# Pacers 'not learning' or growing in close games



## Basel

> CHARLOTTE, N.C. – No team in the NBA this season has more experience in close games than the 2014-15 Indiana Pacers.
> 
> Through half a season, the Pacers have gained intimate knowledge of this pressure. They've scored pivotal baskets within the final two minutes and even stood up defensively for stops while going down to the wire in 11 games and taking four others to overtime. They have consistently shown the ability to compete, and yet they haven't grown enough to win these games.
> 
> "We're sitting over there looking at (each other) saying it looks familiar," said first-year Pacer C.J. Miles. "'(Darn),' we're doing this again. Alright, then, let's fix it.' We talk about it as competitors, as basketball players, perfectionists at our craft. You want to get the last three possessions back on the next possession and it doesn't work like that."
> 
> The Pacers (15-27) may have more experience than any other opponent in tight games but the results tell a different story. Saturday night in Charlotte marked the latest example of the Pacers' late-game flaws. Unable to outscore an opponent that was missing its top two scorers, Indiana lost to the Hornets 80-71 in overtime.
> 
> Though the Pacers have spent the past 30 days tied up in the same quandary – six of the team's last 10 losses were all one-possession games – they have displayed little resolve. And the frustration continues to build.
> 
> After the loss in Charlotte, veteran power forward David West responded with brutal honesty to a question focused on if the Pacers are familiar with handling close games.
> 
> "We're not winning, so we're not (familiar)," West said, murmuring his words until they finally trailed off. "We're losing these games. We're not learning and I don't know."


http://www.indystar.com/story/sport...ana-pacers-not-learning-and-growing/21967491/
@R-Star @Knick Killer @Gonzo @clownskull @PaCeRhOLiC @Redeemed @Pacers Fan


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## R-Star

I hope they don't learn or grow all year. 

This team needs to be losing games, not winning them. I feel bad for West, but that's about it.


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## Knick Killer

R-Star said:


> I hope they don't learn or grow all year.
> 
> This team needs to be losing games, not winning them. I feel bad for West, but that's about it.


I was just about to post the exact same thing. The last thing I want to see is them squeeze their way into the playoffs to get their asses kicked in 4-5 games.


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## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> I was just about to post the exact same thing. The last thing I want to see is them squeeze their way into the playoffs to get their asses kicked in 4-5 games.


I almost want to trade West so we can at least legit tank instead of this fight for 8th nonsense. 

The season is gone. I don't know what the hell Vogel and Bird are doing.


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## Knick Killer

R-Star said:


> I almost want to trade West so we can at least legit tank instead of this fight for 8th nonsense.
> 
> The season is gone. I don't know what the hell Vogel and Bird are doing.


Well it is a good sign that the guys are still playing hard for Vogel. But yeah, I would agree I wouldn't mind seeing D-West get traded. Maybe they figure this team next season with Paul George back we will be as good as ever. I don't think that will be the case, but maybe they do.


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## R-Star

Knick Killer said:


> Well it is a good sign that the guys are still playing hard for Vogel. But yeah, I would agree I wouldn't mind seeing D-West get traded. Maybe they figure this team next season with Paul George back we will be as good as ever. I don't think that will be the case, but maybe they do.


Even so, if they plan on the team being a contender next year, why not throw this year away and get a top 10 pick? It just doesn't make any sense to me.


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## Bogg

R-Star said:


> I hope they don't learn or grow all year.
> 
> This team needs to be losing games, not winning them. I feel bad for West, but that's about it.


Given what Boston recently got for Rondo and Jeff Green, what's the minimum you would accept for West? Sacramento's shopping for a power forward, would you take the Nik Stauskas/Derrick Williams' expiring contract package they're floating?


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## R-Star

Bogg said:


> Given what Boston recently got for Rondo and Jeff Green, what's the minimum you would accept for West? Sacramento's shopping for a power forward, would you take the Nik Stauskas/Derrick Williams' expiring contract package they're floating?


I've been low on Stauskas since the draft, so I doubt it. Although you'd think he has as much value as a mid to late first so the value is about right, I just don't like the kid.


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## Knick Killer

I would take Nik Stauskas for David West. Stauskas is still incredibly young and could develop into a solid player. I think the window has closed on our current core group so it is time to make some changes.


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## Bogg

Knick Killer said:


> I would take Nik Stauskas for David West. Stauskas is still incredibly young and could develop into a solid player. I think the window has closed on our current core group so it is time to make some changes.


While I think that moving West would be really unpopular in the locker room, getting a good prospect for him and a draft pick in the top 12 of this upcoming draft could really allow Indiana to reload on the fly and turn this Paul George injury into.....well, not a positive, but an opportunity at least. 

I only mention Stauskas because I have a hard time seeing Indiana get a much better prospect than him value-wise, and wouldn't be surprised if he was able to find his stride as a spot-up guy living off Paul George. I suppose you could maybe get Reggie Jackson for him (along with Kendrick Perkins) and move George Hill to the two-guard spot. Other than that, what else is really out there that works for Indy? Chuck Hayes/Landry Fields and a first from Toronto? I suppose if it was the lower of the Knicks/Nuggets firsts in '16 that they hold.


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## R-Star

Bogg said:


> While I think that moving West would be really unpopular in the locker room, getting a good prospect for him and a draft pick in the top 12 of this upcoming draft could really allow Indiana to reload on the fly and turn this Paul George injury into.....well, not a positive, but an opportunity at least.
> 
> I only mention Stauskas because I have a hard time seeing Indiana get a much better prospect than him value-wise, and wouldn't be surprised if he was able to find his stride as a spot-up guy living off Paul George. I suppose you could maybe get Reggie Jackson for him (along with Kendrick Perkins) and move George Hill to the two-guard spot. Other than that, what else is really out there that works for Indy? Chuck Hayes/Landry Fields and a first from Toronto? I suppose if it was the lower of the Knicks/Nuggets firsts in '16 that they hold.


I'd be all over a deal for Jackson. Sign Jackson to an extension this offseason and go after Afflalo.

Jackson / G.Hill
Afflalo / G.Hill
George / S.Hill
Porzingis? / L.Allen
Hibbert / Mahinmi

With the Pacers pick I'm sure we can get a good big man prospect. This years draft is stacked with them.


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## Pacers Fan

This team is so bad. I'm glad this is the year I chose to move to Washington. I can sit back and enjoy the Wizards, and not worry about watching this team. I thought we'd be a little better than 15-30, though, but I guess George Hill's injury has really hurt us and no one's really having a good season.



R-Star said:


> With the Pacers pick I'm sure we can get a good big man prospect. This years draft is stacked with them.


Ditto. Even though we're only 4 games back of the 8th seed, we're the 6th worst team in the NBA this year. With the way Charlotte and Detroit have been playing lately, no way we make the playoffs. If we miraculously fall behind Orlando, that only leaves 4 the tanking teams behind us. Worst-case scenario, that's Myles Turner, Porzingis, or Cauley-Stein. Best-case scenario, Towns or Okafor.

I don't see the need to move West, though. He's underperforming this season, but he's always going to have that 5-17 foot range where he's automatic. Aside from Okafor and maybe Cauley-Stein, I don't think any of the bigs this year are going to make much of an impact next year. If we go big, I'd like to bring that player along slowly with the minutes Luis Scola's been getting. I still think this team can compete as is next year when George returns.

Still wouldn't mind a better guard, too, though. Mudiay, Russell, and Hezonja all have some promise. I'd give Reggie Jackson a shot in free agency as well. Hopefully the Thunder's addition of Waiters knocks his value down a little.


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## R-Star

Pacers Fan said:


> This team is so bad. I'm glad this is the year I chose to move to Washington. I can sit back and enjoy the Wizards, and not worry about watching this team. I thought we'd be a little better than 15-30, though, but I guess George Hill's injury has really hurt us and no one's really having a good season.
> 
> 
> 
> Ditto. Even though we're only 4 games back of the 8th seed, we're the 6th worst team in the NBA this year. With the way Charlotte and Detroit have been playing lately, no way we make the playoffs. If we miraculously fall behind Orlando, that only leaves 4 the tanking teams behind us. Worst-case scenario, that's Myles Turner, Porzingis, or Cauley-Stein. Best-case scenario, Towns or Okafor.
> 
> I don't see the need to move West, though. He's underperforming this season, but he's always going to have that 5-17 foot range where he's automatic. Aside from Okafor and maybe Cauley-Stein, I don't think any of the bigs this year are going to make much of an impact next year. If we go big, I'd like to bring that player along slowly with the minutes Luis Scola's been getting. I still think this team can compete as is next year when George returns.
> 
> Still wouldn't mind a better guard, too, though. Mudiay, Russell, and Hezonja all have some promise. I'd give Reggie Jackson a shot in free agency as well. Hopefully the Thunder's addition of Waiters knocks his value down a little.


Lots of options to get better this summer anyways. I don't think we _have_ to move West, I just want us to lose more games and he's not helping in that area.


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