# An Eye To Change...



## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

I have not been able to catch any Knick games but I've noticed that Channing Frye has been struggling stat wise. Conversations amongst Knick fans that keep a close eye on the team seem to confirm that fact that Frye has struggling extends beyond just the numbers. If this is a long term deal, what do you all suggest we do with him?

I know it may be a little premature to begin discussing trades but I could not help but think that if Frye's struggles are a result of the system we run, then maybe it's in our best interest to pursue a change while his trade value is relatively high. If there is no way to productively utilize Frye in our lineup than can Shawn Marion possibly be in our future? I know this sounds relatively far-fetch'd but there have been numerous trade rumors generated about Marion every year. Once in a while would mean that its likely that teams are just inquiring about his availability. Every single year seems to hint at the fact that the Suns are trying to determine his value. While this does not mean Marion would be available to the Knicks, I would have to think that a guy like Channing Frye would generate some interest. I know...I know, that we have to get the contracts to match. Ironically, we just bought out a key pawn with Jalen Rose that could have made this thing work. The Suns obviously had interest in him and his expiring contract would have been extremely appealing to a Suns team obviously focused on financial flexibility (which was the cause of the Marion rumors last year and whether they could balance 4 max or near max contracts). At this point its highly unlikely but I think both teams could get what they want from this deal. The Suns get to move Amare back to the 4 and Diaw to the 3. They also get a big man with range that plays well in an uptempo system. In a sense, he's the 6-11 24 year old answer to the aging Kurt Thomas (sans the defense although it can get there). Marion could be the hustler we need on this team...


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## alphaorange (Jul 2, 2006)

Fantasy post. Marion is going nowhere. Besides, Frye is just struggling. We already know what he brings. He is trying to be more physical and it has temporarily set his game back. He also is playing a different style offensively than he did last year. It'll take time. NY's problem is still Marbury and the lack of defense, plus we still have a need for a shooter. IT has made a mistake in personel. You can't play run and gun without guns.


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## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

alphaorange said:


> Fantasy post. Marion is going nowhere. Besides, Frye is just struggling. We already know what he brings. He is trying to be more physical and it has temporarily set his game back. He also is playing a different style offensively than he did last year. It'll take time. NY's problem is still Marbury and the lack of defense, plus we still have a need for a shooter. IT has made a mistake in personel. You can't play run and gun without guns.


Gunners, refer to guys who can put the ball in the basket. We may not have very many jump shooters but you can not deny the fact that we have plenty of accomplished scorers. I never realized however that it was a mandate to have jump shooters on your team to enjoy any kind of success. Most recently, the New Jersey Nets made it to the Finals twice and Conference Finals playing an uptempo style without jump shooters. It's possible to make it work because it has worked in the past. We just need to find to right balance on the court. One thing is for sure, Francis, Marbury and Crawford can get to that basket at will. When they kick that ball out, there is going to be alot of space to shoot the ball. No matter how bad a shooter you are, NBA players can convert consistently on open shots so that can right there can offset the lack of a jump shooter. 

As for the post, naturally it is a fantasy post. Any post made suggesting a trade by a fan is a fantasy post because its a suggestion based on unconfirmed sources in newspapers. Is it possible, I think so especially had we still had Jalen. We've seen them move many accomplished and known players for players regarded as less talented or unknown (Johnson for Diaw). What most people do not know is that their system is flexible enough to have people enjoy career years so Frye's numbers could very well sky rocket and strengthen what they really need.


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## alphaorange (Jul 2, 2006)

*Baloney...*

Marion is a top player and we don't have the goods....even if he was available...which he is not. There were real reasons JJ was traded and it was because thje Suns would not have enough money to keep all their young stars. It was one or the other.W/O him the Suns will set. And the Nets failed because they did NOT have a shooter....duh.


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## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

*Re: Baloney...*



alphaorange said:


> Marion is a top player and we don't have the goods....even if he was available...which he is not. There were real reasons JJ was traded and it was because thje Suns would not have enough money to keep all their young stars. It was one or the other.W/O him the Suns will set. And the Nets failed because they did NOT have a shooter....duh.


Duh? So Two Finals appearances and a Conference Finals appearance is a failure to you? Somehow, I find it hard to believe that one of the most successful teams in the league in the past few years can be regarded as a failure. As for the Suns, Marion is a top player but how do you know he is not available. Someone mentioned (and I'm not sure who) that everyone in the league is available for the right price. Considering the number of rumors that have surrounded Marion's name the past few seasons, I would not go as far to say he is not available especially since the Suns are not taking questions regarding personnel from fans. You mentioned JJ being traded because there was not enough money to keep their young stars but Amare got his max deal, and Diaw ended up getting the money that was owed to Joe. In essence, there in the same situation financially that they had attempted to avoid by moving JJ in the first place so why is it hard to believe that they may make a move with a financial agenda in mind?


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## alphaorange (Jul 2, 2006)

*Really?*

Diaw got the max? Thats what JJ was after. And what rumors were there after JJ left? I saw where Marion was wanted by other teams but never where the Suns were rumored to be interested. Hell yeah, everyone's available for the right price. Thats a real epiphany. I got another one for you......the Knicks don't have the goods...not even close. And if you don't win, you lose. If you don't succeed, you fail. The Nets failed in the quest for a title. With a good shooter they win. No team EVER wins it without having a couple of good shooters (see '96 Knicks). Its nice to do the pretend thing, but the real season is upon us now and its better to talk about real scenarios.


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## kconn61686 (Jul 29, 2005)

> As for the Suns, Marion is a top player but how do you know he is not available


well maybe if you are offering Lebron James, yea, you can get him


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## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

*Re: Really?*



alphaorange said:


> Diaw got the max? Thats what JJ was after. And what rumors were there after JJ left? I saw where Marion was wanted by other teams but never where the Suns were rumored to be interested. Hell yeah, everyone's available for the right price. Thats a real epiphany. I got another one for you......the Knicks don't have the goods...not even close. And if you don't win, you lose. If you don't succeed, you fail. The Nets failed in the quest for a title. With a good shooter they win. No team EVER wins it without having a couple of good shooters (see '96 Knicks). Its nice to do the pretend thing, but the real season is upon us now and its better to talk about real scenarios.


No team ever wins it without having a couple of good shooters? What shooters did the Pistons really have? The Pistons rarely utilized any ability to shoot the ball with range yet they managed to win a NBA title and make the Finals the next year. It can be done because it has been done. As for Diaw, he'll be making 8 digits which can not be much less than the $12 million Joe Johnson is getting this season. The Suns tend to make moves with finances in mind, plain and simple. Just this offseason, there were rumors spread for at least a week regarding Marion being moved to Seattle for essentially Rashard Lewis. "Is Shawn Marion available? That’s at least being whispered around the league, primarily because it’s obvious that new Phoenix owner Robert Sarver (think Mark Cuban without any redeeming qualities) is dead set against paying any luxury tax and the one salary he might want to shed is Marion’s." That was taken from an article on an internet blog when the rumors were being spread. Hoopsworld even wrote an article to attempt to dispell why it would not make sense for the Suns to be interested in Lewis for Marion because it would was understood the interest was coming from the Suns (http://www.hoopsworld.com/article_17842.shtml). There were alot of rumors surrounding Marion's name around draft time, mostly making the Suns younger and giving them greater financial flexibility. There is no doubt that Marion is an amazing player. He's especially unique because he's perhaps the only big name, high impact player whose always involved in trade rumors in a solid situation. I don't ever recall hearing Lebron James, Dwayne Wade or Carmelo Anthony being mentioned on the block. I think that may say something.


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## EwingStarksOakley94 (May 13, 2003)

kconn61686 said:


> well maybe if you are offering Lebron James, yea, you can get him


yeah, because that would be a good deal


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## TwinkieFoot (Jul 8, 2006)

kconn61686 said:


> well maybe if you are offering Lebron James, yea, you can get him


Then again we never heard Lebron involved in trade rumors. We have heard Marion mentioned in rumors several times and we have heard him being dealt for younger players and financial flexibility. Apparently, it doesn't take a James for them to be interested. Besides, Marion could never effect the game as much as Lebron.


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## alphaorange (Jul 2, 2006)

*Couple of points*

What rumors of his trade have you seen printed since JJ has been gone. Not fan speculation, but rumors. And where have you read that the Suns were entertaining offers. Give me a link and I will bow to you on this. Next....the Pistons have no shooters?!!? Yeah, Rip and Billups are busts. Rasheed certainly can't hit a three ball. And that Prince guy is a real brick layer. You lost a ton of credibility with that statement. Whew!.....


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## Kiyaman (Aug 14, 2006)

Frye is not struggling its just that he knows he is not a Starter over Malik Rose or Mo Taylor. 
Channing Frye knows that he is a cleanup backup PF that will get the majority of playingtime. 
He would like to come into the game playing against teams bench players to get warmed up. 
Frye see NBA PF Starters who just have that touch at the start of any game against any team (Duncan, Garnett, Dirk, O'Neal, Rasheed, Howard, Bosh, Ect.) without a problem. I dont think Channing Frye confidence as a Starter has convinced himself that he is ready to be as good as those elite players. 

Maybe if Mo Taylor or Malik Rose would've been the starting PF at the Start of the season then Channing Frye would not have hit that wall of Nervousness so soon. Even his open hook shot and open 15 footer is off and that is not the Frye that we been seeing in a Knick uniform. 

The Solution: 
Take Frye out of the Starting Lineup, put him on the bench and dont play him for TWO games and watch what he does in the 3rd game. Psycology 1 on1.


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## Truknicksfan (Mar 25, 2005)

> Frye is not struggling its just that he knows he is not a Starter over Malik Rose or Mo Taylor.


He is a better player then malik Rose and Mo taylor.


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## alphaorange (Jul 2, 2006)

*Kiyaman agrees....*

He is just saying that coming off the bench might get Frye's confidence back.


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## Truknicksfan (Mar 25, 2005)

> He is just saying that coming off the bench might get Frye's confidence back.


Yeah I understand, and go for it, this team has got to try somthing. Or they will be playing in front of a lot of empty seats at MSG shortly.


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