# ECF: Game 4: Heat @ Pistons



## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

<center>
PLAYOFFS 2005

Eastern Conference Finals
Game Three
Tuesday, May 31st--8:00ET TNT









Miami Heat
(59-23)

vs.









Detroit Pistons
(54-28)

Series
(2-1 Heat)

Previous Results:
Heat 77 @ Pistons 78
Heat 89 @ Pistons 78
 Pistons 80 @ Heat 72


*Starting Lineups:*

    
vs.
    

_Heat Bench:_
Alonzo Mourning
Keyon Dooling
Shandon Anderson
Michael Doleac
Christian Laettner
Rasual Butler 
Steve Smith

</center>


----------



## DWadeistheTruth (Apr 25, 2005)

My prediction is, Shaq last game seem to start getting that bounce in his step, Detroit, I think will execute somewhat better, this is a tricky game to call, Miami has to come out, like is their last game mentality, cause Piston's will be playing some real D, the only way to counter, is play solid D, and try to not get to frustrated, they probably trow more guys at Wade, and Wade will have to adjust to Hunter, cause he is a real pest, Wade might have and off day, when it comes to scoring, he will have to find the best open guy, Shaq, seems like he is getting back in shape, but I don't know he is going to play as aggressive, or as good, that in game 3, Haslem, Jones, will be key factors, when they get open shots, as long as we play D and smart, will have a chance, Miami has to have a very mature, head, and don't think about home advantage, that type of mentality is a trap, Wade will be ready, but lets see, if the other's follow suit. This game I will not predict and outcome, so is a toss up.


----------



## DwyaneWade4MVP (Apr 1, 2004)

If we take this one we have everything we need to win the series in the AAA!


----------



## sMaK (Jun 13, 2002)

DWadeistheTruth said:


> My prediction is, Shaq last game seem to start getting that bounce in his step, Detroit, I think will execute somewhat better, this is a tricky game to call, Miami has to come out, like is their last game mentality, cause Piston's will be playing some real D, the only way to counter, is play solid D, and try to not get to frustrated, they probably trow more guys at Wade, and Wade will have to adjust to Hunter, cause he is a real pest, Wade might have and off day, when it comes to scoring, he will have to find the best open guy, Shaq, seems like he is getting back in shape, but I don't know he is going to play as aggressive, or as good, that in game 3, Haslem, Jones, will be key factors, when they get open shots, as long as we play D and smart, will have a chance, Miami has to have a very mature, head, and don't think about home advantage, that type of mentality is a trap, Wade will be ready, but lets see, if the other's follow suit. This game I will not predict and outcome, so is a toss up.


That's a run-on sentence if I've ever seen one.

Whatever, I'm so pumped for this game it's ot even funny. I can't wait for tip off. I expect a loss, but going up 3-1 would be HUGE, obviously. It's going to be very interesting how Detroit comes out after the whole Larry Brown situation.


----------



## PartisanRanger (Oct 24, 2004)

This game is gonna come down to the last few possessions, you can count on it. I'm gonna bet it'll come down to a shot by Wade to win/lose...


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

Killer instinct. This game could all but put away the Pistons, but if we lose it is anybody's series. Pistons will play their best game at home in this huge game, and the heat will have to match that intensity. I think the heat could get a w, but its going to take a close to perfect heat game


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

They have to win this game. They have no choice. If we win tonight the series is all but over. If we win tonight, theres nothing left to do but throw the dirt on their casket.

They wil bring their A game, and throw everything at us including the kitchen sink, much like the Nets in game 3 of that series where they took us to double OT. The Heat smell the blood, its there for the taking. We win tonight we can close at AAA. Go HEAT.


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Thats 2 quick fouls on Shaq and D.J.!


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

shaq and damon are both in foul trouble early


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

both of the 2nd fouls were such touch calls also....whatever though, at least we have dooling and zo


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Wade and 1!!!


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

zo should of had a dunk right there


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Dools is tryn to do too much!!!


----------



## MarioChalmers (Mar 26, 2004)

C'mon Heat, I don't think we're defending well enough.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

That whistle was a little late wasn't it?


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

way late call......these refs have been horrible tonight. All of our bigs in foul trouble already


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Thats 2 fouls on Shaq, Zo and D.J.!!!

The Piston fans better not bit*h about the officiating!


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Doleac at the buzzer!!!:biggrin:


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

doleac did something positive for once


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

lol go DOHleac


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

lol they didnt count it.


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

HEATLUNATIC said:


> Doleac at the buzzer!!!:biggrin:


I spoke too soon...


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

nice pass by Sual for the Udon lay in.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

our defense is horrible so far


----------



## mippo (Apr 27, 2005)

Doleac bet on the opposing team again.


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

wadeshaqeddie said:


> our defense is horrible so far


With Shaq and Zo on the bench its pretty much an open lane to the rim!


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

wadeshaqeddie said:


> our defense is horrible so far


Yeah it is, we're getting outhustled. To be expected though. They need this game. We just gotta keep it close and take it at the end.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

horrible call to send shaq to the bench


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Thats a BS foul on Shaq!!!

The refs are killing us...


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

lol these refs are horrible. They must of had a lightbulb. Make Shaq/Zo sit.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

Sheed loves to bit**


----------



## MarioChalmers (Mar 26, 2004)

We're getting pwned out there, AHHH!


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Sheed is a bit**


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

no tech on ben....wow


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

block by zo, dunk by eddie. 5 pt game. :banana:


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

E.J. with the jam!!!:biggrin:


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

ah yeah, eddie with a 1995 dunk!!! i wanna see zo + shaq on the floor together in the 2nd half


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

lol Chauncey got a tech.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Pistons are floppers now?


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Thats 3 fouls on Shaq and Zo...


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

no way was that close to flagrant....


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Wow HASLEM went after the BALL. NOT the player!


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

wasnt a tech either


----------



## UD40 (May 12, 2005)

Are the refs really THIS bad?


----------



## MarioChalmers (Mar 26, 2004)

That wasn't a flagrant. These refs are giving Detroit the game. Thug refs, thug town! THUGS!!!! AHHHHHH!!!

:joke:

But seriously, that wasn't a flagrant.


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Go DJ! said:


> Are the refs really THIS bad?


Yup!!!

Our starting 5 will be fouled out before we even reach the 4th!!!


----------



## MarioChalmers (Mar 26, 2004)

If Haz only knew it'd be a flagrant, Tayshaun Prince would be dead by now.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

DOHleac will get more minutes this game then he has all playoffs at the rate. The Refs wont let our bigs play.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

refs gave the heat no shot in the first half...will the refs actually let shaq play some in the second half?


----------



## UD40 (May 12, 2005)

Bad refs and horrible D, two ways to screw ourselves. I hope Stan rip's us, because our d is, well, not there! We need a fire to be lit, and lit fast. Lets start fresh in the second, if its possible.


----------



## blueeclipse (Mar 25, 2005)

Come on guys you're cryin like virgins in here!!!! Thugs? Detroit is playin hard....match it. That's it...nothin to cry about.


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

joey crawford is doing better than he did in game 1 at least


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

Go DJ! said:


> Bad refs and horrible D, two ways to screw ourselves. I hope Stan rip's us, because our d is, well, not there! We need a fire to be lit, and lit fast. Lets start fresh in the second, if its possible.



our D has been on the bench since 6 minutes in the first qtr


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

blueeclipse said:


> Come on guys you're cryin like virgins in here!!!! Thugs? Detroit is playin hard....match it. That's it...nothin to cry about.


i wouldnt care if the calls went both ways. det. cried in game 3 but they only missed 2 calls, one being the obvious billups foul. miami doesnt even play physical.

the common link between game 1 and 4 is 1) joey crawford and 2) good 3-pt shooting by det.

the lindsey flop wasnt a foul. shaq's 1st and 3rd werent fouls. haslem didnt deserve a tech. eddie ran into wallace and he was 2 feet inside the circle, and there was no call. that was funny actually. wade got Rip in the air at the buzzer and drew contact but there wasnt a call. wade is getting good calls, but at the same time it makes no difference if eddie gets blocked by wallace on a layup and theres no call. its just joey, he can't officiate game 5 and 6 so i think we're ok. im not worried at all.


----------



## maswe12 (Feb 23, 2005)

nickrock23 said:


> i wouldnt care if the calls went both ways. det. cried in game 3 but they only missed 2 calls, one being the obvious billups foul. miami doesnt even play physical.
> 
> the common link between game 1 and 4 is 1) joey crawford and 2) good 3-pt shooting by det.
> 
> the lindsey flop wasnt a foul. shaq's 1st and 3rd werent fouls. haslem didnt deserve a tech. eddie ran into wallace and he was 2 feet inside the circle, and there was no call. that was funny actually. wade got Rip in the air at the buzzer and drew contact but there wasnt a call. wade is getting good calls, but at the same time it makes no difference if eddie gets blocked by wallace on a layup and theres no call. its just joey, he can't officiate game 5 and 6 so i think we're ok. im not worried at all.


And Stan has gone back to trying to work wade with him OFF the ball. He isnt taking it up court tonight although i hope it changes in the 2nd half. Detroit has the athletes to deny him the ball ALL night...then he starts to force shots...

LET WADE CARRY THE BALL UP. We are taking him out of the game...not detroit....AND Dooling only should play spark plug minutes.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

nickrock23 said:


> i wouldnt care if the calls went both ways. det. cried in game 3 but they only missed 2 calls, one being the obvious billups foul. miami doesnt even play physical.
> 
> the common link between game 1 and 4 is 1) joey crawford and 2) good 3-pt shooting by det.
> 
> the lindsey flop wasnt a foul. shaq's 1st and 3rd werent fouls. haslem didnt deserve a tech. eddie ran into wallace and he was 2 feet inside the circle, and there was no call. that was funny actually. wade got Rip in the air at the buzzer and drew contact but there wasnt a call. wade is getting good calls, but at the same time it makes no difference if eddie gets blocked by wallace on a layup and theres no call. its just joey, he can't officiate game 5 and 6 so i think we're ok. im not worried at all.


 :boohoo:


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

THe Pistons fans crawled back out of their hole!?


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

Over the back on prince......very very obvious, but of course not called


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Shaqs not even trying to rebound. He just stands there and lets Ben clean up.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

and 1


----------



## UD40 (May 12, 2005)

Shaq gets #4, but atleast Udominator and EJ are stepping up


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

great.....finally call that foul, but when wade has a wide open dunk


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Sad part is, as much as I hate to say it that's probably why they called it this time.


----------



## MarioChalmers (Mar 26, 2004)

Are they in the penalty? It's alright, even with the refs against us, we're in this game.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

haha.....2 guys fouled wade on that play....


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Dwyane checked him. lol.


----------



## UD40 (May 12, 2005)

lol, he might seem like a good guy on the outside, but mess with Flash and he'll clock ya, lol


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Why the hell is Dwyane sitting. Jesus Van Gundy.


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Dools for 3!!!


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

i guess eddie illegally got jumped on by mcdyss .


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Dwyane is still on the bench. What does he have ? 1 foul. Van Gundy is a complete *******.


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

larry brown never shuts up cause he knows if he isnt complaining his team will lose 120-60 every game


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

nickrock23 said:


> larry brown never shuts up cause he knows if he isnt complaining his team will lose 120-60 every game


Yeah.. uhh.. and Van Gundy is fat.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

That wasnt a foul that was a travel. What game are you watching refs? idiots.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Oh yeah Sheed, that was real clean. U f'ing clown.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

kick ball!??!?


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Cry me a river over here.


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

rip travelled but its not like it matters. theyre holding and body checking 5 times a possesion so its not like we can score anyway. its ok this team cant beat us without joey crawford


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

ehh.....as long as crawford isnt reffing game 5, we should be in fine shape


----------



## the wall (Jul 21, 2002)

nickrock23 said:


> rip travelled but its not like it matters. theyre holding and body checking 5 times a possesion so its not like we can score anyway. its ok this team cant beat us without joey crawford


Wow! Just imagine what the score would be if the Pistons were actually a good team!?


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

wadeshaqeddie said:


> ehh.....as long as crawford isnt reffing game 5, we should be in fine shape


Without their 6th man they can't run with us.


----------



## blueeclipse (Mar 25, 2005)

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaa! You guys are cryin like hell..........you should be embarassed.


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

is ben wallace exempt from the inside the circle rule ? seriously that at least 5 times tonight


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

blueeclipse said:


> Waaaaaaaaaaaaaa! You guys are cryin like hell..........you should be embarassed.


why get embarassed speaking the truth????? Its not like Piston fans were actually quiet about the refs after games 2 and 3. They bit**ed for no reason.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

blueeclipse said:


> Waaaaaaaaaaaaaa! You guys are cryin like hell..........you should be embarassed.


Your team is garb and you need ref help to beat us. Win or lose this series I still know the Heat are better than the Pissytons.


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

the wall said:


> Wow! Just imagine what the score would be if the Pistons were actually a good team!?


how are the sixers doing nowadays? what happened to that top ranked defense after LB left. too bad he couldnt coach his way out of a paper bag in the olympics because the refs laughed at his whining. you lose LB next year your team will be lucky to make the playoffs.


----------



## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Pistons came out and played their typical defense tonight, and got it done. The officials had very little to do with the outcome of the game, just like in the first three games. It's now a three game series and Miami has home court advantage. The Pistons will have to beat the Heat in Miami again to win the series. It should be good, this might end up being the best series in this years playoffs.


----------



## the wall (Jul 21, 2002)

nickrock23 said:


> how are the sixers doing nowadays? what happened to that top ranked defense after LB left. too bad he couldnt coach his way out of a paper bag in the olympics because the refs laughed at his whining. you lose LB next year your team will be lucky to make the playoffs.



Congratulations, that is easily the most ignorant post in the history of bbb.net. If you honestely think the Pistons will be lucky to make the playoffs next year, you must be out of your mind. And good job using LB's inability to coach during the playoffs, woudln't that be a reason for Pistons fans to be happy that he's leaving? 

We're still gonna end up with an elite coach, lose no one from this year's team, and probably pick up another nice veteran to play backup SG. I don't think you'll be able to find another person on this site that thinks the Pistons won't be able to make the playoffs next year. :clap: :clap:


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

Sir Patchwork said:


> Pistons came out and played their typical defense tonight, and got it done. The officials had very little to do with the outcome of the game, just like in the first three games. It's now a three game series and Miami has home court advantage. The Pistons will have to beat the Heat in Miami again to win the series. It should be good, this might end up being the best series in this years playoffs.


just like you said on the playoff board, this game was completely different without shaq, and this game got away from the heat when the refs put shaq on the bench with a totally bs foul


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

the wall said:


> Congratulations, that is easily the most ignorant post in the history of bbb.net. If you honestely think the Pistons will be lucky to make the playoffs next year, you must be out of your mind. And good job using LB's inability to coach during the playoffs, woudln't that be a reason for Pistons fans to be happy that he's leaving?
> 
> We're still gonna end up with an elite coach, lose no one from this year's team, and probably pick up another nice veteran to play backup SG. I don't think you'll be able to find another person on this site that thinks the Pistons won't be able to make the playoffs next year. :clap: :clap:


dude no one will be looking for u here in game 5 and 6. but come by to say congratulations after game 6 ok


----------



## ian (Jun 4, 2003)

wadeshaqeddie said:


> ehh.....as long as crawford isnt reffing game 5, we should be in fine shape


When Detroit fans complain about the refs, they're ridiculous and the officiating is fair to both sides.

When Miami is losing however then the refs are completely horrible towards Miami. Funny how that works

If I was a Heat fan I'd be embarrassed by all the people that lecture and insult Piston fans whenever they mention the refs and then come over here and whine


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

ian said:


> When Detroit fans complain about the refs, they're ridiculous and the officiating is fair to both sides.
> 
> When Miami is losing however then the refs are completely horrible towards Miami. Funny how that works


yep. Miami is the better team. Thats how it is....


----------



## the wall (Jul 21, 2002)

nickrock23 said:


> dude no one will be looking for u here in game 5 and 6. but come by to say congratulations after game 6 ok



If you guys win it after Game 6, I'll congratulate you. I just wanted to point out that your previous post was ridiculous. I think even your fellow Heat fans can agree on that. :biggrin: Hopefully this series will go to 7, I have tickets and I'll be down in Miami to go cheer on the squad.


----------



## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

ian said:


> When Detroit fans complain about the refs, they're ridiculous and the officiating is fair to both sides.
> 
> When Miami is losing however then the refs are completely horrible towards Miami. Funny how that works
> 
> If I was a Heat fan I'd be embarrassed by all the people that lecture and insult Piston fans whenever they mention the refs and then come over here and whine


Yeah, I've noticed that too. Co-sign.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

anyway, the only call I have a real problem with is the shaq third foul call that completely changed the game. And even Pistons fans know that was not close to a foul. The others I complained about were wrong imo, but every game has some of those for both sides. That one shaq foul was the game changer though


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

ian said:


> When Detroit fans complain about the refs, they're ridiculous and the officiating is fair to both sides.
> 
> When Miami is losing however then the refs are completely horrible towards Miami. Funny how that works
> 
> If I was a Heat fan I'd be embarrassed by all the people that lecture and insult Piston fans whenever they mention the refs and then come over here and whine



Well what do you expect? The majority of heat fans are just Shaq fans.. And Shaq whines about everything, why shouldn't they?


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

ian said:


> When Detroit fans complain about the refs, they're ridiculous and the officiating is fair to both sides.
> 
> When Miami is losing however then the refs are completely horrible towards Miami. Funny how that works



and another point, isnt it the same with Detroit. When they one game 1 and this game 4, the officiating was fine. But when the lost games 2 and 3, the officiating was obviously in favor of the heat, duh. You could say the same for most teams fans in the league. They are more likely to notice bad calls when their team is losing


----------



## ian (Jun 4, 2003)

wadeshaqeddie said:


> and another point, isnt it the same with Detroit. When they one game 1 and this game 4, the officiating was fine. But when the lost games 2 and 3, the officiating was obviously in favor of the heat, duh. You could say the same for most teams fans in the league. They are more likely to notice bad calls when their team is losing


I don't see every Piston fan descending into this thread and claiming the officiating was completely fair. That's a uniquely Heat phenomenon.


----------



## ansoncarter (Dec 22, 2004)

the call Hamilton got against Shaq was bad, but Wade gets that call like 5 times a game.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> Well what do you expect? The majority of heat fans are just Shaq fans.. And Shaq whines about everything, why shouldn't they?


Lol, where'd you get that one from?

Shaq whines about everything? Thats all your players do is whine, including your coach! You whine your way to wins.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

ian said:


> I don't see every Piston fan descending into this thread and claiming the officiating was completely fair. That's a uniquely Heat phenomenon.


isnt that what youre doing right now? You are saying we are wrong to complain, implying you agree with the refs tonight

so the refs werent fair tonight. hmmmmm I AGREE


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

You guys can cry about the referring all you want. If the heat simply scored half of thier second chance points you might have seen a different out come tonight, but they didn't get it done. 

I'm sure it was all just "uncalled fouls", that caused those second chance points to not fall... :laugh: 

So sad..... :boohoo:


----------



## ansoncarter (Dec 22, 2004)

wadeshaqeddie said:


> and another point, isnt it the same with Detroit. When they one game 1 and this game 4, the officiating was fine. But when the lost games 2 and 3, the officiating was obviously in favor of the heat, duh. You could say the same for most teams fans in the league. They are more likely to notice bad calls when their team is losing


every year it's the same thing, from every teams fans. 

it's like clockwork


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

lol @ brown trying to make up with detroit fans wearing the Red Wings jersey. Brown, they are going to hate you anyway, no matter what you do, just they they now hate carlisle and diss him every second possible no matter how much he did for the pistons


----------



## PartisanRanger (Oct 24, 2004)

Reasons why we lost this game:
-No Defense or Rebounding - We let them have open jumper after open jumper and let the Pistons pummel us in the paint. They were even running the break quite a few times without anyone guarding the off-ball guy. Ben Wallace got offensive rebounds time after time, simply unacceptable.
-Stupid substitutions - Yet again, Van Gundy is making some dumb coaching decisions. Stop playing the Dooling/Rasual/Doleac lineup, please... Everytime we've done that the lead shot up again.
-Concentration - We got caught by carelessness and frustration, missing some easy shots and getting angry about how the game was going. Gotta pull ourselves together.

I thought the officiating wasn't horrendous, but there were some truly poor calls. The third on Shaq, for example, which changed the tempo of the game, was based on Shaq standing there as Rip jumps into him and then shoots a fadeaway...

I just hope we can bring the game we had in Games 2 and 3 into Game 4 at home.


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

ian said:


> When Detroit fans complain about the refs, they're ridiculous and the officiating is fair to both sides.
> 
> When Miami is losing however then the refs are completely horrible towards Miami. Funny how that works
> 
> If I was a Heat fan I'd be embarrassed by all the people that lecture and insult Piston fans whenever they mention the refs and then come over here and whine


the last time i posted on your board was last year when you lost in 3OT to the nets in the playoffs. i said the pistons will win it all and you all laughed.. anyway my calls are always right and the heat are winning in 6 so enjoy your last victory of the season.


----------



## ian (Jun 4, 2003)

wadeshaqeddie said:


> isnt that what youre doing right now? You are saying we are wrong to complain, implying you agree with the refs tonight
> 
> so the refs werent fair tonight. hmmmmm I AGREE


No, I'm saying if you're going to say after one game not to complain about the refs as a matter of principle you shouldn't turn around the next game and do it yourself.

I've followed the Pistons here for a few years and I've NEVER seen a fanbase act like the Heat fanbase is this series. It's not 'all fans' at this point


----------



## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Any Heat fans believe their team isn't perfect, and care to offer analysis as to why the Heat lost the game? I haven't seen too much of that, like I have from fans of other teams who lose. Pistons, Spurs and Suns. I see fans giving reasons why their teams lost and showing disappointment. All that tells me is that some Heat fans really believe their team can't be beat in any situation unless the officials are bias against them. It's ridiculous. Come on guys, the Pistons are a great team and it's ridiculous to believe that they can't beat the Heat unless the officials aid them.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Heated said:


> Lol, where'd you get that one from?
> 
> Shaq whines about everything? Thats all your players do is whine, including your coach! You whine your way to wins.



Who is my coach?

The truth is that the pistons played the defense that won game one tonight. The heat didn't play the defense they played in game 2-3 and they lost tonight. No amount of bad calls is going to change that. It came down to second chance points, the Heat wasn't making them and the pistons were.

Alonzo was playing a pretty rough fourth quater out there, but he escaped calls. But who cares? Theres bad calls all throughout, only losers that need some sort of crutch when there team loses tries to blame bad calls on the reaosn for the loss. Get real, the Heat just didnt play very good tonight. They lost. I'm sure the next game they will play with a little more heart and it wont be this way. I still pick heat to win the series.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Pistons fans.. :nonono:

may god have mercy on thee


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

ian said:


> No, I'm saying if you're going to say after one game not to complain about the refs as a matter of principle you shouldn't turn around the next game and do it yourself.


that means detroit shouldnt of complained games 2 and 3 after telling Miami not to after game 1?????.......yet they did anyway. 

Anytime I disagree im going to complain. And like I said, in a loss each bad call sticks out a lot more then in a victory


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> only losers that need some sort of crutch when there team loses tries to blame bad calls on the reaosn for the loss


First of all. You just called most every Pistons fan on board a loser. 2nd the HEAT played POOR, because our BIGS played limited minutes DUE to foul trouble. Get it?


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

the wall said:


> If you guys win it after Game 6, I'll congratulate you. I just wanted to point out that your previous post was ridiculous. I think even your fellow Heat fans can agree on that. :biggrin: Hopefully this series will go to 7, I have tickets and I'll be down in Miami to go cheer on the squad.


bro your previous post was rediculous. read my post again, when did i say the pistons wont make the playoffs. again, they will be lucky to make the playoffs if LB leaves. theyre not going anywhere without that whiner on the sidelines. that guy is the biggest whiner ever outside of jerry sloan and marc cuban. enjoy the win


----------



## ian (Jun 4, 2003)

nickrock23 said:


> bro your previous post was rediculous. read my post again, when did i say the pistons wont make the playoffs. again, they will be lucky to make the playoffs if LB leaves. theyre not going anywhere without that whiner on the sidelines. that guy is the biggest whiner ever outside of jerry sloan and marc cuban. enjoy the win


They won 50 games the year before LB came with a lesser lineup. LB left because Philly was crashing, not the other way around.


----------



## the wall (Jul 21, 2002)

nickrock23 said:


> bro your previous post was rediculous. read my post again, when did i say the pistons wont make the playoffs. again, they will be lucky to make the playoffs if LB leaves. theyre not going anywhere without that whiner on the sidelines. that guy is the biggest whiner ever outside of jerry sloan and marc cuban. enjoy the win



I just assumed that by saying that we would be lucky to make the playoffs it would be safe to say you didn't think we would make the playoffs next year. Either way you're calling us a bad team without our coach, who you called a bad coach based on his playoff performance. 

Anyways, this is a great series between two evenly matched teams. Both teams fans have been angry about the reffing in their losses, that is to be expected. We all just have to realize that both of these teams prefer a differently reffered game and it will be nearly impossible for the refs to call a game that will make everyone happy. Let's just hope that the refs stop making some of these unbelievable calls, because some of the calls this series have been mind boggling...BOTH WAYS. Let's hope that game 5 can be fairly called and can be decided by the players and not the whistle. Maybe if the Crawfords retire from referreing, we'll all be happy?


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

ian said:


> They won 50 games the year before LB came with a lesser lineup. LB left because Philly was crashing, not the other way around.


your team stinks get off this board already


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

the wall said:


> *Anyways, this is a great series between two evenly matched teams. Both teams fans have been angry about the reffing in their losses, that is to be expected. We all just have to realize that both of these teams prefer a differently reffered game and it will be nearly impossible for the refs to call a game that will make everyone happy*. Let's just hope that the refs stop making some of these unbelievable calls, because some of the calls this series have been mind boggling...BOTH WAYS. Let's hope that game 5 can be fairly called and can be decided by the players and not the whistle. Maybe if the Crawfords retire from referreing, we'll all be happy?


good post. I agree, especially with the bold part


----------



## AtomGreen (Jun 7, 2004)

Sir Patchwork said:


> Any Heat fans believe their team isn't perfect, and care to offer analysis as to why the Heat lost the game? I haven't seen too much of that, like I have from fans of other teams who lose. Pistons, Spurs and Suns. I see fans giving reasons why their teams lost and showing disappointment. All that tells me is that some Heat fans really believe their team can't be beat in any situation unless the officials are bias against them. It's ridiculous. Come on guys, the Pistons are a great team and it's ridiculous to believe that they can't beat the Heat unless the officials aid them.


Patch, you're attempting to use common sense against a fan base that has become obsessed with the officiating in this series. 90% of the posts in this 9 page thread are about the officials and how they're intentionally screwing the Heat. That's mind boggling. 

Detroit's playing at home and every big man in their frontcourt was in foul trouble tonight and Rasheed fouled out...but the refs were obviously and unfailry biased towards Detroit. I'm sorry but besides sour grapes, that just doesn't make ANY sense.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Heated said:


> First of all. You just called most every Pistons fan on board a loser. 2nd the HEAT played POOR, because our BIGS played limited minutes DUE to foul trouble. Get it?



lol. Yes, your right. All of the fouls were set up. The secert Stern society came together before the game to insure that all the bigs would play limited minutes in the fourth to insure a Pistons victory! THOSE *******S! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: 

Even your own coach is saying Detroit played great defense and that was the difference. But what does that guy know, he only coaches the Heat.. You watch the games on TNT....  

And I don't care what the Pistons fans think about the Ref calls from the previews two games, I watched all of em and I thought bad calls went both ways. Lack of effort and intense Defense made Heat easily pick up those wins. 

Give me a break.. I'm sure after you get out of High School, learn a little more basketball you will be able to except poor team play instead of citing conspiracys agisnt your team. :krazy: 


Hail Stern! 
:cheers:


----------



## WSU151 (Mar 13, 2005)

ian said:


> No, I'm saying if you're going to say after one game not to complain about the refs as a matter of principle you shouldn't turn around the next game and do it yourself.
> 
> I've followed the Pistons here for a few years and I've NEVER seen a fanbase act like the Heat fanbase is this series. It's not 'all fans' at this point


I'm starting to think that blaming the officials is tit-for-tat by a lot of fans of a lot of teams. 

Heat lost, got massively outplayed by the Pistons, especially in the second quarter. And the Pistons shot the basketball just like they did in game 1 - Will that hold up? We'll see. The Heat had a great chance to get back in it in the third, and a little bit in the fourth, but Rip, Sheed, and Billups were shooting well once again. On the flip side, the Heat didn't shoot that well at all.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

the wall said:


> Anyways, this is a great series between two evenly matched teams. Both teams fans have been angry about the reffing in their losses, that is to be expected. We all just have to realize that both of these teams prefer a differently reffered game and it will be nearly impossible for the refs to call a game that will make everyone happy.



I couldn't agree more.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

Sir Patchwork said:


> Any Heat fans believe their team isn't perfect, and care to offer analysis as to why the Heat lost the game? I haven't seen too much of that, like I have from fans of other teams who lose. Pistons, Spurs and Suns. I see fans giving reasons why their teams lost and showing disappointment. All that tells me is that some Heat fans really believe their team can't be beat in any situation unless the officials are bias against them. It's ridiculous. Come on guys, the Pistons are a great team and it's ridiculous to believe that they can't beat the Heat unless the officials aid them.


That one foul on Shaq. The rest of the calls pretty much evened out (and like I said pointing out the ones that go against you in a loss are much easier), but that one shaq foul completely changed what we were doing. There is a reason we made our runs with him in the game. We need him in there and the totally bs call that they made took away a lot of his minutes


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

the wall said:


> Anyways, this is a great series between two evenly matched teams. Both teams fans have been angry about the reffing in their losses, that is to be expected. We all just have to realize that both of these teams prefer a differently reffered game and it will be nearly impossible for the refs to call a game that will make everyone happy. Let's just hope that the refs stop making some of these unbelievable calls, because some of the calls this series have been mind boggling...BOTH WAYS. Let's hope that game 5 can be fairly called and can be decided by the players and not the whistle. Maybe if the Crawfords retire from referreing, we'll all be happy?


It's not these refs job to decide weather they are going to call a game loosely or not. You call what you see. You don't call a foul because someone flops. You don't call a foul because a player or coach b*tches(in fact, that should be a tech) and that's the end of it. If you don't see it Don't call it. If you do see it, call it.

These freaking refs seem to be too worried about making everybody happy which leads to poor officiated games. If the refs weren't so buddy buddy with the players this wouldn't be a problem. They're not doing their job, they're doing someone elses.


----------



## Joker (Aug 7, 2002)

Granted there were some bad calls, but I would not blame anything on the refs tonight. They came with so much more intensity and went after every rebound, every loose ball. You gotta tip your hat when they come up with a sequence like they did in the 4th where Prince goes out of bounds on the Heat bench to save the ball and they score... then when the shot clock was down to 3, they get the offensive rebound and so many second chance points.

Our foul trouble got us out of the game, but you could tell from the opening tip that we were not playing with half the urgency they did.

Plus they're playing through all the coach rumors... I just congratulate them and better be ready for Thursday in Miami.

This one is going to 7.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

any why we lost

Defense. It sucked. Doleac was horrible and gave up like 10 layups. Shaq didnt go for rebounds and gave up lots of offensive rebounds which got the Pistons many second chance points


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

the wall said:


> I just assumed that by saying that we would be lucky to make the playoffs it would be safe to say you didn't think we would make the playoffs next year. Either way you're calling us a bad team without our coach, who you called a bad coach based on his playoff performance.
> 
> Anyways, this is a great series between two evenly matched teams. Both teams fans have been angry about the reffing in their losses, that is to be expected. We all just have to realize that both of these teams prefer a differently reffered game and it will be nearly impossible for the refs to call a game that will make everyone happy. Let's just hope that the refs stop making some of these unbelievable calls, because some of the calls this series have been mind boggling...BOTH WAYS. Let's hope that game 5 can be fairly called and can be decided by the players and not the whistle. Maybe if the Crawfords retire from referreing, we'll all be happy?


youre 17 so that means i watched larry whine at kansas before you were born. tell me you watched the olympics and didnt see larry get ingnored, laughed at and t'ed up whenever he whined. the guy had 10 NBA superstars and coudnt beat club players.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

Joker said:


> This one is going to 7.


definately looks like it


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Yes we lost. Good for you Pistons. I can't congratulate you, not on this win. I think if our bigs weren't in foul trouble so early this could have been a much different game. I look forward to Thursday in Miami.


----------



## AtomGreen (Jun 7, 2004)

Heated said:


> Yes we lost. Good for you Pistons. I can't congratulate you, not on this win. I think if our bigs weren't in foul trouble so early this could have been a much different game. I look forward to Thursday in Miami.


And what about Detroit's bigs? What if they had stayed out of foul trouble? That's a convenient (and cheap) argument when you only look at one team's foul trouble and make assumptions on the game based off that one myopic stat.


----------



## DBurks2818 (May 18, 2005)

Miami was definately outhustled tonight, which really won the game for Detroit. I can't say that they weren't trying, because despite a few very questionable fouls (Shaq's 3rd, Haslem's tech) that altered the flow of the game, they continued to fight back. Ultimately, there was a domino effect that got Shaq in foul trouble, which lead to Wade not having Shaq in enough to take the pressure off of him which either hurting offensive execution (As in the April game) and/or resulted in turnovers, which got Mourning in foul trouble for having to be out there too long, which got Doleac playing more minutes than he should have (and giving up a lot of easy baskets while he was out there), which lead to the shooters never being able to get into a good rhythm like they had in game 3.

What Miami has to do in game 5 is increase their intensity both defensively and offensively. If they don't let Detroit get comfortable like they did for most of game 3, as well as get out in transition, they'll be fine. I also would like Van Gundy not to stay with Dooling so much, and finally give Shandon Anderson some of Dooling's minutes to defend Rip Hamilton behind Eddie.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

AtomGreen said:


> And what about Detroit's bigs? What if they had stayed out of foul trouble? That's a convenient (and cheap) argument when you only look at one team's foul trouble and make assumptions on the game based off that one myopic stat.


2 of Shaqs first fouls weren't even fouls. That's the difference. Shaq sat for a very long time during the first half. Ben got his usual minutes.


----------



## detpistonsrock (Jun 1, 2005)

So I am a Pistons fan and this is going to sound like it came from a Pistons fan but I have one question for all the people that said that foul on Shaq, his third (which I agree was a bit of a weak call but that has happened for both teams all series long) changed the game. If a single foul on a single person changes your teams chances of winning, because you need to change your game plan, doesn't that mean that you are basically a one person team? It sounds like you are all complaining about an unfair call ruined your teams chances of winning. And it may have. But that is discrediting a lot of the work the rest of the team does. For example, Eddie Jones is an amazing shooter. Sure his defense skills are not as high as some people but he can shoot so good. Another thing I noticed that was amazing was the amount of work Dooling (I think it was him) put in at the end of the game. He was running all over the flippin place. For a while, I was actually nervous he was bringing the Heat back in the game in the last minute and a half. Please quite whining about the refs because it is taking away from the rest of your teams performance. Detroit played better D tonight. They also played better D in the first game. Miami played better D in the two middle games. Thats all I have to say. Defense is going to win this series and that is what the Eastern Conference, plus San Antonio, is all about.
:banana: 
The Banana is there because he rocks. This is my first post and I thought he was cool.


----------



## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

3:00 am, just walked in my apartment door from the Palace...

All I'm gonna say is this:
1. SVG is a long way from being a good coach
2. Our defense tonight was absolutely ****ing horrible
3. The next time SVG puts Rasual Butler at PF against Rasheed Wallace, I will buy the domain name "Fire Stan Van Gundy.com" and you are all welcome to join
4. Paging Shandon Anderson, where have you gone?
5. Our guards defense was P-A-T-H-E-T-I-C, besides Stan's coaching, our guards defense pretty much lost us this game. Look who shot FTs in the beginning of the game when our bigs got in foul trouble, it wasn't Sheed and Ben, it was the guards. If we can't keep their damn guards out of the frickin paint, we're gonna get in foul trouble with our bigs realllllllllly quick (like tonight) and we're not gonna win. Bottomline. If you let a team penetrate into the lane whenever they want, you aren't gonnna win very many basketball games. Tonight was horrible, and if it doesn't improve, we're done in 6 games. 

That's it, I'm going to bed....just needed to vent that before I hit the sack...


----------



## P33r~ (Nov 22, 2004)

Looks like it was a nice game, wish i could have watched it. I feel for all the heat fans who can't watch this series in australia as well.

Anyway what's with all the accusations that the pistons complained after game 2? We knew we lost fairly and i dont think i heard a single pistons fan blame the loss on the reffing. Game 3 was different and we complained a little more but nowhere near the level of some of the complaints in the heats game 1 loss. Just thought I'd clear that up.


----------



## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

Sir Patchwork said:


> Any Heat fans believe their team isn't perfect, and care to offer analysis as to why the Heat lost the game? I haven't seen too much of that, like I have from fans of other teams who lose. Pistons, Spurs and Suns. I see fans giving reasons why their teams lost and showing disappointment. All that tells me is that some Heat fans really believe their team can't be beat in any situation unless the officials are bias against them. It's ridiculous. Come on guys, the Pistons are a great team and it's ridiculous to believe that they can't beat the Heat unless the officials aid them.


That's a common attitude I've noticed in Shaq-led-team fanbases. It's almost like they just adopt _his_ attitude.


----------



## dap (Apr 12, 2005)

It seems like everyone here complains about the refs during the game, but afterwards they say it wasnt the refs fault but our poor defense.

Im gonna be very clear about this: THE REFS SCREWED US OVER!!!

Now I feel like a rebel of going against what most people say. Anyways, what is up with that tech foul on Haslem? Im starting to feel like that some of these games are actually fixed. Anyone dare to agree with me?


----------



## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

I would agree if we played well enough to win, but when you play downright horrible defense, and let the refs affect you so much, we ddidn't deserve to win that game, the pistons did...


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Shaq_Diesel said:


> I would agree if we played well enough to win, but when you play downright horrible defense, and let the refs affect you so much, we ddidn't deserve to win that game, the pistons did...



Thank god... A voice of reason.

I still believe the heat will win this series, but last nights game was all pistons all the time.


----------



## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

dap said:


> It seems like everyone here complains about the refs during the game, but afterwards they say it wasnt the refs fault but our poor defense.
> 
> Im gonna be very clear about this: THE REFS SCREWED US OVER!!!
> 
> Now I feel like a rebel of going against what most people say. Anyways, what is up with that tech foul on Haslem? Im starting to feel like that some of these games are actually fixed. Anyone dare to agree with me?


first Haslem had no respect from the refs last year, as an undrafted rookie its to be expected. but for someone who made all-rookie 2nd team and is a solid player in this league already, he still gets very little respect. in time he will get the calls.
my prob with shaq getting called for the 1st and 3rd is if you are going to whistle those, then call it on the other side when eddie crashes into ben wallace in the circle on that layup.
i dont think its fixed though. NBA is the hardest sport to officiate.


----------



## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

dap said:


> Im gonna be very clear about this: THE REFS SCREWED US OVER!!!
> 
> Now I feel like a rebel of going against what most people say. Anyways, what is up with that tech foul on Haslem? Im starting to feel like that some of these games are actually fixed. Anyone dare to agree with me?


Yeah, the league is falling all over itself to keep Shaq out of the Finals. They're fixing the games, so they can have their Spurs-Pistons ratings bonanza.


----------



## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Rawse said:


> Yeah, the league is falling all over itself to keep Shaq out of the Finals. They're fixing the games, so they can have their Spurs-Pistons ratings bonanza.


I think a Spurs/Heat finals would be more exciting than Spurs/Pistons. Course I may be a bit biased. :biggrin:


----------



## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

Heated said:


> I think a Spurs/Heat finals would be more exciting than Spurs/Pistons. Course I may be a bit biased. :biggrin:


I was being sarcastic.


----------

