# Source: Bryant Tells Buss That He Wants Out (Again)



## f22egl (Jun 3, 2004)

Apparently trade talks between the Lakers and Pacers for Jermaine O'Neal had broken down and Kobe wants out again. 

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-lakers16jun16,0,4935832.story?coll=la-home-sports

Thoughts?


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## Mateo (Sep 23, 2006)

This is getting strange.


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## ChosenFEW (Jun 23, 2005)

if anything were to happen i think it would be by the trading deadline in february


i dont think the lakers would part with kobe as easily as they did with shaq


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## Brandon Real (Mar 14, 2006)

This isn't news. He never rescinded his trade in the first place. ESPN needs to stop taking things out of context, but....then it wouldn't be ESPN.


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## f22egl (Jun 3, 2004)

Brandon Real said:


> This isn't news. He never rescinded his trade in the first place. ESPN needs to stop taking things out of context, but....then it wouldn't be ESPN.


The LA Times reported this story.


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## Brandon Real (Mar 14, 2006)

f22egl said:


> The LA Times reported this story.


Even worse.

I heard about the story on ESPN news this morning.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Lol, damn Kobe, one negotiation breakdown isn't the end of the world.


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## AliG (Dec 26, 2006)

Absolutely no credibility whatsoever....LOL... an unidentifiable "source" is the best thing the newspaper can come up with?? Any idiots can write such thing, just because it's published in a newspaper doesn't mean it's credible. This reminds me of why I have stopped subscription to all major newspapers some 8 years ago.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

_Dre_ said:


> Lol, damn Kobe, one negotiation breakdown isn't the end of the world.


Bingo

Left to me, I think they should let him go and start over


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Apparently there is a video, where Kobe goes on a tirade against Kupchak and Bynum.

Apparently Kobe says, "Get ready to buy your Bulls jerseys" in the video.

The guy was on the radio, and he was drunk! The video is supposed to be released to the public sometime this week.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

HB said:


> Bingo
> 
> Left to me, I think they should let him go and start over


They won more without him than with him. He kills the offensive flow because he's a ballhog. Say what you want, but he has the ball for more than 5 seconds at a time in the same spot many, MANY offensive possessions. I think that he hurts their offense and chemistry. Trade him and get bookoo players for him. Maybe. T-Mac, Wells, and a draft pick? How about Deng, Hinrich, and Gordon? The trade scenarios are pretty much unlimited, but he has to sign off on the trade, which I think he will for just about anyone right now, but be upset later on. However, he has crippled their ability to make a trade right now because other GMs smell the desparation and fear in the organization that Kobe may want out and they'll probably try and hold out to get Kobe on their team instead of Odom or Bynum.


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## JoeD (Sep 2, 2004)

I saw a similar article that said that Bryant's agent said to ESPN that Kobe never backed down from his stance to be traded.


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## Ballscientist (Nov 11, 2002)

Kobe/old players for Shaq/young players?


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

The Deng/Gordon trade is just laughable.

The Bulls were a better team than the Lakers by quite a bit.

The Bulls team is lacking majorly in depth, so a large amount of credit (about 80%) of why the Bulls win should be bestowed upon those two.

So why trade the two best players on a better team for the best player on a significantly worse team.

Not to mention Kobe has knee problems, and is older...while Deng has another 12 years of prime ball, and Gordon has another 10 years of prime ball...while Kobe...its a mystery...it could just be 3-4 at most. Gordon/Deng in their prime could be better than Kobe is now (and I think they will be...both of them maybe even).

Deng is basically right there, where Kobe was at age 21...only Deng's been more of a winner than Kobe was.


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## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

Mebarak said:


> The Deng/Gordon trade is just laughable.
> 
> The Bulls were a better team than the Lakers by quite a bit.
> 
> ...



You mean COMBINED right?


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## Samael (Sep 1, 2005)

If he indeed gets traded, I think we are about to witness one of the most lopsided superstar trades in the NBA. Simply because of Kobe's veto power.


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## o.iatlhawksfan (Mar 3, 2006)

Kobe just needs to shut up, go take a vaction with you're beautiful wife, and just leave everybody alone!


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## cadarn (Feb 1, 2006)

die!


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## Brockin25 (Jun 17, 2007)

Brandon Real said:


> This isn't news. He never rescinded his trade in the first place. ESPN needs to stop taking things out of context, but....then it wouldn't be ESPN.


http://joehoo.net/index.php?idx=stories&topic=4


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## Duck (Jan 30, 2006)

Mebarak said:


> The Deng/Gordon trade is just laughable.
> 
> The Bulls were a better team than the Lakers by quite a bit.
> 
> ...



:lol: 

Bulls got 7 more wins...in the East... and were healthy....


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## Duck (Jan 30, 2006)

oh and I'm sure Gordon and Deng's gonna break Wilt's 100 point mark too.


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## o.iatlhawksfan (Mar 3, 2006)

> Not to mention Kobe has knee problems, and is older...while Deng has another 12 years of prime ball, and Gordon has another 10 years of prime ball...while Kobe...its a mystery...it could just be 3-4 at most. Gordon/Deng in their prime could be better than Kobe is now (and I think they will be...both of them maybe even).ol:
> 
> 
> 
> Deng is basically right there, where Kobe was at age 21...only Deng's been more of a winner than Kobe was.


LOL, got me a new sig!


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Do you know what "reiterate" means? It doesn't mean "something said after one changes their mind/rescinds previous statement", it means "something said again", which is what Kobe apparently did. It doesn't say in the Times article I read he rescinded anything, so that's a moot point.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

And I don't know where Kobe thinks he's going to land and contend. Any team he goes to, if Kupchak plays this halfway correct, is going to be significantly weaker with him than without him. The teams we thought were so deep, the Bulls and Mavericks...they didn't do well for themselves at all in the playoffs, what are they going to do with fewer resources? Get better? Doubt it.

And that's if this even gets that far, which I doubt it will, not this offseason. Kobe's just frustrated, all the Lakers have to do is get on the phone and sound serious and he'll be happy again. I think he just wants to pull his weight around right now.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

I don't think the Lakers will trade him for what they can get for him.Essentially the Bulls are the only team that is viable and when you think it through all the Lakers will end up with is Gordon,the ninth pick and guys who make up the rest of the salary.That's about 30 cents on the dollar so if I'm Dr Buss I'd tell Kobe to get used to being unhappy


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

I don't know, I think New York, the Clippers, and (wishfully thinking) Dallas will be on Kobe's wishlist too....

And I say maybe Portland would be a good spot too. Sounds farfetched, but they have a (good) young team, is he willing to wait on Oden and Roy? Randolph, Jack and Aldridge for Kobe and Smush, get it done Kupchak.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

_Dre_ said:


> And I don't know where Kobe thinks he's going to land and contend. Any team he goes to, if Kupchak plays this halfway correct, is going to be significantly weaker with him than without him. The teams we thought were so deep, the Bulls and Mavericks...they didn't do well for themselves at all in the playoffs, what are they going to do with fewer resources? Get better? Doubt it.
> 
> And that's if this even gets that far, which I doubt it will, not this offseason. Kobe's just frustrated, all the Lakers have to do is get on the phone and sound serious and he'll be happy again. I think he just wants to pull his weight around right now.


Bulls did bad in the playoffs? They swept the Heat...you know, that team you kept saying that NO ONE out East could beat. They were fighting the Pistons. They have room for tons of internal improvement with (Luol Deng- just in his 3rd year, Ben Gordon- 3rd year, Tyrus Thomas- rookie, Thabo Sefolosha- rookie, Andres Nocioni- healthy, and #9 pick). Its funny how people say 7 more wins doesn't matter...well how about 16 total wins more than Kobe in their time in the league, and 6 more playoff wins? 

The thing is, that the team won't be gutted right if Kobe goes about it right. If Kobe is just going to be a little pansy, and not go full throttle on this, no trade is going to happen. John Paxson isn't dumb, he isn't going to give both Gordon/Deng away for Kobe. He passed on Paul Pierce for Ben Gordon already, so if the Lakers want Ben Gordon, it will essentially be Ben Gordon + contract filler for Kobe Bryant. John Paxson isn't going to gut the team for a player that can't get it done by himself. Gordon/Deng will most likely be better than Kobe in not so many years. These guys carried the Bulls to the playoffs this year with no frontcourt, and swept a team. 

If the Kobe Bryant supermarket video is legit, then Kobe is definitely done in LA, and Lakers are going to get jack squat for him. 

If a trade is to be worked out by draft day involving Kobe/Bulls, thanks to Kirk Hinrich's poison pill provision it can be done.

Bulls Trade:

Kirk Hinrich
Tyrus Thomas
Viktar Khryapa
Chris Duhon
#9 pick

Lakers Trade:

Kobe Bryant

Thats about the value the Lakers should expect. Thabo Sefolosha in addition to that at best. 

Gives them

PG-Kirk Hinrich
SG-Thabo Sefolosha
SF-Lamar Odom
PF-Tyrus THomas
C- Andrew Bynum
With Luke Walton and the #9 pick off the bench.

Thats about the best the Lakers can hope for.

Get realistic guys. Kobe isn't Tim Duncan. You aren't going to net even one of the two best players on a better team for him. John Paxson's job is to make the Bulls a championship team, not make the Lakers better.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

_Dre_ said:


> I don't know, I think New York, the Clippers, and (wishfully thinking) Dallas will be on Kobe's wishlist too....
> 
> And I say maybe Portland would be a good spot too. Sounds farfetched, but they have a (good) young team, is he willing to wait on Oden and Roy? Randolph, Jack and Aldridge for Kobe and Smush, get it done Kupchak.


Kobe's three team list is Chicago Bulls, New York Knicks, and Los Angeles Clippers.

Chicago is the most likely, since Knicks have nothing of value to offer, and can easily be outdone by Bulls with an offer that doesn't involve Gordon/Deng. Clippers, they are crosstown rivals in the same division. That one just won't be allowed to happen.

Chicago/New York are the only two destinations LA would trade him to.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

Mebarak said:


> The Deng/Gordon trade is just laughable.
> 
> The Bulls were a better team than the Lakers by quite a bit..


Maybe because the Bulls has a deeper team to begin with. But I dont think, you're aware of this.






Mebarak said:


> So why trade the two best players on a better team for the best player on a significantly worse team...


Because your two best players will be traded to one of the best if not the best in the league. Kobe's top 5, Deng and Gordon are not even in the top 20. Do the math.

You put Deng and your toy boy Ben Gordon with last years lakers, in the west...guaranteed their not going to post a better winning percentage or get past Phoenix or San Antonio in the 1st round.




Mebarak said:


> Gordon/Deng in their prime could be *better* than Kobe is now (and I think they will be...both of them maybe even)....


C'mon now. Do you really see Luol Deng or Ben gordon averaging 30, 7 and 6 in a season? Do you see them making All Nba and All Defense 1st team?...

Stop kidding yourself.



Mebarak said:


> Deng's been more of a winner than Kobe was.


I didnt know 3 rings have a lower numerical value than 0 nowadays.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Mebarak said:


> Kobe's three team list is Chicago Bulls, New York Knicks, and Los Angeles Clippers.
> 
> Chicago is the most likely, since Knicks have nothing of value to offer, and can easily be outdone by Bulls with an offer that doesn't involve Gordon/Deng. Clippers, they are crosstown rivals in the same division. That one just won't be allowed to happen.
> 
> Chicago/New York are the only two destinations LA would trade him to.


I said *if* Wade came back healthy they'd come out of the East, and judging by his performance last playoff compared to this playoff, he wasn't healthy.

And the Knicks have some decent parts that could put butts in the seats. Marbury,Nate Robinson, Crawford, Frye's still a strong prospect, Lee, Curry...if all else fails with the Bulls (which it better not if Paxson has balls) and Clippers, Buss could go with that option and take their basket of apples for him. At least he can get an exciting player or two back, and it's probably better than Odom, Butler and Brian Grant. The contracts suck though.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

Diable said:


> I'm Dr Buss I'd tell Kobe to get used to being unhappy



Pretty much, One way or another, its Kobe's loss. He can play unhappy and ruin his career with the Lakers, or the Lakers use him for 1 1/2 to 2 more years, then a 31 y/o Kobe by then can opt out to play for another team. He does'nt really have better options, if the Lakers insist on keeping him. He is under a position where he cannot force anything for 2 more years, plain and simple.


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## O2K (Nov 19, 2002)

KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> Pretty much, One way or another, its Kobe's loss. He can play unhappy and ruin his career with the Lakers, or the Lakers use him for 1 1/2 to 2 more years, then a 31 y/o Kobe by then can opt out to play for another team. He does'nt really have better options, if the Lakers insist on keeping him. He is under a position where he cannot force anything for 2 more years, plain and simple.




actually it's not kobe who has little options its the lakers.


Kobe can afford to sit out a year or two, he'll make that money up and, its the lakers who would have a problem with their max player sitting on the bench for a couple seasons then losing him for nothing.

Kobe's contract benefits kobe more than the lakers with his trade kicker and trade clause. Lakers are in very little space to be stingy.


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## Scuall (Jul 25, 2002)

Mebarak said:


> Not to mention Kobe has knee problems, and is older...while Deng has another 12 years of prime ball, and Gordon has another 10 years of prime ball...while Kobe...its a mystery...it could just be 3-4 at most. Gordon/Deng in their prime could be better than Kobe is now (and I think they will be...both of them maybe even).
> 
> Deng is basically right there, where Kobe was at age 21...only Deng's been more of a winner than Kobe was.


Link to video

<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/pAs6TDLuKgQ"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/pAs6TDLuKgQ" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> Maybe because the Bulls has a deeper team to begin with. But I dont think, you're aware of this.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The Bulls don't have real depth. The Bulls have PAPER DEPTH...and P...P...Potential depth. Anyone who watched the Bulls last year, know that it was just Ben Gordon and Luol Deng carrying a sad sack of crap to a near 50 win season.

The problem is that Kobe is only a top 5 player. There is a big drop off from #1...to #2...and after #2, there is a bigger dropoff. Tim Duncan is the best. He is the guy that you can just stick on a team, and get 50 wins with. Lebron James is the next best thing to Duncan. After that...there is a significant drop off, and no guy that can carry a team to being good by himself. Bulls are a worse team if they do Gordon/Deng for Kobe. There is a reason why Laker fans are pining so hard toget Gordon or Deng...let alone both of them in a trade...because they know it makes them a better team. Most Bulls fans could care less about Kobe Bryant. He has a nice name and all, but on the court, Gordon/Deng are going to get you more wins than Kobe Bryant.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

O2K said:


> actually it's not kobe who has little options its the lakers.
> 
> 
> Kobe can afford to sit out a year or two, he'll make that money up and, its the lakers who would have a problem with their max player sitting on the bench for a couple seasons then losing him for nothing.
> ...


Thats why I also specifically stated 1 and a half year, somewhere. Lakers could use him for another year, then trade him the following season if needed. Either this year or the following, Kobe will get offers. This is not a deal where LA loses Kobe for nothing, therefore an they have a privilege of making deals via contract at a specified time as they wish.


Contrary to popular belief, the Lakers have options. One way or another, if they really want to trade Kobe, they can, they are not held hostage in this situation. Granted value wise its not going to be fair, but you'll never get a equal value anyway when you have Superstar as your chip. Its a business, you have risks and unfortunately this one is miscalculated by a small margin.


The Lakers has been a great organization for decades. Its not an expansion team hurting for fan base support, or media exposure to desperately beg for an individual to stay. It does not end, just because one player decided to leave. Kobe generates a lot of money, true. But the fact still remains, no player is bigger than a storied franchise. Its effect does create an impact, but its only temporary.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

Mebarak said:


> The Bulls don't have real depth. The Bulls have PAPER DEPTH...and P...P...Potential depth. Anyone who watched the Bulls last year, know that it was just Ben Gordon and Luol Deng carrying a sad sack of crap to a near 50 win season..


Key word is NEAR, and thats not even comparable to what the Lakers have suffered in injury this year. Give or take, what? Bulls has 3-4 more games won this year on a much healthier team in the East.


I could understand from a Bulls fan perspective in trying to keep as much talent. Its normal. But be realistic for a sec. Bulls has no need to keep Gordon when essentially, he's being replaced by a player better than what he does best.


Also, I thank you for finally admitting that the Bulls have depth. Something you cant say about the Lakers.



Mebarak said:


> The problem is that Kobe is only a top 5 player. There is a big drop off from #1...to #2...and after #2, there is a bigger dropoff. Tim Duncan is the best. He is the guy that you can just stick on a team, and get 50 wins with. Lebron James is the next best thing to Duncan. After that...there is a significant drop off, and no guy that can carry a team to being good by himself...


I was being conservative with my rankings, to avoid diverting this thread into "whose who" on the "best list". Also having a Top 5, in a league filled with todays talent is a luxury every team would want to have. We're talking about a future HOF'er who still has plenty of gas to take a "2nd tier" team to a higher level.




Mebarak said:


> Bulls are a worse team if they do Gordon/Deng for Kobe..


Dude. C'mon now. Hypothetical scenario just doesnt work, if we're trying to be realistic in this debate. A conversation full of "what if's?" would only lead to an endless scenario of "maybe" and "might be"



Mebarak said:


> There is a reason why Laker fans are pining so hard toget Gordon or Deng...let alone both of them in a trade..


There is, and its not because both of them will effectively make the Lakers a better organization. Its only because they WANT to get the most out of the trade, just like any other team out there. Simple logic really. 


Keep in mind...If the Lakers were to trade Kobe, its not because "he's declining" or is just merely trying to dump a unwanted salary but rather the guy is forcing his way out.




Mebarak said:


> He has a nice name and all, but on the court, Gordon/Deng are going to get you more wins than Kobe Bryant.


Again, Deng and Gordon tandem has'nt really done anything convincing enough to make Laker fans plead for such trade. Far as I see, they are both solid role players. I mean Luol Deng, he's a valuable commodity and all but there's no way I see him averaging 30 ,7 and 6 throughout the entire season, given a chance. Same with Gordon, if anything, his disapperance in the 2nd round is proof enough that Gordon " alone cannot carry a team by himself, much more statistically.


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> Thats why I also specifically stated 1 and a half year, somewhere. Lakers could use him for another year, then trade him the following season if needed. Either this year or the following, Kobe will get offers. This is not a deal where LA loses Kobe for nothing, therefore an they have a privilege of making deals via contract at a specified time as they wish.
> 
> 
> Contrary to popular belief, the Lakers have options. One way or another, if they really want to trade Kobe, they can, they are not held hostage in this situation. Granted value wise its not going to be fair, but you'll never get a equal value anyway when you have Superstar as your chip. Its a business, you have risks and unfortunately this one is miscalculated by a small margin.
> ...


Damn right. If Kobe wants out, good riddance. I sure as hell don't want to see the day it happens, but he is not bigger than the Los Angeles Lakers.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> Key word is NEAR, and thats not even comparable to what the Lakers have suffered in injury this year. Give or take, what? Bulls has 3-4 more games won this year on a much healthier team in the East.
> 
> 
> I could understand from a Bulls fan perspective in trying to keep as much talent. Its normal. But be realistic for a sec. Bulls has no need to keep Gordon when essentially, he's being replaced by a player better than what he does best.
> ...


I guess that Lebron's disapperance in the finals proves that he can't carry a team by himself?

Pistons attacked the Bull sweak offensive scheme of having Gordon/Deng stand in the corners, by putting Hamilton on Gordon, and then using Wallace's guy to come double, to trap Gordon in the corner. They went all out on Gordon attacking him with their entire defense. 

Fact of the matter is, Ben Gordon is getting a lot of blame he doesn't deserve.

Ben Gordon averaged 17 points on 57.0 TS% in that series.

Luol Deng, 19.5 points on 54.0 TS%.

Kirk Hinrich, 12.8 points on 47.9 TS%.

Gordon was far from playing the worse. Ben Gordon only had a -0.3% difference in his regular season TS% vs. Pistons series. Luol Deng -2.2%. Kirk Hinrich a -14.3% hit.

But in the end...none of these guys were at fault (well Hinrich played poorly...he was mostly wide open)...but it all comes down to Ben Wallace in this series. Pistons knew him, they ignored him offensively, and used that to their advantage in shutting down the Bulls perimeter attack.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

Mebarak said:


> I guess that Lebron's disapperance in the finals proves that he can't carry a team by himself?


Just cant compare Lebron's supporting cast with that of the Bulls.

Whatever man, I know you have your opinions, and there's no way I can change that and my last stand is as is. No way we can come up with a agreeable conclusion.


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## ChosenFEW (Jun 23, 2005)

Scuall said:


> Link to video
> 
> <object height="350" width="425">
> 
> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/pAs6TDLuKgQ" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" height="350" width="425"></object>



LMAO!!!!!!!!!


that commercial is hilarious:lol:


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## Steez (Nov 28, 2002)

Sorry if posted, right from the horses mouth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6kt9DBMMwCM

<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/6kt9DBMMwCM"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/6kt9DBMMwCM" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

This whole thing is a freaking joke, because nobody in the media is reading into the story...

Isnt it kind of odd that Kobe demands to be traded again only days after the word got out that the Lakers didnt want to give up Bynum and Odom for JO? If you read into the subject and look at a timeline it is easy to see that Kobe did this to scare Kupcake back into eating from Kobe's hand. Kobe wants JO and the Lakers will pony up whatever it takes to land him, because that is what Kobe really wants.

Its not hard to see...


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

TucsonClip said:


> This whole thing is a freaking joke, because nobody in the media is reading into the story...
> 
> Isnt it kind of odd that Kobe demands to be traded again only days after the word got out that the Lakers didnt want to give up Bynum and Odom for JO? If you read into the subject and look at a timeline it is easy to see that Kobe did this to scare Kupcake back into eating from Kobe's hand. Kobe wants JO and the Lakers will pony up whatever it takes to land him, because that is what Kobe really wants.
> 
> Its not hard to see...


Kobe can **** himself then. Bynum and Odom for O'Neal is a terrible trade anyway you slice it.


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## Baklash (Jun 17, 2007)

Bartholomew Hunt said:


> Kobe can **** himself then. Bynum and Odom for O'Neal is a terrible trade anyway you slice it.


I agree 100%. If Kobe is really demanding a trade because the Lakers declined that, then he is incredibly insane. I can't believe Kobe would even want that deal to go through. 

My only guess is... he wants O'neal to come since he is buddies with O'neal... and doesn't care what the Lakers have to give up for him, as long as they get O'neal.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

Honestly Odom and a first round pick would be more than I'd give up for Jermaine.I like O'Neal's rebounding and shotblocking,but he's always injured and there's not much evidence that he can make the sort of impact you need.I'm not sure I wouldn't rather have Odom all things considered.If I wanted to win some games I would definitely trade Bynum and the pick for him,but I wouldn't think that was enough if I were Indiana and I knew that I had the Lakers over a barrel.


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## DuMa (Dec 25, 2004)

kobe's a crybaby


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## pr0wler (Jun 8, 2003)

*Bulls Trade:
*
Ben Gordon, Chris Duhon, Andres Nocioni (re-signed) and #9 pick in 2007 NBA draft.

*Lakers Trade:*

Kobe Bryant

Bulls draft backup point guards with their second round picks, or sign a free agent/temp player to play behind Hinrich. Say they draft Mustafa Shakur, for arguments sake. 

*Bulls Lineup*

PG - Hinrich/Shakur
SG - Kobe/Stefolosha 
SF - Deng/Stefolosha
PF - Tyrus/Khyrapa
C - Wallace/PJ Brown

Lakers get Spencer Hawes at #9 in the draft...

*Lakers Lineup*

PG - Duhon/Farmar
SG - Gordon/Vujacic
SF - Nocioni/Walton
PF - Odom/Kwame
C - Bynum/Hawes

Upgrades for both teams, IMO.


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## Seuss (Aug 19, 2005)

Lakers Trade: Kobe Bryant


Knicks Trade: Isiah Thomas, Spike Lee, and Nate Robinson.


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## Brockin25 (Jun 17, 2007)

_Dre_ said:


> And I don't know where Kobe thinks he's going to land and contend. Any team he goes to, if Kupchak plays this halfway correct, is going to be significantly weaker with him than without him. The teams we thought were so deep, the Bulls and Mavericks...they didn't do well for themselves at all in the playoffs, what are they going to do with fewer resources? Get better? Doubt it.
> 
> And that's if this even gets that far, which I doubt it will, not this offseason. Kobe's just frustrated, all the Lakers have to do is get on the phone and sound serious and he'll be happy again. I think he just wants to pull his weight around right now.


You're highly misguided. Kobe has veto power, he wants a trade, and everyone knows him. Let's weigh the alternatives to "Kupchak playing it halfway correct"...

1. He keeps Kobe, they still suck, because the Lakers have almost no way to get better, Kobe gets more disgruntled, then... after the 09 season, he leaves LA with nothing. 
2. He trades Kobe out of conference, to a team like the Bulls, and gets what he can... young pieces.

When it's all said and done Kobe has the cards in his hand, just like Shaq had the cards in his hand when people like you said that Odom, Butler, Grant, 1st rounder rumors were ridiculous. 

End of the day, it probably happens if the Bulls offer:

Deng
Gordon
2008 1st rounder


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## Baklash (Jun 17, 2007)

Brockin25 said:


> You're highly misguided. Kobe has veto power, he wants a trade, and everyone knows him. Let's weigh the alternatives to "Kupchak playing it halfway correct"...
> 
> 1. He keeps Kobe, they still suck, because the Lakers have almost no way to get better, Kobe gets more disgruntled, then... after the 09 season, he leaves LA with nothing.
> 2. He trades Kobe out of conference, to a team like the Bulls, and gets what he can... young pieces.
> ...


How are the Bulls going to offer the deal you proposed when the salaries are way off? Wallace would almost certainly need to be in any type of deal the two teams do.


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## Brockin25 (Jun 17, 2007)

Baklash said:


> How are the Bulls going to offer the deal you proposed when the salaries are way off? Wallace would almost certainly need to be in any type of deal the two teams do.


I assumed you'd realize that they would be the principles of the trade... okay so maybe the Bulls would have to add players to make it work.. they would... I'm not a trade checker geek, sorry man...


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## Jizzy (Aug 24, 2005)

So when exactly did Luol Deng get an NBA championship?


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## gi0rdun (May 31, 2007)

Kobe just wants to be Michael Jordan now.

Ok this is Kobe in Chicago


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

o.iatlhawksfan said:


> Kobe just needs to shut up, go take a vaction with you're beautiful wife, and just leave everybody alone!



He is on vacation oddly enough. He was just at Barcelona practice this week to watch his good friend Ronaldinho, and chat it up about one of his favorite sports: football.

If there's one thing I definitely like about Kobe it's his cosmopolitan nature. It's a shame he's not marketed that way, because he would be an amazing ambassador for the game for Europe. Because he is basically a European player. Probably moreso than Tony Parker, who learned the game over here in the states vs. Kobe who learned the game over in europe.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Kobe needs to do the right thing and demand a trade to Cleveland so he can team up with Lebron and own the Eastern conference.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Cavs Trade:
Larry Hughes
Drew Gooden
Daniel Gibson
Shannon Brown

Lakers Trade:
Kobe Bryant

WOOOO! Party time.

Eric Snow
Kobe Bryant
Lebron James
Varejao
Z

And the Lakers suck for years and years.


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## Baklash (Jun 17, 2007)

Brockin25 said:


> I assumed you'd realize that they would be the principles of the trade... okay so maybe the Bulls would have to add players to make it work.. they would... I'm not a trade checker geek, sorry man...


Well adding Ben Wallace is a pretty significant piece of the trade... and people have said over and over it won't work without Wallace. No need to get personal here.


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## One on One (Dec 12, 2004)

This summer is going to be great! I can't wait to see this kobe video.


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## SlamJam (Nov 27, 2004)

Mebarak said:


> Most Bulls fans could care less about Kobe Bryant. He has a nice name and all, but on the court, Gordon/Deng are going to get you more wins than Kobe Bryant.


:lol: :lol: :lol:


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## thatsnotgross (Dec 4, 2006)

Unfortunately the Knicks have nothing to trade for. This is depressing, if Bryant asked this trade last year, the Lakers would be entice with expiring contracts. But if Kobe really wants to go to Chicago, then the ball is on Chicago's court. You will bet that Paxson is going to lowball the Lakers. Don't even think about a fair value. Its going to be 25 cents to a dollar.

Sign and trade PJ brown (1 year - 14 million dollar deal)
Kirk Hinrich or Ben Gordon
Loul Deng
No.9


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

If Kobe leaves the Lakers does Phil Jackson stick around?


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Brockin25 said:


> You're highly misguided. Kobe has veto power, he wants a trade, and everyone knows him. Let's weigh the alternatives to "Kupchak playing it halfway correct"...
> 
> 1. He keeps Kobe, they still suck, because the Lakers have almost no way to get better, Kobe gets more disgruntled, then... after the 09 season, he leaves LA with nothing.
> 2. He trades Kobe out of conference, to a team like the Bulls, and gets what he can... young pieces.
> ...



People like me? I don't think you were even around to know what my opinion was then. That generalization voided your post.

And Jackson is gone if Kobe leaves. Will he retire, or go to Miami or Houston? Could you picture Jackson, Shaq and Riley in the same organization?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Can you imagine Phil Jackson in Cleveland taking Lebron's game to the next level?


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Lebron is already great, Phil wouldn't be brought in to mamimize his talent as much as he would to make his supporting cast look competent, but the Cavaliers are too far away, I doubt Phil takes that jump.

I predict if Kobe's traded, you'll hear whispers about Phil jumping to Miami.


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## One on One (Dec 12, 2004)

The Lakers should have dealt Shaq for Dirk. I recall this was also discussed when they were shopping Shaq. I don't know if it was realistic as the Lakers wouldn't want to keep Shaq in the conference, but if it were, they should have made this deal. Kobe & Dirk could have possibly won a championship by now and they wouldn't be in this current mess. Instead, they get basically Odom, Butler, and a 1st rounder. And Butler was turned into Kwame Brown :lol: And the first rounder I'm not sure, but maybe it was Bynum?? :lol:


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

_Dre_ said:


> Lebron is already great, Phil wouldn't be brought in to mamimize his talent as much as he would to make his supporting cast look competent, but the Cavaliers are too far away, I doubt Phil takes that jump.
> 
> I predict if Kobe's traded, you'll hear whispers about Phil jumping to Miami.



Huh? Shaq wouldn't want him. He pubically called him Benedict Arnold because he went back to LA.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Kobe has to want to go to the Bulls. If Kobe wants to play with the Knicks, that's the only team the Lakers can trade him to and will have to take what they can.


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## Mateo (Sep 23, 2006)

They certainly don't _have_ to do anything. Kobe is under contract and will have to try and work with them to get traded to a team where the Lakers can get a reasonable return, otherwise he won't be traded at all.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

If Kobe opts out in 08-09 and the Lakers get nothing for him, that will be 10x worse.


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## Dynasty Raider (Nov 15, 2002)

*SIT HIM for the entire 2 years ...*



DuMa said:


> kobe's a crybaby


Kobe's a DONT MASK!!

Too bad it took this for you all to see what I've been saying for Years. He's even got you all thinking it is the Laker management and NOT his inability to lead ANYONE. So you disrupt the team and bring in O'Neal (who I love, but has been injured more than healthy the last few years),and Kobe still doesn't get a championsip ... whose fault will it be then.

Personally, I believe this has all been created by Kobe to justify his inability to lead. He knows what his deficiencies are!!!! He blamed his own family for being estranged from him by calling them racists, and that was AFTER he threw them out of his house. To cover for him being such an *** ... he went public during a Finals (worldwide coverage) to label them racists. Of course, that clearly explains why they haven't had anything to do with him for years. (Except for the little job he got Daddy w/the Sparks; and now Daddy is gone. Hmmmm.)

What a joke ... Kobe is an embarrassment to Black professional athletes --- amazing. 

Rape a child, try to destroy Shaq' marriage and now rape an organization.

I hope they make his sit out those 2 years --- I don't think he can survive without media coverage. And, he certainly wouldn't survive if the same team he couldn't lead played better ball. I say, it is worth the risk to sit him. They are risk takers (got rid of Shaq for Kobe); although that hasn't paid off --- why not try again, this time if just might.


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## Blink4 (Jan 17, 2005)

*Re: SIT HIM for the entire 2 years ...*



Dynasty Raider said:


> Kobe's a b88**!!
> 
> Too bad it took this for you all to see what I've been saying for Years. He's even got you all thinking it is the Laker management and NOT his inability to lead ANYONE. So you disrupt the team and bring in O'Neal (who I love, but has been injured more than healthy the last few years),and Kobe still doesn't get a championsip ... whose fault will it be then.
> 
> ...


Please go away


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## essbee (Oct 30, 2006)

*Re: SIT HIM for the entire 2 years ...*



Dynasty Raider said:


> Kobe's a b88**!!
> 
> 
> What a joke ... Kobe is an embarrassment to Black professional athletes --- amazing.
> ...


It's kinda funny how you say he raped a *child* right after pointing out that he's a black athlete. Since you know.. he was not convicted of rape.


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## Brockin25 (Jun 17, 2007)

SlamJam said:


> :lol: :lol: :lol:


Dude... don't laugh. Bulls fans really believe that crap. They think Luol Deng is going to be a superstar...


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## DANNY (Aug 9, 2005)

HKF said:


> If Kobe opts out in 08-09 and the Lakers get nothing for him, that will be 10x worse.


highly unlikely he's opt out and forfeit 20 million dollars

the nba is a business after all right?


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## DANNY (Aug 9, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> If Kobe leaves the Lakers does Phil Jackson stick around?


Phil probably ends up in Australia or Montana


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

I'm not sure that a contending team could clear the capspace needed to sign Kobe to a MAX contract if he opted out.If he wanted to opt out and take a fifty percent paycut then sure that'd be a good option.Otherwise noone that was already good could sign him.Well I guess they could trade their other players to the bobcats for nothing,but other that it'd be hard to see how opting out is a practical option if your real goal is to end up with a contender.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

dannyM said:


> highly unlikely he's opt out and forfeit 20 million dollars
> 
> the nba is a business after all right?


Kobe would make so much more back in NY anyway. Man, NYC would completely embrace him (provided they win). I should know, I have seen them do it in the past with players from all walks of life. If you win, NY will love you.


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

Brockin25 said:


> Dude... don't laugh. Bulls fans really believe that crap. They think Luol Deng is going to be a superstar...


I don't know who's dumber. The Bulls fans who make that statement, or you, for actually believing that we *all* think that way.

Probably just you, though.


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## SeaNet (Nov 18, 2004)

The Lakers are getting exactly what they deserve w/ all of this. The right move would have been to move Kobe years ago (i.e. instead of moving Eddie Jones) when they could have gotten a king's ransom for him and established the foundation for way more than 3 titles. I hope the Lakers *and* Kobe rot.


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## Brockin25 (Jun 17, 2007)

Pay Ton said:


> I don't know who's dumber. The Bulls fans who make that statement, or you, for actually believing that we *all* think that way.
> 
> Probably just you, though.


Ehh probably not. I'd be happy to debate you on the merits of Paxson's "plan." Are you actually denying that the majority of Bulls message board fans think that this "core can reasonably contend" and that they weren't highly in favor of two trades that ended up amounting to Curry and Chandler for Tyrus and maybe Spencer Hawes?

The short shorts mafia is dilusional.. and, like you, they all seem to want to talk with this chip on their shoulder.

Meanwhile, nobody on the current Bulls roster is much better than Horace Grant...


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Dissonance19 said:


> Huh? Shaq wouldn't want him. He pubically called him Benedict Arnold because he went back to LA.


Do you know how fast Shaq would retract that if Riley stepped down and he had to deal with Billy Donovan whispers? Please.

Right now, supposedly Kobe's wishlist is Phoenix, New York and Chicago. Chicago is the favorite, New York the reach, Phoenix the sleeper IMO. As a Mavs fan I'd like to see him out of the West, but Phoenix...that's a fun possibility. All in all, if this gets serious, Chicago better not ***** out. This is a once in a lifetime move...Kobe Bryants don't get traded.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

SeaNet said:


> The Lakers are getting exactly what they deserve w/ all of this. The right move would have been to move Kobe years ago (i.e. instead of moving Eddie Jones) when they could have gotten a king's ransom for him and established the foundation for way more than 3 titles. I hope the Lakers *and* Kobe rot.


I heard the Suns offered Kidd and Marion once. I think they'd have 5 titles by now if they had done that.


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

Kobe is Phoenix uniform , just scary.


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## f22egl (Jun 3, 2004)

Up on Kobe Bryant's Website right now, basically confirming the LA Times rumor.



> The Truth: A new road ahead
> Wassup y'all ...
> 
> Man, today is one of those surreal days for me and my family. When you love something as much as I love the Lakers its hard to even imagine thinking about being elsewhere. But, the *ONE THING I will never sacrifice when it comes to basketball is WINNING.* That is plain and simply what it's all about. It's in my DNA. It's what pushes me to work as hard as I do. It's my daily passion and pursuit.
> ...


http://news.kb24.com/#311


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## Smez86 (Jun 29, 2006)

Brockin25 said:


> Ehh probably not. I'd be happy to debate you on the merits of Paxson's "plan." Are you actually denying that the majority of Bulls message board fans think that this "core can reasonably contend" and that they weren't highly in favor of two trades that ended up amounting to Curry and Chandler for Tyrus and maybe Spencer Hawes?
> 
> The short shorts mafia is dilusional.. and, like you, they all seem to want to talk with this chip on their shoulder.
> 
> Meanwhile, nobody on the current Bulls roster is much better than Horace Grant...


Speaking as a Bulls fan:

1. Most of us are happy to get rid of Curry and are quite happy with Tyrus. Did I miss something, or are the Bulls not playing playoff basketball while the Knicks are fighting to get to the 8th spot in the pathetic East?

2. The Chandler trade was bad. And the initial trade to get him was bad.

3. They can reasonably contend. There is no reason to think otherwise. No Ben Gordon and Luol Deng are nowhere near Kobe's level. We're not idiots. But we also know they're not a bunch of Horace Grant's.

Not meaning to hijack the thread, but I really don't see Kobe going anywhere. And if by some chance he does, I don't think it will be particularly beneficial to either team.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

It would've been cooler if he typed like a troll, then we'd know he was irrationally upset and wanted OUT.


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## One on One (Dec 12, 2004)

Wow, sounds like he is gone and maybe already knows where.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

One on One said:


> Wow, sounds like he is gone and maybe already knows where.


 To a winning franchise like the Knicks! I bet that he'll get DOUBLE the endorsement money there!


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

Brockin25 said:


> Ehh probably not. I'd be happy to debate you on the merits of Paxson's "plan." *Are you actually denying that the majority of Bulls message board fans think that this "core can reasonably contend" *and that they weren't highly in favor of two trades that ended up amounting to Curry and Chandler for Tyrus and maybe Spencer Hawes?


I don't see where that has anything to do with saying Luol Deng has a chance to be a superstar being that the term superstar is reserved for only a handful of players in this league.

But for the record, I hated the Tyson Chandler trade, and I'm still waiting on the outcome of the Tyrus Thomas trade, even though Curry's ineptitude on the defensive end doesn't make me miss him much (and people call Ben Gordon one dimensional).




Brockin25 said:


> The short shorts mafia is dilusional.. and, like you, they all seem to want to talk with this chip on their shoulder.


It makes me sound cool.



Brockin25 said:


> Meanwhile, nobody on the current Bulls roster is much better than Horace Grant...


In his prime? I can't take that as an insult, and I also can't disagree.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Can you imagine Phil Jackson in Cleveland taking Lebron's game to the next level?


Can I imagine Phil Jackson latching himself onto the league's next great wing player and trying to milk one more ring out of it?

...yeah, I can see that.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

f22egl said:


> Up on Kobe Bryant's Website right now, basically confirming the LA Times rumor.
> 
> 
> 
> http://news.kb24.com/#311


I can barely read a Kobe blog or "letter to his fans." It has too much of a sense of wonderment and amazement at how, like, surreal all this...stuff...is, man. Like, wow, I can barely believe all this is really happening. Man, I never thought it would come to this...

Even though he's instigated most of this. It takes self-indulgence to another level.

He types like Keanu Reeves talks.

Whirlwind media circus in the middle of the Conference Finals, then a retraction, and now we're back on again. We get it. Kobe is competitive. So is everyone else in the NBA. Except Stromile Swift. Just demand your trade already and knock off all the Pollyanna, bewildered, man-it's-been-a-tough-couple-days-I-never-thought-it-would-come-to-this....again crap. Emo.


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

1st of all, the post on Kobe's website is the exact same post he put up on May 30th. Someone on the website keeps updating the date.

2nd of all all we have to go on is the LA Times unnamed source...

ill reserve judgment until someone actually get traded somewhere..


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Rawse said:


> He types like Keanu Reeves talks.


Come on, give him a break, he didn't go to college! He doesn't even know what the word 'no' means. (too soon?)


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## Brockin25 (Jun 17, 2007)

Smez86 said:


> Speaking as a Bulls fan:
> 
> 1. Most of us are happy to get rid of Curry and are quite happy with Tyrus. Did I miss something, or are the Bulls not playing playoff basketball while the Knicks are fighting to get to the 8th spot in the pathetic East?


Most of you didn't know what has always won in the NBA... inside presence offensively or defensively. Without it, only Jordan rely could defy the startling trend. The fact is, Cleveland and Indiana showed that without it... you could be about as solid as you want and you'll always lose to the special teams. Is Tyrus better than Curry? If they were both 6'9" hell yeah... but if Curry was 6'9" he couldn't even play for Indiana. 3-4 tweeners and 4-5 tweeners can make you look really good in the regular season and first round, but that is the only place they will ever take you. Karl Malone, the best pure four all-time, doesn't have a ring. McHale, second best.. only has 3 as a second fiddle. A four need be great to be more valuable than a competent true five.

Secondly, Eddy Curry is not great, we know that. But the Bulls had remedies for his weaknesses... New York does not. You'll never find me or anyone with half a brain saying that he is good for New York. He was good for us. In out two games with him v. Detroit in 05, we killed the Eastern Champion Pistons twice in Detroit. We won 49 games this year.. in 04-05 we won 47 and embarassed a lot of teams. 

And it isn't just Tyrus v. Curry... since we gave Chandler away for basically nothing... it becomes Tyrus and Hawes (?)(mediocrity personified) for Chandler and Curry.



> 2. The Chandler trade was bad. And the initial trade to get him was bad.


Yes! I can feel it flowing through you... you're married to this plan because you decided, like most Bulls message board clowns, that you love Paxson and everything he stands for, so therefore you need to derive everything you think from THAT starting point. 

Who the hell cares if Paxson is better than Krause (who made the "bad trade to get Chandler")? Is that the job description for the Bulls GM job? Be better than Krause? What about ALL the GMs who are better than Krause... shouldn't you be better than them?



> 3. They can reasonably contend. There is no reason to think otherwise. No Ben Gordon and Luol Deng are nowhere near Kobe's level. We're not idiots. But we also know they're not a bunch of Horace Grant's.
> 
> Not meaning to hijack the thread, but I really don't see Kobe going anywhere. And if by some chance he does, I don't think it will be particularly beneficial to either team.


There is a reason to think otherwise.. teams with 6'9" fours rebounding jumpers and "trying hard" have never contended for anything. None of them is better than Grant. If Grant was in Deng's shoes... with no Jordan, Pippen, O'neal, Hardway or Bryant? Shiiiiiiit. Horace Grant is better than any of those chumps you love so much....


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## Brockin25 (Jun 17, 2007)

The Truth: A new road ahead
Wassup y'all ...

Man, today is one of those surreal days for me and my family. When you love something as much as I love the Lakers its hard to even imagine thinking about being elsewhere. But, the ONE THING I will never sacrifice when it comes to basketball is WINNING. That is plain and simply what it's all about. It's in my DNA. It's what pushes me to work as hard as I do. It's my daily passion and pursuit.

The more I thought about the future, the more I became convinced that the Lakers and me just have two different visions for the future. The Lakers are pursuing a longer-term plan that is different from what Dr. Buss shared with me at the time I re-signed as a free agent. I have seen that plan unfold for the last three years and watched great trade opportunities come and go, and have seen free agents passed on. That has led to the Lakers not winning a playoff series. All of that was frustrating in itself, but then, this week to have someone "inside" the Laker organization try to blame me in the media for us not being a contender right now -- that is what brought me to my current position today.

I want it to be clear that I still love, with all my heart, the Laker Legacy. From Mikan to West to Goodrich to Wilt to Kareem to Magic. That will never change. And the support my family and I have gotten from Lakers fans is undeniably the best. I will also always believe that.

But, now there is a new road ahead. I am gonna keep grindin and keep workin to get back to competing for Championships. Sometimes the trek up the mountain is tough. But, I know we'll get there.

Strength and Honor,
Kobe 

And many posters think LA will get fair value for him in a trade.


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## thatsnotgross (Dec 4, 2006)

It's already posted three times with his website. It would also be nice if you put up a link instead of copy and pasting. Its copyright infringement. Anyways...

As much as I want Kobe to be on the Knicks, IT doesn't have the talent to get a guy like Kobe. Why? Because he actually believes that there are actually talent on this god forsaken team. 

Kobe KNOWS that NY loves him and NY loves him too. Every time he comes to MSG, he hears the applause, the chants of his name, and all the begging and pleading for Kobe to come to NY. The few times I remember Knicks fans booing Kobe was the year of his Colorado rape charges. This year, there was a lot of begging from Knicks fans.

If he says, I only want to go to the Knicks, I will just pray on my knees to get a 3rd team involve to make this deal work.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

Any team that's going to go for Kobe is going to have to gut their team to get him. So as soon as he arrives, he's going to be in the exact same position as he was with the Lakers.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Hibachi! said:


> Any team that's going to go for Kobe is going to have to gut their team to get him. So as soon as he arrives, he's going to be in the exact same position as he was with the Lakers.


 Not true, in fact, by publicly demanding a trade, he's effectively neutered the front office. Since they know that they can get him in FA when he opt out, they'll drag their heels on a "fair" trade for Kobe. In fact, any off-season move that the Lakers could have made just got blown to bits by Kobe, being the petulant child that he is, going public with his frustrations.

Do you think ANY team would trade for Odom when in a few months they could be trading the EXACT SAME PLAYER for Kobe?


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## knicksfan89 (Jan 6, 2005)

as a knicks fan I hope we get him because we need someone like him or jermaine o'neal


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

As I have said time and time again, superstars are traded in this league for complete garbage. Kobe will be no different. With his no-trade clause, you're not getting an even trade. You're getting a trade with the principal involved that is moved (Kobe) for way less than your value around the league.

Personally I hope he gets traded because the NBA needs a story to get behind. Even if it's just pure hate for Kobe, it would be the biggest thing to happen to the NBA since Jordan came out of retirement (in 95) . Seriously.


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

IceMan23and3 said:


> Not true, in fact, by publicly demanding a trade, he's effectively neutered the front office. Since they know that they can get him in FA when he opt out, they'll drag their heels on a "fair" trade for Kobe. In fact, any off-season move that the Lakers could have made just got blown to bits by Kobe, being the petulant child that he is, going public with his frustrations.
> 
> Do you think ANY team would trade for Odom when in a few months they could be trading the EXACT SAME PLAYER for Kobe?


Or if he didn't demand trade publicly, the Lakers front office would have just ignored him.


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## One on One (Dec 12, 2004)

If I'm the Lakers I wouldn't trade him. He has no way out if you don't trade him and he's not going to spend the next two years of his prime sulking. I'm not sure what the Lakers plan is though cause Kobe is right that you need to try to make a move and win now. Why are you sitting pat with one of the greatest players ever??


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## AliG (Dec 26, 2006)

CubanLaker said:


> 1st of all, the post on Kobe's website is the exact same post he put up on May 30th. Someone on the website keeps updating the date.
> 
> 2nd of all all we have to go on is the LA Times unnamed source...
> 
> ill reserve judgment until someone actually get traded somewhere..


Exactly...there's nothing new in that post, I read exactly the same words back in May.. and yet the whole media is treating it like a new story - pathetic!


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## f22egl (Jun 3, 2004)

CubanLaker said:


> 1st of all, the post on Kobe's website is the exact same post he put up on May 30th. Someone on the website keeps updating the date.
> 
> 2nd of all all we have to go on is the LA Times unnamed source...
> 
> ill reserve judgment until someone actually get traded somewhere..


So what is the motive of updating the date on the website? It was obviously intentional and not some glitch on his website. I think he is still upset that the Lakers have failed to make a major trade and he wants the Lakers to make one or he wants out.


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## Eternal (Sep 7, 2005)

f22egl said:


> So what is the motive of updating the date on the website? It was obviously intentional and not some glitch on his website. I think he is still upset that the Lakers have failed to make a major trade and he wants the Lakers to make one or he wants out.


It's not a glitch. From what I've heard Kobe told them to update it frequently.


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## AliG (Dec 26, 2006)

Common sense told me that he's trying to push the Lakers to do whatever it takes to improve the team. And there no better way of applying this pressure than by going public as Kobe did. Why? As it happen now, the Lakers will be screwed under two out of 3 scenarios below:
(1) Trade Kobe - the Lakers can't get anything equivalent of him, they will lose ticket sales next year. Kobe will be happy though if he gets traded to a team that he likes.
(2) Keep Kobe but did a poor job during off season trades - Kobe will become free agents in a year time and Lakers will be screwed. Kobe will be happy though, if he joins a team he likes.
(3) Keep Kobe but improve the team tremendously - Kobe will be happy, the Lakers should do better in playoff next year, fans will be happier.

So, it looks like under all scenarios Kobe is doing no wrong for himself!!!!

The only thing you can blame Kobe is his selfishness, he doesn't show enough loyalty to Lakers, but how can we still expect "loyalty" when players get traded like pork meat in the supermarket these days? Lakers did what they have to do in the past because it's in their financial interest. Kobe did what he has to do today for his ego (he wants more rings, and he wants them now!!).


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

Here is more false promise from Jerry Buss.


> Lakers owner Jerry Buss took the unusual step of sending a letter to season-ticket holders Friday that expanded on brief written statements he had dispatched since Kobe Bryant initially began demanding a trade almost three weeks ago. In the letter, Buss said he wanted to address "overriding concerns or questions of the basketball side of the Lakers organization." Los Angeles Times
> 
> "You want to win. We want to win," Buss said in the letter. "We are on the same page. During my 28 years of ownership the Lakers have been to the playoffs 26 times. Lakers teams under my ownership have gone to the finals 12 times and won eight championships. Merely qualifying for the playoffs is certainly an accomplishment; however, we all want more. That said, and we know this from experience, making it to the [NBA] finals is never easy, and winning it all is even harder. "Our goal has been, and remains to be, to build the Lakers into a team that can regularly compete for championships. I believe that we have always shown a willingness to do what needs to be done and spend what needs to be spent to deliver you championship caliber basketball. We remain committed to that philosophy." Los Angeles Times


http://hoopshype.com/rumors.htm


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## Brockin25 (Jun 17, 2007)

Pay Ton said:


> I don't see where that has anything to do with saying Luol Deng has a chance to be a superstar being that the term superstar is reserved for only a handful of players in this league.
> 
> But for the record, I hated the Tyson Chandler trade, and I'm still waiting on the outcome of the Tyrus Thomas trade, even though Curry's ineptitude on the defensive end doesn't make me miss him much (and people call Ben Gordon one dimensional).


Yeah but Gordon's one dimension is three point shooting. Curry's one dimension is post scoring from a 285 pounder that hasn't been seen by many players not named Shaq or Wilt. Post scoring also may be the single most important championship attribute. In today's league... where Oden will be the first center in a long time to be as good as Ewing, Olajuwon, Shaq, or Robinson in his prime... you hold onto that.


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## SeaNet (Nov 18, 2004)

Brockin25 said:


> Yeah but Gordon's one dimension is three point shooting. Curry's one dimension is post scoring from a 285 pounder that hasn't been seen by many players not named Shaq or Wilt. Post scoring also may be the single most important championship attribute. In today's league... where Oden will be the first center in a long time to be as good as Ewing, Olajuwon, Shaq, or Robinson in his prime... you hold onto that.


All right!!! Some love for Eddie Curry!!! Get on his back and riiiide to a title!!!


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Brockin25 said:


> Dude... don't laugh. Bulls fans really believe that crap. They think Luol Deng is going to be a superstar...


What crap?

Ben Gordon/Luol Deng have 49 wins this past year. Kobe 42. The first two got 10 playoff wins this year. Kobe 1.

59 wins to 43.

I'll take the two young guys (21/24 going into next season), verse the guy thats going to be 29. 

The regular NBA fan here must just watch ESPN, if they think Kobe Bryant is worth Ben Gordon and Luol Deng.

The Lakers can have their 2 seasons of not making the playoffs over the next 2 years, while the Bulls are probably playing in at least 1 NBA Finals, the ECF at the least.

But ESPN hasn't told you to cheer for Ben Gordon/Luol Deng yet, so we'll just have to give that time.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Brockin25 said:


> Yeah but Gordon's one dimension is three point shooting. Curry's one dimension is post scoring from a 285 pounder that hasn't been seen by many players not named Shaq or Wilt. Post scoring also may be the single most important championship attribute. In today's league... where Oden will be the first center in a long time to be as good as Ewing, Olajuwon, Shaq, or Robinson in his prime... you hold onto that.


Ben Gordon has been to the playoffs 3 times over the last year. Eddy Curry has only been the the playoffs once over the past 3 years....and that one time was with Ben Gordon....

Interestingly enough....with Ben Gordon's one dimension being three point shooting as you put it...he scores less than 6 points per game off of threes. That leaves 15 1/2 points not from threes....from freethrows he gets when he drives, as well as his underrated midrange game.

You are completely missing the point on what wins. Post scoring doesn't equal winning. Thats why Zach Randolph and Eddy Curry were both on crappy teams. We've had three of these franchise bigs...Hakeem, Shaq, and Duncan. One, they were the anchors of their team's defense. All were great interior defenders. But what separates them from guys like Curry and Randolph, is that these guys have great court awareness and passing ability. You could run your team's offense through Shaq, Dream, or Duncan. You can't run your team's offense through Eddy Curry. You can run a turnover factory through him though.

Luol Deng is averaging 18.8 PPG 7.1 RPG 2.5 APG 1.2 SPG at 21 years old.

Ben Gordon 21.4 PPG 3.4 RPG 3.6 APG at 23 years old. 

There is no way the Lakers get these guys in a trade for Kobe. They'll only be able to hope for 2nd rate prospects. 

I think most Bulls fans will be happy to keep Gordon/Deng, keep winning, and just point over and laugh at the Lakers losing.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Mebarak said:


> What crap?
> 
> Ben Gordon/Luol Deng have 49 wins this past year. Kobe 42. The first two got 10 playoff wins this year. Kobe 1.
> 
> ...


Eastern Conference (Cavs)..... Western Conference (Spurs)......

I rest my case.


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

Brockin25 said:


> Yeah but Gordon's one dimension is three point shooting. Curry's one dimension is post scoring from a 285 pounder that hasn't been seen by many players not named Shaq or Wilt. Post scoring also may be the single most important championship attribute. In today's league... where Oden will be the first center in a long time to be as good as Ewing, Olajuwon, Shaq, or Robinson in his prime... you hold onto that.


Gordon's one dimension isn't three point shooting. It's scoring, period. He's proven he can score from anywhere on the floor. And he's getting insanely better at drawing fouls each year. Plus Gordon doesn't have just *one dimension*. Gordon is a fine passer, he's not a point guard mind you, but he's a good passer. His defense is also better (and highly improved) for his position that Curry's defense is for his.

As far as scoring big men...Shaq and Wilt were able to pass out of double teams with tremendous skill. Curry is horrid at it. 

I don't think Curry's any better than Rik Smits in his prime.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

IceMan23and3 said:


> Eastern Conference (Cavs)..... Western Conference (Spurs)......
> 
> I rest my case.


So.

Spurs- 58 wins
Cavs- 50 wins

It was obvious the Spurs were the better overall team, but not only that, they were a matchup nightmare.

Bulls- 49 wins
Lakers- 42 wins

Bulls, without a huge matchup advantage, would likely dispatch of the Lakers in the same fashion...5 games at most.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Gordon and Deng is too much for Kobe, which is why I don't feel he will be traded to Chicago. I love Gordon, but I do question if he is capable of scoring 30 ppg on a regular basis and if he got traded for Kobe, that's exactly what he would have to do.


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

dp


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

Mebarak said:


> So.
> 
> Spurs- 58 wins
> Cavs- 50 wins
> ...


would you trade gordon or deng straight up for kobe, if you could
?


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

kflo said:


> would you trade gordon or deng straight up for kobe, if you could
> ?


Answer is on my sig. 




And yes he was serious...


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## Brandon Real (Mar 14, 2006)

Just heard on ESPN (I know, I know) that Kobe's reasoning for the meeting was beacause the Lakers org still didn't take him seriously and thought they could stay put. How dumb can the Laker front office be? Sorry Jerry, we know you live at the poker tables, but not everyone in the world is bluffing.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

HKF said:


> Gordon and Deng is too much for Kobe, which is why I don't feel he will be traded to Chicago. I love Gordon, but I do question if he is capable of scoring 30 ppg on a regular basis and if he got traded for Kobe, that's exactly what he would have to do.



Its hard to rate Gordon right now in that regard.

He is one of the best scorers in the game. All too often, in Chicago, he will go LONG stretches without even touching the ball because of Scott Skiles' awful offensive schemes (some how they get called some of the best in the league).

But still, Ben Gordon should be one of the great scorers in the league for a long time thanks to Skiles'. Ben Gordon is so ahead of the curve as far as scorers go. Skiles' basically, short leash approach with Gordon has made Gordon one of the most efficient scorers in the league at such a young age. Ben scored with a 57.2 TS%. Kobe has only had ONE season with a higher TS% than Ben's in his 3rd season...which was this past season for Kobe. Allen Iverson has never even come close to that. 

It'll be interesting to see where it goes. I expect Ben Gordon to get 25 PPG on 58 TS% next season.

Its disgusting how few NBA fans realize how impactful of a scorer Gordon is.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Mebarak said:


> Luol Deng is averaging 18.8 PPG 7.1 RPG 2.5 APG 1.2 SPG at 21 years old.
> 
> Ben Gordon 21.4 PPG 3.4 RPG 3.6 APG at 23 years old.


When Lebron was 21 he averaged 31/7/7. Don't talk to me about Luol Deng or Ben Gordon being superstars. If they are both superstars, and the rest of the Bulls cast is as good as it is, why did the Bulls go out in the second round to the Pistons, who everyone agrees was a bad team this year?

The only thing more laughable than Bulls fans believing that they don't need Kobe Bryant, is that John Paxson probably agrees. And the reason he believes is because he doesn't want the pressure of really truly building a championship team. At least not one that he can't control with an iron fist. Which if he got Kobe he would not be able to control the team anymore.


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## Greg Ostertag! (May 1, 2003)

HKF said:


> Gordon and Deng is too much for Kobe, which is why I don't feel he will be traded to Chicago. I love Gordon, but I do question if he is capable of scoring 30 ppg on a regular basis and if he got traded for Kobe, that's exactly what he would have to do.


I agree with this sentiment.

Trading Ben and Luol for Kobe won't achieve the desired results for either club. Chicago guts their team where the forming a well-rounded attack, and Lakers lose pretty much all of their name/star power. I don't see this trade happening.

What are you thoughts on Atlanta, HKF? Could they enter the race?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

If Bulls fans don't want Kobe, I hope the Cavs aren't so dumb. Trade anyone on the roster not named Lebron James, and build around Lebron, Kobe, and a bunch of NBDLers. Would probably win the east easily every year.

But I think Kobe will end up in New York. Which could save basketball.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

Basketball doesn't need New York or Kobe Bryant.Save basketball...Save that hyperbole for someone gullible enough to think the game needs to be saved.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Greg Ostertag! said:


> What are you thoughts on Atlanta, HKF? Could they enter the race?


I bet that Kobe would not agree to a trade to Atlanta.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Diable said:


> Basketball doesn't need New York or Kobe Bryant.Save basketball...Save that hyperbole for someone gullible enough to think the game needs to be saved.


I'm saving basketball right now, using only a rubber band, some toothpicks, a sample of Kurt Rambis' DNA and a time-flux capacitor. What are you doing, cool guy?


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Greg Ostertag! said:


> I agree with this sentiment.
> 
> Trading Ben and Luol for Kobe won't achieve the desired results for either club. Chicago guts their team where the forming a well-rounded attack, and Lakers lose pretty much all of their name/star power. I don't see this trade happening.
> 
> What are you thoughts on Atlanta, HKF? Could they enter the race?


The Hawks front office is even more inept than the Lakers or the Knicks. I have doubts that Kobe would go to the Hawks, unless the goal is to fill up the arena. Besides they would most likely have to give up too much for Kobe because they don't have the right mix of veteran contracts, so young players (like Marvin and J-Smoove) would have to be thrown in.


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## Flash is the Future (May 12, 2006)

Personally, I hope Kobe goes to Chicago and screws up a team that we matchup poorly against. They should stay away from Kobe IMO.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

futuristxen said:


> When Lebron was 21 he averaged 31/7/7. Don't talk to me about Luol Deng or Ben Gordon being superstars. If they are both superstars, and the rest of the Bulls cast is as good as it is, why did the Bulls go out in the second round to the Pistons, who everyone agrees was a bad team this year?
> 
> The only thing more laughable than Bulls fans believing that they don't need Kobe Bryant, is that John Paxson probably agrees. And the reason he believes is because he doesn't want the pressure of really truly building a championship team. At least not one that he can't control with an iron fist. Which if he got Kobe he would not be able to control the team anymore.


I know its your thing to hate on the Bulls players, and devalue them, because you were a Bulls fan (as you said), until they were 31-40 with their backs against the wall, and then you jumped ship to Lebron James, and showed your true colors...just in time for Ben Gordon and Andres Nocioni (that guy that was injured for most of the year) rallied the Bulls into the playoffs. 

Anyhow, I didn't say Ben Gordon/Luol Deng we're superstars. You are just making stuff up now.

Hell, here is a post I made a few days ago in another thread.

"Lebron James, Dwyane Wade, Tim Duncan, Dirk Nowitzki, Kobe Bryant are the only superstars in the league to me. "

Just the fact of what they've shown so far, and knowing how hard they work on their games (two of the hardest workers in the NBA), both Gordon/Deng could become superstars. Its not that hard to imagine.

Bulls just have fantasy depth, in reality, they weren't that great of a team last year overall, and Gordon/Deng bulked the team for the most part.

Kirk Hinrich took 2 months off and played absolutely ****ty ball for those 2 months. But from February on, he was on ship.

Tyrus Thomas showed stretches, such as March/Pistons series, but wasn't there for most of the year outside of a few game stretches.

Thabo Sefolosha, just showed flashes in games spaced far out. They always were on national tv when he had his good games, so people thought he did this every night.

Ben Wallace was horrible for most of the year. Didn't seem to care.

PJ Brown was like having a plank board out there up until the Pistons series.

Andres Nocioni was injured for most of the year, and played like crap when he came back.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thabo/Tyrus are rookies, they should still improve quite a bit, and both showed the tools to be major players (star potential for Tyrus). 

Kirk should become more consistent.

Nocioni should be better just by being healthy.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Like you said...the Cavs management shouldn't be dumb, and should trade everything not named Lebron James for Kobe.

Well why can't Bulls do the same. Make a trade consisting of everything not named Ben Gordon/Luol Deng. Knicks are doing it in saying they won't put Eddy Curry in the trade. How come the Bulls can't do that too? Bulls can offer a more attractive package than both Cleveland and New York with pieces outside of Deng/Gordon. Bulls can offer cap relief. Cavs and Knicks can't do that. Bulls can offer a good player that is relatively young (Hinrich), Knicks can't do that. Bulls have the best young prospects. Tyrus Thomas/Thabo Sefolosha vs. Channing Frye/David Lee/Renaldo Balkman vs. Umm, what do the Cavs have.

Its basically Suns vs. Bulls. Suns are the only team that can offer a more attractive package than the Bulls draft pick wise, proven player wise (Shawn Marion), and young player wise (Barbosa), a draft pick (Hawks), and still have plenty to compete. So it could come down to the Lakers choosing to take less from Chicago vs. more from Phoenix.

Basically:

Kirk Hinrich, Tyrus Thomas, PJ Brown, 2008 first round pick

vs.

Leandro Barbosa, Shawn Marion, Hawks 2008 Pick.

Basically, option one, send him out of conference, get a good point guard, and a great prospect, and then cap relief from PJ Brown...in which you plan on bottoming out, getting one of those good guards from the 2008 draft, and going after a free agent.

Or...going with the better players, but sending him out West, and trying to get one of those great young guards with the Hawks pick rather than their own.

In the end, for all sides involved, Kobe to Phoenix probably makes the most sense. But the Lakers would end up taking less value back in a trade with Chicago if they are hellbent on sending him out East.

You act like its a bad decision for Paxson to trade two, very young players, who are not injury prone, that have shown that they can get you more wins between the two of them, than Kobe will get you himself, for Kobe is a bad decision. In my opinion, if Paxson was to send Gordon and Deng to LA for Kobe, he is taking the cowards way out, and it will hurt the Bulls.

I'll take my chances with Gordon, who is averaging 21.4 PPG, and will be 24 for next season, and Luol Deng, who is averaging 18.8 PPG, and will be 22 for next season over Kobe.


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## f22egl (Jun 3, 2004)

I have a similar sentiment about not trading Arenas and Butler for Kobe which has been rumored on the air in Washington. But to not part with either Deng or Gordon doesn't make sense to me from an outside perspective. The Knicks could easily offer a better package than that and I think Kobe is willing to open his options to other teams if he is indeed demanding a trade.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Mebarak said:


> I'll take my chances with Gordon, who is averaging 21.4 PPG, and will be 24 for next season, and Luol Deng, who is averaging 18.8 PPG, and will be 22 for next season over Kobe.


I didn't read any of your post except for this part which is your conclusion. What a ludicrous position to take when the Bulls have cover for Deng at the 3, and you would effectively be replacing Gordon's 21.4 with Kobe's 30+ points per game.

What is wrong with:
Kirk Hinrich
Kobe Bryant
Nocioni
whoever
Ben Wallace

How is it hatred to say that's an improvement over:

Kirk Hinrich
Ben Gordon
Luol Deng
whoever
Ben Wallace

I am being completely sincere and completely objective to say that Kobe Bryant, by himself, is better than Luol Deng and Ben Gordon combined, and will remain so for the large foreseeable future.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Mebarak said:


> I know its your thing to hate on the Bulls players, and devalue them, because you were a Bulls fan (as you said), until they were 31-40 with their backs against the wall, and then you jumped ship to Lebron James, and showed your true colors...just in time for Ben Gordon and Andres Nocioni (that guy that was injured for most of the year) rallied the Bulls into the playoffs.


Okay. I just read this. This is patently false. Just because you are a newb on the Bulls board, doesn't mean you know everything. I was a Bulls fan till they put Eddy Curry's DNA on the bargaining table. Sorry if I have personal morals and won't support sports teams that transgress them to support their own greed.

The Bulls were a playoff team when I left them, and the Cavs were not. And that's just the facts of the situation. Sorry to disapoint your little made up narrative.


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## Aurelino (Jul 25, 2003)

> First came a report that Bryant had publicly restated his trade request. Then came word of an amateur video in which Bryant profanely expressed his frustration with the Los Angeles Lakers.
> 
> The report proved to be inaccurate. *The video, which could become public by the end of the week, could be damaging.*





> The footage appears to be legitimate, based on a shorter video posted on YouTube.com. The video’s owners played the entire 24-second clip for hoopsworld.com, which posted an article about it yesterday. The author, Eric Pincus, is a Los Angeles-based writer who has spent considerable time around the Lakers and Bryant. The video, Pincus writes, “leaves no doubt that it is in fact Bryant.”





> * “Are you kidding me?” Bryant says in the video. He goes on to say, with a number of profanities mixed in, that the Lakers should “ship out” Bynum.
> 
> “We’re talking about Jason Kidd,” Bryant says. He also speaks in a derisive tone about General Manager Mitch Kupchak before the video abruptly ends.*
> 
> The video’s owners claim that a Lakers fan offered to buy the video to keep it private but that they declined. Instead, they intend to charge $1.99 through their Web site.





http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/19/s...l?_r=2&ref=basketball&oref=slogin&oref=slogin


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

Aurelino said:


> http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/19/s...l?_r=2&ref=basketball&oref=slogin&oref=slogin


Wow, the fact that people filmed Bryant (while he was living in his private life) and are trying to exploit the video on the internet for $2 a pop makes me sick to my stomach.



> The video’s owners claim that a Lakers fan offered to buy the video to keep it private but that they declined. Instead, they intend to charge $1.99 through their Web site.
> 
> “I personally think we’re going to make more money this way,” the spokesman said. “I think people want to see it.”


have these guys honestly forgotten that this is a person's career they are dealing with?


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

Drewbs said:


> Wow, the fact that people filmed Bryant (while he was living in his private life) and are trying to exploit the video on the internet for $2 a pop makes me sick to my stomach.
> 
> 
> 
> have these guys honestly forgotten that this is a person's career they are dealing with?


This all may be true, but how ****ing dumb can you be to run your mouth like that in public? I say just keep him and if he causes problems, sit his *** on the bench. If Kobe is going to trash his trade value and **** us in the process, he can sit and do nothing. If he even tried to pull a Vince Carter, the media would serve him up for dinner.


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

Drewbs said:


> Wow, the fact that people filmed Bryant (while he was living in his private life) and are trying to exploit the video on the internet for $2 a pop makes me sick to my stomach.
> 
> 
> 
> have these guys honestly forgotten that this is a person's career they are dealing with?


This is nothing. Remember last year some demons tried to sell sex tapes of Christopher and Dana Reeve.
Afterall this is America, where people will do anything for money.


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## f22egl (Jun 3, 2004)

Courtesy of KB24.com, Kobe Bryant posts his fans' thoughts which say that Kobe should not be in a Lakers' uniform.



> Truth: Fans speak out
> Normally, this area is reserved for Kobe's thoughts. But today, we're highlighting comments from fans in the KB24.com forums:
> 
> Kobe: demand that trade.....the Lakers decided this was Bynum's team and not yours when they didn't make a trade at the deadline...you're not being selfish, you're being honest....I'll be a fan of yours wherever you go. Freshen things up a little, go to Philly or Chi-town, or rock the Big Apple- I mean how cool would that be for the NBA?
> ...


http://news.kb24.com/#324


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## SeaNet (Nov 18, 2004)

Theonee said:


> This is nothing. *Remember last year some demons tried to sell sex tapes of Christopher and Dana Reeve.*
> Afterall this is America, where people will do anything for money.


Hmmmm... do you have a link?


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## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Okay. I just read this. This is patently false. Just because you are a newb on the Bulls board, doesn't mean you know everything. * I was a Bulls fan till they put Eddy Curry's DNA on the bargaining table.* Sorry if I have personal morals and won't support sports teams that transgress them to support their own greed.
> 
> The Bulls were a playoff team when I left them, and the Cavs were not. And that's just the facts of the situation. Sorry to disapoint your little made up narrative.



I will cosign this. I remember when you lost your respect for the Bulls organization when that happened.


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

SeaNet said:


> Hmmmm... do you have a link?


Sorry, it was more than a year ago.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Drewbs said:


> Wow, the fact that people filmed Bryant (while he was living in his private life) and are trying to exploit the video on the internet for $2 a pop makes me sick to my stomach.


By my calculations, they'll get like $20. I don't think ANYONE cares to pay to see Kobe shouting into his phone because he's angry about not getting a player traded. I don't need video of that.... maybe of his hot wife.... well you know.... If they don't got sex, I don't think anyone wants to see it or even cares about it.




Theonee said:


> This is nothing. Remember last year some demons tried to sell sex tapes of Christopher and Dana Reeve.
> Afterall this is America, where people will do anything for money.


I can't believe I googled Christopher Reeve sex tape... I think I am officially going to hell.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Tragedy said:


> I will cosign this. I remember when you lost your respect for the Bulls organization when that happened.


Really? You didn't lose respect for the Bulls organization for how they treated the Jordan retirement?(No2) You know, how they shipped out Pippen, Horace, Jackson.... instead of showing the the respect that they had earned by helping the team to win 6 championships? Pippen should have NEVER been a Blazer. Horace should have NEVER been a Magician(?) I'm not even a fan of the Bulls and I was pissed that they were sending them out to different teams. I mean, firing a coach that won 70% of the time? 6 rings!!! SIX and they tossed them out like they were nothing! That's when I lost all respect for the Bulls organization. The Curry thing was just another dick maneuver by them.


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## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

IceMan23and3 said:


> Really? You didn't lose respect for the Bulls organization for how they treated the Jordan retirement?(No2) You know, how they shipped out Pippen, Horace, Jackson.... instead of showing the the respect that they had earned by helping the team to win 6 championships? Pippen should have NEVER been a Blazer. Horace should have NEVER been a Magician(?) I'm not even a fan of the Bulls and I was pissed that they were sending them out to different teams. I mean, firing a coach that won 70% of the time? 6 rings!!! SIX and they tossed them out like they were nothing! That's when I lost all respect for the Bulls organization. The Curry thing was just another dick maneuver by them.


I agree with you, I was just talking about futurists reasons for not being a Bulls fan in the post Jordan years.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Tragedy said:


> I will cosign this. I remember when you lost your respect for the Bulls organization when that happened.


A lot of the fans were against shipping Curry out, and thought the DNA test was dumb.

But he still stuck around until he felt the team had no hope in that 2005-2006 season, and jumped ship to Cleveland then, not during Currygate.


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## One on One (Dec 12, 2004)

Kobe knew he was being filmed. I'm sure he knew this video was probably gonna come out even though he had talked to these guys before. It wasn't a hidden camera or anything. Kobe just loves the drama and it's great for the game. I can't wait for the E True Hollywood story.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

One on One said:


> Kobe knew he was being filmed. I'm sure he knew this video was probably gonna come out even though he had talked to these guys before. It wasn't a hidden camera or anything. Kobe just loves the drama and it's great for the game. I can't wait for the E True Hollywood story.


Why would he try so hard to be Jordan in public, then turn around and curse up a storm in "an interview"? Do you know how much stuff he had to do just to get his image back to this point? Then he'd curse his team out in season? Even Kobe's not that calculating. He stopped at some random supermarket and struck a deal with some random dude. Ok. Hater.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

IceMan23and3 said:


> Really? You didn't lose respect for the Bulls organization for how they treated the Jordan retirement?(No2) You know, how they shipped out Pippen, Horace, Jackson.... instead of showing the the respect that they had earned by helping the team to win 6 championships? Pippen should have NEVER been a Blazer. Horace should have NEVER been a Magician(?) I'm not even a fan of the Bulls and I was pissed that they were sending them out to different teams. I mean, firing a coach that won 70% of the time? 6 rings!!! SIX and they tossed them out like they were nothing! That's when I lost all respect for the Bulls organization. The Curry thing was just another dick maneuver by them.


Nope. I sucked it up and stayed with them through rebuilding plans A, B, C, D, X. Even got to see one of the rebuilding plans start to work. But c'mon. How can you support a team that to save 10 million dollars is willing to set the precedent in America that an employees DNA is something that the employer has any right to look at? They said it was for Eddy Curry's health. But it was to save money. And it was completely disgusting. I would still be a bulls fan if they had not brought that up, and just traded Eddy because they didn't want to pay him.


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

David Stern most be loving all the publicity NBA is getting, it also saves his face from having to explain the low ratings of NBA. David Stern owes Kobe big time.


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## One on One (Dec 12, 2004)

_Dre_ said:


> Why would he try so hard to be Jordan in public, then turn around and curse up a storm in "an interview"? Do you know how much stuff he had to do just to get his image back to this point? Then he'd curse his team out in season? Even Kobe's not that calculating. He stopped at some random supermarket and struck a deal with some random dude. Ok. Hater.


Hater? Kobe is my 2nd favorite player. If you read the article about this, it says Kobe has talked to these guys before apparently and the camera wasn't out of sight. I like Kobe cause he really doesn't give a **** anymore, ever since the trial. His "perfection" image was a burden and that is gone and now he is free.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Mebarak said:


> A lot of the fans were against shipping Curry out, and thought the DNA test was dumb.
> 
> But she still stuck around until she felt the team had no hope in that 2005-2006 season, and jumped ship to Cleveland then, not during Currygate.


I did indeed stick around into the 2005-2006 season. But the point where I started to drift away from the Bulls was during Currygate. 

I even made a post going into the season that it was the least excited I had been as a Bulls fan in my entire life.

And then after the 3-5 start, I realized I was not getting any joy from supporting the Bulls anymore. I barely even watched the games anymore. And it just wasn't fun any longer to talk about them. Regardless of the Bulls future prospects, that summer with Curry was what dimmed the light on my Bulls fandom.

This is what I wrote on the Bulls forum in the middle of a thread November 19th 2005, which this and the post immedietely after it were my official resigination from being a fan of theirs, though I've always come back and posted on that board:

"Bah. What am I saying we? I don't even think I like this Bulls team anymore. The thrill is gone. You guys do what'chya want"

I fully believe if we hadn't had Currygate, even if the Bulls had lost every game that year, I would still be a fan of theirs. 

I think you're just jealous though because when I did post on the Bulls board, I was a better poster than you have ever been on any board. But that just comes with experience. I started posted on the Bulls board when you would have been....11 or 12?

The entire reason I joined BBB was to talk about the Bulls. My first post on these boards was on the bulls board, and about the Bulls.

To have my Bulls fandom dedication questioned by someone who only knows the glory years through DVD highlight films, and who can't understand what it means to go from rooting for the most dominant sports team of your lifetime, to the biggest joke in the league, but to still believe that better days are around the corner--that's particularly galling.

What do you know about being a Bulls fan really? Were you even alive when Jordan took on the showtime Lakers? Did you see him switch hands in mid-air LIVE in the game? Are you old enough to remember being a Jordan fan when everyone was calling him a selfish ballhogging loser? Do you know how long it took before the Bulls could start beating down the Celtics on a regular basis?

Who are you to question anything about my fandom?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Theonee said:


> David Stern most be loving all the publicity NBA is getting, it also saves his face from having to explain the low ratings of NBA. David Stern owes Kobe big time.


Yeah this is keeping the NBA in the headlines. Which is good. Baseball has the Sox and Yankees in the offseason. Football has it's draft. We've got Kobe and his trade demands. Hopefully he can keep this up till we get to the draft. Shut up for two days. Then start up again for the rest of the summer.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

futuristxen said:


> I did indeed stick around into the 2005-2006 season. But the point where I started to drift away from the Bulls was during Currygate.
> 
> I even made a post going into the season that it was the least excited I had been as a Bulls fan in my entire life.
> 
> ...


Ha! :lol: You always crack me up, Fruity... So you were so passionate about the Bulls once... and now yoy root for the freaking Cavs? The team that's portrayed as the Bulls' doormat? Ha!


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

IceMan23and3 said:


> Really? You didn't lose respect for the Bulls organization for how they treated the Jordan retirement?(No2) You know, how they shipped out Pippen, Horace, Jackson.... instead of showing the the respect that they had earned by helping the team to win 6 championships? Pippen should have NEVER been a Blazer. Horace should have NEVER been a Magician(?) I'm not even a fan of the Bulls and I was pissed that they were sending them out to different teams. I mean, firing a coach that won 70% of the time? 6 rings!!! SIX and they tossed them out like they were nothing! That's when I lost all respect for the Bulls organization. The Curry thing was just another dick maneuver by them.


This is not true. First of all, Horace Grant had left for Orlando as a free agent for more money. He had his three rings and that's why he left. The Bulls replaced him with Rodman just fine. 

Second, Jordan retired before the lockout happened. So Chicago decided it would be in their best interest to rebuild. Now did the rebuilding job work? No, but I can understand the reasoning. Rodman was a free agent, Jordan retired, Phil retired and Pippen was all that was left. Rather than keep try to mismatch a team together, they blew it up.

Maybe if the Lockout doesn't loom this doesn't happen, but then again, if were not for the lockout, NBA players could conceivably continue to sign one year deals (like Reinsdorf did with Jordan) for 30 million dollars. The lockout was more about getting this salary situation under control and it worked. Now there is a true system in place with many rules.

The fallacy that Chicago's front office ran Jordan and company out of town is false. Now what Paxson did was a scumbag move, because a guy's DNA should no way be allowed as information when you're trying to get a deal done.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

HKF said:


> The fallacy that Chicago's front office ran Jordan and company out of town is false. *Now what Paxson did was a scumbag move, because a guy's DNA should no way be allowed as information when you're trying to get a deal done.*


Wouldn't it be in the GM's best interest to know that Curry's DNA prevents him to rebond, defend or block a shot?


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

HKF said:


> This is not true. First of all, Horace Grant had left for Orlando as a free agent for more money. He had his three rings and that's why he left. The Bulls replaced him with Rodman just fine.
> 
> Second, Jordan retired before the lockout happened. So Chicago decided it would be in their best interest to rebuild. Now did the rebuilding job work? No, but I can understand the reasoning. Rodman was a free agent, Jordan retired, Phil retired and Pippen was all that was left. Rather than keep try to mismatch a team together, they blew it up.
> 
> ...


You're kinda rewriting history here. Jordan decided to retire again because they weren't going to keep Jackson at the end of the season. Then they refused to renew Scottie's contract and everyone knew that there wouldn't be a next year well before that final shot against the Jazz. The lockout didn't happen until the next season. If Jackson retired, why was it for only 1 season? They blew up the team before Jordan could decide if he wanted to REALLY retire. That's why he came back again. He didn't get it all out of his system. They shipped out their ENTIRE starting 5! They wanted to part it out when the pieces were valuable... they screwed up in that regard.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

What Paxson did isn't so much scumbag. It was a little ahead of the curve, but the DNA test in the way of Curry is becoming more and more common. Paxson wasn't asking for Curry's entire genome. He was just asking to check a specific portion to see if Curry would develop a heart disease that would cause him trouble.

There was actually A LOT of misinformation on the DNA test. Such as the 50% false positive rate. Thats not the case. There is basically no error room here. They'd get his genetic sequence. Get it in the computer. Then search for the sequences for the specific heart conditions they were looking for. He'd either have the predisposition for them or not. If he did have a predisposition, there was about a 50% chance in the disease actually developing. This was not some test that Curry took, with a 50% false positive rate, and then if it showed up positive, Curry's career is canned. This was a test to show if he has the predisposition or not of it. If he did have the predisposition, then they know what to look out for, and take the correct measures in his diet/exercise routine to prevent this from developing. They'd be on the watch out for the diseases to develop. This wasn't a case of him having the predisposition for the disease meant his career was in the can.

Paxson was willing to give him 3 years- 24 million if he didn't take the test. If he was willing to take the test, Paxson was going to give him 5 years, 50+ million. I don't know, I have a hard time feeling too morally outraged when Paxson was going to give him 24 million dollars without taking the money. Its not like he was trying to throw Curry out on the street, taking away a salary he desperately needed for subsistence. Paxson was offering him good money given the circumstances. Hardly a souless move on Paxson's part.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

IceMan23and3 said:


> You're kinda rewriting history here. Jordan decided to retire again because they weren't going to keep Jackson at the end of the season. Then they refused to renew Scottie's contract and everyone knew that there wouldn't be a next year well before that final shot against the Jazz. The lockout didn't happen until the next season. If Jackson retired, why was it for only 1 season? They blew up the team before Jordan could decide if he wanted to REALLY retire. That's why he came back again. He didn't get it all out of his system. They shipped out their ENTIRE starting 5! They wanted to part it out when the pieces were valuable... they screwed up in that regard.


No you are wrong.

1998: Chicago Bulls win the championship
1998-99: Lockout season happens

Jordan retired before the lockout. Lockout began during the summer.

Get your facts straight first.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

HKF said:


> No you are wrong.
> 
> 1998: Chicago Bulls win the championship
> 1998-99: Lockout season happens
> ...


Dude, that's exactly what I just said. The lockout started in any meaningful way on October 26th by the way....


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## new dynasty (Jun 19, 2007)

futuristxen said:


> Yeah this is keeping the NBA in the headlines. Which is good. Baseball has the Sox and Yankees in the offseason. Football has it's draft. We've got Kobe and his trade demands. Hopefully he can keep this up till we get to the draft. Shut up for two days. Then start up again for the rest of the summer.


then after that it will be all about lebron again......:lol:


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

The lockout happened because of Michael Jordan and Kevin Garnett. In part due to the contracts that the two of them signed. It did not start in October. During summer of '98, the lockout was very real and zero teams held training camp that year (at least not formal training camp). 

None of the Bulls had long term contracts at the time. Jordan signed two consecutive one year deals. Even if Phil wasn't being brought back, that was an independent decision he made on his own. Phil took a year sabbatical and then hooked up with Shaq and Kobe. Pippen was dealt to Houston because Mike retired. 

People keep blaming the Bulls front office, but there were many things at fault here. Maybe if there is no imminent lockout, they bring everyone back. You can't just overlook the lockout, because it was a major event that ended the Bulls run. Note after the lockout, Pippen was never the same. Phil was not staying, if Jordan was retiring period.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

PauloCatarino said:


> Ha! :lol: You always crack me up, Fruity... So you were so passionate about the Bulls once... and now yoy root for the freaking Cavs? The team that's portrayed as the Bulls' doormat? Ha!


I root for whatever team Lebron James is on. And when he retires, unless some new guy comes along to impress me, I'll stop watching the NBA.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

One on One said:


> Hater? Kobe is my 2nd favorite player. If you read the article about this, it says Kobe has talked to these guys before apparently and the camera wasn't out of sight. I like Kobe cause he really doesn't give a **** anymore, ever since the trial. His "perfection" image was a burden and that is gone and now he is free.


Which is why publicly his interviews are as eloquent and rehearsed as they've ever been.


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## thatsnotgross (Dec 4, 2006)

I was watching a clip on espn.com and one of the espn guys said that it is best to trade him prior to the draft not after. The worst move the Lakers can make is 2 weeks or later during the free agency period. Every team will suck their money dry by acquiring the usual overpaid MLE centers. Do you guys think Kobe should be traded before the draft, during the draft, during free agency or after free agency.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

thatsnotgross said:


> I was watching a clip on espn.com and one of the espn guys said that it is best to trade him prior to the draft not after. The worst move the Lakers can make is 2 weeks or later during the free agency period. Every team will suck their money dry by acquiring the usual overpaid MLE centers. Do you guys think Kobe should be traded before the draft, during the draft, during free agency or after free agency.


The reason why before the draft would be better for the Lakers is because it would force the Bulls to have to use other assets other than a sign and traded expiring such as PJ to match the salaries.


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## One on One (Dec 12, 2004)

_Dre_ said:


> Which is why publicly his interviews are as eloquent and rehearsed as they've ever been.


Doesn't sound like that to me at all...I like the new Kobe.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

One on One said:


> Doesn't sound like that to me at all...I like the new Kobe.


New...? All the interviews he's done publicly, he's been articulate and polite. PTI, The Marbury show, press conferences, Stephen A's show.

One "interview" comes out in which he's unknowingly portrayed as vulgar and highly opionated, and you believe it's a stunt and this is how he wants the world to view him. 2 years of A+ plus PR work say you're crazy.


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

A few Jordan quotes worth posting. I guess if Kobe delivered six rings, he could get away with trashing his teammates.



> "We're beating a lot of poor teams. So what? We won a lot of games last year, too. Will Horace and Bill still be playing at this level in the playoffs...Can Pip keep it up?"
> 
> "I hate being out there with those garbagemen. They don't get you the ball."
> 
> ...


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Jordan was a grade A idiot. 

It'd be scary if he ran the Bulls. Kwame Brown and Adam Morrison were his two picks. Amazing. He's a great talent evaluator.

There is a reason why Jordan was never offered anything with the Bulls front office, yet Cartwright, Stacey King, Bill Wennington, John Paxson, and BJ Armstrong have all gotten jobs within the organization. Then you have Pippen and Kukoc who were both offered positions, but declined for the time being. 

Jordan is simply a pompous *******.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

Bartholomew Hunt said:


> A few Jordan quotes worth posting. I guess if Kobe delivered six rings, he could get away with trashing his teammates.


BH with the eye-opener!

Love it!


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## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

lol @ the Jordan quotes.

David Stern and Nike did a great job at making Jordan appear to be this player who can do or say no wrong.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

Jordan also wanted Michael Findley the year Krause picked Jason Caffey...And I sort of think he would have been tempted to stick around another year or so if the Bulls had taken Findley.Morrison was a bad pick,but noone has ever figured out who really made it.Still at the time noone(aside from me) argued all that vociferously about the pick.The same can be said of the Kwame pick.It's silly to act as though either of those picks were far from the mainstream of thought among the people here or in NBA front offices.Both of them are bad picks and both of them could have been made by more NBA GM's than not.You give MJ the sort of choice any idiot can make and he'll look a lot better.

Of course Michael Jordan is a retired basketball player.He was a very competitive person who wasn't renowned for his cuddliness.This thread doesn't have much to do with him unless you want to deflect attention away from the original topic.


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

Mebarak said:


> Jordan was a grade A idiot.
> 
> It'd be scary if he ran the Bulls. Kwame Brown and Adam Morrison were his two picks. Amazing. He's a great talent evaluator.
> 
> ...



And you're a Bulls fan? notice you arent posting that in the Bulls forum.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Lol, Morrison was being praised endlessly in the year before and leading up to that weak draft, and in hindsight you criticize the move. 

Real spineless, I wonder how many of you would've been trashing him for reaching.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Bartholomew Hunt said:


> A few Jordan quotes worth posting. I guess if Kobe delivered six rings, he could get away with trashing his teammates.


Jordan is the ****ING MAN! I mean seriously! He just pimpslapped everyone in his way! He wouldn't mince words. You gotta love it! He was efficient, effective and probably the greatest competitor in the history of the NBA! Kobe doesn't know how to lead like Jordan does. How many times has Kwame cried since he came to LA? Exactly. Kobe isn't in the same stratosphere as Jordan.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Jordan makes Kobe look like a great teammate.
The only reason those Bulls teams didn't self-destruct was because of Phil Jackson and Scottie Pippen. Scottie and Jordan basically played good cop bad cop. I think Pippen will be a great coach if he's interested. He should go join Jackson's staff.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

futuristxen said:


> Jordan makes Kobe look like a great teammate.
> The only reason those Bulls teams didn't self-destruct was because of Phil Jackson and Scottie Pippen. Scottie and Jordan basically played good cop bad cop. I think Pippen will be a great coach if he's interested.  He should go join Jackson's staff.


They toed the line because Jordan walked the walk. He gave 100% ALL THE TIME and demanded nothing less from his teammates. He held them accountable.


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## SlamJam (Nov 27, 2004)

futuristxen said:


> Scottie and Jordan basically played good cop bad cop. I think Pippen will be a great coach if he's interested. He should go join Jackson's staff.


scottie's greatest leadership was his ability to sit on the bench in the last seconds of a playoff game vs. the knicks. 

now there is a born leader.


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

IceMan23and3 said:


> Jordan is the ****ING MAN! I mean seriously! He just pimpslapped everyone in his way! He wouldn't mince words. You gotta love it! He was efficient, effective and probably the greatest competitor in the history of the NBA! Kobe doesn't know how to lead like Jordan does. How many times has Kwame cried since he came to LA? Exactly. Kobe isn't in the same stratosphere as Jordan.


Kwame Brown wasn't exactly a productive presence on the floor while Jordan was calling him a ***** in the media all the time.


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

hahaha

So Pippen's the angel now?

Pippen is a pompous *** just like Jordan. Do you remember when Pippen was talking smack about Kobe when he played for Portland? Pippen was a trash talker just like Jordan, except Jordan was better.


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

Drewbs said:


> Kwame Brown wasn't exactly a productive presence on the floor while Jordan was calling him a ***** in the media all the time.


that was whack...Kwame was fresh out of high school and Jordan was ripping him because he thought it would motivate him.
Obviously Jordan doesn't understand people as well as he thinks.

No wonder nobody wants Jordan managing/coaching them. 


Mediocre/better then average players make the best coaches...


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

rainman said:


> And you're a Bulls fan? notice you arent posting that in the Bulls forum.


Give me a break. 

Jordan is well known around Chicago for being an *******. Probably more than any other city in the country.

It's just that people don't give a ****. Being the greatest sports figure in baskeball history will do that to you. You can say whatever the hell you want.

It's not right. It's not wrong. It's just the way it is.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Those quotes make me like Michael a lot more. I know why the league and everyone never mentioned it, because he was so good for the league, but reading those quotes really makes his current life so interesting. This guy is almost living his life for the first time now. Pretty crazy.


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## f22egl (Jun 3, 2004)

Mebarak said:


> Jordan was a grade A idiot.
> 
> It'd be scary if he ran the Bulls. Kwame Brown and Adam Morrison were his two picks. Amazing. He's a great talent evaluator.
> 
> ...


The Bulls were willing to give up Elton Brand for Kwame Brown so I don't think they were that much smarter either considering Brown was the consensus number 1 pick. There were no signs that Brown would have such a bad attitude considering he was a good interviewer. Plus he was outperforming Tyson Chandler in workouts back then. Jordan wasn't willing to take front office positions in Chicago because Jordan wanted to acquiring part ownership of club which he had with the Wizards and has now gotten in Charlotte. Jordan didn't do a bad job considering when he left, the Wizards had the cap room to go after Gilbert Arenas.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

f22egl said:


> The Bulls were willing to give up Elton Brand for Kwame Brown so I don't think they were that much smarter either considering Brown was the consensus number 1 pick. There were no signs that Brown would have such a bad attitude considering he was a good interviewer. Plus he was outperforming Tyson Chandler in workouts back then. Jordan wasn't willing to take front office positions in Chicago because Jordan wanted to acquiring part ownership of club which he had with the Wizards and has now gotten in Charlotte. Jordan didn't do a bad job considering when he left, the Wizards had the cap room to go after Gilbert Arenas.


I have a hard time seeing that Bulls were trading up to #1 to get Kwame, when the entire point of trading Brand for Chandler, was to insure that Curry fell to #4. 

If they trade for #1 and take Brown, Clippers take Curry #2.

Curry was Krause's guy, and he believed he was a franchise player. If anything, Bulls were leap frogging the Clippers for Curry.


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## SeaNet (Nov 18, 2004)

Mebarak said:


> I have a hard time seeing that Bulls were trading up to #1 to get Kwame, when the entire point of trading Brand for Chandler, was to insure that Curry fell to #4.
> 
> If they trade for #1 and take Brown, Clippers take Curry #2.
> 
> Curry was Krause's guy, and he believed he was a franchise player. If anything, Bulls were leap frogging the Clippers for Curry.


Boy, that was a great idea.


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## Gilgamesh (Dec 23, 2005)

PauloCatarino said:


> Wouldn't it be in the GM's best interest to know that Curry's DNA prevents him to rebond, defend or block a shot?


hahahahahaha I needed some comedy at the office this morning. Kudos Paulo for possibly the best quote I have ever read since I began reading and posting on this board. Classic!

As for Jordan being an ***. Everybody knew he was an *** to the fans as well. Even the black community criticized him for his lack of charity efforts. The only people who don't know that Jordan was an *** are the kids who only caught Jordan highlights after he retired or followed him during the 2nd threepeat when the league and Nike basically made him into a god. Even then didn't the guy punch out Steve Kerr. I remember his whole beef with Ancient Bill too. MJ is one of the greatest. Maybe the greatest but the man was a well known *******. But meh as a bball fan I when I watch bball I only care about on court production.


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## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

Gilgamesh said:


> hahahahahaha I needed some comedy at the office this morning. Kudos Paulo for possibly the best quote I have ever read since I began reading and posting on this board. Classic!
> 
> As for Jordan being an ***. Everybody knew he was an *** to the fans as well. Even the black community criticized him for his lack of charity efforts. The only people who don't know that Jordan was an *** are the kids who only caught Jordan highlights after he retired or followed him during the 2nd threepeat when the league and Nike basically made him into a god. Even then didn't the guy punch out Steve Kerr. I remember his whole beef with Ancient Bill too. MJ is one of the greatest. Maybe the greatest but the man was a well known *******. But meh as a bball fan I when I watch bball I only care about on court production.


Guess what. Most of those kids grew up and post here now.


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## Gilgamesh (Dec 23, 2005)

Tragedy said:


> Guess what. Most of those kids grew up and post here now.


Yeah and hopefully now they have received an education of the true MJ.

The man was a great bball player but he was far from the saint the league and Nike made him out to be. His public image was a product of ingenious marketing.


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## DuMa (Dec 25, 2004)

"Will Vanderbilt. He doesn't deserve to be named after a Big Ten school." - Michael on Will Perdue

haha that is soooooo gold.


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## O2K (Nov 19, 2002)

haha i love those quotes. As great as jordan was on the court he was a real blue-ribbon *******.

Does anyone have any quotes from Jordan on Rodman?


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

DuMa said:


> "Will Vanderbilt. He doesn't deserve to be named after a Big Ten school." - Michael on Will Perdue
> 
> haha that is soooooo gold.


Actually, some of these are quite hilarious.

I mean, Jordan's a jerk no doubt. But I couldn't help but laugh at a few of these.

"I hope there's a jumpshot in there." - Michael to Stacey King who was walking into the locker room with a box 

"It's probably a twelve-day. He needs two days to wake up." - Michael on a ten-day contract teammate 

:rofl:

"They don't need a ticket to watch you sitting on the bench. They can go to your house for that." - Michael to Charles Davis who was sorting through his tickets for his family and friends 

:laugh:

That's more personality than I've ever seen from Jordan his entire career.


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

> "I hope there's a jumpshot in there." - Michael to Stacey King who was walking into the locker room with a box





> "You ever hear of a guy, six-eleven maybe and two hundred sixty pounds, a guy big and fat like that and he can't get but two rebounds, if that many, running all over the damn court and he gets two rebounds? Big guy like that and he gets one rebound. Can't even stick his *** into people and get more than that...Big, fat, fat guy. One rebound in three games. Power forward. Maybe they should call it powerless forward." - Michael ripping Stacey King a new one


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: 
Jordan is like Tyson.


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

> "He's causing me too many turnovers." - Michael on Cartwright's inability to catch


Kobe should use this for Kwame.


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## f22egl (Jun 3, 2004)

Mebarak said:


> I have a hard time seeing that Bulls were trading up to #1 to get Kwame, when the entire point of trading Brand for Chandler, was to insure that Curry fell to #4.
> 
> If they trade for #1 and take Brown, Clippers take Curry #2.
> 
> Curry was Krause's guy, and he believed he was a franchise player. If anything, Bulls were leap frogging the Clippers for Curry.


The Wizards had the number 1 pick so Chicago would have preferred to get that pick. The Bulls did offer Elton Brand for that number 1 pick but talks never ended up going anywhere because MJ wanted Jamal Crawford as well, which Jerry Krause refused. 

If Eddy Curry was really the Bull's guy, why didn't they just select him then and there? More than likely, it was a PR move to say that the Curry was really the Bull's guy in order to make Bull's fans feel better about the pick. Gasol being the number 3 pick was certainly not slotted by many to be picked that high, and Curry could have been picked by them. Either way, the Bulls would have been better served if the Grizzlies picked up Chandler or Curry while they could have Gasol for themselves. 

It's more than likely anyways that the Clippers would have taken Kwame Brown as well considering they would not have had a power forward while they already had Michael Olowakandi. Imagine, Kwame Brown and Olowakandi on the same team! 

Kwame was killing Chandler in workouts and Chandler's offensive limitations were apparent back then. Brown is one of the biggest busts of all time given all the potential he had coming into the league. What's most annoying about his game is that he has solid games but usually never came back and gave the same effort the next night. I doubt that guy ever puts it all together, he will always find some excuse.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Kwame Brown is just lazy.  That's why Jordan got on him. He didn't fight through the pain and get to the next level.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

You can see why Barkley and Jordan get along so well. It seems like Jordan has a lot of Barkley's sense of humor. Without any of the political ambitions.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Barkley is one of the greatest sports 'heroes' in the history of sports! He is one of THE NICEST GUYS in person. I remember one time when we were leaving a Sun Devils game, and we saw Barkley with his wife. One of my friends approached him and started talking to him. We talked for a couple of minutes and his wife cleared he throat like she wanted to leave and he turned to her and told her to bring the car around because he was going to stay and talk to us for a little bit. That is totally awesome! What superstar does that? I know it was only 5 minutes, but he could have just said that he has to go and it was nice meeting us. Barkley rules. (and he gave us autographs too).


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Nicest NBA players, imho...

1. Ben Gordon
2. Penny Hardaway
3. Toni Kukoc
4. Luol Deng
5. Jalen Rose


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Hrdaway's awesome. He would always have the king sized candy bars on Halloween.


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## eymang (Dec 15, 2006)

remember when jordan called kwame a flaming ******, hahaaha


kg now naming teams, won't be seen as a whiny ***** though since i guess he's not doing it public, still the same thing


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## Piolo_Pascual (Sep 13, 2006)

I posted this in the General NBA section ,but some stupid moderator locked it, eventhough its obvious this is not "just a Kobe" thread



IMO KG is a better fit for the Bulls.



1. KG is available

Thats it. The Bulls would rather have a player that puts up 20+ pts 10+ rebs and 2 bpg over a player that shoots 24 times a game to be effective.

2. Lakers needs Kobe. Minnestoa can live without Garnett.

This is the showtime Lakers. They would do everything in their power to retain the leagues biggest attraction. No way they would deal someone like Kobe because of his marketing power. Kobe is hated, but he has a lot of character and personality and that gets attention. Whether its Good or a bad kind of attention, Kobe will get it, and more attention equates to higher ratings.


Minnesota has been in the lottery the past couple of years and has missed the playoffs 3 consecutive years. KG is in his 30's and as time goes by, its glaringly obvious that the Wolves are better off without KG. Its time for the Wolves to rebuild. And freeing themselves from KG's salary is the first step.

Difference? LA is a big market always clamoring for the biggest star, Minnesota could use another Superstar in return but would'nt mind letting go one of theirs in order to rebuild with some younger and exciting prospects.


3. Paxson will not break up his Bulls.

At least not for a scoring guard. Chicago has no need for another scorer, even if he's the best in the league. A tandem of KG, Heinrich, B Wallace and either Gordon or Deng are most likely to reach the Finals than with the same group but with Kobe as their cornerstone.

Bulls has more pressing need for a player like KG than Kobe. Just because MJ used to play for Chicago, it doesnt mean the team's direction is to pursue a scoring guard and build around him using the same concept.

4.Reinsdorf vs Buss

Bulls owner would rather win a championship now. Lately? Seems like Buss would rather generate more income, Buss is busy drinking and riving with a girl 50 years younger than him while his Superstar is going on with a tirade...see the difference? 

Reinsdorf is willing to compromised a little bit of style as long as winning is put first among its perspective. Therefore, he has no desperate need for Kobe in order to achieve the teams goal.

5. The Fans
Ask any Chicago Bulls fans...given a chance, if they would rather have Kobe or KG, I think its safe to say that a large number would say KG in a heartbeat. fans likes loyalty, and right now thats what KG has strongly demonstrated on the otherhand Kobe and the word "loyalty" does not go hand in hand.

Two players have a chance to opt out if acquired by the Bulls. Guess which one is more likely to stay even if things dont go well in Chicago?


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

i think the lazy charge on brown is a bit of a copout at this point. guy clearly spends time in the weight room. he just doesn't have tremendous talent. he's a physical specimen that never had an incredibly high aptitude for the game. he simply never looks like he's going to be a skilled offensive player. they simply missed on the assessment.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Kobe has no leverage. If I was Buss, I'd keep him until the season before he opted out, and trade him then. What's Kobe gonna do, dog it? We know he won't. Kobe wants to talk down on the franchise? He'll rep it for 1 and a half years, then you let him go. You get 2 years to talk deal with people. If you can't get a good deal in 2 years, well damn.


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