# Jay Williams playing at Pre-Draft Camp!



## BealeFarange (May 22, 2004)

I feel like if he comes back, we should get SOMETHING out of it, no? 

ESPN Insider Chad Ford reports:

http://insider.espn.go.com/insider/magazine/magBlog?id=2039748



> Jay Williams on the comeback trail
> 
> NBA teams, take note.
> The surprise at ATTACK Athletics on Monday was former Bulls point guard Jay Williams. He held his own against two of the fastest guys in the draft, Raymond Felton and Dee Brown. His shot is better than ever. He's cutting and jumping. He went full steam for an entire hour with Felton and Brown and looked just fine.
> ...


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## FreeSpeech101 (Jul 30, 2004)

If we can't sign Duhon, I'm sure Paxson will give him a call.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

Unless we could sign him, and trade him, BYC status and all, then no, we son;t get anything out of his comeback. Unless he is so spectacular that we sign him and keep him and get rid of Kirk (unlikely, but possible) or get rid of Ben (highly unlikely).

No, Bulls fans, wish Jay best of luck and put him out of your mind.

Just MHO. 

But that is a good point -- it is a bargaining chip in the re-signing of Duhon.


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## BealeFarange (May 22, 2004)

I know we're not entitled legally to anything for Jay if he comes back, but it just seems so unfair that he can be injured like that and come back while he'd still be under our rookie contract. That and a couple of bucks will get you a cookie, I know, but it still seems unfair...but so does Eddy's situation...and the fact that I don't look like Tom Cruise...and...

:sigh:


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

The Bulls had the option of having faith in Jay, paying him his full amount, and then reaping the rewards. The joy I have that Jay has regained his first step is being overshadowed by feelings toward the franchise. This is a dark, dark, day.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Paxson is a phsycho if he doesn't sign this guy. If he is able to ball with lottery picks, he could be like having a lottery pick this year by signing him. The guy is still young. Sign him. If we have a handshake deal with him, what would it cost to sign him, 3-4 million. He is a great player, so if we get him, and Duhon back, then I can go into next year confident. No room for Jay there??? We have 4 guys, 96 minutes to distribute, and an average of 24 minutes for each of them. Imagine these 4, 4 fresh guards to go up anytime. Pargo is alright, but he isn't the quality of Jay. Sign Jay, he's not going to be that expensive.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

such sweet thunder said:


> The Bulls had the option of having faith in Jay, paying him his full amount, and then reaping the rewards. The joy I have that Jay has regained his first step is being overshadowed by feelings toward the franchise. This is a dark, dark, day.


I shouldn't take this stance. This news is deserving of dancing bananas.


:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

If JWill can come back and play like a 2nd year version of what we saw, we'd be foolish not to sign him.

Given the status-quo, without a draft pick, and Curry's situation up in the air, a healthy and productive JWill would negate a lot of that at no real cost but buckage.

There's nothing wrong with more depth at guard, and we'd have a trading chip after the season when his BYC status is up. Maybe we trade one of the other guards instead. Who knows...


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## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

sloth said:


> Paxson is a phsycho if he doesn't sign this guy. If he is able to ball with lottery picks, he could be like having a lottery pick this year by signing him. The guy is still young. Sign him. If we have a handshake deal with him, what would it cost to sign him, 3-4 million. He is a great player, so if we get him, and Duhon back, then I can go into next year confident. No room for Jay there??? We have 4 guys, 96 minutes to distribute, and an average of 24 minutes for each of them. Imagine these 4, 4 fresh guards to go up anytime. Pargo is alright, but he isn't the quality of Jay. Sign Jay, he's not going to be that expensive.


I doubt he's gonna cost 3-4M. But if he's at 100% I would love for the Bulls to give him that money, we wouldn't even need Duhon. But I still doubt he will be the player he was, hope I'm wrong and he's back with us.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Honestly, this is one of the things that Chicago fans have been waiting for for a long time. Sign him to whatever it takes, it will be under the MLE for sure, so we can sign him, get him for 4-5 years imo. Bring him, Duhon, Kirk, Pargo, and Ben for a little camp at the Berto. See how he does against those guys. Jay was a very special player that was being held back by the Triangle. He was part of our team heading in the right direction with a 30 win season (albeit a lot of that was JROSE). If Jay never got injured Bill Cartwright would still be the head coach. Jay just ruined all our offseason plans, and now that we can get him back in good form, we have to sign him.


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## bulls (Jan 1, 2004)

such sweet thunder said:


> The Bulls had the option of having faith in Jay, paying him his full amount, and then reaping the rewards. The joy I have that Jay has regained his first step is being overshadowed by feelings toward the franchise. This is a dark, dark, day.



what in the hell are you guys talkin about?why is everyone on this hate jay and or pax trip?if pax hadnt work it out the way he did we would have had one less roster spot,and at that time we needed that spot.

mark my words,if jay keeps his word he will be on the team.we had space for Fwill,Funderburke,Griffin,Reiner so i have no doubt that we will have room for jwill..

i think everyone needs to get off Duhon's sack and stop all this 5mil per year crap,he will be luckly to get 1.5-2mil per.duhon is a back up PG at best.the only reason he did as well as he did is because he was playing on our team..

if it came down to duhon or jwill im takin jwill because we have to much dam time and money into that kid to just let him walk away.
duhon resigns for cheap or he's looking for a new home
put kirk back at PG and start BG at SG with Jwill and pargo or duhon backing up both G spots..


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## johnston797 (May 29, 2002)

:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: 

THAT IS UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somehow I feel better about Curry right now........


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## T.Shock (Feb 11, 2003)

J-Will has always said that the Bulls will have the oppurtunity to sign him first before any other team. I'd be looking at this guy everyday. I'd take 80 percent of J-Will over 100 percent of Duhon at a fraction of Du's price.


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## jnrjr79 (Apr 18, 2003)

We certainly have the room for him roster-wise. If he can be had for the LLE, why not? Sure, if he ends up being good we will have a problem with disbursing minutes, but IMO that is a good problem, not a bad one. At the end of the day it just may mean that we can pull off a good deal somewhere down the line b/c we have an extra piece to deal to another team. My assumption would be, at least at first, that Jay would come in without a whole lot of expectations for PT and attention, so why not give it a whirl?


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## The Truth (Jul 22, 2002)

As anything I have to say on this topic will be completely slanted by bias, I won't say what the Bulls should or shouldn't do.

All I can say is that I truly hope for the best for Jay (and I would love to see him back in a Bulls uniform--there, I said it).


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## SALO (Jun 6, 2002)

To be quite honest, I was never really impressed by him when he was 100% healthy. I still remember how disappointed I was by his play overall. He would constantly get his shot blocked when attempting to finish around the basket, and I'll never forget the time he went up for an uncontested fast-break dunk against Sacramento and got stuffed by the front of the rim. Seriously, the guy was terrific in college but when he played for us he wasn't that good.


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## BealeFarange (May 22, 2004)

First off, there is absolutely no reason NOT to sign him. Minutes be damned, this guy hasn't played or walked right in a couple years...there's no way Jay Williams is playing more than 24 minutes a night next year for ANY team. He'd be an asset and would give us a TON of flexibility for next year...when we'll have cap, talent, and maybe a new coach (??!!). 

Secondly, I do wish all the best for Jay and hope we've seen the last of these silly accidents. (Paging Mr. Winslow...Mr Winslow...?!)


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## ogbullzfan (Mar 9, 2004)

I like Jay and wish him the best of luck but there is always the risk that he can reinjure himself. It could be Grant Hill all over again. Not to mention he's another short guard. I hate to say it but I'd have to pass unless he comes really cheap.


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

Maybe he can be player-coach?

Saves Uncle Jerry some $$$.


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## RSP83 (Nov 24, 2002)

nah.. we got more important deals to take care before we can even thinking about signing him

Our Coach situation is a concern, Eddy is a concern, there are some questions whether Tyson will be back with us nor not.

After that, do you think Jay is good enough to replace Duhon now? I doubt it. Jay is not a better defender than Duhon either. yeah Jay USED TO be a better scorer.

Hinrich, Duhon, Jay, Gordon, Pargo/F.Will... now we have enough Ewoks to help fight the empire.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

I say you can never have too many ewoks for your adventure.










From day one, Paxson's mantra has been asset acquisition. Jay Will at half speed would be a giant killer off the bench. Sign him up!



little known bonus fact: the ewoks spoke hindi in the "adventures." when we were little, my friend used to translate for me. . . or else he was just making crap up and has been laughing at me for the last two decades.


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## p1mpstaR (Jan 17, 2005)

trade/S&T him for a Draft Pick. That would me make :banana: in my pants.


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## lb28matrixsc (Apr 4, 2005)

*I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*

1. Doesn't it bother anyone that Jay once waived off a time out demand by Bill Cartwright, while his teammates were walking off the floor, and tried to take it to the hole on 5 Golden State Warriors?

2. Doesn't it bother anyone that Jay basically did the same thing Kellen Winslow Jr. did? Can you imagine if some of the more "scapegoatish" Bulls had pulled the stunt he pulled? I mean Jay must REALLY be loved to the point of hypnosis, almost like the Bible prophesizes that non-believers will love the anti-Christ, if people are willing to look completely past the fact that he BROKE THE CBA, was told by Marcus Fizer "you aren't supposed to do that," said "I'll be aight" and then pulled a Knievel anyway.

3. Do any of you actually think that he would come back here to be Kirk Hinrich and Ben Gordon's backup? Yeah right. Jay was one of the most spoiled entitled Bulls who ever played in this city his rookie year. He was an unfortunate part of a very childish triad between he, Rose and Crawford....two other chumps. You think he's coming back here if Paxson tells him he's anything but a starter? You think he's coming here for anything less than the max he could get elsewhere? Well there was that whole "you have my word Pax" thing, but his word is probably "solid as oak Jerry."

4. Did any of you watch Dwayne Wade in the post-season? I did. Looks like while everyone has been looking for the next Mike, the closest thing I've seen has flown under a lot of radars. Does Dwayne Wade, who is a wonderful person off the court, have Kobe, MJ or Lebron's talent? No. But unlike Kobe and Lebron he's more selfless and better in a system that's about winning. Put this year's Wade with 2000 Shaq and it isn't even close. *Remember "the #7 pick and Donyell Marshall for the #4 pick and Lamond Murray*"...? I do. It didn't happen because we had to go with more of a player with PG skills because Jay did what Jay did. Remember *Jamal Crawford, Donyell Marshall and the #7 pick for Marcus Camby and the #3 pick (Carmelo Anthony)"..?* I do. Both moves were prevented because of Jay. When Dwayne Wade gets blown up on billboards and ends up being the new face of the NBA after proving to be just a better combo of talent, defensive will and unselfish play than Lebron and Melo, Kobe or TMac..... you remember Jay Williams. Cause I do every time I watch him play. Dwayne could have been the next MJ, where MJ himself did it every night. Right here in Chicago.

5. Finally the last question in the Jay Williams lovefest hearings. What if Jay doesn't come back? If you are one of the people trying to tell everyone that he's gonna accept Jannero Pargo's money and role and that we should cut Pargo to get it done..... what will you say when Jay does... what's best for Jay? Will you then say, "maybe fans of players who got cast aside for Jay's handed-out glory that he received as a ROOKIE, were right about Jay." What will you say if Jay ends up on the Pacers next year because they gave him the best deal? Or the Lakers? Or whoever? Will you finally say.... "nobody has royally screwed the Bulls franchise in it's history like Jay Williams, and maybe others were right about him?" 

Finally I'd like to tip my hat to Kirk Hinrich. He'll never be Dwayne Wade, not even close.... but there is no fault in that. I predict that by the time Wade's career is over there will only have been maybe 10 or 20 guys drafted SINCE Jordan was DRAFTED who turned out as good as Wade. If Wade really maxes out he could leave everyone but Johnson, Jordan, Bird, O'neal, Hakeem and Duncan in his wake (of those drafted after 1978). I'll be happy to see Kirk be what he appears to be. Mark Price physically with less jumper and more Stocktonesque passing, defense and toughness.

But you have to tip your hat to Kirk for one reason? He showed how Jay SHOULD have acted his rookie year. He came off the bench and did his thing when Jalen was still spewing cancer cells all over the UC floor for 16 games. He didn't make comments about how "MJ did his thing, it's time for a new group in Chicago" (a comment that Coach KryZEWski's droid never delivered on). There was no disobeying coach Skiles or Cartwright. There was no "maybe it's not working out for me in Chicago." There was no glory before production..... (see Jay's chevrolet spot that ran during what many considered to be a bust rookie year). Kirk played on BOTH sides of the court. And then in the offseason Kirk did the most important thing he could have done....

*Stayed off of motorcycles and came back to lead the Bulls to the playoffs his second year* just like the prophet Jay Williams was supposed to do. That's 7 combined NBA seasons and ZERO playoff births for Dukie saviors Elton Brand and Jay Williams. 

I'll admit I'm not a Kirk-jocker. But two things are definitely true. Backing Jamal Crawford over Kirk Hinrich is just wrong. Secondly.... Kirk Hinrich was SUCH a breath of fresh air compared to Jay Williams. Every time someone who thinks Kirk gets too much love in Chicago goes to post.... they should think about the fact that Kirk's hype is NOTHING compared to Jay Williams. And Kirk delivers on his rarely used mouth.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

*Re: I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*

This is a nicely written post, but your screen name looks familiar...methinks you are not a rookie poster. 

Anyhow, despite comparing Jay to the anti-Christ, how about acknowledging the fact that we lost a second overall pick for NOTHING but one year of rookie service? If he is really willing to come back to us, how could we not take advantage of his pledge and add him to our team as yet another asset. I don't care whether people liked him or not or whether he behaved well as a rookie. He certainly seemed petulant at times, but he was hardly a problem child that year.

And there's no way Jay Williams expects to start on an NBA team next year. He can't be sure he's even going to make it back in the league this go around. It may take another year, or it may never happen at all. 

Couldn't you at least accept the possiblity that he (and sure, maybe Winslow too) might actually gain some maturity after such an accident?


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## lb28matrixsc (Apr 4, 2005)

*Re: I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*



Darius Miles Davis said:


> This is a nicely written post, but your screen name looks familiar...methinks you are not a rookie poster.
> 
> Anyhow, despite comparing Jay to the anti-Christ, how about acknowledging the fact that we lost a second overall pick for NOTHING but one year of rookie service? If he is really willing to come back to us, how could we not take advantage of his pledge and add him to our team as yet another asset. I don't care whether people liked him or not or whether he behaved well as a rookie. He certainly seemed petulant at times, but he was hardly a problem child that year.
> 
> ...


I know I'm not wanted, and for good reason. It's gonna take a lot of forgiving hearts on this board to forgive me for my pious, arrogant, and idiotic behavior. This issue was just too big for me to stay away from. In the end I wish success to Jay, because it's not really up to me to be Jay's judge and jury..... but it just erked me and I had to ask.

Is not it foul against Kirk Hinrich or Ben Gordon or Tyson Chandler to fail to recognize that Jay was more hyped and adored than they were this year, and all for being a bust who basically blew away a #2 pick for the Bulls? IMO dude might as well have been Chris Washburn. But I just wanted answers and you gave them, which is awesome. 

I just hope to see one of two things happen:

1. Maybe you are right and Jay will give us the opportunity to have him back at a low salary and as a bench player. I highly doubt this, but if it happens I'll be really happy man!

2. If Jay decides he'll be better off in LA or SA or IND, I hope he signs with the Bulls and then gives them value by then being traded to one of these new teams. I feel he owes all Bulls fans that, and in exchange we would then absolve him of costing us Dwayne Wade (IMO). 

But as with the Curry situation, I fear I'm not going to be getting my wish. But it's ok. After much reflection, I was an A-hole this season. Some conclusions:

1. I posted like an arrogant hack.
2. Eddy Curry was not above criticism. I should have let it go. I_Killed_Kenny of realgm fame helped me realize that I was becoming an Ed fan instead of a Bulls fan.
3. John Paxson, Scott Skiles, Kirk Hinrich and everyone else I ripped down to try to make Eddy look better have done a great job. Why be greedy and expect them to live up to MJ for me to be happy for what they've done for the city of Chicago in the sense of sport. They've come out and done their job as blue collar guys. So even if Eddy and Jay don't turn out.... there are going to be plenty of blessings to count for Bulls fans in years to come, and hopefully Eddy will live a long life and Jay will have success elsewhere. 

But DMD....tell me. Am I being an A-hole for wanting a first rounder in return for Williams if Jay comes out and shows in workouts that he's back, but he just doesn't fit on the current Bulls?


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## PC Load Letter (Jun 29, 2002)

Here's an article from the Trib, talking about the same thing Chad Ford did. Jay Will looks good...

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...liams,1,5949218.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines



> Under the supervision of local trainer Tim Grover at ATTACK Athletics, former Bulls guard Jay Williams worked out Monday with Illinois guard Dee Brown and North Carolina guard Raymond Felton and displayed impressive quickness and cutting ability, according to two eyewitnesses.


And, the long-awaited return of the infamous Kevin Bradbury...



> "All the stuff we've been talking about is coming true," said Kevin Bradbury, Williams' business manager. "He can cut, run backward and his lateral movement is good. He just needs to continue strengthening his leg to get all his speed back. But he's close."


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## BealeFarange (May 22, 2004)

*Re: I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*



lb28matrixsc said:


> But DMD....tell me. Am I being an A-hole for wanting a first rounder in return for Williams if Jay comes out and shows in workouts that he's back, but he just doesn't fit on the current Bulls?


Well, in _ my _ opinion, you're not being a, uh, jerk...but you are of course being unrealistic. I would LOVE a first-rounder in return for Jay but no one would give us that if we were to somehow do a sign&trade with him. Which I don't think would even be possible anyway until next year. 

Did anyone notice the temperature of the boards rise a bit? The return of the prodigal son...uh, yeah, sure...Jay Williams...


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*



lb28matrixsc said:


> I know I'm not wanted, and for good reason. It's gonna take a lot of forgiving hearts on this board to forgive me for my pious, arrogant, and idiotic behavior. This issue was just too big for me to stay away from. In the end I wish success to Jay, because it's not really up to me to be Jay's judge and jury..... but it just erked me and I had to ask.
> 
> Is not it foul against Kirk Hinrich or Ben Gordon or Tyson Chandler to fail to recognize that Jay was more hyped and adored than they were this year, and all for being a bust who basically blew away a #2 pick for the Bulls? IMO dude might as well have been Chris Washburn. But I just wanted answers and you gave them, which is awesome.
> 
> ...


Your humility is serving you well. Your post is excellent.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*



BealeFarange said:


> Well, in _ my _ opinion, you're not being a, uh, jerk...but you are of course being unrealistic. I would LOVE a first-rounder in return for Jay but no one would give us that if we were to somehow do a sign&trade with him. Which I don't think would even be possible anyway until next year.
> 
> Did anyone notice the temperature of the boards rise a bit? The return of the prodigal son...uh, yeah, sure...Jay Williams...


Jay is the equivalent of a 1st rounder that the Bulls don't have in this year's draft. He may not pan out all that well, but it's a chance we'd not otherwise have, and a chance that is worth taking. What's there to lose?


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*



DaBullz said:


> Jay is the equivalent of a 1st rounder that the Bulls don't have in this year's draft. He may not pan out all that well, but it's a chance we'd not otherwise have, and a chance that is worth taking. What's there to lose?



I agree. I don't know why the Bulls are reportedly "showing no interest". Doesn't really make any sense to me. I mean, at least bring the guy in and let him play on your summer league team and see whats up, what if he does make a comeback and ends up being Baron Davis type talent? Boy wouldn't the Bulls have egg on their face then?


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

I said from the outset that I found it curious and a little annoying that the Bulls apparently had little to no say / supervision over Williams's rehab.

Now, it seems that whoever advised Paxson that Jay would never play again, or never get back close to the same level, or wouldn't be rehabilitated "soon," was wrong. 

I realize a controlled workout isn't as rigorous as an NBA game, but we're talking about a guy who almost died and was supposed to be in a wheelchair for the rest of his life. If he's come this far this fast, I don't have any doubts that he will be a force on an NBA court in the near future.

I would rather have Duhon than Jay, just because of the defensive advantage. The shame is that we lost a #2 pick and got absolutely nothing back for it, and that #2 pick is poised to contribute for other teams for the next decade or so.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

T.Shock said:


> J-Will has always said that the Bulls will have the oppurtunity to sign him first before any other team. I'd be looking at this guy everyday. I'd take 80 percent of J-Will over 100 percent of Duhon at a fraction of Du's price.


I'll believe that when I see it. Jay Williams will ink the best monetary offer available to him. If it comes from the Bulls (which definitely will not happen), the he'll sign with the Bulls. If it comes from the Bobcats, then he'll sign with the Bobcats. He has no contractual obligation to the Bulls, and that makes us as unlikely to sign him as any other team. *You can't pin it on Pax if he signs elsewhere.* Where he signs is up to him.

And I know it sucks that we won't get anything in return for losing his rights, but that's pretty much tough s*** for us, and we'll have to deal with it. That's life. At the time of the accident, we really had no choice but to assume that his career was over. And once the buyout went into effect, the Bulls had no legal connection to him, which is why he went to his preferred rehab setting at Duke. It's good to see the guy healthy and all, but we really need to let go of the thought of J-Will as a Bull. It does nobody any good to let his ghost haunt us.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

yodurk said:


> I'll believe that when I see it. Jay Williams will ink the best monetary offer available to him. If it comes from the Bulls (which definitely will not happen), the he'll sign with the Bulls. If it comes from the Bobcats, then he'll sign with the Bobcats. He has no contractual obligation to the Bulls, and that makes us as unlikely to sign him as any other team. *You can't pin it on Pax if he signs elsewhere.* Where he signs is up to him.


Jay Will has always said that he will give the Bulls the first shot at signing him because of their generosity in paying him a contract that they didn't have to. Paxson & JWill have a gentlemans agreement and nothing in J-Wills character leads me to believe that he would not honor it. That being said, I am sure J-Will would be expecting, and probably reasonably so if his game really has come back around, something that is at least the sort of rookie scale he had. From what I hear it is the BULLS that have no interest in signing J-Will, not the opposite.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

ace20004u said:


> Jay Will has always said that he will give the Bulls the first shot at signing him because of their generosity in paying him a contract that they didn't have to. Paxson & JWill have a gentlemans agreement and nothing in J-Wills character leads me to believe that he would not honor it. That being said, I am sure J-Will would be expecting, and probably reasonably so if his game really has come back around, something that is at least the sort of rookie scale he had. From what I hear it is the BULLS that have no interest in signing J-Will, not the opposite.


I'm only speculating here, but I would think that the Bulls reportedly have no interest because we already have a strong core of small guards. I'm sure Pax would love to have Jay take Pargo's spot, but ONLY if...

a) He proves he has some sort of advantage over Pargo, and

b) His contract demands are less than or equal to Pargo

I doubt that Jay would outplay Pargo at this point (though I'd have to see him play to judge that), and I also doubt that Jay will cost any less than Pargo just from past credentials alone. And just to point out one more thing, I'm about 95% sure that the Bulls ARE watching Jay to see how he's progressing. They might not be interested in signing him, but I'm sure they aren't turning a blind eye to him either. If he's really in that great of shape, then the Bulls will give him a shot I think.


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## Bulls4Life (Nov 13, 2002)

I'll take Jay on crutches over Frank Williams! :sour: If he is looking as good as they say, I'll take him over Pargo who is too streaky. And his offense has ALWAYS been better than Duhon's.

So Jay would be the 3rd best guard on the team and he's not even 100% yet.


Yeah, I'll take him back in a heartbeat.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

yodurk said:


> I'm only speculating here, but I would think that the Bulls reportedly have no interest because we already have a strong core of small guards. I'm sure Pax would love to have Jay take Pargo's spot, but ONLY if...
> 
> a) He proves he has some sort of advantage over Pargo, and
> 
> ...


That makes sense and it is pretty certain that he is going to get better than Pargo money. Still, if the reports can be believed and Jay Will is holding his own with Dee Brown and his shot is better than ever, that certainly warrants serious interest from the Bulls. All I have heard is that the Bulls have "no interest", shouldn't they at least pretend to show interest?


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

Some people really want us to sign Jay for one reason: so we don't walk away with the feeling that we lost a #2 pick for nothing. It's a crummy feeling, I know, but it doesn't change the fact that he probably won't fit with this team. Ace, I agree that we should have interest if, and only if, he seems to be his old self somewhat. But fact of the matter is that we have more pressing needs than another small guard, especially one with a big risk factor and who will likely get better offers from other teams. I could make better judgement out of this situation if I knew what sort of contract Jay was seeking, and especially if I had the chance to watch him play. Time will tell, I guess.

Btw, the report said he looked good in the workout, but did it really say "he held his own against the lottery picks"? Just curious.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

Ex-Bull Williams making strides in comeback effort 

By K.C. Johnson Tribune staff reporter 

June 7, 2005 

Under the supervision of local trainer Tim Grover at ATTACK Athletics, former Bulls guard Jay Williams worked out Monday with Illinois guard Dee Brown and North Carolina guard Raymond Felton and displayed impressive quickness and cutting ability, according to two eyewitnesses. 

Williams is attempting to return to the NBA after suffering such severe injuries in a June 2003 motorcycle accident that doctors considering amputating his left leg. 



"All the stuff we've been talking about is coming true," said Kevin Bradbury, Williams' business manager. "He can cut, run backward and his lateral movement is good. He just needs to continue strengthening his leg to get all his speed back. But he's close." 

Williams is hoping to be invited to an NBA training camp this fall. Considering the Bulls bought out his contract for $3 million they weren't obligated to pay him after he violated his contract, they'd be offered a look. 

But team sources have made clear there is no interest. 


And here....

From ESPN; 

"NBA teams, take note. 

The surprise at ATTACK Athletics on Monday was former Bulls point guard Jay Williams. He held his own against two of the fastest guys in the draft, Raymond Felton and Dee Brown. His shot is better than ever. He's cutting and jumping. He went full steam for an entire hour with Felton and Brown and looked just fine. 

Williams said after the workout that everything is coming back to him and he's hoping to be in an NBA training camp this fall. Grover concurred, asserting that if things go according to schedule, Williams will be ready to play next season. 

That's amazing progress for a guy who's been playing basketball full-time for only six weeks. 

"Right now it's more mental that physical," Williams said. "I'm still not secure in myself. The doctors have cleared me to play. Now it's about getting back the confidence I need to be a great player. When I think about it, I sometimes doubt. However, when I'm going one-on-one with Dee Brown, my basketball instincts kick in and I play just fine." 

"I don't want to come back and be an average player. I know some people think that it would still be great if I did that. I know I could do that right now. But that's not what I'm trying to do. I want to be an All-Star and play at an All-Star level." 

Williams said he has a handshake deal with the Bulls to give them the right of first refusal after seeing him work out. He doesn't think it's likely that they'll sign him, however, with Kirk Hinrich and Ben Gordon thriving in Chicago. If Chicago is not an option, he's hoping to land with a veteran team with title aspirations, such as the Spurs, Pacers or Timberwolves. 

It remains to be seen whether he'll ever get back to his old self. But he's on the right path."


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

The ESPN article goes into much more detail, and sounds very optimistic about his return. But like I said before, if he's as impressive as they suggest, then he will be far out of what the Bulls can pay. I could see teams giving him a contract starting at $3-4 million per year...he'd be crazy to turn that down for less money (and playing time) in Chicago.


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## ztect (Jun 12, 2002)

ace20004u said:


> Jay Will has always said that he will give the Bulls the first shot at signing him because of their generosity in paying him a contract that they didn't have to. Paxson & JWill have a gentlemans agreement and nothing in J-Wills character leads me to believe that he would not honor it. That being said, I am sure J-Will would be expecting, and probably reasonably so if his game really has come back around, something that is at least the sort of rookie scale he had. From what I hear it is the BULLS that have no interest in signing J-Will, not the opposite.


Wonder if Jay's word is as good as his college teammate Boozer's word to brother Jim


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## ztect (Jun 12, 2002)

yodurk said:


> The ESPN article goes into much more detail, and sounds very optimistic about his return. But like I said before, if he's as impressive as they suggest, then he will be far out of what the Bulls can pay. I could see teams giving him a contract starting at $3-4 million per year...he'd be crazy to turn that down for less money (and playing time) in Chicago.



ANy deal Jay gets will be filled with team options contigent on Jay's ability to stay healthy considering all the reconstructive surgery J has had


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

*Re: I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*



lb28matrixsc said:


> I know I'm not wanted, and for good reason. It's gonna take a lot of forgiving hearts on this board to forgive me for my pious, arrogant, and idiotic behavior. This issue was just too big for me to stay away from. In the end I wish success to Jay, because it's not really up to me to be Jay's judge and jury..... but it just erked me and I had to ask. Is not it foul against Kirk Hinrich or Ben Gordon or Tyson Chandler to fail to recognize that Jay was more hyped and adored than they were this year, and all for being a bust who basically blew away a #2 pick for the Bulls? IMO dude might as well have been Chris Washburn. But I just wanted answers and you gave them, which is awesome. I just hope to see one of two things happen: 1. Maybe you are right and Jay will give us the opportunity to have him back at a low salary and as a bench player. I highly doubt this, but if it happens I'll be really happy man! 2. If Jay decides he'll be better off in LA or SA or IND, I hope he signs with the Bulls and then gives them value by then being traded to one of these new teams. I feel he owes all Bulls fans that, and in exchange we would then absolve him of costing us Dwayne Wade (IMO). But as with the Curry situation, I fear I'm not going to be getting my wish. But it's ok. After much reflection, I was an A-hole this season. Some conclusions: 1. I posted like an arrogant hack. 2. Eddy Curry was not above criticism. I should have let it go. I_Killed_Kenny of realgm fame helped me realize that I was becoming an Ed fan instead of a Bulls fan. 3. John Paxson, Scott Skiles, Kirk Hinrich and everyone else I ripped down to try to make Eddy look better have done a great job. Why be greedy and expect them to live up to MJ for me to be happy for what they've done for the city of Chicago in the sense of sport. They've come out and done their job as blue collar guys. So even if Eddy and Jay don't turn out.... there are going to be plenty of blessings to count for Bulls fans in years to come, and hopefully Eddy will live a long life and Jay will have success elsewhere. But DMD....tell me. Am I being an A-hole for wanting a first rounder in return for Williams if Jay comes out and shows in workouts that he's back, but he just doesn't fit on the current Bulls?


LBMatrix,

I for one have no bone to pick with you, and I like your thoughful posts in this thread. 

Sadly, there's no way Jay is worth a first rounder this year. Like Spreewell (though for different reasons), he will have to work up all the way from the bottom to gain any measure of value. I suspect if he signs with a team this year, he gets no more than a one year deal. I like your idea but he's just not that valuable yet.


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## darlets (Jul 31, 2002)

Just my thoughts, jay signs a 2 year deal with the bulls to play a pargo role on a bit more money but on the understanding that we'll trade him if he proves himself to be capable of a bigger role.

Jay reputation is kept high (think sponsership deals for the remarkable comeback)
Jay gets to play in a big market
Bulls get a big PR scoop and an asset
No teams going to sign him to a big deal with out proof he can play a full season. He can serve his time here and get that proof.
Might have some gentlemens agreement that we try and trade him to a good situation for him.


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## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

*Re: I know none of you want me here, but honestly, questions*



ace20004u said:


> I agree. I don't know why the Bulls are reportedly "showing no interest". Doesn't really make any sense to me. I mean, at least bring the guy in and let him play on your summer league team and see whats up, what if he does make a comeback and ends up being Baron Davis type talent? Boy wouldn't the Bulls have egg on their face then?


The only 2 reasons I can come up w/ is that Jerry or Pax were so pissed off at Jayson "not Jay anymore" for the motorcycle accident, that they don't want to bring him in out of spite. Or they are so in love with Duhon and Kirk that they don't want to bring in another point that could hurt the 06' cap.

Why else would they say they are not at all interested in a very talented player that could help this team.

In this years draft point guard is the strongest position, and even though I haven't seen him in action from what I've heard he would be a first rounder this year if not top 20, or even late lottery. He's the perfect compliment to Kirk (I love Duhon, but he is not Jayson Williams.)

I would take JW over any point guard in the next draft except Deron, Raymond, and Paul. If JW comes back 100% and stays healthy, he is definitly better than at least one of these guys also.


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## LIBlue (Aug 17, 2002)

We have the mid-level exemption this year (approximately $5.5MM) and another slot for $1.3MM under this years salary cap. If we sign Jay Will, he will take a chunk of these available funds. We have greater needs along the front line (depth) and for a defensive minded 2-guard.

For those who want to resign Jay Will (and it is tempting), do we still do so if it means passing on a defensive 2 guard, or a Donyell Marshall along the front line? Do we bypass the signing of Duhon to sign Jay Will? Those are the questions the management must answer.


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## yodurk (Sep 4, 2002)

LIBlue said:


> We have the mid-level exemption this year (approximately $5.5MM) and another slot for $1.3MM under this years salary cap. If we sign Jay Will, he will take a chunk of these available funds. We have greater needs along the front line (depth) and for a defensive minded 2-guard.
> 
> For those who want to resign Jay Will (and it is tempting), do we still do so if it means passing on a defensive 2 guard, or a Donyell Marshall along the front line? Do we bypass the signing of Duhon to sign Jay Will? Those are the questions the management must answer.


You're spot on...this team has 2 gaping holes (backup SG with size, and backup PF/C with size), neither of which Jay Williams comes close to filling. As I said before, I'll let him take Pargo's role if he's in the budget, but there's certainly at least a dozen teams who are willing to dish out more than what the Bulls can afford. The MLE money needs to go to the aforementioned positions, not another small guard.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

Here's a slightly less optomistic link from the Charlotte observer:

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/sports/basketball/nba/charlotte_bobcats/11840549.htm

Williams begins his day at 7 a.m. with 90 minutes of physical therapy, then spends the rest of the morning doing drills on the basketball court. The afternoon is devoted to lifting weights and shooting.

Williams usually works out with North Carolina's Raymond Felton, Illinois' Dee Brown -- two players who have declared for the June 28 NBA draft -- and Bulls guard and former Duke teammate Chris Duhon.

"There's a lot of camaraderie with those guys," said Kevin Bradbury, Williams' agent. "They push each other and are there for each other."

Williams and Felton are close friends. Felton ate dinner at Williams' house in Durham in February, the night before the Tar Heels played Duke at Cameron Indoor Stadium.

"Jay's cutting forward, backward, laterally, everything's great," Bradbury said. "*He's maybe two steps slower than Raymond Felton, but he was probably one step slower than Raymond even before he got hurt."*


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

I would Take Jay Williams over Frank Williams, Pargo, Pike and Jared Reiner any day of the week. Jay Williams would not be expensive at all. I dont understand why everyone on here is so desperate for a SG with size! I mean no mather who you have in the backcourt your gonna be beaten by great players, i dont care who we have in the backcourt, because players like LJ,Arenas, PP, Red,etc will still put up big numbers. IMO we desperatley need offensive production from our PF and Backup C possition. Trust me guys we lost to washington because we had nobody who could score up front. I say we should give Jay atleast a shot, why the hell are we gonna bring up more lousy NBDL and ABA players who arent gonna do jack for us? I dont want to hear anymore of "we need to make getting a big guard as our #1 priority" talk, we had Hassell,Dupree,Linton Johnson, and Pike and we werent any better. Speed is more important then Size.


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## HAWK23 (Jul 1, 2002)

C-Curry
PF-Marshall
SF-Deng
SG-Hinrich
PG-Duhon

6-Gordon
7-Chandler
8-Nocioni
9-Jay Williams
10-Davis

:gopray:


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## BealeFarange (May 22, 2004)

yodurk said:


> You're spot on...this team has 2 gaping holes (backup SG with size, and backup PF/C with size), neither of which Jay Williams comes close to filling. As I said before, I'll let him take Pargo's role if he's in the budget, but there's certainly at least a dozen teams who are willing to dish out more than what the Bulls can afford. The MLE money needs to go to the aforementioned positions, not another small guard.


I agree totally with LIBlue and Yodurk (as usual). It takes mental toughness to realize that Jay Williams is a luxury we literally cannot afford. Though it's easy to say that we deserve something for him...and I've joked about it myself...the fact of the matter is that he's a free agent. Right or wrong. The pain of his loss is real, the just entitlement to sign him is not. We have holes in other places and if we're going to dip into our exceptions to sign someone, this is not the man we need to sign. 

It's heartwarming to hear that he's playing again--and well--but he has lost something, undoubtedly. Too bad to hear about Dee Brown breaking his foot, too...Duhon and Felton best be careful.


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