# oh my JAMAL!



## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

What a shot.


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## uracornball (Nov 13, 2002)

I was wondering who was gonna make the post about it, should someone bump the Jamal update thread


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

That was nice.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

Jamal beats the Rockets by 1 with a last second 3 point banker. He calls it the biggest shot of his career so far in the postgame interview.

Good for him.


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## mizenkay (Dec 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>uracornball</b>!
> I was wondering who was gonna make the post about it, should someone bump the Jamal update thread


lol. let's not and say we did.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

That was a great shot. The Rockets should be ashamed of themselves for letting him get such a good look.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

Jeesh by the look of it, it looked like he was actually trying to get fouled, but man thats a lucky shot. No form whatsover, he just trew the ball at the rim, good for him.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

did we ever need that..that was his best game by far...much more under control and played solid D...

terrible terrible D by Houston


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## NYKBaller (Oct 29, 2003)

Clutch


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## notbeat (Jul 13, 2002)

man, watching the seconds tick down, I knew exactly what was going to happen.

[edit] Knicks, I hate them. But good for Jamal...

At least we have cap space. Though it sure makes for [edit] TV...


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## remlover (Jan 22, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> Jeesh by the look of it, it looked like he was actually trying to get fouled, but man thats a lucky shot. No form whatsover, he just trew the ball at the rim, good for him.


Lucky shot is the best to describe it. 2.9 seconds on the clock, catches it and fires w/ about 1.8, shoots off one leg falling to his right, 3 steps behind the line, banks it in. 

Good for Crawford that he made that shot. Although i wonder if NYK's strategy is to have crawford shoot 11 3's a game?


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>NYKBaller</b>!
> Clutch


Crawford had a nice game, i liked it better when he was passing and rebounding but he shot the ball to much i think, i mean 19 points on 18 shots with no FT's inst that great of a stat and if Jamal dint have a hot game past the arch we could be looking at a terrible shooting night for Crawford overall he had a nice game but not great. 7-18 shooting 5-11 from the 3.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

What happened?


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

That was a pretty freakish shot.

I watched most of the game, and he played pretty well. He had a key steal and a couple of nice assists towards the end too... ended up with 19 points on 7-18 shooting, 5 boards, 8 assists, 2 steals, 0 TOs.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> That was a pretty freakish shot.
> 
> I watched most of the game, and he played pretty well. He had a key steal and a couple of nice assists towards the end too... ended up with 19 points on 7-18 shooting, 5 boards, 8 assists, 2 steals, 0 TOs.


Did he start at PG? But i think most of his asst where to Thomas who had a monster game.


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## remlover (Jan 22, 2004)

Kurt THomas was the true MVP of that game for the Knicks. I just wish he was younger and i would get on board w/ the "trade for KT bandwagon"


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>remlover</b>!
> Kurt THomas was the true MVP of that game for the Knicks. I just wish he was younger and i would get on board w/ the "trade for KT bandwagon"


They would not have won this game if it wasnt for Kurt Thomas putting that great screen at the end of the game, he had a great game.


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## ChiBron (Jun 24, 2002)

Those kind of unbalanced shots was something Jamal made A LOT OF as a Chicago Bull. It's something he has always been good at so i would hardly call it a 'fluke'. Anyway, another very solid night for him as the trend continues for ex-Bulls who play better on other teams.

With each game Paxson looks worse and worse.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> Kurt THomas was the true MVP of that game for the Knicks. I just wish he was younger and i would get on board w/ the "trade for KT bandwagon


Its mindboggling that we cant give this guy away,and even worse nobody in NY wants him...The guy is everything a pro athlete should be,plays in pain and plays hard ALL the time..

Go figure


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SPMJ</b>!
> Those kind of unbalanced shots was something Jamal made A LOT OF as a Chicago Bull. It's something he has always been good at so i would hardly call it a 'fluke'. Anyway, another very solid night for him as the trend continues for ex-Bulls who play better on other teams.
> 
> With each game Paxson looks worse and worse.


 Dude how the heck is Crawford having a better season then he did in chicago, hes pretty much the exact same Crawford no improvement whatsoever. Good at taking unbalanced crazy looking shots is a plus?!


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Crawford had a nice game, i liked it better when he was passing and rebounding but he shot the ball to much i think, i mean 19 points on 18 shots with no FT's inst that great of a stat and if Jamal dint have a hot game past the arch we could be looking at a terrible shooting night for Crawford overall he had a nice game but not great. 7-18 shooting 5-11 from the 3.


At least 4 of those 3's were with the clock winding down with Marbury seemingly on ritalin for most of the game hes getting the ball in bailout position.Hes learning though I saw some things I never saw last year and some of teh same old stuff just less frequently .
















That doesnt looks a running one hand falling sideways out of bounds blindfolded with the rim lowered to 8ft shot to me though


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> Dude how the heck is Crawford having a better season then he did in chicago, hes pretty much the exact same Crawford no improvement whatsoever.


That is a very unfair statement...JC came to NY with TERRIBLE habits and the Knicks are slowly getting him to shed them..He had/has a terrible shot selection,which is getting better,tends to over dribble and pull up ,and doesnt go to the hole as mucha as he should..Not to mention,has he ever been introduced to a weight room??

The guy is getting better each game,but it will be a slow process,and his progress wont necessarily show up in the box score


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TRUTHHURTS</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 No it looks like let me launch this ball and hope i get fouled, hey wait i made it let me run half court and almost sock some old fat white guy in the chops. Same old Crawford to me, a 6-6 PG who had to shoot 3's all night against a 5-11 pg in tyrone Lue.

But i could be wrong Lue is like what 6-1? Cudos.


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Dude how the heck is Crawford having a better season then he did in chicago, hes pretty much the exact same Crawford no improvement whatsoever. Good at taking unbalanced crazy looking shots is a plus?!


41% from the field and 40% from 3 so while everyone is complaining hes shooting 3's hes making them at a much better percentage .

last year he shot 38% and 31% respectfully


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I can't be the only bulls fan who wasn't suprised by what happened. I knew somehow Crawford would get the ball and hit some crazy *** shot. He had so many shots like that with the bulls.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

Hey,anytime you can shoot close to 50% from the arc,keep on hoisting them till the elbow gives out..Shooting 40% from the 3 is just as good as shooting 60% from the floor..6 of one,half dozen of another


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TRUTHHURTS</b>!


Over the moon, off the sun, through the Eiffel tower...


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truth</b>!
> 
> 
> That is a very unfair statement...JC came to NY with TERRIBLE habits and the Knicks are slowly getting him to shed them..He had/has a terrible shot selection,which is getting better,tends to over dribble and pull up ,and doesnt go to the hole as mucha as he should..Not to mention,has he ever been introduced to a weight room??
> ...


The same NY organization that star is Marbury one of the BEST BASKETBALL MINDS IN THE NBA, the same NY organization that Hired the crazy Isiah Thomas as GM? THe same NY organization that pretty much wants to put together last years Bulls team, showing interest in Curry,Erob, Signed Crawford. If crawford becomes a better player its not because the knicks organization is better then the bulls, this is the same crawford who scored 50 points for the bulls hes got the talent, its up to crawford alone to play at a high level game after game, and from what we have seen so far in NY hes no different STATISTICALLY then last year.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truth</b>!
> Hey,anytime you can shoot close to 50% from the arc,keep on hoisting them till the elbow gives out..Shooting 40% from the 3 is just as good as shooting 60% from the floor..6 of one,half dozen of another


Heck if that was true, i would have to belive that steve kerr is a career 60% shooter overall.


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> No it looks like let me launch this ball and hope i get fouled, hey wait i made it let me run half court and almost sock some old fat white guy in the chops. Same old Crawford to me, a 6-6 PG who had to shoot 3's all night against a 5-11 pg in tyrone Lue.
> ...


Lue actually plays pg and he had Marbury on him most of the game Crawford had JJ on him until that last basket so go figure .

The last time the Bulls won a regular season game was when jamal had 50 and now we are over analyzing a game winner ?

I highly doubt anyone would over analyze this much if Tommie Smith came off the IR and and headbutted the ball into the basket for 3 for a game winner tomorrow night as long as we got the win.

Thats the thing Jamal is winning and we are not so how sad are we when 3 wins is like a lifetime away. :no:


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> Same old Crawford to me, a 6-6 PG who had to shoot 3's all night against a 5-11 pg in tyrone Lue.
> 
> But i could be wrong Lue is like what 6-1? Cudos.


It's Jim Jackson...










Still, like Curry's good game...it's just one shot, one game. Never a good thing to *need* a miracle like this was...


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

When your hot from the 3 point line its pretty hard to defend. I dont think anybody is taking anything away from Crawfords game, but its no big surprise that the guy still just jacks up shots like crazy.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TRUTHHURTS</b>!
> 
> 
> Thats the thing Jamal is winning


:jump: 
:rotf:
:jump:


Thats not winning. He wasn't even defended.


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> It's Jim Jackson...
> ...


Well JJ got the Bulls last year in Houston if I remember correctly but yes its only one game, one win to be exact but who here isnt hoping the Bulls can get that ONE win .


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> Heck if that was true, i would have to belive that steve kerr is a career 60% shooter overall.


Dude,its simple math....

The ratio between a 3 point shot and a 2 point shot is 3/2 or 1.5

If a guy shoots 40 percent from 3 point land,thats the equivalant of shooting 60 percent from 2 point land...

Or more simply if i take 10 3 point shoys and make 4,i score 12 points

if i take 10 2 point shots and make 6,i also score 12

So any time someone shoots 5 for 11 from behind the arc,hes on fire


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truth</b>!
> So any time someone shoots 5 for 11 from behind the arc,hes on fire


Or just a lucky game.


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## mizenkay (Dec 29, 2003)

repeat after me.

one nation
under sports center
for highlights we crave.

amen.







that was one freakin' lucky shot. 


:laugh:


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Or just a lucky game.


Cmon now weve seen jamal do this before regardless of whether he does it every game he still does it.

Who can forget what Jamal was doing against NO las season when hit the shot at the end and then mashburn comes back to win it for No on a buzzer beater .


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Or just a lucky game.


seeing as he was shooting over 40% from 3 in the 6 games prior that would make it ...7 lucky games?

it only raised his 3 pt% from .409 to .421...its obvious this was no fluke, he just isn't a bull anymore so he is getting better looks.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> If crawford becomes a better player its not because the knicks organization is better then the bulls, this is the same crawford who scored 50 points for the bulls hes got the talent, its up to crawford alone to play at a high level game after game



So you believe coaching and management,as well as conditioning have no effect on a players performance??

Sorry,Jamal has some horrible flaws in hisame that he developed in Chicago...As you well know,his shot selection is horrible,and it appears he never has seen a weight in his life...it could be immaturity,but it could very well be bulls management judging by the coaching turnover and series of trades which have yet to pay off..Someone has th be held accountable


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TRUTHHURTS</b>!
> 
> 
> Cmon now weve seen jamal do this before regardless of whether he does it every game he still does it.
> ...


Ok...but what was our record?


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>happygrinch</b>!
> 
> its obvious this was no fluke


Why doesn't he shoot all of his three pointers like that then...bank and all?


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> Ok...but what was our record?


it had to be better than our record now.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> it only raised his 3 pt% from .409 to .421...its obvious this was no fluke, he just isn't a bull anymore so he is getting better looks.


exactly..JC is so much better when he gets the open look from marbury kicking it out and JC shooting without ever putting it on the floor..he is at his "worst" after a series of crossovers,and winds up shooting an off balance fadeaway from 25..He can definitely stroke it when he squares up and get the open look..


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> Why doesn't he shoot all of his three pointers like that then...bank and all?


he isn't trying to draw the foul in most of them , like he was on the game winner so there was no double clutch , but seeing how before the shot he was 4 for 10 from deep , its safe to say he was shooting good from out there already.

4-10 to 5-11 , not that big a difference.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truth</b>!
> Sorry,Jamal has some horrible flaws in his game that he  never bothered to correct in Chicago...


Corrected.


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> Ok...but what was our record?


Well we were 23-59 

Weve lost games hes played well in in the 4th 

Wve won games hes played well in the 4th 

Weve lost games because he played bad in the 4th 


So weve seen him do these things so to say its some type of one time thing for him is just ridiculous.Even last year it was well known that jamal at the end of quarters had a knack for hitting buzzer beaters .


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>happygrinch</b>!
> 
> 
> it had to be better than our record now.


 

The season is six games old.


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So when do wins and losses actualy start counting then ? :laugh:


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TRUTHHURTS</b>!
> .Even last year it was well known that jamal at the end of quarters had a knack for hitting buzzer beaters .


He wasn't defended, like tonight. In fact, they were usually focusing on the best player on the team...not his sidekick. Again...the situation he's in in NY.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


plenty long enough to get at least 1 win dont you think

last year's bulls had 3 wins after 7 games(game 7 was against the hornets i believe) and 4 after 9 games.

i somehow doubt we'll be matching it.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> He wasn't defended, like tonight. In fact, they were usually focusing on the best player on the team...not his sidekick. Again...the situation he's in in NY.


so why didn't kirk hit more game winners last season or anyone else, this year?


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>happygrinch</b>!
> last year's bulls had 3 wins after 7 games(


Who was on the roster?


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>happygrinch</b>!
> 
> 
> so why didn't kirk hit more game winners last season or anyone else, this year?


This is a Jamal thread.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> Sorry,Jamal has some horrible flaws in his game that he never bothered to correct in Chicago...


Well,you cant let the inmates run the asylum...

Its up to the coaches and the players..marbury publicly said after the Spurs loss that we have players breaking off plays and taking BAD shots....

One was TT and the other JC...


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> Who was on the roster?


thats a question for our GM.

but a question for you is since you believe the bulls are better without crawford , how do you explain the bulls this season?


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> He wasn't defended, like tonight. In fact, they were usually focusing on the best player on the team...not his sidekick. Again...the situation he's in in NY.


I think the raps were defending him down the stretch in fact I think they tried just about everyone the last game we playedt he raps at home . 

What about the knick game when he makes the the shot from the corner to seal it ?

Did all his plays in the 4th quarters lead to wins? No but he made plays to put us in position to win more than once but we just couldnt pull it out?

So now no one defended him and he hes playing with Marbury so it doesnt count ? :laugh:

I thought I saw JVG tell everyone to let him shoot and then I saw Marbury hanging from the rim and forcing the ball off the glass into the basket .the stuff they do for jamal


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>happygrinch</b>!
> 
> 
> thats a question for our GM.
> ...



This is a Jamal thread.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> This is a Jamal thread.


sure it is , but you didn't answer my question , the bulls have had chance to win a game on a final shot (game 1 vs. the nets)

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?gameId=241105004&period=4

the difference ?

crawford made his 26 fter , and kirk missed his. the result is the bulls lost and the knicks won.

end of story


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>happygrinch</b>!
> crawford made his 26 fter , and kirk missed his.


You _really_ think this is due to a difference in skill level?


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## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> You _really_ think this is due to a difference in skill level?


I don't.

However, the denial on this board is bordering on psychotic. Jamal was the best player on the Bulls last season even before he beat the Rockets. All I keep reading is luck this, fluke that...they just beat a WC playoff team on the road, who is willing to wager the Bulls will do the same this season? 

I am taking all comers!


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>MemphisX</b>!
> 
> they just beat a WC playoff team on the road, who is willing to wager the Bulls will do the same this season?
> 
> I am taking all comers!


I'll wager that. 

It's not as impossible as you make it out to be, they have a bad night, we have a good one. That can equal a victory. It has happened before, it will happen again.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

Hate to give props to not one, but two players I am not particularly fond of, but that shot was positively Reggie-esque.


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## PC Load Letter (Jun 29, 2002)

That was a great shot. I'm happy for Jamal. He never really had the chance to take a game-winning shot in his career up til now. Good for him.

Sidenote: How could the Rockets possibly let someone even get the ball behind the 3-point line? I know Thomas set a pick on Jackson, but you just can't let your guy catch it there, period. That's like something we would do to lose a game. The Rockets aren't looking too good and Van Gundy is already looking burnt out. He may not get through the season.


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

Jamal Crawford is Jamal Crawford. He's the same player as a Knick that he was as a Bull, warts and all. He doesn't "play the right way," but he can contribute good things to a team that's trying to win basketball games.

The current Bulls would be a much better team with Crawford. He is probably better than any one or two on our roster.

I have yet to read/hear/see a satisfactory/compelling reason explaining why we couldn't keep Crawford. His contract demands were not outrageous, and he would have been eminently tradeable once his BYC expired.

Complaining about and trying to diminish Crawford's game-winner -- he was leaning, he used glass, he was too open, his jersey was slightly untucked in the back -- comes off as small-minded and sore-loserish. He played a terrific, under control 4th quarter and made (who cares how?) a clutch buzzer-beating 3 to defeat a quality opponent on the road. Not a lot to nitpick there imo.

Would we have made a playoff run this year with Crawford in the fold? Probably not. But from where I sit, 34 wins is better than 19 wins. A 2-4 start would be better than an 0-6 start. And so on.


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

I'd be relatively happy to have to go to the Knicks board to talk about him


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> When a chance to put his practice to use arose Thursday night, Crawford stuck his head in the huddle and asked New York Knicks coach Lenny Wilkens for the final shot.
> 
> "I honestly practice those kinds of shots all the time," Crawford said. "I felt comfortable. I told coach I could knock it down."
> 
> ...



He asked for the ball at the end and made the shot goood for him 

Now back to the Bulls as I hope we have something like that to talk about tonight regarding them .


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>MemphisX</b>!
> 
> Jamal was the best player on the Bulls last season


Not according to his coaches and teammates...including Jamal.



> they just beat a WC playoff team on the road


One thats lost 4 of it's last 5...and that on a hail mary at the buzzer.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

Jamal IS playing differently in NY, he still has some of the old failings but he is driving the lane more, playing better defense, and generally just shooting the ball better (probably because he has actual NBA players around him). I said when he was traded that Crawford would look a lot better on a different team and so far he is proving that. The game winner last night was just icing on the cake. His stats so far this year are very nice and his floorgame is nice and improving. He still needs to work on shot selection, needs to keep working defensively and add some strength but this guy is a SERIOUS player. A guy that the Bulls could have on their roster right now if they had only been willing to cut a check. I can't believe so many people apparently prefer having Pike & Gordon over Crawford. At least he is getting love in NY where they play him as much as possible. That team is CLEARLY Marbury AND Crawfords IMO. 

And the people who keep dumping on Crawford....man...I just don't get it, did he sleep with your girlfriends or something? Clearly he's doing good and you can say what ya like but people can watch the games themselves and read the boxscores too. Basically your not fooling anyone anymore except yourselves.

All I know is that if Jamal was still on the Bulls we would probably be .500 or better by now.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ScottMay</b>!
> Jamal Crawford is Jamal Crawford. He's the same player as a Knick that he was as a Bull, warts and all. He doesn't "play the right way," but he can contribute good things to a team that's trying to win basketball games.





> The current Bulls would be a much better team with Crawford.


Here we go our seperate ways. For many reasons, and not all of them on court...Jamals best move was leaving Chicago. Even if he had been signed by the Bulls, he would have been on the block.



> Complaining about and trying to diminish Crawford's game-winner -- he was leaning, he used glass, he was too open, his jersey was slightly untucked in the back -- comes off as small-minded and sore-loserish.


It was a hail mary that had as much, if not more chance of not going in as it did of going in. Is that true or false?



> Would we have made a playoff run this year with Crawford in the fold? Probably not.


Then whats this about "much" improved? :laugh:


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> I'd be relatively happy to have to go to the Knicks board to talk about him





> Originally posted by <b>TRUTHHURTS</b>!
> Now back to the Bulls as I hope we have something like that to talk about tonight regarding them .


I agree. Back to the Bulls...


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> Jamal IS playing differently in NY, he still has some of the old failings but he is driving the lane more, playing better defense, and generally just shooting the ball better (probably because he has actual NBA players around him).


I totally disagree. The most notably different thing is that Jamal just doesn't have to force as many shots because there's no one else willing or able to take them, as was the case here. He's trying like hell to rein in some of his crazy shots and passes, which, ironically, almost makes him a less effective player. This is why I think he should have gone to a team that was willing to give him the ball and let him run with it. Too often now I see Jamal floating around the perimeter, not willing to shoot or drive.

Bottom line: any aggregate improvement in Jamal's game has a lot more to do with his surroundings than any refinement in his game. I hate the way the Knicks are made up, but they're a veteran team, they for the most part take care of the ball (or, alternatively, don't have turnover machines like Curry and Chandler), and they have a couple guys who can shoot.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ScottMay</b>!
> 
> 
> I totally disagree. The most notably different thing is that Jamal just doesn't have to force as many shots because there's no one else willing or able to take them, as was the case here. He's trying like hell to rein in some of his crazy shots and passes, which, ironically, almost makes him a less effective player. This is why I think he should have gone to a team that was willing to give him the ball and let him run with it. Too often now I see Jamal floating around the perimeter, not willing to shoot or drive.
> ...


I've seen every Knick game thus far and you make a good point about the personell he is playing with allowing him to "reign it in" a little bit. BUt he HAS been driving the lane more than he did in Chicago. He has blocked a couple of big shots, is playing better defensively and stealing the ball more.


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> It was a hail mary that had as much, if not more chance of not going in as it did of going in. Is that true or false?


I'm willing to give Jamal the benefit of the doubt. Even at the peak of my dislike for the way he plays, the one thing I've always had to give him is that he has a crazy knack for buzzer-beaters, especially half-court and full-court heaves. This was not one of those, and it was from a distance you'd expect him NOT to bank it in, but who the hell cares! It went in, bottom line.



> Then whats this about "much" improved? :laugh:


That's smallball thinking on your part. If after this six-year beatdown you can't see the importance of fighting and scratching and clawing to as many wins as you can get in a given season, and how important that fight is to your young developing core, then smallball's what you get. 

The same thing is going to happen to Kirk that happened to Jamal -- just wait and see.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ScottMay</b>!
> That's smallball thinking on your part.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

You know...Crawford should blow up that picture, frame it, send it to Reinsdorf with a caption under it, "won that"


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

You guys are harsh..JC is playing good ball,and if he continues to play under control,develop some strength,he will be an all star...

Whats more interesting to me,and i know its a Bulls board,but no body gets On Tmac the way you guys get on Jamal..

Tmac appears to have been afflicted with the same mental illness that his cousin Vince suffers from

Fear of Driving....

Tmac makes JC's shot selection look like Jerry Wests


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

*jamal*

the bulls are trash and jamal is beginning his ascent to stardom.

he's on a good team, with good players, and he's performing well.

41% FG
42% from 3
2 steals a game
3.7 assists
1.7 TOs

still some flaws.. but he's getting better... and winning games for a real organization.

meanwhile, we're talking about trading perhaps another future all-star for ?able returns.

same old, same old.... good for the ex-bulls.


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## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Pay Ton</b>!
> 
> 
> I'll wager that.
> ...


No it is not impossible but before you get up to make a bet, I will warn you that the Bulls have not won a game on the West coast since MJ retired.


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## Sith (Oct 20, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>MemphisX</b>!
> 
> 
> No it is not impossible but before you get up to make a bet, I will warn you that the Bulls have not won a game on the West coast since MJ retired.


what was the bulls recors on that annual nov west coast trip during the 96-98? i just wanna see if those MJ lead bulls actually won more games in that west coast alone than what we will win this season.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> Jamal beats the Rockets by 1 with a last second 3 point banker. He calls it the biggest shot of his career so far in the postgame interview.
> 
> Good for him.


You know, I did wish Jamal well when he first left. But after hearing his constant bashing of the Bulls since then, I really want to see him fall flat on his face in NY.


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>yodurk</b>!
> 
> 
> You know, I did wish Jamal well when he first left. But after hearing his constant bashing of the Bulls since then, I really want to see him fall flat on his face in NY.


That's not going to happen though. Its like wishing that the sun does not rise tomorrow.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>yodurk</b>!
> 
> 
> You know, I did wish Jamal well when he first left. But after hearing his constant bashing of the Bulls since then, I really want to see him fall flat on his face in NY.


He really HASN'T bashed the Bulls. The closest he has come is saying that he "feels like he is in the NBA now" and his comments about Curry but everything he has said has been relatively mild.


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## johnston797 (May 29, 2002)

*Re: jamal*



> Originally posted by <b>kukoc4ever</b>!
> jamal is beginning his ascent to stardom.


What an impact player.....

Knicks were 39 & 43 last year.


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## giusd (Apr 17, 2003)

It was a great shot by JC but i hate too break up the JC thing but he was benched with 4 minutes to go in the 3rd quarter. He was 3 for 6 in the first half and then made his first three shots in the second half. By the 8 minute point he had missed his last 7 shots and was getting beat on D and Lenny pulled him for Penny Hardway. When he came back in he missed his first shot before his game beating 3 pointer.

I dont want to hear all this how i hate JC just because i report his night. Much like JC he had a really great 1st half. In the second half he was 4 for 12. No FT. As for his year i will state this. From what i see he is playing no differently than last year for the most part. He does look more comfortable and is not rushing as much and i think he matches up with marbery very well.

However, he is still only shoting around 40% (however much improved 3 point %), is getting to the FT line only 1.7 times per game (last year it was 3 time per game), and is still playing soft D. Now i think he has improved a little since last year but pretty much the same game. Wildly inconsistent. Looks like an alstar in one part of the game and totally lost in other parts.

One last thing. With TT and SM when you add in JC this team is as soft as the come and Thomas is nuts if he thinks this team is going anywhere. They will be lucky to make the playoffs and if so they are out in the first round in 3 stright.

davdi


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>giusd</b>!
> 
> 
> One last thing. With TT and SM when you add in JC this team is as soft as the come and Thomas is nuts if he thinks this team is going anywhere. They will be lucky to make the playoffs and if so they are out in the first round in 3 stright.


John Paxson may never achieve what you describe above.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> You know...Crawford should blow up that picture, frame it, send it to Reinsdorf with a caption under it, "won that"


and in all fainess to JR, he should send Jamal captions for every terrible game he plays. I wonder who will pay more postage? 

Good for Jamal. But remember he won a game for us last year. I am happy for him but he is far from being a star.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> One last thing. With TT and SM when you add in JC this team is as soft as the come and Thomas is nuts if he thinks this team is going anywhere. They will be lucky to make the playoffs and if so they are out in the first round in 3 stright.


Stephon Marbury soft?????Surely you jest..

TT is about to be introduced to his new girlfriend ...the bench...

And,Zeke is not a miracle worker..He is trying to right laydens wrongs,something you should be all too familair with..The Camby,Nene trade for McKnee killed us...

Jamal,Ariza,Sweetney and Marbury are a solid core..Cap relief will come in two years as TT,H20,Penny and Naz come off the books..

Lucky to make the playoffs??? have you looked at your record and the direction your team is headed???


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>giusd</b>!
> It was a great shot by JC but i hate too break up the JC thing but he was benched with 4 minutes to go in the 3rd quarter. He was 3 for 6 in the first half and then made his first three shots in the second half. By the 8 minute point he had missed his last 7 shots and was getting beat on D and Lenny pulled him for Penny Hardway. When he came back in he missed his first shot before his game beating 3 pointer.
> 
> I dont want to hear all this how i hate JC just because i report his night. Much like JC he had a really great 1st half. In the second half he was 4 for 12. No FT. As for his year i will state this. From what i see he is playing no differently than last year for the most part. He does look more comfortable and is not rushing as much and i think he matches up with marbery very well.
> ...


i dont think JC was benched , he came out the game and was put back in after a rest , which he did need , JJ was giving him some trouble.

Tim Thomas was benched, when he left at an earleir point in the 3rd quarter he did not returned, and Wilkens said as much after the game.

and crawford was and is a hot and cold player but the bottom line is he had a good game taking shooting out the equation for a moment he had 8 assists from the 2 guard spot, 5 boards and 2 steals, there would have been no need to bench him just because he was doing other things out there, he came back on the court after the knicks run had ended and provided another spark which did in fact help them win.

i agree the team is soft for the most part , tim thomas is soft, marbury is not, i dont think JC is , because he has heart , he has shown the ability to put a dagger in a team , and not just last night asking for and then making a big shot on a team that if it were fully healthy he would probably not even be on the court, because of allan houston, that he got the shot shows alot of what he thinks of himself and what the knicks think of him.

TT is not a player that should be worried about , he is being put more on the back burner by ariza every day , that kid is going to be good, very good as soon as he gets a jumpshot, and i'm not even talking about a good one just good enough , a decent level J, and he'll start for the next 15 years, tim thomas may not even be starting by the end of the season ,


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: jamal*



> Originally posted by <b>kukoc4ever</b>!
> the bulls are trash and jamal is beginning his ascent to stardom.
> 42% from 3


If you think hes gonna average that from the 3 point line then your smoking something, hes hot from the 3 right now, but thats gonna come down considerably.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truth</b>!
> 
> 
> Stephon Marbury soft?????Surely you jest..
> ...


I dont think we ever said the bulls would make the playoffs, the Knicks are going nowhere either, same could be said for the bulls, were gonna lose some contracts in the next couple of years and were gonna have alot of cap space, calling Jamal,Ariza,and sweetney is not a solid core. You have Jamal who shoots the ball from anywhere on the court, Sweetney cant play a full game without fouling out or getting exhausted and Ariza looks ok but we havent seen what he can do in a full game.


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## rwj333 (Aug 10, 2002)

An excerpt of Steve Kerr's article on the Knicks http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=sk-knicksuptemp1119&prov=yhoo&type=lgns



> Since taking over as president of the New York Knicks last December, Isiah Thomas has completely revamped the roster through a series of bold trades. Thomas' moves have made New York younger, quicker and more athletic, but after a slow 3-4 start this season, the question is: Will they be better?
> 
> The number one issue facing Lenny Wilkens is his team's defense – or lack thereof.
> 
> ...


...


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>giusd</b>!
> It was a great shot by JC but i hate too break up the JC thing but he was benched with 4 minutes to go in the 3rd quarter. He was 3 for 6 in the first half and then made his first three shots in the second half. By the 8 minute point he had missed his last 7 shots and was getting beat on D and Lenny pulled him for Penny Hardway. When he came back in he missed his first shot before his game beating 3 pointer.
> 
> I dont want to hear all this how i hate JC just because i report his night. Much like JC he had a really great 1st half. In the second half he was 4 for 12. No FT. As for his year i will state this. From what i see he is playing no differently than last year for the most part. He does look more comfortable and is not rushing as much and i think he matches up with marbery very well.
> ...


Good observations, and well said. The Bulls knew what they were losing in that sign-and-trade. Crawford is doing mostly the same things as last year. Personally I'm not worried about Crawford turning into an all-star with the Knicks, and coming back to haunt us. I fail to see how he will get any better than he is with his jump-shooting style of play. You won't be a true star in this league as a jumpshooter unless your name is Peja or Ray Allen, and even those guys mix it up a bit. Jamal doesn't. He has a sick handle, but he doesn't use it to get to the hole; he only uses it to free up space for long jumpers.


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## DARULA (Nov 19, 2004)

Other than the shot I wasnt impressed.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

If you see what Jamal has done in NYC, there is no way that anyone can tell me that he wouldnt be either the best player on the Bulls, or second best player after Luol Deng.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>giusd</b>!
> It was a great shot by JC but i hate too break up the JC thing but he was benched with 4 minutes to go in the 3rd quarter. He was 3 for 6 in the first half and then made his first three shots in the second half. By the 8 minute point he had missed his last 7 shots and was getting beat on D and Lenny pulled him for Penny Hardway. When he came back in he missed his first shot before his game beating 3 pointer.
> 
> I dont want to hear all this how i hate JC just because i report his night. Much like JC he had a really great 1st half. In the second half he was 4 for 12. No FT. As for his year i will state this. From what i see he is playing no differently than last year for the most part. He does look more comfortable and is not rushing as much and i think he matches up with marbery very well.
> ...


Thanks.


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

i started the thread to talk about the shot. i should have known better,


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

the bulls would be better off with jamal crawford on the team.

good luck converting the valuable cap relief into something better. i hope they can.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>kukoc4ever</b>!
> the bulls would be better off with jamal crawford on the team.


Nah...


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> 
> 
> Nah...


So you think jamal on the floor is a negative?

really?


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>giusd</b>!
> It was a great shot by JC but i hate too break up the JC thing but he was benched with 4 minutes to go in the 3rd quarter. He was 3 for 6 in the first half and then made his first three shots in the second half. By the 8 minute point he had missed his last 7 shots and was getting beat on D and Lenny pulled him for Penny Hardway. When he came back in he missed his first shot before his game beating 3 pointer.


I hate to break up the inaccuracies of this post but jamal was subbed out at 1:40 secs in the 3rd quarter which is his usually rest time as he normally comes back in for marbury at the 11-10 minute mark of the 4th .he missed shots but 3 of them were driving shots in which couldve gotten a foul call.Did you see the drive in which there was a ton of contact he then grabbed his own rebound inside with the trees only to have Deke send it back out ?
when he came back in he missed his first 2 shots shot but had 4 assists , 2 huge steals and the game winner and thats all within the last 6 minutes of the game .



> I dont want to hear all this how i hate JC just because i report his night. Much like JC he had a really great 1st half. In the second half he was 4 for 12. No FT. As for his year i will state this. From what i see he is playing no differently than last year for the most part. He does look more comfortable and is not rushing as much and i think he matches up with marbery very well.


The shots he missed are not nearly as important as teh kind of shots he missed these were not dribble,dribble off balanced 3's they were drives to the baskets and spot up 3's 



> However, he is still only shoting around 40% (however much improved 3 point %), is getting to the FT line only 1.7 times per game (last year it was 3 time per game), and is still playing soft D. Now i think he has improved a little since last year but pretty much the same game. Wildly inconsistent. Looks like an alstar in one part of the game and totally lost in other parts.


No matter how you add it up his fg% is better than last year and while he hasnt been getting the ft's hes has been getting in the lane much more than last year.I dont now if you can say wildly inconsistent still because you have a god idea what you will get out of him given the minutes .



> One last thing. With TT and SM when you add in JC this team is as soft as the come and Thomas is nuts if he thinks this team is going anywhere. They will be lucky to make the playoffs and if so they are out in the first round in 3 stright.
> 
> davdi


They are soft compared to who ?the pistons ?Pacers ?everyone is when matched up against them bu tI find it very humorous Bulls fans callinga team that came back from 11 down in the 4th against a west playoff team on the road while our own Bulls who blew a 20+ lead to a non playoff team at home is condered gritty,hustlers :laugh:


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

> valuable cap relief


Is that before or after Curry litterally and figuaratively eats his way into the cap space with his 80 million$ extension....


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TRUTHHURTS</b>!
> 
> They are soft compared to who ?the pistons ?Pacers ?everyone is when matched up against them bu tI find it very humorous Bulls fans callinga team that came back from 11 down in the 4th against a west playoff team on the road while our own Bulls who blew a 20+ lead to a non playoff team at home is condered gritty,hustlers :laugh:


TRUTH.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>kukoc4ever</b>!
> 
> 
> So you think jamal on the floor is a negative?
> ...


http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?postid=1655147#post1655147


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>kukoc4ever</b>!
> 
> 
> TRUTH.


Just don't forget that that "Western Conference Playoff Team" has lost 4 of it's last 5 and that there are rumblings the coach won't make it through the season.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

He definetly wont make it thru the season if McGrady keeps on pulling up from 25 and hoisting 3's


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>kukoc4ever</b>!
> the bulls would be better off with jamal crawford on the team.
> 
> good luck converting the valuable cap relief into something better. i hope they can.


There's no doubting that the Bulls would be a slightly better team with Jamal here. The thing is, his presence just wasn't significant enough to justify locking him down for 6 years at big dollars. When you're a losing team, you're just asking for trouble down the road when you commit big long-term deals to your players. There are very few exceptions to this rule. 

Look at Golden State for example. They are a losing team, yet they commit big lengthy contracts to J-Rich, Murphy, and Foyle. Do you really think those guys will make the Warriors winners? Not without some help they won't, but problem is, the Warriors have now screwed themselves out of ANY financial flexibility for the next 6 years. I hope they have fun being bad-to-mediocre for the next 6 years, waiting for those contracts to expire. At least the Bulls have a chance to turn it around within a year or two. A little luck on the free agent market can go a really long way.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

The Bulls are in a similar situation to the Suns when they had marbury,except management saw the handwriting on the wall,and realised they had to reverse directions to be an elite team..Translation..Get rid of Stephon Marbury and Penny and clear cap space..

You guys have a very talented team on paper,but its not translating into wins..Curry has made it clear..He wants max money...Once you do that you are the Suns with Marbury..A possible playoff team,but no more

And I am being kind to your current team


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>yodurk</b>!
> 
> 
> There's no doubting that the Bulls would be a slightly better team with Jamal here. The thing is, his presence just wasn't significant enough to justify locking him down for 6 years at big dollars. When you're a losing team, you're just asking for trouble down the road when you commit big long-term deals to your players. There are very few exceptions to this rule.
> ...


I think you are mistaken. Jamal's contract is VERY reasonable given the way contracts go in the NBA. I guess fans have just been hypnotized by Chicago management into thinking it's OK to not pay your leading scorer and let him walk. They have some of you guys conditioned like pavlovian dogs...as soon as the word CONTRACT comes up someone immediately says "luxury tax", "cap flexibility" etc...


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> 
> 
> I think you are mistaken. Jamal's contract is VERY reasonable given the way contracts go in the NBA. I guess fans have just been hypnotized by Chicago management into thinking it's OK to not pay your leading scorer and let him walk. They have some of you guys conditioned like pavlovian dogs...as soon as the word CONTRACT comes up someone immediately says "luxury tax", "cap flexibility" etc...


Pavlovian dogs, eh? So does that mean the contract is the meat, and cap space is the salivation? Or is the contract the bell, cap space is the meat, and luxury tax is the salivation? :grinning:


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truth</b>!
> The Bulls are in a similar situation to the Suns when they had marbury,except management saw the handwriting on the wall,and realised they had to reverse directions to be an elite team..Translation..Get rid of Stephon Marbury and Penny and clear cap space..
> 
> You guys have a very talented team on paper,but its not translating into wins..Curry has made it clear..He wants max money...Once you do that you are the Suns with Marbury..A possible playoff team,but no more
> ...


Well said. The Suns successfully did what the Bulls are/should be trying to do. I'm not hypnotized by the concept of having cap space, but I do acknowledge that our cap space can land us a higher-caliber player than Crawford. It's a risk, but risks are part of this business. It's not like Jamal was gonna lead this team to the playoffs from the looks of things.


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## giusd (Apr 17, 2003)

rlucus,

Dont get me wrong i would have preferred if paxson had resigned JC and i think overall we would be better off with him. Not to mention we have zero SG's on this team. But i still think my post about his play is right and those in the past.

He is play somewhat better than last year, he matches up well with marbury, and he is not rushing his game as much. On the other hand, still inconsistent, needs to improve his shot selection, drive to the hoop more, and play better D.

I also hate to say this but for the first time i also think Curry is history with the Bulls and that really upsets me. He is a chicago kid, and by any defination a nice and decent young man. For example, you never hear about him getting into trouble in town. But i hear he is way in debt, he looks very unhappy playing bball, and his game is getting worse. 

And i am sick of people blaming everyone else but eddy for this. He is a man and i just wish he would start acting like it. I see such great things for him and i just dont understand what the problem is. He sould be kicking ***. Maybe curry for Nene is a good idea. Lately i have been think EC wishes he was anywhere but in chicago. BTW how do you get several million dollars in debt when you make 6 mill per year?

david


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>MemphisX</b>!
> 
> 
> No it is not impossible but before you get up to make a bet, I will warn you that the Bulls have not won a game on the West coast since MJ retired.


Bump. 

Yeah I'll still bet you. You decide the bet.

Also, I think you mean they have not won a game on the west coast *trip*. Because I know for sure that they won games on the west coast since MJ retired, just not on their "circus" road trip.


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