# Bench Pierce!!!



## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

If you saw the game against NY tonight, you know why. I would have entitled this thread "TRADE PIERCE" but I wouldn't want to piss anyone off.

Five losses, and four of them are directly attributable to absolute **** offensive play by Pierce.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

*SAD SAD SAD*

Yeah he played very poorly and you couldnt name it trade pierce becuase about 5 threads down! I dont know what his problem is but he really needs to snap out of it. Maybe Vin should ***** slap him!


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

I'll tell you what's wrong with him. He's lazy and selfish. He always wants the ball in his hands, and then tries to force his offense against double and triple teams. He walks the ball up instead of running floor. He poisions the offense.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

No coment. 


.

Well I don't want so say anything since I'm not totaly in love with this guy and might just get some flaming from his loyal fans. 

Its not Pauls fault though, its Antoine's.


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## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

where would u be w/o him. U need him. Cant bench a franchise player


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Analysis of Paul Pierce*

I saw the NY game tonight and I noticed Paul Pierce is getting double teamed. He's used to taking shots so he takes a certain amount, like his daily total. Those shots won't go in with double teams. Paul needs to create more and should only take shots 1 on 1


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

about benching the franchise player....

tell that to Kellen Winslow!


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>aquaitious</b>!
> No coment.
> 
> 
> ...


Haha :laugh:


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

The C's play alot better with PP on the bench and the stats back it up. If I where Obie I would sit Paul down and tell him that if he doesn't start hustling he will be seeing more and more of the bench.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>wadecaroneddie</b>!
> where would u be w/o him. U need him. Cant bench a franchise player


Where are we with him now? 5-5 in one of the worst times the east has ever been in.

You know, when Antoine was here, he didn't always give Paul the ball inside, where he should have gotten it if we had a PG, but Antoine was pretty damn close, which helped Paul evolve as a player, now he can't get the ball there, there isn't anyone to get the ball up the court, nor to make it easier for Paul. Paul, being the leader, has to do it all, and well he's turning the ball over at a very hight rate, shooting a bad FG%, and we aren't WINING.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Epadfield</b>!
> The C's play alot better with PP on the bench and the stats back it up. If I where Obie I would sit Paul down and tell him that if he doesn't start hustling he will be seeing more and more of the bench.


Stats suck, I never liked them, never look at them to prove anything. I watch the games to know what is wrong and what isn't.

All I'm saying is stats DON'T tell the whole story, nor even close to it.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

BTW, anyone read the great article from the 11th?


http://www.boston.com/sports/basket...03/11/14/pierces_role_co_star_to_leading_man/


Great piece, Danny is talking crap about Walker again...and questioning his leadership abilities.


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

You mean you don't like those stats because it proves the C's are better with Pierce on the bench.

There is a reason those stats say the C's play better when Pierce is on the bench and it's because he's not hustling.


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## walkon4 (Mar 28, 2003)

*BENCH PIERCE*

Thats right!!!!! Thats the Answer!!!!!

Bench Paul Pierce.. The Franchise Player.

You fans are no worse the sixer fans here. Its pitiful to hear that crap.

BENCH PAUL PIERCE... BRING IN JIRI WELSCH HE'S OUR MAN!!!

NO WAIT, HOW ABOUT WE TRADE PAUL TO DALLAS FOR ANTOINE BACK.. HE CARRIED THIS TEAM TO THE PROMISE LAND. HES THE REAL LEADER!!!!!!!


what a joke. I may never even appear to discuss celtics basketball after what I have heard as of late.

its truly sad.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

Then dont come back! When you lose the finger goes to the star and the coach and vice versa when you win. Lets see the Blazers havent won anything and everyone doggs Sheed, the Kings havent done anything in the playoffs yet and Webber has been praised, back in Washington he wasnt. Let Sactown not make the playoffs and see if they aint calling Chris out! Want an example see KG 3 yrs ago they were talking about trading him becuase they could win the BIG games and now they add some firepower and no one says anything!


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Epadfield</b>!
> You mean you don't like those stats because it proves the C's are better with Pierce on the bench.
> 
> There is a reason those stats say the C's play better when Pierce is on the bench and it's because he's not hustling.


I told ya I'm not a Paul Pierce fanatic, I just don't like stats period.

I mean heck, if we were like 7-3, and those stats were up there I would still be complaing about Pierce not doing what he's supposed to do. If we were 3-7 I would do the same thing.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> Then dont come back! When you lose the finger goes to the star and the coach and vice versa when you win. Lets see the Blazers havent won anything and everyone doggs Sheed, the Kings havent done anything in the playoffs yet and Webber has been praised, back in Washington he wasnt. Let Sactown not make the playoffs and see if they aint calling Chris out! Want an example see KG 3 yrs ago they were talking about trading him becuase they could win the BIG games and now they add some firepower and no one says anything!



LOL, who are you talking to?


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>aquaitious</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> LOL, who are you talking to?


Oh, nevermind.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

TheTruth34(the post above mine).


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

*Re: BENCH PIERCE*



> Originally posted by <b>TheTruth34</b>!
> Thats right!!!!! Thats the Answer!!!!!
> 
> 
> NO WAIT, HOW ABOUT WE TRADE PAUL TO DALLAS FOR ANTOINE BACK.. HE CARRIED THIS TEAM TO THE PROMISE LAND. HES THE REAL LEADER!!!!!!!


I think that is an excellent idea. It is becoming clear that about 75% of Pierce's effectiveness was due to Antoine's ball distribution skills and his ability to take his man off the dribble.

Pierce didn't get to the rack once tonight. He didn't run the floor once tonight. Truly terrible. They built up their lead in the second quarter with Pierce on the bench, and they would have won the game if Pierce had been on the bench in the 4th quarter.


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## ThereisnoIinteam3 (Apr 19, 2003)

OMG Hell has frozen over and the devil is wearing ice skates and doing triple Lutz, triple toe combinations as we speak. The saddest part of this is I can't even be happy that it is happening. I can't even gloat about it. (Did I even spell gloat right?)

Pierce is not to blame here. He is trying to do to much. He knows that if he doesn't that he will take all the blame. 

I won't even comment on that Danny Ainge article. Does Jackie MacMullen have anything better to do with her column then bash Antoine Walker? That is like her 4th article of bashing since he left.

Boston Sport's writers are losing credibility with every word they write.

The Truth,

Never mind. I can gloat now. STOP blaming Antoine Walker for crap. He isn't here anymore and he is doing it when it counts on his new team. He might not always have the best shooting night but he is there for the rebound when it is needed. For the game tying 3 to send it into overtime and just about everything else there is.

I say we trade Pierce to Dallas for Michael Finley
Then the Mavericks can win the whole dang thing.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

OK? Who is ripping Walker here??


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> OK? Who is ripping Walker here??


The link I provided.


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## ThereisnoIinteam3 (Apr 19, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> OK? Who is ripping Walker here??


Page one of this thread. The Truth's comments are his typical Walker ranting.



> NO WAIT, HOW ABOUT WE TRADE PAUL TO DALLAS FOR ANTOINE BACK.. HE CARRIED THIS TEAM TO THE PROMISE LAND. HES THE REAL LEADER!!!!!!!


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

OK, I agree something must be done. Whether its bench him, talk to him, ***** slap him, something has to be done. But at the same time he is the only star we have right now so lets not run him out of town(yet).


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> OK, I agree something must be done. Whether its bench him, talk to him, ***** slap him, something has to be done. But at the same time he is the only star we have right now so lets not run him out of town(yet).


He needs someone who can give him the ball. Hey Vinny might be our second option (for now), but we still need someone feeding Paul (like Toine did for example, sorry to use this analogy). WE NEED ANOTHER PLAYER 3RD SCORER OR SOMEONE WHO'LL GIVE PAUL THE BALL. I'm sure Reaf, Welsch, nor Mills, nor the 1st rounder next year will do that.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

Thats the problem now, we dont need someone to give the ball to Pierce he has too much as it is. What we and he needs is less ballhandling, more passing and more of a post game that we have been lacking for years now(see Vin Baker). What we need is an overall PG that can score and pass(see Jamal Tinsley i.e. now third string). Can I say trade?(we missed him once lets not do it again)


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> Can I say trade?(we missed him once lets not do it again)


I never liked Tinsley, and if he's behind Kenny, well then....thats all I gotta say.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

Thats becuase Carlisle is an old school guy and Kenny is definitely OLD school. Jamal is very very talented. The only real thing he cant do very good is shoot FT.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> Thats becuase Carlisle is an old school guy and Kenny is definitely OLD school. Jamal is very very talented. The only real thing he cant do very good is shoot FT.


Or shoot period. 

I think he's a headcase.


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

Everyone wants to point the finger at someone else. It's not Pierce's fault. It's O'Brien's fault, or the fault of the other players for not getting him the ball, etc. etc.

Let's get this straight. He WALKS up the floor. He does not run, It's Pierce's fault-- no one else's. He's playing as if he does not want to be in Boston. Either fix it or trade him before it's too late.


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## mrsister (Sep 9, 2002)

Pierce can be mostly blamed for the stagnant offense in the fourth quarter. However, I really don't think you can say that was the only reason they lost this game. They were outrebounded 36 to 12 in the second half. Let me repeat that... <b>36 to 12</b>. I'm surprised it was only a three point loss. They also did not defend the three well at all. The Knicks shot over 43 percent - much better than they shot the two. They stopped running, too. I would have to say one mistake OB made was putting Mike James in the game instead of Marcus Banks. Banks was having a great game and creating offense for the team. James slowed it down along with Paul. 

Why do people have to blame a single player for a whole team breakdown? Pierce didn't play well down the stretch, but I didn't see anyone else stepping up. Even Eric Williams, who had a great game, did not step up. Pierce was not shooting well and could not draw the foul. However, even with the stifling defense on him, he only had one turnover. Paul needs to move without the ball but so does the rest of the team. If he's doubled, it should be easy for someone to get open, but more often than not, it's the center who's open outside the three point line, which does no good at all. I agree Paul should not be walking the ball up the court. He should be a leader but not in that way. 

This is a team folks, and Pierce is a piece of it, but the team has to focus as a whole. They cannot get outrebounded like that and expect to win, no matter how well Pierce is playing. The team has made great strides in getting production out of their bench, but nobody is stepping up in the fourth quarter consistently. Until that happens, their default option is Pierce. Defenses will have no reason not to concentrate all their efforts on Pierce in the fourth until they deem someone else as a threat. In my opinion, they should take a chance on Banks in the fourth and let him create offense for others.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

*I love Waltah!!*

Why not Waltah? Does anyone remember last seasons playoff where he avg'd like 15 a game in the first round? Why aint he playing he is much better than Kedrick and Jumaine. He was clutch last playoffs and now he gets no PT? What gives?


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

*Re: I love Waltah!!*



> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> Why not Waltah? Does anyone remember last seasons playoff where he avg'd like 15 a game in the first round? Why aint he playing he is much better than Kedrick and Jumaine. He was clutch last playoffs and now he gets no PT? What gives?


Waltah gets no PT because he isn't skilled. Williams and Brown are superior on offense and every bit as good as Waltah on defense. And Ainge is telling O'Brien to play Jones and Brown.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

Athletically superior yes, skilled maybe do they play that way, NO! Especially not Kedrick. Jumaine has never been an integral part of a team(even in Philly). Kedrick is a JC player that tried to go pro and shouldnt have, Walter on the other hand is a lengthy 6'9-10, that can guard SF or PF. He can shoot the three and can get some rebounds becuase of his height. Kedrick is a flop and Jumaine is decent, Walter is better than both of them!!!


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> Athletically superior yes, skilled maybe do they play that way, NO! Especially not Kedrick. Jumaine has never been an integral part of a team(even in Philly). Kedrick is a JC player that tried to go pro and shouldnt have, Walter on the other hand is a lengthy 6'9-10, that can guard SF or PF. He can shoot the three and can get some rebounds becuase of his height. Kedrick is a flop and Jumaine is decent, Walter is better than both of them!!!


Kedrick has never gotten the chance to play and Jumaine has been stuck playing behind the best players on bad teams. Waltah is the number four SF on this team's depth chart and that is the way it should be. He defends well and grabs a few boards. He can't run a fast break, he can't dribble, he can't hit a shot unless he's wide open, he can't make a tough pass. That's why he's not playing.

Kedrick and Jumaine defend well, grab a few boards, can run a fast break, can dribble, can hit a contested shot, and can make a tough pass. That's why they play.

As for benching Pierce, I'm all for it if that gets the point across to him that this is a running team. However, O'Brien hasn't the testicular fortitude to actually do such a thing and that's sad.


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## w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y (Jul 14, 2002)

The last paragraph I agree with, other than that I think your wrong! But we could do this till we are both blue in the face so...
if Jumaine is so good why is this like his third team in like 4 or 5 yrs and why was Kedrick passed over by 10 other teams? Why did Kedrick not start tonight if he is so good? Why have we been shuffling SF's for like 5 yrs(other than EWill) if Kedrick is good? Where was Kedrick in last yrs playoffs? Need help?(BENCHED) in favor of Waltah!


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> The last paragraph I agree with, other than that I think your wrong! But we could do this till we are both blue in the face so...
> if Jumaine is so good why is this like his third team in like 4 or 5 yrs and why was Kedrick passed over by 10 other teams? Why did Kedrick not start tonight if he is so good? Why have we been shuffling SF's for like 5 yrs(other than EWill) if Kedrick is good? Where was Kedrick in last yrs playoffs? Need help?(BENCHED) in favor of Waltah!


McCarty sucks. No rebounds, The players who have to go are Pierce, McCarty and Battie. Kurt Thomas simply ate Battie alive on the boards. Kurt Thomas???? Battie made him look like an all-star.


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> The last paragraph I agree with, other than that I think your wrong! But we could do this till we are both blue in the face so...
> if Jumaine is so good why is this like his third team in like 4 or 5 yrs and why was Kedrick passed over by 10 other teams? Why did Kedrick not start tonight if he is so good? Why have we been shuffling SF's for like 5 yrs(other than EWill) if Kedrick is good? Where was Kedrick in last yrs playoffs? Need help?(BENCHED) in favor of Waltah!


Kedrick never plays because O'Brien doesn't play rookies. Waltah was passed over by 18 teams, guess he's much worse. Also, I'd hate to be the one to break it to you, but Waltah didn't start either. Jumaine was never given much of a chance in Philly and with Davis, Miles, Wagner, and that LeBron guy to take up the 2/3 in Cleveland, Jones was expendable there. He's been hurt thus far and that's why he's not performing.


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## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

0ne would expect PP to be playing better but would you expect them to be winning a lot of ball games after trading away one of two allstars? I thought they'd be in prime position to end up with a top 5 draft pick, and they still might be if Paul doesn't pick it up. Overall, I've been fairly impressed with the Celtics' competitiveness, as Baker has come back into form fairly unexpectedly.


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## walkon4 (Mar 28, 2003)

*the point is*

IF Pierce had hit the shots at the end, the people on here complaining wouldn't have been.

thats the sad part.


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

*Re: the point is*



> Originally posted by <b>TheTruth34</b>!
> IF Pierce had hit the shots at the end, the people on here complaining wouldn't have been.
> 
> thats the sad part.


Yes, and in the future there will be games where he hits them. But they will lose alot more games than they win, because forcing Pierce to go against double and triple teams on every possession is a losing proposition.

Did you see how they played in the second quarter with Banks in the game and Pierce on the bench? Everyone was running and they were eating the Knicks alive. Banks had something like 5 assists in just a few minutes. That's how they need to play for FOUR quarters.


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## mrsister (Sep 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>w-h-i-t-e-b-o-y</b>!
> Why did Kedrick not start tonight if he is so good? Why have we been shuffling SF's for like 5 yrs(other than EWill) if Kedrick is good?


OB was quoted in the paper as saying not to read into the starting of Jones over Kedrick. He said Jones is not playing better than Kedrick, but he wants to get Jones used to playing with the starting unit. He's still experimenting to see what the best combinations are. The starting five doesn't really mean anything anymore. Last year, it did, because they didn't have any depth. Now, they want to put in the second unit and not lose any intensity. That's why Williams and Blount are coming off the bench. Williams is a better player than Kedrick or Jones, but when they bring him in, he sparks the second unit and they can maintain or build on what the starting unit did. The only constant starters in my mind should be Pierce and Baker. Other than that, I can see it changing a lot depending on matchups.


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## walkon4 (Mar 28, 2003)

*ok*

Ok Big John

I guess you have made your point clear. Bench Paul Pierce! Thats the answer.

Ok, thank god we don't have people like this coaching the team. then where would we be?


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## walkon4 (Mar 28, 2003)

*and John*

Can you please comeback with something positive??

I havent read a post yet where you werent digging a player, or saying he sucks, or he should be traded. Thats all you talk about

Pierce sucks
Pierce should be traded
Pierce should be benched
Battie was outplayed and made KT look like an All-Star
Walter sucks and lacks skills


I mean, why do you even come here? Are you a celtic fan? It sure as hell sounds like you aren't. Sound like a hater. So why discuss the team with a constant negative approach?

Im just trying to support my favorite players and teams. Not constantly badger them. Go watch another team, if this team isn't appealing to you! 

Can you understand that?


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

I'll say something positive: last night against the Knicks Marcus Banks had his best game as a Celtic, both offensively and defensively, and Kedrick Brown and Jiri Welsch played very well also. I was worried about Welsch on defense, but in fact he is a very good defender with good lateral mobility for his size.

But now I have to say something negative: those guys should have been in the game during the 4th quarter. Why weren't they?


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

The NY game was the first one I was able to watch thus far this year. Pierce looked like himself at times, but at others he was taking some horrible shots. There's no need to bench him, just get the ****in ball out of his hands and stop letting him think he's a PG. He's trying to do what Toine did and he can't. This is a totally different team. 

BJ, i will agree with u, w/ banks, brown, and welsch in we played excellent. Banks played great for the minutes he was given. I just don't understand why we decide to disappear after getting a big lead. We have to keep running. Paul needs to get the ball to Banks or James or Welsch. He cannot be taking it up. Baker needs to get the ball MORE. He scores, he gets doubled, Pierce GETS OPEN SHOTS OR ONE ON ONE SITUATIONS. Itz not hard, why can me (and I'VE only seen one game thus far) and you see it, but Obie and the coaches and Danny cannot?? 

Itz frustrating, I didn't see thee end of the game cuz I was actually playing ball, but wut was the last shot all about? Who took it and it wuz horrible as far as I heard??


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## mrsister (Sep 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Big John</b>!
> I'll say something positive: last night against the Knicks Marcus Banks had his best game as a Celtic, both offensively and defensively, and Kedrick Brown and Jiri Welsch played very well also. I was worried about Welsch on defense, but in fact he is a very good defender with good lateral mobility for his size.
> 
> But now I have to say something negative: those guys should have been in the game during the 4th quarter. Why weren't they?


I agree. Especially Banks. It's harder to justify Brown being in there over Williams or Welsch over Pierce, though. Williams provides the intangibles on the floor as well as tangibles. Although if you want quick offense, the Banks-Brown combination is deadly. As much as you want to see Pierce benched in the fourth quarter, it's not going to happen. If they keep losing close games in the fourth, Pierce will recognize he's not doing the right things and will adjust. If he doesn't, then my faith in him will diminish. Pierce is fiercely competetive and hates to lose. I can't imagine that he's satisfied with his performance to date.


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## Schottsie (Jun 25, 2003)

Ideas such as Trade Pierce and Bench Pierce are absolutely ridiculous.

It is a long season- give him a chance to turn it around.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Last second shots*

Pierce took one with 10 seconds left and us down one. It was a good look, for three. It went halfway down and popped out.

He took another with us down three and 3 seconds left. It was a brick.


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## walkon4 (Mar 28, 2003)

*thank you*



> Originally posted by <b>Schottsie</b>!
> Ideas such as Trade Pierce and Bench Pierce are absolutely ridiculous.
> 
> It is a long season- give him a chance to turn it around.


Great! I agree.


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

Trading Pierce is not the answer, no he's not playing that well right now but he will bounce back just give him a little time. One of the things that has frustrated me the most so far is the INABILITY for the team to realize how great Vin Baker has been playing and to GET HIM THE BALL! They are still not utilizing him at all and he's averaging about 18 & 8 and that's without them really seeing him. If they started to use him more it would A) open up more shots for Pierce because they would have to focus more on Vinny too and B) give the team more of a boost in the post.


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>whiterhino</b>!
> Trading Pierce is not the answer, no he's not playing that well right now but he will bounce back just give him a little time.


I think Pierce looks fat and out of shape-- he's certainly playing like it. Put him on IR and get him a personal trainer.


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## Flava D (Sep 27, 2003)

*problem with pierce*

the main problem with pierce is that he's not playing team ball the way the other guys are, thats why they play better with him out....he hasn't been making transition passes, and he tends to walk the ball up and not get out ahead on the break. If O'Brien is going to make this a true running team, everyone has to run...is benching paul going to send that message, probably not, but I think a sitdown with the coaches to make sure paul knows his play is problematic may change things...I don't think pierce is going anywhere anytime soon


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

*Re: problem with pierce*



> Originally posted by <b>Flava D</b>!
> the main problem with pierce is that he's not playing team ball the way the other guys are, thats why they play better with him out....he hasn't been making transition passes, and he tends to walk the ball up and not get out ahead on the break.


You hit the nail on the head. Trade him, just like the Patriots traded Bledsoe. He is a big name and a big contract who isn't producing. He waddles up the floor like a crippled duck.


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## ThereisnoIinteam3 (Apr 19, 2003)

*Re: Re: problem with pierce*

Tell us how you really feel Big John. lol
:laugh: :grinning: 

Forget it. You are never going to get anyone to admit that Pierce is the problem right now. It just won't happen. If he actually was anything like Larry Bird he would know he was the problem and he would try and fix it.

Maybe that is the problem. Maybe Pierce just hasn't figured out he isn't Larry Bird yet.







> Originally posted by <b>Big John</b>!
> 
> 
> You hit the nail on the head. Trade him, just like the Patriots traded Bledsoe. He is a big name and a big contract who isn't producing. He waddles up the floor like a crippled duck.


:laugh: :grinning:


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: problem with pierce*



> Originally posted by <b>Flava D</b>!
> the main problem with pierce is that he's not playing team ball the way the other guys are, thats why they play better with him out....he hasn't been making transition passes, and he tends to walk the ball up and not get out ahead on the break. If O'Brien is going to make this a true running team, everyone has to run...is benching paul going to send that message, probably not, but I think a sitdown with the coaches to make sure paul knows his play is problematic may change things...I don't think pierce is going anywhere anytime soon


That and Pierce is used to getting a certain high number of touches and he's trying to do that this season. The problem is Pierce is getting double-teamed and causes turnovers. He is not working as hard because of he know's he's the star.


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## mrsister (Sep 9, 2002)

*Re: Re: problem with pierce*



> Originally posted by <b>Big John</b>!
> 
> 
> You hit the nail on the head. Trade him, just like the Patriots traded Bledsoe. He is a big name and a big contract who isn't producing. He waddles up the floor like a crippled duck.


I don't see how this is like Bledsoe at all. Bledsoe was injured and Brady stepped in and the team started winning consistently. They didn't want to fix what wasn't broken, so they didn't put Bledsoe back in. Brady then lead the team to a championship. Bledsoe stepped in when he was needed and did a good job, but Brady had proven himself, and they didn't need two high profile quarterbacks. It wasn't that Bledsoe was doing horribly, so they traded him. 

In Pierce's case, he just hasn't caught on to the system yet. It's not a case where he was injured and someone else came in to take his place, so he isn't needed anymore. There isn't someone on the team who can fill his shoes. This isn't like when Walker was traded, because they weren't left without a star when that happened. The only parallel I see between this and the Patriots, is that when Brady stepped in, the team relied less on their quarterback and more on the team mentality. That's what's happening when Pierce is on the bench. 

However, I don't think the solution is to get rid of Pierce because they do ok without him on the floor. I think the solution is to get the team to think as a team while Pierce is on the floor. Pierce needs their help as much as they need his. They need to play like he's just another one of the guys, and he needs to play that way, too. If everyone is running, then he needs to run, too. If everyone relies on the point guard to run the offense, then he needs to, too. He just has more work to do than the others because he will always be the focus of the defense. He has to trust his teammates, and he does that during the first three quarters. That's where he racks up the assists. It's the fourth quarter he has a hard time with. Deferring to Baker in the Pacers game was a good step, but he has to do it more often, and other people need to step when he does. If he gives the ball up and nobody does anything with it, then he'll be more likely not to give it up.


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

The solution is to stick a firecracker up Pierce's arse, and to set it off every time he loafs up the floor.


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## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>wadecaroneddie</b>!
> where would u be w/o him. U need him. Cant bench *a franchise player*


Are you kidding me? He's no Franchise player. He's just a mediocre star, not a supersta

I wouldn't be surprised to see him in a Raptor's uniform but the Raptors just don't have any players excluding Vince to be traded for him. Sad


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> 
> 
> Are you kidding me? He's no Franchise player. He's just a mediocre star, not a supersta
> ...


Bosh and next years 1st rounder.  Algonside Bradley.


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

Barring a three-way deal involving Utah or some other team under the cap, the Celtics would have to receive equivalent salary in any deal involving Pierce.

How about Pierce and Battie to Phoenix for Shawn Marion and Jahidi White?


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## PatBateman (May 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Big John</b>!
> Barring a three-way deal involving Utah or some other team under the cap, the Celtics would have to receive equivalent salary in any deal involving Pierce.
> 
> How about Pierce and Battie to Phoenix for Shawn Marion and Jahidi White?


just for speculation fun, what about taking out White and putting in Johnson so that we could have a second shot at him?


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>PatBateman</b>!
> 
> 
> just for speculation fun, what about taking out White and putting in Johnson so that we could have a second shot at him?


Because then the salaries don't match. Besides, we need a big horse like White to put a body on some people under the boards. Of cousr Brandon Hunter could do that too, but not while he's on IR.

Update: I don't think this trade can be done anyway under the CBA, and it could not happen until January since White just arrived in Phoenix. Oh well.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Sadly, I don't think Phoenix would do it.*

Marion is a nice complement to Marbury. He runs. I don't think Colangelo does that.

Then again, I wouldn't want to see that trade either.


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

Yea letz trade Pierce. Thatz the smart thing to do :dead:


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> 
> *Are you kidding me? He's no Franchise player. He's just a mediocre star, not a supersta*
> 
> I wouldn't be surprised to see him in a Raptor's uniform but the Raptors just don't have any players excluding Vince to be traded for him. Sad


Paul Pierce is a franchise players, he's just not playing like one. He's not playing his heart out fo his 38 minutes. He's loafing around and he's not being a "leader".


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