# How far has Tyrus Thomas fallen in your minds...



## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

I had him as my #3 guy behinde Ridge and Barg before the lotto.

Now I have 
Ridge
Barg
Gay
Roy

Ahead of him, and consider MWilliams a better pick as well, but we sure don't need him.


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## JMES HOME (May 22, 2006)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

what about adam morrison???

c'mon 250th post... lol


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## melo4life (Jun 5, 2006)

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yeh where u put adam morrison i would put him b4 ridge, and barg


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## melo4life (Jun 5, 2006)

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just those 2 at the least


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## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

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I would probably put Morrison 5th, but only because of his worth, I wouldn't want to keep him.


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## remlover (Jan 22, 2004)

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I posted this in the draft board, but has relevance to this thread.

I can't believe we are getting so down on Thomas just for an interview. Especially since the reporter stated himself that he didn't prepare for the interview. 

Who cares that TT thinks he is a SF or a future SF. He is what he is...a PF. Maybe his game can change into that of Marion or Al Harrington, but right now Thomas is a big guy that can contribute from day 1. 

This is what happens when there is so much time before the draft. We nit-pick every little thing a guy says. Maybe TT should take the role of Aldridge who doesnt say a thing and keeps his mouth shut, but call me crazy but i enjoy TT's forthcoming attitude. I enjoy a guy who won't back down at all.


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## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

I really don't see him contributing right away, Noce and Deng maybe less PFish than TT but he's not going to earn any minutes over them. He can't play C so he's not going to eat any of Tyson's minutes, and we are going to sign 1-2 bigs. Minutes will be hard to come by for him on this team.

The interview, pure and simple it was not professional on either part. And more than just that interview I've heard him contradict himself, saying he willl compete against anyone, then backing down and saying well teams already know what they are going to do anyway, that just sounds ridiculous when you have seniors doing those same workouts. It's probably his agents fault or maybe we did give him a promise?


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## remlover (Jan 22, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



Hustle said:


> I really don't see him contributing right away, Noce and Deng maybe less PFish than TT but he's not going to earn any minutes over them. He can't play C so he's not going to eat any of Tyson's minutes, and we are going to sign 1-2 bigs. Minutes will be hard to come by for him on this team.
> 
> The interview, pure and simple it was not professional on either part. And more than just that interview I've heard him contradict himself, saying he willl compete against anyone, then backing down and saying well teams already know what they are going to do anyway, that just sounds ridiculous when you have seniors doing those same workouts. It's probably his agents fault or maybe we did give him a promise?


No guy with sense who considered a lock to go in the top 2 or 3 is going to workout against anyone. He'll show up for the workout and do the drills, but don't expect him or any other top pick to go against someone and risk losing out. Think Risk v Reward.

I don't expect TT to get 30mpg, but i think we can put him out there for 20-25 and he can be an energy force that totally changes the tempo of the game w/ him out there. His blocking and rebounding & the ability to start the fast break is essential with him! Tyson can grab a lot of rebounds, but a majority of his boards never lead to a fast break. Tyson gets the ball and stops and looks for a guard (typical big). However, TT gets the board and looks to go! He can put the ball on the floor and start the break on his own. What i'm saying is the ball isn't foreign in TT's hand. 

I contend that if TT gets 25mpg he will put great stats up and help us win ball games.


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## McBulls (Apr 28, 2005)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

TT certainly comes with more question marks than the other five players at the top of the draft.

His experience. TT's basketball resume is very thin, based on performances in a few college games. If this guy is so good why was he redshirted? College coaches need good players, they don't redshirt guys who they think will help their team win.

His athleticism. One of the strengths of his game is his extraordinary jumping ability. One of his weaknesses is that he is too skinny to defend NBA bigs. Problem is that if he gains the 20-30 lbs, he probably will lose some of his jumping ability.

His emotional maturity. TT's a 19 year old kid who grew up poor in Louisiana. It would not be surprising if he had more difficuty adjusting to the publicity and pressures of NBA life, including managing his newfound wealth, than the average NBA recruit. His performances with the press thus far are not comforting in that regard.

His size. I guess we'll find out just how big this particular big is in a few days. But the rumors suggest that he is likely to be shorter than his advertised 6'9". Add to that the fact that he tends to be on the skinny side and you have a tweener at best playing power forward. Certainly not the next Carl Malone.

His offensive capabilities. Speaking of Carl Malone, can TT hit an outside jump shot? The NBA midrange jump shot while being defended? Who knows? According to him, his coach was reluctant to let him take those shots in college. Not a good sign.

The good news is that there's little doubt that TT can rebound, block shots and dunk with the best. Those are certainly good skills to have in an NBA forward. But then we already have Tyson Chandler.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

I believe Thomas was initially redshirted as a true freshman because he hadn't grown or put on weight yet. He is skinny now, but was just a rail back then.

He developed enough to be ready to play, but then was granted a medical redshirt due to a neck injury.


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## BULLS23 (Apr 13, 2003)

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Honestly, he was already #4 on my board

Aldridge
Bargnani
Morrison
TT

However, now that we've been talking about Roy, TT is #5 . . . I like his upside, just not in Bulls uni. I think he IS more of a SF than a PF due to the fact that I don't think he gets tremendously bigger. And to the poster on page one that said he can contribute right away . . . I have to disagree with you dude. I think that only (in order of how much) Roy, Aldridge, and Morrison could help the team right away.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

Tyrus Thomas is still 1st on my draft board. Why? Well, he was redshirted as a freshman and doesn't have a great deal of basketball experience, but he has worked and kept working to get where he is and he seems committed to continuing that work which is important. Plus at only 19 and starting into basketball late his upside is ridiculously high. Couple those factors with his freakishly atheletic body, his heart and desire, and a will to win and you have an excellent basketball package. Sure, he needs to learn how to deal with the media better but he will in time.

#2 on my draft board is Brandon Roy, good all around game, solid collegiate player, would work very well in a 3 guard rotation with Gordon & Hinrich

#3) Aldridge, skilled offensive big man with a solid all around game. There is SOMETHING I can't put my finger on that I don't like about Aldridge and it scares me. Still, he was underutilized at Texas and I think in an offense where the pg gives him the ball in the post Aldrdidge could be a great pro.

#4.) Rudy Gay, Hasn't lived up to his own hype but has amazing physical gifts and if he ever DOES live up to his potential he is T-Mac part 2

5.) Shelden Williams, Should be an all around solid pro for many years and surprise a lot of people at the pro level. (this is just about a tie with Morrison & O'bryant at 5)


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## Rhyder (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

*Before the lottery*
Aldridge
Bargnani
Thomas
Carney
Roy
Gay
Morrison

*Today*
Aldridge
Bargnani
Gay
Thomas
Carney
Roy
Morrison

Slipped one spot, mainly because every scouting report on Gay seems to have wowed the audience. I still wish Noah hadn't decided to stay in school another year.

Morrison would be higher on most other team's draft boards. I just don't see him making a lot of sense for us unless we're taking him as trade bait.


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## L.O.B (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

after reading Thomas's chat at http://draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1336
I think he's a punk along with being a sf at best.


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## Thorgal (Feb 1, 2003)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



Hustle said:


> I had him as my #3 guy behinde Ridge and Barg before the lotto.
> 
> Now I have
> Ridge
> ...


*DraftExpress* just got him back at 2nd overall...

As for interview - Tyrus (or his agent) is either still a bit bitter over DraftExpress for that 7th seed or he's really punky a bit.

Wheather the reporter was prepared or not - for very similiar questions both Roy and Morrison did much more professional...


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



Thorgal said:


> *DraftExpress* just got him back at 2nd overall...


Wow, either they gave into peer pressure from Thomas and his agents (doubtful, IMO) or they have spoken to GM's who have raved about Thomas' ability.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

Closest to "sure thing" :
Gay
Roy
Morrison
Reddick
Douby

Projects :
Aldridge
Bargnani
Thomas
O'Bryant

(In no particular order)


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> Tyrus Thomas is still 1st on my draft board. Why? Well, he was redshirted as a freshman and doesn't have a great deal of basketball experience, but he has worked and kept working to get where he is and he seems committed to continuing that work which is important. Plus at only 19 and starting into basketball late his upside is ridiculously high. Couple those factors with his freakishly atheletic body, his heart and desire, and a will to win and you have an excellent basketball package. Sure, he needs to learn how to deal with the media better but he will in time.
> 
> #2 on my draft board is Brandon Roy, good all around game, solid collegiate player, would work very well in a 3 guard rotation with Gordon & Hinrich
> 
> ...


No Bargnani, Ace? 

I've fallen off the Tyrus Thomas bandwagon (Bargnani is my guy now), but he is still probably #2 on my draft board while Brandon Roy is #3. Thomas scared me off by talking himself up as a SF. I don't think he'll excel at that position because he's below average skillwise for a SF, whereas he's probably above average skillwise for PF (and he's off the charts athletically compared to other PF's). And what also scares me is his reason for talking himself up as a SF...I think he knows that he's too undersized to play PF in the pros. And why hasn't he worked out competitively? My theory: If he goes up against other SF's like Gay and Morrison, they will dominate him because he's a big notch below them skill-wise. And if he goes up against PF's like Aldridge or Shelden Williams, he'll get outmuscled and embarrassed. So yeah, I have more doubts than before. Maybe I wouldn't have those doubts if the kid would just prove something for these teams. Whoever is advising him need advising themselves.


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## madox (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> Tyrus Thomas is still 1st on my draft board. Why? Well, he was redshirted as a freshman and doesn't have a great deal of basketball experience, but he has worked and kept working to get where he is and he seems committed to continuing that work which is important. Plus at only 19 and starting into basketball late his upside is ridiculously high. Couple those factors with his freakishly atheletic body, his heart and desire, and a will to win and you have an excellent basketball package. Sure, he needs to learn how to deal with the media better but he will in time.



This is how I think as well.

It's really silly that people are so appalled by this interview. Plenty of NBA stars, probably almost all of them, have said some pretty dumb things to the media in their careers. 

He's probably suffered through many injustices and was just lashing out. It's like that time when I was 19 and couldn't decide whether to wrassle gators or go crawl up Desolation Peak and die. Instead I went to business school.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



yodurk said:


> No Bargnani, Ace?
> 
> I've fallen off the Tyrus Thomas bandwagon (Bargnani is my guy now), but he is still probably #2 on my draft board while Brandon Roy is #3. Thomas scared me off by talking himself up as a SF. I don't think he'll excel at that position because he's below average skillwise for a SF, whereas he's probably above average skillwise for PF (and he's off the charts athletically compared to other PF's). And what also scares me is his reason for talking himself up as a SF...I think he knows that he's too undersized to play PF in the pros. And why hasn't he worked out competitively? My theory: If he goes up against other SF's like Gay and Morrison, they will dominate him because he's a big notch below them skill-wise. And if he goes up against PF's like Aldridge or Shelden Williams, he'll get outmuscled and embarrassed. So yeah, I have more doubts than before. Maybe I wouldn't have those doubts if the kid would just prove something for these teams. Whoever is advising him need advising themselves.



Bargnani is probably a 5b for me and he has slipped a lot in my mind. I keep seeing his stats posted in the tourney and they are really underwhelming me. Sure, his highlight reel video's look nice, gm's have nice things to say about him, but other than seeing him in one or two games where he was solid but unspectacular and reading everything about him I really don't have enough 411 to rank him any higher. Originally he was one of my top 3 choices but from what I am hearing he is sounding more and more like a 3 year project, which isn't a BAD thing, but the Bulls should be able to compete for teh ECF next season if they make the right moves and I am not sure that drafting a project guy so high would be the right move. All of that being said, if Pax drafts Bargnani I will assume that he knows a lot more about him than any of us and that he is doing the right thing and I will be excited by it as well.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



yodurk said:


> No Bargnani, Ace?
> 
> I've fallen off the Tyrus Thomas bandwagon (Bargnani is my guy now), but he is still probably #2 on my draft board while Brandon Roy is #3. Thomas scared me off by talking himself up as a SF. I don't think he'll excel at that position because he's below average skillwise for a SF, whereas he's probably above average skillwise for PF (and he's off the charts athletically compared to other PF's). And what also scares me is his reason for talking himself up as a SF...I think he knows that he's too undersized to play PF in the pros. And why hasn't he worked out competitively? My theory: If he goes up against other SF's like Gay and Morrison, they will dominate him because he's a big notch below them skill-wise. And if he goes up against PF's like Aldridge or Shelden Williams, he'll get outmuscled and embarrassed. So yeah, I have more doubts than before. Maybe I wouldn't have those doubts if the kid would just prove something for these teams. Whoever is advising him need advising themselves.



Oh and as far as him saying he is a sf that really doesn't worry me because he won't be playing sf in the pros and Skiles won't be playing him there. I agree that Thomas would get handed his hat against Gay or a quicker more agile 2/3 type player, to expect anything less would be silly IMO. Kind of like asking Othella Harrington to guard Deng. I don't think Tyrus would fare poorly against the pf's, he did alright against them in the tourney, but if he is guaranteed to go #2 (as I suspect) what would be the point in it?


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## L.O.B (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> Oh and as far as him saying he is a sf that really doesn't worry me because he won't be playing sf in the pros and Skiles won't be playing him there. I agree that Thomas would get handed his hat against Gay or a quicker more agile 2/3 type player, to expect anything less would be silly IMO. Kind of like asking Othella Harrington to guard Deng. I don't think Tyrus would fare poorly against the pf's, he did alright against them in the tourney, but if he is guaranteed to go #2 (as I suspect) what would be the point in it?


Pardon me if I am reading this right. Tyrus doesn't want to go against Gay because Gay is quicker and faster and it would show. Isn't Tyrus's biggest asset his freeky ability? Tyrus is listed at 6'9", 215 and I see Gay is listed at 6'9" 220. If Tyrus can play the 4 in the NBA because of his athleticism why couldn't Gay? Hell if freeky skills and height alone can make you a stud 4 why hasn't Darius Miles succeeded at power forward?


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



L.O.B said:


> Pardon me if I am reading this right. Tyrus doesn't want to go against Gay because Gay is quicker and faster and it would show. Isn't Tyrus's biggest asset his freeky ability? Tyrus is listed at 6'9", 215 and I see Gay is listed at 6'9" 220. If Tyrus can play the 4 in the NBA because of his athleticism why couldn't Gay? Hell if freeky skills and height alone can make you a stud 4 why hasn't Darius Miles succeeded at power forward?


Gay has a 2/3 skillset. His biggest assetts are his quickness and atheleticism and the ability to put the ball on the floor and get to the rim. Thomas has a 4 (and possibly a 5 at a later date) skillset, his abilities are more post oriented and he is a very good post defender, he isn't a guy I would want chasing around the Lebrons & Kobe's of the world.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

I am not worried by his comment. I still feel the same way about him as I did before. I don't see any reason to get worked up about one silly interview. Also, the coach can play him wherever he sees fit. It's not like you saw Nocioni this year implode because he was played at PF rather than SF. He's #2 on my board after Bargnani, who I figure will be gone. I also would not be upset if we picked Aldridge or Roy, if that's who the Bulls determine is the best player.


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## L.O.B (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> Gay has a 2/3 skillset. His biggest assetts are his quickness and atheleticism and the ability to put the ball on the floor and get to the rim. Thomas has a 4 (and possibly a 5 at a later date) skillset, his abilities are more post oriented and he is a very good post defender, he isn't a guy I would want chasing around the Lebrons & Kobe's of the world.



but at 215 don't you have to worry that the skill set he showed in College won't translate when he's getting beat up by men that outweigh him by 30 pounds or more? I would be very concerned that at 215 Thomas would be pushed around easier than Tyson. It's pretty hard to sky when a large man is holding you down or backing you out of the paint.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



L.O.B said:


> but at 215 don't you have to worry that the skill set he showed in College won't translate when he's getting beat up by men that outweigh him by 30 pounds or more? I would be very concerned that at 215 Thomas would be pushed around easier than Tyson. It's pretty hard to sky when a large man is holding you down or backing you out of the paint.



True but Thomas is clearly a lot stronger that Tyson already. He is shorter but he has a better center of gravity for holding things down in the post. Plus, it looks to me like Thomas isn't done growing and I think Helland or a skilled strength and conditioning coach could easily get Tyrus to add 20 or more lbs of muscle within a season or two.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> Tyrus Thomas is still 1st on my draft board. Why? Well, he was redshirted as a freshman and doesn't have a great deal of basketball experience, but he has worked and kept working to get where he is and he seems committed to continuing that work which is important. Plus at only 19 and starting into basketball late his upside is ridiculously high. Couple those factors with his freakishly atheletic body, his heart and desire, and a will to win and you have an excellent basketball package.


I'm not worried at all about the media stuff.

However, the mere fact that he is a freakish athlete who doesn't have much experience playing basketball doesn't necessarily translate to ridiculously high upside. It tranlates into a long way to go until he can reach a level where he can contribute.

If he does indeed commit himself to continuing to work hard, there MAY be tremendous upside, but a late start playing the game does not mean he WILL continue to develop to a high level of basketball IQ and skill.

We can hope his IQ and skills follow his heart and desire. But that is only a hope.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

This is the biggest chance Pax is going to have to make this current "core" into a real contender.

I think you have to take anyone who's 19 or 20 years old and scratch them from the list. 

Luol Deng is a good NBA player. His PER is slightly above 15. Maybe he has a lot more upside, but he's hardly one of the league's best at his position. In fact, none of our players are close to the best at their position. He's why you don't want another 19 or 20 year old project - it means the "core" gets older while waiting for the guy to (MAYBE) develop.

Gordon 16.9 PPG / 3.0 APG / .422 FG
Hinrich 15.9 PPG / 6.3 APG / .418 FG (6.3 APG is 15th in the league)
Deng 14.3 PPG / 6.6 RPG / .463 FG
Nocioni 13.0 PPG / 6.0 RPG / .461 FG

Nocioni has the highest PER at about 16. 15 is average.

Our real need is someone who is an upgrade at any or all of these positions, as well as filling a hole.

The reality is we're a team of very good role players in need of both personality (it's player X's team) and a player who's among the elite class of players in the whole league - whatever position it is.


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

Yikes. I hadn't read that interview. Frankly, though Thomas has been #2 on my board behind Aldridge this whole time, I've expressed minor concerns over his attitude from the beginning. Irrational and subjective though it is, I thought he looked like a "fugazy" tough guy the way he was running around acting like an idiot during the NCAA Tourney. Struck me as that "false bravado" type that Skiles was comparing Chapu to earlier this year. The stuff about "eating souls" is typical "all talk" stuff too, in my experience, and suggests a lack of confidence rather than an overabundance. 

But then everything I'd read was that he had a great attitude, terrific work ethic, and was ideal for the Bulls' attitude and mindset. So I kind of shrugged it off. 

This interview leads me to two conclusions. (a) I may have been right all along about his cardboard attitude; (b) his agents stink the stinkiest stink that ever stunk. 

How can they not prepare a guy for an interview like this? How can they go around complaining about #7 rankings in a mock freaking draft? 

Anyway, though the article gives me some pause, Thomas remains #2 on my board behind Aldridge. Though my fingers might subconsciously cross of the Bulls draft the player that might be the real "Big Baby" from LSU.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> I'm not worried at all about the media stuff.
> 
> However, the mere fact that he is a freakish athlete who doesn't have much experience playing basketball doesn't necessarily translate to ridiculously high upside. It tranlates into a long way to go until he can reach a level where he can contribute.
> 
> If he does indeed commit himself to continuing to work hard, there MAY be tremendous upside, but a late start does not mean he WILL continue to develop to a high level of basketball IQ and skill.



Thats a good point and your definitley right. I would argue however that Tyrus has shown enough promise in his short basketball career to infer that he could be pretty darn good someday. In HS he averaged 16ppg, 12rpg, and 6bpg (after getting a late start) and in college he averaged 12.3ppg, 9.4rpg, & 3.1bpg shooting a high percentage and thats after being redshirted his freshman year. Plus, I think we all saw how Tyrus pretty much dominated in the tourney. His current level coupled with room to grow, in my mind, is what makes him the most attractive prospect.


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## L.O.B (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> True but Thomas is clearly a lot stronger that Tyson already. He is shorter but he has a better center of gravity for holding things down in the post. Plus, it looks to me like Thomas isn't done growing and I think Helland or a skilled strength and conditioning coach could easily get Tyrus to add 20 or more lbs of muscle within a season or two.


Is Thomas clearly stronger than Tyson? Getting bodied by College players is alot different than getting bodied by NBA players plus Thomas had the NCAA's biggest body playing with him. I gotta believe that Thomas gets pushed around by most of the NBA's 4's. 

The scary thing about what you're saying about Thomas's potential toward weight gain is alot of us thought Helland could get 20 pounds of muscle onto Tyson as well.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



L.O.B said:


> Is Thomas clearly stronger than Tyson? Getting bodied by College players is alot different than getting bodied by NBA players plus Thomas had the NCAA's biggest body playing with him. I gotta believe that Thomas gets pushed around by most of the NBA's 4's.
> 
> The scary thing about what you're saying about Thomas's potential toward weight gain is alot of us thought Helland could get 20 pounds of muscle onto Tyson as well.



Very good points and not easily dismissed. I do think Thomas is stronger that Tyson, just look at their musculature, Tyson is more string bean with some sclupting while Thomas IS sculpted. I will be curious to see the results from the pre-draft camp to see how much Thomas lifts, how many reps he gets up. I confess I too thought Helland would be able to add weight to Tyson and he has a little but not nearly enough. But, I guess we could wonder if Helland could add mass to ANY player we draft and other than looking at the signs there really is no way of knowing for sure.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

Before the lottery my list was 

Barg
TT
Aldridge


As of two weeks ago it changed and is still the same as it was two weeks ago. 

Barg
TT
Roy 
Aldridge


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

well you all know me

it was

thomas
aldridge
bargnani
roy

now it's

aldridge
bargnani
roy
thomas


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



The ROY said:


> well you all know me
> 
> it was
> 
> ...


Wow, thats an awfully large slide for Thomas, what made him drop so much in your mind? It wasn't that silly interview was it?


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## theanimal23 (Mar 2, 2005)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

My Choices: 1a. Aldridge 1b. Bargnani 

The problem I have is, we need a combo player: A guy with Tyrus' demeanor, Aldridge's Post Play, and Bargnani's Perimeter play. 

I will be happy with whoever Paxson picks, b/c Sadly there is no player who is clearly better than his colleagues. Otherwise we'd all be cheering for the same guy.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> Wow, thats an awfully large slide for Thomas, what made him drop so much in your mind? It wasn't that silly interview was it?


that attitude was ridiculous, but that wasn't it..

it's him THINKING he's a 3. That's pretty much my only problem. I could get over the dispute he had with draftexpress if he was just embrace his role as a 4 lol. That may sound a little silly, but SINCE the tourney, I've wanted him on the team thinking he'd be the 4 we were looking for. Now he's shooting 3's in workouts like crazy and telling everybody who'll listen he's a 3. randy livingston said he'll be a scoring, slashing, ballhandling 4 in the pro's, now THAT's what I want.

if that's not the case, i'd just rather have aldridge. but it looks like he's still atop pax lists (from the things i've read) so maybe he doesn't have a problem with what I have a problem with.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



The ROY said:


> that attitude was ridiculous, but that wasn't it..
> 
> it's him THINKING he's a 3. That's pretty much my only problem. I could get over the dispute he had with draftexpress if he was just embrace his role as a 4 lol. That may sound a little silly, but SINCE the tourney, I've wanted him on the team thinking he'd be the 4 we were looking for. Now he's shooting 3's in workouts like crazy and telling everybody who'll listen he's a 3. randy livingston said he'll be a scoring, slashing, ballhandling 4 in the pro's, now THAT's what I want.
> 
> if that's not the case, i'd just rather have aldridge. but it looks like he's still atop pax lists (from the things i've read) so maybe he doesn't have a problem with what I have a problem with.



Hmmm. That is an interesting observation.


----------



## L.O.B (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

I want to know why Gay couldn't be that ball handling, slashing 4? Gay has better length and there is no disputing his vertical leap. Maybe all this time we should of been looking at Gay as the new prototype four instead of looking at Thomas.


----------



## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



The ROY said:


> that attitude was ridiculous, but that wasn't it..
> 
> it's him THINKING he's a 3. That's pretty much my only problem. I could get over the dispute he had with draftexpress if he was just embrace his role as a 4 lol. That may sound a little silly, but SINCE the tourney, I've wanted him on the team thinking he'd be the 4 we were looking for. Now he's shooting 3's in workouts like crazy and telling everybody who'll listen he's a 3. randy livingston said he'll be a scoring, slashing, ballhandling 4 in the pro's, now THAT's what I want.
> 
> if that's not the case, i'd just rather have aldridge. but it looks like he's still atop pax lists (from the things i've read) so maybe he doesn't have a problem with what I have a problem with.



Why worry what Thomas says? He can say he is a three all he wants, he can say he is the friggin pope for all I care, Skiles will play him at the 4 spot and thats that.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



L.O.B said:


> I want to know why Gay couldn't be that ball handling, slashing 4? Gay has better length and there is no disputing his vertical leap. Maybe all this time we should of been looking at Gay as the new prototype four instead of looking at Thomas.



Gay doesn't really have any post game to speak of. Just because a guy is tall that doesn't make him a 4 IMO.


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## L.O.B (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> Gay doesn't really have any post game to speak of. Just because a guy is tall that doesn't make him a 4 IMO.


 Which is what I've been trying to say all along, Thomas isn't a 4. :biggrin:


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> Why worry what Thomas says? He can say he is a three all he wants, he can say he is the friggin pope for all I care, Skiles will play him at the 4 spot and thats that.


lol makes sense....

like i said, it doesn't seem like it bother's pax much with reports of thomas still being #1. It still irks me to play a guy out of position fulltime that doesn't WANT to. Amare played C two years ago and didn't want to but it actually worked out in his favor so who knows, we'll see.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



L.O.B said:


> Which is what I've been trying to say all along, Thomas isn't a 4. :biggrin:



lol, No. Thomas DOES have a post game and is a 4, Gay, not much of a post game and not strong enough to defend interior players and defintley not a 4! We clear now? :biggrin:


----------



## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

Thomas' interview sort of underscores some of the concerns I brought up in this thread

http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?t=273333

As I said there


> So what does everyone think? I think there's something to find out more about. A guy who can be moody and rebellious when taken out of his comfort zone could be a problem. Especially for this team, which, I think, expects guys to be self-starters.




Well, I think we've found out a bit more, and I didn't like what I found. He sounded like a moody *******.

I still wouldn't be upset if the Bulls take him, but a lot of how he turns out is going to be dependent on his attitude. Look through the nice veneer and I see significant risks.


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## L.O.B (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> lol, No. Thomas DOES have a post game and is a 4, Gay, not much of a post game and not strong enough to defend interior players and defintley not a 4! We clear now? :biggrin:


I am not seeing this great post game from Thomas. I believe he is a good garbage man inside the paint but you can't count on his ability to post anyone at the next level. If you can't get position at the NBA level all the hops in the world aren't going to help you. Reading the Randy Livingston article had me shaking my head that a guard had to teach a powerforward the Mikan drill.


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



MikeDC said:


> Thomas' interview sort of underscores some of the concerns I brought up in this thread
> 
> http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?t=273333
> 
> ...


Agreed. It is troubling.


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## madox (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

I know everyone likes going small but I think this would be a good lineup:

Hinrich
Deng
Noc
T. Thomas
B. Wallace/Nene


Gordon might not be happy about the bench but he'd still his 30+ minutes. 

I like it because Deng has an underrated post game and if he really worked at it he could dominate SG's in the post. 

Noc and T. Thomas would both be good working the pick and roll with Hinrich. 

Defensively it's a juggernaut.


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## l2owen (Apr 24, 2006)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



remlover said:


> *No guy with sense who considered a lock to go in the top 2 or 3 is going to workout against anyone*. He'll show up for the workout and do the drills, but don't expect him or any other top pick to go against someone and risk losing out. Think Risk v Reward.
> 
> I don't expect TT to get 30mpg, but i think we can put him out there for 20-25 and he can be an energy force that totally changes the tempo of the game w/ him out there. His blocking and rebounding & the ability to start the fast break is essential with him! Tyson can grab a lot of rebounds, but a majority of his boards never lead to a fast break. Tyson gets the ball and stops and looks for a guard (typical big). However, TT gets the board and looks to go! He can put the ball on the floor and start the break on his own. What i'm saying is the ball isn't foreign in TT's hand.
> 
> I contend that if TT gets 25mpg he will put great stats up and help us win ball games.


not true. adam who is now becoming a concensus first, himself stated that he will workout against anyone anytime and has already scheduled workouts against rudy in toronto on the 21st and some other places. hes not afraid. hes got heart , hes got fire, and hes gonna take the nba by storm .


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## jbulls (Aug 31, 2005)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



ace20004u said:


> lol, No. Thomas DOES have a post game and is a 4, Gay, not much of a post game and not strong enough to defend interior players and defintley not a 4! We clear now? :biggrin:


I like Thomas but at this point his face up game is more developed than his post game, which is basically non-existant. Not surprising given that he played on the wing in high school, I suppose.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



MikeDC said:


> Thomas' interview sort of underscores some of the concerns I brought up in this thread
> 
> http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?t=273333
> 
> ...


Way to see it ahead of time, MikeDC.

I remember having mixed feelings after those soul-eating comments in the tournament. Obviously, he's tremendously motivate and intense, but does he go about expressing it the wrong way? Is he the type that could piss Skiles off so much that he lands in the doghouse before the season starts? Would his teammates hate him?


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



jbulls said:


> I like Thomas but at this point his face up game is more developed than his post game, which is basically non-existant. Not surprising given that he played on the wing in high school, I suppose.



Thats true but his post game IS more developed than Rudy Gay and I imagine that Thomas will be doing a lot of post play in the NBA, he has to develop it more though and hopefully a coach like Skiles will help him do that.


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> Way to see it ahead of time, MikeDC.
> 
> I remember having mixed feelings after those soul-eating comments in the tournament. Obviously, he's tremendously motivate and intense, but does he go about expressing it the wrong way? Is he the type that could piss Skiles off so much that he lands in the doghouse before the season starts? Would his teammates hate him?


Is he Kenyon Martin? 

The guy is obviously all bent out of shape about a meaningless internet mock draft ranking. Its one thing to use something as motivation. Its quite another to be bruised so easily that you have to publicly cry about it through your agents, and then through your own cake hole. 

If he can't take that, how is he going to react to Skiles? Can he take it?


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## mizenkay (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

i think first and foremost that tyrus thomas needs new representation.

sit the boy down and teach him how to speak to the press. 

and what good is the #2 pick sitting on the bench cause he pissed off the coach with his attitude?

this is why i want brandon roy.


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



Ron Cey said:


> Is he Kenyon Martin?
> 
> The guy is obviously all bent out of shape about a meaningless internet mock draft ranking. Its one thing to use something as motivation. Its quite another to be bruised so easily that you have to publicly cry about it through your agents, and then through your own cake hole.
> 
> * If he can't take that, how is he going to react to Skiles? Can he take it?*


That was my concern after reading the background articles on him. They painted a him (at least to my reading) as a pessimistic guy who had a real problem trusting people outside his immediate circle of supporters. And he's been cocooned in that support structure for a long time.

I think that's a real concern. Add to it his desire to be a SF and it's an even bigger concern.

My other concern is that I still haven't seen any measurements. He's looking closer to Antonio McDyess or KMart to me, and further from say, Shawn Kemp or Amare Stoudemire in terms of what he'll bring to the table. Don't get me wrong, those guys aren't horrible, but in terms of NBA power forwards I don't think they're anything special and they've declined very quickly because they were highly dependent on their athleticism and at the first injury they were pretty much shot.

I'm not sure how far down my list he's moved, but he's down it.


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## fl_flash (Aug 19, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

Lots of good stuff here. For me personally, Thomas has slipped a bit. Before it was like Bargnani 1a and Thomas 1b. Now it's Bargnani #1. Thomas is #2 still but Morrison and Gay are looking better relative to Thomas. All his talk about playing SF isn't all that encouraging. His comments are a little off center. Is he just a really competetive guy or is he a bit of a loon in the veins of Artest or Mike Tyson? Eating someone's soul? I dunno about that one! I like Morrison's and Gay's desire to go competetive in their workouts. Thomas has portrayed himself as this uber-competetive guy and yet won't work out with others. Doesn't sit well with me. Same for Aldridge. This team needs some athletes and Thomas is surely that. What this team doesn't need is a headcase and I just can't tell from the articles and interviews if Thomas is a head case or just "different". I suppose we might get a little more insight later this week.


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## BDMcGee (May 12, 2006)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

I disagree with people who feel that Tyrus Thomas has character issues. He's a humble, down to earth guy who has a passion for the game. He needs to mature mentally, but I think he'll be fine in the long run. I don't forsee him being a trouble-maker in the future. The concern with him is that beanpole body that he has. As MikeDC said, as of right now, he's closer to Kenyon Martin than Amare Stoudemire. Will he be able to add the necessary 25-30 pounds of muscle he needs to play inside in the NBA? That's up in the air. Most guys get bigger in the NBA but few go from being beanpoles to becoming beasts. He does have good upside, but if I'm the Bulls he's too risky of a pick to take him #2 overall. People need to stop criticizing his seeing himself as a 3. None of the big-men playing ball these days want to play inside anymore. He's not alone in that regard.


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## L.O.B (Jun 13, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



BDMcGee said:


> I disagree with people who feel that Tyrus Thomas has character issues. He's a humble, down to earth guy who has a passion for the game.


So you know him personally then?


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## BDMcGee (May 12, 2006)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



L.O.B said:


> So you know him personally then?


No I don't. But from what I've seen of him it appears that his perceived attitude problems are exaggerated. He really seems like a good kid, but he needs to mature like all 19 year olds.


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## SecretAgentGuy (Jul 15, 2003)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

After he measured out to be a little over 6'8" in shoes he's dropped in my book. It's one thing to have a big man that might need some time to develop, a completely different story when you're drafting a project that plays your strongest and deepest position. What makes him so different from Rudy Gay now?


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



sp00k said:


> After he measured out to be a little over 6'8" in shoes he's dropped in my book. It's one thing to have a big man that might need some time to develop, a completely different story when you're drafting a project that plays your strongest and deepest position. What makes him so different from Rudy Gay now?


Exactly what I was thinking. And Rudy is a 3 who wants to develop into a 2 and has stated on several occasions he wants to work on his ball handling and passing whereas Tyrus is a 4 who wants to be a 3. I think at this point I prefer Rudy.


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## BULLS23 (Apr 13, 2003)

After seeing the measurements today he's out of the picture for me . . . I don't see him playing much 4 at all on a team like ours, and really with Patrick O'Bryant, LaMarcus Aldridge, and even Aaron Gray measuring at 6'11"+ I think we have way more bigman options now. My perfect draft would be:

#2 - Aldridge
#16 - Brewer

But I'd also love:

#2 - Bargs/Trade for Roy (4?)
#16 - Carney/Redick/Trade up for O'Bryant or Roy/A. Gray

The biggest thing is we got options, and we got a really smart GM . . . I love our chances at having a good draft.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

I think it is kind of funny to see everyone so dropping off of the bandwagon because the guy measured out 3/4 of an inch shorter than expected. He is 19 and has plenty of room to grow.


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

ace20004u said:


> I think it is kind of funny to see everyone so dropping off of the bandwagon because the guy measured out 3/4 of an inch shorter than expected. He is 19 and has plenty of room to grow.


He's closer to 20 and it is not usual for people to grow after 20 (as far as I know). 

I'm more concerned about his weight. You'd think this uber intense hard worker would be able to get up to a reasonable weight (230) before the draft.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

TripleDouble said:


> He's closer to 20 and it is not usual for people to grow after 20 (as far as I know).
> 
> I'm more concerned about his weight. You'd think this uber intense hard worker would be able to get up to a reasonable weight (230) before the draft.



I think he is still growing and it isn't that uncommon for people to grow up until they hit 22 or 23. Maybe he needs to stop working so damned hard and eat some freaking chicken wings or something! :biggrin:


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

ace20004u said:


> I think he is still growing and it isn't that uncommon for people to grow up until they hit 22 or 23. Maybe he needs to stop working so damned hard and eat some freaking chicken wings or something! :biggrin:


Depending on your definition of not uncommon, I don't think it is fair to count on Thomas growing. Could he? Sure. Is he likely to? I doubt it. 

Thomas should have realized that mass and strength are going to be important for him to add at the next level. I'm sure you realize that there are other ways of adding those than just eating junk food.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

TripleDouble said:


> Depending on your definition of not uncommon, I don't think it is fair to count on Thomas growing. Could he? Sure. Is he likely to? I doubt it.
> 
> Thomas should have realized that mass and strength are going to be important for him to add at the next level. I'm sure you realize that there are other ways of adding those than just eating junk food.



Of course I do, can't ya take a joke! sheesh!


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## johnston797 (May 29, 2002)

ace20004u said:


> I think it is kind of funny to see everyone so dropping off of the bandwagon because the guy measured out 3/4 of an inch shorter than expected.


I am not going to throw the guy overboard until I see the reach numbers. It is a touch disappointing though.


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## Banjoriddim (Aug 14, 2004)

ace20004u said:


> I think he is still growing and it isn't that uncommon for people to grow up until they hit 22 or 23. Maybe he needs to stop working so damned hard and eat some freaking chicken wings or something! :biggrin:


I don't think that it's just that easy also people usually don't grow at hes age so hopeing he will grow is fools dream also I just don't see any 220 pound 6'8'' (actually 6'7'') pf picking league apart. All short pf's are really big dudes with good post game (I mean Boozer, Brand...) now there are some combo fowards but... you have Noc also you need big guy with size and I doupt weather 6'8'' guy with little if any post game is worth 2nd pick.
So he is short, he is project, he claims he is sf, he doesn't seems to bee smartest guy and bulls just don't need another sf. So I'd say he just isn't worth all the risk and problems (since Noch and Deng play well an have serious advantages since they have experience and actually they are quite skilled too so tradeing one of them would be stupid).


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## fl_flash (Aug 19, 2002)

Well, the height measurement is a disappointment. I'm still waiting to see the reach, wingspan and agility scores. I thought I'd read that Thomas and Gay had the highest jump with reach (11' 4"?). Rebounding is all about getting up there to get the ball and Thomas can still do that. His problem will be when he can't jump and he's just trying to get the ball amongst the trees. His weight is something of a concern if the Bulls want him as more of a 4.

He's slipped some more to the point that I'd be more inclined to look at Rudy Gay. They're pretty much the same player but Gay is more polished and has at least demonstrated some semblance of an offensive game beyond putbacks and dunks. Thomas is going to have that "tweener" label put on him (rightly or wrongly) and that's a hard thing to change. Gay is a solid SF-type who is trying to expand his abilities as something of an off-guard. Gay's not a tweener.

Geez! This draft just gets more and more interesting!


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

this is dissappointing. We do not need another small pf.


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

We already knew he was small. This doesn't really surprise me a whole lot. But it does just go that much further in cementing Aldridge as my guy. 

Probably puts Thomas and Gay neck and neck in my book. God, I wish I knew more about Bargnani.


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## madox (Jan 6, 2004)

Why is it so hard for players to just state their accurate height? They think the truth won't come out or something? I'm damned sick and tired of all the lies. 

I don't know what's what anymore. 

Just flip a coin, Pax.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



sp00k said:


> After he measured out to be a little over 6'8" in shoes he's dropped in my book. It's one thing to have a big man that might need some time to develop, a completely different story when you're drafting a project that plays your strongest and deepest position. What makes him so different from Rudy Gay now?


There's still 1 very notable difference between Tyrus Thomas and Rudy Gay. Thomas plays far more aggressively. It sounds lame, but it's very true. And aggressive basketball can be the difference between grabbing 6 rebounds and 10 rebounds, or scoring 15 points instead of 10 points. His energy is far better than Gay's.

However, Thomas has definitely dropped IMO. 6'8 in shoes is nothing to be impressed about, regardless of athletic ability. Aldridge on the other hand, I still have doubts about him but he measured in at 6'10 in bare feet! And he's 6'11 1/4" in shoes. A month ago, I never thought I'd be putting Aldridge ahead of Thomas, but given the full 3 inch size difference (and 234 lbs ain't terrible) I don't see how I can't. So I guess Bargnani is now my undisputed #1, Roy is 2a and Aldridge is 2b.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

ace20004u said:


> I think it is kind of funny to see everyone so dropping off of the bandwagon because the guy measured out 3/4 of an inch shorter than expected. He is 19 and has plenty of room to grow.


Actually more than that, at least in my book. I was hoping Thomas would measure around 6'8.5 without shoes, and a little over 6'9 with shoes. But turns out he's barely 6'7 without shoes and 6'8.25 with. Unless you're Elton Brand and just have a monstrous wingspan AND a strong body, there's no way you're playing PF in the NBA at those measurements.


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## jbulls (Aug 31, 2005)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



yodurk said:


> There's still 1 very notable difference between Tyrus Thomas and Rudy Gay. Thomas plays far more aggressively. It sounds lame, but it's very true. And aggressive basketball can be the difference between grabbing 6 rebounds and 10 rebounds, or scoring 15 points instead of 10 points. His energy is far better than Gay's.
> 
> However, Thomas has definitely dropped IMO. 6'8 in shoes is nothing to be impressed about, regardless of athletic ability. Aldridge on the other hand, I still have doubts about him but he measured in at 6'10 in bare feet! And he's 6'11 1/4" in shoes. A month ago, I never thought I'd be putting Aldridge ahead of Thomas, but given the full 3 inch size difference (and 234 lbs ain't terrible) I don't see how I can't. So I guess Bargnani is now my undisputed #1, Roy is 2a and Aldridge is 2b.


I'm not too spooked by Thomas' height. He plays a little like a PF version of Alonzo Mourning, who was similarly undersized at the 5 (although obviously a lot more bulky). Thomas has put on weight, and would seem to have the capacity to put on some more. Aldridge, on the other hand, has put on no weight and publicly stated that he has an aversion to banging inside. I just can't get excited about him.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

yodurk said:


> Unless you're Elton Brand and just have a monstrous wingspan AND a strong body, there's no way you're playing PF in the NBA at those measurements.


Well, he HAS been telling anyone who will listen that he is a 3, not a 4.

Maybe now people will believe him.


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



jbulls said:


> I'm not too spooked by Thomas' height. He plays a little like a PF version of Alonzo Mourning, who was similarly undersized at the 5 (although obviously a lot more bulky). Thomas has put on weight, and would seem to have the capacity to put on some more. Aldridge, on the other hand, has put on no weight and publicly stated that he has an aversion to banging inside. I just can't get excited about him.


I didn't read his statement so much as an aversion as a statement that it might be somewhat overrated. He might be right.

Thomas' weight scared me. I was hoping the reports he was up around 225 were right. I'm also not sure how much more he can put on. Reportedly he already put on something like 30lbs from what he was in high school. I'm no body type expert, but I have a hard time believing he can go on adding weight forever. If he's already added so much (and 30 is a lot), I'd figure he's about done adding weight.


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## jbulls (Aug 31, 2005)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



MikeDC said:


> I didn't read his statement so much as an aversion as a statement that it might be somewhat overrated. He might be right.
> 
> Thomas' weight scared me. I was hoping the reports he was up around 225 were right. I'm also not sure how much more he can put on. Reportedly he already put on something like 30lbs from what he was in high school. I'm no body type expert, but I have a hard time believing he can go on adding weight forever. If he's already added so much (and 30 is a lot), I'd figure he's about done adding weight.


He's also grown a couple inches since high school, that could account for some of the weight gain. At 6'8'' and 225-230 or so he'd be sturdy enough, IMO. Bosh and Garnett don't weigh much more than that and they're a couple inches taller.


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## BDMcGee (May 12, 2006)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



yodurk said:


> There's still 1 very notable difference between Tyrus Thomas and Rudy Gay. Thomas plays far more aggressively. It sounds lame, but it's very true. And aggressive basketball can be the difference between grabbing 6 rebounds and 10 rebounds, or scoring 15 points instead of 10 points. His energy is far better than Gay's.
> 
> However, Thomas has definitely dropped IMO. 6'8 in shoes is nothing to be impressed about, regardless of athletic ability. Aldridge on the other hand, I still have doubts about him but he measured in at 6'10 in bare feet! And he's 6'11 1/4" in shoes. A month ago, I never thought I'd be putting Aldridge ahead of Thomas, but given the full 3 inch size difference (and 234 lbs ain't terrible) I don't see how I can't. So I guess Bargnani is now my undisputed #1, Roy is 2a and Aldridge is 2b.


I agree with your second paragraph. For awhile I had Thomas ahead of Aldridge, but not anymore. I already figured that LaMarcus was 6'11, but it was extremely disappointing to hear that Tyrus is only 6'8 in shoes. At his current size he has no position in the NBA. Right now I have Brandon Roy 1a, Bargnani 1b, and Aldridge #2.


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



jbulls said:


> He's also grown a couple inches since high school, that could account for some of the weight gain. At 6'8'' and 225-230 or so he'd be sturdy enough, IMO. Bosh and Garnett don't weigh much more than that and they're a couple inches taller.


They have a height and athleticism advantage over opponents to compensate for their strength disadvantage. Thomas will only have an athleticism advantage and I'm not sure if that will compensate for his height AND strength disadvantages.


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

Who thinks Tyrus Thomas is done growing?

This guy could be a more athletic Lamar Odom.


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## laso (Jul 24, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*

Maybe we can get Tyrus as 16, now that's he's measured at 6'7.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



BDMcGee said:


> I agree with your second paragraph. For awhile I had Thomas ahead of Aldridge, but not anymore. I already figured that LaMarcus was 6'11, but it was extremely disappointing to hear that Tyrus is only 6'8 in shoes. At his current size he has no position in the NBA. Right now I have Brandon Roy 1a, Bargnani 1b, and Aldridge #2.


Let's not forget about Patrick O'Bryant either. I'm a big fan of him, and even though he called himself a project I think he'll be good from day 1 for 20 solid minutes defensively. Offensively he needs work but he measured 7-feet, 250 lbs and everyone knows he's a really good athlete (he's been very impressive in workouts). In a few years I think he's easily a starting caliber center; the only downside is that Skiles would have to use him for defensive purposes mostly and his minutes would be limited because of it. Honestly, I have to say O'Bryant and Thomas have equal draft stock right now; both going in the 5-7 range IMO. Given our needs, I'd probably prefer O'Bryant if we can trade down a few spots. If we're gonna draft a project, the project should at least be a position we need.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2006/columns/story?columnist=katz_andy&id=2483589



> Of the dozen players the NBA trotted out as proposed lottery locks Saturday in Orlando, no one was as high on being a top pick as LSU redshirt freshman Tyrus Thomas.
> 
> Thomas wasn't cocky. He simply was confident. He said he knew in the fall, fresh off missing his freshman season with a bulging disk, that he could end up being a candidate for the top pick in this draft.
> 
> ...


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2006/columns/story?columnist=katz_andy&id=2483589


Those ESPN guys sure are convinced that Thomas is coming to Chicago. Personally I'd be surprised if that plays out. And fortunately the "experts" are wrong more than they're right. This to me is the most interesting excerpt though:



> There are no locks in this year's draft, but putting Thomas at Chicago with the No. 2 pick seems the likeliest scenario at this point.
> 
> "They need a player like Tyrus Thomas. That's what Gar [Forman, the Bulls' player personnel director] told me," Brady said. "The Bulls took the time to research him. They did more background work than any other team. I haven't heard from Toronto [No. 1] or other teams.
> 
> ...


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## rwj333 (Aug 10, 2002)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



kukoc4ever said:


> Who thinks Tyrus Thomas is done growing?
> 
> This guy could be a more athletic Lamar Odom.



I think he's done growing. He supposedly went on a growth spurt when he first came to LSU. I don't see it happening again. He's almost 20. Generally your bone plates start fusing around that time.


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## jbulls (Aug 31, 2005)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



kukoc4ever said:


> Who thinks Tyrus Thomas is done growing?
> 
> This guy could be a more athletic Lamar Odom.


I don't see the comparison here. Thomas is an extremely aggressive player, but there are questions about his skills. Odom seems to be the exact opposite - a guy with a really polished game who could stand to play with a little more intensity.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

> "They need a player like Tyrus Thomas. That's what Gar [Forman, the Bulls' player personnel director] told me," Brady said. "The Bulls took the time to research him. They did more background work than any other team. I haven't heard from Toronto [No. 1] or other teams.





> "I told [Chicago GM John] Paxson and Gar not to worry about Tyrus on the floor. He's a heck of a talent. The only problem at 19 or 20 [he'll be 20 on Aug. 17] is, is he emotionally mature enough to handle the NBA life?"


If that doesn't let you know he's #1 in the Bulls staff's head, I don't know what will


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

The ROY said:


> If that doesn't let you know he's #1 in the Bulls staff's head, I don't know what will




Yeah that was my thinking as well when I read that.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

The ROY said:


> If that doesn't let you know he's #1 in the Bulls staff's head, I don't know what will


Well at least we know who the supposed inside source has been. 

But still, this doesn't mean the Bulls will take him. At best, it just means that the Bulls are impressed with his talents and are considering him for the pick. That doesn't mean other prospects haven't impressed too. 

From the way the LSU coach words it, it sounds like Gar Forman said something like: "We could use a player like Tyrus Thomas." This could mean that the Bulls need athleticism. Or hustle. Or someone with upside. He also said the Bulls did more background work than any other team...all that tells us is that the Bulls are doing what they should be doing since they have the #2 pick. I bet they're doing just as much research on Aldridge, Roy, Bargnani, Gay, and even Morrison. I'm convinced that the Bulls have not made a final decision yet on who would fit best with the #2 pick.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

I'm not CONVINCED either but I think we all have a pretty good idea who's looking like the pick, atleast right now and for the last month or so.


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

The ROY said:


> If that doesn't let you know he's #1 in the Bulls staff's head, I don't know what will


I'm not sure why this should convince us. Paxson has acknowledged publicly that the Bulls need more athletes. The Bulls also seem to be pretty concerned with charactor so the fact that they've done a lot of background on Thomas doesn't indicate that they prefer him over other options.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

EVERYTHING said about Thomas for about 2 MONTHS now should indicate he's high on their list.

Even if I don't even want the kid drafted by us, it's still pretty obvious.


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## TwinkieTowers (Jul 16, 2002)

You wouldn't have an attitude during your job interview, would you?

The trouble with comparing Thomas to Mourning or Stoudemire is that both had "NBA bodies" coming into the league (both were listed at 6'10" and 240+ lbs., according to basketball-reference.com).

To me, Tyrus is just a PF version of Jamal Crawford (late-starting basketball player with an exceptional freshman season based on raw physical talents) as well as a Hakim Warrick clone.

Lamar Odom was considered Magic Johnson-lite coming out of college. I don't believe I've seen or heard of Thomas bringing the ball up ala Showtime Lakers style.


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

The ROY said:


> EVERYTHING said about Thomas for about 2 MONTHS now should indicate he's high on their list.
> 
> Even if I don't even want the kid drafted by us, it's still pretty obvious.


That certainly appears to be the majority of reports, anyway. But things change. The Bulls haven't even worked him out yet.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

Ron Cey said:


> That certainly appears to be the majority of reports, anyway. But things change. The Bulls haven't even worked him out yet.


this is true


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## BDMcGee (May 12, 2006)

*Re: How far has TyrusThomas fallen in your minds...*



yodurk said:


> Let's not forget about Patrick O'Bryant either. I'm a big fan of him, and even though he called himself a project I think he'll be good from day 1 for 20 solid minutes defensively. Offensively he needs work but he measured 7-feet, 250 lbs and everyone knows he's a really good athlete (he's been very impressive in workouts). In a few years I think he's easily a starting caliber center; the only downside is that Skiles would have to use him for defensive purposes mostly and his minutes would be limited because of it. Honestly, I have to say O'Bryant and Thomas have equal draft stock right now; both going in the 5-7 range IMO. Given our needs, I'd probably prefer O'Bryant if we can trade down a few spots. If we're gonna draft a project, the project should at least be a position we need.


I like O'Bryant too, but I don't think he's ever going to be a great offensive player. He has some decent post moves and decent touch on his shots around the basket, but he's really, really raw. His footwork and coordination need a lot of work and his face-up game is virtually nonexistent. He also needs to bulk up. I'm not sure trading down a few spots to get him would be worth it.

I would much rather have LaMarcus Aldridge. He's about as big as O'Bryant but he's much more talented. He also has great versatility. His face-up and back to the basket game is very advanced for someone his age. He'll have the ability to play either power forward or center effectively in the NBA while O'Bryant can only play center. If the Bulls could trade up from sixteen and nab O'Bryant in the mid-to late lottery and select Aldridge #2 that would be tremendous.


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## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

TripleDouble said:


> I'm not sure why this should convince us. Paxson has acknowledged publicly that the Bulls need more athletes. The Bulls also seem to be pretty concerned with charactor so the fact that they've done a lot of background on Thomas doesn't indicate that they prefer him over other options.


Yeah, who's to say the Texas coach wouldn't say the same thing. Maybe Pax is just doing more research because his character is so suspect. Maybe Pax just does more research than other GM's. The other teams drafting at the top are not in need of 4. This means nothing to me except, that there is no reason to believe that Thomas is #1 on the boards, if this is indeed the source that has been leading us to believe that.


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## madox (Jan 6, 2004)

Thomas' wingspan is 87'' or 7'3''. Right in line with Aldridge, P. O'Bryant, H. Armstrong, A. Gray. 

Maybe he just has a short head. 



LINK


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## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

madox said:


> Thomas' wingspan is 87'' or 7'3''. Right in line with Aldridge, P. O'Bryant, H. Armstrong, A. Gray.
> 
> Maybe he just has a short head.
> 
> LINK


I did notice he has a short neck.


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## madox (Jan 6, 2004)

^^^He must feel like he's going up against a bunch of giraffes.


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## Bolts (Nov 7, 2003)

This "Thomas is a PF" stuff is just funny.

If it has the heighth of a Duck
If it has the weight of a Duck
If it SAYS it's a Duck . . .

Well, obviously it is NOT a Duck?

Silly


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