# NBA Pre-Draft Camp Heights And Weights is out!



## Dean the Master (Feb 19, 2006)

> The official NBA Pre-Draft Camp Height and Weight measurements.
> 
> NBA Pre-Draft Camp Heights and Weights
> Player	Height w/out shoes	Height w/shoes	Weight
> ...


From DraftExpress.com Here 
Interesed enough, for those Rodney Carney believer, he is measured at 6'5" with shoes.


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Dean the Master said:


> From DraftExpress.com Here
> Interesed enough, for those Rodney Carney believer, he is measured at 6'5" with shoes.


Yeah, that really caught my eye... And Brewer has more length and height.


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## HayesFan (Feb 16, 2006)

seems like there are names missing from that list.. one notable (for me as a UK fan) is Rajon Rondo.


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

Actually it's just under 6'6 with shoes, but still an inch under Brewer and doesn't have Brewer's body either.


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

Him being 6'6' doesn't change anything one bit, he is still got that great jumper and still is athletic. Some other 6'6' players in the leauge are Vince Carter, J- Rich and J.R. Smith, Carney has compable game with all of them.


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Fairsportsfan said:


> Him being 6'6' doesn't change anything one bit, he is still got that great jumper and still is athletic. Some other 6'6' players in the leauge are Vince Carter, J- Rich and J.R. Smith, Carney has compable game with all of them.


Carter and J-Rich are far better ball handlers than Carney.

Carter is also a better passer.

The things that put Brewer above Carney is Brewer's versatility. Although he might not have the freak athleticism of Carney, he is capable of defending PG-SF, the same definitely cant be said of Carney who seems most appropriate for playing SF (where TMac is a lock). Brewer, also has a more NBA ready body and the length... athleticism isnt the only quality this team is lacking. Athleticism, alone, can not help you to be a better defender either (read Stromile Swift). Most of all, I like that Brewer can pass the ball and create shots for others. He is more accustomed to slashing than spotting up and shooting (sad that Carney is so athletic but doesnt seem to make too much use of his ability).

Statistically, Brewer also has the edge even though he is younger than Carney.


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## tone wone (Jan 30, 2003)

TManiAC said:


> Carter and J-Rich are far better ball handlers than Carney.
> 
> Carter is also a better passer.
> 
> ...


 in other words..

_"With the 8th pick the Houston Rockets select....."_


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

tone wone said:


> in other words..
> 
> _"With the 8th pick the Houston Rockets select....."_



If I could have custom avi's Ild sport Brewer like MRC.

Waiting to draft Brewer so we can all start a fan club for our man crush.


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

TManiAC said:


> Carter and J-Rich are far better ball handlers than Carney.
> 
> Carter is also a better passer.


I said that they had similar playing styles, not exact. They all use there athelticism quite a bit and they all are great shooters. And also when J-Rich came in to the leauge he was not that great of ball handler and R. Jefferson who is very compable to Carney he was not that great ball handler either. As Carney moves along in his first few years in the nba those skills will improve. 



TManiAC said:


> The things that put Brewer above Carney is Brewer's versatility. Although he might not have the freak athleticism of Carney, he is capable of defending PG-SF, the same definitely cant be said of Carney who seems most appropriate for playing SF (where TMac is a lock). Brewer, also has a more NBA ready body and the length... athleticism isnt the only quality this team is lacking. Athleticism, alone, can not help you to be a better defender either (read Stromile Swift). Most of all, I like that Brewer can pass the ball and create shots for others. He is more accustomed to slashing than spotting up and shooting (sad that Carney is so athletic but doesnt seem to make too much use of his ability).


I really think that u are under rating Carney's Defence, even though his defence is not as good as Brewers, its pretty solid. And also with the new measuremenst coming out as it did and carney's great shooting ablitily he will most likely be a 2 on the next level. And Even though Brewer is a great playermaker and thats a fact. But really with a healthy T-Mac and Yao, who are both great playmakers who have the balls in their hands most of the time. And Alston our pg which Jeff says is our pure point guard, the need for another playermaker who creates for others is not that big as others. Last year u guys had shooting woes and u even had it when Yao and T-mac were there. And the lost of Wesley and Barry will make thoes shooting woes worst, so getting a 2 that could shoot is a must over any thing. And also Carney is a great slasher, the problem is that he chooses to shoot first, shoot second, shoot third and drive fourth. Carney has a great first step and his the speed and athleticism to finish but he chooses to shoot, this is something that will have to change.

And also i don't see either brewer or Carney starting anytime soon because both are not ready and i just don't see Jeff starting a rookie, the season after next is when really see them trying to break the starting lineup. I really think the rockets will sign a f/a sg/sf with the mle (harpping/murray/posey) and let the rookie develop off the bench were i think they will get alot of mins, just like the nets did with Jefferson. Brewer seems like he is going to be a role player but Carney seem to have the talent to become a star, at the least i think Carney will be a Q-Rich because just like Q, his 3 point shot and Athleticism will keep him in the leauge. Carney could became something speacil in this leauge, i just don't want them to past it up just like they did with Lewis and Jefferson.




TManiAC said:


> Statistically, Brewer also has the edge even though he is younger than Carney.


Stats should not matter, they were in different situations and they are completely different players. Carney is SG while Brewer is a PG, its like trying to compare Kidd and kobe. Brewer thoes not have the edge over Carney its pretty even.


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Fairsportsfan said:


> I said that they had similar playing styles, not exact. They all use there athelticism quite a bit and they all are great shooters. And also when J-Rich came in to the leauge he was not that great of ball handler and R. Jefferson who is very compable to Carney he was not that great ball handler either. As Carney moves along in his first few years in the nba those skills will improve.
> 
> *Than you admit he's no Vince Carter. Also, I dont know that R. Jefferson is an accurate comparison given that R. Jefferson is made out of concrete, has 25 lbs of more muscle, and has 2+ inches on Carney. Jefferson also likes taking it to the rack rather than taking jump shots and is able to do so because he can handle the ball, decently. Im not saying Carney is lesser or cant develop into a similar player, I just think ppl rely too much on comparisons put up by the mock drafts... But its nice to know that Carney's ceiling is RJ.*
> 
> ...


I answered in bold.


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

TManiAC said:


> Than you admit he's no Vince Carter. Also, I dont know that R. Jefferson is an accurate comparison given that R. Jefferson is made out of concrete, has 25 lbs of more muscle, and has 2+ inches on Carney. Jefferson also likes taking it to the rack rather than taking jump shots and is able to do so because he can handle the ball, decently. Im not saying Carney is lesser or cant develop into a similar player, I just think ppl rely too much on comparisons put up by the mock drafts... But its nice to know that Carney's ceiling is RJ.


Vince Carter and Carney do have similar skills but I doubt that he will ever become one . If anybody I named, he could be like a J-Rich. Just like Carney, J-Rich was not that great of a dribbler but improved upon it each and every year which i expect Carney to do to. Carney and J-Rich are both 6-6, great leapers, and good jump shooters. At his LOWEST point i expect a Q-Rich.



TManiAC said:


> Maybe I am underrating Carney's defense. Still, its not as sure of a thing as Brewer's...... Youre right in that Carney will most likely be a 2 (because of his inability to rebound effectively enough to be a 3 and because he is better off spotting up from outside). Its not just his ball-handling thats deficient, its also his passing. We need a good passer at 2 to help find Yao and help TMac make plays off the ball and away from double teams. Brewer is clearly the better slasher and passer and would clearly help to move around the defense more than just an above-average shooter in Carney. Im not sure Carney is a great slasher given that hes a poor ball handler, whenever a player with poor handles tries to dominate the ball, that normally translates into high turnovers... it shouldnt be any surprise that a poor ball handler is unable to use his athleticism.


I seriously don't expect who ever the rockets to draft to do all that, most likely the rockets will try to address that in f/a. Most potienal playoff teams such as rockets do not count on rookies do much, there was only a few rookies in the playoff that actually did anything. And Brewer won't be asked to do much with yao and t-mac on the floor. If the rocket did draft brewer i would only expect him to do is to play solid D and be solid producer at pg in his first year. 

And also i should not say that Carney is a great slasher, he just has a great first step. When he gets past u he doesn't need more then 3 dribbles or 2 dribbles to get to the hole and finish. Carney has this great abililty but choose to shoot first then drive fourth, lol.

And the problem i have with Brewer is if the rockets do draft him, is that i see a lot of teams just laying off him and doubling on T-mac or Yao and just daring him to shoot the ball that will be a big problem. At least with Carney other teams could fear his jumper and think twice about a double team.




TManiAC said:


> I think Brewer is NBA ready. IMHO, only Roy, Foye, and Shelden Williams are more NBA ready. RJ flourishes because hes on a transition team and is the benefactor of many passes from Kidd and turnovers created by their defense. I think Carney can have the same success... on a transition team. Hopefully, the Rockets can be like that. I think Q is an accurate comparison... I also think Q is overrated and would much rather have a Josh Howard on my team.


Just because he is nba ready doesn't mean he is going to start. It just means that a guy is able to make a solid contrabutions to the team instead of a player being drafted and waiting a few years before becoming a solid pro. And Brewer will be no Josh Howard, Josh Howard is a rising star in this leauge while brewer will just be a role player at best. Josh howard is much more of a perimeter player and Jump shooter while brewer is just a slasher. I like draft expresses comparison, Andre Iguodala with pg skills and no jumper. I think that all that Brewer will be is a solid role player but Carney has a higher ceiling could be a star.

And if u remembered last season when kidd was injured for the first half the season and when Carter was not traded to the nets yet. Jefferson did avg around 25 ppg, if i remember correctly, without kidd. K-mart maght be a benefactor but Jefferson has skills.



TManiAC said:


> I totally disagree. Brewer is 6'7 to Carney's 6'5. Comparing them to Kidd and Kobe is ridiculous. Just because Brewer is versatile enough to play the PG, its not fair to make the extreme comparison to Kidd (of all people). I think you can reasonably compare stats for Quentin Richardson and Josh Howard. or JR Smith and Marquis Daniels. Stats is everything we have to go by and statistically, as well as qualitatively, Brewer seems to be the better man although he may not be the most exciting to watch.


Stats are misleading, it really matter what the situations they were in and what kind of a player they are. Lets take for exp Brewer, for the most part he played PG. So of course ast numbers will be better, of couse his TO would be worst because handles the more often, of couse his FG avg would be higher because he took less shots and he is a pg guard so passes first. If u didn't know what spots they played at and what there situation was u would think that Carney was the better ball handler and Brewer the better scorer.


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## tone wone (Jan 30, 2003)

Fairsportsfan said:


> And also i should not say that Carney is a great slasher, he just has a great first step. When he gets past u he doesn't need more then 3 dribbles or 2 dribbles to get to the hole and finish. Carney has this great abililty but choose to shoot first then drive fourth, lol.
> 
> And the problem i have with Brewer is if the rockets do draft him, is that i see a lot of teams just laying off him and doubling on T-mac or Yao and just daring him to shoot the ball that will be a big problem. At least with Carney other teams could fear his jumper and think twice about a double team.


sure teams "could" fear his jumper but he's a damn rookie...and he doesn't have a rep of being a "great" shooter out of college so explain why teams wouldn't leave him open....they left Head open





Fairsportsfan said:


> Just because he is nba ready doesn't mean he is going to start. It just means that a guy is able to make a solid contrabutions to the team instead of a player being drafted and waiting a few years before becoming a solid pro. And Brewer will be no Josh Howard, Josh Howard is a rising star in this leauge while brewer will just be a role player at best. Josh howard is much more of a perimeter player and Jump shooter while brewer is just a slasher. I like draft expresses comparison, Andre Iguodala with pg skills and no jumper. I think that all that Brewer will be is a solid role player but Carney has a higher ceiling could be a star.


Josh Howard is FOWARD through and through. Doesn't have much of handle but is a terrific rebounder. And Howards jumper was hardly polished coming into the league. So I dont know that makes him more of a "perimeter" player. His rookie season he started the last month of season and in the playoffs mainly due to how great he rebounded (he killed Sacramento in the playoffs on the offensive boards) Daniels was considered much more of a scoring threat than he was. The comparisons between him and Brewer are slightly off....Brewer's a guard. His game is actually more simular to Marquis Daniels...from a skill standpoint. Just combine that with Howards activity & defense and you have Ronnie Brewer. IMO, Howard isn't doing anything today that Brewer wont be doing 3 years from now.


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Fairsportsfan said:


> Vince Carter and Carney do have similar skills but I doubt that he will ever become one . If anybody I named, he could be like a J-Rich. Just like Carney, J-Rich was not that great of a dribbler but improved upon it each and every year which i expect Carney to do to. Carney and J-Rich are both 6-6, great leapers, and good jump shooters. At his LOWEST point i expect a Q-Rich.
> 
> *Fair. Im in no position to say otherwise.*
> 
> ...


Again in bold.


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## jworth (Feb 17, 2006)

Carney's jumper is overrated. He's an athletic freak who was blessed with a very talented and athletic supporting cast at Memphis, and more times than not, Carney was lazy on both sides of the floor last season. He'll have a lot to prove in the league, especially if he's a high pick which is almost certain.


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

Wingspans are up, Brewer's is just under 7 feet!

http://www.insidehoops.com/draft-prospect-measurements.shtml


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## Dean the Master (Feb 19, 2006)

> Rodney Carney: Yeah, he’s been giving me a few tips. He’s kind of like a big brother.


Ha Ha, how cute is that. Rodney on T-Mac.
it is from the 3rd media day.


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## bronx43 (Dec 9, 2005)

The one thing that surprised me is that JJ is 6,4 without shoes and 6,5 with shoes. That puts him only one inch shorter than Carney, who is supposed to be 6,7. 
Also, did anyone notice that some players gain .75 inches and some gain 1.25 inches with shoes. What idiot would wear the lower shoes?


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

tone wone said:


> sure teams "could" fear his jumper but he's a damn rookie...and he doesn't have a rep of being a "great" shooter out of college so explain why teams wouldn't leave him open....they left Head open.


I should not say fear, I should say think twice. Sure Carney was not the best 3 point shooter in college but he was pretty good 3 point shooter. Its like when they double T-mac and they left john barry he was not the best but the was pretty good. In other words Carney helps spread the floor.

And when they did leave head open there were many times he hit the shoot, he did hit that game winner when they doubled on t-mac and left him wide open. 






tone wone said:


> Josh Howard is FOWARD through and through. Doesn't have much of handle but is a terrific rebounder. And Howards jumper was hardly polished coming into the league. So I dont know that makes him more of a "perimeter" player. His rookie season he started the last month of season and in the playoffs mainly due to how great he rebounded (he killed Sacramento in the playoffs on the offensive boards) Daniels was considered much more of a scoring threat than he was. The comparisons between him and Brewer are slightly off....Brewer's a guard. His game is actually more simular to Marquis Daniels...from a skill standpoint. Just combine that with Howards activity & defense and you have Ronnie Brewer. IMO, Howard isn't doing anything today that Brewer wont be doing 3 years from now.


Josh howard being a Forward is one reason why brewer is not going to be like him and brewer being more like a point guard is an other reason. I disagree on Howards jumper he has aways had it. Was a pretty good jump shooter in college and now he has develop his stroke out to the 3 point line. Today howard plays more out on the perimeter then anything else, i really don't know whay howard sliped that far down in the draft.

I do agree that Brewer is a mixture of Dainels and howard, it just to hard pin point what kind of player Brewer is. And on last sentence i disagree but we will see.


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

Fairsportsfan said:


> Brewer seems like he is going to be a role player but Carney seem to have the talent to become a star, at the least i think Carney will be a Q-Rich because just like Q, his 3 point shot and Athleticism will keep him in the leauge. Carney could became something speacil in this leauge, i just don't want them to past it up just like they did with Lewis and Jefferson.


Q-Rich has a well built body and an extremely strong post game. There are many more question marks surrounding Carney than Brewer... he doesn't like contact, can't create off the dribble (really doesn't handle the ball well at all) and doesn't have the body to stop any 2 guard from posting him up. He's not going to be more than a spot up shooter his first 2 years in the league, and we need immediate help. Here are the needs Brewer can address as soon as next year:

1. Penetration. Alston can only penetrate in transition and doesn't always make the best decisions when he's in the paint. Penetration from T-Mac was non-existant last year.
2. Decent perimeter shooting, poor form but it works for him.
3. Perimeter defense, can get right up on his man and stay with him.
4. Athleticism, a finisher with a body that can take a beating.


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Mr. Roger's Cardigan said:


> Q-Rich has a well built body and an extremely strong post game. There are many more question marks surrounding Carney than Brewer... he doesn't like contact, can't create off the dribble (really doesn't handle the ball well at all) and doesn't have the body to stop any 2 guard from posting him up. He's not going to be more than a spot up shooter his first 2 years in the league, and we need immediate help. Here are the needs Brewer can address as soon as next year:
> 
> 1. Penetration. Alston can only penetrate in transition and doesn't always make the best decisions when he's in the paint. Penetration from T-Mac was non-existant last year.
> 2. Decent perimeter shooting, poor form but it works for him.
> ...



Not disagreeing, just chiming in on your points.

1. The reason why TMac was poor at penetrating was because the defense almost always collapsed on Yao... TMac didnt have many open lanes to work with (not that he shouldnt have tried and at least got to the line with his athleticism). TMac took shots from outside to try and stretch the defense and open up driving lanes for others and get easier looks for Yao. Brewer can penetrate and spread defenses so TMac has more opportunities to get to the basket and set up his jump shots =)

2. Yup, agreed.

3. Yup, agreed. What I like most is that he can guard any position from 1-3. Other teams continually exploited Alston and Wesley off the switch. Brewer playing point at times should eliminate such a weakness. Imagine Brewer and Buckner in the backcourt... we would be a complete defensive team.

4. Carney is a world-class athlete, but that doesnt mean that Brewer ISNT athletic.


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

TManiAC said:


> Solid D and solid producer at PG takes care of 2 of 3 nagging Rockets problems.


And he will be doing that off the bench.



TManiAC said:


> Yeah, and RJ averaged nearly 4 T/Os a game for the season.


He had 22 pg 7 rb 4 ast 1 steal and shot .432 from the field, i don't 4 TO made him look that bad



TManiAC said:


> How do you figure that? Look at three point percentages for both Carney and Brewer over their college careers. How can you say one is a better shooter than the other? I think you misunderstood Brewer having poor form as one who has a poor shot. Brewer is just a good shooter as is Carney except Brewer doesnt rely on it as much as Carney does.


By only going by their last year in college (because thats what really matters) and looking at how many 3 pointers each guy took thats way i say carney is a better 3 point shooter. You do not look at what a player was 2 or 3 season ago in college because they must likely improved. 



TManiAC said:


> First off, Andre Iguodala does have PG skills. Since you like mock comparisons, mocks have been comparing Brewer to Diaw, Josh Howard, and Iggy. Ild say thats good company and a pretty high ceiling. All three are good defenders, rebounders, slashers, passers and have good intangibles.


Just because I like draftexpress comparisons to J-Rich and Q-Rich then I must like all mock comparisons, Ok. Like i don't think he will be a Josh howard and really i don't think he will be a Diaw either. But the closest player i think he will be is Iggy or Maggete with pg skills. I still think Brewer will be a role player and Carney could be something good in this leauge but we will see.



TManiAC said:


> As for FG%, they took a similar number of shots if you look at the stats and Brewer converted at a higher percentage. And to your last sentence... No... not at all.


Carney took 50 more shoots and nearly half of his FGA were 3 pointers. But i can't blame Brewer of going to hole more often and Carney for not.


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

Mr. Roger's Cardigan said:


> Q-Rich has a well built body and an extremely strong post game. There are many more question marks surrounding Carney than Brewer... he doesn't like contact, can't create off the dribble (really doesn't handle the ball well at all) and doesn't have the body to stop any 2 guard from posting him up. He's not going to be more than a spot up shooter his first 2 years in the league, and we need immediate help. Here are the needs Brewer can address as soon as next year:
> 
> 1. Penetration. Alston can only penetrate in transition and doesn't always make the best decisions when he's in the paint. Penetration from T-Mac was non-existant last year.
> 2. Decent perimeter shooting, poor form but it works for him.
> ...


I totally agree, but I think that brewer will be doing that on that stuff on the bench or any other player that the rockets draft. I think carney will be, like u said, a solid spot up shooter with solid d. But after 2 years i see him progessing into a Star, while Brewer is still a role player. I think Carney could make contrabutions now and greater ones in the future with t-mac and yao. Nobody we draft is going to make us champs but i think carney could do it with yao and t-mac if his talent progress.


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Fairsportsfan said:


> And he will be doing that off the bench.
> 
> *How do you know? Why do you INSIST on this? *
> 
> ...


i think this is played out. Youre entitled to your opinions. I like Brewer.


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

TManiAC said:


> How do you know? Why do you INSIST on this?


Like i said how many playoff teams started a rookie on an everyday basics? how many rookies have started for JVG throughout his coaching career? I really don't see the rockets a playoff contender who have the 4.3 and 1.3 te and the full mle, realy on a rookie starting



TManiAC said:


> No, it was .422 from the field and thats the worst of his career as an NBA pro. The fact that he had the worst shooting percentages of his career and the worst asst/TO shows that he cant create shots as easily on his own and really exposed his weakness regarding ball handling and creating shots for himself. But thats besides the point, the point is that Carney is not even on that level yet and RJ can get shots off easier than Carney becaue RJ is stronger, longer, and has better handles than Carney.


Shooting 42% is not that bad and he still had a great season he had career highs in scoring, rebounding and ast. Kidd makes anybody lifes easier, lol.

And also never did say that Carney was the next RJ, I said houston could bring up carney like NJ did RJ. First playing him off the bench and letting him get his mins.




TManiAC said:


> I dont like your double standards. You say stats dont matter, you say that position matters, you say other years dont matter, only last year matters etc etc... as long as it works for your argument its ok? I mean, you were talking about how stats depend on your situation and position, so in explanation for why Brewer's stats dropped in his last year, I brought up how he was playing SF and playing against bigger and stronger players, explaining why his FG per and threes dropped. If you insist that he will be a PG, lets just look at his stats as a PG (his junior year and best statistical year in college) and did nearly EVERYTHING better than Carney including three point shooting. The only edge Carney has on Brewer is athleticism.. and thats considering, passing, shooting, defense, intangibles, rebounds, turnovers, getting to the line, length, height, strength, etc etc etc etc.... and the fact that Brewer is a great athlete, just not a freak like Carney, should be enough reason to believe that Brewer will be the starter and that Carney is the one thats the project.


You never once mention to me that Brewer played SF.



TManiAC said:


> Yeah, we will. I dont doubt Carney can be better than Brewer.. in the future. I just totally disagree with you insisting that Brewer is a bench rider. I, and many other ppl, think that Brewer can contribute right away considering how polished he is in every aspect of the game and how NBA ready his body is. I also like the fact that Brewer is praised for his work ethic and game maturity while Carney gets knocked for his motivation and concentration.


True brewer might not be a bench rider but i just don't think he is going to start in his rookie season. Yea he could be a solid starter but nothing great. 

T-Mac himself is knocked on his motivation and concetration, Swift was knocked on his motivation and concentration in Memphis and we still signed him. I think Carney would feel right at home here, lol. But any way I expect him to fix that quick as soon he realize how it is in the next level i expect him to change.



TManiAC said:


> 50 more shots and nearly half os his FGA were 3s!!!! Wow, and he played less minutes than Brewer, too. Thanks for making me realize how trigger happy Carney is... Brewer at 8 for sure.


When your shooting nearly 40% from out there its ok. Carney at 8.

Anyway i have my opinion and u have yours, we will just have to see.


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## Pimped Out (May 4, 2005)

bronx43 said:


> The one thing that surprised me is that JJ is 6,4 without shoes and 6,5 with shoes. That puts him only one inch shorter than Carney, who is supposed to be 6,7.
> Also, did anyone notice that some players gain .75 inches and some gain 1.25 inches with shoes. What idiot would wear the lower shoes?


they weigh less


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Fairsportsfan said:


> Like i said how many playoff teams started a rookie on an everyday basics? how many rookies have started for JVG throughout his coaching career? I really don't see the rockets a playoff contender who have the 4.3 and 1.3 te and the full mle, realy on a rookie starting.
> 
> *Oh, I misunderstood. The entire time, you made it sound like Brewer was just not good enough to start. And there have been many rooks starting in playoff teams, dont even act like there arent any. Ok so we have the MLE and TE, tell me who we can afford that will be better than Brewer or Carney? Greg Buckner? Darius Songaila? John Salmons? Devean George? Those players seem like role-players to me.*
> 
> ...


Brewer over Carney


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Fairsportsfan said:


> I totally agree, but I think that brewer will be doing that on that stuff on the bench or any other player that the rockets draft. I think carney will be, like u said, *a solid spot up shooter with solid d*. But after 2 years i see him progessing into a Star, while Brewer is still a role player. I think Carney could make contrabutions now and greater ones in the future with t-mac and yao. Nobody we draft is going to make us champs but i think carney could do it with yao and t-mac if his talent progress.



MRC said "nothing more than a spot up shooter" (we already have that in luther head) and never said anything about having "solid D". You inserted "Solid" before MRC's "Spot up shooter" and inserted "Solid D" entirely. In fact, MRC said that bigger 2s will post up on Carney all day because carney is undersized at 6'4, has little weight to his frame, and lacks the motivation to play good defense.

Brewer on the other hand, is a good spot up shooter like Carney and Luther Head, but to his advantage can play solid defense on bigger 2s, can post up PGs, is the perfect height at 6'7 has good strength and good development to his NBA ready frame and has the right mentality to play good defense for 48 minutes.

Ad to that mixture the fact that he can pass, slash, and handle the ball in general, and I dont see how you can still make the argument for Carney. James White is athletic... why not go with him? I think you put too much stock in Carney's athleticism.


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

TManiAC said:


> MRC said "nothing more than a spot up shooter" (we already have that in luther head) and never said anything about having "solid D". You inserted "Solid" before MRC's "Spot up shooter" and inserted "Solid D" entirely. In fact, MRC said that bigger 2s will post up on Carney all day because carney is undersized at 6'4, has little weight to his frame, and lacks the motivation to play good defense.


I added the solid D because he has played solid D against the bigger guards and unless Carney expects to play bare foot i think it would be more like 6'6.

We could go at it all day untill the draft but no matter what you say, you won't change my opinion that you guys should get carney. And must likely no matter what i say, you won't change your opinion that the rockes should get Brewer. So i am just going to just take the wait and see approach.

CARNEY AT 8


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Fairsportsfan said:


> I added the solid D because he has played solid D against the bigger guards and unless Carney expects to play bare foot i think it would be more like 6'6.
> 
> We could go at it all day untill the draft but no matter what you say, you won't change my opinion that you guys should get carney. And must likely no matter what i say, you won't change your opinion that the rockes should get Brewer. So i am just going to just take the wait and see approach.
> 
> CARNEY AT 8



Im sure alot of ppl got some good information about both players and I think Rockets fans should continue to put up info about potential draft prospects.

Anyone got any good vids, scouting reports, etc?

I can put up stuff about Brewer, you want to do Carney? (and well keep them independent of comparisons to other players in the draft).


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

TManiAC said:


> Im sure alot of ppl got some good information about both players and I think Rockets fans should continue to put up info about potential draft prospects.
> 
> Anyone got any good vids, scouting reports, etc?
> 
> I can put up stuff about Brewer, you want to do Carney? (and well keep them independent of comparisons to other players in the draft).


Thats a pretty good idea and the tread could be called the potential prospects. And on second thought lets just have one tread with all the guys the rockets could chose with there info and other news. TManiAC will do Brewer and i will do Carney, if any other person wants to post any prospect that has not been done yet that would be great. 

yahoo has great vid of players.


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## TManiAC (Dec 19, 2004)

Fairsportsfan said:


> Thats a pretty good idea, i also think each player should have their tread were we could put there info and other news. And yahoo has great vid of both players.



You mean a sticky thread for each of the Rockets players? Thats a great idea, with info ranging from salary matters to injury updates. I just dont think its good to have 15 stickies for each player and an extra 5 for each draft prospect. 

We already have a general injury sticky (dont we?), we should at least have a sticky for TMac and Yao. and maybe one for Luther Head and Skip.

I definitely would like to see something for Carney, Brewer, Roy, and Marcus Williams.


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## Dean the Master (Feb 19, 2006)

What about just merge all the Draft thread, and started another Players' thread. Then we would just stick two? now we have 7 stickers on top already. To much stickers would just make the thread messy.


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

On second thought lets just have one sticky tread with all the potential draft prospects because it might be to many sticky treads if we gave each their on tread. But i got to go but i will be back later to see what u guys think up.


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

TManiAC said:


> Not disagreeing, just chiming in on your points.
> 
> 1. The reason why TMac was poor at penetrating was because the defense almost always collapsed on Yao... TMac didnt have many open lanes to work with (not that he shouldnt have tried and at least got to the line with his athleticism). TMac took shots from outside to try and stretch the defense and open up driving lanes for others and get easier looks for Yao. Brewer can penetrate and spread defenses so TMac has more opportunities to get to the basket and set up his jump shots =)


I'm sure TMac's back had something to do with that as well. But we can't assume McGrady will automatically resume his 2004-05 form. 


I'm not great at organization so am open to all suggestions on what to do with the draft prospects. Personally I don't want alot of valuable info to get lost in a 10 page thread, so I'll just quote other posts leading up to the draft in a "Prospective Draft Picks"... should provide a comprehensive scouting report.


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## Pimped Out (May 4, 2005)

Mr. Roger's Cardigan said:


> I'm sure TMac's back had something to do with that as well. But we can't assume McGrady will automatically resume his 2004-05 form.
> 
> 
> I'm not great at organization so am open to all suggestions on what to do with the draft prospects. Personally I don't want alot of valuable info to get lost in a 10 page thread, so I'll just quote other posts leading up to the draft in a "Prospective Draft Picks"... should provide a comprehensive scouting report.


maybe my engineering skills could come in handy here...

wait, taking a nap wont help, will it?


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## Fairsportsfan (Aug 10, 2005)

I don't think i could be able to do Carney's tread, could somebody else do it for me? Maybe MRC?


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