# We need to sign NOCIONI!



## terry2damp (Apr 24, 2005)

He would be an absolutely perfect fit here!

6'7'' 225 sf and is tough as @#%$ nails! 

Solid defender an shoots 40% on 3s!

13pts 6rpg last year in 27mpg he also shoots a good % from the field!

Trade stack for him


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

terry2damp said:


> Trade stack for him


Work the #s.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Dirk Nowitzki is the only player that the Mavs have thats good enough to trade for Nocioni, and well thats not happening, so Mavs aren't getting Nocioni.


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

sloth said:


> Dirk Nowitzki is the only player that the Mavs have thats good enough to trade for Nocioni, and well thats not happening, so Mavs aren't getting Nocioni.


I think you might be overrating Nocioni just a tad there.....


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

Chiiiill sloth, JET and Josh are better than Andres. But yeah, I'd love to have him. Every team could use him.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Ninjatune said:


> I think you might be overrating Nocioni just a tad there.....


Well it'd take more than Noc's value to get him, especially since he is one of those "more valuable to us than you" since he is everything Bulls basketball is suppose to be about. Jason Terry is comparable, but why would the Bulls want him? Ben Gordon does everything he does, while being more clutch and younger. Josh Howard, don't we already have our own version in Luol Deng? He's a nice player, but we already have an equally young and just as talented version of him. Stackhouse, he isn't that good, and is old now. Devin Harris? He's not that much better than Chris Duhon. 

Bottomline, Bulls are stacked from positions 1-3. It'd have to be a big man that we trade for, and Dirk is the only one good enough for the Bulls to consider trading Nocioni for, thus why its not going to happen ever.


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## Saint Baller (May 3, 2006)

No way that we get Nocioni, he was key to the Bulls playoffs this year. 

And sloth

Dirk for Noc? :rofl: I think Bulls would maybe do it if it was a 2 for one deal. And that wont happen.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

sloth said:


> Well it'd take more than Noc's value to get him, especially since he is one of those "more valuable to us than you" since he is everything Bulls basketball is suppose to be about. Jason Terry is comparable, but why would the Bulls want him? Ben Gordon does everything he does, while being more clutch and younger. Josh Howard, don't we already have our own version in Luol Deng? He's a nice player, but we already have an equally young and just as talented version of him. Stackhouse, he isn't that good, and is old now. Devin Harris? He's not that much better than Chris Duhon.
> 
> Bottomline, Bulls are stacked from positions 1-3. It'd have to be a big man that we trade for, and Dirk is the only one good enough for the Bulls to consider trading Nocioni for, thus why its not going to happen ever.


Chicago will indeed be a very exciting team to watch.... but why are you comparing Nocioni with JET? You shouldn't compare apples to oranges.

If you don't think Josh Howard is comparable to Nocioni, you definitely haven't watched enough games.

p.s. Quality 7 footer is too hard to come by in the league, but smaller G-F seem to be in good supply. Since market is ALWAYS driven by supply-and-demand, asking Dirk-quality big for Nocioni is simply an impossibility.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

edwardcyh said:


> Chicago will indeed be a very exciting team to watch.... but why are you comparing Nocioni with JET? You shouldn't compare apples to oranges.
> 
> If you don't think Josh Howard is comparable to Nocioni, you definitely haven't watched enough games.
> 
> p.s. Quality 7 footer is too hard to come by in the league, but smaller G-F seem to be in good supply. Since market is ALWAYS driven by supply-and-demand, asking Dirk-quality big for Nocioni is simply an impossibility.


Exactly why I said its never going to happen. Mavs have nothing worthwhile to offer the Bulls for Nocioni except Dirk, and its not worth it for the Mavs to trade Dirk for Noc.


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

sloth said:


> Exactly why I said its never going to happen. Mavs have nothing worthwhile to offer the Bulls for Nocioni except Dirk, and its not worth it for the Mavs to trade Dirk for Noc.


Which is partly why I said work the #s. If Stack for Nocioni was proposed, the Bulls would have to pony up more than just him to even come within 15% of Stack's salary.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

bray1967 said:


> Which is partly why I said work the #s. If Stack for Nocioni was proposed, the Bulls would have to pony up more than just him to even come within 15% of Stack's salary.


Deeps pockets can actually hurt....


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## terry2damp (Apr 24, 2005)

hahaha duhon equal to harris!!!! can u see duhon droppin 30 in a key PO game! and im fairly certain with nocioni expiring he could b had especially with

Gordon
Duhon = all the mins at the 1/2
Hinrich

Deng
Sefolosha
Tyrus Thomas = the mins at the 3
Griffin
Khryapa 


absolute JAM at the 1/2/3 and u need a proper sized 2 guard!


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## t1no (Jul 10, 2005)

Howard for Nocioni, let's do it.


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## terry2damp (Apr 24, 2005)

too much to give up!

i was thinkin more along the lines of nocioni being the starting sf with howard sliding to the 2

-or-

nocioni stepping in as the 6th man taking stacks mins from last yr! also nocioni has been impressive playing the 4 part time for the bulls so i think he could handle a few mins there too! since he is so tough and heavy at 225lbs!

Harris / Terry / Johnson
Buckner / howard / Terry
Howard / Nocioni
Nowitzki / Croshere / Nocioni
Diop / Dampier

9 man rotation!

we NEED tht extra shooter in the rotation an nocioni would fill tht need aswell as being tought as nails like najera WITH a killer jumper and possibly even tougher!

Stack+future 1st rounder for Nocioni


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## t1no (Jul 10, 2005)

terry2damp said:


> too much to give up!
> 
> i was thinkin more along the lines of nocioni being the starting sf with howard sliding to the 2
> 
> ...


Nocioni 6th man? he's young, as good as Howard....


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## terry2damp (Apr 24, 2005)

hasnt got howards upside! and nocioni i think i a yr older! he also isnt quite as good as howard on either end of the floor! perfect 6th man would get the same mins he got with the bulls!


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## t1no (Jul 10, 2005)

terry2damp said:


> hasnt got howards upside! and nocioni i think i a yr older! he also isnt quite as good as howard on either end of the floor! perfect 6th man would get the same mins he got with the bulls!


He is pretty consistent, he's a better shooter (better for Dirk, he spreads the floor) and he is also a better defender, i don't care what people say about Howard's defense because it's really overrated and very inconsistent. and ohh yea, he's bigger even though nba.com shows that he is only 1 inch taller than Howard.
and also, do you really think he would be happy being a 6th man when he knows he can be a starter? You have to think about that also.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

This is indeed a very interesting topic comparing JHo and Noc.


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

edwardcyh said:


> This is indeed a very interesting topic comparing JHo and Noc.


NBA.com's Head-to-Head Comparisons is down. :curse:


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

bray1967 said:


> NBA.com's Head-to-Head Comparisons is down. :curse:


Want to start a new thread comparing them?

:makeadeal


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

edwardcyh said:


> Want to start a new thread comparing them?
> 
> :makeadeal


It would be so much easier if NBA.com's Head to Head comparison wasn't down!!  :angel:


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## L (Sep 20, 2005)

bray1967 said:


> It would be so much easier if NBA.com's Head to Head comparison wasn't down!!  :angel:


It would be easier to read your comments if you just posted them in black font!


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

2dumb2live said:


> It would be easier to read your comments if you just posted them in black font!


True; but to instantly disclose my secret source of information...? :clown:


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## L (Sep 20, 2005)

bray1967 said:


> True; but to instantly disclose my secret source of information...? :clown:


So you delay me four seconds to push and hold down the right click button on my mouse! Clever...


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

No chance Dwight Howard is a better defender than Nocioni. He's not a very good defender, while Nocioni is considered one of the tougher defenders in the league. Nocioni is a much better shooter, and is just a more skilled scorer, Josh Howard is just more athletic than Nocioni, which makes them about tied scoring wise for now. Nocioni is the better rebounder. Not sure why Bulls would want to trade for Josh Howard when they also have Luol Deng that has a similiar skillset to Josh Howard, but is a legit 6'9". Jerry Stackhouse, don't even mention that **** for Nocioni.


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

sloth said:


> No chance Dwight Howard is a better defender than Nocioni. He's not a very good defender, while Nocioni is considered one of the tougher defenders in the league. Nocioni is a much better shooter, and is just a more skilled scorer, Josh Howard is just more athletic than Nocioni, which makes them about tied scoring wise for now. *Nocioni is the better rebounder. * Not sure why Bulls would want to trade for Josh Howard when they also have Luol Deng that has a similiar skillset to Josh Howard, but is a legit 6'9". Jerry Stackhouse, don't even mention that **** for Nocioni.


I thought Nocioni was the better rebounder, too. But Josh averaged 6.3 rpg to Nocioni's 6.1, so it's a push. 

I think the original sentiment - Stack for Nocioni - isn't more than whimsical. The money doesn't work, and a lot of other variables would have to be worked out.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

bray1967 said:


> I thought Nocioni was the better rebounder, too. But Josh averaged 6.3 rpg to Nocioni's 6.1, so it's a push.


We can also look at other defensive numbers:

BPG:
JHo: .60 career regular season .67 playoff
Noc: .50 career regular season .67 playoff

SPG:
JHo: *1.25* career regular season *.98* playoff
Noc: .47 career regular season .67 playoff

Noc has the advantage in size and durability (1 missed game due to suspension in last 2 seasons). JHo missed a lot of games to injury, especially this past season.

As for who's a better defender, you'll get a different answer depending who you ask. Since we ARE on the Dallas Mavericks forum.....


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

edwardcyh said:


> SPG:
> JHo: *1.25* career regular season *.98* playoff
> Noc: .47 career regular season .67 playoff


I noticed that SPG stat myself, and was pleasantly reminded that Josh has the quick hands. :biggrin:


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

Josh Howard 
Dallas Mavericks 
Position: F 
Height: 6-7 Weight: 210 
College : Wake Forest 
Player file | Team stats 

2005-06 Statistics 
PPG 15.6 
RPG 6.3 
APG 1.9 
SPG 1.15 
BPG .44 
FG% .471 
FT% .734 
3P% .429 
MPG 32.5 
-------------------------------
Andres Nocioni 
Chicago Bulls 
Position: F 
Height: 6-7 Weight: 225 
From : Argentina 
Player file | Team stats 

2005-06 Statistics 
PPG 13.0 
RPG 6.1 
APG 1.4 
SPG .49 
BPG .63 
FG% .461 
FT% .843 
3P% .391 
MPG 27.3


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

Numbers never lie.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

Ninjatune said:


> Numbers never lie.


And... i am waiting for somebody to jump in with stat differences and playing time....

LOL... It's just a matter of time.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Defense can't be looked at by numbers though. Like look at Chris Paul, he has good steal numbers, but he's a terrible defender. Like when you start getting the really high blocks and steal numbers, then you know you got a special defender, but with a guy like Nocioni, his defensive strength lies within sticking with his guy, and forcing up bad strengths.


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

sloth said:


> Defense can't be looked at by numbers though. Like look at Chris Paul, he has good steal numbers, but he's a terrible defender. Like when you start getting the really high blocks and steal numbers, then you know you got a special defender, but with a guy like Nocioni, his defensive strength lies within sticking with his guy, and forcing up bad strengths.


I'll give you that - Prime Time's interception #s were nothing because nobody would throw to his side of the field. That's BBowen type defense.

But all the intangibles must be considered, like chemistry and what a guy means to his teammates. I don't pretend to be an expert on either Howard or Nocioni, but that Josh probably means a heck of lot to the Mavs.

So up goes the price.


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## Saint Baller (May 3, 2006)




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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

Thank you, I couldn't get it to load.


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## Saint Baller (May 3, 2006)

No problem

Stats mean some thing but not much

I'm sure if you look at each players role on the team you'd realize that Josh's role is much larger than Nocioni's role


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

Saint Baller said:


> I'm sure if you look at each players role on the team you'd realize that Josh's role is much larger than Nocioni's role





bray1967 said:


> But all the intangibles must be considered, like chemistry and what a guy means to his teammates. I don't pretend to be an expert on either Howard or Nocioni, but that Josh probably means a heck of lot to the Mavs.


 :clap:


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## Saint Baller (May 3, 2006)

Eh, great minds think alike?


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## southeasy (Jun 11, 2003)

their both good......but josh howard isthe reason i'm a mavs fan and i';m on the mavs board right now... you trade him and you give me a reason to go to chicagos... haha


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

southeasy said:


> their both good......but josh howard isthe reason i'm a mavs fan and i';m on the mavs board right now... you trade him and you give me a reason to go to chicagos... haha


...and we wouldn't want that. :biggrin:


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