# So....huh. (Bulls Expectations This Season)



## King Joseus (May 26, 2003)

In this thread, there's been a number of people predicting the Bulls to finish 4th in the East. I, for one, don't expect us to finish higher than 6th.

Does anybody here believe we'll finish 4th? What makes us better than the rest of the motley Eastern Conference crew fighting for playoff spots after the three elite teams?


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

1. Cleveland Cavs
2. Boston Celtics
3. Orlando Magic
4. Toronto Raptors
5. Miami Heat
6. Detroit Pistons
7. Atlanta Hawks
8. Bulls/Wizards/Philly fight it out.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

I dont have the Bulls in the playoff's right now, I think a lot of it depends on how they will adjust to playing without BG and I think the Wizards when healthy are much better than the Bulls. 

1. Healthy Boston
2. Orlando
3. Cavs Lebron's contract will be a distraction for the majority of the season.
4. Miami
5. Atlanta
6. Philly
7. Wizards
8. Pistons/Raptors


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

*Orlando & Cleveland are my top 2 teams in the East*. Simple reason: Lebron & Dwight, not to mention strong supporting casts for each guy.

*Boston is my #3* -- everyone seems to think they will be #1 or #2 at worst, but that Garnett is clearly the key to that squad, and will those knees hold up for another 82 games? Furthermore, will he sustain his high level of play after such a bad injury? As we saw in the playoffs, Boston is #3 at best without KG. 

*#4-#12 is just a mess of average to just-above-average teams*: Atlanta, Miami, Chicago, Charlotte, Washington, Toronto, Detroit, Indiana. All seven of those teams are so close that they can (and probably will) end up in some random order based upon Health and Luck. 

In a best case scenario, the Bulls could feasibly get as high as #4. But one key injury could also thrust them down to #11.

If all teams stay 100% healthy all the time (which NEVER happens, btw, so this is pretty meaningless), I like the teams in this order:

1) Orlando
2) Cleveland
3) Boston
4) Wizards
5) Atlanta
6) Bulls
7) Heat
8) Charlotte

Non-playoffs in order: Toronto, Indiana, Detroit, Philly, New Jersey, Milwaukee, New York


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

BG7 said:


> 1. Cleveland Cavs
> 2. Boston Celtics
> 3. Orlando Magic
> 4. Toronto Raptors
> ...


I see ALOT of people rating Toronto as a playoff team this year. Can you elaborate what they did so well this off-season?

Personally I don't think Turkoglu will make that much of a difference. Ditto with Bellinelli. Derozen is very young and is a few years off. 

So how does that shift them from a 33 win team to a 50-ish win team?


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

yodurk said:


> *Orlando & Cleveland are my top 2 teams in the East*. Simple reason: Lebron & Dwight, not to mention strong supporting casts for each guy.
> 
> *Boston is my #3* -- everyone seems to think they will be #1 or #2 at worst, but that Garnett is clearly the key to that squad, and will those knees hold up for another 82 games? Furthermore, will he sustain his high level of play after such a bad injury? As we saw in the playoffs, Boston is #3 at best without KG.
> 
> ...



This is about exactly how I see it. I expect Detroit to be bad this year, so it's been surprising to see so many people regard them as a playoff lock.


I expect the Bulls to grab one of the bottom 3 seeds.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Actually I'll be shocked if the Bulls make the playoffs


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

HB said:


> Actually I'll be shocked if the Bulls make the playoffs


The only people who believe this are those who think Ben Gordon was really critical to the Bulls success.

I'm really not sure what I believe. I know Gordon scored alot of points, but I also know we could do better with more consistent ball movement and get at it more defensively. 

I'm very interested to see what a Gordon-less team looks like this year, and frankly I'm unsure what it will look like. It's been a long time since we saw a Bulls game without Gordon there shooting the ball (5 years to be precise).


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Cept there are plenty of decent teams in the East.

Talent wise are the Bulls that much better than the Raps, Heat, Sixers, Atlanta. Then you have the Bobcats, Pistons and maybe even the Pacers that could be arguably as talented. I dont see how they do it, the Bulls that is.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

HB said:


> Cept there are plenty of decent teams in the East.


Yeah, and the Bulls are one of them. I can certainly admit the Bulls could fail though; we have alot riding on Rose taking high game to another level, on Deng being healthy, and on Salmons handling the role of a #2 scorer.




> Talent wise are the Bulls that much better than the Raps, Heat, Sixers, Atlanta. Then you have the Bobcats, Pistons and maybe even the Pacers that could be arguably as talented. I dont see how they do it, the Bulls that is.


More balanced, more proven than the Raptors -- I really don't see how they improved much from last year, and yet everyone seems to think so.

Deeper than the Heat, and not so reliant 1 guy to carry them for 82 games

LOL at the Sixers, they lost their starting PG and just barely got their stuff together last year to even make the playoffs; in this day and age, you don't get very far without someone who can lead the team from the backcourt. Iggy is not that type of player.

Atlanta should remain pretty good -- certainly will be right there with the Bulls, if not better.

Bobcats I believe are being overlooked too, but they are very much lacking a star presence so who really knows with them.

Pistons have nothing going for them in the frontcourt, and even Pistons fans aren't high on the Gordon/Villanueva signings.

Pacers could surprise, but similar to Raptors, how did they improve from last year?


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

I expect the Bulls to be in the race, but they could be a lock if Derrick Rose turns into a star. Let's not underestimate how good this guy is going to be.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

I like to think we're going to make the playoffs this year... I don't know that we're ready to take a huge leap or anything, but I expect some steady progress. Losing Ben Gordon may actually help us.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

For the Raptors its all about how the start out the gate. The team is loaded offensively, I dont see many teams being able to keep up scoring wise. They just have so many weapons to throw at you. Its almost ike Orlando-lite.

How can you knock the Sixers when the team is loaded with talent. Iggy, Young and a Healthy Brand, regardless of who is playing at point is a pretty good team. Williams will get to play instead of Miller, who actually is a pretty overrated point guard.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

How is Andre Miller overrated?


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Because he cant shoot much, he dominates the ball to be successful and is a poor defender. He's gotten teams into the playoffs, but usually those teams dont do that well. He's not a guy that you miss too much once he's off the team.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

yodurk said:


> The only people who believe this are those who think Ben Gordon was really critical to the Bulls success.



But he was, he is an extremely flawed player but his crazy shooting nights gave the Bulls some critical wins that got them in the playoff's. The offense really centered around Ben's shooting in the second half of the season along with Salmons crazy shooting nights, this is a team with no defensive philosophy and their offense is just let the hot hand shoot. If we had a real coach I think the Bulls would be a lock for a playoff seed but with Vinny I would be really surprised if the Bulls make the playoff's.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

thebizkit69u said:


> But he was, he is an extremely flawed player but his crazy shooting nights gave the Bulls some critical wins that got them in the playoff's. The offense really centered around Ben's shooting in the second half of the season along with Salmons crazy shooting nights, *this is a team with no defensive philosophy* and their offense is just let the hot hand shoot. If we had a real coach I think the Bulls would be a lock for a playoff seed but with Vinny I would be really surprised if the Bulls make the playoff's.


Out of curiosity, is it your opinion that we had a defensive philosophy before Del *****? The only real difference I see between Del *****'s and Skiles' defensive sets is that we switch on picks now and Skiles had people run through them...


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

HB said:


> For the Raptors its all about how the start out the gate. The team is loaded offensively, I dont see many teams being able to keep up scoring wise. They just have so many weapons to throw at you. Its almost ike Orlando-lite.


I only see 1 big time scorer on that team, and that's Bosh. Bargnani and Hedo are 2nd tier scorers; I don't think either will give them more than 18 ppg which is no better than what Salmons or healthy Deng will do for the Bulls.

Calderon is not that great of a scorer, more of a playmaker. How does 3 guys plus a good PG make you a loaded offensive team? If that's the case then the Bulls are all set.



> How can you knock the Sixers when the team is loaded with talent. Iggy, Young and a Healthy Brand, regardless of who is playing at point is a pretty good team. Williams will get to play instead of Miller, who actually is a pretty overrated point guard.


Mainly because they have zero all-stars and no depth to compensate for it. Brand seems pretty done to me. Iggy and Young are nowhere close what it takes to carry a team on their own. They'll be weak at PG and Dalember is pretty average at center. Then tell me who they have on the bench. That team is not making the playoffs no matter how you spin it.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

thebizkit69u said:


> But he was, he is an extremely flawed player but his crazy shooting nights gave the Bulls some critical wins that got them in the playoff's. The offense really centered around Ben's shooting in the second half of the season along with Salmons crazy shooting nights, this is a team with no defensive philosophy and their offense is just let the hot hand shoot. If we had a real coach I think the Bulls would be a lock for a playoff seed but with Vinny I would be really surprised if the Bulls make the playoff's.


Try not to mistake what I'm saying.

I certainly agree that Gordon contributed to our success in 4 of the past 5 seasons.

I don't necessarily agree that Gordon is critical to sustaining that success.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Calderon
Derozan
Hedo
Bosh 
Barganini

Deadly perimeter shooters in Hedo, Bellinelli and Bargs. Solid mid range shooters in Bosh and Calderon and a very athletic young wing in Derozan. They also have the luxury of Kapono on their bench, someone teams have to pay attention to. Jarrett Jack's also a decent player. Putting up points shouldn't be a problem on that team.

Igoudala is an all star caliber player. The Bulls dont have an all star either.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

HB said:


> Igoudala is an all star caliber player.


That's highly debatable. That's like calling Ben Gordon an all-star caliber player. 




> The Bulls dont have an all star either.


Many NBA followers believe Derrick Rose will be an all-star this upcoming season. 

I'll agree to disagree on the Raptors and let the results speak for themselves. I personally just don't see why guys like Derozen, Belinelli, Kapono, and Jarrett Jack are worth mentioning for the upcoming season. The latter three are at best average or even below average NBA players, and Derozen is only 19 or 20 yrs old, right? Only the most special of special players contribute in the NBA at that age.


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## RSP83 (Nov 24, 2002)

HB said:


> The Bulls dont have an all star either.


The Bulls never have a single All-Star since 2004-05. Yet, the Bulls only miss the playoff once since 2004-05.

If you consider Gordon to be an All-Star, well this year I think Derrick Rose will reach Gordon level. So, Rose will cancel out Gordon's departure.

I'm not overrating this team. But, the East is overrated outside of Celtics, Magic, and Cavaleiers.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

^Well you are making my point, you dont need an allstar to make the playoffs, which teams like the Bulls and Sixers have shown in the past few seasons.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

HB said:


> ^Well you are making my point, you dont need an allstar to make the playoffs, which teams like the Bulls and Sixers have shown in the past few seasons.


You do need balance and depth though. This is what the Bulls and Sixers have had the past few years, and the Raptors are lacking going into the season. For example, the Bulls in the playoffs had a solid 8-man rotation; they had rebounding (Noah, Miller), shotblocking (Noah, Tyrus), 3-pt shooting (Gordon, Salmons), wing defense (Hinrich, Salmons), slashing (Rose, Salmons), and a playmaker (Rose). They of course had a flawed team, but we had most of our bases covered.

Unless you have a superstar carrying your team (like Wade w/ the Heat), I do think you need that kind of depth and balance to compensate.

Like I said, Raptors are strong in a few areas such as jump shooting and they have a decent playmaker in Calderon. But do they have any other balance? Is there any depth? I only see a team that goes about 5-6 players deep, and is severely lacking defense, rebounding, shotblocking, and even slashing. Just alot of jumpshooting -- I'm doubtful how far jumpshooting alone will get you in this league.


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## Wynn (Jun 3, 2002)

I think the Bull will be much improved this year... having a healthy Hinrich and Deng, having Salmons and Miller for the whole season, the continued development of Tyrus and Noah, the emergence of Rose, and the departure of Chuck Gordon are all things I see as positives going into the season. I'm still not sold on VDN, and would like to see a re-dedication to defense, but I can't see where this team is going to be any worse than last season.


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## Porn Player (Apr 24, 2003)

Kapono plays for the Sixers now. 

We traded him for Reggie Evans.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Ah my bad, forgot that. Guess thats what Bellinelli was brought in for.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

A quote I came by



> This summer, Bryan Colangelo has parlayed Devean George, Roko Ukic, and the rights to Carlos Delfino into Amir Johnson and Marco Belinelli.


They also picked up Jack and Reggie Evans. Now you might be one of those who will say these guys are average players, but thats still a decent second unit.


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## Luke (Dec 7, 2008)

HB said:


> For the Raptors its all about how the start out the gate. The team is loaded offensively, I dont see many teams being able to keep up scoring wise. They just have so many weapons to throw at you. Its almost ike Orlando-lite.
> 
> How can you knock the Sixers when the team is loaded with talent. Iggy, Young and a Healthy Brand, regardless of who is playing at point is a pretty good team. Williams will get to play instead of Miller, who actually is a pretty overrated point guard.


The Raptors also look like they won't be able to guard a bag of chips. Sure, they've got offensive talent, but can you even think of one above average defender on their team? You're overrating them.

The Sixers aren't really any better from last year. They lost one of their best players in Andre Miller, who was the only true point guard on that team. Let's not underestimate the importance of a good point guard.

We get it, Iggy and Thad are nice young players, but Iggy's really limited offensivley and scores 20 a game out of neccesity, and Young is one of the worst passers in the league, and while he's got some great upside, don't expect too much from him. Brand's proven himself to be an absolutley terrible fit for them, he only excels in systems where it's a slowed down tempo and he's the man. But, the Sixers' other three best players (Iggy, Thad, and Louis) can't really play a slow tempo game, and are pretty dependant on the run n' gun style of play. The Sixers won't be better than the Bulls.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

But are those two teams good enough to make the playoffs? Me say YES!!!!


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## Luke (Dec 7, 2008)

HB said:


> But are those two teams good enough to make the playoffs? Me say YES!!!!


One of them will probably sneak in, but definatly not over the Bulls.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

1. cleveland ....in comes shaq out goes ben wallace , I dont see why they cant win 66 unless there are injuries.
2. boston garnett is back and healthy and now they have "Sheed" too 
3. Orlando Vince will make up for Lee and Hedo for at least a season.
4. hawks won 47 last season and are a team on the rise added crawford to play as a gunner off the bench

past this point it really doesn't matter.

5.raptors 
6.wizards
7.heat
8. knicks
9. bulls
10.bobcats 
11.pistons 
12.76ers 
13.pacers 
14.nets 
15.bucks


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

Da Grinch said:


> 1. cleveland ....in comes shaq out goes ben wallace , I dont see why they cant win 66 unless there are injuries.
> 2. boston garnett is back and healthy and now they have "Sheed" too
> 3. Orlando Vince will make up for Lee and Hedo for at least a season.
> 4. hawks won 47 last season and are a team on the rise added crawford to play as a gunner off the bench
> ...



Knicks?


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## Porn Player (Apr 24, 2003)

I think he was just trying to prove his point that the rest of the teams didn't matter, they were in no order. 

Bit unfair to the Heat though. And the Raptors are an unknown as of yet, we're either going to do really well or head straight back to the lottery.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

Yeah seriously, the Knicks are a virtual lock for bottom 3 in the East, IMO.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

jnrjr79 said:


> Knicks?


actually i think they have decent shot .

32 wins last year 39 got the 8th seed 

gallinari only played a very injury plagued 28 games he fits D'antoni's system to a tee and he is supposedly healthy (the team was 14-14 in those 28 games) 

Curry is basically in game shape (318 according to his trainer last week) he only played 2 games last season, I am assuming a rebound season of sorts.

When D'antoni has any kind of depth last year the knicks were a much better team than their record, he really is that good a coach because their talent level at times was very low and at times he pretty good at masking it.

the bulls in my opinion are going to go through an adjustment period figuring out how they are going to consistently win games without gordon who was their guy down the stretch , Rose should be really improved(especially on defense) but he is going to have to get over his deferring nature and i'm not sure that happens this season ...so it falls to salmons who is good but no gordon.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

yodurk said:


> Yeah seriously, the Knicks are a virtual lock for bottom 3 in the East, IMO.


outside of the wizards who won 19 and are clearly much better than that now with arenas back...

the 9th seed pacers won 36 and the 14th seed knicks won 32

there isn't much of a difference , outside of the nets and bucks who have made moves to make them worse everyone in the east can make the playoffs .


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

The Nets arent even that bad to be honest. Harris is the best point guard in the East, Lopez is arguably a top 3-5 center in the East, they've got young talent in Lee, Williams, CDR and some decent vet presence off the bench. They'll be scrappy and will catch some teams slipping. Saying they made moves to make themselves worse is ridiculous, they are one of the teams with a bright future in the league.


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## BigMan (Mar 18, 2003)

Da Grinch said:


> actually i think they have decent shot .
> 
> 32 wins last year 39 got the 8th seed
> 
> ...


He He He - I don't think that Eddy Curry and the word rebound belong in the same sentence.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

Da Grinch said:


> actually i think they have decent shot .
> 
> 32 wins last year 39 got the 8th seed
> 
> ...



Wasn't Curry's "in shape" year in Chicago a year where he played at something like 285? 318 doesn't sound super svelte, though it sounds better than wherever he was. I still don't ever see him becoming an effective player.


With respect to the Bulls' chances, I agree losing Ben is an adjustment. However, I think if Kirk and Deng are healthy all year this year unlike last season, combined with an improved Derrick Rose, you have a team that's as least as good as last year's squad.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

HB said:


> The Nets arent even that bad to be honest. Harris is the best point guard in the East, Lopez is arguably a top 3-5 center in the East, they've got young talent in Lee, Williams, CDR and some decent vet presence off the bench. They'll be scrappy and will catch some teams slipping. Saying they made moves to make themselves worse is ridiculous, they are one of the teams with a bright future in the league.


vince and anderson for lee , alston and battie didn't make them better in 09-10 it made them worse in my opinion...in the long run it will probably even out because lee can play but for next season, vince>>lee.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Well with Vince on the team they werent guaranteed a playoff spot, so they went younger which will hurt them this year. But next year, capspace, two draft picks in arguably the loaded draft of recent memory, and their younger players all getting another year under their belt, the team should be back in playoff contention.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

jnrjr79 said:


> Wasn't Curry's "in shape" year in Chicago a year where he played at something like 285? 318 doesn't sound super svelte, though it sounds better than wherever he was. I still don't ever see him becoming an effective player.
> 
> 
> With respect to the Bulls' chances, I agree losing Ben is an adjustment. However, I think if Kirk and Deng are healthy all year this year unlike last season, combined with an improved Derrick Rose, you have a team that's as least as good as last year's squad.


curry was like 18 and 285 its natural for an nba athlete to gain about 10% as you mature and lift weights.

that in shape year curry came into camp at 283 and he looked unaturally thin... i watched the games ...i dont think he stayed that low he seemed to gain weight as the season went along. 

i dont think d'antoni uses him as a big time post up option i think he uses him as a finisher and a pick and roll guy ...he isn't a good decision maker that just appears to be who he is, but get him the ball with 1 on 1 coverage or on the move to the basket and he is going to score...if lee can get 16 curry can easily drop 20 stamina permitting.

to the bulls kirk i could see picking up some of the slack not really deng, in 5 years he has pretty much been MIA late in games on the offensive end...add to that VDN's system seems to be an ill fit for some reason.(even though it shouldn't)


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

HB said:


> Well with Vince on the team they werent guaranteed a playoff spot, so they went younger which will hurt them this year. But next year, capspace, two draft picks in arguably the loaded draft of recent memory, and their younger players all getting another year under their belt, the team should be back in playoff contention.


i agree with you and their philosophy , but for next season i see them getting pushed down the conf. only being better than the bucks and because they are young if they lose early i think they go in the tank pretty quick and go straight into developmental mode.


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## Wynn (Jun 3, 2002)

BigMan said:


> He He He - I don't think that Eddy Curry and the word rebound belong in the same sentence.


I'll PASS on that comment...


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

I cant say for sure how we rank at the moment. Barring injuries for us and some of the teams out there it is hard to pick who will be better. That being said, I think the Bulls will be fine. We played very good ball without Deng. Deng coming back will take some of the sting out of losing Gordon. Ben helped us with this 3's. That will be missed. 

We should make the playoffs. 

I can say my top 3 are. 

1. Cleveland
2. Boston
3. Orlando. 

4-8 is a toss up. We could fall anywhere between 4-8. 

If Charlotte had not traded Okafor, I would say they would be one of my sleepers. Dont know if Chandler is as good as Okafor.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Porn_Player said:


> I think he was just trying to prove his point that the rest of the teams didn't matter, they were in no order.
> 
> Bit unfair to the Heat though. *And the Raptors are an unknown as of yet, we're either going to do really well or head straight back to the lottery*.


I agree. You could be really improved or back to the lottery. It depends on whether this team can come together.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

http://www.nba.com/2009/news/powerranki ... index.html

NBA.com has us ranked 14th. 

They have Washington as #4 in the east. :wtf:Arenas is good but come on....


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

truebluefan said:


> http://www.nba.com/2009/news/powerranki ... index.html
> 
> NBA.com has us ranked 14th.
> 
> They have Washington as #4 in the east. :wtf:Arenas is good but come on....


Despite my ramblings about Toronto being very overrated going into this season, I actually think Washington could vault as high as 4th in the East.

True, Gil Arenas is only worth so many wins. However, remember they also were missing Brendan Haywood for all season. Now, you may wonder why an average center is so important. I would say VERY important for the way Washington was constructed. Their team was built to have scorers throughout the 1-4 positions, with the 5 spot being manned by a defensive anchor. Hence, Haywood and Etan Thomas trading off minutes as the tough guy big man doing the dirty work. They got little to zero production from Etan Thomas as well, so they were just very thin on interior defense. 

Even though Etan is gone, they replace him with Oberto who is also a scrappy tough guy. Haywood will probably be back 100% I think. So they defensive center tandem is back.

Combine that with healthy Arenas, and a really great trade to get Randy Foye and Mike Miller. 

Arenas, Miller, Foye as your 3-guard rotation
Butler, Stevenson at the 3 (Stevenson/Miller trading off on 2/3 duties I bet)
Jamison, Blatche at the 4
Haywood, Oberto at the 5

Assuming good health, I see a very good and well-balanced roster there. Much more so than Toronto, and probably more so than the Bulls (I like our 3-guard rotation & center rotation better, but they are much stronger at the forward spots).


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

truebluefan said:


> I agree. You could be really improved or back to the lottery. It depends on whether this team can come together.


 i pretty much take the raptors to be a team run by its belief it can win ...they went from division winners to lottery pretty quickly with not much difference in the roster those 2 years...the same thing happened to the bulls ...when you win it begets more confidence in yourself and your teammates ...which usually results in more wins.....when you slide the exact opposite tends to happen.

if they start off bad , i doubt very much they will recover ...but if they start out good they can win alot of games because the talent is there to challenge for the confertence title


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Da Grinch said:


> i pretty much take the raptors to be a team run by its belief it can win ...they went from division winners to lottery pretty quickly with not much difference in the roster those 2 years...the same thing happened to the bulls ...when you win it begets more confidence in yourself and your teammates ...which usually results in more wins.....when you slide the exact opposite tends to happen.
> 
> if they start off bad , i doubt very much they will recover ...but if they start out good they can win alot of games because the talent is there to challenge for the confertence title


I agree, if they start off slow, then it's over for them making the playoffs.


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

yodurk said:


> *Orlando & Cleveland are my top 2 teams in the East*. Simple reason: Lebron & Dwight, not to mention strong supporting casts for each guy.
> 
> *Boston is my #3* -- everyone seems to think they will be #1 or #2 at worst, but that Garnett is clearly the key to that squad, and will those knees hold up for another 82 games? Furthermore, will he sustain his high level of play after such a bad injury? As we saw in the playoffs, Boston is #3 at best without KG.
> 
> ...


I agree with the top 2 for sure, but I'd put Atlanta higher, possibly to #3. Granted I haven't kept up with the player movements this offseason completely, so I'm assuming the teams are the same as last year for the most part, except Orlando getting Vinsanity and losing Turk. I expect Boston to be worse, with the old guys collapsing as they did this year. Wizards? They make moves I don't know about? Heat and Bulls are a toss up. Everyone else I put clearly below, cept maybe Toronto. They got Turk, so I'd put them in the top 8 somewhere, probably 7 or 8.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

DaBabyBullz said:


> I agree with the top 2 for sure, but I'd put Atlanta higher, possibly to #3.


Atlanta at #3 seems pretty high, but if Al Horford busts out then I could definitely see it. And Horford is quite a talent, I wouldn't be surprised if he's a 20 & 10 guy this year. That would give ATL a killer inside-outside attack and maybe enough to take over Boston for #3.



> I expect Boston to be worse, with the old guys collapsing as they did this year.


I actually agree. Not sure if they'll drop below #3, but I really don't see BOS staying above CLE or ORL. It's not the popular opinion though, which surprises me. Garnett's body suddenly has question marks, and there were times last year when Ray Allen and Pierce just looked old and slow. Rasheed is their big signing, but he too is slowing down noticeably.



> Wizards? They make moves I don't know about?


Well, they did trade their draft pick for Randy Foye & Mike Miller. I thought that's a great move. Signing Oberto should help them too. The main thing is apparently Arenas is mostly his old self again, and Haywood is back. Oh, and Flip Saunders is the coach now. I think they'll be a good team. 



> Heat and Bulls are a toss up. Everyone else I put clearly below, cept maybe Toronto. They got Turk, so I'd put them in the top 8 somewhere, probably 7 or 8.


Count me as someone who doesn't like what the Heat or Raptors have done. I'll be pretty disappointed if the Bulls don't beat out both of those teams in the standings.


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## HB (May 1, 2004)

Horford is not a 20, 10 guy. He's not a high usuage player. 15, 10 is about where he is at.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

HB said:


> Horford is not a 20, 10 guy. He's not a high usuage player. 15, 10 is about where he is at.


A little early to be saying that, don't ya think? He's athletic, very skilled, can post up and hit the mid range jumper. As far as I can tell, he has all the tools to be a 20 ppg scorer. Went #3 in the draft for a reason. Not to mention he's a very good passer for a big guy.

All he's lacked so far is an opportunity. He'll get it sooner or later.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

HB said:


> Horford is not a 20, 10 guy. He's not a high usuage player. 15, 10 is about where he is at.


The guy only gets like 8 shots a game, for a guy who shoots 50% and has the skills he has I would expect him to get more touches and could very easily average 18-20ppg. He destroyed Noah back in November going for 27 16 rebs and 6 blocks, this guy has talent.


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## SWIFTSLICK (Aug 22, 2009)

I expect a drop off due to the absence of BG7. He was the offense for the past five seasons. I'm not sure that John Salmons can make up for his loss. He has his good nights but i'm somewhat concerned about consistency. Also, I've yet to see Deng put forth any effort that merits that contract he signed. 14 ppg and 6 rpg isn't going to cut it this year. I need to see improvement, we've been waiting for him to show his strengths for a long time. But he's always run into that injury plagued wall. 

At best, we're looking at the 7th seed (IMO). At worst, Sub-500 season. I hope and pray this team doesn't waste D.Rose's talents by not providing him with adequate support on the roster. We'll have to wait to see how things pan out but at the moment...I'm not seeing a whole lot of strength in that department.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

^^^Maybe I'm drinking a bit too much Kool-Aid, but the more I look at our team, the more I'm actually appreciative of how well-constructed we are at the moment. 

The guard rotation could really be special. Rose, Salmons, Hinrich -- you can put any combination of those guys on the floor at any time, and they'll always be solid. Rose gives us someone to break down defenses while Salmons & Kirk (and even Pargo) can spot up and shoot the 3-ball. Not at BG level, but still at a nice clip. IMO, we will be getting about 50 ppg from our guards every single game, with pretty adequate defense as well assuming Rose can make some strides (Hinrich & Salmons are already solid).

The forward rotation is not quite as strong, but compared to other teams I'd say we're average at worst (as in middle of the pack compared to other team's forwards). Granted, there are some real wild cards here -- Deng's health, Tyrus' growth, and JJ's readiness as a rookie. But the thing I do like is there is some great versatility, and we can use any combination of these 3 guys to play together. 

The center rotation is, IMO, one of the better tandems in the league. Off hand, I can only think of a handful of teams who consistently field a better duo of centers than Noah & Miller (Orlando, Cleveland of course are the 2 biggies in the East). Just really great balance in skills. If we need offense, throw Miller out there in the high post. If we need defense and rebounding, put Noah out there.

In response to the above post, I certainly expect the occasional game where BG7 is sorely missed. However, I think for the majority of games we won't even notice he's gone. This is D-Rose's show now. 

I'm happy with our 8-9 man rotation going into the year. I see alot of versatility and not really any glaring holes (except maybe that elusive post scorer). Compared to last season, this roster is incredibly well defined -- everybody should know their role. There are few questions about who will bring what. That alone should help ensure everyone's on the same page. It's a major bonus that alot of teams don't have.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

yodurk said:


> ^^^Maybe I'm drinking a bit too much Kool-Aid, but the more I look at our team, the more I'm actually appreciative of how well-constructed we are at the moment.
> 
> The guard rotation could really be special. Rose, Salmons, Hinrich -- you can put any combination of those guys on the floor at any time, and they'll always be solid. Rose gives us someone to break down defenses while Salmons & Kirk (and even Pargo) can spot up and shoot the 3-ball. Not at BG level, but still at a nice clip. IMO, we will be getting about 50 ppg from our guards every single game, with pretty adequate defense as well assuming Rose can make some strides (Hinrich & Salmons are already solid).
> 
> ...


Pf is again our weakness. TT is inconsistent. J Johnson was a good college player, and he showed some overall game in summer ball, but also showed he couldn't shoot the ball well. Gibson is another unknown. Dont have a lot to say about him since he played just a couple of summer games. 

A lot of Bulls fans want Wade next year. I wouldn't mind him coming here, but we will still need to address the pf situation first. I dont see the Bulls resigning TT unless he comes out of the gate and plays like a bat out of hell all year. That being said, would he regress once he signs a long term contract? He is too much of a risk, too many unknowns with him.


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