# Przybilla sheds some pounds



## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

Seven-foot former Gopher Joel Przybilla of the Portland Trail Blazers is down to 237 pounds from 250 after taking up boxing in the offseason to improve his footwork and balance. Przybilla, who has been sparring at a Milwaukee gym and leaves Tuesday for Portland, has three uncles who were Golden Gloves boxers.

http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/sports/columnists/charley_walters/12674900.htm


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

spongyfungy said:


> Seven-foot former Gopher Joel Przybilla of the Portland Trail Blazers is down to 237 pounds from 250 after taking up boxing in the offseason to improve his footwork and balance. Przybilla, who has been sparring at a Milwaukee gym and leaves Tuesday for Portland, has three uncles who were Golden Gloves boxers.
> 
> http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/sports/columnists/charley_walters/12674900.htm


Good to see him getting in great shape and I know he says he plays better at lighter weights, but 237 seems like it might be a little bit too light. Will he still have the bulk needed to not get pushed around in the lane?


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## Trader Ed (Jun 17, 2002)

Well hopefully he added strength to his muscles. 237 is still a good weight for a 7 footer

He was looking for quikness, so hopefully that has been achieved. We shall see

Its nice to see a player wanting to cross train to develop skills to complement his basketball talents.


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## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

after watching all of the hardwood classics games last night it got me to wondering about Walton's hight and weight because i realised i had never really taken into concideration such an important stat. as that for one of the most dominant centers to have played the game. after looking it up i was kind of amazed:*Bill Walton Height: 6-11; Weight: 235 lbs. * 
now that is pretty small concidering most centers are usually more than 260something. after watching the games yesterday on NBATV i realised it was necissary for his weight to be down because of the fast paced game the 77 Blazers played, he needed his weight down for maximum mobility. even though i can't stand Walton on the air i got a new found respect for the man after watching him play from roughly 9am - 1am. any way i just never realised how small or how light walton was, so it gave me hope for Joels game...


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## deanwoof (Mar 10, 2003)

^that's also twenty years ago. people in general were a lot smaller, in terms of muscle as well as fat. but i'm happy that joel is slimming down.


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## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

deanwoof said:


> ^that's also twenty years ago. people in general were a lot smaller, in terms of muscle as well as fat. but i'm happy that joel is slimming down.


yeah i sort of lost track of what my point was and decided to wrap it up before i made my self sound like any more of an ***.
"remember kids don't do drugs! they play hell on... ummm... what was i going to say again?"


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## NateBishop3 (Jul 22, 2003)

Boxing? Seriously? Who would want to spar with someone who is that tall? His reach would be insane. I would love to see Joel fight. That would be awesome.


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## crandc (Sep 15, 2004)

Boxing?
I'm waiting for someone to say white men can't box. :angel:


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## Redbeard (Sep 11, 2005)

Maybe he got tired of him and Zach getting harassed at the stip clubs. JK

That is great that he is expanding on what worked for him last year. He should be able to get up higher and quicker for more blocks and rebounds. The only downside is that he already had trouble catching Telfair's passes and I hope he didn't hurt his hands at all. Glad to hear the news. This is the first center in recent years that has actually made news about trainging in the offseason.


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

crandc said:


> Boxing?
> I'm waiting for someone to say white men can't box. :angel:


Easy there crandc....No need to let things trail from one thread to another.


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## tlong (Jan 6, 2003)

237 is too light in my opinion. I would like to see him add about 15 lbs of muscle.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

tlong said:


> 237 is too light in my opinion. I would like to see him add about 15 lbs of muscle.


hm..who knows his body better..you..or joel..you..or joel and the trainers on the team..

hm..I wonder..


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## crandc (Sep 15, 2004)

Don't worry, Schilly, I was obviously (I thought) joking!


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## BBert (Dec 30, 2004)

I think he's gearing up to run some pick and rolls with Telfair. Could be sweet. 

Also, his increased quickness and agility will help with his help defense and shot blocking while our young perimeter players improve their defense at the NBA level.

I don't like the idea of a center who gets pushed around by heavier centers either, but I'm not so sure it will be an issue. First of all, he has concluded he plays better with less weight. Second, he's probably increased his overall strength. And third, how many big bruiser centers (or forwards) does he have to worry about, really? 

I'm looking forward to a Blazers team that can really get out and run the floor, spread the floor, and attack before the other team can set up. If our center can keep up on both ends of the floor, that's a bonus.

I just remembered how sweet his outlet passes were last year. Beauty.

:banana:


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## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

Blazer Bert said:


> Also, his increased quickness and agility will help with his help defense and shot blocking while our young perimeter players improve their defense at the NBA level.


ahhh yes, this... 



Blazer Bert said:


> I'm looking forward to a Blazers team that can really get out and run the floor, spread the floor, and attack before the other team can set up. If our center can keep up on both ends of the floor, that's a bonus.


and this, are what i was trying to say with my run-on sentance regarding waltons play in 77. thanks Blazer Bert!


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## MercyKersey (Jul 22, 2003)

Less weight more dunks. I think with the style he plays its going to help out with his quickness and
jumping ability. Not to mention all the altercations he gets in down low. Am i the only one who noticed
joel getting in the faces of other players more often then any other blazer?


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## tlong (Jan 6, 2003)

Hap said:


> hm..who knows his body better..you..or joel..you..or joel and the trainers on the team..
> 
> hm..I wonder..



Have you made a conclusion yet?


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## BBert (Dec 30, 2004)

MercyKersey said:


> Less weight more dunks. I think with the style he plays its going to help out with his quickness and
> jumping ability. Not to mention all the altercations he gets in down low. Am i the only one who noticed
> joel getting in the faces of other players more often then any other blazer?


Oh, yes. He is definitely the quiet enforcer. No phony loud blustering. He takes no crap and doesn't hesitate to deliver an inconspicuous shot when needed. Luke may be able to impart a few new techniques in that area as well. (Add Laimbeer to the coaching staff and he might be dangerous. :biggrin: )


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

Hap said:


> hm..who knows his body better..you..or joel..you..or joel and the trainers on the team..
> 
> hm..I wonder..


I would hope Joel's wife, but I digress.....playing at a lighter weight should help his game for shot blocking and getting up and down the court!


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

will help his ballance and adjusting on the move on both sides of the court, he was an enforcer before his boxing training but now i would not want to take a shot in the ribs from him.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Utherhimo said:


> will help his ballance and adjusting on the move on both sides of the court, he was an enforcer before his boxing training but now i would not want to take a shot in the ribs from him.


and when he was heavier is when he was more prone to injuries. Every body has a 'limit' to what it can do. So, while added weight might benefit him for the 2-3 players a year he plays that out-weight him by tons, it'd probably be detrimental to his body if he weighed more than he should.


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## Iwatas (Aug 3, 2003)

I am just psyched to get the season underway and see what we have.

I have painful memories of all those "Kemp had a wonderful off-season, and he has really returned to form" summers. I *want* it all to be true, but the rational side of me knows that there is a lot of cheezewhiz flying around. At least in the Kemp years, I could be sure that most of the flying cheesewhiz found its way down his throat. 

:biggrin: 


iWatas


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## tlong (Jan 6, 2003)

Let's take a look at the playing weight for every team's starting center, shall we?

Atlanta - Collier - 260 lbs
Boston - Blount - 250 lbs (Al Jefferson weighs 265 lbs btw)
Charlotte - Okafor - 252 lbs
Chicago - Curry? - 285 lbs
Cleveland - Ilgauskas - 265 lbs
Dallas - Dampier - 265 lbs
Denver - Camby - 225 lbs
Detroit - Wallace - 240 lbs
Golden State - Foyle - 270 lbs
Houston - Yao - 310 lbs
Indiana - Foster - 242 lbs
Clippers - Kaman - 265 lbs
Lakers - Divac - 260 lbs
Memphis - Tsakalidis - 290 lbs
Miami - Shaq - 500 lbs
Milwaukee - Bogut - 245 lbs
Minnesota - Olowokandi - 270 lbs
New Jersey - Jackson - 253 lbs
New Orleans - Magloire - 259 lbs
New York - James - 280 lbs
Orlando - Cato - 265 lbs
Philly - Dalembert - 250 lbs
Phoenix - Stoudemire - 250 lbs
Sacramento - Miller - 261 lbs
San Antonio - Nesterovic - 255 lbs
Seattle - Potapenko - 285 lbs
Toronto - Araujo - 280 lbs
Utah - Okur - 249 lbs
Washington - Haywood - 266 lbs


There is only one starting center in the NBA that is lighter than Pzyrbilla. I think 237 lbs is too light for a 7 foot starting center in the NBA. I fear he will break down at that weight.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

tlong said:


> Let's take a look at the playing weight for every team's starting center, shall we?


yes, let's.



> Atlanta - Collier - 260 lbs
> Boston - Blount - 250 lbs (Al Jefferson weighs 265 lbs btw)
> Charlotte - Okafor - 252 lbs


let's see..not much of a threat, not much of a threat, and a somewhat threat.

so that's 4 games of not much of a threat and 2 games of a somewhat threat.



> Chicago - Curry? - 285 lbs
> Cleveland - Ilgauskas - 265 lbs
> Dallas - Dampier - 265 lbs


unknown due to health, but a lot of currys problem IS his excess weight (and heart of course).
Goosgoos is 2 games a year.

Damp is a foul prone goon.



> Denver - Camby - 225 lbs
> Detroit - Wallace - 240 lbs
> Golden State - Foyle - 270 lbs


Camby isn't much of a problem (weight wise).

Wallace would be hard no matter how much our C weighs.

Foyle? yah, that's scarey.


> Houston - Yao - 310 lbs
> Indiana - Foster - 242 lbs
> Clippers - Kaman - 265 lbs


so, Yao and 2 yawners.



> Lakers - Divac - 260 lbs
> Memphis - Tsakalidis - 290 lbs
> Miami - Shaq - 500 lbs


Divac is retired, so you mean Mimhmmimuihm. he's heavier, but big deal.
Crap-a-lotus isn't worth worrying about.
Shaq..well, doesn't matter about Joel's weight there.



> Milwaukee - Bogut - 245 lbs
> Minnesota - Olowokandi - 270 lbs
> New Jersey - Jackson - 253 lbs


Bogus is an unknow.
Kandi is an absolute waste.
Jackson. softie.



> New Orleans - Magloire - 259 lbs
> New York - James - 280 lbs
> Orlando - Cato - 265 lbs


Maggie can be an issue. James isn't. Cato? BFD.



> Philly - Dalembert - 250 lbs
> Phoenix - Stoudemire - 250 lbs
> Sacramento - Miller - 261 lbs


Dalembert is kind of a toss up.
Stoudemire is a problem regardless.
Miller is a toss up/problem.


> San Antonio - Nesterovic - 255 lbs
> Seattle - Potapenko - 285 lbs
> Toronto - Araujo - 280 lbs


Rasho = who giveso.
Potacrapo= not a problem.

Not sure about Araujo


> Utah - Okur - 249 lbs
> Washington - Haywood - 266 lbs


Okur wouldnt' be a terrible problem, nor would Brenda.

he's basically out-weighed massively by 2 post players, shaq and yao. And even if he's back to his playing weight last year, he'd still be out-weighed by those guys. So if he's now faster, more vertical and faster horizontal because of the weight loss, I'll take that.


> There is only one starting center in the NBA that is lighter than Pzyrbilla. I think 237 lbs is too light for a 7 foot starting center in the NBA. I fear he will break down at that weight.


and he, knowing his body a whole **** load better than you do, fears he'd break down if he was heavier.

so again, who would I believe..him and the team, or you?

your track-record speaks for itself. Joel in a landslide.


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## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

tlong said:


> Let's take a look at the playing weight for every team's starting center, shall we?
> 
> Atlanta - Collier - 260 lbs
> Boston - Blount - 250 lbs (Al Jefferson weighs 265 lbs btw)
> ...


why because he's Joel Przybilla? Ben Wallace one of the most feared centers in the NBA only has 3 pounds on him right now. i really don't think it's that big of a problem. speed and foot work seem to be a big part of positioning under the basket as well as jumping ability.


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

plus if we ned a heavy center we will put in HA who is 7'4 335!


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## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

Utherhimo said:


> plus if we ned a heavy center we will put in HA who is 7'4 335!


is this an updated stat. ? NBA.com has him 7'3" and 305.


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

DrewFix said:


> why because he's Joel Przybilla? Ben Wallace one of the most feared centers in the NBA only has 3 pounds on him right now. i really don't think it's that big of a problem. speed and foot work seem to be a big part of positioning under the basket as well as jumping ability.



Well...Ben Wallace is 6'8 1/2" too, so he's much thicker than Joel.

I definitely see tlong's point.

So, people who say that a lighter Joel means he'll be quicker, faster, more agile and a better jumper. Let's take it to that extreme. What if he was 7' and weighed 155 lbs? Would that be good? Hell no, somebody'd break him in half. Just the same, if he were 7' and weighed 498 lbs, he'd be too heavy and injury prone. Somewhere in between is a happy medium. I'm with tlong when he says that 237 might be a bit too light. I'd love to see Joel at maybe 245-250 with some added muscle.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Fork said:


> Well...Ben Wallace is 6'8 1/2" too, so he's much thicker than Joel.
> 
> I definitely see tlong's point.
> 
> So, people who say that a lighter Joel means he'll be quicker, faster, more agile and a better jumper. Let's take it to that extreme. What if he was 7' and weighed 155 lbs? Would that be good? Hell no, somebody'd break him in half. Just the same, if he were 7' and weighed 498 lbs, he'd be too heavy and injury prone. Somewhere in between is a happy medium. I'm with tlong when he says that 237 might be a bit too light. I'd love to see Joel at maybe 245-250 with some added muscle.


so..if he was 8 pounds more, you'd be happy.

Supposidely Joel is stronger than he was last year, and therefore, in better shape.


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## mgb (Jun 26, 2004)

tlong said:


> There is only one starting center in the NBA that is lighter than Pzyrbilla. I think 237 lbs is too light for a 7 foot starting center in the NBA. I fear he will break down at that weight.


The reason Joel lost weight before last year was because he kept getting injured at a heavier weight. He found out he was much more efficient at a lower weight. Of course how light he should go is another matter. I think he'll be ok though. I think technique is as important as weight to a degree.


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## mgb (Jun 26, 2004)

DrewFix said:


> after watching all of the hardwood classics games last night it got me to wondering about Walton's hight and weight because i realised i had never really taken into concideration such an important stat. as that for one of the most dominant centers to have played the game. after looking it up i was kind of amazed:*Bill Walton Height: 6-11; Weight: 235 lbs. *
> now that is pretty small considering most centers are usually more than 260something. after watching the games yesterday on NBATV i realised it was necessary for his weight to be down because of the fast paced game the 77 Blazers played, he needed his weight down for maximum mobility. even though i can't stand Walton on the air i got a new found respect for the man after watching him play from roughly 9am - 1am. any way i just never realised how small or how light walton was, so it gave me hope for Joels game...


Walton was a awesome player! I read a quote once that said injuries kept us from seeing the best center ever play the game. 

He set a record in the finals with 20 defensive rebounds and duplicated it in the next game. That's dominating. 

He also help Boston win a title. He played only 20 mins or so a game but when he did he dominated.

I do agree listening to him can get on your nerves pretty fast.


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## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

I agree, fwiw, that 237 might be too light. There aren't a ton of big, dominant centers out there nowadays, but considering Joel's lack of a perimeter offense game, I'd rather have him be bigger than lighter.

Ed O.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Ed O said:


> I agree, fwiw, that 237 might be too light. There aren't a ton of big, dominant centers out there nowadays, but considering Joel's lack of a perimeter offense game, I'd rather have him be bigger than lighter.
> 
> Ed O.


even at the expense of him being more injured and slower..and worse?


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

Hap said:


> even at the expense of him being more injured and slower..and worse?


Well, he clocked in at 255 last year and didn't get hurt. His injuries came when he was closer to 275, which is not a weight he should be playing at. As for the quickness, there's a big tradeoff. There has to be a balance between quickness and strength and it seems like 237 might be erring slightly on the quickness side of things. Besides, he's not going to be lightning quick at any weight.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Fork said:


> Well, he clocked in at 255 last year and didn't get hurt. His injuries came when he was closer to 275, which is not a weight he should be playing at. As for the quickness, there's a big tradeoff. There has to be a balance between quickness and strength and it seems like 237 might be erring slightly on the quickness side of things. Besides, he's not going to be lightning quick at any weight.


but at the beggining of the year, he wasn't nearly as fast as he was at the end. He lost weight throughout the season, and played a lot better.

Again, Joel knows his body, and how it works/feels at different weights far more than any of us want to claim we do. So for us to say HE should be heavier, is rather stupid, since he knows and the team knows infinitely more than we do.


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

+i like the lighter faster joel not the slow injured joel which the lighter he got the better joel played, karl was the one that wanted fat injured joel and you can see for Joel that is a no go!


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## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

Hap said:


> Again, Joel knows his body, and how it works/feels at different weights far more than any of us want to claim we do. So for us to say HE should be heavier, is rather stupid, since he knows and the team knows infinitely more than we do.


Did he "know his body" when he was repeatedly getting hurt earlier in his career?

It's possible that he's learned that he was too heavy when he was with the Bucks. It's also very possible--and IMO likely--that he'll find out that playing under 240 pounds is too light.

There's nothing "rather stupid" about it one way or the other.

Ed O.


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## BlazerFanFoLife (Jul 17, 2003)

wait shaqs not 500 pounds lol! LIES!


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## NateBishop3 (Jul 22, 2003)

Redbeard said:


> The only downside is that he already had trouble catching Telfair's passes and I hope he didn't hurt his hands at al.


If anything, his hands are probably quicker now because of boxing. It gives you much better reflexes. Better reaction time.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Ed O said:


> Did he "know his body" when he was repeatedly getting hurt earlier in his career?


you mean the time when he was a younger player and was following the advice of the coach (who was wrong about it)? you mean that time?

I bet he knows his body better BECAUSE of those times of being injured when he was heavier than he had ever been.



> It's possible that he's learned that he was too heavy when he was with the Bucks. It's also very possible--and IMO likely--that he'll find out that playing under 240 pounds is too light.
> 
> There's nothing "rather stupid" about it one way or the other.
> 
> Ed O.


actually ed, it is rather stupid for us to assume we know more than a guy who's hired a trainer, and worked with the blazers trainer who does it for a living. We can project all we want onto a player, but we don't actually know more than him.


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## hasoos (Jan 3, 2003)

You can be lighter and be more effective. The important things on defense are leg strength for establishing position, and quickness. The things he is doing improves both of those. It might also improve his rebounding. 

Secondly, players have to listen to their bodies. If their body is aching and hurting and telling them they have too much weight on, it is only a matter of time before they get injured by overstressing their knees or ankles. He may be lightening up so that he won't get hurt. Notice how when Shaq got really heavy that he was injured a lot. Last year he lightened up and was healthy much more of the season. 

I trust Joel to do the right thing, he is a hard worker and the type of player who listens to his coaches. He is probably tuning his body to work on the things they asked him to work on.


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## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

Hap said:


> actually ed, it is rather stupid for us to assume we know more than a guy who's hired a trainer, and worked with the blazers trainer who does it for a living. We can project all we want onto a player, but we don't actually know more than him.


You know, you're right Hap. We shouldn't ever second guess a professional trainer. Nor should we second guess players who are, after all, professional. For that matter, we should ever second guess a GM, president, or owner, as they're *paid* to think about these things all the time. Same with reporters for that matter -- they're paid find out what's going on with teams and are clearly in a position to know more about a team than its fanbase. Surely I'm leaving out someone....oh, I know, the hotdog guys -- after all, they know food!  

Sarcasm aside, the whole point of a board like this is to encourage debate and conversation among those interested. Telling someone (even Ed) that his or her ideas are stupid discourages more than encourages such exchanges. Why not simply say something like "Ya know, Ed, I think I'm gonna go with the trainer on this one" or something a little less insulting? And yes, despite expressed opinions counter to this, I'm inclined to think that Ed, too, is human.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

PorterIn2004 said:


> You know, you're right Hap. We shouldn't ever second guess a professional trainer.


on certain things I think we can "second guess" things. But when we're talking as if we know how much he should weigh, it seems kind of dumb for us to be stating it.

It's not like he's going Shawn Bradley on us here. We're talking about a guy who's getting in better shape, with better balance, and some people are complaining that he's 8 pounds under what they think he should be.

Look at Dennis Rodman (not that Joel is Dennis). he was smaller than a lot of players who played PF, but was really good. Why? He was strong.

Weight does not necessarily = strength.



> Nor should we second guess players who are, after all, professional. For that matter, we should ever second guess a GM, president, or owner, as they're *paid* to think about these things all the time. Same with reporters for that matter -- they're paid find out what's going on with teams and are clearly in a position to know more about a team than its fanbase. Surely I'm leaving out someone....oh, I know, the hotdog guys -- after all, they know food!


well, in the event of someone saying they don't think the team should trade for a player, that's completely and utterly different than what a person knows about their body. Especially when the chances are very good that the *team* ok'd him losing weight.

What a lot of us think a player should do is opinion and in most cases, ill-informed. 



> Sarcasm aside, the whole point of a board like this is to encourage debate and conversation among those interested. Telling someone (even Ed) that his or her ideas are stupid discourages more than encourages such exchanges. Why not simply say something like "Ya know, Ed, I think I'm gonna go with the trainer on this one" or something a little less insulting? And yes, despite expressed opinions counter to this, I'm inclined to think that Ed, too, is human.


blasphemy, ed is a robot.

Some things, no matter how much we all want to have soft and fuzzy feelings, are stupid to think. I know it's stupid for me to think that viktor should start ahead of Darius (and Outlaw). Big deal. 

but I don't try to act like I know better than the coach does.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

hasoos said:


> You can be lighter and be more effective. The important things on defense are leg strength for establishing position, and quickness. The things he is doing improves both of those. It might also improve his rebounding.
> 
> Secondly, players have to listen to their bodies. If their body is aching and hurting and telling them they have too much weight on, it is only a matter of time before they get injured by overstressing their knees or ankles. He may be lightening up so that he won't get hurt. Notice how when Shaq got really heavy that he was injured a lot. Last year he lightened up and was healthy much more of the season.
> 
> I trust Joel to do the right thing, he is a hard worker and the type of player who listens to his coaches. He is probably tuning his body to work on the things they asked him to work on.


bingo.


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## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

Hap said:


> actually ed, it is rather stupid for us to assume we know more than a guy who's hired a trainer, and worked with the blazers trainer who does it for a living. We can project all we want onto a player, but we don't actually know more than him.


Wait... so it was stupid for Joel to play heavy, but stupid to think that it might be a bad idea for him to play light. Why? Because he was hurt before, and he hasn't been hurt and/or ineffective yet?

He's working under professional advice now... almost for sure. But he was also working under professional advice when he was heavier, too.

Those of us who think him being lighter is a bad idea might be wrong. I totally admit that. But I don't think that it's a crazy notion that him being one of the lightest players taller than 7 foot in the NBA might not be a good idea.

So I ask you again: why should we trust a trainer more now than we should trust those who gave him advice earlier in his career? And, further yet, why should we trust it to the point of not even questioning it?

Ed O.


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## crandc (Sep 15, 2004)

> Secondly, players have to listen to their bodies.


Precisely!
Actually we all do...
Different people, including different NBA players, have different body types. Shaq has a huge frame; with no extra meat he's going to be near 300 lbs. Other centers are more long and lanky. Bonzi Wells (yes he's a jerk but a good example here) was 6'5", not tall by NBA standards, but I remember when I met him feeling he was huge; not fat, just big and wide because that is his body type. Rod Strickland was slender. 
Bottom line, you can't compare Przy with Shaq; it'd be great to have a huge dominant center but it's still better for Przy to be at his ideal weight for him rather than aim for Shaq weight and not be able to lift his legs off the floor.


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## gatorpops (Dec 17, 2004)

crandc said:


> Precisely!
> Actually we all do...
> Different people, including different NBA players, have different body types. Shaq has a huge frame; with no extra meat he's going to be near 300 lbs. Other centers are more long and lanky. Bonzi Wells (yes he's a jerk but a good example here) was 6'5", not tall by NBA standards, but I remember when I met him feeling he was huge; not fat, just big and wide because that is his body type. Rod Strickland was slender.
> Bottom line, you can't compare Przy with Shaq; it'd be great to have a huge dominant center but it's still better for Przy to be at his ideal weight for him rather than aim for Shaq weight and not be able to lift his legs off the floor.


Good post crandc.

On another note, It is very interesting to me to see these players, Priz, Zack, maybe Miles with maybe others, getting into really good shape. Sounds like we may be gearing up for a faster game, ala 1977. Comments?

gatorpops


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

Ed O said:


> So I ask you again: why should we trust a trainer more now than we should trust those who gave him advice earlier in his career? And, further yet, why should we trust it to the point of not even questioning it?


You're missing the point Ed... which is that this is a chance to call your thoughts stupid. Who cares that 237 is only a few pounds more then Portland's recently drafted HS 2 guard who is a half a foot shorter and plays on the outside. Expressing concerns that a 7 footer playing at this weight would make him one of the skinniest players in the league (let alone inside players) would probably be best expressed on a message board where posters discuss hoops, not on a spot (such as this) where we just wait for opportunities to insult each other.

duh...

STOMP


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Ed O said:


> Wait... so it was stupid for Joel to play heavy, but stupid to think that it might be a bad idea for him to play light. Why? Because he was hurt before, and he hasn't been hurt and/or ineffective yet?


because he knows his body better than you.


> He's working under professional advice now... almost for sure. But he was also working under professional advice when he was heavier, too.


yah, his coach told him to put on weight because (probably) he'd get "broken in half". Joel had never weighed that much, and it obviously wasn't good for his body.



> Those of us who think him being lighter is a bad idea might be wrong. I totally admit that. But I don't think that it's a crazy notion that him being one of the lightest players taller than 7 foot in the NBA might not be a good idea.


it might not, but at the same time, adding weight on him might not be the wisest thing either. If Shaq hadn't ballooned up to as much weight as he did, he would've been much more effective later in his career. 

more weight does not always mean good things (nor does being skinny always mean bad things).



> So I ask you again: why should we trust a trainer more now than we should trust those who gave him advice earlier in his career? And, further yet, why should we trust it to the point of not even questioning it?


as for the first question, it's doubtful that the team (the bucks?) had the knowledge that Joel being heavy was going to cause him to get hurt more and not be nearly as effective as he as in college (when he was skinnier). Also, and I'm sure this is true of a lof of people in the NBA, when you're trying to make it in the NBA and you're a big man, it's probably common for coaches to tell the guy to "gain weight" because we were in the "shaq is a big fat bloated sack" phase of the NBA. 

Secondly, if someone who actually does something for a living gives a player (who knows his body better than I do) advice about how much weight he should bear on his body, I'm going to believe that the guy knows what he's talking about.Just like if you were to give someone some law advice, I'm not gonna try to counter it because it's what I think the case should be.


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

I don't see what the big deal is -- he never was a post-up banger on offense, and he's a help defender (not a post defender) on defense. What's this mean? He needs speed. Speed to run off a pick and roll to get the easy dunk. Speed to turn and jump from one side of the key to the other to get a block. His muscle mass isn't going down; he's just losing fat. And when you're a shot blocker, lighter is generally better. Why? You jump higher, get better position, are more flexible (to avoid body contact) and are more mobile (to get to the shot and block it). Losing weight plays to Joel's offensive and defensive strengths.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

Hap said:


> you done whining?


Whining? :no: way to continue to take the low road. As a mod you do set the tone around here... maybe thats part of the reason so many of the threads have been digressing into Oregon Live-esk insultathons?

I don't think Ed's opinion expressing concern over Joel being too skinny, when he's claiming to have the listed weight of a swing player, is "stupid" at all and it seems that your latest post here has you backing off this and actually considering it. Anyways, it may or may not turn out to be a legitamate concern, but you dismissing it with insults shows (to me) that you aren't involved here to discuss hoops but rather to take yet another tiresome go at Ed. 

STOMP


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

STOMP said:


> Whining? :no: way to continue to take the low road. As a mod you do set the tone around here... maybe thats part of the reason so many of the threads have been digressing into Oregon Live-esk insultathons?
> 
> I don't think Ed's opinion expressing concern over Joel being too skinny, when he's claiming to have the listed weight of a swing player, is "stupid" at all and it seems that your latest post here has you backing off this and actually considering it. Anyways, it may or may not turn out to be a legitamate concern, but you dismissing it with insults shows (to me) that you aren't involved here to discuss hoops but rather to take yet another tiresome go at Ed.
> 
> STOMP


Im not sure where Im considering it. Ive said it once,and I'll say it again. For one of us to give advice to a player who's going on the advice of trainers (who know more than we do), because "think" we know what is best for him, is stupid.

It's stupid when you do it, it's stupid when I do it. 

Now, if Joel was doing something contrary to what the *TEAM* wants, that's one thing. Let's say he was gaining weight at an unhealthy rate, against what the team wanted (ala Shaq about 3 years ago). That'd be one thing to complain about, because it was obviously not at the advice of the team.

As for taking another "go at Ed", I don't know what you're talking about. Ed can have a different opinion than I can, and I can argue against it. Same with him. I think ed is a big boy, and he can handle himself. 

If I was taking a 'shot" at Ed, it would've gotten a lot more personal, which you'll notice it didn't get personal, and never does get personal.


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

crandc said:


> Bottom line, you can't compare Przy with Shaq; it'd be great to have a huge dominant center but it's still better for Przy to be at his ideal weight for him rather than aim for Shaq weight and not be able to lift his legs off the floor.


And what people are suggesting is NOT that Joel somehow magically transform into Shaq. We're suggesting (at least I am) that 237 lbs may be too light to be Joel's IDEAL WEIGHT.


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

Hap said:


> Im not sure where Im considering it. Ive said it once,and I'll say it again. For one of us to give advice to a player who's going on the advice of trainers (who know more than we do), because "think" we know what is best for him, is stupid.
> 
> It's stupid when you do it, it's stupid when I do it.
> 
> ...


I doubt the team told Joel: Become one of the skinniest 7 footers in the league.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Fork said:


> I doubt the team told Joel: Become one of the skinniest 7 footers in the league.


and I doubt Joel thought "hey, Im just gonna get too skinny"


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

Hap said:


> Im not sure where Im considering it..


right here...



EdO said:


> Those of us who think him being lighter is a bad idea might be wrong. I totally admit that. But I don't think that it's a crazy notion that him being one of the lightest players taller than 7 foot in the NBA might not be a good idea.





> it might not, but at the same time, adding weight on him might not be the wisest thing either. If Shaq hadn't ballooned up to as much weight as he did, he would've been much more effective later in his career. more weight does not always mean good things (nor does being skinny always mean bad things).


Sure seems like you're actually considering Ed's concerns more then when you were labeling the same thoughts stupid. I don't think Ed or anyone here has contended that Joel should add weight though... I'm sure we're all hoping that all the Blazers off-season workout plans will prepare them for the upcoming season as best as possible, but reading that the team's big guy is planning on showing up to camp lighter then most of the league's Power Forwards isn't something that makes me (as a fan) psyched as much as it raises a bit of concern that he may have gone too far. We shall see... 



> As for taking another "go at Ed", I don't know what you're talking about. Ed can have a different opinion than I can, and I can argue against it. Same with him. I think ed is a big boy, and he can handle himself. If I was taking a 'shot" at Ed, it would've gotten a lot more personal, which you'll notice it didn't get personal, and never does get personal.


I can't speak for everyone, but you seem to go out of your way to take issue with Ed's posts to an ad nausium extent pretty regularly. While I agree that he can handle himself against such stuff, it's a tiresome song and dance especially with the stupid-type of comments thrown in... I've read other posters making the same observation in other threads... it's not just me. Maybe you don't feel that it never gets personal, but that you go after him so aggressively and often makes it seem that way. 

STOMP


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

STOMP, to be fair Ed and Hap have been posting at each other I believe for about 8 or 9 years or so now...If it was so personal and offensive I am sure one of them would have left by now.

I'm sure as a former Mod and a long term member of the board Ed knows how to use the PM feature to hadle things with a person directly should his feelings get hurt, and also realizing that posting in a thread about it is not the appropriate way to handle it.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

STOMP said:


> right here...
> Sure seems a lot more like you're actually considering Ed's concerns then when you were calling the same thoughts stupid. I don't think Ed or anyone here has contended that Joel should add weight though...


for starters, I wasn't considering Ed's point to the degree you were implying.



> I can't speak for everyone, but you seem to go out of your way to take issue with Ed's posts to an ad nausium extent pretty regularly. While I agree that he can handle himself against such stuff, it's a tiresome song and dance especially with the stupid-type of comments thrown in... I've read other posters making the same observation in other threads... it's not just me. Maybe you don't feel that it never gets personal, but that you go after him so agressively and often makes it seem that way to me.
> 
> STOMP


sounds like a personal problem. You know why I "go out of my way" to take issue with his posts? Because a lot of the time, I don't *agree* with his posts. 

Some reasons why I "go after Ed", are A: Ed can take it B: Ed can dish it C: Ed actually will respond and counter things and most importantly, D: I like Ed more than I like most of the other posters here. 

But the biggest reason is because I tend to not agree with Ed on how the blazers should be run, etc. And one of the main reasons people post here, is to discuss things. Ed isn't a cry baby in that he just whines to whine. He has his opinions, some of which (like some of mine) are a little odd-ball. 

If enough of you are tired of how I am, I'll quit the board. And I don't mean in the "I'll just change my name and act like I'm not who I am" leave either. I'm tired of posters acting as if we mods can't have different opinions or have arguments with posters. 

I'm not gonna change because some people can't seem to be able to decipher the difference between calling an idea stupid, or the act of believing something is stupid and calling a person stupid. It's not my fault people can't tell the difference (and believe me, there IS a difference).

Think about this. I know for a fact I believe in a lot of stupid things. I happen to believe that human life started from aliens a long long time ago. Calling that belief stupid, or the theory stupid, does not mean I'm stupid.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

I know some of you will think that the following is just "company line", but here a response from the horse (owners) mouth.



> His weight loss is old news. He played at his current weight last season
> from the All Star break on. The author attributes his weight loss to
> boxing and in fact Joel may have regained some weight early in the off
> season and used boxing as a means to get back in shape but his current
> ...


so basically, I was right..I was right...I waaaas riiiiight...



for those wondering about the "1 email a week thing", it was when PBF was sending Mr Nash 12 emails a day.

and this is my email



> Mr Nash,
> 
> I know you said earlier that you wanted a "1 question a week" from
> fans, but I figured 2 questions in a couple of months time isn't bad.
> ...


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## tlong (Jan 6, 2003)

Hap said:


> for starters, I wasn't considering Ed's point to the degree you were implying.
> 
> Some reasons why I "go after Ed", are A: Ed can take it B: Ed can dish it C: Ed actually will respond and counter things and most importantly, D: I like Ed more than I like most of the other posters here.



I'm hurt Hap. I think you like Ed more than me. :brokenhea


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## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

Hap said:


> Some reasons why I "go after Ed", are A: Ed can take it B: Ed can dish it C: Ed actually will respond and counter things and most importantly, D: I like Ed more than I like most of the other posters here.


This all may be true. And, while I realize other posters see it differently, I'm not sure I've *ever* seen Ed do any dishing. Sure he can be cold, in the same way that, say, Spock might be. But I've never seen read insults into what he's written. And I'm with Stomp -- you "sound" insulting to me sometime, particularly with Ed, and honestly it gets old to read. I'm also willing to bet that it gets old for him, too, though you'd have to ask him to find out.

And, I don't have any interest in you leaving the board, Hap. Generally speaking, I really enjoy what you bring both to this board and to Courtside --the almost always seem to be reading at least one email from you and frequently it sparks the best conversation of the night. It just gets old to have to watch that dynamic, particularly when the posts from *both* of you are usually so good -- the "ignore" option isn't one I'm interested. For that matter, it's one I've never used yet on this site, nor do I plan to, as even the posters I find myself growing weary of sometimes surprise me with a post that gets me thinking about something in a new, valuable way.


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## CelticPagan (Aug 23, 2004)

crandc said:


> Boxing?
> I'm waiting for someone to say white men can't box. :angel:


Maybe whites don't box as well as blacks, but they can sure Ultimate Fight!


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## Blazer Ringbearer (Jan 28, 2003)

At that weight, he sounds like he's a bit bigger than Rasheed, and I always thought Rasheed did a solid job on defense against just about every center in the league - he even did okay against Shaq at times.

Joel with this training is probably a whole lot stronger than Sheed too, so I'm not concerned.

I think strength and quickness are a lot more important to Joel's game than shear weight, and it sounds like he has improved on both of these traits this offseason, while maintaining the same weight (according to Nash).


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## BBert (Dec 30, 2004)

Blazer Ringbearer said:


> At that weight, he sounds like he's a bit bigger than Rasheed, and I always thought Rasheed did a solid job on defense against just about every center in the league - he even did okay against Shaq at times.
> 
> Joel with this training is probably a whole lot stronger than Sheed too, so I'm not concerned.
> 
> I think strength and quickness are a lot more important to Joel's game than shear weight, and it sounds like he has improved on both of these traits this offseason, while maintaining the same weight (according to Nash).


Excellent points. 

And the quicker hands and feet, stronger abs and better balance (from the boxing training) should serve him well, on both ends of the court.


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## Nightfly (Sep 24, 2002)

*Let's keep this thread focused from here on out.

If you have any problems with any other posters, please work them out amongst your selves via PMs if you could.

Thanks.*


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## mgb (Jun 26, 2004)

Hap said:


> Think about this. I know for a fact I believe in a lot of stupid things. I happen to believe that human life started from aliens a long long time ago. Calling that belief stupid, or the theory stupid, does not mean I'm stupid.





> An idea is not responsible for the people who believe in it. -Don Marquis, humorist and poet (1878-1937)


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