# What NBA teams are considered small markets?



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

In light of this Ricky Rubio rumors and what we have seen with Yi Jianlian, I just want to know if there is a consensus as to which cities are small markets. 

As such, that must mean that there are large and medium markets because there is obviously an NBA middle.


*LARGE MARKET*- 18
Los Angeles (city has two teams)
New York (city will have two teams when Nets move to Brooklyn)
Chicago
Boston
Philadelphia
Atlanta
Houston
Dallas
San Francisco/Oakland
Detroit
Washington D.C.
Miami
Phoenix
Toronto
Denver
Minneapolis/St. Paul

*MEDIUM MARKET* - 5
New Orleans
Cleveland
Indianapolis
Charlotte
Milwaukee

*SMALL MARKET* - 7
Sacramento
Salt Lake City
Portland
Oklahoma City
Orlando
San Antonio
Memphis


I personally feel there is too big of a misconception between large and small market in this league. For example, there are only seven teams that I would consider to be small market (meaning they only support one professional sports franchise). The interesting thing is, out of those seven, four of them made the playoffs.

To be a medium market you need to support more than two professional franchises, but if you don't have all four major sports you are not a large market. Cleveland and Indianapolis are tradition laden cities when it comes to sports, but under this criteria they would fit in the medium markets zip code as they should.

As for the large markets, there are 18 teams located in big market areas and it would be 19 if Seattle didn't move. Cities like Minneapolis/St. Paul and Denver are definitely large markets. As are Washington D.C., Atlanta, Toronto and Detroit.

So what is the point in all of this? Well it is my contention that the reason that people think that every team outside of say New York, Boston or LA is a small market is because of this league's history. When the league was first founded all of the teams were concentrated on the East before merging with the ABA basically (with notable exceptions). Alongside that basketball is the only professional team sport that can truly be dominated by an individual team over a prolonged period of time (if you have the best player). 

The NBA is hurt mostly by the fact that outside of the Celtics and Lakers, most of the teams in this league do not have the tradition laden history necessary to be seen as a big market team. How on earth can the Atlanta Braves or Falcons be considered big market, but not the Hawks? 

It all comes down to winning. The fact that the Lakers have been to the playoffs 56 times in their 61 year history and represented the West in the Finals 30 times is good for the Lakers, but bad for the league.

For this very reason it's why you should root for Washington, Atlanta, Golden State, Denver, Minnesota, all of the medium markets and all of the smaller markets to do well to at least bring some balance to the history of the league. 

I also do recognize that the NBA is the youngest professional league of them all, so perhaps I have to wait another 40 years to see some real evolution, but I like just wish people would realize that there aren't many small market teams in this league. The funny thing about the small market teams, they are all committed to building title contending teams (Maloofs, Peter Holt, Rich DeVos, Paul Allen, Greg Miller, Michael Heisley, Clay Bennett).

What do you guys think?


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

Milwaukee is a very small market. No where "medium".


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## JT (Mar 1, 2004)

> The fact that the Lakers have been to the playoffs 56 times in their 61 year history and represented the West in the Finals 30 times is good for the Lakers, but bad for the league.


bad in what sense? certainly not a business one. san antonio, a small market team, has won four titles in the past ten years yet has the success of the franchise bolstered additional nationwide attention? fans of the team aren't seen in other nba cities like for other teams. I think it is what it is. the largest markets (by population--meaning LA, Chi, & NYC) will always rule, specially excepting boston who represents the entire new england area.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

Dee-Zy said:


> Milwaukee is a very small market. No where "medium".



Id say on the low side of medium, the whole tri county milwaukee area has well over a million people that live in it, not all farms, but compared to the majority of cities that have pro sports they are not a big market


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

JT said:


> bad in what sense? certainly not a business one. san antonio, a small market team, has won four titles in the past ten years yet has the success of the franchise bolstered additional nationwide attention? fans of the team aren't seen in other nba cities like for other teams. I think it is what it is. the largest markets (by population--meaning LA, Chi, & NYC) will always rule, specially excepting boston who represents the entire new england area.


Yes it's bad when one team represents the league for half of their total Finals. That doesn't embrace much room for growth in terms of growing the sport in other domestic markets.


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## Jakain (Sep 8, 2006)

The list looks about right to me. Makes me even more glad that the small market Spurs were able to secure such great feats as: being the most winning-est franchise in all of pro sports and netting the most NBA rings after Jordan left.


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## JT3000 (Nov 3, 2004)

The term "market size" is usually a reference to TV markets. This is a measure of how many people live in a specific area and own televisions, not the number of sports teams a city has. Your list is completely off. 

http://tvbythenumbers.com/2008/09/10/nielsen-local-television-market-universe-estimates/5037

Funny little coincidence...



> 17 Cleveland-Akron (Canton)
> 18 Denver
> 19 Orlando-Daytona Bch-Melbrn


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## JT3000 (Nov 3, 2004)

double post


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

JT3000 said:


> The term "market size" is usually a reference to TV markets. This is a measure of how many people live in a specific area and own televisions, not the number of sports teams a city has. Your list is completely off.
> 
> http://tvbythenumbers.com/2008/09/10/nielsen-local-television-market-universe-estimates/5037
> 
> Funny little coincidence...


Uh, I know what television markets are. The Clippers play in a city with the second largest market and they don't get any viewership. I judge it more by how many teams are in the area because that shows how many more people are able to support the team. Orlando without the Magic, is a minor league town. Denver without the Nuggets isn't one. Get it now.


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## JT3000 (Nov 3, 2004)

No, I don't get it. Probably because it's erroneous logic. Nobody watches the Clippers because they're a 2nd basketball team in a city that already has a much better one. Having teams in separate sports is completely different. The fans in those cities don't have to choose which ones to support. Conversely, just because a city like Orlando has one team, that doesn't mean there's less sports fans in the market. There are other factors.


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## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

Clippers are second largest market. They just need to win 2 championship in the near future.

Clippers have got many top 5 picks last 11 years including Olowokandi, Eltan Brand, ......

9 of 11 years Clippers have top 5? Usually these are superstars. Can you image that a team has 9 superstars?


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

Are you counting Hockey?


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Nimreitz said:


> Are you counting Hockey?


Yes. Basketball. Baseball. Football. Hockey.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

HKF said:


> Yes. Basketball. Baseball. Football. Hockey.


Hockey is not a major sport.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Nimreitz said:


> Hockey is not a major sport.


I am curious why do you feel it's not a major sport.


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## OneBadLT123 (Oct 4, 2005)

Nimreitz said:


> Hockey is not a major sport.


Uh, yes the NHL is.


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## Pimped Out (May 4, 2005)

roux2dope said:


> Id say on the low side of medium, the whole tri county milwaukee area has well over a million people that live in it, not all farms, but compared to the majority of cities that have pro sports they are not a big market


the same thing can be said for Salt Lake or San Antonio (the spurs also control another metropolitan market in Austin) but they are all still small markets.


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