# Game #20: Hawks @ Cavs (12/13/2005)



## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

*VS* 

*Atlanta Hawks* *(3-16) @* *Cleveland Cavaliers* *(11-8)*

_*STARTERS*_


*BENCH*


*TIME:* 4:00 pm PT, 7:00 pm ET
*TV:* *NBALP*, FSOhio
*Radio:* *WTAM 1100*
*Location:* *Quicken Loans Arena*, Cleveland, Ohio

Cleveland lost an emotional and painful game in Milwaukee and return home to face the Hawks. Despite Atlanta’s struggles, after coming off a win against the Spurs, Cleveland needs to take them very serious. Larry Hughes struggled again and appears in pain. He needs to recover to be the Robin we need him to be. Cleveland has been content to trade baskets of late and while they’ve had a chance to win each of those games, they may want to slow down a little for defense’s sake. If Atlanta hangs around, the Cavs will be in a tough spot if their shooting goes cold. Zydrunas Ilgauskas needs to be big; making his presence felt.


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

Larry Hughes needs to start playing some basketball. We keep making excuses for him but he is simply not getting the job done. We will continue to struggle if our supposed #2 guy continues to go 4-13 while letting his 2 guard opponent go off for 25-35 points.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Truth. We've given Hughes a free pass here because he does a lot on the floor. But offensively he definitely needs to start getting things done. It puts too much pressure on Lebron when he sucks.

Ira Newble could do his job right now.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Hughes honeymoon period is over. It's put up or shutup time, dude is getting paid like a star, prove it on the court. I'm one of his biggest fans but his play the last couple games is just plain not getting it done.

This team should NOT be losing games when Lebron scores 50+ pts, that is absurd. This is not last year's roster with Ira Newble starting and no bench. Other people need to step up.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

I hope Cleveland wins this game to end the skid. I also hope the Cavs win by a margin comfortable enough to allow Martynas to get some burn.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

*Beacon Journal | 12/13/2005 | Cavaliers upbeat despite losses*












> *Cavaliers upbeat despite losses*
> 
> *Coach says players are adjusting to his system*
> 
> ...


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

*Tough Central presents challenges for Cavs*











> *Tough Central presents challenge for Cavs*
> 
> Monday, December 12, 2005
> 
> ...


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

*Yahoo! | NBA | Atlanta Hawks/Cleveland Cavaliers Preview*











> *Atlanta Hawks/Cleveland Cavaliers Preview*
> 
> The Cleveland Cavaliers are making a habit lately of wasting most of the points LeBron James has scored.
> 
> ...


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

With Zydrunas sitting tonight out, Henderson will get the start. If Cleveland can win this game handily, with everybody moving up a spot in Ilgauskas' absence, Martynas would be guaranteed burn tonight.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

This is where you really miss Varejao. Hopefully he can make an early recovery, our team needs him big time.


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

I have to think the Cavaliers know that they need to win this game and should win this game. If we get Lebron and Larry going this could be an easy 20 point for the boys. Z and DRU need to do their usual dirty work and maybe this is the game we can get some confidence back into the shot of D Marsh. If I'm Coach Brown and I got a big lead going into the 2nd half I want to see a lot of Marsh on the floor, he can only improve that shot and get out of a slump by being on the court. 

I'm hoping for a big win.

100-75 Cavs


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

Henderson wasn't looking for the pass and didn't turn around. In the past, when James and Z ran that pick-and-roll, Zydrunas was always looking for the ball while sliding middle.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

Gooden is off to a nice start and Hughes looks better early on here than he has the last few games.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Sharapova in the house? Weird. Didn't know she was a Cavs fan.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

^ I doubt she's a Cleveland fan but she has met LeBron James before. It's funny because when she met him, she didn't even know who he was (which sport he played). LOL


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

The Hawks are up 25-19 at the end of the first quarter. Cleveland had a nice run in the early portion of the quarter but after that, the defense broke down (which wasn't great to begin with) and the shooting went ice cold. Despite being a good offensive team, we've had some of the most icy, chilly shooting touches for large stretches of games. Part of it is shot selection but it also comes down to just missing shots.


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

Down 6 at the at the end of 1st? Thankfully for Lebrons 3 or we coulda been down 9. Please beat the Hawks they won 3 times all year.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Hawks are shooting 52 percent tonight. How can a team be this bad defensively? I mean, all Brown talks about is defense. But the team hasn't played any the entire year.

I think Ferry has to do whatever it takes to get Ron Artest. This team needs a shift in attitude, and the current usual suspects aren't going to do it. I mean, Damon is making Tyron Lue look like an all-star now. And Royal Ivey was getting off on Snow. Our point guards just can't guard their own shadow. I say get Artest. Play Hughes at point. Lebron at the 2, Artest at the 3.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Maybe get Anthony Johnson as a throw-in in the Artest deal.


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## ATLien (Jun 18, 2002)

Just tuned in but damn. Cleveland is turning the ball over left and right.

LOL @ the Hawks own announcer calling Salim Damon Stoudamire.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

So we do have our lottery pick this year, right?


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

Cleveland has their 1st round pick this year. Check Pioneer's thread below.


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

If we lose to the Hawks does our chance of Ferry going after Ron increase?


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

Oh and by the way Larry is off to his usual 3-8 from the field.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

AndriuskeviciusFuture said:


> If we lose to the Hawks does our chance of Ferry going after Ron increase?


You would think it would.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I don't think Lebron trusts his teammates anymore this year. This is not good.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Also. Wilks is the best point guard on our roster.

If you don't count Lebron and Hughes.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

The Hawks lead 48-41 at the half. The lead has been reduced (12 points at one point) but the squad can't be happy. They're playing like they're sleepwalking. Not good.


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

Down 7 at the half. Lebron has 20 and most likely get his 6th 30+ point game in a row. The hustle stats match up preety equally, we have 10 turnovers they have 9, we have the same number of blocks and steals. We have been doing a good job of converting on their mistakes. Larry sitting at 3-9. DRU has 8 and 5. Lebron is not getting any offensive help, it's not that he dosen't trust them it's because they can't finish. If we had Z we probably would be winning this game. Hopefully we can't get stuff together in the 2nd half and dominate the 3rd...Damn is this a tough one...


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## Larry Hughes for Retirement (Jul 5, 2004)

You think marty could see some time tonight, If i was 6'10 id be better than Hamilton!


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

Interesting Stat at Halftime: The Hawks have 8 guys with over 2 baskets, we have 3 Lebron DRU and Larry.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

LBJ to LJ for 3 said:


> You think marty could see some time tonight, If i was 6'10 id be better than Hamilton!


This game has all the makings of a dogfight. I guess Martynas won't see time tonight. It's a shame because I want to see him against NBA folks (caught him in the Summer League but that's not the same thing).


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

You could see Martynas tonight, I think. But not because the Cavs are playing well, if you get my drift.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Drew Gooden should be traded. He started out well. But it's just more of the same inconsistent play. Verejao is just flat out better in terms of what this team needs and what he gives.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

Come on Cleveland, let the crowd come alive and give you energy.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Pick and roll with Damon.


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

There we go Damon, nice 3. Down 7, can we please play some D these last 3 minutes of the 3rd.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Sit your *** down Damon Jones.


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

> Sit your *** down Damon Jones.


What's this about?


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

AndriuskeviciusFuture said:


> What's this about?


He and Coach Brown got into it, and Brown sat him on the bench. He put him back in for a second. But Lue has been smoking Jones. Making it impossible to get back.


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## ATLien (Jun 18, 2002)

This is like a Hawks reunion.

Wilks, Henderson, Newble.. Damn. We're one Hanno Mottola and Jacque Vaugh away from a team.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

Cleveland is down by 10 at the end of 3. Lue is doing his TJ Ford impression out there. Like last year, opposing PG's go wild against us. That's why I want Cleveland to trade in a way that can get them a first-rounder, so that 2 guards can be taken in the draft to remedy this reoccurring problem.


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

Damn just watching the Gamecast on Yahoo so not watching it on TV. How noticable was the argument between the two and did Brown get really upset...

Down 10 after 3, Sorry to say it but Lebron needs a look everytime down the floor if we have a chance...

God the Hawks....at home


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I don't really understand drafting two guards. I would rather draft one point guard and a big man. Snow is a good backup. And Hughes and Bron can both play the 1.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

AndriuskeviciusFuture said:


> How noticable was the argument between the two and did Brown get really upset...:


They were yelling at each other as Damon went down the floor. Which if you've seen Coach Brown is really something. The announcing crew made note of it. Damon Jones has been the best player on the Hawks team with his defense in the third.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> I don't really understand drafting two guards. I would rather draft one point guard and a big man. Snow is a good backup. And Hughes and Bron can both play the 1.


To me Snow needs to be slowly phased out. The second guard would have somebody challenge him throughout the year for minutes and on nights where the team struggles, you have an answer. If Jones and Snow both struggle (which has happened several games already), having one guard means you're stuck with one of those guys on the floor. Or you could sub the remaining struggling guard out and go bigger, but with the second guard, you can sub out and remain small if need be.


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

LARRY MISSES BOTH FREE THROWS :curse: :curse: :curse:


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

remy23 said:


> To me Snow needs to be slowly phased out. The second guard would have somebody challenge him throughout the year for minutes and on nights where the team struggles, you have an answer. If Jones and Snow both struggle (which has happened several games already), having one guard means you're stuck with one of those guys on the floor. Or you could sub the remaining struggling guard out and go bigger, but with the second guard, you can sub out and remain small if need be.


Yeah but if you draft two point guards, you have four point guards on your roster, which is a waste of one roster spot. The best would be to shed Damon Jones and replace him with two point guards, but I don't think Damon Jones is going anywhere for a long time with his contract, unless you package him in a deal with Drew Gooden, but who is dumb enough to take that deal? Isiah Thomas already has a ton of power forwards.

Maybe if one of the point guards was a second round pick?


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> Yeah but if you draft two point guards, you have four point guards on your roster, which is a waste of one roster spot. The best would be to shed Damon Jones and replace him with two point guards, but I don't think Damon Jones is going anywhere for a long time with his contract, unless you package him in a deal with Drew Gooden, but who is dumb enough to take that deal? Isiah Thomas already has a ton of power forwards.


Jones probably isn't going anywhere for a while. I think he was signed to a 4 year deal. When I said 2 guards, I meant one who was a pure PG who can play defense (to phase out Snow). And the second guard being a combo guard (with a great outside shot) to slowly phase out Jones. Drew Gooden is a good player who shouldn't be too hard to trade (cheap, young, can grab the boards). As far as who to trade with, I think we'll have to let more of the season pan out to call it.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

This **** is embarassing....


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

What is this, like 10 of the last 11?


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## AndriuskeviciusFuture (Nov 18, 2005)

Down 11 with 4:30 I'm getting hungry and watching this stupid Yahoo Gamecast is making me miserable. The friggin Hawks...

Chris

P.S. Before everyone goes to bed tonight, please say a prayer for Ron ending up in Cleveland, we need defense and I'm willing to give up Larry to get it.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Why is our team so mentally fragile? It's insane, we don't just lose a game here or there, it's either we're on a roll or we are just in these horrific losing streaks. 

The only guy even showing up is Lebron?? It's the same **** as last year.

And our offense is horrid, every play is Lebron and Larry. No movement, it's just "here's the ball Lebron do something".


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

This is gonna be one of those games that comes back to haunt us. Dropping games like this is why we've finished on the bubble the last couple years.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I will give up anybody on the roster except for Lebron and Verejao for Artest. Artest is exactly what this team needs. The mental toughness, the desire. He's what Lebron is on offense, but on defense. It's absurd to ask Lebron to carry this team to the playoffs on both ends of the floor in today's NBA. The amount of energy he is expending right now, he's very close to an injury.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Why the foul? I don't get it, 1:15 you can get a stop and easily play D.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

Benedict_Boozer said:


> This is gonna be one of those games that comes back to haunt us. Dropping games like this is why we've finished on the bubble the last couple years.


It reminds me of the game when New York came into the Gund and they beat us. That was down the stretch and a game that if we won, the magic number to get into the playoffs would have shrunk. Ack. Bad memories.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Nice Hughes, I swear he misses more layups than anybody ive ever seen.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

It will be fun being embarassed on TNT this Thursday by Denver. If Tyrone Lue lights us up this bad, imagine what Early Boykins will do. 

I'm sure Barkley will get a good laugh at our expense.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Fouling everytime down is the best defensive strategy the Cavs have had all night.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

^ Losing another game would be terrible. This skid needs to end. But Barkley will talk a ton of trash if we come out flat again. It would be nice to have a strong showing on national television to momentarily hault the Barkley trash-talking train but I doubt it.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Benedict_Boozer said:


> It will be fun being embarassed on TNT this Thursday by Denver. If Tyrone Lue lights us up this bad, imagine what Early Boykins will do.
> 
> I'm sure Barkley will get a good laugh at our expense.



...hmm wonder what play they're going to run?


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

*Box Score: Atlanta 100, Cleveland 94*


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

These last few box scores are eeerily remeniscient of late last season.

Lebron with 39 10 6 on 57% shooting and we still lose. Lebron with 52 7 7 on 60%+ shooting and we still lose. 

This has to turn around fast or we could be in trouble....just like last year we're getting nothing from our bench, nothing from our secondary players, nothing from our backcourt. :nonono:


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

And what are you supposed to tell Lebron? Do more? He's the only offense we have. And at times he's the only one showing any effort on defense, which is terrible because he's not that good at defense. But hey, at least I've seen Lebron make a defensive rotation to give help.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

^I don't think there is anything you can tell him to change. He tries setting people up and they bobble passes or brick wide open shots - next thing you know we're down 14 to the Hawks. He tries the opposite and comes storming out of the game offensively, we get a 16 pt lead. Great, he goes to the bench for like 3 mins, bam we're only up 3. It's like our team is helpless without him :no: 

I think like last year, it boils down to an inability to overcome our glaring weaknesses at PG. It's killing us on both sides of the ball, and teams are gunning for it. Pick and roll, pick and roll, people are running that the ENTIRE GAME :nonono: 

I mean let's be honest here. When *Tyron Lue* looks like Steve Nash against your PG's, you have serious problems at that position.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Who knew the point guard position was so important?


You know who'd be a good pickup--Delonte West or Marcus Banks. Both of those guys work their *** off, especially on defense.


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

Larry Hughes doesnt belong here. I know people have been shy to say much about him. He has had one good game this year. He is too similar to bron as far as playing style but not even half as effective. He cant shoot after he puts the ball on the floor and he cant convert around the hoop unless he gets a wide open look. If tehre is any resistance u have to prey he gets bailed out and sent to the line where he seems to be missing al ot of freethrows. he is a turn over machine and he is playing 0 defense.


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## undefined_playa (Oct 23, 2005)

Man...Damon Jones is such a bad defeneder. And don't you HATE how he always retardedly kicks up his leg like that when he's dribbling the ball? I think that pisses the other team off so much, they just go off on him every time lol.


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

> *Lowly Hawks prove too tough for Cavs*
> 
> *Brown questions team's effort as losing streak reaches three*
> 
> ...


http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/sports/basketball/nba/cleveland_cavaliers/13403737.htm


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

> <center>
> 
> 
> 
> ...




http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/plain...sports/1134552996299310.xml&coll=2&thispage=2​


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