# My plan for the Warriors



## HKF

I think the Warriors learned a lot about their team this season. First thing, first. They need to keep Eric Musselman. Not worth letting him go as he is a very good coach.

First thing is first. They need to trade Jason Richardson for Tyson Chandler. I think Chandler is a Center personally and he can be a double double guy in this league and would be the perfect compliment to Troy Murphy because of his defense. Richardson, while he is a good player, likes to shoot way too much and can't really stop anyone. I think Pietrus is way more valuable in terms of helping this team win. 

Re-sign Adonal Foyle, Calbert Cheaney and Brian Cardinal and sign Brent Barry to the MLE. 

PG - Brent Barry/Speedy Claxton
SG - Michael Pietrus/Nick Van Exel (healthy and legit 6th man candidate)
SF - Mike Dunleavy, Jr./Calbert Cheaney/Brian Cardinal
PF - Troy Murphy/Clifford Robinson
C - Tyson Chandler/Adonal Foyle

I think by making this team more unselfish with Dampier and Richardson gone, this team will actually improve. Plus with Pietrus and Chandler in the starting lineup, along with Murphy this will be an excellent defensive team, which is what Musselman wants. Foyle, Robinson, Cheaney and Cardinal all will get after it off the bench on the defensive end and NVE could be 6th man of the year if healthy. 

Then with the 11th pick, draft Kosta Perovic (7'2 Center) and develop him behind all of the front line talent. Once Cliff Robinson retires, Perovic moves right into the rotation. 


What do you guys think?


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## MightyReds2020

Well, Muss has to go if the new(?) management don't like him. He at best will be a lamb duck coach next year. It's better to part ways this summer than keeping him because that will benefit both parties. I agreed, though, that Muss has done a terrifc job his time here but he has burned too many bridges.

Tyson Chandler? A 21-year-old with bad back? I'll stay away with him unless Chicago wants to take less (like Pietrus straight up). Chandler and Marcus Camby switched body this season and that's not promising. I won't want to part with JRich, who is much more established than Pietrus, in this unless we're getting a little bit more.


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## Hero

No. 

Hell no. 

J-Rich for Tyson Chandler? Why Tyson Chandler!? Why the world would GS trade their best player for a guy that hardly played? Why would they want J-Rich anyway when they have Jamal Crawford, Kirk Hinrich, Eddie Robinson, Linton Johnson, AND Kendall Gill? Plus, JR is worth more than that, they can easily trade him for more valuable centers like Brad Miller, Bull's own Eddy Curry, Jamal Magloire, Yao Ming. (Just kidding on the last one)

You need to watch J-Rich play more before assuming he shoots way too much. His assist might be down from 3.0 to 2.9 this year but he's a much more unselfish player than he is last year, which he had Jamison to pass to down the low post resulting in lots of dimes. Trust me, he's been passing ALOT more this year, as the team's unofficial point guard since Speedy went down.


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## HKF

Just a suggestion.


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## joekostelnik

I think we've got another year before a real JRich vs. Pietrus debate needs to take place. Pietrus should get significant minutes next year, but I don't think we should trade away our leading scorer and put all the pressure on him just yet. Center is where we really need to focus, and I don't see any great solutions. However, Foyle looked solid in the last couple of games. He played more minutes and gained confidence.

JRich for Chandler is not a good idea. JRich for Brad Miller would be something to consider, but Sacramento wouldn't do that. They have no need for Richardson, and Miller is being groomed to take over for Vlade.


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## Minstrel

If Chandler weren't such an injury risk, it wouldn't be too bad an idea. A shot-blocking, rebounding young center is not that easy to find, even if he doesn't have a lot of offensive upside.

But considering that Chandler may struggle to have even one or two full seasons of play, I think the Warriors are better holding onto the sure thing in Richardson.


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## jokeaward

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> If Chandler weren't such an injury risk, it wouldn't be too bad an idea. A shot-blocking, rebounding young center is not that easy to find, even if he doesn't have a lot of offensive upside.
> 
> But considering that Chandler may struggle to have even one or two full seasons of play, I think the Warriors are better holding onto the sure thing in Richardson.


He played in 68 games in 02-03. Is he really that big of a risk after one season of injury?

Is Antawn Jamison a risk? He missed a lot of 99-00.


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## pr0wler

I agree with the fact that you guys should trade jason richardson. Pietrus brings superior defense to the floor, and his overall +/- ratio is better. However, I wouldn't trade for Tyson Chandler.....who is a sketchy player due to injuries.

You guys also got to find a slot for Brian Cardinal to get signifigant minutes. He has a great +/- ratio as well, and I think a rotation of Pietrus/Dunleavy/Cardinal at the 2 and 3 spots would work well.


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## MightyReds2020

> Originally posted by <b>jokeaward</b>!
> 
> 
> He played in 68 games in 02-03. Is he really that big of a risk after one season of injury?
> 
> Is Antawn Jamison a risk? He missed a lot of 99-00.


Chandler has a back problem and I am pretty sure it is a recurring injury, like the one TMac has. There's no cure for this type of injury except for a long, long break. Players with this injury will typically missed some games because of back spasms. Chandler, however, is still young. Youth is supposed to be the best medicine you can get because young people heal faster. But then again, Chandler doesn't have much strength in his body, which means unless he takes a year off, there's no other way to ensure the injury won't recurred again.

That's my knowledge regarding recurring back injury. There could be some good treatments but I don't know.


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## Hero

> Originally posted by <b>pr0wler</b>!
> I agree with the fact that you guys should trade jason richardson.


Yeah how about J-Rich for Calvin Booth?:laugh:


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## MongolianDeathCloud

I'm for moving J-Rich. I like Chandler too, although I'd want a future 1st from Chicago because of the risk.

There are probably other places JRich could be moved, and I think it will be explored a little. He seems to put up good numbers on a mediocre team, and to me that's always a sign of that guy possibly being an impedement to a team's development. I think JRich kind of dogs it alot of the time.

I'd like to get a good pick in a JRich deal.


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## Knicksbiggestfan

You guys need to move Jrich. And muss needs to start the rookies. I honestly think you guys should keep damp not max him out but keep him.

The biggest worry is pointguard. Damon Stoudamaire for Jrich?

How about that or giving him over to seattle for Ridnour and one of their picks
?


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## RP McMurphy

I think Golden State has a very bright future with Dunleavy, Murphy, and especially Pietrus. These guys are winners. But they need to get rid of Jason Richardson and Erick Dampier. These are two of the biggest losers in the NBA.

You just don't win in the NBA if your best player is an inefficient scorer who can't play defense and isn't a team player. You just don't. Get rid of this guy and make him some other team's problem.

Erick Dampier is a cancer who put up big numbers playing for a contract this year. He is a stat padder. Get him out of Golden State too. If he is re-signed he'll become an albatross around the Warriors' necks.

As for Tyson Chandler I think trading Richardson for him is a great idea. Sure his back is a big question mark, otherwise he wouldn't be on the trading block in the first place. The thing is, a talented young big man with no question marks, like Chris Bosh for example, will not UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES get traded for Jason Richardson. Now is the perfect time to trade for Chandler, I think his trade value is the lowest it will ever be in his career. He has great hustle and aggressiveness, is a great rebounder and shot-blocker and defender, any team would love to have this guy if he can stay healthy. When you're getting a guy who has that much potential and just losing a guy who you're better off without him anyway I think the trade is a no brainer.

I would shed a tear for Bulls fans if they traded their most promising young player for Jason Richardson. :no:


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## Knicksbiggestfan

I dunno about Eric Damp being a cancer, I think he is overplaying for a big contract but the fact he is he outplayed shaq all season during their match ups.

He also hasn't really had to good of minutes, so I just don't know if I am ready to call him a cancer.... now Jrich....


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## MongolianDeathCloud

> I dunno about Eric Damp being a cancer, I think he is overplaying for a big contract but the fact he is he outplayed shaq all season during their match ups.


Dude's a cancer. At least at Golden State.

We signed him to a nice contract, he straight dogged it as soon as he was paid-- people here call him Mister October/November, because he always puts up good stats for about a month and then just *dawgs* it for the rest of the season.

This season he puts up good numbers all season, in a contract year. Hmm, sure seems like a real standup franchise loyal guy.

Anyways, it's moot as there's some article floating around that I might have to track down, where Damp says that he worked hard this season to get out of Goldenstate. I say good riddance, hopefully we can sign and trade him to some poor desperate center deprived team that can't just outright sign him, and get a pick/prospect.


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## RP McMurphy

Dude, Erick Dampier won't outplay Shaq unless it's a contract year. You're right that he's extremely talented, but he's a lazy player who only cares about money. Why do you think he hasn't gotten enough minutes? Maybe because his terrible hustle and work ethic pissed off his coach and his teammates?

He's been in the league too long for the jury to still be out on him. He's a cancer, get rid of him.

A big reason why Golden State has been so bad for so long is that they've built their team around losers like Chris Mills, Danny Fortson, Jason Richardson, Erick Dampier, and to some extent even Antawn Jamison and Gilbert Arenas. Now they have some talented guys on their team who really care about winning. This summer is their chance to get rid of the bad apples.


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## Minstrel

> Originally posted by <b>ArtestFan</b>!
> 
> I would shed a tear for Bulls fans if they traded their most promising young player for Jason Richardson. :no:


You really feel Tyson Chandler is their most promising young player? Even removing the back problems from the picture, Eddie Curry is larger, has had more dominant games and has offensive upside that Chandler really doesn't appear to have. Both players have been inconsistant.

I think the "Curry = future Shaq," "Chandler = future Garnett" comparisons are gone for good, but I think Chandler is looking like shot-blocker and rebounder, with limited offensive game.


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## MightyReds2020

> Originally posted by <b>ArtestFan</b>!
> 
> As for Tyson Chandler I think trading Richardson for him is a great idea. Sure his back is a big question mark, otherwise he wouldn't be on the trading block in the first place. The thing is, a talented young big man with no question marks, like Chris Bosh for example, will not UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES get traded for Jason Richardson. Now is the perfect time to trade for Chandler, I think his trade value is the lowest it will ever be in his career. He has great hustle and aggressiveness, is a great rebounder and shot-blocker and defender, any team would love to have this guy if he can stay healthy. When you're getting a guy who has that much potential and just losing a guy who you're better off without him anyway I think the trade is a no brainer.


I partly agreed with your logic here that since we have a capable replacement in Pietrus, getting a big-man in return for JRich is not a bad dea. I do think JRich, though has shown a lot of improvements in all areas this past season, is more closer to Ricky Davis then Paul Pierce. However, jury is still out that JRich could become the next Pierce, while the back-injury will forever haunt Tyson Chandler. Coupled with his incapable of making any progress on the offensive end, heck, we can just trade for Samuel Dalembert and he is much more cheaper if all we need is a capable shot-blocker/rebounder who has little offensive ability and is young.

Like I said, I won't mind a trade of JRich for Chandler if we get just a little bit more - like a Bulls early 2nd rounder and/or swaping Evan Eshmeyer with Jerome Williams. However, it won't suprised me if it is to happen since the bigman-small guy logic is always apply.


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## Knicksbiggestfan

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> 
> 
> You really feel Tyson Chandler is their most promising young player? Even removing the back problems from the picture, Eddie Curry is larger, has had more dominant games and has offensive upside that Chandler really doesn't appear to have. Both players have been inconsistant.
> 
> I think the "Curry = future Shaq," "Chandler = future Garnett" comparisons are gone for good, but I think Chandler is looking like shot-blocker and rebounder, with limited offensive game.


Curry isn't going to be a future shaq.

The mentality to dominate just isn't there.


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## MongolianDeathCloud

> Originally posted by <b>Knicksbiggestfan</b>!
> 
> 
> Curry isn't going to be a future shaq.
> 
> The mentality to dominate just isn't there.


Yeah, don't let the people on the Bulls board hear this but I think that Curry's really weak rebounding is a bad sign, and that Chandler just has more of a dominant attitude. 

And the injury concerns, I have a couple thoughts about them. 

First, I think Chicago's conditioning sucks donkey nards, I saw Chicago at GS in person and those guys look fatter and more out of shape then they do on TV. Crawford looked like a 16 year old boy out there.

Second, Duncan has had some injury plagued seasons, McGrady has the same back problems, Antawn has an injury prone season, Ray Allen was injured much of this season -- No one really worries about these guys though. The point is, you can have injuries and yet not be Vince Carter or Marcus Camby.

And last, this is as cheap as the guy will come. I'm all about buy low sell high, and I believe that every season in the future for Tyson will be better than this last one.


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## MongolianDeathCloud

> Originally posted by <b>MightyReds2020</b>!
> 
> . Coupled with his incapable of making any progress on the offensive end, heck, we can just trade for Samuel Dalembert and he is much more cheaper if all we need is a capable shot-blocker/rebounder who has little offensive ability and is young.


Hey I like Dalembert too, but I'm pretty sure he's harder to get then Chandler and might even be worth more -- he basically posted the numbers that people expected Chandler to post this season, uninjured, and he was the single positive thing about Philly's season.


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## HKF

> Originally posted by <b>MongolianDeathCloud</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah, don't let the people on the Bulls board hear this but I think that Curry's really weak rebounding is a bad sign, and that Chandler just has more of a dominant attitude.
> 
> And the injury concerns, I have a couple thoughts about them.
> 
> First, I think Chicago's conditioning sucks donkey nards, I saw Chicago at GS in person and those guys look fatter and more out of shape then they do on TV. Crawford looked like a 16 year old boy out there.
> 
> Second, Duncan has had some injury plagued seasons, McGrady has the same back problems, Antawn has an injury prone season, Ray Allen was injured much of this season -- No one really worries about these guys though. The point is, you can have injuries and yet not be Vince Carter or Marcus Camby.
> 
> And last, this is as cheap as the guy will come. I'm all about buy low sell high, and I believe that every season in the future for Tyson will be better than this last one.


We agree quite a bit here. The Chicago conditioning program is probably one of the worst in the NBA. Those guys are in very poor shape for basketball. I think if the Warriors can get Chandler they should. He is going to be a good Center in the NBA. He's not a PF and his type of game (grabbing off. boards and catching alley oops) would be very complementary to Troy Murphy.


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## Minstrel

> Originally posted by <b>Knicksbiggestfan</b>!
> 
> 
> Curry isn't going to be a future shaq.


Yes, that's what I said.


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## Knicksbiggestfan

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> 
> 
> Yes, that's what I said.


Yes, I agree.


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## RP McMurphy

Yes, I would definitely rather have Tyson Chandler or Kirk Hinrich than Eddy Curry or Jamal Crawford. I put a lot of stock in the theory that some guys are winners and some are losers. Here's how I rate the Bulls' prospects, from worst to bes.

Jamal Crawford - He is a tweener who has some problems at either guard position. He is a selfish, inefficient player. He can't play defense. These kinds of players never play major roles on winning teams. LOSER.

Eddy Curry - He doesn't even try to get rebounds. He only hustles during the last two months of the season in meaningless games, or (probably) when he's up for a contract extension. Who cares how big you are or how much offensive talent you have when you have the attitude of Benoit Benjamin or Michael Olowokandi. LOSER.

Ronald Dupree / Linton Johnson- These guys won't be in the NBA for long, but unlike Crawford and Curry, if they're on your team, at least they're cheap, and at least they hustle, and at least they're not cancers.

Kirk Hinrich - He won't ever be anything more than a solid point guard, but pass-first point guards are rare. This guy can finish around the basket, he's got good court vision, a decent shot, and plays good defense. A role player that any team would like to have. WINNER.

Tyson Chandler - He's going to be really good. He's 7 foot 1, a very aggressive rebounder and a great post defender who gets a ton of blocks, and he's very mobile. He'll never be a skilled offensive player, but if he stays healthy, I see him becoming a taller Ben Wallace. The injuries are a concern, but I'd rather have a guy who *might* be a dominant defender and rebounder and great team player than a guy who will *for sure* always be a loser. WINNER.

Give me Chandler over all the other Bulls prospects combined. Some team is going to steal him away from the Bulls this summer and before long the trade will look as bad as the Jalen Rose for Ron Artest and Brad Miller trade.


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## Hero

Non-Warriors fan, you guys want J-Rich out of Oakland because he lit your certain team up, or is it because you guys just jealous that he won a dunk contest over a player in your favorite team? Warriors fan, why do you guys still want J-Rich out of Oakland, even after a breakout season he still gets no respect. J-Rich is not a selfish player, you people who didn't watch 76 Warriors games featuring him this season know nothing of how he plays.

But you know whats funny? You guys want J-Rich out so bad, yet the team hasn't showed a slight sign of him getting traded. He even signed an extension, and said he want to remain a Warrior for long time. I doubt he's going anywhere this off-season.


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## HKF

Sorry I have NBA League Pass, I have seen plenty of Warrior games and I don't think he plays team ball. He is always trying to be a hero on the Warriors.


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## Knicksbiggestfan

> Originally posted by <b>Hero</b>!
> Non-Warriors fan, you guys want J-Rich out of Oakland because he lit your certain team up, or is it because you guys just jealous that he won a dunk contest over a player in your favorite team? Warriors fan, why do you guys still want J-Rich out of Oakland, even after a breakout season he still gets no respect. J-Rich is not a selfish player, you people who didn't watch 76 Warriors games featuring him this season know nothing of how he plays.
> 
> But you know whats funny? You guys want J-Rich out so bad, yet the team hasn't showed a slight sign of him getting traded. He even signed an extension, and said he want to remain a Warrior for long time. I doubt he's going anywhere this off-season.


Wow. Yeah wow that dunk that one time , gotta get him outta of the Warriors because ...

Jrich is incapable of playing defense and Teamball.

Those Pietrus jabs were thrown his way as well as a few other guys, and rightfully so.


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## MightyReds2020

> Originally posted by <b>Hero</b>!
> ...
> But you know whats funny? You guys want J-Rich out so bad, yet the team hasn't showed a slight sign of him getting traded. He even signed an extension, and said he want to remain a Warrior for long time. I doubt he's going anywhere this off-season.


JRich DID NOT sign no extensions. His contract runs through next season. In fact, He won't be eligible to sign an extension until a couple of months later.


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## MongolianDeathCloud

> Originally posted by <b>Hero</b>!
> Non-Warriors fan, you guys want J-Rich out of Oakland because he lit your certain team up, or is it because you guys just jealous that he won a dunk contest over a player in your favorite team? Warriors fan, why do you guys still want J-Rich out of Oakland, even after a breakout season he still gets no respect. J-Rich is not a selfish player, you people who didn't watch 76 Warriors games featuring him this season know nothing of how he plays.
> 
> But you know whats funny? You guys want J-Rich out so bad, yet the team hasn't showed a slight sign of him getting traded. He even signed an extension, and said he want to remain a Warrior for long time. I doubt he's going anywhere this off-season.


Dude, I live in the Bay Area, have seen J-Rich live plenty of times, and yes I do want J-Rich out of town because he lit up my team -- the Warriors that is. He can score but he has little impact in the big scheme of things -- he doesn't defend well, he doesn't create for others, he tunes out alot for portions of games, playing to the beat of his own drum rather than the game's .. he is just not a strong piece for a team like this. We need someone who brings more to the table than just scoring, guys like Pietrus and Dunleavy.

More importantly than his talent is the chemistry though -- I dunno what you're reading, but J-Rich has moaned plenty about the Warriors.

People around here, except for the kiddos I suppose, could care less about J-Rich. All my basketball friends barely ever utter a word about the Warriors' present and usually only talk about their future. No J-Rich jerseys around here. I'm saying this because I want to clue everyone else in that I really don't think he's much of a fan-fav around here. Just kind of a "all-we-got" sort of thing.


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## Hero

> Originally posted by <b>MightyReds2020</b>!
> 
> 
> JRich DID NOT sign no extensions. His contract runs through next season. In fact, He won't be eligible to sign an extension until a couple of months later.


Actually he did, he signed a one-year extension along with Troy Murphy early last season. I would get the article for you, but my virus-infected PC is running _very_ slowly right now, it will take forever to get to the team's site...

I see you guys have a diffrent view from me, that's fine. You guys can b**** and b**** about J-Rich not being a team player (not true) or he has no skills (also not true), and that's fine too. This man took over the go-to-guy role after the dismissal of Tawn and Arenas, the previous leading scorers, and became the leader of the team. He carried the Warriors on his back and won many games for them, namely the game-winning 3-ball as the time expired at Minnesota, and the LeBron deul at Cleveland. He improved his handling, passing, and rebounding last season, and it showed. It sucks that you people blame him for everything.

And Mangolian, which part of the Bay Area do you live? No J-Rich jerseys? Everyone who's a Warrior fan sports it over here where I am.


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## MongolianDeathCloud

I live in the Northbay. J-Rich jerseys are just not any more common than any other jerseys.

For example, I'm taking a basketball course at college this semester (actually just wrapped up), and off the top of my head, there's a guy with a Jason Williams Kings jersey and a Webber Bullets jersey, a guy with Ben Wallace Pistons jersey, a guy with a NJ Kidd jersey, a guy that wore just a crapload of Lakers gear, a guy with a Dunleavey jersey, a guy with a L. Odom Clippers jersey, and I have a Vlade Kings jersey and a Ben Wallace Pistons Jersey. There WAS a guy that had a white J-Rich jersey but he dropped, and there's a kid next door that has a basketball hoop and he sports a J-Rich jersey and a T-Mac jersey.

Not exaclty empirical evidence, just my experience. And at games, you're more likely to see Lakers jerseys or Bulls jersey etc. depending on who they're playing. It might have to due with the fact that Arenas was alot more popular last season, and Jamison was pretty popular a couple seasons ago.

Anyways, to address your comments of J-Rich improving and developing his game (I think you even said he had a "breakout" season) --- it must have gone widely unnoticed. Check out the breakdown of most improved votes:

Player, Team 1st 2nd 3rd Pts 
Zach Randolph, Portland 59 21 21 379 
Carlos Boozer, Cleveland 12 30 16 166 
James Posey, Memphis 17 14 10 137 
Andrei Kirilenko, Utah 11 12 10 101 
Michael Redd, Milwaukee 9 12 14 95 
Lamar Odom, Miami 1 8 2 31 
Jamaal Magloire, New Orleans 3 3 2 21 
Samuel Dalembert, Phi. 3 2 4 25 
Joe Johnson, Phoenix 1 4 3 20 
Brian Cardinal, Golden State 1 3 4 18 
Rafer Alston, Miami 2 1 3 16 
Mark Blount, Boston 0 3 1 10 
Carlos Arroyo, Utah 0 1 5 8 
Quentin Richardson, Clippers 1 1 0 8 
Ronald Murray, Seattle 0 1 4 7 
Ron Artest, Indiana 1 0 2 7 
Yao Ming, Houston 0 1 4 7 
Erick Dampier,Golden State 0 1 2 5 
Richard Jefferson, New Jersey 0 0 4 4 
Corey Maggette, L.A. Clippers 0 1 0 3 
Mike Dunleavy, Golden State 0 1 0 3 
Manu Ginobili, San Antonio 0 1 0 3 
Tayshaun Prince, Detroit 0 0 2 2 
Jason Williams, Memphis 0 0 1 1 
Stephen Jackson, Atlanta 0 0 1 1 
Pau Gasol, Memphis 0 0 1 1 
Marcus Camby, Denver 0 0 1 1 
Desmond Mason, Milwaukee 0 0 1 1 
Kenny Thomas, Philadelphia 0 0 1 1 
Raja Bell, Utah 0 0 1 1 
Nenê, Denver 0 0 1 1


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## pr0wler

You guys are making Richardson out as to be a bad player when he's really not. He has a good +/- ratio, saying that when he's in the game his team does pretty well. When he's not in the game, they aren't as scary.

Mike Dunleavy is the one who can't play defense. When he's in the game, they average 91.6 points per game over 48 minutes. Not bad. However, when he's on the floor, the opponents average 94.8 points per 48. That's 2nd worst on the team next to Nick Van Exel. Unless Mike learns how to play some defense (his offensive game looks very promising) he will never become very useful. 

http://www.82games.com/0304GSW.HTM
http://www.82games.com/0304GSW1.HTM

Thats how you base your playing time on. Speedy Claxton is a great point guard. Cardinal is a great small forward. Pietrus is an amazing shooting guard. 

As great as a player may be, if he isn't doing the little things to help out your team then their talent is wasted. As long as your team is winning the numbers game while a certain player is in, that's all you can ask for.


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## MongolianDeathCloud

Well you might not be familiar with the Warriors depth chart end of season, but because of injuries they had Mike Dunleavey at the point often. This line-up creates bad matchups on both ends, obviously, and I think should be taken into account when looking at Dunleavey's season effect on D (as well as his injured games where he played pretty weak). 

Besides, his on-the court defensive point stats are not that much higher than others, and I wouldn't look too deeply into this stat as far as analyzing individual players (as opposed to five-man squads) --- Look at Clifford Robinsons deffence, he's widely considered as one of the best post defenders in the league and yet he rates low here.

Another factor is that Cheaney played out of his mind at the beginning of the season and Dunleavey is directly being compared to him with +/- stats.

Anyways, I think all this is besides the point -- look at Pietrus +/-!


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## pr0wler

Ya I am familiar with their late season rotation. I did see Dunleavy at the point, and he looked good. He dribbles the ball well, has decent athleticism. Most of all, he PLAYS like a great player. You can just see it when he plays that hes going to be good, and its only a matter of time. That's why I would give him the benefit of the doubt in terms of +/- ratios and the such.

Richardson however, just doesn't impress me all that much. he's not a bad player, but I think that Pietrus is a lot better alrdy at his young age. His defense is incredible, shown by his 89 opponents points avg, and great +/- ratio. Cardinal has a great +/- ratio as well, he should be on the court more often.


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## Hero

> Originally posted by <b>MongolianDeathCloud</b>!
> Well you might not be familiar with the Warriors depth chart end of season, but because of injuries they had Mike Dunleavey at the point often. This line-up creates bad matchups on both ends, obviously, and I think should be taken into account when looking at Dunleavey's season effect on D (as well as his injured games where he played pretty weak).
> 
> Besides, his on-the court defensive point stats are not that much higher than others, and I wouldn't look too deeply into this stat as far as analyzing individual players (as opposed to five-man squads) --- Look at Clifford Robinsons deffence, he's widely considered as one of the best post defenders in the league and yet he rates low here.
> 
> Another factor is that Cheaney played out of his mind at the beginning of the season and Dunleavey is directly being compared to him with +/- stats.
> 
> Anyways, I think all this is besides the point -- look at Pietrus +/-!


:laugh: 

I guess you're not familiar with the Warriors depth chart end of season too, because White Mike played PG on OFFENSE, while Pietrus defend the opposing team's point guard on DEFENSE. So Dunleavy's lack of defense had nothing to do with because of defending smaller guards, because he actually defended players his position for most of the time.

Also, he wasn't the only player to play out of position at PG because Speedy went down, J-Rich handled the ball too, and raised his assist numbers dramatically in the final month.


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## ssmokinjoe

> Originally posted by <b>MongolianDeathCloud</b>!
> Anyways, to address your comments of J-Rich improving and developing his game (I think you even said he had a "breakout" season) --- it must have gone widely unnoticed. Check out the breakdown of most improved votes:


No. It certainly did not go unnoticed. It was well-known that J-Rich went to great lengths to improve his game in the previous off-season. There are articles out there, i just dont feel like digging them up right now. He worked with various personnel to improve his footwork and ball handling skills... and if you payed attention this season, it really showed. His point production went up, his rebounding went way up, and his attitude went up too. The man works on his game and gets better season by season. He may not get into the running for MIP votes, but that isn't the only measure for success in improving your game.

Pietrus seems to have wowed this crowd so much in such a short period of time that they're ready to boot J-rich completely off the team for him. Take it easy fellas, that's the kind of decision that Warriors fans have cursed past GMs for far too many times.


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## MightyReds2020

> Originally posted by <b>Hero</b>!
> 
> 
> Actually he did, he signed a one-year extension along with Troy Murphy early last season. I would get the article for you, but my virus-infected PC is running _very_ slowly right now, it will take forever to get to the team's site...


Technically you are wrong. JRich and Troy Murphy are still under rookie contracts. Their contract next year are actually referred to as 'Team Options' - the team has the right to pick up/decline this option. Players have no right to decide if they want to have this option picked/declined. Of course, the Warriors picked up these options last summer, which was a no-brainer. JRich's and Troy Murphy's 'real' extension negotiations will come in this summer. To break it down, here's how 'rookie contract' looks like for first-round picks under current CBA:

1st year: guaranteed
2nd year: guaranteed
3rd year: guaranteed
4th year: Team Option
5th year: Qualifying Offer (Only if there's no extension already in-place and the 4th-year TO is picked up)


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## CMC

The Warriors have to decide between Jrich and Dunleavy, because you can't have 2 poor defenders at the 2/3 in the NBA and be a winning team.

Personally, I'd much rather keep Dunleavy than Jrich seeing as Dunleavy is a much better fit with the current core of the team.

However, if the W's are deadset on keeping both Dunleavy and Jrich, they need to draft a pg like Devin Harris or Ben Gordon at 11 and just pray they have enough offense at the 1-2-3 to wear other team's down.

And they'd need a Ben Wallace/Theo Ratliff level shot blocker at the 4 or 5 to make up for that horrible perimeter defense.


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## rocketman04

awful post. 
not sure if chandler's back can take much more
we will see
if he gave you
4blks and 12 rebs a game like his a capable of its a good trade
but to damn risky to do now


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## sheefo13

i see no reason to send jrich away.....He just needs more around him, expiernence. 

if they do trade him to the bls, tyson chandler and crawford would be the best deal.


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## Ballscientist

*Trade our best players*

Option 1 - get superstar

J-rich and Dunleavy will be stars (maybe future of the NBA) if they play in other teams. We should trade them for a superstar, like Kobe, Yao or T-Mac.
(pack with xx to make the deal)

Option 2 - Save the money for the future)

trade J-rich for #3 (Bulls need 3 guard)
trade Dunleavy for #2 (Clips need a future star to carry them to the P)
trade Murphy for #1 (magic need impact player)


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## SPIN DOCTOR

> Originally posted by <b>sheefo13</b>!
> i see no reason to send jrich away.....He just needs more around him, expiernence.
> 
> if they do trade him to the bls, tyson chandler and crawford would be the best deal.


Ahem... 

Would you like the Bulls to throw in Heinrich too? 

I guess it is percieved to be rape and pillage time in Chicago, that must be the only explanation. Tyson Chandler injured his back diving headfirst into the 4th row, it was tweaked when he tried to come back too fast. Whoever referenced "chronic or re-occurring issues", is mis-informed. At the time of the injury, he was easily the best player on the Bulls, averaging 15.5 pts + 14 bds per game. Now he is only worth 1/2 of a JR? 

That my friends is redickourous!

Quality Centers are the single most difficult position to find/draft/acquire/trade for in the NBA today. If you think that they are easy to find, just look at the good teams that have spent years trying to replace one unsucessfully.

If I were the Bulls I would not even consider the original deal unless it was improved noticeably. But Paxon is a rookie GM so give it your best shot!


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## The_Franchise

What can J-Rich do that most other guards can't? 360 windmill dunks off the backboard. He isn't a special basketball player, guards like Richardson are going to come out of high school at a frightening pace. Trading him for Chandler would be a great deal for GS, but the Bulls aren't going to give TC away for a SG. I think Richardson will be shopped over the summer, the Warriors will look to bring in a big man to fill the gap Dampier will leave. Or they could send him to a team like Atlanta for future draft picks. 

What about a sign and trade deal with Boston, re-signed Mark Blount, Michael Stewart and a 2005 first rounder for Richardson and Cliff Robinson. Blount and Murphy are a post tandem with a lot of potential, and a backcourt of NVE, Pietrus and Dunleavy will do for now.


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