# What should we do with Eisley?



## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

Ideally, I would like to see us try to get Charlotte to take him, but I'm not sure what I'd offer them for picking him up.. after all, being under the cap doesn't always translate into the ability to use it on top tier players.. If we trade our lotto pick I think it could turn around and bite us. 

From a management standpoint though, getting rid of him would allow us to after the FA's we want, resign McDyess (if that's their perogative.. I would do it, McDyess can log 24~ mins a night just playing backup PF/C, and he's been playing great lately aside from the fouls), then resign our young guns without being substantially over the cap.

My vote goes for trying to unload Eisley onto Charlotte without having to give up something unreasonable (IE a top four/five pick).. the prospect of having to eat his contract is nauseating, but it might come down to that.


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## azirishmusic (Feb 25, 2004)

I'm prepared to use the lottery pick to move Eisley as long as it is not #1 or #2. There are several reasons for this:

1. It clears $13 million in cap space over two years that can be MUCH better used.

2. It would make it possible for the Suns to go after Kobe or two above mid cap FA's without having to give up White. White is a useful role player and would be useful trade bait since he has an expiring contract.

3. I'm not especially excited about the lottery this season. If the Suns draft a project (the most likely situation) they would be tying up over $2 million in cap space for someone who won't play for several years, if ever.


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## RyGuY43084 (Jul 15, 2002)

This is what I have been thinking about this whole thing..... Eisley is Terrible, and whats worse is he is set to make 6.3, and 6.9 the next 2 years....Charlotte having the Expansion draft is nothing short of a miricle for us..... and we NEED TO DO EVERYTHING possible to Rid ourselves of his contract

That said, Giving Charlotte a mid Teens pick (Cavs Trade), plus three Million Cash (which is Half his Salery the first year anyway), may be just enough to get them to bite; now if it is not, and we end up with the 6th or 7th overall pick, then we should consider it....... BUT THERES A PROBLEM.


I don't know if anyone saw this but ESPN reported that the suns would give their top pick to Charlotte just to take White. Now to me this would be WORST CASE SCERNIO... not because of money, because 5 million off the books is always good, BUT 

A. That is WAY too much to give up, just to lose White

B. The next year 2005, We have a team option on Amare, and JJ contract is up, so if we STILL have 7 million in Cap space used on this Waste of Space Eisley, I would hate to see us Lose JJ....

So for the futures sake, WE SERIOUSLY need Charlotte to take Eisley, and I think this should be the #1 plan for the suns this off season....

and by the way, I absolulty agree we should Re-sign Mcdyess, and Try to go for Kobe, assuming we get him, 

Can we go over the Cap to Resign our own players to MAX deals?? 

These are my thoughts


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## RyGuY43084 (Jul 15, 2002)

and another real quick question while we are on the subject, how much do you think Dice will command form us... I was thinking in the 5-6 Million a year range, like the MLE, what do ya'll think?


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## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>RyGuY43084</b>!
> and another real quick question while we are on the subject, how much do you think Dice will command form us... I was thinking in the 5-6 Million a year range, like the MLE, what do ya'll think?


I don't know if he deserves the MLE, but a team like Utah would be willing to give that up for him easily.. I mean he's only 29, and he's been amazing since starting. Part of JJ averaging 7apg or whatever he has been over the course of the last few games has been McNugget's uncanny ability to hit the open 15 footer..

He owes it to us to take a veterans exception, but we'll probably end up giving him more.. One thing I'm set on though is that I want him in a Suns uni next year.


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

> Starve Jahidi for three days, then put Eisley in a confined cell with him.


:laugh: 

What makes you guys think Charlotte will take on Howard Eisley's contract. The biggest no-no to starting a new franchise is bad cap management. You try to build around young picks and players with savvy vets who teach them the fundamentals of winning. Unless you give them Joe Johnson, they aren't even going to think about Howard Eisley.

In essence you will be giving up JJ to have a CHANCE at signing Kobe, so don't look for it to happen.








Oww Mama!


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Sovereignz</b>!
> He owes it to us to take a veterans exception, but we'll probably end up giving him more.. One thing I'm set on though is that I want him in a Suns uni next year.


He owes nothing to you. Alonzo Mourning sure as hell owed alot more to the Heat and we saw him desert them to play with the Nets for the MLE.


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## azirishmusic (Feb 25, 2004)

The Mourning deal was a strange one. Jason Kidd apparently made signing Mourning a condition for him re-signing with the Nets. From what I can tell, no one else was prepared to give Zo more than a two year deal and they wanted to make some of the money conditional (at least this is what Mark Cuban said).

It is hard to tell what the market will be this summer.

Last summer there were only two FA big men that moved for more than mid cap: Brad Miller starting at $7 million and Nesterovic starting at $5.6 million. (Duncan and J. O'Neal stayed put). At mid cap or below (not counting Zo):

Olowokandi started at $4.9 million
Campbell stated at $4 million
Drobnjak started at $2.5 million

There could be more movement this summer. Some of the big men likely to be available include:

Dampier
Camby
R. Wallace
Divac
Blount
Ostertag
Haslem
Swift (RFA)
Tsakalidis (RFA)
Etan Thomas (RFA)
Jerome James (player option)

I'm guessing that Dice might get an offer in the $2 to $3 million range, but not a lot more than that.


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## RyGuY43084 (Jul 15, 2002)

but think about it.... Dice, if he continues to improve VERY EASLIY could be a 14 PPG 9-10 RPG preformer for us..... I REALLY believe that, and as other teams start to see this, they will start offereing him more money.... Now If we give him the MLE, does that count against our Cap room that we already have? (That may sound like a STUPID question, but I really didn't know)


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## azirishmusic (Feb 25, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>RyGuY43084</b>!
> but think about it.... Dice, if he continues to improve VERY EASLIY could be a 14 PPG 9-10 RPG preformer for us..... I REALLY believe that, and as other teams start to see this, they will start offereing him more money.... Now If we give him the MLE, does that count against our Cap room that we already have? (That may sound like a STUPID question, but I really didn't know)


The Suns are below the cap, so the mid cap exemption is not availabe. Currently the Suns have a salary structure of #33.9 million for next year. A #6 pick would cost just under $2 million (it applies even if the player is not signed). If the cap is set at $45 million, this would give the Suns about $9 million to play with unless they trade White or Eisely.


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## BBallFan (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>The Franchise</b>!
> What makes you guys think Charlotte will take on Howard Eisley's contract. The biggest no-no to starting a new franchise is bad cap management. You try to build around young picks and players with savvy vets who teach them the fundamentals of winning. Unless you give them Joe Johnson, they aren't even going to think about Howard Eisley.


There's a rule that allows them to take a player in the expansion draft, and waive him before the regular season starts. Should they do that, they're still on the tab for his salary... but his salary doesn't count against the cap.

Eisley over 13 million dollars left on his deal. If Phoenix gave Charlotte the maximum 3 million allowed, Charlotte could pay Eisley the 10 million, waive him, and have him not count against the cap.

That being said... if Charlotte were to spend 10 million dollars, AND bail out the Suns ****BIGTIME**** they'd have to be compensated hugely. We saw in the trades earlier this year that the going rate to just save 5-million in luxury tax (which doesn't include helping a team lure a top-FA) is a first round pick. The going rate for saving 10 million dollars and allowing a team to go after a topflight free agency would be massive. 

Although it is a reasonable question if Charlotte would spend 10 million dollars to get, what's currently, the #6 pick. I think Charlotte is in the driver seat, and would be able to get even more than that if it took Eisley in the expansion draft.

I think that Charlotte would take Jahidi if Phoenix offered Joe Johnson or the #6... to take Eisley? I'd say it would take some sort of combination of the #6, Joe Johnson, Lampe, Vujanic, or Barbosa. For argument's sake, let's say either the #6 or Joe Johnson, and then one of either Lampe, Vujanic, or Barbosa.

If Kobe really wants to go to Phoenix though, it's a no-brainer that the Suns should give Charlotte whatever it takes to move either White or Eisley.


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## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BBallFan</b>!
> 
> 
> I think that Charlotte would take Jahidi if Phoenix offered Joe Johnson or the #6...


 You think Phoenix is going to give up a 22 y/o who averages 20/5/5 (since the trade at least) for Charlotte to take an expiring contract? Jahidi is not that big of a burden.. he's not exactly hugely overpaid (he's a useful guy to have on a team), and his deal will be up after next year.. They're going to need SOME big men, and Jahidi would be a great pickup for an expansion team because his deal is up at the end of next year. If we didn't protect Jahidi they might take him anyways.

We're looking at being under by 13 million already, anyways. No reason to give up a high lotto pick or a talent like JJ for nothing.


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## BBallFan (Jul 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Sovereignz</b>!
> You think Phoenix is going to give up a 22 y/o who averages 20/5/5 (since the trade at least) for Charlotte to take an expiring contract? Jahidi is not that big of a burden.. he's not exactly hugely overpaid (he's a useful guy to have on a team), and his deal will be up after next year.. They're going to need SOME big men, and Jahidi would be a great pickup for an expansion team because his deal is up at the end of next year. If we didn't protect Jahidi they might take him anyways.


I did say or the #6. In my opinion, I think it's going to take a lot for them to move a contract, because everyone knows that's the only way they can make a legimate run at Kobe. And there's absolutely no way that Charlotte is going to take Jahidi White unless they're compensated for it for that reason. Why would they take Jahidi when it's going to help Phoenix as much as it does? Because it helps them as much as it does, they're going to realize that they (Charlotte) should be made better from it too.

Yes, Joe Johnson's been playing great the last few months. But if you can give him up in order to upgrade to Kobe: what would you do?


> We're looking at being under by 13 million already, anyways. No reason to give up a high lotto pick or a talent like JJ for nothing.


There's not 13-million in cap room, unless you're assuming a 50 million dollar cap.


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## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BBallFan</b>!
> 
> 
> I did say or the #6. In my opinion, I think it's going to take a lot for them to move a contract, because everyone knows that's the only way they can make a legimate run at Kobe. And there's absolutely no way that Charlotte is going to take Jahidi White unless they're compensated for it for that reason. Why would they take Jahidi when it's going to help Phoenix as much as it does? Because it helps them as much as it does, they're going to realize that they (Charlotte) should be made better from it too.
> ...


Huh? So Charlotte isn't going to draft players now because it would give another team some cap space? Obviously any player that they draft is going to give said player's former team cap relief. They're not going to expect recompense for every player they take (taking a big long term contract like Eddie Jones, for example, would be different), they have a roster to fill.

If Charlotte doesn't take White, it will be for reasons like "Jahidi has too big of an injury history,", or "the Clippers didn't protect Drobnjak - he's cheaper and we want a center who can shoot the ball..".. not "we can't draft Jahidi, that would give the Suns cap space!" If they blackball Phoenix to the point of asking for Joe Johnson just to take White's expiring contract, Phoenix will laugh in their faces and probably refuse to deal with the organization ever again. I would, at least. 



> Originally posted by <b>BBallFan</b>!
> There's not 13-million in cap room, unless you're assuming a 50 million dollar cap.


They have 10 players under contract next year for 33.8 million, which would be plenty to sign a max player (experts have said the cap will be 47-49 million) and then use the exceptions to fill out the roster. However, I didn't take into account the fact that they will have to sign a lottery player if they don't move the pick, so you're right. They're going to have to make some moves, but if it requires moving JJ just to get rid of the expiring contract of a valuable roleplayer, I'm 100% against it.

The #6~ pick I could see (since I think this year's lottery is pretty weak), but the Phoenix organization would lose even more support than they already have if they shipped off JJ for nothing, just for the mere chance of acquiring Kobe.


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## RyGuY43084 (Jul 15, 2002)

Yeah I agree the suns would NEVER give up JJ for nothing, (nunless the suns surprise us again with Stupitity), but anyway, I think that providing the Bobcats with the Cavs pick, 3 Million in Cash, and future considerations can be, and may be enough for them to take Eisley's contract......

The reaosn, is they can take that 10 mil, and chalk it up to Start up costs of the Franchise, and deal with it....

Plus I really don't think charlotte would care that much dealing with the suns, its not like the suns are in the eats, I think (assuming they are smart) that they will deal differently with East consideration, rather than the west......

However if it is not enough for them, I would say fine, just Take White (which is who they probably want anyway, considering they HAVE to take 15 players off teams), save the 6th overall pick, and Draft Josh Smith, Mark my words, THIS KID IS GOING TO BE GOOD!!!


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## MightyReds2020 (Jul 19, 2002)

I agreed with BBallFan here. I think some of you guys underestimated the position Charlotte Bobcats are in. All they need to do is sitting in the office and waiting for the best proposal to come until the last minutes. The Warriors, for example, will gladly giveup NVE + their top-pick. This offer is better than Howard Eisley + the Cavs' pick for example.

Seeing the Suns gave up Gugliotta + future first for nothing, it is quite logically to assume they will try to dump White + top pick (or J.J.) if they know their chances on getting Kobe are high.

The bottom line is: I'm pretty sure Eisley + Cavs pick won't make the conversation go far. Eisley + top pick is pretty good deal in Charlotte's part but I suspect there will be teams willing to give up players with smaller contracts. White + Cavs pick? Like my example above, someone could be willing to offer higher pick. At the end, it comes down to White + top pick or something along the line.


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