# blow it up



## pac4eva5

fire gk. trade melo. trade camby. let iverson walk (hopefully)

hire brian shaw.

resign JR and najera.

offer calderon a butt load of money.

calderon, JR, nene, and kleiza is a solid young nucleus. add kmart, najera, and chucky to the list as vets. and im sure we can get SOMETHING pretty nice for melo and camby (maybe trade up for a higher pick)

obviously we need another big (7 feet please), and most likely a SF (i dont want kleiza playing all that much). this team might be fun to watch...


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## knicksfan89

no matter we still dominated you and we confidently predict the lakers WILL sweep you in game 4


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## Steez

knicksfan89 said:


> no matter we still dominated you and we confidently predict the lakers WILL sweep you in game 4


Just a FYI to all the Nuggets fans, this guy was never hired as the official speaker of the Lakers board 

Back on track - I fully expect the Nuggets to take Game 4, but thats is about it. I just cannot see a team like this just quitting again. As for the OP, trade everyone else -- keep Melo. Melo, Kobe, LeBron, DWade, Bosh, D12 are just some of the guys in this league that are untradeable.


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## knicksfan89

Steez said:


> Just a FYI to all the Nuggets fans, this guy was never hired as the official speaker of the Lakers board
> 
> Back on track - I fully expect the Nuggets to take Game 4, but thats is about it. I just cannot see a team like this just quitting again. As for the OP, trade everyone else -- keep Melo. Melo, Kobe, LeBron, DWade, Bosh, D12 are just some of the guys in this league that are untradeable.


lets face it nugs fans your team are quitters, and by the way I said that because I am a rabid lakers fan and I EXPECT this team to sweep your team out of the playoffs


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## Plastic Man

^^Why are you trolling here and giving us Lakers fans a bad name? Completely uncalled for.


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## thaKEAF

Chill out with the baiting KNICKSfan89.


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## pac4eva5

thank u for ruining my thread lakers fans. u guys are class.


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## pac4eva5

Steez said:


> Just a FYI to all the Nuggets fans, this guy was never hired as the official speaker of the Lakers board
> 
> Back on track - I fully expect the Nuggets to take Game 4, but thats is about it. I just cannot see a team like this just quitting again. As for the OP, trade everyone else -- keep Melo. Melo, Kobe, LeBron, DWade, Bosh, D12 are just some of the guys in this league that are untradeable.


this thread had nothing to do with the lakers.

and melo is NOT untradeable. great talent doesnt make u untradable. he is simply not a team player. he is not a "winner" like every homer wants u to believe. he is simply a stat guy and this expirement is over.


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## kirov

good in theory but not probable...


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## seifer0406

why would you build a team with Kmart and Nene as your main pieces? They are both one awkward landing away from missing the season.


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## Basel

Firing George Karl isn't happening, apparently. Reports came out today that he'll be back next season.

I think if Denver had acquired Ron Artest before the trading deadline, there would be no discussion about blowing this team. They need a player like that (regardless of past issues he's had) because their defense is downright atrocious. And it's possible that they still can acquire him, so we'll see what happens. If not, I still think Denver sticks with Melo and AI, but gets rid of players like Camby, J.R. Smith, Kenyon Martin, etc. I think Kleiza will stay there because they seem to be high on him. 

Anyway, as much as some Denver fans want to blow the team up and start over, I just don't see it happening.


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## pac4eva5

seifer0406 said:


> why would you build a team with Kmart and Nene as your main pieces? They are both one awkward landing away from missing the season.


umm calderon, JR smith, and nene would clearly be the main pieces, guy...


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## pac4eva5

kirov said:


> good in theory but not probable...


why isnt it probable? u guys really think melo is untouchable? lol...


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## VeN

pac4eva5 said:


> fire gk. trade melo. trade camby. let iverson walk (hopefully)
> 
> hire brian shaw.
> 
> resign JR and najera.
> 
> offer calderon a butt load of money.
> 
> calderon, JR, nene, and kleiza is a solid young nucleus. add kmart, najera, and chucky to the list as vets. and im sure we can get SOMETHING pretty nice for melo and camby (maybe trade up for a higher pick)
> 
> obviously we need another big (7 feet please), and most likely a SF (i dont want kleiza playing all that much). this team might be fun to watch...


trade camby or melo to us for josh howard

plz?


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## Doodles

i think that the nuggets just have to wait a bit more and see if MELO and AI can pull it off you just have to remember they are in the west which is so tough at the moment


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## seifer0406

pac4eva5 said:


> umm calderon, JR smith, and nene would clearly be the main pieces, guy...


how are you going to offer Calderon a lot of money when the Nuggets are over the cap?

Unless you are going to sign and trade with Toronto, but who are you going to trade to them?


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## pac4eva5

seifer0406 said:


> how are you going to offer Calderon a lot of money when the Nuggets are over the cap?
> 
> Unless you are going to sign and trade with Toronto, but who are you going to trade to them?


did u not read? melo, iverson, camby ALL off the books...


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## pac4eva5

Doodles said:


> i think that the nuggets just have to wait a bit more and see if MELO and AI can pull it off you just have to remember they are in the west which is so tough at the moment


lol, wait a bit more? FIVE STRAIGHT first round exits...

melo is a great player and phenominal talent. and he improves his stats every year. but hes NOT a team player. hes not good enough to take over games. hes lazy. and hes a SF. SF is the easiest position to fill on a team. id much rather have a nice PG-SG combo (something no nuggets team has had in a decade). if the team goes in that direction (i sure ****ing hope so) there will be no need for melo and iverson.

i dont want a stat guy. i want a basketball player.


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## NewAgeBaller

pac4eva5, would you do this trade then?

Miami's #1 Pick + Haslem --> Camby + Melo


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## kirov

pac4eva5 said:


> why isnt it probable? u guys really think melo is untouchable? lol...


who said anything about Melo? you can't just trade half of the team, it's real life not nba live 2008...things just don't work that easy...


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## darth-horax

NewAgeBaller said:


> pac4eva5, would you do this trade then?
> 
> Miami's #1 Pick + Haslem --> Camby + Melo


Absolutely not!

I'd rather see something akin to this:
Melo+Camby+#1 pick for Rudy Gay, Memphis #1, and filler.

I think Gay is a great talent, but Melo would be more marketable and will fil the seats better than GAy would. If Denver could get a high first round ipck, they could get Roy Hibbert or some center to help clog the lane...soemthing that Camby doesnt' do. As far as Memphis is concerned, Melo is marketable, proven, a sub-superstar, and Camby has mad D and rebounding galore. Memphis isn't going anywhere with their current group, and Melo would be the piece to start rebuilding. Camby brings legitmate rebounding and defense threats every night, and he won't be on the books long...something they need for the future, financial flexiblitiy.


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## darth-horax

Imagine this lineup:
AI, JR SMith, Rudy GAy, KMart, Nene

Not too shabby.


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## TheTruth34

Melo sucks.
Trade Melo and Martin to the Pacers for O'Neal and Granger.

Camby
O'Neal
Granger
Smith
Iverson


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## darth-horax

Probably not.


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## Sliccat

TheTruth34 said:


> Melo sucks.
> Trade Melo and Martin to the Pacers for O'Neal and Granger.
> 
> Camby
> O'Neal
> Granger
> Smith
> Iverson


no.



> Imagine this lineup:
> AI, JR SMith, Rudy GAy, KMart, Nene
> 
> Not too shabby.


Except that relying on both Martin and Nene being healthy is stupid.


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## pac4eva5

kirov said:


> who said anything about Melo? you can't just trade half of the team, it's real life not nba live 2008...things just don't work that easy...


why not? memphis and seattle did it just this season.

im not trading scrubs for stars. im trading overrated stars for younger, cheaper pieces that will give this team a CHANCE at a title someday...


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## pac4eva5

TheTruth34 said:


> Melo sucks.
> Trade Melo and Martin to the Pacers for O'Neal and Granger.
> 
> Camby
> O'Neal
> Granger
> Smith
> Iverson


yuck...


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## pac4eva5

darth-horax said:


> Imagine this lineup:
> AI, JR SMith, Rudy GAy, KMart, Nene
> 
> Not too shabby.


well in a deal like that, we BETTER draft rose. then get rid of iverson and id be extatic...


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## pac4eva5

NewAgeBaller said:


> pac4eva5, would you do this trade then?
> 
> Miami's #1 Pick + Haslem --> Camby + Melo


no. its not that bad either. im just leaning toward melo for rose. we can do better than camby for haslem. plus miami cant do such a deal anyway. melo and camby are making way more than haslem...


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## kirov

pac4eva5 said:


> why not? memphis and seattle did it just this season.
> 
> im not trading scrubs for stars. im trading overrated stars for younger, cheaper pieces that will give this team a CHANCE at a title someday...


because that's quite the same thing...I suppose the next stop is new city,new team name and logo...Not to mention every trade proposed is ''yuck'' to you...

get real


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## pac4eva5

the only thing real is our playoff record. 4-20 with melo (FIVE ****ING YEARS)


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## knicksfan89

*NO.*


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## knickstorm

pac4eva5 said:


> why not? memphis and seattle did it just this season.
> 
> im not trading scrubs for stars. im trading overrated stars for younger, cheaper pieces that will give this team a CHANCE at a title someday...


yea the 2 teams you mentioned are either getting ready to be moved or sold and they traded stars for scrubs.....you want young players with stud potential...........that being said the mavs fans are pretty pissed off.....maybe cuban and you guys can trade half your teams to each other.


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## NewAgeBaller

pac4eva5 said:


> no. its not that bad either. im just leaning toward melo for rose. we can do better than camby for haslem. plus miami cant do such a deal anyway. melo and camby are making way more than haslem...


K cool. I saw ur post in the Memphis board, so I was just wondering. And yea, salaries don't match yet.

Just outta curiosity, why do you want to trade Camby? Is it just if you can get good value, or do you want to trade him away?


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## pac4eva5

NewAgeBaller said:


> K cool. I saw ur post in the Memphis board, so I was just wondering. And yea, salaries don't match yet.
> 
> Just outta curiosity, why do you want to trade Camby? Is it just if you can get good value, or do you want to trade him away?


i hate him. he is ridiculously overrated. absolute terrible defender. pathetic on offense. doesnt rotate to anybody. very selfish. steals rebounds. i could go on and on...

4 blocks a game sounds nice and all...that means he makes 4 nice plays a game. literally.


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## darth-horax

#1, Darrick Rose is nice, but you don't trade a proven commodity for an unknown. Rose could be el busto in the league, you never know.

With Melo, you know you're going to get 25 and 8 every night. He's worth more than you think.

Remember, Jordan didn't advance out of hte first round until he was 25...which Melo is not. melo only had one year of college ball under his belt when he came out, and he's being coached by a slug.

Either keep Melo, or trade him for another proven asset. You NEVER trade a superstar for an unknown. never...


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## nbanoitall

loosing makes people write crazy ****. melo is darn near untradeable.
this offseason its the older vets that will be shopped. Melo isn't going anywhere.


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## mediocre man

The problem with trading Melo is that you probably won't get close to equal value back for him. He is a great player, but is percieved as a malcontent after his comments. 

Memphis for example has no reason whatsoever to give up Rudy Gay for him.

Portland would love him, but they are in the same division and wouldn't trade any of Roy, Aldridge or Oden for him. 

Miami would become contenders in the weak *** leastern conference, but other than the potential #1 pick they have nothing to offer that wouldn't hurt them by trading the asset away.

You would probably be looking at players who are young and have shown the ability to contribute, and also a big salary player who is expiring. Knowing the Blazers best it would be a combination of players like 

Outlaw
Jack
Frye
Webster
And picks 

along with a player like Lafrentz aho comes off the books at the end of next season.


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## nbanoitall

if i was memphis id give up rudy gay for him...i know the nuggets got there asses kicked, but seriously keep things in perspective...melo isn't going anywhere.


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## someone

Are any nuggets fans interested in players the Bulls have?


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## nbanoitall

i would be


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## someone

nbanoitall said:


> i would be


who are you interested in? 

I think most Bulls fans would be interested in AI especially


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## nbanoitall

as i posted in that forum.... ben gordon (a shooter) would make sense for denver. basically one trade i heard was Thomas, Gordon, and their 2nd round pick (jawai or say roby) for iverson. 
That still would give the Nuggets the opportunity to move camby for a guy like rip.
pick up jamal tinsley and wouldnt we have a stacked backcourt


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## mediocre man

nbanoitall said:


> if i was memphis id give up rudy gay for him...i know the nuggets got there asses kicked, but seriously keep things in perspective...melo isn't going anywhere.


Why? I mean seriously, why?


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## GNG

mediocre man said:


> Why? I mean seriously, why?


Because Rudy Gay is teh SUX0rs and has reached his potential, and Melo is awesome and threatens to lead the league in scoring every year.

...which...is why some of the Nuggets fans want to trade Melo for Rudy... :thinking2:


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## nbanoitall

exactly. to be fair rawse they are just really pissed off right now. but melo isnt going anywhere. "seriously"


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## GNG

nbanoitall said:


> exactly. to be fair rawse they are just really pissed off right now. but melo isnt going anywhere. "seriously"


I was making fun of the Nuggets fans who are downplaying Rudy's ability yet still want to trade Melo for him, but yes, I agree that Melo won't be traded.


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## darth-horax

All I was saying on your board was that Melo is at his peak, and while Gay may not be at his yet, it's possible he will never reach taht level.

I just think that GAy is a better fit in Denver's system, adn Melo would be easier for you to build a team around.


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## pac4eva5

darth-horax said:


> #1, Darrick Rose is nice, but you don't trade a proven commodity for an unknown. Rose could be el busto in the league, you never know.
> 
> With Melo, you know you're going to get 25 and 8 every night. He's worth more than you think.
> 
> Remember, Jordan didn't advance out of hte first round until he was 25...which Melo is not. melo only had one year of college ball under his belt when he came out, and he's being coached by a slug.
> 
> Either keep Melo, or trade him for another proven asset. You NEVER trade a superstar for an unknown. never...


rose is a sure thing and melo is NOT a superstar.


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## pac4eva5

liekomgj4ck said:


> Are any nuggets fans interested in players the Bulls have?


hinrich. no doubt. i would love to do a camby/hinrich swap. i have no idea how chicago feels about him but hed be a perfect fit for us...


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## pac4eva5

Rawse said:


> Because Rudy Gay is teh SUX0rs and has reached his potential, and Melo is awesome and threatens to lead the league in scoring every year.
> 
> ...which...is why some of the Nuggets fans want to trade Melo for Rudy... :thinking2:


lol id love to swap gay for melo.


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## Ruff Draft

I could see a Kirk/Nene swap, but not Camby. They want to keep it young obviously.


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## pac4eva5

id take that as well...


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## NewAgeBaller

Yea like RD said, I could see a Kirk-Nene trade much more than a Kirk-Camby trade.


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## BenDavis503

I would trade you Raef LaFrentz for Melo. Maybe...


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## knickstorm

trade melo for dirk, them mav fans want to blow it up too


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## seifer0406

pac4eva5 said:


> did u not read? melo, iverson, camby ALL off the books...


Calderon is a restricted free agent this season, getting yourself cap space in the future isn't exactly going to help you land him this year.

If you trade any of these players the earliest for you guys to free up cap is after next year, by then Calderon would've signed a contract.

As I said, the only way for the Nuggets to go after Calderon is through a sign and trade, and that's why I asked who are you guys offering that will interest Toronto.


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## darth-horax

Rose is not a sure thing...no incoming rookie is a sure thing until they ahve proven themselves on the hardwood of the NBA.

There have been way too many great players who get lost once they hit the L.


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## someone

NewAgeBaller said:


> Yea like RD said, I could see a Kirk-Nene trade much more than a Kirk-Camby trade.


Kirk for Nene? How could a team even land Nene in a trade? He'd break a knee or something from the sheer impact.


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## darth-horax

I'd love to see Hinrich out here...I think he's one of the better pass-first PG's in the league. He'd be a great fit in Denver.

I love Nene, but he's never ever ever healthey...ever. EVER. ever...


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## pac4eva5

hes healthy. he is just a bum and doesnt care. he NEVER plays injured. and hes always out of shape.


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## pac4eva5

darth-horax said:


> Rose is not a sure thing...no incoming rookie is a sure thing until they ahve proven themselves on the hardwood of the NBA.
> 
> There have been way too many great players who get lost once they hit the L.


every player in the history of baskebtall was once a rookie at somepoint. have u watched rose at all? he has it all. size, vision, handles, unslefish, can score at will. hes a sure thing.


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## someone

pac4eva5 said:


> every player in the history of baskebtall was once a rookie at somepoint. have u watched rose at all? he has it all. size, vision, handles, unslefish, can score at will. hes a sure thing.


yeah so was Shawn Kemp. And we all know how well that turned out.


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## Sliccat

liekomgj4ck said:


> yeah so was Shawn Kemp. And we all know how well that turned out.


yeah he was only one of the top 5 PF's for around ten years and got his team to the finals. ****ing waste of talent.

Nevermind comparing rose to kemp is idiotic.


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## darth-horax

pac4eva5 said:


> every player in the history of baskebtall was once a rookie at somepoint. have u watched rose at all? he has it all. size, vision, handles, unslefish, can score at will. hes a sure thing.


1) Len Bias
2) Danny Ferry
3) Christian Laettner
4) Joe Barry Carroll
5) Anferny Hardaway
6) Pervis Ellison
7) Khalid El-Amin
8) Sebastian Telfair
9) Lenny Cooke
10) Darko Milicic

All sure things at one point, and all great college players (exception to the high schoolers). NOTHING is a sure thing until they get in the L and prove themselves.


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## pac4eva5

when were half of those guys sure thing? just because they are a high draft pick doesnt mean they are a sure thing. many teams draft on potential. some of those guys didnt live up because of injuries or DEATH (i mean seriously, len bias!?). again, have u seen rose play? hes not a guy who gets by because hes more talented than everybody. he actually has a brain. he has heart. anybody with heart is a guy i want on my team. unless his last name is iverson...


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## pac4eva5

liekomgj4ck said:


> yeah so was Shawn Kemp. And we all know how well that turned out.


lol what? kemp was a great player for a while. i could be wrong, but im pretty confident rose wont get into coke. and if he does, i bet melo gets there earlier...


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## pac4eva5

seifer0406 said:


> Calderon is a restricted free agent this season, getting yourself cap space in the future isn't exactly going to help you land him this year.
> 
> If you trade any of these players the earliest for you guys to free up cap is after next year, by then Calderon would've signed a contract.
> 
> As I said, the only way for the Nuggets to go after Calderon is through a sign and trade, and that's why I asked who are you guys offering that will interest Toronto.


ur taking this way too literally. this wasnt the only plan. calderon would be perfect. if not, no big deal. we could try to land hinrich with camby and a pick or iverson or maybe nene. we could always trade melo for the #2 pick to get rose. doubt that happens but its not the point. the point is to blow it up and get a PG. iverson and camby are MUST GO's. melo hasnt played with a legit PG in his nba career. dre was a selfish bum with no range outside 15 feet. iverson is ridiculously selfish. carter doesnt deserve to be on an nba team. give melo a PG with decent size and and shooting who isnt selfish and we have a winner. the GOAL for next year is to have a PG.


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## seifer0406

pac4eva5 said:


> ur taking this way too literally. this wasnt the only plan. calderon would be perfect. if not, no big deal. we could try to land hinrich with camby and a pick or iverson or maybe nene. we could always trade melo for the #2 pick to get rose. doubt that happens but its not the point. the point is to blow it up and get a PG. iverson and camby are MUST GO's. melo hasnt played with a legit PG in his nba career. dre was a selfish bum with no range outside 15 feet. iverson is ridiculously selfish. carter doesnt deserve to be on an nba team. give melo a PG with decent size and and shooting who isnt selfish and we have a winner. the GOAL for next year is to have a PG.


I'm not arguing about the direction of the team. You just purposed signing Calderon and I asked how you are planning to do that. If it's not something that can be done then that's the end of that story.

Realistically speaking the Nuggets will have to build the team around Melo/Nene/Kmart. Melo is the face of the franchise and I doubt Denver will move him. Nene/Kmart have bad contracts and unless Denver wants to get another player whose contract is just as bad, or a much less talented player with a shorter contract, those 2 guys are going to stay. They can try to move Camby for a point guard and try to move Iverson or just let him walk after this season.


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## VeN

darth-horax said:


> 5) Anferny Hardaway


thats bs man, everyone knows before the injuries penny was a great player


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## Sliccat

They should look at trading Iverson to Atlanta for Bibby and their center... zach something.


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## thaKEAF

If I was Atlanta I probably wouldn't do that.


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## kirov

or maybe just send him to d-league...pointless thread...


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## pac4eva5

Sliccat said:


> They should look at trading Iverson to Atlanta for Bibby and their center... zach something.


zaza? i like it...


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## TheTruth34

Maybe make a shot at AI for T-Mac
Then trade Melo, Camby and Najera to the Heat for Marion and #1 pick
and draft Derrick Rose

Nene
Marion
McGrady
Smith
Rose

and honestly i think the heat would massively bite on the chances of having wade and melo together.

the heat wouldnt be too shabby either

Camby
Haslem
Melo
Wade
Williams

of course that all depends on how the heat mesh.

im sure the sleepy lookin guys would get along
and jr smith's explosive style would go well with t-mac and matrix's athleticism. a young star in rose would love playin with T-Mac and Shawn Marion who are great guys with extreme talent, they just need the right situation. and nene is the muscle and soul of the team like ben wallace on the pistons back in 04. ultimately you cant go wrong.

I SAY DO IT!

returns both teams back to top 4 seeds in their conference if you ask me, but hey no one ever listens to what i have to say.


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## TheTruth34

pac4eva5 said:


> zaza? i like it...


bibby sucks and pachulia is racist

if you think zaza and melo would get along...ha.

zaza wines and thinks he's the sh*t, when he really sucks.

if you take anyone from atlanta its joe johnson and josh smith, but its not gonna happen.

you could trade Melo and Iverson to atlanta for smith and johnson but i still think they'd deny it.


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## Sliccat

The heat wouldn't do it.


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## NewAgeBaller

Yea I can't say we'd do that Heat deal.. Melo I'd love, scoring like 24 ppg or wateva alongside Wade (it'd free up Wade so much too), but Camby + Najera I'm not exactly longing for (at the expense of Marion & Rose - Marion is a $17 mil expiring btw).


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## Sliccat

NewAgeBaller said:


> Yea I can't say we'd do that Heat deal.. Melo I'd love, scoring like 24 ppg or wateva alongside Wade (it'd free up Wade so much too), but Camby + Najera I'm not exactly longing for (at the expense of Marion & Rose - Marion is a $17 mil expiring btw).


It would be cool though. They'd have $37 mil coming off the books next year, plus the top draft prospect. Couple it with Nene, JR and Kenyon, that's a dangerous line-up.


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## nbanoitall

you got your MLE. realistically you can expect the Nuggets to field offers on KMart, Camby, and AI. JR Smith and Najera are your two free agents.
Guys like Michael Redd and Rip Hamilton are good fits around Melo. 
I have no problems with Nuggets deciding to go young either. Hopefully the Nuggets pick up Ajinca (especially if they are moving Camby). 
The Nuggets need a pass first point guard. If winning next year is important they should take a risk on Tinsley to run the point. I think Indiana is getting fed up with him. They might trade Tinsley alone, but if the Pacers are set on moving JO...then JO and Tinsley for AI, Hunter, and Atkins works.
I'm still a fan of a deal for John Salmons, but I want to add DeShawn Stevenson to the list. He clearly is crazy and just a role player (or soliderboy if you prefer), but he shoots 38% from the three point line and tries hard on defense. He could fit a role for the Nuggets.
Trading for "stars" is not going to fix the Nuggets problems. It is time to find guys that will fit roles around Carmelo Anthony. The team never had a chance against the lakers because they didnt have a role player like Stevenson to come in and guard Bryant.
I still think you can trade KMart. There are plenty of teams that will overpay for some size. The New Jersey Nets seem like one of those teams.


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## pac4eva5

nobody said anything about trading for stars. guys like redd and rip were ur ideas. and theres no way we can get them.

hinrich is an easy possibility imo. calderon would be ridiculous for our team and as long as hes there we should be interested. id even take tj ford but not ahead of hinrich or calderon, we need size preferably. we need a pass first PG who can also shoot the three consistantly. the closest we have had in a long time was blake but the FO ****ed that one up.


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## GNG

darth-horax said:


> 1) Len Bias
> 2) Danny Ferry
> 3) Christian Laettner
> 4) Joe Barry Carroll
> 5) Anferny Hardaway
> 6) Pervis Ellison
> 7) Khalid El-Amin
> 8) Sebastian Telfair
> 9) Lenny Cooke
> 10) Darko Milicic
> 
> All sure things at one point, and all great college players (exception to the high schoolers). NOTHING is a sure thing until they get in the L and prove themselves.


You have a good point with about three of those names. The other seven or so are poor examples.


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## nbanoitall

pac4eva5 said:


> nobody said anything about trading for stars. guys like redd and rip were ur ideas. and theres no way we can get them.
> 
> hinrich is an easy possibility imo. calderon would be ridiculous for our team and as long as hes there we should be interested. id even take tj ford but not ahead of hinrich or calderon, we need size preferably. we need a pass first PG who can also shoot the three consistantly. the closest we have had in a long time was blake but the FO ****ed that one up.


actually youve been gone for awhile. you can put john salmons on me...not rip or redd. those names were not first brought up by me...although i agree with them
all the names im seeing in trade rumors are stars...except for the Melo trades which are for guys like gay or draft picks. Pac you were kinda cool before, but you basically now are the Rev. Wright of the nuggets forum. congrats man, youve lost your mind.


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## pac4eva5

not sure where u are going with that. what the hell did i do?

i havent made one proposal for a star, unless u count calderon whos a rising star and perfect fit. FIVE years, 4 wins.

carmelo needs more help than any "star" in this league to win playoff games. thats fact. he needs a perfect PG. he needs a very solid low post presence. he needs at least 3 guys in the lineup next to him who can hit threes.

right now he has none of those. blowing it up is the only way.


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## nbanoitall

pac4eva5 said:


> not sure where u are going with that. what the hell did i do?.


i've seen what you are willing to give up Melo for Reverend.
"blow it up" is just a knee jerk reaction of fans, bloggers, writers without any common sense.
mutombo left and since then we've never had a decent reason to believe (although I liked Dice) until Melo came along. Instead of building the right way the Nuggets decided to speed things up and trade for AI. They **** ed up. No reason to trade Melo and risk sending the Nuggets back to the cellar for the next decade.
its time to put the right guys around melo...anything else...like "blowing it up" is truely insane. I understand the shop the veterans philosophy, but thats it
instead of selling the farm to land rose...why not trade up into the lotto to finally draft a future starting shooting guard. if you want a young pg the nets have a young backup for example. or the pacers have a vet they are fed up with.


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## Sliccat

pac4eva5 said:


> not sure where u are going with that. what the hell did i do?
> 
> i havent made one proposal for a star, unless u count calderon whos a rising star and perfect fit. FIVE years, 4 wins.
> 
> carmelo needs more help than any "star" in this league to win playoff games. thats fact. he needs a perfect PG. he needs a very solid low post presence. he needs at least 3 guys in the lineup next to him who can hit threes.
> 
> right now he has none of those. blowing it up is the only way.


There's no way Calderon is equal value for Melo. Gay and a pick I can see, but you're starting to underrate him. Is he Kobe? No, but he's as good a pure scorer as there is, weaknesses notwithstanding.


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## Sliccat

nbanoitall said:


> i've seen what you are willing to give up Melo for Reverend.
> "blow it up" is just a knee jerk reaction of fans, bloggers, writers without any common sense.
> mutombo left and since then we've never had a decent reason to believe (although I liked Dice) until Melo came along. Instead of building the right way the Nuggets decided to speed things up and trade for AI. They **** ed up. No reason to trade Melo and risk sending the Nuggets back to the cellar for the next decade.
> its time to put the right guys around melo...anything else...like "blowing it up" is truely insane. I understand the shop the veterans philosophy, but thats it
> instead of selling the farm to land rose...why not trade up into the lotto to finally draft a future starting shooting guard. if you want a young pg the nets have a young backup for example. or the pacers have a vet they are fed up with.


To be fair, Miller and Camby might have had a little to do with it. He couldn't have won without them anymore than they could've without him.


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## pac4eva5

nbanoitall said:


> i've seen what you are willing to give up Melo for Reverend.
> "blow it up" is just a knee jerk reaction of fans, bloggers, writers without any common sense.
> mutombo left and since then we've never had a decent reason to believe (although I liked Dice) until Melo came along. Instead of building the right way the Nuggets decided to speed things up and trade for AI. They **** ed up. No reason to trade Melo and risk sending the Nuggets back to the cellar for the next decade.
> its time to put the right guys around melo...anything else...like "blowing it up" is truely insane. I understand the shop the veterans philosophy, but thats it
> instead of selling the farm to land rose...why not trade up into the lotto to finally draft a future starting shooting guard. if you want a young pg the nets have a young backup for example. or the pacers have a vet they are fed up with.


theres no knee jerk reaction. i waited patiently for 5 years. SF's dont lead their teams ANYWHERE. its a fact. other than pippen, name a SF who has led their team to titles? and im not counting lebron or a guy like magic. im talking legit SF's. lol just look at pierce and mcgrady.  great team accomplishments they've had so far...

PG's and C's are the most important pieces to a team. we are pathetic at both spots...


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## pac4eva5

Sliccat said:


> There's no way Calderon is equal value for Melo. Gay and a pick I can see, but you're starting to underrate him. Is he Kobe? No, but he's as good a pure scorer as there is, weaknesses notwithstanding.


i never said he was. im willing to pair them up together.

camby to dallas. j-ho to toronto. calderon to denver.

obviously it wont really happen. we should be pressing hard for hinrich.


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## jericho

pac4eva5 said:


> theres no knee jerk reaction. i waited patiently for 5 years. SF's dont lead their teams ANYWHERE. its a fact. other than pippen, name a SF who has led their team to titles? and im not counting lebron or a guy like magic. im talking legit SF's. lol just look at pierce and mcgrady. great team accomplishments they've had so far...
> 
> PG's and C's are the most important pieces to a team. we are pathetic at both spots...


I wouldn't say Pippen led his team to a title. He was a solid number 2 guy, like Erving in '83. 

I'd say Bird is the exception to your rule. Also Rick Barry.


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## kirov

jericho said:


> I wouldn't say Pippen led his team to a title. He was a solid number 2 guy, like Erving in '83.
> 
> I'd say Bird is the exception to your rule. Also Rick Barry.


solid number 2-that's just your point of view.


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## someone

jericho said:


> I wouldn't say Pippen led his team to a title. He was a solid number 2 guy, like Erving in '83.
> 
> I'd say Bird is the exception to your rule. Also Rick Barry.


haha, a solid number 2?


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## jericho

kirov said:


> solid number 2-that's just your point of view.


Sure, but I'm not the only one who holds it. Would you say that Pippen was the player most responsible for those Bulls titles?


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## jericho

liekomgj4ck said:


> haha, a solid number 2?



Okay, I'll upgrade that to "phenomenal number 2"...but a second banana nonetheless. I was responding to the previous opinion that small forwards don't lead teams to titles. I would say that Pippen didn't, although he certainly had a huge role in that Chicago dynasty. Bird and Barry did.


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## nbanoitall

pac4eva5 said:


> theres no knee jerk reaction. i waited patiently for 5 years.
> PG's and C's are the most important pieces to a team. we are pathetic at both spots...


it is a knee jerk reaction to another first round loss. Instead of building the team correctly, you want to blow it up. All 5 spots are important 1 thru 5. *Trading the "MVP of the World" is loco.*
I read an idea about sending Kmart for Marcus Williams, Swift, and Hassell. there is a point guard.... as for a center.... draft or trade. trade the vets... keep melo. id even try and re-sign jr smith. I like both Tinsely and JO from the Pacers as well (yes I recognize the risk)
I really could see Marcus Williams having a breakout year for the Nuggets next year. 
At least go after the right pieces and give melo a decent chance. The Nuggets didn't have one guy on the roster that could even attempt to stay with Kobe. Salmons would have been a great option to put on him. The front office screwed up. Trading Melo is loco.
I'd still like to get Salmons.


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## pac4eva5

well for one, luis scola was the MVP, so that hurts ur argument a ton. its very easy for a guy like melo to dominate internationally. if they threw a double team to him, it would be a different story, however nobody is gonna leave dwight, kobe, lebron, paul, etc. open. melo is completely perfect for team usa. playoff basketball is a different story.

two, john salmons? are u serious? do u realize how important he is to the kings? who the hell would we give up? nothing short of camby. i live in sac. nobody here wants him traded for ****ty guys. and they have a plethora of sg and sf so we have nothing to offer.

three, ive never been that serious about melo being traded simply because it wont happen. but if i had my way, id swap melo for darrick rose w/o hesitation. name a solid PG in the league who didnt make it to the playoffs? hinrich and devin harris, and both of those guys have excuses. what i have been serious with is camby and iverson. they are MUST GO's.


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## kirov

jericho said:


> Sure, but I'm not the only one who holds it. Would you say that Pippen was the player most responsible for those Bulls titles?



which responsibility are you talking about? responsibility to score 30+ every game? responsibility to take the last shot? responsibility to be a team player? responsibility to rebound? responsibility to play defense? responsibility to assist and distribute the ball? responsibility to pump your teammates prior to the game? responsibility to block shots? responsibility to play 40+ minutes every game?....
Pippen wasn't responsible to score 30+ every game, does that make him number 2? no. He wasn't responsible to take the last shot, does that make him number 2? No. He worked his *** off on defense, (make no mistake, Jordan was also a great, great defender) does that make him number 1? No.
They were a team, in every good sense of the word that's why they did what they did.
I think it's just the fact that Michael Jordan was the greatest but he was also a good businessman, he knows how to sell (just write in youtube ''Michael Jordan commercial'' and then '' Scottie Pippen commercial'') and that's the reason why spectators changed their point of view when the dynasty was over and the strongest name that stayed in memory was of course Jordan's.
I don't want to take anything away from Jordan, nevertheless who am I to talk like this, it just makes me sick when people talk about Michael Jordan and the Chicago Bulls and that's it. Comparing that to current Lebron James and the Cleveland Cavaliers it's just a slap in the face for Pippen, Rodman, etc.
I liked the ''phenomenal number 2'' part, nice touch though...
Later


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## pac4eva5

pippen is a solid 33% responsible for the 6 rings.


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## someone

pac4eva5 said:


> pippen is a solid 33% responsible for the 6 rings.


:laugh: jordan was a mere 23%, now if they only had Shaq...


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