# Why do people continue to rave about Ha?



## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

I'm guessing he must be the best practice player in the history of the game, because every time I've seen him in games he looks like a boy amongst men. He looks lost. He blows layups. The ball slips out of his hands when he goes up for a ordinary layin over a smaller player. He loses tip-offs against players 6 inches shorter than him.

Yes, I know he's only 19. But people talk about the guy like he's one of the bright spots for the future of this franchise.

I guess I just don't see it.:whoknows:

-Pop


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## tradetheo (Feb 24, 2005)

I was wondering the same thing. i compared him to looking like a newborn horse when he runs, but he does look very lost out there. a jumper might help him, but he has a long long way to go to be a bench player.


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

cus he is better than yao was at his age and wasnt even to be on the team this year.


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## tradetheo (Feb 24, 2005)

yao was an allstar his 1st year and i don't think ha has scored 10 points the entire season. theres no comparing the 2 by age, cause one is good and one isn't, and it is obvious which one is good. age really doesn't matter that much. either you can play or you can't, and ha will not be a player in this league.


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## CatchNRelease (Jan 2, 2003)

There were folks that thought Jermaine was a stupid, lazy waste of a draft pick.

I'm not saying Ha's the next anybody, but if he becomes a decent backup, well, that better than a bust. He just might turn out to be good.

Give the kids a chance to develop.

Go Blazers


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

its funny that yao has said he couldnt have played in the nba at 19, Ha wasnt even to be on this team but the reign, I find it funny that people are already burning on HA considering when he came to the blazers HA wasnt going to play at all. 

yao = #1 draft pick 
Ha = #46 draft pick 

and HA just took out Yao.


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## BlazerFanFoLife (Jul 17, 2003)

Ha is tall. :eek8:


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## Backboard Cam (Apr 29, 2003)

tradetheo said:


> ...ha will not be a player in this league.


Ha IS a player in this league right now. And I'm not an expert on contracts, but I believe he gets 3 years.

Not saying he's the next Yao, but he sure is tall. And young, so who knows what will happen. 

Someone mentioned Jermaine, but Cato is a better example- not an allstar, but a decent bench center. He's better now than he was when he was in Portland, and I figured he'd last a year after we traded him.

Of course I could have mentioned Boumtje


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## Tince (Jul 11, 2004)

tradetheo said:


> yao was an allstar his 1st year and i don't think ha has scored 10 points the entire season. theres no comparing the 2 by age, cause one is good and one isn't, and it is obvious which one is good. age really doesn't matter that much. either you can play or you can't, and ha will not be a player in this league.


 Mike Rice said Yao told him that Ha is a better player at 19 than he was. I'm not saying that means he's going to be better than Yao, but I'm not going to write the kid off. As long as nobody on the Blazers is counting on him to be a solid center, then anything that comes of him will be an added bonus.


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## white360 (Apr 24, 2004)

Time will show


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## stupendous (Feb 17, 2003)

Backboard Cam said:


> Someone mentioned Jermaine, but Cato is a better example- not an allstar, but a decent bench center. He's better now than he was when he was in Portland, and I figured he'd last a year after we traded him.


I'm going to have to disagree with you there. While Cato was not (and is still not) a scoring factor, he was a solid rebounder and still a hell of a shot blocker when he played for Portland. I remember in the playoffs against the Jazz collecting something like 7 blocks, several against Malone. Cato at least brought SOMETHING to the table, where at this point, Ha really doesn't. Not saying that he wont develop into a decent player some day, but as of this moment, he is pretty darn bad out there!


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## stupendous (Feb 17, 2003)

Tince said:


> Mike Rice said Yao told him that Ha is a better player at 19 than he was. I'm not saying that means he's going to be better than Yao, but I'm not going to write the kid off. As long as nobody on the Blazers is counting on him to be a solid center, then anything that comes of him will be an added bonus.



I agree, if we get something out of him, great, if we don't, oh well. Mike Rice must have said that like 3 times before half time, and i would bet a couple times in the second half but I had to jet before the 2nd!


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

tradetheo said:


> yao was an allstar his 1st year


there's a couple of points of contention here. For starters, Yao was 22 when he was a rookie. Thats 3-4 years older than Ha, and also 3-4 years more of growth, maturation. Yao being an All Star had more to do with the fact the NBA "opened" voting to China, than Yao deserving it.



> and i don't think ha has scored 10 points the entire season. theres no comparing the 2 by age, cause one is good and one isn't, and it is obvious which one is good. age really doesn't matter that much.


cept that you're comparing how someone was at 22 vs how someone is at 18-19. You're comparing someone who played far more games professionally vs one who basically played high school ball and thats it.



> either you can play or you can't, and ha will not be a player in this league.


If we're to compare how a player is after such a short amount of time playing basketball, we're bound to make grandiose statements that show that we know very little about the game.


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## BlayZa (Dec 31, 2002)

a, he's tall
b, he's goofy
c, he's tall
d, yao ming comparisons
e, he's tall
f, he's young
g, he's tall
h, 'hidden gem crew' aka everyone under 25 on our squad
i, he's tall


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

Interesting that the vreator of this post is the same guy who started a post complaining that people rag on Damon too much. Damons at lesast had 10 years or so to prove that he isn't a great player. 

Ha has the size, hands and mobility to be a solid center in the NBA, maybe not an All star, but a solid player. What he lacks is experience against real competition.

As far as raving about him, fans often love to root for the little used player...see Joe Wolf.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Schilly said:


> Interesting that the vreator of this post is the same guy who started a post complaining that people rag on Damon too much. Damons at lesast had 10 years or so to prove that he isn't a great player.
> 
> Ha has the size, hands and mobility to be a solid center in the NBA, maybe not an All star, but a solid player. What he lacks is experience against real competition.
> 
> As far as raving about him, fans often love to root for the little used player...see Joe Wolf.


that was an absolute PWN post.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

SodaPopinski said:


> I'm guessing he must be the best practice player in the history of the game, because every time I've seen him in games he looks like a boy amongst men.


Well, a very tall boy. Which is, of course, exactly what he is. A very tall boy amongst men. 



> Yes, I know he's only 19. But people talk about the guy like he's one of the bright spots for the future of this franchise.


Well, he's got his whole career ahead of him. And did anyone mention that he's not short? 

barfo


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## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

Schilly said:


> Interesting that the vreator of this post is the same guy who started a post complaining that people rag on Damon too much. Damons at lesast had 10 years or so to prove that he isn't a great player.


I never said Damon was a great player. What I did say is that he gets a fair amount of blame here, which I believe is unfounded. There are at least four players who have literally given up on the season on this team. Damon's not one of them. As a matter of fact, there have been numerous times where he has thrown the entire team on his back. His free throw shooting leads the league. He's on pace to set all kinds of Blazer records this year for three pointers made and percentage.

The Damon-hating will be a lot more interesting if people present more of an argument than "I don't like him" or "He's short".

And please, if you want to continue this Damon conversation, take it to PM. Better yet, why don't we just create a "*****ing about Damon" thread and pin it to the top. That wasn't the intent of my starting this thread. Rather, I wanted to start a discussion about whether Ha is deserving of the praise many have been giving him.

-Pop


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

SodaPopinski said:


> I never said Damon was a great player. What I did say is that he gets a fair amount of blame here, which I believe is unfounded. There are at least four players who have literally given up on the season on this team. Damon's not one of them. As a matter of fact, there have been numerous times where he has thrown the entire team on his back. His free throw shooting leads the league. He's on pace to set all kinds of Blazer records this year for three pointers made and percentage.
> 
> The Damon-hating will be a lot more interesting if people present more of an argument than "I don't like him" or "He's short".
> 
> ...


Ok how about this, then explain why you are so down on Ha. No one is trying to say he should be starting now, no one is saying he should be starting next year. Basically everyone thinks he has the pysical tools to be an NBA player you can either to aknowledge that or you can stick to your guns and expect 30ppg and 20rpg or he's a failure criteria you laid out when Ha was signed.

Since you personally don't have a career working as an evaluator of talent (nor do I) I would think you would at least lend some credence to the opinions like people Like Tim Grugrich and other coaches scouts and maybe even the devil errrr Nash himself say that Ha has the tools to play the game.

Don't take this the wrong way but it just sounds like sour grapes to me.


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## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

Schilly said:


> Ok how about this, then explain why you are so down on Ha. No one is trying to say he should be starting now, no one is saying he should be starting next year. Basically everyone thinks he has the pysical tools to be an NBA player you can either to aknowledge that or you can stick to your guns and expect 30ppg and 20rpg or he's a failure criteria you laid out when Ha was signed.
> 
> Since you personally don't have a career working as an evaluator of talent (nor do I) I would think you would at least lend some credence to the opinions like people Like Tim Grugrich and other coaches scouts and maybe even the devil errrr Nash himself say that Ha has the tools to play the game.
> 
> Don't take this the wrong way but it just sounds like sour grapes to me.


I don't expect Ha to get 30 ppg and 20 rpg. But what I do expect is a guy who is that big to shoot a higher percentage than 10%, to average less than 20 turnovers per minute played, to not fumble the ball out of his own hands, to not lose a tip-off against a player 6 inches shorter than him, etc.

Anyway, read my first post. I basically said, "I don't get the hype. Apparently I'm missing something here."

I mean honestly, don't you think we'd see a glimmer of hope for his future? I haven't seen one decent play out of the guy. And believe me, I'm looking. I want this guy to succeed. I just don't see any reason to believe he'll amount to anything.

-Pop


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

SodaPopinski said:


> I don't expect Ha to get 30 ppg and 20 rpg. But what I do expect is a guy who is that big to shoot a higher percentage than 10%, to average less than 20 turnovers per minute played, to not fumble the ball out of his own hands, to not lose a tip-off against a player 6 inches shorter than him, etc.
> 
> Anyway, read my first post. I basically said, "I don't get the hype. Apparently I'm missing something here."
> 
> ...


so thats you who watches him practice? Good to know you're an assistant coach. Could you get me and schilly into the practice? I want to see how Viktor and Travis play during practices.


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## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

Hap said:


> so thats you who watches him practice? Good to know you're an assistant coach. Could you get me and schilly into the practice? I want to see how Viktor and Travis play during practices.


Huh? Read my first post - I said he must be good in practice, because I haven't seen in it games. I get it that you were trying to be sarcastic, but sarcasm usually works better if the jab has some validity to it.

Good effort.

-Pop


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

SodaPopinski said:


> I don't expect Ha to get 30 ppg and 20 rpg. But what I do expect is a guy who is that big to shoot a higher percentage than 10%, to average less than 20 turnovers per minute played, to not fumble the ball out of his own hands, to not lose a tip-off against a player 6 inches shorter than him, etc.
> 
> Anyway, read my first post. I basically said, "I don't get the hype. Apparently I'm missing something here."
> 
> ...


I think at this point making any judgement in either direction is a mistake. He's never faced this kind of competition...period. He played High School ball, in Korea. I doubt that Korean HS ball is anywhere close to HS ball in the US. I think if you look at his size and mobilty you have to say you like what you see. Portland must like the potential he has as when the signed him they signed him just long enough to qualify him for bird rights, when he turns 22 the same age Yao was as a rookie here.

WE simply haven't seen enough to say he isn't a bright spot, but I think having a mobile 7'4" 320lb player in and of itself can be considered a bright spot.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

SodaPopinski said:


> Huh? Read my first post - I said he must be good in practice, because I haven't seen in it games. I get it that you were trying to be sarcastic, but sarcasm usually works better if the jab has some validity to it.
> 
> Good effort.
> 
> -Pop


which is kind of my point. We're taking information that people who actually see him far more htan any of us do, and believing them far more than we'll believe you.

They aren't prone to hyperboles, and tirades about things that they know little about.


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## Paxil (Jan 1, 2003)

It is only through freak circumstances that HA is playing in the NBA right now. Everyone would admit he really isn't ready. He hasn't even played against US highschool competition so far. I really didn't expect HA to play until a few years from now. That being said... it is cool he is getting some time. It is kind of like fall in baseball when they expand the rosters. I imagine HA will be back on the injured list next year.


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## cpt.napalm (Feb 23, 2005)

I think that he has the building blocks to be a good player. I think that a little time in a development league over here would do him some good. A decent college program even. When he would finish college he would be Yao's age and the comparision would be a little more even. However he is already playing and only with more playing time and just time in general will he get better. The one thing that stands out the most for me is how much his physique has changed since he started playing for us. He has gained quite a bit of muscle. 

I do agree that as it stands he hasn't done much come gametime. There is always a chance that he won't pan out but I think that the Portland media is pessimistic enough for all of us here. Just have a little faith in the kid.


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

yeah and he crushes people including yao, he is closer to shaq bodywise than yao plus HA has longer arms, he wasnt even going to be with the blazers this year at all, he improved enough to be on the roster then he improved enough to play a few games, that in itself is impressive to me.


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## e_blazer1 (Feb 3, 2004)

I remember reading threads like this last year raising the same questions about Travis Outlaw. Anybody questioning whether he's an NBA player now? It takes time for young players, especially ones who have never played against NBA-caliber competition, to learn how to play in the NBA.

It's too early to tell anything about Ha except that he has a very rare combination of size and athleticism that is extremely rare. Given time and instruction, Ha could become a dominant player...or he may turn out to be a bust. What's to be lost by having him in a Blazer uniform while we're checking out what the future holds for the kid?


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## Target (Mar 17, 2004)

Nicely said E.

Even if Ha doesn't turn out he's still the first Korean with a contract and that means a lot to Koreans.


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## gatorpops (Dec 17, 2004)

I was pleasently suprised last night at Ha. 
I expected that he would imbarrass himself and the team. This was his first actual chance to play any extended minuets. 
I found him more mobile than I thought and told my wife that I thought he would make a player in this league. 
He has a chance to be better than La Rue Martin and he was drafted high by Portland. Of course he was a bust. Ha can move and is "tall" is tall is tall and big and if he applies hiself he will make at least a reserve and maybe a Mark Eaton like player. 
If you put a giant in the middle in basketball you have to get around him to get the rebound if you are the other team and he takes up a lot of space. 
Sabonis couldn't move much either at the end and he did allright. 
Ha seems to be tough and I expect he has a great work ethic since he is Korean and they often have a tanacity obout them to apply themselves. They do not want to bring diagrace to their family and Nation. Go Ha!

gatorpops


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## The Professional Fan (Nov 5, 2003)

SodaPopinski said:


> I'm guessing he must be the best practice player in the history of the game, because every time I've seen him in games he looks like a boy amongst men. He looks lost. He blows layups. The ball slips out of his hands when he goes up for a ordinary layin over a smaller player. He loses tip-offs against players 6 inches shorter than him.
> 
> Yes, I know he's only 19. But people talk about the guy like he's one of the bright spots for the future of this franchise.
> 
> ...


I have to agree. I've seen nothing that I'd consider promising about Ha's game. He can run. And he can foul hard (so hard, in fact, that if i was an opposing coach, and i had any kind of lead on Portland, i'd bench my valuable players in fear that Ha will injure them). That's it.


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## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

I think on the Blazers roster getting coaching from Blazers coaches is the best thing that could have happened to Ha. I watched him in the ABA, the disorganized 1 on 1 showcase that is minor league basketball was doing nothing for him at all, if anything he seems more comfortable in the NBA scheme.

Ha has 2 intangibles well 3 really that can't be taught....

Height
Bulk
Athleticism

We should feel very confident that he can at least develop into a 10-15mpg backup to Joel. I didn't see that he really hurt the team last night, his shots looked to me like adrenalized overshoots, he may get over that if not he's at least a big body to make other teams wary of bringing it down the lane.

As far as fouling hard, I think we are seeing a Shaq scenario...he's just so dang big if and when contact occurs it looks nnnnnnaaaaaaassssttttyyyyy!.


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## Paxil (Jan 1, 2003)

I couldn't help but chuckle when he missed a shot last night and started running to the other end. He was at half court before he realized blazers got the offensive rebound. =) He'll learn. Patience.


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

he does suck up a ton of space in a Mark Eaton/Arvydas Sabonis kind of way. he seems pretty inept, but just purely on size alone he has a presence in the middle. he's already at least as good as Dale Davis was in his final season here. Dale could go 10 minutes out on the court and you wouldn't even know he was out there. 

with a lot of the really big boys in the league who washed out (Shawn Kemp, Jahidi White, Shawn Bradley--who would be washed out if Dallas had their way) half their problem is just making it down the court in a timely manner. 

say what you want about Shaq, but the guy does move his enormous mass from end to end in a reasonable amount of time (particularly on defense). no, he doesn't stop the break, but opposing centers aren't usually able to cherry pick off his slow ***. 

Ha seems to have a similar ability to get down the floor on defense. good athleticism, good size, great height. almost no brains. for a project 19 year old center chosen in the second round, how much more can you ask for?


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

theWanker said:


> Ha seems to have a similar ability to get down the floor on defense. good athleticism, good size, great height. almost no brains. for a project 19 year old center chosen in the second round, how much more can you ask for?


I'm just wondering how you figure he has "almost no brains". Do you mean he lacks fundementals, or that he's stupid?


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## ProudBFan (Apr 29, 2003)

Back to the original point:

I don't hear anyone raving about Ha. Who is raving about the kid? Seriously. If anyone is, I haven't seen it.

The vibe I get on him is that Blazers fans, in general, think he's big, young, and has a lot of growing to do on the court. But I also sense that we Blazers fans (again, in general) are intrigued by what could be if he develops his game.

Seung-Jin is no Yao. But maybe, with the right guidance (Grgrich is the IDEAL mentor for him) and a lot of hard work, he'll be able to become a capable (and interesting) NBA center. Anything more than that would be gravy, IMO.

Maybe someday, 4-5 years down the road, we'll be able to legitimately compare Seung-Jin to Yao. And maybe by that time, Seung-Jin will actually compare favorably with him. But right now it's WAY too early to make that comparison. Yao is older, has MUCH more experience playing the game at the professional level, and has had the benefit of better coaching throughout his career. Seung-Jin is just now playing his first basketball at anything above the high-school level. There's just no comparison there. Apples and oranges. Since Yao is rapidly coming into his own right now, let's compare them when Seung-Jin has gained as much experience as Yao has right now.

On the side, the one thing I like about what I've seen from Seung-Jin so far is that the kid is fearless. Then again, maybe he just doesn't know enough yet to be afraid (putting it as nicely as I can here).

But, again, I haven't seen or heard anyone raving about Seung-Jin. Please post links if you have 'em, Pop.

PBF


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## Utherhimo (Feb 20, 2005)

i dont think HA fears anyone but save for his idol Shaq


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## kaydow (Apr 6, 2004)

You know, Yao had some comical moments his first season in the NBA--and he wasn't 19. Just when you think Ha is too awkward, he shows a little glimpse of (dare I say??) athleticism--at least for a guy whose 7'3". I think the guy will be decent, I just don't know how long it will take. 2 years? 5 years? It can't be a surprise to anyone that he's lost out there right now. High school basketball in Korea to the NBA? That's like going from slow pitch softball to facing Randy Johnson.


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

Hap said:


> I'm just wondering how you figure he has "almost no brains". Do you mean he lacks fundementals, or that he's stupid?


well, since I don't know the guy personally I suppose "almost no brains" was shorthand for "very little basketball iq." 

if Ha's ma reads this board, she should know that it was not my intent to say her freakish son is stupid. ugly as sin, but not necessarily stupid.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

theWanker said:


> well, since I don't know the guy personally I suppose "almost no brains" was shorthand for "very little basketball iq."
> 
> if Ha's ma reads this board, she should know that it was not my intent to say her freakish son is stupid. ugly as sin, but not necessarily stupid.


I would think considering his father and sister all played basketball (including his dad playing for, iirc, RO(s)K's basketball teams)..I'd suggest that he has a pretty high basketball IQ.


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## ProudBFan (Apr 29, 2003)

Hap said:


> I would think considering his father and sister all played basketball (including his dad playing for, iirc, RO(s)K's basketball teams)..I'd suggest that he has a pretty high basketball IQ.


Or, at least, a direct line to developing some in a hurry.

BTW, anyone have a link to any articles about Seung-Jin's father? I'd like to know more about the legacy Seung-Jin and his sister have inherited.

PBF


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## tradetheo (Feb 24, 2005)

Tince said:


> Mike Rice said Yao told him that Ha is a better player at 19 than he was. I'm not saying that means he's going to be better than Yao, but I'm not going to write the kid off. As long as nobody on the Blazers is counting on him to be a solid center, then anything that comes of him will be an added bonus.


thats a crappy way to look at players i think. enough with these guys in the league who do nothing, but collect a check. you can look at the guy, and just tell he won't be anything. if he's on the roster at 19, he has to be special, but this guy is a joke.he's 7 ft 3, with the coordination of a 6 year old. i think he's gonna trip getting off the bench to get a drink of water sometimes. .


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

tradetheo said:


> thats a crappy way to look at players i think. enough with these guys in the league who do nothing, but collect a check. you can look at the guy, and just tell he won't be anything. if he's on the roster at 19, he has to be special, but this guy is a joke.he's 7 ft 3, with the coordination of a 6 year old. i think he's gonna trip getting off the bench to get a drink of water sometimes. .


yah, how many 6 year olds do you know can do the splits and stand on their head? how many 6 year olds actually are lauded for being as agile as he is?

I just love it when someone gets in their head that a player is bad, and despite all the things said about him, they refuse to remove their head from the sand. it's not like he's Mengtke Bateer (sp) or Slavko Vranes.


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## tradetheo (Feb 24, 2005)

hap, you need to remove your head from the sand. i have seen him play. there is no reason for him to be out there, no matter what. he still has 3 years to go until he is even ready to think about playing. throwing him out there like this isn't going to help him. and when was the last time doing the splits helped you make a jumper. you think larry bird could do the splits. he would rip ha's head off and use it for toilet paper.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

tradetheo said:


> hap, you need to remove your head from the sand. i have seen him play.


you've seen him play what, 10 games and 40 minutes?

Travis looked just as lost last year (so did Jermaine).



> there is no reason for him to be out there, no matter what. he still has 3 years to go until he is even ready to think about playing.


thats what people said about Travis. And go figure, they were wrong. Maybe the coaches see far more than us fans do, because you know..they do it for a living? They see him almost every day? 

They actually know what they're talking about?



> throwing him out there like this isn't going to help him. and when was the last time doing the splits helped you make a jumper. you think larry bird could do the splits. he would rip ha's head off and use it for toilet paper.


Larry would "rip off" most peoples heads in this league. Whats that prove?

And doing splits = agile 

the implication is that he's an uncoordinated goof. Obviously, thats not true, and just based soley on the fact that people see something interesting in him...and those who are negative nellies who just want to downplay a player based on a limited viewing.


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## tlong (Jan 6, 2003)

Doing the splits just means you have good flexibility...it does not mean you're agile or coordinated.


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