# More prospect thoughts......



## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

*Chris Massie- Wow! That kid is really balling of late. Is averaging 20 a game and 12 rebounds. He probably has played his way into the first round. Great strength, athletic, good toughness and frame, and finally his talent is coming out.

*Darius Rice- Another super prospect. One of the best, and probably will be a lottery pick when he comes out. Great matchup problem, awesome offensive game, not to phyisical but not really soft. Is a good enough athletic to create miss-matches. Really good jump shot from inside out, has a ok handle and obviously has the frame at 6-10 to really do things at SF. Will be a lottery pick.

*Travis Watson- Tough prospect to judge. Is phyisical, has a good post game, has good hands, good feet. Is a ok atheltic, can shoot, and rebound. But he is short and stocky, and not super athletic like some other small PF's. I'm not sure about how good he will be in the NBA, reminds me of Danny Forston in a way, but Danny was more athletic though. Tough pick but could be good.

*Ben Gordon- Great scoring talent, can really get it done on offense. Good speed, good athletic, can hit from outside and drive the lane. Good handle and has showm some PG skills.

*Ryan Randle- Sleeper prospect, good phyisical player, good frame, has improve hands and really has played well his year. Good offensive game, but he will most likely be a banger defender in the NBA. Should be a solid find for a team that needs a hard working big man.

*Ebi Ere- Super talent. Really good offensive game, can rip it up when he is on. Fine athletic, good penetrator, needs to improve his handle just a little though. Good deep shooter from anywhere, great upside and will be a first round pick.

*Drew Nicholas- Big time sleeper, probably will not get drafted but has a chance. Shown he can play PG, has a very improved offensive game, good jump shooter, good leader and character, could be a ok find.

*Kenneth Lowe- Really like this kid because of his defensive abilities. Fine defender at PG, is tall at 6-3 for a PG but probably is not athletic enough for NBA PG's so that is a problem. Improved offensive talent and has defensive skills.

*John Gilchrist- Like I said before, reminds me of Jamaal Tinsley. Has a street game in a way, tough handle to stop, good passer, can really penetrate and kick out, should be a fine prospect in a few years. 

*Jabahri Brown- I still like him as a prospect. Good size, great athletic skill and really has a upside to him. Not a good offensive game and needs to work on his defense but it is hard to pass up athletic big men with upside though.

*Emeka Okafor- Has dropped and I'm dissapointed by that. Really has not played well at all, doesn't defend that well like he usually does, doesn't show a better offensive game, doesn't move well and gets fouled out. But he still is probably a lottery pick, just wish he played up to his abilities this year like he should do.

*Taliek Brown- Really like him as a prospect. Very tough player, doesn't have a good jump shot at all but he can penetrate and get to the lane. Good mentality and is hard nose on defense. Needs to work on some things but is a ok prospect.

*Steve Blake- Improved his stock. Fine leader, just controls a team very, very well. Improved offensive game but he will not be drafted on that. Just can run the system and get the ball in the right places. A ok athlete and has shown he can defend top PG's in college. Should be a pretty good player, and could be a PG to lead a team.

*Willie Deane- Tough because of his position. Is skinny but he can score. Very good offensive talent, good jump shot at times and is a pretty good athlete. Will drop in the draft but some team could pick him up and I would not be surprised if he does well as a change of pace guard.

*Hollis Price- Is a winner, very good shooter, great touch inside and out. He long arms which help his stock. Ok handle, is really, really quick when he wants to be. If he improves his toughness inside and going to the hoop, plus improving the speed he plays at he could be a find player. Just wish he attacked more in college going to the hoop, but he can really shoot.


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## BigChris (Jul 12, 2002)

Not one of them will ever be a starter in the league.


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## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

> Not one of them will ever be a starter in the league.


 And your point is what again? Anyone can pick the starters, well then again obviously not because how is Darius Rice, Emeka Okafor, and Ben Gordon not starter quality? Ok, but again I did the total range of prospects, noy just the "good" ones. But if you don't think Darius Rice is a good one, then obviously you don't know how to spot them


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## BigChris (Jul 12, 2002)

[strike]Since some of us haven't taken reading comprehension, let me explain it to you[/strike] This is unnecessary. TB#1. My "point" - which is the only statement in the post, [Edited]. No personal attacks please. TB#1 - was that NONE of those guys will ever have any type of significant impact on the league.

And Ozzy, seriously when have you EVER been right about a player that wasn't a consensus top 10 pick? [strike] lol, you're a joke kid, seriously. And your track record speaks for itself.[/strike]  No personal attacks please. TB#1 

You still think Ousmane Cisse is a future stud in the league? How about Rod Grizzard? No, well maybe Ron Slay's gonna put up 20-10 when he gets to the league, right? How's bout that Darius Miles? 

[email protected] Austin being a top 10 pick, or Troy Bell being a future all-star, or Ezra Williams being a first rounder, or Reece Gaines becoming a superstar in the nba, or David Lee being a top 10 pick, or Cedric Bozeman ever being anything more than Emmanuel Davis, or Joe Shipp being Bonzi Wells, etc. etc. ad nauseum.



Darius Rice is a poor, poor man's Rashard Lewis at the very best. And no, Ben Gordon and Emeka Okafur will never, ever, ever, be starters in the NBA.

Ben Gordon probably won't even make it to the league at all.


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## JustinYoung (Jul 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigChris</b>!
> And no, Ben Gordon and Emeka Okafur will never, ever, ever, be starters in the NBA.


Okafor has a great chance of becoming a strong player in the league. His offensive skills are slowly improving and with another year of school ahead of him, he'll have that maturity to boot. Defensively, he is already there. 

On the other hand, Ben Gordon is an interesting prospect. He reminds me a lot of Gilbert Arenas. And he started in the NBA, albeit the GS Warriors but still. The jury may still be out on him. 

Just wondering your reasoning. Can you explain?


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## BigChris (Jul 12, 2002)

Ben Gordon is an overrated ballhandler and doesn't have the speed or strength to keep up with nba pg's.

Emeka Okafor might have a chance at becoming a solid 6th or 7th man off the bench, but he's too clumsy around the basket and doesn't have any semblance of a game outside of 9 feet. Solid defender, but is too small to really have an impact on the league IMO.

College basketball has a serious famine of solid big men prospects with all of them jumping to the league early; however, in my opinion the main big men prospects in college are Torin Francis, Jason Fraser, and possibly Rick Rickert. Chris Bosh is Joe Smith-esque, so eventhough he'll be a high pick, I won't include him in the potential impact big man category.


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## TMOD (Oct 12, 2002)

> College basketball has a serious famine of solid big men prospects with all of them jumping to the league early; however, in my opinion the main big men prospects in college are Torin Francis, Jason Fraser, and possibly Rick Rickert. Chris Bosh is Joe Smith-esque, so eventhough he'll be a high pick, I won't include him in the potential impact big man category.


Agreed, on that thought as a whole, and the Chris Bosh thing. Jason Fraser? Not sure, when I've seen him he looked like an athletic garbage player. Before I'd seen him play, I heard that Torin Francis was special because of skills he has, but when I saw him, something that stood out was how big he was, and his strength on the glass. Rickert has quite a ways to go, but weight won't hurt him any because he isn't that fast and can't jump high as it is.


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## Springsteen (Jan 24, 2003)

I really don't like comparing players, because it leads to often only relating white players to white players etc., but I really think that Emeka Okafor is so similar to Foyle from the Warriors. Both fantastic shot blockers, with somewhat limited offense. I don't know how many guys saw Foyle play in college, but that guy was a terror. I think, though I may be wrong, that he still holds the all time collegiate record for blocked shots. Watching Okafor reminds me of him. Both force countless number of shot selection changes. I think there is a spot for Okafor in the league for sure. I also think that he "could" be a starter. But realisitically, that all depends on what team drafts him. If there is room in the NBA for Jelani McCoy to start games...anything can happen.


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## daboy (Jan 24, 2003)

I think Massie is gonna be a starter in the league in the future, he has game. I also think Darius Rice will be a decent pro. Ben Gordon is a good player but he isn't a PG in the league and he isn't the type of small SG that can suceed to me. He needs to stay in school and work on his ball handling and passing skills.


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## Quasi-Quasar (Jul 18, 2002)

Massie will turn 27 before the completion of his 1st NBA season, he has no chance of EVER being a star let alone starting, he probably wont even make the NBA...Lee Benson was a far better prospect and he wasn't even glanced at. 
As for Okafor: Ben Wallace is a 42% free throw shooter and aweful outside of 5 feet but his defence and rebounding make him a starter. If Emeka Okafor were to put on even ten more pounds of muscle, which would put him around a solid 264, he could be a starter at center for a team with great offensive players at other positions. I know for a fact that the Clippers and Magic would love him.
As for the Foyle issue, Foyle did hold the record for single season and career until last year when Worjcek Myrda of UL Monroe topped both records. Myrda wasn't draft although he's 7-4 because he weighs like 220 pounds and can't move any more than the current debilitated Sabonis.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigChris</b>!
> Ben Gordon is an overrated ballhandler and doesn't have the speed or strength to keep up with nba pg's.
> 
> Emeka Okafor might have a chance at becoming a solid 6th or 7th man off the bench, but he's too clumsy around the basket and doesn't have any semblance of a game outside of 9 feet. Solid defender, but is too small to really have an impact on the league IMO.
> ...


Ozzy is a respected poster on this site. You on the other hand........ 
I dont see you making and posts on who you think will be good. [strike]From the posts of yours I've read, right now your not even fit to hold Ozzys jock, you earn your respect on this board, you dont try to take if from respected posters by trying to cut them down. Grow up, or get out.[/strike]

Oh and by the way, Rice will be a starter in this league. Maybe not for his first few years, but he will be a starter.

 Thanks for sticking up for OZZY, but no need to attack back. TB#1


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## Quasi-Quasar (Jul 18, 2002)

*more:*

Here are a couple more emerging guys that might make it:

Marvin Stone Louisville- having a huge senior year he is working his way into the tail end of the first. Would be good for the Mavs as he'd add a low-post power player they lack.

Dijon Thomson UCLA- He's currently the best proprospect in an LA college, he averaging 16 ppg and is a skilled SG-PG-SF. His defensive attentiveness reminds me of Ron Artest. If he were to declare for the 03 Draft he'd be a mid to late 1st pick.

Amit Tamir Cal- He's a 6-11 player in the mold of Raef Lafrentz, however as of late he's added a power game and good rebounding skills making him a mid 1st rounder in 2004.

Julius Page Pittsburgh- He has just exploded this year. He's a 2 very similar to Desmond Mason but he's a better shooter and slightly taller (6-4 to Mason's 6-3).

Salim Stoudamire Arizona- After being Pac-10 Freshman of the year, he has improved his shooting. It's arguable that he is the leader of the Wildcats although Gardner runs the show.

Ezra Williams Georgia- Once Jarvis Hayes leaves, Ezra will have a real chance to showcase himelf like Rickey Paulding has this year.

Henry Domercant - Huge scorer, but undersized for the 2 at 6-4. Great scorer and if Eddie House made the NBA on that bid so too should Domercant. He'll be a early 2nd pick.

Players who will NOT start in the NBA:
Julius Hodge UNC, Cedric Bozeman UCLA (barring him learning how to shoot), David Lee UF (come on haven't we learned anything from Mark Madsen who was a beast at Stanford), Doug Wrenn UW, Ebi Ere OU and Keith Lankford KU (6-4 SFs are a dime a dozen)


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## JustinYoung (Jul 19, 2002)

*Re: more:*



> Originally posted by <b>TheGoods</b>!
> Ezra Williams Georgia- Once Jarvis Hayes leaves, Ezra will have a real chance to showcase himelf like Rickey Paulding has this year.


Ezra is a senior and Hayes is a junior. He has told me on a number of occasions that he (Jarvis) is returning for a senior season. 

Plus, Williams won't play in the league. Too slow. Great shooter but way to slow for the NBA.


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## k^2 (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BigChris</b>!
> Emeka Okafor might have a chance at becoming a solid 6th or 7th man off the bench, but he's too clumsy around the basket and doesn't have any semblance of a game outside of 9 feet. Solid defender, but is too small to really have an impact on the league IMO.


Please, have you seen the starting Centers in this league. Too clumsy? He's probally more coordinated then half the Cs in the league. If Shawn Bradley, Jerome James, Eddy Curry, Vin baker, Shawn Kemp, Mike Doleac and Bo Outlaw can start in this league i think, no I know Okafor can start and have a bigger impact then any of the players i just listed. Too small? Have you taken a look around at some of the big men in todays game. There will always be a place for a rebounder/shot blocker. Does Ben wallace have a "semblence of a game outside 9 feet" hell no.


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## Bball_Doctor (Dec 29, 2002)

Okafor is a very good player. I have always compared him to Theo Ratliff. Okafor should be a good rebounder and shotblocker in the league. His offense is limited but I can see him averaging as much as 14 ppg. That is not bad for his position. Okafor should become a starter, maybe not fulltime but he definitely part time. Bosh could become a Joe Smith-esque player with better rebounding. He should have a rookie year comparable to Gooden with better rebounding. He should put on some weight and muscle and in a couple years he could become the next Jermaine O'Neal. That is the problem with determining draftees, they can either become somebody's poor man or could make someone their poor man. All rookies are drafted based on potential. For example, Yao has proven that he could play in this league while Jay Will has underachieve a lot and could soon become somebody's poor man. Let's just wait and see.


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## SouthwestATL (Jan 24, 2003)

*Big Ten Beast that get's no respect*

I simply don't understand why when discussing prospects for the upcoming draft I never hear a whisper about Jeffrey Newton. He leads the Big Ten in rebounding, he's a great shot-blocker. He's a very legitimate 6'10 if not 6'11 and is extremely athletic. He's a true 4 with a good not great jump shot, some good post moves. Doesn't need a certain amount of touches and shots like his teammate Coverdale. It's simply a mystery to me that no one is mentioning him as a possible draft pick. I'd love to hear what you guys think about Newton and where he might go in the draft.
Also Emeka Okafor will probably start in his rookie year depending on what team he goes to, don't know what that one guy was talking about Okafor will never start in the league.


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## JustinYoung (Jul 19, 2002)

Newton is an interesting prospect. He has had good games against good teams with good frontlines. That surely bodes well in his favor. Plus he is a senior and has a winning pedigree. Down side? Perhaps not enough consistentcy. He isn't that great of a shooter and seems to get down on himself quite a bit. Plus I question Mike Davis's ability to coach. That is an arguement in and of itself. Ask me in March about him again. I'd like to put him on my radar. As well as George Leach.

And for Okafor not being a good NBA player. C'mon guys. This kid is legit. He will become a good PF in the league. Look at what he is doing right now. I'm surprised this is even being discussed. Out of all the big men in the country, I'd draft him and David Harrison. That's it.


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## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

Well "BigChris" see my rap sheet, just go to search, and type in Draft and my user name. Than go to the second page and click on "College prospect analysis over the years." 

As for Okafor like many have said, he is a solid prospect, big long, raw but has a ton of ability. Super shot blocker and every single NBA team needs and wants players that can blocker shots! And Okafor has shown he can do that, he can run the court, he defends. Sure not great yet but he is young and very raw and inexperienced still. I think he will be a solid big man and I would take him any day.



> Out of all the big men in the country, I'd draft him and David Harrison. That's it.


 So JustinYoung, you would not draft Chris Bosh, Rick Rickert, Jason Fraser, and to a less extent Simien, West, and Austin? That is strange, I think there are a ton of good solid big men in college, and I really like Bosh's athletic ability and upside, same with Fraser, plus Simien andAustin is are strong tough kids that have a offensive game. And Rickert is a very skilled shooter and the foriegn players have shown that outside shooting from the bigmen can kill a team on defense!


As for Ezra, well your right on the slow part, but I think he can improve his speed with the ball and that is all the matters. He is a very tough kid, mentally and phyisically, has a great shot obviously, but I think he could maybe over-power smaller PG's and that is why I like him as a sleeper prospect in the future. Just improve his handle and passing just a little bit.


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## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

Also

Why are people down on Jason Garner. Sure the kid is small as hell but he is a very fine player. Yeah he gets beat on defense, and deep down I bet if he picked his defense up he would be a higher pick. But the kid is a solid freaking PG, he is in control of the game at all times. Doesn't get to high, doesn't get to low, but is still really competitive inside and is a natural leader. Has a good outside shot and can hit open jumpers when needed. And he can get to the line at times, good penetrator and knows when to kick it back out when nothing is there. Solid in the clutch as well. Just is in control and basically controls the game tempo wise. He has taken top PG's and played well against them, examples being Hinrick, Ridnour, Ford, Moore and Craven (even though he did not play great he held his own)

Sure he will not be a super star, but I think he has the chance to be a ok NBA PG down the road. Tough kid, hard worker, really worth a second round look, if not sooner than that.


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## Lakers_32_4ever (Dec 30, 2002)

I personally like Rick Rickert. He can develop into an amzing player of outlandish game if given room, but if not, he will be nothing more than a decent guy. Someone who will have respect in the league, but never an all-star, etc. He needs to bulk up though, and get a little more grit.

What about Brian Cook? He has decent size, pretty good shooting range, and is developing a post game. 4 years of basketball at a very solid program can't hurt either. I think he could become a stronger, more powerful, and overall better version of robert horry.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Where is Michael Sweetney from my part of town at Georgetown, Scouts in the Washington Post last week said he was a lottery pick. 

Analysis- great hands, great offensive moves , good rebounder, has a soft shot a monster inside. Alittle short but knowledge and size will compensate. He's better than Okefor is now. He's the best big man in the big East maybe the country. The scout said he could stand to lose ten pounds but he's a sure lottery pick. 

As for Okafor and Rice. Both will be starters in the NBA and both have a chance to be special. Rice's heighth along with shooting ability will cause match-up problems. And Okafor defensively is already a pro. If he gets alittle bigger he could be a BEN WALLACE clone.


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## JustinYoung (Jul 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>OZZY</b>!
> As for Okafor like many have said, he is a solid prospect, big long, raw but has a ton of ability. Super shot blocker and every single NBA team needs and wants players that can blocker shots! And Okafor has shown he can do that, he can run the court, he defends. Sure not great yet but he is young and very raw and inexperienced still. I think he will be a solid big man and I would take him any day.


I know what you think about him. I saw that you said he is still a lottery pick in your eyes. I agree. I was responding to some other posts. No problem there. 



> Originally posted by <b>OZZY</b>! So JustinYoung, you would not draft Chris Bosh, Rick Rickert, Jason Fraser, and to a less extent Simien, West, and Austin? That is strange, I think there are a ton of good solid big men in college, and I really like Bosh's athletic ability and upside, same with Fraser, plus Simien andAustin is are strong tough kids that have a offensive game. And Rickert is a very skilled shooter and the foriegn players have shown that outside shooting from the bigmen can kill a team on defense!


If I had a lottery pick, I would only take Okafor, Harrison and Bosh. I forgot about him simply because I know he isn't coming out. But this year's bunch doesn't do much for me. I like Austin. I like West. But I don't know if I'd draft them in the lottery. With so many players overseas with size and skill, I'd go that route. Plus with the PGs in this class, I think I could go that way as well.

As far as Simien goes. It is too tough to tell right now because of his injury. He reminds me of Shareef Abur Rahim so far. Nothing too exciting but very dependable. 

Jason Fraser...I'm not sold yet. I need to watch him a little longer. 

Rick Rickert...I'm not too high on him like many others that are addicted to the draft. He's good don't get me wrong but there just something about him that I have my doubts about. Maybe I need to watch him more. Who knows?

If there is a name that doesn't get mentioned it is Torrin Francis. He is the man. Give him time. He'll be a stud. 



> Originally posted by <b>OZZY</b>! As for Ezra, well your right on the slow part, but I think he can improve his speed with the ball and that is all the matters. He is a very tough kid, mentally and phyisically, has a great shot obviously, but I think he could maybe over-power smaller PG's and that is why I like him as a sleeper prospect in the future. Just improve his handle and passing just a little bit.


I've known Ezra for a while now. He and I are from the same town in Marietta, GA. He's a great guy and has a great passion for the game. But I don't ever see him making the League. He'll play overseas somewhere and hopefully come back home and take care of his good mother by coaching back at his alma mater Marietta HS. 

He just won't last in the NBA. It is too fast of a game and as much as I love his ability, it just won't happen.


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## Hollis (Jun 4, 2002)

> *Ebi Ere- Super talent. Really good offensive game, can rip it up when he is on. Fine athletic, good penetrator, needs to improve his handle just a little though. Good deep shooter from anywhere, great upside and will be a first round pick.


Wow..you think he's a 1st rounder? I think he's good, but I thought it was just cause I'm a Sooner..... What do you think of his draft status *JustinYoung*? Also....I think "fine athletic" is taking away from him a little.....



> *Hollis Price- Is a winner, very good shooter, great touch inside and out. He long arms which help his stock. Ok handle, is really, really quick when he wants to be. If he improves his toughness inside and going to the hoop, plus improving the speed he plays at he could be a find player. Just wish he attacked more in college going to the hoop, but he can really shoot.


EXTREMELY QUICK, great outside shooter, good penetrator, good passer, huge heart and will to win........but he'll have to play PG in the NBA. He's more of a SG....what do you think about his draft status *JustinYoung*?


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## Quasi-Quasar (Jul 18, 2002)

*more:*

I think that we all should give Ben Gordon some more credit. He is stepping up like Baron Davis did his soph season (for the last 2 weeks and the Tourney, he was out the rest of the year). I think Gordon can become the scoring PG Davis is except Gordon is already a better outside shooter. Although he's not as athletic and he doesn't have the brute strength Davis has. Also he is quite the ballhawk Davis is but he's a better on ball defender because he doesn't try to anticipate much. Props to Ben Gordon, he's a top 11 pick in my books right now.

Another guy being overlooked is Marvin Stone. He quietly been averaging almost a double-double, and he's a true 6-10/6-11 265 and wide. He could easily be an EC center if needed. Plus he's mature for a big man mentally, much the way Melvin Ely was this past year (I still think Ely will develop, he hasn't even logged 200 minutes let alone been able to show his stuff). Stone is a top 22 pick to me and I see the Lakers taking him if West, Austin, and Harrison are off the board where they pick.

Brian Cook has a very real chance at being a player if he improves his defense. He's got range, size, strength, smarts and a good attitude. He's defense and servicable post game away from being a very competent 4.

Marcus Hatten has looked great lately but I think inevitably he falls into the Eddie House, JR Bremer, Marvin O'Conner ultra-scoring PG. He has great ability though and it would be a shame if he doesn't develop into a Jason Jerry type player. I think if he improves his D a little and passes a couple more times he could be a top 18 pick.

Marcus Moore has a lot of intrigue too, but less than one might think. He's a decent outside shooter but mediocre inside and doesn't have great shot selection. He's tall and agile, not super athletic and clever. He has the ability to be like Alvin Williams but I see him more as a second coming of Jerryl Sasser. With that said I can't see him slipping out of the 1st because 6-6 and abilities to play PG are an auto-1st, example: John Salmons.

Zoran Planinic has for some reason dropped off draft radars but I think he could work his way into the back end of the lotto. At 6-7 he can play PG and SG, is great without the ball and is smart. But he's kind of emaciated, that can be fixed though. He's a lot like Kerry Kittles (before the injury) when he's at SG and at PG he's a lot like Tony Delk (brings the ball upcourt, initiates, and then roams the arch for kick-out 3s). He's good just skinny, he's a top 17 pick in my book.

Arthur Johnson is a phsical bruiser along the lines of Lonny Baxter, although he's a bit taller. He's a early 2nd pick right now but he could work into the back end of the 1st if Dallas or Sactown can't find a better 4. 

Desmond Farmer is a big 6-8 PG not many people have heard about. Last year he was a hustling 7th man for the Trojans, but this year he has really looked good. He has good range, and obviously size for a PG at 6-8, he's pretty athletic, and he hustles. He could be picked by the Pacers at the end of the 1st if Hatten and the other top tier PGs are gone.

more to come......


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## JustinYoung (Jul 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>mduke</b>!
> Wow..you think he's a 1st rounder? I think he's good, but I thought it was just cause I'm a Sooner..... What do you think of his draft status *JustinYoung*? Also....I think "fine athletic" is taking away from him a little.....


Well I guess I came to the call. Good to know someone wants to know my 2 cents still.  

Ere is hard to figure out. I like him some days then other days I don't. With so many guys at 6-5ish around Ere needs to find a way to make himself different than the rest. I think he could get drafted but he'll be a name that Sooner fans drop at the watering hole five years from now. 



> Originally posted by <b>mduke</b>!EXTREMELY QUICK, great outside shooter, good penetrator, good passer, huge heart and will to win........but he'll have to play PG in the NBA. He's more of a SG....what do you think about his draft status *JustinYoung*?


Remember Juan Dixon? That is what I think of Hollis Price. Just when you want to find something wrong with him, he plays like he did tonight. Damn him!  He's a competitor and throws all the criticism out the window. 

True he will have to play PG in the Association, but he does what is needed so I won't put it past him. But in reality, it is too hard to tell. I just love to watch him win. Can't say that anymore. 

Sorry if I didn't really give a good answer to any of that!


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## Hollis (Jun 4, 2002)

Thanks!


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## BigChris (Jul 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!
> 
> 
> Ozzy is a respected poster on this site. You on the other hand........
> ...


R-Star, you have no idea how sad this post is. You actually think there's some type of seniority on a message board? lol, get a life please, kid. For your sake.

I don't give a damn how "respected" ozzy is on this message board, he's almost always wrong about his player predictions re the nba and he tried to attack my statement.

And you'd need to get off OZZY's*EDITED *. 


*Big Chris, let's get back on the topic and stop the insults* <<< D >>>


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## dmase_24 (Feb 1, 2003)

*Re: more:*



> Originally posted by <b>TheGoods</b>!
> Here are a couple more emerging guys that might make it:
> 
> Marvin Stone Louisville- having a huge senior year he is working his way into the tail end of the first. Would be good for the Mavs as he'd add a low-post power player they lack.
> ...


desmond is 6-5


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## Quasi-Quasar (Jul 18, 2002)

Desmond Mason is not 6-5. Gary Payton is barely 6-4 and he stand close to 2 inches taller than Mason.


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## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

*Well BigChris take a look at all of my wrong predictions over the years, sure, and if you think I took extra time to make all of this up, well that is just sad. What is your track record ummm...*

2000 NBA Draft 

*Right assesment and prediction 
Kenyon Martin- loved him, thought he would be a great pro, loved his aggression and passion and is a great athlete, one of the only plays picks #1 almost all because of defensive ability.

Jamal Crawford- I did not think he was that great, awesome athletic stats and arm length put was not a lottery player in college, and that has shown in the NBA.

Etan Thomas- loved his defense and shot blocking ability, very rare players and it playing well on Washington.

Courtney Alexander- really liked him and he is showing his promise, loved his touch and competitive drive, a very solid pro just took some time to find the right team.

Marcus Fizer- loved his game, inside out, could handle, was competitive, was very phyisical and could shoot, still think that and it came into play this year, not surprised at all.

Keyon Dooling- never really liked him that much, just a athlete, nothing special and did not pass the ball that well and could not shoot.

Donnel Harvey- really liked him, very raw rebounder and he is putting up ok numbers on Denver, still needs to find the right team but he is a good solid player.

Khalid El-Amin- hated him with a passion even though he is from Minnesota, was not a good PG, to short, fat and slow, not a great passer and not athletic at all, and that held true.

Jason Hart- really liked his toughness and leadership ability, good defender and I believe he is still has a shot on the Spurs in the future.

Quentin Richardson- loved his game, inside out, great rebounder athletic confident passionate, and he is a nice NBA player just needs PT.

Michael Redd- really like him, could score, was strong and aggressive, could shoot and had confidence and up side, thought he could be a lottery pick in 2001 and is playing like on now.



*Wrong assesment and prediction 
Stromlie Swift- really liked him as well, just to tempting to get a athlete at PF just like Shawn Kemp, thought he would grow and develop, and thought he was more competitive and driven than he really is.


Desmond Mason- thought he was just a athlete and he proved me wrong, but I did not get to see that much of him either.

Chris Porter- thought he would be a player, and he was but then he got kicked out of the NBA and is in the "minor" leagues, still has a chance but not as good as I hoped or thought.

Mike Miller- did not think he was that tough are aggressive, just looked like a shooter, but some of that could have been the constent BS my South Dakota cousins talked about and it could have subconciously made me hate him.



2001 NBA Draft 

*Right assesment and prediction 
Kwame Brown- really liked him, never doughted his ability unlike many others.

Richard Jefferson- flat out loved his game, thought he would be a big timer in the NBA, and is, world class athlete, great defender, cocky, confident, passionate, leads, is competitive, great character and shows it!

Shane Battier- hated him, thought he would decline year after year from rookie season, and looks like it is holding to form, ok leader and everything but he is not the great All Star people said, yeah they said he would be a "all star" in his 2-3 year...

Eddie Griffin- loved his athletic ability and his upside, great shot blocker, could shoot, was competitive, would dribble, was very very athletic, and he is doing just fine on Houston, but would be better off on another team.

Rodney White- there are some doughters but he is producing in Denver and is on his way up as a prospect.

Joe Johnson- loved this guys, great handle of the ball, calm and confident very good player in the NBA just needs more time.

Kirk Haston- hated the move of the Hornets to get him, not a great player not is really not a 1st round type of prospect at all.

Brendan Haywood- thought he would be a sleeper and a great center in the NBA, good competitor, athletic, passionate, works hard and is a very good player.

Jamaal Tinsley- I had him picked way higher than where he was, is a very competitive and confident leader, awesome handle, attacks the rim, aggressive, and is a winner.

Gilbert Arenas- what he is doing does not surprise me one bit, great scorer, very aggressive, confident, calm, can handle and shoot, good defender, was not surprised at all when he turned it on late in the year, what a WIFF by the NBA GM's on that one!

Gerald Wallace- another player thought should have been higher, great athlete, and is the Ace in the Hole for the Kings.

Samuel Dalembert- really liked him as a center, great shot blocker, good athlete, and he will produce in years to come.

Jarron Collins- I thought the first time I saw them that Jarron was better than Jason Collins, and he is.

Loren Woods- loved his competitive fire, good athlete, good jump shot, could play good defense wanted to become good, and the Timberwolves got themselves a player they probably would have got in the first round if they had the pick.

Brandon Armstrong- never thought it was a good pick and is not, never was a great scorer and his defense is not that freaking good.

*Wrong assesment and prediction 
Tyson Chandler- never thought he was that good of athlete and did not think he could play SF, he can't play SF but he is a great PF, and I was looking at it from the point of him being a shot blocking athletic skinny center and that was it, my bad.

Jason Richardson- never thought he would be this good but he improved his handle and shooting ability, plus he is a better defender than I thought, but he was put into a good situation.

Michael Bradley- thought he would be more productive that he is, but there is reasons for that though, he doesn't get PT, but I thought he would produce more.

Omar Cook- really liked him, passed very well, confident, could shoot, was a gammer, just has not got his chance, and his defense and ball handling is not that good.



2002 NBA Draft so far... 

*Right assesment and prediction 
Mike Dunleavy- I did not think he was Larry Bird, damn so many people said that, he is not that phyisical and like I thought he is too unathletic to play the SG, and to weak to play the SF, could be ok but not great.

Yao Ming- obviously thought he was worth it and would be a good player, and is like I said the best scoring bigman that tall in NBA history.

Drew Gooden- did everything he did in college, great character, competitive, rebounder,is aggressive, attacks, and he will improve as well.

Amare Stoudemire- loved his athletic ability and mentality, is playing well faster than almost anyone thought he could, great prospect obviously.

Dan Gadzuric- not surprised at all, thought he would be a great second round find and is, very competitive

Dajuan Wagner- Loved the kid, thought he would be a great pro and he has shown he can score in the league. Always thought he was better than Jay Williams and he is starting to show it, has more production at a younger age.


*Wrong assesment and prediction 
Jay Williams- did not think his passing and handle was that good, and his athletic ability I underrated, but still he is not putting up like 20 points a game or anything, and some people said he would be up there with Payton and Kidd, but I don't think so, not yet. But I could make the argument that it was right though...

Rod Grizzard- there is still time to change that, got cut but he still is a good player I think.

(I know there are more but it really is to early to tell,Brochardt, Humphrey, Rush, Williams have not really played that much yet and until they do I will not analize there play. So time will tell.)

As you can see I have more right than I do wrong....


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## Springsteen (Jan 24, 2003)

Some of those that you claimed were right, still are inconclusive, such as Jason Hart and Donyell Harvey, meaning that they could still go either way. Also, you use some weird things, such as Battier being an all-star. Except for hardcore Duke fans perhaps on message boards, no NBA level talent evaluator said that he would be an All-star. Quality role player is all that was ever said. The Griz, when they drafted him so high just wanted a guarenteed investment, which is what he is. You also use lack of PT to validate your assesment of Q, then don't use it when it disagrees with your Dooling assesment when the argument can be made just as easily. Oh well.

Do you have a website where we can go and see that you said these things in the past? I'd love to check it out.


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## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

> Do you have a website where we can go and see that you said these things in the past? I'd love to check it out.


 Sorry I don't have a website, that was just a post I made awhile back. I would make one if I knew how. And I know some people are thinking I made all of these up. Well I didn't, why would I make all of this up anyway? These were my thoughts of the prospects form the last few years. And again I think the track record speaks for itself.


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## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

Some more players that I have already talked about...

Troy Bell- Love the kid, smart basketball player, aggressive as hell, athletic, tough mentally and phyisically. Is not a true PG but who cares. Can really score and has a great ability to get to the line and can knock them down when he is there. Very solid player should be a fine pro.

Jawad Williams- I have said before whenever he comes out I think he is lottery potiental. Great skill at 6-9 and NBA teams love big tall SF's. He has improved on him jump shot but will need to improve some more. Very nice handle, good athlete. Just put some more meat on those bones and work on the jumper, fine talent.

Allan Anderson- Always liked him. Tough player, I believe he is the key to MSU, when he plays well they usually win. Good strong defender, athletic and can slash into the lane. Improving offensive game. But should be a solid backup SF or SG because of his toughness, confidence and defensive abilities.

Kelvin Torbert- Well he is another Keith Bogans I think. Will probably have to stay 4 years but that is not a bad thing look how Bogans turned out. Will have to improve his outside shooting. Has a nice 15 foot shot but needs to work on his overall handle and passing. He is a great athlete and that will help him in the future with his stock. But probably needs 1-2 more years, most likely 2.


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## BigChris (Jul 12, 2002)

Seeing as half of your "right assessments" are guys who can't get off benches for bottomfeeding teams in the league, how right are talking?

lol, you're a funny* EDITED * 

BigChris, I edited that, because of the fact, it's considered baiting to other posters. 
Let's keep the conversations clean, Thanks <<< D >>>


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## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

> Seeing as half of your "right assessments" are guys who can't get off benches for bottomfeeding teams in the league, how right are talking?


 Well a prospect is a prospect, some are future stars in the league, others are role players. So obviously they will not all start....

Hakim Warrick- He showed last night why so many people love him. Great athlete, solid defender and rebounder and has a much improved jump shot. But I think he might be a big skinny still. He is really thin form top to bottom, and unlike Hodge on NC State I don't think Warrick could play SG in the NBA. Really that is the only thing he needs right now. Huge upside and probably will be in the lottery. But some of his success could be because of Carmelo though, just alittle.


Carmelo Anthony- Great foot speed up and down the court, can really run. Ok defender and is tough on the glass, good quickness and has a ton of ways to score points. Awesome player and just like Dajuan will probably leave after his first year. Awesome player obviously.


Bryant Nash- Sleeper prospect, very, very raw still. Not a good handle or jump shot. But I think he has a long shot if he works really hard before his senior year. He has amazingly long arms, makes him look 6-11. Great athlete, run and jump player, good quickness and could maybe become a player like Warrick. Not as skilled but just like Warrick last year he was just a long, skinny athlete that could make plays. And if Nash works on his game over the next year he has a shot I think.


Mike Sweetney- I love this kid. Has played himself into the early part of the 1st round, 20 and up. Huge hands, very good at catching the ball. Giant base in the post and doesn't get pushed around. Really long and strong arms for someone 6-8. Doesn't play short. Has a very good offensive game, can make a basket and get fouled. Good solid rebounder and can even block shots. Might need to get faster and in better shape just a bit, but he is a very solid player in my mind. Sould be a fine pro in the future. Reminds me of a less athletic version of Elton Brand.


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## JoeF (Jul 16, 2002)

*Ruben Douglas*

What does everyone think of University of New Mexico senior guard Ruben Douglas? He has good size at 6-5 200, good athlete, can handle the ball, create his own shot, SCORE and is a good shooter. He is averaging 27.2 PPG(and rising), 6.0 RPG, 2 APG, 40.1 3PT% and 81.8 FT% in 35 MPG. His overall FG% is only 41.1 but I think he is a better shooter than that percentage indicates. I think he has to take a lot of bad shots because of the quality of his teammates who only score about 40 PPG combined. His 3PT% and his FT% indicate he can shoot. He is #2 in the nation in scoring. In his last 3 games he has scored 40 against UNLV, 39 against BYU and 32 against Utah. I think he is a legitimate prospect and should be drafted. I think he has a good chance to be on an NBA roster next season.


Link to New Mexico 02-03 stats


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## CoolHandLuke (Jun 8, 2002)

How about a couple of Louisville players last night against Cincinnati:

Reece Gaines - had a bad game, his shot was just off all night, but still contributed to the team, putting up 17 points, 6 rebounds, and 7 assists. It was one of his worst nights of the year, and that's still a very solid all-around game. Played great defense, as well, shutting down Leonard Stokes, and then fouling him out.

Francisco Garcia - I just can't say enough about this kid. 24 points, on 8-11 from three-point range. That's right, all his points were off threes, and he hit EIGHT of them! And he even sat out about fifteen minutes with an injury in the middle of the second half last night! He only played half the game! Absolutely unbelievable. He's got that kind of stroke, but shooting isn't the best part of his game. He can slash, too, and his defense is becoming very, very good. He gives the kind of effort that in the NBA leads to All Defensive Team honors. He could be a 6-7 point guard in the future, too, as he's a good passer. If he gains 20 pounds over the next two or three years, I think he could be a star in the NBA. Watch out for him. He'd be all over ESPN if he were ranked about ten spots higher in the last recruiting class, but he was about 60th by most. He'll be the go-to man in Louisville's offense next year. Oh, and by the way, he's the best shot-blocking swingman I've ever seen. He's been getting about three steals a game lately, but his shot blocking is just unbelievable. He'll swat it away from anybody.


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## bender (Jul 15, 2002)

*some players from Germany*

*Malick Badiane* - some of you might already know him, cause of his attendance at the ABCD camp last summer. However, he's back in Germany, playing for TV Langen in 2nd division of the German league BBL. His averages are about 11 ppg and 9 rbg, but he's improving with every game. Last game he made 20 points and 16 rebounds, along with 3 blocks. Actually he's the best rebounder in the second division, because of his long arms and huge jumping abilities. He's a good shotblocker as well. But he's still playing kind of flagrant, using his ellbows on the rebounds and so on. And he's a bit thin right now, about 220 lbs. on 6-11.
Best comparison would be Marcus Camby.

*Jon Arnor Stefansson* - the Icelandic newcomer. He's the youngest starter in BBLs first division, and one of the best players as well. He was already named "Player of the Month". He's a 6-5 combo guard, he can play both 1 and 2 similar good. He has to play SG for his actual team, Trier, because their PG, Carl Brown, is one of the best players in the league as well (named Allstar-MVP this year). Great teams from southern Europe are interested in Stefansson, e.g. Benetton Treviso. But he likely has NBA future.
Best comparison would be Marko Jaric.


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## OZZY (Jun 14, 2002)

Well coolhandluke Reece Gaines is obviously are great prospect. Awesome skill level for a player his size. Will be a fine PG or SG in the NBA and will easily be in the lottery.

Francisco Garcia well....

I'm not sold on him, I don't think he will ever play a big PG spot. Doesn't have a great handle and can't really penetrate that well. As for the shooting, well I don't think it really is that big of deal. Jay Williams was picked #2 because of his "shooting" and look at him now, can shoot worth a crap because he doesn't know how to create his own shot. Gracia might be a good prospect but I don't think we are talking All Star or anything, would be lucky to get 10-15 points a game over his career in the NBA. Not a super prospect in my view. Sure he can hit some shots but.... 
(But to make a solid statement on him I would have to see him more.)



*P.S. Is there a PG in college you would take over Raymond Felton???*
That is the question, and like I have said before, I think he is the #1 PG prospect in college. He showed it last night. Played a great game, the key is if he can hit his outside shot. Great penetrator, showed awesome intensity and competitive fire. Could finish inside with contact, passes the ball very well. The only PG I would maybe take over him is TJ, but that is really close. Felton will be a fine PG in the NBA!

*Great game last night, and Duke UNC is dead* :laugh:
And for those Chris Duhon haters, well I think he is a solid player, good passer, good defender and plays hard, should be a late first round.


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## CoolHandLuke (Jun 8, 2002)

Jay Williams was not picked because of his shooting! What would ever give you THAT idea?

Did you watch the Cincinnati game last night? Did you see what Garcia did to them? Maybe he won't play point some day, but still, for a shooting guard or small forward, he's still got great size. His shooting ability will be a great asset, and he can drive. You probably just haven't seen him enough to see it. And you have to agree that he's a very good defensive player. He leads a team with Marvin Stone and Ellis Myles on it in blocks. That's something, especially since he only plays about half the game. 

I'll tell you one thing, I loved Reece Gaines when he was a freshman, but Francisco Garcia can do a lot more than Reece could at this point.


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## LionsFan01 (Aug 7, 2002)

Can I get some love for Daniel Horton out of UM???


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