# Game #21: Phoenix Suns (13-9) @ Los Angeles Lakers (17-3) [12/10]



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)




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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Win. Win. Win.


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## Plastic Man (Nov 8, 2004)

Shaq isn't playing if I'm not mistaken.

Defense. Win. Please. Yes. Please? 

GO LA!


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

Plastic Man said:


> Shaq isn't playing if I'm not mistaken.
> 
> Defense. Win. Please. Yes. Please?
> 
> GO LA!


If Shaq's not playing, then... :sparta:

Otherwise, i'm not too confident...


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Plastic Man said:


> Shaq isn't playing if I'm not mistaken.
> 
> Defense. Win. Please. Yes. Please?
> 
> GO LA!


Yeah I heard a few sites say he wasn't and a few said he was possible. But since Cris had such a nice photoshop from the first game, I thought I'd just assume he was playing until proven otherwise. 

:biggrin:


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Shaq is out for the next two games due to a death in the family; it's already been confirmed on multiple sports websites.

This means that Robin Lopez will probably start at center, and Bynum should absolutely dominate him down low.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Basel said:


> Shaq is out for the next two games due to a death in the family; it's already been confirmed on multiple sports websites.


Well, it's to late now. The game thread shows him playing, so he will just have to postpone his family funeral services to fit accordingly.


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## sylaw (Nov 7, 2002)

I have a bad feeling about this game. I just don't see them winning this one. Suns by 10. Please call me out on it when I'm wrong though. I wouldn't mind at all.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Well we have absolutely zero reason to lose tonight.

Suns will be without Shaq and also without Bell/Diaw (who were just traded to the Bobcats).


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Scouting Report​*


> Tonight’s game represents how quickly things can change in the NBA. Yesterday afternoon we were riding high with one of the top records in the league and now if we don’t get our act together we will be just another team with a two game losing streak. What a difference a day makes. After playing below our expectations last night in Sacramento (partly due to the spirited defense played at times by the Kings) we need to get back on track tonight against the Phoenix Suns.
> 
> Phoenix is looking to run more than in our first meeting (November 20th at Phoenix). While head coach Terry Porter is allowing them to run on every opportunity they still are not the same fastbreaking, seven seconds or less, shoot em up team of years past. They are an unselfish team but they lead the league in turnovers. We know once again we will see a high volume of screen and rolls from a variety of angles. With this being one of the areas that has caused us problems over the last couple of weeks we need to make sure that all five players understand that they have a job to do on each defensive possession. Phoenix is an excellent drive and kick team and even though they only average 6.5 makes from beyond the three point line per night, they are a dangerous group from the perimeter. We will the same offensive sets that we saw in our first game with the Suns and they are actually running more of their Elbow series. This is where Nash hits one of the Bigs at the elbow and then has an option of where to cut and what kind of screen to set.
> 
> One major difference that we will see tonight with the Suns is that Leandro Barbosa is back. He missed our first game with Phoenix and we will need to be ready for the speed he brings to the game. Barbosa is a very quick, very fast player who is most dangerous leaking out and scoring easy transition buckets. He has improved his ability to drive right but when he puts it down he still prefers to go left. He can also shoot the three and is aggressive on the defensive end where he is a good steals guy. He can almost single handedly win the battle of the benches if we allow it.


http://my.lakers.com/lakers/news.html?id=5


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

I just want to see defense.....




new sig


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## ceejaynj (Oct 9, 2005)

Basel said:


> Well we have absolutely zero reason to lose tonight.


Well...we had even more reasons not to lose to the Kings last night.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Whose watching the game?


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## Shaolin (Aug 6, 2004)

Walton is starting....wtf?!


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

I'm definitely watching it.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Shaolin said:


> Walton is starting....wtf?!


He is? I missed the announcements...

If so this will surely improve our defense...:azdaja:


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Shaolin said:


> Walton is starting....wtf?!


Where did you hear that? I'm still watching Cleveland/Philly.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Basel said:


> Where did you hear that? I'm still watching Cleveland/Philly.


Same here, didn't see anything about Walton starting. Maybe he heard it on 570?


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Here we go...


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## gi0rdun (May 31, 2007)

Luke Walton sighting!


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Luke Walton with a great defensive play to start the game...and Fisher and-1 on the other end. Wow. Didn't see that coming from Luke.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Basel said:


> Luke Walton with a great defensive play to start the game...and Fisher and-1 on the other end. Wow. Didn't see that coming from Luke.


Radman has been very bad lately, so I understand changing it up a little. But with so little Walton time lately... I'm surprised.

But if one person knew how to find Bynum last season, it was always Walton.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Well the Ball movement is noticeably better with Walton in there instead of Radman.. Defense cant be that much worse.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Bynum should EASILY score 20+ points tonight - there is nobody that can stop him.

Meanwhile, Kobe comes out and shoots 3 perimeter jumpers (all near 3-point land) and misses them all.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Amare is just blowing by Gasol like he is standing still.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Wow.. Walton really wants to start.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Luke already with 2 assists, a rebound and 2 steals.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Amare just tore up Bynum on that possession. Bynum looks a little timid and afraid of fouling him on the defensive end. Looks great on offense for the most part though.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Bynum's probably just worried about getting into early foul trouble like last night. I think if he can go into the 2nd half with 2 fouls, he'll play more determined on the defensive end. Not that he shouldn't be doing that already, but I'm just guessing that's his mindset right now.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

So far its fair to say Luke is getting it done on both ends. Those steals he had were just reading passes to. No gambling (not like he would be fast enough to get steals any other way)..

I expect DANNY to make an appearance tonight.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

I notice the defense looks similar to what we were running to start the season. Little more team orientated. Not great, but more effort at least.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

The thing about having Walton out there is at least able to improve our ball movement. Sometimes with Vlade out there the ball movement looks a little stale.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Nice offensive game for bynum....but again "It's the Defense, Stupid"


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Honestly our defense doesn't look horrible right now to me.. Suns are hitting some very contested shots right now.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Kobe launches another three..


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

For those keeping track, Kobe has taken 7 shots, made 5 of them, and hasn't driven to the basket one time yet.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Kobe is playing this game like he's in a gym by himself practicing jumpshots


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Luke with the jam! :biggrin:


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Bynum is kicking *** down low, and it's nice to see Walton going to him consistently. 

Unfortunately, our perimeter defense is still giving up wide open shots.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

We have more energy on D but we still don't know what we are doing.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

I'm really pissed at kobe now: it's like he said "The Suns are no concern right now, I'd might as well practice jumpshots"


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Machine shooting sick jumpers of death.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

It's GREAT seeing Sasha hit that 3 just now; hopefully he can get some shots in tonight and get his confidence back up. Nice steal there as well for Sasha.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Good defense from Bynum and Odom on Amre just now.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Nice example of bad rotating D

Bynum did a good job at coming out to help but never rotated back so that Farmer can go back to his man. Open Shot


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Well, 25 points from the Suns in the first quarter isn't to bad considering the type of offense they run. But we are still leaving guys wide open on the perimeter. 

The adjustment of Walton starting seemed to be a fairly decent plan so far. Not sure it's a fluke, but he's still a good passer and no better or worse than Vlade on defense. 

I liked that Walton found Bynum a great deal in the post when he was open. Something Vlade didn't do well (or anyone else really but maybe Farmar and sometimes Kobe).


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

So far, Kobe's taken it to the basket one time, coming there from the baseline, and he turned it over.

I'll try and keep track of how many times he goes to the rim tonight.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

So is Radmanovic not even cracking the lineup now?


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Also, for those keeping track, we've now missed two layups.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Yikes. Ariza is going to be kicking himself in the *** after missing that.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> Well, 25 points from the Suns in the first quarter isn't to bad considering the type of offense they run. But we are still leaving guys wide open on the perimeter.
> 
> The adjustment of Walton starting seemed to be a fairly decent plan so far. Not sure it's a fluke, but he's still a good passer and no better or worse than Vlade on defense..


Both Walton and Vlade stunk at rotationg D. What Vlade can do is guard Forwards and guards one-on-one alot better than Walton and shoot the 3 better. Thats about it.




Where's the defense?


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Sasha with his 2nd triple of the night. Good work, Machine! Maybe this will be the game where he breaks out of his slump.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

There you go! This is how the 2nd unit should ALWAYS be playing! 11-point lead after the shot by Farmar!


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Only reason why we're up because the Sun D is worse than ours


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

The One said:


> Only reason why we're up because the Sun D is worse than ours


Suns have only scored 34 points so far.. If we can close out with them under 50, it will be our best defensive half in a long time.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Sasha is 3/4 from 3-point range now...good to see.

Oh, and L.A., please stop giving up WIDE open looks from the perimeter.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

But if we leave guys like Barbosa wide open, that dream is not going to be a reality.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Wow first time we were in a zone for ages. to bad it was a 3-2 zone that got broke down.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Barbosa wide open again.. Who the **** is supposed to be guarding him right now?


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Just like that we give up a bunch of buckets.. lol.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Kobe doesn't even look like he's trying.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Good to see Luke playing well - I don't think anybody expected that.

But what's going on with Radmanovic? Injured? Or has Phil just decided to bench him?


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> Just like that we give up a bunch of buckets.. lol.


 so I ask again...Where's The Defense??


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

The One said:


> so I ask again...Where's The Defense??


Ask Phil Jackson, not me.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

One positive thing about the defense is that while it still hasn't been great tonight, it does appear that they're giving more of an effort defensively than in the last 5 games or so.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> Ask Phil Jackson, not me.


 I already tried that


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Wow...

What the **** kind of defense was THAT?!


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Basel said:


> Wow...
> 
> What the **** kind of defense was THAT?!


I guess I'll ask you


Where's the defense?


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

The One said:


> I guess I'll ask you
> 
> 
> Where's the defense?


In late October/early November.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Not a very good performance for Kobe that half.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

LOL. Kobe saying that we need to work on defense.

Stop Saying and Start Doing!!!


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> Not a very good performance for Kobe that half.


 he's sleep walking out there


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Well offensively I like the change up with Luke. He's much better at getting everyone involved than Vlad. Obviously, we go without Vlads 3 point shooting... But were such a high scoring team naturally, I don't think were missing much.

But we will see how good Luke is after a few games.. This could just be "I'm finally in the game motivation" and not a true indication of how he will play later on. 

Defensively though were are still garbage. Sure we kept the Suns under 50, but that's mainly because they are playing out of position, and missing some easy shots.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

First half shot chart for Kobe:


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Luke stays in even though he picks up his 4th foul right away...


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Basel said:


> First half shot chart for Kobe:


It's a little closer to the rim... But still not good enough.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

They are leaving Gasol wide open right now.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Well Kobe made the three at least...


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Look at how easy Kobe made that look. He went to the rank and it went right in.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Kobe goes to the basket! Only the 2nd time tonight, but maybe he'll finally continue to do that.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Grant Hill isn't missing right now.


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## gi0rdun (May 31, 2007)

Kobe was jumping everywhere.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Gasol is playing so damn well for us. Earlier in another thread, I said he was our most consistent player offensively, and he's showing it again tonight.

8/10 shooting, 19 points.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

The Suns are on ****ing fire right now.

Luke Walton should stop shooting 3's. Stick to distributing the ball and scoring on layups/dunks.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Kobe and Walton need to stop with the threes.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Basel said:


> Gasol is playing so damn well for us. Earlier in another thread, I said he was our most consistent player offensively, and he's showing it again tonight.
> 
> 8/10 shooting, 19 points.


I agree. He has been the most consist offensive player on this team.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

I really don't want to get started on how pathetic this team is right now.

Luke Walton and Kobe look like two of the biggest jokes I have ever seen. Are they serious with their performances right now? At least act like you're trying. Well, maybe Walton is, but he sucks soooo much.

Right now, the Lakers are not that good. They've survived thus far because they have so much individual talent. As a team, they are not very good at all.

They're lazy, they don't have fight or spirit in them, and they're not a smart team (the number of threes taken, the passes they're making and not making, and all the missed layups show that).


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## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

Wow we suck. I guess we are still in no defense outscore the opponent mode. It's so frustrating watching games like this and watch all the talent in the world get outplayed by the Suns, lmao :azdaja::azdaja:


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Mark Jackson,"this is the defense that the Washington Generals played against the Globetrotters"


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## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

The One said:


> Mark Jackson,"this is the defense that the Washington Generals played against the Globetrotters"


lol


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

Matt Barnes and Grant Hill have combined for almost 40pts. We're in the 3rd Q. I cannot express in words how profoundly sad that is.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

this is just disgusting...


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Kobe is killing me right now.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

this is inconceivably dispicable...


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

We have no injuries right?

WHat the |=U(|( is Going ON!!!!


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Yeah...just keep feeding Pau. He's the only one that gives a ****.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Gave up 33 points in the 3rd quarter. Good job, Lakers.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

"Here's a shot you never seen me take before".. I thought he was going to the rim.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> "Here's a shot you never seen me take before".. I thought he was going to the rim.


 lol


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

We are never going to improve...Phil just said that our problem with our defense is our offense....


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

This is sorry *** defense plain and simple. Kobe and Luke's defense has been dreadful and we haven;t thought about protecting the rim. 

Just terrible and PJ's coaching rotations have been even worse.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

lol at LO


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

I mean the dribble penetration is just unreal Drago is getting into the teeth of the defense lol


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Pau Gasol is awesome; where the hell would we be tonight without him?


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> This is sorry *** defense plain and simple. Kobe and Luke's defense has been dreadful and we haven;t thought about protecting the rim.
> 
> Just terrible and PJ's coaching rotations have been even worse.


Phil jackson just said that our main problem on defense is our (bad) offense.

He does not have a clue on what to do!


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> "Here's a shot you never seen me take before".. I thought he was going to the rim.


Huh?

And good job Odom!


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Heads up on the losing trend Bynum is on the bench again in the 4th quarter.


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## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

This is embarrassing.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

The One said:


> Phil jackson just said that our main problem on defense is our (bad) offense.
> 
> He does not have a clue on what to do!


yeah I heard that PJ isn't losing his mind he's trying to avoid the obvious we don't have defensive minded personel too many skilled offfensive guys, no grit tough defenders.

I've accepted what it is. Kobe could be playing better defense the last couple games but besides him its being frustarted with a team that can't do anything else.


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## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

Kobe needs to grow his afro back and stop playing like a *****!


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

We really need a vocal leader. Kobe only leads by example, Fisher isn't a talker, and Phil Jackson is just lazy......We Need Kevin Garnett!!!


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

I just wanna win this game no matter how ugly, we're struggling it happens to everyone. Just gotta get outta here with a win.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Drago again. lol


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Kobe finally.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Kobe finally hits a shot, yes, but he shouldn't even be taking it. His jumper has been way of since the game against Philly; I don't know how many times I need to say it, but drive to the ****ing rim!


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## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

I hate Kobe launching up jump shots but at-least he finally made on. His shot selection is just awful.


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## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

a stop wow, we got lucky.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> yeah I heard that PJ isn't losing his mind he's trying to avoid the obvious* we don't have defensive minded personel too many skilled offfensive guys*, no grit tough defenders.
> 
> .


 I'll give you that but there is still no excuse to have our team playing like they don't care in stretches. Even when the Celtics and Cavs arn't getter their way they still look like they play hard and that is all on the coach and team captains.

I don't think that Kobe, Fisher, and Phil properly holds players responsible for there Defense. Just saying that are defense needs to improve won't do nothing unless you held people responsible and cuts minutes for that reason.

They said that last game was a defense problem and they respond by putting Luke in the starting linup: W..T..F!!! Put in Ariza!!!

Phil does not have a clue about our main problem.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

LO getting involved.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Kobe is struggling bad pass, bad defense, bad shooting. just ugly stuff.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

I think our team just started getting really arrogant. Look at the quote in S2theONIC's sig:

Andrew Bynum: "We're going to run Jack In The Box out of business."

That sound arrogant as hell to me. Shut up and just play.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> Kobe is struggling bad pass, bad defense, bad shooting. just ugly stuff.


Yeah, this isn't the Kobe we're accustomed to seeing, that's for sure. No idea what's been going on lately, but he needs to snap out of it.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

There you go Kobe lets go Bynum and 1


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Andrew Bynum!


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

God I wish I was a coach right now.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Keep Bynum in Take LO's *** out PJ.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Why did Bynum just get benched?


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Another bad ****ing play by Kobe. Not seen him play this bad in a long *** time just a bad decision to split the damn double. 

Good decision putting Sasha in and sliding Kobe to the 3 though by PJ.


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## Shaolin (Aug 6, 2004)

This team is.....special.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> Keep Bynum in Take LO's *** out PJ.


 I say trade Odom for Wallace and have a smash lineup of Kobe, Trevor, Wallace, Pau, Bynum. and move Powell (who plays great D) to the bench rotation.

If they can't coach defense then they might as well find and play playerss that already know how to play it.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

A 90 year old grant hill just RAPED Kobe. RAPED him.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

That was one of the most obvious fouls I've ever seen.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> A 90 year old grant hill just RAPED Kobe. RAPED him.


 Kobe reached (gamble) and Grant took advantage....


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> A 90 year old grant hill just RAPED Kobe. RAPED him.


Don't think it's a good idea to be using Kobe and raped in the same sentence...the trolls will come out.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

soft play by gasol another to


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Crowd only gets up because they want tacos...

Machine!


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

Kobe at 3, Sasha at 2 is a good lineup.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Basel said:


> Crowd only gets up because they want tacos...
> 
> Machine!


 they need something to cheer for.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> Kobe at 3, Sasha at 2 is a good lineup.


Yeah, if Phil is going to mess with the lineup, maybe it's time that he makes that move instead of inserting either Walton/Radmanovic at the 3 and keeping Kobe at the 2.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> Kobe at 3, Sasha at 2 is a good lineup.


 decent fourth quarter linup...I'd add Bynum in too


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Well, so much for the tacos...


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> A 90 year old grant hill just RAPED Kobe. RAPED him.


and the campaign continues lol. but yeah he got Kobe.a you reach I teach situation.


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## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

And the crowd boos for a lack of tacos...


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

No Laker game is complete without giving up at least 100 points.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

no tacos........dispicable


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

LOL at Mark Jackson saying Kobe should go KG on his team. 

If Kobe does that it'll be how bad a teammate Kobe is.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

And that should do it.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

I think the lakers are looking out for the diet of Lakers fans too much taco eating is bad for the health.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> and the campaign continues lol. but yeah he got Kobe.a you reach I teach situation.


I must be good at it. I'm not the only one annoyed with Kobe lately. Try reading a news paper, or listening to Phil Jackson.


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> LOL at Mark Jackson saying Kobe should go KG on his team.
> 
> If Kobe does that it'll be how bad a teammate Kobe is.


Well kobe can't yell if he's not doing any better....infact yelling won't do **** for this situation. Phil needs to forget about the offense and focus on defense only...I mean he has to go 03-04 Pistons on teams and don't give a **** about how the offense is playing. He needs to play Ariza Powell and Bynum as much as he can to help our defense


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

So, is there anyone that has a problem with Pau Gasol as the POTG tonight?


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> LOL at Mark Jackson saying Kobe should go KG on his team.
> 
> If Kobe does that it'll be how bad a teammate Kobe is.


If he did it he would be a hypocrite.

Whats he going to do? Call out someones defense? Or call out someones shot selection? He has to actually do this things good consistently to call out people out. This is the only time were I miss having a guy like Shaq. Shaq was good at getting the best out of Kobe, and vice versa.


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Basel said:


> So, is there anyone that has a problem with Pau Gasol as the POTG tonight?


Not at all. Gasol was great tonight. Even on the defensive end he played better than "normal". 

Bynum might have been in the mix, but he doesn't play in the fourth so..


----------



## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

And I'm tried of all this "we are playing for the playoff, not the season" bull****. You estabish strends at the beginning the season and follow through them throughout the entire season.


----------



## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> I must be good at it. I'm not the only one annoyed with Kobe lately. Try reading a news paper, or listening to Phil Jackson.


newspaper lol I can imagine how moses felt coming down the mountain now and seeing the heathens going crazy losing their faith in Moses.Despite all the miracles the followers lose faith quick. lol

I guess they need more miracles.


----------



## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

POTG Nash, for playing like crap and allowing us to steal one on our own home court.


----------



## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

Basel said:


> So, is there anyone that has a problem with Pau Gasol as the POTG tonight?


No problem. He is the only one that gives a **** on the team.

His D is not that good but he seems to know his role and follows through his role regardless.


----------



## Kekai (Jan 12, 2005)

Good game, guys.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

110 points.... To a team that is missing without a starting center... With only 9 people dressed out because of a trade that sent two players (one of them a starter) to a different team.. Nash had a horrible game, and was not into it at all... And yet they get 110 points.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> newspaper lol I can imagine how moses felt coming down the mountain now and seeing the heathens going crazy losing their faith in Moses.Despite all the miracles the followers lose faith quick. lol
> 
> I guess they need more miracles.


The brilliance of this post shows why you favored Kwame all those years.


----------



## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> If he did it he would be a hypocrite.
> 
> Whats he going to do? Call out someones defense? Or call out someones shot selection? He has to actually do this things good consistently to call out people out. This is the only time were I miss having a guy like Shaq. Shaq was good at getting the best out of Kobe, and vice versa.


lol

yeah right Kobe's earned the right to fuss at anyone on that damn team who hasn't done anything. 

Gasol won his 1st playoff game when he joined KOBE. and the rest of the team has no ability to speak on anything.

Kobe is struggling with some things. But he's the leader of the team because he's earned it. 

Kobe's problem isn't motivation he doesn't need a lazy Shaq for anything. 

he just needs to work out his struggles shooting and develop a game plan with teammates defensively.


----------



## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

Did Kobe even attempt a lay-up tonight?


----------



## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> The brilliance of this post shows why you favored Kwame all those years.


Get off that garbage, I favored Kwame for his defense over a stumbling Bynum at the time. Bynum and PJ admitted that Byunum went in the tank that season. so I guess PJ favored what i was saying.

I wasn't advocating Kwame ovber Bynum period but I can see why you gotta hold on to that point only argument you make that makes any sense. 

instead of the anti Kobe rants you get on.


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Kobe's shot chart for the night: 










Terrible.


----------



## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> 110 points.... To a team that is missing without a starting center... With only 9 people dressed out because of a trade that sent two players (one of them a starter) to a different team.. Nash had a horrible game, and was not into it at all... And yet they get 110 points.


Time for you to change your sig.

Celtics are going to rip our heads off and dunk it.


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

S2theONIC said:


> Did Kobe even attempt a lay-up tonight?


One time. Look at the shot chart.


----------



## nguyen_milan (Jun 28, 2005)

Recent games made me sick, really. I just dont see the defensive efforts out there and they are all like uninspired...
*&^%&% 
and Kobe, in this game I dont like his defense at all, **** the jump shots things or shot selection


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> Get off that garbage, I favored Kwame for his defense over a stumbling Bynum at the time. Bynum and PJ admitted that Byunum went in the tank that season. so I guess PJ favored what i was saying.
> 
> I wasn't advocating Kwame ovber Bynum period but *I can see why you gotta hold on to that point only argument you make that makes any sense.
> *
> instead of the anti Kobe rants you get on.


This coming from the guy who just compared Kobe to Mosses. :lol:

Kwame Browns defense was overrated. And the last few years so has Kobes. 

I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings, but it's the truth.


----------



## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

Basel said:


> One time. Look at the shot chart.


:sadbanana:


----------



## Shaolin (Aug 6, 2004)

They look like they need a collective laxative....


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Can't wait to see Plastic Man's rant about this game once he watches it...if he watches it...usually entertaining stuff. :biggrin:


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Basel said:


> Can't wait to see Plastic Man's rant about this game once he watches it...if he watches it...usually entertaining stuff. :biggrin:


I know. I missed him tonight. 

:boohoo2:

But I guess getting sleep is probably better than watching this garbage.


----------



## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> This coming from the guy who just compared Kobe to Mosses. :lol:
> 
> Kwame Browns defense was overrated. And the last few years so has Kobes.
> 
> I'm sorry if this hurts your feelings, but it's the truth.


lets see 1st team all defense voted by coaches who watch coaches tape break down every possesion and get detailed stats. 

But you KNOW better than them Okay lol


----------



## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

Yeah I would hate to have to wake up just to watch this puke.


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Any word yet on why Radmanovic didn't play? That's pretty interesting.


----------



## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

Basel said:


> Any word yet on why Radmanovic didn't play? That's pretty interesting.


Yeah Luke getting the start is weird. Maybe they are giving Luke more minutes to try and buil up his value for a trade, oh please yes!!!!


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> lets see 1st team all defense voted by coaches who watch coaches tape break down every possesion and get detailed stats.
> 
> But you KNOW better than them Okay lol


Kobe started off the season last year with stellar defense. After the break it went away. And in the finals was not good at all.

This season it's garbage for the majority of games. I can't help but not be happy, when home court is on the line. Do we really want Boston to get home court? Or even the Cavs? Every game matters, and his defense right now is something short of pathetic.

No one cares what he did last season.. No one cares what he did before. Unless you win a title it means NOTHING. Since Shaq let, we have had a missed playoffs, couple first round exits, and a finals appearance. But unless we win a title, it wont mean dick. Kobe needs to play defense every night, just like everyone else. 

I'm sorry man, I know your apart of the Kobe defense force. But your boy needs to step up and play like an elite again. He needs to go to the rack more. He needs to gamble on the steals less. He needs to take better shots. Lead by example.


----------



## Piolo_Pascual (Sep 13, 2006)

S2theONIC said:


> Yeah Luke getting the start is weird. Maybe they are giving Luke more minutes to try and buil up his value for a trade, oh please yes!!!!


i think luke played because daddy bill is doing the analysis at the espn studio.


----------



## Piolo_Pascual (Sep 13, 2006)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> *
> This season it's garbage for the majority of games. I can't help but not be happy, when home court is on the line. Do we really want Boston to get home court? Or even the Cavs? Every game matters, and his defense right now is something short of pathetic.
> 
> No one cares what he did last season.. No one cares what he did before. Unless you win a title it means NOTHING. Since Shaq let, we have had a missed playoffs, couple first round exits, and a finals appearance. But unless we win a title, it wont mean dick. Kobe needs to play defense every night, just like everyone else.
> ...



this is harsh but this is also the truth. a few months ago, kobe was mvp but looking now and in compariosn to his peers (wade and bron particularly) the gap is about 10 light years away.


----------



## ElMarroAfamado (Nov 1, 2005)

luke walton is horrible its amazing
and i think the lakers are just bored 
i mean up until the last what 5 games? they had been playing dominant just blowing people out ...
someone needs to tell them people are competitive and that not all teams are just going to fold and die


----------



## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> Kobe started off the season last year with stellar defense. After the break it went away. And in the finals was not good at all.
> 
> This season it's garbage for the majority of games. I can't help but not be happy, when home court is on the line. Do we really want Boston to get home court? Or even the Cavs? Every game matters, and his defense right now is something short of pathetic.
> 
> ...


No you twist everything in to somehow Kobe's fault you were part of that keep shaq at all cost klan Kobe is screwing us up posse. 

When did Kobe not hold up his end since Shaq left. 

The Lakers missed the playoffs once when Kobe missed a month and Butler and LO got hurt. 

He lost in the 1st rd to higher seeded teams both times so he didn't underachivee there and in the Finals they lost to the team with the best record in the league last season so stop making it seem somehow that Kobe lets us down. 

he messed up the 04 Finals granted they had homecourt and underachieved then and only then but Shaq was here then. 

Kobe the other night locked down Michael redd and his shot and defense has struggled the last 2 games but you give Kobe no quarter and has twisted every aspect of the current struggles to being Kobe's fault. 

You don;t see the bigs giving up a ton of points in the paint you don;t see them not blocking shots, you don;t see the bench slumping you don;t see that Fisher and Vlad and tonight Luke played dreadful defense you only see everything Kobe does as a screw up but keep silent when he plays well and take no joy in it. 

Kobe has been leading by example since Shaq left carrying Smush Parkers sorry *** to the playoffs on his back scoring 40 or more 27 times in a season and 50 8 times but its not enough for you. 

No one plays great defense every night its impossible, Kobe has been playing ball straight through the year and carried us to the Finals averaging 31 last seasons playoffs and being the hero of the Gold medal Olypic game. 

I have no doubts he'll pick it up he gets better as the season goes on. 

Kobe was all defense because the coaches KNOW better than you who calls out every instance where he gets beaten,

You having a mental Kobe breakdown and we've lost 3 times in 21 games LOL. 

I guess you expected us to be perfect. 

But I'll sit in the cut enjoying your silence when Kobe picks it up and performs his heroics once again. 

This is one argument I've been consistently winning Afobeism.

You ***** and moan in victory and defeat regardless finding some way to twist it into a Kobe argument about him screwing up. 

You actually watch games blaming him for everything that goes wrong you can't believe he's the source of all the struggles if you do you need help. :lol:


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Some post game quotes:

"That's what always happens when a team has eight players, nine players," Bryant said. "They always come out with a lot of energy. We did a good job down the stretch."

"Our record is great," Bynum said. "[But] the way we're playing, we're not going to beat the good teams."

Gasol agreed, saying: "We're not playing our best. Most of the time, I think we can do a lot better defensively. We're giving up a lot of points. We have to consciously every single game go out there and be focused on our defense. We know we can score. We also know that if we want to get to the next level, the championship level, we have to be consistent on our defense. It's something that we haven't been doing very well."

"We weren't playing our best when we started the game, but we eventually had to play," Jackson said. "Maybe not the best, but we had to play well enough to win."


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

A stat I found:

Pau Gasol scored a game-high 28 points in the Lakers' 115-110 win over the undermanned Suns. Since Gasol was traded to Los Angeles, the Lakers have won each of the eight games in which he was the team's leading scorer (4-0 last season and 4-0 this season, not to mention 1-0 during the 2008 playoffs).


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Post-game locker talk:


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Some more quotes:



> The Lakers also had a player who didn't step on the court: Vladimir Radmanovic.
> 
> After 20 consecutive starts, Radmanovic was benched in favor of Walton, who finished with eight points and six assists in 23 minutes. Radmanovic did not play at all as the team's new third-string small forward.
> 
> "We just need to get the ball moving, someone in there to pass the ball," Jackson said. "It keeps guys happy."





> Bryant endured another off night, scoring 18 points on six-for-16 shooting. He also committed five turnovers, prompting a reporter to ask if Jackson saw anything in Bryant's game that worried him.
> 
> "Not worrisome," Jackson said. "Maybe bothersome would be a better term, a minor drop down from worrisome."


http://www.latimes.com/sports/basketball/nba/lakers/la-sp-lakers11-2008dec11,0,35763.story


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> No you twist everything in to somehow Kobe's fault you were part of that keep shaq at all cost klan Kobe is screwing us up posse.
> 
> When did Kobe not hold up his end since Shaq left.
> 
> The Lakers missed the playoffs once when Kobe missed a month and Butler and LO got hurt.




I know reading isn't one of your strong quality's, but take a look at my posts about the Shaq trade then come back in here and talk. People who actually read other peoples posts and then respond know I was not only for Shaq getting the boot, but I defended Kobe the entire time the media slam campaign went on. As well as defended him during the rape trial.




> He lost in the 1st rd to higher seeded teams both times so he didn't underachivee there and in the Finals they lost to the team with the best record in the league last season so stop making it seem somehow that Kobe lets us down.
> 
> he messed up the 04 Finals granted they had homecourt and underachieved then and only then but Shaq was here then.
> 
> Kobe the other night locked down Michael redd and his shot and defense has struggled the last 2 games but you give Kobe no quarter and has twisted every aspect of the current struggles to being Kobe's fault.


When did I say it was all Kobes fault? My point with mentioning our history post Shaq is in reference to him forging his own legacy. His legacy with Shaq is exactly that.. A legacy with Shaq in which Shaq was the clear leader of this team. Since Shaq left, he has been out to create his own glory. And my point was, no one will care about the cards he's dealt, how hards its been.. That in the end.. 20 years from now either he will have won the rings, or he didn't. No one is going to give a crap about the rest. That was my point. Try to keep your sensitivity in check, it wasn't a blame on him. 



> You don;t see the bigs giving up a ton of points in the paint you don;t see them not blocking shots, you don;t see the bench slumping you don;t see that Fisher and Vlad and tonight Luke played dreadful defense you only see everything Kobe does as a screw up but keep silent when he plays well and take no joy in it.


I've called out Vlad plenty of times, as well as Luke. Ask Danny, I'm one of the biggest Luke bashers on the planet. However, them sucking on defense isn't a surprise to me. They always have.. Probably always will. But Kobe? I expect Kobe to play big every night that ends on Y.. Or at least the majority of the time.. He is this teams leader and superstar after all. 



> Kobe has been leading by example since Shaq left carrying Smush Parkers sorry *** to the playoffs on his back scoring 40 or more 27 times in a season and 50 8 times but its not enough for you.


He did a great job. But again, I'm not cheering for a varsity basketball team.. This is the Lakers.. It's about the rings. We don't have up scoring banners, we don't hang up banners for first round appearances with scrubs. 




> I have no doubts he'll pick it up he gets better as the season goes on.
> 
> Kobe was all defense because the coaches KNOW better than you who calls out every instance where he gets beaten,
> 
> You having a mental Kobe breakdown and we've lost 3 times in 21 games LOL.


I have no doubt he will pick up his scoring as the season progresses. However, it's the defense I worry about. 



> I guess you expected us to be perfect.
> 
> But I'll sit in the cut enjoying your silence when Kobe picks it up and performs his heroics once again.
> 
> This is one argument I've been consistently winning Afobeism.


Again, try keeping the dabte with me. No reason to drag someone into the mud that isn't here to defend themselves. 

As for your post, I expect elite defense. Lebron wishes he had the type of supporting cast that Kobe has.. Yet they are getting it done on the defensive end and Lebron has grown leaps and bounds over the last few years defensively.

I'm starting to worry about your sheer love for Kobe. I know this board has seen it's fair share of Kobe fans.. Shaq Fans.. Hell we even got a resident Lamar fan... But most of those guys have been able to admit when Kobe has been off.. And lately he has been off.. Way off..

I've always been fascinated with people who think because you criticize something you hate it. That's like when people say America isn't perfect and has areas to work on, its then anti-American. Yes, because I expect more from Kobe I hate him.. So sad...


----------



## Plastic Man (Nov 8, 2004)

Basel said:


> Can't wait to see Plastic Man's rant about this game once he watches it...if he watches it...usually entertaining stuff. :biggrin:


I won't even bother. No use in ruining a perfectly good keyboard by writing about these pathetic efforts lately. 



CDRacingZX6R said:


> I know. I missed him tonight.
> 
> But I guess getting sleep is probably better than watching this garbage.


Yeah, I can't get myself to wake up for these 10:30 (4:30 AM here) games anymore. At least I'm not a complete zombie when I watch the 1 or 2 AM ones. Can't say I'm sorry I missed the game judging by this thread, the recaps, videos and other stuff I've watched in the past 30 minutes or so. What the F is going on with this team. Is everyone head stuck up their *** or what?!

Kobe is struggling mightily out there, I just hope he's not hurt or something. Or tired from playing non stop basketball since last November. The only thing we need out there to go with our pathetic defense is our best player playing like a lesser version of Ray ****ing Allen.:azdaja:


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Plastic Man said:


> I won't even bother. No use in ruining a perfectly good keyboard by writing about these pathetic efforts lately.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Be careful.. Your going to invoke Jazzy1 to start calling you Afobisme with all your Kobe "hatin". :lol:


----------



## Plastic Man (Nov 8, 2004)

^^Nah, I think we all know that Kobe's not being himself for the past few games. No shame in admitting that he's not playing like we're used to. He's my favourite player by far and all but I'll call him out when he deserves it. And he is very deserving currently.

I'm sure he'll snap out of it though and it wouldn't hurt if the rest of the team (minus Gasol, who's been great) could do the same. What's going on with Farmar, Ariza. Vujacic apparently found his stroke and now those two are MIA. Why is Radman not playing, what the **** is Walton starting. Just some seriously mysterious stuff surrounding this team and I can't say I'm liking it. The scary thing is we could've just as easily been 20-1 (I don't think we had a chance to beat Detroit now) right now... imagine that. 20-1 with the last 10 games being played like they don't even care. No wonder they're in cruise control; I hate to say it but I think a 3, 4 game losing streak might set their heads straight. It would probably cost us the chance for HCA in the Finals, but better to crush their dream of being this invincible team that can win just by showing up now than in June, when we're losing by 40 against an EC team again... as I've said before, I honestly don't think I could take another Finals beating.


----------



## DANNY (Aug 9, 2005)

kobe needs to play within the offense. he's always hanging around the perimeter looking for the bigs to pass him the ball back so they can give him a pick. just make the necessary cut and let pau find him on the backdoor. kobe sucks kobe bad


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## sylaw (Nov 7, 2002)

It's good that we won but 110 points to a undermanned Suns team at home? I'm not exactly thrilled. The defense is still missing and we decide to throw Walton in as a starter. That totally doesn't make any sense at all. Phil must be back on his mancrush of Luke.


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

Did you guys see the RIDICULOUS flop by Amare Stoudemire last night?! I missed it but just noticed it right now:


----------



## sylaw (Nov 7, 2002)

I saw that last night as well. At least his acting is better than his defense.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

Basel said:


> Did you guys see the RIDICULOUS flop by Amare Stoudemire last night?! I missed it but just noticed it right now:


I saw it last night and laughed. It was a rather pathetic moment for the Suns.


----------



## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> I know reading isn't one of your strong quality's, but take a look at my posts about the Shaq trade then come back in here and talk. People who actually read other peoples posts and then respond know I was not only for Shaq getting the boot, but I defended Kobe the entire time the media slam campaign went on. As well as defended him during the rape trial.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


reading not one of my strong qualittes reading comprehension isn't one of yours obviously or you would stop mis-interpreting my takes on kwame or you'd actually get what I was saying then backed up by Phil Jackson.

Kobe's legacy is gonna be judged by his whole career its not gonna be glossed over by the Kobe haters like yourself into 2 different caterogires I never saw Magic's divided up that way or Kareem's divided up that way actual knowledgeable people about the league are gonna look at his whole career and judge that way. If he gets MORE rings it will enhance his already great career if he doesn't he'll still be viewed as one of the alltime greats on both ends of the floor. This grading on the curve by the Haters because of Shaq is ridiculous.I mean had I not watched it you would have thought Shaq carried Kobe on his back all those years. When that was far from the truth. 

Your mention of the post Shaq era was your attempt at judging the time period after Shaq as a disappointmemt but when you got called on it then you tried switching it up nice try. 

You worried about my love for Kobe :lol: get a grip you the one dragged Kobe into a post about Bynum and went about bludgeoning the man's game when no one else in the thread mentioned Kobe 1st. 

I think you are delusioned in your takes about him you reach to rip him. I have ripped Kobe plenty here go look through the Suns thread look back through the Shaq and Kobe feud threads I have taken him to task often but I respect his legend and call it like I see it. I've talked about his struggles recently here and in other thread. 

And mentioned how I believed he would pick it up but YOU are so CERTAIN he's lost a step how did some struggling jump to that wild eyed conclusion. You hate that but* Won't own* it I own the fact I'm a Lakers fan 1st Kobe fan second. But you won't own your bias which makes you deceptive. 

Lebron has just about the same level of talent Lebron has 3 bigs who are much better defenders than our trio of Bigs Big Z, Wallace and Varejao. Mo Williams is better than anyone playing point guard for us and the shooters around the edge are just as good or better than ours. 

Where's the big edge Big Z and Gasol are both 1 time allstars. Gasol is better on offense but Z is just as big a presence on the court defensively clogging the lane and playing physically.

you speak of the value of defense you sure have to nullify any of our Ofensive edge with the grit their bigs play defense with unles you are just flapping your gums about defense. 

I would expect Lebron to grow as a player he's 23 Kobe is done growing or developing as a player. he is a finished product. 

again he's played in the finals, the olympics, coming off 1st team all nba o and defense and MVP. Maybe he's tired some.

You go out of your way to point out Kobe got raped by Hill Kobe this Kobe that. Thats your deal fine. who cares. But own the things you say and stop faking objectivity because again didn't see you chirping about Kobe when he locked down Redd. 

stay consistent with it. 

we don't agree you are clouded and thats fine. 

Afobism I was making a joke about he's cool with me I ain't dragging him anywhere. 

I can spank you without ever bringing his name up. lol

we don't get along so we can continue to get it on.But I'll be clocking your Kobe jocking once we get the ring. I'll be taking notes. lol

It ain't that serious just a friendly blood feud. I played hoops had a couple 10 days in the league went to camp a few times with a few teams played overseas and in college. I'm just competitive don't take it personal you seem edgy. 

its just in fun.


----------



## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> reading not one of my strong qualittes reading comprehension isn't one of yours obviously or you would stop mis-interpreting my takes on kwame or you'd actually get what I was saying then backed up by Phil Jackson.
> 
> Kobe's legacy is gonna be judged by his whole career its not gonna be glossed over by the Kobe haters like yourself into 2 different caterogires I never saw Magic's divided up that way or Kareem's divided up that way actual knowledgeable people about the league are gonna look at his whole career and judge that way. If he gets MORE rings it will enhance his already great career if he doesn't he'll still be viewed as one of the alltime greats on both ends of the floor. This grading on the curve by the Haters because of Shaq is ridiculous.I mean had I not watched it you would have thought Shaq carried Kobe on his back all those years. When that was far from the truth.


Just being honest man. You called me out saying I was riding Shaq's jock during the trade fiasco. But since the reality is that I backed Kobe completely during it.. I assume that you either have poor reading ability.. Or you simply don't read at all. If I'm wrong, and you somehow missed the endless debates with trolls the year after the trades.. I'm sorry.. But you still haven't pulled any quotes or bumped any threads were I said Kobe was at fault for Shaq's departure.. Or that I wanted Shaq over Kobe, or any of the like. 

As for rather or not Kobe helped out.. I'd say the first two years it was more about Shaq than Kobe. The third year was the year I feel it was more about Kobe than Shaq. ******* or not, Shaq was one of the most dominant forces in the paint the NBA has ever seen. It's very easy to be a guard when you got a prime Shaq in the paint. 



> Your mention of the post Shaq era was your attempt at judging the time period after Shaq as a disappointmemt but when you got called on it then you tried switching it up nice try.
> 
> You worried about my love for Kobe :lol: get a grip you the one dragged Kobe into a post about Bynum and went about bludgeoning the man's game when no one else in the thread mentioned Kobe 1st.
> 
> I think you are delusioned in your takes about him you reach to rip him. I have ripped Kobe plenty here go look through the Suns thread look back through the Shaq and Kobe feud threads I have taken him to task often but I respect his legend and call it like I see it. I've talked about his struggles recently here and in other thread.


It's just concern. The irony here is my friends in real life think I'm a Kobe fan boy. But on this forum, and in real life I have always called his faults like I saw them. Kobe has a high standard to live up to, when I feel he isn't reaching it I have no problems saying so. Last night he went to the rack what 3 times the entire game? That's unacceptable. Add to the fact he constantly roams defensively, and his man is left open, it annoys me. 

You look at someone who is perfect.. I look at someone that is capible of being more than he has been so far this season. I'm sorry that you can't be objective about your favorite player, but many people here have been lately. There is always hope for you in the future. eace:



> And mentioned how I believed he would pick it up but YOU are so CERTAIN he's lost a step how did some struggling jump to that wild eyed conclusion. You hate that but* Won't own* it I own the fact I'm a Lakers fan 1st Kobe fan second. But you won't own your bias which makes you deceptive.
> 
> Lebron has just about the same level of talent Lebron has 3 bigs who are much better defenders than our trio of Bigs Big Z, Wallace and Varejao. Mo Williams is better than anyone playing point guard for us and the shooters around the edge are just as good or better than ours.


Lebrosn's team is good.. But Lakers good.. Please. Wallace is old, and can't score to save his life most nights. His defense has gone down a great deal since his Detroit days.. He rarely gets play time in the fourth quarters of games because of his free throw liability. 

Big Z on the level of Bynum or Gasol.. :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Only point you got is Mo Williams. But seriously, overall Lakers are much deeper.. And far more talented than the Cavs. Be serious man. 




> you speak of the value of defense you sure have to nullify any of our Ofensive edge with the grit their bigs play defense with unles you are just flapping your gums about defense.
> 
> I would expect Lebron to grow as a player he's 23 Kobe is done growing or developing as a player. he is a finished product.
> 
> ...


Defense isn't a hard thing for a team to work on. The Cavs have a coach who is very defensive minded. It's paid off for them because they are now one of the top defensive teams in the league.. Far above the Lakers in that regard. Do I think its because the Cavs have more talented players? No. 

They spent the off season practicing defense, and every practice durning the season working more on defense. Lakers practiced defense in the off season, and are having their first defensive minded practice today... This is not Kobes fault, or anyone else... In that regard I blame Phil. Phil has never been into defensive practices.. And that's a mistake that we will have to work on. 



> I can spank you without ever bringing his name up. lol
> 
> we don't get along so we can continue to get it on.But I'll be clocking your Kobe jocking once we get the ring. I'll be taking notes. lol
> 
> ...


:lol:

Spank me? With what? Your rambling of sentences that offer no statical data or back up other than "This is how it is cause Jazzy1 says so?". You can't even respond to your own accusations half the time.. Give me a break.. :laugh:

As for edgy? Blood fued? This is the internet... I enjoy a spirited debate.. But if you think in real life I take anything you say with me... I enjoy reading your posts and responding to them.. Especially when they are blatantly homer like... 

Your one of the few Kobe first fans here.. So there's really no one else to debate with.. It's not like I picked you out because I dislike you. I just disagree with practically everything you say.eace:


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> .. :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


 sometimes the best response to foolishness is
This


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

The One said:


> sometimes the best response to foolishness is
> This


Haha, I'll keep that in mind next time.. It sums up my feelings nicely.


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

That was after Billy used, "The Puppy Who Lost His Way" as an analogy for the Industrial Revolution. :lol:


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## elcap15 (Aug 8, 2006)

This was an ugly game, at least on defense.

Kobe played the worst defense Ive seen from him in a long time. Years. He got burned so many times I cant count. Since he was constantly no where near his man, he made other people look worse than they played, namely Luke.

Luke starting was a shock. I think he played pretty damn well. He is the best player on our team at entry passing. So what happened, Pau and Bynum had great nights on offense because Luke ws giving them the ball. Vlad needs to take lessons. As soon as the Suns realizes that Luke cant shoot, he was marginalized a little.

The retun of the Machine was nice. He shot well but most importantly, he took good shots within the offense. I also think his defense will go unnoticed. When Sasha was in, Barbosa/Barnes werent getting the same kind of looks as when they were being guarded by Kobe. Kobe really had a bad defensive game.

How about that Pau! Damn that guy is good. He and Bynum need to get touches like this on a regular basis.


All in all, this was a tale of one side of the court. Offensively, I think Lakers played one of the better games (at least smarter games) so far this year. Defensively, it was a mess, and some very major issues need to be addressed.


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

CDRacingZX6R said:


> Just being honest man. You called me out saying I was riding Shaq's jock during the trade fiasco. But since the reality is that I backed Kobe completely during it.. I assume that you either have poor reading ability.. Or you simply don't read at all. If I'm wrong, and you somehow missed the endless debates with trolls the year after the trades.. I'm sorry.. But you still haven't pulled any quotes or bumped any threads were I said Kobe was at fault for Shaq's departure.. Or that I wanted Shaq over Kobe, or any of the like.
> 
> As for rather or not Kobe helped out.. I'd say the first two years it was more about Shaq than Kobe. The third year was the year I feel it was more about Kobe than Shaq. ******* or not, Shaq was one of the most dominant forces in the paint the NBA has ever seen. It's very easy to be a guard when you got a prime Shaq in the paint.again the bias its easy to be a guard when you have a prime Shaq down in the paint funny how penny got no rings when he was 1st team all nba playing with Shaq funny as well that Kobe could average 30 lead the team in scoring but its so easy being the top defensive guard in the league and average 30 simply because Shazaam is in the paint lol piece of cake anyone can do it I guess
> 
> ...


:lol::lol:


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

jazzy1 said:


> :lol::lol:


You write so much, yet say so little. I love reading your posts. 

:basel:


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

elcap15 said:


> This was an ugly game, at least on defense.
> 
> Kobe played the worst defense Ive seen from him in a long time. Years. He got burned so many times I cant count. Since he was constantly no where near his man, he made other people look worse than they played, namely Luke.
> 
> ...



Sums up my feelings nicely Elcap.


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