# Allen Iverson... What a damn player



## Bball_Doctor (Dec 29, 2002)

*Incredible AI*

This is one of the greatest offensive playoff performances I have ever seen since Vince Carter drop 50 on AI 3 years ago and the most since I saw MJ drop 55 vs. the Bullets now Wiz. It is incredible how a player who is that small dominate so much...what a talent...what a game...best game of the postseason so far and best game of the season tied with Kobe's 12 3 pointers, 55 vs. MJ and TMac's TD with 45 points.


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## walkon4 (Mar 28, 2003)

What a amazing performance. All the people who diss AI, or dislike his game for whatever the reason... Whats up?????


Allen Iverson is simply amazing. There is nothing else to say..He is the best damn player in the NBA, and the most exciting.

KOBE would never be able to play like Iverson at AI'S height.

Mcgrady wouldnt either..

Allen Iverson is the Answer.

PHILLY IN THE HOUSE. Go Sixers!


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>TheTruth34</b>!
> What a amazing performance. All the people who diss AI, or dislike his game for whatever the reason... Whats up?????
> 
> 
> ...


:yes: :yes: :yes: 

Your Pierce is pretty hype as well.....


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## walkon4 (Mar 28, 2003)

*yeah*

Dont get me wrong, or let my Pierce support fool you.

I was a season ticket holder for the sixers from 1996-2002.
I went to just about EVERY game, EVERY playoff game, and the NBA Finals. The ticket prices were just insane. We had 14th row, behind the visitors bench. I cant even count how many players I have met during my days at the First Union Center. 

I was at the game when Iverson crossed over Jordan. 
I was at the game when Barkley ended his career..
I was at the game when Vince missed the three..
I was at the NBA Finals games...
haha
so many memories.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: yeah*



> Originally posted by <b>TheTruth34</b>!
> 
> I was at the game when Vince missed the three..


I think it was a two, but yea what a series that was eh, Iverson and Vince trading 50 pt games, didnt AI have 2 50 pt games that series?? Anyway that was one of the best series in recent memory, thought maybe a rivalry could form, but the Raptors didn't hold up their end. I remember one summer there was some AI for Vince trade talk, in retrospect......:sigh:


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## 33 (Nov 18, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TheTruth34</b>!
> KOBE would never be able to play like Iverson at AI'S height.
> Mcgrady wouldnt either..



What are you talking about? What is your logic behind this statement? A.I. is a unique player such as Kobe and T-Mac.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Allen Iverson... What a damn player*



> Originally posted by <b>33</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> What are you talking about? What is your logic behind this statement? A.I. is a unique player such as Kobe and T-Mac.


He's saying if you take Kobe with his current skills and put him at AI's height, he wouldnt be able to do as much as AI can.....which is true


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TheTruth34</b>!
> What a amazing performance. All the people who diss AI, or dislike his game for whatever the reason... Whats up?????
> 
> 
> ...


Maybe but the FACT is that Kobe and TMac ARE taller and they are better, IMO.


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## 33 (Nov 18, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Allen Iverson... What a damn player*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> He's saying if you take Kobe with his current skills and put him at AI's height, he wouldnt be able to do as much as AI can.....which is true


Why is that true, please explain


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>TheTruth34</b>!
> KOBE would never be able to play like Iverson at AI'S height.
> 
> Mcgrady wouldnt either..
> ...


What is the point? Of course Kobe and Tmac will never play like AI at his height. What? Do you expect them to magically shrink 5-7 inches so they can be AI's size? WTF!


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

What if AI were Kobe and TMac's size? Would he be as good? The answer isn't all that obvious because he'd be 6-7 inches taller and about 60 pounds heavier. His game is predicated on quickness and speed and he'd lose some of that.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Allen Iverson... What a damn player*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> What is the point? Of course Kobe and Tmac will never play like AI at his height. What? Do you expect them to magically shrink 5-7 inches so they can be AI's size? WTF!


um noone was saying if they shrink to his size, but if they were his size, they wouldnt be as successful, cuz noone in the league has the heart and fearlessness that AI has and that is required to be as successful as he is at such a short height....


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Allen Iverson... What a damn player*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> um noone was saying if they shrink to his size, but if they were his size, they wouldnt be as successful, cuz noone in the league has the heart and fearlessness that AI has and that is required to be as successful as he is at such a short height....


You state that belief as a fact when it is really just an opinion.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Allen Iverson... What a damn player*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> um noone was saying if they shrink to his size, but if they were his size, they wouldnt be as successful, cuz noone in the league has the heart and fearlessness that AI has and that is required to be as successful as he is at such a short height....


You state that belief as a fact when it is really just an opinion.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Allen Iverson... What a damn player*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> He's saying if you take Kobe with his current skills and put him at AI's height, he wouldnt be able to do as much as AI can.....which is true


there's no truth in that arguement at all, its mainly fiction. 
Like 33 said, what is true about that? 

Kobe already is one of few, if not the only person, in the league that can guard AI. What would be the difference?


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

your rite, it is just my opinion, wen it comes to basketball, fav players and comparisms are always opinions. but the way i see it is if kobe was AI's height, meaning no size advantage, AI has the superior speed and would be able to best him, AI also has no fear, not saying Kobe doesnt, but if Kobe was AI's size, would he be able to do better than AI, well theres no way to tell, but I dont think so....


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

Kobe is already quick enough to keep up with AI. If he were smaller I'd think he would be even quicker.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> Kobe is already quick enough to keep up with AI. If he were smaller I'd think he would be even quicker.


Kobe is NOT as quick as AI.....


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## walkon4 (Mar 28, 2003)

*Well*

Heres a good argument:

Allen Iverson stats 2002-2003
PPG 27.6 
RPG 4.2 
APG 5.5 

Tracy Mcgrady Stats 2002-2003
PPG 32.1 
RPG 6.5 
APG 5.5 


Well, If your saying you cant make the statement that AI is better than Mcgrady if they had the same height.. Well heres a fact

Mcgrady only averages about 2 more rebounds than Iverson.. he has 8 INCHES on him. Clearly Iverson would be more dominant than Mcgrady on the rebounding stat if he was bigger. Hes almost even!!!! and there is an 8 inch difference!!!!

Jehu is right.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> Kobe is NOT as quick as AI.....


Re read the quote. He is quick *enough* to keep up with him.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>TheTruth34</b>!
> Heres a good argument:
> 
> Allen Iverson stats 2002-2003
> ...


:mrt:


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Re read the quote. He is quick *enough* to keep up with him.


He is *NOT* quick enough to keep up with him


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> :mrt:


great response


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> He is *NOT* quick enough to keep up with him


He has proven more than once that he can stick with AI. In fact, he shut him down in the last match up between LA and Philly this year. Phil put Kobe on AI who could even get the ball, and the few times he did Kobe smothered him. Two Years ago AI was going off on Lue and Fisher, Phil Put Kobe on him in the second half and he went scorelss. Keep it real.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> great response


Thank you and BTW, that was a great post..... full of if's and but's. FYI: You'd make a lot more sense if you all would stick to what's real instead of playing make believe.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> He has proven more than once that he can stick with AI. In fact, he shut him down in the last match up between LA and Philly this year. Phil put Kobe on AI who could even get the ball, and the few times he did Kobe smothered him. Two Years ago AI was going off on Lue and Fisher, Phil Put Kobe on him in the second half and he went scorelss. Keep it real.


Kobe has the size to sometimes stop him, but he is not quick enough to stop him, take away the size difference, AI would blow him out of the water....


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Why can't we talk straight*

okay Fiction boy! :laugh:


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Thank you and BTW, that was a great post..... full of if's and but's. FYI: You'd make a lot more sense if you all would stick to what's real instead of playing make believe.


you wanna stick to wats real.

Double-Nickel :yes:


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Why can't we talk straight*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> okay Fiction boy! :laugh:


um the point of the thread was not saying AI was better than Kobe. we were talking in non-real terms if Kobe was AI's height. So to then call me fiction boy when that is what the topic was makes no sense whatsoever.....


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> you wanna stick to wats real.
> ...


Yeah I know, it is this years NBA season high courtesy of Kobe Bryant who by the way dropped 50+ 3 times, and 40+ 20 times.:yes:


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## 33 (Nov 18, 2002)

Nobody can check A.I. Not Kobe, not anybody. But A.I. can't guard no other SG in the league. He plays the passing lanes very well, but his one on one defense is suspect. This whole thread is make believe. Let's talk about fact and not fiction


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah I know, it is this years NBA season high courtesy of Kobe Bryant who by the way dropped 50+ 3 times, and 40+ 20 times.:yes:


that would be in the regular season when it does not really matter. Yesterday 39 pts and he kinda sucked in the second half, luckily he has Shaq. AI has noone, has to do it all himself, droppinh 25 in the first half and 20 in the 4th quarter.....


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Why can't we talk straight*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> um the point of the thread was not saying AI was better than Kobe. we were talking in non-real terms if Kobe was AI's height. So to then call me fiction boy when that is what the topic was makes no sense whatsoever.....


THe topic of the thread is to give AI props, and it somehow threw a little twist in attacking Tmac and Kobe. Fiction boy? that's makes plenty of sense.:yes:

BTW, AI is one of my favorite players. I just dont believe in BS. Specualtion nevers proves a point, facts do!


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>33</b>!
> Nobody can check A.I. Not Kobe, not anybody. But A.I. can't guard no other SG in the league. He plays the passing lanes very well, but his one on one defense is suspect. This whole thread is make believe. Let's talk about fact and not fiction


this is a basketball forum, basketball is what is talked about. threads such as saying who would win with players from the past against players form the present is also make believe, but since its a basketball forum, ppl talk about it....


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Why can't we talk straight*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> facts do!


so the fact that AI scored 55 pts last nite would make him better than Kobe is we purely look at the facts, yet I admit Kobe is better than AI cuz theres more than just facts, facts can only be measured in stats. everything else is theoretical. ppl who say if Kobe was on the majic or watever, its not a fact, its theoretical.....


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> that would be in the regular season when it does not really matter. Yesterday 39 pts and he kinda sucked in the second half, luckily he has Shaq. AI has noone, has to do it all himself, droppinh 25 in the first half and 20 in the 4th quarter.....


Did you ever think that haing Shaq and allowing Shaq to score takes away from Kobe being able to completely heist the entire game? This is the privilage that AI and Tmac has and Shaq and Kobe dont. Kobe still manages to give you 40 and 50+ with Shaq on his team. that's say alot. BTW, the regular season matter more than you think because Kobe dropped most of those 40+ 50+ games while the Lakers were in the hunt and without his perfomances they might not be in the Playoffs.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>33</b>!
> Nobody can check A.I. Not Kobe, not anybody. But A.I. can't guard no other SG in the league. He plays the passing lanes very well, but his one on one defense is suspect. This whole thread is make believe. Let's talk about fact and not fiction


Kobe hater comments dont hold any wieght in this discussion, sorry 33. You know just as well as anyone else Kobe has shut down AI before.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Did you ever think that haing Shaq and allowing Shaq to score takes away from Kobe being able to completely heist the entire game? This is the privilage that AI and Tmac has and Shaq and Kobe dont. Kobe still manages to give you 40 and 50+ with Shaq on his team. that's say alot. BTW, the regular season matter more than you think because Kobe dropped most of those 40+ 50+ games while the Lakers were in the hunt and without his perfomances they might not be in the Playoffs.


it is the privelege they have?? more like its the neccesity that makes em have to do so much. until Kobe has his own team and has to do it all himself, there is no way to compare....


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Why can't we talk straight*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> so the fact that AI scored 55 pts last nite would make him better than Kobe is we purely look at the facts, yet I admit Kobe is better than AI cuz theres more than just facts, facts can only be measured in stats. everything else is theoretical. ppl who say if Kobe was on the majic or watever, its not a fact, its theoretical.....


One 55 point game does not make you all of a sudden better than the next player. Tmac and Kobe are better than AI. If you want to lean on a crutch and say its because they are bigger then fine, but its the truth. AI is on the level below them.:yes:


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Why can't we talk straight*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> One 55 point game does not make you all of a sudden better than the next player. Tmac and Kobe are better than AI. If you want to lean on a crutch and say its because they are bigger then fine, but its the truth. AI is on the level below them.:yes:


i wasnt saying AI is better than Kobe or TMac, all im saying is theres more to just facts. if we look at facts, Wilt was the greatest player, one season he averaged over 50 pts, and all his other incredible accomplishments, yet a lot of ppl myself included would regard Jordan as the greatest ever.....


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> it is the privelege they have?? more like its the neccesity that makes em have to do so much. until Kobe has his own team and has to do it all himself, there is no way to compare....


Privilege in the sense that you are speaking. Bernard King, Adrain Dantley all played on teams where they could do all the scoring. Its didnt mean anything because they never won, but hey they got to jack as many shots as they wanted and have incredible numbers scoring wise. 

And think Kobe and Tmac are still able to out score AI over a course of 82 games by 4-6 ppg.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Why can't we talk straight*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> i wasnt saying AI is better than Kobe or TMac, all im saying is theres more to just facts. if we look at facts, Wilt was the greatest player, one season he averaged over 50 pts, and all his other incredible accomplishments, yet a lot of ppl myself included would regard Jordan as the greatest ever.....


I agree, but the facts that make MJ the greatest is he was a winner. Wilt was not.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Why can't we talk straight*



> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> i wasnt saying AI is better than Kobe or TMac, all im saying is theres more to just facts. if we look at facts, Wilt was the greatest player, one season he averaged over 50 pts, and all his other incredible accomplishments, yet a lot of ppl myself included would regard Jordan as the greatest ever.....


Plus this should tell you somthing about size not making a difference. Wilt was big and statically dominate. But who is the greatest, MJ the smaller guy. Size isn't as big a deal as you make it.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Privilege in the sense that you are speaking. Bernard King, Adrain Dantley all played on teams where they could do all the scoring. Its didnt mean anything because they never won, but hey they got to jack as many shots as they wanted and have incredible numbers scoring wise.
> ...


um AI always has his team in the playoffs, and took em to the finals that one yr, he also has an MVP, which is Most Valuable Player in case you didnt know, which means AI can win. Kobe has no MVPs but he has 3 rings wit Shaq, now that is the basic hater comment, but i doubt the Lakers could have won 3 straight witout Shaq in the same way they could not have won 3 staight witout Kobe, wait until Kobe has his own team, and then see if he can carry them to the finals by himself. Kobe is better than AI, I am not trying to say otherwise, but no way can you say AI cant win.....


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Well*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> And think Kobe and Tmac are still able to out score AI over a course of 82 games by 4-6 ppg.


AI has 3 scoring titles, how many does Kobe have??


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

You can't only give AI credit for going to the final. He did have the defensive player of the year, coach of the year, and sixth man of the year, that year.

I need a break be back in a while.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> You can't only give AI credit for going to the final. He did have the defensive player of the year, coach of the year, and sixth man of the year, that year.
> 
> I need a break be back in a while.


anyone who saw the Sixers that playoffs knows he carried em, just like he did yesterday.....

off-topic, does anyone know wats the most playoff pts for a regular game is. Like Jordan has his 63 in double-OT, does anyone know wat the most in a normal playoff game is???


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> I need a break be back in a while.


ok. btw this is a nice discussion, and no hard feelings. believe me i fully respect Kobe for the player he is.


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## 33 (Nov 18, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Kobe hater comments dont hold any wieght in this discussion, sorry 33. You know just as well as anyone else Kobe has shut down AI before.


Why is it that every time I say something about Kobe that you don't agree with, I'm hating. [strike]I'm not just singling you out IV, I'm talking to all Kobe dick beaters.[/strike] IMO, Kobe can't check A.I. Don't just point out one game that Kobe D'ed him up. I remember A.I. going off for like 35+ against Kobe and the Lakers the same year you claim Kobe shut him down. Let's talk about that.

*Please watch the baiting! Thanks, Devestata.*


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

Whoever said AI would be better than Kobe or TMAC if he was as tall as them....that is an unprovable statement.

What if Kobe was as tall as Yao Ming? Kobe would dominate the paint. 40 inch vert with a 3 point shooting touch and harassing defense. 

What if Shaq was as small as AI?

You cant prove these things. Also, the taller or smaller a player gets, it changes their game significantly. They have to adjust their game and develop new moves, strategies, plays. Its too hard to argue for this statement.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Pinball</b>!
> What if AI were Kobe and TMac's size? Would he be as good? The answer isn't all that obvious because he'd be 6-7 inches taller and about 60 pounds heavier. His game is predicated on quickness and speed and he'd lose some of that.


What about that Jehuisthere? You keep trying to shrink TMac and Kobe. How about making AI bigger and slower? How would that affect his game?


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Jehuisthere</b>!
> 
> 
> ok. btw this is a nice discussion, and no hard feelings. believe me i fully respect Kobe for the player he is.


of course not, I loved to talk smack.  This is fun!


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>33</b>!
> 
> 
> Why is it that every time I say something about Kobe that you don't agree with, I'm hating. I'm not just singling you out IV, I'm talking to all Kobe dick beaters. IMO, Kobe can't check A.I. Don't just point out one game that Kobe D'ed him up. I remember A.I. going off for like 35+ against Kobe and the Lakers the same year you claim Kobe shut him down. Let's talk about that.


Kobe has done it more than once. He can check Iverson. You are a self-proclaimed hater so your opinion about Kobe is off no interest in any conversation concerning him. Don't get all sensitive because I called you out.


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## 33 (Nov 18, 2002)

I'm not sensitive. I am a Kobe hater meaning I don't like to see him do anything good, but I do recognize the real. He is a special talent, I just don't like the guy. He can't check A.I. He may have done it once maybe twice (maybe not even once for real) but he cannot stick with A.I. Just like nobody can check Kobe, nobody can check A.I., or T-Mac, or Shaq. Everybody else in the league can be checked. Yes Duncan, yes Garnett, yes Pierce etc.........


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

I guess he would have to hold Iverson scoreless for the rest of his career for you to admit that Kobe can check Iverson. :nonono:
What a shame!


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

You are right no one can check Iverson, but Kobe can do a good of job as anyone. But can Iverson guard Kobe as good as anyone. Doubt it.


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## Jehuisthere (Jan 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pinball</b>!
> 
> 
> What about that Jehuisthere? You keep trying to shrink TMac and Kobe. How about making AI bigger and slower? How would that affect his game?


if AI was their size, the only thing that would seperate them is the intangibles, and AI has the most heart out of anyone in the league, not to mention fearlessness, and his only care is winning, much like MJ....


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## chapi (Apr 4, 2003)

how comes everybody says t-mac is the best (or second best behind kobe) player in the nba?
'coz he got one scoring title? (iverson has 3)
'coz he is in the playofs? (ai is to)
'coz he does the self alley oop? (oh yes this makes him the best on a backyard court)
i can see why you think kobe is the best (scores a lot, got RINGS) but t-mac? 
(no i'm not a kobe fan, i hate them both)


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## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

i dont see why anyone would really hate a player...
if they are good, then they are good... period

Kobe and T-Mac are on another level, granted...
Same way Shaq is on another level
and AI also... on another level

as far as heart and desire, AI is above them head and shoulders...

T-Mac has always been a lil complacent, a lil too much for my taste, as good as he is and all, he could be better...

Kobe, when all else fails, push the ball to shaq... the biggest X Factor he got...

AI, comes wit heart, and determination every game, no matter who they play.... if he takes a better shot selection, and drives more... who knows... 55 point games everynight?


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## ThereisnoIinteam3 (Apr 19, 2003)

I don't know how anyone could not think Allan Iverson is amazing.
I have never seen anyone take over a game like him.


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