# OT: Is "Determination" A Skill?



## ABM (Dec 30, 2002)

Former Blazer Rick Brunson seems to think so....



> Rick Brunson has no misconceptions about his place in the NBA food chain. He's at the bottom and he knows it. Every year the former Salem High star has to fight for a roster spot, which entitles him to nothing more than a few more NBA paychecks, an opportunity to play hard in practice, and, for most of his career, a seat on the bench during games.
> 
> ''To me, determination is a skill," said Brunson, who has been with eight NBA teams, including the Celtics, during his eight-year National Basketball Association career. ''So is having a will to win and not quit. It's not something you're born with. It's something that is instilled in you. It was instilled in me by my high school coach Jack O'Brien and my college coach, [Temple University's] Coach [John] Chaney.
> 
> ''I refused to believe that I'm not good enough. If you tell me I can't do something I'm going to do it. I've always proved people wrong."....


----------



## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

I don't think so, a skill is something that can be learned and IMO few people can learn to be determined. IMI it is something you have or don't have, therefore it's an Attribute.


----------



## B_&_B (Feb 19, 2004)

I think its an attribute, asset, and added bonus.


----------



## Bookworm (Feb 23, 2005)

Schilly said:


> I don't think so, a skill is something that can be learned and IMO few people can learn to be determined. IMI it is something you have or don't have, therefore it's an Attribute.


 That might be true for 99% of people, You can learn to be
more determined, willing to work harder and longer and try 
to change things..Just look at Lance...He got determined
after the Cancer


----------



## BIG Q (Jul 8, 2005)

I think it is indeed a skill, but unfortunatelly it is most often demonstrarted only in contract years!

Believe me, players like Jordan, Bird and Magic know how to teach their team mates determination.


----------



## gatorpops (Dec 17, 2004)

:biggrin:


Schilly said:


> I don't think so, a skill is something that can be learned and IMO few people can learn to be determined. IMI it is something you have or don't have, therefore it's an Attribute.



Not to argue, but can't a person be "_determined"_ and then become "_more determined_" and even "_much more determined_." 

If so wouldn't it follow that you actually can develope determination and that would then be a learned skill? 

Sorta splitting hairs I guess.

gatorpops


----------



## Perfection (May 10, 2004)

Schilly said:


> I don't think so, a skill is something that can be learned and IMO few people can learn to be determined. IMI it is something you have or don't have, therefore it's an Attribute.



Before I even opened the thread, I planned on responding with something pretty much the same...I was thinking "attribute" as well.


----------



## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

I say it's a skill because i consider it equal to hustle. You can learn to give more effort, it just depends on the person if they can improve or not.


----------



## Trader Ed (Jun 17, 2002)

ever heard this 

"heart, desire, hustle.. its the fire within that makes a champion"

that to me is determination, and you do not have to win an NBA title to know of it. Its an individual attribute! Its personal.. its charecter. It defines you and makes who you are.


----------



## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

Bookworm said:


> That might be true for 99% of people, You can learn to be
> more determined, willing to work harder and longer and try
> to change things..Just look at Lance...He got determined
> after the Cancer


I did say few people can learn to be determined, or are they forced into determination, due to circumstance?

FOr the person who spke of increasing determination, is increased determination something that is taght are consciously increased or is it a byproduct of the existing determination refusing to fail?

Determintaion is something that is aquired via personal desire, a desire to succed a desire to win etc etc... Is that desire something that can be taught? I really don't think it is, people can become determined but I think predispositon and outside circumstances (cancer with lanc) are the factors. People who lack the desire quit before determination sets in.


----------



## ABM (Dec 30, 2002)

Also, I've heard it debated in these parts that _skill_ is acquired, whereas _talent_ is something you're born with.


----------



## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

that time i chewed my own foot off to get out of the bear trap was learned determination. 
that was AWESOME!


----------



## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

DrewFix said:


> that time i chewed my own foot off to get out of the bear trap was learned determination.
> that was AWESOME!


The thing that's sad is when someone hasn't learned determination after the second time that happens to them.

Ed O.


----------



## ABM (Dec 30, 2002)

DrewFix said:


> that time i chewed my own foot off to get out of the bear trap was learned determination.
> that was AWESOME!



I've never actually chewed my foot off. Shot myself there plenty of times, though.


----------



## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

Ed O said:


> The thing that's sad is when someone hasn't learned determination after the second time that happens to them.
> 
> Ed O.


so with that, have we come to the conclusion that desperation makes determination a skill if the lesson isn't learned the first time? 
hind site is 20/20.


----------



## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

ABM said:


> I've never actually chewed my foot off. Shot myself there plenty of times, though.


the thing is i keep shooting myself in the foot and then putting it in my mouth to stop the bleeding...


----------



## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

ACtually on a nother note...

To me a skil is measureable. you can rate a persons ability to dribble, you can rate their jumping ability you can determine shooting percentages. Determination is not measurable in any way but subjectiuvely. Just like you can't wegh heart, or leadership.

Determination is an attribute not a skill.


----------



## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

Schilly said:


> ACtually on a nother note...
> 
> To me a skil is measureable. you can rate a persons ability to dribble, you can rate their jumping ability you can determine shooting percentages. Determination is not measurable in any way but subjectiuvely. Just like you can't wegh heart, or leadership.
> 
> Determination is an attribute not a skill.


my multi-sided dice say other wise.


----------



## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

DrewFix said:


> my multi-sided dice say other wise.


My druid beats your paladin, now back to basketball.


----------



## DrewFix (Feb 9, 2004)

Schilly said:


> My druid beats your paladin, now back to basketball.


i couldn't decide if dice would agree or disagree so i just said they begged to differ. i do, however agree that it is an attribute. i can't believe that this is an actual debate.
and for one more record i would never use a paladin!


----------



## DWadeistheTruth (Apr 25, 2005)

You could have all the talent in the world. But if you don't have this asset. You will be simply and allstar. Never a Champion.


----------



## mediocre man (Feb 24, 2004)

Determination is a trait. You have to learn a skill, while traits are what we are born with. Either that or it's one of the seven deadly sins....I believe right after sloth.


----------



## Bookworm (Feb 23, 2005)

We have all been determined to to ride a bike without training
wheels, get a drivers liscense and such forth...Some people
just have more of it, or they learn that if you put your mind to it
and keep trying you usualy get better...

So determination is something we all have in varying amounts,
when you use it to constantly challenge yourself to be better,
you have turned it into a Skill..which some of us lack...

We all decide what to be determined about..So if you can
choose to apply something or not..doesn't that make it a 
skill


----------



## gatorpops (Dec 17, 2004)

If determination is an attribute as many have claimed then we would have to be born with it and it would be of no use for anyone else to strive for it. 

It is an attribute of character true, but it was learned someplace or other thrugh experience/experiances, or so it seems to me.

gatorpops


----------

