# Starbury For Pierce....



## AUNDRE (Jul 11, 2005)

New York Trade Breakdown.......

Outgoing 
Stephon Marbury
6-2 PG from Georgia Tech
21.7 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 8.2 apg in 40.0 minutes 

Incoming 
Paul Pierce
6-6 SF from Kansas
21.6 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 4.2 apg in 36.1 minutes 
Change in team outlook: -0.1 ppg, +3.6 rpg, and -4.0 apg. 



Boston Trade Breakdown.............

Outgoing 
Paul Pierce
6-6 SF from Kansas
21.6 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 4.2 apg in 36.1 minutes 

Incoming 
Stephon Marbury
6-2 PG from Georgia Tech
21.7 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 8.2 apg in 40.0 minutes 
Change in team outlook: +0.1 ppg, -3.6 rpg, and +4.0 apg. 


Successful Scenario 
Due to New York and Boston being over the cap, the 25% trade rule is invoked. New York and Boston had to be no more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.


Tim Thomas..... goodbye...... get rid of his bum ***


Crawford.... Q. Rich.... Pierce........ yup


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

siK_sTyLeZz said:


> New York Trade Breakdown.......
> 
> Outgoing
> Stephon Marbury
> ...


it will never happen,but it would be awesome if it did


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## Biggestfanoftheknicks (Apr 14, 2005)

truth said:


> it will never happen,but it would be awesome if it did


it sure would. Paul Pierce is probably my favorite 2 in the league. Well maybe but he is way up there.


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

Biggestfanoftheknicks said:


> it sure would. Paul Pierce is probably my favorite 2 in the league. Well maybe but he is way up there.


Its actually not a bad trade for both teams but i dont think GMs like to trade within the division...

I know you didnt like the Q aquisition...Can he play the 3?????


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

So Whats the Diffrence withen a few weeks all the Complaints we have about marbury leading the team we will have about Pierce , this does nothing to improve the Team & Might actully hurt the Team finacilly since Marbury can sell better then Pierce can when it comes to the ticket buying public in the East since Marbury has a much bigger east Coast following then Pierce from LA has . So it actully helps boston to continue selling tickets . While our product remains the Same & know we have to hope the Casual NY fan the one who actully buy the tickets to the Games will continue to buy with a player like Pierces cache . Because before marbury got here not only where we Bad but we did'nt even Sell . Since we got marbury we have became medocre but able to Sell more . So unless we get another NY Talent likea Elton Brand or Ron Artest , I would hesitate at doing sideways moves for Steph , since he's been the whole reason why we been selling . 


Besides I would rather a Crawford-Ariza-Mo for Pierce Trade . That way we get another Star to play along a Star instead of reling on 1 star .


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## The True Essence (May 26, 2003)

id do it........only cause it gets nate more burn. i like stephon as well........but...he hasnt really proven much. though its a 1-1 swap, it improves our depth.....were deep like the grizzlies were in their playoff season..

starters- Jamal, Q, Paul, Sweets, James

second unit- Nate, Ariza, Tim, Rose, Frye...
with Lee and JYD waiting in reserve.


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

*Quills...*

Give it up. The Marbury tour '05/'06 is starting soon...in a town far away from you. Brass doesn't need Marbury's sorry *** on the team to fill the Garden. It'll be rockin' this year with or without him. You think NY wouldn't love Pierce?
I admire your loyalty but, seriously, are you related to him? If not, I'd have that crush looked into.....it ain't healthy.


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## Biggestfanoftheknicks (Apr 14, 2005)

truth said:


> Its actually not a bad trade for both teams but i dont think GMs like to trade within the division...
> 
> I know you didnt like the Q aquisition...Can he play the 3?????



He can I mean he and mags used to alternate, it's probably a better fit for him position wise regardless.


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

Which makes Jamal Crawford the starting PG. Boo-ya


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

I you don;t like Marbury at Point you'll just love to Hate Crawford as as the point Every Critisim you have about Marbury will come to light with Crawford as a Starting point for us


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## Biggestfanoftheknicks (Apr 14, 2005)

*Re: Quills...*



alphadog said:


> Give it up. The Marbury tour '05/'06 is starting soon...in a town far away from you. Brass doesn't need Marbury's sorry *** on the team to fill the Garden. It'll be rockin' this year with or without him. You think NY wouldn't love Pierce?
> I admire your loyalty but, seriously, are you related to him? If not, I'd have that crush looked into.....it ain't healthy.



Wait a minute wait minute, is there really someone in this thread who thinks Pierce wouldn't be a hit in the garden??? Have you all watched the dude play?? What the heck???


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

*Kbf...*

Quills was just saying above that Knick brass would be reluctgant to trade Marbury because they need him to fill seats. I replied that with or without him the seats would fill this year. Pierce would only help more.


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

How would Pierce help more , Remember the Celtics where not a very good team untill antoine walker got back with them , So Paul Pierce can't be asked to do it alone & when you take into account that the Celtics had a Equal but Bigger front court then ours & they still needed Walker to make there playoff push . I mean where'nt the C's the 3rd team in the Alantic for the 1st half of the Season behind Us & Philly ? So I see no real improvement in that factor . Unless of course you belive Crawford & Nate can Handle the point & they cant maybe Nate eventully . But Crawford is way to much a gunner to ever be a starting PG , it's not a Knock but to me the Best Crawford can be is an All NBA 6th man since he really does'nt have the game to be made a Starting PG or the Strength & Power to be a Shooting Guard defencivly . I see him rather as someone like a Rickey Pierce type that can come in & Be lights out from the bench . 


So will Stregthen up our Rebounding & probelly Defence , but we would actully be killing our offence since most of you people feel Marbury holds onto the ball & don't pass enough . What do you Think Crawford does besides crossover & throw passes to himself & Hoist bad shots ? Then you'll tell me we got Nate , you do relize with Nate as our Starting PG no knock on him but we very well can be thee worst team in the NBA ??? 



So I'll Just what to know what do you Expect from this team ?


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## AUNDRE (Jul 11, 2005)

^^they wont be making the playoffs IMO...... i dont expect anything from them.... if they make the playoffs I'll call this year a success for them............

Larry Brown will be making Marbury pass it this year...... if Marbury is still there cuz Larry Brown dont like him..... he will have to change his game or he wont stay....


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

All Marbury does is Pass , he needs players to pass too that can get easier buckets then just jump shots


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## Biggestfanoftheknicks (Apr 14, 2005)

Quills said:


> All Marbury does is Pass , he needs players to pass too that can get easier buckets then just jump shots



You forgot about all the shooting he does.


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

he does'nt shoot that much what does he take like 15-20 shots a game ??? & he's by Far the Best option on the Team . 15-20 shots aint that many shots far the best offencive player on youre team , problem is he's a point guard & a team would be better suited with him as a 2nd 3rd or non option on Onfence . But he has NEVER been on a team where he was anything less then the best offencive player on it , including minnesota & Garnett .


Now if you want to say Marbury holds on to the Ball to much Dribbling , just like Ebery other kid from Brooklyn when He & I grew up in that bourough . Then yes he's is a Dribble nut fo sho , But he aint a shot nut


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## Biggestfanoftheknicks (Apr 14, 2005)

Quills said:


> he does'nt shoot that much what does he take like 15-20 shots a game ??? & he's by Far the Best option on the Team . 15-20 shots aint that many shots far the best offencive player on youre team , problem is he's a point guard & a team would be better suited with him as a 2nd 3rd or non option on Onfence . But he has NEVER been on a team where he was anything less then the best offencive player on it , including minnesota & Garnett .
> 
> 
> Now if you want to say Marbury holds on to the Ball to much Dribbling , just like Ebery other kid from Brooklyn when He & I grew up in that bourough . Then yes he's is a Dribble nut fo sho , But he aint a shot nut


Hey Hey Hey. 15-20 shots a game isn't shooting much???

All right now lets stop with jokes.


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

15 to 20 shots a games is not a lot . It's 4 shots a quarter , you're telling me the best Offencive option on the Team can't Take 4 Shots a quarter . Cmon be realistic . i'm not talking 30 shots plus , I'm talking 20 Shots 4 a quarter . you make half you get 20 . how is that a lot of shots , damn people just think about it logicly . How many Shots do you expect to take a quarter & how many of those do you want youre best option taking them . I'm sure if you do the math I'm sure you'll jack up more then 4 shots with youre best player a quarter


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

*If you take 20 shots....*

You damn sure better score more than 20. A couple of 3's and 5 foul shots would give you 27. A guy taking that many shots better get to the line at least a half dozen times. A guy taking that many shots should shoot close to 50% unless there are no other options on the team. A team where a guy averages 20 shots is a team that is unbalanced and easy to stop (9 times out of 10...nobody stopped MJ). I can appreciate that you and superstarbury were from the same area and maybe knew each other, but his game is more suited to an And1 DVD than it is to winning in the NBA.

Pounds the air out of the ball(dominates the ball)....shies away from the big shot at the end....plays no defense....tired legs....a lockeroom moaner...outside of HS has never been a winner...does not create easy INSIDE opportunuities for his bigs. Why does anyone want this guy?


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## The True Essence (May 26, 2003)

marbury only took 15 shots per game last year. thats it. Jamal took more.

get your numbers right before you bash. cause i could name like 15-20 guys who took more shots then steph, and averaged less points and way less assists


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## alphadog (Jan 2, 2004)

*Better take some prozac, Penny*

If you read the thread (and I assume you can read)...you will see they are not my numbers...they are Quills(a SM supporter, I might add). Give it up, Penny, superstarbury is not a winner, even though you want him to be. Grab a beer, watch an And1 dvd, then watch the Finals featuring not1, but 2 real PG's...take notes. Test in June.


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## The True Essence (May 26, 2003)

what the hell does marbury do that has ANYTHING to do with AND1? drive to the bucket and dish off, for 2 points? make a mid range J. drive to the hoop and score? swinging the ball? 

what is it? he doesnt have a flashy crossover dribble. he hardly even throws alleys. 

and do you think that in 04, if the pistons had marbury instead of billups, they would have been terrible? 

wheres ben wallace and sheed on our team. its not just the point guard. tony parker isnt a good point guard. hes inconsistant as hell with incredibly low assists numbers despite his minutes. 

i wish i had him instead of steph.

i wish i had career journeyman chauncey billups instead of marbury, because damn, hes great with hamilton, prince wallace and wallace around him. his job is tough. 

nobody ever called billups a leader until he had a freakin all star team starting lineup. what did he lead in denver? a straight push for the number one pick?

and oh man, i wish we had derek fisher, steve kerr ron harper whoever instead of this guy! cause damn, they went to the finals.


somtimes you guys mistake good players for players on winning teams.

Mr Jason Kidd never passed the first round until he was 30.
Mr Michael Jordan was labeled a selfish chucker until pippen came and helped him out.
Kevin Garnett would get no praise until his team reached the conference finals......after 8 years of getting knocked out the first round.

who the hell are you to say that stephon cannot achieve success just cause of who he is? 

you probably would be the guy saying Jordan wouldnt ever win anything, cause he shoots too much.


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

Damn someone Drunk My Kool Aid


& to Further the Point about Jeffrey Jordan , it's not like Jeff did'nt have good players on his team he had 2 very good players on his Team that he actully made worse in one Mr. Reggie Theuse & 1 Mr. Orlando Woolridge . Now I can see why Jordan & Theus was never ment to be besides The Allgations that one of them where sleeping with the Others Girl . Both Reggie & Jeffrey both POUNDED the Ball into submition in an attempt to run the Offence . Both where great passers but like Marbury they pounded the Ball & did what they wanted to do with the Ball , not neccercillry what the Team wanted them to do . So the Bulls struggled but since the NBA was so Dynasty oriented at the time they where in the same boat as the Rest of the NBA not named Boston-Lakers-Detroit-76ers-Portland at the Time Pretty much every other team in the NBA was Medicore at best like When the 86 Rockets made the Finals with I belive either a .500 Record or a sub .500 record & it was'nt because there team was bad . but Not only where the great teams good every team was good so there where no give mes .

What Happend Jordan A: Finally got 2 players that can play with out the Ball (Now Woolridge I never understoood why Jordan could'nt make better it's not just because i like him better but I really Felt for a Breif time Period for Wooly he Was Better then Pippen ever was Now I know no one will ever bye that but it's always been a feeling of mine , Woolridge was Pippen pretty much cept he was not the Passer & Ball Handler Pippen was . But more of a Beast much more , he was liuke the East Coast Xavier McDainel in my Eyes.) in Pippen & Grant , that can also play with the Ball to Give Jordan a breather . Also both where better Suited for the Way Jordan played D . Since the Bulls where Crafted in his Image Defencivly , alowing Jordan to man up the Ball & Pippen to play passing Lanes & Grant the Post . So that coupled with the Fact Jeffery actully got a player he Respected & FEARED on the Team in one Mr. NANCY Cartwright . Big Bill had more to do with the Bulls Success then many will relize because he was the one that got Jordan to start truley respecting his Teammates since the only Teammate Jordan truley respected to that point was Charles Oakley-Gainesvill Waiters-Artis Gilmore-Geroge Gervin & Thats it 3 washed up players by the Time Jordan played with Them & 1 player Jordan respected but did'nt really fear unfourtintly in Oakley . Also the Bulls needed more height on there Team since the Bulls back then was undersized & Skilled in the Post spots so Cartwright gave them the Height & Attitude & Appittude needed for a championship run



So like my man Penny Said & Like I been Saying all Along Why is Marbury looked at like he's supposed to be the one to lead a team to the finals by himself . when no one even tried to build a team for him in his Image , so untill he gets good players around him don't expect much from him or any player . Because by the Way, the Kobe is a loser because he's never lead a team to the Playoffs argument can be made as well .


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## Attila (Jul 23, 2003)

siK_sTyLeZz said:


> New York Trade Breakdown.......
> 
> Outgoing
> Stephon Marbury
> ...


 Why would Boston trade their best player for a shoot-first point guard?


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## Biggestfanoftheknicks (Apr 14, 2005)

Quills said:


> 15 to 20 shots a games is not a lot . It's 4 shots a quarter , you're telling me the best Offencive option on the Team can't Take 4 Shots a quarter . Cmon be realistic . i'm not talking 30 shots plus , I'm talking 20 Shots 4 a quarter . you make half you get 20 . how is that a lot of shots , damn people just think about it logicly . How many Shots do you expect to take a quarter & how many of those do you want youre best option taking them . I'm sure if you do the math I'm sure you'll jack up more then 4 shots with youre best player a quarter



If a median of 18 shots a game isn't a lot for a pointguard to be taking I flat out don't know where to being with you man. Seriously. 30 shots a game is what you use for comparision? WHAT THE HELL? Do you know ANYBODY that averages 30 a game??? I mean come on man marbury is shoot first think later that's how the dude plays ball, I don't see how you could argue otherwise.

Also penny lets see that list of players that average more than 18 shots a game. It should be worth a look.


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

PG has NOTHING to do with it



The Question still Remains how many Shots do you want your Best Player & your best offencive player to take & be limited too . 


So your telling me just because your best player & pretty much your only Offencive option is a PG you'll hold him to less then 15 shots a game because of his position ???? Marbury rarley looks to shot if he has any option & By the Way Kurt Thomas is not an offencive option . Steph made him last year , but the problem was there is hardley anyone to ever make good on a Marbury Team . Marbury has NEVER played with a good player since leaving Minnesota & he's never even played with a Consitent average one for more then 1 season . 



Again bring your Arguments up about Kobe who has NEVER lead a team to the Playoffs as the man on the Team while Marbury has . if you want to blow things out of purportion like this .


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## Biggestfanoftheknicks (Apr 14, 2005)

Quills said:


> PG has NOTHING to do with it
> 
> 
> 
> ...



PG has everything to do with it. It is his job to get others involved. Basketball is a team sport. I skimmed through your post and saw that you mention uh.. kobe or think that i mentioned Kobe... in which case let me close by saying WHAT?


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## truth (Jul 16, 2002)

Biggestfanoftheknicks said:


> *PG has everything to do with it. It is his job to get others involved. * Basketball is a team sport. I skimmed through your post and saw that you mention uh.. kobe or think that i mentioned Kobe... in which case let me close by saying WHAT?


This is the TRUTH,and why both arguments are right...and wrong..marbury is a very efficient scorer.Believe it or not TT is not far behind..

Starbury supporters are not wrong defending marbury taking 15 -25 shots per game..Its alot better than anyone else shooting......

The problem is exactly what BFK pointed out..hes the point guard and has to get others involved..There is a very fine line marbury walks between not scoring enough,shooting too much and not getting others involved...

Iverson is a better/worse example as he is more extreme.If you compare Marbury vs Iverson,mrbury is a far better efficient scorer.In fact,AI kind of blows...

Everyone thinks of the Pistons when they think of Larry Brown...I think the Knicks are built much more like larry Browns 76ers team with Deke,AI and a bunch of workers...I can see JC being "rip-like",and marbury a better Billups,but our front line isnt long an super athletic with D stoppers..maybe if larry started Ariza,Frye and James..And I do say maybe


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## Biggestfanoftheknicks (Apr 14, 2005)

truth said:


> Its actually not a bad trade for both teams but i dont think GMs like to trade within the division...
> 
> I know you didnt like the Q aquisition...Can he play the 3?????



He can. It doesn't change his game all that much.


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## Premier (Oct 30, 2003)

Need I comment?


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## The True Essence (May 26, 2003)

how much did steve kerr get his teammates involved? how much did Mj however?

marbury gets his teammates involved while scoring. how the hell else does he get 8 dimes? luck? 

and since when is 15 alot of shots?

Who the **** is jason kidd then? Lets bash his *** then.

kidd in 03-04 (pre injury)- 14.3 shots per game. HOLY ****ING ****. Jason kidd shot .7 less shots then stephon CHUCKBERRY! ISNT HE SUPPOSED TO GET HIS TEAMMATES INVOLVED?

HOLY CRAP, and the prior season, 15.5 shots! THATS MORE THEN CHUCKBERRY!

what is this bs

marbury is not a ball hog


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## Attila (Jul 23, 2003)

PennyHardaway said:


> HOLY CRAP, and the prior season, 15.5 shots! THATS MORE THEN CHUCKBERRY!
> 
> what is this bs
> 
> marbury is not a ball hog



You can say whatever you want. The bottom line is that Paul Pierce would help a team win more games than Marbury would.


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## The True Essence (May 26, 2003)

thats why i supported this trade, genius! i like paul on this team considering we can use jamal and nate at point.

im jus saying, 90 percent of the marbury bashing is just plain baseless.

i know his flaws. being a ball hog isnt one of them. in fact, many times this year i was mad at the amount of times he would pass up shots just to look unselfish


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## Quills (Jun 18, 2005)

Well I'm in the Minority that dont Belive that JC & Nate can run the Point there by making us weak there Just like where weak at the Athletic Swing spots now , which is Whi I say where the Same Exact Team with or Woth out Paul Pierce if Marbury is included in the Deal . It doe'snt make us better it's just a Sideways deal & I don't make Sideways deals Involving PGs or C/PFs for a Commen position like SF/SG when it's too Equal players All things being Equal the PG is still more Valuble then a SF/SG


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