# Rudy Fernandez



## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

Hey guys, I have a question about this guy. I know about him, did some research, and think he is a stud, and will be a really good player in the NBA. He is probably the best player in Spain and I heard that they really want to keep him down there. 

Anybody know what is up? I heard his dream was to play in the NBA, and that he might take less money to come over and play.

Is he comin' next year? Or could he come down this year? Or is he comin' at all? Or will he not be on the team next year?

Thanks in advance.


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## sabas4mvp (Sep 23, 2002)

He can't come over this year as he is locked into his contract there. The only way he could come over this year is if he bought out his contract himself, but I believe it is worth more than his NBA contract will be so basically it would bankrupt him. Pritchard said that he thinks teams in europe will throw big offers at him to try and get him to stay next year, but Sergio says it is his dream to play in the NBA and says he will be here next year... Honestly, why would he not come over with how bright the blazers future looks.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

Great, that is awesome. Yea, i'm sure he wants to be a part of this team, definitely somethin' special goin' on. I for one, also really want him to be part of it also.

Thanks for the info, lookin' forward to seein' him next year. He will definitely be a damn fine player.


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## mgb (Jun 26, 2004)

sabas4mvp said:


> He can't come over this year as he is locked into his contract there. The only way he could come over this year is if he bought out his contract himself, but I believe it is worth more than his NBA contract will be so basically it would bankrupt him. Pritchard said that he thinks teams in europe will throw big offers at him to try and get him to stay next year, but Sergio says it is his dream to play in the NBA and says he will be here next year... *Honestly, why would he not come over with how bright the blazers future looks*.


Because he might not get off the bench? He probably will get playing time, but if Sergio is any indication he might worry about that. While he can speak some english I read he'll have a problem just like Sergio communicating to the coaches so that might keep him on the bench more than otherwise.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

^ yea, but i doubt he will be on the bench for more than his first year. He is too talented and too good.


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## gatorpops (Dec 17, 2004)

mgb said:


> Because he might not get off the bench? He probably will get playing time, but if Sergio is any indication he might worry about that. While he can speak some english I read he'll have a problem just like Sergio communicating to the coaches so that might keep him on the bench more than otherwise.


He will probably not get to start early on but these kids can learn English fairly easily. I have a garndson-in-law that is Swiss but grew up speaking French. he has picked up the lanquage very quickly and even the nuanses.(?) They all take English in school and so it just isn't that big off a deal, if they think it is necessary. Rudy will have Sergio and that will be good and those two can really make majic. The teams in Europe know that Rudy is a high flyer and gets loose for those over the rim dunks yet he does it repeatedly in nearly every game. I have very high expectations.

gatorpops

P.S: *Thanks for the tickets to the game last night mgb, my grandson and I celebrated our respective B-Days very well indeed. Thanks again.*


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

mgb said:


> Because he might not get off the bench? He probably will get playing time, but if Sergio is any indication he might worry about that. While he can speak some english I read he'll have a problem just like Sergio communicating to the coaches so that might keep him on the bench more than otherwise.


It might be less of a problem because his position is a bit simpler than Sergio's. 

barfo


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

mgb said:


> Because he might not get off the bench? He probably will get playing time, but if Sergio is any indication he might worry about that. While he can speak some english I read he'll have a problem just like Sergio communicating to the coaches so that might keep him on the bench more than otherwise.


There's just one thing wrong with your worry. Rudy is so much further along developmental wise, that it wouldn't be shocking if Rudy were to start next year. Minutes won't be an issue for Rudy.


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## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

Hap said:


> There's just one thing wrong with your worry. Rudy is so much further along developmental wise, that it wouldn't be shocking if Rudy were to start next year. Minutes won't be an issue for Rudy.


Agreed. _If_ the Blazers really want to try starting Roy at PG next season, Fernandez is _easily_ the best choice for a backcourt mate -- if it's Blake, Jack, or someone shorter than about 6'4", even if they're running the ball through Roy I wouldn't say he's playing PG.

Webster _might_ be another option, but I think they'd be doing that more now if they had that much confidence in Webster's ability to help handle the ball, etc.


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## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

That said, someone else posted the idea that we'd see Blake and Roy starting games with Roy and Fernandez finishing games (and Rodriguez potentially getting minutes with Fernandez in the middle). I'm inclined to agree.

Jack? He's playing well right now as a combo guard but I'll be amazed if he and Fernandez are both on the team beyond next season's trading deadline.


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## GOD (Jun 22, 2003)

Aside from his dream being to come to the NBA, I think the money will not be an issue. If he stayed, he would make about 1-1.5 million more than he would make in the NBA, but that would also be about the most he will ever earn. But if he comes over, in 4 years he has the chance to earn substantially more money on his second NBA contract. 

As far as playing time, I think that KP has made it clear in that Rudy will get time. KP said that they have stayed in constant contact with Rudy this year, and my guess is that they are shmoozing him and letting him know how well he would play alongside Roy. Also, Rudy and Sergio are great friends, and I think that may help him. 

On the Spanish team, Rudy is by far a better player than Sergio is today even though Sergio now has NBA experience. I am so excited to see Rudy slashing for ally-oops and shooting lights out from 3pt range. He may need to adjust to the NBA 3pt range, and his defense will likely be an issue, but that's true of all rooks.


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

yeah rudy is an euro elite player which can play the nba and euro styles no problem!


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## alext42083 (Nov 7, 2003)

Hopefully he comes over next season.
He looks crazy athletic for a Euro, and there are several youtube videos of him and Sergio hooking up for alley-oops.
I don't know a lot about him but I'm excited to see him play. Seeing him and Oden into the mix, oh man, this is going to be good.


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## wizmentor (Nov 10, 2005)

I am excited about Rudy, too!

However, I won't get *too* excited until I see him as a remotely
average NBA defense. He does not have a prototypical "NBA body". He
might be a great defender, but I'd like to see it.


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## Boob-No-More (Apr 24, 2006)

mgb said:


> Because he might not get off the bench? He probably will get playing time, but if Sergio is any indication he might worry about that.


Sergio was never a starter in Europe, either in the Euroleague or on the Spanish national team where he backs up Calderon. Rudy, on the other hand, not only was a starter as a rookie on his Euroleague team, he was fourth in the league in scoring and won the Euroleague Rising Star Award (best Euroleague player under 22). Rudy was more NBA ready last year than Sergio is this year. After he completes his second season of Euroleague play and he'll be ready to contribute right away starting next Fall. Will he start as a rookie? Hard to say. Probably not at the beginning of his rookie year, but I wouldn't be surprised to see him starting beside Roy in the backcourt by the end of his rookie year. At the very least, I'd expect him to be a very solid sixth or seventh man averaging > 20 MPG and double-digit scoring as a rookie and a solid NBA starter as a sophomore.

BNM


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## Boob-No-More (Apr 24, 2006)

wizmentor said:


> I am excited about Rudy, too!
> 
> However, I won't get *too* excited until I see him as a remotely
> average NBA defense. He does not have a prototypical "NBA body". He
> might be a great defender, but I'd like to see it.


Not sure how his his man-to-man defense will fare in the NBA, be last year, as a rookie, he was 6th in the Euroleague in steals. At the very least, his quickness and athleticism should permit him to be solid defensively in the zone the Blazers are playing so much of these days - and next year he'll have Oden behind him. That will allow him to play tight perimeter defense knowing that if his man gets by him Oden will be there to help.

BNM


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## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

Boob-No-More said:


> Not sure how his his man-to-man defense will fare in the NBA, be last year, as a rookie, he was 6th in the Euroleague in steals. At the very least, his quickness and athleticism should permit him to be solid defensively in the zone the Blazers are playing so much of these days - and next year he'll have Oden behind him. That will allow him to play tight perimeter defense knowing that if his man gets by him Oden will be there to help.
> 
> BNM


Right. And with that, I hope that, unless he plays so well that Nate has no choice but to start him, Blake continues to start with Roy. Let Fernandez fly under the radar a little bit, 20 minutes here, 15 minutes there, 25 another night, again, unless his play demands more. Teams already have their hands full with the current squad. Oden will compound that. I'd love to see Fernandez get a chance to acclimate to the NBA against opposing benches and without being of primary concern with scouting reports.

And, it's not as if the Blake and Roy combination isn't working. It's really quite good -- Blake is proving to be something like a Steve Kerr to Roy's Michael Jordan. Neither is the equal of the player I'm using metaphorically (yet) but I think the guys 4 through 10 on this current Blazers team might well be better than the 4 through 10 that Jordan, Pippen, and Kerr had to work with most of that time.


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## HispanicCausinPanic (Jul 2, 2005)

Sombody will have to go. That is too many bodies! Maybe Martell, maybe Jack?


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

With Rudy coming over Jack does look to be the odd man out. He plays best as a backup to Roy at SG, but Rudy may be a better option. I really like Jacks game more than Blake or Sergio, but if we can package Jack, our pick, and Martell/Outlaw for a good player (SF?) that may be a good option.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

Draco said:


> With Rudy coming over Jack does look to be the odd man out. He plays best as a backup to Roy at SG, but Rudy may be a better option. I really like Jacks game more than Blake or Sergio, but if we can package Jack, our pick, and Martell/Outlaw for a good player (SF?) that may be a good option.


I feel like at this point Jack, the pick, and either Frye or Outlaw wouldn't be too far off for Iggy or Deng. Their values are plummeting while ours are getting way better (except for the pick). Or I like the thought of trading our pick up (which should be a mid first rounder) to like number 6 or 7, with Jack and Frye or Jack and Outlaw to grab Eric Gordon (who I think will drop a little because of his height).


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## Goldmember (May 24, 2003)

http://www.nbadraft.net/profiles/rudyfernandez.asp

He gets some pretty high praise in this scouting report. They practically make him out to be a future HOFer. Webster and Jack better watch out.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

Goldmember said:


> http://www.nbadraft.net/profiles/rudyfernandez.asp
> 
> He gets some pretty high praise in this scouting report. They practically make him out to be a future HOFer. Webster and Jack better watch out.


I think his mom wrote that.

barfo


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## BuckW4GM (Nov 2, 2005)

barfo said:


> I think his mom wrote that.
> 
> barfo


:laugh:

i'm really trying to not get too excited about him, but i'm starting to buy into his hype a little bit.


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## #10 (Jul 23, 2004)

Goldmember said:


> http://www.nbadraft.net/profiles/rudyfernandez.asp
> 
> He gets some pretty high praise in this scouting report. They practically make him out to be a future HOFer. Webster and Jack better watch out.


That was written three years ago, and in any case, nbadraft.net makes everyone seem like a future HOFer. Rudy's Euroleague Rising Star award is far more indicative of his talent/potential.


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

darkhelmit54 said:


> I feel like at this point Jack, the pick, and either Frye or Outlaw wouldn't be too far off for Iggy or Deng. Their values are plummeting while ours are getting way better (except for the pick). Or I like the thought of trading our pick up (which should be a mid first rounder) to like number 6 or 7, with Jack and Frye or Jack and Outlaw to grab Eric Gordon (who I think will drop a little because of his height).


Not to get this thread too much further off track, but...

This summer many of the posters here shared these feelings about the team:

This was a crazy young roster, brimming with a lot of talent and potential.

Young teams do not win consistently in the NBA.

With Oden out, and having traded Zach to make room for Oden on the front line, and after such a poor previous season for Joel, our thin front line would be a weak spot.

Failing to trade for a stud Small Forward meant that would be a weak spot.

Expectations for wins were modest, and with the expected injuries during the season, a lotto pick (possibly a high one) was in the offing. The player that this lotto pick represented or could be traded for could/would be a key piece of the future.

Add to the lotto pick, and the current team, we already had as team assets Oden, Rudy (who most thought looked good), 2 more long-shot Euros, a bushel of second rounders, and Yikes! that is too, too much.

It is never a bad thing to have too much talent. Yet, you can't just stockpile it without something of a plan, lest you lose players. Rights expire. Players who are ready to play get upset. Players angling for an extension contract get upset. The trick is to stay ahead of this curve and move players before their value plummets or you are forced into moves.

There was no way that KP wasn't already running many multiple scenarios in his head as to how to deal with this issue. But, the bottom line is that even before this summer's draft, it was obvious that KP was going to have to do a fair amount of roster consolidation before the start of the 09 season.

While the basic concept of consolidation is unchanged, some of the details have changed with the new information of this season so far:

Outlaw has broken out and is showing he can produce against starters and in crunch minutes what in the past he was only able to do against second units. KP has to think with his reasonable contract he is worth keeping. His trade value is likely quite high. Either way, Blazers win.

Roy is even better than last season. And he does his best work with the ball in his hands. When you have a potential star player on your hands, you work the rest of the roster around them. That has impacts on a player like Sergio and on the type of upgrade at point guard KP might conisder. Wouldn't a defensive stud who cans the long ball be a better fit for Roy (and probably Oden too) than other types? And why get a "star" PG who needs the ball and shots, when he and Roy would fit poorly together?

RUDY, RUDY, RUDY. He is playing great, and the expectations for him next season have grown, with the question now being, how good can he be?

Though young, the team isn't playing "young" right now. They are piling up more wins than expected.

This means our pick won't be a blue chipper. It also means some of our players have more value than they did when we were losing. Which means KP will have a better shot at trading quantity for quality.

I think KP will carefully entertain deals that involve anybody not named Roy, LaMarcus or Greg. Doesn't mean he doesn't have favorites, but you can't think that way if you want to grab a grade A talent.

If KP can't make a deal he likes, he will have to do a mad scramble to try and flip into future picks, rights to overseas players, and buyouts, etc.

I hope he can find a good deal. I don't like the cap space in 09 plan very much. The Rashard Lewis deal is a horrifying prospect. I would rather trade for a guy we then extend or who was already extended, to more reasonable terms. We are winning now with playing multiple guys with Roy at the guard spot, and multiple guys at the SF slot. Long term, I would like to have a strong defender who is also average or better offensively at either guard or small forward. We need one more solid starter. Then the last starting position can be platoon style, or role player.

Let's say that player is a small forward as you suggest. Ideally we trade a (fair) selection of assets from this group: 08 1st, 09 1st, Outlaw, Webster, Jack, Sergio, Frye, McRoberts, Green, Euros, 2nd rounders, cash, modestly bad contract

Then we have an 08-09 roster of:

Blake/(Jack or Sergio)
Roy/Rudy
New Player/Jones/(Outlaw or Webster)
Aldridge/(Frye or trade or MLE free agent or platoon)
Oden/Joel


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## pablinho (Sep 8, 2006)

Today Rudy did vs TAU CERAMICA (Final four team last 3 years) 27 points 4/5 2FG 3/7 3FG 10/10 FT adding 7 assists and 3 steals in only 31 min.

You guys going dont know How *HARD* is do 27 points and 7 assists in Euro games ( 40 mins games and assists contabilized if is instant pass & instant bucket )


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

i like the 10/10 on FT the best but 7euro assists and 3 steals is very nice! who won the game?


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

I like your thought process Masbee. Defense and 3pt shooting appear to be the primary attributes we need for our 4th best player to surround Oden/LMA/Roy. Jones is kind of a poor mans version I suppose of what we'd ideally want.

I think Sergio has also become a very expendable man on our roster, although I don't know how much value he really holds around the league. With Roy being the main ball handler for this team, Sergio will never get more than 10 minutes a game of burn. What we need from a backcourt mate for Roy is mostly defense and shooting, two of Sergio's most glaring weaknesses. Might as well keep him around next year and see how he meshes with Rudy, but long-term I don't really see a spot for Sergio.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

I think by next year we will have gotten rid of (or ship oversees, or DLeague.. just not on our roster pretty much) Jack, Green, Miles, McRoberts, LaFrentz, our draft picks this year, and Kaponen and leave us with:

PG - Roy/Blake/Sergio
SG - Rudy/Martell
SF - Jones/Outlaw
PF - Aldridge/Frye
C - Oden/Pryzbilla

that is 11 players, and we need 12 for our roster. I'm hopin' we either get a high pick and pick up Beasly in the draft (unlikely but he would be a perfect 3 for our lineup) get Chris Paul via FA or Get Iggy trade wise with all the bait and picks that we have.

What do you guys think... a VERY realistic line-up could look somethin' like

PG - Roy | Blake | Sergio
SG - Fernandez | Webster
SF - Iguodala | Jones
PF - Aldridge | Frye
C - Oden | Pryzbilla

I'm thinkin' offer somethin' like Jack, McRoberts, our 1st round pick, and Outlaw, pick up Iguodala and cash or a pick or somethin' for 09. What do you all think? Still most likely the youngest team in the league, but give them a couple years to mesh and within 3 years we have a championship back in P-Town for sure.

PG - Paul | Blake | Sergio
SG - Roy | Webster | Jones
SF - Fernandez | Outlaw | Jones
PF - Aldridge | Frye
C - Oden | Pryzbilla

That one would be FA pickup of Paul. It is tempting but i don't like this one because we still have too many bodies. Too many people that are talented and want Playing Time and Roy doesn't get the ball in his hands as much. Paul is great but IDK about Chemistry. To me Iguodala or Beasly is the way to go, because both of them don't need that ball, or shots. They will play defense well, rebound, play smart, and get offensive boards and putbacks, do dirty works, block shots, get their 15 and 7 the hard way, which is what we need.

What do you all think?


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

MrJayremmie said:


> What do you all think?


If Philly takes our junk for their best player I'd do it.


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## Pinot (Dec 23, 2007)

He was the MVP of the week in his league. Good hl video: http://acbtv.acb.com/

It's the video that says "29.12.2007 ACB - Jª14: Rudy, MVP Jugador con más crédito Barclaycard".


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

MrJayremmie said:


> I think by next year we will have gotten rid of (or ship oversees, or DLeague.. just not on our roster pretty much) Jack, Green, Miles, McRoberts, LaFrentz, our draft picks this year, and Kaponen and leave us with:
> 
> PG - Roy/Blake/Sergio
> SG - Rudy/Martell
> ...



I really think we do need to consolidate and that's what I've been hammering in the last couple of weeks. With our win streaks and improved play I really think it increases the value of some of our assets and it would be foolish not to think about who will really fit long term, when the ones that don't have decent value too. People say not to get greedy or give up on players but to me you can't develop 12 guys at once, you need others to cover for their mistakes and not fight each other for minutes to have good development for the ones you really covet. With Rudy coming over I don't see a need for jack at backup guard, Rudy scores better, sergio passes better, blake is better at being passive, koponen is younger and has much more potential and none of them are as emotional. I'm not sure Frye or Outlaw have huge places long-term with the minutes crunch Oden will cause next year, not that they're not decent guys to have at all, it's just if they have decent value we could gain something for them perhaps. Martell provides floor spacing and his outside shooting while be very valuable when Oden is here as he will provide Roy, Oden, and Aldridge a lot more room to work with and won't get in the way. Blake is a decent stopgap until Roy makes the full time move to point. 

I think that a lot of our players do provide something unique but the big key is just to complement your stars, diversify talents to be well rounded, and have the most talent in a semi-short rotation possible. We are going to need to sacrifice some people to do that and I don't think certain players provide enough diversity, complimentary skills, or potential to keep around. The players I really love plugging in as big pieces to go after in consolidating are Andre Iguodala, Luol Deng, and Ben Gordon.

Iggy and Deng don't need the ball to be effective at all, are very well rounded complete players, and are extremely talented and poised. Iggy could play backdoor all day, hit open shots, and play killer defense getting out on the break for us. Gordon needs the ball, but I like him as a guy who could help us push the break and compliment Roy while playing point on defense. He could basically play 1 until the ball is at mid-court when he decides to try for transition opportunities (not Roy's strength as an initiator but he can run the court and receive fast break opportunities) then if it's not there give it to Roy as the half-court ballhandler, and he is fast enough to guard 1's on the other teams.

My favorite 09/10 hypothetical rosters/rotations after consolidating players/picks (Jack, Frye, Outlaw, pick) and Blake and Jones expiring after providing solid, steady, stopgaps:

Roy/Sergio/Koponen
Iguodala/Fernandez
Webster/
Aldridge/Mcroberts
Oden/Pryzbilla/Freeland

Gordon/Sergio/Koponen
Roy/Fernandez
Webster/Outlaw/Mcroberts
Aldridge/Outlaw/Mcroberts
Oden/Pryzbilla/Freeland

Roy/Sergio/Koponen
Webster/Fernandez
Deng/Outlaw
Aldridge/Frye/Mcroberts
Oden/Pryzbilla/Freeland
(very methodical and grinding, with white unit being the up-tempo unit to throw other teams off that get too comfortable in the half-court game)

or the hyped...

Paul/Sergio/Koponen
Roy/Fernandez
Webster/Outlaw
Aldridge/Frye/Mcroberts
Oden/Pryzbilla/Freeland

and none of these seem that impossible really. Iggy's not doing well as a first option and very unhappy in Philly, Deng is in the same boat on an underacheiving team, I could see either of these situations getting worse as we're only 1/3 of the way through the season and teams may not love paying a ton for these guys they want want a trade where they get bulk potential talent. And to get Gordon we'd need to trade up in the draft, but I think he'll fall (undersized 2's always do) and we have a lot of assets to offer a team who wants to contend earlier and is tired of youth. As far as Paul goes he might like to get somewhere more stable and New Orleans may be moving again. Who knows how much better and more talented we could even get?


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

darkhelmit54 said:


> I really think we do need to consolidate and that's what I've been hammering in the last couple of weeks. With our win streaks and improved play I really think it increases the value of some of our assets and it would be foolish not to think about who will really fit long term, when the ones that don't have decent value too. People say not to get greedy or give up on players but to me you can't develop 12 guys at once, you need others to cover for their mistakes and not fight each other for minutes to have good development for the ones you really covet. With Rudy coming over I don't see a need for jack at backup guard, Rudy scores better, sergio passes better, blake is better at being passive, koponen is younger and has much more potential and none of them are as emotional. I'm not sure Frye or Outlaw have huge places long-term with the minutes crunch Oden will cause next year, not that they're not decent guys to have at all, it's just if they have decent value we could gain something for them perhaps. Martell provides floor spacing and his outside shooting while be very valuable when Oden is here as he will provide Roy, Oden, and Aldridge a lot more room to work with and won't get in the way. Blake is a decent stopgap until Roy makes the full time move to point.


how do Channing Frye and Outlaw not provide spacing? I could swear I see them hitting outside shots most every game. I agree with the concept of consolidation, just not how you want to go about it.

For whatever reason, you're obviously really high on Martell, but the stats don't seem to back up reasoning to keep him over the others. He's definitely been the least productive of their 3 SFs this season (Webster, Jones, Outlaw). Yes he can shoot the deep ball, but shooting 3s all of 2% higher then Travis doesn't overshadow TOs other attributes where in 4 less minutes a night he's leading MW in points, steals, rebounds, blocks and the other stats being relatively equal. And of course if you really value a deep threat, and I do, Jones is the league's best 3 point stroke this season shooting almost 20% higher then either. 

I like having at least a couple of guys on the court who can handle/create with the ball and none of these three can really do that proficiently... which makes it tough to play any of them at guard. Martell is the smallest of the three and is undersized at SF. For reference, here are there respective predraft digits...

barefoot height / wingspan 
Martell 6'6 / 6'11 
Jones 6'7.25 / 7'2.5 
Travis 6'7 / 7'2

Contractually, Jones has a player option after this year that I'd expect him to exercise... dude is having a great year and I'm sure he'd like to get a 4-5 year deal. Inking him would probably require at least a full MLE offer. If anyone offers more, I'd definitely be for letting him go... sweet shooting SFs aren't that hard to come by. Travis just resigned a very reasonable deal for the next 3 at 4M per. Martell is due 3M next year (team option) with a qualifying offer up the year after that. 

So my ideal way to consolidate... I sort of laid this out in another thread, but I think the additions of Greg and Rudy next season will have the club pretty stacked with talent that can compete with anyone right now. They will be deep, probably too deep for everyone to be happy with the minutes they get. Greg coming in moves Joel to the backup role while Channing projects to backup LA at the 4. The three 3's is at least one too many with Outlaw the most likely to stick around as his deal is set. Packaging some of their extra youngins at PG and SF with Miles for a vet expiring on time (2009) + picks would make a lot of sense for setting up their future... the Blazers 2008 1st could also be utilized. I see them likely having to choose between Martell/Jones and Sergio/Jack. What the market is bearing obviously factors in but here's my best guess rotation next season...

5 Greg/Joel
4 LA/Frye
3 Jones/Outlaw
2 Roy/Rudy
1 Blake/Sergio

clappers... Raef, Green, Kaponen, McBob, Traded for Vet, high pick, FA scrub

The guards might be a 3 man rotation with Blake, Roy, and Rudy at 25-35 MPG each. So really I'm projecting a 9 man rotation.

STOMP


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## andalusian (Jun 29, 2006)

STOMP said:


> For whatever reason, you're obviously really high on Martell, but the stats don't seem to back up reasoning to keep him over the others. He's definitely been the least productive of their 3 SFs this season (Webster, Jones, Outlaw). Yes he can shoot the deep ball, but shooting 3s all of 2% higher then Travis doesn't overshadow TOs other attributes where in 4 less minutes a night he's leading MW in points, steals, rebounds, blocks and the other stats being relatively equal. And of course if you really value a deep threat, and I do, Jones is the league's best 3 point stroke this season shooting almost 20% higher then either.
> 
> I like having at least a couple of guys on the court who can handle/create with the ball and none of these three can really do that proficiently... which makes it tough to play any of them at guard. Martell is the smallest of the three and is undersized at SF. For reference, here are there respective predraft digits...
> 
> ...


My gut feeling is that you are right - and Travis is here to stay. I would love to see Jones stay as well - which leaves Webster as the "high potential" filler to any kind of move that utilizes Raef's expiring contract and possibly the pick for whatever KP thinks is missing.

Rudy, it seems to me, could be the replacement for Webster's long-ball ability while offering superior ball-handling and court awareness (not a knock on Martell, this specific issue, it is just that Rudy seems to really excel at it).

What this team could really use is another bruiser in the Millsap/Craig Smith type. I would not be surprised to see KP try to get a higher pick to try and get someone like Kevin Love to fill that role. He is not an athletic specimen so he will not be in the "untouchable" area of the draft - but he sure seems like someone that has a wide body and a real understanding of how to play basketball.

As for the PGs - I think that Sergio and Blake are staying, Blake is a good court-mate to Roy and Sergio needs to stay if only to help Rudy make the transition. I think that until we know that Rudy can defend and is strong enough to drive the lanes in the NBA - Jack has a lot of value for this team as the only proven slasher guard other than Roy. Obviously, the league is familiar with him so he might have to be included in any kind of move as a bargaining chip (personally, I would hate to see it). Finally, Green - I would like to keep him around a little longer to see what he can bring to the table - but I will not be surprised if he is part of a package.

Of course, if Playboy is coming next year - another PG will have to be moved...


----------



## yuyuza1 (May 24, 2006)

I don't understand why a lot of you guys are assuming Rudy will start next year. Making the transition from a completely different style of play isn't easy. 

I expect about 10-20 mins off the bench initially.


----------



## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

yuyuza1 said:


> I don't understand why a lot of you guys are assuming Rudy will start next year.


Quotes from KP projecting a Roy - Rudy starting backcourt next season are probably the main culprit. I think it's going to be hard to unseat Blake with as well as he's playing, which is why I listed him as the starter.

STOMP


----------



## DucRider (Dec 22, 2007)

Rudy made a nice steal in the vid, but he is going to have to play NBA man-2-man perimeter defense against the best 2s in the league to get time from Nate. He seems quick enough, but will he be coachable/disiplined enough...we'll see next year!

Any trades thinking2 will bring a quick defensive minded PG with some size, that can handle full court pressure and push the ball on breaks. Last night, there were some opportunities to run that the Blazers did not/could not take advantage of against the Jazz...not that they need to be the Suns...B-Roy's sense of pace/timing will be killer in the playoffs, especially in the finals, but some regular season wins and the ability to make up 10 points on the road can be had on the break.

Eventually, I think B-Roy will play alot of 3 with this team unless DM comes back (mentally and physically) at 95%. The 1 and 2 will be quicker players, Rudy perhaps at 2 and Blakes replacement (his lack of lateral quickness is the thing that will get him out of the starting lineup.)

Personally, I hope KP makes no trades until draft day...the chemistry is really good with this team and there is no rush this year to move anyone for a run at the title...


----------



## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

DucRider said:


> Rudy made a nice steal in the vid, but he is going to have to play NBA man-2-man perimeter defense against the best 2s in the league to get time from Nate. He seems quick enough, but will he be coachable/disiplined enough...we'll see next year!


He's a bit shorter and slighter then Roy, so I'd expect him to be guarding PGs when they're teamed up in the backcourt playing man to man. I'd think that having cat quick Oden around the hoop next year would only add to the effectiveness of their zone D as well. 

STOMP


----------



## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

no kevin love in portland..i don't think it would be good for him to play so close to home and i dont htink he or his dad will like being the backup.


----------



## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

STOMP said:


> how do Channing Frye and Outlaw not provide spacing? I could swear I see them hitting outside shots most every game. I agree with the concept of consolidation, just not how you want to go about it.
> 
> For whatever reason, you're obviously really high on Martell, but the stats don't seem to back up reasoning to keep him over the others. He's definitely been the least productive of their 3 SFs this season (Webster, Jones, Outlaw). Yes he can shoot the deep ball, but shooting 3s all of 2% higher then Travis doesn't overshadow TOs other attributes where in 4 less minutes a night he's leading MW in points, steals, rebounds, blocks and the other stats being relatively equal. And of course if you really value a deep threat, and I do, Jones is the league's best 3 point stroke this season shooting almost 20% higher then either.
> 
> ...


Travis is awesome when he gets that look in his eye and everyone gets out of his way, but he's definetely a guy you feed when he's hot and aggressiv eand he doesn't do a whole lot otherwise. He's a wonderful 6th man, I just think we could get a better "goto" type guy that fits us more (Eric Gordon perhaps), and we're stacked up top. Martell is an athletic swingman, and plays well as a 4th option within an offense providing a great outside shooting threat whether he is hot or not while teams sag off travis when he's not the focus. I see Martell fitting his role better, and he is showing A TON MORE than Travis did at his age, anyone with a 1/3 of a brain could see that! The way Jones plays is perfect, but I think he'll get pretty good money this offseason, and it's way too early to give up on Martell or not bring in Rudy so it'll probably work out best for us if he does opt out. If we give up on Martell this early I will be really really dissapointed. I also think Outlaw has the most trade value as he gets the fans going, provides highlight material, good stats, and could help a struggling franchise save face if they trade one of their stars and have a small contract so we could get way more for him than Webster.


----------



## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

darkhelmit54 said:


> anyone with a 1/3 of a brain could see that!


I stopped reading/considering what you were saying as I came across this. Sorry, but I can't take anyone seriously with juvenile bleep like that... not worth my time.

STOMP


----------



## craigehlo (Feb 24, 2005)

STOMP said:


> Quotes from KP projecting a Roy - Rudy starting backcourt next season are probably the main culprit. I think it's going to be hard to unseat Blake with as well as he's playing, which is why I listed him as the starter.


There's no way to tell how many minutes Rudy will get without seeing how he plays defense in the NBA. That's the real bottom line with Nate's rotations. If Rudy is as inconsistent as Sergio, then expect the same unpredictable minutes.

Personally I'd like to see him take minutes from Martell if he can take it to the hoop and shoot the 3. Martell seems to be regressing quite a bit as of late.


----------



## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

STOMP said:


> I stopped reading/considering what you were saying as I came across this. Sorry, but I can't take anyone seriously with juvenile bleep like that... not worth my time.
> 
> STOMP


thanks for the update, you're so informative, challenging, and engaging. The phrase "bleep" is very distinguishing.

Here are some stats about Martell now and Travis in his third year

Travis in 05-06
16.7 mpg, 44% FG, 26% 3PT, 2.7 RPG, .5 APG, 5.8 PPG

Martell in 07-08
29.6 mpg, 43% FG, 37.5% 3PT, 4.1 RPG, 1.5 APG, 10.8 PPG

fairly comparable until you consider how few minutes Travis got on such a terrible team (year we had worst record). 

By the way, do you think Travis was a beter player in his third year than Martell?


----------



## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

craigehlo said:


> Personally I'd like to see him take minutes from Martell if he can take it to the hoop and shoot the 3. Martell seems to be regressing quite a bit as of late.


When he's involved early in games in the mid-range and plays and screens are run for him he continues his flow throughout the game (like almost all great shooters) Nate should understand this as he coached Ray Allen (who doesn't just sit on the 3 point line). But Nate only uses utility players as a last resort in the game plan and they have to just wait for Roy or Aldridge to create opportunities for them, Martell has always played best when one of the main players were out, it's not a coincidence. W/O running any plays for him you have a much more athletic but not as nasty on D version of bruce bowen out there, and that's such a waste of potential it makes me sick.


----------



## LameR (Jan 4, 2004)

Every time I watch youtube videos of Fernandez, I get that much more excited for next year. I hope he can do half as much as he does in some of those videos.


----------



## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

LameR said:


> Every time I watch youtube videos of Fernandez, I get that much more excited for next year. I hope he can do half as much as he does in some of those videos.


well with the two four minute stretches he'll get a game from Nate he better have some heavy adrenaline pumping and play very selfish ball. jack will thoroughly suck the rest of the game.


----------



## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

I don't think his accountant will be advising him to come over.ROokie scale for the 24th pick is right at 900K for each of the first two seasons and a million for the team option year.He can probably get approximately that much per season in Spain...I think he's already making about 3 million per year isn't he...He'd be a chump to come over if he has to cut his salary by two thirds to do it


----------



## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

it's an investment dude, he won't ever make more than 5 mill a year in europe, after two years of 1 mill over here he can have a decent shot at 7 or 8 million if he's as good as everyone thinks and his value as far as being a draw in Europe is bigger if the NBA doesn't work out well because he's more of a celebrity.


----------



## JAFO (Jul 2, 2006)

HispanicCausinPanic said:


> Sombody will have to go. That is too many bodies! Maybe Martell, maybe Jack?



My vote is for Ｍｉｌｅｓ　．．．　ＴＯ　ＧＯ！

Ａｓ　ｆａｒ　ａｓ　Ｉ　ｋｎｏｗ，　ｔｈｅｒｅ　ｉｓ　ｎｏ　１２　ｍａｎｒｏｓｔｅｒ (ａｎｄ　３　ｍａｎ　Ｉｎｊｕｒｅｄ　Ｒｅｓｅｒｖｅ）．　　Ｔｈｅｒｅ　ｉｓ　ｏｎｌｙ ａ　１５　ｍａｎ　ｒｏｓｔｅｒ．　
Ｗｈｅｔｈｅｒ　ｙｏｕ　ｈａｖｅ　ａ　ｎｉｎｅ　ｍａｎ　ｒｏｔａｔｉｏｎｏｒ　ａｎ　ｅｌｅｖｅｎ　ｍａｎ　ｒｏｔａｔｉｏｎ，　ｙｏｕ ｓｔｉｌｌ　ｈａｖｅ　１５　ｒｏｓｔｅｒ　ｓｌｏｔｓ．　Ｔｒｕｅ　ｎｏｔ　ａｌｌ　
１５　ｓｌｏｔｓ　ｈａｖｅ　ｔｏ　ｂｅ　ｆｉｌｌｅｄ．　Ｂｕｔ　ａｓ　
ｗｅ　ｈａｖｅ　ｓｅｅｎ　ａｎｄ　ｅｘｐｅｒｉｅｎｃｅｄ，　ｂａｓｋｅｔｂａｌｌ　ｉｓ　ａ　ｔｅａｍ　ｓｐｏｒｔ　ｗｈｅｒｅ　ｉｔ　ｉｓ　
ｎｉｃｅ　ｔｏ　ｈａｖｅ　ｓｏｍｅ　ｒｅｄｕｎdeｎｔｃｙ　ｉｎ　ｃａｓｅｏｆ　ｉｎｊｕｒｙ．　　Ｗｈｉｌｅ　ｔｈｅｒｅ　ｍａｙ　ｂｅ　ｎｉｎｅ　ｏｒ　ｔｅｎ　ｃｏｒｅ　ｐｌａｙｅｒｓ　ｔｈａｔ　ｓｅｅ　ｔｈｅ　
ｂｕｌｋ　ｏｆ　ｐｌａｙｉｎｇ　ｔｉｍｅ，　ｔｈｅ　ｏｔｈｅｒｓ　ａｒｅｗａｉｔｉｎｇ　ｔｈｅｉｒ　ｔｕｒｎ　ｔｏ　be ｃａｌｌｅｄ　ｉｎｔｏ　ａｃｔｉｏｎ． Ｒｉｇｈｔ　ｎｏｗ，　ｔｈｅ　Ｂｌａｚｅｒ　ｒｏｓｔｅｒ　ｉｓ　ｆｕｌｌ．　Ｔｏ　ｔａｋｅ　ｏｎ　ｏｕｒ　ｆｉｒｓｔ　ｒｏｕｎｄ　ｄｒａｆｔ　ｐｉｃｋ　ｎｅｘｔ　ｙｅａｒ，　ｓｐａｃｅ　ｈａｓ　ｔｏ　
ｏｐｅｎ　ｕｐ．　　Ｇｒｅｅｎ’ｓ　ｃｏｎｔｒａｃｔ　ｉｓ　ｕｐ　ａｓ　ｉｓ　ＭｃＲｏｂｅｒｔ’ｓ．　Ｉ　ｔｈｉｎｋ　Ｇｒｅｅｎ ｗｉｌｌ　ｂｅ　ｒｅｌｅａｓｅｄ　（ｏｒ　ｉｎｃｌｕｄｅｄ　ｉｎ　ａ　ｄｒａｆｔ　
ｄａｙ　ｔｒａｄｅ）．　　Ｗｈｉｌｅ　ｔｈｅ　ｓａｍｅ　ｍｉｇｈｔ　ｇｏｆｏｒ　ＭｃＲｏｂｅｒｔｓ，　Ｉ　ｗｏｕｌｄ　ｌｉｋｅ　ｔｏ　ｓｅｅ　
ｈｉｍ　ｒｅ－ｓｉｇｎｅｄ．　　
　Ａｎｄ　ｓｉｎｃｅ　ｔｈｅ　ｂｅｇｉｎｎｉｎｇ　ｏｆ　ｔｈｅ　
ｓｅａｓｏｎ，　ｕｐ　ｔｏ　ａｂｏｕｔ　ｔｗｏ　ｗｅｅｋｓ　ａｇｏ，　Ｉｈａｄ　ｗａｎｔｅｄ　ｔｏ　ｓｅｅ Ｆｒｙｅ　ｔｒａｄｅｄ　ａｎｄ　
ｔｈｏｕｇｈｔ　Ｊａｃｋ　ｍｉｇｈｔ　ｈａｖｅ　ｔｏ　ｂｅ　ｉｎｃｌｕｄｅｄ　ｉｎ　ｔｈｅ　ｄｅａｌ　ｔｏ　ｍａｋｅ　ｉｔ　ａｃｃｅｐｔａｂｌｅｔｏ　ｔｈｅ　ｒｅｃｅｉｖｉｎｇ　ｔｅａｍ．　Ｉ　ｄｏｎ’ｔ　ｅｖｅｎ　
ｗａｎｔ　ｔｏ　ｔｈｉｎｋ　ａｂｏｕｔ　ｇｅｔｔｉｎｇ　ｒｉｄ　ｏｆ　
Ｏｕｔｌａｗ　ｏｒ　Ｗｅｂｓｔｅｒ　ａｔ　ｔｈｉｓ　ｐｏｉｎｔ　ｉｎ　
ｔｈｅｉｒ　ｃａｒｅｅｒｓ．　Ｔｏ　ｄｏ　ｓｏ，　ｗｏｕｌｄ　ｂｅ　－　ａｔ　ｌｅａｓｔ　ｆｏｒ　ｍｅ　－　ａ　ｒｅｐｅａｔ　ｏｆ　ｔｈｅ　
Ｊｅｒｍａｉｎｅ　Ｏ’ｎｅａｌ　ｐｌａｙ．
　Ａｎｙｗａｙ，　Ｉ　ｈａｖｅ　ｓａｉｄ　ｍｏｓｔ　ｏｆ　ｔｈｉｓ　ｂｅｆｏｒｅ　ｉｎ ａ　ｐｒｅｖｉｏｕｓ　ｔｈｒｅａｄ．　Ｂｕｔ　Ｉ　ｈａｖｅｃｈａｎｇｅｄ　ｍｙ　ｍｉｎｄ　ａｂｏｕｔ　ｔｒａｄｉｎｇ　Ｆｒｙe　
ａｎｄ　Ｊａｃｋ　－　ａｔ　ｌｅａｓｔ ａｎｙ　ｔｉｍｅ　ｓｏｏｎ．　　Ｉｔｈｉｎｋ　ｔｈｅｙ　ｈａｖｅ　ｂｏｔｈ　ｐｒｏｖｅｄ　ｔｈｅｉｒ　
ｕｓｅｆｕｌｎｅｓｓ　ａｎｄ　ｔｈａｔ　ｔｈｅｙ　ｆｉｔ　ｗｉｔｈ　
ｔｈｉｓ　ｔｅａｍ．　Ｔｏ　ｔｒａｄｅ　ｔｈｅｍ　ｂｅｆｏｒｅ　
ｄｒａｆｔ　ｄａｙ　ｆｏｒ　ｌｅｓｓｅｒ　ｏｒ　ｅｑｕａｌ　ｔａｌｅｎｔｉｓ　ｕｎａｃｃｅｐｔａｂｌｅ　ｔｏ　ｍｅ．　Ｔｒａｄｅｓ　ｈａｖｅ　
ｔｏ　ｉｍｐｒｏｖｅ　ｔｈｅ　ｔｅａｍ　ａｎｄ　Ｉ　ｄｏｎ’ｔ　ｓｅｅ　ｔｈｅｉｒ　ｄｅｐａｒｔｕｒｅ　ｆｒｏｍ　ｔｈｅ　ｔｅａｍ　ｔｈｉｓ　
ｓｅａｓｏｎ　ａｓ　ｂｅｉｎｇ　ａｎ　ｉｍｐｒｏｖｅｍｅｎｔ．　Ｉ　
ｋｅｅｐ ｔｈｉｎｋｉｎｇ　ｔｈｅ　ｉｍｐｒｏｖｅｍｅｎｔ　ｔｏ　ｔｈｅ　ｔｅａｍ　ｗｉｌｌ　ｃｏｍｅ　ｎｅｘｔ　ｙｅａｒ　ｗｉｔｈ　ｔｈｅ　
ｒｅｔｕｒｎ　ｏｆ　Ｏｄｅｎ　ｔｏ　ｐｌａｙｉｎｇ　ｓｔａｔｕｓ　ａｎｄｔｈｅ　ｓｉｇｎｉｎｇ　ｏｆ　Ｒｕｄｙ；　ｂｏｔｈ　will ｂｅ　ｉｎ　
ｔｈｅｉｒ　ＮＢＡ　ｒｏｏｋｉｅ　ｙｅａｒ．　Ｉ　ｄｏｎ’ｔ　ｔｈｉｎｋｙｏｕ　ｃａｎ　ｇｅｔ　ｍｕｃｈ ｂｅｔｔｅｒ　ｔｈａｎ　ｔｈｉｓ　ａｓ　ｌｏｔｔｅｒｙ　ｐｉｃｋｓ．　　Ａｌｌ　ｓｅｃｏｎｄ　ｒｏｕｎｄ　
ｐｉｃｋｓ　ｃｏｕｌｄ　ｂｅ　ｔｒａｄｅｄ　ｅｉｔｈｅｒ　ｔｏ　
ｍｏｖｅ　ｕｐ　ｉｎ　ｔｈｅ　ｄｒａｆｔ　ｏｒ　ｆｏｒ　ｆｕｔｕｒｅ　
ｃｏｎｓｉｄｅｒａｔｉｏｎｓ．　　Ｉｆ　ｔｈｅ　Ｂｌａｚｅｒｓ　ｎｅｅｄａ　ｒｏｓｔｅｒ　ｓｌｏｔ　ｆｏｒ　ｔｈｅ　ｔｅａｍ’ｓ　ｆｉｒｓｔ　
ｒｏｕｎｄ　ｐｉｃｋ　－　ｅｓｓｅｎｔｉａｌｌｙ，　Ｒｕｄｙ　ｗｉｌｌ　ｂｅ　ｒｅｐｌａｃｉｎｇ　Ｇｒｅｅｎ　－　ｔｈｅｎ　ｏｐｅｎ　ｕｐ　
Ｍｉｌｅｓ’ slot．　Looking to see as 

２００８　Ｂｌａｚｅｒｓ

Blake, Jack, Sergio
Roy, Fernandez
Webster, outlaw, Jones
Aldridge, Frye, McRoberts
Oden, Joel、Raef
Ｆｉｒｓｔ　Ｒｏｕｎｄ　Ｄｒａｆｔ　Ｐｉｃｋ

JAFO

Appologies for all the gaps in this post. I'm not on my computer and this much used machine is non responsive to my not so nimble fingers and lack of computer skill.


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## crandc (Sep 15, 2004)

To get back to Rudy:

He probably won't start at least at the beginning of the year and will have to earn his minutes, but if what we've heard about him is correct, he will get those minutes. I don't think language is a huge barrier; Yao Ming and Arvydas Sabonis both played successfully their rookie years, and Spanish is a lot closer to English than either Chinese or Lithuanian.


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## andalusian (Jun 29, 2006)

crandc said:


> To get back to Rudy:
> 
> He probably won't start at least at the beginning of the year and will have to earn his minutes, but if what we've heard about him is correct, he will get those minutes. I don't think language is a huge barrier; Yao Ming and Arvydas Sabonis both played successfully their rookie years, and Spanish is a lot closer to English than either Chinese or Lithuanian.


Brandon did get to start as a rookie, and Rudy has as much experience as Brandon had from his college days - but you are probably correct. Rudy will not join a team that was as bad as the 2005 Blazers and I doubt Nate will put 2 rooks in the starting group.


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## pablinho (Sep 8, 2006)

Diable said:


> I don't think his accountant will be advising him to come over.ROokie scale for the 24th pick is right at 900K for each of the first two seasons and a million for the team option year.He can probably get approximately that much per season in Spain...I think he's already making about 3 million per year isn't he...He'd be a chump to come over if he has to cut his salary by two thirds to do it


He earns this season 1 mill €, with dolar devalued, thats around 1.6-1.7 mill $


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## wizmentor (Nov 10, 2005)

Anyone know how Rudy's english is?


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

darkhelmit54 said:


> thanks for the update, you're so informative, challenging, and engaging. The phrase "bleep" is very distinguishing.


we've one real rule here that keeps threads from turning into flamathons... don't insult other posters. Suggesting that anyone who disagrees with you on something has less then a third of a brain would fall into that category. Saying bleep or cussing outright (which is automatically edited) is just being a bit crass but isn't insulting.

I do disagree with you, but don't think I've come anywhere close to insulting you. I've mostly used facts to illustrate why. 

btw...how are facts anything but informative?


> Here are some stats about Martell now and Travis in his third year
> 
> Travis in 05-06
> 16.7 mpg, 44% FG, 26% 3PT, 2.7 RPG, .5 APG, 5.8 PPG
> ...


He definitely was not, but thats a perfect lead in to why I value him more. When these two were drafted, Travis was thought to be a very raw prospect needing years of work. I compared him trying to cut/changing directions to looking like a baby giraff trying to get off an escalator... not a pretty site. Dude had little to his game besides the obvious insane leaping ability and long frame... he definitely didn't have a jumper let alone a 3 point shot. But a few years of hard work later he has obviously worked on his body and game to the point where he is now a legit SF and go to guy in the 4th. He still has the insane leaping ability and great length which allows him to match up on bigger players and create space to get his solid jumper off.

Conversely Martell came into the league billed as having an NBA ready body and game. Genius John Nash decided the Blazers need at SG made him the choice over Williams and Paul because Portland was set at PG with Telfair... and again, with his body and jumper he was good to go. Unfortunately as with most things, time has proved Nash to be wrong as Webster was not ready to go. His shot was solid but he struggled to get it off and didn't have the ballhandling ability to take his man off the dribble. Size wise, he's a good sized SG about midway between Roy and TO. At his pre-draft MW posted a 30" max vert... for reference Roy posted a 40.5" max vert... while TO's vert wasn't listed at his pre-draft, I did find one reference that had him at an incredble 48". 

http://www.nba.com/blazers/features/Travis_Outlaw_A_Future_NBA_St-163347-41.html

Being able to jump a foot and half higher then Webster and having more length pretty dramatically illustrates why Travis can create a look for himself going one on one and block shots while Martell struggles to do either. MW is going to have to perfect coming off picks or improve his ballhandling significantly to be able to free himself up for regular looks. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like he's done much to improve this during his time in the league. He'll always have value being able to sit in a corner spreading the court, but Travis can do that too and a lot more. 

I was happy to see him show up leaner and determined this season though. On the downside it doesn't seem to help Martell's case for staying that he's had problems personally with other Blazers. Reportedly he had a running feud with Kryapa his rookie year and this year with Joel... hopefully thats nothing to worry about. I've never heard of anything like that with TO. 

Lastly, I'm not opposed to either of these guys being traded or staying... it depends on whats coming back. I would contend that TO is a better match for whats in place already because of his being SF sized and with Roy and Rudy Portland is looking set at SG. I also think due to Outlaw's incredible hops he's got the higher upside that he's just starting to tap.

STOMP


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## pablinho (Sep 8, 2006)

25 points 6/9 2FG, 3/7 3FG, 3 reb, 4 assists 3 steals 1 TO yesterday. He is playing the hardest league in Europe.


The dude is already ranked at #1 at scoring (18.1)with a very nice 56% 2FG and 40% 3FG... and #4 in the assists ranks... and being an SG and playing just 27 MPG ;P

http://www.acb.com/jugador.php?id=B0X


Next season can be *sick* for Portland if Rudy and Greg adapt to the team!


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## PapaG (Oct 4, 2004)

pablinho said:


> 25 points 6/9 2FG, 3/7 3FG, 3 reb, 4 assists 3 steals 1 TO yesterday. He is playing the hardest league in Europe.
> 
> 
> The dude is already ranked at #1 at scoring (18.1)with a very nice 56% 2FG and 40% 3FG... and #4 in the assists ranks... and being an SG and playing just 27 MPG ;P
> ...



I heard Pritchard on 1080 The Fan say that he feels Oden is the best talent in the world not playing right now in the NBA and that Fernandez is the best player in Europe not playing in the NBA.

Scary stuff for the rest of the NBA.


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

STOMP said:


> On the downside it doesn't seem to help Martell's case for staying that he's had problems personally with other Blazers. Reportedly he had a running feud with Kryapa his rookie year and this year with Joel... hopefully thats nothing to worry about.


A single fight in a practice designed to cause a fight (and one they both apologized to each other for later) has turned into a running feud now?

:lol:


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

BlazerCaravan said:


> A single fight in a practice designed to cause a fight (and one they both apologized to each other for later) has turned into a running feud now?
> 
> :lol:


I don't know, the whole "this is Marty." thing could be read as Joel ribbing Martel. Like Martel maybe hates being called Marty (like I'm sure all of us have certain variations of our name we hate being called) and Joel knows it. He's maybe not saying it because he hates him, but kind of like you would maybe do to a friend of yours who's a bit of a tool, if you saw a friend of yours trying to hit on a girl, and you go up to her as he's talking to her and say "Say Martel, could you please stop looking at midget porn on my computer?"

Not saying it's what it IS, but the whole "this is Marty" could've seemed odd to some.


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

Yeah, I can see that. I can also fully believe that Martell is a bit of a tool; all 21-year olds seem to have that know-it-all thing going (thus his nickname The Professor?). But I also think that it's something he *will* outgrow and something that *isn't* a strike against him staying.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

after last night (not that one game makes a huge difference) is there any doubt that Martell should be given a larger role in the offense? Whenever big players are out and he gets his chance he delivers. I'm not saying he could score twenty five a night, but we need to give him more shots and screens, it'll spread the court more, give Roy more room to work, and he could get at least fifteen a night RIGHT NOW. Martell is passive enough and skilled in other ways to work well with a ball-dominating Roy and other strong post options, he just needs to learn to consistently get himself in position for the kickout from our bigs (once Oden comes back). 

By the time we are contendors, Martell is gonna be a monser!


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

After giving it a lot of thought, i HIGHLY doubt we will take anyone from the draft with any of our picks, will make no FA moves or trades. Focus on re-signing our own players, and letting the ones that are worthless go.

I'm 90% sure the roster will be SOMETHING like this...

Blake | Sergio | Jack
Roy | Webster | Jack
Fernandez | Outlaw | Jones
Aldridge | Frye | Outlaw
Oden | Pryzbilla

that is 12 people. Green and McRoberts will prolly be on the IR, but on the team... which leaves: Miles, Freeland, Kaponen, LaFrentz out of the picture next year. But that roster that i had above, is truly an unbelievable roster. Jack is probably the odd man out, we might not be able to keep him happy, but still... i would love to have him on the team, he will get his playing time, and we will be winning. I really hope that is what the team stays, no more added players, the chemistry is phenominal, the positions are taken care of, with no weak spots, in my opinion. Shooting, Driving, good FT shooters, Defenders, rebounders... we have it all. Let them grow together and within 2-3 years we will have a championship back in portland, barring injuries, if we keep the signed and happy.

Thoughts?


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

I think there's little chance that both Jones and Jack will accept being third stringers. It might be bad for chemistry.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

^ Well, Jones is kinda third stringer this year. Behind Webster and Outlaw, but sometimes outlaw plays PF and Jones get SF... Jones will be fine for sure, he will get the same PT as he gets this year, imo. It would be foolish to not give him 20 mins a game... as soon as he got healthy we are like 17-4, he is the best 3 point shooter int he nba. rebounds, plays D, and is a great person, and a great foul shooter.

But Jack is what i'm worried about. It would be hard for him to accept third string, but he would be a PG and a SG, so he would get playing time at both positions, prolly a little less then he gets now. But i think jack is in the last year of his contract, so h e might not come back... 

They will both get a lot of playing time, Nate really does a good job distributing playing time. Everyone on the roster will get a good chunk of minutes, as long as we keep winning. Nate is one of the best coaches in the NBA at doing that. Jones doesn't have to worry about his minutes at all, if anything he will be gettin' more next year. Jack is who i'm worried about. I hope he is one of those players that will do anything for the team, because he will still play next year. Third string isn't as bad as advertised, specially on this blazers team. Everyone gets plenty of minutes. Our main players this year, Roy and Aldridge only get like 37 mins a game.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

yeah I still think that's a little too crowded for long-term

I say we screw NY again...

Jack and Miles to NY
Fred Jones and Malik Rose to Portland

Darius would have to get some run and look decent for it to happen. But we'd get a hometown boy back who we screwed over already. In addition Jones is a much better defender than Jack, much better on the break, and looked pretty good playing with Roy last year as a short SG who can defend PG's. He would also play much better with Sergio off the bench than Jack currently does, as it looks like a tug of war out there. Rose would give us some veteran tougness and rebounding while being ecstatic to be out of NY. it would definetely kill the feel good story of Darius getting his life straight, but it'd be offset by people happy the last of jailblazer image is gone, and would darius really care getting to play in NY with Zach and Q?

Isaiah likes long athletic players a lot, and NY could probably use some dunks and athleticism at the 3/4, and they are desperate. However Darius would need to get playing again, which is feasible for February. Jack gives them a player who knows how to feed the post and run a half-court set w/o being too selfish and some competetive desire and pride.

This move gives us increased cap flexibility, greater frontcourt depth, and adresses a weakness of perimeter D and getting some easy points out on the break. I think it helps us for the present and future.

NY might want this sweetened a bit though, as they are paying that last year of Darius' contract.

Blake/Sergio/Green
Roy/Jones
Webster/Jones/Mcroberts
Aldridge/Outlaw/Rose
Pryzbilla/Frye/Raef

that's a decent playoff team this year, than next year....
next year we cut Rose and Raef, bring in Rudy, draft pick, and either Koponen or Freeland. (fred jones expires)

Blake/Sergio
Roy/Fernandez
Webster/Outlaw/Jones
Aldridge/Frye/Jones
Oden/Pryzbilla

scrubs: Mcroberts, Green, Freeland, draft pick

still crowded though...wouldn't surprise me if James opted out though...who knows.


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## GOD (Jun 22, 2003)

MrJayremmie said:


> After giving it a lot of thought, i HIGHLY doubt we will take anyone from the draft with any of our picks, will make no FA moves or trades. Focus on re-signing our own players, and letting the ones that are worthless go.
> 
> I'm 90% sure the roster will be SOMETHING like this...
> 
> ...


Only James Jones has his contract up after this season, so he may leave If the Blazers don't want to sign him to a 4 year 20mil contract or something like that. As far as thinking that Miles wont be on the team, he still has 2 more years on his contract after this year for over 16 million, so he will most likely be a Blazer. There are two possible ways to get rid of Miles, cut and pay him or trade him along one of our more valuable youngsters. On his own, there is no team in the NBA that would want him. LaFrentz has one more year on an expiring contract of more than 12mil. The Blazers may choose to cut him and let his contract just come off the books at the end of the year, but more likely the Blazers will keep him as a major trading piece for some other team looking to cut costs and add youth. Like Minnesota last year made a trade for expiring contracts, youth and picks for Garnett, some other team may also be willing to trade a star, but LaFrentz will be the linchpin in any big trade.

Green may be cut, McBob as well, although I like both players. Most likely there will be some trades in the summer to consolidate our talent a little.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

MrJayremmie said:


> But Jack is what i'm worried about. It would be hard for him to accept third string, but he would be a PG and a SG, so he would get playing time at both positions, prolly a little less then he gets now. But i think jack is in the last year of his contract, so h e might not come back...
> 
> They will both get a lot of playing time, Nate really does a good job distributing playing time. Everyone on the roster will get a good chunk of minutes, as long as we keep winning. Nate is one of the best coaches in the NBA at doing that. Jones doesn't have to worry about his minutes at all, if anything he will be gettin' more next year. Jack is who i'm worried about. I hope he is one of those players that will do anything for the team, because he will still play next year. Third string isn't as bad as advertised, specially on this blazers team. Everyone gets plenty of minutes. Our main players this year, Roy and Aldridge only get like 37 mins a game.


05/06: second string
06/07: first string
07/08: second string
08/09: third string

yeah right, Jack is kind of frustrated now (according to quick a couple of weeks ago). I'd love it if he was gone :yay: then worthwile projects who bring unique qualities (Sergio and Rudy) will get time along with Martell and James Jones, it even trickles to Outlaw. I'd rather have Koponen over for spot minutes as a third stringer. Jack is Nate's boy, he'll get his minutes (39 last night), there's no good reason why he's playing so much now. Rudy and Sergio will still be behind him for sure next year unless KP makes a pre-emptive strike!


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

^ i definitely like the team you had for next year. But with Jack on the last year of his contract, we might not need to trade, just let him go his way. Also Darius, LaFrentz, Kaponen, and Freeland could be cut also. So right there is -5 people which helps the crowding. So without Jack, the lineup would look ALOT like yours

Blake | Sergio
Roy | Webster
Fernandez | Outlaw | Jones
Aldridge | Frye | Outlaw
Oden | Pryzbilla
IR: Green, Freeland.

So pretty much, all we need to do to have that team, which i'm pretty sure is the team most of us would agree upon, would be get rid of our 5(?) draft picks. Get rid of Miles, Kaponen, Freeland by cutting. Jack and LaFretnz let them walk in FA... make sure Rudy comes over from Europe. Very easy to do, and that would be just an AMAZING team. 

Let us hope somethin' along that line happens... I would hate to bring in players to mess with the chemistry. I think the fans, management, and the players are loving where everything is at right now.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

ah ok, didn't know LaFrentz has an extra year on his contract...

I don't see Kaponen or Freeland comin' from over sees and cluttering the roster even more though... But i'm worried about Miles, i really don't think he would help the team by playing.. and has a huge contract. I think Jack will walk.. and i'm hopin' the blazers and Jones can come to a fair contract for 3 years for a fair price for both parties...

I think Green and McBob will be on the roster but as reserves in street clothes.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

I still think we need guys to help with playoffs now, that's how we can sell the Jack move (Rose vet leadership, defense, rebounding), and add what he gives now but in an expiring form so we're more okay with him leaving. I think having James Jones back would really help with Rudy's transition, because it might be a little tougher at first for him, but I suppose Martell could play some SG while Outlaw fills some time at SF too.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

Blake | Sergio
Roy | Webster
Fernandez | Outlaw | Jones
Aldridge | Frye | Outlaw
Oden | Pryzbilla

that is just the roster i'm really hopin' for... heck i'd be cool if Jack came back also. But bringin' any more players from oversees or the draft or FA would not be cool, in my opinion.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

darkhelmit54 said:


> I still think we need guys to help with playoffs now, that's how we can sell the Jack move (Rose vet leadership, defense, rebounding), and add what he gives now but in an expiring form so we're more okay with him leaving. I think having James Jones back would really help with Rudy's transition, because it might be a little tougher at first for him, but I suppose Martell could play some SG while Outlaw fills some time at SF too.


yea dude, definitely see what you are sayin'... expiring contracts are always nice for a team with too much talent like portland, to keep everyone happy.

I also think you have a good point on Rudy probably struggling for the first half a season comin' to the NBA with the NBA game and the language, but i think by March he will have won the starting job becasue he is sooo talented. Shooting, finishing above the rim, and defending... he will have lots of open shots also with Roy aldridge and Oden on the team. As will Jones and Webster... but i mean come on, why would Jones leave? he is flourishing in this system, and he looks like he is having the time of his life... he should know that he will be a big part of this future dynasty.. i just can't see him being happier somewhere else in the NBA.. this is perfect for him, imo.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

I think we'll make a consolidating move or two this summer (hopefully Jack & will be out IMO) and try to stay relatively deep, then just start letting guys expire to shorten our rotation as our young guys mature. Eventually I don't think we'll need Blake or Jones, and maybe down the line Pryzbilla in particular, but I think they fit well for now as stop-gaps. Long-term if we don't add any big names or draft picks (it's KP so you never know) I'd like a rotation like this, however if the last couple years have taught us anything teams have never looked how anybody in a message board would expect years earlier, injuries, lack of development, and surprises throw things off.

Roy/Sergio/Koponen
Rudy/Roy
Webster/Outlaw
Aldridge/Frye
Oden/Pryz

with scrub: Freeland, Green, Mcroberts

I'd sure love it if somehow between our picks, expiring contracts, and assets we were able to throw Iggy or Eric Gordon into that mix.

A couple of years ago we would've probably though we'd look like this right now:
Telfair
Webster/Monia
Miles/Outlaw
Randolph/Khryapa
Pryzbilla


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

We're going to have to choose: Jack or Sergio. There's not enough minutes for both, and it's to the point where we can't let Sergio languish. He either plays for us or for someone else.

We also have to choose two of the three: Webster, Jones, Outlaw. They all occupy the same space. One of them has to go.

My suggestion is to, over the summer, let Jones take his player option and go FA. Package Jack, Green, Miles, LaFrentz, and our 1st Rounder for an aging vet or two who wouldn't mind playing spot minutes and will come off the books in a year or two.

Let's face it: our cup runneth over, and we have to part ways with some of these good players to give the other good players we have a chance to grow.

With that in mind, here's my 2008-09 roster.

PG: Blake (32) / Sergio (16)
SG: Roy (32) / Fernandez (16)
SF: Webster (24) / Outlaw (24)
PF: LMA (36) / Frye (12)
C: Oden (24) / Przybilla (16) / Frye (8)


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

MrJayremmie said:


> Blake | Sergio
> Roy | Webster
> Fernandez | Outlaw | Jones
> Aldridge | Frye | Outlaw
> ...


I like Martell in the starting unit to play a little more passively and work off of Roy at the beginning of the game, spacing out the floor, with Rudy cmoing off the bench and being THE MAN, in a unit with Sergio. Even if Fernandez ended up with more minutes than Webster. However I think it will eventually be Blake that sees his minutes start getting reduced next year. Roy will have more room to work with long-range threats next to him at the end of games.

close-out
Roy
Fernandez
Webster
Aldridge
Oden


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

MrJayremmie said:


> ... but i mean come on, why would Jones leave? he is flourishing in this system, and he looks like he is having the time of his life... he should know that he will be a big part of this future dynasty.. i just can't see him being happier somewhere else in the NBA.. this is perfect for him, imo.


money money money mon-E. He seems to understand that Webster is the future here in that Quick article/blog the other day. Will we really want to offer him a four or five year at MLE deal (what he deserves if he keeps this up) at the expense of minutes for Outlaw, Webster, and Fernandez?


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

^ lol, crazy!

Is Kaponen good at all? i don't know a lot about him, i just figured that hima nd Freeland wouldn't be a key addition to this team, becasue we are already 10-11 deep, and don't need more people, specially after oden and rudy come.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

> Roy
> Fernandez
> Webster
> Aldridge
> Oden


yea, i could see that.



> money money money mon-E. He seems to understand that Webster is the future here in that Quick article/blog the other day. Will we really want to offer him a four or five year at MLE deal (what he deserves if he keeps this up) at the expense of minutes for Outlaw, Webster, and Fernandez?


i definitely understand. I just hope he see's that he can be a big part of this team, and we need him, and are prolly willing to give him a good bit of money for like a 3 year deal. He is in a great spot right now, hopefully he will realize that there might not be anywhere near as good as portland for him these days in the NBA. And portland fans are the best fans in the NBA, and he is loved here by management, fans, and the players...


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

BlazerCaravan said:


> My suggestion is to, over the summer, let Jones take his player option and go FA. Package Jack, Green, Miles, LaFrentz, and our 1st Rounder for an aging vet or two who wouldn't mind playing spot minutes and will come off the books in a year or two.
> 
> Let's face it: our cup runneth over, and we have to part ways with some of these good players to give the other good players we have a chance to grow.
> 
> ...


completely agree, unless we can consolidate further earlier and parlay the value of Jack, Jones, the pick and Frye or Outlaw for some top level talent at the expense of chemistry this year, but there aren't many players I'd do that for. I think we'll just have to let some assets walk.

I like your roster a lot, and then letting blake walk as the next progression from that team to look like this in 09/10

PG: Roy (28) / Sergio (20) / Koponen
SG: Fernandez (28) / Roy (10) / Webster (10)
SF: Webster (20) / Outlaw (28)
PF: Aldridge (36) / Frye (12)
C: Oden (28) / Pryzbilla (20)


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

MrJayremmie said:


> yea, i could see that.
> 
> i definitely understand. I just hope he see's that he can be a big part of this team, and we need him, and are prolly willing to give him a good bit of money for like a 3 year deal. He is in a great spot right now, hopefully he will realize that there might not be anywhere near as good as portland for him these days in the NBA. And portland fans are the best fans in the NBA, and he is loved here by management, fans, and the players...


I'd like a 3 year deal, IF he understood his minutes would be reduced year by year and he was here to help mentor, Jack was moved, and we didn't draft or trade for any more backcourt talent. I just really don't want to compromise Martell, Rudy or Travis contributing 6-10 more years to us for 3-5 heavy minutes years of Jones.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

I could see any of those lineups, for sure.

I wonder if we could do like James Jones, Jarrett Jack and 3 picks in the 08 draft for someone like Iguodala who plays Defense and will help a lot with rebounding and doin' the dirty work... i doubt it though, maybe if we throw in outlaw?


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

Iggy would be perfect doing all the dirty work. He takes pride in his defense and finishing on the break and he could cut backdoor all day here (something he used to do with AI getting most of the defensive attention), he'd probably score 15 a game instead of 20 there, but he'd get em much easier, and get to concentrate on locking guys down on D. I'm not sure he'll want to be a first option any more after this year. Plus he's best friends with Channing. But he'd be very hard to get. However, the stars are beginning to align for that with how things are in philly. He's frustrated with management, and they're winning too much right now. If they trade Miller he'll be super-pissed and I could see him just demanding they add talent or he wants out, it's a shame our pick's not higher but if they got really desperate/wanted MAJOR cap room this summer along with a higher draft pick this year maybe something like this would work out.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/featur...23&teams=14~22~14~20~14~20~22~20~20&te=&cash=

if Miami would give up their pick unprotected to Philly for James Jones - Andre Miller - Travis Outlaw while giving up Jason Williams and Smush Parker and we gave up Jarret Jack maybe it could happen, but that's a big longshot.

It looks pretty though

Roy/Sergio
Iggy/Fernandez
Webster/?
Aldridge/Frye
Oden/Pryzbilla


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

darkhelmit54 said:


> I like your roster a lot, and then letting blake walk as the next progression from that team to look like this in 09/10
> 
> PG: Roy (28) / Sergio (20) / Koponen
> SG: Fernandez (28) / Roy (10) / Webster (10)
> ...


I'd do something very similar for 09/10:

PG: Roy (24) / Sergio (24)
SG: Fernandez (24) / Webster (12) / Roy (12)
SF: Webster (18) / Outlaw (18) / Frye (6) / Fernandez (6)
PF: LMA (36) / Frye (6) / Outlaw (6)
C: Oden (30) / Przybilla (14) / Frye (4)


Minutes: Roy (36), LMA (36), Oden (30), Fernandez (30), Webster (30), Outlaw (24), Sergio (24), Frye (16), Przybilla (14)

I think Frye can be our Supersub in the frontline, playing SF in the Huge lineup, PF in the normal lineup, and C in the small lineup. Our starters get 30+ minutes a game, our main subs get 16+ minutes a game, and Joel gets meaningful minutes as his career winds down. It's a 9-man lineup, but everyone gets minutes.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

^ Well with that trade... it would have to be somethin' like..

Blake | Sergio
Roy | Webster
Iguodala | Fernandez
Adlridge | Frye
Oden | Pryzbilla

but i'm not holdin' my breathe. The best hting that could happen from that would be gettin' rid of a lot of players from our very clustered roster.

I don't think that it will happen though. If we just keep what we have and re-sign we will be very well off with an NBA title in the future.


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

Seriously, the only piece missing from our lineup is Experience.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

Yea, and that just comes with time. That is why i said 3-4 years = championship. I think we should just re-sign and do nothing through draft, FA, or trade. Keep Green and McRoberts on the IR. Get rid of LaFrentz, Miles, Kaponen, Freeland... and SEe what Jack and Jones want to do, try and keep them, imo. Along with Webster and outlaw and all of them.

If we can keep this 12 deep team together, in 3 years we will have an NBA title barring injuries.


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## BengalDuck (Jun 19, 2004)

BlazerCaravan said:


> We also have to choose two of the three: Webster, Jones, Outlaw. They all occupy the same space. One of them has to go.


That's not true at all. Webster can play 2, Jones the 3, and Outlaw the 4. Hell, I think we've run out a lineup this year of Roy-Webster-Jones-Outlaw-Aldridge.

Everyone here is so excited about trading a bunch of role players/filler for maybe a veteran or simply some roster space.

Why?

I realize that on this forum there is an unhealthy obsession with the "skills" (and I use that term loosely) of Sergio Rodriguez and a hatred of Jarrett Jack, but I wonder why everyone is so dead-set on trading JJ? Didn't he win us the game versus Chicago just a few days ago? Isn't he one of the few leaders on the court on our team? One of the few players who can penetrate and finish at the rim? A very good free throw shooter? Isn't he the perfect backup to Roy, because he brings so much of the same skill sets to the table?

As of now, Jack, Roy, Jones, Webster, Blake, Outlaw, Aldridge, Frye, Pryzbilla, and almost certainly Oden have defined roles on the team (or in Oden's case, will have defined roles). Rodriguez (who is creeping up in to the first group because he has played fairly well over the last few games), Koponen, Freeland, Darius Miles, Raef Lafrentz, McRoberts, Green, and even Rudy Fernandez are all question marks (although in Raef's case we know what he is). Some of those guys are promising prospects, and if they live up to their billings they'll certainly be considered for minutes. Until then, however, why are we so interested in moving some important pieces that have been winning us games - whether that's Frye 3 weeks ago, or Jack literally all year, or Webster the last couple weeks, or Outlaw last year, et al. - in favor of more youth and more "unprovenness."


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

Uhh... if you read the thread, most of us just want to trade jack because he will most likely not want to re-sign next year... and we can't keep him happy with such a deep team.

My advice was to just try and keep EVERYONE and let them grow together. The iguodala deal was just for roster space...

Blake | Sergio | Jack
Roy | Webster | Jack
Fernandez | Outlaw | Jones
Aldridge | Frye | Outlaw
Oden | Pryzbilla
IR: Green, McRoberts

that is the lineup i want. Miles, LaFrentz, Kaponen, Freeland are the only players that i want to get rid of. The thing is, we can't control if players like Jones and Jack want to resign next year.


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## Oldmangrouch (Feb 11, 2003)

If Rudy comes over next season, we will have to move a wing player, or risk having at least one locker-room problem.

I hope we don't give up on big Josh already. After all the patience shown to Outlaw and Webster, why would we bail on McRoberts after only one season?


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

^ yea i agree, we can't let him go. Green is solid also.

But we have sooo many players.. it would be tough to get him in the game. When we got Outlaw we were ina rebuilding process.

But yea, i think Jack might be the odd man out when Rudy comes over. He will make the decision whether he wants to take one for the team, which i hope he does, because i think he is a really fine player, or he can choose not to. Jones also.


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## Sambonius (May 21, 2003)

Jack and Green can go. I don't think Pritchard is one to just cut Green though, I think he'll get some sort of value in return. Jack can be clutch no doubt, but his decision making is often pitiful, especially in the open court. If Rudy was to come over, Jack is the weakest link I'd get rid of. Green is an average NBA talent but if he continues to do well in the D League, Pritchard could pawn him off for something of value that could free up some roster space. McRoberts will stay, they won't let him go because of Oden. Plus, he has some excellent passing ability for his size.


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## Baracuda (Jan 10, 2007)

Sambonius said:


> Green is an average NBA talent but if he continues to do well in the D League, Pritchard could pawn him off for something of value that could free up some roster space.


Green's been back from the D-League for a while now.


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## Sambonius (May 21, 2003)

Baracuda said:


> Green's been back from the D-League for a while now.


We all know that, but I'm sure that Pritchard will send him back again to drive up his value. He did very well there and his value can only go higher as he continues that type of play.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

BlazerCaravan said:


> A single fight in a practice designed to cause a fight (and one they both apologized to each other for later) has turned into a running feud now?
> 
> :lol:


sorry, the running feud was a reference to his rookie year relationship with Khryapa. I should have written the part with Joel in a different way, but I didn't. Oh well... my point still stands that getting along with others may not be his greatest strength... I'd hope not, but it could be.

STOMP


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## Baracuda (Jan 10, 2007)

Sambonius said:


> We all know that, but I'm sure that Pritchard will send him back again to drive up his value. He did very well there and his value can only go higher as he continues that type of play.


Yeah, I was thinking the same thing.


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## Iwatas (Aug 3, 2003)

Green and McBob are going back to D League this week.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

BengalDuck said:


> Everyone here is so excited about trading a bunch of role players/filler for maybe a veteran or simply some roster space.
> 
> Why?


because even keeping 10 players worthy of PT happy on one roster is problematic especially if some of those guys (like Roy, Aldridge, & Oden) are playing traditional starter minutes over 30 per game. Proof of this problem is how few teams in the history of hoops have featured 10 man rotations. If Portland retains Jones (who is only leading the league in 3pt % and IMO the club's best SF) they will have (listed size wise)... 1.Oden 2.Joel 3.Aldridge 4.Frye 5.Jones 6.Outlaw 7.Martell 8.Roy 9.Rudy 10.Blake 11.Jack 12.Sergio 

Thats at least 2 players too many. And if Miles makes it back to his previous form he's #13 and probably the hardest guy on the roster to move. It's not so much that posters are excited about making a trade as being realistic that something will have to give one way or another. This is a good problem to have.

STOMP


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## BBert (Dec 30, 2004)

STOMP, I've started (and aborted) two similar posts in the past two days. I think Rudy, Martell, and Sergio (and of course Roy) are more likely to be the future of this team than Jack. I also put Blake ahead of Jack. It's a numbers game for him, as it is for all players. It's not that Jack isn't or won't be a good NBA player. He will be, on another team that isn't as stacked as we are. Unless he will be content here with "Sergio minutes," which probably wouldn't be fair to him anyway.


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