# Don't look now but Kobe has reclaimed his throne.



## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

As the best guard in basketball. Over the last 9 games dude has been putting up numbers like 28.7 points per game, 8.8 assists per game and 8 boards per game. The wacky thing is the Lakers have gone 8-1 during that stretch. When Kobe sits out, they lose to Atlanta. 

Welcome back bro.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

They also lost to Sacramento.


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## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> They also lost to Sacramento.


Oh no! Not those horrible lottery bound Kings again! Gasp.  

You can't win them all. You know that.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Kobe is playing very well but if you are a Laker fan there is no way you can't be worried with the way some of the other guys are playing. 

Shaq's horrible FT shooting is going to be a problem.


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## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Kobe is playing very well but if you are a Laker fan there is no way you can't be worried with the way some of the other guys are playing.
> 
> Shaq's horrible FT shooting is going to be a problem.


I'm a Pistons fan and a Kobe fan, so I don't care about Shaq lol. Th perfect scenario would be Kobe getting traded to the Pistons for Darvin Ham. Any takers?

Seriously, if Shaq i sstruggling as much as you say that just makes Kobes value that much greater. I believe that there is nobody playing close to as good as he is from either guard position. It looks like he is finally back on track and ready to go on with his career.


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## MongolianDeathCloud (Feb 27, 2004)

In related news, Kobe could miss a game or two of Round 1. His pretrial hearings are on April 26, 27, and 28. The playoffs begin on the 17th.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Shaq's horrible FT shooting is going to be a problem.


The only thing i can say in Shaq's defense is he does make them when it matters most.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> The only thing i can say in Shaq's defense is he does make them when it matters most.


Are you confident in that this year? Honestly? One game means an awful lot this year in the playoffs.


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## socco (Jul 14, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> The only thing i can say in Shaq's defense is he does make them when it matters most.


He missed 2 last night towards the end of the game. Luckily Houston decided not to get the rebound, but I still don't think he makes them when they count. He makes them much more often, but still not that much.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Yeah he's looking pretty good now.

Damn lakers.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>q</b>!
> 
> He missed 2 last night towards the end of the game. Luckily Houston decided not to get the rebound, but I still don't think he makes them when they count. He makes them much more often, but still not that much.


Another thing about Shaq is he doesn't give a 100% effort in the regular season. His play fluctuates, but once the postseason comes around, and they start that hack a shaq.... he makes those free throws. And even if he doesn't KObe will pick up the slack!


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Kobe is playing very well but if you are a Laker fan there is no way you can't be worried with the way some of the other guys are playing.
> 
> Shaq's horrible FT shooting is going to be a problem.


The only thing Laker fans should be worrying about is Karl Malone's health. Payton and Shaq have been playing fine, sans the terrible FT shooting from Shaq of course, which is only a problem if he shoots below 50% in the playoffs, which he never has as a Laker.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

First and foremost Laker fans need to be concerned about Kobe staying a Laker. If he leaves, this franchise is going downhill an fast.


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## jokeaward (May 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> The only thing i can say in Shaq's defense is he does make them when it matters most.


They always count and I thought he bricked them in the Kings game down the stretch.

He's been good at times in recent years, but he's still Shaq.


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## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

What the hell? Iverson is still the best 2 guard since Michael Guard. No two guard after Michael Jordan has been more consistent every season other than Allen Iverson.


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## DaUnbreakableKinG (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> What the hell? Iverson is still the best 2 guard since Michael Guard. No two guard after Michael Jordan has been more consistent every season other than Allen Iverson.


Kobe is lets say about 100 times better then AI. Thats for sure.  

also (no other two guard after MJ has won 3 straight champs other than Kobe) :yes:


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## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> Kobe is lets say about 100 times better then AI. Thats for sure.


Iverson would beat Bryant in a 1 versus 1 game. 
Nobody has schooled Bryant other than Iverson.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> 
> 
> Kobe is lets say about 100 times better then AI. Thats for sure.
> ...


No other two guard since MJ has been playing with another all-star under a hall of fame coach in one of the biggest markets in basketball...

And I wouldn't say Kobe is 100 times better than AI. If Kobe were a 100 times better than AI then that would make him the best player in the game today. And that's simply not true. Kobe, T-Mac and AI are all fairly close together...and that's a mile away from the level KG and Duncan play at.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

*To wit:*

Guy A:
27 ppg
3.9 Rpg
2.44 spg
6.6 apg

Guy B:
22.9 ppg
5.4 rpg
5.2 apg
1.71 spg

yet Guy B is somehow 100 times the player that guy A is? In spite of trailing in all categories with the exception of rebounding, of which the diffrence is less than one would assume, considering guy A is 6-7 inchces shorter than guy B and 55 pounds lighter.


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## DaUnbreakableKinG (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> 
> 
> No other two guard since MJ has been playing with another all-star under a hall of fame coach in one of the biggest markets in basketball...
> ...


Kobe is the best player in the league. He is the only one right now that comes close to MJ. Don't believe me? Watch some Laker games.  


(and that 100 times that I said I was just playing with Mattsanity. (but for real Kobe is better than AI, and AI is a mile away from Kobe.))


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

*Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Guy A:
> 27 ppg
> 3.9 Rpg
> ...


You left off FG%. Must have been an accident.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

*And Furthermore:*

Here is Guy B vs. Guy C:

Guy B:
22.9 ppg
5.4 rpg
5.2 apg
1.71 spg

Guy C:
27.7 ppg
6.1 rpg
5.4 apg
1.37 spg

Conclusion:
Guy C is the best. While Guy A and B are near the same level this year. Though Guy B is hot right now.


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## DaUnbreakableKinG (Jun 28, 2003)

*Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> Guy A:
> 27 ppg
> 3.9 Rpg
> ...



are you also taking in consideration that AI plays with the worst team in the NBA? I mean they some bad players on that team. HE which is AI has to do everything and I'm surprised that he doesn't have more rebounds. Kobe plays with the MDP in the league which is Shaq and with "the Glove" and "Mailman" so it's a different position to be in. He doesn't have to score 30 a game to win games. Youknowwhatimsayin?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

*Re: Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>Pinball</b>!
> 
> 
> You left off FG%. Must have been an accident.


No it was definitely deliberate. Guy A just went 2-21. It's best if we just avoid that whole conversation for now.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

*Re: Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> are you also taking in consideration that AI plays with the worst team in the NBA? I mean they some bad players on that team. HE which is AI has to do everything and I'm surprised that he doesn't have more rebounds. Kobe plays with the MDP in the league which is Shaq and with "the Glove" and "Mailman" so it's a different position to be in. He doesn't have to score 30 a game to win games. Youknowwhatimsayin?


Let's stop calling Shaq the Most Dominant Player now. He isn't anymore. :no:


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

*Re: Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> are you also taking in consideration that AI plays with the worst team in the NBA? I mean they some bad players on that team. HE which is AI has to do everything and I'm surprised that he doesn't have more rebounds. Kobe plays with the MDP in the league which is Shaq and with "the Glove" and "Mailman" so it's a different position to be in. He doesn't have to score 30 a game to win games. Youknowwhatimsayin?


Hey. I do think Kobe is better than AI. Especially last year. But this hasn't been a normal Kobe Bryant season. And Iverson has been closer to where he's generally been, and until he got injured the first time was playing MVP level ball. I just thought a hundred times better than AI was a huge exaggeration. Which you admitted to. It's hard to bring team into this conversation, because that conversation can go either way.

For me T-Mac has been the best of the three on the whole of the season. Regardless of his team's play. Iverson outplayed Kobe in the first half of the season. Now Kobe is moving ahead of him right back to the ol' T-Mac/Kobe arguement we've all missed for so long.


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## DaUnbreakableKinG (Jun 28, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> 
> 
> Hey. I do think Kobe is better than AI. Especially last year. But this hasn't been a normal Kobe Bryant season. And Iverson has been closer to where he's generally been, and until he got injured the first time was playing MVP level ball. I just thought a hundred times better than AI was a huge exaggeration. Which you admitted to. It's hard to bring team into this conversation, because that conversation can go either way.
> ...


:greatjob:


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> 
> 
> Hey. I do think Kobe is better than AI. Especially last year. But this hasn't been a normal Kobe Bryant season. And Iverson has been closer to where he's generally been, and until he got injured the first time was playing MVP level ball. I just thought a hundred times better than AI was a huge exaggeration. Which you admitted to. It's hard to bring team into this conversation, because that conversation can go either way.
> ...


How much of an argument is there when Kobe has missed a boatload of games and T-Mac's team is 17-47? I tend to think we shouldn't even be talking about them this year. 

We should be talking about the Grizz, the Bucks, KG and the Kings.


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## DaUnbreakableKinG (Jun 28, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> 
> 
> Let's stop calling Shaq the Most Dominant Player now. He isn't anymore. :no:


that's right Hong Kong Fooey, he's not anymore, he used to be but I guess that weight is bothering him.


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## HallOfFamer (May 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> 
> 
> Kobe is the best player in the league. He is the only one right now that comes close to MJ. Don't believe me? Watch some Laker games.
> ...


and this is coming from a Kings fan.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> 
> 
> that's right Hong Kong Fooey, he's not anymore, he used to be but I guess that weight is bothering him.


I'm still hoping he can somehow turn it on come playoff time. I'll take tht 30% FT shooting if it means that he's dominating on both ends of the floor. Regardless, I think that the key for LA is getting Malone back. His importance transcends his statistical contributions. Offensively, he stretches the court and opens things up for Shaq down low. He's also a great passer and the most unselfish of the stars. I think the offense will flow better when he's in there. Defensively, he'll still get beaten by most PFs on the block but he has the ability to go out and defend big guys on the perimeter. Shaq never leaves the paint so we need someone to defend the oppposing C on the perimeter. Karl can do that. He's also a much better rebounder than any of the other Lakers PFs. He'll give Shaq a break on the boards every now and then.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> 
> 
> Kobe is the best player in the league. He is the only one right now that comes close to MJ. Don't believe me? Watch some Laker games.
> ...


ChUUUch!


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

Already posted in the Lakers forum:

"Kobe is waaaaay underrated when it comes to take the credit of the Lakers threepeat.

I have no doubt in my mind that, besides the Finals (who weren´t that hard to win) the Lakers wouldn´t win the West in these past years without Kobe.

What people don´t get about the kid is that he thrives under pressure and challenge.
There is absolutely no player i would trust more than Kobe to take the ball (and the game) in his hands in the last seconds of a game 7-even score-playoff game.

The guy is the best in the game in creating (for himself or for others). Period. He just doesn´t fail. Wether it´s grabbing a crutial offensive rebound in the faces of Duncan and D-Rob and scoring, or converting the final play of a close game into an alley-oop for a Shaq´s dunk, or whatever, he delivers the goods.

Besides Shaq and Duncan he is the player that has proven again and again that he will come up on top.

Hate the guy if you want, but damn! just lay back and love his game..."

Adding now: *Kobe Bryant IS Michael Jordan*


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

well kobe is going through that stretch of the season where he is trying to get assists on purpose
i dont know
i have a feeling he just wants to end up AVG more than T-mac

if the lakers only realized that they can win almost every game by just giving the ball to shaq every time down the court
the game wouldnt be all that fun to watch
everyone would know who is gonna win the championship

instead they have Kobe who is trying to get his stats and prove that he is better than McGrady, Pierce, AI, JKidd and etc


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>PauloCatarino</b>!
> Adding now: *Kobe Bryant IS Michael Jordan*


Kobe Bryant is Kobe Bryant. There's no need for comparisons anymore. Comparisons are for young players that haven't established themselves yet. Kobe has done enough in the NBA to create his own legacy. Besides, he's a different type of player than MJ is/was.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>fjkdsi</b>!
> well kobe is going through that stretch of the season where he is trying to get assists on purpose
> i dont know
> i have a feeling he just wants to end up AVG more than T-mac
> ...


Man this kid can't do anything right can he?


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>fjkdsi</b>!
> well kobe is going through that stretch of the season where he is trying to get assists on purpose
> i dont know
> i have a feeling he just wants to end up AVG more than T-mac
> ...


Having more assists than T-Mac? Where would you get that from? Why would Kobe even be thinking about T-Mac? T-Mac isn't going to the playoffs this year. 

Why can't the guy just be playing well? Why does there have to be some ulterior motive? Some of you guys really need to use your heads. You just make **** up as you go. I swear some people make Kobe out to be some super egomaniac that is thinking about everyone else except his own game. Get a frickin clue.


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

lol, maybe i exaggerated about the get more assists than t-mac thing


but he really is playing selfishly

i live in LA and im not a laker fan but i watch all their games(unless a clipper game is on at the same time, than i watch mostly the clippers)

and the way kobe has played hasnt really impressed me

if you remember last year he also avg big numbers during a stretch of games
however the lakers were still loosing
it seems a similar thing is going on right now
they are still winning their games but i think kobe can do more good for the team by giving the ball to shaq and lettin him dominate the game
instead kobe overhandles the ball and tries to find the open man
and get his assist

i know his stats look extremely impressive lately
but his game hasnt been

t-mac does what is naturally in the flow of the game
if he has the opportunity to score he does
if he doesnt he passes
if someone is open he passes to them


kobe it seems like he dribbles around looking for a shot on one possesion
and than the next possesion he dribbles around until he finds the open man


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

I can't convince you but what you just wrote was a crock of ****. Seriously. :no:


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> 
> 
> Having more assists than T-Mac? Where would you get that from? Why would Kobe even be thinking about T-Mac? T-Mac isn't going to the playoffs this year.
> ...


It's ridiculous. If he shoots the ball too much he's being selfish. If he doesn't shoot the ball enough he's being selfish. He's the only player on this board that gets criticized for passing. Assists are usually the ultimate sign of unselfishness unless Kobe is accumulating them. It's not like he's just throwing the ball around to anyone. He's finding *WIDE OPEN* teammates. Since when is that a crime? Oh yeah, it is when you're Kobe Bryant.


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## gonejay (Jun 11, 2002)

Huh. Kobe is playing really well right now. If his stats are impressive how can his game not be? I just dont get that logic. If Kobe scores 40pts he needs to pass the ball, If has 13 assists then he's just padding his stats. lol talk about bias. So if Kobe, as you say over dribbles then gets to pass for an assist its a selfish act! hahaha good one. Why dont you just say you think T mac is better than kobe, atleast that sounds alot more credible than the garbage your spewing.

Oh by the way Kobe is better than T mac IMHO. Not by much though, but still better.


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## jokeaward (May 22, 2003)

*Re: Re: Re: To wit:*



> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> 
> 
> Let's stop calling Shaq the Most Dominant Player now. He isn't anymore. :no:


Maybe if it's fashionable to say for some and if they keep saying it, it'll come true.
...
bzzt.


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## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

Don't ever compare Kobe to McGrady EVER until Kobe is on a team with scrubs.


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## samdge (Feb 3, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>courtside</b>!
> Don't ever compare Kobe to McGrady EVER until Kobe is on a team with scrubs.


Are you implying that Kobe is the lesser basketball player. I like T-Mac and all but i could never see Kobe letting his team go on a 13 game losing streak, and only winning 17 games at this point of the year. Kobe and T-Mac are very comparable players however the above comment really does not make any sense.

Back to the comment, Kobe is going on a streak right now and he is playing at the level he is capable at playing at and should be playing at.


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## kcchiefs-fan (Oct 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> What the hell? Iverson is still the best 2 guard since Michael Guard. No two guard after Michael Jordan has been more consistent every season other than Allen Iverson.


2/21...........the only thing you can count on from Iverson night-in/night-out is that he'll play his a$$ off but won't be anywhere near 50% from the field.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

> Kobe is the best player in the league. He is the only one right now that comes close to MJ. Don't believe me? Watch some Laker games.


Hes closer than anyone, but still not close to MJ...


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## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>kcchiefs-fan</b>!
> 
> 
> 2/21...........the only thing you can count on from Iverson night-in/night-out is that he'll play his a$$ off but won't be anywhere near 50% from the field.


The only aspect of Iverson's game that will *always* be inferior to Bryant's is shot selection and field goal percentage but nevertheless, he still makes more baskets by attempting more shots than Bryant and thats what makes him a trademark great shooter from my perspective. I would prefer Iverson's offensive mindset, his poise, and determination or basically heart over every excellent characteristics of the game that makes up Bryant. I'm not discrediting Bryant's heart on the court, because he shows it tremendously every game, but Iverson is just on another level.


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## kcchiefs-fan (Oct 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> 
> 
> The only aspect of Iverson's game that will *always* be inferior to Bryant's is shot selection and field goal percentage but nevertheless, he still makes more baskets by attempting more shots than Bryant and thats what makes him a trademark great shooter from my perspective. I would prefer Iverson's offensive mindset, his poise, and determination or basically heart over every excellent characteristics of the game that makes up Bryant. I'm not discrediting Bryant's heart on the court, because he shows it tremendously every game, but Iverson is just on another level.


Granted, but to make this a bit more simplistic, I would take Bryant before Iverson in a heartbeat. He's younger, will have a longer, healthier career, is better defensively, is a more efficient scorer, and easily a better rebounder. I'd say Iverson has more playmaking ability but Kobe certainly doesn't have a shortage of that either.


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> 
> 
> The only aspect of Iverson's game that will *always* be inferior to Bryant's is shot selection and field goal percentage but nevertheless, he still makes more baskets by attempting more shots than Bryant and thats what makes him a trademark great shooter from my perspective. I would prefer Iverson's offensive mindset, his poise, and determination or basically heart over every excellent characteristics of the game that makes up Bryant. I'm not discrediting Bryant's heart on the court, because he shows it tremendously every game, but Iverson is just on another level.



So making more baskets by taking more shots is better? So I guess field goal percentage means nothing to you.

Bryant is a far better player than AI without question. Bryant can do anything Iverson can do offensively and his size alone allows him to do things Iverson cant.


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## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

Oh well, it's really sad to realize that it's been 2 years and older of the fact that Iverson *was* always the better player than Bryant, but unfortunately, as of this day, Bryant will always be better than Iverson.

BUT WHY SHOULD I CARE, WHEN BRYANT HAS NOT PROVEN YET HE CAN LEAD A TEAM ON HIS OWN?


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## PetroToZoran (Jul 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> Oh well, it's really sad to realize that it's been 2 years and older of the fact that Iverson *was* always the better player than Bryant, but unfortunately, as of this day, Bryant will always be better than Iverson.
> 
> BUT WHY SHOULD I CARE, WHEN BRYANT HAS NOT PROVEN YET HE CAN LEAD A TEAM ON HIS OWN?


No one is impressed by your use of the Caps Lock key.


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## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>samdge</b>!
> 
> 
> Are you implying that Kobe is the lesser basketball player. I like T-Mac and all but i could never see Kobe letting his team go on a 13 game losing streak, and only winning 17 games at this point of the year. Kobe and T-Mac are very comparable players however the above comment really does not make any sense.
> ...


No, I am not implying Kobe is a 'lesser basketball player'. I am saying not to compare Kobe with McGrady until he leads a team of scrubs into the playoffs 3 years in a row.. 

I know both players have talent, athletic ability, crazy dunks/moves, clutchness... (but until Kobe is thrown into a team with horrible players and is able to lead them to the 1st round, don't compare the 2 in the aspect of who is better because it is pointless)..


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> Oh well, it's really sad to realize that it's been 2 years and older of the fact that Iverson *was* always the better player than Bryant, but unfortunately, as of this day, Bryant will always be better than Iverson.


Say what?


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

It must be a full moon. Some of these posts are the most ridiculous things I have read in years.

Iverson takes more shots thus making him better.  

I guess Jerry Stackhouse was at one time the best player in the NBA too wasn't he. :uhoh:


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

Right now I'd take Kobe and TMac over AI. I'd have to think long and hard about Pierce as well. Pierce has regressed in the last two years but he's still young so he can improve. AI just scares me. He seems like the kind of guy that can just fall of the radar once his quickness abandons him. He can't rely on his size or a steady jump shot like MJ could.


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## hellrazor08 (Feb 20, 2003)

13 game losing streak for McGrady? LOL you give him too much credit. It's more like a 19 game losing streak.

She-Mac could be on a team with 4 cheerleaders in the starting lineup the fact that his team lost 19 straight in the Leastern Conference shows what a horrible leader that whiny girl is.


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## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>PetroToZoran</b>!
> 
> 
> No one is impressed by your use of the Caps Lock key.


LMAO! Well...I was a lil bit. :shy:


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## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> 13 game losing streak for McGrady? LOL you give him too much credit. It's more like a 19 game losing streak.
> 
> She-Mac could be on a team with 4 cheerleaders in the starting lineup the fact that his team lost 19 straight in the Leastern Conference shows what a horrible leader that whiny girl is.


I highly doubt any player could break that 19 game losing streak unless it was a SHAQ...

The coaching is horrible... when the players are on a run, the coach takes out a productive member and puts in a player who is underachieving and the run ends and ends in a loss..


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## hellrazor08 (Feb 20, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>courtside</b>!
> I highly doubt any player could break that 19 game losing streak unless it was a SHAQ...


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...oh man I needed a laugh.


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## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> 
> 
> HAHAHA...oh man I needed a laugh.


There's nothing funny about that statement.


----------



## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mattsanity</b>!
> 
> 
> There's nothing funny about that statement.


Now you now how it feels.


----------



## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pinball</b>!
> 
> 
> Now you now how it feels.


OH YEAH! It feels like I just physically contacted with a beautiful Korean girl.


----------



## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> 13 game losing streak for McGrady? LOL you give him too much credit. It's more like a 19 game losing streak.
> 
> She-Mac could be on a team with 4 cheerleaders in the starting lineup the fact that his team lost 19 straight in the Leastern Conference shows what a horrible leader that whiny girl is.


The fact that you say immature things like She-Mac and whiny girl shows what value this post really holds. None.


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> 
> 
> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...oh man I needed a laugh.


And I'm sure you have seen every single magic game this season to know more about the Magic than me.


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## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>JNice</b>!
> 
> 
> The fact that you say immature things like She-Mac and whiny girl shows what value this post really holds. None.


Don't worry 08 is probably his graduation year...which makes him like 13 years old probably..


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## hellrazor08 (Feb 20, 2003)

Oh no Magic fans fighting back. LOLOLOLOLOL...She-Mac = weak leader. Loved how he was crying about retiring during that losing streak. Good to see T-Wac fans have a quitter to look up to. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> Oh no Magic fans fighting back. LOLOLOLOLOL...She-Mac = weak leader. Loved how he was crying about retiring during that losing streak. Good to see T-Wac fans have a quitter to look up to. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL


Nice intelligent response. 

Regardless of your "witty" little names you are calling him, he is regarded by most in the league as the best shooting guard in the league along with Kobe Bryant. 

Even the worst of Tmac haters will admit he is one of the top players in the league, even the Kobe lovers.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

You might as well lock this thread now.

She-Mac.  C'mon man. :nonono:


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## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> Oh no Magic fans fighting back. LOLOLOLOLOL...She-Mac = weak leader. Loved how he was crying about retiring during that losing streak. Good to see T-Wac fans have a quitter to look up to. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL


Also, Traceme McGravy will never be the next Michael Jordan. NOW YOU GOT MORE THINGS TO LAUGH AT!!!


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## hellrazor08 (Feb 20, 2003)

Maybe you should learn to read first. Never said T-Wac was a bad player. Said he was a weak leader. He may have all the talent in the world but lacks heart and leadership abilities of a true superstar. You can refute that all you want and talk about the other players but the fact is he lost 19 straight games and cried about the thought of retiring and to me that is not a leader.


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> Maybe you should learn to read first. Never said T-Wac was a bad player. Said he was a weak leader. He may have all the talent in the world but lacks heart and leadership abilities of a true superstar. You can refute that all you want and talk about the other players but the fact is he lost 19 straight games and cried about the thought of retiring and to me that is not a leader.


He has also called out his teammates twice this year, both times bringing about winning streaks because, hey, his teammates actually played better. Wow, what an idea, teammates play well and play hard and they can actually win.

Unreal that so many people hold that comment so strongly against him. He has had a rough season and a rough last few years. He was frustrated, big deal.

The no heart and weak leader claims are completely baseless.


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## hellrazor08 (Feb 20, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>JNice</b>!
> 
> 
> He has also called out his teammates twice this year, both times bringing about winning streaks because, hey, his teammates actually played better. Wow, what an idea, teammates play well and play hard and they can actually win.


Wow congrats to T-Mac. Maybe he should have called them out during the losing streak instead of talking to the media about retiring.


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> 
> 
> Wow congrats to T-Mac. Maybe he should have called them out during the losing streak instead of talking to the media about retiring.


Maybe he should have. Maybe he is learning to be a leader. In any case, there shouldnt be a need for him to have to call out his teammates 10 times during the season to get some wins.


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## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hellrazor08</b>!
> 
> 
> Wow congrats to T-Mac. Maybe he should have called them out during the losing streak instead of talking to the media about retiring.


Maybe you need to open your eyes:yes:


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

HellRazor and Mattsanity having multiple posts in the same thread, allow me... :banghead:


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## John (Jun 9, 2002)

I think Shaq does accept that Kobe attacking the defense without going to Shaq himself first.

I know there are lot to do with the zone defense they can imply. I know Kobe is getting collapse once he is in the paint. But he is still not seeing the Carter's Iverson type of defenses where 3 guys just stand on the strong side, force Carter, Ivy to pass up the ball before they have any room to make a move.


I watched La played lastnit, delayed game. I still like to see Lakers going to Shaq first, I dont care if he is not going to score a basket, he is going to changes the game plan of other team defense, and that alone, will make teammates better. 

That's why his effectiveness on the court is at least as high as KG and Duncan even at this moment. Is he able to directly win a championship for Lakers now? No, they need Kobe, the best guard in an NBA to hide some weaknesses for him, that is unable to get a shot off from anywhere on the court.


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## John (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>courtside</b>!
> 
> 
> Don't worry 08 is probably his graduation year...which makes him like 13 years old probably..



For once, I found a true kid there. This is the kid I have been looking for for so long.

Young, Immature, Geeky repsonses, doesnt offer intelligent reponses, No real NBA basketball knowledge in the game. 

If he was my son, I would slap his face all the time until he knows how to type probably.

The one post he just laughs for the whole page, it's not good for his health u know?


----------



## BallBiologist (Mar 29, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


?


----------



## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>courtside</b>!
> 
> 
> I highly doubt any player could break that 19 game losing streak unless it was a SHAQ...


:laugh: That's funny courtside!


----------



## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


:laugh: Cot Damn John, calm down man! :laugh:


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John</b>!
> If he was my son, I would slap his face all the time until he knows how to type probably.
> 
> The one post he just laughs for the whole page, it's not good for his health u know?


Classic, just classic!


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>courtside</b>!
> 
> 
> And I'm sure you have seen every single magic game this season to know more about the Magic than me.


Hey Tmac's had a tough time in Orlando this year, no doubt. *His* team has tanked hard, but the keyword is "his." That is his team. He's gotta be the leader of that team and take responsibility for it's downfall, that is his team. 

_this is his team, so it's time for him to act like it. It means no more blaming others for our team's failure, or blaming staff members. Also, "my team" doesn't mean only when we win, it means carrying the burden of defeat just as gracefully as you carry a championship trophy._ -- KB#8


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## alex (Jan 7, 2003)

Getting back to the original post . . .

(I only read the first four)

I don't think you can be the best shooting guard if you play nine very good to great games in a row. That would be like saying Carmelo Anthony is the best SF because he played the best of any in February. He simply (Melo) is not the best SF because he hasn't played at that level consistently all year long. Same goes for Kobe Bryant. If he played all season like this then sure, but he has missed many games and has only within the last twenty days or so come on and played really well.

I'm not saying Tracy McGrady is better, but he has been putting up better numbers consistlently. Ya, he does have a WNBA-level supporting cast, so he needs to score more. But that also means that he gets double and triple teamed, when Kobe B doesn't. I'm not saying either is better than the other, but this season Tracy McGrady has been the better overall shooting guard.

It could change though . . .


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>alex</b>!
> I'm not saying Tracy McGrady is better, but he has been putting up better numbers consistlently. Ya, he does have a WNBA-level supporting cast, so he needs to score more. But that also means that he gets double and triple teamed, when Kobe B doesn't. I'm not saying either is better than the other, but this season Tracy McGrady has been the better overall shooting guard.
> 
> It could change though . . .


You are right. Tracy has had a much better season overall and was the better player early on. Kobe has regained his form but that still doesn't make his season better than TMacs. Lets see what each of them does for the next 25-30 games. Kobe is well on his way to reclaiming his "throne" but I'm sure TMac will have something to say about that. I wish they played again head-head. That would have been sweet.


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## Mattsanity (Jun 8, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SacKings384</b>!
> HellRazor and Mattsanity having multiple posts in the same thread, allow me... :banghead:


Just for your information, my reputation and attitude on this board are distinctive enough to be considered untouchable by many users. For example, if you say Hellrazor is Mattsanity, then others will disagree because they know Mattsanity acts much more different. 
Also, this is the only username I'll use untill I'm in a coffin.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Kobe and Tmac are the best guards in basketball, point blank. They arent near the level of Duncan, Shaq and KG but they are the best at their position without a doubt. 

Theres no perimeter players in the league that could have overcome Tmacs situation earlier in the season. Even Kobe went 3-9 in his biggest stretch of games without Shaq.


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

i disagree that kobe and tmac aren't near the level of kg, duncan or shaq.

people forget that jordan was successful in no small part because his teams rebounded the ball great, and because they played strong interior defense.

kobe and tmac need teams built to provide that, but i've got no doubt they can be successful in the right situation. the benefit that duncan, kg & shaq have is that they themselves provide the rebounding and interior defense. i think kobe's the better player than tmac, in part because he plays harder and is a better defender.


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## HallOfFamer (May 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


5 stars for you!:laugh: I swear you are the only guy on this message board that can literally make me laugh out loud. John for Admin!:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


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## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

Oh my, who let those little teenybopper T-Mac homers in. Thanks for sorting things out JNice. lol. Now, back to the topic...


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Kobe and Tmac are the best guards in basketball, point blank. They arent near the level of Duncan, Shaq and KG but they are the best at their position without a doubt.
> 
> Theres no perimeter players in the league that could have overcome Tmacs situation earlier in the season. Even Kobe went 3-9 in his biggest stretch of games without Shaq.


What exactly was Tmac situation? There are lots of perimeter players that can top 1-19 in the east with Howard and Gooden.

Its not comparable to going 3-9 in the west with Fisher and Slava is your top scoring options.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Jemel Irief</b>!
> What exactly was Tmac situation? There are lots of perimeter players that can top 1-19 in the east with Howard and Gooden.
> 
> Its not comparable to going 3-9 in the west with Fisher and Slava is your top scoring options.


Tmacs situation was being in a horribly coached environment, with players who were playing horrible. Kobe was in a well coached environment, with decent players playing decent. 

Not to mention, 9 of the 19 teams they lost to(Magic), were western teams. The only "bad" eastern teams they lost to were Chicago, Boston and Toronto. The rest were definitely playoff teams in the east (not inbetweeners like Boston and Toronto). 

Kobe on the other hand, lost to teams like Cleveland, Boston, Washington, and Atlanta. 3 of the 4 worst teams in the NBA last year. 

Lakers had much better coaching and a much better system last year than the Magic this year. That much is obvious. Rick Fox, Robert Horry, Derek Fisher, Devean George and Slava are definitely better than any 5 the Magic have other than Tmac. 

The situation is beyond comparable.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Don't forget that Orlando lost to the Knicks pre-Marbury trade three times. That Knick team was trash to start the season.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> Tmacs situation was being in a horribly coached environment, with players who were playing horrible. Kobe was in a well coached environment, with decent players playing decent.
> ...


Boy this is a truly sad argument. Comparing an 0-19 Magic streak of Tmac's to a 3-9 streak of Kobe where Kobe had Slava, George, Horry, Fisher, and Fox who are supposedly "comparable" to Giricek, Howard, Lue, and Gooden is beyond ridiculous. The Magic outside of Tmac are better than the Lakers outside of the Fab 4. It's sad but true, and no amount of "superior coaching" will change that. 

I mean honestly, is Doc Rivers supposed to be a terrible coach? Boy, talk about ridiculous Kobe hating.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Denial is such an ugly thing. Kobe lovers choose to block out those 12 games and continue with the "you're a hater sherade" as their only defense for having no argument. :laugh:


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

and I've said Kobe and Tmac are the best guards in basketball. The fact you think that is hating proves its more likely you're stuck on him more than me being a hater. Most people who arent bias Lakers fans agree Tmac and Kobe are on the same level. 

and not once did I say that Kobes 3-12 is _as bad_ as Tmacs 0-19. I just said both players have had their struggles leading their teams when the talent just isnt there.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Real question: 

When did Juwan Howard become such a scrub? I mean he looks really bad. He looked good in Denver a year ago, what is it with him?


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## John (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>EHL</b>!
> 
> 
> Boy this is a truly sad argument. Comparing an 0-19 Magic streak of Tmac's to a 3-9 streak of Kobe where Kobe had Slava, George, Horry, Fisher, and Fox who are supposedly "comparable" to Giricek, Howard, Lue, and Gooden is beyond ridiculous. The Magic outside of Tmac are better than the Lakers outside of the Fab 4. It's sad but true, and no amount of "superior coaching" will change that.
> ...


I dont know that EHL, a loser is loser.


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## John (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Real question:
> 
> When did Juwan Howard become such a scrub? I mean he looks really bad. He looked good in Denver a year ago, what is it with him?


I would be questioning teh C's lack of sucess despite key players are healthy for season.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hong Kong Fooey</b>!
> Real question:
> 
> When did Juwan Howard become such a scrub? I mean he looks really bad. He looked good in Denver a year ago, what is it with him?


When Tmac started losing he became a scrub and a inferior player to Slava. 

By the way John, Kobe has a career 500+ record without Shaq. The Lakers proceeded to go 8-10 when Shaq returned that season.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Kobe and Tmac are the best guards in basketball, point blank. They arent near the level of Duncan, Shaq and KG but they are the best at their position without a doubt.


Considering the last full season each has played, do you honestly think Shaq had a better season in 2002-2003 than Kobe and/or Tmac? 

I'm not sure where Tmac finished(I believe it was fourth) in the MVP vote, but I know Kobe finished higher than Shaq.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> Considering the last full season each has played, do you honestly think Shaq had a better season in 2002-2003 than Kobe and/or Tmac?
> ...


He's talking about basketball talent, not evaluating their 2002-03 season.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Jemel Irief</b>!
> 
> 
> He's talking about basketball talent, not evaluating their 2002-03 season.


So he thinks Shaq has more talent than Tmac or Kobe? 
There's simply no way.


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> So he thinks Shaq has more talent than Tmac or Kobe?
> There's simply no way.


c'mon iv - he's saying better player. he thinks shaq's a better player. not based on their contributions for '03, or their placing in the mvp voting, just a better player.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

*Shaq is not a better player than Kobe.*



> Originally posted by <b>kflo</b>!
> 
> 
> c'mon iv - he's saying better player. he thinks shaq's a better player. not based on their contributions for '03, or their placing in the mvp voting, just a better player.


What makes Shaq a better player than Kobe? :whoknows:


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## kflo (Jun 28, 2002)

*Re: Shaq is not a better player than Kobe.*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> What makes Shaq a better player than Kobe? :whoknows:


i'm not arguing he is. i'm restating his argument. and certainly there are many who would agree.


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## Dre (Jun 20, 2003)

As far as skills for the position go, Kobe is better. He's more skilled. Not to say I wouldn't take Shaq first, but basically he's a big wall that can dunk. Kobe is extremely skilled for the Guard position. But I'd take Shaq over Kobes anyday still.


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## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

I haven't really been keeping a close eye on this thread. Too many posts make my brain hurt. So this may have been said before but I believe I cursed Kobe with all this praise.

Kob' my bad.


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

*Re: Shaq is not a better player than Kobe.*



> Originally posted by <b>IV</b>!
> 
> 
> What makes Shaq a better player than Kobe? :whoknows:


Depends on how you look at it. It is pretty obvious having the best center in the league is more valuable to a team than having one of the best shooting guards in the league. There are a ton of ultra-talented swingmen in the league and few elite centers in the league.


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## Lope31 (Jun 11, 2002)

Shaq and Kobe are both as effective, but Kobe is zillions more Valuable due to his age.

In the past ie during the Bling Dynasty Shaq was WAY more effective. Shaq is awesome top 10 players of all time but if a GM chose him over Kobe NOW it would be retarded. Plus he does his own stunts


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Like others said, I'm talking about impact and effectiveness in a game when talking about whos the better player between Shaq and Kobe. Obviously Kobe has more skills, but size is also a huge part of basketball, and it has to be taken into consideration when judging players. Otherwise, an Earl Boykins for Yao Ming trade wouldnt be laughed at. 

Even the media, who love Kobe and compare him to MJ all the time, say often that the Lakers start and finish with Shaq. This doesnt mean Kobe couldnt stand on his own as a good franchise player, it just means that there is a better player on his team. Its nothing to be ashamed of, Shaq is a top 10 player of all time IMO.

Kobe is a top 5 player in the league without a doubt, and I love the way hes been playing before he got hurt. Hes been posting up, racking up a ton of assists, and attacking the game in the right way. I could definitely see him running a successful team in the future with the right pieces around him, but right now the Lakers are still Shaqs team IMO.


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>KABI</b>!
> but if a GM chose him over Kobe NOW it would be retarded. Plus he does his own stunts


I dont necessarily think that is true. If Shaq can keep himself in shape and stay motivated, he's got at least a good 4-5 yrs left. And whatever team he is on for those 4 or 5 years, they'll be considered contenders for the championship.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>JNice</b>!
> 
> 
> If Shaq can keep himself in shape and stay motivated,


Anyone else starting to think this if is becoming a bigger IF by the minute...we've all been saying this for 2 years now...

We thought getting his *** handed to him by TD in the playoffs would do something...it didn't.

We thought getting his *** handed to him by Yao Ming would do something...it didn't.

Will Shaq ever care enough about basketball again to be the dominant player that everyone in the league is scared he can be?

As each day passes it seems less and less likely.


----------



## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JNice</b>!
> 
> 
> I dont necessarily think that is true. If Shaq can keep himself in shape and stay motivated, he's got at least a good 4-5 yrs left. And whatever team he is on for those 4 or 5 years, they'll be considered contenders for the championship.


He's getting up there in age, though. He's 32 and about 70% of the player that he was in his prime. That figure will decline with each passing year. I still have him third as far as the best player in the league is concerned behind KG and Duncan. However, if I were to start a franchise today, Shaq would be lower than 3rd on my list due to age and chronic injuries. I'd put KG, Duncan, Kobe, TMac, Lebron, and Yao ahead of him if I wanted to start a franchise. They may never be as good as Shaq was in his prime but I think they give you a better chance at winning future titles than Shaq.


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## ChiBron (Jun 24, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> 
> 
> Anyone else starting to think this if is becoming a bigger IF by the minute...we've all been saying this for 2 years now...
> ...


I think u're being a little too tough on him.

Shaq for the most part this season has been pretty darn good. U don't put up the numbers he's been putting up by being "unmotivated" or "lazy". Lakers record w/ him playing this season is still OFF the charts(close to being over 75%). And he has really stepped up with Kobe out. I've watched the past 2 Laker games and Shaq looks as hungry, motivated and dominant out there as i've seen him in a while. His entire play in February through today has been quite fabulous. BIG FELLA is still easily top 5 today. And looks the best on many nights as well.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SPMJ</b>!
> 
> 
> I think u're being a little too tough on him.
> ...


I think this Kobe injury was the best thing that could have happened to the Lakers. I'm worried about whether Kobe will ever be 100% healthy this year but I'll never question his desire. Shaq's desire always worries me. With Kobe and Malone out I think that Shaq realizes that the Lakers need him. He feeds off of this. I expect him to finish strong during these last 20 or so games. A motivated Shaq is probably still the most intimidating thing in the NBA.


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

I think it will be interesting to see how Shaq comes back if Kobe leaves. With their relationship, I think Shaq would absolutely love nothing more than to come back and win a championship without Kobe to ultimately prove he really is the man.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> 
> 
> Will Shaq ever care enough about basketball again to be the dominant player that everyone in the league is scared he can be?
> ...


What the hell... I am getting sick of this. What is he supposed to do for you to consider him dominant? Get 40 points, shatter 3 backboards, succesfully defend Kobe in his trial, resign Phil and convince Kobe, Payton and Malone not to opt out?

Watch about 10 Shaq games and tell me he isn't dominant, tell me that most centers aren't scared to death to guard him.

When this guy is at the top of his game this year he is just as good as he has ever been. The only difference is he brings less effort consistently and he has more weapons to spread out the scoring.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Jemel Irief</b>!
> 
> 
> When this guy is at the top of his game this year he is just as good as he has ever been. The *only difference is he brings less effort consistently* and he has more weapons to spread out the scoring.


The part I bolded is exactly the problem with Shaq. He doesn't bring consistent effort anymore.


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## HallOfFamer (May 26, 2003)

> =Originally posted by <b>John</b>!
> For once, I found a true kid there. This is the kid I have been looking for for so long. Young, Immature, Geeky repsonses, doesnt offer intelligent reponses, No real NBA basketball knowledge in the game. If he was my son, I would slap his face all the time until he knows how to type probably. The one post he just laughs for the whole page, it's not good for his health u know?


:laugh:


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## Mack Ten (Jul 2, 2004)

Reclaimed his throne? :laugh: 


A HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA 


As What,<strike> *KING RAPIST? KING BALLHOG? KING OVERRATED? KING PUSSIE?</strike> KING DRAMA QUEEN?*. He damn sure aint the King of the NBA or at his position.

(Confrontational and unnecessary. trm) :nonono:


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## HeinzGuderian (Jun 29, 2004)

What is the point of bringing back not only old threads, but irrelevant ones at that?


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John</b>!
> For once, I found a true kid there. This is the kid I have been looking for for so long.
> 
> Young, Immature, Geeky repsonses, doesnt offer intelligent reponses, No real NBA basketball knowledge in the game.
> ...


This. :rofl:


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