# Sam and a 1st rd pick is out, Jaric and Chalmers is in



## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

*Cassell Delt To Clippers (Merged)*

Clippers send Lionel Chalmers and Marko Jaric

Minnesota sends Sam Cassell and a 1st

Reported on XTRA 570 AM in LA as well as other stations.


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## CrackerJack (Jul 2, 2005)

*Re: Cassell Delt To Clippers*

bringing in the experience to guide livingston who should start but i dont know whether chalmers will be any good but jaric should be able to be a decent 1 abd has got a long career ahead of him


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## 23 (Apr 23, 2005)

http://www.nba.com/clippers/
Its been on the radio out here in LA... its not a rumor, its an actual deal.

What do you fellas think of this?

And no, Im not joking, this is a legit trade

well, since the sports show that broke the story has gone off, but during the commercial breaks the headline stories are read off by Vic the Brick and he also reports such news (and has been all afternoon), so im sure he will continue to do so.

Right now Phil Hendrie is coming on... non sports related, which is why I mentioned Vic the Bricks headline updates


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## jokeaward (May 22, 2003)

Uhh... I don't know. The change of scenery and system better help Jaric.

Okay, he passed well. We'll see. As long as he's energetic, somewhat athletic, playing hard, and not too lost, that'll be fine. If he can score well, that'll be good.


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## KokoTheMonkey (Aug 4, 2003)

*Re: Cassell Delt To Clippers*

Wow is all I can say. Cassell and a conditional first round pick to the Clippers. I'm not too sure what to think of Marko Jaric. I didn't really see much of him last year, and the year before when I briefly watched him I wasn't very impressed. 


Sam and Spree are both goners now, so the "cancer" theory will be tested this upcoming season.


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## KokoTheMonkey (Aug 4, 2003)

*Re: Cassell Delt To Clippers*

There are reports that Jaric's deal is 6 years and 40 something million dollars. Ouch.


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## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

*Re: Cassell Delt To Clippers*

It's an interesting move. I like that we were able to move Cassell. If we want to win now, he had to be moved. Him and Hudson on the same team just doesn't work. Jaric is a nice fit because he can probably play with Hudson. He and Troy can split time handling the ball, and he will certainly give this team a more of a chance defensively. We have quite a few options in the backcourt now, with Jaric able to play 3 positions, Wally as a 2/3, and Hudson as a 1/2. Plenty of different looks to go with there. I just have issue with his injury prone past. If he can stay healthy, I'm guessing this is a deal that will go down as a very positive one.


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## socco (Jul 14, 2002)

*Re: Cassell Delt To Clippers*



KokoTheMonkey said:


> There are reports that Jaric's deal is 6 years and 40 something million dollars. Ouch.


Ya, that's the thing that is getting me down about this deal. If he wasn't getting paid so muich, I'd like it alot.



Jonathan Watters said:


> Him and Hudson on the same team just doesn't work.


Same with him and Wally. There were times when he would just flat out refuse to pass to Wally, even when he was wide open. And then the tirades on the bench whining about Wally. We just had to get rid of him, and got pretty good value in return.


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## hirschmanz (Jun 3, 2005)

*Re: Cassell Delt To Clippers*

clips are getting serious about this competing thing, eh?


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## FanOfAll8472 (Jun 28, 2003)

*Re: Cassell Delt To Clippers*

Awesome move. Jaric, assuming he's healthy, is a nice fit. Chalmers is garbage. 6 years, 40 million isn't bad money wise, just long.


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

Yeah guys, sorry I wasn't around when the news when down.... Mom is headed to Egypt in like 3 hours and I have had work so here are my thoughts.

Jaric, defently the guy you want to start for this team at this point. The contract is really iffy, since we already have enough long term contracts. Honestly, Cassell here was not working for us, this is also probably the best deal we could've made. This gives our back court a lot of different options when it comes to who is on the floor. Jaric simply needs to stay healthy. The reason many of you never really noticed him is because he has been hurt. 

But a 6'7" pg really makes up for a 6'4" sg in McCants. And moving Cassell opens up shots for Wally and McCants. And having Jaric up top on the zone will be nice. What makes this trade so good for us is the fact that he doesn't turn the ball over that much. Anything per turnover, he is always in the top 20 in the league. 

But the thing that will surprise some in the Lionel Chambers part. I have been a big fan of his, and do not agree that he was taken too high. I think if you let him play in the NBDL next year and bring him back the next year, I see no need for Hudson anymore. This guy can ball, its that simple. 

If Jaric is always hurt, and if he sort of by himself in the locker room, this trade is bad for us. What this team needs is a guy like Jaric but as a leader... So if he can try and lead this team like a PG should, then its succesful. The guy is like 27, he is in his prime, so this is a good thing for the Wolves if they are serious about being contenders this next season.


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## FanOfAll8472 (Jun 28, 2003)

sheefo13 said:


> But the thing that will surprise some in the Lionel Chambers part. I have been a big fan of his, and do not agree that he was taken too high. I think if you let him play in the NBDL next year and bring him back the next year, I see no need for Hudson anymore. This guy can ball, its that simple.


I haven't seen a whole lot of him, but he looked like only a decent shooter and an otherwise mediocre player. Every report I've read indicates that he has struggled in this league.

How will the lineup look?
Jaric/Hudson/Chalmers (NBDL?)
Hassell/McCants/Jaric/Hoiberg (?)
Szczerbiak/Jaric/Griffin/Ebi
Garnett/Griffin/'Skita
Olowakandi/Madsen/Jones (NBDL?)
Accurate? Probably could slide Griffin/Garnett at C behind Madsen, I'm sure they'll be on the floor together for some stretches.


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

I think Diop will be signed now though too. Chambers and Jones will be in the NBDL no doubt. But it is accurate.

I just wanna make sure everyone keeps an eye out for Chambers, he will be a solid starter in this league.


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## Jermaniac Fan (Jul 27, 2003)

Good trade for both teams!


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## MrFloppy (Jun 25, 2005)

*Re: Cassell Delt To Clippers*



hirschmanz said:


> clips are getting serious about this competing thing, eh?


LOL :biggrin:


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## bruno34115 (Apr 14, 2003)

I think this is a good trade for the Wolves. I hate giving up the pick, but it is protected so if we blow it again next season we'll keep it. I think Jaric is the perfect fit for the team. I am really excited for Wolves basketball now.


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

There is no doubt in my mind that Jaric wants to win. Hopefully he will break out here and average about 12 ppg and 7 apg.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

I don't like sending out the first round pick if I'm a Wolves fan, but Cassell for Jaric is a good swap.


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## SuperHerbie (Jul 11, 2005)

By all accounts a weak draft is anticipated for next year, so we really don't lose too much, it was just the cost of doing business. I like the trade, having added size in the backcourt is never a bad thing, but now the question becomes: What about Bracey?

If like McHale said, we've been targeting Jaric since July 1, then why'd we take Bracey in the first place? Our logjam looks like this:

Jaric/Hudson/Chalmers/Bracey
McCants/Hassell/Hoiberg
Wally/Ebi/Skita
Ticket/Griffin/Madsen
Kandi/D.Jones

I mean, do we really need to carry 4 PGs? I've heard some (I think borderline insane) rumors that we might be able to trade Huddy to Cleveland for Drew Gooden because the Cavs still need a PG, but who wants Hudson that bad?

I like the look of our team right now, but I feel like we're about to bundle up a couple of these guys in another move. The roster doesn't look too bad, but it feels incomplete somehow. Anybody with me?


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

Wright and Chambers are going to be in the NBDL. It is that simple. MAYBE one makes our roster but I highly doubt it. Why lose Bracey's rights like we did to Stepp when he surely is not ready to play in the NBA? Maybe Anthony Carter can be brought back. The thing we need though is a Center. I would not be surprised if Huddy was dealt to the Celtics for something like Blount... Dwayne Jones is a good talent but certainly is not ready offensivly nor physicallly.

But now with Jaric here, Wally would be great along side him and possibly McCants. I do not like the idea of Shad coming off the bench. I think what would be most effective is having McCants and Wally on the floor. Both of them are not good defenders at all, but can hold their own. Plus the best offensive player can always be guarded by Jaric.


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## kaniffmn (Jul 29, 2003)

sheefo13 said:


> Both of them are not good defenders at all, but can hold their own. Plus the best offensive player can always be guarded by Jaric.


Wally can hold his own? Against who? McCants didn't even have to play D at UNC, so I'm still not sure that I'm convinced that he'll just turn it on. I still would rather have Hassell guarding Kobe, Melo, Ray, McGrady, etc. Jaric improves our defense no doubt, but i don't want him guarding those guys.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

Well we clearly won this trade, you can spin all day however you wish.

Giving a guy 40 million when history says next year he's gona play 42 games is in a word, stupid.

You'll see Jaric on the IR for half of next season.

You'll see us in the playoffs.

Cheers.


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## SuperHerbie (Jul 11, 2005)

arenas809 said:


> Well we clearly won this trade, you can spin all day however you wish.
> 
> Giving a guy 40 million when history says next year he's gona play 42 games is in a word, stupid.
> 
> ...


Clearly won this trade, how? Sammy is a terriffic point guard and I wish him all of the best in LA, but to say (I'm gonna paraphrase) that we clearly lost the trade is ridiculous.

Consider: 

1. Sam was effectively freezing out the best shooter in the NBA by refusing to pass the ball to Wally Z. 

2. He was injured quite a bit himself last year and since he isn't growing younger by the day, the odds are more likely that he will experience more injuries.

3. I don't care how nice a player Elton Brand is, he's no Kevin Garnett. If Cassell couldn't get past his own ego enough to play well with the most unselfish Superstar in the game, how much better will he really be setting up Brand or Kaman?

4. Sam no longer fit our team concept and we wanted to get rid of him in favor of someone who would look to create for othersas much or more than himself. I've seen Jaric play a bit, the Clips are going to miss the looks he created for the wing players with his ability to drive the lane and collapse defenses.

5. Jaric is quicker than Cassell and attacks the basket more frequently.

6. Marko isn't a gate on defense like Sam and that was an area we were definitely looking to shore up. Our perimeter defense was godawful last year and we got torched repeatedly by guys who were willing to drive inside a bit. Jason Terry gave me nightmares last season by breaking down our D and getting inside.

7. We gave up a protected first round draft pick in a draft that should be among the thinnest in recent memory. If I were running the team, I would have dealt that pick also. As I said before, that's the cost of doing business to get rid of a player who hindered our ability to win last year and acquire a younger player who fits with our new team better.

8. The Clips basically gave us Chalmers for free, which I love, because that dude was money at Xavier and if or when we trade Hudson, I'd be fine with him as our backup PG. The guy is good and he might get better with some more PT.

9. We just got bigger, quicker and younger. Y'all just got older and slower and more inconsistent. Does anyone really think the Clips would have made this deal if Sam's contract *wasn't* expiring?

10. Right now 6 years at $38 million might look like we're overpaying but, if Marko gets to about 14ppg, 5.5-6.0apg, 4-5rpg then it'll seem like a fair deal. Personally, the money doesn't bother me, I'm not paying him, so I'm not troubled by it in the least.

I think this was a pretty good deal for both teams and I look forward to seeing this lineup in action together.

Clearly won the trade, though? C'mon, it wasn't one-sided at all, but if it was than it probably went our way more than the Clips.


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## socco (Jul 14, 2002)

arenas809 said:


> Well we clearly won this trade, you can spin all day however you wish.
> 
> Giving a guy 40 million when history says next year he's gona play 42 games is in a word, stupid.
> 
> ...


All I can say is to enjoy having Sam Cassell on the Los Angeles Clippers. You'll see...


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

Saying Jaric will average only 6 apg is unreal. This guy have a lot more talented players, and scorers than he did in LA. I wouldn't be surprised if he was getting 9 to 10 a game. 

People are begining to over rate Cassell. He plays no defense. He hates passing the ball. If he is coming off of the bench, he is going to trip. You have seen what the recent Sam Cassell has done to a much better team than LA, with a much better superstar, can you imagine what will happen to LA? You are going to be surprised if the guy Cassell is guarding has not passed him up by the 3 point land. The guy has major hip problems, which are not improving. Plus he is like 36 now.


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## kaniffmn (Jul 29, 2003)

It's definitely not a matter of who won this trade. I feel it works out for both teams. Jaric didn't want to re-up with the Clips because of the obvious....they haven't been anything for a long time. Cassell however, it seems wore out his welcome here in Minny, and though i felt he would have a breakout season, i don't see it happening in Los Angeles. That much is for sure. I love having Jaric in our backcourt. He is tall and rangy, has a good shot, and can penetrate. I absolutely love this deal. We do need more help in the post for KG. Which is why I feel we need Reggie Evans or another guy who can help KG in the post for at least rebounding. But in no way do I see this deal overly affecting either team in any way.


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

Well today on hoopshype, they said KG was not happy with the trade... Huh? He needs to stop with this President Harding stuff only wanting his friends to be around him. He really needs to stop babying about moves and welcome the new guys, not make them feel like outcasts. 
On the other hand, Wally was happy with the trade. They quoted him about how good he feels Jaric is but seriously, he was about as happy as we were for trading Cassell.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

I love Jaric as much as the next CLipper fan, but Arenas is right on this one... He cant stay healthy, sure he has some talent, but the one year he started to show it (last season) he couldn't even start half the time and the other half he was injured. Yes when healthy he will give you a good defender who can play the 1, 2, and 3.

You guys are raggin on Cassell bad, yeah he is old, but last year was his lowest game total. Look at the years before last, 81, 78, 74, 76, 81, games played. Not to mention in '04 he averaged 19.8 and 7.3. Again yes he is old, but comon he isnt at the end of the road. This is his last year of his contract, im projecting he will average 15 and around 7 and play 70 games. If he can do that, which is realistic, we have a great shot at the playoffs. Not to mention we get 6.1 coming off the books next summer cause of this trade. I really dont see any negatives on our end of the trade. If Cassell doesnt work out, I can gurantee you he will get traded and there will be several suitors.

Marko's games played have gone down every year. He did have a great year stats wise last season, but only played 50 games. He has the potential to be a good player for you guys and I wish him the best. The Clippers just didn't want to give a guy 40 million, when he hasnt proven he can finish a season.

I am a Marko fan and if he lives up to his potential then this is a good deal for you guys. But for the 1st alone I would have traded Marko, considering what is going on in Minnesota. Obviously if you guys get back on track, then that 1st rounder doesnt help much.


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## FanOfAll8472 (Jun 28, 2003)

sheefo13 said:


> But now with Jaric here, Wally would be great along side him and possibly McCants. I do not like the idea of Shad coming off the bench. I think what would be most effective is having McCants and Wally on the floor. Both of them are not good defenders at all, but can hold their own. Plus the best offensive player can always be guarded by Jaric.


Why don't you like McCants coming off the bench? IMO, he could provide a lot of scoring off the bench in a Ben Gordon type role.



> 5. Jaric is quicker than Cassell and attacks the basket more frequently.


Jaric is not quicker than Cassell. He maybe a better team player, but there is no way he is quicker than Cassell. In fact, he struggled in LA against the quick PG's.


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## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

Yep, the Wolves fans on this thread have it right. Gloat all you want for now, Clipper fans, but you will realize fairly quickly that Cassell is not that missing piece to the puzzle that will lead you guys to the playoffs. He was in a precipitous decline athletically before his injuries, and simply wasn't able to keep up last season. He can't defend, and isn't really able to much off the dribble anymore either. Not to mention his already volatile attitude, which Clipperland will only bring out even more. My guess is he ends up going on the IR fairly early in the season, and retires at the end of the year. Keep in mind, we had to throw in a first rounder as well, even with Cassell as an expiring contract. 

You guys warned _us_ about Olo two summers ago, and now we are warning _you_ about Cassell.

Clipper fans honestly think a backcourt of Cassell and Mobley is going to work!? :laugh:


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## SuperHerbie (Jul 11, 2005)

FanOfAll8472 said:


> Why don't you like McCants coming off the bench? IMO, he could provide a lot of scoring off the bench in a Ben Gordon type role.
> 
> 
> Jaric is not quicker than Cassell. He maybe a better team player, but there is no way he is quicker than Cassell. In fact, he struggled in LA against the quick PG's.


Yeah, but Sam had trouble with some of the slow ones, too. IMHO he has lost a step or two and it shows.


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## socco (Jul 14, 2002)

sheefo13 said:


> Well today on hoopshype, they said KG was not happy with the trade... Huh? He needs to stop with this President Harding stuff only wanting his friends to be around him. He really needs to stop babying about moves and welcome the new guys, not make them feel like outcasts.
> On the other hand, Wally was happy with the trade. They quoted him about how good he feels Jaric is but seriously, he was about as happy as we were for trading Cassell.


It's not like he's going public saying he hates the trade or anything. He's a human being, he has the right to have an opinion. As long as he doesn't make the new guys feel like outcasts, and he hasn't, then there's no problem.


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## DaFranchise (Jun 29, 2005)

Chalmers Is Garbage. He Is An Undersized Pg Who Cant Shoot The Nba 3. Daniel Ewing Outplayed Him In The Summer League By Far. As For Jaric, 6 Yr 40 Million For An Injury Proned Pg. He Will Play In 50 Games And Will Miss The Rest Cuz Of His Damn Foot Or Back. This Trade Gets The Clips In The Playoffs This Year And If Sam Doesnt Work Out There Are No Worries Cuz He Is A Fa Next Year. I Expect Sam To Be A Model Citizen Because Of Course Its A Contract Year For Him. Clips In The Playoffs!!


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## SuperHerbie (Jul 11, 2005)

DaFranchise said:


> Chalmers Is Garbage. He Is An Undersized Pg Who Cant Shoot The Nba 3. Daniel Ewing Outplayed Him In The Summer League By Far. As For Jaric, 6 Yr 40 Million For An Injury Proned Pg. He Will Play In 50 Games And Will Miss The Rest Cuz Of His Damn Foot Or Back. This Trade Gets The Clips In The Playoffs This Year And If Sam Doesnt Work Out There Are No Worries Cuz He Is A Fa Next Year. I Expect Sam To Be A Model Citizen Because Of Course Its A Contract Year For Him. Clips In The Playoffs!!


It being a contract year means nothing, we all expected some really great things from Sprewell based on his '03-'04 season and that '04-'05 was his contract year. Yeah, I know, "different players, different attitudes," blah, blah, blah...

The Clippers just don't have the same level of talent as the Wolves. I do think Sam will fit better there this season than he would have here, but I would not say that having Cassell automatically guarantees a playoff berth for the Clips. 

Y'all might have had a good season last year, but still the West is pretty stacked. That said, I think Cat Mobley is going to do more for the Clippers chances next season than Sam Cassell. For once it appears the Clippers will have a pretty decent starting five, but remember your new starting PG was ours last year when we were among the preseason favorites to contend for an NBA title. We didn't even make the playoffs despite all the hype.

The Clips don't even have the hype, and aside from being on the bubble of the playoffs, don't have much hope of doing anything more than being the better Los Angeles basketball team this year.


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## The lone wolf (Jul 23, 2003)

DaFranchise said:


> Chalmers Is Garbage. He Is An Undersized Pg Who Cant Shoot The Nba 3. Daniel Ewing Outplayed Him In The Summer League By Far. As For Jaric, 6 Yr 40 Million For An Injury Proned Pg. He Will Play In 50 Games And Will Miss The Rest Cuz Of His Damn Foot Or Back. This Trade Gets The Clips In The Playoffs This Year And If Sam Doesnt Work Out There Are No Worries Cuz He Is A Fa Next Year. I Expect Sam To Be A Model Citizen Because Of Course Its A Contract Year For Him. Clips In The Playoffs!!



I would bet on Cassell spending more time on the bench than Jaric. Not the other way around.


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

The lone wolf said:


> I would bet on Cassell spending more time on the bench than Jaric. Not the other way around.



I expect Cassell to be on the IL more than Jaric too....


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## DaFranchise (Jun 29, 2005)

I Guess We Will Wait And See. Jaric Is Not Worth 6 Yr 40 Million. The Guy Only Plays In 50 Games A Year. Sam Will Be Rejuvenated With The Cat And The Clips Will Easily Have A Better Record Than The Twolves. You Cant Compare Spree To Cassell. Sam Has Got The Experience And The Rings. Playoffs Baby!!


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## SuperHerbie (Jul 11, 2005)

DaFranchise said:


> I Guess We Will Wait And See. Jaric Is Not Worth 6 Yr 40 Million. The Guy Only Plays In 50 Games A Year. Sam Will Be Rejuvenated With The Cat And The Clips Will Easily Have A Better Record Than The Twolves. You Cant Compare Spree To Cassell. Sam Has Got The Experience And The Rings. Playoffs Baby!!


What are you, Dickie V's brother? Of course I can compare Cassell and Sprewell, I already did. 

Jaric actually got 6 years and 38 million, so does that sound like a better deal for him? 

Incidentally, as far as records go, I cordially invite you to return here after the season when we can compare notes on how our respective clubs performed. 

P.S. Sam got his rings as a backup with the Rockets in his first two season. Saying I can't compare two players because one of them has jewelry is laughable, at best. It would be analogous to saying that Mark Madsen is a better player than Kevin Garnett, because Mad Dog was a reserve for the Lake Show during the Shaq/Kobe days.

P.P.S. "Playoffs" baby? Wow.


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## SuperHerbie (Jul 11, 2005)

One other thing while I'm at it...

You talk about experience? Latrell Sprewell was the catalyst of a New York Knicks team that went to the NBA Finals out of the 8th seed. Does that qualify as experience?


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## DaFranchise (Jun 29, 2005)

Sam was a backup but was still integral part of that Houston ball club. Why is everyone in love with Marko? Have u seen him play much? Do u not remember the last Clip you picked up? Oh yeah, it was the Kandi Man. He was a bust and only got worse when he signed with Minny. Even if Sam proves to be a bust at least his contract will be up and free up some cap space. I will take u up on your invitation. See u in the playoffs!!


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## DaFranchise (Jun 29, 2005)

Spree is done and you guys want nothing to do with him. Get off his ****!


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## sheefo13 (Jul 13, 2002)

Nobody is really in love with Marko... We just like him more than Cassell. Plus the point you bring up with getting another Clipper makes no sense. You are telling me that if we were to sign Desanga Diop this summer and then in a year or 2 sign Lebron James they would both be busts??? Eh no.


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## socco (Jul 14, 2002)

DaFranchise said:


> Sam was a backup but was still integral part of that Houston ball club.


That was more than 10 years ago.


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## Serg LeMagnifique (Aug 23, 2005)

this is a good trade for both teams. Jaric plays more defense than cassel and tries to get everyone on the team involve on offense. I don't agree that Chalmers is garbage at all. At the end of the season he was given the opportunity to play more minutes and was impress with his skills. With playing time he is going to grow into a good player.


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