# Our Point Guard?



## Ballishere (May 24, 2003)

Now that the draft has come and gone, we are still without what many people consider to be the raptors most biggest need, a point guard. Now I am not sure about the Rafael Araujo pick but if it fills our need at center for a good five years and helps Chris Bosh become a superstar I am all for it. Now I am afraid that we may have to play another year without a ture point guard. I was just wondering whether anyone has any information on trades or free agency signing that would help the raptors adress this problem.

P.S. Alvin Williams is no longer able to play that postion at the NBA level Effectivly. (As Sad  as it is to say)


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## B_Baller69 (May 25, 2003)

There are a few free agents that could fit the role of starting point guards for us, but i like these two the best

Troy Hudson - great leader on the floor, but minisota wants to resign him

Keyon Dooling- explosive athlete, could have a breakout year


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

steve nash

jay williams???

carlos arroyo

damon jones?

kenny anderson




jalen rose? lol


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## kirk_2003 (Jun 23, 2003)

i like the idea of Kenyon Dooling if we cant get Hudson here... Kenny Anderson is a nice replacement over aging Rod Strict... :yes:


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## B_Baller69 (May 25, 2003)

yes yes there all fine, but we got about as much chance of getting Nash as the Hawks do of selling out. As for the other guys im not sure if they can be our starting pg maybe kenny anderson.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Have any of you watched Kenny Anderson in the past 2 years? Hes the worst pg thats been mentioned on this thread.


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## SKiP (Jan 28, 2004)

Some other free agent point guards are Derek Fisher and Rafer Alston.


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## gdog (Aug 24, 2003)

I think rafer is staying put and doubt he would come back to the raps. Best chance is dooling or jones, and who knows about JWill.


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## B_Baller69 (May 25, 2003)

Oh yah, forgot about fisher. He would be at the top of my list. Hes an established and well respected pg in this league. Great fit, but dont think we will get him.


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## dork (Mar 21, 2004)

dooling and damon jones in a pg platoon...


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## raptorsrule15 (Jul 4, 2003)

The nuggets traded Jameer Nelson to Orlando for a future first rounder.....Why didn't Babcock do that.....he should have offered a future first and second rounder, that could have probably beaten the Magics offer!!!

We could of had....

Nelson
Rose
Carter
Bosh
Araujo


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>raptorsrule15</b>!
> The nuggets traded Jameer Nelson to Orlando for a future first rounder.....Why didn't Babcock do that.....



because we already traded a future first round pick duh


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## SKiP (Jan 28, 2004)

The Raptors should have drafted Jameer Nelson at #8, and then they should have traded a future first, like Dallas did, to Utah for Pavel Podkolzine.

PG - Nelson
SG - Rose
SF - Carter
PF - Bosh
C - Podkolzine


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## SKiP (Jan 28, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Dathomieyouhate</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> because we already traded a future first round pick duh


Oh... never mind then...


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## Dathomieyouhate (Jun 21, 2003)

my opinion is that we pick up damon he's young and played well in the place of the injured tj ford last year he averaged 7 points 6 assists when starting. which insn't bad for us.


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## kirk_2003 (Jun 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Dathomieyouhate</b>!
> my opinion is that we pick up damon he's young and played well in the place of the injured tj ford last year he averaged 7 points 6 assists when starting. which insn't bad for us.


plus... Mitchell knows him from the BUCKS days... so they should get along nicely... :yes:


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## SKiP (Jan 28, 2004)

Keyon Dooling could become a real good player in the NBA. The Raptors should give him a chance. 

I've seen Dooling play for Dillard High School in Florida and he averaged 22 points, 6 assists, 6 rebounds and 5 steals a game as a senior.

That probably doesn't mean anything because every NBA player could put up those numbers


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## Ballyhoo (May 30, 2003)

Keyon Dooling, :no:. Four years in the NBA and he hasn't shown any improvement, at all. He's no better than Alvin Williams, so why waste money on him?

I assume the Cavs are going to pick up McInnis's option? If not, he would be a great pick up. He averaged 7.5 apg after getting traded to the Cavs.

If we can't sign or trade for a decent PG then we might as well just endure and hope to get a good one in next year's draft. The last thing we want is to sign a Troy Hudson or Keyon Dooling to a long term deal as a stop gap measure.


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## FanOfAll8472 (Jun 28, 2003)

If you're concerned about Jamal Crawford, and to a certain extent, Troy Hudson, playing point for us, you don't want Dooling. He hasn't shown much playmaking skills...and seems to have the same problems Crawford does of creating plays only for himself. Hudson IMO is a little better than both...he's a more natural playmaker and doesn't look to score nearly as much as the other 2.

If you're not worried, then Dooling would be a good risk. He hasn't improved a lot, but the talent and potential is still massive.


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## Junkyard Dog13 (Aug 9, 2003)

Damon Jones, could be had for a good price, is young and good.
Picking him rather than Hudson/Fisher would save us some more money and allow us to get a good C like Mark Blount.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Damon Jones sounds like a good pick up, he and Rafer Alston prolly wont come expensive. Question is are they willing to play starter minutes or are they more reliable coming of the bench.


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## Junkyard Dog13 (Aug 9, 2003)

Its time for Jones to start, sign him a short term deal avg salery no more than 2.5 mill/season.
I.e 3 yr 7 mill.
Hudson will be more expensive but is a proven player howeer injries are cathing with him as he is aging, would be better than Alvin, question is James will be cheaper and allow us to have more cash to sign Blount or Foyle.


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## osman (Jul 29, 2003)

What about Jamal Crawford? It's worth a shot, we could offer him a 6yr contract worth 42million I think, which is the MLE plus 10% annual raises. He could be our point guard of the future, the only question is would he even want to come here, and would the Bulls match.


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## -James- (Apr 27, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>osman</b>!
> What about Jamal Crawford? *It's worth a shot*, we could offer him a 6yr contract worth 42million I think, which is the MLE plus 10% annual raises. He could be our point guard of the future, the only question is would he even want to come here, and would the Bulls match.


no it isnt. we need a playmaker, not another shoot-first guy


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## Junkyard Dog13 (Aug 9, 2003)

Craw is better suited for the Sg position.

We need someone like Jones.


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## butr (Mar 23, 2004)

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/damon_jones/index.html

I don't think he knows Sam. Last year was his first at Milwaukee. Sam has been with Minny for 2 years. I do think Damon is gettable. Obviously he does not mind the cold either. I think he is the best realistic PG we can target. I would say 2-3 million of the MLE should be offered for 2-3 years.

He made 750k last year.


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## -James- (Apr 27, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>blowuptheraptors</b>!
> http://www.nba.com/playerfile/damon_jones/index.html
> 
> I don't think he knows Sam. Last year was his first at Milwaukee. Sam has been with Minny for 2 years. I do think Damon is gettable. Obviously he does not mind the cold either. I think he is the best realistic PG we can target. I would say 2-3 million of the MLE should be offered for 2-3 years.
> ...


sam was with milwaukee the last two years


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## DAllatt (Jun 13, 2003)

I suspect that babcock is trying to work out a deal for a younger point gaurd that can be developed. I doubt, given his philosopy and goal of a championship team in the future, that he is trying to aquire bob jackson, or any of the other older poind gaurds being mentioned...and frankly I like the idea

Here's a thought...donyell for jameer and a filler. Love to see it happen.

Damon jones would also be a decent pickup


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## butr (Mar 23, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>jae05</b>!
> 
> 
> sam was with milwaukee the last two years


Sorry, my fault. Of course he was with Terry Porter. I was thinking about when he and Babcock were in the same organisation.

As for Jameer, Orlando is in a rebuild mode. He is a keeper for them.


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## -James- (Apr 27, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>DAllatt</b>!
> I suspect that babcock is trying to work out a deal for a younger point gaurd that can be developed. I doubt, given his philosopy and goal of a championship team in the future, that he is trying to aquire bob jackson, or any of the other older poind gaurds being mentioned...and frankly I like the idea
> 
> Here's a thought...donyell for jameer and a filler. Love to see it happen.
> ...


bobby jackson isn't that old is he?


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## spuriousjones (Apr 24, 2004)

Damon Jones is a great choice 
look at his assist numbers . an earl boykins-like contract would be a steal.


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## DAllatt (Jun 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jae05</b>!
> 
> 
> bobby jackson isn't that old is he?


31 years old


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## Junkyard Dog13 (Aug 9, 2003)

31 too old , we need someone under 30 who has no past injury issues or minor ones.

Dooling or Jones. :yes:


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## McFurious (Mar 25, 2004)

We should go after Derek Fisher this man can flat out play the PG position. :grinning:


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## DAllatt (Jun 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>McFurious</b>!
> We should go after Derek Fisher this man can flat out play the PG position. :grinning:


no, no, no

Role players on star teams RARELY live up to expectations when they move on. Simply consider who he had around him and how much that would have opened up things for him.

PLUS he's 30 years old and likely looking for a long term contract given that he's on the down swing of his career. We don't need this guy on our roster for 4-5 years. even 1-3 years for that matter. 

Lets take on a player who will improve and learn with Bosh and Hoffa. NO MORE BANDAID SOLUTIONS


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## KeonBackinTO (May 26, 2003)

> James will be cheaper and allow us to have more cash to sign Blount or Foyle.


We aren't going to get a PG and Blount, no way. And Foyle would be a waste with all our big men, even tho most aren't that great.

We might as well use the MLE on 2 decents PGs, Dooling for potential and backup and Jones for solid starter. That's tight but doable.


And Bobby Jackson would be hard to get, the only tradable asset Raps have is Donnyell and the Kings are stacked at PF.


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## lucky777s (Nov 13, 2003)

Is 31 too old? John Stockton played until he was 40 and the Raps would gladly take the last 9 years of his career going forward.

Fisher or BJax for 3 years wouldn't be too bad but that is the type of deal teams like San Antonio can get people to sign, not the Raptors.

We would have to overpay for any starting quality player.

Plus I wouldn't say Fish is great on D. He works hard and is better than what we have but the Lakers have been torched by Bibby, Parker, Hudson and other quick guards over the last few years.

Damon Jones, Carlos Arroyo, Jeff McInnis are better targets for us.

Same with C's. Any guy with legit C size who can put up 8 + 8 seems to get offers well above the MLE which is just out of the Raps range. We have to pay at least 1 mill per season more, or add an extra year or two to the contract to compete with better teams in the US.


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## Sánchez AF (Aug 10, 2003)

De. Fisher is My choice he can play for 4-6 yrs more 

Fisher
Vince
Rose
Bosh
Araujo 

I like this line-up


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## -James- (Apr 27, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>DAllatt</b>!
> 
> 
> 31 years old


damn... thats one helluva lot older than i thot


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## FanOfAll8472 (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Junkyard Dog13</b>!
> Damon Jones, could be had for a good price, is young and good.
> Picking him rather than Hudson/Fisher would save us some more money and allow us to get a good C like Mark Blount.


I totally forgot about Jones. Now that I remember him, he becomes #1 on my wanted list.

Jones
Fisher
Arroyo
Alston
James
Hudson


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## The Mad Viking (Jun 12, 2003)

Jones 

Alston

Either of these guys could eat up the whole MLE, depending on the market.

The question is, do they want to play in Toronto.

Neither are good defensively, BTW.
There is a kid - Jeff Trepagnier, on the Charlotte roster, unrestricted, who played at USC and mostly rode the bench for 3 years in Cleveland & Denver. He's a combo guard with good D and he can hit the trey. Really hustles. Could be had for a song as a roleplayer. Still improving. 

Unless you prefer - Palacio? :sour:


James and Arroyo are RESTRICTED free agents. The Raptors cannot afford them.


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## Sissond (Jun 22, 2004)

*PG*

I think if we are going to get a pg from free agency, he has to be fairly young. No offense to Rod Strikland. He is a great pg but he is aging and getting slow.

We need a pg who can run. Milt can run, but he can't pass or shoot which is a problem. I was looking at the free agent list, and Washington has Steve Blake listed under Other. 

Is there any chance we can get him? I mean they are pretty clogged at that position. I mean Arenas, Hughes, Dixon, and Whitney all can play that position.

The kid is young, he can run, and might develop into a good pg. He is the kind of guy who knows his role, which is to run the offense, and allow the other superstars to score.


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## slash_010 (Dec 20, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Dathomieyouhate</b>!
> because we already traded a future first round pick duh


How so? does anyone know the detail


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## butr (Mar 23, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>The Mad Viking</b>!
> Jones
> 
> Alston
> ...


Jones made 750k last year with Milwaukee. If this guy likes Sam at all from last year, he will come. He will not command the exception but something in the low 7 figures.


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## Ballyhoo (May 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DAllatt</b>!
> Lets take on a player who will improve and learn with Bosh and Hoffa. NO MORE BANDAID SOLUTIONS


Hear, hear! Great post. If we can't get anyone that fits that criteria then don't sign anyone to more than a 1 year deal.


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## FanOfAll8472 (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>The Mad Viking</b>!
> Jones
> 
> Alston
> ...


I don't see us using the MLE on anything else besides a point (I really hope no big man), so why not? Besides Fisher, none of the point guards we have discussed are good defensively. Trepagnier is much more of a shooting guard who likes to score and dunk than a point guard. His agent's been trying to get him a job in Charlotte, but not even the Bobcats are liking the idea.

I doubt we'll get Arroyo, although I certainly wish. I'm pretty sure James will come cheap because he wasn't used much by Brown and the Pistons need the cap space for 'Sheed or maybe Okur.


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## Porn Player (Apr 24, 2003)

one guy that showed he really stepped up and thrived in a starting pg role was Rafer i really hope we puik him up i no he prolly wont want to return to t.dot but he wouldnt command the whole MLE either so we could pik up another pg to compliment him or depending on how much he wants jones may still be had aswell....
the raps betta lose palacio that guy suked the first game i saw hime play he gave like 4 turnovers in as many posssesion pathetic...


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## superdude211 (Apr 3, 2004)

*PG*

Minnesota's Troy Hudson, Miami's Rafer Alston and Derek Fisher of the Los Angeles Lakers are high on Toronto's wish list for point guards, according to team and league sources, and each would probably be affordable when teams can start signing players July 14.(http://www.hoopshype.com/rumors.htm)


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## The Mad Viking (Jun 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>FanOfAll8472</b>!
> 
> I don't see us using the MLE on anything else besides a point (I really hope no big man), so why not? Besides Fisher, none of the point guards we have discussed are good defensively. Trepagnier is much more of a shooting guard who likes to score and dunk than a point guard. His agent's been trying to get him a job in Charlotte, but not even the Bobcats are liking the idea.
> 
> I doubt we'll get Arroyo, although I certainly wish. I'm pretty sure James will come cheap because he wasn't used much by Brown and the Pistons need the cap space for 'Sheed or maybe Okur.


I agree completely. Others were suggesting we could get Foyle as well, I doubt he goes for the minimum, so we can't get both.

But so what. We need the best point we can afford.

Trepagnier IMO would be a great bench player. Can play 1 or 2, and is strong defensively. Palacio was supposed to be strong defensively. NOT!


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