# The Emeka and Luol Show today. The Official Duke vs Wake and Uconn vs UNC thread



## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Ok, what does Pax do today? he sits his *** down in his nothern suburban home and he watches the only 2 players that he should even be considering for this draft. Luol Deng battles Wake at 1 pm est ABC and Uconn plays at UNC after that. This is an exciting day for him, and us Bulls fans. As it increasingly looks like we will have the worst record in the NBA, discussed on another thread, the liklihood of landing one of these 2 is very high. I highly encourage everyone to watch these games and discuss both efforts here


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## badfish (Feb 4, 2003)

Thanks for the reminder rlucas. I'm all over it! Going to tape on my TIVO. :yes:


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Deng is showing a ton of defensive intensity and explosion already


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

I hope that this thread gets a lot of feedback. I am busy the rest of the day until game time, tonight. 

I am very interested in knowing how they did. (Can't find my vcr remote and wife is watching some junk on tv.)


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> I hope that this thread gets a lot of feedback. I am busy the rest of the day until game time, tonight.
> 
> I am very interested in knowing how they did. (Can't find my vcr remote and wife is watching some junk on tv.)


Duke is already opening a can of whupass on Wake. Deng has 2 pts. Taken an open court charge, made a great pass and a block shot out of nowhere. This kid is built like a tank


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Danny Ainge is in the house. Deng hits a smooth 3


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Jwill and his chick in the house

BTW-She is hot


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

Jay Williams in the house! He's standing up and watching the game at Cameron. Brent Musburger said he's still having problems with a nerve in his foot??? But he was standing up and sitting down and cheering. Good to see.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

RLucas, you're not in NYC right now, are you?


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> But he was standing up and sitting down and cheering. Good to see.


So now we know he contribute as much as Marcus Fizer...


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## jadakiss_25 (Aug 4, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>C.C.C.P</b>!
> 
> 
> So now we know he contribute as much as Marcus Fizer...


:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> RLucas, you're not in NYC right now, are you?


No DMD. Will be back in NYC whenever the NY Primary is. early march or something. Hope all is well


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## RoRo (Aug 21, 2002)

hmmm, no games yet on the west coast. paid programming until the carolina game.

at least the grizzlies are playing philly on telemundo. dalembert is starting to get it. gooooooaaaaaaaaal.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Luol with another 3. This kid is special. No, he isnt going to come to the NBA and average 20 like carmello. But can I say that he does everything better then Anthony other then score? Would that be pushing it? He certainly plays better D. He is an explosive athlete. He can be a point forward as his handle and passing is super. He hits the glass hard. he seems to be around every loose ball. He is really strong, like Anthony in that way. he sets off the ball screens. He really is a smart player. he knocks down the 3, he scores on the block and he has unbelievable hands. he catches everything thrown at him. 

Where Anthony was much better then him is in creating his own shot. Anthony can score on anyone. Deng gets his points out of the offense. I am not sure that Deng is the guy who can create for himself. He might be able to do that down the line but in the Dukes sets, he isnt getting that chance. I also think Carmello was slightly more hungry looking at least. But this kid is a star in the making. and I am not talking about a Rashard Lewis level star, im talking about a PPierce level star

A couple of other kids who look good to me. JRedick. This kid isnt fast or big enough to play in the NBA. But have you ever seen a better 20 year old pure shooter. He will find a spot in the NBA as a Steve Kerr type. Shelden Williams might be an undersized 4, but so was Carlos Boozer. This kid has the perfect NBA body. I think he is worth watching more.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

I think Deng looks like a less athletic Joe Johnson.

If he is a lottery pick it will be based on potential.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> I think Deng looks like a less athletic Joe Johnson.
> 
> If he is a lottery pick it will be based on potential.


I think you're watching the Illinois-Iowa game. The Duke-Wake Forest game is on ABC.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

I think it is funny how people always get fed up when you don't compare their favorite college players to superstars.

Just hilarious.

Deng isn't even as good as Johnson was in the NCAA.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> I think it is funny how people always get fed up when you don't compare their favorite college players to superstars.
> 
> Just hilarious.
> ...


\

Give it up mate


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## T.Shock (Feb 11, 2003)

I like Deng, but come draft day barring any trades until then I'd be interested to see what Crawford + Curry + High 1st for Middle 1st + Player would be. And the player I take in the Middle 1st is Josh Childress. He's similar to Deng, but is ready to ball in the L. No doubt about it.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>T.Shock</b>!
> I like Deng, but come draft day barring any trades until then I'd be interested to see what Crawford + Curry + High 1st for Middle 1st + Player would be. And the player I take in the Middle 1st is Josh Childress. He's similar to Deng, but is ready to ball in the L. No doubt about it.


T I was thinking about Childress earlier today. Can you tell me more about his game?


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> I think it is funny how people always get fed up when you don't compare their favorite college players to superstars.
> 
> Just hilarious.
> ...


Fair enough:

I actually like the Johnson comparison to an extent. Except, Deng knows how to handle himself better in the post. Though, Deng will be a lottery pick--he could contribute for a NBA team right now.

I like the Carmelo comparison in that both players are classic fowards--not really pf, not really sf. I love wathcing Deng work the post, and his handle in the open court isn't bad at all. I don't know if Deng has the "scoring sense" that makes Anthony special. But, Deng is a natural defender and a quicker athlete. I was actually worried when Carmelo came in to the league whether he would be able to hang with the quicker perimiter players.

As much as I like Emeka, if I had to choose between these college blue-chips (I don't know what's going on in Europe or HS) I would have to go with Deng.


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## Chicago_Cow (Mar 5, 2003)

What channel is the Uconn game on? It isn't on ABC.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

It's on CBS in Boston.


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## Chicago_Cow (Mar 5, 2003)

I'm getting the Michigan vs. Michigan State game. Who gives a damn about Wolverines!


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

Okafor running the break for his second slam--this kid reeks killer instinct.


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## Chicago_Cow (Mar 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>C.C.C.P</b>!
> Okafor running the break for his second slam--this kid reeks killer instinct.


Why the hell am I getting the Michigan v. the Michigan St game?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Im in London and I am getting the Uconn game. Yes! 

I am in love with Emeka

literally


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> 
> 
> Why the hell am I getting the Michigan v. the Michigan St game?


Bad luck for you Cow. This must be a regional broadcast. This kind of a high profile game should be shown nationally. We'll try to keep you updated.

Okafor looks great to start with on both sides of the ball.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> Im in London and I am getting the Uconn game. Yes!
> 
> I am in love with Emeka
> ...


Yeah, but doesn't Jawad Williams look hot in that Jason Vorhees mask? 

 

Poor kid might have a triple double and still not get laid tonight.


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

We have to put our hands on Emeka.He's the man in the coming draft.


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

Did they show any GMs or scouts?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>curry_52</b>!
> Did they show any GMs or scouts?


Danny Ainge was at the Duke game. might have made the trip to UNC, its only 6 miles away. Jwill was there, maybe he is scouting for us. He cant be worse then Dukan


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>curry_52</b>!
> Did they show any GMs or scouts?


Not yet, but Danny Ainge was at the Duke/Wake game.

This game is going to be fun b/c NC is hanging with UConn.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

Gordon is not as skilled, but he goes to the rack recklessly like Iverson.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Emeka is Zo redux. I love Deng, but right now its Okafor 1, Deng 1a


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> I'm getting the Michigan vs. Michigan State game. Who gives a damn about Wolverines!


Good, so we know what game the network is going to cut to when its Uconn-NC is tied with 5:00 left. :no:


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> Emeka is Zo redux. I love Deng, but right now its Okafor 1, Deng 1a


I know, 

you watch one and think he's the answer, you watch the other and your opinion swings. 

Emeka reminds me a lot of a more refined Amare Stoudomire slightly. Both run the floor like gazelles and have that short post jump shot.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

UNC is really bringing it today. But the Uconn run is bound to come


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

I think that Paxson will try and put his stamp on this team and make people forget about Krause. How?
By Drafting Okafor
By Trading Chandler or Curry away
By letting JC walk or agreeing to a sign and trade.
Build around Hinrich, Okafor and Curry/Chandler
He already has his coach on place
No more Rose, Marshall. E-Rob isnt far away from following the same path.


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

Emeka in double figures already (points)?


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> UNC is really bringing it today. But the Uconn run is bound to come


I think UConn, Carolina, Duke and Arizona have the most talented rosters in the NCAA right now.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

im not sure if Emeka has a block yet, but he has altered a half dozen shots easy


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

Villanueva is getting killed on D. NC knows he's cheating too much and keeps running into backdoor screens. He just isn't holding his own in the post.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Emeka just blocked a shot to Raleigh


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Carolina can do no wrong right now


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

UConn has a big challenge on their hands for the 2nd half. Guess we'll get a good chance to see how Emeka and the boys handle adversity.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Okafor is the real deal. Bottom line. I know his team is losing right now. And I'm pulling for UNC to pull the upset. But Okafor is a man amongst boys. There's no one on either team as dominant.

His size does make me worry. But his ability to block shots and stay out of foul trouble is very impressive.


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

Emeka with the double and the foul!

:grinning:


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

That last block was one of the most amazing I've ever seen. How do you block a ball so well shielded from the defender? He has amazing quickness and timing on his blocks. He's truly taken over this game.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I'm amazed how the entire UCONN team can avoid fouls. They slap so much and jump at the glass so much...but hardly ever get fouls.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>C.C.C.P</b>!
> 
> 
> I know,
> ...


Naw, Emeka isn't nearly as skilled as Amare offensively.

I guess you haven't watched Amare this season.

Emeka is my #1 or #2 pick but he does look a little short.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I like Amare more than Emeka. I think Amare is the kind of guy who would give Emeka a lot of problems. Athletic and mean. Doesn't throw anything up soft.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Didnt see this thread, but I've been watching the whole game. 

Okafor is a beast, but UNC baby!! 

MCCants!!


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> I like Amare more than Emeka. I think Amare is the kind of guy who would give Emeka a lot of problems. Athletic and mean. Doesn't throw anything up soft.


I'm guessing that Amare will remain the more effective offensive player early in their careers, but right now Emeka is much better on defense, both help and man, and obviously the blocks as well. Okafor is going to be a defensive force in the NBA too. His quickness and timing are amazing. His offensive game is also coming around nicely, and he's so fundamentally sound.


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

I really like the zo comparison someone gave earlier.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Now that my team has pulled off the upset, its okay for me to say that Okafor is the next big thing. 

Hes like smarter version of Amare, and a better shotblocker. 

If we can get this guy, do it in a second. I think starting to build this team through smart intelligent hard working players is the best thing at this point. Hinrich was a good start, now Okafor is the next step.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Now that my team has pulled off the upset, its okay for me to say that Okafor is the next big thing.
> 
> Hes like smarter version of Amare, and a better shotblocker.
> ...


That's all fine and good, but we'll have to get in the top 3 picks to get him or Deng, and there is no guarantee of that no matter how bad our record is.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Please.

How can you compare that?

First of all Okafor is playing in the NCAA and not NBA. Amare would go totally crazy on college competition.

Okafor is a great shotblocker, but so would Amare in college and also is a very good shotblocker in the NBA.

I also don't think Okafor is a better man to man defender. Not at all. Amare is very good man to man. Okafor is more of a team defender.

Amare totally dominates offensively within the arc. Turnaround J, midrange J, crossover, hookshot, backdown... He is leading fastbreaks and dribbling it coast to coast through traffic..
Okafor is not nearly as complete offensively not in college basketball.

Okafor also needs to improve on passing, especially out of double teams.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Emeka is our guy. And he will be better then Amare. Im not concerned about that. 

Gordons stock took a hit today. He really looked bothered out there


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

I think Amare will be a more unstoppable offense while Okafor will be a better defender. Like I said earlier I really liked the Zo comparison. Amare and Okafor are about the same size and posses close to the same quickness but Amare is all around more athletic.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Please.
> 
> How can you compare that?
> ...


Its no insult to Amare, Okafor is the future. I wasn't trying to knock Amare, its praise for Okafor. 

Most of Okafors blocks came from on the ball defense today, and he only had 1 or 2 fouls? Thats GREAT on the ball defense, not to mention hes a great team defender as well. 

Amare may be better on offense, but not much. Okafor is also the smarter more intelligent player, and he has a great work ethic. He could easily improve his offensive game a ton within 2-3 years.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TyGuy</b>!
> I think Amare will be a more unstoppable offense while Okafor will be a better defender. Like I said earlier I really liked the Zo comparison. Amare and Okafor are about the same size and posses close to the same quickness but Amare is all around more athletic.


fair enough. But its not like there is a huge gulf in athletic ability. Its very tight. Plus Emeka is a whole world smarter then Amare. He totally understands how to play the game


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> Emeka is our guy. And he will be better then Amare. Im not concerned about that.
> 
> Gordons stock took a hit today. He really looked bothered out there


You are hilarious rlucas. Do you still think that Curry and Chandler are at least as good as Amare?

I bet you haven't seen Amare play in more than a year.

Okafor will be very good but I don't see him becoming anything better than an offensively worse Amare.

He looks great on defense in college but so would Amare. Okafors defensive stats won't be as impressive in the NBA because when he tries to block shots as agressively he will get into foul trouble quick because in the NBA they go stronger to the hole.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Amare may be better on offense, but not much. Okafor is also the smarter more intelligent player, and he has a great work ethic. He could easily improve his offensive game a ton within 2-3 years.


Your basketball smarts detector huh?

Amare plays basketball for a lot less than Okafor and is much better at this point.
Plus Amare has a great work ethic also.


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

Emeka 29,13,6blks

Impact player right away and one of the best future shotblockers in the league(despite size)


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> You are hilarious rlucas. Do you still think that Curry and Chandler are at least as good as Amare?
> ...


there you go again. I watched Amare about 5 times this year. He totally gets by on athletic ability. He doesnt have much upstairs. I think your beef is with others. Id take Okafor before Id take Amare. My opinion


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

I think Emeke is capable of averaging 20 ppg 11 boards and 3 blocks in this league.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

I'm not going to argue with you BigAmare, its pretty known that you're bias because hes your favorite player. 

So I'll just kill that comparison and go with the Zo comparison. Either way, Okafor will be a monster and we need to pounce on him if given the chance.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> there you go again. I watched Amare about 5 times this year. He totally gets by on athletic ability. He doesnt have much upstairs. I think your beef is with others. Id take Okafor before Id take Amare. My opinion


Agreed


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>bullet</b>!
> Emeka 29,13,6blks
> 
> Impact player right away and one of the best future shotblockers in the league(despite size)


best big man prospect the NBA has seen since Tim Duncan. better then yao, better then Curry/Chandler/Amare/Brown, better then Darko


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Ridiculous.

Amare has a high IQ, read the 12 pages main article on Amare's life in last years "NY Times- Sunday Magazin".

Amare gets by on athletic ability only? He is hitting Js, hooks everything
He is passing the ball out of the double teams very well and finds open teammates.

At best you have seen Amare only with Marbury playing.

Since Amare is back from injury he plays like a top5 PF in this league RIGHT NOW , possibly even top 3.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Yeah Okafor plays better "fundementally" and is going to be the better defender.

But I think Amare will be regarded as the better player for the entirety of Okafor's career.

I agree sort of with BigAmare. If Mare was playing against the same competition as Okafor he would be dominating like a crazy man in a scissors shop.

If Amare was playing for UConn instead of Okafor, they probably beat UNC today. Amare possesses a very rare killer instinct.

I can't wait to see the matchup next year though. That's for sure.

They are the same age, correct?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

by the way, Emeka is a very good offensive player. Considering he had zero offense last year and now look at what he is doing. This guy will be a Zo like player in about 2 years. And we need to get him


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## bullet (Jul 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> best big man prospect the NBA has seen since Tim Duncan. better then yao, better then Curry/Chandler/Amare/Brown, better then Darko


I think i agree with u on that,very dominent!!


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Ridiculous.
> 
> Amare has a high IQ, read the 12 pages main article on Amare's life in last years "NY Times- Sunday Magazin".
> ...


Whatever. Cause he can fire his agent and bust his mother out of prison doesnt mean he is a smart player or person. He is a knee injury away from being a non factor. Emeka is a very smart player and doesnt rely on athletic ability as much. Amare is all just jump and dunk. Kind of a modern day version of Kemp


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

I really like both players and would take either in a heart beat. Both have unique qualities that will make them good if not great players in the nba.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Yeah Okafor plays better "fundementally" and is going to be the better defender.
> 
> But I think Amare will be regarded as the better player for the entirety of Okafor's career.
> ...


Amares HS team did not have a winning record.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Yeah Okafor plays better "fundementally" and is going to be the better defender.
> 
> But I think Amare will be regarded as the better player for the entirety of Okafor's career.
> ...


Okafor is a little older than Amare and has at least 2 years more basketball experience than Amare.

Okafor dominates NCAA competition and a bunch of 20 year old undersized players.

Amare dominates NBA competition including the best defenders at his position.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> by the way, Emeka is a very good offensive player. Considering he had zero offense last year and now look at what he is doing. This guy will be a Zo like player in about 2 years. And we need to get him


I think Shawn Kemp was better in his prime than Zo was in his. Which is kind of what the Amare, Emeka comparison would boil down to.

A guy that other teams respect for his hard work. Or a guy that other teams fear for his ferocity.

And again. BigAmare is correct again, sort of. Amare has been a much better player since Steph left.

You want to talk about the progression in Emeka's offense. How about the progression in Amare's offense? Amare is better now and has the higher ceiling offensively.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

im watching the second half on tivo right now. Emeka just had the block of the century


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> Amares HS team did not have a winning record.


You are a fool now seriously.

First of all Amare's highschool team was 16-13.

Second of all what is the point? Amare dominated highschool basketball that was widely known. 30ppg 15rpg 6bpg.

Do you want to say he is a loser? Yeah what a loser winning ROY first ever from highschool, leading his team to the playoffs, holding his own against the MVP, banks in 3 and look at the impact he has on his team now again.


Third of all, Amare didn't play one highschool season. And his teammates didn't give him the ball enough that was often pointed out before that draft.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> You are a fool now seriously.
> ...


if your going to start calling people names, please leave the board. 16-13 is basically a losing record when you have an NBA player on your roster. now i see why you have 60 something odd votes and only 2 stars. if you dont want to discuss things intelligently, take your banter back to the phoenix board.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> Amare is all just jump and dunk. Kind of a modern day version of Kemp


You said this like Kemp wasn't a top 5 player at his peak. Just because he made a littany of personal mistakes that killed his career, it doesn't mean Kemp wasn't a special player.

Once Kemp added the J to his game in 95/96 he was pretty much unstoppable. He was a monster. Better than Malone from 95-97, and a top 5 player in those years. People didn't pay attention because he was doing it off the radar in Seattle. But I guarantee if you polled anyone in the league at that time Kemp was the most feared 4 you could play.

I think Amare will be more like a Karl Malone/Kemp hybrid than a straight beast like Kemp was. Because I think he's going to play a long time and he will incorporate the J into game much more effectively and much quicker than Kemp was able to.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Doesn't intelligence include talking facts rather than making up stupid stuff like that?

I could care less about a rating.

Did you ever look up what the stars actually mean?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Doesn't intelligence include talking facts rather than making up stupid stuff like that?
> 
> I could care less about a rating.
> ...


16-13 is not very impressive. and neither are the suns.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> 
> 
> You said this like Kemp wasn't a top 5 player at his peak. Just because he made a littany of personal mistakes that killed his career, it doesn't mean Kemp wasn't a special player.
> ...



but it isnt sustainable. one injury, or a little age, and your done. you can survive on it, but at some point, you have to know the game intelligently to continue to get better. Kemp got fat and that was the end of him. Thats not to say Amare will get fat or hurt, but unless he discovers some aspect to his game that he doesnt yet have, then I would take Emeka. i think its a fact that Emeka is a smarter player and a better leader. I think its also a fact that we arent talking about an Amare level defender either. We are talking about a guy who is going to be all NBA first or second team defense on day one. The difference is Amare might, MIGHT, be better offensively right now. But in 2 years, I would think its far closer. Then again, if the Bulls get him, they might find a way to screw him up too. but id like that shot


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Last Game

9:42) [PHX 8-4] Stoudemire Jump Shot: Made (4 PTS)
6:25) [PHX 19-9] Stoudemire Jump Shot: Made (6 PTS)
10:42) [PHX 35-28] Stoudemire Jump Shot: Made (9 PTS)
1:02) [PHX 62-42] Stoudemire Jump Shot: Made (17 PTS)
11:01) [PHX 64-49] Stoudemire Jump Shot: Made (19 PTS)

Rest layups on postmoves, hookshots, dunks, freethrows.


----------



## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

rlucas you need to quit talking because you obviously have no clue about Amare Stoudemire.

It is just like at the beginning of the season when you said that Chandler and Curry were better and had so much more skill.

Unbelievable.


----------



## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> leading his team to the playoffs


Marbury and Marion had more to do with making the playoffs than Amare last year. 

Anyways, it will remain to be seen. I think Amare has potential to be a top 5 PF in the league, but I think Okafor has potential to be a top 5 player in the league. Okafor has smarts and timing and skills that go beyond athletic ability. I hate when people say hes doing it against college players so it doesnt mean anything. Carmelo averaged 22 in college, and averages 18 now, thats not much of a difference. The only advantage Amare has over Okafor right now is the fact that hes played in the NBA already for longer, so hes already made the adjustment. By the time both players are 25, I think it'll be a given that Okafor is the better player.


----------



## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Last Game
> 
> 9:42) [PHX 8-4] Stoudemire Jump Shot: Made (4 PTS)
> ...


Congrats


----------



## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> i think its a fact that Emeka is a smarter player and a better leader.


That is so flat out ridiculous.

Amare was a leader from day one.

And this season he talks to rookies, he explains things defensively to teammates and all that stuff.
He is a leader on and off the court.

When he was injured in the summer he still travelled with the summer league guys and helped them from the sidelines and showed he is a leader.

When he was injured this season, he travelled with the team all the time and supported them.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

It is a waste to talk with you, at least futuresixten makes sense, he probably watched the games rather than making things up like he wishes from watching boxscores.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> rlucas you need to quit talking because you obviously have no clue about Amare Stoudemire.
> 
> It is just like at the beginning of the season when you said that Chandler and Curry were better and had so much more skill.
> ...


Currys last 25 games last year are better then any 25 game stretch that Amare has ever had. But I seriously think you have me mixed up with someone else. I said I think chandler and curry are better. And they probably would be if the Bulls didnt screw them up so much. But again, your beef is with someone else. No one is saying that Amare sucks. I certainly am not. But its quite clear that you are in love with the guy and therefore not worth my time talking about it with. But what I will say is that your boy has a tremendous game. But I dont believe that he has anywhere near the intangibles that Okafor or a ton of other guys have. we are talking about a guy whose HS team didnt do anything. The Suns were pretty good last year, this year, not so good. Part of that is Amare has been hurt. To even say Amare is as cerebral as Emeka is a freaking joke.


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

Honestly if I were to take a gamble with either player i would chose Amare. He reminds me a lot of Kemp and just watching Amare from last year and then this year he looks like he is adding more elements to his game. He isnt just running and jumping over people. Ive seen him use nice footwork in the games that Marbury has been gone and then hook it over people. He has been very impressive and if he developed an outside jumpshot he could be very unstoppable. However I think both will be very good players in the league.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> That is so flat out ridiculous.
> ...


Are you sure he wasnt busting his mom out of jail, or firing his agent, or supporting his father figure? Seems like that this guy has a lot of baggage. In fact, that was what your NY Times article said. The point of that article was that here was a great player who was handed to much responsibility to early. He was taking care of his brother, and his brother never showed up for school. He fired his agent, who basically made him cause his mom wanted it. his mom is a convict. It didnt sound like leadership qualities to me. That article wasnt entirely flattering. again, its pretty mature to resort to calling people names. reread the article when talking about facts


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TyGuy</b>!
> Honestly if I were to take a gamble with either player i would chose Amare. He reminds me a lot of Kemp and just watching Amare from last year and then this year he looks like he is adding more elements to his game. He isnt just running and jumping over people. Ive seen him use nice footwork in the games that Marbury has been gone and then hook it over people. He has been very impressive and if he developed an outside jumpshot he could be very unstoppable. However I think both will be very good players in the league.


I dont think you can go wrong with either. It depends on what you want


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## T.Shock (Feb 11, 2003)

I have two legitimate beefs with both sides of the argument. Calling Stoudemire a possible top 3 at PF is just the most ridiculous comment ever. KG, Dirk, Duncan, Malone, Gasol. There are 5 better players right there. Amare is very similar to Kemp. Just a big guy who has some semblence of a game but can make opponents back down. Emeka is far from Alonzo though. The thing that concerns me about Emeka is his ability to hit the open jumper from 15 or 18. He won't be able to overwhelm people with his size in the league. His lack of a shot really worries me. 

Anyways rlucas to answer your question about Childress. Childress has a good all-around game, but has a knock for being soft. He isn't an imposing physical specimen but stands about 6'8''. He can shoot, has range, and has no problems going to the bucket. Above-average on defense, he has a huge wing span that allows him to play passing lanes. His speed concerns me, but I think its an overblown issue a lot like Carmelo's speed was last year. He's an option if we can move down and pickup a good player and then grab Childress. He's ready to contribute and being from Stanford has no problem diving for losse balls. Smart player as well who doesn't turn the ball over. Here is his official scouting report from the people at ESPN 

A tremendous wing or shooting guard prospect ... Often compared to George Gervin ... Possesses a nice stroke coming off screens, pulling up off a dribble, or spotting up ... Able to bring the ball upcourt without making mistakes ... A fluid player who looks as if he's getting by on finesse and talent alone, and this couldn't be farther from the truth ... Really works to free himself up for a shot, and he has great range on his jumper ... Gets as many rebounds as one could ever expect from a player at his position ... Good passing touch ... Knows how to deliver the ball to big men, from the high post or making the entry pass from the wing ... A perfect candidate to feed a big man because of the threat of the return pass and jump shot ... Long arms allow him to be a terror in the passing lanes, and when he puts his mind to attacking who he's defending, he can cause havoc on the ball ... Should be a weapon in a pressing defense.

Stats
Last Year(14 pts/8 bds/1 stl/1 blk/33 % 3PT/42% FG/34 min)
This Year(4 gms/12 pts/6 bds/1 stl/1 blk/20 % 3PT/51% FG/19 min)


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>T.Shock</b>!
> I have two legitimate beefs with both sides of the argument. Calling Stoudemire a possible top 3 at PF is just the most ridiculous comment ever. KG, Dirk, Duncan, Malone, Gasol. There are 5 better players right there. Amare is very similar to Kemp. Just a big guy who has some semblence of a game but can make opponents back down. Emeka is far from Alonzo though. The thing that concerns me about Emeka is his ability to hit the open jumper from 15 or 18. He won't be able to overwhelm people with his size in the league. His lack of a shot really worries me.
> 
> Anyways rlucas to answer your question about Childress. Childress has a good all-around game, but has a knock for being soft. He isn't an imposing physical specimen but stands about 6'8''. He can shoot, has range, and has no problems going to the bucket. Above-average on defense, he has a huge wing span that allows him to play passing lanes. His speed concerns me, but I think its an overblown issue a lot like Carmelo's speed was last year. He's an option if we can move down and pickup a good player and then grab Childress. He's ready to contribute and being from Stanford has no problem diving for losse balls. Smart player as well who doesn't turn the ball over. Here is his official scouting report from the people at ESPN
> ...


Great T. Thanks for the scouting report. He seems like a winner to me. Though I have only seen him once. But all Stanford does is win. And we need a player at his position. So its worth looking at him closer


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Malone had a horrible jumper when he came into the league. Now look at him. Okafor has the work ethic and intelligence to do the same thing.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

If you watched Amare in the last games since he is back you wouldn't dare to put Malone, Gasol or Nowitzki over him. Nowitzki is a SF playing PF because of his height.

Duncan, Garnett, O'Neal and Brand. That is the only ones and I would seriously argue about Brand and probably O'Neal also. Amare already has a better offensive game than either Brand and JO.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Malone had a horrible jumper when he came into the league. Now look at him. Okafor has the work ethic and intelligence to do the same thing.


I think his offense is far better then being given credit for. He has a nice move coming across the lane from either side. And he seems to be able to rotate off his man and shoot a little baseline J. But for him to get to that top 10 level in the NBA, he is going to need to expand his range out to 18-20 feet. i think that wont be an issue


----------



## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> If you watched Amare in the last games since he is back you wouldn't dare to put Malone, Gasol or Nowitzki over him. Nowitzki is a SF playing PF because of his height.
> 
> Duncan, Garnett, O'Neal and Brand. That is the only ones and I would seriously argue about Brand and probably O'Neal also. Amare already has a better offensive game than either Brand and JO.


Chris Webber


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> Are you sure he wasnt busting his mom out of jail, or firing his agent, or supporting his father figure? Seems like that this guy has a lot of baggage. In fact, that was what your NY Times article said. The point of that article was that here was a great player who was handed to much responsibility to early. He was taking care of his brother, and his brother never showed up for school. He fired his agent, who basically made him cause his mom wanted it. his mom is a convict. It didnt sound like leadership qualities to me. That article wasnt entirely flattering. again, its pretty mature to resort to calling people names. reread the article when talking about facts


His family - what an indicator about Amare.

That article made the point that Amare has a high IQ but his school suffered because of his family problems and moving 6 times leading to change school 6 times.

Amare has his own head but of course he still supports his mother like every son would.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TyGuy</b>!
> Chris Webber


Chris Webber isn't even playing for over 8 month and suffered the same injury that Penny had.
At the time Webber has fully recovered if he ever does , Amare will be even better than now.


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

Amare still has a long time before he can even compare to webber. When Webber gets back there is no way Amare has surpassed him.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> His family - what an indicator about Amare.
> ...


and supports the fact that his kid bro doesnt like going to school


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> and supports the fact that his kid bro doesnt like going to school


This has nothing to do with Amare as a player and shouldnt be brought into this argument.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TyGuy</b>!
> Amare still has a long time before he can even compare to webber. When Webber gets back there is no way Amare has surpassed him.


Chris Webber, Amare? Give it a break. Webber is a different universe away then Amare right now. 3 years maybe not. But right now, no way. Lay off the kool-aid


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TyGuy</b>!
> This has nothing to do with Amare as a player and shouldnt be brought into this argument.


When leadership gets brought into it, who would you rather want? The guy who graduates college with a 3.9 GPA in 3 years or the guy who basically allowed his little brother to take a year off and sit by the pool last year? This is a legit leadership question.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Even though Webber isnt back, I'd still put Brad Miller over Amare, easily. 

Duncan
KG
Brand
Walker
Randolph
R. Wallace
B. Wallace
Joneal
Gasol
Chandler
Webber
Malone
B. Miller

Amare may be almost as good as some of those guys, and maybe equal to a couple of them, but hes not BETTER than any of them by a margin worth noting.


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> When leadership gets brought into it, who would you rather want? The guy who graduates college with a 3.9 GPA in 3 years or the guy who basically allowed his little brother to take a year off and sit by the pool last year? This is a legit leadership question.


That still has nothing to do with leadership quality on the basketball court. His brother is his own person, Amare isnt responsible for his destiny.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Even though Webber isnt back, I'd still put Brad Miller over Amare, easily.
> 
> Duncan
> ...


id agree with alot of this. i think Amare is probably better then rasheed, karl malone (today), chandler (there is no doubt about this i am afraid to say). But he isnt better or worse then Gasol or Randolph or Brand. he isnt as good as miller, Webber, Jermaine, Big Ben or Walker today. In 3 years, it might be different.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TyGuy</b>!
> That still has nothing to do with leadership quality on the basketball court. His brother is his own person, Amare isnt responsible for his destiny.


He took the responsiblity for this kid. so that isnt true. his attitude was that he didnt need to go to school. He and his father figure basically allowed this kid to do whatever he wanted. We arent talking about some 17 year old. i think this kid is like 12-14. So it is a knock on his leadership. There can be no doubt about that


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## DaFuture (Nov 5, 2002)

*Okafor ....*

doesnt impress me never has. Hes one of those guys who just plays, nothing flashy nothing extraordinary about him. He just plays hard. the only thing exceptional about him is is shotblocking ability. He is not a franchise savior, like some of you believe. I already see people placing high expectations on akid who is playing college basketball at a time where there are few good college big men. I can see it now in a couple of years when he is struggling we will be clamoring to trade him for a bag of beans.




The thing that sticks out to me about Okafor is in 2002 when Maryland played UCONN and Okafor was basically punked by Lonny Baxter and Chris Wilcox, in fact everytime i have seen him play agianst a guy who is bigger and stronger than him he has struggled. Mike Sweetney ate his lunch last year like he was a preschooler. I dont think hes a bad player. Hes a coaches dream, he works, hard studies the game, and plays hard, but he doesnt have the physical attributes that would make him a franchise savior.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Man, Brand is so underrated. He is better considerably than Amare. He averages 3 more points, 4 more rebounds, 1 more block and 2 more assists on a better team.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Amare since he is back from the injury and starting. Without Marbury.

24ppg 7.5rpg 2.3apg 2.5spg 59%FG in only 33mpg

Suns on a 2 game winning streak and none of the players in the trade coming back are making a contribution.

28 points in a half against the Nuggets, when he played only 5 minutes in the first, almost got his team back in the game alone.
17 points in the first half against Golden State without many minutes and leading his team up by 20 and more in the first half.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

*Re: Okafor ....*



> Originally posted by <b>DaFuture</b>!
> doesnt impress me never has. Hes one of those guys who just plays, nothing flashy nothing extraordinary about him. He just plays hard. the only thing exceptional about him is is shotblocking ability. He is not a franchise savior, like osme of you believe. I already see people placing high expectations on akid who is playing college basketball at a time where there are few good college big men. The thing that sticks out to me about Okafor is in 2002 when Maryland played UCONN and Okafor was basically punked by Lonny Baxter and Chris Wilcox, in fact everytime i have seen him play agianst a guy who is bigger and stronger than him he has struggled. Mike Sweetney ate his lunch last year like he was a preschooler. I dont think hes a bad player. Hes a coaches dream, he works, hard studies the game, and plays hard, but he doesnt have the physical attributes that would make him a franchise savior.


well May is a top notch NBA quality prospect in a year or 2. And what did Emeka do to him on the road today? 29 13-15 bds, 5 blks. I seem to recall that he had very good showings against Sweetney last year.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> He took the responsiblity for this kid. so that isnt true. his attitude was that he didnt need to go to school. He and his father figure basically allowed this kid to do whatever he wanted. We arent talking about some 17 year old. i think this kid is like 12-14. So it is a knock on his leadership. There can be no doubt about that


No insults please- MikeDC 

Amare can't watch 24/7 about his brother when he plays a 82 game NBA schedule.
Their father figure lived with them.

Besides that his brother isn't 12-14. He is 17 or so.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

when doing the Amare vs Emeka thing. It really depends on what you want. If you look at it stats wise, and not look at the intangibles (which i would give to Emeka in a landslide) this is what I see as the max numbers

Amare 22 pts, 8 bds, 2 blks, 47% from the floor

Emeka 17 pts 13 bds, 3.5 blks, 55% from the floor. 

If you want scoring, you might be better off taking Emeka. If you want rebounding, defense, take Amare. depends on what you want.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> You are so retarded.
> ...


Reported


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

LOL

8rpg max for Amare? lol lol lol LOL

That would be a career low, I have no words for you.

47%FG that would also be a career lol.

OMG you are losing it . Just shows that you don't know what you are talking about.


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## DaFuture (Nov 5, 2002)

May is nice but he is soft. I suggest you go and watch the MD-UNC kid for a kid his size he plays like the Pillsbury Doughboy. He has skills but he doesnt play up to his size. Very EC-like. Sweetney ate him up.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Amare since he is back from the injury and starting. Without Marbury.
> 
> 24ppg 7.5rpg 2.3apg 2.5spg 59%FG in only 33mpg
> ...


7.5 bds? Man, thats Eddy Curry Like. Wow, he is awesome!


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> LOL
> 
> 8rpg max for Amare? lol lol lol LOL
> ...


8.5 bds this year. about that last year. Not scaring anybody yet


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

47%FG that would also be a career lol.

OMG you are losing it . Just shows that you don't know what you are talking about.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 47%FG that would also be a career lol.
> 
> OMG you are losing it . Just shows that you don't know what you are talking about.


47% this year, 47% last year. And now defenses can key on him. Count on it.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> 7.5 bds? Man, thats Eddy Curry Like. Wow, he is awesome!


Yeah because he had just 4 against Golden State when his team outrebounded Golden State by 9 anyway and Zarko , Marion, Voshkul, White already combined for 27 rebounds.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> 47% this year, 47% last year. And now defenses can key on him. Count on it.


Yeah his FG% dropped to 60% now.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

ouch. There's former Chicago Bull Brad Miller in another list amongst top forwards in the NBA. That hurts. It really does.

Brand and Miller. Goddamn you Jerry Krause. I think I'm going to go cry now.

Anyhow. BigAmare is saying right now, not over the course of the last two seasons, that Amare is playing near top 5 level at PF.

And I think there is an arguement to be made. (Webber RIGHT NOW is not in basketball shape according to what I heard the other night. So literally, right now, Amare is better than Webber.)

Here's the list that was given:
Duncan
KG
Brand
Walker
Randolph
R. Wallace
B. Wallace
Joneal
Gasol
Chandler
Webber
Malone
B. Miller

Duncan, yes.
KG, yes.
Brand, Yes.
Walker...hell no. What Walker are you watching? Antoine right?
Randolph...been playing pretty poorly since Rasheed went down.
R. Wallace...playing SF.
B. Wallace....maybe.
JO...Yes.
Gasol...maybe if Memphis let him play to his ablity.
Chandler...hell no.
Webber...already addressed.
Malone...no. And he's injured anyways. But even healthy he's just too old.
B. Milller...I would say he would be hardpressed to match Amare if he were playing for the Suns. He's really benefitting from his supporting cast. But I guess it's debatable.

So you're looking at Amare in his second year out of high school as somewhere between 5-7 at the most talented position in the NBA.

And I do think Amare is going to improve. As much or more than Okafor. I mean...why not? He's already added several things to his game from last year.

And I don't understand how someone's GPA has anything to do with Basketball. Chris Dudley was probably a pretty smart guy too, but he never learned how to hit a free throw.

Whereas a lot of great players are dumb as bricks off the court. Basketball isn't rocket science.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah because he had just 4 against Golden State when his team outrebounded Golden State by 9 anyway and Zarko , Marion, Voshkul, White already combined for 27 rebounds.


So Zarko is a better rebounder? Or maybe its Voskuhl? We have Eddy Curry, so we know every excuse


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

BigAmare, where do you think Amare will top out stat wise?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah his FG% dropped to 60% now.


3 games doesnt make a career. But to you it might. Feeble little mind


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> ouch. There's former Chicago Bull Brad Miller in another list amongst top forwards in the NBA. That hurts. It really does.
> 
> Brand and Miller. Goddamn you Jerry Krause. I think I'm going to go cry now.
> ...


its about leadership. Would you listen to the guy who is accomplished off the court or the guy whose off the court life has been one big saga? There is a reason Dudley lasted nearly 12 years in the NBA, and that was intelligence. Duncan doesnt have Amares athletic qualities, but he is about 3x the player Amare is. Why? Upstairs.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Top out?

Probably 25-28ppg 11-13rpg 3-4bpg in his prime

He will definately be one of the top scorers in his prime. Stats probably comparable to Malone in his prime.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> BigAmare, where do you think Amare will top out stat wise?


ill answer it for Big Amare

72 ppg, 32 rpg, 98% FG, 17 blks, 14 apg, 100FT%, 89% 3 pgs, 10 spg. He will average a quintuple double for his best year and lead Phoenix to an 82-0 record and a ring. Why do they need Kobe, they have Amare?


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Top out?
> 
> Probably 25-28ppg 11-13rpg 3-4bpg in his prime
> ...


Neither T-Mac, Iverson, Pierce nor Duncan (NOBODY!!) is averaging 28 points per games or more. What makes you believe he will do so? I bet that you any team brings Rodman at 42 back from ABA and he can slow down Amare. 
And it was so funny watching him pad stats against Denver when they were down by 25. Too bad he saved the explosive dunks once his team was down by 20+ and playing against Elson and Co.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> its about leadership. Would you listen to the guy who is accomplished off the court or the guy whose off the court life has been one big saga? There is a reason Dudley lasted nearly 12 years in the NBA, and that was intelligence. Duncan doesnt have Amares athletic qualities, but he is about 3x the player Amare is. Why? Upstairs.


Do you really view Amare as that big of a liability "upstairs"? I like his competitive fire, personally. I agree he's not a cerebral player like Tim(my second favorite player after Iverson) but he's not Darius Miles or anything. He knows how to play the game pretty well. I thought the Suns were impressed with his ability to take coaching last year? That would seem to portend a bright future.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Walker...hell no. What Walker are you watching? Antoine right?


Walkers last three games hes averaging 13 pts, 13 rebounds, 9 assists in 3 wins. Compare those to Amares, its really no contest. 



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Randolph...been playing pretty poorly since Rasheed went down.


Still averaging 14 and 10 in the last 3 games, which is horrible for him but still comparable to Amares numbers. 



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> R. Wallace...playing SF.


Playing out of position though. Soon as hes traded, Amare gets bumped down a spot. 



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> B. Wallace....maybe.


Averaging 10 pts, 13 rebounds, 3 blocks, 2 assists. Amare gets him in scoring by 6-7 points, thats about it...its not even close in the other categories. 



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Gasol...maybe if Memphis let him play to his ablity.


Well, hes still at 17 and 8 when hes not playing to his ability. That is certainly comparable. 



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Chandler...hell no.


In Chandlers best 3 game stretch, he averaged 13 pts, 18 rebounds which IMO is better than what Amare is doing. 

Anyways, the point is, Amare is comparable to a lot of players and should be consider a top 10 PF on a good day. There are atleast 5 players that are considerably better than him, and when Webber returns and Sheed is moved to play PF, that will make two more...which will make his top 10 status debatable.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> 
> 
> Do you really view Amare as that big of a liability "upstairs"? I like his competitive fire, personally. I agree he's not a cerebral player like Tim(my second favorite player after Iverson) but he's not Darius Miles or anything. He knows how to play the game pretty well. I thought the Suns were impressed with his ability to take coaching last year? That would seem to portend a bright future.


actually, they had some issues with him last year. When his mother got out of jail, he wasnt that easy to deal with. Or atleast that is what this article in the NY Times said. No, I dont think he is a cerbral player, does that mean he cant be great? no. But if you have 2 players with equal athletic ability, which one are you going to take? Every great player in league history has been a very smart person off the court. well minus shaq ofcourse.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

You are funny. He almost didn't play in the first half when his team went down 30. He played in the 2nd half and almost brought them back into the game.

And he was defended by Camby AND Nene. Nene was so hard trying to stop him he got into some shoving with Amare even.

Amare dunked on Nene with one hand with Nene slapping at the ball but Amare still brought it down on him.

Why he will score 25-28? Because he is ferocious offensively, he can flat out put it in the basket and get high percentage shots and he already knows as well as anyone to draw fouls.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>curry_52</b>!
> 
> 
> Neither T-Mac, Iverson, Pierce nor Duncan (NOBODY!!) is averaging 28 points per games or more. What makes you believe he will do so? I bet that you any team brings Rodman at 42 back from ABA and he can slow down Amare.
> And it was so funny watching him pad stats against Denver when they were down by 25. Too bad he saved the explosive dunks once his team was down by 20+ and playing against Elson and Co.


Curry, thanks for doing a little investigating here. It looks like that someone else might be looking at the boxscores and not the games!


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> You are funny. He almost didn't play in the first half when his team went down 30. He played in the 2nd half and almost brought them back into the game.
> 
> And he was defended by Camby AND Nene. Nene was so hard trying to stop him he got into some shoving with Amare even.
> ...


if he scores 25-28 a night, which is major longshot, that must mean that he is playing for one terrible team. high % shots? 47% is nice, but is it high %. I agree on getting to the line


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> actually, they had some issues with him last year. When his mother got out of jail, he wasnt that easy to deal with. Or atleast that is what this article in the NY Times said. No, I dont think he is a cerbral player, does that mean he cant be great? no. But if you have 2 players with equal athletic ability, which one are you going to take? Every great player in league history has been a very smart person off the court. well minus shaq ofcourse.


No insults please- MikeDC 

There was a RUMOR in some article that Amare's MOTHER was difficult to deal with.

Amare came out and said right away that he would prefer his mother would stay on the East Coast rather than living with him or near him.

Amare has his own head, he is smart, mature.

No insults please- MikeDC


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> Rlucas you don't know ****. Please shut up.
> ...


I think the NY times might have it better then you. Frank Johnson was the one quoted. He might know if Amare was easy to deal with more then you. Maybe you are Amares dumb little hooky playing brother however who has been drinking the kool aid.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Top out?
> 
> Probably 25-28ppg 11-13rpg 3-4bpg in his prime
> ...


I guess thats "reasonable" for someone whos such a big fan of the guy. 

People thought Curry could top out at 25-28 ppg, some still do, but its obvious that he probably wont do that...neither will Amare (no offense)

I think he'll top out at 20-23 ppg, 9-11 rpg, 2 blks which would make him a top 5 PF in the league in his prime.

EDIT---- those numbers refering to Amare in his prime.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Maybe you just can't read it certainly seems so.

Frank Johnson has always pointed out how easy Amare is to coach and how fast he is picking up evertyhing and wants to absorb as much information as possible.

Scott Williams also worked with Amare on and off the court and has never said anything other that Amare is real easy to work with.


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

They suspended Amare for scoring 50 points and playing so hard in practice, I guess:

http://espn.go.com/nba/news/2003/0221/1512405.html


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Maybe you just can't read it certainly seems so.
> 
> Frank Johnson has always pointed out how easy Amare is to coach and how fast he is picking up evertyhing and wants to absorb as much information as possible.
> ...


and maybe your so defensive cause your blowing the guy?

Frank Johnson specifically said he wasnt as easy to deal with when his mother got there. His mother and family will be his downfall. Mark my words. If it doesnt happen in phoenix, it will happen in Orlando where i predict he will end up at some point in his career. His own agent says he is a bit wacky. 

Anyway, this thread is about the bulls and Emeka and Luol. I say we get back onto subject. Amare doesnt play for the Bulls. And Big Amare doesnt know squat. Thanks for the Amare input, No insults please- MikeDC


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Yeah he didn't start in one game in his rookie season because of that.

I bet he beat up his teammates.

Marbury was suspended 1 game by the Suns at some time for being late for practice.

:uhoh:


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> now run along little man. We have some discussing to do at the grownups table.


 :laugh:


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

BigAmare, you are acting as if people here were saying Amare is a bust, 6th man, etc.
Everyone thinks he is a very good player, but not a HOFer just because. He is going to improve, but at the same time people will adjust to him and get more double teams.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>! Amare doesnt play for the Bulls. And Big Amare doesnt know squat. Thanks for the Amare input, now run along little man. We have some discussing to do at the grownups table.


Lets see your history


Chandler, Curry at least as good as Amare and much more skilled 

- Totally false

Mickael Pietrus = The european Jordan and a good shooter - LOL

Okafor > Amare - Sure, Alright keep it on.


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Yeah he didn't start in one game in his rookie season because of that.
> 
> I bet he beat up his teammates.
> ...


And we know what kind of attitude Marbury has. You are acting like Marbury were to have a Tim Duncan work ethic, lol. Im sure he is a happy camper now with Wilkens on town. Maybe he could skip practice and party even more.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>curry_52</b>!
> They suspended Amare for scoring 50 points and playing so hard in practice, I guess:
> 
> http://espn.go.com/nba/news/2003/0221/1512405.html


he was late because he and BigAmare had some business to take care of. Nothing wrong with that!


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>curry_52</b>!
> 
> 
> And we know what kind of attitude Marbury has. You are acting like Marbury were to have a Tim Duncan work ethic, lol. Im sure he is a happy camper now with Wilkens in town. Maybe he could skip practice and party even more.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>curry_52</b>!
> BigAmare, you are acting as if people here were saying Amare is a bust, 6th man, etc.
> Everyone thinks he is a very good player, but not a HOFer just because. He is going to improve, but at the same time people will adjust to him and get more double teams.


Uhoh?

He is drawing double teams since his rookie season. He has never played with a big man even 10% as talented as him that could draw the interior defense away from him.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> Lets see your history
> ...


i never said Pietrus was the euro jordan. I liked him and still do. And look at his 3pt stats, he shoots pretty well when given a chance. 

I liked chandler and curry better then amare. as of now, your right

And where did i say that okafor was better. i seem to recall saying that it depends on what you like. Now I think Amare is calling you. he needs his little *****


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> he was late because he and BigAmare had some business to take care of. Nothing wrong with that!


Amare was still in highschool at that point..


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## curry_52 (Jul 22, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> Uhoh?
> ...


Well, Im watching the Coyotes then.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

By the way, most young PFs who are already matured physically dont usually improve much throughout their career. 

Brand as a rookie was 20-21 years old, he was already strong as a bull (no pun intended, well maybe) and he was putting up 20 and 10. Nowadays hes putting up 19 and 12, and hes hovered around those numbers his whole career. Its not a bad thing, because Brand is awesome, but he hasnt improved much in the scoring department. Rethinking my Amare predictions, I think he'll hover just under 20 his whole career, and probably improve his rebounding to 10-11 and his blocks to 2-3.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> Amare was still in highschool at that point..


when you and he were having sex?


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

Alright folks, calm down, let's get back to the heart of this thread, which I can expand further than Deng and Okafor. There' s another big pro prospect playing while you guys are bickering, and it's Hakim Warrick. He's totally dominating Notre Dame right now, but I don't think his play will translate. He's just too skinny to play the 4 in the league, and all he does is dunk (even though his dunks are amazing). Best case scenario for him is that Richard Jefferson somehow disappears and he winds up as Jason Kidd's wing running mate. I'm sure Kidd could make him look good in the pros. Really, he can't really do anything off the dribble, and all of the jumpers he tries at about 15 feet or more he misses.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> No insults please- MikeDC


No insults please- MikeDC


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> Alright folks, calm down, let's get back to the heart of this thread, which I can expand further than Deng and Okafor. There' s another big pro prospect playing while you guys are bickering, and it's Hakim Warrick. He's totally dominating Notre Dame right now, but I don't think his play will translate. He's just too skinny to play the 4 in the league, and all he does is dunk (even though his dunks are amazing). Best case scenario for him is that Richard Jefferson somehow disappears and he winds up as Jason Kidd's wing running mate. I'm sure Kidd could make him look good in the pros. Really, he can't really do anything off the dribble, and all of the jumpers he tries at about 15 feet or more he misses.


While I dont like hakim, i think James white has a chance. And they are similar players. I am inconsistent on that one. Warrick will get a chance, but your 100% right, he will need to play on a wide open team with a great pg for it to work. He looks and plays like Gerald Wallace to me


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

rlucas, read my signature and move on. Its arguments like these I get into with people that make me stoup to their level.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> 
> 
> No insults please- MikeDC


No insults please- MikeDC Its ok with me. It doesnt bother me at all that you and Amare are tight like that. Now run along. I think the Phoenix board needs your undivided attention


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## Vinsanity (May 28, 2002)

emeka killed sh*t today


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> rlucas, read my signature and move on. Its arguments like these I get into with people that make me stoup to their level.


Ok, John. big amare is offically ignored. No insults please- MikeDC


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Cool. 

We all know Okafor is a monster, but what do people think of McCants and Gordon? I think they are also unique players who are NBA prospects. McCants seems to be a headcase kinda, but he has a knack for hitting huge shots. He hit two huge ones today, and I remember watching the Wake Forest game, he hit a lot of big shots in that game as well...what do you guys think?


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

OK, that's quite enough from both of you


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Ok , sorry but this was just too much.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Cool.
> 
> We all know Okafor is a monster, but what do people think of McCants and Gordon? I think they are also unique players who are NBA prospects. McCants seems to be a headcase kinda, but he has a knack for hitting huge shots. He hit two huge ones today, and I remember watching the Wake Forest game, he hit a lot of big shots in that game as well...what do you guys think?


Gordons stock took a hit today. McCants is an interesting prospect. But I think he needs to stay at UNC for a year. Its best for NCAA that UNC return to prominence. McCants I think would go from 13-18 if he was in. I think Deng and Emeka solidified themselves as top 5 picks today. i think Shelden Williams helped himself, as did McCants. It was great seeing Jwill with his chick at Cameron Indoor. I wonder if he is doing a little scouting for us?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

Curry, if your reading this, please post that Orlando article. Apparently Orlando would take Pavel #1. That just increases our odds of landing one of these 2 kids greatly.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> Gordons stock took a hit today. McCants is an interesting prospect. But I think he needs to stay at UNC for a year. Its best for NCAA that UNC return to prominence. McCants I think would go from 13-18 if he was in. I think Deng and Emeka solidified themselves as top 5 picks today. i think Shelden Williams helped himself, as did McCants. It was great seeing Jwill with his chick at Cameron Indoor. I wonder if he is doing a little scouting for us?


Didnt Gordon still have 10 assists today despite playing horrible? Thats something to look at, how well he can play in a bad game.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> Didnt Gordon still have 10 assists today despite playing horrible? Thats something to look at, how well he can play in a bad game.


Thats a good point. I just think UNC won this game on the perimeter. They certainly didnt win it inside. When I say Gordon took a hit. It wasnt drastic. i just think people had him at 4-6 and now might say 6-9 might be better for him. But who knows. How does Gordon match up with Wade?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Enh. Gordon disapeared in this game. 10 assists is pretty easy with the talent UConn has. How many turnovers did he have though?

Mcants needs to go all 4 years at UNC. Otherwise he'll be another Forte.

I think UNC has 6-7 guys who are going to be NBA players right now on their roster. But only Felton and May have a real shot at being special special players.

Though I think May's stock took a tremendous hit against Okafor. Because it kind of showed what would happen if May went to the Pros right now. He was getting a lot of his **** thrown back in his face. I thought he would draw more fouls on Okafor but he didn't.

Jawad Williams looks like he could be a nice late first round early second round pickup.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Enh. Gordon disapeared in this game. 10 assists is pretty easy with the talent UConn has. How many turnovers did he have though?
> 
> Mcants needs to go all 4 years at UNC. Otherwise he'll be another Forte.
> ...


jawad really impressed me. he stepped up and played big despite the injury. i 100% agree with you. 

The most impressive thing about Okafor today of all the things mentioned, was how aggressive and intense he played on the defensive end without picking up any fouls. He made mince meat out of May, who is probably a top 10 player in next years (2005) draft. 

I thought the Carolina guards really controlled tempo. Felton deserves a long look

In the duke game, Duhon gets little publicity today. But i think you can win with him. He is an absolute true PG. he will be a nice pickup in round 2 for someone. His mistake was not coming out a couple of years ago when he was a lottery pick


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## T.Shock (Feb 11, 2003)

I started a thread about McCants last week and the consensus is that he is probably too short to make much of an impact. I disagree, but not entirely. When I was watching McCants today the player I thought of was Reggie Miller. He just shoots and shoots and shoots. And he hits the big ones. Problem is Reggie was 6'6'' and Rashad is 6'3''. So it depends if you wanna take a chance on his height.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

I havent seen nearly enough of Gordon to make a judgement on him as a pro. I've seen so many elite college guards become guys on the deep bench of mediocre NBA teams. I'm always really skeptical of NBA guards coming to the pros.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> I havent seen nearly enough of Gordon to make a judgement on him as a pro. I've seen so many elite college guards become guys on the deep bench of mediocre NBA teams. I'm always really skeptical of NBA guards coming to the pros.


I think your right, the guard position, particularly the point, is the hardest to translate from league to league


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

who would have a better impact 

Emeka or Brand (from his rookie year). I know Brand was 20-10 his rookie year. But I am talking about total impact on the game and on the win column. id like to hear peoples thoughts. Id go with Emeka but its close


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## 7thwatch (Jul 18, 2002)

I watched a lot of the game today, and I'm sold on Emeka.

1) He's a playmaker. I didn't watch the entire game, probably half to 3/4 of it. But whenever I switched the channel back to the game, this kid was making plays, offensively and defensively. He's not just putting up stats quietly so that you don't really notice it, he changes the game. 

2) Both his help/team defense and man to man defense are awesome. When he was matched up against May, May was basically shut down. He couldn't do a thing. Every shot around the basket was challenged by Okafor when he was in there. A few times the UNC players took jumpers on fastbreaks instead of driving to the hoop because they were afraid of him. He actually blocks shots to his teammates sometimes instead of just swatting the shots into the stands. Thats something that Bill Russel used to do, and I don't know of many if any other guys who have that ability. Another point: he doesn't go for pump fakes. he stays on the ground until the last second before committing himself, which makes his defense better and also keeps him out of foul trouble.

3) Offensively, the kid is fast and runs the floor very well. He's an explosive finisher and several times I saw him dunk the ball hard in traffic with two or three guys hanging onto his arms. I wish EC would learn that trick. Okafor has a nice turnaround jumper from short range - I saw him make quite a few from low on the block. Combine his athletic ablity, current skill set, intelligence, and work ethic and I think he'll be an impact player on both ends. I expect him to learn and improve very quickly because he is such a smart player and because he works so hard.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>7thwatch</b>!
> I watched a lot of the game today, and I'm sold on Emeka.
> 
> 1) He's a playmaker. I didn't watch the entire game, probably half to 3/4 of it. But whenever I switched the channel back to the game, this kid was making plays, offensively and defensively. He's not just putting up stats quietly so that you don't really notice it, he changes the game.
> ...


super post. your right on his ability to run the floor. He changes from defense to offense at a blistering pace for a 6-10 guy.


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