# Game Thread: Philadelphia at Toronto - Oct. 15



## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

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<font face="verdana" size="2">With just about a week till the first preseason game I thought I'd get started and make a thread to get some discussion going on.

I have no idea what the line-ups will be so I'll ask you, what would you want the starting five for the Raptors to be?

My starting five to get the preseason underway would preferably be:

PG - #11 Rafer Alston
SG - #15 Vince Carter
SF - #5 Jalen Rose
PF - #4 Chris Bosh
C - #6 Jerome Moiso

I gave Donyell Marshall and Rafael Araujo strong considerations but I just believe that Hoffa isn't ready yet, and Donyell is not a better player than Jalen at the three, and we can't play Bosh at the five again.

Also, it doesn't look like this game will be broadcasted on television - which is kind of sad considering how Leafs TV broadcasts all Maple Leaf preseason games when they played last year. Got to catch the game on The FAN 590AM.</font>


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## billfindlay10 (Jan 24, 2003)

I like the thought of Moiso starting at the 5. If he has added as much wieght as has been reported, it will be nice to see if he can handle Dallambert in the low block. Also seeing if he can catch a pass from Alston on he break will be something to look for!


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

Moiso wont start Araujo will


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SpeakerBoxxX</b>!
> Moiso wont start Araujo will


Coach Sam Mitchell said this morning that Araujo looks lost on the court so far into their training sessions. I'd doubt that he starts in the first preseason game.


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## CrookedJ (May 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> 
> 
> Coach Sam Mitchell said this morning that Araujo looks lost on the court so far into their training sessions. I'd doubt that he starts in the first preseason game.


i agree, Hoffa won't be starting till December at the earliest. Moiso's put on enough bulk to play center, and Araujo is gonna have to prove his worth before he starts. Look at Bosh last year, he didn't come out starting, and he was more talented.


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## Turkish Delight (Mar 17, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>SpeakerBoxxX</b>!
> Moiso wont start Araujo will


:uhoh:


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## madman (Oct 20, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jcintosun911</b>!
> :uhoh:


what??? why not that way we see what he can do


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>madman</b>!
> 
> 
> what??? why not that way we see what he can do


Because you don't start a rookie in the first preseason game - especially Araujo who looks lost on the court, according to Mitchell. You can still see "what he can do" by not starting him.


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## open mike (Jan 3, 2003)

Although Marshall has said he doesnt care wether or not he starts, i think Mitchell will start him anyway.

Rose
Carter
Marshall
Bosh
Moiso

Considering how packed we are at the 2/3, i think rose and Alston will pretty much play all the time at pg.

Rose(18), Alston (30) Mason Jr. (w.e)
Carter(36) Mo Pete(12) Mason Jr. (w.e)
Marshall(21), Rose(12), Mo Pete (8) Lamond Murray (7)
Bosh (32) Marshall (9) Bonner (7)
Moiso (18) Araujo (18) Woods (12)

Keep in mind, injuries will give more oppurtunities for minutes.

1.Rose...(30)
2.Carter...(36)
3.Marshall...(30)
4.Bosh...(32)
5.Moiso (18)
6.Alston (30)
7.Mo Pete (20)
8.Araujo (18)
9.Mason Jr. (injury time)
10.Lamond Murray (7)
11.Bonner (7)
12.Woods (12)


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## CrookedJ (May 8, 2003)

Your starting lineup is plausable, with Alvin goin down our PG 
plan has changed.

However we will not get 10-11 guys out there every night. Take Woods's away (injury only?) and figure that Bonner & Murray won't be getting minutes every night. Murray might, but Bonner is doubtful. Those minutes will be doled our according to injury or foul trouble, or if a matchup favours them.


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jcintosun911</b>!
> :uhoh:


He may start but that dont means he will play more minutes. I think he will start but wont play more tha 20 mpg at least in until january. 

So Shhh.


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> 
> 
> Because you don't start a rookie in the first preseason game - especially Araujo who looks lost on the court, according to Mitchell. You can still see "what he can do" by not starting him.



Is Preseason !!!

And it doesnt matters if he start or not the important thing is how much minutes he will play. Is like when in the beginning on the last season Brendan Haywood start the games but Ethan Thomas plays most of the minutes.

And Start the games could be a nice experience to him


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## -James- (Apr 27, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>SpeakerBoxxX</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


were haywood and ethan even on the same team last year? :uhoh:


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SpeakerBoxxX</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dude you arn't making sense.


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

I heard Mitchell wanted to play all the younger guys and that the Vets will sit. Has anyone else heard that? Does that mean Alston will not play?


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

^Yeah I heard that too, but I think he was specifically talking about Rose and Carter. Talking about preseason did anyone send Kobe a memo that it was just preseason and should get his teammates more involved


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## CrookedJ (May 8, 2003)

I think they just want to make sure they pick the right players for the roster. Almost the whole team is set, its only Bonner, Sow, Cisse, Mason, Woods, playing for time and spots, so might as well let them at it. Looking forward to the game on SUnday :vbanana: 

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: at Kobe throwing down 35 last night. That'll help your team set up its rotations! Maybe he's trying to show up Shaq already.


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>CrookedJ</b>!
> :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: at Kobe throwing down 35 last night. That'll help your team set up its rotations! Maybe he's trying to show up Shaq already.


Haha look at the Lakers boxscore. Kobe is the only one doing the scoring. This team cannot win anything playing like this. Rudy T better get through to Kobe how to play basketball.


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>-James-</b>!
> 
> 
> were haywood and ethan even on the same team last year? :uhoh:


Etan Thomas Brendan Haywood washington wizards ---> OK ?


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> 
> 
> Haha look at the Lakers boxscore. Kobe is the only one doing the scoring. This team cannot win anything playing like this. Rudy T better get through to Kobe how to play basketball.


It's preseason pal.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

WTF is going on here? the NBA isn't giving a live audio feed? is it playing on the fan? I'm getting nothing right now.:upset:


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

and it looks like the starting center position might be Woods' to lose.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

ANYONE GETTING A FEED?  :sigh:


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SkywalkerAC</b>!
> ANYONE GETTING A FEED?  :sigh:


Feed for what? I don't think its free from NBA.com so I couldn't tell ya. You can go to the FAN 590's site and try it.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> 
> 
> Feed for what? I don't think its free from NBA.com so I couldn't tell ya. You can go to the FAN 590's site and try it.


The feeds from NBA.com are free, they just don't have the raptors game for some reason. I'm getting no noise from the fan.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Go to NBA.com and click on their Flash feed for the game. The Fan isn't broadcasting the game and NBA.com doesn't have a live audio feed to share, either.

Vince with 12 (4-of-8, 0-3 from 3) in the first, Bosh with 11/3 (3-of-4), Woods has 5 boards.
Iverson has 10 points (4-of-6, 1-1 from 3).

30-23 Raps going into the second.


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## VINCEDUNK15 (Mar 2, 2004)

lookin good !!!

BOSH, VINCE, WOODS, MOISO

the real impressions after 1


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Does anyone know if Vince was booed, he seems to be of to an impressive start double figures in just one quarter


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

Vince comes out scoring with 12 in the first. I think this will be indicative of things to come- Vince's return to the pure scorer's role rather than that of point forward could mean Vince puts up top 5 scoring numbers. 

11 points for Bosh in the quarter. Williamson can't handle him. 

Woods starts, Moiso first off the bench. 3 points, 5 rebounds, 2 blocks in the first quarter for Loren, a guy that we haven't had great hopes for to this point. The story at center gets even more interesting. However, Ujo should still get his minutes as the game goes on...

MURRAY is the first forward off the bench. Palacio the first guard. 

Bonner, Murray, and Moiso are the frontline currently on the floor and the Raps are up 43-26!!! with 7:30 left in the second. Gotta love quick offense.


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## laydee-bawla22 (Jul 15, 2003)

On TSN.ca it says VC got a mix of boos and cheers.

Stats wise its looking good for the raps.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Okay maybe this is too early, but seriously Vince is going to have a breakout year, top scorer isnt too much for an offensive talent like him, on the other hand Iverson seems to be having as good a game


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

39-25 Raps.

Moiso, Bonner, Murray, Peterson, Palacio on the floor.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

now peterson is lighting it up (9 points).

Moiso has his 5 rebounds for the half. 10 rebounds from the center spot already.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

outrebounding them 22 to 12 and their starting PG has 0 assists.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

45-30 Raps.
Block party in Toronto! 5 Blocks in the first half so far.
Moiso and Woods with 5 boards each.
Peterson has 9 points.


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## crimedog (Jun 3, 2003)

stats wise it looks like they're having some fun out there. 

good to see positives from mo pete, moiso and woods. 

as well as bosh and vince. 

where's 'yell?

can't wait to watch the game tomorrow after i pull myself out of bed by 12:00.


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Sow and Araujo come-in.
Iverson is lighting it up right now, 15 pts.
45-35.


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

Go Matt Bonner !!


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

Iverson continues to dominate with Raptors starters on the bench; Iverson has 21 pts. Him and Sam D (9 reb/3 blk) have turned the game around since being put back in.

Bonner has 4 points, 2 boards, a block and an assist, Ibb!

Raps still up, 51-45 at the half.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

Looks like Mitchell is giving Marshall the night off. I'm sure they talked about it beforehand.

Raptors scrubs couldn't keep up with the Sixers starters. Dalembert is impressing on the stat sheet.


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

Raptors please do the league a favor, and go bury Milt Palacio somewhere, I hate watching him play. He has to be the worst PG in basketball.


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## crimedog (Jun 3, 2003)

i don't think he'll see much time this year (hoping)

if alvin plays at all, milt will hopefully be the fourth string pg. 

i too hate to watch him.


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

AI is on fire , 27 points

63-69 for Raps

Put Matt on the floor, Sam !!


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

84-83 for Philadelphia with 7:25 in the 4th Qtr.

Chris Bosh is playing great with 15 points and 8 rebounds thus far.

Can't wait for the game at 11.


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## VINCEDUNK15 (Mar 2, 2004)

sow had a chance to tie it with .6 left and he missed both free throws my question is was this a dissapointing loss when we were up by like 20 after 1 quarter and a half or was this a good loss looking at the development of the bench?...

RAPTORS LOST 0-1


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

Sixers wins 99-97 , Sow missed 2 f.t. with 2 seconds to the end.

Bonner 9 points (4-8 from 2, 0-2 from 3), 9 rebounds, 4 assist , 1 block (all right ?)


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## Mr_B (Mar 6, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>VINCEDUNK15</b>!
> sow had a chance to tie it with .6 left and he missed both free throws my question is was this a dissapointing loss when we were up by like 20 after 1 quarter and a half or was this a good loss looking at the development of the bench?...
> 
> RAPTORS LOST 0-1


not at all pre-season all about seeing what your team about and working out the ****** in the armor wins and losses don't mean anything espically with the low minutes all the starters got


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

I really don't care who won the game because the preseason is to see what your guys can do. 

By looking at the box score I am impressed by Roger Mason (11 points in 18 minutes), Matt Bonner (9 points, 9 rebounds), Lamond Murray (15 points), and Chris Bosh (15 points, 8 rebounds).

I'll probably like how other people have played once I see the game at 11. Till then I'll leave my opinions for now.


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## Mr_B (Mar 6, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> I really don't care who won the game because the preseason is to see what your guys can do.
> 
> By looking at the box score I am impressed by Roger Mason (11 points in 18 minutes), Matt Bonner (9 points, 9 rebounds), Lamond Murray (15 points), and Chris Bosh (15 points, 8 rebounds).
> ...


what channel is the game gonna be on


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mr_B</b>!
> what channel is the game gonna be on


Raptors NBA TV.


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## Mr_B (Mar 6, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> 
> 
> Raptors NBA TV.


thanks


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

I really like Roger Mason, he was a lot more impressive out there than Morris Peterson, because he can actually put the ball on the floor and penetrate. The sad thing about Mason is he can play, but he's suffering from leaving college a year too soon.

Peterson did a lot of standing around the perimeter and forcing bad shots, after all the spending this offseason he might have the worst contract of them all compared to his value.

Loren Woods looked solid out there, and seemed like the best five man for the Raptors. Araujo couldn't jump over a Sunday paper, he looked pretty mechanical out there, I'll watch the game over and will have a better opinion.


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## Pejavlade (Jul 10, 2004)

why dint donyell play??


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pejavlade</b>!
> why dint donyell play??


No reason. Coach Mitchell just allowed everyone that normally wouldn't get a chance to play and left Marshall out.

Ousmane Cisse, Alvin Williams, Donyell Marshall, and Norman Richardson were the ones with the DNP.

I still would like to see what Cisse and Richardson can do for the team.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>PhillyPhanatic</b>!
> I really like Roger Mason, he was a lot more impressive out there than Morris Peterson, because he can actually put the ball on the floor and penetrate. The sad thing about Mason is he can play, but he's suffering from leaving college a year too soon.
> 
> Peterson did a lot of standing around the perimeter and forcing bad shots, after all the spending this offseason he might have the worst contract of them all compared to his value.
> ...


Thanks Phanatic. I'd (We'd) really appreciate any observations regarding our play tonight. Could you describe how we looked with the starters on the floor? Moiso wasn't impressive in his limited minutes? 

Mason Jr will have the opportunity to win the bulk of the backup minutes (which should be considerable with a 10 man rotation). Generally, Raps fans are pretty optimistic about his development but haven't seen him play many minutes as a true PG. Pretty agressive on D?


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## madman (Oct 20, 2003)

damn good to see the raps play though


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Pejavlade</b>!
> why dint donyell play??


Mitchell is resting some of the vets in the preseason as he has a lot of player evaluation and development planned for these games.


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## cornerback (Aug 15, 2004)

Peterson's deal is only 3 seasons. His contract hardly hurts us, since we had no chance at cap for 3 years anyways.

he's probably our best defender. He ain't great, but he ain't a scrub either. I don't think he's all that overpaid really. He's a good shooter, gets open, and he knows his role.

he can't handle the ball, but he ain't supposed to. If we wanted a poor poor poor mans Jamal Crawford, Mason would take his spot. But his skills just aren't that highly needed here. Mo's are. He fits this team pretty good.


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## Mr_B (Mar 6, 2004)

I just seen the hilights man bosh looks bigger and his body more defined


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## cornerback (Aug 15, 2004)

I hardly recognized him. I thought it was Karl Malone at first.


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## open mike (Jan 3, 2003)

lmao^^:laugh: 

bosh looked very confident and he looked broader in the shoulders especially. that dunk he threw down got me hyped up. he was tryin to get rose some baskets the whole time


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## hellrazor (Jan 3, 2003)

IMO, bosh didnt look bigger, however he's toned up a bit and looked/played stronger out there. That first dunk was amazing.

Vince and Jalen looked the same. Rafer played very solid. He seems to be a very good fit for Mitchell's offense. I loved watching him set up some bosh dunks. Loren woods was very active getting to the offensive glass. 

Bonner basically played the same role donyell would've played, and did a good job. Mo looked like the same old Mo settling for threes. Roger Mason jr. should be our backup pg if alvin isnt healthy. I wouldn't mind having Sow on the roster for defensive purposes. Palacio is just horrible. I can't stand him running our offense anymore. PLEASE cut him.


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## Raptors15 (May 23, 2003)

did vince go to the rack? or settle for jumpers?


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## Pejavlade (Jul 10, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> 
> 
> No reason. Coach Mitchell just allowed everyone that normally wouldn't get a chance to play and left Marshall out.
> ...


oh thanks i have him in my pool i was getting a little worried


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

Not a good sign for ousmane.

Just watched the highlights and fell in love with Bosh all over again. I can't wait to pull up my Chris Bosh thread as we delve into the season. He's going to get a lot more dunks than VC, that's for damn sure.

I'm just so happy that this running thing isn't a false hope. It is Mitchell's philosophy and we have the roster to pull it off. I can't wait to watch the boys in action.

So Mo Pete's just standing around (again)? Like it or not, that's his role. We have other guys to create the play (and slash), Mo Pete might be nothing more than a reciever in Mitch's offense. Have to wait and see, I'm curious to see if Murray is favoured for his offensive versatility.

I hoped Mitchell would go to Araujo a lot more off the bench. I hope he gives Woods a night off and lets Ujo get in for some minutes on sunday. I wonder if Mitchell would have pushed for Biedrins if he had held some sway. Of course it's FAR too early to even begin giving up on Hoffa.


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## djmyte (Jun 10, 2002)

Tonite was basically a carbon copy of last year with one exception...instead of walking the ball up the court in order to take a jumper, we ran it. But it's only game 1 of preseason so hopefully things will change a bit.


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## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>djmyte</b>!
> Tonite was basically a carbon copy of last year with one exception...instead of walking the ball up the court in order to take a jumper, we ran it. But it's only game 1 of preseason so hopefully things will change a bit.


IMO we looked better than Phily. Had we had our prime guys down the stretch this game would have been ours for the taking.


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## lucky777s (Nov 13, 2003)

So much to say, where to start?

The team looked good. We have enough talent to compete, no doubt about it. Looked better than the Sixers for long stretches. Depth is good.

Djmyte is 100% correct about the offense. We pushed the ball nicely and didn't allow the D to set up and get comfortable, but in the end we are still just a jumpshooting team which is not the formula for consistency.

VC just jacked up shot after shot from outside. He attempted to drive about 4 or 5 times but never tried to finish or go strong. Ended up turning the ball over 2 or 3 of those 'drives'. I don't think this is what other GM's want to see from VC. He has to be more than a jumpshooter. 

Our big men looked good, not great. Hoffa did not play (5 min) Woods has very quick feet and a long reach but is not strong in the paint. Woods got no touches in the post. Moiso was stronger in the paint and got touches on O (some good, some bad) and looked to attack Skinner and Dalembert. They were an improvement over last year. Moiso passed the ball very well too. They will contribute and not hurt us.

(Dalembert is awesome by the way - stronger than I remembered)

Bonner was impressive - out of shape after missing a week of camp, but spotted up well for shots and even put the ball on the floor to attack. Physical on D, and guarded Corliss well on the perimeter.

MasonJr had problems with Philly pressure and doubles at times, but the kid can score. Attack the rim and shoot the 3 ball. Needs PT to gain confidence at the point. Should beat out Milt for PT because our offense is still really halfcourt where Milt hurts us.

Murray showed the variety to his offensive game that MoP just doesn't have. Mo cannot finish in a halfcourt or create for others. Lamond can. Mo looked active on D and on the boards. Lamond had a volleyball spike block on some Sixer in the paint.

Rose was settling for J's like VC.

First unit made no attempt to post anyone up or get to the paint. Second unit gave Moiso some touches down low but looked less organized on the perimeter. Murray and MasonJr were the only creators on the second squad.

Very fast paced game. Sixers stuck with their regulars most of the game. Casual fans will like the higher scoring and quicker game.

But we need to get more low post action. Whether its a big man or whether its Rose/VC/LM, we need to establish some kind of low post presence.

We can't just be a jumpshooting team.


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## madman (Oct 20, 2003)

i am surprised that no one has said anything about Murray's 15 pts, that really helps if he is going to come off the bench and put up those kind of numbers


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## pspot (Jul 14, 2004)

How good are the sixers this year?
Was this an evenly matched team, better or worse then the Raps?
I still cant believe "Raptors TV" televised the Orl/Mia game live and then the Raps game in a one hour show, thats freakin pathetic. No wonder the game didnt sell out.
Rafer is the man, cant wait to see him play all year.


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## cornerback (Aug 15, 2004)

there's a good article on Obrien posted on the Phillie board.

his whole thing for the 6ers is to force teams to take outside shots. Might be a big part of the reason we took so many j's.


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

How look Moiso Body he looks bigger ?


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>pspot</b>!
> How good are the sixers this year?
> Was this an evenly matched team, better or worse then the Raps?


Coming out of this I have to say (comparing starting units) the Raptors have the slight edge, especially if Aaron McKie starts for the Sixers during the season. The Sixers have a gaping hole at the two guard spot, so until someone steps up and earns it, we'll be good as in "not winning the Atlantic or making the playoffs".



> I still cant believe "Raptors TV" televised the Orl/Mia game live and then the Raps game in a one hour show, thats freakin pathetic. No wonder the game didnt sell out.
> Rafer is the man, cant wait to see him play all year.


I have a similar complaint, in the Philly area we don't get to see the Raptors/Sixers game on Sunday even though there's nothing else worth watching on Comcast SportsNet or Philly57. You'd think with the NHL lockout they'd manage to get the Sixers on every time they played a game. Guess I'll have to listen to the radio. :no: 

Oh, and on my complaints for Mo Peterson, I know spotting up is his role, but when he's the best offensive player on the floor at points and he's not trying to expand his game on offense? He makes it too easy for defenders to take him out of the game.

Looking at the Raptors starting five, it's surprising to see them settle for jumpers considering the fact that Jalen, VC, and Skip are all capable of penetrating. I came away with this with a more positive opinion of the Raptors than I had prior to the game.


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## SHOX (Jul 28, 2004)

The Raptors are much more superior than Sixers! .. our main bench playr did not play (marshall) and the sixers gave the starters more minutes than the Raptors did! ... The Raptors is way superior ! iverson played 27 minutes, carter 16 ! come on..


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## djmyte (Jun 10, 2002)

Rafer was pretty impressive last night or at least I thought he was. He really pushed the ball hard and always seemed to find the open man. Unfortunately the open man was always standing on the perimeter and settled for the shot. Rafer really does have great handles and vision. Hopefully our guys will learn to move to the basket without the ball cuz If they do, Rafer will get it to them.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

People make it sound like being a jumpshooting team is something terrible. Its hard for a zebra to change its stripes, we are what we are. Dallas is a jumpshooting team and they are always in the playoffs, we have pretty good shooters on our team, we should make do with what we have


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## kirk_2003 (Jun 23, 2003)

has anyone talked about our passing? it was quite entertaining in the first quarter where they were passing left to right and getting the defense to freeze.... i think we couldve won the game... its just that we played our 2nd and 3rd stringers for a longer period... players that looked good; bosh, rafer, bonner, woods... vince is just vince... i just hope he takes less jump shots and drive more in the upcoming pre-season games... the fans should just stop booin the guy... at least he plays hard for us...


PS: BOSH looked more confident and is going strong to the basket and looks like he refined he stroke... he might beat our expectations... he can really go 20/9 this yr if he stays healthy...


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## djmyte (Jun 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hbwoy</b>!
> People make it sound like being a jumpshooting team is something terrible. Its hard for a zebra to change its stripes, we are what we are. Dallas is a jumpshooting team and they are always in the playoffs, we have pretty good shooters on our team, we should make do with what we have



Dallas isn't exactly the best comparison for jump shooting teams since most teams don't have that type of talent on their rosters. (Btw, when was the last time Dallas even made the Finals?)

Being a perimeter oriented team isn't always a bad thing but it's usually not a good thing either. If you have good, consistant shooters than you can be successful/competitive(ie. Dallas) but if you don't have that type of talent you're going to struggle to win while playing that particular brand of basketball(ie. Raptors). Based on recent history, teams that play inside or balance inside play with outside play are the teams that have the most success. 

The Raptors "are what they are" but if what you are ain't working it's time to try something else.


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## DAllatt (Jun 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hbwoy</b>!
> People make it sound like being a jumpshooting team is something terrible.


Its not....but a jumpshooting team that shoots 40% IS terrible


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## lucky777s (Nov 13, 2003)

I think it goes further than that, djmyte.

To just say 'they are who they are' implies that the Raps don't have the talent to penetrate or post up, which isn't right.

They can post up the big men, and they can post up the bigger guards like Carter, Rose, and Murray. Plus all three of those guards can penetrate off the dribble, as can Alston and MasonJr.

All it takes is effort.

The defense WANTS Toronto to setttle for outside shots. We can't just say 'OK' and do what the opposition wants us to do. Its a matter of forcing our will upon the opponents, of breaking down their defence, and taking control of the game.

Layups and foul shots are the way to efficiently increase scoring. You only get those things by attacking the rim.

And you can't underestimate the importance of getting opposing big men in foul trouble. We all know how few good bigs there are. They can't hurt us sitting on the bench.

The Mavs of the past few years were an entertaining team but thats it. Never a true contender. Never in control of a game. New Jersey played an uptempo style that controlled the game. That is the type of system I thought KO would use here. Its a combo Run and Grind system.


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