If I remember correctly. I can see teams like them, Seattle, and Minny going for this guy.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

When I read people talking about Bags I get flashes of...


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## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I totally agree i dont thing O'Bryant will last past the 10th pick. As a matter of fact i think he is a lock for the the top 8. But his moving up means someone is going to fall to us at 16. And, i wonder what international sleepers will also fall in the lotto. Right now it is just bargnani and spliter but i bet one also falls in. IMHO that means either Carney or Brewer are likely to fall to us at 16.

david


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



giusd said:


> I totally agree i dont thing O'Bryant will last past the 10th pick. As a matter of fact i think he is a lock for the the top 8. But his moving up means someone is going to fall to us at 16. And, i wonder what international sleepers will also fall in the lotto. Right now it is just bargnani and spliter but i bet one also falls in. IMHO that means either Carney or Brewer are likely to fall to us at 16.
> 
> david


not with New Orleans having #12 & #15..

they'll grab carney, brewer or o'bryant QUICKLY

i think carney's a lock for the top 10 anyway


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Splitter's TAU played its first playoff game tonight (Win, 80-68 vs A.Girona).

Tiago Splitter:
28 Minutes
16 Points
7/12 FG
2/5 FT
5 Rebounds
1 Turnover
Fouled Out

Scola:
34 Minutes
17 Points
8/13 FG
1/1 FT
10 Rebounds
6 Assists
3 Steals
3 TOs


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Also, Rudy's DKV Joventut defeated Gran Canaria, 81-70.

Rudy Fernandez:
30 Minutes
26 Points
6/7 2PT FG
4/7 3PF FG
2/5 FT
0 Rebounds
6 Assists
2 Steals
0 Turnovers


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

That's a great scouting report from draft express on Patrick O'Bryant. It's cool to hear them say the same positive things about him that I've seen the past 2 seasons at Bradley.

And considering the lack of talented 7-footers in this draft, it would not shock me one bit to see O'Bryant go as high as #5 overall. Heck, I said it the other day, if the Bulls have the 5th pick I'd have no gripes with taking him that high. But then again, it's no secret that he was one of my favorite players in all of college basketball last season.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



giusd said:


> I totally agree i dont thing O'Bryant will last past the 10th pick. As a matter of fact i think he is a lock for the the top 8. But his moving up means someone is going to fall to us at 16. And, i wonder what international sleepers will also fall in the lotto. Right now it is just bargnani and spliter but i bet one also falls in. *IMHO that means either Carney or Brewer are likely to fall to us at 16.
> *
> david


Hope your right about Carney or Brewer. I would say if that's the case no need to trade up. 

Barg, TT, Dridge, Roy, Foye, Bryant, Gay, Carney, Sheldon, M.Williams, and JJ are the 11 guys I have as locks to be taken before 16.


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## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Someone is going to tumble down.

Can't wait for workouts to start.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Hustle said:


> Hope your right about Carney or Brewer. I would say if that's the case no need to trade up.
> 
> Barg, TT, Dridge, Roy, Foye, Bryant, Gay, Carney, Sheldon, M.Williams, and JJ are the 11 guys I have as locks to be taken before 16.


I'm pretty sure Adam Morrison will go before 10 as well....LOL. SO that's 12. 

I think we have a number of good choices at 16 or trade down........(Hoping Brewer or Carney slip but if they don't): still available hopefully - Saer Sene, Thabo Sefalosha, Rudy Fernandez, Marqhinos.. All are foreign players, but since we'd already have atleast one "stud", we can take a chance on the 16th pick. Plus, we have FA to fill the holes not filled. 

If we were pick 1 right now: I take Bargnani at 1, any of the above mentioned at 16 and go full bore at Nene (if healthy, which reports are that he is)....So, we then need a SG like Dermar johnson or John Salmons to complete FA. Plus, someone with decent talent always goes undrafted....

The reason Sene isn't a lock to gamble on is because next year's pick should be high and next year's froncourt players are deep. It might make sense to gamble on Sefalosha or Fernandez, especially since we could pick up Nene and a guy like Pryz or Nazr in FA. Trade a big man next off-season if you need to.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> The reason Sene isn't a lock to gamble on is because next year's pick should be high and next year's froncourt players are deep. It might make sense to gamble on Sefalosha or Fernandez, especially since we could pick up Nene and a guy like Pryz or Nazr in FA. Trade a big man next off-season if you need to.


When you think about the fact that we'll be adding a top 5 pick, a #16 pick, potentially 2-3 free agents AND atleast a top 10 pick in 2007, we should be STACKED for the next 5 years. The depth on that team should be outstanding.

That's also a TON of trade bait should we look to pick up a star later on.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



darlets said:


> Someone is going to tumble down.
> 
> Can't wait for workouts to start.


Me neither, I'm thinking Redick won't fare too well in the one on one workouts.


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## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Another thing to consider is typically before the 16th pick one or two GM's have taken a punt on somebody people had ranked alot lower.


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

*cough cough*

http://www.sendspace.com/file/ety7ka

Toxicity's job


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Another great Bargnani mix! Thanks for posting it italianBBlover, and of course also thanks to Toxicity for making it. Those fadeaway jumpers he hits are impossible to defend, and this second mix again shows that his speed and agility is top notch for a guy his size. 

Draft him!


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## McBulls

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> Another great Bargnani mix! Thanks for posting it italianBBlover, and of course also thanks to Toxicity for making it. Those fadeaway jumpers he hits are impossible to defend, and this second mix again shows that his speed and agility is top notch for a guy his size.
> 
> Draft him!


I've had some trouble downloading mixes, so I've only seen a bit of Bargnani. From what I've seen, and the stats support it, the guy does have an outside shot. On the other hand, his rebounding stats are unimpressive, and he stated in one interview that he'd rather play outside than inside the paint.

Where do you see Bargnani fitting in on the Bulls, LegoHat? 

Is he a slightly taller version of Deng and Nocioni? If so, can he rebound and play defense at the same level as they do?

Or is he a taller Songalia, who is a very good shooting big man who also has a post-up game, is a good passer and can hold his own on the boards. 

Is there any indication that he can play defense better than the above players or provide inside defense and rebounding against opposing Forwards (Rasheed Wallace, Bosh) or Centers (Yao Ming, Howard)? 

If the answers to these questions are no, I don't see how he can be a priority draft pick for the Bulls.


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## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> That's a great scouting report from draft express on Patrick O'Bryant. It's cool to hear them say the same positive things about him that I've seen the past 2 seasons at Bradley.
> 
> And considering the lack of talented 7-footers in this draft, it would not shock me one bit to see O'Bryant go as high as #5 overall. Heck, I said it the other day, if the Bulls have the 5th pick I'd have no gripes with taking him that high. But then again, it's no secret that he was one of my favorite players in all of college basketball last season.


How long until he can be at a minimum as effective as say Chris Kamen?


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



italianBBlover said:


> *cough cough*
> 
> http://www.sendspace.com/file/ety7ka
> 
> Toxicity's job


Awesome stuff.

This was the first I saw of Bargnani playing in the post at all and he had a nice little dribble drive and fadeaway shot on two separate moves.

He is a bit faster than I thought he was watching other clips. The game flow really helped determine his foot speed. Seems like a hustle player, which I'm sure Skiles would like.

He plays above the rim, but he does not have fantastic hops. Sort of like Deng where he can sky if he gets going, but is below average with two feet on the floor.

Seems to have no problem taking a shot. He could be that go-to guy to pair with Gordon for a 1-2 punch. I'm sure Hinrich would love having Bargnani offensively.

Strength and rebounding are my two largest concerns with him. I still have him a solid #2 behind Aldridge, but I would have no problem drafting the guy #1 overall if Paxson thought he was the best fit. I wouldn't be unhappy with any of Aldridge, Bargnani, or Thomas, so here's hoping for a top 3 pick in the draft lottery Tuesday.

Also, I was curious if he knew English? Not knowing the language would make for a much more difficult transition (see Nocioni his rookie year, although Noc did seem like he had a couple of years of English courses and look how tough the transition was for him) to the NBA.


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



McBulls said:


> I've had some trouble downloading mixes, so I've only seen a bit of Bargnani. From what I've seen, and the stats support it, the guy does have an outside shot. On the other hand, his rebounding stats are unimpressive, and he stated in one interview that he'd rather play outside than inside the paint.
> 
> Where do you see Bargnani fitting in on the Bulls, LegoHat?
> 
> Is he a slightly taller version of Deng and Nocioni? If so, can he rebound and play defense at the same level as they do?
> 
> Or is he a taller Songalia, who is a very good shooting big man who also has a post-up game, is a good passer and can hold his own on the boards.
> 
> Is there any indication that he can play defense better than the above players or provide inside defense and rebounding against opposing Forwards (Rasheed Wallace, Bosh) or Centers (Yao Ming, Howard)?
> 
> If the answers to these questions are no, I don't see how he can be a priority draft pick for the Bulls.


He would definately be an upgrade to Songaila from everything I have seen. Definately better defensively, and is much faster on his feet to close out on rotations. While not having great hops, it's not hard to jump higher than than Songaila so I would expect him to be a better rebounder and shot blocker.

Outside shot seems like a wash, although it looks like Bargnani will have NBA 3-pt range as I've seen him comfortably take some threes a few steps behind the Euro line. He plays above the rim when he drives (definately something we need), has a good first step for a 7-footer and seems to handle the basketball relatively well.

I see him as a PF that could guard weaker centers. I do see him having problems guarding the Amare's & Howards of the NBA, so I don't think he'll be a defensive stopper unless he adds some weight and a lot more strength.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Welp, I think I'm putting Bargnani as my 1a, Thomas as my 1b.

Here's the thing -- I still maintain that the Bulls' most pressing need is a frontline player who can score. They've led the league in defensive field goal percentage the last two years while giving large amounts of PT to guys like Eddy Curry and "Sweets". If there's one thing this team can do -- even though I'm not always sure how they manage to do it -- it's play solid to spectacular team defense night in, night out.

Dreams of the Bulls getting Wallace and Thomas and holding the opposition to 70 points a game are more like a nightmare to me. We'd lose just as many 80-77 games as we'd win. I fail to believe that Bargnani in the long term would be any worse of a defender or rebounder than Curry or "Sweets," and while he might not be the post scorer that Eddy is, he looks like he'd provide a major matchup headache for the opposition, and be a guy who can score in a variety of ways.

As long as Hinrich, Chandler, and Skiles are in the fold, I'm not worried about the Bulls' defense. I'm very worried about the offense, though. Bargnani looks like he'd fix a lot of our ills.

So, today, as of 11:45 AM EDT, my strategy is:

1a Bargnani
1b Thomas
2 Brandon Roy
3 (a Yodurk special) Patrick O'Bryant -- if the unthinkable happens and we end up at 4 or 5, where it's looking like the three guys above could be off the board, I would rather see the Bulls take O'Bryant than Aldridge or Rudy Gay. It's not that much of a reach -- if he officially measures out and does well in workouts, he's a top 7 pick anyway.

At 16 you take the best player available, with the Ron Cey stipulation that it's not a player under 6-6, and you call it a day.

We definitely have to hope for good fortune in Secaucus, though. I think the way things are shaking out, Bargnani's about to seize that #1 spot and not look back.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> I do see him having problems guarding the Amare's & Howards of the NBA, so I don't think he'll be a defensive stopper unless he adds some weight and a lot more strength.


Tyrus Thomas or LaMarcus Aldridge is going to struggle guarding those guys, too, so let's flip the question around -- which guy is Dwight Howard or Amare Stoudemire going to have more trouble guarding: Andrea Bargnani, Tyrus Thomas, or LaMarcus Aldridge?

With our stout team defense, if we get a big-time frontline player who can consistently outproduce his cover, we're going to be fine.


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

One thing to note is that all we have seen out of Bargnani are highlights. I would love to see a full half of play so I could see how he positions himself offensively & defensively, and see plays where he makes bone-headed decisions.

His fundamentals definately seem solid from the highlights, but they are just highlight.

As ScottMay put it, I pretty much have the big three (Aldridge, Bargnani, and Thomas) all 1a, 1b, & 1c. If I were judging simply from highlights, I think Bargs would be my clear #1.


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## GB

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> There's a school of thought within the league Dolan has been advised to wait until Tuesday to make an announcement to upstage the Draft Lottery. The Knicks' lottery pick is owned by Chicago. If the Bulls win Tuesday's lottery, it will turn into one of the most humiliating nights in Knicks history.


nypost.com


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



ScottMay said:


> Tyrus Thomas or LaMarcus Aldridge is going to struggle guarding those guys, too, so let's flip the question around -- which guy is Dwight Howard or Amare Stoudemire going to have more trouble guarding: Andrea Bargnani, Tyrus Thomas, or LaMarcus Aldridge?
> 
> With our stout team defense, if we get a big-time frontline player who can consistently outproduce his cover, we're going to be fine.


I think I value Aldridge's potential NBA defense a lot higher than most, but I think that Aldridge is the clear best defender against the bangers out of those three. Thomas would be the best defender out of the three on average, and I think would have a better shot than Bargnani against the stars.

Flipping the question around as you suggested, I think Amare could guard any of the three. Dwight Howard would definately have the most trouble with Bargnani, Aldridge second, and Thomas third.


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## laso

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

OK, I've been thinking, and if we have the choice I don't think we should draft T Thomas... If we are looking for a very athletic 4, who will hustle, rebound and block, we can get that player at 16. One of Cedric Simmons or Hilton Armstrong will be available at that spot and can play a role similar to that of T Thomas.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> I think I value Aldridge's potential NBA defense a lot higher than most, but I think that Aldridge is the clear best defender against the bangers out of those three. Thomas would be the best defender out of the three on average, and I think would have a better shot than Bargnani against the stars.
> 
> Flipping the question around as you suggested, I think Amare could guard any of the three. Dwight Howard would definately have the most trouble with Bargnani, Aldridge second, and Thomas third.


i remember shelden williams & baby BEASTING against lamarcus...don't quite remember anybody doing tyrus like that


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> i remember shelden williams & baby BEASTING against lamarcus...don't quite remember anybody doing tyrus like that


Tyrus had Glen Davis next to him to take care of the guys that Aldridge had a hard time with, and I think that definitely helped him in terms of not being exposed. I think Aldridge will be just fine in the NBA, but I don't see the star potential in him that I see in Tyrus, and especially Bargnani.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



laso said:


> OK, I've been thinking, and if we have the choice I don't think we should draft T Thomas... If we are looking for a very athletic 4, who will hustle, rebound and block, we can get that player at 16. One of Cedric Simmons or Hilton Armstrong will be available at that spot and can play a role similar to that of T Thomas.


That's a good point, out of the two I like Hilton Armstrong the most, and I think he'll be a good player. I still think we should draft Bargnani and Brewer(or Sene, if we can somehow trade for Pietrus), and take care of the bigs in free agency(Nene, Gooden).


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

OT: On NBA.com there is a poll, where you pick who will be the first pick in the draft. The candidates are Adam Morrison, Tyrus Thomas, LaMarcus Aldridge and the last option is trade the pick for some reason...

The votes so far:

What will the winning Lottery team do with the No. 1 pick? 

Adam Morrison (Gonzaga) 45% 
Tyrus Thomas (LSU) 20%
LaMarcus Aldridge (Texas) 18% 
Trade the pick 17% 

Kind of a worthless poll, but it goes to show how popular Morrison is in the general public. I think he'll be a real crowd favourite somewhere, especially if he ends up with the Blazers.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> OT: On NBA.com there is a poll, where you pick who will be the first pick in the draft. The candidates are Adam Morrison, Tyrus Thomas, LaMarcus Aldridge and the last option is trade the pick for some reason...
> 
> The votes so far:
> 
> What will the winning Lottery team do with the No. 1 pick?
> 
> Adam Morrison (Gonzaga) 45%
> Tyrus Thomas (LSU) 20%
> LaMarcus Aldridge (Texas) 18%
> Trade the pick 17%
> 
> Kind of a worthless poll, but it goes to show how popular Morrison is in the general public. I think he'll be a real crowd favourite somewhere, especially if he ends up with the Blazers.


it shows how clueless the average bulls fan is since we're set for a LONG time at SF.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> I think Aldridge will be just fine in the NBA, but I don't see the star potential in him that I see in Tyrus, and especially Bargnani.


I agree...

A kid with L.A.'s skillset definintely couldn't just be a role player. He'll help some team out tremendously in a year or so, maybe even THIS year. If you think about how EASY it is for him to score in the post, it's kinda hard NOT to draft him. He averaged what? 15 PPG and barely got the rock, now imagine Duhon, Hinrich & Gordon setting him up in the low post all game!? That's seriously something to think about even though we DO knock his softness on here regularly. Although it prolly doesn't matter much, I've NEVER seen him dunk though, he doesn't have much of a power game.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> it shows how clueless the average bulls fan is since we're set for a LONG time at SF.


...



> He averaged what? 15 PPG and barely got the rock, now imagine Duhon, Hinrich & Gordon setting him up in the low post all game!?


It's another knock on him, he never demanded the ball.


> That's seriously something to think about even though we DO knock his softness on here regularly. Although it prolly doesn't matter much, I've NEVER seen him dunk though, he doesn't have much of a power game.


His softness matters quite alot as he'll be facing athletic freaks like Tyrus and stronger guys like Shelden every game. He won't be able to shoot over guys as often as he did in college, but then again his jumper is decent enough that he could make the pick and roll his bread and butter.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> ...
> 
> 
> It's another knock on him, he never demanded the ball.
> 
> His softness matters quite alot as he'll be facing athletic freaks like Tyrus and stronger guys like Shelden every game. He won't be able to shoot over guys as often as he did in college, but then again his jumper is decent enough that he could make the pick and roll his bread and butter.


I wouldn't say he NEVER demanded the ball. But after not getting the ball when he DOES demand it, after a while he's probably just like "**** it" lol. It had to be tough playing with those guards. They'll be FORCED to give the rock to Kevin Durant next year, he's the #1 option, no question. But he actually has PG skills so he won't have to wait like L.A. did.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

One other point about a SG falling to us at 16 is most of the mock drafts have only two internation players in the lotto Spliter and Bargnani but i bet one or two more move into the lotto as the private works start and one or two of these players have super workouts.

That would move eveyone at the end of the lotto down one or two spots as well. And from what i am reading it seems there are 14 or so players that are saying they are a lock for the top ten so some of them are going to drop. I still think either Brewer or Carney will be there at 16. But i read some Houson sport pages and i wonder if they are going to take Carney. They do need help at the SG but i still think they need a PF more than a SG.

david


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Houston would definintely take Carney...if T-Mac stays injured (as he always does), Carney could be next in line as the star G/F there.

G Alston
G Carney
F McGrady
F Swift
C Ming


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Not the best of games from Bargnani today...

32 mins.
8 pts
2-5 from 2pt
1-3 from 3pt
1-2 from the line
4 rebounds (all defensive)

Armani 76
benneton 65


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## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



ScottMay said:


> With our stout team defense, if we get a big-time frontline player who can consistently outproduce his cover, we're going to be fine.


This , perhaps , is the essence of how this team moves forward 

Taking this stipulation literally , what and who are you talking about "outproducing" 

When you talk about "outproducing" are you just talking about scoring more points than your positional opposite ? 

Because I take "outproducing" to mean defense and offense and it seems as though ( correct me if I'm wrong ) that your vote for Bargnani is predicated upon having a guy on the frontline logging big minutes who can score in bunches . That's fine. But he has to be able to play defense and be able to consistently keep his man below seasonal averages .

And if he can do this without necessarily scoring more points than his positional opposite then he will still have done his job IMO

Do you want "Mr Big Time " ( sorry Mr Big shot was already taken ) to be outproducing :

Type 1's

A's

Top tier two way big men such as Shaq, Duncan , Yao, Rasheed, Brand , Garnett , Howard , Bosh and Jermaine O'Neal

B's 

Top tier big men that are not true two way players but are gamewinners . Guys like Dirk, Amare and Pau 

Type 2's 

2nd tier highly productive and consistently productive bigs such as Brad Miller , Zach Randolph , Z 

Type 3's 

Young productive developing big men such as Chris Kaman , Eddy Curry, Al Jefferson , ZaZa , David West , Channing Frye , Robert Swift types 

Type 4's 

Vet role playing bigs such as LaFrentz , Battie , Ratliff types 

Type 5's 

Role playing projects like Biedrins, Petro , Diop 


When you break it down like this , it is apparent over 60% of the league currently have a better front line than us either in genuine two way big men stars or multi faceted highly productive all star calibre type big men - which means that they can all score 

So when you talk about "consistently outproducing" wrapt up in the need for scoring it seems more likely that Pax has to swing for the fences in the draft to try and get this player ...because it isn't going to be there in free agency for us .

And with this rationale , as much as I love Tyrus Thomas and think he is a genuine star in the making , Bargnani is perhaps the more rational choice for this team right now 

For the record , I do believe that the Tyranasurus has a body type /build that looks like he could add to his frame and he mmay well end up in the 6'10 245 range . I also see an offensive game in there that's waiting to be polished and a guy that can cover the 2 through to the 4 defensively. I do believe he will be the best player from this draft 

However ....

We need a scorer NOW on the frontline that is multi facted in how he scores. 

And that appears to be Bargnani 

But ..and a big but - he has to be able to be effective in the team defensive schemes . Its unrealistic to expect him to be a stopper but he has be able to work within a team defensive scheme to consistently lower the scoring output of the opposition frontlines - while forcing them to work harder on the defensive end and account for him 

And if it is Bargnani it , IMO , makes the case for Joel Pryzibilla all the more compelling - and run a core 3 frontline of Bargnani, Pryzibilla and Chandler supported by Allen and Sweetney ( for the time being ) with Nocioni also getting minutes at the strong forward spot.

I guess I am down for Bargnani even though I still maintain that Thomas will ultimately be the best player from this draft 

I will PM LegoHat and climb aboard


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



fl_flash said:


> Not the best of games from Bargnani today...
> 
> 32 mins.
> 8 pts
> 2-5 from 2pt
> 1-3 from 3pt
> 1-2 from the line
> 4 rebounds (all defensive)
> 
> Armani 76
> benneton 65


Plus a block

Yep, rough game for the entire Treviso's team.

The Milan's Forum is always a tough arena expecially in the play off.

Serie 1-1


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



SausageKingofChicago said:


> This , perhaps , is the essence of how this team moves forward
> 
> Taking this stipulation literally , what and who are you talking about "outproducing"
> 
> When you talk about "outproducing" are you just talking about scoring more points than your positional opposite ?
> 
> Because I take "outproducing" to mean defense and offense and it seems as though ( correct me if I'm wrong ) that your vote for Bargnani is predicated upon having a guy on the frontline logging big minutes who can score in bunches . That's fine. But he has to be able to play defense and be able to consistently keep his man below seasonal averages .
> 
> And if he can do this without necessarily scoring more points than his positional opposite then he will still have done his job IMO


I pretty much meant just outproduce his opponent as measured by PER/EFF -- he's not going to be able to stop your Tier A or Tier B guys, but then again, the reason those guys are Tier A/Tier B is that no one, for the most part, can stop them. With that type of player, I'd hope Bargnani could at least keep the individual matchup close, and then against all the lesser players in the league, I would fully expect him to give us a huge individual edge.



> So when you talk about "consistently outproducing" wrapt up in the need for scoring it seems more likely that Pax has to swing for the fences in the draft to try and get this player ...because it isn't going to be there in free agency for us .
> 
> And with this rationale , as much as I love Tyrus Thomas and think he is a genuine star in the making , Bargnani is perhaps the more rational choice for this team right now
> 
> For the record , I do believe that the Tyranasurus has a body type /build that looks like he could add to his frame and he mmay well end up in the 6'10 245 range . I also see an offensive game in there that's waiting to be polished and a guy that can cover the 2 through to the 4 defensively. I do believe he will be the best player from this draft
> 
> However ....
> 
> We need a scorer NOW on the frontline that is multi facted in how he scores.
> 
> And that appears to be Bargnani


Here you've explained my rationale for joining Camp Bargnani far better than I did. Tyrus Thomas is the ****. I think he is a once-in-a-generation athletic specimen who, as you've taken great pains to point out, is far more skilled than people are giving him credit for. But I think it'll always be a struggle for him to locate his own shot, and I don't see us 80-77'ing our way to a championship. Bargnani looks so versatile to me -- a big man who can shoot, a big man who can run the floor, a big man who can finish, and a big man who looks like he has the footwork and ability to develop some semblance of a post game (his clips look eerily similar to Gasol's clips, except he's a much better shooter).



> But ..and a big but - he has to be able to be effective in the team defensive schemes . Its unrealistic to expect him to be a stopper but he has be able to work within a team defensive scheme to consistently lower the scoring output of the opposition frontlines - while forcing them to work harder on the defensive end and account for him


This is a given. But for whatever reason, I don't see Bargnani becoming an Al Harrington/Zack Randolph/Al Harrington/Troy Murphy type who gives up just as much (or more) as he gets. Between our team scheme and his athleticism/court sense, I think he'll hold his own. In any event, we need an interior scorer we can lean on in an offensive fire-fight, and I think he's the only guy who fits the bill.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

It's a pretty interesting exercise to examine the PER yielded by the league's best offensive players. A lot of guys who are considered soft or bad defenders -- LeBron, Ray Allen, Gasol, Yao, Michael Redd, Carmelo, Iverson, Pierce etc. -- are in reality very effective (and the same applies for most of Sausage Kings Tier A and Tier B guys). The only players I saw in my quick scan that had awful PERs against were Dirk and Gilbert Arenas (and both slaughtered their guy in PER differentials anyway).

I think an effective offense is a very underrated aspect to effective defense. There was a stretch late in the 04-05 season where the Bulls yielded a bunch of consecutive 100+ point games, and everyone was complaining about the defense. That was no doubt a part of the problem, but it wasn't a coincidence that our offense stunk during the same stretch, too -- lots of missed jumpers and long rebounds, lots of early (bad early) shots, and lots of TOs. Good offensive execution begets good defense, emotionally and strategically.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

frankly...this whole "BIG 3" pick situation is getting on my nerves...i can't wait til it's over and done with

:banghead:


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

IN OTHER news, they say James White's workouts have been so impressive that he's moved his stock into the 1st round. He's also has been invited back by EVERY single team he's worked out for, which they say, is NOT very common.

Personally, he's one of my favorite players in this draft. Denham Brown of UCONN is my 2nd favorite "sleeper".


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> IN OTHER news, they say James White's workouts have been so impressive that he's moved his stock into the 1st round. He's also has been invited back by EVERY single team he's worked out for, which they say, is NOT very common.
> 
> Personally, he's one of my favorite players in this draft. Denham Brown of UCONN is my 2nd favorite "sleeper".


I was hoping that he wouldn't shoot himself up and that we could trade for a second rounder or two to get him and Sene, but this really isn't suprising at all. I wonder if he's worked on his game enough for us to consider him with our pick.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



step said:


> I was hoping that he wouldn't shoot himself up and that we could trade for a second rounder or two to get him and Sene, but this really isn't suprising at all. I wonder if he's worked on his game enough for us to consider him with our pick.


i said earlier in this this thread i'd trade down to get him....i don't understand why he isn't ranked HIGHER...but i haven't see him play as MUCH as most so, i can't really speak on it either...


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Personally, he's one of my favorite players in this draft. Denham Brown of UCONN is my 2nd favorite "sleeper".


I like Denham Brown too, his midrange game is money.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> IN OTHER news, they say James White's workouts have been so impressive that he's moved his stock into the 1st round. He's also has been invited back by EVERY single team he's worked out for, which they say, is NOT very common.


Most athletic guy in the draft, he beat Carney in a dunk contest! White threw it down with two hands from the FT line, never seen that from anyone!!!!!!!!!! The guy can dunk from the FT line rather easily with one hand, it's just sick. I like Carney a lot more because of his strength and shooting ability, but White certainly has an upside of his own. 

The reasons White isn't ranked higher
1. Very inconsistant in every aspect.
2. Didn't have enough dominate preoformances or stretches where he took over a game.
3. Very skinny, this is the biggest reason I don't want him. I wish we had a guy like him who could throw it down like him. But he's not going to bring the post d we need, not a great handler or shooter either.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Hustle said:


> Most athletic guy in the draft, he beat Carney in a dunk contest! White threw it down with two hands from the FT line, never seen that from anyone!!!!!!!!!! The guy can dunk from the FT line rather easily with one hand, it's just sick. I like Carney a lot more because of his strength and shooting ability, but White certainly has an upside of his own.
> 
> The reasons White isn't ranked higher
> 1. Very inconsistant in every aspect.
> 2. Didn't have enough dominate preoformances or stretches where he took over a game.
> 3. Very skinny, this is the biggest reason I don't want him. I wish we had a guy like him who could throw it down like him. But he's not going to bring the post d we need, not a great handler or shooter either.


It's strange watching White in a dunk contest, rather than attempting new groundbreaking dunks, which I know he's capable of, he constantly dunks from the free throw line. He dunks with one hand, two hands and between the legs, but all the dunks are from behind the free throw line. 

He would be great in both the high and long jump events, and I'm sure he must have thought about becoming a track and field star before settling on basketball.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> FWIW: Chad Ford chat @ ESPN --- 12 PM ET


Was there any mentioning of the Bulls' draft in the chat?


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> IN OTHER news, they say James White's workouts have been so impressive that he's moved his stock into the 1st round. He's also has been invited back by EVERY single team he's worked out for, which they say, is NOT very common.


...And POOF...There goes my offseason plans

This news excites me AND scares me AT THE SAME TIME.

Getting him in the 2nd round would be HIGHLY unlikely if this continues.

At least Bobby Jones still seems like he'd be there...


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The Celtics have some very intriguing workouts coming up:

June 2: Shelden Williams and Cedric Simmons
June 3: Patrick O'Bryant and Saer Sene

I'm looking very much forward to reading the reports from these workouts.


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## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> June 3: Patrick O'Bryant and Saer Sene


One not to miss.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Shawne Williams of memphis has a chance to move into the LOTTERY?!



> It's doubtful that Memphis forward Shawne Williams will return to college for his sophomore campaign.
> 
> The 6-foot-9, 225-pound Williams, who averaged 13.2 points and 6.2 rebounds as a freshman for the Tigers, told FOXSports.com that he has not signed with an agent yet – but is leaning heavily towards staying in the NBA Draft.
> 
> "Right now I'm probably not going to go back to Memphis," Williams said. "I feel confident, but I'm still leaving the door open in case of an injury or something like that."
> 
> While some projections have Williams as a late first-round pick in the June draft, two NBA executives said that the skilled forward could move himself into the lottery pick with impressive workouts and a strong showing at the pre-draft camp early next month in Orlando.


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Hustle said:


> Most athletic guy in the draft, he beat Carney in a dunk contest! White threw it down with two hands from the FT line, never seen that from anyone!!!!!!!!!! The guy can dunk from the FT line rather easily with one hand, it's just sick. I like Carney a lot more because of his strength and shooting ability, but White certainly has an upside of his own.
> 
> The reasons White isn't ranked higher
> 1. Very inconsistant in every aspect.
> 2. Didn't have enough dominate preoformances or stretches where he took over a game.
> 3. Very skinny, this is the biggest reason I don't want him. I wish we had a guy like him who could throw it down like him. But he's not going to bring the post d we need, not a great handler or shooter either.


Watching David Lee beat White in the McDonald's dunk contest made me LMAO.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Electric Slim said:


> Watching David Lee beat White in the McDonald's dunk contest made me LMAO.


Wasn't that the contest where Lee bounced the ball, and then took off his shirt while the ball was still in the air before dunking it? That was a pretty good contest.


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> June 3: Patrick O'Bryant and Saer Sene


That should be very interesting to hear about. Personally, I think O'Bryant will struggle against Sene's quickness and athletic ability, but against the bulkier centers in the league O'Bryant will really shine. But maybe I have that wrong.


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Hustle said:


> Most athletic guy in the draft, he beat Carney in a dunk contest! White threw it down with two hands from the FT line, never seen that from anyone!!!!!!!!!! The guy can dunk from the FT line rather easily with one hand, it's just sick. I like Carney a lot more because of his strength and shooting ability, but White certainly has an upside of his own.
> 
> The reasons White isn't ranked higher
> 1. Very inconsistant in every aspect.
> 2. Didn't have enough dominate preoformances or stretches where he took over a game.
> 3. Very skinny, this is the biggest reason I don't want him. I wish we had a guy like him who could throw it down like him. But he's not going to bring the post d we need, not a great handler or shooter either.


James White was practically a LOCK for the lottery if he entered the draft out of high school. He was being hailed as the next Vince Carter. Good thing he didn't, with how slowly he developed he probably would've been out of the league by now. His time in college seems to have really honed his skills and now he's an interesting prospect. We have to seriously consider him at #16 just from how long and athletic he is. Add him to the list!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Electric Slim said:


> Watching David Lee beat White in the McDonald's dunk contest made me LMAO.


he only lost cuz he missed...but 3 straight dunks from the free throw line!? and one between the legs


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Not sure if it's been posted already, but more workouts reviews on draftxpress..



> The Rockets bring in an intriguing group of point guards for a very competitive workout. The top two rebounders in the NCAA go up head to head. James White moving up the charts. Shakur and Boone flop, Shannon Brown impresses.


PG's were Foye, Washington, Rondo and Gibson.

Further down has one for you smartmouf - Ager matching up verse Bobby Jones.


> In terms of the Swingmen, it was Maurice Ager who had the best showing. Ager might be “leading” all draft prospects so far in terms of the amount of workouts he’s scheduled--six--with this being the second time we’ve heard of him playing extremely well. Ager is testing out as both a freak athlete and a killer scoring threat, jumping extremely well and shooting the ball with great confidence from the college and NBA 3-point range. Being away from Michigan State’s rigid offensive system appears to be allowing him more freedom to show off his individual skills. The Lakers oddly tested the players from just a step inside the NBA 3-point line, and Ager hit an impressive 18 of his 20 shots in the drills. He is measuring out a legit 6-5 with good length, which is important for him since some have speculated that he might be shorter. His quick feet and experience under Tom Izzo make him a very capable defender in these type of settings.
> 
> His matchup Bobby Jones does not seem to have anywhere near the same polish on the offensive end, particularly in terms of his perimeter shooting and ball-handling ability, but still managed to flash excellent potential as an NBA player. He is measuring out a legit 6-7 with excellent size and good strength, and doing extremely well in the agility testing. Defensively, he is as usual terrific, but he might be even more impressive off the court with his focus and attitude. He did a good job keeping Maurice Ager in front of him for almost the entire workout, but Ager still hit a number of tough, contested jump-shots with a hand in his face.


If only we had an early second round pick or two. Ager sounds interesting aswell, though I haven't seen him play.

More on White.


> Blessed with a fantastic 6-7 frame, super long arms and possibly the most explosive vertical leap in this draft crop, White is a player who was always going to turn some heads once he enters workouts. What’s standing out and surprising everyone who has seen him is how well he is shooting the ball from distance from the perimeter, as well as just how mature he is off the court.
> ...
> White is currently training for a few days with IMG's Joe Abunassar and Dan Barto at the Home Depot Center in Los Angeles, where he is again drawing rave reviews for his skills and attitude. What’s scary is that the staff there claims he is nowhere near his full potential in terms of his where his body is at strength-wise, which means he might even test out better once his core strength and lower body are worked on.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I love how the guys I've targeted in this draft are doing me proud.

Gives me confidence in my skill in evaluating talent.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

From Bill Simmons' Mailbag: Welcome back, mailbag 



> *Q:* What do you guess the over-under is on the number of times Tyrus Thomas' Tremendous Upside Potential gets mentioned in the 2006 NBA draft? I'm picturing an ecstatic Jay Bilas talking faster and faster till his head just explodes like a FemBot from "Austin Powers."
> -- Matt Mertens, Boston
> 
> *SG:* I'm more excited for Dick Vitale to pull out a chainsaw on live TV and start swinging it like Leatherface when J.J. Redick drops into the 20s. And it's going to happen.


Pretty funny stuff, as is most of the sports guy's draft commentary. I'm already looking forward to his draft diary, it's usually very entertaining.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Some early buzz that I am hearing personally

To reiterate, GS really likes Patrick Obryant. Makes alot of sense in my opinion. They have something at every position. Also, Mully has been to Europe.

Speaking of Europe, rumor has it that McHale has been spending alot of time there as well. Perhaps to see on Andrea Bargnani. 

Looks like the Spurs will get both Ian Mahinmi and Argentinian Ace Luis Scola next season

The scouts I talk to think either Rudy Gay or Rodney Carney are going to be there at 16. One will fall. One of the reasons why appears that Shawnee Williams has been impressive enough in agent workouts that he could go 8-15. 

Im hearing the same James White stuff everyone else is hearing. Mind blowing athletic ability and length. People question whats happening between the ears, BUT BUT BUT, alot of scouts are talking about playing for 2 colleges and 3 head coaches in 4 years and asking themselves if he might suceed in a consistent environment. Right now he is going round 1. 

Cedric Simmons just kind of hangs around in the second half of the lottery. No one knows why, but there doesnt seem to be a player with a lesser range then him outside of Aldridge, Morrison, Thomas or Bargnani. Its like he is locked in 10-14. No higher, no lower. 

Houston is a likely spot for either of the 2 freaky wings (Gay or Carney) and also like Shelden Williams. If houston doesnt get Williams, Shelden might fall out of the lottery with Seattle as the only other logical spot for him

Vasquez will play one more year in Spain and has told Orlando he will be over in 2 years. Dont know if this will have an effect on Darkos resigning or not. 

The draft seems to have lots of 7 footers sitting in the middle of round 1, Hilton Armstrong, Saer Sene, Aaron Gray, near 7 footer Josh Boone (who might be closer to round 2) Oleksiy Pecherov. One talent scout says of this group of players if you want day one production you go with Armstrong. But if your willing to wait 1/2 to 1 year (his words, not mine), go with Saer Sene. Could be a "Samuel Dalembert who actually likes the game of basketball"

The great missing player seems to be Daniel Gibson, who alot of people thought was a lottery pick seems to be this years Chris Duhon

Thabo Sefolosha might have a first round promise.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Thanks for the update Rlucas!

I have a hard time believing either Gay or Carney will be there for us to pick at #16, but if one of them is there we need to pick him. I don't care if we don't need Gay right now, if he is there at #16, we can't afford to not pick him in my opinion. His star potential is too obvious to miss out on with a mid first round pick.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Thabo Sefolosha might have a first round promise.


Draftexpress makes him sound great...

Those guys do a good job of talking players up...

They even have the Bulls taking him @ 16

man i wish i could see these prospects first hand.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Great stuff, rlucas. 

I wish we could grab either Carney or Gay at #16, but I have my doubts. To tell you the truth, theres no chance Gay is there IMO. Carney stock was high once the NCAA tournament started but ended dissapointing. But he is a good player and someome that could be worthy of Pax's attention. He is not a 2 though.

Who is the odd man out in San Antonio? I know Scola wont come to the NBA to play 2 minutes of garbage time per night, and Oberto had the same plans. So given that Fabricio will be a lot more comfortable next season and off the rookie tag, I dont know how that one will play out. Scola had another terrific playoff performance tonight, and Splitter did OK in limited minutes.

First round or not, theres no way we take James White as some people suggested. Pax isnt that dumb.

Sene might make sense for the Knicks. They have two low first round picks, and might "gamble" on him. You should know a lot better than me there, but the Knicks still lack size and inside toughness. Once it was Nene, why not Sene in 2006? :biggr


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Hustle said:


> Most athletic guy in the draft, he beat Carney in a dunk contest! White threw it down with two hands from the FT line, never seen that from anyone!!!!!!!!!! The guy can dunk from the FT line rather easily with one hand, it's just sick. I like Carney a lot more because of his strength and shooting ability, but White certainly has an upside of his own.
> 
> The reasons White isn't ranked higher
> 1. Very inconsistant in every aspect.
> 2. Didn't have enough dominate preoformances or stretches where he took over a game.
> 3. Very skinny, this is the biggest reason I don't want him. I wish we had a guy like him who could throw it down like him. But he's not going to bring the post d we need, not a great handler or shooter either.


James White will be the most athletic player in the NBA. He's fast as hell and gets way up. It's really no suprise that he's blowing people away in workouts. However, he rarely uses his great athleticism in games and is 23. I'd be leary of taking him too high.

The good thing about him though is that he is really well rounded and a team player and so even if he never develops the skills to be a go to scorer he could very well be content to be a great defender and finisher as a role player.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> First round or not, theres no way we take James White as some people suggested. Pax isnt that dumb.


Quite harsh.

Kinda indirectly callin' me dumb huh.

Why would it be dumb to take him?...Not enough letters in his name?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Quite harsh.
> 
> Kinda indirectly callin' me dumb huh.
> 
> Why would it be dumb to take him?...Not enough letters in his name?


I dont think I need to speak for Chapu but I dont think he meant to say it was dumb to pick White, and to call you dumb, just unlikely that Pax would pick him. Came out wrong. Pax ought to look at White. I 100% agree with you there. We just need freaks. White is a freak. And certainly Whites game is better made for the NBA then college. But I think his game might be better suited for a wide open team (why cant anyone in the east play like Phoenix, why is it that the Western Conference have fast break basketball 100% cornered for 25 years?) But I agree with Chapu that Pax probably wont look at White. As Chapu has said somewhere, its too bad Pax doesnt seem interested in rolling the dice every now and then. Pax ought to take a look at some of the projects. But my guess is that he will pass on Bargnani for an established college talent and then pass on a guy like Sene for a Hilton Armstrong at 16. Its safe, conservative and might make the Bulls slightly better in the near and short term. But you cant win titles until you take a chance.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Quite harsh.
> 
> Kinda indirectly callin' me dumb huh.
> 
> Why would it be dumb to take him?...Not enough letters in his name?


Well, if you said the Bulls should take White white their own pick, yeah. But I wasnt attacking you, sorry. 

I think #16 is a little bit high for him and we can get better value for the pick. Just that, maybe saying Pax would be dumb was a little to harsh, but by no means I was calling you out. :angel:

And yes, as rlucas said, I would also have a hard time seeing Pax drafting White or Sene there, even if he sees some positive things during workouts.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I dont think I need to speak for Chapu but I dont think he meant to say it was dumb to pick White, and to call you dumb, just unlikely that Pax would pick him. Came out wrong. Pax ought to look at White. I 100% agree with you there. We just need freaks. White is a freak. And certainly Whites game is better made for the NBA then college. But I think his game might be better suited for a wide open team (why cant anyone in the east play like Phoenix, why is it that the Western Conference have fast break basketball 100% cornered for 25 years?) But I agree with Chapu that Pax probably wont look at White. As Chapu has said somewhere, its too bad Pax doesnt seem interested in rolling the dice every now and then. Pax ought to take a look at some of the projects. But my guess is that he will pass on Bargnani for an established college talent and then pass on a guy like Sene for a Hilton Armstrong at 16. Its safe, conservative and might make the Bulls slightly better in the near and short term. But you cant win titles until you take a chance.


I'm not trying to take you to task but I'd like a little clarification on your position that the Bulls need freaks. Which of the remaining teams are laden with the athletic freaks? I can't think of a freak on the Spurs, unless you want to call Parker one. On the Mavs? Dirk? Pistons? The Wallaces? The Heat? Shaq and Wade obvsiously. Brand because of his long arms? Marion and Barbosa? 

Tyson is just about as freaky an athlete as any of the aforementioned players. He's just one-tenth as skilled as them. 

What am I getting at? Athletic freaks aren't enough. Good teams aren't stocked with dunk champions and track stars. Good teams have a great player or two and those players very often are freaks. They don't have tons of freaky athletes up and down their rosters.


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## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think that it's pretty clear who the Bulls will take with the Knicks pick;who we will take with our pck is interesting though. Draft Express has us taking Sefolosha at 16, but I think you'd have to throw Bobby Jones, Marquinhos, Armstrong and Sene in the mix as well. Personally, I would love for the Bulls to take Sene, but they will go the safe route and take Armstrong. However, if he takes Paul Davis @16 I would be highly pissed.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



TripleDouble said:


> I'm not trying to take you to task but I'd like a little clarification on your position that the Bulls need freaks. Which of the remaining teams are laden with the athletic freaks? I can't think of a freak on the Spurs, unless you want to call Parker one. On the Mavs? Dirk? Pistons? The Wallaces? The Heat? Shaq and Wade obvsiously. Brand because of his long arms? Marion and Barbosa?
> 
> Tyson is just about as freaky an athlete as any of the aforementioned players. He's just one-tenth as skilled as them.
> 
> What am I getting at? Athletic freaks aren't enough. Good teams aren't stocked with dunk champions and track stars. Good teams have a great player or two and those players very often are freaks. They don't have tons of freaky athletes up and down their rosters.


The Bulls need guys who can finish at the basket. The Bulls dont have one. Not one. Even Deng hasnt delievered a facial. All of the remaining teams have guys who finish at the rim. Dallas has a ton of them. The Bulls dont have any. Tyson might be able to finish, but he cant catch the basketball. Freaks also can guard multilple positions and change ends quickly. 

D- If the Bulls take Paul Davis at 16, I am done with the team


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



dsouljah9 said:


> I think that it's pretty clear who the Bulls will take with the Knicks pick;who we will take with our pck is interesting though. Draft Express has us taking Sefolosha at 16, but I think you'd have to throw Bobby Jones, Marquinhos, Armstrong and Sene in the mix as well. Personally, I would love for the Bulls to take Sene, but they will go the safe route and take Armstrong. However, if he takes Paul Davis @16 I would be highly pissed.


Could you please tell me who are we drafting with the Knicks pick from 1 to 5?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The Bulls need guys who can finish at the basket. The Bulls dont have one. Not one. Even Deng hasnt delievered a facial. All of the remaining teams have guys who finish at the rim. Dallas has a ton of them. The Bulls dont have any. Tyson might be able to finish, but he cant catch the basketball. Freaks also can guard multilple positions and change ends quickly.
> 
> D- If the Bulls take Paul Davis at 16, I am done with the team


Freak and finisher are not the same. Nash is a good finisher but no one would call him a freak. Josh Howard is a nice versitile defender and finisher but he is hardly a freak. A good athlete, but not a freak. When I think freak I think James White, McGrady, Iggy, Marion etc... Howard and Stackhouse are not in their class.


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The Bulls need guys who can finish at the basket. The Bulls dont have one. Not one.



But from what I understand, White rarely gets to the basket in games. Sure he has the hops and the hands, but he may turn out to be more Eddie Robinson (or hey, BEN GORDON) than Dwyane Wade.


----------



## Machinehead

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I would laugh my *** off and then dance a jig if the Bulls took Paul Davis at #16


----------



## Showtyme

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



yodurk said:


> James White was practically a LOCK for the lottery if he entered the draft out of high school. He was being hailed as the next Vince Carter. Good thing he didn't, with how slowly he developed he probably would've been out of the league by now. *His time in college seems to have really honed his skills* and now he's an interesting prospect. We have to seriously consider him at #16 just from how long and athletic he is. Add him to the list!


Agreed to all of that, except for the bolded parts. I don't think it REALLY honed his skills. He's become better but had a ton of trouble at the beginning of college. He was mostly a scrappy athlete, but one thing that did improve a lot since his freshman year was his defensive ability. I don't think he's a GREAT defender but he's definitely a lot better... I remember Cincy counted on him to lock down on guys; whether or not he did it, I don't really remember, but I remember him getting the toughest defensive matchups.

But he still doesn't have a great handle (a lost art among many SG's in the NBA... by the way, these playoffs have been INCREDIBLE but one thing there's been a lot of is sloppy turnovers), he's not strong enough to defend the NBA-style hulking SF's... I can't tell if he's more like a Josh Smith (an impressive and quick-learning athletic FREAKO) or if he's more like a Travis Outlaw (a slow-learning poor athletic FREAKO). I'd hope his time in college got him closer to Josh Smith, since both Smith and Outlaw came straight out of high school, but it's sort of hard to say.

He's worth a look but I have a feeling he'll either fall in the drafts as the workout season moves on, or someone will make a mistake in taking a risk on him.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Showtyme said:


> Agreed to all of that, except for the bolded parts. I don't think it REALLY honed his skills. He's become better but had a ton of trouble at the beginning of college. He was mostly a scrappy athlete, but one thing that did improve a lot since his freshman year was his defensive ability. I don't think he's a GREAT defender but he's definitely a lot better... I remember Cincy counted on him to lock down on guys; whether or not he did it, I don't really remember, but I remember him getting the toughest defensive matchups.
> 
> But he still doesn't have a great handle (a lost art among many SG's in the NBA... by the way, these playoffs have been INCREDIBLE but one thing there's been a lot of is sloppy turnovers), he's not strong enough to defend the NBA-style hulking SF's... I can't tell if he's more like a Josh Smith (an impressive and quick-learning athletic FREAKO) or if he's more like a Travis Outlaw (a slow-learning poor athletic FREAKO). I'd hope his time in college got him closer to Josh Smith, since both Smith and Outlaw came straight out of high school, but it's sort of hard to say.
> 
> He's worth a look but I have a feeling he'll either fall in the drafts as the workout season moves on, or someone will make a mistake in taking a risk on him.



Im not sure I 100% agree this BUT I do think here was a kid who really wasted his time in college. If he went to the pros, learned for a few years on what it took to be an NBA shooting guard, I think he would be quite a player. There is this perception that college is the best place to learn, but not always. In fact, probably not most of the time. He needed to learn how to be a 2 guard, and college played him at the 3 and alot of 4 in 4 years with 3 coaches and a transfer. He would have benefitted from pro coaching, pro competition and some focused work on his game. The skill set is there for greatness, but I wonder if his developement will kill his chance


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Draftexpress has 
15th Rodney Carney
16th Thabo Sefolansa
17th Mardy Collins

All these guys would fit our need at SG. 

What are peoples thoughts on these three players and how do they stack up?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> Thanks for the update Rlucas!
> 
> I have a hard time believing either Gay or Carney will be there for us to pick at #16, but if one of them is there we need to pick him. I don't care if we don't need Gay right now, if he is there at #16, we can't afford to not pick him in my opinion. His star potential is too obvious to miss out on with a mid first round pick.


no way in hell rudy gay falls to 16...carney MAYBE


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

More comments from Ford on the bigs :



> Brett (Rockford, IL): Hey Chad. With the emphasis continuing to shift over to playing "smallball", would the Bulls be better off grabbing Brandon Roy with whatever pick they end up with or is Tyrus Thomas still the no-brainer choice? Thanks!
> 
> Chad Ford: Here's an example of the dilemma. Having Roy to play at the two with Kirk Hinrich gives you a big guard with a tough defensive attitude. Because Roy's ball handling skills are so good, you can play him together with Hinrich or Ben Gordon. However, from what I hear, if the Bulls can grab a big guy who can score in the block with their pick from the Knicks their going to do it. Tyrus Thomas and LaMarcus Aldridge both interest them.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> Could you please tell me who are we drafting with the Knicks pick from 1 to 5?


With the Knicks pick: Tyrus Thomas, LaMarcus Aldridge, Andrea Bargnani(1-4), Gay, Roy(5)


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I also agree with my man rlucus one of the top SG will fall out of the lotto and hopefully we can draft a SG at 16. I personally thin carney will be there at 16 but time will tell. I think more teams in the Lotto need big men than SG and players like Hilton, Simmons, and O'Bryant will all go in the lotto. My guess there is also the one or two international sleepers that go in the lotto that no one expects and it that happens some one has to fall to 16 for the bulls.

I have two question for rlucus. First, what is up wtih Ray. Everyone has in in the top 7 but i dont here that he is working out with anyone. Second, I must have read that there are at least 15 players whose agents are saying they are in the top 10. Are you hearing that as well?

david


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



darlets said:


> Draftexpress has
> 15th Rodney Carney
> 16th Thabo Sefolansa
> 17th Mardy Collins
> 
> All these guys would fit our need at SG.
> 
> What are peoples thoughts on these three players and how do they stack up?


If Aldridge, Bargnani, and Thomas are all off the board, I would seriously consider drafting Carney with the #4 or #5. I think his NBA ceiling is higher than that of Roy, and at the very least will be that defensive oriented SG we have coveted since the pairing of Gordon & Hinrich.

I hadn't heard of Sefolosha until about 4 weeks ago. Seems like a Pax guy & is defense oriented who drives to the bucket and is a decent ballhandler. Definately someone we should be looking at, but I have never seen him play so can't comment much about liking or disliking him.

Collins would probably mean Duhon's role would be reduced to a defensive role for when Hinrich gets tired. Offensively, he pairs up well with either Gordon or Hinrich. Defense is not as good as Carney or Sefolosha from the scouting report, but he would be a highly complementary player to our existing guys. I have him ranked right below Brewer on the depth chart if going for a wing at the #16.

Between those three, I guess my ranking would be
#1 Carney
#2 Collins
#3 Sefolosha (although I rank him here only because I don't know much about him)

Ranking all the SG prospects considering fit with the team, I like:
1. Carney
2. Roy
3. Brewer
4. Collins
5. Fernandez
6. Reddick
7. Sefolosha
8. Farmar


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Carney at #16 is a no-brainer if he is there, but I don't think he will be unless he has some terrible workouts.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

IMO Carney is much more of a 3 than a 2. Obviously we would consider him if he, somehow, falls to 16.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Slightly OT: Does anyone else think it's a shame that Al Horford isn't coming out this year? In my opinion he is a better prospect than Noah. He looks like a young Karl Malone to me, he is chiseled and has a great power game under the basket. I think he is going to be a very good player, and I would love to have him on the Bulls.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> IMO Carney is much more of a 3 than a 2. Obviously we would consider him if he, somehow, falls to 16.


It will be interesting seeing the pre-draft workouts, but I suspect that Carney is faster than Roy, Collins, or Brewer. I don't see Carney at the three at all. His ballhandling is probably greatest weakness in terms of ability to handle in traffic. He hustles, is fast, and can shoot over people, all great skills you want in a SG.

If he develops a good head fake and fearless attitude taking it to the hoop (showed some signs of this in college already), he could be a monster.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> Slightly OT: Does anyone else think it's a shame that Al Horford isn't coming out this year? In my opinion he is a better prospect than Noah. He looks like a young Karl Malone to me, he is chiseled and has a great power game under the basket. I think he is going to be a very good player, and I would love to have him on the Bulls.



i 2nd that...and i've been saying since the hype for Noah got crazy.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Rhyder said:


> Ranking all the SG prospects considering fit with the team, I like:
> 1. Carney
> 2. Roy
> 3. Brewer
> 4. Collins
> 5. Fernandez
> 6. Reddick
> 7. Sefolosha
> 8. Farmar


Not bad.

It's so hard to rank the guys that we haven't seen...Like Fernandez or Sefolosha...So I'm just gonna rank think based on how they sound...

1. Roy
2. Brewer
3. Carney
4. Sefolosha
5. White
6. Collins
7. Bobby Jones
9. Fernandez
10. Reddick

Clearly subject to change due to news in workouts....This is where I'm standing now...


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I just got back from the gym where Charlie V is working out with Rudy Gay and some other guys. Nothing really to report. They were just working drills and had trainers passing them the ball, but its always interesting to be a glass wall away from what looked to be a spirited warm up. 

Giusd, I have heard nothing on Ray. And I dont have too much too add on that. Dont know much about him myself. And your right, there always is 50 guys who could go in round 1 and 20 guys who are going among the top 10. I believe the thinking is that one of those for sure types will fall out as someone, such as Charlie V last year or Andrew Bynum, sneaks in. There will always be one or two twists. So its not impossible that a guy who was a lock for the top 10 (Gay, Carney) are there at 16 like Gerald Green was last year.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Just been randomly looking at the mock drafts, what are people's thoughts on Taj Gray? Draftxpress' report on him is quite interesting.


> Gray is an energetic, versatile and skilled PF who is probably the biggest reason behind Oklahoma's success this year besides the coaching of Kelvin Sampson. It's scary to think that this is just his first year of playing Division I basketball, his rapid improvement over the season considering the transition he's had to make has been nothing short of remarkable for those who have followed him.
> 
> Gray is extremely athletic and will likely thrive in an up-tempo offense; he runs the floor very well and has an outstanding vertical leap. He gets off the floor instantly and can bounce back quickly to go up for the rebound or blocked shot. Gray is a fantastic player to have in transition because he can handle the ball for short periods of time, pass real well, or get off the floor to finish with a thunderous alley-oop.


More at the link.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Not bad.
> 
> It's so hard to rank the guys that we haven't seen...Like Fernandez or Sefolosha...So I'm just gonna rank think based on how they sound...


I've actually seen Fernandez play about 15 games over the past three seasons. I was really high on the kid before we had Gordon, but considering Gordon already on the team I don't see Fernandez as bringing much new to the table. He is taller and drives to the hoop, but I think he'll be a liability on the defensive end. We already have our scorer, so I think Rudy drops down the depth chart.

I have never seen Sene or Sefolosha, so all I have to go is off of scouting reports with these two. Neither seems to make a lot of sense to me considering other guys likely to be available unless one of them really wows Pax.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I don't see Sefolosha going first round 

Being a Swiss Guard the buyout with the Vatican will scare away a lot of GM's


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

LMAO

I JUST realized the DRAFT LOTTO is TONIGHTTTTTTTTTT

I'm nervous and excited at the same time....If we get #4 or #5, I'll throw my tv out the window....

MARK IT


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> LMAO
> 
> I JUST realized the DRAFT LOTTO is TONIGHTTTTTTTTTT
> 
> I'm nervous and excited at the same time....If we get #4 or #5, I'll throw my tv out the window....
> 
> MARK IT


It's tomorrow.

NBA.com Key Dates


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



LegoHat said:


> It's tomorrow.
> 
> NBA.com Key Dates


DAMN! noooooooooooooooooooo LOL

do the east finals start tomorrow?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> DAMN! noooooooooooooooooooo LOL
> 
> do the east finals start tomorrow?


Yep, looking forward to it.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> LMAO
> 
> I JUST realized the DRAFT LOTTO is TONIGHTTTTTTTTTT
> 
> I'm nervous and excited at the same time....If we get #4 or #5, I'll throw my tv out the window....
> 
> MARK IT


Man..i thought it was sunday...I was so geeked about it until i found out the truth.

it's like waiting for christmas...lol..


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Hmmmm......

Sam Smith in the Tribune 



> Double dribbles
> 
> The Raptors let go former Purdue coach Gene Keady. It's part of a shakeup under new general manager Bryan Colangelo. Mauricio Gherardini, an executive with Benetton Treviso of the top league in Italy, was added as assistant general manager. That's expected to help the Raptors get Bargnani, who played for Benetton. *The talk is Bargnani's camp will put out word he could return to Europe -- like Orlando pick Fran Vasquez did last year -- if he's not a Raptors pick. That should scare off the top teams.* The new Toronto philosophy is said to be to extend Bosh (he says he wants to return) and then concentrate on international players more comfortable playing in Canada.


Don't know quite what to think of this...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

i coulda swore bargnani said he wanted to be a bull in a recent article...

anyway, espn reports that Rajan Rondo has moved up and could possibly taken as high as 7th or 8th by houston or boston...


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Not bad.
> 
> It's so hard to rank the guys that we haven't seen...Like Fernandez or Sefolosha...So I'm just gonna rank think based on how they sound...
> 
> 1. Roy
> 2. Brewer
> 3. Carney
> 4. Sefolosha
> 5. White
> 6. Collins
> 7. Bobby Jones
> 9. Fernandez
> 10. Reddick


One thing for sure Collins is the last guy we want. He will never hit a wide open three, and is a horrid FT shooter, we really have no place for that.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> i coulda swore bargnani said he wanted to be a bull in a recent article...
> 
> anyway, espn reports that Rajan Rondo has moved up and could possibly taken as high as 7th or 8th by houston or boston...


He did say that, it was something like...if there was no draft and you got to chose your team where would you go ....... chicago

Rondo in the top 10, sounds like a joke to me, but I'll take it one more player to slide down to us (carneyX). It makes me think I'm right in thinking we could nab the 7 or 8 pick with Du and 16.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> i coulda swore bargnani said he wanted to be a bull in a recent article...


He did, but unfortunately it's not always the player's decision in these cases. Agents and advisors always have their say, and young players can be talked into a lot of things by the wrong people. For now, I'll take it for what it is, a rumour.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Hustle said:


> He did say that, it was something like...if there was no draft and you got to chose your team where would you go ....... chicago
> 
> Rondo in the top 10, sounds like a joke to me, but I'll take it one more player to slide down to us (carneyX). It makes me think I'm right in thinking we could nab the 7 or 8 pick with Du and 16.


I just don't see how Carney, Brewer or O'Bryant will be availible @ 16 with New Orleans having two picks before us & every other team before us having a need for any of those three....

the 13 best prospects for the lottery are :

Aldridge
Bargnani
O'Bryant
S. Williams
Morrison
Gay
M. Williams
Carney
Brewer
Roy
O'Bryant
Randy Foye
Thomas

I don't see any of them sliding all the way to 16....no matter who moves up...mainly due to it not being a deep draft..someone would have to come out of NOWHERE to move these players back...


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> the 12 best prospects for the lottery are :
> 
> Aldridge
> Bargnani
> O'Bryant
> S. Williams
> Morrison
> Gay
> M. Williams
> Carney
> Brewer
> Roy
> O'Bryant
> Randy Foye
> 
> I don't see any of them sliding all the way to 16....no matter who moves up...mainly due to it not being a deep draft..someone would have to come out of NOWHERE to move these players back...


I agree with the list 100%, well, not in that order. 

Redick is going to Utah, I don't see any way around that. Rondo, Simmons, Sene, Splitter, Armstrong, Pecherov and Shawne Williams are going to be the biggest x-factors (rondo? I think not,b ut hopefully) we need three of them to go ahead of our pick, it's gonna be close. I actually do think/hope/pray that one of those guys does slip. I can really see the Hornets TAKING sENE or splitter with one of their picks. Shawne Williams may be the next best option for us. He'll be a bit of a project but he's 6'9 and his best position is probably going to be the 2. Long term I think he'll be a good fit.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Hustle said:


> I agree with the list 100%, well, not in that order.
> 
> Redick is going to Utah, I don't see any way around that. Rondo, Simmons, Sene, Splitter, Armstrong, and Shawne Williams are going to be the biggest x-factors (rondo? I think not,b ut hopefully). I actually do think/hope/pray that one of those guys does slip.


yeah, the list was in no specific order...

i agree with reddick going to utah also....

i also hope one of those guys falls to us...


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

If the Bulls are in position to draft Bargnani and he is indeed Pax's guy, he will take it. That report is crap. Bargnani wouldnt play that stupid game and there is no problems with BT.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

though this may sound crazy. i don't want the bulls to get the 1st pick as it gains too much attention and scrutiny. so the 2nd and 3rd is always nice. but im secretly hoping they drop to 4th or even 5th. because none of the bigs are going to make a difference. and by the time they do the bulls pay roll will be over the roof. im wondering why brewer isn't getting more attention. he could be perfect for the bulls smaller gaurds. can bring up the ball and be the point and he can also gaurd the bigger gaurds. im high on brewer...


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



kulaz3000 said:


> though this may sound crazy. i don't want the bulls to get the 1st pick as it gains too much attention and scrutiny. so the 2nd and 3rd is always nice. but im secretly hoping they drop to 4th or even 5th. because none of the bigs are going to make a difference. and by the time they do the bulls pay roll will be over the roof. im wondering why brewer isn't getting more attention. he could be perfect for the bulls smaller gaurds. can bring up the ball and be the point and he can also gaurd the bigger gaurds. im high on brewer...


And whats the problem with that? Even if we are way over the cap, we can re-sign them.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

well you forget that if jordan. wasn't the star he was and had the influence he had. reinsdorf may have never resigned jackson. pippen. rodman etc. look what happened once jordan left. they went back to being tight with the pocket and he let everyone go... not saying he is as tight as d.sterling but i don't see him doing what they are doing in new york either. 

but regardless it was just an afterthought. i mean my point was that bigs usually take longer to develop. and i think they could a already established big. someone like wilcox or pryizbilla. but if you think about it. chanlder is still a project and still developing... 

i just like the fact that brewer is long and athletic and could be that perfect defensive gaurd that can also handle the rock...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



El Chapu said:


> If the Bulls are in position to draft Bargnani and he is indeed Pax's guy, he will take it. That report is crap. Bargnani wouldnt play that stupid game and there is no problems with BT.


until we get WORD from pax...none of these players are his "guys"


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

*IF*


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I just don't see how Carney, Brewer or O'Bryant will be availible @ 16 with New Orleans having two picks before us & every other team before us having a need for any of those three....
> 
> the 12 best prospects for the lottery are :
> 
> Aldridge
> Bargnani
> O'Bryant
> S. Williams
> Morrison
> Gay
> M. Williams
> Carney
> Brewer
> Roy
> O'Bryant
> Randy Foye
> 
> I don't see any of them sliding all the way to 16....no matter who moves up...mainly due to it not being a deep draft..someone would have to come out of NOWHERE to move these players back...



I'm not as high on Thomas as others, but I would think he's atleast top 12..........probably an oversight, due to excitement?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> I'm not as high on Thomas as others, but I would think he's atleast top 12..........probably an oversight, due to excitement?


lol my fault...i thought i listed him....

time to edit


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Was watching ESPN and noticed they had Tyrus Thomas @ 229 LBS.

at least 10 more lbs of muscle by the time the season starts is not out of the realm of possibility.

What if he measures in @ a legit 6'10?!

Suddenly a 6'10' 240lb looks a little Jermaine O'neal / Amareish.

It's crazy how measuresments can alter ones opinion


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> at least 10 more lbs of muscle by the time the season starts is not out of the realm of possibility.


Well he finally quelled my doubt about his body allowing him to put on much weight to actually bang in the post. I don't think the other 10 lbs matters much right now as he'll most likely need to be retrained on where to target the weight training later on, atleast now we know he can work on it. Atleast now I don't have to worry about him being another Chandler, my biggest knock on him.



> What if he measures in @ a legit 6'10?!


It's scary to think that he's only 19, so he probably hasn't stopped growing.The taller he gets, the better he will be. Can you imagine a 6'10 version of Marion, christ.



> It's crazy how measuresments can alter ones opinion


Well it's has gone a long way in changing mine. Now I wonder how will it all impact his game and his confidence, with his attitude I can't see it not helping.

Now I'm going to have to wipe the slate clean and make my mind up again. Damn it!


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Was watching ESPN and noticed they had Tyrus Thomas @ 229 LBS.
> 
> at least 10 more lbs of muscle by the time the season starts is not out of the realm of possibility.
> 
> What if he measures in @ a legit 6'10?!
> 
> Suddenly a 6'10' 240lb looks a little Jermaine O'neal / Amareish.
> 
> It's crazy how measuresments can alter ones opinion


I'll wait for the official measurements to come out from the pre-draft camp before I get too excited about this. What kind of insight does ESPN have into Thomas' weight anyway?


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> Was watching ESPN and noticed they had Tyrus Thomas @ 229 LBS.
> 
> at least 10 more lbs of muscle by the time the season starts is not out of the realm of possibility.
> 
> What if he measures in @ a legit 6'10?!
> 
> Suddenly a 6'10' 240lb looks a little Jermaine O'neal / Amareish.
> 
> It's crazy how measuresments can alter ones opinion


It is, but at the same time, it's somewhat justified in this case. Watching Thomas, it certainly _looked_ to me that he was more than 215 to 220 lbs. And he generally looked like he played with a fair bit of strength. That's why the numbers are important, because they give some objective way to compare what we see on the court. In this case, since we're talking about a guy who's strength, size, and athleticism seem like the major questions, I think the numbers on him are gonna be very important.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

And "the talk" Smith is reporting seems pretty unlikely to me. Smith's contacts that he reports on as "NBA league insiders", I think, aren't very high on Euros in general. He made several comments along the course of a the year and last summer that painted a very skeptical view of Euros after the Vasquez debacle and gave the impression no one would consider taking a Euro very high because of it.

Maybe some GMs wouldn't, but it seems to me any sensible GM would educate himself about the particular guy. Certainly there seems to be plenty of interest in Bargnani at the top of the draft, so I'd guess Smith's guys/opinions don't reflect any more than those of a small minority.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

My gut feeling says we get the 2nd pick or the 4th pick of the draft. However, I'm thinking it's probably #2. 

It's a big day.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

HELP, can anyone give me LIVE results in realtime? My cable went off this morning, seems someone cut it outside.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



Mikedc said:


> It is, but at the same time, it's somewhat justified in this case. Watching Thomas, it certainly _looked_ to me that he was more than 215 to 220 lbs. And he generally looked like he played with a fair bit of strength. That's why the numbers are important, because they give some objective way to compare what we see on the court. In this case, since we're talking about a guy who's strength, size, and athleticism seem like the major questions, I think the numbers on him are gonna be very important.



If he 6' 10" that does help alot...........BUT, does the guy have a reliable offensive game to say 10 ft?

We have a guy who's a rebounding and defensive giant. So, I'm not worried about his defensive game or being tall enough or athletic enough, he is. It's that his offensive game was so limited. Hell, Chandler occassionally would make a 7 or 8 footer and I'd be screaming with excitement.............only to crash back to reality as he'd miss every other shot.

Thomas' height, heart, desire, defensive ability and passion don't concern me at all. His offensive game does.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



chifaninca said:


> If he 6' 10" that does help alot...........BUT, does the guy have a reliable offensive game to say 10 ft?
> 
> We have a guy who's a rebounding and defensive giant. So, I'm not worried about his defensive game or being tall enough or athletic enough, he is. It's that his offensive game was so limited. Hell, Chandler occassionally would make a 7 or 8 footer and I'd be screaming with excitement.............only to crash back to reality as he'd miss every other shot.
> 
> Thomas' height, heart, desire, defensive ability and passion don't concern me at all. His offensive game does.


Well, he has shown he can hit a 15-18 ft'er, can he do it consistently? I have no clue. A gang of great players couldn't shoot very well coming into the NBA, but as long as you have a player with desire & the ethic to work on it, I'd take that chance.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Some Chad tidbits:

*On Thomas and Aldridge:*
I think he's (Tyrus Thomas) Stromile Swift with a motor which actually is a big compliment. If Swift actually played hard, he could be a dominant player in the league. Aldridge doesn't have the upside of Thomas, but I think he's more ready to come in and play now. I think he's a more skilled offensive player than people realize. He can get it done both inside and out. I think he's an obvious fit for the Bulls.

*On Sene:*
Yes, he has a 7-foot-8 wingspan. Teams really like him. He dominated in the Hoop Summit and then looked good in Belgium. I think he's a mid to late first rounder from what I hear. There aren't many good centers in this draft, so teams will reach. I'm not sure I agree with the philosophy of taking kids so raw ... (and he's VERY raw) but the reality is that teams do it every year (look at the Lakers grabbing of Andrew Bynum 10 to 20 spots ahead of where he probably shoudl've went in the draft). If it pays off, they've got a big time asset. If it doesn't, obviously fans and owners have pretty short memories because a lot of guys with big paying jobs are more wrong than right. 

*His favorites players:*
This year I like Andrea Bargnani, Brandon Roy and Randy Foye. I'm also a fan of Rondo despite the fact that scouts have his stock everywhere from the lottery to the late first round.

*On team needs:*
I think the Blazers, Bulls, Hawks, Celtics and Warriors are all teams that will look at trades depending on where they land in the lotter. All five teams are loaded with young talented players. What they need are a few veterans to balance things out. Combine that with no franchise players at the top and I think we're going to see some trades. 

*Eddy Curry trade winner:*
do you think that Eddy Curry, at only 23 years of age, is better than any player in this draft? If so, doesn't that mean that the Knicks' trading away this lottery pick wasn't so bad?

SportsNation Chad Ford: (2:45 PM ET ) No way. Factor in his salary, his heart problem, his lack of rebounding and conditioning and no ... he's not nearly as valuable as the No. 2 pick in the draft.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

This Sene guy sounds like a good pick if all of our guys are gone by #16. I'd take him over Hilton and I've never seen this kid play.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Thanks for the updates Chapu!

Sene is as intriguing as any player in this draft, I can't imagine us not giving him a good hard look if he's there at #16.

"_If Swift actually played hard, he could be a dominant player in the league._" Oh please, Swift has zero basketball intelligence, and lacks anything resembling an offensive game other than dunking. I'm not sure Chad Ford has been watching the same Swift I saw on the Rockets this season.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Words from the great James White



> What do you think will be your natural position in the NBA?
> 
> JW: I think my natural position will be the two, but hopefully I'll get a chance at the one. And if I get stronger, maybe I can play the three more. But mostly, I think it will be the two.
> 
> What would you say to all those people who think James White is just a dunker, just a guy that jumps a lot?
> 
> JW: I think I'm one of the most versatile players in the draft. I'm an all-around player, a guy that can do a lot of different things. I'm a guy who takes pride on his defense most of all. I think that's my game


Can this guy really play the one!? lol i've never seen him do it but I have a hard time believing that. He sounds like a GOOD pickup for our back-up SG position. Most of the SG's that KILLS us are very atheletic, he can atleast match their atheleticsm & apply pressure defensively.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> Words from the great James White
> 
> 
> 
> Can this guy really play the one!? lol i've never seen him do it but I have a hard time believing that. He sounds like a GOOD pickup for our back-up SG position. Most of the SG's that KILLS us are very atheletic, he can atleast match their atheleticsm & apply pressure defensively.


He played som point at Cinci. I doubt he's got the handles for NBA PG duty but he can handle well enough to bring the ball up now and then. 

I think he could be a nice role player. People will look at his athleticism and think he should be a J Rich, T Mac style go to scorer. That's not his game. He could be a Doug Christie type player (more highlights though) if he continues to work hard at his game.


----------



## EasyMoney

*16th pick*

I hope the Bulls go big with the the Knicks pick, Tyrus Thomas, or Andrea Bargnani, or atleast LaMarcus Aldridge. Then with the 16th pick I would take a little risk with, Saer Sene. This kid could be a monster, a few years down the road. This talk about a tall shooting guard is nuts, Gordon and Hinrich, haven't been out played too much this year. The two of them started to gel better toward the end of the season, and definitley in the playoffs. Deng and Noch are fine for our small forwards. All season long we got hurt because our BIGS could not catch the ball, and dunk the basketball. During the playoffs we started to drive to the basket more and more, but no big to dish off too. Please no more draft picks who have the same hand size as my 4yr old son, and hands of cement !!! 
PAXS THINK BIIIIIIIGGGGGGG If so Eastern conference championship game!!!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: 16th pick*

no offense...

but we have a ton of threads on the picks already, plus a HUGE DRAFT thread at the top..

can we please not make so many unecessary threads about the same thing?


----------



## EasyMoney

*Re: 16th pick*

Roy 
We don't need offense, what killed us against Miami was no big who could play Defense. That's were Sene and Thomas come into play, Defense and more Defense, we scored enough points in that series.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: 16th pick*



EasyMoney said:


> Roy
> We don't need offense, what killed us against Miami was no big who could play Defense. That's were Sene and Thomas come into play, Defense and more Defense, we scored enough points in that series.



Don't you think having a big shooting guard who can defend would be good for matchups too?  Gordon isn't a stellar defender, though he is improving, he is never gonna be taller than the generously listed 6'3" he is. We definitley need bigs but don't forget that we also have money to use in FA and we can go after bigs there too. If Pax thinks that the top bigs aren't any good I would not complain about him going with Roy. If we draft a big with the KNicks pick I wouldn't complain if we picked up a guy like Brewer or Sefolosh at 16.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: 16th pick*



EasyMoney said:


> Roy
> We don't need offense, what killed us against Miami was no big who could play Defense. That's were Sene and Thomas come into play, Defense and more Defense, we scored enough points in that series.


ugh...i think u read my post wrong lol

REgardless of that, contrary to popular belief, we STILL need offense, a big that can score in the low post. Sometimes we go on long DROUGHTS when we can't his a shot from the perimeter. that's when the BIG guy with the easy baskets comes into play...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

taken from Chad Ford TODAY :



> Chicago Bulls (via the Knicks)
> Odds of winning the lottery: 19.9 percent
> GM John Paxson is voting for Isiah Thomas as executive of the year. Not only did Thomas take the Bulls' big center with medical issues off Paxson's hands, the Knicks executive gave Paxson what could be potentially the No. 1 pick in the draft this year and possibly next year as well.
> The Bulls seem to be set at small forward right now with Luol Deng and Andres Nocioni both coming along nicely.
> What they need is some height and scoring in the frontcourt. While Aldridge might appear to be a slam dunk for them if they draw No. 1, sources say it's Tyrus Thomas whom Paxson really loves.
> Is it a smokescreen? Is Tyson Chandler on the block?
> Aldridge would give them more scoring in the paint, but less defensive toughness. Thomas, like Chandler, can rebound and block shots. But don't the Bulls need more?
> Edge: Thomas





> Marcus College Station: Tyrus Thomas more like Marion or Swift? I hear both comparisons. And what about my boy Aldridge? Highest upside in the draft?
> 
> Chad Ford: I think he's Stromile Swift with a motor which actually is a big compliment. If Swift actually played hard, he could be a dominant player in the league. Aldridge doesn't have the upside of Thomas, but I think he's more ready to come in and play now. I think he's a more skilled offensive player than people realize. He can get it done both inside and out. I think he's an obvious fit for the Bulls.


----------



## darlets

*Re: 16th pick*



The ROY said:


> ugh...i think u read my post wrong lol
> 
> REgardless of that, contrary to popular belief, we STILL need offense, a big that can score in the low post. Sometimes we go on long DROUGHTS when we can't his a shot from the perimeter. that's when the BIG guy with the easy baskets comes into play...


Paxson has stated this often. We need easy points. And he mentioned there's easy points to be had if we can just find a big that can catch and finish when the guards penetrate. Some points in the post as well would be a big benefit. 

And it's worth remembering, through this long offensive drought we have a tougher time playing defense because we don't have as much time to set up our half court d because we're missing.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Must disagree with Chad Ford here 

He is nothing like Swift either ..again like Chandler , other than his ability to jump and cover air on help defense 

Thomas is already way smarter and has an innate feel for the game moreso than either of these two do


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> This Sene guy sounds like a good pick if all of our guys are gone by #16. I'd take him over Hilton and I've never seen this kid play.


I wouldn't be upset with his selection here ..but he is obviously a 3 to 5 year project and it just means that we have to buy help in free agency rather than wait for Sene ( and hope Chandler becomes more of a consistent factor 

It would also mean that we slip from 3 to 5 and take Roy

Whilst I wouldn't be opposed to a project like Sene ( let's face it its going to be at least 3 years before we are legitimately contending for a Conference title ) I just can't see John Boy Paxson going for it


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

FWIW I think most are dissing this draft class and not giving it its due 

Its not a stellar class but I am convinced it isn't as weak as what a lot are making out just because there is no obvious can't miss.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: 16th pick*



ace20004u said:


> Don't you think having a big shooting guard who can defend would be good for matchups too? Gordon isn't a stellar defender, though he is improving, he is never gonna be taller than the generously listed 6'3" he is. We definitley need bigs but don't forget that we also have money to use in FA and we can go after bigs there too. If Pax thinks that the top bigs aren't any good I would not complain about him going with Roy. If we draft a big with the KNicks pick I wouldn't complain if we picked up a guy like Brewer or Sefolosh at 16.


Sefolosh won't be drafted in the 1st round 

I've already said in the Draft thread that as a Swiss Guard the Vatican have too big a buyout that will scare off potential suitors in the first round 

He's a 2nd round stasher that will come across when he finishes his tour of duty


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Toronto has whispered they like Bargnani but I would be shocked if he goes there. Frankly Toronto needs so much but none of the legit #1 pick targets fit a need. I have to think Charlie V and Bosh are the forwards. But maybe with the league going to small ball they will put one or the other at the 5 and take Bargnani or Morrison. I have heard one guy say they love Marcus Williams and after seeing Marcus and Gay with Charlie V yesterday, I think he could be a target. But not at #1. If I were guessing, pure guess, Id say Morrison is the guy. But, they could easily go with a sleeper and Roy/Williams could be the guy. I dont see Aldridge or Thomas there because they absolutely duplicate the size/skills of Bosh/Charlie. The Bulls are set at #2


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I'm ECSTATIC with the 2nd pick!


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Grrrr....Aldridge is my guy. I think he's going #1. :curse:


----------



## remlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Am i the only one that would be completely happy taking Thomas with the 2nd pick? Yes he is raw, but a raw Thomas can put up 13 and 8 w/o blinking an eye (imo). 

I wouldn't be surprised if Pax tried to trade down a few spots and get a player he really likes (Maybe Roy). 

Getting one of the top 2 picks was great for us and whomever we take on draft night will be an instant contributor come November.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bargnani is my guy, but any of Aldridge, Andrea and TT is a big win for the Bulls. And it wouldnt surprise me if they have their pick of all 3 at 2


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

This is the list of problems with the #1 pick

Toronto could draft OUR guy at #1 to trade down in the draft.

They could draft OUR guy @ #1 to trade for a vet.

They're GM knows all about Bargnani, so I've been told, since he was part of their organization? That's what I heard.

But THEN, Aldridge & Bosh are really good friends. So....it's difficult to call really.

They WON'T draft Thomas for THEMSELVES though, I know that much.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



remlover said:


> Am i the only one that would be completely happy taking Thomas with the 2nd pick? Yes he is raw, but a raw Thomas can put up 13 and 8 w/o blinking an eye (imo).


I don't think Roy's coming here, I just can't see Pax trading down for him.

But yes, I'd be EXTREMELY happy getting Thomas also. He'd score 10 ppg alone just off dunks and putbacks.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

rlucus,

are you saying you think Toronto is going to take morrison at number 1? That would be a really interesting pick and makes for a great front court of Bosh, CV, and morrison. That would surprise me but that team is really lacking in leadership but has great players. Morrison could come in much like bird did at boston and be the player that makes everyone else play better.

david


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

The possibilities are making my head hurt


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Is it POSSIBLE that we can combine all these friggin "picks"/"drafts" threads now? They're all OVER the place.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



smARTmouf said:


> The possibilities are making my head hurt


We may or may NOT get the player we covet. Williams or Roy works alot better in Toronto than anyone else, IMO. Alridge also works out there but they need some SORT of backcourt also. The only thing really selling me on Aldridge going is the fact that him and bosh are close, that's it.

But a :

Alridge
Bosh
Villaeuva

frontline!? a match-up NIGHTMARE


----------



## remlover

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



The ROY said:


> I don't think Roy's coming here, I just can't see Pax trading down for him.
> 
> But yes, I'd be EXTREMELY happy getting Thomas also. He'd score 10 ppg alone just off dunks and putbacks.


Reading Pax's comments that Miz posted it seems that Pax will be perfectly content with TT or LA. Watching the tourney and seeing TT mid-range jumper falling makes him such a dangerous weapon in the future if he can make that automatic. Teams trying to match up against him in the NBA won't be an easy thing. 

The 2nd pick coupled with Free Agency/Trades will cause our glaring front court deficiencies to cease.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



giusd said:


> rlucus,
> 
> are you saying you think Toronto is going to take morrison at number 1? That would be a really interesting pick and makes for a great front court of Bosh, CV, and morrison. That would surprise me but that team is really lacking in leadership but has great players. Morrison could come in much like bird did at boston and be the player that makes everyone else play better.
> 
> david



To be frank, Im not sure what I am saying. But there is a possibility, due to need and Colangelo being a real out of the box type thinker, that they could shock the world at #1. If any team in the history of the draft was positioned to shock, its these guys. I think it might be Roy. I really do.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



remlover said:


> Reading Pax's comments that Miz posted it seems that Pax will be perfectly content with TT or LA. Watching the tourney and seeing TT mid-range jumper falling makes him such a dangerous weapon in the future if he can make that automatic. Teams trying to match up against him in the NBA won't be an easy thing.
> 
> The 2nd pick coupled with Free Agency/Trades will cause our glaring front court deficiencies to cease.


Chad Ford said most NBA scouts and Exec's think Thomas has a better offensive game than he let's on. The thing I can say about him that I like most is, he's a GAME CHANGER. On offense (dunks) and on defense (blocks and great defense) he changes the emotional tide of the game. That's what I like most about him.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I really don't see why Toronto wouldn't take Aldridge. A front court of he, Villenueva and Bosh would be pretty sick. Aldridge is a bit smaller than ideal, but he's got great reach and he's a better option at C than Bosh.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I could also see Toronto trading their #1 down to whomever selects Brandon Roy or Marcus Williams plus a 2nd rounder.

They have a ton of options.

Remember, about a month ago they said they were open to trading their pick for a vet. Now that they're #1, that might change, who knows.

Let's give em Chandler, Duhon & the #16 for their #1 & Morrison Peterson 

C Chandler
F Bosh
F Villeava
G #16 (Brewer, Fernandez etc.)
G Duhon


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Bargnani played tuesday:

29 Minutes
9 Points
1-3 2PT FG
1-4 3PT FG
4-4 FT
8 Rebounds (2 Off)
1 Block
1 Assist
2 Steals
4 TOs


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

Pax In A Position Of Power

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...ttery,1,7602576.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines


> Still, Paxson isn't complaining. He called Thomas a "game-changer."
> 
> "He can block and rebound," he said. "He's not afraid."


The ONLY player he commented on. HAHAHAHA he wants THOMAS!! ya'll might as well get used to it...Chad ford and his "sources" were right


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

John Nash & Tony DiLeo's thought's on Thomas :



> Both Nash and Philadelphia 76ers Senior Vice President of Basketball Operations Tony DiLeo believe Thomas has a chance to be the guy.
> 
> Thomas averaged 12.3 points, 9.2 rebounds and 3.1 blocks per game this season, and helped LSU make a NCAA Final Four run. He was named Southeastern Conference Freshman of the Year and was unanimously selected to the league’s All-Freshman Team.
> 
> "He's got tremendous upside," Nash said. "The job is to identify the guy who is going to be a star. If he's going to be a star you're willing to wait a year or two. He could be that guy in this draft."
> 
> Added DiLeo: "The thing I like about Thomas is that he's high energy, he has that intensity. I see him more in the mold of Amare Stoudemire in terms of that intensity, that high energy type of player."
> 
> "He probably has the most upside but he's a little bit raw right now," DiLeo continued. "That's one of the players teams will have to wait on. That could be worth the wait – he could be special down the road.
> 
> One concern, however, is Thomas made a quick jump from being an unheralded high school player to being a top NBA prospect in the span of a year, and it's unknown whether or not he can continue along his development curve at the rapid pace.
> 
> "I think that's a little bit of a risk," DiLeo said. "That's what teams will have to look for. Just looking at him now. Thomas has a big upside. A lot depends on what's inside. How much drive, how much work ethic they have? Looking on paper – a lot of players have the potential, but they never look up to it."


 :banana:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: 16th pick*

with THAT said then

that #16 pick is looking like serious trade bait. it looks like all the guys we want at #16 will be gone, unless someone falls (drastically) or we trade up.

Rudy Fernandez (6"6 SG) [?]
Maurice Ager (6"5 SG) [?]
Hilton Armstrong (6"11 PF/C) [He'll be an ok nba player, he's a safe pick @ 16 but no upside imo]
Sene (7"0 C) [Worth the risk]
Thabo Sefolosha (6"7 SG) [This kid sounds like a beast]

That's looking like the best the 1st round has to offer if the first 15 names PREDICTED will be called. In a way, I do believe SOMEONE we like will fall to us. We all know how the draft goes.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



> After the drawing, New York reporters peppered Paxson with questions on the ramifications of the Curry trade.
> 
> They wanted to know if Knicks President Isiah Thomas had tried to protect a top-three pick. Paxson said yes but added that the deal hinged on unprotected picks.
> 
> Paxson said he wasn't looking for validation for the Curry trade. Nevertheless, he got it.
> 
> "It's kind of like found money," Paxson said stoically. "You feel lucky that you're here. I'm not smart enough to think we knew this was going to happen."


:laugh:


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I was sold on Tyrus when he was talking about trying to take Tyler Hansborough's SOUL..

THAT was deep...And THAT'S a player destined for great things.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

How many fast break points could Thomas average on this team. 4-5? Look at what Deng and Noce have done, Thomas is faster than either if them, and gets up a lot higher.

I've heard a lot of people say they think TT will be the best player of the draft but would rather draft someone based on need and immediat contribution, which is understandable considering the thin line of talents. But those of you saying we already have Tyson don't have a leg to stand on, consider TT a huge upgrade to Tyson and it makes more sense to draft him.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

I think Paxson has every intention of taking Thomas and unless someone trades up for the first pick i think Thomas will be there at 2. The real question is who does pax have in mind for the 16th pick. Say what you want about pax he has been really good in the draft. BG, KH, LD have all be great picks. Lets see what he does with a lower pick. I would still trade for Michael pieturs but if he doesnt brewer or carney are my next chose.

My wish list is AH or Nene from FA and thomas and Carney.

What would give us BG, KH, LD, AL, and TC with Noci, Carney, and Thomas off the bench.

Skiles will be in heaven.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Morrison Likes The Bulls*



> "[The Bulls have] a great team, and the organization is back on the rise,'' Morrison said Tuesday from Los Angeles, where he is preparing for his pre-draft workouts. "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''
> 
> That scenario would be just fine with Morrison, the Gonzaga junior forward who led Division I in scoring last season with a 28.4 average


http://www.suntimes.com/output/bulls/cst-spt-adam24.html


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*

*"Honestly, it doesn't really matter what team I play for,'' he said. "I've never really been a huge NBA fan, so I just want to go play wherever. I don't care what number I'm drafted at. Just playing in the NBA is the most important thing. That's the main goal.''*





lol. way to bite the hand that is about to feed you very well, adam.


----------



## BULLS23

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*



mizenkay said:


> *"Honestly, it doesn't really matter what team I play for,'' he said. "I've never really been a huge NBA fan, so I just want to go play wherever. I don't care what number I'm drafted at. Just playing in the NBA is the most important thing. That's the main goal.''*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol. way to bite the hand that is about to feed you very well, adam.



Wow, that's not a very good look Adam . . . I don't want this guy at all.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*



BULLS23 said:


> Wow, that's not a very good look Adam . . . I don't want this guy at all.


Not to mention that his position, SF, is perfectly filled on our team. Plus we need an injection of athleticism, not more slow guys whose offense revolves around shooting. It just doesn't add up. The only way we take Morrison is if we're picking him for someone else via trade.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*

FYI - I merged the thread *easymoney* started about the 16th pick into this thread.

thanks


----------



## truebluefan

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*

Pax says we need height and athleticism! So how does Morrison fit in all of that?? 

He doesn't imo.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*

Why didn't he like the Bulls last week? I like the Bulls = I like the money associated with the Bulls.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*



truebluefan said:


> Pax says we need height and athleticism! So how does Morrison fit in all of that??
> 
> He doesn't imo.


i don't want him either, just posted the article

what lottery pick WOULDN'T like a hardworking playoff team though?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread (merged)*



mizenkay said:


> FYI - I merged the thread *easymoney* started about the 16th pick into this thread.
> 
> thanks


can u merge more of these threads!? it's too many of em. one "draft nerds" thread, one "draft lottery" thread and one "draft workouts" thread is enough.

I feel like i'm posting EVERYWHERE  when it's the same stuff in every thread


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*

thanks for posting it ROY, i was about to anyway!

this kid is in for such a rude awakening. it just makes me chuckle.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*

u can merge this with the draft thread too, if you like


i shoulda posted it there in the firsst place


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*

Morrison would be a great fit for the Kings. He could stay out in Cali and Artest's defense could compensate for Morrison. Artest at 2 guard and Morrison at 3 actually could work. Maybe Pax could work out a deal with the Maloofs. How does #2 for Brad Miller and 19 sound?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*



L.O.B said:


> Morrison would be a great fit for the Kings. He could stay out in Cali and Artest's defense could compensate for Morrison. Artest at 2 guard and Morrison at 3 actually could work. Maybe Pax could work out a deal with the Maloofs. How does #2 for Brad Miller and 19 sound?


Personally? I like Miller, but he didn't like it here. I'd rather take a chance on one of the big's in the draft regardless though.


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*



The ROY said:


> Personally? I like Miller, but he didn't like it here. I'd rather take a chance on one of the big's in the draft regardless though.


Do you think he didn't like Chicago as a whole or the fact that team sucked back then? I can't imagine any player enjoyed being a Bull back in those days.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*



L.O.B said:


> Do you think he didn't like Chicago as a whole or the fact that team sucked back then? I can't imagine any player enjoyed being a Bull back in those days.


Think he said something about this not being his type of city.


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Morrison Likes The Bulls*



The ROY said:


> Think he said something about this not being his type of city.


Well he's a backwater hick then. 

I still think Brad would fit perfectly with what the Bulls do though. Hell the Bulls could even hire Keady as an assitant if it made Miller comfortable. Keady and Skiles might irrate opponents better than the duo of Nocioni and Miller


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Paxson is not going to trade the number 2 for miller. And i personally dont think pax will end up trading the 2 period.

My guess is Thomas and Carney or brewer and we sign either nene or AH.

i love that line up.

david


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

draft express article


_*#2- Chicago Bulls*_



> *Will Consider: Andrea Bargnani, Tyrus Thomas, Adam Morrison, Rudy Gay, Brandon Roy*
> 
> After coming full-circle and making the playoffs two years in a row, the future is now for the Baby Bulls and the next goal should be to advance another round in the NBA playoffs with the excellent young core John Paxson and Scott Skiles have developed.
> 
> *Potential smokescreens that have been going around the NBA ever since their stint in the playoffs ended say that Adam Morrison is the player that Paxson and Skiles covet the most, but that’s somewhat hard to believe when looking at the makeup of their current roster. *
> 
> LaMarcus Aldridge is the player that makes the most sense, and the Bulls would certainly snatch him up if the Raptors somehow decided to pass on him. With Aldridge off the board in this projection, Andrea Bargnani becomes the next best option. The thing the Bulls are lacking the most at the moment is point production from their big men, as Tyson Chandler’s incredibly disappointing 5.3 point per game average just isn’t going to cut it next to Mike Sweetney and Othella Harrington. *This is precisely the reason why Tyrus Thomas seems unlikely here, as he’s more of a defender and rebounder like Chandler and appears furthest away from being able to contribute immediately on a potential laden team that has finally grown up*. Bargnani is the best offensive player the Bulls will find here in terms of the bigs, and he should be able to create quite a few mismatches with his ability to space the floor with his perimeter shooting and drive to the basket with his excellent ball-handling skills and first step.
> 
> *If the Bulls have their heart set on drafting Aldridge, most NBA people seem to think that a package involving either Chris Duhon or the #16 pick along with their own lottery selection will get the job done, although this might be too high of a price to pay in a draft where any one of five players could go #1.*



i have no idea how credible this site is, and obviously it is one guys opinion, but if they haven't been reading _every article_ out of chicago that claims the bulls are really high on thomas and NOT ADAM freakin' MORRISON, then i have to think they are talking out of their respective asses.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



mizenkay said:


> draft express article
> 
> 
> _*#2- Chicago Bulls*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> i have no idea how credible this site is, and obviously it is one guys opinion, but if they haven't been reading _every article_ out of chicago that claims the bulls are really high on thomas and NOT ADAM freakin' MORRISON, then i have to think they are talking out of their respective asses.


lol


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I wonder if pax is considering using both picks on big men? Some one lie Simmons could be there at 16 from NCS and he looks like a stud. We could alwasy trade for a SG later.

david


----------



## UD40

*"It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



> Chicago Sun Times - While Gonzaga small forward Morrison does not care which team selects him, he made particular mention of the Chicago Bulls .


http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/40654/20060524/morrison_likes_the_bulls/

Thoughts?


----------



## thebizkit69u

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

I would love to see this Pure Basketball player in Chicago, hes got such great talent but there are some issues with the Diabetes and his average defense, but hes worthy of a #2 pick. No doubt in my mind that he will lead all rookies in scoring.


----------



## PC Load Letter

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



UD40 said:


> Thoughts?


Yeah, enjoy Charlotte...


----------



## UD40

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



PC Load Letter said:


> Yeah, enjoy Charlotte...


So I'm going to guess and say you want either Tyrus or Bargnani?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

already been posted..and merged in the DRAFT thread


----------



## PC Load Letter

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



UD40 said:


> So I'm going to guess and say you want either Tyrus or Bargnani?


You got it! And in that order...


----------



## thebizkit69u

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

I just find it funny how guys like Adam Morrison and JJ Redick who dominated the game and are players that we have seen play numerous times are not as good as Tyrus Thomas who wasnt even a top 10 pick untill he had 3 good games in the Tournament and Andre Bargnani WE HAVE never seen play and yet people on here are calling him the next Dirk! If Tyrus Thomas reaches his absolute potential all we are talking about is a 14ppg 10 rbs 2 blk guy, If Morrison and Gay reach their absolute potential your talking about SUperstar level. Gay alone if he can just get it all together is easilly a 22 8 8 guy.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

aye Bizcuit..can u calm down with the Thomas hate? it's starting to get a bit ridiculous now

you don't know that kid nor his potential...stop assuming you do


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



The ROY said:


> aye Bizcuit..can u calm down with the Thomas hate? it's starting to get a bit ridiculous now
> 
> you don't know that kid nor his potential...stop assuming you do


You love Thomas... do you know him or his potential?


----------



## thebizkit69u

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



The ROY said:


> aye Bizcuit..can u calm down with the Thomas hate? it's starting to get a bit ridiculous now
> 
> you don't know that kid nor his potential...stop assuming you do


 Ok Tyrus Thomas is the next Tim Duncan.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Another columnist joins the Brandon Roy bandwagon... :biggrin: 



> The Bulls should be able to choose between Texas power forward LaMarcus Aldridge, LSU power forward Tyrus Thomas and Washington guard Brandon Roy.
> 
> If the Bulls want an inside scoring presence, they would take Aldridge. If they want an energetic, all-around inside force, they would take Thomas. It says here the best choice is Roy, a polished big guard who would do the most next season to help the Bulls advance in the playoffs for the first time since 1998.
> 
> Of course, none of these scenarios is the surest method for the Bulls to improve next season. That method entails shopping the pick for a veteran star, and the Bulls are in prime position to do that with the second pick. A trade would be their best bet, followed by Roy, who would do wonders for the Bulls even though he does not get as much acclaim as fellow prospects Thomas and Aldridge.


http://www.nwherald.com/SportsSection/hut/292885921661047.php


----------



## The ROY

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



TripleDouble said:


> You love Thomas... do you know him or his potential?


nah, don't know him

but he has a ton of potential....if he didn't...he wouldn't be ranked and coveted by as many gm's as he is...

nobody said he'd be the next duncan...but he can be a GOOD PF in the NBA...maybe even better than orginally thought


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

These columist tend to forget the reaons why we haven't advanced the last two years..

BIG MEN!

i like brandon roy but he isn't the answer...


----------



## thebizkit69u

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



The ROY said:


> but he can be a GOOD PF in the NBA...maybe even better than orginally thought


Iam sorry but a GOOD PF in the NBA isnt what we need for the number 2 overall pick, we need someone who can be GREAT. With Thomas's skill set I cant imagine him being a GREAT NBA four.


----------



## BG7

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

I'd rather not take Travis Outlaw......err Tyson Chandler.......I mean Tyrus Thomas.

LaMarcus Aldridge should definitely be #1 on our draft board. I haven't seen too much outside of some clips of Bargnani, he looks good on offense, so I'd want either Gay, Morrison, or Bargnani if Aldridgei s off the baord when we draft.


----------



## Rodman

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

yes we need big men really bad, but they could be had in FA, for SG the FA-market is really bad this year. Anyway I think there is no way we pick Roy this high, but if Pax really falls in love with the guy, he won't shy away from taking him. I trust Pax to pick the right guy! I just hope he does the right thing in FA\trades too.
His trades don't look to shabby now having a no. 2 pick and cap space for EC!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Big's are MANDATORY. Before ANYTHING else.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> These columist tend to forget the reaons why we haven't advanced the last two years..
> 
> BIG MEN!
> 
> i like brandon roy but he isn't the answer...


If there is a star in this group, let's draft him, regardless of position. Put it this way, in retrospect, who would you draft today, Chris Paul or Marvin Williams?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

problem is, i don't really believe at THIS point, there's a star in the group.

i always would of drafted paul though.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Taken from TODAY's Insider :



> Some have speculated that Aldridge could play center in the NBA and therefore might go to the Raptors. But the scouts I've talked to see Aldridge as a four, not a five. Likewise, before the lottery, Colangelo pegged Aldridge as a power forward, one who reminded him of someone already on Toronto's roster -- Chris Bosh.


Well, maybe he won't become a Raptor. I said the same thing though, they're too simular IMO. It's like having Channing Frye & Kevin Garnett.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



thebizkit69u said:


> Iam sorry but a GOOD PF in the NBA isnt what we need for the number 2 overall pick, we need someone who can be GREAT. With Thomas's skill set I cant imagine him being a GREAT NBA four.


personally, i don't think NONE Of them will be great, at this point...i can't honestly sit here and say i see TT, LA or AB being great...but it's possible

who's your guy?

and as far as the pick being great cause it's #2...this just isn't that type of draft


----------



## The ROY

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

Sloth, you might as well get used to saying TT, cause he'll be a Bull.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

OF COURSE Adam Morrison would think it would be great to play in Chicago.

It's CHICAGO...

Playing basketball with any sort of charisma = CHA CHING!


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> problem is, i don't really believe at THIS point, there's a star in the group.
> 
> i always would of drafted paul though.


Good point. We don't know if there's a star. But sometimes it's hard to say beforehand. I don't think many people knew how good Paul would be. So it's completely up to Pax' scouting staff. But if they see it in Roy, or Gay, they should not hesitate because of position.


----------



## BG7

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

Yeah, Chicago, Orlando, Utah, and New Orleans are the places people want to go. Hmm, do I want to go to the Bobcats.....The Hawks......Or the team that made the playoffs last year.....


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



Adam Morrison said:


> It would be great to play in Chicago with the Bulls.


Here's the great thing about the NBA, Adam: you'll get to play with them in Chicago once a year if you get drafted by a Western team, and (usually) twice if you get taken by someone in the East.

Have fun with it.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> TORONTO (AP) -- A day after winning the top pick in the draft lottery, the Toronto Raptors dispatched coach Sam Mitchell and senior adviser Wayne Embry to Italy to scout forward Andrea Bargnani.
> 
> General manager Bryan Colangelo and team owner Larry Tanenbaum have already scouted Bargnani, a 7-footer who plays for Benetton Treviso.
> 
> ADVERTISEMENT
> "I'm not certain we would be sending Sam and Wayne to Italy if we had the No. 5 pick," Colangelo said Wednesday.


From the AP


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Toronto will get the first pick and draft an Euro. Repeat.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Toronto will get the first pick and draft an Euro. Repeat.


the guy covets bargnani...so it makes sense


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> the guy covets bargnani...so it makes sense


Haha, only that I said it before the lottery.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Haha, only that I said it before the lottery.


you are a prophet!

something that could make sense is if they drafted Bargnani then traded Charlie for say, Brandon Roy + a few 2nd rounders.

G 
G Roy
G Bargnani
F Bosh
C


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Well Bargnani would be a great pickup, but not the best in terms on the court for them. Bosh, Villanueva and Bargnani all play the same spot.

Now would they give up Villaneuva for the 2nd pick?


----------



## step

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



> Hmm, do I want to go to the Bobcats.....The Hawks......Or the team that made the playoffs last year.....


Ding Ding Ding, we have a winner.



> Here's the great thing about the NBA, Adam: you'll get to play with them in Chicago once a year if you get drafted by a Western team, and (usually) twice if you get taken by someone in the East.
> 
> Have fun with it.


:laugh:

How is a basketball player not a fan of the NBA, I just want to know that... and where was his agent and how the hell did he let him finish that sentence.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*



step said:


> Ding Ding Ding, we have a winner.
> 
> 
> :laugh:
> 
> How is a basketball player not a fan of the NBA, I just want to know that... and where was his agent and how the hell did he let him finish that sentence.


Joakim Noah said something similar about the NBA game being boring and not interesting.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Anyone seen Sefolosha play? He sounds like he might be a good pick at 16.


----------



## HKF

*Re: "It would be great to play in Chicago for the Bulls.''-Adam Morrison*

Guys who play basketball who say they don't watch the NBA or like it, are what I call...

skerred.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Thabo Sefolosha


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> the guy covets bargnani...so it makes sense


Paxson comments on Bargnani to the NY daily news :



> Another possibility is Italy's Andrea Bargnani, who is drawing comparisons to Dirk Nowitzki. And a big man with shooting range would fit in with the Bulls.
> 
> "There aren't many 7-footers who can shoot it from the three-point line like he can," Paxson said. "One of the reasons we had success was we ended up getting two guys in (Darius) Songaila and Malik Allen who can make shots."


http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/story/420743p-355207c.html 

A little love for Bargnani to help Toronto to make up their minds to sign the guy they really want?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Bargnani will give us a whole new dimension on offense if ewe draft him, if we play a more uptempo game like we did against the Heat this year, it would be amazing having a 7' footer who can shoot the three.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Paxson knows damn well he doesn't want a perimeter driven euro. But if he does get him, I wouldn't be upset.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Bargnani will give us a whole new dimension on offense if ewe draft him, if we play a more uptempo game like we did against the Heat this year, it would be amazing having a 7' footer who can shoot the three.


Indeed.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The bulls have plenty of swing players what we need are height and muscle both a PF and SG.

david


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> The bulls have plenty of swing players what we need are height and muscle both a PF and SG.
> 
> david


I hear that, and I'm sure we'll take care of those needs with the other pick and in free agency. What I like about Bargnani is the fact that he'll make other teams adjust to us, and that he'll be a nightmare mismatch for most of the leagues bulkier power forwards. When I see what Nowitzki is doing for the Mavs in the playoffs this year, I think it would be a mistake to simply draft according to our basic team needs, when we could go all out and get a possible star. I don't want to compare Bargnani to Nowitzki just yet, but both his size and skillset seem eerily similar to Nowitzki's.

With that said, Tyrus Thomas is my next option, and I also think he would be a great addition to this team. The main difference as I see it however, is that Tyrus will change the game with his defense, while Bargnani seems like a guy who can take over on offense. In a lot of games this season, I've seen Ben and Kirk shoot way too many ill-advised jumpshots because we didn't have a big go to guy. I think Bargnani will give us that.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Bargnani update...

25 mins.
15 pts
3-4 2pt
2-2 3 pt
3-4 FT
7 boards
3 blocks
1 assist

Benneton lost 67-75. I believe their series is tied 2-2. Doesn't look like Benneton played all that well, but if the Toronto folks were in attendance, they got to see a decent game from Bargnani.

Edit... Here's the box score: http://195.56.77.208/game/62007.html

(I also initially typed the game results wrong too!!!)


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

15 points on 5-6 shooting, 7 boards and 3 blocks in 25 minutes by a 20-year old player in his first playoff series sounds pretty damn good to me.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

So from a Bulls perspective, would you rather see Bargnani explode in this series while the Raps are scouting him closely or just flat out suc*?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> So from a Bulls perspective, would you rather see Bargnani explode in this series while the Raps are scouting him closely or just flat out suc*?


I guess I'd want him to suck it up like a vacuum cleaner, but I really don't see the Raptors drafting Bargnani unless they pull off a trade involving Bosh or Villanueva. Colangelo does seem to like him very much though...


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Splitter fouled out today, as well.

25 minutes
7 points
2/5 FG
3/4 FT
7 rebounds
1 assist
1 steal
1 TO

Rudy Fernandez had a terrible game.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Do any of our European posters have opinions on Thabo Sefolosha? Draft Express has us taking him at 16, and a rather glowing write up about him...sorry if he's already been discussed...


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



jbulls said:


> Do any of our European posters have opinions on Thabo Sefolosha? Draft Express has us taking him at 16, and a rather glowing write up about him...sorry if he's already been discussed...


I dont think anyone has watched extensive film on this guy.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I too would like some more information on Thabo Sefolosha. Perhaps rlucus might have something to add about this player and if paxson has had his team out to europe to scout him?

david


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I wish I knew more about Mardy Collins. If we don't draft Brandon Roy, which we probably won't, and we don't get a shot at Ronnie Brewer at 16, which we probably won't, Collins might be there, and having a big pg/sg combo guard would really complete our guard core. It looks like he's an inconsistent shooter. Who can tell me more about him?


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I wish I knew more about Mardy Collins. If we don't draft Brandon Roy, which we probably won't, and we don't get a shot at Ronnie Brewer at 16, which we probably won't, Collins might be there, and having a big pg/sg combo guard would really complete our guard core. It looks like he's an inconsistent shooter. Who can tell me more about him?


I saw 3 Temple games this year, and despite his overall success in those games I wasn't impressed. He had a very good handle and passing ability, and a very big body. That big body is also why he isn't that fast or athletic. Defensivily he is big and could guard the post well, but I think he will struggle on the perimeter because of his lateral quickness. Scoring is going to be his big issue. Just look at his numbers and right away you know he cannot shoot. Most of his points in college were in the post and muscling his way towards the basket, which he won't be able to do that the next level. 

Not the finisher we need on the break, and on our team there is really no place for a guard who can't even hit a 15 footer consistantly. He sounds like he would be nice next to Gordon and Hinrich, because he's big and can play either spot, but trust me, he's somewhere in between Reece Gaines and Jeryl Sasser.

If Brewer isn't available I don't think we are going to fill that hole with our pick, the guys next up at OG aren't going to be the best available players.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

A Few words from Chad Ford today



> One of the benefits of doing a mock draft is that my cell phone starts going crazy. I got calls from half the teams in the league offering and seeking info. But it's very dangerous for the next five weeks to take teams at face value. Teams have a lot of incentive to put out half-truths this time of year.





> • Toronto Raptors: It seems as though everyone is predicting LaMarcus Aldridge as the Raptors' pick at No. 1. The thinking I hear almost every time is that Aldridge fits a need at center, so they have to take him.
> 
> I think that's wrong.
> 
> GM Bryan Colangelo will likely fill his needs via trade (Dalembert, Magloire), with the $13 to $15 million he has in cap room this summer as an important part of the bargaining. And he'll likely use his draft pick to get the player he wants.





> • Portland Trail Blazers: It appears there's going to be a fire sale in Portland this summer. Multiple league executives say that just about everyone, with the exception of Martell Webster, will be available this summer as Nate McMillan and company try to clean house.
> 
> Zach Randolph, Darius Miles, Theo Ratliff and even Sebastian Telfair can be had. The 30th and 31st picks in the draft are also for sale. The price? The Blazers want another top-10 draft pick to go along with No. 4. The targets? They'd like to get a scorer like LaMarcus Aldridge or Adam Morrison with one pick and Brandon Roy with the other one





> • Atlanta Hawks: The Hawks could also be in the Samuel Dalembert running this summer. They seriously considered making him an offer last summer but were fearful the Sixers would match.
> 
> Sixers GM Billy King told me on Tuesday it was unlikely he'd be willing to trade Allen Iverson to Atlanta, but Dalembert might be another story. Al Harrington, via sign and trade, could be the bait.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> • Toronto Raptors: It seems as though everyone is predicting LaMarcus Aldridge as the Raptors' pick at No. 1. The thinking I hear almost every time is that Aldridge fits a need at center, so they have to take him.
> 
> I think that's wrong.
> 
> GM Bryan Colangelo will likely fill his needs via trade (Dalembert, Magloire), with the $13 to $15 million he has in cap room this summer as an important part of the bargaining. And he'll likely use his draft pick to get the player he wants.


Why do I feel like the Raptors want Bargnani? If they get a real center, then he would fit in well, and they could bring him along slowly and have him learn from Bosh and Villanueva. I think they would be better off with Aldridge, and that's also who Bosh seems to want, so let's hope they'll do everything to make him happy before he signs his extension.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Alexander Johnson Working Himself into 1st Round
> 
> If two editions ago of Word on the Street it was Marcus Williams of UConn who had the strongest buzz going for him in NBA circles, and last time it was Cincinnati's James White, this week’s high-riser is Florida State Power Forward Alexander Johnson. DraftExpress got the first shot to watch him workout in an exclusive private workout at the Five-Star Pro Training Center two weeks ago, and has since been getting feedback from private workouts consistent with the statement we made then about Johnson being the “most athletic Power Forward in the draft after Tyrus Thomas.”
> 
> Johnson has impressed everyone who has watched him with more than just his athleticism, though, hitting a good amount of his mid-range jumpers, playing with more tenacity than anyone in any workout, playing strong defense, and leaving a favorable impression with his excellent demeanor both on and off the court.
> 
> Like his workout buddy Guillermo Diaz, Johnson has been consistently clearing 40 inches on his one-step vertical in the agility tests, and just under 37 inches with no step. Diaz in fact cleared 42 inches with no step and over 48 inches in one workout on the one-step vertical.
> 
> After favorable workouts with the Wizards, Lakers and Nets, Johnson appears to be working himself strongly into the 1st round, and will be targeting his best case scenario teams (Chicago, Indiana, and the Wizards once again) against stronger competition if they choose to work out against him.


Anyone have more on Anthony Johnson?


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



LegoHat said:


> Why do I feel like the Raptors want Bargnani? If they get a real center, then he would fit in well, and they could bring him along slowly and have him learn from Bosh and Villanueva. I think they would be better off with Aldridge, and that's also who Bosh seems to want, so let's hope they'll do everything to make him happy before he signs his extension.


I understand that feeling too I think for the Raptors it is between Aldridge & Bargnani but they will likely make a trade. You have to remember, Toronto REALLY wants to resign Bosh and Bosh & ALdridge are friends and workout partners so it kinda might behoove Toronto to sign Aldridge and I think ultimately thats what they will do. I think they like Bargnani and were kind of expecting to be in a slot to draft him. Now that they are higher on the board they are sending people out to get a final look at Bargs and do due diligence to make sure that he shouldn't be #1.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ace20004u said:


> Now that they are higher on the board they are sending people out to get a final look at Bargs and do due diligence to make sure that he shouldn't be #1.


and that's exactly why he didn't send himself lol


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I wonder if NO is calling around to see if they could use there two picks, 12 and 15, to get one of the mid lotto picks. Teams like Alt, Minny, and bos might be interested in trading back and getting two picks.

david


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I wonder if NO is calling around to see if they could use there two picks, 12 and 15, to get one of the mid lotto picks. Teams like Alt, Minny, and bos might be interested in trading back and getting two picks.
> 
> david


makes alot of sense...

they could trade up for O'Bryant...


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I have also been wonder what about Shawne Williams with our 16 pick. I know that he played SF at Mem but i wonder if he could play SG in the NBA. 


david


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I have also been wonder what about Shawne Williams with our 16 pick. I know that he played SF at Mem but i wonder if he could play SG in the NBA.
> 
> 
> david


I doubt it, he's pretty damn slow & he'd get absolutely chewed up by the Redd's, Wade's & Kobe's of the NBA.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'm starting to warm up to Rudy Gay.


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> I have also been wonder what about Shawne Williams with our 16 pick. I know that he played SF at Mem but i wonder if he could play SG in the NBA.


You can pretty much rule out any 6'9 guy playing the two spot.

I've been looking at Williams moreso lately as any trade we do would most likely require Deng, the one guy who we can afford to part with. Now would Williams be a capable replacement to fill the void of backup? I say backup as we're most likely going to sign / draft a big or two that will greatly impact Nocioni's minutes at the 4.

ie: Trade Deng & Sweets to GSW for Pietrus and their pick? That fair?
Then we pick Thomas (or the big of your choice) with the Knicks, O'Bryant with theirs and Williams with ours.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



step said:


> You can pretty much rule out any 6'9 guy playing the two spot.
> 
> I've been looking at Williams moreso lately as any trade we do would most likely require Deng, the one guy who we can afford to part with. Now would Williams be a capable replacement to fill the void of backup? I say backup as we're most likely going to sign / draft a big or two that will greatly impact Nocioni's minutes at the 4.
> 
> ie: Trade Deng & Sweets to GSW for Pietrus and their pick? That fair?
> Then we pick Thomas (or the big of your choice) with the Knicks, O'Bryant with theirs and Williams with ours.


one of the best trade proposals i've heard in a while...

shawne would be a good backup for noc..plus he can shoot the 3...


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## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'm firmly in the "draft Sene" camp. O'Bryant won't be there @16, but if Sene is, Pax would be hard pressed not to at least give him a loooooong look. 7 footers with a 7'8" wingspan don't come around often. Doesn't hurt to have a big man or two. As for the #2 pick, I'm also in the Bargnani camp. He's a guy that can stretch the defense and would be a nightmare for opposing fours to match up against.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I like Bargnani but i dont think the problem with the bulls is we cant streach the defensive we already have very good three point scorers (KH, BG, AN, and Duhan) the issue for the bulls is we dont have any big men who can finish and clog the middle on Defensive. I just cant see pax drafting Bargnani he is more a SF than a PF and we already have deng and noci. This team needs size at the PF and center spots and at SG. I would be shocked if pax drafts anyone other than Thomas.

But i am interested to see who pax drafts at 16. He has had good luck in the draft so far but those picks have all been in the top tne (8, 7, and 3) and it will be interesting to see if pax is as good at evaluating talent in the mid first round. I think there will be alot of players who can play SG but the question is who will be best for our team.

david


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



dsouljah9 said:


> I'm firmly in the "draft Sene" camp. O'Bryant won't be there @16, but if Sene is, Pax would be hard pressed not to at least give him a loooooong look. 7 footers with a 7'8" wingspan don't come around often. Doesn't hurt to have a big man or two. As for the #2 pick, I'm also in the Bargnani camp. He's a guy that can stretch the defense and would be a nightmare for opposing fours to match up against.


How is Pax going to be hard pressed to draft Sene? For all we know, he could drop to the second round and nobody is going to cry crime.


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## mw2889

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Give me Sene or Give me Death, this guy is so talented.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

OK, here's another idea if Bargnani is gone.

#2 Rudy Gay
#16 Hilton Armstrong

Definitely addresses our need for more length and athleticism.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Anyone else read Shawne Williams (draft express) has a 7'3" wing, I think it's safe to say his stock is rising.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I read some place (maybe ESPN insider?) that Shawne Williams agent said Williams was only working out with teams with darft positions from 6 to 15 and he made it sould like that is where he is going. In addtion, i have also read that (i cant exactly remember where) that Simmons, Armstrong, and Rando are working out for teams in the high lotto. If you add Spliter into the late lotto than several players in the mock drafts in the 9 to 14 range should drop to the bulls.

I would love any of these players on the bulls. Even thro we may draft Thomas it would also be great to add another big man like Simmons or maybe Brewer or Carney will drop to 16. maybe even Foye. Any of the players would really increase the depth of our bench next year and could develop into starters in a year or two.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



laso said:


> OK, here's another idea if Bargnani is gone.
> 
> #2 Rudy Gay
> #16 Hilton Armstrong
> 
> Definitely addresses our need for more length and athleticism.


.....

I'm trying to understand why EXACTLY we would need Rudy Gay?!

Hilton's garbage...that would be one of the worst draft days ever for the bulls


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The ONLY Hilton that's garbage is Paris.

If we get him @ 16...That's GREAT value...You trippin' HARD.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> .....
> 
> I'm trying to understand why EXACTLY we would need Rudy Gay?!
> 
> Hilton's garbage...that would be one of the worst draft days ever for the bulls


I don't know, 6'9, super athletic, comes from a big program... Definitely a potential super star. There are not a lot of these types of players coming around. His stock has significantly dropped after the NCAA tourney, but that doesn't mean he's not a talent. There are tons of players who are successful in the NBA who had less than impressive NCAA showings.

My thinking here is that Tyrus Thomas does not necessarily bring much more than other athletic power forwards in this draft. Is TT necessarily a significant improvement over Simmons or Armstrong? He has no offense so he's not going to contribute offensively right away. Sure,he'll help our D, and I'm not minimizing that... Cause it's important. But these two other guys also seem like they would be good defenders/rebounders.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

These is a very big difference between TT, simmons, and Armstrong. I think Simmons is a real sleeper in this draft who is at least 6'10" with a 7'4" wingspan who is only 20 years old and TT is close behind. They both have a big upside and have made a huge improvement in their games the last year. Armstrongs has been playing about the same the last two years and was on a team of stars and still didnt look that dominate. TT is a top 3 pick while IMHO simmons will go top 10 while Armstrong is mid first round at best and could be late first round.

david


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Cedric Simmons is a bit of a mystery to me, as I haven't seen him play this season. He doesn't put up spectacular stats, but by all accounts he has a terrific physique.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

More info I hear

OBryant is on the way up. Golden State wants him in a fairly big way and might be willing to swap some of their assets to get up to 4 or 6 to get him. If any player could make a late run at finishing #1, it might be him. Similar to the meteroic rise that Olowakandi, Kwame Brown etc. Alot of people think with some work, he could be a Brad Daugherty type, which is really good for those of you too young to remember him

Sene is on the way up. He has looked extremely fluid in Belgium recently and his athletic ability is draw dropping. He could go anywhere from 10-16. He is rumored to have a promise between 20-24 but his battling to increase his stock. Toronto likes him. They hired a player personnel whiz from Bennetton Treviso (one of the reasons everyone thinks they love Bargnani) who is rumored to be ready to try and pry Sene from Belgium. Might look for another pick to grab him. 

JJ Redick is still on the way down. Apparently scouts just dont know what he brings outside of shooting, and are unconvinced he is anything more then Steve Alford

One scout I spoke with still remains convinced that either Gay or Carney falls. 

Rondo has a huge range. Some scouts hate him and have him in the 20s, others have him as high as 6. His stock will probably fluctuate on how well he matches up against a Marcus Williams in a head to head. 

Oleksiy Pecherov is rumored to have a promise in round 1

Toronto wants to accumulate assets. They like Bargnani but might trade down to get more assets. 

LaMarcus Aldridge is rumored to be Chicagos option 1a if he is available. 

Tyrus Thomas is a player, that as of right now, could fall to 5-7 if he doesnt do well in workouts. 

Shawnee Williams is rumored to have a promise late lottery, which might be why Gay or Carney could fall. 

Seattles draft plans are 100% reliant on Mickael Gelabale. The highly promising swingman has indicated he might not want to come to the US anytime soon so Seattle might concentrate on the wing. If he changes his mind then Seattle will draft for other spots. But this kid would be a top 12 pick in this draft.

Dee Brown impressed Memphis big time in his workout earlier this week.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> More info I hear
> 
> OBryant is on the way up. Golden State wants him in a fairly big way and might be willing to swap some of their assets to get up to 4 or 6 to get him. If any player could make a late run at finishing #1, it might be him. Similar to the meteroic rise that Olowakandi, Kwame Brown etc. Alot of people think with some work, he could be a Brad Daugherty type, which is really good for those of you too young to remember him
> 
> Sene is on the way up. He has looked extremely fluid in Belgium recently and his athletic ability is draw dropping. He could go anywhere from 10-16. He is rumored to have a promise between 20-24 but his battling to increase his stock. Toronto likes him. They hired a player personnel whiz from Bennetton Treviso (one of the reasons everyone thinks they love Bargnani) who is rumored to be ready to try and pry Sene from Belgium. Might look for another pick to grab him.
> 
> JJ Redick is still on the way down. Apparently scouts just dont know what he brings outside of shooting, and are unconvinced he is anything more then Steve Alford
> 
> One scout I spoke with still remains convinced that either Gay or Carney falls.
> 
> Rondo has a huge range. Some scouts hate him and have him in the 20s, others have him as high as 6. His stock will probably fluctuate on how well he matches up against a Marcus Williams in a head to head.
> 
> Oleksiy Pecherov is rumored to have a promise in round 1
> 
> Toronto wants to accumulate assets. They like Bargnani but might trade down to get more assets.
> 
> LaMarcus Aldridge is rumored to be Chicagos option 1a if he is available.
> 
> Tyrus Thomas is a player, that as of right now, could fall to 5-7 if he doesnt do well in workouts.
> 
> Shawnee Williams is rumored to have a promise late lottery, which might be why Gay or Carney could fall.
> 
> Seattles draft plans are 100% reliant on Mickael Gelabale. The highly promising swingman has indicated he might not want to come to the US anytime soon so Seattle might concentrate on the wing. If he changes his mind then Seattle will draft for other spots. But this kid would be a top 12 pick in this draft.
> 
> Dee Brown impressed Memphis big time in his workout earlier this week.



Thanks. 

I'm curious about your take on Gay. I know you like long, athletic and versitle players and he sure fits that bill. Would you be happy if the Bulls took him at #2?


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TripleDouble said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I'm curious about your take on Gay. I know you like long, athletic and versitle players and he sure fits that bill. Would you be happy if the Bulls took him at #2?



I like Rudy Gay and he has the highest upside of anyone in this draft if he can put it altogether. But I dont think the Bulls will take him. So I am not really thinking of him interms of the Bulls. I do like him and am a fan and if the Bulls took him I wouldnt be hurt by it all, just surprised. Doesnt fit a need and doesnt seem like a Skiles/Pax type. But then again, I am not a huge fan of choirboys either.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

rlucus,

do you think that aldridge and thomas will be in at the same time and will actually plah agaisnt each other for the bulls and pax.

david


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> rlucus,
> 
> do you think that aldridge and thomas will be in at the same time and will actually plah agaisnt each other for the bulls and pax.
> 
> david


I seriously doubt it. Almost never happens. Only time I can recall players slated to go that high ever working out against each other was 2001. Curry vs Diop played against each other on the Sunday before the draft for Krause and Chandler went up against Brown in Washington.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

This just in, Tyrus Thomas does not want BBB.net's Bulls forum to talk about him anymore, since many believe the Bulls shouldn't take him, and Thomas got upset....


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> This just in, Tyrus Thomas does not want BBB.net's Bulls forum to talk about him anymore, since many believe the Bulls shouldn't take him, and Thomas got upset....



Actually, I think it's his agents who would be upset.

Great stuff Rlucas, thank you for your insights. It's good tohear that about Sene and O"bryant since Sene going before 16 would move someone else down. And, if he is there at 16 and Brewer isn't, I say grab him. He'll have 2 or 3 years of trade value just from "potential". No one else knocks my socks off, so he may worth the flyer at 16 (unbelievable upside and if nothing else, a huge body to put in the lane to clog things when Chandler gets into enevitable foul trouble ....just from checking in to a game....lol)


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Good Stuff Rlucas



rlucas4257 said:


> Sene is on the way up. He has looked extremely fluid in Belgium recently and his athletic ability is *draw dropping*.


 :laugh:


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> Actually, I think it's his agents who would be upset.
> 
> Great stuff Rlucas, thank you for your insights. It's good tohear that about Sene and O"bryant since Sene going before 16 would move someone else down. And, if he is there at 16 and Brewer isn't, I say grab him. He'll have 2 or 3 years of trade value just from "potential". No one else knocks my socks off, so he may worth the flyer at 16 (unbelievable upside and if nothing else, a huge body to put in the lane to clog things when Chandler gets into enevitable foul trouble ....just from checking in to a game....lol)


Senes stats are not great, but they keep getting better and better. The one thing though is that his rebounding numbers are just staggering. 16 rebounds in 23 minutes? His scoring and post game are far ahead of where they were, so I am told. And the fact that he was better then anyone in next years draft at the Nike Camp, minus Oden who didnt show, and you have to think the talent is there. Chapu is my guy, but he always talks about the lack of competition. But whats interesting is that no one talks about how Sene beat up on one of the best HS classes of alltime. Thats great competition. His game might be suited more for the NBA where you have more athleticism then in Europe.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Hustle said:


> Good Stuff Rlucas
> 
> 
> :laugh:



That should read jaw dropping! Thanks


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Senes stats are not great, but they keep getting better and better. The one thing though is that his rebounding numbers are just staggering. 16 rebounds in 23 minutes? His scoring and post game are far ahead of where they were, so I am told. And the fact that he was better then anyone in next years draft at the Nike Camp, minus Oden who didnt show, and you have to think the talent is there. Chapu is my guy, but he always talks about the lack of competition. But whats interesting is that no one talks about how Sene beat up on one of the best HS classes of alltime. Thats great competition. His game might be suited more for the NBA where you have more athleticism then in Europe.


Would you take Sene at #2? The reason I ask this is: what does Tyrus Thomas provide that Sene doesn't and Sene has three or four inches in height and, what, six or so inches in wingspan? There's all this talk of O'Bryant shooting up the charts, but I wonder about when Sene gets to the states and starts to work out; might his stock climb even faster than O'bryant?

I checked on his stats in the Belgium league. Not much PT early on, but his last four or five games were pretty impressive (at least from a stats per minute standpoint). He's really an interesting prospect.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



fl_flash said:


> Would you take Sene at #2? The reason I ask this is: what does Tyrus Thomas provide that Sene doesn't and Sene has three or four inches in height and, what, six or so inches in wingspan? There's all this talk of O'Bryant shooting up the charts, but I wonder about when Sene gets to the states and starts to work out; might his stock climb even faster than O'bryant?
> 
> I checked on his stats in the Belgium league. Not much PT early on, but his last four or five games were pretty impressive (at least from a stats per minute standpoint). He's really an interesting prospect.



I wouldnt Flash. Just my opinion. Based on everything I have heard from established people who have seen him play, from the little I have seen and from what I read, he is a great talent with huge upside. I would gladly take him at 16. At #2, you just cant take a project.  You need to have someone a bit more established. But at #2, it sounds like we ought to take a long look at Obryant. But if Sene comes over and outplays Obryant, he might be long gone by 16. At 16, I have a list of guys I really think the Bulls should take if no one falls. Sene, and then Fernandez. I just love the fact that Sene tore the best bigman HS class of alltime a new one at the Nike Camp and that his first words were to play against Aldridge in workouts. I remember Josh Smith saying similar things, and I think we all know Smith can play. Sene might be a Josh Smith of the 5 spot, and that is not a bad thing

I also agree that if you target Sene at all, then Tyrus Thomas doesnt make much sense at all.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think if Splitter is there at 16, we need to take him, he is a top 5 talent imo, and thanks to contract issues, he's gonna fall. Then try to work out a buy out with him, and if you can't work one out, then he'll develop more overseas against good competition, and you'll have a high level talent oming in, even if New York doesn't suck next year.

If Splitter is gone, and no one major falls, I say go for Sene at 16, if he's there of course.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

sloth, I agree. But it does appear right now that Splitters buy out is so bad that he will probably pull out of this draft. Would be a damn shame. he has been an NBA player for 3 years and its about time he start getting some time in the league


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> sloth, I agree. But it does appear right now that Splitters buy out is so bad that he will probably pull out of this draft. Would be a damn shame. he has been an NBA player for 3 years and its about time he start getting some time in the league


Last year, he was looking for a top 20 garauntee, and no one gave it to him, so if thats all he's looking for this year, we should give it to him at 16. If it wasn't for a buyout, he would easily be Paxson's choice at #2 if he was even still there. If he doesn't pull out, and is still there at 16 WE NEED TO TAKE HIM, regardless of the buyout situation. Whats the maximum # of years we'd have to wait for him, its 2 at most I think, maybe only one, don't remember how many years he had left on his contract. But back in 2003, a buyout was pretty well arranged, but he had one workout in the US, and during that workout it was a bad shooting day, so he didn't get the garauntees he wanted and pulled out. 

He makes more sense than anyone else in the draft for us.

He's long, athletic, and has the right attitude. He has good skils and plays good defense. Paxson should be working on a buyout right now! And at the very least, I think we possess Splitter's rights for 4 years after drafting him, so if he comes over 2 years from now, that is a valuable asset that we can trade, but I'd rather keep him since he'd be a great fit.


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> sloth, I agree. But it does appear right now that Splitters buy out is so bad that he will probably pull out of this draft.


That would be a shame, I wonder if we could trade for another mid to late first rounder and make a _promise_ would he stay? I feel confident of him falling that far as it seems the buyout issues have put off the majority of teams.

One main reason I have doing that trade is that I wouldn't mind taking Rudy Fernandez with our pick. All I've got to go on is a scouting report, maybe someone who's seen him could enlighten me, but from what I've read he's definitely quite intriguing.


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?p=3597606#post3597606


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Seems to be another decent performance by Bargnani, I wonder how Bernie Bickerstaff feels on him since he supposedly went over to scout him.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

People are running out of reasons to label Bargnani another "euro-bust" with his perfomances in the Italian playoffs. He is playing a key role on a great team in Europe at age 20, and putting up good stats all around the board. I really hope Toronto and Bosh wants Aldridge over Bargnani, although I don't think that's very likely right now.


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## narek

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The Tribune seems to be spotlighting possible draft picks:

Flying high despite lows: LSU's Thomas has elevated game while enduring hardships 



> Tyrus Thomas knows a lot about loss. It's about time the 19-year-old had a taste of success.
> 
> Thomas has received more than a sampling of recognition since he and his teammates at Louisiana State pounded Duke and Texas en route to the Final Four last month. He has become a super-sized version of an "American Idol" superstar—an amateur on the brink of something really big.
> 
> The redshirt freshman wasn't on any scout's radar when the season began—he wasn't even a starter through the Tigers' first nine games—but by season's end reporters were describing the 6-foot-9-inch power forward as a gravity-defying freak of nature on the basketball court.
> 
> He is expected to be one of the top picks in the June 28 NBA draft. If the Toronto Raptors do not select him with the No. 1 pick, the Bulls will have their eye on him at No. 2.
> 
> "I'm not really surprised," Thomas said of his turnaround in a telephone interview. "I'm not overwhelmed. It's all because of work."


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## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

OK, let me summarize the different rationales for each option:

1. Aldridge: Addresses our need for length and athleticism. Provided Chandler gets his act straight and bsts his butt this summer, we've got the Twin Towers reconstituted.

2. Bargnani: The closest thing to Dirk we've seen so far in the league. He's got size, a tremendous amount of skills, and he is also quite athletic. Will help us put the ball in the hoop.

3. T Thomas: Super athletic defense. Keeping with the Skiles mentality of a gritty, intense defense. Two shot blockers in the middle (3 with Noc) will make it tough to get inside.

4. R Gay: Most athletic wing out there. Possibly the greatest upside. Gives us the modern player. Having Deng, Gay and Nocioni is the equivalent of Marion, Diaw and Thomas... Well, sort of.

5. Morisson: A true scorer. We need someone who will systematically put it in the hoop. Someone the defense must always keep their eye on. Him and Gordon together will make us tough to defend.

6 Roy: Fits our need for a big guard perfectly. Does everything well, is a true team player. Will contribute right away. By drafting him, we've addressed our backcourt. All we need now is to pray that NY gets #1 next year and we're set.

Based on this, here is my preference

1. Bargnani
2. Gay
3. Aldridge
4. Roy
5. Thomas
6. Morisson


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Eric and Jonathan do a good job over at draftexpress. here is their first hand look at Sene. The good, the bad and the outlook. Interesting read and doesnt sway me at all. 

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1314

raftExpress had the pleasure of attending a small workout in Northern California Friday to check in on draft mystery man Saer Sene and St. Mary’s product Reda Rhalimi. The workout was run by former San Jose Spartans coach Keith Moss who was quite forthcoming and very enthusiastic about his two studies. Moss has only had 9 days to work with both players, but he’s made up for lost time by running them hard and heavy every day since they stepped through his door.

Moss has had much success working with agent Bouna NDiaye over the past two seasons. The tandem has uncovered the hidden talents of Ronny Turiaf, Mickael Gelabale, Ian Mahinmi, and DJ Mbenga just over the last two seasons and have started a trend of finding mobile big men with the work ethic and intensity that’s worth following. Each of the four aforementioned players are all known for their length, defensive intensity, and mobility to create problems for the opposition. Technique and repetition were the key words of the day for all these prospects and Moss runs the type of solid routine that can clearly get results.

The morning session was close to two hours with both players working at a vigorous clip. Neither said a word nor showed any outward signs of fatigue as they methodically went through every drill, stopping briefly perhaps once or twice for water. The players started with standard ball-handling drills as well as jump-stop and other balance and fundamental positioning work. The regimen went extensively into hand-eye coordination and touch development, which is clearly paying off as both players showed a soft clean release of the ball. Motion drills were incorporated into the shooting routines and the players worked from 3 attack angles during each series of repetitions. Much of the shooting work was predicated on recovery speed and endurance, which is certainly to the benefit of these two big men.

Player Evaluations:

Saer Sene, 7’0” 235lbs, Center, Senegal

Rbcverviers-pepinster.be


The most important thing to remember when evaluating Sene is how new most of this drill work is to him and how raw a physical specimen he is. Moss made no attempts to hide this fact and was actually quite enthusiastic about the progress Sene has made over such a short period of time.

The physical attributes Sene brings to the table are impressive and even more so when thought of in the context of his lack of any formal weight training and overall developmental experience. When talking to Moss, he projected that Sene could put on 30 pounds of muscle without altering his agility or range of motion whatsoever. After seeing Sene’s impressive frame there is no disagreement. *Sene has the ability to touch the rim while standing and uses his phenomenal length to its fullest extent both offensively and defensively. Once his lower body strength is improved he’ll be a terror on the boards and in the paint defensively.*

Athletically, Sene has quick feet and is fairly fluid. Nothing he did in the drills was geared to a speed for gauging his peak explosive ability, but *Sene was up to his elbows effortlessly on his dunk attempts while going half speed*. At one point, coach Moss a*sked if I had a camera so I could take a picture of him slapping the top of the backboard, so there’s not much more to say about him in terms of shot blocking potential.*

Skills wise, Sene has a long way to go before he’s game ready. Sene is working on harnessing the most fundamental of concepts such as jump-stops, post footwork, body positioning, and other form related core basketball concepts. Because of this, all of Sene’s drill work was done at a more measured pace in order to maintain the fundamental approach that is essential for him at this stage in his career. Moss was quick to point out that there are a number of things that Sene does well that simply do not translate into this setting, and that is understandable. Sene has got to continue to develop his hands. *While the touch is soft he had only modest success receiving the ball*, *though not poor*. Repetition is something that this 19 year old needs before he can become the aggressor in any offensive area.

*Sene does have some tools that are refined enough to serve as an excellent foundation for his future game. For one, there are shades of Kareem in his hook shot. The release point has to be near 11 feet in the air with Sene utilizing the full length of his reach and enormous hands to cup the ball effortlessly before the smooth release*. While the footwork isn’t there yet to be a competent offensive weapon, his release is high and consistent with good form, making it unblockable on any level. Sene was actually at his best when doing the motion shooting drills, using glass as well as dropping the ball in directly with an excellent arching trajectory. The improvement on execution during these drills serves as a good indicator of Sene’s ability to perform better in live situations where his instinct takes over.

*The negatives are obvious with a player who’s only played 3 years of organized ball*. He doesn’t have the lower body strength to hold position in the post against NBA centers and will not be able to simply rely on timing and reach to block shots. Because of the lack of leg strength, Sene cannot establish a low base and he’ll need that on both sides of the ball in the paint. Sene has no defined footwork or feel for the post at this point aside from his nice finishing ability. He’s still at the rudimentary stages of learning how to get himself into a position to utilize his excellent shooting form, so primary offense is not an option at this stage. Also, the lack of repetition leads him to tweak his delivery after a miss or two, though a quick word from Moss here and there would snap him back into line.

*The most significant portion of the workout, and what truly will determine if he becomes a factor in the NBA, is his attitude and approach to the game. From what we saw and heard, these areas are only going to serve him well. Sene is visibly hard on himself when failing to execute effectively and was vocal on numerous occasions. But, he also maintains his signature smile and seems to genuinely be having a good time while pushing himself through the routine. Despite there only being two players here, Sene never looked winded, never rested his hands on his knees or said a word about the pace of the drills.*

Overall, there is plenty to be encouraged by with Saer Sene. *He is definitely a player that shows all the traits that lead one to believe that he’ll continue to develop*. But, situation will be essential for Saer as he’ll need a ton of extra attention from the coaching staff of whatever team chooses him. *He’s quiet, but has a warm personality that will only serve him well as he attempts to overcome the language barrier and become an active part of whatever organization chooses him.*

The best situation for Sene would be one where he has some type of veteran to emulate and practice against, but also have some young players who he can identify with and come to when things are tough. Also, Sene will need a coach that knows how to foster development through positive instruction instead of someone who relies on intimidation and fear to get their message across. A team like Boston, Atlanta, or even Phoenix would be ideal for the various reasons mentioned above.
*
It’ll take some time to harness his talent but our opinion is that anyone looking for rebounding and interior defense from the center spot, and has the patience to wait for it, would be happy with what their working with.*


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The more I hear about this guy, the more I want him at #16.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

From now on, Im taking everything I read from DraftExpress with a grain of salt. And I dont have to explain why...hopefully Pax gets to work him out extensively.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I really dont think Paxson will take two big men with both picks unless someone like Simmons is still on the board. Paxson doesnt have three years to wait on some iffy big man no matter how good he may be. We need an athletiic Big defensive SG for a rotation with BH and KH and hopefully we can get that person at 16. It is ether Thomas or Aldridge at 2 and who ever is still there at 16 as a SG. Brewer, Carney, this guy from Switzerland, or Foye. But we have two spots to fell.

And with luck we can get our starting PF from FA either Harrington (combo foward) or Nene. But the idea of deng, Thomas, and Carney or Brewer off the bench sounds good to me.

david


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## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I really dont think Paxson will take two big men with both picks unless someone like Simmons is still on the board. Paxson doesnt have three years to wait on some iffy big man no matter how good he may be. We need an athletiic Big defensive SG for a rotation with BH and KH and hopefully we can get that person at 16. It is ether Thomas or Aldridge at 2 and who ever is still there at 16 as a SG. Brewer, Carney, this guy from Switzerland, or Foye. But we have two spots to fell.
> 
> And with luck we can get our starting PF from FA either Harrington (combo foward) or Nene. But the idea of deng, Thomas, and Carney or Brewer off the bench sounds good to me.
> 
> david


As well as that, Paxson has said that he might not be able to fill the Big Guard hole through F.A.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I really dont think Paxson will take two big men with both picks unless someone like Simmons is still on the board. Paxson doesnt have three years to wait on some iffy big man no matter how good he may be. We need an athletiic Big defensive SG for a rotation with BH and KH and hopefully we can get that person at 16. It is ether Thomas or Aldridge at 2 and who ever is still there at 16 as a SG. Brewer, Carney, this guy from Switzerland, or Foye. But we have two spots to fell.
> 
> And with luck we can get our starting PF from FA either Harrington (combo foward) or Nene. But the idea of deng, Thomas, and Carney or Brewer off the bench sounds good to me.
> 
> david


Another SG that Pax might target is Rudy Fernandez. Back then, when Paxson traveled to Spain to scout Nocioni and Macijauskas, Rudy played great ball against them and earned MVP honors in spite of his team losing the King's Cup final. So Im sure Pax knows about him and has a fairly good impression. Its been two years from that, so you never know...
Also Rudy's team, DKV Joventut, is playing next year's Euroleague and the kid would love to stay in Spain to compete in that competition. So I dont know for certain if he is coming to the States to play pro ball as soon as this year.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Isnt he a PG?

david


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> Isnt he a PG?
> 
> david


Nope.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Nope.



He might line up as the offguard but he sure plays as a playmaker a good amount of the time. He could very well find that his best position in the pros is as a 1, considering his game seems to be out front a good deal, with good success


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> He might line up as the offguard but he sure plays as a playmaker a good amount of the time. He could very well find that his best position in the pros is as a 1, considering his game seems to be out front a good deal, with good success


I dont see him as a playmaker at all, even more at the NBA level.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I can't find the post, but someone mentioned that Shawne Williams has a 7'3" wingspan, WOW! The guy I hope for @ 16 is Carney, but if we cannot find an athletic swingman, I would not mind taking a gamble on Williams. He may not be NBA ready, but in the middle of the lottery, it may be hard to find an NBA-ready player anyway. We should take a gamble with him, if our other top choices (ie Cedric Simmons, Carney, Brewer, etc) are taken. I'm not too high on Brewer, but he fills a need. I also have not seen much of Brewer, so hopefully someone can give their honest input about him.

Sene looks like a guy, I would love to get a late 1st rounder for, and take a gamble. He would be hit or miss. A team like SA would be able to gamble with him, versus us though. We have not shown to be good developers of big man. Ewing is reportedly available as a coach, why can't the Bulls be smart enough, and grab him to tutor Tyson and possibly Aldridge (whoever we draft).


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

O'Yeah, I don't know where rlucas gets his info, but keep it coming. Thanks so much for the great reports rlucas! We really appreciate it.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> O'Yeah, I don't know where rlucas gets his info, but keep it coming. Thanks so much for the great reports rlucas! We really appreciate it.



Your welcome animal


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> O'Yeah, I don't know where rlucas gets his info, but keep it coming. Thanks so much for the great reports rlucas! We really appreciate it.


I second that.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> I second that.


Thanks Chapu. I enjoy reading your stuff as well. Your insight on Spanish basketball through your allegiance to Argentina is very insightful. And I thought of you when Sam Smith talked about trading for Scola this morning. That is something that could/should be explored.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Marquinhos works out for the Lakers. Jonathons insight. Great stuff. 

Marcus Vinicius Vieira De Souza (Marquinhos):

Marquinhos measured out very well at 6’10 with shoes, with a 6’11 ½ wingspan and a 34 inch vertical jump. He shot the ball well from the outside and looked good in the two on two portion of the drill. The source was pretty clear that Marquinhos really showed in the two on two drills that he was the best fit for the triangle offense due to his size and skill package


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Marquinhos works out for the Lakers. Jonathons insight. Great stuff.
> 
> Marcus Vinicius Vieira De Souza (Marquinhos):
> 
> Marquinhos measured out very well at 6’10 with shoes, with a 6’11 ½ wingspan and a 34 inch vertical jump. He shot the ball well from the outside and looked good in the two on two portion of the drill. The source was pretty clear that Marquinhos really showed in the two on two drills that he was the best fit for the triangle offense due to his size and skill package


He was a headache for various argentinean teams in some continental competitions, he was a great scorer and very good outside shooter (college 3).

BTW: Any doubt that Sam Smith takes many ideas from visiting different message boards?


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Here is a Hoopsworld article I found interesting. I will post the whole article, mostly because the flashing ads are so annoying that I want to spare anyone having to click the link. 

http://www.hoopsworld.com/article_17529.shtml


--------

With the lottery finally in the books, the Chicago Bulls tip-toed their way into the second overall pick in the draft. Suspense was high heading into the commercial break with the Toronto Raptors having snuck into the top three, but when it was all said and done, John Paxson got the pick that the Knicks record deserved.

So where do the Bulls go from here? What are they supposed to do with that number two pick? If last week’s “Running with the Bulls” is any indication, there should be no reason not to draft LaMarcus Aldridge or Tyrus Thomas. Toronto has a few options at number one: LaMarcus Aldridge, a potential center-of-the-future to go alone with Chris Bosh and Charlie Villanueva, Adam Morrison, the most established scorer of this class, or Andrea Bargnani, a 6’11” Colangelo family favorite who has drawn comparisons to Vlad Radmonovic and Dirk Nowitzki.

No matter what the Raptors decide to do, Paxson will end up with Ty Thomas or Aldridge. He knows that the Bulls need size and length, and he’s just not stupid enough to pick anybody outside of those two guys.

Now at pick 16, anything could happen. If the Bulls do in fact draft for size with the first pick, they may opt to go for a big guard later. Or, they’ll go for size again. Or, as Paxson has said he’ll do if the right player were to fall, he’ll draft the player with the most star potential, even if that player doesn’t fit any specific need.

The following is the rest of the Bulls’ unofficial first round draft board (picks 6-16). Must like last week’s column, this does not necessarily reflect John Paxson’s list; it’s just the best guess to be made according to the Bulls’ needs and the way some of the early workouts are pointing. Remember, this is not a mock draft—it’s a draft sheet for the Bulls, and the Bulls only.

One more note: The only position the Bulls have absolutely no reason to draft is point guard. Hinrich’s most likely a Bull for life, and it’s difficult to envision Paxson drafting uncertain point prospects like Marcus Williams, Randy Foye, and Rajon Rondo. For that reason, these players, usually considered more highly touted than a lot of the guys on this list, have been omitted from the draft board.

And so, without further ado…

6. Adam Morrison, SF, 6’8”, 220 lbs., Junior, Gonzaga. Not that Morrison will be there for the Bulls at 16, but if he were, he’d certainly be the best player available!

7. Ronnie Brewer, SF/SG, 6’7”, 217 lbs., Junior, Arkansas. For most of the season, many thought it was possible for Brewer, possibly the best defensive guard available in this draft (and blithely compared to Scottie Pippen), could potentially be available for the Bulls latter pick. However, now that guys like Joakim Noah and Josh McRoberts have pulled out of the draft, he’ll probably go somewhere between 10 and 13. He’s exactly what the Bulls need for the guard rotation, but chances of him being available when Chicago picks are slim.

8. Sheldon Williams, PF, 6’9”, 250 lbs., Senior, Duke University. This is another guy who is a lock for the lottery, but his kind of size, experience, and intensity would be a great fit. Look for Williams to end up in Houston, Seattle, New Orleans, or Philadelphia. 

9. Mardy Collins, PG, 6’6”, 205 lbs., Senior, Temple University. Collins was the first realistic middle first-rounder to work out with the Bulls this week, but it doesn’t seem like his early wave of tryouts have been going well. His shot has not been good, but many scouts believe it’s just nerves. Known as being a strong defensive player in college, his size and position would allow him to defend a lot of the tall guards in the league, leaving Kirk Hinrich to better utilize his defensive abilities on smaller guards. He’d be a great fit for the Bulls if he were to fall that low, but a lot of teams like the idea of him for the same reasons the Bulls do.

10. Rodney Carney, SF/SG, 6’7”, 205 lbs., Senior, Memphis University. The Bulls might have Carney listed a little higher than this, even if only because of his potential to be a Jason Richardson type player. The kid can absolutely jump out of the gym, and along with Ty Thomas might be the most athletic guy in the draft. He, too, should be taken by the time the Bulls select, but if he’s there, go ahead and put him into black and red. Paxson wouldn’t pass.

11. Cedric Simmons, PF/C, 6’10”, 233 lbs., Sophomore, North Carolina State. Simmons is another defensive-minded specialist, and he’s tall. The only problem is that he wouldn’t give the Bulls the kind of offense down low that they need, and he’s extremely young. He might be a good gamble, but many other players would be better fits.

12. Shannon Brown, SG, 6’4”, 205 lbs., Junior, Michigan State University. Brown might be a little too short for the Bulls’ needs, but as a home-state product from Maywood, picking him would surely be a nice full-circle journey. Many scouts are pitting Brown as a serious possibility for the Bulls at sixteen. He averaged over 17 points a game last year, which would give the Bulls another serious scorer from the perimeter. It’s not their most pressing need, but Brown might be too hard to pass up if he were the best man available at that point in the draft.

13. Patrick O’Bryant, C, 7’0”, 250 lbs., Sophomore, Bradley University. Bradley U had a great tournament, which will certainly up O’Bryant’s status a tish, but most of the hype behind this guy is due to his seven-footedness. He’s a young, raw project (which is the last thing the Bulls need), but he is huge, and that’s never a bad thing. He’s expected to be a lottery pick, but if he fell, he might become an intriguing possibility as a project guy to develop. That said, the Bulls are going to avoid going young as much as possible.

14. Hilton Armstrong, PF/C, 6’11”, 235 lbs., Sophomore, University of Connecticut. This is another guy that could very realistically be there for the Bulls’ second pick. He’s very tall and long, blocks a lot of shots, and isn’t afraid to turn around and dunk on somebody. Still, his offensive game needs a lot of work, and he would need to gain a lot weight in muscle to make it as a banger in the NBA. If Paxson goes size, Hilton may be the boy.

15. Maurice Ager, SG, 6’4”, 205 lbs., Senior, Michigan State University. Ager is another interesting MSU possibility. Again, he might be too short, but he also might be the best guy left at 16.

16. JJ Redick, SG, 6’4”, 190 lbs., Senior, Duke University. Redick is slipping further and further down draft boards because of his lack of height and apparent inability to create his own shot. Of course, that’s what scouts said about Jameer Nelson, and look how that panned out for Orlando. Somebody’s eventually going to take a gamble on this kid, and the Bulls probably wouldn’t be the worst place in the world for him. He’d be reunited with ex-teammates Luol Deng and Chris Duhon, just in time to slip into that John Paxson-Steve Kerr roll. The token white three-point shooter. If the Bulls draft Aldridge second overall to spread out defenses a little more for the likes of Hinrich and Ben Gordon, a guy like Redick might have a place in the Windy City.

No matter what happens, Bulls fans, trust that John Paxson will make the best decisions for this team. He’s done well drafting the last few years, and it’s a safe guess that he’ll continue to do well. He understands that drafting polished, experienced college players is a priority over needlessly gambling on too many freshmen and sophomores. He knows that if there’s a very talented player available over someone who aligns with a “need,” he’ll draft the very talented player if that’s what he feels is best.

At sixteen, look for the Bulls to take one of three guys: Shannon Brown, Mardy Collins, or Hilton Armstrong. Any of those players could be available at that point in the first round, and off them would fill different needs for an already-young Bulls team.

Chicago’s had some luck so far in just getting the second overall pick. How it plays out from here will rely quite a bit on luck as well.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> Here is a Hoopsworld article I found interesting. I will post the whole article, mostly because the flashing ads are so annoying that I want to spare anyone having to click the link.
> 
> 
> At sixteen, look for the Bulls to take one of three guys: Shannon Brown, Mardy Collins, or Hilton Armstrong. Any of those players could be available at that point in the first round, and off them would fill different needs for an already-young Bulls team.
> 
> Chicago’s had some luck so far in just getting the second overall pick. How it plays out from here will rely quite a bit on luck as well.



I will puke if we take one of those overrated undertalented three.

Shannon Brown solves nothing. Mardy "do nothing well, everything average" Collins would be fine at pick 25. Hilton Armstrong is Tyson Chandler without the experience.

Damn, if that is our lot to choose from, we should beg for a trade. Fortunately, that's not and the writer is bonging it. 

Sene, Fernandez, Marqhinous will all be there and fill needs. Sene may be too long of a project for Paxson but another shrimp guard is not needed.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

LOL @ the Hilton Armstrong and Tyson comparison....

Stop it...That just ruins your credability.


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I wish there were a database of players attributes so that we won't keep seeing the numbers change.


> 15. Maurice Ager, SG, 6’4”, 205 lbs., Senior, Michigan State University. Ager is another interesting MSU possibility. Again, he might be too short, but he also might be the best guy left at 16.


Ager is one the guards I have a keen eye on, didn't he supposedly measure at 6'5" before one of his workouts? Anyways, we have him working out on the 30th, along with Quincy Douby and Hassan Adams.

Most of the other guards I can't see falling to our pick. Brewer would be great, Carney would be another one to keep an eye on, but after that nothing interests me. Shannon Brown is listed at 6'3 on draftexpress, he'll have to impress Paxson alot to be considered imo. Collins is the last player I would look at with our pick, if I really wanted defense that much I would pick up a second rounder and get Bobby Jones.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

TomB,

Thanks great post and looking foward to next weeks.

david


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Quite frankly, whatever Pax is does at 2 and 16 is probably going to work out. I have confidence in Paxs ability to draft good players. I dont have confidence in everything else he does, but I think he has a good handle on the draft. Sometimes I wish we broke the GM part into a draft guy and a FA/trade guy. Pax knows he needs athletes and size. he will figure it out. But if the 16th pick is Paul Davis then syanara Bullsnation. I will no longer be a fan. That would be the ultimate great white hope homer pick to appease our little republican coach and I wont stand for it. Thats where I draw the line in the sand. Outside of that, I am fine with most anything. 

Though I hope its 

Bargnani

Sene/Fernandez.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

rlucus,

We saw two years ago that paxson wanted BG and either deng or Iggy and he made a second pick appear out of thin air. Is it possible he would use 16 and something else to move up and get Roy in addition to one of the big men?

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Bargnani is a raptor without the jersey right now...

might as well keep your sights on the other 2 big's


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> rlucus,
> 
> We saw two years ago that paxson wanted BG and either deng or Iggy and he made a second pick appear out of thin air. Is it possible he would use 16 and something else to move up and get Roy in addition to one of the big men?
> 
> david



David, anything is possible. I havent heard about the Bulls moving up. But there does appear to be a few teams who want to move up and a few teams who want out altogether. Id look for GS to move up. Id look for Toronto to move down. I think the Bulls are probably going to stand pat in the end. I hear its Aldridge with the pick if he is available. But its so early in terms of workouts etc that I am sure that could change. But thats what I hear now. I just hope the Bulls, and not that bimbo Ivika Dukan, is watching Bargnani. After watching Dirk yesterday, how could we not want something similar? No, Bargnani is probably not going to be as good as Dirk. But geez, the similarities in terms of their games is there. If he is a poor mans Dirk, how can we pass on that?


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> David, anything is possible. I havent heard about the Bulls moving up. But there does appear to be a few teams who want to move up and a few teams who want out altogether. Id look for GS to move up. Id look for Toronto to move down. I think the Bulls are probably going to stand pat in the end. I hear its Aldridge with the pick if he is available. But its so early in terms of workouts etc that I am sure that could change. But thats what I hear now. I just hope the Bulls, and not that bimbo Ivika Dukan, is watching Bargnani. After watching Dirk yesterday, how could we not want something similar? No, Bargnani is probably not going to be as good as Dirk. But geez, the similarities in terms of their games is there. If he is a poor mans Dirk, how can we pass on that?


Aside from Kukoc, our European scouting during the Krause regime was pretty awful. Has Paxson re-shuffled the perssonel at all? Nocioni was a nice find but we don't seem to have gone Euro much lately...

Does anybody know how Drago Pasalic fared in Europe this season? He was somewhat intriguing in the Rocky Mountain Revue, putting up okay numbers, 20 years old and 6'11''. Anyone know anything?


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Thankis rlucus,

As you know i enjoy each years draft and the effort you put in keeping us updated.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

...

would of posted words from chad ford today, but it was nothing special at all

only thing noteable is



> Two, this is one of the weakest drafts in recent memory. Players will go 15 to 20 places higher in some cases than they normally would. That's a great incentive to be in the draft this year. Next year's draft, on paper, looks like one of the best ever. We could name 10 guys who would be ranked ahead of the top four or five prospects in this draft.


LOL I disagree, because aside from Durant, Oden & POSSIBLy Noah, there aren't many in 2007's draft going before the top 5 in this one


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



jbulls said:


> Aside from Kukoc, our European scouting during the Krause regime was pretty awful. Has Paxson re-shuffled the perssonel at all? Nocioni was a nice find but we don't seem to have gone Euro much lately...
> 
> Does anybody know how Drago Pasalic fared in Europe this season? He was somewhat intriguing in the Rocky Mountain Revue, putting up okay numbers, 20 years old and 6'11''. Anyone know anything?



I have thought Pasalic but just dont have the resources I used to to keep up with him. Ill snoop around and get you an answer sometime this week. 

The Bulls hired a guy from the Knicks last year whose name now skips me. I was told that one of his plans was to build up the european scouting. But when I asked recently a couple of my sources they basically say the Bulls, along with the Knicks, are basically ghosts in terms of the international scouting regime. Now, Krause didnt have much success in Europe, but he was there constantly. Krauses problem was that he was a control freak and didnt trust anyone. So it was him and Dukan for the most part. But Krause was a mad man going to games in God awful places, including China to see Yao 2 years before Yao was even available. We can criticize Krause for alot of things, but effort can not be one of them. Krause alone gave us a bigger presence in Europe then the Pax regime has so far. 

But you know what, Maybe the Bulls need to think outside the box. Maybe Europe is not the place to be anymore? Watching guys like Ginobili, Barbosa, and now the rumor is that Marquinhos might be that Diaw type player at the end of round 1. Maybe we ought to spend some money on a fulltime South American scout. I say hire Chapu, who knows the terrian and what constitutes a good player (thats a complement Chapu) or anyone. Only 5-7 teams have fulltime South American scouts. Or go to Africa, where only 3 clubs have fulltime scouts (Dallas, Detroit, San Antonio). Eventually Africa is going to be a huge importer of talent to the NBA. Or Asia. But I still am very disappointed with this. We need to have a presence. Pax I believe is a bit lazy. He likes his college players, players from major programs, and thats it. Heck, I would just like to draft a guy from an NAIA school, let alone an unknown european. I mean, what seperates the Spurs from someone like us is not so much the fact that they have good players but that they go anywhere to find them. Does anyone really think Pax even knew who Ian Mahinmi was when the Spurs took him last year? Now the guy looks like an absolute steal. If Mahinmi were in this draft, he would be top 7. The Spurs do the homework, put in the miles and thats why they are a great franchise. We need to be more like that. If Pax isnt willing to go and scout these guys in a big way, he ought to build out a staff that will, fulltime.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> But you know what, Maybe the Bulls need to think outside the box. Maybe Europe is not the place to be anymore? Watching guys like Ginobili, Barbosa, and now the rumor is that Marquinhos might be that Diaw type player at the end of round 1. Maybe we ought to spend some money on a fulltime South American scout. I say hire Chapu, who knows the terrian and what constitutes a good player (thats a complement Chapu) or anyone. Only 5-7 teams have fulltime South American scouts. Or go to Africa, where only 3 clubs have fulltime scouts (Dallas, Detroit, San Antonio). Eventually Africa is going to be a huge importer of talent to the NBA. Or Asia. But I still am very disappointed with this. We need to have a presence. Pax I believe is a bit lazy. He likes his college players, players from major programs, and thats it. Heck, I would just like to draft a guy from an NAIA school, let alone an unknown european. I mean, what seperates the Spurs from someone like us is not so much the fact that they have good players but that they go anywhere to find them. Does anyone really think Pax even knew who Ian Mahinmi was when the Spurs took him last year? Now the guy looks like an absolute steal. If Mahinmi were in this draft, he would be top 7. The Spurs do the homework, put in the miles and thats why they are a great franchise. We need to be more like that. If Pax isnt willing to go and scout these guys in a big way, he ought to build out a staff that will, fulltime.


Exactly! Nice post btw.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I have thought Pasalic but just dont have the resources I used to to keep up with him. Ill snoop around and get you an answer sometime this week.
> 
> The Bulls hired a guy from the Knicks last year whose name now skips me. I was told that one of his plans was to build up the european scouting. But when I asked recently a couple of my sources they basically say the Bulls, along with the Knicks, are basically ghosts in terms of the international scouting regime. Now, Krause didnt have much success in Europe, but he was there constantly. Krauses problem was that he was a control freak and didnt trust anyone. So it was him and Dukan for the most part. But Krause was a mad man going to games in God awful places, including China to see Yao 2 years before Yao was even available. We can criticize Krause for alot of things, but effort can not be one of them. Krause alone gave us a bigger presence in Europe then the Pax regime has so far.
> 
> But you know what, Maybe the Bulls need to think outside the box. Maybe Europe is not the place to be anymore? Watching guys like Ginobili, Barbosa, and now the rumor is that Marquinhos might be that Diaw type player at the end of round 1. Maybe we ought to spend some money on a fulltime South American scout. I say hire Chapu, who knows the terrian and what constitutes a good player (thats a complement Chapu) or anyone. Only 5-7 teams have fulltime South American scouts. Or go to Africa, where only 3 clubs have fulltime scouts (Dallas, Detroit, San Antonio). Eventually Africa is going to be a huge importer of talent to the NBA. Or Asia. But I still am very disappointed with this. We need to have a presence. Pax I believe is a bit lazy. He likes his college players, players from major programs, and thats it. Heck, I would just like to draft a guy from an NAIA school, let alone an unknown european. I mean, what seperates the Spurs from someone like us is not so much the fact that they have good players but that they go anywhere to find them. Does anyone really think Pax even knew who Ian Mahinmi was when the Spurs took him last year? Now the guy looks like an absolute steal. If Mahinmi were in this draft, he would be top 7. The Spurs do the homework, put in the miles and thats why they are a great franchise. We need to be more like that. If Pax isnt willing to go and scout these guys in a big way, he ought to build out a staff that will, fulltime.


Nice post. It's been extremely impressive that the Spurs have been able to consistently find good players with low draft picks, and largely due to their overseas scouting it would seem. Now that the Bulls are a respectable team we're going to be dealing with mid to late first and second round picks. Krause's bad drafting at 20+ in the first round really hamstrung the franchise post-Jordan. Can't let that happen again.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think it must be every year i hear this is a weak draft or there are three impact players but the rest of the draft is one of the weakest ever. Wade is too small. Kh is too white. JRich is to from Mich state. I think we sports beat writes print things like that they are just being lazy. I think this is a strong draft in terms of depth there are just not superstars. But that is at most a couple of players a year after that he all depends on scouting and good judgement. Karl Malone was what the 12th pick. We shall see how strong this draft is but it always takes a couple of years.

david


----------



## dnana86

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> ...
> 
> would of posted words from chad ford today, but it was nothing special at all
> 
> only thing noteable is
> 
> 
> 
> LOL I disagree, because aside from Durant, Oden & POSSIBLy Noah, there aren't many in 2007's draft going before the top 5 in this one


Durant, Oden, Noah, McRoberts, Splitter, Hawes and Tomic are seven that come my mind really quickly. I think Chad may actually be more or less right on this one.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I think it must be every year i hear this is a weak draft or there are three impact players but the rest of the draft is one of the weakest ever. Wade is too small. Kh is too white. JRich is to from Mich state. I think we sports beat writes print things like that they are just being lazy. I think this is a strong draft in terms of depth there are just not superstars. But that is at most a couple of players a year after that he all depends on scouting and good judgement. Karl Malone was what the 12th pick. We shall see how strong this draft is but it always takes a couple of years.
> 
> david



Hopefully your right David. But this one looks closer to the Fizer/Crawford stinker then it does the 2004 bonanza, IMO


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Its the same story (or it seems so) when it comes to future drafts, and this "next year's crop is going to be great". And when it comes, you find that 2 or 3 guys went back to school and other prospects didnt pan out as expected. 

Oden is what makes next year's draft special, with the opportunity of having other exceptional talents. But until we get to see whats there, we cant talk about it as one of the best ever (or in recent memory).

I would gladly scout our entire country for the Bulls, we have great talent over here and its base is growing each year. South America its pretty interesting, Argentina and Brazil will keep producing talent, no matter what sport you are talking about. But seriously, it wouldnt be bad to have a REAL scout going back and forth between Argentina and Brazil. Sometimes they will leave early for Europe, especially Spain, but not always. At least you get to see their development curve.

I always wondered about scouting departments and why is it that teams seem reluctant to give them an important place when it comes to building the future of the franchise. Its a win-win situation having scouts over Asia, Africa, South America and Europe. Is it about money? I dont think so. Why would IT fire his entire european scouting corp? Obviously Im ignorant, thats why Im asking. And when you think they are the Knicks, New York Knicks, you just have to shake your head in disbelief.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Its the same story (or it seems so) when it comes to future drafts, and this "next year's crop is going to be great". And when it comes, you find that 2 or 3 guys went back to school and other prospects didnt pan out as expected.
> 
> Oden is what makes next year's draft special, with the opportunity of having other exceptional talents. But until we get to see whats there, we cant talk about it as one of the best ever (or in recent memory).
> 
> I would gladly scout our entire country for the Bulls, we have great talent over here and its base is growing each year. South America its pretty interesting, Argentina and Brazil will keep producing talent, no matter what sport you are talking about. But seriously, it wouldnt be bad to have a REAL scout going back and forth between Argentina and Brazil. Sometimes they will leave early for Europe, especially Spain, but not always. At least you get to see their development curve.
> 
> I always wondered about scouting departments and why is it that teams seem reluctant to give them an important place when it comes to building the future of the franchise. Its a win-win situation having scouts over Asia, Africa, South America and Europe. Is it about money? I dont think so. Why would IT fire his entire european scouting corp? Obviously Im ignorant, thats why Im asking. And when you think they are the Knicks, New York Knicks, you just have to shake your head in disbelief.


I think next year's draft will definitely be better than this year's. However, it may be downgraded a bit by the fact that it'll be so strong due to being the first year post-HS rule change that some mid-late first round guys will stay in school. That may thin it out a bit. The lottery should be great though.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Speaking of Krause etc, man did he mess up with Bagaric and Tarlac. God, and that 2000 Draft where we got Fizer, JC, El Amin, Voshkul (spelling?) and Guyton. It made me want to cry.

I love NBA Draft Day b/c anything can happen. The surprises with the picks and the trades. 

I really hope Carney falls to us at 16. I def think he is fast enough to play the 2. Scary thing is, I can see a team like Houston taking him, and him fitting in very well.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Dont forget Roberto Dueñas, a.k.a "El Sexy".


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



jbulls said:


> I think next year's draft will definitely be better than this year's. However, it may be downgraded a bit by the fact that it'll be so strong due to being the first year post-HS rule change that some mid-late first round guys will stay in school. That may thin it out a bit. The lottery should be great though.


We can all agree this one is weak and next year's crop wont have to be special to be better. But when you read in different sites about how great its going to be, I prefer to proceed more cautiously.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I agree about the lack of international scouting on the Bulls part. It sucks because there is some talent to be had there. I highly doubt that anyone on the Bulls staff knows anything about Sene, Marquinhos or Rudy Fernandez. The college talent's good, but not as good as it used to be and should not be the only avenue that we rely on.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



dsouljah9 said:


> I agree about the lack of international scouting on the Bulls part. It sucks because there is some talent to be had there. I highgly doubt that anyone on the Bulls staff knows anything about Sene, Marquinhos or Rudy Fernandez. The college talent's good, but not as good as it used to be and should not be the only avenue that we rely on.


I posted that Pax watched one of Rudy's best performance first hand, and when you are left with a good first impression...Im not saying he is going to take him @ 16, but if he decides to pass on him it wont be for not knowing about Rudy.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> I posted that Pax watched one of Rudy's best performance first hand, and when you are left with a good first impression...Im not saying he is going to take him @ 16, but if he decides to pass on him it wont be for not knowing about Rudy.


I cant remember when that actually happened but wasnt it last year/season? It certainly can not hurt to see a player a few times before making a decision. It was reported that he would be in for a workout, so the Bulls are interested. But as you pointed out, his team has advanced and now the amount of workout time is limited. I would hope they would know more about Fernandez then one weekend of basketball. A workout doesnt do much for me either. Kwame Brown had just tremendous workouts. The more info the Bulls can have, the better. I am hoping they bring Marquinhos in and have him workout. Id move Marquinhos to my #3 choice for 16 behind Sene and Fernandez right now. But with next years draft awash in bigs, i think I might throw Fernandez in before Sene over the next few weeks.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I cant remember when that actually happened but wasnt it last year/season? It certainly can not hurt to see a player a few times before making a decision. It was reported that he would be in for a workout, so the Bulls are interested. But as you pointed out, his team has advanced and now the amount of workout time is limited. I would hope they would know more about Fernandez then one weekend of basketball. A workout doesnt do much for me either. Kwame Brown had just tremendous workouts. The more info the Bulls can have, the better. I am hoping they bring Marquinhos in and have him workout. Id move Marquinhos to my #3 choice for 16 behind Sene and Fernandez right now. But with next years draft awash in bigs, i think I might throw Fernandez in before Sene over the next few weeks.


He was the MVP of that competition in 2004.


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## mgolding

*THE BALL(er)S OF THE DRAFT*

It's very easy to get caught up in a draft class and I think a lot of people here are falling for that. I see this draft as being of similar strength as the 2000 draft where we selected Fizer and Crawford. It is fun looking at a draft and fantasising about all the wild possibilities of what these players could turn into. Though the same excitable moments were had over Swift, Fizer, Miles and Dermarr Johnson in 2000. 

There's a general consensus about this draft not being particularly strong yet so many people have been advocating trading to get another pick and the like. For instance, I would not trade Deng for any pick other than the first in this draft and I wouldnt even strongly advocate that. 

Reddick was the college player of the year. Reddick. That doesnt mean everything considering TJ Ford was in the draft of Lebron/Wade/Anthony/Bosh but I think it is more representative of this draft class. The only future all-star possibilities I see in this draft are Bargnani and Gay. The only reason I even list them is because of potential, not because I think there anywhere near that level now or that there is any solid belief that they ever will be.

Whether trading up, trading down, trading out, trading in or using the picks we have I think its important that we dont get to carried away in this draft class. Bogut was dominant in college to a degree that none of this years big men came close to and he was nothing more than a solid contributor this last season for the Bucks.

Very little pressure should be put on this years picks especially if we go with a big man. There's no evidence in my mind to suggest that Aldridge, Bargnani or Thomas will do much more than have the odd good game inbetween many games of foul trouble and general punishment over the next season.

To revert back to the 2000 analogy I think Roy will be the Mike Miller of this draft. In that he'll never be spectacular but has the highest probability of being a strong NBA player throughout his career. The three big men could be related to 2001 and end up like Kwame, Tyson and Gasol. But which one is going to be Gasol and which are going to be Kwame and Tyson?


----------



## taurus515th

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

i have a feeling Paxson will draft Shelden Williams. I was really for tyrus thomas but i think he is not wut we need. Shelden Williams is the right choice. The only problem i have is that Shelden is only 6'9 but to me thats ok. 

shelden is the a good post player, he blocks shots, rebounds, hits free throws, played with luol deng and chris duhon, and is a Scott Skiles type player and has had 4 years of college basketball. Whats wrong with him? Why isnt he one of the top 10 players on peoples list of the top players in the draft? 

He may be short but for all those people here who say we should get al harrington in free agency well al harrington is the same height as shelden.

i think we should pick shelden with the knicks pick because he will be gone before our 16th pick. and + do we really need 2 rookies when our team is young enough?

Shelden's college stats 
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=11146

Lamarcus college stats
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=22514

Tyrus college stats
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=22259


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



taurus515th said:


> i have a feeling Paxson will draft Shelden Williams. I was really for tyrus thomas but i think he is not wut we need. Shelden Williams is the right choice. The only problem i have is that Shelden is only 6'9 but to me thats ok.
> 
> shelden is the a good post player, he blocks shots, rebounds, hits free throws, played with luol deng and chris duhon, and is a Scott Skiles type player and has had 4 years of college basketball. Whats wrong with him? Why isnt he one of the top 10 players on peoples list of the top players in the draft?
> 
> He may be short but for all those people here who say we should get al harrington in free agency well al harrington is the same height as shelden.
> 
> i think we should pick shelden with the knicks pick because he will be gone before our 16th pick. and + do we really need 2 rookies when our team is young enough?
> 
> Shelden's college stats
> http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=11146
> 
> Lamarcus college stats
> http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=22514
> 
> Tyrus college stats
> http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=22259



Taurus,


Willaims is a fine player, but at Number 2 Paxson or any other GM would be run out of town; and rightfully so.


----------



## taurus515th

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> Taurus,
> 
> 
> Willaims is a fine player, but at Number 2 Paxson or any other GM would be run out of town; and rightfully so.


i know wut ur saying but if the guy fits our team why not? why get a player that will have to take a few years to develop especially since our team is just a few players away. We do not have to for a rookie to develop inton a guy people say he will. why get a guy just because experts feel that he deserves to be in the top ten? i mean look at the 2000 and 2001 draft now i know if the experts could go back in time and change their opions they would. Gilbert Arenas a 2 second round pick. Tony Parker a 28th pick. None of the top 4 players in the draft from the 1998-2005 have gotten a ring yet or been in the finals or even the conference finals. i think k-mart is the only one tho now that i remember when he was on New Jeresy. i feel shelden williams will make an impact right away.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I found this trade in a mock draft by a poster here 

T Shock Draft 

#33 Pick
Josh Childress

#16 Pick
Othella Harrington

Thoughts? Would you do it? Would Atlanta do it?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



taurus515th said:


> i have a feeling Paxson will draft Shelden Williams. I was really for tyrus thomas but i think he is not wut we need. Shelden Williams is the right choice. The only problem i have is that Shelden is only 6'9 but to me thats ok.
> 
> shelden is the a good post player, he blocks shots, rebounds, hits free throws, played with luol deng and chris duhon, and is a Scott Skiles type player and has had 4 years of college basketball. Whats wrong with him? Why isnt he one of the top 10 players on peoples list of the top players in the draft?
> 
> He may be short but for all those people here who say we should get al harrington in free agency well al harrington is the same height as shelden.
> 
> i think we should pick shelden with the knicks pick because he will be gone before our 16th pick. and + do we really need 2 rookies when our team is young enough?
> 
> Shelden's college stats
> http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=11146
> 
> Lamarcus college stats
> http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=22514
> 
> Tyrus college stats
> http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=22259



LOL Shelden has no upside man. He reached his peak in college. He's gonna be a GOOD role player, but u don't take a player like him #2...any other year he'd be picked 15-25


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> rlucus,
> 
> We saw two years ago that paxson wanted BG and either deng or Iggy and he made a second pick appear out of thin air. Is it possible he would use 16 and something else to move up and get Roy in addition to one of the big men?
> 
> david


Paxson made Phoenix desperately clear Cap Space to make a big-time run at Kobe Bryant, which required them to shed the guaranteed salary their #7 pick would cost? 

If he's got that kind of power, maybe I shouldn't be critical of him, ever. He might get wind of it and mind-vaporize me or somesuch.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> Bargnani is a raptor without the jersey right now...
> 
> might as well keep your sights on the other 2 big's


You're probably right, and that's a shame. I think that Bargnani has the best chance out of all the big men this year or next of becoming an offensive powerhouse in the NBA. His skills will be all the more valuable as the league seems set to let offense come back into vogue. 

Maybe Colangelo's blowing smoke, but I doubt it. Humor me and imagine that Paxson has fallen head-over-heels for Bargnani and is willing to trade up for him. How much would you be willing to spend?

I'd give up the #2 and Colangelo's choice of Deng/Nocioni and a handful of future second-rounders for Bargnani and whatever salary-cap ballast needs to be thrown in.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Shelden's got as much upside as what Bill Laimbeer's hops were

And that's no diss on Shelden ...all I'm saying is is that he's a completed product


----------



## nbanoitall

*Trading Down?*

If I was Paxson personally Id draft Morrison because I believe he's the best in the draft, but I know not everyone agrees and thats ok I dont want to debate that. But I do want to debate what will happen with your picks.

The two guys I kinda thought would look good in a Bulls uni next year are

Sheldon Williams

and

Aaron Gray

Any thoughts on either of these two guys?


----------



## Mark_R

*Re: Trading Down?*

We'd have to deal down to 7 since Houston and Golden State could use Williams greatly in the post. Williams would be a great banger down low (could be a Ben Wallace without the hefty pricetag) and a great defensive presence. I still maintain the Bulls need a guy in the post who can get it in the hoop, but for the difference in money and the difference in potential output throughout the course of the contract, Shelden would be a wise move (compared to Big Ben).

Haven't seen much of Gray at all.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Trading Down?*

horrible idea

an idea in which u could of posted in the many various threads we already have


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> You're probably right, and that's a shame. I think that Bargnani has the best chance out of all the big men this year or next of becoming an offensive powerhouse in the NBA. His skills will be all the more valuable as the league seems set to let offense come back into vogue.
> 
> Maybe Colangelo's blowing smoke, but I doubt it. Humor me and imagine that Paxson has fallen head-over-heels for Bargnani and is willing to trade up for him. How much would you be willing to spend?
> 
> I'd give up the #2 and Colangelo's choice of Deng/Nocioni and a handful of future second-rounders for Bargnani and whatever salary-cap ballast needs to be thrown in.


what the hell!? for BARGNANI!? what if he turns out to be a bust?!

not thanks...you throw all that to a player like dirk..not to a guy you've barely ever seen


----------



## animalthugism

*Re: Trading Down?*

Yea.. highly unlikely, if we were to trade down to the lower lottery, I'd command a nice veteran also


----------



## nbanoitall

*Re: Trading Down?*



The ROY said:


> horrible idea


what drafting size, or you dont like the particular players I mentioned.

I hadnt heard much from bulls fans on gray. thats why i asked.


----------



## BenDengGo

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

i like bargnani, but no way i'm throwing in noc or deng as fillers.

deng is two off season away to be grant hill (light) !!

many people just seem to forget that he wasnt able to do much in the offseason due to his broken wrist.
no shooting practice and no weight lifting.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



BenDengGo said:


> deng is two off season away to be grant hill (light) !!
> 
> many people just seem to forget that he wasnt able to do much in the offseason due to his broken wrist.
> no shooting practice and no weight lifting.


Remeber before the playoffs when Deng was our hottest comodity. Nocioni blew up in the playoffs and suddenly Deng is the odd man out? The way I see it is Ben, Kirk, Lu, and Noce were all the best player on the team for stretches which is why I consider them our core and would like to keep all for at almost any expense.


----------



## BenDengGo

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

he did improve his shooting though he had surgery on his RIGHT wrist from .434 to .463.

i'm telling you on off season can do wonders. he'll have a significant improved three point shot and his midrange shot will be money. plus once he bulked up his upper body, he'll drive to the lane more frequently.

and in my opinion he is way quicker than people want him to look like.

come contract year at the latest he'll have all star like numbers.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I like Deng but he does seem like a bit of a chucker/blackhole to me. But he is definetely worth hanging on to. But he is no Grant Hill. Not the same mentality, not the same skill set.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> what the hell!? for BARGNANI!? what if he turns out to be a bust?!
> 
> not thanks...you throw all that to a player like dirk..not to a guy you've barely ever seen


Agreed. I like Bargnani, and would be thrilled if we get him, but let's not throw the farm away at him. There are other very nice players in this draft which would complement our core group well... We have had a habit of getting excited with the unknown and trading away (or wanting to trade away) our proven players. That hurts. My prefered option is to keep our core and add to it.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> I like Deng but he does seem like a bit of a chucker/blackhole to me. But he is definetely worth hanging on to. But he is no Grant Hill. Not the same mentality, not the same skill set.


Agreed.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Come on Deng was perhaps our best player the last 20 games of the season. And while he struggled a bit in the playoffs it was his first year in the playoffs and did get the experience the rest of the team got last year against washington. My guess is with his first full off season summer to work out he is going to really have a great third year and we will see a lot of BG, KH, LD, and Noci on the court at the same time next year.

david


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I like Deng. He can be, and in all liklihood will be, a tremendous player. But I think the Grant Hill comparisons are a bit preposterous, for lack of a better word. Grant Hill could explode and dunk on people, Grant Hill was a point guard in a SF body, Grant could do clear outs. When I think of players similar to Grant Hill, I think of James, I think of Pippen. Deng doesnt run the point, Deng doesnt get mid digit assists, Deng doesnt explode on people and Deng certainly doesnt have Hills handles. Could he get those things? Some of them yes, some of them no. I think your born with handles and the ability to run sets. I dont think you learn that. But could Deng work on his explosion, his ability to take people off the dribble, etc? Yes. But Luol Deng is not Grant Hill. He could be a Boris Diaw, he could be a Rashard Lewis, but I just dont see Grant Hill. But that doesnt mean he can not be, and will be, successful. The one thing Deng has to learn is that not every shot is a good shot. He shoots a great % for a guy who is a complete chucker. There are alot of things that infuriate me about the Bulls, Hinrichs overdribbling, Gordons inconsistency, Chandlers inability to catch a pass, Sweetneys inability to do anything, but Deng inability to make the extra pass is right up there. For him to take the next step is going to require him to pass on some very questionable shots that he normally does take. Because, as I have said before, I like SFs who are versatile, who can link up the backcourt with the front court, who can guard multilple spots and can provide help wherever needed. On my team, a SF is probably the most important position. And Deng needs to provide that ability to get everyone involved. So far he has not done that.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> what the hell!? for BARGNANI!? what if he turns out to be a bust?!
> 
> not thanks...you throw all that to a player like dirk..not to a guy you've barely ever seen


I hate to break it to you, but Toronto wouldn't hand over the #1 pick for Duhon and the #2. You have to give up something to get something.

And I hate to break it to you again, but the likelihood of the Bulls having both Deng and Nocioni in the fold for the long term is kind of a longshot. They are both best-suited to play the 3, and they're both going to want big, big contracts. Why not deal one of them now and get something out of it in return?

I would rather keep Deng than Nocioni, FWIW.


----------



## charlietyra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> I hate to break it to you, but Toronto wouldn't hand over the #1 pick for Duhon and the #2. You have to give up something to get something.
> 
> And I hate to break it to you again, but the likelihood of the Bulls having both Deng and Nocioni in the fold for the long term is kind of a longshot. They are both best-suited to play the 3, and they're both going to want big, big contracts. Why not deal one of them now and get something out of it in return?
> 
> I would rather keep Deng than Nocioni, FWIW.


I like Bargnani too and I think he is Colangelo's guy. However, he is not Lebron James and the Bulls do not have the luxury of giving up more than Duhon to get him IMO. Bargnani is still too much of a gamble to give up one of our core guys. 

I think we should keep both Deng and Nocioni. One of the disturbing trends I have seen recently on this board is the denigrating of Deng. He still has the most upside (by far) of any of the Bulls on the current roster. The improvement of Nocioni should not overshadow this. My vision of Noce is for him to be sort of a super 6th man (e.g. John Havlicek his first few years) who comes off the bench to play 30-35 minutes at either forward spot. This would mean that Deng or Thomas (for example) swing to other positions to give Noce the court time.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> I hate to break it to you, but Toronto wouldn't hand over the #1 pick for Duhon and the #2. You have to give up something to get something.
> 
> And I hate to break it to you again, but the likelihood of the Bulls having both Deng and Nocioni in the fold for the long term is kind of a longshot. They are both best-suited to play the 3, and they're both going to want big, big contracts. Why not deal one of them now and get something out of it in return?
> 
> I would rather keep Deng than Nocioni, FWIW.


you're not breaking ANYTHING to me

your trade proposal was absurd....PERIOD

he's not wade, not lebron, not kobe, not amare

u make those type of ttrades for THOSE guys..not some unproven kid u know NOTHING about


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Carney, Please Drop to 16 



> Like the 6-foot-8 McGrady, the 6-7 Carney has jaw-dropping leaping ability, an effortless jump shot, and when he's hot, he can burn the nets for hours.
> 
> Carney might be the best athlete in the draft; there's little doubt whether he's the fastest. He can cover the 40-yard dash in 4.5 seconds.


I'm afraid though, he'll be taken by Houston. He would fit perfectly next to TMac


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Carney, Please Drop to 16
> 
> 
> 
> I'm afraid though, he'll be taken by Houston. He would fit perfectly next to TMac


there was already heavy speculation that houston would of taken him....so that pick is pretty much a done deal


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I like Carney, I like Gay, I like Morrison, I like Shawnee Williams and I like Marquinhos. Somene is going to fall to 16. There just isnt the demand for 3s in the top half of this draft. Williams is rumored to have a promise. Might mean Gay or Carney crater. It wouldnt be unlike the kid who fell to Indiana last year or Gerald Green.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I like Carney, I like Gay, I like Morrison, I like Shawnee Williams and I like Marquinhos. Somene is going to fall to 16. There just isnt the demand for 3s in the top half of this draft. Williams is rumored to have a promise. Might mean Gay or Carney crater. It wouldnt be unlike the kid who fell to Indiana last year or Gerald Green.


Rlucas, why would a guy like Rudy Gay fall to #16? I think, as well, that there is at least one team with multiple picks before us, so you take need with one and BPA with the other. I cant see a talent like Gay dropping that far with the talent level available. 

Carney was training with T-Mac, right?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Rlucas, why would a guy like Rudy Gay fall to #16? I think, as well, that there is at least one team with multiple picks before us, so you take need with one and BPA with the other. I cant see a talent like Gay dropping that far with the talent level available.
> 
> Carney was training with T-Mac, right?


The hunch I hear, and agree with is, is that perhaps the deepest position in this draft is on the wings. Either 2s or 3s. However the teams at the top really dont have much use for those positions. Every year someone falls. Usually the player that falls comes out of the position with the most supply. That position is the wingman this year. Someone will fall. I didnt say it would be Gay or anyone in particular, but I do think someone will. 

For the record, I hear Shelden Williams is the guy Houston likes.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The hunch I hear, and agree with is, is that perhaps the deepest position in this draft is on the wings. Either 2s or 3s. However the teams at the top really dont have much use for those positions. Every year someone falls. Usually the player that falls comes out of the position with the most supply. That position is the wingman this year. Someone will fall. I didnt say it would be Gay or anyone in particular, but I do think someone will.
> 
> For the record, I hear Shelden Williams is the guy Houston likes.


Do you have a personal mock draft?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Do you have a personal mock draft?



Not yet Chapu. Id like to get through some more of the workouts, perhaps a trade or two and the predraft camp. Ill come up with something before I take off for the world cup on June 21. Thatll have to stand til draft day. I am in the process of accumulating lots of info, rumour, opinion, conjecture, and the like to figure out what I think will happen.


----------



## Like A Breath

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

There is no way that Rudy Gay slips past 10, he's not a completely unproven commodity like Gerald Green or a perceived tweener like Danny Granger.

Hilton Armstrong has a far better offensive game than some of you guys realize. His midrange jumpshot is _money_ and he is a rather remarkable high-low passer. He finishes strong at the hoop. He can pump fake and put the ball on the floor for a few dribbles. I have seen him dribble out of a double team and a full court press, which is very impressive for a college center. Currently his post game is unpolished, but I like what I see from the rest of his offense.

I think the way James White has been shooting up draft boards that the Bulls might look at him at 16. He plays defense and fills the need for a long and athletic 2. Just a hunch.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

rlucus,

I too am looking foward to your mock draft. I think that either Brewer or Carney will be there at 16 for the same reasons that rlucus states. There are a lot of 2/3's in this years draft. And i agree that Houston wants a big rugged PF to help protect Yao and help him at rebounding and i think Williams game is a lot like Boozers. I also think boston and GS could go big as well and i think GS wants O'bryant from what i read on insider and the local papers. I also think Rando will end up at Seattle. The need a PG to make that team go and Luke seems to have really fallen out of favor there due to inconsistant O and almost no D. Rando's D could really help that team. And i think Simmons is going to quitely move up the broad as well with his size and reach and the 76ers and NO both need a replacement PF. If these bigs go early some SG has to fall. 

david


----------



## charlietyra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Like A Breath said:


> I think the way James White has been shooting up draft boards that the Bulls might look at him at 16. He plays defense and fills the need for a long and athletic 2. Just a hunch.


I have been thinking the same thing. Pax promised to get more height and athleticism for the Bulls. Wouldn't Aldridge/Thomas at the #2 spot and White at the #16 fulfill that promise?


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I like Carney, I like Gay, I like Morrison, I like Shawnee Williams and I like Marquinhos. Somene is going to fall to 16. There just isnt the demand for 3s in the top half of this draft. Williams is rumored to have a promise. Might mean Gay or Carney crater. It wouldnt be unlike the kid who fell to Indiana last year or Gerald Green.


Shawne Williams would be a bit of a reach at 16, wouldn't he? I don't know what to make of him. I don't think he suits our needs, he's 6' 9'' and still filling out. I don't think he's really a guy who can log too many minutes in the NBA at the 2 spot. I hope Ronnie Brewer falls, he's the guy I'd really like to get at 16.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Shawne Williams agent was quoted as saying he is working out for most of the teams from 6 to 15. i dont know what that means but i guess they think he is in the low teens. There does not seem to be much talk about him but i will bet someone in the top 15 wants him and because of this there is total radio blackout.

david


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> I hate to break it to you, but Toronto wouldn't hand over the #1 pick for Duhon and the #2. You have to give up something to get something.
> 
> And I hate to break it to you again, but the likelihood of the Bulls having both Deng and Nocioni in the fold for the long term is kind of a longshot. They are both best-suited to play the 3, and they're both going to want big, big contracts. Why not deal one of them now and get something out of it in return?
> 
> I would rather keep Deng than Nocioni, FWIW.


That's true. I still wouldn't let either Deng or Nocioni go for the right to pick Bargnani though (especially not with speculation that the Raptors really want to move down and draft Marcus Williams). 

Both guys are just too valuable. I'm not sure that in a draft where there's really no consensus anything at the top that trading for the right to move up one spot is a good idea. Ask 10 NBA GM's who's going to be better out of Tyrus Thomas and Andrea Bargnani in 5 years and I bet they'd be pretty evenly split. I don't think dealing a proven, young commodity for the right to pick one or the other is a great idea.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> I like Carney, I like Gay, I like Morrison, I like Shawnee Williams and I like Marquinhos. Somene is going to fall to 16. There just isnt the demand for 3s in the top half of this draft. Williams is rumored to have a promise. Might mean Gay or Carney crater. It wouldnt be unlike the kid who fell to Indiana last year or Gerald Green.


I see Carney playing shooting guard in the NBA, not small forward, I'm not alone with this am I?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



LegoHat said:


> I see Carney playing shooting guard in the NBA, not small forward, I'm not alone with this am I?


nope, you aren't

he's 6"7 but quick as hell...very mobile...

he can play both but he can play SG exclusively also IMO


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



LegoHat said:


> I see Carney playing shooting guard in the NBA, not small forward, I'm not alone with this am I?


I concur. Thus hoping we can somehow get him to be our big 2


----------



## remlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> I concur. Thus hoping we can somehow get him to be our big 2


I really want Carney. I just have this feeling that Carney will be picked 14th or 15th which will bum me out. 

Watching Tyrus rebound andn start the break with carney running the wing would be a great sight to see.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



remlover said:


> Watching Tyrus rebound andn start the break with carney running the wing would be a great sight to see.


the greatest site to see...in the HISTORY OF ALL SPORTS!

bring on the SHOWTIME bulls!


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'd trade Deng for Carney straight up, its a good deal for us. Then draft Splitter, O'Bryant, S. Williams, or Reddick at 16, preferably one of the bigs drop (and Splitter stays in.)

If Splitter stays in, we have a primary guard rotation of Gordon, Hinrich, Reddick, and at small forward we'd have Nocioni/Carney playing some spot minutes there, and then as a big man rotation, Chandler, Aldridge (or Thomas), (O'bryant, Williams, Splitter, cross out Reddick if this is the situation). and free agents.

Carney make sense imo, and he will probaly be better than Deng.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I agree that Thomas and Carney would look really great coming off the bench this year and learning the ropes. rlucus says that Paxson may draft Aldridge instead of Thomas but i think the Raptors may trade out of 1 with the bobcats or Portland so they can draft Aldridge and still end up getting Bargnani. If this happens than Thomas is our man. As for Carney the only workout peice i have read said he looks super fantastic in drills but in 2 on 2 he seems passive. Funny but that is the knock on him. What ever, if this is why if falls to the bulls great i think he would make a great defender and super on the fast break.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> rlucus says that Paxson may draft Aldridge instead of Thomas


Not doubting his word, but right now, all indications point to Thomas. Recently with Pax's comments in the paper, his comments to Chad Ford & that big *** spread in the suntimes of Thomas.. The top 4-5 GM's have already spoke on their "GUY" since the lotto, are they smokescreens? Possibly, Pax could be talking up Thomas so someone else takes him. I doubt it though, he's represents our current team alot more than any of the other big 2.

I'd be happy with Aldridge or Thomas, but I'd rather take the kid that shows heart, desire and lays it all out on the floor. I'm tired of these soft players, can we get SOMEONE with some sort of 'enforcer' mentality?!


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think Orlando or Houston take Carney though. However, if Gay is on board, Orlando could take him. Houston may take Shelden, as someone suggested earlier.

You never know who drops. Who would have thought Leinert would have fallen to the Cardinals (I actually told my friends the night before, he be a perfect fit there). But I would have never thought he'd drop so far.

Someone is going to drop, and we will be waiting to grab him a la Artest @ 16.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Lampe fell to 31 in 2003, hopefully Splitter, if he stays in, drops to 16, although Lampe isn't that good compared to Splitter imho, but Lampe had the hype to go #4 to the Raptors, and fell all the way to the 2nd round, hopefully Splitter lasts until 16, because he is probaly the best player in the entire draft.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> hopefully Splitter lasts until 16, because he is probaly the best player in the entire draft.


 ity:


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> the greatest site to see...in the HISTORY OF ALL SPORTS!
> 
> bring on the SHOWTIME bulls!



You must not have seen to many of the Michael Jordan championships era to think anything compares to those sights.

Or the Sight of Walter Payton holding the Superbowl Trophy.


Still, I am looking forward to the next championship running Chicago Bulls. I think this run will be team driven, instead of star driven.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Well i too must admit i like the idea of Thomas but my man (rlucus) says paxson likes Aldridge :clap: :cheers:. Sorry my daughter wants me to add the two drinking guys. But i think who ever pax takes he has good track record.

I still think Houston is taking Williams since they need a power foward to protect Yao and I personally think Foye will still be on the board when Orlando picks and they would be nuts not to take him. That leaves Brewer and Carney as SG and i think Marcus Williams as well. Seattle takes a PG as and Some one is going to take Armstrong and Simmons before us. And JJ R goes to Salt Lake City (home of the white person) and if this happens either Brewer or Carney falls to the bulls. We shall see. I am not saying it is Carney at 16 but i think it is one of the other. NO needs a SG and i just think they will take Brewer but we shall see.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> You must not have seen to many of the Michael Jordan championships era to think anything compares to those sights.
> 
> Or the Sight of Walter Payton holding the Superbowl Trophy.
> 
> 
> Still, I am looking forward to the next championship running Chicago Bulls. I think this run will be team driven, instead of star driven.


i was kidding


----------



## remlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

With all due respec to rlucus whose posts i enjoy reading, however he has a gut feeling about Paxson wanting Aldridge. Back in 03 rlucus had a gut feeling that Pietrus would have been a Bull. 

I want Tyrus badly, but i won't complain if Aldridge becomes a Bull. To me, it is a win-win situation (i just believe Tyrus will be a bigger win).


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> Well i too must admit i like the idea of Thomas but my man (rlucus) says paxson likes Aldridge :clap: :cheers:.


no offense to rlucus, but i could come on here and claim the same stuff. so until he comes through with who HE is or his sources are, i'll take the word of reputable writers and colulmnists.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Ooch!

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> Ooch!
> 
> david


it wasn't ment to be a diss or anything but it is the truth.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



remlover said:


> With all due respec to rlucus whose posts i enjoy reading, however he has a gut feeling about Paxson wanting Aldridge. Back in 03 rlucus had a gut feeling that Pietrus would have been a Bull.
> 
> I want Tyrus badly, but i won't complain if Aldridge becomes a Bull. To me, it is a win-win situation (i just believe Tyrus will be a bigger win).


No offense taken. 

For the record, my old college roommate played with Pietrus in france, and also happend to have had a short stint with the Bulls. When Krause was the GM, they were on MP2 likes flies on ****. Then Pax became the GM late in the cycle. I thought perhaps Krause would have clued Pax in. And Pax did send BJ and Pete (does this quote sound familiar "I will trust BJ and Pete inherently") to watch MP2, 3 days before the draft. But Jay went down, Pax didnt like JC, and everything changed. But all in all, they liked MP2 and my guess is they still do. And I hope they trade 16 for him.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> no offense to rlucus, but i could come on here and claim the same stuff. so until he comes through with who HE is or his sources are, i'll take the word of reputable writers and colulmnists.



fair enough


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Wow, I doubt Sene is going to be available at 16.

-Can touch the basket while standing.
-Effortlessly up to elbows on dunk attempts (no Sweetney eh)
-Quick feet, fluidity in his motion.
-


> At one point, coach Moss asked if I had a camera so I could take a picture of him slapping the top of the backboard, so there’s not much more to say about him in terms of shot blocking potential.


-Good hook shot, an 11 foot release point on it :O
-Good understanding of the backboard
-Good finishing ability.

-Lack of leg strength (any smart NBA team would get right to fixing this).
-Needs to work on his footwork in the post.

-Does not like to fail.
-Vocal
-Has fun while playing.
-Conditioned Well.


He has good potential, and he can do already what a guy like Ruffin would do, his long length would be good for patrolling the paint, and doing alley oops and easy dunks, as well as cleaning up. He has good enough shooting ability, but his problem right now, is leg strength so he doesn't get backed down at will in the post, and his positioning, so you can actually get him the ball and run a play through him, rather than depending on him to get the ball via rebound, or someone creating an open look for him.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I dont have any inside info but i would think that a team like Washington would be interested in a player like Sene. They are really small up front and you would think they would take a flyer on a player with good potential.

david


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Yeah, I'd take Sene in the 20's, but not at 16 when a player like Splitter or Carney may be available. But I think Sene will be gone before we pick again at 16.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> no offense to rlucus, but i could come on here and claim the same stuff. so until he comes through with who HE is or his sources are, i'll take the word of reputable writers and colulmnists.


FWIW, rlucas and I talk by PM every so often. I know where some of his sources come from and have no doubt they are legit.

Take it for my :twocents: and with a grain of salt if you will, but I vouch for him to the extent my credibility allows the same.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> FWIW, rlucas and I talk by PM every so often. I know where some of his sources come from and have no doubt they are legit.
> 
> Take it for my :twocents: and with a grain of salt if you will, but I vouch for him to the extent my credibility allows the same.



Thanks Tom. 

Just on a side note, I think its fine to question sources and the info. Its a month before the draft so What I hear isnt necessarily going to happen. It just happens to be the opinions of people in the know. Only one of the opinions that I stated came directly from an employee of the team that I mentioned. All the other opinions were gossip from NBA scouts (mostly international scouts that I knew from my brief 3 year career as a part time scout), two asst GMs and one actual GM. I remain in contact with 5 teams in total. 

Now for the record, what I heard about Aldridge being preferred came from a guy I trust. But it should also be pointed out that there is plenty of time for that to change. It did not come from the Bulls. I have no contact with anyone on the Bulls, unless we count Kismet, and even then I havent spoken to him in almost a year. Take my little gossip posts with a grain of salt. Its just passing along the info I hear and I dont mean to report it as fact or knowing the future. If anyone would simply prefer that I not post what I hear at all, if I get enough of that, I certainly will stop. But I thought some of this stuff would be of interest and might show what certain GMs are thinking before the start of the workout season


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> If anyone would simply prefer that I not post what I hear at all, if I get enough of that, I certainly will stop. But I thought some of this stuff would be of interest and might show what certain GMs are thinking before the start of the workout season



LOL

Dog...I really wouldn't have a reason to come to this site during this time of year then.

I feel like I owe you a monthly fee for all the stuff you say...LOL.

KEEP POSTING!


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Well, I don't feel like I should be paying you, but I'll keep taking the info, for free .


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

No one owes me anything. I enjoy talking hoops, particularly the draft (and my favorite, the undiscovered gems), with 99% of you. I am just saying that sometimes people get offended by posts and its not my intent to offend. If enough people dont want to hear the rumors I hear or gossip, then Ill stop posting it and talking pure basketball. Its not offensive to me. But I dont think thats the case at all.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> No one owes me anything. I enjoy talking hoops, particularly the draft (and my favorite, the undiscovered gems), with 99% of you. I am just saying that sometimes people get offended by posts and its not my intent to offend. If enough people dont want to hear the rumors I hear or gossip, then Ill stop posting it and talking pure basketball. Its not offensive to me. But I dont think thats the case at all.


Keep it coming. The rumors and gossip are what keeps this period of the year fun!


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> no offense to rlucus, but i could come on here and claim the same stuff. so until he comes through with who HE is or his sources are, i'll take the word of reputable writers and colulmnists.



Wow Roy, you really have chosen the wrong side on this issue.

Rlucas is too classy to defend himself, so I will. 

Rlucas has been paid for his opinion on basketball players and has the ear of many in the industry. He is a sounding board for those in the know and they trust him because he's trustworthy.

You don't have to believe him and I know you said it wasn't a diss. Still, for those who causually read these baords - Rlucas is as close to an impartial inside source as we are lucky to have.

J Givony from Draft Express also posts on the boards and is another great source for impartial info.

It doesn't mean they "KNOW" what will happen, but they certainly can give light to what would otherwise be grey topics.


I would read 100 of Rlucas' posts eagerly before 1000 of most others.

Rlucas is one of the bright spots on otherwise opinion boards.

Again, I understand you're not dissing, butyour thought process was way off base on this one.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> Wow Roy, you really have chosen the wrong side on this issue.
> 
> Rlucas is too classy to defend himself, so I will.
> 
> Rlucas has been paid for his opinion on basketball players and has the ear of many in the industry. He is a sounding board for those in the know and they trust him because he's trustworthy.
> 
> You don't have to believe him and I know you said it wasn't a diss. Still, for those who causually read these baords - Rlucas is as close to an impartial inside source as we are lucky to have.
> 
> J Givony from Draft Express also posts on the boards and is another great source for impartial info.
> 
> It doesn't mean they "KNOW" what will happen, but they certainly can give light to what would otherwise be grey topics.
> 
> 
> I would read 100 of Rlucas' posts eagerly before 1000 of most others.
> 
> Rlucas is one of the bright spots on otherwise opinion boards.
> 
> Again, I understand you're not dissing, butyour thought process was way off base on this one.


He doesn't have to "defend" him self because I didn't INSULT him. You don't have to come and defend him either, he's a grown man, I'm sure he doesn't need your help.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> He doesn't have to "defend" him self because I didn't INSULT him. You don't have to come and defend him either, he's a grown man, I'm sure he doesn't need your help.



Wasn't defending him as much as giving others who casually read the boards and don't know the history of his posts, his info and what made these baords what they are today - because of great posters and the ocassional piece of inside info we get from a poster like him.

Anytime you preface something with: I'm not..........YOU PROBABLY ARE.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> Wasn't defending him as much as giving others who casually read the boards and don't know the history of his posts, his info and what made these baords what they are today - because of great posters and the ocassional piece of inside info we get from a poster like him.
> 
> Anytime you preface something with: I'm not..........YOU ARE.


no, actually I wasn't...quit assuming so much..you CONTINUE to do that with me, now it's getting annoying.

I enjoy Rlucus's posts as much as the next man...


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

If I'm Toronto, I'd rather have a front court of Gay, Bosh and Aldridge instead of Villanueva, Bosh and Aldridge. Gay is more of a pure three and gives Toronto the perimeter athleticism and defense they need. 

Would you deal the #2 for Villanueva?


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> If enough people dont want to hear the rumors I hear or gossip, then Ill stop posting it and talking pure basketball.


They can choose to ignore you if they wish, there are quite alot of us that do enjoy reading your input.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I personally love the NBA Trade Deadline and Draft Day b/c of the rumors, the possibilities, etc. It lets us run with our imagination and wonder what our team can be like. Otherwise, everything would be boring. Might as well watch golf or something.

Draft Day is my favorite day of the year.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Draft Day is my favorite day of the year.


Interesting choice. My favorite day of the year is October 4.

I wait with barely contained anticipation for someone to ask me, "What day is it?" or "What's today's date?" It doesn't happen every year. But when they do, I'm ready with the answer.

"10-4, good buddy."

Wait, am I actually posting this?


----------



## johnston797

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> I'd give up the #2 and Colangelo's choice of Deng/Nocioni and a handful of future second-rounders for Bargnani and whatever salary-cap ballast needs to be thrown in.


Bulls can't do this. Way too much risk. Colangelo knows Bargnani's value better than Paxson. If Colangelo makes this deal, I bet he gets his top prospect in the draft and Deng or Noch for free. Considering they already have a better player than we have, Bulls would never recover in the long run.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TripleDouble said:


> If I'm Toronto, I'd rather have a front court of Gay, Bosh and Aldridge instead of Villanueva, Bosh and Aldridge. Gay is more of a pure three and gives Toronto the perimeter athleticism and defense they need.
> 
> Would you deal the #2 for Villanueva?



Wow, Coangelo would either be brilliant or remove KRause as most hated GM from a team........Oh wait, Isiah Thomas has already done that.....LOL


Interesting trade, but a tremendous amount of risk for Toronto.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TripleDouble said:


> If I'm Toronto, I'd rather have a front court of Gay, Bosh and Aldridge instead of Villanueva, Bosh and Aldridge. Gay is more of a pure three and gives Toronto the perimeter athleticism and defense they need.
> 
> Would you deal the #2 for Villanueva?


Yes. In a heartbeat

He was 13 and 6.5 in 29 minutes. 
Starting the last 36 games he was
Min fg% 3% ft% reb A s b p
34.9 .444 .317 .770 2.5 5.4 7.9 1.4 .7 .81 14.2

There's only 26 guys in the N.B.A that average 8 rebounds per game and 3 of them don't average over 10 points a game. 

I'd be willing to back he could get 14/8 at least.


----------



## TwinkieTowers

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



darlets said:


> Yes. In a heartbeat
> 
> He was 13 and 6.5 in 29 minutes.
> Starting the last 36 games he was
> Min fg% 3% ft% reb A s b p
> 34.9 .444 .317 .770 2.5 5.4 7.9 1.4 .7 .81 14.2
> 
> There's only 26 guys in the N.B.A that average 8 rebounds per game and 3 of them don't average over 10 points a game.
> 
> 
> I'd be willing to back he could get 14/8 at least.


Skiles would have to get the Toronto out of him, but I'm sure he'd be willing to play Chicago-style defense.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Dont you think CV is a player without a position. He is not that aggressive. And his D is nothing to write home about. I personally would not trade the 2 pick in the draft for him.

david


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> Dont you think CV is a player without a position. He is not that aggressive. And his D is nothing to write home about. I personally would not trade the 2 pick in the draft for him.
> 
> david


I wouldn't trade the #2 for him either. I wouldn't even trade Noc for him although that trade would probably balance out both rosters a bit better.


----------



## narek

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Reinsdorf was on with Mike North this morning, and North asked what the Bulls are going to do and the Chairman said John hasn't told him what he's going to do. 

Reinsdorf was at the Berto Center and mentioned Pax, Skiles and the rest of the staff was meeting next door.


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Rhyder said:


> I wouldn't trade the #2 for him either.


W're running the danger of over-valuing the pick.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



GB said:


> W're running the danger of over-valuing the pick.


I don't think I'm overvaluing the pick. I'd rather take a chance on a big man who can be THE guy which is why I like Aldridge or Bargnani slightly more than Thomas (because I see his potential limited at being a quality #2 guy).

While being a good and useful player, I see CV as a #3 option on a championship team. We have a number of #3 options (Noc, Deng, and sometimes even Ben or Kirk depending on their play) already on the team and are still searching for that #1 guy, whether it be thru internal improvement, the draft, FA, or trade.

FA - no chance at getting that guy
Internal Improvement - Possibly Ben, and a smaller possibility of Kirk
Draft - #2 pick
Trade - Known Quantity

Looking at our options, it seems the best chance of landing that guy is in the draft or trade. If all we needed was a starting quality PF with some size that can shoot and rebound a bit to push us into being contenders, then a #2 for CV trade might make sense. I just don't see that as being the case for this Bulls squad. I do realize that we would have to pay more than the #2 pick if we are making a trade for that #1 option.

We have a valuable asset for us with the #2 pick, and it's probably more valuable to us than to a lot of teams (since we're still searching for that go-to guy). Same goes for Charlotte, Portland & Atlanta, the difference being we are not bottom feeders and I don't expect us to swap with either of these teams. Utah and New Orleans are two others in a similar boat as we are, although they are without a top pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

As much as I like Charlie, I'd rather have the #2 pick also.

I think the BULLS #1 guy is coming to our team in 2007's draft though. 

PEEP THE SIG!


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

*Joe (Madison Wi): Who will the Bulls take with the #2 pick this year...*


_B.J. Armstrong: LaMarcus Aldrige. When it's all said and done, he's a big kid who can run the floor, he's athletic. He can block some shots. When you look at the Bulls this year, you saw their vulnerabilities in the paint are. I look for them to go big in the draft and then via free agency to add experience to the backcourt. I don't see them being big risk takers._


http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/chatESPN?event_id=11851


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I agree. I don't see Pax as a risk taker. However, that could change. When he took over the team, he couldn't really afford to take risks, since we were horrible anyway. So, he took the 'proven' guys in the draft, and solidified our lineup. I still think he takes Aldridge if available, or maybe Bargnani. However at 16, he better show us if he is a great draft guru.

Sidenote: Had a random dream last night that O'Bryant, Gay, and Carney were available at 16. I really want Carney, but in my dream, Pax took Big Pat. I was still happy with the choice, b/c somehow we ended up with Aldridge and O'Bryant.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



mizenkay said:


> *Joe (Madison Wi): Who will the Bulls take with the #2 pick this year...*
> 
> 
> _B.J. Armstrong: LaMarcus Aldrige. When it's all said and done, he's a big kid who can run the floor, he's athletic. He can block some shots. When you look at the Bulls this year, you saw their vulnerabilities in the paint are. I look for them to go big in the draft and then via free agency to add experience to the backcourt. I don't see them being big risk takers._
> 
> 
> http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/chatESPN?event_id=11851


isn't BJ one of the Bulls head scouts, should he be saying anything like this? I would expect a fuzzy answer.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Bargnani update... (At this point it's an act of pure optimism to post his stats as I believe that either Toronto is going to take him #1 and if they don't, it sure doesn't seem like Pax has even looked his way... But a guy can hope!)

Mins 30
Pts. 13
2-6 from 2pt
3-5 from 3pt
8 boards (3 offensive) Led the team
0-0 from the Ft line (which is quite unusual for him not to get to the line...)
1 assist.

Benneton 85
Lottomatica 77

I believe Benneton is up 1-0 in this semifinal match. Judging from the box score, it looked like a very balanced game from Benneton.

http://195.56.77.208/game/62596.html


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Hustle said:


> isn't BJ one of the Bulls head scouts, should he be saying anything like this? I would expect a fuzzy answer.


We parted ways with BJ long time ago. Two years, more or less.

Edit: Found an old article

As reported last week, B.J. Armstrong has left the organization to pursue other opportunities.

In a statement officially announcing the move, Paxson said Armstrong "will always be a Bull."

Armstrong's future plans are unclear. He hasn't returned calls seeking comment.

"I love the people who live in this city and the passion they have for their teams and that is something I will never forget for the rest of my life," Armstrong said in the statement.

"This is a first-class organization and I want to thank [club Chairman] Jerry Reinsdorf and John Paxson for the opportunity to be a part of the rebuilding process in Chicago."


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

BJ Armstrong works with ESPN now.


----------



## bullet

*nbadraft.net say Bulls give 1st round promise to Douby!??*



> Two weeks ago NBADraft.net reported that Quincy Douby likely had a first round promise from a Midwest team. According to contacts, the rumored Midwest team with a promise to Douby is the Chicago Bulls. Chicago coach Scott Skiles has the same agent as Douby and the Bulls appear intent upon adding Douby to their backcourt of Ben Gordon, Kirk Hinrich and Chris Duhon.
> After winning the second pick in the draft lottery, the Bulls are assured of nabbing one of the top bigmen in the draft. With LaMarcus Aldridge likely to go first overall, the Bulls will select between Andrea Bargnani and Tyrus Thomas, allowing them to go small with their second pick.
> 
> Douby is similar to Gordon in that he is more of a scoring small guard. Should the Bulls end up making a blockbuster deal including Gordon for Kevin Garnett, Douby would be able to give the team a similar type of player.
> 
> NBADraft.net spoke with a scout with Chicago on Wednesday who said that the Bulls have had Douby in for a workout and were impressed but denied this report saying that there has been no promise made.


http://www.nbadraft.net/draftbuzz059.asp


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I read in the NBA Draft Forum that Karl Malone, who joined the Jazz organization and began working out guys, really likes Sear Sene. Is this true? I thought Malone didnt join the Jazz yet, and I dont know if Sene worked out for teams already (other that open workouts or camps).

Anyone?


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Re: nbadraft.net say Bulls give 1st round promise to Douby!??*

I refuse to have a guy with the name Quincy Douby on this team

Just like I objected to talk way back when of acquiring Ira Newble

We're trying to be blue collar lunch pail tough guys ... having guys like Quincy and Ira on the team really take away from that in a big way 

May as well do the intros to your Chicago Bulls with some Pet Shop Boys or Bronski Beat


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: nbadraft.net say Bulls give 1st round promise to Douby!??*

Just doing a favor to Scott Skiles' agent. We wont draft him, Im sure. Just helping his stock a little bit.


----------



## truebluefan

*Re: nbadraft.net say Bulls give 1st round promise to Douby!??*

We dont need another small guard.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I read that Malone was just there as an adviser and never went onto the floor remaining in the stands the whole time. I think insider said they like O'Bryant, Williams, and Sere but said that only Sere would likely be there at the 14th pick. But i also read they really liked Redrick and that he is a much better athlete than rumored. They also said he shot the lights out.

david


----------



## darlets

*Re: nbadraft.net say Bulls give 1st round promise to Douby!??*

I've read that last night and still can't fathom that happening 24 hours later.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: nbadraft.net say Bulls give 1st round promise to Douby!??*

I watch all the NCAA prospects all year and this ***************** has to come out of no where.

Damn him, damn him to hell.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

sam smith on the draft in his weekly Q&A 




> Survey says ... Brandon Roy. The results of my unscientific survey show that Bulls fans prefer the team draft the U. of Washington guard over big men LaMarcus Aldridge and Tyrus Thomas.
> 
> *An unscientific survey, by the way, is usually where we make up the results...*
> 
> ...But this is serious since it involves me. Not that I was doing any survey, but *I'd say about two-thirds of those e-mailing since the lottery drawing preferred Roy with a sprinkling for Aldridge, Thomas, Andrea Bargnani and trading the pick.*








> *Sam, I think you've got the Bulls' second pick wrong. Brandon Roy is probably the most NBA ready of the prospects in this draft and offers the complete package. He's quick, has size, plays defense and his shooting improved markedly while at UW. If he continues to improve his outside shooting, I don't see a hole in his game. He may not help the Bulls in the post but he still fills a big need for them. Drafting him would take pressure off Hinrich, allowing him to guard guys his own size. He would receive significant playing time in a three-guard rotation of Gordon, Hinrich and Roy. Could Thomas and Aldridge be the Hakeem and Sam Bowie of 2006? And if not quite on MJ's level, how high do you see Roy's ceiling and why? --Mike, Evanston, Ill*.
> 
> _Yes, I've long argued to get Hinrich some defensive help and get him a shooting guard, though I'd prefer a veteran. If they can't get a veteran or two, I know Roy would help. But rookies take time and I see an opening to make a jump in the East now. I'm not sure on Roy; the college game is way down from where it was. I can't say I know that much as someone who really watched Pac 10 basketball. Though everything I hear is positive and I agree he's most ready. If one of those guys is Hakeem, though, grab him. Look, Bowie had a decent career even with the injuries and was mocked more because he went before Jordan. Thomas and Aldridge both appear to be players who will make significant NBA contributions, though not right away._
> 
> *Hey, Sam, what are the odds that the Bulls end up coming to their senses and realize that Aldridge and Thomas aren't going to contribute until a few years down the road and go for Roy or Gay instead? We have enough money to get a better big man via free agency rather than someone with no experience. --Neeraj Chhabra, Indiana*
> 
> _I think they may be getting there. Have you been sitting in on the scouting and personnel meetings?_


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Hey, Sam, what are the odds that the Bulls end up coming to their senses and realize that Aldridge and Thomas aren't going to contribute until a few years down the road and go for Roy or Gay instead? We have enough money to get a better big man via free agency rather than someone with no experience. --Neeraj Chhabra, Indiana


I don't know how the rest of you see these prospects, but I only think that three guys are NBA ready coming into their rookie years. I'd rank them in order of NBA readiness as:
1. Roy
2. Carney (as I have iterated, my preference would be Carney on the Bulls ahead of Roy)
3. Marcus Williams
4. Brewer

Guys who I think will struggle out of the gate, but will probably find their niche sooner than later:
1. Morrison
2. Aldridge
3. Splitter
4. Shelden Williams

Guys who I think have a lot of talent but will need a lot of development time.
1. Bargnani
2. Thomas
3. Gay (his handles aren't NBA ready IMO which will take away from a lot of his strengths initially)
4. O'Bryant
5. Foye

My top 3 draft choices would be Aldridge, Bargnani, and Thomas, so you can see I'm more for leaning towards potential with the #2 pick. If Carney really impresses in workouts and all of the big three do not, I wouldn't be entirely upset with a Carney pick at #2. However, I don't think he will raise his draft stock by that much in workouts.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Rhyder said:


> I don't know how the rest of you see these prospects, but I only think that three guys are NBA ready coming into their rookie years. I'd rank them in order of NBA readiness as:
> 1. Roy
> 2. Carney (as I have iterated, my preference would be Carney on the Bulls ahead of Roy)
> 3. Marcus Williams
> 4. Brewer
> 
> Guys who I think will struggle out of the gate, but will probably find their niche sooner than later:
> 1. Morrison
> 2. Aldridge
> 3. Splitter
> 4. Shelden Williams
> 
> Guys who I think have a lot of talent but will need a lot of development time.
> 1. Bargnani
> 2. Thomas
> 3. Gay (his handles aren't NBA ready IMO which will take away from a lot of his strengths initially)
> 4. O'Bryant
> 5. Foye
> 
> My top 3 draft choices would be Aldridge, Bargnani, and Thomas, so you can see I'm more for leaning towards potential with the #2 pick. If Carney really impresses in workouts and all of the big three do not, I wouldn't be entirely upset with a Carney pick at #2. However, I don't think he will raise his draft stock by that much in workouts.


Good analysis. I think Gay may be in the second group though, and may be closer to contributing. Right now, expectations seem pretty low, but having played at a big program, he may find his role in a system easier than people expect him to.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



laso said:


> Good analysis. I think Gay may be in the second group though, and may be closer to contributing. Right now, expectations seem pretty low, but having played at a big program, he may find his role in a system easier than people expect him to.


I think this is where there's a difference in people's opinions about him. I think Gay will follow a Richard Jefferson type in terms of minutes and numbers, where he doesn't "break out" until year 3 or 4, yet not quite reach that perennial All-Star level.

I definately dont' think his style is similar to Jefferson's in that Jefferson plays a much more hustle and IQ game whereas Gay will probably rely more on his athleticism to get his numbers.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Rhyder said:


> I don't know how the rest of you see these prospects, but I only think that three guys are NBA ready coming into their rookie years. I'd rank them in order of NBA readiness as:
> 1. Roy
> 2. Carney (as I have iterated, my preference would be Carney on the Bulls ahead of Roy)
> 3. Marcus Williams
> 4. Brewer
> 
> Guys who I think will struggle out of the gate, but will probably find their niche sooner than later:
> 1. Morrison
> 2. Aldridge
> 3. Splitter
> 4. Shelden Williams
> 
> Guys who I think have a lot of talent but will need a lot of development time.
> 1. Bargnani
> 2. Thomas
> 3. Gay (his handles aren't NBA ready IMO which will take away from a lot of his strengths initially)
> 4. O'Bryant
> 5. Foye
> 
> My top 3 draft choices would be Aldridge, Bargnani, and Thomas, so you can see I'm more for leaning towards potential with the #2 pick. If Carney really impresses in workouts and all of the big three do not, I wouldn't be entirely upset with a Carney pick at #2. However, I don't think he will raise his draft stock by that much in workouts.


I agree with most of your analysis. I do however thing that Shelden Williams will be more of a right out of the gate kind of guy. I also think he will be better than expected.


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## Aurelino

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Why would Chicago give Douby a guarantee? Does that mean Gordon is gone?


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Aurelino said:


> Why would Chicago give Douby a guarantee? Does that mean Gordon is gone?


They wouldn't. It's been speculated that the so called "guarantee" is his agent trying to get his kid noticed all around the league and maybe improve his stock.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I dont think Carney is anywhere near the 2nd pick in the draft and if you look at espn insidered he has dropped out of the top 10 propects and is now at number 16, that by the way is where the bulls 2nd pick is. I have read he looks great in drills but very passive in 2 and 2. Still he would be a great pick at 16.

david


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## Rhyder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I dont think Carney is anywhere near the 2nd pick in the draft and if you look at espn insidered he has dropped out of the top 10 propects and is now at number 16, that by the way is where the bulls 2nd pick is. I have read he looks great in drills but very passive in 2 and 2. Still he would be a great pick at 16.
> 
> david


I don't really think so either, although I do expect Carney to improve his stock in Orlando. I think teams like Orlando or Houston would be a really good fit for him and I doubt he'll drop all the way to #16, although I would be extremely pleased if he did.

Carney ran track and was very good in short sprints and the high jump, so while being a super athlete, he is also more used to structured drills than most of his counterparts.


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

chad ford chat june 1st 



*Josh (Chicago): What do you think are the odds Chicago trades their #2 pick? Who might they get for it? Thanks* 

_Chad Ford: (12:19 PM ET ) I think it's for sale. John Paxson doesn't really need more young kids. He's got plenty. What he needs are some veterans to help push the Bulls to the next level. 

I definitely think there's a chance for them to do something with their two picks and maybe a guard like Ben Gordon. 

They'll probably make a pitch for guys like Kevin Garnett and Jermaine O'Neal._


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I dont know about Chad sources, but he still has this "Bulls like Tyrus Thomas" thing going...


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> I dont know about Chad sources, but he still has this "Bulls like Tyrus Thomas" thing going...


That seems to be the way it's headed, but there are new rumours popping up all the time. I really have no idea who we are going to draft right now, or if we're trading the pick, colour me clueless...


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Yes but most of those rumors are made up by guys like Sam Smith and Peter Vesey. And IMHO that have their head stuck up you know where. Sam Smith is famous for his H.Grant and Scotty Pipen for Larry Bird trade the summer when birds career was done because of his back and played like 40 games that year. If we had made the Sam Smith Speical trade no championships.

david


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## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Writers get paid to produce articles that's make people want to buy the paper. They don't get paid to report the truth. 
No ones going to get an article printed that says "No news happened today so there's nothing to report"


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

View from a Bulls fan:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...anview,1,268248.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines



> Prior to the opening of the envelope that revealed the Bulls would have the rights to the second selection in the upcoming NBA draft, we knew one thing for certain about the team's needs: Size, whether it is in the front court or back court. GM John Paxson, who has helped put together a terrific over-achieving young core of players, suggested the team could use some athleticism and length to solidify that core. Perhaps fittingly it appears that it might be possible to get all three assets in one player in this draft.
> 
> The Bulls could use another player with enough length to help defend and block shots from players who get into the lane or try to post up on our smaller guards. Yeah, I'll take 6 feet 9 inches of talent with tremendous upside, who also happens to play with raw passion, especially in this draft. Tyrus Thomas of LSU is excitable and fits the mold of an immediate Chicago fan-favorite. Imagine having had Thomas in this year's playoff series with the Heat. I can see him coming over to swat away that Wade shot or Payton up-and-under baseline move and throwing the outlet pass to Hinrich starting the break.
> 
> 
> 
> If Thomas is available at No. 2, I take him knowing that I'll at least have an energetic player, who is ready to block shots, run the court, and give it his all every night. This is of course pending what trade possibilities there are come draft day and what the Bulls wish to do in the free agent market.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Daily Quickie: 6/2/06 



> NBA Draft: Magic reportedly want to move up from No. 11 to get a top SF (Gay?), SG (Foye? Redick?) or big man (Sheldon Williams?)


Too Early to Call, but this is one team that could pass up on Brewer and Carney. The wildcards for Carney will likely be Orlando, Houston, and NOK. For Brewer: Orlando, Utah, possibly NOK. Although I think Carney would be a better fit for NOK.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

http://www.2theadvocate.com/sports/lsu/featured/2918666.html




> DESTIN, Fla. — The closer the NBA draft gets, the more LSU men’s basketball coach John Brady is convinced that former Tigers forward Tyrus Thomas won’t have to wait long to hear his name called.
> 
> The Toronto Raptors have the No. 1 pick in the June 28 draft. Brady said he hasn’t heard from Toronto in regard to Thomas, but said he thinks the Chicago Bulls are very interested in the former LSU star.
> 
> “If he’s sitting at number two, I think Chicago will take him,’’ Brady said while attending the Southeastern Conference Spring Meeting.
> 
> The Bulls were a playoff team this season but acquired their lottery pick from the New York Knicks.
> 
> Brady is glad for that, considering that he said the Bulls are the kind of team that would be good for Thomas. The Knicks are not.
> 
> “He’s coming out of maybe the closest college basketball team in the country,’’ Brady said. “He’s known those guys since he was 6- or 7-years old.
> 
> “With the Knicks, the players don’t like the coach, the coach doesn’t like the players and the players don’t like each other. Tyrus doesn’t need that.
> 
> “I like that they (the Bulls) are a young team, (coach) and Scott Skiles challenges his guys. Tyrus’ personality fits all of that. I think he’ll be an NBA all-star in four years.’’


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I am really interested to hear the measurements and some work out reports on Thomas.

If he can measure out at 6'9" plus and show any kind of offensive game beyond 7 ft, he's gonna be hard to pass up.

However, if he's 6'8" and struggles in offensive workouts (especially since he won't be going up against anyone defensively)................Pass


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

i have no idea what his measurement are but i have seen him play and he looks 6"10" to me with a long wingspan.

david


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## Bulls4Life

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Bulls should go with Shannon Brown with the #2 pick!!!

:bsmile:


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Bulls4Life said:


> Bulls should go with Shannon Brown with the #2 pick!!!
> 
> :bsmile:



Haven't you heard?????????

We promised we'd Take and "Pass the Douby on the left hand side"....................errr, pick Douby. LOL. (Musical Youth)


I don't care if it was Michael Jordan cloned - if the clone was 6'4" or smaller I've got no interest in the Scrimp...........

"Short people got.........no reason....No reason to......" (Bill Joel???) be drafted by the Chicago Bulls!

Damn I'm feeling musical today. Also old, since most won't get either song reference.

Also, David - Thomas is listed by most draft sites as 6'9". I'm hoping he's 6'10 or more .....and can display offense from 10 feet in..............We already play 4 on 5 when Chandler's on the floor. We can't play 5 on 3. Plus, you only get to the first round of the playoffs with no offense.....EC finals with defense only.......... Give me both!


NO MORE SCRIMPS>>>>>NO MORE SCRIMPS>>>>>NO MORE SCRIMPS>>>>>NO MORE SCRIMPS>>>>>


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> NO MORE SCRIMPS>>>>>NO MORE SCRIMPS>>>>>NO MORE SCRIMPS>>>>>NO MORE SCRIMPS>>>>>


I don't care if the Bulls draft Shannon Brown at 16. But come hell or high water, Paxson cannot leave the offseason without crossing out the giant pink elephant that's been on his to-do list for three goddam years now -- get a big 2 who can play. 

Not the Polish Karate Chop, not Eddie "That's My Guy--That's My Guy Right There" Basden, not THE HAWK. A legit 6-6 to 6-8 guard who can shoot the ball, handle it a little bit, and play 15-20 harrassing disruptive minutes of defense against Dwyane Wade and/or LeBron James.

If we go into next season with Hinrich having to play small forward and/or get battered trying to guard twos, or suffering the embarrassment of watching Deng or Nocioni give it a shot, I'm gonna freakin' go crazy.


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

"Short People" was that Randy Newman classic.

i totally agree. no more midgets! no more midgets!


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> If we go into next season with Hinrich having to play small forward and/or get battered trying to guard twos, or suffering the embarrassment of watching Deng or Nocioni give it a shot, I'm gonna freakin' go crazy.


You and me both!


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I dont saw Hinrich getting embarrased by Wade. And we are still the best defensive team (Opp FG%) as you said, while arguing the "No" to Ben Wallace.


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> I don't care if the Bulls draft Shannon Brown at 16. But come hell or high water, Paxson cannot leave the offseason without crossing out the giant pink elephant that's been on his to-do list for three goddam years now -- get a big 2 who can play.
> 
> Not the Polish Karate Chop, not Eddie "That's My Guy--That's My Guy Right There" Basden, not THE HAWK. A legit 6-6 to 6-8 guard who can shoot the ball, handle it a little bit, and play 15-20 harrassing disruptive minutes of defense against Dwyane Wade and/or LeBron James.
> 
> If we go into next season with Hinrich having to play small forward and/or get battered trying to guard twos, or suffering the embarrassment of watching Deng or Nocioni give it a shot, I'm gonna freakin' go crazy.


If we happen into an early second round pick in this draft, I really think Paxson might consider a guy like Bobby Jones, although we haven't worked him out yet. He's that quintessential 6' 7" swingman defensive stopper, and I love my boy Roy, but Jones was clearly the best perimeter defender on the Huskies, and in fact I think he was probably the best perimeter defender in college basketball last year.

I couldn't agree more with the sentiment in several of the last few posts in this thread. We really need a big guard who is a defensive stopper. Enough of this. Two offseasons, two draft picks, and loads of cap room this time around provide all the opportunities any GM should need to fill such a glaring hole.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> I dont saw Hinrich getting embarrased by Wade. And we are still the best defensive team (Opp FG%) as you said, while arguing the "No" to Ben Wallace.


This isn't about Hinrich's inability to guard 2s. He's probably a better defender of 2s than any big 2 we'd draft or sign. It's about the toll it takes on him physically to guard much bigger players so often, and I think he pays a price in the form of diminished offensive capabilities.

If we're going to make the leap to championship-level, we need probably two guys who are a threat to score >20 each and every game. I think Hinrich can be that type of guy, but not if he's going full-throttle against bigger and stronger players on the defensive end each and every night.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> This isn't about Hinrich's inability to guard 2s. He's probably a better defender of 2s than any big 2 we'd draft or sign. It's about the toll it takes on him physically to guard much bigger players so often, and I think he pays a price in the form of diminished offensive capabilities.
> 
> If we're going to make the leap to championship-level, we need probably two guys who are a threat to score >20 each and every game. I think Hinrich can be that type of guy, but not if he's going full-throttle against bigger and stronger players on the defensive end each and every night.


Yeah, same as the other SGs that are in the league...


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Yeah, same as the other SGs that are in the league...


The other SG's in the league aren't giving up size and height to virtually everyone they guard. I'm with ScottMay on this one, it's not a great idea to force your point guard to defend shooting guards all the time. It's going to take a physical toll, and I'm sure it has an effect on Hinrich's offense.


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Yeah, same as the other SGs that are in the league...


We're asking this from our PG though.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> I don't care if the Bulls draft Shannon Brown at 16. But come hell or high water, Paxson cannot leave the offseason without crossing out the giant pink elephant that's been on his to-do list for three goddam years now -- get a big 2 who can play.
> 
> Not the Polish Karate Chop, not Eddie "That's My Guy--That's My Guy Right There" Basden, not THE HAWK. A legit 6-6 to 6-8 guard who can shoot the ball, handle it a little bit, and play 15-20 harrassing disruptive minutes of defense against Dwyane Wade and/or LeBron James.
> 
> If we go into next season with Hinrich having to play small forward and/or get battered trying to guard twos, or suffering the embarrassment of watching Deng or Nocioni give it a shot, I'm gonna freakin' go crazy.



I can see it now "The off-season is a Wash Thread" .....I'll be right there posting. Paxson loves Scrimps cause it makes him feel taller than he is.

Besides, it's important for Paxson and Skiles to see "eye to eye" with these guys....LOl


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Hinrich would average 18 PPG & 9 APG if he didn't have to guard 2's all game.

BOTTOM LINE


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Draft or trade, this is what I want the pick to provide for us next season or the season afterward:



> "When we were down seven, I just saw the whole season swimming away," Nowitzki said, repeating a sentiment he trotted out for the first time when the Spurs erased a 20-point deficit in Game 7.
> 
> That time, Nowitzki forced overtime in the closing seconds with an unforgettable drive . . . and a foul by Manu Ginobili. This time, Nowitzki capitalized on some help from the Suns -- Marion's foul trouble and technical fouls assessed to Raja Bell and coach Mike D'Antoni -- with a run of 15 points in a row, eight of them at the line.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'm sorry, but guarding twos isn't whats diminishing Hinrich's offensive ability, his offensive game is holding him back on the offensive game. Hinrich rarely guards anyone full court, Gordon/Duhon do that, and its not like the two guards back Hinrich down beating him up, the only advantage they usually use is their height, and when you play, at least imo, is that giving up 3 inches isn't that bad, and Hinrich wasn't Hinrich stronger than Carmelo, James, and Wade, now I know James would just outpower Hinrich now, but its not like he would get backdowned easily. And that 3 inches isn't that much of a disadvantage, you can still easily contest a shot of a guy that heights, its not like getting a 6'8" guy on a 7'0" guy, where that advantage will be huge, why? Since the big men play closer to the basket. If Hinrich can't get his arms over the guys eye length to mess up the guys vision any, then I'm sorry, but he shouldn't be playing basketball then....but of course he can, and thats why Hinrich isn't at any real disadvantage, and people are just looking for an excuse for some of his offensive struggles. Heck, the way he guarded the shooting guards should be proof enough he's not at a disadvantage, he is better than most shooting guards in the league on defense.


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/40771/20060602/uconns_gay_impresses_bobcats_at_workout/

Rudy Gay: 6' 8.5" with shoes on, 7' 2" wing span. Wow, can you say physical specimin?

Brandon Roy was too sick to work out against him. Oops.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/40771/20060602/uconns_gay_impresses_bobcats_at_workout/
> 
> Rudy Gay: 6' 8.5" with shoes on, 7' 2" wing span. Wow, can you say physical specimin?
> 
> Brandon Roy was too sick to work out against him. Oops.


Interesting.

Gay didn't have a great tournament, but he was the only UConn guy to have success guarding Roy. Roy didn't look too comfortable with Rudy draped all over him for parts of that game...


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> I'm sorry, but guarding twos isn't whats diminishing Hinrich's offensive ability, his offensive game is holding him back on the offensive game. Hinrich rarely guards anyone full court, Gordon/Duhon do that, and its not like the two guards back Hinrich down beating him up, the only advantage they usually use is their height, and when you play, at least imo, is that giving up 3 inches isn't that bad, and Hinrich wasn't Hinrich stronger than Carmelo, James, and Wade, now I know James would just outpower Hinrich now, but its not like he would get backdowned easily. And that 3 inches isn't that much of a disadvantage, you can still easily contest a shot of a guy that heights, its not like getting a 6'8" guy on a 7'0" guy, where that advantage will be huge, why? Since the big men play closer to the basket. If Hinrich can't get his arms over the guys eye length to mess up the guys vision any, then I'm sorry, but he shouldn't be playing basketball then....but of course he can, and thats why Hinrich isn't at any real disadvantage, and people are just looking for an excuse for some of his offensive struggles. Heck, the way he guarded the shooting guards should be proof enough he's not at a disadvantage, he is better than most shooting guards in the league on defense.


gotta disagree sloth,

When you are guarding the 2 you are in near constant motion on offense, whereas at PG you have small breaks when the PG bringing the ball up the court and waiting for the offense to set up. Guarding the PG there is a lot less physical contact, slightly less picks, alot more post up and fighting for positioning, more rebounding responsibilties. The more tired you are the worse you play on offense. And Hinrich is 6'3 which is a disadvantage, although I agree he is still better than most 2's. I hust don't think a PG the caliber of Hinrich is best suited having to play against bigger guys all the time, he is resposible for running the offense. He's still going to have to do a lot of it next year, But my man Ronnie Brewer will take some of the load off when Pax trade Du and 16 to Houston on draft day:smilewink


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Ideally, the Bulls would like to land Brewer because they need a tall guard for their backcourt. They plan to pursue a guard with their second selection, the 16th pick overall. Brewer, listed at 6-7, is expected to be selected earlier in the draft, somewhere between Nos. 11 and 15. If the Bulls trade down with their No. 2 pick, though, Brewer might be a possibility.
> 
> Brewer said he played every position except center for Arkansas. His father, Ron, who finished an eight-year NBA career in the mid-1980s, believes Ronnie eventually will become a full-time point guard.Brewer is an above-average defender who needs to improve his awkward outside shot. Since then, he has shot with his elbow out, almost perpendicular to his body. "It's unorthodox and people sort of cringe when they see it, but if it goes in, you can't really say too much about it," he said. Brewer and Brown were the most intriguing prospects at the Berto Center- Chicago Tribune


His only ? was his shot, and his shooting percentages are not bad at all 44 and 34%. He was absolutley the man at Arkansas, so the 44 isn't as shabby as it looks.


> *One drill Brewer did for the Rockets involved 25 three-point shots. Ron Brewer Sr. said his son made 19*. “As long as he’s finishing, they’re not concerned,” Brewer Sr. said. A little nervous energy followed Ronnie Brewer to Houston because it was his first NBA workout, his father said. It included an interview with team officials, part of which had Brewer give a sort of scouting report on the Rockets organization and where he thought he might fit. “He did the drills well, shot the ball well,” Brewer Sr. said. “The basketball part, I think there’s no doubt [the Rockets ] are excited about what he brings to the table, but you want to be able to see it firsthand. The basketball part was convincing. The questionand-answer thing, the feedback I got from Ronnie was he was very positive about that.” NWANews.com





> Orlando at No. 11 and Utah at No. 14 are potential destinations for *Brewer, but his father, former NBA player and Arkansas standout Ron Brewer, believes the Bulls will make a serious attempt to acquire his son. "I've been friends with John [Paxson] for a long time,'' said the senior Brewer, who was at the Berto Center but not allowed to watch the workout. "John's followed Ronnie and watched him a lot.''* Chicago Sun-Times


----------



## remlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Hustle said:


> His only ? was his shot, and his shooting percentages are not bad at all 44 and 34%. He was absolutley the man at Arkansas, so the 44 isn't as shabby as it looks.


If Pax really wants Brewer what do you think it will take to move up? How much could Sweetney or Duhon + 16 move them up to? 

I am not really blown away by the 19 for 25 (still nice that he can hit that). I recall when Deng worked out at Hoops he hit about the same number of 3's and people were all wild about his 3 point range. 

I wonder what Skiles reaction to Brewer's shot mechanics if he has a game of 3-11? Mechanics are important in basketball, but as long as the shooter keeps the same form each shot then it isnt as bad. The negative is Tyson who seems to change his shot everytime he shoots it.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



remlover said:


> If Pax really wants Brewer what do you think it will take to move up? How much could Sweetney or Duhon + 16 move them up to?
> 
> I am not really blown away by the 19 for 25 (still nice that he can hit that). I recall when Deng worked out at Hoops he hit about the same number of 3's and people were all wild about his 3 point range.
> 
> I wonder what Skiles reaction to Brewer's shot mechanics if he has a game of 3-11? Mechanics are important in basketball, but as long as the shooter keeps the same form each shot then it isnt as bad. The negative is Tyson who seems to change his shot everytime he shoots it.


I think Du and 16 will easily get the job done especially if Houston (about as early as he can go) doesn't draft him, and maybe even then. Duhon has done a great job here and it's not at all the best situation for him, that coupled with the parody of talent in the draft should net us Brewer. I think either Boston or Houston would go for it.

As for the 19-25, I've done it many of times and I'm not a great shooter, 25 shots really doesn't mean a whole lot. But we don't need a shooter, so if he's only average or even slightly below average shhoter that is OK. The rest of his game is damn near flawless. The kid works his *** off, not only reportly but just look at his body, he is NBA ready then some. I don't think Skiles would worry about a 3-11 night with Brewer the way he would with Ben, who primary purpose is to shoot.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

As DMD pointed out a few days ago, dealing Duhon pre-draft is a near impossibility...


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I just dont see why Houston would want Duhan and to get him them would trade down six spots. they have Luther and he is a very solid PG. That team needs a SG and a PF really bad and they will only be albe to address one of those needs in the draft. I really like Duhan's game but he is a career backup PG and i mean teams dont trade down for backups.

If we want to move up to get brewer it will take something that houston needs like another draft pick in the late 20's. However, i also dont think Brewer is heading for Houston and think he is more likely to go to NO or the Jazz. I still think Sere, Simmons, Rondo, and Armstrong go in the top 15 so some of the SG's will drop. I just dont thing Brewer is going to be one of them. IMHO Carney is the one that drops but we shall see. I hate to say this but i would rather have Brewer than Carney.

david


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> I don't care if the Bulls draft Shannon Brown at 16. But come hell or high water, Paxson cannot leave the offseason without crossing out the giant pink elephant that's been on his to-do list for three goddam years now -- get a big 2 who can play.
> 
> Not the Polish Karate Chop, not Eddie "That's My Guy--That's My Guy Right There" Basden, not THE HAWK. A legit 6-6 to 6-8 guard who can shoot the ball, handle it a little bit, and play 15-20 harrassing disruptive minutes of defense against Dwyane Wade and/or LeBron James.
> 
> If we go into next season with Hinrich having to play small forward and/or get battered trying to guard twos, or suffering the embarrassment of watching Deng or Nocioni give it a shot, I'm gonna freakin' go crazy.


There are very few guys with the bulk to defend Lebron and the quickness to defend Wade. It think Deng and Nocioni are a pretty good 1-2 punch against Lebron. I'm worried more about the guys who are too quick for them and too big for Kirk.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/40771/20060602/uconns_gay_impresses_bobcats_at_workout/
> 
> Rudy Gay: 6' 8.5" with shoes on, 7' 2" wing span. Wow, can you say physical specimin?
> 
> Brandon Roy was too sick to work out against him. Oops.


I Pax sees enough in Gay to draft him at 2, I have no problem.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I love this time of year.....

Workouts start and guys start to improve their stock (some amazingly skyrocket).


I really think there is gonna be a quality pick for us at 16 and a trade isn't needed.

Guys who would be good value (IMHO) if they are around at 16 (and it's a real possibility):

Cedric Simmons, Ronnie Brewer, Rudy Fernandez, Saer Sene, Thabo Sefalosha, Maurice Ager or trade the pick for next year #1 and maybe a #2 this year and next year.


----------



## Charlotte_______

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Is it true? Bulls guarantee Tyrus will be taken 2nd?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Charlotte_______ said:


> Is it true? Bulls guarantee Tyrus will be taken 2nd?


Probably not guaranteed, it's just speculation at this point, but it does seem more and more likely.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



jbulls said:


> As DMD pointed out a few days ago, dealing Duhon pre-draft is a near impossibility...


I guess any deal not done on draft day is worthless.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I just dont see why Houston would want Duhan and to get him them would trade down six spots. they have Luther and he is a very solid PG. That team needs a SG and a PF really bad and they will only be albe to address one of those needs in the draft. I really like Duhan's game but he is a career backup PG and i mean teams dont trade down for backups.
> 
> If we want to move up to get brewer it will take something that houston needs like another draft pick in the late 20's. However, i also dont think Brewer is heading for Houston and think he is more likely to go to NO or the Jazz. I still think Sere, Simmons, Rondo, and Armstrong go in the top 15 so some of the SG's will drop. I just dont thing Brewer is going to be one of them. IMHO Carney is the one that drops but we shall see. I hate to say this but i would rather have Brewer than Carney.
> 
> david


As a Luther Head fan, it's very easy to say he's not half the PG Duhon is, he is a nice combo guard to come of the bench, but he cannot control the game like Du at all. Really all we have is Du to trade, and Sweets but I don't think abyone will want him. Brewer could end up being the best guard in this draft, Carney I doubt it.


----------



## 3 Pointer

*Potential Draftees*

Why are people forgetting about these guys:

Kevin Pittsnogle- Austin Cro
Patrick OBryant- A name and a body like a very good big man


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Potential Draftees*

we have a stickied draft thread at the top of the page, so i will be merging this there.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Sene keeps creeping up everyones draft boards. Here is what Jonathan has heard, just scroll lower. He will be working out for the Bulls soon. 

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1324


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'm happy Pax is giving this kid a workout. Who knows, he could be taken way before 16. I can't say if that would be a risky pick or not, but it could be another Arujo/Telfair type of deal. A kid taken 10 spots earlier than he should have.

But, from all reports, he has been a great kid. Hard worker and Quick learner is all I'm reading. Sounds like a good kid. How old is he? Hopefully they don't inflate his age a la Mutombo.

Pax will have a tough choice at 16 if his guys (ie Brewer) are already taken. I'm not for taking Brown who is a 6-2 guard. I rather take a riskier pick at 16 then a short guard.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The funny thing is we have 20 players solidifying themselves as lotto picks.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I agree i does appear that i have read quotes from at least 20 players who say they have been told that they will be drafted in the lotto. But there are only 14 picks so some one is going to fall to us at 16. i assume i wouldnt be Brewer but i can hope.

david


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

How far does Thomas want to fall. I could see teams taking O'Bryant, Aldridge, Bargnani, and Williams ahead of Thomas. If Saer catches on quick enough, he could pass up Thomas too if he refuses to workout with everyone.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think it's funny when people end up with big enoug ego's before they are even in the NBA and refuse to work out with teams. Hell, even Reggie Bush didn't go 1, and he was one of the most hyped players entering the NFL Draft. Tyrus, there are no guarantees unless you are Lebron James, Shaq, Duncan, etc.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Ya'll must of forgot that Brandon Roy said he wouldn't work out for anybody NOT drafting in the top 5...

Stop acting like players don't do this EVERY year...

LOL @ Sene passing up Thomas..


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Bargnani update...

Not the greatest of games today...

26 mins
5 pts
0-3 2pt
1-3 3pt
2-2 FT
5 boards (2 offensive)
1 steal 
3 blocks

His team lost 67-70. I believe they are tied 1 game apiece.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'm surprised that the Bulls are bringing in Sene for a workout; hopefully he impresses. If he's there @ 16, I think the Bulls might take him if Brewer's off the board. If Brewer's there, the Bulls will take him.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Anyone read the Gay (Rudy) interview on draftexpress? One thing that stuck out to me is when asked about working out against other draftees, he says........



> "I have no problem with it, because obviously if people don't want to go up against anybody they obviously have things they need to work .........I have no weaknesses in my game, I'm ready for anybody."


He's also stated before he would like to go head to head with Morrison, Roy and Tyrus.

He's the same size as Tyrus with more skill, I just don't know where to stand on this guy. If he had the same demeanor as Tyrus he would be a #1 lock.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> I have no weaknesses in my game


Sure buddy...


> If he had the same demeanor as Tyrus he would be a #1 lock.


If he wasn't trying to become the next David Copperfield that would be true.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



dsouljah9 said:


> I'm surprised that the Bulls are bringing in Sene for a workout; hopefully he impresses. If he's there @ 16, I think the Bulls might take him if Brewer's off the board. If Brewer's there, the Bulls will take him.



Maybe guys like you, Flash and myself are having an effect?

I hear the Utah workout he had was a total homerun. Thats not really an inside scoop since its being reported in several places. They say Karl Malone loved him and that his work ethic blew away Sloane. If I were doing a mock today Id see what 2 guards were out there at Utahs pick and weight it against Sene, but I think they might be leaning towards Sene, especially if they deal Boozer (I hear GS is interested)


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

It's a little disconcerting that a 20 year old concludes that he does not need to improve his game at all.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> especially if they deal Boozer (I hear GS is interested)


Looks like Golden State might have found a suitor for Troy Murphy.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

He did not say he did not need to improve his game what he said is i dont think i have any weakness in his game. I think that is different. i also think the Jazz are thinking very strongly about taking Sene. The Jazz need a big center bad and then my guess is they will trade one of there big men for a SG since they have 3 PF and no centers. If Sene is really moving into the top 15 picks along with Rando, Simmons, and Shanwe Williams then some SG is going to have to fall to us at 15. I can name at least 18 players that are in the top 15 so someone must be pushes down.

david


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> He did not say he did not need to improve his game what he said is i dont think i have any weakness in his game. I think that is different.
> 
> david


If he has no weakness, then what would he need to improve? Or maybe he meant that he has no weakness when compared with career bench players? Surely he has weaknesses when compared with the expectations of the kind of player a top selection should become.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TripleDouble said:


> If he has no weakness, then what would he need to improve? Or maybe he meant that he has no weakness when compared with career bench players? Surely he has weaknesses when compared with the expectations of the kind of player a top selection should become.


No, I think you have it all wrong. I think what Gay meant, was heres my game, you can see what I can do, I'm not ashamed of it, I'm not trying to hide anything from you guys, come watch me, I'm better than Tyrus Thomas, I'm better than Morrison, I'm better than Roy, watch me destroy them in a workout....

I like Gay's demeanor, right now, it seems like to me that Gay thinks he can show a team that he is a better powerforward/center than Thomas is too, which might not be a stretch. He is thinking, watch this, watch me destroy Ty Thomas, I'm bigger than him, and I'm gonna dominate him, I'm gonna make myself into the #2 pick.....and Gay shuold get his wish if Thomas doesn't drop out of the Bulls workout.


----------



## ChiSox

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I haven't watched many LSU games. Can someone tell me more about Tyrus Thomas? Is he more of a AK47 or Stromile Swift type of player? Will he be star or a bust? What do you think?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I agree with you Sloth. There is no question Gay is the most talented player in the draft. If most scouts had to pick one guy to be an all-star in this draft, it would be Gay. He's the prototypical SF. Unfortunately we already have two great ones. If we go by the route of picking BPA, it should be Gay. 

Oh, the great debate: Need vs BPA


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Having a guy like Sene in for a workout is great for setting up smoke screens and sending some signals. I hope after we workout him out that we hear how great he was, and that he is our guy at #16.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Having a guy like Sene in for a workout is great for setting up smoke screens and sending some signals. I hope after we workout him out that we hear how great he was, and that he is our guy at #16.



Can I ask, why do you dislike him so much?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Can I ask, why do you dislike him so much?


I dont dislike him, Id rather draft other players #16. You cant dislike a guy with that height, lenght, wingspan, attitude and work ethic. 

But since reporters are saying he can go lottery, well, its a good opportunity to try to help his stock/position.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> There is no question Gay is the most talented player in the draft


There are more talented players than Gay, the main factor is that they're closer to their "ceiling" than he is. Gay right now really isn't that talented or special, it's his potential that makes him so appealing, it's almost limitless. He has the tools to become great, just will he?
Atleast with his latest comments he's slowly eliminating one of the knocks against him, his attitude. If he can carry this chip on his shoulder throughout his career, he's going to be mightily impressive.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



step said:


> There are more talented players than Gay, the main factor is that they're closer to their "ceiling" than he is. Gay right now really isn't that talented or special, it's his potential that makes him so appealing, it's almost limitless. He has the tools to become great, just will he?
> Atleast with his latest comments he's slowly eliminating one of the knocks against him, his attitude. If he can carry this chip on his shoulder throughout his career, he's going to be mightily impressive.


Can you name those players more talented than Gay?


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Can you name those players more talented than Gay?


Simply, Roy.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



step said:


> Simply, Roy.


So not only is Roy the most NBA ready player in the Draft, he is as well the most talented. I wonder why he isnt going #1 or #2.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think thw whole potential thing is a joke. Potentail is how hard a player works and how committed he is to getting better. As for Gay, seriously he is going to be an all star some day and have a long career in the nba. This is like saying MJ would not be a good pro because is gave up personal stats to help the team. Gay played for UConn and it was a deep veteran team and Gay did the right thing by staying and playing in the framework of the TEAM. I think he will be a much better pro than college player and if pax thinks he can play SG i would love him on the bulls.

david


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> So not only is Roy the most NBA ready player in the Draft, he is as well the most talented. I wonder why he isnt going #1 or #2.


You could of participated in this discussion, instead you chose to patronize me. So now i'm not going to even bother.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



step said:


> You could of participated in this discussion, instead you chose to patronize me. So now i'm not going to even bother.


Im participating of the discussion. I just want you to tell me how a guy that is considered the most NBA ready AND the most talented doesnt go #1. Just having a hard time understanding that. But if you prefer not to answer, thats fine. I dont have any more questions.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> I just want you to tell me how a guy that is considered the most NBA ready AND the most talented doesnt go #1. Just having a hard time understanding that


You've assumed too much.


> But if you prefer not to answer, thats fine.


Refer to my last post.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



step said:


> You've assumed too much.
> 
> Refer to my last post.


Thank you for making me "assume too much". 

Back to the topic (and making sense), rlucas, when is another round of draft rumours due? Waiting for that!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I diagree with Roy being more talented than Gay, that's simply not the case.

Is he more NBA ready? yep but a better TALENT? not even close

I've seen Gay to Carter/Bryant type moves with EASE in his two years playing in college. He has THAT type of talent. No, he hasn't put it all together but if and when he does, Roy wouldn't even be in his league.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> I diagree with Roy being more talented than Gay, that's simply not the case.
> 
> Is he more NBA ready? yep but a better TALENT? not even close
> 
> I've seen Gay to Carter/Bryant type moves with EASE in his two years playing in college. He has THAT type of talent. No, he hasn't put it all together but if and when he does, Roy wouldn't even be in his league.


I agree with a lot of what you say here, but why does, for instance, ball handling never seem to weigh anywhere near as much as athleticism when it comes to evaluating talent, especially when we're talking about any position besides point guard. Roy is a wizard with the basketball in his hand and is highly effective at getting wherever he wants to get on the court. Of course Gay can jump way over the top to finish, but is he ever going to be able to take the one or two dribbles to get to his spot, or will he always need a skillful pass? Roy has the skill to take care of business for himself.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Thank you for making me "assume too much".
> 
> Back to the topic (and making sense)


The "discussion" went from me comparing 2 players to you comparing the whole draft. Can you spot the assumption?
Hopefully this makes enough sense for you now.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



step said:


> The "discussion" went from me comparing 2 players to you comparing the whole draft. Can you spot the assumption?
> Hopefully this makes enough sense for you now.


Read the whole thing, first. And when and why it started. The "comparison" went beyond two players.

Just PM me if you have any issue...


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think there may be semantic confusion here. Roy is definately more skilled than Gay; Gay is more talented than Roy.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TripleDouble said:


> I think there may be semantic confusion here. Roy is definately more skilled than Gay; Gay is more talented than Roy.


That about sums it up.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TripleDouble said:


> I think there may be semantic confusion here. Roy is definately more skilled than Gay; Gay is more talented than Roy.


pretty much


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Thank you for making me "assume too much".
> 
> Back to the topic (and making sense), rlucas, when is another round of draft rumours due? Waiting for that!


The rumors I hear are the ones being sort of reported in the press

Utah loves Sene and are seriously considering him.

Add Seattle and the Clippers to teams who have an interest in Jay Williams, who still holds out hope Chicago will give him one more chance (fat chance)

Tyrus Thomas, no ROY this is not aimed at anyone so I dont want to get slammed, is pissing alot of people off and if he doesnt get picked by Chicago, could fall

The Lakers like Marquinhos and Roy, look for one of them to go there. 

San Antonio is confident that Scola and Mahinmi are coming over. They are psyched about Mahinmi because in a perimeter focused conference, you need to have big guys who can block shots from the weakside and this guy is a ****ing Freak

Big Bulls workout on June 19

Rajon Rando, Randy Foye and Marcus Williams is a toss up. But one of these 3 could fall a long ways in this draft.

Nick Fazekas will probably go back to school.

Keep an eye on the Treviso camp. Also former prodigy Nemanja Aleksandrov hopes to make a big impression there.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The rumors I hear are the ones being sort of reported in the press
> 
> Utah loves Sene and are seriously considering him.
> 
> Add Seattle and the Clippers to teams who have an interest in Jay Williams, who still holds out hope Chicago will give him one more chance (fat chance)
> 
> Tyrus Thomas, no ROY this is not aimed at anyone so I dont want to get slammed, is pissing alot of people off and if he doesnt get picked by Chicago, could fall
> 
> The Lakers like Marquinhos and Roy, look for one of them to go there.
> 
> San Antonio is confident that Scola and Mahinmi are coming over. They are psyched about Mahinmi because in a perimeter focused conference, you need to have big guys who can block shots from the weakside and this guy is a ****ing Freak
> 
> Big Bulls workout on June 19
> 
> Rajon Rando, Randy Foye and Marcus Williams is a toss up. But one of these 3 could fall a long ways in this draft.
> 
> Nick Fazekas will probably go back to school.
> 
> Keep an eye on the Treviso camp. Also former prodigy Nemanja Aleksandrov hopes to make a big impression there.



Thanks. What is Aleksandrov status as far as his NBA elegibility goes?


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Thanks Rlucas........


Your updates and insights are appreicated.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

rlucas, do you hear any rumors on potential trades the Bulls can make? I know most trades occur within 36 hours of the draft. But think Paxson will get rid of any picks, or add any (late 1st rounders/2nd round picks)?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Oh let me add one that I forgot. GS and Utah have had exploratory talks regarding a Boozer for Murphy swap. I dont know how it works on trade checker but those 2 would be the principles. 

Animal, the only insight I have into the Bulls was a former poster here named Kismet. But Kismet and I havent spoken in 7-8 months. I hear the occasional thing, like they would prefer Aldridge all things being equal at this second, but for the most part dont have an insight into what they are thinking or doing. But the one thing is that Paxson doesnt seem to be the most secretive guy. In fact, I think he is way to wide open in regards to his plans with the press. But the contacts I have dont have much info on the Bulls. The Bulls dont scout Europe and my most of my contacts are scouts (all scouts or directors of international scouting, one GM (same team as director of international scouting and two asst GMs) over there, so that might be the reason.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> The Bulls dont scout Europe...


That sucks; we gotta step our international game up. I'm not saying that we have to draft a international player, but for God's sake at least scout 'em 



> Utah loves Sene and are seriously considering him.


Crap!!  If Utah drafts him, you wouldn't get a shot off with him and Kirilenko on the floor.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> GS and Utah have had exploratory talks regarding a Boozer for Murphy swap. I dont know how it works on trade checker but those 2 would be the principles.


With Utah being under the cap I don't see it being a problem. The interesting part for me is if Utah would want more, other than getting rid of Boozer their biggest need is a capable 2 guard.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



dsouljah9 said:


> That sucks; we gotta step our international game up. I'm not saying that we have to draft a international player, but for God's sake at least scout 'em
> 
> 
> 
> Crap!!  If Utah drafts him, you wouldn't get a shot off with him and Kirilenko on the floor.


The Bulls should have a full time presence there, South America, Africa and Asia. You cant have them all, but atleast know the players. They got Nocioni, which was good. But lets face the facts on the Noc signing: First off, he wasnt exactly a secret. He was a damn good player long before Pax and company even knew who he was. Second, he wasnt even the guy they wanted initialy. They wanted Arvydas Macijauskas (who I think will find a spot in the NBA). Maci didnt want to come over and the Bulls kind of lucked into Noc. You would think they learned their lesson that Europe could be a good place, but instead they act like the Knicks and ignore it for the most part. I am sure Pax takes the occasional trip there, but with teams having multiple fulltime scouts there, that puts the club at a disadvantage. Take Sene for example. He could have an outstanding workout (and I agree with Chapu, he could be a "workout warrior") but what do we really know about his game? A good team would see him in Belgium, see him play for Senegal, scout the practices of both teams, get comments from his opponents etc. When I scouted, and I am not saying I was a good scout, I was lucky in that my college roommate played in France and I had first hand knowledge of Pietrus brothers, Diaw, Mahinmi, Gelabale (he plays in Spain but practiced for the French team) etc. You need to have these kind of contacts. I mean, San Antonio picked two guys who were so far under the radar screen that the draft day coverage didnt even know who they were (Parker and Mahinmi). Utah did this with Kirilenko. No one knew Dirk from a hole in the wall. Guys like Noc were high profile. Thats an easy scout. He was atleast a good NBA player. But what I want to see is a guy who might not be a household name be picked up by the Bulls. A guy who doesnt have a great international tournament that is on ESPN (like Macijauskas). Krause always looked for those hidden gems. Sometimes they worked (Pippen, Kukoc) and sometimes they didnt (Bagaric and Kornel David) but atleast he was there looking. Say what we want about Krause, but he really does outwork Paxson.


----------



## unBULLievable

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The Bulls should have a full time presence there, South America, Africa and Asia. You cant have them all, but atleast know the players. They got Nocioni, which was good. But lets face the facts on the Noc signing: First off, he wasnt exactly a secret. He was a damn good player long before Pax and company even knew who he was. Second, he wasnt even the guy they wanted initialy. They wanted Arvydas Macijauskas (who I think will find a spot in the NBA). Maci didnt want to come over and the Bulls kind of lucked into Noc. You would think they learned their lesson that Europe could be a good place, but instead they act like the Knicks and ignore it for the most part. I am sure Pax takes the occasional trip there, but with teams having multiple fulltime scouts there, that puts the club at a disadvantage. Take Sene for example. He could have an outstanding workout (and I agree with Chapu, he could be a "workout warrior") but what do we really know about his game? A good team would see him in Belgium, see him play for Senegal, scout the practices of both teams, get comments from his opponents etc. When I scouted, and I am not saying I was a good scout, I was lucky in that my college roommate played in France and I had first hand knowledge of Pietrus brothers, Diaw, Mahinmi, Gelabale (he plays in Spain but practiced for the French team) etc. You need to have these kind of contacts. I mean, San Antonio picked two guys who were so far under the radar screen that the draft day coverage didnt even know who they were (Parker and Mahinmi). Utah did this with Kirilenko. No one knew Dirk from a hole in the wall. Guys like Noc were high profile. Thats an easy scout. He was atleast a good NBA player. But what I want to see is a guy who might not be a household name be picked up by the Bulls. A guy who doesnt have a great international tournament that is on ESPN (like Macijauskas). Krause always looked for those hidden gems. Sometimes they worked (Pippen, Kukoc) and sometimes they didnt (Bagaric and Kornel David) but atleast he was there looking. Say what we want about Krause, but he really does outwork Paxson.


Gangstalicious


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

A Boozer for Murphy trade would be good for GSW. The Warriors get an established low post guy (given he is healthy). I think Utah will try to get another player out of this deal, or possibly GSW's pick. This is my own speculation. The thing is, if GSW gets Boozer, do they still go for POB, as most mock drafts indicate?


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> A Boozer for Murphy trade would be good for GSW. The Warriors get an established low post guy (given he is healthy). I think Utah will try to get another player out of this deal, or possibly GSW's pick. This is my own speculation. The thing is, if GSW gets Boozer, do they still go for POB, as most mock drafts indicate?



A front line of Murphy, Kirilenko and one of my absolute favorite players Mehmut Okur, could really succeed in this smaller out on the floor NBA. Bring in a guy like Sene for athleticism and you might have something


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## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Say what we want about Krause, but he really does outwork Paxson.



Say what you will about Pax, he has proven much better at rebuilding...


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



laso said:


> Say what you will about Pax, he has proven much better at rebuilding...


 6 titles speaks for itself


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

So, Rlucas... Got anything on Nemanja? I know he' supposed to be playing at Treviso, but I couldn't find anything regarding him playing a single minute this year. I know he blew out a knee over a year ago and he's completely fallen off the map since then. I'd be all for Pax getting a second rounder this year and simply taking a flyer on this kid (if only to obtain his rights). I'm pretty sure that even with a pretty stellar showing in Treviso he'll not get a first round guarantee. Too many questions about his dedication and that knee. Would he stay in the draft if he's not going to be a first rounder? It may even be to his advantage to stay, go undrafted and become a free agent. That way, at least he can pick a situation that might be of an advantage to him (ie the possibility of getting some PT). Give a team that holds a mid-second rounder this year our NY 2007 (or 2009 - their choice) second round pick and draft the kid. Stick him in the D-Leauge and see how he does. extremely low risk, possibly very high reward type pick.


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Haven't heard much talk about Marco Belinelli lately. He seems to fit the bill in terms of what we need - big guard with a good handle. Any speculation about where/if he's going to go in the draft?


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

We need to sign Jay Williams, and get rid of Duhon, Jay is going to be better, no doubt. He said he was modeling his game after Steve Nash since getting injured (steve nash sent him a note saying that if anyone could get better, it was him). Jay said he is working on stuff like right handed layup off the right leg, left off left, floaters, etc. Tell him Duhon had 29 minutes a game last year, and this role is yours if you want, and if you outplay the others, you can start. Guy is going to blow up, and when we have right of first refusal, its gonna hurt more.

If Paxson and Skiles sit him down, and tell him, Duhon's spot


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> We need to sign Jay Williams, and get rid of Duhon, Jay is going to be better, no doubt. He said he was modeling his game after Steve Nash since getting injured (steve nash sent him a note saying that if anyone could get better, it was him). Jay said he is working on stuff like right handed layup off the right leg, left off left, floaters, etc. Tell him Duhon had 29 minutes a game last year, and this role is yours if you want, and if you outplay the others, you can start. Guy is going to blow up, and when we have right of first refusal, its gonna hurt more.
> 
> If Paxson and Skiles sit him down, and tell him, Duhon's spot



Is Jay a Pax/Skiles type? I 100% agree with you. The guy wants to be a Bull, to make it up to the Bulls. Why have they prematurely shut the door down on him? Makes no sense. I really think Pax and Skiles just want to be rid of the Krause era. Period. And frankly they have been right so far, but this is not one of them.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Too bad we still got Tyson.


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Is Jay a Pax/Skiles type? I 100% agree with you. The guy wants to be a Bull, to make it up to the Bulls. Why have they prematurely shut the door down on him? Makes no sense. I really think Pax and Skiles just want to be rid of the Krause era. Period. And frankly they have been right so far, but this is not one of them.


Isn't there a chance that they don't think he can play?


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TripleDouble said:


> Isn't there a chance that they don't think he can play?


He can definitely play.


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## narek

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TripleDouble said:


> Isn't there a chance that they don't think he can play?


It was reported last fall that Williams did work out for Paxson and Gar Forman and like everyone Jay's tried out for up to this point, didn't think Jay was ready for the NBA.


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## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> 6 titles speaks for itself


For some reason though, Krause got progressively worse as a GM after MJ left. I personally believed in him for a long time. But then came the failure to bring significant FAs. And then I think he must have panicked cause he started doing really bonehead moves. E-Rob. Brand for Tyson. Bringing in Jalen Rose...

Pax has put us back in the right track.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



narek said:


> It was reported last fall that Williams did work out for Paxson and Gar Forman and like everyone Jay's tried out for up to this point, didn't think Jay was ready for the NBA.


Yeah, but this year is different. Apparently he is better than Marcus Williams (the top ranked point guard in the draft). Jay probaly has one of the top work ethics in the NBA, and since his injury he has watched Steve Nash to see what made Nash successful. Also, he apparently has put on some great strength, Marcus Williams said that Jay pushes him around in practice, using his strength to his advantage. Also, Jay's jumpshot should be world's better from what we saw in 02-03. 

Isn't getting another top 5 pick caliber talent who has intangibles, and is a veteran worth it for a cheap price? I think so, I hope Paxson sees this.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Lot of posts that belong to the Free Agent thread. 

IMO I would like the Bulls to "consider" Jay Williams. I get the feeling that Pax might work him out and came away impressed and still say no.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Has anyone seen a report on the Boston workout with Patrick O'Bryant, Shelden Williams, Saer Sene and Torin Francis? I'd love to hear how Sene looked against these guys, as this must be some of the toughest competition he has ever faced. 

Here's a picture of Sene and O'Bryant from the workout, but I haven't seen any reports.










From the Boston Herald: 



> Spreading his wings
> 
> And the Celtics thought that N.C. State’s Cedric Simmons had a colossal wing span - the 6-9 forward’s reach measuring 7-4.
> 
> Sene, who played professionally in Belgium last year, confirmed yesterday that he has a 7-8 wing span - a characteristic that has captivated scouts and general managers ever since he blocked nine shots in a European all-star game earlier this year.
> 
> “I know I can do it,” he said of moving over to the NBA. “I have to still work, but it will be no problem.”


I am liking this Sene guy more and more, he sounds like he has a great attitude, and although he is confident in his abilities, he knows he has to work hard. That 7'8 wingspan sounds incredible, along with his athleticism he would be a great intimidator on defense right off the bat. He will take his time to develop, but this kid can turn out to be an amazing defensive presence.


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## Toxicity

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



jbulls said:


> Haven't heard much talk about Marco Belinelli lately. He seems to fit the bill in terms of what we need - big guard with a good handle. Any speculation about where/if he's going to go in the draft?


He's not in the draft. He'll wait until 2007 draft.


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## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I like the looks of this Saer Sene kid. I don't think I'd be too unhappy if we walked away with him at #16 and Rudy Gay at #2.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think it is absolutely false to say that the Bulls "don't scout Europe". Of course they do, they even have Ivicka Dukan who is an international scout. It's funny but I just finished reading an article prior to this post where Bennetton Treviso's asst coach was interviewed and commented that the only team he has seen more of than Toronto is the Chicago Bulls. Plus we went after Nocioni who was a great signing and we have scouts over there looking at some guards right now as well. So, I think Rlucas is a little off in this comment.

On Gay, he has great size, great atheleticism, all of the tools and I have been hearing since he was in HS what sort of great player he could become some day...I am still waiting to see it. He could be a Vince Carter or Tracy Mcgrady type in the NBA one day if he ever maximizes his potential, he sure hasn't showm much success at that yet though IMO.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ace20004u said:


> I think it is absolutely false to say that the Bulls "don't scout Europe". Of course they do, they even have Ivicka Dukan who is an international scout. It's funny but I just finished reading an article prior to this post where Bennetton Treviso's asst coach was interviewed and commented that the only team he has seen more of than Toronto is the Chicago Bulls. Plus we went after Nocioni who was a great signing and we have scouts over there looking at some guards right now as well. So, I think Rlucas is a little off in this comment.
> 
> On Gay, he has great size, great atheleticism, all of the tools and I have been hearing since he was in HS what sort of great player he could become some day...I am still waiting to see it. He could be a Vince Carter or Tracy Mcgrady type in the NBA one day if he ever maximizes his potential, he sure hasn't showm much success at that yet though IMO.



In relation to what everyone else is doing Ace, only the Knicks are doing less. Thats simply a fact. And Ivika Dukan is crap. Period. If he is all you have, then you dont have anything.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Rlucas, I don't suppose you've heard anything about the workout with O'Bryant, Sene, Williams and Francis?


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



LegoHat said:


> Rlucas, I don't suppose you've heard anything about the workout with O'Bryant, Sene, Williams and Francis?



Nothing but I put in a ring to someone who might have heard something.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> In relation to what everyone else is doing Ace, only the Knicks are doing less. Thats simply a fact. And Ivika Dukan is crap. Period. If he is all you have, then you dont have anything.



According to Benneton Trevisio's asst coach we have been to see him more than any other NBA team so I don't think "only the Knicks are doing less" and we will have to agree to disagree on Dukans skill level. Plus there have been several euro prospects we have looked at, I think you have a bias or something on this issue.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Nothing but I put in a ring to someone who might have heard something.


Very nice, thanks.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I don't know about you all, but this draft has the makings to be one of the more EXCITING ones in a long time. I know they say it's a draft of 'role players' but EVERYONE is looking to move up, down or out of the draft completely. I expect alot of trades on draft night, maybe even one involving us. Boston, Minnesota, Golden State & Philadelphia all need to trade out, those teams need vets, not more young players (ESPECIALLY the celtics & warriors who have too many youngsters). One thing I DON'T expect is, the bulls to trade to get another lotto pick, I don't think Pax is looking to get younger at all. Deng/Nocioni/Hinrich/Gordon should be all safe from any trades next season, with the only exception being POSSIBLY Gordon. Bottom line is, I think with the #2 pick, Pax is drafting a big. I say that MAINLY because the 'big 3' in this draft have more potential and upside than probably any bigman in FA. So add that "potential" with another solid contributor or two & you have a pretty good frontline.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ace20004u said:


> According to Benneton Trevisio's asst coach we have been to see him more than any other NBA team so I don't think "only the Knicks are doing less" and we will have to agree to disagree on Dukans skill level. Plus there have been several euro prospects we have looked at, I think you have a bias or something on this issue.



Ace, I think your the best so I have no issue with you. But your poorly misinformed here. So we have seen Bargnani but I doubt the asst coach can spot every scout in the stands for every game? Maybe Pax has seen him a couple of times. But that doesnt mean we scout Europe. I scouted Europe. I know some of the guys who do this. Even NO/OKC does as much as the Bulls, and they are cheap *******s. Its a fact. Only the Knicks do less. You talk about us getting Nocioni. Well, that doesnt mean much since everyone knew who he was. Its finding those hidden gems that seperate the good from the bad. Nocioni wasnt even the guy we were really after. The fact is, the Bulls are not there in any serious way and Pax has said so as much himself. And if you want to disagree on Dukans level, lets see who he was responsible for drafting, Tarlac, Bagaric, David, and the hits keep coming. He is basically a joke in the scouting circuit. Maybe the reason why Pax doesnt do more there is because he knows his one scout is crap? But he ought to have like 5-7. I know the Mavs have 7 scouts in Europe, FULL TIME, a fulltime guy in Africa and a fulltime guy in South America. Thats what we should have. Detroit has a fulltime guy in Asia. Why dont we have that? Questions.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Ace, I think your the best so I have no issue with you. But your poorly misinformed here. So we have seen Bargnani but I doubt the asst coach can spot every scout in the stands for every game? Maybe Pax has seen him a couple of times. But that doesnt mean we scout Europe. I scouted Europe. I know some of the guys who do this. Even NO/OKC does as much as the Bulls, and they are cheap *******s. Its a fact. Only the Knicks do less. You talk about us getting Nocioni. Well, that doesnt mean much since everyone knew who he was. Its finding those hidden gems that seperate the good from the bad. Nocioni wasnt even the guy we were really after. The fact is, the Bulls are not there in any serious way and Pax has said so as much himself. And if you want to disagree on Dukans level, lets see who he was responsible for drafting, Tarlac, Bagaric, David, and the hits keep coming. He is basically a joke in the scouting circuit. Maybe the reason why Pax doesnt do more there is because he knows his one scout is crap? But he ought to have like 5-7. I know the Mavs have 7 scouts in Europe, FULL TIME, a fulltime guy in Africa and a fulltime guy in South America. Thats what we should have. Detroit has a fulltime guy in Asia. Why dont we have that? Questions.



Alright then fair enough I will acede to your knowledge on the subject. Benneton's asst coach sure did sound like the Bulls have been noticed:

"The Raptors are not the only ones [we've seen a lot of],'' he said. "I've seen the Bulls [more than once]. I think Andrea is a great choice for the Bulls. Andrea would do well there. I know Johnny Paxson, and he's terrific. And [Scott] Skiles is a great coach. I know offensively Andrea could help the Bulls a great deal, and I know that coach Skiles could help him a lot with the continued development of his defense.'' 

I agree that the Bulls should have 5-7 guys scouting internationally and if they don't they are missing the boat. All I know is I wish I could get a scouting gig! lol


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ace20004u said:


> Alright then fair enough I will acede to your knowledge on the subject. Benneton's asst coach sure did sound like the Bulls have been noticed:
> 
> "The Raptors are not the only ones [we've seen a lot of],'' he said. "I've seen the Bulls [more than once]. I think Andrea is a great choice for the Bulls. Andrea would do well there. I know Johnny Paxson, and he's terrific. And [Scott] Skiles is a great coach. I know offensively Andrea could help the Bulls a great deal, and I know that coach Skiles could help him a lot with the continued development of his defense.''
> 
> I agree that the Bulls should have 5-7 guys scouting internationally and if they don't they are missing the boat. All I know is I wish I could get a scouting gig! lol


Ace, you know I would hire you in a second. Always a ton of respect from me to you. I will say one last thing on the above quote and then drop it. I think it does nothing for Bargnani if the coach, who I would think as Andreas best interest in mind, to say he sees San Antonio, Phoenix, Detroit alot. He needs to say Chicago and Toronto because they have the top 2 picks, and that is where they would Bargnani to be drafted. This is a quote to generate demand, IMO. Perhaps Pax knows them. I dont know. I doubt it. I believe Pax made a relationship with CSKA, which was a damn good idea only to see it hijacked by the kid from Miss State a few years back.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Ace, you know I would hire you in a second. Always a ton of respect from me to you. I will say one last thing on the above quote and then drop it. I think it does nothing for Bargnani if the coach, who I would think as Andreas best interest in mind, to say he sees San Antonio, Phoenix, Detroit alot. He needs to say Chicago and Toronto because they have the top 2 picks, and that is where they would Bargnani to be drafted. This is a quote to generate demand, IMO. Perhaps Pax knows them. I dont know. I doubt it. I believe Pax made a relationship with CSKA, which was a damn good idea only to see it hijacked by the kid from Miss State a few years back.


You mean Mario Austin? I seem to remember him getting sick and hospitalized in Moscow, but what does that have to do with Pax's relationship with CSKA? Maybe I don't remember the story correctly...


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Ace, you know I would hire you in a second. Always a ton of respect from me to you. I will say one last thing on the above quote and then drop it. I think it does nothing for Bargnani if the coach, who I would think as Andreas best interest in mind, to say he sees San Antonio, Phoenix, Detroit alot. He needs to say Chicago and Toronto because they have the top 2 picks, and that is where they would Bargnani to be drafted. This is a quote to generate demand, IMO. Perhaps Pax knows them. I dont know. I doubt it. I believe Pax made a relationship with CSKA, which was a damn good idea only to see it hijacked by the kid from Miss State a few years back.



Well if you know anybody wanting a scout tell them to hire me, I will go anywhere they need me too.

Thats a good point about draft posturing and such and not one I had really considered. Of course it seems like he would do even better to hype how much Toronto with the #1 pick has seen Bargnani rather than the Bulls at 2. So, who do you like at 2 and 16?


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Just an interesting note below. After reading this it is hard to think the bulls are not drafting Thomas.

EDIT: per the Terms of Service at bbb.net we can't have complete INSIDER articles quoted. snippets, as far as i understand the agreement, are allowed. so i had to edit this and provide the link. really sorry, dave. it is a good article.


http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draf...ford_chad&id=2470898&univLogin02=stateChanged



> Thomas' workout on Friday wasn't what I expected. There were no post moves. No flying dunks. In fact, Thomas didn't dunk the ball once in his workout. Thomas has read the scouting report on him. It says that he's an amazing athlete, excellent shot-blocker and rebounder and a good hustle guy. However, it also says that he's very raw on the offensive end.
> 
> 
> Thomas decided he would show me that his offensive skills are anything but raw.
> 
> Thomas spends the better part of an hour doing ball-handling and shooting drills.
> 
> It's clear that he was once a point guard. He handles the ball very well for a big man. He can dribble with his right and left, change directions and bring the ball up the floor. We didn't see much of that at LSU.
> 
> The shooting is a mixed bag. His jump-shooting form is very good. He's got a high, consistent release on his jumper with nice rotation. But on the day I saw him, the results were streaky.
> 
> He started off the workout missing just about everything, especially from 10 feet in. He did show a nice kiss off the glass from about eight feet in on the right side. Then, 20 minutes into the workout, his shot started to fall.
> 
> He stepped out to the college 3-point line and hit 22 of 33 during one catch-and-shoot drill. As he got tired toward the end of the workout, his shot started to come up short.
> 
> I didn't come out of the workout thinking Thomas was an amazing shooter. But he was clearly more skilled in that area than advertised. Given his shot mechanics, he looks like he'll be the type of guy who will be able to hit the 15-to-18 foot jumper.




for the rest of the article, please click the link (if you are an insider that is)


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

DOPE article.

But the part about him seeing himself as more of a '3' than a '4' is a bit concerning. He also said he feels more comfortable on the perimeter. That actually would make me NOT want to draft him.

You should post this in the "Thomas" thread or made ANOTHER thread about this. I think it's very important.

All of a sudden, Aldridge sounds more attractive to me. 6'11 F/C who plays IN THE POST.


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



LegoHat said:


> You mean Mario Austin? I seem to remember him getting sick and hospitalized in Moscow, but what does that have to do with Pax's relationship with CSKA? Maybe I don't remember the story correctly...



Mario Austin lied. Made the Bulls look bad. Austin basically said he was dying (or something like that) only to go back to the US and not honor his contract when in fact he wasnt sick at all. It got broiled in all sorts of lawsuits and I recall hearing a CSKA guy say they werent thrilled with the experience. Not really Paxs fault there, but it have an effect. Now that I think about it, Pax also worked out a deal with a team who is skipping me now (my memory is fading fast) for Tommy Smith and tried to work out the same deal for Chris Duhon with the same team. Perhaps thats a relationship they can use down the road.

Ace, I would go with Bargnani, Thomas and Aldridge (in that order) at 2 and Brewer/Sene at 16. I love Gay (that doesnt sound right) and would consider taking him at 2 if they really have a need somewhere else. I think Brandon Roy will be a heck of a player, but not if the Bulls keep Gordon.


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## dsouljah9

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Rlucas...

You love Gay? :raised_ey . I mean, the kid's a nice player and all, but don't you think that's a little bit to much. You just don't come out of the closet and say _"This is who I am"_ , you ease out playa. :biggrin:


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Wow. This article makes me think he is more of a Marion type of player. A guy who is both a 3 + 4. I really want to know what he measures up as. If he is 6-9, and has the frame (which I think he does) to go up to 240, he'll play large. He already has the heart. 

I honestly love our draft spot. I won't be mad who we draft. Aldridge is the most NBA ready out of the big men. Best low post option. Bargnani has the potential to be the next Dirk. Tyrus has the heart and the work ethic to be a beast.

Man, if we could only have a workout of the 3 top big men, and possibly include O'Bryant. 

It's going to be interesting if Tyrus shows up to the workout we are having with Gay and Morrison on June 19?


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I dunno,

I think it's valuable to have a kid like that who can play both positions, but only if he was a PF that COULD play SF like Dirk or KG. I feel like Pax drafted him to play PF, we'd be playing him out of position.

His heart, work ethic and desire still have me SOLD but we already have Deng & Nocioni playing 3/4, why draft another one?

 the article just messed up my whole thought process on the draft lol


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



dsouljah9 said:


> Rlucas...
> 
> You love Gay? :raised_ey . I mean, the kid's a nice player and all, but don't you think that's a little bit to much. You just don't come out of the closet and say _"This is who I am"_ , you ease out playa. :biggrin:


  :rbanana: :buddies: :sfight: :cannibal:  :makeout:


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Mario Austin lied. Made the Bulls look bad. Austin basically said he was dying (or something like that) only to go back to the US and not honor his contract when in fact he wasnt sick at all. It got broiled in all sorts of lawsuits and I recall hearing a CSKA guy say they werent thrilled with the experience. Not really Paxs fault there, but it have an effect. Now that I think about it, Pax also worked out a deal with a team who is skipping me now (my memory is fading fast) for Tommy Smith and tried to work out the same deal for Chris Duhon with the same team. Perhaps thats a relationship they can use down the road.
> 
> Ace, I would go with Bargnani, Thomas and Aldridge (in that order) at 2 and Brewer/Sene at 16. I love Gay (that doesnt sound right) and would consider taking him at 2 if they really have a need somewhere else. I think Brandon Roy will be a heck of a player, but not if the Bulls keep Gordon.



Thats funny, sounds like we have the exact same draft board. At 2 I agree, Bargnani, Thomas, and Aldrdridge in that order. At 16 I am hoping that Shelden Williams or Ronnie Brewer falls or that we perhaps trade up fro O'bryant. I haven't really seen Sene but the reports are intriguing.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



 rlucas4257 said:


> :rbanana: :buddies: :sfight: :cannibal:  :makeout:


 :cowboy:


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I dont think that was from the insider but was from CNNSI.com. Do the same rules apply?

Thanks

david


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

you know, let me check. i will repost it if it was CNN/SI. but i am pretty sure it was insider!

edit:

Is Tyrus Thomas the No. 1 pick in the draft?

*By Chad Ford
ESPN Insider*


there's your answer.

that said, i did KEEP the relevant workout stuff quoted in your post.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

So if Tyrus Thomas sees himself as an perimeter oriented foward, then he is clearly behind Bargnani. 

I guess Paxson's draft board looks like this (more or less):

1- Roy
2- Aldridge
3- Bargnani
4- Thomas
5- Gay


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> So if Tyrus Thomas sees himself as an perimeter oriented foward, then he is clearly behind Bargnani.
> 
> I guess Paxson's draft board looks like this (more or less):
> 
> 1- Roy
> 2- Aldridge
> 3- Bargnani
> 4- Thomas
> 5- Gay


That's more like YOUR draft board.

Nobody here can sit and guess what Pax's board looks like. He may trade out altogether.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

"I Guess" "I Guess"...whats so hard to understand? Maybe if I put Thomas #1, you will agree that that is Pax's board.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> "I Guess" "I Guess"...whats so hard to understand? Maybe if I put Thomas #1, you will agree that that is Pax's board.


nah, actually I wouldn't....

He's no longer #1 on MY board though.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Right now, my draft board would have to be 

1. LaMarcus Aldridge
2. Patrick O'Bryant
3. Andrea Bargnani
4. Adam Morrisson
5. Rudy Gay
6. Tyrus Thomas
7. Brandon Roy
8. Saer Sene
9. JJ Reddick
10. Rodney Carney


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> "I Guess" "I Guess"...whats so hard to understand? Maybe if I put Thomas #1, you will agree that that is Pax's board.


:rofl: Touche.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Thanks yes i got that from my insider. 

Thomas is still number one for me. The tie breaker for me is how hard he appears to work and how passionate he is about the game. Do you remember what MJ says to bill murry while they are golfing in the MJ/Disney move. "its a man's game". And I think Thomas is going to be a man when he matures and fills into his body. 

david


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



step said:


> :rofl: Touche.


why don't you hi five your girlfriend while you're at it?


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> why don't you hi five your girlfriend while you're at it?


Because she's not that loose


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I have no problem grabbing Roy with 2. We can only afford to trade down if Portland wants to move up to grab LMA. But if we grab Roy, we better have another draft move in place to grab O'Bryant.

Is O'Bryant going to be worked out by us? I can see Pax trying to trade and grab Shelden.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ace20004u said:


> Thats funny, sounds like we have the exact same draft board. At 2 I agree, Bargnani, Thomas, and Aldrdridge in that order. At 16 I am hoping that Shelden Williams or Ronnie Brewer falls or that we perhaps trade up fro O'bryant. I haven't really seen Sene but the reports are intriguing.


I'm in complete agreement with both Rlucas and Ace on this. Bargnani followed by Thomas with the #2 pick and Sene/Brewer/O'Bryant in that order with the #16.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Is O'Bryant going to be worked out by us? I can see Pax trying to trade and grab Shelden.


Nothing is up yet on Draftexpress, so I don't thnik he'll work out for us.


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## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Mario Austin lied. Made the Bulls look bad. Austin basically said he was dying (or something like that) only to go back to the US and not honor his contract when in fact he wasnt sick at all. It got broiled in all sorts of lawsuits and I recall hearing a CSKA guy say they werent thrilled with the experience. Not really Paxs fault there, but it have an effect. Now that I think about it, Pax also worked out a deal with a team who is skipping me now (my memory is fading fast) for Tommy Smith and tried to work out the same deal for Chris Duhon with the same team. Perhaps thats a relationship they can use down the road.


I remember an interview he did on ESPN. Dude was crying like a baby. I'm not sure if he was completely lying about his health situation though, as I believe he was actually hospitalized with a collapsed lung? Or did he make that part up?


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



SALO said:


> I remember an interview he did on ESPN. Dude was crying like a baby. I'm not sure if he was completely lying about his health situation though, as I believe he was actually hospitalized with a collapsed lung? Or did he make that part up?



Maybe I was harsh. What I recall and was told was that he recieved medical attention in Moscow from some of the best doctors in Europe for what they thought was a mild problem. He went to the US, on their permission, and never came back. Just broke the contract. Then Austin, for lack of a better term, made it sound like he was sold into slavery by the Bulls to CSKA. Pax tried to downplay it and CSKA, never piss of Russians, were livid. Pax gave Austin a chance but since he never played for the Bulls, I dont think they have terrible feelings towards the Bulls, but the whole thing did leave a sour taste in their mouth.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I didn't remember the Austin story right, but anyways, the Bulls really should have about 5-7 good scouts around the world. I especially think it would be a great idea to have a permanent scout in Africa, because a lot of big athletic guys from there seem to pop out regularly and go on to play in Europe. It would be great to have the first scoop on them and have an extra advantage in the draft, if we wanted an unknown player it would open up a lot of opportunities to trade down and get players/money in return.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

It really is appalling to see a big market team like us not following suit. Just look at how successful the Spurs have been, they've been near the top for a better part of a decade and alot of the credit goes to their scouting department.
Spurs.
Tony Parker, 28th pick, 2001.
Leandrinho Barbosa, 28th pick, 2003. Traded for a future 1st rounder, Parker was already on the scene.
Manu Ginobili, 57th pick, 1999 
Luis Scola, 55th pick, 2002.
Ian Mahinmi, 28th pick, 2005.

Rest of the league
Anderson Varejao, 30th pick, 2004.
Darius Songalia, 49th pick, 2002.
Mehmet Okur, 37th pick, 2001.
Andrei Kirilenko, 24th pick, 1999.

If we can achieve half of that success, it would be well worth the risk.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Did ya'll catch that Tyrus Thomas segment on channel 7 just now?

That kid's gonna be a Bull.


----------



## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> Did ya'll catch that Tyrus Thomas segment on channel 7 just now?
> 
> That kid's gonna be a Bull.


what did he say ?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



mr.ankle20 said:


> what did he say ?


They showed him in the GYM and said he was the player the bulls had their eye on. He did a few dunks and hit a few 20 footers consistently. He also said he'd love to play for the bulls but he just wants to play basketball and help wherever he goes.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> They showed him in the GYM and said he was the player the bulls had their eye on. He did a few dunks and hit a few 20 footers consistently. He also said he'd love to play for the bulls but he just wants to play basketball and help wherever he goes.



Tyrus has serious heart, and I admire that. He doesn't have the size or skill that I covet, and he's probably #3 on my personal draft board, but if we draft him, I realize that I may find it quite easy to root for him.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I dont understand he doesnt have the size. What are we talking about here. Do we know his height and weight? I have heard he is 6'9" with a long reach at least. But i have seen him on TV and he sesms bigger than that to me. As for his weight i he is still 19 and should easily put more weight on.

Am I mis-informed?

david


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> but if we draft him, I realize that I may find it quite easy to root for him.


Isn't that a given DMD?!



> He doesn't have the size or skill that I covet, and he's probably #3 on my personal draft board


Same reason and slot I have him on my board. Great minds really do think alike :tongue:
Roy
Aldridge
Thomas
Bargnani

Any of those 4 in a Chicago uniform next season and I will be a happy lil' chap.


> Did ya'll catch that Tyrus Thomas segment on channel 7 just now?


Hopefully someone out there captured it and it'll end up making it to this board, would of loved to have seen it.



> I dont understand he doesnt have the size. What are we talking about here. Do we know his height and weight? I have heard he is 6'9" with a long reach at least.


So far measurements puts him at 6'9", hopefully he is taller because it might force the issue for him to focus on the paint, but now, he invisions himself more as a wing .


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Its a long time discussion, but to the date I cant understand people obssesion with height. Its like if you are 6'9, you are undersized for PF. But wait, if you are 6'10, you are a monster. Its one freaking inch. You wouldnt even notice the difference. 

Now, if we talk skills, talent, etc I can understand.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Its a long time discussion, but to the date I cant understand people obssesion with height. Its like if you are 6'9, you are undersized for PF. But wait, if you are 6'10, you are a monster. Its one freaking inch. You wouldnt even notice the difference.
> 
> Now, if we talk skills, talent, etc I can understand.


I hear you on the height, Chapu, but I think the biggest issue for Tyrus is the bulk. The most recent picture we saw of him showed him looking about 210 lbs. He looked Hakim Warrick skinny. Meanwhile, Al Harrington is listed at the same height but 245 lbs. He's built like a Mack Truck. Really, I've never really seen Al as much of an undersized four due to his weight and strength. What makes him a tweener to me is his style of play.

I'm very interested to see how much Tyrus weighs and how he is being described at workouts.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

6'9 is cool as long as you got the bulk and wing-span.

I'm sure some of my fellow posters already mentioned that...just felt like posting...lol.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I hear you on the high, Chapu, but I think the biggest issue for Tyrus is the bulk. The most recent picture we saw of him showed him looking about 210 lbs. He looked Hakim Warrick skinny. Meanwhile, Al Harrington is listed at the same height but 245 lbs. He's built like a Mack Truck. Really, I've never really seen Al as much of an undersized four due to his weight and strength. What makes him a tweener to me is his style of play.
> 
> I'm very interested to see how much Tyrus weighs and how he is being described at workouts.


You are right, but I dont hear that being an issue as far as some posters go. Its like they are making a big issue about Tyrus measuring at 6'8 or 6'9 or 6'9 2/3. 

IMO Tyrus is at 220.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Its a long time discussion, but to the date I cant understand people obssesion with height. Its like if you are 6'9, you are undersized for PF. But wait, if you are 6'10, you are a monster. Its one freaking inch. You wouldnt even notice the difference.
> 
> Now, if we talk skills, talent, etc I can understand.


Its a game of inches. You can make up for an inch here or there with athleticism/reach/explosion/skills. Some guys do it on heart. But there is a reason why there is hundreds of 6-7 to 6-8 guys who were absolute stars in college, or europe, havent done diddly squat in the NBA. And the same can be said for the tweener guard (jeez, Rodney Monroe was God like at NC State and never made it to the pros, same could be said of Harold Miner and more recently Joe Forte). And most of the time, that thing is that one inch. But I do agree, you can make up for the inch with a number of things, otherwise, your odds of success are slim.


----------



## remlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Its a game of inches. You can make up for an inch here or there with athleticism/reach/explosion/skills. Some guys do it on heart. But there is a reason why there is hundreds of 6-7 to 6-8 guys who were absolute stars in college, or europe, havent done diddly squat in the NBA. And the same can be said for the tweener guard (jeez, Rodney Monroe was God like at NC State and never made it to the pros, same could be said of Harold Miner and more recently Joe Forte). And most of the time, that thing is that one inch. But I do agree, you can make up for the inch with a number of things, otherwise, your odds of success are slim.


Good post. I was thinking to myself how just an inch here or there can radically change the career of certain college stars.

IMO, Tyrus will have no problem dealing with being 6'9. As rlucas eluded to, athleticism can make up for height. Day 1 I feel Tyrus can give us 13/7 on pure energy and athleticism alone. In the coming years when he puts on weight and becomes an experienced ball player his numbers will continue to rise.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Are you guys reading this stuff about Tyrus Thomas?!

The way he thinks...His drive...His dedication...His passion...His FIRE!

A kid like that CAN'T lose.

I don't want to hear another thing about Roy...There is NO WAY he's gonna be as clutch as Gordon has been for us...NONE.

It's all about T2!


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## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



remlover said:


> Good post. I was thinking to myself how just an inch here or there can radically change the career of certain college stars.
> 
> IMO, Tyrus will have no problem dealing with being 6'9. As rlucas eluded to, athleticism can make up for height. Day 1 I feel Tyrus can give us 13/7 on pure energy and athleticism alone. In the coming years when he puts on weight and becomes an experienced ball player his numbers will continue to rise.



Tyrus Thomas is going to be a good player, maybe even a great player. He would be a good pick. I think he can be a PF in the NBA with an inch to spare. Sure, Id love to see him an inch or two taller, but he has an inch to spare. His athleticism and reach indicate that.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> They showed him in the GYM and said he was the player the bulls had their eye on. He did a few dunks and hit a few 20 footers consistently. He also said he'd love to play for the bulls but he just wants to play basketball and help wherever he goes.


So when Tyrus Thomas says this he has big heart, when Tim Thomas and Eddy Curry say this, we get rid of them from our team?


----------



## charlietyra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Its a game of inches. You can make up for an inch here or there with athleticism/reach/explosion/skills. Some guys do it on heart. But there is a reason why there is hundreds of 6-7 to 6-8 guys who were absolute stars in college, or europe, havent done diddly squat in the NBA. And the same can be said for the tweener guard (jeez, Rodney Monroe was God like at NC State and never made it to the pros, same could be said of Harold Miner and more recently Joe Forte). And most of the time, that thing is that one inch. But I do agree, you can make up for the inch with a number of things, otherwise, your odds of success are slim.



IMO, athleticism and explosion are more important than height (up to a certain limit). The best examples are JRich and DWade, both "undersized" shooting guards. I would say both of them are no taller than 6'4" in shoes and both are probably a little less. But taking a chance on Shannon Brown at 6'2" is dumb if he plans on being a 2. He will not be tall enough to get it done either offensively or defensively. He will not be more than a "rotational player." Fred Jones is a good example of this. A very explosive player but will never be great. I also believe Ben Gordon will never be a great 2 because his explosiveness and shooting ability will not compensate for his height, which I would put at 6'1" notwithstanding the BS from the Bulls that he is 6'3". Anybody who has been at a Bulls game can easily ascertain his true height. 

If you have both explosion and girth you can make up several inches. For example, Charles Barkley was certainly no taller than 6'6" in shoes but played much bigger due to his size and incredible quick leaping ability. A third element he had was his heart. No one wanted it more. IMHO, if Fizer did not tear his ACL he could have succeeded in the league, albeit certainly not in Barkley's class. Fizer's main weakness was his lack of explosion which kept him from finishing around the hoop. However, he improved greatly in this area prior to his injury through training. Remember how many bunnys he would miss during a game? This was due to his inability to beat the defender to the rim.

Ben Wallace is a good example of an undersized 5 who succeeded due to athleticism and heart. Wes Unseld was a great 5 even though he was probably no taller than 6'7" and not super athletic. He was incredibly wide and strong, however, and was very smart. 

There are tons more players who have succeeded in the league although very undersized for their position. We could have a long post just on those guys (e.g. Earl Boykins).


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

If Tyrus Thomas is such a superior athelete, I'm sure he won't mind demonstrating it in competitive 2 on 2 workouts with three other leading draft candidates of similar size.

But I've heard that he's reluctant to do that... Hmm, wish him the best on some other team.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



McBulls said:


> If Tyrus Thomas is such a superior athelete, I'm sure he won't mind demonstrating it in competitive 2 on 2 workouts with three other leading draft candidates of similar size.
> 
> But I've heard that he's reluctant to do that... Hmm, wish him the best on some other team.


I like him, but jeez, I have to agree with this. If he has all of this heart, dedication, competitive drive, why not go out and tear Rudy Gay, Adam Morrison and whoever else a new one? I think the Bulls will take him. I think he will be a star. But lets not talk about him being a heart player until he agrees to workout against other players. Deng tried a stunt like that a couple of years ago and it hurt him. Put me in the Thomas camp, but dont label me as thinking he is a heart player until he shows what he can do with the bosses watching. Its a flag, no doubt.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



McBulls said:


> If Tyrus Thomas is such a superior athelete, I'm sure he won't mind demonstrating it in competitive 2 on 2 workouts with three other leading draft candidates of similar size.
> 
> But I've heard that he's reluctant to do that... Hmm, wish him the best on some other team.


Maybe he knows something we dont know? If not, it wouldnt make much sense.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

for those talking about his 'refusal' to work out against others



> Like most other top-tier prospects, he's likely to work out for teams by himself. Likewise, Andrew Bogut and Marvin Williams refused to work out against anyone last year. Ditto for Dwight Howard, Emeka Okafor, LeBron James, Carmelo Anthony, Darko Milicic, Yao Ming and Jay Williams in years past.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'm increasingly of the opinion that someone very good is going to drop to the 16th pick. I'm willing to back two or three GM will take punts on people not currently listed in the top 16 on draft boards. This seems to happen every year.

Especially if one of the higher candidates tumbles, that will throw alot of teams off on who they thought would be available and who their willing to take a punt on.

In Paxson we trust


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Ali Traores name keeps getting mentioned as a possibility for someone, perhaps Dallas, somewhere in the draft


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Ali Traores name keeps getting mentioned as a possibility for someone, perhaps Dallas, somewhere in the draft


Both draftexpress and nbadraft come up clean when searching for a Ali Traore. Well I sort of lie, draftexpress has him but nothing really useful.

Ali Traore, 21, 6-9 240lbs from Ivory Coast/France and is playing for Roanne.

Sounds like the Mavs might use him on their late first rounder or even possibly their second if they're lucky.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



step said:


> Both draftexpress and nbadraft come up clean when searching for a Ali Traore. Well I sort of lie, draftexpress has him but nothing really useful.
> 
> Ali Traore, 21, 6-9 240lbs from Ivory Coast/France and is playing for Roanne.
> 
> Sounds like the Mavs might use him on their late first rounder or even possibly their second if they're lucky.



The Mavs have set up a camp in Africa and apparently this guy has come through there a few times. He is a freaky 6-9 240 pounder Ivory Coast (looking like a very athletic culture recently) product who plays in the french league and might be a big steal. They know about him because they scout Africa, like Mbenga.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Talking about Splitter, if he doesnt declare for this year draft then he is a free agent next offseason, right? And we wont have any cap room, other than the MLE (which could be enough and great value BTW), right?

Maybe Im confused...


----------



## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Talking about Splitter, if he doesnt declare for this year draft then he is a free agent next offseason, right?


I thought he had two more years, with the buyout clause on the last year being very reasonable.
If he couldn't work out a reasonable buyout for this year, wasn't he going to pull out of this years draft and enter next year? Makes me believe he has 2 years on his contract otherwise he could just come to the NBA and join the team he wishes if he's a FA.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Isn't this his last year on his contract? I was reading an interview from last year, and he said he was waiting to see how the draft shapes up, and that he would have to pay some of the buyout out of his salary, but he said moneys not an issue to him. And he said his dream is to play in the NBA, but he'd be okay with playing some more one or two more years.

So cross out one year, since that was from last year, and sholdn't he only have one year left with them? If so, I can't imagine the buyout being so terrible that if we were going to take him at 16, he wouldn't be able to afford it. Heck, even if we do draft him at 16, I'd be cool with letting him go over seas for a year, then bringing him over. But as of now, he hasn't withdrawn form the draft at least.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think Splitter's 21, and after 22 is when you become a free agent if you're a Euro, so, Tiago can dip his foot into the water one more time.

From what I have read, Splitter does not have a buyout built into his contract with Tau for this upcoming season, so, to be able to play in the NBA, he would need to be a high draft pick to afford a payoff with the team, so he is looking to get a guarantee of being a top 7-10 pick, but no one wants to do that because of his buyout, so it's kind of shunning him from being able to break himself in.

I think he'll dropout of the draft, and then re-enter (again!) next year, where I think he actually has something built into his contract that would allow him to go to the NBA.

That's what I know, but I'm probably pretty loose on the details. I think that explains the brunt of the situation though.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Also,

What does anyone know of Aleksiy Pecherov?

Apparently he's had good workouts against other mid 1st-round bigs, and is looking like a guy that could be picked in our range.

Reading his scouting report on NBAdraft.net, it looks like he's Bargnani-ish in his style of play.

Has anyone seen him play, and have any opinions about how he'd fit on this team?


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rosenthall said:


> Also,
> 
> What does anyone know of Aleksiy Pecherov?
> 
> Apparently he's had good workouts against other mid 1st-round bigs, and is looking like a guy that could be picked in our range.
> 
> Reading his scouting report on NBAdraft.net, it looks like he's Bargnani-ish in his style of play.
> 
> Has anyone seen him play, and have any opinions about how he'd fit on this team?


I have nothing on Pecherov, but those NBAdraft.net scouting reports are really suspect IMO...


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Many of folk have stated how next years draft is going to be deep with better bigs than this year, but besides Oden who are you talking about......

McRoberts
Noah
Horford?

None of these guys stood out apart from this years big three, Noah might have, but it would've been close at best.

Hansbrough- great college player, but really has zero all-star chances at next level.
Jason Smith- I like but no overwhelming potential

So I guess everyone has their money on....
Hawes 
Durant
Jialian
Tomic
B. Wright

a bunch of unknowns. I'm sure some of them will pan out, but they may not all enter next year. The mocks are full of guys that pulled out of this years draft because they weren't going to make it. What is it that makes next years draft so promising? and this year OK to lackluster?


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Hustle said:


> Many of folk have stated how next years draft is going to be deep with better bigs than this year, but besides Oden who are you talking about......
> 
> McRoberts
> Noah
> Horford?
> 
> None of these guys stood out apart from this years big three, Noah might have, but it would've been close at best.
> 
> Hansbrough- great college player, but really has zero all-star chances at next level.
> Jason Smith- I like but no overwhelming potential
> 
> So I guess everyone has their money on....
> Hawes
> Durant
> Jialian
> Tomic
> B. Wright
> 
> a bunch of unknowns. I'm sure some of them will pan out, but they may not all enter next year. The mocks are full of guys that pulled out of this years draft because they weren't going to make it. What is it that makes next years draft so promising? and this year OK to lackluster?


I don't think it's worth discussing until next year. This year's draft is an inexact science. Next year's draft is an even more inexact science (albet a slightly more tantelizing one). I'm not getting worked up over the prospect of drafting Al Horford after the Knicks finish 35 - 47...


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

FoxSports mock:

http://msn.foxsports.com/fantasy/story/5668778


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> FoxSports mock:
> 
> http://msn.foxsports.com/fantasy/story/5668778



OMG...Does that guy even watch basketball?

He makes it seem like Eric Snow is STILL on Philly and has the 2nd Hornets pick seem like it's the Bucks pick..

Wussup with Diaz going so damn high...And GS passing on O'Bryant...And Hilton and Tyson being the same player?...Come on now.

No love to the author of that...


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The fox mock is a joke and also has Rando at like the 26th pick going to NY. The already have three PG and on combo guard and very little at SF. How lazy are these sports writters?

david


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> The fox mock is a joke and also has Rando at like the 26th pick going to NY. The already have three PG and on combo guard and very little at SF. How lazy are these sports writters?
> 
> david


I think he is an amateur. I mean I know he's amateur -- besides that, I don't think he is a paid sports writer.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I just heard Splitter pulled out of the draft.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I read from an article posted some minutes ago that he is still undecided and will wait until the 18th to decide whether if he is staying or not.


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## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> That is what Rondo is doing: rising, soaring in this draft class that learns its lot in 22 days. NBA coaches and personnel experts tell me there is not a player in the draft who has risen further or faster than Rondo.
> 
> I sure hope the Nuggets are watching.
> 
> Every personnel guru in every sport will tell you that the weeks before a draft reveal plenty about a player. If an athlete cannot pull it together and sharpen his or her skills and mind during the draft process, that is a serious red flag. With draft positioning at stake and dollars, too, what more incentive will a player ever experience? With a lifelong dream near fulfillment, do they blow it by showing a carefree attitude and lousy work habits?
> 
> Rondo got it.
> 
> First, he surveyed NBA sources and learned that if he left Kentucky having completed only two seasons, he would be a late first-round pick. So, he did in early April. And went to work in Chicago.
> 
> His mornings start with two-hour weight-lifting sessions. That is followed by 45-minute shooting sessions. The afternoon continues with another nearly two-hour session, developing his all-around point guard skills.
> 
> Scouts say his weaknesses are shooting and strength.
> 
> But in workouts thus far for Phoenix, Houston, Boston, Washington, Toronto, Minnesota and Sacramento, his shooting was crisp. He weighed 167 pounds at Kentucky. He weighs 175 pounds now.
> 
> "When I started this training," Rondo said, "I could lift 185 pounds about twice. Now I can do it seven or eight times."
> 
> He has used his predraft time to concentrate on his weaknesses. Some draft boards have him rated as high as No. 4.
> 
> Few believe he will fall further than the last lottery pick at No. 14.
> 
> You start with this player's perceived weaknesses because his strengths take awhile.
> 
> Six-feet-1 ... lightning quick ... a playmaker via the bounce pass, lob or as a finisher ... supreme court vision ... finds the open man ... deadly flipping in runners and floaters ... up-tempo player ... nasty defense ... provides leadership on the court ... speed ... athleticism ... intelligent ... big hands and special rebounder, especially for his size ... poised with the ball in his hands ... confident.
> 
> Here is what Kentucky coach Tubby Smith said at Rondo's farewell news conference:* "I don't think I've ever coached a better athlete or more talented basketball player in my entire life."*


http://www.denverpost.com/nuggets/ci_3902839


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

http://celtics.bostonherald.com/otherNBA/view.bg?articleid=142097



> It’s the same kind of doubt that has dropped Tiago Splitter -- arguably the most talented international player -- off most draft boards. With at least two years remaining on his contract, including one more year that carries an expensive buyout amount, the 6-foot-11 Brazilian is expected to remain in Spain for one more season.
> 
> Splitter is a rare Euro-leaguer, in that his talents run more to the defensive end and rebounding than offense. But considering that NBA draftees are responsible for buying out their own contracts, it doesn’t take much for a player to develop cold feet -- even if, in the case of Vazquez, he qualifies for guaranteed first round money.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> http://celtics.bostonherald.com/otherNBA/view.bg?articleid=142097



And he just dropped out of the draft so his position will drop even lower! lol


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ace20004u said:


> And he just dropped out of the draft so his position will drop even lower! lol


Link?


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Fresh "meat" 

http://195.56.77.209/top5/2-10664-dsl.wmv


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

email the bulls with your draft ideas. they are posting them at bulls.com!

email: [email protected] 

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/draft06_fanforum.html


_NBA Draft Fan Forum: Who wants to play GM for a day? Everyone has their opinions about what the Bulls should do with their picks in this year’s NBA Draft, and we want to hear from you!

Send us your thoughts on who you’d like to see the Bulls take with the 2nd and/or 16th selections… or do you feel a trade is in order? 

Email the Bulls at [email protected] with your full name and hometown and check back to see if your entry is posted._




lol. they should just read this thread.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



italianBBlover said:


> Fresh "meat"
> 
> http://195.56.77.209/top5/2-10664-dsl.wmv


Whoa.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Nice play at both ends. Too bad he stepped on the line. 

If we get him, I really hope Tyson puts on some muscle this summer and develops a post move or two and a baby hook.

Actually, I hope that anyway, but you know what I mean.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The other draft thread had an article about Roy's work out being rescheduled so JR can watch. Now, the question is. Do we select Roy at 2 do a Carter-Jamison trade with Portland. We grab LMA at 2 trade him to Portland who grabs Roy for us at 4. They could also include the 30th pick which I believe they own. We could then package 16, 30, and a filler to move up.

If GSW does not grab O'Bryant, Seattle would be a great trading partner. This is pending if Gordon is not being traded. They could use a guard such as Duhon. We would have two guys in Roy and Hinrich who could handle the point. Gordon would be the 3rd guard in the rotation. Having Seattle's pick would allow us to grab a big man such as Shelden Williams or O'Bryant. Although I think we would be giving up too much with 16,30, and Duhon. But we need to come away with one big man in this draft. There are rumors that Houston wants to move down. I believe they also need a PG. Being in 8th should guarantee O'Bryant. 

I'm a believer that we should go for BPA. If that is Roy, then so be it. Just better have other plans to fill our need of depth.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> Too bad he stepped on the line.


It looks like the trailing ref gave him the trifecta, though.

Can one of the Italian basketball aficionados please explain what in the hell the deal is with those effete little tassels at the bottom of the net? I might have to change my mind about Bargnani because of them.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> The other draft thread had an article about Roy's work out being rescheduled so JR can watch. Now, the question is. Do we select Roy at 2 do a Carter-Jamison trade with Portland. We grab LMA at 2 trade him to Portland who grabs Roy for us at 4. They could also include the 30th pick which I believe they own. We could then package 16, 30, and a filler to move up.
> 
> If GSW does not grab O'Bryant, Seattle would be a great trading partner. This is pending if Gordon is not being traded. They could use a guard such as Duhon. We would have two guys in Roy and Hinrich who could handle the point. Gordon would be the 3rd guard in the rotation. Having Seattle's pick would allow us to grab a big man such as Shelden Williams or O'Bryant. Although I think we would be giving up too much with 16,30, and Duhon. But we need to come away with one big man in this draft. There are rumors that Houston wants to move down. I believe they also need a PG. Being in 8th should guarantee O'Bryant.
> 
> I'm a believer that we should go for BPA. If that is Roy, then so be it. Just better have other plans to fill our need of depth.


That doesn't make sense for Portland, because with Okafor, May, and Brezek, Charlotte is probably not going to take LaMarcus. I believe they are looking for a perimeter wing like Gay, Morrison, or Roy. Why would they need to trade up for him? If Toronto and the Bulls don't take Aldridge, and he's their guy, he'll be there at #4.

The only way a trade down works with Portland is, I think, if Charlotte and Portland both want Morrisson, and Charlotte's second choice is Gay.


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> I might have to change my mind about Bargnani because of them.


Uh ?

Anyway those tassels at the end of the net are just a "special" thing of the Treviso's arena; I don't remember to have never seen something similar in other arenas.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



italianBBlover said:


> Uh ?
> 
> Anyway those tassels at the end of the net are just a "special" thing of the Treviso's arena; I don't remember to have never seen something similar in other arenas.


I'm kidding about changing my mind about Bargnani . . . but those tassels are an abomination.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Bargnani update...

24 mins
10 pts
2-5 2pt
2-4 3pt
0-1 FT
5 boards (1 offensive)
3 blocks and 2 steals (or is it 2 blocks and 3 steals? I'm not reading this Italian box score very well!)
1 assist.

It appears as if he didn't start. Looks like a so-so game from the stats....

Benneton won 63-55. Up 2 games to 1

http://195.56.77.208/game/?id=62600


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

A few words from Insider (I chopped up the paragraphs and just took out the important facts about each player so if you want the full low down, get INSIDER!)



> Alexander Johnson is the more intriguing. He's a 6-9 power forward who's been measured in workouts with a 39-to-40 inch vertical leap. His game, in many ways, now resembles that of Denver's Kenyon Martin. While Johnson doesn't have Martin's attitude, it doesn't mean that he's not tough. The kid loves to get physical and can bang.





> Johnson also demonstrated a very solid jump shot for a big guy -- he showed some NBA 3-point range, and was excellent from 12-to-15 feet. He ran many of the same drills that the smaller Diaz did and showed that he can shoot off the dribble or spotting up. The Chicago Bulls had him in for a workout and came away very impressed. They need a player like Johnson at the four and could grab him with the 16th pick if they were to opt for Brandon Roy instead of Tyrus Thomas with the second pick.





> Cedric Simmons, North Carolina State: Simmons also was very impressive. So impressive that his workout raised the question, what's the big difference between him and Thomas? Simmons is roughly an inch taller (Simmons is measuring 6-10 in shoes). He has a bigger, more muscular body (235 lbs. versus 220). He has a similarly long wingspan (7-3). Like Thomas, he's an excellent athlete. Thomas is more polished on the perimeter. He's a better ball handler and perimeter shooter. And although both are athletic, Simmons doesn't get up the way Thomas does.





> I think the comparisons to a young Theo Ratliff are dead on. Not only does Simmons look a lot like Ratliff, but he also carries himself like him. Simmons might never be a great offensive player, but his toughness, rebounding, shot-blocking and athleticism should keep him in the league for a long time, the same way that combo did for Ratliff.





> Thabo Sefolosha, He's a prototypical small forward in the pros. He's somewhere between 6-7 and 6-8 with a huge wingspan (I swear his fingertips were touching the tops of his knees) and good athleticism. He's a very smooth player with an excellent handle and good court vision. He flies up and down the floor, uses his feet well and can really defend. "I think the kid has the potential to be a Boris Diaw-type player down the road," one NBA international scout told me. "He's really got all the tools. He's not a huge scorer, but all the little things he does don't show up on the box score."





> No one has mentioned O'Bryant as a No. 1 candidate. Let me be the first. As I watched him work out, I had to keep asking myself, why isn't this guy getting mentioned as a potential top pick in the draft? Physically, he reminds me a lot of a young Tyson Chandler. Similar size, body and athleticism. The difference is that O'Bryant already looks much more polished offensively than Chandler has ever looked.





> His ability on the offensive end surprised me. He showed a number of post moves, including a sky hook. That's right, a sky hook. So why isn't the 7-0, athletic, coordinated, defensively and offensively gifted center not being mentioned as the potential No. 1 pick? The Knock : Some NBA scouts believe O'Bryant isn't the most motivated player in the draft. Will he put in all the hard work he needs to become a great player? My prediction: I think at the end of the day, O'Bryant sneaks into the top five on draft night.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> A few words from Insider (I chopped up the paragraphs and just took out the important facts about each player so if you want the full low down, get INSIDER!)


Yet again more possibilities. My head is spinning now. But if the hype is half of what we're hearing, and if Pax does his job, we're going to get someone good at 16.

Right now I would be thrilled with Roy/Gay or Morrisson at 2 and Simmons/Johnson or Sene at 16. Or if you look at it the other way Bargnani/Aldridge/Thomas at 2 and Thabo/Marquinos or Brewer at 16... So many choices!

I've got to say though, that latest Bargnani clip reinforces the feeling I have that he is going to be really special. He's still my #1.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> A few words from Insider (I chopped up the paragraphs and just took out the important facts about each player so if you want the full low down, get INSIDER!)


And this brings me to another pet peeve -- it would be awesome to get some player analysis that lies somewhere in between the breathless, starry-eyed dispatches of Chad Ford and Jonathan Givony (don't get me wrong, I read them avidly and love their level of access, but fellas, please, a little discernment -- an alien who dropped to earth would think there were sixty future HOFers in this draft class if he had just your writing to go by) and the curmudgeonly Marty Blake and son.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The Roy, thanks a lot for your insider tidbits. Greatly appreciate it here!


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Cool to hear those comments about O'Bryant who I'm obviously a big fan of (see avatar).

In this particular draft, I guess it's not obsurd to think he could vault to #1, only because there isn't a no-brainer #1. Still, O'Bryant is not an athlete of Tyson's caliber; he's a very good athlete for a guy his size but Tyson's natural run-and-jump ability is off the charts. And yes, O'Bryant has more skill than Tyson already but still has a ways to go before he can be a factor offensively in the pros. Funny enough, I don't question O'Bryant's motivation one bit. He's ALWAYS active defensively and absolutely terrorized the Missouri Valley this past year. He sort of has a Duncan-like approach where he's motivated and aggressive except with a calmer demeanor.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ScottMay said:


> And this brings me to another pet peeve -- it would be awesome to get some player analysis that lies somewhere in between the breathless, starry-eyed dispatches of Chad Ford and Jonathan Givony (don't get me wrong, I read them avidly and love their level of access, but fellas, please, a little discernment -- an alien who dropped to earth would think there were sixty future HOFers in this draft class if he had just your writing to go by) and the curmudgeonly Marty Blake and son.


I completely agree. I would definitely like to hear both negatives and positives. They make O'Bryant sound like he could be the next David Robinson, when IMO he'll be more on the level of a Chris Kaman/Brad Miller in his prime (which will be a few years minimum before he reaches that level).


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

They posted negatives, but I only posted small tidbits in fear of getting my post shortened entirely! lol they said things we really already knew though.

How Obryant is raw and ways away from contributing

How Simmons isnt very polished offensively but is a beast on the defensive end.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

The question of O'Bryant's motivation worries me. Maybe in the 'jibbish' environment he will work harder. If the Boozer for Murphy rumored trade does occur, I don't see anyone taking O'Bryant in the top 10. I can see ourself trading up and having a chance to grab him if we grab Roy at 2. 

I don't like the fact that his build is Tyson-ish. I do think he can put on weight better than Tyson, but that has to be done.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> A few words from Insider (I chopped up the paragraphs and just took out the important facts about each player so if you want the full low down, get INSIDER!)



Thanks Roy. If the Bulls draft Brandoy Roy, will you change your handle from The ROY, to Roy?

I actually like Insider even if he gets bashed. But here is my daily patting myself on the back. He mentions Obryant as a potential #1 pick and says no one has done it. Well if you go back about 15 pages on this thread, in one of my rumor posts, I post that people have openly wondered if the kid would go #1 and I put him down on a list of possible #1 overall picks. So, atleast here, there has been one person who has atleast touched on that possibility. :clap: to me.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> More info I hear
> 
> *OBryant is on the way up. Golden State wants him in a fairly big way and might be willing to swap some of their assets to get up to 4 or 6 to get him. If any player could make a late run at finishing #1, it might be him. Similar to the meteroic rise that Olowakandi, Kwame Brown etc. Alot of people think with some work, he could be a Brad Daugherty type, which is really good for those of you too young to remember him*
> 
> Sene is on the way up. He has looked extremely fluid in Belgium recently and his athletic ability is draw dropping. He could go anywhere from 10-16. He is rumored to have a promise between 20-24 but his battling to increase his stock. Toronto likes him. They hired a player personnel whiz from Bennetton Treviso (one of the reasons everyone thinks they love Bargnani) who is rumored to be ready to try and pry Sene from Belgium. Might look for another pick to grab him.
> 
> JJ Redick is still on the way down. Apparently scouts just dont know what he brings outside of shooting, and are unconvinced he is anything more then Steve Alford
> 
> One scout I spoke with still remains convinced that either Gay or Carney falls.
> 
> Rondo has a huge range. Some scouts hate him and have him in the 20s, others have him as high as 6. His stock will probably fluctuate on how well he matches up against a Marcus Williams in a head to head.
> 
> Oleksiy Pecherov is rumored to have a promise in round 1
> 
> Toronto wants to accumulate assets. They like Bargnani but might trade down to get more assets.
> 
> LaMarcus Aldridge is rumored to be Chicagos option 1a if he is available.
> 
> Tyrus Thomas is a player, that as of right now, could fall to 5-7 if he doesnt do well in workouts.
> 
> Shawnee Williams is rumored to have a promise late lottery, which might be why Gay or Carney could fall.
> 
> Seattles draft plans are 100% reliant on Mickael Gelabale. The highly promising swingman has indicated he might not want to come to the US anytime soon so Seattle might concentrate on the wing. If he changes his mind then Seattle will draft for other spots. But this kid would be a top 12 pick in this draft.
> 
> Dee Brown impressed Memphis big time in his workout earlier this week.



:clap: :clap:


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Hi rlucus,

Thanks for the great post. I also agree that if Rando, Simmons, Sene, and Shawne Williams all go in the lotto, as your post suggest and i have read elsewhere, than one of the SG's is going to have to fall out of the lotto and hopefully to us at 16. I can think it would be Gay but i would not be surprised if it is Carney. If all these big man are lottos then Foye could easily to to NO and then unless the jazz take jj instead of carney he could be ours.

david


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

rlucas, thank you!

I would be incredibly happy on draft day if Carney fell into our laps. Man, O'Bryant is moving up quickly. Maybe Minnesota could get a Vet from GSW if they are potential trade partners. I think the big question mark about Gay or Carney falling to us is obviously Houston, Orlando, and NOK.

NOK has two picks. I can see them using one on a big. So, Houston, Orlando, NOK, possibly Utah (if they don't pick Sene) will choose from Shawne Williams, Carney, Gay, and Brewer. One of them should fall to us as giusd said.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Given that many big men are improving their stocks, it would make sense to grab the best one availabe at #2 (Bargnani, Thomas or Aldridge...or O'Bryant, if Pax thinks so) and then hope for Carney, Gay or Brewer. I think it isnt too far fetched to think two of those could be there. 

And Id rather have a Aldridge/Brewer combo than Roy/Sene, for example. Or Roy/AJ.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> Thanks Roy. If the Bulls draft Brandoy Roy, will you change your handle from The ROY, to Roy?
> 
> I actually like Insider even if he gets bashed. But here is my daily patting myself on the back. He mentions Obryant as a potential #1 pick and says no one has done it. Well if you go back about 15 pages on this thread, in one of my rumor posts, I post that people have openly wondered if the kid would go #1 and I put him down on a list of possible #1 overall picks. So, atleast here, there has been one person who has atleast touched on that possibility. :clap: to me.


Secretly..

My name is based off of BRANDON ROY!!!

he's a PLAYER baby!!!!


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## Toxicity

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



fl_flash said:


> Bargnani update...
> 
> 24 mins
> 10 pts
> 2-5 2pt
> 2-4 3pt
> 0-1 FT
> 5 boards (1 offensive)
> 3 blocks and 2 steals (or is it 2 blocks and 3 steals? I'm not reading this Italian box score very well!)
> 1 assist.
> 
> It appears as if he didn't start. Looks like a so-so game from the stats....
> 
> Benneton won 63-55. Up 2 games to 1
> 
> http://195.56.77.208/game/?id=62600


3 blocks
2 turnovers
1 steal

Anyway it was a good game considering he woke up this morning with fever (in fact he didn't start)... plus he was decisive in the last 5 minutes with 7 straight points. All in front of his new american agent: Leon Rose (LBJ, AI, etc)... :cheers:


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

This relates to the draft two years ago. I was shocked that Gordon was called at 3. I was expecting Luol. Did Pax just surprise everyone, or were their signs indicating that he liked Gordon? I have always been into the draft, but more up to date this year than I have in the past. I just wanna compare if Pax showed any signs back then and if he is doing anything now. I was just shocked draft day 2 years ago. 

Thanks.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> This relates to the draft two years ago. I was shocked that Gordon was called at 3. I was expecting Luol. Did Pax just surprise everyone, or were their signs indicating that he liked Gordon? I have always been into the draft, but more up to date this year than I have in the past. I just wanna compare if Pax showed any signs back then and if he is doing anything now. I was just shocked draft day 2 years ago.
> 
> Thanks.


Actually it was a lock that Gordon was his guy. The only question was whether he was going to deal Gordon for Al Harrington since Bird wanted Gordon as well.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> This relates to the draft two years ago. I was shocked that Gordon was called at 3. I was expecting Luol. Did Pax just surprise everyone, or were their signs indicating that he liked Gordon? I have always been into the draft, but more up to date this year than I have in the past. I just wanna compare if Pax showed any signs back then and if he is doing anything now. I was just shocked draft day 2 years ago.
> 
> Thanks.


Try to see if you can find the papers (Chi Tribune, Sun Times) back of that day.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> "When I started this training," Rondo said, "I could lift 185 pounds about twice. Now I can do it seven or eight times." He has used his predraft time to concentrate on his weaknesses. Some draft boards have him rated as high as No. 4. Few believe he will fall further than the last lottery pick at No. 14. Denver Post


sure hope thats true, if JJ goes to Utah like I expect, and Sene is lotto bound we are going to get a solid pick at 16.Couarneygh.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Come on Chad? I've been saying we might need to take O'Bryant at 2. I've been saying to trade Deng to move up to 3 or 4 to draft him after getting Aldridge. 

And doesn't O'Bryant weight like 40-50 pounds more than Tyson?


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## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I was looking at these mocks
hoopsworlds writers mock draft 

The four writers have us taking

LaMarcus Aldridge or Roy at the 2
and

Leon Powe(?), Aaron Gray, Hilton Armstrong or Cedric Simmons at the 16th pick

Interestingly they all have us going big with the second pick


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Man, I don't care how "weak" this draft supposedly is, NO WAY you take O'Bryant with the 1st or 2nd pick.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> Man, I don't care how "weak" this draft supposedly is, NO WAY you take O'Bryant with the 1st or 2nd pick.


I agree, let's be a little bit more ambitious with this pick. When you have a chance for a superstar, you go for it, they don't come along that often. Draft the best player available, I think it's Bargnani, but I'm also open to Thomas and Gay if Pax feels that one of them is going to be the best. You don't draft strictly for need with the second pick, especially if it's for a guy like O'Bryant, who despite all his good qualities is a major reach at #2.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



LegoHat said:


> I agree, let's be a little bit more ambitious with this pick. When you have a chance for a superstar, you go for it, they don't come along that often. Draft the best player available, I think it's Bargnani, but I'm also open to Thomas and Gay if Pax feels that one of them is going to be the best. You don't draft strictly for need with the second pick, especially if it's for a guy like O'Bryant, who despite all his good qualities is a major reach at #2.


OK, today, I'm leaning towards someone who's skilled and will bring offense from the start. So here's my board (subject to change based on latest gossip...)

1. Bargnani (at least I've been constant on this. I think he'll be awesome)
2. Roy (great fit for us, I love big shooting guards who can handle and shoot)
3. Morrisson (can put it in the bucket all night long)
4. Aldridge (post scoring)

The more I think about Tyrus the more leary I get. The fact that his camp is trying so hard right now to sell us that he's really a small forward lets me know his going to measure small (6'8 or 6'7) and may be a tweener. An unskilled small forward and a small power forward.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> Man, I don't care how "weak" this draft supposedly is, NO WAY you take O'Bryant with the 1st or 2nd pick.


I agree, and this coming from a huge O'Bryant fan. 

I could see a jump into the top 5 or 6 though. Currently, most mocks have the top 6 prospects being Bargnani, Thomas, Aldridge, Morrison, Roy, and Gay (O'Bryant is likely #7 behind these guys). But it wouldn't surprise me one bit to see 1 or 2 of those guys slip a little, which would bump O'Bryant up a few spots. What I'm unsure of is who will slip. I suppose Tyrus Thomas is the most likely to fall a few spots, because a) his refusal to work out for teams, b) his measurements might be poor (6'8, 210?), and c) I'm sure people still doubt his skill level. I think Gay and Aldridge could also fall behind O'Bryant as well, if the stars align right on draft day.


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## Sir Patchwork

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



LegoHat said:


> You don't draft strictly for need with the second pick


I don't think you draft for need at all with the 2nd pick. I think in every scenario, you have to take the best player available. The draft is about attaining assets for your team. 

I see it as a situation where you get the most out of it that you possibly can, then sort it out later.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

If we don't draft Tyrus Thomas, I could DEFINITELY see him tumbling, perhaps as far down as Boston or Minnesota.

His official measurements and workout performances will be key, obviously.


----------



## mgolding

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Cedric Simmons anybody?

If we are to go with Roy with the 2nd pick I see no need at all for anyone that isnt an inside player with the 16th. Even if we go with a big with the 2nd pick it wouldnt really surprise anyone if we went big again.

I dont see that there are any big guys likely to make an immediate impact that far down so Id imagine whoever we get will be a bit of a project.

Is Cedric Simmons that project?
(by the way I am calling him a project because we have a big with 5 years experience who it still seems fair to be calling a project)


----------



## mgolding

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1330
- has a cedric simmons report from the last few days of workouts


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



mgolding said:


> Cedric Simmons anybody?
> 
> If we are to go with Roy with the 2nd pick I see no need at all for anyone that isnt an inside player with the 16th. Even if we go with a big with the 2nd pick it wouldnt really surprise anyone if we went big again.
> 
> I dont see that there are any big guys likely to make an immediate impact that far down so Id imagine whoever we get will be a bit of a project.
> 
> Is Cedric Simmons that project?
> (by the way I am calling him a project because we have a big with 5 years experience who it still seems fair to be calling a project)


I don't even know if Simmons will be there at 16, if he is he certainly would be an intriguing pick.


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## mr.ankle20

*why would the bulls waste the # 2 pick on Roy*

He really did not impress me in the ncaa tournament .From what I saw in the tournament he was a decent player but he didnt do one particular thing that wowed me in the tournament. I truely believe drafting Roy with the #2 pick would be just as bad when the warriors drafted mike dunleavy with the third pick . I don't any problems drafting the best player availble , but roy is not the best player available with the second pick in the long term


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## mizenkay

*Re: why would the bulls waste the # 2 pick on Roy*

no surprise really.



> Shannon Brown is keeping his name in the NBA draft and is skipping his senior season at Michigan State, the shooting guard announced Thursday.
> 
> Brown didn't hire an agent when he entered his name in the draft two months ago, leaving open the possibility of staying in college.
> 
> He had been regarded as a player who could be drafted late in the first round or early in the second. But following strong workouts, he has turned into an projected first-round pick.



http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/cs-060608nbabrown,1,7269586.story?coll=cs-home-headlines


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

As of today I am leaning towards addressing size first, Aldridge or Andrea then hopefully landing Thabo Sefolosha or Sene at 16. Thabo's work out yesterday http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1330


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/luke_winn/06/08/tyrus.thomas/index.html

This article indicates that Tyrus has put on eight pounds, although it does not mention what his actual weight is now. This picture shows he has a pretty well developed upper body already. That picture that popped up a month ago still sticks in my head because his legs looked so thin. I don't know if he intends to hold position in the post, but I doubt he has the lower body strength to do that yet. Anyhow, he's clearly a hard worker, and he's got quite a physique.

Miz, you'll probably enjoy this:


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

i'm enjoying that _very_ much.

not where i have my tattoos, but whatever! :smilewink


----------



## Rodman

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'm with you Miz, he looks darn good! We need such pictures of every goodlooking player :biggrin:


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/luke_winn/06/08/tyrus.thomas/index.html
> 
> This article indicates that Tyrus has put on eight pounds, although it does not mention what his actual weight is now. This picture shows he has a pretty well developed upper body already. That picture that popped up a month ago still sticks in my head because his legs looked so thin. I don't know if he intends to hold position in the post, but I doubt he has the lower body strength to do that yet. Anyhow, he's clearly a hard worker, and he's got quite a physique.
> 
> Miz, you'll probably enjoy this:


But then again, Tyson Chandler put on 15 pounds of muscle a few times in his career, so he weighs upwards 270 now.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Wow that was a super article. Man thomas sure does look good.

david


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Don't know if anyone has touched on this, but buried in the Oregon Live article that Narek posted earlier was a mention that LaMarcus Aldridge doesn't want to work out against competition for Portland next week. This concerns me. Tyrus Thomas has indicated pretty much the same, but I don't have questions about his motor or competitive drive. I do with Aldridge. After the LSU - Texas game I'd think he'd be eager to show he can match up with the elite bigs in this draft...


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



jbulls said:


> Don't know if anyone has touched on this, but buried in the Oregon Live article that Narek posted earlier was a mention that LaMarcus Aldridge doesn't want to work out against competition for Portland next week. This concerns me. Tyrus Thomas has indicated pretty much the same, but I don't have questions about his motor or competitive drive. I do with Aldridge. After the LSU - Texas game I'd think he'd be eager to show he can match up with the elite bigs in this draft...


It could be that neither wants to play for Portland, as they would both start out their careers behind Zach Randolf.

All of these workout quirks are most likely the agent's doing than the player being scared. If you're likely a consensus top pick, all your stock can move is down.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Did anyone read the comments about thomas workout. It sounds like he was out of this world.

david


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

From Chad Ford:

_I think that the choice is between Thomas and Roy. The reason has to do with playing philosophy and position. The Bulls prefer Thomas due to his toughness and fast motor. Aldridge is more skilled offensively, at the moment. But Thomas has a big upside. As for Roy, the questions here are whether the Bulls can solve their needs in the frontcourt via free agency, combining him in the backcourt with Hinrich and Gordon. _


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I love the idea of roy but if it is between roy and thomas is has to be thomas. We can get a solid SG at 16 and this draft is rich in SGs but last year we got killed up front and someone like Thomas is someone i dont think pax can pass on. Not after what i read about his workout today.

david


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I love the idea of roy but if it is between roy and thomas is has to be thomas. We can get a solid SG at 16 and this draft is rich in SGs but last year we got killed up front and someone like Thomas is someone i dont think pax can pass on. Not after what i read about his workout today.
> 
> david


What did you read about his workout? Are you talking about the CNNSI article?


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Yes the article from cnnsi was really eye opening. And it was not just his super abilities but how committed he seems and how hard he works. I also say when we talk about upside it should really include how hard someone works at there craft. I always think of Odom. Superstar skills but just doesnt seem that committed. Thomas really seems focused. Now maybe it is all show but it seems everyone (even his LSU coach) all seem to agree how hard a worker he is.

david


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> I love the idea of roy but if it is between roy and thomas is has to be thomas. We can get a solid SG at 16 and this draft is rich in SGs but last year we got killed up front and someone like Thomas is someone i dont think pax can pass on. Not after what i read about his workout today.
> 
> david


I don't see how Thomas is going to stop us from getting killed up front. Do you really think a 6'8" 215 lb guy would have helped us stop Zo and Shaq in the Miami series? Would he have helped stop Kristic if we played NJ? How about Detroit's Wallaces? Cleveland's bigs? Washington's bigs? Dalembert? Orlando's bigs?

This kid isn't going to help defend any of those bigs, now or in the future. He just isn't big enough.

On the offensive end, I have a weakness for players who can shoot the ball. He says he can do this, but we haven't seen it in competition much.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> Yes the article from cnnsi was really eye opening. And it was not just his super abilities but how committed he seems and how hard he works. I also say when we talk about upside it should really include how hard someone works at there craft. I always think of Odom. Superstar skills but just doesnt seem that committed. Thomas really seems focused. Now maybe it is all show but it seems everyone (even his LSU coach) all seem to agree how hard a worker he is.
> 
> david



That's the problem listening to coaches. I remember wanting Odom because of his uber-talent and maturity. His ability to lead. Blah blah Blah.

I agree you have to like what we are seeing, but what else would any of these guys be doing. This is their most important job interview and they get to work on their skils 24/7 for 3 months. Damn, Someone should tell CHandler he's up for being redrafted and we may see a new found dedication from him as well.

If Thomas is nothing more than a spingier Chandler (no offense except putbacks) I don't want him. We don't lose games because of our defense. We lose them because we don't have ANY scoring from our PF/C (not including Noc since he's technically a SF).


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

If Paxson thinks Roy and Thomas can be stars, why doesn't he trade to take both of them? So say Deng and Duhon to Portland for #4. So then at #2, we take Bargnani if he slips through the cracks, because Cats aren't gonna take Thomas imo, so come out with Bargnani and Thomas. But assuming Toronto takes Bargnani, then we take Thomas #2, and then at #4, it comes down to who the Bobcats take, if they take Roy, we go for Aldridge #4, if not then take Roy (again, if he's Paxson's guy). Then, I would say try to unload #16 and Chandler to the Hawks for the #5. Now here is where it can get interesting. We take Thomas #2, and Roy #4. Basically, at #5, it comes down to O'Bryant or Aldridge depending on if Aldridge is still there.

So the premise is we come out with one of these sets:

1. Bargnani, Thomas, Roy
2. Bargnani, Thomas, Aldridge
3. Thomas, Aldridge, Roy
4. Thomas, Roy, O'Bryant
5. Thomas, Aldridge, O'Bryant

So now cross out the first two imo, and we either come out of the draft with these lineups:

PG-Kirk Hinrich/Ben Gordon
SG-Ben Gordon/Brandon Roy
SF-Andres Nocioni/Tyrus Thomas
PF-Tyrus Thomas/Michael Sweetney
C- LaMarcus Aldridge/Michael Sweetney

Thats a 7 man rotation right there, so we'd want to add a center in free agency, so maybe give Nazr a massive ONE year contract.

Or this one

PG-Kirk Hinrich/Ben Gordon
SG-Ben Gordon/Brandon Roy
SF-Andres Nocioni/Tyrus Thomas
PF-Tyrus Thomas/Michael Sweetney
C- Patrick O'Bryant/Michael Sweetney

Primary 7 man rotation, we'd want to add a combo forward like Al Harrington for a massive ONE YEAR deal.

Or we come out with this:

PG-Kirk Hinrich/Ben Gordon
SG-Ben Gordon/
SF-Andres Nocioni/Tyrus Thomas
PF-LaMarcus Aldridge/Tyrus Thomas
C- Patrick O'Bryant/LaMarcus Aldridge

Now this is only a 6 man rotation really, in this one, we need to add another big guy, I guess Sweetney or Schenscher will do, but they aren't heavy hitters in this one. And then we need another shooting guard, maybe a Jason Terry for a massive ONE YEAR contract.

So basically

We Add: Thomas, Roy/Aldridge, O'Bryant/Aldridge

We Lose: Duhon, Chandler, Deng

We Win: We become a more balanced team. And then, this could allow us to become players in the 2007 free agency with a better crop.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I agree everyone agreed that odom had great talent but i dont think anyone said he had maturity. As a matter of fact he refused to workout of the bulls as i recal and did several other things that raised some big time red flags. As i recal airhead was wispered around and IMHO they were correct. To this day odom is a great talent but is just missing something. This is his 3rd team and he almost got traded last year. 

I also agree that Thomas and Roy would be fantastic but i cant think how we could do this.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> he picked balls up off the floor near the block and then dunked them with such force that the basket's entire ceiling-support system was shaking.


BEAST

That's a good article, he sounds like the type of player Skiles would love to mold.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> BEAST


I'm not crazy about Thomas but I have to say the quote about him physically impressing even more than Reggie Bush (or something like that) has got me intrigued...


----------



## fleetwood macbull

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> he picked balls up off the floor near the block and then dunked them with such force that the basket's entire ceiling-support system was shaking.





The ROY said:


> BEAST
> 
> That's a good article, he sounds like the type of player Skiles would love to mold.


that sounds like the draft workout drill that Shawn Kemp was doing that impressed everybody


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I must agree i do think that Thomas does remind me of a young Shawn Kemp. They are the same height and both have that super quick explosive jumping ability. The also both have that edge and i think that is really important it pushes a player to improve.

david


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I could be potentially bamboozled...But man...T2's quotes ALONE have sold me.

This kid is putting on 8 lbs. of muscle ALREADY?!..

In an environment where physical abilities are close to ones peers...It's ALWAYS the little things that seperate the special ones from the pack.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



smARTmouf said:


> I could be potentially bamboozled...But man...T2's quotes ALONE have sold me.
> 
> This kid is putting on 8 lbs. of muscle ALREADY?!..
> 
> In an environment where physical abilities are close to ones peers...It's ALWAYS the little things that seperate the special ones from the pack.



Here's the problems I have getting completely on board the Thomas train:

1. Is he 6'8" or 6'9" in shoes? 6'8" is a problem, not because he can't outjump our outhustle, but because he will have to play that way on every play and few do. His reach is more important, ala Elton Brand. He is also not bulky and adding 40 lbs., and not having it affect other aspects of your game is tough task. In College you can out athlete your oponent, not as easy to do int he NBA.


2. So far, he's a hustle and self made player, not a talented player. I know that should be good, but how many times did we outhustle only to lose to the more talented team. It a little difficult to judge since he was a team player, but his offensive game is nothing that Arron Gray can't do, except that Thomas flys through the air doing it.

3. Guys bash Wilcox cause "he only did it for half a season". Well, Thomas only played "lottery worthy" for about 15 games, albeit imporatant games. So, I question his consistency and ability to step it up again at a much higher and more competitive level quickly. The same can be said of Aldridge and Bargnani (though to a lesser extent).

4. Does he "have", not "can he develop" an offensive game. I know it will infuriate, but Chandler in workouts was told he couldn't hzndle the ball with his left hand, so he worked hard on it and improved it prior to the draft. Develpoment is not a strength of the Bulls organization. So, unless we hire Livingston and/or Kareem to work with guys, It's less about "potential" for me now, than about who is more developed.

5. I love Bravado and confidence, but this guy has been all over the place with his. 

In the end, I must admit I'm as concerned about who we get at 16, if not moreso, since I think that any of the top 4 are inter-changeable risk V reward guys.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Guys bash Wilcox cause "he only did it for half a season". Well, Thomas only played "lottery worthy" for about 15 games....


Great point. 

In general, I think we all rationalize our opinions in life -- even if they're good opinions.


----------



## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

If we grab Roy with the 2nd pick, who do you think we should grab at 16?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

All the decent bigs will be gone by 16. We'll end up grabbing Hilton.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> 1. Is he 6'8" or 6'9" in shoes? 6'8" is a problem, not because he can't outjump our outhustle, but because he will have to play that way on every play and few do. His reach is more important, ala Elton Brand. He is also not bulky and adding 40 lbs., and not having it affect other aspects of your game is tough task. In College you can out athlete your oponent, not as easy to do int he NBA.


The combination of wing-span and his quick leaping ability eases this concern for me...But certainly, I have a hard time swallowing the idea of T2 as our PF...I've always thought he was more of a SF, and recent reports seem to be proving me right...But if anyone can prove me wrong, it's a kid with the desire to take someones soul, as he so elegantly put it, when referring to McRoberts...It's a kid That dunks emphatically then hustles down the court to block a lay-up...It's a kid that, if he loses, will fight you til he wins, then fight you til you get the idea that he's gonna win everytime you fight from now on...You just can't teach this stuff...His intangibles are grade A...If anyone is going to make good on their potential, it's going to be a kid like Tyrus...I'll completely re-think my way of evaluating talent if I'm wrong on my gut on this one....



> 2. So far, he's a hustle and self made player, not a talented player. I know that should be good, but how many times did we outhustle only to lose to the more talented team. It a little difficult to judge since he was a team player, but his offensive game is nothing that Arron Gray can't do, except that Thomas flys through the air doing it.


I believe his talent goes beyond physical...He has all the pieces necessary to put his attributes together and torture his opponent...You say we lost to talented teams...Sure, but we also beat a lot of teams we shouldn't have because of that same hustle and fight...I'll rather have a gritty unit that won't quit, than a talented team that's quick to back down ANY DAY....T2, IMO, is a talented player dripping with potential with the heart of Genghis Khan....And no way should A. Gray and...*breath*....Tyrus Thomas be mentioned in the same breath...Completely different player



> 3. Guys bash Wilcox cause "he only did it for half a season". Well, Thomas only played "lottery worthy" for about 15 games, albeit imporatant games. So, I question his consistency and ability to step it up again at a much higher and more competitive level quickly. The same can be said of Aldridge and Bargnani (though to a lesser extent).


Great points...Again...I feel once the opponets start landing harder blows, those that hearts disappear like a fart in the wind, crumble...I don't believe it's in Tyrus to back down.



> 4. Does he "have", not "can he develop" an offensive game. I know it will infuriate, but Chandler in workouts was told he couldn't hzndle the ball with his left hand, so he worked hard on it and improved it prior to the draft. Develpoment is not a strength of the Bulls organization. So, unless we hire Livingston and/or Kareem to work with guys, It's less about "potential" for me now, than about who is more developed.


SMH @ Chandler...To me, he just doesn't want it...Like Livingston said...He doesn't even want the ball on offense...How are you gonna get better if you don't have confidence in yourself?...Man...Tyson really ticks me off.



> 5. I love Bravado and confidence, but this guy has been all over the place with his.


Yeah...He's so consistent with it though...A guy like Rudy seems to just have come out of no where with his bravado...When Roy stepped to him...I coulda swore I saw a pink thong underneath his shorts.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Speaking of out of no where...

This kid from FSU sounds good...I missed the boat during the season on him...I can't even remember his name.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think it's kinda hard to question Thomas's consistency for a few Reasons. He says he felt like he played out of position in his first year. Prior to LSU, he was more of a ballhandler.

His coach told him to worry about the little things (blocking, rebounding) and leave the scoring to Darrel Mitchell & Glen Davis so he wouldn't feel pressured his first season. Regardless of this, he still managed to score in double figures 21 times out of the 31 games he played, all while shooting 60% for the season. Now, if he played SF all season and had MORE of a scorer's role, there might not even be a question who the #1 pick is.

I feel like a 2nd season at LSU would of gave us all a better chance to evaluate who he REALLY is as a player. With that said, if he wants to be a SF, I don't want him. Randy Livingston seems to think he'll play PF though so, I dunno.

He's still my favorite prospect but him wanting to be a '3' is my only problem with taking him.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

If he thinks he's a three...Tyson is an all-star Caliber Center.

You have to be able to shoot from beyond 7 Feet. 

Again, Thomas is such an enigma. I'll be fine with him chosen, but if we do..hell no matter WHO we draft, Paxson and JR need to get some coaches in here to develop these guys.


PS - Thomas and your dumb agents.......The Bulls don't need a 3 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They need a dominant four who will excel at both ends of the floor.


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## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> He's still my favorite prospect but him wanting to be a '3' is my only problem with taking him.


I have a problem with that too. But I guess I trust Pax on this one.

I trust that if Paxon drafts Thomas, that means he can be a good interior player. Based on good sound scouting. I trust that if Pax finds out that Thomas is a tweener he won't draft him. Everyone on this board knows that that's the last thing we need, and Pax does too.

Now here's the good news. If Thomas measures up at 6,9 or over with a huge wingspan. If he can indeed play inside but also shows a bit more skills than expected, than thomas is probably going to be a monster in this league.

In Pax we trust.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

?

I recall Tyrus shooting 15-18 foot jumpers ALL last season. Was that his go-to? no but he can hit it.

He actually showed alot of SF like abilities, which is why I could see some comparing him to Marion at times. The rest of the time he was more like a Kenyon/Swift type player.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Yeah, and Marcus Fizer could be moved to SF.
Jamal Crawford could be a SG.
Kirk Hinrich could be a SG.
Ben Gordon could be a PG.


Yeah, we can stick them there and they can play minutes effective there at one end of the floor. 

Honestly, I'm hoping he can shoot much better than we have seen.

I live in So. Cal. and saw about 5-6 of Chandler's games his Sr. year of high school and let me tell you ... he could shoot the ball much better than we've seen in the NBA. Unfortunately, again, it comes down to doing against big, strong, athletic guys that are as talented and athletic as you.

As for Thomas hitting some outside shots, yes, but no often or consistent enough. Again, he was not as dominant as he should've been throughout the season.....reminds me of Aldridge, Bargnani, Gay and almost everyone in this draft. I'm not trying to bash him, just saying I'm very concerned about these things.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> Yeah, and Marcus Fizer could be moved to SF.
> Jamal Crawford could be a SG.
> Kirk Hinrich could be a SG.
> Ben Gordon could be a PG.
> 
> 
> Yeah, we can stick them there and they can play minutes effective there at one end of the floor.
> 
> Honestly, I'm hoping he can shoot much better than we have seen.
> 
> I live in So. Cal. and saw about 5-6 of Chandler's games his Sr. year of high school and let me tell you ... he could shoot the ball much better than we've seen in the NBA. Unfortunately, again, it comes down to doing against big, strong, athletic guys that are as talented and athletic as you.
> 
> As for Thomas hitting some outside shots, yes, but no often or consistent enough. Again, he was not as dominant as he should've been throughout the season.....reminds me of Aldridge, Bargnani, Gay and almost everyone in this draft. I'm not trying to bash him, just saying I'm very concerned about these things.


hell, i'm concerned too...

it's really a bunch of "if's"..cause if aldridge had a pg like marcus williams, he woulda averaged 20 and 10...

bargnani's looked cool in clips but his recent statlines have been very 'lorenzen wright' like...and they're in the playoffs, i expected a bit more out of him..

i still think a star will emerge out of these big's sooner or later though...

i'd put my money on bargnani & thomas


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> ?
> 
> I recall Tyrus shooting 15-18 foot jumpers ALL last season. Was that his go-to? no but he can hit it.
> 
> He actually showed alot of SF like abilities, which is why I could see some comparing him to Marion at times. The rest of the time he was more like a Kenyon/Swift type player.


You were watching LSU games all of last season?


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Is sat the day everyone gets measured in Orlando. I also agree that if thomas is 6'8" that is a problem but if he is 6'9" with a longer reach than he will be playing PF in the NBA. Also the bulls run a lot of pick and roll with there big men and if Thomas can roll to the basket and finish, like Amare, than again i think it more likely he goes to the bulls.

david


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



jbulls said:


> You were watching LSU games all of last season?


I mainly caught the games for Big Baby.......

And yeah, I wathed quite a few of their games...


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> Is sat the day everyone gets measured in Orlando. I also agree that if thomas is 6'8" that is a problem but if he is 6'9" with a longer reach than he will be playing PF in the NBA. Also the bulls run a lot of pick and roll with there big men and if Thomas can roll to the basket and finish, like Amare, than again i think it more likely he goes to the bulls.
> 
> david


Elton Brand's 6'8", and he is was as good as any other powerforward in the league (although, if he was 7'0", he' easily be a first ballot hall of famer)....If Tyrus Thomas has the drive, he can get it done. I've seen some videos where he looks like he may be 6'9". He looks like he has a good wingspan though, the only problem is that he won't be able to see over a Duncan in the post.

btw, can we get a new big man coach in Chicago? Someone has to demonstrate how easily the ball goes in if you bounce it off the glass.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> Elton Brand's 6'8", and he is was as good as any other powerforward in the league (although, if he was 7'0", he' easily be a first ballot hall of famer)....If Tyrus Thomas has the drive, he can get it done. I've seen some videos where he looks like he may be 6'9". He looks like he has a good wingspan though, the only problem is that he won't be able to see over a Duncan in the post.
> 
> btw, can we get a new big man coach in Chicago? Someone has to demonstrate how easily the ball goes in if you bounce it off the glass.



Elton Brand had a huge wingspan if I remember correctly.

The ball should also never be brought down to the small guys level. of course, they should also be taught to just "CATCH THE DAMN BALL"!

Not many see over Duncan.

I do think that Thomas is a very good candidate to play pick and roll and be Amare like with it.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> Elton Brand's 6'8", and he is was as good as any other powerforward in the league (although, if he was 7'0", he' easily be a first ballot hall of famer)....


If Ben Gordon was 7'0" he'd easily be a first ballot hall of famer...


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Magic Looking to Trade Up: Like Carney 



> The Orlando Magic took a closer look Thursday at players who should be available if they make the No. 11 pick as expected in the NBA draft this month.
> 
> Yet their sights still are set higher.
> 
> "I'm comfortable at 11, but we're trying to get up a couple picks ahead of us,'' said Magic General Manager Otis Smith. "It's a realistic goal. There are teams trying to move down, so I wouldn't be surprised if we get in there.''
> 
> Smith said the Magic would like to pick in the 6-7-8 range -- spots currently held by the Timberwolves, Celtics and Rockets -- which would create a different set of available players.
> 
> Guards Rodney Carney (Memphis), Ronnie Brewer (Arkansas) and Randy Foye (Villanova) -- who all are expected to be picked in the 9-15 range on draft night -- were among those in a private workout at RDV Sportsplex on Thursday.
> 
> Also, there were guard Mardy Collins (Temple), guard Quincy Douby (Rutgers), guard Hassan Adams (Arizona) and forward Shawne Williams (Memphis). The Magic also have two (and possibly a third if they want it) second-round picks. Most of the Magic staff has been at the NBA pre-draft camp this week at Disney's Wide World of Sports, along with the staffs of the other 29 NBA teams. The Magic shuttled back between sessions for the private workout.
> 
> "Carney is a physical specimen,'' Smith said. "I think he could be special, a real good player in this league. Brewer is pretty talented. He gets the whole picture. Some of the things he does, you can see his dad [former NBA player Ron Brewer] in him."


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## BULLS23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> Elton Brand's 6'8", and he is was as good as any other powerforward in the league (although, if he was 7'0", he' easily be a first ballot hall of famer)....If Tyrus Thomas has the drive, he can get it done. I've seen some videos where he looks like he may be 6'9". He looks like he has a good wingspan though, the only problem is that he won't be able to see over a Duncan in the post.
> 
> btw, can we get a new big man coach in Chicago? Someone has to demonstrate how easily the ball goes in if you bounce it off the glass.


Elton Brand is also 260 and strong like Ox . . . He's put in plenty of work on his midrange game and that's where he scores most of his points, but that weight helps on defense. I honestly don't think Tyrus is the best fit for the team because from what I've seen of his game last year (we saw our fair share due to living in Atlanta) he's certainly no banger; notice I didn't say he wasn't tough or able to play D or anything, but he didn't guard many 6'10" 240 - 275 pound guys playin at LSU. And I think he'll see plenty of that in the league. I also am concerned that he can be the same player at 245 (or even get to 245). He'll be a great player where ever he goes, but I don't like him for the Bulls at this point.


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## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

what happen to the lamarcus alridge hype ? Most mock drafts have the bulls taking thomas or roy .


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Pick 2: I want Aldridge or Bargnani. I'll be happy with either. I would accept Roy as our pick. But I hope we have a trade in works to move up from 16 to get a big man if we draft Roy.

Pick 16: Really hoping Carney or Brewer falls to us. Otherwise, I like this Thabo guy. I'm hoping one of the top swingman drop to us.


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## Pain5155

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Bulls need Adam Morrison for his scoring ability, they should try to trade their other 1st round pick, and maybe Tyson Chandler to get a higher pick in hte top 5, and get Aldridge or Baragni.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Dont know if these pics have been posted. If so, please delete them:













LOL, I know many people love to draw conclusions from pics, so what do you think about Tyrus and his body?


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## McBulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Pain5155 said:


> Bulls need Adam Morrison for his scoring ability, they should try to trade their other 1st round pick, and maybe Tyson Chandler to get a higher pick in hte top 5, and get Aldridge or Baragni.


It will be interesting to see Morrison and Gay face off against each other later this month. 

Morrison is the best offensive player in this draft. If he's able to do a respectable job of defending Gay, the Bulls should grab him at #2 in spite of health concerns. It would be obtuse to pass on a guy with Larry Bird shooting and leadership credentials who could also hold his own on defense.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



McBulls said:


> It will be interesting to see Morrison and Gay face off against each other later this month.
> 
> Morrison is the best offensive player in this draft. If he's able to do a respectable job of defending Gay, the Bulls should grab him at #2 in spite of health concerns. It would be obtuse to pass on a guy with Larry Bird shooting and leadership credentials who could also hold his own on defense.



It's the hold his own on defense part I would be worried about. I think Morrisson could be a great NBA scorer but I expect he will have faster guards and sf's blowing by him and scoring themselves.


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## McBulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



ace20004u said:


> It's the hold his own on defense part I would be worried about. I think Morrisson could be a great NBA scorer but I expect he will have faster guards and sf's blowing by him and scoring themselves.


Well, Rudy Gay is purportedly a sf who should be capable of blowing by Morrison (or anyone else) at will. If he does that in the workout, I guess the question of Morrison's defensive abilities is answered. On the other hand, if he shows the lateral quickness and anticipation that frustrates or stops Gay often, you have to conclude that Morrison is the pick of this year's litter.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Finally! A concrete, indisputable piece of information regarding a draft prospect.










We now know for sure that John Elway can't stop Tyrus Thomas's dribble.


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Elway or Rudy T? :biggrin:


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## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Magic Looking to Trade Up: Like Carney
> 
> "I'm comfortable at 11, but we're trying to get up a couple picks ahead of us,'' said Magic General Manager Otis Smith. "*It's a realistic goal. There are teams trying to move down*, so I wouldn't be surprised if we get in there.''


This is what I'm hoping for. No matter who we take at #2, I want us to try and move up from pick 16. This seems like a great year to move up, as teams are more than willing to move their picks. I'd target Brewer or Simmons in a trade up, depending what we do with the Knicks pick. 

I also get the feeling Tyrus Thomas could slide if we don't take him at #2, especially if he limits his workouts to a small number of teams. The next team who would take him after us would probably be Minnesota at pick 6, but they're trying to move that pick. I could also see them taking Marcus Williams or Gay at that spot. 

If we could pull off Thomas AND Roy, I'd be thrilled. If it takes a combination of #16, Sweets, Duhon, Knicks 2nd rounders, our 2008 1st rounder (limited protection) to get it done, I'm all for it.


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## andras

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



rlucas4257 said:


> The Mavs have set up a camp in Africa and apparently this guy has come through there a few times. He is a freaky 6-9 240 pounder Ivory Coast (looking like a very athletic culture recently) product who plays in the french league and might be a big steal. They know about him because they scout Africa, like Mbenga.


hi rlucas!

Mbenga only started playing basketball in Belgium. so Dallas can't know him from scouting in Africa
it also sounds more logical to me they know this Traore guy from his play in France, and not from Ivory Coast

love your posts though!
Andras


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Maybe Paxson should trade next years Knicks pick (with the pick swap), unprotected for a top 5 pick, similiar to the Deng trade a few years ago. Say its to Minnesota for #6.

With the #1 pick in the NBA draft, the Toronto Raptors select.......Andrea Bargnani.

WIth the #2 pick in the 2006 NBA Draft, the Chicago Bulls select, LaMarcus Aldridge from Texas.

With the #3 pick in the 2006 NBA Draft, the Charlotte Bobcats select.......

Now lets take a look at this.

You have Tyrus Thomas, Adam Morrisson, Rudy Gay. You get one of these 3 players at #6.

Then if you trade for #7 or #8 from the Celtics or Rockets, we get a chance at Patrick O'Bryant or Brandon Roy.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Too many young guys...

I don't think Pax is interested in getting younger...

You have to protect the 2007 pick up to like, 20, there's too many good players in that draft...


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Pain5155 said:


> Bulls need Adam Morrison for his scoring ability, they should try to trade their other 1st round pick, and maybe Tyson Chandler to get a higher pick in hte top 5, and get Aldridge or Baragni.


The Bulls score just fine on the perimeter...we don't NEED morrison


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Funny how the draft is only 3 weeks away and we have no idea what the first four picks will be. But i know pax wants to go big. I have not heard a word about Aldridge on any of the rumors pages. I still think pax is going to trade our of 2 down to 5 to get Roy and then trade up to get one of the bag men. Or take Thomas and trade up to get brewer. Either way we need two players, a big and big SG and they have to be filled in this years draft.

Anyone heard about the JO and the 17 from the pacers to the raptors for the 1st pick and CV.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> Funny how the draft is only 3 weeks away and we have no idea what the first four picks will be. But i know pax wants to go big. I have not heard a word about Aldridge on any of the rumors pages. I still think pax is going to trade our of 2 down to 5 to get Roy and then trade up to get one of the bag men. Or take Thomas and trade up to get brewer. Either way we need two players, a big and big SG and they have to be filled in this years draft.
> 
> Anyone heard about the JO and the 17 from the pacers to the raptors for the 1st pick and CV.
> 
> david


That makes no sense for Toronto...why have two similar players in JO and CB? That's a disaster waiting to happen...but here';s some other rumors



> The latest Raptors rumor buzzing around the gym has the Raptors talking with the Bucks about a deal that would bring Toronto native Jamaal Magloire and Maurice Williams to Toronto for Charlie Villanueva or the No. 1 pick (the Raptors can make this deal because they'll be under the cap).
> 
> That trade would allow the Raptors to take care of their needs at center and the point and still retain either Villanueva or the No. 1 pick. If they were to keep Villanueva or draft Andrea Bargnani to play the three, Toronto would be set at essentially every position. The long-term risk is that both Magloire and Williams hit free agency next summer and might cost the Raptors too much money to re-sign.


That's a pretty good trade for Milwaukee...Charlie or someone like Gay or Thomas would be insane for them...

G Ford
G Redd
F Charlie, Gay or Thomas
F Smith
C Bogut

that makes ALOT of sense for T.O. too...they get a banger in magloire, still get to draft their coveted player in bargnani, and they get a pretty GOOD pass-first pg in williams

G Mo Williams
G Mo Peterson
F Bargnani
F Bosh
C Magloire


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Especially since Magloire has yearned to play for Toronto. They also get a point guard in Mo Williams who had a great year. I think Milwaukee ends up picking Tyrus Thomas if they get #1. It's the last position they have to fill --> Bogut, TT or CV, Simmons, Redd, Ford.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Especially since Magloire has yearned to play for Toronto. They also get a point guard in Mo Williams who had a great year. I think Milwaukee ends up picking Tyrus Thomas if they get #1. It's the last position they have to fill --> Bogut, TT or CV, Simmons, Redd, Ford.


That would crush me...losing TT to another team in the CENTRAL?

Ford/Bogut/Redd/Thomas? They'd be a contender some years down the line.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

What about Chandler, Duhon, and 16 for either Villanueva or #1?

Either way we make LaMarcus Aldridge our pick to play some center, but if its for #1, take Ty and LA.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> What about Chandler, Duhon, and 16 for either Villanueva or #1?


That's a bit much for either charlie or the #1

But I'd personally do it just to land two big's...

Aldridge & Thomas, or Bargnani

You get younger but if you land two big's in FA, you make up for it and add a TON of talent.

Knowing Pax, he'd get one of the big's then grab Roy with the other pick.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Paul Davis was the most effective center in the NCAA last season, according to CBS: 

Rankings:

1: Paul Davis
2: Kevin Pittsnogle
3: Cedric Simmons 
4: Eric Williams
5: Yemi Nicholson
6: Michael Southall
7: Kenny Adeleke
8: Aaron Gray
9: Ian Vouyoukas
10: Joseph Jones

Other notables:

14: Roy Hibbert 
20: Patrick O'Bryant 
113: John Bunch (he is 7-2/320, yikes!)


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## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/basketball/273470_sonx10.html?source=rss 



> *Sonics mull trading first-round selection*
> 
> As the NBA predraft camp came to a conclusion Friday at Walt Disney World and the Sonics resigned themselves to the fact their potential first-round pick wasn't here, club officials left Orlando leaning heavily toward trading the 10th pick in the June 28 draft.
> 
> Sonics officials appear convinced that no player they could land at No. 10 could break into their playing rotation.
> 
> Although the Sonics won just 35 games this season, they don't have any pressing needs in the draft.
> 
> Club officials are considering moving down in the first round and taking a project who can sharpen his skills in the National Basketball Development League.
> 
> With two second-round picks and Frenchman Mickael Gelabale expected to be in camp in October, the Sonics apparently believe they have enough young players in the fold.
> 
> "The D-League is going to 12 teams and we can stock it with young players," general manager Rick Sund said this week. "A lot of this (evaluation) becomes more important in developing guys for the future. We are fine with that."


Seattle's pick (10th) would be an excellent spot to move up from 16 and land Ronnie Brewer or Cedric Simmons. It sounds like the Sonics are willing to stash whomever they draft in the NBDL for a year. Our 16th pick would be a nice spot for the Sonics to grab a raw prospect like Sene for example. Dropping from pick 10 to 16 would also save the Sonics some cash. 

Would our 16th pick, 3M cash, and both of New York's 2nd rounders in 2007 and 2009 be enough for Seattle? It would certainly be an attractive offer financially.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I totally think that brewer would be there at 10. My dream draft is still Thomas and Brewer. I think Brewer's length and combo skills would be perfect for the bulls. Add that to a big man and we finally have a solid 7 man rotation. And next year we use the knicks pick to add our 8 player and we will be set.

I just wish we had more info about the big men in this draft. 

david


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Augustine frustrated by Predraft Camp

http://www.suntimes.com/output/bulls/cst-spt-bull10.html



> ORLANDO, Fla. -- James Augustine, the 6-10, 235-pound Illinois forward who has been projected anywhere from a late first-round pick to late second-round pick, sounded a bit discouraged Friday about the games at the NBA's predraft camp.
> 
> "As games went on, it kind of got out of control a little bit,'' said Augustine, who had a double-double in one game. ''People were getting down on each other and stuff like that instead of just playing basketball.
> 
> "I wish I could have done a little bit more. In this type of atmosphere, it's like playing in the Nike or Adidas camps again: The shots are going up; there's really not much ball movement. It's not a real game almost, so it's kind of hard to show what you can really do in a game situation.''
> 
> Augustine has worked out for 10 teams. He will work out for Phoenix and the Bulls this week.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Other news from Camp, from the same link:



> Justin Williams, who was Eddy Curry's backup at Thornwood, helped his stock by blocking eight shots in one game.
> 
> ''That's what I came out there to do, show everybody what I can do,'' said the 6-10, 225-pound forward from Wyoming, who finished his senior season with an average of 11 rebounds (sixth nationally) and 5.4 blocks (second nationally).
> 
> ''Coming from a small conference [Mountain West], I felt like I had to come out here and prove what I did in conference against the top players in the country.''
> 
> Williams has worked out for Washington, Portland, Denver and Memphis and is headed to Detroit this week.
> 
> Blake Schilb, the junior forward from Loyola, came to Orlando thinking he was a lock to be back at school for his senior season. Now he thinks it's a 50-50 proposition after what Jim Whitesell, his college coach, has heard from NBA types this week.
> 
> ''He was here and telling me he was hearing nothing but positive reviews,'' said Schilb, who must make his decision by June 18. ''At the same time, you can't go based on that. You don't want to risk it and not be able to come back to school. It would probably have to be a first-round [pick] guaranteed [to leave school]. Other than that, I wouldn't have my degree. It would be harder to find a job in that situation. It's up in the air right now; I can't really call it.''
> 
> Sean Dockery, the former Julian and Duke guard, battled through the final day of the camp while nursing a headache and pulled hamstring. Dockery, who likely needed to impress here to become a second-round selection, was nearly knocked out when he had a head-to-head collision with Mustafa Shakur in a game Thursday. Dockery, who has already worked out for the Bulls, didn't even think of quitting because of injuries.
> 
> ''It's a once-in-a-lifetime experience,'' he said.
> 
> The 6-2, 185-pound prospect said statistics weren't what he was about at this camp.
> 
> ''Just making people better,'' Dockery said of his pre-camp goal. ''People really didn't see me play point guard too much at Duke because I always shared [the position]. Most point guards come out here to try and score. I know that in the NBA I won't be a scorer the first couple of years. So I have to lead the team, and that's what I did.''


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

When do we get measurements?


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I think today (measurements).


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

_no measurements yet._

but nbadraft.net has updated it's mock. 


tyrus thomas @ 2

aaron gray @ 16.

(never heard of him.)


they also have updated draft camp player evaluations here


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Passing on Brewer for Gray? :clown:


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> Passing on Brewer for Gray? :clown:



Exactly,

if you waste a pick on on Gray prior to 25 you get what you deserve - FIRED.

Just one more example of those guys not knowing the teams, just the players.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Draft express posted a bunch of player interviews, mostly from potential lotto picks. Alot of the generic stuff, but I have to point out Tyrus Thomas! My gosh, he sounds genuinely peeved against Draft express...for some reason I can't copy and paste their text, but make sure to check out Tyrus' entire interview.

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1336

Oh yeah, and it's HIGHLY notable that Tyrus Thomas specifically said that he sees himself as a *small forward*. IMO, he'll probably become a combo-forward like Danny Granger or Marion, but that doesn't make much sense for us with Deng and Noch on board.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

LaMarcus Aldridge 6'11" 235 pounds in shoes.

Shelden Williams, 6'7 3/4 w/o shoes, just under 6'9" in them. 250 pounds.

Tyrus Thomas just seems like a real *******, honestly. Considering we have 2 small forwards who will probaly be better than him the duration of his career, good riddance and have fun on your slide if Portland doesn't take you.


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Not exactly an interview that screams maturity on Thomas' part. The irony is that I think DraftExpress had him too low at 7, but that he may be talking himself into that becoming a possibility.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Who in the hell is minding Tyrus Thomas and why haven't they told him to quit saying, "I wanna be a three; I'm a three!" 

Maybe that new nbadraft.net mock'll keep Gray in the draft. The last thing I read suggested he was leaning toward going back to school.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I have been really high on Thomas but i must agree his interview screamed of immaturity. He thinks his best position is at SF. i just dont see that. If you look at his stats last year the one thing that really stands out is he had a lot of TO per minute. That is fine for a PF but that does not suggest to me he is a SF. Paxson must be really nervous reading something like that. I agree Thomas agent needs to either stop these kind of interviews or Thomas thinks he is some kind of swing foward.

david


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

If Aaron Gray stays in school, I feel sorry from him.

They have Thabo in the 2nd round still, no Justin Williams, and Sene going 30.

If this is how the draft is gonna go, then we should trade #16 to Portland for 30 and 31, and take Sene at 30 and Thabo at 31....of course its not gonna go like this.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

On the other hand, Marlen Garcia's just out with a piece that says Thomas and Gay blew people away today during the testing:



> Tyrus Thomas came across as shy and reserved Saturday when he and several other potential lottery picks for the June 28 NBA draft met with reporters at a resort.
> 
> But earlier, during individual testing, Thomas was said to be off the charts with enthusiasm and athleticism.
> 
> "He's a crazy athlete," Connecticut's Rudy Gay said. "He can do so many things."
> 
> This no doubt will impress the Bulls, who are considering selecting Thomas with the No. 2 pick.
> 
> Thomas, a 6-foot-9-inch power forward from LSU, and Gay, a 6-9 small forward, were striking with their running vertical leap, players said.
> 
> "They really impressed everybody," Ronnie Brewer of Arkansas said.
> 
> In interviews, Thomas had little to say, but he left no questions about his confidence.
> 
> Asked about the ceiling for his potential, he said: "If I keep working hard, there's no limit. You can't limit yourself. If I tell you I can only reach a certain point, I'd be belittling myself."



http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...thomas,1,4541868.story?coll=cs-home-headlines


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Did anyone read the LaMarcus Aldridge interview? He said his sky hook would be his go to move pretty much. Not bad. Said he models his game after Duncan and KG, tries to understand the game better.

If Paxson doesn't draft Aldridge #2, I'll be upset.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



yodurk said:


> Draft express posted a bunch of player interviews, mostly from potential lotto picks. Alot of the generic stuff, but I have to point out Tyrus Thomas! My gosh, he sounds genuinely peeved against Draft express...for some reason I can't copy and paste their text, but make sure to check out Tyrus' entire interview.
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1336
> 
> Oh yeah, and it's HIGHLY notable that Tyrus Thomas specifically said that he sees himself as a *small forward*. IMO, he'll probably become a combo-forward like Danny Granger or Marion, but that doesn't make much sense for us with Deng and Noch on board.



Great interviews to read. If I based it off the interviews - Aldridge would be the guy easily. Workout everyday against an All-star big and learning from him is huge.

Fortunately for Thomas......interviews are just interviews. Plus, if you read ten interviews he comes off different in each one. I'm not gonna throw the towel in on him just yet, but we can get ANOTHER (as if we needed one) 3/4 combo without costing anything by signing Harrington. So, unless he's just trying to combat the "he can't shoot outside of 5 feet group", he's slipping on my list.

Chandler has crazy athleticism as well and it isn't enough. Plus, your always one injury away from losig that athleticism.

Looking forward to measurements being released.

Is it possible that thomas is gonna measure out below 6'9" and is selling himself as a combo to fend off the not big enough suggestions?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

As much as Thomas' whineness is annoying, that me against the world attitude prove them all wrong attitude can motivate players to succeed (e.g. Gilbert Arenas). 

That said, I'm not sure I want to draft a big who thinks he's a SF.


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## Aesop

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Roy's interview came across Jibish.


----------



## Like A Breath

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



mizenkay said:


> _no measurements yet._
> 
> but nbadraft.net has updated it's mock.
> 
> 
> tyrus thomas @ 2
> 
> aaron gray @ 16.
> 
> (never heard of him.)
> 
> 
> they also have updated draft camp player evaluations here


Aaron Gray is the definition of "Stiff".

Anybody who drafts him might as well give their pick away.


----------



## Aesop

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I guess nbadraft.net got that Douby promise wrong.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Aesop said:


> I guess nbadraft.net got that Douby promise wrong.



So CHicago will "pass the Douby".........."Drugs are bad mmmKay"


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> Is it possible that thomas is gonna measure out below 6'9" and is selling himself as a combo to fend off the not big enough suggestions?


That's what I think. I also think he's trying to promote his versatility, which hasn't been publicized at all.

I'm in no means writing off Thomas, but if he measures out small I'm not sure we can take him and be happy about it.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> Draaft Express : Say I'm a GM, why do I draft you?
> 
> Thomas : You're not a GM, I Don't have to sell myself to you


Ughh..don't want that kid...that wasn't even called for...

Plus he think's he's a SF? No thanks

Aldridge is my #1 right now, Roy & Bargnani follow behind him.


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## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



sloth said:


> Did anyone read the LaMarcus Aldridge interview? He said his sky hook would be his go to move pretty much. Not bad. Said he models his game after Duncan and KG, tries to understand the game better.
> 
> If Paxson doesn't draft Aldridge #2, I'll be upset.


I can think of alot of worse things a draft pick can say than "I've been working out with an all star and playing one on one with him" He said he measured 6'11 in shoes.


----------



## remlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> Ughh..don't want that kid...that wasn't even called for...
> 
> Plus he think's he's a SF? No thanks
> 
> Aldridge is my #1 right now, Roy & Bargnani follow behind him.


What is keeping Tyrus #1 on my list is the chip on his shoulder to prove everyone wrong. I totally understand that his attitude is a major turn-off to some people.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



remlover said:


> What is keeping Tyrus #1 on my list is the chip on his shoulder to prove everyone wrong. I totally understand that his attitude is a major turn-off to some people.


The problem is he is being considered for a top pick, Gilbert Arenas wasn't, Arenas got passed up by every team in the NBA, what is Tyrus gonna be, passed up by 3 teams? And its not even a playing thing, its a draft position thing he has a chip on his shoulder about, he is in a battle against draftexpress, he is just trying to prove them they were wrong for putting him 7 on their mock, how often does a guy get in a bicker battle with a mock draft site?


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

doesn't the fact that he is taking things so personall with a mock draft show a little concern in terms of showing professionalism and maturity? 
wait untill he tastes the reality of the scrutiny of the country of journalists that will be on his back. can this kid handle the scrutiny and pressure? 
im starting to favour Roy with the second pick. someone who is a little more level headed and doesn't get worked up about things as where he may be drafted but more so about the fact that he'll make an impact no matter where he'll be.


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Man....Tyrus Thomas is a JERK.

I wasn't feeling that interview AT ALL!

Aldridge is an IDIOT...NOT hitting the gym...To gain strength like he should so he can get better position in the paint.

WHAT AN IDIOT.


I'm really disappointed in these guys after those interviews.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



> These days, according to Aldridge, the skill-level gap is closing (Between him and Bosh). Perhaps to his credit, Aldridge is not exactly deferential when he recounts the goings-on in the duo's one-on-one games.
> 
> "It's usually (Bosh) wins one, I win one, he wins one," said Aldridge. "I don't think nobody wants to let somebody beat 'em over and over again."


GET EM PAX!



> Now he's more than a measurement. Yesterday, while Aldridge was surrounded by a phalanx of international media at a press gathering that featured a handful of draft hopefuls, Tyrus Thomas, who was on the winning side of LSU's NCAA tournament triumph over Aldridge's Texas squad, sat alone at a table. As Aldridge answered no end of questions, Thomas — a talented player who drew the interest of very few reporters — eventually put his head on the table in mock sleep.


LOL


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

LSU's THOMAS dazzling in drills :



> LAKE BUENA VISTA, Fla. -- Tyrus Thomas came across as shy and reserved Saturday when he and several other potential lottery picks for the June 28 NBA draft met with reporters at a resort.
> 
> But earlier, during individual testing, Thomas was said to be off the charts with enthusiasm and athleticism.
> 
> "He's a crazy athlete," Connecticut's Rudy Gay said. "He can do so many things."
> 
> This no doubt will impress the Bulls, who are considering selecting Thomas with the No. 2 pick.
> 
> Thomas, a 6-foot-9-inch power forward from LSU, and Gay, a 6-9 small forward, were striking with their running vertical leap, players said.
> 
> "They really impressed everybody," Ronnie Brewer of Arkansas said.
> 
> In interviews, Thomas had little to say, but he left no questions about his confidence.
> 
> Asked about the ceiling for his potential, he said: "If I keep working hard, there's no limit. You can't limit yourself. If I tell you I can only reach a certain point, I'd be belittling myself."
> 
> Last fall, Thomas was just about the only person who believed he could make it to the draft. He had missed his first college season as a medical redshirt and wasn't expected to flourish in his debut season. He ended up helping Louisiana State reach the Final Four.
> 
> "A lot of critics didn't [think so] because they weren't in the gym," Thomas said. "They watched the games, but they don't watch the 9 and 10 o'clock workouts at night when you're in the gym by yourself, rebounding for yourself and going hard."
> 
> LSU coach John Brady has expressed concern about the cultural and social shock awaiting Thomas wherever he goes because Thomas, 19, never has lived outside the Baton Rouge area. Thomas said his coach shouldn't worry.
> 
> "I can handle myself wherever I go," he said.
> 
> Bulls general manager John Paxson has said he doesn't see such situations—young players leaving home for the first time with money to burn—as a major problem.
> 
> "There are issues with every young player that any team has to acknowledge and deal with," Paxson said earlier in the week. "This is the first year you don't have high school kids in the draft, but they're still young players. You make sure there is a support system in place."


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

O'Bryant Admits He's a Project :



> LAKE BUENA VISTA, Fla. -- Anyone who calls Patrick O'Bryant a "project" won't get an argument from the 7-foot sophomore from Bradley.
> 
> "I'd agree with them," O'Bryant said Saturday at the NBA's predraft camp.
> 
> 
> "I don't think I'm going to be some dominating force," O'Bryant said. "Some people here are older and more polished. Those are the kinds of guys who come in and contribute right away. I'm going to be one of those guys who will come in and in a couple of years be a good force in the NBA."
> 
> O'Bryant averaged 13.4 points per game last season and led the Missouri Valley Conference in blocked shots with 2.9 per game.
> 
> His status as a project probably will deter the Bulls, though there is some talk O'Bryant could climb into the draft's top five based on his potential and size.
> 
> O'Bryant will work out for the Bulls sometime in the next two weeks. He wants to silence questions about his work ethic and believes he got a good start during a workout with the Hornets.
> 
> "There is speculation about my work ethic because I'm not an overly emotional guy, but I think I've showed this is what I want to do, and I want to work at it," he said.
> 
> If Bulls general manager John Paxson opts for a true post scorer with the No. 2 pick in the draft, LaMarcus Aldridge, a 6-11 sophomore from Texas, would be his choice, if he's available.
> 
> Like Tyrus Thomas from Louisiana State, whom many expect the Bulls to pick, Aldridge made big strides in the last year. He said he hopes to impress with his offensive skills when he works out for the Bulls.
> 
> "Having different ways to score is going to help me out so much in this draft," he said. "I have a sky hook, jump hook and turnaround 'J.' All three of those are pretty big time."
> 
> At small forward, Gonzaga's Adam Morrison will be an immediate scoring threat, and it looks as if he'll be picked No. 3 by the Charlotte Bobcats.
> 
> Morrison has been tagged as a suspect defender, which he attributes to the stereotype of scorers being lazy on defense. He said he dispelled that notion when he worked out for the Bobcats.
> 
> There are questions about Morrison's durability because he has diabetes.
> 
> "[My doctor] can disprove some of the myths and notions of what can and cannot be done [by diabetic athletes]," Morrison said. "I could say, 'Hey, I played 38 minutes a game at a high level and led the nation in scoring.' I don't know how else I can prove it's possible."


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

http://www.floridatoday.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060611/SPORTS/606110346/1002



> LAKE BUENA VISTA - Not since 2001, when the Washington Wizards gambled and lost on high school bust Kwame Brown, has there been this much uncertainty at the top of the NBA Draft.
> 
> Toronto, Chicago, Charlotte, Portland and Atlanta hold the top five picks, but that will likely change in the days leading to the June 28 draft. With so much uncertainty, there could be more teams wanting to trade down for multiple picks than looking to jump up to the top.
> 
> "This year isn't a bad draft, but it just doesn't have that special feeling to it at the top," said Denver head coach George Karl, who was in Orlando this past week scouting players at the NBA's Pre-Draft Camp. "It has good quantity to it, but I'm not sure about the quality."
> 
> Is the top pick Tyrus Thomas, the jumping-jack forward from LSU whose star power exploded in the NCAA Tournament? Is it Gonzaga's Adam Morrison, the prolific scorer who has so patterned his game after Larry Bird that he's even grown in the wispy mustache?
> 
> Could Italian 7-footer Andrea Bargnani, the draft's international man of mystery, intrigue the Raptors? Or are teams willing to gamble on the tremendous potential of college sophomores Rudy Gay or LaMarcus Aldrige?
> 
> "Man, it's crazy right now because one day you're hearing that you could be the top pick and the next you hear you could slide all the way down to sixth," said Gay, who was in Orlando on Saturday for his official physical and testing by the NBA.
> 
> If the top five teams don't have a concrete idea on what they are doing in the draft, the Orlando Magic are understandably undecided over who will be available at No. 11. The Magic worked out seven players -- guards Randy Foye, Rodney Carney, Ronnie Brewer, Quincy Douby, Hassan Adams and Mardy Collins -- in a private session Thursday.
> 
> The Magic have another pivotal session set Wednesday, this one featuring Naismith and Wooden award winner J.J. Redick. Redick, who measured 6-foot-4 and 189 pounds Saturday, figures to be available for the Magic. He averaged 26.8 points this season at Duke but is eager to prove to the Magic he is more than a scorer and spot-up shooter.
> 
> "I want to do well in every workout, but I've definitely circled that date on my calendar and I've looked forward to working out for them for a few weeks now," Redick said of the Magic, who already watched him drill once in Los Angeles.
> 
> "I can play basketball. I know how to play and I'm effective at what I do," Redick continued. "I've proven myself for four years and I got better every season."
> 
> Shelden Williams, Redick's former Duke teammate, was one of the most impressive athletes tested Saturday by NBA trainers. Williams bench-pressed 185 pounds 25 times. Comparatively, the rail-thin Aldridge, an athletic power forward, lifted 185 pounds just eight times.
> 
> Quipped Aldridge: "Shelden did it 25 times. That's what four years of college will get you."
> 
> Brewer, whose father played for the Portland Trail Blazers, was also quite impressive. Not only did he lift 185 pounds 19 times, but he also reached 12 feet, 1 inch off a running leap. Only Thomas and Gay jumped higher, at 12-3.
> 
> The athleticism and stamina of Morrison, the nation's leading scorer this past season (28.1 ppg), might preclude him from being the sure-fire top pick. Morrison has Type I diabetes and wears an insulin pump in his abdomen.
> 
> Morrison, a 6-foot-8, 205-pound small forward, has to closely monitor his blood-sugar levels, eating the same meals every day on game nights. For example, it's steak, baked potato and green vegetable precisely two hours and 15 minutes before games. NHL Hall of Famer Bobby Clarke and former NBA center Chris Dudley are two prominent athletes who played professionally while successfully managing the disease.
> 
> "I think it's overblown," said Morrison, who will work out Thursday in Portland. "People act like since it's another jump that I'm not going to take care of myself. But I understand where they're coming from because if you are going to pay a 21-year-old kid a lot of money, they have the right to know the whole process."
> 
> Washington shooting guard Brandon Roy and Bradley center Patrick O'Bryant are two players whose stock seems to be soaring. Roy feels his draft hopes are aided by high school players no longer being eligible.
> 
> Because players now must be 19 and out of high school at least one year, that rules out Indianapolis center Greg Oden. If he were available, that would likely clear up the debate over the top pick. Andrew Bogut (2005), Dwight Howard (2004), LeBron James (2003) and Yao Ming (2002) were clear-cut top choices the past four years.
> 
> "There are some great players at the top of the draft, but I believe in myself," said Roy, who averaged 20.2 points, 5.6 rebounds and 4.1 assists this season. "It's huge for guys like me not having the high school kids in the draft.
> 
> "Now, they have to draft the best players. I think it helps a lot of us, especially me a lot."


----------



## DaBullz

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



chifaninca said:


> So CHicago will "pass the Douby".........."Drugs are bad mmmKay"


Douby a Douby. Don't be a don't be.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I dont know why DraftExpress instead of engaging in a silly argument with Thomas, they didnt ask him about his measures and weight (See: Shelden's interview, for example).


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I'm not surprised by Shelden Williams. He is more of a physical marvel than people give him credit for. He measured in at 6'7 3/4 (6'8 for all intents and purposes) WITHOUT shoes, so with shoes he's basically the full 6'9 that he was listed at. That's not exactly tall for being an NBA 4, but he's certainly not undersized either. But man, benching 185 lbs 25 friggin times is impressive. Emeka Okafor for comparison sake benched it like 23 times if I recall. And it sounds like Shelden has blown people away with the athletic drills. Supposedly Atlanta wants him at #5, which doesn't surprise me....earlier in the season I boldly predicted he'd go top 5. :biggrin:


----------



## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> I dont know why DraftExpress instead of engaging in a silly argument with Thomas, they didnt ask him about his measures and weight (See: Shelden's interview, for example).


That's what I'm saying.

Get the answers we all want to kno....

that interview was a turn off.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> I dont know why DraftExpress instead of engaging in a silly argument with Thomas, they didnt ask him about his measures and weight (See: Shelden's interview, for example).


They were probaly afraid he'd rip their heads off if he asked him that. 

Draft Express: What did you measure in for height and weight today?

Tyrus Thomas: None of your business.

Draft Express: Were you 6'10", 6'9".

Tyrus Thomas: Well, your not a GM, so it doesn't matter, its only for the GM's to know.

Draft Express: Oh, here's the list of measurements, 6'7", 6'8" in shoes? 

Tyrus Thomas: Give that to me, your not supposed to have it, your no gm, you guys at Draft Express are trying to make me slip down in the draft.

Draft Express: This is our copy of the measurements you know.

Tyrus Thomas: No, MINE (jumps in and rips off the draft express guys head).


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

What Thomas has to understand as well is that these guys from DraftExpress will dissapear from his life in 2 weeks, so he might as well relax and take it easy.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

You know paxson is always going on and on about how he wants players from big time programs with lots of experience. I wonder if he has his eye on Roy and Shelden Williams. This is consistant with what he always says. I have reallly not been that high on williams but he was a monster last year and he is 6'9" and my guess he is much closer to a boozer type player.

That would give us two high quality players with lots of experience from top 10 college programs. I wonder how high pax would have to move up from 16 to get Williams. Seattle at 10.

david


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



giusd said:


> You know paxson is always going on and on about how he wants players from big time programs with lots of experience. I wonder if he has his eye on Roy and Shelden Williams. This is consistant with what he always says. I have reallly not been that high on williams but he was a monster last year and he is 6'9" and my guess he is much closer to a boozer type player.
> 
> That would give us two high quality players with lots of experience from top 10 college programs. I wonder how high pax would have to move up from 16 to get Williams. Seattle at 10.
> 
> david


The rumor I've read on various sites is that Atlanta really wants Shelden, and might take him #5. So that means somebody is going to drop then. My guess is that Morrison, Roy, Bargnani, and Aldridge are picks 1-4 (in no particular order), Shelden goes #5 to Atlanta, then Gay goes to Minnesota at #6 who I hear they really like. O'Bryant goes to Boston at #7 (a nice Irish name for the Celtics ), then finally our friend Tyrus Thomas drops to the Rockets at #8.


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Tyrus Thomas will be a future Portland Trailblazer whether he gets drafted by them or not.


----------



## TM

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> What Thomas has to understand as well is that these guys from DraftExpress will dissapear from his life in 2 weeks, so he might as well relax and take it easy.


exactly right

i still found it quite amusing :biggrin:


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



yodurk said:


> I'm not surprised by Shelden Williams. He is more of a physical marvel than people give him credit for. He measured in at 6'7 3/4 (6'8 for all intents and purposes) WITHOUT shoes, so with shoes he's basically the full 6'9 that he was listed at. That's not exactly tall for being an NBA 4, but he's certainly not undersized either. But man, benching 185 lbs 25 friggin times is impressive. Emeka Okafor for comparison sake benched it like 23 times if I recall. And it sounds like Shelden has blown people away with the athletic drills. Supposedly Atlanta wants him at #5, which doesn't surprise me....earlier in the season I boldly predicted he'd go top 5. :biggrin:


I saw that. Good for Shelden, I had a hunch he might turn out to be quite a bit shorter than advertised. Anyone else catch the bit about Ronnie Brewer jumping higher than everyone but Thomas and Gay? Impressive stuff.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



The ROY said:


> Ughh..don't want that kid...that wasn't even called for...
> 
> Plus he think's he's a SF? No thanks
> 
> Aldridge is my #1 right now, Roy & Bargnani follow behind him.



It's clear that Tyrus has a chip on his shoulder. This has allowed him to develop tremendously as a basketball player in the last year. He's clearly a tireless worker and a fierce competitor. 

However, he also may be a complete *******, and I'm not sure how he's going to garner the support of all his future teammates/coaching staff or piss them off to the point where they want to trade him after a year. 

Honestly, there were things I was disappointed to read in the interviews with Roy, Aldridge, and Thomas. Roy has got to man up and finish that workout in Charlotte. Sure, I know he feels he has one chance to impress the Bobcats, but the nature of realtime a competition like basketball requires you to produce when you're not feeling your best. That's a little scary.

Thomas seems so insecure over DraftExpress's mock draft that I wonder if he's mature enough or has the steadyness and social skills to deal with life in the NBA. This is the time when draft prospects are supposed to market themselves as well as possible to GM's, fans, the other players, everybody. Tyrus already can't keep his composure.

LaMarcus doesn't like banging in the post. Great.

OK, there's my negativity for the day.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> http://www.floridatoday.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060611/SPORTS/606110346/1002
> 
> 
> Brewer, whose father played for the Portland Trail Blazers, was also quite impressive. Not only did he lift 185 pounds 19 times, but he also reached 12 feet, 1 inch off a running leap. Only Thomas and Gay jumped higher, at 12-3.


If we don't draft Roy, we MUST trade up from 16 and take Brewer. Even if it means we part with Duhon. Roy or Brewer would be perfect fits next to Gordon / Hinrich.

It's also quite impressive for Brewer to do 19 reps of 185lbs. Gordon is a weightlifting machine and he could only do 12 reps.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



SALO said:


> If we don't draft Roy, we MUST trade up from 16 and take Brewer. Even if it means we part with Duhon. Roy or Brewer would be perfect fits next to Gordon / Hinrich.


I am also on board that I will be disappointed if we are not able to land either Roy or Brewer in the draft. These are the kind of unique players that can help cement Ben Gordon as a career Bull AND give our backcourt the necessary versatility to be elite.

If only Seatle hadn't traded for Watson at the deadline, then they might have considered trading down from 10 to 16 and getting Duhon in some sort of trade package.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Aldridge is going to be a very solid big guy in the league, if he can hit the hooks and turnarounds consistently, he is going to be a star. 235 pounds is a good for a power forward/center combo. Aldridge is basically the same size as Rasheed, and its not like Rasheed gets pushed around. He'll probaly naturally bulk up to around 250 just through his normal weight training routine, no need to overstress it. If he has all these offensive skills, and if it shows in the Bulls workout, no reason we shouldn't take him. Thomas has some nice skills, but we don't need a small forward. I'll be much happier with Nocioni, who can actually consistently hit the long shot.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> It's clear that Tyrus has a chip on his shoulder. This has allowed him to develop tremendously as a basketball player in the last year. He's clearly a tireless worker and a fierce competitor.
> 
> However, he also may be a complete *******, and I'm not sure how he's going to garner the support of all his future teammates/coaching staff or piss them off to the point where they want to trade him after a year.
> 
> Honestly, there were things I was disappointed to read in the interviews with Roy, Aldridge, and Thomas. Roy has got to man up and finish that workout in Charlotte. Sure, I know he feels he has one chance to impress the Bobcats, but the nature of realtime a competition like basketball requires you to produce when you're not feeling your best. That's a little scary.
> 
> Thomas seems so insecure over DraftExpress's mock draft that I wonder if he's mature enough or has the steadyness and social skills to deal with life in the NBA. This is the time when draft prospects are supposed to market themselves as well as possible to GM's, fans, the other players, everybody. Tyrus already can't keep his composure.
> 
> LaMarcus doesn't like banging in the post. Great.
> 
> OK, there's my negativity for the day.


 When did Aldridge say he didn't want to bang? I'm not saying your misled -- I just haven't seen that article. Aldridge seems to have a prototypical pf/neo-c game to me.

Also, I'm not sure you have to be so hard on Roy. He may have been legitimately sick. You can reschedule workouts. . . you can't reschedule games.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



such sweet thunder said:


> When did Aldridge say he didn't want to bang? I'm not saying your misled -- I just haven't seen that article. Aldridge seems to have a prototypical pf/neo-c game to me.
> 
> Also, I'm not sure you have to be so hard on Roy. He may have been legitimately sick. You can reschedule workouts. . . you can't reschedule games.


No, Aldridge never said he didn't want to bang. He said the biggest transition would be having to bang every night, which just means he's gonna have to adjust to the level of talent in the NBA. But if he can beat Chris Bosh, thats a good start.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



such sweet thunder said:


> When did Aldridge say he didn't want to bang? I'm not saying your misled -- I just haven't seen that article. Aldridge seems to have a prototypical pf/neo-c game to me.
> 
> Also, I'm not sure you have to be so hard on Roy. He may have been legitimately sick. You can reschedule workouts. . . you can't reschedule games.


I guess I took the quote a little out of context:

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1336



> Reporter: Do you think you need to put on weight to play in the NBA?
> 
> LaMarcus Aldridge: Everybody says I need to put on strength, that I need to add 10-15 pounds, but KG isn't 275. He's wiry, and he's strong enough to compete.
> 
> ....
> 
> Reporter: What is your biggest challenge?
> 
> LaMarcus Aldridge: Looking back on the season, I think I played well again'st 4's like Pittsnogle, but I think getting used to the banging night in, night out will be the biggest transition.



Basically, what I get these comments is that he sees the potential in himself to be a finesse post player and that he's not really comfortable banging (yet). That's great that he's more comfortable playing against a slow, finesse big man like Pittsnogle, but we know he won't always have that luxury. 

I'm not sure this kid wants to be a banger.


----------



## unBULLievable

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Stay away from Aldridge. He has many question marks. My choices are Brandonb Roy and Adam Morrison.

These guys will kill to win.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> I guess I took the quote a little out of context:
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1336
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Basically, what I get these comments is that he sees the potential in himself to be a finesse post player and that he's not really comfortable banging (yet). That's great that he's more comfortable playing against a slow, finesse big man like Pittsnogle, but we know he won't always have that luxury.
> 
> I'm not sure this kid wants to be a banger.


I took his Pittsnogle comment as encouraging. It shows he's aware of what he needs to do to improve. That's in stark contrast with Thomas who seems to think he has no weakness.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

But then again, where are these great banging centers now? Shaq.........Curry....yeah a finesse big man like Aldridge isn't as bad as people are making him out to be. Shaq, and most of the other 90's centers had hook shots and turn away J's, thats what missing from a lot of centers today. Its not like he won't bang, he can bang and play finesse ball, and he'll probaly be a 15-8 guy next year, which is what we will need to take that next step, while if we take Roy or Morrisson were just compounding on what we already have, but Aldridge gives us everything we've been clamoring for all of last season...if only we had a guy who could score in the post........yet we want to take a self proclaimed small forward who is afraid of Rudy Gay #2?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I see people mentioning that Shelden Williams measured out at 6'9 in shoes, does that mean that the Orlando measurements have been released?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



unBULLievable said:


> Stay away from Aldridge. He has many question marks. My choices are Brandonb Roy and Adam Morrison.
> 
> These guys will kill to win.


And Morrison doesn't have question marks?

everybody wants to win...but we need a talented BIG man.....

the same knocks on Aldridge are the same ones said about Frye, Villeuva & Bosh coming out of college also....

With our guards, Aldridge would get a ton of good looks every game. This is the perfect situation for him.

But I will say that his comments about not wanting to bang with Big Baby earlier this year turned me off too.


----------



## Toxicity

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

It's not only about Bargnani in Italy: Marco Belinelli (2007 draft) scored 34 points (11/18 FG - 8/14 3p - 4/4 FT) and took Climamio Bologna to the Italian League Finals... against Benetton Treviso and Bargnani! 

What a challenge! :cheers:


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I have no idea what paxson is going to go but more and more i think that it is going to be Roy. Now maybe we take him at two or pax trades down to someone who whats into the second spot but i really get the feeling that pax's is iffy about both aldridge and Thomas.

I also think it very interesting that Atlanta seems to be closing in on Williams at the 5th pick. If that is true someone is going to spin out of the top 5. I know Portland wants Mossison in the worst way and it looks like the raptors and bulls will trade out of the first and second picks. If so i really have no idea who is going one and two but if williams is five then at least a couple of players are going to fall. 

david


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I've seen TT as the guy I would be most excited about, he has the most potential. But the more I hear from him the less I like him, he comes off as extremely immature.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Anyone else notice how wacky the NBADraft mock has been lately? The latest version has these projections:

1. Jordan Farmer going to Philadelphia at 13, while Rajon Rondo slips to LA at 26.

2. The Bulls taking Aaron Gray at 16.

3. The Bulls passing on Ronnie Brewer to take Gray at 16, after drafting Tyrus Thomas at 2.

4. Alexander Johnson slipping to the bottom half of the second round behind guys like Denham Brown, Daniel Gibson and PJ Tucker.

Maybe I'm missing something but these projections seem totally off the wall. If we draft big at 2 and then pick Aaron Gray over Ronnie Brewer I may be PM'ing DaBullz for membership in his club.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

I must agree that the NBADraft mock is pretty awful. Some of the players seem really off. I know they make changes as it gets closer to the draft but some seem really strange.

david


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

For the sake of comparison, here is their last 2005 Mock Draft:
http://www.nbadraft.net/index.asp?content=mock2005


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



 sloth said:


> But then again, where are these great banging centers now? Shaq.........Curry....yeah a finesse big man like Aldridge isn't as bad as people are making him out to be. Shaq, and most of the other 90's centers had hook shots and turn away J's, thats what missing from a lot of centers today. Its not like he won't bang, he can bang and play finesse ball, and he'll probaly be a 15-8 guy next year, which is what we will need to take that next step, while if we take Roy or Morrisson were just compounding on what we already have, but Aldridge gives us everything we've been clamoring for all of last season...if only we had a guy who could score in the post........yet we want to take a self proclaimed small forward who is afraid of Rudy Gay #2?


NBADraftnet's evaluation of Bosh in '03

Strengths: Great inside outside player. Few are blessed with his athletic prowess. Plays with a good amount of aggresiveness, but doesn't get out of control or lose his composure easily. Appears "Garnett-esque" because of his long frame and amazing fluidity. Runs the floor exceptionally well. Doesn't have the perimeter skills of Garnett, namely shooting, but appears to like playing in the post more so than Garnett and could end up filling out into more of a dominating post player. Has great ball handling skills and really can pass the ball. Has some developed post moves and an advanced offensive game for a 19 year old. Can even step out to three point land and hit a few long range shots. Understands the game well, doesn't make unnecessary moves, uses the drop step and jump hook effectively. Because of his long arms, timing, and explosiveness, he is an excellent shot blocker. The team even goes to him to bring the ball up the court at times as a point forward.

Weknesses: Still weak physically. Needs time to develop into his body. Must bulk up and add strength to handle the power of NBA players. Still has problems with consistency but that can be expected from a young player. Needs better stamina, mental toughness. He can lose focus towards the end of games.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



El Chapu said:


> For the sake of comparison, here is their last 2005 Mock Draft:
> http://www.nbadraft.net/index.asp?content=mock2005


 2005's mock was actually pretty good. . . especially towards the top.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

everyone is getting a little over excited about this nba draft. we don't need for our team to get younger and any less experienced. if anything i think we trade on of our picks for a future pick or a in a package for an veteran player. and just only keep one. i know we have all these players that suddenly seem to fit the bill but that could be said every year every draft. and we don't nesscarily need to draft them. we can always get them in the future through trades. but i just don't think two more rookies to tutor and pamper is the way to go. we are already young enough...


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

*Anyone know when official measurements come out from predraft camp ?*

Anyone ? anyone ?


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Anyone know when official measurements come out from predraft camp ?*

we're still waiting. probably published tomorrow, though why florida today had reference to the measurements (see official draft thread, tom b. posted the article), the damn list still hasn't been released. 


so while we wait i'm merging this up in the draft thread.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

sausage: 

http://basketballboards.net/forum/showpost.php?p=3650223&postcount=2498

the only article i've read today that even mentions select measurements.

don't know why they can't get it _freakin' together_ 24 hours later to not have the list out.



tyrus thomas probably had issue with it. :smilewink

and speaking of him, the attitude, tyrus, work on that. ok.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*

Screw Roy, lets just trade up from 16 and draft Ronnie Brewer. Guy sounds pretty amazing. Aldridge has to be our pick at #2 if he's there.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!)*



mizenkay said:


> sausage:
> 
> http://basketballboards.net/forum/showpost.php?p=3650223&postcount=2498
> 
> the only article i've read today that even mentions select measurements.
> 
> don't know why they can't get it _freakin' together_ 24 hours later to not have the list out.
> 
> 
> 
> tyrus thomas probably had issue with it. :smilewink
> 
> and speaking of him, the attitude, tyrus, work on that. ok.


 yup. that interview was out. . . like on pluto. i'm officially in the anti-tyrus thomas camp.


----------



## mgolding

*Draft Express Interviews - Thomas sounds bitter*

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1336

"You're not a GM. I don't have to sell myself to you."

He is pissed


----------



## BG7

*Re: Draft Express Interviews - Thomas sounds bitter*

Old news, this interview has made Thomas the butt end of jokes for over a day now.


----------



## SALO

*Tyrus Thomas interviewer*

The guy who did the Tyrus Thomas interview posted his thoughts at RealGM... 



> *That was the worst interview I'd ever conducted, and was caught completely off-guard by it.* Me and my four colleagues split up all the guys that we'd approach before we went into the interviewing room, and I finished my assignments (Morrison and O'Bryant) early, so my boss told me to go over to Thomas, who I hadn't really prepared for. The guy started responding at me with sharp comments, and the interview definitely had a kind of hostile tone. I was being up front with the guy, I told him I agreed with him that oftentimes players don't get to showcase their full skillset in college because of the role they're assigned to, but he seemed set in his opinion that we are being unfair to him or whatever he believes.
> 
> The biggest thing that jumps out at me in this interview that seems to get lost behind Thomas's sharp, borderline rude responses is how he says he's a small forward. *The guy, from everything I've heard, thinks he's going to Chicago at #2, and probably that he's a top-3 pick for sure*, but him being a small forward does nothing to help that notion. Further, as he said in the interview, he wasn't able to show his SF skills at LSU. But then he says he won't work competitively in workouts to show those skills, because he doesn't find it necessary.
> 
> Chicago won't take a SF with Deng there. I don't see why any team would take a completely unproven SF in Thomas over Roy, Morrison, or Gay, and one could make an argument for Brewer, too. Thomas could very well play SF, and I believe it's definitely possible he can be very successful, but for the guy to have this arrogant attitude when he personally admits he hasn't shown SF skills in college, yet won't work out competitively to show them, it's just absurd to me.
> 
> *I don't think Chicago will take him.* At PF, he duplicates too many of Chandler's skills and doesn't complement his game at all. At SF, they don't need help, and it's very arguable that Deng is a more promising SF prospect (in terms of likelihood to pan out, not necessarily peak potential). I think Chicago has better options than Thomas, and I'd be extremely surprised if they took him. I think they should take Alexander Johnson at #16 and either of Roy/Aldridge at #2, if they don't move down a few spots to take Roy. Another option would be Aldridge at #2 and Brewer at #16, but I don't see Brewer falling that far.
> 
> Either way, if they take Johnson at #16 and Roy/Aldridge at #2, they're going to be in a damn good position moving forward. A three-man rotation of Johnson/Chandler/Aldridge at PF/C would be nasty, with Sweetney/Nocioni rounding out with some PF minutes. Otherwise, they could add Roy and really solidify their backcourt, possibly giving them an opportunity to move out Duhon or Gordon if they find some good value. Then they have cap space. Their options are tremendous, and I think they're undoubtedly in the best situation in the entire league in terms of rebuilding. Their whole core aside from Nocioni (27) is under 25, they're all on the same page, they play team ball, have a good coach who they respect, and they already play like veterans and put up a challenge in the playoffs, this without whatever else they add in the draft/free agency in the next two years. *I don't see them taking a risk on Thomas, who might not even fit into their team. They should play it safe, and I believe they will.*


JoeT's post

If we don't take Thomas at #2, I could definitely see him falling outside the top 5. Charlotte will pick a wing (Morrison, Gay, Roy). Portland doesn't want anymore potential headcases. Atlanta already has Josh Smith and Marvin Williams. Minnesota would probably take him at pick #6, and that's if they don't end up trading their pick. Tyrus better get his act together for his Bulls interview, and quit talking about himself as a small forward!


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Tyrus Thomas interviewer*



SALO said:


> Tyrus better get his act together for his Bulls interview, and quit talking about himself as a small forward!


Somebody has to of told him about the SF thing, look at our roster buddy, it's the position we don't need. Maybe he's trying to position himself for Charlotte(no way they take him with Gerald), or Portland(he does have an attitude), or Minnesota in case the Bulls don't pick him.

I've also heard from Tyrus and his agent the they were all for competitive workouts, now they are saying they don't need them. Maybe they don't, maybe they got a guarantee, but if not this kid is shooting himself in the foot.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

new interviews on draftexpress are up..........

Gay says he's working on his ballhandling so he can play 2 guard.......

Brewer continues to look like a true pro, much like Roy

Bryant doesn't have a lot to say.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I like Brewer's attitude very much, he seems determined to get better and he trusts his abilities. In the interview it said that he more than held his own against Carney, Foye, Collins, Adams, Douby and Shawne Williams, especially on defense. He is getting advice from Pippen as well, and he seems like a can't miss prospect at #16 if he falls that far, although it doesn't seem to be the case at the moment.

Oh, and Gay hopes he can become McGradyesque if he becomes a better ball-handler, which he has been working on all season. That sounds very intriguing to me.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



LegoHat said:


> I like Brewer's attitude very much, he seems determined to get better and he trusts his abilities. In the interview it said that he more than held his own against Carney, Foye, Collins, Adams, Douby and Shawne Williams, especially on defense. He is getting advice from Pippen as well, and he seems like a can't miss prospect at #16 if he falls that far, although it doesn't seem to be the case at the moment.
> 
> Oh, and Gay hopes he can become McGradyesque if he becomes a better ball-handler, which he has been working on all season. That sounds very intriguing to me.


The Brewer interview is great. I really hope we find a way to get him. Court smarts, much better than advertised athleticism and a seriously good attitude - I don't care if he shoots underhanded, frankly.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Tyrus Thomas interviewer*



Hustle said:


> Somebody has to of told him about the SF thing, look at our roster buddy, it's the position we don't need. Maybe he's trying to position himself for Charlotte(no way they take him with Gerald), or Portland(he does have an attitude), or Minnesota in case the Bulls don't pick him.
> 
> I've also heard from Tyrus and his agent the they were all for competitive workouts, now they are saying they don't need them. Maybe they don't, maybe they got a guarantee, but if not this kid is shooting himself in the foot.


I seriously doubt Gerald Wallace would stop them from drafting Tyrus Thomas...theyr're nothing alike...


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Like I told you guys, Gay is a 2. If we take Brandon Roy, I'm gonna go crazy, Brewer is going to be better in the long run.

I think this is the stem of the Sweetney and 2 for Murphy and 9. Its to take Ronnie Brewer #9.

The way I look at it you have:

Tyrus Thomas
LaMarcus Aldridge
Andrea Bargnani
Patrick O'Bryant
Adam Morrison
Brandon Roy
Rudy Gay
Shelden Williams

Those are the 8 guys that I think will go ahead of Brewer, but if not, we'll still get a quality guy. If we can somehow get Brewer at #9 and Simmons at #16 we'd be in a good position. 

So we'd have

PG-Ben Gordon/Kirk Hinrich
SG-Ronnie Brewer/Chris Duhon
SF-Andres Nocioni/Luol Deng
PF-Troy Murphy/Cedric Simmons
C- Tyson Chandler/

Not bad at all.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



sloth said:


> Like I told you guys, Gay is a 2. If we take Brandon Roy, I'm gonna go crazy, Brewer is going to be better in the long run.


Just because he says he is a two doesn't mean he in fact _is_ a two. I believe Richard Nixon once proclaimed that he wasn't a crook...


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



sloth said:


> Like I told you guys, Gay is a 2. If we take Brandon Roy, I'm gonna go crazy, Brewer is going to be better in the long run.
> 
> I think this is the stem of the Sweetney and 2 for Murphy and 9. Its to take Ronnie Brewer #9.
> 
> The way I look at it you have:
> 
> Tyrus Thomas
> LaMarcus Aldridge
> Andrea Bargnani
> Patrick O'Bryant
> Adam Morrison
> Brandon Roy
> Rudy Gay
> Shelden Williams
> 
> Those are the 8 guys that I think will go ahead of Brewer, but if not, we'll still get a quality guy. If we can somehow get Brewer at #9 and Simmons at #16 we'd be in a good position.
> 
> So we'd have
> 
> PG-Ben Gordon/Kirk Hinrich
> SG-Ronnie Brewer/Chris Duhon
> SF-Andres Nocioni/Luol Deng
> PF-Troy Murphy/Cedric Simmons
> C- Tyson Chandler/
> 
> Not bad at all.



I think thats a horrible trade. Move down 7 slots in the draft to aqcuire an overpaid pf who doesn't play defense? wtf?


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

chad has his mock draft version 2 up at espn. says the bulls are still leaning toward tyrus thomas.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draf...ory?columnist=ford_chad&page=MockDraft-060612




> The skinny: I've championed LaMarcus Aldridge all year, but after watching Thomas work out, I can see why the Bulls would want him. He's got the physical and mental toughness that GM John Paxson and head coach Scott Skiles demand. Given Thomas' physical gifts and motor, it's probably just a question of when, not if, he develops.
> Thomas' most serious competition for the No. 2 spot is Washington's Brandon Roy. The Bulls want to add size to their backcourt and think another big might be available at No. 16. From what I'm told they're leaning toward Thomas, but it's a close call.


and thabo at #16



> The skinny: If the Bulls go for a frontcourt player with pick No. 2, look for them to try to add a big two guard to fill their need in the backcourt. Brewer and Carney would be likely targets if they're still on the board. If they're not, the Bulls could turn to Sefolosha. He's long, athletic and experienced, and he has a balanced, all-around game.
> Temple's Mardy Collins is another option here.
> 
> Or, if the Bulls decide to go for a player like Roy at the top, then an athletic forward like Alexander Johnson could be the guy.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

draftexpress has us taking Aldridge and Thabo.

nbadraft has us taking Thomas and Aaron Gray out of Pitt.

Haven't really heard anything about Gray, but from what I read on his profile, I was underwhelmed.

Sounds like a slightly beefier Will Purdue.


----------



## Floods

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



> chad has his mock draft version 2 up at espn. says the bulls are still leaning toward tyrus thomas.
> 
> 
> 
> http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2006/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=MockDraft-060612
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and thabo at #16


If i was the Bulls i'd lean toward Aldridge. He'll be the better player.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Must find a way to come away with one of the bigs + Brewer.


----------



## Floods

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I don't like Ronnie Brewer. Brandon Roy would be better for you guys.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



XtaZ606 said:


> I don't like Ronnie Brewer. Brandon Roy would be better for you guys.


Well yeah of course he would. But Roy is a top 5 pick probably while Brewer may actually be available at 16, though probably not.


----------



## Floods

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

When is Chicago's other pick? I think Roy will still be available once the draft hits double digits.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I really would love Brewer with the #16. From what I hear though, he's been impressive and could probably go as high as #8 or #9. And trading up is easier said than done.

Still haven't heard ANYTHING about the Bulls being interested in Bargnani...the closest thing we've heard is that the Benneton coach said that Bulls scouts (among other teams) have made multiple scouting trips to watch Bargnani. So I'm 100% certain that Pax knows all there is to know about him. I just hope that all this talk about Thomas and Roy is a smoke screen, and that Pax is merely keeping mum.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



XtaZ606 said:


> When is Chicago's other pick? I think Roy will still be available once the draft hits double digits.


We own #2 and #16. But let me tell you theres no way Roy drops that far (#10 or lower).


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

well "officially" up at bulls.com there's pics of LaMarcus, Thomas and Roy being touted as possibilities.










_LaMarcus Aldridge, Brandon Roy and Tyrus Thomas 
are all players the Bulls will consider taking with the 
second overall selection in NBA Draft 2006._

plus they have draft profiles of all the players. 

_Player profiles written by Anthony Hyde and Brett Ballantini._


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Looks like they aren't even considering Bargnani.

they also took the profiles from nbadraft.net it seems


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> Looks like they aren't even considering Bargnani.


And that's a damn shame if it's true.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> Looks like they aren't even considering Bargnani.



which means we will probably end up drafting him! lol

I am quite sure he is still in the mix, I think Bargnani is starting to look more and more like a long term project though.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

No, they only put up three pictures. I doubt that means they are excluding Bargnani -- in fact, in true Sleuth tradition, his absence may have more meaning...



Here is a link to all the player profiles on the Bulls site:

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/draft_prospects06a.html


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

We've made it to the Monday after the predraft camp. I expect a big article today with both measurements and athletic testing info, or I might just start making them up.

Sheldon Williams is actually 6' 8.75" with shoes, but he makes up for being slightly shorter than average with a 17 foot wingspan.

At 4' 6.25", Kyle Lowry can only dunk when jumping off a ladder.

At 11' 2.5", Saer Sene can dunk the ball with his mouth.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> which means we will probably end up drafting him! lol
> 
> I am quite sure he is still in the mix, I think Bargnani is starting to look more and more like a long term project though.


Why is he looking more like a long term project all of a sudden?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

That Aldridge+Roy+TT image has been up on Bulls.com for quite some time already.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



LegoHat said:


> Why is he looking more like a long term project all of a sudden?



I don't think it is "all of the sudden". A lot of us armchair GM's haven't seen him, or a lot of him, and we sort of have arrived at a conception of his game from scouting reports, highlight clips, etc. But, looking at his statistical performance in the tourney and...he just hasn't DONE all that much. That makes me think that he, perhaps, is more of a long term project than a guy who is ready to ooh and awe right out of the gate. Maybe I am wrong but I don't hear a lot of buzz on Bargnani all of the sudden and either teams are keeping quiet and hoping he slips to them or they hope some other team drafts him.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



El Chapu said:


> That Aldridge+Roy+TT image has been up on Bulls.com for quite some time already.


 well today was the first time i saw it and i checked all weekend.


still no measurements posted anywhere, not draftexpress, nbadraft.net, inside hoops etc...

ugh.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mizenkay said:


> well today was the first time i saw it and i checked all weekend.
> 
> 
> still no measurements posted anywhere, not draftexpress, nbadraft.net, inside hoops etc...
> 
> ugh.


It wasnt there on the main page, but when you entered the Bulls draft section.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> I don't think it is "all of the sudden". A lot of us armchair GM's haven't seen him, or a lot of him, and we sort of have arrived at a conception of his game from scouting reports, highlight clips, etc. But, looking at his statistical performance in the tourney and...he just hasn't DONE all that much. That makes me think that he, perhaps, is more of a long term project than a guy who is ready to ooh and awe right out of the gate. Maybe I am wrong but I don't hear a lot of buzz on Bargnani all of the sudden and either teams are keeping quiet and hoping he slips to them or they hope some other team drafts him.


This is Real Talk.

If he was IMPRESSING during the italian league playoffs, he'd probably be a lock for #1. But his numbers are rather, doo doo, at the present time, if i'd say so myself.


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Read a interesting comparison in a recent ESPN the Magazine article...said to compare Brandon Roy with Josh Howard in ability to contribute almost immediately and still have plenty of 'ceiling' to grow into. 

I'm wavering now though...not a Tyrus fan, but stuck between Roy and LeMarcus...

In Pax we trust.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> This is Real Talk.
> 
> If he was IMPRESSING during the italian league playoffs, he'd probably be a lock for #1. But his numbers are rather, doo doo, at the present time, if i'd say so myself.


He had some good moments during the italian playoffs so far. But what about the other top prospects (Aldridge, TT, etc) and their performance in the NCAA Tournament? Which BTW is a much weaker competition...


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



El Chapu said:


> He had some good moments during the italian playoffs so far. But what about the other top prospects (Aldridge, TT, etc) and their performance in the NCAA Tournament? Which BTW is a much weaker competition...


Yeah, it's just like any young player whether college or pro. Plenty of promising young players struggle in their first set of playoffs when things get more intense. That doesn't mean he'll struggle for the rest of his life when the playoffs roll around. He's only what, 20 years old?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



yodurk said:


> Yeah, it's just like any young player whether college or pro. Plenty of promising young players struggle in their first set of playoffs when things get more intense. That doesn't mean he'll struggle for the rest of his life when the playoffs roll around. He's only what, 20 years old?


Exactly, I don't think you can make any serious conclusions by looking at his performance in the playoffs, which haven't been bad by any means, especially considering the competition and his young age. Instead look at what he's done all year long, where he has been impressing everyone in Europe in both the Italian league and the Euroleague. Tyrus Thomas on the other hand, hasn't had a consistent season, but on the other hand he has had a couple of really impressive games in the NCAA Tournament. I prefer the guy who has performed constantly all season long.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



LegoHat said:


> Exactly, I don't think you can make any serious conclusions by looking at his performance in the playoffs, which haven't been bad by any means, especially considering the competition and his young age. Instead look at what he's done all year long, where he has been impressing everyone in Europe in both the Italian league and the Euroleague. Tyrus Thomas on the other hand, hasn't had a consistent season, but on the other hand he has had a couple of really impressive games in the NCAA Tournament. I prefer the guy who has performed constantly all season long.


How was his season not consistent? he scored in double figures 21 out of his 31 games...double digit rebounds in even more games and was pretty consistent with his 3 blocks a game...

his only truely bad game was the last game of the season

I don't see Bargnani stepping up now, when it really matters...


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



LegoHat said:


> Exactly, I don't think you can make any serious conclusions by looking at his performance in the playoffs, which haven't been bad by any means, especially considering the competition and his young age. Instead look at what he's done all year long, where he has been impressing everyone in Europe in both the Italian league and the Euroleague. Tyrus Thomas on the other hand, hasn't had a consistent season, but on the other hand he has had a couple of really impressive games in the NCAA Tournament. I prefer the guy who has performed constantly all season long.


One thing that's really sold me on Bargnani from day 1 wasn't his highlight clips, rather it was the fact that he's earned a major role on such an impressive Euroleague squad. And while his stats aren't huge by American standards, by Euro standards they're actually quite good, especially when you consider his youth. And something else that's rather convincing is that Pau Gasol was in a similar situation as Bargnani at the same age and put up nearly identical numbers of 11 pts & 5 rebounds. The highlight clips just make me feel a little better about him, as they show off his athleticism, ballhandling skill, and pretty looking shot.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

My question is, to echo LegoHat --

Is there a smokescreen being put out there by the Bulls?

I mean, it REALLY, REALLY looks like we're not even considering Bargnani (I still say it's only 50/50 or 60/40 that he goes to the Raptors at pick one).

If that's the case, why the hell not? 

That's absolute nonsense. 

Bargnani's a 20-year-old seven-footer with an offensive game in the mold of a Nowitski or Gasol. As YoDurk pointed out, he's putting up numbers on a strong, championship-quailty Euro club that are similar to the numbers Gasol put up at the same age in Europe.

You've got to be ****ing kidding me if Pax is not giving this kid an EXTREMELY close look. :curse:


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

IMO there is no chance the Bulls ARE NOT considering Bargnani. Pax always talks about adding size and athleticism and Bargnani fits the bill very well. He is a scorer as well and can run the court pretty well for someone his size. And he has some length and knows how to use it on defense. 

If you are the Bulls, you must be at least consider him. We, as a team, have some needs and Bargnani can fill some of those.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Tyrus Thomas interviewer*



SALO said:


> The guy who did the Tyrus Thomas interview posted his thoughts at RealGM...
> 
> 
> 
> JoeT's post
> 
> If we don't take Thomas at #2, I could definitely see him falling outside the top 5. Charlotte will pick a wing (Morrison, Gay, Roy). Portland doesn't want anymore potential headcases. Atlanta already has Josh Smith and Marvin Williams. Minnesota would probably take him at pick #6, and that's if they don't end up trading their pick. Tyrus better get his act together for his Bulls interview, and quit talking about himself as a small forward!


There are two possibilities I read into Tyrus' insistance that he is a SF. The first is that he is angling for the #1 pick and has recieved word that the Charlie V. for Magloire + deal is going down. The other possibility is that he is 6'8" and is really weak.


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



El Chapu said:


> IMO there is no chance the Bulls ARE NOT considering Bargnani. Pax always talks about adding size and athleticism and Bargnani fits the bill very well. He is a scorer as well and can run the court pretty well for someone his size. And he has some length and knows how to use it on defense.
> 
> If you are the Bulls, you must be at least consider him. We, as a team, have some needs and Bargnani can fill some of those.


That's what I'm saying.

Maybe Pax is planning to shock everyone. He's investigating trades, but, when it comes down to it, he's going to take whoever is left after the first pick -- Bargnani or Aldridge.

That's why he almost NEVER mentions either of them. :biggrin:


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Just wanted to post this Bargnani video, courtesy of The Mad Viking on the Raptors board:

Bargnani video 

Bargnani is covering the opposing team's point guard and ends up blocking his layup and falling down, after that he runs the full lenght of the court and drains a three. Great play, I don't know if it's been posted here before, but it definitely shows off Bargnani's foot speed and defensive instincts.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



dogra said:


> That's what I'm saying.
> 
> Maybe Pax is planning to shock everyone. He's investigating trades, but, when it comes down to it, he's going to take whoever is left after the first pick -- Bargnani or Aldridge.
> 
> That's why he almost NEVER mentions either of them. :biggrin:


I totally agree with you here. Thats a very good observation you have made! :clap: :clap:


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



LegoHat said:


> Just wanted to post this Bargnani video, courtesy of The Mad Viking on the Raptors board:
> 
> Bargnani video
> 
> Bargnani is covering the opposing team's point guard and ends up blocking his layup and falling down, after that he runs the full lenght of the court and drains a three. Great play, I don't know if it's been posted here before, but it definitely shows off Bargnani's foot speed and defensive instincts.


It was posted already, but many sure missed it.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Splitter has apparently fallen off the draft boards for 2006. Draftnet has him on their 2007 board.

Has he pulled out of the 2006 draft?

If not, the Bulls should draft him at #16 if he is available. We can wait a couple of years.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



McBulls said:


> Splitter has apparently fallen off the draft boards for 2006. Draftnet has him on their 2007 board.
> 
> Has he pulled out of the 2006 draft?
> 
> If not, the Bulls should draft him at #16 if he is available. We can wait a couple of years.


Yeah, word was a couple of days ago he had dropped off of most mocks, and accordingly had pulled out of the '06 draft.

Not sure if I ever saw an actual confirmed link, but that was the scuttlebutt.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Yeah, I don't think Spitter pulled out yet, he'll probaly pull out on the last day like its been since 2004.

If for whatever reason he stays in, and even if he can't come for 2 years, you have to take him at 16, unless someone slips majorly. But if it goes like we expect, and its are choice between Reddick and Sene and Thabo, and Splitter stays in the draft, Splitter has to be the pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

From Ford's Mock TODAY :



> 2. Chicago
> (via New York)
> Tyrus Thomas Position: PF
> Height: 6-9
> Weight: 229
> Age: 19
> School: LSU
> 
> The skinny: I've championed LaMarcus Aldridge all year, but after watching Thomas work out, I can see why the Bulls would want him. He's got the physical and mental toughness that GM John Paxson and head coach Scott Skiles demand. Given Thomas' physical gifts and motor, it's probably just a question of when, not if, he develops.
> 
> Thomas' most serious competition for the No. 2 spot is Washington's Brandon Roy. The Bulls want to add size to their backcourt and think another big might be available at No. 16. From what I'm told they're leaning toward Thomas, but it's a close call.


Guess Tyrus's SF talks haven't changed Pax's mind on the kid yet.




> 16. Chicago
> Thabo Sefolosha Position: SF
> Height: 6-6
> Weight: 215
> Age: 22
> Country: Switzerland
> 
> The skinny: If the Bulls go for a frontcourt player with pick No. 2, look for them to try to add a big two guard to fill their need in the backcourt. Brewer and Carney would be likely targets if they're still on the board. If they're not, the Bulls could turn to Sefolosha. He's long, athletic and experienced, and he has a balanced, all-around game.
> 
> Temple's Mardy Collins is another option here.
> 
> Or, if the Bulls decide to go for a player such as Roy at the top, an athletic forward like Alexander Johnson could be the guy.


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



LegoHat said:


> Just wanted to post this Bargnani video, courtesy of The Mad Viking on the Raptors board:
> 
> Bargnani video
> 
> Bargnani is covering the opposing team's point guard and ends up blocking his layup and falling down, after that he runs the full lenght of the court and drains a three. Great play, I don't know if it's been posted here before, but it definitely shows off Bargnani's foot speed and defensive instincts.



It's like this: anyone can look good in a series of highlights, but the bargnani ones alwyas seem to show cajones and know-how. Very natural. Is it wrong to be high on this kid through highlight clips?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> From Ford's Mock TODAY :
> 
> 
> 
> Guess Tyrus's SF talks haven't changed Pax's mind on the kid yet.


Why do you think Chad knows Paxson's mind?


----------



## rebelsun

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

These Roy at #2 rumors are ridiculous. I really don't see them passing on one of the 3 bigs.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Apparently, Splitter was on the radio, and said he'd wait until the last day to make his decision. I cannot verify what country this radio was in, I saw it over at draftexpress. Paxson should give him a garauntee at 16. Think, if we take Aldridge 2, Splitter 16, and get Noah next year (I think he'll be more in our range of picks than a Durant or Oden). Then look at how solid we fill out.

PG-Kirk Hinrich/Chris Duhon
SG-Ben Gordon/Who gives a ****
SF-Andres Nocioni/Luol Deng
PF-LaMarcus Aldridge/Joakim Noah
C- Tiago Splitter/tyson Chandler

very solid.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



RebelSun said:


> These Roy at #2 rumors are ridiculous. I really don't see them passing on one of the 3 bigs.


Brandon Roy is a smokescreen if there ever was one.

Paxsons list at #2 has to be Gay, Morrison, Aldridge, and Bargnani. He'll be clearer on his direction once he works out the first 3 I listed. No way we take Tyrus "I'm afraid of the gay man" Thomas.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



sloth said:


> Apparently, Splitter was on the radio, and said he'd wait until the last day to make his decision. I cannot verify what country this radio was in, I saw it over at draftexpress. Paxson should give him a garauntee at 16. Think, if we take Aldridge 2, Splitter 16, and get Noah next year (I think he'll be more in our range of picks than a Durant or Oden). Then look at how solid we fill out.


That is quite a rosy senario for manning the Bulls front line. Problem solved -- long term.

Maybe the reason Splitter is waiting until the last moment is because he's unwilling to accept a starting salary lower than what he can get in Europe. At #16 the Bulls can only offer 1.16 mil the first year. He may think waiting a year or two and offering his services as a free agent makes more sense.

On the other hand, the fact that he's waiting until the last day suggests that he really does want to come to the NBA to try his skills. A competitive athlete would. So I agree we should offer him a guarantee. 

Nothing ventured nothing gained.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I think the problem is his buyout, not the lack of a team's guarantee. IMO if he enters is because he knows he could come over here this fall. And if he does so, you can sure expect him to go higher than #16.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



El Chapu said:


> I think the problem is his buyout, not the lack of a team's guarantee. IMO if he enters is because he knows he could come over here this fall. And if he does so, you can sure expect him to go higher than #16.


Honestly, the buyout isn't too bad for the Bulls, we could wait one year for him to come over (thats when his buyout becomes realistic), we already are going to be bringing in one rookie and free agents, so a player of his caliber is worth the one year wait. And McBulls, last year, he said that money isn't an issue to him, the buyout was the problem, and teams were too scared to give him a garauntee, he was looking for a top 14 garauntee last year, so 16 he might agree to stay in, and the 16 starting salary should be closer to the 14 anyhow. And if by any chance someone picked up Splitter before us, that just means that someone falls to us.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



TripleDouble said:


> Why do you think Chad knows Paxson's mind?


Well, he knows Pax...that's for certain

And he's paid to get the inside scoop...

I'm pretty SURE he doesn't know his mind though...Mr. Cleo, he isn't


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



sloth said:


> Brandon Roy is a smokescreen if there ever was one.
> 
> Paxsons list at #2 has to be Gay, Morrison, Aldridge, and Bargnani. He'll be clearer on his direction once he works out the first 3 I listed. No way we take Tyrus "I'm afraid of the gay man" Thomas.


I could care less about taking Thomas, but how is he afraid of Gay? Did I miss something?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I dont get all this Tyrus Thomas to Chicago when he has yet to workout for us at Berto Center and he has shown some inmaturity on the process. Not saying Pax wont take him, but its premature to say he is our guy by all means. And this might also be reflected on Draftexpress.com latest mock that has Thomas going to Chicago at #2 when yesterday he was at #7.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> I could care less about taking Thomas, but how is he afraid of Gay? Did I miss something?


They had a workout scheduled for the Bulls, for June 19th together. Gay called out Thomas, saying that he could play the powerforward position better than Thomas, despite being a wing, claiming that a wing who plays the powerforward position better than a powerforward is a better pick. So then Thomas had to reschedule for the 15th.....its one thing to do solo workouts, but when you schedule a workout together with other players (I think it was Gay, Morrisson, and Reddick) and a guy calls you out and then you back out, that doesn't speak much for your competitive edge. Yes its a smart move for Tyrus, because Gay, Morrisson, and Reddick would have torched him in that workout, all three players want to prove they are better than Thomas, but Thomas backed out. Is Thomas going to fake sick when he has to play Rudy Gay? Same deal with Brandon Roy, backing out of a Charlotte workout in the middle of it because Gay was outplaying him. Why is everyone so afraid of Rudy Gay? Either he is really good and embarassing them, or he has bad body odor.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Damn..

didn't know that

SMH


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## McBulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



sloth said:


> They had a workout scheduled for the Bulls, for June 19th together. Gay called out Thomas, saying that he could play the powerforward position better than Thomas, despite being a wing, claiming that a wing who plays the powerforward position better than a powerforward is a better pick. So then Thomas had to reschedule for the 15th.....its one thing to do solo workouts, but when you schedule a workout together with other players (I think it was Gay, Morrisson, and Reddick) and a guy calls you out and then you back out, that doesn't speak much for your competitive edge. Yes its a smart move for Tyrus, because Gay, Morrisson, and Reddick would have torched him in that workout, all three players want to prove they are better than Thomas, but Thomas backed out. Is Thomas going to fake sick when he has to play Rudy Gay? Same deal with Brandon Roy, backing out of a Charlotte workout in the middle of it because Gay was outplaying him. Why is everyone so afraid of Rudy Gay? Either he is really good and embarassing them, or he has bad body odor.


The legend of Rudy Gay is growing in my head. I'm glad Paxson has a chance to work him out and see him play against some of his peers. 

Thomas's agent should consider what it would be like to be the laughing stock of his profession if his client gets drafted in the 7-9 spot because of his manuvering. Thomas is only 19 so he is excused for listening to his elders.


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## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



McBulls said:


> The legend of Rudy Gay is growing in my head.


All right, I'll say it... The player that excites me the most at 2 is Gay. :brokenhea 

Seriously, he seems to have quite the package. :biggrin: OK, now real seriously. Athletically, he's placed in the same category as Thomas. He's been working on his ballhandling to play the two. His workout with Draftexpress seemed to indicate he's got a chip on his shoulder and is playing with more intensity...

I could see him as a Diaw type of player, but more explosive. Sign me up.

(I'm still more of a Bargnani proponent right now, but Gay does seem attractive. :clap:


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



> 1) Without taking into consideration the buyout issue, who would you choose first, Andrea Bargnani or Tiago Splitter?
> (Breno Pequeno, Belo Horizonte/MG)
> 
> I know this isn’t the most popular sentiment out there, but I would personally take Splitter. I think he has a much more defined role in the NBA, and I see him having success almost right off the bat if he’d ever be able to make it over. Bargnani is a very nice prospect, but after watching the half dozen or more tapes I have here on him, I feel like he might be a little overrated right now. Watching him play, I really wonder sometimes how many NBA teams he’d actually be able to contribute to consistently considering his poor defense and rebounding. Every time things start getting a little tough over in Benetton, he seems to disappear. The way he’s played in the Italian playoffs over the past month or so has to be a little worrysome considering the fact that he is a candidate to go #1 overall. When his outside shot isn’t falling, there are major concerns about how else he’d be able to make an impact on the game. I think he will end up figuring it out at some point, but with all the talk about how big his upside is, we need to keep in mind just how considerable his downside is too. I like Splitter a bit more...it’s just a shame that he is going to have to wait another year because he is ready to go right now.


taken from an Interfiew at draftexpress.com, might interest some of your Bargnani fans.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Rudy seems fuGayzi...

I don't know if I'm buying this just yet...But if this attitude was legit...That makes a HUGE difference

And if he can legitimately play the TWO?....LOL..wow...that would be hard to pass up.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Looks like the TT bandwagon has stopped, now everyone get off.

The SF thing did it for me. He's not ready and going to need developement. His interviews make him sound like a highschool kid. And the *proven* guys are calling you out and you back down after already saying you will face anyone.?


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## remlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I can't believe we are getting so down on Thomas just for an interview. Especially since the reporter stated himself that he didn't prepare for the interview. 

Who cares that TT thinks he is a SF or a future SF. He is what he is...a PF. Maybe his game can change into that of Marion or Al Harrington, but right now Thomas is a big guy that can contribute from day 1. 

This is what happens when there is so much time before the draft. We nit-pick every little thing a guy says. Maybe TT should take the role of Aldridge who doesnt say a thing and keeps his mouth shut, but call me crazy but i enjoy TT's forthcoming attitude. I enjoy a guy who won't back down at all.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



remlover said:


> I can't believe we are getting so down on Thomas just for an interview. Especially since the reporter stated himself that he didn't prepare for the interview.
> 
> Who cares that TT thinks he is a SF or a future SF. He is what he is...a PF. Maybe his game can change into that of Marion or Al Harrington, but right now Thomas is a big guy that can contribute from day 1.
> 
> This is what happens when there is so much time before the draft. We nit-pick every little thing a guy says. Maybe TT should take the role of Aldridge who doesnt say a thing and keeps his mouth shut, but call me crazy but i enjoy TT's forthcoming attitude. I enjoy a guy who won't back down at all.



Definatly doesn't sound like anybody on our current team.

I don't believe Pax and company like ATTITUDES...

He could be a potential problem...Who knows.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



sloth said:


> They had a workout scheduled for the Bulls, for June 19th together. Gay called out Thomas, saying that he could play the powerforward position better than Thomas, despite being a wing, claiming that a wing who plays the powerforward position better than a powerforward is a better pick. So then Thomas had to reschedule for the 15th.....its one thing to do solo workouts, but when you schedule a workout together with other players (I think it was Gay, Morrisson, and Reddick) and a guy calls you out and then you back out, that doesn't speak much for your competitive edge. Yes its a smart move for Tyrus, because Gay, Morrisson, and Reddick would have torched him in that workout, all three players want to prove they are better than Thomas, but Thomas backed out. Is Thomas going to fake sick when he has to play Rudy Gay? Same deal with Brandon Roy, backing out of a Charlotte workout in the middle of it because Gay was outplaying him. Why is everyone so afraid of Rudy Gay? Either he is really good and embarassing them, or he has bad body odor.


 :clap: :clap: Gay has kicked everyone's [edit] in the workouts. I wonder who wins, him or Morrison on the 19th


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



remlover said:


> I can't believe we are getting so down on Thomas just for an interview. Especially since the reporter stated himself that he didn't prepare for the interview.
> 
> Who cares that TT thinks he is a SF or a future SF. He is what he is...a PF. Maybe his game can change into that of Marion or Al Harrington, but right now Thomas is a big guy that can contribute from day 1.
> 
> This is what happens when there is so much time before the draft. We nit-pick every little thing a guy says. Maybe TT should take the role of Aldridge who doesnt say a thing and keeps his mouth shut, but call me crazy but i enjoy TT's forthcoming attitude. I enjoy a guy who won't back down at all.


Thomas was my pick for a while (followed very closely by Bargnani, though). But what changed my mind wasn't his interview; it was a combination of a) he seems to think he's a SF, b) his refusal to have competitive workouts (and personally I think he's hiding something), and c) I'm starting to think that he measured in small, like maybe 6'7 or 6'8 tops...hence possibly his "I'm a SF" comments. I wanted Tyrus because he'd be that freak of nature PF that could add a new dimension to our team. Run the floor and dunk, terrorize opposing 4's with his athleticisim, take them off the dribble, stuff their shots, etc. But if he measures small, and is indeed only a SF in size, I'm not sure we can risk having yet another undersized PF even if he is a freak. That said, if Pax takes him then he obviously saw something he really liked in workouts, so I'd at least give the kid a chance. There's no doubt he's talented.


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## narek

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



remlover said:


> I can't believe we are getting so down on Thomas just for an interview. Especially since the reporter stated himself that he didn't prepare for the interview.


I haven't been on anyone's bandwagon, but I'm down on Thomas because he keeps coming off as lacking maturity. He may end up being incredibly talented and a major force in the NBA but in 5 years. Do we really need a project?


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> taken from an Interfiew at draftexpress.com, might interest some of your Bargnani fans.


Which tapes has this guy seen ? 

Bargnani disappears during tough moments ? failed the play-off ? 

Rofl ... he's always on the floor in the last minutes/seconds of every game, above all the close ones ... and often he made clutch 3s or 6-7 points in a decisive run ... 

Then the play off: ok, he wasn't so brilliant, but not even bad ! and c'mon ... the guy is still 20y old ... 

Play-off (9 games) so far

28 mpg
11 ppg
6 rpg
1 bpg
4.4 fouls drawn
42% from 2
44% from 3
85% free throws


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Tyrus Thomas is still my pick, stupid interviews aside, he just needs some polish, some handlers. A lot of kids don't know how to act until they get "handlers" to teach them the media ins & outs. Frankly, Thomases agent needs to do a better job of keeping his boy prepared, I would fire the guy if I was Thomas. Of course Tyrus wouldn't want to work out competetively against Gay, Gay is a 2/3 and quick, Tyrus, for all of his talk of being a 3, is a 4 maybe even a 4/5 someday, Gay would run circles around him. And Gay, for all of his bluster, has never developed to anywhere near the player people think he is capable of becoming. In Hs everyone was on Gays jock and he got to college and his game was still basically a yawner. Now, thats not to say that he might not improve and become this McGrady like player that everyone thinks he is capable of being. SO far though it looks like Gay has underachieved to me and I would be wary. 

Interesting comments on Bargnani, kind of echoes my comments yesterday. Bargnani may be playing solid team ball but his stats in the tourney have not STOOD OUT. If your going to spend the #1 or 2 pick on a guy you want him to at least be able to put up a whopper game in the tourney, or even just a GOOD statistical game, we really haven't seen that out of Bargs, plus with the Worlds going on he can't work out for teams individually yet so that hurts his stock IMO.


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## BULLS23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> Tyrus Thomas is still my pick, stupid interviews aside, he just needs some polish, some handlers. A lot of kids don't know how to act until they get "handlers" to teach them the media ins & outs. Frankly, Thomases agent needs to do a better job of keeping his boy prepared, I would fire the guy if I was Thomas. Of course Tyrus wouldn't want to work out competetively against Gay, Gay is a 2/3 and quick, Tyrus, for all of his talk of being a 3, *is a 4 maybe even a 4/5 someday,* Gay would run circles around him. And Gay, for all of his bluster, has never developed to anywhere near the player people think he is capable of becoming. In Hs everyone was on Gays jock and he got to college and his game was still basically a yawner. Now, thats not to say that he might not improve and become this McGrady like player that everyone thinks he is capable of being. SO far though it looks like Gay has underachieved to me and I would be wary.
> 
> Interesting comments on Bargnani, kind of echoes my comments yesterday. Bargnani may be playing solid team ball but his stats in the tourney have not STOOD OUT. If your going to spend the #1 or 2 pick on a guy you want him to at least be able to put up a whopper game in the tourney, or even just a GOOD statistical game, we really haven't seen that out of Bargs, plus with the Worlds going on he can't work out for teams individually yet so that hurts his stock IMO.


Hey Ace, that not even true. Even if he measures in at 6'9" (which I have a VERY hard time thinking he will) he'll never come close to being a 5 in the league unless he's on Steroids . . . I honestly believe that he's one of those people who have a very hard time adding weight after a certain point. Just my opinion though.


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> taken from an Interfiew at draftexpress.com, might interest some of your Bargnani fans.


Perhaps it might help to add the the interview was from a Brazillian draft site? Maybe there was a bit of nationalism going on with his choice of Splitter over Bargnani?


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> And Gay, for all of his bluster, has never developed to anywhere near the player people think he is capable of becoming. In Hs everyone was on Gays jock and he got to college and his game was still basically a yawner. Now, thats not to say that he might not improve and become this McGrady like player that everyone thinks he is capable of being. SO far though it looks like Gay has underachieved to me and I would be wary.


Gay was better than Thomas in college and is the same age.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



BULLS23 said:


> Hey Ace, that not even true. Even if he measures in at 6'9" (which I have a VERY hard time thinking he will) he'll never come close to being a 5 in the league unless he's on Steroids . . . I honestly believe that he's one of those people who have a very hard time adding weight after a certain point. Just my opinion though.



Well, it really depends on how much muscle mass and strength he can add. If he can add quite a bit he could be very much in the mold of Ben Wallace, he might not be able to do that and could be more like a J O'neal type too, it remains to be seen. I would think that with his broad shoulders that an NBA strength coach like the Bulls Eric Helland should be able to help Thomas add strength a LOT.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



TripleDouble said:


> Gay was better than Thomas in college and is the same age.


Really? How do you quantify this? I think Thomas was better than Gay myself. Of course we can look at stats, if you compare Tyrus first year playing (his sophomore year) with Gay's first year playing (his freshman year) Thomas clearly comes out on top:

Thomas: 12.3ppg, 9.2rpg, 1.3apg, 1.8topg, 1spg, 3.1bpg, fg: 61% 25.9mpg

Gay (Freshman): 11.8ppg, 5.4rpg, 1.5apg, 1.9bpg, fg: 46% 28.8mpg

Gay (Sophmore): 15.2ppg, 6.4rpg, 2.1apg, 1.8spg, 1.69 bpg, fg:46% 30.8mpg


Clearly Thomas played better his first year playing than Gay did and their #'s with Gay as a sophomore and Thomas as a freshman are comparable. Plus, Gay played more minutes than Thomas and was a much much larger component for UConn than Thomas was at LSU. Thomas was more of a team player whereas Gay was regarded more at Uconn as "the man".

I definitley think Thomas was a better collegiate player. Incidenatlly, Thomas also averaged 16ppg, 12rpg, and 6bpg in high school...


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> Interesting comments on Bargnani, kind of echoes my comments yesterday. Bargnani may be playing solid team ball but his stats in the tourney have not STOOD OUT. If your going to spend the #1 or 2 pick on a guy you want him to at least be able to put up a whopper game in the tourney, or even just a GOOD statistical game, we really haven't seen that out of Bargs, plus with the Worlds going on he can't work out for teams individually yet so that hurts his stock IMO.


On a german 2nd division team like Dirk, Andrea would be averaging 24/10 if no more ...


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



italianBBlover said:


> On a german 2nd division team like Dirk, Andrea would be averaging 24/10 if no more ...



maybe, maybe not. I am familiar with euro ball a little so I do know things operate differently. Obviously you are a Bargnani fan and probably with good reason, thus far his statistical performance just hasn't been exceptional. Even if he had ONE really solid breakout game in the tourney I am sure he would be in GM's minds a little more. But when you see your potential #1 putting up 10pts & 3rebs in tournament play it worries you. I think Bargnani, from what little I have read and seen, will be an excellent pro, I also think he will be a 3 year project or so.


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> maybe, maybe not. I am familiar with euro ball a little so I do know things operate differently. Obviously you are a Bargnani fan and probably with good reason, thus far his statistical performance just hasn't been exceptional. Even if he had ONE really solid breakout game in the tourney I am sure he would be in GM's minds a little more. But when you see your potential #1 putting up 10pts & 3rebs in tournament play it worries you. I think Bargnani, from what little I have read and seen, will be an excellent pro, I also think he will be a 3 year project or so.


Putting up 11/6 in 28 mpg is that bad ? a 20y kid on a team full of euro veterans ? in the play-off for the italian championship ?

Look Gasol ...

2000-01 F.C. Barcelona
11.3 ppg
5.2 rpg
0.9 bpg

2001-2002 Memphis Grizzlies
17.6 ppg
8.9 rpg
2.0 bpg

:raised_ey

Andrea Bargnani full 2005-2006 season (without play-off)
22.5 mpg
12.0 ppg
5.5 rpg
1.3 bpg
1.4 spg


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



laso said:


> All right, I'll say it... The player that excites me the most at 2 is Gay. :brokenhea
> 
> Seriously, he seems to have quite the package. :biggrin: OK, now real seriously. Athletically, he's placed in the same category as Thomas. He's been working on his ballhandling to play the two. His workout with Draftexpress seemed to indicate he's got a chip on his shoulder and is playing with more intensity...
> 
> I could see him as a Diaw type of player, but more explosive. Sign me up.
> 
> (I'm still more of a Bargnani proponent right now, but Gay does seem attractive. :clap:


Hmm...Gay seems more attractive because he has a nice package. Better rethink that statement. :raised_ey


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*




italianBBlover said:


> Putting up 11/6 in 28 mpg is that bad ? a 20y kid on a team full of euro veterans ? in the play-off for the italian championship ?
> 
> Look Gasol ...
> 
> 2000-01 F.C. Barcelona
> 11.3 ppg
> 5.2 rpg
> 0.9 bpg
> 
> 2001-2002 Memphis Grizzlies
> 17.6 ppg
> 8.9 rpg
> 2.0 bpg
> 
> :raised_ey
> 
> Andrea Bargnani full 2005-2006 season (without play-off)
> 22.5 mpg
> 12.0 ppg
> 5.5 rpg
> 1.3 bpg
> 1.4 spg



Ummm, I don't know what to say except, yeah...it is. Maybe Bargnani will be Gasol or Nowitski, I don't know, but 12ppg & 5.5rpg is pretty underwhelming. I understand your point about his euro averages being close to superstars. I would be curious to see what Milicic or Lampe averaged in intl play as well, or even Diaw. Still, having decent #'s doesn't necessarily mean you are the next Pau Gasol, or that your not, I trust the Bulls scouting of Bargnani more than mine as I have only seen the guy twice and wasn't blown away.


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



italianBBlover said:


> Putting up 11/6 in 28 mpg is that bad ? a 20y kid on a team full of euro veterans ? in the play-off for the italian championship ?
> 
> Look Gasol ...
> 
> 2000-01 F.C. Barcelona
> 11.3 ppg
> 5.2 rpg
> 0.9 bpg
> 
> 2001-2002 Memphis Grizzlies
> 17.6 ppg
> 8.9 rpg
> 2.0 bpg
> 
> :raised_ey
> 
> Andrea Bargnani full 2005-2006 season (without play-off)
> 22.5 mpg
> 12.0 ppg
> 5.5 rpg
> 1.3 bpg
> 1.4 spg


Excellent points. It's also noteworthy that Gasol was considered a star for his old team, was he not? Despite the very mild statistics (by American/NBA standards at least).


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Then you must consider how usually euro teams play lot of "team basketball", as you know ... just look the Suns of D'Antoni ... a part Marion "the freak", the other players don't have big/outstanding numbers ... but PHX scores 100-110 points like nothing and they win 50-60 games per season (with that system).


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



italianBBlover said:


> Then you must consider how usually euro teams play lot of "team basketball", as you know ... just look the Suns of D'Antoni ... a part Marion "the freak", the other players don't have big/outstanding numbers ... but PHX scores 100-110 points like nothing and they win 50-60 games per season (with the system).


I know and Bargnani might just be the next great thing. I'm just not convinced with what little I have seen of him. And even if he IS the next great thing he may be a bit of a project as an NBA player.


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## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> he may be a bit of a project as an NBA player.


Wasn't the same with Gasol coming from Spain with those "poor" numbers or Nowitzki from an almost unknow german 2nd division ?


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> Ummm, I don't know what to say except, yeah...it is. Maybe Bargnani will be Gasol or Nowitski, I don't know, but 12ppg & 5.5rpg is pretty underwhelming. I understand your point about his euro averages being close to superstars. I would be curious to see what Milicic or Lampe averaged in intl play as well, or even Diaw. Still, having decent #'s doesn't necessarily mean you are the next Pau Gasol, or that your not, I trust the Bulls scouting of Bargnani more than mine as I have only seen the guy twice and wasn't blown away.


Here are numbers for Diaw, Milicic, and Lampe. The biggest difference between Bargnani and the latter two (or someone like Skita) is that Bargnani is getting tons of PT (especially considering his age) on a quality first-division team. Lampe rode the pine when he played for Real Madrid, and Darko was on a junior/second-division team.

http://www.tsn.ca/nba/teams/players/bio/?id=938&hubname=nba-suns

http://www.tsn.ca/nba/teams/players/bio/?id=902&hubname=nba-magic

http://www.tsn.ca/nba/teams/players/bio/?id=955&hubname=nba-rockets

Bargnani's situation is very comparable to Gasol's. He may not be the top producer for Treviso, but he's considered their best overall player because of his age and potential.


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

so no measurements yet!?

i emailed mcgraw yesterday to find out if he had them (sneaky) and he said he didn't have them.



> I have not seen the heights and test results. Over the years, they've been very inconsistent about releasing those to the media. I remember years when they just put a pile for the taking on a table at Moody Bible. Other years, they released them via e-mail a few days after the camp _and sometimes they never made them available._


 :eek8: 

he thinks they'll get leaked this week.



then we talked about troy murphy:



> I've been meaning to ask some Bulls insiders if they like Troy Murphy. I hate him. He never takes a shot within 20 feet. I wouldn't trade a second-round pick for him, with that ridiculous contract he has. Usually, Pax and I are on the same wavelength (he agrees that Jermaine O'Neal would probably be a bad addition), but you never know.


and then i said i thought that Brandon Roy was a smokescreen, for Bargnani and Mike doesn't think so:



> The Roy talk is legit. He's a close second on their list right now behind Thomas. I've seen no evidence the Bulls like Bargnani enough to take him at #2.





:raised_ey 

so there you have it. one bulls writers _OPINION_. doesn't mean it's carved in stone. who knows what will happen!?


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ScottMay said:


> Here are numbers for Diaw, Milicic, and Lampe. The biggest difference between Bargnani and the latter two (or someone like Skita) is that Bargnani is getting tons of PT (especially considering his age) on a quality first-division team. Lampe rode the pine when he played for Real Madrid, and Darko was on a junior/second-division team.
> 
> http://www.tsn.ca/nba/teams/players/bio/?id=938&hubname=nba-suns
> 
> http://www.tsn.ca/nba/teams/players/bio/?id=902&hubname=nba-magic
> 
> http://www.tsn.ca/nba/teams/players/bio/?id=955&hubname=nba-rockets
> 
> Bargnani's situation is very comparable to Gasol's. He may not be the top producer for Treviso, but he's considered their best overall player because of his age and potential.


Thanks for the stats, interesting. Milici almost matched Bargnani's stats in less mpg. I definitley understand that Bargnani is Bennetton Treviso's star and has a great deal of potential. JUst to clarify, I am not even saying that I think Bargnani will be a bust or not be a good pro, he might very well be the next Dirk or Pau and if so I hope Pax takes him if he is available. I'm just not sold enough on him to talk him up quite that much yet.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> Milici almost matched Bargnani's stats in less mpg.


. . . but as I said, he wasn't playing for a top team. Maybe one of the Eurobasket/ULEB followers can explain the differences in the leagues/divisions.


----------



## ChiSox

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

What do you think about Paul Davis? If he is available I would think Paxson would have to consider taking him with the 16th pick. He was highly productive in college, has a good back to the basket game, and is a good shooter. He rebounds really well and he is a true center. He may not be able to block shots but he moves his feet well and is really good on offense and defense. 

He is 6'11" and has game. To me he is better than a lot of player rated ahead of him in the draft i.e. Hilton Armstrong, Mouhamed Saer Sene, and Cedric Simmons. I have seen him play, looked at his stats and believe he will be a good NBA center.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Does anyone know if DraftExpress or anyone will be attending Aldridge, Tyrus, or Roy's workouts this week? I'd love to get an insight scoop on them.

I wonder if Houston is still looking to get Reddick at 8.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



fl_flash said:


> Perhaps it might help to add the the interview was from a Brazillian draft site? Maybe there was a bit of nationalism going on with his choice of Splitter over Bargnani?


*shrugs shoulders*

only thing i know is, they've seen more of him than us


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ChiSox said:


> What do you think about Paul Davis? If he is available I would think Paxson would have to consider taking him with the 16th pick. He was highly productive in college, has a good back to the basket game, and is a good shooter. He rebounds really well and he is a true center. He may not be able to block shots but he moves his feet well and is really good on offense and defense.
> 
> He is 6'11" and has game. To me he is better than a lot of player rated ahead of him in the draft i.e. Hilton Armstrong, Mouhamed Saer Sene, and Cedric Simmons. I have seen him play, looked at his stats and believe he will be a good NBA center.


No No and No! 1st overall all those players are better than him and secondly I wouldn't want to lose RLucas as a poster if this were to happen. As a Michigan State fan, I have a tough time believing that last year's team could possibly produce 3 1st rounders after how badly they played this season as a team. Paul Davis is almost the same player today as the day Izzo recruited him, I think that says enough for me.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> maybe, maybe not. I am familiar with euro ball a little so I do know things operate differently. Obviously you are a Bargnani fan and probably with good reason, thus far his statistical performance just hasn't been exceptional. Even if he had ONE really solid breakout game in the tourney I am sure he would be in GM's minds a little more. But when you see your potential #1 putting up 10pts & 3rebs in tournament play it worries you. I think Bargnani, from what little I have read and seen, will be an excellent pro, I also think he will be a 3 year project or so.


How about these games?

May 17th, 2006. Playoff game #1 against Milano

28 mins
20 pts
1 for 2 2pt
2 for 4 3pt
12-14 FT
5 boards

May 25th, 2006. Playoff game #4 against Milano

25 mins
15 pts
3 for 4 2pt
2 for 2 3 pt
3 for 4 FT
7 boards (team high)

May 27th, 2006. Playoff game #5 against Milano

31 mins
15 pts
3 for 5 2pt
1 for 5 3pt
6 for 6 FT
5 boards

He's trailed off somewhat in his semifinal games, but I think part of that has been he's been sick for at least two of those games. Those are two solid games and one pretty damned good one. So, I believe your assertion that if he'd only have ONE breakout game (I'm not quite sure what that is) is pretty much baseless. He's got the finals now against Bologna (best team in the league). We'll just have to see how he does. The guy is a player though.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



fl_flash said:


> How about these games?
> 
> May 17th, 2006. Playoff game #1 against Milano
> 
> 28 mins
> 20 pts
> 1 for 2 2pt
> 2 for 4 3pt
> 12-14 FT
> 5 boards
> 
> May 25th, 2006. Playoff game #4 against Milano
> 
> 25 mins
> 15 pts
> 3 for 4 2pt
> 2 for 2 3 pt
> 3 for 4 FT
> 7 boards (team high)
> 
> May 27th, 2006. Playoff game #5 against Milano
> 
> 31 mins
> 15 pts
> 3 for 5 2pt
> 1 for 5 3pt
> 6 for 6 FT
> 5 boards
> 
> He's trailed off somewhat in his semifinal games, but I think part of that has been he's been sick for at least two of those games. Those are two solid games and one pretty damned good one. So, I believe your assertion that if he'd only have ONE breakout game (I'm not quite sure what that is) is pretty much baseless. He's got the finals now against Bologna (best team in the league). We'll just have to see how he does. The guy is a player though.


One non-playoff-related statistical tidbit I found today that I'd like to add -- Bargnani led the Italian League Series A in blocks per game this season (1.4).


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mizenkay said:


> so no measurements yet!?
> 
> i emailed mcgraw yesterday to find out if he had them (sneaky) and he said he didn't have them.
> 
> 
> 
> :eek8:
> 
> he thinks they'll get leaked this week.
> 
> then we talked about troy murphy:
> 
> and then i said i thought that Brandon Roy was a smokescreen, for Bargnani and Mike doesn't think so:
> 
> :raised_ey
> 
> so there you have it. one bulls writers _OPINION_. doesn't mean it's carved in stone. who knows what will happen!?


 props on the info

nice to know pax feels how we feel on trying to add JO.

McGraw agreeing that Thomas was still #1 just proves to me that Chad Ford knows Pax VERY well. He JUST said that yesterday in the Insider.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Or at least. . . Chad Ford know McGraw very well.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



fl_flash said:


> How about these games?
> 
> May 17th, 2006. Playoff game #1 against Milano
> 
> 28 mins
> 20 pts
> 1 for 2 2pt
> 2 for 4 3pt
> 12-14 FT
> 5 boards
> 
> May 25th, 2006. Playoff game #4 against Milano
> 
> 25 mins
> 15 pts
> 3 for 4 2pt
> 2 for 2 3 pt
> 3 for 4 FT
> 7 boards (team high)
> 
> May 27th, 2006. Playoff game #5 against Milano
> 
> 31 mins
> 15 pts
> 3 for 5 2pt
> 1 for 5 3pt
> 6 for 6 FT
> 5 boards
> 
> He's trailed off somewhat in his semifinal games, but I think part of that has been he's been sick for at least two of those games. Those are two solid games and one pretty damned good one. So, I believe your assertion that if he'd only have ONE breakout game (I'm not quite sure what that is) is pretty much baseless. He's got the finals now against Bologna (best team in the league). We'll just have to see how he does. The guy is a player though.



And those are good, but not great #'s. 20pts 5reb, 15pt 7reb, 15pt 5reb, those are all pretty good in euro play and everything but I don't look at those as a "breakout" game either. Compare them with some of Thomas & Aldridge's collegiate games (obviously euro pros are better than college players, still) 


Thomas @ Tx: 39minutes, 21pts, 10-14fg 1-3ft, 13rebs, 1ast, 1stl, 1to, 3blk

@Duke: 9pts, 3-5 fg, 3-6ft, 13rebs, 1ast, 3to's, 1stl, 5blks

Thomas had SIXTEEN blocks during march madness, how many has Bargnani had in the euro tourney overall?

Aldridge @ W.virginia: 37minutes, 26pts, 11-15fg, 4-8ft, 13rebs, 2ast, 1to

And I could go back through the season and find plenty of similar examples of these sorts of games, they aren't just one or two game anomalies. What inspires more confidence in you if you have the #2 pick? 11 & 6 or 21, 13, & 3 / 26 & 13?


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

This threads a beast. I think its already the 4th biggest thread on the site, and the largest basketball related thread. Assuming we keep this for the actual draft day, I think we can get 4,500 posts, this thread is beastly.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



such sweet thunder said:


> Or at least. . . Chad Ford know McGraw very well.


lol that could be then case also


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> And those are good, but not great #'s. 20pts 5reb, 15pt 7reb, 15pt 5reb, those are all pretty good in euro play and everything but I don't look at those as a "breakout" game either. Compare them with some of Thomas & Aldridge's collegiate games (obviously euro pros are better than college players, still)
> 
> 
> Thomas @ Tx: 39minutes, 21pts, 10-14fg 1-3ft, 13rebs, 1ast, 1stl, 1to, 3blk
> 
> @Duke: 9pts, 3-5 fg, 3-6ft, 13rebs, 1ast, 3to's, 1stl, 5blks
> 
> Thomas had SIXTEEN blocks during march madness, how many has Bargnani had in the euro tourney overall?
> 
> Aldridge @ W.virginia: 37minutes, 26pts, 11-15fg, 4-8ft, 13rebs, 2ast, 1to
> 
> And I could go back through the season and find plenty of similar examples of these sorts of games, they aren't just one or two game anomalies. What inspires more confidence in you if you have the #2 pick? 11 & 6 or 21, 13, & 3 / 26 & 13?


You're just not getting it. You asked for solid game examples and one breakout game (which I still don't know what that criteria is) and I gave them to you. You then cite 9pts, 13 boards, 1 assist, 3 TO's 1 steal and 5 blocks as something to be impressed about????? Thomas scores 21 points in 39 minutes and that's great but Bargnani scores 20 points in 28 minutes against far better competition and that's nothing big? I believe Bargnani has 11 or so blocks in the Italian tourney so far. What's your point? Aldridge had a nice game against West Virginia. What did he do against LSU?

Nice that you ask for what inspires confidence and you lay out Bargnani's season average and then compare it to a single game for one player. Way to NOT prove a point. You can do better than this, can't you ACE?

The European game is different and you can't just blindly try to translate stats across the Atlantic Ocean. It doesn't work. Educate yourself on the European game. I did. I've come away pretty impressed. They play a different brand of ball over there. Generally a slower pace. 40 mins vs. 48 mins. Teams overall shoot a better percentage which means fewer boards. An assist is an arbitrary gift it seems in Europe with no clear definition and that's why you don't see guys averaging double-digit assists. Scoring is generally lower and team play is stressed almost to a fault. You just don't have players who go out and score 30 a night - that's not team ball. You put Bargnani against the Fairliegh-Dickensons of the world and tell him to "just score baby" and he'd shread the NCAA level player. If you choose not to even consider that for whatever reason; that's your perrogative.

Bargnani is a player.


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ScottMay said:


> . . . but as I said, he wasn't playing for a top team. Maybe one of the Eurobasket/ULEB followers can explain the differences in the leagues/divisions.


Yep, serbian league isn't comparable with the A1 league ...

then someone should explain me how Lampe went to NBA with those numbers :eek8: 

Man ... they are worse than the Skita's ones ...


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mizenkay said:


> then we talked about troy murphy:
> 
> I've been meaning to ask some Bulls insiders if they like Troy Murphy. I hate him. He never takes a shot within 20 feet. I wouldn't trade a second-round pick for him, with that ridiculous contract he has.


 :clap: 

Troy Murphy is one of the most overrated players on these boards. I keep seeing people come up with potential trades for him and I have no idea why. Bay Area sportswriters / talk show hosts are always bashing the guy. Callers defend him by throwing up his "stats" and the hosts say his stats fool everyone. His double-doubles do not really reflect his overall impact on the games. 

As others have pointed out, Murphy is a jumpshooting big-man who shoots in the low 40's. His defense is horrible. Add to that his ridiculous contract and we'd be stupid to give up a 2nd round pick for him straight-up, as Mike suggested.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Yeah, I haven't been a fan of taking these European guys that don't put up stats, but Bargnani is not one of these cases. He obviously has game, and is contributing. I've never gotten why the best players on these teams are never given any attention. But then again, Mario Austin was the MVP in a league over there, so its hard to tell.


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



> Fran Fraschilla stood in the Lawrence North High School gymnasium, watching the boys basketball team practice. The former college coach turned ESPN announcer was in town in December to cover a Wildcats game, and he wanted a first-hand look at the main attraction.
> 
> After watching the 7-foot, 260-pound Greg Oden, Fraschilla decided there were no modern comparisons.
> "From the mid-'70s on, I've seen all the guys. Shaq. Ralph Sampson. Alonzo Mourning. He's the best," Fraschilla said of The Star's 2006 Marion County Male Athlete of the Year.
> "I think defensively, he can hold his own right now in the NBA, and offensively, he's going to get tip dunks and the close-in shots, run the floor, get points that way. And that's before all the work on his post game really starts to kick in."
> --
> Oden is considered such an important part of America's basketball future that Phoenix Suns owner Jerry Colangelo, head of the USA Basketball men's program, invited Oden to scrimmage with the national team.


http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060613/SPORTS02/606130392


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

So New Orleans is trading their #12 & #15 for Houston's #8. That's more than likely to happen now.

good trade for both teams


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



italianBBlover said:


> then someone should explain me how Lampe went to NBA with those numbers :eek8:
> 
> Man ... they are worse than the Skita's ones ...


If I'm not mistaken, Real Madrid loaned Lampe to their junior club and he went nuts for a few games, putting up something close to a 20/10. It's not the same as doing it on the big stage, but I think that's where a lot of his hype started. Then he fell to the second round because of buyout fears.

I think Lampe could be a useful NBA player . . . ain't gonna happen in Houston, though.


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



sloth said:


> But then again, Mario Austin was the MVP in a league over there, so its hard to tell.


Mario Austin ? MVP ? where ?

1 season ago he played for Biella, a middle-low standing team of the italian top league, and these were his stats

34.5 mpg
16.7 ppg
6.1 rpg
0.3 bpg (11 blocks in the whole season)
http://195.56.77.208/player/?id=AUS-MAR-82

And he was the "main gun" of this low standing team ... look how many 2 pointers he shot in some games ...

http://195.56.77.208/player/pbd.phtml?ply=AUS-MAR-82&year=2004&team=1087&type2=d1&name_search=Austin

all but a MVP ... if not in the Cyprus or Ukrainan league :raised_ey


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> So New Orleans is trading their #12 & #15 for Houston's #8. That's more than likely to happen now.
> 
> good trade for both teams


Really? Any idea who either team is looking to draft?

Link? Or is this insider info?

Thanks again for the tidbits


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Really? Any idea who either team is looking to draft?
> 
> Link? Or is this insider info?
> 
> Thanks again for the tidbits


i got it off hoopshype, but it was a link from draftexpress...

they didn't say it was set in stone...but with houston trying to move down and the hornets tryin to move up...it sounded like something that was probably a no-brainer

they said NO likes Shelden @ #8 and Houston thinks they can grab one of the guards they covet at #12...they said nothing about the 15th pick tho


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



italianBBlover said:


> Mario Austin ? MVP ? where ?
> 
> 1 season ago he played for Biella, a middle-low standing team of the italian top league, and these were his stats
> 
> 34.5 mpg
> 16.7 ppg
> 6.1 rpg
> 0.3 bpg (11 blocks in the whole season)
> http://195.56.77.208/player/?id=AUS-MAR-82
> 
> And he was the "main gun" of this low standing team ... look how many 2 pointers he shot in some games ...
> 
> http://195.56.77.208/player/pbd.phtml?ply=AUS-MAR-82&year=2004&team=1087&type2=d1&name_search=Austin
> 
> all but a MVP ... if not in the Cyprus or Ukrainan league :raised_ey



A couple seasons ago he played for CSKA Moskow and put up around 20 ppg, I think. That's probably the season he was referring to.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



fl_flash said:


> You're just not getting it. You asked for solid game examples and one breakout game (which I still don't know what that criteria is) and I gave them to you. You then cite 9pts, 13 boards, 1 assist, 3 TO's 1 steal and 5 blocks as something to be impressed about????? Thomas scores 21 points in 39 minutes and that's great but Bargnani scores 20 points in 28 minutes against far better competition and that's nothing big? I believe Bargnani has 11 or so blocks in the Italian tourney so far. What's your point? Aldridge had a nice game against West Virginia.  What did he do against LSU?
> 
> Nice that you ask for what inspires confidence and you lay out Bargnani's season average and then compare it to a single game for one player. Way to NOT prove a point. You can do better than this, can't you ACE?
> 
> The European game is different and you can't just blindly try to translate stats across the Atlantic Ocean. It doesn't work. Educate yourself on the European game. I did. I've come away pretty impressed. They play a different brand of ball over there. Generally a slower pace. 40 mins vs. 48 mins. Teams overall shoot a better percentage which means fewer boards. An assist is an arbitrary gift it seems in Europe with no clear definition and that's why you don't see guys averaging double-digit assists. Scoring is generally lower and team play is stressed almost to a fault. You just don't have players who go out and score 30 a night - that's not team ball. You put Bargnani against the Fairliegh-Dickensons of the world and tell him to "just score baby" and he'd shread the NCAA level player. If you choose not to even consider that for whatever reason; that's your perrogative.
> 
> Bargnani is a player.


I do get it and I have watched quite a bit of euro ball myself, the game is definitley different over there, more passing, better shot selection, tougher perimeter defense. And I know that stats don't translate, you can easily look at Bargnani's production on Benneton Treviso and conclude that if he were playing for Texas or Duke his stats would be much better. And maybe they would be, maybe they wouldn't? Honestly with what little I have seen of Bargnani I just don't know and I am willing to admit that. And I think nabbing 13rebs & getting 5 blocks is pretty darn impressive. I will never see a breakout game like I would like to see from Bargnani where he is playing. I'd love to see him have a 20pt, 10reb, 2 block game but it isn't very likely given his cirucmstances. That doesn't mean he isn't going to be a great NBA player. A lot of GM's rave over his abilities and from the highlight reels I have seen he is definitley a skilled player. I'm not disputing that or disputing that Bargnani might be a good NBA player or even the guy we should pick at #2, I'm just not sold from what information I have. 

Thomas didn't have a great game against LSU, it looked a lot like some of Bargnani's recent performances honestly. But, like I said, I can go back on Aldridge's game by game or Thomases and find probably a dozen examples of high quality games, I think thats a good thing. 

Ok, I see your point and I think in the haste of my post I compared one game of Aldridge Thomas vs Bargnani's season average. Ok, so 20 & 5 compared to 21 & 13. Or, 11, 6, 1.6 compared to 12.3, 9.2 & 3.1blocks. The competetion is tougher overseas and I am well aware of that. I think people are getting the impression that I am anti-Bargnani and thats just not the case. I think his stock has slipped a little because he is being viewed as more of an NBA project and he hasn't played exceedingly well recently in the tourney, thats it.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



L.O.B said:


> No No and No! 1st overall all those players are better than him and secondly I wouldn't want to lose RLucas as a poster if this were to happen. As a Michigan State fan, I have a tough time believing that last year's team could possibly produce 3 1st rounders after how badly they played this season as a team. Paul Davis is almost the same player today as the day Izzo recruited him, I think that says enough for me.


I would probably reach for a sharp object if we draft Paul Davis. But you raise an interesting point about several potential NBA players producing a bad college team. It reminds me of DePaul (my old school) back in 2000-2001. They had several pro prospects as well...Bobby Simmons and Steven Hunter among them. Yet they were absolutely horrible...I think they were something like 12-20 on the season.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



fl_flash said:


> The European game is different and you can't just blindly try to translate stats across the Atlantic Ocean. It doesn't work. Educate yourself on the European game. I did. I've come away pretty impressed. They play a different brand of ball over there. Generally a slower pace. 40 mins vs. 48 mins. Teams overall shoot a better percentage which means fewer boards. An assist is an arbitrary gift it seems in Europe with no clear definition and that's why you don't see guys averaging double-digit assists. Scoring is generally lower and team play is stressed almost to a fault. You just don't have players who go out and score 30 a night - that's not team ball. You put Bargnani against the Fairliegh-Dickensons of the world and tell him to "just score baby" and he'd shread the NCAA level player. If you choose not to even consider that for whatever reason; that's your perrogative.
> 
> Bargnani is a player.


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to fl_flash again.


----------



## ChiSox

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



yodurk said:


> I would probably reach for a sharp object if we draft Paul Davis. But you raise an interesting point about several potential NBA players producing a bad college team. It reminds me of DePaul (my old school) back in 2000-2001. They had several pro prospects as well...Bobby Simmons and Steven Hunter among them. Yet they were absolutely horrible...I think they were something like 12-20 on the season.


The 2000 Depaul team had several NBA player but underachieved bigtime. They had Q, Simmons, Hunter and McPherson who all have played in the NBA. 

MSU biggest problem was no point guard. If you don't have a very good point guard, you won't be very successful in college basketball.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

For Bargnani advocates:

What do you see in the highlights that suggests he will be very good? 

I'm asking because every time I see a must see Bargnani highlight, I'm underwhelmed. 

The pluses I see are a great shot for a seven footer and a pretty quick first step (again, for a seven footer). 

What I don't see: strength, post moves, passing, ball handling, leaping ability, moves beside the show and go using his aforementioned quick first step. 

What am I missing?


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



TripleDouble said:


> For Bargnani advocates:
> 
> What do you see in the highlights that suggests he will be very good?
> 
> I'm asking because every time I see a must see Bargnani highlight, I'm underwhelmed.
> 
> The pluses I see are a great shot for a seven footer and a pretty quick first step (again, for a seven footer).
> 
> What I don't see: strength, post moves, passing, ball handling, leaping ability, moves beside the show and go using his aforementioned quick first step.
> 
> What am I missing?


You don't see ballhandling? Several of his best highlights involve him making hard drives to the basket, which shows both good ballhandling skill AND solid athletic ability. 

But to be clear, I pay VERY little credit to highlight clips. I think they're fun to watch but I don't rely on them for solid information. My judgement is based on the cold hard facts, which have been discussed ad nauseum in this thread: 1) Benneton Treviso is an excellent team in the ultra-competitive Euroleague, 2) Bargnani plays major minutes on this team, 3) Bargnani is one of the youngest Euroleague players to have such a big role on his team, 4) 11 ppg is solid for Euroleague's style of play, 5) He scores efficiently; well over 50% shooting and 80% FT shooting (and FT shooting is something that will not change in the NBA).


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Anyone else see the cris ford post mock about if roy falls to 7 teams looking to trade up to get him include the bulls. The reason i mention this is with all the talk about morrison going number 1 and Williams having a commitment from Atl at 5 someone is going to have to drop out of the top 5 or 6. I also think i read that Minny wants a PG bad and is planning on taking Marcus at 6. Is it possible that Roy could be there at 7 and the bulls are trying to trade down to get him.

And if Morrison is number one and thomas number 2 where is bangnani going. I think the Raptors and the bobcats are going to swap picks and Kight and the raptors will still take Bangnani at 3. Which means Portland is on the clock for LA and Gay is still there at 6. Would Minny take marcus over Gay?

david


----------



## dogra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



giusd said:


> ... if roy falls to 7 teams looking to *trade up* to get him include the bulls.... Is it possible that Roy could be there at 7 and the bulls are trying to *trade down* to get him.
> 
> david


Which is it?  

I'm trying to get the rumors straight in my head -- 

Are we trying to trade UP from 16 to grab Roy (something I would be into) or trying to trade DOWN from 2 to grab Roy (something I'm much less interested in)?


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



TripleDouble said:


> For Bargnani advocates:
> 
> What do you see in the highlights that suggests he will be very good?
> 
> I'm asking because every time I see a must see Bargnani highlight, I'm underwhelmed.
> 
> The pluses I see are a great shot for a seven footer and a pretty quick first step (again, for a seven footer).
> 
> What I don't see: strength, post moves, passing, ball handling, leaping ability, moves beside the show and go using his aforementioned quick first step.
> 
> What am I missing?


Well, from the various highlight videos out there, he's an exceptional ball handler for a seven (or near seven) footer. You don't steal the ball on the wing, drive the length of the floor, cross over the defender and finish at the rim while drawing contact and not have the ability to do so. It's not like he had this epihpany for 10 seconds and was able to do those things. He has a very nice shooting stroke - all the way out to NBA 3-point range. He can go right or left and has a very quick first step. Combine that with better than average ball-handling and you've got yourself a handfull. His post game is raw, but that doesn't mean it's non-existant. The thing about watching all these highlight films is that you forget this guy is in the 6'-10" to 7' range. He moves like a 6'-6" guy. He's a good rebounder, not great. He's a good to very good shot blocker.

He's not the rugged post player that many seem to think this team needs. He will spread the floor like nobodies business and allow Hinrich and Gordon (and Deng and Noch) all sorts of room to operate. He'd be golden on the Pick and Roll because you'd have to honor not only the outside shot but if you double the ball handler, he's got the hands and ability to roll to the rim and finish. On the defensive side of things, I think he'll be an OK defender. Not Ben Wallace great, but he should be able to hold his own. He's not the athlete that Thomas is, but he's far, far more advanced offensively. I think he's every bit as polished as Aldridge (actually, moreso) and he's just as big. I think Thomas will end up the better defender - at least from a rebounding and blocked shot standpoint. 

Then there's all the stuff that yodurk posted. He's getting PT in a difficult league at a young age and producing good (not great) numbers.

In short, he's a player.


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## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

If Roy is Pax's guy, he's...

1. Going to set up a trade where he thinks Roy should be taken.
2. Pick a big that he won't mind keeping with the second pick
3. Trade that pick for Roy and a player or a pick or considerations when Roy successfully falls to that draft spot.

He'd be stupid to trade the pick and hope...and Paxson doesn't strike me as a very stupid GM.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



fl_flash said:


> Well, from the various highlight videos out there, he's an exceptional ball handler for a seven (or near seven) footer. You don't steal the ball on the wing, drive the length of the floor, cross over the defender and finish at the rim while drawing contact and not have the ability to do so. It's not like he had this epihpany for 10 seconds and was able to do those things. He has a very nice shooting stroke - all the way out to NBA 3-point range. He can go right or left and has a very quick first step. Combine that with better than average ball-handling and you've got yourself a handfull. His post game is raw, but that doesn't mean it's non-existant. The thing about watching all these highlight films is that you forget this guy is in the 6'-10" to 7' range. He moves like a 6'-6" guy. He's a good rebounder, not great. He's a good to very good shot blocker.
> 
> He's not the rugged post player that many seem to think this team needs. He will spread the floor like nobodies business and allow Hinrich and Gordon (and Deng and Noch) all sorts of room to operate. He'd be golden on the Pick and Roll because you'd have to honor not only the outside shot but if you double the ball handler, he's got the hands and ability to roll to the rim and finish. On the defensive side of things, I think he'll be an OK defender. Not Ben Wallace great, but he should be able to hold his own. He's not the athlete that Thomas is, but he's far, far more advanced offensively. I think he's every bit as polished as Aldridge (actually, moreso) and he's just as big. I think Thomas will end up the better defender - at least from a rebounding and blocked shot standpoint.
> 
> Then there's all the stuff that yodurk posted. He's getting PT in a difficult league at a young age and producing good (not great) numbers.
> 
> In short, he's a player.



I'm sold. Give me Bargnani.............or Aldridge.................Or Thomas........... Or Roy..... LOL.

Actually, that would be my ranking today.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I think paxson is going to both trade down from 2 and still get a big man and then use what he gets from trading down to trade up from 16 to get a big SG. We shall see.

david


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Those highlights of Bargnani really do say a lot,. Just his athletisism and size are enough to be impressed. But his form and ball handling are just outstanding, besides Dirk, Garnett, Odom, Webber, Villanueva and Antione Walker no other 4-5 players can compare in these combined abilities. Besides Charlie who may be more of a 3 anyway and is still, all these guys have made multiple allstar teams.


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## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



dogra said:


> Which is it?
> 
> I'm trying to get the rumors straight in my head --
> 
> Are we trying to trade UP from 16 to grab Roy (something I would be into) or trying to trade DOWN from 2 to grab Roy (something I'm much less interested in)?


 Chad Fords quote is:

The skinny: A number of teams are trying to move up in the draft to get Roy. If Roy's available at No. 7, you can expect the Magic, Jazz, Bulls and Pacers to all make a serious pitch.

It really doesn't specify.


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## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



GB said:


> If Roy is Pax's guy, he's...
> 
> 1. Going to set up a trade where he thinks Roy should be taken.
> 2. Pick a big that he won't mind keeping with the second pick
> 3. Trade that pick for Roy and a player or a pick or considerations when Roy successfully falls to that draft spot.
> 
> He'd be stupid to trade the pick and hope...and Paxson doesn't strike me as a very stupid GM.


I think the GM's have alot better idea about where players are going so this is entirely possible.

If Paxson can magically convert the 2# and 16# into Roy and Simmons then I think we'd all be happy campers. He'd have to get a third team involved for that


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



darlets said:


> I think the GM's have alot better idea about where players are going so this is entirely possible.
> 
> If Paxson can magically convert the 2# and 16# into Roy and Simmons then I think we'd all be happy campers. He'd have to get a third team involved for that


"All"? that's stretching it.

I for one, wouldn't be happy


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> "All"? that's stretching it.
> 
> I for one, wouldn't be happy


That would garner a D+ grade from me for Paxson on the draft.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



such sweet thunder said:


> Chad Fords quote is:
> 
> The skinny: A number of teams are trying to move up in the draft to get Roy. If Roy's available at No. 7, you can expect the Magic, Jazz, Bulls and Pacers to all make a serious pitch.
> 
> It really doesn't specify.


I believe he's going to package a player with the #16 pick and move up to get a guard like Brewer or Roy.

Do that and add a big with the #2 pick, I'd have to give him an A+ for that draft.

I'd expect Duhon to be part of any package with the #16 if we're looking to get a guard.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> I believe he's going to package a player with the #16 pick and move up to get a guard like Brewer or Roy.
> 
> Do that and add a big with the #2 pick, I'd have to give him an A+ for that draft.
> 
> I'd expect Duhon to be part of any package with the #16 if we're looking to get a guard.


 Hope so, that's what I've been advocating for months.


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## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

What two picks would make you happy???? Or trade and picks?


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Anyone read the scouting reports on the 06' prospects on bulls.com, 

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/draft_prospects06a.html

no negative feedback at all, and seemingly a ton a positive feedback that isn't even true.


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## darlets

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Slightly off topic, but what actually happened to the draft measurements?????


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I think that's what everyone wants to see. Not a whole lot more consider at this point unless it's about the foriegn guys, mainly Sefolosha and Barg. Really TT is all I want to know about, many of the other guys obviusly have size or we have seen results already.


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## BULLS23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



darlets said:


> If Paxson can magically convert the 2# and 16# into Roy and Simmons then I think we'd all be happy campers. He'd have to get a third team involved for that



I'd be pretty disappointed with that draft if it were to happen . . . I think we need to get off Roy unless we trade up from 16. I'd like a big - Aldridge - with the #2.


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## dogra

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> I believe he's going to package a player with the #16 pick and move up to get a guard like Brewer or Roy.
> 
> Do that and add a big with the #2 pick, I'd have to give him an A+ for that draft....


Agreed. That's exactly the scenario I'm hoping for.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



Hustle said:


> Anyone read the scouting reports on the 06' prospects on bulls.com,
> 
> http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/draft_prospects06a.html
> 
> no negative feedback at all, and seemingly a ton a positive feedback that isn't even true.


looks like they copied and pasted that stuff from nbadraft.net


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## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

An article on LaMarcus Aldridge, from ESPN (Andy Katz, not from Insider):

ORLANDO -- LaMarcus Aldridge is hardly the chosen one.

Back in middle school, he wasn't even selected at times to play in Dallas-area parks because he was considered to be the tall kid who couldn't play.

"I was horrible," Aldridge said during Saturday afternoon's media session at the NBA predraft camp. "I couldn't shoot. I couldn't do a hook shot. I was just tall. I was 6-7 in the eighth grade, and I was only scoring points because everyone else was [shorter]."

Aldridge said he would go to the parks with his older brother, LaVontae, and would just stand there "and they wouldn't pass me the ball."

Maybe that's why he feels he has earned the right to be considered for the No. 1 overall pick instead of being handed it. Maybe it's also why Aldridge is humbled about even being considered in the conversation.

"I wasn't one of those kids who was born with the golden spoon," Aldridge said. "That's why it makes you appreciate it more when you get there."

Aldridge did continue to grow, all the way up to 6-11, and in the past six years he has made himself into a potential top pick. It wasn't all smooth, though, as his freshman season at Texas was cut short by a season-ending hip injury against Nebraska, causing him to miss the final 15 games of the season. Aldridge was on a tear at that point, having scored in double figures in nine of 16 games.

Still, once Aldridge returned in shape for his sophomore season, the consensus in Austin from the first practice day was that Aldridge could be gone by this spring. Aldridge wouldn't commit to such a thing after losing to LSU in the Elite Eight in Atlanta, though. He said it took him a few weeks after the loss to decide he should leave.

There were signs throughout the year that he was ready to make the jump. He averaged 15.0 points, 9.2 rebounds and two blocks per game and scored in double figures 28 times. His 26-point, 13-rebound game against West Virginia in the Sweet 16 -- and a total of 59 points, 41 rebounds and nine blocks in the NCAA Tournament -- certainly put him in the No. 1 discussion.

(It's not entirely fair to compare Aldridge's 2-of-14, four-point, 10-rebound, five-block performance versus Tyrus Thomas's 10-of-14 shooting, 21 points and 13 boards in the Elite Eight matchup since the Longhorns played mostly zone.)

Unlike the confident Thomas, the extroverted Adam Morrison and the mysterious Andrea Bargnani, Aldridge is more reserved. He looks like the tall kid in the corner, and no one is quite sure how much he wants to be the star. If he's selected No. 1, he might be the least sexy pick since 2001, when Kwame Brown went to Washington. That doesn't mean, though, that Aldridge won't provide a franchise with some buzz.

"I'm a very marketable guy," said Aldridge, his face beaming, a broad smile and chuckle lighting him up. "I don't have a bad image. I don't have a bad bone in my body.

"I think what makes me marketable is that I'm team-oriented and a guy where they'll say, 'Oh, yeah, LaMarcus Aldridge is a great guy who gives back to the community and does other things.' "

Aldridge sees himself in Tim Duncan; he hopes to be the best possible center while being a player who doesn't have issues and is the consummate teammate. Duncan might not be as commercial-friendly as No. 1 picks Yao Ming (2002) and LeBron James (2003), but he's still widely respected in all corners of the industry.

Aldridge would have to produce to be in that category, but he is confident his face-the-basket game and his improving post skills can put him there.

For the past two months, Aldridge has been working out with former NBA center Will Perdue in Dallas. He has been able to sleep in his own bed, work out and hang around his friends and family.

"It's been great working out with no distractions," Aldridge said.

For some players, being at home might be trouble, but nothing seems to faze him.

"I think there is less pressure [on this year's No. 1 pick] because no one knows [who it will be]," Aldridge said. "LeBron and Yao had the pressure from the first day. Everyone knew who was going to be the No. 1 pick last year in the middle of the year [Andrew Bogut of Utah] -- and in LeBron's case, the beginning of the high school season."

Aldridge could end up being another piece in Toronto, along with Chris Bosh and Charlie Villanueva, if neither is traded. He could be the missing piece in Chicago, along with Tyson Chandler, if the Bulls desire his services at No. 2. He doesn't necessarily fit with Charlotte as much, with Emeka Okafor and Sean May already on the roster. In Portland, at No. 4, he would be one of the pieces in a complete rebuilding job and could have a few more bricks placed on his shoulders in his rookie year.

For now Aldridge is playing it cool, working out, hoping he can be the No. 1 pick -- not because he was destined for it but because he is confident that he has worked hard enough to claim the spot.

The reality is that his size, length and the draft's favorite word -- upside -- makes him a palatable pick at No. 1. If he is chosen, we'll have to wait and see whether he lives up to his own private hype, a player who can be a Duncan-like presence for years to come. 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft...z_andy&id=2482068&lpos=spotlight&lid=tab2pos3

I wouldnt be so sure about TT being Pax's guy.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



El Chapu said:


> I wouldnt be so sure about TT being Pax's guy.


Well, until we hear differently, we have no other choice but to believe TT & Roy are his guys.

Aldridge definintely has the potential to be the next Bosh. He's gonna have to toughen up a bit but he should be a force in the NBA.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



darlets said:


> Slightly off topic, but what actually happened to the draft measurements?????


It always takes several days for them to release the measurements for some reason. We just have to be patient. 

Last year, I think the list came out like 5 days afterward.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> Well, until we hear differently, we have no other choice but to believe TT & Roy are his guys.


From whom?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



El Chapu said:


> From whom?


pretty much EVERY source we've read on online, in the papers and on espn.

Are they smokescreens? who knows, but I doubt it. Somebody that knows Pax knows who he likes and it's OUT there, period.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> pretty much EVERY source we've read on online, in the papers and on espn.
> 
> Are they smokescreens? who knows, but I doubt it. Somebody that knows Pax knows who he likes and it's OUT there, period.


The same could be said about Roy.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

though im wanting the bulls to choose a big with their first pick. though past history shows that GM's always choose bigs over gaurds/forwards and they end up paying for it as they become the better players. but thats always the risk of choosing a big because if you get the right one it changes your whole team.. i don't think there has ever be a sure thing big since duncan. the rest have been make or break or taking years to develop and testing patients before being shipped off to another team and them blowing up. regardless is anyone feeling Maurice Ager? i obviously prefer Roy and Brewer. though i prefer Brewer over Roy as i think Brewer can really be a scottie pippen type of player where he just fills all different holes. but if we can't get either because we choose a big with the first pick. how does Ager sound?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



kulaz3000 said:


> though im wanting the bulls to choose a big with their first pick. though past history shows that GM's always choose bigs over gaurds/forwards and they end up paying for it as they become the better players. but thats always the risk of choosing a big because if you get the right one it changes your whole team.. i don't think there has ever be a sure thing big since duncan. the rest have been make or break or taking years to develop and testing patients before being shipped off to another team and them blowing up. regardless is anyone feeling Maurice Ager? i obviously prefer Roy and Brewer. though i prefer Brewer over Roy as i think Brewer can really be a scottie pippen type of player where he just fills all different holes. but if we can't get either because we choose a big with the first pick. how does Ager sound?


Ager would be absolutely fine at #16...


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Tribune 




> *Redick is one of several shooting guards the Bulls are eyeing. Until Tuesday it didn't look like he would be available at 16.
> 
> The arrest probably would not prevent the Bulls from drafting Redick, a team source said, but several NBA teams, including the Bulls, will scrutinize the incident and likely question Redick's maturity.*
> 
> A few days ago, it was believed Redick had locked up a top-10 selection in the June 28 draft. He canceled Wednesday's workout with the Orlando Magic, who have the 11th pick, because of a sore back but there was speculation Redick had secured a better spot in the draft.
> 
> By Tuesday afternoon, his mug shot was plastered on the Internet alongside news of his arrest and questions about his draft status.
> 
> **
> 
> *There are questions about his defense and quickness, both of which were giving some teams pause. At No. 16, however, Bulls general manager John Paxson may have a hard time passing up Redick.*
> 
> The buzz surrounding the Bulls' No. 2 pick has left little room for talk about their selection at 16, but Redick adds an intriguing option.
> 
> *Arkansas' Ronnie Brewer, Temple's Mardy Collins, Memphis' Rodney Carney, Michigan State's Shannon Brown and fellow Spartan Maurice Ager are are other possibilities. Carney appears to be moving up and out of the Bulls' range.*
> 
> These options are based on the assumption general manager John Paxson will use his 16th pick to get a guard because he's targeting a big man at No. 2 and the Bulls lack a tall, defensive-minded guard who could lessen the burden on Kirk Hinrich —but it's not a sure thing.
> 
> _*Paxson has said he is leaning toward drafting the best available player as opposed to filling a need. For that reason, he isn't ruling out drafting big men with both picks, a source said.*
> 
> *The Bulls are keeping an open mind to drafting North Carolina State's Cedric Simmons or Senegal's Saer Sene. Simmons, 20, is a 6-9 power forward with a long wingspan and huge potential. Sene, 20, is a 6-11 power forward for a Belgian team.*_


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

hmm. . . can you say copyright?


http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/draft_prospects06c.html

Oleksiy Pecherov – 6’10”, 235

NBA Position: Power Forward
Euro Team: Paris Racing / Hometown: Donestk, Ukraine
NBA Comparison: Mike Miller

Strengths: Only 21 years old … athletic European with solid inside / outside game ... skilled big man … solid perimeter player … consistent jumper out to 20 feet ... can occasionally knock down the three-point shot ... an offensive threat with great form and confidence in his jumper ... aggressive ... has a scorer’s mentality ... loves to face the basket ... decent ball-handler for a frontcourt player ... not a classic banger for a power forward … fairly solid rebounder ... very strong legs ... plays hard … has a good attitude ... has been one of the top players in his age group in Europe. 

http://nbadraft.net/profiles/oleksiypecherov.asp

Oleksiy Pecherov
Birthdate: 4/30/85
NBA Position: Power Forward
Ht: 6-10
Wt: 232
Euro Team: Paris Racing
Hometown: Donetsk, Ukraine 
2005 Stats

Strengths: Athletic European with inside/outside game ... Very skilled big man. Knows how to play close to the basket, but excels outside ... His coordination and height are a great combination ... Plays very well on the perimeter, jump shot out past 20 feet is consistent ... Even knocks down the three point shot ... A real offensive threat with great form and confidence in his jump shot ... Plays very aggressively ... Has a scorers mentality ... Nice quickness ... Loves to face the basket ... Good ball handler for a PF ... Has good rebounding ability with good leaping and good second and third jump ability ... Very strong legs ... Plays hard, good attitude ...

Notes: Has been one of the top players in his age group in Europe for some time ... Won MVP of the 2004 Global Games competition in Dallas ... Developing well under maybe the top coach in France, Gordon Herbert.

Aran Smith 3/3/06


If bulls.com donesn't have permission, I put the over-and-under at that article being up on the site at twenty-four hours. They could have at least changed the order.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Told you guys that Reddick was a pick Paxson would make.

Whats everyones draft board look like right now?

Mine is:

1. LaMarcus Aldridge
2. Rudy Gay
3. Adam Morrison
4. Andrea Bargnani
5. Patrick O'Bryant
6. Tyrus Thomas
7. JJ Reddick
8. Ronnie Brewer
9. Brandon Roy
10. Shelden Williams
11. Cedric Simmons
12. Rodney Carney
13. Saer Sene
14. Steve Novak
15. Justin Williams
16. James White
17. Maurice Ager
18. Thabo Sefolosha
19. Alexander Johnson
20. Paul Davis


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

no mention of redick's back injury in marlen's article. do we think pax would take _another guard_ with a back problem? much more of a concern than a DWI.

i don't see it. i don't think he'll go as high as 7, but redick will be gone by 16.

_what is news is that Pax could target two bigs with the picks._


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> pretty much EVERY source we've read on online, in the papers and on espn.
> 
> Are they smokescreens? who knows, but I doubt it. Somebody that knows Pax knows who he likes and it's OUT there, period.



Yeah, my best friends and confidants are always sharing what I tell them not to share with anyone.....


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Well, he is a winner and a leader, so I could see how Paxson would dig him.

I still don't think that'll happen though.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mizenkay said:


> no mention of redick's back injury in marlen's article. do we think pax would take _another guard_ with a back problem? much more of a concern than a DWI.
> 
> i don't see it. i don't think he'll go as high as 7, but redick will be gone by 16.
> 
> _what is news is that Pax could target two bigs with the picks._


The problem with two bigs with the picks is that Paul Johnson and Alexander Johnson will probaly be the two best bigs when we pick.

Obviously none of Bargnani, Thomas, Aldridge, or O'Bryant will be there are 16. Sene probaly goes 14 to the Jazz, which leaves us Simmons as the only quality big guy that I'd take at 16, so right now its looking more likely to get one of Carney, Reddick, or Brewer, who ever drops that far.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mizenkay said:


> _what is news is that Pax could target two bigs with the picks._



That is news and maybe the possibilty of having a sg like Reddick or Brewer available will sway him into selecting a Big Man at 2. I wouldn't mind going big twice.

Aldridge and Simmons..........

Aldridge and Brewer............

If somehow miraculously Roy slips to 7..........I can see Pax jumping out a window to move up and grab him.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mizenkay said:


> _what is news is that Pax could target two bigs with the picks._


YEP

It would be a wonderful day to land one of the 3 big's then get someone like simmons, johnson or sene @ #16


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Measurements are finally out ladies and gentlemen!!

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1342


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

though it doesn't have wingspan and reach yet. its interesting. some players are shorter than i thought they'd be like carney. yet noone is taller than expected.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Brewer is a solid 6'6 player and already at 223 pounds. i know thats just measurements. but that shows a kid who is commitment to being in top shape at an early age. i want this guy in our 3 gaurd rotation with Gordan and Hinrich badly.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



kulaz3000 said:


> Measurements are finally out ladies and gentlemen!!
> 
> http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1342


Tyrus Thomas: 6'7! No thanks! No wonder he keeps saying he's a 3!


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Tyrus Thomas = 6'8.25" w/shoes, 217lbs? 

Man he's pretty much the same size as Deng, actually a little shorter since Deng grew an inch since he entered the league.


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Ouch, that does hurt Thomas' stock.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Shoes appear to generally contribute an inch.

Aldridge 6'11 1/4" - real height..........real offensive game....He or Bargnani for me.

Brewer 6' 6 3/4" in shoes - not bad, a little shorter than touted - but so are a number of guys.

Thomas 6' 8 1/4" in shoes - Could this be the reason he's also claiming to be a SF/PF combo. Damn, 6'8" and an eyelash...........does this change anyone else opinion? I have no doubt about his athleticism and determinationi.....but he's gonna have to out position and out hustle every play. ......

Gay 6' 8" in shoes
Sene 7' 0" in shoes........

Cedric Simmons 6' 9 1/2" in shoes.

Sheldon Williams 6' 8 1/2" in shoes - Does this change your opinion on him?

O'Bryant 7'0" in shoes - does he shoot up now?

Marco Killingsworth 6'6 3/4" - say hello to the overseas basketball game.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Carney only being 6'5 surprises me a lot, maybe his wingspan makes him look longer than he actually is, but this will definitely hurt his stock. 

Right now, my picks would be Bargnani and Sene, who is as big as advertised and when the wingsan measurements surface he'll look even more impressive.


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## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



LegoHat said:


> Carney only being 6'5 surprises me a lot, maybe his wingspan makes him look longer than he actually is, but this will definitely hurt his stock.


A lot of times, though not always, guys get their measurements rounded up. Carney will probably be listed at 6' 6". That's only an inch shorter than advertised, but he's looking more like a shooting guard than a small forward, at least according to size.

Ager is a little shorter than I would have hoped. Gay and Morrison are just as advertised on height, but the fact that Morrison weighs under 200 pounds is a bit of a shock. 

Brewer is exactly the same height as Iguodala.

Wow, Tyrus is a bit shorter than we thought. He really is built pretty much like Hakim Warrick.

Brandon Roy and LaMarcus Aldridge are just the right size. :clap: 

I can't wait for the wingspans, standing reach, and athletic testing results.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Sheesh...It's about TIME!


Tyrus is dropping like a ROCK!...What happened to the 2 inches they said he grew...LOL...People be lying TOO much.

Shelden Williams is taller and MUCH stronger, with an orangutan's wingspan.

I love the athletic numbers tho...That's what I really wanna see.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



smARTmouf said:


> Tyrus is dropping like a ROCK!...What happened to the 2 inches they said he grew...LOL...People be lying TOO much.


ohhh, so that's why he wants to be a SF.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



> A Raptors official made it abundantly clear the team wouldn’t surrender its No. 1 overall pick for Indiana forward Jermaine O’Neal. Racine Journal-Times


Uhhmmm ??


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## Banjoriddim

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Tyrus height is really hurting hes stocks from now on.


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## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I have to say, based on the most recent measurements and interviews, that i would rather have Willams and Roy than Thomas and who ever will be left at 16. 

I read a Willams interview and i was really impressed,

ESPN insider has a rumor that we are trading 2 and 16 for Odom. I really doubt that. IMHO we already have to SF better than Odom and he hates playing PF. I think this is the Lakers blowing smoke. Also, if Odom is so great how come everyone wants to trade him. IMHO he is not that different than JRose.

david


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## BULLS23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Thank God for measurements!!! I'm so glad we can finally give the TT pick a rest . . . He knew he wasn't coming in at 6'9" so that's why he talked all that mess. I'm really interested in what you guys think about us taking Redick at #16 if he's there. Now that he basically measured in at 6'5"(!) I think he could be nice value if he's there. I still think Roy or Brewer are better players, but if we take Aldridge at #2 I think JJ could be there. I also think that Brewer shoots way up into the lottery now that he's measured and he'll be more impressive when his reach and athletic stats come out.

About Shelden being there at 16, I just don't see it happening . . . I think he goes no later than 14 to Utah and probably earlier.


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Glad to see Roy check in at a legit 6'6". There was some talk that he was shorter.


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## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I want Brewer hands down. Yes we need a big. but i think Brewer fits into what the Bulls are about to a T. Yes his not worth the no.2 but i don't think either are the 3 bigs. they are based too much on potential. and bigs now are being undermained with the new rules. i think we trade down to get brewer. and get a big with the 16th. whether it be a project or not. and bring bigs in by free agency. im really feeling the Hinrich. Gordan. and Brewer back court. They could cause havoc. Add to that Deng. Nocioni and Chandler. thats a deadly line up in itself. Gritty!


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## step

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



> Also, if Odom is so great how come everyone wants to trade him.


Billups found his way on like 5 teams in 5 years, does that make him worthless?


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## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



> Billups found his way on like 5 teams in 5 years, does that make him worthless?


thats because Billups was a tweener. just like Odom. His still a tweener. he just needs to find a team that can really execute his talents. but his not a defensive player that that fits into the bill of the bulls team. his more of an offensive orchestrator in my opinion. and we don't need a point forward when we have Hinrich as our general.


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## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



BULLS23 said:


> Thank God for measurements!!! I'm so glad we can finally give the TT pick a rest . . . He knew he wasn't coming in at 6'9" so that's why he talked all that mess. I'm really interested in what you guys think about us taking Redick at #16 if he's there. Now that he basically measured in at 6'5"(!) I think he could be nice value if he's there. I still think Roy or Brewer are better players, but if we take Aldridge at #2 I think JJ could be there. I also think that Brewer shoots way up into the lottery now that he's measured and he'll be more impressive when his reach and athletic stats come out.
> 
> About Shelden being there at 16, I just don't see it happening . . . I think he goes no later than 14 to Utah and probably earlier.


You know, as bad a pick as Morrison would be for us, I actually don't think Reddick would be THAT bad with the #16. Reason being, I don't see hardly anyone better who looks to drop that far. It totally depends on who's available before we can accurately judge a pick like that. If it's between Reddick and Mardy Collins, you gotta take Reddick. If it's Brewer vs Reddick, undoubtedly take Brewer. It all depends. 

Reddick's stock definitely gets helped by his size. I don't think anyone expected him to measure out 6'5 in shoes. Could he be Fred Hoiberg reincarnated? I wouldn't mind him as a backup 2-guard playing 20 minutes a game.


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## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



> You know, as bad a pick as Morrison would be for us, I actually don't think Reddick would be THAT bad with the #16. Reason being, I don't see hardly anyone better who looks to drop that far. It totally depends on who's available before we can accurately judge a pick like that. If it's between Reddick and Mardy Collins, you gotta take Reddick. If it's Brewer vs Reddick, undoubtedly take Brewer. It all depends.


I personally think we've got enough shooters in the gaurd position. Hinrich and Gordan need their shots. along with Deng and Nocioni. we need someone who is atheltic that doesn't mind grinding it out on the defensive end and distribute the ball like collins or ager. but thats my opinion.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Paxson better not draft Thomas. Aldridge should be the guy.

I don't care about Thomas' athletic ability. When he is against a strong powerforward who has him pinned, Thomas won't be able to get a full jump to block the shot, because he's small, weak, short. Aeful pick at #2. Aldridge is pretty much a legit center size, put him and Tyson downlow and you have a good frontcourt, I think Aldridge is better fit for the 4, but he can play both spots.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Cross Justin Williams off the list, he was suppose to be 6'11", but is only 6'7.75.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



sloth said:


> Paxson better not draft Thomas. Aldridge should be the guy.
> 
> I don't care about Thomas' athletic ability. When he is against a strong powerforward who has him pinned, Thomas won't be able to get a full jump to block the shot, because he's small, weak, short. Aeful pick at #2. Aldridge is pretty much a legit center size, put him and Tyson downlow and you have a good frontcourt, I think Aldridge is better fit for the 4, but he can play both spots.



Thomas seemed to do alright playing against Aldridge....


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## DaBullz

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> Thomas seemed to do alright playing against Aldridge....


That would make Aldridge's stock drop, no?


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> Thomas seemed to do alright playing against Aldridge....



Big Baby played Aldridge in the game. Big Baby flustered alot of guys he played against because of his girth.

It definitely showed that Aldridge needs to bulk up, and also toughen up. Still, he got good shots off. He just didn't hit them that night.

Aldridge, Bargnani, Trade down, Roy, Thomas......my preference right now.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

And even though Aldridge's shot wasn't on that game, he still contributed on the defensive end, he was blocking shots (and not on help defense either, which makes it more impressive) and rebounding the ball. That game was a good display of his offensive arsenal which is huge, he just wasn't hitting his shots that game. The one thing that can make Aldridge a better player than Duncan, Shaq, and Curry, is that all these guys fell in love with one or two moves, if Aldridge equally develops and uses all his moves, he'll be a much more dangerous player.


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## rosenthall

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Actually, Thomas' height really doesn't bother me that much. Obviously it doesn't help him, but if he has a long reach, that and his athleticism pretty much negates the fact that he's 6'8.25 and not 6'9. 

I always thought that people who obsess over minute discrepancies in a players measurements kinda miss the forest for the trees. It's like when people poo-pooed Chris Paul for being 6'0 and not 6'2, and Dwayne Wade for being 6'4 and not 6'6. If I'm John Paxson and I workout Tyrus Thomas and he's flushing all sorts of pick and rolls Amare-style, I really don't care if he's 6'8 or 6'9.

Not saying that height isn't important, just that the way people are isolating it and using it as a means to knock him down a peg or two strikes me as being a little misguided.

If anything worries me, it's his weight. Like I said, I'm not a huge fan of over-analyzing measurements, but 217 is pretty lithe for a power forward, and when you have guys that are as well conditioned and sculpted as NBA athletes are, weight corresponds corresponds fairly well with strength, I think, which is pretty much the crux of my concerns with Tyrus. The height alone really doesn't bother me, but if he doesn't measure out with a great wingspan, along with his weight, then the seeds of doubt will probably be planted, although not enough to really make me write him off.

The attitude and maturity issues that have come up within the past two weeks worry me much more.


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ace20004u said:


> Thomas seemed to do alright playing against Aldridge....


Thomas was almost never matched up with Aldridge during that game.


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## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



rosenthall said:


> Actually, Thomas' height really doesn't bother me that much. Obviously it doesn't help him, but if he has a long reach, that and his athleticism pretty much negates the fact that he's 6'8.25 and not 6'9.
> 
> I always thought that people who obsess over minute discrepancies in a players measurements kinda miss the forest for the trees. It's like when people poo-pooed Chris Paul for being 6'0 and not 6'2, and Dwayne Wade for being 6'4 and not 6'6. If I'm John Paxson and I workout Tyrus Thomas and he's flushing all sorts of pick and rolls Amare-style, I really don't care if he's 6'8 or 6'9.
> 
> Not saying that height isn't important, just that the way people are isolating it and using it as a means to knock him down a peg or two strikes me as being a little misguided.
> 
> If anything worries me, it's his weight. Like I said, I'm not a huge fan of over-analyzing measurements, but 217 is pretty lithe for a power forward, and when you have guys that are as well conditioned and sculpted as NBA athletes are, weight corresponds corresponds fairly well with strength, I think, which is pretty much the crux of my concerns with Tyrus. The height alone really doesn't bother me, but if he doesn't measure out with a great wingspan, along with his weight, then the seeds of doubt will probably be planted, although not enough to really make me write him off.
> 
> The attitude and maturity issues that have come up within the past two weeks worry me much more.


excellent post...repped!


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## rosenthall

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

And just on a general note, I wish the NBA would ditch the bench press as its official strength measurement in favor of something that might actually correlate well to basketball, like squats.

The bench press information is still useful, since it gives you a general intuition about someone's work ethic and how phsyically developed a guys body is, but I'm not sure if there's an exercise that signifies less on a basketball court.


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## remlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Thomas is still my guy for the draft. 3/4 of an inch won't scare me away. He is still a freak on teh court which the Bulls would love to have. 

Who knows, Aldridge might walk into the Berto Center and totally wow Pax and all the discussion of TT will be mute. Although i feel the player w/ the best chance to wow Paxson in a workout with his athleticism is TT.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I wonder how Aldridge's workout is going right now

Isn't Thomas there tomorrow?


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



chifaninca said:


> It definitely showed that Aldridge needs to bulk up, and also toughen up.


Aldridge has a frame perfectly capable of the first -- although it will take time.

Toughness, that is a sticking point. It is sort of one of those things where you got it or you don't.

You rarely find a player who shuns contact learning to thrive on banging. I can't think of too many softies who later became pillars of determination and will.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Well, those soft knocks were also said about Bosh, Frye & Duncan...and they're all pretty good

I wouldn't worry about it MUCH...hell they even say Greg Oden's soft...he'll still dominate in the NBA so who cares


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Realgm's Winners and Losers of the Pre-Draft Camp Measurements :



> Winners:
> 
> Ronnie Brewer – Weighing in a 6’7” and 223 pounds, Brewer will be a very unique point forward who should be considered by teams who want to draft a valuable sixth man. Brewer has the ability to play three or even four positions, similar to Boris Diaw. Like Diaw, Brewer is known for his selflessness and court vision.
> 
> Jordan Farmar – Measuring at taller than 6’0” was the hope and the result was 6’2”, which certainly will not hurt the stock of the UCLA standout point guard.
> 
> Randy Foye – If scouts buy into Foye’s viability as a point guard in the NBA, they should be impressed with his size at 6’3” and 212 pounds. Foye is similar in size to Baron Davis or Chauncey Billups, both of whom (mostly Billups) have been successful NBA point guards.
> 
> Patrick O’Bryant – Claims that he’s a project and at a legit 7’0” and 250 pounds, that’s certainly a good start.
> 
> Tyrus Thomas – Many expected that he’d be shorter than advertised and wire thin, but Thomas looks to have added nearly 10 pounds to his frame and measured at around his projected height.
> 
> Shawne Williams – The freshman out of Memphis measured at a smidge under 6’9” and 227 pounds, which shows up as an NBA-ready body on paper.





> Losers:
> 
> LaMarcus Aldridge – Teams would have loved to see him put on a few pounds to prove that he could develop a body suited for the center position. He’s just under a legit 7’0” and under 240 pounds, which indicates that he falls just short of the league’s expectation for centers.
> 
> Rodney Carney – Has always been listed at 6’7” or 6’8” and for him to measure at under 6’6” is a definite blow to his stock. Carney is a great athlete, but how many successful small forwards in the league are under that height? It reminds me of Jarvis Hayes’s measurements a few years back.
> 
> Paul Millsap – For a player with his natural talents, I’m certain that most general managers were hoping that he would reach 6’8”, but Millsap measured below that. Either way, it will be hard for a team that needs rebounding to turn him down.
> 
> Adam Morrison – His height was expected, but with his agent recently talking about his desire to gain weight, weighing in at under 200 pounds cannot help his stock, which has recently been soaring. Regardless, Morrison is still the favorite to go at the top pick if the Raptors trade out.


comments?


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## BULLS23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



rosenthall said:


> Actually, Thomas' height really doesn't bother me that much. Obviously it doesn't help him, but if he has a long reach, that and his athleticism pretty much negates the fact that he's 6'8.25 and not 6'9.
> 
> I always thought that people who obsess over minute discrepancies in a players measurements kinda miss the forest for the trees. It's like when people poo-pooed Chris Paul for being 6'0 and not 6'2, and Dwayne Wade for being 6'4 and not 6'6. If I'm John Paxson and I workout Tyrus Thomas and he's flushing all sorts of pick and rolls Amare-style, I really don't care if he's 6'8 or 6'9.
> 
> Not saying that height isn't important, just that the way people are isolating it and using it as a means to knock him down a peg or two strikes me as being a little misguided.
> 
> If anything worries me, it's his weight. Like I said, I'm not a huge fan of over-analyzing measurements, but 217 is pretty lithe for a power forward, and when you have guys that are as well conditioned and sculpted as NBA athletes are, weight corresponds corresponds fairly well with strength, I think, which is pretty much the crux of my concerns with Tyrus. The height alone really doesn't bother me, but if he doesn't measure out with a great wingspan, along with his weight, then the seeds of doubt will probably be planted, although not enough to really make me write him off.
> 
> The attitude and maturity issues that have come up within the past two weeks worry me much more.


Great post and my sentiments exactly . . . I really would like TT to be 6'9" beacuse that would help him, but I didnt' think he would be. It's his weight and the ability to add to it that worries me the most. He'll be no match for guys like Boozer, Brand, Gooden, Howard, Jamison(!) who are all pretty strong AND outweigh him a good 35-50 pounds.


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> I wonder how Aldridge's workout is going right now
> 
> Isn't Thomas there tomorrow?


yes, TT is scheduled for thurs. they also have augustine coming in on friday and brandon roy on saturday!

busy week!!


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Bargnani update... Italian League Finals game #1

Treviso 77 Bologna 69 Treviso leads series 1-0

Bargnani...
26 minutes (fifth most on the team)
16 points (second most on the team)
5-8 2pt
2-5 3pt
0-0 ft
5 boards (1 offensive) (second on the team)
1 steal, 1 block, 1 assist

box score here


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



fl_flash said:


> Bargnani update... Italian League Finals game #1
> 
> Treviso 77 Bologna 69 Treviso leads series 1-0
> 
> Bargnani...
> 26 minutes (fifth most on the team)
> 16 points (second most on the team)
> 5-8 2pt
> 2-5 3pt
> 0-0 ft
> 5 boards (1 offensive) (second on the team)
> 1 steal, 1 block, 1 assist
> 
> box score here


Ugh. I am slowly coming to grips with the fact that we're not going to land this guy (probably because he'll be taken at number one), but he is far and away my favorite player in this draft. I'll have to make a point of avoiding Raptors games next season.


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## fl_flash

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ScottMay said:


> Ugh. I am slowly coming to grips with the fact that we're not going to land this guy (probably because he'll be taken at number one), but he is far and away my favorite player in this draft. I'll have to make a point of avoiding Raptors games next season.


Well, I'd prefer he'd be taken #1. At least that way I won't be too upset that Pax doesn't have the choice to take him. If Toronto doesn't take him (by trading down or drafting a different player) I'm 99.9% positive that Pax won't even consider him. It's too bad too. I think he'd have a semi-difficult rookie year adjusting to the NBA and the United States in general (much like Nocioni). After that though, the sky really is the limit with this guy. He just gets the job done. 20 years old and putting up good stats on one of the top teams in Europe.

My ideal draft is Bargnani and a trade up for Brewer.


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## LegoHat

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ScottMay said:


> Ugh. I am slowly coming to grips with the fact that we're not going to land this guy (probably because he'll be taken at number one), but he is far and away my favorite player in this draft. I'll have to make a point of avoiding Raptors games next season.


I feel the same way, we'll be lucky if we can get him at #2. Oh, and so much for Bargnani not producing when it counts, now he's stepping it up in the finals.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Courtesy of crazybarns at RealGM , there are video highlights of several players at Yahoo . 

My board for a while has been: 1a. Aldridge and 1b. Bargnani. Hell, I'll be happy with those two, Tyrus, or Roy. But I'm really hoping that guys like Brewer or Carney drop. Both look like studs. I know these highlights only show the good stuff, but Carney's athleticism cannot be denied. Brewer is as perfect as a fit as they come. Pax, please move up the draft to get either one of these guys.


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## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Courtesy of crazybarns at RealGM , there are video highlights of several players at Yahoo .
> 
> My board for a while has been: 1a. Aldridge and 1b. Bargnani. Hell, I'll be happy with those two, Tyrus, or Roy. But I'm really hoping that guys like Brewer or Carney drop. Both look like studs. I know these highlights only show the good stuff, but Carney's athleticism cannot be denied. Brewer is as perfect as a fit as they come. Pax, please move up the draft to get either one of these guys.


Those are some good highlight vids (none of Bargnani, unfortunately).

In the case of Aldridge, they must have gone to great lengths not to show a single unassisted basket (apart from stickbacks). From what I've read on this board, I'd just assumed he must not have had more than a handful of assisted baskets the entire season.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



















> *Bulls.com: How did you feel that your workout went?*
> *LaMarcus Aldridge: * “I think it went pretty well. It was very intense; there was a lot of up-and-down and agility drills for them to gauge how I move and how I shoot it. I think I did alright.”
> 
> *Bulls.com: * Was this your first workout? What other workouts do you have scheduled?
> *Aldridge: * “This was my first one. I go to Portland in two or three days and I’ll go wherever from there.”
> 
> *Bulls.com: * What kind of things did you consider as you debated entering the NBA Draft or returning for another season at Texas?
> *Aldridge:* “First off, I really loved being at school and my teammates were all great. We had a great time and a great year, and there are some really talented guys coming in for next year. It was a matter of deciding if I wanted to stay and possibly help that group win a national championship, or leave and go pro. I finally sat down with Coach [Rick] Barnes and my mom and a few other people and I decided that it was time to leave because it was the best thing possible at this point in my life.”
> 
> *Bulls.com:* You’ve drawn some comparisons to Tim Duncan for your style on and off the court. Do you feel they are accurate?
> *Aldridge:* “I hope that they are. He’s a great player and he’s got a great personality on and off the court. He’s just a great overall guy; he’s certainly not a bad guy to be compared to. With him being close in San Antonio, I had the chance to watch him play quite a bit so I’d take pointers from him when I could and used them when I could.”
> 
> *Bulls.com: * You’ve recently been working out with help from former Bulls center Will Perdue. How did that come about? What have you concentrated on in those sessions and how has he helped you?
> *Aldridge: * “There was a connection through my agent, and things just worked out from there. We’ve been working out the last few months in Dallas and he’s helped me with a lot of the things that we did today—shooting, agility, footwork, and various moves in the post.”
> 
> *Bulls.com: * One of the first things you notice when seeing you in person is your long arms. How big is your wingspan and how has your length helped you on the court?
> *Aldridge: * “My wingspan is 7-foot-5. My long arms help me as I try to become more versatile. I’d like to be able to guard anywhere from a three to a four to a five. I think my wingspan helps me out on defense, because I can cover a little more ground and block a few more shots. It helps on offense too, because when I put up a shot with a little higher release, it’s a little tougher for guys to challenge.”
> 
> *Bulls.com:* You were 6-foot-7 as an eighth grader, but you lacked the skills to excel as basketball player. How did you go about improving your game?
> *Aldridge:* “I sucked. [Laughing] But my brother was there, always pushing me and motivating me to go to the parks and to hit the gym and work on my game everyday. I started to really develop in high school, and my coach there helped me a lot too in pushing me to my max all the time. Some guys who are stars go to high school and don’t get pushed, but my coach worked me and helped me become the player that I am now.”
> 
> *Bulls.com:* Which is more important to you, being the first overall pick in the draft or landing with a team where you’re a great fit?
> Aldridge: “More than anything, I want to be a great fit. I want to be somewhere that I can shine and become a great player and hopefully be in this league for a long time.”
> 
> *Bulls.com: * You’ve known Toronto Raptors star Chris Bosh for a long time, going head-to-head since your high school days. In fact, you averaged a stellar 23 points and 13 rebounds in two games against him your sophomore year.
> *Aldridge: * “Yeah, I’ve known Chris since high school and I did pretty well against him. There was a lot of hype going on leading up to those games, and I was able to get myself psyched up and ready to play. I have a great relationship with him and it’s real cool. When I’ve been in Dallas this summer, we’ve worked out every day. It’s been helpful for me to get used to going against someone who is long, quick, and All-Star caliber. Hopefully, that will help my game go to the next level.”
> 
> *Bulls.com:* How competitive do your one-on-one matches get?
> *Aldridge: * “Oh they’re serious. We’re falling all over the place and going full speed; we both want to win so badly. But they’ve been fairly even; he’ll win one and I’ll win one. We’ve just kept going at it. If I lose, all I want to do is play him again and come back strong the next game.”
> 
> “I think I’d fit in great here and I’d love to come here,” Aldridge said about coming to Chicago. “This is a great team and organization and it would be a great situation for me.”
> 
> *Bulls.com:* One of the few knocks on you is that you need to add some bulk and muscle to your frame.
> *Aldridge: * “That’s a given. Everyone who is looking at drafting me knows I need to get stronger and bigger. I’ve been working out it, hitting the gym three times a day to work on my conditioning and with the weights in addition to my court workout.”
> 
> *Bulls.com: * What position do you see yourself playing the most in the NBA?
> *Aldridge: * “I see myself mostly as a true [power forward], someone who can be mobile and shoot the ball, whether it’s stepping out or on a pick-and-roll. Playing the four is where I see myself mostly, but I am definitely versatile enough to play the four or the five.”
> 
> *Bulls.com: * Now that you’ve had a chance to get to know John Paxson, Scott Skiles and some of the Bulls’ other coaches, how do you think you would fit in here?
> *Aldridge: * “I think I’d fit in great here and I’d love to come here. Overall, this is a great team and organization and it would be a great situation for me. I love talking to the coaching staff here; I even got to talk with a Luol Deng for a little while. I love every bit of it.”
> 
> *Bulls.com: * A growing theme here in Chicago has been defense. What kind of defensive player are you?
> *Aldridge:* “I take defense very seriously. I was All-Defensive team in the Big 12 and All-Defensive Player of the Year. More than anything, I want to be in a position where I can guard guys all over the court, whether they are a three, four or five. I want to be as versatile of a defender as I can be.”
> 
> *Bulls.com:* In Chicago, you’d play along side another 7-footer in Tyson Chandler. How formidable of a front line do you think that would become?
> *Aldridge:* “I think we could be something special, hopefully kind of like Tim Duncan and David Robinson were back in the day.  I think we’d be a nice complement to each other; I know I could learn a thing or two about playing D from him and we would push each other to improve both offensively and defensively. He could help me out and hopefully I’d help him out too.”
> 
> — Adam Fluck | Bulls.com


Lamarcus Aldridge Interview At Bulls.com


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I want the kid. He has that Duncan like demeanor. I hope he has the drive to be the best like Duncan. I'll admit, I've hated that quiet demeanor of Duncan's, but if it brings us 3 rings, I'm up for it. Just make sure it's another 3Peat, lol.

Pax, please move up from 16 and grab either Brewer or Carney.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Roy is my #1, but Aldridge is the only one of the 3 top bigs that won't be a letdown to me on draft day. He is the only one of that crew that I can see really helping the Bulls front court situation.

Bargnani is a maybe, only because he is such a question mark.


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## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I want no part of Aldridge. My opinion is based on having seen several of his games. His workouts/interviews won't change what I think of him. Get ready for a lot of fadeaways in regards to his low-post game. And when the going gets tough I'm so glad to hear his go-to move will be the "sky hook."  

To me, Aldridge is one of the worst case scenarios with the 2nd pick. The other being Rudy Huxtable.


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...4bulls,1,1329408.story?coll=cs-home-headlines




> *The silence at dinner the previous night was uncomfortable. LaMarcus Aldridge thought he had done something wrong because the coach stared at him for five or 10 minutes.
> 
> Finally, Scott Skiles spoke.*
> 
> "We had a great time, and I got to see the other side of him," Aldridge said after Wednesday's workout with the Bulls.
> 
> The Bulls are strongly considering drafting a big man with the second pick on June 28, and the 6-foot-10 Aldridge is a possibility. He averaged 15 points and 9.2 rebounds and led Texas to a school-record 30 wins, the Big 12 regular-season title and the NCAA regional finals as a sophomore last season.
> 
> A good ballhandler, Aldridge has a soft touch around the basket and from midrange and is a versatile defender. He hit 219 of 385 field-goal attempts (.569) and blocked 73 shots in 37 games and was named defensive player of the year by the Big 12 coaches last season.
> 
> A few awkward minutes at dinner Tuesday with Skiles and general manager John Paxson aside, Aldridge thinks he and the Bulls are a comfortable fit. They're looking for a big man, and he certainly wouldn't mind joining a playoff team.





lol. what was up with the silence? did skiles conduct the "how would you do in the doghouse?" test during appetizers??

so funny.


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

How incredibly weird. This is our pre-draft interview technique? Inviting prospects to dinner and staring at them in silence?


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## jbulls

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mizenkay said:


> http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...4bulls,1,1329408.story?coll=cs-home-headlines
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol. what was up with the silence? did skiles conduct the "how would you do in the doghouse?" test during appetizers??
> 
> so funny.


Yeah. Didn't you hear Skiles on the Score: "We really like LaMarcus. He's long and athletic. Nice stroke from 18 feet in. Responded really well when Paxson and I stared at him in silence for 10 minutes straight before dinner."

I'm glad we're not just putting prospects through the normal NBA tryout stuff, we're also challenging them to staring contests. You can't be too thorough.


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## narek

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



jbulls said:


> How incredibly weird. This is our pre-draft interview technique? Inviting prospects to dinner and staring at them in silence?


There's got to be more to this story - Aldridge may have said something that Skiles just had a little trouble digesting along with the main course.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



jbulls said:


> Yeah. Didn't you hear Skiles on the Score: "We really like LaMarcus. He's long and athletic. Nice stroke from 18 feet in. Responded really well when Paxson and I stared at him in silence for 10 minutes straight before dinner."


Please tell me you are kidding?


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

"I don't just wanna be #1, I wanna be great and have a great career"

Looking at some of his highlights on channel 7 actually got me a bit hyped. He has that very HIGH rasheed wallace like turnaround. That move is pretty much unguardable, unless you're Yao Ming or somethin. He moves pretty fluidly and working out with Bosh can only help that kid. He could very well be the NEXT Bosh.

Regardless of if we draft him or not, I think he'll be VERY good in this league for a long time.

I want him on the bulls.

They also showed Tyrus on the highlights, and the MORE you watch, the more he LOOKS like a SF. They showed him taking some players coast-to-coast and finishing with those incredibly sick lay-ups only players like vince and kobe can do with ease. They also showed him hitting long-range jumpers with ease and dunking on cats like Marion.

On the Tribune show, they said Luol Deng is possibly trade bait since they feel like Nocioni is a star and they could get away with him not having a kid like Deng. ONLY if they got something that could truely help in return though.


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

well then i guess tonight is tyrus' turn at the skiles appetizer course.

skiles and pax probably won't be able to get a word in edge-wise.

oh to be a fly on that wall.


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



SALO said:


> I want no part of Aldridge. My opinion is based on having seen several of his games. His workouts/interviews won't change what I think of him. Get ready for a lot of fadeaways in regards to his low-post game. And when the going gets tough I'm so glad to hear his go-to move will be the "sky hook."
> 
> To me, Aldridge is one of the worst case scenarios with the 2nd pick. The other being Rudy Huxtable.


Personally I came full circle back to Ridge as the guy I want the most. The interview was pretty PC. I really don't know how much more it's going to make any one think of him except one thing, one on one vs. Bosh he's winning half the games, that's impressive. He did take too many fade aways, but that it's not a bad thing that he has that abilty, and he has all the tools to do anything you would want out of a PF. You can't say the same for TT, based on his size I think he's right to say he's going to be a SF. I like Bargnani's potential but don't know enough to want to take him over Ridge. I never wanted Roy with #2, 16 and Du for him would be great but but but


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



Hustle said:


> Personally I came full circle back to Ridge as the guy I want the most. The interview was pretty PC. I really don't know how much more it's going to make any one think of him except one thing, one on one vs. Bosh he's winning half the games, that's impressive. He did take too many fade aways, but that it's not a bad thing that he has that abilty, and he has all the tools to do anything you would want out of a PF. You can't say the same for TT, based on his size I think he's right to say he's going to be a SF. I like Bargnani's potential but don't know enough to want to take him over Ridge. I never wanted Roy with #2, 16 and Du for him would be great but but but


I like that kid, he doesn't have Tyrus's attitude but that doesn't mean he isn't hungry.

I've seen a number of things Aldridge does that remind me of Duncan, Rasheed Wallace, Frye, Joe Smith Bosh and even Horace Grant. 6"11 guys with his skillset don't come around very often.

Hinrich / Duhon
Gordon
Deng / Nocioni
Aldridge
Chandler

Aldridge playing that 4/5 definintely eases the scoring burden for Hinrich & Gordon. Add the two FA big's & another guard...We could possibly even get to the ECF. There aren't many teams deeper than that out here. Washington & Milwuakee definintely wouldn't be a problem to get past.

I have NO doubt that he'll come in his ROOKIE season and give us the 15 ppg & 6 rpg we lost with Eddy Curry. He's a wayyyyyyy more well-rounded player.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

If Pax can land Aldridge and Brewer/Carney, I will give him an A++. If Brewer can play the 1-2-3, then Duhon can be shipped off elsewhere down the road. I think Pax will try to get Pryz during FA. That will be his main target, unless he also believes Al Harrington would be a good PF for us. 

I know this is a side topic, but do you think Songalia will pick up his option? 

We would have a very flexible lineup, similar to Dallas if we can get Brewer. I think, if Pax can, he should get Bobby Jones in the 2nd round. 

Hinrich/Duhon/Brewer
Gordon/Brewer/Jones
Deng/Noce/Brewer
Chandler/Noce/Songalia
Pryz/Aldridge/Allen


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## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

i like the lineup of "theanimals23" 

but i prefer more veterans. replace jones with a michael finely type. and replace allen with AD. bring him back. he was huge for the youngsters. 

but im definitly feeling brewer and albridge. they are both can play multiple positions along with the other players on the team. very versatile team that can switch everything on the court on defensive. deadly.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

After Noc went APE-**** in the playoffs, I wouldn't even want Songalia back. Why pay him when you got a guy (NOC) who can use those minutes and do EVERYTHING better than Songalia?

C Pryzbilla / Butler
F Aldridge / Chandler
F Deng / Nocioni
G Gordon / #16
G Hinrich / Duhon

Yeah, I know "Jackie Butler?", but the kid can be legit. He's a natural C, big body, good defensively, nice soft touch and he outplayed every big on the team a few times last year in NY. He's a project but he could also develop into a SERIOUS piece down the line.


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## smARTmouf

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



kulaz3000 said:


> i like the lineup of "theanimals23"
> 
> but i prefer more veterans. replace jones with a michael finely type. and replace allen with AD. bring him back. he was huge for the youngsters.
> 
> but im definitly feeling brewer and albridge. they are both can play multiple positions along with the other players on the team. very versatile team that can switch everything on the court on defensive. deadly.



Yeah...I like it too...But Brewer aint fallin' to 16....And we DO NOT have a 2nd rounder.

A deal has to be made.

But I'm ALL for getting Bobby Jones...ANYWAY...ANYHOW.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

The Roy, I agree. I do not want Songalia back either. But, I think he has a player option, not a team option. Unless he feels like he will make more money elsewhere, I think he'll end up returning.

Kulaz3000, I agree, I'd like to get more veterans. I wish we could get the Hawk, Adrian Griffin, back. But that won't happen. Cuban will keep his team together. But, yeah, I think we all would like to build a versatile team. This way we can change lineups as we want to control the pace of the game. I love Noce's emergence, so we can go small if wanted. But, hopefully we can add a few bigs to go big too.

Another guy I'd like to get would be Ely. The price might be a lil too steep for him. AD is a possibility, but do you think he has anything left to provide? 

I remember reading a lil while back, that Kelvin Cato said he thinks he can provide for a team like Chicago. He mentioned us. It was in the Chic. Trib. He would be a serviceable 3rd option for center.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



smARTmouf said:


> Yeah...I like it too...But Brewer aint fallin' to 16....And we DO NOT have a 2nd rounder.
> 
> A deal has to be made.
> 
> But I'm ALL for getting Bobby Jones...ANYWAY...ANYHOW.


I mentioned a few pages back, that we have 2 next year (Chi and NYK). We can use one of those. A lot of times, 2nd rounders are traded for future 2nd rounders, scrubs (*cough* Othella, Sweets, Pargo) or cash. We got all 3. If Pax really wants a guy, he will make it happen.

As for getting Brewer, I'd love to be able to trade Duhon + 16 to move up to 10 (Seattle) and grab him. I know they would go for a PG. They were not satisified with the play of Ridnour or Watson. However, we may need to trade a future 1st to acquire a higher pick. If we do that, I want to trade our 16th for a future 1st, ideally next years draft.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Courtesy of crazybarns at RealGM , there are video highlights of several players at Yahoo .
> 
> My board for a while has been: 1a. Aldridge and 1b. Bargnani. Hell, I'll be happy with those two, Tyrus, or Roy. But I'm really hoping that guys like Brewer or Carney drop. Both look like studs. I know these highlights only show the good stuff, but Carney's athleticism cannot be denied. Brewer is as perfect as a fit as they come. Pax, please move up the draft to get either one of these guys.


I know. I'm an annoying broken record. But anyone who hasn't seen Roy's game yet should check out his clip. The first two minutes of the video show Roy's ability to shoot, drive with both hands, finish with both hands, play d, pass, handle, and hit two buzzer beaters. . . and what makes this special is that all of these highlights are from the same game (v. Arizona).


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



theanimal23 said:


> The Roy, I agree. I do not want Songalia back either. But, I think he has a player option, not a team option. Unless he feels like he will make more money elsewhere, I think he'll end up returning.
> 
> Kulaz3000, I agree, I'd like to get more veterans. I wish we could get the Hawk, Adrian Griffin, back. But that won't happen. Cuban will keep his team together. But, yeah, I think we all would like to build a versatile team. This way we can change lineups as we want to control the pace of the game. I love Noce's emergence, so we can go small if wanted. But, hopefully we can add a few bigs to go big too.
> 
> Another guy I'd like to get would be Ely. The price might be a lil too steep for him. AD is a possibility, but do you think he has anything left to provide?
> 
> I remember reading a lil while back, that Kelvin Cato said he thinks he can provide for a team like Chicago. He mentioned us. It was in the Chic. Trib. He would be a serviceable 3rd option for center.


Ely would be another nice back-up option. There's been times where he's KILLED us also.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



theanimal23 said:


> I mentioned a few pages back, that we have 2 next year (Chi and NYK). We can use one of those. A lot of times, 2nd rounders are traded for future 2nd rounders, scrubs (*cough* Othella, Sweets, Pargo) or cash. We got all 3. If Pax really wants a guy, he will make it happen.
> 
> As for getting Brewer, I'd love to be able to trade Duhon + 16 to move up to 10 (Seattle) and grab him. I know they would go for a PG. They were not satisified with the play of Ridnour or Watson. However, we may need to trade a future 1st to acquire a higher pick. If we do that, I want to trade our 16th for a future 1st, ideally next years draft.


I would think Duhon + #16 could land us atleast at 9 or 10 to a team needing a point. Boston would be the perfect choice since Rivers loves Duhon's game, but they're too high.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



such sweet thunder said:


> I know. I'm an annoying broken record. But anyone who hasn't seen Roy's game yet should check out his clip. The first two minutes of the video show Roy's ability to shoot, drive with both hands, finish with both hands, play d, pass, handle, and hit two buzzer beaters. . . and what makes this special is that all of these highlights are from the same game (v. Arizona).


The very last highlight gives a glimpse of his post-up game. They should have showed more of that. With his back to the basket, he has the ability to go right or left but also finish with either hand. 

His jumpshots were impressive in that he wasn't really wide open or coming off a ton of screens. A lot of those jumpers were quick pull-ups in the defender's face. 

Side note: I think all the highlights for each player are limited to a couple of games. For example, they must have re-played the same Aldridge rebound / put-back off the glass clip AT LEAST 5 times during his video. Tyrus Thomas' video had zero clips from the game against Texas. If you play the Mardy Collins video the first minute or so is the exact same play repeated over and over again, just at different angles. :laugh:


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I think they show about 3 different camera angles for each highlight, lol.

The ROY, hope you are right about the Duhon deal. However, do you think Skiles would allow Duhon to be moved? Thats a toughy.

SST, I agree with you about Roy. But I personally don't believe he significantly better than Brewer. But I could be very wrong. I did not see much of these two play during college. I saw Roy vs UConn.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



SALO said:


> The very last highlight gives a glimpse of his post-up game. They should have showed more of that. With his back to the basket, he has the ability to go right or left but also finish with either hand.
> 
> His jumpshots were impressive in that he wasn't really wide open or coming off a ton of screens. A lot of those jumpers were quick pull-ups in the defender's face.
> 
> Side note: I think all the highlights for each player are limited to a couple of games. For example, they must have re-played the same Aldridge rebound / put-back off the glass clip AT LEAST 5 times during his video. Tyrus Thomas' video had zero clips from the game against Texas. If you play the Mardy Collins video the first minute or so is the exact same play repeated over and over again, just at different angles. :laugh:


 I actually like these videos. They're kinda fun in a low-budget sort of way. The Morrison and Gay clips have this really hip funk soundtrack (same track for both ) that goes well with their "shaky camera" high school like highlights. Kinda reminds me of a Nike commercial.

Edit: It's 1975, and it's keeping the funk alive.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Though im sticking with Brewer as my number one gaurd option followed by Roy. Looking at the clips of Morrison is pretty impressive. By the fact that all his shots are contested and always has a hand right in his face as his too slow to move around or jump over them. I think thats impressive in itself. I think he will be a star in the nba scoring wise. Unfortunatly we don't need him..


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Portland had Gay, Roy, Morrison, and Adams (originally Foye, but he *****ed out). So it'll be interesting to read how Gay and Morrison destroyed Big bad roy once the results of it get out.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



kulaz3000 said:


> Though im sticking with Brewer as my number one gaurd option followed by Roy. Looking at the clips of Morrison is pretty impressive. By the fact that all his shots are contested and always has a hand right in his face as his too slow to move around or jump over them. I think thats impressive in itself. I think he will be a star in the nba scoring wise. Unfortunatly we don't need him..


 They have a clip of my favorite Morrison move of his video. I love when he's on the baseline and spins towards the baseline and then banks off the glass. It's so old school. Jordan used to always spin towards the bucket when he was near the edge (away from the baseline) and I think most of the current generation of players have imitated that. I've seen a couple guys who spin towards the baseline, like Garnett. But haven't seen, spin baseline, bank that wasn't on a highlight video from the 70's to mid '80's. 

I'm think I'm in agreement with you on your take of Morrison. I think he'll be special at being able to put the ball in the hoop as a pro, but I'm glad he isn't going to be on the Bulls. The other parts of his game are a headache. . .


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



theanimal23 said:


> I think they show about 3 different camera angles for each highlight, lol.
> 
> The ROY, hope you are right about the Duhon deal. However, do you think Skiles would allow Duhon to be moved? Thats a toughy.
> 
> SST, I agree with you about Roy. But I personally don't believe he significantly better than Brewer. But I could be very wrong. I did not see much of these two play during college. I saw Roy vs UConn.


Good question, for the right deal, yeah Duhon could be moved but that player would have to possess some of the same characterists of Duhon. As back-up, he's pretty damn good and could be even better starting.

Honestly, Roy isn't THAT much better than Brewer IMO. Brewer's a better ballhandler, defender and distributor. Roy's a better scorer, slasher and overall better leader. IMO, @ #2 he doesn't possess THAT much more than Brewer that we have to give up a big guy though. Trading down from #16 would be alot wiser IMO.

If the Razorbacks wouldn't have gotten eliminated so early, Brewer could've been alot more heavily favored right now.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I just viewed the highlights for Carney. He seems like a super athelete. But you've got to wonder a little when he does the whole head banging with his fist thing after dunks. I become weary as to whether there is some cult with disarrange players such as Miles or Richardson... that whole manuever doesn't do it for me. But his super quick. but his jumpshot release seems a little flat, i can imagine that getting swatted away by the atheletic SG's. And mind you with his height his going to have to pick up his handles and be a shooting gaurd. But my comments are strictly on those meager highlights....


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I'm a fan of Carney. The guy is lighting quick, and can fly. I hope he can develop into a slasher with the occasional 3. We don't need to depend heavily on anyone for 3s as we got Kirk, Benny, and Noce for those. 

I agree about the head thingy. I hate that too. But, I feel the guy is worth a risk. He can play without a doubt.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I like Carney also just on his atheletic ability. But i just don't see him fitting into the bulls. I see him more as a guy off the bench to give some energy and just go full speed. But i think his the type to drive Scott Skiles nutts. Plus his ball handling from what i've seen from games is quite terrible espically now his probably going to have to play gaurd. I also think the Bull need a BIG Guard who can play both PG/SG so they can switch around with Hinrich and Gordan. Ala. in order of preference. Brewer. Roy. Ager. or Collins. maybe even Shannon Brown.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I just don't want another small guard such as Ager or Brown. Unless those guys are small, but play big like Wade, they are a No No from me. We let Gordon pass b/c few can shoot lights out like him. If Gordon couldn't do that, he'd be worthless.

I agree with you about Carney fitting in here. But I feel like some players are too talented to pass. If a guy like him slips to 16, you have to take him if he is the BPA. I dunno why, but I think I just like him b/c his athletism is incredible, that I think he will be amazing. Others such as Miles had that ability, and suck. But Carney has been in school for 4 years under Pitino, and can hit the 3 decent. 

We'll see. Time will tell. I think the best fits are Aldridge and Brewer. Both might not be the greatest players, but they are both solid guys who will come in and contribute. Both don't have low ceilings either.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

One last comment about these video clips: I've never been a huge Sheldon Williams fan, but his highlights look much better than the rest of the bigs (with the exception of O'Braynt who looks pretty slick). Sheldon's showing both hands, and a better variety of post moves than any of the other prospects. These are just highlight clips, and don't really show anything, but I'm going to start watching Williams more closely.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I've liked Pat for a while. I think he can put on a lot of weight too and possibly go up to 275-280 easily. But he is still a project. The thing that scares me, is how we develop talent as a team. It is harder to develop big men, and they do take more time. We have not had success doing this (Eddy and Tyson). I also think Pax wants to win now, and will not pick him for that reason too. If we had a great big man coach, then we'd be fine. I wish we got Ewing while we could.


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## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



theanimal23 said:


> I just don't want another small guard such as Ager or Brown. Unless those guys are small, but play big like Wade, they are a No No from me. We let Gordon pass b/c few can shoot lights out like him. If Gordon couldn't do that, he'd be worthless.
> 
> I agree with you about Carney fitting in here. But I feel like some players are too talented to pass. If a guy like him slips to 16, you have to take him if he is the BPA. I dunno why, but I think I just like him b/c his athletism is incredible, that I think he will be amazing. Others such as Miles had that ability, and suck. But Carney has been in school for 4 years under Pitino, and can hit the 3 decent.
> 
> We'll see. Time will tell. I think the best fits are Aldridge and Brewer. Both might not be the greatest players, but they are both solid guys who will come in and contribute. Both don't have low ceilings either.


I don't think Ager is small as such. His a solid 6'5 with good atheletic ability. Very versatile. The point you made about Carney also his been in college for 4 years and the only thing that people rave about is his atheletic ability and his "potential" still. and that has to be abit of a concern. for a freshman even a sophmore maybe but for a senior youd think he'd have more cred by now.

But i agree Aldridge and Brewer. Disregarding the whole potential and what ifs and what nots of the other players in the draft. They would fit perfectly for the Bulls team for the "Now" and not the "When". and as you said they may not wow you but their ceilings arnt low either. Add in a veteran or two. and presto!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



kulaz3000 said:


> But i agree Aldridge and Brewer. Disregarding the whole potential and what ifs and what nots of the other players in the draft. They would fit perfectly for the Bulls team for the "Now" and not the "When". and as you said they may not wow you but their ceilings arnt low either. Add in a veteran or two. and presto!


Yeah, that's definintely the combo I'm looking forward to adding as well.

G Hinrich / Gordon / Brewer
F Deng / Nocioni / Aldridge / Chandler
C FA #1 / FA #2


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> Yeah, that's definintely the combo I'm looking forward to adding as well.
> 
> G Hinrich / Gordon / Brewer
> F Deng / Nocioni / Aldridge / Chandler
> C FA #1 / FA #2


That's been my hope since the beginning, though I admit I've had Barg and TT in and out. If we get Brewer I am going to flip.


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Aldridge shakes off staredown from Skiles 




> LaMarcus Aldridge got a taste of what it's like to be coached by Scott Skiles on Tuesday night when Skiles and Bulls general manager John Paxson took him to dinner downtown.
> 
> *"Scott Skiles came across as a very focused and determined man," Aldridge said after a solo workout for the Bulls on Wednesday. "At the table, he stared at me for five or 10 minutes and didn't say anything. I was kind of wondering, 'Did I do something wrong?'
> 
> "After a while, he started to open up and we had a great time. I had thought he was going to be quiet the whole night, and I was kind of scared."*
> 
> It's a good thing Aldridge has a sense of humor. He has plenty of other characteristics that could make him the Bulls' pick at No. 2 in the June 28 draft.
> 
> _Here's a recap on the sophomore from Texas:_
> 
> _Why the Bulls like him:_ He's a skilled big man who measures just taller than 6 feet 11 inches with shoes. He has the ability to hit 15- to 18-foot shots and is fundamentally sound. Aldridge can play with his back to the basket or facing it and has terrific coordination.
> 
> _Why he should like the Bulls:_ Skiles doesn't hesitate to give rookies big roles if they earn them. The Bulls need an offensive threat in the frontcourt—they were lucky to make the playoffs this season without one—and that means Aldridge could play valuable minutes.
> 
> _What he needs to work on:_ He must become more assertive or he risks getting pushed around on the block. Some say he's too nice and lacks aggressiveness, but that's probably tied to inexperience—he's only 20. If he doesn't bulk up, he will be too wiry to hold his ground against the NBA's behemoths. He's listed generously at 240 pounds. In last weekend's predraft camp, he weighed 234.


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## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



Hustle said:


> That's been my hope since the beginning, though I admit I've had Barg and TT in and out. If we get Brewer I am going to flip.


As will I my friend.

:cheers:


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## mizenkay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

wingspans are now up at inside hoops

http://www.insidehoops.com/draft-prospect-measurements.shtml


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## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Paxon needs to do everything to get Brewer. Trade up from 16 with Duhon to the 9th or 10th spot. Im guessing he'll still be there. Or trade a future draft pick for him. In the case of trading a future pick for Brewer i think we then trade the 16th pick for a future pick because i don't think we'd want an over abudance of rookies. I put Brewer even ahead of Aldridge in terms of fitting into the Bull system though not nesscarily need. Heck i put Brewer ahead of any of anyone in the draft that would into the Bulls system. The only knock on him is his shooting. But thats just repition ala Reggie Miller and more recently Josh Childress. I mean its just about practising because he has no choice but to shoot that way anyhow regarding his injury so its just about keeping it consistent.


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## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Aldridge, LaMarcus	6' 10''	6' 11.25''	234.0	88.75	

Brewer, Ronnie 6' 5.75''	6' 6.75''	223.0	83.25

SOLID!


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## Hustle

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mizenkay said:


> wingspans are now up at inside hoops
> 
> http://www.insidehoops.com/draft-prospect-measurements.shtml


Wow, the big guys didn't disappoint. None of the top prospects are going to be hurt by this, though there are some names missing.

Sene 92.5 wing, dear god. that's 7'8.5"!!!!!!!!!!

Sheldon at 88.25 is also very impressive considering his height, hell even with out considering his height.


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

What is with this delayed release of info? I suppose in a few days we will get standing reach too. Wingspan is obviously effected by should width so a guy like Aldridge who has long arms has only an average wingspan for his height because he has pretty skinny shoulders.


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## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



Hustle said:


> Wow, the big guys didn't disappoint. None of the top prospects are going to be hurt by this, though there are some names missing.
> 
> Sene 92.5 wing, dear god. that's 7'8.5"!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Sheldon at 88.25 is also very impressive considering his height, hell even with out considering his height.


Even if Sene has no offensive skill and would be redundent with Tyson Chandler I would not be opposed to the Bulls taking him at 16 if they think he has elite defense ability. He sure does seem pretty freaky.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Aldridge's Wingspan: 88.75"
Shelden's Wingspan: 88.25"


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## bbertha37

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Both Gay and Tyrus have 7'3" wingspans.


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## narek

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Aldridge meets the Press: http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/ on the right side of the page under Sports Video is Aldridge's press conference including the whole Skiles not talking for ten minutes at the 5:42 point. Comes off a bit differently than it does in the press.


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## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



narek said:


> Aldridge meets the Press: http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/ on the right side of the page under Sports Video is Aldridge's press conference including the whole Skiles not talking for ten minutes at the 5:42 point. Comes off a bit differently than it does in the press.


Webpage doesn't load for me.

Edit: Windows crashes when I get to the Video screen.


----------



## Saint Baller

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Man I hope the Bulls draft Aldride, as a 'Horns fan I would love him to come to one of my favorite team.


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## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Aldrdige looks away from the camera a lot. Sounds like he's our pick. How often does a guy go out to dinner? I've never heard of that with a draft pick, only with free agents. It doesn't sound like he's going to be working out for any teams. He said the chicago one was his first one, and he's just letting his agent handle everything, he says he thinks he might be working out in Portland next week, Tellem doing Paxson a favor by not having Aldrdige workout for many teams, good job Tim Thomas? However, Draftexpress has him working out in Toronto and Charlotte, maybe they're wrong, especially the Toronto one, you'd think he'd give himself more travel time to get well adjusted. He also said that Luol Deng was shooting hoops at 9 at night.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

OK GUYS...............


I'M CALLING IT: Paxson will draft Adridge or Roy.

WHY?: Because Paxson isn't about to risk screwing this pick up by going for risks in either Bargnani or Thomas. They have off the charts upside and lose your job, be the joke of the NBA downside.

Instead, Paxson will take the safest guy with some upside: i.e. - Roy is considered the safest bet to not be disappointing and can elevate his game still. At the very least he's a strong 6th man.

Aldridge is the safest Big man pick as he brings a very solid (if unspectacular) all around game. He can play well with Chandler since he has some range on his shot, but will still bring the D and rebound. His upside might be that of Thomas or Bargnani, but again, at worst he will be the first big of the bench and give you valuable and productive minutes.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Yup, I think Paxson continues his ways of drafting big system guys, and drafts Aldridge and Reddick. 

It pretty much sounds like Morrison is Toronto's guy, so Bargnani, how far does he fall, considering Gay would probaly be Charlotte's guy at 3.


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## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



chifaninca said:


> Instead, Paxson will take the safest guy



That means trading for a vet with a NBA track record.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Watching the highlight tape of Aldridge reminded me of what I though watching him live. 

Strengths: Length, good hands (the most underrated facet for big men IMO), good touch, good J with high release, solid footwork.

Weaknesses: He's really not a great athlete and is pretty weak. In that highlight he had a couple of those Chandleresque twisting ackward finishes as a result of not being able to go up and through a little contact.


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## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



GB said:


> That means trading for a vet with a NBA track record.



That wouldn't surprise me at all. However, the only solid rumor I hear of Odom and Mihm for #2, #16 Chandler and Duho is idiotic. Odom is a talent but WILL NOT work in Skiles' system. If Paxson doesn't understand that (and I think he does)... We're in trouble.

So, unless J Oneal become available for #2 and Duhon.....I don't know where else you go.

To me Aldridge at worst is Channing Frye and at best Chris Bosh.

I actually think Adridge will make Chandler better, as teams will probably double him as his offensive game develops.

Thomas will just crowd the paint as he can't hit the backboard from 10 feet away consistently. 

Ugggh, the thought of watching Thomas and Chandler brick from 7 feet out (they will have to issue helmets for oppposing teams).


----------



## BG7

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

If Chandler can ever just catch an alleyoop pass, and can sky over someone if they shift onto him, Aldridge with his back to the basket could just do a flip pass, not even look, just flip it up, and expect Chandler to do the alleyoop if he knows its Chandlers man, but I don't have enough faith in Chandler to finish it.


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



chifaninca said:


> Odom is a talent but WILL NOT work in Skiles' system.


He can rebound, he can shoot, he can pass. He's a natural for Skiles system.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



GB said:


> He can rebound, he can shoot, he can pass. He's a natural for Skiles system.



And so can Tim Thomas. Skiles DEMANDS you practice at the same level or you don't play. Paxson believes in the same philospohy.

Also, Chris Mihm is a stiff. 
Odom is not a practice player. Living here in So Cal I heard it every other week that Phil wasn't happy with Odom's work ethic.

On paper, Odom is an all-star. On effort, Odom is an average NBA player. And don't forget he's a max salary guy.

When I refer to Jib - Odom is the anti-jib.

I wish it wasn't so. I wanted Odom on oour team over Brand. I was very wrong. Odom has ALL the potential in the world, but could not fit i with the Lakers. He had zero pressure, but did not deliver 80% of the games.

You watch him and wonder what is wrong with him. He could dominate if he wanted to. Problem is, most night he doesn't want to.


If they were to send Odom, Bynum, #26 and future set of #2s....I would be interested, but not at the cost of #s 2, 16, Chandler and Duhon.

Duhon would be awesome next to kobe and Chandler would also see a great improvement.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



chifaninca said:


> If they were to send Odom, Bynum, #26 and future set of #2s....I would be interested, but not at the cost of #s 2, 16, Chandler and Duhon.


Agreed


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



chifaninca said:


> And so can Tim Thomas.


Welll for that matter so can Songaila. Difference between Odom and Tim and Songaila? He's better than all three.



> Skiles DEMANDS you practice at the same level or you don't play. Paxson believes in the same philospohy.


Why do we believe this will be a problem for Odom? 16, 8 and 4. All he has to do is what he's always done. We don't need him to try and be our Kobe or our LeBron.

He's a piece. And Tim is gone. Regardless of the reasons, nothing is bringing him back. The future is a more interesting sandbox to play in than the past. Join us there.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



GB said:


> Welll for that matter so can Songaila. Difference between Odom and Tim and Songaila? He's better than all three.
> 
> 
> 
> Why do we believe this will be a problem for Odom? 16, 8 and 4. All he has to do is what he's always done. We don't need him to try and be our Kobe or our LeBron.
> 
> He's a piece. And Tim is gone. Regardless of the reasons, nothing is bringing him back. The future is a more interesting sandbox to play in than the past. Join us there.



I understand, but you don't make the same mistake again.........do you?

If you know a guy won't practice the way you demand you either have to accept it or you have to avoid it.

odom isn't suddenly going to change for Skiles, when he has tuned out Phil Jackson.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



GB said:


> Welll for that matter so can Songaila. Difference between Odom and Tim and Songaila? He's better than all three.
> 
> 
> 
> Why do we believe this will be a problem for Odom? 16, 8 and 4. All he has to do is what he's always done. We don't need him to try and be our Kobe or our LeBron.
> 
> He's a piece. And Tim is gone. Regardless of the reasons, nothing is bringing him back. The future is a more interesting sandbox to play in than the past. Join us there.



PS - I don't like, nor ever liked Tim Thomas. I was surprised it took us that long to get rid of him, knowing our management and their expectations.

Tim Thomas is one of the all-time underachievers (with the talent he was given)...hey wait, right next to him on that list is Lamar Odom.....But go ahead and give away your depth and talent. We love medicrity as long as it comes with JIB.

JIB PLEASE


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



chifaninca said:


> Tim Thomas is one of the all-time underachievers (with the talent he was given)...hey wait, right next to him on that list is Lamar Odom.....


I'll take the career 16ppg 8.5rbnds and 4.5 assists.

I'm not interested in developing the guy...he gives me more offense than Sweets and Harrington and passing to boot.

Potential is for young guys. He's a known quality now and we can use what he's shown. Anything else is gravy.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



GB said:


> I'll take the career 16ppg 8.5rbnds and 4.5 assists.
> 
> I'm not interested in developing the guy...he gives me more offense than Sweets and Harrington and passing to boot.
> 
> Potential is for young guys. He's a known quality now and we can use what he's shown. Anything else is gravy.



I completely agree. I just wish our coach and GM saw it that way.


----------



## GB

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



chifaninca said:


> I completely agree. I just wish our coach and GM saw it that way.


Well, their detractors say Paxson won't take a risk, and that Skiles demands unquestioning obedience.

So here's the gut check. If they pull the trade off, the board will be forced to reunite because it'll take away the major plank of the opposition party 'platform'. I'd just hope we wouldn't have people rooting for the trade/player to fail.

Of course it could fall the other way too.


----------



## laso

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Watching those highlights, I came away real impressed by Gay and Brewer.


----------



## SALO

Mike McGraw: Aldridge ranked below Thomas & Roy on Bulls draft board 



> So the biggest question regarding Aldridge is if he will simply be a competent NBA big man or if he has the chance to be special.
> 
> Here’s an interesting comparison to two former college centers from the state of Texas: Tony Battie averaged 18.8 points and 11.8 rebounds during his final season at Texas Tech. Chris Mihm produced 17.7 points and 10.5 rebounds at Texas in 1999-2000.
> 
> Both turned in better college stats than Aldridge, both were top-10 draft picks and both have become decent, but very ordinary, NBA players.
> 
> *The idea that Aldridge might have limited potential probably is the biggest reason he has ranked below LSU forward Tyrus Thomas and Washington guard Brandon Roy on the Bulls’ draft board.*


I think Thomas & Roy have been Pax's guys all along. McGraw seems to think so, and based on his Q&A responses he's given to this message board in the past, I'd like to think McGraw is pretty in tune with what the organization is thinking. 

More evidence to support Thomas & Roy? Remember an interview Pax did before the draft lottery? He specifically stated that he hoped to land *at least a top two pick*. He didn't say top three, even though the lottery is set up for the first three picks. The fact he specifically said top two means he's had his eye on two players all season long, and had two favorites based on the college season, since he made that statement before any workouts or measurements occured.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Odom is a tweener. He is more of an offensive orchestra who looks to score second. Isn't an aggressive defensive player. Doesn't play all out. Only thing going for him is versatility. But we have our wing players and forwards. Deng is probably just as good as him if only he had more touches. We also don't need an offensive orchestra since we have Hinrich as our floor general. We need a big and his name is Aldridge. We also need to get Brewer who can play 3 positions on the court. I think his another andre iguodala without the major hops but with more basketball IQ. We need to trade up for Brewer. I think his the perfect fit in terms of our team. Our backcourt could switch around constantly without missing a beat with Deng. Gordan. Hinrich. and Brewer. MONSTER! Then add on Chandlers and Aldridge length to protect the basket. We're going to continue to be the top defensive teams for a very long time. And thats not including a few veterans.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Reports and conversations with various people (i.e. Coach Brady of LSU) indicate Tyrus is their man. We'll see what happens today (?) when he comes for his tryout. I think Tyrus is Pax's man. I don't think he'll go with Roy, as we have a larger need in the frontcourt, and they want a guy with his athletism and passion. 

I'll be happy with either guys, but I hope Pax has not made up his mind yet.

Have we looked at Thabo yet in a workout?


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Ok but if pax wants thomas or roy then is he planning to trade up to get say brewer who will not be there at 16?

david


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



> Ok but if pax wants thomas or roy then is he planning to trade up to get say brewer who will not be there at 16?


i think Duhon and the 16th can get to atleast the 10th spot. I really hope we get Brewer.


----------



## giusd

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

They just posted Thomas' Wing Span. 7'3". Wow that is only two inches shorter than O'Bryant. This more than makes up for his height of 6'8 1/2" in shoes. Still have no idea what pax is going to do.

david


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



theanimal23 said:


> Reports and conversations with various people (i.e. Coach Brady of LSU) indicate Tyrus is their man. We'll see what happens today (?) when he comes for his tryout. I think Tyrus is Pax's man. I don't think he'll go with Roy, as we have a larger need in the frontcourt, and they want a guy with his athletism and passion.
> 
> I'll be happy with either guys, but I hope Pax has not made up his mind yet.
> 
> Have we looked at Thabo yet in a workout?



Seems pretty clear that Pax is wanting Thomas. I think the whole Roy thing developed as a way to scare the teams below us into thinking we might draft their guy and try to gouge them for something.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

WARNING:

If you're a Bargnani fan who doesn't think he'll be available when we pick, or that Pax will take him if he is available, you don't want to click on this Insider profile. Or see the highlights I'm posting.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2006/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&id=2484931

--Bargnani's recently measured out at 7-1 (shoes), 250 lbs, 9-2 standing reach

--He's a very tough city kid. He grew up in the heart of Rome

--The head coach of Treviso is an American named David Blatt, who emphasized how unusual it is for a guy Bargnani's age to be such a key guy in such a competitive league. "When he plays well, we win." Stresses that what separates Bargnani from some similar Euro prospects past and present is that he loves to finish and absorb contact.

--NBA exec in attendance told Ford he thinks Bargnani can be a 5 in the NBA

--His nickname is "Il Mago," "The Magician"

--Speaks fluent English

--Posterized Dalibor Bagaric vs. Bologna (the game Ford witnessed)

--"While other top prospects are ducking workouts or asking teams to bring them in alone, Bargnani is playing in top-level competition just two weeks before the draft."

--"If you know anything about basketball overseas," one executive said, "then you know the type of pressure and competition that kid played against tonight. The players are better than college and the intensity is greater than just about anything you'll ever come up against. Do you know how crazy you all [in the media] would be going if an NBA rookie put up a performance like that in the Finals? He's going to be just fine."

Sigh.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ScottMay said:


> --Bargnani's recently measured out at 7-1 (shoes), 250 lbs, 9-2 standing reach
> 
> --NBA exec in attendance told Ford he thinks Bargnani can be a 5 in the NBA


 :jawdrop:

yeah, but how appealing is having a C that likes to stand out on the perimeter (a la Sam Perkins)?


----------



## Electric Slim

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> :jawdrop:
> 
> yeah, but how appealing is having a C that likes to stand out on the perimeter (a la Sam Perkins)?



The SAm Perkins that made it to two NBA finals?


----------



## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> :jawdrop:
> 
> yeah, but how appealing is having a C that likes to stand out on the perimeter (a la Sam Perkins)?



you know the game is changing,if this guy is the real deal the should pick him


----------



## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



kulaz3000 said:


> i think Duhon and the 16th can get to atleast the 10th spot. I really hope we get Brewer.



why would a team witha top ten pick trade down to get a back up pg .Who can not shoot and get middle first round pick for ? people overrat duhon value


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ScottMay said:


> WARNING:
> 
> --His nickname is "Il Mago," "The Magician"


Wasn't Toni Kukoc's nickname "The Magician" back in croatia? Or was it "The waiter"?


----------



## SecretAgentGuy

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

*sigh*

I really wish we had more Bargnani footage because this kid is such a wild card. I'm not too concerned with his lack of a low post game because we're seeing that become outdated. Besides, in our system having a big that can pick and roll is far more important. If Bargnani's shot is anything near what it's advertised he'd be pretty successful. My biggest concern is this - can Bargnani defend and rebound better than Eddy Curry?


----------



## SecretAgentGuy

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



Electric Slim said:


> The SAm Perkins that made it to two NBA finals?


 I believe that would the same Sam Perkins that hit the game winner against the Bulls in game 1.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



mr.ankle20 said:


> why would a team witha top ten pick trade down to get a back up pg .Who can not shoot and get middle first round pick for ? people overrat duhon value


I don't nesscarily think Duhon is overated. Sure most teams would probably have him as a back up point. But his a solid back up point. Who plays great defense, good distrubuter and team player. Im just guessing if someone can fill a need with a point guard Duhon could be good trade bait along with the 16th. If you think about it the whole draft is up in the air. Noone can really say they solidfied a draft position. Plus i don't see any alot of immediate impact players in the draft anyhow. So someone could get a solid Pg in Duhon and a project player with the 16th that could be just as good as the 10th. And before you say that could be said according to the Bulls in terms of them getting just as a good player with the 16th as with the 10th, its just that im in favour of Brewer. So im just trying to find ways to get Brewer in a Bulls uniform. 

Regarding Ridnour compared to Duhon? I think Duhon is a better overall player anyhow. I think that would be an upgrade for seattle.

But as i've said im just throwing some ideas in the air.


----------



## BULLS23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



ScottMay said:


> WARNING:
> 
> If you're a Bargnani fan who doesn't think he'll be available when we pick, or that Pax will take him if he is available, you don't want to click on this Insider profile. Or see the highlights I'm posting.
> 
> http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2006/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&id=2484931
> 
> --Bargnani's recently measured out at 7-1 (shoes), 250 lbs, 9-2 standing reach
> 
> --He's a very tough city kid. He grew up in the heart of Rome
> 
> --The head coach of Treviso is an American named David Blatt, who emphasized how unusual it is for a guy Bargnani's age to be such a key guy in such a competitive league. "When he plays well, we win." Stresses that what separates Bargnani from some similar Euro prospects past and present is that he loves to finish and absorb contact.
> 
> --NBA exec in attendance told Ford he thinks Bargnani can be a 5 in the NBA
> 
> --His nickname is "Il Mago," "The Magician"
> 
> --Speaks fluent English
> 
> --Posterized Dalibor Bagaric vs. Bologna (the game Ford witnessed)
> 
> --"While other top prospects are ducking workouts or asking teams to bring them in alone, Bargnani is playing in top-level competition just two weeks before the draft."
> 
> --"If you know anything about basketball overseas," one executive said, "then you know the type of pressure and competition that kid played against tonight. The players are better than college and the intensity is greater than just about anything you'll ever come up against. Do you know how crazy you all [in the media] would be going if an NBA rookie put up a performance like that in the Finals? He's going to be just fine."
> 
> Sigh.


Thanks Scott . . . And Whoa! I'd be surprised if he was a FULL time 5 in the NBA, but he seems to be able to handle it when we would go small. I think if he is the real deal he could be Dirl-lite. He seems to have a solid body and is a legit 7'. I wouldn't be horrified if we got him, but I do prefer Aldridge.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



SALO said:


> Mike McGraw: Aldridge ranked below Thomas & Roy on Bulls draft board
> 
> 
> The idea that Aldridge might have limited potential probably is the biggest reason he has ranked below LSU forward Tyrus Thomas and Washington guard Brandon Roy on the Bulls’ draft board.


This is interesting. McGraw has been a pretty responsible journalist as far as I know. Although his use of the past tense "has" makes me wonder how long ago he knew about the Bulls draft board.


----------



## SecretAgentGuy

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



TripleDouble said:


> This is interesting. McGraw has been a pretty responsible journalist as far as I know. Although his use of the past tense "has" makes me wonder how long ago he knew about the Bulls draft board.


 I'm sure this topic has been discussed somewhere in this thread but it'll be interesting to see it rehashed in light of recent reports. Is Bargnani or Aldridge a future all star player? And which one is more likely to reach that status? Given the lack of big men in the league, becoming a top 5 player at that position isn't extremely difficult. This isn't the 90s where we had Shaq, Robinson, Dikembe, Hakeem, Zo, and Ewing. Outside of Yao what centers still exist?


----------



## mr.ankle20

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



TripleDouble said:


> This is interesting. McGraw has been a pretty responsible journalist as far as I know. Although his use of the past tense "has" makes me wonder how long ago he knew about the Bulls draft board.


I would not trust him , remember the whole jamal cawford fiasco.Every Chicago and New York newspaper reported that the trade was in the works. But he denied those stories until the trade actually happen


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Some pics of game 1 against Bologna (courtesy basketground.it)




























Bargnani Vs Belinelli


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

For the Bargnani supporters: 

I like what I have seen and read. If he can provide better defense than Eddy Curry and provided his jump is as good as advertised, I'll like him.

Regarding Aldridge...

Someone mentioned earlier him chucking up shots Tyson-esque and they went in. I think Aldridge has the work ethic (it appears that way) and the frame to add weight. I think he can get up to 260. He won't be another Toothpick Tyson.

I'll be happy with either guy. Lets see what happens. I think Paxson will take the safer pick, which is Roy or Aldridge.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Btw, Deng at the gym at night, nice. We gotta keep the kid. Lets hope Aldridge joins them this summer and they are constant gym rats.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Barganini looks to have a Yao like body in that his lower body is pretty well developed but his arms are skinny.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



TripleDouble said:


> Barganini looks to have a Yao like body in that his lower body is pretty well developed but his arms are skinny.


Toronto will take him. Coangelo has scouted him for 2 years, he is NBA ready, played against great competition, and look at his measurements. He has the body to play the 4 or 5. He won't play center, but once he adds a low post game, he will be hard to stop. 

My choice for who we draft: Whoever Toronto doesn't between Bargnani or Aldridge.


----------



## narek

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

The Blazers are posting videos of their draft workouts:

http://www.nba.com/blazers/news/draftcentral.html so since they're seeing the same folks Pax and Skiles are seeing, we should get video of Aldridge, Morrison, Roy etc in the next week.


----------



## SALO

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

"Il Mago" is a cool sounding nickname. 

Carry on.


----------



## BDMcGee

*Aldridge or Roy?*

It appears that the two most likely selections at #2 for the Bulls are either LaMarcus Aldridge or Brandon Roy. After Tyrus Thomas measured out at 6'8 in shoes it's unlikely that the Bulls will use the 2nd overall pick on him. Bargnani is a possibility, but it's unclear whether or not the Bulls have any interest in him. So my question for everyone is, who should they draft? Should it be Aldridge or Roy?

LaMarcus Aldridge is a talent and would fit in perfectly with this team. He's 6'11 with a huge wingspan allowing him to play even bigger and he has big, soft hands. Due to his hands he can catch nearly any kind of pass thrown to him and they allow him to be a dominant rebounder. He would be able to catch the tough entry passes Gordon, Hinrich, and Duhon like to throw that Tyson Chandler normally drops. He has hands like a shortstop in baseball. He has an effortless shooting stroke should become an excellent mid-range shooter. He could become a great pick-and-pop guy to use with our guards. In addition to that he has a very good post game. He also has excellent defensive skills (Big 12 Defensive Player of the Year), and can guard all three positions on the front-line. Because of his size, talent, and versatility he's a blue-chip prospect and would help the Bulls front-line immensely.

Roy can do it all. He has good size for a guard and has the total offensive reportoire. He creates off the dribble incredibly well and can get into the lane seemingly at will due to his explosive first-step. He can hit the pull-up jumper and is also capable of backing down smaller guards in the post. He has great court vision and passing ability and is capable of making his teammtes around him better. He's also a solid rebounder from the guard position and is a good defensive player. More than anything though, he has great intangibles. He's a fiery competitor who plays with great confidence and doesn't back down from anybody. He has no problem being a leader and embraces the role of carrying a team on his back. He also has the great feel and understanding of the game that all the great ones have. He would really, really help the Bulls backcourt.

The question is, which one of the two should the Bulls take? It's a dead-heat for me. I've been shouting from the rooftops the last few days saying that they should take Roy, but I'm waivering on that a little bit. I have to admit that theoretically Aldridge makes more sense due to team needs. I would be thrilled with either one of them. Thoughts?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

This Colangelo guy is sooo lucky. Even Russ Granik noticed this during lotto night. :raised_ey


----------



## Banjoriddim

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

I read from Raps board that Bargnani is 7'1''1/4 with shoes and weights 249 lbs (some sort of official mesurments...) this stuff sounds scary :biggrin:


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



The ROY said:


> yeah, but how appealing is having a C that likes to stand out on the perimeter (a la Sam Perkins)?


First of all, Ford said he CAN play center, not that he necessarily will play center. If a coach really wants to use mismatches, he'll be playing PF most of the time. 

Secondly, I could care less if a player (or team for that matter) is perimeter oriented. What's important is that they can score efficiently and get high percentage shots. I get pretty tired of hearing about how low-post offense is so important. 3 of the final 4 NBA teams in the playoffs were almost completely perimeter oriented. Nowitzki is probably going to be the Finals MVP and he's not a low-post guy; what he does well is score the ball at an efficient clip. 

As long as Bargnani can find his signature shot in the NBA like the other stars, he'll be an incredible player. A 7-footer with his skill level has a very good chance of doing so.


----------



## DaBabyBullz

*Re: Aldridge or Roy?*

Neither, Bargnani, Thomas are just 2 that should be taken ahead of Aldridge. Ahead of Roy I'd also put Gay and Morrison. So I guess if I had to pick between Aldridge and Roy, it'd be Aldridge without a doubt.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Hey all, standing reach measurements have been added.

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1348

I really wish we got official measurements on Alexander Johnson, Hassan Adams, Bargnani, and Thabo.

Patrick O'Bryant's frame is HUGE! I wonder if he's our "secret workout" warrior from yesterday.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Hey all, standing reach measurements have been added.
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1348
> 
> I really wish we got official measurements on Alexander Johnson, Hassan Adams, Bargnani, and Thabo.


O'Bryant and Sene both with ridiculous standing reaches of 9'5". :eek8:


----------



## Hous1978

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Something that was not mentioned in the recap is that Bargs coach has been working with Blatt on a post game all season long. Ford saw him practicing it, and said his post game looks promising.


----------



## jnrjr79

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

Everyone together now...


Merge!


----------



## MKazz

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Anyone else think Carney was a lot taller than 6'4.5''? I mean he's only a half inch taller than the "undersized" Redick...


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*



MKazz said:


> Anyone else think Carney was a lot taller than 6'4.5''? I mean he's only a half inch taller than the "undersized" Redick...



Yeah, Carney is shorter than anticipated. At 6' 5.75", I think they'll probably round up and list him at 6' 6", which is only one inch shorter than his college listing.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Attention: Draft Nerds - *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (merging!!)*

Thomas with a standing reach only 2 inches less than Aldridges and 4 (!) more than Shelden Williams'.


----------



## deranged40

*NBA Pre-Draft Measurements*

NBA Pre-Draft Measurements 

I don't think this has been posted yet, so sorry if it's already on here somewhere. Draft Express just put up the Pre-Draft Measurements so I figured some people would want to take a look. Aldridge is a legit 6'11", while Thomas is only 6'8".


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: NBA Pre-Draft Measurements*

merged again.





just don't touch jnrjr's monkey  :smilewink


----------



## deranged40

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (INCLUDING Draft Measurements) Merged!*

Oops sorry for the redundant thread everybody, I haven't been on this board in awhile and didn't notice the draft thread.


----------



## GB

*Re: NBA Pre-Draft Measurements*



> *This blog post is meant to be the giant fan that will clear all the smoke from everyone's eyes. All these workouts in the upcoming week of the top NCAA prospects are merely to help Bryan Colangelo decide if he should attempt to trade for another first round pick. The first overall pick is already locked up by Andrea Bargnani.
> 
> I've suspected this to be the case ever since the Raptors won the first overall pick, but my fear of the unknown has driven to me to consider "safer" alternatives like Aldridge, Thomas and Morrison. My fear is irrelevant to the fact that Colangelo has coveted Bargnani for years and he will not pass up the opportunity to draft him now. Nobody else in this draft offers the same combination of size, skill and proven performance.
> --
> Over the next two weeks, don't be fooled by the smokescreens, the rumors and the workouts. On June 28th, you shouldn't just be prepared for David Stern to announce Andrea Bargnani's name with the Raptors' first overall pick – you should expect it.*


http://www.raptorblog.com/


----------



## The ROY

*Re: NBA Pre-Draft Measurements*



GB said:


> http://www.raptorblog.com/


pretty much

no way colangelo passes up a player he covets so much....


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (INCLUDING Draft Measurements) Merged!*



deranged40 said:


> Oops sorry for the redundant thread everybody, I haven't been on this board in awhile and didn't notice the draft thread.


 These stickied workout and draft threads serve a purpose, but shouldn't the measurements have their own thread? I mean, wasn't the one from last year like ten pages long? Six people have tried to start it as its own thread for a reason.

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

Nows the part in the program where I verbalize how happy I am that I am no longer a mod and don't have to deal with the *****ing from the masses!!! You guys are doing a terrific job, and I am thankful for your hard work .


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (INCLUDING Draft Measurements) Merged!*

fine.


i will make an OFFICIAL measurements thread and will stick that sucker up at the top.


----------



## jnrjr79

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (INCLUDING Draft Measurements) Merged!*

This is not a democracy. We shall not listen to the irrelevant voices from the mindless horde!


Carry on.


: )


----------



## dogra

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (INCLUDING Draft Measurements) Merged!*



mizenkay said:


> fine.
> 
> 
> i will make an OFFICIAL measurements thread and will stick that sucker up at the top.


Don't let it be said that mizenkay doesn't respect the will of the people. :twave:


----------



## yodurk

*Re: NBA Pre-Draft Measurements*



GB said:


> http://www.raptorblog.com/


  

I hope he's wrong, but it's consistent with everything we've heard. How can Toronto be so greedy? They already have 2 good young PF's.


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

The Oregonian Blazers Beat writer got a peak at the Roy-Gay -Morrison work out in Portland, and the winner was - Gay:

http://www.oregonlive.com/weblogs/b...live_blazersbeat/archives/2006_06.html#151826



> By looking through the blinds in the media room Thursday, I got a chance to see a large chunk of the Blazers workout featuring Adam Morrison, Rudy Gay, Brandon Roy and Hassan Adams.
> 
> My opinion, and granted, I'm just a beat reporter and not a talent evaluator: Rudy Gay outplayed Morrison.
> 
> The most striking facet of the workout was Gay's ability to drive past Morrison. Twice this resulted in thunderous dunks by Gay. Morrison also had his shot blocked multiple times by Gay.


But then there's this:



> Everybody knows that Morrison's defense will be a concern, and I think today's workout confirmed those questions. Morrison always appeared a step slow. That being said, I thought Morrison - and everyone for that matter - competed at a very high level. It wasn't like any one of the four was scoring at will. In fact, there was a time when Morrison cut off Gay's baseline drive, after which Gay hit the side of the backboard with his shot.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

What a fun article. This has to be written by the same guy who did the stalking of the GMs on the grassy knoll, John Paxson mouthing "Roy" bit. This is what we need -- more investagtive/stalking journalism!

My favorite quote was this: Former Blazers center Chris Dudley was on hand, and remarked that Morrison's game will translate well to the NBA because of his high release point.

How do you spell irony?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

Professor Dudley of Yale University uses his knowledge of Physics to analyze Morrison's shot, lol.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

If Roy can't finish at the rim, and Gay can, there is no reason to take Roy over Gay, AT ALL.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

I think the most interesting news of the last two days is out of Atlanta and reported by Chad Ford who says he has two sources that Williams has a agreement with Atlanta at the 5th pick. I think there is a lot of this doesnt make sense (which it doesnt by the way) but we are talking altanta here.

But if this is true, and it does appear that williams has stopped working out for teams, then some one is going to fall out of the top 6 and into the 7th spot where boston sits.

I really think that it looks more and more like Roy may be the player that falls, which doesnt reflect the kind of pro he will be but i think Bangnani, Thomas, Morrison, Gay, and Aldridge are locks for the top 6 and if so someone has to fall to 7 and unless someone takes a chance it think Roy falls.

And the word from boston is they want to trade out since the GM doesnt seeem that high and anyone this year. So 7 is for sale and i think Roy is in the slot.

david


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> If Roy can't finish at the rim, and Gay can, there is no reason to take Roy over Gay, AT ALL.


Here are several:

- defense
- leadership/maturity
- motor/work ethic
- ballhandling
- shooting

Outside of that, yes, Gay is a no brainer.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

I wish Gay had Tyrus' motor and demeanor, as he is by far the most talented player in the draft. It's definitely a statement if you are the most talented player in UConn history. I know that is quite the difference from being the most accomplished. We'll see if he continues UConn's run of producing great NBA products.


----------



## OziBull

*Blazers Blog workout Roy, Gay, Morrison*

Blazer Blog 

Its interesting, if Aldridge is gone maybe Gay is our man if he is the BPA?
Could he play SG?


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Blazers Blog workout Roy, Gay, Morrison*

(thanks ozi. and yes, i merged the thread)

here's what they said about Roy.

*Brandon Roy in these drills showed great accuracy from 15 feet, hitting about 8 of 10 shots. Again, very pretty shot. During the competitive portion of the workout, I noticed that Roy had trouble finishing at the rim, but he also had some nice passes to Morrison after penetrating.

Afterward, McMillan refused to talk about individual players. saying that it was "pretty much what we expected. They did what they could, and the guys who were scorers and shooters ... what I saw on tape, I saw here.''

In summary: I thought Gay outplayed Morrison, and that Roy was as advertised - not great at anything, but solid at everything.*


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> I wish Gay had Tyrus' motor and demeanor, as he is by far the most talented player in the draft. It's definitely a statement if you are the most talented player in UConn history. I know that is quite the difference from being the most accomplished. We'll see if he continues UConn's run of producing great NBA products.


I just can't get past Gay's unwillingness to receive the ball in key spots in tight games during the tourney. We need a guy with Gay's athleticism, but not if he's going to be a shrinking violet in the fourth quarter.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> And the word from boston is they want to trade out since the GM doesnt seeem that high and anyone this year. So 7 is for sale and i think Roy is in the slot.
> 
> david


Is there any word from Boston as to what they'd be looking for to trade away the #7 pick?

If the GM isn't that high on anyone in the draft, he's probably not interested in the #16, so that's out. Would we be willing to part with Nocioni or Deng to get the #7? That's what I'd be looking for if I were in Ainge's shoes.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Is there any word from Boston as to what they'd be looking for to trade away the #7 pick?
> 
> If the GM isn't that high on anyone in the draft, he's probably not interested in the #16, so that's out. Would we be willing to part with Nocioni or Deng to get the #7? That's what I'd be looking for if I were in Ainge's shoes.


Want the 7th pick of the draft whom? To draft Roy? Both Nocioni and Deng are better than Roy. I wouldn't do that deal. Maybe package the 16th with future first round picks but definitly not part with Nocioni or Deng. If that were the case id rather trade one of them for Brewer as he can play some SF as well.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Is there any word from Boston as to what they'd be looking for to trade away the #7 pick?
> 
> If the GM isn't that high on anyone in the draft, he's probably not interested in the #16, so that's out. Would we be willing to part with Nocioni or Deng to get the #7? That's what I'd be looking for if I were in Ainge's shoes.


We'd be dumb to do that. Deng or Noc, proven NBA players with the potential to get even better, for the 7 pick in a weak draft? No thanks.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

I think paxson has all but said that KH, BG, deng, Noci, and chandler are untouchable so trading any of them of the 7th pick is totally out of the question.

I have no idea what anige would be looking for for the bulls to trade up. My guess is our pick at 16 and something in the future but i really have no idea. We got deng for basically nothing just swapping picks for next year. Pax has been good at this so i hope he has a plan.

david


----------



## charlietyra

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> I think paxson has all but said that KH, BG, deng, Noci, and chandler are untouchable so trading any of them of the 7th pick is totally out of the question.
> 
> I have no idea what anige would be looking for for the bulls to trade up. My guess is our pick at 16 and something in the future but i really have no idea. We got deng for basically nothing just swapping picks for next year. Pax has been good at this so i hope he has a plan.
> 
> david


Chandler is "untouchable" in the sense that no team in its right mind would want this turkey at five more years at about $50 million. For the 7th pick I would give them Chandler and throw in Reinsdorf's daughter as a sweetner.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

When is the draft? We should put the date of the draft in the thread title.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> We'd be dumb to do that. Deng or Noc, proven NBA players with the potential to get even better, for the 7 pick in a weak draft? No thanks.


Yeah, after hearing that Deng was practicing when Aldridge came in, I don't want to trade him, he seems commited to improving.

If they can get a little workout group of Chris, Ben, Deng, Reddick, Aldridge, Livingston, and develop some chemistry, good god! (does Kirk workout at the Berto during the summer? I assume Noc. stays in Argentina most of the summer).


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

Noc is playing the World Championship for Argentina.


----------



## Like A Breath

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> I just can't get past Gay's unwillingness to receive the ball in key spots in tight games during the tourney. We need a guy with Gay's athleticism, but not if he's going to be a shrinking violet in the fourth quarter.


Did you watch the last game against George Mason? Who kept the Huskies in the game in the second half and made big basket after big basket?


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> I think paxson has all but said that KH, BG, deng, Noci, and chandler are untouchable so trading any of them of the 7th pick is totally out of the question.
> 
> I have no idea what anige would be looking for for the bulls to trade up. My guess is our pick at 16 and something in the future but i really have no idea. We got deng for basically nothing just swapping picks for next year. Pax has been good at this so i hope he has a plan.
> 
> david


Well, what Pax was "good at" in 2004 was picking up the phone when Bryan Colangelo was calling other GMs in a panic looking to unload the #7 because he needed to maximize Cap Space to make a run at Kobe Bryant. (the Cap Space went instead to the reigning two-time MVP, as it turns out.) Is Boston in similar straits? Not to my knowledge--they're a bad team that needs help right now at multiple positions and has no room to sign free agents. 

I wouldn't want Paxson to trade a good young player for this year's #7, either, but I'm trying to keep the discussion grounded in reality. We're not going to bogart away a pick from a GM ahead of us through sheer magic -- it'll cost us something.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



Like A Breath said:


> Did you watch the last game against George Mason? Who kept the Huskies in the game in the second half and made big basket after big basket?


That doesn't atone for the two previous games where Gay was visibly petrified whenever the ball came near him during crunch time. That's just me, though.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> That doesn't atone for the two previous games where Gay was visibly petrified whenever the ball came near him during crunch time. That's just me, though.


Eh, Ben Gordon is for clutch time. If Gay can show up as often as Hinrich does in clutch, he'll be fine.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

Hey all, I have a question about Sene.

Scouting has clearly improved over the years, as has the rabid basketball fan's access to scouting. Back in the day, when David Stern said "Toni Kukoc, nobody in the Theatre at Madison Square Garden knew who he was. These days, that kind of thing would never happen. To be an unknown player now, do you have to be...bad?

This brings me to Saer Sene. Man, does that kid have incredible physical vitals. I know he looked amazing at the Nike Hoops Summit and all, but I worry about drafting a player that draftniks hadn't even heard about until March. 

So here's my question: have there been any international players that nobody knew about -- total diamonds in the rough -- that came out of nowhere right before the draft, got drafted in the first round, and actually ended up being a good player? I can't think of one off hand, and it makes me wonder if Sene is the kind of player Chad Ford or some other guru talks up enough to be drafted, and only later we find out that the guy isn't really a basketball player. I think about Skita and Podkolzine most of all when I think about this kind of player. Maybe Krystic was the most unknown player that ended up pretty good. I also don't know Dirk's whole story. Tony Parker was getting serious minutes on his team his last year, scoring over 13 points a game, so he definitely doesn't qualify.

Of course, my philosophy is conservative, but I wonder whether it's advisable to risk a #16 pick on a player such as Sene, who didn't make any waves until right before the draft. So am I crazy, or were the other foreign players who have succeeded in the NBA more experienced (and therefore more known quantities) at draft time?


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



> or were the other foreign players who have succeeded in the NBA more experienced (and therefore more known quantities) at draft time?


It's really hard to say, when you go further back past the euro hype craze, you end up getting into the era where teams selected the players with late picks which stayed in Europe for a while.
You could say they were more experienced, but this is mainly due to them developing their game, rather than being thrown into the deep end that is the NBA and be asked to swim. One thing I won't forget is how Drazen Petrovic already won it all when he was drafted by the Blazers in the 3rd round, but opted to stay for another 3 years in Europe as he didn't believe he was ready.



> This brings me to Saer Sene. Man, does that kid have incredible physical vitals. I know he looked amazing at the Nike Hoops Summit and all, but I worry about drafting a player that draftniks hadn't even heard about until March.


With him being at the Nike Hoops summit shows to me that he wasn't off the radar completely, I just think that him entering his name into the draft came as a suprise to everyone.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

HI Everyone,

Yahoo sports has 3 minute clips on most of the top 20 picks in the draft and they are really worth a look. From what i say Rudy Gay is going to be a star and can easily play both SF and SG in the NBA. Pax should really consider him.

Roy doesnt seem that big and plays on the floor and IMHO plays a lot like a bigger mike bibby but has great court sense.

I think Brewer looks super and much better than Carney and he is a lot more explosive than Roy and he is going to get to the free throw line a ton in the nba. I think he could be the perfect fit for us.

Thomas does look really skinny and seems more like a tweener than a real PF.

Williams looks alot like a poor mans Karl Malone. His shoulders are huge.

Aldridge is really long and shots the ball with has hands really high and i think he will be a great back to the basket big man and he looks a lot bigger than thomas.

Carney is a great jumper but i think he will fall he doesnt seem to have the court sense that the other SG have. 

Anyone who thinks JJ Redrick is not going to be a solid starter in the nba needs to watch these clips and look at his stats in college he looks super.

O'bryant is going to take a few years to develop and he is really skinny but looks like a young Robert Parish. He also has small shoulder much like Will Perdue.

Simmons is huge but looks really machinical on offensive.

Marcus Willimas is going to be a star he really looks like he is in total control when he is running the offensive and seems to have several speeds he can use when ever he wants to.

Morrison is going to be an all star and is the likely ROY.

I also think that paxson will take a pass on Thomas due to his size that it looks like a tweener and will take Aldridge and if i was him i would trade up and really try to get brewer.

david


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



El Chapu said:


> Noc is playing the World Championship for Argentina.



Really? I didn't know he was playing this year, can someone get us some stats please? See how the guy is doing.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> I think the most interesting news of the last two days is out of Atlanta and reported by Chad Ford who says he has two sources that Williams has a agreement with Atlanta at the 5th pick. I think there is a lot of this doesnt make sense (which it doesnt by the way) but we are talking altanta here.
> 
> But if this is true, and it does appear that williams has stopped working out for teams, then some one is going to fall out of the top 6 and into the 7th spot where boston sits.
> 
> I really think that it looks more and more like Roy may be the player that falls, which doesnt reflect the kind of pro he will be but i think Bangnani, Thomas, Morrison, Gay, and Aldridge are locks for the top 6 and if so someone has to fall to 7 and unless someone takes a chance it think Roy falls.
> 
> And the word from boston is they want to trade out since the GM doesnt seeem that high and anyone this year. So 7 is for sale and i think Roy is in the slot.
> 
> david



I know this sounds weird and people will be like "no, your crazy Ace" (which is a reaction I am used to btw). But I can't help but wonder if maybe Atlanta has a deal with the Bulls. Williams would be a nice fit with us and he has the pedigree, he is a Dukie, not a sexy pick but he could end up being one of the best players in this draft and I have felt that way for a while. We may have some interest in a sign & trade for Harrington, Pachulia would be an interesting piece for us. Maybe the Hawks are trading up, or, maybe we are trading up from 16 with other pieces? Anything is possible I guess but I wouldn't be surprised to see the Bulls involved in some sort of deal with ATL.


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



> We may have some interest in a sign & trade for Harrington


Interest in a S&T, why bother when he's unrestricted and willing to come here.

The only way I see a trade happening is if Atlanta really wants to move up and is willing to part with Childress / Smith to do so, otherwise there is no point.


----------



## InPaxWeTrust

*Paxson will...*

Take TT at #2 and Thabo or Ager at 16(since Brewer and Carney will be gone) and then in FA sign Nene or Pryzbilla and bring back Songalia.

Hinrich,Duhon,Pargo
Gordon,Sefolasha
Nocioni,Deng
Thomas,Songalia
Nene,Chandler


----------



## step

*Re: Paxson will...*

That's great...


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> Really? I didn't know he was playing this year, can someone get us some stats please? See how the guy is doing.


The WC is in august (Japan) ...

http://www.fiba2006.com/index_e.html


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



step said:


> Interest in a S&T, why bother when he's unrestricted and willing to come here.
> 
> The only way I see a trade happening is if Atlanta really wants to move up and is willing to part with Childress / Smith to do so, otherwise there is no point.


true, we don't have to send ATL anything but maybe ATL likes Duhon & Sweetney and we want to shed those contracts to make another move in FA? There could be any one of a number of reasons. Pachulia would be an interesting player for the Bulls, as would Smith, anyway I wouldn't be terribly surprised if something was cooked up between the two teams.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



italianBBlover said:


> The WC is in august (Japan) ...
> 
> http://www.fiba2006.com/index_e.html



Ok good, thanks something to look forward to.


----------



## laso

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> HI Everyone,
> 
> Yahoo sports has 3 minute clips on most of the top 20 picks in the draft and they are really worth a look. From what i say Rudy Gay is going to be a star and can easily play both SF and SG in the NBA. Pax should really consider him.
> 
> Roy doesnt seem that big and plays on the floor and IMHO plays a lot like a bigger mike bibby but has great court sense.
> 
> I think Brewer looks super and much better than Carney and he is a lot more explosive than Roy and he is going to get to the free throw line a ton in the nba. I think he could be the perfect fit for us.
> 
> Thomas does look really skinny and seems more like a tweener than a real PF.
> 
> Williams looks alot like a poor mans Karl Malone. His shoulders are huge.
> 
> Aldridge is really long and shots the ball with has hands really high and i think he will be a great back to the basket big man and he looks a lot bigger than thomas.
> 
> Carney is a great jumper but i think he will fall he doesnt seem to have the court sense that the other SG have.
> 
> Anyone who thinks JJ Redrick is not going to be a solid starter in the nba needs to watch these clips and look at his stats in college he looks super.
> 
> O'bryant is going to take a few years to develop and he is really skinny but looks like a young Robert Parish. He also has small shoulder much like Will Perdue.
> 
> Simmons is huge but looks really machinical on offensive.
> 
> Marcus Willimas is going to be a star he really looks like he is in total control when he is running the offensive and seems to have several speeds he can use when ever he wants to.
> 
> Morrison is going to be an all star and is the likely ROY.
> 
> I also think that paxson will take a pass on Thomas due to his size that it looks like a tweener and will take Aldridge and if i was him i would trade up and really try to get brewer.
> 
> david


David, I agree with your thoughts. I came away super impressed by Brewer. I didn't even think his shot looked that bad (after all I heard about it). I really liked Rudy Gay as well.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Yeah, after hearing that Deng was practicing when Aldridge came in, I don't want to trade him, he seems commited to improving.
> 
> If they can get a little workout group of Chris, Ben, Deng, Reddick, Aldridge, Livingston, and develop some chemistry, good god! (does *Kirk workout at the Berto during the summer?* I assume Noc. stays in Argentina most of the summer).



sloth, you may not have heard the skiles interview the other day on espn 1000.

kirk is _already_ back at the berto working out (uh, so yeah, he does, and has for his whole career _so far_ - he's not a "hoops gym" boy.) 

and you really need to get off this redick kick. i highly doubt the bulls draft him. skiles didn't sound that gung-ho on him during the interview.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> I know this sounds weird and people will be like "no, your crazy Ace" (which is a reaction I am used to btw). But I can't help but wonder if maybe Atlanta has a deal with the Bulls. Williams would be a nice fit with us and he has the pedigree, he is a Dukie, not a sexy pick but he could end up being one of the best players in this draft and I have felt that way for a while. We may have some interest in a sign & trade for Harrington, Pachulia would be an interesting piece for us. Maybe the Hawks are trading up, or, maybe we are trading up from 16 with other pieces? Anything is possible I guess but I wouldn't be surprised to see the Bulls involved in some sort of deal with ATL.


I hope chandler's involved...


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> I hope chandler's involved...



Well, I like Chandler so I would be just fine keeping him. But, it seems like I remember Atlanta showing some interest in Tyson in the past.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

1. Pax won't trade Chandler. I think the staff values him too much. At least more than a draft pick.

2. I'd do Chandler for #5 + Childress

We could come out with Aldridge and Thomas (#2 + #5). Or go real big and get O'Bryant if Tyrus or Aldridge are taken by Portland. Though, it may be a reach to get O'Bryant at 5, we would get some size. At least basketball players who can catch the ball.

I think Tyson would be a great fit for Atlanta. A team that runs the floor and would not ask for him to touch the ball on offense.


----------



## GB

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

A big man we should look at?

>> Pittsburgh sophomore 7-foot C Aaron Gray is on the Knicks' radar at either pick 20 or 29 if he stays in the draft. During his workout, Gray was extremely physical, a witness said. Gray was concerned because the Knicks have three centers. Gray has until Sunday to pull out, calling it "50-50." "They said they wouldn't waste my money or time." Gray said. "They said they were very serious in drafting me."<<


----------



## BG7

*Re: Paxson will...*

I bet you none of the stuff that you just said happens.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

Bob Love thinks Roy is the best player in the draft and shows no love for Chandler!





> “They may have the best three shooting guards in the league. They can really fill up the hole,” Love said Thursday at Rockford Boylan after being the guest speaker at the 27th annual Fightin’ Titan basketball camp.
> 
> Love said the Bulls “are one or two guys away from being a real contender.”
> 
> The good news is the Bulls, who lost in the first round of the playoffs the last two years, have two first-round draft picks this year, including the No. 2 overall pick.
> 
> *The bad news is Love thinks the best player in the draft is another shooting guard, Washington’s 6-5 senior Brandon Roy. Area fans know him well; Roy knocked Illinois out of the NCAA Tournament with 21 points, seven rebounds and three steals in the second round.*
> 
> “That guy has the offensive skills to be a real force in the league,” Love said. “The guy can play.”
> 
> Unlike Bulls center Tyson Chandler, who may be limited to being a defensive/rebounding specialist.
> 
> *“He has been playing for four years now and he has shown no offensive skills at all,” Love said. “You’ve got to have a basic move, a go-to move, and he hasn’t shown it. We need that. We need a guy who has some offensive skills on the inside.”*


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

Isn't Bob Love on the Bulls payroll? Sheesh, a little tact, please, even if you are stating the obvious!


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Isn't Bob Love on the Bulls payroll? Sheesh, a little tact, please, even if you are stating the obvious!



is he? sorry, i didn't realize that. then, yeah, sheesh.

:laugh:


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Paxson will...*



sloth said:


> I bet you none of the stuff that you just said happens.


I bet that when an explanation for why none of this stuff happens is given, it won't occur in this or any other similarly appropriate thread, but instead the explainer will create a new thread in a misguided attempt to give the explanation more import than it would have otherwise.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> is he? sorry, i didn't realize that. then, yeah, sheesh.
> 
> :laugh:


Yikes -- I thought he was just a consultant or somesuch, but it turns out he's the Bulls' *Director of Community Affairs!*

http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/staff_directory.html

Did Love pick Tyson up by the scruff of his neck when he threw him under that bus, or did he employ the old one-arm, one-leg spin and toss?


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Yikes -- I thought he was just a consultant or somesuch, but it turns out he's the Bulls' *Director of Community Affairs!*
> 
> http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/staff_directory.html
> 
> Did Love pick Tyson up by the scruff of his neck when he threw him under that bus, or did he employ the old one-arm, one-leg spin and toss?


Maybe theres a trade with Atlanta in the works?

Bulls trade:

Tyson Chandler
Chris Duhon
#2
#16

for 

Joe Johnson
#5


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Maybe theres a trade with Atlanta in the works?
> 
> Bulls trade:
> 
> Tyson Chandler
> Chris Duhon
> #2
> #16
> 
> for
> 
> Joe Johnson
> #5


If that's true, then I feel even more strongly that Love was totally out of line here. 

I can't think of any good reason for a highly placed team official, even one not involved in player personnel decisions, to pointedly criticize a guy with 5 years and 55 million left on his contract.

Stick to ribbon cutting, ground breaking, and photo ops, Bob, and leave the rest of it alone.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> Bob Love thinks Roy is the best player in the draft and shows no love for Chandler!


Maybe he's the "source" from today's article on Roy...

"Roy is their guy" 



> While team officials remain tight-lipped as usual, indications are the Bulls — who own the No. 2 overall pick — have already targeted Washington off guard Brandon Roy as their top priority in the June 28 draft. Roy is scheduled to visit the Berto Center on Saturday.
> 
> "Roy is their guy," said one source close to the situation. "He's smart, he's tough, he plays defense and he plays a team game. In other words, he's everything the Bulls want in a player."


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

thanks *salo!* didn't see that yet.

i wonder if the bulls will schedule another session with tyrus?


----------



## Dornado

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

Have we even worked out Shelden Williams yet? If not, I find it highly unlikely that we'd be targeting him (as Ace mentioned earlier) as a possibility at #5 in a trade-down scenario.

I really can't stand all of this Brandon Roy talk... I still maintain that we're standing shirtless (no bigs) looking for a pair of fancier shoes (two guard)... We've already proven that we can play defense with this backcourt... I just don't understand the need to use such a high pick on a shooting guard. Nutty.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

i think shelden williams has shut down his workouts based on "a promise" (this is the rumor) from the hawks to be taken with the fifth pick. that's what i am hearing.


----------



## Dornado

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> i think shelden williams has shut down his workouts based on "a promise" (this is the rumor) from the hawks to be taken with the fifth pick. that's what i am hearing.


So its safe to say that we're not going to trade down for him.... assuming you don't draft people without seeing them in person first, which seems like common sense.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



GB said:


> A big man we should look at?
> 
> >> Pittsburgh sophomore 7-foot C Aaron Gray is on the Knicks' radar at either pick 20 or 29 if he stays in the draft. During his workout, Gray was extremely physical, a witness said. Gray was concerned because the Knicks have three centers. Gray has until Sunday to pull out, calling it "50-50." "They said they wouldn't waste my money or time." Gray said. "They said they were very serious in drafting me."<<



He is nothing more than a big body, who can occassionaly get his shot going. I see him as a Will Perdue type. He's slow, mothdoical but plays to his strengths (which works in College cause he was bigger than most). Nice back up to have, but no one you should count on to start.

In the very late first round this year he might make sense.

next year he's not in the top 20 big men available.....wihtout some major improvement.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

Fesenko is my guy at #16. From draftexpress:



> The Milwaukee Bucks brought in Fesenko, a 19-year-old, 6-foot-11 Ukrainian, along with three others Thursday as the team prepares for its 39th overall pick in the June 28 draft. North Carolina State's Cameron Bennerman, Minnesota's Vincent Grier and the University of Denver's Yemi Nicholson were the other prospects.
> 
> But none of them had the coaching staff throwing their heads back in laughter way Fesenko did.
> 
> About halfway through the 70-minute workout, Bucks assistant coach Brian James told the players he wanted them to "put the ball on the floor," meaning take a dribble before shooting. Fesenko was first up, and after taking a pass near the baseline, he softly set the ball on the court and walked away looking puzzled as if to say, "Why did you want me to do that?"
> 
> After pausing to take in what happened, the coaches, including head coach Terry Stott and Dave Babcock, the Bucks' director of player personnel, broke into laughter.
> 
> "Well, he's coachable," James said as another coach explained to Fesenko what the jargon meant. "He did exactly what I told him to do."
> 
> Fesenko smiled about it but did not seem to think it was as amusing.
> 
> "I just don't understand," he said in rough English. "He told me to put it down. I don't know what it means."
> 
> The last drill of the workout was a two-on-two, full-court game. When it was announced that the next team to score won, Fesenko, who was taking out the ball under the far baseline, threw it off Grier's backside, hopped back inbounds and raced down for the dunk.
> 
> The other players, including teammate Bennerman, watched in confusion. The coaches threw up their hands, laughed again and counted the point as Fesenko walked back as if nothing was unusual.
> 
> It capped a workout in which Fesenko snapped at Bennerman to get him the ball, talked back to a coach after a defensive breakdown and semi-pouted missing shots or making mistakes.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Another Bargnani update...

At the half. Treviso 41 Bologna 39

14 mins (5th on the team)
12 pts (team high)
3-5 2 pt
0-2 3pt
6-6 FT
2 boards (both defensive) 
1 assist
4 steals? (am I reading that correctly - don't know what "st" stands for in Italian. I'm guessing its' steals)

Pretty damned good half. Let's see if he can keep it up in the second half.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



fl_flash said:


> Another Bargnani update...
> 
> At the half. Treviso 41 Bologna 39
> 
> 14 mins (5th on the team)
> 12 pts (team high)
> 3-5 2 pt
> 0-2 3pt
> 6-6 FT
> 2 boards (both defensive)
> 1 assist
> 4 steals? (am I reading that correctly - don't know what "st" stands for in Italian. I'm guessing its' steals)
> 
> Pretty damned good half. Let's see if he can keep it up in the second half.


"St" stands for stoppate, which is blocks. Very impressive that he already has 4 at the half.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



LegoHat said:


> "St" stands for stoppate, which is blocks. Very impressive that he already has 4 at the half.


Thanks. 4 blocks at halftime in 14 mins. Pretty impressive. Ya paying attention ACE?


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Seems as though he has blocked our old friend Dalibor Bagaric a few times.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



fl_flash said:


> Thanks. 4 blocks at halftime in 14 mins. Pretty impressive. Ya paying attention ACE?



looks good so far! Hey, I never said Bargnani might not be great just that I didn't have enough info to delcare him the next best thing.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

no offense

but darko's put up 3blocks in 4-5 minutes..

that means nothing...

zo can put together 3 back-to-back-to-back

wooopty doo


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

After the 3rd quarter, Bargnani's team is up 65-61:

Bargnani's stats:

27 minutes (3rd on team)
17 points (1st on team)
5/10 shooting, 1/3 3 pts
6/6 free throws
4 rebounds (2nd on team)
2 assists (2nd on team)
4 blocks (1st on team)


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> no offense
> 
> but darko's put up 3blocks in 4-5 minutes..
> 
> that means nothing...
> 
> zo can put together 3 back-to-back-to-back
> 
> wooopty doo


He had 4 blocks in 14 minutes, therefore he sucks... I get it, wait no I don't.

EDIT: He has just had his 5th block, even worse.


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Insider has the athleticism results up at
http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=ford_chad#20060616.

Brewer second best athlete overall.
Thomas: 39.5" max vert
Gay: 40.5" max vert
Brewer: 41" max vert
Roy: 40.5" max vert


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Some more stats (rank; no step vertical; max vertical; bench press; lane agility; sprint):

Aldridge: 68 26.5 34 8 12.02 3.43
Brewer: 2 35 41 19 11.32 3.14 
Carney: 5 32 38.5 10 10.57 3.06 
Gay: 26 33 40.5 9 11.03 3.32 
Morrison: 59 25.5 30.5 11 11.46 3.37 
O'Bryant: 79 26.5 30 13 12.68 3.63 
Redick: 51 27.5 33 6 10.94 3.29 
Roy: 30 34 40.5 6 11.13 3.27 
Sene: 72 28.5 31 7 12.52 3.38 
Simmons: 20 30.5 35 15 11.05 3.31 
Thomas: 21 34 39.5 8 11.36 3.2 
Shelden: 31 29 33.25 25 11.53 3.59


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Qwerty123 said:


> Some more stats (rank; no step vertical; max vertical; bench press; lane agility; sprint):
> 
> Aldridge: 68 26.5 34 8 12.02 3.43
> Brewer: 2 35 41 19 11.32 3.14
> Carney: 5 32 38.5 10 10.57 3.06
> Gay: 26 33 40.5 9 11.03 3.32
> Morrison: 59 25.5 30.5 11 11.46 3.37
> O'Bryant: 79 26.5 30 13 12.68 3.63
> Redick: 51 27.5 33 6 10.94 3.29
> Roy: 30 34 40.5 6 11.13 3.27
> Sene: 72 28.5 31 7 12.52 3.38
> Simmons: 20 30.5 35 15 11.05 3.31
> Thomas: 21 34 39.5 8 11.36 3.2
> Shelden: 31 29 33.25 25 11.53 3.59


Am I reading that right? From the looks of it, by my reading, the "non-athletic" Roy stacks up pretty favorably to the "uber-freakish athlete" Thomas...


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

25 reps for Shelden and 19(!) for Brewer, that's very impressive. Do we know who the top athlete out of the whole bunch was?


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Game 2 

Treviso-Bologna 88-82

Bargnani

32 minutes
17 points
7 rebounds
3 steals
0 turnovers
5 fouls drawn
6 blocks


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> Am I reading that right? From the looks of it, by my reading, the "non-athletic" Roy stacks up pretty favorably to the "uber-freakish athlete" Thomas...



Thomas only did EIGHT bench presses? Now I am starting to get worried...


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



italianBBlover said:


> Game 2
> 
> Treviso-Bologna 88-82
> 
> Bargnani
> 
> 32 minutes
> 17 points
> 7 rebounds
> 3 steals
> 0 turnovers
> 5 fouls drawn
> 6 blocks


Hey! Don't forget about the 2 assists!

The guy is a player.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Great game by Bargnani, he is leading Benneton at the moment, which is very impressive for a 20-year old in a pro league.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> Thomas only did EIGHT bench presses? Now I am starting to get worried...


With that stomach virus, he was probably focusing 90% of his attention on keeping his sphincter puckered tight while he did his reps.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> With that stomach virus, he was probably focusing 90% of his attention on keeping his sphincter puckered tight while he did his reps.


lol

Well, big men sometimes don't do so well surprisingly with the weight lifting because it takes so much effort to lift with those long arms.


This is the kind of breakout game I was looking for from Bargnani btw!


----------



## jnrjr79

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Wow! Love that game from Bargnani. He is definitely my draft crush at this point. Let's nab him, a FA center (Nene would be my preference, if healthy), and whoever is the best available at #16 and I'd be a happy camper, assuming no big trades are made.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jnrjr79 said:


> Wow! Love that game from Bargnani. He is definitely my draft crush at this point. Let's nab him, a FA center (Nene would be my preference, if healthy), and whoever is the best available at #16 and I'd be a happy camper, assuming no big trades are made.


Not surprisingly, I agree with you. Sene is my guy at #16, my gut feeling is that if we pull this scenario off, we will be greatly rewarded.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Assuming that Bargnani is off the ball, what about Rudy Gay at 2 and then Sene at 16? If the Jazz don't take Sene at 14, he'll be there for us.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> If the Jazz don't take Sene at 14, he'll be there for us.


That's my fear as well, apparently Karl Malone likes Sene almost as much as he likes hunting for litttle Mexican girls.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Assuming that Bargnani is off the ball, what about Rudy Gay at 2 and then Sene at 16? If the Jazz don't take Sene at 14, he'll be there for us.


I'd be all for that! Problem is, I don't see Pax taking either guy if they're available at #2 and #16. It'd be more like Aldridge and Reddick... yuck!


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Qwerty123 said:


> Some more stats (rank; no step vertical; max vertical; bench press; lane agility; sprint):
> 
> Aldridge: 68 26.5 34 8 12.02 3.43
> Brewer: 2 35 41 19 11.32 3.14
> Carney: 5 32 38.5 10 10.57 3.06
> Gay: 26 33 40.5 9 11.03 3.32
> Morrison: 59 25.5 30.5 11 11.46 3.37
> O'Bryant: 79 26.5 30 13 12.68 3.63
> Redick: 51 27.5 33 6 10.94 3.29
> Roy: 30 34 40.5 6 11.13 3.27
> Sene: 72 28.5 31 7 12.52 3.38
> Simmons: 20 30.5 35 15 11.05 3.31
> Thomas: 21 34 39.5 8 11.36 3.2
> Shelden: 31 29 33.25 25 11.53 3.59


If it isn't a hassle, could you possibly put this in Excel and paste it in here. So it can be easier to read.

If not, no biggie. Thanks.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

animal, check out the OTHER, actually the OFFICIAL measurement thread.

qwerty posted a more complete list there.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

If we draft Roy, Tyson better be on his way out, so Roy can wear the number 3 :cheers: 

I won't allow Tyson to switch his number either.


----------



## jnrjr79

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Assuming that Bargnani is off the ball, what about Rudy Gay at 2 and then Sene at 16? If the Jazz don't take Sene at 14, he'll be there for us.



Gay certainly seems to be the most talented of the group from a combined skills/height/athleticism standpoing - by a good margin. I really wonder about guys that supposedly have heart/desire issues. That's one of those situations where I hope the guys in the front office armed with more information can make a good decision about it.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*



SALO said:


> Maybe he's the "source" from today's article on Roy...
> 
> "Roy is their guy"


 In which case we shouldn't take the rumors that seriously. Bob Love's always come across as a good guy, but I'd be surprised if Paxson and Skiles kept him "in the loop" on their draft plans. 

theanimal23: I agree about Roy's number. I've become attached to seeing him sport "3" for the beloved purple and white (I'm actually not a U. Wash fan, but you get the point).


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (plus Draft Measurements) Merged!!!!*

_*Saer Sene Moving Up*

Senegal bigman Saer Sene's stock is on the rise. According to contacts, Phoenix is so high on him that they may consider packaging their two picks to move up for him. 

Similar to fellow Senegalese bigman DeSagana Diop, who has done an excellent job of defending Shaq in the Finals, Sene could turn into a defensive stopper inside. Sene is a project, but his upside makes him very intriguing.

*Quincy Douby Struggling in Workouts*

Rutgers standout combo guard Quincy Douby has slipped in workouts over the past few weeks and no longer looks like a surefire first rounder. Douby has dynamic scoring ability, but lacks a great NBA body and isn't a true point guard._






oh, i just had to post that douby one. :angel:




new draft buzzzzz at nbadraft.net


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



italianBBlover said:


> Game 2
> 
> Treviso-Bologna 88-82
> 
> Bargnani
> 
> 32 minutes
> 17 points
> 7 rebounds
> 3 steals
> 0 turnovers
> 5 fouls drawn
> 6 blocks


I think I need to have a really good cry.

What's particularly sad is that while I'm sure he'll have a long and successful career as a Raptor, he would have fit our team like a friggin glove. 

Instead, we'll take Roy and we'll go through another year of suffering positional imbalance, an offensively inept frontcourt, lots of Ben Gordon chatter, and having the results of Knicks games matter more than our own.

Good times.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> I think I need to have a really good cry.
> 
> What's particularly sad is that while I'm sure he'll have a long and successful career as a Raptor, he would have fit our team like a friggin glove.
> 
> Instead, we'll take Roy and we'll go through another year of suffering positional imbalance, an offensively inept frontcourt, lots of Ben Gordon chatter, and having the results of Knicks games matter more than our own.
> 
> Good times.


 pole sana.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> pole sana.


Not as sana as I am.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

When is the last day for underclassmen/foreign players to withdraw?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

That's a nice game for Bargnani but it's not really mind blowing numbers wise. 7 rebounds in 32 minutes is fairly average.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> That's a nice game for Bargnani but it's not really mind blowing numbers wise. 7 rebounds in 32 minutes is fairly average.


atleast his a 7 footer whos able to stay on the court longer than 20mins unlike Chanlder. Mind you i love him but its just so fustrating to think of such little developments his made. I remember a few times he put up 20/20 against portland once as i remember in his second year? What happened to those numbers?


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



fl_flash said:


> When is the last day for underclassmen/foreign players to withdraw?


Sunday

Let the countdown to the draft begin, 10 days left(wait according to NBAdraft.net), but isn't it on the 28?

Ok between 10-12 days.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> That's a nice game for Bargnani but it's not really mind blowing numbers wise. 7 rebounds in 32 minutes is fairly average.


After further reflection, you're right. This game raises a huge red flag for me with respect to Bargnani.

7 boards isn't enough. It did tie him for his team lead, and he did tie for his team lead in points scored, and then there were the six blocks and the three steals, the zero turnovers, the trips to the line, and you have to consider that he is 20 and got negligible PT to start the year but has played an enormous role in propelling his team to the brink of the Italian Series-A League championship, with the first two wins coming in an arena where their opponent had won 34 straight home games, but what difference does all of that make when you only seize 7 boards?

Sorry to be an person able spot the truth, TripDoub, but this is just preposterous nitpicking on your part. If Bargnani's not your cup of tea, that's one thing. But what he's doing right now is downright impressive, and I'm not sure I see the sense of downplaying it.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> After further reflection, you're right. This game raises a huge red flag for me with respect to Bargnani.
> 
> 7 boards isn't enough. It did tie him for his team lead, and he did tie for his team lead in points scored, and then there were the six blocks and the three steals, the zero turnovers, the trips to the line, and you have to consider that he is 20 and got negligible PT to start the year but has played an enormous role in propelling his team to the brink of the Italian Series-A League championship, with the first two wins coming in an arena where their opponent had won 34 straight home games, but what difference does all of that make when you only seize 7 boards?
> 
> Sorry to be an a person able see the truth, TripDoub, but this is just preposterous nitpicking on your part. If Bargnani's not your cup of tea, that's one thing. But what he's doing right now is downright impressive, and I'm not sure I see the sense of downplaying it.


I'm not saying its a bad game. It's a good game stats-wise. I just don't think the stats are proportional to peoples reaction to them. If I were to have not seen the stat line but just read the despair in people posts over losing Bargnani, I would have though he put up 35 and 15. 

I guess I could say it another way. If Toronto was wavering on whether to take Bargnani or not, I can't imagine this game was impressive enough statistically to impress them beyond any doubt into taking Bargnani.

Edit: I am coming around to Bargnani. His size (7'1" 250) and skill combo along with my questions about the other top choices lead me to believe that he's got the most upside of all the bigs.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

nbadraft.net has updated it's mock

*tyrus thomas remains at #2*

roy moves up to #3

aldridge slips to #5

*and brewer to the bulls at #16*





that could work. i would be good with that. :yes:


----------



## Aesop

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> *and brewer to the bulls at #16*


If I were a betting man I think I'd give 5:1 odds that Brewer goes before 16.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

You know guys, we are taking in too much about the pre-draft. The teams that worked out Ronnie Brewer previously to it, knew his height, generally knew his strength, and knew his athleticism, I doubt seeing him do the same tests over at the predraft camp over again will raise his stock with those teams. So all it takes is a team wanting one player over him, like favoring Randy Foye over Ronnie Brewer, it doesn't take too much for a player like Brewer to slip, so we might be in for a pleasant surprise on draft day.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> You know guys, we are taking in too much about the pre-draft. The teams that worked out Ronnie Brewer previously to it, knew his height, generally knew his strength, and knew his athleticism, I doubt seeing him do the same tests over at the predraft camp over again will raise his stock with those teams. So all it takes is a team wanting one player over him, like favoring Randy Foye over Ronnie Brewer, it doesn't take too much for a player like Brewer to slip, so we might be in for a pleasant surprise on draft day.



I hear ya. However, I gotta believe many teams were surprised by the measurements of some guys that they hadn't measured themselves (i.e. - Thomas, Carney, Reddick, Killingsworth, etc...).

We will have someone fall to us at 16. I'm just praying it isn't Reddick.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> nbadraft.net has updated it's mock
> 
> *tyrus thomas remains at #2*
> 
> roy moves up to #3
> 
> aldridge slips to #5
> 
> *and brewer to the bulls at #16*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that could work. i would be good with that. :yes:


I have a feeling that Tyrus agent had something to do with Tyrus being at no.2 in most mock draft boards. after him complaining and pouting about his position miraculously he has been on no.2 in mostly all of them... i think his stock is actually down at the moment if anything.


----------



## charlietyra

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> nbadraft.net has updated it's mock
> 
> *tyrus thomas remains at #2*
> 
> roy moves up to #3
> 
> aldridge slips to #5
> 
> *and brewer to the bulls at #16*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> that could work. i would be good with that. :yes:



Does anyone realize how absurd that mock is? Why would a team take Pecherov or Shannon Brown over Brewer? Pecherov is your standard Euro perimeter big guy and Brown is an undersized two guard. Brewer is a unique talent who is very athletic and can play multiple positions. No way will Brewer be available at 16.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...un17,1,3273341.story?coll=chi-sportsbulls-hed


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Aesop said:


> If I were a betting man I think I'd give 5:1 odds that Brewer goes before 16.




i think you're right! draftexpress has him at 11. i'm just saying if _that's the outcome_ i would be ok with that. brandon roy is still my guy. 

i am just trying to get my head wrapped around the fact that pax may in fact select tyrus thomas.

brewer would be great, but i'm not betting he'll be there either.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

If Brewer slips past Orlando, I will be shocked.


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> If Brewer slips past Orlando, I will be shocked.


Well considering they have a good PG already, taking a combo one isn't the best route imo, so I wouldn't be suprised if he did. Though I see the Sonics picking him up first off, even with their 2 pg's they just don't seem content, maybe allowing a trade to patch up other holes.
I wouldn't be suprised if Orlando, Utah and New Orleans select him,I just see him more suited to the combo role and they wouldn't be maximising his skillset. Philly is the only other team I'm mainly worried about, pairing him with Iggy could work well, especially if they ship Iverson out.

I'm also sort of suprised we haven't heard anything from the T-Wolves with this, are they even considering him with their pick?


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=100724




> *This is going to kill my pal on 670 The Score, Mike North, but the answer is increasingly looking like a 'yes.'* There are a few knocks on Thomas (many of which North has enumerated to me): great athlete, but too raw; needs bulk to up; sure, he was stellar in the NCAA tournament, but where's he been all year?
> 
> But not all of those knocks are fair. It's not as though Thomas spent the entire season under a rock. He averaged 12.3 points and 9.2 rebounds, plus 3.1 blocks. He shot 60 percent. He did this in the SEC, as a freshman, playing alongside a dominating big man (Glen Davis). He was not high on the Tigers' list of offensive options, but he did what he was asked -- get rebounds, be a defensive demon and score on putbacks.
> 
> "There is a lot to his game that people have not seen," says one of Thomas' agents, Brian Elfus. "He had a role at LSU, and he did everything he could to fill it. But he can do more."
> 
> Thomas has been working out in Orlando in the run-up to the draft, and has had some jaw-dropping workouts -- including one in which, after working for 45 minutes, he made 15-for-25 on 3-pointers. He has bulked up and has shown a smooth midrange shooting stroke. As important has been his work with former LSU guard Randy Livingston, who has played with nine teams over the last 10 seasons. Livingston has not only been teaching Thomas some on-court tricks, but has been talking to him about how to handle himself when he meets with coaches and general managers.
> 
> *Put it all together, and word is, Thomas has nudged ahead of Aldridge, Bargnani and Rudy Gay for the Bulls' affection.*


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



step said:


> Well considering they have a good PG already, taking a combo one isn't the best route imo, so I wouldn't be suprised if he did. Though I see the Sonics picking him up first off, even with their 2 pg's they just don't seem content, maybe allowing a trade to patch up other holes.
> I wouldn't be suprised if Orlando, Utah and New Orleans select him,I just see him more suited to the combo role and they wouldn't be maximising his skillset. Philly is the only other team I'm mainly worried about, pairing him with Iggy could work well, especially if they ship Iverson out.
> 
> I'm also sort of suprised we haven't heard anything from the T-Wolves with this, are they even considering him with their pick?


As of right now, it seems imminent that Marcus Williams is the T-Wolves pick.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> According to one report, Thomas and Connecticut’s Rudy Gay tied for the highest jump during tests at the Orlando predraft camp last week, touching 13 feet, 2 inches off the floor.
> 
> If that measurement is accurate, combined with a 9-foot standing reach, it would give Thomas a 50-inch vertical leap.- Daily Herald


But insider and nbadraft.net has him with a 39.5 vert. That makes a huge difference, for Gay as well. My guess is the daily herald got it wrong. 2 guys having a 50 inch vert, with their length would be insane.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

So because Tyrus Thomas is afraid of Rudy Gay and backs out of the workout like a little flower called the panzee he wins over their affection? Rudy Gay is bigger, more athletic, and more skilled. Thomas would have **** his pants in a workout with Gay. First Gay would reapetedly get past Thomas and dunk over him. Then if Tyrus tries to post up, Gay will just push around Thomas because he is stronger. If you don't go completely big with a guy like Aldridge or Bargnani at 2, YOU HAVE TO TAKE RUDY GAY. Every single thing about Rudy Gay is superior than Thomas. Thomas should be taken closer to 10 than 2 if the gm's were sane.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Hustle said:


> If Brewer slips past Orlando, I will be shocked.


I think Brewer has to be our guy for the Bulls. and if that means we trade down from the no.2 position to get him because they afraid they'd get scrutinized for picking him so high. than so be it. here are some trades in terms of slotting down a few positions. feel free to shoot them down..


1. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Boston for no.7 & K.Perkins/A.Jefferson. But more likely Perkins. Boston are wanting a more of passer than they have with D.West. they get it with Duhon. and we also get one of their young bigs. 

2. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Houston for no.8 & Keith Bogans & M. Lampe. we get a versatile gaurd and a young big.

3. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Seattle for no.10 & N.Collison & possible D.Wilkens. We get a decent big man and big guard.

4. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Warriors for no.9 & A. Beidrins or M. Pietrus. Im actually high on A.Beidrins i think he'll be a good player in the future. he already plays good bench mintues.

Sidenote: I used Duhon as the trade bait not because i dislike him. but i seem him having the most value besides the core bulls that i would like to keep atleast for one more year to see them gell.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> So because Tyrus Thomas is afraid of Rudy Gay and backs out of the workout like a little flower called the panzee he wins over their affection? Rudy Gay is bigger, more athletic, and more skilled. Thomas would have **** his pants in a workout with Gay. First Gay would reapetedly get past Thomas and dunk over him. Then if Tyrus tries to post up, Gay will just push around Thomas because he is stronger. If you don't go completely big with a guy like Aldridge or Bargnani at 2, YOU HAVE TO TAKE RUDY GAY. Every single thing about Rudy Gay is superior than Thomas. Thomas should be taken closer to 10 than 2 if the gm's were sane.


Is Gay really bigger than Thomas?


----------



## McBulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Sorry to be an person able spot the truth, TripDoub, but this is just preposterous nitpicking on your part. If Bargnani's not your cup of tea, that's one thing. But what he's doing right now is downright impressive, and I'm not sure I see the sense of downplaying it.


It is impressive. But unless Paxson has developed acting abilities that have not been present in the past, Bargnani doesn't seem to be on the Bull's radar screen. That's too bad, because he and Aldrich are probably the two quality big guys in this draft; and the Bulls need bigs.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> I think Brewer has to be our guy for the Bulls. and if that means we trade down from the no.2 position to get him because they afraid they'd get scrutinized for picking him so high. than so be it. here are some trades in terms of slotting down a few positions. feel free to shoot them down..
> 
> 
> 1. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Boston for no.7 & K.Perkins/A.Jefferson. But more likely Perkins. Boston are wanting a more of passer than they have with D.West. they get it with Duhon. and we also get one of their young bigs.
> 
> 2. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Houston for no.8 & Keith Bogans & M. Lampe. we get a versatile gaurd and a young big.
> 
> 3. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Seattle for no.10 & N.Collison & possible D.Wilkens. We get a decent big man and big guard.
> 
> 4. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Warriors for no.9 & A. Beidrins or M. Pietrus. Im actually high on A.Beidrins i think he'll be a good player in the future. he already plays good bench mintues.
> 
> Sidenote: I used Duhon as the trade bait not because i dislike him. but i seem him having the most value besides the core bulls that i would like to keep atleast for one more year to see them gell.


Brewer's not worth THAT much


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> Is Gay really bigger than Thomas?


Thomas is quarter of an inch taller in shoes, Gay weighs 5 pounds heavier. Not much in the numbers, but Gay has filled out quite a bit.


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> Brewer's not worth THAT much


Indeed, I wouldn't want to trade down to get him when we can get Roy.
Now if we could trade up, that's a different story.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> Is Gay really bigger than Thomas?


They're the same height, have the same wingspan, Thomas has a slightly taller standing reach, but Gay makes up for it in his vert. Gay weighs more, and could do the bench press more times. He did better in agility, and they were the same in speed. What I don't get is how Thomas got a higher athleticism rank over Gay, which just proves those ranks and scores are bull****ted. Thomas only did better than Gay in the standing jump, by 1 inch, but Gay outdid him in the running very be 2 inches. In everything else, they were either equal, or Gay was better.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



step said:


> Indeed, I wouldn't want to trade down to get him when we can get Roy.
> Now if we could trade up, that's a different story.


well if you think about it most of the players are pretty even. you don't have a sure talent in any sense. Roy and Brewer? I think they are pretty even to say the least. and the players you could get in return arn't too shabby either. but as i said those were just some random trades scenarios for fun.. 
I just don't want a chance to pass up on a reincarnation of the next Pippen over a reincarnation of a Stromile Swift in Tyrus Thomas.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> I think Brewer has to be our guy for the Bulls. and if that means we trade down from the no.2 position to get him because they afraid they'd get scrutinized for picking him so high. than so be it. here are some trades in terms of slotting down a few positions. feel free to shoot them down..


Maybe most athletic guy in the draft, can play 1-3, is NBA ready. I really want him his measurements have been just amazing, every one of them. His only knock is his shot, but that's far from our greatest need. He's the guy I want most on this team next year. Of course our greatest need is big guys, damn this year it's a tough call.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Hustle said:


> Maybe most athletic guy in the draft, can play 1-3, is NBA ready. I really want him his measurements have been just amazing, every one of them. His only knock is his shot, but that's far from our greatest need. He's the guy I want most on this team next year. Of course our greatest need is big guys, damn this year it's a tough call.


I totally agree.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Brewer's being rated a bit high on this board.

As good as he IS, and as perfect of a fit as he is for this team, the next pippen he isn't.

any other year in the draft, he'd go no higher than #15


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Brewer's being rated a bit high on this board.
> 
> As good as he IS, and as perfect of a fit as he is for this team, the next pippen he isn't.


Rudy Gay's the next Pippen via draft.net comparison.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Rudy Gay's the next Pippen via draft.net comparison.


I think that comparison's pretty off too


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Brewer's being rated a bit high on this board.
> 
> As good as he IS, and as perfect of a fit as he is for this team, the next pippen he isn't.
> 
> any other year in the draft, he'd go no higher than #15



Let's hope he doesn't go higher than 16 this year.

I do agree. In fact, no one in this draft IMHO would go top next year.

So, it's a down year, but, there are still some very good players available.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



chifaninca said:


> Let's hope he doesn't go higher than 16 this year.
> 
> I do agree. In fact, no one in this draft IMHO would go top next year.
> 
> So, it's a down year, but, there are still some very good players available.


Agreed on all counts...


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> 1. Chicago trades their no.2 & C.Duhon to Boston for no.7 & K.Perkins/A.Jefferson. But more likely Perkins. Boston are wanting a more of passer than they have with D.West. they get it with Duhon. and we also get one of their young bigs.


I don't think Boston is parting with either Perkins or Jefferson, but I would sure like Perkins on the Bulls. I like Perkins' game, he simply doesn't allow any soft layups when he is manning the middle, and I love that mentality. I think he'll end up as the better player of the two when all is said and done.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



LegoHat said:


> I don't think Boston is parting with either Perkins or Jefferson, but I would sure like Perkins on the Bulls. I like Perkins' game, he simply doesn't allow any soft layups when he is manning the middle, and I love that mentality. I think he'll end up as the better player of the two when all is said and done.


I'd have to disagree....I've never seen Perkins do ANYTHING but start fights and try to intimidate people.

Jefferson will be a way better player than him.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> I'd have to disagree....I've never seen Perkins do ANYTHING but start fights and try to intimidate people.
> 
> Jefferson will be a way better player than him.


Perkins is built like a rock and he is already a very good rebounder and shotblocker, and I don't think the thug label fits him very well. I seem to remember one particular incident where he was accused of crossing the line, but I felt that was just Perkins playing hard because he is so focused on his defensive assignments. 

I think Jefferson will be a good scorer, but he won't match Perks' importance to his team, he is too non-existant on defense. Perk will always get his putback dunks, and his post moves are coming along nicely along with his confidence getting better. 

I guess time will tell who will be the better player, I've got my money on Perkins though.


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> I guess time will tell who will be the better player, I've got my money on Perkins though.


Same.
I just for one can't understand why Jefferson didn't bust out last year, no Toine meaning more minutes and nothing changed. Heck he was beaten out by Ryan Gomes, I'm more worried than anything.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Scouting Bargnani In Italy 



> All-Star, #1 option on offense, #1 pick material. The kid has a lot of room to grow, but once he does, watch out. Most NBA fans aren’t big fans of hyping up Euros, but this kid is the real deal. He will have a great career ahead of him, but he will have to improve his rebounding in order to become the player he can potentially be: a future Hall of Famer. It’s going to be hard to crack that level, but in this game, Bargnani proved he is able to turn it on at the right time, just like all of the great players are. There’s no doubt in my mind he can, it’s just a matter of him being able to adjust quicker then Nowitzki. If he doesn’t, he becomes a great #2 option on offense. Not bad for a skinny Italian kid who can’t board.


It would be pure genius, as several people on this board have speculated, that Pax has 'overlooked' Bargnani, and Toronto trades down with Charlotte or Portland to grab him there. And Bada Bing, Bada Boom, Pax has his man in Andrea Bargnani. Then again, this may be too wishful thinking as Colangelo has scouted this kid for 2 years and has praised him. 

Oh I wish. Like I said, I'll be happy with whoever we come out with, b/c there no clear cut draft choice. Thus, I'm assuming some are better than others just by a little bit. Only time will tell which player takes the next step to become a force in the league.

I've had Aldridge and Bargnani as my 1a and 1b respectively for sometime now. Depending on who is leftover from Toronto, lol. But Bargnani would be an ideal fit with our pick n'roll and spacing offensive scheme.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Scouting Bargnani In Italy
> Then again, this may be too wishful thinking as Colangelo has scouted this kid for 2 years and has praised him.



AND is reportedly hiring Bargnani's team GM for a front office Toronto job...


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

And the fact that his coaching staff flew out to Europe to watch the kid play.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Scouting Bargnani In Italy
> 
> 
> 
> It would be pure genius, as several people on this board have speculated, that Pax has 'overlooked' Bargnani, and Toronto trades down with Charlotte or Portland to grab him there. And Bada Bing, Bada Boom, Pax has his man in Andrea Bargnani. Then again, this may be too wishful thinking as Colangelo has scouted this kid for 2 years and has praised him.
> 
> Oh I wish. Like I said, I'll be happy with whoever we come out with, b/c there no clear cut draft choice. Thus, I'm assuming some are better than others just by a little bit. Only time will tell which player takes the next step to become a force in the league.
> 
> I've had Aldridge and Bargnani as my 1a and 1b respectively for sometime now. Depending on who is leftover from Toronto, lol. But Bargnani would be an ideal fit with our pick n'roll and spacing offensive scheme.


The author raves about Bargnani's low post game. I thought that was one of his weaknesses. If he really has a good low post game, the Bulls would be foolish to pass on him.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> The author raves about Bargnani's low post game. I thought that was one of his weaknesses. If he really has a good low post game, the Bulls would be foolish to pass on him.



I've read that in a few reports lately as well. I think it may be a bit of Tyrus Thomas syndrome.....People underrated his post game and have been surprised to seehe has more than thye have given him credit for. 

Of course, the difference is that Bargnani really has the ability to play multiple positions and I don't want another SF who can play some minutes at PF....Bargnani or Aldridge at #2.


----------



## laso

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

From the Toronto Star:



> According to several NBA scouts, Aldridge has a more NBA-ready game than Bargnani and is probably just behind Gonzaga's Adam Morrison among the top draft prospects in being able to immediately help whichever team takes him on June 28. But those same scouts say both Aldridge and Bargnani have much more room to improve than Morrison does and either might be a better long-term prospect.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> The author raves about Bargnani's low post game. I thought that was one of his weaknesses. If he really has a good low post game, the Bulls would be foolish to pass on him.


That's my feeling as well, we would be absolutely crazy not to give him some very serious consideration if he is there after Toronto have picked. In fact, I'll be extremely disappointed if we don't draft him if he's available, he is doing incredible things in Europe despite his young age.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...un18,1,4977281.story?coll=chi-sportsbulls-hed

If the Bulls draft a post player with the No. 2 pick June 28, they probably will have to wait a few years for him to develop.

Analysts say Washington senior Brandon Roy can contribute immediately, which is why the shooting guard believes he will be picked anywhere from No. 2 to No. 6.

Roy, 21, worked out for the Bulls on Saturday along with Connecticut power forward Hilton Armstrong and shooting guard Thabo Sefolosha of Sweden.

The latter two could be available to the Bulls at No. 16, their only other pick in the draft.

The Bulls are looking for a tall guard and the 6-foot-6-inch Roy could suit their needs.

"I'll bring size [and] versatility on the wing," Roy said. "I can guard anywhere from [small forward] to [point guard]. Offensively, I can create. I can make plays off the dribble and I can make plays off the ball."

Why the Bulls like him: He looks capable of giving Kirk Hinrich and Chris Duhon, the Bulls' sturdy but small guards, a break from defending opponents' shooting guards. Plus, Roy is on target when he says he can create off the dribble.

"My size and ability to handle the ball ... is pretty intriguing," Roy said. "It's definitely a mismatch for other teams."

Why he's a risk: The Bulls' biggest weakness was the absence of a post player. General manager John Paxson might decide that acquiring one through free agency or with the 16th pick gives him the flexibility to add Roy.

This leads to another question: How would the addition of Roy affect Ben Gordon, who is eager to prove he has an all-around game? Paxson is weighing the potential predicament.

What are Roy's intangibles? Four years of college helped him build a sound repertoire on offense. He deferred to veteran players in college until he took over for the Huskies as a senior. At 210 pounds, Roy has an NBA body, and he should be able to withstand the league's rigorous nature in his first season.

Why he likes the Bulls: "They have the No. 2 pick, and they already went to the playoffs. They don't need a guy to come in and make this team turn around. They just need a guy to come and help them get over the hump to maybe start trying to win some championships."

His analysis of his workout: "I shot the ball really well. I was very explosive off the dribble. I did nicely on the pick-and-roll. I think I could have focused a little more with a little more energy down the stretch."

Who's up next: Rudy Gay of Connecticut will join Gonzaga's Adam Morrison on Monday at the Berto Center. They are the top small forwards in the draft and have had spirited workouts together. Roy was part of one last week in Portland, Ore.

"It was really fun," he said.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/bulls.asp


Dozens of players have passed through the Berto Center for predraft workouts during the past four weeks.

But Washington guard Brandon Roy left little doubt that he was there Saturday to claim the Bulls’ No. 2 slot in the NBA draft on June 28.

“I would love to play for the Chicago Bulls,” Roy said. “Just walking around the locker room, seeing all these great memories that they have here, I would love to be a part of it.”

Roy appears to be one of the Bulls’ top two candidates for the second pick, along with LSU power forward Tyrus Thomas.

A 6-foot-6 guard from Washington, Roy certainly could fill the team’s need for a taller, multiskilled guard to complement Kirk Hinrich and Ben Gordon. Roy also loves the possibility of joining a team that already has been to the playoffs the past two seasons.

“That’s the special part about this pick,” he said. “They don’t need a franchise guy to come in and turn this team around. They just need a guy to come in and help them get over the hump to maybe start trying to win some championships.

“That’s a good feeling to come and know that the pressure’s not on me to score 25 points a night. It’s just to come in and help the team do whatever it can to win games.”

Roy is one of those rare draft prospects who spent four seasons in college. In last year’s draft, only one lottery pick (Channing Frye) was a college senior.

Staying in school paid off for Roy as he jumped from 12.8 points per game as a junior to 20.2 as a senior. He also averaged 5.6 rebounds, 4.1 assists, shot 51 percent from the field and was named Pac-10 player of the year.

A popular story line is that Roy willingly stepped into a supporting role as a junior because Washington had other scorers such as current Knicks guard Nate Robinson.

“I think that’s what I can bring to an NBA team,” Roy said. “I don’t have to come in and be a superstar right away. I can come in and be a role player and do well at that. Or I can come in and lead a team. So I think I had a chance in college to show both sides of what I can do.”

Roy gave himself mixed reviews for his performance in Saturday’s five-man workout for the Bulls.

“I shot the ball really well,” he said. “I was very explosive off the dribble. We were bringing it up from half court and attacking the guy in the paint.

“I think I was really nice in the pick-and-roll and things like that. I think late, there were some areas where I could have shot the ball a little better, focused a little more.”

Roy was working against Switzerland’s 6-6 Thabo Sefolosha, an interesting player and a definite contender when the Bulls use the 16th pick of the first round. Sefolosha, 22, averaged 12.0 points for Angelico Biella in the Italian league last season.

“He’s a really good player,” Roy said. “He’s quick, but he’s crafty. He kind of has this slow dribble, then he kind of explodes. He’s extremely long. His wingspan is very long.”

Saturday’s workout also included Connecticut power forward Hilton Armstrong and two unidentified big men. On Monday, the Bulls are scheduled to host Gonzaga’s Adam Morrison and Connecticut’s Rudy Gay.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> http://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...un18,1,4977281.story?coll=chi-sportsbulls-hed
> 
> Why he likes the Bulls: "They have the No. 2 pick, and they already went to the playoffs. They don't need a guy to come in and make this team turn around. They just need a guy to come and help them get over the hump to maybe start trying to win some championships."
> 
> His analysis of his workout: "I shot the ball really well. I was very explosive off the dribble. I did nicely on the pick-and-roll. I think I could have focused a little more with a little more energy down the stretch."


These quotes were on the news as well, he also said something to the effect of

"They don't need me to score 25 points a games."

It's nice that he thinks that's a possibility.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Hustle said:


> These quotes were on the news as well, he also said something to the effect of
> 
> "They don't need me to score 25 points a games."
> 
> It's nice that he thinks that's a possibility.


McGraw got that quote in his story:



> “That’s the special part about this pick,” he said. “They don’t need a franchise guy to come in and turn this team around. They just need a guy to come in and help them get over the hump to maybe start trying to win some championships.
> 
> “That’s a good feeling to come and know that the pressure’s not on me to score 25 points a night. It’s just to come in and help the team do whatever it can to win games.”


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> Roy, 21, worked out for the Bulls on Saturday along with Connecticut power forward Hilton Armstrong and shooting guard Thabo Sefolosha of Sweden.


Sweden... They'd be lucky to have as good a player as Sefolosha.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Scouting Bargnani In Italy


I like the comments on Bargnani's post game, it's good to hear that he doesn't just shoot constantly from the outside as he has been accused of. He seems more and more like a can't miss player to me.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.dailysouthtown.com/southtown/columns/arvia/x18-ard1.htm




> In other hands, especially the sun-burnished mitts of a Jerry Angelo, they are undeniably four-letter words:
> 
> Safe. Pick.
> 
> *For John Paxson, however, let them be the guiding mantra of his coming Bulls draft.
> 
> Safe. Pick.
> 
> The safe pick spent Saturday working out for Bulls brass at the Berto Center, and Brandon Roy didn't mind essentially being dubbed the navy blue, three-piece suit on a rack with trendier, and riskier, couture.*
> 
> "That's a compliment to me staying four years, really improving my game each year," the 6-foot-6 guard out of Washington said. "There's some young players in this draft, but they're talented ... I'm just trying to do my best to keep that — the safest pick in the draft — because I think that's going to work for me this year."
> 
> It's seldom worked in recent basketball history, mostly because the draft seldom employs common sense.
> 
> In the NFL, where prospects tend to arrive almost fully formed, going for the transcendent player is a must — a must too often ignored by the conservative Angelo. But in a league such as the NBA, where most of the brightest prospects are also projects, it might make sense to dare to settle.
> 
> *Regardless of whether Paxson gets frontline help via free agency or a trade, the Bulls GM should suck up the courage to ignore some potentially great big men and take a big guard who can help him now.*
> 
> There is pressure for him not to miss out on post help, because in the playoffs the Bulls came up shorter in the post than a three-cent stamp.
> 
> This assumes someone among LaMarcus Aldridge, Tyrus Thomas or perhaps, if you prefer the Dirk Nowitzki model that is all the rage, Andrea Bargnani is that next great big man. You may recall a similar assumption was made in 2001 about Kwame Brown, Tyson Chandler and Eddy Curry.





> Paxson can go with Aldridge, who looks like he may one day be a legitimate, back-to-the-basket NBA big man — even though he lacks much in the way of a back-to-the-basket game.
> 
> Paxson might choose Thomas, a great shot-blocker and rebounder who has drawn comparisons to, gulp, Chandler — except without the maturity.
> 
> Then there's Bargnani, a standard-issue European big who has about as much use for the paint as a vegetarian has for the Bolognese sauce.
> 
> *Or, as I said, Paxson can settle. If you consider it settling to draft a player Bruce Weber compared to Kobe Bryant.*


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I say go big at both picks.

2. Bargnani
16. Splitter

PG-Kirk Hinrich/Chris Duhon
SG-Ben Gordon/
SF-Andres Nocioni/Luol Deng
PF-Andrea Bargnani/Michael Sweetney
C- Tiago Splitter/Tyson Chandler

Then we can go find some big guard in free agency, or develop Basden some more, or say F! it, or get Deng to play some 2.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

i thought i read a few weeks ago that *splitter* was pulling out of the draft.

anybody? anybody? bueller?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> http://www.dailysouthtown.com/southtown/columns/arvia/x18-ard1.htm


that was an incredibly biased article...

thanks for posting it regardless....


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> that was an incredibly biased article...
> 
> thanks for posting it regardless....


just trying to post all the media about the guys we're working out.

it is a rare day indeed that _i actually agree_ with phil arvia. 



:|


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> i thought i read a few weeks ago that *splitter* was pulling out of the draft.
> 
> anybody? anybody? bueller?


 If memory serves, all indications are that Splitter will pull out, like has the last two years, but no paperwork has been filed yet. I think he can withdraw all the way until the last day before the draft . . . but am not sure. Theres a rule change next year that will move the non-American date to where the college date is now.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> If memory serves, all indications are that Splitter will pull out, like has the last two years, but no paperwork has been filed yet. I think he can withdraw all the way until the last day before the draft . . . but am not sure. Theres a rule change next year that will move the non-American date to where the college date is now.


I believe today is the last day for Splitter to drop out, since he is an early entry, there doesn't appear to be a foreign date listed this year, so I assume that today is the last day to pull out.

Like last year, it took 11 picks before the first foreign player was picked, only 3 were picked in the first round, and none of them have had any success right away. In 2004, it took 11 picks again for the first foreign player to be taken, 6 were taken overall in the first round, once again, no success yet. In 2003, the best foreign player is Barbosa, no one else has really done much in the NBA. Guys like Darko, Pietrus, and Delfino have showed something, but they were just glimpses, no consistent production. Which brings us back to 2002, when the last succesful foreign player was taken, Yao Ming #1 overall. You had Skita, bust, Nene who has shown some stuff but is majorly injury prone. 

The market for foreign players has shrunk, and with the level of American talent in next years draft, he could tumble farther next year than this year.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

One that withdraw from the draft is Rudy Fernandez.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I DON'T HAVE A LINK BUT i AM POSITIVE sPLITTER pulled out.


----------



## Dornado

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> I believe today is the last day for Splitter to drop out, since he is an early entry, there doesn't appear to be a foreign date listed this year, so I assume that today is the last day to pull out.
> 
> Like last year, it took 11 picks before the first foreign player was picked, only 3 were picked in the first round, and none of them have had any success right away. In 2004, it took 11 picks again for the first foreign player to be taken, 6 were taken overall in the first round, once again, no success yet. In 2003, the best foreign player is Barbosa, no one else has really done much in the NBA. Guys like Darko, Pietrus, and Delfino have showed something, but they were just glimpses, no consistent production. Which brings us back to 2002, when the last succesful foreign player was taken, Yao Ming #1 overall. You had Skita, bust, Nene who has shown some stuff but is majorly injury prone.
> 
> The market for foreign players has shrunk, and with the level of American talent in next years draft, he could tumble farther next year than this year.


Didn't Boris Diaw come out in 2003?


----------



## dogra

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> ...the Bulls GM should suck up the courage....


Yeah, suck up the courage to make a conservative, "safe" pick! LMAO :laugh:


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Bargnani update....

Italian League Finals - game #3

Bologna 73 Treviso 72 (Treviso leads 2-1)

37 mins
16 pts
2-4 2pt
3-8 3pt
3-6 ft
9 boards (2 offensive)
1 assist

The kid is pretty consistant thru these finals so far.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Hustle said:


> I DON'T HAVE A LINK BUT i AM POSITIVE sPLITTER pulled out.



Splitter just pulled out.

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1355

Rudoy also informed us that Tiago Splitter will not keep his name in the draft, as expected, which means that he likely could not secure a committment from a team in the "top 10 or 12" of the draft, as Rudoy said he was seeking last week.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Yup, he made it official after Tau lost another game against Unicaja, in the ACB finals (0-2):
http://www.acb.com/redaccion.php?id=32112

So no Splitter and no Rudy.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

What does Splitter do next year? Isn't his big issue regarding the buyout situation with his European contract? If he comes out next year, w/the deep draft class he may be drafted mid-to-late 1st round. When would he become a 'Nocioni' type of FA? So teams can try to offer him a contract?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

O'Yeah, I'm also liking the idea of Shawne Williams at 16. I know we got enough SGs, but someone said he shut down Morrison in the NCAAs. How is his handle? Can he be a DerMarr Johnson-ish 6'9" SG? I heard he will likely project as a SF/PF though in the NBA? 

At 16, we must go for BPA no matter what. Even if we pick Roy, Gay, or Morrison at 2, I don't want to go big at 16. We can address that in FA. I don't think Alexander Johnson or anyone will necessarily be better than picking up Harrington, Gooden, Ely, etc.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1355



> There are rumors that the Suns might even try to trade with Chicago and move up all the way to the #2 pick, a deal which would most likely involve Shawn Marion.


Hmm. Shawn Marion is a PLAYER, there's no doubt about it. He could be our starting 4, as he's grown comfortable playing that position for the last few years. He's undersized at 6' 7", but he's made it work so well that you can't really knock his ability. 

He's under contract for three more years, at 15, 16, and 17 million dollars respectively. Trading for him would eat up most of our cap room. I also wonder if he would thrive anywhere near as much on a mostly half court team.

So in the end, I can't say I'm in favor of such a deal.

Draft Express is also reporting the Phoenix wants to trade into the mid first round using their #21 and #27 picks. We could be a good candidate for such a trade. Who might we pick with two later first rounders? Realistically, the Bulls have worked out an incredible number of players that might get drafted in the 20's:

James Augustine (a stretch for the first round)
Dee Brown (a stretch for the first round)
Shawne Williams
JJ Redick (considering his DUI and his back injury, he could slip to #21)
Mardy Collins (he could be around for #21)
Quincy Douby
Hassan Adams
Shannon Brown (he could be around for #21)
Sene (quite possibly gone at #21)
Alexander Johnson (could he last until #21?)

What do you guys think? Should we trade down from #16 to #21 and #27?


----------



## jnrjr79

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Marion is quite the player, to be sure, but I am pretty scared of finding that he was the beneficiary of the Steve Nash effect and having him not pan out here.

I guess the question is, do we think whoever we take at #2 would be better than Marion? I'm not so sure.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1355
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm. Shawn Marion is a PLAYER, there's no doubt about it. He could be our starting 4, as he's grown comfortable playing that position for the last few years. He's undersized at 6' 7", but he's made it work so well that you can't really knock his ability.
> 
> He's under contract for three more years, at 15, 16, and 17 million dollars respectively. Trading for him would eat up most of our cap room. I also wonder if he would thrive anywhere near as much on a mostly half court team.
> 
> So in the end, I can't say I'm in favor of such a deal.
> 
> Draft Express is also reporting the Phoenix wants to trade into the mid first round using their #21 and #27 picks. We could be a good candidate for such a trade. Who might we pick with two later first rounders? Realistically, the Bulls have worked out an incredible number of players that might get drafted in the 20's:
> 
> James Augustine (a stretch for the first round)
> Dee Brown (a stretch for the first round)
> Shawne Williams
> JJ Redick (considering his DUI and his back injury, he could slip to #21)
> Mardy Collins (he could be around for #21)
> Quincy Douby
> Hassan Adams
> Shannon Brown (he could be around for #21)
> Sene (quite possibly gone at #21)
> Alexander Johnson (could he last until #21?)
> 
> What do you guys think? Should we trade down from #16 to #21 and #27?


Hmm. I'm not sure I like the idea of trading 16 for 21 and 27. I like the idea of trading up from 16 better, as I'm becoming more and more convinced that Ronnie Brewer is going to be an impact pro.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

*How do you copy and paste from DraftExpress?* I'm trying to post a quote from there.

They mention that Thabo Sefolosha has a 7'2" Wingspan and a 8'11.5" Standing Reach. 

Draft Express


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Hmm. I'm not sure I like the idea of trading 16 for 21 and 27. I like the idea of trading up from 16 better, as I'm becoming more and more convinced that Ronnie Brewer is going to be an impact pro.


Brewer should get some more consideration to be picked. i think the difference between Roy and Brewer is only a hair of difference depending on the day they play. they are both good athletes. both have good personalities. both can play multi positions. but i think on the defensive end has to go to Brewer. which basically means if your willing to pick Roy at the no.2 slot i dont see why you couldn't pick Brewer at the no.2 also. I think he needs to get more of a closer look. He is what a whole inch shorter than Thomas? and alot more skilled than him. with a basketball pedigree. 

though i wouldn't' want marion on our team. well not with his contract anyhow. i think his talented and you can't just put him in the Nash effect department because he was doing what he was doing even when they had the non point guard marbury. his just getting more credibilty because they are winning. but his game hasnt changed much since his come into the nba.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

What about Nemaja Aleksandrov in the draft? Maybe trade down with Phoenix, 16 for 21 and 29 so Phoenix is in a better position to draft Sene. And we take Namaja with 29, and someone else at 21.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> What about Nemaja Aleksandrov in the draft? Maybe trade down with Phoenix, 16 for 21 and 29 so Phoenix is in a better position to draft Sene. And we take Namaja with 29, and someone else at 21.


I think having one rookie is enough. even two i think is still quite alot. so i think it will be a impact player. and a relative project that paxson will pick. but i doubt Paxson is going to want 3 rookies on the team. espically 2 extra projects.... if anything i think they'll trade one of their picks to get a veteran or for a future pick.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> *How do you copy and paste from DraftExpress?* I'm trying to post a quote from there.
> 
> They mention that Thabo Sefolosha has a 7'2" Wingspan and a 8'11.5" Standing Reach.
> 
> Draft Express


I think he's the worst case scenario for the big 2 guard, we've been waiting for. Which isn't bad considering the guys ahead of him.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I don't know why Marquis Daniels is in Avery's doghouse for most of the year, but I'd love to get him for 16.


----------



## southpark

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archi...ontract_of_alvin_williams_and_#3_pick_for_#1/

damn if thats true....i'm pretty sure they're going Morrisson 1....perhaps Gay but more importantly, it REALLY frees up Pax to get who he wants among: LA, TT, Roy. I'm still trying to figure out if he'd really pass up LA to take on TT or if he'd go "safe" and take Roy


----------



## laso

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



southpark said:


> http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archi...ontract_of_alvin_williams_and_#3_pick_for_#1/
> 
> damn if thats true....i'm pretty sure they're going Morrisson 1....perhaps Gay but more importantly, it REALLY frees up Pax to get who he wants among: LA, TT, Roy. I'm still trying to figure out if he'd really pass up LA to take on TT or if he'd go "safe" and take Roy


That would be great. I would love for us to get a shot at Bargnani!


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Welcome to America Andrea Bargnani!


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Well, if Paxson is just flying under the radar, and really is scouting Bargnani heavily, like his agent said about seeing the Bulls at every game, and Toronto thinks that he'll be there at three, and the Bulls are flying under the radar, more power to them. Take Bargnani 2, he is 7'1", 250, can play center on defense, has some low post, and good for the pick and roll. However, I think Charlotte might be trading up to get Gay because they're afraid we'll take him.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Maybe Toronto's caving into Bosh wanting Aldridge?


----------



## Amareca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Not sure the Suns would have to trade Marion to get the #2 possibly. I mean we have an Atlanta draftpick with only top3 protection next year and top1 in 2008. So we are looking worst case at a #10 and best cast #4 pick in a draft that should be one of the best. No way Atlanta makes the playoffs next season.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Yup, Raptors are drafting Aldridge.



> And on July 12, it will be Chris Bosh Day as Canadians likely will celebrate the signing of a lucrative six-year contract extension that will keep the American in a Toronto Raptors uniform.
> 
> "I can't wait to sign it," Bosh said. "I know where I'll be. If I didn't, I would have to answer all those free-agent questions.
> 
> "It's for me and my family. I can focus on building a championship team there. ... If I know where I'll be, I'll worry about the team and make us better."


http://www.denverpost.com/nuggets/ci_3950429


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Yup, Raptors are drafting Aldridge.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.denverpost.com/nuggets/ci_3950429


LOL

that does make alot of sense...

he wasn't all that convinced until AFTER Aldridge works out?

I still can't see colangelo passing on HIS guy though. He's been scouting him for two years.


----------



## The Krakken

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



The Krakken said:


> Just out of curiosity, why on earth would we consider drafting Gay? Is he projected to be THAT much better than Deng? I don't see it. ANd I doubt he could play the 2 or 4, so it seems Gay would be a wasted pick for us no matter HOW badly the knicks tanked.
> 
> Get a big with the Knicks pick, and go after Ronnie Brewer, Marco Bellini, or Mardy Collins.
> 
> 
> My big 5 as far as realistically obtainable assets that might fit well here are:
> 
> Brewer, Bellini, Collins, Splitter, Fazekas.
> 
> I don't consider Aldridge obtainable unless he drops or the Knicks TANK AND get lucky.



My my, I wish I could have this post back. :laugh:


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*

What if Charlotte moves up and grabs Bargnani. This way we likely pass on Morrison or Gay, they get one of the remaining, who Toronto picks for them. Toronto still gets their man with some cap relief, and Charlotte still gets Morrison or Gay. I know, if they don't trade up, then they likely will have a choice between Gay or Morrison anyway. Maybe there would be more to the deal? Otherwise, unless they are confident we pass on Morrison, Morrison ends up in their hands for sure, and not to the Pacers or Portland.


----------



## step

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



> Take Bargnani 2, he is 7'1", 250, can play center on defense


After a long day I'm glad that I can always come here for a laugh, cheers sloth.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Attention : Draft Nerds - The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread*



step said:


> After a long day I'm glad that I can always come here for a laugh, cheers sloth.


This got a laugh out of me :clown: :clap: :cheers: :biggrin:


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

As draft nears, level of uncertainty rises  

Mike on the Bulls' and other choices:



> With the No. 1 pick, Toronto is expected to either select Italy’s Andrea Bargnani or trade the pick to a team that’s after Gonzaga’s Adam Morrison.
> 
> •The Bulls at No. 2 are trying to decide between LSU forward Tyrus Thomas and Washington guard Brandon Roy.
> 
> •Some believe Connecticut’s Rudy Gay could go as high as No. 3 to Charlotte. There are reports Atlanta is ready to take Duke’s Shelden Williams at No. 5. Texas center LaMarcus Aldridge is still in the mix somewhere, as well.
> 
> Whether this year’s crop of players turns out to be good or bad, there seems to be no consensus among the executives involved.
> 
> The Bulls are in an enviable position because the top players all want to end up here.
> 
> That’s not meant as speculation. Anyone would prefer to join a team that’s been in the playoffs instead of one that faces an uncertain period of rebuilding.
> 
> Knowing that, don’t be surprised if the Bulls try to create one last competitive workout to help make up their minds. If they invited Thomas, Roy, Aldridge and Morrison to come back on the same day, would any of those players say no?


More, including who the Bulls might pick at 16.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



narek said:


> As draft nears, level of uncertainty rises
> 
> Mike on the Bulls' and other choices:
> 
> 
> 
> More, including who the Bulls might pick at 16.


i liked what they said about Brewer. i really wonder if they are willing to trade down for him. that would be my prays answered. but i highly doubt with the no.2 

i honestly think if your going to for Roy. your better of going for Brewer. i think Brewer will end up being the better of the two.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> i liked what they said about Brewer. i really wonder if they are willing to trade down for him. that would be my prays answered. but i highly doubt with the no.2
> 
> i honestly think if your going to for Roy. your better of going for Brewer. i think Brewer will end up being the better of the two.



Add sefolosha to the mix and I honestly don't see how you can take Roy #2. Yes, he is gonna be a contributor from day one and might turn out to be all-star quality, but it is very difficult to find quality big men and you have your choice of the remaining - Aldridge or Bargnani, if not both. We have a phenomenal outside game. We have a phenomenally bad inside game. Our PF and C position contribute nothing but defense (when Chandler isn't fouling out or injured with a hang nail stuck in his esophagus :brokenhea ).

Aldridge and Bargnani at a minimum giving you a scoring presence and both are underrated on defense. Thomas is in the mix, but I just don't like a guy who has nothing but athleticism on his side (since most guys in the NBA have athleticism). 

I also think the notion we can "easily grab the FA big men we want" is false. Honestly, are any of the big men available difference makers already? No. In fact, they may be rated after the three at the top in this draft. Scary thought.


That's why I say we have to go with Aldridge or Bargnani. Roy would be great, but we are not a complete team with him and at 16 there aren't any big men that can contribute quickly and upgrades over what we have. At 16, there will be a few talented SG that would be an upgrade and give us what we need (Sefalosha definitely available, Brewer or Carney maybe).

If we end up with a Roy + marginal big man prospect at 16, we deserve what we get - bounced out of the playoffs in the first or second round. And, that's if we are willing to overpay for a Big man in FA.

We need an offensive weapon in the frontcourt - Give me Aldridge or Bargnani.


The irony is that we talk about Pax doing such a great job -

well, we're not having this discussion if he does what so many of us clamored for before:

Trade Marshall and our pick and draft Wade.
Draft Iggy over Gordon.
Now, when we have a chance to add a quality big man, we're stillt alking about the damn SG position. 


Has he really done that good in drafting?

Sure Deng was a godsend at 7 (he did good in getting this pick from Phoenix, but it was phoenix who chose us to suck more than Boston).

Hinrich is very good, but I'd trade him and Gordon to have Wade....let alone Hinrich and Marshall.


----------



## charlietyra

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



chifaninca said:


> Add sefolosha to the mix and I honestly don't see how you can take Roy #2. Yes, he is gonna be a contributor from day one and might turn out to be all-star quality, but it is very difficult to find quality big men and you have your choice of the remaining - Aldridge or Bargnani, if not both. We have a phenomenal outside game. We have a phenomenally bad inside game. Our PF and C position contribute nothing but defense (when Chandler isn't fouling out or injured with a hang nail stuck in his esophagus :brokenhea ).
> 
> Aldridge and Bargnani at a minimum giving you a scoring presence and both are underrated on defense. Thomas is in the mix, but I just don't like a guy who has nothing but athleticism on his side (since most guys in the NBA have athleticism).
> 
> I also think the notion we can "easily grab the FA big men we want" is false. Honestly, are any of the big men available difference makers already? No. In fact, they may be rated after the three at the top in this draft. Scary thought.
> 
> 
> That's why I say we have to go with Aldridge or Bargnani. Roy would be great, but we are not a complete team with him and at 16 there aren't any big men that can contribute quickly and upgrades over what we have. At 16, there will be a few talented SG that would be an upgrade and give us what we need (Sefalosha definitely available, Brewer or Carney maybe).
> 
> If we end up with a Roy + marginal big man prospect at 16, we deserve what we get - bounced out of the playoffs in the first or second round. And, that's if we are willing to overpay for a Big man in FA.
> 
> We need an offensive weapon in the frontcourt - Give me Aldridge or Bargnani.
> 
> 
> The irony is that we talk about Pax doing such a great job -
> 
> well, we're not having this discussion if he does what so many of us clamored for before:
> 
> Trade Marshall and our pick and draft Wade.
> Draft Iggy over Gordon.
> Now, when we have a chance to add a quality big man, we're stillt alking about the damn SG position.
> 
> 
> Has he really done that good in drafting?
> 
> Sure Deng was a godsend at 7 (he did good in getting this pick from Phoenix, but it was phoenix who chose us to suck more than Boston).
> 
> Hinrich is very good, but I'd trade him and Gordon to have Wade....let alone Hinrich and Marshall.



I agree with you completely regarding your assessment of Paxson. I believe his record is mixed. For example, when he started the job he couldn't wait to throw millions at a broken down Scottie Pippen when James Posey was on the market. This just showed a lack of experience, judgment, or both.

You don't even have to go that far back. The Tim Thomas thing was an abortion. Perhaps that was more of a Scott Skiles thing but the bottom line is that Thomas would have helped the team a lot more than Piatkowski, who was totally useless. And why not resign Adrian Griffin who would have contributed a lot more than Piatkowski/Shensher? And as for the way the Curry matter was handled.......? 

Pax did have the foresight to sign Noce and get Deng, that is why his record is mixed, at best. However, most posters on this board somehow think that Pax is infallible.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



chifaninca said:


> Hinrich is very good, but I'd trade him and Gordon to have Wade....let alone Hinrich and Marshall.


Has there ever been any evidence that that deal was actually a possibility?


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> •There is no evidence so far that the Bulls are close to trading the No. 2 pick for a veteran, but this week is traditionally when trade offers start to arrive.


Oh this will spice things up, hopefully we don't hear the same garbage that's being recycled oh so often lately.



> (Sefalosha definitely available, Brewer or Carney maybe).


Sefolosha has been tearing up his workouts, I wouldn't be suprised if he gets snapped up.


> Thabo Sefolosha was surprisingly not invited to the physical-only portion of the NBA pre-draft camp, but DraftExpress has managed to obtain his measurements taken by an NBA team that worked him out last week in Orlando. Sefolosha measured out at 6-7 in shoes, 207 pounds, with an astounding 7-2 wingspan and 8-11 ½ standing reach. Sefolosha worked out with the Minnesota Timberwolves today against Brandon Roy, Rudy Gay and Shawne Williams and reportedly had an outstanding workout, only losing one of four games in the one on one competitive portion against the two likely top 10 picks.


Also reports state that Rudy Fernandez, Brad Newley and Tiago Splitter have all pulled out, reducing the number of appealing options with our pick.

Just randomly going over it, I wouldn't be suprised if we walked away with Roy and Johnson in this draft. Though Roy and Sefolosha does sound tempting, sure would make FA and the trade rumours interesting.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> i honestly think if your going to for Roy. your better of going for Brewer. i think Brewer will end up being the better of the two.


Good thing about Brewer is, he could guard 1-3 any given day.

I hope we do get him.

At the same time, I will agree with all the Roy lovers :

a Roy/Hinrich backcourt is PERFECT...if he is drafted by us, I expect Gordon to be moved and soon. I still don't want him at the expense of the #2 pick though...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



chifaninca said:


> We have a phenomenal outside game. We have a phenomenally bad inside game. Our PF and C position contribute nothing but defense (when Chandler isn't fouling out or injured with a hang nail stuck in his esophagus :brokenhea ).
> 
> Aldridge and Bargnani at a minimum giving you a scoring presence and both are underrated on defense.
> 
> I also think the notion we can "easily grab the FA big men we want" is false. Honestly, are any of the big men available difference makers already? No. In fact, they may be rated after the three at the top in this draft. Scary thought.
> 
> That's why I say we have to go with Aldridge or Bargnani. At 16, there will be a few talented SG that would be an upgrade and give us what we need (Sefalosha definitely available, Brewer or Carney maybe).
> 
> If we end up with a Roy + marginal big man prospect at 16, we deserve what we get - bounced out of the playoffs in the first or second round. And, that's if we are willing to overpay for a Big man in FA.
> 
> We need an offensive weapon in the frontcourt - Give me Aldridge or Bargnani.
> ion.


TELL EM' WHY YOU MAD!!!

lol, I agree with all this though. If we wind up coming out of the offseason with say just, Mohammed & Ely, we're going nowhere, AGAIN. Gooden, Wilcox, Nene or Benny Wallace aren't promised to us and more than likely will stick with the teams their with (ESPECIALLY Nene). The best offensive player in the FA bunch is Chris Wilcox but we all see what production Erick Dampier, Adonal Foyle, Jerome James put up AFTER they got that huge payday.

GOTTA draft one of the big's with #2. They possibly have more potenial than any big we could hope to get in FA.

My Pick - LaMarcus Aldridge.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1356

Read that review of Bargnani's last game where he had that impressive statline.

That say's he's faster than Gasol, a better slasher & a better shooter but isn't as didn't take over in the playoffs how Pau did (Gasol doesn't take off over in them NOW though hehe).

Kid sounds intriguing as hell though. They said he started off the game in the low post and scored with ease although some of his movements are unpolished. Also, they talked about how he was on the 3-point line, faked and slashed to the hole. If you think about it, he sounds like a mix of Dirk & Pau. I think he'll atleast be as good as Pau in the NBA someday. That's hard to pass on, hopefully the Raptors select him and we don't have a choice LOL.


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> That's hard to pass on, hopefully the Raptors select him and we don't have a choice LOL.


Just like with Wade? That excuse hasn't worked to well so far.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> TELL EM' WHY YOU MAD!!!
> 
> lol, I agree with all this though. If we wind up coming out of the offseason with say just, Mohammed & Ely, we're going nowhere, AGAIN. Gooden, Wilcox, Nene or Benny Wallace aren't promised to us and more than likely will stick with the teams their with (ESPECIALLY Nene). The best offensive player in the FA bunch is Chris Wilcox but we all see what production Erick Dampier, Adonal Foyle, Jerome James put up AFTER they got that huge payday.
> 
> GOTTA draft one of the big's with #2. They possibly have more potenial than any big we could hope to get in FA.
> 
> My Pick - LaMarcus Aldridge.


Ely is a RFA who isn't promised either. I can't see Denver, Seattle or Cleveland giving up on good RFA Bigs without compensation. It will take unexpected stellar seasons from Chandler and Sweetney to make next year a success if the Bulls draft a wing player rather than one of the two top bigs in this draft.

Obviously Aldridge is the logical pick. Toronto doesn't seem that interested in drafting him with the #1. Coangelo damned him with faint praise by saying he was certainly one of the top five prospects in the draft. I don't think Bosh has enough pull to demand who the Raptors draft this year. They are clearly trying to trade down with someone who wants one of the four wings available at the top of the draft.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



step said:


> Just like with Wade? That excuse hasn't worked to well so far.


But the Heat were suppose to take Hinrich


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



McBulls said:


> I don't think Bosh has enough pull to demand who the Raptors draft this year. They are clearly trying to trade down with someone who wants one of the four wings available at the top of the draft.


As the franchise player

I'd say he has TONS of pull


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> As the franchise player
> 
> I'd say he has TONS of pull



Also, after losing Vince Carter for essentially nothing, they really can't afford to have yet another star leave them.


Still, I'm hoping they trade the pick so someone can grab Morrison. Paxson is just crazy enough to take Morrison, so I want him off the board. Also, it gives us the real choice between Aldridge and Bargnani.


----------



## BULLHITTER

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> I agree with you completely regarding your assessment of Paxson. I believe his record is mixed. For example, when he started the job he couldn't wait to throw millions at a broken down Scottie Pippen when James Posey was on the market. This just showed a lack of experience, judgment, or both.
> 
> You don't even have to go that far back. The Tim Thomas thing was an abortion. Perhaps that was more of a Scott Skiles thing but the bottom line is that Thomas would have helped the team a lot more than Piatkowski, who was totally useless. And why not resign Adrian Griffin who would have contributed a lot more than Piatkowski/Shensher? And as for the way the Curry matter was handled.......?
> 
> Pax did have the foresight to sign Noce and get Deng, that is why his record is mixed, at best. However, most posters on this board somehow think that Pax is infallible.


this is 20-20 hindsight at its finest; there's *no* gm that's considered "infallible". any forum fan that thinks so is delusional. so many factors go into putting together a winning program that in pax's tenure, while the results have been mixed, NONE of the above miscalculations have cost the bull anything in terms of their present rate of progress. for the opinions that paxson "doesn't gamble", scottie pippen, who imo *was * over the hill when acquired, was the kind of "veteran influence" he was looking for (and still is) to help the young players. if scottie's knees had held up, the team would have benefitted greatly. it didn't so, here's the window of opportunity for criticism. 

tim thomas was an absolute throw in to the curry deal that (imo) was foisted upon the bull. should the bull have kissed his *** to be a contributing member of the team, or the other way around? d'antoni, went the back door route, if you get my drift. thomas did about what was expected for phoenix; would what he did for phoenix have helped the bull this season? they'd still have lost in the first round. again, revisionist "pax blew it" history in effect once again. griffin's ability was appreciated, of course, but needing big men and wanting to leave a spot open for the opportunity to grab one wasn't a bad idea (even though schenscher is a scrub and nobody better surfaced), but again would griff's contribution to the mav been the equivalent to what he brought to the table for the bull? not enough to beat the heat, cause dwade is using griff like a tool up to this point as well.

and curry?......don't get me started on that mama's boy. i believe new york is going to seriously damage his career when its all said and done; and the revisionists will be nowhere to be found.

point is, gm's are all subject to criticism....i thought krause screwed things up righteously. pax is doing a commendable job correcting it; perfectly? no. *but their business is an inexact science*. even veteran gm's make miscalculated decisions. i like most of the bull players. give it time; things appear to be moving in the right direction. i haven't seen evidence that management is on the road to screwing them up to the same degree the prior situation did.


----------



## charlietyra

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



BULLHITTER said:


> this is 20-20 hindsight at its finest; there's *no* gm that's considered "infallible". any forum fan that thinks so is delusional. so many factors go into putting together a winning program that in pax's tenure, while the results have been mixed, NONE of the above miscalculations have cost the bull anything in terms of their present rate of progress. for the opinions that paxson "doesn't gamble", scottie pippen, who imo *was * over the hill when acquired, was the kind of "veteran influence" he was looking for (and still is) to help the young players. if scottie's knees had held up, the team would have benefitted greatly. it didn't so, here's the window of opportunity for criticism.
> 
> tim thomas was an absolute throw in to the curry deal that (imo) was foisted upon the bull. should the bull have kissed his *** to be a contributing member of the team, or the other way around? d'antoni, went the back door route, if you get my drift. thomas did about what was expected for phoenix; would what he did for phoenix have helped the bull this season? they'd still have lost in the first round. again, revisionist "pax blew it" history in effect once again. griffin's ability was appreciated, of course, but needing big men and wanting to leave a spot open for the opportunity to grab one wasn't a bad idea (even though schenscher is a scrub and nobody better surfaced), but again would griff's contribution to the mav been the equivalent to what he brought to the table for the bull? not enough to beat the heat, cause dwade is using griff like a tool up to this point as well.
> 
> and curry?......don't get me started on that mama's boy. i believe new york is going to seriously damage his career when its all said and done; and the revisionists will be nowhere to be found.
> 
> point is, gm's are all subject to criticism....i thought krause screwed things up righteously. pax is doing a commendable job correcting it; perfectly? no. *but their business is an inexact science*. even veteran gm's make miscalculated decisions. i like most of the bull players. give it time; things appear to be moving in the right direction. i haven't seen evidence that management is on the road to screwing them up to the same degree the prior situation did.


How can you say that some of these decisions did not hurt the Bulls progress? In my opinion, it was a stroke of luck that the Bulls were able to even get into the playoffs this year after winning 47 games the year before. That stroke of luck was Songalia going down, which permitted Nocioni to play more minutes and show his stuff. The Curry matter set the Bulls back big time. When all is said and done, even an underachieving Curry would have meant a lot more victories last year. I would still rather have Curry than any of the so-called phenoms Pax is evaluating for this year's draft. NBA GMs who were polled on this issue last month agree!

Many of us knew before Pippen was acquired that he had fallen off the shelf. This wasn't hindsight. When you spend money on trainwrecks like him (or Chandler) you tie the hands of the franchise in being able to acquire other players. Look, we can argue this to the cows come home. My point is that Paxson has not given me the feeling that he totally knows what he is doing. I get the feeling that he does not have much of a grand plan at all. Probably similar to a lot of other GMs in the league. I just question the amount of trust most posters have in him when I read posts on this board.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



charlietyra said:


> I would still rather have Curry than any of the so-called phenoms Pax is evaluating for this year's draft. NBA GMs who were polled on this issue last month agree!


I'm still not understanding WHY though lol.

Their were more con's to his game than pro's and I remember the board complaining about him DAILY.

Bottom line is, there's a few players at the top of this draft that are DEFININTELY more well-rounded as a player than Curry was. 5 years later and no progress has been shown on his part.

Glad we got rid of him.


----------



## BULLHITTER

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> My point is that Paxson has not given me the feeling that he totally knows what he is doing. I get the feeling that he does not have much of a grand plan at all. Probably similar to a lot of other GMs in the league. I just question the amount of trust most posters have in him when I read posts on this board.


as stated arguing "til the cows come home" is a fruitless exercise; however, with respect to the above quote, "plans" at least in nba, are always subject to change. *but* the amount of "trust" posters have in pax is based on some very simple truths;

has he improved the team?
has he brought in better players?
has he brought in a credible coach?
has the team's progress been noted by its nba peers?

if the answer to all these is yes, and since paxson was instrumental in answering yes to those questions, then one could argue that pax has afforded himself a certain amount of trust (with posters) with respect to basketball decisions. by comparison, veteran gm's like mitch kupchak, isaiah thomas, billy king, steve patterson (wasn't he recently let go?), et al all lead teams with far less "upside" and far more question marks than the bull. 

so i'd guess there'll be the agreement to disagree until further data is compiled.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The thing I hated with Eddy, is that I was a sucker in hoping and hoping he would realize and fulfill his potential. Before his heart illness, he had two monster games. A 21 pt 1st Qtr vs Indiana, and a solid game vs Memphis. But that was only 2 star stellar games every few months. The kid has the size to dominate like that every night. He rightfully was nicknamed Baby Shaq as he SHOULD have been. But he NEVER became that. I wish we brought back the same exact team as the previous year. I do think we had a great team concept going where each players' WEAKNESS was covered by another's STRENGTH. But what is done is done, and we have proven that we are STILL a SOLID team. What this team did this year without a frontcourt has been amazing. We are only a few pieces away from going to the ECF (unless the Refs keep staying on their knees when attending Wade). 

I think we go Bargnani if he is available, if not we must address size at 2. We need to trade up and grab Brewer. I do not think Roy is head and shoulders above Brewer. If we do not grab a big at 2, we will struggle to land a quality one at 16 or in FA. Unless our idea of a big is Al Harrington. Pax will go strongly for AH or Pryz as both are UFA. The RFAs will be tough, and Pax has said he will not overpay. He already has for one big.

My vote for the picks as of now:
At 2: If Bargnani is available, Grab him. If not, Grab Aldridge.
At 16: If we do not trade up, grab the best wingman available. My order: Brewer, Carney, and Sefolosha. Thabo should be available while the others are not. No quality big will be here then. If Sene is, we won't grab him. We suck at developing our Bigs. Pax won't want a project either.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



charlietyra said:


> My point is that Paxson has not given me the feeling that he totally knows what he is doing. I get the feeling that he does not have much of a grand plan at all. Probably similar to a lot of other GMs in the league.


Hmm..

Is three years he's created a hardworking, winning core.

a team that WON't quit and is possibly the hardest working in the entire league

He's gotten us BACK to the playoffs two years straight

The only team to scare the hearts out of the SOON TO BE nba champions (besides dallas)....

All this with NO frontline help at all

I'd say he knows what he's doing....And he's doing a pretty good job too


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



charlietyra said:


> I just question the amount of trust most posters have in him when I read posts on this board.



That was my point earlier.

I HOPE Paxson does the right thing. I was responding to the general feeling that Paxson has done a very good job. I find his moves to have been very average, even if the results we're better than average - (i.e. - Hinrich very good, but had a chance to get Wade. Deng very good choice, but without Phoenix underestimating it, doesn't happen).

Again, if we choose a guy many were clamoring for each draft, we wouldn't still be discussing drafting yet another SG witht he #2 pick. So, was Ben Gordon the right choice? I don't think so, even though I love watching him. His impact ( Hinrich playing constantly out of position, HOT V Cold Shooting nights, average at best defense, some reported starter grumblings, etc)......

It frustrates me because we seem to repeatedly address the same positions year after year, when it's plain to see we have a need for atleast 2 starter quality big men. I know one can be found through FA, but I am not sure both can.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

*rlucas*, any inside info lately about the Bulls or any other team? :biggrin: :angel:


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> *rlucas*, any inside info lately about the Bulls or any other team? :biggrin: :angel:


Heres the scoop I heard. John Paxson is not looking to trade for Jalen Rose, Eddy Curry, Jamal Crawford, Zach Randolph, or Darius Miles. He is not going to be able to draft Tiago Splitter at 2 OR 16. HE WILL NOT draft Josh Boone at 2.


----------



## laso

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Heres the scoop I heard. John Paxson is not looking to trade for Jalen Rose, Eddy Curry, Jamal Crawford, Zach Randolph, or Darius Miles. He is not going to be able to draft Tiago Splitter at 2 OR 16. HE WILL NOT draft Josh Boone at 2.


I also hear he has decided he will NOT draft Bargnani at 16...


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

CjayC on RealGM with Tyrus Thomas Info 

Apparently Tyrus was suppose to workout for Portland but cancelled his workout. 

Radio Station With News 
It might not be from an official source, but seems true.



> I have just learned that Tyrus Thomas WILL NOT be coming to Portland for a workout with the Blazers tomorrow. More details to come, but the indication is that he was promised something by Toronto, Chicago or Charlotte, and thus decided he didn't need to come here for a workout.


I wonder if Pax guaranteed anything


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> CjayC on RealGM with Tyrus Thomas Info
> 
> Apparently Tyrus was suppose to workout for Portland but cancelled his workout.
> 
> Radio Station With News
> It might not be from an official source, but seems true.
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if Pax guaranteed anything


I Hope not. I don't want him. I've gone back and forth, but he's not what we need, unless we are moving to a Phoenix style team. I wouldn't object, but we don't have the coach or GM for that.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> CjayC on RealGM with Tyrus Thomas Info
> 
> Apparently Tyrus was suppose to workout for Portland but cancelled his workout.
> 
> Radio Station With News
> It might not be from an official source, but seems true.
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if Pax guaranteed anything


Wow...

I would say that definintely ment he got a promise. Did he even workout for Toronto yet?

Either that, or he just doesn't want to play for portland.

OR

Toronto plans to take him and trade him to Charlotte for the #3

Also, if Bulls did promise, maybe his 'light' workout went well or they were impressed that he even worked out through his illness or injury.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Ick, ick, ick. Tyrus is NOT my guy. 

Sigh. I wonder if we'll get some follow up news on this.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> CjayC on RealGM with Tyrus Thomas Info
> 
> Apparently Tyrus was suppose to workout for Portland but cancelled his workout.
> 
> Radio Station With News
> It might not be from an official source, but seems true.
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if Pax guaranteed anything


 My money is on it being Bickerstaff/Jordan who gave the promise. Didn't they tell Okafor he was the pick a couple years ago? Paxson, to my knowledge, has never told a player they were are guy. Of course, Paxson has never drafted this high either where he would be in the position to give a guarantee. Still, given Paxson's sleuth tactics over the last couple of weeks it would surprise me.

Edit: Jordan also let it be known that Kwame was his guy before the 2001 draft.


----------



## BULLS23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> CjayC on RealGM with Tyrus Thomas Info
> 
> Apparently Tyrus was suppose to workout for Portland but cancelled his workout.
> 
> Radio Station With News
> It might not be from an official source, but seems true.
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if Pax guaranteed anything



I hope this is just conjecture . . . He's so not my guy, only because we aren't a PHX style team. I don't think we have the players nor the coach to do that at this time. I think TT will be a good player, I just don't think it will be with the Bulls.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> My money is on it being Bickerstaff/Jordan who gave the promise. Didn't they tell Okafor he was the pick a couple years ago? Paxson, to my knowledge, has never told a player they were are guy. Of course, Paxson has never drafted this high either where he would be in the position to give a guarantee. Still, given Paxson's sleuth tactics over the last couple of weeks it would surprise me.
> 
> Edit: Jordan also let it be known that Kwame was his guy before the 2001 draft.


Tyrus is the absolute opposite type of player of what Bickerstaff said he was looking for (a shooter). Bernie is usually a pretty straight shooter too.


----------



## SecretAgentGuy

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Promising a player this soon doesn't sound like a Paxson type move. Toronto has been linked to every player other than Thomas, although it sounds like Thomas has worked out for the Raptors on multiple occassions (at least 2x?). Charlotte makes sense if they view him as a SF.

But my bet is that Tyrus pulled his groin, as was reported when he came here. Wasn't that the reason he couldn't finish his workout here?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sp00k said:


> Promising a player this soon doesn't sound like a Paxson type move. Toronto has been linked to every player other than Thomas, although it sounds like Thomas has worked out for the Raptors on multiple occassions (at least 2x?). Charlotte makes sense if they view him as a SF.
> 
> But my bet is that Tyrus pulled his groin, as was reported when he came here. Wasn't that the reason he couldn't finish his workout here?


i thought it was something with his stomach, or somethin he ate the night before


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

One more note. If Roy is your guy and you know Charlotte likes Tyrus Thomas and you wanted to use your leverage to force Charlotte to trade up, you would position yourself exactly like the Bulls have: leak to Tyrus's people that he is your pick, but at the same time give consistent information that you would also be interested in Roy. This makes Charlotte know that you are considering their guy, but could be convinced to trade the pick and select Roy instead. It will be quite a sleuth accomplishment if Paxson is able to coax a trade with Charlotte for the three pick on draft day.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Wow, this is a crazy year for the draft. No one knows even the 1st pick. 

I'd love to say it's fun, but I think I'll just say it's more maddening than anything else.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Tyrus is the absolute opposite type of player of what Bickerstaff said he was looking for (a shooter). Bernie is usually a pretty straight shooter too.


 Charlotte is also the only team that has had a change of the people making their draft position over the last month (adding Jordan). Perhaps a change of their drafting position is reflected?


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



chifaninca said:


> Wow, this is a crazy year for the draft. No one knows even the 1st pick.
> 
> I'd love to say it's fun, but I think I'll just say it's more maddening than anything else.



Makes for good conversation, if nothing else !!!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

One thing I should say is,

If the reports (various sources) were true about The Bulls coveting Thomas for the last couple of months, why wouldn't they make a promise? Plus having Livingston work him out, they get the inside scoop DAILY.

Remember Livingston & Thomas's coach both said they'd be shocked if they Bulls didn't take him. ALSO, with Thomas telling everybody that he was a lock for Chicago? C'mon now ya'll, something is up and it's probably already been a done deal for some time now.

Aldridge is still my pick, but I wouldn't be mad drafting ANY of the BIG 3.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*




such sweet thunder said:


> One more note. If Roy is your guy and you know Charlotte likes Tyrus Thomas and you wanted to use your leverage to force Charlotte to trade up, you would position yourself exactly like the Bulls have: leak to Tyrus's people that he is your pick, but at the same time give consistent information that you would also be interested in Roy. This makes Charlotte know that you are considering their guy, but could be convinced to trade the pick and select Roy instead. It will be quite a sleuth accomplishment if Paxson is able to coax a trade with Charlotte for the three pick on draft day.


Yeah, but maybe Charlotte is only saying that they like Thomas so that Paxson will think that they like him, knowing that he will bluff and say that Tyrus is his pick, and so that he will take the chance and make the pick and try to trade down to get Roy, but Charlotte drafts Roy instead, knowing that Portland has leaked that it is looking at Roy as part of a package to trade to Toronto for the rights to Bargnani.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> Yeah, but maybe Charlotte is only saying that they like Thomas so that Paxson will think that they like him, knowing that he will bluff and say that Tyrus is his pick, and so that he will take the chance and make the pick and try to trade down to get Roy, but Charlotte drafts Roy instead, knowing that Portland has leaked that it is looking at Roy as part of a package to trade to Toronto for the rights to Bargnani.


That makes alot of sense also.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> Yeah, but maybe Charlotte is only saying that they like Thomas so that Paxson will think that they like him, knowing that he will bluff and say that Tyrus is his pick, and so that he will take the chance and make the pick and try to trade down to get Roy, but Charlotte drafts Roy instead, knowing that Portland has leaked that it is looking at Roy as part of a package to trade to Toronto for the rights to Bargnani.


Man in Black: All right. Where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right... and who is dead.
Vizzini: But it's so simple. All I have to do is divine from what I know of you: are you the sort of man who would put the poison into his own goblet or his enemy's? Now, a clever man would put the poison into his own goblet, because he would know that only a great fool would reach for what he was given. I am not a great fool, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool, you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.
Man in Black: You've made your decision then?
Vizzini: Not remotely. Because iocane comes from Australia, as everyone knows, and Australia is entirely peopled with criminals, and criminals are used to having people not trust them, as you are not trusted by me, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you.
Man in Black: Truly, you have a dizzying intellect.
Vizzini: Wait til I get going! Now, where was I?
Man in Black: Australia.
Vizzini: Yes, Australia. And you must have suspected I would have known the powder's origin, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.
Man in Black: You're just stalling now.
Vizzini: You'd like to think that, wouldn't you? You've beaten my giant, which means you're exceptionally strong, so you could've put the poison in your own goblet, trusting on your strength to save you, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you. But, you've also bested my Spaniard, which means you must have studied, and in studying you must have learned that man is mortal, so you would have put the poison as far from yourself as possible, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.
Man in Black: You're trying to trick me into giving away something. It won't work.
Vizzini: IT HAS WORKED! YOU'VE GIVEN EVERYTHING AWAY! I KNOW WHERE THE POISON IS!
Man in Black: Then make your choice.
Vizzini: I will, and I choose - What in the world can that be?
Vizzini: [Vizzini gestures up and away from the table. Roberts looks. Vizzini swaps the goblets]
Man in Black: What? Where? I don't see anything.
Vizzini: Well, I- I could have sworn I saw something. No matter.First, let's drink. Me from my glass, and you from yours.
Man in Black, Vizzini: [they drink ]
Man in Black: You guessed wrong.
Vizzini: You only think I guessed wrong! That's what's so funny! I switched glasses when your back was turned! Ha ha! You fool! You fell victim to one of the classic blunders! The most famous is never get involved in a land war in Asia, but only slightly less well-known is this: never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha...
Vizzini: [Vizzini stops suddenly, and falls dead to the right]
Buttercup: And to think, all that time it was your cup that was poisoned.
Man in Black: They were both poisoned. I spent the last few years building up an immunity to iocane powder.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Remember Livingston & Thomas's coach both said they'd be shocked if they Bulls didn't take him. ALSO, with Thomas telling everybody that he was a lock for Chicago? C'mon now ya'll, something is up and it's probably already been a done deal for some time now.


I don't put too much stock in that. Coaches want their player to go high in the draft an so they hype up their player. It's pretty unlikely that Toronto would take Thomas (with their own 3/4 tweener and established PF) so Chicago is as high as they could reasonably hype him.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> I don't put too much stock in that. Coaches want their player to go high in the draft an so they hype up their player. It's pretty unlikely that Toronto would take Thomas (with their own 3/4 tweener and established PF) so Chicago is as high as they could reasonably hype him.


If he's a top 5 pick barnone, why not hype him to #1? They obviously believe in him enough that Chicago won't pass him up. How come with all this confidence he speaks of, he isn't talking about being #1?

Like I said, it's probably already been a done deal. I don't ever recall a year where a coach got a fully written article describing why his former player would be taken but a certain team who wasn't a BONAFIDE #1 pick.

How ironic is it that this information didn't leak until AFTER today's workout?

Something's up, my spidey sense is tingling.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> If he's a top 5 pick barnone, why not hype him to #1? They obviously believe in him enough that Chicago won't pass him up. How come with all this confidence he speaks of, he isn't talking about being #1?
> 
> Like I said, it's probably already been a done deal. I don't ever recall a year where a coach got a fully written article describing why his former player would be taken but a certain team who wasn't a BONAFIDE #1 pick.
> 
> How ironic is it that this information didn't leak until AFTER today's workout?
> 
> Something's up, my spidey sense is tingling.


Yeah, you're probably right. But I do so like Roy.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> If he's a top 5 pick barnone, why not hype him to #1? They obviously believe in him enough that Chicago won't pass him up. How come with all this confidence he speaks of, he isn't talking about being #1?
> 
> Like I said, it's probably already been a done deal. I don't ever recall a year where a coach got a fully written article describing why his former player would be taken but a certain team who wasn't a BONAFIDE #1 pick.
> 
> How ironic is it that this information didn't leak until AFTER today's workout?
> 
> Something's up, my spidey sense is tingling.


Because, like I said, hyping him up to number 1 would not be believable and would therefor be counter productive. Who is going to buy Thomas' coach saying Toronto is going to take him when Colangelo has been scouting Bargnani forever, Charlie V. is a young and talented 3/4 tweener, and Bosh is a star 4? Thomas to Chicago at #2 is very believable.

I'm not saying that it's not possible that the Coach and Livingston are telling the truth, I'm just saying that there is reason to believe they might not be telling the truth.


----------



## jnrjr79

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> Man in Black: All right. Where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right... and who is dead.
> Vizzini: But it's so simple. All I have to do is divine from what I know of you: are you the sort of man who would put the poison into his own goblet or his enemy's? Now, a clever man would put the poison into his own goblet, because he would know that only a great fool would reach for what he was given. I am not a great fool, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool, you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.
> Man in Black: You've made your decision then?
> Vizzini: Not remotely. Because iocane comes from Australia, as everyone knows, and Australia is entirely peopled with criminals, and criminals are used to having people not trust them, as you are not trusted by me, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you.
> Man in Black: Truly, you have a dizzying intellect.
> Vizzini: Wait til I get going! Now, where was I?
> Man in Black: Australia.
> Vizzini: Yes, Australia. And you must have suspected I would have known the powder's origin, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.
> Man in Black: You're just stalling now.
> Vizzini: You'd like to think that, wouldn't you? You've beaten my giant, which means you're exceptionally strong, so you could've put the poison in your own goblet, trusting on your strength to save you, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you. But, you've also bested my Spaniard, which means you must have studied, and in studying you must have learned that man is mortal, so you would have put the poison as far from yourself as possible, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.
> Man in Black: You're trying to trick me into giving away something. It won't work.
> Vizzini: IT HAS WORKED! YOU'VE GIVEN EVERYTHING AWAY! I KNOW WHERE THE POISON IS!
> Man in Black: Then make your choice.
> Vizzini: I will, and I choose - What in the world can that be?
> Vizzini: [Vizzini gestures up and away from the table. Roberts looks. Vizzini swaps the goblets]
> Man in Black: What? Where? I don't see anything.
> Vizzini: Well, I- I could have sworn I saw something. No matter.First, let's drink. Me from my glass, and you from yours.
> Man in Black, Vizzini: [they drink ]
> Man in Black: You guessed wrong.
> Vizzini: You only think I guessed wrong! That's what's so funny! I switched glasses when your back was turned! Ha ha! You fool! You fell victim to one of the classic blunders! The most famous is never get involved in a land war in Asia, but only slightly less well-known is this: never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha...
> Vizzini: [Vizzini stops suddenly, and falls dead to the right]
> Buttercup: And to think, all that time it was your cup that was poisoned.
> Man in Black: They were both poisoned. I spent the last few years building up an immunity to iocane powder.



:clap: :clap: 


Funniest. Scene. Ever.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I just got off the phone with a Chicago reporter, he lifted up the blinds, and he MIGHT have seen Gay torching Morrison. And they got a directional mic, so they could hear his lips instead of having to read them.

Apparrently Paxson was saying "Oh boy, I enjoy this soy cereal, it destroys my bad cholesterol, oh look at this joy, theres a toy in the box, its a model horse from Troy."


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> Because, like I said, hyping him up to number 1 would not be believable and would therefor be counter productive. Who is going to buy Thomas' coach saying Toronto is going to take him when Colangelo has been scouting Bargnani forever, Charlie V. is a young and talented 3/4 tweener, and Bosh is a star 4? Thomas to Chicago at #2 is very believable.
> 
> I'm not saying that it's not possible that the Coach and Livingston are telling the truth, I'm just saying that there is reason to believe they might not be telling the truth.


agreed


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Apparrently Paxson was saying "Oh boy, I enjoy this soy cereal, it destroys my bad cholesterol, oh look at this joy, theres a toy in the box, its a model horse from Troy."



Belated, but funny none the less.


Did they also report what flavor of humble pie Tyrus Thomas ate the night before his Bulls workout?


----------



## Guest

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



chifaninca said:


> Belated, but funny none the less.


Agree that it is belated. Respectfully disagree otherwise.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1357

vids of the top prospects and team needs courtesy of the nbatv


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The Roy, thanks for the link. It's better than the Yahoo ones I posted which showed the same clip in 5 different angles for half the viewing time.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> The Roy, thanks for the link. It's better than the Yahoo ones I posted which showed the same clip in 5 different angles for half the viewing time.


These guys don't seem to have a CLUE though.

They didn't really speak highly of Aldridge, calling raw and said he was just a "tip in" type of guy right now but has alot to work oun.

But RAVED about Thomas, saying he was skilled offensively and a beast defensively. And that he could be Amare-like if he put on 25 pounds..

Not really diggin' their observations lol


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Itis better presentation than Yahoo, but they don't know their stuff. I agree. But it's something to watch, haha.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

They also compared Maurice Ager and I think that was on the money. In his highlights, he looked like he could explode any time offensively, he's fast as hell and loves to slash.

At 6"4, I don't know if he's the ideal SG we're looking for though.

Ronnie Brewer looks ALOT like Josh Howard on defense and on the fastbreak. They compared the two also. VERY excited about him, he plays the passinglanes VERY well. I didn't know he throws down on dunks so HARD!


----------



## Amareca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1357
> 
> vids of the top prospects and team needs courtesy of the nbatv


what a bunch of crap.

Carney is 6'5 and they keep saying he has great length for the mondern day SF.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Amareca said:


> what a bunch of crap.
> 
> Carney is 6'5 and they keep saying he has great length for the mondern day SF.


I think this was probably recorded before the measurements came out


----------



## eljam

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

You just killed my productivity for the rest of the work day... LOL  



The ROY said:


> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1357
> 
> vids of the top prospects and team needs courtesy of the nbatv


----------



## Amareca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> I think this was probably recorded before the measurements came out


No they kept talking about the great combine results for some of those guys didn't they?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Amareca said:


> what a bunch of crap.
> 
> Carney is 6'5 and they keep saying he has great length for the mondern day SF.


He's closer to 6'6" than 6'5" and he does have pretty long arms (significantly longer than Roy's). But obviously he doesn't have great length for a SF.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Cedric Simmons reminds me of a more athletic Brendan Haywood.

Not diggin' him LOL


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

OH MY GOD

I see why Bosh doesn't like Bargnani

HE LIT HIS *** up in that game when they played the Raptors LLMAO!

Bargnani's alot more athletic than Dirk. That kid's gonna be GOOD, geez


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Amareca said:


> No they kept talking about the great combine results for some of those guys didn't they?


i dunno

but they were talking about bargnani and said they were in the SEMI finals.

so this had to have been before mesurements


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Roy looks alot like a SG version of Kirk Hinrich.

Even in his highlights, he just looks like an all-around good player but not great at anything.

The "Wade" talk needs to stop lol

He definintely doesn't look like a guy you take #2


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

RealGM's updated take on Chicago's #2 pick :



> 2. Chicago: The Bulls, and I, were high on LaMarcus Aldridge but things change and Tyrus Thomas is too good. Ask any coach and if two guys are of even talent he’ll always take the one who hasn’t been coached up yet. That said, these two are not of even heart. Don’t believe the Brandon Roy stuff, this is just to get teams to think of moving up.


more about other teams



> 3. Charlotte: Rudy Gay, plain and simple. Bickerstaff is on record as saying he’s not sure how Adam Morrison will translate to the pros, and B2 doesn’t mince words or throw smoke screens.





> 4. Portland: I’m hearing more and more things about them going another way, but I think in the end Nate McMillan gets his way and the Blazers will get Washington star Brandon Roy. Seattle would LOVE to move here and snag him though. That’d be just the thing to get Sonics fans to show up again.





> 5. Atlanta: Ok, so now we’re at 5 and Marcus Williams, Adam Morrison nor LaMarcus Aldridge are all on the board. Billy Knight has been quoted as saying that he’ll take the best player available and let the coach figure it out, but everyone seems to think the Hawks need a true PG. He’s such an idiot he has yet to work out any of the Top 6 players. I say he takes Aldridge and shows Jason Terry the money. That’s if he doesn’t shock everyone and take Patrick O’Bryant #1 overall.


LOL


> - Mark my words: Some 7’ Euro dude will come out of the stands in a 9-button suit and shake hands with the Commissioner at the end of the 1st Round. And Mr. Stern won’t be quite sure if it’s actually the guy that was just drafted.


LMAO!


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Any exciting info or surprises in Chad Ford's latest mock draft?


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> These guys don't seem to have a CLUE though.
> 
> They didn't really speak highly of Aldridge, calling raw and said he was just a "tip in" type of guy right now but has alot to work oun.
> 
> But RAVED about Thomas, saying he was skilled offensively and a beast defensively. And that he could be Amare-like if he put on 25 pounds..
> 
> Not really diggin' their observations lol


You know the guy sitting in the middle, Ryan Blake, is the assistant director of NBA scouting. I assume hes the person how helps advise college players for the NBA on their potential draft selection to help them decide if they should declare. That would make him, by far, the most qualified person who can openly comment on the draft. He would also be more in the loop on how individual teams rank prospects than any other person. I actually think their commentary is superb and surprisingly honest: they both were quite hard on Guillermo Diaz, Josh Boone and Lamarcus Aldridge. . . not what you would expect on from the NBA propaganda site.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

_You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to such sweet thunder again._


(that's for vizzini, too - hilarious!)


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> You know the guy sitting in the middle, Ryan Blake, is the assistant director of NBA scouting. I assume hes the person how helps advise college players for the NBA on their potential draft selection to help them decide if they should declare. That would make him, by far, the most qualified person who can openly comment on the draft. He would also be more in the loop on how individual teams rank prospects than any other person. I actually think their commentary is superb and surprisingly honest: they both were quite hard on Guillermo Diaz, Josh Boone and Lamarcus Aldridge. . . not what you would expect on from the NBA propaganda site.


I'm not saying they weren't on the money with some of the picks...but they aren't always accurate either...no one is


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Insider UPDATED :

You cannot post Insider or other subscription articles quoted verbatim. Sorry.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Roy looks alot like a SG version of Kirk Hinrich.
> 
> Even in his highlights, he just looks like an all-around good player but not great at anything.
> 
> The "Wade" talk needs to stop lol
> 
> He definintely doesn't look like a guy you take #2


I think I would take a OG version of Hinrich at #2 this year.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Hustle said:


> I think I would take a OG version of Hinrich at #2 this year.


I don't think we need more of the same personally....

Brewer makes more sense to me and we wouldn't have to give up #2 to get him...

Longer, more athletic, better slasher, better defender, better on the break


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The ROY, does Chad Ford mention why he sees teh Bulls liking Tyrus? Did Chad observe the workout that had an article regarding Tyrus working out w/Randy Livingston a few weeks back in Insider? 

Wow. Toronto still had people in Europe scouting Bargnani.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

All i know is if atlanta is taking williams someone is going to fall out of the top six and to boston? If there is someone looking too trade up it will be to get bostons pick at seven.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> The ROY, does Chad Ford mention why he sees teh Bulls liking Tyrus? Did Chad observe the workout that had an article regarding Tyrus working out w/Randy Livingston a few weeks back in Insider?
> 
> Wow. Toronto still had people in Europe scouting Bargnani.


nah, he didn't say anything more than the little bit that I posted. Hell it felt like something I've already read by him LOL


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

From Insider (Ford) :

Can't quote Insider

Yeah, there were 5 things but ugh, the rest weren't important lol


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Check out this quote form Ryan Blake, the Assistant Director of NBA scouting on Brandon Roy's Improvement:

At 2:50, of http://boss.streamos.com/wmedia/nba/nbacom/draft/draftprofile_roy_b.asx

When you get a database together sometimes you are starting in highschool. For Brandon, he declared for the draft out of high school and pulled his name back out and went to Washington, and had an average first year. But you watched him progress, because he was also a guy that kept going, "Okay, I might come out this year." And we were going, "Well why? You're not doing this. . . Oh, well now you are. Well now you're not showing your range game. You're not showing you can make others better." And then he did. Now his cofidence has became whole. When you see that you go, I think this guy could help a team. You're going to see him move up the draft ladder. When teams can't decide whether or not they need an off-guard or a small forward or a point, you may have a little bit of each in Brandon. 

This is the guy that puts files together to help players decide if they should go pro. Pretty interesting compliments from someone who has been scouting him since high-school.


----------



## rwj333

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

This is probably obvious information or a repost, but I just remembered this and it blew my mind. 

Remember when the Raptors played an exhibition game in Europe 2 years ago and almost lost? (The team was Donyell Marshall, Chris Bosh, Jalen Rose, Vince Carter, Morris Peterson, etc.) Well, the team they played was Benetton Trevisio! With, yes, Andrea Bargnani. I was able to find an excerpt of an article from Draftexpress that isn't up anymore. 



> Andrea Bargnani, the 6-11 Italian prospect, had a great performace in the exhibition game played by Benetton Treviso against Toronto Raptors in Canada last Wednesday. The young promising forward scored 13 points (6/15 from the field), grabbed 5 rebounds and blocked 2 shots in 22 minutes, while matching with NBA sophomore talent Chris Bosh. Benetton finally lost the game by just 3 points.
> 
> His coach, the much respected Ettore Messina, spoke about his player’s bright future. “I guess now, more than before, not only us will talk about Andrea Barnani as a future draft pick. I wish it for the player, but above all I hope he understands how better is to arrive at the proffesional world of the NBA as a mature player, with a loaded European baggage of experience and victories. Like, Danilovic, Ginobili, Divac, Jaric and co.: prestigious players who assured themselves to be respected in that new environment, and also with enough level to be instant contributors and not only future hopes”, reports Il Gazzettino.
> 
> “I agree with the coach –assured Bargnani- better to make the big jump with enough level to not fail. But at this moment, in the first place I’m not sure if I’ll ever have this chance, and in the second place, I don’t think about it at all. I’m focused just in Benetton and my development work to improve, grow and complete my game. Of course, I will remember this game, but I’m sure reading the stats or the praises won’t go to my head. I know I have to prove myself day after day, game after game. I hope to show improvement also in the Italian league and in the Euroleague, not only in an exhibition game, as prestigious as this is.”


I still don't think the European league is that strong, but this definitely raises my opinion of Bargnani. 

http://forums.interbasket.net/showthread.php?p=30 ... That's the link where someone pasted the excerpt.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Uh oh, Could it be a Nene, Sene and Break Me (Chandler) Front court?

It appears (or atleast it's rumored) that Sene had a very impressive workout for the Bullies.

Sene wows the Bulls 

And there is a clip there as well.


It's also said that he's gonna work out again for Karl Malone and Utah. Then Houston. This guy is like Thomas - out of nowhere to a lottery pick. 

I can see the following scenario: We draft Roy at 2, then draft Sene at 16..........Ooops, Utah takes him before us and Brewer is on the board at 16....What do you? 

Ahhhhh the draft....I love this game.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Posted this in the Sene thread as well:

It was nice to finally see some footage of him though, he really attacks the boards and those long arms seem to block everything arund the rim. On defense he looked like a 7' foot Tyrus Thomas to me when he was blocking those shots, he just outjumped everyone and stuffed them, just like Thomas did in the NCAA tournament.

I'm all for drafting Sene at #16, and it sounds like the Bulls staff liked him very much as well. I love the "_He might be the longest person in the world!_" comment. 

Bargnani and Sene is officially my dream draft, especially now after Splitter isn't declaring.



chifaninca said:


> Uh oh, Could it be a Nene, Sene and Break Me (Chandler) Front court?


That is almost too good to be true! Defense? Offense? You've got it!


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> It seems unlikely the Bulls would select Gay at No. 2. As Bulls guard Ben Gordon, a fellow UConn product, said when asked about Gay: "He's a good player, but he's the same type of player as Luol Deng. So he doesn't seem to make sense for us.''


http://www.suntimes.com/output/bulls/cst-spt-bull20.html

This coming from a player that has had close encounter with Gay as a fellow Uconn player. and Gordon has said all year long his followed their games closely also. Not saying Gay is not a good player. but even Gordon says that he is pretty much the same player ad Deng. meaning that he probably thinks Deng is better for the team but in a subtle way..


----------



## SecretAgentGuy

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Well this is a little interesting tid bit on the other board, courtesy of the Oregonian.

http://www.oregonlive.com/weblogs/b...ive_blazersbeat/archives/2006_06.html#1529433



> Meanwhile, Tyrus Thomas of LSU pulled out of his solo workout for the Blazers that had been scheduled for Tuesday. *Art Sasse, Blazers vice president of communication, said Thomas’ agent informed the Blazers that a team with a higher pick had promised it would select Thomas.* Speculation is that Chicago is the team that has targeted Thomas.


Looks like he was promised afterall.


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> Blazers vice president of communication, said Thomas’ agent informed the Blazers that a team with a higher pick had promised it would select Thomas.


Thomas' agent's word is the last thing I would trust.


----------



## SecretAgentGuy

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



step said:


> Thomas' agent's word is the last thing I would trust.


 Not I. What does his agent have to gain by declining to workout for the team with the 4th pick overall and fabricating a story about how his client was promised? He has everything to lose and nothing to gain. If this quote is accurate then Tyrus is going top 3. Now the question is to who.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



step said:


> Thomas' agent's word is the last thing I would trust.


any agent as a matter of fact. whether considering rookies or free agents.

this whole process is like a game of chess for them. you can never believe anything that they say. its all about battle of tactics to get their guy as high as possible.

potential reason for his agent to have said what he said is that maybe T.Thomas's stock is indeed going down... who knows. its all a guessing game.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sp00k said:


> Not I. What does his agent have to gain by declining to workout for the team with the 4th pick overall and fabricating a story about how his client was promised? He has everything to lose and nothing to gain. If this quote is accurate then Tyrus is going top 3. Now the question is to who.


i don't think there is everything to gain and nothing to lose. his stock could be going down so his agent may be positioning thomas to think he is still highly regarded for potential teams that had interested in him further down the draft to force them to trade up to get him with a high pick. but thats purely a different way of viewing the situation...


----------



## SecretAgentGuy

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> any agent as a matter of fact. whether considering rookies or free agents.
> 
> this whole process is like a game of chess for them. you can never believe anything that they say. its all about battle of tactics to get their guy as high as possible.
> 
> potential reason for his agent to have said what he said is that maybe T.Thomas's stock is indeed going down... who knows. its all a guessing game.


 If his stock is going down then why take yourself out of the running for the 4th overall pick?


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sp00k said:


> If his stock is going down then why take yourself out of the running for the 4th overall pick?


to get the teams that have lower picks to trade up for higher picks to pick him thats why. im sure there are a tone of teams that would love to have him who don't have a high pick. so "claim" that he is going higher that would mean that teams would have to trade up with one of the teams with the top picks. thats what my point was. the agents goal is to get them as high as possible. maybe his agent thought his draft position was slipping so to insure that he remains a top 3-4 pick. he decline the portland work out and claimed a top 3 team gave him a promise as leverage for other teams that love him. OR the agent could be doing one of the top 3 teams a favour being putting that rumour out to get the other teams to work out a trade with them to get them to trade up for a top 3 pick. 

Yes. long winded. but i had to get my point across. and im not saying your right or im wrong. im just giving you another perspective on the whole comment..


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Didn't Thomas' coach say that the off the court stuff would be the hardest for Thomas to adjust to? Maybe they're trying to keep Thomas away from Portland for those reasons.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> Didn't Thomas' coach say that the off the court stuff would be the hardest for Thomas to adjust to? Maybe they're trying to keep Thomas away from Portland for those reasons.


makes sense...

I wouldn't want that kid in portland either...


----------



## McBulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sp00k said:


> Not I. What does his agent have to gain by declining to workout for the team with the 4th pick overall and fabricating a story about how his client was promised? He has everything to lose and nothing to gain. If this quote is accurate then Tyrus is going top 3. Now the question is to who.


I agree. Credibility may not be the most important concern of an agent, but you don't just throw it away for nothing. My guess is that Jordan persuaded Charlotte to issue the guarantee.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

We all know who he got a promise from...

Why act like we don't? lol

"I wanted them to take Aldridge, but I could see why they want Thomas so badly" --- Chad Ford


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Rlucas or someone who really wants Thomas, please share why this guy should be our pick. I was all for him at 16 when the tourney started. But at 2, I was all about Aldridge or Bargnani. I thought Roy would be top 7. Again, Thomas, top 16. 

I'm just searching for what beyond hype and shot blocking he brings? 

So help me and others who would dread this decision come to the light.


----------



## thebullybully

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



chifaninca said:


> Rlucas or someone who really wants Thomas, please share why this guy should be our pick. I was all for him at 16 when the tourney started. But at 2, I was all about Aldridge or Bargnani. I thought Roy would be top 7. Again, Thomas, top 16.
> 
> I'm just searching for what beyond hype and shot blocking he brings?
> 
> So help me and others who would dread this decision come to the light.



I was pretty pro Thomas for a while, and it's not just shot blocking. It's a super athletic ability to come out of no where and make a play on the defensive or offensive side. All those missed layups and even bad passes seem to fall into his hands, and he'd be a wonder in a defensive scheme like Skiles' with the speed to get between his man and his help assignments, though a bit of coaching would be required there in the decision making. Clearly Skiles is capable of getting guys to play good D.

That said, however, I think I'm turning my hopes elsewhere not for any shortcomings of Thomas', but for going for legitimate (I do understand a dominant presence is not available for the trading, drafting, or free-agenting) size and inside presence (even if it's a trade of that #2 pick.) Then I'd hold that freaky athlete spot open for next years class and Julian Wright who is all the things Thomas is, but with the added bonus of passing. Seriously beautiful passing. Even Tyson would look like he has good hands.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Well we do know some things about the draft and thomas. First, the bulls are done working players out. Second, Thomas pulled out of his workout with the Blazers so i think it likely he is going in the top 3. In addtion, if the bulls are trading down it is not with Portland because if it was Thomas would be working out for portland. We know the Raptors are going to take Bangnani so if thomas is going in the top 2 it is not number one so either he has a agreement with the bobcats (who already are deep at PF and i hear they are going with either Morrison or Gay) or Thomas is coming to Chicago. And from what i can read every mock draft has Thomas being taking by the bulls. And i just mentioned to rlucus is is possible that paxson is taking two big men and wants thomas and Sere. I wonder i know we need a big SG but Sene and Thomas would along with Chandler would really make us big, long, and athletic up front and what a great future three man rotation. I dont know maybe pax is blowing smoke to get someone to trade down and by pushing Sene into the top 15 a SG like carney or brewer will fall to 16.

david


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> Well we do know some things about the draft and thomas. First, the bulls are done working players out. Second, Thomas pulled out of his workout with the Blazers so i think it likely he is going in the top 3. In addtion, if the bulls are trading down it is not with Portland because if it was Thomas would be working out for portland. We know the Raptors are going to take Bangnani so if thomas is going in the top 2 it is not number one so either he has a agreement with the bobcats (who already are deep at PF and i hear they are going with either Morrison or Gay) or Thomas is coming to Chicago. And from what i can read every mock draft has Thomas being taking by the bulls. And i just mentioned to rlucus is is possible that paxson is taking two big men and wants thomas and Sere. I wonder i know we need a big SG but Sene and Thomas would along with Chandler would really make us big, long, and athletic up front and what a great future three man rotation. I dont know maybe pax is blowing smoke to get someone to trade down and by pushing Sene into the top 15 a SG like carney or brewer will fall to 16.
> 
> david


What if we are trading with the Suns for Marion, Pacers for O'neal, T-Wolves for Garnett, etc...maybe Thomas is one of THEIR picks. Doesn't seem likely, I think we are drafting Thomas but I was surprised we didn't bring him back for a more complete workout.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Ace,

Very good point. His workout did really seem short and you would have guessed they would bring him back. Mayge pax does have a trade lined up but if so who? Thomas has only worked out for teams in the top3?

david


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> Ace,
> 
> Very good point. His workout did really seem short and you would have guessed they would bring him back. Mayge pax does have a trade lined up but if so who? Thomas has only worked out for teams in the top3?
> 
> david



true but doesn't mean that Phoenix hasn't scouted him a whole lot throughout his career and wants him. If I had to guess, I would say if we aren't drafting Thomas for ourselves (I think we are) that it would be a deal with the Suns for Marion since the Suns have a ridiculous scouting staff and just that the Suns are trying to deal Marion for some strange unfathomable reason.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> What if we are trading with the Suns for Marion, Pacers for O'neal, T-Wolves for Garnett, etc...maybe Thomas is one of THEIR picks. Doesn't seem likely, I think we are drafting Thomas but I was surprised we didn't bring him back for a more complete workout.


Thomas as part of the Suns deal makes some sense. Because the owner could play it off as they are getting everything they get from Marion, only for cheaper.


----------



## different_13

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Just reading through hoopshype, and they mention how maybe Thomas is being picked at 2 for a trade (and that he knows it).

so i was wondering, who could this be to? (feasibly)

things to take into consideration - there's rumours Orlando and Houston are swapping picks.
I was gonna say maybe Chicago trade him to Houston, but that would mean houston getting rid of Swift or Howard, so i think it unlikely.

Danny Ainge is apparantly high on Thomas, so maybe there's something behind the Jefferson and #7 for #2 talks, with Jefferson as the young backup 4 that can be developed. Chicago COULD then possibly get Roy at 7, IF:
1 Bargnani
2 Thomas
3 Gay
4 Morrison
5 Shelden Williams / Marcus Williams
6 LaMarcus Aldridge / Marcus Williams / Randy Foye (who they apparantly really like)

i think that order is FEASIBLE, but not definite of course. (it would also be possible to get Aldridge there, but I doubt it. However, I see Foye as more viable for Mini than Aldridge, so you never know)


Another possible option, which is pure speculation on my part - Chicago trade #2 to Seattle for #10 and a sign/traded Chris Wilcox. This could happen if he wants more money than they are willing to give (with the current ownership issues...), but this way Seattle still get something back for him. A #2 pick is obviously cheaper than Chris Wilcox, and Tyrus Thomas is a perfect way of adding athleticism and shotblocking at the 4 (or even the 3 in the future, maybe).

At 10, i see the bulls then drafting Ronnie Brewer, then Sene at 16.

that would give:

C FA (Przybilia?) / Sene / Harrington
PF Wilcox / Chandler / Sweetney or Allen or Songaila
SF Nocioni / Deng
SG Gordon / Brewer
PG Hinrich / Duhon

then add a third string guard, perhaps simply pargo; and a thirdstring swingman (veteran, such as Shandon Anderson) and your set for at least the second round, i'd say, with youth aplenty (Wilcox is only..23? 24?)


Looking at it, even though i don't think it'll happen, I think that would actually work for both teams (well, the Seattle ownership more than their team... but still!)



Lastly, if Extremely unlikely - #2 (Tyrus Thomas) to New Orleans for #12, #15 and David West (or something similar), allowing Chicago to take either Carney or Brewer at 12 (i think), Sene at 15 and perhaps trade 16? for a 1st in 2007? Apparantly Miami and San Antonio are looking to move into the draft, and at 16 SA could select Oleksiy Pecherov (fitting the euro theme) or that Swiss swingman, or Miami could select a pg such as Farmar, Lowry or even Rondo (to replace Payton and add youth, as this gives miami a future at 1-4 (Lowry, Wade, ...Wright and Haslem/Simien, all quite young).

The 2007 first would likely fall somewhere between 24 and 30, which at the moment are mostly guards (using draft.net). Though Aaron Gray might be there, and apparantly Paxson likes him.

All this is pure fantasy on my part of course.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I agree and think there may be a trade in the works but if so with whom?

Most of the teams in the lotto dont really have much to offer or what would be worth taking they are unlikely to be offering. And if pax is trading down it is to take Roy and he should be in the top 6 or 7 so teams like bos, minny, and Portland are not going to give away the store for thomas.

But it does smell like a trade.

david


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I don't think we will draft Tyrus and trade him. He just hasn't worked out for a lot of teams. I do think teams would love to grab him. But we won't trade him to a team that gives us a large contract, killing any shot of us getting a big man.

If we do a trade, I don't see us going below 7, unless it's to a team like NOK, where we would get their two picks. But, I don't see Pax doing that either unless we get an established young player. If we had picks 12,15, and 16 we would not be in a great draft position. We might get Brewer and Sene, but how much better is that than Aldridge and Thabo?

If we make a deal with Boston, Pax prolly won't have interest in a guy needing development in Gerald Green. He prolly won't be traded either. Al Jefferson showed promise his rookie year, but sucked horribly last year. We don't want anyone else.

I wish Atlanta had a reason to move up. We could move down to their spot, pick up Childress, and have a chance to grab Aldridge or Thomas (if they slip).


----------



## remlover

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

It's too bad for Thomas that he doesn't have the luxury like Bargnani who is only visible on a couple of tapes and box scores. 

I bet if we saw Bargnani as much as we have seen Thomas that there would be quite a few dissenters. I am curious for the Pro Bargnani crowd why you think he shoudl be our pick considering on offense he seems to live on the outside? How does that help our low post game? 

I bet the boards would be buzzing if all we had on Tyrus Thomas was his highlight tape and box scores from the Tourney. 

This post is not directed towards anyone in particular, just to all the Bargnani posters who always have him #1 on their list.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

chad's new blog says MJ is high on Brandon Roy for the 'Cat pick

http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=ford_chad#20060620

essentially looking for a "complete" player since he got burned on kwame.

but didn't roy cancel his charlotte workout? did i read that here?


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Looks like the Italian League finals are done!

Treviso 69 - Bologna 68

so-so game for Bargnani...

34 mins
8 pts
1-3 2pt
2-2 3pt
3 boards (all defensive)
1 block
1 assist

I wonder if he's gonna hightail it over to the states to hold a workout or two?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> chad's new blog says MJ is high on Brandon Roy for the 'Cat pick
> 
> http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=ford_chad#20060620
> 
> essentially looking for a "complete" player since he got burned on kwame.
> 
> but didn't roy cancel his charlotte workout? did i read that here?


Yes, Roy was under the weather, and didn't finish his first Charlotte workout. :raised_ey 

However, I believe he has another workout in Charlotte on Thursday.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

thanks DMD. yes i knew about the previous workout, but could've sworn i read someplace he cancelled the thurs. workout too.

draft fever has my brain looking like a fried egg right now.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



fl_flash said:


> I wonder if he's gonna hightail it over to the states to hold a workout or two?


I've been wondering that too, we should definitely work him out if he comes over.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> chad's new blog says MJ is high on Brandon Roy for the 'Cat pick
> 
> http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=ford_chad#20060620
> 
> essentially looking for a "complete" player since he got burned on kwame.
> 
> but didn't roy cancel his charlotte workout? did i read that here?


Wow. If Michael is still having players come in that means the promise to Tyrus Thomas came from [gulp] us.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

i also thought it was telling (from chad's blog) that apparently MJ doesn't like Rudy Gay for the Cat pick cause he feels Gay lacks "killer instinct".

and he would know "killer instinct".


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> Wow. If Michael is still having players come in that means the promise to Tyrus Thomas came from [gulp] us.


Why the gulp?

Can I get a "IN PAX WE TRUST!" up in here?


----------



## southpark

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

if it means anything, foxsports mock draft has us taking Roy at 2 and Oleksiy Pecherov (6-10 232 PF) at 16...I really hope we somehow trade for Brewer instead of Roy at 2

edit:
i wouldnt mind Thabo as a back up plan for #16


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Why the gulp?
> 
> Can I get a "IN PAX WE TRUST!" up in here?


 IN PAX WE TRUST!

Actually, I wouldn't be heartbroken if Pax drafted Thomas. I've watched a lot of game tape, and I still don't have a good feel for his game. If someone like Pax, who has a track record of drafting players with actual skills, feels like he is the way to go, I would give him the benefit of the doubt.

The 'gulp' is purely greed . I would love to be able to flip on a Bulls game next year and watch Roy play. It's a personal enjoyment thang.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



southpark said:


> if it means anything, foxsports mock draft has us taking Roy at 2 and Oleksiy Pecherov (6-10 232 PF) at 16...I really hope we somehow trade for Brewer instead of Roy at 2
> 
> edit:
> i wouldnt mind Thabo as a back up plan for #16


 Awesome! You guys know the rule: if its coming from fox news, it is truth. 


:biggrin:


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



southpark said:


> if it means anything, foxsports mock draft has us taking Roy at 2 and Oleksiy Pecherov (6-10 232 PF) at 16...I really hope we somehow trade for Brewer instead of Roy at 2
> 
> edit:
> i wouldnt mind Thabo as a back up plan for #16


Who is this Pecherov? I've seen him climbing up in mock drafts (NBADraft.net). Have you seen him play? Any info on him or who is looking to grab him? 

Put me in the category of "In Pax We Trust." Until Pax makes a total boneheaded move (aside from resigning Tyson), I will support him. He's proven to be successful in the draft. I will give him and Skiles the benefit of the doubt. What they have done in these past few years, few or if any GMs and Coaches could have with the makeup of our team.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Who is this Pecherov? I've seen him climbing up in mock drafts (NBADraft.net). Have you seen him play? Any info on him or who is looking to grab him?
> 
> Put me in the category of "In Pax We Trust." Until Pax makes a total boneheaded move (aside from resigning Tyson), I will support him. He's proven to be successful in the draft. I will give him and Skiles the benefit of the doubt. What they have done in these past few years, few or if any GMs and Coaches could have with the makeup of our team.


Pecherov's the dumbest guy in the draft.

During a workout with the Bucks, Terry Stotts said they were going to run a drill where they put the ball on the ground. Stotts passed the ball to Pecherov and Pecherov put the ball on the ground and walked away. Apparently during the workout, he got in a fight with an assistant coach and a fellow workoutee. And when they were playing a game, Stotts said next point wins, and Pecherov was inbounding, he threw it off a guys back, ran in grabbed the ball and dunked it and said he won.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Pecherov's the dumbest guy in the draft.
> 
> During a workout with the Bucks, Terry Stotts said they were going to run a drill where they put the ball on the ground. Stotts passed the ball to Pecherov and Pecherov put the ball on the ground and walked away. Apparently during the workout, he got in a fight with an assistant coach and a fellow workoutee. And when they were playing a game, Stotts said next point wins, and Pecherov was inbounding, he threw it off a guys back, ran in grabbed the ball and dunked it and said he won.


nvm, that was Fesenko, a fellow 6 foot 11 Ukranian.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> Is Brandon Roy MJ's guy?
> 
> A source close to Jordan told Insider over the weekend that for the last month Jordan has watched tape and been getting up to speed on the draft.Based on that background work and recommendations from Bobcats GM/coach Bernie Bickerstaff, Jordan has summoned four players to Charlotte for a Thursday workout for Jordan -- Texas' LaMarcus Aldridge, UConn's Rudy Gay, Washington's Brandon Roy and LSU's Tyrus Thomas.





> A source close to Jordan told Insider over the weekend that Jordan wasn't a huge fan of either Gay or Morrison. Morrison's agent, Marc Bartelstein, told Insider on Sunday that the Bobcats have not requested that Morrison return to work out in front of Jordan. According to the source, Jordan loves Morrison's toughness but doesn't think he has the athleticism to be a star in the league. The same source said that while Jordan thinks Gay has the athleticism to be a star, he believes Gay lacks the killer instinct that superstars like Jordan possess.





> The fact that Gay is coming back and Morrison isn't might be telling. Bickerstaff might be trying to convince Jordan that Gay has the inner fire he needs to be a star in the league.
> One rumor has the Bobcats swapping with the Hornets in a deal that would bring Charlotte the No. 12 and No. 15 picks along with J. R. Smith for the No. 3 pick. However, an NBA team source laughed off the rumor, saying that Smith is not a Bickerstaff-type of player.





> james (indy): I don't think there is any way the Bulls take Bargani where are you getting that info?
> 
> Andy Katz: He is on the board. I'm not for sure he's going there but he's a possibility.
> 
> Jay (Chicago): Bulls taking Bargnani? Do you know something we don't? He hasn't even worked out for them? Any news on who promised Thomas a top 3 pick?
> 
> Andy Katz: He won't work out for anyone since he's still playing in the Italian League playoffs. I didn't say it would happen but don't be surprised if it does.


nice tibits on bargnani's situation...from insider


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Yeah, I guess Tyrus Thomas got the garauntee from Jordan. He wanted athleticism, and fire....well attitude problems is what Thomas has....

If #3 can fetch 12, 15, and JR Smith, why can't 2?

Then we take two bigs at 12 and 15, preferably O'Bryant and Sene, but if O'Bryant doens't fall then Sene and Simmons works.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Did thomas even work out for Charlotte?!

Jordan wants Roy...they've made that pretty clear


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Based off Insider, would we or NOK do 12,15, and JR Smith for 2? I dunno if JR is a 'jib' guy, but he is talented for sure, and very young. That does leave us with 3 very late picks, which hurts us, unless we trade up using 2 of those. It's a reach regardless to have Brewer, Carney fall to us at 16. Would we be able to use 15 + 16 with Sweetney to go up 7? What if Tyrus or Aldridge fall? We could also pick up O'Bryant there? We would also have the 12th pick to pick up the BPA. Maybe we can grab Shelden there?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Who else would be willing to trade 2 for 12,15, and JR Smith? Count me in if Bargnani is off the board. I just hope we have some assurance that big men will fall to that 12,15, or 16, OR we make another trade to move up.

Kirk/Duhon
Gordon/JR Smith
Noce/Deng
Chandler/Shelden/Songalia
Pyrz or Nene/O'Bryant/Allen

I wonder what GSW does. I can see them picking O'Bryant. Possibly Seattle. I know got two centers, but they seem to have every position 'filled'.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I really don't think Paxson wants all that youth...

If you get J.R. Smith, what's the point of going after Brewer or Carney?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I agree. I don't know who would be the better player, Brewer or JR. I think Brewer is a better fit, and prolly a more 'polished' player. But he has yet to play a game in the NBA. First, I don't think we'd go for JR Smith. He comes off as anti-jib. Second, we would miss out on the best bigs by having 3 picks in the mid-1st round. I don't know what we would do.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Of no consequence to the Bulls. The guy who seems to be really moving up is an English bloke by the name of Joel Freeland. Apparently going to be picked late first early second. Pretty good for a guy who was on no ones radar a month ago. 6-11, athletic and really combative, or so I hear.


----------



## darlets

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Why the gulp?
> 
> Can I get a "IN PAX WE TRUST!" up in here?


In Pax we trust.

Things I like about Thomas from reading his background.

He grew late.
He had to out work and outhustle people when he was smaller.
He played guard in H.S.

I think there's a fair chance Thomas has alot more skill currently than he got to show in college.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

So right now, the top 5 is shaping up to be :

#1 - Bargnani (Still think Charlie's getting traded to Milwaukee for Magloire & Williams)
#2 - Thomas (Possibly will be traded)
#3 - Roy (Jordan's guy)
#4 - Morrison (Portland's man with Roy off the board)
#5 - Williams (Still don't get why, but good for them)

#6-10 is still up in the air.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> So right now, the top 5 is shaping up to be :
> 
> #1 - Bargnani (Still think Charlie's getting traded to Milwaukee for Magloire & Williams)
> #2 - Thomas (Possibly will be traded)
> #3 - Roy (Jordan's guy)
> #4 - Morrison (Portland's man with Roy off the board)
> #5 - Williams (Still don't get why, but good for them)
> 
> #6-10 is still up in the air.



Shelden or Marcus? If its Shelden, then Marcus Williams, Patrick Obryant are definetely in that 6-10 range with Gay. 


I think this Shelden Williams to Atlanta talk is just plain hooey.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> So right now, the top 5 is shaping up to be :
> 
> #1 - Bargnani (Still think Charlie's getting traded to Milwaukee for Magloire & Williams)
> #2 - Thomas (Possibly will be traded)
> #3 - Roy (Jordan's guy)
> #4 - Morrison (Portland's man with Roy off the board)
> #5 - Williams (Still don't get why, but good for them)
> 
> #6-10 is still up in the air.


Don't remember where I read this, but Williams is not guaranteed anything by Atlanta at #5. What I read was, someone saying that if one of the top bigs did not fall to 5, Atlanta will trade down to pick him at a more 'suitable' draft position.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Don't remember where I read this, but Williams is not guaranteed anything by Atlanta at #5. What I read was, someone saying that if one of the top bigs did not fall to 5, Atlanta will trade down to pick him at a more 'suitable' draft position.


It's been reported on insider that he has a promise from Atlanta at #5 and was told not to attend anymore workouts...


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



rlucas4257 said:


> Shelden or Marcus? If its Shelden, then Marcus Williams, Patrick Obryant are definetely in that 6-10 range with Gay.
> 
> 
> I think this Shelden Williams to Atlanta talk is just plain hooey.


It was Shelden

It makes no sense though, even the ESPN writers said this LOL but they did say Knight wants an experienced player...


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> It's been reported on insider that he has a promise from Atlanta at #5 and was told not to attend anymore workouts...


I wish I could remember where I read this. Might have been Hoopshype or something. But they want Shelden, just probably not at 5. Maybe they go down a few spots, like 7 or 8? Unless they can find a deal to move down, they will get him at 5 if Aldridge does not drop.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

i think in an insane world. I wouldn't mind getting both S.Williams & R.Brewer.

I think both fit in perfectly with the bulls. Both long and strong. Both great defenders. and both are gritty and no nonsense types of palyers.

I think Williams is a little under rated because his not a high flyer or isn't as tall as the other forwards. But i think he could be a Charles Oakley Remix type of player with longer arms and a much better athelete. I think the old school thick bodied leverage types of power forwards will be a hit again in the leauge. espically with the leauge becoming smaller. ala elton brand. similar type. not that big. both wide bodies. stronger upper and lower bodies. long arms. not fancy. gets it done.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'd like Shelden #16...but he's not a top 5 top of player....

He's a little too plain though....especially for the athletic, running team we're trying to build....

He'll be very good tho


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> I'd like Shelden #16...but he's not a top 5 top of player....
> 
> He's a little too plain though....especially for the athletic, running team we're trying to build....
> 
> He'll be very good tho



I agree, in a Kurt Thomas sort of way.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



rlucas4257 said:


> I agree, in a Kurt Thomas sort of way.


lol...yep


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

i just think his unfairly put in the "his hit his cieling" type of catergory. and his undermined because of players such as thomas who if anything is just a better athelete. well there are tones of great atheletes in the leauge that hasn't done much. 

yes. but i agree his not worth no.5 but as i said in an insane world those two would be good for our team. also i think he could fit into the team his not exactly slow. and i think if anything that we need is a bruiser type of player to protect our guards. like when we had A.D. I think we miss that type of strong presences in the paint that won't mind putting a player to the floor. i don't see thomas or a albridge doing that..


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I think Shelden is a lot closer to a young AD than Thomas. He's a much better shot blocker than Kurt Thomas is.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

A while back there was a thread about Pax not being a risk taker, and he has chosen the 'safe' picks of the draft for various reasons. The only one to my surprise was Ben. 

But my point is, IF Pax takes Tyrus at 2, does that change your view of him being a risk taker? Especially if Tyrus is picked if Aldridge is available? Just curious of your opinions. I think it'll be a somewhat risky pick, but not too risky. If Tyrus backs up his talk of being a hard worker, he has won games, has heart, and could turn out to a be a solid player.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'm not sure how anyone whose highest pick yet has been a 6'2" shooting guard can be accused of not taking risks.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> A while back there was a thread about Pax not being a risk taker, and he has chosen the 'safe' picks of the draft for various reasons. The only one to my surprise was Ben.
> 
> But my point is, IF Pax takes Tyrus at 2, does that change your view of him being a risk taker? Especially if Tyrus is picked if Aldridge is available? Just curious of your opinions. I think it'll be a somewhat risky pick, but not too risky. If Tyrus backs up his talk of being a hard worker, he has won games, has heart, and could turn out to a be a solid player.


I think with this uncertain draft class. he has not choice but to take a player that is abit of a risk. I think he has been pushed into that predicament to take a "gamble" of sorts with unexpectedly getting NY second pick. So if anytime was to make a gamble its this year. So i wouldn't suprised if he goes either way. going for a "solid" player from a good school. or taking a gamble on a high ceiling type of player. I just hope he doesn't do what Detriot did with the second pick when they got one as a luxury and took a far fetched reach type of gamble. Because Dumars is basically similar to Paxson in the no nonsense approach so who knows... we're just lucky enough that we have a good solid young core group already with flexibilty with free agency cap space to fall on.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> I'm not sure how anyone whose highest pick yet has been a 6'2" shooting guard can be accused of not taking risks.


Preach, Brah!


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I think the Gordon pick was obvious sign on Draft Day for Crawford should put his house up for sale and start packing his bags. I think he found a 'combo' guard as Crawford's replacement. Crawford you could say is also a 'combo' guard. A guy initially coming in as a PG, but who became a shooter. (I'm not trying to make this a Crawford vs Gordon. Just comparing how both play PG/SG-ish). 

So I do not think it was a risk. I think Gordon having won the championship in college, being the best player in the Big East Tourney, being coached by a guy similar to Skiles in Calhoun (hardnosed), it wasn't a risky pick. This is not to say that Pax should have passed Gordon to pick an unproven guy in Livingston (who I think will be a top 3 PG in 2 years).

Now if we pick Roy at 2, is it a sign for Gordon to pack his bags? I dunno. I agree with most of these picks being 'unproven.' I think a riskier pick would be if we trade down a few spots and grab a guy like O'Bryant. A guy who is young, but has potential. But since there are no LBJ's or Duncans, we have no idea if this will be a solid draft class or another the horrible NBA Draft similar like 2000 (Fizer, Crawford).


----------



## darlets

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Just as a exercise to see how this years draft stacks up against last year, below is the top 7 players as listed by nbadraft from 2005 and 2006. In what order do you think they'd get drafted if the drafts were combined?????

Andrea Bargnani 6-11 240 PF Italy 1985 
Tyrus Thomas 6-8 217 PF LSU Fr. 
Rudy Gay 6-8 222 SF UConn So. 
Adam Morrison 6-8 198 SF Gonzaga Jr. 
Shelden Williams 6-9 258 PF/C Duke Sr.
Brandon Roy 6-6 207 SG Washington Sr. 
LaMarcus Aldridge 6-11 234 PF Tex. So.
Andrew Bogut 7-0 251 C Utah So. 
Marvin Williams 6-8 228 SF UNC Fr. 
Deron Williams 6-3 202 PG Illinois Jr. 
Chris Paul 6-1 178 PG Wake Forest So. 
Raymond Felton 6-1 200 PG UNC Jr. 
Martell Webster 6-7 230 SG/SF WA HSSr. 
Danny Granger 6-9 225 SF New Mex. Sr.


----------



## rlucas4257

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



darlets said:


> Just as a exercise to see how this years draft stacks up against last year, below is the top 7 players as listed by nbadraft from 2005 and 2006. In what order do you think they'd get drafted if the drafts were combined?????
> 
> Andrea Bargnani 6-11 240 PF Italy 1985
> Tyrus Thomas 6-8 217 PF LSU Fr.
> Rudy Gay 6-8 222 SF UConn So.
> Adam Morrison 6-8 198 SF Gonzaga Jr.
> Marcus Vinicius 6-9 235 SF Brazil 1984
> Brandon Roy 6-6 207 SG Washington Sr.
> LaMarcus Aldridge 6-11 234 PF Tex. So.
> Andrew Bogut 7-0 251 C Utah So.
> Marvin Williams 6-8 228 SF UNC Fr.
> Deron Williams 6-3 202 PG Illinois Jr.
> Chris Paul 6-1 178 PG Wake Forest So.
> Raymond Felton 6-1 200 PG UNC Jr.
> Martell Webster 6-7 230 SG/SF WA HSSr.
> Danny Granger 6-9 225 SF New Mex. Sr.



Marquinhos?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Man, I'd love to trade 16 + fillers to get Marquis Daniels.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Man, I'd love to trade 16 + fillers to get Marquis Daniels.


i wouldn't mind him also. but i heard his contract is a little on the rotten side..

one of those Cuban getting over excited and giving tons of cash after a good season.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> i wouldn't mind him also. but i heard his contract is a little on the rotten side..
> 
> one of those Cuban getting over excited and giving tons of cash after a good season.


yep..i rmember that lol


----------



## onelove23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The bottom line is that the bulls dug themselves a hole into this draft. they got rid of eddy curry and now they sent themselves 4 years backward now that that have to draft ANOTHER dominant big man. so, trade an eddy curry for a future lemarcus aldridge or tyrus thomas? maybe. but , if we wouldve kept curry, we couldve focused on getting another scoring guard and taken the heat off of henrich to get 15-20 a night. i think with the number 2 pick in this draft doesnt mean much . does it?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

it means a ton

Curry was a very flawed player..not only do you have the chance to draft a more well-rounded player..but you also get rid of the HEADACHES which is his monther, his agents and HIMSELF


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> it means a ton
> 
> Curry was a very flawed player..not only do you have the chance to draft a more well-rounded player..but you also get rid of the HEADACHES which is his monther, his agents and HIMSELF


thats a little harsh. espically bring his mother into the picture. but the point is he was benefical to the team. but he by losing him has not sent the team back a ton. having nene/wilcox or pryzibilla will make up for him and thats not including a big from the draft. but yes. we do need a low post scoring threat. but he didn't do much in fourth quarters. he only gave you one or two quarters max of production. he had no level of consitenticy what so ever. he can be replaced...


----------



## laso

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> chad's new blog says MJ is high on Brandon Roy for the 'Cat pick
> 
> http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=ford_chad#20060620
> 
> essentially looking for a "complete" player since he got burned on kwame.
> 
> but didn't roy cancel his charlotte workout? did i read that here?


Not the best of signs for Roy's prospects in the league...


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



laso said:


> Not the best of signs for Roy's prospects in the league...


Jordan made some questionable picks when he drafted big men, but you might think he would know what it would take to be a shooting guard in this league.

Anyway, to all those who think Roy is a stretch at #2, it looks like if we don't draft him, he has a very good chance of being drafted #3.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Jordan made some questionable picks when he drafted big men, but you might think he would know what it would take to be a shooting guard in this league.
> 
> Anyway, to all those who think Roy is a stretch at #2, it looks like if we don't draft him, he has a very good chance of being drafted #3.


Jordan only ever drafted one big man and it was Kwame Brown. I think the talent is still there. they just didn't evaluate his motivation and smarts as a kid. he just doesn't seem motivated enough. his talent level is undeniable he just has a very low basketball IQ. Lucky for him there arn't too many bigs to chose from this years draft class anyhow. I think its a toss up between Roy and Gay for Jordan...


----------



## truebluefan

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



onelove23 said:


> The bottom line is that the bulls dug themselves a hole into this draft. they got rid of eddy curry and now they sent themselves 4 years backward now that that have to draft ANOTHER dominant big man. so, trade an eddy curry for a future lemarcus aldridge or tyrus thomas? maybe. but , if we wouldve kept curry, we couldve focused on getting another scoring guard and taken the heat off of henrich to get 15-20 a night. i think with the number 2 pick in this draft doesnt mean much . does it?


Welcome to the site.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I just read your "Change of Heart towards Economic Lessons"

I pretty much agree with everything that you said. espically in regarding Brewer. i've been wanting this kid for a long time now. whether people see it or not thats each to their own. but its always nice to have someone else agree. Why if Roy is considered at no.2 can't Brewer be considered a no.2 pick also? the simple fact is he isn't a sexy pick. meaning his not a big guy. or its because he isn't flashy. that is why. 

i brought it up on another thread. i've compared him to pippen. in that he fills alot of holes and can play multiple positions whilst holding his own on defense. but to compare him to a modern aged player you could compare him a little to Iggys game. in that he does everything. has the potential to just fill the state sheet. and just go around the court guns a blazin and just leave it out there. and both don't have the most sweetest shot or offensive game yet. but who cares? we have scorers already. we need a guy like Brewer who will slash and get to the basket and finish strong. and get to the line which the bulls desperately need. I think his a can't miss prospect. 

we are definitly going to be getting bigs through free agency so why bring in a big thats probably going to be coming off the bench anyhow? and probably will need time to develop? trade down to get Brewer. Trade away the 16th pick. and wait untill next year for a big. we don't need to get any younger now anyhow. one rookie is plenty. and Brewer should be that player.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

*rumors floating of toronto looking to deal the #1 pick:*



> The hottest rumour concerning the Raptors right now is not which player general manager Bryan Colangelo will draft with the No.1 overall pick on July 28.
> 
> *Rather, it's a possible deal brewing between the Raptors and the Charlotte Bobcats, which would involve a swap of veteran point guards, Alvin Williams for Brevin Knight, with Toronto also giving up the No.1 pick for Charlotte's No. 3 overall in the draft.*
> 
> Williams, 31, has played very little the past two seasons after undergoing microfracture surgery on his right knee in November 2004. There is no guarantee he'll play again, although his agent, Bill Strickland, told the Toronto Sun yesterday that Williams will be ready to play when the 2006-07 NBA season begins next fall.
> 
> Williams told reporters late this past season that he was ready to play, but coach Sam Mitchell was not convinced.
> 
> *The possible deal between Toronto and Charlotte would make some sense if the Raptors are intent on drafting Italian forward Andrea Bargnani, as reports have suggested. The European star likely still would be available to the Raptors if they held the No. 3 pick*.
> 
> *Strickland would not comment on the trade rumour yesterday, but he did not shoot it down either.*








http://www.torontosun.com/Sports/Basketball/2006/06/21/1644767-sun.html


----------



## yodurk

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

That trade makes sense...the Raptors could seriously use a PG like Brevin Knight, while the Cats would get whoever they want (probably Morrison, IMO) and can afford to take on a bad contract like Alvin Williams.

My only question is, why would the Bulls pass on Bargnani? By now, it's become so clear that he's the best combination of NBA ready and tremendous upside. 7-footer with a 9'3 standing reach, mobility, perimeter skills, and a pure shot...and coming off a terrific performance for a Euro league championship. What more do you want in a draft prospect.


----------



## Dornado

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> *rumors floating of toronto looking to deal the #1 pick:*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.torontosun.com/Sports/Basketball/2006/06/21/1644767-sun.html


Why would Charlotte do that? I heard they like Brandon Roy the best... certainly they wouldn't need to move up to #1 to get him...


----------



## Zeb

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> *rumors floating of toronto looking to deal the #1 pick:*
> http://www.torontosun.com/Sports/Basketball/2006/06/21/1644767-sun.html


Paxson's plan working out perfectly, Bargs it is? :gopray:


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I agree yodurk. Honestly, I'll be happy with whoever Pax picks b/c there is no clear cut choice, unless Bargnani is available. Granted, no one knows who will be a star or bust. But from all the quotes we read about these players, Bargnani fits our system the best (spacing offense, lots of screen/rolls), has legit size, and has been tested. 

I'll be content w/Bargnani, Aldridge, or Tyrus. The sad thing is, each player brings something vastly different which we need. Bargnani's shooting touch, drive, and size. Aldridge being a better post player than the other 2. Tyrus' aggressive drive and 'apparent' versatility of hitting the long J or flying over the rim.

I think Roy will be a solid pro, just not a guy we need at 2. If we miss out on a big at 2, we will be screwed for a while. We need to do anything to trade up and grab Brewer. I believe in HoopsHype today, the Jazz are rumored to want Foye, Brewer, then Sene at 14 (whoever is available in that order).

It'll be amazing if Bargnani is Pax's guy, and the trade between Charlotte and Toronto goes down. No one will see it coming, other than us .


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Dornado said:


> Why would Charlotte do that? I heard they like Brandon Roy the best... certainly they wouldn't need to move up to #1 to get him...


Unless they really think Pax wants Roy.

I think it is a solid trade for Toronto. They get some extra cap room, a solid vet PG, and at least one of Bargnani or Aldridge will be available at 3. If we pass up on Bargnani, and Toronto grabs him, they will have extra cap room to go hard after Nene.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

so toronto trades down thinking the italian will still be there, but pax sweeps in and surprises everyone by taking him #2.

that would be so ****ing great.

and that's not to say i still don't like roy (see sig.) but if pax could pull this off, that would just be outstanding.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> so toronto trades down thinking the italian will still be there, but pax sweeps in and surprises everyone by taking him #2.
> 
> that would be so ****ing great.
> 
> and that's not to say i still don't like roy (see sig.) but if pax could pull this off, that would just be outstanding.


This sounds a lot like the 2004 draft, where the Clippers traded down from #2 to #4, knowing Shawn Livingston would still be there at #4 because the Bulls weren't going to take him at #3. Just sub Livingston with Bargnani if this latest trade rumor goes down. 

Toronto better be sure Pax won't take Bargnani, or trade the #2 to another team that wants Bargnani.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



SALO said:


> This sounds a lot like the 2004 draft, where the Clippers traded down from #2 to #4, knowing Shawn Livingston would still be there at #4 because the Bulls weren't going to take him at #3. Just sub Livingston with Bargnani if this latest trade rumor goes down.
> 
> Toronto better be sure Pax won't take Bargnani, or trade the #2 to another team that wants Bargnani.


I could see the Suns killing for that #2 if Bargnani is there. And I dont think B.Treviso would be against it, and they have the euro connection with D'Antoni as well. 

Hopefully Pax will give him some consideration, but if he doesnt work out I dont see it (Obviously what matters is the real games, but...). Or it could be a good move not to work him out if we are indeed very interested and want the Raptors to believe we have no interest whatsover on him.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

#2 for Shawn Marion?


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> #2 for Shawn Marion?



Thats the rumor but I bet it is #2 plus something, maybe the 16, maybe Gordon...


----------



## Guest

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

While Shawn Marion is indeed a bona fide star, and is better than either Noc or Deng right now, I fail to see why we would do that move, when it does nothing to address our needs.

Even if we got the Suns mid-first round pick and the swap was #2 for Matrix straight up, I think I'd rather keep the pick. Unless we then package Noc or Deng in trade for a big.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Spud said:


> While Shawn Marion is indeed a bona fide star, and is better than either Noc or Deng right now, I fail to see why we would do that move, when it does nothing to address our needs.
> 
> Even if we got the Suns mid-first round pick and the swap was #2 for Matrix straight up, I think I'd rather keep the pick. Unless we then package Noc or Deng in trade for a big.


I think if Marion is being offered up for the #2 overall straight up you do that deal and sort out team needs later myself.


----------



## Guest

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> I think if Marion is being offered up for the #2 overall straight up you do that deal and sort out team needs later myself.


Yeah, you are probably right about that.


----------



## laso

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> I think if Marion is being offered up for the #2 overall straight up you do that deal and sort out team needs later myself.


I wouldn't do that deal. I'd even rather draft Tyrus Thomas than trade for Marion. Marion will make us better, but won't get us anywhere... There are a couple of players in this draft, if we get lucky, that could be real impact players.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



laso said:


> I wouldn't do that deal. I'd even rather draft Tyrus Thomas than trade for Marion. Marion will make us better, but won't get us anywhere... There are a couple of players in this draft, if we get lucky, that could be real impact players.



It's wishful thinking if you believe there is a player better in the draft than Marion IMHO.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> It's wishful thinking if you believe there is a player better in the draft than Marion IMHO.


I think it's actually a pretty safe bet that there will be a better player than Marion in the draft. The unfortunate variables from our perspective are "who" and "when".


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> I think it's actually a pretty safe bet that there will be a better player than Marion in the draft. The unfortunate variables from our perspective are "who" and "when".



There MIGHT be one or two players thats true. BUt the who and the when is the tough part. It's entirely possible that there ISN'T a player as good as Marion in the draft period too, he is awfully good.


----------



## mw2889

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Marion can really fill up meaningless stats, he reminds me of Glenn Robinson the way he can be such a natural role player desguised as a legit star. When does he every have a basket or rebound that truly changes the outcome of a game?


----------



## laso

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> It's wishful thinking if you believe there is a player better in the draft than Marion IMHO.


Marion is good, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. I don't think he is an elite NBA player. Definitely above average, close to the top, but not a go-to guy. Not a systematic game changer. And he also benefits tremendously from playing in Phoenix. How deep is he on his team's depth chart? Definitively after Nash, Diaw, Amare (when he's healthy), in the playoffs I even had doubts whether he did not fall behind Tim Thomas.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



laso said:


> Marion is good, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. I don't think he is an elite NBA player. Definitely above average, close to the top, but not a go-to guy. Not a systematic game changer. And he also benefits tremendously from playing in Phoenix. How deep is he on his team's depth chart? Definitively after Nash, Diaw, Amare (when he's healthy), in the playoffs I even had doubts whether he did not fall behind Tim Thomas.



He was doing his thing in Phx before Nash even go there and I definitley think he is one of the elite NBA players. And I put him right after Nash & Amare myself...


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Well hell, if we're gonna trade for Marion's bloated deal we might as well take Odom. 

Come on guys, if we only needed one player, I'd be all for that.

however we arren't just trading the #2. We are trading the # and cap space we need for a C for Shawne Marion, if not the Bulls having to throw in more. Why? HE doesn't bring anything we don't have in Nocioni and Deng. Seriously, he's not gonna go inside and bang down low. I can't believe he'd change our fortunes that much.

Honestly, if were gonna do that, go ahead and grab Thomas. For me, Thomas + Nene (and maybe another player or pick) is better than Marion alone. We still have no one to play center if we get Marion. 

This year is not hte year to consolidate. 

This year we have the ability to stock ourselves two deep at every position:

PG - Hinrich, Duhon
SG - Gordon, Seflosha
SF - Deng, Nocioni
PF - Thomas, Chandler, Sweetney
C - Nene, Nazr, Sweetney

I believe we can grab Nene + and other center (Nazr or Jackie Butler - I don't think Pryz would come if we grabbed Nene_.


Point being, you let these guys go hard all next season then you package the extra pieces with the lottery pick we hopefully get from NY next season and you have depth when you get that final piece.

adding Marion doesn't finish our team needs and likely opens a new need for depth.


No to any trades.....for guys not named Gasol or that cost us 3 to 1


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Insider :



> His agents also said they've canceled his workouts with the Raptors and Bobcats.
> 
> "It's a slight pull," Siegal said. "It's not serious at all. However, we don't want to risk that it could turn into something more serious. We want Tyrus to be 100 percent healthy for summer league and don't think an extra workout or two is worth the risk." How will all of this effect his draft stock? It probably won't. I still believe that Thomas is likely to go to the Bulls at No. 2. They have liked him all year and a slight groin pull and a stomach virus in the past two weeks aren't going to taint their year-long scouting reports.





> The Bulls are a likely destination, but not a guaranteed one. Two sources say that LaMarcus Aldridge, after an excellent workout in Chicago, has moved back into the conversation. Washington's Brandon Roy also has fans in the organization.





> On Monday, we reported that Adam Morrison's agent, Mark Bartelstein, told Insider that Morrison had not been invited back to Charlotte to work out for Michael Jordan. Apparently MJ had a change of heart. Bartelstein told Insider that Jordan called Monday (after the blog was published) trying to schedule Morrison for a workout. However, Bartelstein told Jordan that Morrison couldn't accommodate him because of Morrison's workout schedule. That decision probably puts Morrison completely out of the picture in Charlotte. That has to make the Blazers very happy. They've got Morrison atop their draft board and are trying to move up in the draft to guarantee that they get him.





> Bobcats Raptors? Bobcats-Raptors Talk Trade?
> Jun 21 - The Toronto Sun reports a possible deal is brewing between the Toronto Raptors and the Charlotte Bobcats which would involve a swap of Alvin Williams and the No. 1 pick for Brevin Knight and the No.3 pick.


*has no clue who's coming to chicago*


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I don't really want to get younger, than we already are probably going to be next year but what do you guys think of Noel (played all 4 years)



> David Noel III worked out for the Bucks Tuesday. Next year at this time, could he be working out for the Green Bay Packers? Only time will tell, but Noel claims both Wisconsin professional sports teams have expressed an interest in his services. A well-chiseled 6-foot-6, 230-pound athlete from the University of North Carolina, Noel is focusing on trying to become a professional basketball player. But Noel said if he falls short in his quest to become a pro basketball player, he’ll explore his next option: playing in the NFL. Noel didn’t play football for the Tar Heels, but he was a highly-regarded wide receiver in high school in Durham, N.C. Racine Journal-Times


He is quite an athlete, has a decent shot, decent defender, not a great passer or handler, but not too bad. I wouldn't mind having him on the back of the bench at all, peace out Basden. He'll probably get picked in the 2nd round, even though the mocks seem to disagree with me.

Even if he isn't very impressive ala Basden, he could earn his paycheck in a couple of minutes, when Sheed starts laughing, David could come in a bashing. I've been a Wilcox advocate for his post game, but we also need some intimidating muscle. If not Wilcox, Nene, or Cato, Noel could be useful.

I'm not saying we need some dirty play, just some old school toughness, take that!


----------



## harley

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



laso said:


> Marion is good, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. I don't think he is an elite NBA player. Definitely above average, close to the top, but not a go-to guy. Not a systematic game changer. And he also benefits tremendously from playing in Phoenix. How deep is he on his team's depth chart? Definitively after Nash, Diaw, Amare (when he's healthy), in the playoffs I even had doubts whether he did not fall behind Tim Thomas.


marion don,t have to be a elite player. All we need from him is to put 18 point and 10 rebound a night


----------



## onelove23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I really really do not think the big men in this draft will be GREAT players or all-stars if you think of it like that. Shawn marion would be an impact player getting 20 and 10. THAT will help the bulls get farther into the playoffs. why would the bulls take their chances on a rookie that could be a bust like the past (curry and chandler). when they can get the marion. if that offer is on the table for marion i say take it. marion can also GUARD some of the best fowards and guards in the leauge. better than nocioni lol. like i said in an earlier thread , if kirk would only have to worry about being a pg , he would be alot better and productive. kirk shouldnt have to get 17 a night for the bulls to win. he COULD get 10 pts and 12 assist if the bulls had a better offensive threat than ben gorden and himself. Marion all the way.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I love Marion, and think he is one of the most underrated basketball players out there. But no way do I want him unless we got another trade lined up to get us a quality center. The guy would take up all cap room.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The trade might be something like:

Bulls Trade:

#2
#16

Phoenix Trades:

Shawn Marion
#29

Phoenix uses #2 on Bargnani. 16 on Sene. 21 on someone.

I'd assume they'd want 16 to get Sene. But if Bulls could just do #2 for Marion, AND take Sene, we'd be sitting good.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> I love Marion, and think he is one of the most underrated basketball players out there. But no way do I want him unless we got another trade lined up to get us a quality center. The guy would take up all cap room.


i agree. but his a western conference type of player. where alot of teams are run and gun. and the whole nash made him a whole world better is untrue. he was pretty much what he was even before nash got there. and when they had marbury. but regardless to say he can play out in the western conference the way he does but not in the eastern conference. when they matched up against the clippers. when they slowed the pace down and made it a grind out. it was obvious it wasn't his game. espically when dallas did the same thing to phoneix also. when they grinded it to a half court sets he wasn't nearly as effective. and thats how most teams in the eastern conference play. they play half court sets and the grind it out. he won't be as nearly effective in the east then he is in the west. and espically in the half court sets that skiles uses. marion strives in the particular system. though he will be effective mind you. he won't be AS effective out here in my opinion.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Not sure how this factors in with the Bulls draft plans. 

But Ben Gordon on drafting Bargnani

"I don't trust those guys from over seas".

Its an honest thing though, its not like he's saying no way, you don't take a foreign player, but he seems to think of it as a crapshoot with foreign players, since guys who show good game overseas have come over and sucked in the NBA, and guys that showed nothing, like Kirilienko have been stars.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Not sure how this factors in with the Bulls draft plans.
> 
> But Ben Gordon on drafting Bargnani
> 
> "I don't trust those guys from over seas".
> 
> Its an honest thing though, its not like he's saying no way, you don't take a foreign player, but he seems to think of it as a crapshoot with foreign players, since guys who show good game overseas have come over and sucked in the NBA, and guys that showed nothing, like Kirilienko have been stars.




:raised_ey 


do you have a LINK for that sloth?


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> :raised_ey
> 
> 
> do you have a LINK for that sloth?


it was in an aim convo.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

NVM, he came back from the basics, but he isn't going to comment much on what he thinks the Bulls are going to do (involving Bargnani, Thomas, Roy, Gay, Sene, and Marion). He thinks the Fesenko ball on the ground thing is hilarious though.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> i agree. but his a western conference type of player. where alot of teams are run and gun. and the whole nash made him a whole world better is untrue. he was pretty much what he was even before nash got there. and when they had marbury. but regardless to say he can play out in the western conference the way he does but not in the eastern conference. when they matched up against the clippers. when they slowed the pace down and made it a grind out. it was obvious it wasn't his game. espically when dallas did the same thing to phoneix also. when they grinded it to a half court sets he wasn't nearly as effective. and thats how most teams in the eastern conference play. they play half court sets and the grind it out. he won't be as nearly effective in the east then he is in the west. and espically in the half court sets that skiles uses. marion strives in the particular system. though he will be effective mind you. he won't be AS effective out here in my opinion.


Great post. I agree with all your points. Marion is a great player, but I don't think he'd fit well with us. I think JO would be a better fit here. I'm not saying I want JO, but just talking about the type of guys we are *rumored * to get.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

It makes no sense to me to add a 28 year guy at a position of strength when the rest of the core is in their low to mid 20s. We should be aiming at a dynasty, not several years of being competative in the Eastern conference.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Sometimes stats can be overdone. But this article puts a very interesting spin on things. A very interesting read to say the least.

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1361


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Add this one along with the previous. I wouldn't delve TOO much into the whole reasoning of it. But still fun to read..

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1362


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Don't forget to sign up for NBA.com's draft pickem.

Good prizes.

Prizes: (1) Grand Prize: 3-day/2-night trip for two to the NBA Draft 2007 in New York City consisting of round-trip coach air transportation from major U.S. gateway airport nearest to winner’s residence, 2-nights’ standard double-occupancy hotel accommodations (one (1) room), ground transportation to/from the airport and the applicable hotel, and two tickets to the NBA Draft (Approximate Retail Value "ARV"=$3,000US). Actual prize value will vary depending on winner’s city of departure. Sponsor, in its sole discretion, reserves the right to provide ground transportation in place of air transportation if winner lives within a reasonable driving distance of New York City, as determined by Sponsor in its sole discretion, and no compensation or substitution will be provided for different in prize value. Travel and hotel arrangements determined by Sponsor in its sole discretion and must be booked through Sponsor’s agent and on a carrier of Sponsor’s choice. Winner and guest must travel together on the same itinerary, and any minor traveling companion must be accompanied by a parent or legal guardian. Winner and guest are responsible for obtaining all required travel documents. Trip must be taken on dates and times designated by Sponsor or prize will be forfeited in its entirety and, at Sponsor’s discretion, may be awarded to a runner-up. If designated event is canceled or postponed for any reason, travel prize will be awarded less applicable prize-related activity(s) and Sponsor will substitute that activity(s) with an item(s)/activity(s) of comparable or greater value as determined solely by Sponsor. Exact seat locations at the event to be determined by Sponsor in its sole discretion. All prize details are at Sponsor’s sole discretion.

(10) First Prizes: $50 NBA.com Store Gift Certificate (ARV=$50 US/each). Gift Certificates subject to certain terms and conditions. Total ARV of all prizes=$3,500US.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> Add this one along with the previous. I wouldn't delve TOO much into the whole reasoning of it. But still fun to read..
> 
> http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1362


Take home message for the Bulls is that the chances that the #2 pick will produce at solid starter are very good, but the chances that he will be a star are not so good; particularly if he is a big man.

A second take-home message is that it's not a very good idea to draft a big man at #16.

So past experience suggests that the best bet for the Bulls is to draft a big man (Aldridge or Bargnani) at #2, but to keep expectations modest, and to draft the best shooting guard available at #16.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/basketball/nba/specials/draft/2006/06/22/raptors.pick.ap/

TORONTO (AP) -- Texas forward LaMarcus Aldridge has impressed the Toronto Raptors to the point where they are rethinking who they might take with the first pick in next week's NBA draft.

General manager Bryan Colangelo said Wednesday that Aldridge's recent workout in Toronto complicated things.

"We like what we see. There is tremendous talent at the top of this draft. LaMarcus Aldridge came in and if anything confused us a little bit more the other day. You are hoping for one of these guys to come in and stumble," Colangelo said.

Colangelo has been enamored with Italian forward Andrea Bargnani. A day after winning the top pick in the draft lottery, Colangelo dispatched coach Sam Mitchell and senior adviser Wayne Embry to Italy to scout Bargnani.

Even team owner Larry Tanenbaum has scouted Bargnani, a 7-footer who plays for Benetton Treviso.

They are even close to hiring Benetton GM Maurizio Gherardini as Toronto's new assistant GM, Colangelo said.

But Colangelo says they haven't made up their mind on who they will take. He said they're open to trading the pick but haven't heard any acceptable offers.

"I know that there are some teams that are interested in No. 1," Colangelo said. "Maybe they haven't said the right number yet or the right piece or the right combination of things to make us move yet, but right now all I can assure is that right now we hold the No. 1 pick and we're prepared to make a selection on draft day."

On Wednesday, the Raptors worked out Gonzaga forward Adam Morrison, Connecticut forward Rudy Gay and Villanova guard Randy Foye.

Colangelo said injuries to LSU forward Tyrus Thomas (strained groin) and Washington guard Brandon Roy (hamstring) could preclude them from working out in Toronto, but they've already seen both of them at private workouts in Orlando and Los Angeles.

Colangelo said Bargnani will probably take a physical in New York before the draft. He doesn't expect him to work out in Toronto.

"We've got as much information as we need. Now it's a matter of processing information," Colangelo said.

The acquisition of center Rasho Nesterovic from the San Antonio Spurs on Wednesday doesn't necessarily alter who they will pick, Colangelo said.

The 6-foot-10 Aldridge averaged 15 points and 9.2 rebounds and led Texas to a school-record 30 wins, the Big 12 regular-season title and the NCAA regional finals as a sophomore last season.

Bargnani's team won the Italian League championship on Tuesday. Bargnani averaged 12.1 ppg and 5.8 rpg and shot 46 percent from the field and 44 percent from 3-point range in the playoffs.


----------



## BenDengGo

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

which channel will broadcast the draft?

if it is on abc, tnt, espn or epsn2, i might be able to watch it.

will nba.com have live coverage via nba broadband?


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



BenDengGo said:


> which channel will broadcast the draft?
> 
> if it is on abc, tnt, espn or epsn2, i might be able to watch it.
> 
> will nba.com have live coverage via nba broadband?


Broadcast is on ESPN.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



BenDengGo said:


> which channel will broadcast the draft?
> 
> if it is on abc, tnt, espn or epsn2, i might be able to watch it.
> 
> will nba.com have live coverage via nba broadband?


Broadcast is on ESPN.


http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2006/index


----------



## BenDengGo

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

thats perfect.

to all foreigners!!!!!!!!!! download the tvuplayer and you'll be able to watch it!!!


----------



## garnett

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Ok I've lost track here. Why do Toronto want Bargnani after Bosh said that he would rather the Raptors draft a banger? Is it a BPA thing?


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



garnett said:


> Ok I've lost track here. Why do Toronto want Bargnani after Bosh said that he would rather the Raptors draft a banger? Is it a BPA thing?


Because their GM probably doesn't care who Bosh wants? Bosh is going to sign that extension no matter who they draft because he'll want the money, and Bryan Colangelo will draft who Bryan Colangelo wants to draft. if he thinks Bargnani is the best player available, he'll take him. And if that turns out to be true, Bosh will be glad Colangelo didn't listen to him.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



narek said:


> Because their GM probably doesn't care who Bosh wants? Bosh is going to sign that extension no matter who they draft because he'll want the money, and Bryan Colangelo will draft who Bryan Colangelo wants to draft. if he thinks Bargnani is the best player available, he'll take him. And if that turns out to be true, Bosh will be glad Colangelo didn't listen to him.



Huh? Bosh can get a max deal anywhere. True, it might cost him a couple of million in percentile raises but THATS not gonna keep him in Toronto. If Toronto wants to keep Bosh they need to keep Bosh happy which is the only reason they may draft Aldrdige instead of Bargs.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> Huh? Bosh can get a max deal anywhere. True, it might cost him a couple of million in percentile raises but THATS not gonna keep him in Toronto. If Toronto wants to keep Bosh they need to keep Bosh happy which is the only reason they may draft Aldrdige instead of Bargs.


No, Bosh can't get a max deal anywhere. Not this August 1, anyway.

I don't think there's a precedent for a player turning down an max extension offer and playing out his rookie deal to reach unrestricted free agency. Maybe a guy like LeBron can afford to do that, but I would be shocked if Bosh turned down that type of security. Even if Colangelo drafted Wayne Gretzky at #1 next Wednesday.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> No, Bosh can't get a max deal anywhere. Not this August 1, anyway.
> 
> I don't think there's a precedent for a player turning down an max extension offer and playing out his rookie deal to reach unrestricted free agency. Maybe a guy like LeBron can afford to do that, but I would be shocked if Bosh turned down that type of security. Even if Colangelo drafted Wayne Gretzky at #1 next Wednesday.


No, he can AFTER playing a year without extending, that was my point. Noone wants to stay in Toronto, no US basketball player at least, and Bosh could very easily play out his deal and search elsewhere and if the team doesn't committ to him by making him happy and listening to his input that is probably exactly what he will do. Him signing an extension is NOT a foregone conclusion IMO.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> No, he can AFTER playing a year without extending, that was my point. Noone wants to stay in Toronto, no US basketball player at least, and Bosh could very easily play out his deal and search elsewhere and if the team doesn't committ to him by making him happy and listening to his input that is probably exactly what he will do. Him signing an extension is NOT a foregone conclusion IMO.


It'd be two years for Bosh to reach unrestricted free agency, not one.

All outward signs strongly point to Bosh's staying, and no player coming off a rookie contract has ever turned down a max extension offered at the earliest opportunity. The odds Bosh leaves Toronto are slim to none.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> It'd be two years for Bosh to reach unrestricted free agency, not one.
> 
> All outward signs strongly point to Bosh's staying, and no player coming off a rookie contract has ever turned down a max extension offered at the earliest opportunity. The odds Bosh leaves Toronto are slim to none.



ok then two years. Players have signed deals and then demanded trades, thats likely what Bosh would do. Still, just because it has never happened that doesn't mean it won't ever happen.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Daily Quickie - 6/22/06



> NBA Draft: Who's No. 1?
> The Raptors will select Euro-stud Andrea Bargnani. At least, that's the signal from the Raps, who are reportedly set to hire Bargnani's Italian coach Maurizio Gherardini as assistant GM.
> 
> The question, then, is whether Toronto takes Bargnani with the No. 1 overall pick or trades down from that pick, expecting him to be available slightly later in the draft order.
> 
> That theory dovetails with an earlier report that the Bobcats had been talking with the Raptors about trading from the No. 3 slot up to No. 1.
> 
> That would still let the Raptors pick Bargnani, and give Michael Jordan his pick of players -- and also allow him to leapfrog his ex-teammate John Paxson, GM of the Bulls, who holds the No. 2 pick.
> 
> (I'm bullish on Bargnani: New Raptors GM Bryan Colangelo is going to turn Toronto into Phoenix East. Don't be totally blinded by the backlash against international players. Bargnani is more Dirk than Darko.)


----------



## garnett

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Bargnani looks tempting, but after seeing Dirk's performance in the Finals I think I'd rather have a PF that scores in the post rather than one that relies on jump shots. I don't think we would have seen Duncan go 2-14 from the field against the Heat.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



garnett said:


> Bargnani looks tempting, but after seeing Dirk's performance in the Finals I think I'd rather have a PF that scores in the post rather than one that relies on jump shots. I don't think we would have seen Duncan go 2-14 from the field against the Heat.


That's because Duncan got sent home early by the Mavs. Dirk attacked the basket and was so much better against the Spurs for some reason.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/basketball/nba/specials/draft/2006/06/22/raptors.pick.ap/
> 
> TORONTO (AP) -- Texas forward LaMarcus Aldridge has impressed the Toronto Raptors to the point where they are rethinking who they might take with the first pick in next week's NBA draft.
> 
> General manager Bryan Colangelo said Wednesday that Aldridge's recent workout in Toronto complicated things.
> 
> "We like what we see. There is tremendous talent at the top of this draft. LaMarcus Aldridge came in and if anything confused us a little bit more the other day. You are hoping for one of these guys to come in and stumble," Colangelo said.
> 
> Colangelo has been enamored with Italian forward Andrea Bargnani. A day after winning the top pick in the draft lottery, Colangelo dispatched coach Sam Mitchell and senior adviser Wayne Embry to Italy to scout Bargnani.
> 
> Even team owner Larry Tanenbaum has scouted Bargnani, a 7-footer who plays for Benetton Treviso.
> 
> They are even close to hiring Benetton GM Maurizio Gherardini as Toronto's new assistant GM, Colangelo said.
> 
> But Colangelo says they haven't made up their mind on who they will take. He said they're open to trading the pick but haven't heard any acceptable offers.
> 
> "I know that there are some teams that are interested in No. 1," Colangelo said. "Maybe they haven't said the right number yet or the right piece or the right combination of things to make us move yet, but right now all I can assure is that right now we hold the No. 1 pick and we're prepared to make a selection on draft day."
> 
> On Wednesday, the Raptors worked out Gonzaga forward Adam Morrison, Connecticut forward Rudy Gay and Villanova guard Randy Foye.
> 
> Colangelo said injuries to LSU forward Tyrus Thomas (strained groin) and Washington guard Brandon Roy (hamstring) could preclude them from working out in Toronto, but they've already seen both of them at private workouts in Orlando and Los Angeles.
> 
> Colangelo said Bargnani will probably take a physical in New York before the draft. He doesn't expect him to work out in Toronto.
> 
> "We've got as much information as we need. Now it's a matter of processing information," Colangelo said.
> 
> The acquisition of center Rasho Nesterovic from the San Antonio Spurs on Wednesday doesn't necessarily alter who they will pick, Colangelo said.
> 
> The 6-foot-10 Aldridge averaged 15 points and 9.2 rebounds and led Texas to a school-record 30 wins, the Big 12 regular-season title and the NCAA regional finals as a sophomore last season.
> 
> Bargnani's team won the Italian League championship on Tuesday. Bargnani averaged 12.1 ppg and 5.8 rpg and shot 46 percent from the field and 44 percent from 3-point range in the playoffs.


All this article does is convince me Toronto will NOT pick Aldridge #1. They want someone else to trade up for Aldridge.


----------



## garnett

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



SALO said:


> That's because Duncan got sent home early by the Mavs. Dirk attacked the basket and was so much better against the Spurs for some reason.


 True, but come Finals where there's more pressure than at any point in the season I don't think I'd like to be relying on a jump shooter. Particularly Bargnani who I'm pretty sure I've read doesnt like playing inside, so I wouldn't expect much driving to the hole.


----------



## anorexorcist

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Whaddaya guys think of my avatar? :rbanana:


----------



## garnett

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Has anybody been to the Portland site? Aldridge looked good. It's funny to hear the players say they'd like to play for Portland haha.


----------



## LegoHat

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

By all accounts Toronto are drafting Bargnani, which means that my blatant homering has been to no use... Why did COlangelo have to be hired by the frickin' Raptors!?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

...


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> ...


DMD, when you say you were "right" about Sweetney, you mean that you thought he was not going to have a successful NBA career, correct?

(He's the only guy in your "right" category who isn't good, so I'm just double-checking.)


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



garnett said:


> Has anybody been to the Portland site? Aldridge looked good. It's funny to hear the players say they'd like to play for Portland haha.


If Bargnani is gone, I really want Aldridge. I like the kid's personality, and he has a variety of moves. He is ready for the NBA and has upside.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Some Chad Ford quotes from his chat (today):

Raps and the first pick--I talked to Bryan Colangelo yesterday. He said it's looking more and more likely that they'll keep the pick.

Garnett to Bulls--I would if the Wolves are willing to deal. Maybe the No. 2, No. 16 and either Ben Gordon or Luol Deng. However, it sounds like Kevin McHale is unwilling to move KG. I think he'll regret it in a year or so. His value is as high as it will ever be right now.


Bulls draft options--If they keep the pick, I think it will be Thomas or Roy. Aldridge is stil in the picture, but I think Thomas' motor and upside win out. Unless, the Bulls think they can solve their woes at the four in free agency or via trade and want to add Roy to round out their backcourt. I've been advocating Aldridge here all year (I think he fits a need the best) but I think the Bulls question his toughness a little. 

About Aldridge--I think Aldridge is much closer to a four three than he is a center. He doesn't have the strength for the position and is actually more comfortable facing the basket -- Texas just didn't use him that way. The truth is that the only "fits" are a true center or point guard and there aren't any at the top of the draft. So ... the Raptors take the best player. There's a huge debate about who that is, but Bargnani is definitely in the conversation. For the record I think the top 5 players in the draft are:

*1. Tyrus Thomas*
2. Andrea Bargnani
3. LaMarcus Aldridge
4. Brandon Roy
5. Adam Morrison


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I want: Bargnani, then Aldridge. But Pax picks Tyrus b/c Too much upside, athletism and aggresiveness to pass up.


----------



## jordanwasprettygood

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Not sure if this has been posted yet...from si.com
(They have the Bulls drafting Tyrus)



> Thomas is the type of player who can be an asset right away in the NBA with his rebounding and shotblocking while the team works with him to sharpen his offensive skills. *The rumor is that Chicago has already worked out a trade that will send Thomas to another team.*


Haven't heard that before...then again, this time of the year there are all sorts of rumors.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/chris_ekstrand/06/22/mock.draft/index.html


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Finally a mock draft (CNNSI) with measurements updated. Wait, nbadraft.net has done the same. My bad.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jordanwasprettygood said:


> Not sure if this has been posted yet...from si.com
> (They have the Bulls drafting Tyrus)
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't heard that before...then again, this time of the year there are all sorts of rumors.
> 
> http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/chris_ekstrand/06/22/mock.draft/index.html


Marion for Thomas? Ugh. We kill our cap room, get more athletic but get no bigger. Marion makes about 15 mil this year. 

So would we want:

Hinrich, Duhon
Gordon, Sefalosha?
Nocioni, Deng
Marion, Sweetney
Chandler, Allen?

or 

Hinrich, Duhon
Gordon, Roy
Nocioni, Deng
Gooden, Sweetney
Pryzbilla, Chandler, Sene?

I still like option 2 better.


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I really am not high on Sene as everyone else. His shooting form is absolutley awful(never seen worse from someone going into or playing in the NBA), it will be the worst in the league for a couple of years, but hey maybe that will give Chandler some offensive confidence actually having a guy on the team less offensivily skilled than him. Sene is quite the athlete, but he has very very little skill. I know he just started playing b-ball and that has everyone saying he's going to improve and be a lot better in the future, but in my experience not starting things until later years results in not being able to play to your body's potential.


----------



## Pain5155

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

raptors are gonna draft morrison, bargani is the smokescreen.


----------



## The ROY

*Paxson Said On The Score Today...*

according to BILLYDW from REALGM :



> He said: The bulls won't really worry about who can step in right away and that they are going to take the guys that "feel" right to them in their gut.
> 
> Shuster added that Toronto's pick won't really affect them in Pax's mind and that the Bulls will keep their two picks.
> 
> Pax also said they like where they are and feel very good about getting a good player.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Paxson Said On The Score Today...*

and according to a post by STILLDROPPIN20, Curry is way over weight again



> I've been in pick up games with Eddy Curry and Bobby Simmons all in the past week at lifetime, Burr ridge.
> 
> You can find them there in the late evenings at least once per week. A few depaul players were palying as well as 2 guys from Arizona...one as big as Curry. Curry is way overweight again and is just plain lazy...it is so easy to out hustle him for rebounds and deny him the ball as a help defender. and I'm merely 5'11 and 34 years old. So glad Curry is gone. Simmons on the other hand is tough and strong as hell.


realgm folks seem to have all the insider's...why don't we?


----------



## OziBull

*Re: Paxson Said On The Score Today...*



The ROY said:


> according to BILLYDW from REALGM :


Yeh but i kind of think everyone knows Pax goes with his gut feeling in drafts in present, with BG etc


----------



## 7RINGS?

*Re: Paxson Said On The Score Today...*

Hey that a good question.I think its because they do way more research.They are off alot though anyway.Curry fat...I know that ones on the money!! :biggrin:


----------



## GB

*Re: Paxson Said On The Score Today...*



The ROY said:


> Curry is way overweight again and is just plain lazy...it is so easy to out hustle him for rebounds and deny him the ball as a help defender. and I'm merely 5'11 and 34 years old.


I'm sure theres some disparity in the 34 years enthusiasm for playing against Curry and Curry against him. I wouldn't put much into it.




> realgm folks seem to have all the insider's...why don't we?


I think the terms of the sale to VerticalScope call for us to get 3 or 4 insiders of our own.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Paxson Said On The Score Today...*

Does Paxson feel confident that Sene's going to be there at 16? I still wouldn't be surprised if he leaped frogged the Jazz in this draft.


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

First of a two part Q and A with Pax up at Bulls.com - sounds like this may have been part of what was on the Score earlier: http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/paxson_060622.html



> *With Chicago fans expecting more now than just the first round of the playoffs, do you weigh the long-term versus short-term any differently now? Are you maybe a little more focused on the short-term?*
> 
> “I would say so. First of all, I think that most of the kids in this draft are going to be able to contribute for teams right away. Whether they are going to be starters is another story. For us, I don’t necessarily want to get that much younger, but there are no guarantees in the free agent market that we’re going to be able to find something that we can get for a good price and all of those things. Being young in the East is not necessarily a bad thing. We’re in a great situation. We’re the only team in the lottery that made the playoffs last year. We have a lot of things we have to address; we have to address our size and our length. That’s a given. Can we address everything this summer? In a perfect world, yes, but that may not happen. But we’re going to keep banging away at it.”


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



narek said:


> First of a two part Q and A with Pax up at Bulls.com - sounds like this may have been part of what was on the Score earlier: http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/paxson_060622.html


Hmm.

Tyrus heavy interview. Smokescreen or indicator that Pax really likes the guy?


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



narek said:


> First of a two part Q and A with Pax up at Bulls.com - sounds like this may have been part of what was on the Score earlier: http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/paxson_060622.html


I don't think he likes Aldridge that much, and that makes me very happy. Right after the draft lottery, he called Aldridge a "finesse" player, but he called Tyrus a "game changer." 

For all those people who want Aldridge for his "low-post" game, even Pax says that's not his strength. Kid would rather face the basket and shoot jumpers than bang down low. What I don't like about that is he doesn't have the athleticism or shown the ability to take anyone off the dribble. If we want a big who shoots jumpers, take Bargnani. At least Bargnani's shown the willingness and ability to attack the basket. 

I think McGraw has been right all along... the pick is between Thomas and Roy, with Thomas currently holding the top spot, barring a trade. He thinks Thomas could be special and is willing to wait a few years for him to develop.

We'll have to wait for part two to see what he thinks of Bargnani. My guess is he's not considering him at all. :no:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Few things from insider :



> But a month ago Colangelo said the team would try to address its needs at center and point guard via trades and free agency in addition to the draft. And adding a center making more than $7 million per season would seem to quench some of the thirst the Raptors might have had to draft a center. In other words, it seems to make LaMarcus Aldridge a less likely choice and boost the chances of perimeter players Andrea Bargnani, Adam Morrison and Rudy Gay.





> What about a trade? The Toronto Sun reported this morning that the hot rumor had the Raptors swapping the No. 1 pick and Alvin Williams for Brevin Knight and Charlotte's No. 3 pick. Not being considered, according to Colangelo. "We have had some interest in some Bobcats players," Colangelo said, "but we're looking to do something much bigger with the No. 1 pick.". "The more we zone in on the prospects of the draft, the more I think we're comfortable keeping the pick".





> On Wednesday, a source said the Bulls might be considering trading the No. 2 pick and Chandler to the Phoenix Suns for Shawn Marion. With the pick, the Suns would select Tyrus Thomas. The move would help the Suns get the their salary-cap situation under control and allow them to re-sign Boris Diaw and Leandro Barbosa next summer.
> 
> More likely, the Bulls are keeping the pick and deciding between Thomas and Brandon Roy. A source in Chicago reiterated to Insider on Wednesday that they hadn't promised to draft Thomas and were still trying to decide which way to go.





> Cristian (Argentina): Chad, please tell me the Bulls arent picking Tyrus Thomas! Any chance they go with Aldridge?
> 
> Chad Ford: If they keep the pick, I think it will be Thomas or Roy. Aldridge is stil in the picture, but I think Thomas' motor and upside win out. Unless, the Bulls think they can solve their woes at the four in free agency or via trade and want to add Roy to round out their backcourt. I've been advocating Aldridge here all year (I think he fits a need the best) but I think the Bulls question his toughness a little.


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



SALO said:


> I don't think he likes Aldridge that much, and that makes me very happy. Right after the draft lottery, he called Aldridge a "finesse" player, while Tyrus was a "game changer."
> 
> For all those people who want Aldridge for his "low-post" game, even Pax says that's not his strength. Kid would rather face the basket and shoot jumpers than bang down low. What I don't like about that is he doesn't have the athleticism or shown the ability to take anyone off the dribble. If we want a big who shoots jumpers, take Bargnani. At least Bargnani's shown the willingness and ability to attack the basket.
> 
> I think McGraw has been right all along... the pick is between Thomas and Roy, with Thomas currently holding the top spot, barring a trade. He thinks Thomas could be special and is willing to wait a few years for him to develop.
> 
> We'll have to wait for part two to see what he thinks of Bargnani. My guess is he's not considering him at all. :no:


Because he knows Toronto's taking him - the whole other talk out of Toronto is Toronto trying to get someone to trade a lot for the number one and Toronto thinking Bargnani will be there in a lower pick. And no one may be willing to give Toronto what they want. 

It does seem if Pax takes TT he understands exactly what he's getting and is taking him for the player TT will be in 4 years, not who he'll be this year. 

OTOH, I love the pic they put up with the interview.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

He's was definintely SELLING Thomas...

Bargnani is the ULTIMATE though


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Is it me, or does this kid look bad a$$. Although I may prefer Aldridge b/c he seems to be a better fit inside, Tyrus has always intrigued me. If they kid can add mass and lives up to his billing of working hard, he'll be a good player inside. Those are two huge IFs. The kid has the Amare-like attidue where he wants to block and dunk on you. Just wants to put you to shame.

Man, I would not want to piss this kid off on the court.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

i merged the Pax on the Score thread here in case people were wondering.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Is it me, or does this kid look bad a$$. Although I may prefer Aldridge b/c he seems to be a better fit inside, Tyrus has always intrigued me. If they kid can add mass and lives up to his billing of working hard, he'll be a good player inside. Those are two huge IFs. The kid has the Amare-like attidue where he wants to block and dunk on you. Just wants to put you to shame.
> 
> Man, I would not want to piss this kid off on the court.


he actually reminds me of the Bull in the background


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



narek said:


> OTOH, I love the pic they put up with the interview.













:laugh:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Pax look like Tom Hanks in Forrest gump in that pic


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Nice pants, Pax.


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Yeh he really did sound like its out of Thomas or Aldridge and he still is unsure by stating its going to be a hard decision but a fun one. He said he wished Free Agency came first and then the draft, but thats not the case so he is no way going into the draft thinking or knowing he will pick up what he wants in Free Agency because there isnt a sure thing he will be able to do so. 
So this says to me he is definetley going to draft our need and that is a big man, Thomas or Aldridge its down too.

Also what i found interesting was in the full interview there was a question about how much consideration has he taken to the 16th pick, he stated they love the 16th pick and they have a few guys in mind that hopefully will be there for that pick. 
Also apparentley theres one more workout, somone who hasnt been there before, he stated he is just a long shot and its just to cover all basis, would he be talking about Bargnani here?

Full Interview is at this link-
http://wgntv.trb.com/ 

Good news about putting Gordon rumours to rest stating Ben is very valuable to this team and he wouldnt trade him unless it was a block buster.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The one thing I take from it is...

He had questions about Aldridge's game while with Thomas, he just praised his athleticism, versitility and the fact that he hasn't played much college ball...

I think Thomas/Sene is the goal

"Size, athleticism & length"


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*








johnny "red" kerr on  the draft  (top item)


----------



## remlover

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Paxson didn't sound really gung-ho about Roy. It could be GM speak or the fact that Roy isnt that high on Paxson's radar and is just a smokescreen. 

From Pax's comments it sure sounds like TT is their guy. I'm sure if i reread the article i'll get the impression that Pax instead covets Aldridge. 

If you go by Pax's original comments after the lotto where he was excited to be in the top 2 so they could get size and athleticism, it goes to say that LA or TT have always been his target.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> I think Thomas/Sene is the goal
> 
> "Size, athleticism & length"


Yup, I see it the same way. 

"he’s the most gifted athlete in this draft." - Pax speaking about Thomas. 

That quote from Pax's latest interview has me convinced that Thomas is his guy.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> johnny "red" kerr on  the draft  (top item)


It must be nice to not have to give a rats' *** about the draft.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



remlover said:


> Paxson didn't sound really gung-ho about Roy. It could be GM speak or the fact that Roy isnt that high on Paxson's radar and is just a smokescreen.
> 
> From Pax's comments it sure sounds like TT is their guy. I'm sure if i reread the article i'll get the impression that Pax instead covets Aldridge.
> 
> If you go by Pax's original comments after the lotto where he was excited to be in the top 2 so they could get size and athleticism, it goes to say that LA or TT have always been his target.


Well, it seems like the Roy talk was cut off a bit since it's only half the interview. I'd assume part two of the interview will continue with more about Roy, then end with the other guys like Morrison, Gay and Bargnani.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



remlover said:


> Paxson didn't sound really gung-ho about Roy. It could be GM speak or the fact that Roy isnt that high on Paxson's radar and is just a smokescreen.


Miz contacted Mike McGraw and he said that the Roy consideration was just a smokescreen.

I'm pretty sure it was a post from Miz


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Miz contacted Mike McGraw and he said that the Roy consideration was just a smokescreen.
> 
> I'm pretty sure it was a post from Miz


Hey Miz,

Have you and McGraw talked about Tyrus vs LaMarcus at 2? If so, what'd he think? Is it almost a sure thing he is picking Tyrus at 2, as most signs indicate?

*Edit:* Miz, any idea who Pax considers @ 16


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Another thing I don't think many noticed...

Pax really NEVER talks about Bargnani

But I don't think it's cause he doesn't LIKE him

I think it's because he knows these GM's personally and I'm sure he knows Colangelo is taking Bargnani


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Another thing I don't think many noticed...
> 
> Pax really NEVER talks about Bargnani
> 
> But I don't think it's cause he doesn't LIKE him
> 
> I think it's because he knows these GM's personally and I'm sure he knows Colangelo is taking Bargnani


Or maybe Bargnani has a shrinkage problem, and would have problems against the jib filled players in the shower?


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

OK, that was a pretty interesting interview, and as usual I don't think Pax is really blowing smoke. Lots of little things creep out when he starts talking that, coupled with the things he's said in the past about the directions he wants to go, are very telling.

I think Thomas is that guy.

He's said all along he wants to get athletic, and he thinks Thomas is the best athlete in the draft. He's not concerned about the tweener stuff, considering that the way the game is played, especially by the Bulls, it can be made to work. We've got two other guys, Deng and Noc, that he'll somewhat complement. I was very interested to see that he brought up the fact that Thomas is going have a big adjustment coming out of his relatively sheltered upbringing. That was the money quote of the whole interview, I thought:



> _His college coach has voiced concerns for him leaving a tight-knit community and adjusting to his new surroundings. Is that a concern for an organization?_ “I think that whoever takes Tyrus is going to have to provide an environment where he can be comfortable. All the guys he played with at LSU, or at least the majority of them, were guys he had known since something like sixth grade. So they go way back. He didn’t go through the AAU system, so he never traveled to Vegas or Orlando and did what those kids do. He’s going to have to be in an environment that really supports him. Any organization that takes him is going to have to provide that for him. We knew that going in.”


That's been my biggest concern with him, and it eases my mind a lot to kow the Bulls are cognizant of it. 

I think they came away fairly unimpressed with Aldridge. He did muster that he'll be a "successful NBA player" and that he'll be able to swing between the 4 and the 5, but it was hard to see how Pax thought Aldridge's "workout" was anything but a disappointment. Perhaps he was trying to put some pressure on Aldridge to get back in for a competitive workout (By the way, Aldridge seems quite likely to hurt himself doing this... I can see him falling).

It was also interesting that he noted part of his lack of offense at Texas was due to Daniel Gibson, but that he thought part of the blame, for lack of a better term, lay on Aldridge too. But he's young. I got the sense they'd be ok taking him, but they aren't exactly enamoured with him either.

He didn't say anything about what Roy brought to the table, which I thought was telling. And given the vote of confidence he gave Ben, you'd think he'd at least make a case for how Roy was worthy of a pick there. He didn't really do that.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

There’s been a lot of talk lately about how if Brandon Roy comes in, obviously you’re going to trade Ben Gordon.

“I’ll put this to bed. Unless a blockbuster deal comes up, I’m not trading Ben Gordon. I think that he is extremely valuable. You never say never; I understand that in this business. No one has presented anything to me that I would remotely consider for Ben. I think that Ben is going to be a better player this year than he was last year. The kid works at his game, he’s got pride, and I expect that he’s going to come back ready to go. Whatever position we draft, in my mind does not affect Ben Gordon. He’s going to come in and do what he has to do to compete. So I don’t see that as an issue at all.”


Its draft time and Pax is a GM, but that is about as emphatic as one can possibly be.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



MikeDC said:


> OK, that was a pretty interesting interview, and as usual I don't think Pax is really blowing smoke. Lots of little things creep out when he starts talking that, coupled with the things he's said in the past about the directions he wants to go, are very telling.
> 
> I think Thomas is that guy.
> 
> He's said all along he wants to get athletic, and he thinks Thomas is the best athlete in the draft. He's not concerned about the tweener stuff, considering that the way the game is played, especially by the Bulls, it can be made to work. We've got two other guys, Deng and Noc, that he'll somewhat complement. I was very interested to see that he brought up the fact that Thomas is going have a big adjustment coming out of his relatively sheltered upbringing. That was the money quote of the whole interview, I thought:
> 
> 
> 
> That's been my biggest concern with him, and it eases my mind a lot to kow the Bulls are cognizant of it.
> 
> I think they came away fairly unimpressed with Aldridge. He did muster that he'll be a "successful NBA player" and that he'll be able to swing between the 4 and the 5, but it was hard to see how Pax thought Aldridge's "workout" was anything but a disappointment. Perhaps he was trying to put some pressure on Aldridge to get back in for a competitive workout (By the way, Aldridge seems quite likely to hurt himself doing this... I can see him falling).
> 
> It was also interesting that he noted part of his lack of offense at Texas was due to Daniel Gibson, but that he thought part of the blame, for lack of a better term, lay on Aldridge too. But he's young. I got the sense they'd be ok taking him, but they aren't exactly enamoured with him either.
> 
> He didn't say anything about what Roy brought to the table, which I thought was telling. And given the vote of confidence he gave Ben, you'd think he'd at least make a case for how Roy was worthy of a pick there. He didn't really do that.


 Agree on all accounts Mike. One things for sure, we're not drafting Daniel Gibson.

Re: Thomas . . . Just the pharse, "We knew that going in." You haven't drafted him yet Pax. No reason for spin control yet!


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> There’s been a lot of talk lately about how if Brandon Roy comes in, obviously you’re going to trade Ben Gordon.
> 
> “I’ll put this to bed. Unless a blockbuster deal comes up, I’m not trading Ben Gordon. I think that he is extremely valuable. You never say never; I understand that in this business. No one has presented anything to me that I would remotely consider for Ben. I think that Ben is going to be a better player this year than he was last year. The kid works at his game, he’s got pride, and I expect that he’s going to come back ready to go. Whatever position we draft, in my mind does not affect Ben Gordon. He’s going to come in and do what he has to do to compete. So I don’t see that as an issue at all.”
> 
> 
> Its draft time and Pax is a GM, but that is about as emphatic as one can possibly be.


Hopefully Ben starts picking up his offseason work a little more.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



MikeDC said:


> OK, that was a pretty interesting interview, and as usual I don't think Pax is really blowing smoke. Lots of little things creep out when he starts talking that, coupled with the things he's said in the past about the directions he wants to go, are very telling.
> 
> I think Thomas is that guy.
> 
> He's said all along he wants to get athletic, and he thinks Thomas is the best athlete in the draft. He's not concerned about the tweener stuff, considering that the way the game is played, especially by the Bulls, it can be made to work. We've got two other guys, Deng and Noc, that he'll somewhat complement. I was very interested to see that he brought up the fact that Thomas is going have a big adjustment coming out of his relatively sheltered upbringing. That was the money quote of the whole interview, I thought:
> 
> That's been my biggest concern with him, and it eases my mind a lot to kow the Bulls are cognizant of it.
> 
> I think they came away fairly unimpressed with Aldridge. He did muster that he'll be a "successful NBA player" and that he'll be able to swing between the 4 and the 5, but it was hard to see how Pax thought Aldridge's "workout" was anything but a disappointment. Perhaps he was trying to put some pressure on Aldridge to get back in for a competitive workout (By the way, Aldridge seems quite likely to hurt himself doing this... I can see him falling).
> 
> It was also interesting that he noted part of his lack of offense at Texas was due to Daniel Gibson, but that he thought part of the blame, for lack of a better term, lay on Aldridge too. But he's young. I got the sense they'd be ok taking him, but they aren't exactly enamoured with him either.
> 
> He didn't say anything about what Roy brought to the table, which I thought was telling. And given the vote of confidence he gave Ben, you'd think he'd at least make a case for how Roy was worthy of a pick there. He didn't really do that.


In a way, you kind of get the feeling of what he's gonna do.

Some posters on REALGM interpreted from the interview that Aldridge is HIS guy LOL I don't know how they got that one but it certainly doesn't SOUND like it.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Interesting take, Mike.

FWIW, Thomas's managing to avoid the AAU apparatus is likely a huge, huge plus in Pax's eyes. In at least 2-3 of the radio interviews I've listened to this year, Pax basically blames the AAU/HS summer travel leagues for the downfall of civilization, global warming, etc.


----------



## laso

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I think you guys are reading way too much in what he says. Basically his comments praise all three players and highlight how each player would fill a need in what the Bulls need:

Aldridge: He is a true inside player (which was not apparent in college cause his point guard sucked). We need inside game. He'll fit well.

Thomas: He is an athletic freak. He doesn't have a position but that's OK, in today's game a player can play without a position and still do well. And he'll fit well cause we need athletic freaks.

Roy: He will round up our 3 guard rotation. He can play with Kirk and with Ben (cause he can also handle.) And we need someone who can defend shooting guards and fits well with our already two super talented guards.

Viewed like this, all three choices make sense. Paxson has kept his options open.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Don't know whaat YOU were reading..but he definintely didn't "praise" all 3 players



> don’t think his strength right now is the low post game because he doesn’t have the base yet to hold that position.


How is he a true "inside" player?? inside what!? lol


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

He uses the words "Right now" and "Yet" in the same sentence while talking about a prospect. Big deal.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Hopefully he takes Thomas or Aldrdige. I like Aldridge more than Thomas, but if its down to those three, Brandon Roy at 2 is my worst nightmare on draftday.


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I know this is a tad of subject but i didnt want to make a whole new thread about it.
Im looking for videos of bulls players getting drafted on draft night, can anyone hook me up with any of them???????????


----------



## RoRo

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



OziBull said:


> I know this is a tad of subject but i didnt want to make a whole new thread about it.
> Im looking for videos of bulls players getting drafted on draft night, can anyone hook me up with any of them???????????


you might not find all the bulls, but there's some draft history pics and video on the nba site.
http://www.nba.com/draft2006/


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Thanks RoRo mate, yeah i knew that was there but im looking for downloadable ones


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The stories on Pax's press conference:

Paxson won't tip hand on draft picks 



> John Paxson had glowing remarks Thursday about Tyrus Thomas.
> 
> But the praise for Thomas doesn't necessarily mean the Bulls' general manager plans to pick the 6-foot-8-inch forward from Louisiana State with the No. 2 pick in Wednesday's NBA draft.
> Paxson was equally complimentary of LaMarcus Aldridge, Brandon Roy, Adam Morrison, Rudy Gay and Andrea Bargnani when giving reporters an evaluation of this year's draft.
> 
> Paxson had been mum since potential top-five picks began auditioning for the Bulls 10 days ago. When he finally commented Thursday at the Berto Center, he didn't tip his hand on whom he will select with the Nos. 2 or 16 picks.
> 
> He said he still hasn't narrowed his choices to a single player at either spot and isn't ruling out a trade.


Garcia breaks down his remarks.

Mike has two stories out of the press-conference:

Paxson makes it clear: Gordon staying put  



> If the Bulls select Washington guard Brandon Roy in Wednesday’s NBA draft, some might assume the team’s next step would be to shop Ben Gordon in a trade.
> 
> That’s absolutely not the case, according to Bulls general manager John Paxson.
> 
> “I’ll put this to bed,” Paxson said Thursday. “Unless a blockbuster deal comes up, I’m not trading Ben Gordon. I think he is extremely valuable. No one has presented anything to me that I would remotely consider for Ben.”


If the Bulls do choose Roy with the second pick, they expect to use him in a three-guard rotation with Gordon and Kirk Hinrich.

Bulls’ Paxson: No easy answer for Wade, James  



> An obvious question is, which draft pick will give the Bulls the best chance of handling Wade and James down the road?
> 
> Texas center LaMarcus Aldridge could become an effective post scorer, which might make the game easier for the Bulls’ perimeter players.
> 
> LSU forward Tyrus Thomas is a great leaper and may be able to swat away some shots when one of those stars drives to the basket.
> 
> Washington’s Brandon Roy, a multi-skilled 6-foot-6 guard, might have the best chance of guarding those two.
> 
> Paxson acknowledged that he hasn’t made up his mind yet about which player to draft with the second pick, and there are a few candidates.
> 
> That statement is consistent with what’s already been written. Most of the Bulls’ debate has focused on Thomas or Roy, while Aldridge and Gonzaga forward Adam Morrison are getting some support.
> 
> Italy’s Andrea Bargnani, who may go No. 1 to Toronto, and Connecticut forward Rudy Gay are longshots for the Bulls.
> 
> “We’ve had great debates about this draft at the top and at (No.) 16,” Paxson said. “I think all of us wish it was a little more clear-cut, but that’s part of the fun of it, too.”
> 
> According to Paxson, the Bulls have discussed at great length how to contend with Wade and James, but that probably won’t be a deciding factor when making the draft picks.


Hanley in the Sun-Times:

Bulls' planning picks up steam 



> Paxson and his staff have watched workouts, games and countless videos of all the players on the team's draft board. They will spend the weekend sorting through medical and psychological tests administered in the pre-draft process.
> 
> "There's not a perfect player,'' Paxson said of what is considered the most wide-open draft in years. "So your job is to analyze them, break it down the best you can -- and sometimes you can overanalyze it, too.''
> 
> Though Paxson gave no hints as to which players the Bulls are leaning toward, he did talk about some of the prospects predicted to be available at their spots


And Southtown Paul:

Bulls' Paxson still mulling options  



> "It's still open to debate," Paxson said. "All of us would sleep a little better at night if it was more clear cut, but that's part of the fun of it."
> 
> The situation is complicated by the many options of the Toronto Raptors, who own the first overall pick.
> 
> While Paxson did not name names, indications are the short list includes forward-center LaMarcus Aldridge (Texas), guard Brandon Roy (Washington) and forward Tyrus Thomas (LSU).
> 
> Paxson said several teams expressed interest in the No. 2 pick. He wouldn't discount the possibility of a trade for a proven veteran player.
> 
> "This might be a chance for us to take a shot at something that maybe you wouldn't ordinarily do," Paxson said. "We've got good, young talent and were a playoff team last season. I like the position we're in right now. I really do."
> 
> Neither Aldridge nor Thomas went through a full-scale workout at the Berto Center earlier this month.
> 
> At the advice of their agents, Aldridge and Thomas took part only in individual drills. Thomas was at less than peak physical condition because of stomach and groin problems on both of his visits.
> 
> "It's not the best-case scenario," Paxson conceded. "All of us would like to have every player to go against someone or in a group of four guys on the floor. But the agents try to position their guys the best they can, so there's no sense to complain or worry about it too much."


While there's no knew news in any of these stories, it's just interesting to see what they chose to highlight in the stories. Plus it gives everyone more ammunition to argue over the meaning of Pax's words. :biggrin:


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Hopefully Ben starts picking up his offseason work a little more.


i don't know where you've been but Ben Gordon is probably one of the hardest workers on our team. He was the biggest gym rat according to Paxson and Skiles last off season. and quite frankly he may not have made a huge improvement this season as many expected from him. but for him to have maintained his scoring ability with EXTRA attention is the focal point of the chicago bulls offense. he did extremely well. he'll only get better...


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Trade Talk @ Draft Express 



> Portland is almost definitely trading the #30 and #31 picks. Don't be surprised to see them package those picks to New Jersey for the #22 pick.


Makes me think, we should be able to get at least one of those, maybe both to trade down to 4. Then package these picks along with 16 to move up to grab Brewer.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Trade Talk @ Draft Express
> 
> 
> 
> Makes me think, we should be able to get at least one of those, maybe both to trade down to 4. Then package these picks along with 16 to move up to grab Brewer.


To get Brewer then im with you.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



narek said:


> Bulls' Paxson still mulling options
> 
> "*This might be a chance for us to take a shot at something that maybe you wouldn't ordinarily do*," Paxson said. "We've got good, young talent and were a playoff team last season. I like the position we're in right now. I really do."


THOMAS.

It's like he's already starting to prepare everyone for this pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Ford & Tellum on why Roy/Aldridge didn't show in Charlotte :



> "They didn't show because I'm very comfortable where they're going in the draft," Tellem said.
> 
> Asked if that meant that a specific team had committed to taking them, Tellem said, "I know where they're going, yes."
> 
> How can all of these guys have promises?
> 
> "I've never been caught up on the number of where a guy goes," Tellem said. "It's about finding the right situation for our clients. In this case, we've found a good fit for both of them, so there's no need for them to work out for anyone else."
> 
> Does that mean Tellem would discourage other teams from drafting Aldridge or Roy?
> 
> "I don't think it will get to that," Tellem said. "Both are going very high. But if that needs to happen, I'll do it."
> 
> 1. Let's say the Bulls have decided to draft Roy at No. 2 or they've agreed to a trade and are taking Roy for another team. The Lakers have been after Roy and there's been a lot of speculation about Lamar Odom coming to Chicago in such a trade.
> 
> "Bottom line, we're just not happy with the way things went down,'' he told the Charlotte Observer.
> 
> The draft just got a whole lot more mysterious, folks.


This draft is very weird indeed


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> i don't know where you've been but Ben Gordon is probably one of the hardest workers on our team. He was the biggest gym rat according to Paxson and Skiles last off season. and quite frankly he may not have made a huge improvement this season as many expected from him. but for him to have maintained his scoring ability with EXTRA attention is the focal point of the chicago bulls offense. he did extremely well. he'll only get better...


He's just spending a little too much time on the computer and playing XBOX for my liking, yeah he's a gym rat in NBA 2k6 right now....


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'd thinking we'd be taking Aldridge over Roy. 

But then again, if Bargnani is available at 2 and Toronto takes Aldridge #1, Paxson better be hustling over to that meeting. 

I don't see how either guy got a promise from the Bulls, Paxson said he's going to make his decision on draft night, and that he's going to do all the major evaluation for his decision this weekend.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

*Very Interesting * tidbit at RealGM from poster CJE about Brandon Roy. Apparently Roy had a radio interview, he thinks he will be traded to a team on draft day. He failed to indicate that he worked out for the Lakers.

Here is the link for the interview: Roy Radio Interview - Real Player Audio

I wonder how much truth there is behind this. This goes along with Chad Ford's Insider report that Roy and Aldridge seem to know where they are headed.

Edit: Trade talk occurs after 11min in the audio feed.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Ehh

Sounds like we might be doing that Lamar Odom deal.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I think somewhere in this thread that there was a debate about Tyrus growing at his age. See Pax's response (I was right nya nya lol)


Thomas thought that he made enough perimeter shots during his workout to play out there at times. Do you agree with that assessment? 

“Tyrus is a kid that right now does not have a defined position. He’s not a three and he’s not really a four right now. I’m not so sure that’s a bad thing, either. He’s so gifted athletically and he’s got an improving skill level, so I don’t think it’s a bad thing. He shot it OK. We stretched him out a little further and he’s not a three-point shooter, but he’s the most gifted athlete in this draft. There’s no doubt about that. He’s going to have to get stronger. *He’s only going to be 20 in August, and sometimes the body doesn’t naturally mature for another year or two.” *


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Ehh
> 
> Sounds like we might be doing that Lamar Odom deal.


Don't be so sure. The deal might also be:

Houston: #8 pick, Luther Head
Minnesota: #6 pick

Houston takes Roy with the #6 pick in this scenario.

Would someone please remind me when teams start using 06/07 salary figures in trades. In other words, when are we under the cap?


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The bulls are not trading for Odom these rumors are silly. first, pax has made it clear he doesnt want players like odom (Pot head under achievers) and second we alread have deng and noci who IMHO are already as good as odom and in a year or two will be better.

Pax wants size and muscle at SG and PF and that is that. Odom is a SF.

david


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> The bulls are not trading for Odom these rumors are silly. first, pax has made it clear he doesnt want players like odom (Pot head under achievers) and second we alread have deng and noci who IMHO are already as good as odom and in a year or two will be better.
> 
> Pax wants size and muscle at SG and PF and that is that. Odom is a SF.
> 
> david


Odom had played his best at the PF position though. He also has averaged 9.7 rebounds per game over the last 3 years. He's also an underrated post player. He's 6' 10" 230. I think he's fine at the 4 these days.

I agree that he's somewhat of an underachiever, and I do worry a little about his character, but he hasn't really slipped up in the last three years to my knowledge. Some people do mature, you know.

I only like this deal if we send Chandler out, honestly. I've given up hope that he's going to be offensively useful enough to be worth his deal. 

Nobody has told me whether we could swing this deal on draft day or not due to 05/06-06-7 turnover issues (I believe as of right now, we are over the cap). Anyway, I could live with Odom and the #26 pick for Chandler and the #2 pick. Hopefully we could get Mardy Collins with the #26 pick.

I'd prefer to just take Roy though, but you all knew that.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> e hasn't really slipped up in the last three years to my knowledge. Some people do mature, you know.
> 
> I only like this deal if we send Chandler out, honestly. I've given up hope that he's going to be offensively useful enough to be worth his deal.


Did you ever think he'd be good enough offensively to be worth 10 mil? His value lies in his defense.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> Did you ever think he'd be good enough offensively to be worth 10 mil? His value lies in his defense.


Yeah, and last year, his defense wasn't that great either. 

Tyson was so much better two years ago than last year. That's just not a good sign. I feel he has lost his confidence, and I'm not sure how he's going to get it back.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Yeah, and last year, his defense wasn't that great either.
> 
> Tyson was so much better two years ago than last year. That's just not a good sign. I feel he has lost his confidence, and I'm not sure how he's going to get it back.


You don't think a 24 year old has a chance to repeat and even improve on a season he had as a 22 year old? Also, don't you think that not playing next to any competent bigs hurt Chandler last season?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> You don't think a 24 year old has a chance to repeat and even improve on a season he had as a 22 year old? Also, don't you think that not playing next to any competent bigs hurt Chandler last season?


I suppose Tyson could turn it around, but he wouldn't be worth his contract, IMO, even if he produced as he did two years ago. This contract was based on Tyson progressing. Instead, he regressed. He still doesn't commit to living and training in Chicago in the offseason. 

In my estimation, I don't think he's going to be worth his deal when it is all said and done. Therefore, I would consider trading him in a package for players who are worth their deals. If we do that, I want to make sure we don't lose too much height.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

2006 Green Room Invites

Adam Morrison
Tyrus Thomas
Rudy Gay
LaMarcus Aldridge
Andrea Bargnani 
Brandon Roy
Marcus Williams
Randy Foye
Patrick O'Bryant
Shelden Williams
Ronnie Brewer
Cedric Simmons
Rodney Carney
J.J. Redick 
Hilton Armstrong


----------



## GB

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> The bulls are not trading for Odom these rumors are silly. first, pax has made it clear he doesnt want ...Pot head under achievers


Odom isn't.


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:



> Don't be so sure. The deal might also be:
> 
> Houston: #8 pick, Luther Head
> Minnesota: #6 pick
> 
> Houston takes Roy with the #6 pick in this scenario.


I also think it'll be Houston with Roy, but my strong hunch right now is that the deal is with Atlanta.
#5 (Roy) and Lue for #8 (Shelden Williams) and Alston. I think the filler will be Alston rather than Head since Atlanta would have more of a use for Alston, and Houston wouldn't really need a true PG with Roy and TMac on the court. From comments near the end of the season, it sounds like Mike James is heading back there anyway.

Shelden cancelled his workouts right before visiting the TWolves, which gets him past #6. He'd just need to make it past the Celtics (#7), who did work him out, but I think they'll go for a PG. Roy at 5 and Williams at 8 are right about where they probably should go value-wise.

The only thing bugging me about this theory is I'm just not sure why Shelden would accept a promise at #8. I guess his range is probably from #7 to #15 and decided to take the sure thing rather potentially than slide a few spots.


As for the Aldridge promise, I think it came from Portland.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> "I don't necessarily want to get all that much younger, but there's no guarantees going into the free-agent market that we're going to be able to find something at a good price for all those [needs]. We have to address our size. That's a given.''


This right here should let you know he's going BIG with the pick.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Portland desperately wants Morrison. I doubt they gave a promise to Aldridge.


----------



## GB

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Oh wow.

I just read that Trib article. I got a weird Morrison vibe from it. I think it might be Morrison or Gay.


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Portland desperately wants Morrison. I doubt they gave a promise to Aldridge.


Yeah, just call it a hunch, but I don't see anyone else that would give him a promise that he would accept unless it's us and Pax has everyone fooled. I don't think he'd accept a promise at 5 or 6 since that's about his worst case scenario anyway. He might be trying to avoid Atlanta, though I'm not sure I'd really prefer the Portland situation either. Whoever ends up with the #1 pick doesn't need to promise anyone anything. Charlotte doesn't need him and Jordan hasn't seen him. That just leaves us, but if we've promised anyone anything, it would be Thomas.

Incidentally, if I were Portland, I'd definitely have Morrison at the top of my draft board, but ignoring that, I'm just trying to figure out who would give Aldridge a promise, and by all accounts, Portland likes him.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



GB said:


> Oh wow.
> 
> I just read that Trib article. I got a weird Morrison vibe from it. I think it might be Morrison or Gay.


?

How? because he said Morrison could play some 2guard?

We all like Morrison and Gay...but they're not coming here unless someone is moved


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> ?
> 
> How? because he said Morrison could play some 2guard?
> 
> We all like Morrison and Gay...but they're not coming here unless someone is moved



I don't like Morrisson that much. If Pax thinks they can play the 2 then why would anyone be moved? I got weird vibes when Pax was talking about Morrisson playing the two as well, I hope he doesn't draft him....


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> I don't like Morrisson that much. If Pax thinks they can play the 2 then why would anyone be moved? I got weird vibes when Pax was talking about Morrisson playing the two as well, I hope he doesn't draft him....


I just don't see why you'd draft a player like Morrison to bring off the bench...

I'm sure if Gordon comes off the bench, all hell will break loose....

I like Morrison, but that kid isn't a SG lol


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



GB said:


> Oh wow.
> 
> I just read that Trib article. I got a weird Morrison vibe from it. I think it might be Morrison or Gay.


you do? then that's marlen's vibe, i think. i get no such vibe. i would be stunned if pax drafted either rudy or morrison. even with the quotes. 



comcast has an audio interview up with pax - cuts into a sentence at the beginning so we don't know who "they both do" is.

he also clears up the skiles staredown thing. it's still the funniest pre-draft story. 

http://chicago.comcastsportsnet.com/multimedia.asp

top audio item dated 6/22


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

i think mcgraw (today's DH) has a better feel:



> Paxson acknowledged that he hasn’t made up his mind yet about which player to draft with the second pick, and there are a few candidates.
> 
> That statement is consistent with what’s already been written. Most of the Bulls’ debate has focused on Thomas or Roy, while Aldridge and Gonzaga forward Adam Morrison are getting some support.
> 
> Italy’s Andrea Bargnani, who may go No. 1 to Toronto, and Connecticut forward Rudy Gay are longshots for the Bulls.


----------



## GB

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> you do?


Yeah, because if it applies to Roy, then it applies to Morrison:



> If the Bulls do choose Roy with the second pick, they expect to use him in a three-guard rotation with Gordon and Kirk Hinrich.
> 
> “Whatever position we draft, in my mind, does not affect Ben Gordon,” Paxson added. “Ben’s going to come in and do what he has to do to compete. I don’t see that as an issue at all.”


And he's and Gay are skilled, not projects, something Paxson likes. Plus the comments on the cut of the jib exist only for Morrison. Sounds like he's prepping the fans for something...



> "He moves around the floor real well. I wasn't the most gifted athletically. I figured out how to defend over 11 years in the NBA."
> --
> "I loved his comment—he said he knows he's going to be playing against the best of the best when he gets to the league so why not work out against the best in this draft," Paxson said. "That's about as good a comment as you can hear."


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> comcast has an audio interview up with pax - cuts into a sentence at the beginning so we don't know who "they both do" is.
> 
> he also clears up the skiles staredown thing. it's still the funniest pre-draft story.
> 
> http://chicago.comcastsportsnet.com/multimedia.asp
> 
> top audio item dated 6/22


Oh my. It's even a funnier story when you hear Pax filling in the blanks. But wait until Ben Wallace comes to town for a FA visit (and he will if just to make Detroit anti up more) and they go out!


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Apologies if this has already been posted:

http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1364

It's an interview with Thabo Sefolosha. Good stuff. Seems very level-headed and mature. If we don't get Brewer I would be just fine with Sefolosha.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Seems very level-headed and mature.


Of course -- he's Swiss!


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Apologies if this has already been posted:
> 
> http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1364
> 
> It's an interview with Thabo Sefolosha. Good stuff. Seems very level-headed and mature. If we don't get Brewer I would be just fine with Sefolosha.


Yup, I like what he's got to offer.

For 16, my choices are (so far)
1. Brewer
2. Thabo
3. Carney. At the 16 pick, you aren't going to get a guy who's perfect, so you sort of have to pick your poison. I'd hope his iffy head works out and take a guy who's an absolute freak of nature as an athlete.
4. Sene - Seems interesting, but I think lost in the fact that he's 30 feet long is that he's raw as sushi. He looks like a Dalembert or Sagana Diop level project to me. Years from contributing, but obviously he's got some eye raising capabilities.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



MikeDC said:


> Yup, I like what he's got to offer.
> 
> For 16, my choices are (so far)
> 1. Brewer
> 2. Thabo
> 3. Carney. At the 16 pick, you aren't going to get a guy who's perfect, so you sort of have to pick your poison. I'd hope his iffy head works out and take a guy who's an absolute freak of nature as an athlete.
> 4. Sene - Seems interesting, but I think lost in the fact that he's 30 feet long is that he's raw as sushi. He looks like a Dalembert or Sagana Diop level project to me. Years from contributing, but obviously he's got some eye raising capabilities.


That's about how I see it, with Alexander Johnson a close 5th. Unfortunately, I think there's virtually no way Brewer lasts that long.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1366




> Tyrus Thomas flew into Houston today for measurements and an interview, DraftExpress learned today. Thomas' agent Brian Elfus would not deny nor confirm the visit, stating that he has "no comment." Thomas flew in from Baton Rouge for a brief visit and flew back to Louisiana just a few hours later.
> 
> Rumors of a trade between Portland and Houston are likely rumored to be the reason for Thomas' visit today. Both teams are reportedly in discussions for swapping their picks (#4 for #8), but the exact details are still unknown.
> 
> *Thomas was seeking assurances that the Chicago Bulls will draft him with the #2 pick, but has received nothing of that nature at this point.*



Hmm, interesting. As of today, Tyrus's camp isn't even sure we're going to draft him. It looks like we really haven't promised him.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> That's about how I see it, with Alexander Johnson a close 5th. Unfortunately, I think there's virtually no way Brewer lasts that long.


Yeah, I've concluded that there's no way Brewer drops lower than 10th. More than likely, I think he's gone by #7 or #8. He's blown everyone away in both workouts and measurements. He's tall, super long arms, one of the best verticals in the draft, quick, proven defender, terrific all-around skills. He's going to be a very good starter for a long time.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

This question stems from Such Sweet Thunder's thread about the green room...

Would you guys be happy grabbing Cedric Simmons or Hilton Armstrong @ 16? Would you guys pick them over Thabo (if Brewer does not fall)? If you had to pick between either big man, who would you pick? I have not seen Simmons, but I have seen Armstrong play. I think Armstrong can become a player who resemble's a poor man's PJ Brown.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> I have not seen Simmons, but I have seen Armstrong play. I think Armstrong can become a player who resemble's a poor man's PJ Brown.


Armstrong's trash LOL

But Cedric? He's the fortunate he's a BIG guy because he looks like a basic big. I compared him to another player earlier in this thread and it wasn't a good thing. Go to draftexpress.com and find that link with the video's of all the lotto picks, check out that vid.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> "I like agressive players and kid's that don't shy away from the competition"


Aldridge isn't coming here LOL


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Am i the only one who think this draft is totally up for grabs. The draft is different from anyone i can remember. atl is or isnt trading down. Portland is or isnt trading down. Houston wants thomas but if so who does pax take. I can believe he will take roy at 2. He could get him at 5.

And someone between 15 and 10 is going to take someone that no one expects and who know who will fall to 16. This seems more like las vegas than the draft.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Pax gettin Thomas, wish it was Barg's though.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Am I the only one who doesn't see Thomas from these? With all the competitive fire and stuff, I'd see Gay and Morrison as the top 2 players on Paxson's list if it was just based on competitive fire.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

If I were a betting man (and I suc* pretty much while doing it), I say the Bulls picks are Roy and Sene.


----------



## step

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> I'd see Gay and Morrison as the top 2 players on Paxson's list if it was just based on competitive fire.


Gay top 2? We're talking about the same "competitive" player who becomes invisible when it counts the most?


----------



## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

My worst case draft scenario would have to be TT and Sene, all potential and no significant help soon.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Hustle said:


> My worst case draft scenario would have to be TT and Sene, all potential and no significant help soon.


If you want help soon, draft Shelden Williams and Reddick. 

I'd rather gamble on upside and get immediate help via FA.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



step said:


> Gay top 2? We're talking about the same "competitive" player who becomes invisible when it counts the most?


The same guy who called out Tyrus Thomas and said he would dominate tyrus showing better low post skills than Tyrus....who both had a June 19th workout scheduled for the Bulls....in which Tyrus had to reschedule for the 15th....for some reason....and then was in town on the 20th for another workout.....

I wonder if Gay vs. Morrison will ever develop into a rivalry in the league, definitely played each other a lot during the workouts. The Aldridge not working out competitively, and Roy, Aldridge, and Williams constantly cancelling workouts, and Reddick for that matter makes sense, why, their agent. He is positioning his clients for where they want to go, and where they don't want to go. So Aldridge not being in competitive workouts falls in line with everything else his agent does, his agent is a mastermind, and all his clients are probaly going to end up happy on draft night...while Thomas could slip, I don't know who the hell these guys are that Thomas hired, but the other two guys they represent will probaly never play an NBA minute. So Thomas rescheduling for the Bulls workout would be more Thomas imo than his agent, just like the draftexpress problem was more of Thomas with his agent, because if his agent was any real good professional, they'd know that mock drafts don't have dicksquat on a real team's draftboard.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Sorry, but workouts dont get you trophies.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> If you want help soon, draft Shelden Williams and Reddick.
> 
> I'd rather gamble on upside and get immediate help via FA.


That actually wouldn't be a bad draft. 

But 2 is probaly too high for Williams, and 16 too low for Reddick. Interesting stuff there.

PG-Kirk Hirnich/Chris Duhon
SG-Ben Gordon/JJ Reddick
SF-Andres Nocioni/Luol Deng
PF-Shelden Williams/Darius Songaila
C- Tyson Chandler/Malik Allen

And thats just coming out of the draft. Good job. :clap:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Those two would make this a very bland team...I'm a big Shelden fan though...

Brewer and Shelden would be better


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1366




_Update #2: (9:45 PM) DraftExpress was informed by *multiple sources that Tyrus Thomas also conducted a “very private meeting" with the Timberwolves on Wednesday* at the Target Center, further confirming the notion that he is still searching for a floor if the Bulls decide to go in another direction with the #2 pick._


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1366
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Update #2: (9:45 PM) DraftExpress was informed by *multiple sources that Tyrus Thomas also conducted a “very private meeting" with the Timberwolves on Wednesday* at the Target Center, further confirming the notion that he is still searching for a floor if the Bulls decide to go in another direction with the #2 pick._


Like I said in one of the many draft threads here, Aldridge, Roy, Reddick, and S. Williams with Tellem are in a good position with the cancellations of workouts, he is a real agent, and is playing the game, and all his clients will be happy on draft day. Thomas has some agent whose other clients probaly won't see a minute in the NBA, maybe Tony Skinn, but its a long shot. Thomas' agent tried to play the game, and I think he lost.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I don't think they played a game

I think his agents possibly came to some sort of medium with Paxson and thought/think it was a given they'd take Thomas.

Now that they see the Bulls possibly thinking about trading the pick or going in a different direction, they still need to try and find a position in which their client can succeed.

By reading this whole Thomas/Agents/Bulls situation, we should know that obviously something has been discussed by these parties but no mutual agreement has been reached. Atleast, that's what it sounds like.

They want a promise from Chicago and haven't recieved one yet.


----------



## superdave

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Bring on the freaks Pax...Ty Thomas at #2 and James White #16.

That would be fun to watch next season. Someone slap some sense into me. :angel:


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

From that DraftExpress report that Miz posted, it says that Portland (also gives up 30 + 31) and Houston have talked about swapping picks. Portland wants to get rid of Miles, and would pick up Juwan Howard's contract to do so. Houston rejected. Now, I do not know who Houston wants, whether it is Tyrus or Roy. More than likely it will be Roy.

I see Portland wanting to move down. But all along, I thought their guy would likely be one of Aldridge, Morrison, and Roy, with Morrison being the latter two being the likely candidates as they need a new face of the franchise and a local guy would help.

It does appear if we do not pick Tyrus at 2, he is the most likely to slip as he has limited his workout for a number of teams. He could squeeze this some before the draft. But he could slip to Minny, Houston, or maybe even further (GSW)? Hey, anything is possible on draft day. 

I don't think we can make a trade with Portland if we do not pick up Miles' contract, which none of us will and would want. The thing is, I would love to gain those additional Portland picks and trade down to 4, which good chances Tyrus is still there. 

Sorry for the long post, but does Portland seem to want to drop down in the draft and not move up to get their guy? As they were rumored to? 

Agh. I'd love to get our guy, get their picks and have a way to move up and grab Brewer!


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Another not so big man that is on the market is Luis Scola. I read today (saturday) that San Antonio told Scola that they wont bring him in and that they are looking to trade his rights.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Pax gettin Thomas, wish it was Barg's though.


ditto


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Southtown Paul with a draft story with stuff that hasn't been everywhere else:

http://www.dailysouthtown.com/southtown/dssports/pro/242sd1.htm



> The Bulls did not have a first-round draft pick last year, but in retrospect, Paxson wished they did.
> 
> After a review of the wish list of a year ago, Paxson found he and his staff were on target for the most part.
> 
> "We kept in mind how (the rookies) performed this year, and (the projections) were pretty good," Paxson said. "Without a pick we didn't have the ability to bring in many people (for workouts) to get to know them. I don't know if that says the draft was kind of clear-cut or what."
> 
> Paxson didn't disclose the names on the list, except to say Illinois guard Deron Williams was among the top five players.


Interesting that they went and rated the top players and projected them out in a year without picks.

The rest of the story talks about Adam Morrison, Dee Brown and James Augustine. Pax thinks Brown and Augustine both will make it in the league somewhere.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

...............


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Is it possible that pax really wants Aldridge and is keeping quite hoping that the Raptors take bangs or they trade out of 1 with a team that wants Morrison and either way Aldridge falls to Paxson?

And i understand that Portland wants to get ride of miles. If so why dont we trade down and get miles and then trade miles to a team ahead of us to move up from 16 to 10 or 8? Either Thomas or Aldridge will be there at 4.

daivd


----------



## mr.ankle20

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

If he slips should the bulls go after Rondo ? I know his offense sucks but his defense and above average rebounder for a guard .


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Rondo? for what exactly?


----------



## southpark

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

According to Katz on ESPN, he said as of Saturday the Bulls "were looking to make a safe pick" and therefore have LA#1 on their draft board. Now I saw clips of him but he looks VERY skinny. Does anyone that has seen him upclose know if he has the frame to bulk up? Otherwise I think I might want TT esp. since it looks like he could add on more muscle.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

WTF

Did he just say this?


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The magician part III 

http://www.sendspace.com/file/5hndgf

or

http://rapidshare.de/files/24025236/The_Magician_-_Part_III.wmv.html


----------



## Toxicity

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

My 3rd "The Magician" Mix on Bargnani is finally done:

http://www.sendspace.com/file/5hndgf

:cheers:


----------



## Toxicity

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



italianBBlover said:


> The magician part III
> 
> http://www.sendspace.com/file/5hndgf
> 
> or
> 
> http://rapidshare.de/files/24025236/The_Magician_-_Part_III.wmv.html


Too quick for me, ItalianBBlover! :biggrin:


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

eheh :biggrin:

Great job as always :clap:


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



southpark said:


> According to Katz on ESPN, he said as of Saturday the Bulls "were looking to make a safe pick" and therefore have LA#1 on their draft board. Now I saw clips of him but he looks VERY skinny. Does anyone that has seen him upclose know if he has the frame to bulk up? Otherwise I think I might want TT esp. since it looks like he could add on more muscle.


He has the frame to get to about 250ish, which is only gaining 15 pounds which won't be too hard, Tyson has gained more than 15 pound of pure muscle every offseason since becoming a Bull. :clap: Saer Sene has the best frame for bulking up. He's also at around 235 right now. They think he will be able to get up to 270 without giving up any athleticism, thats amazing, year one, we'd have to expect him to be an energy guy, who can score the easy stuff, putbacks, and an occasional move, but can rebound by jumping (ala Tyson) and block the hell out of everyone. Year two with mroe bulk on, we have the best center in the East!


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> He has the frame to get to about 250ish, which is only gaining 15 pounds which won't be too hard, Tyson has gained more than 15 pound of pure muscle every offseason since becoming a Bull. :clap: Saer Sene has the best frame for bulking up. He's also at around 235 right now. They think he will be able to get up to 270 without giving up any athleticism, thats amazing, year one, we'd have to expect him to be an energy guy, who can score the easy stuff, putbacks, and an occasional move, but can rebound by jumping (ala Tyson) and block the hell out of everyone. Year two with mroe bulk on, we have the best center in the East!


I know its all good and well to say someone has this frame or that from to put on weight. But who has actually lived up to that bill over the years and who hasn't i wonder.

You have players such as. S.Bradely. Mutumbo. Prince. Camby. Joe Smith. Kevin Garnett. to name a few who have come in thin and remained relatively thin. and just adding to their core strength.

Such as players such as J.Oneil. J.Howard. Kobe. T-mac. who came in in to the leauge thin and added signifcant weight and muscles.

But then their are players that a big that just remain big. Curry. Traylor. Sweetney.

Any other players you can see that has made significant changes to their bodies in the leauge? or not made any at all? 

I just personally don't see Chandler gaining that much bulk any further. i think he is what he is. maybe gained that extra core strength. and maybe another 10 pounds of pure muscles if possible. and he'll be fine. he just needs to maintain that core strength and keep his agility and quickness because thats his strength against bigs which also is sometimes his weakness. just at times its not always to gain or lose weight. it really depends on the individuals game and there weakness and strengths. to use a point. J.Oneil. pretty much HAD to put on weight since he is a relative low post player and he just NEEDED the extra strength. another example is S.Nash. he came in relatively thin. but he added extra strength and bulk with the Mavs thinking it would benefit him driving and taking the punishment. but once he moved back to phoneix he actually decided to lose weight again to regain that quickness and agility for their system. so i mean its really depends on their situation. and again sometimes body types are body types...

Regarding Sene. i just don't see him changing his body THAT much as people expect. yes he will naturally change just by the fact of working out with men and keeping healthy he will just change gradually. but his not ever going to be a guy who is 270 pounds in my opinion... i think his body will remain in the mold of Mutombo. and thats not nesscarily a bad thing.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'm fine with Sene only gaining 10-15 more pounds of muscle. Like I've been saying all along, shades of Mutumbo in him. And Mutumbo was a beast. Now only for Sene to develop a good finger wag.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Without trades, I say we got two possible combinations:
Roy-Sene
Aldridge-Thabo


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Draft articles from the Tribune today:

Draft's dodgy query: Who's No. 1? 



> The six, in no particular order other than alphabetical because no one in the NBA can figure out how they should go, are LaMarcus Aldridge, Andrea Bargnani, Rudy Gay, Adam Morrison, Brandon Roy and Tyrus Thomas.
> 
> All six have been mentioned at times as the possible No. 1 pick, which is why there have been rumors of Toronto trading down and then taking the Italian Bargnani. Or Portland could trade up to get Morrison from Gonzaga.
> 
> In this draft nothing is certain. There are rumors Duke's Shelden Williams could crack that top six.
> 
> "This is truly an eye-of-the-beholder draft," one league executive said.
> 
> The big men—Aldridge, Thomas and Bargnani—are projects while there are questions of health with Morrison, enthusiasm with Gay and drive from Roy. But all are projected to become good NBA players, perhaps All-Stars. Roy's last name is an acronym for Rookie of the Year (ROY). Perhaps that tells us something.


Then he goes over the top five in every possession.

And Marlen writes:

Italian may reward patient team 



> Bargnani is a world away from looking like the Nowitzki who was an NBA Most Valuable Player candidate. In Bargnani's inaugural NBA season, he is more likely to resemble the Nowitzki who averaged 8.2 points and 20.4 minutes per game as a Mavericks rookie seven years ago.
> 
> "There's a universe between Dirk now and when he came into the league," Blatt, a Massachusetts native, said in a recent phone interview.
> 
> Like most of the 2006 draft class, Bargnani is attractive for his potential, but 7-foot height and his perimeter skills—he's awfully close to Nowitzki's long-distance range—should make him a rare and valuable asset in the NBA.
> 
> Still, fans will need to show patience with Bargnani.
> 
> "People were ready to judge Nowitzki right away," NBA consultant Chris Ekstrand said. "The one thing I hope people learn that they didn't with Nowitzki is when you throw a guy in at 20 or 21, unless you're a LeBron James, you're not going to see a great player right away."





> Paxson said Thursday that Bargnani will have to adjust to the physical nature of the NBA but added his experience playing in a top European league cannot be discounted.
> 
> To that end, Bargnani is ahead of most college athletes.
> 
> "The one thing you have to remember over there is that he has been playing in meaningful games with professionals," Paxson said. "He's playing against guys who are like NBA players in terms of their age and experience.
> 
> "He's a guy who has been playing professionally at a very young age. He's doing good things. He's playing against men and you know they're not backing off him or afraid of playing him."


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I think bangs may be slipping and could easily go 6 or 7. If LA really does go number 1 either via a trade or the raptors have a change of heart than paxson will take thomas at 2. Or if Morrison goes number 1 than pax will take LA and the draft will be totally up for grabs.

But i think the bobcats are taking Gay and that will leave someone to fall and it cold very easily be bangs who may have the most upside but may take some time to develop.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I want Bargnani!

I'll go as far as to say, I think he'll be BETTER than Dirk.



> "Dirk was playing in the second division in Germany," Ekstrand said. "[Bargnani] was playing at the top level."
> 
> For this reason, among others, Bargnani's coach believes the Italian has a head start on Nowitzki.
> 
> "Physically, Andrea is a little more developed and stronger than Dirk at this age," Blatt said.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I want Oden and his broken wrist...


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

i have been thinking if pax drafts a big man at two what are the two or three things that he will use to make that decissison that might help with who he is thinking about.

1. Must be able to finish especially on the pick and roll.
2. Defensive and more importantly to block shots.
3. Fits skiles tude that is works really hard.

I think that mans thomas even thro i wish he was a little taller. Can really finish way above the rim and will be outstanding on the pick a roll going to the hoop. The best shot blocker in the draft and as he puts on weight should be a big time defender. And by all accounts he an very intense person with a real chip on his shoulder. I still think it is thomas.

david


----------



## jordanwasprettygood

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> I want Oden and his broken wrist...


Hah if we got Bargs this year and lucked out on Oden that would be a hell of a frontcourt of Oden/Bargs/Chandler...we need the Knicks to do thier part...in Isiah we trust


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> I think bangs may be slipping and could easily go 6 or 7. If LA really does go number 1 either via a trade or the raptors have a change of heart than paxson will take thomas at 2. Or if Morrison goes number 1 than pax will take LA and the draft will be totally up for grabs.
> 
> But i think the bobcats are taking Gay and that will leave someone to fall and it cold very easily be bangs who may have the most upside but may take some time to develop.
> 
> david



I think any of these guys can slip from #1 consideration to 7 or 8.

Think about it, If we don't take Thomas - Who takes him? 

I think it's all about making your best guess witht his draft. No one is a clear cut stud, including Roy.

I expect most of them to strugle next year, maybe for two year. this looks to be a developmental draft.

The only guy in the top 10 used to not being trated like a star player by his team and the Refs is Bargnani, but he's got other adjustment issues.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> i have been thinking if pax drafts a big man at two what are the two or three things that he will use to make that decissison that might help with who he is thinking about.
> 
> 1. Must be able to finish especially on the pick and roll.
> 2. Defensive and more importantly to block shots.
> 3. Fits skiles tude that is works really hard.
> 
> I think that mans thomas even thro i wish he was a little taller. Can really finish way above the rim and will be outstanding on the pick a roll going to the hoop. The best shot blocker in the draft and as he puts on weight should be a big time defender. And by all accounts he an very intense person with a real chip on his shoulder. I still think it is thomas.
> 
> david



Umm, actually, I think you decscribed all three. I would de-emphasize the Number 2, because Chandler and the available Bigs in FA are all defensive guys, not offensive. I would emphasize the guy must have offensive skills more than defensive since defensive big men are easier to find.

Thus my preference would be Bargnani, Aldridge, Thomas.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Roy's Board :

#2 : Bargnani, Thomas

#16 : Sene, Thabo (Brewer won't be there)

All those players solve length, size & athleticism. If we land any two of those four, I'll be extremely happy.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I agree it is thomas and thado.

It could be different and pax may indeed have a trade or two brewing but if so he has been very quite about it. i have long throught that he would trade down from 2 with Portland and still get his man at 4 but what could he get from Portland. They have the 30th and 31st picks and they want to get rid of Miles really bad but you would think if a trade like that was in the works than some one would leak. My guess is we keep our picks and it is thomas and thado. Didnt i read someplace that in one on one thado got the best of carney and brewer. Is pax so quite because he wants thado and he doesnt want anyone trading up to beat him to the pick.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> Is pax so quite because he wants thado and he doesnt want anyone trading up to beat him to the pick.
> 
> david


Possibly..

The highest he's been on the mock boards IS #16. So we know Pax definintely likes the kid.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

And i also think pax is kind of telling us it is thomas. He has said several times about how the game is changing and players it is not as much a power game as it has been and speed and being able to finish on the pick and roll has changed the game. And this is something that Thomas should be excellent at.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

IMO, the REALGM latest mock is the most accurate. They break down every pick/team and WHY they made the selection.

http://www.realgm.com/src_feature/603/20060625/realgm_mock_draft_version_50/

They also make complete sense of Brewer to Orlando. He'd push them to the playoff's.

I don't agree with their pick of Hilton Armstrong to Utah @ #14 though.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I think they have Redick and Shawne Williams too low.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

not really...shawne could fall anywhere between 13 and the mid twenties..

depending on reddick's back..he could fall anywhere from 14 to the mid twenties himself...


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I hear shawne williams is going to the sixers and the jazz want Sene. I also think Minny wants Gay and that makes sense since they dont have a SF. The bulls will not take ager that is silly, we already have too many under sized guards. And Atl is taking Williams, period.

Dont these guys writting these mocks ever read the draft blogs?

david


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> IMO, the REALGM latest mock is the most accurate. They break down every pick/team and WHY they made the selection.
> 
> http://www.realgm.com/src_feature/603/20060625/realgm_mock_draft_version_50/
> 
> They also make complete sense of Brewer to Orlando. He'd push them to the playoff's.
> 
> I don't agree with their pick of Hilton Armstrong to Utah @ #14 though.


IMO, that looks the worst....but then again, the draft has a way of making nearly EVERY mock draft seem like crap.


----------



## NDAVE01

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I was pretty bored this afternoon so I decided to compare the measurements and athletic tests of recently drafted power forwards to Tyrus Thomas (see attachment). I used standing reach as the length measurment since I believe that is the main one the matters. When comparing this measurement to other power forwards he stacks up fairly well as 13 were longer, 13 were shorter, and 3 were the same. His weight is an obvious deficiency in comparison to the others. However, I feel confident that it will not be a long term problem. When you look at him you can tell that he is not the classic ectomorph (the ones that really struggle to add muscle). Players I would consider to be ectomorphs would be Tyson, Jared Jeffries and Tayshaun Prince. To me, he looks to have a much wider shoulders and a better frame to add muscle. Also, he has grown so much lately (being 5'11" as a freshmen in highschool) that it is not surprising that he hasn't filled out yet. His vertical is where he really shines. In all my years of following the draft, I have never seen a player with a 9 foot or taller standing reach with a vertical as big as Tyrus'. A lot of bigmen get categorized as freak athletes, but Tyrus is really on different level than most. For example, I recall Chris Wilcox was considered to be an amazing physical specimen when he came out in 2002. However, when being compared to Tyrus he looks pretty ordinary. Wilcox has a shorter standing reach, and has a 5 inch smaller vertical at roughly the same weight. While he is much better in the bench press, this stat seems to be completely meaningless when trying to project NBA success. Overall, I think Tyrus stacks up pretty well and hope he's the pick on Wednesday.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



NDAVE01 said:


> I was pretty bored this afternoon so I decided to compare the measurements and athletic tests of recently drafted power forwards to Tyrus Thomas. I used standing reach as the length measurment since I believe that is the main one the matters. When comparing this measurement to other power forwards he stacks up fairly well as 13 were longer, 13 were shorter, and 3 were the same. His weight is an obvious deficiency in comparison to the others. However, I feel confident that it will not be a long term problem. When you look at him you can tell that he is not the classic ectomorph (the ones that really struggle to add muscle). Players I would consider to be ectomorphs would be Tyson, Jared Jeffries and Tayshaun Prince. To me, he looks to have a much wider shoulders and a better frame to add muscle. Also, he has grown so much lately (being 5'11" as a freshmen in highschool) that it is not surprising that he hasn't filled out yet. His vertical is where he really shines. In all my years of following the draft, I have never seen a player with a 9 foot or taller standing reach with a vertical as big as Tyrus'. A lot of bigmen get categorized as freak athletes, but Tyrus is really on different level than most. For example, I recall Chris Wilcox was considered to be an amazing physical specimen when he came out in 2002. However, when being compared to Tyrus he looks pretty ordinary. Wilcox has a shorter standing reach, and has a 5 inch smaller vertical at roughly the same weight. While he is much better in the bench press, this stat seems to be completely meaningless when trying to project NBA success. Overall, I think Tyrus stacks up pretty well and hope he's the pick on Wednesday.
> 
> 
> 
> Name St. Reach Weight Vertical Sprint Bench
> Boozer, Carlos 9'1.5" 258 28.5 3.31 13
> Bosh, Chris 9'1" 225 33 3.3 9
> Brown, Kwame 9' 243
> Chandler, Tyson 9'2" 224
> Collison, Nick 9" 255 33 3.28 8
> Diogu, Ike 9'1" 255.4 31 3.45 21
> Fizer, Marcus 8'8" 262
> Frye, Channing 9'2.5" 243.6 31 3.38 19
> Gooden, Drew 8'10.5" 227 33 3.19 13
> Haslem, Udonis 8'10" 250
> Hilario, Nene 9'1" 253 34 3.19 16
> Howard, Dwight 9'3.5" 240 35.5 7
> Humphries, Kris 8'10.5" 238 36 22
> Jefferson, Al 9'2" 263 30 3
> Lee, David 8'10.5" 229.5	32.5 3.19 14
> Murphy, Troy 8'9.5" 230
> Martin, Kenyon 8'10.5" 234
> May, Sean 8'9" 258.8 33 3.29 12
> Okafor, Emeka 9'2.5" 263 34 22
> Simien, Wayne 8'11" 255.8 27.5 3.35 11
> Stoudemire, Amare 9'0.5" 233 35.5 3.25	12
> Sweetney, Mike 8'11.5" 262
> Swift, Stromile 9' 220
> Taft, Chris 9'1" 261 33 3.27 14
> Thomas, Etan 8'9" 260
> Turiaf, Ronny 8'10.5" 237.8 33 3.23 15
> Villanueva, Charlie 9'1" 236.6 31 3.3 11
> West, David 9'0.5" 226
> Wilcox, Chris 8'11.5" 218 34.5 3.16 20
> 
> Aldridge, Lamarcus	9'2" 234 34 3.43 8
> Bargnani, Andrea	9'2" 249
> Thomas, Tyrus 9' 217 39.5 3.2 8
> 
> 
> When I was posting this it appeared that all the numbers were lined up properly under the different categories and was much easier to read.


Good stuff Dave...

Is 249 an official measurement for Bargnani or not? He certainly doesn't look like he outweighs Aldridge by 15 pounds from the footage I've seen...


----------



## NDAVE01

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I got Bargnani's measurements from ESPN Insider. Apparently the NBA asked Benneton to measure him and these were what they sent to the NBA. He was also listed as 7'1.25" in shoes. That makes his 9'2" standing reach relatively weak for his height.


----------



## dsouljah9

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

There's no way we take Thomas with Aldridge on the board. If Toronto takes him, maybe, but I don't think that we bypass him if he's there for the taking. Same goes for 16, we don't bypass Sene(whom the Bulls like) for an undersized 2 in Ager. I'd rather the Bulls take Marquinhos @ 16 over Ager.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



dsouljah9 said:


> There's no way we take Thomas with Aldridge on the board. If Toronto takes him, maybe, but I don't think that we bypass him if he's there for the taking. Same goes for 16, we don't bypass Sene(whom the Bulls like) for an undersized 2 in Ager. I'd rather the Bulls take Marquinhos @ 16 over Ager.


With recent statements by your man Aldridge saying skiles "scared him"..

I think his chance of being a bull is out the window


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I am not sure sure. I really think Paxson is leaning towards Thomas. Just IMHO but if you read between the lines i think that is his man. Really i think either would address our major problem in the middle but pax keeps talking about how the game has changed and i think thomas' skills fit that more than Aldridge. As for the 16 pick we really need a SG bad and if brewer is gone i really this pax has Thado in mind.

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> I am not sure sure. I really think Paxson is leaning towards Thomas. Just IMHO but if you read between the lines i think that is his man. Really i think either would address our major problem in the middle but pax keeps talking about how the game has changed and i think thomas' skills fit that more than Aldridge. As for the 16 pick we really need a SG bad and if brewer is gone i really this pax has Thado in mind.
> 
> david


I think he'll select Thomas...

I figured it out with the recent statements made on draftexpress about how Thomas contacted the Bulls to be assured that they'd select him. Since they didn't promise him, he went to Houston for an extra workout just to cover all bases.

Why would you contact them for asssurance? That right there tells you it's been discussed by both parties. But Pax obviously doesn't wanna make the decision too soon. Especially when you could get a good trade proposal or something.

At the end of the day, I think it'll be Thomas. He's said too many subliminal things in his recent interviews that make me believe that .But he also did say it depends on what Toronto does. So I'd assume, if they don't take Bargnani, he possibly will. I'd be fine with either Barnani or Thomas personally.

I told this board after LSU vs. Texas that Thomas would be a Bull.

Think about it, if Marion, 6"7, 240lbs can play PF, why can't Thomas? Marion came into the league 210lbs.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

And while everyone (including me) wishes he was 6'9" he does have a 9'3" reach and that is huge and bigger than alot of other PF in the league. Including Shawn Kemp who i think more and more is who he reminds me of. It is not just his leaping but how quickly he gets up into the air. That is what IMHO seperates him from Aldridge and Simmons. They can get up but it is like they have to collect themselfs but thomas just seems to jump so much faster than other big men and i think that is why he blocks so many shots and what seperates him. 

david


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> And while everyone (including me) wishes he was 6'9" he does have a 9'3" reach and that is huge and bigger than alot of other PF in the league. Including Shawn Kemp who i think more and more is who he reminds me of. It is not just his leaping but how quickly he gets up into the air. That is what IMHO seperates him from Aldridge and Simmons. They can get up but it is like they have to collect themselfs but thomas just seems to jump so much faster than other big men and i think that is why he blocks so many shots and what seperates him.
> 
> david


He's an assassin on the blocks. Have you ever watched how he seems to stalk players before he swats their ****?! It's beautiful.

But yea, I wish he was 6"9 also, but if Pax is willing to gamble on him, I won't question it. He's been on point thus far.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

In spite of what I think (MY OPINION), I trust Pax so much that I will be an instant supporter of whoever we get to draft. I will see that player with my half full glasses instead of *****ing why he was the pick. And from all the potential Bulls' selections at #2, Thomas is the guys that excites me the most from a basketball fan point of view, along with Gay. So no matter if we go Aldridge or Thomas, Bargnani or Roy, Im going to be on his bandwagon from day one.


----------



## RoRo

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> He's an assassin on the blocks. Have you ever watched how he seems to stalk players before he swats their ****?! It's beautiful.
> 
> But yea, I wish he was 6"9 also, but if Pax is willing to gamble on him, I won't question it. He's been on point thus far.


not just the blocks either. 
his ability to move on the perimeter would be a great asset, esp in the new small ball pick and roll trend. he looked very comfy closing out on the duke shooters for example. it'll be intriguing to see how skiles would use him in a defensive scheme. but i think all the potential draftees could bring something needed to this team so it's all good. can't wait for wednesday.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'll support the player that we pick, but that won't stop me from *****ing!

<a href="http://basketballboards.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=651">







</a>


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> I'll support the player that we pick, but that won't stop me from *****ing!


Thats fine and its the way to go. But I trust Pax and the staff scouting ability over mine's or Givony or nbadraft.net.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



El Chapu said:


> In spite of what I think (MY OPINION), I trust Pax so much that I will be an instant supporter of whoever we get to draft. I will see that player with my half full glasses instead of *****ing why he was the pick.


I totally agree. I'll have my preference too, but I won't doubt Pax. Even if we grab Tyrus, and we don't see impact on Day 1 vs with a guy like Aldridge or Roy.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



El Chapu said:


> Thats fine and its the way to go. But I trust Pax and the staff scouting ability over mine's or Givony or nbadraft.net.


If we do take Thomas, I'm gonna hope that he proves me wrong and serves me a plate of crow.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Is this the thread were going to use on draft day?


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Well it appears that draft express is reporting that Houston and Atl have a trade in place. Atl will draft Roy and send him to Houston and Atl will draft Williams and get Luther Head. I think Luther will be a solid player for Atl and Williams will play PF and Center for them from day 1.

Tellam, the agent for Roy and Aldridge also said Aldridge has a promise in the draft as well and since he refused to workout for the Bobcats my guess is it is either Portland or the raptors since Paxson has said he will make no promises. I really think the Raptors are going to take Aldridge and Portland will take Morrison so the the top 8 picks are starting to fall into place.

1. Aldridge
2. Thomas
3. Gay
4. Morrison
5. Roy
6. No idea what minny will do.
7. Boston who knows.
8. Williams

And if this is really the deal where does Bangnani go? He is not going to the bobcats and no way Portland passes on Morrison they need to sell seats. Houston wants to win now so they will not take a project. But if the raptors do take Bangs then Chicago will determine who falls. If they take Thomas then Aldridge falls to Minny and i love the frontcourt of KG and Aldridge but if the bulls take Aldridge i dont really know where Thomas will go. Minny wants to win now and boston already has a lot of young frontcourt players and Thomas refused to workout for boston. Interesting.

david

david


----------



## BenDengGo

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

how long does this whole draft procedure take?
does the 2nd round selection go faster than the 1st round? whats the time gap between each pick?
will there be a commercial break after every pick?

this will be my first nba draft i'll be able to follow live, thanks to an espn stream.

apparently on espn it says it starts @7pm ny time, that means it'll be 12.00 midnight over here in germany.

i assume only the first round is of interesst.


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



BenDengGo said:


> how long does this whole draft procedure take?
> does the 2nd round selection go faster than the 1st round? whats the time gap between each pick?
> will there be a commercial break after every pick?
> 
> this will be my first nba draft i'll be able to follow live, thanks to an espn stream.
> 
> apparently on espn it says it starts @7pm ny time, that means it'll be 12.00 midnight over here in germany.
> 
> i assume only the first round is of interesst.


I don't remember if they go into the second round much, but it's over fairly quickly in comparison to the NFL draft. There is a time limit to make a selection - I think the whole thing took 4 hours or so last year but I could be wrong. 

I can't wait to hear Dick Vitale say "upside" a million times this year. Someone needs to invent new cliches.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The draft begins at 7:30 and each team gets 5 mintues to make a pick and the first round takes about 2 1/4 hours then the 2nd round i think it is every two mintues and the whole think is over just after midnight.

david


----------



## jnrjr79

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Sports Illustrated's Iam Thomsen has us taking Bargnani is his mock draft, saying:



> Bargnani should hope he gets by the Raptors because he would complement Tyson Chandler beautifully.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/ian_thomsen/06/23/mock.draft/index.html?cnn=yes


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Is this the thread were going to use on draft day?


I'd definately prefer a new thread. Something about clicking back 24 pages from page 310 doesn't sound like a great time (when I get home from work).


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'm pretty sure we'll have an "Official Draft" thread that day


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

i agree. we'll make a new thread on _WEDNESDAY MORNING_ to discuss the actual draft.

make it like a game thread with the play by play.




_as redick falls down the board and the cameras move in closer...in the background one can hear dickie vitale moaning "oh the humanity, are these GMs crazy, this kid's a winner baby. a winner...oh the humanity"..._


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> i agree. we'll make a new thread on _WEDNESDAY MORNING_ to discuss the actual draft.
> 
> make it like a game thread with the play by play.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _as redick falls down the board and the cameras move in closer...in the background one can hear dickie vitale moaning "oh the humanity, are these GMs crazy, this kid's a winner baby. a winner...oh the humanity"..._


lol.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Maybe i am worry but i dont think JJ will fall. I think Orlando will take him.

david


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Hanley was just talking about all the reports on what the Bulls are going to do. He said Pax won't know what he's going to do until right before it's time to tell David Stern the name, but he probably has a scenario for any possibility, and all the reports are just guesses. And Pax will be talking to lots of folks until that time, too. 

He mentioned he's talked to Sam Smith about Sam's columns, and Sam said aren't they great conversation starters?


----------



## MKazz

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Maybe it's up and I missed it, but could anyone comment on Chad Ford's most recent Insider Mock Draft?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> Chicago
> (via New York)
> 
> 
> Tyrus Thomas
> Position: PF
> Height: 6-9
> Weight: 229
> Age: 19
> School: LSU
> The skinny: A few days ago, this one seemed like a lock. Thomas had started pulling out of workouts, and rumors were flying that the Bulls told Thomas' agents he was coming to Chicago.
> 
> But since then, things have been pretty fuzzy. The Bulls and Thomas' agents denied that a deal was in place. Thomas started visiting places like Minnesota (No. 6) and Houston (No. 8). Meanwhile, LaMarcus Aldridge refused to work out for Charlotte, with his agent claiming that Aldridge had been locked up. And then there's the ongoing talk that Brandon Roy is the Bulls' choice.
> 
> At the end of the day, I think Thomas is the pick. The Bulls have been high on him all year, and none of the strange happenings the past few weeks (including Thomas cutting short two Bulls workouts because of stomach problems and a pulled groin) should change that.


latest from the chat



> Max (Chicago, IL): Who are the Bulls going to take at number 2? It doesn't look to me like there are any quality BIG big men ready to contribute right away and guard Shaq (or someone similar). If there's not a big man who's even as good as Tyson Chandler, should the Bulls trade or pick?
> 
> SportsNation Doug Gottlieb: (12:45 PM ET ) I think they'll draft Thomas and here's why: the Bulls are probably 2-3 years away from competing for the Eastern Conf. crown. They're on a similar learning curve as the Cavs. So what will the Bulls look like in 2-3 years. It looks like Chandler, Hinrich, Nocioni, Gordon, etc. are a part of it, but they'll need toughness on the front line. Thomas is everything Chandler is not and vice versa. While Thomas isn't much bulkier than Chandler, he is nastier. He's not as refined offensively, but he can go through and over people because of his strength and athleticism.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

it's up. he still has Chicago taking Tyrus @ #2.

Toronto - Bargnani
Chicago - Thomas
Charlotte - Morrison
Portland - LaMarcus
Altlanta - Roy
T-Wolves - Foye
Boston - Simmons
Rockets - Shelden Williams
Warriors - Rudy Gay (at 9? i think he'll go before then!)
Sonics - Hilton Armstrong
Orlando - Ronnie Brewer
NO/OK - O'Bryant
Sixers - Shawne Williams
Utah - Sene
NO/OK - Carney
Chicago - Thabo



http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draf...ory?columnist=ford_chad&page=MockDraft-060626



Doug Gottleib is also chatting right now:

http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/chatESPN?event_id=12134



_*Chance (St. Louis MO):* Doug, You've gotta help sell me on Tyrus Thomas. I'm sure he's a good kid, and he had a few strong games at the end of the year. But I'm not convinced that is enough to warrant the #1 or #2 pick after just one year of D-1 level hoops (games played - I know about the redshirt situation). I know 'potential' is a popular word this time of year, but 'potential' also cost MJ and Jerry Krause their jobs a few years ago.... 

* Doug Gottlieb: (12:17 PM ET )* Again, you have to look at who's available in this draft, and not compare it to other years. There's no LeBron in this draft. The thing I like about Thomas, even more than his athleticism, shot-blocking ability and offensive board work, is the fact that he's a competitor. He redshirted, had a bad neck, probably would've been a backup if not for Brandon Bass leaving. Thomas was the glue and blocking shots, diving for loose balls, etc. I want a guy that's going to compete for 82 games a season, considering all the money these guys are about to make._ 


-----


_*Max (Chicago, IL):* Who are the Bulls going to take at number 2? It doesn't look to me like there are any quality BIG big men ready to contribute right away and guard Shaq (or someone similar). If there's not a big man who's even as good as Tyson Chandler, should the Bulls trade or pick? 

* Doug Gottlieb: (12:45 PM ET )* I think they'll draft Thomas and here's why: the Bulls are probably 2-3 years away from competing for the Eastern Conf. crown. They're on a similar learning curve as the Cavs. So what will the Bulls look like in 2-3 years. It looks like Chandler, Hinrich, Nocioni, Gordon, etc. are a part of it, but they'll need toughness on the front line. Thomas is everything Chandler is not and vice versa. While Thomas isn't much bulkier than Chandler, he is nastier. He's not as refined offensively, but he can go through and over people because of his strength and athleticism. _


----------



## LuCane

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Did Doug Gottlieb just state that Tyrus Thomas is less refined offensively than Tyson Chandler? Tyson Chandler?


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



LuCane said:


> Did Doug Gottlieb just state that Tyrus Thomas is less refined offensively than Tyson Chandler? Tyson Chandler?


I doubt that was his point, but if taken literally, Thomas' stock just fell out of the lottery.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=gallo/060626

Special to Page 2


The NBA draft is just two days away and -- oh, boy! -- what a draft it will be.

I don't recall any other pool of draft prospects that has been so consistent talentwise from top to bottom, allowing teams at the bottom of the draft to get players just as mediocre as those available at the top.

Since it's so difficult to differentiate between players this year, NBA front-office personnel are searching for every bit of information they can find on each player in hopes of finding someone who stands out.

And since I'm nothing but helpful, I wanted to offer up some scouting reports I've developed on a few of the biggest names in the draft. I trust they will be of use -- and I hope every NBA GM keeps this in mind Wednesday night: In a year when the draft is a boondoggle, the only smart choice is to choose Pittsnogle. 

Adam Morrison (6-8, SF, Gonzaga) -- Solid all-around player who has been compared to Larry Bird, Rick Barry, Wally Szczerbiak or anyone white. His game has no similarities to any person of color. None. Poor defense and lack of athleticism have scouts questioning how good he can really be, and mustache has scouts questioning his decision-making. Emotional player who likely will start bawling and rolling around on the floor if he's not taken with the first pick.

Andrea Bargnani (7-1, PF, Italy) -- Those high on him say he could be the next Dirk Nowitzki, while others claim he's nothing more than the next Nikoloz Tskitishvili. Regardless, he'll easily become the best player named "Andrea" in NBA history. 

Tyrus Thomas (6-8, PF, LSU) -- Compared to former LSU forward Stromile Swift. Will be a great choice for any team looking to find a Stromile Swift-esque nine points and four rebounds per game with a top-five draft pick.

LaMarcus Aldridge (6-11, PF, Texas) -- Can score, rebound and defend. Could go to the Bulls at No. 2 where he would -- in a perfect world -- team with another ex-Big 12 big man Chicago picked high a few years ago, Marcus Fizer, to form an imposing front line that would no doubt dominate opponents for years to come.

Brandon Roy (6-6, SG, Washington) -- Dynamic player who will likely be called the "surprise" of the NBA draft next season (by East Coast media people who never stayed up late enough to watch him play in college). Only negative is that as someone who played four years in college and is nearly 22 years old, Roy is quite old for an NBA rookie.

Rudy Gay (6-8, SF, UConn) -- Scouts drool over his size and athletic ability and think he can become a superstar. Only downside is the minor fact that he never was really all that good or productive in college and was actually quite disappointing in every conceivable way. But I'm sure that's nothing to worry about. Golden State would love to take him with the ninth pick, mainly because his jersey would be a huge seller in the San Francisco area.

Marcus Williams (6-3, PG, UConn) -- A great passer who led the nation in assists his sophomore year. Last year, in his junior season, he led the nation in laptop thefts. Has had trouble with weight gain, leading to questions about his work ethic and if he perhaps ate Khalid El-Amin. 

J.J. Redick (6-5, SG, Duke) -- Armed not just with a jump shot or a dribble, but also armed for life. Big-name player who can sell tickets -- mostly to those who will want to come to the arena to heckle him. Showed great abilities as a leader at Duke and can really rally a team at halftime or during timeouts with a selection of inspirational poetry. Shot a team-high 42.1 percent from 3-point range last season and also was among the lead leaders in the ACC in blood-alcohol level.

Rajon Rondo (6-2, PG, Kentucky) -- Often referred to as a "pure point guard" because that's nicer than saying "a point guard who can't shoot at all -- no, really, he's awful." Rondo is an extremely quick player, but he needs to put on weight. Of course, then he'll be a slow player who needs to lose weight in order to gain quickness. Bit of a catch-22 there.

Shelden Williams (6-9, PF, Duke) -- Very polished scorer with his back to the basket. Can also face up and score by distracting his defender with his face. Self-motivated, but will respond best to a fiery coach who drops f-bombs two or three times per sentence.

Jordan Farmar (6-2, PG, UCLA) -- Has great court vision. His ears also enable him to hear passing lanes that other players cannot. Struggles with turnovers and shooting, so he should fit seamlessly into the system of any team in the draft lottery.


----------



## LuCane

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> I doubt that was his point, but if taken literally, Thomas' stock just fell out of the lottery.


I know, it was just funny to me because of the sloppy wording.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

portland - Morrison
Chicago - Thomas
Charlotte - Gay
Raptors - Bangnani
Altlanta - Roy
T-Wolves - Aldridge
Boston - Simmons
Rockets - Shelden Williams
Warriors - Sene
Sonics - Hilton Armstrong
Orlando - Foye
NO/OK - O'Bryant
Sixers - Shawne Williams
Utah - JJ
NO/OK - Carney
Chicago - Brewer


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

With the new NBA ball (that supposedly will make it harder to score) and the possibility of the NBA allowing players to clean the board when the ball is above the rim (ala FIBA Basketball), would that give TT a kind of plus or at least make him a little more desirable?


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I still see no confirmation anywhere that there will be a new game ball, and Spalding continues to advertise the usual 100% leather ball as the Official Game Ball.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> I still see no confirmation anywhere that there will be a new game ball, and Spalding continues to advertise the usual 100% leather ball as the Official Game Ball.


I remember Miz post some weeks ago and I read today's article on Draftexpress about the Celtics working out a group of prospects with the new ball. Check it out over there.

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1374


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

LaMarcus Aldridge (6-11, PF, Texas) -- Can score, rebound and defend. Could go to the Bulls at No. 2 where he would -- in a perfect world -- team with another ex-Big 12 big man Chicago picked high a few years ago, Marcus Fizer, to form an imposing front line that would no doubt dominate opponents for years to come.


Seriously, that's pretty funny.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> Thomas is everything Chandler is not and vice versa. While Thomas isn't much bulkier than Chandler, he is nastier. He's not as refined offensively, but he can go through and over people because of his strength and athleticism.




Is it possible to be less refined offensively than Chandler? Well, is it?


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The rest of Pax's Q and A is up at Bulls.com: http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/paxson_060622.html#draft2




> *Are there any plans to bring in Andrea Bargnani*?
> 
> “He’s not going to allow teams to bring him in. He’ll be in New York for physicals and if teams want to go and see him, they can go and talk to him. We’ve done our work on him. I went over in January and saw him practice a couple of times and saw him play a couple of times. Just recently, [Director of European Scouting] Ivica Dukan and [Assistant Coach] Ron Adams were over there; Ron was also over there for the Treviso big man camp. So they spent some time with him, and we feel very comfortable knowing what we need to know about him. The biggest thing right now is for him to take his physical and then the teams will get his medical records.”
> 
> *What have you heard about what Toronto might do with their pick*?
> 
> “We’re hearing all the same things that everyone is hearing. It’s guys like Morrison, Aldridge, Bargnani and Thomas at the top. They could go one of many ways. [Raptors GM] Bryan [Colangelo] is still talking about the possibility of moving that thing. The teams at the top—Toronto, Charlotte and us—we’re all kind of in the same position. We’re young teams with high picks, cap flexibility, and we’re all asking ourselves if we want to stay young. We’re all in the same position.”


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> [/color]
> 
> Is it possible to be less refined offensively than Chandler? Well, is it?


In the limited time I've seen him produce offensively, he's NOWHERE as near as raw as Chandler


----------



## eljam

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

BTW - If I missed this posted somewhere else I apoligize, but notice Pax's quote about Roy in Hanley's article...

http://www.suntimes.com/output/bulls/cst-spt-bullch25.html

It sounds like his speed / penetration skills are questioned by Pax. Also, note what he says about Aldridge's post ability.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> I still see no confirmation anywhere that there will be a new game ball, and Spalding continues to advertise the usual 100% leather ball as the Official Game Ball.













_On June 28, NBA Commissioner David Stern will introduce the NBA's newest employees, as he announces the Class of 2006. Before that, however, he will unveil the contents of the black box below -- *sure to change the way you see the game.* Check back Wednesday at 11:30 a.m. ET to see what's in the black box._

http://www.nba.com/news/blackbox_060628.html



*is it the new ball, dave?*

either that, or cuban's head on a platter. 


:angel:


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> _On June 28, NBA Commissioner David Stern will introduce the NBA's newest employees, as he announces the Class of 2006. Before that, however, he will unveil the contents of the black box below -- *sure to change the way you see the game.* Check back Wednesday at 11:30 a.m. ET to see what's in the black box._
> 
> http://www.nba.com/news/blackbox_060628.html
> 
> 
> 
> *is it the new ball, dave?*
> 
> either that, or cuban's head on a platter.
> 
> 
> :angel:


"See" games? Maybe it'll be the ability to get league pass over nba.com for people with broadband connections. Or they're going 3D!


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## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

If you go over to draftexpress.com you will see that there is a rumor that Boston and Chicago are considering swapping draft picks with Duhan going to Boston. I guess this is contigent on Duhan signing off on this. I like Duhan and would miss him but with Ben Gordon maturing into a real comb guard and the fact that we are almost definately taking a SG Duhan is kind of the odd man out in chicago.

This give the bulls 2 and 7 and much like two years ago shows paxson really does think out of the box to get the players he wants. Two year ago it was Ben and Deng and this year?

I bet it is Roy and what ever big man falls to seven. It also means that paxson did this to beat houston to Roy and means that it was Roy all along. If paxson takes Roy at 2 and the bobcats take Gay and Portland takes morrison then either thomas or Aldridge should be there at 7.

So i think it is Roy and either Aldridge and Thomas. My bet is Aldridge goes number one, the roy, then gay, morrison, and i assume this means Alt is at 5 since houston wants a SG and why would they move up so atl takes williams. Then bangnani and thomas are left for minny and they need to win now and i cant think they would take thomas.

Roy and Thomas was on my X-mas list.

david


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## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Or maybe thomas and brewer?

The second choice for x-mas.

david


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## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> If you go over to draftexpress.com you will see that there is a rumor that Boston and Chicago are considering swapping draft picks with Duhan going to Boston. I guess this is contigent on Duhan signing off on this. I like Duhan and would miss him but with Ben Gordon maturing into a real comb guard and the fact that we are almost definately taking a SG Duhan is kind of the odd man out in chicago.
> 
> This give the bulls 2 and 7 and much like two years ago shows paxson really does think out of the box to get the players he wants. Two year ago it was Ben and Deng and this year?
> 
> I bet it is Roy and what ever big man falls to seven. It also means that paxson did this to beat houston to Roy and means that it was Roy all along. If paxson takes Roy at 2 and the bobcats take Gay and Portland takes morrison then either thomas or Aldridge should be there at 7.
> 
> So i think it is Roy and either Aldridge and Thomas. My bet is Aldridge goes number one, the roy, then gay, morrison, and i assume this means Alt is at 5 since houston wants a SG and why would they move up so atl takes williams. Then bangnani and thomas are left for minny and they need to win now and i cant think they would take thomas.


Great post. Makes a lot of sense. Makes you just so happy that Pax is our GM. He needs an extension on the table the second he is up for one. :banana: :clap: :cheers:


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## GB

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'll be so happy when this is all finally over.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> Before that, however, he will unveil the contents of the black box below -- *sure to change the way you see the game.*


----------



## italianBBlover

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> or cuban's head on a platter.


 :rotf:


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## johnston797

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

OK - just checked 2 and (7 and) 16 on nbadraft.net and draftexpress.com

dexpress - Bargs (TT) O'Bryant
nbadraft - TT (Aldridge) Brewer

Any of that works for me!!!! Yes!!!


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## Hustle

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



johnston797 said:


> OK - just checked 2 and (7 and) 16 on nbadraft.net and draftexpress.com
> 
> dexpress - Bargs (TT) O'Bryant
> nbadraft - TT (Aldridge) Brewer
> 
> Any of that works for me!!!! Yes!!!


OBryant or Brewer falling sounds so wrong, but feels so good.


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## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Tomorrow we need an official draft day thread. One with all the final mock drafts from all the sites at the top. Then all of us can post who we think Pax will pick, and who we want him to pick. 

Then a play by play like a game day thread, hehe.


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## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Here's my draft board... best overall, not necessarily for the Bulls:

<table x:str="" style="border-collapse: collapse; width: 669pt;" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="887"><col style="width: 29pt;" width="38"> <col style="width: 11pt;" width="15"> <col style="width: 107pt;" width="143"> <col style="width: 36pt;" width="48"> <col style="width: 11pt;" width="14"> <col style="width: 26pt;" width="34"> <col style="width: 13pt;" width="17"> <col style="width: 48pt;" width="64"> <col style="width: 6pt;" width="8"> <col style="width: 48pt;" width="64"> <col style="width: 16pt;" width="21"> <col style="width: 48pt;" width="64"> <col style="width: 14pt;" width="18"> <col style="width: 35pt;" width="47"> <col style="width: 16pt;" width="21"> <col style="width: 41pt;" width="54"> <col style="width: 8pt;" width="10"> <col style="width: 48pt;" width="64"> <col style="width: 10pt;" width="13"> <col style="width: 38pt;" width="50"> <col style="width: 12pt;" width="16"> <col style="width: 48pt;" width="64"> <tbody><tr style="height: 38.25pt;" height="51"> <td class="xl28" style="height: 38.25pt; width: 29pt;" height="51" width="38">Rank</td> <td class="xl28" style="width: 11pt;" width="15"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 107pt;" width="143">Player</td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 36pt;" width="48">Pos.</td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 11pt;" width="14"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 26pt;" width="34">Wt.</td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 13pt;" width="17"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">Ht.</td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 6pt;" width="8"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">Wing span</td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 16pt;" width="21"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">Max Vertical</td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 14pt;" width="18"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 35pt;" width="47">Bench Press</td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 16pt;" width="21"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 41pt;" x:str="Lane Agility Drill " width="54">Lane Agility Drill </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 8pt;" width="10"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 48pt;" x:str="3/4 Court Sprint " width="64">3/4 Court Sprint </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 10pt;" width="13"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 38pt;" width="50">Class</td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 12pt;" width="16"> </td> <td class="xl29" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">Age (D)</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="1" height="17"> 1 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Bargnani, Andrea</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">249</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 1.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.684931506849313"> 20.7 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="2" height="17"> 2 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Thomas,Tyrus</td> <td class="xl26">F</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">217</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 3"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">39.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">8</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.36</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.2</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">FR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="19.876712328767123"> 19.9 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="3" height="17"> 3 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Morrison,Adam</td> <td>SF</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">198</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 7.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 10"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">30.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">11</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.46</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.37</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.956164383561642"> 22.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="4" height="17"> 4 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Roy,Brandon</td> <td class="xl26">SG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">207</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">40.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">6</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.13</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.27</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.945205479452056"> 21.9 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="5" height="17"> 5 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Aldridge,LaMarcus</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">234</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 4.75"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">34</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">8</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">12.02</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.43</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SO</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.956164383561642"> 21.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="6" height="17"> 6 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Williams,Shelden</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 26pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="34">258</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 13pt;" width="17">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:str="6' 8.5""> 6' 8.5" </td> <td class="xl27">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 4.25"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">33.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">25</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.53</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.59</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.701369863013699"> 22.7 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="7" height="17"> 7 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Brewer,Ronnie</td> <td class="xl26">G</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">223</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 11.25"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">41</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">19</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.32</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.14</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.287671232876711"> 21.3 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="8" height="17"> 8 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Gay,Rudy</td> <td class="xl26">SF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">222</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 3"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">40.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">9</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.03</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.32</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SO</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="19.876712328767123"> 19.9 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="9" height="17"> 9 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Rondo, Rajon</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">171</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 2"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SO</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.358904109589041"> 20.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="10" height="17"> 10 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Foye,Randy</td> <td class="xl26">SG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">212</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 3.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 6.25"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">38</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">14</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.53</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.23</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.775342465753425"> 22.8 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="11" height="17"> 11 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Simmons,Cedric</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">223</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 4.25"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">35</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">15</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.05</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.31</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SO</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.495890410958904"> 20.5 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="13" height="17"> 13 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Armstrong,Hilton</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">240</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 10.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 4"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">31.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">13</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">12.28</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.53</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.608219178082191"> 21.6 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="13" height="17"> 13 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Sefolosha, Thabo</td> <td>W</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 26pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="34">220</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 13pt;" width="17">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:str="6' 7""> 6' 7" </td> <td class="xl27">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.169863013698631"> 22.2 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="14" height="17"> 14 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Carney,Rodney</td> <td class="xl26">W</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">204</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 5.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 10"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">38.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">10</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.57</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.06</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.243835616438357"> 22.2 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="15" height="17"> 15 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Redick,J.J.</td> <td>SG</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">190</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 4.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 3.25"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">33</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">6</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.94</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.29</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.024657534246575"> 22.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="16" height="17"> 16 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">O'Bryant,Patrick</td> <td>C</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">249</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 0"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 5.75"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">30</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">13</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">12.68</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.63</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SO</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.035616438356165"> 20.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="17" height="17"> 17 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Sene,Saer</td> <td class="xl26">C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">237</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 0"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 8.5"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">31</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">7</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">12.52</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.38</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.142465753424659"> 20.1 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="18" height="17"> 18 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Lowry, Kyle</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">185</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 0"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SO</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.273972602739725"> 20.3 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="19" height="17"> 19 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Rodriguez, Sergio</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">180</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 3"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.057534246575344"> 20.1 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="20" height="17"> 20 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Ager,Maurice</td> <td>SG</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">203</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 4.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 7.75"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">35</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">11</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.73</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.22</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.397260273972602"> 22.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="21" height="17"> 21 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Pecherov, Oleg</td> <td class="xl26">PF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">232</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 10"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.175342465753424"> 21.2 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="22" height="17"> 22 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Collins,Mardy</td> <td class="xl26">G</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">224</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 5.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 10"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">37.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">9</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">12</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.27</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.912328767123288"> 21.9 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="23" height="17"> 23 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Williams,Marcus</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 26pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="34">215</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 13pt;" width="17">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:str="6' 3.25""> 6' 3.25" </td> <td class="xl27">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 7"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">28</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">4</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.3</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.4</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.580821917808219"> 20.6 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="24" height="17"> 24 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Farmar,Jordan</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">171</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 2"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">6' 3"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">42</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">11</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.07</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.17</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SO</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="19.589041095890412"> 19.6 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="25" height="17"> 25 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Williams,Shawne</td> <td>F</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 26pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="34">227</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 13pt;" width="17">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:str="6' 8.75""> 6' 8.75" </td> <td class="xl27">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 3"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">31</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" width="47">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.69</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.3</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">FR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.375342465753423"> 20.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="25" height="17"> 25 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Augustine,James</td> <td class="xl26">PF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">227</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 0.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">32.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">13</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.54</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.25</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.347945205479451"> 22.3 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="26" height="17"> 26 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Vinicius, Marcus</td> <td class="xl26">SF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">235</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.495890410958904"> 22.5 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="27" height="17"> 27 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Brown, Shannon</td> <td class="xl26">SG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">200</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 3"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.591780821917808"> 20.6 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="28" height="17"> 28 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Douby, Quincy</td> <td class="xl26">G</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">175</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 3"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.13150684931507"> 22.1 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="29" height="17"> 29 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Boone, Josh</td> <td class="xl26">C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">237</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.621917808219177"> 21.6 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="30" height="17"> 30 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Freeland, Joel</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">225</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="19.4"> 19.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="31" height="17"> 31 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Tucker,PJ</td> <td class="xl26">F</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">224</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 5.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">34</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">19</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.58</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.31</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.161643835616438"> 21.2 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="32" height="17"> 32 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Davis, Paul</td> <td>C</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">260</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.950684931506849"> 22.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="33" height="17"> 33 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Johnson,Alexander</td> <td class="xl26">PF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">230</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="23.4"> 23.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="34" height="17"> 34 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Bowman,Brandon</td> <td class="xl26">W</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">209</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">34</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">24</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.41</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.31</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.715068493150685"> 21.7 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="35" height="17"> 35 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Pittsnogle, Kevin</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">255</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 10"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.926027397260274"> 21.9 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="36" height="17"> 36 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Blalock,Will</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">194</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 0.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">40</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">8</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.08</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.18</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.81917808219178"> 22.8 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="37" height="17"> 37 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Novak,Steve</td> <td class="xl26">W</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">216</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">31</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.11</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.37</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.054794520547944"> 22.1 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="38" height="17"> 38 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Quinn,Chris</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">175</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 1.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">37</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">7</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.25</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.25</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.767123287671232"> 22.8 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="39" height="17"> 39 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Millsap,Paul</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">258</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 7.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 1.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">32.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">15</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.67</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.3</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.386301369863013"> 21.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="40" height="17"> 40 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Pinnock,Danilo</td> <td class="xl26">SG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">204</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 4"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 7.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">37</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">7</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.91</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.08</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.561643835616437"> 22.6 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="41" height="17"> 41 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Gansey, Mike</td> <td class="xl26">SG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">205</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 4"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="23.534246575342465"> 23.5 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="42" height="17"> 42 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Mensah-Bonsu,Pops</td> <td class="xl26">PF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">232</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 0"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">36</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">19</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.47</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.29</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.82191780821918"> 22.8 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="43" height="17"> 43 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Powe, Leon</td> <td class="xl26">PF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">225</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 7</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SO</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.446575342465753"> 22.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="44" height="17"> 44 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Stinson,Curtis</td> <td class="xl26">G</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">208</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 2.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">31.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">17</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.95</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.27</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="23.375342465753423"> 23.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="45" height="17"> 45 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Williams,Eric</td> <td class="xl26">PF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">285</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 4.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">29</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">17</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.71</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.56</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.271232876712329"> 22.3 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="46" height="17"> 46 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Jones,Solomon</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">224</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 4.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">39</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">6</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.27</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.3</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.964383561643835"> 22.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="47" height="17"> 47 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Williams,Justin</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 26pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="34">211</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 13pt;" width="17">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:str="6' 8.75""> 6' 8.75" </td> <td class="xl27">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 1.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">31.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">7</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.9</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.31</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.142465753424659"> 22.1 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="48" height="17"> 48 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Halperin, Yotam</td> <td class="xl26">G</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">200</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.44109589041096"> 22.4 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="49" height="17"> 49 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Caner-Medley,Nik</td> <td class="xl26">SF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">234</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">35.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">17</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.57</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.21</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.704109589041096"> 22.7 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="50" height="17"> 50 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Eliyahu, Lior</td> <td class="xl26">F</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">210</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.813698630136987"> 20.8 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="51" height="17"> 51 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Veremeenko, Valdimir</td> <td class="xl26">F</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">235</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.950684931506849"> 22.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="52" height="17"> 52 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Amundson,Louis</td> <td class="xl26">F</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">221</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">35.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">14</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.58</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.2</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="23.572602739726026"> 23.6 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="53" height="17"> 53 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Noel,David</td> <td class="xl26">SF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">223</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">38.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">20</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.54</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.07</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.347945205479451"> 22.3 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="54" height="17"> 54 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Horton,Daniel</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">198</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 2.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 7"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">36.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">17</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.35</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.16</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.2"> 22.2 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl30" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="55" height="17"> 55 </td> <td class="xl30">
</td> <td class="xl26">Clark,Keydren</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">184</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">5' 10.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 2.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">34</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">13</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.03</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.11</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.734246575342464"> 21.7 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Adams, Hassan</td> <td class="xl26">SF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">201</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 4"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.035616438356165"> 22.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Dean,Taquan</td> <td class="xl26">G</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">183</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 3"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">34.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">16</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">10.53</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.2</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.904109589041095"> 22.9 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">White, James</td> <td class="xl26">W</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">190</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 7"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="23.701369863013699"> 23.7 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Brown, Dee</td> <td class="xl26">PG</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">180</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6'</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.876712328767123"> 21.9 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Brown,Denham</td> <td class="xl26">W</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">218</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">34.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">12</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.42</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.25</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="23.490410958904111"> 23.5 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Balkman,Renaldo</td> <td>F</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">206</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 1"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">35</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">9</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.58</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.22</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.969863013698632"> 22.0 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Gray,Taj</td> <td class="xl26">PF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">231</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" width="64">7' 0.75"</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">33</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">10</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.02</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.45</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.304109589041097"> 22.3 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Jones,Bobby</td> <td class="xl26">W</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">211</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6.75"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">34.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">15</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.23</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.28</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.482191780821918"> 22.5 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Markota, Damir</td> <td>PF</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">225</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">FOR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="20.515068493150686"> 20.5 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Nicholson,Yemi</td> <td class="xl26">C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">258</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 4.25"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">26</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">8</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">12.57</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.65</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="23.068493150684933"> 23.1 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Hill,Tedric</td> <td class="xl26">PF</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">236</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 9"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 1"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">36.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">1</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">12.23</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.24</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27">
</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Francis,Torin</td> <td class="xl26">PF/C</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">247</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 10"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">7' 1"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">32</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">9</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.97</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.51</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">SR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="22.736986301369864"> 22.7 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Slaughter,Marcus</td> <td>F</td> <td>
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">220</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 8"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 11.5"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">34</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">9</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.56</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.4</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.293150684931508"> 21.3 </td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl31" style="height: 12.75pt;" x:num="56" height="17"> 56 </td> <td class="xl31">
</td> <td class="xl26">Almond,Morris</td> <td class="xl26">W</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26" x:num="" align="right">214</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 6"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl26">6' 10"</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">35.5</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 14pt;" width="18">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 35pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="47">13</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 16pt;" width="21">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 41pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="54">11.45</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 8pt;" width="10">
</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 48pt;" x:num="" align="right" width="64">3.19</td> <td class="xl25" style="width: 10pt;" width="13">
</td> <td class="xl26">JR</td> <td class="xl26">
</td> <td class="xl27" x:num="21.413698630136988"> 21.4 </td> </tr> </tbody></table>


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

DraftExpress' latest mock is too good to be true. They have us getting Bargnani and O'Bryant at 2 + 16 respectively. If this happened, I couldn't be happier.

Does anyone know if DraftExpress had a mock last year, and how accurate they were? I know NBADraft.net is pretty accurate with the lotto, and the 1st 10 picks.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

*Overrated first rounders:*
Way over rated
Marcus Williams
Shannon Brown
Patrick O'Bryant

Somewhat over rated
Shawne Williams
JJ Redick
Jordan Farmar
Rudy Gay
Randy Foye

*Under rated 1st Rounders:*
Way underrated
Rajon Rondo
Thabo Sefolosha
Ronnie Brewer
Hilton Armstrong

Somewhat underrated
Kyle Lowry

*End 1st/2nd Round guys I like:*
Joel Freeland 
Paul Davis 
David Augustine
Paul Millsap
Marcus Vinicius
Will Blalock

*End 1st/2nd Round guys I don't like:*
Shannon Brown
Guillermo Diaz
James White
Dee Brown
Daniel Gibson
Denham Brown

*Bubble/undrafted guys I like:*
Chris Quinn
Nik Caner-Medley
David Noel
Daniel Horton
Danilo Pinnock


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



MikeDC said:


> *Overrated first rounders:*
> Way over rated
> Marcus Williams
> Shannon Brown
> Patrick O'Bryant
> 
> Somewhat over rated
> Shawne Williams
> JJ Redick
> Jordan Farmar
> Rudy Gay
> Randy Foye
> 
> *Under rated 1st Rounders:*
> Way underrated
> Rajon Rondo
> Thabo Sefolosha
> Ronnie Brewer
> Hilton Armstrong
> 
> Somewhat underrated
> Kyle Lowry
> 
> *End 1st/2nd Round guys I like:*
> Joel Freeland
> Paul Davis
> David Augustine
> Paul Millsap
> Marcus Vinicius
> Will Blalock
> 
> *End 1st/2nd Round guys I don't like:*
> Shannon Brown
> Guillermo Diaz
> James White
> Dee Brown
> Daniel Gibson
> Denham Brown
> 
> *Bubble/undrafted guys I like:*
> Chris Quinn
> Nik Caner-Medley
> David Noel
> Daniel Horton
> Danilo Pinnock



I think Rondo is overrated. Thats coming from a UK /UL fan who has watched a lot of him.


----------



## McBulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

MikeDC,

Love the formatting on your spreadsheet (not to mention the spreadsheet itself). How did you keep the columns straight in the post?


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



McBulls said:


> MikeDC,
> 
> Love the formatting on your spreadsheet (not to mention the spreadsheet itself). How did you keep the columns straight in the post?


I just pasted out of the spreadsheet into the reply window... with one trick.

When you want to paste a table in from a spreadsheet, to get enough blank space between the numbers you need to insert a blank column between the columns you want to display.

For example, in the spreadsheet, column F is weight and column h is height. I inserted a blank column G to properly space them. It takes a little bit of playing to get it right.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> I think Rondo is overrated. Thats coming from a UK /UL fan who has watched a lot of him.


He's certainly a risk. He needs to develop his shot, but he's got all the tools and he's young. I think given a couple years he'll pan out.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Nice work, Mike.

I'm still stunned how friggin athletic Ronnie Brewer is, with both vertical, speed, and strength. 

And just one more question...how the F did James Augustine blow all other big men away on the agility drills?


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



MikeDC said:


> *Overrated first rounders:*
> Way over rated
> Marcus Williams
> Shannon Brown
> Patrick O'Bryant
> 
> Somewhat over rated
> Shawne Williams
> JJ Redick
> Jordan Farmar
> Rudy Gay
> Randy Foye
> 
> *Under rated 1st Rounders:*
> Way underrated
> Rajon Rondo
> Thabo Sefolosha
> Ronnie Brewer
> Hilton Armstrong
> 
> Somewhat underrated
> Kyle Lowry
> 
> *End 1st/2nd Round guys I like:*
> Joel Freeland
> Paul Davis
> David Augustine
> Paul Millsap
> Marcus Vinicius
> Will Blalock
> 
> *End 1st/2nd Round guys I don't like:*
> Shannon Brown
> Guillermo Diaz
> James White
> Dee Brown
> Daniel Gibson
> Denham Brown
> 
> *Bubble/undrafted guys I like:*
> Chris Quinn
> Nik Caner-Medley
> David Noel
> Daniel Horton
> Danilo Pinnock


Interesting list. I don't agree on Marcus Williams and Shannon Brown, but I won't belabor that stuff in this thread - still, do you really not like Shannon Brown as a bubble first rounder? I think he'd be great value at the end of the first and start of the second. 

Good call on Noel. I think he could be a really good fit here too. If Ronnie Brewer is way underrated how good do you think he can be? All Star level? Most mocks have him pegged around 10. I agree on Farmar. I've seen him play plenty and I don't think he's going to be a good pro. I have no idea what to make of Freeland. Other than DE hype, why the high marks?


----------



## LuCane

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Mike,

What's your view on P.J. Tucker?

He is one of my favorite values of the draft. To me, he is what Quentin Richardson came into this league as, only to end up distorting his game into a standstill 3PT shooter.

Ultimately, I don't think it's a stretch to think that P.J. Tucker can find a similar niche to the one Ruben Patterson has found as a player.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Due to my inside sources, Pubic Lice Bryce. Patrick O'Bryant and Josh Boone were in for a secret workout at the Berto Center on Sunday. Josh Boone was the big white stiff for O'Bryant to demonstrate on. Why would O'Bryant do a....secret workout if he wouldn't possibly be available at 16?


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Chats @ ESPN.com (Today, tuesday 27th)
5:45 p.m.ET: Adam Morrison (Gonzaga)
6:00 p.m.ET: Randy Foye (Villanova)
6:15 p.m.ET: Rudy Gay (Connecticut)
6:30 p.m.ET: Tyrus Thomas (LSU)


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Anyone who has insider, could you fill us in with what the latest news/rumors are. 

THANK YOU


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



El Chapu said:


> Chats @ ESPN.com (Today, tuesday 27th)
> 5:45 p.m.ET: Adam Morrison (Gonzaga)
> 6:00 p.m.ET: Randy Foye (Villanova)
> 6:15 p.m.ET: Rudy Gay (Connecticut)
> 6:30 p.m.ET: Tyrus Thomas (LSU)


What's the over/under in minutes before Tyrus Thomas goes off on a chat partcipant? Pencil me in for 12.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=2501756&name=katz_andy



> *League sources confirmed to ESPN.com that Toronto is considering Gay at No. 1.* This would certainly shock the draft, since Gay has been considered a lock to drop over the past few weeks.
> 
> -----
> 
> The perception that Toronto must trade down to draft Bargnani also is taking a hit. League sources said the Raptors are now worried that they couldn't get a guarantee that Bargnani would be available for them below No. 2. *League sources told ESPN.com that Chicago is seriously considering taking Bargnani -- or at least is putting that out there -- so if the Raptors want Bargnani, they may have to take him at No. 1*.
> 
> 
> ---
> 
> _League sources said the Bulls are considering a host of options at No. 2, with Bargnani among those at the top. Aldridge is also in the mix, along with LSU freshman Tyrus Thomas. There are other scenarios whereby the Bulls could move the pick, but league sources say Chicago also is listening to offers for Tyson Chandler (but not necessarily trying to push him out)_


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> League sources told ESPN.com that Chicago is seriously considering taking Bargnani


 :banana: :banana: :banana: 

Please. I ask for so little in life. Please let the Bulls select Andrea Bargnani. Please.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=ford_chad#20060627



> "Adding to the confusion, two teams told me on Monday that Roy's physical didn't come back totally clean. He's has had a knee operation or two, and, according to one source, he has an arthritic ankle as well."



Wow, this is a quote from Chad Ford on Insider today about Roy's workout with Houston. That's really too bad. Well, there are a lot of players who never have these things bite them in their career. Caron Butler supposedly had some really bad knees when he got drafted, and I believe he's still healthy. Let's hope Brandon can stay healthy. 

And especially with the death of the Duhon rumor, I'm conceding we're not picking my boy.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Wow. This is where it gets interesting. I think Gay going as #1 is trying to get Charlotte/Portland to possibly trade up in the last minute.

But with Chicago hinting at Bargnani, we may force Colangelo to play his hand. I WANT BARGNANI if available. 

I see Gay contributing more to Toronto than Bargnani though.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=ford_chad#20060627
> 
> "Adding to the confusion, two teams told me on Monday that Roy's physical didn't come back totally clean. He's has had a knee operation or two, and, according to one source, he has an arthritic ankle as well."
> 
> 
> Wow, this is a quote from Chad Ford on Insider today about Roy's workout with Houston. That's really too bad. Well, there are a lot of players who never have these things bite them in their career. Caron Butler supposedly had some really bad knees when he got drafted, and I believe he's still healthy. Let's hope Brandon can stay healthy.
> 
> And especially with the death of the Duhon rumor, I'm conceding we're not picking my boy.











**Bulls consultant advocates drafting Thomas over Roy**


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Anyone who has insider, could you fill us in with what the latest news/rumors are.
> 
> THANK YOU


Ford gave a run-down on the thinking of the teams with the top 10 picks. As it pertains to the Bulls, he said the Duhon for #7 deal was turned down by Ainge. The Chandler and 16 for Murphy, Pietrus, 9 deal was reportedly being discussed last night, but his Warriors source said it probably didn't have any legs. Andy Katz said the Bulls are listening to offers for Chandler, but not necessarily shopping him. Ford mentioned Aldridge, Thomas, and Barnani as possibilities for #2, with Thomas still the front-runner. He thought the Bargnani talk might be a smokescreen to deter Toronto from trading the first pick.

There are just so many things floating around now, many of which are contradictory, that it's nearly impossible for us second-hand rumor gatherers to discern what anyone's thinking IMO.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=2501756&name=katz_andy


I'd think Gay would be a great pickup for the Raps. I'm hoping that Toronto takes anybody but Bargnani and that Pax jumps all over that one. Skiles would be salivating over having a seven footer who could actually execute a proper pick and roll/pop without screwing it up by bobbling the ball or not having the ability to hit a simple 15 footer.

MikeDC... Better late than never on the supposed desire for Il Mago!


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

(This is a very short, CHOPPED up version)

What The Top 10 Teams Are Thinking (Ford) :

*Boston*



> Multiple sources told me last night that those talks are real. The Blazers and Celtics have discussed a trade that would send Sebastian Telfair to Boston for Dan Dickau and the No. 7 pick. If the Telfair-to-the-Celtics deal happens, the Blazers would look at Brandon Roy, Rudy Gay and Foye as possibilities for pick No. 7. One of those players is likely to still be there. As for the rumor that has the Chicago Bulls sending Chris Duhon to Boston for the No. 7 pick, Ainge flatly denied it, saying he had no interest in doing that deal.


*Golden State*



> There is a lot of talk about the Warriors trading down or out of the draft instead of exercising their No. 9 pick. Last night, the hot rumor (and I emphasize the word rumor here) had the Bulls sending Tyson Chandler and the No. 16 pick to Golden State for Troy Murphy, Mickael Pietrus and the No. 9 pick.
> 
> I talked to a source in Golden State late Monday, who told me that while there were trade discussions going on, he believed this deal didn't "have any legs." That's not the strongest denial I've ever heard. But he sure didn't make it sound like it was happening, either.


*Toronto*



> As of late last night, the majority of NBA GMs I spoke with still believe Andrea Bargnani is going No. 1. LaMarcus Aldridge is a possibility and some are mentioning Adam Morrison and Rudy Gay as possibilities as well. But what if the Raptors don't draft Bargnani? Things could get very interesting for the pride of Italy. So could Bargnani slide to the Celtics at No. 7 or the Rockets at No. 8? It's not out of the question.


*Chicago*



> Two sources told me that the Bulls still were leaning heavily toward taking Tyrus Thomas with the No. 2 pick. Some believe that Aldridge will be the pick here and a developing school of thought has the Bulls taking Bargnani. While Bargnani would give the Bulls a pretty solid offensive weapon at power forward, I wonder if this isn't a smokescreen to deter Toronto from trading the No. 1 pick. If the Bulls really want Thomas, they might fear that Toronto would trade the top pick to a team that would draft Thomas.


*Charlotte*



> Drafting No. 3, the Bobcats, according to what I'm hearing, are having an internal debate over Adam Morrison, Rudy Gay and Brandon Roy. I'm still hearing Morrison, but I think Roy remains a strong possibility.


*Atlanta's (nothing we haven't heard before, NEXT)*

*Minnesota*



> At No. 6, the Wolves appear to be leaning heavily to Foye. With Rashad McCants out for possibly the entire season, Foye becomes a much greater need. The Wolves also think he can play the point, boosting his stock even higher. If Thomas or Aldridge were to slip, they'd probably have to take him. But if not, it sounds like Foye's the guy. That said, the Wolves have been involved in a lot of trade talk as well.


*Houston*



> At No. 8, the Rockets have a dilemma if their hearts are set on Brandon Roy. Do they move up to No. 5? That depends on what the teams above them are doing. Do they wait it out at No. 8 to see if Roy slips? Adding to the confusion, two teams told me on Monday that Roy's physical didn't come back totally clean. He's has had a knee operation or two, and, according to one source, he has an arthritic ankle as well. Could that really cause him to slip? It seems unlikely, but remember, Danny Granger took a major slide last year when teams became concerned about his knee.


*Seattle*



> The rumor about a trade of Rashard Lewis for Shawn Marion continues to make the rounds, but as we reported yesterday, both sides deny that there's anything going on with Marion and Lewis.
> 
> More likely, the Suns would send the No. 20 and No. 27 picks for the No. 10 pick and take the best big man available between Cedric Simmons, Hilton Armstrong and Mouhamed Saer Sene. Athletic swingmen Ronnie Brewer and Rodney Carney would also be options.


BARGNANI to CHICAGO!


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I posted this in the thread about the Celts-Bulls deal, but if Ainge is considering Telfair for Dickau + 7, he's the 2nd biggest idiot on earth (1. Isiah). How is that not better than Duhon + 16 for Dickau and 7 (works under trade checker). Now if it was Telfair + 4 for Dickau and 7 (which makes NO SENSE for Portland), then I'd be more interested if I'm Ainge. But I don't think that was the deal.

I think Gay will do wonders for Toronto vs Bargnani. It's just a better fit for both the team and player. I think Bargnani fits in VERY well with our offensive scheme. 

Someone should ask Tyrus on the chat why he doesn't want to play PF in the NBA? Then again, we don't want to piss him off and have him not talk to ESPN anymore a la DX.

Edit: I agree, the Bargnani talk by Chicago seems like a smokescreen to deter Toronto to trading the pick for a team that picks Tyrus.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Katz about Chicago



> The perception that Toronto must trade down to draft Bargnani also is taking a hit. League sources said the Raptors are now worried that they couldn't get a guarantee that Bargnani would be available for them below No. 2. League sources told ESPN.com that Chicago is seriously considering taking Bargnani -- or at least is putting that out there -- so if the Raptors want Bargnani, they may have to take him at No. 1.





> League sources said the Bulls are considering a host of options at No. 2, with Bargnani among those at the top. Aldridge is also in the mix, along with LSU freshman Tyrus Thomas. There are other scenarios whereby the Bulls could move the pick, but league sources say Chicago also is listening to offers for Tyson Chandler (but not necessarily trying to push him out).


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> Katz about Chicago


Someone offer us a solid deal for Tyson. Please Please.


----------



## BULLS23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> Two sources told me that the Bulls still were leaning heavily toward taking Tyrus Thomas with the No. 2 pick. Some believe that Aldridge will be the pick here and a developing school of thought has the Bulls taking Bargnani. While Bargnani would give the Bulls a pretty solid offensive weapon at power forward, I wonder if this isn't a smokescreen to deter Toronto from trading the No. 1 pick. If the Bulls really want Thomas, they might fear that Toronto would trade the top pick to a team that would draft Thomas.


My question is, who would jump up to grab TT at #1? Houston? Charlotte? Wolves? I just don't see anyone in the lotto jumping up to get him and people lower than that would have to give up quite a bit for an unrefined player at best.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



BULLS23 said:


> My question is, who would jump up to grab TT at #1? Houston? Charlotte? Wolves? I just don't see anyone in the lotto jumping up to get him and people lower than that would have to give up quite a bit for an unrefined player at best.



Charlotte.


----------



## BULLS23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

To me it only seems that he'd be a marginal fit for Charlotte whereas Morrison, Gay, or Roy would be exactly what they need right now . . . Opinions?


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?name=ford_chad#20060627
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, this is a quote from Chad Ford on Insider today about Roy's workout with Houston. That's really too bad. Well, there are a lot of players who never have these things bite them in their career. Caron Butler supposedly had some really bad knees when he got drafted, and I believe he's still healthy. Let's hope Brandon can stay healthy.
> 
> And especially with the death of the Duhon rumor, I'm conceding we're not picking my boy.


Yeah, Caron Butler fell all the way to the 10th pick. Rumor had it teams were scared off by his knees. That's the only way I could see Roy slip. His knee surgeries are old news though. Everyone knew about that. But arthritic ankle? I guess that could potentially bother him later in his career. I think Doug Christie retired due to a bad ankle. But we're talking 10+ years down the line. I don't "think" that sort of thing would deter a team from drafting him though. 

Imagine what Roy's vertical would be without those surgeries? I was very surprised when he surpassed / matched Thomas & Gay at the combine. Factor in his previous knee surgeries / arthritic ankle and it's even more surprising.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



BULLS23 said:


> To me it only seems that he'd be a marginal fit for Charlotte whereas Morrison, Gay, or Roy would be exactly what they need right now . . . Opinions?



I agree but I did read a rumor that MJ likes Thomas and although I think Bickerstaff will be calling the shots I am sure he is interested in MJ's opinions.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Colangelo just said on NBATV that they will keep the 1st pick and it's down to TWO players.

STOP BSING

We all know damn well who you're drafting. If he doesn't take him :

G Hinrich
G Gordon
F Deng
F Bargnani
C [Free Agent]

:banana:


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I don't buy the Pax is forcing Toronto's hand to keep some team from trading to Number 1 and getting Thomas. Thomas isn't talked about going #1 by anyone. In fact, the talk is he slides hard and fast if we pass on him (which I hope we do).

If we end up with a choice between Bargnani or Aldridge, that would be incredible. I like Bargnani as he is potentially a huge mismatch and very versatile. Plus, there are plenty of good PF available often through the draft and the FA.


Again, that is why my number one traget this off-season is Nene. He canf play both and has the physical presence we need. He and our PF's will have to pick it up on the rebounding end. However, I think Nocioni and Deng do a good job of getting rebounds as well.


As for trading CHandler in that package to GS - I wish we would know who was going to eb available at 9 and then at 16. For Tyson, going to GS would be a dream as he'd be much closer to home.

FOr the Bulls - Pietrus becomes the defensive 3rd guard. At 9 you then have a choice between O'Bryant, Simmons or some surprise falling player. 

Hmmm:

Bulls get Bargnani with the #2, O'Bryant/Simmons with the #9 and pick up Pietrus and Murphy. IF we could still land Nene, we'd be unbelievably deep.

O'Bryant can be developed. Bargnani would not be forced to play 36 minutes a night. Pietrus is our shut down SG type. We lose CHandler (we would miss his defensive presence). In FA, we get a starter that has girth and fire on both ends in nene.

Wow, that is extremely tempting. How bad is Murphy's contract? When is Pietrus up for extension?


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

DX update at 1:39 pm ET

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1377





> A survey of a half a dozen NBA war rooms 24-36 hours before the draft reveals some very interesting information.
> 
> *-J.J. Redick is now unanimously projected as being the last player sitting in the Green Room*. Concerns about his back problems— previously described by ESPN as a “wild internet rumor”—may cost him a spot in the lottery and potentially even the top 20. Team mock drafts have him slated anywhere from 17-22 at the moment, with not even one team projecting him in the lottery.
> 
> ---
> 
> *-All war room mock drafts currently have Toronto selecting LaMarcus Aldridge at #1. The intrigue begins at #2, where the Bulls will pick between Andrea Bargnani, Tyrus Thomas and Brandon Roy. With Aldridge off the board, and trade becomes more realistic, but most expect them to take Bargnani if they decide to keep the pick. *
> 
> -Rudy Gay is consistently projected ahead of Adam Morrison at Charlotte’s pick, with that choice being described on multiple occasions as “MJ’s pick.”


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I hope he does go to Toronto.

I still don't see why we haven't tried to get Seattle's #10 pick.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Draft Express Update  

I don't know how to copy and paste from Draft Express, so I'll throw in some tidbits:

-Several people expect JJ Redick to fall, possibly late teens/20s. Utah covets him, and might deal their pick for both of Phoenix's. Thus, they can pick JJ later in the draft. 

-Orlando is in a tough spot @ 11 if Brewer/Carney go 9 + 10. They could go for Thabo, or else BPA.

-Apparently, Aldridge is the #1 pick in 'war room' mock drafts. Who knows if this is legit or a lot of crap.

-Ainge is considering Dickau + 7 for Telfair. *SERIOUSLY, how is this better than 16 + Duhon for Dicaku + 7? * You still get a 1st round pick, and an ESTABLISHED PG. You know what Duhon can bring.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

One of the "consensus top 6" will drop, IMO. My guess is Foye will be the one who bumps one of the other guys out. Shelden & Marcus Williams at picks 5/6 wouldn't surprise me either, but I think Minnesota takes Foye #6.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Oops, sorry Miz for repeating what you said. You prolly clicked 'post' before I did . Btw, how did you copy and paste from DX? You can merge or get rid of my thread.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> DX update at 1:39 pm ET
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1377


1. Toronto: Aldridge

:gopray:


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Oops, sorry Miz for repeating what you said. You prolly clicked 'post' before I did . Btw, how did you copy and paste from DX? You can merge or get rid of my thread.


that's cool. and it's a new post not a thread, so no worries.

you just have to copy and paste the entire thing and then EDIT OUT the bits you don't want. 


i am feeling the italian buzz happening, and I LIKE IT!


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

It would definitley be nice if Pax had the choice between Thomas & Bargnani IMO. Honestly, if you put me in that situation I am not sure which direction I would go. Bargnani would fit on the Bulls well but Thomas has that freakish atheleticism. This is one draft I may actually be glad Pax is making the pick instead of me (usually I always wish I was picking lol)


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I hope DraftExpress is right. Roy has been my boy, but these late reports of knee and ankle problems are a concern. And if not Roy, Bargnani is a solid choice, IMO.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Hopefully Charlotte does trade up and take Thomas at #1, that way it doesn't give Paxson an opportunity to mess up.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> It would definitley be nice if Pax had the choice between Thomas & Bargnani IMO. Honestly, if you put me in that situation I am not sure which direction I would go. Bargnani would fit on the Bulls well but Thomas has that freakish atheleticism. This is one draft I may actually be glad Pax is making the pick instead of me (usually I always wish I was picking lol)


Who is bound to free fall if the Bulls dont pick him? I read Bargnani could be there at #10 (+ or -) if the Raps didnt take him #1. Another reason to try to pry #7 away from the C's. Telfair for #7 is horrible.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



El Chapu said:


> Who is bound to free fall if the Bulls dont pick him? I read Bargnani could be there at #10 (+ or -) if the Raps didnt take him #1. Another reason to try to pry #7 away from the C's. Telfair for #7 is horrible.



I don't think either one of those guys will free fall. I could see Roy dropping a few spots because of what Houston turned up in their physical but teams are not going to pass on guys like Bargnani or Thomas to select Marcus Williams or even Shelden WIlliams for that matter.

Yeah, I don't know what Ainge is thinking with that Portland deal seems like there has to be more to it, I guess we will find out tomorrow...maybe.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> I don't think either one of those guys will free fall. I could see Roy dropping a few spots because of what Houston turned up in their physical but teams are not going to pass on guys like Bargnani or Thomas to select Marcus Williams or even Shelden WIlliams for that matter.
> 
> Yeah, I don't know what Ainge is thinking with that Portland deal seems like there has to be more to it, I guess we will find out tomorrow...maybe.


Well, for a second, lets say the Raptors go Aldridge and the Bulls take Thomas.

#3 I really dont see the Bobcats, with MJ, taking Bargnani. No chance.
#4 The Blazers want a special player and someone that could change the image of the franchise. Pass. Morrison most probably will be here for them to take.
#5 Atlanta could be the first team to take a long look at Bargnani, just because of size. But at the same time, he is more perimeter oriented, same as the their 14 SFs. And he isnt the rebounder or D anchor they are seeking.
#6 Minny needs some guard and they need instant production if they are keeping KG. I say picking Bargs could piss KG off. Foye makes a lot of sense, same for Roy.
#7 -> Pick

Obviously there could be some wildcard, like the Suns, willing to move up to snag Bargnani. But if it stays this way, I can really see him dropping. 

But since I have a hard time picturing Colangelo going with someone not named Bargnani, it could be a moot point.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

There's no way Colangelo takes a chance on losing Bargnani.

If he doesn't grab him, we have the FUTURE leader of our team.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



El Chapu said:


> Well, for a second, lets say the Raptors go Aldridge and the Bulls take Thomas.
> 
> #3 I really dont see the Bobcats, with MJ, taking Bargnani. No chance.
> #4 The Blazers want a special player and someone that could change the image of the franchise. Pass. Morrison most probably will be here for them to take.
> #5 Atlanta could be the first team to take a long look at Bargnani, just because of size. But at the same time, he is more perimeter oriented, same as the their 14 SFs. And he isnt the rebounder or D anchor they are seeking.
> #6 Minny needs some guard and they need instant production if they are keeping KG. I say picking Bargs could piss KG off. Foye makes a lot of sense, same for Roy.
> #7 -> Pick
> 
> Obviously there could be some wildcard, like the Suns, willing to move up to snag Bargnani. But if it stays this way, I can really see him dropping.
> 
> But since I have a hard time picturing Colangelo going with someone not named Bargnani, it could be a moot point.


I think Atlanta or Minny would take Bargnani and count their blessings myself.


----------



## UMfan83

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

You guys obviously scout this draft a LOT more then I do, so I ask: How able do you think Bargnani is to contribute next year and to what extent? 

He seems like he has the most upside (with our needs - Roy having the most upside overall), but the least polished


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> There's no way Colangelo takes a chance on losing Bargnani.
> 
> If he doesn't grab him, we have the FUTURE leader of our team.


I think he does - and here's why...

I'm starting to believe that Rudy Gay is going to be the #1 pick. Just going off the skuttlebutt that's floating around out there right now. He supposedly was very impressive in his workouts with the Raptors. He definatly fills a need for them. There's the stories that the Raps are looking at him and Bargnani because of a clean bill of health. He's marketable. Also, from reading the RealGM Raptors board, it seems like it's about 70/30 in favour of Gay over Bargnani.

Colangelo can't lose if he takes Gay. If the Bulls take Aldridge or Thomas (or anyone other than Bargnani) at #2, then Colangelo can still deal with either Charlotte or Portland to deal down and grab Bargnani plus a PG (either Knight or Bassy) in exchange for Gay. If the Bulls take Bargnani at #2, Colangelo still has taken, argueably, the best player available and a guy whom the Raptor faithful seem to really like. Either way it's a win/win for Colangelo. Take Bargnani #1 and he's going to have the expectations of being the first non-american #1 pick along with questions of him being a good fit for the Raps...

I dunno... It just seems to make sense for Colangelo to take the guy that gives him options. I suppose in a little over 24 hours, we'll finally know for sure!


----------



## Mr. T

*Insider: Katz - Gay #1, Bargnani #2 ?*

Andy Katz on Insider reports Gay will go #1 to Toronto or #3 to Charlotte. 

He says Gay worked out exceptionally well in Toronto. He also said the idea that Toronto can trade down and still get Bargnani is taking a hit. Sources say the Raptors are worried Chicago is seriously considering taking Bargnani (or putting out a good smoke screen). 

I haven't gotten that feeling from Paxson that we're taking Bargnani. So if it's out there, does that mean Pax has been using Thomas, Roy and Aldridge as a smoke screen so Bargnani will fall to us? 

Of course in this draft, it's hard to discern smoke screen from genuine confusion. And if Toronto is now leaning towards Gay, why would they be worried who we take?


----------



## Damian Necronamous

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



fl_flash said:


> I think he does - and here's why...
> 
> I'm starting to believe that Rudy Gay is going to be the #1 pick. Just going off the skuttlebutt that's floating around out there right now. He supposedly was very impressive in his workouts with the Raptors. He definatly fills a need for them. There's the stories that the Raps are looking at him and Bargnani because of a clean bill of health. He's marketable. Also, from reading the RealGM Raptors board, it seems like it's about 70/30 in favour of Gay over Bargnani.
> 
> Colangelo can't lose if he takes Gay. If the Bulls take Aldridge or Thomas (or anyone other than Bargnani) at #2, then Colangelo can still deal with either Charlotte or Portland to deal down and grab Bargnani plus a PG (either Knight or Bassy) in exchange for Gay. If the Bulls take Bargnani at #2, Colangelo still has taken, argueably, the best player available and a guy whom the Raptor faithful seem to really like. Either way it's a win/win for Colangelo. Take Bargnani #1 and he's going to have the expectations of being the first non-american #1 pick along with questions of him being a good fit for the Raps...
> 
> I dunno... It just seems to make sense for Colangelo to take the guy that gives him options. I suppose in a little over 24 hours, we'll finally know for sure!


First non-American? What about Hakeem Olajuwon and Yao Ming? You mean the first European player ever selected #1.

And yes, I agree that the Raptors should take Rudy Gay. From what I've read and heard, he's much more of a sure-thing than Bargnani. The last "next Dirk" got about 1mpg for Phoenix last season in like 3 games.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

a very please  take it with a grain of salt SCOOP from blogabull.



> *I know someone from inside the bulls org.He told me the bulls have a trade on the table for minn.This is the trade.Ben Gordon,Tyson,Sweeney,2nd pick,16th pick for Garnett,Hassell,madsen,6th pick. What do you guys think about that? This isn't b.s.I think it's a great trade for the bulls if minnesota takes it.It's give's us a star, a big 2 guard in Hassell and we can draft at # 6 and we might get Roy.Plus we get rid of Tyson's contract.*


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Insider: Katz - Gay #1, Bargnani #2 ?*

This is a sign to me that we are officially in smoke screen territory. What would Toronto do with Gay? The best two players on their team are 3/4 combos. I remember reading somewhere where you can't trust what teams say when you get within a month of the draft, and you have to rely on your prior knowledge. We know that the Raps like Bargnani. We know that the Bulls like Thomas. Barring trade, I'm about 75% confident that is how the draft will play out.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Insider: Katz - Gay #1, Bargnani #2 ?*

*T!!*

this was already posted (twice) up in the PRE-Draft thread, so i will be merging now.

please make sure your seatbacks and tray tables are in their locked, upright position.

thanks


----------



## The ROY

*Re: Insider: Katz - Gay #1, Bargnani #2 ?*

already posted

a few times


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'd do that...

lose #2, Gordon & Chandler

gain #6 & KG...

nice!

G Hinrich
G Roy ?
F Deng
F KG
C Wallace ?


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Damian Necronamous said:


> First non-American? What about Hakeem Olajuwon and Yao Ming? You mean the first European player ever selected #1.
> 
> And yes, I agree that the Raptors should take Rudy Gay. From what I've read and heard, he's much more of a sure-thing than Bargnani. The last "next Dirk" got about 1mpg for Phoenix last season in like 3 games.


Doh!!! How could I forget Ming! Olajuwon I wouldn't have remembered (I'm getting a little long in the tooth - plus he was a product of the NCAA system - Phi Slamma Jamma!) My mistake.


----------



## UMfan83

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I love those "I know someone inside (insert team)" rumors.

Not gonna happen IMO


----------



## LuCane

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> I know someone from inside the bulls org.He told me the bulls have a trade on the table for minn.This is the trade.Ben Gordon,Tyson,Sweeney,2nd pick,16th pick for Garnett,Hassell,madsen,6th pick. What do you guys think about that? This isn't b.s.I think it's a great trade for the bulls if minnesota takes it.It's give's us a star, a big 2 guard in Hassell and we can draft at # 6 and we might get Roy.Plus we get rid of Tyson's contract.


 LMAO.

Did they steal that from my "In news from Fantasy Land" thread? I made that exact trade three days ago in a Mock Draft.

Garnett, Hassell, #6

for

Gordon, Chandler, Harrington, #2, #16

Funny stuff.


----------



## Mr. T

*Re: Insider: Katz - Gay #1, Bargnani #2 ?*



such sweet thunder said:


> This is a sign to me that we are officially in smoke screen territory. What would Toronto do with Gay? The best two players on their team are 3/4 combos. I remember reading somewhere where you can't trust what teams say when you get within a month of the draft, and you have to rely on your prior knowledge. We know that the Raps like Bargnani. We know that the Bulls like Thomas. Barring trade, I'm about 75% confident that is how the draft will play out.


It seems like I've read quite a bit lately about Gay playing the 2 at least in part. If they see him as a 2/3 maybe it looks better.

If I was hoping the Bulls were going to take Bargnani I think I'd be a little depressed. They don't seem to be real interested in him. At least that was my perception. So hearing we would grab him at the two makes me wonder if Pax has simply been doing a good job of drawing any attention to our interest in him in another direction. If so, kudos. 

We all know this is an upside down draft which makes it even more compelling. But, at what point do we think the media is going to finally start getting these stories right on who is taking who? Roughly 24 hours to go and nothing seems to be a lock yet.


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> a very please  take it with a grain of salt SCOOP from blogabull.


After putting down the bucket full of salt...

I don't think Minny would do this. But from the Bulls side, it would make more sense if Eddie Griffin was included (a lesser version of Tyson basically) and if we could land Roy at #6 (who I'd prefer as our starting SG instead of Hassell). 

PG: Hinrich, Duhon
SG: Roy, Hassell
SF: Deng, Nocioni
PF: Garnett, Griffin, Madsen
C: Free agent, Allen

How much cap space would we have left? Big Ben would probably come on over for a chance to play with KG. Most likely we could fill the center spot with Nazr or Pryzbilla though.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

rodney carney is  way too sexy for his shirt 



and other draft portraits from getty. from strictly a FASHION perspective, i think tyrus looks pretty damn fine!!

and adam morrison must have gone "super volume" with the hair conditioner this morning.

i love these pictures. they make me laugh.




:laugh:


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> rodney carney is  way too sexy for his shirt
> 
> 
> 
> and other draft portraits from getty. from strictly a FASHION perspective, i think tyrus looks pretty damn fine!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :laugh:


From a strictly fashion perspective Tyrus looks like he hopped straight out of the 60's with those polyster pants and that bright orange tie....eww lol


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> rodney carney is  way too sexy for his shirt
> 
> 
> 
> and other draft portraits from getty. from strictly a FASHION perspective, i think tyrus looks pretty damn fine!!
> 
> and adam morrison must have gone "super volume" with the hair conditioner this morning.
> 
> i love these pictures. they make me laugh.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :laugh:


A friend of mine who was at this thing today said that Morrison dresses like a seventh grader and was more tense than the Cuban missile crisis.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> From a strictly fashion perspective Tyrus looks like he hopped straight out of the 60's with those polyster pants and that bright orange tie....eww lol


he looks good! and he matches the background.

and morrison and redick look like they're about to give us a powerpoint presentation. dorks.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> he looks good! and he matches the background.
> 
> and morrison and redick look like they're about to give us a powerpoint presentation. dorks.



I'm calling the fashion police on you! I don't think it is his clothes you are looking at Miz! naughty!


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> rodney carney is  way too sexy for his shirt
> 
> 
> 
> and other draft portraits from getty. from strictly a FASHION perspective, i think tyrus looks pretty damn fine!!
> 
> and adam morrison must have gone "super volume" with the hair conditioner this morning.
> 
> i love these pictures. they make me laugh.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :laugh:


Aldridge isn't really demanding the camera in that shot. 

Thomas looks much more confident in the spot light. 















:clown:


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> A friend of mine who was at this thing today said that Morrison dresses like a seventh grader and was more tense than the Cuban missile crisis.


the guys at Slam went and reported on the whole thing: http://slamonline.com/links/06262006/


Tyrus Thomas seems to have impressed them the most.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> I'm calling the fashion police on you! I don't think it is his clothes you are looking at Miz! naughty!



you are going to call the _fashion police_ on the miz. that's rich! 



:smilewink


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

jj redick being interviewed on espn news saying his back issue is a herniated disk that's touching on a nerve but he doesn't think it's going to need surgery.

just ask chris duhon about that after two years of 82+ games, mmkay??


----------



## charlietyra

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Draft Express Update
> 
> I don't know how to copy and paste from Draft Express, so I'll throw in some tidbits:
> 
> -Several people expect JJ Redick to fall, possibly late teens/20s. Utah covets him, and might deal their pick for both of Phoenix's. Thus, they can pick JJ later in the draft.
> 
> -Orlando is in a tough spot @ 11 if Brewer/Carney go 9 + 10. They could go for Thabo, or else BPA.
> 
> -Apparently, Aldridge is the #1 pick in 'war room' mock drafts. Who knows if this is legit or a lot of crap.
> 
> -Ainge is considering Dickau + 7 for Telfair. *SERIOUSLY, how is this better than 16 + Duhon for Dicaku + 7? * You still get a 1st round pick, and an ESTABLISHED PG. You know what Duhon can bring.



I think Redick falling is going to be huge for the Bulls strategy tomorrow. Why? The consensus now at draft sites is that the Bulls will now go "big" with the second pick (i.e. Aldridge, Thomas, or Barganani). Assuming the Bulls fill this need with the second pick they then will need to go "small" at #16 to get size in the backcourt. I believe Pax has been very comfortable with the knowledge that Thabo will be there. However, with Redick slipping Thabo could go 11 through 15. The next best projected wings after Thabo appear to be Ager or Shannon Brown. However, I think Pax wants more length in the backcourt, and I don't blame him. I don't see Pax taking a flier on Redick.

Could this require Pax to decide to go "small" at #2, i.e. go with Roy or even Gay? That could allow for Pax to pick up Sene at #16 if he is still on the board or perhaps Alexander Johnson who I think Pax likes a lot. In any event, I think the Redick situation scrambles things for the Bulls.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> you are going to call the _fashion police_ on the miz. that's rich!
> 
> 
> 
> :smilewink


 Begin fashion rant (because I've always wanted one). 

I'll back you up on this and I'm a celebrated metro-sexual, if only in my own mind. I dig the pants with the background and the pinstripes with the bold tie. 

End fashion rant.

Edit: OT, but why so many hands in so many pockets? God sees everything. :biggrin:


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



such sweet thunder said:


> Begin fashion rant (because I've always wanted one).
> 
> I'll back you up on this and I'm a celebrated metro-sexual, if only in my own mind. I dig the pants with the background and the pinstripes with the bold tie.
> 
> End fashion rant.
> 
> Edit: OT, but why so many hands in so many pockets? God sees everything. :biggrin:


I still say you guys are crazy he looks like a 60's insurance salesman in that getup.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

If we do that Garnett trade, we have to sign Ben Wallace. We'll have 3.5 less capspace than we would without doing the trade, we lose about 6 million in player contracts, but shave off about 2.5 million from the draft pick salary differential.

PG-Kirk Hinrich
SG-Luol Deng
SF-Andres Nocioni
PF-Kevin Garnett
C- Ben Wallace
B1-Chris Duhon
B2-Rookie
B3-Malik Allen

That gives us a very veteran laden team that could make a title run.


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Man i cant believe this but only now i really really want Tyrus, 
I think this guy has a great way about him, he is cocky, kind of reminds me of a KG personality, cocky but hard worker and looks a fun guy to be around. 
Heres like a behind the scene look at what he is going to wear on draft nite and shows Gay also.
http://www.sendspace.com/file/6yn6yu


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

LOL

"I do this for the clothes, the clothes don't do this for Tyrus"

Rudy and him are pretty damn funny


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

LOL yeah i was laughing at that quote too.
Yea he seems like hes a real chilled out funny guy that would be a great addition to our team.
Reminds me so much of a KG personality dont ya think?


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



OziBull said:


> LOL yeah i was laughing at that quote too.
> Yea he seems like hes a real chilled out funny guy that would be a great addition to our team.
> Reminds me so much of a KG personality dont ya think?


I'd have to agree...

real cocky but can also be very lighthearted and fun

Lady : The good thing about your suit is, you'll be the only pick with a sweatervest

Tyrus : ughh, that's IF I wear it


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> from strictly a FASHION perspective, i think tyrus looks pretty damn fine!!


For a Walgreen's manager...


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> For a Walgreen's manager...


I drive a Dodge Stratus.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Rudy gay seemed more intelligent than that otherguy in the video....


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> I drive a Dodge Stratus.












YeeeeAAAAAHHH BooooYYEEEEE!


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Interesting list. I don't agree on Marcus Williams and Shannon Brown, but I won't belabor that stuff in this thread - still, do you really not like Shannon Brown as a bubble first rounder? I think he'd be great value at the end of the first and start of the second.


Oops... I messed up there. He should have been in the slightly overrated 1st round group, not guys I don't like group. If you look at my list, I have him at 27, which is just right for the end of the 1st and a good value in the early second.

I don't like him at 15-20 though, where most everyone is predicting he'll go. Too inconsistent and too reliant on his athleticism, which, while good, isn't going to stand out in the NBA. And his shortness too.



> Good call on Noel. I think he could be a really good fit here too. If Ronnie Brewer is way underrated how good do you think he can be? All Star level? Most mocks have him pegged around 10. I agree on Farmar. I've seen him play plenty and I don't think he's going to be a good pro. I have no idea what to make of Freeland. Other than DE hype, why the high marks?


OK, maybe Brewer's not "way" underrated anymore, but I think after some consideration I'd take him over Gay and Foye, so I'd put him well in the top ten. I guess that's only a couple spots, but they're important spots.

Freeland- Well, beyond that point in the draft, the way I figure it you're sort of swinging for the fences all the guys you like better are gone.. Besides DE, NBAdraft.net and Yahoo have similarly nice write ups. They all stress his intensity and intelligence. That, coupled with his age (only 19), good size and good athleticism make me figure he's as good as anyone. Pick a guy like that and let him stay in Europe for another year or two, and maybe he works out. It's a chance because he's so raw, but if it works out, you won't get a guy with that ideal size in the second round.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



LuCane said:


> Mike,
> 
> What's your view on P.J. Tucker?
> 
> He is one of my favorite values of the draft. To me, he is what Quentin Richardson came into this league as, only to end up distorting his game into a standstill 3PT shooter.
> 
> Ultimately, I don't think it's a stretch to think that P.J. Tucker can find a similar niche to the one Ruben Patterson has found as a player.


If PJ could shoot 3s at all he'd be a first rounder. Everything else seems to be there. He probably won't pan out, I don't think, but he's worth a try.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Rudy gay seemed more intelligent than that otherguy in the video....


One plays with a SERIOUS chip on his shoulder..

The other takes what's given...

I'll take the guy who's tougher on the court..who care who sounds more intelligent OFF the court?


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Rudy gay seemed more intelligent than that otherguy in the video....


You really dislike Thomas dont you?
Why is that? 

I find it hard to find a real reason you could say Gay seems more intelligent than Thomas in the video so i think you must have something really against Thomas.

What is it?


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Wow, due to NBAdraft.net, we can get LaMarcus Aldridge if we move up to the 10th pick!


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



El Chapu said:


> Who is bound to free fall if the Bulls dont pick him? I read Bargnani could be there at #10 (+ or -) if the Raps didnt take him #1. Another reason to try to pry #7 away from the C's. Telfair for #7 is horrible.


I'd guess the Bobcats are locked into Gay at this point, and there's little logic to them taking Thomas. The Blazers, should, at least, want Morrison if he's there. Makes sense for them. Of course, we could hold him for Ransom and try to swap picks with them.
The Hawks would probably take Aldridge or Williams over another undersized guy. That makes sense for them too.
That leaves the TWolves, who are supposedly locked onto Foye. I personally think they'd be the perfect team to draft Thomas. Thomas, if he's going to be good, will contribute quicker than folks think, and the idea of him (with a year of learning from KG) and Garnett at the forward slots should make any right thinking GM drool. But we're talking about Kevin McHale here, so they'll pick another undersized shooting guard since McCants got hurt. Moron.

That'll put us at the Celtics and #7. I have no idea what Ainge wants to do, but I'd wager it's not Tyrus Thomas. Maybe we sweeten the Duhon offer and really make a press for that pick. If we did that, we could theoretically draft Bargnani #2 and Thomas #7.

I'd wet myself with glee. I feel like I'm jinxing the idea by even mentioning it.

(By the way, I still don't think we'd really take Bargnani, but I'm happily waiting to be surprised!)


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> One plays with a SERIOUS chip on his shoulder..
> 
> The other takes what's given...
> 
> I'll take the guy who's tougher on the court..who care who sounds more intelligent OFF the court?


I don't know if Tyrus players with with a chip on his shoulder, but he sure interviews with one on it.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> I don't know if Tyrus players with with a chip on his shoulder, but he sure interviews with one on it.


Other than giving some ish to a website that has been slagging him, I think TT has actually been pretty respectful, if a bit bland, in interviews.


----------



## LuCane

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

How come people have not talked about Sheldon Williams' [lack] of standing reach?


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> Other than giving some ish to a website that has been slagging him, I think TT has actually been pretty respectful, if a bit bland, in interviews.


Agreed totally!


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Because Williams is a HUGE STUD.

david


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Anyone else having trouble downloading that video?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Anyone else having trouble downloading that video?


...


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



TripleDouble said:


> yes.


Perhaps somebody who's succesfully downloaded it could put it up on YouTube?


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Perhaps somebody who's succesfully downloaded it could put it up on YouTube?


Actually, I waited a while and then the little link to download it popped up. It seems to work now.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I got a Tyrus Thomas music video coming up, I'm about 1/5 done with it, its good so far. I hope yall like it when its done.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> I got a Tyrus Thomas music video coming up, I'm about 1/5 done with it, its good so far. I hope yall like it when its done.


Trying to get back into "glass half full" mode I'll admit there is a first time for anything.


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

What video are we talking about?


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I was going through portlands realgm board and they got this from Jason Quick on KFXX

According to him, there are two picks that are locked in: 

#2) Tyrus Thomas 
#3) Rudy Gay 

Leaving Portland to decide between Morrison and potentially LaMarcus Aldridge

Also, the Smokescreen dejour out of NY today (where Quick is at) 

Chicago really likes Sheldon Williams.

Not sure how reliable this guy is but interesting


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Tyrus Thomas is on TV talking about all the adversity he has.....man, if he is a Bull and keeps talking about the adversity.

Also, he just said that the Bulls TOLD him to come back to finish his workout or else he has no chance of drafting him....he didn't have plans to come back.


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Did anybody see how NICE Tyrus's jumper was on the predraft show? from about 20 ft out, he was shotting those high-arc rudy gay type shots...


----------



## remlover

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I have been crazy about Tyrus for a long time and i will continue to be high on him.

I contend come November we will be having a BumpFest of Threads of people who had nothing but disdain for Tyrus. He will be a heck of a player for us and i'm keeping my fingers crossed we take him.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



remlover said:


> I have been crazy about Tyrus for a long time and i will continue to be high on him.
> 
> I contend come November we will be having a BumpFest of Threads of people who had nothing but disdain for Tyrus. He will be a heck of a player for us and i'm keeping my fingers crossed we take him.


 I sincerely hope you're right.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Now, do to my sources, the new composite ball is very similiar to the Euroleague balls. Another reason to draft Bargnani!


----------



## LuCane

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> If PJ could shoot 3s at all he'd be a first rounder. Everything else seems to be there. He probably won't pan out, I don't think, but he's worth a try.


If that's the sole reason you don't think he will "pan out," I think that's somewhat flawed, especially in light of all the players we've seen work at their game and find a niche (Bruce Bowen was once cut from the Bulls; Michael Finley fell to #23 because no one thought he could shoot).

What are the huge differences you see between a guy like Ruben Patterson and a prospect like PJ Tucker?


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



LuCane said:


> If that's the sole reason you don't think he will "pan out," I think that's somewhat flawed, especially in light of all the players we've seen work at their game and find a niche (Bruce Bowen was once cut from the Bulls; Michael Finley fell to #23 because no one thought he could shoot).
> 
> What are the huge differences you see between a guy like Ruben Patterson and a prospect like PJ Tucker?


It's not the only reason, it's just the more obvious one. The way I figure it, he's a 6'5" PF with no shot and no other really exceptional qualities except that he's a hard worker. He'll have to make a big transition to be an NBA 3, both in shooting and how he matches up to guys. He's not going to out-strong anyone any more.

Sure, he can make it, but once you get to the second round, the odds tend to be against guys.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Tyrus Thomas Music Video

Its Rated PG-13, don't complain if you click on it. (no porn or anything, its not like that)

http://rapidshare.de/files/24329178/tyrus_thomas.wmv.html


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Bilas: "Aldridge is not a low-post player, but he has a nice turnaround jump shot." 

He has Aldridge ranked #6 and Bargnani ranked #8 overall in terms of his top ten players. Thinks Raptors would be better off taking Foye #1 than Bargnani.

LOL at Andy Katz and his "sources close to the situation." Dude, we all know you're making things up as you go along.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I will suppor however Pax gets. I like each of Bargnani, Aldridge, and Tyrus. I just question Aldridge's game the most, although I think he'd be the 'ideal' fit here.

I love Tyrus' heart and versatility. If he adds Bulk (not Chandler Bulk) we will have the best player in the draft in a few years, once he learns some low post moves. I hate the word potential, but if he lives up to it, we are good to go.


----------



## LuCane

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> It's not the only reason, it's just the more obvious one. The way I figure it, he's a 6'5" PF with no shot and no other really exceptional qualities except that he's a hard worker. He'll have to make a big transition to be an NBA 3, both in shooting and how he matches up to guys. He's not going to out-strong anyone any more.
> 
> Sure, he can make it, but once you get to the second round, the odds tend to be against guys.


I think this one of those times you have to overlook the spreadsheet, and rely more on game film. It isn't about being a prototypical "3" or "4," it's about being the right complement to the players around you, and fitting into a role within a system (unless you transcend roles). Ultimately, as I've repeated, it's about being able to find a niche. 

At one point, people were overlooking the actual game (and the mechanics) and allowed Michael Redd to drop into the 40s because they didn't think he could transform himself into a legit 2-Guard. Oh yeah, and Michael Redd couldn't shoot consistently enough. Go figure.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



LuCane said:


> I think this one of those times you have to overlook the spreadsheet, and rely more on game film. It isn't about being a prototypical "3" or "4," it's about being the right complement to the players around you, and fitting into a role within a system (unless you transcend roles). Ultimately, as I've repeated, it's about being able to find a niche.
> 
> At one point, people were overlooking the actual game (and the mechanics) and allowed Michael Redd to drop into the 40s because they didn't think he could transform himself into a legit 2-Guard. Oh yeah, and Michael Redd couldn't shoot consistently enough. Go figure.


I don't know that Redd really proves the point you're trying to make. It was precisely from watching game film and viewing his college stats that Redd fell to the second round. 

He was a mid-40s FG%, a low 30s 3-pt FG%, and a high-60s FT% shooter in college. He was a lousy ballhandler with a career AST/TO ratio under 1. He suffered significant statistical declines from his freshman to sophomore season, and then from his sophomore to junior season. I don't know for sure, but I would bet anything that he tested poorly in the combine; he's not a great athlete.

Combine all that with an unorthodox release, and I'm not going to kill anyone for passing on him. GMs aren't fortune-tellers.


----------



## chifaninca

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Since tehre has been so much frustration and/or negativity I thought I would share something my wife said:

We atleast you only have to sit throuh 80 minutes of coverage to hear both icks, what did it take to hear the Bears' picks this year - 3 hours for one?

I laughed and said, thank you for your perspective honey.


So guys, it could be worse, no matter our favorites, we only have to wait for 80 minutes to have our team improved or destroyed....however you may choose to see it.


----------



## OziBull

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Tyrus Thomas Music Video
> 
> Its Rated PG-13, don't complain if you click on it. (no porn or anything, its not like that)
> 
> http://rapidshare.de/files/24329178/tyrus_thomas.wmv.html



What the!?
Why would you be comparing him to OJ Simpson? 
Oh i forgot no complaining ill stop now


----------



## johnston797

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> DX update at 1:39 pm ET
> 
> http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1377
> 
> -All war room mock drafts currently have Toronto selecting LaMarcus Aldridge at #1. The intrigue begins at #2, where the Bulls will pick between Andrea Bargnani, Tyrus Thomas and Brandon Roy. With Aldridge off the board, and trade becomes more realistic, but most expect them to take Bargnani if they decide to keep the pick.


ok - so why does their mock still have Bargs at #1?

I gotta go with NBADraft.net. Bargs #1 and Thomas #2.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



OziBull said:


> What the!?
> Why would you be comparing him to OJ Simpson?
> Oh i forgot no complaining ill stop now


Now, I think you missed the pont of the video. From an artistic standpoint, I wanted to provoke an emotional response to the video, I think that was made clear by the song choice. The song is perfect for it. Now the first part that fits is the lyrics about hurting inside, Tyrus Thomas doesn't really hurt our inside game, but he doesn't help our inside game, as in with a post game because he's a tweener. Then it talks about breaking your heart, which is true, because if we take Tyrus Thomas I'll have a broken heart on draft day. Then it talks about how at 26 years old what we'll expect out of him, but in the end, our patience couldn't last. So then it says plucking daisy petals with looking but not seeing. As in taking Andrea Bargnani #2, we never had him for a workout, but we looked at him in videos, and overseason, but never saw him in a workout. Then it talks about how rage is a bad thing, and someone with with so much venom will die, as Tyrus' attitude will kill the chemistry of our team. Its a well done video if you ask me.


----------



## LuCane

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> I don't know that Redd really proves the point you're trying to make. It was precisely from watching game film and viewing his college stats that Redd fell to the second round.
> 
> He was a mid-40s FG%, a low 30s 3-pt FG%, and a high-60s FT% shooter in college. He was a lousy ballhandler with a career AST/TO ratio under 1. He suffered significant statistical declines from his freshman to sophomore season, and then from his sophomore to junior season. I don't know for sure, but I would bet anything that he tested poorly in the combine; he's not a great athlete.
> 
> Combine all that with an unorthodox release, and I'm not going to kill anyone for passing on him. GMs aren't fortune-tellers.


The point of alluding to Michael Redd, in relation to PJ Tucker, was that problems about "fitting" into a certain spot on the floor (1, 2, 3, 4, 5) can be overcome if the player finds a niche. Michael Redd just so happens to be the extreme case: where the niche he found (excellent outside gunner) happened to be everything he was being questioned for coming in. Furthermore, from watching him in college, I think most people could see he was a "player," and could find a role as a scorer. Doesn't necessarily make him a lotto pick then, but definitely a player I expected to go higher (23-30). Similarly, if PJ Tucker is picked in the 32-40 range, I think he presents the value of a 20-25 type player in terms of future production.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I just got done talking with some "casual" hawks fans to say the least.....the majority of them want JJ Reddick with their pick.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> I just got done talking with some "casual" hawks fans to say the least.....the majority of them want JJ Reddick with their pick.


They want Reddick?! ... good riddens! they can take him..!


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> They want Reddick?! ... good riddens! they can take him..!


This leads me to believe that the "casual" fan that watches the draft will be surprised when Reddick goes in the teens, and when Andrea Bargnani goes #1 possibly, everyone will be freaked out. I agree with Reddick's star potential, but I don't like his back problems. Morrison is my pick at #2, sort things out later, but with Gordon and Morrison we are going to cause a lot of matchup problems for other teams, the two are just way too good on offense, and with each other to lean on, wow, if reddick didn't have back problems, I wouldn't mind a Gordon-Reddick-Morrison backcourt, it'd be amazing scoring wise. Maybe we do take both Morrison and Reddick, I don't know, not neccassarily have that as a starting, but you have those 3 guys on your team, you have to give that lineup some burn sometime to see if they absolutely torch other teams. If we have to go big, we better take Bargnani, or Aldridge.


----------



## kulaz3000

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> This leads me to believe that the "casual" fan that watches the draft will be surprised when Reddick goes in the teens, and when Andrea Bargnani goes #1 possibly, everyone will be freaked out. I agree with Reddick's star potential, but I don't like his back problems. Morrison is my pick at #2, sort things out later, but with Gordon and Morrison we are going to cause a lot of matchup problems for other teams, the two are just way too good on offense, and with each other to lean on, wow, if reddick didn't have back problems, I wouldn't mind a Gordon-Reddick-Morrison backcourt, it'd be amazing scoring wise. Maybe we do take both Morrison and Reddick, I don't know, not neccassarily have that as a starting, but you have those 3 guys on your team, you have to give that lineup some burn sometime to see if they absolutely torch other teams. If we have to go big, we better take Bargnani, or Aldridge.


even a "casual" bulls fan would realize that Riddick does not fill any of the bulls needs. His not a big man obviously, and his certainly not the big guard that we desire to slash to the basket and get to the line. Shooters don't get to the line, and we have a bunch of them already which results to our team being at the bottom of free throw attempts. Our team needs a post play and a slasher to get to the line and Riddick does neither. Sure he may be solid in the nba, but id prefer to take a gamble on someone that can actually help our teams needs instead of getting someone that will be deep in our bench and only be helpful in practises.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



> The skinny: Since the night of the lottery, we've predicted Bargnani would go to Toronto and Thomas would go to Chicago.
> 
> *On Tuesday night, I spoke with Bulls GM John Paxson, who told me that the choice was down to Bargnani, Thomas and LaMarcus Aldridge. Within the Bulls organization, the respective camps had made their pitches, and Paxson said, "Now I've got to go pick the guy I feel most comfortable with."
> 
> The word is that Paxson is a Thomas fan, but Thomas didn't endear himself to Chicago coach Scott Skiles with the two workouts he cut short.*
> 
> Still, according to Paxson, he's making the decision based on who will be "the best player down the road and a guy who fits the character of the team."



http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draf...ory?columnist=ford_chad&page=MockDraft-060628


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

The Oregonian has us taking Sheldon Williams. 

http://www.oregonlive.com/canzano/index.ssf?/mtlogs/olive_JohnCanzano/archives/2006_06.html#155802

I think these are "mock" drafts for a reason.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



kulaz3000 said:


> even a "casual" bulls fan would realize that Riddick does not fill any of the bulls needs. His not a big man obviously, and his certainly not the big guard that we desire to slash to the basket and get to the line. Shooters don't get to the line, and we have a bunch of them already which results to our team being at the bottom of free throw attempts. Our team needs a post play and a slasher to get to the line and Riddick does neither. Sure he may be solid in the nba, but id prefer to take a gamble on someone that can actually help our teams needs instead of getting someone that will be deep in our bench and only be helpful in practises.


huh? I am a die hard Bulls fan and while I admit that he isn't a "need" for this team any team can use a guy who can shoot and can score and being the ALL TIME leading scorer in the ACC Redick can definitley do that. A lot of people don't like Redick and keep coming up with reasons why he will fail in the NBA. He isn't my favorite player and I am not all about him but he is better than people are giving him credit even if he only ends up being a spot up shooter in the NBA.


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Insider has Brewer going at #9 to the Warriors.



> The Warriors don't have any glaring needs and aren't in love with anyone in the draft. So don't be surprised to see Golden State trade down -- a number of teams, including the Hornets and the Bulls, are after Brewer.
> 
> If the Warriors draft and keep Brewer, they'll probably say goodbye to Mickael Pietrus this summer.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2006/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=MockDraft-060628


Gulp. Sure wish we'd gone and to New York and let Skiles stare down Bargnani over dinner.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



MikeDC said:


> Gulp. Sure wish we'd gone and to New York and let Skiles stare down Bargnani over dinner.


Well, Pax did clearly state that he knows everything he needs to know about Bargnani. And fortunately he's in Pax's top 3 (nice to see that we're locked into a big, too). I have no doubt he's done every background check known to man on Bargnani.


----------



## o.iatlhawksfan

*here something interesting*

--- Source says Bulls coach Scott Skiles is interested in a power forward who can contribute right away. Don't look now, but that's not Tyrus Thomas. He's not NBA ready. An NBA scout tells me that Duke's Shelden Williams, a big-time competitor, could be the guy Chicago is targeting, so keep that in mind as the draft unfolds today

ya'll could pick Sheldon at 2.
got it from oregonlive newspaper


----------



## The ROY

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

LMAO

how the hell would some folks in oregon know what we're gonna do? please

pax ain't dumb enough to take him #2

Ford said it boils down to Bargnani, ALdridge & TT tonight...no Gay, NO roy, no morrison and definintely no shelden


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Another reason why Im happy its because I will finally stop reading "Sheldon" everywhere. Finally. Draft couldnt come fast enough...


----------



## yodurk

*Re: here something interesting*



o.iatlhawksfan said:


> --- Source says Bulls coach Scott Skiles is interested in a power forward who can contribute right away. Don't look now, but that's not Tyrus Thomas. He's not NBA ready. An NBA scout tells me that Duke's Shelden Williams, a big-time competitor, could be the guy Chicago is targeting, so keep that in mind as the draft unfolds today
> 
> ya'll could pick Sheldon at 2.
> got it from oregonlive newspaper


Shelden isn't in the equation for the #2. There's no ifs ands or buts about it. 

But if we're indeed trying to move up to #7 with Boston, it's entirely possible we go for Shelden there. Personally I like O'Bryant a little better though; not as polished as Shelden but more of an NBA body with a massive 9'5 standing reach.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



The ROY said:


> LMAO
> 
> how the hell would some folks in oregon know what we're gonna do? please
> 
> pax ain't dumb enough to take him #2
> 
> Ford said it boils down to Bargnani, ALdridge & TT tonight...no Gay, NO roy, no morrison and definintely no shelden


Unless we trade down. But yes, it sounds like we're going big at #2, which makes a lot of sense.

And if we do indeed take one of the three Paxson mentioned at #2, I'll be waiting desperately for Stern to say "there has been a trade" to see if we can somehow grab Brewer.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Unless we trade down. But yes, it sounds like we're going big at #2, which makes a lot of sense.
> 
> And if we do indeed take one of the three Paxson mentioned at #2, I'll be waiting desperately for Stern to say "there has been a trade" to see if we can somehow grab Brewer.


Golden State could end up being our partner after all...


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

chad's  chattin' 

_*Chris (chicago):* Hey Chad, wasn't there talk at one point about the Bulls trading the #2 pick for an established NBA player and I heard something about Shawn Marion to the Bulls? What are the chances of a last minute trade? (will not stop asking until answered!!!) 

*Chad Ford: (1:33 PM ET )* OK ... I know there's a lot of Bulls trade talk. *Here's my opinion and that's all it is. If the Bulls make a big trade it will be for Kevin Garnett*. I think a package of No. 2 (Wolves would take Tyrus Thomas) and No. 16 (probably a point guard like Marcus Williams) along with a young player like Luol Deng or Ben Gordon has to be intriguing. But if a deal like this were to happen, it couldn't happen untill mid July for cap reasons. _


----------



## SALO

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draf...ory?columnist=ford_chad&page=MockDraft-060628


Brandon Roy is not on the list? :nonono: 

The Sports Guy wants us to take Roy 



> *2. CHICAGO*
> 
> *WHAT THEY SHOULD DO*: *Draft Brandon Roy*, this year's "Guy Who Everyone Knows Will Be A Very Good Pro, But Somehow This Doesn't Translate Into Him Being A Top-Three Pick" guy (a la Dwyane Wade, Chris Paul and Caron Butler). If they wanted to emulate Phoenix, Hinrich plays the Nash role; Gordon plays Barbosa; Roy plays Raja Bell (giving them better offense as well); Deng and Nocioni play smaller versions of Tim Thomas and Boris Diaw; and Chandler handles the boards and protects the rim. *That would be the ballsy move*.
> 
> *WHAT THEY WILL DO*: I think LaMarcus Aldridge is the guy -- along with Chandler, they would be covered in the "set picks, rebound and block shots" department. Just just for the record, I like Tyrus Thomas more than Aldridge -- *I haven't been the biggest Aldridge fan since Big Baby Davis shoved him around in the NCAAs and made him settle for turnarounds in the low post*, and if BIG BABY DAVIS can do that to you, what the hell is going to happen during an 82-game NBA season?


Bargnani,Thomas, or Roy.

Just say no to LaMarcus Aldridge.


----------



## giusd

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Has anyone noticed that this is like the 3rd time in two days that Chad Ford has mentioned the bulls trading with GS to get the 9th pick to draft Brewer. I wonder if he does know something?

david


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



SALO said:


> Just say no to LaMarcus Aldridge.


I can't even type or speak his name anymore . . . I call him the African-American Will Perdue.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> Has anyone noticed that this is like the 3rd time in two days that Chad Ford has mentioned the bulls trading with GS to get the 9th pick to draft Brewer. I wonder if he does know something?
> 
> david


Paxson'll snatch away that #9 after he's done bogarting the #7 away from Boston, right?


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> Has anyone noticed that this is like the 3rd time in two days that Chad Ford has mentioned the bulls trading with GS to get the 9th pick to draft Brewer. I wonder if he does know something?
> 
> david


That's in Sam Smith's column, too. I swear they're just trading ideas. It's a question we should ask someone like PAX if we ever get the chance - Do those insiders just make stuff up? 

It's like the Magliore trade rumors from the winter - Harris wasn't planning on trading him during the season, someone writes that he's thinking about it and he started getting GM calls which just fanned the rumors for a bit.


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



giusd said:


> Has anyone noticed that this is like the 3rd time in two days that Chad Ford has mentioned the bulls trading with GS to get the 9th pick to draft Brewer. I wonder if he does know something?
> 
> david


If we are trading with them, I don't think we'll hear anything tonight. The only rumors have included Murphy and Chandler, both of whom are BYC until July 1. And then there's the July moratorium where deals can't be made, so a deal with them would likely be on hold until mid July, which you really just don't see, so I'm not holding my breath.


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Chad Ford now has O'Bryant slipping all the way to #19 - Sacramento. The key to him slipping is that NO seems to prefer Simmons and Armstrong. He's got us taking Sefalosha, but would you guys take O'Bryant instead? (He has us taking TT at #2. Brewer and Carney are gone by #16). Even after going big at #2, I'd get the coordinated legit center O'Bryant at that spot over the tall guard consolation prize Sefolosha.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



Qwerty123 said:


> Chad Ford now has O'Bryant slipping all the way to #19 - Sacramento. The key to him slipping is that NO seems to prefer Simmons and Armstrong. He's got us taking Sefalosha, but would you guys take O'Bryant instead? (He has us taking TT at #2. Brewer and Carney are gone by #16). Even after going big at #2, I'd get the coordinated legit center O'Bryant at that spot over the tall guard consolation prize Sefolosha.


Yeah I would have to go with O'bryant too. I have him rated much higher than Armstrong and just below Simmons on my draft board.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Wow. People (well, just Chad Ford really) were talking about O'Bryant as a dark horse for the first overall selection a couple weeks ago. Now he's at 16 and 19 on the DE and ESPN mocks? What the heck has he been doing in workouts?


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> Yeah I would have to go with O'bryant too. I have him rated much higher than Armstrong and just below Simmons on my draft board.


Ace, do you really have a draft board?


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Wow. People (well, just Chad Ford really) were talking about O'Bryant as a dark horse for the first overall selection a couple weeks ago. Now he's at 16 and 19 on the DE and ESPN mocks? What the heck has he been doing in workouts?


Mike DC nailed this slide in his analysis of the physical testing. O'Bryant was really sluggish and unathletic, and apparently the "desire" issue is rearing its ugly head again (maybe in psychological testing/interviews?).

O'Bryant seemed to have good up-and-down speed in the games I saw, though. I wonder if like academic tests, there are some guys who just don't test well at the combines.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Mike DC nailed this slide in his analysis of the physical testing. O'Bryant was really sluggish and unathletic, and apparently the "desire" issue is rearing its ugly head again (maybe in psychological testing/interviews?).
> 
> O'Bryant seemed to have good up-and-down speed in the games I saw, though. I wonder if like academic tests, there are some guys who just don't test well at the combines.


Makes you wonder if he was the red flag guy Paxson mentioned in that radio interview...

I thought O'Bryant looked pretty swift for a guy his size during the NCAA's.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Makes you wonder if he was the red flag guy Paxson mentioned in that radio interview...
> 
> I thought O'Bryant looked pretty swift for a guy his size during the NCAA's.



I heard Redick has been red flagged by some teams....


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> I heard Redick has been red flagged by some teams....


Redick, it seems, has been given a medical red flags by some team doctors. The red flag Paxson was referring to seemed to relate to a character issue...


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Redick, it seems, has been given a medical red flags by some team doctors. The red flag Paxson was referring to seemed to relate to a character issue...



What red flag did Pax refer to? Did I miss something?


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

That's a really good guess, jbulls.

ace, in an extended Score interview about the draft process, Paxson said that they didn't like the reaction one of the prospects had had when "confronted" with something he'd done in the past.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> What red flag did Pax refer to? Did I miss something?


While discussing how they interview guys and evaluate backgrounds he mentioned that one prospect this year had given an unsatisfactory answer to a question concerning his background. Pax didn't go into much depth, but whatever the prospect said caused him to get "red flagged" by the Bulls. I have no idea who it might've been - it didn't sound like it was one of the big 6.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> That's a really good guess, jbulls.
> 
> ace, in an extended Score interview about the draft process, Paxson said that they didn't like the reaction one of the prospects had had when "confronted" with something he'd done in the past.



Thats interesting. Being out of Chicago I miss all the good radio interview stuff. I wonder who it could be? Who has a history of doing bad stuff? I am guessing Marcus Williams, wasn't he the one who stole all the laptops?


----------



## narek

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> Thats interesting. Being out of Chicago I miss all the good radio interview stuff. I wonder who it could be? Who has a history of doing bad stuff? I am guessing Marcus Williams, wasn't he the one who stole all the laptops?



Did they have Marcus Williams in? I don't think they did.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Andy Katz: (3:21 PM ET ) My sources don't have the Bulls making any deals at this juncture.


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



jbulls said:


> Makes you wonder if he was the red flag guy Paxson mentioned in that radio interview...
> 
> I thought O'Bryant looked pretty swift for a guy his size during the NCAA's.


I think the O'Bryant workout came after that interview with Pax, though, IIRC.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ace20004u said:


> Thats interesting. Being out of Chicago I miss all the good radio interview stuff. I wonder who it could be? Who has a history of doing bad stuff? I am guessing Marcus Williams, wasn't he the one who stole all the laptops?


There's a separate thread about this interview, because it was the same interview Paxson kind of gave a no-confidence vote to Gordon. It's definitely worth a listen when you have a second.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



narek said:


> Did they have Marcus Williams in? I don't think they did.



I'm not sure either....


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Andy Katz: (3:23 PM ET ) The Warriors are the wild card here. Someone is going to fall to them, like Rudy Gay. The question is do the Warriors draft on need or do they take the best available player. But Golden State will have plenty of high-level choices. *The Warriors entertained trade partners but couldn't find one. *

:sigh of relief:


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



narek said:


> Did they have Marcus Williams in? I don't think they did.


Not that I heard. I doubt it was Williams anyway. My understanding was that the Bulls knew something about a guy, the guy didn't realize it, and he lied. Marcus Williams' laptop swiping has been pretty extensively documented.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> There's a separate thread about this interview, because it was the same interview Paxson kind of gave a no-confidence vote to Gordon. It's definitely worth a listen when you have a second.



I wish I don't have a soundcard at work pc...


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Oh, God, no:

Andy Katz: (3:40 PM ET ) I've been told Thomas or Aldridge. That's it. With them leaning going toward Aldridge. 

****tastic.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Screaming A. Smith just said the Raptors decided on Andrea Bargnani for the #1 pick, and that LaMarcus Aldridge will be the #2 pick.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Screaming A. Smith just said the Raptors decided on Andrea Bargnani for the #1 pick, and that LaMarcus Aldridge will be the #2 pick.


That's absolutely fantastic. I'm really, really happy.


----------



## o.iatlhawksfan

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

is it Aldridge for ya'll becuase so far 3 picks in the top 5 have been set
Toronto will select Andrea, Charlote will select Adam morrison at 3, and Atlanta willselect Sheldon at 5, 2 teams remain ya'll and Portland, i hope ya'll select Tyrus, so they select lamarcus and that deal with Atlanta and houston can come back, since Brandon Roy will be avalible.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Screaming A. Smith just said the Raptors decided on Andrea Bargnani for the #1 pick, and that LaMarcus Aldridge will be the #2 pick.


Ugh. Here's hoping I'm wrong about him.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Basically the only thing stopping Aldridge from being in a Bulls uniform right now is:

<img src="http://members.aol.com/EAlle22675/stepgarn.jpg">


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> Oh, God, no:
> 
> Andy Katz: (3:40 PM ET ) I've been told Thomas or Aldridge. That's it. With them leaning going toward Aldridge.
> 
> ****tastic.


 ******


this only confirms my theory that pax and skiles were not and are not on the same page. and skiles won.


----------



## fl_flash

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Screaming A. Smith just said the Raptors decided on Andrea Bargnani for the #1 pick, and that LaMarcus Aldridge will be the #2 pick.


Ugh. I hope not. Not keen on Aldridge. I'll just have to keep repeating to myself... In Pax we trust... In Pax we trust... In Pax we trust...


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> ******
> 
> 
> this only confirms my theory that pax and skiles were not and are not on the same page. and skiles won.


Skiles probaly just gave Paxson a little staredown and put him in his place. Paxson was looking around like, what did I do wrong, do I have spaghetti on my shirt or something, whats he looking at, oh ****, I think he's mad, better just agree with him, and nod my head.


----------



## SecretAgentGuy

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> ******
> 
> 
> this only confirms my theory that pax and skiles were not and are not on the same page. and skiles won.


 I'm not sure where I read the quote but isn't it stated somewhere that Skiles doesn't like Tyrus at all while Paxson does?


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

it was speculation from ford et al, that because tyrus didn't finish either workout for the bulls, that skiles wouldn't have liked that too much.

no direct quotes from pax or skiles on the subject.

yet.


----------



## Qwerty123

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Screaming A. Smith just said the Raptors decided on Andrea Bargnani for the #1 pick, and that LaMarcus Aldridge will be the #2 pick.


If that's the case, Pax is halfway to my ideal draft. Now just figure out a way to get Brewer and I'll be happy.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



mizenkay said:


> it was speculation from ford et al, that because tyrus didn't finish either workout for the bulls, that skiles wouldn't have liked that too much.
> 
> no direct quotes from pax or skiles on the subject.
> 
> yet.


Tyrus Thomas didn't finish the second workout? I knew the 2nd workout was along the lines of "get your *** back here or you have no chance of getting drafted here" but how can a guy not be able to finish 2 workouts? Did Skiles poke a joke and Tyrus started crying or something?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Screaming A. Smith just said the Raptors decided on Andrea Bargnani for the #1 pick, and that LaMarcus Aldridge will be the #2 pick.


 :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: 

Man oh man. We found the ideal fit for Tyson and our team.

Looks like Skiles gets his player if it came down to Tyrus (Pax) vs Aldridge (Skiles). I'm sure Skiles will make sure his new 'pet' makes an impact for our team from Day 1 and onward.

Now I wonder if it is true that we are looking to move Sweets + 16 for Olie + 13. Olie has a 2 year deal, but the second year being a team option. I believe he has either a salary of $3.25 million or $6.5 million for this year. Probably the former. I think it'd be worth it, to get ahead of Utah (likely getting Sene or a SG) and NOK (getting a big man or SG, opposite of pick 12).


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> Tyrus Thomas didn't finish the second workout? I knew the 2nd workout was along the lines of "get your *** back here or you have no chance of getting drafted here" but how can a guy not be able to finish 2 workouts? Did Skiles poke a joke and Tyrus started crying or something?


he had a strained hammy, sloth.


----------



## El Chapu

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

Should we underestimate the power of agents?


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> Man oh man. We found the ideal fit for Tyson and our team.


An unathletic, narrow-shouldered skinny 4 with a bad habit of disappearing in big games who's been working out with Will Perdue and refers to Perdue's playing career as having been, and I quote, "awesome"?

I think that LaMarcus Aldridge is as soft as a grape and has a pretty good chance of being a bust.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:
> 
> Man oh man. We found the ideal fit for Tyson and our team.
> 
> Looks like Skiles gets his player if it came down to Tyrus (Pax) vs Aldridge (Skiles). I'm sure Skiles will make sure his new 'pet' makes an impact for our team from Day 1 and onward.
> 
> Now I wonder if it is true that we are looking to move Sweets + 16 for Olie + 13. Olie has a 2 year deal, but the second year being a team option. I believe he has either a salary of $3.25 million or $6.5 million for this year. Probably the former. I think it'd be worth it, to get ahead of Utah (likely getting Sene or a SG) and NOK (getting a big man or SG, opposite of pick 12).


Hmm, its an interesting trade. Apparently Utah is leaning towards Reddick anyhow....so Sene would be on the board. Brewer and Carney will both be gone, I think what he does with this, is take the remainder of Sene or O'Bryant thats still on the board.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> An unathletic, narrow-shouldered skinny 4 with a bad habit of disappearing in big games who's been working out with Will Perdue and refers to Perdue's playing career as having been, and I quote, "awesome"?
> 
> I think that LaMarcus Aldridge is as soft as a grape and has a pretty good chance of being a bust.


I meant an offensively ready NBA player. I agree. I'm really sitting on the fence with Tyrus vs LaMarcus. Tyrus is Raw, but Hungry. Aldridge is Ready yet doesn't seem like a 'franchise' player for the 2nd pick. 

I'm iffy. But if the pick is Aldridge, and Skiles can bring the best out of him, then I'm all for it. If it's that close of a race for Pax to pick, let Skiles pick the player he thinks would fit best. 

I hope he did not mean Purdue was great, but said it out of politeness. But, we'll see. Time will tell who it is. I'll be happy with Tyrus or LaMarcus. I'm just hoping whoever comes in, can maximize their potential unlike the twin duds of 2001.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



ScottMay said:


> An unathletic, narrow-shouldered skinny 4 with a bad habit of disappearing in big games who's been working out with Will Perdue and refers to Perdue's playing career as having been, and I quote, "awesome"?
> 
> I think that LaMarcus Aldridge is as soft as a grape and has a pretty good chance of being a bust.


Whats wrong with saying that Will Purdue's career is awesome? The worst players can make the best coaches. Is Aldridge suppose to come out and say that the guy whose been teaching him stuff is a big white stiff?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

We need Dickey Simpkins as our big man coach.

The biggest gripe I have w/our organization, is we don't have a single good big man coach. We need to invest in one.


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



theanimal23 said:


> We need Dickey Simpkins as our big man coach.
> 
> The biggest gripe I have w/our organization, is we don't have a single good big man coach. We need to invest in one.


Bill Cartwright....Tyson Chandler had a pretty good offesnsive display under Cartwright.


----------



## Mr. T

*Insider: Garnett one last time?*

Not sure what time this was posted today by Chad Ford, but I just noticed it.


Will the Chicago Bulls trade the No. 2 pick? 
The hot rumor floating among GMs this morning was that the Bulls and Timberwolves might pull off a blockbuster Kevin Garnett deal, sending picks No. 2 (Tyrus Thomas) and No. 16 (probably Marcus Williams) along with either Luol Deng or Ben Gordon to Minnesota for Garnett.

Blockbuster deals are very difficult to pull off at this time of year. Given the Bulls' cap situation, they'd have to wait until after July 1 to clear the cap space to make it happen.

I'm skeptical the Wolves are ready to trade Garnett, but otherwise the trade makes a lot of sense.

If the Bulls keep the pick...

I talked to GM John Paxson on Tuesday night, and he appeared close to making up his mind between LaMarcus Aldridge and Tyrus Thomas. There were reports today that Shelden Williams might be in the mix there, but I'm not buying that. Paxson didn't mention his name.

Paxson told me that Bargnani was also seriously in the mix for Chicago at No. 2. I think this helped end trade talks for the Raptors. They were looking at trading down a few spots in the draft, but once they were convinced Bargnani would be gone at No. 2, they knew they had to keep the No. 1 pick.


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I hear ya. But I wish we would have gotten Ewing while we could. Maybe we can bring out Hakeem to tutor Aldridge if he is our pick.

The question is, what numbers do Tyrus or Aldridge wear? Should Tyrus wear 11 to honor Isiah since 12 is taken? 

23 is taken by some guy, I wonder if Aldridge picks one of the numbers that a lot of centers wear: 32,33,34? If he does, he better live up to the billing of the players wearing them. He can't get 21, even though he would to emulate his game after KG/Duncan as he says he does.


----------



## DengNabbit

*hey wheres that garnett thread*

disappearing before my very eyes. just like our chances for him?


----------



## theanimal23

*Re: Insider: Garnett one last time?*



Mr. T said:


> Paxson told me that Bargnani was also seriously in the mix for Chicago at No. 2. I think this helped end trade talks for the Raptors. They were looking at trading down a few spots in the draft, but once they were convinced Bargnani would be gone at No. 2, they knew they had to keep the No. 1 pick.


I think it was always Tyrus vs Aldridge. Thus Pax put out the Bargnani talk to make sure he has his choice between the two.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Insider: Garnett one last time?*

Yeah, I saw the thing on Insider, so its not a rumor, its actual talks, which is good. Hopefully they get something done, preferably without Gordon involved, the way I look at it, its like when Miami traded for Shaq, they protected their best young player, Dwyane Wade, ben gordon is that guy on this team. Only I think we'd be able to keep Hinrich, Gordon, and Nocioni, so we would have 1-4 set in our lineup, and still have capspace.

As far as Minnesota, they'd probaly draft like this:

2. Tyrus Thomas
6. Randy Foye
16. Marcus Williams 

So they'd have

PG-Marcus Williams (or Kyle Lowry)
SG-Randy Foye
SF-Luol Deng
PF-Tyrus Thomas
C- Tyson Chandler


Even with all those good young players, as we know as Bulls fans, just because you have good young players doesn't mean it'll be easy to completely rebuild.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: hey wheres that garnett thread*

it was merged into the PRE-Draft thread by me because the item had ALREADY BEEN POSTED THIS MORNING!!!!


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

I'd like to give a big, hearty ScottMay thanks to all the people who bogged down ESPN chats today with inane, selfish, irrelevant questions about whether a marginal 2nd round pick from their favorite college program will be drafted. Now I won't **** myself with surprise when I hear Carl Krauser's been tabbed in the second round.

Douchebags.


----------



## bullet

*Another KG to Bulls rumor - for Tyson , Deng and 2nd pick*



> A deal for Garnett would likely include Thomas, whose outrageous athleticism piqued the interest of the Timberwolves, among other teams.
> 
> One possibility has Thomas headed to the Bulls at the second overall pick. They then would send Thomas, center Tyson Chandler and forward Luol Deng to the Timberwolves in return for Garnett, the former Farragut Academy star. The deal could include other draft picks or lesser players.
> 
> Such a move would provide the Timberwolves with a young frontcourt to build around. In Garnett, the Bulls would have the superstar talent necessary to make a serious playoff run next spring, provided they're able to sign a free-agent center, such as Nene or Joel Przybilla, this summer.


http://www.dailysouthtown.com/southtown/dssports/pro/281sd9.htm


----------



## BG7

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*

uh-oh, looks like a rookie mod messed up on the merge!


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: *The Official Bulls 2006 PRE-Draft thread* (June 28th) Merged!!!!*



sloth said:


> uh-oh, looks like a rookie mod messed up on the merge!


Nah, it was a vet but I fixed it!


----------



## ScottMay

Chad Ford's mock v5.2 now has the Bulls taking Aldridge after *WEEKS* of Thomas at 2.

Yeeehaw!


----------



## ace20004u

ScottMay said:


> Chad Ford's mock v5.2 now has the Bulls taking Aldridge after *WEEKS* of Thomas at 2.
> 
> Yeeehaw!



That scares me, something about Aldridge worries me...


----------



## ScottMay

This is from RealGM's "draft night"

4:44 PM: ESPN's Chad Ford is reporting that the Bulls and Timberwolves are talking trade with Kevin Garnett the focal point. Minnesota would receive picks No. 2 (Tyrus Thomas) and No. 16 (probably Marcus Williams) along with either Luol Deng or Ben Gordon

can anyone confirm?


----------



## ace20004u

ScottMay said:


> This is from RealGM's "draft night"
> 
> 4:44 PM: ESPN's Chad Ford is reporting that the Bulls and Timberwolves are talking trade with Kevin Garnett the focal point. Minnesota would receive picks No. 2 (Tyrus Thomas) and No. 16 (probably Marcus Williams) along with either Luol Deng or Ben Gordon
> 
> can anyone confirm?



Yeah I can confirm. They have talked about it for a long time now, whether it actually happens or not is anyones guess, I would guess no.


----------



## greekbullsfan

*KG to Chicago*

:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:ESPN's Chad Ford is reporting that the Bulls and Timberwolves are talking trade with Kevin Garnett the focal point. Minnesota would receive picks No. 2 (Tyrus Thomas) and No. 16 (probably Marcus Williams) along with either Luol Deng or Ben Gordon

:banana:


----------



## The ROY

*Re: KG to Chicago*

fugg it..

who cares

do it and get it over with


----------



## The Future7

*Re: KG to Chicago*

I hope this goes through. If it does I will be playing NBA 2K6 for hours just using the Bulls.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: KG to Chicago*

I don't know if KG is enough to put us over the top. If we do the deal so that we're absorbing $16+ million in cap space, I doubt we have more than an MLE left for free agents. 

It's a tough one.


----------



## ace20004u

Kg is a heck of a player but we are giving up way too much in that deal given his age. Would be interesting to see KG & Chandler together in the front court. If we could swing it to have enough to pay Wallace that 10 mil a year and have a Wallace/Kg/Chandler front court that would be pretty darn solid.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: KG to Chicago*

well are we taking LaMarcia or Tyrus and trading him for KG??????


jesus. two hours. i already need a drink.


----------



## DaBullz

I have been lukewarm to the idea of trading for KG all along, but I am now convinced that it'd be a good idea.

We're still a real deep team if the trade goes down, and we get our superstar. He's good for 3-5 more fine seasons for us. 

At least we'd have a shot during that time, instead of waiting for some project draft pick to develop.

And we still have the option on the Knicks pick next season.

With just this trade:

Hinrich/Gordon/Duhon 
KG/Nocioni
Chandler/Sweetney/Allen

I think we still have some cap space left (more than MLE, less than Max), enough to make Peja an offer of some kind.


Hinrich/Gordon/Duhon
KG/Peja/Nocioni
Chandler/Sweeney/Allen

I'd play KG at C in a smallball lineup.


----------



## BG7

*Re: KG to Chicago*

So basically it comes down to this:

Tyson- 12 million
Deng- 3 million 
#2
#16
(rough salaries)

for

Kevin Garnett 20 million

But when you factor in the picks, we don't lose any capspace. Under this scenario, you have to sign Ben Wallace.

PG-Kirk Hinrich
SG-Ben Gordon
SF-Andres Nocioni
PF-Kevin Garnett
C- Ben Wallace

If you could tell me that we could come into the offseason, and switch Tyson Chandler and Luol Deng, forfeit our draft picks (something familiar to Minnesota) but come out with Garnett and Wallace, I'd do it. 

If we bring in Garnett and Wallace, just basically break it down like this.

Garnett>Deng
Wallace>Chandler

We improve, and we should still have capspace to sign some more bench guys, a veteran laden team, in better position than Miami was after the Shaq trade, get er done Pax!


----------



## DaBullz

*Re: KG to Chicago*



sloth said:


> So basically it comes down to this:
> 
> Tyson- 12 million
> Deng- 3 million
> #2
> #16
> (rough salaries)
> 
> for
> 
> Kevin Garnett 20 million
> 
> But when you factor in the picks, we don't lose any capspace. Under this scenario, you have to sign Ben Wallace.
> 
> PG-Kirk Hinrich
> SG-Ben Gordon
> SF-Andres Nocioni
> PF-Kevin Garnett
> C- Ben Wallace
> 
> If you could tell me that we could come into the offseason, and switch Tyson Chandler and Luol Deng, forfeit our draft picks (something familiar to Minnesota) but come out with Garnett and Wallace, I'd do it.
> 
> If we bring in Garnett and Wallace, just basically break it down like this.
> 
> Garnett>Deng
> Wallace>Chandler
> 
> We improve, and we should still have capspace to sign some more bench guys, a veteran laden team, in better position than Miami was after the Shaq trade, get er done Pax!


Chandler's not in the reported ESPN deal


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: KG to Chicago*



sloth said:


> So basically it comes down to this:
> 
> Tyson- 12 million
> Deng- 3 million
> #2
> #16
> (rough salaries)
> 
> for
> 
> Kevin Garnett 20 million
> 
> But when you factor in the picks, we don't lose any capspace. Under this scenario, you have to sign Ben Wallace.
> 
> PG-Kirk Hinrich
> SG-Ben Gordon
> SF-Andres Nocioni
> PF-Kevin Garnett
> C- Ben Wallace
> 
> If you could tell me that we could come into the offseason, and switch Tyson Chandler and Luol Deng, forfeit our draft picks (something familiar to Minnesota) but come out with Garnett and Wallace, I'd do it.
> 
> If we bring in Garnett and Wallace, just basically break it down like this.
> 
> Garnett>Deng
> Wallace>Chandler
> 
> We improve, and we should still have capspace to sign some more bench guys, a veteran laden team, in better position than Miami was after the Shaq trade, get er done Pax!



How long is Garnett>Deng, how long is Wallace>Chandler?


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## OziBull

Very Interesting stuff its 7am here in Australia, Good Mourning All! 
Very excited although i wont be able to actually watch it


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## DaBullz

*Re: KG to Chicago*



ace20004u said:


> How long is Garnett>Deng, how long is Wallace>Chandler?


Garnett may be >Deng for 10 years.


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## BG7

Well if Chandlers not involved, than with Garnett we gain 

20 Garnett- 3 Deng- 5 for picks, equals 12 million in capspace lost. I haven't done the math on how much capspace we have and all, but it should still be at around 8 million at least right? Ben Wallace said he'd do an 4 year 40 million contract, with max raises would 8 million be the starting contract? Could be interesting, hopefully this deal gets done.


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## ScottMay

*Re: KG to Chicago*



DaBullz said:


> Chandler's not in the reported ESPN deal


Which is hugely important. I'm not sure what our final cap # is, but absorbing $16-odd million of Garnett's contract is going to put a huge crimp in it. 

We would have no draft picks to add to the mix this year, period, and probably only another MLE-level FA. 

Is Hinrich/Duhon/Nocioni (Deng)/Garnett/Chandler enough to get out of the east in the next 2-3 years, which is pretty much Garnett's window?

I'm not sure.


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## BG7

*Re: KG to Chicago*



ScottMay said:


> Which is hugely important. I'm not sure what our final cap # is, but absorbing $16-odd million of Garnett's contract is going to put a huge crimp in it.
> 
> We would have no draft picks to add to the mix this year, period, and probably only another MLE-level FA.
> 
> Is Hinrich/Duhon/Nocioni (Deng)/Garnett/Chandler enough to get out of the east in the next 2-3 years, which is pretty much Garnett's window?
> 
> I'm not sure.


I'd rather take my chances on getting to the finals the next 4-5 years with Garnett than depending on Tyrus Thomas, LaMarcus Aldridge, and Joel Pryzbilla to get us there.


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## ScottMay

A whopping 70% of KGs FGAs in 2005-2006 were jumpers.

His eFG% in crunch time is .420.

I love him to death, but I think at this point in his career he's an incredibly good and expensive 2nd banana.


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## ScottMay

*Re: KG to Chicago*



sloth said:


> I'd rather take my chances on getting to the finals the next 4-5 years with Garnett than depending on Tyrus Thomas, LaMarcus Aldridge, and Joel Pryzbilla to get us there.


That's a very fair point.


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## DaBullz

ScottMay said:


> A whopping 70% of KGs FGAs in 2005-2006 were jumpers.
> 
> His eFG% in crunch time is .420.
> 
> I love him to death, but I think at this point in his career he's an incredibly good and expensive 2nd banana.


I think this is a fair point. You don't need him to be the crunch time guy - we have done OK with crunch time the past couple of seasons with Gordon.

Giving up Gordon instead of Deng would kill this deal for me.


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## BG7

DaBullz said:


> I think this is a fair point. You don't need him to be the crunch time guy - we have done OK with crunch time the past couple of seasons with Gordon.
> 
> Giving up Gordon instead of Deng would kill this deal for me.


Same here. By his fourth year, but more likely next year, I think Ben Gordon is a star. Luol Deng is good, but if it comes down to Deng and Gordon, hopefully Deng doesn't let the door hit him on the way out.

And remember the rumors of Paxson trading Deng a few days ago....maybe this is it.


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## mizenkay

_"sighhhh....ben will always be 6'1""_


if this deal goes down, i'll bet it's gordon who goes.

ford is on espn news saying it's looking like LaMarcus will go 2 to Chicago.

then in the next breath, he says he is suspicious, considering the bulls have been saying TYRUS all along. chad thinks a trade will happen.


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## ScottMay

mizenkay said:


> "sighhhh....ben will always be 6'1""
> 
> 
> if this deal goes down, i'll bet it's gordon who goes.
> 
> ford is on espn news saying it's looking like LaMarcus will go 2 to Chicago.
> 
> he's suspicious, considering the bulls have been saying TYRUS all along. chad thinks a trade will happen.


LaMarcus for 4 and 7 would be just fine and dandy by me. 

LaMarcus for ourselves would me I'd be superfocused on my rotisserie team this year, and I'd make darn sure not to draft any Bulls.


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## DaBullz

mizenkay said:


> "sighhhh....ben will always be 6'1""
> 
> 
> if this deal goes down, i'll bet it's gordon who goes.
> 
> ford is on espn news saying it's looking like LaMarcus will go 2 to Chicago.
> 
> he's suspicious, considering the bulls have been saying TYRUS all along. chad thinks a trade will happen.


In spite of all the misplaced disloyalty to Gordon:

* Gordon scored 20 PPG in the playoffs for us
* Deng disappeared in the playoffs for us
* Trading gordon would leave us a back court of Duhon (your favorite!) and Hinrich with Pargo as #3


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## The ROY

ScottMay said:


> LaMarcus for 4 and 7 would be just fine and dandy by me.
> 
> LaMarcus for ourselves would me I'd be superfocused on my rotisserie team this year, and I'd make darn sure not to draft any Bulls.


I doubt they'd do that..but I'd also be fine with 4 & 7


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## jbulls

mizenkay said:


> _"sighhhh....ben will always be 6'1""_
> 
> 
> if this deal goes down, i'll bet it's gordon who goes.
> 
> ford is on espn news saying it's looking like LaMarcus will go 2 to Chicago.
> 
> then in the next breath, he says he is suspicious, considering the bulls have been saying TYRUS all along. chad thinks a trade will happen.


That's a shame. Gordon would be a great complement to Garnett. Deng would play fine w/ Garnett, but I think if KG is going to win the championship he's going to have to play with a really good pure scorer.


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## mizenkay

listen guys, i'm not saying it...i was just quoting PAX from his score interview.

we still need a big defensive minded guard in whatever scenario (trade/draft) that happens.


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## The ROY

Looks like we're taking soft *** LaMarcus Aldridge.....


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## DaBullz

mizenkay said:


> listen guys, i'm not saying it...i was just quoting PAX from his score interview.
> 
> we still need a big defensive minded guard in whatever scenario happens.


There's always that rookie sensation Eddie Basden!


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## BG7

I wouldn't be surprised if Minnesota wanted us to take Aldridge for them, because Tyrus is probaly still there at 6, and then they take Lowry at 16.

PG-Kyle Lowry
SG-Ricky Davis
SF-Luol Deng
PF-Tyrus Thomas
C- LaMarcus Aldridge


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## El Chapu

The Blazers will trade for the Bulls only if the want X guy and they are certain he will be taken either by them (Bulls) or Cats. I say they have a shot at getting Morrison and Aldridge at #7 (if Shelden to Atlanta happens).


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## mizenkay

i need a STRONG drink.

from  the other board 




> Hey everybody. Long time reader first time poster. *I have it from a very reliable source that the Bulls are targeting Tyrus Thomas at #2 and Thabo at #16.* The Bulls like Thomas and Thabo a lot because of their athletic ability, work ethic and energy. They view Thomas as a shorter version of Amare. I love Thabo but am dissapointed with Tyrus. I am really hoping they draft Bargnani. I really can't say much more about the source and I know everyone will be skeptical but you just have to trust me on this one. Other tidbits I gathered are as follows:
> 
> - They are concerned about you know who trading up in front of them to draft Ty.
> 
> - They like Bargnani a lot and think he will end up being better than Gasol. However, based on his current level of play his game in the NBA would be perimiter oriented and they need inside help now, not in two years when is interior skills will develop.
> 
> - Aldridge doesn't like to mix it up inside.
> 
> - Chandler could be traded.
> 
> - *Minnesota wants too much for KG- Deng, Gordon, Chandler and both #1s.*
> 
> - They also like O'Bryant but think he'll need a couple of years to fill out and develop. O'Bryant (if he's there),Sene or Paul Davis would be options at 16 if Tyson is traded.
> 
> I hope this quenches everybody's thirst for news. I was excited to get the info but was dissapointed to hear that Thomas was the pick. I am 100% positive this info is solid but I guess we'll find out shortly.







> My source is not Chad Ford, not a Bulls player and it is not Skiles or Paxson. Suffice it to say that it is someone in the organization that is close to the decision making process.


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## The ROY

This is going to be a CRAZY night

If the Bulls view Tyrus as a smaller Amare..you don't TRADE him


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## OziBull

6:20 PM: Andy Katz is reporting that teams are talking to the Bulls about moving up to the #2 pick with the idea of taking Adam Morrison
From real gm webcast


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## DaBullz

ESPN reports:

Bargnani a sure thing at #1 by raptors

Morrison a sure thing at #3 by Charlotte/MJ

LOTS of teams trying to get the #2 from Chicago to draft Morrison


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## The ROY

OziBull said:


> 6:20 PM: Andy Katz is reporting that teams are talking to the Bulls about moving up to the #2 pick with the idea of taking Adam Morrison
> From real gm webcast


YEP, I was just about to report that LOL

We could pick up another asset if we trade with Charlotte (Ely?) or Portland.


----------



## BG7

OziBull said:


> 6:20 PM: Andy Katz is reporting that teams are talking to the Bulls about moving up to the #2 pick with the idea of taking Adam Morrison
> From real gm webcast


Could we land both #4 and #7 if Portland desperately wants Morrison? Not sure who else we'd want.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

DaBullz said:


> ESPN reports:
> 
> Bargnani a sure thing at #1 by raptors
> 
> Morrison a sure thing at #3 by Charlotte/MJ
> 
> LOTS of teams trying to get the #2 from Chicago to draft Morrison



OOOOHHHH I'm loving all this! 

Only an hour or so away!

Tick Tick Tick!


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## OziBull

Yeh Pax must be feeling preety good about himself right now, looks like the KG rumours have died down.
Portland might want Morrison real bad! Offer us 4 and 7 for 2 and 16


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## The ROY

OziBull said:


> Yeh Pax must be feeling preety good about himself right now, looks like the KG rumours have died down.
> Portland might want Morrison real bad! Offer us 4 and 7 for 2 and 16


Ohh, I'd do that 

don't think they would though lol


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## BG7

After further review, maybe this happens.

Bulls Trade 2 and 16

Portland Trades: 4 and 7

Bulls take Aldridge and Roy

Portland gets Morrison and someone at 16.


----------



## DaBullz

...


----------



## OziBull

Yeh i just suggested that, doubt it would happen though after giving up Telfair for 7.


----------



## truebluefan

DaBullz said:


> ESPN reports:
> 
> Bargnani a sure thing at #1 by raptors
> 
> Morrison a sure thing at #3 by Charlotte/MJ
> 
> LOTS of teams trying to get the #2 from Chicago to draft Morrison


I saw that too. They talked like some teams want our #2 pick so we may trade down slightly and still get a good player.


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## OziBull

Unless they are intersted in Duhon as a backup too Jack? and its practically the same deal that was rumoured to go down with Boston.
Oh i dont know, my mind is spinning a million miles an hour!
This is crazy! 
I wish i could have visual of ESPN


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## El Chapu

Would you rather have the deal announced before the actual draft or have Stern saying "we have a trade to announce"?


----------



## OziBull

6:41 PM: Toronto is trying to trade down to 4 or 5 and looking to select Randy Foye


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## ScottMay

El Chapu said:


> Would you rather have the deal announced before the actual draft or have Stern saying "we have a trade to announce"?


It would probably be conditional on certain players being available at certain spots, so it'd almost have to be the latter. 

Which is always exciting. The group of friends I watch the draft with STILL make remarks about the expression on my face when I learned the Bulls had traded Brand for Chandler.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1

ScottMay said:


> The group of friends I watch the draft with STILL make remarks about the expression on my face when I learned the Bulls had traded Brand for Chandler.


*"Tell 'Em...
Large Marge Sentcha!"*


----------



## chifaninca

OziBull said:


> 6:20 PM: Andy Katz is reporting that teams are talking to the Bulls about moving up to the #2 pick with the idea of taking Adam Morrison
> From real gm webcast



TRADE DOWN PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Unless Bargnani is available at 2, you can take either Aldridge or Thomas at 4, pick up Roy or Brewer or SImmons at 7 and then round it out with Thabo or Sene at 16 and if we had to give the 16, then lets hope we grab a 30 and/or 31.


I can live with any of Bargnani, Aldridge, or Thomas. They all offer the same problems and uncertainty.


----------



## El Chapu

chifaninca said:


> TRADE DOWN PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Unless Bargnani is available at 2, you can take either Aldridge or Thomas at 4, pick up Roy or Brewer or SImmons at 7 and then round it out with Thabo or Sene at 16.
> 
> 
> I can live with any of Bargnani, Aldridge, or Thomas. They all offer the same problems and uncertainty.


Me too, and Im sure the Blazers as well. At least with Bargnani, Aldridge or Gay.


----------



## The ROY

Anybody just see the whole group of players on stage?

bargnani was clearly taller than EVERYONE else lol...they looked like kids compared to him..even O'Bryant


----------



## mizenkay

guys, please don't FREAK OUT, but i am going to TEMPORARILY LOCK this thread until after the draft.

let's go over to the OFFICIAL thread now.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

I'M FRREEEEEEAAAAKKKIIIINGGG OOOOOOOOUUUUUUTTTTT!!!!

O.M.G.!!!!!


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## rwj333

> Hey everybody. Long time reader first time poster. I have it from a very reliable source that the Bulls are targeting Tyrus Thomas at #2 and Thabo at #16. The Bulls like Thomas and Thabo a lot because of their athletic ability, work ethic and energy. They view Thomas as a shorter version of Amare. I love Thabo but am dissapointed with Tyrus. I am really hoping they draft Bargnani. I really can't say much more about the source and I know everyone will be skeptical but you just have to trust me on this one. Other tidbits I gathered are as follows:
> 
> - They are concerned about you know who trading up in front of them to draft Ty.
> - They like Bargnani a lot and think he will end up being better than Gasol. However, based on his current level of play his game in the NBA would be perimiter oriented and they need inside help now, not in two years when is interior skills will develop.
> - Aldridge doesn't like to mix it up inside.
> - Chandler could be traded.
> - Minnesota wants to much for KG- Deng, Gordon, Chandler and both #1s.
> - They also like O'Bryant but think he'll need a couple of years to fill out and develop. O'Bryant (if he's there),Sene or Paul Davis would be options at 16 if Tyson is traded.
> 
> I hope this quenches everybody's thirst for news. I was excited to get the info but was dissapointed to hear that Thomas was the pick. I am 100% positive this info is solid but I guess we'll find out shortly.



Seems like this dude that mizenkay quoted was exactly right. Hm...


----------



## The ROY

> - Chandler could be traded.


I think this is coming


----------



## TripleDouble

The ROY said:


> I think this is coming


I hope not. Why trade when value is at an all time low?


----------



## The ROY

TripleDouble said:


> I hope not. Why trade when value is at an all time low?


I'm not saying I want to deal right now. But there's too many rumors out there.


----------



## kulaz3000

Ill say this about our team. We've got plenty of length now. We're all arms!!!


----------



## BG7

We need to keep Chandler, he's our only 7 footer right now (and schenscher). If we trade him, we'll probaly end up with a point guard and small forward.


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## mizenkay

ok. anyone else just glad that's all over? talk about anticipation. whew! 

now onto the rest of the off-season. FA's! here we come.

going to unstick this mega baby. will keep the draft night thread and the combine thread up a little while longer.


----------

