# Kobe Sneezes



## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

and also manages to put in 45 in a gutsy win over Indy...

Odom knocked in a big 3 (finally)

only putting this in General forum cuz it's history...

1st player since Wilt in 1964 to score 4 45 pt or more games... it's amazing to think of all the players that have been great in the past over 40 years to never have done this...


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

OK, so since we know how smoothly Kobe threads go in the General forum (*sarcasm*), how about we keep this one clean? No baiting, no name calling, and everyone stays happy? Good.


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

Since Kobe is back..
47.6 PPG
9.3 RPG
5.0 APG
.490 FG % (50/102)
.571 3PT % (16/28)
.771 FT% (27/35)

3 Wins (PHI, LAC, IND)
0 Losses

But.. I'm gonna say this right now.. Horrible free throw shooting.. He only gets 5 assists a game in this streak.. He shoots the ball 34 times a game.. and jacks up 9 3's a game in this streak..


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## DuMa (Dec 25, 2004)

if only artest had played


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## ChiBron (Jun 24, 2002)

Like you wouldn't have created a topic had he just sneezed 

Streak's impressive, although I'm sure he's also set the record for most shot attempts during this 4 game stretch and his FG% was quite weak barring 1 game.


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

"LOS ANGELES (AP) -- Kobe Bryant scored 45 points, making him the first player to score at least that many in four consecutive games in more than 41 years, and the Los Angeles Lakers beat the Indiana Pacers 96-90 Monday night for their third straight victory.

The last player to score at least 45 or more points in four consecutive games was Wilt Chamberlain in November 1964, according to the Elias Sports Bureau. "


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

Best Player in the League. 100% real talk.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

SPMJ said:


> Like you wouldn't have created a topic had he just sneezed
> 
> Streak's impressive, although I'm sure he's also set the record for most shot attempts during this 4 game stretch and his FG% was quite weak barring 1 game.


tonite however despite being apparently tired (if u didnt watch just look at the freethrows) and not really shooting particulary well he managed to get to the hole and finish with a "not-so-bad" FG%


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## onelakerfan (Nov 11, 2004)

DuMa said:


> if only artest had played



for LAKERS, WHoaaaaaaa, WHoaaaaa, WHoaaaaa


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

The MAMBA said:


> Best Player in the League. 100% real talk.


look i agree... but posts like that without somethin to back it up bring the haters out...


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

onelakerfan said:


> for LAKERS, WHoaaaaaaa, WHoaaaaa, WHoaaaaa


i wish they would do it... i honestly would be willing to give up Odom... i like him, but artest is just vicious


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## IbizaXL (Sep 21, 2005)

good for him....yet another individual acolade he has earned


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

I would trade Odom for Artest, and add a good rebounding power forward...and you have the late 90's Bulls.

PG Ron Harper / Smush Parker
SG Money / Izzo
SF Pip / Artest
PF Rodman /
C Longely / Mihm


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

gio30584 said:


> good for him....yet another individual acolade he has earned


To go along with those three glossy championship rings....pretty much rounds out his career. :biggrin:


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

The MAMBA = Annoying..

Kobe = Annoying..

But Kobe means more to the Lakers than The Mamba means to this board..


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## essaywhuman (Aug 10, 2005)

The MAMBA said:


> I would trade Odom for Artest, and add a good rebounding power forward...and you have the late 90's Bulls.
> 
> PG Ron Harper / Smush Parker
> SG Money / Izzo
> ...


I see where you're going, but everybody in that Bull's starting 5 was better than their Laker "counterparts."


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

*don't start*


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

shobe42 said:


> look i agree... but posts like that without somethin to back it up bring the haters out...


I don't need to. You would have to be a blind idiot not to see the case that is being presented for me, BY Kobe himself, lol. He sits...Lakers lose bad. He's in, he torches people for 40+ being the only fixation for the defense and they beat some pretty good teams.


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## ChiBron (Jun 24, 2002)

shobe42 said:


> tonite however despite being apparently tired (if u didnt watch just look at the freethrows) and not really shooting particulary well he managed to get to the hole and finish with a "not-so-bad" FG%


Oh I did watch, especially the part where he just ran into defenders and kept getting bailed out by the refs . He must've also been more tired in those other 2 games where he shot even worse then tonight.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

mang said:


> I see where you're going, but everybody in that Bull's starting 5 was better than their Laker "counterparts."


word, cant compare Smush to Harper. Harper was the initiator in the triangle in the Laker days.


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## King Sancho Fantastic (Jul 19, 2005)

I think i saw Kobe pass the rock like 10 times to wide open teammates out of double and triple teams and they miss the shot! He should have had a triple double if the other players had hit their shots. :curse:


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

mang said:


> I see where you're going, but everybody in that Bull's starting 5 was better than their Laker "counterparts."


I agree. Except I think Mihm is better than Longely, and that Smush is a more capapable offensive player than Ron Harper, but even though Smush has D it isn't at Ron's level. I was just making a comparison...not saying that the team would actually be AS successful or as good. Just similar styles and players.


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

SPMJ said:


> Oh I did watch, especially the part where he just ran into defenders and kept getting bailed out by the refs . He must've also been more tired in those other 2 games where he shot even worse then tonight.


blah blah blah :banana:


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## steadyeddy (Jan 2, 2003)

SPMJ said:


> Like you wouldn't have created a topic had he just sneezed
> 
> Streak's impressive, although I'm sure he's also set the record for most shot attempts during this 4 game stretch and his FG% was quite weak barring 1 game.




Why must you always qualify any shred of praise or acknowledgement you give Bryant? Why not just stay silent if that's all you can do?


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

SPMJ said:


> Oh I did watch, especially the part where he just ran into defenders and kept getting bailed out by the refs . He must've also been more tired in those other 2 games where he shot even worse then tonight.


wheeeeeeww (long breathe) 1...2...3... 3...2...1... (long breathe) haha

Mamba try that...

isn't Kobe shooting 50% since his return... i dont know what he shot in the 1st 45 pt game before the suspension... how many boards is he averaging?


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

steadyeddy said:


> Why must you always qualify any shred of praise or acknowledgement you give Bryant? Why not just stay silent if that's all you can do?


i think a good amt of that is sarcasm... though im not sure


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

Harper is probably still better than Smush even at his age. We don't hold a torch to the 90's Bulls teams, even with Artest. Big congrats to Kobe for another great performance tonight and most importantly, a win against a very solid team from the East. We're not so bad I guess. Even during the losing streak, we played very competitively. This team is overacheiving, which is a major testament to Phil Jackson. He's proving his true worth thus far. I hope it continues.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

The MAMBA said:


> I agree. Except I think Mihm is better than Longely, and that Smush is a more capapable offensive player than Ron Harper, but even though Smush has D it isn't at Ron's level. I was just making a comparison...not saying that the team would actually be AS successful or as good. Just similar styles and players.


ha did u ever see Harp b4 his Bulls days... boy was a scorer


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

shobe42 said:


> ha did u ever see Harp b4 his Bulls days... boy was a scorer


Before his Bulls days of course, and yes I did watch while he was on the Cavs and Clips. He lost that athleticism when he came to the Bulls though and at times was a severely lack luster scoring option. Smush has the capability of being a way better offensive threat.


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## essaywhuman (Aug 10, 2005)

Bartholomew Hunt said:


> Harper is probably still better than Smush even at his age. We don't hold a torch to the 90's Bulls teams, even with Artest. Big congrats to Kobe for another great performance tonight and most importantly, a win against a very solid team from the East. We're not so bad I guess. Even during the losing streak, we played very competitively. *This team is overacheiving, which is a major testament to Phil Jackson. He's proving his true worth thus far.* I hope it continues.


[Marv Albert]YES![/Marv]

I'll be honest, before this season, I was a bit skeptical about Phil's value as a coach even after those 9 championships. The year where we brought in GP and Karl Malone just made me wonder why he couldn't run a system that would have fit the team's strengths better, but Phil has turned me into a believer. I was young and foolish, but now I have seen the light!


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## KDOS (Nov 29, 2005)

shobe42 said:


> ha did u ever see Harp b4 his Bulls days... boy was a scorer


LMAO..HArper was never a score in the BUlls. Last time he was a consistent scoring machine was when he was on Cleveland as a Cavalier.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

The MAMBA said:


> Before his Bulls days of course, and yes I did watch while he was on the Cavs and Clips. He lost that athleticism when he came to the Bulls though and at times was a severely lack luster scoring option. Smush has the capability of being a way better offensive threat.


i'd more say he just shut down and play his role... either way the reason u got back up ur **** and not just go off yelling is cuz it makes laker/ kobe fans (i dont know which u r, we are mostly all laker fans) look no better than the haters... it gives them ammunition... and it turns these threads to **** and gets em closed...

kobe/tmac posters used to be so intense in their debates but they'd be 20 pages long of good (tho repetitive) debate


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> LMAO..HArper was never a score in the BUlls. Last time he was a consistent scoring machine was when he was on Cleveland as a Cavalier.


that...is... why.... i.... said.....B.....4.... (BEFORE)... so b4 (there it is again) u start Laughing your *** off read my post


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> LMAO..HArper was never a score in the BUlls. Last time he was a consistent scoring machine was when he was on Cleveland as a Cavalier.


True, and maybe one season on the Clips. After he blew his knees out, he was never the "scorer" again. He was a role player on the Bulls, a damn good one, but a role player who played D and occasionally hit an open J. That's why I said Smush has the capability of being a better player. And he does.


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

shobe42 said:


> i'd more say he just shut down and play his role...


I wouldn't, but I digress...



> either way the reason u got back up ur **** and not just go off yelling is cuz it makes laker/ kobe fans (i dont know which u r, we are mostly all laker fans)


True, but I didn't feel the need to at that moment. His play and teams success as of late has done it for me.



> look no better than the haters... it gives them ammunition... and it turns these threads to **** and gets em closed...


They don't need ammo. They hate just to hate. Kobe could go onto lead his team to the title and score 102 points in the last game and they would still hate. That's just the way it is with them.


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## Samael (Sep 1, 2005)

I'm not a hater but I think Kobe is just a scrub on Chris Mihm's team.




:rofl:


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Smush Parker will never be a better player then a post knee injury Harper. His defense ain't anywhere close to what Harper brought to the table and Harper was by no means a slouch on offense.

Great game by Kobe BTW. Anyone who scores a bunch against the Pacers even w/o Artest deserves props


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

Did no one read where I said Smush was *CAPABLE*...which adversely doesn't mean *IS* better. Again, watch the personal attacks.


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

The MAMBA said:


> Did no one read where I said Smush was *CAPABLE*...which adversely doesn't mean *IS* better. Jesus, I thought reading comprehension was taught in grade school.


 I disagree. Smush is not better than Ron Harper.


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## aNgelo5 (Oct 24, 2005)

damn Team Kobe Lakers are no more.


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## DuMa (Dec 25, 2004)

*What happened to your Kobe filter?*


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

*Are you looking for a suspension? Please reread my first post in this thread*


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

DuMa said:


> *edit*


They should. Name fits the team. I mean, they almost did it for the Bulls....


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Another great effort by Kobe, best perimeter player in the league.


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## carrrnuttt (Dec 4, 2004)

When is this being moved to the Kobe, err, Lakers forum?


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## qross1fan (Dec 28, 2004)

*take your mod isues to PM*


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Everyone loves Kobe. If you don't love him, you love to hate him. He is more relevant in the general forum than anyone.


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

carrrnuttt said:


> When is this being moved to the Kobe, err, Lakers forum?


We already have one there.. where people appreciate him.. :laugh:


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## magic_bryant (Jan 11, 2004)

The scoring ability that Kobe contains is simply amazing, considering the fact that he just did something not done in the MODERN era of basketball (i.e. 1980-Present), that being 4 straight games with 45+. And this is in a very weak scoring era, compared to the past 20+ years. Barkley, Malone, Drexler, Dantley, 'Nique, Hakeem, even MICHAEL JORDAN, never did this, despite being in a higher scoring era where teams routinely scored around 105. This isn't to say he's better than any of those guys, but please, it says alot in terms of scoring. MJ probably COULD have done it, but he didn't. Kobe isn't even on a team where his teammates get attention. Only Lamar Odom is deserving of any kind of defensive attention, but that's more to watch what he does as a PASSER. 

Dude looks like the guy from the '02-03 season. Lakers are 0-2 without Kobe this year. 18-14 with him. No other consistent offensive threat. Looking at the roster from top-to-bottom and one says "How do they expect to win games with this ragtag group?". If they find a way to win the division (looks unlikely), then he deserves the MVP.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

carrrnuttt said:


> When is this being moved to the Kobe, err, Lakers forum?


why should it be... its a top performance in the entire league and history in the making... very relelvant


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## Spriggan (Mar 23, 2004)

magic_bryant said:


> The scoring ability that Kobe contains is simply amazing, considering the fact that he just did something not done in the MODERN era of basketball (i.e. 1980-Present), that being 4 straight games with 45+. And this is in a very weak scoring era, compared to the past 20+ years. Barkley, Malone, Drexler, Dantley, 'Nique, Hakeem, even MICHAEL JORDAN, never did this, despite being in a higher scoring era where teams routinely scored around 105. This isn't to say he's better than any of those guys, but please, it says alot in terms of scoring. MJ probably COULD have done it, but he didn't. Kobe isn't even on a team where his teammates get attention. Only Lamar Odom is deserving of any kind of defensive attention, but that's more to watch what he does as a PASSER.
> 
> Dude looks like the guy from the '02-03 season. Lakers are 0-2 without Kobe this year. 18-14 with him. No other consistent offensive threat. Looking at the roster from top-to-bottom and one says "How do they expect to win games with this ragtag group?". If they find a way to win the division (looks unlikely), then he deserves the MVP.


I think if Kobe gets the Lakers to the playoffs, he's MVP, period.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

Spriggan said:


> I think if Kobe gets the Lakers to the playoffs, he's MVP, period.


 :yes: to me he is so far the MVP this year


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

Kobe Bryant (Lakers 18-16): 33.7 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 4.5 apg, 1.19 spg, 44.4% FG

Allen Iverson (76ers 17-17): 33.1 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 7.3 apg, 2.12 spg, 44.8 % FG

Philadelphia: 10-6 against Western Conference
Los Angeles: 8-11 against Western Conference

Iverson has a PF that shoots 42%, Kobe has a PF that doesn't shoot. Iguodala and Korver are much better than LA's wing players, but Iverson certainly isn't too far behind in the MVP race.


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## 7M3 (Aug 5, 2002)

Spriggan said:


> I think if Kobe gets the Lakers to the playoffs, he's MVP, period.


Why are you not on AIM?


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## magic_bryant (Jan 11, 2004)

Spriggan said:


> I think if Kobe gets the Lakers to the playoffs, he's MVP, period.


He's my choice for MVP as well, Spriggan. I'm just basing this on what I think it would take for the media to actually give it to him. But yeah, he's my MVP choice too.


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## Sith (Oct 20, 2003)

nobody believed me when i said " kobe is the best player right now in the NBA, hes playing like the prime Jordan"


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## Yao Mania (Aug 4, 2003)

Meh, I'd still prefer T-Mac (with a healthy back) 

Gotta give Kobe his props, if it was any other player who pulled this off fans would be raving about how great this guy is.


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## naibsel (Dec 21, 2005)

Sith said:


> nobody believed me when i said " kobe is the best player right now in the NBA, hes playing like the prime Jordan"



yeh i yelled at you coz when has kobe had 11 triple doubles in 14 games, averaging 34-10-12 for the stretch

or in his 3rd year in the league has 2 60 point games in a month, and 3 50pt games inbetween those two.

oh had a 69 pt 18 rebound game like jordan did.

i congratulate kobe on yet another individual achievement, and i dont mean it to slight him but if lebron got to the playoffs and had smush parker, odom, kwame and mihm as his team mates i think he would would make 45-9-5 look pretty average. and what i mean by that is 40+ppg and 10+apg.


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## Spriggan (Mar 23, 2004)

naibsel said:


> yeh i yelled at you coz when has kobe had 11 triple doubles in 14 games, averaging 34-10-12 for the stretch
> 
> or in his 3rd year in the league has 2 60 point games in a month, and 3 50pt games inbetween those two.
> 
> ...


What the hell are you talking about?


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Spriggan said:


> What the hell are you talking about?


Kind of wondering the same thing.


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## magic_bryant (Jan 11, 2004)

Ditto.


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## naibsel (Dec 21, 2005)

well i think those accomplishments listen above are greater than 4 straight 45+ games, and kobe is on a mission right now, and before ppl put him in a league of his own, im just trying to show that any of the elite players raise their game when it counts the most.

and i know the playoffs stuff was speculation , but lebron averaged 32-10-8 on 46% shooting last april, and got a triple double in that last game of the season, but it wasn't enough to drag his team to the promised land


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## carrrnuttt (Dec 4, 2004)

Sith said:


> *hes playing like the prime Jordan*


And we're supposed to believe that now?

Look, I have much respect to Kobe the player, but it is the almost lustful (I was going to say '****-erotic', but didn't, in case some of you are female), the way you speak about this boy, even beyond reason is what's so annoying to a lot of people.

As a counter, here's some of Nash's highlights from last season:



> _*Followed sensational MVP performance in regular season, with even gaudier numbers in the postseason, averaging 23.9 points, 11.3 assists, 4.8 rebounds on .520 shooting in 15 playoff games… **Became the first player* *in NBA history to record four consecutive games with at least 25 points and 10 assists in the postseason* (ahead of Jordan and Oscar Robertson, who both have three) * (May 18-24)… Joined Wilt Chamberliain and Michael Jordan as the only players to score 40-plus points in one playoff game and then collect a triple double in the next game…*_


I'd say that those are more impressive than scoring numbers put up consecutively by someone who is not only the best (and only) scorer on his team (by his own choosing), but is well practiced in putting up shot, after shot, after shot, after shot, after shot, after shot. I'd say he's well-acquainted with the rim now, especially the ones in LA.

So yeah, GREAT accomplishment, but please don't take it to ridiculous levels.


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## BBB (Jan 19, 2005)

If anything, by saying Kobe is *currently* playing like the prime Jordan, it's a compliment and testament to MJ's amazing career. No, we're not implying that he is or better than prime Jordan, but just look at this...



> Bryant scored 45 points on Dec. 28 against Memphis, 48 last Friday night against Philadelphia, and 50 on Saturday night against the Clippers.


I rest my case.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

carrrnuttt said:


> And we're supposed to believe that now?
> 
> Look, I have much respect to Kobe the player, but it is the almost lustful (I was going to say '****-erotic', but didn't, in case some of you are female), the way you speak about this boy, even beyond reason is what's so annoying to a lot of people.
> 
> ...


Yeah, except those impressive performances were accomplished 8 months ago. Kobe's happened to have occurred today. There is a Suns board though, where I'm sure they'd love to reminisce about all that.


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## naibsel (Dec 21, 2005)

yeh there is not a single reason why u can say kobe is a better player than nash in their form of the past 2 seasons.

they play different positions and have different responsibilities, kobe leads the league in points, nash leads the league in asissts. nash shoots a higher %age, and he has had a game where he decided to scory and went crazy 48 points on more than 20 from less than 30 against dallas in the playoffs, but his team lost. so he stuck with the play making and got a triple double in a win ( he was like one rebound away from it at halftime)

he has led to his team to far more wins than the lakers possess, and why do they need to reminice when they are doing it all over again this season without there most dominant offensive player. against a supposed eastern powerhouse, miami, he had 19 assists as they utterly destroyed the heat, and a few days earlier has had 28 points 22 assists against the knicks ( if none of those were 3pters thats still 72 points of combined offensive production)


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Kobe is better than Nash at everything except passing, which I admit is a pretty large advantage, but Kobe also has a huge advantage as a scorer and defender.


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## carrrnuttt (Dec 4, 2004)

EHL said:


> Yeah, except those impressive performances were accomplished 8 months ago. Kobe's happened to have occurred today. There is a Suns board though, where I'm sure they'd love to reminisce about all that.


You don't get the point.

The poster I was replying to was saying that not only is Kobe playing 'like Jordan', he is playing 'like the prime Jordan'. Do YOU believe that?

My point with quoting Nash's accomplishments last year is to show that more impressive Jordan/Wilt records have been matched, in the playoffs nonetheless, and even broken by another player, yet there was NEVER even a sniff of a Jordan comparison.

Now, the self-created scorer (he either discourages others from becoming one, or they get traded away, a la Butler), scores a LOT of points consecutively, albeit to win the game, as he needs to (now), and he's playing like a prime Jordan? Please.


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## Spriggan (Mar 23, 2004)

carrrnuttt said:


> You don't get the point.
> 
> The poster I was replying to was saying that not only is Kobe playing 'like Jordan', he is playing 'like the prime Jordan'. Do YOU believe that?


And was one poster saying that worth posting some old Nash stats in size 80 red font? Nobody cares except you. You hate Kobe. We get it. Move along.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

carrrnuttt said:


> You don't get the point.
> 
> The poster I was replying to was saying that not only is Kobe playing 'like Jordan', he is playing 'like the prime Jordan'. Do YOU believe that?
> 
> My point with quoting Nash's accomplishments last year is to show that more impressive Jordan/Wilt records have been matched, in the playoffs nonetheless, and even broken by another player, yet there was NEVER even a sniff of a Jordan comparison.


Nash doesn't draw Jordan comparisons because he doesn't play anything like Jordan. There is hardly a single thing reminiscent between Jordan and Nash's games. That's why very few people say Kobe (or Nash, or whatever other guard you want to list) plays like Wilt. Wilt was a big man who played nothing like a guard. The comparison is not just in terms of quality of play but type of game. 



> Now, the self-created scorer (he either discourages others from becoming one, or they get traded away, a la Butler),


Butler and Odom's scoring seasons with and without Kobe are almost exactly identical in terms of points, FG%, FTM, etc. 



> scores a LOT of points consecutively, albeit to win the game, as he needs to (now), and he's playing like a prime Jordan? Please.


Yes, he has been playing like a prime Jordan recently. It happens every now and then with great players. LeBron this season, Tmac a few seasons ago. Great perimeter players occasionally play like prime Jordan. It happens, and people will talk about it. Deal with it. 



Spriggan said:


> And was one poster saying that worth posting some old Nash stats in size 80 red font? Nobody cares except you. You hate Kobe. We get it. Move along.


I also didn't quite get the point of posting Nash's stats from 8 months ago. But to each his own.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

Additionally, Nash has drawn a lot of Magic comparisons and rightfully so. That is, proportionally to how often Nash gets talked about (in a way, he's sort of like Duncan, a great player that doesn't really get talked about as much as he should). And those Magic comparisons make sense, both in terms of quality of play (his most recent postseason) and style (pass-first, score when need be).


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## carrrnuttt (Dec 4, 2004)

Spriggan said:


> You hate Kobe. We get it. Move along.


NO, YOU don't get it.

I don't hate Kobe. As a matter of fact, of all the current players in the NBA I would most like to play like, it'd be Kobe.

I, however, hate puerile fans like the one I responded to, who would take an accomplishment of Kobe's, and blow it up to undeserved proportions. I also hate his fans like YOU, who would take criticism of said undeserved 'blow-up', and respond with the all-too-whiny-and-familiar "you're a hater" speech, hence blowing things over propertion even more, resolving these types of threads to one big argument, because you'd rather bask in the over-glorification of your favorite player, than accept the truth--THAT IT IS NOT THAT BIG OF AN ACCOMPLISHMENT IN PROPORTION TO THE WAY SOME OF YOU ARE TAKING IT.

Now if it were say, rookie Salim Stoudamire of the Atlanta Hawks that did this, then it'd be god-friggin' parade-worthy, but it was accomplished by someone who takes damn near 40% of his team's shots, ESPECIALLY because he has to.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

carrrnuttt said:


> Now if it were say, rookie Salim Stoudamire of the Atlanta Hawks that did this, then it'd be god-friggin' parade-worthy, but it was accomplished by someone who takes damn near 40% of his team's shots, ESPECIALLY because he has to.


You know who also took damn near 40% of his teams' shots? Michael Jordan in his prime. Hey, you walked right into it. :laugh:

Plus, I don't see why Salim doing it is "parade-worthy". Any player that does great things should be praised for it, no matter who they are, how many times they've done it, what city they play for, etc. Unless, of course, you're just tired of hearing about it.


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## tone wone (Jan 30, 2003)

so I heard Kobe scored some points today.

He sure is prone to do that from time to time


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

tone wone said:


> so I heard Kobe scored some points today.
> 
> He sure is prone to do that from time to time


But over the past few games he's also rebounding the heck out of the ball, doing a good job of facilitating for his teammates (for someone who's putting up so many shots, it's actually surprising that he's averaged 5 assists over the past 3 games), all while also playing great defense. Dominating the game in all aspects, hence the comparisons to a prime MJ.

But while the comparisons for the most part are valid, there's a big difference in their scoring approaches. Kobe gets his points primarily on jumpshooting, and this has been the case for years now; whereas a prime MJ split his scoring between jumpshooting and finishing at the basket, as LeBron (for example) has been doing.


----------



## carrrnuttt (Dec 4, 2004)

EHL said:


> You know who also took damn near 40% of his teams' shots? Michael Jordan in his prime. Hey, you walked right into it. :laugh:


Actually, I was wholly expecting that reply.

Kobe is attempting 27 shots per game now, while at the MOST, Jordan attempted an average of 27.8, in the 1987 season, and then averaged between 24 to 25 FGA-PG after. One of the biggest differences between Jordan's '87 (37ppg) season and Kobe's '06 (33ppg) season is, Jordan was shooting at a 48% clip, to Kobe's 44%. Jordan also never needed *41 attempts* to get to 50 points.


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## magic_bryant (Jan 11, 2004)

carrrnuttt said:


> NO, YOU don't get it.
> 
> I don't hate Kobe. As a matter of fact, of all the current players in the NBA I would most like to play like, it'd be Kobe.
> 
> ...


My bad. You're right. I mean, ONLY he and Wilt have done it. Not Jordan. Not Bird. Not Drexler, 'Nique any of em. ONLY Kobe and Wilt. I guess it was blown up to "undeserved proportions." I mean, afterall, Kobe's the FIRST player to EVER be a GREAT scorer AND on a bad team in the last...oh...40+ years, right?  I mean, AI in his MVP year had the dominant scoring of Deke. OH, and T-Mac had the AMAZING Pat Garrity's scoring. And we simply CAN'T forget Nique's great Hawks teams with the amazingly ball-hoggish Doc Rivers taking Nique's shots away to prevent him from scoring 45+ 4 straight games. 

Undeserved of ANYONE to praise Kobe. Again, please, forgive me. My bad.


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## magic_bryant (Jan 11, 2004)

carrrnuttt said:


> Actually, I was wholly expecting that reply.
> 
> Kobe is attempting 27 shots per game now, while at the MOST, Jordan attempted an average of 27.8, in the 1987 season, and then averaged between 24 to 25 FGA-PG after. One of the biggest differences between Jordan's '87 (37ppg) season and Kobe's '06 (33ppg) season is, Jordan was shooting at a 48% clip, to Kobe's 44%. Jordan also never needed *41 attempts* to get to 50 points.


And 48% in 87' is relatively a bad FG% when the league-wide FG% average was pretty much at around 50-51%. In today's NBA, 44% is relatively average. Of course, don't consider such things as Zone defenses or, I dunno, things such as different eras when talking about Michael Jordan. Afterall, he simply could not have had a bad game ever. I mean, since ESPN never shows highlights of one, right? 

Nope he never took 41 shots to get 50 points, but he did have his 9-36 game against the Jazz in the Finals in '98, I think it was.  And trust me, he didn't have 50 in that game.

Why people feel the need to overrate MJ just because someone garners a comparison. MJ need not be overrated, everyone knows he's the best.


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

magic_bryant said:


> And 48% in 87' is relatively a bad FG% when the league-wide FG% average was pretty much at around 50-51%. In today's NBA, 44% is relatively average.


The league average in '87 was 48.02%. Today it's 44.74. In MJ's prime he was consistently one of the most efficient scorers....just wanted to point that out.


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Kobe is averaging 34 points on 44%, which is undoubtedly similar efficiency to Jordan's 37 points on 48% when you consider the era differences and the three point shooting differences. Jordan only hit 12 three pointers that whole year, Kobe has already hit 50+ in 32 games. That closes the gap in eFG% a bit. Then when you consider how much tougher defenses are today, it really makes it about even when it comes to scoring. That's how good Kobe has been. 

Jordan also went on to average 33, 8 and 8 a couple years later, which is an all-around game that is more like LeBron James. Kobe will probably never be that great of all-around player, but as a scorer and as a defender, he is right with Jordan, in my opinion. He is that good.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

carrrnuttt said:


> Kobe is attempting 27 shots per game now, while at the MOST, Jordan attempted an average of 27.8, in the 1987 season, and then averaged between 24 to 25 FGA-PG after.


So what's your point? This is also Kobe's highest FGA season of his career.



> One of the biggest differences between Jordan's '87 (37ppg) season and Kobe's '06 (33ppg) season


That's 34 ppg, just to be accurate. 



> Jordan was shooting at a 48% clip, to Kobe's 44%.


I realize Jordan had better scoring seasons than Kobe. I never denied this. My point was that sometimes great players play like prime Jordan, or prime Magic, or prime etc. And those great players will get compared to those all time great players, and threads will emerge, and people will praise them. It happens every now and then and will continue to happen. I'd get used to it. 

Additionally, I still feel there was no reason for you to bring up Nash other than to deflect this thread to (one) of your favorite players on your favorite team and how he doesn't get his rightful comparisons. If you feel that way, start a thread about it here on the General board, or on the Suns board. 



> Jordan also never needed *41 attempts* to get to 50 points.


Again I ask, what's your point? Kobe never needed more than 31 shots to break 60 points in a game. Jordan did. So what?


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## pac4eva5 (Dec 29, 2005)

magic_bryant said:


> My bad. You're right. I mean, ONLY he and Wilt have done it. Not Jordan. Not Bird. Not Drexler, 'Nique any of em. ONLY Kobe and Wilt. I guess it was blown up to "undeserved proportions." I mean, afterall, Kobe's the FIRST player to EVER be a GREAT scorer AND on a bad team in the last...oh...40+ years, right?  I mean, AI in his MVP year had the dominant scoring of Deke. OH, and T-Mac had the AMAZING Pat Garrity's scoring. And we simply CAN'T forget Nique's great Hawks teams with the amazingly ball-hoggish Doc Rivers taking Nique's shots away to prevent him from scoring 45+ 4 straight games.
> 
> Undeserved of ANYONE to praise Kobe. Again, please, forgive me. My bad.


what is your point?

boykins scored a nba record 15 points in a 5 min overtime. i *please don't go into detail about stuff like that* :dead:


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

EHL said:


> I realize Jordan had better scoring seasons than Kobe. I never denied this. My point was that sometimes great players play like prime Jordan, *or prime Magic*, or prime etc.


Just to point out that NOONE consistently plays like a "prime Magic". Kidd and Lebron (not Nash) can/could EVENTUALLY put up Magic's number for, say, a week (at most). But that's it. 

About the direction the thread is going:

AI's MVP year: 31.1ppg in .420FG% 4.6apg: "Oh, what a great player! No one hustles like him! He took a team with no other star to the Nba Finals!"
Kobe 05-06: 34.1ppg in .443FG%, 4.5apg: "Ballhog! Trigger-happy! Selfish!"

Meh...


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## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

I still don't think people understand what they are watching right now in Kobe. It is Jordan, pre-Pippen. It is so eerily similar. Just wait until Kobe gets some teammates around him and like prime Jordan he can pick his spots to go on scoring explosions.

It is history repeating itself. Jordan was not considered the greatest ever back in '87. That Jordan would be getting the same criticism Kobe is getting now. He was the anti-Bird/Magic. A perversion of "good" basketball. A ball hog. He would never win a chapionship. Same ****. It was a one man show. The difference is that most people fawning over Jordan, never saw him actually play when his teammates sucked.

Enjoy this season of individual dominance and pitty the Western Conference team that is going to draw the Lakers in the playoffs. They might beat them but what you are going to see out of Kobe on the big stage is going to be incredible. I wouldn't even bother logging in if you are sick of Kobe now...it is going to get worse because he is still getting better.


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## xPAGANx (Dec 19, 2005)

Kobe is not = to Jordan.

I respected Jordan. I have no respect for Kobe.


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## lakegz (Mar 31, 2004)

^because you can easily do what he does right?


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

MemphisX said:


> I still don't think people understand what they are watching right now in Kobe. It is Jordan, pre-Pippen. It is so eerily similar. Just wait until Kobe gets some teammates around him and like prime Jordan he can pick his spots to go on scoring explosions.
> 
> It is history repeating itself. Jordan was not considered the greatest ever back in '87. That Jordan would be getting the same criticism Kobe is getting now. He was the anti-Bird/Magic. A perversion of "good" basketball. A ball hog. He would never win a chapionship. Same ****. It was a one man show. The difference is that most people fawning over Jordan, never saw him actually play when his teammates sucked.
> 
> Enjoy this season of individual dominance and pitty the Western Conference team that is going to draw the Lakers in the playoffs. They might beat them but what you are going to see out of Kobe on the big stage is going to be incredible. I wouldn't even bother logging in if you are sick of Kobe now...it is going to get worse because he is still getting better.


Good post. The biggest difference between Jordan in his prime and Kobe now is Scottie Pippen. You pair Kobe with an Elton Brand or Pau Gasol, and it's a wrap.


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

MJ was in the 95+ percentile in scoring efficiency for 4+ straight seasons during his prime, even before he had a developed supporting cast. In 1989 he was in the 98th percentile; only 7 players were more efficient. Leading the league in scoring by far, while being 8th in the league in TS%. That's how good Jordan was as a scorer. This season, Kobe ranks 95th out of 215 in TS%.

But don't get me wrong, I think Kobe has proven he's the best overall scorer in the league this season. He's gone on a rampage not seen in years. I just don't think he's quite on Jordan's level in scoring.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

MemphisX said:


> I still don't think people understand what they are watching right now in Kobe. It is Jordan, pre-Pippen. It is so eerily similar. Just wait until Kobe gets some teammates around him and like prime Jordan he can pick his spots to go on scoring explosions.
> 
> It is history repeating itself. Jordan was not considered the greatest ever back in '87. That Jordan would be getting the same criticism Kobe is getting now. He was the anti-Bird/Magic. A perversion of "good" basketball. A ball hog. He would never win a chapionship. Same ****. It was a one man show. The difference is that most people fawning over Jordan, never saw him actually play when his teammates sucked.
> 
> Enjoy this season of individual dominance and pitty the Western Conference team that is going to draw the Lakers in the playoffs. They might beat them but what you are going to see out of Kobe on the big stage is going to be incredible. I wouldn't even bother logging in if you are sick of Kobe now...it is going to get worse because he is still getting better.


This is an awesome post. :clap:


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## L (Sep 20, 2005)

ok, to sum things up a little

kobe is equal to jordan as far as scoring wise, but mj is better in everything else.did i get that right??? :angel:


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

GTA Addict said:


> MJ was in the 95+ percentile in scoring efficiency for 4+ straight seasons during his prime, even before he had a developed supporting cast. In 1989 he was in the 98th percentile; only 7 players were more efficient. Leading the league in scoring by far, while being 8th in the league in TS%. That's how good Jordan was as a scorer. This season, Kobe ranks 95th out of 215 in TS%.
> 
> But don't get me wrong, I think Kobe has proven he's the best overall scorer in the league this season. He's gone on a rampage not seen in years. *I just don't think he's quite on Jordan's level in scoring.*


Jordan never had to face zone defenses.

Ask T-Mac what is the difference


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## JT (Mar 1, 2004)

> I wouldn't even bother logging in if you are sick of Kobe now...it is going to get worse because he is still getting better.


To me he still seems to be learning the wing position out there...and is still trying to find his niche as the scorer who doesn't need to handle the ball that much. Once he grasps it I suspect the shot attempts will fall dramatically, with him still managing to score the ball at this Hall of Fame level (34+ a game) while simultaneously playing great defense on his man. 

When will this happen? Well, historically Kobe has been known to kick it up a few notches after the all-star break, so I expect it will be about then that he really starts to put on a show. The league better watch out, go code-red level 5 alert or something. If he is toying with defenses now...


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

Maybe I'll ask LeBron this season instead, who's scoring 31 ppg while ranking #14 in TS%. LeBron this season is proving it's possible to approach Jordan's efficiency in this era of the dreaded _zone defense_.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

shobe42 said:


> and also manages to put in 45 in a gutsy win over Indy...
> 
> Odom knocked in a big 3 (finally)
> 
> ...


:yes: 

Kobe is outta control. He's on a tear. I know the haters can't stand it.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

GTA Addict said:


> Maybe I'll ask LeBron this season instead, who's scoring 31 ppg while ranking #14 in TS%. LeBron this season is proving it's possible to approach Jordan's efficiency in this era of the dreaded _zone defense_.


Gotta factor in the hand check too. :bsmile:


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## ralaw (Feb 24, 2005)

Kobe Bean Bryant is the single greatest player in the league today! I just hope he doesn't breakdown when the Lakers need him most during the "race for the playoffs".


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## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

GTA Addict said:


> Maybe I'll ask LeBron this season instead, who's scoring 31 ppg while ranking #14 in TS%. LeBron this season is proving it's possible to approach Jordan's efficiency in this era of the dreaded _zone defense_.



Yep and he is playing with an All Star at center and on the wing, a darn near double double at PF and a veteran PG who has started in the NBA finals. Compare rosters first.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

MemphisX said:


> It is history repeating itself. Jordan was not considered the greatest ever back in '87. That Jordan would be getting the same criticism Kobe is getting now. He was the anti-Bird/Magic. A perversion of "good" basketball. A ball hog. He would never win a chapionship. Same ****. It was a one man show. The difference is that most people fawning over Jordan, never saw him actually play when his teammates sucked.


If I already saw the show, why do I need to see it again? Kobe almost verges on parody. I'd rather see someone who is doing it new. Someone in whom I can see more than just Jordan. Someone I can see Bird/Magic/Big O/Gervin/Shaq/AND Jordan.

But seriously. This **** should be on the Lakers board, not the general forum. You guys don't want trolls in your circle jerks, put this **** where it belongs, not in the general.

Pacers have really been reeling since the Cavs beat them. Just goes to show that Artest>JO. If Artest hadn't shot his mouth off, I have no doubt Tinsley and JO would have been served their walking papers. The Pacers should make Sarus their point guard, and let him run the team the way it needs to be run. Too much one on one, not enough team basketball. Bird agrees the Pacers need to be playing the euro style. Not the Bronze medal winning USA baskeball style.


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## Kirk64 (Oct 19, 2005)

Mr. Roger's Cardigan said:


> Kobe Bryant (Lakers 18-16): 33.7 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 4.5 apg, 1.19 spg, 44.4% FG
> 
> Allen Iverson (76ers 17-17): 33.1 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 7.3 apg, 2.12 spg, 44.8 % FG
> 
> ...


You forgot about Kobe's superior defense, but, yeah, AI is having a great year.


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## crazyfan (Dec 9, 2005)

PauloCatarino said:


> Jordan never had to face zone defenses.
> 
> Ask T-Mac what is the difference




well tts because t-mac plays 1-on-5 40% of the time


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## Kirk64 (Oct 19, 2005)

GTA Addict said:


> But while the comparisons for the most part are valid, there's a big difference in their scoring approaches. Kobe gets his points primarily on jumpshooting, and this has been the case for years now; whereas a prime MJ split his scoring between jumpshooting and finishing at the basket, as LeBron (for example) has been doing.


Yet, Kobe is still getting to the line on a par with prime Jordan.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Kirk64 said:


> Yet, Kobe is still getting to the line on a par with prime Jordan.


He gets fouled on a lot of jumpshots. Like Reggie Miller. Lots of pumpfakes, and jukes. Paul Pierce does the same sort of moves.


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## xPAGANx (Dec 19, 2005)

"Kobe is not = to Jordan.

I respected Jordan. I have no respect for Kobe."



lakegz said:


> ^because you can easily do what he does right?


Not because I play ball better than Kobe, because Kobe is a freakin' loser. Cheap shotting people, and raping.


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

MemphisX said:


> Yep and he is playing with an All Star at center and on the wing, a darn near double double at PF and a veteran PG who has started in the NBA finals. Compare rosters first.


I was refuting the contention that Kobe's supposed on-par-with-MJ scoring efficiency won't be reflected in the numbers because Jordan didn't have to play against a zone defense. LeBron's efficiency isn't the only example, he's just a prime one given the fact that he's averaging 31 ppg. Pierce is at .611 TS% on a terrible Celtics team. Arenas .576. Ray Allen .561. Kobe .538.

MJ was above the 95+ percentile in TS% during his prime years. Kobe has never come close to being in similar company at any point in his career, and let's not forget he played with some damn good supporting casts while Shaq was still in LA, which undoubtedly made scoring much easier for him. Kobe is the best scorer in the league right now, and how much Kobe's scoring efficiency would increase with a better supporting cast remains to be seen, but it can't be argued that Kobe has reached a level on par with MJ in scoring YET.


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## BBB (Jan 19, 2005)

xPAGANx said:


> "Kobe is not = to Jordan.
> 
> I respected Jordan. I have no respect for Kobe."
> 
> ...


:rofl:


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## Vintage (Nov 8, 2002)

The MAMBA said:


> I agree. Except I think Mihm is better than Longely, and that Smush is a more capapable offensive player than Ron Harper, but even though Smush has D it isn't at Ron's level. I was just making a comparison...not saying that the team would actually be AS successful or as good. Just similar styles and players.



Except for the fact that Ron Harper was a 20ppg scorer before he came to the Bulls....

And this is the first time Smush has ever had double digit scoring.....(11ppg)...

But don't let a little thing like facts get in the way of your arguement....


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## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

Sir Patchwork said:


> Kobe is averaging 34 points on 44%, which is undoubtedly similar efficiency to Jordan's 37 points on 48% when you consider the era differences and the three point shooting differences. Jordan only hit 12 three pointers that whole year, Kobe has already hit 50+ in 32 games. That closes the gap in eFG% a bit. Then when you consider how much tougher defenses are today, it really makes it about even when it comes to scoring. That's how good Kobe has been.
> 
> Jordan also went on to average 33, 8 and 8 a couple years later, which is an all-around game that is more like LeBron James. Kobe will probably never be that great of all-around player, but as a scorer and as a defender, he is right with Jordan, in my opinion. He is that good.


I agreed with everything you said until you said he was as good of a defender as Jordan. Kobe's defense is by far the most overrated aspect of his game. Honestly, his post-Shaq defense is pretty much average.

With that said, the 05-06 Kobe is probably a better all-around scorer than the 80s Jordan was.


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## Vintage (Nov 8, 2002)

KOBEDUNKEDONSHAQ said:


> LMAO..HArper was never a score in the BUlls. Last time he was a consistent scoring machine was when he was on Cleveland as a Cavalier.



Because when he signed with Chicago, he wasn't going to be a scoring option AHEAD OF JORDAN AND PIPPEN!

His scoring dipped bec. Jordan and Pippen were our primary scorers; we brought Harper in for his defense (and to be a scorer when needed; which wasn't very often).

His scoring dropped bec. he was behind Pippen and Jordan; not bec. he couldn't score.


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## JT (Mar 1, 2004)

> Honestly, his post-Shaq defense is pretty much average.


Michael Redd and Vince Carter will tell you otherwise. And look at this;



> Memphis: Kobe 45, Eddie Jones AND Dahntae Jones Avg 12.5
> Philly: Kobe 48, Iggy AND Salmons Avg 11
> Clips: Kobe 50, Cassell AND Livingston Avg 7.5
> Indy: Kobe 45, Jackson AND Johnson Avg 11
> ...


That's good basketball.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

xPAGANx said:


> "Kobe is not = to Jordan.
> 
> I respected Jordan. I have no respect for Kobe."
> 
> ...


Watch the personal attacks.

-SJax


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

Vintage said:


> Because when he signed with Chicago, he wasn't going to be a scoring option AHEAD OF JORDAN AND PIPPEN!
> 
> His scoring dipped bec. Jordan and Pippen were our primary scorers; we brought Harper in for his defense (and to be a scorer when needed; which wasn't very often).
> 
> His scoring dropped bec. he was behind Pippen and Jordan; not bec. he couldn't score.


thank u... harper became the ultimate role player sacrificing his game and fitting a different mold for titles


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## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

sherako said:


> Michael Redd and Vince Carter will tell you otherwise. And look at this;
> 
> 
> 
> That's good basketball.


I really don't see where you're going with this. Even if he guarded all of those players, none of them are all-stars or big time scorers. If he goes off for 30+ and shuts down LeBron on Thursday, that will impress me a lot.


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## Jorbroni (Nov 24, 2004)

I not a Kobe fan by far, but I have to give the devil his dues because the guy is ballin right now.

But before anyone start passing out rewards you have to realize that you are only 2 games above .500. The lakers can be right back out of the playoff picture before the end of this week. Also, as great as Kobe has been playing (scoring wise) , if the lakers are gonna to need Kobe to score 45 points a game to win then you guys are in deep trouble. Because as great as Kobe is, those legs and arms are gonna start getting tired as the season goes on if he continues to shoot 30 spg. Plus nobody stays hot for the whole season, not even the GOAT himself (I'm talking about MJ).

One more thing. I keep reading posts from this forum stating that Kobe is doing something that MJ never did. Come on now people, For those who witness MJ play, you all know that he could have done that if he wanted to. I mean this is a guy that had a 50 point game at the age of 37 , average 40ppg in the finals, and average 37 ppg in a season. The reason he didn't is because he never have to.

And by the way, defense was tougher back then because they allowed more contact then they do now. You can't even touch a player these days without getting a flagrant foul :razz:


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

Jorbroni said:


> One more thing. I keep reading posts from this forum stating that Kobe is doing something that MJ never did. Come on now people, For those who witness MJ play, you all know that he *could have done* that if he wanted to. I mean this is a guy that had a 50 point game at the age of 37 , average 40ppg in the finals, and average 37 ppg in a season. The reason he didn't is because he never have to.


Then you agree. Being able to do something and actually doing it are two totally seperate things.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

Jorbroni said:


> I not a Kobe fan by far, but I have to give the devil his dues because the guy is ballin right now.
> 
> But before anyone start passing out rewards you have to realize that you are only 2 games above .500. The lakers can be right back out of the playoff picture before the end of this week. Also, as great as Kobe has been playing (scoring wise) , if the lakers are gonna to need Kobe to score 45 points a game to win then you guys are in deep trouble. Because as great as Kobe is, those legs and arms are gonna start getting tired as the season goes on if he continues to shoot 30 spg. Plus nobody stays hot for the whole season, not even the GOAT himself (I'm talking about MJ).
> 
> ...


agree with most the part about the D... depends when ur talkin... in the 80s defenses were overwhelmingly weak... because D wasnt taught or stressed like it is in the game of the last 10-15 years... the Pistons really changed how teams went to play D...


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## Jorbroni (Nov 24, 2004)

IV said:


> Then you agree. Being able to do something and actually doing it are two totally seperate things.


Okay good point. In that case the argument that Kobe could have score 80 points in that Dallas game* if he played the 4th quarter* is a mute point right?


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

Jorbroni said:


> Okay good point. In that case the argument that Kobe could have score 80 points in that Dallas game* if he played the 4th quarter* is a mute point right?


Jordan could have done those things and your point is not moot. With that said, you can't discredit someones post who post facts. Kobe has acheivements that Jordan never had regardless of whether he could have done them or not.


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## xPAGANx (Dec 19, 2005)

shobe42 said:


> quote deleted


You're just defending that loser cause your a fan. Kobe is a *****.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

xPAGANx said:


> You're just defending that loser cause your a fan. Kobe is a *****.


You need to take a cold shower. Trust me, it'll make you forget all about Kobe.


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## Vintage (Nov 8, 2002)

I could have sworn Pagan was 13 too shobe, judging by his post.

Kobe is putting together a heckuva season.

Haters are here in full force bec. they too are recognizing that Kobe is having a great season.


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## ChrisWoj (May 17, 2005)

xPAGANx said:


> "Kobe is not = to Jordan.
> 
> I respected Jordan. I have no respect for Kobe."
> 
> ...


The girl was willing and taking advantage of him in hopes of a trial from everything I've read. If you want to get Kobe for something immoral go at him for cheating on his wife... The rape thing though has been shot down in the courts. He did commit statuatory rape, but because of circumstances it was thrown out.

Besides... the rape thing is played out and old.


-Chris.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

he didn't commit statuatory rape?


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## ChrisWoj (May 17, 2005)

IV said:


> he didn't commit statuatory rape?


Legally, no... he didn't. Legally.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

ChrisWoj said:


> Legally, no... he didn't. Legally.


Man yall be givin Kobe a hard time.... I know for sure he aint never rape no statues.


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## JT (Mar 1, 2004)

> I really don't see where you're going with this. Even if he guarded all of those players, none of them are all-stars or big time scorers. If he goes off for 30+ and shuts down LeBron on Thursday, that will impress me a lot.


Then open your eyes. Kobe has already locked up guys like Vince Carter and Michael Redd this year while giving back major points of his own. He is proven to be top5 defensively [guard-wise] this year, since Phil has got him gambling less than he is used to. Stephen Jackson has been going off for 25+ a game for the past five until he meets up with izzo.

As for guarding LeBron, I doubt it until maybe the 4th when the game is close. Let Lamar stay on him until its the right time. No reason to waste energy on LeBron who is a lot stronger than Kobe is.


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## ChrisWoj (May 17, 2005)

No personal attacks/insults, please.

-SJax


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## The One (Jul 10, 2005)

ChrisWoj said:


> quote deleted


Dude. He was joking.


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## ChrisWoj (May 17, 2005)

The One said:


> Dude. He was joking.


You've been here since July. I would imagine you'd have noticed the level of intellect of about 1/3 the posters on the site.


-Chris.


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

Why don't we call this the Kobe homer thread instead of Kobe Sneezes. A place for all Kobe homers to congregate. Just kidding all you Kobe lovers. You guys are one sickening bunch.


This is the neutral side of the coin. Kobe is playing out of his mind right now and he deserves all the accolades. He is helping his team win and playing within the team more than not. Can he keep scoring 40+ points a game? Maybe...but the Lakers probably won't win everyone of those games. Should he score 30+ a night for the Lakers win. Hell yeah! But you have to remember the Lakers need others to score more in the long run if they plan on winning consistently. They are still only 2 games over .500 right now so they are far from being a consistently good team.

Right now, not a lot can be said negative about Kobe. He has a had a few stretches of games where he took some god awful shots and made some bad playmaking decisions, but the Lakers are above .500 and he is playing well now. IF Kobe can somehow manage to limit those bad games then the Lakers can be a legitimate playoff threat. Probably not championship material without Odom playing like a wimp, but a good playoff threat. 

This thread has been spared the Kobe haters and the Kobe lovers were out in full force. Now I see who is on the side of Kobe and who hates him. It's kind of fun watching all of you guys. It's like the eternal struggle of good and evil, another lord of the rings battle for middle or the road NBA. 


I have to say that I never thought there was so many Kobe haters until the 62 point thread came along. That thread changed my mind about Kobe haters. They were everywhere! I don't know who is worse, probably the Kobe haters. Haters are usually worse. More power to the Kobe lovers. Keep loving your main man. Its sickening but at the same time, will love win over hate? Will good conquer evil?


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## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

I'll give you the Carter game, that's only one all-star he's shut down all season. He didn't really shut Redd down, considering he scored 21 and shot 44% from the field.

He's capable of being a lock down defender, as evidenced when he played with Shaq, however he doesn't bring that defensive intensity night in and night out.

Kobe is having a very similar season to that of the 87-88 Jordan, where he put up 35, 6 and 6 on 54% shooting. He also won defensive player of the year.

You can talk all you want about Kobe's capabilities, we all know he has them, but until he does it every night, he's nothing more than average on defense.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

The One said:


> Dude. He was joking.


Aw man, I missed what he said..... did he get tight?

Damn! I bet it was really funny. 

:clown:


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

ChrisWoj said:


> You've been here since July. I would imagine you'd have noticed the level of intellect of about 1/3 the posters on the site.
> 
> 
> -Chris.


I hope it was better than this, cause this is really dry. :dead:


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## Phenom Z28 (Nov 22, 2004)

IV said:


> Man yall be givin Kobe a hard time.... I know for sure he aint never rape no statues.


:rofl:


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

compsciguy78 said:


> Why don't we call this the Kobe homer thread instead of Kobe Sneezes. A place for all Kobe homers to congregate. Just kidding all you Kobe lovers. You guys are one sickening bunch.
> 
> 
> This is the neutral side of the coin. Kobe is playing out of his mind right now and he deserves all the accolades. He is helping his team win and playing within the team more than not. Can he keep scoring 40+ points a game? Maybe...but the Lakers probably won't win everyone of those games. Should he score 30+ a night for the Lakers win. Hell yeah! But you have to remember the Lakers need others to score more in the long run if they plan on winning consistently. They are still only 2 games over .500 right now so they are far from being a consistently good team.
> ...



im sure i fall into the Kobe lover area but everything u said in ur post ispretty much what i have been saying... so compsciguy... what does that make you??

let the love fill ur heart my friend... dont subcumb to the darkside


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

YES compsci! let the love fill your heart, LUV baby, it's the wave of the future!


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## Samael (Sep 1, 2005)

This thread should be made into a sticky as the ultimate Kobe Homer and Hater thread so this way all the nonsense is just contained in one area.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

****! me and IV just became a couple of hippies...


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

ya got ta do it!


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

Vintage said:


> Except for the fact that Ron Harper was a 20ppg scorer before he came to the Bulls....
> 
> And this is the first time Smush has ever had double digit scoring.....(11ppg)...
> 
> But don't let a little thing like facts get in the way of your arguement....


Excuse me, where did I 
A) Say Ron Harper wasn't a 20 ppg scorer?
and 
B) Where did I say Smush was better than Harper?

All I said was he has a CHANCE to be a better SCORER than Ron Harper. Chance isn't a definitive word. Look up the meaning if you don't believe me. 

That comment wasn't necessary. Watch the personal attacks.

-SJax


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## Like A Breath (Jun 16, 2003)

The MAMBA said:


> Quote deleted


And the award for most endearing new poster goes to...


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

The MAMBA said:


> Excuse me, where did I
> A) Say Ron Harper wasn't a 20 ppg scorer?
> and
> B) Where did I say Smush was better than Harper?
> ...


I gotta be straight up with you, and please be straight up with me. I've been wanting to know what Jesus's middle name was all my life. I now know it's starts with a "H" If I had one guess I'd say his middle name is Heathcliff, am I right?


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

Howard?


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

Herman?


I'm a keep asking until someone answers me.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

all wrong... it's Horowitz... after all Jesus was a Jew


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> If I already saw the show, why do I need to see it again? Kobe almost verges on parody. I'd rather see someone who is doing it new. Someone in whom I can see more than just Jordan. Someone I can see Bird/Magic/Big O/Gervin/Shaq/AND Jordan.
> 
> But seriously. This **** should be on the Lakers board, not the general forum. You guys don't want trolls in your circle jerks, put this **** where it belongs, not in the general.
> 
> Pacers have really been reeling since the Cavs beat them. Just goes to show that Artest>JO. If Artest hadn't shot his mouth off, I have no doubt Tinsley and JO would have been served their walking papers. The Pacers should make Sarus their point guard, and let him run the team the way it needs to be run. Too much one on one, not enough team basketball. Bird agrees the Pacers need to be playing the euro style. Not the Bronze medal winning USA baskeball style.


Stop posting Bogut threads when he scores 14 points then please?


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

Jamel Irief said:


> Stop posting Bogut threads when he scores 14 points then please?


Has Bustgut score 14 points in one game already? 


:biggrin:


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Jamel Irief said:


> Stop posting Bogut threads when he scores 14 points then please?


Agreed. I've made like two threads on Bogut this year. But I'd gladly trade them back for you Laker fans to keep it in your pants. Why does every single thread have to be about Kobe? And I'm asking that of fans and fellow haters? This is ridiculous. Act like you've seen it before. You all celebrate or diss everything the man does like he died for your sins. There are more threads about Kobe than any other single topic on here.

If you want to talk about Kobe every day go to the ****ing Lakers boards. Some of the non-Lakers fanboy Mods need to exercise a little bit of authority and start cleaning this **** up. Delete or lock the constant Kobe hating threads. And send the Kobe love threads back to the Lakers forum where they belong. And stop letting every thread turn into something about Kobe. There's a thread on here about Lebron and 75 percent of it is Kobe haters talking about Kobe. Get over it folks. Let's let it play out. It's not like Kobe is even playing the best of his career. Didn't he have a whole month where he was averaging 40ppg? Hasn't he played on teams that won championships? Hasn't he already had huge scoring 3 quarter games? He's not breaking new ground for himself. He's just doing what he's always done. If you notice, the arguements for and against are the same now as they have always been. So let's stop it, please. I know there are some mods out there that aren't stooges for the Lakers. Man the **** up. It's getting to where we can't discuss anything NBA general here. It's only Kobe specific. Flex damnit.


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> Agreed. I've made like two threads on Bogut this year. But I'd gladly trade them back for you Laker fans to keep it in your pants. Why does every single thread have to be about Kobe? And I'm asking that of fans and fellow haters? This is ridiculous. Act like you've seen it before. You all celebrate or diss everything the man does like he died for your sins. There are more threads about Kobe than any other single topic on here.
> 
> If you want to talk about Kobe every day go to the ****ing Lakers boards. Some of the non-Lakers fanboy Mods need to exercise a little bit of authority and start cleaning this **** up. Delete or lock the constant Kobe hating threads. And send the Kobe love threads back to the Lakers forum where they belong. And stop letting every thread turn into something about Kobe. There's a thread on here about Lebron and 75 percent of it is Kobe haters talking about Kobe. Get over it folks. Let's let it play out. It's not like Kobe is even playing the best of his career. Didn't he have a whole month where he was averaging 40ppg? Hasn't he played on teams that won championships? Hasn't he already had huge scoring 3 quarter games? He's not breaking new ground for himself. He's just doing what he's always done. If you notice, the arguements for and against are the same now as they have always been. So let's stop it, please. I know there are some mods out there that aren't stooges for the Lakers. Man the **** up. It's getting to where we can't discuss anything NBA general here. It's only Kobe specific. Flex damnit.


Kobe really does need his own sub-forum here.


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## ralaw (Feb 24, 2005)

Sir Patchwork said:


> Kobe really does need his own sub-forum here.


*The Official Kobe Bryant Forum * would be great, if not atleast an _*Official Kobe Bryant Thread*_ would be nice. I suggest you use your mod powers to make it happen.....it would be teh best!


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Sir Patchwork said:


> Kobe really does need his own sub-forum here.


You guys should just make it a sub-forum of the Laker forum.
Get one Kobe lover and One Kobe hater to be moderators.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

Jamel Irief said:


> Stop posting Bogut threads when he scores 14 points then please?


lmfao.



futuristxen said:


> Agreed. I've made like two threads on Bogut this year. But I'd gladly trade them back for you Laker fans to keep it in your pants. Why does every single thread have to be about Kobe? And I'm asking that of fans and fellow haters? This is ridiculous. Act like you've seen it before. You all celebrate or diss everything the man does like he died for your sins. There are more threads about Kobe than any other single topic on here.
> 
> If you want to talk about Kobe every day go to the ****ing Lakers boards. Some of the non-Lakers fanboy Mods need to exercise a little bit of authority and start cleaning this **** up. Delete or lock the constant Kobe hating threads. And send the Kobe love threads back to the Lakers forum where they belong. And stop letting every thread turn into something about Kobe. There's a thread on here about Lebron and 75 percent of it is Kobe haters talking about Kobe. Get over it folks. Let's let it play out. It's not like Kobe is even playing the best of his career. Didn't he have a whole month where he was averaging 40ppg? Hasn't he played on teams that won championships? Hasn't he already had huge scoring 3 quarter games? He's not breaking new ground for himself. He's just doing what he's always done. If you notice, the arguements for and against are the same now as they have always been. So let's stop it, please. I know there are some mods out there that aren't stooges for the Lakers. Man the **** up. It's getting to where we can't discuss anything NBA general here. It's only Kobe specific. Flex damnit.


Hate to break it to you, but not a single mod here is going to do anything different with the Kobe threads on the general board. When there's something new to discuss about a player there's going to be a thread about it. If you don't like it because it's a player you hate, I suggest you never post in those types of thread again.


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## Spriggan (Mar 23, 2004)

Rofl.

People already complain about the so-called "Laker-lover" modding around here. Can you imagine if a forum was created just to discuss Kobe?


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## Vinsane (Feb 27, 2005)

i am pretty sure i am not the only one who doesnt care when you take 35 shots a game 4 straight that is telling that you are not a team player especially when you have other valuable scoring options like odom,parker when he is hot and cook points is the only reason some of the other best players in the league aen't doing it is becausethey beleive in there teammates


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Agreed. I've made like two threads on Bogut this year. But I'd gladly trade them back for you Laker fans to keep it in your pants. Why does every single thread have to be about Kobe? And I'm asking that of fans and fellow haters? This is ridiculous. Act like you've seen it before. You all celebrate or diss everything the man does like he died for your sins. There are more threads about Kobe than any other single topic on here.
> 
> If you want to talk about Kobe every day go to the ****ing Lakers boards. Some of the non-Lakers fanboy Mods need to exercise a little bit of authority and start cleaning this **** up. Delete or lock the constant Kobe hating threads. And send the Kobe love threads back to the Lakers forum where they belong. And stop letting every thread turn into something about Kobe. There's a thread on here about Lebron and 75 percent of it is Kobe haters talking about Kobe. Get over it folks. Let's let it play out. It's not like Kobe is even playing the best of his career. Didn't he have a whole month where he was averaging 40ppg? Hasn't he played on teams that won championships? Hasn't he already had huge scoring 3 quarter games? He's not breaking new ground for himself. He's just doing what he's always done. If you notice, the arguements for and against are the same now as they have always been. So let's stop it, please. I know there are some mods out there that aren't stooges for the Lakers. Man the **** up. It's getting to where we can't discuss anything NBA general here. It's only Kobe specific. Flex damnit.


I've been on this site since before the NBA board even had a thread, and I've probably started less than 5 threads about Kobe on this board. I've complained about the "Kobe plague" on this forum among moderators for a while. If you realize YOU probably have 4x more posts in Kobe threads than I do. So I don't even know why I am responding to this post, since I'm getting the impression that you are complaining when the Kobe praise threads are outnumbering the hate ones. It's boring and repetitive. I think the only other Laker fan mod on this NBA board is EHL and he rarely starts them either. Threads on the same topic are merged, such as when multiple threads popped up on the elbow and the 62 points.

But this is a open board. The USERS decide to content. I'm not locking and moving a bunch of threads because you and I don't like them. If you watch NBA shows, Kobe dominates conversation there as well. It's what people want to hear and discuss. I don't want you to stop writing threads on Bogut, Nocioni, Anderson Varejao or whoever. Just don't try to act like it's the mods fault that they get bumped off for Kobe. 

Do your part, stop reading and stop posting in them.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

EHL said:


> Hate to break it to you, but not a single mod here is going to do anything different with the Kobe threads on the general board. When there's something new to discuss about a player there's going to be a thread about it. If you don't like it because it's a player you hate, I suggest you never post in those types of thread again.


I think it was Pinball who said that he would typically let threads like this go a day, and then move them to the team forum. Kobe threads are allowed to fester like an open sore for weeks and weeks.

I don't know, I look around at the colored names, and so many of them just happen to be Laker fans. At least the active mods. I think there's been a loss of balance on the main board.

I'm just trying to find a solution. I'm a solutions oriented person. I see a problem that a lot of people are *****ing about on both sides, so I say "hey, why not find a way to solve this problem?"

I've noticed a lot of people have put forth good ideas on both sides, but not a damn thing has been done about it. Whether it's me or it's Pauolo, people are telling you they are tired of it. You're a mod, why don't you at least take it into consideration and at least consider trying to make this a better place to post? In other forums I've seen mods do this same sort of thing in order to better organize and direct discussion. Just because you're a mod in the NBA general, doesn't mean you can't at least try and make it a better place to post. No matter what your bias is, you can't possibly think it's for the best that the main board is almost entirely dominated by a single topic? If that were happening on any other forum a sub-forum would be created, or a general thread would be created.

We have always had a similiar problem on the Bulls board with Jamal Crawford and Eddy Curry, and while it wasn't a perfect solution, having a single thread to throw all the comments, was a pro-active action and it has helped.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Jamel Irief said:


> I've been on this site since before the NBA board even had a thread, and I've probably started less than 5 threads about Kobe on this board. I've complained about the "Kobe plague" on this forum among moderators for a while. If you realize YOU probably have 4x more posts in Kobe threads than I do. So I don't even know why I am responding to this post, since I'm getting the impression that you are complaining when the Kobe praise threads are outnumbering the hate ones. It's boring and repetitive. I think the only other Laker fan mod on this NBA board is EHL and he rarely starts them either. Threads on the same topic are merged, such as when multiple threads popped up on the elbow and the 62 points.
> 
> But this is a open board. The USERS decide to content. I'm not locking and moving a bunch of threads because you and I don't like them. If you watch NBA shows, Kobe dominates conversation there as well. It's what people want to hear and discuss. I don't want you to stop writing threads on Bogut, Nocioni, Anderson Varejao or whoever. Just don't try to act like it's the mods fault that they get bumped off for Kobe.
> 
> Do your part, stop reading and stop posting in them.



Nah. You're not understanding. I'm complaing about the haters too, bro. I'm not complaing about you specifically starting Kobe threads either, so don't personlize it like that. Read my other post. Nobody is curtailing Kobe discussion by putting it in it's own subforum. Is there any other board where a single topic dominates conversation without getting one lump thread or a subforum?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

And I'm not the first person or the only person saying this **** either. Kobe haters, lovers, and impartials all feel this way. Before it was closed the yays were outdoing the nays in my poll.

The people want it. Why not give it to them? Stop saying this or that will happen. Make it happen.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

futuristxen said:


> I think it was Pinball who said that he would typically let threads like this go a day, and then move them to the team forum. Kobe threads are allowed to fester like an open sore for weeks and weeks.


Dirk threads, Tmac threads, Shaq threads, Carter threads, etc. are left on the main board for long periods of time as well. It's just how it is. Take your complaints to the appropriate forum (comments and suggestions), not here. 



> I don't know, I look around at the colored names, and so many of them just happen to be Laker fans. At least the active mods. I think there's been a loss of balance on the main board.
> 
> I'm just trying to find a solution. I'm a solutions oriented person. I see a problem that a lot of people are *****ing about on both sides, so I say "hey, why not find a way to solve this problem?"


No, you're not. future, we all know you hate Kobe Bryant with a passion. And that's fine. But for the love of god, please moan and groan about him in the appropriate forum. By complaining about it in this thread you are leaving little hope that it stays on topic in any way whatsoever. 



> I've noticed a lot of people have put forth good ideas on both sides, but not a damn thing has been done about it. Whether it's me or it's Pauolo, people are telling you they are tired of it. You're a mod, why don't you at least take it into consideration and at least consider trying to make this a better place to post? In other forums I've seen mods do this same sort of thing in order to better organize and direct discussion. Just because you're a mod in the NBA general, doesn't mean you can't at least try and make it a better place to post. No matter what your bias is, you can't possibly think it's for the best that the main board is almost entirely dominated by a single topic? If that were happening on any other forum a sub-forum would be created, or a general thread would be created.


Redundant Kobe threads will be locked, threads will be moved. When something new happens someone is allowed to post about it. That's just how it is. 



> We have always had a similiar problem on the Bulls board with Jamal Crawford and Eddy Curry, and while it wasn't a perfect solution, having a single thread to throw all the comments, was a pro-active action and it has helped.


An official Kobe thread might help. But again, posters have every right to start a new thread about a player if there's something new to talk about. This isn't like posting a Tmac v. Kobe thread, which has been done a 1000 times. This started out as something different, but is getting closed to locked because you (and some others) feel as if you need to discuss in every Kobe thread why you don't want Kobe threads on the General board. You don't like it, so take it to the proper forum.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

You're a mod. Why don't you just move my comments to the appropriate forum? And while you're at it, why don't you stop discussing making one kobe thread, and do it? Do you have someone you have to ask first? Send the PM and get it done.


You can continue to just dismiss what I say because I'm a Kobe hater. Or you can listen to my suggestions because I'm a good poster.


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

Oh come on....if an official Kobe forum/thread was created, everyone knows they'd frequently visit it anyway.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

futuristxen said:


> You're a mod. Why don't you just move my comments to the appropriate forum? And while you're at it, why don't you stop discussing making one kobe thread, and do it? Do you have someone you have to ask first? Send the PM and get it done.
> 
> You can continue to just dismiss what I say because I'm a Kobe hater. Or you can listen to my suggestions because I'm a good poster.


You do realize your "Start a Kobe forum" thread was moved to the comments and suggestions forum right? Repost your suggestions there. Now please, drop the subject and stay on topic (what's left of it).


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## GoDWade (Jul 25, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> Or you can listen to my suggestions because I'm a good poster.


Kobe just sneezed


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

EHL said:


> Now please, drop the subject and stay on topic (what's left of it).


Kobe sucks. T-Mac is better. Are we to that point yet? Or did I skip a few steps?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

GoDWade said:


> Kobe just sneezed


I know. Techinically the thread title is my suggestion. :biggrin:


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

My god what a bunch of babies.. Ya'll just cant get enough Kobe.. the haters and the homers.. It's the truth.. 

ONE THREAD would be the worst thing ever on this forum.. why? Becuase I dont wanna read rambling and go through 20 pages to discuss what I wanna discuss..

And even if the Kobe forum somehow found its way here.. The homers and haters would still be there.. 

See.. It'd be worthless..


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Brian34Cook said:


> And even if the Kobe forum somehow found its way here.. The homers and haters would still be there..


Yeah. They'd be there. Not here. A one stop shop for all your kobe needs. Hating, loving. Whatever. It could be something beautiful. Go to the comments and suggestions section, and we'll debate your stance. You'll find your objections are lacking. The Kobe forum will happen. And it will work.

By Gawd.


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## GoDWade (Jul 25, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> Yeah. They'd be there. Not here. A one stop shop for all your kobe needs. Hating, loving. Whatever. It could be something beautiful. Go to the comments and suggestions section, and we'll debate your stance. You'll find your objections are lacking. The Kobe forum will happen. And it will work.
> 
> By Gawd.



Kobe is too great to just have one thread dedicated to 

He is an all around player, not a one-dimensional player


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## Spriggan (Mar 23, 2004)

It's a good thing that The Staple of Objectivity himself, Brian34Cook, came to set us straight.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

GoDWade said:


> Kobe is too great to just have one thread dedicated to
> 
> He is an all around player, not a one-dimensional player


That's why there would be a whole forum. To discuss all facets in which he was lacking.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Bartholomew Hunt said:


> You could just stop reading and posting in the threads. Not that hard to scroll down.


Some days you feel like a nut. Some days you don't.

If there was a Kobe forum, I'd post hate over there sometimes just like I do now with threads, but I could afterwards head over to the NBA general board and discuss other issues. The Kobe threads bury all other discussion on the main board. In their own forum, we'd still have the discussion, in fact, we could probably organize it even better, but it wouldn't take away from other kinds of discussion.

It's like how we keep hiphop seperate from music in the forums.

Go to the comments section, and we can debate the pros and cons. I'm convinced right now that there's not a single good reason not to have this done. There is absolutely nothing negative about doing this. It seems that you could only reap positive results here. Plus you'd have a mod there whose sole responsibility would be to shepard Kobe talk. That would lift a huge load off of the mods in this forum.


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

I posted that without reading the last three pages of the thread. Looks like you guys have already covered it.


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

I'm with Future on this one. We need a Kobe forum so bad! Just make a Kobe forum by golly. What's so hard about this? It will set precedence and you will realize that haters and lovers will go there, as well as impartials. 


Why can't there be a Kobe forum? I haven't heard a good reason why not. Is it because there is no one forum on any one player? Then break the rules and start something new. Everybody wants it and that's what matters.


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## Tyrellaphonte (Feb 21, 2004)

wow. kobe does something that hasnt been done since wilt chamberlain in the 60's, and he still sucks. 

i have to have at least one post in each of these threads to just show the haters how ****ing stupid they are


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

My golly.. Kobe could make more history.. The first ever player forum on BBB  .. Then there would be more Kobe bashing because of that.. That's why there shouldnt be..


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

The Kobe homers don't want the board and a lot of Kobe homers are Mods. That's why it will never get created. They want Kobe to be the talk of NBA General. Damn, I didn't want to say that.

I just don't understand why a Kobe homer wouldn't want him to have his own forum. That would be the pinnacle of existence on BBB.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Brian34Cook said:


> My golly.. Kobe could make more history.. The first ever player forum on BBB  .. Then there would be more Kobe bashing because of that.. That's why there shouldnt be..


The only thing stopping this is because you're worried there will be Kobe bashing?
Newsflash: People are already bashing Kobe when he drops 62. They'll bash him no matter what.
They can complain about it in the Kobe forum.

There's no real reason not to do it. THe only people giving reasons not to have it are Kobe lovers so far. Don't get the idea that the Kobe forum is some sort of Kobe utopia. People will bash Kobe in the Kobe forum. Just as much as they do now.


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

No.. I'm just saying.. I'd hate to hear the out cry of Kobe got a subforum so why cant, Vince Carter, LeBron, Tmac, etc. have one?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Brian34Cook said:


> No.. I'm just saying.. I'd hate to hear the out cry of Kobe got a subforum so why cant, Vince Carter, LeBron, Tmac, etc. have one?


None of those players are discussed nearly as much as Kobe, and all of those players can be discussed in the team forums, most of those team forums for those guys need the extra action anyways.

The one Lebron thread today was completetly about comparing Lebron to Kobe.


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## GoDWade (Jul 25, 2005)

Brian34Cook said:


> No.. I'm just saying.. I'd hate to hear the out cry of Kobe got a subforum so why cant, Vince Carter, LeBron, Tmac, etc. have one?



It's okay, the Kobe haters will never be able to comprehend the greatness of Kobe. So they will cry for everything that Kobe gets


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## Kirk64 (Oct 19, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> The Kobe threads bury all other discussion on the main board.


So don't click on the thread. Is it really that hard?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Kirk64 said:


> So don't click on the thread. Is it really that hard?


We've already covered this point. Go back a few pages. I'm not suggesting this just for myself. I'm suggesting it for everyone.

When one topic is consistently getting double digit page numbers, then that tells me that the topic is big enough that it can hold down it's own forum.

If you got a Kobe forum, you could probably have even better more varied discussions on Kobe.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> You're a mod. Why don't you just move my comments to the appropriate forum? And while you're at it, why don't you stop discussing making one kobe thread, and do it? Do you have someone you have to ask first? Send the PM and get it done.
> 
> 
> You can continue to just dismiss what I say because I'm a Kobe hater. Or you can listen to my suggestions because I'm a good poster.


Good poster or not, I am less likely to hear your suggestions when you accuse me of keeping legitimate basketball threads on the board out of favoritism or being corrupt. Especially when you enjoy reading and posting in those threads more than I do.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

i dont understand how matching a scoring feat that hasnt occured in the NBA since 1964 isn't worthy of the general forum?? if this isnt what is... can some1 pleez explain that to me...

we have a topic about McGrady being out 2 games on the general forum... what is that doing here? how should that be here and not Kobes recent enormous accomplishments?


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## The MAMBA (Jan 6, 2006)

Because Haters hate seeing the accopmplishment being rubbed in their face, knowing damn well they hate his guts.


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## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

shobe42 said:


> i dont understand how matching a scoring feat that hasnt occured in the NBA since 1964 isn't worthy of the general forum?? if this isnt what is... can some1 pleez explain that to me...
> 
> we have a topic about McGrady being out 2 games on the general forum... what is that doing here? how should that be here and not Kobes recent enormous accomplishments?


well i don't have a problem with the topic, but saying that it's some big feat is stretching it a bit. the "feat" is four 45 point games, that's an arbitrary "record" if there ever was one. there some type of arbitrary "record" broken probably every game, doesn't mean any of them are amazing.

so maybe this is the first time there has been four 45 point games, but maybe Iverson or Kobe or someone put together 6 straight 40 point games, isn't that at least just as impressive? maybe, but that doesn't come into question because this "record" is just something people look for. still, i have no problem with the topic.


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## GoDWade (Jul 25, 2005)

The MAMBA said:


> Because Haters hate seeing the accopmplishment being rubbed in their face, knowing damn well they hate his guts.



*M to the A-M-B-A*


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## Blink4 (Jan 17, 2005)

nugzhomer said:


> well i don't have a problem with the topic, but saying that it's some big feat is stretching it a bit. the "feat" is four 45 point games, that's an arbitrary "record" if there ever was one. there some type of arbitrary "record" broken probably every game, doesn't mean any of them are amazing.
> 
> so maybe this is the first time there has been four 45 point games, but maybe Iverson or Kobe or someone put together 6 straight 40 point games, isn't that at least just as impressive? maybe, but that doesn't come into question because this "record" is just something people look for. still, i have no problem with the topic.


People start threads when Lebron and Wade had triple doubles in ONE game. Kobe scored 45+ in FOUR games. I think that it is definately worth a damn thread.


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

nugzhomer said:


> well i don't have a problem with the topic, but saying that it's some big feat is stretching it a bit. the "feat" is four 45 point games, that's an arbitrary "record" if there ever was one. there some type of arbitrary "record" broken probably every game, doesn't mean any of them are amazing.
> 
> so maybe this is the first time there has been four 45 point games, but maybe Iverson or Kobe or someone put together 6 straight 40 point games, isn't that at least just as impressive? maybe, but that doesn't come into question because this "record" is just something people look for. still, i have no problem with the topic.


Yo, homer, i'm keeping an eye on you. Keep up with the good work. :greatjob:

That being said, you suck. Your failure to recognize Kobe's feats (wether you like it or not) is astounding. Only 2 guys in the history of the game have had 4 45pts-games. Still, you shrugg it off? How can you?

If only you've came across with the old "Kobe is a ballhogg" excuse, that would be something (albeit despicable). But saying that 4 straight 45pts in a basketball game in the NBA is something trivial... well, i don't know what to say to you...


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

..

_Banging your head against a wall uses 150 calories an hour._


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

nugzhomer said:


> well i don't have a problem with the topic, but saying that it's some big feat is stretching it a bit. the "feat" is four 45 point games, that's an arbitrary "record" if there ever was one. there some type of arbitrary "record" broken probably every game, doesn't mean any of them are amazing.
> 
> so maybe this is the first time there has been four 45 point games, but maybe Iverson or Kobe or someone put together 6 straight 40 point games, isn't that at least just as impressive? maybe, but that doesn't come into question because this "record" is just something people look for. still, i have no problem with the topic.


Actually Kobe had 9 straight 40 games in 2003. :biggrin:


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## magic_bryant (Jan 11, 2004)

Exactly. I mean, come on. No other players have EVER done this. There have been some GREAT scorers in this league that have had some HORRIBLE teams AND good teams. Dominique Wilkins was a GREAT scorer where he was THE first and second options on offense and saved ALL his energy for the Offensive end, but he never scored 45+ in 4 straight games. Ally I, the best player 6' and under of ALL-TIME, has had some horrible teams where he HAD to shoot every shot. He once had a streak where he scored 40+ in 5 straight games, but never 45+. Michael JORDAN, the guy who AVERAGED 37 for an ENTIRE SEASON as the SOLE offensive option in an era where scoring was the priority as opposed to the defensive era we're in now, had a streak where he scored 40+ in 9 straight games (Kobe tied this record). He AVERAGED 37 points per game, but yet, he never had 45+ in 4 straight games. All these GREAT GREAT GREAT scorers who have been put into positions where they have HAD to score for their teams to even come CLOSE to a win. 

Yet, only Kobe and Wilt have done it. As an NBA fan, you need to just let that sink in your head. Let it roll off your tongue. Think about it. If you do without hate or anything clouding your judgement, you'll realize that, no, it isn't the GREATEST feat ever, but yeah, it's up there. 

And to top it off, Wilt was practically head and shoulders over everyone plus a 100 lbs when he did it. Kobe's doing it at a time when he's the average sized NBA player. And he's not even the most athletically gifted. He's doing all this on sheer will and determination.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

Jordan never scored 40 in 9 straight games. Only Kobe and Wilt did it.


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

Jamel Irief said:


> Jordan never scored 40 in 9 straight games. Only Kobe and Wilt did it.


Actually MJ did


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

45+ in 4 straight is a very notable accomplishment given its rarity, but come on, up there with the greatest feats in league history? No way


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

Please direct all comments and suggestions about a Kobe Bryant subforum to the proper thread, located here. Do not discuss them in this thread, or they will be moved/deleted.


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## magic_bryant (Jan 11, 2004)

Jamel Irief said:


> Jordan never scored 40 in 9 straight games. Only Kobe and Wilt did it.


You're thinking of the 13 consecutive games with 35+ Points, Jamel. Only Kobe and Wilt have done that. Jordan had 10 straight with 35+, though.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

GTA Addict said:


> 45+ in 4 straight is a very notable accomplishment given its rarity, but come on, up there with the greatest feats in league history? No way


*that's a bit off topic*


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## cambyblockingyou (Nov 26, 2005)

Jamel Irief said:


> Actually Kobe had 9 straight 40 games in 2003. :biggrin:


yeah also impressive but my point is that you can find these kinds of records all the time. but like i said i think it deserves a thread if someone wants to post one.


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## GTA Addict (Jun 27, 2005)

shobe42 said:


> so in order to be on the general forum you have to do accomplishments to match the greatest feats in L history??? we better just clear the whole thing


I never said I had any problem with this thread being in NBA General. In fact I said it's a very notable accomplishment.



> no·ta·ble ( P ) Pronunciation Key (nt-bl)
> adj.
> Worthy of note or notice; remarkable: notable beauty; sled dogs that are notable for their stamina.
> Characterized by excellence or distinction; eminent: formed a commission of notable citizens.


But there are members here blowing its significance out of proportion.


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## shobe42 (Jun 21, 2002)

GTA Addict said:


> I never said I had any problem with this thread being in NBA General. In fact I said it's a very notable accomplishment.
> 
> 
> But there are members here blowing its significance out of proportion.


fair enough... i agree the stat is arbritary as far as history and records go but nonetheless amazing and more proof to his dominance this year...


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## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

Does anyone not realize that Kobe's record is kind of...I dunno not as good as people are making it out to be? He was suspended for two games, his first 45 point game was 9 days before his second one. If he has a 45 point game against the Cavs, then I think it's a more legit four straight. Until then, it's still a very impressive three straight in my eyes.


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## Pnack (Aug 23, 2005)

CiMa said:


> Does anyone not realize that Kobe's record is kind of...I dunno not as good as people are making it out to be? He was suspended for two games, his first 45 point game was 9 days before his second one. If he has a 45 point game against the Cavs, then I think it's a more legit four straight. Until then, it's still a very impressive three straight in my eyes.


How is it not impressive?!?!

He was the first to do it since Wilt....yea WILT that's a long time ago....I dont think any records that old have been matched this year.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

KobeBryant08 said:


> How is it not impressive?!?!
> 
> He was the first to do it since Wilt....yea WILT that's a long time ago....I dont think any records that old have been matched this year.


Lebron just matched a Big O record tonight. Some sort of arcane combo of points, assists, and rebounds.


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## Pnack (Aug 23, 2005)

What was the record lol?


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## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Agreed. I've made like two threads on Bogut this year. But I'd gladly trade them back for you Laker fans to keep it in your pants. Why does every single thread have to be about Kobe? And I'm asking that of fans and fellow haters? This is ridiculous. Act like you've seen it before. You all celebrate or diss everything the man does like he died for your sins. There are more threads about Kobe than any other single topic on here.
> 
> If you want to talk about Kobe every day go to the ****ing Lakers boards. Some of the non-Lakers fanboy Mods need to exercise a little bit of authority and start cleaning this **** up. Delete or lock the constant Kobe hating threads. And send the Kobe love threads back to the Lakers forum where they belong. And stop letting every thread turn into something about Kobe. There's a thread on here about Lebron and 75 percent of it is Kobe haters talking about Kobe. Get over it folks. Let's let it play out. It's not like Kobe is even playing the best of his career. Didn't he have a whole month where he was averaging 40ppg? Hasn't he played on teams that won championships? Hasn't he already had huge scoring 3 quarter games? He's not breaking new ground for himself. He's just doing what he's always done. If you notice, the arguements for and against are the same now as they have always been. So let's stop it, please. I know there are some mods out there that aren't stooges for the Lakers. Man the **** up. It's getting to where we can't discuss anything NBA general here. It's only Kobe specific. Flex damnit.


 I don't get it. I see alot of Lebron threads. Certainly not as much as Kobe, but it's a pretty decent amount. When you take into account that for some reason Kobe gets people feeling a certain way when he does something, it's understandable that there would be so many threads.

You shouldn't really be so against the Kobe threads, when you would probably make the same thread had it been something about Lebron.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Tragedy said:


> I don't get it. I see alot of Lebron threads. Certainly not as much as Kobe, but it's a pretty decent amount. When you take into account that for some reason Kobe gets people feeling a certain way when he does something, it's understandable that there would be so many threads.
> 
> You shouldn't really be so against the Kobe threads, when you would probably make the same thread had it been something about Lebron.


The only way a Lebron thread is going to hit 14 pages is if someone drops Kobe's name into it. Let's all just be honest here. For the vast majority of posters, posting in a Kobe Bryant thread for good or bad, is just something you can't not do. There's no player in the NBA right now who engenders this level of blind hate or blind love. Let's not be naive here.


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## magic_bryant (Jan 11, 2004)

futuristxen said:


> The only way a Lebron thread is going to hit 14 pages is if someone drops Kobe's name into it. Let's all just be honest here. For the vast majority of posters, *posting in a Kobe Bryant thread for good or bad, is just something you can't not do.* There's no player in the NBA right now who engenders this level of blind hate or blind love. Let's not be naive here.


Kinda the way you do? For good or bad?


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## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> The only way a Lebron thread is going to hit 14 pages is if someone drops Kobe's name into it. Let's all just be honest here. For the vast majority of posters, posting in a Kobe Bryant thread for good or bad, is just something you can't not do. There's no player in the NBA right now who engenders this level of blind hate or blind love. Let's not be naive here.


 I'm talking about the frequency of the threads, not the post count of the threads.

But you choose to ignore the fact that YOUR post was about the threads and not the length of them.


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## Samael (Sep 1, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> *The only way a Lebron thread is going to hit 14 pages is if someone drops Kobe's name into it.* Let's all just be honest here. For the vast majority of posters, posting in a Kobe Bryant thread for good or bad, is just something you can't not do. There's no player in the NBA right now who engenders this level of blind hate or blind love. Let's not be naive here.


Good point, I think I'll try just that, not just in Lebron threads but in any thread for that matter.


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## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

KobeBryant08 said:


> How is it not impressive?!?!
> 
> He was the first to do it since Wilt....yea WILT that's a long time ago....I dont think any records that old have been matched this year.


You must have missed my last sentence. It is impressive, but he had a longer layoff than Wilt did and who knows he might not have been able to do it against Utah.


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## IV (Jul 16, 2002)

GTA Addict said:


> 45+ in 4 straight is a very notable accomplishment given its rarity, but come on, up there with the greatest feats in league history? No way


If accomplishing something only two other players in history have is not 'up there' what would be?


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## PauloCatarino (May 31, 2003)

IV said:


> If accomplishing something only two other players in history have is not 'up there' what would be?


To put it into perspective, i'd say it's an impressive/great offensive mark.


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