# Fisher Agrees to Deal with Lakers



## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

3 years 16 million.

We just used the full mle on a 30 something, no defense, can't make a layup "shooter" who is coming off a season where he shot 30% from 3pt range. And this despite the fact that we have two consecutive 1st round picks at the same spot.

We just cemented a first round exit. Only KG can save us now.

What a joke.


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## Laker Freak (Jul 1, 2003)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

Do you have a link?


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## Theonee (Dec 5, 2006)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

If that is true Let the fire Mitch fan club begin....
I would rather they spent it on Mihm... if they really had that kind of money to spend.


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## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/sports/abox/article_1760239.php


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## Unique (Apr 13, 2005)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

this is true but he did not use up all of MLE

Decent move. IMO, Last 3 years we have been screwed over the MLE.


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## cmd34 (Jul 17, 2002)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



Unique said:


> this is true but he did not use up all of MLE
> 
> Decent move. IMO, Last 3 years we have been screwed over the MLE.



or screwed over by the guy signing people to the MLE ?


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## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



Unique said:


> this is true but he did not use up all of MLE
> 
> Decent move. IMO, Last 3 years we have been screwed over the MLE.


3 years 16 million doesn't leave much left. Tell me who we are going to get with what is left-over.


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## Silk D (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



Theonee said:


> If that is true Let the fire Mitch fan club begin....
> I would rather they spent it on Mihm... if they really had that kind of money to spend.


we can still re-sign Mihm; we have his bird rights.


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

at 5.33 million a year, it's pretty much the MLE to me. we need a big, not fisher. oh well.

i like fisher and all, but im not sure if this is the right move.


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

How much does that leave us??


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## Silk D (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

good move, IMO. he's just holding the fort till one of our yougin's are ready. he'll be great in the locker room, and can be trusted in the forth quarter.


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## Silk D (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



afobisme said:


> at 5.33 million a year, it's pretty much the MLE to me. we need a big, not fisher. oh well.
> 
> i like fisher and all, but im not sure if this is the right move.


the contract most likely starts of low and increases anually. probably somwhere between 4-4.5 million. either way, it won't leave us with much; 1.5 mil tops.


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

we can't trade him either, because he came to LA for a reason. he probably has a no trade kicker.


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



Silk D said:


> good move, IMO. he's just holding the fort till one of our yougin's are ready. he'll be great in the locker room, and can be trusted in the forth quarter.


Are you serious? Good move? 

5+ mil/year for Fisher? The ONLY good part of this deal is that its not too long. And to think... I was hoping the Lakers would sign him for the vet's min.


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## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

all depends what "most" means.


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

Sorry, but we got torched with this one. Again.


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## Eternal (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



Bartholomew Hunt said:


> Sorry, but we got torched with this one. Again.


Sadly yes.


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

I hope Bynum learns to alter shots. Until we have some sort of force to be reckoned with in the paint, this team is going to continue to be atrocious against penetration.


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

Personally i dont mind this signing cuz im a big Fisher fan and i think his intangibles and experience will be very good for J & J. but all you naysayers out there ill pose a question for you. Who would you sign for our MLE?? Mo Williams wasnt signing for the MLE, and we sure as hell arent getting Billups. I would rather have Fisher than Blake. Who could we realistically have gotten for the MLE??


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

Thats a bit much. I love D Fish but 5 mil a year? Oh well, I dont want to complain since its only for 3 yrs anyway. 

Plus we've always lacked poise, veteran leadership, stability and someone can execute the triangle in point guard position. Fisher simply fills all those holes.


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## Silk D (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



CubanLaker said:


> Personally i dont mind this signing cuz im a big Fisher fan and i think his intangibles and experience will be very good for J & J. but all you naysayers out there ill pose a question for you. Who would you sign for our MLE?? Mo Williams wasnt signing for the MLE, and we sure as hell arent getting Billups. I would rather have Fisher than Blake. Who could we realistically have gotten for the MLE??


exactly. who were you guys hoping for? I mean the only player you can make a case for is Francis, and thats a very weak case, IMO.

we may have over-paid a bit, but seriously, who cares? consider this; Fisher's worth at least 3.5 mil. Now, that 2 million we woulda had left wasn't going to net us another player. this isn't an "un-movable" contract, but even if it was, we can't trade him anyway. And as long as Kobe and Lamar are still on the team, we aren't going to be under the cap anytime soon. so I say again, who cares?


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## Dominate24/7 (Oct 15, 2006)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



CubanLaker said:


> Personally i dont mind this signing cuz im a big Fisher fan and i think his intangibles and experience will be very good for J & J. but all you naysayers out there ill pose a question for you. Who would you sign for our MLE?? Mo Williams wasnt signing for the MLE, and we sure as hell arent getting Billups. I would rather have Fisher than Blake. Who could we realistically have gotten for the MLE??



My thoughts exactly. Blake might be better, but not by much. Fish has tri experience and he is a true class act. Javaris and Jordan will have a good mentor. Welcome home, Fish!


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## Laker Freak (Jul 1, 2003)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*

At the moment the team is incredibly weak in the front court:

PG: Fisher/Farmar/Crittenton/Sasha
SG: Kobe/Evans
SF: Odom/Walton/Radmanovic/Yue
PF: Cook/Turiaf
C: Brown/Bynum/Gasol

EDIT: this is not a starting lineup but just a list of everyone at their natural positions.


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

*Re: Lakers sign Fisher to full mle*



Laker Freak said:


> At the moment the team is incredibly weak in the front court:
> 
> PG: Fisher/Farmar/Crittenton/Sasha
> SG: Kobe/Evans
> ...


yeah but if you put them where they will play... it doesnt look too bad. Still 1st round exit but much better..

PG: Fisher/Farmar/Crittenton/Sasha
SG: Kobe/Evans
SF: Walton/Radmanovic/Yue
PF: Odom/Cook/Turiaf
C: Brown/Bynum/Gasol


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Can all of you please calm the hell down. We used the whole MLE on Fisher...so what? He's the best FA we have signed since Karl Malone and Gary Payton.

We can't sign any good FAs now? Like who? Steve Blake isn't as good as Fisher, and guys like James Posey, Darko Milicic and Ruben Patterson sure weren't going to make us much better. Fisher is probably the best player out of all of them, and he has been playing some great basketball. He is in fantastic shape and will be sooo much more steady than Smush Parker.

Great signing!


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## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Don't worry guys there's still plenty of money to give Smush another contract :whoknows:


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## Silk D (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Damian Necronamous said:


> Can all of you please calm the hell down.



:lol: 

sorry, I couldn't help it. I never thought I'd hear _you_ say that. I'm with you, though; good pick-up


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

I really can't find another free agent I would rather have with the MLE, so I guess I side with you guys. It does make sense.


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

4 pgs now. sasha needs to be shipped out. if crittendon can live up to what we expect of him, he can alternate between the 1 and the 2, and farmar can get maybe 20 minutes a game or so.


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## Ghiman (May 19, 2003)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Welcome Back D-Fish! :yay:


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

I like this move as well.


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## elcap15 (Aug 8, 2006)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Damian Necronamous said:


> Can all of you please calm the hell down. We used the whole MLE on Fisher...so what? He's the best FA we have signed since Karl Malone and Gary Payton.
> 
> We can't sign any good FAs now? Like who? Steve Blake isn't as good as Fisher, and guys like James Posey, Darko Milicic and Ruben Patterson sure weren't going to make us much better. Fisher is probably the best player out of all of them, and he has been playing some great basketball. He is in fantastic shape and will be sooo much more steady than Smush Parker.
> 
> Great signing!



Im with you on this one. I am a little bit of a Fisher fanboi but I still think that this is a good move for the team. We can still resign Mihm if we want to and there is no one out there that I would rather have that would take the MLE. We have two young talented pt guards who can stand to learn a lot from Fisher and a locker room that could stand a little maturity.

Fisher is the best guard we have had on this team since. . . well, Fisher.


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Steve Francis> Derek Fisher


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## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



> Fisher and the Lakers have agreed to a three-year contract worth about $13,959,000, league sources said.
> 
> However, there will be a holding period before he can sign the contract. Fisher, who was released by the Utah Jazz last week, has to clear waivers first.


http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/47074/20070712/fisher_agrees_to_return_to_lakers/


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

I hate this deal. Fisher will be out 3rd best point guard within a year and he'll be stealing minutes from the our other two PGs who are actually capable of playing defense.


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## Silk D (Feb 6, 2006)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

wow, you guys think we're all set at the point with Jordan and Javaris? yaul crazy. We certainly needed a veteran PG, and as has been pointed out, Fisher was the best one available to us. we got him starting out at 4 million and for three years? very reasonable contract; great signing.


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## Kobester888 (Jul 8, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

I think this is an excellent signing. This has made our team a lot better than we were the past few years. The biggest thing is that Fisher knows the offense inside-out meaning that will be giving more in depth knowledge to our future young point guards. This is going to help us out 10-fold for the present and the future. We probably won't be going to the finals but it is a huge step forward.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

I like Fisher and respect what he did for our title teams but he's a bad fit with this team. He only adds to the problems with the team and this just adds another smart yet basically unathletic non penetrator to the team. Fisher's gonna have really good games shooting the 3 ball, he's gonna be mentally tough in tough times and gonna add some veteran stability BUT

He's also never gonna penetrate, get slow roasted on defense, take bad shots, and gonna stifle the play of 2 good and better playing pg's just because he has been a legend for us during the title years. 

He doesn't need to be here holding the hands of our young pg's, its time for them to play and begin to lead. 

Other teams play their young talented pg's. We act like its a crime to trot them out there. 

I would really prefer Critt's and Farmar's athleticsm and ability to penetrate as an offfenisve option than Fisher spot up shooting. 

Teams that win have penetrators as focal point of their teams. With Kobe Fisher and walton on the perimeter we'll hardly have anyone collapsing the paint.

This is not the direction we need to be going in. 

I'd much rather have Steve Francis's penetrating ability than Fisher's spot up 3 pt shooting if we have to go vet pg.


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Fisher is a quality signing and I too concur that there was nobody better to use the MLE on. IMO way better than dealing with Francis and his lack of knowledge of the system. I've noticed that most of the people the Lakers sign take about 3/4 of their first year to get comfortable in the offense, no need for that with Fish. He will teach Jordan and Javarius (spelling?) what they need to know.


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## elcap15 (Aug 8, 2006)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Fisher is what we need and he is the best option available. He isnt going to be playing 40 minutes a game. Farmar and Javaris will still get their minutes, but we will have a veteran leader who knows what to do with the ball in tough situations and in crunch time.

And lets not overvalue Farmar or Critt. They both have potential, but that doesnt mean **** until that potential is realized.


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## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

LAS VEGAS - For all intents and purposes, Derek Fisher will re-join the Lakers. 
Fisher and the Lakers have agreed to a three-year contract worth about $13,959,000, league sources said. 

However, there will be a holding period before he can sign the contract. Fisher, who was released by the Utah Jazz last week, has to clear waivers first. 
It'll take seven days before Fisher can clear waivers, and that won't start until his previous contract of $20,592,600 that he walked away from is amended to zero dollars. 

As of Wednesday night, the Jazz had not filed the paperwork with the NBA about Fisher's release. The seven-day countdown to Fisher's being free and able to sign with the Lakers won't start until Utah does. 

Another team could pick up Fisher before he clears waivers. But if it does, that team will be on the hook for all of Fisher's $20,592,600 salary. 

Fisher's contract with the Lakers will start at $*4.3* million, which is less than the mid-level exception for next season at $5.3 million.
http://www.pe.com/sports/basketball/lakers/stories/PE_Sports_Local_D_lakers_12.412003a.html


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Fisher will be great for the Lakers. But right now I'm worried about this upcomming season because it seems like everybody is back to being at full strength again. And when that happens there is always some injury that ruins it. 05(Kobe's ankle) 06(Mihm's ankle) 07(Lamar's knee, Kwame's Ankle, Walton's Ankle). So whats going to happen in 08? To follow the partern, the next victim should be Andrew Bynum!


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## Tyrellaphonte (Feb 21, 2004)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

i'd rather have signed mo williams, but thats about it... maybe a big but who knows


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Luke was on Rome is Burning right now. Is happy about the Lakers offer to give him a contract. Says he thinks Kobe will be back next year. and that Bynum has been in the gym "everyday this offseason" and that Bynum is scheduled to be in Atlanta workimg out with some special trainers in the next few weeks.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



elcap15 said:


> Fisher is what we need and he is the best option available. He isnt going to be playing 40 minutes a game. Farmar and Javaris will still get their minutes, but we will have a veteran leader who knows what to do with the ball in tough situations and in crunch time.
> 
> And lets not overvalue Farmar or Critt. They both have potential, but that doesnt mean **** until that potential is realized.


Exactly.


Lets not overrate Javaris. Kid has potential, but to even think he's a better point guard than Fish right now is ridiculous. Crittenton is lighting up the SL, but how is he going to handle all the pressure of a real NBA game? How is he going to cope with the fact that he's not going to get calls in his favor? This is a great move by the F/O. Phil obviously wants experience and direction from the point guard slot, Fisher can provide this.



Right now, with emphasis on _now_ Fisher is the best guard to start for the Lakers if we are trying to win. Kobe and Fisher will bring a lot of experience and stability in the 1-2 spot. Fisher is a leader, he's a floor general. I love how he does all the small little things that helps you win games. He's not flashy or doesnt, but he brings a great deal of leadership and positive attitude in this team.


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## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Fisher can't handle the ball, he doesn't attack the hoop, he doesn't play defense, and this last season he shot 30% from 3pt range. That is terrible. 

You guys realize that Farmar shot better from downtown than Fish? At least he can create for himself and the other guys instead of relying so heavily on them like Fish does.


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## elcap15 (Aug 8, 2006)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Wilt_The_Stilt said:


> Fisher can't handle the ball, he doesn't attack the hoop, he doesn't play defense, and this last season he shot 30% from 3pt range. That is terrible.
> 
> You guys realize that Farmar shot better from downtown than Fish? At least he can create for himself and the other guys instead of relying so heavily on them like Fish does.



What are u talking about? Cant handle the ball? Are we talking about the same person? Why do you think he cant play defense?

last season was without a doubt his worst shooting year, but he is a career 37% 3pt shooter. We are not getting Fisher so we can have a killer scoring threat at pt guard. we are getting him so we have someone who doesnt **** Up or disappear in the close games. Farmar may very well be a better shooter than Fish, and he may end up being a better point guard than Fish, but right now he is not. He cant manage the floor the way fisher can, and he doesnt have the expirience to know what needs to be done. 

Did you watch the playoffs last year? Fisher was amazing and a big reason why they did as well as they did.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

You try to justify Farmar as a better player with numbers, and yet the disparity between both is not even mind boggling to make the other look bad and to make matters worse, Fisher is still a better player based on their stats last year.


Farmar is struggling, even in the SL. Right now, if it comes down to both, Fisher is a better option than Farmar. Dont get intangibles confused with stats, because numbers wise the difference between both is so narrow and still Fisher brings a whole lot more in the table than sophomore Jordan.


You can possibly make a case for Javaris, because he appears more NBA ready than Farmar, but Im not going to get excited and proclaim Javaris as the team's starter.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



elcap15 said:


> *We are not getting Fisher so we can have a killer scoring threat at pt guard. we are getting him so we have someone who doesnt **** Up or disappear in the close games. *


Seriously. Is this really hard to decipher at all? After what we've went through with Smush and even Farmar when he took over Smush's job, you would think people would understand this.


Great post Elcap.


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## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



elcap15 said:


> Cant handle the ball?


Fisher rarely brought the ball up the floor. And it was rare to see him create for others. He is a sg in a point guard's body.



> Why do you think he cant play defense?


Maybe it's because Troy Hudson put up 24ppg against him in the playoffs and set a franchise record for points in the process? And that was several years ago. Not to mention the countless other point guards who have roasted him over the years. He's only going to get worse. But if you think he is a good defender then maybe we are thinking of different players.



> last season was without a doubt his worst year,


You sure about that? His worst 3pt% season was actually his last year with us ('03-04) when he shot 29%.



> We are not getting Fisher so we can have a killer scoring threat at pt guard.


Then why are you defending his terrible %?



> we are getting him so we have someone who doesnt **** Up or disappear in the close games.


I'll give you that to an extent. Fisher is a vet and he is familiar with the offense. But how many games during the year will Fisher win us that another, cheaper vet point guard wouldn't?



> Farmar may very well be a better shooter than Fish, and he may end up being a better point guard than Fish, but right now he is not. He cant manage the floor the way fisher can, and he doesnt have the expirience to know what needs to be done.


In what way does Fisher "manage the floor" Is it the way he stands at the 3pt line waiting for someone to pass for him because he can't create for himself? Or is it the way he misses all those layups? 



> Did you watch the playoffs last year? Fisher was amazing and a big reason why they did as well as they did.


Are you talking about the first round where he shot an amazing 31% from 3pt range, or are you talking about the conference finals where he shot an even better 13% from 3pt range and 25% overall? He had one good series, but his playoff performace on the whole was hardly amazing.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Wilt_The_Stilt said:


> Are you talking about the first round where he shot an amazing 31% from 3pt range, or are you talking about the conference finals where he shot an even better 13% from 3pt range and 25% overall? He had one good series, but his playoff performace on the whole was hardly amazing.


And you're saying this because Farmar's %200 3FG is better? :lol: 


You keep knocking Fisher's D, when its obvious Farmar is not any better.


Ill tell you right now,with all the knock on Fisher, him against Nash last year would''ve been a better option than Farmar.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

I don't even view this argument from a stats perspective if Fisher joins us he'll get 11-12 ppg he'll be solid offensively he'll hustle for lose ball and we'll lose a bunch of close games to athletic teams. 

We lost to so many dreadful teams simply because we weren't as athletic as some of the lower tiered teams. 

Bobcats beat us Twice because of it, Knicks guards penetrated us into an embarrasing home loss last season. 

Getting Crittenton was a great step in the righ direction. He is a future star.Farmar is a solid player in the making much more athletic , more of penetrator a better scorer than Fisher. 

Our young guards are more talented and need to be given a chance to run the show. 

Getting Fisher is just prolonging the obvious and adding much too strong a voice that'll fight tooth and nail to ensure PJ keeps them on the bench to the detriment of the team overall. 

He knows what PJ likes, he'll use vet savy to stay ahead of the younger talents but it won't help us win. 

Two really bad mistakes this offseason is re-signing Walton and signing Fisher. 

I'm still betting we get KG and give away too much to get him. 

Unfortunately Kobe is right about mitch.


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## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> And you're saying this because Farmar's %200 3FG is better? :lol:


I never said Farmar played well in the playoffs.

I also never said Farmar was better than Fisher based on any statistic, but I do find it ironic that in the one area Fisher is supposedly best at (3pters) Farmar outperformed him.




> You keep knocking Fisher's D, when its obvious Farmar is not any better.


Very convincing. 



> Ill tell you right now,with all the knock on Fisher, him against Nash last year would''ve been a better option than Farmar.


Unless of course, he played like he did against the Spurs.


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## Eternal (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

I can't believe people are actually not happy with this sign. Fisher brings a ton of experience, something we lacked sorely the past couple of years, and won't dissapear crunch time.

Fisher > Farmar hands down, and Javaris isn't ready.


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## The Lake Show (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

I'm still a Farmar believer and I am not sure why you guys are knocking him. Players need minutes to get better, and Farmar didn't start games until the very end of the season. We have 2 great young point guards that we can develop. Our MLE money can be better spent elsewhere. No disrespect to D-Fish, but I personally don't think he is that great of a point guard and definitely isn't worth a big contract. He's a great guy and all, but he got torched by every quick point guard out there when he was a laker.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Wilt_The_Stilt said:


> Very convincing.


Prove me wrong then...


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Since the goal is to win now...


Its common sense that Fisher's experience is much more valuable than Farmar's upside.



Fisher's biggest attribution is his attitude. He may not be the quickest, the flashiest or the most gifted guard in this rotation, but you can be sure that Fisher is the one who can help LA's chemistry to get even better.



Chemistry is a key and is important. Any team with a great chemistry will end up having better communications on the floor. Thats how you build a winner.



I hate to say this, but Fisher has more leadership skills than Kobe. I just cant see Kobe being more vocal as it is, without stepping on someone's sensitive toes. Situations like this, a class act like Fisher is the perfect voice of reason. A guy who works hard and doesnt complain. 



I mean this is the same reason why Kobe is so ticked off. LA always seems to find players who has a high ceiling but is a few years away from helping him achieve his goal, instead of giving him help he that could produce now.



I think guys who knocks on Fisher is missing the biggest picture of all. LA and Kobe wants to win a championship ASAP. Not 3-5 years from now. logic will tell you that surrounding him with experience not potential is the way to go.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

Also I do not think athleticism was LA's major downfall in losing games. IMO it has to do with lacking the basic knowledge of executing fundamentally sound ball. LA's team is pretty athletic as it is. Kobe,Lamar,Kwame, Mo Evans and even Smush are athletic players. I think a better definition or assessment of the teams character is they are simply not talented enough to compete at a higher level.



The team loss a lot of games due to minor mental lapses. From missing an opportunity to box out in key situations to blowing individual defensive assignments and missing rotations, to giving up too many second chance points in crucial periods.


For example, the Spurs are far from being the most athletic team, yet you see them crowned as the leagues champion. The biggest difference is their understanding and executing fundamentals with consistency.



Athleticism can only bring you so far, but without the most important aspect or if the team is mising the biggest component to make it much more valuable, then it simply will not produce success.


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*

And someone has yet to name another "veteran point guard" thats out there that we can get for the MLE, and that is better than Fisher.


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## Eternal (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



CubanLaker said:


> And someone has yet to name another "veteran point guard" thats out there that we can get for the MLE, and that is better than Fisher.


Well it seems the people who are disagreeing with signing Fisher want to let our young guys (Javaris and Farmar) develop rather then signing someone, which I totally disagree with, as our goal should be to win now... and probably will make alot more sense signing Fisher if we pull off a trade somehow which would probably make us more of a veteran team.


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

signing fisher isn't that bad an idea, but he can't be traded (or else we'll get a lot of negative media) and is as good as he'll ever be.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Its not a great move, but it was also one of the only moves out there.

I mean, where were we going to find a vet guard with experience in the triangle that would sign 3 years and come in better than Fisher?

There might be better guards to pick up, but the problem is finding a better guard at the price we can give them that will fulfill the role that Fisher can. 

If we resign Mihm for a decent price, I think this would be an ok off season. I still am one of those few people that think the laker's have a decent team, if they can remain healthy have a shot at the second round. No title of course, but making it a little further in the playoffs for sure.

Last season everyone including our coach was injured. This season I think we should be fine.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Damian Necronamous said:


> Can all of you please calm the hell down. We used the whole MLE on Fisher...so what? He's the best FA we have signed since Karl Malone and Gary Payton.
> 
> We can't sign any good FAs now? Like who? Steve Blake isn't as good as Fisher, and guys like James Posey, Darko Milicic and Ruben Patterson sure weren't going to make us much better. Fisher is probably the best player out of all of them, and he has been playing some great basketball. He is in fantastic shape and will be sooo much more steady than Smush Parker.
> 
> Great signing!


Awesome post. You get a rep from me on this one.

Fisher knows our offense. Is a great floor leader with fourth quarter experience. Is a good presense both on the court and in the locker room. And he isn't afraid to tell Kobe to stfu. Thats the type player the Lakers need.. And goobers like Steve Blake were not going to bring that.

Not to mention if people don't think Kobe was involved at bring Fisher here, there nuts. He was probably pushing them to pull the trigger as soon as Fisher opted out.


----------



## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> Also I do not think athleticism was LA's major downfall in losing games. IMO it has to do with lacking the basic knowledge of executing fundamentally sound ball. LA's team is pretty athletic as it is. Kobe,Lamar,Kwame, Mo Evans and even Smush are athletic players. I think a better definition or assessment of the teams character is they are simply not talented enough to compete at a higher level.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



We lost games due to athleticsm plain and simple, got beat by the Grizz at home because some guy named Kinsey, Warrick, and gay ran us off the court. It was like that playing all the bad teams they had athlete's not savy vets and ran us out.

The good teams had more cerebral players and we hung in because they didn't have the young huys who could run and our supposed cerebral guys were able to compete. 

Too many games, Sasha, Walton, odom at 4, Smush not that athletic as far as lateral movement, a limping Kwame and Kobe before he got in shape after surgery were liabilities. 

We can win now with younger pg's, pg's in our system don't run the team they simple bring the ball up so its not a typical pg situation with us we could use the shooting and penetrating and athleticsm of the young guys. 

Fishers just isn't gonna move the dial all that much. 

If one of the young guys develop fast who knows we might actually take a step forward. 

Who says Critt might not be a phenom who comes in and plays great right way. 

But he won't get a real shot to help this season because Fisher will be dragging his vet savy around and PJ won't ever want to pull someone he trusts. 

Critt is more agressive and talented than farmar and Farmar I think is still gonna be a good one. 

This Fisher move looks like a transparent play to make Kobe feel better sadly Kobe will see through this as well he knows Fish can't help them get much better.


----------



## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> Prove me wrong then...


You keep knocking Farmar's D, when its obvious Fisher is not any better.

There, I "proved" it the same way you did. With lot's of insight, logic and evidence.


----------



## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Wilt_The_Stilt said:


> You keep knocking Farmar's D, when its obvious Fisher is not any better.
> 
> There, I "proved" it the same way you did. With lot's of insight, logic and evidence.


That statement does not need a lot of insight and evidence. Its not rocket science. If you've seen how Fisher played and how Farmar did, none of them is miles ahead better than the other defensively. I dont even know why you're arguing with me. Its like me saying "Slava Medvedenko is not any better than Brian Cook defensively" and all of a sudden you have Medvedenko fanbois standing up for poor ol Slava. 


Anyway...

On a defensive point of view, Fisher on the floor is a much safer piece than Farmar right now. Simply because Fisher's experience means a lot in crucial situations. He's battle tested and possesses the smarts and wits of a veteran, he has a much broader knowledge in the pro level. Farmar has been exposed and is struggling for the exact opposite reasons that Fisher has demonstrated.


Will Farmar emerge as a better player? Sure, maybe, I hope so. Kid is phenomenal and is more of a true point guard than Fisher. IS Farmar a more capable player than Fisher right now?...


Ask yourself, after hitting the rookie wall and sent to the D League in mid season and is currently being outplayed by Javaris in the SL this month, Its hard to believe he is an overall better player than Fisher at either end of the court.


----------



## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



jazzy1 said:


> We lost games due to athleticsm plain and simple, got beat by the Grizz at home because some guy named Kinsey, Warrick, and gay ran us off the court. It was like that playing all the bad teams they had athlete's not savy vets and ran us out.
> 
> The good teams had more cerebral players and we hung in because they didn't have the young huys who could run and our supposed cerebral guys were able to compete.
> 
> ...


If LA is simply and plainly losing because of athleticism and not because of their poor execution on fundamentals, then they should've never made the Playoffs, because I could name a whole lot of teams much athletic than the Lakers and yet they were beaten by this sqaud when LA was healthy.


I could remember one game from the Grizzlies where LA was up by double digits at the end of first half. The Lakers then decided not to execute the same game plan in the other quarter. To make story short, they did not play defense and forgot to use the same formula that helped them maintain a lead and boom, Grizllies blew up for 40+ points or at least close to it(if im not mistaken) in just ONE quarter, short summary and the Lakers lost for obvious reasons.


Im also wary about putting inexperience point guards for starters. Javaris may be an exemption to the rule simply because he has Tri experience, but I dont think Phil is going to break the rule if he has better options. On a traditional Triangle, you dont need a quick and younger guard to attain the goal, if history is any indication, its always better to have a player who has knowledge on how to properly execute the game plan.


Rookies are just very prone to errors. The kind of errors you want to avoid if you're team is trying to elevate their team play and rhythm. If we are rebuilding, then Im all for Javaris or Jordan taking majority of the minutes. But unitl they can prove otherwise, Id rather have veterans playing majority of the time. A game or two of spectacular play in the SL IMO does not warrant an automatic promotion in a real NBA roster.


----------



## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> That statement does not need a lot of insight and evidence. Its not rocket science. If you've seen how Fisher played and how Farmar did, none of them is miles ahead better than the other defensively. I dont even know why you're arguing with me. Its like me saying "Slava Medvedenko is not any better than Brian Cook defensively" and all of a sudden you have Medvedenko fanbois standing up for poor ol Slava.


Actually I don't know why you are arguing with me. I never mentioned Farmar's defense until my last post, and that was in sarcasm. I never seriously said Farmar is or is not a better defender than Fisher. Just that Fisher himself is a poor defender.


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## L.A. Guy (Jun 8, 2007)

Got Fish? dont forget about the .4 shot.


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## elcap15 (Aug 8, 2006)

We can all ***** back and forth about whether this was good or not, but anyone that doesnt like this deal, what would you have rather done?


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## Eternal (Sep 7, 2005)

elcap15 said:


> We can all ***** back and forth about whether this was good or not, but anyone that doesnt like this deal, what would you have rather done?


Most of them already said. They want the young guys to get the playing time between Jordan and Javaris.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Personally, I love the signing.


----------



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



elcap15 said:


> What are u talking about? Cant handle the ball? Are we talking about the same person? Why do you think he cant play defense?
> 
> last season was without a doubt his worst shooting year, but he is a career 37% 3pt shooter. We are not getting Fisher so we can have a killer scoring threat at pt guard. we are getting him so we have someone who doesnt **** Up or disappear in the close games. Farmar may very well be a better shooter than Fish, and he may end up being a better point guard than Fish, but right now he is not. He cant manage the floor the way fisher can, and he doesnt have the expirience to know what needs to be done.
> 
> Did you watch the playoffs last year? Fisher was amazing and a big reason why they did as well as they did.


fisher hasn't played good defense since his first season

I don't care how hard he tries, the guy is crap defensively and gives up at least 20 ppg to any point guard and at least 30 to good point guards. he is ****, plain and simple.

I don't care how much leadership and intangibles he is because the guy can't guard and can't do **** on offense either except a streaky jumpshot


----------



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Eternal said:


> Well it seems the people who are disagreeing with signing Fisher want to let our young guys (Javaris and Farmar) develop rather then signing someone, which I totally disagree with, as our goal should be to win now... and probably will make alot more sense signing Fisher if we pull off a trade somehow which would probably make us more of a veteran team.


I want to win now and in the future and I don't think the Fisher signing helps with either. People are just getting nostalgic. He was an slow but tough pg and overall an ok role player, but he was still in the bottom third of starting pgs in the early 2000's. Now he is even slower and capable of giving up even more points defensively.


----------



## Eternal (Sep 7, 2005)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



KennethTo said:


> I want to win now and in the future and I don't think the Fisher signing helps with either. People are just getting nostalgic. He was an slow but tough pg and overall an ok role player, but he was still in the bottom third of starting pgs in the early 2000's. Now he is even slower and capable of giving up even more points defensively.


And you think Farmar is any better right now?


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## Silk D (Feb 6, 2006)

this thread can go on forever. It boils down to what you think we need more; experience or athleticism/penetration, with defense being pretty equally bad. 

I'm not buying that Fish will stunt the growth of our young guys. He won't play more than 25-30 minutes a game, and he can do nothing but help them in practice and in the locker room. If they take the job from him, so be it; who cares? But I'd rather have them take the job from an experienced vet versus letting them learn on the fly and possibly costing us a couple games. They'll be fine, and Fish will help with their development.

N jazzy, com'on man. you one of my favorite posters, but you seriously think our team would be better off w/o Luke and Fish so long as we added some athletes? what do you want? another mo evans that can jump out the gym, put some points on the board, but can't make smart basketball plays to save his life? The dip in the teams chemistry was painfully obvious when luke went to the bench and mo replaced him. Not everything that Luke and Fish will do to help us win games is going to show up on the stat sheet, and no, they're not great (or even good) defenders. But they're smart players, they make the most of what they have, and they'll help us win games, period.


----------



## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



Eternal said:


> And you think Farmar is any better right now?


Unless we bring in a player like KG, this team is going nowhere, so there is no point in using the mle to sign an aging vet who isn't very good to begin with.

If by some miracle we do bring in a star player, then it makes a little more sense to bring in Fish, but even then I don't think the difference would be all that huge between Fisher and Farmar/Javaris or some vet minimium point guard


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## Sean (Jun 7, 2002)

I love Fisher. Great guy, class act, good teammate, an integral part of the great teams of 1996-2004. Hit some big shots at critical times. I cried while researching his daughter's cancer issue. Being a father in my rookie season, it broke my heart.

Having said that, my problem is not that he's back, but the $$$ that he's getting. Giving him most of the MLE was not a good idea. Does he deserve it? Sure, but the teams needs that $$$ for other purposes right now. Had they brought him back for half the MLE or less, then I could really support the signing. His leadership is untouchable, but his defense has never been good and that was always been a problem. His missing of layups is a problem. 

The Lakers need to give their young PG's a chance. Other teams are forced to do it all of the time and eventually those guys learn their way. In this offense it is not so critical to have a superb ball handler. But what the Lakers have been lacking for a decade is the defensive stopper at the 1. The Lakers were able to get around that with Shaq here, but now there is no swatter in the middle and other teams are having a field day with it. Put a defender in that position (could it be Javaris?) and things will change.

Who knows, maybe this is all part of another plan...


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

Sean said:


> Who knows, maybe this is all part of another plan...


what do you know???!


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## Sean (Jun 7, 2002)

I know absolutely nothing. Just ask my wife. :biggrin:


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Silk D said:


> this thread can go on forever. It boils down to what you think we need more; experience or athleticism/penetration, with defense being pretty equally bad.
> 
> I'm not buying that Fish will stunt the growth of our young guys. He won't play more than 25-30 minutes a game, and he can do nothing but help them in practice and in the locker room. If they take the job from him, so be it; who cares? But I'd rather have them take the job from an experienced vet versus letting them learn on the fly and possibly costing us a couple games. They'll be fine, and Fish will help with their development.
> 
> N jazzy, com'on man. you one of my favorite posters, but you seriously think our team would be better off w/o Luke and Fish so long as we added some athletes? what do you want? another mo evans that can jump out the gym, put some points on the board, but can't make smart basketball plays to save his life? The dip in the teams chemistry was painfully obvious when luke went to the bench and mo replaced him. Not everything that Luke and Fish will do to help us win games is going to show up on the stat sheet, and no, they're not great (or even good) defenders. But they're smart players, they make the most of what they have, and they'll help us win games, period.



Let me make clear my postion with Luke and Fisher because it might come off that I'm hating on them. 

Luke can play we all know that he has great feel for the game. 

He FITS with our offensive design because he can initiate the offense. 

But his negatives have been glossed over and they cost us an awful lot. 

His nagatives lack of mental toughness, lack of physical toughness, and lack of athleticism. 

he couldn't play for us in the dynasty because he was getting smoked defensively now he's our stalwart. Come on. 

Every season he seems to go through a stretch for a month or so where he simply can't hit a perimeter shot he did last season right before he sprained the ankle he was playing terrible. 

Thats real mental weakness, then he gets the injury bug. 

We have a team full of guys like this mentally weak and injury prone physically in kwame, odom, Sasha, Mo Evans, Luke Walton, Bynum, Radman and farmar to a small degree. 

Of course I'm not saying just go out and get an athlete with no brains for the game But I want guys who are alitte more mentally sturdy guys who have toughness to get that stop, guys who can get that rebound. 

Desmond Mason I think was or is out there to me I wouldn't have minded adding him instead of Luke.

I get why Kobe is so frustrated because he doesn't have teammates with his sorta toughness mentally. He see's us stockpiling the same types of personalities to the mix and its pissing him off. 

Now Fisher does give us that I admit he's tough as nails and will help us I just think Critt is gonna be the one who takes us to the next place at pg.

And the idea of adding Mihm back to this mix made me throw up in my mouth alittle to even say this. 

He is another in the long line of mentally weak and physically frail.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

So much for the belief that signing Luke meant the Lakers were going to split the MLE on two players.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Jamel Irief said:


> So much for the belief that signing Luke meant the Lakers were going to split the MLE on two players.


Well with the left over cash theres always the option of bringing back Smush.

:lol:


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> Let me make clear my postion with Luke and Fisher because it might come off that I'm hating on them.
> 
> Luke can play we all know that he has great feel for the game.
> 
> ...


Agreed with most you said except one thing. (IMO) besides Kwame and Odom, the teams is just physically frail; not mentally weak.

My thoughts on the offseason:

*1.* *Walton Resigning*. We all know that Walton has his downs but that did not seem to change his usefulness to the Lakers eyes. As far as they are concern, whatever Walton is doing on the court works. The best chemistry was when Walton was on the team and healthy. Right after Walton got injured, the team set a personal record to Phil Jackson for losing streaks. Of course there are other factors to the downfall, but the organization still chose the road of simply putting 2 and 2 together - With Walton: Team won. Without Walton: Team losed: Solution: Keep Walton. 
I don't have that much problem with this resigning mainly because the Lakersresigned him without the MLE (thanks to the Bird Rights). When healthy, Walton made the team better somehow through his defensive lapses and bonehead plays. Right now there is nobody on the market that the Lakers could pay to replace Walton's knowledge of the offense and (when focused) basketabll IQ. Who ever is still hating on Walton, Too Bad - you're stuck with him for six more years......ohh, I can just here the moans right now 

*2.* *The Signing of Fish:* Ahh, The Beloved Point Gaurd of the Shaq era returns. His journey back? - Drama..... After going from the Warriors (who renigged on the plan of starting Fisher by trading for Baron Davis) to Utah, life gave Fisher a rude slap to the face when he found out his daughter was diagnosed with cancer. With his daughter's health on his mind, Fisher talks Utah into setting him free from his contract showing also that he isn't as lucky as Steve Francis who received a 30 million dollar check as a departure gift. With no guaranteed money coming from the NBA in the future and his daughter needing special care, nobody should be surprised that shortly after comtemplating retirement, Fisher agreed to sign with The Lakers. Having his daughter's health as top priority means he needs the best medical attention near by while he can still do what he does best and make money for it....Los Angeles provides both of these things along with the fact that the Fans love him here and he'll be right at home. So I feel I speak for everyone (almost everyone) when I say, ":clap2: Welcome Back D' Fish!!!!!!!!:clap2: "

Now that I got my emotions out, here what I think. This is a very good short term investment; if of course they gave him 'short term' money - Fisher cost a bundle. But the money would not have been spent better either way; any other signing would have been either worse than Fisher (Francis - I'll explain later*) or simply unsignable since the player would want more money (Mo Williams). Those who feel that Fisher will stunt the Lakers young PG growth doesn't understand proper player developement. *1.* Fisher is in his 30, he's only going to be starting for one season guaranteed. *2.* Fisher will not take playing time from Farmar and were not even sure if Phil was going to play Critt that often anyway. *3.* Fisher is a tough, classy, and very influencial veteran so all that a young player can do while near him is learn. This could be the best thing that ever happens Farmar. 
*Francis offensive style would not fit with how the Lakers play now and for what has been said about Fisher, Francis defense is even worse. Plus the Lakers get no future value since he will be useless off the bench and I can't imagine him having nearly as much of positive impact on the Lakers young guards than Fisher would.

So the signing work wells for both now and the future of the Lakers; Fisher is a durable and triangle knowledged veteran that the Lakers never had since....well when Fisher first left. He will help the Lakers' PGs of the future while also helping the Lakers win right now.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Lets clear up this media spin about what Luke did for chemistry and this phantom notion that the teams record of being pretty good with Walton in the line-up. The record dove tailed because of the injuries to the OTHER players not because of Walton's absence. odom being out was the reason his record was bad, as well as not having kwame's interior and post deense, not because of Walton's great chemistry. 

Walton always fits in whomever he plays with because of the way he plays. 

We had a good record earlier in the season with him in the line-up because EVERYONE was healthy and we had the unbalanced home schedule. 

Not simply because Walton was there. 

We would be no worse for wear if Walton was gone. I think we'd be better with desmond mason.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

So, let's see...

So far, the off-season where Kobe's threatning to jump ship has resulted, so far, in:

1- drafting 2 guards who have no chance to be imediate contributers and 1 center who won't play for the Lakers next year;

2- Resigning Luke Walton;

3- Signing Derek Fisher (another guard).

Yup, the Lakers are in fine shape, indeed.


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## hollywood476 (Aug 20, 2005)

well at least Derek Fisher knows the Triangle Offense, is another leader, has great defense. So if you get stuck with Phoenix again Fisher can actually guard Steve Nash instead of Parker or Farmar.

Luke Walton is all around a good player, not great at anything but not bad at anything either.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

hollywood476 said:


> well at least Derek Fisher knows the Triangle Offense, is another leader, *has great defense*. So if you get stuck with Phoenix again Fisher can actually guard Steve Nash instead of Parker or Farmar.
> 
> Luke Walton is all around a good player, not great at anything but not bad at anything either.


Nope.


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## DANNY (Aug 9, 2005)

hollywood476 said:


> well at least Derek Fisher knows the Triangle Offense, is another leader, has great defense. So if you get stuck with Phoenix again *Fisher can actually guard Steve Nash *instead of Parker or Farmar.
> 
> Luke Walton is all around a good player, not great at anything but not bad at anything either.


this puzzles me, care to explain?


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

Since when did Fish play Defense?


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## DANNY (Aug 9, 2005)

atless we didnt spend 18 million over 3 years on mikki moore :clap2:


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## Marcus13 (Jul 17, 2002)

I dont understnad how you can dislike this signing


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

Marcus13 said:


> I dont understnad how you can dislike this signing


I like Fisher but I'm not thrilled with the signing. Why? He's a mediocre defender, he's a streaky shooter, and he's a quasi PG. He's actually alot like Farmar but with more moxie and leadership skills. There's not much out there but I probably would not have signed a veteran PG for the third year in a row. I'd sign an athletic swingman who can bring some energy and defense off the bench and let the kids fight it out for the PG position. They need to be thrown into the fire at some point in time.


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

Fisher rejoining Kobe, Lakers

EL SEGUNDO, Calif. (AP) - Derek Fisher is coming back to Los Angeles and will rejoin Kobe Bryant in the Lakers backcourt.

They came into the NBA together in 1996, Fisher taken with the Lakers' 24th draft pick and Bryant obtained in a draft day trade with Charlotte.

Fisher, who turns 33 on Aug. 9, cleared waivers Thursday, and the Lakers scheduled a news conference for Friday to announce his signing. The contract reportedly is a 3-year deal worth about $14 million.

He had asked the Utah Jazz to release him from his contract so he could concentrate on finding the best medical care for his 1-year-old daughter, Tatum, who has cancer in her left eye. The Jazz honored his request.

Fisher played eight years in Los Angeles, including three NBA championship seasons, before signing with Golden State as a free agent after the 2003-04 season. After two seasons with the Warriors, he was traded to Utah.

The 6-foot-1, 185-pounder averaged 10.1 points, 1.8 rebounds and 3.3 assists for the Jazz last season. He has career averages of 8.7 points, 3.3 assists and 2.2 rebounds.

He made one of the most dramatic shots in Lakers' history with his desperate "0.4" second shot in the fifth game of the 2001 Western Conference semifinals against San Antonio. 


http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/7040320


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## Dominate24/7 (Oct 15, 2006)

It's official



> ]EL SEGUNDO – The Los Angeles Lakers have signed free agent guard Derek Fisher it was announced today by General Manager Mitch Kupchak. Per team policy terms of the contract were not released.
> 
> “In evaluating our team at the end of last season, we said we needed help in the back court, primarily a veteran ball-handling guard” said Kupchak. “As we began looking at free agents, we never imagined that Derek would be available. However, due to unforeseen circumstances, the opportunity to sign him became an option and we are pleased we were able to do so.”


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## Dominate24/7 (Oct 15, 2006)

Now that we've re-signed Mihm and signed DFish, it's time to make some moves! I'm hoping that Kwame's out.


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## Tha Freak (Dec 5, 2006)

I don't like this signing at all. I love Derek Fisher and all the memories he has given us Laker fans. He was a key member in our three peat and had tons of unforgettable plays like the big shot against San Antonio (how can anyone forget that play?) It's really hard for me to hate Derek Fisher, because he's such a great person and has meant so much for the Lakers organization in the past, but he's not what we need at the moment. 

Phil Jackson said in his exit interview that he wanted a defensive minded point guard. Derek Fisher isn't a defensive minded point guard. Derek Fisher can't play defense to save his life. He really isn't a huge upgrade over Smush Parker defensively at all. Fisher will bring his experience and veteran leadership to this squad, but at the end of the day, I would have rather us target someone like Steve Blake, or even former Laker Jannero Pargo, who is a better defender than Derek Fisher. Any of you guys who have "forgotten" about Fisher's defense, watch some old Laker tapes, and you'll remember. The guy can't play defense. We were lucky to have someone like Shaq roaming the paint

All in all, the Lakers better have a plan of aquiring a stopper in the paint, because if not, point guards will be driving into the lane at will once again. From Chucky Atkins, to Smush Parker, to Derek Fisher. What's so hard Mitch? What's so hard finding players that play defense?


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## Maddocks (Jun 16, 2006)

time to ship off the team. dont need bynum...get rid of the cake thrower.....

get some moves done.


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## Laker Freak (Jul 1, 2003)

I hope this works out better than the last free agent we signed who wore #2.


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## Tha Freak (Dec 5, 2006)

At least the old #2 played some decent defense when he was given the minutes. Derek Fisher can't guard my grandmother


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Part 1*

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*Part 2*

<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/LYLQh5ouIRQ"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/LYLQh5ouIRQ" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>


----------



## Piolo_Pascual (Sep 13, 2006)

do you guys still hate the fisher signing?


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

Still??? Who ever did besides KennethTo and koberules24 ever did?


----------



## Piolo_Pascual (Sep 13, 2006)

dude are you familiar with dj benny? i thought ive seen your picture in one of his parties at a car show in san diego


----------



## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



SoCalfan21 said:


> Steve Francis> Derek Fisher


LOL...


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

aznzen said:


> dude are you familiar with dj benny? i thought ive seen your picture in one of his parties at a car show in san diego


lol...no

So I checked who didnt like it:

Pinball
Sean
Wilt the Stilt
Drewbs
KennethTo
The Freak


you are all on notice....:biggrin:


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## Piolo_Pascual (Sep 13, 2006)

we need to ban them all


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

a lot of people were wrong eh


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

*Re: Lakers, Fisher Might Reunite*



DaRizzle said:


> Fisher is a quality signing and I too concur that there was nobody better to use the MLE on. IMO way better than dealing with Francis and his lack of knowledge of the system. I've noticed that most of the people the Lakers sign take about 3/4 of their first year to get comfortable in the offense, no need for that with Fish. He will teach Jordan and Javarius (spelling?) what they need to know.


How do I give myself rep? :clap2:

kidding


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

Haha. Fisher gave us more than I thought he would. In my defense, I wasn't effusive in my hatred of the signing like some people. :biggrin:


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

Ah ha! A culprit! :biggrin:

B.H. was about to be on the list too but then I saw a post where he sort of recanted...lol

Im just giving ya'll a hard time


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

Happy to see that my analysis of the signing was correct.


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

is it wrong that i hope he runs over kennethto's legs with a scooter?


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

seems like a legitimate desire to me


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

and then when he's rendered immobile and helpless, we can call monique over to have her way with him


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## DANNY (Aug 9, 2005)

CubanLaker said:


> Happy to see that my analysis of the signing was correct.


man isnt it great giving yourself a pat on the back? :clap:


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

So we need a scooter and a dump truck to haul her fat *** over...Ill get the scooter, you get the dump truck and the whale


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

DANNY said:


> man isnt it great giving yourself a pat on the back? :clap:


I love me some me!

:smoothcriminal:


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## Silk D (Feb 6, 2006)

I was wit it the whole way. 

Fish has really been invaluble. I mean, besides his production on the court, which I think exceeded everyone's expectations, the stability he's brought to the position, the leadership he's brought in the locker room, the mentorship he's given Jordan and Sasha, the calming effect he had on kobe early in the year. You really can't put a price tag on what he's done. I'll take an occasional blow-by and missed lay-up for all the above + 40% 3 pt shooting. He's also been a menace on D in the play-offs.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

I think I did Ok as well. Loved the Fisher deal from day one. 




KDOS said:


> Lets not overrate Javaris. Kid has potential, but to even think he's a better point guard than Fish right now is ridiculous. Crittenton is lighting up the SL, but how is he going to handle all the pressure of a real NBA game? How is he going to cope with the fact that he's not going to get calls in his favor? This is a great move by the F/O. Phil obviously wants experience and direction from the point guard slot, Fisher can provide this.
> 
> 
> Right now, with emphasis on *now*, Fisher is the best guard to start for the Lakers if we are trying to win. Kobe and Fisher will bring a lot of experience and stability in the 1-2 spot. Fisher is a leader, he's a floor general. I love how he does all the small little things that helps you win games. He's not flashy, but he brings a great deal of leadership and positive attitude in this team.





KDOS said:


> Since the goal is to win now...
> 
> 
> Its common sense that Fisher's experience is much more valuable than Farmar's upside.
> ...


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

congrats! everyone who got it right wins... nothing.


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

I'd withhold my judgment until fisher has to deal with a fast PG like Paul or Parker. This is the same guy that made Hudson rich and many other crap PGs, because they went crazy on him in the playoffs.

I still hate fisher, afobisme and DaRizzle, *unnecessary.*


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

Fisher is shooting better than I thought he was capable of, I'll give you that


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

afobisme said:


> congrats! everyone who got it right wins... nothing.


Not really.


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

sweet, you guys won a picture of a cookie.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

Yup. E-Cookie is awesome.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

afobisme said:


> sweet, you guys won a picture of a cookie.


Better than nothing.


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

KennethTo said:


> I'd withhold my judgment until fisher has to deal with a fast PG like Paul or Parker.


So if an all star (Parker/CP) have an all star type game against Fisher for 4-7 games Fisher sucks??? Is CP a good defender because Parker scored all over the place? Is *Bruce Bowen* a good defender because Paul was running circles around him...you know, a guy who earned 7 consecutive Defensive 1st teams.

NEWSFLASH: They score on everyone, thats why they are superstars

BTW, do you still think "team defense" doesnt even exist? Like at the beginning of the year when I said Fisher played good team defense.


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

fisher sucks, he's only in the nba because he plays on the court with roller skates


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## G-man-sc (May 9, 2008)

i must admit im not sold on this deal either, although he is impressing me against deron, especielly in game 1 where he was all over him, i'm having a hard time figuring out what i feel about him, all i know is that he's one of the best glue guys in the league and he doesn't mind being 5th option on offence, which is pretty important seeing that the other 4 starters are kobe-lamar-gasol-bynum, but i don't really know, it's seem to be working pretty darn good during these playoffs though, but i wanna see him stop paul or parker in the WCF, if he does, im sold and i will tip my hat off for him.

sorry for my bad english


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

What is with people wanting Fisher to stop/shut down all star PG's?!? They are all stars for a reason.
Can we all agree that Kidd is at the _very_ least an above average defensive PG??? Here are the shooting #'s for Deron Williams and CP3 vs. Kidd in the regular season...Ill be nice and not include playoffs

Cp3- 28/53 53%
D. Williams- 15/27 56%

I mean really...wtf


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## G-man-sc (May 9, 2008)

im not saying he'll have to shut down those guys, and i really think that he is doing a fantastic job on deron, i'm just saying that i'll wait and see what he does against quick guards, but i think you can also agree that if NOH moves on to WCF and paul averages 35/17 or something fisher really didn't do the best job on him? i just think that younger blood would be bether than using the whole cap space on a pretty old player...
this is not to offend you in any way


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

Ok well 35/17 avg is unrealistic, a game sure, but not average. Also if LA and NO were to match up in the next round I dont think they will have Fish guard him exclusively. Fish, Sasha, and Kobe will all have there time guarding CP3, maybe even Ariza if he is healthy by then.

I dont understand the cap space comment. Lakers used the MLE which has nothing to do with affecting the cap space. Sure young blood is great but look at the situation the Lakers were in at that time. Fisher was a gift from the heavens at that time. A champion PG who knew the system, a leader in the locker room, a friend to Kobe, and willing to take a pay cut.


Oh PS....and not Smush Parker


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## G-man-sc (May 9, 2008)

DaRizzle said:


> Ok well 35/17 avg is unrealistic, a game sure, but not average. Also if LA and NO were to match up in the next round I dont think they will have Fish guard him exclusively. Fish, Sasha, and Kobe will all have there time guarding CP3, maybe even Ariza if he is healthy by then.
> 
> I dont understand the cap space comment. Lakers used the MLE which has nothing to do with affecting the cap space. Sure young blood is great but look at the situation the Lakers were in at that time. Fisher was a gift from the heavens at that time. A champion PG who knew the system, a leader in the locker room, a friend to Kobe, and willing to take a pay cut.
> 
> ...


made me laught.... ALOT! :lol: 

beside from that, i think i understand the cap-thing wrong then i don't think he is a very good point guard, but yet i haven't either written of the fact that it could be a VERY important player, especielly if lakers draft/sign/whatever a young potential PG, he will be worth alot as a sensei/teacher/etc. but im not totally sold on fisher, either am i against him in any way, i'm just curious wether he will stand his ground against the lights-out quick points(parker, paul) and i really don't think putting kobe on either will help anything, they are simply to quick, and i don't think that lamar and pau can afford to help out to much having to guard west and chandler (midrange killer or alley-oop monster) yet u make a very good point


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

Below is the statline of a PG against Derek Fisher a few years ago in the playoffs
Game 1 - 17 points 4 assists 
Game 2 - 37 points, 10 assists
Game 3 - 27 points, 4 assists
Game 4 - 28 points, 4 assists
Game 5 - 14 points 7 assists
Game 6 - 18 points, 4 assists

that's pretty impressive for a star huh DaRizzle?







Troy Hudson. ****ing Troy Hudson put that on Fish.


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## G-man-sc (May 9, 2008)

KennethTo said:


> Below is the statline of a PG against Derek Fisher a few years ago in the playoffs
> Game 1 - 17 points 4 assists
> Game 2 - 37 points, 10 assists
> Game 3 - 27 points, 4 assists
> ...


not to jump to darrizle's defence or being his pup or whatever, you can dig that up on anybody, many said bill russell was the greatest defender of all time, yet he was also manhandled by wilt chamberlain, as far as i know? and Jordan has possibly too been taken to school by somebody during his career? you simply can't dig up one statline and hold it against somebody


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## ToTheRack (Dec 15, 2005)

KennethTo said:


> Below is the statline of a PG against Derek Fisher a few years ago in the playoffs
> Game 1 - 17 points 4 assists
> Game 2 - 37 points, 10 assists
> Game 3 - 27 points, 4 assists
> ...



My memory is fuzzy, who won that series again?


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

All I know is what Fisher is doing right now is good.. He's taking care of business far better than any other options we had at the time. He's also playing some of the best defense of his career right now. 

As for waiting to see how he does against Parker or Paul? Reality check, no one guards those two guys well normally. Thats why they are All star caliber players. There is no PG in the game that could stop CP the way he's playing right now. Yes Kenneth, not even Javaris could defend Parker or CP on his best day in a seven game series..


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

G-man-sc said:


> not to jump to darrizle's defence or being his pup or whatever, you can dig that up on anybody, many said bill russell was the greatest defender of all time, yet he was also manhandled by wilt chamberlain, as far as i know? and Jordan has possibly too been taken to school by somebody during his career? you simply can't dig up one statline and hold it against somebody


The point is that Fisher can't guard any PG with a resemblance of quickness and penetrates often. Getting destroy by Wilt is one thing, getting destroyed Troy Hudson is another. It's like being a center and having Mark Madsen averaging 30 point and 12 rebounds on you throughout a playoff series.


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## DANNY (Aug 9, 2005)

KennethTo said:


> The point is that Fisher can't guard any PG with a resemblance of quickness and penetrates often. Getting destroy by Wilt is one thing, getting destroyed Troy Hudson is another. It's like being a center and having Mark Madsen averaging 30 point and 12 rebounds on you throughout a playoff series.


yeah fisher is the only player to blame for hudson's performance in the playoff huh? hater gtfo

wtf is with the mark madsen comparison? hudson is a offensive minded player, he has the ability to put up those numbers especially when you got a one of the worse pick & roll defender as your center. horrible comparison, complete failure.


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

G-man-sc said:


> made me laught.... ALOT! :lol:
> 
> beside from that, i think i understand the cap-thing wrong then i don't think he is a very good point guard, but yet i haven't either written of the fact that it could be a VERY important player, especielly if lakers draft/sign/whatever a young potential PG, he will be worth alot as a sensei/teacher/etc. but im not totally sold on fisher, either am i against him in any way, i'm just curious wether he will stand his ground against the lights-out quick points(parker, paul) and i really don't think putting kobe on either will help anything, they are simply to quick, and i don't think that lamar and pau can afford to help out to much having to guard west and chandler (midrange killer or alley-oop monster) yet u make a very good point


At the time it realistically was the best thing out there for PG *for the Lakers*and maybe to any teams standards.If you want to say you are sold on Fisher vs. other upper level PG in the NBA thats fine. I would say he is maybe just average if you take all PG out of their teams and just did it by abilities/ clock times from point A to point B, etc.. Him on the Lakers adds more than him going to any other team. You might not see it in a box score every night but you will see it over the long haul. He is the rock on that team. He knows what Phil Jackson wants maybe more than any active player in the NBA. You dont become president of the players association without being respected and having quality people/communication skills. He helps promote the right mindset among the team. Fisher might not always make the play but it will never be for lack of effort or having a brainfart.

In regards to guarding CP3 or Parker if we make it that far...its a team game, denying people to a certain spot, the Lakers arent going to just have Fish sit out on an island out there with CP3 and tell him good luck.

Just for your information about contracts in the NBA:
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#19 (This website goes over EVERYTHING)
This is from that site and explains the MLE.

MID-LEVEL SALARY EXCEPTION -- This exception allows a team to sign any free agent to a contract equal to the average salary, even if they are over the cap (see question number 24 for the definition of "average salary." Also note that for 2005-06 they used a defined figure of $5 million). This exception may be split and given to multiple players. It may be used for contracts of up to five years in length, and raises are limited to 8% of the salary in the first year of the contract. Signing a player to a multi-year contract does not affect a team's ability to use this exception every year. For example, a team can sign a player to a five-year contract using this exception and still use the exception the following year to sign another player. Also see question number 20 for more information on the availability and use of this exception.

If the player is a restricted free agent with one or two years of service and receives an offer sheet from a new team, the player's prior team may use the Mid-Level exception to match the offer sheet (see question number 36 for restricted free agency).

Here are the actual values of this exception for each season. Note that since this exception is based on the average player salary, the actual value of this exception is not determined until the start of the free agent signing period.


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

Oh and KennethTo, sorry had to run errands, I could help prove you wrong but it looks like everyone else has done a bang up job


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## Sean (Jun 7, 2002)

Sean said:


> I love Fisher. Great guy, class act, good teammate, an integral part of the great teams of 1996-2004. Hit some big shots at critical times. I cried while researching his daughter's cancer issue. Being a father in my rookie season, it broke my heart.
> 
> Having said that, my problem is not that he's back, but the $$$ that he's getting. Giving him most of the MLE was not a good idea. Does he deserve it? Sure, but the teams needs that $$$ for other purposes right now. Had they brought him back for half the MLE or less, then I could really support the signing. His leadership is untouchable, but his defense has never been good and that was always been a problem. His missing of layups is a problem.
> 
> ...


That was what I wrote 10 months ago. I'll admit that I have been pleasantly surprised by Fisher's steady play over the last 10 games. He has been instrumental in the winning streak. 

What none of us knew at the time of this thread originally was that Drew was going to be a great defender, Turiaf was going to be a threat in the middle and Pau would be sportin' purple and gold.


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## Wilt_The_Stilt (Jun 7, 2002)

First off, Fisher is still a poor defender. Deron was getting into the lane at will...I know that Farmar wasn't doing any better, but that doesn't have anything to do with Fisher.

And if Shaq was to blame for Hudson's production, why didn't Hudson go off in the prior year's playoffs when he was going up against Elden Campbell on the pick and roll? Was Elden that much better than Shaq?

But I have to admit that Fisher has shot the ball much better than I thought he would, and his play thus far in the playoffs has been excellent. That said, I think it is kind of silly to bump this when Fisher is playing the best ball of the season, and his contract is not yet over. We did sign him to a multi-year deal, not a 1 year deal.


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

You can blame the bumpage on Aznzen..but it is sort of interesting to read everyones perspective from the beginning of the season


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

DaRizzle said:


> At the time it realistically was the best thing out there for PG *for the Lakers*and maybe to any teams standards.If you want to say you are sold on Fisher vs. other upper level PG in the NBA thats fine. I would say he is maybe just average if you take all PG out of their teams and just did it by abilities/ clock times from point A to point B, etc.. Him on the Lakers adds more than him going to any other team. You might not see it in a box score every night but you will see it over the long haul. He is the rock on that team. He knows what Phil Jackson wants maybe more than any active player in the NBA. You dont become president of the players association without being respected and having quality people/communication skills. He helps promote the right mindset among the team. Fisher might not always make the play but it will never be for lack of effort or having a brainfart.
> 
> In regards to guarding CP3 or Parker if we make it that far...its a team game, denying people to a certain spot, the Lakers arent going to just have Fish sit out on an island out there with CP3 and tell him good luck.
> 
> ...


Troy Hudson averaged 7.5 points and 2.4 assists in the regular season, he averaged 23.5 points and 5.5 assists against Fisher. Hudson isn't an elite point guard, he's just a PG that penetrates, which seems to be your excuse for Fisher playing horrible defense now (and if we do make it to the next round, the horrible defense that he will play against the spurs or the hornets).

I could care less how respected he is, what I care about is seeing the Lakers win the title, I didn't become a fan of the Lakers because of their community service. In that regard, he still is a large concern, considering his age as well.

You are right though in that there are some things Fisher does that doesn't show up on the stat sheet. Like the fact that he requires more help defense because any PG can just waltz right by him into the lane (making it easier for the opposing team to score even if the PG he guards doesn't get an assist for it).

He is still a huge defensive liability unless you are going against a below average PG like Anthony Carter that rarely penetrates and can't score well in any manner.


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## afobisme (Apr 29, 2006)

i see you're still defending your "i hope he gets his legs run over by a car" stance. and somehow you're using your troy hudson facts. 

you can come up with as many bs facts as you'd like, but you know he's playing good defense on deron - better than most PGs in the game. you say he can't defend any PG who is fast... well, let me tell you something: deron williams is fast.

all this fisher hate... are you actually a jazz fan? here, go click on this http://www.basketballforum.com/utah-jazz/


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## DANNY (Aug 9, 2005)

KennethTo said:


> Troy Hudson averaged 7.5 points and 2.4 assists in the regular season, he averaged 23.5 points and 5.5 assists against Fisher. Hudson isn't an elite point guard, he's just a PG that penetrates, which seems to be your excuse for Fisher playing horrible defense now (and if we do make it to the next round, the horrible defense that he will play against the spurs or the hornets).
> 
> I could care less how respected he is, what I care about is seeing the Lakers win the title, I didn't become a fan of the Lakers because of their community service. In that regard, he still is a large concern, considering his age as well.
> 
> ...


yeah good luck finding a PG who can stay with the faster PGs with the MLE. your expectation from fish is ridiculous. of course he's going to need help defense against faster PGs in the league. you expect him to play shut own man-man type defense? 

if you really cared about the lakers winning a title, you first need to appreciate what fisher brings to the table. Dont go overboard with your lofty expectation and expect fisher to shut down every PGs in the league. Your little argument about hudson is trivial. that **** happened years ago get over it and as i said before it's not something you can entirely blame d fish. 

IMO fisher is the same player he was 3~4 years ago, yet he's playing terrific D on deron williams. why is that? great team rotation with pau acutally getting out there to slow down the PG and odom rotating to cover the man rolling to the basket. that was non-existent with shaq as our center. hopefully you get this even though it might be quite confusing for you. 

if you still dont get it, i'm gonna assume that you want either SMUSH back on this team or was a huge supporter for marcus banks. they're practically the only guy out there that fits your bill for a defensive PG who can stay in front of the quicker guards at a price equal or less than the MLE. Sure i would love to have devin harris, chris paul or any of the other few PGs who can man up, but if they ever come at MLE you let me know ok?


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

Damn...I keep on wanting to shoot down KennethTo but it has already been done...twice

I will say one thing..That was the hottest Troy Hudson has ever been at shooting in his life at a whopping 41% shooting.
Think the were more focused on KG not beating them? Maybe? Possibly? Ya know, let the role players get theirs...hmmmm


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## DaRizzle (May 22, 2007)

BTW, since you reasoning revolves around a series that happened 4 years ago then this is only fair for the argument.
<a href="http://s199.photobucket.com/albums/aa258/thefreshprince101/Sports%20Pictures/?action=view&current=11c89yd.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa258/thefreshprince101/Sports%20Pictures/11c89yd.jpg" border="0" alt="derek fisher shot gamewinner"></a>


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