# Should Atlanta draft Michael Conley?



## ATLien

*What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*

Things will get clearer as the draft approaches, but right now if you were the Hawks what do you do?


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## knickstorm

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*

pray seattle really likes Yi or another prospect instead of durant, after all if they get durant, perhaps that oculd mark the end of Rashard Lewis' stay.........then maybe they'd trade down with ATL, #3 and #11 for their #2 allowing ATL to get Durant.

Too bad for ATL, the players they'll get probably wont make enough of a difference nad phoenix gets a high lotto pick next year.


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## ATLien

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*

I'm not sure how high that pick will be as I don't have a crystal ball. Two lottery picks and a healthy Joe Johnson should help improve the Hawks record to the point where they might not be in the playoffs, but should still be able to improve a little bit.

This post was supposed to be a poll, but the site has been acting so slow tonight. I might try to create another one later.


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## Burn

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*

draft Yi, Horford, or Wright - whoever has the best workouts. Obviously Shelden isn't our answer at PF and either of those would be a nice pick at 3. Take Conley if he's available at 11, if not take Law.


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## belarus

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*

take Yao2


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## ATLien

...

Atlanta needs a point guard, but 3 might be too high to draft Conley. What do the people say?


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## Diable

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*

I'd have to take Wright even though you might have to wait a while for him.If I got the right deal I would trade down and take Conley since you need a point and I can't see any other way to get one.


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## Samael

You guys should take Brandan Wright at #3rd pick then send the #11th pick with Childress to Milwaukee for the #6th pick and draft Mike Conley.


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## arhie

The two main things the hawks are missing from making the playoffs are a great big man, and a point guard. Point guards are much easier to find than great bigs. If the Hawks don't draft Noah, I will be greatly disappointed. IF the Hawks do draft Noah, Noah can be a big defensive stopper and Jsmoove will get the help side blocks as well. Also it will open up the lane for JJ and Jsmoove.


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## Burn

Conley doesn't merit the third pick. Atlanta doesn't need a point guard so badly that we make that kind of reach. You're talking about a guy who will just be 'good', there's a reason he's projected where he is; look at the other guys in history who have been taken 8,9,10,11. That's how good we can expect him to be. 

Antonio Daniels is a good player, but he shouldn't have been a #3 pick, and neither should Mike.


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## ATLien

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*



Burn said:


> draft Yi, Horford, or Wright - whoever has the best workouts. Obviously Shelden isn't our answer at PF and either of those would be a nice pick at 3. Take Conley if he's available at 11, if not take Law.


I don't want Yi.

1.) He looks like a shooting guard or small forward from the five second ESPN palyed and 
2.) I don't know if Atlanta can afford to draft someone who is as raw as he is supposed to be.

I would take whoever is best out of Horford, Wright, and Hibbert. Watching Oden match up against Noah and against Hibbert, and it was pretty obvious Noah got dominated like a scrub and Hibbert held his own. Just not sure how good Hibbert can be in the pro's.


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## Damian Necronamous

Whoever they pick, they need to start shopping Marvin Williams, Shelden Williams and Josh Smith.

If I were Atlanta, I'd take either Jianlian, Noah, Horford or Wright at #3, then look to trade the 11th pick and Childress for a higher pick to take Conley Jr.


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## ATLien

Trade Josh, Marvin, and Shelden for whom exactly? It's easy to say "trade them", but there is only a select few players that other teams are looking to trade as well.


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## Mr. Hobbes

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*



knickstorm said:


> pray seattle really likes Yi or another prospect instead of durant, after all if they get durant, perhaps that oculd mark the end of Rashard Lewis' stay.........then maybe they'd trade down with ATL, #3 and #11 for their #2 allowing ATL to get Durant.
> 
> Too bad for ATL, the players they'll get probably wont make enough of a difference nad phoenix gets a high lotto pick next year.


Not gonna happen.

I think Atlanta has to bite it and take Conley at the 3. The last time they took the best player available, they missed on two PGs that led their teams to the playoffs and ended up with a 'developing superstar' that averages about 8 points a game. I'd make a joke right here, but this is not the time.

When drafting the best player available doesn't work, you gotta go the other way. Atlanta right now needs that big center to start fast breaks, and a PG to lead it. Since there is no center in the draft other than Oden that is a break-starter (I don't think Hibbert can do it), they need the PG. Conley Jr is a very risky pick, but he is the best PG for Atlanta in this draft. This is the guy they need to run the break.

I don't see anyone else in the draft that could make people say "Oh, the Hawks blew it by drafting Conley instead of (blank)".


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## ATLien

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*



Chan said:


> I don't see anyone else in the draft that could make people say "Oh, the Hawks blew it by drafting Conley instead of (blank)".


I see a number of players that could potentially end up better than Conley down the line but who might not contribute much their rookie year. I'm not 100% sold on Conley. Is he really that good? Are we just hyping him up because we are so desperate for a point guard? How good is he without Greg Oden? etc. He might be the pick, but I'm not sure yet. I just get the feeling that taking Conley at 3 would be like taking Shelden at 5. A mega reach that will look really bad in two years.


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## Deng101

I think what would be best for you guys is to draft Noah with the 3rd pick and Law with the 11th. You get the 2 positions filled you need the most. What I think will happen is you guys take Conley jr. with the 3rd pick than maybe Hibbert with the 11th.


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## Diable

Noah is about the last player I would take at three.He just doesn't have anything like the talent that Horford or Wright has.Hell I'd gamble on the China Man before I took Noah.I have no idea how good Yi will be,but I'll bet you money right now that Noah is never an impact player at the NBA level.Personally I wouldn't draft him in the top ten.He just isn't that good.


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## Ruff Draft

No. Draft one of the 2 big-men, and then trade up for Conley. God that'll be awesome...

Conley
JJ
Smith
Horford
Zaza


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## Mr. Hobbes

*Re: What should Atlanta do with pick #3?*



TheATLien said:


> I see a number of players that could potentially end up better than Conley down the line but who might not contribute much their rookie year. I'm not 100% sold on Conley. Is he really that good? *Are we just hyping him up because we are so desperate for a point guard?* How good is he without Greg Oden? etc. He might be the pick, but I'm not sure yet. I just get the feeling that taking Conley at 3 would be like taking Shelden at 5. A mega reach that will look really bad in two years.


Yes, and there is no other choice. Will it look bad? Yes, it could. But this is a start and a good idea. Who would you rather draft? Brewer, a swingman? Horford, Green, Brandan Wright, all tweeners? Noah, who's gonna be a role player? Hibbert, who is just as big of a risk as Conley?


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## ATLien

I don't know who I want Atlanta to draft lol. I am not up on these prospects, but what makes you think Horford is a tweener? 

Brandan Wright is being hyped as the BPA after Oden and Durant, but he is also supposed to be a couple years away from making an impact.

Atlanta could always target a player like Mike Bibby or Jose Calderon. I don't agree that "there is no other choice".


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## o.iatlhawksfan

Atlanta has to fill it's needs. Most of yall say Conley is a 5-8 type player, whats wrong with getting him a couple of picks high. We really need to pick a player who is going to help us big, we don't have a pick next season, so these 2 picks are big. I say take Conley at 3, and draft the best big at 11.


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## Mr. Hobbes

Nevermind about Horford. He's a forward, that's what I meant. I don't like Brandan Wright because I never saw what made him so good. But he is a forward.

Atlanta should avoid forwards the way a senior avoids his prom date after realizing how much the entire thing is going to cost me. With that in mind, it's gotta be a guard or center, and I'd take Conley over Hibbert.


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## Samael

o.iatlhawksfan said:


> Atlanta has to fill it's needs. Most of yall say Conley is a 5-8 type player, whats wrong with getting him a couple of picks high. We really need to pick a player who is going to help us big, we don't have a pick next season, so these 2 picks are big. I say take Conley at 3, and draft the best big at 11.


There's nothing wrong to reach for a player in order to fill a team's need but the problem is that the gap between Conley and what you could get at #3 (Hordford, Wright, Yi, Hibbert, Noah) is just too big to pass up literally. Like I said earlier you guys are better off packaging Childress and the #11th to go up in #6th-8th pick to get Conley but getting him at #3 is just too big of a reach.


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## rebelsun

Take Brandan at #3 and take the best PG available at 11 - 1.)Conley 2.)Javaris 3a.)Law 3b.)Pruitt.


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## croco

Draft Horford at #3 and trade up to get Conley. I'm sure the Hawks have the pieces to get such a deal done.


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## Coatesvillain

Damian Necronamous said:


> Whoever they pick, they need to start shopping Marvin Williams, Shelden Williams and Josh Smith.
> 
> If I were Atlanta, I'd take either Jianlian, Noah, Horford or Wright at #3, then look to trade the 11th pick and Childress for a higher pick to take Conley Jr.


Why in the world would they trade Josh Smith?


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## speedythief

TheATLien said:


> I don't know who I want Atlanta to draft lol. I am not up on these prospects, but what makes you think Horford is a tweener?
> 
> Brandan Wright is being hyped as the BPA after Oden and Durant, but he is also supposed to be a couple years away from making an impact.
> 
> Atlanta could always target a player like Mike Bibby or *Jose Calderon*. I don't agree that "there is no other choice".


There is currently a notion floating around Raptorland that the Raps would send Calderon for Marvin Williams, considering the Hawks would rather keep Smith. I'm sure you'd sooner give up Childress but I don't think he'd be as good a fit for Toronto--and you are desperate for a decent point. What do you think?


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## HB

You take Brandon Wright without even thinking twice. I think Brandan will be really special, but it might take a while to realize his full potential.


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## DANNY

Take Brandon Wright with the #3 pick, and hope Conley falls to #11. If he's gone, then there's nothing wrong with taking Acie Law with the 11th pick.


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## ATLien

speedythief said:


> There is currently a notion floating around Raptorland that the Raps would send Calderon for Marvin Williams, considering the Hawks would rather keep Smith. I'm sure you'd sooner give up Childress but I don't think he'd be as good a fit for Toronto--and you are desperate for a decent point. What do you think?


That would hurt quite a bit I think but I am seriously not the person who can gouge how good Calderon is as I didn't watch many Raptor games except for when they were playing the Hawks. Marvin Williams is difficult to watch sometimes. I'm not pro talent evaluator expert, but he is _supposed_ to have all this potential, but watching him play I just never see it. He's a very good rebounder, but whenever he is around the basket his shot always seems to be blocked.

A couple weeks ago, Bernie Mullin mentioned on the radio that they received several trade offers for Josh Childress during the season. That makes me think he could end up in another city by his time next year. I like Josh Childress game a lot, too. I think we saw the _real_ Boris Diaw in 2007, but for me Josh Childress is a better player than Diaw is.

When ranking the top point guards in the NBA, where would you place Calderon? I really don't have an idea as to how valuable he is in comparison to others around the leage.

BTW - how exciting was this lottery?  When they announced the top three and went to commercial break, I was so frickin' happy. I still think Atlanta can land a good player at #3, but Billy Knight controlling the thing frightens me. Really.


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## Diable

Personally I don't see the Raps giving up Calderon,at least not unless he's part of a bigger deal that helps Toronto more than either Childress or Marvin would.Truth is it's awfully nice to have two good point guards and also you just have to worry about Ford's health for several reasons


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## speedythief

Jose's jump shot was a bit shaky last season but this past summer he spent a great deal of time with the Spanish national team (winning the World Championships) and came into training camp with a tonne of confidence. His shooting percentage went up almost ten percent from his rookie season to this past season (.423 to .521) and he doubled his three-point shooting percentage (.163 to .333).

He is extremely steady at the point guard position. He knows how to control the game. He was used as a pace-changing guard with Ford. When TJ was pushing the tempo with the starting line-up, Calderon would sub him out and change the game to a half-court set, and the other way around. He has good court vision and can make assists without turning the ball over much at all. For both his years in the NBA his assist-per-48 numbers and assist-to-turnover ratio were outstanding.

His best two assets, in my opinion, are his ability to dribble-drive into traffic and finish with a high-percentage lay-in. He can dunk and is athletic but he doesn't play that way. His go-to move is a gear change at the top of the key, where he goes from a trot to full bore in two steps. He abused Jason Kidd and company in the playoffs with that move. His other asset is his ability to irritate ball handlers with pressure defence. He has good size and long arms. He knows how to rip and swipe at the basketball and creates a lot of steals and loose (50-50) balls. His steals numbers don't show how many turnovers he creates.

As a starter I'd put him in the top-15 for point guards. I don't know how he would perform in the Atlanta environment, though. Seems like a lot of his success has been predicated on the team chemistry and international mix/playing style that has been created in Toronto.


For the Raps, they need a small forward who can play defence, rebound, hit open jump shots, pass, slash and attack the rim. Who fits the bill better--Childress or Williams?


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## ATLien

Yeah, especially since Raptor fans don't want to trade TJ Ford and Jose Calderon for Deron Williams. I think they might have a riot if one were to be traded for Marvin Williams.


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## ATLien

speedythief said:


> For the Raps, they need a small forward who can play defence, rebound, hit open jump shots, pass, slash and attack the rim. Who fits the bill better--Childress or Williams?


Childress. Seriously.. Marvin Williams greatest asset is his rebounding abilities where as to me Childress is more well rounded, does everything good but nothing great. For some reason I just like Childress game. He isn't a freak athlete, he has a funky form, and he went to college for three or four years, but to me he is a good player.


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## speedythief

Diable said:


> Personally I don't see the Raps giving up Calderon,at least not unless he's part of a bigger deal that helps Toronto more than either Childress or Marvin would.Truth is it's awfully nice to have two good point guards and also you just have to worry about Ford's health for several reasons


I agree with this, and I'd rather not trade Jose, but I think BC is looking at him as our biggest trading chip this season. And despite the good tandem of point guards we've relied on, having two good points usually means one is expendable under the right circumstances. Ford is a guy Colangelo specifically brought in to run his team so I have to think Calderon, with his smaller contract as well, would be the first to go, if it came to that.


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## tdizzle

After taking a great deal of slack – and rightfully so in hindsight – for passing up on both Chris Paul and Deron Williams two years ago in the draft, I can't see the Hawks making the same mistake again even if grabbing Conley Jr. with the third pick may be a bit of a reach.


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## mediocre man

You guys should draft Brandan Wright at #3 then trade Childress and #11 to Portland for Jarrett Jack, Joel Przybilla and next years first round pick


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## Zuca

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=2879914


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## WhoDaBest23

mediocre man said:


> You guys should draft Brandan Wright at #3 then trade Childress and #11 to Portland for Jarrett Jack, Joel Przybilla and next years first round pick


That sounds really fair for both teams. Sadly Josh will go, but he'd be going to one of my favorite teams, so yeah!

Anyways, do not take Conley at #3. Do not totally fall into the hype. Seriously, this would be a huge mistake and a really really big reach. Take Horford or Wright, whoever the Hawks are more enamored with and hope for the best. Try to trade up somehow to get Conley if you can, or just pray that he'll fall to #11. That's how they should approach trying to get Conley. #3 is just way too high for a guy like him. He is just not on a Deron/Paul level.


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## osman

Draft Wright.


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## o.iatlhawksfan

Billy was interviewed today, saying, he interested in trading the pick for a veteren, and he's not looking to make the team any younger. He also said that he thinks the P.G issue is resolve if Speedy can stay healthy. :krazy:. In the press confrence tough he metion P.G alot, so who knows what he's thinkin'.


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## o.iatlhawksfan

From the hawks blog:




> I spoke to Billy Knight right after the lottery was announced, and you could hear the excitement in his voice.
> 
> "Having two picks in this draft is definitely fortunate," said the notoriously understated GM. "I was very nervous when they were announcing the order, but it worked out in our favor. One part of the job is over, and now it's time to start focusing on the next part.
> 
> "There are a lot of players available that we think can come in and help us right away, and we are going to get to work figuring out who will fit in with us the best."
> 
> I only spoke to BK for a couple minutes, but I came away with the impression that he is not going to be looking for long-term projects. He wants guys who, like he said, can come into training camp and hopefully make a difference on the court right away and not several years down the line.


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## ATLien

He's going to **** it up no matter who he picks.

Period. End of discussion. Lock thread. Goodbye.


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## Mr. Hobbes

But hey, some people think '****ing up' in this case is to pick Conley.

With Hibbert gone, it has to be Conley. Don't need another Marvin Williams or Childress.


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## ATLien

It doesn't even matter.

If Atlanta picks Conley, people will say it was dumb. Whoever Atlanta picks is the wrong move. **** it.


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## BleedGreen

I say you take Wright at 3, then look for Crittenton at 11 if he stays in the draft. If not pick up Acie Law. Or you can reach and take Conley at 3 and look for a big like Hawes at 11.


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## ChosenFEW

with the number 3 pick after just letting CP and deron pass by?.....i dont know...im not really big on conley


maybe trade down if B. knight is smart


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## o.iatlhawksfan

ChosenFEW said:


> with the number 3 pick after just letting CP and deron pass by?.....i dont know...im not really big on conley
> 
> 
> maybe trade down if B. knight is smart



They should pick the BPA, and thats either Yi JianLian or Brandon Wright. COnley can't do anything Critteton can do, He's just as NBA ready( Which doesn't mean anything, cause neither are NBA ready) and has more upside. You could get Critt at 11. Instead of reaching for Conley, and passing on a potiential superstar.


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## Mr. Hobbes

o.iatlhawksfan said:


> They should pick the BPA, and thats either Yi JianLian or Brandon Wright. COnley can't do anything Critteton can do, He's just as NBA ready( Which doesn't mean anything, cause neither are NBA ready) and has more upside. You could get Critt at 11. Instead of reaching for Conley, and passing on a potiential superstar.


You just want Crittenton because he's from Atlanta. The Hawks need an elite PG from this draft, and Conley is the best PG in this draft.

What's with all the support for Brandan Wright? Giving up on Williams already?


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## o.iatlhawksfan

Chan said:


> You just want Crittenton because he's from Atlanta. The Hawks need an elite PG from this draft, and Conley is the best PG in this draft.
> 
> What's with all the support for Brandan Wright? Giving up on Williams already?



Wright is another Lamarcus Aldride ( with more upside), he can play be a 5. I don't even live in Atlanta, so no I don't want him because he's from Atlanta. He's just as Nba ready, and has more upside. Conley is not an elite PG, that just because the lack of PG depth in this draft. Critt, is a better pick and we don't have to reach for him.


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## Damian Necronamous

There's a link on Hoopshype.com saying the Hawks would only trade the #3 pick for Roy or Aldridge, and I think that's a little stupid on their part.

Why not a trade of Speedy Claxton, Lorenzen Wright and the #3 pick for Zach Randolph and Jarrett Jack?

That would certainly put the Hawks on the playoff map.

PG: Jarrett Jack...Tyronn Lue...Anthony Johnson
SG: Joe Johnson...Salim Stoudamire
SF: Marvin Williams...Josh Childress
PF: Josh Smith...Shelden Williams
C: Zach Randolph...Zaza Pachulia

Sure, they'd be a little small, but they would be ridiculously versatile and have two legitimate 20+ppg scorers.

Portland, on the other hand, would get the young team that they want.

PG: Mike Conley Jr....Speedy Claxton...Sergio Rodriguez...Dan Dickau
SG: Brandon Roy...Fred Jones
SF: Travis Outlaw...Martell Webster...Darius Miles
PF: LaMarcus Aldridge...Lorenzen Wright...Raef LaFrentz
C: Greg Oden...Joel Przybilla


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## ATLien

Knight rejected that trade? good lord, someone fire him asap


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## Mr. Hobbes

o.iatlhawksfan said:


> Wright is another Lamarcus Aldride ( with more upside), he can play be a 5. I don't even live in Atlanta, so no I don't want him because he's from Atlanta. He's just as Nba ready, and has more upside. Conley is not an elite PG, that just because the lack of PG depth in this draft. Critt, is a better pick and we don't have to reach for him.


Aldrige can't even be a 5, and no way Wright can. He's an athletic PF, not a low-post scoring center.

Crittenton is not the best PG in the draft, and he has a very high bust factor, as it is with every player compared with a big time player. His defense is poor, unlike Conley. Conley is areach, but he is the best PG in the draft, and he is better than Crittenton. He is also more of a floor leader than Crittenton. Atlanta needs a defender and a distributor at PG, not a scorer. Johnson, Smith, and Williams can be the scorers.


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## Mr. Hobbes

Damian Necronamous said:


> There's a link on Hoopshype.com saying the Hawks would only trade the #3 pick for Roy or Aldridge, and I think that's a little stupid on their part.
> 
> Why not a trade of Speedy Claxton, Lorenzen Wright and the #3 pick for Zach Randolph and Jarrett Jack?
> 
> That would certainly put the Hawks on the playoff map.
> 
> PG: Jarrett Jack...Tyronn Lue...Anthony Johnson
> SG: Joe Johnson...Salim Stoudamire
> SF: Marvin Williams...Josh Childress
> PF: Josh Smith...Shelden Williams
> C: Zach Randolph...Zaza Pachulia
> 
> Sure, they'd be a little small, but they would be ridiculously versatile and have two legitimate 20+ppg scorers.
> 
> Portland, on the other hand, would get the young team that they want.
> 
> PG: Mike Conley Jr....Speedy Claxton...Sergio Rodriguez...Dan Dickau
> SG: Brandon Roy...Fred Jones
> SF: Travis Outlaw...Martell Webster...Darius Miles
> PF: LaMarcus Aldridge...Lorenzen Wright...Raef LaFrentz
> C: Greg Oden...Joel Przybilla


That's retarded.


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## ATLien

I agree that Conley is more of a floor general and contributor than Crittenton, all things being equal I take Conley over Crittenton 100 out of 100 times. I'm just not sure if Atlanta takes Conley at #3, won't that be the same thing as taking Shelden at #5 that everyone was against? Reaching for a player that fits a need?


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## Mr. Hobbes

TheATLien said:


> I agree that Conley is more of a floor general and contributor than Crittenton, all things being equal I take Conley over Crittenton 100 out of 100 times. I'm just not sure if Atlanta takes Conley at #3, won't that be the same thing as taking Shelden at #5 that everyone was against? Reaching for a player that fits a need?


Well, I was against Shelden at #5. I was against drafting Shelden, period. I was in the Randy Foye camp. I think in the east, a PG is more important than a C, and Altanta should try to address that first. But last year Atlanta gave Shelden a promise, and they came through. Bad idea.

An interesting note: there were only three pass-first PGs drafted last year, NJ's Williams, LA's Farmar and Portland's Rodriguez.


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## ATLien

weren't you hollering for Atlanta to draft Marcus Williams last year?


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## BDB

Draft Hortford at 3 then trade the 11th pick andplayer for an NBA point guard. Calderon would be perfect.
I don't think Conley's that good.


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## Mr. Hobbes

TheATLien said:


> weren't you hollering for Atlanta to draft Marcus Williams last year?


Probably. I don't remember. I would probably be a Williams guy more than a Foye guy. I know I was screaming the whole time after he dropped past the 6th/7th/8th spots. Sadly, the Sonics didn't draft him. Which made me scream a lot more. 

So yeah, I was probably telling you guys to draft Williams, not Foye.


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## Diable

Chan said:


> Probably. I don't remember. I would probably be a Williams guy more than a Foye guy. I know I was screaming the whole time after he dropped past the 6th/7th/8th spots. Sadly, the Sonics didn't draft him. Which made me scream a lot more.
> 
> So yeah, I was probably telling you guys to draft Williams, not Foye.


You're a sonics fan?And you're sad that they passed on Marcus Williams?Eh,Okay.Personally that was the only move Knight has made that made me believe he wasn't braindead,although in hindsight they should have taken Roy and played him out of position at the point.Wouldn't have been ideal,but he would have been an improvement over anything they had and probably as good at point as anyone available this year.So far Marcus Williams hasn't been as good as Tyrone Lue or Speedy Claxton who are the problem in ATL.The scouts for the first 21 teams nailed that much.


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## Mr. Hobbes

Diable said:


> You're a sonics fan?And you're sad that they passed on Marcus Williams?Eh,Okay.Personally that was the only move Knight has made that made me believe he wasn't braindead,although in hindsight they should have taken Roy and played him out of position at the point.Wouldn't have been ideal,but he would have been an improvement over anything they had and probably as good at point as anyone available this year.So far Marcus Williams hasn't been as good as Tyrone Lue or Speedy Claxton who are the problem in ATL.The scouts for the first 21 teams nailed that much.


Williams has shown that he can be a very good PG. He is much better than Lue and Claxton. The scouts said his biggest knock is his attitude, after that laptop stealing incident. Not his ability.


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## Diable

check the Nets board if you can't watch him play


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## Mr. Hobbes

Diable said:


> check the Nets board if you can't watch him play


Hey, he was good in the beginning of the year. Did he regress or something?


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## HB

I think Marcus' biggest problem has and will be playing behind Kidd. Its just a bar that not many points can come close to, case in point Mcinnis. He was terrible on the Nets playing behind Kidd, but goes to Charlotte and has a relative good season.

Marcus showed promise earlier in the year, but as the season wore on, his game took a hit. He even mentioned it himself that his confidence had faltered. I have no doubt in my mind that if he played on a team where he had adequate minutes he could average close to 8 apg.


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## Mr. Hobbes

So yeah, Marcus Williams is a good player, and Atlanta should've drafted him. Over Shelden "Poor Man's Nick Collison" Williams.


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## ATLien

Shelden played well down the stretch when he actually was given minutes. He's not going to be a better pro than Brandon Roy or perform like a top five pick, but he'll be alright I think.


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## seifer0406

Marcus Williams has not played well this year. There isn't a single NBA point guard in the NBA that he can guard. I repeat, if whoever Marcus Williams guard doesn't score, it will be because the guy can't shoot or wasn't looking to shoot, it's not because of Williams. Watch him for a few games and you will see how everyone obliterates his defense.


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## Mr. Hobbes

TheATLien said:


> Shelden played well down the stretch when he actually was given minutes. He's not going to be a better pro than Brandon Roy or perform like a top five pick, but he'll be alright I think.


Well, Nick Collison is alright too. I've only seen Shelden play once on the Hawks, and he had a bad game. He didn't do much. But his numbers and physical attributes (6'9ish, strong, good defenders, not much if an offensive skillset, not very athletic, good hustle) suggest he is like Collison, except worse in every way. Williams is a crappy Collison without a jumper (Collison's shot is unreliable, but it's not too bad).

I wanted Marcus over Shelden last year because I knew Shelden would be, at best, a glorified Nick Collison (it turned out to be the other way around). I was also wary of the F/C position that he plays. Unlike a lot of posters, I thought he would never be a C in the long run. At least not a C that would help this team compete. Contenders never have an undersized center. Except Ben Wallace, but Shelden is not Ben Wallace.


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## Diable

I'm not about to defend drafting Shelden at five.He would have been a good pick around ten to fifteen because he was the best big man available.His numbers weren't good,but he had a higher PER than Marcus WIlliams while playing good defense and rebounding.The Hawks drafted him because they needed someone to defend big men and rebound.The fact of the matter is that Marcus Williams is not a good point guard.He dribbles too much,he takes bad shots and he turns the ball over at about twice what is acceptable rate of a quality point guard.He is at best a career backup in the NBA and if you look at the Hawks roster you'll see those guys are already well represented.

In retrospect the Hawks should have taken Brandon Roy and played him out of position at the point.Of course this is very easy to say in hindsight.At the time I posed their dilemna as a choice between Marcus and SHelden i.e the best available big man vs a point guard I saw as extremely flawed.Hey I've been wrong before.I was absolutely not wrong about Marcus Williams,instead I failed to imagine the possibility of the Hawks taking Roy.


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## Mr. Hobbes

Diable said:


> I'm not about to defend drafting Shelden at five.He would have been a good pick around ten to fifteen because he was the best big man available.His numbers weren't good,but he had a higher PER than Marcus WIlliams while playing good defense and rebounding.The Hawks drafted him because they needed someone to defend big men and rebound.The fact of the matter is that Marcus Williams is not a good point guard.He dribbles too much,he takes bad shots and he turns the ball over at about twice what is acceptable rate of a quality point guard.He is at best a career backup in the NBA and if you look at the Hawks roster you'll see those guys are already well represented.
> 
> In retrospect the Hawks should have taken Brandon Roy and played him out of position at the point.Of course this is very easy to say in hindsight.At the time I posed their dilemna as a choice between Marcus and SHelden i.e the best available big man vs a point guard I saw as extremely flawed.Hey I've been wrong before.I was absolutely not wrong about Marcus Williams,instead I failed to imagine the possibility of the Hawks taking Roy.


Calling a rookie a career backup is too harsh.


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## seifer0406

Chan said:


> Calling a rookie a career backup is too harsh.


Well, I once thought Tyrone Lue would be a career backup. Theres just something about him that shouts bench player. I guess there are always teams desperate for starting PG and starting C, you just never know these days.


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