# Your 2004 Draft Bust Pick



## JohnPaxson (Apr 21, 2004)

Mine would have to go to David Harrison. Some team that is starved for size will go for this kid and extremely sorry. Assuming he declares I could see him going mid first round but he will not work out IMO.


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## RetroDreams (Jun 9, 2002)

He reminds me of Steven Hunter for some odd reason. But good call on him, I think he will be a bust as well.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

Ivan Chiriaev.

Tskitishvilli the return.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

Oh yeah... also

Sebastian Telfair
Rafael Araujo


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## PC Load Letter (Jun 29, 2002)

Put me on record as saying Shaun Livingston will end up being considered a bust.

I also see Josh Childress never living up to his potential.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>PC Load Letter</b>!
> Put me on record as saying Shaun Livingston will end up being considered a bust.
> 
> I also see Josh Childress never living up to his potential.


 

For real?


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## JohnPaxson (Apr 21, 2004)

I am a fan of Childress. Great kid, solid work ethic, very intelligent, high basketball IQ. I don't see superstar but I do see a very productive long NBA career.


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## PC Load Letter (Jun 29, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> 
> 
> For real?


No lie, Ace! I assume it's the Shaun Livingston one that prompted your reaction. I just don't see it, man. I think he's being severely overrated simply because he's 6'7". It may sound obvious, but if he was 6'4" with the same skills, he wouldn't be anywhere near the lottery at this point. Don't get me wrong, the kid is talented and will probably be an ok pro, but I don't ever see him being near good enough to warrant where he'll be picked (assuming top five).


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## ztect (Jun 12, 2002)

Whoever the Bulls pick will be a bust....

well at least for the Bulls...

the Bulls will then trade him or not resign him, and
then that player will be a star for some other team.

just my optimistic spin on things 


:grinning:


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## InPaxWeTrust (Sep 16, 2002)

I think we should start a thread picking the brain of the poster JohnPaxson. To have an NBA scout on this board should be taken advantage of. I am sure they are several players that some of us are curious about but do not know enough about. Maybe he does.


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## TRUTHHURTS (Mar 1, 2003)

Okafor 
Deng 


:yes:


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

I haven't really started studying reports in detail, but I liked what I saw of Araujo.

I don't like what I see of Telfair or Ben Gordon. Chiriaev's scouting reports scare me to death. I can't imagine that a guy who's 7'1 and 245 or whatever is really quick enough to play the 2 or the 3 without requiring a team to totally re-adjust the players they put around him (a la 7' SG Allen Iverson).


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Sebastian Telfair.

I hate NYC PGs


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## JohnPaxson (Apr 21, 2004)

> I think we should start a thread picking the brain of the poster JohnPaxson. To have an NBA scout on this board should be taken advantage of. I am sure they are several players that some of us are curious about but do not know enough about. Maybe he does.



I would be fine with this. If a mod wanted to start a thread and maybe sticky it. Make it sort of a question and answer thread on players that you are curious about what I think of them. As long as the questions stayed on course with that and did not get into trade rumors and that kind of thing I would be more than happy to do that. I would actually like that better than getting a ton of PMs from people.


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## Benny the Bull (Jul 25, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> Ivan Chiriaev.
> 
> Tskitishvilli the return.


:yes: 

The way he talks himself up, I hope he is a bust.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

Iam gonna go with Livingston as a possible bust, hes just not ready physically, but then again look at Tayshaun Prince who kinda looks just like Livingston, Tskitishvilli has not had anytime to even showcase i mean hes only averaging 7 minutes a game but his shooting percentage is horrible so bust could be right.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

Pavel Podkolzine.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> Pavel Podkolzine.


is there any vid clips on him, i hear hes got pretty good mobility for his size.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> Ivan Chiriaev.
> 
> Tskitishvilli the return.


Skita didn't hide from NBA scouts/teams...


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>arenas809</b>!
> Skita didn't hide from NBA scouts/teams...


That's not the part I was referring to. Its the frame, supposed skill set, draft slot, and yes.. the comparisons to Dirk. It ain't happening IMO.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> is there any vid clips on him, i hear hes got pretty good mobility for his size.


He actually could be really awsome. He's got a shot and is very fast, but I don't think he had any post game as of last year. We'll see. There were video clips of him on ESPN last year around draft time. His workout was great, but he hadn't been getting any minutes on his team.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> 
> 
> That's not the part I was referring to. Its the frame, supposed skill set, draft slot, and yes.. the comparisons to Dirk. It ain't happening IMO.


Skita has the skill, his confidence is just shot to hell right now...

This Ivan guy has all the confidence in the world, he just doesn't have the skill...


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I think there are going to be a lot of busts in this draft for some reason. It seems like just a really suspect draft. After Okafor, I think the best players of this draft will be late 1st round or early second round picks.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>arenas809</b>!
> 
> 
> Skita has the skill, his confidence is just shot to hell right now...
> ...


Haha, not bad Arenas. I disagree about Tskitishvili but between you and me what else is new, eh? He's bulked up a lot since he came in the league and watching him the few minutes he played this season, he looks like a highly average 4 out there.

Considering he didn't even make the playoff roster, I'd say its fair to call him a bust at this point. Its not like Kiki or Bzdelik has some vendetta against the kid or anything.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> I think there are going to be a lot of busts in this draft for some reason. It seems like just a really suspect draft. After Okafor, I think the best players of this draft will be late 1st round or early second round picks.


No way all the high school kids are busts. Now which ones make it....who knows.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> 
> 
> He actually could be really awsome. He's got a shot and is very fast, but I don't think he had any post game as of last year. We'll see. There were video clips of him on ESPN last year around draft time. His workout was great, but he hadn't been getting any minutes on his team.


They actually worked him into the lineup as the season went on this year. I am not certain that he will be much of a player but one good comparison that I hear is Mark Eaton. This guy can be a force defensively. He has a soft touch. But does he have the skills to even get his shot off in the pros? I dont know. But I think defensively he will impact games as long as he is in shape


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> They actually worked him into the lineup as the season went on this year. I am not certain that he will be much of a player but one good comparison that I hear is Mark Eaton. This guy can be a force defensively. He has a soft touch. But does he have the skills to even get his shot off in the pros? I dont know. But I think defensively he will impact games as long as he is in shape


As athletic as the guy is, I remember being wowed by Yao's workout and relatively unimpressed with Pavel's. Yao's got some post moves you need. He's probably not as fast, but he's more skilled.

Pavel seems like a huge risk pick to me if he's in the lotto. That's par for the course this draft, though. Lots of tempting HS kids and some talented, unproven Euros at the top of a lot of draft boards.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>arenas809</b>!
> 
> 
> Skita has the skill, his confidence is just shot to hell right now...
> ...


Iam gonna agree with you here, i belive Skita has tons of talent, but he was stuck in a place where they where loaded with Fowards, i belive they had Vincent Yar as a project, they had Rodney White,Howard,Ryan Bowen,Harvey, and others, And common guys Skita is only what 21-22? Drafting Carmelo Anthony ment that Skita will have to move to PF now, its a tough place for that kid.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>arenas809</b>!
> 
> 
> Skita has the skill, his confidence is just shot to hell right now...
> ...


http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/TPStory/LAC/20040504/CHIRIAEV04/TPSports/TopStories

Chiriaev signs with Bill Duffy.


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## RP McMurphy (Jul 17, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Iam gonna agree with you here, i belive Skita has tons of talent, but he was stuck in a place where they where loaded with Fowards, i belive they had Vincent Yar as a project, they had Rodney White,Howard,Ryan Bowen,Harvey, and others, And common guys Skita is only what 21-22? Drafting Carmelo Anthony ment that Skita will have to move to PF now, its a tough place for that kid.


Having Rodney White, Ryan Bowen, and Donnell Harvey on your team does not make you loaded with forwards. These guys sucked and were worse than the competition Skita would have faced on nearly every other team. If he couldn't make it there, where could he make it?


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>ArtestFan</b>!
> 
> 
> Having Rodney White, Ryan Bowen, and Donnell Harvey on your team does not make you loaded with forwards. These guys sucked and were worse than the competition Skita would have faced on nearly every other team. If he couldn't make it there, where could he make it?


Rodney White was a lottery pick and Vincent Yarbrough was gonna get a shot with the Nuggz, But you have to look at it like Skita was a project from day one, Hes a Euro kid wich pretty much is kinda like a HS kid.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Rodney White was a lottery pick and Vincent Yarbrough was gonna get a shot with the Nuggz, But you have to look at it like Skita was a project from day one, Hes a Euro kid wich pretty much is kinda like a HS kid.



you mention Vincent Yarborough. This is a guy I wanted us to bring in for a long time now. He has some legit NBA skill and got a lot of experience starting when he was at Denver. He would be an excellent pick up for teh bulls and cheap too I'd imagine since he is out of the league.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> you mention Vincent Yarborough. This is a guy I wanted us to bring in for a long time now. He has some legit NBA skill and got a lot of experience starting when he was at Denver. He would be an excellent pick up for teh bulls and cheap too I'd imagine since he is out of the league.


I see him as a more athletic Dupree with some good Ball handling skills.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> I see him as a more athletic Dupree with some good Ball handling skills.


thats a fair comparison, of course a more atheletic Dupree isn't necessarily a bad thing, particularly with better handles. Also Yarborugh has 2-3 inches on Dupree.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> 
> 
> thats a fair comparison, of course a more atheletic Dupree isn't necessarily a bad thing, particularly with better handles. Also Yarborugh has 2-3 inches on Dupree.


I think best of all hes a natural SF, we dont need anymore 6'5 6'6 SF's.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> I think best of all hes a natural SF, we dont need anymore 6'5 6'6 SF's.



That I agree with wholeheartedly. And his NBA experience sort of gives him a leg up on the Linton Johnsons of the world myself.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> That I agree with wholeheartedly. And his NBA experience sort of gives him a leg up on the Linton Johnsons of the world myself.


If you compare Dupree to Vincent Yarbrough the stats are kinda similar, Both Averaged about 7 ppg, shot about the same and rebounded about the same, but heres something to look at, Yarbrough averaged 2 asst a game in 23 minutes, start this kid and he might be hitting 4 asst a game and if he gets anywhere near the high 30's in minutes you could have a SF who averages about 15 pts 5 asst 5 rbs, his carrer high in points was 18 wich he did 3 times, wich kinda tells you that hes a player that can average in the mid teens for points. Iam not Dupree Bashing but if were gonna take chances on minor league players then why not sign one that is an actuall SF and not a tweener.


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## RetroDreams (Jun 9, 2002)

There is a reason why the Vincent Yarbourghs and Terrence Morris of the world didn't make it big.


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## AdamIllman (May 12, 2003)

I agree with the shaun livingston thing. Anything I've seen of him has not impressed me at all...i don't see it. And his stats are nothing to write home about it.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>RetroDreams</b>!
> There is a reason why the Vincent Yarbourghs and Terrence Morris of the world didn't make it big.


What about the Shirleys,Dupree's,Johnsons,Jeffries and Chandlers of the world?


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> What about the Shirleys,Dupree's,Johnsons,Jeffries and Chandlers of the world?


Busts in no particular order:
Pavel Podkolzine
Shaun Livingston
Sergei Monya
Kirk Snyder
David Harrison
Ivan Chiriav

Surprise really good pickups
Kris Humphries
Darrell Wright
Kosta Perovic
Victor Khryapa
Anderson Verejo
Jameer Nelson


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>whiterhino</b>!
> Surprise really good pickups
> Kris Humphries
> Darrell Wright
> ...


Read my mind whiterhino, I trully was shocked to see Kris Humphries drop all the way down to the late first round where a team like the lakers would take him, Humphries is a huge steal if the lakers got him, I have humphries going in the mid teens, I hope the bulls snag Varejo in the second round along with someone like Matt Freije.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> Matt Freije.


Yawn, Dan Langhi Part 2...


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

the biggets Bust this year will be Pavel


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>arenas809</b>!
> 
> 
> Yawn, Dan Langhi Part 2...


I dont know Matt Freije is 6'9 249 pounds as to Dan was 6'11 220
Freije has close to 30 pounds over Dan, so Freije could actually be a good inside player as well as outsite , Dan a career 33% shooter as to Freije who is in the 40%s. 

Some stuff said about Freije;

"Freije is one of the best two-way threats in the country, capable of knocking down three-pointers or scoring inside... He might not have been the most physical guy in the league, but Freije has proven he’s a gamer."
— Chris Dortch, 2003-04 Blue Ribbon College Basketball Yearbook

"Matt Freije is one of those unique college basketball players, a tall American with a European-style game — a good combination of a long-range shooter, good ball-handling skills, and an improving inside game."
— Larry Conley, ESPN and Jefferson-Pilot Sports Analyst

"At a school renown for both, Matt Freije is the perfect blend of brains and basketball. He is blessed with an outside touch and inside toughness and promises to be the 2003-04 college basketball season’s answer to the NBA’s Dirk Nowitzki."
— Mark Wiedmer, Chattanooga Times Free-Press


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## The Krakken (Jul 17, 2002)

I still say that Telfair will be average at best.
He might make an ASG around 28-29, but not before then.


Livingston? The jury is still out.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>The Krakken</b>!
> I still say that Telfair will be average at best.
> He might make an ASG around 28-29, but not before then.
> 
> ...


the kid would be what 18-19, so your saying its gonna take him alsmost 10 years to play at an allstar level, yet this kid is so packed full of talent and potential, but who knows.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>The Krakken</b>!
> I still say that Telfair will be average at best.
> He might make an ASG around 28-29, but not before then.
> 
> ...


I think Telfair could average 8-9 assists in his rookie year.

He doesn't need to be a dominate scorer, I'm sure he'll get his share of buckets especially in transition, but his job is going to be to control the tempo of the game and get everyone else involved.

He can do that NOW.


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## JohnPaxson (Apr 21, 2004)

Telfair will take a while. I doubt he gets that many assists right away. I do think he will be good. Clippers might be the one team that would play him right away. Although if I was the Clippers I would be going with a vet there. That team is close. Real close. Go get Arroyo.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>JohnPaxson</b>!
> Telfair will take a while. I doubt he gets that many assists right away. I do think he will be good. Clippers might be the one team that would play him right away. Although if I was the Clippers I would be going with a vet there. That team is close. Real close. Go get Arroyo.


We (I'm a Clips fan too JP) have bigger plans than Arroyo....


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>arenas809</b>!
> 
> 
> I think Telfair could average 8-9 assists in his rookie year.
> ...


:laugh: 

8-9 asst his first year out of high school?! This kid will be lucky if he averages 5 asst a game, I do not see Telfair averaging 8-9 asst a game when Jason Kidd, John Stockton, Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas and others have not done in there first year in the NBA after sucessfull college careers.


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

Pavel
Telfair
Kryahpa


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

Pavel and Swift.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> Pavel and Swift.


Swift will be a bust no doubt, Pavel could be a bust or a greg ostertag type player.


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

shaun livingston or andris biedrins


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> :laugh:
> ...


8-9 might be a little high, I should have stayed in 6-7 range. If he's on a team that puts him in a starting, heavy minute backup role, he can do those #s.

I wonder what you base your evaluations off of, according to you everyone's going to be a bust, and I question how much you've actually seen these guys play...especially Pavel. Why don't you call the Clippers, since their scouts discovered him in Siberia and ask them what they think?

A guy like Swift his stock has gone up because he's starting to show signs of being a big time player, that's not the same as starting out as a some hype machine like Chiriaev and ending up being a disappointment.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>texan</b>!
> shaun livingston or andris biedrins


Have you ever seen Biedrins play?

Seriously.

The kid is Dirk O with Kirilenko D....


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ace20004u</b>!
> Pavel and Swift.


I totally disagree on Swift. He plays like a true center with some back to the basket post moves, and he's got a lot of energy. I think he'll be a solid center in the league, actually. He'll need a little more bulk to get major minutes, though.


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## MongolianDeathCloud (Feb 27, 2004)

I don't see Pavel as being as a big a potential bust as some other players, for a couple reasons. He's slipped alot and I don't think he'll go high enough to make him a tremendous bust. Second, he's been described as being animated and emotional, and I think the prototype big stiff is exactly the opposite of that (maybe you Bulls guys are familiar.. ok I'll stop). And the reports I've read say that he does have _some_ skills, so he's not just a raw freak like everyone suggests (remember last year he had people at draft camps drooling over his skills).

It's hard to pick out a bust amongst this draft because there is so much possibility! I think the ultimate bust will be someone picked way too high, because this draft is going to have some star emergence from deep from the looks of it. 

I think that a PG will be taken to early -- they all kind of strike me as questionable, and some team will be kicking itself in the arse when it drafted Reece Gaines and another team got Dirk 2.0.

I think that the UConn boys may end up looking bad -- they're everyone's sweetheart based on the tournament but I dunno they both come with some large drawbacks, both don't have huge amount of upside, and it would not surprise me in the slightes if a few players overtake these guys.

The same can be said for Deng.

I guess it kind of goes against the grain to predict that the college guys could be busts, but my reasoning is that they all look to be picked too high, and will enivtably be passed up by some phenom diamond in the rough. I'm thinking Shane Battier here.

Good call about Perovic being a sleeper, no one seems to pay him much mind this year but he seems to be a good mix of potential and tangible talent (outside of the obvious guys like Howard and Biedrins).


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

How about...

"Whoever the Bulls draft?"

Depending on how you look at it, we've had only two real good lotto picks: Brand and Hinrich - seems like we have a 1/3 chance of getting a good player. Or Paxson is 1 for 1 in his drafting if you ignore the previous results.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DaBullz</b>!
> How about...
> 
> "Whoever the Bulls draft?"
> ...


There were a # guys that if taken at 7 would have been "good" picks as well.

I think picking Hinrich was a "safe" pick....


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>arenas809</b>!
> 
> 
> 8-9 might be a little high, I should have stayed in 6-7 range. If he's on a team that puts him in a starting, heavy minute backup role, he can do those #s.
> ...


Never said telfair was gonna be a bust, i actually think otherwise, but your prediction of 8-9 asst was just far fetched, Swift and Pavel i never said Pavel was going to be a bust but he might not be a star either, iam not sold on swift.


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## MongolianDeathCloud (Feb 27, 2004)

Actually, one guy that I can pinpoint as a bust -- Peter John Ramos. He seems to range from late lotto to 2nd round depending where you go, and everything I've read aobut him screams walking dead big guy stiff. He's been criticized for simply being listless at times, and has no drive or motivation whatsoever.

Seems like that's a familiar trait for failed big guys.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>MongolianDeathCloud</b>!
> He's been criticized for simply being listless at times, and has no drive or motivation whatsoever.
> 
> Seems like that's a familiar trait for failed big guys.


Dont want to start anything but kinda sounds like Curry, lifeless and no motivation.


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## Killuminati (Jul 30, 2002)

I ain't even fimilar with this years draft class due to vast amounts of Europeans and High-Schoolers but if I had to take a stab in the dark I'd go with Telfair or Pavel.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Killuminati</b>!
> I ain't even fimilar with this years draft class due to vast amounts of Europeans and High-Schoolers but if I had to take a stab in the dark I'd go with Telfair or Pavel.


Pavel i understand, But why Telfair? I dont think Telfair will light the league on fire anytime soon, but if your gonna sit there and not see the Talent this kid has then you might have to take a second look, Telfair has TONS of talent. It will take a couple of years to harnest all his potential and showcase it on the court, but i dont think Telfair will flop.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Emeka Okafor or Josh Childress. Role players not stars.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Emeka Okafor or Josh Childress. Role players not stars.


 Is being a role player an automatic chance to call someone a bust? I honestly think Emeka is no bust and will be much more then a Role player, Emeka is good very good he can change the game with his defense and inside game, if your gonna call him a role player then call Ben Wallace a role Player.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Is being a role player an automatic chance to call someone a bust? I honestly think Emeka is no bust and will be much more then a Role player, Emeka is good very good he can change the game with his defense and inside game, if your gonna call him a role player then call Ben Wallace a role Player.


If a no.1 overall pick turns into a role player (aka not a go-to guy) than yes he is a bust. No. 1 overall picks should be able to lift a franchise. I don't see Okafor doing that.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Emeka Okafor or Josh Childress. Role players not stars.


I knew HKF was a freakin genius....

I'll add Luol Deng to that list...


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## Benny the Bull (Jul 25, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> 
> 
> If a no.1 overall pick turns into a role player (aka not a go-to guy) than yes he is a bust. No. 1 overall picks should be able to lift a franchise. I don't see Okafor doing that.


I agree with your view point here. However, a player really can't determine where he will be drafted. I mean if Okafor came out in a really strong draft class, and is taken at 5 or 6, he's not a bust but if taken at No. 1, he's a bust even if he fulfills his maximum potential which may just be as a role player?


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## sMaK (Jun 13, 2002)

Kris Humphries


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> 
> 
> If a no.1 overall pick turns into a role player (aka not a go-to guy) than yes he is a bust. No. 1 overall picks should be able to lift a franchise. I don't see Okafor doing that.


Besides a few name a couple of GO to guys who are PF's. I see Duncan but he really isnt the guy you want to shoot the game winning shoot, Webber same, Martin same, Amare same, I see Okafur lifting up the franchise, Elton Brand is a player who is able to lift a franchise, but you need players to surround them with. Your not gonna build an entire franchise around a big guy without having guys who can shoot around him. I see Okafor Averaging double double his first year, hes gonna be leading reabounder if hes drafted by the Bulls, their best post player probably i dont see how that would be a role player.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Benny the Bull</b>!
> I agree with your view point here. However, a player really can't determine where he will be drafted. I mean if Okafor came out in a really strong draft class, and is taken at 5 or 6, he's not a bust but if taken at No. 1, he's a bust even if he fulfills his maximum potential which may just be as a role player?


You are correct as well. However if Okafor was drafted last year he would have been picked after Nick Collison at the earliest. Now a year later he is the No. 1 pick. I am not buying it. The only reason he is the No.1 pick is because of the youth of this draft class (not many real great sophs or juniors coming out this year), which creates uncertainty. 

Next year Okafor would have an improved Chris Taft, Marvin Williams, Rudy Gay, Chris Paul, Deron Williams, JR Giddens and LaMarcus Aldridge who would all be on his tail for that No. 1 pick. I think he just happened to come along in the right year for himself.

However, I would not use the No. 1 draft pick on him. You know how you know that he isn't an overwhelming can't miss prospect, how many people are talking about trading players to get him. No one that I have heard about. 

People wanted to trade up for Bosh, Melo, Millicic and Lebron. See the difference in that respect. I really think he is the No. 1 pick by default. Although Dwight Howard could have a better rookie year than him.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Besides a few name a couple of GO to guys who are PF's. I see Duncan but he really isnt the guy you want to shoot the game winning shoot, Webber same, Martin same, Amare same, I see Okafur lifting up the franchise, Elton Brand is a player who is able to lift a franchise, but you need players to surround them with. Your not gonna build an entire franchise around a big guy without having guys who can shoot around him. I see Okafor Averaging double double his first year, hes gonna be leading reabounder if hes drafted by the Bulls, their best post player probably i dont see how that would be a role player.


Amare was picked 9th and he is better than Okafor. Martin was picked in the weakest draft in the last half century No. 1 pick. Webber has definitely validated his status as a No.1 pick because his talent level has lifted teams out of the doldrums and into the playoffs every team he has been on. Now he is a on a contender, but make no mistake they needed him. Brand was picked No. 1 but if the Bulls didn't trade him he would be living up to his billing to. 

I am saying as a No. 1 pick you have got to be the guy or you are a bust just like Joe Smith or Michael Olowokandi. You can't just be okay, but you need to be great. Remember the No.1 pick is supposed to be the face of the draft.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> 
> 
> Amare was picked 9th and he is better than Okafor. Martin was picked in the weakest draft in the last half century No. 1 pick. Webber has definitely validated his status as a No.1 pick because his talent level has lifted teams out of the doldrums and into the playoffs every team he has been on. Now he is a on a contender, but make no mistake they needed him. Brand was picked No. 1 but if the Bulls didn't trade him he would be living up to his billing to.
> ...


I understand but your not allways asured a great player even if you have the number 1 pick. Kwame Brown,Olowakandi,Joe Smith,Larry Johnson,Coleman, FIve out of the last 14 number one picks are busts, Martin, Brand, Robinson, are other players who alone are not gonna win you a championship thats 8 numbers 1's who wont win you a championship alone, now i can also add in there Iverson and Webber who wont win you a champioship alone. And if you notice these are all big guys, are all of them role players not really, But i dont see anyone in this years Draft thats better then Okafor. Last year offcourse Okafor is not gonna go Number 1, but whos better then Okafor right now thats in the draft that you would bet all your money on would be an instant impact player?


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Let me clarify, the No.1 pick doesn't have to lead you to a title. I am not saying that. What I am saying is that the No.1 pick should be good enough to get a team to the playoffs and be the leader of the team and be the man. 

Larry Johnson was the man, at least for a little while. He took an expansion team basically to the 2nd round and might have beat the Knicks that one year for Charlotte had Oakley not hurt him. 

If Okafor can be the type of guy that can deliver a team to the playoffs and be a go to player by all means take him. I just don't see that's all. Remember the name of this game is putting the pill in the cup, and I don't think he will do that well enough on this level.


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## ViciousFlogging (Sep 3, 2003)

I don't think anyone is expecting Childress to be a star. He's pegged for late lottery at best, right? Teams draft there either to take a chance on potential or for an immediate contributor with less "upside" (god I hate that word). Childress is the latter. 

I think you'll end up being wrong about Okafor. He won't be a Hakeem or Shaq-level star, but I definitely think he'll be a great player for whoever is lucky enough to take him and not a bust, even at #1. JMO


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ViciousFlogging</b>!
> I don't think anyone is expecting Childress to be a star. He's pegged for late lottery at best, right? Teams draft there either to take a chance on potential or for an immediate contributor with less "upside" (god I hate that word). Childress is the latter.
> 
> I think you'll end up being wrong about Okafor. He won't be a Hakeem or Shaq-level star, but I definitely think he'll be a great player for whoever is lucky enough to take him and not a bust, even at #1. JMO


Do you see Okafor being better than Kenyon Martin or Elton Brand? 

Think carefully before you do though. As yourself this question before you reply to me. What post moves did he show you on the college level that make you think he will be an effective scorer in the NBA (not to mention he is a horrible FT shooter). 

If you want reference, the games against Sweetney, Pittsburgh's physical frontline, Lonny Baxter in the NCAA tournament, Texas in the 2002 NCAA tournament, let me know that real physical teams can work him. We'll see how well that back and his game hold up against the NBA physicality over an 82 game season.


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## ViciousFlogging (Sep 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> 
> 
> Do you see Okafor being better than Kenyon Martin or Elton Brand?
> ...


I see him being better than KMart and at least equal to Brand. KMart had and still has no real moves, but he's a very good PF. Brand had trouble against UConn's frontline in that championship game, but did that mean he was a bust? Nope. Okafor demolished everyone in his path this season for the most part, and not getting the ball for stretches :coughGordon/Browncough: was a big reason why he didn't score even more. That's part of what I love the most about him - he's still improving rapidly.

Okafor has the quick turnaround jumper out of the post. tough to guard because it's so quick. He has good touch around the basket. He flashed a developing face-up game where he could take a dribble or two and rise up for the 10-12 foot jumper. He's a terrific rebounder and the best shotblocker I've seen in years. Absolute discipline and intelligence on the defensive end. His athleticism isn't jaw-dropping but it's only a step or two down. Will it translate over to the NBA? Well he won't come in and be MVP, but I think he'll still be awfully good.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Point taken. I'll just say that Okafor will be in for a rude awakening on the next level. Ben Gordon will end up being the better pro.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Point taken. I'll just say that Okafor will be in for a rude awakening on the next level. Ben Gordon will end up being the better pro.


With all the tools that Emeka has there is no way this guy is not gonna be a bust, second Emeka is a smart kid and i dont think hes expecting to dominate the league at all, he will work hard and will become a better player. Okafor will hold his own. Ben Gordon will not be a better pro.


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