# cavs vs nuggz!



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

lets get this started!

last time we played, camby, KMart, and nene were all out. they clogged up the middle forcing us to take jumpers ALL night. look for the same in this game...


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

nobody wants to talk about this? this (along with the spurs game coming up) is our turn to show the nba whats up. we've been overlooked all season. now is melo's chance to prove he is an all-star...


----------



## darth-horax (Nov 21, 2005)

I think tonight will be the night when Melo will outscore LeBron while leading the Nuggets to a 15 point victory. When we play San Antonio, I don't know if we'll win, but we'll make a strong point in the league. Especially now that we're tied for first and people are starting to get healthy.

We will need our bench to play better than they did against Chicago, though.


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

I believe the big question is how the Nuggets will stop Big Z without Camby.


----------



## Snicka (Dec 29, 2003)

Rumor has it that big Z is hurting and is a game time decision.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

cpawfan said:


> I believe the big question is how the Nuggets will stop Big Z without Camby.


By committee with Elson, Kleiza, and Najera some too.


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

how is that a foul on KMart???

just another example of the charity lebron receives from the league...


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

btw, yall can make a better game thread cuz this one's kinda whack...


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

it's good enough. yeah, the Z matchup is going to be key tonight. so far so good though.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

uh our defense is terrible all of the sudden.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

geez snow is great on defense.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

Martin has been terrible. geez, bring back Elson.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

they've played terrible. We should be up by 20. Our defense hasn't gotten it done.


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

kmart is garbage...


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

why does martin take those stupid fadeaway jumpshots when he never hits them. geez, you're a dunker. stand under the basket and freaking dunk.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

i think we are going to lose this game because our defense has been so bad. we can't win this game on the offensive end, we don't have the guns.


----------



## njnets21 (May 29, 2005)

hey i am watching the game and at the start of the 2nd half, i noticed something. kenyon's headband/armband/legband were white in the first half and now he has switched to yellow ones in the second half. does he always do this? i dont get to see many games as i am in NJ so never would have a chance to notice this until now. can anyone explain this? or am i the only one that noticed


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

never noticed before actually. maybe he thinks he'll stopping playing terribly if he switches head bands.


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

when is karl gonna put kmart's *** on the bench? this is getting rediculous...

yo andre! are u gonna ****ING pass the ball to melo? hes in the post EVERYTIME!!!

and damn! lebron gets EVERY call...


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

Carmelo playing all right, not getting enough touches.


----------



## njnets21 (May 29, 2005)

think you guys spoke a bit too soon on kenyon. he has really come up huge here down the stretch. so many huge, key rebounds and extremely solid defense. if the rest of the team hadn't switched to so many double-teams and let kenyon take Z 1 on 1, this would be a very different score. their last 10 points or so were from open guys that became open from double-teaming Z. kenyon is HUGE right now.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

Another game, another game winner for Carmelo (assuming we get a stop).


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

dang it, carmelo missed 1. they have a chance to tie.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

now we *HAVE* to get the freaking rebound on the foul shot.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

I Freaking Knew It, How The Heck Do You Miss A Defensive Rebound On The Free Throw.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

James chokes, we win. 

We didn't deserve this one at all.


----------



## njnets21 (May 29, 2005)

wow what a play by lebron. karl's philosophy of intentionally fouling when up by 3 almost backfired on him. anyway, congrats on a gritty win guys.


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

njnets21 said:


> wow what a play by lebron. karl's philosophy of intentionally fouling when up by 3 almost backfired on him. anyway, congrats on a gritty win guys.


he crossed the line before the ball hit the rim...

and kmart did NOT come up huge. why the hell was he controlling the ball EVERY freakin play in the fourth quarter??? sad when the home crowd boos you because u are a retard...

boykins was huge! nah was the best player on the court. and melo "the winner" does it again...


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

Najera had the best game, i think. Really only Najera, Boykins, and Carmelo had decent or better games. pretty sad. we did everything in our power to lose this game, but Carmelo refuses to lose, so we didn't.


----------



## njnets21 (May 29, 2005)

pac4eva5 said:


> he crossed the line before the ball hit the rim...
> 
> and kmart did NOT come up huge. why the hell was he controlling the ball EVERY freakin play in the fourth quarter??? sad when the home crowd boos you because u are a retard...
> 
> boykins was huge! nah was the best player on the court. and melo "the winner" does it again...



i dont know how you saw him controlling the ball "every freakin play". all i saw was a lot of rebounds, hard fouls at the right time, all the intangibles that make an impact. if you hate him so much, send him home to jersey cuz i miss him bigtime. his passion and energy was unparallel.


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

Wow, my heart can finally settle down. That was a tough game to watch. Some random quick thoughts:

1) Did anyone else notice Big Z grabbing Kenyon's jersey to slow him down on LeBron's missed FT? It was just enough to slow him down.

2) If it wasn't the last seconds of the game, Henderson would have been called for a foul for how hard he shoved Kenyon on that last rebound.

3) Dre was screwed on that blocking call against LeBron in the middle of the floor.

4) I'm glad they finally stopped double teaming Big Z. The Cavs passes were far too quick for the Nuggets rotations.

5) Najera and Kenyon just manufactured rebounds and points tonight.

6) A win is a win.

7) The Nuggets have earned some luck after the way the season started. I guess as Karl said a few weeks ago. It is now 2006, time to forget about 2005.


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

pac4eva5 said:


> he crossed the line before the ball hit the rim...
> 
> and kmart did NOT come up huge. why the hell was he controlling the ball EVERY freakin play in the fourth quarter??? sad when the home crowd boos you because u are a retard...
> 
> boykins was huge! nah was the best player on the court. and melo "the winner" does it again...


1) The crowd booed his shot selection, not his effort.

2) Early in the 4th when Melo was on the bench, Karl was trying to create offensive spacing as well as give Kenyon some confidence.


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

cpawfan said:


> 1) The crowd booed his shot selection, not his effort.
> 
> 2) Early in the 4th when Melo was on the bench, Karl was trying to create offensive spacing as well as give Kenyon some confidence.


i said they bood him cuz hes a retard. throwing up brick after brick after brick in the final minutes of a game (especially when u suck at shooting anyway!) classifies as borderline retarded...

kmart never even LOOKED at melo ONE TIME!!! :nonono:


----------



## njnets21 (May 29, 2005)

pac4eva5 said:


> i said they bood him cuz hes a retard. throwing up brick after brick after brick in the final minutes of a game (especially when u suck at shooting anyway!) classifies as borderline retarded...
> 
> kmart never even LOOKED at melo ONE TIME!!! :nonono:



the only positive i draw from your recent posts in this thread is the realization that my fellow posters on the Nets board are not the only posters who attack their own players afterall. i cant believe you will call a grown man "a retard" simply for some poor shot selection. the man is first of all a human being, and second of all an NBA player. this warrants at least a shred of respect.


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

pac4eva5 said:


> i said they bood him cuz hes a retard. throwing up brick after brick after brick in the final minutes of a game (especially when u suck at shooting anyway!) classifies as borderline retarded...
> 
> kmart never even LOOKED at melo ONE TIME!!! :nonono:


Melo left the game at with 8:45 left in the 4th and didn't get back into the game until the 4:43 mark. Kenyon was 1/2 before Melo left the game and then while he was out, he was 0/3 and 2/2 from the line. During that 0/3 stretch, he was booed.

Over the last 4:43 of the game, he was 3/4 from the line and 1/2 from the field


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

njnets21 said:


> the only positive i draw from your recent posts in this thread is the realization that my fellow posters on the Nets board are not the only posters who attack their own players afterall. i cant believe you will call a grown man "a retard" simply for some poor shot selection. the man is first of all a human being, and second of all an NBA player. this warrants at least a shred of respect.


You should know by now that Kenyon universally inspires hatred in everyone :bsmile:


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

njnets21 said:


> the only positive i draw from your recent posts in this thread is the realization that my fellow posters on the Nets board are not the only posters who attack their own players afterall. i cant believe you will call a grown man "a retard" simply for some poor shot selection. the man is first of all a human being, and second of all an NBA player. this warrants at least a shred of respect.


im sorry. did i hurt your feelings?


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

cpawfan said:


> Melo left the game at with 8:45 left in the 4th and didn't get back into the game until the 4:43 mark. Kenyon was 1/2 before Melo left the game and then while he was out, he was 0/3 and 2/2 from the line. During that 0/3 stretch, he was booed.
> 
> Over the last 4:43 of the game, he was 3/4 from the line and 1/2 from the field


from the line, kmart was surprisingly good.

1/2 doesnt explain the whole story. he controlled the ball the entire clock more than 3-4 times in that final quarter making our offense look rediculous. he did draw a couple of lucky fouls, or we might have had 4 shot clock violations in a row...

and we are forgetting how he got DESTROYED inside giving up layup after layup.

all in all, he played HORRIBLE in 3 1/2 quarters, and played OK in the final minutes. nothing to get all excited about. kmart was EASILY the worst player on the floor...well except for that guy who got swatted by boykins...WTF?


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

pac4eva5 said:


> from the line, kmart was surprisingly good.
> 
> 1/2 doesnt explain the whole story. he controlled the ball the entire clock more than 3-4 times in that final quarter making our offense look rediculous. he did draw a couple of lucky fouls, or we might have had 4 shot clock violations in a row...
> 
> ...


The giving layup after layup was a direct result of the horrible decision to continue to double Big Z and the crappy rotations of the Nuggets. It only looked like Kenyon gave up all those layups because he ended up the closest to the man with the ball, when in reality, he wasn't suppose to be.


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

cpawfan said:


> The giving layup after layup was a direct result of the horrible decision to continue to double Big Z and the crappy rotations of the Nuggets. It only looked like Kenyon gave up all those layups because he ended up the closest to the man with the ball, when in reality, he wasn't suppose to be.


i think u are missing the point. the same happened to najera in the post, yet najera wasnt giving up layup after layup??????????

how many blocks did kmart end up with? how many did nah have?

nah is CLEARLY the better player, which is ironic.

when camby comes back i hope nah starts at PF. hes a better player on both sides of the floor.

and since KMART is a "spark" type player and is always in foul trouble anyway...what a perfect fit it will be having him and boykins come off the bench! INSTANT ENERGY!!!

i doubt that will happen, but it should...


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

pac4eva5 said:


> i think u are missing the point. the same happened to najera in the post, yet najera wasnt giving up layup after layup??????????
> 
> how many blocks did kmart end up with? how many did nah have?
> 
> ...


Najera wasn't in the game that much without Kenyon when Z was in the game. The same types of plays weren't happening. If you remember, Karl started out with Najera trying to guard Z and then to switch Kenyon on to him because Z backed Najera down.

Just as the Nuggets offense is obviously worse w/o Melo in the game, the Nuggets defense is obviously worse w/o Kenyon in the game while Camby is out.

BTW, Kenyon wasn't in foul trouble the entire game


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

cpawfan said:


> Just as the Nuggets offense is obviously worse w/o Melo in the game, the Nuggets defense is obviously worse w/o Kenyon in the game while Camby is out.


with camby starting, i'll take Nah over kmart at PF. Nah is a better shooter, better finisher, better rebounder, better defender, and ALWAYS hustles...



> BTW, Kenyon wasn't in foul trouble the entire game


of course he wasnt! did u see all the layups? its either one or the other...


----------



## nbanoitall (May 21, 2004)

najera is earning his pay check. 


I'm starting to see this team all healthy with Camby back later on, and Paul Pierce in a Nuggets Uniform. I smell an upset.


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

pac4eva5 said:


> with camby starting, i'll take Nah over kmart at PF. Nah is a better shooter, better finisher, better rebounder, better defender, and ALWAYS hustles...


You're entitled to your opinion, no matter how wrong you are. This is the classic case of the backup QB being everyone's favorite player until he actually plays. I have no desire to knock Eddie as I love what he brings to the Nuggets and was one of the few people on this forum excited when he was acquired.



> of course he wasnt! did u see all the layups? its either one or the other...


So you would rather him take dumb fouls???? Of course, this is your perception, so there is no point in debating this.


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

cpawfan said:


> You're entitled to your opinion, no matter how wrong you are. This is the classic case of the backup QB being everyone's favorite player until he actually plays. I have no desire to knock Eddie as I love what he brings to the Nuggets and was one of the few people on this forum excited when he was acquired.


i loved the move too. and i dont give kiki ANY credit, cuz i believe that was karl's man.





> So you would rather him take dumb fouls???? Of course, this is your perception, so there is no point in debating this.


your missing my point again. kmart is an OVERRATED defender. USUSALLY he DOES make the stupid foul. today, he just acted like an open door...

what are postives about kmart? he runs the floor better than any other PF in the league. he dunks hard. every now and then swats one into the crowd. brings energy. sounds like an AWESOME 6th man to me...

najera is the better defender. he can guard one-on-one off the dribble. he can guard off the post. he had like 5 blocks today and they were all HIS man! almost all kmarts blocks come from help defense, never his own man. najera got square blocks simply defending HIS guy. nah also gets many steals.

najera is also the better offensive player in the half court. moves around. better shooter. almost ALWAYS finishes around the hoop. pass first player. very good at setting screens...

point is, unless kmart is running the fast break rediculously, najera is the better overall player...


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

pac4eva5 said:


> i loved the move too. and i dont give kiki ANY credit, cuz i believe that was karl's man.


Sure, getting another team to take Skita and White off the Nuggets hands was all Karl's doing 



> your missing my point again. kmart is an OVERRATED defender. USUSALLY he DOES make the stupid foul. today, he just acted like an open door...
> 
> what are postives about kmart? he runs the floor better than any other PF in the league. he dunks hard. every now and then swats one into the crowd. brings energy. sounds like an AWESOME 6th man to me...
> 
> ...


I'm not missing your point, rather you aren't making one. You aren't debating facts, instead you are presenting your perceptions as facts.

Najera had 3 blocks today on Snow and Pavlovic twice. None of those were Najera's own man, rather they were players that he had to switch to because of rotations.

Again, don't let facts stand in the way of your perception.

The plays you are talking about Kenyon acting like an open door as you put were plays in which Kenyon had to move over because the weakside defender didn't rotate quick enough. Sure there were a couple of times where Henderson beat Kenyon to a spot, but the vast majority of those were team screw ups.

To claim Najera is a better defender than Kenyon is laughable. Najera is a pesky defender with active hands who never turns down a defense assignment; however, he doesn't have the lateral quickness that Kenyon does to defend guards and wings as well as Kenyon does. Also, Karl made a point of having Kenyon on Big Z and not Najera after Z backed him down.

I'm going to stop here because I really have no desire to continue this pointless comparison of my 2 favorite Nuggets.


----------



## darth-horax (Nov 21, 2005)

I have to admit that I was frustrated with Kmart's shooting in the final minutes of the game.

Let's remember, though, that he still isn't 100%. He's fighting off injuries, and the guy grabbed 17 rebounds! I don't care if you're Dennis Rodman, 17 boards is great!

He brings hustle and intensity, and a little intimidation. Is he worth the max contract and several first rounders we gave up? Probably not, it's hard to tell since he's never been healthy. However, he SHOULD make a better shot selection late in games.

I love Kmart, but dang, everytime I see he's a DNP with the $ he's making, it makes me want to puke.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

Wait a second, Najera can't defend guards as well as Kenyon? Huh? Yeah he does, probably the best on our team outside of Buckner. That guys does have good lateral movement and plays right up on his man. wouldn't do that if he was slow laterally. that's why carmelo plays back some.


----------



## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

darth-horax said:


> I have to admit that I was frustrated with Kmart's shooting in the final minutes of the game.
> 
> Let's remember, though, that he still isn't 100%. He's fighting off injuries, and the guy grabbed 17 rebounds! I don't care if you're Dennis Rodman, 17 boards is great!
> 
> ...


If Martin's contract was half of what it is, I'd like him a lot more. Sometimes he plays great and is obviously helping the team just by being there. last night he was worse than elson though.


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

cambyblockingyou said:


> Wait a second, Najera can't defend guards as well as Kenyon? Huh? Yeah he does, probably the best on our team outside of Buckner. That guys does have good lateral movement and plays right up on his man. wouldn't do that if he was slow laterally. that's why carmelo plays back some.


I didn't say Najera doesn't have lateral quickness nor that he couldn't defend guards. Rather I said he isn't as quick nor as good as Kenyon in either of these areas.


----------



## cpawfan (Jun 20, 2004)

cambyblockingyou said:


> If Martin's contract was half of what it is, I'd like him a lot more. Sometimes he plays great and is obviously helping the team just by being there. last night he was worse than elson though.


If Kenyon doesn't play the 4th quarter last night, the Nuggets get blown out. Even on a very poor shooting night, he managed to manufacture 16 points and grab 17 rebounds.


----------



## njnets21 (May 29, 2005)

cpawfan said:


> If Kenyon doesn't play the 4th quarter last night, the Nuggets get blown out. Even on a very poor shooting night, he managed to manufacture 16 points and grab 17 rebounds.


thats exactly the bottom line. say what you want about the downside to his game last night, but cpaw's statement here is simple truth. without the upside to his game last night, the nuggets lose. period.


----------



## Kuskid (Aug 18, 2004)

Kenyon took way too many jumpers, but he stepped it up down the stretch big time. Without him in there we don't win that game (shouldn't have anyways, good thing Henderson n Bron gave us a bit of help). Kenyon played as tenacious as you could ask while defending Z in the post last in the game, he made it personal. I'm not sure I like the yelling to your coach to let you take him one on one while you're running up the court, but the enthusiasm is at least there. And if Melo doesn't make the All Star team I'm unplugging my TV for All Star weekend.


----------



## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

stats dont mean ****. i saw kmart do 3 things great. one-on-one with z at the end, freethrows, rebounds.

thats it??? 3 things??? why are we paying him???

i cant believe there is even an argument! w/o nah, we are 10 games below .500!!!

nah is FAR more consistant and plays well on BOTH sides of the floor!


----------

