# OT: Kobe leaving? staying? moving? holding off?



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

Ric Bucher is reporting Kobe wants Jerry West or will to be traded.

LA Times is reportsing that "Bryant clearly stated Saturday that he had not asked for a trade. But those little bombs have finally backed the Lakers into a corner out of which the only exit is to trade him."

What a ****ing baby. Sorry. He *****ed at the end of the season. I am sure the Lakers heard it. Deals almost never get done at this point in the playoffs. So much for "my team". Lame.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

ESPN link:


> Bryant told ESPN The Magazine's Ric Bucher that he wants the Lakers to bring West back to the organization and give him full authority. If the Lakers don't want to do that, Bryant said he wants to be traded.


----------



## knickstorm (Jun 22, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

better than staying quiet like KG and wasting the prime of your career surrounded in mediocrity


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Except for one important thing - Kobe had a winning team, and complained about that too.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

wally, gerald and the number 5 for kobe??? lol...he may be a whiner but hes still a great player id like to see him and paul playing side by side with a formitable post player like Al down low


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

The Lakers will not trade him. It would ruin the franchise.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

He's is backing them in a corner. We'll see who blinks. Maybe they actually will hire West - although, would West want to go back to LA?


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

West is nearly senile and he doesn't get along with Phil Jackson, but Buss is going to offer West a lot of money to manage the Lakers.

You, sir, are a hater of anything associated with the Lakers. Now, that is understandable since you are a Celtics fan, but let's try to be objective.


----------



## BostonBasketball (Jan 10, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Pierce and #5 for Kobe and #19? I'd seriously consider that.


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

The idea is to add Bryant to Pierce & Jefferson, not make a marginal upgrade on Pierce. People need to forget about player's absolute worth and realise the realities of the free market. There are going to be _a lot_ of players on the market this summer. LA won't get anything like "fair" value for Bryant. Prior to the summer trade season I don't think I'd go higher than Green, Rondo, #5, & filler (either Wally or Theo).


----------



## BackwoodsBum (Jul 2, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



BostonBasketball said:


> Pierce and #5 for Kobe and #19? I'd seriously consider that.


As much as I dislike Kobe I'd probably go for this too. No way would LA consider giving us Kobe for any package that didn't include Pierce and honestly there wouldn't be any way for them to co-exist on the same team anyway IMHO. 

Another trade scenario that I wouldn't mind see would be Kobe and Odom for Pierce, Wally, and the #5. That would give the C's a starting backcourt of Rondo and Kobe, and a front line of Jefferson, Odom, and Gomes. The C's upgrade at two positions while losing the albatross that is Wally. Odom is not really a favorite in LA even though I think he has done a good job since being there so I don't think he would be a deal breaker from the LA point of view. Essentially the Lakers get Pierce (a hometown boy who would probably welcome a trade to LA) for Kobe and the #5 pick for Odom with Wally being thrown in for cap purposes.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Prem, true I do not like the Lakers or Kobe, but not true that I am a hater of all things related to the Lakers - although I get recently, why it might seem that way. But I have respected many things Laker in the past - Magic, Kareem, Worthy...


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

- Ray Allen (October 14, 2004):




> "If Kobe doesn't see he needs two and a half good players to be a legitimate playoff contender or win a championship in about a year or two he'll be calling out to Jerry Buss that 'We need some help in here,' or 'Trade me,' " Allen said. "And we'll all be saying, 'I told you so,' when he says that."


----------



## MicCheck12 (Aug 12, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Jefferson,Pierce, and the number 7 for Bryant


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



BostonBasketball said:


> Pierce and #5 for Kobe and #19? I'd seriously consider that.


What does that exactly do for us?

Kobe's a great player, one of the most talented players in basketball, but it's not like Pierce is not a great player, too.

And plus, in the end, unless Kobe teaches Doc, Al and the others how to play defense this team will improve by just a few games if the Celtics had Pierce and Jefferson together for a whole season.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



MicCheck12 said:


> Jefferson,Pierce, and the number 7 for Bryant


That's more of what I was thinking the Lakers would want from the Celtics...

Although we don't have the 7th pick.


----------



## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Before you all hate on Kobe...he never demanded a trade if they don't get West. Bucher is just a moron and is trying to create rumors for ESPN.



> "My feeling on Jerry West is I trust him completely," Bryant said. "I don't want to get into people believing me to be bashing anybody. Mitch is a great guy. All I can go by is what has happened with this team the last two years, and I know Jerry West is a guy who's great at what he does.
> 
> "He wants to win and he wants to win right now. I can roll with that, even if we don't have the complete turnaround we're hoping to have this summer. Just having him back in the nucleus will help."
> 
> *"I would love for him to be a part of this," Bryant said. "But it's not something where I demand he comes here. All I can do is offer my thoughts. I love being a Laker. I want to retire a Laker. I want to fix this thing, or at least help any way I can."*


http://www.latimes.com/sports/basketball/nba/lakers/la-sp-lakers28may28,1,3711739.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-nba-lakers


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

That's spin control by Bryant, Basel. And actually if you read this thread there's little hating on Kobe (although admittedly I think he's a piece of ****) - most posts in here are on the possibility of trading for him.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



MicCheck12 said:


> Jefferson,Pierce, and the number 7 for Bryant



entirely too much...if hes demanding a trade then his stock drops ridiculously...see: vince carter being traded for eric williams


----------



## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

I can't stand Kobe, absolutely despise him, but I would give up Paul for him sadly but not Paul AND Al. Al is a franchise guy, Paul is a franchise guy........Kobe is a franchise guy....one franchise guy demands a trade the team does not get 2 franchise guys back including one who's only 22 years old.


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Neither Pierce nor Jefferson are franchise guys, in my opinion. You cannot build championship teams with Jefferson as the main guy or Pierce as the main guy.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Nor can you, obviously, with Kobe. Unless of course you have Shaq.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



Premier said:


> Neither Pierce nor Jefferson are franchise guys, in my opinion. You cannot build championship teams with Jefferson as the main guy or Pierce as the main guy.




in the case of pierce, yes you can...unless your prez of basketball operations is a moron named danny ainge


----------



## whiterhino (Jun 15, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



Premier said:


> Neither Pierce nor Jefferson are franchise guys, in my opinion. You cannot build championship teams with Jefferson as the main guy or Pierce as the main guy.



I disagree, the key here is build a "TEAM", Detroit has had much success and they don't have SUPERSTARS either....Al & Paul are very nice peices with the right people around them. Al is just starting to show what he will be as well so saying he's not what you build championship teams around after only his 2nd healthy season is premature for sure.


----------



## BostonBasketball (Jan 10, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Kobe now demanding a trade?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2886927


----------



## LX (Oct 14, 2004)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Gerald, #5, and Ratliff for Kobe? 

Too much? Not enough?


----------



## silverpaw1786 (Mar 11, 2004)

*Kobe*

I'm sure some will think we shouldn't trade for him, while others will agree with me that we should offer everyone on the roster except for PP.

My trade proposal for the lakers would be:

We trade:
Ratliff
Szerbiak
Gerald Green
#5
Delonte West
Tony Allen

We receive:
Kobe
Vlad Radmonovich (and his horrible horrible contract)
Brian Cook
A future protected #1


----------



## DaBosox (Apr 10, 2007)

*Re: Kobe*

Any trade with LA almost necessitates Pierce going from us. Although a combo of Pierce and Kobe on the wings would be an offensive festival, it's absolutely unlikely that they would consider trading a top 3 player for anything but another superstar.

Although it would be fun to watch kobe steal the ball from Pierce to get shots.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



BostonBasketball said:


> Kobe now demanding a trade?
> 
> http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2886927


He is. This is done, I do not see what LA can do at this point except trade him. As much as i dislike Kobe and the Lakers, hard to imagine him playing anywhere else.


----------



## BostonBasketball (Jan 10, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



LX said:


> Gerald, #5, and Ratliff for Kobe?
> 
> Too much? Not enough?



Salaries don't match and I can't see the Lakers doing that. We'd need to give up more. Only way to make the salaries match is to have both Wally and Theo in the deal. And then you'd probably need to sweeten the deal for them to take Wally. Maybe a future 1st round pick (Minny's?/ours lottery protected). 

I would think though that if the Lakers trade Kobe (aka going into full rebuilding mode) that we'd need to take on Radmonovich's contract as well.

Maybe something like 

Green
Ratliff
Wally
#5
Future #1

for

Kobe
Radmonovich

I'd thrown in 1 of the following players too if needed: Telfair (please?), Perk, West, Gomes or Allen.

Would the Lakers do that? Seems like the best they're gonna get to me. They'll probably demand Jefferson though.

edit: I don't think anyone can be traded until after the finals no?


----------



## LX (Oct 14, 2004)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



BostonBasketball said:


> Salaries don't match and I can't see the Lakers doing that. We'd need to give up more. Only way to make the salaries match is to have both Wally and Theo in the deal. And then you'd probably need to sweeten the deal for them to take Wally. Maybe a future 1st round pick (Minny's?/ours lottery protected).
> 
> I would think though that if the Lakers trade Kobe (aka going into full rebuilding mode) that we'd need to take on Radmonovich's contract as well.
> 
> ...


Not Gomes. 

Everyone else is fine. 

I doubt they'd want Wally though.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



BostonBasketball said:


> edit: I don't think anyone can be traded until after the finals no?


correct.


----------



## DWest Superstar (Jun 30, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



Causeway said:


> correct.


Wasn't Rafael Araujo traded during the playoffs?


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*



LX said:


> Not Gomes.
> 
> Everyone else is fine.
> 
> I doubt they'd want Wally though.


They can have Gomes. 6'7" power forwards just aren't that hard to find.


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

*Re: Kobe*



DaBosox said:


> Any trade with LA almost necessitates Pierce going from us. Although a combo of Pierce and Kobe on the wings would be an offensive festival, it's absolutely unlikely that they would consider trading a top 3 player for anything but another superstar.
> 
> Although it would be fun to watch kobe steal the ball from Pierce to get shots.


Bryant's gone Carter on them, they don't have a lot of options. They'll have to take what they can get for him. I would personally sacrifice defenseless puppies to Satan to add him to Pierce & Jefferson.


----------



## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Re: Kobe*

Let me preface this by saying that I think Kobe is a cancer and not a leader.

The Lakers would be best served trying to trade for the highest bidder, and Dallas would be a team to me that could offer a package of younger players (Josh Howard, Devin Harris, expiring contracts, picks) that could entice the Lakers. But you gotta think they'll deal him East.

So, who out East, would put up with Kobe's b.s.?

New York and Charlotte come to mind.

But Munro, your point is well taken. I would not include Pierce or Jefferson.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: Kobe*



Truth34 said:


> Let me preface this by saying that I think Kobe is a cancer and not a leader.


agreed.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: Kobe*



Truth34 said:


> Let me preface this by saying that I think Kobe is a cancer and not a leader.




...yet anyone here would give up their first born if we could add him to pierce and jefferson...cancer or not hes the best in the game...and a cancer with 3 rings isnt too shabby


----------



## narrator (Feb 11, 2006)

*Re: Kobe*

Wouldn't any trade for Bryant mean the Celts HAVE to deal Pierce and Jefferson/Green? Remember, all the Lakers really have to do to make him feel better is fire the moron to leaked the "Kobe demanded Shaq" line to the LA Times.

In any event, I'm pretty sure Bryant's not going to be traded. Though it is fun to speculate about... :biggrin:


----------



## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Re: Kobe*

Or they could fire Phil Jackson. After all, he was in the exit interview with Kobe in '04 when Kobe said that he was "sick of being a sidekick," essentially intimating he would explore free agency if Shaq wasn't dealt. He put that in his book, "The Last Season."

You think Kobe didn't orchestrate the deal? What planet are you living on?

Kobe has lied to everyone in his life...and he lies to the media every day. The Lakers should do themselves a favor and jettison him as soon as possible...just not to us, please.


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Kobe was just on a radio show in LA - saying he now does not want to be traded, that Phil calmed him down. Kobe sounded like he was going to cry. Who knows how this absolutely ridiculous drama will all get played out. Should be a "Lifetime" series.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: Kobe*



narrator said:


> Wouldn't any trade for Bryant mean the Celts HAVE to deal Pierce and Jefferson/Green? Remember, all the Lakers really have to do to make him feel better is fire the moron to leaked the "Kobe demanded Shaq" line to the LA Times.
> 
> In any event, I'm pretty sure Bryant's not going to be traded. Though it is fun to speculate about... :biggrin:



again...vince carter was traded for eric williams...when a star demands a trade and makes it public they dont want to be where they are their team will get pennies to the dollar for them...kobe will not be traded for a star...he'll be traded for expirings, young players and draft picks


----------



## Causeway (May 18, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Simmons: Seven trade possibilities for Kobe



> *Deal No. 5: Boston trades Theo Ratliff (expires in 2008), Al Jefferson, Gerald Green, the No. 5 pick and their rights to Minny's future No. 1 for Kobe.*
> 
> 
> Comments: A more logical trade (Kobe for Paul Pierce and the No. 5 pick) doesn't work because Kobe would never agree to lead another youth movement. So could a Jefferson-Green-picks package work? I like the thought of Kobe and Pierce joining forces in a crummy conference, and it's hard to imagine the Lakers doing better in terms of potential cap space, premium picks and players with UPPPPPPPPPPPPPside (in my opinion, Jefferson is the best low-post scorer in the league under 24). Still, it's hard to imagine the Los Angeles Lakers trading their franchise player to the Boston Celtics. I just can't see it. It's too weird. Also, I think my dad's head would explode.


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

if we could give up delonte instead of Al, i think thats plenty and it would make sense since LA needs a pg and delonte is miles ahead of smush parker...id be drooling to see rajon, kobe, paul, gomes, Al...in the east...omg...


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Simmons is giving up too much in that trade. Normally, I would try to be realistic, but looking at the trade market, you have multiple superstars available. Kevin Garnett, Pau Gasol, Jermaine O'Neal, and now Kobe Bryant may be on the move this offseason. The market is saturated. It is a buyer's market and the Lakers cannot expect a massive bidding war when teams have other alternatives. The Celtics will not likely trade for Kobe, but this is good news for the Celtics in any possible acquisition for Garnett, Gasol, O'Neal, etc.

In terms of salary, Kobe makes 19.490625M in '07-'08, though he is marketing gold. This is without his trade kicker. His trade kicker can be 15% of the remaining value of his 138.20625M extension or 13.2890625M. This would be allocated over his two non-ETO contract years, so his future team would add 6.64453125M to his salary the following two seasons. However, trade bonuses can never exceed the maximum contract. I am not familiar enough with the CBA to know what to do with this follwing situation, since Kobe cannot make 25M and 28M these next two seasons, but I think his trade kicker may not be an issue. Kobe has the right to waive his trade kicker.

Using Ratliff as a basis for negotiation, the Celtics would have to trade at least 3.825833M in salary. This means that the Celtics can trade a combination of Jefferson or Telfair along with either West, Allen, or Rondo.

I would offer Ratliff, Jefferson, West, the thirty-second selection, and Boston's '08 first-round selection [top ten protection] for Bryant and continue negotiating from there.


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: Kobe*



Truth34 said:


> You think Kobe didn't orchestrate the deal? What planet are you living on?


According to direct quotes made by Kobe and Shaq in the past three days, Jerry Buss independently decided on moving Shaq, but it's very possible that you are more familiar with the drama behind that trade than a person with intimate details of the trade, like Shaq.


----------



## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

*Re: Kobe*

Shaq already conceded to the fact that Kobe didn't force him out. Move on to another dead horse. And no that proposal. Awful awful awful. How can you suggest that Kobe has gone VC on the Lakers when Carter tanked 2+ seasons? Having said that, a Pierce/Kobe tandem would be nasty. Put a bunch of scrubs around them in the East and you have yourselves a contender(to reach the conference Finals).


----------



## #1AntoineWalkerFan (Mar 10, 2005)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

i would agree with prems offer yet i would rather give up green than jefferson even if it meant giving up green and the number 5...i dont see LA accepting anything that doesnt include the number 5


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

A more realistic proposal would have the Celtics trading for Radmanovic and taking on his contract. Depending on Kobe's trade kicker, the Celtics could legally propse Bryant, Radmanovic for Ratliff, Telfair, Jefferson, West, Green, #32, and an '08 first.

If the Celtics can manage to keep the fifth selection, since there is no way that they do not demand Jefferson to pair with Bynum, Horford would be ideal.


----------



## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: OT: Kobe still whining - asking for a trade?*

Chicago is going to look nasty next season with Kobe.

Kobe threads have been merged. There's enough love/hate in one thread. 

-aqua.


----------



## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

Dear Danny,

please get us Gasol

Kind regards,

Celtic fans.


----------



## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

Aqua, I am with you. Let's use the #5 and Ratliff, and get creative and try to get Gasol.

Memphis would have picks 4 and 5 in a decent draft.

As for the other issue, of course Shaq is going to take another opportunity to take a shot at Buss after the way he was disrespected, but you didn't READ WHAT I WROTE. READ PHIL'S BOOK; HE WAS THERE when Kobe made the thinly veiled demand.

Does anybody believe what this guys says?

LOL

I also like the "buyer's market" comment. I doubt many teams will sell the farm for the most selfish, petulant player in the league, but if it lessens the price for a KG or a Pau, then this is a good thing.

My guess...Kobe plays '08 in LA...but he probably won't retire in LA.


----------

