# Top PG's list



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

1. Raymond Felton, UNC
2. Jameer Nelson, St. Joseph’s 
3. Chris Thomas, Notre Dame
4. Mo Williams, Alabama
5. Dee Brown, Illinois
6. Blake Stepp, Gonzaga
7. Daniel Horton, Michigan
8. Aaron Miles, Kansas
9. Devin Harris, Wisconsin
10. Travis Diener, Marquette
11. Andre Barrett, Seton Hall
12. Jarrett Jack, Georgia Tech
13. Anthony Roberson, Florida
14. Chris Paul, Wake Forest
15. Jason Parker, Tulsa


----------



## DaFuture (Nov 5, 2002)

*Chris Paul has never played a*

minute of college ball.


Gilchrist should be on that list. So should Chris Duhon:laugh: Just kidding about Duhon.


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>blabla97</b>!
> 1. Raymond Felton, UNC
> 2. Jameer Nelson, St. Joseph’s
> 3. Chris Thomas, Notre Dame
> ...


No Chris Hill?


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Re: Top PG's list*



> Originally posted by <b>Spartanfan2003</b>!
> No Chris Hill?


Hill is a SG, as you know. Don't get me wrong though, Hill did a great job at PG, but he's a SG at heart, not a PG, and thats what this list is about: natural PGs.


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Top PG's list*



> Originally posted by <b>Ukfan4Life</b>!
> 
> 
> Hill is a SG, as you know. Don't get me wrong though, Hill did a great job at PG, but he's a SG at heart, not a PG, and thats what this list is about: natural PGs.


It looks like Hill is set at PG for the rest of his career in college. Michigan State already has former high school player of the year, Kelvin Torbert, at SG, as well as newcomer Shannon Brown. When he gets to the NBA it might change though.


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Top PG's list*



> Originally posted by <b>Spartanfan2003</b>!
> It looks like Hill is set at PG for the rest of his career in college. Michigan State already has former high school player of the year, Kelvin Torbert, at SG, as well as newcomer Shannon Brown. When he gets to the NBA it might change though.


Yeah, but that doesn't take away the fact that he's a SG at heart.


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

*Re: Chris Paul has never played a*



> Originally posted by <b>DaFuture</b>!
> minute of college ball.
> 
> 
> Gilchrist should be on that list. So should Chris Duhon:laugh: Just kidding about Duhon.


Chris Paul is a stretch, but I like what I have seen. He's the only freshman who stands a chance of being on this list at the year's end, that's for sure


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Top PG's list*



> Originally posted by <b>Ukfan4Life</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah, but that doesn't take away the fact that he's a SG at heart.


Still, he plays PG so he should be qualified. I wouldn't put him in a top SG list, but I would put him in this.


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Top PG's list*



> Originally posted by <b>Spartanfan2003</b>!
> It looks like Hill is set at PG for the rest of his career in college. Michigan State already has former high school player of the year, Kelvin Torbert, at SG, as well as newcomer Shannon Brown. When he gets to the NBA it might change though.


What happened the all-american PG that MSU is bringing in? I would think that Cotton would steal some of Hill's minutes at PG, Hiil and Brown would split minutes at the two, while Torbert gets mostly pine. 

Hill is a decent player, but he's not top 15 in the country at any position. He's just not a guy who can take over a game when opponents are focusing on him. He'll take what teams give him (the open 3) and play good defense, but that's about it. He will complement MSU's more talented freshman quite nicely.


----------



## Hollis (Jun 4, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Top PG's list*



> Originally posted by <b>Spartanfan2003</b>!
> It looks like Hill is set at PG for the rest of his career in college. Michigan State already has former high school player of the year, Kelvin Torbert, at SG, as well as newcomer Shannon Brown. When he gets to the NBA it might change though.


Torbert is nothing. Brown is great though.....Can they not have a 3-guard lineup?


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

> Torbert is nothing. Brown is great though.....Can they not have a 3-guard lineup?


That's what I was thinking, but Alan Anderson is going to be the starting 3 no matter what, and I would expect Lorbeck and Davis to be locked in at the 4 and 5. Backcourt minutes are going to be hard to come by for the Spartans!


----------



## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

Gerry McNamara?


----------



## Im The One (Sep 1, 2002)

I love that #1.

I think those that havent seen Paul play are in for a big surprise. He's as pure as it get's when it comes to point guards, and his speed is almost unmatched. I like to compare his game to a young Stockton with more scoring ability. Not saying he will be as good as stockton though. Wake's backcourt will be good next year not as good as UNC's but good none the less


----------



## kg_theGREATEST (Feb 21, 2003)

Gerry McNamara is better than all those guys except for Felton and Dee Brown


----------



## FSH (Aug 3, 2002)

yea GMac should be up there somewher..


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

Ok, if no Chris Hill then how about Tony Stockman?


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>kg_theGREATEST</b>!
> Gerry McNamara is better than all those guys except for Felton and Dee Brown


You are right, GMac should be on the list. Ben Gordon as well, as I feel he's going to turn out to be a fairly good NBA PG. 

I really don't know where to put McNamara, however. He's got the quick release, but the rest of his game isn't exceptional. He needs to show that he can lead Syracuse without Anthony before he's in my top 5.


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Spartanfan2003</b>!
> Ok, if no Chris Hill then how about Tony Stockman?


I haven't seen Stockman play. I know he's never played PG in college before, as Scott played the position when Stockman was at Clemson. There might be some adjustment to the Big 10 as well. He's off my list for now, but I am definitely keeping my eye on him. If OSU's backcourt is as good as it is being hyped by certain Buckeye fans, the Big Ten had better watch out.


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Im The One</b>!
> I love that #1.
> 
> I think those that havent seen Paul play are in for a big surprise. He's as pure as it get's when it comes to point guards, and his speed is almost unmatched. I like to compare his game to a young Stockton with more scoring ability. Not saying he will be as good as stockton though. Wake's backcourt will be good next year not as good as UNC's but good none the less


I agree completely. I absolutely LOVE watching 2-PG backcourts go to work. Syracuse was and will be awesome with GMac and Edelin. Same with Illinois, with Brown and Williams. Kansas had Miles and Hinrich. Gray and Paul will be just as effective. These teams simply run opponents into the ground. 

2-PG backcourts are so affective in college that I really don't understand why more coaches don't use them. This isn't like the NBA, where you have to have a tall guard out there at all times for defensive purposes. 

Anyways, think about the guard play in the ACC this season. 

Maryland with Gilchrist & Jones
UNC with Felton and McCants
WF with Paul and Gray

That's just sick. It's going to be run and gun all season! If Duke was smart, they would sit Duhon and let Dockery run next to Ewing.


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

Updating the list...

I decided I had Daniel Horton a bit too high. He plays way too out of control for my taste. Miles and Harris are both better. I added McNamara and Gordon. 

1. Raymond Felton, UNC
2. Jameer Nelson, St. Joseph’s 
3. Chris Thomas, Notre Dame
4. Mo Williams, Alabama
5. Dee Brown, Illinois
6. Ben Gordon, UConn
7. Blake Stepp, Gonzaga
8. Aaron Miles, Kansas
9. Devin Harris, Wisconsin
10. Daniel Horton, Michigan
11. Gerry McNamara, Syracuse
12. Travis Diener, Marquette
13. Andre Barrett, Seton Hall
14. Jarrett Jack, Georgia Tech
15. Anthony Roberson, Florida


----------



## FSH (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>blabla97</b>!
> Updating the list...
> 
> I decided I had Daniel Horton a bit too high. He plays way too out of control for my taste. Miles and Harris are both better. I added McNamara and Gordon.
> ...


I think this list is alot better


----------



## KA (Apr 21, 2003)

Marques Green deserves to be on any top 15 PG list.

His Stats Prove It


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

Chris Thomas declared. Time for a new list.


----------



## kansasalumn (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Spartanfan2003</b>!
> Chris Thomas declared. Time for a new list.


I was about to mention that.


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

C'mon. Cliff Hawkins doesn't have the stats but his defense will suffocate any man Tubby chooses him to defend.


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Ukfan4Life</b>!
> C'mon. Cliff Hawkins doesn't have the stats but his defense will suffocate any man Tubby chooses him to defend.


Cliff might be Top 75, but we are talking about the elite here.


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Spartanfan2003</b>!
> Cliff might be Top 75, but we are talking about the elite here.


True.


----------



## TMOD (Oct 12, 2002)

> C'mon. Cliff Hawkins doesn't have the stats but his defense will suffocate any man Tubby chooses him to defend.


 If Cliff Hawkins deserves to be mentioned...the Cravens from USC...:yes:


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

No, Spartans right. He maybe in the top 75 but not this high. I don't think Hawkins is NBA-caliber.


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

Hawkins has always intrigued me. He's as quick as any PG in the country. However, he doesn't have an outside shot, and definitely is missing that ability to control the game that most of the PG's on this list have.


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>blabla97</b>!
> Hawkins has always intrigued me. He's as quick as any PG in the country. However, he doesn't have an outside shot, and definitely is missing that ability to control the game that most of the PG's on this list have.


Doesn't have an outside shot? Correction: He didn't have an outside shot LAST year. His shot could still use some work but he said he worked all off season and the time he wasn't allowed to play for UK for half the season working on his 3 point shot. I mean come on! He scored three 3 pointers against Mississippi State. I know it's not that much but it definitley shows he can shoot now. Despite him being a good 3 point shot, he's still not our go to guy if we need a 3 (that has always belonged to Fitch, Barbour, and Bogans).


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Rupp</b>!
> 
> 
> Doesn't have an outside shot? Correction: He didn't have an outside shot LAST year. His shot could still use some work but he said he worked all off season and the time he wasn't allowed to play for UK for half the season working on his 3 point shot. I mean come on! He scored three 3 pointers against Mississippi State. I know it's not that much but it definitley shows he can shoot now. Despite him being a good 3 point shot, he's still not our go to guy if we need a 3 (that has always belonged to Fitch, Barbour, and Bogans).


UKFan4Life?

I am not hating on Kentucky by putting down Hawkins. I think he is the worst point gaurd that Kentucky has had in a long time, which again is no "diss". He is just up with elite company at Kentucky. He may be good some day, but he isn't even the best player on his team right now while some of the guys on that list have their whole team revolving around their each and every move.


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

He's not a point guard pal. Tubby only used him as PG for the first part of the season because Hawkins was out, and Tubby only uses him for the first 4-5 minutes of every game so they can bring in Hawkins to turn up the defense and pull a fresh, better PG and get a 1 up on the other team. He also only brings him in when Hawkins is tired or in foul trouble. He's a good PG for a 5 minute period or so, but he's a SG at heart. It's sort of like Chris Hill with MSU, except Fitch doesn't do as good of a job at PG as Hill does. Fitch players SG for about 90% of every game, except for when Hawkins was academically inelgible for the first part of the season. He's a great SG, but not NBA-caliber.


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Rupp</b>!
> He's not a point guard pal. Tubby only used him as PG for the first part of the season because Hawkins was out, and Tubby only uses him for the first 4-5 minutes of every game so they can bring in Hawkins to turn up the defense and pull a fresh, better PG and get a 1 up on the other team. He also only brings him in when Hawkins is tired or in foul trouble. He's a good PG for a 5 minute period or so, but he's a SG at heart. It's sort of like Chris Hill with MSU, except Fitch doesn't do as good of a job at PG as Hill does. Fitch players SG for about 90% of every game, except for when Hawkins was academically inelgible for the first part of the season. He's a great SG, but not NBA-caliber.


Sorry, I meant to say Hawkins. I got pretty confused. I'll edit my post to make sense.


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

Hawkins isn't exactly the best offensively. His shot can still use some work, and sometimes he slashes into the lane without knowing what he's doing. His defense is what makes him shine though. And he's fast which makes him a great fast-breaker.


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Rupp</b>!
> He's not a point guard pal. Tubby only used him as PG for the first part of the season because Hawkins was out, and Tubby only uses him for the first 4-5 minutes of every game so they can bring in Hawkins to turn up the defense and pull a fresh, better PG and get a 1 up on the other team. He also only brings him in when Hawkins is tired or in foul trouble. He's a good PG for a 5 minute period or so, but he's a SG at heart. It's sort of like Chris Hill with MSU, except Fitch doesn't do as good of a job at PG as Hill does. Fitch players SG for about 90% of every game, except for when Hawkins was academically inelgible for the first part of the season. He's a great SG, but not NBA-caliber.


I can't tell. Is this Fitch?


----------



## tdizzle (Apr 12, 2003)

*what about cj watson?*

What about C.J. Watson from Tennessee, he did lead the SEC in assist last season as a freshman.

link to profile.
http://utsports.ocsn.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/watson_cj00.html


----------



## ATLien (Jun 18, 2002)

Rashad Wright is the best true PG in the nation! :yes: Only reason he gets no love is he doesn't score much and he's a rising senior


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

> What about C.J. Watson from Tennessee, he did lead the SEC in assist last season as a freshman.


Definitely a guy I'm keeping an eye on. I really haven't seen him play much, though. Can anybody give a report on his game?


----------



## ATLien (Jun 18, 2002)

Watson should be top 10 by the end of next season:yes:


----------



## spartanfan2003 (Jul 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Omni</b>!
> Watson should be top 10 by the end of next season:yes:


No he shouldn't. I would accept top ten in the SEC, but there is life outside of the south you know.


----------



## feedy (Apr 7, 2003)

I think that Andre Barrett shoul be a little bit higher.

Plus watch out for Lafonte Johnson at George Washington next season. I think he will be on this list after next season even top 5.


----------



## ATLien (Jun 18, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Spartanfan2003</b>!
> No he shouldn't. I would accept top ten in the SEC, but there is life outside of the south you know.


Don't post what you don't know about. Watson is an up and comer, and if you can't see that then you're blind.

Life outside the south is not a life worth living:yes:


----------



## CrossinUOvr03 (May 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>blabla97</b>!
> 
> 
> Definitely a guy I'm keeping an eye on. I really haven't seen him play much, though. Can anybody give a report on his game?


C.J.'s a player. Saw him play in high school and he's just a killer. Just a tough kid. By losing a couple of their major scorers, I see him really breaking out this year as a soph.


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>GeorgiaSports</b>!
> Watson is an up and comer, and if you can't see that then you're blind.
> 
> Life outside the south is not a life worth living:yes:


He's right. I know that if you watched as many UT games as you could, you'd see that with almost every game, Watson showed improvement one way or another. The guys just a sophomore now. IMagine what he'll be like as a senior.


----------



## CrossinUOvr03 (May 23, 2003)

Since 3 of the top 4 on the list have declared for the Draft, here's my new top 15:

1. Raymond Felton
2. Ben Gordon
3. Dee Brown
4. Blake Stepp
5. Devin Harris
6. Aaron Miles
7. Daniel Horton
8. Gerry McNamara
9. Andre Barrett
10. Travis Diener
11. Jarrett Jack
12. Anthony Roberson
13. Antonio Burks
14. C.J. Watson
15. Rashad Wright

Honorable Mention (no order):
Chris Paul
Mustafa Shakur
Billy Edelin
Chris Duhon

I'm still switching guys around, but that's pretty close.


----------



## UKfan4Life (Mar 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>CrossinUOvr03</b>!
> Since 3 of the top 4 on the list have declared for the Draft, here's my new top 15:
> 
> 1. Raymond Felton
> ...


I think I'll agree with that list, but I think Cliff Hawkins at least deserves an honorable mention.


----------



## carver401 (Aug 24, 2002)

I think you are really overrating Dee Brown, he got beat out by Horton for freshman of the year and the Wolverines depended on Horton is twice is much as the Illini did on Brown. Also Aaron Miles is pretty high, I was very unimpressed from what I saw, no outside shot.


----------



## CrossinUOvr03 (May 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>carver401</b>!
> I think you are really overrating Dee Brown, he got beat out by Horton for freshman of the year and the Wolverines depended on Horton is twice is much as the Illini did on Brown. Also Aaron Miles is pretty high, I was very unimpressed from what I saw, no outside shot.


actually, I was just thinking about Miles myself. He's a strong defensive player, but was nonexistent on O. I also think I underrated Barrett.


----------



## CrossinUOvr03 (May 23, 2003)

Okay, here are my final rankings:

1. Raymond Felton- Can do it all. National Player of the Year top candidate.

2. Ben Gordon- When he's hot, just unstoppable. More of a combo guard though.

3. Blake Stepp- Mark Few says he's better than Dan Dickau was in college.

4. Devin Harris- Just a solid PG who doesn't get much publicity.

5. Andre Barrett- I love this guy. He's carried Seton Hall the last two years and almost got them to the NCAAs last year.

6. Dee Brown- A lot like Barrett, but his skills aren't as refined. His defense/speed puts him ahead of Horton.

7. Daniel Horton- Should be even more dominant in the Big Ten this year. More of a scorer than distributor.

8. Gerry McNamara- Another combo guard. Great shooter. Just a clutch player.

9. Travis Diener- Not as athletic as other guys on this list, but makes up for it with his toughness.

10. Jarrett Jack- Another player who could break out this year.

11. Anthony Roberson- Has to look to get other guys involved as well, but otherwise, a great talent.

12. Antonio Burks- As fast as Dee Brown or 'Dre Barrett, he's a nightmare for other teams on both ends of the floor. More of a typical PG.

13. C.J. Watson- A guy who can rise up this list real fast next year. He's got it all.

14. Aaron Miles- Solid on D. Runs the show well, but his lack of scoring from the outside means teams give him lots of room.

15. Rashad Wright- Great floor leader. Look for him to become more of a factor on offense now that some of the scorers for UGA are gone.

Honorable Mention:

Mustafa Shakur- My choice as the best freshman PG this year.

Chris Paul- Another freshman who'll have a major impact.

Billy Edelin- Him and Gerry starting in the backcourt will be deadly.

Chris Duhon- Was supposed to break out like Jay Williams, but it never happened. A real mystery. Looks like his time has passed. Still a solid PG, but other guys like Redick, S. Williams, and Daniel Ewing will be the scorers next year.



My 5 favorite PGs to watch this year will be:

Andre Barrett (Seton Hall)
Raymond Felton (UNC)
Mustafa Shakur (Arizona)
Andrew Lavender (Oklahoma)
C.J. Watson (Tennessee)


----------



## ATLien (Jun 18, 2002)

Good for you for putting Wright on your list! And I agree with you about Jack ready to break out. GT is loaded in the 1-3 spots, so look for Jack to tear it up at PG.


----------



## carver401 (Aug 24, 2002)

*Devin Harris*

Harris is a solid player but watching the Big Ten this year he was certainly the 3rd best PG behind Horton and Brown. He only averaged 12 ppg and was very inconsitent. Not to metioned he got killed when he was matched up against Horton


----------



## CrossinUOvr03 (May 23, 2003)

*Re: Devin Harris*



> Originally posted by <b>carver401</b>!
> Harris is a solid player but watching the Big Ten this year he was certainly the 3rd best PG behind Horton and Brown. He only averaged 12 ppg and was very inconsitent. Not to metioned he got killed when he was matched up against Horton


True, it'll be interesting to see how all 3 of those guys in the Big Ten step up since some of their top players graduated. No Kirk Penney, Brian Cook, etc. Those are my ratings coming into the year, but they may change very quickly midway through when some guys who are sophs breakout (like J-Will did at Duke when he was a soph).


----------

