# Player Comparisons, busts, steals and other thoughts



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

Random thoughts, add your player comparisons, opinions...

BUT before the comparisons

I would like to hand out some awards

BUST OF THE DRAFT- Lampe, not even a top player in europe, hype will get him drafted high. I think some stupid team will draft him, like the Knicks
TJ Ford is way overrated in my opinion. I have a feeling 4 PGs drafted after him may be better.


STEAL of the Draft- Highschoolers in general, except for Villanueva. This means Outlaw, Lang, and Perkins. Add banks if he drops to 2nd round. Barbosa if he falls out of top 12



LeBron James- Magic w/ athleticism of Kobe, less devoted to game, just naturally skilled, which may end up a negative in his career. Can play anywhere from the 1 to the 3 offensively. Defensively should stick to guarding SG and SF's 
Darko Milicic- Garnett with less strength, a lot weaker in defensively ability, more agressive scorer than Garnett however, probably better offensively 
Carmelo Anthony- Paul Pierce 
Chris Bosh-Garnett with less range. Even weaker than Milicic. No upper body strength. Freakishly athletic. If Melo is a consolation prize for someone who can't get lebron, than Bosh is a consolation prize for someone who can't get Milicic 
Chris Caman-A cross between Big Z and Olowakandi 
Barbosa-A shorter Ginobli, Gary Payton minus low post scoring 
TJ Ford- A more diciplined Jay Williams (the dukie), runs half court game better, less talented scorer than Willams however 
Lampe- People are calling him Dirk 2, but I hesitate to say that because I don't think he'll be close... Like Dirk he can't defend and can dribble well and shoot well for a big man. Unlike Dirk he can't rebound... 
Mike Sweetney-Elton Brand, straight up 
Hinrich- No camparison available. Has great range and accuracy, solid defender, can rebound well, unselfish. 
Sofoklis Schortsanitis- Eddy Curry with less refined offensive moves. Probably 6'8 in real height. Less finese than Curry, but tougher, a pounder inside, ala Brand. Defensively he is nothing like curry in that he is agressive, will end a solid shotblocker. 
Luke Ridnour-Somewhere between Jay williams(of Grizzles) and John Stockton. Will NOT be a star PG, may be solid. Better decision making than williams, but a lot lower. Probably will be picked too high, more so they he should be. 
Travis Outlaw- May be the best athelete in THE DRAFT, that's impressive when your in the same draft as lebron, milicic, and bosh. A small foward with blazing quickness. Darius Miles but faster, jumps higher. Has raw fundamentals that need to be worked on. Can be a steal if he is properly developed. 
Reece Gaines- Jimmy Jackson (younger version, when he was with the Mavs)


----------



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

One more award.

Play that Should not be drafted but will be- Dahntay Jones


----------



## TMOD (Oct 12, 2002)

Darko is one skinny mofo alright!








Looks pretty big to me...and not that bad on defense, either.

Also...with Lampe...what are you talking about?!? He has been 18 for less than a month...'not a top player in Europe'...no kidding, but he has had some huge games (even if he is 2nd team).

Also, why won't Villanueva be a steal if the others will be?
Sweetney is hardly Elton Brand, a lot closer to like Robert Traylor, but he'll be better.

Finally, James is closer to McGrady (at this point), at least in my opinion. Why shouldn't Jones get a second round look?


----------



## ATLien (Jun 18, 2002)

Jarvis Hayes in the late teens would be a huge steal
Anderson Varejão = bust


----------



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

"Darko is one skinny mofo alright!"

Please read what I wrote before you comment "Garnett with less strength, a lot weaker in defensively ability"

I never said he was skinny, I said he was weaker, and he is. Defensively I think he can posted up, not necessary horrible, but he's no Garnett who can shut down anywhere any position from 2 to 4.

Villanueva seems soft from the few times I've seen him. I don't think you are a steal unless you overperfrom or are drafted lower than you should be. I think Perkins and Lang will overperfrom where they will be drafted. They'lll score more and have high value, being large players who have low post scoring potential.

There is nothing distinctive about Villanueva that shows me he will be anything more than a solid bench player brought in for offensive reasons.


----------



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

As for Jones, he has absolutely no shooting touch, and if your a PG who has shooting touch you better be an amazing passer, which Jones isn't. He isn't athletic enough to justify drafting him based on atheleticism either. Out of the player to be draft in the mid to late to second round he'll probably end up in Europe, NBDL, or a bench warmer... Plus this is a deep draft, so a lot more talented players are available


----------



## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

forgot about him, i agree Varejão will be a bust


----------



## TMOD (Oct 12, 2002)

Garnett is not strong, and it has nothing to do with his defense either. People can back him down, it is shooting over him that become a problem, and Milicic is damn long and athletic himself, too. If they can't go over Kevin, they're stuck because he is quick, too. I bet Darko could back Garnett down, but Kevin could only use his fall-away on Darko, or out-maneuver him. I wouldn't say Darko is weaker by any means.

Also, everything you said about Villanueva has been used at one time or another about the other highschoolers...

Also, since when did the 6'6 215 pounds dunking machine Dahntay Jones become a pg, lol.


----------



## MadFace (Jul 12, 2002)

*Darko is going to get stronger*

especially when he gets here and gets under the wing of Arnie Kander The Pistons strength and conditioning coach


----------



## Brady00 (May 16, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>KennethTo</b>!
> 
> TJ Ford is way overrated in my opinion. I have a feeling 4 PGs drafted after him may be better.


Finally another person with some common sense, I see the next Travis Best


----------



## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

I really like these assessments. Good job. Yeah, I'd say Garnett could overpower Darko; Garnett hits the weightroom hard in the summer, and plus Darko's 17!!! I just don't see Heinrich being that great either, he's a scrapper, but I just don't see him ever starting for a full season, or playing for 30 minutes a night. I think Barbosa might end up being the best PG in the draft.

Agree with Villanueva. He's strong and can dunk, but there aren't many more things he can do. There's a long list of "cannots" though, and he'll be an NBDLer. I think Lebron will be the only high schooler taken in the first round with the possible exception of Ebi, but that most of the top ones will make their team that takes them in the 2nd round.


----------



## LuCane (Dec 9, 2002)

No offense, you may have made the post of the year, but it sure is hard to give you true credibility when you speak of D. Jones.

Why?

It sounds like youve never seen him play at all, which means you dont watch much NCAA basketball, considering he plays for the TV friendly Blue Devils. If you have seen play, however, then your credibility TRULY is shot because:

1) He is not a PG, not even close, lol.
2) You are actually serious when you speak of him lacking athleticism, when in fact, its his best attribute.

Just my opinion man.


----------



## secretconvict (May 20, 2003)

bosh is garnett with less range? lol. your talking not talking about the same bosh who shot 45% from the land of plenty r u?


----------



## Brady00 (May 16, 2003)

Hayes, no matter where he is drafted, will be a steal.


----------



## GerBullsFan9 (Apr 12, 2003)

garnett stronger than milicic?maybe right now,but not by much,look at milicic's arms and remember KG at this stage,he's still skinny but back then he was :bender:


----------



## Oosh (May 16, 2003)

> Finally another person with some common sense, I see the next Travis Best


What are you serious? 

They are completley different players. 

Travis best is a shooting PG and TJ Ford is a passing PG.

Thats the complete opposite in my book?


----------



## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

I'm not sure who agrees with me, but i have a feeling that bron's game as a pro is going to be very similiar to Baron Davis. There both strong physical point guards, who although being scores will still rack up the assists.


----------



## Chef (Nov 24, 2002)

> BUST OF THE DRAFT- Lampe, not even a top player in europe, hype will get him drafted high. I think some stupid team will draft him, like the Knicks


When Dirk was drafted he was playing in the German 2nd division, and it's a lot worse than the Spanish second division where Lampe is playing. Also Lampe is not a bad rebounder but he prefers to play outside and he has superb rebounder in his team.

And you say the steals of the draft are gonna be the high-schoolers who have only proven that they can jump high...


----------



## Bball_Doctor (Dec 29, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>KennethTo</b>!
> Random thoughts, add your player comparisons, opinions...
> 
> BUT before the comparisons
> ...


Lebron is very naturally skilled...who are you comparing his natural skill to? Kobe or Magic. If you are comparing to Kobe at the same age and stage Lebron is MUCH more naturally skilled...physically and mentally. Lebron is a better athlete and he has better feeling for the game than Kobe in HS. Kobe was only all about scoring in HS. If you are comparing to Magic...Lebron is more gifted physically. Mentally...Magic a supremem edge but that is becuz I am comparing a HS player to a pro. I don't know how they are at the same age. I will say this Lebron has that great touch for passing and dribbling like Magic BUT don't expect Magic-like assists numbers. Why? Magic LOVED to pass...Lebron LOVES to pass but more importantly he also LOVES to score.

I agree with your Darko assessment. I have compared Darko to a less athletic C Webb or a more versatile and athletic Raef LaFrentz.

TJ and Jay are different players. The way they play are not similar. Ford is more aggresive.

Your Sofo comparison is good...I have said that he is Curry without the finess.

Luke and "white chocolate" are actually quite different. Luke is a much better offensive player and dribbler. Jason was always all about the 'fancy'. Luke is not. Comparing Luke is hard....but his shooting and play reminds me of Nash. He is a Nash with better dribbles.

Travis Outlaw is very good but some people are overhyping him now. He wasn't very dominant in HS but he is extremly good. Is he the best athlete? He can jump but athletically I think Lebron is better IMO. But I definitely agree that he can be the STEAL of the draft. He has to work on his condition and shot though. He is actually not as good as Miles was in HS. If you were to compare Outlaw and Miles while they were in HS...Miles was a better pick but Miles has not improved. Outlaw is the most probable steal but also the biggest gamble in the first round.

Gaines...I have always compared Gaines to Steve Smith....that is a Smith with the Heat or in college where he played PG not now. Gaines athletically is nowhere near Jimmy Jackson especially before the injuries. Jackson is a gym freak and his physique shows that. He used to ATTACK the basket before his injuries. Gaines is also a better shooter than Jackson. I think that Steve Smith is the closest comparison to Gaines becuz Smith was a 6'6 player who was mid athletic and could shoot and had the ability to play PG or SG. The only thing I see the same about Gaines and Jackson is that they have the ability to play 1 or 2. Skillwise they are very different becuz they rely on different strengths.

All in all I pretty much agree with everything else you said.


----------



## Bball_Doctor (Dec 29, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chef</b>!
> 
> 
> When Dirk was drafted he was playing in the German 2nd division, and it's a lot worse than the Spanish second division where Lampe is playing. Also Lampe is not a bad rebounder but he prefers to play outside and he has superb rebounder in his team.
> ...


This is true. Can someone post Lampe's stats with Real Madrid. Dirk had amazing stats in Germany...23 ppg 11 rpg or somewhere near there. He also really impressed people when he came to US and played in games before the draft.


----------



## thegza (Feb 18, 2003)

Carmelo Anthony's going to be better then Paul Pierce; that's my thought for this thread.


----------



## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

MY random thoughts...

Reece Gaines will slip into the second round. Every team loves big PG's, but he is too mediocre in all aspects to be a first rounder. 

Chris Thomas will be a steal in the 2nd round, I've seen him play at Notre Dame and besides his small build he has looked impressive to me. 

Varejao, so much speculation about this kid not caring about the NBA. HE'S BARELY 17! What does he know, he'll come to his senses soon, or his agent will knock some sense into him, if he can slip past the 15th pick that would be a steal.

Carlos Delfino looks solid. Expect him, like many other foreigners, to be left overseas for a year or 2.


----------



## Nimreitz (May 13, 2003)

I think Reece Gaines is a lot like Steve Logan, but with 6 more inches. I don't believe Steve Logan slipped into the second round, so I really don't think Gaines will.


----------



## MixMatched (May 1, 2003)

Bball Doctor, on your comments about Travis Outlaw not being dominant in HS, are you talking about stats or just his game in general? Just curious if you think him playing out of position has anything to do with it? Correct me if I am wrong, he played center over 90% of the time, right?







P.S. Don't laugh. I'm just learning the game. So if I sound as if I do not know what I'm talking about...it's because I probably don't. :grinning: I've always been a huge SEC fan.....and in the recent years I've been suckered into HS ball. Now I'm hooked!


----------



## Bball_Doctor (Dec 29, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>MixMatched</b>!
> Bball Doctor, on your comments about Travis Outlaw not being dominant in HS, are you talking about stats or just his game in general? Just curious if you think him playing out of position has anything to do with it? Correct me if I am wrong, he played center over 90% of the time, right?
> 
> 
> ...


In HS Outlaw can get away with playing C as most guys who are 6'5 and above. From what I have seen Outlaw has been a very good HS player but doesn't derserve the title "dominant". Perkins is more dominant but Outlaw is a better player. It doesn't really have anything to do with stats...Melo only averaged 21.7 ppg in HS senior year but he was very dominant. Outlaw's stats in HS were 25 ppg and 10 rpg, and 6 bpg. It is certainly dominant as far as stats are but he just never seemed "dominant" to me IMO and you see that in several HS allstar games like McD. There is no question that is a great prospect. I don't think playing out of position makes him less dominant becuz in HS like I said many players who are 6'5 and over play C. Also...YES he played C a lot...I don't know if it was 90% but majority of his starts.


----------



## Bball_Doctor (Dec 29, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Bball_Doctor</b>!
> 
> 
> In HS Outlaw can get away with playing C as most guys who are 6'5 and above. From what I have seen Outlaw has been a very good HS player but doesn't derserve the title "dominant". Perkins is more dominant but Outlaw is a better player. It doesn't really have anything to do with stats...Melo only averaged 21.7 ppg in HS senior year but he was very dominant. Outlaw's stats in HS were 25 ppg and 10 rpg, and 6 bpg. It is certainly dominant as far as stats are but he just never seemed "dominant" to me IMO and you see that in several HS allstar games like McD. There is no question that is a great prospect. I don't think playing out of position makes him less dominant becuz in HS like I said many players who are 6'5 and over play C. Also...YES he played C a lot...I don't know if it was 90% but majority of his starts.


----------



## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>NorthSideHatrik</b>!
> I'm not sure who agrees with me, but i have a feeling that bron's game as a pro is going to be very similiar to Baron Davis. There both strong physical point guards, who although being scores will still rack up the assists.


that seems like a reasonable comparison. baron is the better shooter and lebron has the height. i expect lebron to be the better player of course...kobe seems like the natural comparison now that his distribution of the basketball has improved.


----------



## Chef (Nov 24, 2002)

*Lampe stats with Complutense (his team)* 

23 games played

33 mpg

19.1 ppg .510 FG% 0.443 3P% 0.800 FT%

7.8 rpg

1 apg
1 spg

0.6 bpg

2 TO

*Playoff stats* 

8 games played

21 ppg

8.75 rpg


Plus he leaded his team without much help to playoff semifinals. When he arrived to Complutense his team was the FOURTH WORST TEAM of the spanish second division with a 5-10 record. With him they finished with a 16-14 record (11-4 record since he entered the team).


----------



## MixMatched (May 1, 2003)

Thanks Bball Doctor.


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

I like what I have read about Lampe. He can shoot but the guy is very big. I mean is 7'0" 240lbs. He is a big boy to be playing small forward. I expect him to be a jump shooting power forward/small forward match-up nightmare for some teams. He is 18 but the only thing I am scared of is he gets down on himself if he plays poorly and gets high on himself if plays well. He needs to temper his enthusiasm if he is to make it thru his first 2 years, but I think he will be a superstar player in this league.


----------



## pizzoni (Mar 27, 2003)

*Varejão*



> Varejao, so much speculation about this kid not caring about the NBA. HE'S BARELY 17! What does he know, he'll come to his senses soon, or his agent will knock some sense into him, if he can slip past the 15th pick that would be a steal.


Actually, Varejão is 21, cuz he was born in 82 like countryman Nene.

But, I thik people are being to harsh on him, I can´t undertand why he was a lottery pick a few weeks ago and now He is a late first round.

He would be picked in the 1st round last year by San Antonio before the Spurs make a trade for Claxton.

And the Spurs LOVE him, If he is available whe they choose, he won´t´pass by them. I would be really happy If this happen.

But, I (I´m from brazil by the way) heard a interview of him, saying that He would like to be drafted and be able to play next year in Barcelona.

Barcelona already had say that they would really like him to come back. His coach, who was the yugo coach in the last WC, also like him alot. and Bodiroga said that Varejão was one of the better players he saw in his age.

And last, For a brazilian who grown up in a country where soccer is almost a religium, Be playing for Barcelona, which is one of the top 3 clubs in the world, is reallly important.

Pizzoni


----------



## Bball_Doctor (Dec 29, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chef</b>!
> *Lampe stats with Complutense (his team)*
> 
> 23 games played
> ...


Thank you VERY much for the stats. :yes:


----------

