# Jermaine O'Neal to Portland?



## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

I know that Jermaine O'Neal and coach Thomas had a close relationship. Maybe now that Thomas has been fired we can pull off a Wallace for O'Neal swap. What do you guys think?


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

Thomas out as Pacers coach


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## Storyteller (Dec 31, 2002)

O'Neal cannot be traded until December. Even then, it would be tough to work out a trade because of his BYC status for one year.


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## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

My bad, I totally spaced out about him signing his new contract extension. Oh well.


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

*What?!*

Jermaine isn't as good as Wallace, Hands down... No deal!


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## MJG (Jun 29, 2003)

*Re: What?!*



> Originally posted by <b>magnifier</b>!
> Jermaine isn't as good as Wallace, Hands down... No deal!


:laugh:


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

I agree with MJG.


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## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

*Where you born yesterday magnifier*

How do you base your opinion that Rasheed is better than Jermaine. Look at their stats. Rasheed is a bum! At least Jermaine loves the sport and gives full effort.


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## Scinos (Jun 10, 2003)

*Re: What?!*



> Originally posted by <b>magnifier</b>!
> Jermaine isn't as good as Wallace, Hands down... No deal!


lol...We've had this debate before. While some may argue that Sheed is better than JO, there is no way Portland would turn down a Sheed for JO trade...


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

I love Jo but sheed is a way better talent Jo is in the east so thats why he has better numbers


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## HOWIE (Dec 30, 2002)

*Re: What?!*



> Originally posted by <b>magnifier</b>!
> Jermaine isn't as good as Wallace, Hands down... No deal!



Um yeah. I would do a deal Wallace deal for a hungry O'neal. What O'neal lacks in skills compared to Wallace I think he more then makes up for in heart. The kid is willing to play the PF position, Rasheed isn't.

Then again, would you really want to deal with O'neal and Randolph trying to get playing time? I think that Portland is going to stand pat and keep Wallace. Maybe they can sign him for much less money next season. :whoknows:


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

I do remember Jo saying if thomas was not the coach he would not resign


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## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

*Come on Cimalee, I know u r smarter than that*

How can you say Sheed is better on talent. He is a 6'11" power forward that has a career rebounding average of 6.7 and has never averaged over 20 points a game. Did I mention he is almost 30 years old. Jermaine average 20.8 and 10.3 last year at the age of 24. I know your scoring gets inflated a bit in the east, but the rebounding stats speak for themself.


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

I love Jo sheed is more talented , have you seen the blazers vs pacer game sheed lights up Jo all the time


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## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

How can you argue the stats I just posted. Big deal if Sheed outplays Jermain head to head. Thats one matchup. There's plenty of guys Jermaine plays better against than sheed.


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## jackiejackal (Nov 7, 2002)

*i would make the trade in a heartbeat*

Hands down..
Jermaine has already surpassed the "potential" superstar 
moniker.

And he is still on the upswing !


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## MillerTime (Jul 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DirtMcMoses</b>!
> I know that Jermaine O'Neal and coach Thomas had a close relationship. Maybe now that Thomas has been fired we can pull off a Wallace for O'Neal swap. What do you guys think?


Drinking and posting is not cool man.

Keep dreaming, but Jeramine is staying in Indy.


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## Scinos (Jun 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>cimalee</b>!
> have you seen the blazers vs pacer game sheed lights up Jo all the time


:nonono:

March 17 vs. Trailblazers

J. O'Neal: 31pts, 12rebs.
Rasheed: 14pts, 9rebs.

Err...who lights up Jermaine all the time ?


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## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

*Thanks for the post Scinos*

March 17 vs. Trailblazers

J. O'Neal: 31pts, 12rebs.
Rasheed: 14pts, 9rebs.

Err...who lights up Jermaine all the time ? 




Wow, you were right Cimalee, Sheed always dominates Jermaine!


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

*I knew I would get a lot of response about that post...*

But the reason I say this is for two reasons....

Oneal is in the East and he is the focal point on a depleted offense.

In the East... What other big men are in the East last season? Or for that matter, what big men actually put up great numbers in the East? 

Depleted offense... Jermaine was the only low post threat the Pacers had.

I agree that Jermaine is much hungrier than Wallace and he is much younger, but Jermaine isn't our solution, he just isn't...


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Scinos</b>!
> 
> 
> :nonono:
> ...


remind me who won the game?


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## Goldmember (May 24, 2003)

That's just one game though. Every other time they matched up Sheed outplayed Jerm. 

I'm not sold on Jermaine. He seems like just a big-number guy on a bad team and not much else. I also don't think his heart is a big as people think. He sure didn't show a lot of heart when he was loafing around the court as a Blazer.


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## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

Still, how can you say Sheed is more talanted when he averages only 6.7 rebounds a game at 6'11". And if i'm not mistaken, our team was lacking in the rebounding department last year. Why didn't Sheed do anything to help it.


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

> He seems like just a big-number guy on a bad team and not much else.


You do know the Blazers won a whole 2 games more then the Pacers last year right? 



> Depleted offense... Jermaine was the only low post threat the Pacers had.


Odd the "depleted" Pacers offense scored 1.5 more PPG then the Blazers and I guess him being the only low post threat explains why they went to the line a miserable 28 times a game last year.


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## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

Good post Epadfield. Man, someone needs to give me a good rating. All my post are getting the most responses. Come on guys, give Dirty some luv.


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## DirtMcMoses (Aug 25, 2003)

Thank you!


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## ABM (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DirtMcMoses</b>!
> Good post Epadfield. Man, someone needs to give me a good rating. All my post are getting the most responses. Come on guys, give Dirty some luv.


Something about _dirty_ and _luv_ doesn't quite set with me. :uhoh:


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Epadfield</b>!
> 
> 
> You do know the Blazers won a whole 2 games more then the Pacers last year right?


yah, do you know that the Pacers play in a much much much MUCH weaker conference? The 6th best record in the West would be the #1 team in the east..


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## ABM (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hap</b>!
> 
> 
> yah, do you know that the Pacers play in a much much much MUCH weaker conference?


Hap, with ALL due respect, that comment doesn't hold a lot of water (record-wise).........considering that the East has the play the West and visa versa.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

I think 8th place Utah would have given NJ everything they could have handled too, and I'd have made the 7th place Suns favored... Detroit may rise up and be a respectable Eastern champ this year though.

STOMP


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

> You do know the Blazers won a whole 2 games more then the Pacers last year right?
> 
> 
> 
> Odd the "depleted" Pacers offense scored 1.5 more PPG then the Blazers and I guess him being the only low post threat explains why they went to the line a miserable 28 times a game last year.


Keep in mind that the Blazers are in the West and not the JV East. Points in the paint have more to do with being a low post threat than getting to the foul line. There are guards that get there more than centers. And again, we are talking about the JV league...


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>ABM</b>!
> 
> 
> Hap, with ALL due respect, that comment doesn't hold a lot of water (record-wise).........considering that the East has the play the West and visa versa.


so, if the east has to play the west, and the west has to play the east, then why is the west full of teams winning more games?


why did only 1 team in the east win 50 games, and 6 teams in the west did? How come the 6th seed in the west would have HCA in the finals?

The west had 5 teams under .500, wereas the east had 7...the east IS weaker (which is why the east have had no shot at a title since 98)..


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>ABM</b>!
> 
> 
> Hap, with ALL due respect, that comment doesn't hold a lot of water (record-wise).........considering that the East has the play the West and visa versa.


It does hold a lot of water.... The East and West only have to play each other 2 times. You have to play your conference 4 times. There is a big difference. I wonder what the record of the Blazers against Eastern squads?


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## TMOD (Oct 12, 2002)

I know there are some serious Zach fans...how many of you would not trade Zach for Jermaine? (Obviously some filler would be involved...)


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

we have a way better squad than the pacers , *** the scores up when they played in portland tis year


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

I would not trade Zach for Jo , Zach is younger and has huge upside


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## GOD (Jun 22, 2003)

> I would not trade Zach for Jo , Zach is younger and has huge upside


I would trade Zach in a flash for JO. JO is a proven player and is still young and entering his prime. JO is a couple of inches taller and uses the height to be a good shot blocker, something that the blazers do not have. Zach may turn out to be as good or even better then JO, but I would do the trade in a sec for the garenteed talent of JO.


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## ABM (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>magnifier</b>!
> 
> 
> It does hold a lot of water.... The East and West only have to play each other 2 times. You have to play your conference 4 times. There is a big difference. I wonder what the record of the Blazers against Eastern squads?


Ya, that's true. I realized that right after I posted it. :laugh: 

Sorry, Hap. Will you forgive me?


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

Humm last I checked the Pacers had to play the West 28 times a year and do you want a real telling stats? How about 3 point attempts per-game. There are 12 west teams in the top 17 but in free throws attempts per-game 12 east teams are in the top 17. Now logic goes that if a team that plays in the paint they would go to the line and not shoot a bunch of 3's.


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## TMOD (Oct 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>cimalee</b>!
> I would not trade Zach for Jo , Zach is younger and has huge upside


Even so, Jermaine is less than three years older, and at twenty-four is a 22-11-2 seven footer. Is Zach's upside THAT much bigger?


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Epadfield</b>!
> Humm last I checked the Pacers had to play the West 28 times a year and do you want a real telling stats? How about 3 point attempts per-game. There are 12 west teams in the top 17 but in free throws attempts per-game 12 east teams are in the top 17. Now logic goes that if a team that plays in the paint they would go to the line and not shoot a bunch of 3's.


And the Blazers played the West 54 times. That is a huge difference, especially since the East's 7th seed had a losing record. The 8th seed of the West had a winning one. Also, the West's 6th seed, the Blazers had 50 wins when only 1 Eastern team had over 50 wins.

As for free-throw attempts, three point attempts proves there is more low post action. When a player gets doubled down low, he kicks it out to the open tre. Hence more low post = more open outside shots. The "Real" stat would be 3 point % from East to West. I would bet that the East would have a lower %.


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## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>magnifier</b>!
> 
> 
> It does hold a lot of water.... The East and West only have to play each other 2 times. You have to play your conference 4 times. There is a big difference. I wonder what the record of the Blazers against Eastern squads?


that still doesn't mean what you guys make it out to mean. The west still has to play the west, and we're the conference with 2 60 game winners, and 4 50 game winners.

the blazers were 21-9 against the east. That would be the 4th best record against the east, of the western conference.

The East against the west: 170 wins, 250 losses.

11 teams with losing records against the west (including the 3rd 4th, 6th, 7th and 8th seed)

The West against the east: 250 wins and 170 losses.

3 teams with losing records against the east. No playoff teams.

simple translation? The East is weak.

check and mate.


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

*Great post*



> Originally posted by <b>Hap</b>!
> 
> 
> that still doesn't mean what you guys make it out to mean. The west still has to play the west, and we're the conference with 2 60 game winners, and 4 50 game winners.
> ...


Great post!!!!!!


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## Anima (Jun 3, 2003)

Out of 10 teams in 3 point, 3 point makes, and 3 point attemps % it's 50/50 east and west.


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

*Re: What?!*



> Originally posted by <b>magnifier</b>!
> Jermaine isn't as good as Wallace, Hands down... No deal!


I agree.


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## TMOD (Oct 12, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hap</b>!
> 
> 
> that still doesn't mean what you guys make it out to mean. The west still has to play the west, and we're the conference with 2 60 game winners, and 4 50 game winners.
> ...


Excellent post...


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## The_Low_Post_Presence (Aug 28, 2003)

Larry Bird probably waited until Jermaine resigned with the team, before firing Isiah Thomas, knowing full well Jermaine wouldn't be happy with Thomas being fired. Well atleast Bird locked up Jermaine, before firing Thomas. Why take the chance of Jermaine walking as a free agent?


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## GOD (Jun 22, 2003)

It really does not matter because it sounds like Indiana also wants to try to better the attitude on their team. With that in mind, they will not be trading with portland. I can not see JO leaving indiana, but if he does, I see about 20 teams that would be more likelyto trade for him then the blazers.


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## ilPadrino (May 23, 2003)

From the article...



> The biggest criticism of Thomas was his inconsistent rotations. While most players preferred a set role, Thomas made his decisions on his own feelings for a particular game and team matchups.


I liked this part of the article. As I have said many times before, in my opinion, coaches should not constantly be trying to mess around with their rotations to matchup with the other team in an attempt to mask weaknesses. Instead, they should strive to keep things as consistent as possible, maximize their own strengths and force the other team to matchup with them.


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## lakerman83 (Aug 26, 2003)

*Wheel and Deal*

This is the right time to deal if there is a chance. JO is by far better than Wallace. He proved himself to the leauge that he could step up and lead an old style of play team to the playoffs. What was Reggie Miller doing? nothing. What was Tinsley doing? nothing. I thought it was Miller's team? Use to be right? JO is for sure gonna stay in Indy, but if the management was worried about whether or not he'd be happy there with out Thomas as coach I can see them dealing him to the leauge for two superstars to be: Wallace, and Wells. Wells will be at home and Wallace with his fresh new start, and Bird said he would like a fresh new start. Maybe even Miller or Croshere could be part of the package. But one question is would JO be happy coming back to Ptown?


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## Draco (Jun 28, 2003)

J Oneal has always spoken postive about his time in Portland. I think he was frusterated he didn't get more PT but he has indicated it would be one of his top choices if he left Indy.

Jermaine is one of the toughest players to watch because he could have been doing what he's doing now for the blazers if he'd just been a bigger role.


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## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>cimalee</b>!
> I would not trade Zach for Jo , Zach is younger and has huge upside


The blazers forum would just not be complete without you cimalee, you are freakin hilarious. I love your posts, all of them give me a good laugh. Thanks for the entertainment. Would you trade Randolph for Tim Duncan and Tony Parker? Or does San Antonio have to give up a future first round pick too?:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


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## Yega1979 (Mar 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DirtMcMoses</b>!
> How can you argue the stats I just posted. Big deal if Sheed outplays Jermain head to head. Thats one matchup. There's plenty of guys Jermaine plays better against than sheed.


Yes, Eastern Conference bums. You think you have a shut and closed case by looking at stats? Rasheed has a much better post game and outside jump shot than O'Neal, Rasheed is a good defender, so is O'Neal, but O'Neal strenghts happen to come in the rebounding and shot blocking department whereas Rasheed's is one on one defense(which doesn't show up in stats).


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## Yega1979 (Mar 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hobojoe45555</b>!
> 
> 
> The blazers forum would just not be complete without you cimalee, you are freakin hilarious. I love your posts, all of them give me a good laugh. Thanks for the entertainment. Would you trade Randolph for Tim Duncan and Tony Parker? Or does San Antonio have to give up a future first round pick too?:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


Hobo, you're just a typical freak who likes anyone with a shoe contract. Z-bo has a great post game, and Jermaine still looks confused down in the blocks. Of course any Blazer fan would trade Z-bo for Duncan, but that is a FAR cry from Jermaine O'Neal so I don't know why you made that comparison.


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## Petey (Aug 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Hap</b>!
> 
> 
> remind me who won the game?


Don't know, if you are implying the Blazers, imagine them swapping, the Blazers would have really tanked them then.

-Petey


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## Oldmangrouch (Feb 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Yega1979</b>!
> 
> 
> Yes, Eastern Conference bums. You think you have a shut and closed case by looking at stats? Rasheed has a much better post game and outside jump shot than O'Neal, Rasheed is a good defender, so is O'Neal, but O'Neal strenghts happen to come in the rebounding and shot blocking department whereas Rasheed's is one on one defense(which doesn't show up in stats).


You beat me to it Yega. Blocked shots are not a good measure of 1-on-1 defense. Many blocks come when a big man has to help a (smaller) team-mate who has been beaten. They don't reflect whether he plays his own man tough.


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## Goldmember (May 24, 2003)

I wouldn't trade Zach for Jerm. Forget the numbers or the upside stuff, Zach is fun to watch and a guy you want to route for. He has a lot of heart and plays with great enthusiasm. I never really liked Jerm when he was a Blazer. He loafed and then whined about PT. If you want PT then earn it, like Zach did (Bonzi too). Bust yer butt and prove yourself. Show the coaches you deserve to be out there. 

I don't really miss him too much. If he ever leads his team to the championship then I'll change my mind.


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## Siouxperior (Jan 15, 2003)

Why debate this? Donnie Walsh made it very clear they want Jermaine in Indiana for a very long time with the $120 mill contract he gave Jerm.


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## MAS RipCity (Feb 22, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hobojoe45555</b>!
> 
> 
> The blazers forum would just not be complete without you cimalee, you are freakin hilarious. I love your posts, all of them give me a good laugh. Thanks for the entertainment. Would you trade Randolph for Tim Duncan and Tony Parker? Or does San Antonio have to give up a future first round pick too?:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


I'm with Cima on this one. Zach will be better then JO. Sorry just my opinion. Zach plays in the much tougher West, and if given the same amount of playing time,he would put up better stats then JO. The Playoffs were only the tip of the iceberg for Zach.


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

in all reality, Jermaine O'Neal will probably put up better (possibly much better) stats over his career than Zach Randolph. he'll most likely be the better player. 

however, I wouldn't trade him for Zach for purely illogical reasons. I like Zach. he's got a great attitude and he's always trying hard. he's not a whiner like Jermaine used to be. he doesn't call himself the next Karl Malone, like Jermaine did. there was no self-hyped "year of resurrection" for Zach, because he's never seemed to feel like he needed one. 

he just shoves people around under the hoop, waiving his arm for somebody to get him the damned ball. when he gets stuffed, he's got the second shot off so quickly that the shot blocker is still posturing and two point are scored. 

Zach strikes me as the kind of guy who doesn't take crap off of others and just does what it takes to get the job done. he doesn't ***** about playing in summer leagues or coming off the bench. he's forced the coach to give him playing time because he's improved his defense, not by complaining. 

Jermaine failed to earn playing time in Portland over the course of four years. It was the coach's fault.

Jermaine failed to get his stacked team out of the first round last year in a weak eastern conference. It was Reggie's fault. 

Jermaine failed to dominate teams in the recent international tournament, resulting in us not even getting a medal. It was the whole team's fault. 

Zach, to be fair, broke a guy's eye socket, sending the team into a spiral. However, it was only his second year and Patterson certainly has issues anyway. And Zach apologized to the team. It was Zach's fault. 

Maybe I'm just a sucker for less-gifted underdogs, but I'd rather see Zach go his whole career in Portland earning 19 pts/10 rebs, than watch Jermaine O'Neal go for 24/11. If I want talented studs with no sense of accountability, I can always reminisce about Wallace, Rider and Uncle Cliffy.


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>theWanker</b>!
> in all reality, Jermaine O'Neal will probably put up better (possibly much better) stats over his career than Zach Randolph. he'll most likely be the better player.
> 
> however, I wouldn't trade him for Zach for purely illogical reasons. I like Zach. he's got a great attitude and he's always trying hard. he's not a whiner like Jermaine used to be. he doesn't call himself the next Karl Malone, like Jermaine did. there was no self-hyped "year of resurrection" for Zach, because he's never seemed to feel like he needed one.
> ...


Another great post... I too believe that Jerm is one of those guys that will blame others for his inability to lead his team. Who knows, he might grow up and become the man in Indiana like Kobe did in L.A. Remember Kobe wasn't all that great his first 2 years.


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

if we traded for jermaine , the pacers would not want sheed , they would want bonzi and dale


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>cimalee</b>!
> if we traded for jermaine , the pacers would not want sheed , they would want bonzi and dale


Well then... Go for it!!!!!
A line-up of Sheed/Z-Bo/Jerm together would be really scarey!  

I don't think it would happen, but we all can dream can't we?:sigh:


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## cimalee (Apr 17, 2003)

I say Bonzi because hes from there and Bird loves Dale Davis


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>cimalee</b>!
> I say Bonzi because hes from there and Bird loves Dale Davis


Wouldn't that be sooooo ironic that we trade McGinnis and Dale for Jerm! The Blazers say "Let's trade you to another team so you can become great and then we will get you back by trading the player we traded you for and a scrub?" The funny thing is, Jerm loved it in Portland!!!! Well at least the community...


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## antibody (Apr 4, 2003)

I would sure love to see a frontline combo of Jerm and Z-Bo for years to come in Portland. There is nothing wrong with dreaming.


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## magnifier (Jul 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>antibody</b>!
> I would sure love to see a frontline combo of Jerm and Z-Bo for years to come in Portland. There is nothing wrong with dreaming.


And could you imagine if Woods became as great as he should? A combo of Woods, Jerm, Zack busting up the league would be totally awesome!!!!

Don't worry, I always dream!


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