# Offseason Thread



## RollWithEm

*How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

Has Scott Skiles warn out his welcome yet in Milwaukee?

Who would you consider the Bucks' core players at this time?

Would you amnesty Drew Gooden?

What would you do with the 12th and 42nd picks?

What trades would you make?

What has your opinion been thusfar on Ekpe Udoh? Larry Sanders? Tobias Harris?

Would you exercise your team option on Shaun Livingston for 1 year at $3.5 mil?

How would you approach free agency?

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/milwaukee.htm


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## roux

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



RollWithEm said:


> Has Scott Skiles warn out his welcome yet in Milwaukee?
> 
> Who would you consider the Bucks' core players at this time?
> 
> Would you amnesty Drew Gooden?
> 
> What would you do with the 12th and 42nd picks?
> 
> What trades would you make?
> 
> What has your opinion been thusfar on Ekpe Udoh? Larry Sanders? Tobias Harris?
> 
> Would you exercise your team option on Shaun Livingston for 1 year at $3.5 mil?
> 
> How would you approach free agency?
> 
> http://hoopshype.com/salaries/milwaukee.htm


1. Yes.. skiles has more than worn out his welcome. The Bucks should be a team looking to rebuild for the future instead of constantly reloading in efforts to make the 8 seed. Having a lame duck coach who has a reputation for being tough on rookie development is not the way for this team to go... ill give him till the middle of december before he is fired.

2. Our core right now is Jennings, Harris, Sanders and Udoh.. its quite sad actually, but these are the only guys on this team i think are worth holding onto for at least the next 3 years

3. Would I amnesty Gooden? In a heartbeat. Will the Bucks? No. They are enamored with stats and despite Gooden being a horrid defensive player his notable averages (points, rebounds) will keep him a Buck next season

4. I would look for a big guard that can shoot the ball or an athletic big man. Perry Jones, Jeremy Lamb would be my ideal picks, but i am bracing myself for the win now move of Tyler Zeller

5. I think the Bucks will eventually have to trade Monta Ellis... he is not a good fit in the backcourt with Jennings and his contract expires after this season. I would love to see us get a lottery pick for him but our front office's mentality is win now and after only a small sample size of him and Jennings together they probably wont part with him till the deadline if at all.

6. Epke Udoh... the guy is going to be a good defensive player in this league, i dont see much offense coming from him but he has a chance of at least being somewhat efficient, I like him alot. Larry Sanders... pretty much the same can be said about Larry, he is sligtly more athletic than Epke but has this desire to shoot 18 footers which he cannot do. A good defensive big man who brings good energy to the team. Tobias Harris... this guy kinda floats under the radar. I didnt know much about him when we drafted him as the sec freshman of the year. He came into the league with a little bit of baby fat but his game is well rounded and very solid. He has a good game around the hoop, he finshes well and has shown the ability to knock down an 18 foot jumper. I saw a picture of him working out and the dude looks cut and ready to roll, he may be a real sleeper for the Bucks this year.

7. Let Livingston walk, you have Jennings and unfortunately we have Beno Udrih coming back (more for his salary than his play) So we are covered at the point, and you could always shift Monta there if you had to as well.

8. Nobody really good wants to come play here so we have to look for under the radar talent. I wouldnt mind seeing us go after Spencer Hawes to play center, that way we dont have to draft Spencer Hawes jr. in Zeller and we can actually use that pick on a big guard.


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## narek

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

1. I think Skiles wants to go - I wouldn't be suprised if he does something stupid early in this fall to get himself fired. 

2. The Bucks have core players?

3. Yes, I'd amnesty Gooden. They can do so much better than that.

4. I'd pick the best player available when the time comes. 

5. Ellis should be traded.

6. I wish Harris had gotten more consistent playing time. He has shown flashes of being a better than average player when he did get the time. I reserve judgment on Udoh. Sanders needs to make better offensive decisions.

7. We have too many guards - let Livingston walk.

But the biggest thing the Bucks need is a new owner. I love Herb, but he's made bad decisions in hiring.


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## Bubbles

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



RollWithEm said:


> Has Scott Skiles warn out his welcome yet in Milwaukee?
> 
> Who would you consider the Bucks' core players at this time?
> 
> Would you amnesty Drew Gooden?
> 
> What would you do with the 12th and 42nd picks?
> 
> What trades would you make?
> 
> What has your opinion been thusfar on Ekpe Udoh? Larry Sanders? Tobias Harris?
> 
> Would you exercise your team option on Shaun Livingston for 1 year at $3.5 mil?
> 
> How would you approach free agency?
> 
> http://hoopshype.com/salaries/milwaukee.htm


1. Unfortunately, yes. If this team wasn't rebuilding he would have a place, but that is not the case.

2. Jennings, Udoh, and Harris. I want to Harris get some more minutes this year because I really want to see what the kid can do. I would be tempted to include Sanders like roux, but he far too inconsistent for my liking.

3. I wouldn't even hesitate to amnesty Gooden. I hate Gooden. I wish he would go away.

4. At 12 we need to draft big. The only exception to this is Meyers Leonard. I want nothing to do with him. At 42 we can hopefully add a shooter which we desperately need to get some points on the board.

5. Only see a couple potential deals happening. Ellis would be one player we could trade and net some decent in return. Otherwise maybe some team out there is in love with Ersan and we can do a sign and trade.

6. Udoh is going to be a defensive fiend and solid player to have. Sanders brings energy and defense, but I feel like he can be way too inefficient at times. Harris was a bit raw last year, but he looked good when he actually played and it will be interesting to see him get more minutes this year.

7. Yes. Shaun is a good glue guy for this team who can help with ball movement and defense, even if we have to play him at SG.

8. We need a shooter who can get the ball in the basket. Otherwise we just need to not make bad signings (i.e. Gooden, Salmons, etc.)


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## Bubbles

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



narek said:


> 1. I think Skiles wants to go - I wouldn't be suprised if he does something stupid early in this fall to get himself fired.
> 
> 2. The Bucks have core players?
> 
> 3. Yes, I'd amnesty Gooden. They can do so much better than that.
> 
> 4. I'd pick the best player available when the time comes.
> 
> 5. Ellis should be traded.
> 
> 6. I wish Harris had gotten more consistent playing time. He has shown flashes of being a better than average player when he did get the time. I reserve judgment on Udoh. Sanders needs to make better offensive decisions.
> 
> 7. We have too many guards - let Livingston walk.
> 
> *But the biggest thing the Bucks need is a new owner. I love Herb, but he's made bad decisions in hiring.*


I love Herb too - he is the main reason we still have a team in Milwaukee - but I can't say I have ever been a fan of his personnel moves. If we can get another owner who will keep the Bucks in Milwaukee I will be happy, but I don't hold out much hope for such an outcome. I think the inevitable outcome is the Bucks will leave Milwaukee.


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## BlakeJesus

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

*Has Scott Skiles warn out his welcome yet in Milwaukee?*

Seems so, change up might be good for both parties.

*Who would you consider the Bucks' core players at this time?*

Jennings, Udoh, and Monta as an asset.

*Would you amnesty Drew Gooden?*

I definitely think it would be a smart move, but amnesty doesn't really make sense for a team like the Bucks. They aren't an appealing place for free agents, and they don't generate a ton of revenue so paying a rotation player NOT to play doesn't sound fiscally possible. It looks good on paper, but unless Gooden is a menace on the locker room I don't see it as likely. If I had my way he'd be gone, though.

*What would you do with the 12th and 42nd picks?*

Meyers Leonard, Perry Jones, Terrence Jones, or Tyler Zeller at 12, and at 42 somebody like Kyle O'Quinn or Kim English might be really nice value.

*What trades would you make?*

I liked the idea behind the trade for Monta, and it's not like it was a colossal failure or anything, but I also think he's the likeliest to be traded. Not being an ideal fit with the "franchise" player, and also far and away having the most trade value of anybody else on the team not named Brandon Jennings makes Monta moveable. Hard to say what's out there for Monta, but I imagine a market does/will exist.

If a sign and trade for Ersan is available at all I would consider that too, would be a shame to lose him for nothing. Not a cream of the crop type of player, but he has some value.

*What has your opinion been thus far on Ekpe Udoh? Larry Sanders? Tobias Harris?*

Udoh is a guy you want playing for your team, Larry Sanders is trash, and Tobias Harris is worth keeping around at this point.

*Would you exercise your team option on Shaun Livingston for 1 year at $3.5 mil?*

Nope.

*How would you approach free agency?*

I would attempt a sign and trade for Ersan, pick up Leuer's team option, and try not to sign anybody to a deal longer than three years. Not a ton of options in free agency for Milwaukee, sadly.


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## RollWithEm

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

Did anybody see this?


Alex Kennedy said:


> The Milwaukee Bucks are trying to move into the top ten. Sources say they're targeting John Henson. _Twitter_


How do you guys feel about Henson?


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## roux

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



RollWithEm said:


> Did anybody see this?
> 
> 
> How do you guys feel about Henson?


I would be fine with him at 12, i dont like the idea of trading assests to move up and get him


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## RollWithEm

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



roux2dope said:


> I would be fine with him at 12, i dont like the idea of trading assests to move up and get him


I don't exactly know which "assets" are being discussed, but it shouldn't be a whole lot to move from #12 to #9 or #10.


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## Dornado

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

*Has Scott Skiles warn out his welcome yet in Milwaukee?*

I think Skiles has to go and sooner is better. Skiles isn't a bad coach and he's certainly a great guy to bring in to introduce a culture change or turn your bunch of NBA losers into something resembling a competitive team, but at a certain point he seems to lose guys. I'm not sure if he's overbearing or too demanding or if it is more a commentary on NBA players, but it seems to be true wherever he goes. If you're a Bucks fan you have to be worried about what kind of impact Stephen Jackson, who called Skiles a "college coach", had on Brandon Jennings last year... hopefully Skiles hasn't completely lost the team. Scott Skiles and an undersized backcourt just brings backs memories of mediocrity in Chicago. 
*
Who would you consider the Bucks' core players at this time?*

Brandon Jennings. Monta Ellis to an extent... though maybe more as an asset. On the periphery guys like Moute and Udoh are nice defensive pieces, though Moute may help more on a team that is ready to contend. 

*Would you amnesty Drew Gooden?*

I'm on the fence on this. I think Drew Gooden is a bum - let me get that out of the way first. That being said, I think the Bucks would have a hard time replacing his production. Normally I would argue that teams should be really conservative with how they use their amnesty clause, but there aren't a lot of other guys that were on the Bucks roster when the CBA was ratified that seem like amnesty candidates, so it isn't as much of a concern for me. Generally I'd say no... but if amnestying Drew Gooden meant you were able to retain Ersan Illyasova or bring in a 4 that can give you consistent production I'd consider it. If they were smart they'd just play him 18 minutes a game off the bench.

*What would you do with the 12th and 42nd picks?*

BPA is the general answer, other than PG (though none are really rumored to go in that range anyway). I'm not sure who the best player is, but I wouldn't worry too much about positional needs other than avoiding adding another small guard. 

*What trades would you make?*

If you can find a taker for Beno Udrih, I'd move him. As Roux2Dope mentioned, if you can't resign Monta Ellis you have to flip that asset for something of value. 
*
What has your opinion been thusfar on Ekpe Udoh? Larry Sanders? Tobias Harris?*

I actually like what I've seen from Ekpe Udoh. My question with Udoh, as well as with Sanders, is whether or not Skiles will give them a long enough leash to make the impact they're capable of making on the defensive end. I can just see Skiles feeding Bucks fans a steady diet of Drew Gooden. Anyway, Udoh is a guy I'd be testing as much as possible at the 5 and 4 this year... you need to figure out if he's a piece in place for the future. Sanders I'm a little skeptical about at this point... I was high on him coming out of college but I'm starting to worry that he's getting close to the point where he needs to show something or be written off. I don't watch a ton of Bucks games, so take that with a grain of salt... maybe Skiles is holding him back. Tobias Harris seems nice... he's super, super young still and from what I've seen he seems to have decent potential at the 3.

*Would you exercise your team option on Shaun Livingston for 1 year at $3.5 mil?*

I love me some Shaun Livingston, but that's probably too much to pay for him. He's kind of a useful guy to have around if you can play him at the 2 next to Ellis or Jennings and let them work off ball while he basically runs the point. 3.5 million just seems steep... if he's willing to resign for less I'd do it.
*
How would you approach free agency?*

Spencer Hawes? I wouldn't put many eggs in the free agency basket. In general you want to find guys with high ceilings that are young enough to grow with Jennings, I just don't think those guys (if they exist) are lining up to sign with Milwaukee.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/milwaukee.htm


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## RollWithEm

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

So now that this happened:

TRADE: Rockets send Dalembert/#14 to Bucks for #12/Livingston/Leuer/Brockman

Who does Milwaukee target at #14?


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## TucsonClip

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

Shouldnt change anything for Milwaukee. Dalembert is in the final year of his contract.


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## narek

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



RollWithEm said:


> So now that this happened:
> 
> TRADE: Rockets send Dalembert/#14 to Bucks for #12/Livingston/Leuer/Brockman
> 
> Who does Milwaukee target at #14?


So much for moving into the top ten!


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## Nimreitz

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

I never come in here, but I just want it on record that the Bucks should draft Sullinger. You don't get the opportunity to draft a guy who is unquestionably the best rebounder in the class and the best back-to-basket scorer in the class at #14. He also has the potential to add an outside shot to his game. To me, he's Kevin Love without the outlet passes, or if he wants to be he can get there. Maybe the back doesn't hold up, but you take that chance as the Bucks in my opinion. I'd rather gamble on a guy who DEFINITELY has the talent and keep him healthy than a guy who might never "get it", and if he does it won't even be in Milwaukee. What's our track record of developing athletes? I don't remember a single one being successful other than MAYBE Redd, but I don't know if you call him an athlete coming out of OSU. And Sullinger is from a crappy town in the Midwest too, he'll sulk a lot less than other entitled dicks. He's also the kind of guy who will hold a grudge against the teams that passed on him.


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## Bubbles

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

I wouldn't mind getting Sullinger.


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## Bubbles

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

So now we have Udoh, Sanders, Henson, and Dalembert (so much for addressing our need for wing players)...what moves do we need to make in free agency?


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## narek

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



Prince said:


> So now we have Udoh, Sanders, Henson, and Dalembert (so much for addressing our need for wing players)...what moves do we need to make in free agency?


I don't think they'll be doing anything major in free agency - don't think they are in a position to spend a lot of money. A scoring big man would be nice, though.


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## Bubbles

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

I wonder if we nab Lamb with this pick.


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## Bubbles

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

Called it.


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## roux

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

Like the second rounder more than the first... i hate the fact we took a guy so similar to Sanders and Udoh, but at the same time henson is probably just better than them so it may work out fine.... love the Lamb pick, that guy is going to make this team


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## Bubbles

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

I love Lamb pick. Huge pickup for the team.


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## RollWithEm

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

*Henson* and *Lamb* is good value for this team. I think they both fit right in with the young core of the squad.


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## RollWithEm

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

Does Ilyasova's decision on whether to accept the Bucks' offer of 5-yrs/$40 mil or whether to accept his "big offer" from an unnamed European team affect the direction management will take this team next year?


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## roux

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



RollWithEm said:


> Does Ilyasova's decision on whether to accept the Bucks' offer of 5-yrs/$40 mil or whether to accept his "big offer" from an unnamed European team affect the direction management will take this team next year?


Ilyasova is gone, they just said on the radio that if he gets an offer anywhere near the range the bucks threw at him he was going to take it...love that milwaukee pride


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## RollWithEm

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



roux2dope said:


> Ilyasova is gone, they just said on the radio that if he gets an offer anywhere near the range the bucks threw at him he was going to take it...love that milwaukee pride


In the USA or Europe?


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## roux

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



RollWithEm said:


> In the USA or Europe?


they made it sound like the offer could come from ****ing Antarctica and he would take it over the Bucks offer


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## RollWithEm

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

Can tomorrow night's Amnesty deadline possibly pass with Drew Gooden still remaining on this roster?


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## Dornado

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

I'm hearing absolutely zero chatter about Gooden getting amnestied.


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## roux

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



Dornado said:


> I'm hearing absolutely zero chatter about Gooden getting amnestied.


Gooden isnt going anywhere


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## Dornado

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*

If they just play him 15-18 minutes off the bench I'd be satisfied... you just get the feeling he's going to be playing 30+


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## roux

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



Dornado said:


> If they just play him 15-18 minutes off the bench I'd be satisfied... you just get the feeling he's going to be playing 30+


Dalembert should play 25 a night, and Ilyasova about 32 a night. That leaves 41 minutes in the frontcourt to be divided amongst gooden, sanders, udoh and henson barring a trade. 15-20 for gooden seems likely.


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## narek

*Re: How Would You Fix the Bucks?*



roux2dope said:


> Dalembert should play 25 a night, and Ilyasova about 32 a night. That leaves 41 minutes in the frontcourt to be divided amongst gooden, sanders, udoh and henson barring a trade. 15-20 for gooden seems likely.


They better make a trade with one of those power forwards.


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