# Hawks Will Offer Joe Johnson A Max Contract



## BootyKing (Apr 7, 2005)

Oh God we better match it like they said we would 

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_a...hawks_will_offer_joe_johnson_a__max_contract/


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Yeah, this is in the thread about us awaiting his answer.


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## Tiz (May 9, 2005)

And is he wants any hope of seeing the NBA Finals or even the playoffs for that matter he will laugh in their faces.


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

wtf lol, they already have like 340340340395543543908 swingmen as it is. and just drafted another one.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Drewbs said:


> wtf lol, they already have like 340340340395543543908 swingmen as it is. and just drafted another one.


:laugh: :laugh: that was classic.

yeah, but I think Al Harrington is on his way out eventually through trade or expiring deal after this season and they also may use JJ at PG maybe?


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

I guess, this deserves it's own thread, so I'll keep it as that. 

Here's what the article said.




> A player personnel source in the NBA's Eastern Conference tells us that the Atlanta Hawks not only intend to offer Suns restricted free agent guard Joe Johnson a maximum contract offer on July 22, there are people within the Hawks organization saying they're going to end up getting him.
> 
> And a Western Conference source tells us that the Cleveland Cavaliers will turn their attention to Johnson now that Michael Redd has agreed to return to Milwaukee.
> 
> ...


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## Tiz (May 9, 2005)

dissonance19 said:


> I guess, this deserves it's own thread, so I'll keep it as that.
> 
> Here's what the article said.


Well I think that you can take the Cavs out of the picture now. So it looks like Atlanta will be the front runner. With the loss of Hughes I wonder if the Wizards will make a run at him now?


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## sunsaz (Apr 18, 2005)

I wonder what's crazier: The Hawks willing to spend so much bread on one man or Johnson throwing away a title shot to go to a lottery team.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Tiz said:


> Well I think that you can take the Cavs out of the picture now. So it looks like Atlanta will be the front runner. With the loss of Hughes I wonder if the Wizards will make a run at him now?


Yeah, that's true. I had heard some sites may have jumped the gun on the Hughes deal and they were working out details but I just heard on espn radio it's done.

When I looked at Wiz' sal situation, they had 37 mill, and only had like half a team or so. Sal cap is set at 49 mill? I don't know if they can do it.

New Orleans could though.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

sunsaz said:


> I wonder what's crazier: The Hawks willing to spend so much bread on one man or Johnson throwing away a title shot to go to a lottery team.


Well, he hasn't signed it yet but I don't know if he's turned down our 6 yr offer worth 60 million though. I guess, we'll see.


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## Tiz (May 9, 2005)

dissonance19 said:


> Yeah, that's true. I had heard some sites may have jumped the gun on the Hughes deal and they were working out details but I just heard on espn radio it's done.
> 
> When I looked at Wiz' sal situation, they had 37 mill, and only had like half a team or so. Sal cap is set at 49 mill? I don't know if they can do it.
> 
> New Orleans could though.


Hornets would put him into almost the same situation as the Hawks. It seems that everyone one playing there wants out (Baron, Magloire).


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## BootyKing (Apr 7, 2005)

Oh sorry didn't realise ud already posted it. Oh well good for it 2 have its own thread


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## sunsaz (Apr 18, 2005)

dissonance19 said:


> Well, he hasn't signed it yet but I don't know if he's turned down our 6 yr offer worth 60 million though. I guess, we'll see.


To be safe, I'm warming up the "You sold out" chant just in case.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

sunsaz said:


> To be safe, I'm warming up the "You sold out" chant just in case.


i really hope he stays..i loved watching you guys play,and with a healthy JJ i think you would have beaten the Spurs..


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## Chalie Boy (Aug 26, 2002)

Hughes 5yr $65-$70 million
Redd 6yr $90-$96 million
Allen 5yr $80-$85 million

And now you guys offer joe 6yr 60 million!?!?! :laugh: he should AT LEAST get a deal as good a Hughes, teams are screwin it up for you guys


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

They wouldn't trade Q with any chance that they wouldn't resign Joe.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

RebelSun said:


> They wouldn't trade Q with any chance that they wouldn't resign Joe.


I don think in their wildest nightmares they saw Hughes gettin12-14 per..


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

I dont see this on ESPN or anything.


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## Drk Element (Nov 10, 2004)

I hope we keep joe..


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## 1 Penny (Jul 11, 2003)

I really think the final offer the suns will make willbe $70-$75 Million for 6 years. 

Thats pretty much the same as Atlanta but for 5 years.


Any SANE player will sacrifice $1 Million from their $10+ million yearly salary to be on a championship caliber team, instead of a rebuilding team. The only players who do sign away are the real greedy players or atleast persuaded by their greedier agents.

JJ should get the same deal as Hughes, but for 6 years.. In that case the $70-$75 milion for 6 years look fair.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

1 Penny said:


> I really think the final offer the suns will make willbe $70-$75 Million for 6 years.
> 
> Thats pretty much the same as Atlanta but for 5 years.
> 
> ...


I wouldn't call turning down 1 million dollars a year sane no matter what team your talking about. Atlanta wouldn't be that far off from the playoffs if he went there.


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## tempe85 (Jan 7, 2005)

I don't think people should be too worried for now. We ARE GOING TO KEEP JOE. However.... somebody might get shipped off a year from now. Thankfully Stoudemire's contract extension (that he will sign soon) won't go into effect until AFTER this next season meaning the Suns won't have too much of a financial burden. However after next year I'll bet Marion gets traded. It's sad but true. 

However we should get another great chance at a title next year. If we win it then everything we've done will have been worth it.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

tempe85 said:


> I don't think people should be too worried for now. We ARE GOING TO KEEP JOE. However.... somebody might get shipped off a year from now. Thankfully Stoudemire's contract extension (that he will sign soon) won't go into effect until AFTER this next season meaning the Suns won't have too much of a financial burden. However after next year I'll bet Marion gets traded. It's sad but true.
> 
> However we should get another great chance at a title next year. If we win it then everything we've done will have been worth it.


Nah, I think owners would keep Marion. If there was a big problem with his deal we'd prolly gotten rid of him and not Q. Owners are committed, I think we'd keep this core for awhile or try to. It's not that much money


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## PAIDNFULL23 (Jul 9, 2005)

If the suns don't match a deal for JJ, then you guys aren't the same high scoring Suns of last year, it just wouldn't be the same.


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

PAIDNFULL23 said:


> If the suns don't match a deal for JJ, then you guys aren't the same high scoring Suns of last year, it just wouldn't be the same.


sadly I agree. Without JJ it wont be no fun


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## Lukasbmw (Jul 30, 2004)

I thought from the get go Bryan/Jerry/Robert were putting out the "we will match any offer to JJ" memo to scare teams off. 

What team wants to tie up their money with a max offer to someone who most likely will be retained?

At first it worked great. The Cavs, Bucks, and others went after other players. However, now that all the stars are pretty much settled, teams like the Bobcats and Hawks have all this money and no one to spend it on. Why not offer JJ a max contract? He's the only good player left up for grabs.


IMO: Marion, Nash, JJ, and Amare are all almost equally important. 

Without Nash there is no leader and there is no running

Amare is the future of the NBA and may develop into an all time great

Marion does all the dirty work and may be better then Scottie Pippen...as long as he shows up for the next playoff series

JJ will one day be an all-star. He could be better then Walter Davis

We need to keep all 4 no matter what the cost. The only way this does not happen is if we have a failure of a reason and need to shake up the chemistry. I hope this does not happen as NO other team has such a great core.

Nash makes us a .500 team

Amare makes us a .680 team

Marion makes up a .780 team

JJ makes us a championship team.


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## WhoDaBest23 (Apr 16, 2003)

I will laugh if the Suns don't keep JJ. That would be idiotic.


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## KJay (Sep 22, 2002)

I'd laugh at him if he goes to atl


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

Lukasbmw said:


> I thought from the get go Bryan/Jerry/Robert were putting out the "we will match any offer to JJ" memo to scare teams off.
> 
> What team wants to tie up their money with a max offer to someone who most likely will be retained?
> 
> ...


So why didnt we win the championship this past season? haha


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## KJay (Sep 22, 2002)

they were illergic to defense.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

KJay said:


> I'd laugh at him if he goes to atl



And he would laugh for getting a max contract


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

Lukasbmw said:


> I thought from the get go Bryan/Jerry/Robert were putting out the "we will match any offer to JJ" memo to scare teams off.
> 
> What team wants to tie up their money with a max offer to someone who most likely will be retained?
> 
> ...


You sure are optimistic. Its kind of hard to say JJ makes hte Suns a championship team the Spurs just wiped the floor with them not too long ago (no offense Suns fans). Also, calling Shawn Marion better than Scottie Pippen is awfully generous for someone who can't create his own shot (much less shots for others), can't pass, and can't defend as well as Pippen.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

Drewbs said:


> You sure are optimistic. Its kind of hard to say JJ makes hte Suns a championship team the Spurs just wiped the floor with them not too long ago (no offense Suns fans). Also, calling Shawn Marion better than Scottie Pippen is awfully generous for someone who can't create his own shot (much less shots for others), can't pass, and can't defend as well as Pippen.


I would take Pippen at his prime over Marion any day of the week but that doesn't mean much in real life lol.


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

KJay said:


> they were illergic to defense.


Sorry dont know what illergic means


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?va=allergic


> Main Entry: al·ler·gic
> Pronunciation: &-'l&r-jik
> Function: adjective
> 1 : of, relating to, inducing, or affected by allergy
> 2 : having an aversion <allergic to work>


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

kamego said:


> http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?va=allergic


i know what allergic means not illergic :laugh:


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

it was a joke lol


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

kamego said:


> it was a joke lol


hahahha...my bad im kinda out there


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

no problem we all have those days


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Drewbs said:


> You sure are optimistic. Its kind of hard to say JJ makes hte Suns a championship team the Spurs just wiped the floor with them not too long ago (no offense Suns fans). Also, calling Shawn Marion better than Scottie Pippen is awfully generous for someone who can't create his own shot (much less shots for others), can't pass, and can't defend as well as Pippen.


Wiped the floor with us if you only look at 4-1 series but if you look within the series it's not like we got killed in those games. We lost by no more than 10 pts. Never got blown out ONCE. Pistons, Sonics, Nuggets can't say that.

And as for JJ, he's a key to us and I wouldn't think we're title contenders w/o him. 

Marion, I think people get carried away by insulting his game because they say doesn't he can create a shot. I think he can, it's just not as rare as people make it out to be.I don't think he should be penalized cuz of it. He still gets 20/10 without doing it that well is damn good. I don't think it matters if he can pass or not. He can defend just not that well at PF. At SF of course. He was playing out of position, remember. It may be debatable if it's as good as Pippens D. Marion was also just the 2nd player in NBA history to be top 5 in steals and rebounds(David Robinson, 1st). So, he's not as bad or overrated as people think he is. Not saying you were saying that though. But he's a big part of what makes this team go. We're not as good as we are w/o him either.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

dissonance19 said:


> Wiped the floor with us if you only look at 4-1 series but if you look within the series it's not like we got killed in those games. We lost by no more than 10 pts. Never got blown out ONCE. Pistons, Sonics, Nuggets can't say that.


Losing is losing, you can't have a good loss....


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

kamego said:


> Losing is losing, you can't have a good loss....


Well, obviously. Never said there was a good loss. "Wiped the floor with us" is not good words to use cuz it's not true.


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

I disagree. I think there is such thing as a good loss. If your team is playing excellent bball for 48 minutes, but gets beat buy a full court desperation heave and the other team wins by 1, sure its a tough feeling, but its a good loss because you played excellent the whole game


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## tempe85 (Jan 7, 2005)

Drewbs said:


> You sure are optimistic. Its kind of hard to say JJ makes hte Suns a championship team the Spurs just wiped the floor with them not too long ago (no offense Suns fans). Also, calling Shawn Marion better than Scottie Pippen is awfully generous for someone who can't create his own shot (much less shots for others), can't pass, and can't defend as well as Pippen.


Yep they beat the Suns without JJ. In the couple games he did play he wasn't even close to 100%. With JJ the Suns may very well have won that series.


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

tempe85 said:


> Yep they beat the Suns without JJ. In the couple games he did play he wasn't even close to 100%. With JJ the Suns may very well have won that series.


You can't be serious. The Suns would not have beaten the Spurs in a 7 game series. He wasn't 100%? The guy broke a bone in his face. Does that inhibit him from running up and down the floor? Or any phyiscal activity at all? Outside of his shooting, which he might have to adjust too with the mask, Joe Johnson's injury didn't show when he was on the floor in those games. He actually shot pretty well too from what I remember. This isn't something like the Heat series. If you can say that Johnson wasn't 100%, fine, Tim Duncan wasn't 100%. He was playing on two sprained ankles, against the Suns and the Pistons. The Suns were clearly outmatched, and their weak interior defense lost them the series, not a lack of 3 pt shooting.

You didn't get killed in individual games, but you got killed in the series. 

Most of the games were fairly close, but after the first two games it was obvious that the Suns couldn't stop the Spurs execution late in games. Anyone who watched the series will tell you it was lopsided. You don't go up 3-0 in a 7 game series from good luck or flukes, despite what the scores are in those 3 games. Don't kid yourself.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Drewbs said:


> You can't be serious. The Suns would not have beaten the Spurs in a 7 game series. He wasn't 100%? The guy broke a bone in his face. Does that inhibit him from running up and down the floor? Or any phyiscal activity at all? Outside of his shooting, which he might have to adjust too with the mask, Joe Johnson's injury didn't show when he was on the floor in those games. He actually shot pretty well too from what I remember. This isn't something like the Heat series. If you can say that Johnson wasn't 100%, fine, Tim Duncan wasn't 100%. He was playing on two sprained ankles, against the Suns and the Pistons. The Suns were clearly outmatched, and their weak interior defense lost them the series, not a lack of 3 pt shooting. Most of the games were fairly close, but after the first two games it was obvious that the Suns couldn't stop the Spurs execution late in games. Anyone who watched the series will tell you it was lopsided. You don't go up 3-0 in a 7 game series from good luck or flukes, despite what the scores are in those 3 games. Don't kid yourself.



Yea, Spurs were just deeper and more efficient and it showed. No excuses.


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## ShuHanGuanYu (Feb 3, 2005)

No excuses...but the Suns need to keep JJ. Along with the Spurs being awesome, I blame the fact that these guys have only had one year together. It's said that all great teams must have their heart broken once before moving on to greatness. Hopefully with the additions they've made and with what they've learned in their CF loss they can take one more step towards winning it all.


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

Yeah, you can tell when a certain team is just going to win a series. It happened with the Phoenix/Dallas series as well. The games were fairly close, but you never felt that Dallas had a clear advantage despite going 6 games.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

ShuHanGuanYu said:


> No excuses...but the Suns need to keep JJ. Along with the Spurs being awesome, I blame the fact that these guys have only had one year together. It's said that all great teams must have their heart broken once before moving on to greatness. Hopefully with the additions they've made and with what they've learned in their CF loss they can take one more step towards winning it all.


great points. I agree. Not sure if you saw but we're saying we're gonna match it so. Atlanta is still gonna have him sign it though.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

That's a hell of a deal to match. I am sure the Suns management was hoping for something more user friendly lol


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## tempe85 (Jan 7, 2005)

Drewbs said:


> You can't be serious. The Suns would not have beaten the Spurs in a 7 game series. He wasn't 100%? The guy broke a bone in his face. Does that inhibit him from running up and down the floor? Or any phyiscal activity at all? Outside of his shooting, which he might have to adjust too with the mask, Joe Johnson's injury didn't show when he was on the floor in those games. He actually shot pretty well too from what I remember. This isn't something like the Heat series. If you can say that Johnson wasn't 100%, fine, Tim Duncan wasn't 100%. He was playing on two sprained ankles, against the Suns and the Pistons. The Suns were clearly outmatched, and their weak interior defense lost them the series, not a lack of 3 pt shooting.
> 
> You didn't get killed in individual games, but you got killed in the series.
> 
> Most of the games were fairly close, but after the first two games it was obvious that the Suns couldn't stop the Spurs execution late in games. Anyone who watched the series will tell you it was lopsided. You don't go up 3-0 in a 7 game series from good luck or flukes, despite what the scores are in those 3 games. Don't kid yourself.


Just wondering but how can you be 100% after not playing or shooting a basketball for a couple of weeks? If the tables had been turned and Ginobili was out and he came back with a mask on then the Suns probably would have won. They lost a couple of those games by a mere couple of points. Don't kid yourself that it wouldn't have made a huge difference.


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

tempe85 said:


> Just wondering but how can you be 100% after not playing or shooting a basketball for a couple of weeks? If the tables had been turned and Ginobili was out and he came back with a mask on then the Suns probably would have won. They lost a couple of those games by a mere couple of points. Don't kid yourself that it wouldn't have made a huge difference.


Ginobili plays a bigger part in the Spur's offense than Joe Johnson does in the Sun's offense. You can't compare the two in that regard. Ginobili plays as a facilitator for the Spur's. He is the one who does most of the ballhandling and makes most of the decisions with the ball. Parker is often incompetant. Partiuclarly when teams cut off his penetration, he is often unable to even consistently make coherent plays. Ginobili is a much more important piece to the Spur's than JJ is the Suns. Johnson is a good player, but Jim Jackson can replace him in limited stretches. The way the Suns play, Steve Nash dominates the ball. Johnson's role in the offense is to basically shot spot up 3's in transition, and play defense. JJ can do a lot of other things well, but for the most part he's limited to scoring off feeds from Nash. Jackson can do the same things. Johnson is an important part of the offense, but not an irreplacable part of the offense. His role on the team is important, because without a spot up shooter who can run the floor, the teams secondary break isn't nearly as dangerous as when they can have a guy like JJ trailing in for open looks. Believe it or not, Jim Jackson can do the same thing, not to mention hes a pretty good defender himself. Ok, they didn't have JJ for the first 2 games, but thats not why the Suns lost the series. They lost because they couldn't stop the Spurs. Its no good if you can score all these points if late in the game, a more disciplined team can execute their offense against such little defensive pressure. Having Joe Johnson didn't exactly help stop the Spur's late game execution when he came back into the lineup. The Spurs were just a better team.


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## 1 Penny (Jul 11, 2003)

The suns got their behinds handed to them by the spurs. I mean the Spurs defeated the Suns in their own tempo/Style. No excuses the Suns got beat.

But if JJ played the full game in Game 2 Against Dallas, I would actually expected the Suns be 2-0 going to Dallas, and the chance to be 4-1 or 4-0. I know I picked Dallas to win it all, but Suns actually played them a lot better than I hoped for.


Anyways.... SUNS are Matching the MAX offer by Hawks. yay?


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## ShuHanGuanYu (Feb 3, 2005)

Just a spot up shooter? Maybe you watched him two years ago. Now? No way, Joe is more than just a spot up shooter. He has a crossover that gets him into the lane whenever he wants. When the Suns have nothing going with Nash and Amare, it's Joe who gets the ball at the top of the key and creates his own shot...and he usually hits it. I saw it all season.


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

ShuHanGuanYu said:


> Just a spot up shooter? Maybe you watched him two years ago. Now? No way, Joe is more than just a spot up shooter. He has a crossover that gets him into the lane whenever he wants. When the Suns have nothing going with Nash and Amare, it's Joe who gets the ball at the top of the key and creates his own shot...and he usually hits it. I saw it all season.


In the Suns offense, Joe Johnson's role is to score when his opportunities come, usually shooting open 3's in the Sun's transition game. I know Joe Johnson can do more than that, but he very rarely does long stretches of ball handling with STeve Nash dominating the ball. I'm not just talking about his importance, his importance comes from the role he provides in the offense. That is why there wasn't a significant dropoff when Jim Jackson played alot of minutes, because he could play a very similar role to Johnson.


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## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

Drewbs said:


> In the Suns offense, Joe Johnson's role is to score when his opportunities come, usually shooting open 3's in the Sun's transition game. I know Joe Johnson can do more than that, but he very rarely does long stretches of ball handling with STeve Nash dominating the ball. I'm not just talking about his importance, his importance comes from the role he provides in the offense. That is why there wasn't a significant dropoff when Jim Jackson played alot of minutes, because he could play a very similar role to Johnson.


But when Joe takes over the PG which he does kind of a lot, his role is a lot different


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## tempe85 (Jan 7, 2005)

Drewbs said:


> In the Suns offense, Joe Johnson's role is to score when his opportunities come, usually shooting open 3's in the Sun's transition game. I know Joe Johnson can do more than that, but he very rarely does long stretches of ball handling with STeve Nash dominating the ball. I'm not just talking about his importance, his importance comes from the role he provides in the offense. That is why there wasn't a significant dropoff when Jim Jackson played alot of minutes, because he could play a very similar role to Johnson.


Wow you must not watch the Suns much. Johnson was our best backup point guard this last season. When Nash went out of the game Joe was our ball handler. He's also our second best defender, our best shooter (possibly with the exception of Nash), and he creates a lot of defensive missmatches. Despite the fact he hadn't played basketball at all for about 2 weeks he played pretty well against the Spurs. Imagine if he was at full speed for all 5 games? No the Suns probably wouldn't have won but it would have at least gone 6 and maybe 7.


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## ShuHanGuanYu (Feb 3, 2005)

Drewbs said:



> In the Suns offense, Joe Johnson's role is to score when his opportunities come, usually shooting open 3's in the Sun's transition game. I know Joe Johnson can do more than that, but he very rarely does long stretches of ball handling with STeve Nash dominating the ball. I'm not just talking about his importance, his importance comes from the role he provides in the offense. That is why there wasn't a significant dropoff when Jim Jackson played alot of minutes, because he could play a very similar role to Johnson.


He's a shooting guard. The role of most shooting guards is not to have long stretches of ball handling. He plays good defense without fouling, plays a lot of minutes and rarely tires, is tall and physicall tough, can get wherever he wants on the floor, is a good ballhandler, is a good passer and not turnover prone, and can hit the shot in the end of the game when needed. Jim Jackson has...maybe two of those. He's not a good defender, and he's a very streaky shooter. He can't drive like Joe can and is more of a "jump shooter" that we're talking about. Joe is more than that. The Suns do suffer without Joe Johnson. If they won with Jim Jackson it's because they were that much better than the other team, and guys like Nash and Amare stepped it up that much more. You would have to have watched his games in the regular season to get the scope of everything he does for the Suns, some of it not on the stat sheet. They're offensive flow is simply way better when Joe is out on the floor compared to Jim Jackson. Ginobili's role is more important to the Spurs in my opinion, because they do need him to run the offense. But that's why I'm not arguing that. I'm simply arguing that Joe Johnson is much more than just a glorified spot up shooter.


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## 1 Penny (Jul 11, 2003)

Suns fans KNOW how JJ plays.

He just stands around and shoot?

Thats what the damn casuals always stated during last season. It was the Suns fans that stood up for JJ... and a lot of his fans too.

A lot was saying that JJ wasnt a star player, even asking what so special about him... and even saying he is only good in the suns system. It was the fans that stood up for what they see and know about JJ's game.

And the comparisons to Ginobili etc. I remember a lot saying No way JJ will even be compared. But a lot of suns fans stated that JJ has potential to be as impactful as Ginobili, only right now Ginobili is obviously far more better. 

So basically the critics of JJ, became supporters since he has the chance to jumpship to another team. All of a sudden other fans states he is notfully utilized under the suns system. All the excuses comes out to justify him leaving.

Well, the suns org. know specifically what type ofplayer JJ is as much as the fans do, and they think he's special enough to be part of the Suns core today and the future.


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

I'm not downplaying Joe Johnson as a player. If you read what I usually post; for the most part, I have nothing but good things to say about Johnson as a player. I know very well what type of player that Joe Johnson is, but read what I wrote. JJ plays a role in the Sun's system to score when the game comes to him. The Suns system does make him look better at times, but it also limits what he can really do. I'm fully aware that he is a very good player on the ball, he is a pretty good slasher and a pretty good passer. I didn't say that all he can do is stand around and shoot, but most of his offense comes from trailing the break for open 3s when the defense if forced to collapse. I didn't compare him to Ginobili, I compared the roles they played on this respective teams. Ginobili's role on his team is closer to Nash than it is to Johnson. My post isn't to crticize him, it was a respone to the guy who compared losing Johnson to losing Manu, which are two completely different situations. Nothing about, how Manu is or isn't a better player.


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## ShuHanGuanYu (Feb 3, 2005)

Agreed, a large chunk of his offense comes that way. My only point here is that he saves the Suns a lot of times. When they get into a half court set and can't get anything going with Nash and Amare (happens more than people think), Joe is there to create something from nothing.

I think the part about the Ginobili/JJ comparison was to 1 Penny, right? I know you weren't comparing the two, and I did read what you wrote quite thoroughly. The half implication that the dropoff from Joe Johnson to Jim Jackson is not significant jumped out at me when I read it, and that's all I am responding to. JJ2 can play a similar role, but just can't do it nearly as well as JJ.


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