# OT: Kobe and Shaq...again



## trifecta (Oct 10, 2002)

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=stein_marc&id=1647603

For some reason it just makes me warm all over! Of course it's much too early. I'd really appreciate this sometime in March.

(Sorry if this was already posted)


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>trifecta</b>!
> For some reason it just makes me warm all over! Of course it's much too early. I'd really appreciate this sometime in March.
> (Sorry if this was already posted)


Thanks, I get the same feeling you do! But now is a good time for this - as the Lakers showed last year, a crappy start to the year is a lasting gift to the rest of the league...

barfo


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## Public Defender (May 5, 2003)

*My question...*

... how much of this is the fact that Kobe's out of shape, how much of it is Kobe declaring that he's going to opt out of his contract at the end of the season, and how much of it is that Kobe will have to face a trial for sexual assault? 

I realize that Shaq's comments are directed primarily at the fact that Kobe's not in shape - but in the past, that's been true and it hasn't been a major big deal. I think the offcourt stuff - the trial and Kobe's public intention of testing the market - are more of what's going on. It's that, and Shaq trying to make sure everyone (especially Gary, Karl and _Kobe_) knows who the 340-pound alpha male is.

Part of me has to laugh at these overgrown teenagers, but part of me would like to see them settle their differences and show whether or not they have the makings of a championship team...


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

*Re: My question...*



> Originally posted by <b>Public Defender</b>!
> I realize that Shaq's comments are directed primarily at the fact that Kobe's not in shape - but in the past, that's been true and it hasn't been a major big deal.


Especially since, in the past, it has mostly been true of Shaq.



> part of me would like to see them settle their differences and show whether or not they have the makings of a championship team...


Part of me would like to see the 'or not'. The other part of me would be happy if they continue fighting. No part of me wants them to show they do have the makings of a championship team.

barfo


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## CatchNRelease (Jan 2, 2003)

*Ya Just Gotta Love It!*

Seems like, if Shaq wants this to be his team, he could have been man enough to handle this one on one with Kobe.

I can imagine the looks on GP's & the Mailman's faces when they heard the news. :nonono: :krazy:  

PJax better whip some of that Zen shinzt on those two before things get out of hand.

OOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMmmmmmm...............:meditate: 

Go Blazers


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## antibody (Apr 4, 2003)

Shaq is just being Shaq. I'm not shocked to hear anything from him anymore. He just doesn't care one way or the other. He will say what he wants and when he wants.


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

why on earth did Payton and Malone settle on LA? they could've avoided all the egos and controversy, and been more key contributors, if they'd angled to get on a team like the Spurs or T-Wolves.

just imagine:
PG: Cassel
SG: Payton
SF: Garnett
PF: Malone
C: Kandi

or

PG: Parker
SG: Payton
SF: Turkoglu
PF: Malone
C: Duncan

*sigh*


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

lets make a deal for kobe


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## s a b a s 11 (Dec 31, 2002)

*"then opt out..."*

Yikes.. this sounds pretty serious... Shaq daring him to "opt out" that actually is pretty funny.

Watching two of the preseason games that Kobe played (in which the Lakers ended up losing) Kobe was forcing shots, seemingly trying to force the issue and then not getting back on defense. He shot a combined 7-24 in two games. Hate to say it, Shaq has a point. 

Anyways, isn't this the same issue they had when Kobe started coming up? Kobe breaking the offense and taking horrible shots?

BTW, hilarious avatar Wank...

Stuart


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## Talkhard (May 13, 2003)

It's pretty simple. Shaq knows the Lakers won't win a championship unless they share the ball. Kobe doesn't want to share the ball. Shaq is sending a shot across Kobe's bow before the season starts: Share the ball or else!


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

kobe's retort was classic: "tell Shaq to worry about the post and I'll worry about the perimeter" LOL. 

just glad its them and not us.


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

team termoil the lakers


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## jackiejackal (Nov 7, 2002)

*could it be because they both looked*

hooooooorible in preseason?
neither looked ready to start..
or ready to throw stones.

I don't like any one player to say it's his team either..
his team??
the very idea of it makes me sick.

This is a team sport.
that's the beauty of it.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

*Re: "then opt out..."*



> Originally posted by <b>s a b a s 11</b>!
> Yikes.. this sounds pretty serious... Shaq daring him to "opt out" that actually is pretty funny.


Not too much of a dare, though...Kobe has already said he plans to opt out and test the free agent market.

Boy...if LA loses him...I really hope they extend Shaq till Doomsday. They won't have any money to build a real powerhouse.


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## s a b a s 11 (Dec 31, 2002)

*Re: Re: "then opt out..."*



> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> Not too much of a dare, though...Kobe has already said he plans to opt out and test the free agent market.


Yeah, but when Shaq dared him to opt out, it was like "my way or the high way" kind of thing.

There is a little added asterick, now, when Kobe does opt out. I think most would believe that he would resign with the Lakers only testing the market to get more money in the end. 

With this little spat and how the Lakers (both the players and management) respond to it, I believe there is a higher chance that Kobe may leave LA.

Stuart


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## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

I think there's a better-than-even chance that this is just orchestrated by Kobe and Shaq to distract the media from asking more painful questions about Kobe... or about the amount of pressure four future HoF'ers feel heading into the season.

I hope that it's legit, and that it messes up the team, but I wouldn't bet that way.

Ed O.


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## Terrible (Jan 3, 2003)

You're right Ed, what would you rather answer at Laker camp:

So are you going to opt out of your contract Kobe after what Shaq said?

OR:

How does it feel to know you could spend the rest of your 20's in prison for rape?

A good team drama makes for an easier set of questions one might think.


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

there's more from kObe today, he said that (paraphrase) "If Shaq is the leader of the team its time he started acting like it and not show up to camp fat and out of shape when all the rest of the guys are depending on him to be a leader."


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

Ed is 100% right. Jedi Knight is just telling Shaq to say certain things to do a couple things.

1: remove the bullseye on Kobe, to Shaq.

2: make everyone think that there are problems within the Lakers, so the next title will be "that much better"

3: toy with the media and fans because they pretty much are being played and no one understands it.

4: attention grabbing whiner.


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## trifecta (Oct 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Ed O</b>!
> I think there's a better-than-even chance that this is just orchestrated by Kobe and Shaq to distract the media from asking more painful questions about Kobe... or about the amount of pressure four future HoF'ers feel heading into the season.
> 
> I hope that it's legit, and that it messes up the team, but I wouldn't bet that way.
> ...


That's a good point Ed.

Given the common knowledge of PJ's methodology and his current lack of comment it's a decent possibility.


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## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

To further support my hypothesis, I remember seeing Shaq recently saying that he and Kobe never really had any issues in the past... when they were arguing in the press it was just to feed the media. Of course he MIGHT have been fibbing then, and just trying to downplay true issues in the past, but I find it more likely that they're going back to the same well and everyone's lapping it up.

It's kinda like the running "feud" that jackie jackal and I have... we're actually really good buds and we crack up over all of the publicity our combative ways receive.

Ed O.


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## s a b a s 11 (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Ed O</b>!
> I think there's a better-than-even chance that this is just orchestrated by Kobe and Shaq to distract the media from asking more painful questions about Kobe... or about the amount of pressure four future HoF'ers feel heading into the season.
> 
> I hope that it's legit, and that it messes up the team, but I wouldn't bet that way.
> ...


The create-a-diversion-thought actually flew through my head... what are the chances that this is a setup on the Laker powers that be? Kobe did say a lot of disparaging things... things that would point to not being a diversionary tactic.

I don't know....

Stuart


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## loyalty4life (Sep 17, 2002)

Ed, you are a smart man... Good thinking.


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

Has anyone seen Kobe's new quotes? 



> He did receive phone calls, Bryant said, from other teammates and team officials, other teams' players and coaches, from Michael Jordan, Tiger Woods, even O'Neal's uncle.
> 
> ``But yet from my so-called big brother (O'Neal), I heard nothing,'' Bryant said.





> The latest in a series of feuds between the two flared over the weekend when O'Neal said Bryant needs to be more of a team player.
> 
> ``That's ridiculous. I have been successfully sacrificing my game for years for Shaq,'' Bryant said Monday. ``That's what Phil wanted me to do, so I did it. Last year, Phil told me Shaq was not in physical condition to carry the thrust of our offense, so he asked me to do it.
> 
> ``But then he saw Shaq was getting upset that the team wasn't running through him, so Phil asked me to pull back and I did. This year is no different. My role is whatever Phil wants it to be, period.''





> *O'Neal has said it's fine with him if Bryant leaves, adding the Lakers are his team.
> 
> ``It doesn't matter whose team it is. But this is his team, so it's time for him to act like it,'' Bryant told ESPN. ``That means no more coming into camp fat and out of shape, when your team is relying on your leadership on and off the court.
> 
> ``It also means no more blaming others for our team's failure, or blaming staff members for not over-dramatizing your injuries so that you avoid blame for your lack of conditioning. Also, `my team' doesn't mean only when we win, it means carrying the burden of defeat just as gracefully as you carry a championship trophy.''*


http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-feudinglakers&prov=ap&type=lgns


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## loyalty4life (Sep 17, 2002)

Those quotes that Epadfield posted made me believe even stronger that it's just a bunch of hogwash, trying to take the off-the-court issues with Kobe away and focuse the attention on Shaq. Why would they do this so early in the season, probably ruining their chances of cohesion and winning the championship? Simply put: They wouldn't. 

They lose two preseason games in a row, and all of a sudden the team is sinking faster than the Titanic? I don't believe that. Ed O is on the money with this. 

Perhaps if we see Kobe not passing Shaq the ball AT ALL on the court and we see Shaq and Kobe arguing on the court, then I might change my mind. Until then, I'm with Ed on this.


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## Storyteller (Dec 31, 2002)

Here's the quote that made my eyebrows jump when I heard these words on the ESPN broadcast tonight:



> ``I've played with IVs before, during and after games. I've played with a broken hand, a sprained ankle, a torn shoulder, a fractured tooth, a severed lip and a knee the size of a softball,'' he said.
> 
> ``I don't miss 15 games because of a toe injury that everybody knows wasn't that serious in the first place.''


I've thought about the 'conspiracy' idea, too. But something tells me that this is for real. My instincts say that some long-standing feelings are coming to the surface. 

Yes, if it's all a plot, then I'm a sucker. But I've got to follow my instincts.....


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

I think the "mind tricks" angle is given too much play. I don't think the massive attention given to *both* Shaq and Kobe, especially regarding Shaq's extension and Kobe's opt-out, is a good solution to take the attention *off* Kobe's legal issues.

Kobe's legal issues would naturally fade to the background until the next step in the proceedings. This type of saga will be rehashed over and over, all season long. When things don't go well, there will be a hundred articles that the team is being ripped apart.

I can't see a great strategy in creating/faking the most distracting type of controversy, teammate dispute, to take attention off something that will basically generate no news for months.


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## barfo (Jan 2, 2003)

Much as I love a conspiracy theory, it seems to me like Kobe, at least, really hates Shaq. Shaq may just think he (Shaq) is being cute. 

This is a nice karmic payback for Malone and Payton. They deserve this. Here's hoping it continues all year!

barfo


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## Goldmember (May 24, 2003)

If this thing is true, I would have to take Kobe's side. It's pretty weak of Shaq to take his complaints to the press instead of dealing with him man to man. Shaq coming out and _putting Kobe in his place_ like that in front of the nation is low. Shaq should have a little more appreciation and respect for what Kobe has done for him. It was Kobe who hit big shot after big shot in the biggest of games, while Shaq would get hacked because he can't shoot free throws. Shaq owes Kobe more than that, without him, Diesel may have never won a championship. I'm not saying Shaq isn't right about Kobe needing to play team ball more, but you don't handle it like that. 

I like that Kobe reminded Dumbo that he's not the coach, Phil is.


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

man, that interview opened my eyes to how much Kobe really can't stand Shaq. he said some things that were just too cold blooded and honest to put up to conspiracy.

frankly, Kobe comes off as the much more sympathetic character.


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## RG (Jan 1, 2003)

I really doubt this thing is staged. Think about it. The last thing someone who is accused of rape wants is to be viewed as a person who responds impulsively to emotional stimulus. If this is to distract from the trial, it's a mistake.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>RG</b>!
> I really doubt this thing is staged. Think about it. The last thing someone who is accused of rape wants is to be viewed as a person who responds impulsively to emotional stimulus. If this is to distract from the trial, it's a mistake.


wouldn't that kind of implied this thing IS staged?

He's being all calm and collected, and Shaq is going off..just like he did for their first 3 titles...but oddly enough, all things were quiet on the front last year, and they didn't.

So Jedi Master decided to spice things up a bit, and make all the lemmings think Kobe and Shaq hate each other, because he doens't have the distraction of a Dennis Rodman (read: a good healthy distraction, not criminal charges distraction) to take everyones mind off Kobe.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>barfo</b>!
> Much as I love a conspiracy theory, it seems to me like Kobe, at least, really hates Shaq. Shaq may just think he (Shaq) is being cute.
> 
> This is a nice karmic payback for Malone and Payton. They deserve this. Here's hoping it continues all year!
> ...


:yes: 

Hopefully than teams underestimate the Lakers going into the playoffs when Shaq and Kobe magically work things out and go 15-1 in the playoffs.

Deja vu. :uhoh: 

I think Shaq, Kobe and Phil are smarter than most of you people think.


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## Crazy Fan From Idaho (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Jemel Irief</b>!
> 
> I think Shaq, Kobe and Phil are smarter than most of you people think.


They'd have to be.


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## Im The One (Sep 1, 2002)

The cospiracy theory did run into my mind once.

But if they really never hade any problems would they of got into a (physical) fight in pratice a while back. Plus if Kobe was happy would he be opting out of his contract. If he loved playing there so much he would'nt. Also with all the things going on in Kobe's life and with the Lakers period do you really think they'd be doing all this. Why go through all this trouble to avoid questions. If someone ask him a question he doesnt want to answer, then he doesnt have to answer it. Neither one is dumb enough to think just because their doing this the questions about the rape case are just going to go away.


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## jackiejackal (Nov 7, 2002)

*The Laker email groups are going nuts*

:laugh: 

But on a serious side..
Here is the biggest reason I can't stand Malone..
Karl "doing his thing"elbowing
Maggette last night, chipping two of his teeth and injuring his nasal
passage. Maggette said "that was no accident," and Karl shrugged and
said rather wryly "Oh, was that me? Well you give a few and you take
a few."

He also said something about little guys don't have any business
in the paint..
I can't stand him..
Gary looked pretty glum in the news,oh this is joyous ! :grinning: 

Hey we could call their season "Clash Of The Ego's"


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

early prediction:

Karl Malone will be a lot dirtier this year because he has Shaq to back him up, and then he's going to play innocent and wonder why anyone is fighting back..blah blah blah..god I wish someone would return to him what he deserves.


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hap</b>!
> early prediction:
> 
> Karl Malone will be a lot dirtier this year because he has Shaq to back him up, and then he's going to play innocent and wonder why anyone is fighting back..blah blah blah..god I wish someone would return to him what he deserves.



if only we still had Brian Grant, one fo the few people I ever seen dish it back to Malone, and come out the winner.


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

by the way, the staged conspiracy angle is a joke. This is real, absolutely. This has been an ongoing problem for 5 years.


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## Masbee (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>theWanker</b>!
> man, that interview opened my eyes to how much Kobe really can't stand Shaq. he said some things that were just too cold blooded and honest to put up to conspiracy.
> 
> frankly, Kobe comes off as the much more sympathetic character.


I was just about to add this very thought, but you beat me to it.

After reading the Jim Gray interview of Kobe, I do not feel there is any merit to the conspiracy theory. Sorry, Ed O, your instincts were correct, but in this instance, the facts no longer support the theory. Kobe's comments are waaay too hurtful, and totally uneeded to do the job of distraction.

Kobe, among other insults, hurled one of the worst in the sports world "won't play through pain". In that macho world that cuts deep from a teammate.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Tommyboy</b>!
> by the way, the staged conspiracy angle is a joke. This is real, absolutely. This has been an ongoing problem for 5 years.


Yeah and they won titles in 3 of those years.

So it is either
a) staged
b) overblown


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Jemel Irief</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah and they won titles in 3 of those years.
> ...


or
c) both


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

or D) Reality


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## RG (Jan 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hap</b>!
> 
> 
> wouldn't that kind of implied this thing IS staged?
> ...


Calm and collected? He's acting like a child in a schoolyard game of dozens. Mark it down...this is no more staged than Damon is innocent.


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

another giant hole in this conspiracy to outwit the media and public is that it relies heavily on the acting ability of Shaq. to better understand the flaw in this theory, go watch Kazaam.

i think it's highly unlikely that Shaq is smarter than we think.


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## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>RG</b>!
> 
> Calm and collected? He's acting like a child in a schoolyard game of dozens.


Actually, you're wrong here according to the person who did the interview. I saw an interview with Jim Gray, and if he didn't use the exact words "calm and collected" he used a lot of synonyms for them. He said there was no anger in Kobe's voice and he sounded like he was being deliberate with what he was saying.

Now, this doesn't mean that Kobe's not being sincere, but I don't think that he's flying off the handle, either.

While I agree that much of what Kobe said was hurtful, I don't think that this discounts that this round of the feud is being orchestrated/staged. NOTHING that's been said about either player isn't exactly what that player's detractors have been saying for some time. It's too convenient, and it seems reasonable that the two of them had a discussion where they each said what they were going to criticize and that would get the media off of Kobe's back about important stuff and create a more familiar "us vs. them" atmosphere.

About Kobe opting out: I don't see that as a sign of unhappiness (although it's not inconsistent with unhappiness). I see it as a sign of wanting more money and more flexibility.

Who knows? We probably won't know for sure until/unless Kobe leaves the Lakers.

Ed O.


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## MJ23theGOAT (Jul 4, 2003)

Ok lets think about this. How did all this controversy start? Shaq stated that Kobe should pass the ball instead of shooting it until he gets his groove back....So if all you guys think this is orchestrated....Kobe intentionally went out and shot all those 26 shots in two preseason games so Shaq could intentionally make a remark about him and therefore rekindle the feud? No...This is foreal...and the Lakers are in trouble.


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## bfan1 (Mar 5, 2003)

*and so it grows...*

Kobe fined for his remarks.
Hmm...wonder how he feels about Shaq not getting fined as well?

LINK


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## RG (Jan 1, 2003)

Which is another reason to not buy into this staged theory.

Ed O, it's called passive aggresive. You don't have to fly off to engage in childish behavior.

I don't buy it, this isn't the freaking WWF ( or whatever it is).


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Tommyboy</b>!
> or D) Reality


What is reality? That the Lakers have won 3 titles with dramas like this that the media and Tommyboy seem to think is a big deal? Maybe they can't win without them? 

Deep down I start to feel for the Spurs. Will anyone ever pay attention to one of their titles?


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## Sean (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: and so it grows...*



> Originally posted by <b>bfan1</b>!
> Kobe fined for his remarks.
> Hmm...wonder how he feels about Shaq not getting fined as well?


Kobe was fined because his jim gray interview was done *after* the team was instructed not to comment anymore about the latest BS. He was not fined for the stuff he and shaq said prior.


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## bfan1 (Mar 5, 2003)

*Re: Re: and so it grows...*



> Originally posted by <b>Sean</b>!
> 
> 
> Kobe was fined because his jim gray interview was done *after* the team was instructed not to comment anymore about the latest BS. He was not fined for the stuff he and shaq said prior.


I see...BAD KOBE!


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Jemel Irief</b>!
> 
> 
> What is reality?


reality is they don't like each other, never have.



> That the Lakers have won 3 titles with dramas like this that the media and Tommyboy seem to think is a big deal?


anything like this IS a big deal. Heck I saw it on the front page in the news section on MSN.com this morning, lol. Its kobe and shaq, you can bury your head in the sand and try to pretend like its not a big deal but when the 2 biggest stars in the game, 1 of which is under indictment for rape (which is itself a big deal), and the other who is the biggest baddest big man of all time are sparring in the press, and this time unloading some really hurtful shots, its a big deal. Me personally, I think its funny and I'm glad its happening to you guys instead of us (meaning, Laker fans instead of Blazer fans...we've already had our share of drama...welcome to the club).



> Maybe they can't win without them?


maybe. maybe that's wishful thinking? maybe a lot of things...maybe monkeys might fly out of my butt at any second.



> Deep down I start to feel for the Spurs. Will anyone ever pay attention to one of their titles?


probably not unless they win like 3 or 4 in the next few years.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Tommyboy</b>!
> 
> 
> reality is they don't like each other, never have.


I don't care. All I care about is that they are effective on the court.




> anything like this IS a big deal. Heck I saw it on the front page in the news section on MSN.com this morning, lol. Its kobe and shaq, you can bury your head in the sand and try to pretend like its not a big deal but when the 2 biggest stars in the game, 1 of which is under indictment for rape (which is itself a big deal), and the other who is the biggest baddest big man of all time are sparring in the press, and this time unloading some really hurtful shots, its a big deal. Me personally, I think its funny and I'm glad its happening to you guys instead of us (meaning, Laker fans instead of Blazer fans...we've already had our share of drama...welcome to the club).


Were you around during the 2001 season?


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

yes I was, and that was a big deal then too. A lot of media attention, similar to now. What's your point? If your point is that they won a title anyhow, that still doesn't detract from the fact that its a big deal. Its news, and since it involves the two biggest names in the game, its big news. The end result of that season has nothing to do with the reality of the here and now. None of us knows what will happen come May/June anyhow. I'm talking about today. That's why I said D) Reality.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

Its news because the media wants to make it news, not neccesarly because it greatly harms the Lakers chances. Therefore I say its overblown.


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

good thing you don't determine for the rest of us what "news" is.

basically what you're saying is you don't like it so to you its not news. 


meanwhile the vast majority of casual and real sports fans find it compelling to watch the feud unravel in LA. Its pretty good entertainment. 

just because it doesn't fit your idea of what's newsworthy (based on your percieved homerism and guess that it doesn't impact potential) doesn't mean the broader population isn't interested in it. They are. That is why it was plastered all over the internet today (saw two threads about it on a fantasy football website LOL), that is why it was a main topic on Jim Rome and Dan Patrick, that is why it will be on eveyrones local news sports report, why it will be reported in the sports pages of the nations newspapers and why we are even talking about it right now.

anyhow, believe what you want Jamel, sorry to burst your bubble.


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## jackiejackal (Nov 7, 2002)

*QUITE INTERESTING*

">At one time I thought that if nothing else, his wife and her O.C. roots would keep him here, but considering the obvious problems in his marriage, I no longer feel as strongly about this. If he is acquitted, he may want to start all over in another city, who could blame him? 
>

You make an excellent point. Last week, Doug Krikorian (sports writer 
for the Long Beach Press Telegram and ESPN Radio personality) mentioned 
that he has spoken with someone he claims is very close to Vanessa 
(Kobe's wife). According to his source, there will be a divorce 
immediately following the conclusion of the trial. They are merely 
keeping up appearances. According to Krikorian, it's a done deal.

I usually don't put much stock in most 'rumors' I come across, but Doug 
Krikorian was the first to break the story that Malone would take a $17 
million pay cut to sign with LA for the veteran's minimum. [The story 
was published in the Long Beach Press Telegram in April or May. Well 
before the deadlines had passed that would allow potential free agents 
to even begin negotiating/entertaining offers.]"


Doug by the way has been around for a long time and is very well respected.
That was my home town newspaper..The Long Beach Press Telegram.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Tommyboy</b>!
> good thing you don't determine for the rest of us what "news" is.
> 
> basically what you're saying is you don't like it so to you its not news.
> ...


Again you misunderstand me. Because its news doesn't mean it harms the Lakers chances. It's news because it's compelling. Just like the news of Kobes tat that everyone seemed to care about (including this board). You seem to be stuck on convincing me that people care about this tabloid stuff when I obviously believe that they do, what I'm questioning is it's importance to the teams performance on the court.

You may call me a blind homer, but I witnessed this same news story in 2001 that turned out to be irrelevant. In fact the Lakers had the greatest postseason run in NBA history following that fued. Not to mention in the other two title years there were several other minor spats involving a combo of Rice, Shaq, Phil and Kobe. You are letting Dan Patrick, Jim Rome and MSNBC tell you something while I am letting history tell me the other. Guess that does make me a homer. 

Whatever, believe that the Lakers are unraveling. I guess you will be shocked if (when) it turns out to be no big deal (again).


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## Tommyboy (Jan 3, 2003)

see jemel, that's the problem, I never said I believed the Lakers are unraveling, never once did I say that. You assume I believe that though. I don't.

to me the results of this season are completely irrelevant to whether this is news or not. You previously stated


> Its news because the media wants to make it news, not neccesarly because it greatly harms the Lakers chances. Therefore I say its overblown.


and I disagree with you that its "overblown" and that "the media wants to make it news". That is all.


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## RG (Jan 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Jemel Irief</b>!
> 
> 
> Deep down I start to feel for the Spurs. Will anyone ever pay attention to one of their titles?


Not as long as people are more thrilled the Lakers lost...who beats them is secondary. But I'll bet you paid attention while watching the trail of tears after game 6 of the WCF.


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## Terrible (Jan 3, 2003)

Last night Kobe said he killed the beef with Shaq as Shaq said about Kobe and it was actually not that big of a deal. So here comes Phil to relight the fire and say this is a long way from being over, why would he say that being their coach?

Many have said including me that this was Phils plan all along to take the attention away from Kobe and the sex trial. If it's not then why would Phil want to keep stalking the oven with Kobe and Shaq logs? 

My thought is that for two days now we have heard nothing about Kobe and jail, meantime this gives the Lakers time to gel as a team and keeps Kobe from answering felony questions ALL DAY LONG!!

This is smart on Phils part, so expect more drama cause the more it's about the team the less it's on Kobe and the easier it is for the trial to be put on the back burner until it's over.


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## jackiejackal (Nov 7, 2002)

*yeah right..*

Think back to someone you can't stand,never could stand them.
Suddenly 20 minutes later,you are inviting them for hot chocolate?
please..
the fans are not that stupid !


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## RG (Jan 1, 2003)

Now they are doing damage control...still any believers in the diversion theory?  

Here's a theory about as likely... "Look darlin' we are about to get caught so cry rape and I'll pay you. That way all my blind followers will begin to bleed purple and yellow for me. Then when it's begins to look like I'm innocent of rape, they will forgive me for cheating on my wife who is at home with a newborn. Not only will I be forgiven, but all adulterers that go after me will have clear sailing!"


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