# What if Gay falls to us?



## vandyke (Jan 8, 2004)

Do you take him because of his tremendous upside or are there too many questions about his desire for the game that you take a pass on him. Personally I take him, just like we took a chance on Gerald in last year's draft, could you imagine a second team of:

Allen
Green
Gay
Jefferson
La Frentz

Sounds good to me


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## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

i hope Andrea Bargnani falls to us. probably wont though


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## banner17 (Jun 28, 2003)

I wouldn't take him.

Between Paul, Wally, Gerald, Tony and even Delonte for that matter, we are all set at the swing positions.

I'm all for drafting the most talented player available when we make our choice as we've done quite well with such a philosphy over the past two years, *but* we are weak at the PG and PF, C postions. and I'd rather see us draft to fill those needs, especially the PF/C. I respect what Perk has done this year, I'm dissapointed in Al because of injuries and effort but feel he can be a major post presence if he truly wants it. That being said, I hope the chips fall such that we can take Aldridge. Its a lot to ask, but we need a top flight rookie big to push Perk and Al and serve notice that they are not untouchable and our demands are much higher in terms of our post production on both ends of the floor.


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## P-Dub34 (May 19, 2005)

Drafting for position instead of talent doesn't exactly have a glittering history.


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

or...if someone like gay or carney is there and we take them to package to another team for a pf/c i wouldnt mind that either...we dont need a rookie pg or big man...we just need a pg and or big man...im all for trading this pick for some experience


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

P-Dub34 said:


> Drafting for position instead of talent doesn't exactly have a glittering history.




cmon now the raps made out great when they took arauuuuuuuuuujo to fill their center needs :biggrin:


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## Delontes Herpes (May 11, 2005)

P-Dub34 said:


> Drafting for position instead of talent doesn't exactly have a glittering history.


Yup.

I remember Ainge saying that it doesn't make any sense for a team like the Celtics to draft for position, as they aren't just one piece away from a championship...besides, this draft is awful, there aren't going to be any potentially good PF/C on the board when they pick, unless McRoberts declares (it's just my opinion that he could be a decent starter one day). If they win the lottery, I wouldn't mind seeing them take Thomas or Aldridge. But otherwise, I'll be happy with either Gay, Roy, or Foye.


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## LX (Oct 14, 2004)

Gay is overrated.


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## BackwoodsBum (Jul 2, 2003)

Lanteri said:


> Gay is overrated.


My opinion exactly. There are several players that I would prefer over him.


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## Seth (Feb 27, 2004)

BackwoodsBum said:


> My opinion exactly. There are several players that I would prefer over him.


I tend to agree with you guys. He lacks commitment to intense play throughout the course of a game. Will the almighty dollar motivate him t perform more consistently? Only time will tell on that. :makeadeal 

I would say though, that if he's available, Danny will take him. His philosophy of acquiring various pieces that could fit or combined to trade for veteran talent would indicate that he might take a "sexier" player in order to use in a trade, if there's no player available to fit the needs the C's have (PG, C).


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## km109 (Jul 18, 2003)

Gay is an interesting option. I thought Villanueva was a reach because he seemed to have more than a little dog in him, but he got motivated and right now the pick looks like the first smart move the Raptors have made in years. I think Gay takes way too much time off when he's on the court and my guess is that in spite of the fact Charlie V pulled it together when he started getting paid the real money, lightning isn't going to strike twice on lazy Huskies - pass on Gay unless you're sure he's got way more talent than the next best choice who has shown motivation and work ethic.


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

Gay does have oodles of talent. And he's seven months _younger_ than Gerald. If Gay's there you go Gay. The Celtics aren't good enough to pass up talented players. Besides, odds are Pierce gets dealt during training camp next year in an attempt to tank for a top 5 pick in '07, so there'll be room for Gay.


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

I also think Gay is overated and will not amount to much of anything in the NBA. I also think Gerald is way better than him. If Gay were available when we drafted I'm all for trading the pick. Honestly unless we get Marcus Williams or Tiaggo Splitter I'm all for trading the pick. This draft does not excite me and we are too young as it is. We don't need another young guy, I want a solid vet.


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

whiterhino said:


> We don't need another young guy, I want a solid vet.





:worship: :worship: :worship:


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

Why does everyone want Splitter, I bet you guys know nothing more on him then you have read online, and from what I have read it does not even look like he is worth a loto pick. And if Gay falls to us draft him, and then trade him. To me trading someone Rudy Gay looks more appealing then trading the 6th or 7th pick.


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Lanteri said:


> Gay is overrated.


:rofl:


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

I saw a few Splitter videos and my interest in him has diminished. He has no mid-range shot despite some decent post moves and interior defense. Frankly, other Brazilian big-men looked better as prospects, in my opinion, in Nene Hilario and Anderson Varejao. If we select him, we would be taking him for his position.

I really, _really_ want Brandan Roy. Rudy Gay would be a fine choice as well. You always go for potential in these types of draftss. He's offensive game is too good to pass up..


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## LX (Oct 14, 2004)

Premier said:


> :rofl:


Care to explain that? 

I've watched Gay the past two seasons being that I am a UConn fan, and the kid has no heart whatsoever. He doesn't give two flying ****s out there on the court and frankly he seems like the kind of guy that would get himself into trouble with his attitude rather than becoming a great player.


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

Lanteri said:


> Care to explain that?
> 
> I've watched Gay the past two seasons being that I am a UConn fan, and the kid has no heart whatsoever. He doesn't give two flying ****s out there on the court and frankly he seems like the kind of guy that would get himself into trouble with his attitude rather than becoming a great player.




i heard the same criticisms about villanueva a year ago...noone seems to be *****in about him now


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## LX (Oct 14, 2004)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> i heard the same criticisms about villanueva a year ago...noone seems to be *****in about him now


Villaneuva wasn't nearly as bad.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> i heard the same criticisms about villanueva a year ago...noone seems to be *****in about him now


no one? college boy


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

DWest Superstar said:


> no one? college boy



i missed a space...get over it and post something that adds to the board or find someone else to annoy


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

I don't want Splitter at all. There has to be some reason why he opted out of the last two or three drafts when he was projected to go lotto, and that makes me want to stay away.

For Gay, I'd go for it if he was there, then trade him for a vet.


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

Rudy Gay sucks. Gerald Green kicks his ***.


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

WTChan said:


> Rudy Gay sucks. Gerald Green kicks his ***.


Rudy's got about 35 lbs on Gerald, no way Green kicks his butt. Plus, I'm of the opinion that Green and Gay on the wings is a pretty sick combo two years off, and it's not like the Celtics are turning the corner before 2009 anyway.


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## BostonBasketball (Jan 10, 2005)

agoo101284 said:


> I don't want Splitter at all. There has to be some reason why he opted out of the last two or three drafts when he was projected to go lotto, and that makes me want to stay away.
> 
> For Gay, I'd go for it if he was there, then trade him for a vet.


I think he pulled out of the draft becuase of issues with a buyout. But I could be wrong about that.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> i missed a space...get over it and post something that adds to the board or find someone else to annoy


what do you mean I was talking about Rudy Gay


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

DWest Superstar said:


> what do you mean I was talking about Rudy Gay


sure


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

ehmunro said:


> Rudy's got about 35 lbs on Gerald, no way Green kicks his butt. Plus, I'm of the opinion that Green and Gay on the wings is a pretty sick combo two years off, and it's not like the Celtics are turning the corner before 2109 anyway.



fixed


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## LX (Oct 14, 2004)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> If we still had Antoine we would have won the championship.


...


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

nice lant...and no we wouldnt have won the championship but we'd be looking forward to more basketball games right now that actually meant something thats for sure


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## socco (Jul 14, 2002)

The Wolves won the coin flip (Go Wolves!) so barring any move in the lottery you guys will have the 7th pick.


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

BostonBasketball said:


> I think he pulled out of the draft becuase of issues with a buyout. But I could be wrong about that.


The issue with the buyout was the fact that he needed to be a top 5 pick to be able to afford a buyout. And three years later he still has no offensive game. So no one wants to spend a top 5 pick on him.


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

ehmunro said:


> Rudy's got about 35 lbs on Gerald, no way Green kicks his butt. Plus, I'm of the opinion that Green and Gay on the wings is a pretty sick combo two years off, and it's not like the Celtics are turning the corner before 2009 anyway.


Rudy Gay should have the word 'bust' branded on his forehead. You want a wing, just take James White in the second round.


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## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

socco said:


> The Wolves won the coin flip (Go Wolves!) so barring any move in the lottery you guys will have the 7th pick.


The coin flip is just for the odds right? They still gotta do the ping-pong ****.


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

the coin flip is to see who gets the 6th pick and the 7th pick in the event that the ping pong balls dont go the wolves or celts way...the lottery is only for the top 3 picks...after that it goes by worst record...the wolves and celts had the same and the wolves won the flip so they get the 6th and we get the 7th...in other words that meaningless win to close out the year cost us a draft spot


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> the coin flip is to see who gets the 6th pick and the 7th pick in the event that the ping pong balls dont go the wolves or celts way...the lottery is only for the top 3 picks...after that it goes by worst record...the wolves and celts had the same and the wolves won the flip so they get the 6th and we get the 7th...in other words that meaningless win to close out the year cost us a draft spot


Are you scared that the Wolves will pick a player we want?


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

ya never know


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

WTChan said:


> Rudy Gay should have the word 'bust' branded on his forehead. You want a wing, just take James White in the second round.


Last year I'd've said that exact same thing about Chuckie Fugly. Now I'm beginning to suspect it has something to do with the coaching. 

And it's not a matter of "wanting a wing". It's not like this draft is chock full of NBA all stars. Unlike almost everyone in this pool, Gay _could be_ an all star. The alternative is going to be Danny Fortson Lite or another backup point guard. Sorry, if Gay's on the board at seven you grab him. Besides, with Al Jefferson and Kendrick Perkins starting alongside him the Celtics front line would be Big-Gay-Al. That has to be worth something.


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

ehmunro said:


> Last year I'd've said that exact same thing about Chuckie Fugly. Now I'm beginning to suspect it has something to do with the coaching.
> 
> And it's not a matter of "wanting a wing". It's not like this draft is chock full of NBA all stars. Unlike almost everyone in this pool, Gay _could be_ an all star. The alternative is going to be Danny Fortson Lite or another backup point guard. Sorry, if Gay's on the board at seven you grab him. Besides, with Al Jefferson and Kendrick Perkins starting alongside him the Celtics front line would be Big-Gay-Al. That has to be worth something.


Charlie was emotionless, not heartless. He wouldn't disappear like Gay. Big Gay Al is tempting, but not tempting enough for me to go Gay.


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

So Gay's a second banana, that's what we have G-2 for. And Chuckie Fugly most certainly _did_ disappear during UConn games. Add in the fact that he's actually younger than Green and there's planty of time for the next coach to get through to him. Give me a potential starter over backup backup big men eight days a week.


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

ehmunro said:


> So Gay's a second banana, that's what we have G-2 for. And Chuckie Fugly most certainly _did_ disappear during UConn games. Add in the fact that he's actually younger than Green and there's planty of time for the next coach to get through to him. Give me a potential starter over backup backup big men eight days a week.


I don't like the idea of two of those kind of players, even if one could shoot. Darius Miles syndrome. And Gay's younger than Green?


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## Greg Ostertag! (May 1, 2003)

The weird thing about Rudy Gay is that coming into college he was supposed to be a coache's dream etc. Wonder what happened there. Nevertheless, if he's there at the Boston pick, you have to take him. Hopefully Paul Pierce can show him how to succeed and influence people.


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## banner17 (Jun 28, 2003)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> the coin flip is to see who gets the 6th pick and the 7th pick in the event that the ping pong balls dont go the wolves or celts way...the lottery is only for the top 3 picks...after that it goes by worst record...the wolves and celts had the same and the wolves won the flip so they get the 6th and we get the 7th...in other words that meaningless win to close out the year cost us a draft spot



are you sure about this?

I'd like some clarification. Even this story in the Globe has me scratching my head

http://www.boston.com/sports/basket.../2006/04/22/celtics_will_likely_pick_seventh/


it states that the lottery will determine the first three picks, but also says that the C's could pick anywhere from 1st to 10th depending on the outcome of the loterry.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

banner17 said:


> are you sure about this?
> 
> I'd like some clarification. Even this story in the Globe has me scratching my head
> 
> ...


It's correct. It's very unlikely, but it's possible.

If the 8th-14th worst records get the 1-3 picks, then the worst record would get the 4th, the 2nd worst gets the 5th, etc bumping the Celtics to the 10th pick.

The chances of that happening is less than 1% though. So yeah, we'll probably pick 7th...possibly 8th.


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## AMΣRICAN GOD™ (Jun 4, 2005)

If Gay fell to us, and we didn't take him, I wouldn't watch another C's game as long as I live.


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Did Gay murder someone when I wasn't looking?


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

WTChan said:


> I don't like the idea of two of those kind of players, even if one could shoot. Darius Miles syndrome. And Gay's younger than Green?


It's not like the Celtics are an über-talented team just a player or two from competing for a title. They're a 33 win team that could use as much talent as they can get. Everywhere. Was Portland correct to trade out of the 3 spot because they already had Telfair? I don't care that Boston has Tony Allen and Gerald Green, Gay is quality. If he's there you grab him. And yes, he's seven months younger than Gerald Green.


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

ehmunro said:


> It's not like the Celtics are an über-talented team just a player or two from competing for a title. They're a 33 win team that could use as much talent as they can get. Everywhere. Was Portland correct to trade out of the 3 spot because they already had Telfair? I don't care that Boston has Tony Allen and Gerald Green, Gay is quality. If he's there you grab him. And yes, he's seven months younger than Gerald Green.


This could all change by the combine. But Gay will be a bust, you heard it here first.


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## Delontes Herpes (May 11, 2005)

Assuming the C's don't win the lottery and Thomas, Aldridge, and Morrison are off the board when they pick, I'd like

1) Gay
2) Foye
3) Roy

In that order. I don't care if Gay might be a bust, he's the only player who might be available with potential to become one of the top 50 players in the league. Guys like Shelden and JJ will be 7th/8th men if they don't bust, and that is just a waste of a lottery pick.

And if those 3 guys are all off the board, I say draft Andrea Bargnani and hope he stays in Europe forever. (Side note: draftexpress.com lists his best case scenario as the next Dirk and his worst case scenario as the next Skita. Thanks for giving me an idea of what range his potential falls into, draftexpress!)


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## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

vandyke said:


> Do you take him because of his tremendous upside or are there too many questions about his desire for the game that you take a pass on him.


you take him.


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## AMΣRICAN GOD™ (Jun 4, 2005)

WTChan said:


> This could all change by the combine. But Gay will be a bust, you heard it here first.


No, I've heard it everywhere on these boards. Why would you think that he's going to be a bust. It's not like he's TOO athletic. 

Maybe the 'fire' problems might scare you a bit, but didn't PP have some problems with 'fire' last year?


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## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

i still want Andrea Bargnani. Dirk Nowtizki i'm telling you.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

TheBigDonut said:


> i still want Andrea Bargnani. Dirk Nowtizki i'm telling you.


I hate player comparisons on NBAdraft.net makes people try to look smart when they say them.


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

Delontes Herpes said:


> I say draft Andrea Bargnani and hope he stays in Europe forever.


 :rotf:


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

The difference between Bargnani and Tskitishvili is that Nikoloz never produced in Europe and was drafted soley on his potential and hype, while Bargnani is doing well in Benetton Treviso at a very young age, something quite uncommon for European prospects besides Marco Belinelli.


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

Premier said:


> The difference between Bargnani and Tskitishvili is that Nikoloz never produced in Europe and was drafted soley on his potential and hype, while Bargnani is doing well in Benetton Treviso at a very young age, something quite uncommon for European prospects besides Marco Belinelli.


Bingo

Bargnani is playing, even starting, against real and tough pro players and producing at very high level in both italian league and Euroleague.

Look today too: 22 points and 6 rebounds in 28 minutes ...


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

Premier said:


> The difference between Bargnani and Tskitishvili is that Nikoloz never produced in Europe and was drafted soley on his potential and hype, while Bargnani is doing well in Benetton Treviso at a very young age, something quite uncommon for European prospects besides Marco Belinelli.


I was reffering to the Dirk comparison. What you wrote has nothing to do with that


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

DWest Superstar said:


> I was reffering to the Dirk comparison. What you wrote has nothing to do with that


I did not mean to quote you as evidenced by my double-post without your quote.


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## BostonBasketball (Jan 10, 2005)

DWest Superstar said:


> I was reffering to the Dirk comparison. What you wrote has nothing to do with that


Yes it does, because Tskitishvili was also compared to Dirk when he came out. He was trying to make the point of how Bargnani won't be the bust that Tskitishvili was.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

BostonBasketball said:


> Yes it does, because Tskitishvili was also compared to Dirk when he came out. He was trying to make the point of how Bargnani won't be the bust that Tskitishvili was.


Did I mention Tskitishvili?


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

TAllen42 said:


> No, I've heard it everywhere on these boards. Why would you think that he's going to be a bust. It's not like he's TOO athletic.
> 
> Maybe the 'fire' problems might scare you a bit, but didn't PP have some problems with 'fire' last year?


Hey, I'm 1 for 1 when it comes to unproven prospects- see Monta Ellis. They don't call me Goldeneye for nothing.

It's a gut feeling. And PP wasn't a draft prospect last year.


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

Agoo - Splitter pulled out of the last couple drafts because his buyout was too big with his current club and he wouldn't be able to afford it.
I still say Gay is a bust and certainly not a star even if he's not. I do like Bargnani some some video of Benneton and he looked awesome but I think he's a top 5 pick so unless we get a lucky ping pong bounce I think he's gone when we pick. I like Splitter in the NBA because I think his game is suited for it and I like Marcus Williams as a true point who's ready to contribute now. Like I said though, I'd prefer to trade the pick and get a solid vet PG...Brevin Knight, Earl Watson, Derek Fischer.........not a star a solid vet who will help this team win.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

You would rather have Derek Fischer and his contract starting over D-West?

I would rather have West starting than Fischer if he was earning the minimum


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

i would rather have bob cousy at 80 yrs old starting over west at pg...WEST IS NOT A PG


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Earl Watson. Derek Fi*s*her.

:rofl:

I'll take Delonte, and I am certainly not a fan.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

Premier said:


> Earl Watson. Derek Fi*s*her.
> 
> :rofl:
> 
> I'll take Delonte, and I am certainly not a fan.


They are just sticking to morals


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

#1AWF does that also mean you would rather have an 80y.o Cousy start over Iverson? He is not a PG either


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

DWest Superstar said:


> #1AWF does that also mean you would rather have an 80y.o Cousy start over Iverson? He is not a PG either




wow u did not just say that...


iverson is a superstar...west is uhhh west...if west was as good as iverson (ha) i would not have a beef...but he isnt in the same universe....so please refrain from ever comparing delonte west to allen iverson ever again...thanks


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

I'll say that I would rather have Brandan Roy as point guard than Delonte West, but I think that's quite obvious. I cannot see why anyone would want Derek Fisher and Earl Watson, considering their age, lack of skills, and absurb contracts.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

#1AntoineWalkerFan said:


> wow u did not just say that...
> 
> 
> iverson is a superstar...west is uhhh west...if west was as good as iverson (ha) i would not have a beef...but he isnt in the same universe....so please refrain from ever comparing delonte west to allen iverson ever again...thanks


Neither of them are (true) PGs I'm sorry they fall into that same category.


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

You don't need pure point guards to won a championship. Parker, Fisher, Paxon.... It's a common misconception.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

WTChan said:


> You don't need pure point guards to won a championship. Parker, Fisher, Paxon.... It's a common misconception.


Don't tell them that...


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

> I'd prefer to trade the pick and get a solid vet PG...Brevin Knight, Earl Watson, Derek Fischer.........not a star a solid vet who will help this team win.


First off that does not make sense and 2 what idiot would trade the 7th pick for Earl Watson/Fisher/Knight?


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## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

DWest Superstar said:


> Neither of them are (true) PGs I'm sorry they fall into that same category.




the only category that iverson and west fall into is that they are both human...i think in wests case anyway...


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

DWest Superstar said:


> First off that does not make sense and 2 what idiot would trade the 7th pick for Earl Watson/Fisher/Knight?


I'd give it up for Knight. Not like we would get anything better and if we do it'll be a few years down the road.


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

Earl Watson is not old and he's better than Delonte at PG, Brevin Knight is a VERY good pure PG, Derek Fisher I named because of the fact this team needs vet leadership and he does have 3 championship rings to his name. I don't like his contract either though, forgot how bad it was. I also like Luke Ridnour and he's unhappy with the time Watson has taken from him in Seattle. My point is I want a guy with some freaking experience and we are not getting a superstar.....these are the types I'm looking at. Even Chucky Atkins was better at PG for us than most have been in recent years. 
Delonte is simply not going to get it done at PG...he's a good energy guy but he's just not a PG. I don't want another rookie we have to wait on. Paul's window will only be open for so long and I want to win one while he's here.


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## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

If you want a damn PG that knows his role then draft Marcus Williams although we do not need a starting PG only a backup. But it is worth the 7th pick for you haters.


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

whiterhino said:


> Earl Watson is not old and he's better than Delonte at PG, Brevin Knight is a VERY good pure PG, Derek Fisher I named because of the fact this team needs vet leadership and he does have 3 championship rings to his name. ...
> 
> Paul's window will only be open for so long and I want to win one while he's here.


Brevin Knight probably wouldn't be enough to get the Celtics into the playoffs, much less put them into title contention. Neither Fisher nor Watson make the Celtics title contenders. The Celtics' problem is that they have one all star and a boatload of scrubs, kids, and hideously overpriced vet roleplayers. There's nothing this team can do to become title contenders outside of getting Paul Pierce to sit out next year and landing the top pick in the Oden draft. And it's not like they can even afford all of their kids as re-signing Perkins, Jefferson, West, and Gomes alone (presuming they gave Pierce an extension) would put them ridiculously past the luxury tax threshold. I hate to say it, but the curtain's coming down on the Paul Pierce era, and in anticipation of that, more than _anything else_ the team needs talent that will still be here at the end of the decade, which is about the next point in time that this franchise has a window of opportunity to be really competitive (rather than a four and out playoff team).


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