# Kobe case:Alleged victim had multiple sex acts



## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

EAGLE, Colo. - Kobe Bryant’s lawyers said Monday that the woman accusing him of rape had sex with someone else less than 15 hours after her alleged assault by the NBA star.

The accusation was made in a court filing in which the defense argued that the woman’s sex life should be admissible at Bryant’s trial, despite Colorado’s rape-shield law.

The defense said the woman had “multiple acts of sex” in the three days before her June 30 encounter with Bryant. Bryant’s lawyers also said she had sex with two prosecution witnesses, which could affect their credibility.

At the heart of the defense attack is a contention that the 19-year-old accuser had a “plan” to have sex with Bryant to attract attention from an ex-boyfriend. Bryant’s attorneys say injuries found on the woman could have been caused by sex with someone other than the Los Angeles Lakers’ guard.

Prosecutors have urged the judge to bar any evidence about the woman’s sexual past, saying it is not relevant to whether she was raped.

Link


this was brought up in court today


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

Let´s see...

Fact 1- Kobe and the girl had sex (wether it was rape or consentual)

Fact 2- The girl claims Kobe raped her.

Fact 3- The same girl, after the incident, proceeds to have sexual relations with another guy the same night or the mourning after.

Fact 4- Then she goes to the police and press charges against Kobe.

*Given those circunstances,* how can this even go to trial? Am i missing something?


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

LOL, what an idiot.:laugh:


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

What does her sex life have anything to do with this case? Theres a rape shield law for a reason, because its irrelevant to the case...


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

Irrelevant to the case? Thats not true at all.


Her sexual histroy plays a huge role in trying to figure out what happened. We need that information to determine who's fluids are on her clothes, how often she had had sex before and after becuase injuries could have came from other men.

She even had sex with 2 of the prosecution's witnesses, very important information.

The rape shield law shouldn't apply to this case, if she is allowed to hide behind the rape shield law then the defense team wont have information that is very relevant to the case, and they wont be able to defend him to the best of their ability.


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## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

very good point


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hOnDo</b>!
> Irrelevant to the case? Thats not true at all.
> 
> 
> ...


Other than maybe the witnesses, what relevance is her having sex with a guy have anything to do with the case. The case is did she say "NO", just because she said yes to multiple people doesnt change the fact one way or another as to what she said THAT NIGHT. What does her having sex with another guy have anything to do with what happened in that room.


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## jstempi (Jul 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> 
> 
> Other than maybe the witnesses, what relevance is her having sex with a guy have anything to do with the case. The case is did she say "NO", just because she said yes to multiple people doesnt change the fact one way or another as to what she said THAT NIGHT. What does her having sex with another guy have anything to do with what happened in that room.


Absolutely ignorant. The ONLY evidence that the prosecution has that would be irrefutable is the injuries to the girl. Any other evidence could easily be refuted by Kobe (i.e., Kobe could simply say she never said "no") or be dismissed as something that could also have happened if it was consentual (Kobe fluids). If the girl had sex with someone else during the same time period, the girl tainted the evidence (her you know what) leaving clear reasonable doubt as to who caused the damage. Hence the prosecution could not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Kobe (not someone else) caused the injuries to the girl, resulting in there being clear reasonable doubt that Kobe is guily of rape. I'm not saying he's innocent or not, we will never know for this very reason...all i am saying is that there is clear reasonable doubt. And the rape shield is crap because you cannot have a victim before you prove that an actual crime ocurred. If the judge upholds the rape shield and that it applies in this case, then its clear they do not want a fair trial.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>PauloCatarino</b>!
> 
> *Given those circunstances,* how can this even go to trial? Am i missing something?


Small town cops looking for attention.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jstempi</b>!
> 
> 
> Absolutely ignorant. The ONLY evidence that the prosecution has that would be irrefutable is the injuries to the girl. Any other evidence could easily be refuted by Kobe (i.e., Kobe could simply say she never said "no") or be dismissed as something that could also have happened if it was consentual (Kobe fluids). If the girl had sex with someone else during the same time period, the girl tainted the evidence (her you know what) leaving clear reasonable doubt as to who caused the damage. Hence the prosecution could not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Kobe (not someone else) caused the injuries to the girl, resulting in there being clear reasonable doubt that Kobe is guily of rape. I'm not saying he's innocent or not, we will never know for this very reason...all i am saying is that there is clear reasonable doubt. And the rape shield is crap because you cannot have a victim before you prove that an actual crime ocurred. If the judge upholds the rape shield and that it applies in this case, then its clear they do not want a fair trial.


This girls name has gone through the gutter, her life is ruined, the rape shield law is to help prevent that as much as possible. Her life would be even more ruined if they start digging up everyone she had sex with...


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> What does her sex life have anything to do with this case? Theres a rape shield law for a reason, because its irrelevant to the case...


Explain how it would be irrelavant? If they can prove that she not only had sex with a guy before but after Kobe... how is that irrelavant? It's very relavant because the damage to this womans vagina that she's blaming on Kobe for raping her could have just as easily come from screwing three guys in a matter of hours.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Explain how it would be irrelavant? If they can prove that she not only had sex with a guy before but after Kobe... how is that irrelavant? It's very relavant because the damage to this womans vagina that she's blaming on Kobe for raping her could have just as easily come from screwing three guys in a matter of hours.


Plus, how many rape victims have sex with another person within a matter of days? If she had sex with someone *after* Kobe Bryant allegedly raped her, either she's a liar or she's a very fast healer.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pinball</b>!
> Plus, how many rape victims have sex with another person within a matter of days? If she had sex with someone *after* Kobe Bryant allegedly raped her, either she's a liar or she's a very fast healer.


For what i´ve read, it wasn´t "within a matter of days", but * in the same day of the alleged rape, and after it or the mourning after*.

That´s (if it´s true) what i don´t buy.

I may be way off base here (though i doubt it) but no rape victim would have sex after only hours past the alleged agression...

Rape shields, shmields... A man´s life is in stake here. It must be admissible in court, or the whole USA law system is a pure sham!!!


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## jstempi (Jul 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> 
> 
> This girls name has gone through the gutter, her life is ruined, the rape shield law is to help prevent that as much as possible. Her life would be even more ruined if they start digging up everyone she had sex with...


You did not address anything I said, but i think the other posters sufficiently refuted your points. Kobe's name has also been drug through the gutter...and he hasn't even been proven guilty. The fact is that you cant have a victim of a crime before you prove that a crime even existed, so the rape shield cannot apply in this case. 

I wouldn't be surprised if the judge disallowed the defense from useing the testimonies of those two prosecution witnesses that had sex with the girl long before the Kobe incident...not because of the rape shield but because of relevance. But the Judge will be forced by the Constitution to deny the rape shield for the girl's sexual acts with other people within a few days of the incident since that incident has not been deemed to be an actual crime yet (Kobe is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law).

My recommendation Sackings...take a law course when/if you go to college.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> My recommendation Sackings...take a law course when/*if* you go to college.


:laugh:


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## mavsman (Jun 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jstempi</b>!
> The fact is that you cant have a victim of a crime before you prove that a crime even existed, so the rape shield cannot apply in this case.


I agree with many things you said but I don't think this statement
is correct. If that were so than there would be no such thing as
a rape shield. Simply because Kobe denies that a rape occured
does not mean that we throw out the rape shield law because
maybe there was no rape.

If that were true than every rape by someone the victims knows
would not qualify for the rape shield law because the guy always
denies that a rape occured. So based upon your logic here than
since the guy denies it happened than we don't know if a crime
was even committed so we must throw out the rape shield law.

I don't think that is how it works.


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## antibody (Apr 4, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>mavsman</b>!
> Simply because Kobe denies that a rape occured
> does not mean that we throw out the rape shield law because
> maybe there was no rape.
> ...


The rape shield law applies here just as mavsman stated above.


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## jstempi (Jul 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>mavsman</b>!
> 
> 
> I agree with many things you said but I don't think this statement
> ...


You're right, let me reword what I am trying to say. The rape shield is constitutional, but it is still crap in this case because since the defendent is presumed innocent (or like what I said in that you cant have a victim before a crime is proven to have happened) the rape shield law allows the defendant to bypass the rape shield and present her sexual history to jurors if they can prove an alleged victim's sexual history is relevant. Clearly, as I have argued, her history is relevant since it could have tainted the prosecutions main evidence (the injuries to her you know what). And let me add two things:

1. If it can be proved that Kobe did it then I hope he fries, dont think that I am blindly defending him.

2. Something else smells funny to me...the prosecution was trying to get the judge to not allow the defense team to interview the alleged victim. Anyone who knows anything about law knows that you have a constitutional right to confront your accuser. Why are they so interested in preventing Kobe from his constitutional rights? I realize they think he raped her but even so, that is his constitutional right and they are lawyers who are supposed to respect the law. Smells funny, maybe they know they dont really have a case since she tained the evidence. Then, like someone said, its small town lawyers trying to get attention.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

Hold on, so in which case do you think the rape shield law is ok? Because what your saying is since Kobe is presumed innocent there shouldnt be a rape shield law, but in what rape trial is the defendant guilty, if he was then there wouldnt be a case... Im not quite getting your argument here


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

In a way this whole trial has been a little shady.

Just the knowledge that she had intercourse before AND after she was with Kobe should have made prosecutors determine whether or not it could have been Kobe. But instead of checking out what the other guys did, they went straight to Kobe, no questions asked.

And yeah, if she had sex after this so called "rape", she definately must have been healing fast because the prosecution is trying to hint at some pretty bad damage, and if she is out there doin some other guy it must not be very bad.

Kobe should definately get acquitted here, just because of all the things that weren't done right and of the facts.

I'm not saying what he did wasn't wrong, because he did have an affair, but according to the facts, he didn't do what the State of Colorado is accusing him of.


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## jstempi (Jul 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> Hold on, so in which case do you think the rape shield law is ok? Because what your saying is since Kobe is presumed innocent there shouldnt be a rape shield law, but in what rape trial is the defendant guilty, if he was then there wouldnt be a case... Im not quite getting your argument here


I'm sorry you are still confused. I thought my last post would clear it up. The rape shield is constitutional and applies in all alleged rape cases. However, the shield can be bypassed and the defense can present her sexual history to jurors if the defense can show that the alleged victim's sexual history is relevant. Like I said, clearly her history is relevant since it taints the prosecutions main evidence (the injuries to her you know what could have been made by her having sex with many dudes shortly before and/or after the Kobe incident). 

Think of it this way...if you allege that I assaulted you (hit you in the face) but you are a boxer and I've talked to people who say you had a boxing match a few days before and another match right after the day I supposedly hit you. Nobody saw me hit you, there is no evidence that I hit you other than the bruises on your face. And you want to prevent me from bringing up that you are a boxer and had matches on days surrounding the day you said I assaulted you. Gimme a break, how would that be fair?


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## mavsman (Jun 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jstempi</b>!
> 
> 
> I'm sorry you are still confused. I thought my last post would clear it up. The rape shield is constitutional and applies in all alleged rape cases. However, the shield can be bypassed and the defense can present her sexual history to jurors if the defense can show that the alleged victim's sexual history is relevant. Like I said, clearly her history is relevant since it taints the prosecutions main evidence (the injuries to her you know what could have been made by her having sex with many dudes shortly before and/or after the Kobe incident).
> ...


This is an excellent analogy. The only problem right now is that I
have not heard from anyone but the defense that the girl had
sex after the alleged assault. If she did than I don't think there is
a case at all. How traumatized could she be by supposedly being
raped if she has sex within a day?

With that said it could just be the defense throwing a theory up
there to cast doubt on the case. It seems very far fetched that
a girl claiming to be raped would have sex a couple of hours after
the supposed incident. If true than she has zero credibility.


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>mavsman</b>!
> 
> 
> This is an excellent analogy. The only problem right now is that I
> ...



Its a known fact in the case that *two* of the prosecutions witnesses had sex with the girl after she was with Kobe.


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## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

but that doesnt get rid of the fact that KOBE BRYANT is accused of RAPE, wether or not the girl had sex with 2 other guys


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

I'm not denying the fact that he is accused of rape, I'm just saying that some areas of the trial should have been handled differently.

If you look at my post above, I say that the law enforcement should have looked into the other men that were involved with this woman before pressing charges on Kobe. They should have tested the clothing and gotten DNA results and used those to decide who to charge, and becasue there was DNA material from many people this of course would have lengthened the trial, but at least they would know for a fact what happened, and when.

I just hope that when this is all said and done that the verdict is the right one, and both parties can move on.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hOnDo</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> Its a known fact in the case that *two* of the prosecutions witnesses had sex with the girl after she was with Kobe.


What?????

TWO guys?

Can you provide a link, please?


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## mavsman (Jun 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>PauloCatarino</b>!
> 
> 
> What?????
> ...


Really!! Lets see the link. 

Saying its a known fact that she had
sex with two guys after the alleged rape is like me saying that
its a known fact that Kobe raped the girl. Neither one is a known
fact.


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>mavsman</b>!
> 
> 
> Really!! Lets see the link.
> ...



Here is your link. 


On her neck, thigh, and vagina. Three samples. Three swabs.

"Defense attorney Hal Haddon told Judge Terry Ruckriegle that swabs of semen taken from the neck, thigh and vaginal area of the 19-year-old accuser during an examination 15 hours after the alleged rape were from a man other than Bryant."

None of it matched Kobe. Someone did ejaculate on her face that night. But not Kobe.


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## mavsman (Jun 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hOnDo</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This statement says that the defense claims it was from another
man, NOT TWO. And again this is a claim of the defense. Maybe
prosecution experts disagree with this statement. Until they all
examine the evidence it is hardly a know fact.

If it is from another person it still would only be
speculation as to the time line. Maybe it got there prior to the
encounter with Kobe and not after.


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## mavsman (Jun 11, 2003)

Just because Kobe's attorneys claim something hardly makes it
a known fact. It does not mean they are false either but
defense attorneys will always throw out whatever theories they
can think of to create doubt in people's minds.

The following statements from the girls attorneys doesn't make
them a know fact either.

The woman's attorney, John Clune, said the claim that she had sex the morning after the alleged attack was "patently false." 

"Anyone trying to prove otherwise will be chasing ghosts," he said, declining further comment. 

Former prosecutor Norm Early said the defense's "outlandish" allegations about the accuser's sex life were probably intended for the public, not the judge. 

"They're trying to taint the public's mind and eventually taint the mind of the jury pool," he said


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

How do you know that semen wasnt from before?


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## Sean (Jun 7, 2002)

If it was, then she hadn't cleaned herself in 3-4 days.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Sean</b>!
> If it was, then she hadn't cleaned herself in 3-4 days.


I was about to say the same thing.


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Sean</b>!
> If it was, then she hadn't cleaned herself in 3-4 days.



With as much as a dirty **** this girl is, I wouldn't doubt that.


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## SirHinn (Feb 9, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hOnDo</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> With as much as a dirty **** this girl is, I wouldn't doubt that.


Absolutely digusting post on your part. I don't know how her having a sex life makes her a dirty ****. Your comment is very derogetory, very unnecessary, and very classless. You guys have already judged this girl before the facts have even came out. All of your opinions are incredibly biased as well. How about you wait until after all the facts are presented to a jury before ya start judging someone like that. It's almost as if she has been charged with rape, not the other way around.


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SirHinn</b>!
> 
> 
> Absolutely digusting post on your part. I don't know how her having a sex life makes her a dirty ****. Your comment is very derogetory, very unnecessary, and very classless.



Absolutely disgusting? We are talking about a girl who sleeps with a different guy every night. Maybe if you would read the articles about her sexual history you might know what we are talking about.

Any girl that sleeps around as much as she does is a dirty **** in my book, and if she isn't in yours, I definately want to know what is.


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## Nikihotgirl (Apr 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SirHinn</b>!
> 
> 
> Absolutely digusting post on your part. I don't know how her having a sex life makes her a dirty ****. Your comment is very derogetory, very unnecessary, and very classless. You guys have already judged this girl before the facts have even came out. All of your opinions are incredibly biased as well. How about you wait until after all the facts are presented to a jury before ya start judging someone like that. It's almost as if she has been charged with rape, not the other way around.




well, well, lets see.............

av claims to have sex with a man/boy on the 28th of june with a condom.

in the preliminary hearing dect. winters testified that kb told the av to swash up when the "attack" was over.


there are semen found on the girl neck, vagina and theigh. if her last sexually activity was on the 28th with a condom, how did those semen stains survive a brutal rape? she had to change clothes before she went to bed. how come none of it rubbed off on her pillow/blanket? if the semen was old how did it remain moist in order to get swabs from it? keep in mind last sex encounter was on the 28th with a condom.

if the semen does not matched kobe, how did the non kobe semen survive two weeks or days?

something is not right, so common sence tells me sex after alleged rape.

if that is false, the prosecutors need a expert to explain how its possible for two days or two week old semen can still be moist enough to contain swabs.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

To me this girl seems to have Don Jaunism. (except for females.) It's like she wants too see how many people she can sleep with. I heard that she was at a party bragging about how big kobe's "mamber" was. I wonder if this was before or after she charged him for rapping her. WTF is wrong with her. I also heard that she had a mental illness that made here seek attention. (some form of phycosis from what I heard on CNN. I'll addmit I don't know what happened but to me she sounds like an insecure, self centered, stupid little *****>>>... zing!!!!!!!

no masked cursing, thanks.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SirHinn</b>!
> 
> 
> Absolutely digusting post on your part. I don't know how her having a sex life makes her a dirty ****. Your comment is very derogetory, very unnecessary, and very classless. You guys have already judged this girl before the facts have even came out. All of your opinions are incredibly biased as well. How about you wait until after all the facts are presented to a jury before ya start judging someone like that. It's almost as if she has been charged with rape, not the other way around.


Exactly...


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hOnDo</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hmm, so if shes 20 and she sleeps with a different guy every night, shes at about, 7300 guys by now... Amazing... And of course, the sleeping around is speculation, but lets not mention that right?


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> 
> 
> Hmm, so if shes 20 and she sleeps with a different guy every night, shes at about, 7300 guys by now... Amazing... And of course, the sleeping around is speculation, but lets not mention that right?


I'm pretty sure that the "sleeping with a different guy every night" thing is more of a figure of speech. 
All I have to say is, If she did have sex with another guy right after she got raped then went to charge him then she is an idiot and deserves to have her name dragged through the mud.


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## bballin (Jun 3, 2003)

and i'm pretty sure that we know bugger all about the real facts of the case. If you think that Kobe's attorneys aren't spinning athe facts s hard as they can then...nah im sure everyone knows that they are.

Nice of the posters here to slander a girl without knowing her and on a few scraps of information from the press. Don't worry you can sit in your arm chair and make pathetic proclamations while a girl and a young super star have their lives put under a microscope and one ultimately gets labeled liar in the most public and humiliating manner.

debating the "did he/didn't he" is fine, but the trash talking is the absolute worst homerism i've seen on this board.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>bballin</b>!
> and i'm pretty sure that we know bugger all about the real facts of the case. If you think that Kobe's attorneys aren't spinning athe facts s hard as they can then...nah im sure everyone knows that they are.
> 
> Nice of the posters here to slander a girl without knowing her and on a few scraps of information from the press. Don't worry you can sit in your arm chair and make pathetic proclamations while a girl and a young super star have their lives put under a microscope and one ultimately gets labeled liar in the most public and humiliating manner.
> ...


what is homerism. 
I'm glad you feel sorry for Kobe. LOL.


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## Jaywalk (Feb 19, 2004)

It goes both ways though, for every person who says shes a whore or whatever, theres someone saying Kobe rapes women. I was at the park shooting around the other day, and there were some teenagers playing on the other courts. One of them had a kobe jersey on, and more than once someone made a comment about "you rape women?" in a joking manner. Thats unfair to Kobe, even if its just a joke. Just like you cant prove the woman is a whore without a doubt, you cant prove Kobe raped her without a doubt. 

Both sides have been slandered in this case, neither side should be, but I'd rather have BOTH sides slandered, than just one.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

This is ridiculous, a defense team (even for a star like Kobe) isn't so unethical that they would slander a women about her sexual history without any proof whatsoever. Not only that, but the defense's whole case revolves around proving that the alleged victim's vaginal tears were caused by the men she had sex with prior to and immediately after the alleged rape, _in addition_ to Kobe Bryant. 

There is no comparison between us not knowing whether Kobe raped this women or not and whether this women had sex with other men. Multiple independent sources and the defense team itself have claimed that they have evidence of such sexual activity by the alleged rape victim. If you honestly believe they all happen to be 100% wrong about her sexual history, then you're in for a surprise come the summer trial.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>EHL</b>!
> This is ridiculous, a defense team (even for a star like Kobe) isn't so unethical that they would slander a women about her sexual history without any proof whatsoever. Not only that, but the defense's whole case revolves around proving that the alleged victim's vaginal tears were caused by the men she had sex with prior to and immediately after the alleged rape, _in addition_ to Kobe Bryant.
> 
> There is no comparison between us not knowing whether Kobe raped this women or not and whether this women had sex with other men. Multiple independent sources and the defense team itself have claimed that they have evidence of such sexual activity by the alleged rape victim. If you honestly believe they all happen to be 100% wrong about her sexual history, then you're in for a surprise come the summer trial.


Exactly. The defence team isn't going to start just making stuff up. 
There is obviously some truth behind what they are saying.


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## mavsman (Jun 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>EHL</b>!
> This is ridiculous, a defense team (even for a star like Kobe) isn't so unethical that they would slander a women about her sexual history without any proof whatsoever. Not only that, but the defense's whole case revolves around proving that the alleged victim's vaginal tears were caused by the men she had sex with prior to and immediately after the alleged rape, _in addition_ to Kobe Bryant.
> 
> There is no comparison between us not knowing whether Kobe raped this women or not and whether this women had sex with other men. Multiple independent sources and the defense team itself have claimed that they have evidence of such sexual activity by the alleged rape victim. If you honestly believe they all happen to be 100% wrong about her sexual history, then you're in for a surprise come the summer trial.


What freaking planet are your from? The defense team wouldn't
make up stories to try and discredit the accuser!! You didn't
actually state that with a straight face did you? You are so
blind to reality that you actually think you know all about this
woman based upon Kobe's sleazy lawyers.

Wow, I have no idea if the woman is a slut or not but for sure I
am not going to base my opinion on what B.S. they throw out
there.

You have heard about defense lawyers throwing out there any
B.S. they can think of to try and create doubt in potential jurors
minds. Until there is proof of her sleeping with multiple people
before and/or after the alleged rape than what the lawyers say
is meaningless.

Do you remember the famous "Twinkie defense"? The guy
committed murder because of Twinkies. Yes, a defense lawyer
actually tried to use that as a defense. They will say anything
that they hope might turn the case in thier favor.


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## Duece Duece (Mar 28, 2003)

> Until there is proof of her sleeping with multiple people
> before and/or after the alleged rape than what the lawyers say
> is meaningless.




What the ****, what more proof is there to be needed when someone else's sperm, (not Kobe's )was found on her. I mean, come on now. You trying to make like the * ALLEGED VICTIM* is a good girl or somethin.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally *posted by EHL!*
> This is ridiculous, a defense team (even for a star like Kobe) isn't so unethical that they would slander a women about her sexual history without any proof whatsoever. Not only that, but the defense's whole case revolves around proving that the alleged victim's vaginal tears were caused by the men she had sex with prior to and immediately after the alleged rape, in addition to Kobe Bryant.


That's not slander. Slandering a person is a violation of the law; therfore, there's no way a judge would rule in favor of the defense if they were slandering her. 



> There is no comparison between us not knowing whether Kobe raped this women or not and whether this women had sex with other men. Multiple independent sources and the defense team itself have claimed that they have evidence of such sexual activity by the alleged rape victim. If you honestly believe they all happen to be 100% wrong about her sexual history, then you're in for a surprise come the summer trial.


You're the one that's in for a surprise this summer. I'm sure you'll be terribly disaapointed when Kobe's in found not guilty. Defense teams don't make up evidence. The evidence is the foundation of Kobe's case, it's all factual. And it will ultimately clear his name.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> 
> 
> Hmm, so if shes 20 and she sleeps with a different guy every night, shes at about, 7300 guys by now... Amazing... And of course, *the sleeping around is speculation, but lets not mention that right?*


What would you think if your girlfriend came to visit you with semen in her panties? If you knew it wasn't your semen, would you be foolish to 'speculate' she had sex with another man? Or would you just think she took another guys semen and rubbed in to her panties? Which seems more plausible?

The sleeping around is not speculation, it's a fact! And this is why the prosecution is fighting so hard to have the judges ruling overturned. They can't convict an innocent man, unless they can uphold that silly rape shield law, they know that, you know that, and so does the defense.


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## mavsman (Jun 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Duece Duece</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


How many freaking times do I have to say it? This is what Kobe's
lawyers have said. It does not make it a fact. Kobe's lawyers
claim there was someone else's sperm on her. She and her
lawyer's have denied it. Its amazing to me that simply because
his lawyers say something that many of you automatically assume
it is true. You are doing in reverse what you all claim others are
doing to Kobe. If he is innocent until proven guilty than tell me
why she is guilty simply because his lawyer makes some claim.
When I see some expert present evidence that she has someone
elses sperm than I will believe it but not until.

Where did I say she was a good girl? She may be the biggest
slut on the planet. But she is at least entitled to the same
benefit of the doubt that he is, even if she doesn't play for the
Lakers.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>bballin</b>!
> and i'm pretty sure that we know bugger all about the real facts of the case. If you think that Kobe's attorneys aren't spinning athe facts s hard as they can then...nah im sure everyone knows that they are.
> 
> Nice of the posters here to slander a girl without knowing her and on a few scraps of information from the press. Don't worry you can sit in your arm chair and make pathetic proclamations while a girl and a young super star have their lives put under a microscope and one ultimately gets labeled liar in the most public and humiliating manner.
> ...


EXACTLY, if the paper came out and said rumor is the victim is a transvestite, it would be all over this board "OMG she was a guy" You beleive everything you read but if the rumor saying Kobe was caught raping another woman, it would be "Remember guys, its just a rumor" You need it to go both ways, its all speculation... Yes a woman whos life has been trashed needs even more people trashing her... Great job guys...


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## Sha-Kobe O'Bryant (Jan 3, 2003)

If it comes out that this woman has lied from the start. She needs to face 4 to life behind bars.


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## bballin (Jun 3, 2003)

which ever one is lying is going to have the book thrown at them. i just love the armchair lawyers dribbling whatever information the side they support has put in the media. I hope Kobe didin't do it and is found innocent. if he did however, let him rot. until the jury makes a determination, the "she is a whore" thing is a representation of the character of the person posting such crap. ditto for any "kobe is a rapist".


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>mavsman</b>!
> 
> 
> How many freaking times do I have to say it? This is what Kobe's
> ...


You for real?

If the defense made up something about another mans nut that wasn't true it would take the prosecution two seconds to prove it incorrect. They have the same lab report as the defense and the people that investigated her body and panties would go on the stand.

Its not even like the twinkies because its not a subjective claim... its a fact whether there was or wasn't someone elses nutt on her.

I had a open mind until then but that story convinced me. I'm sure some will call me a homer anyways.

If you consider that other man nutting on her as a fact I don't see any logical way where she isn't lying.

And I really hope Kobes lawyers do whatever it takes to make the rest of her life miserable... and possibly investigate the Eagle sheriffs and DAs motives.


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## bballin (Jun 3, 2003)

and all they have to do is prove it in the court buddy. the prosecution has to play by stricter rules when it comes to "leaks" to the media. 



> possibly investigate the Eagle sheriffs and DAs motives.


yeah, these guys are probably kings fans lemme guess, just cus you are paranoid doen't mean the whole world is conspiring against you right?


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>bballin</b>!
> and all they have to do is prove it in the court buddy. the prosecution has to play by stricter rules when it comes to "leaks" to the media.
> 
> 
> ...


Ouch, shot at me man shot at me...


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>bballin</b>!
> yeah, these guys are probably kings fans lemme guess, just cus you are paranoid doen't mean the whole world is conspiring against you right?


No, they are attention seeking small town people. I actually read a article where the sheriffs office was celebrating their fame and handing out t-shirts... I wish I could find it now.



> and all they have to do is prove it in the court buddy. the prosecution has to play by stricter rules when it comes to "leaks" to the media.


Really? Explain why.


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Jemel Irief</b>!
> 
> 
> No, they are attention seeking small town people. I actually read a article where the sheriffs office was celebrating their fame and handing out t-shirts... I wish I could find it now.


Here is a link to the story. 

While the DA and prosecuting attorney didn't directly order the shirts, someone from the sheriff's office involved in the case did.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> 
> EXACTLY, if the paper came out and said rumor is the victim is a transvestite, it would be all over this board "OMG she was a guy" You beleive everything you read but if the rumor saying Kobe was caught raping another woman, it would be "Remember guys, its just a rumor" You need it to go both ways, its all speculation... Yes a woman whos life has been trashed needs even more people trashing her... Great job guys...


This has been letigated in court, it's documented. It is a fact that this girl had semen in her panties and the semen was not Kobe's. That's not a rumor, it is the truth. Why don't you just face the facts.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>hOnDo</b>!
> 
> 
> Here is a link to the story.
> ...


You the man hondo!

I wonder what bballin would say if someone in David Sterns office ordered "Lakers 2004 champions" shirts? Or possibly "Celtics suck" shirts?


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> That's not slander. Slandering a person is a violation of the law; therfore, there's no way a judge would rule in favor of the defense if they were slandering her.
> ...


Did you read what you quoted?


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## bballin (Jun 3, 2003)

i've said before, and i'll say it again, i hope Kobe didn't do it and is found innocent. Ok, got that part? need it repeated again?
the other part i have been saying is the discussion on this board, i.e. calling the alleged victim a whore and selectively choosing a few articles which are subject to the spin that any good defence attorney would be putting out there is just as bad as a straight out "kobe is a rapist " statement. 

A claim of rape has been made and there is prima facie evidence of assault upon the victum, as decided by a judge. the case has to move forward, no matter who it is.


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## jstempi (Jul 23, 2003)

Jstempi, right again...

"Colorado Supreme Court on Thursday cleared the way for Kobe Bryant's attorneys to ask the 19-year-old woman accusing him of rape detailed questions about her sexual past.

Bryant's attorneys, however, say the information is important because it will show the woman had a "plan" to have sex with Bryant, perhaps to win the attention of an ex-boyfriend. The defense has also suggested the woman was injured during sex with someone else, saying she had multiple partners during the week of her encounter with Bryant, including someone within 15 hours afterward. The woman's attorney, John Clune, has called that claim "patently false."

Pugsley said prosecutors may be reconsidering whether they want to go forward with the case, though Hurlbert promised to push on. Pugsley indicated that the prosecution will have difficulty winning this case."

Article 

I hate to say I told you so, but...she tainted any evidence the prosecution had and that makes her sexual history relevant so the rape shield cannot be fully enforced in this case.


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## hOnDo (Jun 26, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jstempi</b>!
> 
> I hate to say I told you so, but...*SHE* tainted any evidence the prosecution had and that makes her sexual history relevant so the rape shield cannot be fully enforced in this case.



Exactly. In some situations the rape shield law might actually apply but not in this case.

The girl *willingly* had sex with other men and *knowingly* wore underwear that contained other men's semen .

Its her own fault that the shield isn't protecting her. Because of her actions during the investigation, the defense team gets to question her.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>EHL</b>!
> 
> 
> Did you read what you quoted?


Obviously. It's not slander because its true and it pertains to the case. You can't just get all upset because the defense is establishing motive. Yeah, they are making this woman out to be a whore, but hey if the shoe fits.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Obviously. It's not slander because its true and it pertains to the case. You can't just get all upset because the defense is establishing motive. Yeah, they are making this woman out to be a whore, but hey if the shoe fits.


From what you wrote, it sounded like you were disagreeing with me, when in fact I agree with you.


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