# Bargnani



## NJ+VC (Feb 8, 2005)

Heres a couple of videos of him because i know lots of people havn't really seen him play.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=z14brkHotT0&search=Bargnani ->displaying his shooting touch

http://youtube.com/watch?v=QuBVnY0rqzQ&search=Bargnani ->getting to the basket 

http://youtube.com/watch?v=RHHJb4Tf6gM&search=Bargnani -> steal and dunk over a defender


Congrats on the #1 pick, raps future is looking bright :biggrin:


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## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

Nice, thanks for the videos! I'd really like to know a lot more about this dude.


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## JS03 (Jan 5, 2005)

Cool, thanks for the links.


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## aizn (Jun 19, 2005)

good looks on the links.


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## ansoncarter (Dec 22, 2004)

Aldridge would have swatted all that stuff away imo


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## NeoSamurai (Jan 16, 2003)

such a smooth and fluid player....i trust BC will make the right decision come the 28th...

thanks for the vids....


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

NJ+VC said:


> Heres a couple of videos of him because i know lots of people havn't really seen him play.
> 
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=z14brkHotT0&search=Bargnani ->*displaying his shooting touch
> *
> ...


I wonder how he shoots when being guarded?


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## Mr_B (Mar 6, 2004)

Drafting Euro Players early in the draft=A no no


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## speedythief (Jul 16, 2003)

^ Pau Gasol worked out pretty well.


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## Greg Ostertag! (May 1, 2003)

Bargnani is definitely from the Nowitzki/Gasol school. That is, having performed against men.

He's no workout wonder. If he's the next Dirk, you've got to take him.


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## MonsterBosh (Feb 9, 2005)

Bargnani and Bosh on the same team may not work out well. Unless Bargnani is drafted and then next season decide who to build with.

BC could trade Bosh to LAL and keep Bargnani ... bringing in more role players .... as a possibility.


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

Aldridge is the better pick. Bargani can't play the 5.


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## Scipio (Feb 18, 2004)

I think Bargnani and Bosh can play together easily since Bargnani is more of finesse player who likes to play as SF and their skills would complement each others. Now where does that leave Villanueva I can't say. Talent wise Bargnani is a good pick as #1 but position wise maybe not.

Anyway you have the luxury of choosing so congratulations on #1 pick. I'm, really starting to like your team. Good young peaces to build around.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

Greg Ostertag! said:


> Bargnani is definitely from the Nowitzki/Gasol school. That is, having performed against men.
> 
> He's no workout wonder. If he's the next Dirk, you've got to take him.


Do you guys remember a guy by the name of darko milicic? I remeber people saying that he was the next duncan, the next garnett, the biggest thing to hit basketball in ten years. I said that he looked a little slow and unathletic in the little bit of tape id seen of him. 

I know its a little lame to bring up darko, but im surprised someone hadnt. Like someone said, drafting euro players high is a no no. Thats because Bargani's success in the NBA doesnt rely on things like shuttle times or vertical jump, but on his intangable feel for the game of NBA basketball. Is he a gamer like dirk or a dud like darko? That is impossible to judge right now! he is a huge risk. A risk that the raptors should not take because their 2 best players as of now, play the same position as him.


A little OT, but dont you think the pistons would be a much better team if they had a go to scorer like i dont know, Dwade or melo for when their offense goes flat. Someone who can create their own shot. I couldnt help but think of that when i was watching the cleavland detroit series.


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

mo76 said:


> Do you guys remember a guy by the name of darko milicic? I remeber people saying that he was the next duncan, the next garnett, the biggest thing to hit basketball in ten years. I said that he looked a little slow and unathletic in the little bit of tape id seen of him.
> 
> I know its a little lame to bring up darko, but im surprised someone hadnt. Like someone said, drafting euro players high is a no no. Thats because Bargani's success in the NBA doesnt rely on things like shuttle times or vertical jump, but on his intangable feel for the game of NBA basketball. Is he a gamer like dirk or a dud like darko? That is impossible to judge right now! he is a huge risk. A risk that the raptors should not take because their 2 best players as of now, play the same position as him.





Have you heard about Darko post 2005? He is doing pretty well right now and I have a feeling he might improve, he was drafted at like 17 years old, the kid is still only 20-21. He might not be wade of lebron, but he'll be a solid pick.



welcome to 2006 buddy


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

Dee-Zy said:


> Have you heard about Darko post 2005? He is doing pretty well right now and I have a feeling he might improve, he was drafted at like 17 years old, the kid is still only 20-21. He might not be wade of lebron, but he'll be a solid pick.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


ya, what did detroit get for him again? :clap:


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

mo76 said:


> Do you guys remember a guy by the name of darko milicic? I remeber people saying that he was the next duncan, the next garnett, the biggest thing to hit basketball in ten years. I said that he looked a little slow and unathletic in the little bit of tape id seen of him.
> 
> I know its a little lame to bring up darko, but im surprised someone hadnt. Like someone said, drafting euro players high is a no no. Thats because Bargani's success in the NBA doesnt rely on things like shuttle times or vertical jump, but on his intangable feel for the game of NBA basketball. Is he a gamer like dirk or a dud like darko? That is impossible to judge right now! he is a huge risk. A risk that the raptors should not take because their 2 best players as of now, play the same position as him.
> 
> ...


If you can remember so much about Darko how come you can't remember his played in a lower level Euroleague than Gasol and Bargnani?

Your missing the point when people say he played against MEN.


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

mo76 said:


> ya, what did detroit get for him again? :clap:




dunno if you are being sarcastic, but they got cap space to resign their starters and depth for the playoffs (Cato, he was the exp contract)


doesn't really matter what they got in return, they sucked at using him properly. It was detroit's own fault for receiving poor stuff in the trade.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

shookem said:


> If you can remember so much about Darko how come you can't remember his played in a lower level Euroleague than Gasol and Bargnani?
> 
> Your missing the point when people say he played against MEN.


look at those clips. I guess they were men that dont like to play D then. Guys standing right infront of him sometimes dont even put up a hand when he shoots a 3. I dont want this to turn into a big argument about the inferior D in Bargani's euroleague, PLEASE!!! You guys are missing the point anyways. Bargani would be a stupid pick for the Raptors!!!


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

mo76 said:


> look at those clips. I guess they were men that dont like to play D then.


I was just saying bringing up Darko was kinda pointless.


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

mo76 said:


> look at those clips. I guess they were men that dont like to play D then.





What people are saying is that Darko played in the younger league and was a prospect, like I said, he was drafted at like 17-18 so he played like high school level in europe.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

shookem said:


> I was just saying bringing up Darko was kinda pointless.


I acknowledged that it was kind of ..... Cheesy on my part. It shows how strongly im against drafting a PF for the third year in a row.


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

mo76 said:


> I acknowledged that it was kind of ..... Cheesy on my part. But from where im sitting, its like Darko Dejavu, i swear.


It definatly could be, add to that the potential logjam for minutes and it's reasonable to have reservations. My feeling is that is BC is sold on this guy (after watching him for years) I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

Ooo PC starting...


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

shookem said:


> It definatly could be, add to that the potential logjam for minutes and it's reasonable to have reservations. My feeling is that is BC is sold on this guy (after watching him for years) I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.
> 
> Ooo PC starting...


well were projected to take aldridge on nbadraft.net. I really hope that stuff with collangelo was a bougus rumour.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

Dee-Zy said:


> *dunno if you are being sarcastic*, but they got cap space to resign their starters and depth for the playoffs (Cato, he was the exp contract)
> 
> 
> doesn't really matter what they got in return, they sucked at using him properly. It was detroit's own fault for receiving poor stuff in the trade.


yes, i sure was.


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## ballocks (May 15, 2003)

thanks for the vids. great stuff.

well, i don't know what to say. i know they're just highlight clips, granted, but the camera doesn't lie (aside from the ball going in the basket every single time). i don't know if i've ever seen a player _like that_. don't really know how to describe him. but what an interesting prospect. and his shot- the man has a model release. he'd be a good nfl quarterback, i think. his hands on the ball are electric.

the confidence is what most excites me, though. confidence is certainly something you can't reveal from a clip or two- or ten- but the way he appears to dive _into_ the game (even if it happens just once a month) is a tool that most established coaches use to realize player potential. 

bargnani looks like a gem, imo. i'm not saying we should pick him... he could still bust... but the talent presented on those videos looks precious to me. i just don't know how he would _fit_ on our team, that would be complicated- but we do have coaches.

peace


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

ballocks said:


> thanks for the vids. great stuff.
> 
> well, i don't know what to say. i know they're just highlight clips, granted, but the camera doesn't lie (aside from the ball going in the basket every single time). i don't know if *i've ever seen a player like that.* don't really know how to describe him. but what an interesting prospect. *and his shot- the man has a model release. he'd be a good nfl quarterback, i think. his hands on the ball are electric.
> *
> ...



wtf :laugh:


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

ballocks said:


> thanks for the vids. great stuff.
> 
> well, i don't know what to say. i know they're just highlight clips, granted, but the camera doesn't lie (aside from the ball going in the basket every single time).


No camera tricks, the guy shoots 62% from the field.


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## neoxsupreme (Oct 31, 2005)

He can spot up & shoot from the perimeter & put the ball on the floor like Dirk. Wow! Impressive.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

looking at those clips again, he does have a very nice release on his jumper, but do you guys honestly think he will be getting looks like that in the NBA. I think hes kind of slow to be a 3 and he would get messed up on the inside. I honestly think he has a terrible post up game from those clips, like real bad. Bosh can expliot bigger players at the 4 by poasting them up higher out to create more room. Id compare Bargani to Peja, maybe even better. But dont forget, he hasnt done anything in the NBA yet and Peja has. I could see this guy being a great spot up stooter with some driving and passing ability or being completely useless in the NBA. He's not "unlike any other player i have ever seen" good. Hes not a good fit for the raptors. Its either him or eva on the raptors, there isnt room for both. Id stick with the proven player.


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## TRON (Feb 29, 2004)

> Originally posted by *Dee-Zy !*
> 
> Have you heard about Darko post 2005? He is doing pretty well right now and I have a feeling he might improve, he was drafted at like 17 years old, the kid is still only 20-21. He might not be wade of lebron, but he'll be a solid pick.


so in hindsight would you still take him #2 overall? I wouldn't, but it's not to say he won't become a good player

The Bargnani hype is errily similar to the Darko hype of 2003. While Dirk and Pau turned out great, there are just as many who have not.


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## shookem (Nov 1, 2005)

TRON said:


> so in hindsight would you still take him #2 overall? I wouldn't, but it's not to say he won't become a good player
> 
> The Bargnani hype is errily similar to the Darko hype of 2003. While Dirk and Pau turned out great, there are just as many who have not.


And there has been more American college players that got hyped and busted.

I don't understand the "Euro bust, so don't draft them high" theory, considering how many American players have never panned out after being pick high.

It's just a case of people being happier with what they are more familiar with.


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## ansoncarter (Dec 22, 2004)

does bargnani ever dunk on people?


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## trick (Aug 23, 2002)

sig check


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## NeoSamurai (Jan 16, 2003)

anyone happen to know of Dirk's numbers while playing ball in Europe?...

just was doing some research and found that Gasol's numbers while playing for FC Barcelona was similar to those posted by Bargnani this year for Bennetton...(these numbers are taken from their 2nd years on their Euro teams....one should also take note of their similar improvement from their 1st to 2nd years...)

Gasol: http://nbadraft.net/profiles/paugasol.htm
Bargnani: http://www.euroleague.net/plantillas/jugador.jsp?id=BWZ
Heres Tskita's profile....notice that his experience and numbers dont hold up to the other 2, added because of their similar situations coming into the draft (ie/ tall, skilled Euros coming out of the Euroleague): http://nbadraft.net/profiles/nickoloztskitishvili.htm

Gasol/Bargnani

FG%: .580/ .558
3PT%: 32.7/43.3
FT%: 56.0/71.1
REB: 3.8/4.1
PPG: 11.0/11.5

Not trying to say anything, like Bargnani is a slam dunk pick or isnt....just some food for thought


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## butr (Mar 23, 2004)

TRON said:


> so in hindsight would you still take him #2 overall? I wouldn't, but it's not to say he won't become a good player
> 
> The Bargnani hype is errily similar to the Darko hype of 2003. While Dirk and Pau turned out great, there are just as many who have not.


Darko never proved himself as Bargnani has. Plus BC has the pipeline into those who whould know if he can make it.


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## Timbaland (Nov 18, 2005)

Raptors send Mitchell and Embry to Italy to scout the kid.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-raptors-no1pick&prov=ap&type=lgns


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## clutchmoney (Feb 14, 2006)

Timbaland said:


> Raptors send Mitchell and Embry to Italy to scout the kid.
> 
> http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-raptors-no1pick&prov=ap&type=lgns


BC said he's not going to make a pick to plug a hole...instead he said that whatever he thinks brings the greatest value to the team...we lack a bench/PG/C/SG ...I would take Bargnani just because I don't want to be responsible of not taking Dirk II...Aldridge is too much like Chris Bosh....it would be silly to get two guys who play so much alike.


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## Benis007 (May 23, 2005)

shookem said:


> I was just saying bringing up Darko was kinda pointless.


I think that younger from both sides of the bond can become busts.

Kwame Brown was picked # 1 by none other that Jordan. 

I think that it is easier to feel remorse with a big draft pick gone sour if they are from Europe because picking them has been based largely on hype. No raw video, no March maddness performances, no state championships. The average basketball fan doesn't comprehend the competition that they have in the top division in Europe. A second round pick can make more than double overseas than what they would expect in the NBA.(http://www.askmen.com/sports/business_100/131c_sports_business.html)

I dont know very much about Barg. From what I know about his style of play, I would much rather get Aldrige. I honestly think that Barg parallels Charlie's game.


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## Slade (Dec 7, 2005)

ballocks said:


> thanks for the vids. great stuff.
> 
> well, i don't know what to say. i know they're just highlight clips, granted, but the camera doesn't lie (aside from the ball going in the basket every single time). i don't know if i've ever seen a player _like that_. don't really know how to describe him. but what an interesting prospect. and his shot- the man has a model release. he'd be a good nfl quarterback, i think. his hands on the ball are electric.
> 
> ...


That's what worries me. I still don't think Sam Mitchell is the right coach. Yes, it's good to have stability but some of the plays he calls during games are just really amatuerish (is that a word?).


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## aizn (Jun 19, 2005)

can anyone tell me wat happened to dajaun wagner besides his injuries? i remember him playing like the next allen iverson with cleveland.. sorry if the question seems kinda random, but i was lookin at the 2002 draft with tskitishvili and found wagner on there. anyone kno anythin about him?


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## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

aizn said:


> can anyone tell me wat happened to dajaun wagner besides his injuries? i remember him playing like the next allen iverson with cleveland.. sorry if the question seems kinda random, but i was lookin at the 2002 draft with tskitishvili and found wagner on there. anyone kno anythin about him?


 He had his colon removed not too long ago.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

Budweiser_Boy said:


> He had his colon removed not too long ago.


I had to have the same operation as wagner did. It takes 2 or 3 operations actually. Anyways, there is no reason he can't return to play NBA basketball sometime after this. It sounds unbeleivable after such a huge operation but i had this when i was like 18 and i dont think i was impaired at all athletically. I would say it would take a year to recoup though cause you are real weak after because of not eating much for a long time and surgury takes alot out of you.


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## pmac34 (Feb 10, 2006)

Greg Ostertag! said:


> Bargnani is definitely from the Nowitzki/Gasol school. That is, having performed against men.
> 
> He's no workout wonder. If he's the next Dirk, you've got to take him.


he wont be that good


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

NeoSamurai said:


> anyone happen to know of Dirk's numbers while playing ball in Europe?...
> 
> just was doing some research and found that Gasol's numbers while playing for FC Barcelona was similar to those posted by Bargnani this year for Bennetton...(these numbers are taken from their 2nd years on their Euro teams....one should also take note of their similar improvement from their 1st to 2nd years...)
> 
> ...


dirk played for pretty much a club team in germany, where he really made his rep was when he played in the nike summit game against lamar odom and elton brand and co. and torched them for 32 pts. bargnani to me looks like the same kind of player but he needs to get stronger and you cant measure heart with any of these guys, in this draft where there are questions with all these guys he is a near lock to go either 1st or 2nd.


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

This guy is amazing. We better pick him 1st. He can play small foward he's an amzing athlete


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## adhir1 (Dec 28, 2004)

i dunno..i really dont think that BC or any GM for that matter can be soo damn transparent about who they want to pick, Colangelo has been mentioning Bargnani or something about his game (w/o mentioning him) every time he has opened him mouth...seems kinda foolish to me..which leads to the thought, who the hell does Colangelo REALLY want, it seems like a huge and very thick smokescreen. I dunno...

maybe BC isnt as smart as we all think he is, and maybe it was all Papa Colangelo behind the magic which we called the Suns. 

OR

Colangelo is really messing with the minds of all the GM's who are drafting after him, so they pick Bargnani and BC trades down gets a player from another team that he wants and then still gets his guy...

OHH I CANT WAIT FOR DRAFT NIGHT!!!!!!!!


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

I'll be all smiles if BC decides to draft Bargnani. Apparently he's got great work ethic and has that star aggressiveness. Taking him commits us to playing a big line for close to 48 minutes a night and absolutely not having a shoot first point guard. Much like Charlie, he's got massive upside AND he's ready to play right now. Get this guy on an NBA training program and he's going to wind up being a beast. 

Bosh has said he wants a banger. We've already got a bench banger in Hoffa and another can be added with ease. Joel P comes to mind of course (who I'm sure is working like hell right now to woo those with some ching). 

Bosh/Charlie/Bargnani/Joel/Hoffa

That could very well be the best frontcourt rotation, given some time. And I don't think that's a huge stretch either. I think Bosh, Charlie, and Nani could play together next year and cause opponents no end of problems. Defense will be the issue with this Italian, as it was for Dirk, but apparently he's already made major strides. 

One thing about this kid that we haven't lit upon so much is his slashing ability. I see him coming from the weakside 3-point line as Bosh is doubled in two strides, catching and slamming in fluid motion. How about these triple towers ripping rebounds and coming at you on the break? Fantasy? Perhaps. 

One thing I do know is that the NBA has never seen a combination anything close to the one we're discussing here. It might not be practical but the thought sure is exciting.


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

adhir1 said:


> i dunno..i really dont think that BC or any GM for that matter can be soo damn transparent about who they want to pick, Colangelo has been mentioning Bargnani or something about his game (w/o mentioning him) every time he has opened him mouth...seems kinda foolish to me..which leads to the thought, who the hell does Colangelo REALLY want, it seems like a huge and very thick smokescreen. I dunno...
> 
> maybe BC isnt as smart as we all think he is, and maybe it was all Papa Colangelo behind the magic which we called the Suns.
> 
> ...



why does it matter if he's transparent or not when he has the first pick. the only thing he would be doing is trying to pump up the guy's value, which is a good thing.


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## adhir1 (Dec 28, 2004)

rainman said:


> why does it matter if he's transparent or not when he has the first pick. the only thing he would be doing is trying to pump up the guy's value, which is a good thing.


he hypes him up...pulls a trade for lets say, 4th and Jack and the top three teams here him hyping him up..take him with their top pick....and one of the top three picks is (LA, TT,Morrison) one of which is the one Colangelo likes...gets him and jack...while with the first he could only get his guy....feel me?


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

adhir1 said:


> he hypes him up...pulls a trade for lets say, 4th and Jack and the top three teams here him hyping him up..take him with their top pick....and one of the top three picks is (LA, TT,Morrison) one of which is the one Colangelo likes...gets him and jack...while with the first he could only get his guy....feel me?


i guess, bc could play the he'll only play for toronto card or maybe bc wants morrison or gay and ends up getting a pg to boot. when someone figures it out let me know.


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## MonsterBosh (Feb 9, 2005)

SkywalkerAC said:


> I'll be all smiles if BC decides to draft Bargnani. Apparently he's got great work ethic and has that star aggressiveness. Taking him commits us to playing a big line for close to 48 minutes a night and absolutely not having a shoot first point guard. Much like Charlie, he's got massive upside AND he's ready to play right now. Get this guy on an NBA training program and he's going to wind up being a beast.
> 
> Bosh has said he wants a banger. We've already got a bench banger in Hoffa and another can be added with ease. Joel P comes to mind of course (who I'm sure is working like hell right now to woo those with some ching).
> 
> ...



But where is the basketball IQ .... like the Suns, Pistons, Mavs possess .... you just can't throw players together and suddenly think their individual athletic abilities will create a smart NBA team .... because that quantitative approach to building a contending NBA team is neanderthal .... and Colangelo proved that in PHX .... brawn plus brains ..... where are the brains ... ????!!!!


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## NeoSamurai (Jan 16, 2003)

MonsterBosh said:


> But where is the basketball IQ .... like the Suns, Pistons, Mavs possess .... you just can't throw players together and suddenly think their individual athletic abilities will create a smart NBA team .... because that quantitative approach to building a contending NBA team is neanderthal .... and Colangelo proved that in PHX .... brawn plus brains ..... where are the brains ... ????!!!!


it should start with the coach......

the coach should be able to develop his players and their minds...understand what they want to do on both sides of the ball and execute....

with that said, i dunno if Sam would be the right guy to have in place then....


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?p=3597606#post3597606


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