# Udonis Haslem to meet with Cavs!



## Miamiballer2k5 (Jun 29, 2005)

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sports/basketball/12092112.htm



> The Cleveland Cavaliers missed out on top free agents Ray Allen and Michael Redd, so their immediate plans now include courting Heat free agent Udonis Haslem.
> 
> Sources indicate the Cavaliers are interested in setting up a meeting with Haslem to convince the third-year forward he can be part of the team's future, and they could be prepared to offer Haslem more than the five-year, $33 million deal the Heat can offer.
> 
> ...


Udonis has previously said he would take less money to remain with the Heat and I hope that is the case. Also why do the Cavaliers want Udonis when they have Drew Gooden? Both are pure Power Forwards who can't play C or SF. It will be interesting to see what happens.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

If Haslem makes the team, Gooden is either gone or sent to the second unit.

A possible scenario:

C - Ilgauskas/Varejao 
PF - Haslem/Gooden 
SF - LeBron/Jackson 
SG - Hughes/Pavlovic 
PG - Saras/Snow


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## Tersk (Apr 9, 2004)

Is Haslem really a better starter than Gooden?


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## Spudd (Jun 20, 2004)

I think this is a bad move by the cavs. Gooden although inconsistent i believe is on par if not better than haslem, and also with alot greater potential. Its a waste to have gooden or haslem on the bench. Although the cavs have the money, it sort of jams up our power forward spot, not a good idea to do when it will be 3 young players. 
This could also point to varajeo playing centre in the future. The only big positive i see out of signing haslem is that we may be able to get something in return for trading gooden.


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## MJG (Jun 29, 2003)

With Gooden and Varajeo already on the roster, I don't see what this really adds to the team. He's a solid player, but I'm sure the money would be better spent elsewhere.


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## Drk Element (Nov 10, 2004)

Theo! said:


> Is Haslem really a better starter than Gooden?


meh, not really sure imo.


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## hendrix2430 (Mar 21, 2005)

Bad, bad move, if they're actually serious about it.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Gooden is a FA next year so I'm not sure the Cavs are willing to dish big bucks out to him.

The thinking is they want a smarter player to play around the primary scorers in Lebron, Z and Hughes.

Doubt this happens but Gooden has weaknesses that Haslem doesnt and in the long term might be cheaper

But with first priority now a shooter at PG I don't think we'll have money left over for Haslem


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Maybe the Cavs are trying to get the Heat to lose their MLE so they can't get Saras? It's a risk, but it is what the article seems to point to.


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Haslem is better than both Gooden and Anderson. Bringing him in would be great for the frontcourt, starting him with Z. Of course, I'm not an expert on the cap, so signing him might take away the option of re-signing Z to a reasonable contract, I'm not sure. If they can bring in Haslem and still re-sign Z, it should be done without hesitation.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Haslem isn't going to be better then AV.

I haven't seen a guy with the energy and rebounding potential of AV in quit some time. He's also eventually better on the defensive end as he's a good shotblocker


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Word on the rumor mill is that Z will get a 5-6 year deal. That will drive his price down to 8 million a year.

We''ll still have around 7-8 million under the cap and with that the Cavs are going to go after Haslem and Sarunas!!

Don't know what this means with Gooden - trade, 6th man, I'm not sure. His contract definitely is valuable as he can come off the books at the end of the year


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Pioneer10 said:


> Word on the rumor mill is that Z will get a 5-6 year deal. That will drive his price down to 8 million a year.
> 
> *We''ll still have around 7-8 million under the cap and with that the Cavs are going to go after Haslem and Sarunas!!*
> Don't know what this means with Gooden - trade, 6th man, I'm not sure. His contract definitely is valuable as he can come off the books at the end of the year


That would be a great offseason, Hughes+Sarunas+Haslem and Z is alot of talent to add to the team (while weakening conference opponents like Washington and Miami).

The only thing is that means Gooden would have to be traded, he doesn't perform well off the bench and would likely regress in that role. He has value, i'd look to get a quality center prospect 1st (package for Magloire?), then a PG prospect.

We already have the 2/3/4 positions set for years with Hughes/Lebron/AV.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Or maybe Gooden is on the block?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Gooden for a player and a draft pick next year or the year after? Maybe Ferry wants to get back the draft picks Paxson lost?

If those rumors are true then....damn! 

AV will be better than both Haslem and Gooden, and sooner than later. But maybe they think he can be the backup center? If that's the case, then you probably don't even need to trade Drew. Though asking Drew to come off the bench is probably not worth the trouble and dealing him is probably a good idea.


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## Blazer Freak (Jul 11, 2004)

Or couldn't the Cavs be doing this so Gooden can slide over to C and they don't have to pay Z? I'm not saying they should do that, just a scenario.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Gooden play Center?


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## Blazer Freak (Jul 11, 2004)

HKF said:


> Gooden play Center?


  :curse: It was just a scenario...


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## Chalie Boy (Aug 26, 2002)

HKF said:


> Gooden play Center?



:laugh: ROTFFLMMFAO


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

HKF said:


> Gooden play Center?



Haha Ditto. Verejao can play a little center. Drew has enough problems holding down the power forward spot. I think even Drew would laugh his *** off if you told him he was going to replace Z at center. Remember, this is a guy who at times thinks he is a small forward or even guard.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Haha Ditto. Verejao can play a little center. Drew has enough problems holding down the power forward spot. I think even Drew would laugh his *** off if you told him he was going to replace Z at center. Remember, this is a guy who at times thinks he is a small forward or even guard.


Not only that, he said sooner or later a team is going to realize they need to build around him. He must have a chemical imbalance or something, because he believes he's a star.


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## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

Haslem isn't coming to Cleveland, so keep dreaming......

He's Miami born and raised, he wants to come back and we want him back...he said he wants to go to a team who can win a title, and that pretty much drops Cleveland out of contention...he came in with Dwyane, and he said he wants to stay a Heatian for life with him...why would he want to go to a cold, boring city when he lives in his hometown thats a tropical paradise?

#2--You guys don't even deserve to have Haslem mentioned to your team after some of the stupid comments you made. "Varejao is as good as Haslem"??? Are you kidding me? "Gooden is just as good or better"?? Get a clue...Watch a few Heat games next year and let me know if you still think that...atleast I'm seeing alot of Cavs games so I know that Varejao is nothing but a hustler and Gooden has nothing close to Udon's game...


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Shaq_Diesel said:


> Haslem isn't coming to Cleveland, so keep dreaming......
> 
> He's Miami born and raised, he wants to come back and we want him back...he said he wants to go to a team who can win a title, and that pretty much drops Cleveland out of contention...
> 
> #2--You guys don't even deserve to have Haslem mentioned to your team after some of the stupid comments you made. "Varejao is as good as Haslem"??? Are you kidding me? "Gooden is just as good or better"?? Get a clue...Watch a few Heat games next year and let me know if you still think that...atleast I'm seeing alot of Cavs games so I know that Varejao is nothing but a hustler and Gooden has nothing close to Udon's game...



Verejao>Gooden and Haslem
Haslem>Gooden
That's been the general gist. And I agree with it.
And good luck with that loyaty bull****. Money talks. And when the Cavs offer more than the Heat can without giving up the MLE we'll see just how badly Miami wants him and he wants to be with Miami.

And good luck winning that title without Damon Jones or Udonis Haslem. I'm sure Christian Laettner will be a great starting powerforward.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

I am not a big Haslem fan, he seems to hit his open jumpers well but Cleveland doesn't need another PF anyway


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

kamego said:


> I am not a big Haslem fan, he seems to hit his open jumpers well but Cleveland doesn't need another PF anyway


Unless they are trading Gooden! And either way, Haslem gives you excellent frontcourt depth. He or Gooden could play the Mcdysses role off the bench. With Verejao playing behind Z.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

I don't think any of those names are as solid as Dice but I understand what your saying. Still would rather see them focus on Z or another center first.


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## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Verejao>Gooden and Haslem
> Haslem>Gooden
> That's been the general gist. And I agree with it.
> And good luck with that loyaty bull****. Money talks. And when the Cavs offer more than the Heat can without giving up the MLE we'll see just how badly Miami wants him and he wants to be with Miami.
> ...


 hahaha....1st you say Varejao is better than Haslem, and then you talk about the Heat's title hopes??? Can the Cavs even make the playoffs?????

I'd love to hear you present some facts about how Varejao is better than Haslem, b/c that should be some entertainment for all of us. If he's better, than why sign Haslem when you have him and Gooden already there? Doesn't really make sense does it? 

Varejao better work hard this summer, b/c he hasn't even came close to touching Udon's level in this league yet....


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Shaq_Diesel said:


> hahaha....1st you say Varejao is better than Haslem, and then you talk about the Heat's title hopes??? Can the Cavs even make the playoffs?????
> 
> I'd love to hear you present some facts about how Varejao is better than Haslem, b/c that should be some entertainment for all of us. If he's better, than why sign Haslem when you have him and Gooden already there? Doesn't really make sense does it?
> 
> Varejao better work hard this summer, b/c he hasn't even came close to touching Udon's level in this league yet....


Learn to read homeskillet. I said Haslem is better than Gooden. But Verejao is better than both. Thus you are getting Haslem I guess to upgrade Gooden's spot.

As far as "facts" that Verejao is better than Haslem. He didn't play enough last year for a fair statistical comparison, but I've watched Verejao play for the Cavs and Brazil. He's much longer than both Gooden and Haslem, and has been talked about as being a possible center down the line. He is a better ball handler than either Haslem or Gooden, and his cuts around the basket are wonderful. He's exceptional at getting himself open under the basket for Lebron's passes. Something Haslem is also good at. He is a really active body, loves to rebound on both the offensive and defensive sides. He's an excellent on the ball shot blocker, and can develop into a wonderful low post defender. He's very quick, much quicker than Haslem. Once he slows down a little, I think you'll see more of his offenisve repetoire. But as it stands he has an excellent touch around the basket, and has shown nice range out to 15 feet.

I see him as a more aggressive JO down the line.

What do you care though? Haslem is like the greatest PF ever, right? But you won't miss him if he leaves, because your team is the Heat--YEAH! WADE IS TEH GOD!!!


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

Tractor Trailer is better then them all  hail to the victors baby lol


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## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Learn to read homeskillet. I said Haslem is better than Gooden. But Verejao is better than both. Thus you are getting Haslem I guess to upgrade Gooden's spot.
> 
> As far as "facts" that Verejao is better than Haslem. He didn't play enough last year for a fair statistical comparison, but I've watched Verejao play for the Cavs and Brazil. He's much longer than both Gooden and Haslem, and has been talked about as being a possible center down the line. He is a better ball handler than either Haslem or Gooden, and his cuts around the basket are wonderful. He's exceptional at getting himself open under the basket for Lebron's passes. Something Haslem is also good at. He is a really active body, loves to rebound on both the offensive and defensive sides. He's an excellent on the ball shot blocker, and can develop into a wonderful low post defender. He's very quick, much quicker than Haslem. Once he slows down a little, I think you'll see more of his offenisve repetoire. But as it stands he has an excellent touch around the basket, and has shown nice range out to 15 feet.
> 
> ...


 yeah...so....Varejao is better than Haslem, but he couldn't get enough minutes on the CAVS to show that? I know he was injured for awhile, but he still wasn't getting a ton of minutes before that. Varejao is good talent, but he's not close to Udonis. You can act like I'm being a homer, but read your posts. If you seriously believe that Udonis is gonna come to Cleveland to be a 6th man, when he can be the starting PF next to Shaq...in his hometown...on a top 2 team in the East with serious title chances...you my friend, are nuts...


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## sMaK (Jun 13, 2002)

Please stay Udonis :sigh:


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## UD40 (May 12, 2005)

I think Udonis will stay(I hope) because he has Miami in his blood. He grew up in MIA, played high school ball in MIA, played college ball in MIA and played pro ball in MIA.


Please stay Udominator!!!


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

Money is a big factor, I would expect him to take the highest offer.


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## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

he said he would accept less money to stay in Miami. Hopefully he stays true to his word and accepts 5/33, the best the heat could offer


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## SamTheMan67 (Jan 4, 2004)

Shaq_Diesel said:


> yeah...so....Varejao is better than Haslem, but he couldn't get enough minutes on the CAVS to show that? I know he was injured for awhile, but he still wasn't getting a ton of minutes before that. Varejao is good talent, but he's not close to Udonis. You can act like I'm being a homer, but read your posts. If you seriously believe that Udonis is gonna come to Cleveland to be a 6th man, when he can be the starting PF next to Shaq...in his hometown...on a top 2 team in the East with serious title chances...you my friend, are nuts...


money talks bro
boozer
hughes
pretty soon damon jones
the lituanian pg

money > loyalty sadly
that being said god i hope we dont sign this dude. hes like a cheap mans boozer


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

I'm not sure what to think of this yet. Gooden has issues but he seems to progress at the end of the year. AV, I thinks, is going to be a better player then both Haslem or Gooden.

Basically if this happens, I'm waiting to see what Ferry can get from Gooden and his nice contract before making judgement.

Overall it would be a bit a of a lateral move but Haslem is a much smarter player then Gooden and his contract demands might be much less then what Gooden would want next year.

Come to think of it I wonder if Mike Brown is behind this. You have to decent basketball IQ to play good D (which Gooden doesn't have) and so maybe he wants a PF who will actually rotate and double team the way he likes


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

SamTheMan67 said:


> money > loyalty sadly
> that being said god i hope we dont sign this dude. hes like a cheap mans boozer


Why do you say sadly? You only have a certain amount of years to play professional sports, before your body can't take anymore. You should always go for the most loot. Once your career is over, you'll never see big dollars again.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

HKF said:


> Why do you say sadly? You only have a certain amount of years to play professional sports, before your body can't take anymore. You should always go for the most loot. Once your career is over, you'll never see big dollars again.



I 100% agree here. Unless you come into the league loaded with millions apon millions, you have to take what you can get while you still can...


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## DWadeistheTruth (Apr 25, 2005)

Shaq_Diesel said:


> hahaha....1st you say Varejao is better than Haslem, and then you talk about the Heat's title hopes??? Can the Cavs even make the playoffs?????
> 
> I'd love to hear you present some facts about how Varejao is better than Haslem, b/c that should be some entertainment for all of us. If he's better, than why sign Haslem when you have him and Gooden already there? Doesn't really make sense does it?
> 
> Varejao better work hard this summer, b/c he hasn't even came close to touching Udon's level in this league yet....


For real like if Cleveland has any shot at the title. Haslem wants to be a winner. I bet you, he rather play with Wade and Shaq, than with Lebron, Hughes, and Z combo. Haslem will stay.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

DWadeistheTruth said:


> For real like if Cleveland has any shot at the title. Haslem wants to be a winner. I bet you, he rather play with Wade and Shaq, than with Lebron, Hughes, and Z combo. Haslem will stay.



Of course if money wasn't a factor he would resign with Miami but money is a factor... He won't turn down being set for life just to play for Miami. If the Heat want him back, they need to ante up.


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## DWadeistheTruth (Apr 25, 2005)

kamego said:


> Of course if money wasn't a factor he would resign with Miami but money is a factor... He won't turn down being set for life just to play for Miami. If the Heat want him back, they need to ante up.


He is still going to get paid, is just the fact, some people always want more. Like aka, Sprewel. Sometimes some players want to get paid, and win. If it means taking a little bit less loot.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

DWadeistheTruth said:


> He is still going to get paid, is just the fact, some people always want more. Like aka, Sprewel. Sometimes some players want to get paid, and win. If it means taking a little bit less loot.


If Miami offers just as much as Cleveland, I am sure he will resign. I won't argue against staying at home and the chance to win but I doubt he would give up money to win when he's a youngster (if it's under a million differance maybe he would take the cut now) If Miami is offering the MLE, I wouldn't think Cleveland would offer more, he should resign


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## Miamiballer2k5 (Jun 29, 2005)

Haslem has said he would take less money to remain in Miami, and if you guys do get Haslem all that means is that the Heat will get an upgrade in the form of Shareef Abdur Raheem.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

wadeshaqeddie said:


> he said he would accept less money to stay in Miami. Hopefully he stays true to his word and accepts 5/33, the best the heat could offer


Can't the Heat offer more if they give up their MLE?


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

Cleveland has actual cap room and could  offer more then the MLE if they wanted too. Miami doesn't have bird rights and can only goto the MLE.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Shaq_Diesel said:


> yeah...so....Varejao is better than Haslem, but he couldn't get enough minutes on the CAVS to show that? I know he was injured for awhile, but he still wasn't getting a ton of minutes before that. Varejao is good talent, but he's not close to Udonis. You can act like I'm being a homer, but read your posts. If you seriously believe that Udonis is gonna come to Cleveland to be a 6th man, when he can be the starting PF next to Shaq...in his hometown...on a top 2 team in the East with serious title chances...you my friend, are nuts...


Udonis didn't have to learn english, deal with a coach who hates rookies, and have a real competitor for the starting power forward spot. There wasn't a lot of competition for the starting Miami power forward spot. Certainly no one as good as Drew Gooden on the Miami bench to start the year.

I'm not saying Haslem isn't good. I'm saying he is good. And it's a good pickup for the Cavs if it happens. You're just a panicked Miami fan seeing his team get looted by the rest of the league after getting its first taste of success. The Cavs are just trying to do whatever they can to be a better team. And Haslem is just trying to do what's best for him. 

Don't you Miami fans have your own board to talk **** on? What's the point of coming to the Cavs board and telling Cavs fans how Haslem is staying in Miami, contrary to what this report implies? Let us discuss the implications of adding Haslem to the Cavs, not the implications of Haslem coming to Cleveland for Miami. You guys are turning this into a Miami Heat thread when you have your own thread on your own board to do that in.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

kamego said:


> Cleveland has actual cap room and could  offer more then the MLE if they wanted too. Miami doesn't have bird rights and can only goto the MLE.


The article says if the Heat renounce their MLE they can offer Haslem more. It's just that the Heat don't want to do that. It seems funny to me that Heat fans talk about Haslem's loyalty when his own team won't go past a certain point to retain him. Who is being loyal to whom? If the Heat really want Haslem, they should let it speak with their dollars, not with empty public sentiments. That's all I'm going to say about it from the Heat prospective.

I think I would prefer the Cavs found a backup center with any money they have left. I mentioned Oberto in another thread. I think the Cavs should drop this Haslem business and go get Oberto to back up Z. And leave the AV DG duo alone for now. Unless Danny does have a trade set up to get something good for Gooden.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

futuristxen said:


> The article says if the Heat renounce their MLE they can offer Haslem more. It's just that the Heat don't want to do that. It seems funny to me that Heat fans talk about Haslem's loyalty when his own team won't go past a certain point to retain him. Who is being loyal to whom? If the Heat really want Haslem, they should let it speak with their dollars, not with empty public sentiments. That's all I'm going to say about it from the Heat prospective.
> 
> I think I would prefer the Cavs found a backup center with any money they have left. I mentioned Oberto in another thread. I think the Cavs should drop this Haslem business and go get Oberto to back up Z. And leave the AV DG duo alone for now. Unless Danny does have a trade set up to get something good for Gooden.


I agree the center postion needs to be dealt with first for Cleveland and Haslem isn't the answer for that, unless a trade is in the works like you said.

If the Heat want him bad enough they will find the way to keep him. loyality is a two way street.


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## Miamiballer2k5 (Jun 29, 2005)

kamego said:


> Cleveland has actual cap room and could  offer more then the MLE if they wanted too. Miami doesn't have bird rights and can only goto the MLE.


The Heat have early bird rights and can sign Haslem with that. But once a team offers more the Heat can still match but they have to forfit there MLE. So even if Haslem got a max (i know its not happening just saying) the Heat could match.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

Sorry about that, I forgot about the early bird rights. So many rules lol


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## Miamiballer2k5 (Jun 29, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> Udonis didn't have to learn english, deal with a coach who hates rookies, and have a real competitor for the starting power forward spot. There wasn't a lot of competition for the starting Miami power forward spot. Certainly no one as good as Drew Gooden on the Miami bench to start the year.
> 
> I'm not saying Haslem isn't good. I'm saying he is good. And it's a good pickup for the Cavs if it happens. You're just a panicked Miami fan seeing his team get looted by the rest of the league after getting its first taste of success. The Cavs are just trying to do whatever they can to be a better team. And Haslem is just trying to do what's best for him.
> 
> Don't you Miami fans have your own board to talk **** on? What's the point of coming to the Cavs board and telling Cavs fans how Haslem is staying in Miami, contrary to what this report implies? Let us discuss the implications of adding Haslem to the Cavs, not the implications of Haslem coming to Cleveland for Miami. You guys are turning this into a Miami Heat thread when you have your own thread on your own board to do that in.


Udonis Haslem is better then AV, you have nothing to say otherwise. You may think AV is better but he has not proved it.

Udonis says he will take less money to stay a Heation, things can change though.

www.sun-sentinel.com/spor...ports-heat 



> MIAMI--Saying he is willing to sign a Heat contract for less than what he might earn on the open market, forward Udonis Haslem expressed optimism he would re-sign with the team.
> 
> Haslem, speaking Wednesday morning on 790 AM The Ticket (WAXY), said Atlanta and Cleveland expressed an interest in offering him a free-agent contract but that he prefers to return to the Heat, which signed the Miami native and University of Florida product after he played a season in France.
> 
> ...


It is pretty funny to see a Cavs fan say we got out first taste of success, where were you at in the 90's when the Heat were winning the Atlantic Divison, including a trip to the Eastern Conference Finals in 1997. You guys were depending on Crack Head Kemp at the time.

Lastly we are free to post anywhere in BBB.net don't act like you run this place.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Miamiballer2k5 said:


> It is pretty funny to see a Cavs fan say we got out first taste of success, where were you at in the 90's when the Heat were winning the Atlantic Divison, including a trip to the Eastern Conference Finals in 1997. You guys were depending on Crack Head Kemp at the time.
> 
> Lastly we are free to post anywhere in BBB.net don't act like you run this place.



Where was I? I was rooting for my favorite team, the Chicago Bulls. You may have heard of them. They won Six Championships in the 90's. Some guys on their team...Jordan and Pippen.

Look up at the rafters the next time you got to a heat game. You've got one of my player's jerseys retired.









Ya like that?


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## DBurks2818 (May 18, 2005)

> "It's looking good," Haslem said of negotiations. "Obviously this is where I want to be."
> 
> The Heat can offer Haslem, 25, a maximum deal of five years at about $33 million. The Heat can match a higher offer from another team if it uses its mid-level exception, _a move it *hopes* to avoid_ as it looks to use that exception on other free agents.


It doesn't say that they won't use part of the MLE on him. It's simply a last resort.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Anyone is free too come and talk in the Cavs forum as longs as it it's about basketball related topics.

Please no trolling and baiting though and keep the talk about basketball. No need to attack any fan bases


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I wonder would Drew could fetch in a trade?
I feel bad for the guy if he is on the block. He's been traded so many times, and I thought he was really liking it with Lebron, it looked like he was finally settling in.

I don't even know if there's a team out there that would want him that would have anything the Cavs really wanted back. There's a ton of PF's in the league right now.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

futuristxen said:


> I wonder would Drew could fetch in a trade?
> I feel bad for the guy if he is on the block. He's been traded so many times, and I thought he was really liking it with Lebron, it looked like he was finally settling in.
> 
> I don't even know if there's a team out there that would want him that would have anything the Cavs really wanted back. There's a ton of PF's in the league right now.


 It's not only his value as a player (his stock significantly improved) but his contract. He's pretty cheap right now and he comes off the book next year if you don't want to keep him.

I simply will hate to waste money on another PF or even Drew when in all likelihood in a few years AV will be the starter without question. For all the Haslem fans out there, we all agree he's a good player and right now he's probably better then AV. But in terms of potential, AV has a lot more then Haslem. He's taller with good length and he's already a great rebounder who runs the floor well. In a few years this guy could be the premier rebounder in the league. I don't know if he'll get there but it's a risk I'm willing to take


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

*RealGM: Wiretap Archives*

*Cleveland Making Run At Haslem*



> _Miami Herald_ - According to the Miami Herald sources indicate the Cleveland Cavaliers are interested in setting up a meeting with Heat free agent Udonis Haslem to convince the third-year forward he can be part of the team's future, and they could be prepared to offer Haslem more than the five-year, $33 million deal the Heat can offer.
> 
> Word among players is that LeBron James has become a Haslem fan after watching him the past two years and playing with him in the Rookie Challenge games the past two All-Star weekends.
> 
> ...


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## DWadeistheTruth (Apr 25, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> The article says if the Heat renounce their MLE they can offer Haslem more. It's just that the Heat don't want to do that. It seems funny to me that Heat fans talk about Haslem's loyalty when his own team won't go past a certain point to retain him. Who is being loyal to whom? If the Heat really want Haslem, they should let it speak with their dollars, not with empty public sentiments. That's all I'm going to say about it from the Heat prospective.
> 
> I think I would prefer the Cavs found a backup center with any money they have left. I mentioned Oberto in another thread. I think the Cavs should drop this Haslem business and go get Oberto to back up Z. And leave the AV DG duo alone for now. Unless Danny does have a trade set up to get something good for Gooden.


It seems like Cleveland wants to go the Larry Hughes way, and way overpay Haslem. He might understand that we are in it, for the long haul. Money sometimes aint everything. Like he said, he might take less to stay in the Heat, his hometown. To win. He understands, that good teams, need all their pieces. We still have to go after Damon, and probably add a extra player.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Pioneer10 said:


> It's not only his value as a player (his stock significantly improved) but his contract. He's pretty cheap right now and he comes off the book next year if you don't want to keep him.
> 
> I simply will hate to waste money on another PF or even Drew when in all likelihood in a few years AV will be the starter without question. For all the Haslem fans out there, we all agree he's a good player and right now he's probably better then AV. But in terms of potential, AV has a lot more then Haslem. He's taller with good length and he's already a great rebounder who runs the floor well. In a few years this guy could be the premier rebounder in the league. I don't know if he'll get there but it's a risk I'm willing to take



Good post. Yeah I've been wondering about that as well. Maybe Ferry is figuring he can get Haslem for cheaper now than he would be able to get Gooden next year, and that Haslem will have an easier time transitioning to the bench when AV is ready? You know Gooden will just pout if he gets put on the bench. He didn't like coming off the bench in Orlando either.

I will admit to being puzzled though, because I thought PF was the one position besides starting small forward that didn't need to be addressed.

Maybe the Cavs really do want to have AV become a center? But then why did they draft Martynas?

It's very puzzling.

Though I mean if you put egos aside, can you really complain about a front court that is: Z, Gooden, AV, and Haslem for next year?

Oh well. So long as Ferry gets Z re-upped and signs Saras I could really give a **** what he does with the rest of the money. I'll be really disapointed if there's no Saras.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

This idea of the heat having to forfiet the MLE is what really interests me.
Could this be a power move by Ferry to free up Saras or Damon Jones?

If Haslem is a top priority by the heat and Ferry knows that, then he could be forcing Pat Riley out of the Saras sweepstakes or be forced to lose his young stud. And for Ferry, even if the Heat call his bluff, he gets to keep Haslem who Lebron likes, and then he can probably still sign either Saras or Damon Jones, whichever the heat don't sign. Or he might have a deal on the table with Gooden getting traded for some shooting point guard we're not even thinking about.

I think the play is either Haslem + Jones or if the heat match for Haslem, then Ferry signs Saras.

If that's the case it's a win-win for the Cavs. As if you got Haslem and Jones, you'd still have Gooden to trade for even more **** down the line. So it'd be like Haslem+Jones+ and whatever Drew Gooden nets you. If they lose they get Saras, the guy they wanted all along and still have money left over to get a backup like Vitaly Potenpko or Jerome James or something.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Maybe the Cavs really do want to have AV become a center? But then why did they draft Martynas?
> 
> It's very puzzling.


AV is closer to becoming a center than Mini Z. For the short-term, AV is the center and Marty the forward.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Marty is closer to being an NBDL cheerleader then an NBA center right now.

We're going to have to wait a long time before he's ready if ever. Still a good pickup but he's a project who might never help us


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

futuristxen said:


> This idea of the heat having to forfiet the MLE is what really interests me.
> Could this be a power move by Ferry to free up Saras or Damon Jones?
> 
> If Haslem is a top priority by the heat and Ferry knows that, then he could be forcing Pat Riley out of the Saras sweepstakes or be forced to lose his young stud. And for Ferry, even if the Heat call his bluff, he gets to keep Haslem who Lebron likes, and then he can probably still sign either Saras or Damon Jones, whichever the heat don't sign. Or he might have a deal on the table with Gooden getting traded for some shooting point guard we're not even thinking about.
> ...


 Interesting gamesmanship by Ferry if this is the case, Future


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## DWadeistheTruth (Apr 25, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> This idea of the heat having to forfiet the MLE is what really interests me.
> Could this be a power move by Ferry to free up Saras or Damon Jones?
> 
> If Haslem is a top priority by the heat and Ferry knows that, then he could be forcing Pat Riley out of the Saras sweepstakes or be forced to lose his young stud. And for Ferry, even if the Heat call his bluff, he gets to keep Haslem who Lebron likes, and then he can probably still sign either Saras or Damon Jones, whichever the heat don't sign. Or he might have a deal on the table with Gooden getting traded for some shooting point guard we're not even thinking about.
> ...


So they probably want to bait the Heat, to overpay Haslem for D Jones, won't be available. Pretty smart, but if the Heat don't call their bluff, they will end up overpaying Haslem, will keep D Jones, and go hard after somebody else. Wonder how the new rookie, is looking.


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## Miamiballer2k5 (Jun 29, 2005)

The Heat wont overpay for Haslem, if he leaves you can say hello to Shareef Abdur Raheem on South Beach.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

None of you heat fans have brought up the fact that the Heat drafted Simien this year. Does that factor into this? How much are the Heat willing to pay for Haslem? Maybe it's not gamemanship. Maybe Ferry is calling the Heats bluff on their interest in Haslem.

You guys said it yourselves. You supposedly could get SAR. Why would you re-sign Haslem when you can have Simien and SAR instead?

Of course this could be like the Curry story, where it's another one of Lebron's "Friends" trying to use cleveland to up their value to their own team?

Maybe Haslem is just trying to get the Heat to up their offer a little bit by flirting with the Cavs?


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## Miamiballer2k5 (Jun 29, 2005)

The reason the Heat are not going all out for SAR is becasuse we want to sign Haslem with our early bird rights. Then we can use our mid level for elsewhere. If someone offers more to the point where the Heat lose there Mid level I think they will let Haslem go. Because then it kind of becomes do you want Udonis Haslem or SAR.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

Shaq_Diesel said:


> Haslem isn't coming to Cleveland, so keep dreaming......
> 
> He's Miami born and raised, he wants to come back and we want him back...he said he wants to go to a team who can win a title, and that pretty much drops Cleveland out of contention...he came in with Dwyane, and he said he wants to stay a Heatian for life with him...why would he want to go to a cold, boring city when he lives in his hometown thats a tropical paradise?
> 
> #2--You guys don't even deserve to have Haslem mentioned to your team after some of the stupid comments you made. "Varejao is as good as Haslem"??? Are you kidding me? "Gooden is just as good or better"?? Get a clue...Watch a few Heat games next year and let me know if you still think that...atleast I'm seeing alot of Cavs games so I know that Varejao is nothing but a hustler and Gooden has nothing close to Udon's game...


Both AV and Gooden are better than Haslem. Sorry, but your contention that Haslem is clearly better than both is just completely overblown. Any PF can look good playing next to Shaq. He's an undersized PF even in the East, doesn't block shots and plays average defense. Fairly atheltic but not nearly as athletic as Gooden (or AV somewhat). 



Miamiballer2k5 said:


> Haslem has said he would take less money to remain in Miami, and if you guys do get Haslem all that means is that the Heat will get an upgrade in the form of Shareef Abdur Raheem.


The chances of SAR going to Miami are exactly zero. Won't happen in a milion years, unless Nash pulled an Isiah and traded for bad contracts and mediocre talent.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

EHL said:


> Both AV and Gooden are better than Haslem. Sorry, but your contention that Haslem is clearly better than both is just completely overblown. Any PF can look good playing next to Shaq. He's an undersized PF even in the East, doesn't block shots and plays average defense. Fairly atheltic but not nearly as athletic as Gooden (or AV somewhat).


Thank you, I thought I was the only one thinking this. Haslem is not clearly better than either one of them long term.


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## DWadeistheTruth (Apr 25, 2005)

EHL said:


> Both AV and Gooden are better than Haslem. Sorry, but your contention that Haslem is clearly better than both is just completely overblown. Any PF can look good playing next to Shaq. He's an undersized PF even in the East, doesn't block shots and plays average defense. Fairly atheltic but not nearly as athletic as Gooden (or AV somewhat).
> 
> 
> 
> The chances of SAR going to Miami are exactly zero. Won't happen in a milion years, unless Nash pulled an Isiah and traded for bad contracts and mediocre talent.


Haslem is one of them guys, that know their role, don't complain. And is tough SOB, he played, with a mess up finger through some stages of the playoffs. You need, gritty guys, like that to hold you down. Haslem will be missed, but I think he will stay. So nothing to get sad over. :cheers:


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## DWadeistheTruth (Apr 25, 2005)

And this is to my Heat fans, Haslem will have a place in my heart. Cause in that Chicago game during the regular season. That Argentian punk came at Wade hard. Haslem put him in his place in two seconds. True warrior.


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## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Where was I? I was rooting for my favorite team, the Chicago Bulls. You may have heard of them. They won Six Championships in the 90's. Some guys on their team...Jordan and Pippen.
> 
> Look up at the rafters the next time you got to a heat game. You've got one of my player's jerseys retired.
> 
> ...


that's nice....atleast you're a long time Cavs fan who can talk about rooting for his team through the good times and the bad.


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## Miamiballer2k5 (Jun 29, 2005)

Benedict_Boozer said:


> Thank you, I thought I was the only one thinking this. Haslem is not clearly better than either one of them long term.


Up to this point Udonis is definatly better then AV and has outplayed Drew Gooden.

Also Haslem is a tenacious and great defender so EHL is flat out wrong. You said 0 chance SAR goes to Miami, its one of his top three choices with the Kings and Nets, shows how much you know.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Miamiballer2k5 said:


> Up to this point Udonis is definatly better then AV and has outplayed Drew Gooden.
> 
> Also Haslem is a tenacious and great defender so EHL is flat out wrong. You said 0 chance SAR goes to Miami, its one of his top three choices with the Kings and Nets, shows how much you know.


Haslem also benefits from playing alongside Shaq, who creates open jumpers/layups and offensive rebounding opportunities for him. He's a better post defender, but with the other glaring holes in the Cavs lineup right now I would rather spend money on a PG/C than another PF. 

Also I never said anything about SAR, so i'm assuming your referring to EHL.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

In favor of Haslem, he is a much smarter player then Gooden. Better on his rotations, much better shot selections, more hustle, more consistency. No doubt Gooden has more talent but when you're core is Z, Hughes, and Lebron you need a guy willing to do the dirty work, be an enforcer, and not back down. Haslem impressed me in how after playing poorly in the Miami/Detroit series he finished strong.

As always though if Gooden can keep his head straight and hit the freaking weight room for once his potential is awesome. He's exceptionally quick for a 6 10 guys with good hops and good moves. Unfortunately I don't know if he'll ever put it together

With regards to AV, I don't know how anyone who watched this kid doesn't think he's not going to something special. He's going to better then both Gooden and Haslem


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## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

Pioneer10 said:


> In favor of Haslem, he is a much smarter player then Gooden. Better on his rotations, much better shot selections, more hustle, more consistency. No doubt Gooden has more talent but when you're core is Z, Hughes, and Lebron you need a guy willing to do the dirty work, be an enforcer, and not back down. Haslem impressed me in how after playing poorly in the Miami/Detroit series he finished strong.
> 
> As always though if Gooden can keep his head straight and hit the freaking weight room for once his potential is awesome. He's exceptionally quick for a 6 10 guys with good hops and good moves. Unfortunately I don't know if he'll ever put it together
> 
> With regards to AV, I don't know how anyone who watched this kid doesn't think he's not going to something special. He's going to better then both Gooden and Haslem


 Since I'm sure you guys were watching alot of Heat basketball before this year, you wouldn't really know anything about Haslem as a rookie. So to make the comment "he's just good b/c of Shaq" is pretty stupid b/c I'm almost certain most of you didn't see many games b/c we weren't on TV much at all. Haslem isn't the most talented player in the world, but he outworks almost anyone and plays hard every play. He's improved a ton, and I'm sure he's working his *** off right now to keep getting better. You can think that he's a "product of Shaq", but I'm sure if you asked any PF in the league, they'd tell you their respect for Udon's game.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Shaq_Diesel said:


> Since I'm sure you guys were watching alot of Heat basketball before this year, you wouldn't really know anything about Haslem as a rookie. So to make the comment "he's just good b/c of Shaq" is pretty stupid b/c I'm almost certain most of you didn't see many games b/c we weren't on TV much at all. Haslem isn't the most talented player in the world, but he outworks almost anyone and plays hard every play. He's improved a ton, and I'm sure he's working his *** off right now to keep getting better. You can think that he's a "product of Shaq", but I'm sure if you asked any PF in the league, they'd tell you their respect for Udon's game.


 Exactly why are you quoting my post about Haslem. I don't believe I even mention Shaq in there and I believe I was quite complementary toward's his game. 

Just relax - I don't think anyone here has really bashed Haslem. But it is a legitimate question and should be to even Heat fans whether he would be any better then Gooden or AV for the Cleveland Cavaliers. Especially when considering from a straight statistical standpoint Gooden has a big edge in almost every category


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