# Semi OT: The Official Tonight around the NBA thread



## MikeDC

Bucks vs. Sixers.
These are two pretty good teams. Bogut can play. He's blocked a few shots and probably has a double double. TJ Ford is playing out of his mind. Except for him being a competitor, it's nice to him back at a high level from such a serious injury. They're a lot like Washington in their scoring ability with Redd and Simmons on the wings, except their inside options (Bogut, Magloire, Joe Smith, Gadzuric) are light years ahead of anything the Wiz had last year (Haywood, Thomas, Kwame, Ruffin). If they keep playing like this, they'll compete with the Pistons and Pacers.

I was wrong, Iggy ain't gonna get a lot of shots on a team with AI and Webber. Unfortunately, people forget just how good those two are. They're really really good players when they're healthy. Kyle Korver is such a one-trick pony.

The sixers are booed off the court at the end of OT! :laugh:

Kings vs. Hornets
Didn't watch as much of this one so far. Chris Paul and Speedy Claxton looks like a nice 1-2 punch. PJ Brown will be effective until he gets worn down. Des Mason didn't start and hasn't done anything.

The curse of SAR appears to be affecting the Kings already. They can't buy a bucket. Are down by 20!

Nuggets vs. Spurs
Fabricio Oberto has the same crazy-eyed look as Nocioni. Duncan is more or less playing the point for decent stretches... bringing the ball up the court and all. A couple times he's shown what he can really do and just made a ridiculous shot look easy.

As I mentioned, Nene is down and likely out for the season. Earl Boykins is an underrated player. Eduardo Najera looks like the little Mexican embalmer from 6 feet under. Carmelo is in very good shape to start the year, unlike last year when he was fat.


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

I'm finding that basketball is very boring at the begining of the season. The intensity is just not there.


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

How bout these lines..

CWebb - 32 points, 14 boards, 5 assists
TJ Ford - 16 points, 9 boards, 14 assists


 


Great to see Webber acting like his old self, at least for a night. Hopefully he can keep it up.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



TripleDouble said:


> I'm finding that basketball is very boring at the begining of the season. The intensity is just not there.


Bucks-Sixers was a legitimately great game, and the fantastic crowd in Oklahoma City has made that a fun game to watch.

Mike, did you catch the halftime interview with Larry Harris? He said he expects the Bucks to compete for homecourt in the first round, and based on what I saw tonight, I'd say that is not at all a far-fetched goal. They are deep, they are talented, and they seem to be very well-coached. And this is with a dreadfully out-of-shape Magloire.

OT: I've said this a million times over the years, but I can't stand it when the League Pass feed is from the road team's broadcaster and it's an over-the-air station. Instead of getting commercials, you get a steady diet of the same two or three NBA PSAs. It's maddening.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

This may sound sacrilegious, but I would like to see TNT give Kenny and Barkley the boot and just go with Reggie. 

Barkley's great, but the shtick is tiring, and it seems like everything he says anymore verges back to "if you don't have the best player in the league, your team is going nowhere." That may be true, but I'd like a tad more analysis than that.

Reggie is sharp as a tack, very well-spoken, and he's actually played against every guy in the league except for the rookies. I hope at the very least they make sure he gets his fair share of air time.


----------



## truebluefan

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

I have lost in my predictions. The first three games, I have been wrong about.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



ScottMay said:


> Bucks-Sixers was a legitimately great game, and the fantastic crowd in Oklahoma City has made that a fun game to watch.
> 
> Mike, did you catch the halftime interview with Larry Harris? He said he expects the Bucks to compete for homecourt in the first round, and based on what I saw tonight, I'd say that is not at all a far-fetched goal. They are deep, they are talented, and they seem to be very well-coached. And this is with a dreadfully out-of-shape Magloire.


Nope, I spent halftime of that game watching Tim Duncan make a strangly Ben Gordon looking floater. I agree that the Bucks looked quite good. Magloire and Des Mason both looked like a couple of D-O-G-S.



> OT: I've said this a million times over the years, but I can't stand it when the League Pass feed is from the road team's broadcaster and it's an over-the-air station. Instead of getting commercials, you get a steady diet of the same two or three NBA PSAs. It's maddening.


You'd think they could sell that space. Pretty often I fall asleep watching the late games (and reading boring economics stuff) and the League Pass off-air "theme music" sort of blends into a generic recurring nightmare.


----------



## bullsville

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



ScottMay said:


> This may sound sacrilegious, but I would like to see TNT give Kenny and Barkley the boot and just go with Reggie.
> 
> Barkley's great, but the shtick is tiring, and it seems like everything he says anymore verges back to "if you don't have the best player in the league, your team is going nowhere." That may be true, but I'd like a tad more analysis than that.
> 
> Reggie is sharp as a tack, very well-spoken, and he's actually played against every guy in the league except for the rookies. I hope at the very least they make sure he gets his fair share of air time.


You are 100% dead on about Reggie, I didn't see all of the evening's broadcast but he was outstanding.

I did catch a few not-even-remotely subtle digs at the Pacers' players. When asked about PHX's James Jones, Reggie said "He was one of the few Pacers who listened to me". Earlier, he openly questioned their chemistry and leadership.


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

How bout this Dallas/PHX game?

Dallas was down by 17, Dirk hit 3 huge three's, and they just went up by 1 with about 1:45 left on that Terry layup.


----------



## jbulls

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



ScottMay said:


> This may sound sacrilegious, but I would like to see TNT give Kenny and Barkley the boot and just go with Reggie.
> 
> Barkley's great, but the shtick is tiring, and it seems like everything he says anymore verges back to "if you don't have the best player in the league, your team is going nowhere." That may be true, but I'd like a tad more analysis than that.
> 
> Reggie is sharp as a tack, very well-spoken, and he's actually played against every guy in the league except for the rookies. I hope at the very least they make sure he gets his fair share of air time.


The Kenny Smith/Charles Barkley banter is wearing a little thin these days. Still better than the slop we're treated to on any NFL halftime show though. And it absolutely kills ESPN's NBA coverage. I suppose I can kind of understand people being entertained by SAS, and I legitimately enjoy Greg Anthony, but Tim Legler is just horrendous. ESPN seems to be getting fat and happy lately at the expense of good programming/analysis. It's almost as self referential as MTV at this point.

Raja Bell was excellent as an analyst for ESPN News during the playoffs last year. I hope somebody gives him a steady national gig when his playing days are over.


----------



## Rhyder

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

I'm happy that I was so desparate for another PG on my fantasy team that I picked up Ford and actually had him in my lineup last night. :banana:


----------



## L.O.B

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

I watched a little of the Sixers/Bucks game last night before watching San Antonio/ Denver. Did San Antoinio really need to get better? Finley and Oberto are really nice additions to an already terrific squad. Oberto is off the charts in Jib Factor. 
BTW anyone catch Brent Barry kiss Stern last night during the ring ceremony? I laughed my *** off, Barry certainly didn't get that since of humor from his dad.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



L.O.B said:


> I watched a little of the Sixers/Bucks game last night before watching San Antonio/ Denver. Did San Antoinio really need to get better? Finley and Oberto are really nice additions to an already terrific squad. Oberto is off the charts in Jib Factor.
> BTW anyone catch Brent Barry kiss Stern last night during the ring ceremony? I laughed my *** off, Barry certainly didn't get that since of humor from his dad.


Barry holds the record for the funniest quote ever by a Bulls player, imo.

During his season here, he hit a couple free throws to put the Bulls over the 100-point mark and thus provide a screaming, frenzied United Center crowd with a free sandwich (don't remember which).

Afterwards, he said something like, "I felt like Jesus out there with the loaves and the fishes, feeding the multitudes."

It is pretty scary how nicely Finley, Van Exel, and Oberto seem to fit in. That organization is simply firing on all cylinders -- great owner, great front office, great building, great coach, great fans, great franchise player, great supporting cast, you name it.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



L.O.B said:


> BTW anyone catch Brent Barry kiss Stern last night during the ring ceremony? I laughed my *** off, Barry certainly didn't get that since of humor from his dad.


That was classic. Even Stern was cracking up.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

I watched some of the games last night too...was very impressed with Milwaukee, Ford is the real deal and Bogut is gonna be a solid big man, they looked very good and played well together. 

I was shocked that NOK absolutely dismantled the Kings, are they going to be better than expected or was it a fluke? Every anaylst I have heard has predicted the Kings to win their division but they looked like crap on a stick against a cellar dweller last night.

The Spurs are definitley a good team. I thought Denver actually looked pretty good too, if they weren't playing the world champs last night then that game probably goes in the "W" column.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

Btw, did anyone else see Scott Pollards "how to be like Reggie" clinic with Granger? That was hilarious, especially the end where Granger was like "who is this Reggie guy yuo keep talking about" lol....brilliant.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



ScottMay said:


> Barry holds the record for the funniest quote ever by a Bulls player, imo.
> 
> During his season here, he hit a couple free throws to put the Bulls over the 100-point mark and thus provide a screaming, frenzied United Center crowd with a free sandwich (don't remember which).
> 
> Afterwards, he said something like, "I felt like Jesus out there with the loaves and the fishes, feeding the multitudes."
> 
> It is pretty scary how nicely Finley, Van Exel, and Oberto seem to fit in. That organization is simply firing on all cylinders -- great owner, great front office, great building, great coach, great fans, great franchise player, great supporting cast, you name it.


Never heard that one before. Funny.

But my alltime favorite Bulls quote still goes to Bill Wennington, who, on an MJ "Superman" night, got the last basket of the game for his only 2 points of the night, and remarked "Michael and I combined for 57 points."


----------



## TripleDouble

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

One impression I had from opening night is that Doug Collins is the best national color guy in pro sports. He's Tim McCarver without the annoyingly strident pedantry.


----------



## bullsville

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



ace20004u said:


> Btw, did anyone else see Scott Pollards "how to be like Reggie" clinic with Granger? That was hilarious, especially the end where Granger was like "who is this Reggie guy yuo keep talking about" lol....brilliant.


That was awesome, yes, they really "roasted" Reggie in that entire segment.

I personally liked the "don't take it to the hole weak" comment over the video of Tayshaun's block in the playoffs.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



ace20004u said:


> I watched some of the games last night too...was very impressed with Milwaukee, Ford is the real deal and Bogut is gonna be a solid big man, they looked very good and played well together.
> 
> I was shocked that NOK absolutely dismantled the Kings, are they going to be better than expected or was it a fluke? Every anaylst I have heard has predicted the Kings to win their division but they looked like crap on a stick against a cellar dweller last night.
> 
> The Spurs are definitley a good team. I thought Denver actually looked pretty good too, if they weren't playing the world champs last night then that game probably goes in the "W" column.


I don't know how much can be read into that game. Oklahoma City/Baton Rouge got a huge, emotional lift from the fans. But the Kings sure laid down for that one.

I was impressed with every other team I saw last night, win or lose. Dallas and Phoenix both looked good. I am fully on the Bucks bandwagon -- Bogut is clearly going to be right in the mix for ROY, Simmons is a stud, Ford is downright dangerous, and Redd is even more dangerous when he gets to play with a good point and not have to create his own shot. They've got a good bench, they look like they're playing stouter defense, and I like the way they didn't give up in that game. But I also liked what I saw from Philadelphia. There are still some kinks to work out, and it would probably behoove them to run a lot more plays for Igoudala, but if Webber stays healthy, they are going to be a bear.


----------



## ScottMay

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



TripleDouble said:


> One impression I had from opening night is that Doug Collins is the best national color guy in pro sports. He's Tim McCarver without the annoyingly strident pedantry.


:yes:


----------



## bullsville

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



TripleDouble said:


> One impression I had from opening night is that Doug Collins is the best national color guy in pro sports. He's Tim McCarver without the annoyingly strident pedantry.


"Mark Cuban, wearing Craig Sager's sportsjacket" was priceless.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



TripleDouble said:


> One impression I had from opening night is that Doug Collins is the best national color guy in pro sports. He's Tim McCarver without the annoyingly strident pedantry.


Word. Doug is the best color man. When he and Marv work together, it's the best.

I think that Steve Kerr quickly shaped himself into an excellent color man. In terms of team broadcasts, I'm fond of Sean Elliott's (sp?) work when I watch Spurs broadcasts.


----------



## rosenthall

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

Personally, I think Phoenix is going to have quite a bit of problems. They'll still be a decent team, but it looks like they can be stopped pretty easily with good defense now, after the talent exodus they had during the offseason. And while their defense is better, I don't think it's that much better to make up for this discrepancy. Plus with the way the team is setup now, I think Nash is going to have a lot of tread on his tires by the end of the season. 

Also, Jason Terry has to be the best unspoken of player in the NBA. You never hear about the guy, but he just seems to do his thing every season. He's probably better than either Kirk or Ben right now.


----------



## ace20004u

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



ScottMay said:


> I don't know how much can be read into that game. Oklahoma City/Baton Rouge got a huge, emotional lift from the fans. But the Kings sure laid down for that one.
> 
> I was impressed with every other team I saw last night, win or lose. Dallas and Phoenix both looked good. I am fully on the Bucks bandwagon -- Bogut is clearly going to be right in the mix for ROY, Simmons is a stud, Ford is downright dangerous, and Redd is even more dangerous when he gets to play with a good point and not have to create his own shot. They've got a good bench, they look like they're playing stouter defense, and I like the way they didn't give up in that game. But I also liked what I saw from Philadelphia. There are still some kinks to work out, and it would probably behoove them to run a lot more plays for Igoudala, but if Webber stays healthy, they are going to be a bear.



I agree for the most part. A lot of teams did look sharp last night. I don't agree on Philly at this point though, they aren't gonna get a career game out of Webber every night and their interior defense was pretty porous. That being said, they should be a much better defensive team when Dalembert gets back IMO.


----------



## such sweet thunder

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



rosenthall said:


> Also, Jason Terry has to be the best unspoken of player in the NBA. You never hear about the guy, but he just seems to do his thing every season. He's probably better than either Kirk or Ben right now.


I herebye name the Anti-Jason Terry award, the "Shareef Abdur-Rahim." Looks like Sac-town's is on their way towards a complete breakdown.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



rosenthall said:


> Personally, I think Phoenix is going to have quite a bit of problems.


I wouldn't worry about Phoenix. They still have Steve Nash, and he was last year's MP3.


----------



## MikeDC

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



rosenthall said:


> Personally, I think Phoenix is going to have quite a bit of problems. They'll still be a decent team, but it looks like they can be stopped pretty easily with good defense now, after the talent exodus they had during the offseason. And while their defense is better, I don't think it's that much better to make up for this discrepancy. Plus with the way the team is setup now, I think Nash is going to have a lot of tread on his tires by the end of the season.
> 
> Also, Jason Terry has to be the best unspoken of player in the NBA. You never hear about the guy, but he just seems to do his thing every season. He's probably better than either Kirk or Ben right now.


Yeah. I was sort of writing off the Mavs halfway through that game but by the end they were just pouring it on.

I like Terry, a lot, and Devin Harris played really well too.

But what I really came out of that game thinking was that Daniels and Howard could be the best set of win players in the league in a couple of years. Compare what they do to Vince Carter and Richard Jefferson, and I think (especially as Kidd slows down due to age), that the Mavs duo is going to be "that good" for a long time.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*



Mikedc said:


> I like Terry, a lot, and Devin Harris played really well too.


FYI - Jason Terry is an unrestricted free agent after this season. Obviously he hasn't been brought up as a Bulls target because of our numerous small guards. But I'm also a big Terry fan, and would be all for bringing him here if he fit. That of course would only happen if we traded Ben Gordon. And more than likely, trading Gordon would net us a large salary back to kill our cap room, making us unable to land Terry. So it's pretty much impossible.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Semi OT: Opening night around the league*

I'm not watching any games at the moment, but a boxscore I'm watching says that LeBron James is 4-4 on 3-pointers. And he just hit 3 of those in a 1-minute time span. Wow.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Semi OT: The Official Tonight around the NBA thread...*

i like this thread started by mike on opening night. (even though the REAL opening night was a day later :smilewink )

*however, i edited the title and am bumping it, cause i thought it would be a fun thread to continue and make comments about games happening around the league throughout the season.* 


tonights random (ok maybe not SO random) game thought is this:

_knicks home opener at MSG v. the WiZaRdS...who do you pick??_


(why, the wizards of course!!)


and on another note, not entirely unrelated - did anyone happen to notice what kobe, uh sorry, MAMBA, was wearing the other night in Denver? yes, that's right...pantyhose.


http://www.yaysports.com/nba/2005/11/kobe_bryant_wears_tights.html


----------



## JRose5

*Re: Semi OT: The Official Tonight around the NBA thread...*



mizenkay said:


> i like this thread started by mike on opening night. (even though the REAL opening night was a day later :smilewink )
> 
> *however, i edited the title and am bumping it, cause i thought it would be a fun thread to continue and make comments about games happening around the league throughout the season.*
> 
> 
> tonights random (ok maybe not SO random) game thought is this:
> 
> _knicks home opener at MSG v. the WiZaRdS...who do you pick??_
> 
> 
> (why, the wizards of course!!)
> 
> 
> and on another note, not entirely unrelated - did anyone happen to notice what kobe, uh sorry, MAMBA, was wearing the other night in Denver? yes, that's right...pantyhose.
> 
> 
> http://www.yaysports.com/nba/2005/11/kobe_bryant_wears_tights.html



Is there any way that neither team can win that Knicks/Wizards game?
Some sort of forfeit where they both lose?



I won't get to catch any of the games on tonight, but the Cavs/Spurs will probably be a good game, and I'd be most interested in seeing Wolves/Sonics.

Hopefully the trend keeps up, this has been a great opening week.


----------



## narek

I'm going to watch the Spurs/Cavs game but with the sound off so I don't hear any of those ESPN "experts". 

And of course I want the Wizards to win. The Knicks are evil (although a co-worker is horrified that there's a professional team named the Wizards - I must get a Wizards sweatshirt to wear to our holiday party).


----------



## MikeDC

narek said:


> I'm going to watch the Spurs/Cavs game but with the sound off so I don't hear any of those ESPN "experts".
> 
> And of course I want the Wizards to win. The Knicks are evil (although a co-worker is horrified that there's a professional team named the Wizards - I must get a Wizards sweatshirt to wear to our holiday party).


Ils sont "Lez Bullez"!

:frenchy:


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Semi OT: The Official Tonight around the NBA thread...*



JRose5 said:


> Is there any way that neither team can win that Knicks/Wizards game?


well it doesn't really matter cause tonight is all about larry brown. i'm watching some of the pre-game and it's all larry/all the time. larry's back! the papers tomorrow? they'll be a larry-fest. 

larry said before the game "i have no clue who to play". reporters lapped it up. oh that larry.

i can't wait to see the back page of the post tomorrow if they lose. i know, i'm mean.

:laugh:


----------



## MikeDC

:frenchy:

I'll be watching Knicks Bullez tilt as soon as the French news rebroadcast is over. 

By the way, lemme go off on a bit of a rant here about the French news. Those silly *******s make Lacy Banks look like Edward R. Murrow. 

Gotta be the the only country in the world where they can have places going up in flames in a way that makes the Watts Riots look like a summer campfire sleepover and still spend half of the newscast talking about scientific efforts to reconstruct what Copernicus' face looked like and the Riverdance farewell tour.

Money quote was them interviewing a guy just got laid off because someone torched the company he worked at... gets quoted as being "scandalized" about the whole affair. LOL.

My wife tells me this sounds a little bit less silly and effiminent in French, but not much.


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Semi OT: The Official Tonight around the NBA thread...*



mizenkay said:


> well it doesn't really matter cause tonight is all about larry brown. i'm watching some of the pre-game and it's all larry/all the time. larry's back! the papers tomorrow? they'll be a larry-fest.
> 
> larry said before the game "i have no clue who to play". reporters lapped it up. oh that larry.
> 
> i can't wait to see the back page of the post tomorrow if they lose. i know, i'm mean.
> 
> :laugh:


:laugh:

Hysterical. You think P-Jax is getting similar attention throughout the season?


----------



## yodurk

*Re: Semi OT: The Official Tonight around the NBA thread...*

The Bobcats might be more improved than we think. Now they're winning 52-44 at halftime IN Philadelphia. I know Philly's not great, but the Cats aren't the joke that people make them out to be it seems.

And I just caught the Knicks-Wizards score. Apparently the "mediocre" Wizards are winning by 12 versus the "much improved" Knicks for the New York home opener (through the 1st quarter). Wonder if the Knicks can put together a furious rally as well.

Edit/Updates...

The Bobcats indeed did it. They might be quite a surprise this year. Alot of good young talent, and a very strong frontline. They won 110 - 93 in Philly. Very impressive. Could it be a 30-win season for them?

Looks like the Knicks are done with 3:30 left (down by 7...you never know though). Knicks are outrebounding the Wiz 56-32, but 29 are offensive rebounds! :eek8: The Knicks 32% shooting surely has something to do with that.

Oh yeah, and I'm watching the Spurs/Cavs...Spurs are absolutely putting on a clinic in the 2nd half. They look insanely good all the way around.


----------



## MikeDC

Wizards torch the Knicks in the first quarter... and have 9 points in the second with only a minute left.

Really wierd game.

Curry got two quick fouls and took a seat.

Antawn Jamison forgot how to shoot over the summer... don't know what happened to him.


----------



## kukoc4ever

Wow, AD is playing like a warrior tonight. He's the baddest man on the Knicks. 14 rebounds, 6 offensive in 24 minutes. 1-9 shooting is no good... but he's the most physical man on the floor. Really giving the Knicks a presence.


----------



## spongyfungy

Philly sucks. down 17 against the Bobcats, couldn't get past them. Team has two superstars and one up and coming.

Bulls down 20+, we beat the Bobcats with no stars.


----------



## yodurk

Oh man...just saw the end of the Pistons/Celtics game. Mark Blount hit a jumper to give them the lead with like 2 seconds left, then Rip Hamilton "ripped" their hearts out with a game winner of his own. Game. Set. Match.


----------



## kukoc4ever

The Celtics / Pistons game was a thriller.

I don't understand how people can rip Paul Pierce. The guy is playing like stud. He absolutely owned Tayshaun Prince down the stretch of that game.

Then, Mark Blount of all people hits a huge go-ahead basket to put the Celtics up 1 with .8 seconds.... only to have Rip Hamilton drain a shot at the buzzer on a catch and shoot to win it for the Eastern champs.

Great game. Its been a fun start to the regular season.


----------



## narek

Did you see that Detroit-Boston score? 82-81 - last second shot by Hamilton won the game. 

I thought the Cavs would be a bit stronger against the Spurs, I wanted an exciting game that I could really get into. Sigh.

Knicks 0-2, otoh, is somewhat diverting.


----------



## yodurk

kukoc4ever said:


> I don't understand how people can rip Paul Pierce. The guy is playing like stud. He absolutely owned Tayshaun Prince down the stretch of that game.


You're referring to me of course.  I'll argue that Prince is a finesse defender and will always struggle against the power 3's (which is a big reason why Artest will always be the ultimate defensive player, and why Tayshuan is a little overrated). Pierce is just too strong for Prince. And I'll give Pierce his props, so far he's playing like the Pierce I loved watching back in 2002. When his heart is in it, he's a great player. 



> Great game. Its been a fun start to the regular season.


Indeed it is.


----------



## jbulls

kukoc4ever said:


> Wow, AD is playing like a warrior tonight. He's the baddest man on the Knicks. 14 rebounds, 6 offensive in 24 minutes. 1-9 shooting is no good... but he's the most physical man on the floor. Really giving the Knicks a presence.


Davis played a great game, minus the shooting. He's going to wear out fast playing 33 MPG though.

Eddy was Eddy. A couple highlight reel plays, even one really nice assist, but he managed to commit 5 TO's in 16 min's. Larry Brown put him in the game in the 4th then yanked him two minutes later after a particularly bad pass and re-inserted Channing Frye. Neither Curry nor Brown looked pleased. Frye looked good. If Ariza could shoot at all he'd be a very, very good player. 

It's early days yet, but I wonder if NY will be that great a fit for Eddy both in terms of the amount of pressure playing there and the way he fits in basketball wise with his teammates.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Man, Oberto looks great in the high post, and Walton can't stop talking about him.

The fact ath we could have actually split the MLE on Duhon and Oberto makes me pretty upset. I guess he had no incentive to play for us if the Spurs were interested. I really think he might be a better player than Eddy Curry right now, although he's already 30 years old.


----------



## MikeDC

Jamison found that shot. He started 2-12 and ended 8-22.

OK, I missed most of the second half :|

Marbury's idea of running the offense is dribbling around for 15 seconds. He's gotta be the league's least effective "superstar"

Brendan Haywood still doesn't get along very well with Eddy or AD. He gave Eddy a couple of elbows on a drive and then goaded Curry into knocking him on his *** the Knicks' next possession. Haywood sort of flopped, but it was a pretty smart play.

Haywood, by the way, has developed some pretty sound basketball IQ. The Haywood, Jamison, Jeffries, Arenas, Daniels linup might be the single smartest in the league outside of the Spurs. Not saying they're the best, but they know how to play the game.

---------

Spurs vs. Cavs

Bill Walton is close to pronouncing Oberto the next Bill Russell. He well could be performing fellatio on the Argentine big man during the current commercial timeout.


----------



## kukoc4ever

jbulls said:


> Eddy was Eddy. A couple highlight reel plays, even one really nice assist, but he managed to commit 5 TO's in 16 min's.


If tonight was "Eddy was Eddy" he'd never see the floor or get signed by any team. He played like crap. If you look at his history, his usual game is not 5 turnovers and 4 fouls in 16 minutes. That's a Sweetney-esqe foul rate. The Knicks have no chemistry at all right now, I agree. But, that's kind of what everyone expected, right? Its going to take a few games, just like the Bulls, for Brown to find out a rotation. 



> Frye looked good. If Ariza could shoot at all he'd be a very, very good player.


I agree. Ariza is a great athlete and hustle player. Frye will be solid it seems. The Knicks really do have a nice core of young talent there. Marbury was actually playing some D in the second half...... looked good....perhaps not as a PG but getting to the hole. Crawford was a non factor. And, Arenas is just a frightening player. 




> It's early days yet, but I wonder if NY will be that great a fit for Eddy both in terms of the amount of pressure playing there and the way he fits in basketball wise with his teammates.


Yah, we'll see. There are a lot of able bodies on that squad that are hungry for playing time. Not quite sure what Matt Barnes is doing starting games though. I guess Brown likes his spirit.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Mikedc said:


> Jamison found that shot. He started 2-12 and ended 8-22.
> 
> OK, I missed most of the second half :|
> 
> Marbury's idea of running the offense is dribbling around for 15 seconds. He's gotta be the league's least effective "superstar"
> 
> Brendan Haywood still doesn't get along very well with Eddy or AD. He gave Eddy a couple of elbows on a drive and then goaded Curry into knocking him on his *** the Knicks' next possession. Haywood sort of flopped, but it was a pretty smart play.
> 
> Haywood, by the way, has developed some pretty sound basketball IQ. The Haywood, Jamison, Jeffries, Arenas, Daniels linup might be the single smartest in the league outside of the Spurs. Not saying they're the best, but they know how to play the game.
> 
> ---------
> 
> Spurs vs. Cavs
> 
> Bill Walton is close to pronouncing Oberto the next Bill Russell. He well could be performing fellatio on the Argentine big man during the current commercial timeout.


Yeah, but good head aside, Oberto is playing really, really well already. The Spurs look unbeatable really. They have our depth plus three stars and a superstar. Miami, Detroit, and Indy will have a fighting chance in the finals because all three look like solid teams, but there's all 12 ESPN experts picked the Spurs to win it


----------



## MikeDC

Darius Miles Davis said:


> Yeah, but good head aside, Oberto is playing really, really well already. The Spurs look unbeatable really. They have our depth plus three stars and a superstar. Miami, Detroit, and Indy will have a fighting chance in the finals because all three look like solid teams, but there's all 12 ESPN experts picked the Spurs to win it


They're right. Barring an injury to Duncan, I don't see how anyone can beat them.

Meanwhile, I'm proving I'm a glutton for punishment - I'm gonna watch the Blazers and Nuggets and try and figure out whether we'll be trading Gordon for Zach Randolph or Kenyon Martin


----------



## kukoc4ever

yodurk said:


> You're referring to me of course.  I'll argue that Prince is a finesse defender and will always struggle against the power 3's (which is a big reason why Artest will always be the ultimate defensive player, and why Tayshuan is a little overrated). Pierce is just too strong for Prince. And I'll give Pierce his props, so far he's playing like the Pierce I loved watching back in 2002. When his heart is in it, he's a great player.


Nah, not just you. I just would like to see him on the Bulls is all. Boston would be crazy to trade the guy with the way he's playing though. Celtics may be a playoff team. This play in the 4th was just nasty. Baseline dunk after dusting Tayshaun. Tayshuan is a nice player, but he could not handle Pierce tonight.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Mikedc said:


> They're right. Barring an injury to Duncan, I don't see how anyone can beat them.
> 
> Meanwhile, I'm proving I'm a glutton for punishment - I'm gonna watch the Blazers and Nuggets and try and figure out whether we'll be trading Gordon for Zach Randolph or Kenyon Martin


Me too, but I'm mainly watching to check out Pryzbilla, who I didn't really watch last year when he started to put it together. 

Yeah, this game game is terrible.

edit: Jeez, Kmart should not be punching the padded backboard support. What would Denver do if he broke his hand?


----------



## The Krakken

Mikedc said:


> They're right. Barring an injury to Duncan, I don't see how anyone can beat them.
> 
> Meanwhile, I'm proving I'm a glutton for punishment - I'm gonna watch the Blazers and Nuggets and try and figure out whether we'll be trading Gordon for Zach Randolph or Kenyon Martin


Not funny on so many levels. That's just plain wrong.....just plain wrong...:nonono:


----------



## bullsville

The Knicks are 0-2, Jamal has been a non-factor and Eddy's numbers through 2 games are almost identical to what he put up last season as a Bull. So not only are the Knicks currently the worst team in the NBA (with 3 other teams) and the Bulls currently looking at a very high lottery pick next summer, I am currently looking very good for my long-standing view that Eddy (and Jamal) isn't (aren't) a difference maker(s). 

The Bulls, meanwhile, are 1-0 with an incredible comeback against a very nice 2nd-year team in Charlotte (ask the Sixers).

At this moment, the Bulls fan part of my life is grand. Too bad there are 81 more to play (and 80 for the Knicks), if the season ended right this moment it would be perfect.

So I'm going to enjoy it while I can! Got the stuffed pizza, got the Old Style, got the Denver resident's favorite. I'm set.

EDIT: In fact, I'm even going to honor Eddy with a spot in my signature, just to show him some love.


----------



## kukoc4ever

bullsville said:


> EDIT: In fact, I'm even going to honor Eddy with a spot in my signature, just to show him some love.


Make sure to add A.D. as well. He played the most minutes of any ex-Bulls tonite.


----------



## MikeDC

Well, one thing's for sure, the Blazers are bad.

The question is just why they're so bad. 

Pryzbilla is a nice, active guy with no offensive game whatsoever. He looks like a pretty good fit next to an offensive powerhouse like Randolph. But... I just don't see how Pryzzy and Tyson can be effective unless one of them makes an unforseen quantum leap on offense. Even the Bulls with MJ and Scottie on the wings wanted some guys who could score down low (Longley, Kukoc, Wennington, Cartwright etc. You didn't see them going out and looking for Dikembe Mutombo to pair up with Rodman). By that example, I'm just pointing out that even with the most powerful offensive guys you can imagine on the perimeter, no team is (or should be) comfortable with a purely defensive set of bigs. It just doesn't work very well in actual NBA games.

More importantly, I don't know if being "active" (read: moving around a lot) and blocking shots makes you a good defender. When it comes to actually stopping someone, I'm not sure he's very good. Marcus Camby appears to have eaten him up and spat him out. I didn't see the beginning of the game, but Camby's got 21 points and 14 boards in like no time at all.


----------



## MikeDC

Anyway, the Blazers have possibly the worst collection of guards ever.

Martell Webster just checked in though, so lets see him. 

He's got a pretty NBA looking body for a kid straight oug of high school.

Made a nice long-range jumper


----------



## bullsville

kukoc4ever said:


> Make sure to add A.D. as well. He played the most minutes of any ex-Bulls tonite.


But why would I do that?

I openly wanted Jamal and Eddy to be gone because of their complete lack of commitment to defense and rebounding and playing the right way, and since they were both traded away for "lesser talents" I am very interested in keeping track of how their new team is doing with them getting starter's minutes.

Especially now, since their new team sucks more with Jamal and even more yet with Jamal and Eddy. I have confidence in my opinions, that's why I am displaying them publicly. I don't expect to have to change the theme of my signature next summer due to the fact that I was 100% totally and completely wrong about the results of the trades, because IMHO the Bulls will continue to improve and Jamal and Eddy will continue to be the same 30-win Jamal and Eddy they were in Chicago.

I didn't want to see AD go, so why would I put something in my signature about that? I made no predictions about him so why would I keep track of him?


----------



## Babble-On

kukoc4ever said:


> If tonight was "Eddy was Eddy" he'd never see the floor or get signed by any team. He played like crap. If you look at his history, his usual game is not 5 turnovers and 4 fouls in 16 minutes.


I'd say Eddy was Eddy in that sometimes with Eddy those are the types of performances you get on a given night. Just like Jamal on occasion has his 3-15 type shooting games. The positive about Eddy though, is that last year he he managed to have those games not occur as frequenctly as they used to as the season progressed.


----------



## MikeDC

bullsville said:


> But why would I do that?
> 
> I openly wanted Jamal and Eddy to be gone because of their complete lack of commitment to defense and rebounding and playing the right way, and since they were both traded away for "lesser talents" I am very interested in keeping track of how their new team is doing with them getting starter's minutes.
> 
> Especially now, since their new team sucks more with Jamal and even more yet with Jamal and Eddy. I have confidence in my opinions, that's why I am displaying them publicly. I don't expect to have to change the theme of my signature next summer due to the fact that I was 100% totally and completely wrong about the results of the trades, because IMHO the Bulls will continue to improve and Jamal and Eddy will continue to be the same 30-win Jamal and Eddy they were in Chicago.
> 
> I didn't want to see AD go, so why would I put something in my signature about that? I made no predictions about him so why would I keep track of him?


Take it to the Eddy Curry thread.


----------



## kukoc4ever

bullsville said:


> because IMHO the Bulls will continue to improve and Jamal and Eddy will continue to be the same 30-win Jamal and Eddy they were in Chicago.


OK, fine, but make sure to add AD to all statements like this. If the season goes on like the first two games have, he'll have played more minutes than either Jamal or Eddy.

EDIT: Please reply in the Curry thread. Don't ruin this one. I'm guilty as well with this reply.


----------



## MikeDC

kukoc4ever said:


> OK, fine, but make sure to add AD to all statements like this. If the season goes on like the first two games have, he'll have played more minutes than either Jamal or Eddy.


Take it to the AD thread! 

----------------------------------

Martell Webster has no idea where to go when he doesn't have the ball. Neither does anyone else on the Blazers.

----------------------

I'm was a fan of Chris Kamen before, and his game has only stepped up now that he's got Oberto's hair.


----------



## bullsville

Mikedc said:


> Well, one thing's for sure, the Blazers are bad.
> 
> The question is just why they're so bad.
> 
> Pryzbilla is a nice, active guy with no offensive game whatsoever. He looks like a pretty good fit next to an offensive powerhouse like Randolph. But... I just don't see how Pryzzy and Tyson can be effective unless one of them makes an unforseen quantum leap on offense. Even the Bulls with MJ and Scottie on the wings wanted some guys who could score down low (Longley, Kukoc, Wennington, Cartwright etc. You didn't see them going out and looking for Dikembe Mutombo to pair up with Rodman). By that example, I'm just pointing out that even with the most powerful offensive guys you can imagine on the perimeter, no team is (or should be) comfortable with a purely defensive set of bigs. It just doesn't work very well in actual NBA games.
> 
> More importantly, I don't know if being "active" (read: moving around a lot) and blocking shots makes you a good defender. When it comes to actually stopping someone, I'm not sure he's very good. Marcus Camby appears to have eaten him up and spat him out. I didn't see the beginning of the game, but Camby's got 21 points and 14 boards in like no time at all.


I'm not worried about Przy and Tyson fitting together, if Tyson plays 35 minutes and Przy 30 that's only 19 minutes they are on the floor together. And it means you will always have a shot-blocker/rebounder on the floor.

It's the same as putting Tyson and Big Ben together, you make it work. And you don't allow many 4th quarter points with the two of them defending down the stretch of games.

Skiles commented yesterday that winning teams in the NBA have big men who can rebound and defend, that in the end it's the guards who have to make the plays down the stretch in crunch time. Throw in a Songaila with either Tyson or Przybilla on the floor the rest of the game and the C's will get enough points on pick and roll and offensive rebounds and passes off of movement (which Songaila excels at).

Przy isn't a max guy, but he should come at a price that allows us to also add a max guy if we want. Anything more than that and I think Pax takes his chances with adding a defensive big man in the draft (thanks, Isiah!).


----------



## MikeDC

bullsville said:


> I'm not worried about Przy and Tyson fitting together, if Tyson plays 35 minutes and Przy 30 that's only 19 minutes they are on the floor together. And it means you will always have a shot-blocker/rebounder on the floor.
> 
> It's the same as putting Tyson and Big Ben together, you make it work. And you don't allow many 4th quarter points with the two of them defending down the stretch of games.


No... one of those guys is Ben Wallace, a perrienial defensive player of the year candidate. The other is Joel Pryzbilla.



> Skiles commented yesterday that winning teams in the NBA have big men who can rebound and defend, that in the end it's the guards who have to make the plays down the stretch in crunch time. Throw in a Songaila with either Tyson or Przybilla on the floor the rest of the game and the C's will get enough points on pick and roll and offensive rebounds and passes off of movement (which Songaila excels at).


You're entering into the realm of "desire to see the home team win" inspired fantasy. And if Skiles thinks you win with no offense from him frontcourt then he is too. Songaila is a nice player, but come freaking on. Songaila-Chandler-Pryzbilla isn't even in the top half of NBA big man rotations.

And anyway, after what I saw tonight, I'm having a pretty hard time understanding the belief that Pryzbilla's a good defender. He's a guy who generates statistics, but he really didn't play very good defense.



> Przy isn't a max guy, but he should come at a price that allows us to also add a max guy if we want. Anything more than that and I think Pax takes his chances with adding a defensive big man in the draft (thanks, Isiah!).


If he wants to do that, he's going to have to trade next year's pick for a shot in the 2007 draft, because there's no useful bigs next summer.


----------



## UMfan83

So I gotta ask. Are the Bobcats potentially good? I mean after playing 3 dominating quarters against the Bulls and blowing out the 76ers tonight, you gotta wonder. If May and Felton develop like Deng and Gordon did last year, then you add them to a semi-established Okafor and Williams and all the sudden they are looking like the Bulls last year. Of course they have no depth, but I like the stratagy similar to the Bulls of picking players from winning college programs (or did that just happened by chance).


Or maybe Philly just sucks. Oh well one less opponent to fight out for a playoff spot


----------



## jbulls

kukoc4ever said:


> If tonight was "Eddy was Eddy" he'd never see the floor or get signed by any team. He played like crap. If you look at his history, his usual game is not 5 turnovers and 4 fouls in 16 minutes. That's a Sweetney-esqe foul rate. The Knicks have no chemistry at all right now, I agree. But, that's kind of what everyone expected, right? Its going to take a few games, just like the Bulls, for Brown to find out a rotation.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. Ariza is a great athlete and hustle player. Frye will be solid it seems. The Knicks really do have a nice core of young talent there. Marbury was actually playing some D in the second half...... looked good....perhaps not as a PG but getting to the hole. Crawford was a non factor. And, Arenas is just a frightening player.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yah, we'll see. There are a lot of able bodies on that squad that are hungry for playing time. Not quite sure what Matt Barnes is doing starting games though. I guess Brown likes his spirit.


K4E...I didn't mean to say that Eddy played an average game for Eddy, I just meant that there was good and bad, as there always has been to varying degrees with him. I'm on record as saying I wish we'd kept him and I think he's already a good player, with a chance to be very good. I think there's a real possibility that in NY he'll turn into LB's whipping boy and that the skillset of that team will suit his game less than that of his former Bulls teammates.

This is my last post regarding Eddy in this thread, btw.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

Mikedc said:


> Well, one thing's for sure, the Blazers are bad.
> 
> The question is just why they're so bad.
> 
> Pryzbilla is a nice, active guy with no offensive game whatsoever. He looks like a pretty good fit next to an offensive powerhouse like Randolph. But... I just don't see how Pryzzy and Tyson can be effective unless one of them makes an unforseen quantum leap on offense. Even the Bulls with MJ and Scottie on the wings wanted some guys who could score down low (Longley, Kukoc, Wennington, Cartwright etc. You didn't see them going out and looking for Dikembe Mutombo to pair up with Rodman). By that example, I'm just pointing out that even with the most powerful offensive guys you can imagine on the perimeter, no team is (or should be) comfortable with a purely defensive set of bigs. It just doesn't work very well in actual NBA games.
> 
> More importantly, I don't know if being "active" (read: moving around a lot) and blocking shots makes you a good defender. When it comes to actually stopping someone, I'm not sure he's very good. Marcus Camby appears to have eaten him up and spat him out. I didn't see the beginning of the game, but Camby's got 21 points and 14 boards in like no time at all.


I agree 

not a fan of acquiring the Pryz ..you can get an AD like defensive vet big like Lo Wright for half the cost

Pryz is a fit with Zach Chubs and in particular , he would be awesome with Pau Gasol - if there was some way for Jerry West to acquire him. Given the vet flavor of his team he is more likely to find imediate benefit in Theo Ratliff


----------



## bullsville

Mikedc said:


> No... one of those guys is Ben Wallace, a perrienial defensive player of the year candidate. The other is Joel Pryzbilla.


What's the difference?

Yeah, thanks, I meant to add that there is a slight difference in the 2. Which is why Przy is worth about 60% or so of what Ben will get paid. Slightly under TC and EC money. I only said that Przy would leave us room for a max FA, and I'm thinking that's $8 million for the first year at most.

Anything over that, and we're better off drafting 2 defensive big men with our 1st rounders, between the two we'd get what Przy would give us for less cap space. Przy is only a role player, and only worth ~5 years and $45 million, but IMHO he'd fit our system very well for that kind of money. 



> You're entering into the realm of "desire to see the home team win" inspired fantasy. And if Skiles thinks you win with no offense from him frontcourt then he is too. Songaila is a nice player, but come freaking on. Songaila-Chandler-Pryzbilla isn't even in the top half of NBA big man rotations.


Skiles didn't say "no offense from the frontcourt", he just was being obvious IMHO in saying that the FIRST job of your big men is to rebound and defend the paint, and that you don't win big without big men who can do that. He was talking about what he expected of Tyson when he said it, to put it in context, but that's basically true.

I think what he was saying, at least the way I took it, was that you can win with big men who can defend and rebound but don't score a lot, but there is no way you are winning big if your bigs can't rebound and defend the paint. 

And Tyson and Przy both shoot a good percentage, they are OK on pick and roll. And Tyson is showing a little more jumper and a little more post game, he's only 23 and I expect that he'll continue to improve on offense to at least a Deke level.

And maybe I am feeling a little homerism over Songaila, but I really love his offensive game so far. He's an outstanding shooter for a big man, and from what I've watched a great passer as well. He'll probably max out at a 28-30 mpg player, but for just over the MLE he's a bargain IMHO. And I think he'll fit in well with Skiles' defensive schemes, which are looking more and more like the 2-3 matchup zone he played at MSU. 



> And anyway, after what I saw tonight, I'm having a pretty hard time understanding the belief that Pryzbilla's a good defender. He's a guy who generates statistics, but he really didn't play very good defense.


Yeah, I only saw a little, but that's what I saw tonight.

But I saw different last season, I don't expect him to look very good with all the youngsters the Blazers are playing out front this season and I wouldn't be surprised if he slacks a little and makes sure he doesn't get hurt. If that team is as bad as it looks, it would be hard to blame him.

At least if they are as bad as they look right now, there's a chance they'll trade Przy during the season for our 1st rounder if he is very unhappy (since they can't pay him more than the MLE). If he gets a taste of contributing to winning, maybe he'll give us the home team discount and make it worth our while?



> If he wants to do that, he's going to have to trade next year's pick for a shot in the 2007 draft, because there's no useful bigs next summer.


For me, it's still way too early to look at next summer's draft, nobody knows what players will step up this season in college and in Europe. But I can promise that at least one good big man will emerge between now and next summer, it always happens. Almost always, anyways. 

When it comes to the draft, in Pax I trust. He has been just about perfect so far IMHO.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

Players I will be watching long and hard in College this year are 

Ronnie Brewer 

LaMarcus Alridge 

Josh Boone 

Already seen a bunch of Shelly Williams but we need length


----------



## bullsville

The college player I'll be watching is Shagari Alleyne.

He's still a project, but at 7-3 with the 8-1 wingspan he still has offensive skills. But he's a project who can play 10-15 minutes right away solely on his shot-blocking skills. And he has progressed so much in his first 2 seasons at Kentucky that another similar year could certainly push him into the first round.


----------



## rosenthall

For anyone who has league pass, WTF is with Mehmet Okur? Good lord, did he just spontaneously mutate from the fat, slow, lazy, out of shape player that he was? I don't think I've ever been terribly impressed with the guy, but his stats these first two games are pretty eye opening. Does anyone know how he's doing it? Is he still the wimpy milquetoast (sp?) player that he was, who just happens to be on a hot streak, or has he significantly changed his style of play?


----------



## Soulful Sides

bullsville said:


> The Knicks are 0-2, Jamal has been a non-factor and Eddy's numbers through 2 games are almost identical to what he put up last season as a Bull. So not only are the Knicks currently the worst team in the NBA (with 3 other teams) and the Bulls currently looking at a very high lottery pick next summer, I am currently looking very good for my long-standing view that Eddy (and Jamal) isn't (aren't) a difference maker(s).
> 
> The Bulls, meanwhile, are 1-0 with an incredible comeback against a very nice 2nd-year team in Charlotte (ask the Sixers).
> 
> At this moment, the Bulls fan part of my life is grand. Too bad there are 81 more to play (and 80 for the Knicks), if the season ended right this moment it would be perfect.
> 
> So I'm going to enjoy it while I can! Got the stuffed pizza, got the Old Style, got the Denver resident's favorite. I'm set.
> 
> EDIT: In fact, I'm even going to honor Eddy with a spot in my signature, just to show him some love.


I hope the Bulls grow up fast. Charlotte will not forget what we have done to them and we will have a nasty fight on our hands.

Okafur is very impressive. I do not understand the drafting of May though.

Old Style?? I gag to think of it.


----------



## Soulful Sides

This guy claims to have predicted 13 of 15 winners so far this season with a simple 4 step approach. Some may like it.

http://www.eog.com/news/index.aspx?id=954


----------



## Sham

rosenthall said:


> For anyone who has league pass, WTF is with Mehmet Okur? Good lord, did he just spontaneously mutate from the fat, slow, lazy, out of shape player that he was? I don't think I've ever been terribly impressed with the guy, but his stats these first two games are pretty eye opening. Does anyone know how he's doing it? Is he still the wimpy milquetoast (sp?) player that he was, who just happens to be on a hot streak, or has he significantly changed his style of play?



He was playing all summer. And fighting his teammates. That helped his shape no end.


----------



## UMfan83

I guess no one agrees/disagrees with my thoughts about the Bobcats....


----------



## mizenkay

poor larry.



















:laugh:


----------



## mizenkay

meanwhile, i caught the end of the wolves @ sonics game last night. overtime. t-wolves down. two possession game. game on the line, and they don't call a play for KG. kandi-man misses on a pathetic girly layup. timeout. they STILL don't call a play for KG. madsen practically with the airball. jaric with the airball. wolves lose. 


KG did not look very happy. 




:raised_ey


----------



## jnrjr79

mizenkay said:


> meanwhile, i caught the end of the wolves @ sonics game last night. overtime. t-wolves down. two possession game. game on the line, and they don't call a play for KG. kandi-man misses on a pathetic girly layup. timeout. they STILL don't call a play for KG. madsen practically with the airball. jaric with the airball. wolves lose.
> 
> 
> KG did not look very happy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :raised_ey




I found that curious, too. I'm happy if KG is disgruntled and wants out, however. Anything to help that cause is ok by me. 

Ok, just dreaming.


----------



## bullsville

mizenkay said:


> poor larry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :laugh:


Beautiful. :cheers:


----------



## spongyfungy

UMfan83 said:


> I guess no one agrees/disagrees with my thoughts about the Bobcats....


 May is going to be good. They have a very good core. I don't know about Gerald Wallace. Primoz will be solid when all is said and done. He just needs to stop disappearing. 

And Rush needs to go.


----------



## JRose5

mizenkay said:


> poor larry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :laugh:




 




That Wolves game was ridiculous, you give it to the Kandi-man and Madsen before KG?
I don't care if he's quadrupl-teamed, I'd rather give it to him then Olowokandi.


----------



## giusd

Yes i saw the bobcats 76s game and this was a MUST win game for the 76ers and the bobcats just kicked there butts. If they ever get a SG and the rookies mature look out. I have posted this a couple of times but they are the hardest working team i have ever seen. They play great D, have players with excellent quickness, and i still think they are going to make the playoffs. They play bos at home tonight. i say they beat bos by 15 points.

david


----------



## fl_flash

Mikedc said:


> Well, one thing's for sure, the Blazers are bad.
> 
> The question is just why they're so bad.
> 
> Pryzbilla is a nice, active guy with no offensive game whatsoever. He looks like a pretty good fit next to an offensive powerhouse like Randolph. But... I just don't see how Pryzzy and Tyson can be effective unless one of them makes an unforseen quantum leap on offense. Even the Bulls with MJ and Scottie on the wings wanted some guys who could score down low (Longley, Kukoc, Wennington, Cartwright etc. You didn't see them going out and looking for Dikembe Mutombo to pair up with Rodman). By that example, I'm just pointing out that even with the most powerful offensive guys you can imagine on the perimeter, no team is (or should be) comfortable with a purely defensive set of bigs. It just doesn't work very well in actual NBA games.
> 
> More importantly, I don't know if being "active" (read: moving around a lot) and blocking shots makes you a good defender. When it comes to actually stopping someone, I'm not sure he's very good. Marcus Camby appears to have eaten him up and spat him out. I didn't see the beginning of the game, but Camby's got 21 points and 14 boards in like no time at all.



I only caught the second half of the game last night because I wanted to see Pryz in action. What I came away with was a big ?. He never got the ball in any position to score. Early in the third quarter, he established nice post position on four or five occasions, sealed his defender and was calling for the ball. Every time the Blazer guards simply ignored him. They'd swing the ball around and then jack up a shot from the perimieter. After a while, you could tell, Pryz simply quit trying and all he did was run around and set picks. He's the highest percentage shooter on the team (granted, he's only 4 for 7). He just isn't a part of their offense (if you can call it that) whatsoever.

My thing with Pryz is that he's in a system that doesn't even include him in the offense. He shot a very high percentage last season - just not that many shots. You already know he's a very good rebounder and amongst the league leaders in shot blocking. I've got to believe, all things being considered, that he'd be chomping at the bit to go to a situation where he's actually involved in the offense and on a winning team. With guys like Randolph, Miles, Patterson, Bassy, Dixon, et-al, he's never going to see the ball.

I'll agree with you that the Blazers look simply awful. They may well end up with the worst record in the league. That was one sloppy game they played.


----------



## Sham

fl_flash said:


> I only caught the second half of the game last night because I wanted to see Pryz in action. What I came away with was a big ?. He never got the ball in any position to score. Early in the third quarter, he established nice post position on four or five occasions, sealed his defender and was calling for the ball. Every time the Blazer guards simply ignored him. They'd swing the ball around and then jack up a shot from the perimieter. After a while, you could tell, Pryz simply quit trying and all he did was run around and set picks. He's the highest percentage shooter on the team (granted, he's only 4 for 7). He just isn't a part of their offense (if you can call it that) whatsoever.
> 
> My thing with Pryz is that he's in a system that doesn't even include him in the offense. He shot a very high percentage last season - just not that many shots. You already know he's a very good rebounder and amongst the league leaders in shot blocking. I've got to believe, all things being considered, that he'd be chomping at the bit to go to a situation where he's actually involved in the offense and on a winning team. With guys like Randolph, Miles, Patterson, Bassy, Dixon, et-al, he's never going to see the ball.
> 
> I'll agree with you that the Blazers look simply awful. They may well end up with the worst record in the league. That was one sloppy game they played.





Portland factors Przybilla into the offense about as much as any team can. He's a pretty dreadful offense player, whose only points come off garbage points, open dunks from penetrate and dishes, and pick and rolls. He's good at th elast one. He holds the NBA record for most screens set in a half. God knows who had the fun job of counting that statistic.


----------



## TonyMontana_83

rosenthall said:


> For anyone who has league pass, WTF is with Mehmet Okur? Good lord, did he just spontaneously mutate from the fat, slow, lazy, out of shape player that he was? I don't think I've ever been terribly impressed with the guy, but his stats these first two games are pretty eye opening. Does anyone know how he's doing it? Is he still the wimpy milquetoast (sp?) player that he was, who just happens to be on a hot streak, or has he significantly changed his style of play?


Go to Memo13.com for more info on his summer. What happened was he finally decided to get serious about basketball. He completely dedicated himself to getting in shape and becoming the best player he can be. He even didn't cancel his workout with his personal trainer on his one year anniversary. He is putting basketball ahead of everything, including his beautiful wife; and that has been the difference. I know I'm somewhat of an Okur homer, but go to that site and check out the pics. The before and after difference is amazing. I wasn't that much of an Okur fan until I saw the dedication he has for basketball. He is still not much of a banger traditionally, but he's been a monster on the boards so far and he hasn't been afraid to get physical. Still, most of his points come on jump shots and put backs; he still doesn't have much of a post game, but it is better. His defense has improved as well. If I had to guess, I believe this year he will put up around 18 and 9 and play solid defense. That's enough to be considered a top 5 Center in the NBA, imo.


----------



## yodurk

Gerald Wallace is having ANOTHER amazing game. End of the 1st half, and he's got 17 pt, 3 reb, 2 ast, and 4 steals.


----------



## bullsville

The Bobcats are now 2-1 after beating Boston tonight, us falling behind them by 25 seems a lot less deplorable now, and the fact that we came back to win is even more impressive.


----------



## Sham

The Bobcats gift wrapped us that game. Even though the Bobcats are improved, and no pushover, falling behind by 25 to them is not defendable. Still, sod it, we got away with it.


----------



## mizenkay

just flipping around the pass last night saw a minute or two of the wolves/clippers game.

what is with the hulk hogan hair extensions being sported by chris kamen? best hair in the nba so far this season. it's a special look for him.


***

bucks are undefeated @ 3-0 with their win last night against the shaq-less heat. cavs are in the cellar of the central. for now. philly managed to get their first in the win column last night with a victory over the pacers. 

***

knicks have the matinee at MSG today v. the warriors. 1pm est.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

mizenkay said:


> poor larry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :laugh:


http://www.newsday.com/sports/baske...0,7357449.column?coll=ny-basketball-headlines



> "We've gotta learn how to play 48 minutes," Brown said in a barely audible monotone after the game. "It kinda reminded me of Boston."
> 
> In their season opener Wednesday night, the Knicks battled the Celtics to a standoff through four quarters only to collapse in overtime, 114-100. Friday night was a sickeningly similar performance, but this time the Knicks collapsed in regulation time.
> 
> After falling behind by 19 in the first quarter and driving the once-enthusiastic crowd to exasperated boos, the Knicks scuffled to tie the score at 61 after three.
> 
> Then they fell apart in the fourth, managing only 14 points and missing 6 of 10 shots from the free-throw line.
> 
> *Welcome to New York, Mr. Brown.
> 
> "I understand what it means being coach of this team, in this environment," he said. "It's important that we play with some passion and some enthusiasm."
> 
> No, it's important that you win. *
> 
> The game was preceded by a circus-like buildup in which a video of the July news conference at which Brown was introduced as the new Knicks coach, followed by a bunch of neon-encrusted acrobats on pogo sticks, was used to whip the crowd into a frenzy.
> 
> *But within 11 seconds of the tip, the first turnover of the night was committed by Stephon Marbury. Three minutes later, the first boos of the Larry Brown Era were heard as the home team fell behind by seven points.*
> 
> If there was any doubt that Brown wasn't in Detroit anymore, that opening sequence erased it. Back there, he had the law firm of Wallace & Wallace as his defenders, but here, the law firms sit in the stands.
> 
> Nobody in a Knicks uniform could jump nearly as well as the guys on the pogo sticks. His point guard, Marbury, couldn't seem to find anyone on the floor he would rather see with the ball than himself. He managed only three assists and the Knicks totaled just 11, which was less than half their number of turnovers: 23.
> 
> They hit only 32.9 percent of their field-goal attempts. And although the Knicks pulled down an impressive 29 offensive rebounds, they managed to score just 22 points off them.
> 
> "That's not the stat you want to see,'' Brown said.
> 
> *Nor is an 0-2 start to a season that is supposed to be different, the start of a new era that already is looking frighteningly like the old one.
> 
> Brown was asked if he is "horrified" by his new team's abysmal start.
> 
> "No, I would have been horrified if we hadn't battled back," he said. "I'm actually pretty proud of the way we came back."
> 
> That sounded familiar, too. Like Don Chaney, Lenny Wilkens and Herb Williams before him, Larry Brown sounded like one more guy in a suit without any real answers.*


Man, that's a mighty short honeymoon.


----------



## spongyfungy

Did I hear correctly? Eddy Curry at the SF position?

James is starting at C. so Eddy is probably PF. with Barnes


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1

Eddy having a decent, but not great game -- 11 points, 3 boards in 16 1/2 minutes of play so far.

Jamal...not so much. Continues to struggle. About 7 1/2 minutes of burn, 0-2 and 1 board.


----------



## RoRo

david lee is an animal, no wonder pax wanted him. the other knick youngsters are doing pretty well too. frye, ariza, and robinson - larry's letting them play thru their mistakes. 

curry draws a double team everytime he touches the ball. crawford's just blending in at the moment, not trying to do too much.


----------



## Bull_Market

this ny-gs game is very close. 74-73 with 4:00 min left in the 4th. a real grind out.

come on knicks, time to give up!


----------



## Bull_Market

yessssssss!

knicks about to go 0-3. down by 5 with 50 seconds left.

AD acatually IS playing for us. he basically insured a gs win with his horrible play down the stretch...

espn.com already putting the knicks down for an L in their standings (j/k)


----------



## Bull_Market

game over, knicks lose.

eddy 4 fouls in 16 minutes played (11pts 45% fg)
jamal 1-5 shooting for 2 pts and 3 TOs in 12 minutes played.


----------



## yodurk

Haha. I love this game. There's not a team I love to watch lose than the Knicks. I find it very interesting how they play though. Entering the season, I expected NY to be an offensive-minded team who was weak on the boards and on defense. It's really been the complete opposite; they've been pretty solid on the boards (especially offensive boards) and have generally played low-scoring grind-it-out games. But they're chemistry on offense has been pathetic.

I was wrong about Channing Frye, too. He looks like the real deal. He's been good from day 1, both with his shooting and rebounding. If LB knows what's good for them, he'll have Frye playing 30 min/game. 

Nate Robinson is out of control though. Doesn't give the Knicks anything they really need. Plus he picked a fight with Jerome James in practice. :laugh:


----------



## mizenkay

already have the ti-faux set to record the CSI Miami/CSI NY crossover sweeps stunt.

the other games to watch tonight (besides colts @ new england and the bulls of course)


*cavs at raptors - uh, yeah, cavs.

bobcats at utah - the cat looking for their first ever three game winning streak. they will be denied.

clips at wolves - sammy's back!

nets at heat on nba tv - payton is already causing trouble mouthing off to the press about the offensive schemes. way to be a team player, gar! *


----------



## jbulls

mizenkay said:


> already have the ti-faux set to record the CSI Miami/CSI NY crossover sweeps stunt.
> 
> the other games to watch tonight (besides colts @ new england and the bulls of course)
> 
> 
> *cavs at raptors - uh, yeah, cavs.
> 
> bobcats at utah - the cat looking for their first ever three game winning streak. they will be denied.
> 
> clips at wolves - sammy's back!
> 
> nets at heat on nba tv - payton is already causing trouble mouthing off to the press about the offensive schemes. way to be a team player, gar! *


things could get ugly in miami. any coach would have a tough time dealing w/ those egos, let alone one with somewhat questionable job security. and now shaq's gone for 2-4 weeks...


----------



## narek

mizenkay said:


> already have the ti-faux set to record the CSI Miami/CSI NY crossover sweeps stunt.
> 
> the other games to watch tonight (besides colts @ new england and the bulls of course)
> 
> 
> nets at heat on nba tv - payton is already causing trouble mouthing off to the press about the offensive schemes. way to be a team player, gar! [/b]


The other location for great drama this year. The Miami off-court action may be more interesting than the Miami on-court action.


----------



## kukoc4ever

Cavs are wrapping up a whipping of the Raptors.

What a great 7 man rotation they have. I envy it.

L. James 
D. Gooden
Z. Ilgauskas
L. Hughes 
E. Snow 
D. Marshall 
D. Jones 

If you are a Cavs fan, what do you have to complain about? Talent? Size? Athleticism? Maybe outside shooting... but Marshall and Jones off the bench take care of that.

Nice team. I miss Donyell.


----------



## ScottMay

Memo Okur and Richard Jefferson are playing amazing basketball. 

Anyone catch Vinsanity's facial on Mourning tonight? He picked up a loose ball foul line extended right, went behind his back with the dribble to shed his man and get to the middle, then elevated, absorbed a hit from Zo with his shoulder, hung, then threw down viciously over Zo's arm.

Zo did play a good game, though. SVG went to an absurdly short rotation tonight -- only 7 guys played. I think they can weather Shaq's absence, but it is placing a mighty burden on Wade. Given that they're a lock to win their division, at least, I don't know why they don't give Wright some run, or at least play more than 7 guys!


----------



## johnston797

ScottMay said:


> Memo Okur and Richard Jefferson are playing amazing basketball.


I saw Memo tonight. Wow!!!


----------



## Chris Bosh #4

Okur is playing great, but wtf he's playing like a damn shooting guard.


----------



## Rhyder

kukoc4ever said:


> Cavs are wrapping up a whipping of the Raptors.
> 
> What a great 7 man rotation they have. I envy it.
> 
> L. James
> D. Gooden
> Z. Ilgauskas
> L. Hughes
> E. Snow
> D. Marshall
> D. Jones
> 
> If you are a Cavs fan, what do you have to complain about? Talent? Size? Athleticism? Maybe outside shooting... but Marshall and Jones off the bench take care of that.
> 
> Nice team. I miss Donyell.


I don't expect a deep playoff push this year, but I think they will be contenders after giving them a couple years to gel as a team and growth of Lebron.


----------



## dkg1

Rhyder said:


> I don't expect a deep playoff push this year, but I think they will be contenders after giving them a couple years to gel as a team and growth of Lebron.


And if Illgauskus stays healthy.


----------



## DaBullz

jbulls said:


> things could get ugly in miami. any coach would have a tough time dealing w/ those egos, let alone one with somewhat questionable job security. and now shaq's gone for 2-4 weeks...


http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap;_ylt=Asj17AwTHhxj82VrD1Ue2pW8vLYF?gid=2005110714

Heat get first win without Shaq

Miami 90, New Jersey 89

MIAMI (AP) -- Vince Carter and Lawrence Frank vehemently argued for a foul, and Alonzo Mourning later acknowledged that the New Jersey Nets may have had a point. Yet to Mourning and the Miami Heat, what ultimately mattered was being one point better. 

Dwyane Wade made a free throw with 5.2 seconds left, then blocked Carter's potentially game-winning layup at the buzzer to give Miami a 90-89 win over New Jersey on Monday night and snap a two-game losing streak. 

``All ball,'' Wade said. 

``A win is a win, regardless of how you look at it,'' Mourning said. ``We needed a win.''



...

Antoine Walker had 18 points and Gary Payton added 13 for the Heat. Mourning had 11 points, 11 rebounds and five blocks, while Jason Williams added 11 points for Miami -- which again played without the injured Shaquille O'Neal and used a seven-man rotation.


----------



## Soulful Sides

Did anyone read Sam Smiths criticism of Lebron James yesterday?



> You wish the media that's so quick to anoint LeBron James would watch him play. He is a wonderful talent, but he closed the last two seasons seeking out statistics and now he has fallen in love with the three-point shot. He said during camp that he had worked on something new all summer, but wouldn't say what it was. So in a 1-2 start for the Cavs, he has attempted 19 threes and 20 free throws, a horrible ratio and one that points to selfish play. It's sad for such a gifted passer and all-around talent.


http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...07smith,1,5317821.column?coll=cs-home-utility

It is interesting in light of this article from the rumors page of inside hoops:



> "Cavs guard Damon Jones famously refers to himself as: ``The best shooter in the world, period.'' Well, after three games, LeBron James is literally and verbally challenging him on that. Heading into Monday, James was shooting 53 percent on 3-pointers, and Jones was hitting 33 percent. ``I'm the best 3-point shooter on the team, look at the stats,'' James said. And as for the ``Best in the World'' declaration? ``Damon's No. 2, now.''


There is nothing wrong with rounding out your game. The more weapons, the more dangerous. I think they will gel by the time they get around to make or break time for making the plasyoffs.


----------



## Soulful Sides

DaBullz said:


> http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap;_ylt=Asj17AwTHhxj82VrD1Ue2pW8vLYF?gid=2005110714
> 
> Heat get first win without Shaq


Mouring was dunked on 4 times. Once by Jefferson, the rest byCarter.

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/37843/20051108/vince_and_rj_slam_it_to_zo/

Anybody have video? I will go to ESPN.

The Nets impressed me with their athleticism.


----------



## mizenkay

the vince dunk on 'zo is on nba.com.

that wasn't just a facial. it was microdermabrasion with a seaweed wrap. wow.


----------



## Soulful Sides

Thank you. That was very nasty.

Here is a very fantastic article about the NBA.
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=hruby/051104



> A lie told repeatedly really can become the truth. Especially when told about the NBA.
> 
> Superstars get the calls. Only the last five minutes matter. The fix is in for big-market teams. Such are a few of the clichéd conceptions surrounding pro basketball, articles of faith so stubborn, so commonplace it's as if James Naismith himself carved them onto stone tablets after taking dictation from a flaming peach basket.
> 
> Too bad they're utterly bogus.


Enjoy.


----------



## Sham

All four dunks on Zo including the big one, and also Wade's 360 layup:

http://rapidshare.de/files/7341055/71105_njn-mia.asf.html


----------



## Sham

kukoc4ever said:


> Cavs are wrapping up a whipping of the Raptors.
> 
> What a great 7 man rotation they have. I envy it.
> 
> L. James
> D. Gooden
> Z. Ilgauskas
> L. Hughes
> E. Snow
> D. Marshall
> D. Jones
> 
> If you are a Cavs fan, what do you have to complain about?




Defense. Of those seven, James plays mediocre defense, Gooden plays very little, Ilgauskas blocks shots through being 7'3 but is not a good defender, Hughes gets steals but is overrated as one, Snow is good, Marshall is bad but is an occasional shot blocker, and Jones is a very poor defender of the point guard position. If you go further down the bench, Luke Jackson and Sasha Pavlovic are dreadful at it, Newble can play some but doesn't play, Henderson is a rebounder and that's it, Varejao is solid but out intil the New Year, Hamilton cannot, Wilks is OK, and Andriuskevicius is as raw as......something very raw.


They do cover most facets. But that is their big gaping weakness. Already this season they've given up 113 to Memphis.


----------



## mizenkay

bucks fall to the warriors tonight 110-103

jason richardson 28 pts/14 rbs 

baron davis 20pts/ 15 assists

troy murphy with 25 points - guarded by bogut


box score


----------



## narek

mizenkay said:


> bucks fall to the warriors tonight 110-103
> 
> jason richardson 28 pts/14 rbs
> 
> baron davis 20pts/ 15 assists
> 
> troy murphy with 25 points - guarded by bogut
> 
> 
> box score


Three pointers killed the Bucks. 12 of Murphy's 25 points came on three pointers.

I watched the game on and off (I get most of their games on extended cable), and Murphy posted up a lot. Bogut was pretty active but Magliore didn't seem much of a factor in the parts I watched, but TJ Ford looked good.


----------



## jbulls

Another loss for the Heat tonight. And 10 TO's from Dwayne Wade. Interesting situation...


----------



## mizenkay

the pistons burned the suns last night 111-104 to go 5-0 on the season. take that larry.

even more remarkable is the fact they've scored over 100 points in four out of the five wins.


----------



## fl_flash

How good is the Central Division? A combined 16-6 (.727) Even the Southwest is a combined 12-10 (.545). Top to bottom, we're in the best (and toughest) division in basketball. The season is still very young and a lot can happen, but the early returns seem to support the Central as the best division. Gonna make it tough to get a playoff spot. I would think it pretty unusual for 5 of the 8 playoff teams to come from one division. One thing so far is that the Central is the only division to not have had any team play another team in the division. One those games are played, I'd expect that .727 percentage to drop accordingly.


----------



## yodurk

fl_flash said:


> How good is the Central Division? A combined 16-6 (.727) Even the Southwest is a combined 12-10 (.545). Top to bottom, we're in the best (and toughest) division in basketball. The season is still very young and a lot can happen, but the early returns seem to support the Central as the best division. Gonna make it tough to get a playoff spot. I would think it pretty unusual for 5 of the 8 playoff teams to come from one division. One thing so far is that the Central is the only division to not have had any team play another team in the division. One those games are played, I'd expect that .727 percentage to drop accordingly.


I think it's very possible, even likely, that all 5 from our division make the playoffs. Of course, you have to consider that somebody in the very weak Atlantic division will get a marginal boost in record by playing more games agaist poor competition. I only see New Jersey coming out of that division, and I only see Washington and Miami coming out of the Southeast. That leaves 5 more spots for the Central teams.


----------



## bullsville

People, for the 8 billionth time, the NBA plays a balanced schedule. 

Being in the Central doesn't mean anything, we play 4 games vs each Central team and either 3 or 4 against every other team in the Eastern Conference.

In fact, we play more games vs the Southeast and Atlantic divisions (18 each) than we do against the Central (16 games).


----------



## ScottMay

bullsville said:


> People, for the 8 billionth time, the NBA plays a balanced schedule.
> 
> Being in the Central doesn't mean anything, we play 4 games vs each Central team and either 3 or 4 against every other team in the Eastern Conference.
> 
> In fact, we play more games vs the Southeast and Atlantic divisions (18 each) than we do against the Central (16 games).


It might not be as meaningful as a strong division in the NFL, or playing in the stronger of the two NBA conferences, but the Central's overall strength is not without consequence.

The schedule is NOT perfectly balanced as you point out. There are 4 non-division conference opponents we play only 3 times. And teams from the Atlantic and Southeast don't have to play every team in our division 4 times. The bottom line is that a Central Division team ends up playing a tougher schedule than teams in the Atlantic or Southeast. 

This is backed up by the first installment of the Sagarin rankings, which show the Central as by far the strongest division, and the Atlantic and Southeast as barely ahead of the Northwest for the "honor" of worst.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/nba0506.htm

And that's not even getting into some of the travesties of justice that might occur come playoff time in regards to seedings.

EDIT: for the purposes of discussing strength of schedule, it's probably more instructive to look at last year's final Sagarin rankings. Look at the SOS for the Southwest teams (which I think we can all agree was the best top-to-bottom division):

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/nba0405.htm


----------



## yodurk

bullsville said:


> People, for the 8 billionth time, the NBA plays a balanced schedule.
> 
> Being in the Central doesn't mean anything, we play 4 games vs each Central team and either 3 or 4 against every other team in the Eastern Conference.
> 
> In fact, we play more games vs the Southeast and Atlantic divisions (18 each) than we do against the Central (16 games).


I realize that ESPN over-emphasizes which division NBA teams are in. They do it all the time, and it really gets annoying. But there is a _marginal_ boost for being in a weak division. The Bulls have to play the Pistons, Cavs, Bucks, and Pacers 4 times each. We get to play Atlanta and New York only 3x each. I'd rather trade a game against the Pistons and Pacers and get an extra game against Atlanta and New York. It could very well be a 2-game swing in the win column that way. And when you're on the border for playoffs, that could very well be the difference. But remember, no excuses!


----------



## fl_flash

yodurk said:


> I realize that ESPN over-emphasizes which division NBA teams are in. They do it all the time, and it really gets annoying. But there is a _marginal_ boost for being in a weak division. The Bulls have to play the Pistons, Cavs, Bucks, and Pacers 4 times each. We get to play Atlanta and New York only 3x each. I'd rather trade a game against the Pistons and Pacers and get an extra game against Atlanta and New York. It could very well be a 2-game swing in the win column that way. And when you're on the border for playoffs, that could very well be the difference. But remember, no excuses!


I get where Bullsville is comming from and I think the opposite of what you write holds true also. The Hawks, for example, would much rather not have to play any team in the Central because no matter which team they face, they're going up against what should be a playoff level team. The Hawks can't play themselves. (Much as they might like too to get a win!) The Bulls, on the other hand, do get to play the Hawks. Put any Central division team in either of the other two Eastern Divisions and they'd be legit division contenders - especially the Atlantic. Irregardless of divisional location, the Bulls have to face the Central 16 times and they face the Atlantic and SE roughly the same number of times (if not more). In the end, it pretty much evens out although like your wrote, that one or two games against a sub-standard opponent that we won't have could come back to bite us - big time!


----------



## SALO

Detroit @ Portland

Portland hanging tough, Darius Miles looking good, not even Prince can guard him. Ben Wallace is underrated on offense, the guy has some nice moves in the post. I'm mainly watching the game to see Joel Pryzbilla, and he's looking very good out there matched up against Big Ben. He is doing exactly what I expected, grabbing rebounds and blocking / altering shots. Offensively all he does is set screens and then go for offensive rebounds. They never pass him the ball.


----------



## mizenkay

well the pistons are looking so tough. undefeated 6-0.



but the boxscore that really caught my eye was the wiz scoring *137!!* v. the sonics. uh, what up with that? wow.



sonics @ wiz box score


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Memphis escapes with a win in Atlanta. Zaza misses two free throws in the last few seconds after he was 6-6 from the line before that. Mike Miller misses from the corner, but Battier tips the rebound to Gasol, whose putback rattles in as the game clock expires, and Memphis wins by one.

Poor Atlanta.


----------



## yodurk

mizenkay said:


> well the pistons are looking so tough. undefeated 6-0.
> 
> 
> 
> but the boxscore that really caught my eye was the wiz scoring *137!!* v. the sonics. uh, what up with that? wow.
> 
> 
> 
> sonics @ wiz box score


The Wizards are red hot!! They just beat the SPURS 110-95. Gilbert Arenas is playing out of his mind. 43 points on 15-20 from the field (11-12 from 2-point range, 4-8 on 3's).


----------



## MikeDC

yodurk said:


> The Wizards are red hot!! They just beat the SPURS 110-95. Gilbert Arenas is playing out of his mind. 43 points on 15-20 from the field (11-12 from 2-point range, 4-8 on 3's).


I watched most of that game, and the Wiz are just playing some really good ball.


----------



## mizenkay

yodurk said:


> The Wizards are red hot!! They just beat the SPURS 110-95. Gilbert Arenas is playing out of his mind. 43 points on 15-20 from the field (11-12 from 2-point range, 4-8 on 3's).


great story in the NYT today about Arenas and his off-court obsession; bowling. yes, you read that correctly, bowling. so that's his secret!













New York Times (subscription) 





> Gilbert Arenas's follow-through is underhand, with a nifty right-to-left spin. When he was not shooting hoops last summer, he was bowling for push-ups, for pride and for a hobby.
> 
> To say that Arenas, the Washington Wizards' star guard, has taken to the sport is an understatement equivalent to saying that Earl Anthony could knock down a few pins. "I don't know who he is," Arenas said of Anthony, the Hall of Fame bowler. "I don't have any bowling heroes."
> 
> Arenas is an athlete who routinely operates in his own world - he goes to the MCI Center at 2 a.m. to work on his game - so it was no surprise that he became obsessed with bowling this past summer.
> 
> During high school in Los Angeles, he was in bowling leagues. When his friends suggested an outing last summer, he was eager. "We started gambling, playing for push-ups," he said. "I lost and I had to do 300 push-ups right there. So the next morning I went bowling. Then we all went bowling - every day for three months straight of the summer."
> 
> Arenas's high game after all that work? A 277, after a spare, finishing with all strikes. He has three custom bowling balls (two 16-pounders and a transparent 14-pounder with a boxing glove inside) and his own shoes.
> 
> Antawn Jamison, a Wizards teammate, sees how that is so Gilbert.
> 
> "Little things that most people don't take seriously, he would," Jamison said. "He's coming in after a game, that's his practice. Bowling, most guys wouldn't take it as seriously as Gilbert. But he makes it fun."


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

I've got to eat my words. I mean, really eat 'em.

Charlie Villanueva doesn't just look good, he looks awesome. He looks super quick out there, athletic and decisive. Charlie has 25 points and 8 rebounds in 29 minutes so far today off the bench. I thought he would be a flat out bust and he's been a flat out stud instead.

Joey Graham looks like he can play too. Babcock had himself a hell of a draft. And watching this thriller against the Sonics tonight, the Toronto crowd is fantastic, much louder than ours. I know a lot of people seem to think that Toronto is an undesirable destination to play ball, but I personally wouldn't see it that way.

edit: BTW, Jalen rode the bench during the most of the fourth quarter in this one while Toronto made a huge comeback. He did not look happy.

Wow, Bosh with a putback of a FT that Mike James missed intentionally. Charlie V gets the rebound, misses, and Bosh gets that rebound and puts it in. Overtime.


----------



## JRose5

I think the Knicks might be heading for that first win tonight.
At halftime:

New York - 57
Sacramento - 41


----------



## MikeDC

An interesting matchp of Brad Miller vs. Eddy Curry. I'd gladly take either of them back, but Curry more or less just facialized Brad.

The Knicks are doing both the "run the offense through Eddy" thing again and the Skiles style get him the ball in scoring position thing. 

The "run the offense through Eddy" option often seems to be to throw him a quick at the top of the key or so right as the offense gets initiated. Curry's usually alone and gets to make a quick and easy pass to someone else. The purpose of all of this is a little perplexing because in most cases Eddy is way out of position to do much with it. Still, it seems to send a couple of Kings running to get in his way, so it does show (and make use of the fact) the Kings are worried about him. Still, if they had any sense, they'd not react so much. As a confidence building exercise for Curry to get him touching the ball in game situations it's also probably a pretty nice move. 

Miller is physically outclassed by Curry and has been abused and put in foul trouble. But then he does a couple of freakishly smart things like pushing Eddy and hooking him so the ref calls an offensive foul on Eddy. He also just threw a backdoor pass to Wells that was just plain wicked. It looked like something Jason Williams might, just maybe be able to pull off.

As far as the Kings, I spose we can look ahead to a fourth quarter comeback since they're playing the Knicks (they've cut a 15 point lead to 9), but they still lok primed for a breakup to me. When Shareef Abdur-Rahim is your most demonstrative, intense player, you've got problems.


----------



## MikeDC

Peja still looks above average to me. I don't mind spending $7-8 million on him next year, but I don't know that we get over the top with him.

Still, with $20M to spend, barring a trade, a haul of Peja ($8M), Baby Al ($6M), and Nazr or Pryzbilla, or Ely ($5-6M) would set us up pretty well for a talent consolidating (read: acquiring a superstar) trade further down the road.

----------------

Channing Frye's really skilled and coordinated for someone that big.


----------



## El Chapu

Mikedc said:


> Peja still looks above average to me. I don't mind spending $7-8 million on him next year, but I don't know that we get over the top with him.
> 
> Still, with $20M to spend, barring a trade, a haul of Peja ($8M), Baby Al ($6M), and Nazr or Pryzbilla, or Ely ($5-6M) would set us up pretty well for a talent consolidating (read: acquiring a superstar) trade further down the road.
> 
> ----------------
> 
> Channing Frye's really skilled and coordinated for someone that big.


Peja getting only 8M? Not happening. No chance.


----------



## MikeDC

Knicks vs. Jazz - AD has two good looks in a row. He misses the first shot point blank and walks on the next.

Curry guarded by Ostertag draws a foul on what looks like a clean block

---------

Halftime of Memphis vs. the Lakers and Kwame Brown still sucks major ***.


----------



## MikeDC

AK47 and Gordan Giricek aren't playing for the Jazz. 

AK47, by the way, might be a great player but he's one of the strangest looking dudes ever. He's like a cross between Jay Leno, Ivan Drago and Derrick Zoolander.


----------



## Babble-On

WTF, Eddy is actually getting rebounds. Kinda pisses me off.


----------



## ScottMay

Mikedc said:


> Halftime of Memphis vs. the Lakers and Kwame Brown still sucks major ***.


You should be allowed to unmask cursing while making this particular observation.

It's incredible that a guy with that much raw talent has yet to develop a discernible basketball skill in 4+ years. Hell, even DeShawn Stevenson has fashioned himself into a reasonable facsimile of a mediocre NBA player.


----------



## ScottMay

Babble-On said:


> WTF, Eddy is actually getting rebounds. Kinda pisses me off.


Curry has as many blocks in the second half of this game as Chandler has all season.


----------



## ScottMay

Knicks hold the Jazz to 29% shooting and an all-time record for fewest points against in franchise history in an ugly 72-63 win.


----------



## yodurk

ScottMay said:


> Knicks hold the Jazz to 29% shooting and an all-time record for fewest points against in franchise history in an ugly 72-63 win.


Can not even believe some of the scores the Knicks are coming up with. This one's right up there with the Bulls/Wizards game a few years ago when MJ made his first appearance at the United Center as a non-Bull. 

Oh, and I believe the Bulls beat the Jazz 96-54 or something like that, back in the '96 playoffs.


----------



## ScottMay

yodurk said:


> Can not even believe some of the scores the Knicks are coming up with. This one's right up there with the Bulls/Wizards game a few years ago when MJ made his first appearance at the United Center as a non-Bull.
> 
> Oh, and I believe the Bulls beat the Jazz 96-54 or something like that, back in the '96 playoffs.


You are correct. But I said fewest points allowed in [Knicks] franchise history.

I believe it's been broken since, but in 99 the Bulls set the all-time NBA "record" for fewest points scored in a game since the inception of the shot clock: 49 vs. the Heat. 

Fortunately, we have the entire second half to score 14 points tonight.


----------



## JRose5

ScottMay said:


> Fortunately, we have the entire second half to score 14 points tonight.


Don't count your chickens before they hatch, watching the end of that second quarter I wouldn't hold my breath for those 14 points.

:dead:


----------



## rosenthall

Without having watched the game, I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not I should be concerned about the Knicks win tonight. I do think as the season wears on they'll pick up the slack and finish in the later half of the lottery, but I'm not sure whether or not tonight was a sign of the ship changing course, or a reflection of the fact that the team the Jazz trotted out tonight was really f'n bad. The jazz without Carlos Boozer, Andrei Kirlienko, and Gordan Giricek is pretty putrid, but still, 62 points is 62 points. Who do the knicks play next?


----------



## El Chapu

Dwight Howard with 21 points, 20 rebounds against Okafor and the Bobcats.

Peja the scrub with 16 points (7-10 FG), 3 rebounds, 2 assists and 2 steals against Utah (Halftime).


----------



## ScottMay

DeSagana Diop had a HUGE game for Dallas tonight -- 16 boards (6 offensive), 6 blocks, 37 minutes, and a nice job of neutralizing Marcus Camby.

I know the Cavs had to clear as much cap space as possible this summer, but man, Diop would make a perfect back-up/complement to Ilgauskas and a great long-term replacement.


----------



## El Chapu

Well, the Cavs gave Diop plenty of opportunities to show his worth and he didnt quite produce as expected. They also have Verejao who made the decision easier for them.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Charlie Villanueve with an insane game tonight:

37 minutes, 12-17 from the field, 3-3 from three, 0-1 FT, 13 reb, 27 points

I can't believe what he's become. I seriously thought he was going to be a flat out bust. He was never this good in college, and he certainly never worked as hard as he is working for the Raps. What's going on?


----------



## Chris Bosh #4

Darius Miles Davis said:


> Charlie Villanueve with an insane game tonight:
> 
> 37 minutes, 12-17 from the field, 3-3 from three, 0-1 FT, 13 reb, 27 points
> 
> I can't believe what he's become. I seriously thought he was going to be a flat out bust. He was never this good in college, and he certainly never worked as hard as he is working for the Raps. What's going on?


27 points 13 rebounds :biggrin: He's playing his off right now, and this kid is really talented IMO.


----------



## Hustle

rosenthall said:


> Without having watched the game, I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not I should be concerned about the Knicks win tonight. I do think as the season wears on they'll pick up the slack and finish in the later half of the lottery, but I'm not sure whether or not tonight was a sign of the ship changing course, or a reflection of the fact that the team the Jazz trotted out tonight was really f'n bad. The jazz without Carlos Boozer, Andrei Kirlienko, and Gordan Giricek is pretty putrid, but still, 62 points is 62 points. Who do the knicks play next?


Utah is down 102-70 tonight against Sacramento with 7 min remaining. Maybe NY was just lucky to be playing Utah.


----------



## ScottMay

Hustle said:


> Utah is down 102-70 tonight against Sacramento with 7 min remaining. Maybe NY was just lucky to be playing Utah.


But I thought they were lucky to have gotten their first win against Sacramento, too.

I'm confused.


----------



## mizenkay

pacers lose to the charlotte 'cats tonight 122-90. 

kareem rush went off for 35 - a new career high.


----------



## El Chapu

Frye > Curry

:angel:


----------



## King Joseus

Dallas up 43-18 on Detroit early in the 2nd quarter. hopefully they can give 'em their first loss tonight...


----------



## The 6ft Hurdle

El Chapu said:


> Frye > Curry
> 
> :angel:


Probably true if it isn't already, but doesn't take away from the fact that we are 3 - 5 and sort of hurting without this post threat.


----------



## ScottMay

This Cavs-Sixers game is downright spicy.

Pax will have to hit home runs with all the cap space and draft picks and other birds in the bushes for us to be even competitive with the Cavs over the next decade, imo.


----------



## El Chapu

LeBron against the Sixers tonight (Game not over yet, might go to OT);

33 points
10 rebounds
10 assists


----------



## El Chapu

ScottMay said:


> This Cavs-Sixers game is downright spicy.
> 
> Pax will have to hit home runs with all the cap space and draft picks and other birds in the bushes for us to be even competitive with the Cavs over the next decade, imo.



Against LeBron or the Cavs? Players like Hughes or Gooden are a dime dozen, its all about LeBron that makes that good players even better. And Z is getting closer to retirement and that cant help.


----------



## ScottMay

El Chapu said:


> Against LeBron or the Cavs? Players like Hughes or Gooden are a dime dozen, its all about LeBron that makes that good players even better. And Z is getting closer to retirement and that cant help.


I don't understand what distinction you're trying to make. I certainly wasn't arguing that the Cavs would be more successful without LeBron in the picture. The Bulls would have sucked without Jordan, the Celtics would have sucked without Russell, the Lakers would have sucked without Magic, etc.

And if Hughes and Gooden are "dime a dozen" players, we should all pitch in and send Pax a few rolls of dimes.


----------



## El Chapu

ScottMay said:


> I don't understand what distinction you're trying to make. I certainly wasn't arguing that the Cavs would be more successful without LeBron in the picture. The Bulls would have sucked without Jordan, the Celtics would have sucked without Russell, the Lakers would have sucked without Magic, etc.
> 
> And if Hughes and Gooden are "dime a dozen" players, we should all pitch in and send Pax a few rolls of dimes.


IMO they are not difference makers. Nice players, but thats all about them. 

I wasnt trying to make any distinction, my point was that the Cavs got lucky with LeBron and thats the difference with Pax that had to do more work than get the #1 pick and make the obvious call. 

As far as they have LeBron under contract, the Cavs will remain competitive. You cant say the same thing about the Bulls and one of its players. Thats why you must give Pax some credit.


----------



## MikeDC

El Chapu said:


> IMO they are not difference makers. Nice players, but thats all about them.


We could use some nice players like them.

Speaking of that, I'm really warming up to Gooden as a target. He's maybe gettable despite being an RFA given the money the Cavs invested this year and their PF depth, and he's certainly capable of helping us.

And taking a player from a division rival is a good thing.

Of course, if we overpay, for a guy that's really no good and they won't miss, that's not a good thing. So I guess I'm not sold yet.... but warming.


----------



## step

Gooden would be ok, but he always seems to be a bit clueless when it comes to the defensive end (as i remember, haven't seen him lately), so i doubt he'd really fit Skiles' model, unless Brown does something magical with him this year, i doubt it'll change.


----------



## MikeDC

Pau Gasol's beard somehow makes him both better looking and a better player.


----------



## futuristxen

step said:


> Gooden would be ok, but he always seems to be a bit clueless when it comes to the defensive end (as i remember, haven't seen him lately), so i doubt he'd really fit Skiles' model, unless Brown does something magical with him this year, i doubt it'll change.


Right now Gooden is all about busting his *** all over the court. Possibly the hardest working man in the league these days. Ripping down rebounds on both ends, hustling on defense. He's more of a Skiles guy than Sweetney, and lately, probably moreso than Chandler, because he's not useless on offense.

As far as Hughes, Marshall, and Gooden not being diffrence makers...well...the Cavs record speaks for itself. They've been destroying teams at home, and winning on the road. They avenged one of their losses(Memphis) and the other one was a stinker in San Antonio.

We'll get a good shot of just how good this team is on Thursday when they play the Pacers. But an impressive as **** win against a red hot sixers team tonight.

I was saying over the offseason to trade Curry for Pavlovic and Gooden. I think we should actually see if we can pick up Pavlovic, because Luke Jackson has basically taken his job, and he's really too talented to be a 12th man. He could be the answer for us at shooting guard. 

Bah. What am I saying we? I don't even think I like this Bulls team anymore. The thrill is gone. You guys do what'chya want.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

futuristxen said:


> Bah. What am I saying we? I don't even think I like this Bulls team anymore. The thrill is gone. You guys do what'chya want.


Wow. 3-5. That was pretty easy.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

I agree with Michael DC Esq and others who are warming up to Drew Gooden

I have seen 4 Cavs games this season and the guy and is a handful..not a domiant beast but an active body that can get his points in the post ..facing up or even just on hustle / clean up plays

I thought he pimped Dwight Howard yesterday to be honest...outplayed him totally whenever they were directly matched up

And defensively he is not as clueless as the clueless make out

Historically..he would have the occasional lapse/brain fart play..but I think it would have been a bit hash to call him useless

This season though and evven a few games a caught him in toward the end of last season- he's pretty focused 

Nice player 

I have tabbed him as a free agency target in the 2006 free agency thread 

Would be very happy to add him and a defensive vet big to pair with Sweets, Tyson and Othella


----------



## futuristxen

Darius Miles Davis said:


> Wow. 3-5. That was pretty easy.


It's not much to do with the record. I just haven't really been able to sit down and watch a Bulls game. The team is made up of boring role players, and players I hated on in college. And I think the owner doesn't give a damn.

We're not even the second most exciting team for me to watch in our own division. It's been a long time coming, but it may finally be time to part ways.

I hate the "right way".


----------



## SALO

Sacramento at Seattle

Peja with 25 pts in the FIRST HALF on 9-10 shooting, 6-7 on threes. Start of 3rd quarter and he gets hacked by Fortson and re-injures his finger. 

Radmonovic looks good for the Sonics, UFA at the end of the year but I just don't like his attitude.


----------



## El Chapu

Marcus Camby is insane!!! 21 points and 21 rebounds tonight!! Having a heck of a season!!


----------



## King Joseus

El Chapu said:


> Marcus Camby is insane!!! 21 points and 21 rebounds tonight!! Having a heck of a season!!


 he's on 2/3 of my fantasy teams :biggrin:


----------



## rosenthall

Man, what's up with David West? He's gone berserko these last couple of days, putting up 34 and 16 with 20 and 9 tonight. He's been pretty solid the rest of the season too. The weird part is, the two seasons before this, he's pretty much been non-existant, and was probably quickly approaching bustdom, if he wasn't already there, since he was supposed to be a finished product coming out of Xavier. Maybe he's the type of big guy that needs good guard play to be effective. I'd be curious to watch him play a little bit.


----------



## yodurk

I think the most noteable thing tonight is that Milwaukee got creamed by a banged up Utah team. 

New Jersey also lost at Golden State, repeating what the Bulls did about a week ago. 

Anything to help our positioning right now is a big bonus. We still have yet to hit stride.


----------



## MongolianDeathCloud

yodurk said:


> I think the most noteable thing tonight is that Milwaukee got creamed by a banged up Utah team.
> 
> New Jersey also lost at Golden State, repeating what the Bulls did about a week ago.
> 
> Anything to help our positioning right now is a big bonus. We still have yet to hit stride.


Also worth noting that Carter experienced a minor back strain tonight, probably not going to miss games, but Pietrus sprained his knee and according to him, may miss 6 weeks.


----------



## Sham

rosenthall said:


> Man, what's up with David West? He's gone berserko these last couple of days, putting up 34 and 16 with 20 and 9 tonight. He's been pretty solid the rest of the season too. The weird part is, the two seasons before this, he's pretty much been non-existant, and was probably quickly approaching bustdom, if he wasn't already there, since he was supposed to be a finished product coming out of Xavier. Maybe he's the type of big guy that needs good guard play to be effective. I'd be curious to watch him play a little bit.




It's a combination of a long list of injuries, and having a lot of decent players in front of him. Both of those have cleared up.


----------



## narek

yodurk said:


> I think the most noteable thing tonight is that Milwaukee got creamed by a banged up Utah team.
> 
> New Jersey also lost at Golden State, repeating what the Bulls did about a week ago.
> 
> Anything to help our positioning right now is a big bonus. We still have yet to hit stride.



The Bucks have horrible stretches even in the games they won. I watched parts of the Pacers/Bucks game and the first half the Bucks didn't play any defense. It's going to be an interesting year.


----------



## DaBullz

Philly is looking like a certain playoff team, IMO.

Iverson had 9 assists last night, CWebb 15/10/5, and Iggy was 5-6.


----------



## MikeDC

ShamBulls said:


> It's a combination of a long list of injuries, and having a lot of decent players in front of him. Both of those have cleared up.


Was gonna say the same thing. His first two years were freakishly quiet, but he seemed to rate out fairly well given his (low) minutes.

Now that Magloire's gone and they've got a PG who likes setting guys up for easy buckets, he's looking very effective.

The couple of times I've seen him, he kind of reminds me of a young AD but with a more polished offensive game. He's like AD in the sense that he's about the same size, pretty well built, and seems to more fundamentally sound in how he plays than the vast majority of guys in his size.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

And the breakout game award goes to: Luther Head.

28/7/3 for Luther tonight, in the absence of Tracy McGrady. 

I can't really figure out Houston's problem. Maybe it's that they don't have that many steady producing veterans (older than McGrady) on their team. They're definitely missing Bobby Sura, if you can believe that. With a talented young core of McGrady, Ming, Luther Head, and Stromile Swift -- the latter whom always seems to underachieve -- you'd like to think their future is bright. However, they're 3-8 this year and sinking fast. Can they turn it around?


----------



## rosenthall

Darius Miles Davis said:


> And the breakout game award goes to: Luther Head.
> 
> 28/7/3 for Luther tonight, in the absence of Tracy McGrady.
> 
> I can't really figure out Houston's problem. Maybe it's that they don't have that many steady producing veterans (older than McGrady) on their team. They're definitely missing Bobby Sura, if you can believe that. With a talented young core of McGrady, Ming, Luther Head, and Stromile Swift -- the latter whom always seems to underachieve -- you'd like to think their future is bright. However, they're 3-8 this year and sinking fast. Can they turn it around?


I'm pretty sure they had similar problems last year as well, and things eventually turned out alright. Although I do think that Houston, as currently comprised, isn't a title contender. Tracy and Yao are great players, but they're not good enough by themselves to take a team to elite status, and their supporting cast is pretty bad, IMO. In fact, I don't think they have one other quality starter on their team, and I don't think their management has done a particularly good job of bringing in role players that really fit well into their system.


----------



## ScottMay

Darius Miles Davis said:


> And the breakout game award goes to: Luther Head.
> 
> 28/7/3 for Luther tonight, in the absence of Tracy McGrady.
> 
> I can't really figure out Houston's problem. Maybe it's that they don't have that many steady producing veterans (older than McGrady) on their team. They're definitely missing Bobby Sura, if you can believe that. With a talented young core of McGrady, Ming, Luther Head, and Stromile Swift -- the latter whom always seems to underachieve -- you'd like to think their future is bright. However, they're 3-8 this year and sinking fast. Can they turn it around?


Luther Head was fantastic . . . Derek Anderson had a good game, too, but if I'm Van Gundy, Head is now firmly ahead of Wesley in the rotation. Head played outstanding D and showed off a variety of offensive looks -- finishing in traffic, on the break, some mid-range, and a great-looking J. Very impressive.

I think Houston's problems, in no particular order, are:

-- A pretty tough schedule so far, combined with lots of injuries. McGrady's being a game-time decision many nights has to hurt their preparation

-- Yao just isn't that good. He still seems poorly conditioned, he's very passive, and even when fresh, he moves like he's in quicksand. I'm not saying he's not a first-rate talent, but he is not a "franchise" player like Dwight Howard or LeBron or Amare. 

-- While I am a huge Jeff Van Gundy fan, I don't like his approach to offense with this particular team. Of course, it's hard to think of two more disparate offensive players than Yao and T-Mac, so maybe his hands are tied.

-- Outside of Head's breakout game last night and occasional contributions from Stromile Swift (who has otherwise been dreadful), their bench is pretty thin. 

I think they'll right the ship eventually, provided they get T-Mac healthy and get Yao in shape and/or somehow light a fire under his ***.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Luther Head with a second strong game in a row: 15/10/4...

...but Houston loses again.

Good for them for finding a potential stud toward the end of the first round though.


----------



## GB

Eye popping stat: 36 of Detroits 43 field goals were assisted.

Thats team ball. Could you ever get a Kobe, or a LeBron (or an MJ) to play within a system like that?

Major props to Dumars.


----------



## GB

Darius Miles Davis said:


> Luther Head with a second strong game in a row: 15/10/4...
> 
> ...but Houston loses again.
> 
> *Good for them for finding a potential stud toward the end of the first round though.*



Wouldn't it have been nice if Jerry Krause had spent the 90's doing that for the Bulls? 

A Tony Parker, a Gilbert Arenas, a Trevor Ariza...
(not those exact players, of course...)

EDIT:

Slim pickings in the 90s

Nick Van Exel was missed...PJ Brown anyone?...Mike Finley of course...Othella Harrington or Malik Rose over Travis Knight? Probably. Rashard Lewis or Nazr Mohammed over Corey Benjamin. Manu Ginobili over Michael Ruffin.


----------



## SALO

Al Harrington drops 34 pts on the Celtics tonight, 11-18 from the field, 12-14 FT's. First win of the season for the Hawks. Salim Stoudamire could be this years Ben Gordon. 

Harrington and Peja are starting to look like realistic options for us next season, but we should only sign one of them since they both play SF and we already have Deng & Noce, but I would go ahead and trade Noce to get one of them here. I'm leaning towards Harrington because he and Deng would terrorize opposing small forwards/shooting guards on defense.


----------



## yodurk

SALO said:


> Al Harrington drops 34 pts on the Celtics tonight, 11-18 from the field, 12-14 FT's. First win of the season for the Hawks. Salim Stoudamire could be this years Ben Gordon.
> 
> Harrington and Peja are starting to look like realistic options for us next season, but we should only sign one of them since they both play SF and we already have Deng & Noce, but I would go ahead and trade Noce to get one of them here. I'm leaning towards Harrington because he and Deng would terrorize opposing small forwards/shooting guards on defense.


Al Harrington just continues to get better each year. He showed last year that he can't be "the man", but he has proven already that he can really thrive in a team system (see: Indiana). He's extra valuable because he's equally good at either the 3 or 4 positions. That means we can go big at times with Deng at the 2, Al at the 3, and Sweets at the 4...or small with Kirk at the 2, Deng at the 3, Al at the 4, etc. Positionally, it makes more sense than Peja. Although Peja sure can light it up, so I would like either one to be honest.


----------



## ScottMay

yodurk said:


> Al Harrington just continues to get better each year. He showed last year that he can't be "the man", but he has proven already that he can really thrive in a team system (see: Indiana). He's extra valuable because he's equally good at either the 3 or 4 positions. That means we can go big at times with Deng at the 2, Al at the 3, and Sweets at the 4...or small with Kirk at the 2, Deng at the 3, Al at the 4, etc. Positionally, it makes more sense than Peja. Although Peja sure can light it up, so I would like either one to be honest.


Well, if the glass-is-half-full outlook says Harrington's "equally good" at either small or power forward, the pessimist might say that's because he's not really special at either. He hasn't been able to truly find a position in his career -- at least not for a team that's playing better than .200 ball.

The only good thing I can see about bringing in Harrington for the 45-55 million he'll command is that he's probably tradeable (Peja at a max or near-max contract wouldn't be). But I like Deng much, much more as a 3, I like Chandler/Sweetney/2006 draft pick much better at the power positions, and if we assume more organic growth from our players than what we'll get out of Harrington, I don't envision enough minutes for the guy to justify what he'll cost.

And generally speaking, barring some sort of lightning bolt of luck in the lottery (the Knicks have played just three games out of eleven at home, so I'm not counting on a top-three pick just yet), I think we have to make much bolder plays this offseason than Al Harrington. We need a superstar, not a guy who probably isn't any better than what we've already got.


----------



## step

> We need a superstar, not a guy who probably isn't any better than what we've already got.


I nominate Pierce for that role. If we somehow acquire him, we'd still be able to hit up Nazr Mohammed for a decent sized contract i believe. Chandler, Sweets, Mohammed can basically avg 30mins a game a piece.



> Although Peja sure can light it up


I was impressed by his performance the other night vs Seattle. Skiles would be able to cover his deficiencies enough to make him very useful. I just don't feel he'll be able to carry a team, not that he would need to with the Bulls, but it would certainly help. Plus you won't have ot worry about him fading away in the 4th when you do have the likes of Gordon.

I would prefer to go after Pierce, but if it costs too much they might go the Peja route. Harrington would be nice, but i believe Sweets has filled that void nicely.


----------



## rosenthall

After watching the games tonight:

I'm not sure why, but I find Ron Artest humorous to watch. The guys just got a one screw-looseness about him that you can sense whenever he does anything. 

Despite their win tonight, I don't think the Lakers will be a serious team until Lamar and Kobe figure out how to play well at the same time. They both had good games statistically, but all of Lamar's damage came when Kobe was on the bench w/ foul trouble, and during the second half when Kobe exploded, Lamar was as quiet as a lamb. 

I think the Lakers are a really interesting team. In the past, I've never really cared about them that much, but this year, with Phil Jackson in the fold, and their weird combination of talent, and all the history surrounding Kobe and Phil, and watching Kobe do his best Jordan impersonation, it's created for a rather intriguing story, in my mind. 

I think Vlad Rad may have cost himself 30-40 million dollars last offseason. He looks terrible. His game is completely disjointed and out of synch, and he was a big liability whenever he was on the floor. Everything he did looked rushed. At this rate, he'll be lucky to get an MLE deal when the season is finished. 

I think Brian Cook will manage to stick around in the league for 10+ years as a guy who knows his role, will willingly defer to players that are better than him, and be a guy that can make open shots. 

And lastly, that dunk that Smush Parker had on Potapenko was just nasty. And, I find myself rooting for him whenever I see him play. He's quite a talent. And he seems to be the only player on the Lakers besides Kobe that isn't playing tentatively.


----------



## jbulls

ScottMay said:


> Well, if the glass-is-half-full outlook says Harrington's "equally good" at either small or power forward, the pessimist might say that's because he's not really special at either. He hasn't been able to truly find a position in his career -- at least not for a team that's playing better than .200 ball.
> 
> The only good thing I can see about bringing in Harrington for the 45-55 million he'll command is that he's probably tradeable (Peja at a max or near-max contract wouldn't be). But I like Deng much, much more as a 3, I like Chandler/Sweetney/2006 draft pick much better at the power positions, and if we assume more organic growth from our players than what we'll get out of Harrington, I don't envision enough minutes for the guy to justify what he'll cost.
> 
> And generally speaking, barring some sort of lightning bolt of luck in the lottery (the Knicks have played just three games out of eleven at home, so I'm not counting on a top-three pick just yet), I think we have to make much bolder plays this offseason than Al Harrington. We need a superstar, not a guy who probably isn't any better than what we've already got.


I like Harrington quite a bit, but I think if we're going to make Sweets and Chandler part of the long term plans the other big in our rotation (I figure there are enough minutes at the 4/5 spots for 3 guys to get decent chunks of PT) must be able to play the 5. Harrington can't, and I don't like him better than Deng or Peja at the 3. I just don't see a spot for him the way our team's constructed, unless we make some pretty drastic moves...

Anyone seen much of Marvin Williams this year? The early returns are a bit disturbing. Will he get it going? Perhaps the struggles of the Hawks swingmen are a sign that the Joe Johnson at point guard idea isn't going to work long term...


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Deron Williams with 22/5/7 half way through the fourth quarter. It looks like Utah is going to win tonight. I'm proud of Deron. He's really stepping it up.

Speaking of our Illini, Luther Head looking like a true point guard tonight with 10 points and 8 assists. Houston loses again though. They sure seem to be very beatable right now. Let's hope we can continue the trend. Anyone know when TMac returns?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

jbulls said:


> I like Harrington quite a bit, but I think if we're going to make Sweets and Chandler part of the long term plans the other big in our rotation (I figure there are enough minutes at the 4/5 spots for 3 guys to get decent chunks of PT) must be able to play the 5. Harrington can't, and I don't like him better than Deng or Peja at the 3. I just don't see a spot for him the way our team's constructed, unless we make some pretty drastic moves...
> 
> Anyone seen much of Marvin Williams this year? The early returns are a bit disturbing. Will he get it going? Perhaps the struggles of the Hawks swingmen are a sign that the Joe Johnson at point guard idea isn't going to work long term...


Marvin does not have it as of yet. I called that one. I didn't like Marvin's lack of aggressiveness in college. He just doesn't seem like a star to me. Atlanta must be kicking itself for not drafting Chris Paul, a local college star playing a position they needed who just happens to be a flat out NBA stud.

BTW, Golden State comes back to overtake Utah at home despite Deron's fine game.

Slightly OK: Does anyone know of any NBA stats site that updates stats right after a game?


----------



## spongyfungy

Mo Cheeks back to coach against his former club.

Juan Dixon sucks. Salmons looks good as does Dmiles and Travis


----------



## Sham

Did anybody just watch Kobe single handedly lose a game?


Anyone who tells you Kobe shoots too much because has to.......just got owned. He was ****in DREADFUL tonight. 9-33, no assists, shot his game out of the game in the fourth when pretty much everybody else was playing well.

Wow. That was sickening. And I don't even care about the Lakers.


----------



## narek

Bucks beat the Mavs in Overtime and Kukoc played nearly 19 minutes, including a lot in the overtime. Ford continues to impress as does Bogut. 

I do wonder if the Bucks are the only team to have a post game show called "The Piggly Wiggly Post Game Show".


----------



## narek

ShamBulls said:


> Did anybody just watch Kobe single handedly lose a game?
> 
> 
> Anyone who tells you Kobe shoots too much because has to.......just got owned. He was ****in DREADFUL tonight. 9-33, no assists, shot his game out of the game in the fourth when pretty much everybody else was playing well.
> 
> Wow. That was sickening. And I don't even care about the Lakers.



Anyone think Phil may not last out the entire three years of his contract? 

MJ learned he couldn't do it all on his own - someday, maybe, Bryant will.


----------



## Sham

No chance. I have no doubt in my mind that Kobe will never, ever learn. He knows what he needs to do. He is not thick. He CHOOSES to do what he does, well aware of the alternative. I don;t think that can be changed by anyone. There's nothing you can say. Maybe one day, he just changes. But I doubt it.


----------



## spongyfungy

narek said:


> Bucks beat the Mavs in Overtime and Kukoc played nearly 19 minutes, including a lot in the overtime. Ford continues to impress as does Bogut.
> 
> I do wonder if the Bucks are the only team to have a post game show called "The Piggly Wiggly Post Game Show".


 That was a fun game to watch. Bulls game was boring compared to that one. TJ had a clutch three and Bogut was pretty good defensively. Simmons was great in place of Redd tonight.

I love to watch Terry shoot and he almost won it for the Mavs but that block by Bogut on him was fantastic


----------



## yodurk

narek said:


> Bucks beat the Mavs in Overtime and Kukoc played nearly 19 minutes, including a lot in the overtime. Ford continues to impress as does Bogut.
> 
> I do wonder if the Bucks are the only team to have a post game show called "The Piggly Wiggly Post Game Show".


That was disappointing for us. Bulls are gonna be fighting for playoff positioning with teams like the Bucks. It would've been nice to see the Mavs take this one. By the way, Milwaukee seems to have a flair for the dramatic too. They seem to be winning all the close ones, from what I've seen.


----------



## Sir Patchwork

ShamBulls said:


> Anyone who tells you Kobe shoots too much because has to.......just got owned. He was ****in DREADFUL tonight. 9-33, no assists, shot his game out of the game in the fourth when pretty much everybody else was playing well.


Kobe did play terrible tonight, but the fact that people consider the Lakers roleplayers to be playing well when they're shooting 39% (24-61) from the field is pretty telling.


----------



## narek

spongyfungy said:


> That was a fun game to watch. Bulls game was boring compared to that one. TJ had a clutch three and Bogut was pretty good defensively. Simmons was great in place of Redd tonight.
> 
> I love to watch Terry shoot and he almost won it for the Mavs but that block by Bogut on him was fantastic


Bogut impresses everytime I watch the Bucks - I get half the games locally - he's so active on the floor. Williams is damn good, too.


----------



## Sham

Sir Patchwork said:


> Kobe did play terrible tonight, but the fact that people consider the Lakers roleplayers to be playing well when they're shooting 39% (24-61) from the field is pretty telling.





If by people, you mean me, you'll notice I said "in the fourth quarter".


----------



## narek

yodurk said:


> That was disappointing for us. Bulls are gonna be fighting for playoff positioning with teams like the Bucks. It would've been nice to see the Mavs take this one. By the way, Milwaukee seems to have a flair for the dramatic too. They seem to be winning all the close ones, from what I've seen.


Also a flair for playing stretches at a time as if they've never seen a basketball before.


----------



## El Chapu

Speaking of the Celts, our next rivals, Perkins started tonight against Philly and had a very good line:
12 points
*19 rebounds*
4 assists
2 blocks


Watchout Tyson!!


----------



## ScottMay

Folks, keep your eyes on Cavs-Sonics tonight. It's 23-20 with 4 minutes left in the first, our old friend Jimmy Durham is doing the call with Steve "Snapper" Jones, Allen and Lewis are bombing threes, and LeBron is doing his very best impersonation of MJ in 1989. 

Looks like a good one.


----------



## jbulls

33 and 20 for Camby vs. Phoenix tonight, with less than a minute left...

35 PTS for Mo Williams(?!) for the Bucks vs. the Wizards on 15-21 from the field...


----------



## narek

jbulls said:


> 33 and 20 for Camby vs. Phoenix tonight, with less than a minute left...
> 
> 35 PTS for Mo Williams(?!) for the Bucks vs. the Wizards on 15-21 from the field...


He's one of the quiet reasons why the Bucks have been winning.


----------



## yodurk

jbulls said:


> 33 and 20 for Camby vs. Phoenix tonight, with less than a minute left...
> 
> 35 PTS for Mo Williams(?!) for the Bucks vs. the Wizards on 15-21 from the field...


Camby is playing out his mind right now. Seriously, he's an MVP candidate through 15 games. Averaging about 17 points, 14 rebounds, 1.6 assists, 1.8 steals, 3.4 blocks, only 2.1 turnovers. #2 in the NBA in efficiency ranking (#1 per 48 minutes). #1 Yahoo fantasy player. With the Nuggets at 8-9, where in the world would they be without him? My goodness.


----------



## Sham

Thing is though, with no Nene and a gimpy Martin, he's playing 40 minutes a night. So it's when, not if, he gets injured. Unless a miracle happens. They really must pull the trigger on the Lenard for Doleac deal.


----------



## bullsville

How about the Grizzlies? Major props are in order.

After their blowout win over the Magic, they now have the 3rd best record in the league (11-5), behind only Detroit and San Antonio.

The Logo let Swift and Bonzi walk, and he traded away White Chocolate and Posey, and now they have a nice, solid rotation of 7 players who get 22.4 minutes or more but only 2 guys (Pau and Battier) who get more than 34 minutes/game. 

Very similar rotation, minutes-wise, to the Bulls.

And the Grizz don't have anyone who averages 19 points per game, but 5 guys in double-figures (and BJax close at 9.9 pts/game).

This "team" game stuff with no "superstar" seems to be catching on and becoming more and more successful.


----------



## yodurk

bullsville said:


> How about the Grizzlies? Major props are in order.
> 
> After their blowout win over the Magic, they now have the 3rd best record in the league (11-5), behind only Detroit and San Antonio.
> 
> The Logo let Swift and Bonzi walk, and he traded away White Chocolate and Posey, and now they have a nice, solid rotation of 7 players who get 22.4 minutes or more but only 2 guys (Pau and Battier) who get more than 34 minutes/game.
> 
> Very similar rotation, minutes-wise, to the Bulls.
> 
> And the Grizz don't have anyone who averages 19 points per game, but 5 guys in double-figures (and BJax close at 9.9 pts/game).
> 
> This "team" game stuff with no "superstar" seems to be catching on and becoming more and more successful.


Maybe I should take K4E's "Chicago Grizzlies" comments as a compliment to our beloved team.


----------



## ScottMay

bullsville said:


> How about the Grizzlies? Major props are in order.
> 
> After their blowout win over the Magic, they now have the 3rd best record in the league (11-5), behind only Detroit and San Antonio.
> 
> The Logo let Swift and Bonzi walk, and he traded away White Chocolate and Posey, and now they have a nice, solid rotation of 7 players who get 22.4 minutes or more but only 2 guys (Pau and Battier) who get more than 34 minutes/game.
> 
> Very similar rotation, minutes-wise, to the Bulls.
> 
> And the Grizz don't have anyone who averages 19 points per game, but 5 guys in double-figures (and BJax close at 9.9 pts/game).
> 
> This "team" game stuff with no "superstar" seems to be catching on and becoming more and more successful.


Russ Granik will be presenting the Ned Irish Trophy, given since 1968 to the league's third-best team after 16 games played, to Michael Heisley and Dick Versace in a ceremony to be broadcast on ESPN 12 at 12:30 Pacific Time tonight.

Don't miss it.

In all seriousness, I wish the Bulls had a single player as good as Pau Gasol. Maybe he's not a superstar, but he's a lot closer to it than anything we have.


----------



## johnston797

yodurk said:


> Camby is playing out his mind right now. Seriously, he's an MVP candidate through 15 games. Averaging about 17 points, 14 rebounds, 1.6 assists, 1.8 steals, 3.4 blocks, only 2.1 turnovers. #2 in the NBA in efficiency ranking (#1 per 48 minutes). #1 Yahoo fantasy player. With the Nuggets at 8-9, where in the world would they be without him? My goodness.


Some posters, it's ok, I won't name names, said that the Nuggets couldn't trade Camby away for ending contracts if the Nugz decided to invest in Nene instead. Hmmm.


----------



## jbulls

ShamBulls said:


> Thing is though, with no Nene and a gimpy Martin, he's playing 40 minutes a night. So it's when, not if, he gets injured. Unless a miracle happens. They really must pull the trigger on the Lenard for Doleac deal.


He's at 35.4 right now, but that has to be a concern. Camby's been around since 96-97 and has only played 70 games once. He's averaged 54 a season over his nine year career. Still, he's having a fantastic season. I hope he stays healthy, could put up some huge numbers.


----------



## Sham

Unbelievably the Orlando Magic, coming off an embarassing defeat and missing 3 of their 4 best players in Francis, Hill and Turkoglu, are ahead on the road to the Bucks, 68-67. Keeping me eyes on that one.


----------



## Sham

The old ShamBulls kiss of death is still in effect I see. Milwaukee just went on a 24-7 run.


Oh well, that was fun for a minute.


----------



## narek

ShamBulls said:


> The old ShamBulls kiss of death is still in effect I see. Milwaukee just went on a 24-7 run.
> 
> 
> Oh well, that was fun for a minute.


I was hoping this game would be on FSN which carries the Bucks games, but nope, we had college Hockey tonight. I wanted to see Bogut against Howard. 

OTOH, the Badgers did sweep Minnesota in Hockey................

Toronto beat New Jersey. Wow.


----------



## bullsville

Philly lost tonight as well, and they now lead the Atlantic with an 8-10 record, a 36-win pace.

I keep getting the feeling that my "Knicks win the Atlantic with 35 wins and the 3-division alignment screws us out of a lottery pick" nightmare is coming true.

Then I remember that the Bulls are sitting in a great position to claim the 6th seed and the honor of sweeping the Atlantic winner in the first round, and all is well.


----------



## spongyfungy

Bosh Monster. 29 and 13 

15-16 FT's

Chicago Bulls : 15-26 FT's MY GAWD


----------



## kukoc4ever

ScottMay said:


> In all seriousness, I wish the Bulls had a single player as good as Pau Gasol. Maybe he's not a superstar, but he's a lot closer to it than anything we have.


Which is the main difference, IMO, between the current Griz and the Griz of the last 2 years.

Gasol is becoming a star type player, one that any real NBA team needs.

Its also good to see the Griz playing their best players heavy minutes under the new regime. It never made much sense to see a great player like Gasol not getting 37 minutes a night.


----------



## Cyanobacteria

Sham,
your new avatar has taken over first place as my favorite on the board...

(wait for it)...

but only by the slimmest of margins.


----------



## Sham

That's the dagger......


----------



## spongyfungy

Had a double dose of Wayne today. He did the illini game as well at the UC. He stays in Chi-town for the Green Bay game tommorow.


----------



## kukoc4ever

Anyone see THE HAWK logged 35 starting minutes in tonights Mavs/Hornets game?

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore?gid=2005120306

4-8 shooting, 7 boards, 2 blocks. Solid veteran leader. Nice to see him doing well... he's a solid guy.


----------



## yodurk

Anyone else becoming a fan of the Celtics? 

They allow us to win at their place, then they go into New York and do what we couldn't the other night...beat the Knicks. Not to mention they're sagging right now in the East, allowing us the inside track for playoff positioning.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

kukoc4ever said:


> Anyone see THE HAWK logged 35 starting minutes in tonights Mavs/Hornets game?
> 
> http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore?gid=2005120306
> 
> 4-8 shooting, 7 boards, 2 blocks. Solid veteran leader. Nice to see him doing well... he's a solid guy.


And we could use him. Against teams like New Jersey and Indiana, I don't know how long we can play our small guards against Carter or Stephen Jackson. It might behoove us in those cases to play big minutes with Deng and Nocioni manning the 2 and 3, leaving us no small forward depth.


----------



## truebluefan

kukoc4ever said:


> Anyone see THE HAWK logged 35 starting minutes in tonights Mavs/Hornets game?
> 
> http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore?gid=2005120306
> 
> 4-8 shooting, 7 boards, 2 blocks. Solid veteran leader. Nice to see him doing well... he's a solid guy.


Indeed, a very nice game.


----------



## bullsville

Basden has looked pretty comfortable in the few minutes he is starting to get, I have a feeling that he will be seeing more minutes at the 3 with Nocioni and/or Deng playing more 4.


----------



## Sham

The Hawks got blown out pretty badly vs Phoenix tonight, but put up a 40 point quarter in the fourth. And some of their talent was on show. Marvin Williams had 17 and 11 with three steals, his best performance to date, and after Zaza got ejected to start the third, Esteban Batista got his first significant dollop of playing time apart from one abortive start, and responded with career highs in every single category. Salim Stoudamire had a 4 point play, too.


I know the Hawks aren't very good, but I still feel they've got about 6 or 7 of the pieces that they need, and I follow them very closely.


----------



## spongyfungy

<table border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr class="yspsctbg"> <td class="ysptblhdr" height="18"> Top Performers</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="ysptblbdr2"> <table class="yspwhitebg" border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr class="ysptblthbody1"> <td colspan="2" class="yspdetailttl"> Miami</td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblbdr2"> <td colspan="2" height="1">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td height="60" valign="top">  </td> <td class="yspgens" valign="top" width="100%"> D. Wade
12-25, 29 Pts
6 Rebs, 4 Assists </td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblthbody1"> <td colspan="2" class="yspdetailttl"> LA Clippers</td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblbdr2"> <td colspan="2" height="1">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td height="60" valign="top">  </td> <td class="yspgens" valign="top" width="100%"> E. Brand
16-23, 37 Pts
12 Rebs, 3 Assists


</td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody> </table> Clippers win 99-89. Wow.


----------



## rosenthall

spongyfungy said:



> <table border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr class="yspsctbg"> <td class="ysptblhdr" height="18"> Top Performers</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="ysptblbdr2"> <table class="yspwhitebg" border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr class="ysptblthbody1"> <td colspan="2" class="yspdetailttl"> Miami</td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblbdr2"> <td colspan="2" height="1">
> </td> </tr> <tr> <td height="60" valign="top">  </td> <td class="yspgens" valign="top" width="100%"> D. Wade
> 12-25, 29 Pts
> 6 Rebs, 4 Assists </td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblthbody1"> <td colspan="2" class="yspdetailttl"> LA Clippers</td> </tr> <tr class="ysptblbdr2"> <td colspan="2" height="1">
> </td> </tr> <tr> <td height="60" valign="top">  </td> <td class="yspgens" valign="top" width="100%"> E. Brand
> 16-23, 37 Pts
> 12 Rebs, 3 Assists
> 
> 
> </td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody> </table> Clippers win 99-89. Wow.


I know this is beating a dead horse that's already been pulverized into a smushy pulp by now, but it really is remarkable that we had 2 future MVP candidates on our team (I'm counting Ron Artest as a fringe candidate right now) at the same time in their early twenties, and traded them away for what has amounted to Tyson Chandler, and some capspace. 

Yeesh.


----------



## rosenthall

And also, Antoine Walker seriously stank it up tonight.

18 minutes, 0-10 from the floor, 0-6 from three, 0 pts. 

Go Toine!


----------



## El Chapu

Diaw having a nice season so far, he is all over the place. Not Joe Johnson caliber, but he is a solid baller.


----------



## yodurk

Not that I'm happy about losing to Dallas last night, but you've gotta be impressed that they won tonight at Indiana on the 2nd night of a back to back. Indiana is impressing me less with each passing game.


----------



## spongyfungy

El Chapu said:


> Diaw having a nice season so far, he is all over the place. Not Joe Johnson caliber, but he is a solid baller.


 Atlanta just utilized the kid so incorrectly. The boy can pass.

Also : the knicks signed Qyntel Woods.

 Knicks sign journeyman Woods


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

spongyfungy said:


> Atlanta just utilized the kid so incorrectly. The boy can pass.
> 
> Also : the knicks signed Qyntel Woods.
> 
> Knicks sign journeyman Woods


Actually Diaw would be an awesome fit with Ben Gordon ..and Kirk for that matter 

Boris for Chris ?


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

Credit where credit is due 

Jamal came up clutch for the Knicks down the stretch tonight


----------



## Da Grinch

spongyfungy said:


> Atlanta just utilized the kid so incorrectly. The boy can pass.
> 
> Also : the knicks signed Qyntel Woods.
> 
> Knicks sign journeyman Woods


i disagree with the hawks using diaw wrong , i think he is just one of those guys who was scared of making a mistake in atl. they didn't have alot of talent and mistakes can be costly , they wanted him to be more prominent , in fact they would bench him for not shooting enough or not being aggressive.

in pho. its a lot more free wheeling a mistake is more easily made up there because of their pace and style of play where they force other teams to play in a way they aren't really accustomed.

qyntel woods , i sort of doubt it will work out, IT knows talent and woods has some , but to me he isn't at the point where he will reverse his downward spiral, i hope i'm wrong for his sake but i think this experiment will end sometime around the all star break.


----------



## ScottMay

I've said this countless times over the years, but man, do I ever enjoy Raptor telecasts, be it Swirsky-Armstrong or Swirsky-Rautins. I'm watching long stretches of a game I have no rooting/rotisserie interest in tonight simply because of the call.


----------



## Sham

Make sure to watch Wade's dunk tonight. Splits 2 defenders and his own screen before throwing down a very powerful one hander. Best part of the dunk: how incredibly quickly Tony Parker runs backwards.


----------



## spongyfungy

Da Grinch said:


> i disagree with the hawks using diaw wrong , i think he is just one of those guys who was scared of making a mistake in atl. they didn't have alot of talent and mistakes can be costly , they wanted him to be more prominent , in fact they would bench him for not shooting enough or not being aggressive.
> 
> in pho. its a lot more free wheeling a mistake is more easily made up there because of their pace and style of play where they force other teams to play in a way they aren't really accustomed.
> 
> qyntel woods , i sort of doubt it will work out, IT knows talent and woods has some , but to me he isn't at the point where he will reverse his downward spiral, i hope i'm wrong for his sake but i think this experiment will end sometime around the all star break.


 Well, this is what I read from an article about him : 



> "I like to do a bit of everything on the court," he said. "I wanted to try to do a little bit of everything [in Atlanta], the way they make me play here. I'm not asking for minutes. I just wanted to really know what I was supposed to do."
> 
> That uncertainty about his future and fit with the Hawks is what prompted Diaw to request a trade at the end of last season.
> 
> "Hey, Boris couldn't play for me," Hawks coach Mike Woodson said. "He said he didn't want to play for me. He wanted out. But all I can do as a coach is coach a guy the best way I know how, and if he doesn't want to play for me, we have to try and accommodate him.


 http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sports/hawks/1205/04johnson.html

Diaw's a finesse guy and while he does fit well in Phoenix, he just didn't like playing in Atlanta because he didn't know his role or didn't like it. either way, they used him wrong or they forced things he didn't want to do.


----------



## jbulls

spongyfungy said:


> Well, this is what I read from an article about him :
> 
> http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sports/hawks/1205/04johnson.html
> 
> Diaw's a finesse guy and while he does fit well in Phoenix, he just didn't like playing in Atlanta because he didn't know his role or didn't like it. either way, they used him wrong or they forced things he didn't want to do.


If I'm a Hawks fan that Mike Woodson quote is making me bang my head against the wall. If Diaw ends up being 2/3rds the player Johnson is (a distinct possibility) that trade is looking awfully good for Phoenix.

I always thought Diaw looked decent for stretches with the Hawks, but he's a guy whose talents are better employed on a team that can actually move the ball and make shots.


----------



## Da Grinch

spongyfungy said:


> Well, this is what I read from an article about him :
> 
> http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sports/hawks/1205/04johnson.html
> 
> Diaw's a finesse guy and while he does fit well in Phoenix, he just didn't like playing in Atlanta because he didn't know his role or didn't like it. either way, they used him wrong or they forced things he didn't want to do.



the hawks wanted to him run the 2nd unit , they originally wanted him to start alongside terry and all of their small 2's playing the pg, but he wouldn't shoot or shoot enough so he was a liability ....the thing is when you watch him , you can see he can play , even when he isn't playing well.

i think it was the losing that soured him personally ...not everyone takes it well you know, i think it made his game worse, but he is obviously far more free flowing in sunsland.


----------



## rlucas4257

Has Phoenix picked up his option for next year cause he would fit into what the Bulls are trying to do as a 2 guard in FA


----------



## yodurk

We actually discussed a possible Duhon for Diaw trade on this board last year. It might've been a winning trade for both sides. But I'm not convinced Diaw can play well on any team. Steve Nash is just so good at making his teammates look like all-stars. Diaw's confidence is at an all-time high. I'm not so sure he'd flourish here.


----------



## El Chapu

Ahhhh....Knicks vs Clips, Curry and Brand having very good games. :brokenhea


----------



## RoRo

nice sequence in the knicks clips game.
brand takes curry off the dribble to tie the game with a sweeping hook.
curry and crawford run a loose pick and roll. craw hits curry with a good pass. curry goes for the dunk and brand goes for the block. curry gets dunk over brand.
clips ball...


----------



## RoRo

lol brand beats curry at a jumpball. clips take the lead.


----------



## McBulls

The Knicks may lose this one, but I'm impressed with the defense they are playing on the second game of a back-to-back against a very good LA team. 

Curry looks pretty good as well.


----------



## Rhyder

McBulls said:


> The Knicks may lose this one, but I'm impressed with the defense they are playing on the second game of a back-to-back against a very good LA team.
> 
> Curry looks pretty good as well.


Keep on losing Knicks. :clap: 

I'm very surprised Frye only received 15 minutes tonight especially with his improved rebounding to go along with his offense as of late.


----------



## RoRo

good game by curry, but terrible finish. curry missed 2 big free throws. might be his conditioning too , when kaman drove on him curry was flat footed and watched him run by for an open jumper. 

crawford was off but he was still able to set up some easy shots for the bigs and also get to the free throwline. 

nate robinson was all over the court. as was brand who did a little bit of everything until the guards were able to hit some big shots at the end of the game.

good game.


----------



## Cyanobacteria

In the Suns-Warriors shoot-out Marion made a play I'd never seen done before. Warrriors were running an alley-oop, Marion came in from the wing and just stole the pass out of the air and headed the other way. I've seen plenty of alley-oops broken up before by defenders swatting the ball away or lots of contact, but this was new. He just elevated an extra foot and intercepted the pass with one hand before it came down to the offensive player with all kinds of daylight between them. Just an astonishing display of athleticism, but the kind of play that will never be on a highlight show, didn't even get a replay during the telecast. All I could say was "wow."


----------



## spongyfungy

Hawks beat the Spurs. my word


----------



## El Chapu

Line: 30 points, 11 rebounds, 5 assists, 4 blocks


No, its not KG. Thats Bosh's line against Okafor and the Bobcats. They are becoming pretty normal.


----------



## Sham

LeBron had 52/7/7 tonight. And the Cavs still lost.

And T.J. Ford has officially got three point range now.


----------



## narek

ShamBulls said:


> LeBron had 52/7/7 tonight. And the Cavs still lost.
> 
> And T.J. Ford has officially got three point range now.


And they keep putting Toni in at the end of games. He's still got game.


----------



## spongyfungy

check Team4 on League Pass. Detroit losing big to Utah.

Lakers win over Dallas on a crazy three by kobe and the hornets win over the Suns...... A serious cause of the MUUNDAAYSS.


----------



## mizenkay

a heartfelt *Welcome Home* (sorta) to the New Orleans Hornets.

playing in Louisiana tonight (at LSU) for the first time since Hurricane Katrina.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2260562






> P.J. Brown knows firsthand the horrors that Hurricane Katrina brought on New Orleans and the Gulf Coast region and he doesn't want anyone to forget.
> 
> Brown and the New Orleans Hornets will play the Phoenix Suns in Baton Rouge on Friday, the first of six "home" games scheduled on the campus of Louisiana State University.
> 
> Before the game, Brown hopes to get home for a few hours to tie up some loose ends. But even 3½months after the storm, there's no way he can spend one night at his house in Slidell, La., across Lake Pontchartrain from New Orleans.
> 
> "It's not livable," said Brown, the Hornets' 6-foot-11 center. "We really haven't even started getting it back. We've got it cleaned up and stuff like that just like everybody else. The insurance companies are dragging their feet with all of us."
> 
> The trip home will be a fresh reminder for Brown, who visited his flooded, damaged and looted home several times before the season began and went back again for his mother-in-law's funeral last month.
> 
> "It's special to go back home and go back and see family, see some friends and play in front of so many of our fans who haven't had a chance to see us play," Brown said. "It's bittersweet. It's tough just knowing the situation, knowing a lot of the tough times that people are going through down there."
> 
> While Brown keeps up with Katrina's lingering effects, he fears that the country's awareness has dropped off since the Aug. 29 storm.
> 
> "You see the reports, but people don't have no idea the pain and suffering that people are going through down there," he said. "We've got a long, long way to go down there."
> 
> Brown will be among the players presenting food to hundreds of needy families as part of an "Operation Rebound" caravan stopping in three Louisiana cities over the weekend. He said he hopes the effort reminds others that there's more work to be done.


----------



## MikeDC

The Hornets are laying it on the Suns pretty good. The Suns have been playing like real garbage lately :|

Chris Paul is just a fantastic player, and I'd trade all 14 of our PFs for David West. He just drove, got blocked, got it back and scored in a real crowd of Suns.


----------



## MikeDC

LOL, no sooner did I talk them up then Phoenix outscored them 37-10 in the 4th quarter and steals the game. It must be nice to be able to turn it on whenever your need it like that!


----------



## bullsville

Mikedc said:


> LOL, no sooner did I talk them up then Phoenix outscored them 37-10 in the 4th quarter and steals the game. It must be nice to be able to turn it on whenever your need it like that!


Why couldn't you have been talking the Pistons up in the game thread, maybe we could have outscored them 37-10 in the 4th.

Of course, that would have only been good enough to send the game into overtime... :curse:


----------



## rosenthall

A few musings:

As of right now, I think Chauncey Billups, is the best PG in the NBA. He's quietly having an unreal season. 19 pts, 9 assts, w/ 46% from downtown and 92 % from the line. And I think he leads the NBA in Ast/TO ratio, while being the Pistons primary ballhandler and playing about 40 minutes a game. And he's first team all defense. His statline tonight against the Blazers was pretty sick, and they're starting to become normal. If he keeps this up, I think he could be considered a darkhorse MVP candidate. 

Shaun Livingston looks to be healthy, and he seems to be doing pretty well. I haven't seen him play yet, but it looks like his talent was as good as advertised, and apparently, he's even good enough that Sam Cassell isn't *****ing about having to share time with him. But there's still a lot of season to go, so it's probably too early to tell on that one.


----------



## narek

Another loss for the Spurs without Manu - Overtime, 7 seconds left Toni inbounds - lop pass to Bogut, Bogut scores. Duncan had fouled out in the fourth quarter.


----------



## ScottMay

narek said:


> Another loss for the Spurs without Manu - Overtime, 7 seconds left Toni inbounds - lop pass to Bogut, Bogut scores. Duncan had fouled out in the fourth quarter.


I'm trying to figure out how I can nominate this as an instant ESPN Classic. What an outstanding NBA game.

(And I'm not just saying that because it gave me an excuse to basically ignore the Bulls getting worked at home by the Robertcats)


----------



## narek

ScottMay said:


> I'm trying to figure out how I can nominate this as an instant ESPN Classic. What an outstanding NBA game.
> 
> (And I'm not just saying that because it gave me an excuse to basically ignore the Bulls getting worked at home by the Robertcats)


The last play is the play of the game over at the videos at nba.com - with the Spurs announcers.

I watched a bit of NBA fastbreak on ESPN2 last night and either Legler or Anthony was dissing Bogut (big plus to the show - not seeing who is talking). that was when the Spurs had a 14 point lead. Stotts, otoh, believes in him enough that he's always in at the end of close games. As is Toni.


----------



## Sham

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap;_ylt=AhhhOtr3qdj0mWcFcTCWEfY5nYcB?gid=2005122330



Christ.


----------



## spongyfungy

Vince 51 point effort. AI bested him with 53 points. 

Gilbert is going for forty tonight


----------



## spongyfungy

ShamBulls said:


> http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap;_ylt=AhhhOtr3qdj0mWcFcTCWEfY5nYcB?gid=2005122330
> 
> 
> 
> Christ.


Oh wow.....what a game by Kaman!


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

spongyfungy said:


> Oh wow.....what a game by Kaman!


Despite Iverson's 53, Carter's 51, and Kaman's 22/22, the line of the night goes to:

Elton Brand!!!

38 points, 20 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 blocks, 1 steal 

:eek8:


----------



## El Chapu

David West also got himself a nice s-line:
27 points, 18 rebounds


----------



## ScottMay

I'm doing a little work with GS-Boston on in the background, no sound. Although I'm not watching it all the time, I realize that I haven't seen a guy miss in a while. So I look it up -- with 3:54 left in the 1st, Boston's 14/17 from the field and GS is 12/16. 29-27 Celtics.

Sheesh.


----------



## DaBullz

Streaks...

Bulls 2-8 in their last 10, 7 losses in a row.

76ers snapped a 9 game losing streak last night.

Raptors have won 5 of 7 and 3 in a row (look out or they'll pass us).

Lakers are now below .500 at 15-16 and have a 5 game losing streak.

TWolves are 2-8 in their last 10, but still at .500 (what a difference a top star makes)

Knicks have a winning streak (1 game! LOL). They're 2-8 in their last 10 also.


----------



## TRUTHHURTS

The east is so bad the knicks are still only 4 games out of the 8th seed .That is just sickening to me :curse:


----------



## Sham

Raptors win again. Started 1-15, 9-7 since.


----------



## rosenthall

I always liked this thread, so I figured it's time to give it 'da bump.

I watched the Cavs-Hawks game tonight, and spent most of the game watching the Al Jefferson-Drew Gooden matchup. A few impressions:

Al Harrington is a pretty good player, and he's pretty jibby, and I think he could function reasonably well on our team, but he's tweenerish enough that I'd be pretty nervous if we were going to rely on him for an inside presence on offense or defense. So, on one hand, I think signing him would only make sense if we were planning on getting other players to supplement him in the frontcourt, because in a lot of ways, he's just like everyone currently on our team. Talented, hard working, but ultimately role-playerish in that he probably needs someone that's better than him on the court at the same time to be really effective. A part of me says that maybe it's a bad idea to give a player 60 million dollars that we'd probably have to make such accomodations for, but another part of me says 'who the hell else are we going to sign?'

In terms of a basketball fit, Drew Gooden is tangibly better. I think he's on a higher plateau in terms of how impactful his 'big man's' game is. He can legitimately score and rebound against most people in the league, I think. I don't watch him regularly, so I don't know if it was an aberration tonight, but most of the time he was on the court he was pretty active and was around the ball a lot. I know he's had jib issues, but considering our circumstances, I think Pax would be foolish not to look into him and see if there's any disparity between perception and reality there.

Has anyone else noticed that Chris Kaman is quietly turning into one of the best centers in the NBA? Whenever I've seen him I've always thought he had talent, but just hadn't quite gotten in a groove yet. Looks like he's found it.


----------



## spongyfungy

Busy night in the NBA. I'll be watching Wally and Artest play for their new teams. Should be fun.


----------



## BullSoxChicagosFinest

Peja not in uniform. Wally coming from physical, should be in uniform but not likely to play. Artest will start

EDIT: NM on Wally. The Boston telecast first said he wasn't going to, now he's stretching and the sideline report says he expects to.


----------



## spongyfungy

Artest with the tap-steal, fastbreak Artest has it. pass to a cutting Brad Miller for the layup.


----------



## spongyfungy

oh my goodness : *Hornets' Andersen dismissed from NBA*


NEW YORK - The NBA announced today that Chris Andersen of the New Orleans/Oklahoma City Hornets has been dismissed and disqualified from the league for violating the terms of the Anti-Drug Program agreed to by the NBA and the National Basketball Players Association. 

A veteran player such as Andersen who is dismissed from the league under the Anti-Drug Program cannot apply for reinstatement for at least two years. 

The NBA, NBA teams, and the Players Association are prohibited from publicly disclosing information regarding the testing or treatment of any NBA player under the Anti-Drug Program, other than to announce a player's suspension or dismissal from the league.

http://www.tsn.ca/nba/news_story.asp?id=152575


----------



## rlucas4257

spongyfungy said:


> oh my goodness : *Hornets' Andersen dismissed from NBA*
> 
> 
> NEW YORK - The NBA announced today that Chris Andersen of the New Orleans/Oklahoma City Hornets has been dismissed and disqualified from the league for violating the terms of the Anti-Drug Program agreed to by the NBA and the National Basketball Players Association.
> 
> A veteran player such as Andersen who is dismissed from the league under the Anti-Drug Program cannot apply for reinstatement for at least two years.
> 
> The NBA, NBA teams, and the Players Association are prohibited from publicly disclosing information regarding the testing or treatment of any NBA player under the Anti-Drug Program, other than to announce a player's suspension or dismissal from the league.
> 
> http://www.tsn.ca/nba/news_story.asp?id=152575



This guy has always been among my 5 most disliked players in the league. He is an out and out dip****. And the story was that he hurt Skitas developement early cause they would always go out and party. Lots of missed meetings, etc. Everyone thought he was a nice story cause he came out of literally nowhere to land in the league but he has acted like a dufus since then and the league will be better off without this cancer. Hopefully, and it will be interesting, the media picks this up because they do tend to talk about players of a certain race when they screw up but not other players, and this is every bit as big as Steve Francis not entering a game or some of those Pacers trying to protect themselves during the brawl last year. This is another black eye on the game and Ill be curious to hear or see if it gets any real pub.


----------



## Cyanobacteria

It's time for the birdman to fly.


----------



## Swan

rlucas4257 said:


> This guy has always been among my 5 most disliked players in the league. He is an out and out dip****. And the story was that he hurt Skitas developement early cause they would always go out and party. Lots of missed meetings, etc. Everyone thought he was a nice story cause he came out of literally nowhere to land in the league but he has acted like a dufus since then and the league will be better off without this cancer. Hopefully, and it will be interesting, the media picks this up because they do tend to talk about players of a certain race when they screw up but not other players, and this is every bit as big as Steve Francis not entering a game or some of those Pacers trying to protect themselves during the brawl last year. This is another black eye on the game and Ill be curious to hear or see if it gets any real pub.


As a basketball fan, to me it's a big deal, but I doubt it gets the same press as those other incidents, probably because outside of hornets fan, nobody knows or cares who Andersen is. Besides being in the dunk contest, the guy's a second stringer and not somebody who's name's going to register. But I totally agree with you that in sports, and especially basketball, race becomes an issue and lens with almost anything.


----------



## TripleDouble

Who is the big-name white player who has screwed up and been let off the hook by the media? 

Who is the last black twelfth man who has been grilled by the media for a un-malicious crime like drug abuse?


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

rlucas4257 said:


> This guy has always been among my 5 most disliked players in the league. He is an out and out dip****. And the story was that he hurt Skitas developement early cause they would always go out and party.



Or it could be that Skita just could have taken some responsibility for himself when you had an organisation obligated to pay him millions of dollars under a contract to play basketball

That and the fact that he just wasn't that good in the first place 

But yeah it was Chris Andersen's fault


----------



## SausageKingofChicago

TripleDouble said:


> Who is the big-name white player who has screwed up and been let off the hook by the media?


Take your pick . Pro sports is full of them 

[edit]



> Who is the last black twelfth man who has been grilled by the media for a un-malicious crime like drug abuse?


Again take your pick


----------



## mizenkay

ok, back to the TOPIC OF THIS THREAD!

tonight CELTICS @ MINNY! that should be interesting. 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime-060130

*Wally's back! The Celtics make a Minny stop just four days after the trade that sent Szczerbiak, Michael Olowokandi and Dwayne Jones east for Davis, Mark Blount, Marcus Banks and Justin Reed. It will be fun to see Wally and Ricky challenge each other so soon after the deal -- and even more fun if Davis and ex-teammate Paul Pierce face off. Speaking of ex-teammates, don't forget this trade is for bragging rights among Larry Bird's former supporting castmates, Wolves VP Kevin McHale and Celtics boss Danny Ainge.*


----------



## narek

mizenkay said:


> ok, back to the TOPIC OF THIS THREAD!
> 
> tonight CELTICS @ MINNY! that should be interesting.
> 
> http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime-060130
> 
> *Wally's back! The Celtics make a Minny stop just four days after the trade that sent Szczerbiak, Michael Olowokandi and Dwayne Jones east for Davis, Mark Blount, Marcus Banks and Justin Reed. It will be fun to see Wally and Ricky challenge each other so soon after the deal -- and even more fun if Davis and ex-teammate Paul Pierce face off. Speaking of ex-teammates, don't forget this trade is for bragging rights among Larry Bird's former supporting castmates, Wolves VP Kevin McHale and Celtics boss Danny Ainge.*


Gee, does Ainge win bragging rights by default?


----------



## mizenkay

celtics were down early but have managed to get it within 2 at the end of the first.

wally got a very nice ovation at the target center.

when kandi-man entered the game late in the first - the boos rained down so he took it hard to the basket and dunked over blount. 

:laugh:


----------



## spongyfungy

wow. hawks Pistons game. Joe Johnson clutch.


----------



## Sham

I'm not a big fan of standings, as I can never be arsed to look.

But was anyone else surprised when they saw that the Celtics had slipped to 13 games under .500?

13?

Yeesh.


----------



## MikeDC

ShamBulls said:


> I'm not a big fan of standings, as I can never be arsed to look.
> 
> But was anyone else surprised when they saw that the Celtics had slipped to 13 games under .500?
> 
> 13?
> 
> Yeesh.


They've been getting progressively worse for quite a while now. I'm actually pretty surprised. I would have thought any team whose key signings were Dan Dickau and Brian Scalabrine was headed for great things. Probably a good thing they decided to shore things up by trading for Wally World!


----------



## rosenthall

Two things:

At some point, people are going to have to realize that Chris Kaman has been playing like one of the 5 best centers in the league for the past month or two. He's pretty good for 15/10/2 these days. I've watched him play a few times, and he's always impressed me. Underrated athlete, with underrated offensive skills. I think the haircut/hygiene is dragging him down. Him and Brand are a pretty big load for any team.

At some point, people are really going to have to give the Mavs some credit. I almost flinched when I looked at the standings after tonight and saw that they were a half game behind the Pistons. 12 in a row, and they're just annihilating everyone. And really, they might be the most complete team in the NBA. Great starting 5, great bench, athletic, can shoot the ball, and are good offensively and defensively. Mark Cuban's done a helluva job down there.


----------



## Cyanobacteria

2 HUGE clutch 3's from everyone's favorite ******* Brad Miller tonight for the Sacto Bulls-west. Brad was severely ticked after fellow Boiler Cardinal flopped and almost got Brad's 6th, but it was overruled. Brad managed to get a technical in on the play though.


----------



## GB

Some interesting stats:

The Cavs won 8 of their last 10 --> They're fighting to have home court come the playoffs, and right now they are 5 games better than Indiana...who has won 3 in a row.

San Antonio is fourth in the west, 9 games better than the 5th place team, the Clippers. They've won seven in a row and aren't in third or second only by virtue of NBA rules. 

Dallas has won 13 in a row, and thats the only thing keeping them ahead of San Antonio. I think they may get overtaken...

Theres something in the Oklahoma air: Chris Paul, I mean, the Hornets, are in 7th place in the west, better than the Lakers, basically on the strength of a 16-8 home record...

Memphis is tumbling, and either Utah or Houston are going to knock the Lakers out of the playoffs.


----------



## spongyfungy

Anyone see Dwayne just absolutely take over the Pistons in the fourth quarter. It hurts everytime I watch this kid play.


----------



## giantkiller7

spongyfungy said:


> Anyone see Dwayne just absolutely take over the Pistons in the fourth quarter. It hurts everytime I watch this kid play.


That was insane. What a great game. What'd he score, the last 15 Heat points?


----------



## PowerWoofer

spongyfungy said:


> Anyone see Dwayne just absolutely take over the Pistons in the fourth quarter. It hurts everytime I watch this kid play.


And to think if only he could have slipped down a couple spots in the draft and Chicago could have picked him up. Think of where we would be right now with Wade instead of Hinrich. But, ...


----------



## GB

This is actually pretty humorous when you think about it. Straight from the newspaper:



> Isiah Thomas was supposed to give a "State-of-The-Knicks" address last night, but instead called in sick.


http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/63669.htm


----------



## Rhyder

GB said:


> This is actually pretty humorous when you think about it. Straight from the newspaper:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/63669.htm


I'd call in sick too if I were IT and had to explain what was going on in my brain.


----------



## narek

Cleveland lost at home last night, and the fans bood Lebron James:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=260224005


> "We tried to pressure the ball, take him a little out of his game, and see if things might happen," Arenas said. "It's a real good win for us."
> 
> James finished with 25 points, but went 0-for-8 from the field and 4-for-12 from the foul line in the second half as Cleveland dropped its second straight after winning three in a row.
> 
> "I put all the blame on myself," said James, who came in averaging 35.8 points on 52 percent shooting over his previous five games. "It was a bad performance by me, simple as that."
> 
> James missed his final seven from the line -- and was even booed in the final minutes. After missing a shot from the wing with 5 seconds left, he angrily ripped off his headband, threw it into the crowd and walked off the court.
> 
> James said he "of course" heard the boos, adding, "If these fans want to boo me, it's on them."


Did MJ ever get booed in Chicago? I can't think of any time like that.


----------



## bullsville

I don't think MJ ever got booed in Chicago, but I'm also pretty sure that he never missed 7 straight free throws either.


----------



## spongyfungy

Last night was an incredible night of basketball. Almost all the games went down to the wire and there were many buzzer beating efforts and clutch shots. Joe Johnson, Carmelo Anthony after a Hassell steal and alley-oop to KG, Caron Butler, Mike Miller. J-rich and Michael Redd making go-ahead dunks with seconds to go. Memphis made a late rally.

This was the best night of the NBA since Kobe Sunday. NBA TV Daily Friday Recap

quick game highlights

Top 10 plays


----------



## spongyfungy

watching the mavs-raptors game and it's a t-party there too. Graham clotheslined Jason Terry on a handoff to Mike James. even more shocking, Raptors are winning big.

(6:12) * [DAL 39-50] Stackhouse Free Throw Technical (4 PTS)*
(6:12) [TOR] Mitchell Foul: Technical ( PF)
(6:12) [DAL] Team Rebound
(6:12) [DAL] Nowitzki Free Throw Technical missed
(6:12) [TOR] James Foul: Technical (1 PF)
(6:12) * [TOR 50-38] James Free Throw Technical (11 PTS)*
(6:12) [DAL] Terry Foul: Technical (2 PF)
(6:12) * [TOR 49-38] James Free Throw Technical (10 PTS)*
(6:12) [DAL] Johnson Foul: Technical ( PF)
(6:12) [DAL] Team Timeout: Short
(6:14) * [TOR 48-38] Graham Jump Shot: Made (3 PTS) Assist: James (2 AST)

*and our old friend Adrian Griffin with a technical for shoving Mike James while in the air


----------



## mizenkay

cavs lost their *5th game in a row* tonight v. the king 97-90.

just caught a few minutes of the end. cavs announcers saying "they fail to execute offensively down the stretch" sound familiar!?

they'll be fired up tomorrow.


----------



## narek

mizenkay said:


> cavs lost their *5th game in a row* tonight v. the king 97-90.


This sure has been a season of lots of long losing streaks for teams, hasn't it? Teams are going to stumble their way into the 6th, 7th and 8th play off spots.


----------



## El Chapu

Good news for our Knicks pick: Bobcats defeated Utah.

And to cap a terrible night for Knicks fans, Denver won against Detroit (they own their first rounder this year).

Lets go Portland!


----------



## Chris Bosh #4

Villanueva scored 25 points and grabbed 11 rebounds 6 of them offensive!


----------



## spongyfungy

mizenkay said:


> cavs lost their *5th game in a row* tonight v. the king 97-90.
> 
> just caught a few minutes of the end. cavs announcers saying "they fail to execute offensively down the stretch" sound familiar!?
> 
> they'll be fired up tomorrow.


 scouting the opponents huh? 

We've been catching alot of teams off a tail-end of a back-to-backs lately.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

I turned on the Magic/Suns game after the Bulls finished. I'm hoping to see some Darko floor time.

Yeesh, Gary Bender is an awful announcer! You Bears fans remember him? How does he continue to get hired?


----------



## jbulls

Darius Miles Davis said:


> I turned on the Magic/Suns game after the Bulls finished. I'm hoping to see some Darko floor time.
> 
> Yeesh, Gary Bender is an awful announcer! You Bears fans remember him? How does he continue to get hired?


Watching a little of it now. It always beffudles me how little the Magic run for Dwight Howard. People used to blame it on Steve Francis, but it doesn't look much different now he's gone. Darko's body language still looks extremely poor, he doesn't exactly get after it out there.


----------



## spongyfungy

Darko didn't box out Matrix as he got an easy alley-oop from Nash. Suns win.

watching the Sonics beat the Pistons...very weird.


----------



## PowerWoofer

*Games tonight on March 4th*

I know there's already an official thread for "Tonight around the NBA," but I wanted to try this out. Every day we could have a thread for all the different games going on during that specific day. If you think it's a good idea, then I'll keep doing it. If not, ship it to the "Tonight around the NBA" thread and I won't make any more threads like this.

So, games played today/tonight:

Toronto vs. New Jersey: TOR 100 NJN 105 (OT)
Atlanta vs. Miami: ATL 85 MIA 77 (4th)
New York vs. Milwaukee: NYK 62 MIL 48 (Half)
Portland vs. San Antonio: POR 58 SAN 55 (3rd)
Orlando vs. Denver: ORL 39 DEN 47 (2nd)
Detroit vs. Los Angeles: 10:30 on NBATV

This would be better if I had started it during the day, because I wouldn't list the scores or anything. I'd just list the games played and at what times. If you think it's a good idea, I may work on this and make it look better.

Anyway, if you want to talk about a certain game, feel free to do so right here.


----------



## PowerWoofer

*Re: Games tonight on March 4th*

Some surprising games so far are the New York and Miami games. New York is leading Milwaukee by a a dozen so far, and Atlanta and Miami are tied in the final minutes of that game.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

*Re: Games tonight on March 4th*

The Knicks knock off Milwaukee. Obviously, it's a mixed bag, but if the Knicks were going to win one, then I'm glad they beat the current 8th seed in front of us. We're currently 2.5 behind Milwaukee, with Boston 2 behind us.


----------



## spongyfungy

*Re: Games tonight on March 4th*

I think that's a great idea. I spend half the time trying to find the Around the NBA thread... just scrap it and make a new one...

Knicks win which i'm glad about. knocks the Bucks down a peg. Knicks played some decent ball tonight. They shared the ball and did the things they needed to do. 

still they had some brain cramps at the end, fouling when they were up more than 2 posessions...

I didn't want to watch the Heat-Hawks game because D-wade is out with an ankle sprain.


----------



## narek

*Re: Games tonight on March 4th*



spongyfungy said:


> I think that's a great idea. I spend half the time trying to find the Around the NBA thread... just scrap it and make a new one...
> 
> Knicks win which i'm glad about. knocks the Bucks down a peg. Knicks played some decent ball tonight. They shared the ball and did the things they needed to do.
> 
> still they had some brain cramps at the end, fouling when they were up more than 2 posessions...
> 
> I didn't want to watch the Heat-Hawks game because D-wade is out with an ankle sprain.


The Bucks have a bad habit of losing at home, just like the Bulls. I heard the first quarter of the Bucks/knicks on the radio and the Bucks announcers called the Bucks "pathetic" in the first quarter. Also has a familiar ring, doesn't it?

I'm not sure what to think of Stotts as a coach. Terry Porter's hiring was a bit of a PR move since they were dumping well liked players - especially Ray Allen - and his firing was just weird. They wanted Flip Saunders, but he was holding out for Detroit. So they ended up with Stotts whom the Senator got to know and like when he was a George Karl assistant. 

The best part of watching the game, at least on the Bucks network, were the close-ups of Brown and Isiah Thomas who was at this game (and in the tunnel to the locker rooms). Brown looked like he'd rather be in a hospital.


----------



## BG7

*Re: Games tonight on March 4th*

Bucks are dropping off lately, so we should be able to pass them up. Like I've been telling Ben Gordon, if we can put together a 6 or 7 game win streak, we may be in the mix of things for the 5th/4th seeds.


----------



## Cyanobacteria

Game winning bucket by Deron Williams in Jazz over Clips last night. I think he actually wanted to pass, got strung out a little, but made something happen. Go Illinois Former Illini!


----------



## jbulls

Cyanobacteria said:


> Game winning bucket by Deron Williams in Jazz over Clips last night. I think he actually wanted to pass, got strung out a little, but made something happen. Go Illinois Former Illini!


Jerry Sloan isn't the easiest coach to play for as a rookie PG. Once Deron gets a hold of the system I think he'll be a real good NBA point.


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Games tonight on March 4th*

i like this idea for a thread too. 

but i am still going to merge it into the "around the nba" thread now that the discussion has waned.

:smilewink


----------



## mizenkay

*Re: Games tonight on March 4th*

very significant night in New Orleans tonight. the first Hornets game to be played there since Hurricane Katrina. they've cleaned up the arena, had the biohazmat team in (always a good thing), installed new scoreboards and they're ready to go.

Lakers @ Hornets. NBA TV has the call. 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2356808


----------



## ScottMay

It may be time to re-evaluate the notion of Yao Ming's being a franchise player.

I used to think he was, then I didn't, now I might. Since he got his toe infection fixed and back into game shape, he's been an absolute beast. His little baseline face-up J is becoming the sort of unstoppable occurrence that Kareem's sky hook was.

The Rockets are something like 10-3 when Yao and McGrady are in the lineup. If they can keep the both of them on the court together for ~70 games, there's going to be another elite in the west.


----------



## tone wone

ScottMay said:


> It may be time to re-evaluate the notion of Yao Ming's being a franchise player.
> 
> I used to think he was, then I didn't, now I might. Since he got his toe infection fixed and back into game shape, he's been an absolute beast. His little baseline face-up J is becoming the sort of unstoppable occurrence that Kareem's sky hook was.
> 
> The Rockets are something like 10-3 when Yao and McGrady are in the lineup. If they can keep the both of them on the court together for ~70 games, there's going to be another elite in the west.


 actually 20-10 when they both play. 

Sadly, McGrady left the game in the 3rd....but yea, the big fella has been dominant for past 3 weeks


----------



## PowerWoofer

But of course you know that Yao will not leave Houston any time soon and probably never. We are probably bot going to see a dominant center on this Bulls team for a long time to come. If we had, I doubt we'd be so disappointing this season, that's for sure.

I think I've probably said disappointing on this board over 200 times in the past week or so. It just shows you how much this season has gone and how bad things have come along in what was supposed to be a great season for us. But no, I knew Pax wouldn't let it happen. He wouldn't let us become a better team than last year. He did his job and gave us one good season, and now we are doomed to eternal mediocrity for as long as Pax is our GM.

Of course I'm exagerating here, but I'm just so "disappointed" in the way we have become since coming off the best season post-dynasty. Pure crap is what it's been so far.

Count it: 201 times.


----------



## ScottMay

tone wone said:


> actually 20-10 when they both play.


Maybe what I heard is that they're 10-3 when they've both been able to play since Yao came back?


----------



## tone wone

ScottMay said:


> Maybe what I heard is that they're 10-3 when they've both been able to play since Yao came back?


 The rockets went 10-3 last month....which was like the 5th best record for the month. So, thats probably what you heard.

38pts 10rebs tonight. As a rocket I dont even know how to take these numbers


----------



## Frankensteiner

Semi-good news about tonight: Philly, Milwaukee, Washington, and Indiana all lost.


----------



## spongyfungy

Yao was doubleteamed and whacked downlow but he came up with a key block on Foster and was just an intimidating presence in the last minute. Great game by Yao


----------



## step

> 38pts 10rebs tonight.


Impressive.


> Semi-good news about tonight: Philly, Milwaukee, Washington, and Indiana all lost.


----------



## ScottMay

Frankensteiner said:


> Semi-good news about tonight: Philly, Milwaukee, Washington, and Indiana all lost.


The almost inconceivable news about tonight -- somehow, Boston is only a game behind the Bulls.

They have a pretty rough road trip coming up, but after that, their schedule isn't outrageously tough. We have two games left against them head-to-head.

There are so many in-conference games down the stretch that on any given night, we can count on teams in front of us to lose. But until we start stringing wins together, it's almost moot. I can see a sub-.500 team sneaking in, but not a 35-win team.


----------



## JRose5

Wow, Pierce is clutch.
That's two nights in a row he hit big shots and sealed the deal himself.


----------



## PowerWoofer

TNT 's got Denver vs. Philly and San Antonio vs. Phoenix. I think the second game is a preview of what's to come later on in the playoffs, and also Dallas is squaring off against Portland.

I've got 1000 points apiece on vBookie for Dallas, San Antonio and Denver.

Just shows you my luck. Denver's losing to Philly right now, although there's still a full quarter left, and Philly has lost close games in the past week or so. So this could end up being a Denver win. I hope so. Plus I'm banking on Dallas being Dallas and getting it done against the Blazers. San Antonio and Phoenix could be a toss-up, since it's at Phoenix, but I decided to pick the team who has done the best so far.

Anyone else playing with vBookie tonight? (Too late to bet tonight, but there's always tomorrow.)


----------



## PowerWoofer

Denver's got the lead back with about 8:30 left. Looks like I'm getting my points back! :biggrin:


----------



## step

> TNT 's got Denver vs. Philly and San Antonio vs. Phoenix. I think the second game is a preview of what's to come later on in the playoffs,


I highly doubt that, Phoenix is without Nash, Stoudemire, and Thomas.


----------



## Hustle

LAC up by 12 against Milwaukee at half, did we say the playoffs are a bust too soon?

Charlotte up by 15 on NY w/ 5minutes left, thats huge.

Orlando wins their second straight further solidifying NY's low position.

Everything went right for our Bulls tonight.


----------



## rosenthall

Hustle said:


> LAC up by 12 against Milwaukee at half, did we say the playoffs are a bust too soon?
> 
> Charlotte up by 15 on NY w/ 5minutes left, thats huge.
> 
> Orlando wins their second straight further solidifying NY's low position.
> 
> Everything went right for our Bulls tonight.


Except the Wizards just paddywhacked the Pistons something fierce. 

110-92. 

Yikes, they made them eat their shorts.


----------



## GB

Charlotte hangs 116 on the Knick.

116-109 'Cats.


----------



## ScottMay

The Bucks barely escaped with a win vs. the Hawks at the Bradley Center tonight. They blew a pretty big lead and their body language/general demeanor looked awful as it happened. I don't know if they have the leadership to hang on to the 8 spot. 

17 assists from Joe Johnson and a great outside shooting performance by Josh Smith (!) wasn't enough. Al Harrington was playing center a lot of the night and looked wretched doing it.

During Nets-Rockets, a disgusted Jeff Van Gundy called a timeout after a mini-spurt, assembled the team in its huddle, and then sat there glaring at them angrily without saying a word for at least 90 seconds.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Arg, Milwaukee tips Atlanta at home 88-87. Man, we were almost within 2 games of the 8th spot. Now it's 3.


----------



## step

> Arg, Milwaukee tips Atlanta at home 88-87. Man, we were almost within 2 games of the 8th spot. Now it's 3.


That's quite depressing


----------



## rosenthall

Well, to be a little more optimistic, it does look like the bottom 3 teams in the eastern playoff picture are really slumping right now. I mean, even though they won, I don't think this really changes the fact that the Bucks are playing pretty bad basketball right now. And it looks like the Sixers may have lost Allen Iverson, and the Wizards schedule is brutal, so, hope still abounds..............


----------



## Rhyder

ScottMay said:


> The Bucks barely escaped with a win vs. the Hawks at the Bradley Center tonight. They blew a pretty big lead and their body language/general demeanor looked awful as it happened. I don't know if they have the leadership to hang on to the 8 spot.
> 
> 17 assists from Joe Johnson and a great outside shooting performance by Josh Smith (!) wasn't enough. Al Harrington was playing center a lot of the night and looked wretched doing it.
> 
> During Nets-Rockets, a disgusted Jeff Van Gundy called a timeout after a mini-spurt, assembled the team in its huddle, and then sat there glaring at them angrily without saying a word for at least 90 seconds.


This is sort of what I was getting at with my power ratings. I'm not sure if I explained it all that well to you, but the negative rating Mil has even with a winning record is supposed to be a predictor of a slump.

Yet I'm still waiting for a Bulls streak that hasn't happened, so it is by no means perfect obviously.


----------



## ScottMay

I hope we don't have to win our last game of the season to get into the playoffs, because the Raptors just look like they're going to be a giant pain in everyone's *** the rest of the way. They annihilated the Sixers in the 4th last night and they're giving the Pistons a nice little test tonight (although as I've been typing, the Pistons have extended to a 7-point lead).


----------



## ScottMay

Al Harrington had NINE turns tonight as the Hawks fell in a 2OT snoozer to the Knicks. Combined with the Robertcats loss to the Wiz, the Knicks are 1.5 out of the cellar.

And a lot of national writers owe an apology to Joe Johnson. He's a hell of a player and well worth whatever he's being paid and whatever it cost to get him.


----------



## johnston797

ScottMay said:


> And a lot of national writers owe an apology to Joe Johnson. He's a hell of a player and well worth whatever he's being paid and whatever it cost to get him.


I wasn't sure he was worth it for the Hawks but I was on the record as saying Cleveland should have gone as hard as they could after Joe Johnson rather than Larry Hughes. Him and Bron would have been scary as heck. Maybe the RFA status was too scary for them.


----------



## step

> Maybe the RFA status was too scary for them.


Many assumed he wouldn't leave, Atlanta was the only one willing to take the risk.


----------



## TripleDouble

Boston is clubbing Miami.


----------



## PowerWoofer

Not anymore. Miami is winning right now. I knew they would start leading, because Miami is too good of a team and Boston isn't experienced enough to win against a team like Miami.

But Boston exploited the fact that Shaq isn't quick enough to keep up with the younger guys, so they put I think Perkins on him and had Jefferson in there as well, plus LaFrentz too.


----------



## TripleDouble

I think Boston will be good next season. They've got a lot of young talent, a solid veteren offensive player (Wally) and a superstar in Pierce. I'd love to have one of their young bigs.


----------



## PowerWoofer

TripleDouble said:


> I think Boston will be good next season. They've got a lot of young talent, a solid veteren offensive player (Wally) and a superstar in Pierce. I'd love to have one of their young bigs.


I wish we had their squad. They have a ton of potential with guys like Gomes, Jefferson, Green, West and Allen. Plus yeah, having Wally and Pierce doesn't hurt either. I think I'd rather have that team right now compared to ours (although some think our situation -- draft, FA -- is better than theirs). But the thing is they're ready to start playing now that they have pieces. But we're still trying to get some pieces to start playing great basketball. We're a couple years away from contending, and it's tough having to watch this team while we have to go through that phase. But in the meantime, I'll be watching the good teams compete for playoff positioning and to see who's gonna get to the top this season.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Chris Wilcox doing his best Amare immitation and indescriminately dunking on people. 

Seattle takes the lead by one over Philly with three minutes to go. Come on Sonics!


----------



## ScottMay

Robert Vaden . . . sorry, Ray Allen with what ought to be the dagger.

Another blown fourth-quarter lead for the Sixers.

Hopefully we'll make up some ground, but probably not this weekend. Those remaining head-to-head games w/Philly are going to be huge.


----------



## step

> Hopefully we'll make up some ground, but probably not this weekend. Those remaining head-to-head games w/Philly are going to be huge.


Indeed, which is scary, especially after the Milwaukee game.


----------



## spongyfungy

Raptors win! over the Bucks

19-2 run by the Raptors at the end.


----------



## mizenkay

milwaukee just lost to the raptors by one point. boston also loses tonight to the magics. 


knicks and detroit at MSG are all tied up at 73-73 end of three.


----------



## ScottMay

ScottMay said:


> I hope we don't have to win our last game of the season to get into the playoffs, because the Raptors just look like they're going to be a giant pain in everyone's *** the rest of the way. They annihilated the Sixers in the 4th last night and they're giving the Pistons a nice little test tonight (although as I've been typing, the Pistons have extended to a 7-point lead).


The Raptors are at it again, and it's to our benefit tonight. They snatch away a sizable Q4 lead from the Bucks and win it by 1 on two Bosh FTs with 3 seconds left.

Wizards lose as well, Celtics are about to lose.


----------



## ScottMay

Detroit is going to seriously regret trading Darko. I can see how Okur, as talented as he is, didn't really fit their mold. But Darko looks like he could round into a defensive force. 

I think Joe D. panicked a little bit on that one. They could have kept him hidden for another year and they still could have matched any offer for him.


----------



## spongyfungy

Pistons playing without both Rasheed and Rip. (technicals and throwing a ball in the stands) It's interesting to watch Detroit without those guys.

Jamal has been taking some tough and sometime ill-advised shots.


----------



## spongyfungy

Jalen Rose in for Jamal Crawford for defensive purposes. Proceeds to foul Tayshaun.

Jamal back in and nails the jumper. 2.2 seconds left. 105-103


----------



## spongyfungy

oh my goodness. Bennett Salvatore calls the foul on the buzzer shot. Dice to shoot two.

EDIT: well Knicks win. Mcdyess missed the first one.


----------



## remlover

Correct call on the foul. Mcdyess' elbow was clearly hit when he shot it.

Dice misses first...purposely misses second. Knicks win.

grrrrr


----------



## ScottMay

spongyfungy said:


> oh my goodness. Bennett Salvatore calls the foul on the buzzer shot. Dice to shoot two.
> 
> EDIT: well Knicks win. Mcdyess missed the first one.


That last-second call was sketchy, but at least McDyess was actually fouled. That phantom call they made on Jalen Rose guarding Tayshaun Prince was downright inexplicable.


----------



## PowerWoofer

Has hell finally frozen over or what???????????????

How in the hell did the Knicks, of all teams, beat the Pistons?????

I seriously can't believe it!!!

:jawdrop:


----------



## ScottMay

PowerWoofer said:


> Has hell finally frozen over or what???????????????
> 
> How in the hell did the Knicks, of all teams, beat the Pistons?????
> 
> I seriously can't believe it!!!
> 
> :jawdrop:


The Pistons were without Rasheed Wallace and Rip Hamilton for at least half of the game.

Detroit's pretty vulnerable if they lose one starter, let alone two. McDyess stepped up with a huge game in Rasheed's absence, but he missed two free throws to tie with 0.7 left.

Crawford hit the game-winning jumpshot and Curry had an excellent game as well.


----------



## mizenkay

i just looked outside my window and this is what i saw.

seriously. 








:smilewink


----------



## PC Load Letter

Jesus, can't those Pistons do _anything_ to endear themselves to me??? The prospects of the Knicks ending up with the worst or even second worst record aren't looking too good at this point(and Portland looks just about ready to not win another game this season; how in the world did Phoenix lose to them?). Bleh.


----------



## The ROY

man..if morrison or bargnani are gone with our ny pick..what the HELL are we gonna do!? LOL


----------



## ScottMay

The Sixers are in a world of trouble in LA tonight. Bad energy and down by 13 to the pleasingly attired (Braves throwbacks) Clippers.


----------



## step

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to mizenkay again.


----------



## truebluefan

Pigs starting to fly eh?


----------



## ScottMay

Bucks win the first of their three-game west coast trip vs. a hapless, really-not-at-all-fun-to-watch Blazers team 100-93.

We are five games back of the Bucks with 16 games to play (they have 15). We're nearing the point where this officially becomes a two-team race for the 8 spot (Boston seems dead in the water, and the Wizards seem to have their **** together).


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Amare is back in action for the first time this year against Portland. I just turned on the game and saw him get a rebound and then dunk it. He's got no lift in his legs. The announcers seem to feel it will come back, but I have to wonder if he will ever be the same. I hope he will. He was so fun to watch.


----------



## spongyfungy

game of the night IMO was the Dallas-GSW. J-Rich spinning running three at the buzzer to win the game.


----------



## MikeDC

Darius Miles Davis said:


> Amare is back in action for the first time this year against Portland. I just turned on the game and saw him get a rebound and then dunk it. He's got no lift in his legs. The announcers seem to feel it will come back, but I have to wonder if he will ever be the same. I hope he will. He was so fun to watch.


Well, he did have 20 points and 9 boards in 19 minutes, thus making me wait around all year with him on my fantasy team worth it.


----------



## dogra

> Well, he did have 20 points and 9 boards in 19 minutes, thus making me wait around all year with him on my fantasy team worth it.


Smells like 1st place, MikeDC. :cheers: 

Anyone have an idea whose minutes are going to go down in Phoenix? I have no idea what their rotations are these days. Is Diaw still playing a lot in the front court?

I'm guessing maybe Tim Thomas will lose some floor time. 

Okay, I'm hoping maybe Tim Thomas will lose some floor time.


----------



## Chris Bosh #4

Well you guys might wanna know Charlie "Bad Pick" Villanueva poured down 48 points against the Milwaukee Bucks today.


----------



## mizenkay

just tuned into the net game.

suns are getting SHELACKED by the nets!

three minutes left in the third *39-79* nets.

that's right *39!!*

not even timmy thomas can help them tonight.


----------



## PowerWoofer

mizenkay said:


> just tuned into the net game.
> 
> suns are getting SHELACKED by the nets!
> 
> three minutes left in the third *39-79* nets.
> 
> that's right *39!!*
> 
> not even timmy thomas can help them tonight.


I tuned in to that game as well, and this is what I did:

:jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop: 

I seriously laughed for like the entire 4th quarter. I couldn't help it, because I never would have thought I'd be seeing the Phoenix Suns get whipped like that.


----------



## TripleDouble

Looks like Kidd did a number on Nash. I've always thought that a strong and aggressive defender could cause Nash problems and effectively cut the head off Phoenix. For example, I think Sacramento would cause Pheonix a lot of problems in round one if they stick Artest on Nash.


----------



## narek

mizenkay said:


> just tuned into the net game.
> 
> suns are getting SHELACKED by the nets!
> 
> three minutes left in the third *39-79* nets.
> 
> that's right *39!!*
> 
> not even timmy thomas can help them tonight.


I checked the box score at nba.com - 26.8% as a field goal percentage? Wow. Good Dor total collapse by the Suns?


----------



## mizenkay

TripleDouble said:


> Looks like Kidd did a number on Nash. I've always thought that a strong and aggressive defender could cause Nash problems and effectively cut the head off Phoenix. For example, I think Sacramento would cause Pheonix a lot of problems in round one if they stick Artest on Nash.



this is exactly what happened.


----------



## narek

And tonight, the Bucks were just hot - beat the Suns at their own game. The Bucks shot just over 60 Percent, plus hit 18 of 32 three point attempt. 11 of those came in the third quarter.
Nash looked tired.


----------



## spongyfungy

Bucks win tonight. I think they solidified a playoff spot. Indiana is now 1.5 games behind them.

Bulls 2.5 behind Pacers (one head to head left) and 1 behind Philly and we play them both this week!


----------



## unBULLievable

spongyfungy said:


> Bucks win tonight. I think they solidified a playoff spot. Indiana is now 1.5 games behind them.
> 
> Bulls 2.5 behind Pacers (one head to head left) and 1 behind Philly and we play them both this week!


If the Bulls manage to somehow get both of these games ,they will be i nthe drivers seat


----------



## spongyfungy

Knicks are actually playing defense and they get back into the game. 49-48 Philly.

And Jamal is stepping up his D who is btw starting this game due to Stephon and Jalen being injured.


----------



## remlover

spongyfungy said:


> Knicks are actually playing defense and they get back into the game. 49-48 Philly.
> 
> And Jamal is stepping up his D who is btw starting this game due to Stephon and Jalen being injured.


Knicks defense gives up 89 points in 3 quarters. 

If we are going to make the playoffs we HAVE to beat the Sixers in those back-to-back games.


----------



## spongyfungy

well the 76ers came alive in the second half


----------



## JRose5

Cavs beating the Sixers 30-26 after one Q tonight.
That'd be nice if they dropped this one..


----------



## LegoHat

Chris Wilcox just put up 26 and 24 for Seattle against Houston, and I have to say that he would look great in a Bulls uniform next season. Get on it Pax!


----------



## step

> Chris Wilcox just put up 26 and 24 for Seattle against Houston, and I have to say that he would look great in a Bulls uniform next season. Get on it Pax!


It's been good to see him with PT, now you can sort of get the indication of what he might be like, but I don't think he'll be worth what it would take to outbid Seattle.


----------



## The ROY

He can't be THAT good, especially if Rashard & Ray are publically telling their GM they still need an inside presence.

He's just playing for a contract.


----------



## spongyfungy

Bucks lose tonight to the hot Magic. Interesting late game stuff.


----------



## spongyfungy

Also Jamal Crawford is on fire.


----------



## step

Atlanta: 101
Minnesota: 99

Woo!
Now if the Cavs can finally step up and not lose the Knicks, will be a good day!


----------



## mizenkay

jamal is the hero as the knicks hold off lebron for their 20th win.


----------



## TripleDouble

Does Jamal hate the Cavs? Didn't he play a great game against them a few years back?


----------



## spongyfungy

TripleDouble said:


> Does Jamal hate the Cavs? Didn't he play a great game against them a few years back?


 I think this year as well. 26 points. yeah a few years back he went off on them

Lots of good games tonight.


----------



## Electric Slim

step said:


> Atlanta: 101
> Minnesota: 99
> 
> Woo!
> Now if the Cavs can finally step up and not lose the Knicks, will be a good day!



Will someone post the #'s for Josh Smith's last 6 games? :jawdrop: 

Looks like that kid's getting quite good. Makes up for the sting of watching Diaw explode.


----------



## narek

mizenkay said:


> jamal is the hero as the knicks hold off lebron for their 20th win.


And now I have to hope he's going to be a hero again as the Knicks play the Pacers Friday night. Can they be motivated by not giving the Bulls the best shot at a number 1 pick?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

narek said:


> And now I have to hope he's going to be a hero again as the Knicks play the Pacers Friday night. Can they be motivated by not giving the Bulls the best shot at a number 1 pick?


Hmm, would I prefer the Knicks to win over the Pacers tomorrow? Jeez, I'm not sure. I might rather have the 8th seed (which I understand we have not yet secured) and have the most ping pong balls.


----------



## Rhyder

Darius Miles Davis said:


> Hmm, would I prefer the Knicks to win over the Pacers tomorrow? Jeez, I'm not sure. I might rather have the 8th seed (which I understand we have not yet secured) and have the most ping pong balls.


#1. More losses for teams battling for the final few spots is worth more than a few extra ping pong balls.

#2. The contrarian opinion would be that we hope that we hope NY loses because we are confident that we will make the playoffs no matter what.

I'm tending to lean more towards #1.


----------



## ATLien

Electric Slim said:


> Will someone post the #'s for Josh Smith's last 6 games? :jawdrop:
> 
> Looks like that kid's getting quite good. Makes up for the sting of watching Diaw explode.


Last 5 Games: 14.4 PPG, 9.4 RPG, 4.6 APG, 3.40 BPG

Kind of pedestrian stats, but he is off to a tear for month of April.

Last 3 Games: 17.0 PPG, 11.3 RPG, 6.7 APG, 3.67 BPG

Would have been a nasty trio with Chris Paul and Joe Johnson,    ..


----------



## ndistops

Philly, Milwaukee and Indiana ALL lost tonight. :biggrin:

1 1/2 out of the 6th seed now! And the Pacers play Detroit and the Bucks play NJ on Sunday. By Monday morning, the Bulls could well be 1/2 game out of the 6th spot.


----------



## jbulls

Some young guys had great games tonight:

Josh Smith: 25 points, 8 boards, 4 blocks and 2 steals in 29 minutes for Atlanta.

Gerald Green: 17 points in 25 minutes for the Celtics.

Tony Allen: 16 points in 21 for the Celts.

Deron Williams: 13 points, 6 assists for the Jazz.

Rashad McCants: 17/4/2 for the T-Wolves.

It hasn't been the best year for rookies and soph's. This is nice to see...


----------



## TripleDouble

Josh Smith has been hot of late.


----------



## mizenkay

ok, this could be strange but in a compelling kind of way.

tonight on nbatv sonics at spurs will be televised using PRIMARILY only dual "skycams". so not the traditional fixed camera at center court. could be kinda cool. could induce vertigo.

no play by play announcers either.


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

Thank you Charlotte. The Bobcats took out the Knicks today, pretty much insuring the Knicks will end with the 2nd worst or worst record. 

Do any of you remember that I was talking up Alan Anderson, realizing that he might be undrafted? He's been producing a lot more than Basden, that's for sure.


----------



## The ROY

Darius Miles Davis said:


> Thank you Charlotte. The Bobcats took out the Knicks today, pretty much insuring the Knicks will end with the 2nd worst or worst record.


NY will end the season with the 2nd worst. They play NJ next though.

Portland plays Golden State WITHOUT Randolph next game & the Suns to finish the season. They'll finish the season a 1/2 game worst than NY.


----------



## superdave

Darius Miles Davis said:


> Thank you Charlotte. The Bobcats took out the Knicks today, pretty much insuring the Knicks will end with the 2nd worst or worst record.
> 
> Do any of you remember that I was talking up Alan Anderson, realizing that he might be undrafted? He's been producing a lot more than Basden, that's for sure.


2nd worst assures the Bulls of a top five pick, correct? Worst case scenario, three teams jump the Knicks/Portland picks, Portland #4, Knicks pick #5... does that sound right?


----------



## PC Load Letter

The ROY said:


> NY will end the season with the 2nd worst. They play NJ next though.
> 
> Portland plays Golden State WITHOUT Randolph next game & the Suns to finish the season. They'll finish the season a 1/2 game worst than NY.


It's impossible for any team to finish 1/2 game worse than anybody because every team plays the same number of games.

I agree it certainly looks like they'll finish worse than the Knicks, though. Of course, Phoenix has nothing left to play for, so I can't imagine Nash or Marion playing much in the final game, leaving the door open for Portland to sneak out of there with a win. Crazier things have happened. 

Speaking of that, who would win the tiebreaker between Portland and the Knicks?


----------



## Darius Miles Davis

superdave said:


> 2nd worst assures the Bulls of a top five pick, correct? Worst case scenario, three teams jump the Knicks/Portland picks, Portland #4, Knicks pick #5... does that sound right?


You are correct. We will be picking in the 1-5 range, and our other pick will be in the 15-18 range.


----------



## The ROY

PC Load Letter said:


> It's impossible for any team to finish 1/2 game worse than anybody because every team plays the same number of games.


oh 

*slaps self*


----------

