# Round One Game Two Milwaukee Bucks vs Detroit Pistons



## Brian. (Jul 11, 2002)

*Round One Game Two Milwaukee Bucks vs Detroit*

*<center>Time: 7:00 PM ET
Venue: The Palace of Auburn Hills
Bucks @ Pistons
April 21, 2004</center>*

<center>*







vs.







</center>*

<center>



































</center>
<center>*vs.</center>*
<center>



































</center>

Well the pistons look to go up 2-0 in this series. We don't play until wednesday so at least guys like chauncey and rasheed will have a few days off .


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

Well, Milwaukee (mainly Damon Jones) is talking a big game, so we'll see if they show up Wednesday. I expect more of the Milwaukee I saw in the first half than the Milwaukee I saw in the second half Sunday afternoon. Then again i expect to see the same aggressive Pistons too. It would be great going to Milwaukee up 2-0, since I kind of expect the Pistons to lose one of the two in Milwaukee before closing the series out.


----------



## froggyvk (Sep 12, 2002)

Just do what we've been doing for the past two months and we'll win.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

I too thought we would drop two games in this series actually but by the way we played last night I am doubting that we will. I expect Waukee to grab two somewhere along the line but it won't be a tight 6 game series, we will still win handedly.


----------



## fear the fro (May 28, 2003)

Give me a break. Milwaukee will win one if they're lucky. I just can't believe the way Damon Jones has been running his mouth. Wait and see who still has something to talk about a week from now, Damon.


----------



## PistonFAN81 (May 30, 2003)

i think that we need to get the brooms out. I am one that hates to say it but I don't really see how they can match up with us for an entire game


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

Teams that get blown out tend to come back strong the next game, but good defenses tend to nullify this.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

After watching the first game, there is no doubt in my mind that if the Pistons play their game they can win 4 straight. They completely dominated that game, and I hope they can keep that same level of play throughout the series and the playoffs. Damon Jones can run his mouth all he wants, but he just looks like an idiot. It isn't a fluke that the Bucks were turning the ball over. Since Rasheed came to the Pistons, it's been the norm that the Pistons force a ton of turnovers. I really don't see what good his comments are for the Bucks, if anything it will just fire up the Pistons already suffocating defense.

Game two, I'm hoping for a better game out of Chauncey. I think he was still feeling some of effects of his ankle, because I would say that game one was a mediocre game for Chauncey at best. He was missing a ton of shots that he normally makes. It's not necessary that he has an <b>awesome</b> game, but it would be nice to see him have a <b>good</b> game and prove the ankle is not that big of a problem. We may not need him in game one, or possibly in game two, but there will come a time in this playoff season where Chauncey has to play well.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> The most startling revelation Sunday was made by Bucks captain Desmond Mason, who told reporters: “I don’t think we were prepared for the jump traps that a lot of our turnovers came from. We didn’t talk about it too much.”
> 
> How could the Bucks not have scouted that? The Pistons have been using a variety of traps and presses, using Ben and Rasheed Wallace to harass opposing guards, since Rasheed was acquired Feb. 22.
> 
> ...



Someone on the Bucks scouting team needs to be fired.


----------



## froggyvk (Sep 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> Well, Milwaukee (mainly Damon Jones) is talking a big game, so we'll see if they show up Wednesday. I expect more of the Milwaukee I saw in the first half than the Milwaukee I saw in the second half Sunday afternoon. Then again i expect to see the same aggressive Pistons too. It would be great going to Milwaukee up 2-0, since I kind of expect the Pistons to lose one of the two in Milwaukee before closing the series out.





> “The two Wallaces started the game, right?” Jones said. “And it was a two-point game with four minutes to go in the first quarter. You tell me what problem they caused us. They didn’t cause any problems. They have two guys that put their shoes on and uniforms on just like we do. No big deal. Anything else?”





> James was told that Bucks guard Damon Jones said the Bucks’ 25 turnovers Sunday were mostly unforced. “If those were unforced, then I guess we will have to give them a few more unforced turnovers.”


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> Someone on the Bucks scouting team needs to be fired.


Yeah, I was surprised that Milwaukee was surprised to see full court pressure. Have they watched the Pistons play at all in the last month and a half? We've been pressing and trapping like crazy since Sheed, James, and Hunter have been in the lineup, I don't see how that should take anyone by surprise.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

I'll be missing the game tonight, to take an Econ Exam (I suppose I could just skip). But, I think this is a game we should definately win. Let's take this one in 4 or 5 games, and get some rest for what should be a hard fought series against the Nets.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> I'll be missing the game tonight, to take an Econ Exam (I suppose I could just skip). But, I think this is a game we should definately win. Let's take this one in 4 or 5 games, and get some rest for what should be a hard fought series against the Nets.


Traitor.  


Good luck on the exam...


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

Let the games begin. I love being able to watch all the games .


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

Alley oop off the tip... this team is great.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

I would bet any amount of money that Rip and Sheed were planning that before the tip-off. The Pistons are moving the ball really well but just not hitting our shots. Well, the Prince and hamilton three didn't go in, maybe I am just greedy. I think we have a _low 12 points_ while they have a _high 11 points_. Meaning I would like to see if they could continue scoring at that rate ie Redd bailing them out with contested three's.

Ben Wallace seems hyper and jumping too early for rebounds. he got bailed out with a Skinner call which was pretty obvious to both fans and refs alike. 

It is interesting they gave the PG duties to Desmond Mason. If Jones has this much trouble with Chauncey guarding him I would like to see him when James and Hunter are out.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>KABI</b>!
> It is interesting they gave the PG duties to Desmond Mason. If Jones has this much trouble with Chauncey guarding him I would like to see him when James and Hunter are out.


That's how we built our lead last game. The pitbulls forced them into a bunch of turnovers.

It sucks that they're not playing extremely well when you do get to watch them, but it'll come in time.

It's good to see Chauncey playing well.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

Chauncey Billups is a great pass-faker. He has done two or three succesfully already to today. 

We are getting called for a lot of fouls. If we don't watch out we might end up with a few starters with 4 or 5 fouls come closing time. Of course we will probably build a huge lead and let our benchers play anyway.

Damon Jones basically give Price (?) the ball was an example of how far we are ahead of them as far as preparation goes. This Milwaukee team is inexperienced. Joe Smith played with the Minnesota First-Round-Losers and didn't Redd come AFTER the dominant Bucks team of the early 2000's? We have all our key players from last year where we made it to the ECF's and Rasheed Wallace who is no stranger to big playoff games.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

Joe Smith should not have 9 points and 4 rebounds in the first quarter. This is the perfect example of someone scoring a lot and the computers interpreting it as him doing it against Ben because they are matched up against each other.


----------



## D.Spartan (Nov 21, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> Joe Smith should not have 9 points and 4 rebounds in the first quarter. This is the perfect example of someone scoring a lot and the computers interpreting it as him doing it against Ben because they are matched up against each other.


U R correct!
The Wallaces' are not playing defense yet.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

If my memory serves me correctly hasn't Smith been to the line quite a bit? I just checked the boxscore and he has gotten 4 shots from the line. Not a ton but enough. He had a sweet dunk but that was more in a hectic transition sequence. (The little left hander from basically under neath the net). He has hit some nice jumpers aswell. Not a bad game by him, I can give him some props for tonight.

Was anybody else as happy to see Brevin Knight and Redd yelling at each other on defence one play? Redd seemed to have gotten into it with Hunter aswell. The Hunter to Prince play was sick and even more proof that those who think the Pistons are boring should be electricuted.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

It doesn't look like anyway on the Pistons is playing D. I guess they thought they could outscore the Bucks, but what they need to realize is that playing defense leads to easy baskets. I expect them to wake out of this defensive "slumber" pretty soon.

And someone from out team grab a rebound.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

I don't like this lineup we have on the floor at all. We're not putting our overwhelming size advantage to use. Forget matching up with them, they need to match up with us. I like Darvin Ham and all, but we need to replace him with a big.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

Ughh make a sub, what a terrible lineup. Our center is the only guy with a jump shot. We just went to Corliss like 4 times in a row and didn't get a single good shot out of it.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

The Bucks are hustling more right now an example is when Van Horn came down hard and doubled on (Corliss?) flawlessly resulting in a turnover. Hunter is chugging away but has missed two big three's. Out scoring opponents is a good idea but you can't miss 7 shots in a row and still expect it to work. Corliss has nothing productive so far tonight. Hopefully thing will change.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

He made a sub and he put Ben in for Okur. I'm not understanding that at all. Put Memo in for Ham.

EDIT: Well at least he put Rip and Billups back in.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

Finally some defense -- leading to easy scoring opportunities..


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

Now THAT is more like it. Chauncey Billups hitting that three felt like finally letting out a **** after holding it in all day. 

Rasheed Wallace is a tank on those outlet passes and had a phat block on Van Horn too. Billups unselfishness is praiseworthy, him dropping it back to Ben Wallace was amazing. As was the previous play where Sheed hit Ben and Ben hit Rip for the traditional weak-as-hell-cram Hamilton style.


----------



## D.Spartan (Nov 21, 2002)

Sheed's block on VanHorn was sweet!

Why don't we go with a big line up, ie Okur & the Wallaces

We would dominate!!!!


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>D.Spartan</b>!
> Sheed's block on VanHorn was sweet!
> 
> Why don't we go with a big line up, ie Okur & the Wallaces
> ...


I agree. It's just not Corliss' night tonight. He looks to be a little off. I don't know what's the deal with Memo not playing much.


----------



## D.Spartan (Nov 21, 2002)

we would be up by 10 if Corliss wasn't playing.:upset: 

He looks really bad on both ends of the court


----------



## Jwick (Jul 15, 2002)

Im watching the game...and it seems like RIP has been wearing that face guard FOREVER...Is he ever gonna take it off?......ANOTHER THING! CAN WE STOP TONI KUKOC AND JOE SMITH? lol


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

Anyojne else hear Rasheed say to Mason "everybody on TV knows that wasn't a foul", while he was at the FT line. LOL...


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

I agree, Corliss is out of it. He can't get his hands on any rebounds or passes. He can't finish shot or layups for that matter. We are giving up too much rebounds which could be solved if one of our guys put their massive body on somebody like Kukoc as opposed to just jumping up and hoping it bounce their way.


----------



## the wall (Jul 21, 2002)

Absoluetly lack luster effort on the boards throughout the entire half. It seems like every time the Bucks shoot the ball, Kukoc or Joe Smith is gonna bring it down. Ridiculous. We better start putting forth some real effort - it's the Bucks. We shoudln't be losing to them. Ever.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>the wall</b>!
> Absoluetly lack luster effort on the boards throughout the entire half. It seems like every time the Bucks shoot the ball, Kukoc or Joe Smith is gonna bring it down. Ridiculous. We better start putting forth some real effort - it's the Bucks. We shoudln't be losing to them. Ever.


Welcome back to the Pistons board... It's been awhile.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

For goodness sake would somebody please box out! That is what is killing us.

EDIT: I see I am not the only one complaining about this.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

The Bucks are parading to the free throw line on weak foul after weak foul. 

Tayshaun had 7 points and 3 boards in the first but couldn't even get into the game the second quarter. Larry's subs really confuse me sometimes.

We are playing abolutely terrible. Nobody looks like they are even trying to play the way that's made this team good. Michael Redd misses an uncontested 3 and Ben and Sheed just sat and watched as fricken Kukoc soared over them for a rebound and a put back.

We are 2-12 from the 3-point line STOP SHOOTING THEM. I don't know what is going on.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> 
> We are 2-12 from the 3-point line STOP SHOOTING THEM. I don't know what is going on.


I think the three's we are shooting are good three's. Rasheed's, Hunter's and Prince's have been. Chauncey's not so much but hey it's Chauncey. It wouldn't hurt if we worked the ball around and got some easy ones to get our confidence up though. 

The play where Redd was wide open was painful enough but was even worse when Ben and Sheed watched Kukoc grab it like you said.


----------



## the wall (Jul 21, 2002)

> Welcome back to the Pistons board... It's been awhile.


Thanks, school has been brutal lately. But I should be back for now. 
What we need to do in the second half --

1. DON'T LET THE BUCKS GET THE OFFENSIVE BOARDS. Way too many for Milwaukee, and they shouldn't be getting any with that frontcourt.

2. Make your layups (Corliss). Missed too many easy ones.

3. Work it inside more. Lots of perimeter shots, and with the exception of Chauncey no one is making them.

I gotta think we're gonna improve in the 2nd half, that was just a very bad half.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> watched as fricken Kukoc soared over them for a rebound and a put back.


:laugh: 

In all seriousness, Magic Johnson just nailed it on the halftime show. The Pistons are taking the Bucks for granted and if they don't turn it up in the second half, that HCA that we worked for during the season will be gone.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

Our bench usually gives us a lot of help and builds leads.

Right now we have 34 bench minutes, 0 points, 3 rebounds, and 1 assist.

I like Darvin Ham, but this is not a series where he should be getting PT. He's usefull against the stronger guys like Jefferson and Artest not jump shooters like Kukoc, get Tayshaun on the floor to defend the shooters.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

With all do respect to the Pistons this whole losing thing is starting to get old. I think I might shift my primary attention to making my resume instead of the other way around. I better be distracted by some crazy Pistons fan crowd noises though!


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

JEEZ, 'Sheed got swatted.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

Screw Jason Kidd, let Corliss Williamson run the point for the Eastern All-Stars. That behind the back pass was fresh. Ahem...right...resume.


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

Michael Redd with serious range. Takes me back to yesterday with Walta McCarty.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

Michael Redd looks like McGrady out there. His shot is so damn ugly it's frustrating when it goes in because it looks like he's just chucking the ball with two hands at the backboard.

Rip needs to start looking to pass the ball. He's forcing thing in the paint. He needs to go back to what he's been doing the last several games and use his penetration to set up others.


----------



## the wall (Jul 21, 2002)

No intensity tonight, how can you not be totally hyped to play a playoff game??


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

Billups play was slick. Reminds me of Tinsley with all those cheap little tricks.


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

Good night Hamilton.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

Wow... Rip and Mason really want to get at each other's throats.


----------



## MillerTime (Jul 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> Good night Hamilton.


:laugh: 

And people say Artest is a head case....... lol !!!


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

I missed the whole third quarter... I can't believe our bench hasn't scored one point. Is it because of who Larry had out there or were they just that ineffective?


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> :laugh:
> ...


People get mad sometimes, get over it...


----------



## MillerTime (Jul 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> People get mad sometimes, get over it...


Ouch. 

So it's ok for Detriot fans to call Artest names when he gets a T during a game but when a Piston does it, he just gets mad? 

I loved how Hamilton tried to act like a gangster. lol. Even Artest doesn't do that!


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> Ouch.
> ...


Noone's mad. Your post just didn't add anything to the thread other than a post. A post that looks like it was used to just to try to get under people's skin. 

I'm not going to even respond on you comparing Ron Artest's antics to Rip's.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

Looks like the refs missed the travel on that one. Looked like a bailout to me.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

What the hell are these fouls!!!!! God damn bail them out a little more. That's been the story of the night every time we trap them they just throw there arms up in the air and get bailed out on bad passes.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

C'mon Stones... one more possession of good D. 

Why did they wait so long to finally play?


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

Finally playing with some intensity. 2 point game. This would be an absolute robery if they pull this out.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

couldnt get that most important rebound....


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

Only fitting, the refs bail them out one last time.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> Only fitting, the refs bail them out one last time.


that was an obvious foul after MIL got the rebound


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

And Damon Jones pulls a Chris Webber.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>wadecaroneddie</b>!
> 
> 
> that was an obvious foul after MIL got the rebound


Maybe so, but Ben got a huge forearm in the back on that rebound. As Rasheed would say, "That ball aint gonna lie!".


----------



## MillerTime (Jul 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> And Damon Jones pulls a Chris Webber.


So true. lol

So who takes the final shot? Rasheed?


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> And Damon Jones pulls a Chris Webber.


lol...if u guys win tis one, it will be amazing...u came back well,not giving up after Hamilton got ejected.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>wadecaroneddie</b>!
> couldnt get that most important rebound....


No suprise that's been the story all night. I haven't the slightest idea how Milwaukee is outrebounding us.

All that trash Jones talks and he chokes.


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

At least Billups is out.


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

Bucks ball!!! Bucks ball!!!! 

I thought it really looked like it went of Rasheed.'

Maybe he was passing to that nut case in the crowd.


----------



## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

ur lucky its still ur ball....oops...said it too soon


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

And Sheed pulls a Michael Finley. God dammit.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

Terrible last play. They looked lost without Billups and Hamilton out there.


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

By the way, I'm rooting for the Bucks since Hamilton is out.


----------



## MillerTime (Jul 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> And Damon Jones pulls a Chris Webber.


And Rasheed out does Damon. Ouch......


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

Bucks get the first underdog victory of the post season.


----------



## NewAnomaly (Apr 13, 2004)

ouch, geez sheed.



BTW unlike most Blazer's fans, I like Sheed, just couldn't fit on the Blazers.


----------



## froggyvk (Sep 12, 2002)

Wild finish, too bad we couldn't pull it out.

Brevin Knight is quickly becoming my least favorite player in the league. He's like 3'5" and talking trash after every make, and complains after every Bucks foul.

And Lindsey Hunter? What was he doing in when Rip fouled out? Mike James has more offense, and that's what we needed.

PacersGuy: http://basketballboards.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=31


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

> PacersGuy: http://basketballboards.net/forum/f...p?s=&forumid=31


What? Am I supposed to create a game thread in the final 10 seconds?


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

I'm glad I didn't get to watch this game. Unfortunately I did get to see the last minute or so. Looking at the stat sheet and reading what was posted here, it looks like it comes down to what I've been harping on for about a month or two. GRAB REBOUNDS.

Corliss played real well I see.


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> I'm glad I didn't get to watch this game. Unfortunately I did get to see the last minute or so. Looking at the stat sheet and reading what was posted here, it looks like it comes down to what I've been harping on for about a month or two. GRAB REBOUNDS.
> 
> Corliss played real well I see.


Pistons got the most important reboudn of the game, but they didn't convert off of it. It was a great game regardless of who won. It had unexpected twists like the Damon Jones misses and the Rasheed Wallace pass to the upper deck.


----------



## froggyvk (Sep 12, 2002)

That might have been the most important rebound, but fact is it wouldn't have come down to that if we could've grabbed other rebounds. The Pistons had a golden opportunity of Brevin Knight's miss, but it was tapped around for a while and finally offensive rebounded by Milwaukee.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

The Bucks scored 92 points with only 26 in the paint.

That shows how out of control they were with their jump shots.

I don't think we are going to come out with that total lack of intensity again, and I don't think Milwaukee can keep up that degree of outside shooting.


----------



## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> The Bucks scored 92 points with only 26 in the paint.
> 
> That shows how out of control they were with their jump shots.
> ...


Teams that are blown out generally come back strong the next game.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> Teams that are blown out generally come back strong the next game.


And teams that blow someone out generally come out flat. I was hoping we would avoid that because we were good in the regular season at stringing blow out after blow out.

We played hard at the end and made up a 10 point lead in about 2 minutes. We have to play with that kind of fire the whole game.


----------



## froggyvk (Sep 12, 2002)

If Corliss had put even one of those damn shorties in, we wouldn't have to deal with this. That was such a frustrating game...I knew us not being able to make the cheapies was going to kill us.

Come on Big Nasty! You're better than that, man!

We better win next game, because we ever go down 2-1 to a Bucks team with Game 4 on the road, we're in trouble.


----------



## PistonFAN81 (May 30, 2003)

I watched the whole game I swore, made excuses, said there was fouls when there wasn't and the plain as day thing is that we just didn't play the way that we should have...REBOUNDS...man it killed us! well it looks like the saturday game could be a bit on the interesting side heh?


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

Again, looking at the boxscore you can tell the bench was pretty poor tonight. If we want to win in Milwaukee, they need to play much, much better. Milwaukee's going to come out in game three with a ton of energy, and we're going to need to weather that storm. When the bench comes in, that's where we have to do our killing. We especially need a better effort of Corliss. I saw him miss one of the first layups, and from what I understand that continued.


----------



## fear the fro (May 28, 2003)

Being the first team to lose at home is pretty embarrassing. But this is the same team that needed 7 games to put Orlando away last year-what else would you expect? 

Anyways, that game was gross. Outrebounded by 11. The worst was when some guy on Milwaukee, I forget who, was in the corner about to shoot a 3-Ben thought about running out at him but decided to stay and wait for the rebound. The shots hits off the rim, and Ben watches Toni Kukoc come down with it. Pathetic. Anyone know why Tayshaun played only 28 minutes? he was having an awesome game...Seems like Corliss woke up this morning and thought it was November all over again. 0-5 from the field. 3 turnovers and 3 fouls in 14 minutes. And what exactly did Darvin Ham add in his 8 minutes of playing time?

But, to be honest, this team has had trouble pulling out close ones all year. Especially since we've gotten Rasheed, all of our wins have been blowouts, and our losses have been the close or relatively close ones. This team just has trouble pulling out the close W's and while I expect us to definetly still beat the Bucks it will come back to bite us if we don't improve our execution and not let a crappy team beat us on the boards by 11. This is just not the same team that last year was able to come from behind time and time again. I can't really remember one game this year when we came back from a big deficit...but we did have a shot until Sheed lost the ball. By the way, did anyone else think Tayshaun should have taken that shot? He was wide open for about a second from three, and he at least wouldn't have thrown it out of bounds. 

One last point-Memo's going to be playing a lot more than 3 minutes a game for whatever team he decides to sign with next year.


----------



## fear the fro (May 28, 2003)

And I couldn't belive Larry Brown brought back the 3 guard rotation. What a joke.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>fear the fro</b>!
> Being the first team to lose at home is pretty embarrassing. But this is the same team that needed 7 games to put Orlando away last year-what else would you expect?
> 
> Anyways, that game was gross. Outrebounded by 11. The worst was when some guy on Milwaukee, I forget who, was in the corner about to shoot a 3-Ben thought about running out at him but decided to stay and wait for the rebound. The shots hits off the rim, and Ben watches Toni Kukoc come down with it. Pathetic. Anyone know why Tayshaun played only 28 minutes? he was having an awesome game...Seems like Corliss woke up this morning and thought it was November all over again. 0-5 from the field. 3 turnovers and 3 fouls in 14 minutes. And what exactly did Darvin Ham add in his 8 minutes of playing time?
> ...


Great 5-star post. That's what this board needs, not all that other crap.

Anyways, I agree about Tayshaun. Not only did he have an open shot from three but he seemed to create seperation on his drive and I've got to believe he could have taken it all the way to the hole. In that situation, I was hoping we would go for the two points to send it to overtime. With the crowd behind us and although we were missing our starting backcourt, I don't think we would have been denied.

It's a good wakeup call though. You can't just go out there and expect to win. You've got to go out, play hard, and earn the win. Judging from the rebound discrepency, the Pistons were not playing hard.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

I had beef with Larry pulling Memo after three minutes tonight too. I have no idea what he was pulled for, but now isn't the time to start messing with his ego and what not LB. I also don't know what the deal was with that awful lineup of Memo, Corliss, Ham, Hunter, and James, that was a terrible lineup and I believe that's the point in the game that we started to fall behind. I gotta believe this loss will piss off the Pistons and I expect a fired up team come game time for game 3.

It's tied up 1-1, plus it has a little subplot developing with Damon Jones talking junk and now Rip and Dez getting into it. Should be an interesting series in what is otherwise a very boring start to the playoffs in the NBA.


----------



## fear the fro (May 28, 2003)

Would have been tough to pull it off in OT without Chauncey and Rip, but the guys would have been so fired up. Tough to say what would have happened.

BTW, any other U of M fans hear about Malik Hairston? He apparently told ESPN that U of M and MSU are not for him, although no one thought he was still considering MSU. How do the top two HS prospects (him and Joe Crawford) both end up going out of state? MSU is so loaded at guard that I can understand why they wouldn't want to go there but U of M is a team on the rebound, just won the NIT, future looks bright, etc...is their recruiting just really crappy?


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>fear the fro</b>!
> Would have been tough to pull it off in OT without Chauncey and Rip, but the guys would have been so fired up. Tough to say what would have happened.
> 
> BTW, any other U of M fans hear about Malik Hairston? He apparently told ESPN that U of M and MSU are not for him, although no one thought he was still considering MSU. How do the top two HS prospects (him and Joe Crawford) both end up going out of state? MSU is so loaded at guard that I can understand why they wouldn't want to go there but U of M is a team on the rebound, just won the NIT, future looks bright, etc...is their recruiting just really crappy?


I can't say I'm too mad, I didn't want U-M to get him anyway. I guess it happens sometimes.

By the way, your posting has been great lately. Keep it up, it greatly adds to the board.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>fear the fro</b>!
> Would have been tough to pull it off in OT without Chauncey and Rip, but the guys would have been so fired up. Tough to say what would have happened.
> 
> BTW, any other U of M fans hear about Malik Hairston? He apparently told ESPN that U of M and MSU are not for him, although no one thought he was still considering MSU. How do the top two HS prospects (him and Joe Crawford) both end up going out of state? MSU is so loaded at guard that I can understand why they wouldn't want to go there but U of M is a team on the rebound, just won the NIT, future looks bright, etc...is their recruiting just really crappy?


I just don't think he wanted to come to the U, although I don't think it's completely out. That said, I think he'll end up at Kansas. It's tough to lose out on Hairston, but I don't think you can say the recruiting is "really crappy". Afterall, they did snag the Mr. Basketball (Dion Harris) last year for the first time in a long time. Playing time could have been an issue. :whoknows: Don't know what to say, I don't really follow basketball recruiting all that closely.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>fear the fro</b>!
> 
> BTW, any other U of M fans hear about Malik Hairston? He apparently told ESPN that U of M and MSU are not for him, although no one thought he was still considering MSU. How do the top two HS prospects (him and Joe Crawford) both end up going out of state? MSU is so loaded at guard that I can understand why they wouldn't want to go there but U of M is a team on the rebound, just won the NIT, future looks bright, etc...is their recruiting just really crappy?


All I know is Drew Neitzel was Mr. Basketball and he tore Renasance to pieces in the state finals. I can't for the life of me firgure out how both Crawford and Hairston were McDonald's All-Americans over Neitzel.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> 
> 
> All I know is Drew Neitzel was Mr. Basketball and he tore Renasance to pieces in the state finals. I can't for the life of me firgure out how both Crawford and Hairston were McDonald's All-Americans over Neitzel.


They are better players that are going to be playing out of state. There is a certain bias in this state that the award is given to a guy that stays in-state to play college basketball. While Drew Neitzel was tearing up competition over on the west side of the state, Crawford and Hairston were dominating the PSL, one of the top conferences in the entire country. Now if someone wants to explain to me how Crawford and Hairston didn't get all-league honors, then I'd be delighted to hear. Absolute robbery. 

Nothing against Drew Neitzel, he's a great player, but Joe Crawford, Malik Hairston, those guys are better players.


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Good riddance to Hairston. He is going to be a one and done anyway. Glad to see Tommy not waiting on him. Ronald Coleman will be good for Michigan anyway. 

Next the Wolves will be dancing.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> Nothing against Drew Neitzel, he's a great player, but Joe Crawford, Malik Hairston, those guys are better players.


But Neitzel tore those guys up in the state finals. Renasaince won because they have a much better team, but Drew was unstopable.

He's a great passer and an incredible ambextrous shooter. I've never seen anything like it. He shoots normally with his right hand but shoots 3-pointers with his left hand, and he is money out to 25 feet. Hairston and Crawford are more athletic but they can't touch Neitzel in terms of pure basketball skills.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> 
> 
> But Neitzel tore those guys up in the state finals. Renasaince won because they have a much better team, but Drew was unstopable.
> ...


I'm certainly not taking anything away from Neitzel, he's a hell of a player. But, that's one game (in which Malik and Joe played pretty well, might I add). Again, Hairston and Crawford dominated the PSL all year. The award is given to the best player for the entire season, and dominating the PSL is much more impressive to me than dominating teams over on the west side of the state. There's a reason they are more highly regarded players, because they are more talented.

I have heard talk that Tom Izzo has alot of influence over who wins this award....

Over the past five years:
1999 Jason Richardson (MSU)
2000 Marcus Taylor (MSU)
2001 Kelvin Torbert (MSU)
2002 Paul Davis (MSU)
2003 Dion Harris (UM)

Now did all these guys deserve to win, maybe. But, please know that where they go to college has some influence on their chances. This years pick was just a glaring display of bias.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> I'm certainly not taking anything away from Neitzel, he's a hell of a player. But, that's one game (in which Malik and Joe played pretty well, might I add). Again, Hairston and Crawford dominated the PSL all year. The award is given to the best player for the entire season, and dominating the PSL is much more impressive to me than dominating teams over on the west side of the state. There's a reason they are more highly regarded players, because they are more talented.


It's not just one game though, I've watched him play a lot over the last 3 years and he is for real. Screw conferences, Neitzel almost outscored Hairston and Crawford COMBINED in that game.

There was a lot of talk about who deserved Mr. Basketball before that game but I thought Neitzel erased any doubt.

The competitoin in Grand Rapids isn't as good as it is in Detroit, but there are still good teams. The OK White has had a team in the Class B championship 3 years in a row now, and South Chrisitan won it last year and knocked Rennessaince out the year before (well I guess Wyoming Park wasn't technically in the championship game this year but Dewitt didn't stand a chance no matter who they played). Besides, it's not like he hasn't proven himself against the countries best players. He was the MVP and Most Outstanding Player at the 5-star camp last summer and ranked out as the 13th best point guard in the country at the ABCD camp as a juinor, just behind Sebastion Telfair.

Conference strength aside, Neitzel still outplayed them both and has played very well against other top players in the country. He doesn't have the height or leaping ability of a guy like Hairston, but I think he is definately more talented.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

You have to realize also that Nietzel also more than likely got all the votes from his regional voting, while Hairston and Crawford probaly "took" votes away from each other, with the voters not being able to make up their minds on which one deserved the award more.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> You have to realize also that Nietzel also more than likely got all the votes from his regional voting, while Hairston and Crawford probaly "took" votes away from each other, with the voters not being able to make up their minds on which one deserved the award more.


Maybe, but Neitzel had over 900 votes while Crawford and Hairston had around 300 each.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> 
> 
> Maybe, but Neitzel had over 900 votes while Crawford and Hairston had around 300 each.


That's becasue of all the good players in the PSL. Nietzel is good, don't get me wrong, but the PSL of course has many more good great great players and they are "stealing" each others votes. I'm not exactly sure how the regions break down, but I'm pretty sure Nietzel got just about all of his regions votes, while the region with Crawford, Hairston and so on... well you get the point.


----------



## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> That's becasue of all the good players in the PSL. Nietzel is good, don't get me wrong, but the PSL of course has many more good great great players and they are "stealing" each others votes. I'm not exactly sure how the regions break down, but I'm pretty sure Nietzel got just about all of his regions votes, while the region with Crawford, Hairston and so on... well you get the point.


Don't forget Crawford and Hairston had to work together on the same team, in essence stealing the spotlight from one another. I think the reasons you have listed plus this reason are big reasons, but the biggest reason is still bias. This award is voted on by the Coaches of Michigan, do you think they get to watch all the players? This award should be decided by the media: people that actually get to watch all the players.


----------



## fear the fro (May 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> By the way, your posting has been great lately. Keep it up, it greatly adds to the board.


Thanks, I do what I can  



> just don't think he wanted to come to the U, although I don't think it's completely out. That said, I think he'll end up at Kansas. It's tough to lose out on Hairston, but I don't think you can say the recruiting is "really crappy". Afterall, they did snag the Mr. Basketball (Dion Harris) last year for the first time in a long time. Playing time could have been an issue.


State got Neitzel as well as two other guys ranked top 100 in the country, while U of M got one. That is not good considering U of M is trying to challenge MSU's status as the best team in Michigan. I think it might have something to do with U of M's scholarships being limited though


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

I know one of the guys they got is Marquise Gray. He's 6'8"/6'9" and can rebound and play defense. He's tough too, the perfect compliment to Davis. His offensive skills aren't anything to write home about, but that can improve in time. I believe the other guy is probaly the 7' footer they got from Lansing Everett. I could be wrong on that though. It's a good sign that MSU got some big guys considering that's whatg they needed the most.


----------



## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

On the game:

The bench has to play much better... Their play last night was unacceptable. Memo *has* to get more than 3 mnutes.

Larry can't go to those scoreless lineups. That lineup was terrible. No real playmaners were on the court and it showed. Last night is the first time in a while that I have been upset at LB. Just as players have off nights, I feel LB had one last night. His coaching was subpar.

Establish our low post dominance again. Sheed go back down low. Ben hit the boards. Play Memo more. Give Elden five minutes here and there. Anything to establish our low post dominance again. I'll give Corliss a pass on last night, he has been playing great lately, but that was just terrible. I can't think of a better word for his perfromance and he doesn't deserve one.

Somebody please rebound. Last night was unacceptable and I think Mike Luvs KG summed it up perfectly with his "fricken Toni Kukoc" line.

Do those things and we should win.


----------



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

We looked like we didn't want the game. We got early fouls. Those are the two leading causes of our loss. Fortunatley for us, both of those are repairable. Ben has no right to whine about Artest winning an award if he doesn't show up the next game.


----------

