# Since everyone is calling for Dwayne Wade's head...



## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

...where do you think his trade value currently stands? He's currently 30 years old with 2 more guaranteed years left on his deal with two more years after that which he will almost surely opt into. Most people still consider him a top 5 player in the league when healthy, but he's missed between 5 and 31 games every single year of his career thusfar.

I'm thinking something like this trade might make some sense for both teams:

Dwayne Wade
Dexter Pittman (as cap filler)

for

Kevin Martin
Patrick Patterson
Sam Dalembert
#14 overall pick 2012
#16 overall pick 2012

Does that reflect his value adequately?


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## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

Wade/M Miller/Pittman/Curry/Haslem for DHo and Hedo.


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

This is another crazy one that actually redefines all three teams:

*Heat trade*: Dwayne Wade, Joel Anthony
*Heat receive*: Josh Smith, Jeff Teague, MarShon Brooks, 2012 23rd overall pick

The Heat do this to shake things up pretty drastically. They get two high potential guards and a pick that has the chance to make their roster as well as a dose of defense, versatility, and toughness.

*Nets trade*: Deron Williams (agrees to extension), Gerald Wallace (agrees to extension), MarShon Brooks
*Nets receive*: Joe Johnson, Al Horford, 2014 First (from ATL)

The Nets do this so that they are not completely left in the cold when their two best players opt out to test free agency. This move puts Al back in his natural PF position next to a good back-to-the-basket guy in Lopez. Not a bad haul for them considering how bad it might really turn out.

*Hawks trade*: Joe Johnson, Al Horford, Josh Smith, Jeff Teague, 2012 23rd overall, 2014 first
*Hawks receive*: Deron Williams, Dwayne Wade, Gerald Wallace, Joel Anthony

The Hawks really shuffle the deck here. They completely overall their roster which was clearly heading nowhere. They reunite back-to-back first round picks Marvin and Deron Williams.


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## BlakeJesus (Feb 1, 2006)

D Will and D Wade on the Hawks? Make it happen!


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

BlakeJesus said:


> D Will and D Wade on the Hawks? Make it happen!


I think their games would compliment each other well.


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## TheAnswer (Jun 19, 2011)

I never usually do possible trade scenarios, but what about something centered around a Deron Williams/DWade swap? Obviously it wouldn't be done straight up, but like adding players/picks etc.


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## Game3525 (Aug 14, 2008)

I don't think D-Wade has much value.

30 year old guards who make a living at the rim and appear to be on the decline isn't going to fetch much.

If they lose, the Heat should really explore a Dwight/Lebron swap, that deal honestly makes sense for both parties involved.


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## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

RollWithEm said:


> ...where do you think his trade value currently stands? He's currently 30 years old with 2 more guaranteed years left on his deal with two more years after that which he will almost surely opt into. Most people still consider him a top 5 player in the league when healthy, but he's missed between 5 and 31 games every single year of his career thusfar.
> 
> I'm thinking something like this trade might make some sense for both teams:
> 
> ...


That's a pretty good deal for the Heat, considering that's more than Wade's worth and it fills both their major needs (reliable shooting and rebounding). Doesn't make the Rockets contenders but it should assure them a playoff spot for a few years and put some butts in seats.


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## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

Game3525 said:


> I don't think D-Wade has much value.
> 
> 30 year old guards who make a living at the rim and appear to be on the decline isn't going to fetch much.
> 
> If they lose, the Heat should really explore a Dwight/Lebron swap, that deal honestly makes sense for both parties involved.


Trading LeBron makes no sense. He's their best player and still in his prime, unlike Wade.


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

Floods said:


> That's a pretty good deal for the Heat, considering that's more than Wade's worth and it fills both their major needs (reliable shooting and rebounding). Doesn't make the Rockets contenders but it should assure them a playoff spot for a few years and put some butts in seats.


Rockets would look like this after the deal:

PG Kyle Lowry
SG Dwayne Wade
SF Chandler Parsons
PF Luis Scola
C Marcus Camby
-----------------------------
G Courtney Lee
F Chase Budinger
F Marcus Morris

They would then just need to retain Dragic and Terrence Williams while going after a couple of bench bigs with their MLE. Maybe a Carl Landry/Jordan Hill combo might make some sense. I think that makes them fringe contenders. For instance, I think they would beat the Clippers in a 7-game series if LAC remains basically the same.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

Wade for Ray Allen, Doc Rivers(S+T), and Greg Stiemsma. Let Doc coach in warm-ups.


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## AirJay (Aug 5, 2005)

I posted this in the Heat forum:

As much as I hate watching this Heat team (compared to even worse versions, like 2007 and 2009, and as much as Wade as acted like a diva, is there no loyalty in sports?

The guy is a Heat lifer. He won us a championship. He stuck with the Heat through 3 terrible teams (2008-2010) without asking for a trade and playing his heart out (remember the back-to-back triple OT games against the Bulls and the Jazz? The Game 4 against Boston?). He recruited LBJ and Bosh here.

Now we want to kick him out because guess what, it's not working out and he's getting older?

I mean I want to win a championship as much as anybody, and I know Wade is the most logical piece to go, but it saddens me that winning really is everything to some fans. This would be like calling for Riley to trade Zo when he was diagnosed with his kidney ailment. It's sort of disgusting.



The above being said if I take my Heat glasses off and look purely objectively any of the above trades make the Heat better. But I'm guessing that Wade's trade value is not very high right now and other teams are not lining up to help Pat Riley out. The biggest problem with this Heat team has not been Wade and Lebron's incompatibility or even Chris Bosh's injury, the biggest problem is that Riley went all in on a supporting cast without any home runs (Chalmers has worked out ok, but Haslem Miller Battier Anthony are abysmal). This Heat team in all honesty with Bosh hurt and Wade sucking is probably worse than Lebron's peak Cavalier teams if you look at pure individual performance and not reputation.


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## Ronnie (May 18, 2012)

With out the DWhistle, Shaq and Riley on the bench, Wade is either injury prone or a baby crying over getting owned by better teams.


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## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

To original proposal:

How about 3-way deal?

#14 and #16 to Sacra Kings Evans


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

why is this on the playoff board?

Wade still has one of the 7 best trade values in the league. It's like last year when people were claiming gasol was a scrub after his playoffs and then Houston traded 3 above average starters and dragic for him. Or two years ago when joe Johnson tanked it and then got 120 million.

Fans are fickle, gms are smart.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

It doesn't matter because he's not getting traded.


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## doctordrizzay (May 10, 2011)

Jamel Irief said:


> why is this on the playoff board?
> 
> Wade still has one of the 7 best trade values in the league. It's like last year when people were claiming gasol was a scrub after his playoffs and then Houston traded 3 above average starters and dragic for him. Or two years ago when joe Johnson tanked it and then got 120 million.
> 
> Fans are fickle, gms are smart.


giving Joe Johnson a max 120 Mill contract was smart???


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

:yesyesyes:


doctordrizzay said:


> giving Joe Johnson a max 120 Mill contract was smart???


Hey! You stopped hiding!


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

NBA insider Stephen A. Smith is reporting that Pat Riley will not be adverse to trading one of the big three this off season if the Heat lose in the second round to the Pacers. Brian Windhorst has also been on ESPN speculating that if this was to happen, Wade would be traded, and the 3x MVP and their only decent big man Bosh would be kept on the Heat roster. Plus take into consideration the dynamic of the new NBA contract structure that will take effect next season, and trying to keep the big three and build a strong supporting cast around them. And add to the fact the Heat don't have any draft picks. 

To me if the Heat lose again this post season, it's obviously a flawed team. Wade and James are just to similar. And of the reasons up above it' only makes sense that Wade would get traded out of the big three.


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## AirJay (Aug 5, 2005)

Yeah you trade this guy :jester:


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

AirJay said:


> Yeah you trade this guy :jester:


Crowning yourself champions after one game?

That's whats really funny.


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## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

AirJay said:


> Yeah you trade this guy :jester:


Yeah, you do. If the right deal presents itself.


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## AirJay (Aug 5, 2005)

R-Star said:


> Crowning yourself champions after one game?
> 
> That's whats really funny.


When did I say they are going to win the title? They barely won this game with Lebron and Wade going gangbusters. Vogel made a huge tactical mistake by not putting West and Hibbert out earlier, even with 4 fouls each you can't sit them until the 6 minute mark of the 4th. The Heat will probably sneak this in 7, stumble past Boston/Philly and then got floored by SA/OKC.



Floods said:


> Yeah, you do. If the right deal presents itself.


Is there any loyalty in sports anymore? Sorry unlike some fans winning isn't everything to me. My favorite Heat team is the 2003-2004 version, not the 2005-2006 version for a reason.


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## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

AirJay said:


> Is there any loyalty in sports anymore?


Not when it goes against what's good for the team.



> Sorry unlike some fans winning isn't everything to me.


I don't care.



> My favorite Heat team is the 2003-2004 version, not the 2005-2006 version for a reason.


I don't care.


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## AirJay (Aug 5, 2005)

Floods said:


> Not when it goes against what's good for the team.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well then we watch sports and root for teams for different reasons my friend. No reason to continue this discussion.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

AirJay said:


> Well then we watch sports and root for teams for different reasons my friend. No reason to continue this discussion.


I like your take, and I agree. You and I are a dying breed though.

Wade was there first. Wade helped win them a title. Wade has been there his whole career.

He deserves the teams loyalty if hes been giving it back to them all these years.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

There is no loyalty :favre:






































See what I did there?


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## AirJay (Aug 5, 2005)

R-Star said:


> I like your take, and I agree. You and I are a dying breed though.
> 
> Wade was there first. Wade helped win them a title. Wade has been there his whole career.
> 
> He deserves the teams loyalty if hes been giving it back to them all these years.


Thank you.

There is some loyalty in sports. Look at Paul Pierce in Boston, Tim Duncan in San Antonio, Steve Nash in Phoenix.

If nothing else Wade deserves loyalty for being a good solider in the post-Shaq years when his supporting cast was worse than Lebron's in Cleveland and he carried them into two profitable playoff series. Seriously I went to several games in 2008-2010, besides rooting for your team the only thing worth seeing was the effort and intensity of Dwyane Wade.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Pierce, Duncan and Nash are all still very good players though. 

Look at Chris Webber, Allen Iverson, Jermaine O'Neal off the top of my head. If you stop performing to a certain level you're expendable.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> Pierce, Duncan and Nash are all still very good players though.
> 
> Look at Chris Webber, Allen Iverson, Jermaine O'Neal off the top of my head


JO wanted out though. AI was constantly at odds with his coach. I don't quite remember the CWebb situation.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

> If you stop performing to a certain level you're expendable.


Undeniable


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Deniable. Duncan has been up and down for a while. San Antonio hasn't tired to drop him. There's plenty of examples.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

They were 1st in the West last year and could legit win the title this year, we had this discussion before. He didn't fall far enough off to where he was a liability and they needed to rebuild. Loyalty has 0% to do with why he's still in San Antonio, he's there because he's still a good player even at an advanced age.

You can twist it to say the core trio plays better than the sum of their abilities together and management knows this and kept them together, but exclusive "loyalty" in the sense of a man and his trusty ball cap or some shit is just naive in the sports world. It does not happen.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> They were 1st in the West last year and could legit win the title this year, we had this discussion before. He didn't fall far enough off to where he was a liability and they needed to rebuild. Loyalty has 0% to do with why he's still in San Antonio, he's there because he's still a good player even at an advanced age.
> 
> You can twist it to say the core trio plays better than the sum of their abilities together and management knows this and kept them together, but exclusive "loyalty" in the sense of a man and his trusty ball cap or some shit is just naive in the sports world. It does not happen.


Then the Lakers should dump Kobe this offseason no?


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Yes, that's *exactly* what I'm saying R-Star


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> Yes, that's *exactly* what I'm saying R-Star


He's declining, doesn't look like can lead a team to a championship anymore. 

What exactly are you saying?


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## AirJay (Aug 5, 2005)

That's a ridiculous argument. Pierce and Duncan are retiring with their current teams. Wade is still a very good player as well, so how is it different? He isn't 40 year-old Brett Favre trying to hang on 2 seasons too long


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Reggie stayed his whole career with the Pacers. They could have traded him for a nice return in his last 3-4 years in the league.

They didn't. Because of loyalty.

Also, we've done this before Dre. What's your take on Jeff Foster? Loyalty.


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## 29380 (Feb 23, 2009)

R-Star said:


> Reggie stayed his whole career with the Pacers. *They could have traded him for a nice return in his last 3-4 years in the league.*


Like what?

The most you could get for a past his prime guard in his late 30s is a second round pick from a contender.


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## AirJay (Aug 5, 2005)

R-Star said:


> Reggie stayed his whole career with the Pacers. They could have traded him for a nice return in his last 3-4 years in the league.
> 
> They didn't. Because of loyalty.
> 
> Also, we've done this before Dre. What's your take on Jeff Foster? Loyalty.


QFT

I would be disappointed in Arison and Riley if Wade and Haslem don't retire in Heat jerseys


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Knicks4life said:


> Like what?
> 
> The most you could get for a past his prime guard in his late 30s is a second round pick from a contender.


What? Not a ****ing chance. You think back then the Kings, Blazers, Spurs, etc wouldn't have traded more than a 2nd for Reggie?

That's not even close to being true.


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## 29380 (Feb 23, 2009)

R-Star said:


> What? Not a ****ing chance. You think back then the Kings, Blazers, Spurs, etc wouldn't have traded more than a 2nd for Reggie?
> 
> That's not even close to being true.


No team would give anything of value for 36-37 year old guard, at most he could bring back an expiring contract or a 2nd round pick.


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## AirJay (Aug 5, 2005)

Knicks4life said:


> No team would give anything of value for 36-37 year old guard, at most he could bring back an expiring contract or a 2nd round pick.


I think a contender like Sacramento would have happily parted with a 1st round pick to be able to put Reggie on the floor with Webber, Bibby, Divac, Turkoglue, and Stojakovic


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

That's not a "nice return".


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

R-Star said:


> He's declining, doesn't look like can lead a team to a championship anymore.
> 
> What exactly are you saying?


He's still a top 10 ****ing player and the Lakers should be top 5 in the West for the next 2-3 years, so there's no reason to trade him.

It's not like anyone is taking that contract anyway, there's nothing you can get for him that's better than just keeping him and riding him out at this point

But don't think the Busses are in there thinking "we have to stay loyal" to Kobe...because how loyal to them was he when he wanted to be traded if they didn't field a winner?

And you want to talk about JO wanting out, how loyal was he to them? Is it not a two way street?

And again who cares about Jeff Foster taking the last seat on the bench, talk to me if he was putting up that production making 13M a year. How loyal would they be then


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## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

Knicks4life said:


> No team would give anything of value for 36-37 year old guard, at most he could bring back an expiring contract or a 2nd round pick.


Did you read the Ray Allen trade rumors earlier this year?


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

I think they said they actually traded him for Mayo but there was some kind of snag and it died


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Since we're talking Celtics though, remember that thread earlier about Red talking to Ainge about the offers he was getting for the big 3 and Ainge was like "why didn't you do them"...the Celtics were mediocre for like 15 years thanks to loyalty....still think it's a good idea?

I mean we might watch the game for different reasons, but I watch it with the desire to see my team successful, not loyal and losing because of nostalgic clinging


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## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

Dre said:


> I think they said they actually traded him for Mayo but there was some kind of snag and it died





> According to a Yahoo! Sports report, the Celts had a deal in place that would have sent Ray Allen to the Memphis Grizzlies last month in exchange for O.J. Mayo and a draft pick.


LINK

My point being, Mayo and a pick isn't garbage and Ray Allen is about to turn 37 with his best days clearly behind him. Same situation.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

The Pacers weren't about to get anything for Reggie that was so impressive you had to dig for "loyalty" to reject. They didn't trade him because he was still an asset and nobody was about to give them anything worth more than what he meant to them oncourt.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

You know what, I'll backtrack even. A player's tenure and accomplishments with a franchise does factor into his value to an extent, but it's *never* the primary motive for keeping a player around. You can't say Duncan, Pierce, Kobe are still on their teams because their management was loyal, it's because they still have value oncourt.

Then you compound that with their value being worth more than any realistic trade they could be offered and their you go.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> He's still a top 10 ****ing player and the Lakers should be top 5 in the West for the next 2-3 years, so there's no reason to trade him.
> 
> It's not like anyone is taking that contract anyway, there's nothing you can get for him that's better than just keeping him and riding him out at this point
> 
> ...


:laugh:

So the team was supposed to stay loyal to JO even though he asked to leave? 

And again :laugh: 

it only matters if the player is making a big contract? Foster got to play when he felt like it because he gave so much to the Pacers over the years. I'm sure they'll give him some sort of office job or broadcasting role like Croshere has now as well. That's loyalty. You have no clue what you're talking about.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> Since we're talking Celtics though, remember that thread earlier about Red talking to Ainge about the offers he was getting for the big 3 and Ainge was like "why didn't you do them"...*the Celtics were mediocre for like 15 years thanks to loyalty....still think it's a good idea?*
> 
> I mean we might watch the game for different reasons, but I watch it with the desire to see my team successful, not loyal and losing because of nostalgic clinging


So now loyalty does exist, but its a bad idea?

Look, pick what your argument really is and stick with it before proceeding.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> The Pacers weren't about to get anything for Reggie that was so impressive you had to dig for "loyalty" to reject. They didn't trade him because he was still an asset and nobody was about to give them anything worth more than what he meant to them oncourt.


Again, you have no clue what you're talking about. By that time JO was the leader and the Pacers were rebuilding around youth. OJ Mayo and a draft pick would have been something any sane team would jump on. But you don't trade a guy who's played his entire career as the face of your franchise in a situation like that.

And teams that do? They're the teams that never have a guy stay with them their entire career, because they know the front office will stab you in the back when they get their chance.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

I'm talking about him staying loyal to his team, hence "two way street", but I think you know that.

And no, you don't get kudos points for "loyalty" per this discussion when you're talking about some garbage man in garbage minutes. Let me see him be that same garbage man making max money and there would *be no *loyalty, and that's my point. 

You know damn well if Jeff Foster was making 13M "playing when he felt like it" you wouldn't be all nostalgic and proud of the "loyalty" of the situation.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> I'm talking about him staying loyal to his team, hence "two way street", but I think you know that.
> 
> And no, you don't get kudos points for "loyalty" per this discussion when you're talking about some garbage man in garbage minutes. Let me see him be that same garbage man making max money and there would *be no *loyalty, and that's my point.
> 
> You know damn well if Jeff Foster was making 13M "playing when he felt like it" you wouldn't be all nostalgic and proud of the "loyalty" of the situation.


What?

What the ****?

"Ok... lets assume he's the same player, but we're going to double his salary to help my side of the arguemnt!"

Ok Dre. Lets assume Wade makes 4 million a year then. For arguments sake. 

For **** sakes this is just ridiculous buddy. Of course if you take a role player and give him a max contract no ones going to want him.

Real keen ****ing insight on that one Dre.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

R-Star said:


> So now loyalty does exist, but its a bad idea?
> 
> Look, pick what your argument really is and stick with it before proceeding.


My point with that was loyalty is rightfully dead and went away with that old guard of management...once the league became big business, saw parity, and the cap situation became modernized that way of dealing was dead as evidenced by Auerbach's failure with trying to hold onto principles or whatever in the 90s.

Do you know how ****ing stupid Ainge would look if he was offered say Monta Ellis, David Lee and picks for Paul Pierce and didn't do it out of loyalty? What would you say in that thread R-Star, would you really be like you understood why he did it?



> Again, you have no clue what you're talking about. By that time JO was the leader and the Pacers were rebuilding around youth. OJ Mayo and a draft pick would have been something any sane team would jump on. But you don't trade a guy who's played his entire career as the face of your franchise in a situation like that.


A. We can't play pretend acting like we know if Walsh ever received anything similar to that for Miller, so why even discuss this. 

B. You don't? So why was Patrick Ewing traded for a declining Glen Rice and Luc Longley :2ti:


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

R-Star said:


> What?
> 
> What the ****?
> 
> ...


But what about Dwyane Wade putting up the production of a roleplayer making that kind of money, which is the crux of our discussion...star players, not some bum sitting on the end of the bench being the compass for what the Celtics should do with their big 3.

So again I ask, what if in 4 years when Wade is 36 or whatever and creaky and playing like crap making 15M a year, is it still "of course Pat Riley shouldn't want Wade"....or would that be disloyal?


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## 29380 (Feb 23, 2009)

Dre said:


> B. You don't? So why was Patrick Ewing traded for a declining Glen Rice and Luc Longley :2ti:


Because Scott Layden is a dumb ass and Ewing requested the trade.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

Everyone is going to do what is in their own best interest. Loyalty is for your wife and kids. If you can trade Wade and give yourself a better chance at the title that's what you do. I really don't see what you get for him which makes you better. Only way you get a decent return is if you trade for someone who's trying to force his way out of his current team.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> But what about Dwyane Wade putting up the production of a roleplayer making that kind of money, which is the crux of our discussion...star players, not some bum sitting on the end of the bench being the compass for what the Celtics should do with their big 3.
> 
> So again I ask, what if in 4 years when Wade is 36 or whatever and creaky and playing like crap making 15M a year, is it still "of course Pat Riley shouldn't want Wade"....or would that be disloyal?


So now we're only talking about loyalty with washed up stars?

So we're talking about Rashard Lewis type situations and that only?


Oh. Ok then....


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

lol you're ridiculous man


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> lol you're ridiculous man


How so? I bring up Foster, you say it only counts if he's making over twice what he was making.

We talk about star players making big contracts, you say it only matter is they aren't all that good anymore.


You went from saying loyalty doesn't exist, do saying it does but it didn't work for the Celtics, to wherever you're at now.

Please. Feel free to elaborate Dre.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

nah, I'll pass. You win.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> nah, I'll pass. You win.


:laugh:

Well that's pretty weak now isn't it?


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

:yep:


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> :yep:


If someone makes a good argument for your side of the debate I assume you'll come back in and coat tail it?


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Go away R-Star, it's over with


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## Standard (May 12, 2012)

I dont trade for any 30+ year old with a misspelled name


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> Go away R-Star, it's over with


Then quit posting if you're not going to continue with the debate you championed.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

I can do what I want just like you can. Don't tell me what to do I won't tell you.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dre said:


> I can do what I want just like you can. Don't tell me what to do I won't tell you.


You just told me to go away 1 post ago.

Are you the king of flip flopping your arguments tonight?


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

I think people bringing up the loyalty argument are missing the uniqueness of this Miami situation. They have 2 stars in their prime (one of which is the best player in basketball) even if they trade Wade. Most of the time teams trade a star for 75 cents on the dollar and never see immediate returns with their current roster.  Trading Wade for a package like the Houston one in the OP makes them considerably better in an instant despite the fact that they would no longer have 2 of the top 10 players on the planet. Look at what it took for Dallas to win last year and what the Spurs are doing this year. Expanding the number of quality role players on your roster is paramount to winning.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

The loyalty thing we just had had nothing to do with the Heat from my POV at least


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Dwyane Wade sucks dick.


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## BlakeJesus (Feb 1, 2006)

If he doesn't have an issue playing second fiddle to LeBron (especially at times like now where he doesn't seem to be 100%) than I like him a lot more as a player/teammate, but when he's trying to take over games and just letting everybody around him down I can't stand watching him play.


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

I still think trading him is a completely viable option... if Pat Riley truly doesn't care about the loyalty issue.


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## ~Styles~ (May 1, 2006)

I don't understand this whole no-trade for Wade issue. Is this purely because of the title 6 damn years ago?. I somewhat understand the loyalty if its a player coming to the end of his career ala Pierce with little trade value. Wades very much on the decline but he's a very tradeable asset still. Miami needs to win now. Move on from 06. Its not his team no more. No title this year i'm looking to trade this summer.


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## jericho (Jul 12, 2002)

Wade and Turiaf for Marc Gasol and Tony Allen?


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

They should trade Wade for a couple of good pieces. Then try to package a couple players and get a player like Wade. They'd be so good. 

They're a game away from the finals and they've been playing without an all-star big man who is probably top 20-25 in the league. They were a bad quarter or two away from winning a chip last year. This team is constructed fine. You don't press reset when you're knocking at the door every year. You just tweak. 

Wade needs to play better, but he is capable of that.


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

I don't think that Wade's capable of being a sidekick. And if Miami's going to win he absolutely needs to be "the other guy".


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

http://www.cbssports.com/columns/st...rned-into-whining-wade;-heat-are-paying-price

Article is exactly how I feel and how I've been calling Wade these playoffs.


I'm glad I'm not the only one seeing 19 point games are phony as shit. Chalmers and Battier were easily better players in last nights game than Wade.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

I'd like to come in to some sort of screaming defense for Dwyane, but honestly, that article was pretty spot on.

I love Dwyane. He's been one of my favourite players for so many years, which is why it sucks so bad to see him in this funk he's in. He's been in funks before but this is now what, 8 games straight where he has been below standard? Other than a few otherworldy games to finish off the Pacers, he has been pretty lacklustre the entire postseason. 

If this team is going to win a championship, they're gonna need huge contributions from Dwyane Wade - one of the top 5 players in the league - not this imposter.

Article sort of said it best. Stop whining. Stop flopping and flailing hoping for bail out calls. Get in the gym and hone your jumper. Get into the paint and create contact for free throws. Go look at the tape on how they're defending you and adjust.

You're too good to play like this for so long. Don't be the 2010-2011 Finals Lebron James....for the love of god....


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## Wade2Bosh (Mar 31, 2004)

I hate Greg Doyel with a passion, but he is spot on with that article.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

I like D Wade a lot, he's done a lot for Miami, and already proved what he could do in his prime. But it's clear he's on the downside now. I'm sure Pat Riley will have no problem trading Wade. Riley is there to bring in championships, he can see that Wade isn't the player he use to be, and that they need some more horses to fill his role. 

The question is who do you trade Wade for, because if you trade Wade, and don't ever get back to the Finals, you look even worse than losing in the Finals. 

I agree though, Wade should be traded, his game and James is to much alike IMO and over lap a lot also. They need another dynamic player next to James who isn't a carbon copy. Ray Allen and Steve Nash would be great on this Miami team next to James and Bosh.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

23AJ said:


> I like D Wade a lot, he's done a lot for Miami, and already proved what he could do in his prime. But it's clear he's on the downside now. I'm sure Pat Riley will have no problem trading Wade. Riley is there to bring in championships, he can see that Wade isn't the player he use to be, and that they need some more horses to fill his role.
> 
> The question is who do you trade Wade for, because if you trade Wade, and don't ever get back to the Finals, you look even worse than losing in the Finals.
> 
> I agree though, Wade should be traded, his game and James is to much alike IMO and over lap a lot also. They need another dynamic player next to James who isn't a carbon copy. Ray Allen and Steve Nash would be great on this Miami team next to James and Bosh.


For a guy who likes Wade a lot, you sure turned on him quick.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

R-Star said:


> For a guy who likes Wade a lot, you sure turned on him quick.


Actually it's not turning on Wade. It's being honest, his game has diminished, and if the Heat lose in the Finals again. It's a good idea to trade him. As you can see by my comments made last month in this thread, this isn't anything new. I can read the writing on the wall, as will the Heat brass. I think D Wade can find another team to finish his career out with, and make it a good closing chapter.

But this big three will have to change if they get taken out again. I don't think you can just sit on this after you see that' it's failing year after year. That's just crazy. Heat still have James and Bosh in their primes. And if you add a knock down SG and a great PG this team will be playing some great opened up fast break offensive basketball, as well as good half court ball with the better spacing.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

23AJ said:


> Actually it's not turning on Wade. It's being honest, his game has diminished, and if the Heat lose in the Finals again. It's a good idea to trade him. As you can see by my comments made last month in this thread, this isn't anything new. I can read the writing on the wall, as will the Heat brass. I think D Wade can find another team to finish his career out with, and make it a good closing chapter.
> 
> But this big three will have to change if they get taken out again. I don't think you can just sit on this after you see that' it's failing year after year. That's just crazy. Heat still have James and Bosh in their primes. And if you add a knock down SG and a great PG this team will be playing some great opened up fast break offensive basketball, as well as good half court ball with the better spacing.


That would be more acceptable if you're a Heat fan, but you supposedly aren't. Or are. I'm not sure. But last year Wade was your favorite player. Now you want his team to dump him for spare parts and move on. Doesn't sound like sticking by your favorite player to me.

When Reggie was in his last 30's and declining, and the Pacers were considered a contender, I wasn't crossing my fingers that the team would dump him and try to move in another direction. But we're kind of different in that aspect aren't we?


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

R-Star said:


> That would be more acceptable if you're a Heat fan, but you supposedly aren't. Or are. I'm not sure. But last year Wade was your favorite player. Now you want his team to dump him for spare parts and move on. Doesn't sound like sticking by your favorite player to me.
> 
> When Reggie was in his last 30's and declining, and the Pacers were considered a contender, I wasn't crossing my fingers that the team would dump him and try to move in another direction. But we're kind of different in that aspect aren't we?


I'm not looking at it from an emotional investment. However you are. I'm looking at it from an entertainment perspective. So, enjoy your hoops however you like R-star.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

23AJ said:


> I'm not looking at it from an emotional investment. However you are. I'm looking at it from an entertainment perspective. So, enjoy your hoops however you like R-star.


The Pacers keep me well entertained.

Please refrain from ever calling yourself a fan of any player or team in the future AJ. You can call yourself a fan of the game, which I'm sure you are, but of players or a team? Nah. Not even close.

Dwyane Wade was your absolute favorite player last year. You argued up and down with anyone who said Lebron was better, you argued when someone said he had a bad game, you were his #1 fan. Now he's slowed down, and KD is on his rise so guess what, now you're KD's #1 fan. Now you think Miami should throw Wade in the trash and hope to get some other parts. Its ridiculous yet it will never end. There will be a "Trade KD while he still has some value" thread by you in a few years once the new shinny superstar comes along and KD has a down year.

Cheering for #1 every year must be fun. I'd find it kind of bland though.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

R-Star said:


> The Pacers keep me well entertained.
> 
> Please refrain from ever calling yourself a fan of any player or team in the future AJ. You can call yourself a fan of the game, which I'm sure you are, but of players or a team? Nah. Not even close.
> 
> ...


Dwyane Wade is still one of my favorite players. But if dude isn't getting it done, it makes sense for the Heat to trade him, to get something of value for him before it's to late. This is NBA business 101. Hence everyone here talking about, but I get it you just want to be salty with me. (fine by me, i take no offense what so ever).

Secondly, I've been a fan of Durant since his Texas days, and followed him into the draft as it was between Portland and Seattle who would draft Durant or Oden. That being said KD is not my favorite player nor are the Thunder my favorite team. However I do enjoy watching their brand of basketball, and Durant is a rare once in a generation player, I like his moral compass, his humility, and over all work ethic. Much much more than a guy like LBJ, who's EGO and proclaimed greatness and championships were all for taken granted, but never earned. 

I believe Wade could be traded and flourish on another NBA team. I'm sure all the Heat fans here probably feel the same. 

And it' is fun for me to watch basketball the way I do. I already made that clear to you up above. 

Again enjoy your hoops the way you want R-star. And I'll do the same.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

23AJ said:


> Dwyane Wade is still one of my favorite players. But if dude isn't getting it done, it makes sense for the Heat to trade him, to get something of value for him before it's to late. This is NBA business 101. Hence everyone here talking about, but I get it you just want to be salty with me. (fine by me, i take no offense what so ever).
> 
> Secondly, I've been a fan of Durant since his Texas days, and followed him into the draft as it was between Portland and Seattle who would draft Durant or Oden. That being said KD is not my favorite player nor are the Thunder my favorite team. However I do enjoy watching their brand of basketball, and Durant is a rare once in a generation player, I like his moral compass, his humility, and over all work ethic. Much much more than a guy like LBJ, who's EGO and proclaimed greatness and championships were all for taken granted, but never earned.
> 
> ...


You have disarmed me with this post for the time being. Good timing, my relief will be here in 15 minutes.


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## BlackNRed (Feb 9, 2005)

Here's your trade.

Wade and Bosh for Dwight and Hedo.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Wade isn't even physically diminished he just looks like his heart isn't in it, like he's going through the motions. Perhaps the foul call thing is a part of it...I don't get it though


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## ~Styles~ (May 1, 2006)

I agree about going through the motions but he's definitely lost a bit of agility this season...whether its the knee thats bothering him and he can bounce back, I don't know. He looks to be bailing a lil on proper contact going up and still expecting to be bailed by the refs.


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## doctordrizzay (May 10, 2011)

Derrick Fisher is beating him to the rim...Derrick Fisher.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

That's a lie...like the lie you told when you said you had the Thunder in 4 or whatever it is you said.


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