# GRADEN from realgm confirms that JC&ERob have been traded!!!!!!!!



## unBULLievable (Dec 13, 2002)

*A well respected poster on REALGM ,GRADEN who happens to have an inside source confirmed that Jamal and ERob have been traded!!!!!* 

Sitting Bull is right, my bulls guy said that a deal including Crawford and Robinson went down. 

This sucks!!! What is happening here, Paxson should be fired for his moves. 

I need to know GROBs contract right now!


http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=212936&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=48


It could be for gRob ..it could be for someone else

Apparently Sitting Bull was right


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>unBULLievable</b>!
> *A well respected poster on REALGM ,GRADEN who happens to have an inside source confirmed that Jamal and ERob have been traded!!!!!*
> 
> Sitting Bull is right, my bulls guy said that a deal including Crawford and Robinson went down.
> ...


Well if it's going to happen it's going to happen. Tommy Williams would have loved this partnah Bow wow wow yippee yo yippee yay.

I hope someone pulls out of this trade.


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## Chi_Lunatic (Aug 20, 2002)

If that happens...I resign as a bulls fan..that **** is ABSURD


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## ChiBulls2315 (Aug 11, 2002)

If this is true, I'm going to be pissed. Chalk up another trade that sets the Bulls back years. **** that.


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## unBULLievable (Dec 13, 2002)

Apparently Pax has made up his mind about Jamal.

I think it would've been more painful watching him sign elsewhere during the summer.



Paxson's plan is starting to unfold.

I trust the MadPax...although I hate losing jC but I'm a Bulls fan.

TEam first..players second.

That GRob contract will come handy for trades on draft night!


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## BSchmaranz (May 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>unBULLievable</b>!
> That GRob contract will come handy for trades on draft night!


That's a very good point, perhaps Pax already has something lined up for the offseason?


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## unBULLievable (Dec 13, 2002)

Yeah..let's say we trade Tyson and GRob plus a future pick for the soon to be rebuilding Celtics.What better way to know that after a year they are going to have millions to spend.Same could be said for Orlando and tMAC...


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## remlover (Jan 22, 2004)

If the bulls make the JC-Grob trade then making the Orlando deal is a must, maybe not a must, but would sure help. Lue would be a solid backup for Kirk (no i dont want brunson out there). 

On paper it looks like the bulls get raped but as people are starting to realize we will have flexiability and grob's contrcat will become rather appealing come draft night and next year for sure. 

a guard/forward rotation after the deals would be a lot better then what we have now. 
Grob/mckie/gordon
Mckie/Gordon(if deal made)/Gill
Kirk/Lue (if deal made)

I sure love the idea of trading jamal and getting something then getting nothing when he signs somewhere else.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

Really don't care who this Graden is, and since he is not a member of Bulls management, this deal isn't confirmed until the Bulls make a formal announcement.

Getting real tired of people and they're so called sources.

This trade SUCKS btw.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

hmmm, I like getting McKie. Hes the type of player we need desperately. I think getting Glenn Robinson will be a very important part of this deal. Not only can he play the SF for now, but his contract ends the year we need to be looking to sign Chandler and Curry back.

So being an ultimate optimist, JYD isnt happy here and JC is leaving in offseason anyways. McKie is a gritty veteran who hustles and all that jazz, and Grob puts us in a much better situation money wise. 

but talent for talent, we are getting royally screwed in this deal. Thats assuming its true, which I'm still skeptical because of GBs little prank, and because I find it hard to believe Philly would want Crawford in a backcourt next to Iverson. Although it does make for an interesting combination.


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## C3Dreaming (Apr 18, 2003)

If Paxson has concluded that Crawford is not part of the puzzle and is not prepared to match offers, he is looking to get some value. I can understand this. It’s better than a free walk.

I disagree and would match offers for Crawford. Nonetheless.

OT:- Complaint. Second time around here. If reports were true, Denver would have accepted our pick and Crawford for the #3. Now we stopped all discussions after Jwills injury. Failed to bite the bullet. #7 and Marshall with Toronto . Same problem. Either Melo or Wade would have been better than Hinrich (as good as he has been).

Well atleast he is now following his instincts which he did not do earlier. But it has cost us a year and he is now selling low compared to when he came into the job.

Crawford, ****. I just have this fear he will turn out to be something great. Catalyst for a championship team, not likely, but Top 20. Could be? For some reason I feel he will be better than either Curry or Chandler. Curry skills, Chandler heart. Unfortunately neither has both.

So we will have some flexibility next year (and the following with Davis). With the hope of drafting Okafor, I smell Chandler and GRobinson for some max player out there. But I don’t think you get championship quality players for a salary dump (see Sheed trade). It’s either draft for FA.

So Paxson must get us under the salary cap to make a max offer for someone like McGrady (he can opt out after next year?) and hope that the development of Curry, Chandler and Hinrich will be enough to attract him. Lets be clear, with this move Paxson has concluded that this team will not win the title, let alone conference in the next 3 years.

BTW, if we were the Knicks we do not do this trade. Knicks would keep Crawford regardless of cost, because the talent is there and then deal with it if the promise did not materialize. We have been cheap since we missed out on the FA's post Jordan.


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>C3Dreaming</b>!
> Crawford, ****. I just have this fear he will turn out to be something great. Catalyst for a championship team, not likely, but Top 20. Could be? For some reason I feel he will be better than either Curry or Chandler. Curry skills, Chandler heart. Unfortunately neither has both.


I don't see why not, he's definitely changing his game under Skiles, so it's obvious to me that he knows what his weaknesses are and wants to improve, and there's no question he has a lot of strengths. Also people seem to not know his numbers in PPG, RPG, and APG have gone up every year since he's been in the league, no reason for him to not be end up being a star in this league.


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## C3Dreaming (Apr 18, 2003)

Arenas, don't get me wrong. I would retain JC and think he will continue to improve. For me, worst case is Derek Anderson type of player, best mm'm Ray Allen. Not quite his shot, but a better play maker.

Ray Allen is an All Star in IMO top 20 talent.

Are either of these good enough to be the catalyst for a championship team. No. Can he still be a valued member of the roster? Yes.

Who are the catalysts for a championship team? Duncan, Shaq. thats it. Garnett could not get it done until the talent improved (TWolves my tip to win this year). McGrady? As much as I love him, probably not. AI at his peak?

I dont think Crawford is this person, nor anyone else on the roster. Hence Paxson is preparing to go to well to try and find his gem, most likely via trade or FA.


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## Benny the Bull (Jul 25, 2002)

I use to read the RealGM boards regularly, and I'm not disputing Graden, but he has been wrong at times, so its no given this deal happens, especially with JC.

I don't see Big Dog coming to the Bulls. We traded Rose. If we take Big Dog, we would be getting someone like Rose, who is a nut case. I don't see the logic in the deal, because cap wise, we likely will be using money to resign Chandler and Curry.


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## RetroDreams (Jun 9, 2002)

I just don't see how any self-respecting GM, let alone everyday casual basketball fan, would ever do any trade in which Glenn would be traded for Jamal AND another player... I wouldn't do it straight up and to add another player is insult to injury.


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## giusd (Apr 17, 2003)

Paxson is not trading for grob he is not a paxson like player. He plays no d, is selfish, and lost his game long ago. paxson traded rose for almost nothing he is not going to bring in someone like him.

david


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Instead of everyone getting all bent out of shape over a messageboard post, let us wait and see for sure what the media brings us today. 

We have sources here as well and they say they are not hearing this. Either way, let's wait and see if it is true. 

I have my opinions on this trade if it does go down with Crawford in the mix. I will post them, if they become a reality.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

2 thoughts. 

Graden is a great guy. but he isnt infallible. His source has been right less then he has been wrong. Only Vic was worth listening too cause he was tight with the Pax family. And he was driven away by some of the posters there

Second, if Glenn robinson were really coming to Chicago, it would show how shallow Paxs sphere of influence really is. He doesnt seem to be really interested in a player unless they have some kind of Chicago connection. AD had his wife. Brunson, Blount, Pippen were all Bulls before. Skiles was relatively local. He went after Walker who is a Chicagoan. Gill is a local kid. Wade was his first choice, who was local. He is going to have to greatly expand that sphere of influence if this team is going to take a step in the right direction

having said that, I dont think graden is right. but let it be known that I think he is a really good guy


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

I hate that site. Too many f'n popups.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> I hate that site. Too many f'n popups.


too many popups, but some good people. too bad a couple of bad apples have made it hard for some people to go to it


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> too many popups, but some good people. too bad a couple of bad apples have made it hard for some people to go to it


Which page is GRADEN's post on? THere's like 7 pages and I'm getting swallowed up by pop-ups.

Agreed, there are some fine posters there IMO.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> 
> 
> Which page is GRADEN's post on? THere's like 7 pages and I'm getting swallowed up by pop-ups.
> ...


its too bad that there could be 25 great people there, but since they cant control the 4 or 5 bad apples, it just kills the place.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>unBULLievable</b>!
> *A well respected poster on REALGM ,GRADEN who happens to have an inside source confirmed that Jamal and ERob have been traded!!!!!*
> 
> Sitting Bull is right, my bulls guy said that a deal including Crawford and Robinson went down.
> ...


Color me blind but I don't see any posts from GRADEN, unless it got deleted recently.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> 
> 
> Which page is GRADEN's post on? THere's like 7 pages and I'm getting swallowed up by pop-ups.
> ...


Go to Mozilla.com and download their browser.

Its shareware, creating by programmers from what used to be netscape--except its much better. Options to eliminate pop-ups; good password recognition; this neat way you can scan through links; and a tab function. 

I switched because it was safer. It seems like so many web-virus's are targeted to Internet Explorer/Micorsoft software. 

Everyone should check it out, *this is my good dead for the day...*


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> too many popups, but some good people. too bad a couple of bad apples have made it hard for some people to go to it


Slightly OT, but I've checked it out again over the last couple of days and I was shocked.

1st, I went to check out their Hawks affiliate's interview with Rasheed Wallace and got bombarded with file transfer requests (they allow their advertizers to try and send unsolicited files... most likely spyware). Totally nasty.

2nd, I saw at least two mods there basically telling people they should get lost and not post there anymore. Without casting too much of a stone, I'll just say that's about as opposite as you can get from what I think the right way to go about things is. Even the people I disagree with I want here, posting, and happy... that's what makes a good environment (at least IMNSHO .).


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

*Re: Re: GRADEN from realgm confirms that JC&ERob have been traded!!!!!!!!*



> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> 
> 
> Color me blind but I don't see any posts from GRADEN, unless it got deleted recently.


http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=212936&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=36

Page 4, half way down.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>C.C.C.P</b>!
> 
> 
> Go to Mozilla.com and download their browser.
> ...


Yeah I've used Mozilla, ZoneAlarm, Norton, and another pop-up stopper on my home PC. However on my work computer I do not. Maybe that's being reckless but its really not a problem with most sites.


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## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> 
> 
> Slightly OT, but I've checked it out again over the last couple of days and I was shocked.
> ...


Mozilla, Mozilla, Mozilla. I'm serious folks, check it out.

Oh, and if this trade goes down, this is strike three and I'm out as a Bulls fan. 

I've had enough...


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## SecretAgentGuy (Jul 15, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>C.C.C.P</b>!
> 
> 
> Go to Mozilla.com and download their browser.
> ...


Yeah, Mozilla is awesome. Also, check out www.opera.com


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> 
> 
> Slightly OT, but I've checked it out again over the last couple of days and I was shocked.
> ...


You know, they will attack guys there who are basically good people. But then will actually show respect for the bullies of the board. the guys who have nothing to say, but just want to tear everything down that others say. It doesnt make any sense to me. Like I said, they have great people over there. But as is the case with life, a few bad apples ruins a bunch. They just havent gotten rid of those apples


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>C.C.C.P</b>!
> 
> 
> Mozilla, Mozilla, Mozilla. I'm serious folks, check it out.


LOL, I know... this is just from my work computer 

I've got a good popup blocker for home, although I haven't tried the latest Mozilla


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Realgm has some good posters. I agree. Some post here. Some do not.


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## Wynn (Jun 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 2 thoughts.
> 
> Graden is a great guy. but he isnt infallible. His source has been right less then he has been wrong. Only Vic was worth listening too cause he was tight with the Pax family. And he was driven away by some of the posters there
> ...


Absolute textbook class, my friend. I don't weigh in often enough in your discussions (I have a job! ), but I love the way you separate the issue from the poster.

I'd just like to say that I'm against getting Big Dog. Besides, then we trade our small forward (lack of) problem for a guard (lack of) problem. This solution would be treading water at best. i hope Pax decides to match Crawdaddy. I'm loving the attitude I'm seeing out of the kid, and consistent play will follow a good attitiude.

Peace!


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> 
> 
> LOL, I know... this is just from my work computer
> ...


LOL, Mike. What would us working people do w/o BB.net?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

i have had many conversations with Graden. And like I said, I really like him. he is a good guy. but he used to post Finley to the Bulls are imminent threads all the time. that never happened. So id put less weight here. But I do believe Graden truly believes his source. the onus isnt on Graden, cause all he is trying to do is post and share his knowledge of the game, which is very good, but on the bad feed he gets. But I have enjoyed my conversations with him on a personal level. And if he wanted to post here, id welcome him here anytime. even if i dont like his source. he is more then a guy with a connection


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

I just want to let everyone know that we need to wait and see what happens. I reiterate this because I have sources too. All i can say is that the sources refutes the trade rumor of Big Dog for jamal. (no I will not reveal my sources) However, I would not post this if I didn't believe them. 

So until the trade deadline comes and goes or until the Big Dog trade actually comes about (which I am told is not true), why get all unwound over this?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> I just want to let everyone know that we need to wait and see what happens. I reiterate this because I have sources too. All i can say is that the sources refutes the trade rumor of Big Dog for jamal. (no I will not reveal my sources) However, I would not post this if I didn't believe them.
> 
> So until the trade deadline comes and goes or until the Big Dog trade actually comes about (which I am told is not true), why get all unwound over this?


tell Matt Lloyd I said hi!


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>superdave</b>!
> 
> 
> LOL, Mike. What would us working people do w/o BB.net?


We're the opiate of the masses


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## unBULLievable (Dec 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> I just want to let everyone know that we need to wait and see what happens. I reiterate this because I have sources too. All i can say is that the sources refutes the trade rumor of Big Dog for jamal. (no I will not reveal my sources) However, I would not post this if I didn't believe them.
> 
> So until the trade deadline comes and goes or until the Big Dog trade actually comes about (which I am told is not true), why get all unwound over this?


could you give us a hint then where Fizer might end up???


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Nope.


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> Nope.


im thinking of changing my handle to Matt Lloyd. Do you think that would confuse people?


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## Rodman (Feb 5, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> I just want to let everyone know that we need to wait and see what happens. I reiterate this because I have sources too. All i can say is that the sources refutes the trade rumor of Big Dog for jamal. (no I will not reveal my sources) However, I would not post this if I didn't believe them.
> 
> So until the trade deadline comes and goes or until the Big Dog trade actually comes about (which I am told is not true), why get all unwound over this?


I hope your source is right... this trade is absurd, I don't want this to happen.... 
I go play Diablo now and let out my anger on the monsters.....
cu later...


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## Zeos (Jun 4, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Wynn</b>!
> 
> I'd just like to say that I'm against getting Big Dog. Besides, then we trade our small forward (lack of) problem for a guard (lack of) problem. This solution would be treading water at best. i hope Pax decides to match Crawdaddy. I'm loving the attitude I'm seeing out of the kid, and consistent play will follow a good attitiude.
> 
> Peace!


I agree 100%. I've not been accused of being a Jamal lover in the old Jamal vs. Kirk debates (thank heaven those seem to be over), but I absolutely love the slow transformation I've been seeing in Jamal. He's slowly transforming his game from a Jalen Rose game to a Richard Hamilton game. I've been impressed. Jamal seems to genuinely want to become a great player.

GRob seems to me to be exactly the kind of player Paxson does NOT want on the team. It just doesn't make any sense to me. I'll believe it when I see it, and maybe not even then.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Zeos</b>!
> 
> 
> He's slowly transforming his game from a Jalen Rose game to a Richard Hamilton game.


That's so perfect! What an observation!

I could kiss you!

But I won't.


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## Zeos (Jun 4, 2003)

Thanks!

:hurl:


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## XXXCalade (Jul 4, 2003)

I might be one of the only bulls fans who likes this trade. I am starting to like Crawford but i mean cmon we are getting a very good small forward whose contract ends soon and a good shooting guard. Although EROB is playing better, we are still getting rid of his contract. Think about it, Tyson Eddy and Glenn who will get a rebound on us. These guys will get every board. Not to mention Hinrich and Mckie getting assists every time down the court to the big guys. I think it would be sweet.


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## Electric Slim (Jul 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> 
> 
> Slightly OT, but I've checked it out again over the last couple of days and I was shocked.
> ...


As a mod on the site, I've been pleased that things have gone rather smoothly at RealGM. It's a great Bulls board, and maybe it would be better if some of you haven't left. I don't blame any of you guys for leaving in Summer 2002 because I jumped to here when RertoDreams invited me. After about a year of cooling off I went back to RealGm to say hi to some old pals, and eventually I was offered a mod position which I happily accepted. I'm not really buddy-buddy w/ the other mods, I just do what I do and don't try to make a big production out of it.

As far as telling the armpit-farters to get lost, I would say that I have nothing to do with that. I PM them and I tell them what I'd like to see from them. Of course, some tell me to shove it up me arse, but sometimes some of the cold *****lies have turned into warm fuzzies.

So for the record, give us at Real GM a break (not that all of you are particularly ATTACKING it per se). The Bulls fans there bleed red , black, and white just like you.


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>XXXCalade</b>!
> I might be one of the only bulls fans who likes this trade. I am starting to like Crawford but i mean cmon we are getting a very good small forward whose contract ends soon and a good shooting guard. Although EROB is playing better, we are still getting rid of his contract. Think about it, Tyson Eddy and Glenn who will get a rebound on us. These guys will get every board. Not to mention Hinrich and Mckie getting assists every time down the court to the big guys. I think it would be sweet.


Grob is avg. 4.9 rebs a game 

seeing as yesterday donyell grabbed 24 and the bulls still outrebounded them by 8 I believe the bulls do just fine on the boards


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## ViciousFlogging (Sep 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Electric Slim</b>!
> 
> 
> As a mod on the site, I've been pleased that things have gone rather smoothly at RealGM. It's a great Bulls board, and maybe it would be better if some of you haven't left. I don't blame any of you guys for leaving in Summer 2002 because I jumped to here when RertoDreams invited me. After about a year of cooling off I went back to RealGm to say hi to some old pals, and eventually I was offered a mod position which I happily accepted. I'm not really buddy-buddy w/ the other mods, I just do what I do and don't try to make a big production out of it.
> ...


I really should have been a mod when they offered it to me. but it was right when I started a new job and I didn't think I'd have as much time to surf the boards as I do. I think they could have done a little better with one of their new selections. Hint: It's not you or Frink.  another hint, my handle over there isn't ViciousFlogging, and I used to have a built to spill avatar, recently replaced by Dr. Strangelove.


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## ChiBullsFan (May 30, 2002)

If this rumor is true, I'm definitely a fan of it. I feel that getting rid of Crawford, like Rose, is addition by subtraction.

I gave him a shot, but have ultimately been disappointed by his play. There is no lower form of player than one who can't stand contact (Marvin Harrison is my least favorite NFLer) and Jamal just avoids it all costs. That's the easiest way to play to lose.

He's not a bad kid and I wish him future success, but getting rid of him will be best for this Bulls team.

I am left wondering (and I'm assuming there is NO WAY we would resign Big Dog) what quality wing players we could make a run at this offseason? I don't know what GRob's cap number is, but I assume it's not enough to make a serious run at Kobe, nor am I convinced that he would desire Chicago over LA, LA or Phoenix.

Anyone got an idea of who the big-name wings out there are? Anybody under the age of 28? Obviously the 2000 draft class offers virtually nothing....


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## Electric Slim (Jul 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ViciousFlogging</b>!
> 
> 
> I really should have been a mod when they offered it to me. but it was right when I started a new job and I didn't think I'd have as much time to surf the boards as I do. I think they could have done a little better with one of their new selections. Hint: It's not you or Frink.  another hint, my handle over there isn't ViciousFlogging, and I used to have a built to spill avatar, recently replaced by Dr. Strangelove.


KeithBoothFan?


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

if i may, slim and frink are class acts. so is coldchi.


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## ViciousFlogging (Sep 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Electric Slim</b>!
> 
> 
> KeithBoothFan?


the one and only. because honestly, who else in this world is insane enough to like Keith Booth?


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Electric Slim</b>!
> 
> 
> As a mod on the site, I've been pleased that things have gone rather smoothly at RealGM. It's a great Bulls board, and maybe it would be better if some of you haven't left. I don't blame any of you guys for leaving in Summer 2002 because I jumped to here when RertoDreams invited me. After about a year of cooling off I went back to RealGm to say hi to some old pals, and eventually I was offered a mod position which I happily accepted. I'm not really buddy-buddy w/ the other mods, I just do what I do and don't try to make a big production out of it.
> ...


So that's where you've been Slim. Hmm, good to hear that you're still posting. (my moniker used to be Vin Diesel now its superdave)  I'm on RealGM from time to time so I'll look out for your posts.

There is so much information and yes perspective that is shared between the boards that I would hope the war wounds would heal for some. Easier said than done but its good to know that you landed there. Kudos


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ChiBullsFan</b>!
> If this rumor is true, I'm definitely a fan of it. I feel that getting rid of Crawford, like Rose, is addition by subtraction.
> 
> I gave him a shot, but have ultimately been disappointed by his play. There is no lower form of player than one who can't stand contact (Marvin Harrison is my least favorite NFLer) and Jamal just avoids it all costs. That's the easiest way to play to lose.
> ...


explain how someone who garners 11 boards and 11 free throws is afraid of contact?Also let me clue you in on a misconception on your part Glenn robinson is a free agent after next season ,not this season so aquiring him for cap space means at least a year and a half of the human cancer that is the big dog...but if this is the type of trade you endorse have at it but do so knowing that this core of philly players with a player like A.I. is only 6 games better than the bulls who have the 2nd worse record in the nba...the nba is not a place where team make it a practice to let go of players they need to win aaron mckie is fading amal mcwhatever his name is ,is simply a never was and glenn robinson is a loser he has been in the league a decade and he never wins anywhere he goes ,in fact no team he has ever left looked worse for his departure which says alot for his impact

little known fact since you are concerned about players who dont like contact ...JC gets to the line about the same as G.robinson but since he is injury prone, JC has made more free throws than glenn has taken(127-119)


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## Electric Slim (Jul 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ViciousFlogging</b>!
> 
> 
> the one and only. because honestly, who else in this world is insane enough to like Keith Booth?












Or vicious flogging for that matter. :grinning:


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## ViciousFlogging (Sep 3, 2003)

:headbang: :dpepper: :woot: :woot: :woot: :woot: :woot: 













:uhoh:


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## Wynn (Jun 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Electric Slim</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I've been a really bad boy......


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>happygrinch</b>!
> 
> 
> explain how someone who garners 11 boards and 11 free throws is afraid of contact?Also let me clue you in on a misconception on your part Glenn robinson is a free agent after next season ,not this season so aquiring him for cap space means at least a year and a half of the human cancer that is the big dog...but if this is the type of trade you endorse have at it but do so knowing that this core of philly players with a player like A.I. is only 6 games better than the bulls who have the 2nd worse record in the nba...the nba is not a place where team make it a practice to let go of players they need to win aaron mckie is fading amal mcwhatever his name is ,is simply a never was and glenn robinson is a loser he has been in the league a decade and he never wins anywhere he goes ,in fact no team he has ever left looked worse for his departure which says alot for his impact
> ...


11 fta was impressive and that is why I have been wanting him to do all season. 

Big Dog 3.5 attempts and Jamal exactly 3 fta a game. He is improving. He was below two most of the season. 

He does avoid contact but is improving. Finally!! I commend him for it.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> 
> 
> 11 fta was impressive and that is why I have been wanting him to do all season.
> ...


There has been a lot of hating on Big Dog and some of it is deserved. However, he is the superior player to Jalen Rose and the better scorer than Jamal Crawford. Crawford has youth, passing, and probably better defense in comparison. But Robinson has been and probably will be the more efficient scorer in the near future.

Like Rose he is 31 years old and can't play a lick of D.

But Big Dog has been a 2 time All-Star (2000 and 2001 respectively) and career 21/6/3 player on a 46%/34% split. He's done it from day 1 in this league. Worst season shooting was 43%. Does he have his issues? Clearly yes. But he's done more in his career than Rose and right now is still the superior scorer compared to Jamal.

As for defense and heart well.... :sigh:


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## rlucas4257 (Jun 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ViciousFlogging</b>!
> 
> 
> the one and only. because honestly, who else in this world is insane enough to like Keith Booth?


damn. really? I always thought Vflog carried himself like someone I had read before. And then we was going to the GS game I thought it was strange. Well, i have always been a KBF fan, from espn to realgm to his pseudopersonality VFlog

By the way, im thinking of changing my handle to. Do you think MattLloyd sounds good?


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> 
> 
> 11 fta was impressive and that is why I have been wanting him to do all season.
> ...


the thing is if you dont like crawford for avoiding contact (which i dont believe he does) you are going to hate robinson for the same crime , he has almost a power forwards body but all he does is try to set up for a jumpshot from 18 feet, in crawford i see a player who grew up a a toothpick so he developed a game that keeps him from contact,but i never thought he was afraid of it for one simple reason,he wants to gain weight so he can post up smaller guards ,players who want to post up aren't afraid of contact because you simply cant be and be a post up player it requires you to fight for position,Crawford has developed a floater which he has had for his whole career as his shot of choice in the lane and probably his whole life but he is learning when not to use it and force the issue and its easy to see he is trying to change things about his game.I dont commend crawford for developing parts of his game he should be developing, its his job, but i dont think endless streams of posts should come his way when its obvious he is improving , for instance there shouldn't be a bunch of marshmellow curry threads after he grabs 9 boards and put VC on his duff.that being said an individual game means little if its not backed up by consistent effort , but there are definite signs that this is the case with crawford


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## chifaninca (May 28, 2002)

CHiBullsFan,


You are in favor of it because it's addition by subtraction?

The difference was that Crawford was able to step in and fill that role that Rose had for the Bulls. 

Grob isn't going to fill anything other than his bank account. Also, what is Grob's worth if all they can get is a player that many here think is garbage.

Amazing. Addition by subtraction only occurs when you have someone else willing to step up.

If you guys are so "concerned" about guys producing or not producing, you should be loving the idea of butterfingers Chandler or butterball Curry being traded.

I'm excited though cause if many of you have your way we'll get Slava Medvedenko or Shane Battier for Curry. Then we can trade Chandler for Qyntel Woods or Darius Miles.

Come on....did Jamal steal your wives or girlfriends or something?

the guy puts up alot of shots, in part, cause no one else steps up. He took more shots last night than any other teammate, yet still had more assists. And he did this grabbing more rebounds as well.

The guys who are working their arse off are Hinrich and Crawford. If you want to bang on guys for not contributing here's my list in order:

John Paxson

Antonio Davis - He, I would gladly give away for a bag of chips. 0-11 last night. No one seems to mind his 0% shooting percentage cause he tied Jamal for team high in Rebounds as our CENTER.

JYD - If hustle and heart were enough, Lint woould still be a Bull.

Chandler - Since we aren't giving anyone slack anymore, let's ship Chandler out now while he still has the potential to score on a few put backs. He was on his back more than ....(too tempting, insert fav porn reference)....

Curry - If you can score 15 and grab 7 rebounds in the first 12 minutes, you should be able to do atleast that in the next 30



So to recap - our last "Should do for additioin by subtraction" trade netted us - Antonio (I couldn't throw it into the ocean) Davis, Jerome (my nickname describes my offensive game) Williams, and Chris (I lost my game in my hair and can't find it) Jeffries for Jalen Rose, Donyell Marhsall (don't need him do we?) and Lonny (I learned in college how to use my backside for positioning) Baxter.

Yeah, that was subtraction.............We got nothing, yeah I said it, nothing out of that deal.

So Paxson has compounded Krause's trade blunders and we want to blame one player for losses. 

You guys are right. Let's trade Crawford to a team with a real gm...the Knicks or Pacers and watch them kill us for the next 10 years.

PS - I don't think Crawford is great or close to being great yet. I do believe he is a much improving player who can flourish under Skiles' guidance.

Again, I blame Paxson and Krause for putting this young guys in the position to fail.


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## ViciousFlogging (Sep 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rlucas4257</b>!
> 
> 
> damn. really? I always thought Vflog carried himself like someone I had read before. And then we was going to the GS game I thought it was strange. Well, i have always been a KBF fan, from espn to realgm to his pseudopersonality VFlog
> ...


I like keeping a low profile and usually did on espn and realgm. getting a new handle and being completely anonymous was fun here. plus, there aren't too many posters here that I talked with a lot at realgm because I was not posting much anywhere for quite a while when a lot of these guys were on realgm and then moved here. I didn't even know about this place until I saw some of the mysterious posts about "that other board".

i'd be pretty amused if you changed to MattLloyd, personally.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>happygrinch</b>!
> 
> 
> the thing is if you dont like crawford for avoiding contact (which i dont believe he does) you are going to hate robinson for the same crime , he has almost a power forwards body but all he does is try to set up for a jumpshot from 18 feet, in crawford i see a player who grew up a a toothpick so he developed a game that keeps him from contact,but i never thought he was afraid of it for one simple reason,he wants to gain weight so he can post up smaller guards ,players who want to post up aren't afraid of contact because you simply cant be and be a post up player it requires you to fight for position,Crawford has developed a floater which he has had for his whole career as his shot of choice in the lane and probably his whole life but he is learning when not to use it and force the issue and its easy to see he is trying to change things about his game.I dont commend crawford for developing parts of his game he should be developing, its his job, but i dont think endless streams of posts should come his way when its obvious he is improving , for instance there shouldn't be a bunch of marshmellow curry threads after he grabs 9 boards and put VC on his duff.that being said an individual game means little if its not backed up by consistent effort , but there are definite signs that this is the case with crawford


I am not just talking about offense, here. Jamal does not fight through screens. He did not like contact. Period. Through most of the year he settled for jumpers and three point shots. Many times on a fast break he would shoot a quick three, even before some of this team mates were down court? Why? He had a defender between him and the basket. 

As for Robinson? He does not shoot 39%. He is not our #1 option. Crawford is. (at least he was until Curry got going.)

Like I said, he is getting better. He needs to continue to do this!!

I am not the only one who observes this. Listen and watch many in the media. They say the same thing.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Guys, gals, keep in mind, Graden said "tomorrow" 

This is tomorrow. So far no Crawford for Big Dog trade! 

However, we could still see the a trade with philly.


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## dsouljah9 (Jul 9, 2002)

This trade is a load of :cthread:

There hasn't been any mention of it anywhere else. And if this is indeed true, then i want proof.


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Electric Slim</b>!
> 
> 
> As a mod on the site, I've been pleased that things have gone rather smoothly at RealGM. It's a great Bulls board, and maybe it would be better if some of you haven't left. I don't blame any of you guys for leaving in Summer 2002 because I jumped to here when RertoDreams invited me. After about a year of cooling off I went back to RealGm to say hi to some old pals, and eventually I was offered a mod position which I happily accepted. I'm not really buddy-buddy w/ the other mods, I just do what I do and don't try to make a big production out of it.
> ...


Yikes, I didn't mean for that to sound like a slam, but I guess it kinda did. I was just kinda ticked by the combination of having to kill my browser so it'd stop asking my to DL files and because I saw a couple of guys I like to read being talked down to. :| But in full fairness, plenty of stuff goes on here that I won't necessarily handle in the same way when I become dictator, so I hope my criticism is understood in that light. There are lots of good guys over there (like you! IMO) and obviously it's a place worth going to to read about the Bulls.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

Ouch, Chicago getting Glenn "Big Hog" Robinson?!

First it was Atlanta, then Philly, and it's so sad that the Bulls are the next in line. The guy is a cancer where ever he goes. Even with all that talent he had in Milwaukee (Allen and Cassell)...he still never managed to be very successful.

Some of you had hopes of winning 15 or so games in the second half I believe. Well...you can now be thankful if you get more than 3 wins the rest of the way.

Glenn Robinson is NOT the answer to Chicago's problems. They could've gotten something better for Jamal Crawford.


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## Bullwhip (Feb 26, 2003)

Relax everyone. This is all just bull. If Jamal IS traded, it won't be for Big Dog. My suspiscion tells me that there's a multi-team deal in the works, thus the sudden silence these past 48hours. We may be surprised to find a trade that goes down that we never knew was being discussed. Let's just hope whatever it is, it's for the better.

:|


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## man_utd_nz (Jan 29, 2004)

if this is true.................if this is true then somebody tell me why there hasnt been any of this on espn or any other tv channels and stuff. sure sure it could happpen that a deal is made without them knowing but.....................wats the chances of that??? you mean im supposed 2 believe a guy in a forum but yet theres no word from anywhere else.....................go figure


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## Electric Slim (Jul 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> 
> 
> Yikes, I didn't mean for that to sound like a slam, but I guess it kinda did.


Oh, no offense taken DC, It's just that the "rivalry" thing to me is so  . I'm just here to wave the flag I guess. :usa: :angel:


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## Da Grinch (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> 
> 
> I am not just talking about offense, here. Jamal does not fight through screens. He did not like contact. Period. Through most of the year he settled for jumpers and three point shots. Many times on a fast break he would shoot a quick three, even before some of this team mates were down court? Why? He had a defender between him and the basket.
> ...


i look at crawford and compare him to other players...for arguments sake lets compare to the players he is most compared to at shooting guard,Larry hughes, kerry kittles and rip hamilton.

out of these 3 who can you say really bust through screens kittles is probably the best of the bunch at this but if you can find a game where he doesn't get lost half a dozen times you found a rare game,its just not in the cards unless you have some sort of super ability to get through screens(bruce bowen or joe dumars come to mind) ...the avg. thin guard just doesn't walk through 245 lbs power forwards or centers ,look at our team when antonio davis sets a baseline screen no matter who is guarding a guard on our team he has a step on his defender to put up a shot ,unfortunately the guy who usually shoots off these curls are people who aren't used to doing so (JC) people who were never that good at (kendall gill) or people who haven't gotten the hang of it in the nba (hinrich) while other teams use reggie miller ,rip hamilton and other such shooters who have been doing it well for years , while the bulls have had to institute this offense on the fly during the season, which puts us at a major disadvantage in execution,but back to the screens i dont see it as a huge disadvantage people make it out to be,i've seen crawford fight through screens before ,in fact i've seen him make game saving plays in such situations (the block on baron davis in an earlier game this season) I think he is similar to most players in that his defense lags periodically in games until the 4th quarter and that stuff like fighting through screens are the most visable indication,because if you are afraid you are afraid all the time, not just from the 1st thru 3rd periods or in games one week and not another, its the same as his drawing fouls its just something he has to work on being more consistent at.


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## Marcus13 (Jul 17, 2002)

:laugh: 


This trade is the farthest thing from the truth I have read in a long time


If this goes down- I will give everyone here who agrees with this guy 5 stars-

I dont believe this


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## arenas809 (Feb 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Marcus13</b>!
> :laugh:
> 
> 
> ...


It's already been reported this "internet rumor" wasn't true...


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