# OT: Draftexpress measurements history



## Sonny-Canzano (Oct 20, 2007)

Some interesting numbers. Shaq is actually a tad over 7'2" in shoes!

*Shaquille O'Neal*
_7'1" w/o shoes
9'5" standing reach
303 lbs
12.2% body fat_

*Rasheed Wallace*
_6'9.75" w/o shoes
230 lbs_

*Theo Ratliff*
_6'8.75 w/o shoes
214 lbs_

*Kevin Garnett*
_6'11" w/o shoes
217 lbs_

*Raef LaFrentz*
_6'11.5" w/o shoes
235 lbs_

*Bonzi Wells*
_6'5" w/o shoes
213 lbs_


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## Hector (Nov 15, 2004)

I certainly don't believe those heights for Sheed and Theo, and I probably don't believe it for Bonzi. They just didn't stand up straight.


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## BenDavis503 (Apr 11, 2007)

Why would you not believe them? Is Sheed really 7'3'' w\o shoes?


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

link

I always look for these lists to incorporate Outlaw and a few others. I have a printout with Travis's measurements along with others from his pre-draft, but the link I got it off is long since lost.

STOMP


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## Sonny-Canzano (Oct 20, 2007)

I think it's a good measuring stick for players going into the draft. 

We can all agree Theo Ratliff was a very effective Center at only 6'8.75". 

During the Olympics Ray Allen came in at only 6'3.5" and we can all agree he did just fine as a SG.

Dwight is only 6'9" and he's a beast of a Center.


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## Boob-No-More (Apr 24, 2006)

Sonny-Canzano said:


> Some interesting numbers. Shaq is actually a tad over 7'2" in shoes!
> 
> *Shaquille O'Neal*
> _7'1" w/o shoes
> ...


And, since nobody in the NBA plays barefoot, add about 1.5" to get their actual playing height. So, Theo's official NBA listed height of 6'10" and Sheed's of 6'11" are both perfectly accurate and consistent with their pre-draft measurements.

BNM


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## blazerboy30 (Apr 30, 2003)

Sonny-Canzano said:


> Some interesting numbers. Shaq is actually a tad over 7'2" in shoes!
> 
> *Shaquille O'Neal*
> _7'1" w/o shoes
> ...



It is amazing to see numbers like these, and realize just how big and beastly Shaq is. He makes Oden not seem all that huge.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

Boob-No-More said:


> And, since nobody in the NBA plays barefoot, add about 1.5" to get their actual playing height. So, Theo's official NBA listed height of 6'10" and Sheed's of 6'11" are both perfectly accurate and consistent with their pre-draft measurements.


how come hockey players heights aren't listed with their skates on?

I wish they'd just list the guys with their actual (barefoot) heights like the rest of the world. Shoe widths vary and listing with them on just muddies the picture. Some guys are listed 2"+ over their barefoot height, some are listed their barefoot height.

Just my personal wah! thats bugged me for a while.

STOMP


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## Darkwebs (May 23, 2006)

Sonny-Canzano said:


> During the Olympics *Ray Allen came in at only 6'3.5"* and we can all agree he did just fine as a SG.


Wow, that is the most surprising height so far in this thread. He seems like he's at least 6'6".


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

Sonny-Canzano said:


> During the Olympics Ray Allen came in at only 6'3.5" and we can all agree he did just fine as a SG.


do you have a link for those Olympic measurements?

STOMP


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

Sonny-Canzano said:


> *I think it's a good measuring stick for players going into the draft*.
> 
> We can all agree Theo Ratliff was a very effective Center at only 6'8.75".
> 
> ...


I don't think it's that simple. Yes these three played their respective positions well, but some context on how/why they succeeded is needed. Theo may be only 6'8.75, but you don't play hoops with the top of your head/dude has a ridiculous wingspan. Same is true for Howard and dude is also the premiere leaper among today's Bigs. Ray Allen is able to succeed as a smallish SG because his super quick release allows him to get his deadly jumper off on anyone.

A few years back I started a thread with a compiled pre-draft measurements data base for "measuring stick" of size averages per positions. Here were the results... 

*PG* av (barefoot) height 6'1.5 - lbs 186.9 - wingspan 6'5.4
*SG* 6'4.9 - 210 - 6'10.2
*SF* 6'6.9 - 221 - 7'0.0
*PF* 6'8.6 - 242 - 7'2.3
*C* 7'0.3 - 257 - 7'2.7 

maybe I'll update it after this year's combine

STOMP


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

always seemed to me that if you wanted to boil down a player to one height statistic, it would be barefoot standing reach. that takes into account wingspan and height, and is probably the most accurate predictor of a player's ability to rebound, block/alter a shot, and get a shot up in the face of a defender. it's not how tall your head is, it's how tall your fingertips are that really matter. 

if you want to get an even clearer picture, track barefoot standing reach and vertical.


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## STOMP (Jan 1, 2003)

mook said:


> if you want to get an even clearer picture, track barefoot standing reach and vertical.


I'm not sure if the standing reach measurement is done with shoes on or not, but I do agree with your point. 

I think the reason I didn't list standing reach initially was the many holes in data back when I created the list. Since then, draftexpress and others have improved on this and provided much simpler formats to access/compile the data. 

STOMP


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

yeah, I wasn't saying that as a criticism of you. just a statement of the obvious, I guess. 

I just wish the NBA would organize this better. there's what--350 NBA players? and only about 150 of them really matter. would it be so hard and expensive to send a guy around on a plane with a tape measure for a couple of weeks to objectively collect this data and post it on their site? 

for around $10,000 the NBA could do a lot to make a ton of its most hard core fans incredibly happy. they probably spend that much on promoting a crappy Clippers vs Hawks TNT game in December.


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## B_&_B (Feb 19, 2004)

I think its funny that someone with "Canzano" in their name would start a thread scrutinizing minor measurement mistakes. :biggrin:


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## Boob-No-More (Apr 24, 2006)

mook said:


> if you want to get an even clearer picture, track barefoot standing reach and vertical.


It was Oden's standing reach plus no step vertical that most impressed me at the pre-draft camp last summer. His standing reach of 9'4" combined with his no-step vertical of 32" means Oden can hit 12 feet going straight without even taking a single step. The top of the square above the basket is at 11.5 feet. So, without a running start, he can touch 6" above the top of that square. No wonder he blocks so many shots. It's just insane for a guy with that kind of standing reach (highest in last year's draft class) to also have such a good no-step vertical (highest no-step vertical of any player with a standing reach > 8'10.5").

BNM


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## mook (Dec 31, 2002)

Boob-No-More said:


> His standing reach of 9'4" combined with his no-step vertical of 32" means Oden can hit 12 feet going straight without even taking a single step. The top of the square above the basket is at 11.5 feet. So, without a running start, he can touch 6" above the top of that square.


damn. that's just crazy.


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## Hector (Nov 15, 2004)

BenDavis503 said:


> Why would you not believe them? Is Sheed really 7'3'' w\o shoes?


I've seen Sheed stand next to Shaq many times and I don't see a difference of 3 1/4 inches. May we have a link, please? I just looked in DraftExpress and can't find these numbers.


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