# Feb.19th...who do we want???



## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

their are several team interested in our very own shawn marion and his expirring contract..the teams & players being mentioned are:

Sacramento- brad miller,kenny thomas, john salmons
Toronto- Jermain O'neal, jamario moon
Dallas- josh howard, jerry stackhouse

philadelphia- andre miller, elton brand
clippers- zach randolph,chris kaman
knicks- nate robinson, eddie currry...i think theie entire team is avialable
minnesota- mike miller
bobcats- gerald wallace, raymond felton

top 3 have all been rumored to the Heat Org. and with pat riley...the others are players that we have beem hearing through boards and realgm who sound intriguing ......

the more i feel jermaine oneal plays the harder it will be to deal with toronto...as we haveall seen he keeps playing extremely well the past few games..while our only viable trading piece hasnt sniffed the court bc of a bad groin....

currently the best and probly the only option right now is with the kings for brad miller...which doesnt bother me... bc all i want is something in return for marion , who i dont want to lose for nothing...


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## Wade2Bosh (Mar 31, 2004)

For me its between the Toronto and Kings deal. Right now, reports indicate that the Raptors are willing to take on Marcus Banks so i'd lean toward that deal.


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## sknydave (Apr 27, 2006)

yeah, Toronto deal.. A summer ago most of us were dreaming of Brand, but damn that dude gets hurt more than Shaq


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

I still want Kaman:yes:

but since that won't happen i rank em like this. 

1. TO deal for JO, unloading Banks
2a. Josh Howard deal
2b. Kings deal, since I really don't see us snatchin Salmons.


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

i don't want salmons.. he is good but he cries when he doesnt start and we dont want that.. unless we plan on leaving cook on the bench..

I think the JO deal would be the best deal for us in the long run.. having JO for another season and unloading banks would make our team much better next year and a player in 2010... 


looking at options i think we are going to use most of the money for 2010 no wade and haslem... i really dont see us landing another impact player in FA


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## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

Marcus Camby needs a look also....he is a great player and would look nice on d and on the glass


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

I think if we can dump Banks, then we have to do the JO deal, it helps us so much more in the long run. However, we are winning without Marion even playing, so any deal that brings us a starter can only help.

If somehow we can get Howard, I'd love it too.


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

i dont see howard helping TOO much.. if we want to make a push in the play offs we needs a big.. as far as camby.. clippers said their bigs aren't moving ANYWHERE.. that blows


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

ShOwTiMe 15 said:


> their are several team interested in our very own shawn marion and his expirring contract..the teams & players being mentioned are:
> 
> Sacramento- brad miller,kenny thomas, john salmons
> Toronto- Jermain O'neal, jamario moon
> ...


Im pretty sure the rumors of the Heat being interested in Salmons are false. His deal runs past 2010. All the article said was that they'd been discussing the Marion for Miller/Thomas deal, and that Salmons is another piece the Kings might trade. They never actually made the connection with the Heat, but the headline tried to make it seem that way.

As far as the TO deal, it was rumored that the Heat are trying to get Moon, but I don't believe that either. The Raptors probably wouldn't want to send him over anyway. I hear he's basically like a worse version of Wright now, anyway.

The Dallas deal won't happen. I believe Cuban when he says he wouldn't trade Josh for Marion. Im not sure they'll trade Josh at all unless they really start slumping. On top of that, he's not taking us over the top.

The Philly deal doesn't help us. We're still going to want to play Chalmers/Quinn a lot because of Mario's defense/shooting/development, and Quinn's steadiness and shooting. Miller is a nice veteran PG who can run a team like no other, but he can't shoot, which would really hinder this team. If he's a third-string PG here, I don't see him being happy. Brand is a PF (we have a few of those), and he's way too injury prone. On top of that, he hasn't shown that he has returned to form.

I would do a Kaman deal in a heartbeat. Especially if we're sure he'll be back strong from that foot injury.



HeatBall said:


> i don't want salmons.. he is good but he cries when he doesnt start and we dont want that.. unless we plan on leaving cook on the bench..


No way the Heat start Cook consistently. He'd get abused by the 6-8 and up SFs.


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

^ agree about Cook, at the 3, he is a spot starter based on the matchup, at best. I know we do it now(out of need with Marion out or on the bench and needing Cook's scoring), and he plays with great effort on the defensive end this year, but we can't be having Cook goin up against the 'Shards, Hedo's, Tayshaun's, Danny G's of the league on a daily basis.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

Would you guys do this?

Heat Trade - 



























Sixers Trade - 


























Rationale:

Sixers are unsure as to whether they will resign Andre Miller this offseason, or let Louis Williams run the team next year. They should get a trial run to see if he's capable. Brand doesnt look like a good fit with the Sixers as yet, and they may be regretting the signing - he still has value so perhaps move him now. Rush is filler, he was nice for the Pacers last year but nothing so far for the Sixers. The move gets them in 2010 striking distance also. 

Lineup:

PG - Williams/Ivey
SG - Igoudala/Green
SF - Young/Cook
PF - Marion/Haslem/Evans
C - Dalembert/Ratliff

Marion fits will next to the young core of Young and Igoudala. He comes off the books this year but could sign a much smaller deal. Haslem is either a solid starter or a great big man off the bench, and Cook is cold as ice for a young guy off the bench.

For the Heat:

PG - Miller/Chalmers/Quinn/Banks
SG - Wade/Rush
SF - Jones/Wright/Diawara
PF - Beasley/Anthony
C - Brand/Magloire/Blount

Does anyone think we can get a better player than Brand in 2010? Im on the fence with this. If we are under the assumption that Beasley is going to be some kind of Bosh/Melo mix at the PF...do we need Bosh? Considering Brand is a back to the basket player, rebounder and shot blocked - does it matter if his contract runs 4 more years?

Dre Miller may be a rental, but he's a quality player. Not the ideal fit next to Wade as he's not a great distance shooter, but we all saw how Wade played next to a good PG in the olympics. If Miller was willing to take mid level next year, thatd be a good result. Good mentor for Chalmers.

Rush would hopefully provide the 3pt spark that DQ does.

Thoughts? I think both Marion and Brand are in similar situations, and this could work better for both.


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

I just don't like the idea of natural sized PF that play Center, i kno Brand is long and all, but i just don't see a 6' 8" frame as good Center, not too mention the JO type injury concerns. I personally don't think we are gonna snatch a Superstar in 2010, which is why i would love to acquire Kaman. Only problem with that is not being able to unload Banks, and i don't know if in 2010 we'll have enough money to throw at some1 (not superstar but good-solid 3) after resigning Haslem and Wade (of course assuming we re-sign Haslem and he's good with coming off the bench, which i am kinda doubtful of). Another thing I would like to do would be to pick up a vet PG for relatively cheap, that won't mind coming off the bench, i'm lookin at Stevie Blake who is a FA in 2010.


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## Flash is the Future (May 12, 2006)

Nah, I wouldn't. At this point, I'd hesitate to trade Marion for Brand straight up. We don't need anymore PFs, Brand is not a C, and the dude gets injured way to often and doesn't contribute nearly enough on the floor.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

Riles has long had a fascination with Brand. We signed him to an offer sheet a number of years ago.

I think Brand can play C - he's roughly the same size as Joel Anthony, only 100000% better. I actually think he'd fit nicely next to Wade and Beasley.


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

he's the same size as Joel, and we all here ******** about size and how we need some lol. I agree his offensive skills if healthy and used correctly would fit nicely, but we would still be undersized on the rebounding and defending end.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

Elton plays big though - he could match up with any C in the East (just about). 

The fact hes a banger opens up Beasley's J and Wade's drives - Im still on the fence about it, but its not beyond the realms of possibility.


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

To me, it's still the fact that we would be hurt by the lengthier teams, Just look at that last Lakers game, I honestly mustve seen a hundred tips and almost all of them went to the Lakers, it wasn't a question of playing 'big' either because Joel has a big wingspan too i believe, and we were puttin the effort they were just longer, period. 

So i guess we will have to agree to disagree, I mean i wouldnt be THAT opposed to it, it just doesnt say Championship to me.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

^ Thats fair. The Lakers are blessed with length though (Bynum, Gasol, Odom). I think we'd do well in the East, but im not sure if its Championship calibre either.


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## anru321 (Jul 13, 2002)

I feel like trading for Brand is just like the Boozer problem. Very good big man, but undersized unfortunately. Plus both currently have legitimate injury concerns. I'd be scared to take on Elton's max contract at this point. 

(Now if he went back to his 05-06 status then that it another story. Brand was an absolute beast that year.)


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

Injury concerns aside, Brand is a much better defender and shotblocker than Boozer. But I see what you're saying, height remains a concern.


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

Brand and Kaman have the same standing reach. That is real ****ed up... dunno how that would affect us with long teams like Lakers....


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## Smithian (Apr 3, 2006)

Brand scares me. He is long, but he is still an inch shorter than the undersized Joel Anthony, isn't a real nager, is a bigger injury risk than Jermaine O'Neal, and, yet again, it just small. If we played the Celtic or Magic in the playoffs, they'd shred through us down low with Garnett or Howard, especially if we had Brand and Beasley together.

Lets say we make the Finals somehow with that frontcourt... Can you imagine trying to match up with the Lakers, Spurs, Rockets, or even the Suns? No bueno.


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## SKiP (Jan 28, 2004)

We should trade Beasley, Cook, Haslem and Joel to the Wolves for Jefferson, Miller and Craig Smith.
And trade Marion and Banks to the Raptors for Jermaine O'Neal.

Heat
PG - Chalmers / Quinn
SG - Wade / Diawara
SF - Miller / Jones
PF - Jefferson / Smith
C - O'Neal / Magloire

Wolves
PG - Foye / Telfair
SG - Cook / McCants
SF - (Brewer) / Gomes / Carney
PF - Beasley / Haslem
C - Love / Joel

The Heat get a championship caliber team and the wolves get younger. Beasley and Cook could be great for them as a starters.


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## NewAgeBaller (Jan 8, 2007)

I just want JO.

If its gona be something else, we can wait and pick out the best offer. This JO deal has been 'close to going down' for a while now though, and JO looks like he could really contribute..


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## Adam (Jan 28, 2003)

SKiP said:


> We should trade Beasley, Cook, Haslem and Joel to the Wolves for Jefferson, Miller and Craig Smith.
> And trade Marion and Banks to the Raptors for Jermaine O'Neal.
> 
> Heat
> ...


You're hilarious :laugh:


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## sMaK (Jun 13, 2002)

Trading Marion for Brand would be a lateral move. I don't think we'd get that much better and we'd be stuck with his max deal. 

Philly has been playing better without him anyways.


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## nickrock23 (Mar 28, 2004)

I haven't been watching games as much lately, but i think it's obvious we need a point guard. is miller the best thing available? i think he or marbury would help... marbury has more risk... but 
upside.

we are stacked at F, which is why i hated the Beasley pick. I like what i've seen so far though. he will be a nice player in time. At least Haslem can play C, so i think a PG makes the most sense right now.

i haven't been posting but i have been reading from time to time, still the best heat forum..hope all is well with you guys.. peace


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

Good to hear from ya dude, its been a while.

Personally, id rather see us unclog our forward prospects (Haslem or Marion out) for a C more so than a PG. Which is why I like the O'Neal deal (nice rhyme).


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## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

i hope what stephen a smith said comes to fruition...chris bosh to miami


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

Oh, so when I say it - I'm ludicrous but when the ballscientist of ESPN says it, people are taking him seriously?


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

:laugh:

I'm possibly in the small group of people who don't want Bosh. Beasley is going to develop to that sort of standard IMO, and we should look at acquiring a C through a Marion trade. I think in a Bosh trade, Toronto would try to take Bease off us, which I'd like to avoid at all costs, and wait till 2010 comes, have our core, and see what we can get.


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## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

im sorry.. i hope what dee-zy reported comes to fruition...he's a genius


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

im with beast on thsi one.. we would be in the same situation as we are with marion.. ahve bosh for a year and then try and shop him to get "something" in return for him before he leaves in free-agency (unless we can resign him)

I'm not saying i'm not for what boston did and getting rid of their young players for some vets.. but I have to know they will stick around for a few seasons and win a couple championships...


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## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

HeatBall said:


> im with beast on thsi one.. we would be in the same situation as we are with marion.. ahve bosh for a year and then try and shop him to get "something" in return for him before he leaves in free-agency (unless we can resign him)
> 
> I'm not saying i'm not for what boston did and getting rid of their young players for some vets.. but I have to know they will stick around for a few seasons and win a couple championships...


D-Wade and Bosh share the same agent and they would be contenders living on South Beach for the next 6-7 seasons.

Riles would lock them up easily.


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

ShOwTiMe 15 said:


> im sorry.. i hope what dee-zy reported comes to fruition...he's a genius



RECUGNYZE!!!!


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

WTF do people think that we would have Bosh for just one year? If he comes here, it would be for long term.

Especially if we have to give up Bease.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

Yeah, we'd have to really suck it up for Bosh to leave here in free agency. Then, we'd probably lose Wade and Riley.


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

I don't think we'd have Bosh for a year, but still, I think I'd rather try and keep Beasley and see if he can become the same as or better than Bosh, which I think he has every chance of doing.


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

well.. remember that his numbers and wade's numbers would drop.. no iverson ego's here? (i hope not).. I'm looking at it from a business perspective... 

Besides.. I see Bosh filling that alonzo role playing center at 6'10, he spreads the floor with his shooting and takes the load off of wade, but our bench is still not deep enough.. 

I would love to see it.. i think it would definately sell more seats and win more games.. but for THIS season.. half way through.. i see us winning a few more games than expected (this year) and making a stronger push the following year..


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

Beast said:


> I don't think we'd have Bosh for a year, but still, I think I'd rather try and keep Beasley and see if he can become the same as or better than Bosh, which I think he has every chance of doing.


that all depends on the cost.. if ur tellnig me u rather keep beasley because he MIGHT be chris bosh.. i say F that.. and trade for bosh.. but if they want too much.. beasley, chalmers, pick and cook.. im against it. I'm thinking marion, beasley, banks and nothing more. I really don't want to get rid of cook or chalmers at any cost.. I rather get rid of wright if thats the case... 

but i dont see why u would keep a player that MIGHT be good when u can get a sure fire all-star for the "right" cost.. but the question is what is the "cost".... 

Did anyone notice wade's comments on marbury and how he would help either a team like the celtics or the heat??? Never really seen wade do any time of PR stuff like that..


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

Michael Beasley is 20. The last 3 games, he's put up, 16/7, 11/11, 18/10, and he's a rookie. Now okay, Bosh has more consistency at the moment, and is a sure-fire all star, but Beasley has years to develop. 

This is in no way trying to prove Beasley as a better player than Bosh, but on this contract, I'd rather have him, and he will improve to be as good or better than Bosh.

Edit: I agree with this quote from the other thread.



The '93 Heat said:


> Beasley projects to be better than Bosh who is only a 2nd tier PF behind Dirk, Duncan, and KG. Beasley can be at least as good as Dirk. Bosh is becoming vastly overrated.


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## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Beast said:


> Michael Beasley is 20. The last 3 games, he's put up, 16/7, 11/11, 18/10, and he's a rookie. Now okay, Bosh has more consistency at the moment, and is a sure-fire all star, but Beasley has years to develop.
> 
> This is in no way trying to prove Beasley as a better player than Bosh, but on this contract, I'd rather have him, and he will improve to be as good or better than Bosh.
> 
> Edit: I agree with this quote from the other thread.


I really like Beasley and I dont want him traded at all. That said...I dont think Riles would hesitate to team up Wade/Bosh for the next 6 seasons.

Its all about winning now.


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## SKiP (Jan 28, 2004)

I thought of a better trade. We send Beasley, Blount and Wright to the Suns for Amare. Then send Marion and Banks to the Raptors for O'Neal.


Heat = NBA Champs
PG - Chalmers / Quinn
SG - Wade / Cook
SF - Jones / Diawara
PF - Stoudemire / Haslem
C - O'Neal / Magloire

Suns
PG - Nash / Barbosa
SG - Richardson / Wright
SF - Hill / Barnes
PF - Beasley / Dudley
C - Shaq / Lopez


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## Flash is the Future (May 12, 2006)

That's definitely a better trade for us, but Beasley doesn't make sense for a win-now aging Suns team.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

No more Beasley packages please - the kid should be untouchable.


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## Smithian (Apr 3, 2006)

MB30 said:


> No more Beasley packages please - the kid should be untouchable.


Said it before and I still agree.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

Giving up Marion AND Beasley for Bosh is a lateral move, infact its less than lateral. Beasley is Bosh mixed with Melo - in other words, a face up guy who can take you off the dribble but has range out to 3. 

Does anyone think he wont be at 20/10 in the next 18 months?


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## sknydave (Apr 27, 2006)

He's improving by leaps and bounds. Just about every game he comes out a bit more polished. me likes


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## Smithian (Apr 3, 2006)

MB30 said:


> Giving up Marion AND Beasley for Bosh is a lateral move, infact its less than lateral. Beasley is Bosh mixed with Melo - in other words, a face up guy who can take you off the dribble but has range out to 3.
> 
> Does anyone think he wont be at 20/10 in the next 18 months?


I think it could be next year when he is a consistent 20 point guy and he is a bit stronger. In his third season I think he'll have a true a post up game with added strength and maturity both emotionally and physically... And that is when he is the ultimate offensive package, especially if his handles and outside shooting continure goriwing. Keep guys like Mario Chalmers, Daequan Cook, and Udonis Haslem alone plus that Dwyane Wade dude around... Oh my...


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

...plus that 2010 cap space and...yeah...dominance


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

Did anyone realize he put a sleeve over his leg now to cover those scrawny calfs?


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

Glad to see others thinking he's untouchable too, there's no way I would trade Beasley, with his endless amount of potential, for Bosh or Amare.


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## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

agreed...leave beasley alone...unless im trading for lebron, he stays...

and another reason why i want him to stay is bc i just bought his jersey and if he gets traded ima be pissed...


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

ShOwTiMe 15 said:


> agreed...leave beasley alone...unless im trading for lebron, he stays...
> 
> and another reason why i want him to stay is bc i just bought his jersey and if he gets traded ima be pissed...



lol.. i hope he changes his number :azdaja::azdaja:


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## Smithian (Apr 3, 2006)

MB30 said:


> ...plus that 2010 cap space and...yeah...dominance


Michael Beasley isn't putting up the 18 and 8 I was hoping for, but the guy has shown a lot more so far than I expected. Great young cast on this team.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

My initial reaction to trading Beasley for Bosh was "no." Then I started to really think about what it would do for us to add a player like Bosh, and I started to climb over the fence.

After seeing Beasley's performance last night, being reminded of his future brilliance, and watching him talk to Jax on the post-game show, Im back to wanting to stick with the kid. He may not be as tall as Bosh, but his ceiling is undoubtedly higher.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

HeatBall said:


> Did anyone realize he put a sleeve over his leg now to cover those scrawny calfs?


Actually, he's wearing the sleeves to protect his legs - after the knocked knees in the Atlanta game limited him to 8 minutes.

But yeah, hiding those pin legs is the other benefit :laugh:


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

yea.. my cousin (rather unique) mentioned that to me also.. but it goes all the way down to his ankle... CMON!!! lol.. chicken legs


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

I can't see much difference between their rookie legs.


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## anru321 (Jul 13, 2002)

Jace said:


> My initial reaction to trading Beasley for Bosh was "no." Then I started to really think about what it would do for us to add a player like Bosh, and I started to climb over the fence.
> 
> After seeing Beasley's performance last night, being reminded of his future brilliance, and watching him talk to Jax on the post-game show, Im back to wanting to stick with the kid. He may not be as tall as Bosh, but his ceiling is undoubtedly higher.


I understand all the love for Beasley because he IS an absolute beast on the offensive end. But Bosh is already a proven commodity in this league and is only 24 years old himself. The problem is that none of those three guys can be the defensive anchor on your squad. Bosh and Amare have the size to do so but they have not been able to yet, although Bosh has been getting better at it. 

I like my teams to have an old school back to the basket type big man who can anchor your defense but those are hard to find. Hopefully Beasley makes me re-think that!


SIDENOTE: Like Rather Unique is always praying for, I also would LOVE to put Kaman next to Beasley. Perfect frontcourt. But just a pipe dream =/


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

bosh can play back to the basket and is really athletic.. but defensively.. he needs to work on that


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

CAN play back to the basket is different than DOES play back to the basket. 
Im sure both him and Bease could play back to the basket, will they is the real question. Because right now they are both heavy on the perimeter.


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

in the NBA he doesnt seen to play back to the basket.. dont know why.. but when he was on Team USA thats all he really did.. back to the basket moves and alley oop dunks..


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

Im sure the Heat's coaching staff and the motivation of getting a ring could get Bosh back to playing good anchor defense and using his back to the basket offensive moves.


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## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

The Phoenix Suns have begun exchanging trade proposals with teams for forward Amare Stoudemire, league executives told Yahoo! Sports on Thursday.

Steve Kerr apparently is determined to move Stoudemire ahead of the deadline.

“Everyone is on the table but (Steve) Nash,” one executive said.

Stoudemire is expected to opt out of his contract for the historic free-agent summer of 2010 and his relationship with the front office has reached a point where neither side wants him to be in Phoenix beyond 2010.

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap/


rather have amare than bosh..get it done pat


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## myst (Feb 22, 2006)

No way, rather have Bosh then Amare. Amare is a pain in the locker. And besides, we all know Pat has a man crush on Bosh, he wanted to draft him over Wade.


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## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

a pain in the locker room? what has he done other than say he wants to be the featured guy offensively?

tougher? amare
more athletic? amare
better player? amare (top 2 PF in my book)

pat may have a man crush but we all know who the better player is....


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## LamarButler (Apr 16, 2005)

Beast said:


> I can't see much difference between their rookie legs.


It's not like having big calves is a good thing anyways. It's better to have scrawny calves.

Anyways, I've been hearing about a Marion for Chandler deal, what do you guys think about that.


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## Wade2Bosh (Mar 31, 2004)

ShOwTiMe 15 said:


> a pain in the locker room? what has he done other than say he wants to be the featured guy offensively?


This pretty much sums up Amare's problems..


> That said, there's no question Stoudemire is at the core of the Suns' problems. Seven years into his NBA career, and he still doesn't understand what it takes to be a winner.
> 
> Defense and rebounding are still an afterthought. Even more disturbing, Stoudemire refuses to take responsibility for his failings. In his world, it's everyone else's fault.
> 
> ...


Link


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

LamarButler said:


> It's not like having big calves is a good thing anyways. It's better to have scrawny calves.


lol...what? Where do you get this from? If you're saying aesthetically, then OK, maybe. But why would it be better to have smaller muscles that help you jump in a game based around jumping? Ask Mugsy Boges if having big calves deterred his jumping ability.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

Wade2Matrix said:


> This pretty much sums up Amare's problems..
> 
> Link


Yeah man. Amare is far from being a good locker room guy. This is why Riley apparently turned down a Marion/Beasley for Amare package, and why the rest of the league probably wont give PHX the value theyre looking for.

I really, really don't want the guy here.


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## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

he just soounds frustrated....ever since kerr got there, pheonix hasnt been the same since going to the western conference finals....kerr cant control him...PAT RILEY CAN

how would we feel if were always one of the top 3 teams in the west and constantly cant get over the hump? then they trade your coach, your gm leaves , they trade away players...

he needs to be surrounded by motivators and leaders to help him on & off the court...nash isnt vocal, he cant lead..wade can


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## NewAgeBaller (Jan 8, 2007)

Wade2Matrix said:


> This pretty much sums up Amare's problems..
> 
> Link


Yea he really doesn't sound like much of a leader at all. But to be fair, that article probably paints the worst picture for him, and winning clears most everything.


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## LamarButler (Apr 16, 2005)

Jace said:


> lol...what? Where do you get this from? If you're saying aesthetically, then OK, maybe. But why would it be better to have smaller muscles that help you jump in a game based around jumping? Ask Mugsy Boges if having big calves deterred his jumping ability.


Small calves, more specifically, short calves are superior for jumping and running. The shorter your calf is, the longer your Achilles tendon is, meaning you can return more energy whenever you jump or run (the tendon stretches and snaps back). You look at the lower leg characteristics of Olympic sprinters and jumpers, and you'll notice that most of them have those skinny lower legs, with a short calf and long achilles. There's a ton of explosive athletes like that in the NBA too, Kobe, Vince, T-Mac (not anymore, but thats just injuries), Allen Iverson, Shawn Marion etc. Michael Jordan, Shawn Kemp, Dr. J, Spudd Webb all had this build also.

Your calves generate very little power in jumping or running. They just gotta be strong enough to absorb high impact forces from the ground so that you can use your real power generators, which are your glutes, hamstrings, and quadriceps. So you really only need a certain level of calf strength, and adding extra mass to them won't help you run faster or jump higher, but will contribute to dead weight. What would really help Beasley would be getting in the weight room and trying to get a huge *** and huge thighs (squats, deadlifts).


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## myst (Feb 22, 2006)

Are you a human anatomy major or something?


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

Well, I guess I meant 'visible' calves, of which Beasley lacks.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

myst said:


> Are you a human anatomy major or something?


I don't know, it appears he's fifteen-years-old.


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## Dwyane Wade (Oct 12, 2004)

If we got Amare...Who would we be giving up?


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

No-one really knows, but the main rumors involve Marion + Beasley, which would suck.


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## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

Dwyane Wade said:


> If we got Amare...Who would we be giving up?


It would probably be Marion/Beasley for Amare/Barbosa. I doubt Riles would give up Beasley (who just turned 20) for Amare and garbage.


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## LamarButler (Apr 16, 2005)

myst said:


> Are you a human anatomy major or something?


Haha, no. I've just been reading a whole lot of **** trying to get faster and jump higher.


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## SKiP (Jan 28, 2004)

We could trade Marion and Cook for Peja and Chandler. They come off in 2011 though.

Heat
PG - Chalmers / Quinn
SG - Wade / Diawara
SF - Peja / Jones
PF - Haslem / Beasley
C - Chandler / Magloire

Hornets
PG - Paul / Daniels
SG - Cook / Butler
SF - Marion / Peterson
PF - West / Posey / Wright
C - Armstrong / Ely


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## Smithian (Apr 3, 2006)

SKiP said:


> We could trade Marion and Cook for Peja and Chandler. They come off in 2011 though.


So, we'd be showing up at the party with cap space after the part was over.

Also, I can't stand Peja.


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

I'm sure if we pulled that off we'd be targetting someone in 2011? Who's free agents then?

Edit: http://www.realgm.com/src_freeagents/2011/


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## Flash is the Future (May 12, 2006)

Beast said:


> I'm sure if we pulled that off we'd be targetting someone in 2011? Who's free agents then?
> 
> Edit: http://www.realgm.com/src_freeagents/2011/


Actually, it'd be these guys. Realgm does their dating really strangely.

http://www.realgm.com/src_freeagents/2010/


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## SKiP (Jan 28, 2004)

We could get Caron! That would be one nice team in '11.

PG - Chalmers
SG - Wade / Cook
SF - Caron
PF - Beasley
C - Chandler

I guess Pietrus at SF would be the worst case scenerio.


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## NewAgeBaller (Jan 8, 2007)

Speaking of Caron, he dropped 35/13 tonight including the Wizards' last 15 pts.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

Anyone still kinda hope this goes down?

Miami trades -

Marion
Banks

Portland trades - 

Outlaw
Bayless
LaFrentz

lineups - 

PG - Chalmers/Bayless/Quinn
SG - Wade/Cook
SF - Outlaw/Jones/Wright
PF - Haslem/Beasley
C - Magloire/Anthony/Blount


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## Flash is the Future (May 12, 2006)

They'd never give us that.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

yeah, I don't really see them doing that. Plus we'd have to develop two young PGs, or possibly two young SGs if Bayless turns out to not be a point. Outlaw is nice, but we'd still have a forward glut. LaFrentz, though a C, provides nothing.


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## Wade County (Jun 22, 2003)

^ hence why I left LaFrentz off the depth chart.

I still think its possible. Portland would kill for a dependable, veteran SF - and he'd fit nice next to Roy and Aldridge.

For the Heat, Outlaw provides a starting quality SF and Bayless was a player Riles really liked leading into the draft.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

Yeah, Im just saying I don't see that trade going down because it doesn't fill any positions of need for the Heat, nor does it seem too appealing to the Blazers.


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## LamarButler (Apr 16, 2005)

What do you guys think of Chandler for Marion?


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

It would probably have to be Chandler and Butler unless a third team got involved. I approve.


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

If we can get a promising young big man.. i'm all for it, but we have to dump banks


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## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

shouldnt portland be shopping ODEN? they have to be killing themselves with this old man looking kid...id take him just for his size and prescence defensively...marion and magloire for lafrentz and oden...

oden could possibly be the worst 1 st pick so far ever...right? so why not deal him?


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

ShOwTiMe 15 said:


> shouldnt portland be shopping ODEN? they have to be killing themselves with this old man looking kid...id take him just for his size and prescence defensively...marion and magloire for lafrentz and oden...
> 
> oden could possibly be the worst 1 st pick so far ever...right? so why not deal him?


I agree.

Wait...what?


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

it's his first year.. u can't really tell what upside u can get from ODEN.. he's freakishly big.. and has all the tools to be a scoring machine.. u can't trade someone with so much potential.. A player like that comes once in a blue..

but trading him would fit into what portland ALWAYS has done.. get good young talent and trade them away.. wallace, o'neil, randolph, etc. etc. THey always get big men and trade them away.. not sure why


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## myst (Feb 22, 2006)

ShOwTiMe 15 said:


> shouldnt portland be shopping ODEN? they have to be killing themselves with this old man looking kid...id take him just for his size and prescence defensively...marion and magloire for lafrentz and oden...
> 
> oden could possibly be the worst 1 st pick so far ever...right? so why not deal him?


:sarcasm:


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

ShOwTiMe 15 said:


> shouldnt portland be shopping ODEN? they have to be killing themselves with this old man looking kid...id take him just for his size and prescence defensively...marion and magloire for lafrentz and oden...
> 
> oden could possibly be the worst 1 st pick so far ever...right? so why not deal him?


...what?


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## ShOwTiMe 15 (Jun 30, 2005)

^ya i exaggerated a lil on the worst first pick ever....but so far has been a bust and a half.

how do you guys feel about going after...

*The Warriors are reportedly willing to include Monta Ellis or Andris Biedrins, but not both, in the right trade.

Golden State has tried to make a play for Phoenix's Amare Stoudemire, but they don't have the large, expiring contracts that the Suns are coveting.

The Warriors are looking for more big men, but really only have swingmen and guards to offer in return.*
http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_ar...llis_biedrins/


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

^ I tried to work somethin out on trade machine, for that 3 way deal involving the Suns, Warriors, and us. It was difficult to pull off tho, and the trade that went through, didn't seem to realistic to me.


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## Ben (Nov 7, 2006)

Biedrins would be a quality capture if we could get him, he's a beasty rebounder, (what we need) but that could be inflated in the Warriors system.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

Biedrins would be pretty nice, but no trades work directly with the Heat and Warriors.


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

they do if u include a 3rd party and "cash considerations"


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

^ they wouldn't trade Biedrins to us head to head anyways, they just puttin him out there to possibly be in the Amare sweepstakes.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

HeatBall said:


> they do if u include a 3rd party and "cash considerations"





Jace said:


> Biedrins would be pretty nice, but *no trades work directly with the Heat and Warriors*.


see bolded portion


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## HeatBall (Jan 14, 2009)

key work directly.. i get it.. but maybe with cash considerations.. how off are u on the trade?


i'm against it regardless.. take JO and get the FA u want 10-11


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