# Raps Interested In Heat Pick



## Onions Baby (Mar 12, 2007)

> So for the talk coming out of Toronto about the Raptors possibly interested in the Heat's No. 2 pick for a package that includes restricted free-agent guard Jose Calderon, it would require the Heat first to pick for the Raptors and then a leap of faith that Calderon would, two weeks later, agree to a contract and deal to Miami.


http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/columnists/sfl-flspira25sbmay25,0,4693738.column?page=2

The 'leap of faith' part lessened my excitement a bit, but if we can pull this off and bring Michael Beasley to town... wow. Almost a 0% chance of this happening if Bulls don't take Rose.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

seems pretty unlikely that the Heat would be willing to give up Beasley when he would would take their frontcourt from miserable to formidable. 

and i'm pretty sure you can't trade a free agent without signing him first.

sure the Heat are weak at the point but Wade can play that position if he had a couple of decent wings to play with. 

a sign and trade for Marion also not out of the question.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

if you're as shallow as the Heat are, you want to add impact players on rookie contracts and trade big contracts, getting 2 or more useful players in return. 

we can't really for Marion with a Jose S&T because of the BYC but TJ and Rasho is probably a good place to start. 

for some reason i thought Marion was a free agent but he's actually under contract for another year if he exercises his player option, which is for a whopping $17 mill. he's overpaid and he wants a big extension but he's an impact player that BC has a history with. 

our roster needs consolidation and the heat's needs expansion. i don't think they can afford to keep Marion at this stage in their development, not with a wade extension upcoming and an empty roster to fill out. 

very interested to see what Riley will do with the Heat.


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

I don't think that Calderon for Beasley is happening any time soon.


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## NeoSamurai (Jan 16, 2003)

ehmunro said:


> I don't think that Calderon for Beasley is happening any time soon.


And yet something tells me that there are a couple of delusional Raptor fans out there who WOULDNT do the deal...


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## charlz (Jun 9, 2003)

it's all postuiring by the heat with their prospective trade partners and the raps with their dealings with TJ and Jose this summer. It is always best to enter negotiation when you do not seem pigeon holed.


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## lucky777s (Nov 13, 2003)

The Raps may be hoping that Beasley measures out a little small.

Because that will lower his value to other trading partners, and maybe to the Heat as well. But if we plan to keep Bosh, then a Beasley who can play the 3 would become a great fit if he can guard that spot.

We can pick a big man at our spot for the Heat, who may even like a Hibbert type. So they fill the PG and C spots with one move. And losing Beasley doesn't mean as much if they keep Marion and Haslem.

Or maybe the Raps believe CHI will take Beasley and Rose will fall to them. 

Either way there is NO danger in the Heat taking this trade and picking for the Raps because they will be taking Rose or Beasley no matter what.


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## King Bosh (Jan 23, 2008)

This doesn't make sence to me. Why would the Heat tank 3/4 of their season to get Jose Calderon? This as to be the most ridiculous rumour i've heard in a long time. I love Jose Calderon but to have the chance in getting Beasley or Rose I'd trade him without hesitation. Even though Jose can become an all star someday.


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## superdude211 (Apr 3, 2004)

What about and Andrea Bargnani for #2 pick?
I'm not saying this trade will happen or that earthier team is interested but if giving the opportunity would you be in favor of this trade. Furthermore what about trading Bargnani for any of the top 5 picks? 
Was the 2006 draft low enough on top end talent that the number one pick could be traded for a 5th pick this year. Some good players came out of that draft Gay, Roy and Aldridge but did there talent match up with those of Beasily, Mayo, Rose and Bayless?


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## King Bosh (Jan 23, 2008)

Andrea's value is too low to other GM's to be traded for such a high pick in a pretty deep draft from pick 1-10. Plus Colangelo would trade Calderon or TJ ford for such a high pick before giving up on Bargnani. I'd love to have such a high pick in this draft, but i'm not ready to give up on Bargs just yet. The potential is still there, and like everyone as been saying lately it's a big off season for Il Mago. Lets just tough it out one more year.


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## ballocks (May 15, 2003)

superdude211 said:


> What about and Andrea Bargnani for #2 pick?
> I'm not saying this trade will happen or that earthier team is interested but if giving the opportunity would you be in favor of this trade. Furthermore what about trading Bargnani for any of the top 5 picks?
> Was the 2006 draft low enough on top end talent that the number one pick could be traded for a 5th pick this year. Some good players came out of that draft Gay, Roy and Aldridge but did there talent match up with those of Beasily, Mayo, Rose and Bayless?


it's draft time right now so everyone's stock is through the roof. derrick rose is now *derrick rose*, michael beasley is now *michael beasley*, etc. imo, i absolutely agree with you. this draft is not top heavy, similar to 06, and it should be easier than usual to trade into a top slot. 

i'll be honest, i think gay, roy and aldridge were superior to mayo, rose and bayless now (and that's not saying much, mind you). with the possible exception of rose, those are three players who have just started to develop- i can't see them contributing meaningfully anytime soon.

the derrick rose hype is out of control, imo.

the fact that most of the prospects have been sliding all over the mocks all year tells me that fans/scouts are so unsure of pretty much all of these players that they're experimenting with them everywhere to see where they stick. mayo, for example, was 10-15 as recently as the ncaa tournament. now he's a prime catch? it's too fickle for me at the moment.

i would trade bargnani for beasley but that's as far as i'd go, and only because beasley's a safe bet. he's a player already, imo. the rest are too early on their development curves for our team- too risky to take a gamble on any of them at this point, at least for me. 

peace


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

again, it's marion that the Heat should be shopping to the Raps for a PG. 

TJ/Kapono/Joey for Marion

TJ/Banks
Wade/Ricky Davis (FA?)
Kapono/Wright/Graham
Beasley/Haslem
Blount/Pekovic

Not bad. They've also got a little cap room to grab another C, i think.

Jose/Roko
AP/Delfino
Marion/Moon/Garbo
Bosh/Speights/Hump
Bargnani/Rasho

Trading for a "star" small forward, and keeping Delfino (who fits with the team IMO), BC is able to add an athletic big man (which we desperately need IMO). That's a pretty impressive roster. Marion's a good fit with B&B and I think he'd be very productive in Sam's system.


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## Flash is the Future (May 12, 2006)

SkywalkerAC said:


> again, it's marion that the Heat should be shopping to the Raps for a PG.
> 
> TJ/Kapono/Joey for Marion


Ford's such a bad fit next to Wade though. And Wade wants to play with Marion, and we want to keep Wade happy. As for the pick, I'm sure Riley's interested in moving it, but he speaks of trading it for a guy like KG. It would almost certainly take Bosh to pry that pick away, and the Raptors would almost certainly decline.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

really? the heat would take bosh for the #2 pick? i would seriously consider making that trade. bosh is a good regular season player but he hasn't been able to lead this team anywhere in the playoffs. his play in the postseason is uninspiring, and that's me being polite.

if beasley is available at #2, by all means, let's trade bosh for beasley. in fact, i wouldn't mind blowing this team up and start from scratch. this team hasn't shown any mental toughness so building on this "core" is going to be just another waste of time. they'll make the playoffs for 2-3 seasons and then when the east gets stronger(thanks to developement of guys like horford, rose, beasley, yi, and teams like bobcats) they'll go right back to the lottery.


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## billfindlay10 (Jan 24, 2003)

c_dog said:


> really? the heat would take bosh for the #2 pick? i would seriously consider making that trade. bosh is a good regular season player but he hasn't been able to lead this team anywhere in the playoffs. his play in the postseason is uninspiring, and that's me being polite.
> 
> if beasley is available at #2, by all means, let's trade bosh for beasley. in fact, i wouldn't mind blowing this team up and start from scratch. this team hasn't shown any mental toughness so building on this "core" is going to be just another waste of time. they'll make the playoffs for 2-3 seasons and then when the east gets stronger(thanks to developement of guys like horford, rose, beasley, yi, and teams like bobcats) they'll go right back to the lottery.


Bosh for the # 2 and who? what makes it work money wise?


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

billfindlay10 said:


> Bosh for the # 2 and who? what makes it work money wise?


any filler pretty much. this team can absorb some bad contracts.. mark blount, ricky davis, it doesn't matter. ricky davis may actually give this team a good wing player for a change.


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

what makes you think that Beasley would be a better post season player than Bosh though? In fact, many people actually predict Beasley to be a good regular season player only because he seems to be in the mold of a good player on a bad team.

I think this trade rumor is flat out ridiculous. Giving up Bosh is about the only chance we have at getting their pick and theres just no way in hell that Colangelo go through with something like this. The highest pick that we have a chance of getting is New York's #6, and it will cost us a combination of talent and salary relief.


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

c_dog said:


> any filler pretty much. this team can absorb some bad contracts.. mark blount, ricky davis, it doesn't matter. ricky davis may actually give this team a good wing player for a change.


Ricky Davis expires. The only bad contract the Heat have right now are Marcus Banks and Blount.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

c_dog said:


> really? the heat would take bosh for the #2 pick? i would seriously consider making that trade. bosh is a good regular season player but he hasn't been able to lead this team anywhere in the playoffs. his play in the postseason is uninspiring, and that's me being polite.
> 
> if beasley is available at #2, by all means, let's trade bosh for beasley. in fact, i wouldn't mind blowing this team up and start from scratch. this team hasn't shown any mental toughness so building on this "core" is going to be just another waste of time. they'll make the playoffs for 2-3 seasons and then when the east gets stronger(thanks to developement of guys like horford, rose, beasley, yi, and teams like bobcats) they'll go right back to the lottery.


-bosh for #2 isn't happening. EVER. Maybe in a videogame, but not in real life. I don't know how you can consider yourself a raptor fan after suggesting this trade.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

seifer0406 said:


> what makes you think that Beasley would be a better post season player than Bosh though? In fact, many people actually predict Beasley to be a good regular season player only because he seems to be in the mold of a good player on a bad team.
> 
> I think this trade rumor is flat out ridiculous. Giving up Bosh is about the only chance we have at getting their pick and theres just no way in hell that Colangelo go through with something like this. The highest pick that we have a chance of getting is New York's #6, and it will cost us a combination of talent and salary relief.


c_dog just likes "the new" of mike beasley. Next year he'd be saying trade mike beasley for the number one pick.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

yeah right.

i'm saying trade bosh because he's let us down in the playoffs twice already. a lot of fans weren't happy with vc when he disappeared in the playoffs either, or when he started milking his injuries. i am a raps fan, and i want the raptors to do well, but i'm not going to let my homerism blind my perspective. bosh is what he is which is a good jump shooting big man. what's unfortunate is that jump shooting big man aren't all that great at carrying teams in the post season. i, for one, am tired of our best players settling for jumpshots when they have all the tools to get to the rim and be more aggressive. those muscles tend to tense up during the playoffs so those jumpshots don't fall as often, and that's when the stars need to get in the paint.. something bosh almost never does.

and you're right, i don't know if beasley will be a good post season player, but i do know he seems to have a much better inside game than bosh. it seems bosh doesn't have much on offense other than his midrange shot and rare layups. i can't remember the last time i see bosh work in the paint and score with an actual postmove. bosh can really learn a thing or two from guys like david west, boozer, aldridge, randalph, on how to score in the paint.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

c_dog said:


> yeah right.
> 
> i'm saying trade bosh because he's let us down in the playoffs twice already. a lot of fans weren't happy with vc when he disappeared in the playoffs either, or when he started milking his injuries. i am a raps fan, and i want the raptors to do well, but i'm not going to let my homerism blind my perspective. bosh is what he is which is a good jump shooting big man. what's unfortunate is that jump shooting big man aren't all that great at carrying teams in the post season. i, for one, am tired of our best players settling for jumpshots when they have all the tools to get to the rim and be more aggressive. those muscles tend to tense up during the playoffs so those jumpshots don't fall as often, and that's when the stars need to get in the paint.. something bosh almost never does.
> 
> and you're right, i don't know if beasley will be a good post season player, but i do know he seems to have a much better inside game than bosh. it seems bosh doesn't have much on offense other than his midrange shot and rare layups. i can't remember the last time i see bosh work in the paint and score with an actual postmove. bosh can really learn a thing or two from guys like david west, boozer, aldridge, randalph, on how to score in the paint.


The raptors do run a lot of plays to get jump shots for bosh. That is because he is their best player. (His jumpshots are meant to be jump shots, its not like he is settling)However, to say bosh is nothing more than a jumpshooting bis is rediculous. He has an advanced back to the basket game where he can post up bigger slower 4/5s further away and use his quickness to get easy baskets. He is also a great weapon on the fastbreak for a 4. I don't see the point in trading your star player for a similar player to replace him. The raptors need to draft donte green or batum. Maybe trade tj ford to move up if necissary. That should be the extent of their trades imo.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

mo76 said:


> The raptors do run a lot of plays to get jump shots for bosh. That is because he is their best player. (His jumpshots are meant to be jump shots, its not like he is settling)However, to say bosh is nothing more than a jumpshooting bis is rediculous. He has an advanced back to the basket game where he can post up bigger slower 4/5s further away and use his quickness to get easy baskets. He is also a great weapon on the fastbreak for a 4. I don't see the point in trading your star player for a similar player to replace him. The raptors need to draft donte green or batum. Maybe trade tj ford to move up if necissary. That should be the extent of their trades imo.


i've never seen bosh post up anyone, ever. not even when he has guards on him. i remember vividly him getting mismatches and him settling for the jumpshot.

i don't think the raptors run plays to get bosh jumpshots because they want to, they run plays to get bosh jumpshots because that's all he has under his offensive arsenal. bosh is good on the break as he is one of the quickest pf's in the league, but how often do the raptors get on the break really? this is not a fast breaking team like many would believe. bosh would maybe get one dunk off a fast break in a game, and that's it. his offensive game is extremely limited.

i would do this trade for beasley because i think the raptors may as well start fresh. their current core is just going to win some games in the regular season, milk their injuries and other issues as other excuses for not winning as many games as they should, and not show up in the playoffs. another reason to do this trade now rather than later is because bosh's stock is as high as it ever will be. in 2-3 years his injuries would really slow him down and rob him of whatever athletism he has left, and executives would put a red flag on him for not being able to advance in playoffs for consecutive years. B easy is a really good player who should have a brandon roy esque impact on the game. I think if the raps get the chance to get him, they should totally pull the trigger. of course, we don't know if the heat would even do this trade, or if Rose would go #1 over Beasley.


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## billfindlay10 (Jan 24, 2003)

Bosh does post up more than you think, he just utilizes a reverse pivot to square up and then beat his man. IF you are calling posting up only backing a man down and using "post moves" than you are right, Bosh seldom uses a jump hook or drop step move. He does put up the lefty hook the odd time though.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

billfindlay10 said:


> Bosh does post up more than you think, he just utilizes a reverse pivot to square up and then beat his man. IF you are calling posting up only backing a man down and using "post moves" than you are right, Bosh seldom uses a jump hook or drop step move. He does put up the lefty hook the odd time though.


exactly how often is "more than you think"? i think for every time bosh goes in the paint, he takes jumpshots another 10 times.

if the fact that i think this team may improve by trading bosh for beasley and other assets makes me a non-raptors fan than i guess i'm not a raptors fan. i guess i was a non-raptors fan 7-8 seasons before bosh even joined the raptors too.


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## ATCQ (Jun 16, 2005)

c_dog said:


> *exactly how often is "more than you think"? i think for every time bosh goes in the paint, he takes jumpshots another 10 times.*
> 
> if the fact that i think this team may improve by trading bosh for beasley and other assets makes me a non-raptors fan than i guess i'm not a raptors fan. i guess i was a non-raptors fan 7-8 seasons before bosh even joined the raptors too.


I thinks not. This is a chart of Bosh's 2006-2007 offensive production from different zones of the court. Take a look at the paint area. Unfortunatly i couldn't find the same thing for this previous season, but this gives you a pretty decent idea.


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## billfindlay10 (Jan 24, 2003)

c_dog said:


> exactly how often is "more than you think"? i think for every time bosh goes in the paint, he takes jumpshots another 10 times.
> 
> if the fact that i think this team may improve by trading bosh for beasley and other assets makes me a non-raptors fan than i guess i'm not a raptors fan. i guess i was a non-raptors fan 7-8 seasons before bosh even joined the raptors too.


You are confusing the paint with posting up. Some players post up in the high post out side the lane as well as the low block extended (baseline). That is when Bosh catches the ball with his back to the basket (posting his man) and using the reverse pivot to square up....not all posting up is in the paint or shooting hooks and up and unders. 


Also the shot chart shows quite a bit!!!!!!!!!!


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## Onions Baby (Mar 12, 2007)

*Bosh's Shot Selection According To 82games.com*

58% Jump Shots
30% Low-Post
10% Dunks
3% Tips

Dumbing it down, he's 58% of the time a jump shooter and 42% of the time a low-post scorer.
He scores 8.0 PPG from inside and 7.3 PPG from the perimeter... the rest coming from the stripe which you could qualify (for the most part) as inside scoring. Therefore 14.3 of his points, or 64%, are coming from down low.

*Comparative Shot Selections...*

_Kevin Garnett_
73% Jumpshots
27% Inside (17% close, 10% dunks, 1% tips)

_Tim Duncan_
55% Jumpshots
45% Inside (38% close, 4% dunks, 3% tips)

_Dirk Nowitzki_
81% Jumpshots
19% Inside (17% close, 1% dunks, 1% tips)

_David West_
65% Jumpshots
35% Inside (28% close, 5% dunks, 3% tips)

_Amare Stoudemire_
53% Jumpshots
47% Inside (26% close, 18% dunks, 3% tips)

_Carlos Boozer_
54% Jumpshots
46% Inside (39% close, 5% dunks, 2% lay-ups)

_Dwight Howard_
16% Jumpshots
84% Inside (52% close, 30% dunks, 2% tips)

_Al Jefferson_
53% Jumpshots
47% Inside (36% close, 8% dunks, 4% tips)

Aside from Dirk Nowitzki and arguably KG, Chris Bosh is probably the best shooting big man of that clump, thus it is understandable that his jump shooting %'s are slightly elevated. He still gets down low and to the line more often than some of us give him credit for.


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## southeasy (Jun 11, 2003)

i think he's underrated in the aspect of playing BIG, it's just his talent is so advanced, alot of us expect more. he's just not built for low-post scoring as much as the next guy.

he's still top 10 in FTA, that has to stipulate he's driving rather settling for the jumper (which in reality he does too often) we just expect more, because he's just that capable everytime he gets a touch to blow by a defender.

BEASLEY does not impress me, i'd rather have a character guy like Bosh then a kid like Beasley any day.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

ATCQ said:


> I thinks not. This is a chart of Bosh's 2006-2007 offensive production from different zones of the court. Take a look at the paint area. Unfortunatly i couldn't find the same thing for this previous season, but this gives you a pretty decent idea.


wow, i simply can't believe he actually took that many shots in the paint. he does drive by his defenders for layups sometimes, but it wasn't always effective.

there's got to be something wrong with those stats because i simply can't recall bosh working in the paint at all.

@billfindlay10: if he's posting up 20 feet from the basket and then squaring up, i wouldn't call it a postup because he's essentially just catching passes with his back to the basket and then shoot jumpshots. i'd rather he attempt that shot closer to the hoop. and as you said, he doesn't do hook shots or up and unders. you basically agree that even when he does score in the paint, he's just squaring up and taking jumpshots.


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## ballocks (May 15, 2003)

c_dog said:


> wow, i simply can't believe he actually took that many shots in the paint. he does drive by his defenders for layups sometimes, but it wasn't always effective.
> 
> there's got to be something wrong with those stats because i simply can't recall bosh working in the paint at all.


i've long felt that chris gets a bit of a bad rap when it's suggested that he doesn't go inside enough. i think the fact that he's often the only raptor who shows an ability to go inside kills him- he gets the spotlight shone on him as a result, and when he doesn't go in, it seems like he really *doesn't go in*.

i do think he can do it more often (he waits for the fourth quarter sometimes, and i think he can do better than that) but he's so far ahead of the rest of the pack that i can't be bothered to complain. when players like andrea bargnani spend more time outside the three-point line than anywhere else- even when they're missing (as andrea usually is)- i feel like chris bosh is not deserving of much blame.

peace


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

ballocks said:


> i've long felt that chris gets a bit of a bad rap when it's suggested that he doesn't go inside enough. i think the fact that he's often the only raptor who shows an ability to go inside kills him- he gets the spotlight shone on him as a result, and when he doesn't go in, it seems like he really *doesn't go in*.
> 
> i do think he can do it more often (he waits for the fourth quarter sometimes, and i think he can do better than that) but he's so far ahead of the rest of the pack that i can't be bothered to complain. when players like andrea bargnani spend more time outside the three-point line than anywhere else- even when they're missing (as andrea usually is)- i feel like chris bosh is not deserving of much blame.
> 
> peace


the difference here is that bosh is suppose to be our franchise player, which is why i expect a lot more out of him than i do andrea bargnani. bargnani was always known as a shooter, heck, we drafted him because he is suppose to become one of the best shooting big man in the nba. bosh does need to add a better post game. in the regular season he tends to get a few of those wacky looking layups to go in, but it's in the playoffs where his offense is virtually none existent.


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## billfindlay10 (Jan 24, 2003)

c_dog said:


> the difference here is that bosh is suppose to be our franchise player, which is why i expect a lot more out of him than i do andrea bargnani. bargnani was always known as a shooter, heck, we drafted him because he is suppose to become one of the best shooting big man in the nba. bosh does need to add a better post game. in the regular season he tends to get a few of those wacky looking layups to go in, but it's in the playoffs where his offense is virtually none existent.


He put up 24ppg, 9rpg, 3.6apg, and 1.6spg in the playoffs...all above his season averages, not that nonexistent. Sure he did not take his game to the next level for the playoffs, but he did play as good or better than he did in the regular season. Bosh is what he is, a second level suprstar that needs a better supporting cast to help him take the team further.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

billfindlay10 said:


> He put up 24ppg, 9rpg, 3.6apg, and 1.6spg in the playoffs...all above his season averages, not that nonexistent. Sure he did not take his game to the next level for the playoffs, but he did play as good or better than he did in the regular season. Bosh is what he is, a second level suprstar that needs a better supporting cast to help him take the team further.


ugh, i hate it when people defend someone's play with stats. you watched the games, those were some very insignificant 24/9. bosh took bad shots, settled for bad shots(he even attempted 3's), really couldn't get much going especially when the game is on the line. kris humphries can probably put up 20/10 if we were to feature him on our offense too. darius songalia did it for stretches for the kings when he was starting, crawford(guy who used to play on the hawks who's now retired due to torn ACL) did it after shareef abur-rahim got traded. there are some other examples too, but the point is you need to look at the players and not just the stats. i say despite bigger stats in the playoffs, bosh made a bigger impact on the game during the regular season than he did in the playoffs.


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

I don't know which playoffs you were watching, but this year Bosh did his share in his playoffs. The year before against the Nets he did underperform but I thought this year he at least kept his play (could play better when it matters, like the great ones do) against the Magic. The rest of our guys with the exception of Kapono just didn't step up and perform. A big part of the fault is on Colangelo for not bringing guys that are capable of sharing the load in the playoffs.

This entire discussion is ignoring the fact that nobody knows if Beasley would be a better playoff performer than Bosh. The guy that he's most compared to, Carmelo Anthony, hasn't had that much more success in the playoffs than Bosh. When you look at the list of offensive-heavy combo small forwards that have come into the league in the past, not many have been able to become franchise players that lead their team deep in the playoffs. Some names that come to mind other than Carmelo, Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Antoine Walker, Glenn Robinson, Antawn Jamison, etc. In fact, I can't think of the last small forward that has a similar game as Michael Beasley that has led a team at least to the conference finals. (Glenn Robinson is an exception, but he was hardly the best player out of the big 3, ditto walker and Pierce.) Not to say that the Raptors will be able to get there with Bosh leading them, but the question mark is at least just as big if not bigger with Beasley.

And I can't believe I just typed out this much for a trade that has no chance in hell of happening.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

It'll come down to what level defense Beasley can play. I've heard he needs a lot of work.


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## billfindlay10 (Jan 24, 2003)

SkywalkerAC said:


> It'll come down to what level defense Beasley can play. I've heard he needs a lot of work.


He also measured out pretty short for a power forward (nice reach though) and I am not sold on Beasley's wing skills.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

Yeah bosh for heat pick probably won't happen. there are rumors they might trade wade to acquire the #1 pick, so it looks like they're probably going to keep their #2.

I thought bosh was still soft this year. Too many jumpshots and bad shot attempts. No where to be seen when the team needs to make a shot either. His performance looked even worse considering Dwight Howard singlehandedly destroyed us inside.


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

c_dog said:


> His performance looked even worse considering Dwight Howard singlehandedly destroyed us inside.


That's what you get for trying to play the Magic with Rasho Nesterovic as your only legitimate center.

Sorry to break it to you, but Bosh wasn't suppose to be matched up against someone who's at least 70 pounds heavier than him and playing a different position.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

seifer0406 said:


> That's what you get for trying to play the Magic with Rasho Nesterovic as your only legitimate center.
> 
> Sorry to break it to you, but Bosh wasn't suppose to be matched up against someone who's at least 70 pounds heavier than him and playing a different position.


i thought andrea and rasho both did their part in terms of trying to slow down howard, especially near the end of the series. i really liked andrea's defense. it wasn't so much that our defense sucked as much as dwight was just too dominating.

i don't see why bosh couldn't take advantage of being matched up against lewis though. howard had his advantage and he capitalized. bosh had a soft and weaker player on him, one who isn't even known for defense, and he couldn't make the most out of it.

i honestly would have liked to see beasley. i think he could be the real deal. this team needs an athletic 3 like him ever since we lost t-mac and carter. it's true that we don't know if he'll perform better in the playoffs, but it doesn't hurt to get a better talent with higher ceiling who's also younger when your franchise has plateau'ed.


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

c_dog said:


> i thought andrea and rasho both did their part in terms of trying to slow down howard, especially near the end of the series. i really liked andrea's defense. it wasn't so much that our defense sucked as much as dwight was just too dominating.
> 
> i don't see why bosh couldn't take advantage of being matched up against lewis though. howard had his advantage and he capitalized. bosh had a soft and weaker player on him, one who isn't even known for defense, and he couldn't make the most out of it.
> 
> i honestly would have liked to see beasley. i think he could be the real deal. this team needs an athletic 3 like him ever since we lost t-mac and carter. it's true that we don't know if he'll perform better in the playoffs, but it doesn't hurt to get a better talent with higher ceiling who's also younger when your franchise has plateau'ed.


Bargnani and Rasho did such a nice job that Bosh ended up guarding Howard for good portions of every game. okay..... I'm sure they did their part, but too bad those parts are just a tad too small. Dwight wasn't nearly as dominating against the Pistons. It is our lack of big men defenders that is to blame and not Bosh alone.

And Bosh did average 24 points. I know everyone would like him to average more and he probably should average more given the situation. But 24 points a game is very respectable and it's more difficult for him when most of the team struggled for most of the series.

The bottom line is, show me a 6-7/6-8 power forward in a small forward's body that has had a lot of playoff success say in the past 15 years. There are probably 2 of them in that height, one of them is Elton Brand (who hasn't had much playoff success but is a great player), the other is Carlos Boozer. Either of their games are far different from what Beasley has and in all likelihood Beasley would go in the direction of guys like Shareef Abdur Rahim and a less finesse version of Antawn Jamison. That is if he is the "real deal". If that's his ceiling, I don't know how that is any higher than what Bosh has right now.


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## ballocks (May 15, 2003)

seifer0406 said:


> That is if he is the "real deal". If that's his ceiling, I don't know how that is any higher than what Bosh has right now.


you may be right, but i'll play devil's advocate for a second: how much more time does bosh have at this level? all things equal between beasley and bosh, i might lean to beasley just because bosh is the oldest 24 year-old i've ever known. 

i think bosh's durability is his biggest question mark, not his skills right now. i just don't know how long he'll last.

peace


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## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

Actually if you really want to compare their potential using my basis, you still wouldn't want to build your team around Beasley given that he likely won't become a player that can lead a team to playoff wins. It may be the same with Bosh, but why would you switch from a player who can't do something to another that won't be able to do the same thing? Wouldn't that *at best* be a lateral move?

I am not saying that Beasley won't be a good player because I believe that he will be a good 2nd option on a good team. But if you are building a team around Beasley, which is what the Raptors will be doing if they trade Bosh for him, chances are the team won't mount to much as he has all the signs of becoming a good player on a bad team.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

it wouldn't be a lateral move. the team would get younger and get a couple years extra to rebuild and field a good team.

and i like the jamison comparison, i think beasley does have a similar skillset as him. i think beasley may be a better pro though. his mentality is different. he's kind of immature, but i like the fire and intensity i see from him. that alone makes me think that he'll be a better pro than another player with similar skillset.


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