# Devin Harris vs Jarrett Jack



## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

http://www.nba.com/games/20071203/DALCHI/boxscore.html --> Devin Harris vs Bulls- 4 pts, 2 rebs, 1 asst

http://www.nba.com/games/20080206/CHIPOR/boxscore.html --> Jarrett Jack vs Bulls- 17 pts, 2 rebs, 6 assts

Checkmate.

P.S> http://www.nba.com/games/20080103/PORCHI/boxscore.html --> Jarrett Jack vs real Bulls- 17 pts, 4 rebs, 5 assts off the BENCH on the ROAD

Checkmate, folks. Checkmate.


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## ROYisR.O.Y. (Apr 1, 2007)

wow devin harris against the real bulls
jj against the no offense or really any d bulls (no gordon, deng , hinrich)

i respect a lot of your opinions but please.....


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## Resume (Jul 17, 2007)

Interesting. You should keep this up. Post stats for everytime Jack and Harris play the same night.


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## Sambonius (May 21, 2003)

ROFLMAO. Okay...


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## Resume (Jul 17, 2007)

ROYisR.O.Y. said:


> wow devin harris against the real bulls
> jj against the no offense or really any d bulls (no gordon, deng , hinrich)
> 
> i respect a lot of your opinions but please.....


hey it does not matter who is out there. You still gotta put your numbers up


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## alext42083 (Nov 7, 2003)

Yeah... I would still take Devin Harris over Jarrett Jack any day of the week.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

http://www.nba.com/games/20080103/PORCHI/boxscore.html --> Jarrett Jack vs real Bulls- 17 pts, 4 rebs, 5 assts off the BENCH

Checkmate.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

ROYisR.O.Y. said:


> wow devin harris against the real bulls
> jj against the no offense or really any d bulls (no gordon, deng , hinrich)
> 
> i respect a lot of your opinions but please.....


See new CHECKMATE above.


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## Resume (Jul 17, 2007)

I'm starting to like Jack again... he puts up some good numbers


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> http://www.nba.com/games/20071203/DALCHI/boxscore.html --> Devin Harris vs Bulls- 4 pts, 2 rebs, 1 asst
> 
> http://www.nba.com/games/20080206/CHIPOR/boxscore.html --> Jarrett Jack vs Bulls- 17 pts, 2 rebs, 6 assts
> 
> ...


So you're saying you'd take Jack over Harris? Really?


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## alext42083 (Nov 7, 2003)

How the roller coaster keeps rolling.... particularly with Jarrett Jack.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

HOWIE said:


> So you're saying you'd take Jack over Harris? Really?


dude look at the numbers. you would give up Jack AND Outlaw AND Frye for a guy who only puts up 4 pts, 2 rebs, and 1 asst vs the BULLS? If you take Outlaw, Frye, and Jack off our team tonight and add Harris' 4 pts, we get blown out! Glad we didn't make the deal.

Checkmate.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

And remember this-------- Jack is in only his THIRD year. He still has time to become one of the top PGs in the league.


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## alext42083 (Nov 7, 2003)

Well to be fair.. Devin Harris did get knocked out in that game by Noah's elbow or something in the third quarter.



> The Mavericks got a scare in the third quarter, when Devin Harris got knocked to the floor by Joakim Noah while going for an offensive rebound. He stayed down for a few minutes before walking away and heading to the locker room with a neck contusion. X-rays were negative.
> 
> "I felt his body come down and I tried to lift up," Harris said. "It's a little stiff right now. It's too early to tell."


http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap?gid=2007120304


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

alext42083 said:


> Well to be fair.. Devin Harris did get knocked out in that game by Noah's elbow or something in the third quarter.
> 
> 
> 
> http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap?gid=2007120304


Excuses, excuses. He played like 26 minutes, no?

Jack would've just gotten back up and torched the Bulls just the same.


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> dude look at the numbers. you would give up Jack AND Outlaw AND Frye for a guy who only puts up 4 pts, 2 rebs, and 1 asst vs the BULLS? If you take Outlaw, Frye, and Jack off our team tonight and add Harris' 4 pts, we get blown out! *Glad we didn't make the deal.*
> 
> Checkmate.


Dude, I'm just talking player for player. I doubt that any deal with Outlaw is going to fly, Dallas is in a corner. Nice thing is Portland doesn't have to make a trade. I can live with Jack, but Harris would be a nice PG to play along with Roy. All I'm saying.

There are still 15 days left and I'm sure that there are other deals out there that haven't been leaked out. I really doubt that Pritchard is going to make a move that would hurt the team, but we do need to clear roster spots for next season.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

HOWIE said:


> Dude, I'm just talking player for player. I doubt that any deal with Outlaw is going to fly, Dallas is in a corner. Nice thing is Portland doesn't have to make a trade. I can live with Jack, but Harris would be a nice PG to play along with Roy. All I'm saying.
> 
> There are still 15 days left and I'm sure that there are other deals out there that haven't been leaked out. I really doubt that Pritchard is going to make a move that would hurt the team, but we do need to clear roster spots for next season.


All we have to do is waive Green and then put Rudy in. Trade all the picks for cash and future considerations and keep Kopoenen in Finland.


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## ProfitByProphet (Jan 31, 2008)

This thread is retarded. Checkmate.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

ProfitByProphet said:


> This thread is retarded. Checkmate.


Facts are facts. I will be in Dallas next Wednesday to see UP CLOSE who is the better PG.


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> All we have to do is waive Green and then put Rudy in. Trade all the picks for cash and future considerations and keep Kopoenen in Finland.


I know you had a grin while you were typing that cuz I was had one while I was reading that. I don't think that is what is going to happen. I think that Pritchard is going to get value for players going out. I could see a package on trade day, along with out pick to move up in the draft. We'll have to see what happens.


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## ROYisR.O.Y. (Apr 1, 2007)

whoa whoa i never wanted to trade outlaw and jack for harris.

i was just talking about swapping harris for jack and i can pull up just as many one game stats to make jack look bad


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> Facts are facts. I will be in Dallas next Wednesday to see UP CLOSE who is the better PG.


I think that Harris is still out isn't he?


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## wastro (Dec 19, 2004)

Small sample size. Means nothing.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

HOWIE said:


> I think that Harris is still out isn't he?


No excuses.


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> No excuses.


Not an excuse just a fact. Wash't he out for two or three weeks?


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## ProZach (Oct 13, 2005)

But Jack vs. real GoldenState had 2/5/4 and Harris had 21/7/5 vs. real GoldenState, so Harris should automatically be the better player, right? Facts after all, are facts. I'm so confused. :thinking2:


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

> This thread is retarded. Checkmate.


+1.

Zach, can you please post every game that Jack and Harris played, vs. the same teams? because i can make a case that Martell webster is better than LeBron James if i talk about his 2 games vs. Utah.. Or LaMarcus is better than Duncan. This is a rediculous thread.



> But Jack vs. real GoldenState had 2/5/4 and Harris had 21/7/5 vs. real GoldenState, so Harris should automatically be the better player, right? Facts after all, are facts. I'm so confused


no, only vs. the bulls, you can only test it vs. one team, no other team counts. I'm sorry, facts are facts, lmao.


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## NewAgeBaller (Jan 8, 2007)

ZackAddy said:


> And remember this-------- Jack is in only his THIRD year. He still has time to become one of the top PGs in the league.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol:


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Hey NewAgeBaller- how do you feel about the Heat trade? I would think you would be happy, no? Marion is a great very underrated player.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

This thread is a glimpse into madness. A depiction of a world where hamburgers eat people and Jarrett Jack is a top young point guard.


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## NewAgeBaller (Jan 8, 2007)

ZackAddy said:


> Hey NewAgeBaller- how do you feel about the Heat trade? I would think you would be happy, no? Marion is a great very underrated player.


Yea I'm very happy, feels like I'm dreaming right now (mostly cause I'm tired and need sleep but yea). Great trade and definately a move in the right direction! Even if we don't become a playoff team next season, and an ECF contender the next (which is what I'm hoping and predicting), it can't be much worse than where we are now (literally.. the worst team in the league..).

So yea I'm real happy. What did that have to do with this thread though, or were you just asking?


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Look at last season when Jack started. His numbers were better than Harris'

06-07 Devin Harris 10.2 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 3.7 apg, 1.2 spg, 1.83 tpg
06-07 Jarrett Jack 12.0 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 5.3 apg, 1.1 spg, 2.37 tpg

Jack is better, folks.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

NewAgeBaller said:


> Yea I'm very happy, feels like I'm dreaming right now (mostly cause I'm tired and need sleep but yea). Great trade and definately a move in the right direction! Even if we don't become a playoff team next season, and an ECF contender the next (which is what I'm hoping and predicting), it can't be much worse than where we are now (literally.. the worst team in the league..).
> 
> So yea I'm real happy. What did that have to do with this thread though, or were you just asking?


I was just asking. I think it's a great deal. Wade-Marion is a start and maybe you'll get a good draft pick though the 8th seed Nets are only 20-29. Maybe you could still catch em.


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## craigehlo (Feb 24, 2005)

ZackAddy said:


> 06-07 Devin Harris 10.2 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 3.7 apg, 1.2 spg, 1.83 tpg
> 06-07 Jarrett Jack 12.0 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 5.3 apg, 1.1 spg, 2.37 tpg
> 
> Jack is better, folks.


Not even close.

Forgot the big stat:

06-07 Harris 26:00 minutes per game
06-07 Jack 33:23 minutes per game

Stats aside, watch some Mavs games on League Pass when Harris is back from injury. He's a much more pure PG, not an undersized SG.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

craigehlo said:


> Not even close.
> 
> Forgot the big stat:
> 
> ...


If he's so pure, why does he not even get 6 assists per game but averages over 2 turnovers per game? Umm.... that's not as good as Blake, let alone as good as REAL great pure PGs like Nash, Paul, Deron, and Billups. I'm honestly curious-- what about Harris makes him a pure PG with such a weak assist to turnover ratio. What makes Harris better than Blake? That he can dunk?


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## craigehlo (Feb 24, 2005)

ZackAddy said:


> If he's so pure, why does he not even get 6 assists per game but averages over 2 turnovers per game? Umm.... that's not as good as Blake, let alone as good as REAL great pure PGs like Nash, Paul, Deron, and Billups. I'm honestly curious-- what about Harris makes him a pure PG with such a weak assist to turnover ratio. What makes Harris better than Blake? That he can dunk?


His vision, speed and handles really differentiate him from combo guards like Jack. His turnovers are on a running team, not a half-court offense like the Blazers. Don't forget that the Blazers were DEAD LAST in the NBA scoring fast break points in 06-07.

It really boils down to player efficiency. Harris is 15.1 and Jack is 9.6 according to NBA.com.

Don't just look at the stats though, watch some Mavs games. He's legit.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

^^ (to Zach) how many times have you watched him play exactly?

I've never seen a PG turn the ball over more than Jack.

And Blake is one of the most solid PGs i've ever seen, you know exactly what you will get out of him, but he won't play the defense Harris will, he won't get you the easy baskets Harris will (which we desperately need) and he won't be able to drive and finish/kick like Harris will. He is also 3 years older than Harris. Jack is the same age.

IT is a no brainer, i think. Would i give up Outlaw or Martell? no, unless it is straight up Martell for Harris.

Would i do Jack, Sergio, Frye and our pick for Harris and Bass? in a second. We are going to be 13 deep next year, we need to consolidate that, and try and get some good player in return, without letting people walk, and without having them pissed that they aren't getting enough minutes, and demand a trade and kill chemistry.


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## JFizzleRaider (Nov 1, 2004)

ZackAddy said:


> dude look at the numbers. you would give up Jack AND Outlaw AND Frye for a guy who only puts up 4 pts, 2 rebs, and 1 asst vs the BULLS? If you take Outlaw, Frye, and Jack off our team tonight and add Harris' 4 pts, we get blown out! Glad we didn't make the deal.
> 
> Checkmate.


Your basing this off a couple games, look at there careers. Jack has had multiple times to be the starting PG on the blazers and he cant even beat out steve blake.

Harris played so good for dallas that they had to insert him to the starting lineup and plugged terry at SG/6th man


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## JFizzleRaider (Nov 1, 2004)

ZackAddy said:


> And remember this-------- Jack is in only his THIRD year. He still has time to become one of the top PGs in the league.


Jack isn't a PG, hes a combo guard that is horrible playing PG


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## ThatBlazerGuy (May 1, 2003)

ZackAddy Logic...

Linas Klezia vs. Utah: 41 points, 9 rebounds, 2 assist, 1 steal
Dwayne Wade vs. Utah: 20 points, 2 rebounds, 6 assist, 1 steal

Klezia is far better than Wade.


Harris is better than Jack at nearly everything. First off, he can and often does play off the ball offensivley. He doesnt require the rock in his hands to make plays. This is unlike Jack who is nearly useless without the ball in his hands. Also, unlike Jack, Harris doesnt 'Damon' the ball(Holding the ball for 10+ seconds for no reason), unlike Jack. Once more, while no Nash, Harris can at least competentley run the break. He can also run off the ball on the break, as he is a phenominal athlete with top 10 speed/quicks among PG's. Jack plays like a robot. He has no 'smoothness' and just has no PG 'feel'. The above isnt even the big difference. Defense. Jarrett Jack is a absolutley horrible man defender. He looks like he should be a bruising, Billups like defender, but is slow as hell and just plain sucks ***. Devin can actually make plays defensivley, while also playing sound defense. 

I would trade 3 of Webster, Frye, Jack, Sergio, 2008 1st rounder for Harris and a semi-competent short term replacment big man. It looks like overpaying, and probably is, but we absolutley must consolidate talent.


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

I'd be hesitant to start trading too much of Jack/Frye/Outlaw/Webster/1st rounder for Harris, but saying Harris isn't a better player than Jack is very much quite silly indeed.

Teams almost always overvalue their own young talent and undervalue the young talent of others. Remember how outlandish many on this board thought the Calderon for Aldridge rumors were? Well now they are starting to look pretty fair.


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## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> Look at last season when Jack started. His numbers were better than Harris'
> 
> 06-07 Devin Harris 10.2 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 3.7 apg, 1.2 spg, 1.83 tpg
> 06-07 Jarrett Jack 12.0 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 5.3 apg, 1.1 spg, 2.37 tpg
> ...


there's a little thing called defense that harris is much better at. and there is the minutes factor.

harris is better than jack. there's no argument. but there's also no way that the blazers would trade jack, outlaw, and more to get harris. just doesn't make any sense.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

What good is a PG that plays without the ball? That makes no sense to me. Nash and Kidd play with the ball in their hands.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Draco said:


> but saying Harris is a better player than Jack is very much quite silly indeed.


My point exactly.


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## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> What good is a PG that plays without the ball? That makes no sense to me. Nash and Kidd play with the ball in their hands.


being able to play without the ball is a very good thing. pgs don't have the ball in their hands the entire game. they have to be able to play off ball.


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

ZackAddy said:


> My point exactly.


HAHA

Nice job editing my post in your reply :biggrin:


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

rocketeer said:


> being able to play without the ball is a very good thing. pgs don't have the ball in their hands the entire game. they have to be able to play off ball.


Sure. But a "pure PG" has the ball in his hands most of the time, right?


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## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> Sure. But a "pure PG" has the ball in his hands most of the time, right?


not necessarily and not on dallas. the mavs are all about mismatches. they get the mismatch and they attack it. that means the ball may or may not be in harris's hands. terry can handle the ball as can howard and then there's dirk.

and look at portland. is it not important for your pg to be able to play off the ball with roy there doing a lot of the ball handling?


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## ProfitByProphet (Jan 31, 2008)

ZackAddy said:


> Facts are facts. I will be in Dallas next Wednesday to see UP CLOSE who is the better PG.


Yes, facts are facts. The FACTS are Harris averages more than Jack in every single statistical category. The facts are Harris isn't wildly inconsistent. The facts are Harris was drafted 5th overall while Jack was drafted 22nd. The facts are Harris is an elite defender, while Jack is a poor defender.

So facts are facts, but nothing more. Saying one player is better than another because of how they perform in one single game isn't logical. And saying checkmate with such a stupid argument makes you look like an immature child.

Jarrett Jack = Backup SG, maybe a starting combo guard
Devin Harris = Championship caliber point guard


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

rocketeer said:


> not necessarily and not on dallas. the mavs are all about mismatches. they get the mismatch and they attack it. that means the ball may or may not be in harris's hands. terry can handle the ball as can howard and then there's dirk.
> 
> and look at portland. is it not important for your pg to be able to play off the ball with roy there doing a lot of the ball handling?


You're right.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

ProfitByProphet said:


> Yes, facts are facts. The FACTS are Harris averages more than Jack in every single statistical category. The facts are Harris isn't wildly inconsistent. The facts are Harris was drafted 5th overall while Jack was drafted 22nd.
> 
> So facts are facts, but nothing more. Saying one player is better than another because of how they perform in one single game isn't logical. And saying checkmate with such a stupid argument makes you look like an immature child.


Dude, read your last sentence and check yourself. It's called projection. I'm just havin' fun in here.


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## ProfitByProphet (Jan 31, 2008)

ZackAddy said:


> Look at last season when Jack started. His numbers were better than Harris'
> 
> 06-07 Devin Harris 10.2 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 3.7 apg, 1.2 spg, 1.83 tpg
> 06-07 Jarrett Jack 12.0 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 5.3 apg, 1.1 spg, 2.37 tpg
> ...


Harris wasn't starting last season. This is Harris' first season as a starter and his numbers blow away Jack's.


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## NateBishop3 (Jul 22, 2003)

Eric you've been toeing a line over the last month and you just stepped over it.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Draco said:


> HAHA
> 
> Nice job editing my post in your reply :biggrin:


I didn't edit it. Look at what you typed.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

NateBishop3 said:


> Eric you've been toeing a line over the last month and you just stepped over it.



Huh?


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## Perfection (May 10, 2004)

ZackAddy said:


> Huh?


He's saying you need to step away from the computer screen. Spend the time to learn how to play an instrument or write a television pilot (for whenever your show goes off the air)...something.

The fact that you had trouble sleeping after the Blazers loss is cause for concern and you might want to see a professional about that. Everything in moderation man.


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

ZackAddy said:


> http://www.nba.com/games/20071203/DALCHI/boxscore.html --> Devin Harris vs Bulls- 4 pts, 2 rebs, 1 asst
> 
> http://www.nba.com/games/20080206/CHIPOR/boxscore.html --> Jarrett Jack vs Bulls- 17 pts, 2 rebs, 6 assts
> 
> ...


http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jackja01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/harride01.html
PER adjusts for minutes and pace:
Harris PER: 18.6
Jack PER: 12.6

Harris Win Shares above average: 4.0
Jack Win Shares above average: -2.0

Harris is a better scorer, more effecient scorer, better 3pt shooter (despite have a rep on not being a good outside shooter), gets more assists per min, gets to the line more per min, gets more steals per min, has a lower turnover percentage, and, as others have already mentioned, is a good defender that can stay in front of his man with good lateral quickness.

Jack shoots free throws better (86% to 82%) and is a better rebounder (6.2% highest of career, to 4.5% - lowest rebounding rate of Harris' career).

I don't think the rebounding makes up for EVERYTHING ELSE.


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## alext42083 (Nov 7, 2003)

I think most of us know that Devin Harris is a much better player than Jarrett Jack...

And common sense that says basing it on simply how they played against a mediocre Chicago team that we see two times a year is not exactly the best benchmark.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

> http://www.basketball-reference.com/.../jackja01.html
> http://www.basketball-reference.com/...harride01.html
> PER adjusts for minutes and pace:
> Harris PER: 18.6
> ...


arguement ender right there.


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

Draco said:


> HAHA
> 
> Nice job editing my post in your reply :biggrin:


It made me re-read your post, I was like I thought he said it the other way around. :lol:

I like Harris, I think that he will be a great top 7 starting PG for someone in the near future. I think that he fits what Pritchard is building here, more so than Jack. I don't think that Jack is a bad player, just the system that he is asked to play in. I think he could also be a starting PG in the right system, just not in Portland.


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

alext42083 said:


> I think most of us know that Devin Harris is a much better player than Jarrett Jack...
> 
> And common sense that says basing it on simply how they played against a mediocre Chicago team that we see two times a year is not exactly the best benchmark.


I think that Harris is perfect for this team, my only problem was the rumored price tag. I understand addition by subtraction, but that is a lot to lose. If we did a Webster, Frye, Jack for Harris & Bass I could live with it. I think that wing players are a dime a dozen, but a PG like Harris is hard to find. I love that he would be locked up too.

There is a price to win, I just don't want to overpay this soon. It might be better to wait it out, but Harris would be pretty awesome.


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

Masbee said:


> http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jackja01.html
> http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/harride01.html
> PER adjusts for minutes and pace:
> Harris PER: 18.6
> ...



You had me at "PER adjusts for minutes and pace". :biggrin:

Nice stat find Masbee. Maybe something happens and Harris becomes a Blazer, maybe not. I know Pritchard won't do something to just do something, there is a reason to his madness. :yay:


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

HOWIE said:


> It made me re-read your post, I was like I thought he said it the other way around. :lol:


Yeah that was funny.

Although maybe it was possible I accidentally typed 'is' instead of 'isn't' and had to edit it a couple seconds later.


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

HOWIE said:


> I think that Harris is perfect for this team, my only problem was the rumored price tag. I understand addition by subtraction, but that is a lot to lose. If we did a Webster, Frye, Jack for Harris & Bass I could live with it. I think that wing players are a dime a dozen, but a PG like Harris is hard to find. I love that he would be locked up too.
> 
> There is a price to win, I just don't want to overpay this soon. It might be better to wait it out, but Harris would be pretty awesome.


I don't think we need to try and get Bass from Dallas, they really want to keep their bench intact or acquiring Kidd becomes a lateral move. Bass wouldn't be a key member of our core, we can get an MLE guy like him in a few years if we really need it so there is no reason for us to try and pry him away. Dallas might be willing to give up draft pick(s), hopefully to NJ so we don't have to give up any.

Also if we are going to make a play for Harris it really has to be RIGHT NOW. Kidd becomes much less valuable in the offseason, Dallas losses a year of their short window, and Harris becomes more valuable.


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## gatorpops (Dec 17, 2004)

ZackAddy said:


> http://www.nba.com/games/20071203/DALCHI/boxscore.html --> Devin Harris vs Bulls- 4 pts, 2 rebs, 1 asst
> 
> http://www.nba.com/games/20080206/CHIPOR/boxscore.html --> Jarrett Jack vs Bulls- 17 pts, 2 rebs, 6 assts
> 
> ...


Everyone knows that I am on board to try to get Harris. 

As to your comparison of Jack vrs. Harris I submit the stat line for Solfolosa who is normaly a "bench" player like Jack has been. 

T.Sefolosha G 41:48 9-17 2-3 2-2 -1 2 2 4 6 3 3 2 2 0 22 Conclusion he is better than Jack or Harris and almost as good as Roy. :biggrin:

gatorpops


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## Samuel (Jan 1, 2003)

HOWIE said:


> I think that Harris is perfect for this team, my only problem was the rumored price tag. I understand addition by subtraction, but that is a lot to lose. If we did a Webster, Frye, Jack for Harris & Bass I could live with it. I think that wing players are a dime a dozen, but a PG like Harris is hard to find. I love that he would be locked up too.
> 
> There is a price to win, I just don't want to overpay this soon. It might be better to wait it out, but Harris would be pretty awesome.




Assuming PF will be locked down by Aldridge, C will be locked down by Oden, and SG will be locked down by Roy, that leaves SF and PG as the two positions KP needs to either grow or acquire a player at. 

So the question becomes: if faced with two possible scenarios, one where we have an above average SF and an average PG, the other where we have an average SF and an above average PG, which do we choose? 

To reiterate Draco's point somewhat, I'm not sure if there will be many opportunities to get a B or A caliber PG in the next few years. At the SF position, however, there are many more opportunities to find B or A caliber players. 

Using Hollinger's somewhat flawed 'PER' metric as a guidebook, let's take another look at PGs who have a decent PER, are young, and are not considered untouchable:

1. Jose Calderon 22.33
2. TJ Ford
3. Tony Parker
4. Devin Harris
5. Mo Williams
6. Nate Robinson
7. Jordan Farmar
8. Louis Williams
9. Rajon Rondo
10. Mike Conley
11. Jameer Nelson
12. Keyon Dooling
13. Beno Udrih
14. Raymond Felton
15. Steve Blake 13.47

The average PER of these players is 16.43 (Mo Williams and above), and the median PER player is Louis Williams (PHI). 

Devin Harris seems like the best guy of that group to go after. Calderon and Parker may not fit our timeline, Mo is a little on the SG side, and NateRob evokes memories of Damon. TJ isnt built Ford tough.

The other guys who I'd consider are Louis Williams, Raymond Felton, and Mike Conley, although all seem firmly entrenched in their respective teams' rebuilding projects.


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## MARIS61 (Apr 28, 2003)

ProfitByProphet said:


> Devin Harris = Championship caliber point guard


:lol:
Thanks a heap. That made my coffee come out my nose.

I'm sure that's why Cuban is looking to get rid of Harris, because he's the key to their next Title.


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## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

I could almost (but not quite) see arguing for Jack over Harris in a vacuum. However, given the make up of this team for next year, I _much_ prefer a four guard rotation of Roy, Fernandez, Harris and Blake to a four guard rotation of Roy, Fernandez, Jack and Blake.


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## gatorpops (Dec 17, 2004)

Samuel said:


> Assuming PF will be locked down by Aldridge, C will be locked down by Oden, and SG will be locked down by Roy, that leaves SF and PG as the two positions KP needs to either grow or acquire a player at.
> 
> So the question becomes: if faced with two possible scenarios, one where we have an above average SF and an average PG, the other where we have an average SF and an above average PG, which do we choose?
> 
> ...



Samuel, could you add Jack and Sergio's numbers to the list to see where they fall. If gives us all a better idea how they compare.


gatorpops


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## craigehlo (Feb 24, 2005)

MARIS61 said:


> :lol:
> Thanks a heap. That made my coffee come out my nose.
> 
> I'm sure that's why Cuban is looking to get rid of Harris, because he's the key to their next Title.


If the read the press out of Dallas they are loath to give up Harris because his development has taken a big leap this year. If anything the Kidd trade was DOA because Harris was a a required piece.

Harris aside, Jack and Blake are in a battle for the bench right now since neither is a long term starter. My money is on Blake.


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