# My EC predictions



## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

Here are my predictions about the upcoming European championship that will take place in Sweden.
Rosters are not complete, don't be mad if I missed one or two good players I tried to be realistic about it...

I did want to write comments under each team, but ran out of time:uhoh: 

No.1- Yuga
C- Drobnjak
PF- Gurovic
SF- Stojakovic
SG- Jaric
PG- Vujanic

Bench:Tarlac, Cabarkapa,Vukcevic, Pavlovic, Koturovic, Kecman, Rakocevic...

Still impressive list although Bodiroga, Tomasevic, Divac, Radmanovic and Rebraca will not play. EC won't be so easy for them this year.

No.2 -Turkey
C- Okur
PF- Turcan
SF- Turkoglu
SG- Kutluay
PG- Erdenay

Bench: Pars, Besok, Yildrim, Tunceri...


No.3 -France

C- Weiss
PF-Moiso
SF-Pietrus
SG-Foirest
PG-Parker

Bench:Abdul-Wahad, Diaw, Sonko, Digbeu,Turiaff, Morlende, F.Pietrus...


No.4 -Slovenia
C- Brezec
F- Smodis
SF-Nachbar
SG-Gorenc
PG-McDonald

Bench: Milic, Lakovic, Tusek, Jurkovic, Udrih, Vujacic, Duscak...


No.5 -Greece
C- Tsakalidis
PF- Fotsis
SF- Alvertis
SG- Hatzivretas
PG -Papalouskas

Bench: Sigalas, Papadopoulos, Rentzias, Kalaitzis, Diamantidis, Shortsianitis...


No.6 -Spain
C- Duenas
PF- Garbajosa
SF- Gasol
SG- L.Angulo
PG- Navarro

Bench: Kornegay, Lopez, Rodrigez, De la Fuente...


No.7 -Croatia
C- Kovacic
PF- Kukoc
SF- Sesar
SG- Giricek
PG- Mulaomerovic

Bench: Sundov, Vujcic, Skelin, Popovic, Prkacin, Tabak, Planinic...


No.8 -Germany
C- Femmerling
PF- Nowitzki
SF- Okulaja
SG- Pesic
PG- Garret

Bench: Demirel, Tomic, Arigbabu, Garris...


No.9 -Italy
C- Chiacig
PF-Marconatto
SF-Radulovic
SG-Basile
PG-Pozzecco

Bench: Bulleri, Galanda, Righetti, Mian, De Pol...


No.10 Lithuania
C- E. Zukauskas
PF-Einikis
SF- Stombergas
SG-Salenga
PG-Jasikevicius

Bench: Timinskas, M.Zukauskas, Siskauskas, Slanina...


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

Brief comment : France and Greece too high, Italy, Lithuania and Germany too low


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## kingl (Jun 21, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>italianBBlover</b>!
> Brief comment : France and Greece too high, Italy, Lithuania and Germany too low


Greece too high?I would say the opposite...We have a very good team this time with young and talanted players 
For France and Germany i agree...
Is Italy good this time??


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## Zalgirinis (Feb 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> No.10 Lithuania
> C- E. Zukauskas
> PF-Einikis
> ...


Well, if you put this lineup of course we could be No.10, but from the starting 3 or 4 players wont be in NT at all, look at this starting 5:
C-Ilgauskas (Sabonis) | E.Zukauskas said he wont play if both NBAers will be.
PF-Songaila (Praskevicius) |Einikis??? are you drunk, he didnt shown a thing this year and isnt invited for training camp, hes done with NT, if not carreer.
SF-Siskauskas (Timinskas, M.Zukauskas) | dont know really, who of them will be a starter.
SG-Macijauskas (Slanina) | Salenga, dont make me laugh )
PG-Jasikevicius (Maskoliunas)

We have one other spot for K. or D. Lavrinovic, E.Zukauskas, Zavackas or Stombergas (no pls dont take him...)

And after all, how could be Lithuania in 10th place after wining all groups matches???!!!


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## starvydas (Jul 16, 2002)

Spain should be ranked higher IMO. They are a well balanced team, probably Europe's best defense and have a go-to-guy in Gasol.

Also guys, please don't sleep on France. It's true we've never done well in a EC but this year could be great for us. We have the best young backcourt in the competition with Parker, Diaw, Pietrus and Morlende. The only knock on us is that we have to start that big stiff Frederic Weis:no:and we lack big men, that's why Ronny Turiaf should be the surprise of this team. He's really good, last year he was the leader of Gonzaga and in the top five of FT attempted in the whole NCAA.


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## SEOK (Apr 3, 2003)

*Re: Re: My EC predictions*



> Originally posted by <b>Zalgirinis</b>!
> 1) PF-Songaila (Praskevicius) |Einikis??? are you drunk, he didnt shown a thing this year and isnt invited for training camp, hes done with NT, if not carreer.
> 
> 2) And after all, how could be Lithuania in 10th place after wining all groups matches???!!!


1) Where was playing Einikis this year? I've lost him... 

2) Ukraine - Lithuania 89-82


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## Zalgirinis (Feb 18, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: My EC predictions*



> Originally posted by <b>SEOK</b>!
> 
> 1) Where was playing Einikis this year? I've lost him...


He was playing in Zalgiris. In first half of season he was our main center, blah.. you can check our results then, when Tanoka Beard came here, Einikis went to bench, where he belongs too. The only thing he could do this season was making few 3pts, cause other centers didnt follow him to 3pt line, he was nothing near basket and absolute zero in defence.



> 2) Ukraine - Lithuania 89-82


Well yea, that one was great, but have you checked other results from our qualification group?

I like this the most Lithuania - Turkey 100:62, and about that game we lost, it was in 2002 January long time ago... I havent seen the game cause our fakin TVs didnt manage to show it. But if I remember good, we had just one center in that game - E.Zukauskas, cause others were injured. E.Zukauskas got quick fouls and the main power of Ukraine was their centers Okunski and Xizniak, who made both double-double's or so. And I think it was the only Xizniak game in his National team, where he was allowed to play so big minutes. And morealso our players were thinking that they will get back to the game when they need, but it was too late in the end. 

I dont think that one loss in qualification round is tragedy and other games showed that we have potential, especially I liked last one in Stambul, where with help of referess Turkey managed to come back and get 8 points lead with 2 minutes left, but our guys managed to make the OT and won it...
Turkcan was pissed off :laugh:


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## kingl (Jun 21, 2003)

Here are my predictions...

No.1- Yuga
No.2 -Greece
No.3 -Spain
No.4 -Germany
No.5 -France
No.6 -Turkey
No.7 -Lithuania
No.8 -Italy
No.9 -Slovenia
No.10 Croatia

I dont like my predictions that much...so ll try to change it amonth before the the games start


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## starvydas (Jul 16, 2002)

Hmmm are you Greek kingl? 

Seems to me that Greek basketball isn't as dominant as it used to be. I really don't see them reaching the final. I like Spain, Turkey, and France more. But hey you never know...


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## kingl (Jun 21, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>starvydas</b>!
> Hmmm are you Greek kingl?
> 
> Seems to me that Greek basketball isn't as dominant as it used to be. I really don't see them reaching the final. I like Spain, Turkey, and France more. But hey you never know...


Yes.YOu got me 
But i truly believe we have a good team this time. Its the best team we had the last 10 years...The only thing that can make us dont be so good, is that it is a new team...I dont know if we ll be at the finall, but i am almost sure we ll be at th final 4...


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## Chef (Nov 24, 2002)

Here you have Spanish NT:

PG-Marco, Calderon, Cabezas

SG-Navarro, Grimau, Herreros

SF- Jimenez, De la Fuente, Yebra

PF- A.Reyes, A. Bueno. Garbajosa

C-Gasol, F. Reyes


2 players will not be at the Eurobasket. I will like them to be: Cabezas and Grimau but they will probably be Cabezas and Yebra.

Still we could be better. I hope Raul Lopez and Roberto Dueñas are ready for Athenas...


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## SEOK (Apr 3, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: My EC predictions*



> Originally posted by <b>Zalgirinis</b>!
> 
> 
> I dont think that one loss in qualification round is tragedy and other games showed that we have potential, especially I liked last one in Stambul, where with help of referess Turkey managed to come back and get 8 points lead with 2 minutes left, but our guys managed to make the OT and won it...
> Turkcan was pissed off :laugh:


Thanks for the infos about Einikis...
I was kidding of course, who cares about the qualifications? There are 12 teams that already know they will pass them in a positive way (Italy, France, Spain, Greece, Croatia, Slovenia, Lithuania, Russia, Germany, Israel, Bosnia, Turkey), two teams already qualified (Serbia&Montenegro and the NT of the country that will organize the tournament) and two others coming from the group Ukraina, Latvia, Estonia, Poland, Czech Republic, Hungary, Belarus, Fyrom....


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## Marco Mitis (Dec 17, 2002)

For SEOK

how do you rate ANDREAS GLINIADAKIS ?
Rumors are that he have signed for Snaidero Udine.
ciao


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## SEOK (Apr 3, 2003)

I rate him like a fighter, the classical center "like-we-could-see-15-years-ago". I don't believe he will play some seasons at 20 points and 10 rebs per game, but he will always work for the team (like he made this year with Peristeri). 
If I've to make a comparison, I imagine he will become a sort of Michael Andersen in the future.


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

> Well, if you put this lineup of course we could be No.10, but from the starting 3 or 4 players wont be in NT at all, look at this starting 5:


As you can see i am not an expert about Lithuanian NT. I don't know how good are some players at this particulary moment. Also I didn't know Sabas and Ilgauskas will play in Sweden- that certanly makes Lithuania much, much better team.
My bad- No offense



> are you drunk


I just got sober...:cheers: 



> Spain should be ranked higher IMO


Basketball is a team sport you can't win just because one individual. It's true that happened quite some times- but this will end sooner or later- quality of euro basketball is rising from year to year.... 




> No.9 -Slovenia


Maybe I am too patriot ( no.4) but...:jawdrop: :whofarted 



> No.2 -Greece


I don't believe your guards are good enough...


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## Zalgirinis (Feb 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> 
> Basketball is a team sport you can't win just because one individual. It's true that happened quite some times- but this will end sooner or later- quality of euro basketball is rising from year to year....


I agree with that and thats why I dont think Germany is a favorite, but Spain has something more than Gasol alone. I like Navarro and De La Fuente a lot. 

Greeks, Matiz and starvydas think that their teams are stronger when before, I think the same about mine too, but there cant be 5 teams in semifinals (these 4 +S&M)... so just wait and see, I dont like predictions much.


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

EC will end up totally different than all predictions- but it's fun...



> agree with that and thats why I dont think Germany is a favorite, but Spain has something more than Gasol alone. I like Navarro and De La Fuente a lot.


They are good players (I like them too)- but just nothing special- Germany has Okulaja and Femmerling= same thing. 

France has a nice team- a lot of very good guards but they would definitely need a center and a pf...

But in the end Zalgirinis you are right, we will see... can't wait


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## kingl (Jun 21, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> we will see... can't wait


yeah me to...I belive that it would be a very interesting tournament,,,because most teams are pretty much at they same level. You cannot really c if sb will be 2nd or 8th...

PS: Why are the games on September?I hate waiting 2 more months....:uhoh:


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

> You cannot really c if sb will be 2nd or 8th...


Yeah it is difficult to make such predictions... It is based on Players ratings but that theory was proved wrong quite some times in my NT case... :upset: 
It is time to revenge...  :laugh: :rocket:


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## safari (May 19, 2003)

There's no way France starts Weis at Center ! It would be smarter to start Julian ( or palmer if he is on the team ).
I think that Spain, France, Yougo and Turkey have a good chance of winning it all ( although Yougo may not have Peja and Divac, they still have Bodiroga ).


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

> I think that Spain, France, Yougo and Turkey have a good chance of winning it all ( although Yougo may not have Peja and Divac, they still have Bodiroga ).


Peja will play, Bodiroga doesn't know yet... Yuga and Turkey yes, Spain and France... semifinals at best.


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## Chef (Nov 24, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> 
> 
> Peja will play, Bodiroga doesn't know yet... Yuga and Turkey yes, Spain and France... semifinals at best.



Turkey better than Spain and France? :laugh: 

Spain beat Turkey at Worlds 87-64

France is a very young team but they have a lot of potential, if Pietrus and Diaw explode like parker did watch out. Also, they have some good big men coming:

PG-Parker
SG-Pietrus
SF-Diaw
PF-Turiaf
C-Petro

Imagine that lineup in 3 or 4 year...


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

> Imagine that lineup in 3 or 4 year...


Did I say France is not talented!?!?:whatever: I didn't ( that would be realy stupid...)
I don't know about France- you are just unexperienced, but yes Turkeys players are better than Spains...

PG- Lopez : Erdenay- equal
SG- Navarro : Kutluay - Both stars, Kutluay is better
SF- De la Fuente: Turkoglu - Guess!?!
PF- Garbajosa : Turkcan - Guess again
C- Gasol : Okur - Only position where spain is dominating

Spain has a bit better bench players.

Still, this are just names...


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## Chef (Nov 24, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> 
> 
> Did I say France is not talented!?!?:whatever: I didn't ( that would be realy stupid...)
> ...


First, Lopez is in the NBA so he is probably better than Erdenay, Second, Kutluay better than Navarro??? I don't think so...
Third, Turkcan is not better than Garbajosa. Both were top 5 in the Euroleague, but at the final 4, guess who did better? Garbajosa, Turkcan is a loser, never shows up in the important moments.
Fourth, Spain's bench is way better than Turkey's one...

Remember

Spain 87

Turkey 64


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

Anyway we both have different opinions on this stuff, you are a patriot- YOU SHOULD BE! but we will see all that in the EC... the things you wrote right now could be true( if i'm wrong) all But Navarro: Kutluay... hey I absolutely hate this ugly madafaka Kutluay- so believe me i Would like to see Navarro better than him... but NO CAN DO! 
PEACE


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## suspect (Sep 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> Anyway we both have different opinions on this stuff, you are a patriot- YOU SHOULD BE! but we will see all that in the EC... the things you wrote right now could be true( if i'm wrong) all But Navarro: Kutluay... hey I absolutely hate this ugly madafaka Kutluay- so believe me i Would like to see Navarro better than him... but NO CAN DO!
> PEACE


Kutluay is hardly a star.....He is a one dimensional three pointshooter...If he's hot he is good..but if he's not he will do a lot of damage to his own team as his offence is limited to shooting three pointers..... (besides he doesn't play D)...Navarro has better offence (but has flaws as well)........


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## safari (May 19, 2003)

Pietrus Suuxxxx 
How can he pass by the EC just because he's exhausted ?

:upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: 

If he acts like that it wouldn't surprise me if he wasn't invited to future french national team tournament .....
Even Morlende who's been injured is gonna play in the EC !

French roster is set now :

PGs : Paccelis Morlende, Tony Parker, Moustapha Sonko

SGs / SFs : Tariq Abdul-Wahad, Boris Diaw, Alain Digbeu, Makan Dioumassi, Laurent Foirest, Karim Souchu

PFs / Cs : Cyril Julian, Vincent Masingue, Jérôme Moïso, Florent Pietrus, Ronny Turiaf, Thierry Rupert

The only thing nice about the desertion of Pietrus is that Dioumassi will see PT, and will shut down ( as he always does ) opponents' scorers.


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## Just dunk it (Jun 20, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Chef</b>!
> 
> 
> First, Lopez is in the NBA so he is probably better than Erdenay, Second, Kutluay better than Navarro??? I don't think so...
> ...


Forget Matiz. He has a curious understanding of the game...


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

> Forget Matiz. He has a curious understanding of the game...


 
I'm a provocator- yes, but I've been playing basketball for looooong time, and played against some guys that are in our junior NT , I have a judge course so... perhaps I know a few things about basketball even though you don't agree with me?!?!

By names Turkey is a better team, but the way you beat us last EC, I must agree you have a strong team and you can beat Turkey- you are a patriot- that's cool, you should be and you do not have sooo impresive roster and such crap as Garbajosa equals Turcan... makes me LMFAO.

enjoy


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## Genjuro (Jul 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> 
> Basketball is a team sport you can't win just because one individual. It's true that happened quite some times- but this will end sooner or later- quality of euro basketball is rising from year to year....


That's why I think Spain should be better than Turkey right now. Spain plays team ball, while the 12 Dev Adam didn't seem to do that in the Worlds, far from home. To many egos there. And that's why I think Germany is also better. It would be like the Spurs: one great superstar and the entire supporting cast just filling roles.


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## 2222 (Mar 21, 2003)

I think some of you are grossly overrating the Turkish NT because:

1.They dont have one single top class guard:
Tunceri is unarguably the biggest loser in the European basketball scene
Tutku Acik and Ender Arslan are second rate at best
Kutluay cant dribble, cant penetrate and finish, cant rebound and cant defend.
Yilmaz is a big liability on the offensive end
2.Their bench is not deep enough-actually the only bench player that contributes offensively is Besok
3.They have one of the stupidest coaches in Europe whose teams ALWAYS fail at crunch time(most times because of him)
4.There is no cohesion and no team spirit: Turkoglu and Kutluay, Turkoglu and Turkcan, Tunceri and Kutluay hate each other while everyone in the team hates Asim Pars and Yildirim.
5.The team has no leader on and off the court.
6.They are too static in offense and too erratic in shooting.


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## J-Will2 (Aug 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Genjuro</b>!
> 
> That's why I think Spain should be better than Turkey right now. Spain plays team ball, while the 12 Dev Adam didn't seem to do that in the Worlds, far from home. To many egos there. And that's why I think Germany is also better. It would be like the Spurs: one great superstar and the entire supporting cast just filling roles.


Spain could compete with Turkey or even beat them, my opinion is that Spain plays one of the best defenses in europe and have a good offense. But Germany... Germany has one of the 10 best players in the world in Nowitzky, a solid forward in Okulaja and a large man in Femerling. But that is all. The other players in the German NT couldn't be starters in a solid Euroleague team (which Alba isn't, unfortunately). I do like their game, but I think that it's not that hard to stop them; you really just have to stop Dirk from scoring more than 28, 30 points... I give them credits for an incredible accomplishment in the last EC, but i don't think they can reach higher then the quarter finals. They would need a lot of :lucky: to do so...


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## Genjuro (Jul 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>J-Will2</b>!
> 
> 
> Spain could compete with Turkey or even beat them, my opinion is that Spain plays one of the best defenses in europe and have a good offense. But Germany... Germany has one of the 10 best players in the world in Nowitzky, a solid forward in Okulaja and a large man in Femerling. But that is all. The other players in the German NT couldn't be starters in a solid Euroleague team (which Alba isn't, unfortunately). I do like their game, but I think that it's not that hard to stop them; you really just have to stop Dirk from scoring more than 28, 30 points... I give them credits for an incredible accomplishment in the last EC, but i don't think they can reach higher then the quarter finals. They would need a lot of :lucky: to do so...


That's the theory, but don't forget that Germany finished third in the Worlds. I mean, it wasn't just one lucky championship (2001 EC).

Being said that, it is clear than many European national teams have a lot more talent than the Germans. Turkey, Lithuania, Croatia, Russia, France... But will they step up, play hard as a team to succeed?. It is always safer to bet on a team with one truly superstar and a core of role players than on a team full of talented-but-not-near-so-good players. The superstar always plays at the highest level (that's why he is a superstar), and his teammates feel oblied to play for the team as hard as possible.


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## bender (Jul 15, 2002)

You all have Germany way too low, and I don't say that only because I'm German. I mean, Matiz had us as #8, what is pretty ridiculous. We have arguably the best player in Europe, the tournament MVP in spe, who won us a Bronze medal at the Worlds. Germany will reach the Semi-Finals *at least*, and it isn't hard to predict that they'll beat teams like Greece, Slovenia and France on their way (who in these teams should hinder Dirk to score 30+?).

You're right, J-Will2, Germany mainly relies on Dirk. The "supporting cast" with Okulaja, Femerling, Pesic and Demirel (and don't sleep on Nikagbatse) isn't that good. But it worked at the Europeans '01 as well as at the Worlds '02. Why shouldn't this One-Man-Show win it all?

My top4 of the European Championships:
1. Serbia-Montenegro
2. Germany
3. Turkey
4. Spain


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## AleksandarN (Jul 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>bender</b>!
> 
> . Why shouldn't this One-Man-Show win it all?


No because; that would mean you have go through Serbia and Montenegro who could match your star plus more.


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## bender (Jul 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>AleksandarN</b>!
> No because; that would mean you have go through Serbia and Montenegro who could match your star plus more.


Well, S-M did stop Germany many times before, but now they don't have Pavlovic, Milojevic and Bodiroga, what makes the chances for both teams to win almost equal.


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## AleksandarN (Jul 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>bender</b>!
> 
> Well, S-M did stop Germany many times before, but now they don't have Pavlovic, Milojevic and Bodiroga, what makes the chances for both teams to win almost equal.


Pedja and Dirk are a wash when it comes to European games head to head then you will see

Marko Jaric, Milos Vujanic, Vule Avdalovic, Igor Rakocevic, Milan Gurovic, Dusan Kecman, Dusan Vukcevic, Nebojsa Bogavac, Predrag Drobnjak, Dejan Koturovic, Ognjen Askrabic and Nenad Krstic is way better then the rest of the German team. That is even without Divac, Bodiroga, Rodmanovic,Darko Milicic, Pavlovic, Scepanovic, Tomasevic, Zarko Cabarkapa and Rebraca playing. Heck even the players not even joining team would beat Germans.


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## safari (May 19, 2003)

Jerome Moiso will stop Dirk  
I'm sure he will  If he doesn't, then France has A LOT of good defenders ( Dioumassi, Abdul Wahad, Diaw ... ) who can try to stop him, but they're all a bit short.
Still, I'm convinced that Germany isn't going to win a medal, it would be nice for them to finish 5ft.
Since I'm French, I have to go with French national team for the win, and i know they have the talent to win it all. It will all depend on Moiso and Turiaf, on how well they play ( in an exebition game against sweden, Moiso had 10 pts and 7 boards and Turiaf had 14 and 3, not too bad ).
Whoever wins the EC, what is sure is that the show will be great and i can't wait to watch the games :grinning:


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## Matiz (Jun 5, 2003)

Actually before the last EC Milic stopped Dirk: Dirk scored 4 points when Milic was in the game- but that is not the point, Nowitzki is way better right now than any euro BBall player and that game didn't mean anything.
For guys like Nowitzki, coaches in Europe developed tactics like zone defense 4+1 (guarding Dirk) that can be quite effective unless you have a very good supporting team in other players...


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## J-Will2 (Aug 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Matiz</b>!
> Actually before the last EC Milic stopped Dirk...


That's just what I was about to write. A big :clap: for you, Matiz. Dirk can be stopped. If one player can't stop him, you put a double team on him. He doesn't have many players to pass to... And Bender, they did do very well the last couple of times but I'm sorry, there are just too many teams better or at least as good as Germany this year. And you have to understand that Germany came out of nowhere, they were the biggest surprise of the last EC and WC. This year... The Bulls-eye is on their back also. Everyone's gonna play their best against them. In my opinion, 5th place would be an incredible achievement for them. 

And don't get me wrong, I don't hate German ball. I like it. And the S'Oliver BBL too. I'm just being realistic... By my standards, of course. :angel:


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Germany is a top 3 favorite.

You have teams like Turkey ranked ahead of us who we beat twice easily recently.
Greece- They have trouble winning against Germany WITHOUT Nowitzki.
Croatia another team that isn't better than Germany WITHOUT Nowitzki.

Serbia-Montenegro will miss many players including all rookies, bodiroga, divac and more.


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## qwertyu (Dec 29, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Germany is a top 3 favorite.
> 
> You have teams like Turkey ranked ahead of us who we beat twice easily recently.
> ...


When did Greece play Germany without Nowitzki?

In the last Eurobasket Greece and Germany were playing to get a spot in the quarterfinals and was Greece started the game with a 21-0 or something like that. We would have won you then easily no matter how good Nowitzki played but Paploukas our lone point guard played 40 minutes in that game and got tired. The team therefore lost it's rythm but we still had a chance to win you at the end of the game if Papaloukas didn't have 0/4 free throws.

I do think some people like bender are over-rating Germany and under-rating Greece and other teams but the games will start soon and we'll see what happens then.


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## J-Will2 (Aug 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Germany is a top 3 favorite.
> 
> You have teams like Turkey ranked ahead of us who we beat twice easily recently.
> ...


 Do your homework, BigAmare. I think that even bender would agree that Greece and Croatia are much better than Germany WITHOUT Dirk.


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## ltsook (Jun 8, 2003)

1. Nowitzki can score 50 but if noone else scores Germany will lose.
2. Nowitzki will have at least one bad game in the tournament and that could easily be the big one.
3. Nowitzki can certainly be stopped by a good defensive combination. Teams are not afraid of superstars anymore.
4. In a difficult tournament such as this one a team needs depth to survive and that's just what Germany lacks.


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