# Keep Blount at all costs



## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

This guy is a WARRIOR. Even if it means giving him 3 million or even the MLE, you keep him. The guy is awesome, and a legit center in the East. We must re-sign him.


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

It isn't a matter of resigning him it's a matter of him not wanting to play here. He is going to want more then 3 million to stay here where he feels he is being mis-treated by Danny Ainge.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

I know Blount has been unhappy with Ainge for trading away his untalented friends but how does Blount see that Ainge is mistreating him? Do you have a link? I would love to see that in print because that is the first I have heard of it. Other than when you also mentioned it in another thread.

Blount will cost more than 3 million but I agree it would be nice to keep him.

Hopefully he will see that he is playing the best ball of his life with his new teamates who really seem to appreciate him.

If Blount is unhappy with the neccesary moves that Ainge has made and is not commited to what Danny is trying to build, do we really want him here anyway?

I would say no. I hope he does want to be here because IMO he has made the most improvement during the course of a season of any Celtic I have ever seen.

Incredible job by Mark Blount.


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

I don't have a link but it was in the Boston Globe not that long ago. I am sure you can go look it up on their website.
In it Mark Blount said that Danny Ainge doesn't even talk to him. 

There was also the article where Danny Ainge talked to the team and hearing Mark Blounts answers in that article tell's a telling picture.

It has also been mentioned here on talk radio that Mark Blount is telling anyone who will listen that he is working so hard to show case his talents for another team so that he can get out of here.


I think it's pretty rude to call Eric Williams and Tony Battie untalented and that is not the only reason Mark has had enough with this team.

Eric and Tony were big reasons we did so well in the playoffs the last few years and for you to not resepct what they have given to this team in the past is really unfair.

We will have to wait and see but Tony and Eric's contributions to this teams playoff run the last few years is more then Ricky has done for this team so far.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>lastlaugh</b>!
> I think it's pretty rude to call Eric Williams and Tony Battie untalented and that is not the only reason Mark has had enough with this team.
> 
> Eric and Tony were big reasons we did so well in the playoffs the last few years and for you to not resepct what they have given to this team in the past is really unfair.
> ...


I hate when people do that, every ex-Celtic is a bum but the guys we have right now are Gods, when those guys are traded they are automatically bums.


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

You know what is even worse then that. It is when people who say they are Celtics fans forget what these people did when they were here.
Am I the only one who remember Tony Battie blocking shot after shot against Indiana when they were making their run? Or Eric Williams defense on big plays?

I could go on and on.





> Originally posted by <b>aquaitious</b>!
> 
> 
> I hate when people do that, every ex-Celtic is a bum but the guys we have right now are Gods, when those guys are traded they are automatically bums.


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

I miss Batman and Ewills toughness...I hope Ricky can be consistent, cuz otherwise I am torn either way, him playin good will help me feel not as torn, though not seeing batman w. his green mouf guard n e more sux and ewill in the post with his elbow pads :sigh:


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

I was under the impression Williams and Battie were no good when they were here. I never liked Eric Williams and surely never came close to calling him a God! Of course I am going to bash him, he is horrible. 

Tony Battie is a 6 and 6 player who blocks shots less than half as well as Raef LaFrenz does.

Eric Williams is horrible and Cleveland is now beginning to figure that out. When Cleveland was winning, Eric was the reason, now that they are losing it is because they are so young. Funny how that works. Lee Nailon started in his place tonight. LEE NAILON!

Eric and the team he turned around are going to be home watching Ricky Davis and the Celtics in the play-offs. Perhaps Eric and Tony are not as important as some made them out to be. If they were as big to a play-off push as we were led to believe, the Cavs would have clinched by now.

If Mark Blount is putting in extra effort so he can showcase his talent, what does that say about him? I see people say Obie got the most out of his players, obviously not if Blount has had to motivate himself in this manner. I guess this explains why Blount went from being uninterested to looking like an all star, he is mad at our GM. What a pro. I bet Larry Bird will pat him on the back when he sees him for this behavior.

As for the lockeroom talk, that was ages ago in the midst of our long losing streak on the West Coast. Ever since we got home from that trip, we have been playing solid basketball.

Apparently that talk by Danny that drew so much ire from the haters, worked like magic.

Eric Williams is no God, but Danny is!


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

You are quoted above saying "I was under the impression Williams and Battie were no good when they were here."

That means you don't watch this team? or you would know what went on.

Eric Williams and Tony Battie are not great players but they helped this team a lot the last two years. Your disregard for what they did says a lot.


You are the new NBA fan. This is why the sport has fell so far so fast.


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

The thing I wonder about Ainge and Blount is: is it even normal for the Executive Director of Basketball Operations to "talk" to his guys alot, I'm not saying either way, just curious, I mena I kno he shud have a good relationship, but this whole "he doesn't talkto me thing..." N e way, would that be more Wallace's job, I dunno, I'm just wondering what / how u guyzz feel about this.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Richie Rich</b>!
> The thing I wonder about Ainge and Blount is: is it even normal for the Executive Director of Basketball Operations to "talk" to his guys alot, I'm not saying either way, just curious, I mena I kno he shud have a good relationship, but this whole "he doesn't talkto me thing..." N e way, would that be more Wallace's job, I dunno, I'm just wondering what / how u guyzz feel about this.


The thing is, Danny has "his guys" the paper reported that after practice he helps guys like Pierce, Jones and Banks a lot and not the other ones.

I don't think that a EDOBO is supposed to have a great relationship, or even a good one, but if you are going to give some players special treatment and not others, that's where it crosses the line.


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

Don't waste your time. He doesn't seem tp grasp the concept of this.
Danny Ainge is a hands on head of basketball operations. He is at most of the games sitting behind the bench yelling at everyone on the court.

If you can't see it is wrong of him to treat his favorites one way and everyone else the other way then no amount of trying to explain it will get into your brain.

All Danny's talk of free agents not wanting to come here is laughable. Just wait till Eric Williams, Mark Blount and all the guys Danny treated like $#$$ get the word around. Danny will be lucky if anyone wants to come play here.
We will have rookies telling teams not to draft them because they won't play here.lol


Spoiling the stars. This is why the NBA is perceived as a bunch of rich spoiled brats.




> Originally posted by <b>aquaitious</b>!
> 
> 
> The thing is, Danny has "his guys" the paper reported that after practice he helps guys like Pierce, Jones and Banks a lot and not the other ones.
> ...


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

I actually watch about every game (I miss one every now and then) and have for the last 20 years. During the winter I spend more time with Tommy Heinsohn and Mike Gorman than I do with my wife.

Tony Battie is a below average center to an average back-up. Eric Williams is below average no matter how you use him. Eric Williams is a wing player and a horrid one at that, on both ends.

Due to the lack of offenes of both of these players that Jim O'Brien insisted on playing 30+ minutes our offense was weak and predictable.

The defense of these two players was also nothing special. Where people get the idea that Eric Williams is some stud defensively is a question I can't answer. You'd think he was Scottie Pippen or Ron Artest the way people talk.

Where is the great play out of Eric and Tony now that the Cavs are struggling? Where are all of their good qualities? They don't seem to be doing much for Cleveland right now. They were supposed to be differene makers but they aren't doing jack. 

Can you please stop speculating on who I am, what kind of fan I am, how old I am or whether or not I watch the games. You seem to think you know everything about me when I just started posting today.

Trust me, if I didn't watch this team, I wouldn't be posting here. 

I find it funny your name is last laugh. Ironic!


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

What do Pierce, Banks and Jones all have in common? 

They play positions that Danny Ainge is familar with. It is not a matter of playing favorites, it teaching guys what he knows. Danny played the point in college and then the wing in the pros, what a shock that he woudl work with players who play those positions. 

If he worked with Blount he would be accused of being TOO hands on. He attends games and he gets accused of, "yelling at everyone on the court". That is the first I have heard of that.

As for Blount and Eric Williams getting the word out, I am sure Danny is not too worried nor am I. Jim O'Brien's style drove away a lot more than Eric ever will.

Antoine already ripped Danny as bad as anyone could and it has done nothing to hurt our reputation. Both Chucky Atkins and Ricky Davis seemed to have no concerns about coming here.

And what exactly did Ainge do to Williams besides TRADE HIM? And what exactly has Ainge done to Blount?

You guys act like Ainge stabbed both in the back. Blount is still here and Eric Williams was traded like dozens of others are each year, even those who play for teams that finish six games above .500.

What is Eric going to tell the rest of the league, don't sign with Boston becaue they traded ME! That is laughable! Eric Williams and Mark Blount could co-write a tell all book about what bad guy Danny Ainge is and it would not cost us ONE FA or draft pick. Thinking that Eric Williams opening his mouth (assuming he would be understood which is 50/50) is going to turn the entire league against us is crazy. Nobody is going to listen to him. 

Most guys would probably say, who are you again?


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## voice of reality (Sep 20, 2003)

Tony battie was a decent player who had occasional big games.. The inconsistency i could never really tell whether it was due to injury or being soft.. I perceived it more towards the soft..He was at one game a tiger, others a tame house cat.. He was too easily pushed around by the bigger guys and not fast enough for some of the quicker guys in the league.. *Hows he playing in clevland??????????* 



Eric williams was a very good player, and was a tough loss..He had character and gave his all.. He did have weaknesses though which the teams in the league were beginning to exploit.. He was a good obie system player.. (as was battie).. The thought that these guys were some really talented players is absurd... They were role players... 


I dont buy this load of horse manure being spread regarding ricky davis.. He has made one mistake (the dunk attempt) here.. But he has worked as hard as eric williams or tony battie ever did.. Chris mihm should be playing more. Now perhaps you are a mark blount fan but when dany made this trade mark was not playing as he is now.. 


If you chose to applaud and appreciate some ex celts efforts as wonderful,but please lets be realistic about our evaluations of talent.. *how are tony and eric doing in clevland??? how is clevland doing??? *


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## vandyke (Jan 8, 2004)

I hope Mark Blount resigns with the Celtics, he has had a career year with the Celts but if he doesn't want to be here than he doesn't want to be here, I am so tired of hearing about how he feels under appreciated and how his friends have been traded away and how he is out of here first chance he gets. We are not talking about Wilt Chamberlain here it is Mark Blount, Ainge has a team he has to run, I wasn't aware that Ainge had to check with Blount first before he made deals, Ainge has to do what is best for the team and the trade of Eric, and Battie while it was tough he traded for youth and athleticism and you can't get that without giving up something. Williams and Battie are as good as they are going to get you can say both players are on the downside of their careers and Kedrick is a washout who wasn't ready to be in the NBA yet and would have benefited from some Div. 1 college and in return we got two players who are young, athletic and have tremendous upside it was a risk for both teams. So while I am happy to see Mark finally get some recognition for his hard work but lets not go overboard until he strings together a few years of productivity, and if he doesn't want to be here then leave, he is one unproductive year away from being a Marc Jackson, Michael Stewart, Jerome James, Calvin Booth, or Vitaly so please lets not break the bank for him just yet


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*If Blount doesn't want to be here....*

Then let him walk. But he might appreciate staying, too. He must be enjoying playing with Chucky, Paul and Waltah every night and winning games. I think he saw what he had when he went for Denver for a couple hundred thousand more.

Let me chime in and say that Eric Williams is a good basketball player, Tony Battie is average and Kedrick Brown sucks. If anyone saw that game we won against New Jersey on Monday, I think you see that Ricky Davis is the real deal, and I think the Celtics got the better end of the trade. You have to ask yourself...if we go to the playoffs (no guarantees of course), and Cleveland goes back to the lottery (and loses Williams in the offseason), how does it benefit them again? Williams is 32 or something with like 7 knee surgeries. Battie is a gimp. Yes, they helped us win a playoff series or two--in the mediocre East. Let's move on to 2005 and stop living in the mediocre past. 

As for Blount, I think if he played like this for an entire season, he could be an All-Star in the Eastern Conference. I hope he ignores his foolish pride and resigns.


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## SavSicc (Feb 26, 2004)

I think Mark Blount will stay here. If he gets the right amount. This is the only place where he will get time. If he go out west , he would have to face kg, tim and shaq. He know's he isn't going to get 15 20 rebounds playing with them on nightly basis. If I was Mark i would stay here. He aready know his teams is trying to put him into the offensive game. When it's all set and done i expect to see him nexy year.


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> 
> Tony Battie is a below average center to an average back-up. *Eric Williams is below average no matter how you use him. Eric Williams is a wing player and a horrid one at that, on both ends.*
> 
> *The defense of these two players was also nothing special.* Where people get the idea that Eric Williams is some stud defensively is a question I can't answer. You'd think he was Scottie Pippen or Ron Artest the way people talk.





> I was under the impression Williams and Battie were no good when they were here. I never liked Eric Williams and surely never came close to calling him a God! Of course I am going to bash him,* he is horrible*.
> 
> *Eric Williams is horrible* and Cleveland is now beginning to figure that out.





> Eric Williams is no God, but Danny is!


Wow! You claim you watch the Celtics day-in and day-out. If so, then there is absolutly no logical explanation for saying Eric Williams' defense is "horrible". Surely, every Celtic fan will agree with me when saying Eric Williams was the best defender on the Celtics when he was playing on the team. Now, defense is very hard and illogical to prove with stats, but just from watching Eric, you could tell he was a great defender. Can you please explain your reasoning for your opinion? I'd be very interested. 

Second, you also mentioned Eric Williams is "horrible" on offense. Pretty bold, considering Eric Williams, per 48 minutes, averages better numbers than Ricky Davis. Williams was the best post-up player, while he was with the Celtics. He averaged 11.6 Points, 4.5 Rebounds, in 24.4 Minutes, with the Celtics. He averaged 20 PPG while in Denver, 15 PPG in his First Full Season with Boston. 

Eric Williams also was a team leader, reflecting his scrappy, courageous play in the locker room. He was a valuable asset for the Celtics, and I'm ashamed that he doesn't get the respect he deserves.



> It really has no bearing on anything other than showing that you made ANOTHER mistake but the 15 ppg came in Erics second season which was one of the worst seasons this team has ever had.


I said first FULL Season. 8 Games Matter. He played 64 Games in his Rookie Season and 72 in His Soph Season.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Revisionist History vs. Who is better now?*

OK, so the guy may have been wrong about Williams. Williams was a good, not star defender. I think his point was he is no Artest. Well, Williams is no Artest. But he was probably our best individual defender and definitely was our best post-up player. 
He was the 2nd best Celtic on the team at the time of the trade. 

That said, I would not take him and Battie back for Ricky Davis alone. To try and say that he is better "per 48" than Ricky is absurd. Davis is a better player and he is only 24. The two knocks on Davis, selfishness and no defense, are being disproved by the determined Davis. Look, the Williams you are referring to was 7 knee surgeries ago. Look, I love the guy, too, and maybe he'll come back after the season, but I like the trade.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

I do watch the Celtics nearly every game and Eric Williams drove me crazy. 

On offene, Obie treated him like he was Bernard King. On defense you would think he was Alvin Robertson.

I don't care if his numbers per whatever are better than Ricky Davis. Maybe that shows I DO watch the games, otherwise I would have nothing to go on besides numbers. If I don't or didn't watch Eric play, why would I dislike him or why would I make such statements?

The Celtics used a help defensive system under Harter, not one that utilized special one on one defenders. Eric Williams could not guard opposing wing players, not the way Jiri Welsch does. Eric was usually responsible for guys like Ray Allen, T-Mac, Vince and others lighting us up. Since Eric left this team, I don't remember too many impressive games by opposing wing players. Eric could never shut anyone down, it was always up to the help defense, to do just that, help when Eric couldn't stay in front of quicker (every one we saw) wing players. Sure he could go down on the other end and hack, smack, bowl, crash and fight his way to 10 points but I can promise you he gave up many more on the other end. 

Eric can play some offense but he does not play, TEAM offense. He is the biggest black hole the Celtics have ever had. You seem to be in love with numbers. Look at Eric's assit total. Look at his game log from THIS season and check out the first 10 games or so. This guy is labled this great TEAM guy and he never records assist. I guess he is the first assist iilliterate TEAM player in the hiistory of the game. Most team guys I have ever seen play have a rep for PASSING THE BALL.

I won't deny that he played hard and blah, blah, blah, blah but he is also the poster boy for what Danny Ainge is doing and what he didn't want.

Eric likes to play grind it out basketball which is the exact opposite of what Danny wants. Eric Williams is a good 7th or 8th man which is what Cleveland has now discovered. He is not a third option starter on a team trying to go places. 

Eric Williams has already worn out his welcome in Cleveland. They are more excited about Lee Nailon at this point. Eric is a guy who will have trouble finding a job on a decent team come this offseason, what does that tell you?


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Celts11</b>!He averaged 11.6 Points, 4.5 Rebounds, in 24.4 Minutes, with the Celtics. He averaged 20 PPG while in Denver, 15 PPG in his First Full Season with Boston.


Nice job trying to sway the stats in your favor. The 11.6 came from this year, a whopping 20 games. That is a very small sample size.

Last year his average was 9 ppg, 6.4 the year before that. Him being our best post player hardly is saying much.

The 20 ppg you refrer to was accomplished in FOUR GAMES, not an entire season. The season in which you say he scored 20 per game, he scored a TOTAL of 79 points that season. Others might be stupid, I can tell you right now, hanging curveballs do not get by me.

It really has no bearing on anything other than showing that you made ANOTHER mistake but the 15 ppg came in Erics second season which was one of the worst seasons this team has ever had.


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

Eric Williams is a leader, that is what made Eric Williams so valuable to this team...that is intangible and does NOT show up in the stats, that is why this team struggled mightily after he left, we had no leader. Paul is a star but he is no leader. Chucky is taking on that role now. Tony Battie was a solid player, he was hobbled by injuries but he played injured a lot and had heart. Kedrick is a good defender but he has no offense to speak of and will find himself out of the NBA very soon. 
But on to the subject at hand, Mark Blount. I've stated this about 100 times, Mark is playing well right now but Mark is no star. Mark has improved but he's playing for a contract right now and could very easily be back to his old self once his contract is secured with his NEW TEAM. That is right, new team, Blount is not a part of Danny's future and he doesn't want to be. Please understand this, it has been said by Mark and Danny doesn't speak of re-signing him EVER so that should give you a clue when a guy is busting out major numbers and is a free agent and his GM NEVER ONCE even mentions a thought about resigning him. Say goodbye to Mark, he'll be playing somewhere else next year, very likely in Philly if OB is there and he'll be very happy about that fact.


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

Anyone who watched the Celtics last year and refuses to give Battie and Williams any kind of credit did not watch the Celtics on a daily basis. No matter how much they claim to have.

Aqua was 100% correct when he said if a player plays in Boston he is God but when he leaves the team he all of a sudden had no talent or sucked.

No one is giving the majority of the credit to Tony and Eric but to ignore what they did for this team the last two years is unexcusible.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

E and Battie did not come out to give us 20 each every night. They were here with specific roles. Especially Eric He was the most experianced player on this team. No Williams was never a "great first option" but he was great to have as a post presence when we couldn't hit a shot, or struggled to get to the line. I love the way Eric got to the free throw line, how he dived for lose balls, and how he got up for huge rebounds. I miss him.

Now, I'm not saying that Davis is a terrible player, or that he's bad, nor am I saying its a bad trade, I'm just saying that Eric as well as Battie and Walker and Delk were valuable to this team.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

I do not need to justify myself to any of you. 

You have no idea what I do or don't do.

Does it make you feel better to pick on others that you do not know? Is it fun to speculate about stuff you have no clue about? Is that how this board operates? Whenever you disagree with someone you just say, "You must not watch the games"

I could say the same thing because valuing Eric Williams as if he is headed to the HOF is last laughable.

At least if Walter gets traded we'll know you guys have drowned in your own tears if you disapear instead of having to wonder where you are.

ERIC WILLIAMS AND TONY BATTIE? Both of them are two of the worst players at thier positions in the entire NBA. Neither are capable starters.

I have about had it up to my nose with Eric Williams is a leader and we struggled after he left. This team was .500 with him this year and then .500 without him up until Obie left. Since the team has gotten over that and recovered, they have been playing great WITHOUT ERIC.

You can call me an idiot for not praising Eric and you can claim I don't tune into the games but it won't affect me because I know how silly it makes you sound, because I know what I do, you do not.


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> 
> ERIC WILLIAMS AND TONY BATTIE? Both of them are two of the worst players at thier positions in the entire NBA. Neither are capable starters.


Well that comment just showed you don't know ANYTHING about the NBA, give me a break, if you want to be bitter because you think you're being picked on that's fine, but you leave yourself wide open when you make completely moronic statements like this one


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

Name some worse wing players who actually play?

Name some centers who are clearly worse than Battie who we have actually seen. 

Are they closer to being the worst players or the best? I might have exaggerated to a degree but these two guys are nothing special and they are overpaid to boot.

This Celtic fan was estatic when Eric was moved. This team was going to be stuck in the mud with Eric playing big minutes, just like we will be stuck in the mud if we continue to give Walter big minutes, year after year. 

Sure, with Eric we were stuck in the mud, next to the beach on a partly sunny day, but we were still stuck in the mud. The surroudings were nice, but were not going anywhere. Being at the beach was nice, but I didn't want to stay there forever.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

And by the way what kind of comment is:

You just showed you don't now anything about the NBA?

Again, you know nothing about me.

I could sit here and tell you I have forgotten more than you have ever known but I do not know you and I am not going to pretend I do. 

It may not be obvious to you but I think it is pretty clear to everyone else that most people who visit a Boston Celtics message board are pretty darn likely to have SOME knowledge of NBA basketball.

If you are so insecure that you have to queston mine after a 1/2 day, it ain't my probllem.


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> Name some worse wing players who actually play?
> 
> Name some centers who are clearly worse than Battie who we have actually seen.
> ...


Yes, I think you overstated, I mean just thinking of a few players in the East at Center Jason Collier, Jason Collins, Mamadou N'Diaye, Dikembe Mutumbo, Joel Pryzbilla, Brendan Haywood, Brian Skinner, Brian Grant, Samaki Walker.....Tony Battie is better than all of them and most of them play quite a bit. For wings off the top of my head Aaron McKie, Drew Gooden, Jerome Williams, Marcus Haislip, Marcus Fizer, Antonio Daniels, Jalen Rose, Michael Bradley, Caron Butler and so on....I mean Eric is not an All-Star but he's a leader and he plays EVERY night unlike those guys who all play a lot for their teams but SUCK and are totally inconsistent and not leaders. 
And by the way the only reason the team pulled out of the spiral they were in after losing Eric's leadership qualities is Chucky Atkins because he also has those leadership qualities. No one said they were all-stars but they are certainly not terrible and they brought a lot to the table that cannot be measured on a stat sheet.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

And you are the guy who accused me of knowing nothing about the NBA?

And you call Brian Grant better than Battie? And you list Dikembe Mutumbo who is probably 50. Skinner averages 10 and 7, something Battie has never done, how is Battie better than him? Brendan Haywood is posting basically the same numbers Battie was at the same age. Pryzbilla is still young but has been hurt so you got me there and since I know nothing about the league, I can't even remember who Samaki Walker plays for.

Your llist of wing players is where it gets interesting and quite funny, considering you took so much pleasure in question my knowledge of the NBA.

Are you aware that Michael Bradley is a 6'10 PF? Well, obviously not......

The argument could also be made that Drew Gooden is a PF but why argue that when it is so clear that Gooden is a better player. No team in the NBA would take Eric Williams over Drew Gooden, at least no team not being coached by Jim O'Brien.

Jerome Williams is ANOTHER PF who plenty of peoplle could argue is better than Eric. No matter, he doesn't play on the wing. How can you not know that? When he leaves the lane it is to set a pick.

Antonio Daniels is a PG.

Butler when healthy is better than EWill. Clearly!

Putting Jalen Rose on your list has to be a joke. Seriously, is it?

I have no idea who Marcus Haislip is, so you got me there. I'll give you Fizer too.

You say you got that list off the top of your head. I guess that is not where you keep your NBA knowledge?


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> And you are the guy who accused me of knowing nothing about the NBA?
> 
> And you call Brian Grant better than Battie? And you list Dikembe Mutumbo who is probably 50. Skinner averages 10 and 7, something Battie has never done, how is Battie better than him? Brendan Haywood is posting basically the same numbers Battie was at the same age. Pryzbilla is still young but has been hurt so you got me there and since I know nothing about the league, I can't even remember who Samaki Walker plays for.
> ...


I listed forwards, not JUST small forwards not just wing players, FORWARDS, and Centers, and small forwards PAY ATTENTION, Tony Battie played Center and Power Forward and Brian Grant sucks and is worse than Tony Battie in my opinion. Why do you think the Heat want to get rid of him so bad. There you go listing stupid stats again, Battie is a very good defender and a leader that does not show up on a stat page. Antonio Davis is who I meant to say not Daniels. Butler was listed as one of the biggest dissapointments possible this season and he hasn't been injured since VERY early on in the season. Jerome Williams sucks he can't even get into the lineup on the pitiful Bulls, so does Jalen Rose, I don't care what he scores he plays NO defense and NO ONE wants him on their team. Marcus Haislip plays for the Bucks. Williams & Battie were VERY SOLID role players for this team and very good defenders and leaders. I like Chris Mihm a lot and I think Ricky Davis will yeild a peice to our puzzle in a trade so I wasn't totally against the trade, I'm against idiots saying guys like them who played hard all the time, sucked, they didnt' and you need to stop putting down guys who worked their butts off for us. Not everyone has natural all-star talent but a team of all-stars does not always make the best team, you need guys who play their roles well and are comfortable doing so.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Stop whining about the past, ladies*

Ricky Davis is better than both of those gimps combined. The Chief makes a good point...Jiri guards 2's way better than Eric ever did, and Chucky Atkins has filled in Eric's leadership void. It's over....almost. If Cleveland gets into the playoffs, we'll never live it down.


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>whiterhino</b>!
> *For wings* off the top of my head Aaron McKie, Drew Gooden, Jerome Williams, Marcus Haislip, Marcus Fizer, Antonio Daniels, Jalen Rose, Michael Bradley, Caron Butler and so on





> Originally posted by <b>whiterhino</b>!
> *I listed forwards*, not JUST small forwards not just wing players, FORWARDS, and Centers, and small forwards PAY ATTENTION, Tony Battie played Center and Power Forward and Brian Grant sucks and is worse than Tony Battie in my opinion. Why do you think the Heat want to get rid of him so bad.


You listed Forwards, but you called them wings. Also, I'd take Gooden, Rose, and Butler over Eric Williams and you've have a very tough time finding someone who isn't a Celtics fan who would disagree with that. Also, McKie is every bit the player that Williams is. Additionally, Brian Grant is a better player than Tony Battie. Miami is trying to get rid of him because he's horribly overpaid and they're going for youth, and Grant is an old man.

You're overrating hustle. I like Battie and Williams as much as the next guy. Williams is still one of my favorite players in the league. However, that deal isn't going to hurt us at all in the long run. Davis and Mihm will be/already are better than Williams and Battie. With the exception of Davis' little break-away dunk issues, he's been a terrific player since he got here. Mihm, who will be resigned, is going to be a better player than Tony Battie, and in some ways, he already is.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

Thank you agoo. All your points are valid.

Grant is overpaid, he doesn't stink.

I forgot about McKie, take him in a heartbeat over EWill. 

As for working their butt off, I won't deny that but if they do not have much talent, I dont' want them, then or now. This is a league of talent. And if Tony Battie worked his butt off, his nickname would not be EL BUSTO! Give me a break. Battie is one of the laziest C's ever. The guy never improved, never got stronger, never taught himself a post move. The guy stunk.

This sentiment that everyone treats current players like GOD while hating on the same guys as soon as they leave is just another load of crap.

I NEVER liked Eric Williams. NEVER! And it is so stupid of some of you to try to tell me I did. If this theory of yours is true, where does that leave Walter McCarty?

I don't see him treated like a god, I see about 99% of people who want him playing 10 minutes, not 40.

But when he gets traded for a draft pick, the whinning will never stop and we who have hated on him will be accused of calling him a god while he was here.


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## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> Thank you agoo. All your points are valid.
> 
> Grant is overpaid, he doesn't stink.
> ...



If anyone would care to pay attention to what I post, I NEVER said I was against the trade or that I don't like Chris Mihm or even Ricky Davis (although I don't see him in the long term plan). I only too exception to the Cheifs guy saying that Eric and Tony SUCK, because they don't suck and they did a lot for this team while they were here.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

What did they do? Please explain.

Tony Battie did what any 7 footer who played the minutes he played would do. Most NBA Centers can score 7 points and grab 6 rebounds and block less than one shot if given the minutes Tony got. Other than what any below average C would give us, what makes Tony so special? Mark Blount is making Batitie look like Acie Earl for crying out loud.

I know you will say the stuff he did doesn't show up on a stat sheet but where does it show up? If there is more to the story, tell me what it is. 

Tony Battie was a seven foot C who never once learned a new trick. If Tony Battie had any continuous drive to play this game, he would be an all star. Sure he looks good WHEN he does block a shot and sure he gets all jacked up but he doesn't do it enough. Raef LaFrenz has been twice the scorer and is twice the shot blocker. Raef is decent, Battie is well below LaFrenz. 

I won't even go to any of Eric numbers because they don't mean anything I guess. Of course when he post good numbers the Eric fans are quick to point THEM out.

Eric is slow. When did he ever finish a fast break?

Eric cannot jump. When did he ever rise above everyone and grab a board?

Eric, despite what many say, cannot defend. The proof IS in the numbers. He got lit up like a Christmas tree time in and time out over the past few years. Without him, it has NOT happened. Funny how last year other teams star wing players had no trouble with us and now all of a sudden teams are going away from their stars who are being covered by Jiri Welsch to go the player Paul Peirce is guarding. HMMMMMMM! On defense, Jiri Welsch is making Eric Williams look like Dino Radja, which he basically did already.

I would love to know what the heck it is that these guys did that doesn't show up in the stat sheet.

The only thing that I see that they did was post some average to below average numbers while not complaining that this was Paul and Idiot's team.

Like I said, please explain, I would really love to hear it.


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

Exactly who would "idiot" be?
I think you just showed your true colors.
Another Pierce fan who refuses to give anyone else credit.
FYI, I had you pegged from the beginning.

Eric Williams was never a fan favorite. You haven't been around Celtic Nation long if you think he had so many fans to come to his defense.lol


Two years ago Antoine and Paul were on the bench against the Pistons in the playoffs. It was Eric, Tony and Kenny Anderson who not only kept the lead we had when both Antoine and Paul had to sit down but they also got us an even better lead and I bet you remember how that series ended.

Last year Tony Battie blocked several shots when the Pacers were in the middle of getting down a 16 point lead to I believe a 7 point lead and Eric's defense (along with Walker on O'Neil) got us that win.

I know there was more and eventually I will go read my old papers on the playoff wins and get you some more information that wasn't off the top of my head.

Just for the record. I have never been a Eric Williams fan and you will have to look long into the past where I have ever said anything nice about him if I didn't had too. You have us fans sticking up for him because you refuse to acknowledge that he was in deed a helpful member of this team and a big reason we had successfull rounds in the playoffs the last 2 years.







> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> The only thing that I see that they did was post some average to below average numbers while not complaining that this was Paul and Idiot's team.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Eric was a favorite of mine*

I am only one fan, but he was a favorite of mine. I hope Cleveland makes the playoffs instead of New York for that reason. 

Glad we got Ricky though.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> I NEVER liked Eric Williams. NEVER!


That explains a lot, you don't like him and that makes him a bad player.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

Idiot would be Antoine and my true colors are green. 

Paul Pierce is not my favorite player, I don't have favorites, just a favorite team. I want the Celtics to do well and that is all I care about. It is why I dd not like Eric and Tony because this team was not going to do anything more than what they did with them playing such roles on the team. That is just how I feel. If Danny Ainge wants to trade Paul Pierce for some stud PF and go with Jiri and Ricky on the wings, I won't cry. It wouldn't be what I would do, but it wouldn't really bother me, depending on who we got back.

Is basketball actually ever discussed on this board are do all the vets just try to peg what new posters are all about? If it is some ploy to try to drive away those you disagree with, I can see it has been working but I can tell you right now it will not work with me.

I can see why this place is so dead. 

For one thing certain folks seem to think it is still 2002. I don't know about the rest of you but I threw out my May 2002 issue of the Globe about 22 months ago. 

I do still have today's paper and looking at the standings, Eric and his qualities that don't show up on the stat sheet are falling out of the play-off race while we are headed back for the third straight year, this time without him and his precious leadership. Funny how when Cleveland was the team that looked like they would make the play-offs, Eric and his leadership and experience was reason #1. Now that they have fallen out of it, how come it ain't Eric's fault?

last laughable, you can go dig up some old articles and point out that Tony Battie blocked seven shots in one game or that Eric hit some clutch shots. That is fine but it means nothing to me. There are plenty of players in this league who if put in their positions would have or could have done the same things. You cannot deny that. We are talking about players who can be replaced, EASILY.

It doesn't mean they never scored or never blocked a shot or were never part of winning a play-off series. But we went as far as we were going to go with that team. Why is that so hard to understand.

Some of you guys act like Ainge broke up Stockton and Malone in their prime. 

Tonight when you set your clocks ahead, do the same with your calender.

Its 2004.


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## epic (Mar 16, 2004)

i just want to say that the chief is absolutely correct on this. eric williams better than rose and butler? oh man that was good. williams and battie were average. i still back the trade that got us a talented young guy like davis. davis is doing far better than anyone would have seriously thought, _especially_ coming off the bench. seriously davis>williams, mimh>battie. cleveland got screwed on that deal.

even the walker for welsch/raef trade i still support, just because of the consistent play of jiri. raef, if he's healthy, will more than make up for that trade. and all this talk about the glory past 2 3 years with all the former players -- well, guess what -- there's no championship rings anywhere. not even a trip to the finals. and you seriously think that mob could beat the current detriot lineup? (who should have had carmello too, man, what a team they would have been with him aswell) 

in anycase, at least ainge is a realist. look at the last game, we had a good 7 players in double figures. before all we had was pierce and walker. 

and i do hope blount re-signs and gets over himself. if he leaves because of inane reasons like his friends have left or whatever, then screw him.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*The Chief Rules this Board...*

I am nominating him for award status. I am also joining his fan club. Chief, join my In Danny We Trust club if you wish. I have also started The Living in 2004 Celtic Fan Club, of which you are the honorary president.

As coach Norman Dale said to the Hickory fans when they were booing and chanting, "Jimmy, Jimmy..." when Jimmy Chitwood didn't come out of the tunnel, "THIS IS YOUR TEAM." Either root for it, or move to Dallas. THESE ARE THE BOSTON CELTICS.

And again, I wouldn't trade Ricky Davis back for Williams, Battie by themselves. The trade is looking better by the game. 

Go to the Mavericks board. Read what Mavericks fans are starting to say about the Welsch trade.

BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, SUPPORT THIS 2004 TEAM. THEY ARE WINNING BASKETBALL GAMES AND NEED YOUR SUPPORT!!!


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## boscelticsgood (Apr 3, 2004)

The bottom line of the whole Boston Celtics this year is that before the first game of the season, they were serious contenders coming out of the East, and now it's a damn shame that the East is so bad that they're going to make the playoffs and not get any chance at the lottery because they have no shot at doing anything in the playoffs.

I don't care what free agents did or didn't want to play for Jim O'Brien. He had the team playing great with what he had and Ainge should've had more respect for where the team was before he came in and where they were before Jim O'Brien became head coach.

Great, now we have a cap-strapped team in a year where the free agent market could be pretty sweet and we have 3 late first round picks... Way to improve the team...

Blount is the best player the Celtics have right behind Pierce, and I think he would've been coming out about now anyway even if the Celtics had their roster from before the Walker & Delk (funny how people forget about Tony Delk) trade.

Saying Battie and Eric Williams weren't any good is just the dumbest thing I've ever read. Williams will give you 14 off the bench, play good defense and draw fouls...he's no starter, that's for sure, but he's a very good player coming off the bench. They really didn't need Battie with Baker playing the way he was playing and Blount coming out the way he has been, but he is a solid rebounder and defender. Another guy people forget about is Kedrick Brown. He wasn't playing that well, but he was starting to look like the guy they thought they were drafting (it takes 3-4 years for these high school guys to develop), that's the one that's going to come back and bite us in the ***.

Kinda like when they got Rodney Rogers and Tony Delk for a package that sent Joe Johnson to the Suns and they couldn't/didn't try to retain Rodgers...


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## theBirdman (Jun 20, 2003)

I also like EWill. Not because of the stats but because of his leadership. You always need players like that on your team. He was a great role player and his leadership is greatly missed. 
Despite that, I liked the trade for Davis and Mihm, because we got younger and more talented players in return. And in the phase we are currently in (semi-rebouilding) we need to acquire as much talent as possible. Kedrick Brown, on the other hand, is never going to be more than a decent role player and a defensive specialist to me, that is why losing him was not a big deal! 
All in all, this is the most talented team we have had in years, we just need to keep these young guys and develop them. And most importantly we need a coach who is good in developing young players and who actually lets them play. What can be more intriguing than watching a promising, talented, young team in a running game?


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## knicksfan (Jan 4, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>whiterhino</b>!
> 
> 
> I listed forwards, not JUST small forwards not just wing players, FORWARDS, and Centers, and small forwards PAY ATTENTION, Tony Battie played Center and Power Forward and Brian Grant sucks and is worse than Tony Battie in my opinion. Why do you think the Heat want to get rid of him so bad. There you go listing stupid stats again, Battie is a very good defender and a leader that does not show up on a stat page. Antonio Davis is who I meant to say not Daniels. Butler was listed as one of the biggest dissapointments possible this season and he hasn't been injured since VERY early on in the season. Jerome Williams sucks he can't even get into the lineup on the pitiful Bulls, so does Jalen Rose, I don't care what he scores he plays NO defense and NO ONE wants him on their team. Marcus Haislip plays for the Bucks. Williams & Battie were VERY SOLID role players for this team and very good defenders and leaders. I like Chris Mihm a lot and I think Ricky Davis will yeild a peice to our puzzle in a trade so I wasn't totally against the trade, I'm against idiots saying guys like them who played hard all the time, sucked, they didnt' and you need to stop putting down guys who worked their butts off for us. Not everyone has natural all-star talent but a team of all-stars does not always make the best team, you need guys who play their roles well and are comfortable doing so.




brian grant is not a bad player, hes just way overpayed. if i was a gm i would be very thrilled to have him on my team, just not for that kind of money! that is why the heat want to get rid of him so badly


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

_Saying Battie and Eric Williams weren't any good is just the dumbest thing I've ever read. Williams will give you 14 off the bench, play good defense and draw fouls...he's no starter, that's for sure, but he's a very good player coming off the bench._ 

Do you live in a hole in the ground? 

Saying Williams will give you 14 off the bench is the dumbest thing I have ever read. 

Two years he averaged 6.4 pts per game.

Last year he averaged 9 pts per game. 

Where are you getting the idea that he comes off the bench and provides 14 pts. Because he did it ONCE or TWICE? Give any NBA player 30 minutes of playing time on a nightly basis and any of them are going to come up with an occasional 14 pt game. ANY of them.

You Eric Williams fans are all the same, I'll give you that, you have to STRETCH, big time to come up with anything good to say about him.

"He was a leader"

"His qualities don't show up on the stat sheet, EVER"

"He could get to foul line"

"He averaged 6 pts per game but he was our best post player"

"It doesn't matter that we gave up Brown, he was nothing more than a defensive stopper but we should have kept EWill because he was a defensive stopper.

"Eric earned his check in the locker-room"

Eric Williams is a bozo. Again, I ask the question, if Eric is so important and was so vital is us making the play-offs, why is it that we are going to make it without him, while he is going to miss them, despite being ahead of us in the standings not too long ago. 

Eric Williams is on his way out of Cleveland, because they don't want him. Time for him to gain Ricky Davis' rep as a guy who keeps wearing out his welcome. Come next year, EWill will be playing for his third team in months. Hmmmmmmm!

Will an Eric Williams fan please stand up and answer that question. PLEASE!


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## epic (Mar 16, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>boscelticsgood</b>!
> The bottom line of the whole Boston Celtics this year is that before the first game of the season, they were serious contenders coming out of the East, and now it's a damn shame that the East is so bad that they're going to make the playoffs and not get any chance at the lottery because they have no shot at doing anything in the playoffs.


the key here is before the first game... before the first game the bulls were expected to make the playoffs. roofle. in anycase, they may have been "serious contenders", but even that is an overstatement i'd say given last year, and even if they were, there is no way they were going to win anything this year. maybe a few more games, lose maybe in the 2nd round instead of 1st round, and end up with a worse pick. and i could just imagine everyone moaning about how we should have done something instead of keep all our old players.



> Great, now we have a cap-strapped team in a year where the free agent market could be pretty sweet and we have 3 late first round picks... Way to improve the team...


you do know that walker is the highest paid mav this year, and next year too? sure raef is expensive, but we had to take him to offload walker. raef, if healthy, could do something in the east without any centres. especially in tandem with blount if he stays.



> Kinda like when they got Rodney Rogers and Tony Delk for a package that sent Joe Johnson to the Suns and they couldn't/didn't try to retain Rodgers...


that was a bad move too. but that was before ainge anyway. we should have stuck it out with joe, but anyways.


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> 
> Where are you getting the idea that he comes off the bench and provides 14 pts. Because he did it ONCE or TWICE? Give any NBA player 30 minutes of playing time on a nightly basis and any of them are going to come up with an occasional 14 pt game. ANY of them.


Eric Williams averaged 11.6 Points in 24.4 Minutes in 21 Games with Boston this year. That's .4755 Points a Minute. With 30 Minutes, Eric Would have averaged 14.3 Points. This all with competing with Jiri Welsch, Paul Pierce, Walter McCarty, Kedrick Brown, and Jumaine Jones. He didn't come with the occasional 14 pt. game. He averaged 11 on a steady basis, with limited time. 



> Eric Williams is a bozo. Again, I ask the question, if Eric is so important and was so vital is us making the play-offs, why is it that we are going to make it without him, while he is going to miss them, despite being ahead of us in the standings not too long ago.


At the Time of Eric's trade, we were 12-12. Eric missed three games, all losses. So in the games he played in, with the Boston Celtics, we were 12-9. 

12-12: Winning % of, .500
12-9: Winning % of .572

Our Current Record:

35-41: Winning % of .461

I guess I "Stood Up"


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

We could have paid Antoine 15 million a year and not done the trade and the cap would have been the same. (Jiri, Raef and the draft pick) That is "if" we paid him that much and we would have gotten more production out of Antoine then the other 3 combined.





> Originally posted by <b>epic</b>!
> 
> 
> you do know that walker is the highest paid mav this year, and next year too? sure raef is expensive, but we had to take him to offload walker. raef, if healthy, could do something in the east without any centres. especially in tandem with blount if he stays.


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

You are a Celtics fan but you hated half the team? 
Antoine is an idiot (according to you) Eric Sucked ( according to you) Tony never did anything (according to you) but I gave you instances where both of them helped us and you said that you don't care how they helped us?

Who do you think buys your BS. LOL 

You showed your true colors alright. :laugh: 

So if this years team doesn't win it all you will be saying they suck too? and diminish anything anyone on it brought to the table?


You are not discussing basketball. Your insulting three players (one of which I personally could not stand at all) who did a lot for this team. It doesn't matter if Danny broke up Stockton and Malone. The product he broke up was better then what he put back on the floor.
If he couldn't bring guys around to help a great player like Jason Kidd win a championship (WITHOUT a salary cap what makes you think anything he has done has improved this current team enough to be anything in the future?




> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> Idiot would be Antoine and my true colors are green.
> 
> Paul Pierce is not my favorite player, I don't have favorites, just a favorite team. I want the Celtics to do well and that is all I care about. It is why I dd not like Eric and Tony because this team was not going to do anything more than what they did with them playing such roles on the team. That is just how I feel. If Danny Ainge wants to trade Paul Pierce for some stud PF and go with Jiri and Ricky on the wings, I won't cry. It wouldn't be what I would do, but it wouldn't really bother me, depending on who we got back.
> ...


:laugh:


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> Eric Williams is a bozo. Again, I ask the question, if Eric is so important and was so vital is us making the play-offs, why is it that we are going to make it without him, while he is going to miss them, despite being ahead of us in the standings not too long ago.
> 
> Eric Williams is on his way out of Cleveland, because they don't want him. Time for him to gain Ricky Davis' rep as a guy who keeps wearing out his welcome. Come next year, EWill will be playing for his third team in months. Hmmmmmmm!
> ...


I'm not going to overrate the contributions of Eric Williams, but this is ridiculous. The Celtics are headed to the playoffs because we have a bunch of guys who are used to winning (Pierce, Blount, Atkins, McCarty) and the Cavs don't. Eric Williams is likely out of Cleveland because they are a young team and Eric Williams is not a young guy. He hasn't worn out his welcome at all. He just isn't in their plans for the future. Williams didn't wear out his welcome here either. Ainge was just looking to fill the roster up with his guys.

Bash a guy if you want to, but atleast be accurate when you do.


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## boscelticsgood (Apr 3, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>lastlaugh</b>!
> We could have paid Antoine 15 million a year and not done the trade and the cap would have been the same. (Jiri, Raef and the draft pick) That is "if" we paid him that much and we would have gotten more production out of Antoine then the other 3 combined.


That's what I'm saying. Typically, when you trade 2 of your 3 best scorers one of which being your team captain, you are unloading salary and making room for a free agent. Besides, Walker only had 2 years left, LaFrentz has like a billion.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

How can you say Blount, McCarty and Pierce are used to winning and then say that Battie and Eric Williams aren't.

Those five players all have won the same amount in the NBA, all for the same team. 3 of them now play for Boston. Two of them now play for Cleveland. The Cavs also have Lee Nailon who played in some play-offs for the Hornets IIRC.

This is EXACTLY my point. When Cleveland was doing well and were ahead of us in the standings, the primary reason given by Ainge bashers like Peter May was the Cavs acquisition of play-off veterans Eric Williams and Tony Battie. 

NOW, it looks like the Cavs will miss the play-offs and what are the comments? Well now the Cavs are a young team with no play-off experience.

It is hogwash. 

And Eric Williams has worn out his welcome, at least that is what I gather from reading what Cav fans have to say. Management could feel differently, I don't know. 

Check out some Cavs message boards, quite a few of the folks do not like the guy and see that he brings little to the table, just as he did here.

As for Eric's stats, it was 20 games. Ricky D put up 20/5/5 last year if you want to talk numbers and now he is going to play-offs and Eric is not.

Ricky Davis is 10 times better than Eric Williams.


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> NOW, it looks like the Cavs will miss the play-offs and what are the comments? Well now the Cavs are a young team with no play-off experience.


Yes, the Cavs are a young team without much playoff experience, even with Battie and Williams and Jeff McInnis there. How? Look at who leads the team.

The Celtics start Chucky Atkins, Paul Pierce, Jiri Welsch, Walter McCarty and Mark Blount. With the exception of Welsch, they all have playoff experience. The guys with the playoff experience are the ones who are relied upon to win the games.

The Cavs start Jeff McInnis, LeBron James, Ira Newble, Carlos Boozer, and Zydrunas Ilgauskas. While I'm not willing to bet my life on it, I'm pretty sure that McInnis is the only one with playoff experience. The guys who have playoff experience are not the ones who are relied upon to win the games (save McInnis).

So yes, the Celtics have guys who are used to winning and the Cavs are a young team with little play-off experience.


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>agoo101284</b>!
> 
> So yes, the Celtics have guys who are used to winning and the Cavs are a young team with little play-off experience.








Yes siree BoB.


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## TheChief00 (Mar 29, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>lastlaugh</b>You are a Celtics fan but you hated half the team?
> 
> The product he broke up was better then what he put back on the floor?


I did not hate half the team. I did hate Williams and Antoine Walker. Let me restate that, I hated the way they played the game. I am a fan of the Celtics but I am no fool when it comes to the game of basketball. If you don't play it the correct way, I am not going to throw you my admiration.

As for your other comment, I disagree. Our team record does not yet indicate it and there are numerous factors in that but I think the prodcuct IS better. 

We may not find ourselves in the ECF's this year but I believe we are closer to winning now than we were two years ago. This team has a future, that team did all it was going to do.

I'm sorry if you think it makes me an idiot, but I agree with Danny Ainge!


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## lastlaugh (Oct 30, 2003)

What is the point of having a better team FG % if you don't win enough games?

All that matter's is winning. period.
I don't care if Marcus Banks has a great game (like he did against the Wizards) if we lose. I don't care if Paul Pierce nearly has a triple double if we lose.

This team is not better by the record we have. We have been passed by the Heat and Knicks and if it wasn't for the fact that Cleveland had a harder schedule down the stretch we wouldn't be in the playoff race. We are not in the playoffs yet. We could very well lose to Atlanta and Miami twice (Miami has been playing some amazing ball lately) and blow the 2 and a half point game lead we have.

Cleveland is only 2 plus games behind us and they are being led by a highscooler who is only going to get better. Boozer is a second year player too.







> Originally posted by <b>TheChief00</b>!
> 
> 
> I did not hate half the team. I did hate Williams and Antoine Walker. Let me restate that, I hated the way they played the game. I am a fan of the Celtics but I am no fool when it comes to the game of basketball. If you don't play it the correct way, I am not going to throw you my admiration.
> ...


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## SavSicc (Feb 26, 2004)

you act like raef lafrentz can't play. but the team is still a low budget team http://celtics.bostonherald.com/celtics/view.bg?articleid=484


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