# OT: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey



## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

I even had it on in the mugshot and everything. Why I am sharing this? WHo knows and who cares. But I didn't wanna go to jail butt naked so I threw on the jersey and a pair of shorts. But when the police raid your house and find over 400 marijuana plants in your house, well it's jail for you. I wish J Will would have gotten to show the nba what he could do, and didn't have a loser of a coach in Bill Cartwright who didn't know what he was doing. I was really excited when we got the opportunity to draft him. Would have been a quality point guard for several years.


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

LMMFAO, funny stuff there.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

This has got to be the weirdest thread EVER!

Thanks for sharing with us Joakim.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



thebizkit69u said:


> This has got to be the weirdest thread EVER!
> 
> Thanks for sharing with us Joakim.


Now why would Joakim have a Jay Williams Bulls jersey when he already has his own. If I was Joakim Noah, I'd throw my own damn jersey on before I went to jail. I probably smoked more than him. But I can't smoke anymore because I don't have plants anymore. But anyway, Go Bulls!!! Hopefully I don't do any real time and I can continue sharing all sorts of wonderful things with you digital people who I don't know. God bless every one of you.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

I had a dream last night I went to jail and could never get another job. Oh well.


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## pduh (Aug 20, 2008)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

Hmmm interesting story I'm sure Jay will be proud lol.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



mo76 said:


> I had a dream last night I went to jail and could never get another job. Oh well.


Where you also black in this dream?

I had a dream once that I was shot 8 times and was dying, it felt so damn real.. hate those dreams almost as bad as the dreams were your falling.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



ScottVdub said:


> I even had it on in the mugshot and everything. Why I am sharing this? WHo knows and who cares. But I didn't wanna go to jail butt naked so I threw on the jersey and a pair of shorts. But when the police raid your house and find over 400 marijuana plants in your house, well it's jail for you. I wish J Will would have gotten to show the nba what he could do, and didn't have a loser of a coach in Bill Cartwright who didn't know what he was doing. I was really excited when we got the opportunity to draft him. Would have been a quality point guard for several years.


You are officially my favorite poster.


Sorry to hear about your weed plants... 400 in your house? Must have been a big house. How'd they catch on to you?


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## Laker Freak (Jul 1, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

Best thread title ever.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

Over 400 marijuana plants, the spirit of Bob Marley lives long WOW!


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



Dornado said:


> You are officially my favorite poster.
> 
> 
> Sorry to hear about your weed plants... 400 in your house? Must have been a big house. How'd they catch on to you?


They could probably smell it from half a mile away. If you've ever come onto contact with the sticky icky you'd know that the fresher the more it smells. Now multiply that times fifty per plant.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



Dornado said:


> You are officially my favorite poster.
> 
> 
> Sorry to hear about your weed plants... 400 in your house? Must have been a big house. How'd they catch on to you?



They caught my room mate dumping used soil in the woods and came and raided my house. And one time the police came to my house searching for somebody who didn't even live there, and I guess they smelled weed because my carbon filter controller wasn't set properly for one day, so those 2 things gave them a warrant. But hey, I made the front page of the local newspaper.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



Hyperion said:


> They could probably smell it from half a mile away. If you've ever come onto contact with the sticky icky you'd know that the fresher the more it smells. Now multiply that times fifty per plant.


Usually people that have 400 plants have taken the smell into consideration.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



ScottVdub said:


> They caught my room mate dumping used soil in the woods and came and raided my house. And one time the police came to my house searching for somebody who didn't even live there, and I guess they smelled weed because my carbon filter controller wasn't set properly for one day, so those 2 things gave them a warrant. But hey, I made the front page of the local newspaper.


Ouch.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

Eh you got what you deserved ----- lol. 400 plants WTF.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



thebizkit69u said:


> Eh you got what you deserved ----- lol. 400 plants WTF.


We'll you're a real nice guy aren't you? You think people deserve the potential of prison time over a plant that grows from seed out of the ground. That isn't processed in any way, that harms nobody. -------. Anyway, God bless you mr 69. But if I get locked up and go to prison, whatever. But there are people who assault police officers who spend 4 days in jail and get 1 year probation. Child molesters who are only locked up for 2 years. People who drink and drive, or recklessly drive, killing somebody and getting 30 days, and you consider a plant a crime? You really are a moron. Anyway, lets talk about some bulls stuff.


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## Marcus13 (Jul 17, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

just out of curiousity...how much was bond?


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## bball2223 (Jul 21, 2006)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



thebizkit69u said:


> Eh you got what you deserved moron lol. 400 plants WTF.


Marijuana shouldn't even be illegal. If there wasn't so many ignorant politicians and extremeists (people in general too) this would be a non-issue in terms of being in trouble with the law. Weed is less harmful than Cigs/Alcohol and is illegal. SMH at thinking he got what he deserved.


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## thaKEAF (Mar 8, 2004)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

lmao


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

If your username had been QuincyDouby it would have been more appropriate.


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## intheegame (Jun 24, 2009)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

Damn dude, you'll probably do A LOT of time for that. If I were you I'd probably kill myself or go on the run, not even playing. Prison isn't **** I'd be down with at all.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



bball2223 said:


> Marijuana shouldn't even be illegal. If there wasn't so many ignorant politicians and extremeists (people in general too) this would be a non-issue in terms of being in trouble with the law. Weed is less harmful than Cigs/Alcohol and is illegal. SMH at thinking he got what he deserved.


Not trying to start anything here, but I think your post needs an IMO next to it. Anything in mild/moderate doses isn't going to kill anyone, true. But, people get stuck on weed and it sends plenty of lives down the crapper. Happened to a good friend of mine. To be clear though, I don't deny these things happen w/ alcohol too. Alcohol is just a helluva lot harder to ban (see: prohibition era). Pardon the rant, carry on. :cheers:


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## bball2223 (Jul 21, 2006)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



yodurk said:


> Not trying to start anything here, but I think your post needs an IMO next to it. Anything in mild/moderate doses isn't going to kill anyone, true. But, people get stuck on weed and it sends plenty of lives down the crapper. Happened to a good friend of mine. To be clear though, I don't deny these things happen w/ alcohol too. Alcohol is just a helluva lot harder to ban (see: prohibition era). Pardon the rant, carry on. :cheers:


I have friends in the same boat, but that doesn't mean Marijuana should be illegal. If we were to ban everything that could possibly turn out bad there wouldn't be a whole lot to do legally in this country. I agree my statement does need an IMO I agree.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

Just because weed comes from the ground and isnt processed doesnt mean its not a potent drug. Thats like saying oxycotin just comes from the drugstore.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



mo76 said:


> Just because weed comes from the ground and isnt processed doesnt mean its not a potent drug. Thats like saying oxycotin just comes from the drugstore.


i've been proscribed oxycotin before, and it is a much harder drug than marijuana. So is percusset. Just about anything in pill form is more harmful than weed. It isn't like saying oxycotin just comes from the drug store at all. But something that the creator of the universe invented should not be illegal. It should possibly be controlled, but going to prison for being a pot head is ridiculous. We'll see what happens. Nothing I can do, just try to enjoy my freedom and see what happens. I have no prior record and I live in Oregon which is fairly lenient on weed. The only reason I posted this was because of the Jay Will jersey, just trying to make light of a f'd up situation. I have a stress fracture on the metartarsil(ball of the pinky toe) in my left foot. gives me ankle problems, knee problems, lower back, and shoulder problems all the way up the left side of my body, and weed is the only thing thats ever helped me without making me sick. I get the urge to work out and stretch and I can feel the stretch my body needs to be comfortable while on weed. 

Someone asked what my bail was or whatever. It was listed as 385,000 but I was released the next day. So if anyone would have paid 10 percent of that when I was gonna be released anyway, they are a dumby. Also the police broke several execution of search and seizure laws while handling the situation and one of them threatened to shoot me for asking for a warrant because they refused to show it to me. I know I did my crime or whatever, but the police really need to be held accountable for upholding their own laws and executing their own laws by the book. But they're gonna cover eachothers butts anyway so what can I do.

And I'm not gonna off myself or flee the county. Im gonna be 25 in a week. I can get past this. Plus I'm not gonna flee when my mom is here. Why make her life harder cuz I messed up.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



ScottVdub said:


> i've been proscribed oxycotin before, and it is a much harder drug than marijuana. So is percusset. Just about anything in pill form is more harmful than weed. It isn't like saying oxycotin just comes from the drug store at all. But something that the creator of the universe invented should not be illegal. It should possibly be controlled, but going to prison for being a pot head is ridiculous. We'll see what happens. Nothing I can do, just try to enjoy my freedom and see what happens. I have no prior record and I live in Oregon which is fairly lenient on weed. The only reason I posted this was because of the Jay Will jersey, just trying to make light of a f'd up situation. I have a stress fracture on the metartarsil(ball of the pinky toe) in my left foot. gives me ankle problems, knee problems, lower back, and shoulder problems all the way up the left side of my body, and weed is the only thing thats ever helped me without making me sick. I get the urge to work out and stretch and I can feel the stretch my body needs to be comfortable while on weed.
> 
> Someone asked what my bail was or whatever. It was listed as 385,000 but I was released the next day. So if anyone would have paid 10 percent of that when I was gonna be released anyway, they are a dumby. Also the police broke several execution of search and seizure laws while handling the situation and one of them threatened to shoot me for asking for a warrant because they refused to show it to me. I know I did my crime or whatever, but the police really need to be held accountable for upholding their own laws and executing their own laws by the book. But they're gonna cover eachothers butts anyway so what can I do.
> 
> And I'm not gonna off myself or flee the county. Im gonna be 25 in a week. I can get past this. Plus I'm not gonna flee when my mom is here. Why make her life harder cuz I messed up.


Have they made you an offer yet? Hopefully you only get the minimum 4 year sentence. With good behavior you could be out within 30 months


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



bball2223 said:


> I have friends in the same boat, but that doesn't mean Marijuana should be illegal. If we were to ban everything that could possibly turn out bad there wouldn't be a whole lot to do legally in this country. I agree my statement does need an IMO I agree.


Understood. I don't have a foot completely in one side or the other. I studied sociology and psychology in college so I think about this stuff from both points of view. The whole point of being illegal is to make sure its not abused, but the ironic thing is, I wonder if some (e.g., teens) gravitate to it, in part, because of the stigma. It's a theory, not a fact; but still could be true. In a perfect world you'd have humans who knew how to use drugs in healthy doses without need the laws in place. Then again, if we reversed the law, the easy access could have terrible results on vulnerable populations (young teens, addicts). That's in part where my hesitation lies. Anyway, it makes for an interesting debate at the very least. I'll be quiet now. 

:bananallama:


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



> We'll you're a real nice guy aren't you? You think people deserve the potential of prison time over a plant that grows from seed out of the ground. That isn't processed in any way, that harms nobody. You're the moron.


You obviously were intending to sell an illegal narcotic no? I cant imagine 400 plans is just for yourself. You break the law you pay the consequence, you don't want to spend time in prison then why do something that increases those chances, ------ knock off the insults/personal attacks.

As for the whole Marijuana should be legal debate I just ask you this, lets just say you get hurt and your in need of life saving surgery do you want your surgeon to be someone who was doing bong hits 10 minutes before? Do you want your ambulance driver to be baked?


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



thebizkit69u said:


> As for the whole Marijuana should be legal debate I just ask you this, lets just say you get hurt and your in need of life saving surgery do you want your surgeon to be someone who was doing bong hits 10 minutes before? Do you want your ambulance driver to be baked?


Can't you make the same argument about alcohol? Do you want your surgeon/ambulance driver having downed a few cocktails at lunch?


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



Dornado said:


> Can't you make the same argument about alcohol? Do you want your surgeon/ambulance driver having downed a few cocktails at lunch?


100% right, I'm someone who has first hand seen the tragedy of what alcohol abuse and un responsible drinking can do, the problem is alcohol is legal and marijuana is not. Legalizing marijuana isn't easy as people think it is, it will create tons more laws than just allowing it to be an illegal law that pretty much just results in a slap on the wrist.


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## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



ScottVdub said:


> It isn't like saying oxycotin just comes from the drug store at all. But something that the creator of the universe invented should not be illegal. It should possibly be controlled, but going to prison for being a pot head is ridiculous. We'll see what happens. Nothing I can do, just try to enjoy my freedom and see what happens. I have no prior record and I live in Oregon which is fairly lenient on weed. The only reason I posted this was because of the Jay Will jersey, just trying to make light of a f'd up situation.


Just a few random comments

1. Your not going to prison for being a pot head. your going to jail for 400 plants. We're not talking about just smoking a hooter on a friday night. There's a big big difference.

2. Since you can spout off tons of facts about weed, i'm fairly sure you knew what the consequences are. So you created this F'd up situation yourself. no pity here.

3. Honestly i'm incredibly neutral on the whole legalize weed topic. I'm just shocked your acting surprised by all this.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

someone's gotta grow it...


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## BenDengGo (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

hang in there scotty!! in the case you should go to prison, i hope it doesnt break you in any kind of way. how many days do you have in "freedom". any plans?


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



NorthSideHatrik said:


> Just a few random comments
> 
> 1. Your not going to prison for being a pot head. your going to jail for 400 plants. We're not talking about just smoking a hooter on a friday night. There's a big big difference.
> 
> ...


im not surprised by anything at all. ive lived long enough to not be surprised by anything. But the police need to execute their warrants according to the law. 

The reason there was 400 plants was because i did a method called the Sea of Green. Where you put as many little tiny plants into a small space as possible. These plants were all less than 2 feet tall and yielded only a little bit a piece. And I harvested a 4 foot by 8 foot section every 2 weeks. The amount of weed that came from the 400 plants was much less than you would think. 

And to mr 69, who said that I was intending to sell. Everything the police found in the house that day was intended to be personal. 

An officer does not have the right to threated to shoot somebody over demanding to see a warrant.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



BenDengGo said:


> in the case you should go to prison, i hope it doesnt break you in any kind of way.


Yeah dont drop the soap :dogpile: .

:laugh:


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



thebizkit69u said:


> Yeah dont drop the soap :dogpile: .
> 
> :laugh:


you need some prayer and some originality


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

Mod, I'm sorry to post this dumb post. But there is being some ignorance coming out of this thread so if you wanna lock it, i wouldn't be mad at you. I don't wanna divert the attention of the Chicago Bulls away from this forum. So if you feel nothing worthwhile is going to come from this post feel free to lock it.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*

For the supportive people, thank you. For the ignorant ones, I'm not gonna let you make me mad. I got enough to think about, and if they wanna try to mock me, that's their life. You can do what you wanna do with your life, so if you think knocking Scott Von Wald is a productive use of your life, then whatever. Now I know the ignorant are gonna flip it on me and say, growing weed isn't a productive use of life. But it got me to stop buying the stuff, it taught me how to garden, it taught me how to work hard at your passions, and it kept me in shape. It also taught me many other things, like to not include nobody in your business. Any business, legal or illegal. If you have any type of business run it yourself because if you go 50-50 on something with somebody and you do 8 times more work, they are still gonna want half. So just run your own life and limit others involvement except where they are needed. Go Bulls. Bring home a championship in the not too distant future, and regardless of what happens, y'all ain't done hearing from me. They can't lock me up forever, and if they do, what is that gonna prove. Is that gonna make the world a safer place, by spending tax dollars on locking me up? If that's what they wanna do, ok, but I just don't see it as productive. I'm small potatoes and they already stopped any crime I was doing. But if they wanna lock me up, congratulations American Justice System.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> But there is being some ignorance coming out of this thread


Your the one caught with 400 plants of an illegal drug, I find it funny that your looking for any kind of sympathy here lol. If anything your thread should be an example to any other idiot who thinks growing tons of weed is a good idea.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

thebizkit69u said:


> Your the one caught with 400 plants of an illegal drug, I find it funny that your looking for any kind of sympathy here lol. If anything your thread should be an example to any other idiot who thinks growing tons of weed is a good idea.


plants of a drug? a plant isnt a drug buddy bro. Im not looking for sympathy. I dont need sympathy. sympathy never did anybody any good. But you assume I'm saying this for this and that reason, I was just bored and posted a dumb post. simple as that. But apparently my life interests you, so thank you very much for being part of my fan club. When im done with my case and have done my time I'll be performing in a town near you.


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## urwhatueati8god (May 27, 2003)

I'm going to have to concur with thebizkit69u on this one. It doesn't matter whether or not the plant is a narcotic or not. The point is that there are very clear laws prohibiting the possession and redistribution of said plant. Whether or not it should be allowed is also irrelevant because as it's not allowed under current law. ScottVdub very clearly violated said it is irrelevant. The main point is that he was in possession of a massive amount of a banned substance and now he is going to have to deal with the ramifications of his actions.

For the record, I do believe that marijuana should be legalized, but the possession of over 400 plants is excessive.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: I went to jail in a Jay Williams Bulls Jersey*



ScottVdub said:


> i've been proscribed oxycotin before, and it is a much harder drug than marijuana. So is percusset. Just about anything in pill form is more harmful than weed. It isn't like saying oxycotin just comes from the drug store at all. But something that the creator of the universe invented should not be illegal. It should possibly be controlled, but going to prison for being a pot head is ridiculous. We'll see what happens. Nothing I can do, just try to enjoy my freedom and see what happens. I have no prior record and I live in Oregon which is fairly lenient on weed. The only reason I posted this was because of the Jay Will jersey, just trying to make light of a f'd up situation. I have a stress fracture on the metartarsil(ball of the pinky toe) in my left foot. gives me ankle problems, knee problems, lower back, and shoulder problems all the way up the left side of my body, and weed is the only thing thats ever helped me without making me sick. I get the urge to work out and stretch and I can feel the stretch my body needs to be comfortable while on weed.
> 
> Someone asked what my bail was or whatever. It was listed as 385,000 but I was released the next day. So if anyone would have paid 10 percent of that when I was gonna be released anyway, they are a dumby. Also the police broke several execution of search and seizure laws while handling the situation and one of them threatened to shoot me for asking for a warrant because they refused to show it to me. I know I did my crime or whatever, but the police really need to be held accountable for upholding their own laws and executing their own laws by the book. But they're gonna cover eachothers butts anyway so what can I do.
> 
> And I'm not gonna off myself or flee the county. Im gonna be 25 in a week. I can get past this. Plus I'm not gonna flee when my mom is here. Why make her life harder cuz I messed up.


You know, saying things like "Something the creator of the universe invented should not be illegal" makes you come off as a burnout.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

ScottVdub said:


> plants of a drug? a plant isnt a drug buddy bro. Im not looking for sympathy. I dont need sympathy. sympathy never did anybody any good. But you assume I'm saying this for this and that reason, I was just bored and posted a dumb post. simple as that. But apparently my life interests you, so thank you very much for being part of my fan club. When im done with my case and have done my time I'll be performing in a town near you.


So you're saying weed isn't a drug then?


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

urwhatueati8god said:


> I'm going to have to concur with thebizkit69u on this one. It doesn't matter whether or not the plant is a narcotic or not. The point is that there are very clear laws prohibiting the possession and redistribution of said plant. Whether or not it should be allowed is also irrelevant because as it's not allowed under current law. ScottVdub very clearly violated said it is irrelevant. The main point is that he was in possession of a massive amount of a banned substance and now he is going to have to deal with the ramifications of his actions.
> 
> For the record, I do believe that marijuana should be legalized, but the possession of over 400 plants is excessive.


So he's guilty of violating an unjust law... I have no problem with that.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> So he's guilty of violating an unjust law... I have no problem with that.


I am glad I don't live in a society where I can break any law I don't agree with.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> I am glad I don't live in a society where I can break any law I don't agree with.


Ever hear of civil disobedience?


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> Ever hear of civil disobedience?


Still not sure where you're going with this. Every law known to man has its detractors. The whole "I don't like that law so it doesn't matter" approach is one I don't agree with.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Still not sure where you're going with this. Every law known to man has its detractors. The whole "I don't like that law so it doesn't matter" approach is one I don't agree with.


Well, when a law isn't really based in reason, I have no problem with someone breaking it, whether it is done as a form of civil disobedience or not


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> Well, when a law isn't really based in reason, I have no problem with someone breaking it, whether it is done as a form of civil disobedience or not


Laws based on drug distribution aren't based on reason?


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Laws based on drug distribution aren't based on reason?


not this one, no... not any sound reasoning, at least.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> not this one, no... not any sound reasoning, at least.


I can see plenty of sound reasoning behind not wanting someone to grow 400 plants. I'm sure you could sit back and tell me a punch of pot head facts about how marijuana is safer than alcohol, tobacco and everything else in the world. Bottom line is marijuana should be controlled. And if it was controlled, growing 400 of your own plants would still be illegal.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> I can see plenty of sound reasoning behind not wanting someone to grow 400 plants. I'm sure you could sit back and tell me a punch of pot head facts about how marijuana is safer than alcohol, tobacco and everything else in the world. Bottom line is marijuana should be controlled. And if it was controlled, growing 400 of your own plants would still be illegal.


You don't sound particularly open minded on the subject... I view it as a victim-less crime, but it probably isn't worth debating.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> You don't sound particularly open minded on the subject... I view it as a victim-less crime, but it probably isn't worth debating.


That is like calling alcoholism a victim-less crime.

Also, I enjoy how people use the word open minded and try to make it sound like the other side of the debate are closed minded, clinging on to the past.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> That is like calling alcoholism a victim-less crime.
> 
> Also, I enjoy how people use the word open minded and try to make it sound like the other side of the debate are closed minded, clinging on to the past.


The reason I said you weren't open minded is that you preemptively labeled any response I was going to make a "bunch of pot head facts"... so, you kind of made your bed on that one.


Also... there is no law against being an alcoholic.... and even if there was, that's not what this guy did.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> The reason I said you weren't open minded is that you preemptively labeled any response I was going to make a "bunch of pot head facts"... so, you kind of made your bed on that one.
> 
> 
> Also... there is no law against being an alcoholic.... and even if there was, that's not what this guy did.


No, he grew 400 plants. Which in turn makes for intent to sell on a illegal drug.

You said weed is a victimless crime, I compared it to alcohol. Explain how its not, don't dance around the argument when you don't like the direction it is moving in.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> No, he grew 400 plants. Which in turn makes for intent to sell on a illegal drug.
> 
> You said weed is a victimless crime, I compared it to alcohol. Explain how its not, don't dance around the argument when you don't like the direction it is moving in.


Alcohol isn't a crime, I'm not dancing around the argument, you just aren't making an argument.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> Alcohol isn't a crime, I'm not dancing around the argument, you just aren't making an argument.


I don't agree that alcoholism is a victimless crime.

People die to drunk drivers, etc all the time.


----------



## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> I don't agree that alcoholism is a victimless crime.


I'm not saying alcoholism doesn't create victims, I'm saying it isn't a "crime"... you don't go to jail for being an alcoholic


What this guy is doing is akin to brewing your own beer... again, not something you'd go to jail for.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> I'm not saying alcoholism doesn't create victims, I'm saying it isn't a "crime"... you don't go to jail for being an alcoholic
> 
> 
> What this guy is doing is akin to brewing your own beer... again, not something you'd go to jail for.


Brewing beer isn't illegal. When it was illegal, people went to jail.

I'm not trying to move this towards alcohol, I was just trying to draw comparisons from you. I don't think weed is some terrible, terrible drug. I used to smoke it, I have plenty of friends who still do smoke it. Growing 400 illegal plants with plans of illegally selling it on the other hand, I have a problem with.

People would probably find a problem if I brewed 400 cases of beer and went to a school to sell my homemade brew.


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## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

R-Star said:


> Brewing beer isn't illegal. When it was illegal, people went to jail.
> 
> I'm not trying to move this towards alcohol, I was just trying to draw comparisons from you. I don't think weed is some terrible, terrible drug. I used to smoke it, I have plenty of friends who still do smoke it. Growing 400 illegal plants with plans of illegally selling it on the other hand, I have a problem with.
> 
> People would probably find a problem if I brewed 400 cases of beer and went to a school to sell my homemade brew.


from what he said the plants were very small and were all intended for personal use, not to be sold.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

rocketeer said:


> from what he said the plants were very small and were all intended for personal use, not to be sold.


400 plants for 1 person? That guy's got a problem.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

rocketeer said:


> from what he said the plants were very small and were all intended for personal use, not to be sold.


No one grows 400 plants for personal use. He brought the story up, so I don't know why hes lying like we're the cops.

When I want to get drunk, I don't go out and buy 400 beers. When my wife plants vegetables, she plants enough for us to eat. If she planted 400 tomatoes, we would be selling the majority of them.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Brewing beer isn't illegal. When it was illegal, people went to jail.
> 
> I'm not trying to move this towards alcohol, I was just trying to draw comparisons from you. I don't think weed is some terrible, terrible drug. I used to smoke it, I have plenty of friends who still do smoke it. Growing 400 illegal plants with plans of illegally selling it on the other hand, I have a problem with.
> 
> People would probably find a problem if I brewed 400 cases of beer and went to a school to sell my homemade brew.


Right... and if he was going to a school and selling it, then I would agree there would be a problem.

You keep keep making these analogies to behavior that is nothing like what the guy did... I don't know what else to tell you. I think it should be treated like alcohol...


----------



## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> Right... and if he was going to a school and selling it, then I would agree there would be a problem.
> 
> You keep keep making these analogies to behavior that is nothing like what the guy did... I don't know what else to tell you. I think it should be treated like alcohol...


So he was growing 400 plants for himself then................


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## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

R-Star said:


> No one grows 400 plants for personal use. He brought the story up, so I don't know why hes lying like we're the cops.


i doubt that story helps him in court, but i don't see any reason to believe that it's definitely false. i haven't seen the plants, how much he gets off of them, or how much he regularly smokes so i can't really make that judgment.



> When I want to get drunk, I don't go out and buy 400 beers. When my wife plants vegetables, she plants enough for us to eat. If she planted 400 tomatoes, we would be selling the majority of them.


so you've never known someone that had a kegerator?


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

rocketeer said:


> i doubt that story helps him in court, but i don't see any reason to believe that it's definitely false. i haven't seen the plants, how much he gets off of them, or how much he regularly smokes so i can't really make that judgment.
> 
> 
> so you've never known someone that had a kegerator?


Yes. Because kegs are meant to be drank by multiple people.


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## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

R-Star said:


> Yes. Because kegs are meant to be drank by multiple people.


i'm saying when someone owns a kegerator and keeps a keg in their house at all times when only a couple of people live there, that certainly could be comparable to this.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

rocketeer said:


> i'm saying when someone owns a kegerator and keeps a keg in their house at all times when only a couple of people live there, that certainly could be comparable to this.


I'm not so sure, but its something I'll think about. 

I am told I drink alone quite a bit, but if I had a kegerator at my home, guests would drink from it when they came. Translate that into home grow marijuana, and its distribution of an illegal drug. 

Honestly, not that big of a deal to me. I don't hate the guy for it. Weed isn't that big of a deal to me. But he broke the law. What I don't agree with is the "If you don't agree with a law, it doesn't matter if you break it" mindset.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

R-Star said:


> So you're saying weed isn't a drug then?


exactomundo.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

R-Star said:


> I am glad I don't live in a society where I can break any law I don't agree with.


Benjamin Franklin broke laws. He and his homeboy disected human bodies before any of that was legal and left the remains of all sorts of bones underneath his house to be dug up many years later.


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## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

ScottVdub said:


> exactomundo.


Unless your planning to circle around say the drug is THC and not "weed", you just sound silly right now. Its packed with chemicals that alter your body functions, including brain activity. It's a drug. It does not matter that its a plant and not a pill. Most drugs are made from plants or modified versions of plant chemicals. Granted things are changing with the creation of high throughput screening, but lets just consider the "historical" perspective.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

NorthSideHatrik said:


> Unless your planning to circle around say the drug is THC and not "weed", you just sound silly right now. Its packed with chemicals that alter your body functions, including brain activity. It's a drug. It does not matter that its a plant and not a pill. Most drugs are made from plants or modified versions of plant chemicals. Granted things are changing with the creation of high throughput screening, but lets just consider the "historical" perspective.


While possibly meant to be humorous, this could be taken in all sorts of negative light. ~Rhyder


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

Dornado said:


> You don't sound particularly open minded on the subject... I view it as a victim-less crime, but it probably isn't worth debating.


Directly speaking, no there are not any victims.

Indirectly, there are potentially thousands of victims. It does not happen during traumatic instances like a drive-by. But, easy access to vulnerable, confused populations (read: young teens who don't know what the hell they're doing) most certainly has victims over the long-term. 

If a few pot laws saves even a couple thousand teen lives from accessing a drug that would otherwise throw turn their entire lives upside down, it could be worth it.

Irregardless, it's a tricky subject. Pros and cons abound. Much like the alcohol issue. Thing is, alcohol is already legal, and these types of laws are very hard to change 180.


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

You can also argue the criminalization of marijuana and other illicit drugs has brought on more crime and deaths and hasn't proven to be effective at all to deter use.

regulate and tax it heavily but I think the stigma of drug use in the US is strong there's no way this will happen outside of marijuana for medicinal purposes.

____________
This thread is awesome and I can't believe there are so many narcs up in here


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

yodurk said:


> Directly speaking, no there are not any victims.
> 
> Indirectly, there are potentially thousands of victims. It does not happen during traumatic instances like a drive-by. But, easy access to vulnerable, confused populations (read: young teens who don't know what the hell they're doing) most certainly has victims over the long-term.
> 
> ...


Again, the same things can be said of alcohol... and I think it would be a lot easier to keep it out of the hands of young folks if the distribution of marijuana wasn't 100% reliant on the black market and instead had some formal legal mechanisms and regulations to guide it.


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## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

R-Star said:


> I am glad I don't live in a society where I can break any law I don't agree with.


That is a scary way of thinking. Imagine some of the horrible types of laws that have existed in the world.

If you think that is true you do not understand the laws of nature.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> You can also argue the criminalization of marijuana and other illicit drugs has brought on more crime and deaths and hasn't proven to be effective at all to deter use.


So what we should just give up the war on drugs and legalize coke, pcp and other drugs as well? 

Once you legalize Marijuana it will just open up the door to legalizing other drugs.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

thebizkit69u said:


> So what we should just give up the war on drugs and legalize coke, pcp and other drugs as well?
> 
> Once you legalize Marijuana it will just open up the door to legalizing other drugs.


Well, the system as-is is broken... we have overcrowded prisons brimming with non-violent criminals, a black market that lines the pockets of violent organized criminals... meanwhile, despite being illegal, people are still doing plenty of drugs. So something needs to be done, and straight prohibition is clearly not the answer.


Also, I think you're selling America short in their ability to differentiate between different substances... we treat aspirin differently than we treat oxycontin, why can't we treat weed differently than cocaine or heroin?


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Hustle said:


> That is a scary way of thinking. Imagine some of the horrible types of laws that have existed in the world.
> 
> If you think that is true you do not understand the laws of nature.


So I can break any law I don't agree with then?

Ok. Well I hope my wife doesn't anger me today. Man do I ever love her, but some times she makes me so mad I want to stab her in the neck. So next time, BAM! knife right to the neck. 

I can do whatever I want, laws are for suckers.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> Well, the system as-is is broken... we have overcrowded prisons brimming with non-violent criminals, a black market that lines the pockets of violent organized criminals... meanwhile, despite being illegal, people are still doing plenty of drugs. So something needs to be done, and straight prohibition is clearly not the answer.
> 
> 
> Also, I think you're selling America short in their ability to differentiate between different substances... we treat aspirin differently than we treat oxycontin, why can't we treat weed differently than cocaine or heroin?


Hypocritical on your part. The black market for drugs is lining the pockets of violent organized criminals? Except Scotty here who grew 400 plants and it doesn't matter right?



For clarification, I don't think Scott is a violent criminal. Just pointing out the glaring contradiction in Dornados post.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

thebizkit69u said:


> So what we should just give up the war on drugs and legalize coke, pcp and other drugs as well?



Bingo.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

R-Star said:


> I can do whatever I want, laws are for suckers.


No, suckers are people who conflate the law with morality.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

jnrjr79 said:


> No, suckers are people who conflate the law with morality.


Most laws tie in directly to morality.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Most laws tie in directly to morality.



Wow, that is an incredibly naive thing to say.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

Dornado said:


> Well, the system as-is is broken... we have overcrowded prisons brimming with non-violent criminals, a black market that lines the pockets of violent organized criminals... meanwhile, despite being illegal, people are still doing plenty of drugs. So something needs to be done, and straight prohibition is clearly not the answer.
> 
> 
> Also, I think you're selling America short in their ability to differentiate between different substances... we treat aspirin differently than we treat oxycontin, why can't we treat weed differently than cocaine or heroin?


Hell yeah a lot of people are still doing plenty of drugs and if we dint have any laws against drugs we would have a hell of a LOT more people doing drugs, is the system flawed yes but its there for a reason can you imagine how crazy a simple walk in the park would be if everybody were allowed to do drugs whenever they wanted. 

You dont go to prison for getting caught with a joint or two, the people who actually go to prison are the ones growing 400 plants and selling them to kids and others. 

The side effects of Marijuana may not be as severe or violent as cocaine or heroin but there are long lasting effects, some that could very well ruin a persons life thats for sure. If people want to smoke weed legally go to Amsterdam 

I dont have a lot of hope for America's youth or for most humans anyways, we freaking celebrate the life of a pedophile who died of a heart attack most likely do to drug abuse and when a guy like Billy May's who lived the American dream and build himself up from nothing dies it goes unnoticed and cared for.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

jnrjr79 said:


> Wow, that is an incredibly naive thing to say.


Naive? That's laughable. The original 10 laws were the 10 commandments, which are based directly on morality. 

Try to spin some tale where I'm stuck in the past, or naive though.



And yes, I understand some laws are there to benefit the people who put them in place. But the majority of laws are morality based.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

thebizkit69u said:


> Hell yeah a lot of people are still doing plenty of drugs and if we dint have any laws against drugs we would have a hell of a LOT more people doing drugs, is the system flawed yes but its there for a reason can you imagine how crazy a simple walk in the park would be if everybody were allowed to do drugs whenever they wanted.
> 
> You dont go to prison for getting caught with a joint or two, the people who actually go to prison are the ones growing 400 plants and selling them to kids and others.
> 
> ...


Yep. With the way youth is parented, taught and disciplined these days, I have little faith for the future.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

R-Star said:


> Naive? That's laughable. The original 10 laws were the 10 commandments, which are based directly on morality.
> 
> Try to spin some tale where I'm stuck in the past, or naive though.
> 
> ...


The drug laws were passed to hurt minorities. Marijuana was illegalized during the Great Depression because Mexican farmers would smoke weed. Since we needed those jobs for Americans, marijuana was illegalized so that sheriffs could harass the mexican workers and chase them out of Texas, Arizona, Southern California and New Mexico. Another interesting thing about the drug laws was that back in the 1800s morphine, a narcotic, was prescribed as a treatment to alcoholism. The thinking behind that is an alcoholic is beligerent, loud, and causes social problems while a morphine addict generally stays in their homes and keeps to themselves.

So drug laws aren't about morality more so what is economical and easier for society.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Hypocritical on your part. The black market for drugs is lining the pockets of violent organized criminals? Except Scotty here who grew 400 plants and it doesn't matter right?
> 
> 
> 
> For clarification, I don't think Scott is a violent criminal. Just pointing out the glaring contradiction in Dornados post.


If anything, we should be thanking Scotty for growing so that we don't have to pay some drug cartel for it.... and my post was talking about 'drugs' in general... so that includes groups like the Taliban who can sling heroin and make huge profits from it


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Hyperion said:


> The drug laws were passed to hurt minorities. Marijuana was illegalized during the Great Depression because Mexican farmers would smoke weed. Since we needed those jobs for Americans, marijuana was illegalized so that sheriffs could harass the mexican workers and chase them out of Texas, Arizona, Southern California and New Mexico. Another interesting thing about the drug laws was that back in the 1800s morphine, a narcotic, was prescribed as a treatment to alcoholism. The thinking behind that is an alcoholic is beligerent, loud, and causes social problems while a morphine addict generally stays in their homes and keeps to themselves.
> 
> So drug laws aren't about morality more so what is economical and easier for society.


In the 1800's the also used to put leaches on people to cure them, and burn smart women for being witches. 

Drug laws are passed to hurt minorities? No. They are there to keep them out of the hands of people. How would making heroin, PCP, crack and the rest legal help minorities in any manner?


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Naive? That's laughable. The original 10 laws were the 10 commandments, which are based directly on morality.


You can't be serious. The 10 commandments were the original 10 laws? Good lord, man. Buy a history book.



> Try to spin some tale where I'm stuck in the past, or naive though.


No need.



> And yes, I understand some laws are there to benefit the people who put them in place. But the majority of laws are morality based.


http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/ilcs.asp

Those are the state statutes in Illinois. I doubt you can say most of them are "morality based."

Moreover, the proper function of laws is not to be moral. Ethical, yes. Mostly, though, the law is amoral, as it should be. Most laws are relatively mundane.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

jnrjr79 said:


> You can't be serious. The 10 commandments were the original 10 laws? Good lord, man. Buy a history book.
> 
> No need.
> 
> ...


Buy a book? What in the good **** are you talking about? 

Here, lets make this simple, hows about you tell me the original laws champ. Don't try to strut in here sounding superior. 

If you do or don't believe in god and the bible, the foundation for laws were based from the 10 commandments.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

thebizkit69u said:


> Hell yeah a lot of people are still doing plenty of drugs and if we dint have any laws against drugs we would have a hell of a LOT more people doing drugs, is the system flawed yes but its there for a reason can you imagine how crazy a simple walk in the park would be if everybody were allowed to do drugs whenever they wanted.
> *
> You dont go to prison for getting caught with a joint or two*, the people who actually go to prison are the ones growing 400 plants and selling them to kids and others.


Actually, in your own home state you can find yourself in the clink for 6 months for having just over 2.5 grams of weed... and trust me, there are plenty of people who can roll 2.5 grams into a couple of joints... we're not talking about a lot of pot here.

For 10g (a little over a quarter ounce.... about $120 bucks worth of decent weed) you can be sent to jail for a year... over 30 grams (not an outrageous amount for personal use) you can get hit with a felony, spend 3 years in the big house and pay up to $25,000 in fines 

And those are just for possession... not selling, not growing... just having.




> The side effects of Marijuana may not be as severe or violent as cocaine or heroin but there are long lasting effects, some that could very well ruin a persons life thats for sure. If people want to smoke weed legally go to Amsterdam


Ah, I see... "love it or leave it". Anyway, the "long lasting effects" haven't really been proven... and, for the record, drinking coffee.... eating candy... all have 'long lasting effects'. I would say that believing everything the D.A.R.E. program taught you about weed is probably not the way to go.



> I dont have a lot of hope for America's youth or for most humans anyways, we freaking celebrate the life of a pedophile who died of a heart attack most likely do to drug abuse and when a guy like Billy May's who lived the American dream and build himself up from nothing dies it goes unnoticed and cared for.


I don't get the degree of the Michael Jackson adulation either... but I'd disagree that Billy Mays' death went unnoticed... he just wasn't as big of a star... and I have no problem with Billy Mays, but hocking products on TV isn't really enough to qualify you as an American hero in my book.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Buy a book? What in the good **** are you talking about?
> 
> Here, lets make this simple, hows about you tell me the original laws champ. Don't try to strut in here sounding superior.
> 
> If you do or don't believe in god and the bible, the foundation for laws were based from the 10 commandments.


Yes, buy a history book. Or just do some googling. Your post was absurd.

Whether or not I believe in a god or the bible has nothing to do with whether the 10 commandments were the _original_ laws, which was your silly claim. Do you mean to tell me that humanity had no laws in any society until Moses came down from Mount Sinai?

Also, to be fair, and I have no idea what the answer to this question is, but were the 10 commandments ever enacted as actual law by any country? Religious rules aren't law until some government makes them so.

In any event, we're pretty far afield here. Laws aren't necessarily moral, though morality and laws can intersect. But your assertion was that people should not break the law merely because they believe it to be unjust. I think if you're really the religious person you seem to project yourself to be, you'd know that to be false. In fact, wouldn't Christianity _require_ you to break certain laws either here in the U.S. or elsewhere in the world, hypothetically?


----------



## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Buy a book? What in the good **** are you talking about?
> 
> Here, lets make this simple, hows about you tell me the original laws champ. Don't try to strut in here sounding superior.
> 
> If you do or don't believe in god and the bible, the foundation for laws were based from the 10 commandments.


You might want to start with the Code of Hammurabi, King of Babylon...


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

jnrjr79 said:


> Yes, buy a history book. Or just do some googling. Your post was absurd.
> 
> Whether or not I believe in a god or the bible has nothing to do with whether the 10 commandments were the _original_ laws, which was your silly claim. Do you mean to tell me that humanity had no laws in any society until Moses came down from Mount Sinai?
> 
> ...


I do not follow religion. But I do believe morality to play a large factor in the foundation of laws. Were there laws before the 10 commandments? There were morals, I don't know if there were dead set laws, where if you broke them the police would come get you and you'd go to jail. I'm sure if you pissed off the wrong person you'd be stoned or murdered, but I'm not sure how that's the same. 

Modern law was formed on simple, clear cut laws. You do not kill, you do not steal, etc. That foundation to me sounds like it is tied into morals.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> You might want to start with the Code of Hammurabi, King of Babylon...


Nope. I'm not going to do that.


----------



## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> Actually, in your own home state you can find yourself in the clink for 6 months for having just over 2.5 grams of weed... and trust me, there are plenty of people who can roll 2.5 grams into a couple of joints... we're not talking about a lot of pot here.
> 
> For 10g (a little over a quarter ounce.... about $120 bucks worth of decent weed) you can be sent to jail for a year... over 30 grams (not an outrageous amount for personal use) you can get hit with a felony, spend 3 years in the big house and pay up to $25,000 in fines
> 
> ...


And now we're comparing coffee and candy to weed. ****, I've got a couple posts left in me then I think I'll need a break. ------*****----------


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

Dornado said:


> Actually, in your own home state you can find yourself in the clink for 6 months for having just over 2.5 grams of weed... and trust me, there are plenty of people who can roll 2.5 grams into a couple of joints... we're not talking about a lot of pot here.
> 
> For 10g (a little over a quarter ounce.... about $120 bucks worth of decent weed) you can be sent to jail for a year... over 30 grams (not an outrageous amount for personal use) you can get hit with a felony, spend 3 years in the big house and pay up to $25,000 in fines
> 
> And those are just for possession... not selling, not growing... just having.


Alot of it depends on the arresting officer also, I have seen a lot of guys have a ton of weed on them just get a slap on the wrist, do community service, drug addiction prevention or whatever. I have not seen these laws be enforced severely, that being said you dont want to get arrested dont carry around weed, simple.




> Ah, I see... "love it or leave it". Anyway, the "long lasting effects" haven't really been proven... and, for the record, drinking coffee.... eating candy... all have 'long lasting effects'. I would say that believing everything the D.A.R.E. program taught you about weed is probably not the way to go.


I dont need some FDA to prove to me the effects, I have seen what marijuana does. My brother smokes it almost every day and I can honestly say that hes getting dumber by the day and his memory is crap. You cant sit there and tell me that it doesn't have its side effects or that the side effects are un proven.

Yes Candy, Coffee, acetaminophen and almost everything else out there has its side effects but ITS LEGAL. We are talking here about an Illegal drug.



> I don't get the degree of the Michael Jackson adulation either... but I'd disagree that Billy Mays' death went unnoticed... he just wasn't as big of a star... and I have no problem with Billy Mays, but hocking products on TV isn't really enough to qualify you as an American hero in my book.


Never called him an American Hero, I said he lived the American dream that so many people out there dream of, he sold stuff on the Atlantic City Board walk and turned that into a multi million dollar business.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> Nope. I'm not going to do that.


Well, for the record, it pre-dates the 10 commandments.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> Well, for the record, it pre-dates the 10 commandments.


And probably has basic moral foundations such as thou shall not kill, thou shall not steal, etc. Which are the laws that I am saying were the foundation for modern law(1850+).


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

R-Star said:


> And probably has basic moral foundations such as thou shall not kill, thou shall not steal, etc. Which are the laws that I am saying were the foundation for modern law(1850+).


Its actually "eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth"... which might involve the same kind of crimes, but has more to do with social order than morality.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

Mammurabi Laws.

1. If any one ensnares another, putting a ban upon him, but he can not prove it, then he that ensnared him shall be put to death.

2. If any one brings an accusation against a man, and the accused goes to the river and leaps into the river, if he sinks in the river his accuser shall take possession of his house. But if the river proves that the accused is not guilty, and he escapes unhurt, then he who had brought the accusation shall be put to death, while he who leaped into the river shall take possession of the house that had belonged to his accuser.

3. If any one brings an accusation of any crime before the elders, and does not prove what he has charged, he shall, if a capital offense is charged, be put to death.

4. If a Builder builds a house for someone, and does not construct it properly, and the house which he built falls in and kills its owner, then that builder shall be put to death.

5. If a man give his child to a nurse and the child dies in her hands, but the nurse unbeknown to the father and mother nurses another child, then they shall convict her of having nursed another child without the knowledge of the father and mother and her breasts shall be cut off.

6. If any one steals the minor son of another, he shall be put to death.

7. If a man takes a woman to wife, but has no intercourse with her, this woman is no wife to him.

Those are some harsh laws lol. #2 is just crazy.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dornado said:


> Its actually "eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth"... which might involve the same kind of crimes, but has more to do with social order than morality.


That falls under morality to me as well. If someone kills my wife or someone of my family, I will kill them. 

But in doing so, I would go to jail knowing full well why I am there. While I wouldn't agree I did anything wrong, I would understand why I was being called a murderer and serving a sentence.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

R-Star said:


> That falls under morality to me as well. If someone kills my wife or someone of my family, I will kill them.
> 
> But in doing so, I would go to jail knowing full well why I am there. While I wouldn't agree I did anything wrong, I would understand why I was being called a murderer and serving a sentence.



mg:


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

jnrjr79 said:


> mg:


I would be killing the person knowing full well that in the eyes of the law I was committing murder. And that would be fine in my eyes.

While I would see murdering the person who killed my wife as fair justice, I would understand why the law would not view it in the manner. Anyone who murders (not kills in self defense or any other plausible situation) a person and for some reason thinks they shouldn't have to answer to the law is insane.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

8 pages on this topic, oh my goodness we need a basketball season to start right now. My attorney said I'm probably facing 3 years probation, I got no problem with that.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

ScottVdub said:


> 8 pages on this topic, oh my goodness we need a basketball season to start right now. My attorney said I'm probably facing 3 years probation, I got no problem with that.


Are you going to stop growing weed?


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

Dornado said:


> If anything, we should be thanking Scotty for growing so that we don't have to pay some drug cartel for it.... and my post was talking about 'drugs' in general... so that includes groups like the Taliban who can sling heroin and make huge profits from it


You're welcome, I just wish I coulda smoked the **** with you. I had 5 varieties. Bubblegum, Barry Bond's(not named after the baseball player), God Bud, Atomic Northern Lights, and Hawaii Snow. 4 of them cannabis cup award winners.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

thebizkit69u said:


> Are you going to stop growing weed?


i already did, the police tore the **** down and I got evicted and I'm not allowed to do that at my mammas house. If I ever get a medical card I'll grow a little bit, but I'm never growing illegally again.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

ScottVdub said:


> You're welcome, I just wish I coulda smoked the **** with you. I had 5 varieties. Bubblegum, Barry Bond's(not named after the baseball player), God Bud, Atomic Northern Lights, and Hawaii Snow. 4 of them cannabis cup award winners.


So unlike you previously stated then, it wasn't 400 plants just for you then.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

R-Star said:


> And probably has basic moral foundations such as thou shall not kill, thou shall not steal, etc. Which are the laws that I am saying were the foundation for modern law(1850+).


and in George Carlins words, Honor Thy Giver Of Nookie.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

R-Star said:


> So unlike you previously stated then, it wasn't 400 plants just for you then.


No, not just me, my room mate too.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

ScottVdub said:


> i already did, the police tore the **** down and I got evicted and I'm not allowed to do that at my mammas house. If I ever get a medical card I'll grow a little bit, but I'm never growing illegally again.


Well then you learned your lesson and you have nothing to worry about then, just dont do something so stupid again and you will not go to prison.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

ScottVdub said:


> No, not just me, my room mate too.


Scott, I'm not an idiot. I used to smoke a lot of weed, many of my friends still do. 400 plants weren't for you and 1 other dude. Doesn't matter to me. If one of my friends were doing it, I wouldn't judge them. I just wouldn't lose any sleep for them if they got caught either. 
You grew 400 plants with intent to sell some of them, and got caught. Either that or you may have overstated how many plants you actually grew.


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

R-Star said:


> Scott, I'm not an idiot. I used to smoke a lot of weed, many of my friends still do. 400 plants weren't for you and 1 other dude. Doesn't matter to me. If one of my friends were doing it, I wouldn't judge them. I just wouldn't lose any sleep for them if they got caught either.
> You grew 400 plants with intent to sell some of them, and got caught. Either that or you may have overstated how many plants you actually grew.


and im not an idiot either, so im not sayin nothin to incriminate myself. But everything they found in the house that day, was intended on being personal. What I did a month before, I can't say, I smoked alot of high grade weed back then, I don't remember. But I do know that I just wanted to flower out everything in the house and move out of that town and I felt things were getting hot so I didn't wanna do anything that was hotter than the situation already was. But the amount of plants doesnt tell you the amount of weed. Its not like i harvested 400 at a time. i harvest around 50 at a time. About 75 of the plants were unrooted in a cloning machine. about 80 or so just got out of the cloning machine, and several more were in vegetative. I like to have a constant supply of fresh weed. I hate buying stuff from somebody that's a year old. I don't even like buying weed now that I've grown my own. Stuff thats been handled by 4 or 5 drug dealers, bagged 5 or 6 different time, several months old, nah. I like to smoke quarter ounce blunts, and 2 of them per sitting.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

ScottVdub said:


> and im not an idiot either, so im not sayin nothin to incriminate myself. But everything they found in the house that day, was intended on being personal. What I did a month before, I can't say, I smoked alot of high grade weed back then, I don't remember. But I do know that I just wanted to flower out everything in the house and move out of that town and I felt things were getting hot so I didn't wanna do anything that was hotter than the situation already was. But the amount of plants doesnt tell you the amount of weed. Its not like i harvested 400 at a time. i harvest around 50 at a time. About 75 of the plants were unrooted in a cloning machine. about 80 or so just got out of the cloning machine, and several more were in vegetative. I like to have a constant supply of fresh weed. I hate buying stuff from somebody that's a year old. I don't even like buying weed now that I've grown my own. Stuff thats been handled by 4 or 5 drug dealers, bagged 5 or 6 different time, several months old, nah. I like to smoke quarter ounce blunts, and 2 of them per sitting.


Not telling you to incriminate yourself, lets just not sit back and say 400 plants were for personal use. We can just leave it at that if you'd like.


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## someone (Jul 17, 2007)

damn that's a full fledged garden up in your house :lol:


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## ScottVdub (Jul 9, 2002)

someone said:


> damn that's a full fledged garden up in your house :lol:


hell yeah


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