# Ron Artest



## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

If the Pacers trade him -

Why Not the Nuggets ? Who do we have that could make this work ?

I would love to have him on our squad.

Do you favor an Artest trade if it becomes plausible ?

And yes I'm a dreamer.


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## darth-horax (Nov 21, 2005)

I'd welcome it if Carmelo or Ron Ron would switch to 2 guard. his scoring and D would help us out a lot.

We could package Vo, Watson, and Buckner for Ron Ron and Croshere...if they'll let him go. with ron ron, we wouldn't need Buck's D.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

darth-horax said:


> I'd welcome it if Carmelo or Ron Ron would switch to 2 guard. his scoring and D would help us out a lot.
> 
> We could package Vo, Watson, and Buckner for Ron Ron and Croshere...if they'll let him go. with ron ron, we wouldn't need Buck's D.


Good work horax that is a good deal right there for the Nuggets.

Only concern would be melo at the 2 guard. Not sure if he could handle that.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

The more I think about I don't think Melo can cover the 2guard. Probably the reason the Nuggets haven't tried to play him there this season. So that means Artest and Melo would be fighting for minutes. So this trade probably doesn't work well for the Nuggets.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

artest can play the two guard. the above trade isnt flying. The only way Indiana even considers a deal is if it includes either Andre Miller or Kenyon Martin. Vo Watson and Buckner, thats a joke


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

nbanoitall said:


> artest can play the two guard. the above trade isnt flying. The only way Indiana even considers a deal is if it includes either Andre Miller or Kenyon Martin. Vo Watson and Buckner, thats a joke


Was just over at the pacers board. I was suprised by how many Pacers wanted Miller over Tinsley. Seems like they realize that Miller and Tinsley are the same player. However Miller is more mature and much more durable of a floor leader than Tinsley is.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

23AJ said:


> Was just over at the pacers board. I was suprised by how many Pacers wanted Miller over Tinsley. Seems like they realize that Miller and Tinsley are the same player. However Miller is more mature and much more durable of a floor leader than Tinsley is.


Andre Miller would play well within the pacer's system. same with new york. Id actually look for Larry Bird to go after Channing Frye and Q


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

nbanoitall said:


> Andre Miller would play well within the pacer's system. same with new york. Id actually look for Larry Bird to go after Channing Frye and Q


I've been impressed with Frye. I didn't think I would be because I always thought he was weak in college. I would be shocked if the Knicks gave up Frye. However if it's for Artest they probably do this.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

23AJ said:


> I've been impressed with Frye. I didn't think I would be because I always thought he was weak in college. I would be shocked if the Knicks gave up Frye. However if it's for Artest they probably do this.


well you have to keep in mind the knicks go about rebuilding the wrong way. for instance maybe they should keep curry, frye, robinson, and ariza and try and trade everyone else. well thats what i would do. but thomas has got to be craving Artest right now. Because this trade makes them a playoff team. 

Curry, One of a hundred knick PFs, Artest, Crawford, Marbury.

Regardless, I feel safe in saying the knicks are a fundamentally flawed team. And it all starts at the PG position. Sure Marbury is a good PG, but he doesnt belong in Knickland being coached by LB. That is kinda extreme compared to how I view Andre Miller. Miller's got a lot a of strong suits, however the areas he is weak in, are the areas the whole team is weak in. So that leaves denver with two choices. Find a shooting guard that can meet all our needs, or trade Andre Miller. I'm not knocking Miller by saying this either. I'm just saying what I think makes sense to better the franchise.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

nbanoitall said:


> well you have to keep in mind the knicks go about rebuilding the wrong way. for instance maybe they should keep curry, frye, robinson, and ariza and try and trade everyone else. well thats what i would do. but thomas has got to be craving Artest right now. Because this trade makes them a playoff team.
> 
> Curry, One of a hundred knick PFs, Artest, Crawford, Marbury.
> 
> Regardless, I feel safe in saying the knicks are a fundamentally flawed team. And it all starts at the PG position. Sure Marbury is a good PG, but he doesnt belong in Knickland being coached by LB. That is kinda extreme compared to how I view Andre Miller. Miller's got a lot a of strong suits, however the areas he is weak in, are the areas the whole team is weak in. So that leaves denver with two choices. Find a shooting guard that can meet all our needs, or trade Andre Miller. I'm not knocking Miller by saying this either. I'm just saying what I think makes sense to better the franchise.


Good points in your post.

I don't see why Miller has to go though if everyone is bad at shooting. Going by what your saying, shouldnt it be the shooting guard that takes the heat? Since the SG position is defined by shooting. Where the point guard position isn't defined by shooting ?

Again Miller stays in D-Town. :biggrin:


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

> Vandeweghe declined comment on any interest the Nuggets might have in Indiana Pacers forward Ron Artest, who has asked to be traded .


http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/nba/article/0,2777,DRMN_23922_4310735,00.html


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## darth-horax (Nov 21, 2005)

How about this?

Kenyon Martin, Vo Lenard and Watson for Bender, Croshere, and Ron Ron?

Nuggs get rid of two HUGE contracts (well, one anyway), and two backups for a perennial all star and two young up and coming bigs? I love K-Mart, but his injuries are not worth the salary we've tied up in him.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

darth-horax said:


> How about this?
> 
> Kenyon Martin, Vo Lenard and Watson for Bender, Croshere, and Ron Ron?
> 
> Nuggs get rid of two HUGE contracts (well, one anyway), and two backups for a perennial all star and two young up and coming bigs? I love K-Mart, but his injuries are not worth the salary we've tied up in him.


Good idea, but one small problem with that is Jonathan Bender is going to retire this season.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

23AJ said:


> Good points in your post.
> shouldnt it be the shooting guard that takes the heat? Since the SG position is defined by shooting. Where the point guard position isn't defined by shooting ?
> 
> Again Miller stays in D-Town. :biggrin:


personally i dont think like that anymore. To help spread the floor its nice to have 2 players capable of hiting the shot out on the floor.

Regardless, you can point your finger at a lot of players that arent great 3 point shooters. But a lot of our guards (because there PGs) are small and not capable of defending the big athletic wings. So why does Andre Miller have to go. One reason is we have lots of PGs and Miller has a contract (with a decent salary) that can be traded. Now, keep in mind im only talking about trades the benefit the franchise. The first option would be to trade watson, but other teams are going to want Miller. And right now there are only two untradable players on this team, and Miller isnt one of them. Id say Boykins is even more untradable than Miller, because (like I was talking about in an earlier thread) boykins has that defined role. He is the "spark" off the bench that we need in a lot of games. 

Now that changes (like I said) when you add someone else to be that "spark". Then Boykins is very tradeable. But even if you trade Dre (like I suggested when Vince was on the block) and get no PG back in return. Your still ok because you can start watson and bring boykins off the bench.

That deal was Dre, Lenard, and flores (plus a first round pick) for Vince Carter. The toronto board laughed at me. Hmmm, who got the last laugh. 

Regardless, there are a lot of "big names" on the block right now. Kiki might be able to trade Lenard and Watson to land a player we need, but keep in mind he might have to trade Kenyon or Dre to get the job done. If it makes this franchise better im all for it.


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## darth-horax (Nov 21, 2005)

Bender's retiring? He's way too young! Wow...that caught me off guard...totally.

Howsabout K-Mart straight across for J,O'Neal? Hahahahahaha!


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

darth-horax said:


> Wow...that caught me off guard...totally.
> 
> !


really?, its been rumored for quite awhile. he was doomed since he never put on muscle after coming out of high school as a stickboy


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

nbanoitall said:


> personally i dont think like that anymore. To help spread the floor its nice to have 2 players capable of hiting the shot out on the floor.
> 
> Regardless, you can point your finger at a lot of players that arent great 3 point shooters. But a lot of our guards (because there PGs) are small and not capable of defending the big athletic wings. So why does Andre Miller have to go. One reason is we have lots of PGs and Miller has a contract (with a decent salary) that can be traded. Now, keep in mind im only talking about trades the benefit the franchise. The first option would be to trade watson, but other teams are going to want Miller. And right now there are only two untradable players on this team, and Miller isnt one of them. Id say Boykins is even more untradable than Miller, because (like I was talking about in an earlier thread) boykins has that defined role. He is the "spark" off the bench that we need in a lot of games.
> 
> ...


As big of a Miller fan boy that I am. I would even trade him for Vince Carter. However I'm not sure if trading Miller and keeping Watson/Boykins would be as good for the Nuggets. Yes who ever they aquire from the trade will help the Nuggets. Yet if Watson doesn't contribute as much as Miller our PG position may become a problem. Watson and Boykins would be very undersized against a lot of PG's in the league. To me Watson is a back up PG not a starter. IMO trading Miller just for a SG and filler is not the answer. Its fixing one problem, but starting another for the Nuggets.

If we could deal Watson in place of Miller + who ever I have no issues with that what so ever. Having Miller solidifys the Nuggets PG position IMO. All we need is a good SG to be a top tier team right now.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

23AJ said:


> If we could deal Watson in place of Miller + who ever I have no issues with that what so ever. Having Miller solidifys the Nuggets PG position IMO. All we need is a good SG to be a top tier team right now.


ideally, but it all depends on the level of talent coming back. dont forget about nene either. 

FYI, since peja is going to be unrestricted, if he doesnt go for artest, he may drop a lot in value over the season.

As for a trade, if we would just start drafting right, maybe we could have this position filled. there are going to be a lot of two guards available in the draft this summer. And even in the second round. If you havent seen Brandon Roy, watch him. it seems he has worked on his outside shot as well.

but ideally im talking about roby, Denham Brown,dean,or ager.

actually id like to get two picks in the draft one to get a big (to replace Nene) example being either Josh Boone or Paul Davis, and of course a shooting guard.

However my point hasnt changed, to bring in a star like Artest, or Ray Allen, or whoever, guys like Andre Miller and Kenyon Martin are going to have to be delt.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

nbanoitall said:


> ideally, but it all depends on the level of talent coming back. dont forget about nene either.
> 
> FYI, since peja is going to be unrestricted, if he doesnt go for artest, he may drop a lot in value over the season.
> 
> ...


Looks like there is going to be a lot of Michigan State guys avalable in the draft. I like Ager a lot. Tough player. Also I been high on Josh Boone for awhile now. Just look at how his old teammate Charlie is doing in Toronto. I have no doubt Boone will be a solid player in the league.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

The problem with Peja is that him and Melo play the same position. So nix that idea.


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## darth-horax (Nov 21, 2005)

Miller is the most underrated PG in the league, period.

He does all the things a good PG should do. He passes the ball first, but when he's hot, there's nobody better. Best post up PG in the league. We were smart to get him, and we'd be stupid to trade him.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

23AJ said:


> The problem with Peja is that him and Melo play the same position. So nix that idea.


yes they are listed at the same position, but the only issue would be defending other teams. Let me say this, when the kings play the rockets, Adelman likes to have Peja guard McGrady. So there is some hope that Melo and Peja could play together. its not something id just look at and then nix without and consideration.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

nbanoitall said:


> yes they are listed at the same position, but the only issue would be defending other teams. Let me say this, when the kings play the rockets, Adelman likes to have Peja guard McGrady. So there is some hope that Melo and Peja could play together. its not something id just look at and then nix without and consideration.


Well I'm very suprised Peja can keep up with Tracy McGrady. Maybe McGrady is losing a step? Peja has a hard time dealing with Melo. However I can't see Peja being able to guard guys like Wade/Bryant/Jesus(ray allen)/etc

We Need Maggette!


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

darth-horax said:


> Miller is the most underrated PG in the league, period.
> 
> He does all the things a good PG should do. He passes the ball first, but when he's hot, there's nobody better. Best post up PG in the league. We were smart to get him, and we'd be stupid to trade him.


A voice of reason. Thank you. By the way you noticing nobody is complaing about Jason Kidd. Yet he was never a good shooter. Not saying Miller is Kidd, but they have a lot in common.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

Kenyon for Artest??

From Chris Sheridan, ESPN Insider

DENVER NUGGETS — One player agent told Insider on Monday that the Nuggets were listening to offers for Kenyon Martin ($10.89 million). If Denver tried to get Artest at a cheaper price, an offer of Voshon Lenard ($3.5 million) and Nene ($3.04 million) would work.


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## darth-horax (Nov 21, 2005)

If they do that, they'd better get Croshere or a first round pick in return. That'd be sweet, but we'd have NOBODY in the post.


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## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

For the right price. I'm not interested in a deal that involves Carmelo, Kenyon, or Marcus. But honestly I think he wants to be "the man" and he's not going to be that hear. I'm happy with our current defensive players who have no problem taking a backseat to Carmelo in publicity. 

And don't shoot me, but I don't think Buckner is that much worse on defense.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

nugzhomer said:


> And don't shoot me, but I don't think Buckner is that much worse on defense.


buck not much worse than artest?

:rocket: bang u dead


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

nugzhomer said:


> For the right price. I'm not interested in a deal that involves Carmelo, Kenyon, or Marcus. But honestly I think he wants to be "the man" and he's not going to be that hear. I'm happy with our current defensive players who have no problem taking a backseat to Carmelo in publicity.
> 
> And don't shoot me, but I don't think Buckner is that much worse on defense.


Good post nugzhomer. I don't agree that Buckner is on the same level as Artest. However I do agree with you that Buckner is a very good defender.

If Kenyon Martin can stay healthy I wouldn't want Artest in Denver either. However thats a big question mark right now with K-Mart.

Also good points about how Camby, K-Mart, Miller and company all realize and accept Melo is their young leader. Thats something that may be an issue with Artest.


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## darth-horax (Nov 21, 2005)

The only real difference between Buckner and Ron Ron is the fact that Ron Ron can Score Score nearly at will will. Buck can shoot the 3, and everybody in the league can score when called upon, except for Chris Andersen, but Ron probably won't fit in with the player type here.

Even though K-Mart is out 50% of the time, Ron will be suspended for about %30. Even though K-Mart is overpaid (only cause of injury), I'd say keep him for the size and intensity. He will eventually get healthy, but Ron Ron is just crazy in the head.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

darth-horax said:


> only real difference between Buckner and Ron Ron .


is Ron Ron is one of the most talented players in the league, and buckner is a scrub. Thats just a slight difference mind you, but dont even try and compare these guys on any level. Ron is a crazy MFer. And thats the only reason teams wouldnt trade the farm for him, and quite frankily the only reason he isnt filthy stinking rich (and a household name like Kobe or Shaq, Wade, Lebron, Melo, Paul Pierce, etc) outside of Indiana anyways.

If Artest kept himself in check, and had a fully functional brain, I can only imagine the possibilities


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## Timmons (May 25, 2005)

nbanoitall said:


> If Artest kept himself in check, and had a fully functional brain, I can only imagine the possibilities


Don't people say that about Terrell Owens too? I don't see Ron being happy in Denver playing second fiddle to Melo. 

I would hate to see the franchise blow up if Artest came in an aggrivated everyone like he has done to J. O'neal.

I'm not sold on Artest's mental ability. No question the kid can play though. 

CAN ARTEST CO-EXIST ANYWHERE? ESPECIALLY IN ANOTHER SMALLER MARKET LIKE DENVER. HE MAY NEVER BE HAPPY UNTIL HE'S IN A MEDIA CIRCUS TOWN LIKE NY OR LA.

I definitely would consider dealing KMart for Artest however. As much as I like Kenyon as a player and as a good person, his health is just detrimental to the team and will continue to be once Denver is paying him in excess of $14 million to rehab his aching knees. I was so happy when Denver got him and so miserable that his play has been hindered. Any trade for KMart must be looked at for betterment of the franchise in the long run.


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## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

Tobin 73 EIRE said:


> I'm not sold on Artest's mental ability. No question the kid can play though.
> 
> .


i just am not going to stand around and watch favorable comparisons to buckner. thats just not right.

there are some serious rumors, some circulating from ESPN that he is coming here. The truth of the matter is nobody understands Ron Artest. The best situation for him seems to be in Indiana, but here he is asking for a trade. With Ron, you get unpredictability. But if you dont have to give up the farm for him. like trading melo or camby, its something to consider, simply because you could never trade for a player of talent (obviously ron is a usual case) without giving up those guys.

So who knows


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

More on K-Mart by Kiki .



> General manager Kiki Vandeweghe refuted an ESPN.com report in which an unnamed agent said Denver is considering trading Kenyon Martin. "I don't comment on rumors and we're not interested in trading him," Vandeweghe said


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## Timmons (May 25, 2005)

23AJ said:


> More on K-Mart by Kiki .


Kiki better get interested in trading KMart!

I agree with NBAnoitall, getting the talent Artest can bring in without giving away too much is definitely worth a shot...

But should Nene be in the deal? I say keep Nene, trade Kmart (if they'll take him) and focus on next season! 

Maybe ink Rad-man in Seattle to provide a big shooter to go with Nene's inside game and Denver is a threat!

Miller / Boykins / Watson (who knows)
Artest / Buck / DJ (who knows)
Melo / Kleiza / Hodge (who knows)
Nene / Radmonovich (sp?) / Najera
Camby / Elson

Would be an interesting team.

I wonder how much Melo wants KMart to stay????????????????


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

Tobin 73 EIRE said:


> Kiki better get interested in trading KMart!
> 
> I agree with NBAnoitall, getting the talent Artest can bring in without giving away too much is definitely worth a shot...
> 
> ...


That lineup would be a serious up grade to what we are playing with right now. However I don't see Artest being a 2 guard.


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

More news on Ron from espn










http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime-051217-18


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## 77AJ (Feb 16, 2005)

Also teams have been turning away from Voshon and Earl Watson.


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