# Melo for Kwame and #1?



## NorthEast Wiz

Chad 'I will put every possibility and something must stick' Ford posted this on insider:

The Wizards don't have as much ammunition, but they do have a former No. 1 pick and the No. 10 pick in this year's lottery. If the team continues to clear house post-MJ, expect it to at least entertain the idea of trading Kwame Brown. If Brown is really as good as some people in the league think, it could be hard for Kiki to pass up the chance to grab another 7-footer and a lottery pick. Pietrus could still be on the board (though the Bulls are high on him) at No. 10. Add Gilbert Arenas to the mix, and the Nuggets are rolling again.


http://insider.espn.go.com/insider/story?id=1559326

No way we do this. If they throw in a future first rounder I would think about it.


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## BCH

No thanks for me either.

Maybe Kwame by himself because I feel he has comparable talent. The thing is, Kiki has worked Kwame out at the big man camp, and he knows Kwame's ability. If the Nuggets were to make that trade, it would just solidify in my mind how bad we would get ripped.

I still like my idea better.

Stackhouse
Haywood

for 

#3
Camby


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## NorthEast Wiz

I like your trade BCH but I don't see Denver doing it mostly because there will be better offers on the table and additionally thier fans would rip them. 

Maybe some people are higher on Haywood than I am. I see him at the high end turning into Bill Cartwright. I am not confident he can do that though.


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## BCH

Stackhouse is an All Star that is worth Carmelo. Carmelo would have to work hard to put up what Stack puts up, and Stack is the veteran 2 that the Nuggets really need. Haywood gives them a non-injury prone 5 to suit up next to Hilario. Kiki could work with him, but his main attributes would be similar to what he did in Washington last year which was guard the paint. He can only get better in that area.

It helps the Wizards because we stay young, and Carmelo fits in better with our rebuilding than Denver's. Denver is about a year or two ahead of us right now, because they have the cap space today whereas we have it in a couple of years.

Neither team loses much cap wise becausse of the length of contracts are equal.


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BCH</b>!
> No thanks for me either.
> 
> Maybe Kwame by himself because I feel he has comparable talent. The thing is, Kiki has worked Kwame out at the big man camp, and he knows Kwame's ability. If the Nuggets were to make that trade, it would just solidify in my mind how bad we would get ripped.
> 
> I still like my idea better.
> 
> Stackhouse
> Haywood
> 
> for
> 
> #3
> Camby


haha - that deal blows. i cant believe you think its fair!

kwame/10 for 3 isnt as bad but it also sucks.


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BCH</b>!
> Stackhouse is an All Star that is worth Carmelo. Carmelo would have to work hard to put up what Stack puts up, and Stack is the veteran 2 that the Nuggets really need. Haywood gives them a non-injury prone 5 to suit up next to Hilario. Kiki could work with him, but his main attributes would be similar to what he did in Washington last year which was guard the paint. He can only get better in that area.
> 
> It helps the Wizards because we stay young, and Carmelo fits in better with our rebuilding than Denver's. Denver is about a year or two ahead of us right now, because they have the cap space today whereas we have it in a couple of years.
> 
> Neither team loses much cap wise becausse of the length of contracts are equal.


stack=melo? :laugh:

again, HORRIBLE idea. try again please.


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## adarsh1

stackhouse, haywood, and russell for the three will be a good deal

getting rid of b russell will make me really happyany way if we get melo. him and kwame will be amazing


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## BEEZ

> Originally posted by <b>NugzFan</b>!
> 
> 
> stack=melo? :laugh:
> 
> again, HORRIBLE idea. try again please.


Now Nugzfan how silly are you making yourself look. Stackhouse is a former 30 ppg scorer in the NBA. Carmelo has avg what???


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## NorthEast Wiz

> Originally posted by <b>adarsh1</b>!
> stackhouse, haywood, and russell for the three will be a good deal
> 
> getting rid of b russell will make me really happyany way if we get melo. him and kwame will be amazing


I would do it but I think they will have better offers on the table and they will use thier cap space better than to take our guys. Also, B. Russell is a free agent so we won't be resigning him.


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## MikeDC

On the face of it, that's an atrocious trade for the Wiz.

Every year at this time, people start hyping the top draft picks, but lets not get carried away. A couple years ago, people were saying the same things about Kwame. He was a #1 pick.

Why trade a #1 overall for the #3 overall?

Unless we're just plain convinced that Kwame sucks and will always suck, I don't see why this should be done.

Personally, I don't have a whole lot of confidence in Kwame, but I'd think at the very least we shouldn't have to include our pick too to get Melo. At most, we should get something back.


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## BCH

I see no specific reason to jettison our future for Melo, which is why I suggested possibly Stackhouse. I do not see him as part of the future.

I wouldn't be upset if the Wizards can't make a deal to move up to the third spot.


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## ATLien

trading Kwame would be a mistake. Besides Denver already has Skita and Nene at forward, who they both drafted very high in last year's draft. Have THEY already given up on Tskit?


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## NorthEast Wiz

I just can't believe Chad Ford thinks we would possibly give up Brown and the #10 for Anthony.

As my Grandfather would say "That is crazy talk!".


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> Now Nugzfan how silly are you making yourself look. Stackhouse is a former 30 ppg scorer in the NBA. Carmelo has avg what???


um, hes a rookie. you havent been paying attention.


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>adarsh1</b>!
> stackhouse, haywood, and russell for the three will be a good deal


for washington. horrible for denver.


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## BEEZ

> Originally posted by <b>NugzFan</b>!
> 
> 
> um, hes a rookie. you havent been paying attention.


I've been playing plenty of attention. I think you need to reread your post. You said Stackhouse for Anthony is laughable. How??


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> I've been playing plenty of attention. I think you need to reread your post. You said Stackhouse for Anthony is laughable. How??


and you countered with stacks 30 ppg? how nice that you compared his stats to a guy who cant have any yet!

make a poll and see how many want a 40% shooter, with poor D and a huge contract over melo. go ahead. if stack wins, ill apologize.


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## BEEZ

> Originally posted by <b>NugzFan</b>!
> 
> 
> and you countered with stacks 30 ppg? how nice that you compared his stats to a guy who cant have any yet!
> 
> make a poll and see how many want a 40% shooter, with poor D and a huge contract over melo. go ahead. if stack wins, ill apologize.


Stack does not have a huge contract by any means. At least know what you are talking about first. And my point was that you were laughing as if Carmelo is better than Stackhouse and hes not.


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> Stack does not have a huge contract by any means. At least know what you are talking about first. And my point was that you were laughing as if Carmelo is better than Stackhouse and hes not.


he makes alot more than melo does. and ill take melo any day over stack. i think most people would.


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## BCH

Stack's contract is about $7M. He actually has a worthwhile deal. I don't think it would be smart for the Nuggets to trade Carmelo for Stack, unless they think Tskita is a SF only, they think he will be better than Melo, they think they can sign Stack to a reasonable contract after his current one ends after the 2005 season.

Hard to imagine, but not laughable, and hardly due to the contract Stackhouse has.


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## BEEZ

> Originally posted by <b>NugzFan</b>!
> 
> 
> he makes alot more than melo does. and ill take melo any day over stack. i think most people would.


So basically you'll take an unproven over a proven. That makes alot of sense


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> So basically you'll take an unproven over a proven. That makes alot of sense


who would you take - pj brown or kwame brown. pj has proven to be a valuble, decent, consistent PF. kwame has not.

stack at his age, his proven stats, and his salary is NOT what i want. would you trade him for melo straight up (assuming not having to match salaries since the nuggets are under the cap). yes you would. 

ill take melo ANY DAY over stack.


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## BCH

> Originally posted by <b>NugzFan</b>!
> 
> 
> who would you take - pj brown or kwame brown. pj has proven to be a valuble, decent, consistent PF. kwame has not.
> 
> stack at his age, his proven stats, and his salary is NOT what i want. would you trade him for melo straight up (assuming not having to match salaries since the nuggets are under the cap). yes you would.
> 
> ill take melo ANY DAY over stack.


If the best you can do is come up with PJ Brown then it is obvious you are not able to make valid comparisons.


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## Bball_Doctor

> Originally posted by <b>BCH</b>!
> Stackhouse is an All Star that is worth Carmelo. Carmelo would have to work hard to put up what Stack puts up, and Stack is the veteran 2 that the Nuggets really need. Haywood gives them a non-injury prone 5 to suit up next to Hilario. Kiki could work with him, but his main attributes would be similar to what he did in Washington last year which was guard the paint. He can only get better in that area.
> 
> It helps the Wizards because we stay young, and Carmelo fits in better with our rebuilding than Denver's. Denver is about a year or two ahead of us right now, because they have the cap space today whereas we have it in a couple of years.
> 
> Neither team loses much cap wise becausse of the length of contracts are equal.


Wizards should not do this unless if it was Stack for Melo:grinning: . Kwame is going to blossom and could one day be the most dominant 4 in the east.


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BCH</b>!
> 
> 
> If the best you can do is come up with PJ Brown then it is obvious you are not able to make valid comparisons.


good job at missing the point. you are good at missing points.


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## BCH

> Originally posted by <b>NugzFan</b>!
> 
> 
> good job at missing the point. you are good at missing points.


I got the point. You were trying to make a throw away argument. It didn't work, becasue PJ Brown's consistency has nothing to do with what Stackhouse adds to a team like Denver. I surely believe you when you say that you would not make that deal. Circumstances, however, are not the same for each team, which was my point, and one you seemed to ignore. Yes, the Wizards would trade Stack for Melo straight up, because they are not as far in the rebuilding process as Denver. Denver needs scoring and a solid veteran. Stackhouse is both of those things. The Wizards need to accumulate some talent, while waiting for some cap room. 

But you can stick with the PJ Brown throw away comparisons.


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BCH</b>!
> 
> 
> I got the point. You were trying to make a throw away argument. It didn't work, becasue PJ Brown's consistency has nothing to do with what Stackhouse adds to a team like Denver. I surely believe you when you say that you would not make that deal. Circumstances, however, are not the same for each team, which was my point, and one you seemed to ignore. Yes, the Wizards would trade Stack for Melo straight up, because they are not as far in the rebuilding process as Denver. Denver needs scoring and a solid veteran. Stackhouse is both of those things. The Wizards need to accumulate some talent, while waiting for some cap room.
> 
> But you can stick with the PJ Brown throw away comparisons.


no you still didnt get the point. you have to read what i was replying to. 

i could have said brown or 20 other power forwards and my point still remains.


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## plasticman23

stackhouse an all-star? no way, only reason he ever averaged 30 ppg is because he played for the pistons. i bet melo will put up better numbers than him next season.


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## BCH

Yeah. What was I thinking?

He is a two-time All-Star that was universally said to have been snubbed last year. Go figure.


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## bigbabyjesus

> Originally posted by <b>BCH</b>!
> 
> 
> Stackhouse
> Haywood
> 
> for
> 
> #3
> Camby


NO WAAAYY! Nuggets would do that, in a million years


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## Philo

I'd take Melo over Stack in a second. Kwame is a different story, I think he is still the real deal and they could get more for him if they wait.


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## plasticman23

BCH - so going by your line of reasoning anthony mason, juwon howard, and brad miller are also great players because they are former all-stars. Stackhouse got snubbed this year? who should he have replaced? iverson? mcgrady? pierce? uh...no


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## BCH

> Originally posted by <b>plasticman23</b>!
> BCH - so going by your line of reasoning anthony mason, juwon howard, and brad miller are also great players because they are former all-stars. Stackhouse got snubbed this year? who should he have replaced? iverson? mcgrady? pierce? uh...no


Recent history, and different circumstances. Juwan Howard hasn't sniffed being an All Star any time recently. Anthony Mason did it one season , and that has proven to be a fluke. Brad Miller was only an All-Star because of the lack of any sort of center in the East. 

Stackhouse was probably superceded by MJ this year, and at the time of the All Star game, he was outplaying MJ. I am not saying he definitely should have been in, but he definitely deserved to be in the game.


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## NugzFan

um, yeah. :laugh:


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## BEEZ

> Originally posted by <b>NugzFan</b>!
> um, yeah. :laugh:


I dont understand whats funny about the post. Those are facts. You havent really backed up the point you were trying to make Nugzfan


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## Ballin101

That's because he doesn't make any points BEEZ.


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## plasticman23

well my point is that stackhouse is no longer an all-star caliber player, and carmelo anthony has the pontential to be a much better player than stack was in his prime.


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## BEEZ

> Originally posted by <b>plasticman23</b>!
> well my point is that stackhouse is no longer an all-star caliber player, and carmelo anthony has the pontential to be a much better player than stack was in his prime.


Why would you say that Stackhouse is no longer an All-star caliber player??? Had that Michael Jordan fiasco not had gone down Stackhouse would have been an all-star. I dont understand because people use to complain that he shot too much then he changed his game to be more all-around and still the complaints. I love Carmelo Anthony just look at my posts, but I do have to say its to early for anyone to say Carmelo has the potential to be be better than Stackhouse. If thats the case break it down to me how??


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## Absynth

i think i will try to take a stab at this arguement.

I think any trade mentioned will not work.


first the melo for kwame and #10

Kwame is a PF. The Nug's already have Nene, so they have no need for Kwame. Also, Kwame and a #10 pick is debately worth more than melo. There is no reason for the wiz to make this trade either.

Neither team would want to do this trade

Now the trades involving what boils down to Stack for Melo

I see the wiz doing this in a second, but not the nugs. The reason is obvious. Both of these teams will not become championship contenders, or even playoff contenders next year. Both are in a state of rebuilding. Now when you are confronted with two talents, one young, one old, a team will always want the old one when rebuilding. If the nugs knew they could win something next season this will b different. but next season I think is about gelling. You have camby, finally back from injury, nene in his second yr, melo, s.g. who could be anyone, and probably arenas.

these players need time to gel, to learn to work together, and nene and melo need time to grow. camby needs time to come back from injury. arenas is going to be a 3rd yr, so this will allow him to break out.

all this equates to a pretty good lottery team. A trade for old talent would screw this up. It would hurt the nugs growth movement, so i see no reason to do this.

with stack, you loose youth and vitality for the upcoming seasons where you will be competing. arena's growth will be stunted, because he will have to play second fiddle. and stack cant even tutor nene, because the two dont play similar positions. I dont see a positive reason at all for this trade for denver.


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## BEEZ

> Originally posted by <b>heatfan</b>!
> i think i will try to take a stab at this arguement.
> 
> I think any trade mentioned will not work.
> 
> 
> first the melo for kwame and #10
> 
> Kwame is a PF. The Nug's already have Nene, so they have no need for Kwame. Also, Kwame and a #10 pick is debately worth more than melo. There is no reason for the wiz to make this trade either.
> 
> Neither team would want to do this trade
> 
> Now the trades involving what boils down to Stack for Melo
> 
> I see the wiz doing this in a second, but not the nugs. The reason is obvious. Both of these teams will not become championship contenders, or even playoff contenders next year. Both are in a state of rebuilding. Now when you are confronted with two talents, one young, one old, a team will always want the old one when rebuilding. If the nugs knew they could win something next season this will b different. but next season I think is about gelling. You have camby, finally back from injury, nene in his second yr, melo, s.g. who could be anyone, and probably arenas.
> 
> these players need time to gel, to learn to work together, and nene and melo need time to grow. camby needs time to come back from injury. arenas is going to be a 3rd yr, so this will allow him to break out.
> 
> all this equates to a pretty good lottery team. A trade for old talent would screw this up. It would hurt the nugs growth movement, so i see no reason to do this.
> 
> with stack, you loose youth and vitality for the upcoming seasons where you will be competing. arena's growth will be stunted, because he will have to play second fiddle. and stack cant even tutor nene, because the two dont play similar positions. I dont see a positive reason at all for this trade for denver.


Now thank you, a good well-thought out reasoning for why this trade would not work. Personally I would not trade Melo for Stack either, I just wanted to know why for arguments sake. The only good I could see in it is. Say Denver traded the #3 and player for Stackhouse and Washington's #10. I say this because, I dont recall the last time a young team grew together to become a championship team. I may be wrong but somebody can tell me. Stackhouse, why not the most stand up guy around still is a veteran of this league and just him being around the amount of time he has and him knowing some of the ins and outs of the NBA would help out those other players.


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## BCH

> Originally posted by <b>heatfan</b>!
> i think i will try to take a stab at this arguement.
> 
> I think any trade mentioned will not work.
> 
> 
> first the melo for kwame and #10
> 
> Kwame is a PF. The Nug's already have Nene, so they have no need for Kwame. Also, Kwame and a #10 pick is debately worth more than melo. There is no reason for the wiz to make this trade either.
> 
> Neither team would want to do this trade
> 
> Now the trades involving what boils down to Stack for Melo
> 
> I see the wiz doing this in a second, but not the nugs. The reason is obvious. Both of these teams will not become championship contenders, or even playoff contenders next year. Both are in a state of rebuilding. Now when you are confronted with two talents, one young, one old, a team will always want the old one when rebuilding. If the nugs knew they could win something next season this will b different. but next season I think is about gelling. You have camby, finally back from injury, nene in his second yr, melo, s.g. who could be anyone, and probably arenas.
> 
> these players need time to gel, to learn to work together, and nene and melo need time to grow. camby needs time to come back from injury. arenas is going to be a 3rd yr, so this will allow him to break out.
> 
> all this equates to a pretty good lottery team. A trade for old talent would screw this up. It would hurt the nugs growth movement, so i see no reason to do this.
> 
> with stack, you loose youth and vitality for the upcoming seasons where you will be competing. arena's growth will be stunted, because he will have to play second fiddle. and stack cant even tutor nene, because the two dont play similar positions. I dont see a positive reason at all for this trade for denver.


The only thing I have to say about that argument is that with an incredibly young team like that, with Camby the supposed veteran, it is going to be tough to gel.


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> I dont understand whats funny about the post. Those are facts. You havent really backed up the point you were trying to make Nugzfan


but it was funny. thus i laughed. 

cause and effect.


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## NugzFan

> Originally posted by <b>BCH</b>!
> 
> 
> The only thing I have to say about that argument is that with an incredibly young team like that, with Camby the supposed veteran, it is going to be tough to gel.


no way. the nuggets are gellin like a felon. want some melon?

melo rules.


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## Absynth

I think having a good coach is key to a team being able to gel. From what I have seen, a team unable to gel is a team where niches are either undefined or unacceptable.

Look at the pacers, there players had no niche, and when isiah tried to create some they were unacceptable for the players. for example he wanted al harrington to be a garbage man, whos main focus would be rebounds and put backs. now thats just under utilizing talent, and thus hurt both harrington's growth and the teams ability to "gel"

A good coach is able to not only create a team that is able to coexist, but a team that can do this and not be unhappy.

Look at sacremento, each player not only has a set role, he does his role without complaint.

It is this that truely sets a good coach apart from a bad coach, its not up to the vetrans of the team, it is up to the coach. Silas, brown, etc, are good examples of coaches that can do this.


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## plasticman23

> Why would you say that Stackhouse is no longer an All-star caliber player??? Had that Michael Jordan fiasco not had gone down Stackhouse would have been an all-star. I dont understand because people use to complain that he shot too much then he changed his game to be more all-around and still the complaints. I love Carmelo Anthony just look at my posts, but I do have to say its to early for anyone to say Carmelo has the potential to be be better than Stackhouse. If thats the case break it down to me how??


Changed to be a more all-around game? how so? last season he averaged 3.7 rebounds, and his assists are actually the lowest they have been in 3 years. He is still a poor outside shooter (29% last year), and his field goal percentage is an unremarkable 40%. I can't say with certainty that Carmelo will do better than this(although i believe he will), but i think it's more than reasonable to say that he has the potential. The fact is that Melo is a much more skilled and accomplished player than Stackhouse was at that age and has a great upside.


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