# Bye, Doc? Rivers fired (merged)



## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

*Doc Rivers to be fired*

Doc Rivers will coach the Orlando Magic tonight against the Utah Jazz. Should the Magic lose again to see their streak grow to 10, Rivers could be listed as "doubtful" for Thursday night's game in Phoenix.

The Magic would have two off-days before facing the Suns, giving them time possibly to make a coaching change.

Although Magic Chief Operating Officer John Weisbrod declines to discuss Rivers' situation, sources indicate management has a short list of candidates at the ready. The Magic could fire Rivers and turn over the team to assistant Johnny Davis, who has head-coaching experience.

Davis coached the Philadelphia 76ers during the 1996-97 season.

Another Magic assistant, Dave Wohl, coached the New Jersey Nets from 1985-87 and led them to a playoff berth in 1986.

Or Weisbrod can let Rivers ride out the rest of this five-game West Coast swing. He can take into account how hamstrung Rivers has been by injuries and poor bench play that taxes weary starters.

"I don't know if I can do a better job, actually, with a group of guys that we have right now," Rivers said, wearing the stress and strain of losing on his face. "But we're still losing games.

"It's tough for me. It's tough for the players. It's tough for management. We put them [management] in a tough position because they have to look to see if we're doing a good job. I think we are."

Riding a nine-game losing streak, the Magic are short-handed because of injuries. But other sources say it may be time for players to hear a new voice, hoping a change can snap the club's longest losing streak since the 1991-92 season, when the Magic dropped 17 in a row.

Magic forward Drew Gooden came to Rivers' defense, saying, "It's not him. He's on the bench. He can only do so much.

"I hate it when teams are struggling. You don't look at what's going on, on the court; you look behind the scenes for an excuse. There's no way in this world this is all on Doc Rivers.


----------



## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Its not really Docs fault. It always puzzles me when they put it on the coach. They could put a high school team out there and lose all the games and they'd blame it on the coach somehow. 

I dont expect the Magic to start winning much more when hes gone. They may get a few wins just because of a "new start" type thing, but nothing permanent until they add some talent to their roster.


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

Hehe..Doc is the scapegoat... but technically, he isn't motivating them enough and doing what coaches are suppose to do by the way they are playing..the magic aren't making simple plays but instead making basic mistakes that are losing us the game.


----------



## Priest (Jun 24, 2003)

wow...they seem to forget the good things quickly


----------



## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

By putting a new coach in there, it's not saying it's Doc's fault, they're just hiring a new head coach they're sending a message to the players and getting a new voice in there to try and shake things up, because obviously whatever they're doing right now isn't working.


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rukahS capuT</b>!
> By putting a new coach in there, it's not saying it's Doc's fault, they're just hiring a new head coach they're sending a message to the players and getting a new voice in there to try and shake things up, because obviously whatever they're doing right now isn't working.


:yes:  :heart:


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Its not really Docs fault. It always puzzles me when they put it on the coach. They could put a high school team out there and lose all the games and they'd blame it on the coach somehow.
> 
> I dont expect the Magic to start winning much more when hes gone. They may get a few wins just because of a "new start" type thing, but nothing permanent until they add some talent to their roster.


Well, if the players have stopped listening to him and he can no longer fire them up, then he should be fired. In today's NBA, the coach's main job is to mesh egos and light fires under them. 

In a perfect world, none of it should be blamed on Doc, but in reality, there is really only one move the team can make at this point and that is to let him go.

Orlando does need more talent, at the same time, they definitely are not as bad as 1-9 ... someone has to take the blame for that.


----------



## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

> I dont expect the Magic to start winning much more when hes gone. They may get a few wins just because of a "new start" type thing, but nothing permanent until they add some talent to their roster.


More talent?

I am not sure how you upgrade from the talent level of Tracy McGrady who is arguably top 5, and unquestionably top 8 talent.

With Drew Gooden, Gorden Giricek, Juwan Howard as fine complementary players and Ty Lue and Pat Garrity as solid role players, the talent is there to be competitive in the East.

Just compare the talent of the Magic to the Jazz, Milwaukee, Toronto, Atlanta, Clippers, Golden State or the Knicks to see some talent poor rosters.

Orlando has two current problems. First, 2 of the top 6 players are out with injury, and they have little quality depth. Second, they have an unbalanced roster with no true center to even contribute bench minutes, and no decent PG. Letting Armstrong go was a mistake.

The rest has to fall on the players and the coach.


----------



## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

*Bye, Doc?*

Orlando Sentinel reported that if the Magic lost tonight, Rivers would lose his job. Magic lose a heartbreaker, 90-88... They now have a 10 game losing streak..

So.. bye Doc?


----------



## ToddMacCulloch11 (May 31, 2003)

I wouldn't be surprised to wake up tomorrow and read that headline


----------



## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Me either


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

*Re: Bye, Doc?*



> Originally posted by <b>Sovereignz</b>!
> Orlando Sentinel reported that if the Magic lost tonight, Rivers would lose his job. Magic lose a heartbreaker, 90-88... They now have a 10 game losing streak..
> 
> So.. bye Doc?


I don't think so.. he may or may not be forced to resign.. 

one more thing about the game... diles got fouled with 5 seconds to go in 4th magic down 2 and the refs didnt call it even though they were standing right next to him and were watching...go look at the replay.

magic pllayed good except for the lack of rebounds

if anyone is to blame...gabriel should have brought in a rebounder by now..a real center...

doc said "If you take a look at the past, w/o our second best player we made it to the playoffs for the past 3 years....and you look at what we have now, the past 10 games..." 

haha yeah..

i dont mind seeing doc go...but its a shame..


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

I think he'll get two more games, vs Phoenix and Sac-Town ... if Orlando lose both or one of those, I doubt he'll be making another appearance in Orlando.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

Everytime Orlando loses there is a problem with the officiating. EVERY TIME.


----------



## The MAgiC (Aug 3, 2003)

Yes. There is. We don't need your *edited: Don't be insulting* sarcasm about it. We have been screwed around with big time by the refs the last couple of games. That last shot in the Jazz game was a foul. But I'm sure it's not just us. The entire league needs new referees. Ones with eyes.


----------



## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Dee Bo</b>!
> Well, if the players have stopped listening to him and he can no longer fire them up, then he should be fired. In today's NBA, the coach's main job is to mesh egos and light fires under them.
> 
> In a perfect world, none of it should be blamed on Doc, but in reality, there is really only one move the team can make at this point and that is to let him go.
> ...


I can agree with that.


----------



## Mulk (Jun 25, 2002)

*Rivers Fired...*

Doc Fired early today. I know there are a few threads about Doc possibl being fired but here is the definitive story....


Rivers Fired 

Davis takes over for the rest of the season 

I think it was time Doc was fired to be honest, he doesn't have the X's and O's and he really couldn't motivate this team to play defense which has been his aim for the last 3 years. Also he has had as big an impact as Gabe in trading, drafting players and we all know how well that has gone.


----------



## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

*Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>Mulk</b>!
> Doc Fired early today. I know there are a few threads about Doc possibl being fired but here is the definitive story....
> 
> 
> ...


John Gabriel should be fired. This team doesn't have the talent to win. When Pat Garrit's and Giricek's injuries hurt your team then you were destined to bomb out. 

My guess: Doc Rivers will get back to the playoffs before the Magic.


----------



## Mulk (Jun 25, 2002)

*Re: Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>MemphisX</b>!
> 
> 
> John Gabriel should be fired. This team doesn't have the talent to win. When Pat Garrit's and Giricek's injuries hurt your team then you were destined to bomb out.
> ...


I'm thinking they can still make the playoffs this year, its obviously not a dead certainty after the 1-10 start but it looks like T-Mac is getting rolling now, Howard has been shooting a lot better the last couple of games, Giricek coming back is big for the Magic, he is a good shooter and can create for other players which is something we have lacked.


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

LoL..he didn't resign...he got fired.. 

and they made him go home on a commercial airline because he was 'no longer part of the team'


----------



## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

Well they lost to the Jazz. Bye bye Doc.


----------



## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

I think I already posted about this?

http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=61891&forumid=2


----------



## Slasher (Jul 11, 2003)

Well its official: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/spor...icfiring111803,1,6043367.story?coll=orl-magic


----------



## ToddMacCulloch11 (May 31, 2003)

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=1664543


----------



## DownUnderWonder (May 27, 2003)

thats pro sports for coaches. Last to be congratulated and first to be blamed. At least the Doc seemed like there was no malice in the situation of his firing...


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>The MAgiC</b>!
> Yes. There is. We don't need your *edited* sarcasm about it. We have been screwed around with big time by the refs the last couple of games. That last shot in the Jazz game was a foul. But I'm sure it's not just us. The entire league needs new referees. Ones with eyes.


:verysad: 

*edited: Don't attack posters or fanbases*


----------



## 1/2man-1/2incredible (Sep 30, 2003)

*Magic-doc's gone-team is gone*

So it's official that Orlando Magic head coach Doc Rivers has been fired and Davis will replace him... what are your thougths on this.. I mena yes the Magic have a horribel record....but isn't he the one who got McGrday and Hill to go to the Magic in the first place after leading a bunch of nobody's to the playoffs and becoming the coach of the year just a few seasons ago.
I mean what happened ot this team from last year. They added fire power and depth on the bench from the giricek gooden move last year. I jsut don't see why this team is losing so badly... Is Tracy to Blame???? Maybe.....(Yes)....Or is it the coaching
My question is......does this move(firing Doc) really make a difference in this team..... Will they do better....or has Tracy's ego gotten to big... not enough offense help for Tracy... or is it that htey are just not meshing as a team.. If you read the latest Slam maggazine and the article on McGrady it seems that his head has gotten alot bbigger then last year... but maybe it should have got bigger being the quality of player he is and the situation he is in where he has to carry a team single handedly.... (Howard, gooden, giricek need to produce more also)
Will the Magic be better after this... or will they continue there downward fall to the #1 in the lottery?


----------



## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

*Re: Magic-doc's gone-team is gone*



> Originally posted by <b>1/2man-1/2incredible</b>!
> Will the Magic be better after this... or will they continue there downward fall to the #1 in the lottery?


They will continue to downfall because wasn't this Johny Davis dude part of the Magic's crapping? Why did they fire Doc and Kohl while they let Davis stay?


----------



## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

Well T Mac's idol is Penny Hardaway and just like Penny he got a coach fired in Orlando.

Congratulations T-Mac:clap: :rock: :cheers: ...


...and welcome back to the lottery.


----------



## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Miami needs to fire SVG and sign Rivers!!!:gopray: 

It wont happen though...


----------



## pavlo11 (Jul 8, 2003)

At least they could have let Doc get home before firing him. The classless GM canned him in the hotel room after the game.:no: Doc isn't the one that made all of the personel changes during the off season. What about the three years he coached before.


----------



## jdg (Jun 13, 2003)

Ah yes, another case of the coach getting blamed for losses and the players getting credit for wins. I hate the double standard. Yes, sometimes it is the coaches fault, like I believe it was with Isiah Thomas. But in this case I think it was a combined effort.


----------



## Priest (Jun 24, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>pavlo11</b>!
> At least they could have let Doc get home before firing him. The classless GM canned him in the hotel room after the game.:no: Doc isn't the one that made all of the personel changes during the off season. What about the three years he coached before.


basically this isnt doc's fault at all its funny how a 10 game losing streak can make the gm forget about the past 3 yrs


----------



## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>The MAgiC</b>!
> Yes. There is. We don't need your *edited* sarcasm about it. We have been screwed around with big time by the refs the last couple of games. That last shot in the Jazz game was a foul. But I'm sure it's not just us. The entire league needs new referees. Ones with eyes.


What about the games you guys won? Sorry I meant game.

I mean I know that the refs were horrible in both games that the Raptors won and lost, in previous seasons too. I don't complain about the refs after every game we lose. You're right that the NBA needs new refs. Deal with it.

Everyone gets screwed... well except the Lakers.


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> Everytime Orlando loses there is a problem with the officiating. EVERY TIME.


Dont generalize towards all Magic fans. It isn't uncommon for fans of any team to blame the refs after losses, especially when fans of a team are seeing their team struggle so badly. I think everyone knows rarely do refs decide a game. You dont need to worry about the refs if you get up by 20 ... so it isnt their fault.


----------



## ATLien (Jun 18, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>courtside</b>!
> 
> and they made him go home on a commercial airline because he was 'no longer part of the team'


AWWWGRRR!!!!

that is COLD!!


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Priest</b>!
> 
> 
> basically this isnt doc's fault at all its funny how a 10 game losing streak can make the gm forget about the past 3 yrs


It is not all Doc's fault, but some of it is. He has not been a great coach the last three years. He got entirely too much credit for that "Heart and Hustle" year for the Magic. I always liked Doc, but he has made many, many questionable decisions as a coach. Hell, he has started a rookie each of the last 3 seasons when they clearly werent ready .. and where did they end up? Steven Hunter, confidence demolished. Pat Burke, gone from NBA. Britton Johnson, just released.

When you need to make a change, something has to be done. And it isnt like you can just fire some players and hire some others. And Orlando doesnt have a lot of trade assets.

I think along with Doc though, John Gabriel should definitely have been fired as well. It is just as much his fault for not getting the right talent around Tmac as it is Doc's inability to teach and motivate the talent.


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JarvisHayes24</b>!
> 
> 
> AWWWGRRR!!!!
> ...


I have read a lot of articles and have not ready anything about that. I highly doubt they really did that. That wouldn't look good for a team now looking for a new coach.


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>Mulk</b>!
> 
> 
> I'm thinking they can still make the playoffs this year, its obviously not a dead certainty after the 1-10 start but it looks like T-Mac is getting rolling now, Howard has been shooting a lot better the last couple of games, Giricek coming back is big for the Magic, he is a good shooter and can create for other players which is something we have lacked.


They definitely still have a shot. It isn't like a lot of the Eastern Conf teams are really rolling anyway, except maybe Indiana. But if they are going to do it, it needs to start right away.

As bad as the 1-10 is, they have really been in the game late or even had a lead in all but the Minnesota game in Orlando. With a little luck, and maybe with Garrity and Giricek the whole team, they could just as easily have been more like 9-2 or 8-3. But once the snowball got rolling ...


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Dee Bo</b>!
> 
> 
> Dont generalize towards all Magic fans. It isn't uncommon for fans of any team to blame the refs after losses, especially when fans of a team are seeing their team struggle so badly. I think everyone knows rarely do refs decide a game. You dont need to worry about the refs if you get up by 20 ... so it isnt their fault.


I'm not generalizing towards <i>all</i> Magic fans. I recognize that there are some intelligent Magic fans and some very ignorant ones, just like all teams fanbases. But, I've noticed a recurring theme on this board with Magic fans criticizing officials and not their own team. Need we go back to last years playoffs, where the Magic would have swept the Pistons 4-0 if it weren't for the officials?

And Minstrel, please PM me because I don't understand your edit. I'm not exactly sure what I wrote as of now...


----------



## jokeaward (May 22, 2003)

This is a lot less worse than Carlisle.

The owner does sort of have a responsibility to try to have a coach in to win THE NEXT game and not just hope it gets better.

If he doesn't take another contract, he can just come back and they can "look to the future." lol.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>Dee Bo</b>!
> 
> 
> They definitely still have a shot. It isn't like a lot of the Eastern Conf teams are really rolling anyway, except maybe Indiana. But if they are going to do it, it needs to start right away.
> ...


9-2, I've really got to question that. They are 1-10, and not a very good team. I'm not buying that with a 'little luck' they could receive an 8 game swing in their favor. 

As far as making the playoffs, the Atlantic Division has been pretty bad to start off with so I really wouldn't say it's out of the realm of possibilty.


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> 9-2, I've really got to question that. They are 1-10, and not a very good team. I'm not buying that with a 'little luck' they could receive an 8 game swing in their favor.
> ...


Well, they have been in almost every single game near the end, except for the Minnesota game. Usually self-destructing late in the 4th quarter. I also added if Giricek and Garrity were playing, which makes a big difference.

I'm just saying, as bad as things have been, they were very close to being pretty decent. Once the bad luck and lack of confidence starts, it just steamrolls from there.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>Dee Bo</b>!
> 
> 
> Well, they have been in almost every single game near the end, except for the Minnesota game. Usually self-destructing late in the 4th quarter. I also added if Giricek and Garrity were playing, which makes a big difference.
> ...


That's fine and all, but with a little luck they win a couple of those close games, maybe. Not 8 of them. 

Giricek and Garrity would make a difference, but do you believe that with a little luck the Magic would be the best team in the NBA?


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> That's fine and all, but with a little luck they win a couple of those close games, maybe. Not 8 of them.
> ...


With a little luck, why not? Their schedule to start the season was relatively easy, which makes 1-10 even worse, and they already played a handful of teams they should have beaten easily and have had a good number of games at home. 

One or two plays go a different way in those games an they could have won most of them, again, except for Minny who just killed them.

I'd say 7 of the 11 teams they started playing, mostly at home, they should have been able to handle without too much trouble. 

But, it doesnt matter, they are 1-10 ...


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>Dee Bo</b>!
> 
> 
> With a little luck, why not? Their schedule to start the season was relatively easy, which makes 1-10 even worse, and they already played a handful of teams they should have beaten easily and have had a good number of games at home.
> ...


Well, that would have been a lot of luck.

All in all, I think this is a poor argument, but if that's what you think I'm not going to change your mind.


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Rivers Fired...*



> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Well, that would have been a lot of luck.
> ...


Sounds good to me.


----------



## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

The Magic still have a shot at the playoffs, definately. Will it be as easy as I predicted in the beginning of the season? No, but if the Raptors can come back from a 13 game losing streak late in the season and come back to make the playoffs without their best player, the Magic can definately do it with their best player early in the season.


----------



## Fromthasouth (Nov 19, 2003)

The Magic have games at the suns and and at the kings; then they come home to Indiana, Boston ,Toronto and New Orleans, then at New Orleans, Spurs at Dallas and the suns..

I say at best they win 3 of these games (3 - 7)


----------



## Fromthasouth (Nov 19, 2003)

Is anyone watching NBA Fast Break?? Every single announcer ripped Tracy Mcgradys effort and leadership, and they said part of the reason Doc was fired was because of Tracys lack of effort and hustle on the defensive end to go along with his poor conditioning once the 4th quater comes along! Thats whats wrong with pro sports, Guys get the credit when they win, but when they lose its the coaches fault. I find it kind of ironic that Doc Rivers would always come to Tracys Defense, esp. when he got eliminated every year, saying dont blame these losses on Tracy etc. However when Doc is in trouble, Tracy didn't do anything to help save his coaches job! It will be intresting to see if Doc comments on Tracys Leadership now that hes not his coach, or if he just takes the classy way out, and leaves it untouched


----------



## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

T-Mac does nothing but praise Doc Rivers.

I think T-Mac realised he's responsible for the Magic's current record and Doc River being fired. He slumped onto the floor after the loss to the Jazz. I guess 4 years of carrying a team is just too much for him.

Maybe he'll play better after this. Maybe he just needs someone new to motivate him. But no doubt he didn't want Doc fired.


----------



## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

If scoring 51 points isn't trying to save your coaches job then I don't know what is.


----------



## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Budweiser_Boy</b>!
> The Magic still have a shot at the playoffs, definately. Will it be as easy as I predicted in the beginning of the season? No, but if the Raptors can come back from a 13 game losing streak late in the season and come back to make the playoffs without their best player, the Magic can definately do it with their best player early in the season.


And bear in mind...the Magic, despite their horrible start, are only 4.5 games out of first place in their division.

It's a *bad* division, and one poor stretch isn't going to sink anyone. Every team in that division (maybe excepting New Jersey) will probably have a terrible stretch.

If Giricek returning and the new coach spark the team, they could be near the top of their division by Christmas, let alone the end of the season.


----------



## The MAgiC (Aug 3, 2003)

Haters will always find a way to blame Tracy. It's all they're good for. This is Doc and Gabriel's fault. No one elses.


----------



## zerotre (Sep 28, 2002)

Im the biggest magic fan and have watched EVERY game (thanks to TIVO) I do believe Tmac is to blame as well as doc. Tmac should be a scottie pipen type defender, but he isnt he takes to many plays off. If only he played defense as hard as he plays offence he would diffinately be the best wing player in the NBA. As it stands he is considered one of the best, not THE BEST. 
I do believe a big reason for his play of defense is because he he has to carry such a big load on offense, if he had a true post player such as shaq i would bet he would be on the defensive all nba team.


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>zerotre</b>!
> Im the biggest magic fan and have watched EVERY game (thanks to TIVO) I do believe Tmac is to blame as well as doc. Tmac should be a scottie pipen type defender, but he isnt he takes to many plays off. If only he played defense as hard as he plays offence he would diffinately be the best wing player in the NBA. As it stands he is considered one of the best, not THE BEST.
> I do believe a big reason for his play of defense is because he he has to carry such a big load on offense, if he had a true post player such as shaq i would bet he would be on the defensive all nba team.


Tmac gaurds his man well, I rarely see them blow right by him.. the rest of the team doesn't do such a good job on their part..get tied up in screens and good rotations by other teams.. we have no inside presence other than gooden...

btw, I'm not saying tmac is best defensive player in the league..i'm just saying he is a good defender considering how much effort he has to have with his offense..


----------



## Fromthasouth (Nov 19, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>zerotre</b>!
> Im the biggest magic fan and have watched EVERY game (thanks to TIVO) I do believe Tmac is to blame as well as doc. Tmac should be a scottie pipen type defender, but he isnt he takes to many plays off. If only he played defense as hard as he plays offence he would diffinately be the best wing player in the NBA. As it stands he is considered one of the best, not THE BEST.
> I do believe a big reason for his play of defense is because he he has to carry such a big load on offense, if he had a true post player such as shaq i would bet he would be on the defensive all nba team.


Im guessing this is a cheap shot to Kobes accomplishments throughout his career?? Do you want to go back and post how many points the opposing 2's and 3's have scored against the magic this year??

[Nothing was said about Kobe, so dont bring him into this thread. - Dee Bo]


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Fromthasouth</b>!
> Is anyone watching NBA Fast Break?? Every single announcer ripped Tracy Mcgradys effort and leadership, and they said part of the reason Doc was fired was because of Tracys lack of effort and hustle on the defensive end to go along with his poor conditioning once the 4th quater comes along! Thats whats wrong with pro sports, Guys get the credit when they win, but when they lose its the coaches fault. I find it kind of ironic that Doc Rivers would always come to Tracys Defense, esp. when he got eliminated every year, saying dont blame these losses on Tracy etc. However when Doc is in trouble, Tracy didn't do anything to help save his coaches job! It will be intresting to see if Doc comments on Tracys Leadership now that hes not his coach, or if he just takes the classy way out, and leaves it untouched


Tracy has stood behind Doc the last couple weeks. And Doc has made many comments to lead one to believe this had nothing to do with the players.

Something had to be done and it was done. There is no big drama here.

Tmac has played very well recently. His defense and the team's defense has been good ... but when you constantly give up offensive rebounds that usually turn into momentum killing 3 pt shots, it makes you defense look like crap.

Also, Tmac's conditioning in the 4th has been fine. But teams are not going to let Tmac beat them in the 4th quarter. He is making the passes, maybe being too unselfish, and other guys are helping him win the games.


----------



## Fromthasouth (Nov 19, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Dee Bo</b>!
> 
> 
> Tracy has stood behind Doc the last couple weeks. And Doc has made many comments to lead one to believe this had nothing to do with the players.
> ...


Thats true he has been playing a lot better and finally gotten into some kind of rythm. However, with that being said he missed 2 game winning shots in the finals seconds at Utah and also had a huge Turnover, which could have saved Docs Job for a couple more days. Tracy's rebounds including offensive are down along with his steals, both which are hustle stats, plus his turnovers are higher than any other time of his career. I still think most of these losses are due to Gabriels poor decision making, this team could have had guys like arenas or parker, maggette and ben wallace, but instead have tryon lue Declerq and Giricek  .


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Fromthasouth</b>!
> 
> Thats true he has been playing a lot better and finally gotten into some kind of rythm. However, with that being said he missed 2 game winning shots in the finals seconds at Utah and also had a huge Turnover, which could have saved Docs Job for a couple more days. Tracy's rebounds including offensive are down along with his steals, both which are hustle stats, plus his turnovers are higher than any other time of his career. I still think most of these losses are due to Gabriels poor decision making, this team could have had guys like arenas or parker, maggette and ben wallace, but instead have tryon lue Declerq and Giricek  .


Well, the move to get Hill was a no-brainer, even if you do have to give up Ben Wallace, Chucky, and Maggette, among others. Not a GM in the league wouldnt have done that deal. Just an unfortunate circumstance Hill hasnt gotten healthy.

As far as the drafting, Orlando has had no luck and passed on a lot of players .. partially Gabriel's fault, but also Doc's. I know for sure that Doc was the major reason Jeryl Sasser was picked ahead of others and also Steven Hunter. Those were Doc's guys. And I believe the trade for Ryan Humphrey was as well.

Really stinks .. this team could have Tony Parker, Zach Randolph, and Mehmet Okur .. they'd probably be the favorite in the East.
But hindsight doesnt get you anywhere.


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

You say T-mac has lost those games? He had to shoot that last shot with 1 second remaining off an inbound pass that he made happen in the first place...the probability of that going in was like 5%... also, they shouldn't even have to come down to a game winning shot by mcgrady...if the rest of the team played well, they wouldn't have to worry about having to make the shot to win in the first place... there is no player in the league who can hit game winning shots 100% of the time...except for probably MJ..but he just had good chances @ making them


----------



## Fromthasouth (Nov 19, 2003)

The last shot was an impossible shot, but the one he bricked with like 15 seconds left and the turnover he had in the final minute were his fault, and to say no one stepped up is also false! Howard scored 21. But thats not the point of his thread. Because i know people are gonna make EXCUSES for their team, even though no matter what team it is the star player should take the blame along with the credit when due, and not make excuses such as the type of defense which is played against him.
After watching a few minutes of this Grizz game, its obvious to me that the Magic should have never gotten rid of Mike Miller, the kid is a legit 6 foot 9 and has one of the purest jumpers in the league, he was also tracys best friend.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> [Nothing was said about Kobe, so dont bring him into this thread. - Dee Bo]


What? He wasn't?


----------



## Fromthasouth (Nov 19, 2003)

I'm confused on why the Magic didnt get any cap relief from the NBA due to Hills injury?? Isnt that the point, to help teams out if a serious injury occurs??


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Fromthasouth</b>!
> I'm confused on why the Magic didnt get any cap relief from the NBA due to Hills injury?? Isnt that the point, to help teams out if a serious injury occurs??


Not sure. Hill's dad said something about Grant being able to return this season. They didnt want to give Orlando the relief if Hill could possibly come back and the NBA determined he might.


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> What? He wasn't?


He mentioned something about Kobe and the Kobe/tmac debates are basically "outlawed" in here now, so I was attempting to stop before it got started. Not a big deal.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Dee Bo</b>!
> 
> 
> He mentioned something about Kobe and the Kobe/tmac debates are basically "outlawed" in here now, so I was attempting to stop before it got started. Not a big deal.


No big deal, but the Magic fan initiated it. But, I understand what you were doing.


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Fromthasouth</b>!
> The last shot was an impossible shot, but the one he bricked with like 15 seconds left and the turnover he had in the final minute were his fault, and to say no one stepped up is also false! Howard scored 21. But thats not the point of his thread. Because i know people are gonna make EXCUSES for their team, even though no matter what team it is the star player should take the blame along with the credit when due, and not make excuses such as the type of defense which is played against him.
> After watching a few minutes of this Grizz game, its obvious to me that the Magic should have never gotten rid of Mike Miller, the kid is a legit 6 foot 9 and has one of the purest jumpers in the league, he was also tracys best friend.


LOL.. never get rid of mike miller..where is mike miller now...?? what avg 15 ppg., maybe less? yeah the kids got a shot but gooden+giricek> miller+humprhy.... 

sure miller was a friend but things change.. giricek=miller and gooden>humphry = good trade


----------



## Fromthasouth (Nov 19, 2003)

"[Tuesday], I was really hurting," McGrady said. "I don't know what I did. It just started when I got on the plane [from Salt Lake City]. I just have to take it easy. 

"I'll play, no doubt, but it's going to be a problem until I retire."

Tracy is whining again, i have never heard a superstar who complains to the media as much as him. We all know you have CHRONIC back pain, that is not the reason you are 1 - 10. Tracy needs to have a gag order, so he'll quit making excuses to the media.


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Fromthasouth</b>!
> "[Tuesday], I was really hurting," McGrady said. "I don't know what I did. It just started when I got on the plane [from Salt Lake City]. I just have to take it easy.
> 
> "I'll play, no doubt, but it's going to be a problem until I retire."
> ...


Its local news.... he is just saying whats happening..and what the situation is.. whats wrong with that..if he doesnt..the media will crush him even more and say ...you are healthy and cant do good when he is injured and playing bad..

btw..its not whining, he's just saying he is gonna not be playing up to his potential tonight...and is admitting it'll be there till he retires..


----------

