# [45] - Celtics [12-32] vs Bryants [27-18]



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

Ahh the old days, when a Celtic's / Lakers game was must-see TV.










Anyway...


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: Jan 31st - Kobe's back, and in Boston*

kobe might go for 82 against delonte...i wouldnt doubt it


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: Jan 31st - Kobe's back, and in Boston*

Doubt Kobe will play long enough to get 82.


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: Jan 31st - Kobe's back, and in Boston*

Sorry about missing the game thread. I was in Lenox all day.

Anyways, should be fun watching Kobe [that is if you don't hate him].


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: Jan 31st - Kobe's back, and in Boston*

Gomes is on point with hitting open mid-range shots.

Kobe had a nice no-look pass to Smush Parker, but he wasn't able to finish.


----------



## pokpok (Jul 26, 2005)

gerald rises over kobe!!!

nice shot!


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Bynum is something, isn't he. I'd say he has more potential than Al.

Perkins is leading our offense. That's sad.


----------



## pokpok (Jul 26, 2005)

tony allen at the game


----------



## pokpok (Jul 26, 2005)

shammond williams in the game for the lakers...remember him?


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Even though he missed his last three-point attempt, Scalabrine's playing quite well. His defense against Kobe has been pretty good and he nailed some key threes. He's earning some of his paycheck tonight.


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

pokpok said:


> shammond williams in the game for the lakers...remember him?


I always confuse him with Milt Palacio, but yes, I remember him.


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Even though Kobe is the main guy in LA, Smush Parker has a tendency to dominate the ball.


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Celtics down eight to the Lakers at halftime, 49-57.

<table class="bodytext" bgcolor="#dcdcdc" border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td colspan="13" class="head" align="center" bgcolor="#542582">*LOS ANGELES LAKERS*</td> </tr> <tr class="xb" align="right" bgcolor="#cccccc"> <td align="left">*STARTERS*</td> <td width="5%">*MIN*</td> <td nowrap="nowrap" width="7%">*FGM-A*</td> <td width="7%">*3PM-A*</td> <td width="7%">*FTM-A*</td> <td width="6%">*OREB*</td> <td width="6%">*REB*</td> <td width="6%">*AST*</td> <td width="6%">*STL*</td> <td width="6%">*BLK*</td> <td width="6%">*TO*</td> <td width="6%">*PF*</td> <td width="6%">*PTS*</td> </tr> <tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Smush Parker, PG</td><td>17</td><td>6-12</td><td>1-4</td><td>1-1</td><td align="right">0</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>2</td><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>1</td><td>14</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Kobe Bryant, SG</td><td>19</td><td>4-9</td><td>2-3</td><td>6-8</td><td align="right">0</td><td>3</td><td>4</td><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>2</td><td>1</td><td>16</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Lamar Odom, F</td><td>20</td><td>1-4</td><td>0-2</td><td>2-2</td><td align="right">0</td><td>3</td><td>2</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>4</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Vladimir Radmanovic, PF</td><td>12</td><td>1-2</td><td>0-0</td><td>2-2</td><td align="right">0</td><td>2</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>2</td><td>4</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Andrew Bynum, C</td><td>11</td><td>4-6</td><td>0-0</td><td>1-1</td><td align="right">1</td><td>4</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>3</td><td>9</td></tr><tr class="xb" align="right" bgcolor="#cccccc"> <td align="left">*BENCH*</td> <td width="5%">*MIN*</td> <td nowrap="nowrap" width="7%">*FGM-A*</td> <td width="7%">*3PM-A*</td> <td width="7%">*FTM-A*</td> <td width="6%">*OREB*</td> <td width="6%">*REB*</td> <td width="6%">*AST*</td> <td width="6%">*STL*</td> <td width="6%">*BLK*</td> <td width="6%">*TO*</td> <td width="6%">*PF*</td> <td width="6%">*PTS*</td> </tr> <tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Maurice Evans, SG</td><td>11</td><td>1-2</td><td>0-1</td><td>2-3</td><td align="right">0</td><td>1</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>4</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Shammond Williams, PG</td><td>4</td><td>0-0</td><td>0-0</td><td>0-0</td><td align="right">0</td><td>1</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Jordan Farmar, G</td><td>2</td><td>0-1</td><td>0-0</td><td>0-0</td><td align="right">0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Sasha Vujacic, G</td><td>1</td><td>0-1</td><td>0-1</td><td>0-0</td><td align="right">0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Ronny Turiaf, F</td><td>12</td><td>2-2</td><td>0-0</td><td>2-2</td><td align="right">1</td><td>6</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>2</td><td>6</td></tr><tr class="xb" align="right" bgcolor="#cccccc"><td colspan="2" align="left">*TOTALS*</td><td nowrap="nowrap">*FGM-A*</td><td>*3PM-A*</td><td>*FTM-A*</td><td>*OREB*</td><td>*REB*</td><td>*AST*</td><td>*STL*</td><td>*BLK*</td><td>*TO*</td><td>*PF*</td><td>*PTS*</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec"><td colspan="2" align="left">
 </td><td>19-39</td><td>3-11</td><td>16-19</td><td>2</td><td>21</td><td>10</td><td>2</td><td>1</td><td>3</td><td>10</td><td>57</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff"><td colspan="2" align="left">
 </td><td>*48.7%*</td><td>*27.3%*</td><td>*84.2%*</td><td colspan="8">Team TO (pts off): 3 (4)</td></tr><tr bgcolor="#ffffff"><td colspan="13"> 
</td></tr><tr> <td colspan="13" class="head" align="center" bgcolor="#006532">*BOSTON CELTICS*</td> </tr> <tr class="xb" align="right" bgcolor="#cccccc"> <td align="left">*STARTERS*</td> <td width="5%">*MIN*</td> <td nowrap="nowrap" width="7%">*FGM-A*</td> <td width="7%">*3PM-A*</td> <td width="7%">*FTM-A*</td> <td width="6%">*OREB*</td> <td width="6%">*REB*</td> <td width="6%">*AST*</td> <td width="6%">*STL*</td> <td width="6%">*BLK*</td> <td width="6%">*TO*</td> <td width="6%">*PF*</td> <td width="6%">*PTS*</td> </tr> <tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Gerald Green, GF</td><td>13</td><td>4-6</td><td>1-2</td><td>4-4</td><td align="right">0</td><td>2</td><td>2</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>3</td><td>13</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Delonte West, G</td><td>18</td><td>1-6</td><td>0-1</td><td>2-2</td><td align="right">0</td><td>2</td><td>5</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>2</td><td>2</td><td>4</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Ryan Gomes, F</td><td>15</td><td>5-8</td><td>0-0</td><td>2-2</td><td align="right">0</td><td>2</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>2</td><td>12</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Kendrick Perkins, FC</td><td>10</td><td>3-5</td><td>0-0</td><td>1-2</td><td align="right">1</td><td>2</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>7</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Al Jefferson, FC</td><td>21</td><td>1-6</td><td>0-0</td><td>1-4</td><td align="right">3</td><td>8</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>1</td><td>2</td><td>3</td></tr><tr class="xb" align="right" bgcolor="#cccccc"> <td align="left">*BENCH*</td> <td width="5%">*MIN*</td> <td nowrap="nowrap" width="7%">*FGM-A*</td> <td width="7%">*3PM-A*</td> <td width="7%">*FTM-A*</td> <td width="6%">*OREB*</td> <td width="6%">*REB*</td> <td width="6%">*AST*</td> <td width="6%">*STL*</td> <td width="6%">*BLK*</td> <td width="6%">*TO*</td> <td width="6%">*PF*</td> <td width="6%">*PTS*</td> </tr> <tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Rajon Rondo, G</td><td>13</td><td>1-4</td><td>0-0</td><td>0-0</td><td align="right">1</td><td>2</td><td>2</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>2</td><td>2</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Wally Szczerbiak, GF</td><td>11</td><td>0-2</td><td>0-0</td><td>2-2</td><td align="right">0</td><td>1</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>2</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff" valign="middle"> <td align="left" nowrap="nowrap">Brian Scalabrine, PF</td><td>12</td><td>2-3</td><td>2-3</td><td>0-0</td><td align="right">0</td><td>1</td><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>6</td></tr><tr class="xb" align="right" bgcolor="#cccccc"><td colspan="2" align="left">*TOTALS*</td><td nowrap="nowrap">*FGM-A*</td><td>*3PM-A*</td><td>*FTM-A*</td><td>*OREB*</td><td>*REB*</td><td>*AST*</td><td>*STL*</td><td>*BLK*</td><td>*TO*</td><td>*PF*</td><td>*PTS*</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ececec"><td colspan="2" align="left">
 </td><td>17-40</td><td>3-6</td><td>12-16</td><td>5</td><td>20</td><td>13</td><td>2</td><td>1</td><td>5</td><td>13</td><td>49</td></tr><tr align="right" bgcolor="#ffffff"><td colspan="2" align="left">
 </td><td>*42.5%*</td><td>*50.0%*</td><td>*75.0%*</td><td colspan="8">Team TO (pts off): 5 (7)</td></tr></tbody></table>


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

it seems to me that the lakers r just toying with us for now...kobe has made multiple behind the back no look passes...when the lakers feel like playing in the 4th quarter they will win this game by 10+...kinda like the wizards game the other night


----------



## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

What did Wally do?


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

kobe just hit a 35 foot 3 like it was nothing


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

Hibachi! said:


> What did Wally do?


Tried to prevent an easy layup and grounded a Laker. He didn't mean it, he probably thought he couldn't do it, anyway.

The Celtics hold for the last shot of the quarter, Wally loses the ball and Kobe gets a 3 at the buzzer five feet from the 3 point line. Talk about a 200% turnaround.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

Veal with his Celtic-career high and matched his total for total points last season, I believe.

17 for Veal, he'll make a good role player next season.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

kobe could have been doin this all game long if he wanted to but he was just playin around out there for 3 and a half quarters


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

**** the Lakers, up by 10 with a minute left - chuckimg up 3's.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

kobe took the night off and still dropped 43 points with a near triple double...



check out the look of dissappointment on gerald and all of these kids faces...great experience that they r getting!!!


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

Causeway said:


> **** the Lakers, up by 10 with a minute left - chuckimg up 3's.



this isnt football...u cant take knees...u can run the shot clock down til the end but u still have to take shots...i have no problem with them taking 3s...tmac scored 13 pts in 35 seconds once so technically the game was still not over


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

This Kobe character is quite good.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> kobe took the night off and still dropped 43 points with a near triple double...
> 
> 
> 
> check out the look of dissappointment on gerald and all of these kids faces...great experience that they r getting!!!


Gerald sitting on the bench and giggling like a school girl will not make him any better.

He's going through his lows...just like every wing in his career.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

Give a break - the game was clearly over. We did not have a TMac on the floor. Kobe does not need to be on the floor taking a 3 to pad his stats. That's bush league.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

kobe was on the bench when the lakers were up by double digits in the 4th...then the celts made a semi-comeback and brought it to what 4 or 5??...thats when kobe came back in and made sure that everyone knew they were gonna win the game...again i have no problem with it...if gerald can do windmill dunks against the raptors with 4 seconds left up by 8 then kobe can hit 3s when the game is out of reach


----------



## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

aquaitious said:


> This Kobe character is quite good.


haha...good game guys...seriously im not just saying that because we won and im happy...the celts are a work in progress.and adding a few pieces in the draft wont hurt em...again good game


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

Green is 15. Kobe is a vet. Not the same.


----------



## BostonBasketball (Jan 10, 2005)

I may not like Kobe, but he is an amazing player. He made 43 points look easy. Didn't he only take like 1, maybe 2 shots in the 1st quarter. Wow.

It was nice to see Gerald bounce back after a string of bad games...he shouldn't get too down on himself.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

sounds like a double standard to me...


and again kobe would have been planted on the bench for the rest of the game had the celtics not come back to make it a 4 or 5 pt defecit...u cant expect for the lakers to not bring him back in and feed him the ball every time...and againnnn its not like peyton throwing 40 yrd passes in the 4th quarter up by 30 against the pats...in basketball u have to take shots before the shot clock goes off...thats all he did


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Good game guys...hopefully next time in LA, Pierce will be back...I was really looking forward to Kobe/Pierce, so hopefully next time.


----------



## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

you guys got quite a player in Green. When he gets some experience hes gonna be a handful.


----------



## jokeaward (May 22, 2003)

Nothing about the chant?


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

jokeaward said:


> Nothing about the chant?


If I was at the game and didn't disdain obnoxious crowd noise, I'd chant "Kobe" also.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

Premier said:


> If I was at the game and didn't disdain obnoxious crowd noise, I'd chant "Kobe" also.


Or M-V-P.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

Nash is MVP.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

Causeway said:


> Nash is MVP.


Where would the Lakers be without Kobe, where would the Suns be without Nash.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

aquaitious said:


> Where would the Lakers be without Kobe, where would the Suns be without Nash.




the suns with nash are title contending...the suns without nash are playoff contending


the lakers with kobe are playoff contending...the lakers without kobe arent in the playoffs


nash is the mvp


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

aquaitious said:


> Where would the Lakers be without Kobe, where would the Suns be without Nash.


Is that the definition of MVP? Then I guess Pierce is MVP.

What Nash does night in and night out in running that team is amazing.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> the suns with nash are title contending...the suns without nash are playoff contending
> 
> 
> the lakers with kobe are playoff contending...the lakers without kobe arent in the playoffs


Bingo. Lakers are a lottery team without Kobe, Suns make a pretty good playoff push.



Causeway said:


> Is that the definition of MVP? Then I guess Pierce is MVP.
> 
> What Nash does night in and night out in running that team is amazing.


The Celtics don't stand a chance of making the playoffs with Pierce, nevermind without.

I never questioned what Nash does.


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

The amount of disrespect that people show Dirk is truly awe-inspiring. Last year he carried a worse team to a better record, and further in the playoffs. Did he even finish in the top 3 for the MVP balloting? This year he's carrying a _much_ worse team further, and still not even an ounce of respect. There is _one_ MVP in this league, and it's Dirk. Hands down.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

aquaitious said:


> Bingo. Lakers are a lottery team without Kobe, Suns make a pretty good playoff push.



riiiiiiight so ur definition of a mvp is one that take a lottery team to the playoffs??? ok my definition of a mvp is one that takes a playoff team to a championship claibur team...guess we just disagree


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

ehmunro said:


> This year he's carrying a _much_ worse team further, and still not even an ounce of respect.



and if by much worse team u mean one with jason terry josh howard and devin harris then i would love my team to be as bad as that


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> and if by much worse team u mean one with jason terry josh howard and devin harris then i would love my team to be as bad as that


Gee, Jason Terry, Josh Howard, and Devin Harris, or Amare ****ing Stoudemire, Shawn Marion, Leandro Barbosa, Boris Diaw, and Raja Bell. Gee, that's a tough choice. But I think if I have to go with a surrounding cast, I'm going to pick the surrounding cast that has the two all-stars, especially when one of them is one of the best young big men in the NBA. Maybe it's just me, but having a Hall of Fame level center like Amare is just a _liiiitle_ better than having two nice players at the 2/3.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> riiiiiiight so ur definition of a mvp is one that take a lottery team to the playoffs??? ok my definition of a mvp is one that takes a playoff team to a championship claibur team...guess we just disagree


No, my definition of a MVP is the guy that's _More Valuable_ to his team.

Oh yeah...Dirk. He's a good fella.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

aquaitious said:


> No, my definition of a MVP is the guy that's _More Valuable_ to his team.




ok so as said before if this is your definition then pierce is definitely the MVP...the c's are what 2-25 without him??? at the suns and lakers would at least win games without nash and kobe...


in all seriousnesss ur saying a guy thats more valuable to his team...how that is not a guy that makes u a championship calibur team i have no idea...kobe is great but does not make the lakers a championship team




ehmunro said:


> Gee, Jason Terry, Josh Howard, and Devin Harris, or Amare ****ing Stoudemire, Shawn Marion, Leandro Barbosa, Boris Diaw, and Raja Bell


who the HELL are leandro barbosa, boris diaw and raja bell???...diaw couldnt get minutes in ATLANTA, raja bell has been through more teams than is almost humanly possible because he is good but just not good enough to keep, and barbosa is a good nba pg nothing special...put these guys with steve nash and they become EXPONENTIALLY better...the reason why you can put them in your statement IS STEVE NASH...theres a reason that when quentin richardson is with the suns he leads the nba in 3 pters made and is a threat every night but when he goes to ny and plays with a pg like marbury he struggles to average 10 ppg...its because nash makes mediocre players good, good players great and great players superstars...thats why he is the mvp


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> who the HELL are leandro barbosa, boris diaw and raja bell???...diaw couldnt get minutes in ATLANTA,


Because he can't shoot treys, and Woodson's offense resembles O'Brien's offense. He got loads of minutes under Terry Stotts, who didn't need him to shoot. When Mike Woodson came to town Diaw had to progress as a shooter, and he didn't (he still isn't really much of a shooter). In D'Antoni's offensive set, Diaw isn't asked to space the floor, but attack the rim and be the secondary offensive initiator, things he does well. Steve N ash didn't _make Diaw_, the offensive system was more suited to Diaw's talents.



#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> raja bell has been through more teams than is almost humanly possible because he is good but just not good enough to keep,


I see, so what you're saying is that two years ago, it wasn't that Bell played well, but the aaaaawesooooome pointguardness of All-NBAers Keith McLeod and Howard Eisley that made him what he was? 



#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> and barbosa is a good nba pg nothing special


Barbosa is instant offense off the bench. Always has been. Even as a rookie before Nash. He isn't much of a point guard, though. That responsibility falls to Diaw when Nash isn't on the floor. Barbosa's out there because he can get to the rack at will and he can shoot the long ball.



#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> ...put these guys with steve nash and they become EXPONENTIALLY better.


Yes, because Amare Stoudemire was a scrub heading for a career of mediocrity until Steve Nash saved him. :lol: 



#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> theres a reason that when quentin richardson is with the suns he leads the nba in 3 pters made and is a threat every night but when he goes to ny and plays with a pg like marbury he struggles to average 10 ppg


Yes, and it's because he injured his back in Phoenix. Or haven't you noticed that he struggles to get to the rim these days? When the defender doesn't have to worry so much about you getting to the rim, they can challenge the jumper harder. And, ahem, what about Joe Johnson? He seems to have got a whole lot better away from Nash, so why haven't you told us that Nash made JJ worse?


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

That makes a lot of sense. Let's see. According to HoopsBoston's finest (home of "The Penis Sandwich" and other highly anticipated articles), the Celtics young players stats are inflated because we are a bad team, and so other teams don't try as hard. Joe Johnson is on a much much worse team than he was with the Suns, and almost as bad as the Celtics, yet his stats show he is better when not playing with Nash?

Ok.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> ok so as said before if this is your definition then pierce is definitely the MVP...the c's are what 2-25 without him??? at the suns and lakers would at least win games without nash and kobe...
> 
> 
> in all seriousnesss ur saying a guy thats more valuable to his team...how that is not a guy that makes u a championship calibur team i have no idea...kobe is great but does not make the lakers a championship team


The Lakers lost in a seven game series to the Suns last year. I don't see what makes the Suns anymore of a "championship caliber" team if they barely took out a inferior Laker team.

As I've mentioned earlier, Celtics without Pierce = no playoffs, Celtics with Pierce = no playoffs.

Here's a better definition of MVP, your team exceeds expectations and you lead your team to the playoffs.





#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> who the HELL are leandro barbosa, boris diaw and raja bell???...diaw couldnt get minutes in ATLANTA, raja bell has been through more teams than is almost humanly possible because he is good but just not good enough to keep, and *barbosa is a good nba pg nothing special*...put these guys with steve nash and they become EXPONENTIALLY better...the reason why you can put them in your statement IS STEVE NASH...theres a reason that when quentin richardson is with the suns he leads the nba in 3 pters made and is a threat every night but when he goes to ny and plays with a pg like marbury he struggles to average 10 ppg...its because nash makes mediocre players good, good players great and great players superstars...thats why he is the mvp


Diaw averaged 13-7 and 6 last year. I do understand Nash making his scoring better, but how does Nash make him average 7 rebounds and 6 assists?

Barbosa's nothing special? Where have you been hiding? I'd take Barbosa over anyone on the Celtics 1/2 roster except for Pierce.

Steve Nash is a great player, much deserved of both his MVP's, but the Suns have a top team in the NBA with or without Nash.


----------



## pokpok (Jul 26, 2005)

wat about putting steve nash on the celtics team instead of paul pierce??? oOOoOOhhh


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

bump...

if the last 3 suns games dont prove nash is the mvp then i dont know what will...suns lost to the bulls and hawks and it took overtime for them to beat the blazers...the suns are nothing without nash


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

Using that criteria Paul Pierce becomes the MVP. Check out the Celtbecks winning percentage without him


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

Yes, the Celtics with Pierce are a team that will go deep in the playoffs with a real shot at a title. Just like the Suns with Nash. Pierce for MVP.


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

I'm fairly convinced that Dirk is more worthy than Nash, simply because the Mavericks are the best team in the league and Dirk's supporting cast is much less talented than Nash's supporting cast. Plus, Dirk has equal or even better individual numbers and is a better defender than Nash.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

Premier said:


> Dirk's supporting cast is much less talented than Nash's supporting cast.



i still dont understand this arguement! the reason why nash's supporting cast is "so talented" IS NASH...you are using it as a negative that nash makes the players around him better...shawn "all star" marion has only averaged 11 ppg since nash has been out....but i guess thats just a coincidence right?? u know its not like dirk has any other all stars on his team...wait josh howard is a monster averaging 20 and 7 and jason terry is averaging 16 and 6


----------



## P-Dub34 (May 19, 2005)

> shawn "all star" marion has only averaged 11 ppg since nash has been out....but i guess thats just a coincidence right??


Shawn "All Star" Marion averaged 21 a game before Nash arrived on the scene. But I guess that's just a coincidence, right? We should obviously write off the years of consistent production that Marion gave without Nash for three or four games.

I like you, AWF, but that could've been the dumbest point you've ever tried to make.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

P-Dub34 said:


> Shawn "All Star" Marion averaged 21 a game before Nash arrived on the scene. But I guess that's just a coincidence, right? We should obviously write off the years of consistent production that Marion gave without Nash for three or four games.
> 
> I like you, AWF, but that could've been the dumbest point you've ever tried to make.



hahaha i like u too pdub but listen to my reasoning before u call it dumb...before nash got on the scene marion had to work much harder to dominate the game like he does most of the time...now he is used to having nash give him the ball right where he needs it and he has been used to that for years...take that away from him and its much harder for him to play like he once did before he had nash...lets say you jogged to work every day for 2 or 3 years then you got a car for 2 years and stopped jogging...if your car breaks down do u think it would be so easy just to start jogging again??? no because you are no longer used to it


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> i still dont understand this arguement! the reason why nash's supporting cast is "so talented" IS NASH...you are using it as a negative that nash makes the players around him better...shawn "all star" marion has only averaged 11 ppg since nash has been out....but i guess thats just a coincidence right?? u know its not like dirk has any other all stars on his team...wait josh howard is a monster averaging 20 and 7 and jason terry is averaging 16 and 6


Yes, one can see that Amare Stoudemire was a scrub on his way out of the NBA before Steve Nash "saved" him. Problem is, now that Nash is out of the lineup, Amare's averaging 30.3 p/g. Using what passes for logic in your weird little world, that means that Steve Nash was making Amare worse. At which point we have to ask ourselves why he's MVP-worthy since he's obviously holding the big guy back.


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

Wait, Leandro Barbosa's averaging 20 p/g and Raja Bell's averaging 18, Nash is making them worse too!


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

ehmunro said:


> Wait, Leandro Barbosa's averaging 20 p/g and Raja Bell's averaging 18, Nash is making them worse too!



yes, eh...and despite this boost in numbers for all these players THEY ARE LOSING GAMES...if EVERY player boosts their scoring without nash and they lose games it means absolutely nothing...nash makes that team go...and in the case of amare look at his numbers when marbury was his pg and look at them when nash was his pg...yes, nash makes him and the rest of them worse


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Take away a team's best player and most teams will lose, but over an entire season a Nash-less Suns have a much better record than a Dirk-less Mavericks.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

Can't wait to see how the Nash-bashers spin this one: Suns promptly lose three in a row without him and fall to 4-12 over the past three seasons when he's injured.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

Causeway said:


> Can't wait to see how the Nash-bashers spin this one: Suns promptly lose three in a row without him and fall to 4-12 over the past three seasons when he's injured.



bravo causeway...seems like that star studded cast filled with raja bell and boris diaw doesnt really fare well without (mvp) nash


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

"Two-time MVP Steve Nash had 13 points and 12 assists in his return, and Shawn Marion scored 31 points in the Phoenix Suns' 115-90 rout of the Los Angeles Clippers on Tuesday night."


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

Nash: 32-16-8 in a win

Dirk: 30-16-6 in a loss

Jerry Stackhouse and his 33 pts, Jason terry and his 27-5-5-4 and Howard and his 19-9 say hello to those who say dirk doesnt have a team

even if dirk was leading before tonight nash just pulled ahead in the run for the mvp


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> Nash: 32-16-8 in a win
> 
> Dirk: 30-16-6 in a loss
> 
> ...


Well that one game settles it. If Stackhouse, Terry and Howard can blow up once in a lifetime at the same time, it must mean Nash is MVP and Dirk has a great team round him!


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

And poor, Nash. Zero help from Amare & Marion...


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

aquaitious said:


> Well that one game settles it. If Stackhouse, Terry and Howard can blow up once in a lifetime at the same time, it must mean Nash is MVP and Dirk has a great team round him!



once in a lifetime??? it happens regularly...




> And poor, Nash. Zero help from Amare & Marion...


i never said that nash didnt have a team around him...he does...everyone claims that dirk doenst have a team around him...so whatever point ur trying to make doesnt really matter cuz i never claimed anything about nash not having a team


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> once in a lifetime??? it happens regularly...


Are you sure? I see Stackhouse, Terry and Howard average 12 points; 16-5; and 19 and 7 regularly, not the insane numbers posted above.






#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> i never said that nash didnt have a team around him...he does...everyone claims that dirk doenst have a team around him...so whatever point ur trying to make doesnt really matter cuz i never claimed anything about nash not having a team


No one said Dirk doesn't have _a_ team, everyone did say that Nash has a _better_ team. There's no denying that both teams are very good, but Dallas without Dirk is a lottery pick, Phoenix without Nash is a top five seed in the West.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

aquaitious said:


> Dallas without Dirk is a lottery pick, Phoenix without Nash is a top five seed in the West.




phoenix without nash is 4-12 in the last few years...hardly a top 5 seed in the west


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Usually when you take a team's best player away and don't give the team time to adjust, they lose often.


----------

