# Consolidate The Roster



## ROYisR.O.Y. (Apr 1, 2007)

Oden
Roy
Rudy
Sergio
LMA
Freeland
Lafrentz
Miles
Blake
Joel
Mcroberts
Frye
Green
Jack
Jones
Webster
Outlaw

these are all the player under portland's control

MISSION:
create a depth chart of 12 players from this point forward, but the catch is you cant leave a guy overseas if they are not on the roster they are traded for an expiring or cut. (so if freeland isn't on your roster he is lost, or green is left off he is cut)

sound good?


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## ROYisR.O.Y. (Apr 1, 2007)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*

Roy/Blake/Sergio
Webster/Rudy/Blake
Jones/Outlaw
Aldridge/Frye/McRoberts
Oden/Przy

this is how i would do it at first but eventually hopefully rudy can swap with webster and sergio overtakes blake


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



ROYisR.O.Y. said:


> Oden
> Roy
> Rudy
> Sergio
> ...


C- Greg Oden/Joel Przybilla
PF-LaMarcus Aldridge/Channing Frye/Josh McRoberts
SF-James Jones/Travis Outlaw
SG-Martell Webster/Rudy Fernandez
PG-Brandon Roy/Steve Blake/Sergio Rodriguez


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## Public Defender (May 5, 2003)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*

PG: Blake/Sergio/Green
SG: Roy/Webster
SF: Outlaw/Jones
PF: Aldridge/Frye
C: Oden/Przybilla

That part is easy (11 players). 

The toughest part - not having seen much of McRoberts at the NBA level, and having seen none of Fernandez or Freeland in the NBA - is whether or not those guys are better to have around than Jarrett Jack or a potentially healthy Darius Miles. I'm gambling that Taurean Green, with his championship pedigree, would be a slight upgrade over Jack at PG - whether Jack is better than Rudy as a combo guard off the bench, I don't know.


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## Resume (Jul 17, 2007)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*

Roy\Blake\Jack
Webster\Rudy
Outlaw\Jones
LMA\Frye\McBob
Oden\Joel

^^^ That roster will win the WCF


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## ebott (Jan 7, 2003)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*

How I'd do my 15 man roster:

c- Oden(26)/Przybilla(22)/(LaFrentz)
pf- Aldridge(30)/Outlaw(18)/(Frye)
sf- Webster(28)/James Jones(20)/(Darius Miles)
sg- Rudy Fernandez(20)/Jarret Jack(20)/ (1st Rounder)
pg- Brandon Roy(36)/Steve Blake(20)/(Sergio Rodriguez)

Threads like this make me think KP is planning on doing some kind of many for 1 trade. We've got a full roster and we're gonna add at least Rudy and our 1st rounder Next season. Who knows if he'll be able to pull off such a deal. 

I can't imagine that he'd be happy cutting the likes of Freeland, McRoberts and Green. I also can't imagine the team will stay happy with guys like Sergio, Darius, our first rounder and Frye (or who ever might turn out to get the shaft in the rotation) not getting regular minutes.

Edit: I can't believe so many of you are slotting Outlaw in at small forward. He's never been any good at small forward. All his success has been at power forward. With Frye and McBob on the roster it makes me think that Outlaw is likely to be the centerpiece of a many for 1 deal.


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## MARIS61 (Apr 28, 2003)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*

You left out Petteri Koponnen.

C - Greg, Joel
PH - LMA, DRAFT PICK
SF - Travis, Martell
SG - Brandon, Rudy
PG - Sergio, Petteri

2 SPOTS FOR WHO WE GET STUCK WITH IN TRADES.


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## yuyuza1 (May 24, 2006)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



MAS RipCity said:


> C- Greg Oden/Joel Przybilla
> PF-LaMarcus Aldridge/Channing Frye/Josh McRoberts
> SF-James Jones/Travis Outlaw
> SG-Martell Webster/Rudy Fernandez
> PG-Brandon Roy/Steve Blake/Sergio Rodriguez


I like this one. 

But wow! Jack is getting minutes on only on one roster so far. I'm assuming he's the Blazer most fans would see traded.


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## KingSpeed (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*

Oden/Przybilla (LMA)
LMA/Frye
Outlaw/Jones/Webster
Roy/Rudy 
Blake/Jack/Sergio

LMA can play C as can Frye. Outlaw can play PF as well. Webster can play the 2. Rudy can play 1,2,3. Roy can as well. Jack can play the 2.

Go Blazers

Oh... and it's "Consolidate." Can we change it so that we Blazer fans don't look bad to the rest of the forum?


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## ThatBlazerGuy (May 1, 2003)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*

PG- Brandon Roy/Steve Blake/Sergio Rodriguez
SG- Martell Webster/Rudy Fernandez
SF- James Jones/Travis Outlaw
PF- LaMarcus Aldridge/Channing Frye/Josh McRoberts
C- Greg Oden/Joel Pryzbilla


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*

unotouchable core:

let expire after they help us a couple of years:
Blake - (let his contract expire and help us)
Lafrentz (ick)
Jones (will help proivde role but after this year we can let martell step into it, he's soo young).
Pryzbilla - we'll get three great years of heavy backup minutes out of him while Oden grows

trade if possible:
DMiles

youngs I want to see before we do anything:
Rudy, Sergio, Freeland, Koponen, Mcroberts

I don't care:
Green

I want to move and have some value:
Jack - we can find a better slacsher who isn't as terrible on the break or as much of a *****, Rudy needs a chance
Frye - where's the time?

I'm willing to move to get a great player and have value:
Outlaw

My hope/plan/desires:
use combo or all of Jack, Frye, Outlaw, and pick to get:
1) Iggy
2) Eric Gordon
3) Luol Deng
....
longshots I like: Paul, Kirilenko (I'd demand we ditch miles though), others...


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## <-=*PdX*=-> (Oct 11, 2007)

^NO WAY I want AK47 on this team! NO WAY!!!


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## Anonymous Gambler (May 29, 2006)

ROYisR.O.Y. said:


> Oden
> Roy
> Rudy
> Sergio
> ...


This means just picking the top 12, right? Since in reality we would trade to reduce numbers/increase talent.

Here goes:

Oden/Pyrzbilla
Aldridge/Channing Frye
Webster/Outlaw/Miles
Roy/Jack/Rudy
Blake/Sergio

* if I had a 13th spot, I'd keep Jones


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## Hector (Nov 15, 2004)

Ignoring contracts:

C: Oden, Przybilla
PF: Aldridge, Outlaw, Freeland
SF: Miles, Jones
SG: Roy, Fernandez
PG: Rodriguez, Blake, Koponen
Goodbye: Jack, Webster, Frye, Lafrentz, McRoberts, Green, 2008 draft picks


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## southnc (Dec 15, 2005)

12-man roster (secondary position)

Oden / Pryzbilla / (LMA)
LMA / Frye / (Outlaw)
Webster / Outlaw / Jones / McRoberts
Roy / Rudy / (Blake)
Blake / Sergio / (Roy)

This does go against the PG-heavy mentality of the Blazer's management, but I'd rather have more help in the bigs, since Blake and Roy can play either PG or SG.

I like the idea of pairing Rudy & Sergio on the 2nd team, since they know each other's game pretty well.


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## RedHot&Rolling (Jun 26, 2004)

Oden - Przybilla (center position)
Aldridge - Frye - McRoberts (PF position)
Jones - Outlaw - Miles (SF position)
Roy - Fernandez (SG position)
Blake - Sergio - Koppenen (PG position)
2008 First Round pick (roster spot #14)
??? Player in return for Jack, Webster, Green, Freeland and LaFrenz (roster spot #15)

I'm assuming we're talking about consolidating for the next season 2008-09. Miles cannot be traded IMO.


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## mediocre man (Feb 24, 2004)

Oden/Joel
Aldridge/Frye/McBob
Jones/Outlaw
Roy/Fernandez
Sergio/Green/Koponen


That's mine minus draft picks and trades


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## chairman (Jul 2, 2006)

My top 13 Keepers are:

Oden/Pryz
Aldridge/Frye/McRob
Jones/Outlaw, Webster
Roy/Fernandez
Blake/Sergio/Koponen

Its not that I want to get rid of Jack, because I like what he brings to the table. But I agree with most that he probably will not be content with his minutes. The third PG position will be a battle between Green and Koponen. I think Koponen fits better with Roy. Green is too short IMO. But if he turns out to be a better outside shooter than I think he is, then he may win.


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## craigehlo (Feb 24, 2005)

The only guys that seem expendable to me are Martell, Jack, Green and LaFrenz. If Martell doesn't command a huge payday on the free agent market, we should resign him. He's really come back down to earth a great start this season. Seems like we could divide his minutes up between Jones and TO and do just fine.

Jack is getting better about his tunrovers, but still isn't a great decision maker for stretches when the game is on the line.

This team is so tough to evaluate w/o Oden in the post. I think with him in the mix, we won't need so mutch scoring from the bench and we can let some players walk that aren't thrilled with their bench roles (Jack in particular).

I was pretty impressed with McRoberts enegry in Summer League and really seem him as nice park plug off the bench (ala Milsap for Utah).


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

we need to just cut miles..seriously


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## alext42083 (Nov 7, 2003)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



darkhelmit54 said:


> My hope/plan/desires:
> use combo or all of Jack, Frye, Outlaw, and pick to get:
> 1) Iggy


Getting Andre Iguodala here would be awesome. I think he would fit in perfectly. He showed me a lot that he has a pretty nice jumper with good range.
He's athletic as hell and can D up on anyone.

I wonder what it'd take to get him. Looks like he might be a FA in '09.


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## BlayZa (Dec 31, 2002)

roy/rudy/?/lma/oden

rudy and roy could be a swing backcourt as they are both great ballhandlers , same size , and good scorers and assist-men. 

? = player via trade or FA , hopefully darius + tempting filler (jack/webster/sergio) could get this done , or at least clear some room.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

<-=*PdX*=-> said:


> ^NO WAY I want AK47 on this team! NO WAY!!!


you wouldn't trade Miles, Jack, and Webster or Outlaw for him? I wouldn't trade A LOT for him, but he's an awesome player if used correctly and his value isn't very high right now.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



alext42083 said:


> Getting Andre Iguodala here would be awesome. I think he would fit in perfectly. He showed me a lot that he has a pretty nice jumper with good range.
> He's athletic as hell and can D up on anyone.
> 
> I wonder what it'd take to get him. Looks like he might be a FA in '09.


I've been saying that for about a year, but now that his value's dropping and our players values are increasing it might become a borderline reality. He can't be thrilled about the way the team's playing, them expecting him to be the first option (which he's not) and not paying him like one either, and the salary type trades, especially if Miller's next he might be ready to get out of there.

I think if things continue the way they are (and Miller is traded) by the trade deadline we might be able to get ahold of something like Jack, Outlaw, and our pick for him. At that point he might really help push us over the edge to legit contendors this year adn Roy could move over to point. Maybe Frye and Outlaw, I don't know but he's not happy and they're not happy, and I'm sure they aren't thrilled with the games that they're winning right now killing their shot at draft picks more and more just like last year.

this season (jack and outlaw gone)
Blake/Sergio
Roy/Webster
Iggy/Jones/Miles
Aldridge/Frye/Miles
Pryzbilla/Raef

next season?
Roy/Sergio/Green/Koponen
Iggy/Fernandez
Webster/Jones?/Miles?
Aldridge/Frye/Mcroberts
Oden/Pryzbilla/Freeland


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## craigehlo (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



darkhelmit54 said:


> I think if things continue the way they are (and Miller is traded) by the trade deadline we might be able to get ahold of something like Jack, Outlaw, and our pick for him.


There's no way Philly would listen to that conversation unless Roy, Oden or LMA are involved. Iguodala is the player that they are building around and was the reason they traded Iverson away. If they were to trade him, they would need a legit NBA star in return for ticket selling reasons alone. 

I think the SF that we could swing a deal for would be Corey Maggette. He's on a floundering team and is due for a new contract if he opts out this summer. Maybe a sign and trade with LaFrenz's expiring contract plus some cheap players & picks?


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## JAFO (Jul 2, 2006)

MAS RipCity said:


> we need to just cut miles..seriously


I loudly second that!!!

Plus Green's contract expires after this season and Kopponen and Freeland are not signed, so do not count against the 15-man roster and are stashed in Europe for a very good reason; so they can be brought in to replace future expiring contracts or be included in future trades along about 2009-2010. I'll keep the current 15-man roster minus Green and Miles adding as their replacements Fernandez and the Blazer's First Round Draft Pick for 2008. This is the start of the Blazer Dynasty and I'll re-evaluate at the end of the 2008 season.

JAFO


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## DucRider (Dec 22, 2007)

For 2008-9 Opening night
5 - GO/Joel
4 - LMA/Frye/(McBob or lottery stud from the trade that eventually moves in front of Frye)
3 - Roy/Jones
2 - Webster/Rudy
1 - TBD (Tony Parker?)/Blake/Sergio

Everytime I think about the future lineups, I keep seeing B-Roy as Pippen like, using the 3 to control the ball, with defense and spot up shooting from the 1 and 2, guys that can get back on D and off on the break. I put Parker in there because I think KP would only bring someone in that has deep playoff experience, if not a ring or 3, and knows how to play with B-Roy, does not have to be the #1 guy. 

These guys and the 2008 pick are probablly gone:
Miles
Green
Jack
Outlaw
Lafrentz


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## cpt.napalm (Feb 23, 2005)

Oden
Roy
Rudy
Sergio
LMA
Freeland
Lafrentz
Miles
Blake
Joel
Mcroberts
Frye
Green
Jack
Jones
Webster
Outlaw


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



craigehlo said:


> There's no way Philly would listen to that conversation unless Roy, Oden or LMA are involved. Iguodala is the player that they are building around and was the reason they traded Iverson away. If they were to trade him, they would need a legit NBA star in return for ticket selling reasons alone.
> 
> I think the SF that we could swing a deal for would be Corey Maggette. He's on a floundering team and is due for a new contract if he opts out this summer. Maybe a sign and trade with LaFrenz's expiring contract plus some cheap players & picks?


They might want a little more, but if they don't think he's going to re-sign, then it's tough, they don't want a pissed off player all year and many fans are frustrated watching him try to play like a star and turn it over (who should he pass it to?). Maybe if it was Jack-Outlaw-Pick-Frye for Iggy and filler that'd be more appealing but that'd be a lot to give up. He's a second teir player worthy of about 10 million a year, Philly knows that and won't resign him for more, but they're asking him to play first tier.

BTW stars are almost never traded for stars, just doesn't happen.

Maggette is a whiny boring player who just takes it to the whole and gets fouled and he can't shoot and plays selective defense. His best attribute is that he works out a lot. I'd much rather see Outlaw, Jones, Martell, or Rudy getting some burn out there than Maggette.


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## andalusian (Jun 29, 2006)

I see the 15 men roster like this:

#4 / #5:
Big Greg / LaMarcus / Thrilla / Frye / Outlaw / McBob

#3: 
Jones / Outlaw / Roy 

#1 / #2:

Roy / Blake / Jack / Rudy / Sergio / Green

Bench or retirement:

Miles

To be determined: 

Draft Pick

If Miles retires:

Playboy or Freeland. Probably Freeland to help with rebounding.


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## craigehlo (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



darkhelmit54 said:


> Maggette is a whiny boring player who just takes it to the whole and gets fouled and he can't shoot and plays selective defense. His best attribute is that he works out a lot. I'd much rather see Outlaw, Jones, Martell, or Rudy getting some burn out there than Maggette.


Maggette isn't flashy, but is a nice slasher that can take it to rim when Roy is double teamed and the rest of the guys are taking too many long jumpers. While I like TO, Martell and Jones, none of them have the moves to get to the rim and get high percentage shots like Maggette. This team has perhaps fallen a little too in love with the 3-pointer during the win streak and could use some more points in the paint.

Again, trying to pry Andre Iguodala from the 76ers is pretty absurd without giving up one of our core 3 players (Oden, Roy & LMA). It's as unrealistic as the Richard Jefferson for Zbo talk that was floating around this board last season.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



MAS RipCity said:


> C- Greg Oden/Joel Przybilla
> PF-LaMarcus Aldridge/Channing Frye/Josh McRoberts
> SF-James Jones/Travis Outlaw
> SG-Martell Webster/Rudy Fernandez
> PG-Brandon Roy/Steve Blake/Sergio Rodriguez


This is exactly what i would do except for switch Martell and Rudy. I think Rudy will start his first season... the ONLY thing that might hinder that would be his trouble speaking English. He is too good of a player to come off the bench, imo.

I guess mine would go somethin like...

Oden - Pryzbilla
Aldridge - Frye - McRoberts
Fernandez - Outlaw - Jones
Roy - Webster
Blake - Rodriguez

same players.. a bit different lineup. Nate will play around with it anyway, and find the one that gives us the best chance to win, the best bench, the best at working together and meshing. I think it will end up bein' somethin' like that.

Championship within' 3 years from next year, imo.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

Also, i think that getting Iguodala would be pretty easy...

Outlaw, Jack, 1st round pick for Iguodala... 

then we need to find a way to get rid of Freeland, Kaponen, Green, LaFrentz, and Miles and we will be good!


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## craigehlo (Feb 24, 2005)

MrJayremmie said:


> Also, i think that getting Iguodala would be pretty easy...
> 
> Outlaw, Jack, 1st round pick for Iguodala...


If that was a top 3 pick, sure. If that's a pick in the mid-teens or later, then no way.

Andre Iguodala is a top 10 SF in the NBA. You can't just trade two bench players with modest success early in the season and expect to land him. I think this 13-game streak is starting to get to Blazer fans' heads a bit too much.


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## MrJayremmie (Dec 29, 2007)

Outlaw is a stud, and many many teams will want him. He will be hot on the market. Jack is solid, at WORST he will be a 7th man in philly, most likely a starter. The pick will be what, like 14-17... maybe give them one next year... Iguodala might not re-sign with them, so why not have them get somethin' for him? We could always throw in extra's like Miles, LaFrentz, Green or cash, or future considerations, or like i said another pick (next years 1st or this years 2nd)... I think it is possible to get Iguodala withouht trading any of our big 4 and have him as the final piece.

Oden
Aldridge
Iguodala
Fernandez
Roy

Just a thought. Maggettee is someone i hope isn't even in consideration.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

craigehlo said:


> If that was a top 3 pick, sure. If that's a pick in the mid-teens or later, then no way.
> 
> Andre Iguodala is a top 10 SF in the NBA. You can't just trade two bench players with modest success early in the season and expect to land him. I think this 13-game streak is starting to get to Blazer fans' heads a bit too much.


Iggy is about to hit the prime of his career... he's easily Phili's best player. Comparing the two rosters, he probably only trails Oden in trade value. And they're to give him up for 2 of Portland's rotation players and what looks to be a mid to late 1st???

Good grief. Maybe KP throws in McBob to make it really enticing for them?

STOMP


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## Hector (Nov 15, 2004)

MrJayremmie said:


> Also, i think that getting Iguodala would be pretty easy...
> 
> Outlaw, Jack, 1st round pick for Iguodala...
> 
> then we need to find a way to get rid of Freeland, Kaponen, Green, LaFrentz, and Miles and we will be good!


Freeland and Kaponen will definitely be decent players. Green might be, at about the Telfair level after a few years.

Each draft, Pritchard is praised for the quantity of players he trades for or buys with Paul Allen's money. Now you see what good they really are. There just isn't room. Some of the hubbub each draft day is over players who will have to be disposed of later, without ever playing for us.


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## chairman (Jul 2, 2006)

MrJayremmie said:


> Outlaw is a stud, and many many teams will want him. He will be hot on the market. Jack is solid, at WORST he will be a 7th man in philly, most likely a starter. The pick will be what, like 14-17... maybe give them one next year... Iguodala might not re-sign with them, so why not have them get somethin' for him? We could always throw in extra's like Miles, LaFrentz, Green or cash, or future considerations, or like i said another pick (next years 1st or this years 2nd)... I think it is possible to get Iguodala withouht trading any of our big 4 and have him as the final piece.
> 
> Oden
> Aldridge
> ...


Iquodala would be difficult to get. But if we did get him that easily then I would be even more suspicious of his selfishness than I already am. The guy is an unbelieveable talent (no doubt)and he reminds me of another AZ wildcat. (Arenas) And quite frankly I would not want either one of them. I could easily be wrong, but I am not sure he fits in our team concept.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

*Re: Consolodate The Roster*



craigehlo said:


> Again, trying to pry Andre Iguodala from the 76ers is pretty absurd without giving up one of our core 3 players (Oden, Roy & LMA). It's as unrealistic as the Richard Jefferson for Zbo talk that was floating around this board last season.


It's a longshot and would probably require some circumstances in our favor, BUT Iggy's value is very down, his future is very uncertain, the sixers are winning too much, and some of our guys values have gone up (Frye, Outlaw) so there are already some circumstances going in our favor, who would've thought we were gonna get Oden, who thought we'd go on a 13 game winning streak w/o him. 

Besides all three of our guys have much value than Iggy, Lamarcus is one of the most athletic 4's in the game putting up stats as good as Iggy while younger and A BIG, Greg is A BIG that's extremely hyped, and Roy is hypothetically about the same talent wise, but Roy is happy and his contract situation is much better, and he's on a winning team leading them!

Who of LMA, Oden, or Roy's ability are the sixers gonna get for Iggy. 

The only real great value situation I could see happening are a shakeup move for Chicago and Philadelphia involving Deng and Iguodala, they're about the same ability wise, their contract situations are similiar, their teams are both struggling, and Iggy is from Chicago.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

MrJayremmie said:


> Outlaw is a stud, and many many teams will want him. He will be hot on the market. Jack is solid, at WORST he will be a 7th man in philly, most likely a starter. The pick will be what, like 14-17... maybe give them one next year... Iguodala might not re-sign with them, so why not have them get somethin' for him? We could always throw in extra's like Miles, LaFrentz, Green or cash, or future considerations, or like i said another pick (next years 1st or this years 2nd)... I think it is possible to get Iguodala withouht trading any of our big 4 and have him as the final piece.
> 
> Oden
> Aldridge
> ...


I've been dreaming of that type of thing ever since we got the top pick. Iggy would fit perfectly and I've posted that about 10,000 times. I think Philly would need a little more honestly, but there are guys w could find a way to sweeten the whole thing with. Only change I would make is having Martell in there as a starter, we need another less agressive player in there with the rest of the lineup who's okay playing a little more passive on O, and Sergio & Rudy being the focus of a mean second unit (with Frye and Pryz and whoever's hot between Martell, Roy, and Iggy at 3) is a dynamite second unit and up the tempo, they'd turn our leads into blowouts on teams tired from our first unit.

after trading Outlaw/Jack/Jones/our pick (just hypothetical)

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2004~2386~557~2768~2009~2015~1823~933~2423&teams=14~22~14~20~14~20~22~20~20&te=&cash=

too big to happen but I like the concept, Miami can make their push stronger with the added firepower and get a replacement back for Kopono, Philadelphia gets young talent, tons of cap room, and losses for a draft pick, we consolidate and get Iggy (who is probably excited to be a third option/play with good big men/play on a good team/be with his buddy Frye. The thing would be PR trouble probably though, although his dunks would make up for it in a matter of a few weeks.

Here's our rotation

Oden/Pryz
Aldridge/Frye
Webster
Iguodala/Fernandez
Roy/Sergio

victory cigars: Mcroberts, Green, Koponen, Freeland


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

STOMP said:


> Iggy is about to hit the prime of his career... he's easily Phili's best player. Comparing the two rosters, he probably only trails Oden in trade value.
> STOMP


I'm Iggy's biggest fan, with that said, you're delusional. He is a very talented second or third option being asked to be a first option, Roy is a proven clutch leader, Aldridge is younger and has incredible potential who isn't doing too shabby now and bigs always have better value. Stop exaggerating.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

chairman said:


> Iquodala would be difficult to get. But if we did get him that easily then I would be even more suspicious of his selfishness than I already am. The guy is an unbelieveable talent (no doubt)and he reminds me of another AZ wildcat. (Arenas) And quite frankly I would not want either one of them. I could easily be wrong, but I am not sure he fits in our team concept.


he's had 30 games of being accused of selfish play on one of the least talented teams in the entire NBA, but the whole rest of his career (college and NBA) he's been nothing but a very well rounded, very aggressive, team player, who's been accused of being too unselfish. Who is he supposed to pass to right now?


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

darkhelmit54 said:


> I'm Iggy's biggest fan, with that said, you're *delusional*.


and you're continuing to have a tough time understanding our single simple rule here... is that because you're so well thought out?



> He is a very talented second or third option being asked to be a first option, Roy is a proven clutch leader, Aldridge is younger and has incredible potential who isn't doing too shabby now and bigs always have better value. Stop exaggerating.


Pretending to be the President of Iggy's fan club doesn't allow you to have the sole opinion expressed on the board... sorry. Shooting isn't Iguadala's best trait true dat, but he is a top wing defender, passer, athlete, and a proven ironman. I rate him right there with LA and Roy. I'm sure fans here would choose their own as thats what home fans generally do, but if you want a more unbiased response feel free to post your silly trade on the nba board. After they're done laughing at you, tell them they are all delusional so they can enjoy another.

STOMP


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## Trader Ed (Jun 17, 2002)

I can see us making a trade before the deadline. But if we are going strong and have a lot of wins... I can see us waiting until the draft too. Both strategies work

I can see us trading Jack + Frye or Jack + Martell for a piece of the puzzle. With Rudy coming over next year I think it makes it an easy choice to move Jack if need be. Although I still think he has a role right now. But not in the long term. Long term I think Sergio or Green will be the backup PG, and Rudy will be the SG of choice.

If we can improve our backup PF spot I think it will be Jack + Frye, if its SG or SF oriented... I think it will be Jack + Matell. I like Martell & Travis, but I think we need Jones more. His vet savvy and shooting is nice to have right now. He is a player I can see us resigning and keeping as a role player for a few years to come. He fills a need. Travis can be dealt for the right deal

I agree with ED in that Sergio is a year plan away.. combined with Rudy.... 

I still want to upgrade at PG though somehow.... with Blake as backup and Sergio/Green/Kopnen as backups

Roy should stay at SG

PG ?, Blake, Sergio/Green/Koponen
SG Roy, Fernandez, ?
SF ?, Jones, Travis
PF LMA, ?, McRoberts
C Oden, Przybilla, Frye?

2008 draft pick

Not in the cards for 2009
Jack, Webster?, Miles, LeFrentz, Sergio/Green/Koponen


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

STOMP said:


> and you're continuing to have a tough time understanding our single simple rule here... is that because you're so well thought out?
> 
> Pretending to be the President of Iggy's fan club doesn't allow you to have the sole opinion expressed on the board... sorry. Shooting isn't Iguadala's best trait true dat, but he is a top wing defender, passer, athlete, and a proven ironman. I rate him right there with LA and Roy. I'm sure fans here would choose their own as thats what home fans generally do, but if you want a more unbiased response feel free to post your silly trade on the nba board. After they're done laughing at you, tell them they are all delusional so they can enjoy another.
> 
> STOMP


Well Mr. Premium User I wouldn't consider delusional to be that big of an insult, just kidding around. I was saying he's worth more than that poster was for one thing, and I was giving reasons why to us LMA and Roy are more valuable than Iggy and saying that I don't think Philly gets that kind of value for either of them, which is accurate. Thanks for all your excellent social analysis though, it should help me grow into a stronger and more well-rounded person.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

darkhelmit54 said:


> Well Mr. Premium User I wouldn't consider delusional to be that big of an insult, just kidding around. I was saying he's worth more than that poster was for one thing, and I was giving reasons why to us LMA and Roy are more valuable than Iggy and saying that I don't think Philly gets that kind of value for either of them, which is accurate. Thanks for all your excellent social analysis though, it should help me grow into a stronger and more well-rounded person.


thanks for the clarification  here's Wikipedia's definition of delusion

_"Delusional disorder is a psychiatric diagnosis denoting a psychotic mental illness that involves holding one or more non-bizarre delusions in the absence of any other significant psychopathology (signs or symptoms of mental illness)"._

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delusional_disorder

better to just avoid that sort of stuff all together... attack the post you disagree with not the poster.

and as far as being a Premium member, that just means I donated 20$ to help keep a site I enjoy up and running. You'll notice many of the regulars here have done this

STOMP


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

How about this: The assertion that Iggy is worth only slightly less than Oden (and more than Roy) is patently absurd. Obviously a delusional madman took over your account for that post, because a well-informed poster such as yourself would never make such an asanine remark.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

BlazerCaravan said:


> How about this: The assertion that Iggy is worth only slightly less than Oden (and more than Roy) is patently absurd.


I realize you're trying to be funny, but I didn't say any of that

STOMP


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

STOMP said:


> I realize you're trying to be funny, but I didn't say any of that
> 
> STOMP





STOMP said:


> Comparing the two rosters, he probably only trails Oden in trade value.


That's what it sounds like to me.


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

me too you joke


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

darkhelmit54 said:


> me too you joke


Quit eroding your arguing position by acting like this. STOMP probably has a good reason for saying what he did (I still think his account was hijacked); he's a respected and intelligent dude.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

BlazerCaravan said:


> That's what it sounds like to me.


How do you get slightly less from my saying IMO Iguadala trails only Oden in trade value? The Knicks are trailing the Celtics, are they only slightly behind? Further, saying trailing only Oden could mean that I place about equal NBA trade value on AI as Roy and LA... right? 

I hope that helps

STOMP


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

Trails only Oden DEFINETELY implies that you think he's ahead of Roy and Aldridge. In a race how often is the runner trailing only the guy in first exactly in the same spot as two other guys? Stop trying to cover yourself, it's rediculous, you basically said in common langauge that Oden > Iggy > Aldridge & Roy, you can take it back if you want or admit that you made an error in phrasing it but that's what 95% of people would take by the way you used terminology so that would make you in the wrong.

STOMP


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

STOMP said:


> Your demonstrating some creative reading comprehension here. How do you get slightly less from my saying IMO Iguadala trails only Oden in trade value? The Knicks are trailing the Celtics, are they only slightly behind? Further, saying trailing only Oden could mean that I place about equal NBA trade value on AI as Roy and LA... right?
> 
> I hope that helps
> 
> STOMP




I get "slightly less" this way:

1 - AI is second (maybe) only to Oden in trade value. That maybe is problematic, because it could mean he's worth less than our second-best player, or more than Oden. We'll eliminate it from the equation, because either assertion is beyond the scope.

2 - Oden is not so much better than Roy and Aldridge, having (a) not played an NBA game yet, and (b) not shown yet how well the knee has healed. Unknowns, to be sure, that put his ceiling no less high, but his current value maybe a little less than on draft day.

3 - I had to make a mental judgement: Oden has higher trade value than Roy, but given Roy's value, not by much. Roy's ceiling is lower, but he's proving to be A Real Value.

4 - If we're placing AI's value at the exact same level as Roy's, this means that AI is worth only slightly less than Oden.

5 - However, AI is second only to Oden in trade value. Since no clear remark was made that Roy has equal value, I made the decision that you meant to say that AI was more valuable than Roy.

Now, I see (and it's easy to see) how there are some flaws in my logic. But you should now be able to see how I came to this conclusion. If you want to say that AI has much less value than Oden, say so. If you want to say that AI has the same value as Roy, say so. If people are calling you delusional because they misread your statement, clarify it. And not just defensively. Go all the way. Don't give me "could mean". You're just obfuscating things further.

So: Is AI worth more than Roy? Is he worth more than LMA? Is he worth Oden? Is he worth a combination of other players? If so, which ones?


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

darkhelmit54 said:


> Trails only Oden DEFINETELY implies that you think he's ahead of Roy and Aldridge. In a race how often is the runner trailing only the guy in first exactly in the same spot as two other guys? Stop trying to cover yourself, it's rediculous, you basically said in common langauge that Oden > Iggy > Aldridge & Roy, you can take it back if you want or admit that you made an error in phrasing it but that's what 95% of people would take by the way you used terminology so that would make you in the wrong.
> 
> STOMP


good grief... what a convoluted load of crap

I don't think AI is valued more then Roy or Aldridge. I could see legit arguments that one player is better then another, but I think in the overall views would have them around equal... thats how I see them and thats exactly what I was implying.

An example of this... Dallas trails only the Spurs in their division, but the Hornets are equal to them record wise

I think Oden has significant more trade value then any of the three

Spin that

STOMP


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

STOMP said:


> Spin that


Okay. Why do you want to trade Roy for AI?


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

BlazerCaravan said:


> Okay. Why do you want to trade Roy for AI?


Heh... to expand on Oden, knee micro and all, I'm still higher on him then most here. I recall a DHoward trade hypothical where the board seemed to unanomously go for DH... thats not me. I wouldn't trade him for anyone in the league other then LaBron. If he avoids complications (knock on wood) I'm positive dude is going to absolutely crush.

STOMP


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## darkhelmit54 (Jan 23, 2005)

Finally something we agree on, however that steals leaves a jam at 3/4 between Outlaw, Frye, Jones, Webster, and Miles. And a jam at 1/2 with Roy, Blake, Jack, Rodriguez, Fernandez, and Green/Koponen. We've seen Jack, he's not changing and his best attribute is steadiness and free throw shooting...c'mon. So what do we do with our guys to get the ones we really value time?


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## BlazerCaravan (Aug 12, 2004)

Seriously, it might be easier just to keep Roy, LMA, and Oden, then force each of the following groups to draw straws:

Miles, Green, Kapponen, McBob
Jack, Sergio, Rudy
Webster, Jones, Outlaw

And keep two out of each group.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

darkhelmit54 said:


> So what do we do with our guys to get the ones we really value time?


I've laid out my guess as to how the team might best deal with the present and future several times now. I'm for packaging some youngins with DM's deal for an overpriced vet expiring on time (2009) + picks. I'd like to resign Jones at a reasonable rate over 4 years or so, but I wouldn't be willing to break the bank for him or any of Portland's SFs. I think they've enough talent within the organization right now to be competing for a championship starting next season without dealing for other contributing players. To me KP has shown himself to be a pretty astute judge of young players, so future picks equals future contributers and I'd guess he'd make wise use of cap space as well... one would think that quality FAs would be lining up to play in Portland for a shot at a ring. Anyhoo, I'm not for giving up on Webster/Outlaw/Sergio/Jack etc... so much as parlaying them into talent to be named later. 

Of course if some GM decides to hold a fire sale plans could change. I'm also sure that Portland's logjam of young talent is apparent to the rest of the league so plenty of offers should be coming in. 

STOMP


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## LameR (Jan 4, 2004)

BlazerCaravan said:


> Seriously, it might be easier just to keep Roy, LMA, and Oden, then force each of the following groups to draw straws:
> 
> Miles, Green, Kapponen, McBob
> Jack, Sergio, Rudy
> ...


Haha nice.


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