# dwight still worth #1?? He lost AGAIN on national television



## knickstorm (Jun 22, 2003)

once again telfair steps up to lead his team to victory. I dont get it, if the guy is worth the #1 overall pick he should be able to lead his team to victory against other hs teams in the country that are good too. Lost to randolph morris' team, and my hometown team lincoln railsplitters. GO TELFAIR!!! Once again great job scoring and distributing the basketball. Stupid announcer kept trying to give howard every excuse in the world blaming the refs etc.


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## MJG (Jun 29, 2003)

I haven't seen either game, so I won't comment too much, but I'm guessing NBA teams don't care much how good his team is. It takes more than one dominant player to win games, and if the rest isn't that great (compared to the competition), then they'll lose.


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## Idunkonyou (Feb 23, 2003)

There is only one guy I would pick #1 as of right now and that would be Okafor. He is dominating night in and night out in the NCAA and has since he was a freshman. 

Smith would be the only other guy. He is another high schooler who is under the radar now, but come June he will more then likely be a top 5 pick unless he goes to college. 

Guys like Howard and Pavel, from what I have heard and seen are way too raw. Both will need years of seasoning before they becoming good. Think Darko and J. O'Neal (I know O'Neal is great now, but it took him like 6 years to get there).


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Idunkonyou</b>!
> There is only one guy I would pick #1 as of right now and that would be Okafor. He is dominating night in and night out in the NCAA and has since he was a freshman.
> 
> Smith would be the only other guy. He is another high schooler who is under the radar now, but come June he will more then likely be a top 5 pick unless he goes to college.
> ...


Well then if you feel that way about Howard you definitley have to feel the same about Josh Smith


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## Idunkonyou (Feb 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> Well then if you feel that way about Howard you definitley have to feel the same about Josh Smith


What I meant is if I had to take a high schooler right now, I would take Smith over Howard. 

As far as #1 is concerned, it is a no brainer. Okafor is the man.


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## MagnusPinus (Aug 27, 2003)

Losing high school games shouldn't affect his status.. He will be drafted because of his illimitate potential.. High school games are ridicolous..


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

All I know is that when I saw Howard against Morris, Morris looked like the guy I would want my team to draft. Not Howard. And they both looked like they needed some seasoning.


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## Kmasonbx (Apr 7, 2003)

Josh Smith definitely killed his draft stock yesterday against Cardinal Dougherty, he struggled the whole game and was outplayed by Shane Clark. Yes Smith is a freak athlete but besides that the rest of his game leaves a lot to be desired. I hope teams tell him he won't be a first round pick, because he needs college, his game will benefit a lot from a year or 2 in college rather than just sitting on the bench of an NBA team for 3 years. 

Howard didn't win because Lincoln's team is simply better and should have won by a lot more. They held a 16 point lead and stopped scoring. More than anything Sebastian proved he will be in the NBA next year, how many high school kids have the ability to knock down a 20 footer off of a step back with 2 people on them? Now ask yourself how many players in the NBA can do that. As dominant as Howard is, Telfair could be just as dominant, with his ability to disrupt teams defenses and take the big man out of the middle, which is exactly what happened last night. 

Howard had 23 points, 17 rebounds and 4 blocks, he was quietely a dominant player facing constant double and triple teams. Sebastian's 30 points and 9 assists was even more impressive, and I don't think there is any way he doesn't go in the lottery come June.


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

> Howard had 23 points, 17 rebounds and 4 blocks, he was quietely a dominant player facing constant double and triple teams. Sebastian's 30 points and 9 assists was even more impressive, and I don't think there is any way he doesn't go in the lottery come June.


I agree about Telfair. He's pretty good, and could go anywhere from 8-15. As for Howard, he has an NBA body and tons of potential, but he's raw. Any team that takes him at #1 instead of Okafor will regret that decision.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

Since when does winning in HS warrant where you are selected in the draft?


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## Reece Gaines (Feb 8, 2003)

Also Telfair hit the game winning 3


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

He won't slip past #2.


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## AZwildcats4 (Feb 9, 2004)

It's a shame, but there is no way Okafor goes before Howard.


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## knickstorm (Jun 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TucsonClip</b>!
> Since when does winning in HS warrant where you are selected in the draft?


if your so friggan good peopel think you can go #1, and you cant win against the best HS teams how are you supposed to help beat the pro's in the near future?? If LeBron 's hs team went 1-15 then you would've known he couldnt be that great. OF course HS games tell you a lot about the player, why else do scouts attend?? we know telfair can play under pressure, through injury. He's a floorleader and motivates his teammates much like LeBron did. Howard is a different story. While TElfair is tlaking to his teammates on the floor on where to go, how to play, and telling them what they need to do to help win the game, howard's just standing there telling his teammates the throw the ball higher so he can alley oop it. Granted Telfair is a PG, i would like to see more leadership qualities in howard, or else he might just be another very good player with a yao ming attitude


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## Kmasonbx (Apr 7, 2003)

There are players who just aren't leaders, that doesn't mean you aren't a great basketball player. LeBron's team went undefeated last year because they had 3 other division 1 players on that team, it wasn't just LeBron and a bunch of stiffs. There is no other division 1 senior on that team, while Javaris Critterton is certainly a division 1 prospect he is only a Sophomore. 

Howard's team has 2 losses, not like they are losing left and right.


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## sonny22 (Dec 28, 2003)

Howard is overrated. They always make excuses of why he doesnt put up monster numbers. I have an answer, maybe he isnt as good as people hype him to be. I think Al Jefferson is number one in the class. I would rate Telfair ahead of Howard b/c he can dominate a game unlike Howard. One "expert" said Howard still manged 23 despite being double and triple teamed. If you came to Al Jefferson's game, you would see him go for atleast 35 while being doubled and tripled.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>sonny22</b>!
> Howard is overrated. They always make excuses of why he doesnt put up monster numbers. I have an answer, maybe he isnt as good as people hype him to be. I think Al Jefferson is number one in the class. I would rate Telfair ahead of Howard b/c he can dominate a game unlike Howard. One "expert" said Howard still manged 23 despite being double and triple teamed. If you came to Al Jefferson's game, you would see him go for atleast 35 while being doubled and tripled.


Everything you said is true but you didnt mention that Al Jefferson doesnt pass worth anything and He has no range outside of 8 feet. Also using Howard still scoring 23 while Jefferson scoring at least 35 while being double and triple teamed isnt something that holds any weight in an argument


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## MagnusPinus (Aug 27, 2003)

i couldn't see him... I won't able to see him till he goes to the Nba... but tell me.. does he remind u Kwame? Or has a different type of game..?


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## BagFullOTreez (Apr 6, 2003)

Are you serious? Have you ever seen Big Al Jefferson play! He has range out to the High School 3 easy. He is a Manimal bro. Make sure you make an educated post next time.http://www.bigalj.com/player_3.html


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BagFullOTreez</b>!
> Are you serious? Have you ever seen Big Al Jefferson play! He has range out to the High School 3 easy. He is a Manimal bro. Make sure you make an educated post next time.http://www.bigalj.com/player_3.html


No sir you are mis informed. Just because a player has hit one or 2 3's doesnt mean he has that kind of range. You do realize that website is strictly for hype purposes. If you seriously watch him he doesnt have that range. He cant consistently knock it down. So sorry to disappoint but your post was actually uneducated and if you search Al Jefferson's name you will find I posted a very detailed scouting report on him at the end of his 11th grade year.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>knickstorm</b>!
> 
> 
> if your so friggan good peopel think you can go #1, and you cant win against the best HS teams how are you supposed to help beat the pro's in the near future?? If LeBron 's hs team went 1-15 then you would've known he couldnt be that great. OF course HS games tell you a lot about the player, why else do scouts attend?? we know telfair can play under pressure, through injury. He's a floorleader and motivates his teammates much like LeBron did. Howard is a different story. While TElfair is tlaking to his teammates on the floor on where to go, how to play, and telling them what they need to do to help win the game, howard's just standing there telling his teammates the throw the ball higher so he can alley oop it. Granted Telfair is a PG, i would like to see more leadership qualities in howard, or else he might just be another very good player with a yao ming attitude


While proving you are a clutch player or a team laeder doesnt mean you win every game. Eventhough he is the #1 player in the nation, that doesnt mean his team is going to win every game. 

Another great example of this is Al Jefferson. He is avg. 40 point per game, yet his team is not ranked. I dont know what his teams record is now, but last time i check they were 11-6. His season low in points is 29.

Dwight puts up KG numbers with Jason Kidd assists and Yao Ming blocks. The kid can play, he is no doubt the #1 player in the nation and will be a top3 pick for sure. It is almost a gurantee he will be the #1 overall pick in the draft. 

Oh yeah he lost to the #3 team in New York. Are the scouts going to remember who he lost to, or how he performed?


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## rynobot (Oct 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> No sir you are mis informed. Just because a player has hit one or 2 3's doesnt mean he has that kind of range. You do realize that website is strictly for hype purposes. If you seriously watch him he doesnt have that range. He cant consistently knock it down. So sorry to disappoint but your post was actually uneducated and if you search Al Jefferson's name you will find I posted a very detailed scouting report on him at the end of his 11th grade year.


can you post a link of your Jefferson Scouting report. I tried looking for it and could not find it.


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Kmasonbx</b>!
> There are players who just aren't leaders, that doesn't mean you aren't a great basketball player. LeBron's team went undefeated last year because they had 3 other division 1 players on that team, it wasn't just LeBron and a bunch of stiffs. There is no other division 1 senior on that team, while Javaris Critterton is certainly a division 1 prospect he is only a Sophomore.
> 
> Howard's team has 2 losses, not like they are losing left and right.


Come on now lebrons other d1 mates went to the local university of Akron to play ball which is hardly a powerhouse. Without lebron they almost lost to a local team in Akron when he served that game suspension. Without LeBron they most likely wouldnt have made it to state much less become the nations top team. Although his teamates weren’t/t stiffs they certainly were not top caliber players.


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## knickstorm (Jun 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TucsonClip</b>!
> 
> 
> While proving you are a clutch player or a team laeder doesnt mean you win every game. Eventhough he is the #1 player in the nation, that doesnt mean his team is going to win every game.
> ...


how is friggan AL Jefferson is great example?? now if his team blows and he's still a top pick then it'll work, but right now his team is only 11-6 according to you and his name is nowhere to be found in the mock draft right now. Of course the scouts aren't going to remember 1 FRIGGAN GAME that Howard lost, probably cuz the only they take out that game is telfair. But if you bothered to look at the topic it said he lsot AGAIN, i guarantee you if howard loses over and over to other top hs teams, it will stick in the scouts minds. No scout will remember what he performed w/o using his height over the smaller players. I wanna see howard show me some of his post moves, i wanna see his jumper. I dont want to see him catch and dunk and shoot ft's over and over and over again. I dont care what kind of kidd, ming, kg numbers Howard puts up, it's all worthless if he cant win the game. Bottom line is at this moment, I dont see how Howard no matter how talented he is, has the ability to make those around him better. sure in HS they are forced to double team him so he can kick it out, but in the NBA he's not gonna get double teamed, Amare proved he can ball and he doesnt get double coverage. Bottom line is Telfair outplayed Howard and that shouldnt friggan happen when your bestowed the #1 pick in the 2004 draft. YOu cant compare Howard to KG cuz he doesnt have that emotion and desire that KG shows, he doesnt improve his team like KIdd does so you might as well just say he gets jamaal tinsley assists #'s rather than kidd. Howard averaged 2 assists a game last year, how in the world is that supposed to be like JKidd?


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rynobot</b>!
> 
> 
> can you post a link of your Jefferson Scouting report. I tried looking for it and could not find it.


I cant either Ryno. When I get my notebook fixed I will repost it. Its on there


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## sonny22 (Dec 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> No sir you are mis informed. Just because a player has hit one or 2 3's doesnt mean he has that kind of range. You do realize that website is strictly for hype purposes. If you seriously watch him he doesnt have that range. He cant consistently knock it down. So sorry to disappoint but your post was actually uneducated and if you search Al Jefferson's name you will find I posted a very detailed scouting report on him at the end of his 11th grade year.



Where is this scouting report? The only reason I keep screaming about Big Al is b/c its sad how they do him. Imagine everyone hyping Deng last year when he is clearly noy as good as Lebrom. Its amazing how when Lebron was on TV in the potlight, ge rose to the occasion. The same occured when Telfair was on TV. But whjen Howard plays on TV, there are mixed reactions and he play a sub par game. If you think about it, he hit all his averages in that game so that was what he usually does. He just isnt capable of of doing much more. Also Al's team is horrible. No fundamentals what so ever. They werent even on the map until Al led them to a state championship.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>sonny22</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> Where is this scouting report? The only reason I keep screaming about Big Al is b/c its sad how they do him. Imagine everyone hyping Deng last year when he is clearly noy as good as Lebrom. Its amazing how when Lebron was on TV in the potlight, ge rose to the occasion. The same occured when Telfair was on TV. But whjen Howard plays on TV, there are mixed reactions and he play a sub par game. If you think about it, he hit all his averages in that game so that was what he usually does. He just isnt capable of of doing much more. Also Al's team is horrible. No fundamentals what so ever. They werent even on the map until Al led them to a state championship.


Please read the post above yours


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>knickstorm</b>!
> 
> 
> how is friggan AL Jefferson is great example?? now if his team blows and he's still a top pick then it'll work, but right now his team is only 11-6 according to you and his name is nowhere to be found in the mock draft right now. Of course the scouts aren't going to remember 1 FRIGGAN GAME that Howard lost, probably cuz the only they take out that game is telfair. But if you bothered to look at the topic it said he lsot AGAIN, i guarantee you if howard loses over and over to other top hs teams, it will stick in the scouts minds. No scout will remember what he performed w/o using his height over the smaller players. I wanna see howard show me some of his post moves, i wanna see his jumper. I dont want to see him catch and dunk and shoot ft's over and over and over again. I dont care what kind of kidd, ming, kg numbers Howard puts up, it's all worthless if he cant win the game. Bottom line is at this moment, I dont see how Howard no matter how talented he is, has the ability to make those around him better. sure in HS they are forced to double team him so he can kick it out, but in the NBA he's not gonna get double teamed, Amare proved he can ball and he doesnt get double coverage. Bottom line is Telfair outplayed Howard and that shouldnt friggan happen when your bestowed the #1 pick in the 2004 draft. YOu cant compare Howard to KG cuz he doesnt have that emotion and desire that KG shows, he doesnt improve his team like KIdd does so you might as well just say he gets jamaal tinsley assists #'s rather than kidd. Howard averaged 2 assists a game last year, how in the world is that supposed to be like JKidd?


Al Jefferson, because he is the 6th best prospect in the NATION. he is totaly carring his team, but they still can get as many wins as they should. 

The topic did say lost AGAIN, but people are saying he wont be a top 3 pick jsut because his team doesnt win x amount of games. There are better teams out there with 1 2 puches that are unreal. How about Joe Crawford and Malik Hariston. they are one of the best duos in the nation and are only ranked 3rd in the state.

Quote from hoopsworld.com
" Southwest Atlanta Christian Academy’s standout senior is being compared to Kevin Garnett because of his massive size and frame, but it’s his shooting touch that is really drawing the cheers. Howard is averaging better than 27 points, 18 rebounds, and eight blocks a game. Truly a man among boys. The one thing most people do not know about Howard is he is devotedly religious; with a very strong family background guiding him."

How many centers lead fast breaks in hs? He did it numerous times this season.


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## sonny22 (Dec 28, 2003)

> How many centers lead fast breaks in hs? He did it numerous times this season.


Al Jefferson is a power forward, but he can stiill lead the break. Read this article and see for yourself.

http://www.hattiesburgamerican.com/news/stories/20040121/localsports/269716.html


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>sonny22</b>!
> 
> 
> Al Jefferson is a power forward, but he can stiill lead the break. Read this article and see for yourself.
> ...


I am not knocking Al Jefferson at all. He will be in the league eventually. Sooner than later as a matter of fact, but you are showing anything that is or would convince anyone that hes better than Howard on top of the fact that you havent mentioned the high school's division he is in is not that great as far as potential College D1 players


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## sonny22 (Dec 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BEEZ</b>!
> 
> 
> I am not knocking Al Jefferson at all. He will be in the league eventually. Sooner than later as a matter of fact, but you are showing anything that is or would convince anyone that hes better than Howard on top of the fact that you havent mentioned the high school's division he is in is not that great as far as potential College D1 players


I was just replying to he guy who asked, how many centers have you seen lead the break. Im not trying to convince anyome that he is better than Howard. Everyone has there own opinion. Plus it doesnt matter who he is playing against b/c he dominated the summer circuit also.


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## Amareca (Oct 21, 2002)

Ndudi Ebi dominated Jefferson a year or 2 ago.


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## sonny22 (Dec 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>BigAmare</b>!
> Ndudi Ebi dominated Jefferson a year or 2 ago.



Are you sure about that? They met twice last year. One time Jefferson scored 23 to Ebi's 6. The Second time Jefferson 22, Ebi 24. I dont think you can say he was diominated. Read away. I dont know why people wish to downgrade this young man. 



AT THE MDC: JEFFERSON PROPELS TIGERS
By Eric Bossi 
[email protected] 
May 26, 2002 

BLOOMINGTON, Ind. -- Last week we profiled the Jackson (MS) Tigers squad that would be playing up in the 17-U Division at the MDC. The Tigers spent their day testing their mettle and the early results had many observers roaring with approval. 

The Tigers are deep with talent and size at virtually every position, but the real star of the show is Prentiss (MS) High sophomore big man Al Jefferson. Playing up an age group, Jefferson was still a man among boys, turning in some truly incredible performances. 

The 6-8 man-child got things rolling early during the Tigers early morning 82-64 romp over Indiana Select. By getting it rolling, we mean stepping on to the court for an 8:30 am tip and dropping a scintillating 36 points and 11 rebounds. He dunked, he shot turn around jumpers, and he even put the ball on the floor a little bit in displaying an incredibly complex skill set for a young bull. 

Not satisfied with that performance, Jefferson came up big again late Saturday night in a loss suffered at the hands of the high powered Houston Hoops in a highly anticipated game. While a eagerly awaited personal showdown with super BF Ndi Ebi never materialized -- Ebi fouled out on a silly reach in and ensuing tech for flapping his gums a little too much after scoring only six points -- Jefferson failed to disappoint for the second time. 

All Jefferson did in the night cap was go for 23 points and corral 19 rebounds. Even more important, he continually came up big during crunch time as the Tigers staged a furious late comeback before ultimately falling to the Hoops 80-73. Speaking of the Hoops……. 








AT THE PEACH JAM: JEFFERSON VS. EBI, TAKE TWO
By Rob Harrington and Jeff Markman 
[email protected] 
July 15, 2002 

NORTH AUGUSTA, S.C. -- On the first morning of the Nike Peach Jam, one game stood out from the rest on the schedule: outstanding 2003 forward Ndudi Ebi's Houston Hoops versus beastly 2004 big man Al Jefferson and his Jackson Tigers. 

The two superstars met in May at the Memorial Day Classic and fought to an epic battle in front of the Bloomington crowd. The sequel promised to bring more of the same intense, rim-shaking, shot-swatting action. 

Jefferson's Tigers jumped out to an early lead with talented MS PG Charles White setting the tone with drive-and-dish penetration, combo forwards Charles Thomas and Charles Rhodes cleaning the glass. 

Ebi led the way for his squad, filling every column on the stat sheet with 24 points, 11 rebounds, six blocks (including some nasty swats) and five steals before fouling out late in the game, but the Tigers managed to hold their lead deep into the second half. 

Soon enough, though, elite Hoops WG Daniel Gibson broke out of his pass-first point mentality that dominated his first half play with a roar, scoring seven points in about 30 seconds to bring Houston back. PG/WG Tack Minor bullied his way to the basket and hit outside shots to help build Houston's first lead of the game. But the Tigers were far from finished… 

The boys from Jackson turned up the pressure and fought their way back to a three-point deficit with under 30 seconds remaining, but missed three shots on their last possession with a chance to tie. Somehow, though, the ball caromed into Jefferson's big hands, which hoisted a prayer from three point land—and caught nothing but the bottom of the net. 

However, Houston wasn't going to bow out quietly. Gibson and Minor took over in Ebi's absence in overtime and held off another Jackson run to win the game as the Tigers failed to get Jefferson the necessary touches in the extra period. 

Jefferson finished with 22 points, 12 rebounds and two blocks, and WF Robert Clark, Jr, added 16, in the loss. Minor had 15 and Gibson 12 for Houston. Also notable was relatively unknown Hoops BF Justin Benson, who did an admirable job defending Jefferson in the paint for most of the game.


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## knickstorm (Jun 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TucsonClip</b>!
> 
> 
> Al Jefferson, because he is the 6th best prospect in the NATION. he is totaly carring his team, but they still can get as many wins as they should.
> ...


really? how come i aint see him lead fast breaks on tv either time he faced quality teams? WHy would you even need your center to lead a fast break?? sure that makes him more versatile, but what team desperately needs that? none, the fact that joe schmoe malike whatever are only 3rd ranked in state just goes to show they're not as good as you say they are, or else why aren't they ranked higher?? local league reps trying to hold them down???? I'd be more impressed if people not only carried the teams, but helped everyone on the court pick up their game. Dwight hasnt shown that, and i'm guessing neither has jefferson which is why his team loses so much. not sure what your whole better teams out there argument is about.


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## Kmasonbx (Apr 7, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>knickstorm</b>!
> 
> 
> really? how come i aint see him lead fast breaks on tv either time he faced quality teams? WHy would you even need your center to lead a fast break?? sure that makes him more versatile, but what team desperately needs that? none, the fact that joe schmoe malike whatever are only 3rd ranked in state just goes to show they're not as good as you say they are, or else why aren't they ranked higher?? local league reps trying to hold them down???? I'd be more impressed if people not only carried the teams, but helped everyone on the court pick up their game. Dwight hasnt shown that, and i'm guessing neither has jefferson which is why his team loses so much. not sure what your whole better teams out there argument is about.


Your Argument is very weak, because somebody doesn't win all their games they aren't that good? They have lost 2 games this season, they both just happened to be on tv. So I guess Brian Johnson is a better pro prospect because Oak Hill is undefeated. I guess Sebastian isn't that great because his team lost 2 games while he was playing. 

There isn't another player on Dwight's team that would be a good division 1 players next year, so why is it expected that they win every game? A big man needs someone to get him the ball, and when teams double and triple team him, when he passes out for the 3 he needs his teammates to make the shot. If those things don't happen it isn't his fault when they lose.


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## knickstorm (Jun 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Kmasonbx</b>!
> 
> 
> Your Argument is very weak, because somebody doesn't win all their games they aren't that good? They have lost 2 games this season, they both just happened to be on tv. So I guess Brian Johnson is a better pro prospect because Oak Hill is undefeated. I guess Sebastian isn't that great because his team lost 2 games while he was playing.
> ...


who in the world taught you how to read? where did i say he has to win all his games??? you just jumped to your own conclusion, lol you telling me he lost 2 games and they just "happened" to be on tv?? like it was chance??? hellz no, he played better teams and thats the reason they lost. I never explicitly or implicitly said that if you dont win all your games your not that good, i just said if you dont win big games then it makes you look worse off. I never said cuz dwight lost so he stinks, i said he lost, so i dont believe from what i saw he still deserves to be #1 overall pick. Hellz yea because oak hill is undefeated it would make Brian Johnson a better prospect than if oak hill was a 500 team. LeBron had nobody who would be a good D1 player next year either, neither did randolph morris or Sebastian TElfair and they both beat howards team what do you have to say to that??? Its not how many times you lose, its when and against who. 
ohhh please dont put this on howards teammates cuz he fouled himself out against morris, and how did telfair get so many layups and set up so many other people for layups when howard is supposed to control the paint??? whose fault is that??? Shaq gets triple, double teamed he still dominates theres no reason why howard cant at the hs level. Lincoln had nobody to match up with howard and yet he still got bottled up by their zone, and his teammates hit a helluva lot of 3's.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

Joe Crawford and Malik Hariston are top 25 recruits in the nation. Both are candidates to play in the McD. AA game. Now if their teams' ranking and winning games meant so much to people, why would they be top 25 recruits, or even be in the AA game?

Fact of the matter is, it doesnt matter how many games you win in HS. Sure its going to help if your team is undefeated or top 25 ranked. 

Here is an example..

Arizona bound Jawaan McClellan, is leading his undefeated team in the state of Texas in almost all catagories. Yet he isnt considered a top 25 recruit by most experts. His team is beating some of the best teams in Texas, yet he still gets no love for winning. His coach also said that if it werent for Jawaan, they would be lucky to be a .500 team, because of what Jawaan does for the team.


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## Kmasonbx (Apr 7, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>knickstorm</b>!
> 
> 
> who in the world taught you how to read? where did i say he has to win all his games??? you just jumped to your own conclusion, lol you telling me he lost 2 games and they just "happened" to be on tv?? like it was chance??? hellz no, he played better teams and thats the reason they lost. I never explicitly or implicitly said that if you dont win all your games your not that good, i just said if you dont win big games then it makes you look worse off. I never said cuz dwight lost so he stinks, i said he lost, so i dont believe from what i saw he still deserves to be #1 overall pick. Hellz yea because oak hill is undefeated it would make Brian Johnson a better prospect than if oak hill was a 500 team. LeBron had nobody who would be a good D1 player next year either, neither did randolph morris or Sebastian TElfair and they both beat howards team what do you have to say to that??? Its not how many times you lose, its when and against who.
> ohhh please dont put this on howards teammates cuz he fouled himself out against morris, and how did telfair get so many layups and set up so many other people for layups when howard is supposed to control the paint??? whose fault is that??? Shaq gets triple, double teamed he still dominates theres no reason why howard cant at the hs level. Lincoln had nobody to match up with howard and yet he still got bottled up by their zone, and his teammates hit a helluva lot of 3's.


On that St. Mary's team two other players, Romeo Travis and Dru Joyce are playing division 1 basketball this year. Lincoln has 3 other players who are going to be division 1 players. Eugene Lawrence is getting mid major looks, Antonio Pena is considered a top 75 player in the nation, and is getting major looks, and Nyan Boateng is being recruited to play both football and basketball on the division 1 level, so you argument about them having no divison 1 players is way off. 

Dwight Howard's team beat Randolp Morris team the first they played, and they one the Slam Dunk to the Beach which is the most prestigious post christmas tournament there is. Going into that tournament they weren't considered anywhere near the favorites, and even after the best team in it got upset SACA still wasn't the favored and yet they won it. 

By saying that you aren't saying he has to win all of his games to be the 1st pick and then say because he lost 2 games on TV (the only 2 he lost) he shouldn't be the #1, you are contradicting yourself. Why should Emeka Okafor be the #1 pick if UCONN has 4 losses? So lets make Josh Smith the #1 pick because Oak Hill undefeate, or maybe Josh Childress of Stanford or Jameer Nelson I guess because they win all their games and are the star players they definitely should be drafted higher than somebody 6'11, 230 pounds, who can handle the ball and is very athletic, what the hell was I thinking?


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## Coach Toons (Feb 15, 2004)

*Videos*

Hi all!!

I´m reading what you say about this high schoolers and i would really like to see them play.

If you have some of his games this years on video and want to trade for videos of european prospects or oak hill ones, or european players when they were younger, please write to [email protected]

I´m very interested, thank you!


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## hogfan (Dec 27, 2003)

FIW, here is an great article on Big Al that came out today.

Big Al


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## knickstorm (Jun 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Kmasonbx</b>!
> 
> 
> On that St. Mary's team two other players, Romeo Travis and Dru Joyce are playing division 1 basketball this year. Lincoln has 3 other players who are going to be division 1 players. Eugene Lawrence is getting mid major looks, Antonio Pena is considered a top 75 player in the nation, and is getting major looks, and Nyan Boateng is being recruited to play both football and basketball on the division 1 level, so you argument about them having no divison 1 players is way off.
> ...


whoa whoa please read the guys post again, he said they didnt have any "good D1 players" now i know travis and joyce are in AKron, but have you seen their stats? they are d1 players, but nowhere near "good d1 players" as the guys. Please, Eugene Lawrence isnt getting any looks from any quality d1 team, he's been a disappointment to tiny morton. Furthermore he said "HOWARD HAS NOBODY THAT WILL BE A GOOD D1 PLAYER NEXT YEAR" i simply countered that it applies to telfair too. Geez thanks for pointing out the obvious with boateng and pena, but you forgot somethign, they wont be good d1 players next year cuz they aint seniors. Dwight has some top sophomore prospect on his team but the guy knew that, that is why he phrased it "top d1 player NEXT YEAR". SO your agument is way off cuz you didnt even bother to figure out the qualifications. Jesus christ, will you read the entire thread before throwing out these stupid comments. I said its not just how many he loses, but when and how he loses. Yea if UCONN continues to lose and gets bounced out of the tourney 1st round, its gonna lower his draft status in some of the gm's eyes. IF CArmelo Anthony got bounced out of the NCAA tournament in the first round would he still be #3 overall?? i doubt it. I never said explicity "you gotta win all your games to be a top pick" its just quick thinkers who assumed i did. OF course winning and going undefeating is going to boost your draft status. Look where Jammer Nelson is projected to go......now if SJU had a 500 record you think he'll still be projected to go at that spot? why dont you answer me that before throwing anymore irrelevant comments into the thread.


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## Kmasonbx (Apr 7, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>knickstorm</b>!
> 
> 
> whoa whoa please read the guys post again, he said they didnt have any "good D1 players" now i know travis and joyce are in AKron, but have you seen their stats? they are d1 players, but nowhere near "good d1 players" as the guys. Please, Eugene Lawrence isnt getting any looks from any quality d1 team, he's been a disappointment to tiny morton. Furthermore he said "HOWARD HAS NOBODY THAT WILL BE A GOOD D1 PLAYER NEXT YEAR" i simply countered that it applies to telfair too. Geez thanks for pointing out the obvious with boateng and pena, but you forgot somethign, they wont be good d1 players next year cuz they aint seniors. Dwight has some top sophomore prospect on his team but the guy knew that, that is why he phrased it "top d1 player NEXT YEAR". SO your agument is way off cuz you didnt even bother to figure out the qualifications. Jesus christ, will you read the entire thread before throwing out these stupid comments. I said its not just how many he loses, but when and how he loses. Yea if UCONN continues to lose and gets bounced out of the tourney 1st round, its gonna lower his draft status in some of the gm's eyes. IF CArmelo Anthony got bounced out of the NCAA tournament in the first round would he still be #3 overall?? i doubt it. I never said explicity "you gotta win all your games to be a top pick" its just quick thinkers who assumed i did. OF course winning and going undefeating is going to boost your draft status. Look where Jammer Nelson is projected to go......now if SJU had a 500 record you think he'll still be projected to go at that spot? why dont you answer me that before throwing anymore irrelevant comments into the thread.


I was the one that made the comments about no good D1 players next year, I was including current juniors on that list. Carmelo would've still went #3 don't be fooled. How do you explain Chris Bosh going 4th? Did Georgia Tech get out the 1st round last year? If St. Joe's had a 500 record Jameer Nelson wouldn't be the player he is. If the Bulls didn't win 6 championships Jordan wouldn't be considered the greatest player ever, because he simply wouldn't have been as good as he was. You can't just say if a guys team didn't win so much would they be considered what they are, because the chances are if the team didn't win so much that player wouldn't be as good as he really is. 

Jameer Nelson was the freshman of the year, so it's not like he just recently popped on to the national scene, he would still be known, let's say if Delonte West didn't go there, and they did struggle some.


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## knickstorm (Jun 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Kmasonbx</b>!
> 
> 
> I was the one that made the comments about no good D1 players next year, I was including current juniors on that list. Carmelo would've still went #3 don't be fooled. How do you explain Chris Bosh going 4th? Did Georgia Tech get out the 1st round last year? If St. Joe's had a 500 record Jameer Nelson wouldn't be the player he is. If the Bulls didn't win 6 championships Jordan wouldn't be considered the greatest player ever, because he simply wouldn't have been as good as he was. You can't just say if a guys team didn't win so much would they be considered what they are, because the chances are if the team didn't win so much that player wouldn't be as good as he really is.
> ...


so basically your friggan agreeing with me that if dwight keeps losing these games, then he's not the same #1overall type player that everyone thinks he is. WEll if you meant good D1 players next year, i didnt know that would count jrs, and if you count jrs, then you gotta count soph's who will be good d1 players, and Dwight does have one of those on his team. BAsically since dwight isnt winning these big games, i dont think that he's the player that he is. Bosh went #4 cuz Toronto needed a big man, if they didnt have VC they easily could have taken wade. If Bosh had led his team to NCAA title, theres no doubt in my mind detroit would have taken him. In short, if dwight howard is the player that everyone says he is, why isnt he winning any of these prime time games?


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