# Official: 2010 Magic Playoff thread



## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

A little late, but better late than never, right? Come here to vent or discuss anything Playoff related, with your fellow Magic fans. Haters gonna hate, doubters gonna doubt, trolls will troll, but it's all about what the teams do on the bball court. Im feeling pretty confident about our chances against any team, this year. Forget Boston, Forget Cleveland, and Forget LA, It's our time! Here's a nice little video that will get you pumped up, before every game.






GO MAGIC!​


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

*SVG is an ********



> Van Gundy channeled his inner-Don Shula during a 30 minute video session prior to practice, showing his club nearly 80 clips of busts, breakdowns, slips, and errors Orlando committed in Saturday's Game Three. That's 80 out of approximately 200 offensive and defensive sets. Do the math. More than a third of the game was unacceptable to the bench boss.
> 
> Let the record show the Magic won by 30 points--it wasn't that close--and seek a four game series sweep Monday. But despite being just one win away from a return to the Eastern Conference Finals don't expect any attaboys.
> 
> ...


The guy's such a negative nancy...he's probably that guy that sucks the joy out of everything. I understand keeping your guys on their toes, but I feel like he overdoes it.

*On another note*



> ATLANTA – With his Orlando Magic possibly on the verge of their second four-game sweep in as many weeks, small forward Matt Barnes was asked on Sunday about the prospect of recreating Moses Malone’s famous ``Fo’, Fo’ Fo’’’ prediction.
> 
> ``Yeah, Moses Malone, baby,’’ said Barnes, one of the players old enough to recall the 27-year-old prediction. ``That would be great, wouldn’t it? It’s a lot easier said than done, but that’s what we’re going for.’’
> 
> ...


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## Adam (Jan 28, 2003)

^He's obnoxious and he was 2 seconds from being canned last year when the Magic struggled against Philly. Howard was public complaining about him and the fans wanted his head.

The national media likes to make him into a martyr after Riley dumped him but the simple truth was that he got fired for his ****. Good coach but like Larry Brown he can't stick any one place for more than a couple seasons.

Back on topic, this Magic team reminds me of the Heat team that won the championship. Everyone was counting us out after a big trade and saying we lost our chance and when the playoffs came we left everyone in our dust. History often repeats itself.


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## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

Fo', Fo', Fo'


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

*Link*



> Orlando is so hot. Winning for the 14th consecutive time, standing a perfect 8-0 as David Stern's only undefeated band in the merry month of May. The Magic led every second of every minute of their two game party in The Highlight Factory. With more glitter than a disco ball, the Magic blinged from outside the arch. Pardon me Barry Gibb, but Orlando Bee-Geed 16 treys, one shy of the franchise playoff record established last spring while taking out the Pre-Shaq, Pre-Jamison, Pre-Whoever-Else-They-Added Cavs. Even 35 year old Jason Williams--wide eyed, mouth agape, laughing with teammates--ran arms opened wide down the court after making his first two of the playoffs. Four threes for Rashard Lewis. Four for Vince Carter. Four for Michael Pietrus. Recognize a pattern?


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

*The intrigue of a Suns-Magic Final*



> You want entertainment? You want ratings? You want scintillating matchups, TV-ready backstories, and the breathless anxiety of two star-crossed franchises staring Destiny dead in the face?
> 
> Then you want Phoenix to play Orlando in the NBA Finals. Two time zones and 2100 miles apart, and yet at times, mirror images.
> 
> ...


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## HB (May 1, 2004)




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## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

*Matt Barnes would love to guard Paul Pierce, calls Pierce a flopper*



> “I’d love to guard Pierce,” Barnes said. “I got the chance to guard him a little bit the last game and felt that I did a pretty good job. But he’s really rolling right now. So we need to slow him down somehow.”
> 
> 
> It was Barnes who revealed last week that his assignment for Game 1 was Ray Allen instead of Pierce, whom he guarded during the regular season. Pierce is averaging 25 points, seven rebounds and five assists per game in the Eastern Conference Finals.
> ...


We gotta shut Pierce down in game 3... Tired of seeing that fool beat us, with that little smirk & wink on his face. Barnes, Lewis, i dont care who guards him, but we cannot let one man beat us 3 games in a row.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

All I know is, his twitter account wasn't hacked


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

*Is Charley onto something?*



> Actually, whatever part of his game Howard emphasizes, his defensive prowess is highly overrated. That’s because he’s too easily drawn to the ball, yearning to pad his swat column. But the championship-tested Celtic big men simply slide into the spaces around the rim that Howard vacates, and wind up with numerous uncontested layups. This same tendency was likewise trumped by the Lakers in last year’s championship series.
> 
> Howard still doesn’t know when to make a full help commitment to ball penetration, and when to show and recover. And his current big man coach, the defensively challenged Patrick Ewing (at least in the NBA) is proving to be of less help here than he is on the offensive end. It’s clear that Howard’s in-the-post moves have not expanded or improved since Ewing replaced Clifford Ray (who happens to be the best big man’s coach in the league). One also wonders if Ray’s insistence that Howard work harder and longer than he wanted to had something to do with Ray’s untimely exit. How ironic that Ray has been coaching Kendrick Perkins since then, and it’s Perkins' manful defense that has contributed to Howard’s befuddlement in this series.
> 
> Secondary results of Howard’s ball-oriented wanderlust on defense were wide-open jumpers created when the Celtics' swing passes took full advantage of Orlando’s skewed defense.


Howard's not the only problem though.


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## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

No, he isn't on to anything. He's about 1 year late with his critique of Howard's rotations. That was a problem a year or 2 ago, but he is much more disciplined when it comes to filling lanes and anticipation. The only time guys are usually open with him is on screen & rolls where Howard doesn't want to leave the paint area so he leaves his man open. That's more about a defensive philosophy tho than being lost on the defensive end... I rarely see him out of position due to chasing blocks, because it is the responsibility of the weakside to cover that pass. But if he truly thinks Howard is overrated, i'd love to see who he thinks is better. If his response is Kendrick Perkins, than he just pretty much lost all credibility. 

Dwight is a better offensive and defensive player than Perkins, especially if we're taking about filing lanes and mobility. If we're talking about man-to-man D only, then it's arguable, but Dwight is probably better at everything else(from what I've seen). Offensively, Dwight is miles ahead of Perk. He may be abit inconsistent, i'll give you that, but I dont think i've EVER seen Perk take over a game.


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## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

Check out some of Dwight's moves.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

Blue Magic said:


> If his response is Kendrick Perkins, than he just pretty much lost all credibility.
> 
> Dwight is a better offensive and defensive player than Perkins, especially if we're taking about filing lanes and mobility. If we're talking about man-to-man D only, then it's arguable, but Dwight is probably better at everything else(from what I've seen). Offensively, Dwight is miles ahead of Perk. He may be abit inconsistent, i'll give you that, but I dont think i've EVER seen Perk take over a game.


Perkins has gone from end-of-the-bench liability that did nothing all that well to an excellent defensive center that's semi-competent on offense. Dwight's always had enormous talent(averaged a double-double as a rookie out of high school). The point isn't that Perk is better than Dwight(he isn't) but that Perk, who has a reputation for being an extremely hard worker, has made much greater strides in the same time than Dwight has, relatively speaking.

EDIT: Cliff Ray also developed Al Jefferson from overweight teenager into a nightly double-double with excellent post moves. There's really no debating that Cliff Ray is an excellent big man coach.


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## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

Bogg said:


> Perkins has gone from end-of-the-bench liability that did nothing all that well to an excellent defensive center that's semi-competent on offense. Dwight's always had enormous talent(averaged a double-double as a rookie out of high school). The point isn't that Perk is better than Dwight(he isn't) but that Perk, who has a reputation for being an extremely hard worker, has made much greater strides in the same time than Dwight has, relatively speaking.
> 
> EDIT: Cliff Ray also developed Al Jefferson from overweight teenager into a nightly double-double with excellent post moves. There's really no debating that Cliff Ray is an excellent big man coach.


That is weak sauce. This guy is saying that Dwight is an overrated defender because he thinks Boston's bigs were scoring at will over him? Boston's bigs had a pretty small offensive impact in the paint in this series. KG did little on O aside from hit a few 15footers, Perk was almost a non-factor on O, Baby did okay for his mins and mixed it up the best imo, but Sheed did all his damage on the perimeter. Paul Pierce and Ray Allen pretty much did all the heavy lifting for them, and this guy is speaking like Dwight was getting exposed? Lol, Boston's big men were pretty much useless, especially when they tried to go 1on1 with Dwight. Dude has no case for calling him overrated, at all.

Meanwhile on the other end, Dwight pretty much scored at will on them in 4 out of 6 games. He put the 'no offense' myth to rest, by hanging 3 games of 28+ points on the supposed "Dwight Howard stoppers". This clown is speaking like Howard was lost or getting shut down. Even if we're talking about just D tho, Dwight clearly was better than Perk and I dont care what you say about relative improvement. 

Dwight has made great strides in his game on both ends of the court, and to say otherwise is just an attempt to discredit him and his work ethic. Dude came in out of HS, and turned himself into one of the most fit, hard working guys in the league. He couldve pulled an Olowakandi, Kwame Brown, or a Marvin Williams, but his work ethic is why he is currently at superstar status. Relatively speaking, I'd say Dwight is miles ahead of Perk in both actual game, game development, and work ethic. Heck, Kendrick Perkins still has a gut and Dwight is probably the most fit guy in the league your telling me the other guy is more dedicated? Howard is breaking ancient records, and is one of the more consistent guys in the league, and you're saying a specialist is working harder? No way you can tell me that this guy is getting outworked by Kendrick Perkins. That is asinine. Perk is a good defender and everything, but to act like this dude is more dedicated than Dwight is just asinine.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

Blue Magic said:


> That is weak sauce. This guy is saying that Dwight is an overrated defender because he thinks Boston's bigs were scoring at will over him? Boston's bigs had a pretty small offensive impact in the paint in this series. KG did little on O aside from hit a few 15footers, Perk was almost a non-factor on O, Baby did okay for his mins and mixed it up the best imo, but Sheed did all his damage on the perimeter. Paul Pierce and Ray Allen pretty much did all the heavy lifting for them, and this guy is speaking like Dwight was getting exposed? Lol, Boston's big men were pretty much useless, especially when they tried to go 1on1 with Dwight. Dude has no case for calling him overrated, at all.



I was more addressing the comments about Dwight's play on the offensive end and the development of his post moves than his defense. I thought he was fine on defense, if not completely dominant. It's hard to blame him for the team defense when Barnes is the only other guy I'd call a "defender" in the rotation(before this series I'd have included Pietrus, but he disappeared). 





Blue Magic said:


> Meanwhile on the other end, Dwight pretty much scored at will on them in 4 out of 6 games. He put the 'no offense' myth to rest, by hanging 3 games of 28+ points on the supposed "Dwight Howard stoppers". This clown is speaking like Howard was lost or getting shut down. Even if we're talking about just D tho, Dwight clearly was better than Perk and I dont care what you say about relative improvement.


Again, you're confusing the point behind the Clifford Ray comments, and I don't really think you get what just happened in the ECF. Boston's entire game plan was to play Dwight in one-on-one man coverage with role players and shut down the rest of the Orlando team, which they did fairly effectively. Sure, averaging a shade under 22 and 11 for the series looks good on paper, but Dwight was in single coverage against good-but-not-great role players for the majority of the series. With the exception of game four (32 pts, 16 reb) Doc Rivers basically challenged Dwight to beat the Celtics on offense and he didn't. 





Blue Magic said:


> Dwight has made great strides in his game on both ends of the court, and to say otherwise is just an attempt to discredit him and his work ethic. Dude came in out of HS, and turned himself into one of the most fit, hard working guys in the league. He couldve pulled an Olowakandi, Kwame Brown, or a Marvin Williams, but his work ethic is why he is currently at superstar status. Relatively speaking, I'd say Dwight is miles ahead of Perk in both actual game, game development, and work ethic. Heck, Kendrick Perkins still has a gut and Dwight is probably the most fit guy in the league your telling me the other guy is more dedicated? Howard is breaking ancient records, and is one of the more consistent guys in the league, and you're saying a specialist is working harder? No way you can tell me that this guy is getting outworked by Kendrick Perkins. That is asinine. Perk is a good defender and everything, but to act like this dude is more dedicated than Dwight is just asinine.




Dwight loves doing sit-ups, I get that, but he needs to spend some time on his footwork and shooting too. Dwight's numbers, and to a degree his game, have plateaued since the 07-08 season. For the past three years his offensive repertoire has consisted of a drop-step dunk and a baby hook - he's developed no mid-range jumpshot, no up-and-under, no turnaround/fade-away, and no real touch moves/floaters. In the same time frame Perkins has gone from stop-gap center and oftentime liability to high-level role player. Maybe this has something to do with Cliff Ray moving from Orlando to Boston, maybe not, but there is a much greater difference between 2008 Perkins and 2010 Perkins than there is between 2008 Howard and 2010 Howard - and honestly, it isn't even debatable. 

Lastly, nobody is arguing that Perkins is better than Dwight Howard, so bringing up anything to that point is just setting up a straw man.


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## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

Bogg said:


> I was more addressing the comments about Dwight's play on the offensive end and the development of his post moves than his defense. I thought he was fine on defense, if not completely dominant. It's hard to blame him for the team defense when Barnes is the only other guy I'd call a "defender" in the rotation(before this series I'd have included Pietrus, but he disappeared).
> 
> Again, you're confusing the point behind the Clifford Ray comments, and I don't really think you get what just happened in the ECF. Boston's entire game plan was to play Dwight in one-on-one man coverage with role players and shut down the rest of the Orlando team, which they did fairly effectively. Sure, averaging a shade under 22 and 11 for the series looks good on paper, but Dwight was in single coverage against good-but-not-great role players for the majority of the series. With the exception of game four (32 pts, 16 reb) Doc Rivers basically challenged Dwight to beat the Celtics on offense and he didn't.
> 
> ...


So Perkins has improved leaps and bounds, and Dwight is sitting on his ass and only doing sit-ups? You have no ****ing clue what what you're talking about bro, Im sorry. I have watched this dude develop, and he is much much better than he was 3 years. He has gotten better every year, just in terms of the little things. Poise, focus, confidence, and making less mistakes, seeing double teams, etc. Dude is getting better just in terms of the way he is seeing the game. Perkins may have improved a little bit, but that dude is still way more limited than Dwight. 

Just following the trend of their PER's, Dwight improvement over his career is far greater than Perkins. Everything that you and this author are saying, pretty much has no basis. Perkins first season playing over 50 games, he had a PER of 11. In Dwight's first year, he had a PER of 17. This year, Perk had a PER of 15 and Dwight had a PER of 24. No way Perk has improved more... Not saying he doesn't work hard, but to imply that Dwight is lunching while Perk is over here refining all of these advanced moves is a joke. If we're talking about production, development, or whatever... There is nothing indicating that Dwight is a slacker, much less that Perk is working harder them him. Absolutly NOTHING backs up that claim, at all. im sorry. It's a preposterous statement from a homer. Even if we're just doing 2008-2010, Perkins PER's were: 13.3, 13.2, 15.0... Dwight's PER's were: 22.9, 25.4, 24.0... Dwight has improved alot since '05-'06, when Patric took over for Ray.


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

I don't know how much Perkins have improved throughout the years because I don't really follow the Celtics all that much. However watching Howard this year I can't say he got any better than last year which leads me to believe that he likely won't make any significant improvements next year. I think it's safe to say that he will never develop any sort of jump shot (neither has Shaq) nor will he ever have above average touch around the basket. 

But to be honest even if Dwight doesn't make any significant improvements what he is now as a center is already pretty damn good. He is going to put up around 20/13 while giving you the best defense in the league at the center position at least until his contract runs out. He's the least of Orlando's problems and I don't think people should dwell on his shortcomings and ignore his strengths. To me criticizing Dwight Howard's offense is like criticizing Lebron's 3pt shot. It would be nice if both of them improve but it's not why their teams aren't winning championships. Those players have already done more than enough to be the main guys on their team and it is the rest of the team that is letting them down.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

Blue Magic said:


> So Perkins has improved leaps and bounds, and Dwight is sitting on his ass and only doing sit-ups? You have no ****ing clue what what you're talking about bro, Im sorry. I have watched this dude develop, and he is much much better than he was 3 years. He has gotten better every year, just in terms of the little things. Poise, focus, confidence, and making less mistakes, seeing double teams, etc. Dude is getting better just in terms of the way he is seeing the game. Perkins may have improved a little bit, but that dude is still way more limited than Dwight.
> 
> Just following the trend of their PER's, Dwight improvement over his career is far greater than Perkins. Everything that you and this author are saying, pretty much has no basis. Perkins first season playing over 50 games, he had a PER of 11. In Dwight's first year, he had a PER of 17. This year, Perk had a PER of 15 and Dwight had a PER of 24. No way Perk has improved more... Not saying he doesn't work hard, but to imply that Dwight is lunching while Perk is over here refining all of these advanced moves is a joke. If we're talking about production, development, or whatever... There is nothing indicating that Dwight is a slacker, much less that Perk is working harder them him. Absolutly NOTHING backs up that claim, at all. im sorry. It's a preposterous statement from a homer. Even if we're just doing 2008-2010, Perkins PER's were: 13.3, 13.2, 15.0... Dwight's PER's were: 22.9, 25.4, 24.0... Dwight has improved alot since '05-'06, when Patric took over for Ray.


Again.........it's not that one player is "working harder" than the other, which I never said, but rather what they're working on. You keep comparing Dwight's overall ability to Perk's overall ability when that isn't the conversation anybody's having. 

The fact of the matter is that Dwight's probably been the best center in the league for three or four years now and hasn't developed a reliable post-up gaming, relying heavily on athleticism to get his buckets. He's either not putting in the work needed to become a go-to scorer, or he is putting in tons of work on his offensive game and just isn't capable of being that type of player. Honestly, as a Magic fan, I'd want to believe the former. Orlando is going to be in trouble as a franchise if "three or four fat guys" continues to be an effective way to check their franchise player.


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## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

Honestly, they really weren't effective in checking him, so idk what you're talking about. Dwight's offense wasn't the problem, as he had 3 games over 28+ points... How are you seeing offense as a problem? He did his part on both ends of the court, the problem was Vince and Rashard Lewis absolutely failing miserably in the series, just a look at their %'s will verify. 

I'll give Lewis a pass because he supposedly had the flu, and his matchup was alot more unfavorable... We should've got him alot more reps at the 3. But Vince, you're telling me he got shut down by Pierce and Allen? I dont know if he has an excuse, because he had Pierce or Allen 1on1 all series, and put up some miserable %'s. KG had to stick on Lewis, Perk on Dwight, and Rondo on Meer, so it's not like their D was keying on him... He just couldn't deliver for us. To blame Dwight, suggests to me that we didn't watch the same series. Dwight was scoring at will in 4 out of 6 games.


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