# Pull the trigger



## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

> *Dump Dirk? For Kobe, Mavs should*
> 
> It doesn't matter whether Mark Cuban or Donnie Nelson makes the phone call, but one of them needs to contact Lakers GM Mitch Kupchak today and find out what it takes to get Kobe Bryant.
> 
> ...


Article

Change starts at the top, and I swear I'd do it.


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

Co-signed.


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## Saint Baller (May 3, 2006)

My favorite player for the greatest player on earth.

Hard choice =/


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

I'm over the personal attachment to the big german......... I just want a championship.


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

The forest has too much undergrowth, and the answer is fire.

Kobe has fire, Dirk does not.


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## VeN (May 10, 2005)

ok so we get kobe, and then we have the same problems that chicago has, no depth at the 4-5. do yall think about these things or do yall just say oo kobe *sign* besides you think me-first kobe would be the same kobe on this team? first hed probably hamper the development of jho and devin, because we all know win or lose he has to be "the man". and 2nd AJ isnt about the me first philosophy, its more about team ball, so of course kobes numbers would prolly go down (that is if he plays within the offence of course). not to mention, that teams will just crowd the lane and I dont trust kobes shot as much as some of yall do.


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

Show me "depth" at the 4...

The problem is (as crazy as this sounds) is your PF is Dirk. Yeah, he's the MVP and all, but you have no low post presence on this team - none whatsoever - so even though you have a 3 pt shooting champion, he can't use that shot. 

Dirk can't create his own shot, can't work his way free off a pick, and he can't defend. Defenses know what we see - crowd him and he's flustered. Bang him inside and he won't return. "Run him" and he's fatigued. Unless you a) return to the run & gun, or b) put a low post presence down low, Dirk's potential is limited and worse, wasted.


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## VeN (May 10, 2005)

xray said:


> Show me "depth" at the 4...
> 
> The problem is (as crazy as this sounds) is your PF is Dirk. Yeah, he's the MVP and all, but you have no low post presence on this team - none whatsoever - so even though you have a 3 pt shooting champion, he can't use that shot.
> 
> Dirk can't create his own shot, can't work his way free off a pick, and he can't defend. Defenses know what we see - crowd him and he's flustered. Bang him inside and he won't return. "Run him" and he's fatigued. Unless you a) return to the run & gun, or b) put a low post presence down low, Dirk's potential is limited and worse, wasted.


just saying, getting kobe solves the guard problem, but creates more problems. we cant sacrifice more than we get back. we should be thinking about a low post presence and not someone like kobe. as many times as Ive seen him shoot the lakers into a game, ive seen him shoot them right out.


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

VeN said:


> just saying, getting kobe solves the guard problem, but creates more problems. we cant sacrifice more than we get back. we should be thinking about a low post presence and not someone like kobe. as many times as Ive seen him shoot the lakers into a game, ive seen him shoot them right out.


I understand, but I'm going with the impression that Dirk is all we're giving up; we can then surround Kobe with more talent than he has with the Fakers. Assuming then that we can pursue other trade prospects.

This is dreaming - if we had the ability to forge a guard-forward combo like that, we would've already done it. :biggrin:


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

VeN said:


> just saying, getting kobe solves the guard problem, but creates more problems. we cant sacrifice more than we get back. we should be thinking about a low post presence and not someone like kobe. as many times as Ive seen him shoot the lakers into a game, ive seen him shoot them right out.


IMO, we get low-post presence, and all our problems go away.

I don't care if the opponent has a big and strong guard like BDavis. When you have a well-rounded big, the slasher will be forced to think twice before slashing...


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## Astral (Apr 23, 2007)

Lakers wont touch this trade with a 15 foot lance.


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## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

The problem really is if you solve one problem you might have two new ones.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

I do love Kobe, but this deal wouldn't be good for anybody....

Seriously, low-post situation needs to be solved before moving our 7 footer to get another guard/forward. Can you imagine the amount of work and retooling needed if the Kobe trade goes down.

On the other hand, if we just focus on bringing in JO.... Harris-JO would make a killer combo, and Dirk can just play the mid-range game that he loves.


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## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

Get Kobe and keep Dirk ...

:joke:


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

I would like to be traded, yeah," Bryant told ESPN radio.

Now it's gets compelling.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

I'll do JHo, Terry and Dampier for Kobe. lol...

That's 3 starters I'm willing to give up for Kobe. :deal:


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

Funny, but I've got Damp as a fixture with Kobe, unless of course a true big with skills is on the way...


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## VeN (May 10, 2005)

edwardcyh said:


> I do love Kobe, but this deal wouldn't be good for anybody....
> 
> Seriously, low-post situation needs to be solved before moving our 7 footer to get another guard/forward. Can you imagine the amount of work and retooling needed if the Kobe trade goes down.
> 
> On the other hand, if we just focus on bringing in JO.... Harris-JO would make a killer combo, and Dirk can just play the mid-range game that he loves.


that would be a good trade, as long as JO stays quiet and just plays the game.


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## VeN (May 10, 2005)

edwardcyh said:



> I'll do JHo, Terry and Dampier for Kobe. lol...
> 
> That's 3 starters I'm willing to give up for Kobe. :deal:


is that assuming we would keep dirk? I think so, but if not who would be our #2 that plays as well as Jho. IMO I wouldnt get rid of Jho if were getting a guard. Maybe a big with a low post game.


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## t1no (Jul 10, 2005)

VeN said:


> but if not who would be our #2 that plays as well as Jho.


Who cares?? we have Kobe.


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## VeN (May 10, 2005)

t1no said:


> Who cares?? we have Kobe.


i hope thats sarcasm, cause not having a reliable 2nd option is workin out realllly well for LA right? right?!


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## Jet (Jul 1, 2005)

Ugh.. I love Dirk. I dont want to give him up. If we got Kobe for Dirk, and won a Championship the next year, that would be a huge slap in the face to Dirk. It would depress me, Im not gonna lie about it...It depresses me even thinking about it. As great as a player Kobe is, I would rather keep Dirk. I think we should keep Dirk and trade for Kobe to make the best of both worlds, but thats never going to happen.


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## NOODLESTYLE (Jan 20, 2005)

Dallas has one thing that KOBE would definatley play for and KOBE would be lying to himself if he said NO and that would be Mark Cuban. Mark would do whatever it takes to keep his superstars happy.

Therefore if Dallas wants him, I would offer everyone on the table except Dirk. Perhaps Erik Dampier, Josh Howard, Devin Harris, and future picks?

Kobe needs an outside shooter and offensive scorer to help take the scoring load off of him, Dirk needs a player who will take over the game in the clutch. Kobe and Dirk would be great together. What Mark needs to do is escalate this situation more like he usually does...he should publicly state "If KOBE Bryant wants to come to the Mavs, I'll make it happen". Kobe could then waive his no-trade clause...and talks can happen.


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## cokeplease (Jun 3, 2006)

VeN said:


> ok so we get kobe, and then we have the same problems that chicago has, no depth at the 4-5. do yall think about these things or do yall just say oo kobe *sign* besides you think me-first kobe would be the same kobe on this team? first hed probably hamper the development of jho and devin, because we all know win or lose he has to be "the man". and 2nd AJ isnt about the me first philosophy, its more about team ball, so of course kobes numbers would prolly go down (that is if he plays within the offence of course). not to mention, that teams will just crowd the lane and I dont trust kobes shot as much as some of yall do.



Trade Josh Howard for Zach Randolph with fillers.

Theres an article on Blazers GM Kevin Pritchard communicating with Dallas and Seattle today in the Oregonian i believe.

That would solve your problem at PF.


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## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

cokeplease said:


> Trade Josh Howard for Zach Randolph with fillers.
> 
> Theres an article on Blazers GM Kevin Pritchard communicating with Dallas and Seattle today in the Oregonian i believe.
> 
> That would solve your problem at PF.


Josh Howard is more valuable to us than Zach Randolph would ever be. He was the only one to show some heart in the playoffs.


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## VeN (May 10, 2005)

croco said:


> Josh Howard is more valuable to us than Zach Randolph would ever be. He was the only one to show some heart in the playoffs.


I wouldnt say that, Diop was great, and Devin was as well. Even the limited time that Damp played, he was good too. 



NOODLESTYLE said:


> Dallas has one thing that KOBE would definatley play for and KOBE would be lying to himself if he said NO and that would be Mark Cuban. Mark would do whatever it takes to keep his superstars happy.
> 
> Therefore if Dallas wants him, I would offer everyone on the table except Dirk. Perhaps Erik Dampier, Josh Howard, Devin Harris, and future picks?
> 
> Kobe needs an outside shooter and offensive scorer to help take the scoring load off of him, Dirk needs a player who will take over the game in the clutch. Kobe and Dirk would be great together. What Mark needs to do is escalate this situation more like he usually does...he should publicly state "If KOBE Bryant wants to come to the Mavs, I'll make it happen". Kobe could then waive his no-trade clause...and talks can happen.


you kiddin me? Ok so who would run the point? 

Im not even gonna rundown how bad that sounds. wow. you do know you just described houston right? you cant have two superstars and then big GAPING holes at every other position...


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

From Simmons article on ESPN:



> *Deal No. 4:* Dallas trades Josh Howard, Jason Terry and Jerry Stackhouse (sign-and-trade starting at $7.3 million per) for Kobe.
> 
> 
> *Comments:* I'm intrigued by this one because (A) the Lakers would be competitive with a Howard-Terry-Odom-Bynum nucleus; (B) Kobe would solve all of Nowitzki's toughness/crunch-time problems; and (C) Dallas could probably win a title with Kobe, Nowitzki, the Diop/Dampier combo, Devin Harris and seven guys they found on the street. But would the Lakers ever trade Kobe to a Western contender? And would Cuban ever admit that Dirk was irrevocably damaged by the 2006 Finals and the Warriors-Mavs series, to the degree that he needed to acquire another crunch-time guy? If the Mavs didn't have the testicular fortitude to pull off a Shaq trade three years ago, they won't have the gulliones to go after Kobe.


I'd do that trade in a heartbeat too.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

VeN said:


> Even the limited time that Damp played, he was good too.


On the flip side, as much as he's getting paid, Damp is not producing much. Compare him to Nene of the Nugz....



VeN said:


> Im not even gonna rundown how bad that sounds. wow. you do know you just described houston right? you cant have two superstars and then big GAPING holes at every other position...


There are more superstar combos that succeeded than those that failed. If you talk to some Rocket fans (I unfortunately work with two of them), they'll tell you that Yao doesn't belong in the superstar category. Yao didn't produce until this year, and he was too passive when the team needed him. (Sound familiar!?!?!)

Yao is more considered a 7-6 role player on the team.

Dirk and Kobe gives Dallas two legit stars. Surround them with an above-average supporting cast (anybody BUT Rafer Alston), and we should be alright.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

Ninjatune said:


> I'd do that trade in a heartbeat too.


"Howard-Terry-Odom-Bynum nucleus" sounds pretty intimidating.... Plus, Farmar seems to be developing well. As soon as Smush is shipped out, they'll be set.

I would much rather give up Damp than Stack. Stack was one of the few players with production off the bench.


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

> Dallas trades Josh Howard, Jason Terry and Jerry Stackhouse (sign-and-trade starting at $7.3 million per) for Kobe.


Mo Ager would shoot himself. :biggrin:


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

edwardcyh said:


> "Howard-Terry-Odom-Bynum nucleus" sounds pretty intimidating.... Plus, Farmar seems to be developing well. As soon as Smush is shipped out, they'll be set.
> 
> I would much rather give up Damp than Stack. Stack was one of the few players with production off the bench.


Not more intimidating than Kobe-Dirk -Harris-Damp/Diop...................


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

Kobe and Devin would have some killer one-on-one battles in practice; would probably make him a better player. :biggrin:


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

xray said:


> Mo Ager would shoot himself. :biggrin:


I think he might wet himself....


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

Ninjatune said:


> Not more intimidating than Kobe-Dirk -Harris-Damp/Diop...................


I would much rather have:

Kobe-Dirk-Harris-JO

:biggrin:


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

edwardcyh said:


> I would much rather have:
> 
> Kobe-Dirk-Harris-JO
> 
> :biggrin:


I actually think the white guy looks out of place...


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

xray said:


> I actually think the white guy looks out of place...


Who? Harris?









:lol:


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

BTW, I'm gonna shoot myself if SA wins another freakin ring.


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

I hope you have a gun ready.....


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

Ninjatune said:


> BTW, I'm gonna shoot myself if SA wins another freakin ring.


When I said "pull the trigger", that wasn't the implication. :lol:


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

Just makes me sick to my stomach.............


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

Ninjatune said:


> Just makes me sick to my stomach.............


.... but you had to be prepared for THIS after Dallas made the exit in first round.


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## Ninjatune (May 1, 2006)

Of course.... but there's always a little bit of hope that someone would knock them off.....


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

Ninjatune said:


> Of course.... but there's always a little bit of hope that someone would knock them off.....


the Jazz?

:lol:

:joke:


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

I was kinda hoping too that the field would've been more open without the top seed...


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

Though I wanted a TX team to win, deep down inside I was rooting for the Suns and Jazz....


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

edwardcyh said:


> Though I wanted a TX team to win, deep down inside I was rooting for the Suns and Jazz....


It takes a hellava man to say that - like wearing a pink shirt to a party. :worthy:


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

xray said:


> It takes a hellava man to say that - like wearing a pink shirt to a party. :worthy:


I know! My feminine side slips out every now and then. :biggrin:




p.s. Girls dig it. lol...


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## edwardcyh (Dec 13, 2005)

BTW, for some strange reason, I kept on reading the title of this thread as "Pull the finger."


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## VeN (May 10, 2005)

edwardcyh said:


> On the flip side, as much as he's getting paid, Damp is not producing much. Compare him to Nene of the Nugz....


exactly why I think we should be thinking depth at the 4-5, someone who can score. even someone as limited as Croshere showed that having production from the 4-5 slot couldve put us over GS. 





> There are more superstar combos that succeeded than those that failed. If you talk to some Rocket fans (I unfortunately work with two of them), they'll tell you that Yao doesn't belong in the superstar category. Yao didn't produce until this year, and he was too passive when the team needed him. (Sound familiar!?!?!)
> 
> Yao is more considered a 7-6 role player on the team.
> 
> Dirk and Kobe gives Dallas two legit stars. Surround them with an above-average supporting cast (anybody BUT Rafer Alston), and we should be alright.


yao was out with legitimate injuries as well. lets put it this way though, would the mavs take him? 

would it be possible to replace what we have if we gave them up for kobe? I doubt it. At least, not cheaply. We would have to wheel and deal, and I shudder remembering the last time we tried this experiment.. cause walker and jamison were outstanding right?


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## Javelin (Apr 17, 2007)

Terry and Dampier for Corey Maggette or Elton Brand.


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## VeN (May 10, 2005)

Javelin said:


> Terry and Dampier for Corey Maggette or Elton Brand.


rather have brand


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## sonicFLAME6 (Dec 19, 2006)

it would be sweet if someway somehow they could get kobe and keep nowitzki, but i know it isnt going to happen


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## xray (Feb 21, 2005)

Mmmm, Brand...:drool2:


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## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

xray said:


> Mmmm, Brand...:drool2:


:rules:


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## Javelin (Apr 17, 2007)

Well both can take it to the basket more effectively than anyone we have on our line up right now. Its obvious that Kobe to Dallas, let alone go anywhere is out of the question so lets just leave him out of the discussion for now.


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