# Dennis Rodman vs. Ben Wallace



## JonH818 (Aug 31, 2006)

Here's a question for everyone. Who would you rather have......Ben Wallace in his prime or Dennis Rodman in his prime and explain why.


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## Sith (Oct 20, 2003)

wallace, he's bigger and a better defender. a better passer too. better ball handler.


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## UMfan83 (Jan 15, 2003)

No doubt in my mind Rodman. I love what Wallace brings, but Rodman had the ability to get into opponents heads, wear them out physically, plus he is a better rebounder and IMO a slightly better offensive player.

Ben is a better shotblocker and passer, but I think Rodman wins it.


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## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

ummm dennis rodman, and it's pretty easy. rodman actually had an offensive game in the pistons era, he just didn't need it once he left there. rodman was a better rebounder and a better defender. this really isn't even a fair comparison.


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## AMΣRICAN GOD™ (Jun 4, 2005)

Rodman is more talented and a winner. Period.


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## RSP83 (Nov 24, 2002)

UMfan83 said:


> No doubt in my mind Rodman. I love what Wallace brings, but Rodman had the ability to get into opponents heads, wear them out physically, plus he is a better rebounder and IMO a slightly better offensive player.
> 
> Ben is a better shotblocker and passer, but I think Rodman wins it.


Agree.

Rodman's production was beyond statistics.

I love Ben Wallace. But no matter how good Ben was defensively when Detroit won the chip, we can't ignore Rasheed.

Rodman when he was a Piston got help from guys like John Salley, Bill Laimbeer, and Rick Mahorn. But when he was a Bull. He's almost single handedly took care opponents best post pressence. The job he did on Shawn Kemp and Karl Malone in Bulls' three NBA championships was amazing. And who did he have to back him up? Luc Longley, Bill Wennington, Bison Dele.


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## lougehrig (Mar 1, 2005)

RSP83 said:


> I love Ben Wallace. But no matter how good Ben was defensively when Detroit won the chip, we can't ignore Rasheed.


Rasheed Wallace is perhaps one of the most overrated players in NBA history, IMHO.


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## theanimal23 (Mar 2, 2005)

lougehrig said:


> Rasheed Wallace is perhaps one of the most overrated players in NBA history, IMHO.


Rasheed, when he first started getting PT in Portland was damn good. The transition he made from backing up Brian Grant to being a starter. But, he fell in love with the jumpshot and the 3. The second he become a shooter, and not a guy who can mix it up, he became overrated. I think he was the most talented PF offensively. No one had his range (until Dirk), and his post play ability. I dunno, maybe the game got too physical for him.


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## melo4life (Jun 5, 2006)

after a performance like today u cant go past big ben


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## Rhyder (Jul 15, 2002)

With this current grouping of players, Wallace.

With MJ, Pippen, Phil and co., Rodman.


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## RSP83 (Nov 24, 2002)

lougehrig said:


> Rasheed Wallace is perhaps one of the most overrated players in NBA history, IMHO.


I'm not disagreeing with you on Rasheed being overrated as a player in overall.

But, you're overrating Ben too if you say Rasheed's defense means nothing to the Pistons championship team. Rasheed's impact on defense in that championship team is probably underrated by a lot of people.

Rahseed made things easier for Ben defensively, And that's a fact.


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## RSP83 (Nov 24, 2002)

Actually when I think about it again. Both are different type of defenders. The only thing Ben and Dennis have in common is tehir rebounding ability. So it's tough to judge who's the better defender.

Ben is the type of defender that block shots, grab some steals, alter shots. He's closer to the likes of Hakeem, Dikembe, Zo defensively.

Dennis was more of a lockdown guy. Man to man defender. He's closer to Bowen and Artest.

But as a rebounder, I have to go with Dennis. He's been one of the best rebounder in the league since very early in his career. I mean the guy averaged at least 15 rpg for 5 straight years. And three of them were 17, 18, 18. And he's the same height as Ben too.


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## darlets (Jul 31, 2002)

I'd have to go Rodman.

He was actually a clutch F.T shooting and had some offensive game when he tried.


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## Salvaged Ship (Jul 10, 2002)

Despite the headband incident and a few minor issues, Wallace has been an angel in his career compared to Rodman. In my opinion, if you have to factor in attitude and ability to deal with on top of their basketball talents, I may have to side with Wallace. If strictly what they brought to the court in their primes, I would go with Rodman.


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## HAWK23 (Jul 1, 2002)

here's a thought... Skiles coaching Rodman

just wow


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## nanokooshball (Jan 22, 2005)

HAWK23 said:


> here's a thought... Skiles coaching Rodman
> 
> just wow


better than players like Tim Thomas... Rodman at least gave his heart out at practice and a game... but then he would randomly miss game days for some reason or another... so id say toss up


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## lougehrig (Mar 1, 2005)

HAWK23 said:


> here's a thought... Skiles coaching Rodman
> 
> just wow


Rodman is a dream team player. Alot of his reputation was just antics. Playing under Skiles is easier than playing with Jordan. He played hurt and battled much larger players night in and night out.


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

lougehrig said:


> Rodman is a dream team player.



Do you remember his behavior with the San Antionio Spurs?

Why do you think they traded him for Will freaking Perdue?


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## TwinkieTowers (Jul 16, 2002)

Damn, with all this love of Rodman over Wallace, we should have drafted Balkman.

Wallace has how many DPOY awards? Compared to one Rodman won as a Bad Boy? One could make a case that the press was against him during his years as a Spur and Bull, limiting his votes for the award, but it's very hard to discredit the recognition Ben has received.

I'll say that Rodman's unique approach to rebounding, as well as his impeccable timing to grab a board right at the pinnacle of his jump, is laudable, but some of his issue as a person limited the number of games he actually played. Consistent reliability is a big factor here.


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## da bully (Oct 17, 2006)

i think rodmans 2 dpoy awards hold more weight than wallace 4 because rodman did it against far superior centers and power forwards. honestly now... how many quality centers does wallace play against every night?

i really feel that if rodman played against the centers of today he would average 12 points and 20 rebounds. 

rodman>>>>wallace


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## TwinkieTowers (Jul 16, 2002)

da bully said:


> i think rodmans 2 dpoy awards hold more weight than wallace 4 because rodman did it against far superior centers and power forwards. honestly now... how many quality centers does wallace play against every night?
> 
> i really feel that if rodman played against the centers of today he would average 12 points and 20 rebounds.
> 
> rodman>>>>wallace


Playing alongside Bill Laimbeer and Rick Mahorn and then later David Robinson usually helps a lot. I never really saw Rodman defend centers that often, except when I saw him guarding Shaq in the 1996 playoffs.

For being technically the smallest center in the NBA, Wallace sure does a lot defensively. Heck, even Rodman wasn't the shortest power forward in the NBA when he was grabbing rebounding crowns; that honor goes to Charles Barkley, an exceptional rebounder as well.


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## da bully (Oct 17, 2006)

well, even still rodman played against better POWER FORWARDS than wallace competition at center.


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## McBulls (Apr 28, 2005)

The comparison of the two players is reasonable.

Wallace is by far the better offensive player (at least when Rodman was a Bull). 

Rodman is one of the greatest, if not the greatest, rebounders of all time. Wallace is too, but he ranks behind Rodman.

Both players are great defensive players, but Rodman was a bit better IMO.

Rodman was a lousy free-throw shooter, but nowhere near as bad as Wallace.

Both players can elevate their game to another level when it really matters.

So, it's a close call, but Rodman has more rings. If Wallace wins some rings with the Bulls I reserve the right to change my mind.


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

No comparison, I'd take Rodzilla over Big Ben any day, and 10 times on game day. First off, Rodman wasn't undersized at his normal position, PF. Ben is vastly undersized at his normal position, C. Rodman was a better scorer, better rebounder, better man defender...just about everything better except attitude. 

Hell, Rodman at age 35-38 when we were winning championships with him was better than Wallace is now at 32.


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## Brian. (Jul 11, 2002)

TwinkieTowers said:


> Damn, with all this love of Rodman over Wallace, we should have drafted Balkman.
> 
> *Wallace has how many DPOY awards? Compared to one Rodman won as a Bad Boy?* One could make a case that the press was against him during his years as a Spur and Bull, limiting his votes for the award, but it's very hard to discredit the recognition Ben has received.
> 
> I'll say that Rodman's unique approach to rebounding, as well as his impeccable timing to grab a board right at the pinnacle of his jump, is laudable, but some of his issue as a person limited the number of games he actually played. Consistent reliability is a big factor here.


The number of DPOY awards is a little misleading. Ben won a couple of those because Artest is nutcase and couldn't stay on the court.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

McBulls said:


> The comparison of the two players is reasonable.
> 
> Wallace is by far the better offensive player (at least when Rodman was a Bull).
> 
> ...


Pretty close to my assessment. Both were DPOY candidates year-in-year-out. Rodman was an amazing rebounder, considerably better than Wallace.

Just who is Wallace fighting with for rebounds on the bulls anyhow? Nocioni?

For a brief 2-3 year period, Wallace was such a dominant force on defense that the only player better at it in the history of the NBA (that I saw) was Bill Russell. 

But Rodman did it for a decade plus, and was still quite an athlete at age 37 or even 40... he was just so damned amazing for a guy who didn't practice or work out.

If the quesiton was about Wallace during the year-before, championship year, year-after in detroit, he'd have been my choice, hands down.

Realize Rodman at age 36 was grabbing 15 RPG.

Wallace isn't even close.


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

For their careers? To date, I'd take Wallace. 

Rodman was the better rebounder. But Wallace was/is a better all around defender than Rodman. 

In his his prime, Wallace was the closest thing to Scottie Pippen I've ever seen in his ability to - literally - defend the entirety of the other team. By that I mean that Pippen and Wallace are the only two defenders I've ever seen who could have at least some kind of an impact on the entirety of the other team's offensive sets while still being lightning quick and aware enough to get back to their man on time to prevent a breakdown. Watching those two defend in their primes is some of the greatest basketball I've ever seen. 

But Rodman had a freakish ability to perform at an extremely high level into his late 30's which may ultimately give him a career edge over Wallace. 

They both rock.


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## TwinkieTowers (Jul 16, 2002)

Well, by the end of Wallace's contract we'll see how good he will be.



> But Rodman did it for a decade plus, and was still quite an athlete at age 37 or even 40... he was just so damned amazing for a guy who didn't practice or work out.


I'm not sure about weightlifting, but Rodman was known to be riding the exercise bikes after games. And Wallace has a reputation for working out after games as well.


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## DengNabbit (Feb 23, 2005)

Ron Cey said:


> In his his prime, Wallace was the closest thing to Scottie Pippen I've ever seen in his ability to - literally - defend the entirety of the other team. By that I mean that Pippen and Wallace are the only two defenders I've ever seen who could have at least some kind of an impact on the entirety of the other team's offensive sets while still being lightning quick and aware enough to get back to their man on time to prevent a breakdown.



i dunno, wasnt Pip able to float around as much as he did because of what was around him?


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## Orange Julius Irving (Jun 28, 2004)

I can only say I was NOT happy when The Bulls got Rodman. But it just goes to show you what you put up with as a fan when a person with no character, notice I didn't say personality, comes to the team you love and support.

All the junk he brought to The Bulls was only excused because he played along side Pippin and Jordan and Phil let him get away with ALLOT. Missing practice, yes I'm talking about practice, practice, practice; showing up late, like just before tip-off on game days; and Phil put him in.

In today's NBA Rodman would be banned or would have 50 game suspensions for the things he got away with when he was with the Bulls.

Also, I remember the debates about Rodman when he was playing was that he was one-dimensional and everybody cringed when he went to the hoop or had to shoot free-throws late in games.

So, I guess like John Elway, Dennis Rodman is somehow a well-rounded player now that he is retired?


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## jbulls (Aug 31, 2005)

FWIW, I went with Wallace in a close call. It surprises me that nobody has brought up the huge edge in shot blocking / altering that Wallace has over Rodman.


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

jbulls said:


> FWIW, I went with Wallace in a close call. It surprises me that nobody has brought up the huge edge in shot blocking / altering that Wallace has over Rodman.


And steals.

Ben Wallace has ranked in the top 10 in steals, blocks and rebounds in an NBA season. Thats just crazy.

I didn't notice until after I posted that the question was who would you take "in their prime" - as in when they were at their pinnacle.

At his pinnacle, there may never have been a better defender ever than Ben Wallace. Ever. 

The only two I can think of who even come close are: (a) Bill Russell (based on reputation); and (b) Pippen (based on what I saw with my own eyes). 

I'm sure there are others. And I'm sure Rodman is in the conversation as well. But "in his prime" Ben Wallace was completely and utterly dominant. And not just as a rebounder like Dennis.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

Jordan was a phenominal defender, as was Ho Grant.

I think I'd take a young/in-his-prime Grant over Wallace, too.


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## Brian. (Jul 11, 2002)

DaBullz said:


> Jordan was a phenominal defender, *as was Ho Grant.
> 
> I think I'd take a young/in-his-prime Grant over Wallace, too.*


Its funny you mentioned that because I just bought the 1988-1989 Detroit Pistons DVD. It has all 6 games of the ECF that year against the bulls. I have only gotten through game 2 but so far Grant has been dominating the likes of Rodman, Salley, Laimbeer, and Mahorn. I never realized how good he was.


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## DaBullz4Sho (Oct 12, 2002)

the only thing big ben has on rodman is blocks, if we're talking big ben vs. rodman in a fight, well then the worm would be in big trouble:clap:


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## JonH818 (Aug 31, 2006)

If you played Rodman and Wallace 1 on 1, the score would be 0-0 the entire game and they would have 50 rebounds each.

:lol:


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## McBulls (Apr 28, 2005)

DaBullz4Sho said:


> the only thing big ben has on rodman is blocks, if we're talking big ben vs. rodman in a fight, well then the worm would be in big trouble:clap:


I'm not so sure. Remember professional wrestling was Rodman's hobby. Also, Rodman would definitely not fight fair (pull Ben's pants down, threaten to kiss him, etc). 

Rodman drove a young Shaq crazy in the playoffs by tugging at his pants in the post.


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## johnston797 (May 29, 2002)

lougehrig said:


> Rodman is a dream team player. Alot of his reputation was just antics. *Playing under Skiles is easier than playing with Jordan.* He played hurt and battled much larger players night in and night out.


LOL. That's right. Skiles did say he was just like a sweet big brother to his players, right.

PaxSkiles has yet to go out and get anyone with a poor attitude\reputation and use them well. Guys like PJ Brown are freaking out on PaxSkiles. 

Rodman is the perfect example of someone who thrived on Pjax and MJ's team but wouldn't on a lot of teams.


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## TwinkieTowers (Jul 16, 2002)

Ask Kurt Rambis who he'd rather have on his team. Even ask Don Nelson and Mark Cuban who they'd rather have on their team.

Rodman was great as a player alone, but in Detroit his personality fit in to the Bad Boy image of the team, and, as many said, in Chicago his antics were covered up by the greatness of Jordan and Pippen. The Spurs, Lakers, and Mavericks, obviously, could only tolerate so much of him.


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## fleet40 (Jan 14, 2004)

Brian said:


> Its funny you mentioned that because I just bought the 1988-1989 Detroit Pistons DVD. It has all 6 games of the ECF that year against the bulls. I have only gotten through game 2 but so far Grant has been dominating the likes of Rodman, Salley, Laimbeer, and Mahorn. I never realized how good he was.


Horace Grant was a good player. He was better than Mahorn and Salley. Not better than Laimbeer, and not better than Rodman. In that series the Bulls I believe won the first game. But you will find that Detroit has the better overall team at that time (Obviously) Also understand that Rodman is having major back spasms, and Laimbeer dislocated his shoulder in the prior series. So this is a beat-up front court. And Daily had to substitute many big bodies to compensate.


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