# Jazz and Kirilenko disagree on forward's value



## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

Jazz, Andrei talks 'far apart'

http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,595098139,00.html

By Tim Buckley
Deseret Morning News

Contract extension negotiations between the Jazz and the agent for All-Star Andrei Kirilenko have taken a turn for the worse.

"We're far apart on what we both see his value as being, and I'm not optimistic at the moment," said agent Marc Fleisher, who left with no deal in hand after coming to Salt Lake City for a face-to-face meeting with Jazz basketball operations senior vice president Kevin O'Connor.

"We met (Tuesday) night," Fleisher added Wednesday afternoon, "and I think there's a big disparity in what we see as Andrei's value."

The deadline for agreeing to an extension before this season is Oct. 31, and Fleisher said it is possible things can change before then.

But Kirilenko's side is standing firm on its demand for Pau Gasol money, meaning an extension just like the six-year, roughly $86 million deal Memphis recently gave to its big man from Spain.

The Jazz apparently are offering much less to their forward from Russia — perhaps even less than $76 million over six seasons that, as of last week, they were believed to be willing to pay.

"I think we believe Andrei is in the same class as Pau Gasol," said Fleisher, who got deals done with O'Connor for both big man Mehmet Okur (six years, $50 million) and shooting guard Gordan Giricek (four years, $16 million) this past summer.

"In fact, Andrei was selected over Pau Gasol as an All-Star (last season)," Fleisher added. "And the Jazz don't see it that way."

O'Connor did not return phone messages left Wednesday.

It should come as no great surprise that Kirilenko's camp is using the Gasol deal as a gauge, since that is a max-money rookie-contract extension under terms of the current collective bargaining agreement between the NBA and its players association.

This season, Kirilenko will earn $1.67 million — a far cry from what's in store.
"We believe that the market value for Andrei has been determined apart from us — meaning we didn't determine it, and nor did the Jazz," said Fleisher, who planned to return to his Connecticut office to deal with other client issues.

"It's been determined for us, and we believe, and most people around the league feel, that Andrei is deserving of the sort of money Gasol got."

Fleisher said he and Kirilenko are adamant about that, and that they're willing to forgo the financial security that comes with signing an extension now in order to enter the NBA's free-agency market as a restricted free agent season.

There are pros and cons for both sides if that were to happen, but Fleisher suggested that is what will happen if that is what it takes for Kirilenko to be adequately compensated.

"Absolutely," Fleisher said.

"Andrei would like to get something done now," he added, "but, if not now, we believe there are a lot of teams out there that will believe his market value is as we see it."

Even if another team were to sign Kirilenko to an offer sheet next summer, the Jazz would have the opportunity to match.

They'd have to do so, however, under terms established by another franchise — meaning the possibility of dealing with a heavily front-loaded contract that can be avoided by coming to terms now.

Kirilenko, for his part, has been relatively mum on the issue.

The 23-year-old said last week he was "a little unhappy" that Gasol's extension was done before training camp opened and his was not, but he later expressed hope that a deal would be struck.

Jazz owner Larry H. Miller, too, has said the team would like to extend Kirilenko this month — and that it "makes sense for both sides."

Miller, though, also said it would require a degree of compromise from both sides to reach an accord.

Fleisher, seemingly unwilling to budge, isn't buying it.

"I read where Larry said (last week) he is '90 percent sure' this is gonna get done," the agent said. "I'm nowhere near that optimistic."


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

I am so damned sick of hearing about people's contracts and not getting what they think they are worth and not getting their extension quick enough and blah blah ... begeezus, just play the damned game.


----------



## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I hope the Jazz decide to try and be cheap with AK-47. AK-47 is the only thing I like about the Jazz. If they could get him on another team, that'd be nice.

Cleveland should get him to go with Lebron.


----------



## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> I am so damned sick of hearing about people's contracts and not getting what they think they are worth and not getting their extension quick enough and blah blah ... begeezus, just play the damned game.


Still, you've got to admit, AK deserves what he's asking for. He's at least as good as Gasol (better, really).



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> I hope the Jazz decide to try and be cheap with AK-47. AK-47 is the only thing I like about the Jazz. If they could get him on another team, that'd be nice.
> 
> Cleveland should get him to go with Lebron.


AK pulls a Boozer and heads to the Cavs next summer? I'd laugh my *** off.


----------



## Locke (Jun 16, 2003)

Wow, I'm surprised there's any dispute here. If I were AK I wouldn't sweat it. He'll get maxed out someplace else, guaranteed.


----------



## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

I'm so sick of athletes these days, they are spoiled rotten.

My Grandpa used to say "back in my day, we just played the damn game for hardly any money at all."

It's a shame it's still not like that.


----------



## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

and we'll have another overpaid player in the NBA.

The contracts given out this season have been simply ridiculous. Sorry, AK does not yet warrant the money Pau got. Actually, I don't even think that Gasol deserved that extension.


----------



## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>CiMa</b>!
> I'm so sick of athletes these days, they are spoiled rotten.
> 
> My Grandpa used to say "back in my day, we just played the damn game for hardly any money at all."
> ...


Hey... You would be lying if you were in his shoes to tell me that you wouldn't go for as much money as possible... Hell, him taking little money isn't going to change the NBA, why should he just play and not get the money while guys like Foyle and Fisher get paid all this money? He knows other teams are willing to pay for him, I sure as hell would get as much as I can. Same goes for everyone on this board...


----------



## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> 
> 
> Hey... You would be lying if you were in his shoes to tell me that you wouldn't go for as much money as possible... Hell, him taking little money isn't going to change the NBA, why should he just play and not get the money while guys like Foyle and Fisher get paid all this money? He knows other teams are willing to pay for him, I sure as hell would get as much as I can. Same goes for everyone on this board...


You're missing the point though. Professional Athletes in general are WAY overpaid, but a pretty significant percentage of them feel that they are being underpaid.

Yeah, 60 million isn't enough to last me my whole darn life. I want 70, no make it 80!

Tisk tisk.


----------



## md6655321 (Sep 19, 2004)

And exactly how much do owners make?

You guys just assume that players are asking for ridiculous amount to "play a game." First off, this is their jobs and their livlihood, they deserve the money they can get. Second, how much does he bring to the Jazz? How many wins do they get without him and how many less fans are in the seats? How many jerseys does he sell?

Why is it that the players are the only greedy ones and never the owners? Kirilenko is making 1.67 million this year. I guarantee he brings in ALOT more money than that for the organization.

Kirilenko deserves his market price, which is clearly very high. The Jazz should give it to him because not only is he their franchise player, but because they have got him so cheaply over the past 4 years.


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Simple supply and demand. He is not going anywhere. They will match whatever someone tries to sign him to, so why even try.


----------



## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>CiMa</b>!
> 
> 
> You're missing the point though. Professional Athletes in general are WAY overpaid


Overpaid based on what? Becuase they earn more than you?

In a Capitalistic economy, a person's "worth" is based on the economic impact they have. In this case, Kirilenko's worth is based on how much revenue he will earn for the Jazz. Isolating a single players' impact on revenue is not easy, but financial experts can construct complex models to figure it out.

Unless you have constructed such models and are prepared to present them, I don't think you are capable of determining (credibly) whether athletes are "overpaid." Unless you don't agree with Capitalism, which is valid, in which case you need to have a non-Capitalistic model of how to value workers in the marketplace. Absent either, it just comes off as resentment of people who make more than you.

Just because someone makes a lot of money, doesn't make them overpaid.


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>CiMa</b>!
> 
> 
> You're missing the point though. Professional Athletes in general are WAY overpaid, but a pretty significant percentage of them feel that they are being underpaid.
> ...


Supply and demand. They are not overpaid. When you bring in a lot of cash, they deserve to get paid a nice percentage of that. 

You know who were really underpaid? The stars of the 80's got less than 25% of what these guys got. A lot of owners got filthy rich during the NBA's golden era.


----------



## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

jazz trying to low-ball ak47? they better not otherwise they're going to pay for it..

you know, cavs are going to have enough cap space to sign a max player next year. would be nice if they sign ak47. revenge on the jazz.

anyway, it's weird why they'd overpay boozer and then not be willing to pay kirilenko.. where's the loyalty?


----------



## Yyzlin (Feb 2, 2003)

Grant Hill contract comes off the books. Magic sign Kirilenko to a max or close to max contract. Utah doesn't match. Magic get Kirilenko!!! 

A guy can dream, can't he?


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Kirilenko is restricted at the end of the year. The Jazz will match.


----------



## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

Kirlenko doesn't deserve that money, either does Gasol.

I realize Kirlenko is overrated on this site, but if juys like Gasol, Kirlenko, Martin, Jamison, Marion and so on continue to get max contracts when they aren't even perrenial all-stars the CBA needs to be reworked.


----------



## Yyzlin (Feb 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Kirilenko is restricted at the end of the year. The Jazz will match.


Which doesn't really make sense. Kirilenko is definitely going to get as much or more than Gasol-type money in a free market, and they will be forced to match. They should just give him an extension and get it over with.


----------



## ChristopherJ (Aug 10, 2004)

I think hes demanding too much for 1 third year player.


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Yyzlin</b>!
> 
> Which doesn't really make sense. Kirilenko is definitely going to get as much or more than Gasol-type money in a free market, and they will be forced to match. They should just give him an extension and get it over with.


I agree. However, I feel that they are banking on Kirilenko either proving his worth (i.e. another all-star appearance and a subsequent playoff berth) or him disappointing and them locking him up for cheap. If he takes the Jazz to the playoffs, I definitely feel they will lock him up. If not, someone is going to offer him the max or close to it and the Jazz will match.

Also, they might be waiting to see if a new CBA is in effect, so they don't have to give him 7 years and maybe 4 years instead.


----------



## Yyzlin (Feb 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Jamel Irief</b>!
> Kirlenko doesn't deserve that money, either does Gasol.
> 
> I realize Kirlenko is overrated on this site, but if juys like Gasol, Kirlenko, Martin, Jamison, Marion and so on continue to get max contracts when they aren't even perrenial all-stars the CBA needs to be reworked.


Kirilenko's only 23, and he's already led an underwhelming team to the brink of the playoffs. You would have to be a damn stingy owner not to give him that type of money.


----------



## bballlife (Oct 5, 2003)

AK is a top 15 player in this league, he will get max money.

A way of looking at it is to remember that every team in the league can basically afford 2 max players, and most teams do have 2 players making max money, some have more. Its the way everything is structured right now. 

Who else are the Jazz going to max out if not AK??

PS-I would love to see the lengths of these contracts knocked down a little in the next CBA.


----------



## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

The Jazz have little to gain by giving him a max extension now, and anyone who says they are low-balling him by not doing so is wrong. There's no reason not to just let the season play itself out and then give him the max when the need to do so arises. If he has some kind of freak accident, or for whatever reason just has a terrible season, they're absolved of having to deal with a nightmare contract.

How many franchises cripple themselves by giving out all these huge contracts? Utah is a small-market team owned by a car dealer, this isn't Paul Allen and the Blazers. After giving out some huge contracts this offseason, they're not going to be capricious about spending (the rest of) their money.


----------



## Yyzlin (Feb 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Arclite</b>!
> The Jazz have little to gain by giving him a max extension now, and anyone who says they are low-balling him by not doing so is wrong. There's no reason not to just let the season play itself out and then give him the max when the need to do so arises. If he has some kind of freak accident, or for whatever reason just has a terrible season, they're absolved of having to deal with a nightmare contract.


Is the risk really that different, though? If Kirilenko manages to stay healthy and productive through this year, then the Jazz will still end up giving him a 7-year contract. That's 7 years where a possible freak injury could occur. If they make the extension now, it's 8 possible years. In the long run, I don't really think that extra year's worth of risk is _that_ major. Plus, I would have to imagine that while Kirilenko's camp seems to be standing firm on Gasol money, as long as the extension is fairly close instead of the current lowball offer the Jazz are offering, they will accept. If Kirilenko hit the free market instead, he would be offered far greater. Sure, a year's worth of security is nice, but in my opinion, saving a possible few million bucks a year is more valuable.


----------



## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Yyzlin</b>!
> Is the risk really that different, though? If Kirilenko manages to stay healthy and productive through this year, then the Jazz will still end up giving him a 7-year contract. That's 7 years where a possible freak injury could occur. If they make the extension now, it's 8 possible years. In the long run, I don't really think that extra year's worth of risk is _that_ major. Plus, I would have to imagine that while Kirilenko's camp seems to be standing firm on Gasol money, as long as the extension is fairly close instead of the current lowball offer the Jazz are offering, they will accept. If Kirilenko hit the free market instead, he would be offered far greater. Sure, a year's worth of security is nice, but in my opinion, saving a possible few million bucks a year is more valuable.


AK doesn't deserve max money right now, regardless of other teams overpaying their guys. Them gaining from not signing him to an unreasonably large contract right now has less to do with the possibility of his getting injured during this season than it does with this season being a bigger indicator of whether he is a max-type player. The injury thing was just a small reason.


----------



## sweet_constipation (Jul 3, 2004)

It's a little too late to be discussing who gets paid how much, and who's getting overpaid after seeing the contracts given to players the past few years.

:yes:


----------



## Yyzlin (Feb 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Arclite</b>!
> AK doesn't deserve max money right now, regardless of other teams overpaying their guys. Them gaining from not signing him to an unreasonably large contract right now has less to do with the possibility of his getting injured during this season than it does with this season being a bigger indicator of whether he is a max-type player. The injury thing was just a small reason.


But it doesn't matter if AK "deserves" max money in your opinion. It's if he will _get_ max money. If AK went on the free agent market now, I would have a hard time believing a team wouldn't offer him at least Gasol money. Given a similar season this year and a playoff appearance, and it's pretty much a lock that he will get even more. The Jazz will be forced to match, or lose what would have been their franchise player instead of signing him to a money saving extension now.


----------



## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Yyzlin</b>!
> 
> But it doesn't matter if AK "deserves" max money in your opinion. It's if he will _get_ max money. If AK went on the free agent market now, I would have a hard time believing a team wouldn't offer him at least Gasol money. Given a similar season this year and a playoff appearance, and it's pretty much a lock that he will get even more. The Jazz will be forced to match, or lose what would have been their franchise player instead of signing him to a money saving extension now.


It's the Jazz franchise's opinion that he doesn't deserve it, not mine - and they're the ones making the decisions. He's not on the free agent market right now though. Utah is a conservative franchise (did they ever even offer Stockton more than 7 million a year?) that just spent a ton of money on free agents this offseason. They're not going to throw max money at a guy if they think there's a chance that he might not be worth it. If he has a great season and Utah makes the playoffs and they're sold on him being a franchise player, I highly doubt that they'll have a problem giving him the money he deserves.


----------



## Yyzlin (Feb 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Arclite</b>!
> It's the Jazz franchise's opinion that he doesn't deserve it, not mine - and they're the ones making the decisions. He's not on the free agent market right now though. Utah is a conservative franchise (did they ever even offer Stockton more than 7 million a year?) that just spent a ton of money on free agents this offseason. They're not going to throw max money at a guy if they think there's a chance that he might not be worth it. If he has a great season and Utah makes the playoffs and they're sold on him being a franchise player, I highly doubt that they'll have a problem giving him the money he deserves.


Yes, and I was simply stating my opinion that the Jazz's current decision not to offer Kirilenko an extension is a bad one. They would be saving a lot more money that way, rather than letting Kirilenko test the free agent market and being forced to match.


----------



## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Yyzlin</b>!
> 
> Yes, and I was simply stating my opinion that the Jazz's current decision not to offer Kirilenko an extension is a bad one. They would be saving a lot more money that way, rather than letting Kirilenko test the free agent market and being forced to match.


If Kirilenko had made a big leap from his sophomore to junior seasons as a player, I would say you definitely go ahead and bank on him reaching a certain level of potential. But given the situations, AK didn't really make a big leap from his 2nd to 3rd year at all and I definitely question his ultimate potential as an offensive player.

But, it's also true that Utah has its entire core signed long term, and they're not going to have any financial flexibility in the upcoming years anyways, so them trying to save themselves 10~ million over 7 years might be an exercise in futility.


----------



## Yyzlin (Feb 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Arclite</b>!
> If Kirilenko had made a big leap from his sophomore to junior seasons as a player, I would say you definitely go ahead and bank on him reaching a certain level of potential. But given the situations, AK didn't really make a big leap from his 2nd to 3rd year at all and I definitely question his ultimate potential as an offensive player.


I really wasn't even taking any future improvement into account. I already consider him a franchise player, and at 23, he will be one for a long time. 



> But, it's also true that Utah has its entire core signed long term, and they're not going to have any financial flexibility in the upcoming years anyways, so them trying to save themselves 10~ million over 7 years might be an exercise in futility.


Depending on what the upcoming cap figures are, Utah still has a good chance of falling under it, even with their entire core signed long term, and Kirilenko being generously estimated at $15 mil a year. $10-15 million over 6-7 years is nothing to sneeze at if it helps Utah make it under the cap.


----------



## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Lebron and Kirilenko in the same lineup? That would be scary as hell.


----------



## KokoTheMonkey (Aug 4, 2003)

Kirilienko put together an extremely nice season last year, but I personally don't think it was good enough to earn a max-type contract. As Jamal Irief basically said, secondary superstars like Marion, Martin, Kirilenko, etc really don't deserve to be paid like top-notch players. If Kirilenko steps his game up to another level and takes his team into the playoffs, then I can see him being worth the money. Until then, I don't see him as a top-notch max salary player. 


As for the comparison to Gasol, Gasol had his team win 50 games and make the playoffs, so I'd say he's a little more deserving of some cash as opposed to AK-47. Richard Jefferson raked in 76 mill, so that should be a good start for Kirilenko.


----------



## JazzMan (Feb 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Johnny Mac</b>!
> Lebron and Kirilenko in the same lineup? That would be scary as hell.


That would be the ultimate revenge.

It would also kill me.

I'm in three minds here. Part of me says "give him whatever, we can't afford to lose him", but another part agrees with Arclite, and he is not yet worth a max deal, and he can still get one from us later anyway. 

The other part is thinking about sex, obviously.

I gather AK47 likes Utah, and I think he can be persuaded to stay in an environment that works for him for less than the max. THe Jazz brass must make him feel important and valued if they do not offer an extension now. Even though he is limited offensively, he is the backbone of the team. However good Boozer and Okur are supposed to be, the Jazz would be nothing without Kirilenko.


----------



## John (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> 
> 
> Overpaid based on what? Becuase they earn more than you?
> ...


lol, talks about Econ here? I can still challenge you here, but at least challenge guys with a college degree man, it's not fair for the kids.

You can educate them, but dont challenge them. True winner dont do it, u know?


----------



## JazzMan (Feb 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John</b>!
> 
> 
> lol, talks about Econ here? I can still challenge you here, but at least challenge guys with a college degree man, it's not fair for the kids.
> ...


Who are your tips for Breakout Poster of the year then, John?


----------



## John (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JazzMan</b>!
> 
> 
> Who are your tips for Breakout Poster of the year then, John?



Not you for sure


----------



## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

I think the Jazz would be foolish not to max Andrei out. It's not worth losing him to free agency over. Just give him the max and call it a day. If he works out, great; if not, then trade him.


----------



## kawika (May 7, 2003)

I might be off-base here, but one thing that strikes me about AK that makes it slightly more difficult to determine his market value compared to some other guys, is that while all players are different, of course, he's a fairly unique talent. I mean, his agent can use Gasol as the standard to measure against, but they're really not that similar as players, are they? 

Most of the time, it's not too difficult to 'slot' someone. ie "X is a 6'5" shooting guard who's a good three-point shooter, above average ballhandler, mediocre defender who has problems finishing." (or whatever). And there are usually (at least) a few other guys that are more-or-less the same player. It becomes a lot more subjective when, IMHO, a guy's a real good player but there really aren't too many comps to measure him against.


----------



## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Why should Kirilenko get maxed? Lets say for a second (although I dont agree at all with it) that you guys are right, and he is a little better than Ron Artest. Artest signed a way smaller contract last year I belive. Just because other players are getting rediculous contracts doesnt it right for Kirilenko to demand huge dollars.


----------



## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

If the Jazz wanted to exercise fiscal responsibility, they should have done so before they shot their wad on Boozer. Do they really think AK47 is going to sign for less than Boozer? As a player, I would view it as a slap in the face that they threw all that money at a leeser player and wanted to llowball me.


----------



## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>MemphisX</b>!
> If the Jazz wanted to exercise fiscal responsibility, they should have done so before they shot their wad on Boozer. Do they really think AK47 is going to sign for less than Boozer? As a player, I would view it as a slap in the face that they threw all that money at a leeser player and wanted to llowball me.


Yea, I never realy looked at it that way. Theres no way Boozer should be getting payed more than AK. If big men werent getting payed outrageous amount of money players like Kirilenko wouldnt feel like they're getting stiffed.


----------



## bballlife (Oct 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!
> Why should Kirilenko get maxed? Lets say for a second (although I dont agree at all with it) that you guys are right, and he is a little better than Ron Artest. Artest signed a way smaller contract last year I belive. Just because other players are getting rediculous contracts doesnt it right for Kirilenko to demand huge dollars.



Artest is clearly underpaid in todays market. Part of the reason he didn’t get a huge contract is because he is not always stable, or has the potential to "go off." If he were not a potential head case his deal would probably be worth at least 20 mil more. 

That said, Okur has a 50 mil dollar deal, AK has to be worth a bit more than that don’t you think? 

Put yourself in AK's shoes, you are a top 15 player and you see all these guys you are better than getting big deals. Unless you don't care about money and have no ego, that aint gonna float.


----------



## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

Kirilenko is a top 6 or 7 player in the league. Give him what ever the hell he wants.


----------



## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> As for the comparison to Gasol, Gasol had his team win 50 games and make the playoffs, so I'd say he's a little more deserving of some cash as opposed to AK-47. Richard Jefferson raked in 76 mill, so that should be a good start for Kirilenko.


Gasol played with a lot of really good players. Kirilenko played with pretty good roleplayers. There's no comparison. You can't judge the player based on how well his team did. AK is better than Gasol, by quite a lot, and that's just the end of it.


----------



## KokoTheMonkey (Aug 4, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pan Mengtu</b>!
> 
> 
> Gasol played with a lot of really good players. Kirilenko played with pretty good roleplayers. There's no comparison. You can't judge the player based on how well his team did. AK is better than Gasol, by quite a lot, and that's just the end of it.




If that was the end of it, this thread would never have been started, because the Jazz would have already given him whatever the hell he wanted.



Oh, and let me throw this quote in: 




> "I think we believe Andrei is in the same class as Pau Gasol," said Fleisher, who got deals done with O'Connor for both big man Mehmet Okur (six years, $50 million) and shooting guard Gordan Giricek (four years, $16 million) this past summer.




His agent, the man that will overrate his players more than anybody else, says he is in the same class as Pau........


----------



## RP McMurphy (Jul 17, 2003)

All of you guys are missing the point. The reason the Jazz are waiting is because there's a chance that next summer, the maximum length of a contract will go down to four or five years. Andrei Kirilenko will get a max contract one way or the other, but the Jazz would rather make it a four-year deal than a six-year or seven-year deal.

Kirilenko is a max player, but there's no reason to pay him now rather than later. The Jazz are a smart team because they understand that you don't need to blow your wad of cash at your first opportunity. Memphis would have been wise to wait with Pau Gasol the same way the Jazz are waiting with Andrei Kirilenko.


----------



## JustinSane (May 26, 2003)

A lot of people are saying there is no risk for the Jazz in not giving him the contract this offseason. That's not necessarily the case. They could tick him off enough that he decides he'd rather spend his career elsewhere and he does have the means to accomplish that. He can play under his current contract this season, use the bulk of his salary (and any savings he may have) to purchase a hefty disability policy, and then next offseason sign a one year max contract with the team of his choice after having made clear that he will not re-sign with the Jazz the following offseason under any circumstances. If the Jazz match, they lose him for nothing the following offseason. If they don't match, they lose him immediately. If I were Kirilenko, that is exactly what I would do. I'm that type of vindictive personality


----------



## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Pan Mengtu</b>!
> Kirilenko is a top 6 or 7 player in the league. Give him what ever the hell he wants.



6 or 7? God no.


----------



## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> 6 or 7? God no.


After thinking about it, 8 is the number. kg, duncan, shaq, j-o, kobe, tmac, dirk, Kirilenko.


----------



## Debt Collector (Mar 13, 2003)

i dont really care how good a defender the guy is.... there is no way im giving him a max deal scoring 16.5 on 44 percent shooting... no freakin way


----------



## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>RP McMurphy</b>!
> All of you guys are missing the point. The reason the Jazz are waiting is because there's a chance that next summer, the maximum length of a contract will go down to four or five years. Andrei Kirilenko will get a max contract one way or the other, but the Jazz would rather make it a four-year deal than a six-year or seven-year deal.
> 
> Kirilenko is a max player, but there's no reason to pay him now rather than later. The Jazz are a smart team because they understand that you don't need to blow your wad of cash at your first opportunity. Memphis would have been wise to wait with Pau Gasol the same way the Jazz are waiting with Andrei Kirilenko.


This theory is fine, except for one major flaw. How smart is it to have your best player unhappy for an entire season?


----------



## RP McMurphy (Jul 17, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pan Mengtu</b>!
> This theory is fine, except for one major flaw. How smart is it to have your best player unhappy for an entire season?


The stupid GM's are the ones who give players more money than they need to just to keep them happy. There aren't many players who will pout and pack it in because they wish they had more money, and Andrei Kirilenko is not one of them. And if you *do* think he's immature enough to pack it in because he didn't get paid, you need to stop calling him a Top 8 player.

Kirilenko is a professional, and he knows that in order to get his max contract, he needs to have another great season and lead the Jazz to the playoffs. He's going to have a great year regardless.


----------



## Ryoga (Aug 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JustinSane</b>! He can play under his current contract this season, use the bulk of his salary (and any savings he may have) to purchase a hefty disability policy, and then next offseason sign a one year max contract with the team of his choice after having made clear that he will not re-sign with the Jazz the following offseason under any circumstances.


any offer sheet made to a RFA should be of at lest 3 years, just to avoid the scenario you painted.


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>RP McMurphy</b>!
> 
> 
> The stupid GM's are the ones who give players more money than they need to just to keep them happy. There aren't many players who will pout and pack it in because they wish they had more money, and Andrei Kirilenko is not one of them. And if you *do* think he's immature enough to pack it in because he didn't get paid, you need to stop calling him a Top 8 player.
> ...


This man knows what he is talking about.


----------



## NateBishop3 (Jul 22, 2003)

honestly, I'd give Kirilenko whatever he wants. He's the center piece of a jazz team that should contend in a couple of years. Who else on that team can do what AK-47 does? Certainly not Boozer, or Okur... 

Is Andrei a leader? I don't know... But he leads by example. I'd pay the man!


----------



## BigMike (Jun 12, 2002)

This is really not that big of a deal...at some point, AK will get his $, and the Jazz will pay it...probably before the season, but if not, they'll do whatever it takes to match an offer sheet.


----------



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

Some thoughts

About Ron Artest- He signed his contract before his breakout season, and he is massively underpaid. Plus he is a headcase, unlike ak47.

andrei is worth the money. If you are paying Okur the money he got, you can definately pay your best player andrei.


----------



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

As for andrei, he leads his team in points, rebounds, fg%, steals, and blocks.

why lowball him, you should be lowballing guys like boozer or okur


----------



## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

Well they can look forward to a frontloaded offer sheet if they let him on the market. He would be good compensation for the CLippers missing on Kobe but they won't pay money to another player that won't fill the seats.


----------

