# Maui Invitational Thread



## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

First Round Starts Tomorrow

*Colorado vs. Gonzaga
Cincinnati vs. Vanderbilt
Chaminade vs. Maryland
Arizona vs. Wisconsin*

Someone's gonna carry the weight around here and start this thread... I'm looking at you TM!

Obviously the favorites are Wisconsin.


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## bball2223 (Jul 21, 2006)

No outstanding teams here to speak of, but it should be high quality action for 3 days.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

bball2223 said:


> No outstanding teams here to speak of, but it should be high quality action for 3 days.


Say WHAAAAAAAAA???

There is a certain team wearing cardinal in this field.


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

Gonzaga vs Maryland finals?


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## TM (Jun 30, 2003)

haha. why i always gotta do everything?!

is this the weakest maui field in a long while? sorry, but none of these games appear appealing.


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

TM said:


> haha. why i always gotta do everything?!
> 
> is this the weakest maui field in a long while? sorry, but none of these games appear appealing.


No top 10 teams... yet

But I would say its a highly competitive field of six teams that are all within the fringes of the top 25 or BCAA tounrey caliber - Ciny, Zona, Wisconsin, Gonzaga, Vandebilt, Maryland.

The results of these games could be very significant on selection sunday.


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## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

fjkdsi said:


> Gonzaga vs Maryland finals?


I'm with ya. Zaga looked good against MSU, they just choked down the stretch. 


JuniorNoboa said:


> No top 10 teams... yet
> 
> But I would say its a highly competitive field of six teams that are all within the fringes of the top 25 or BCAA tounrey caliber - Ciny, Zona, Wisconsin, Gonzaga, Vandebilt, Maryland.
> 
> The results of these games could be very significant on selection sunday.


I agree, not any big-time matchups or high profile teams but most of the games should be very competitive, which IMO is where it's at.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

TM said:


> haha. why i always gotta do everything?!
> 
> is this the weakest maui field in a long while? sorry, but none of these games appear appealing.


There's no marquee team this year, but there are 6 programs that are usually near the top of their conference every year.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

Nimreitz said:


> Say WHAAAAAAAAA???
> 
> There is a certain team wearing cardinal in this field.


Cardinal and Navy.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

There are no marquee teams in the field, but most of these wins are going to end up quality win by the time March rolls around.

Zags sure are having a hard time slowing down that Princeton offense.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

Since when can you stop the game and get the refs to go back 2 plays and check for an intentional foul?

Bo Ryan just got the refs to stop the game and check the video to see if Nic Wise bounced the ball off someones face, two plays earlier.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

5 mins into the second half and there have been 15 fouls called in the second half of the Arizona Wisconsin game.

Terrible calls all around, both ways.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

54 fouls called, awful...


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## Geaux Tigers (Apr 26, 2004)

Who bet on Arizona +5.5...I DID!


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

What a celebration. My friend had Arizona +4.5 and I didn't bet on the game because I'm a Wisconsin fan... when Trevon Hughes missed that free throw to secure the 4 point win we must have looked so gay because we were jumping up and down together. For me: Wisconsin advanced; for my friend: he won a $500 bet on Arizona. So cool. In his extreme enthusiasm I got him to promise me a night of drinking with his winnings. Awesome.

Gonzaga don't want none of this!!! CAUCASION INVASION!!


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## Willo (Nov 21, 2003)

Gonzaga, Maryland, Wisconsin and Cincinnati advance.

Gonzaga / Wisconsin and Maryland / Cincinnati

Colorado will face Arizona and Vandy will face the host.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

Guess who's favored tonight? That's right, WISCONSIN BABY! Bring it zagsfan!


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## bball2223 (Jul 21, 2006)

What time is Gonzaga/Wisconsin game?


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## TM (Jun 30, 2003)

i thought i saw 9:30. might be wrong though.


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## Willo (Nov 21, 2003)

9:30, or half an hour after the Maryland/Cinci game.


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

Nimreitz said:


> Guess who's favored tonight? That's right, WISCONSIN BABY! Bring it zagsfan!


We'll route you.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

I just hope that we dont have to see these refs that have been calling 45+ fouls in the big games.

Watching Wisconsin is hard enough, let alone when the refs call terrible fouls everytime down the floor. Out of the 6 Maui games played so far 3 have had 45+ fouls. I think I can speak for everyone when I say nobody wants to watch that crap. Let the kids play.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

TucsonClip said:


> Watching Wisconsin is hard enough


How dare you, the swing offense is exciting!


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## TM (Jun 30, 2003)

maryland's vasquez is really, really good sometimes and then sometimes he makes some decisions that just make you scratch your head. do people think he's going to succeed at the next level?


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## TM (Jun 30, 2003)

Cincy is athletic. Up 13 at the half over Maryland.


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## bball2223 (Jul 21, 2006)

Stephenson's breakout game?


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## thatsnotgross (Dec 4, 2006)

No, I don't think this is Stephenson's breakout game. I think he will breakout or at least I hope so during the in conference game. Cincy should be a top 25 team and not ND. But I could understand why ND gets some love and thats because they possibly have one of the Big East player ever in Luke H.

Cincy is looking good so far. As well as the rest of the Big East. 

P.S I hate you rutgers for losing to VERMONT!


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## thatsnotgross (Dec 4, 2006)

Cincy looks like they are hitting everything.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

Cincy looks fantastic tonight. I'd probably have them as the favorite over Wisconsin or Gonzaga in the final.


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## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

Not happy with the way UC has handled the press, but I like what I'm seeing overall. Gates and Lance are special players. Nice to have two studs to go along with all the other role players Mick recruited.

Vaughn can score, but he isn't a leader.


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## apelman42 (Apr 8, 2005)

TucsonClip said:


> I just hope that we dont have to see these refs that have been calling 45+ fouls in the big games.
> 
> Watching Wisconsin is hard enough, let alone when the refs call terrible fouls everytime down the floor. Out of the 6 Maui games played so far 3 have had 45+ fouls. I think I can speak for everyone when I say nobody wants to watch that crap. Let the kids play.


Amen.


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## thatsnotgross (Dec 4, 2006)

Cincy is having a great week so far. They've beaten #24 Vanderbilt and #21/22 Maryland making them a case for a top 25 showing or getting close to it. If they can beat Wisconsin or Zag, then they deserve to be in the top 25.


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

Sacre has NBA written all over him. Bouldin will be a 1st rounder as well. Not many 6'5" point guards in the NBA as strong as him.


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## Geaux Tigers (Apr 26, 2004)

Anyone else wanna take Bouldin in the first?


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Nope


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## apelman42 (Apr 8, 2005)

Geaux Tigers said:


> Anyone else wanna take Bouldin in the first?


I would.

As for their team, Gonzaga is unbelievably quick. Way too many weapons for this team not to make it to the 2nd weekend in March.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

BTW, I bet on Gonzaga.

I'm not a dope.


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## Geaux Tigers (Apr 26, 2004)

apelman42 said:


> I would.
> 
> As for their team, Gonzaga is unbelievably quick. Way too many weapons for this team not to make it to the 2nd weekend in March.


I wouldnt say that's going out on a limb...they bust up a weak conference and get much too high of a seed in each tournament each year...


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## Geaux Tigers (Apr 26, 2004)

Nimreitz said:


> BTW, I bet on Gonzaga.
> 
> I'm not a dope.


Meeeeeeeeee toooooooooooo


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

Geaux Tigers said:


> Meeeeeeeeee toooooooooooo


As a fan I have to talk all the bull**** about "we're gonna kick your ***", but let's get real, Wisconsin has lost a TON of talent the last 2 years and haven't come anywhere close to replacing it.


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

But this happened before when they lost Harris and than Tucker and still came back as one of the best teams
Trevon Hughes and Jon Leuer are very good players Bohannon is solid Im not sure about their talent outside those 3 though


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## Geaux Tigers (Apr 26, 2004)

As far as Wisconsin goes aside from the obvious I was pretty impressed Keaton Nankivil...he is really athletic and very active on the boards. He also can take you away from the basket or go inside.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

Like Bouldin, but he doesnt have that one trait that he does very well.

He is a good all around player, but considering the likely depth of this draft, he looks like a 2nd round pick to me.


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

TucsonClip said:


> *Like Bouldin, but he doesnt have that one trait that he does very well.*
> 
> He is a good all around player, but considering the likely depth of this draft, he looks like a 2nd round pick to me.


That was the same exact thing people said about Brandon Roy coming out of college. I'm not saying that Bouldin is going to be anywhere as good as Roy. Bouldin does everything well, can push the ball, drives the ball to the hoop well, has great vision and can pass the ball as well as anyone in the nation. His size allows him to post up smaller guards. I'm trying to think of a good comparison, but there is just no players that really come to mind. 

He'll be a first round pick easily. Heck, AA first team easily. You'll get to watch him more tomorrow.


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

Geaux Tigers said:


> I wouldnt say that's going out on a limb...they bust up a weak conference and get much too high of a seed in each tournament each year...


Too high of a seed? Beating good teams early in the season in the OOC schedule and taking care of business in conference is recipe for a top 4 seed if you ask me.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

fjkdsi said:


> But this happened before when they lost Harris and than Tucker and still came back as one of the best teams
> Trevon Hughes and Jon Leuer are very good players Bohannon is solid Im not sure about their talent outside those 3 though


1) Bohannon is not solid, the dude is a bum plain and simple. Hasn't improved since he was a freshman, and is the worst alleged 3 point specialist in the country.

2) They lost Harris, and then had 2 years of Tucker and also still had Mike Wilkinson. They lost Tucker and still had one of the oldest and deepest teams in the country. In the last 2 years we have lost Brian Butch, Michael Flowers, Greg Steimsma, Marcus Landry, and Joe Krabbenhoft. Those are 4 starters and a big 7 foot contributer. The only guys who have stepped up to replace those guys with anywhere near the talent are Leuer and Nankivil. Aside from them we just don't have that much new talent. Hughes was the starting PG on that 31 win team 2 years ago. Jordan Taylor is an adequate backup point guard, and Bo is being forced to play him and Hughes together in the back court because no one else can play guard.



Geaux Tigers said:


> As far as Wisconsin goes aside from the obvious I was pretty impressed Keaton Nankivil...he is really athletic and very active on the boards. He also can take you away from the basket or go inside.


I like Nankivil as well; was pretty excited when he committed a few years ago and you can probably dig up posts to that effect in the Big Ten forum. Sucks that Bo Ryan played him 46 minutes total his freshman year instead of redshirting the kid, because he's already a junior.


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## Tom (Jul 15, 2002)

I think Stevenson is overrated. He doesn't seem as athletic as I thought he would be and he needs to get in better shape. He also isn't a good defender on the ball. I'm not saying he won't be a good player, but he isn't fresh of the year material.


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## apelman42 (Apr 8, 2005)

Nimreitz said:


> BTW, I bet on Gonzaga.
> 
> I'm not a dope.


1.) Were you introduced to betting over the last 6 months? It seems like all you can talk about now is who you bet on.

2.) Betting against your favorite team? Sad. Not a true fan. You need help.


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## apelman42 (Apr 8, 2005)

fjkdsi said:


> But this happened before when they lost Harris and than Tucker and still came back as one of the best teams
> Trevon Hughes and Jon Leuer are very good players Bohannon is solid Im not sure about their talent outside those 3 though


True true true. Most notably Harris. Harris is probably the best player that the University of Wisconsin basketball program has ever seen. Harris went pro after his junior year and we came back the following year and made the elite 8 before being ousted by the eventual national champion North Carolina Tar Heels.

Bo is pretty good at getting young guys solid minutes so that they're ready to fill in when others leave.

I like this team a lot better than last year's team. Getting rid of Krabbenhoft and Landry makes our team quicker and less ploddy. I really believe we're a top 25 team by the end of the year, which makes me believe that Gonzaga is very good.

We played UConn close in a preseason tournament last year up until the 8 minute mark. UConn ended up being a final four team.

Gonzaga had us buried by halftime.

I know it's not the best of comparisons, but we're a pretty consistent program year in and year out. We rarely lose neutral site games by a wide margin like we did last night, making the Zags solid.


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## apelman42 (Apr 8, 2005)

Geaux Tigers said:


> As far as Wisconsin goes aside from the obvious I was pretty impressed Keaton Nankivil...he is really athletic and very active on the boards. He also can take you away from the basket or go inside.


Wow, I didn't know people outside of the state paid attention to Wisconsin basketball games when on TV .

I think Nankhivil has the best chance of anyone on this team to play pro ball (not necessarily NBA). He's got a pretty jumper and is pretty athletic in the middle. He just needs to put on a few pounds and become tougher minded.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

apelman42 said:


> 1.) Were you introduced to betting over the last 6 months? It seems like all you can talk about now is who you bet on.
> 
> 2.) Betting against your favorite team? Sad. Not a true fan. You need help.


I've been back into it in the last few months. Have known about my gambling problem for many years.


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

Anyone else falling in love with Mike Bruesewitz this week? He's the big Wisconsin freshman with the red buzzcut.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

Love Solomon Hill, he is definitely going to be a pro.

Arizona playing very well against Vandy right now. This would be a big win, considering the Pac-10's RPI.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

Thank you Jay Bilas for hammering the refs, finally. The reffing in the UA games has just been terrible and im glad Bilas pointed it out and got on the refs.

Saying, "I think we've just seen a ref lose his cool" and "Unfortunately, Hess is one of those officials who always feels the need to play a part in the outcome of a game. We came to watch basketball, not your officiating."


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

good stuff by Bilas I hate announcers that overly dickride refs 
Im not sure about Hill I know the guy and followed him really closely in his HS years and Im just not sure he is NBA material. The talent is there to a certain extent but its not like he stands out that much
Whats up with him in Arizona? He was a point forward in HS but doesnt seem to be getting alot of assists for the Wildcats (have barelly watched any Arizona basketball so far)


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## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

Damn, UC just let that slip away late in the second half and then couldn't make their free throws in OT.


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## zagsfan20 (Dec 24, 2004)

cpawfan said:


> Damn, UC just let that slip away late in the second half and then couldn't make their free throws in OT.


They let it slip, or the Zags never quit and played a complete game. Either way, your right I guess.


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## bball2223 (Jul 21, 2006)

Congrats Gonzaga on the win. I had some observations, so here goes nothing:

-Cincinnati is very similar to Calipari's teams at Memphis the past couple of years. They are big, physical and athletic, but they are just a decent offensive team. Vaughn, and Stephenson are both pretty good and I like what Wright and Dixon bring to the table. Gates is not a good offensive player especially skillwise. He is a good defender, rebounder, and he is pretty big, but those airballs tonight were just pathetic. 

I like how hard the Bearcats compete, and how they play defense. They should be a top 5-6 team in the Big East and should make the tournament. I think they got a raw deal at the end of regulation as it was clear Gates was fouled. Their free-throw shooting cost them in overtime though and thats on them. 

-Lance Stephenson is going to be a very good player. He lacks a jumper of any kind, but he has almost everything else. He is big, physical, and he is terrific going one on one. That move he made on Bouldin at the end of regulation is a big-time NBA move. His one on one defense on Bouldin was outstanding from what I saw. He even passed the ball, and looked good doing so a couple of times. 

However his attitude remains an issue. His temper-tantrum at the end of regulation, and again at the end of OT were both signs of immaturity. I understand his frustration, but he looked like a 12 year old kid playing AAU. If he can control that, and get a jumper he is going to be a very good player on the NBA level. He may not look like Freshman of the Year right now, but Tyreke Evans started off slow last year and look how he has turned out. Granted I think Evans is a little better at the same stage, it just goes to show you that Stephenson is only going to get better. 


-Gonzaga impressed me in this torunament. They are very good on both sides of the ball and are a very tough team. As always they are well-coached and prepared. Sacre is going to be a good player and I was impressed by his skill. Would rather have him than Gates on my team. Goodson is a heady Point Guard who is very quick. Bouldin had an off night scoring, but I thought he was terrific otherwise. This is a sweet 16 caliber team, but I can not see them advancing any farther than that.


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## thatsnotgross (Dec 4, 2006)

Well, I didn't watch the end but I looked at the boxscore and it says, Cincy 31 3PA. Their defense is good, I would say top 3-4 in the Big East but come on, you can't jack up 3s when you don't have the personnel to do it.

Deonta Vaughn is nothing but a poor version of Scottie Reynolds and both of them makes my head hurt. Vaughn is a 6'1 midget who should do less shooting and become a leader. Yes, he doesn't get the ball as much as last year because Cashmere Wright has taken those responsibilities off his hand. But come on, you're a 39-40% career shooter, if you can't hit shots, stop shooting. You too Reynolds.

Here is a nice question... Cincy beats Vanderbilt and Maryland. Do they deserve to be in the range between 20-25?

Zag should be around 14-20 in next week's ranking. If UNC gets that much love for losing to Syracuse then Zag should be the same because they lost to MSU by only 4 points.


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

I dont now I wasnt that impressed by Stephenson
I like Deonta Vaughn though his jumpshot wasnt going he looked really in control of the offense of course that comes with being with 23 years old and a senior but he is one of my favorite PGs in the NCAAs 
It is a very weak crop though aside from Wall


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## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

bball2223 said:


> -Cincinnati is very similar to Calipari's teams at Memphis the past couple of years.


This is an interesting observation. I don't know if it's the REALLY long shorts and headbands that they all wore, or if I'm just a horrible racist, but for some reason the only person in the last 3 years on Memphis that I could tell apart from the rest of the team was Derrick Rose. This is a bit of an exaggeration, but in the uniforms, Antonio Anderson looked exactly the same as Shawn Taggart and Robert Dozier. Everyone just looked EXACTLY the same to me. Cincy has a little bit of that going on. Just everyone on the team is really long and the guards are about the same height as the forwards.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

fjkdsi said:


> good stuff by Bilas I hate announcers that overly dickride refs
> Im not sure about Hill I know the guy and followed him really closely in his HS years and Im just not sure he is NBA material. The talent is there to a certain extent but its not like he stands out that much
> Whats up with him in Arizona? He was a point forward in HS but doesnt seem to be getting alot of assists for the Wildcats (have barelly watched any Arizona basketball so far)


He isnt getting the assists because nobody else can score besides Wise.

Hill is the only guy on the team outside of Wise that has permission to grab a rebound and take it coast to coast. He definitely needs some work, but at 6'7, he has by far the 2nd best passing ability and handles on the team.

He cant shoot that well yet, but knows his strengths and looks to create off the dribble rather than jack up a jumper. Overall, just a very smart player, can defend, can play PG, rebounds, and has great handles and passing ability. He isnt an athletic freak, but his skillset just screams NBA because of how he can play with the ball in his hands.


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

He reminds me of a taller but worse James Harden
Plus Harden has actually been shooting the ball well in the NBA so far
Im not sure Hill will ever be a good shooter
Maybe Josh Smith without the athletism?


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## TM (Jun 30, 2003)

why does everyone have to be compared with someone else? you guys never agree on who their match is anyway, so what's the point?


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

I like doing the comparison thing because it kind of gives you a guide of about where the players career is going to go
A little projection
Of course no 2 players are exactly alike


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

fjkdsi said:


> He reminds me of a taller but worse James Harden
> Plus Harden has actually been shooting the ball well in the NBA so far
> Im not sure Hill will ever be a good shooter
> Maybe Josh Smith without the athletism?


Speaking on UA terms I would go with a cross between Iguodala and Luke Walton.

He isnt the athlete Iguodala is, but better than Walton. He can play in the post like Walton, out of the high post and perimeter like Iguodala, neither could shoot well, he is quicker than Walton but not as quick as Iggy, He plays defense well but not as good as Iguodala did. Hill has good form and is decent from mid range, but need to put in some work to improve his consistency.

I think that is the easiest comparison to make, because all three players are somewhat similiar in their role in the offense and all around skills.

No to any Josh Smith comparison, because Hill has a better beasketball IQ already.


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