# Z-Bo SNUBBED!!!!



## NateBishop3 (Jul 22, 2003)

How could the coaches pick Andrei Kirilenko over Z-Bo????

EASTERN CONFERENCE ALL-STARS
Head coach: Rick Carlisle (Indiana)
Player Team Pos. Ht. Wt. All-Star
selections 
Ron Artest Indiana F 6-7 246 1 
*Vince Carter Toronto F 6-6 225 5 
Baron Davis New Orleans G 6-3 223 2 
*Allen Iverson Philadelphia G 6-0 165 5 
Jason Kidd New Jersey G 6-4 212 7 
Jamaal Magloire New Orleans C 6-11 259 1 
Kenyon Martin New Jersey F 6-9 234 1 
*Tracy McGrady Orlando G/F 6-8 210 4 
*Jermaine O'Neal Indiana C/F 6-11 242 3 
Paul Pierce Boston G/F 6-6 230 3 
Michael Redd Milwaukee G 6-6 215 1 
*Ben Wallace Detroit C 6-9 240 2 

WESTERN CONFERENCE ALL-STARS
Head coach: Flip Saunders (Minnesota)
Player Team Pos. Ht. Wt. All-Star
selections 
Ray Allen Seattle G 6-5 205 4 
*Kobe Bryant L.A. Lakers G 6-6 220 6 
Sam Cassell Minnesota G 6-3 185 1 
*Tim Duncan San Antonio F 7-0 260 6 
*Steve Francis Houston G 6-3 200 3 
*Kevin Garnett Minnesota F 6-11 240 7 
Andrei Kirilenko Utah F 6-9 225 1 
Brad Miller Sacramento C 7-0 261 2 
Dirk Nowitzki Dallas F/C 7-0 245 3 
Shaquille O'Neal L.A. Lakers C 7-1 340 11 
Peja Stojakovic Sacramento F 6-10 229 3 
*Yao Ming Houston C 7-6 310 2


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## QRICH (Feb 2, 2004)

:upset: I would have put Zach ahead of AK47!!!


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## Starbury03 (Aug 12, 2003)

Ahead of Dirk.


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## bfan1 (Mar 5, 2003)

wow-that is a major snub. He'd be in if he wasn't a Blazer.

I believe that.


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## THE'clip'SHOW (Sep 24, 2002)

And no Elton Brand :upset: these dont include the coaches picks?


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>THE'clip'SHOW</b>!
> And no Elton Brand :upset: these dont include the coaches picks?


He didn't play enough.


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## QRICH (Feb 2, 2004)

Also, Carlos Boozer is another snub!!!

Boozer >>>> Martin, Maglore


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## dkap (May 13, 2003)

Interesting. With all the talk of how deep the West forwards are, they end up taking 3 centers, 4 forwards, and a forward/center.

For what it's worth, this should not be construed as a snub of Zach. He just hasn't gotten to that level yet. Look past his scoring and rebounding numbers and look to his defense and the team's record. Shouldn't be that tough to figure out why he isn't on the squad. He's getting close, though.

Malone, Marion, Stoudemire, Brand, Webber, Lewis, Walker, Jamison, Wallace, Carmelo, Gasol. Just a few other names that didn't make it, either. That's not a snub, just stiff competition.

Dan


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## QRICH (Feb 2, 2004)

You can make a strong case to take Zach Randolph over the likes of Dirk and AK47, 21 ppg 11 rpg, what else must you do? 

I think it's because his team is sub-.500


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## bfan1 (Mar 5, 2003)

I won't be watching now...no longer interested.


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## THE'clip'SHOW (Sep 24, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Fork</b>!
> 
> 
> He didn't play enough.


And Ray did?


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## Trader Ed (Jun 17, 2002)

Where was Carmelo Anthony????


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## ABM (Dec 30, 2002)

I hope Z-Bo has something to _say_ about this, come Friday night. :yes:


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## NateBishop3 (Jul 22, 2003)

It's not so much that Zach didn't make it, it's that AK-47 did... He's a good player, but hardly an All-Star in my book


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

LeBron got snubbed.


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## dkap (May 13, 2003)

Kirilenko doesn't have a rap sheet. Z-Bo does.

Kirilenko plays hard on both sides of the ball. Z-Bo doesn't.

Kirilenko is seen as a hard working, exciting player on an overachieving team that plays great team ball.

Z-Bo is seen as a somewhat selfish player on an underachieving team that can't stay out of trouble and has lost fans in droves.

Is it really that hard to see why?

Dan


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>NateBishop3</b>!
> It's not so much that Zach didn't make it, it's that AK-47 did... He's a good player, but hardly an All-Star in my book


I think he's an all-star. He's putting 17, 8, 3, and 3 and is one of the best defensive players in the NBA.


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## Todd (Oct 8, 2003)

No, Lebron and Carmelo are playing in a Rookie all star game the night before.


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

But the NBA allows rookies and 2nd year players to skip the Rookie/Sophomore and play in the all-star game like Yao did last year and will do again this year.

LeBron was snubbed.


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## NateBishop3 (Jul 22, 2003)

Dkap you practically just described Ruben Patterson... well, without the rap sheet.


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

I'm a huge Randolph fan, but you have to look at team records and overall talent level. 

Utah has won more games this year than us, yet doesn't feature anyone who would even start on our team other than Andre. 

Hopefully, this will help Zach realize that when somebody drives the lane, he's got to think "Stop that shot!" instead of "Grab that rebound if he misses!" 

Zach will have plenty of chances to make the all-star game in his career. I hope he uses this as motivation to learn how to defend and pass.


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>NateBishop3</b>!
> Dkap you practically just described Ruben Patterson... well, without the rap sheet.


Ruben plays on overachieving team? When did he get traded?


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## Scout226 (Sep 17, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Fork</b>!
> 
> 
> He didn't play enough.



Brand(33) played more than Shaq(30) and Ray(21).


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## nikebasketball (Jan 28, 2004)

*
>Andrei Kirilenko Utah F 6-9 225 1

They should have picked Zach over him ^^

*:upset:


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## MJG (Jun 29, 2003)

Record and defense counts. Not saying Randolph didn't deserve it, but it's hardly a snub. Only twelve guys can get in, and the only really questionable selection on either side in my opinion is Allen -- and if he didn't make it, they would've put in another guard and not Randolph.

AK-47 is probably a top ten defensive player on a winning team, and is a coaches favorite. Can't discount that factor.


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## MagnusPinus (Aug 27, 2003)

Kirilenko deserves it... maybe even more than ZAch...because u have to look at both halves of the court....


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

Anyone else notice that no one on the bottom 11 teams in the NBA got in via the coaches? Hell, I don't know if T-Mac would have made the East team if he wasn't voted in.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>dkap</b>!
> 
> Malone, Marion, Stoudemire, Brand, Webber, Lewis, Walker, Jamison, Wallace, Carmelo, Gasol. Just a few other names that didn't make it, either. That's not a snub, just stiff competition.
> 
> Dan


Of those names you mentioned, Malone and Webber don't even deserve to be mentioned as All star "snubs". In Malones case, he hasn't played enough, and in Webbers case, he hasn't played *AT ALL*.

Gasol, maybe. But he probably didn't make it in the same manner that Zach didn't. lack of defense. Walker, Jamison, Lewis and Wallace all didn't deserve recognition, let alone someone putting them in a group of people who you could say were "snubbed".

I think it has a lot to do with the poor record, and the fact he's not a decent defender.

However, Ray Allen making it is a slap in the face. The guys played not even half the damn games this year.

BTW, the obvious bad choice for a starter on the WEST? 

Steve Francis, in no way, shape form, issue, but, and or it's, deserves to start.

Hell, he doesn't even deserve to make the team. China just stuffed the ballot.

Oh well, I stopped caring about the All Star Game years ago when it became obvious it was a popularity contest, and a "screw Portland's attempt at hosting it" event.

I could care less about any of it now.


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## NateBishop3 (Jul 22, 2003)

Utah isn't a winning team. They're at 500, which may be overachieving, but overachieving ISN'T winning. How about Memphis? Grizzlies are 26-21, ranked AHEAD of Utah.


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Epadfield</b>!
> 
> 
> I think he's an all-star. He's putting 17, 8, 3, and 3 and is one of the best defensive players in the NBA.


Oh, I forgot the 2.1 SPG.


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>NateBishop3</b>!
> How about Memphis? Grizzlies are 26-21, ranked AHEAD of Utah.


They weren't supposed to be the worst team in the NBA like Utah was.


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## Petey (Aug 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Epadfield</b>!
> Anyone else notice that no one on the bottom 11 teams in the NBA got in via the coaches? Hell, I don't know if T-Mac would have made the East team if he wasn't voted in.


T-Mac would had made it. Lets say Kidd was voted in, or Carter was listed as a SG instead of SF. Whom is more worthy?

-Petey


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## Petey (Aug 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>NateBishop3</b>!
> It's not so much that Zach didn't make it, it's that AK-47 did... He's a good player, but hardly an All-Star in my book


Any other player out there that gets 3 blocks and 2 steals per game over half a season so far? They are lofty numbers already, but together from 1 player? Fantastic. Now only is he helping to prevent 5 scoring chances for the other team, it helps creating scoring chances for his own. I can see the arguement against him, but it wasn't as bad as Allen going after missing all those games or Webber last year.

-Petey


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## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

heres my opnion...AK deserves it more

sure Randolph is gettin 20 and 10, but AK isnt that far behind with 17 and 8. He is gettin more assists, more steals and more blocks than Randolph with 100x the defense......I would of picked AK to be in it over him 100 out of 100 times. I see no problem here


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## dkap (May 13, 2003)

> Of those names you mentioned, Malone and Webber don't even deserve to be mentioned as All star "snubs".


I realize that, but Weber, Allen, and Carter (to name a few from recent history) have made the squad with very few games played. It is less of a deciding factor than it probably should be.



> Dkap you practically just described Ruben Patterson... well, without the rap sheet.


Er, yeah, right. When Ruben establishes himself as a coaches favorite, plays on a something other than a disappointment of a team, and plays _smart_ in addition to hard on offense, then maybe my description of Kirilenko would be similar to his...

Dan


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Petey</b>!
> 
> 
> T-Mac would had made it. Lets say Kidd was voted in, or Carter was listed as a SG instead of SF. Whom is more worthy?
> ...


Not saying he's not putting up all-star numbers but he's playing for the worst team in the NBA and the coaches don't seem to pick players from bad teams.

Players like LeBron & Shareef would be all-stars if there teams won a little more.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Yo, yo, yo.

Zach Randolph isn't even CLOSE to deserving it over AK47. Not even CLOSE guys.

Sure, the pts and rebs are numbers are nice, but that's not the whole basketball game guys.

Andrei Kirilenko is having a HISTORY MAKING season. No player in the HISTORY OF THE GAME has ever finished in the top 3 in both steals and blocks. Kirilenko does it ALL. He fills the stats sheet like no one ever has. He is one of the few people ever to get 5-5-5-5 twice in one season.

And he has a young inexperienced team (playing WITHOUT Malone, Stockton, OR Harpring) winning more than half their games.

Randolph isn't even CLOSE to Kirilenko. AK47 wins more and his Efficiency Ranking is higher. It's a no brainer.

Same with Dirk. His team is winning more. He rebounded from a slow start and now his pts and rebs are close to Zach but he has more blocks and less turnovers. His effiency ranking is higher and his team is winning and deserves ONE All Star.

As for Ray Allen, he is a GUARD. They need two backup guards. The best two were selected.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>wadecaroneddie</b>!
> heres my opnion...AK deserves it more
> 
> sure Randolph is gettin 20 and 10, but AK isnt that far behind with 17 and 8. He is gettin more assists, more steals and more blocks than Randolph with 100x the defense......I would of picked AK to be in it over him 100 out of 100 times. I see no problem here


Wow I was about to post the same exact thing


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## RoddneyThaRippa (Jun 28, 2003)

You just gotta look at the All-star game for what it is: a popularity contest. Do I think Kirilenko deserved to go, even ahead of Zach? Fo sho. You take Kirilenko off of that Utah squad and the team is awful as they come. You take Randolph off Portland and while they definitely will suffer, the team will still get along. 

That said, can picks like Ray Allen and Steve Francis be justified? No, unless you view the process as a popularity contest. The NBA brass should be embarrassed about how they put these ballots together. Some guys don't even belong on the ballot in the first place. But the reality of the situation is that the NBA has turned into a big business, and the all-star game will be more popular and generate more revenue if the most popular players are there, even if that means snubbing someone more deserving. It's a sick, sick situation.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

No. The reserves have nothing to do with a popularity contest. Z-Bo simply didn't deserve it over ANYONE on the team.


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## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

I like ZR, I'm very happy with how he's doing this season and I'm excited he's a Blazer.

But snubbed? Come, on. Kirilenko's really the only one that people here can really complain about making it over ZR, and as others have mentioned Andrei's a more complete player on a better (more successful) team. Statistically, ZR's a bit better offensively (although not THAT much better) and defensively Andrei's much better.

Add it all up and ZR's squeezed out (the same way so many other good forwards in the West are) this season, but I don't see it as a snub at all.

Ed O.


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## antibody (Apr 4, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Ed O</b>!
> Add it all up and ZR's squeezed out (the same way so many other good forwards in the West are) this season, but I don't see it as a snub at all.
> 
> Ed O.


Yeah, I would say it was somewhat of a snub. Very few players average 21 and 11 in the NBA let alone a double-double. He would probably be in if he was in the east. Yet, one can argue that Z-Bo deserved it more than Dirk or AK-47. I just dont' buy the theory of being on a better team. The Jazz are really not that much better than Portland.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>antibody</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah, I would say it was somewhat of a snub. Very few players average 21 and 11 in the NBA let alone a double-double. He would probably be in if he was in the east. Yet, one can argue that Z-Bo deserved it more than Dirk or AK-47. I just dont' buy the theory of being on a better team. The Jazz are really not that much better than Portland.


This is why



> Originally posted by* wadecaroneddie!*
> heres my opnion...AK deserves it more
> 
> sure Randolph is gettin 20 and 10, but AK isnt that far behind with 17 and 8. He is gettin more assists, more steals and more blocks than Randolph with 100x the defense......I would of picked AK to be in it over him 100 out of 100 times. I see no problem here


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## antibody (Apr 4, 2003)

Actually Randolph is averaging over 21 and 11 per game. That is quite a bit better than 17 and 8. You just can't ignore the fact that he is a double-double guy and there are very few players averaging more points and rebounds per game than Zach. You can include all you want but Zach has more offensive rebounds, defensive rebounds, FT attempts, 2nd chance points, free throws, and so on...when do you quit? Portland would be in the cellar of the West if not for Z-Bo in my opinion.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>antibody</b>!
> Actually Randolph is averaging over 21 and 11 per game. That is quite a bit better than 17 and 8. You just can't ignore the fact that he is a double-double guy and there are very few players averaging more points and rebounds per game than Zach. You can include all you want but Zach has more offensive rebounds, defensive rebounds, FT attempts, 2nd chance points, free throws, and so on...when do you quit? Portland would be in the cellar of the West if not for Z-Bo in my opinion.


Ok but he does not block any shots, does not pass the ball, plays terrible defense so in all its a nice feat that he is doing, But 21 and 11 aint that much of a difference when Kirilenko passes so much more and is a STUD on the defensive end


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

hey Beez--nice avatar!


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## dkap (May 13, 2003)

antibody, have you read any of the counter arguments in favor of Kirilenko? It sure doesn't sound like it. Zach has the edge (and not a huge one) in scoring and rebounding. Kirilenko is ahead in every other category, including intangibles.



> Portland would be in the cellar of the West if not for Z-Bo in my opinion.


Doesn't exactly set him apart from AK...

Dan


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>theWanker</b>!
> hey Beez--nice avatar!


Yours too.


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## Todd (Oct 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Epadfield</b>!
> But the NBA allows rookies and 2nd year players to skip the Rookie/Sophomore and play in the all-star game like Yao did last year and will do again this year.
> 
> LeBron was snubbed.



Lebron wasn't snubbed at all. The NBA had this friday night rookie challenge planned all along. It is the first year of this, and they are making the all star gig a weekend thing. Just think of the money the NBA is going to pull in from sponsers on friday night.

It is clearly a marketing decision by the NBA.




Carmelo was overlooked for this same reason.

From ESPN:



> Carmelo Anthony? If LeBron didn't make it, it shouldn't surprise you that 'Melo didn't. Guess that first-ever Friday night Rookie Game will mean something after all.


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>THE'clip'SHOW</b>!
> 
> 
> And Ray did?


No, but I don't think he deserved to be there either.


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>NateBishop3</b>!
> How could the coaches pick Andrei Kirilenko over Z-Bo????
> 
> EASTERN CONFERENCE ALL-STARS
> ...


Brad Miller,Andre Kirilenko,Ray Allen over Zach Randolph


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>bfan1</b>!
> I won't be watching now...no longer interested.


I agree...but still GO EAST!


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

I think I heard somewhere that only like 3-5 players in the league are averaging 20 and 10...and one is Zach...he needs to be in the game.


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

ZBo didn't deserve to make it I'm a huge blazer fan but there is no way I'd vote him in over AK47. Brad Miller is having an awesome year too he's playing better then Zack, the only questionable pick is Ray Allen but it would have been Bibby or Spreewell or Payton who'd take his place anyways.

Zack is one of those players who gets 20 and 10 but doesn't even help his team that much because he is so nonexistent in every other aspect of the game. I love the kid and think he can really improve but his PPG and RPG make him look much better then his contributions really are.

IMO Sheed has actually had a very good season, if you had to pick a lineup with Zbo or Sheed, the team with sheed is more competitive IMO.


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## Blazer Ringbearer (Jan 28, 2003)

Good points Draco,

To take it one step further, I think one could make just as strong of an argument for selecting Sheed over Zach as for selecting Zach over AK...

When you have two borderline all-stars on a sub-.500 team, it makes it very difficult to get one in.


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## Fork (Jan 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>NathanLane</b>!
> Yo, yo, yo.
> 
> Zach Randolph isn't even CLOSE to deserving it over AK47. Not even CLOSE guys.
> ...


Not even close? That's laughable.

Efficiency ratings disagree:

Kirilinko 22.25
Zach 22.22

That's the equivalent of one extra rebound...over the entire season. I'd say that's as close as you can get.

And before you start talking about defense, you know efficiency ratings include blocks, steals and assists and all the other stuff that Kirilinko excels at. 

Kirilenko may deserve the spot as much as anyone...but it's far from a 'no brainer' as you say.


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## Petey (Aug 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>MAS RipCity</b>!
> I think I heard somewhere that only like 3-5 players in the league are averaging 20 and 10...and one is Zach...he needs to be in the game.


How about Elton Brand? The guy has put up how many 20/10 seasons, how many 18/11 seasons and not made it? Points and rebounds are not always the attributing factor of making an All-Star game. 

-Petey


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

If and when Shaq strains something, Zach will most likely be added, so you Portland fans will have a reason to watch the game, though if you like the NBA I wonder why you wouldn't be watching the game regardless of if a Portland player is in it.


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## antibody (Apr 4, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Fork</b>!
> Not even close? That's laughable.
> 
> Efficiency ratings disagree:
> ...


Exactly. Thank you for the numbers. I was about to go find those but you beat me to it. I just fail to see why Z-Bo is so far below AK-47 to some people...it's mind boggling. Z-Bo can change a game on the offensive side of the ball to where the opposition has to make changes and prepare for him. You don't do that with AK-47.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>antibody</b>!
> 
> 
> Exactly. Thank you for the numbers. I was about to go find those but you beat me to it. I just fail to see why Z-Bo is so far below AK-47 to some people...it's mind boggling. Z-Bo can change a game on the offensive side of the ball to where the opposition has to make changes and prepare for him. You don't do that with AK-47.


No they do it offensively. Teams run plays to try and take him out of the game defensively. Also Kirilenko changes a game defensively so. Your at a stalemate


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## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

Zach may or may not deserve to be on the All-Star team, but AK47 has a lot going for him that Randolph DOESN'T. 

-AK47 is leading one of the most overachieving teams this year in the entire league, and that's WITHOUT Matt Harpring. 

-Randolph is on one of the must underachieving teams this year in the entire league, and one of the worst teams in the West. Randolph is in the same position as Shareef Abdur-Rahim this year, exact same thing. 

-Kirilenko is light years ahead of Randolph on the defensive end. It's like night and day, and that has to be worth something.

-Kirilenko plays an all-around game, and excels in many areas of the game. 

As for Ray Allen, sure he's only played 20 games, but he has helped the Sonics greatly in those games. He's been terrific, simply amazing at times. He's hit countless game winners, and come up huge in several games, taking the team on his shoulders in the 4th Quarter and overtime. He's been a difference maker on a team that is in the playoff hunt. In the little time he's been healthy, he's been great.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

Just wanted to chime in that this is probably how I would have done the selections. There are always a couple of guys that are left off that have an argument as to why they should be on, but IMO anyways, everyone that made it was very deserving. There were no obvious slights, just a few others who deserved consideration.

STOMP


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## Terrible (Jan 3, 2003)

I'm starting to wonder if a player like Zbo or even Tmac for that matter would ever be an allstar in Portland. To be clear is it the player or the city that's causing the most damage here? 


My thought is there might be such a bias now against Portland that no star would be good enough to get the nod there!

This troubles me because last night we watched Anthony get star treatment in Denver and he's been in the league all of half a year. This kid got looked at hard and he was on the line, meanwhile Zbo got hammered and the game kept going.

Will there ever be a star big enough to overshadow the Blazer Bias?


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## THE'clip'SHOW (Sep 24, 2002)

http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=75683&forumid=27

Does this change anybodys opinion...... Elton Brand is an all-star, stop with the excuses...

go blazers, d-miles!


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rukahS capuT</b>!
> Zach may or may not deserve to be on the All-Star team, but AK47 has a lot going for him that Randolph DOESN'T.
> 
> -AK47 is leading one of the most overachieving teams this year in the entire league, and that's WITHOUT Matt Harpring.
> ...


He hasn't helped out Seattle that much really,at least record wise. RAY RAY is one of my fv players,but play some games before you become an all-star.


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## SheedSoNasty (Dec 31, 2002)

I had a gut feeling that Zach wouldn't make it due to his defensive liabilities. Oh well, All-Star games have lost their savvy over the last few years and I'm not totally disappointed that he's not in. We still love you Zach!


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

you want to talk about snubbed?

remember when Paul Westphal was the coach of the West team? Drexler FINALLY made the starting 5 of the West team..and that assclown played Drexler like 11 minutes that year? And Dan Majerle played like 30?

Guess who happened to coach Marjerle? Yep, thats right, Paul Westphal.

Drexler, coming off of a finals appearance the year before, (granted, 92-93 wasn't his best year) and a great all star performance the year before (where he was robbed of the MVP because everyone had gone nuts over Magics "return"..yah, let's celebrate a man cheating on his wife with numerous women..hey..Magic was a laker who cheated on his wife...so was kobe..anywho)..and what does Westphal do?

"Oh, I forgot he wasn't getting minutes"..

For all I know Drexler asked to not play major minutes (which might be the case, as I might have forgotten) but from that moment on the All Star game was a waste.


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

You had to bring that back up Hap...I remember I was only 8 at the time but I had the disliking of Westphaul running through my veins. He was sitting my fv athlete and I couldn't comprehend it. I have never liked him since. Bad Memories:no:


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>MAS RipCity</b>!
> You had to bring that back up Hap...I remember I was only 8 at the time but I had the disliking of Westphaul running through my veins. He was sitting my fv athlete and I couldn't comprehend it. I have never liked him since. Bad Memories:no:


I went to the next game in Portland after they returned from the AS break against Phoenix.

when his name was introduced, (and iirc, it was done deliberately) the PA guy have the crowd more than enough time to boo him..and let me tell you we did!

It was a louder boo than any boo I've heard since...and they showed him up on the score-board, and he did one of those "what, me?" looks..which just incited us even more.


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

lol good work, boo his azz!


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

Brad Miller should not have made it over Zach Randolph.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Damian Necronamous</b>!
> Brad Miller should not have made it over Zach Randolph.


I think he made it for several reasons. He's more of a thorough player, and he's on the sacred cow team.


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## shazha (Nov 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>NathanLane</b>!
> 
> Andrei Kirilenko is having a HISTORY MAKING season. No player in the HISTORY OF THE GAME has ever finished in the top 3 in both steals and blocks. .


wait up wait up. i agree that AK deserves to be in the team , BUT didnt olajuwon make it in top 3 in both blocks and steals?

********STL****BLK************* 
*1988-89* 2.60 3.44 
*1989-90* 2.12 4.59 
*1990-91* 2.16 3.95


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>shazha</b>!
> 
> 
> wait up wait up. i agree that AK deserves to be in the team , BUT didnt olajuwon make it in top 3 in both blocks and steals?
> ...


yea,you're right, Dream did it more then once.


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Damian Necronamous</b>!
> Brad Miller should not have made it over Zach Randolph.


Couldn't agree more.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Todd</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What you and that ESPN report overlooked is that the NBA changed the rules this year. A player can play in *both* that Rookie/Sophomore game *and* the main All-Star Game.

This is the first year that that's true.

So, it couldn't have been a marketing decision. Having James in *both* games would have boosted rating *both* days.

I think James and Marbury were snubs. Both are more talented than the likes of Kenyon Martin. If the East is weak in big men, the answer isn't to select weak (relatively speaking) big men and snub far, far more talented perimeter players.

This isn't a team meant to play 82 games. If it's top heavy with perimeter players, big deal. Get the most exciting and *talented* players out there.

As far as Randolph goes, I'd like to have seen him selected, but I wouldn't call it a "snub." He was up against a *ton* of excellent competition and lost, probably due to being inept at half the game.

Were I Randolph, I'd use this as motivation to work extremely hard on becoming a good defensive player, so that I was a lock All-Star...a low-post monster with a defensive game to speak of.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Zach needs to take the mentality that if the coaches don't want him as an All Star...then **** the all star game, and use it as motivation to kick everyone of those teams butts the next time we play em.

It's sorta like Groucho Marx's old quote about "Id never be in a club that would have me as a member"...cept for me it's if you don't want me as a member, I don't want to be a member.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

Z-Bo over Brad Miller? Uh..... no. Brad Miller blocks shots and passes the ball like no big man in the entire NBA. Sorry, Brad Miller is a no brainer pick over Z-Bo.

Yo, I love Z-Bo and I love the Blazers but we didn't field an All-Star this year. It's not enough that Z-Bo gets 20 and 10. It's just not. Not when you have a player like Kirilenko making HISTORY. Not when you have a big man playing a complete game like Brad Miller is. Not when you have a 7 footer who can do all the things that Dirk can do.

It's not bias against Portland AT ALL. I believe the coaches love Z-Bo. But Z-Bo isn't better than the guys who were picked. He probably won't even be the sub if Shaq is out. That should go to Brand. Look at Brand's numbers. His stats are SICK. MUCH better than Z-Bo.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

By the way, the Rookie Challenge is NOT a new event. It has been around for 10 years. Rookies have foregone the rookie challenge and played in the All Star game in year's past. This year they were going to let rookies play in BOTH if they qualified for both. No one did.


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>NathanLane</b>!
> Z-Bo over Brad Miller? Uh..... no. Brad Miller blocks shots and passes the ball like no big man in the entire NBA. Sorry, Brad Miller is a no brainer pick over Z-Bo.
> 
> Yo, I love Z-Bo and I love the Blazers but we didn't field an All-Star this year. It's not enough that Z-Bo gets 20 and 10. It's just not. Not when you have a player like Kirilenko making HISTORY. Not when you have a big man playing a complete game like Brad Miller is. Not when you have a 7 footer who can do all the things that Dirk can do.
> ...


Do you have some beef with ZBO or what? Brad Miller is a good player,but he doesn't make that team go,he can pass yes...but so can vlade divac, you see him on the team? And how is AK47 having a history making season? I am not trying to start anything btw.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

I don't have a beef with Z-Bo. I hear you.

Listen.

Kirilenko is on pace to become the first player in the history of the game to finish in the top three in steals and blocks. (Hey, if we had a guy like that, we'd have one of the better records in the NBA right now). He is also one of the few players ever to get back to back 5-5-5-5s.

Brad Miller absolutely DOES make that Kings team go. He has had TWO triple doubles so far this season. Only two players in the entire NBA have had more. Kidd and KG.


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## s a b a s 11 (Dec 31, 2002)

I know this is all opinion, but I have no idea what some of you are talking about. This is probably the most-deserving squad (outside of Steve Francis and *maybe* Ray Allen) to ever represent the West all-stars in say, the last 10 years... 

There is no arguing the reason why AK made the all-star team, he deserved it, period. 

Like someone said, there was just real great comp at the forward position this year.

Antoine Walker could have made it. Just as Zach's case to make the team is strong, the case for Elton Brand is just as strong. Pau Gasol could have made it also, the Grizziles are the same as the Jazz, definitely surprising everyone in the west. I don't even want to think what the logjam would have looked like had Karl Malone not got injured.

If anything, we should be arguing the western guard positions.

Stuart


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