# Looks like someone may get some more playing time soon



## Fordy74 (May 22, 2002)

Lenny Wilkens on Sweetney:

"Our young rookie boy, he just goes after the ball," Wilkens
said. "Sweetney had a terrific game for us. He had 10
rebounds, and he's relentless. He just keeps going after it.
He understands about positioning and that's huge."


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

I am happy for Sweetney because he is a nice guy and he works really hard, but if he wants to reach his potential he has got to get in the weight room and transform his physique. There is no reason why (if in shape) he couldn't get a close to a double double or 8 points and 8 rebounds a game coming off the bench.

I want to see you working hard this off-season Michael. :yes:


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## Perennial All Star (Aug 13, 2003)

Finally Sweetney over Harrington. There is a god.


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## Fordy74 (May 22, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> I am happy for Sweetney because he is a nice guy and he works really hard, but if he wants to reach his potential he has got to get in the weight room and transform his physique. There is no reason why (if in shape) he couldn't get a close to a double double or 8 points and 8 rebounds a game coming off the bench.
> 
> I want to see you working hard this off-season Michael. :yes:


If he does work and improve his body than the sky is the limit. He had 7 offensive rbounds in 23 minutes of PT yesterday.


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## Rashidi (Oct 2, 2003)

Not a chance. Look who drafted him.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

thats all he has to do is get in NBA shape...He has great hands,soft touch and good knowledge of the game...

He is one of the few guys i have seen who actually beat ben wallace to rebounds....

His body is MUCH better than when he came into the league.....He had no upper body strength in pre draft workouts and his vertical sucked because of his weight....

The guy has enormous upside.....Its up to him....


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## Perennial All Star (Aug 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Rashidi</b>!
> Not a chance. Look who drafted him.


Yes look who drafted him and had him rotting on the IL.


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## Knicks Junkie (Aug 21, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>NYKFan123</b>!
> Finally Sweetney over Harrington. There is a god.


Earlier in the season, I seriously doubt Sweets would have performed even half as well as Harrington. If you remember, Sweets used to be a liability. Harrington was playing well, and deserved the majority of the backup minutes.


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## NYKBaller (Oct 29, 2003)

I do like that he lost 17 pounds since the start of the season....


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## dcrono3 (Jan 6, 2004)

I had this question before, why did Sweetney suck so badly at the begining of the season. From all the scouting reports I read about him before the draft, he was said to have a strong work ethic. However, during the begining of the season, ppl were bashing Sweetney about his "laziness." Was it just his unwillingness to work out before? Well, Sweetney is finally starting to play like he did during college, good thing.


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## The True Essence (May 26, 2003)

Mike has developed as a player, no way he could have done this well earlier in the season. He got a chance to get big minutes since Othella missed a couple of games with his grandparents dying


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## Knicksbiggestfan (Apr 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>dcrono3</b>!
> I had this question before, why did Sweetney suck so badly at the begining of the season. From all the scouting reports I read about him before the draft, he was said to have a strong work ethic. However, during the begining of the season, ppl were bashing Sweetney about his "laziness." Was it just his unwillingness to work out before? Well, Sweetney is finally starting to play like he did during college, good thing.



Both truth and sort of lead the bashing on him. He was reported to have good work ethic but failed his pre draft workouts miserably. Something like he couldn't bench 185 3 times or something like that which ... hell I can do... a 6'8 NBA power forward should be able to do.


Also the fact that he did so horrid in workouts just seemed to make the statement that he wasn't making the most of his oppurtunity to play in the league, couple that with the fact that he was undersized power forward number..... 12... I think and he got no respect whatsoever.



His play in the summer league was pretty crap too.


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

Sweetney is an interesting player. If he can add more muscle to his big frame he could very well be better than Malone. He has softer hands...is quicker..has more post moves(KM is more of a scorer on the break and spot ups)..and he REALLY goes after the ball hard.If he maintains that energy he could average 12-14 boards a game. A little short but has long arms to make up for it ala Brand. Defense seems to be his weakness so far..but he will get better.


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## Rashidi (Oct 2, 2003)

KARL Malone?

Malone has range on his jumper, and is a great passer for a PF. There's a reason Sweetney drew more comparisons to Elton Brand.


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## dcrono3 (Jan 6, 2004)

Being compared to Elton Brand isn't a bad thing. I love the type of player Brand is, and will be very happy is Sweetney turn out to be like Brand.


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

Sorry...duplicate post.


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

I'll concede the passing because Sweetney never had to pass much so I don't know about him but I do know that he has range on his jumper. I have watched him for 3 years and he can hit from 17 or 18 no problem. I don't think Malones range is any greater on a consistent level. I am not comparing him to Karl just yet...I said he needs to get more strength and upper body development. I think he will be a better ebounder(especially offensively) than Brand and he is quicker. He is really a combination of the two players..I'll take him. I also prefer to rely on my own instincts when I have seen the players enough times. Even though the NBA scouts are pros, they screw up more than I do. Every year you hear about guys compared to someone else that after youo watch them, you think, where the hell did they get that?


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## Rashidi (Oct 2, 2003)

> Being compared to Elton Brand isn't a bad thing. I love the type of player Brand is, and will be very happy is Sweetney turn out to be like Brand.


Nobody said it was a bad thing. They are two different players though. It's like saying John Starks is the same type of player as Reggie Miller.

However, I think it's a little far fetched to be saying a backup PF looks similar to a top 3 PF in NBA History (if not the best).



> I'll concede the passing because Sweetney never had to pass much so I don't know about him but I do know that he has range on his jumper. I have watched him for 3 years and he can hit from 17 or 18 no problem.


Sweetney might have had range in college, but he hasn't used a bit of it in the NBA. LOTS of PFs have 17-18 foot range. Kurt Thomas, Horace Grant, A.C. Green, Chris Webber, Kevin Garnett, Tim Duncan, Christian Laettner, Tom Gugliotta, etc. Even Elton Brand has close to that range, which he exhibited against Kurt Thomas. Clearly it takes more than a jumpshot to be similar to Karl Malone.



> I don't think Malones range is any greater on a consistent level.


Malone's range extends to 3pt range. He is 85-309 (.275) over his career, and 16-52 in the previous 4 seasons. And he is the very definition of consistency. If you consider "consistency" to be 50%, Malone certainly shoots a lot better than that from 17.



> I am not comparing him to Karl just yet...I said he needs to get more strength and upper body development.


A bit? Have you seen Malone? He is a freak of nature.



> I think he will be a better ebounder(especially offensively) than Brand and he is quicker.


That's a pretty bold statement, considering Brand is leading the league in offensive rebounding. If Sweetney is any better, his name must be Dennis Rodman. Scratch that, Brand is now in 2nd in the offensive rebounding race. His 4.3 offensive rebounds per game are trailing Erick Dampier's 4.6.



> Even though the NBA scouts are pros, they screw up more than I do. Every year you hear about guys compared to someone else that after youo watch them, you think, where the hell did they get that?


Care to name someone?

And no, Stackhouse/Kobe/McGrady/Carter/Hill/Miner Jordan comparisons do not count.


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## Knicksbiggestfan (Apr 29, 2003)

Elton Brand is a Top 5 powerforward in this league, he is a good defender, has amazing ball fakes, he just does it all, on top of that the guy works hard no matter what.

Karl Malone is a freak of nature. Like Amare Could be if Amare hits the weights. I mean when he showed up in the league he was just to big, to strong to quick for nearly everyone, the jump shot came way later.




Sweetney has a way to go before he even warrants a comparision between those two. Right now he is in mind closer to a PJ brown type of player than any of those others.


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## Perennial All Star (Aug 13, 2003)

Rashidi, we are comparing Michael Sweetney to Elton Brand, not Chris Dudley to Shaquille O'Neal. The whole purpose of comparison is to have a mindset of what kind of player this kid can be when he reaches his full potential, and ofcourse that hasn't happened yet and wont till next year. He has just now received quality playing time and is finally showing why he was the 9th pick in the draft. Let's wait and see before we waive off any comparions of Sweets to Brand.


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

Number one...you are full of crap on Malones range. So he is slightly better than one outta four from three..big deal. And I bet I have seen him play much more than you having had the benefit of a room-mates hopped up Sat tv. He is a good shooter inside of 17-18 and doesn't push the range. He is also great on the break..who is going to get in his way? But he is NOT a very good low post guy and Stockton should get credit for half his points. Because MS has not yet shown he can hit the mid range jumper doesn't mean he can't..I have seen it. And by the way..an 18 foot college jumper is the same as an 18 foot NBA jumper. Also Malone is no freak of nature...he is a freak of weight lifting. And to KBF...Malone was not nearly this size when he came into the league and his quickness is/was not his strength. And I do believe Sweetney has the right attitude to surpass Brand as a rebounder. Very few guys really GO AFTER boards...Sweetney does..like B Wallace and, yes, Rodman. I am not saying he is on their level, only that he has the intangibles and the physical ability.


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## Knicksbiggestfan (Apr 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>alphadog</b>!
> Number one...you are full of crap on Malones range. So he is slightly better than one outta four from three..big deal. And I bet I have seen him play much more than you having had the benefit of a room-mates hopped up Sat tv. He is a good shooter inside of 17-18 and doesn't push the range. He is also great on the break..who is going to get in his way? But he is NOT a very good low post guy and Stockton should get credit for half his points. Because MS has not yet shown he can hit the mid range jumper doesn't mean he can't..I have seen it. And by the way..an 18 foot college jumper is the same as an 18 foot NBA jumper. Also Malone is no freak of nature...he is a freak of weight lifting. And to KBF...Malone was not nearly this size when he came into the league and his quickness is/was not his strength. And I do believe Sweetney has the right attitude to surpass Brand as a rebounder. Very few guys really GO AFTER boards...Sweetney does..like B Wallace and, yes, Rodman. I am not saying he is on their level, only that he has the intangibles and the physical ability.


Paragraphs please.


Malone wasn't nearly the size but his combination of strength size and quickness where very unique. Then he got bigger faster and played with a pointguard who is one of the best of all time.


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## Rashidi (Oct 2, 2003)

> He has just now received quality playing time and is finally showing why he was the 9th pick in the draft. Let's wait and see before we waive off any comparions of Sweets to Brand.


Huh? I am the one comparing Sweetney to Brand...



> Number one...you are full of crap on Malones range. So he is slightly better than one outta four from three..big deal.


And what do you think Sweetney would be?



> is a good shooter inside of 17-18 and doesn't push the range.


Likewise for Malone. He only takes shots 20 feet and back when the shot clock is running down, or the opposition leaves him wide, wide open.



> But he is NOT a very good low post guy and Stockton should get credit for half his points.


That's a load of crap, are you saying that the only PG capable of running a Pick and Roll is John Stockton? What's embarrassing about this statement is that the year John Stockton missed 18 games, and was replaced by the villified HOWARD EISLEY, It sure didn't stop the Jazz from going 62-20 that year. Malone averaged 0.4 fewer points than in his previous season (which was an MVP season btw). Is that the so-called John Stockton effect?

I suppose you're a believer in the lame arguement that half of Kenyon Martin and Richard Jefferson's points are solely because of Jason Kidd, and nothing to do with the athleticism of those players. Nothing at all. 

For all the hoopla made over KT's pick and roll with Marbury, it is no more effective than it was with Howard Eisley running things.

And not a good low post guy? When did you start watching the guy?


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

I am not going to get drawn into one of your prolonged conflicts but I have been watching malone since his days at L. Tech. Howard Eisley was playing the best ball of his career at this time. There is no comparison between what he is and what he was. That is why he got the contracts. One more thing...I never said Sweetney could shoot from three....your statement about Malones 20 something % from there is completely irrelevent. Next topic, please.


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## knicksfan (Jan 4, 2003)

before the marbury trade i would have rather taken wade or ford, or even bosh if that was at all possible. I STILL would have rather traded up for bosh, but hey i guess layden cudnt pass up the georgetown connection


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## dcrono3 (Jan 6, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>knicksfan</b>!
> before the marbury trade i would have rather taken wade or ford, or even bosh if that was at all possible. I STILL would have rather traded up for bosh, but hey i guess layden cudnt pass up the georgetown connection


I would have liked to trade up too. However, I wonder how you think the Knicks could have traded up. When I heard that Layden offered KT for Bosh directly, I kind of doubted his trading skills. We may have not gotten Bosh, but Sweetney is no scrub either and a nice pick anyway, especially the way he has been playing recently.


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## H2O (Jul 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>knicksfan</b>!
> before the marbury trade i would have rather taken wade or ford, or even bosh if that was at all possible. I STILL would have rather traded up for bosh, but hey i guess layden cudnt pass up the georgetown connection


Yeah, and that kid Lebron and the other one Carmello. OR how about Kirk Hinrich? Or basically anyone picked before we got to the board, huh?

Kind of like saying I might have taken Yao over Frank Williams.

But anyways, I think Mike Sweetney has the potential to be a special player. He is good at putting the ball in the basket, and can finish on the fast break if Shandon Anderson and Penny stop feeding him the ball 18' away instead of 7' on the break, where he has to dribble and just looks stupid like any other big. 

His rebounding on the offense is excellent, his defense has been OK, he tries at least. His defensive rebounding seems a bit weaker than it should be. And as far as his J, he has taken and knocked down a few since he has gotten some confidence and time, but I think if he came out and started jacking up jumpers, Lenny would have his head. I like that he looks to take it to the basket primarily.

Ultimately I'd say he is a more versatile player than we have yet seen, and will probably be starting here or elsewhere within 2 years.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

Alfa,your assessment of Sweetney is right on..Once his body is NBA legit he will be a player..he has an uncanny knack of getting and grabbing the ball...

As for karl malone comparisons,you arent that far off.....Karl came into the league without the body he has today,and the same knocks against sweetney were directed at Karl,which is why he was picked 13th...He is anything but a freak of nature..The guy is a conditioning and strength training freak,much like Holyfield is and walter payton was...

Two last things,Dont listen to the "stuff" about Karl Malone and his 3 point shooting...Karl malone did not make ONE 3 point shot in his first 3 years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Not ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And regarding Eisly vs stockton....The year Stockton missed the first 18 games the Jazz went 11-7 for a .611 winning percentage..When Eisly went back to the bench,the Jazz went 51-13 a .7969 winning percentage..You do the math


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> Both truth and sort of lead the bashing on him. He was reported to have good work ethic but failed his pre draft workouts miserably. Something like he couldn't bench 185 3 times or something like that which ... hell I can do... a 6'8 NBA power forward should be able to do.


KBF,I was definetly his main basher....The guy came into the league 20 pounds overweight with no upper body strength...You can get away with that in college,but NOT in the N.o B.oys A.lllowed

To his credit,and you can see it,he has dropped 17 pounds..The guy has an incredible nack for getting to the ball and is a BEAST..He has soft hands and I do not think it is that much of a stretch to compare him to an Elton Brand,as opposed to that waste of flesh Robert Traylor......

I love to see guys who bust their butt and make the most of their god given ability


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## Rashidi (Oct 2, 2003)

> Two last things,Dont listen to the "stuff" about Karl Malone and his 3 point shooting...Karl malone did not make ONE 3 point shot in his first 3 years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Not ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


And? Call me when Sweetney hits an 18 footer in a game. All his points so far have been from inside. Most 3pt attempts by big men are full court heaves at the end of quarters, so I don't see how one can complain about Malone being "0-2", 0-7", and "0-5" in his first 3 years. He hardly took any threes. Yao Ming has 3pt range, but he was only 1-2 last year. This year he's 0-1. What a crappy shooter he must be. Perhaps there is a reason he only has 3 attempts in 2 years.


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## Knicks Junkie (Aug 21, 2003)

I don't know about you, but right now, I don't care about his ability to hit the 18 foot jumper. We already have Kurt Thomas.

However, I do care about his inside game because we are somewhat weak in that department. And so far, I like what I see. He is really holding his own down in the block.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

Rashidi,I thought you loved Sweetney???Where is the LOVE???All i am saying is you cant compare Malones 3 point shooting today with Sweetneys rookie year....Karl,just like Sweetney didnt make one,and certainly didnt shoot many for his first three years...So,we have to wait for year 4 to compare...Then its an apple to apple comparison....

Secondly,I think he is way more Brand than malone..Lets be thankful hes not the second coming of tractor traylor....

I have been converted..I LOVE the guy...


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## Rashidi (Oct 2, 2003)

> Rashidi,I thought you loved Sweetney???


You think I love all of Layden's players.

I like Sweetney, but I'll buy the Karl Malone comparison when he hits two consecutive jump shots. Malone also has excellent hands and defense. Karl Malone is the Jordan of PFs. Sweetney isn't even starting. Sweetney might have similarities, but right now it's Harold Miner - Michael Jordan similarities. Yes, Miner could score. And he could dunk. But that's all he could do. And Jordan did a lot more than just score. Sweetney can rebound. And he can score in the post like Malone. But that's where it ends. Offensive rebounds are more a Brand thing than a Malone thing fyi.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

i dont know who brought up malone.....my post said Sweetney is much more "brandlike"....malones is a much different type of athlete..Sweets will have to run mountains in the off season and lift like a maniac if he wants to achieve malone like status..Most guys dont have the abilty malone has..and almost no one is willing to work like him..

have you ever read about jerry rices off season workouts??e


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

I brought up Malone but I never said Sweetney was as good as Malone in his prime, only that he had many similiar qualities. He is actually bigger(even with the lost weight), just as fast or faster down the court, as good or better hands(he has among the best I have ever seen), he is as good or better than Malone at rebounding, and he has a nice touch inside of 20. To say he needs to hit a couple in a row before you think so only confirms that you don't know squat about Sweets. I watched him many games in the BE and the guy is a very solid shooter who just doesn't take unneccessary j's. That is what this team needs. He is not in as good condition as Malone was nor is he as good a defender or as intimidating. If he had been getting starters minutes all year he would be a solid double/double guy as a rookie. He may never be the scorer that KM is/was but he will never get the offense wrapped aroound him either. BTW, I also watched Malone in college. He was a nice player but not as dominating offensively as MS. I was not a fan of the Sweetney pick at #9 because I thought he would have trouble inside against the taller guys but that, and defense on the NBA PFs were the only parts of his game that I doubted. Brand is similiar in size and low post skills but is a better shot blocker and defender. Sweetney is a more active rebounder and faster in the open court. Lastly, Sweetney is an under-rated passer. He was doubled constantly and found the open man consistently. For those of you that doubt his offensive skills, try to get a tape of him against 'Melo's SU team last year in the dome....he lit them up for 35 or something.


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## H2O (Jul 10, 2002)

Sweets has hit 2 18 footers I can remember, one against Houston, and the other was I believe in our recent loss to Boston.


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