# Game Thread: Pacers @ Pistons



## DetBNyce

*<center>Time: 1:00 PM ET
Venue: The Palace of Auburn Hills
Pacers @ Pistons
April 4, 2004</center>*

<center>*







vs.







</center>*


<center>*Indiana Pacers (56-20) vs. Detroit Pistons (49-27)</center>*



<center>



































</center>
<center>*vs.</center>*
<center>



































</center>

<center>*Key Matchup:</center>*

*<center>







vs.







</center>*

Sheed and JO face off for the first time in their respective uni's...


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## Brian.

This should be an interesting game and most likely an ECF preview. Of course I have to work but I will be refershing the score of the game on my cell phone ever five minutes or so. The big matchup will be Sheed vs O'neal everything we have heard from the blazers fans has been Sheed plays great D against O'neal. If Sheed is able to contain him then this should be a W for the pistons. I can see this game getting very intense. Corliss and Artest are just dying to fight each other. It seems like everytime they play there is at least one altercation between them.


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## PistonFAN81

I am so pumped about this game I have been hyping this game for a long time, I went to the first match-up at the palace, when we lost that close one, I hope to see a different outcome but it will be a great one indeed.(as long as b.wallton is comentating on abc)


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## DetBNyce

*Matchups:*

Jeff Foster vs. Ben Wallace: *Pistons*

Jermaine O'neal vs. Sheed Wallace: *Pacers* 

Ron Artest vs. Tayshaun Prince: *Pacers* 

Reggie Miller vs. Rip Hamilton: *Pistons* 

Jamal Tinsley vs. Chauncey Billups: *Pistons* 

---------------------

Bench: *Pistons* 

Coaching: *Pistons*


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>PacerMan</b>!
> 
> 
> And that's why games aren't played on paper.


Who said they were? I'm a very big believer in having to show yourself on the court.


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## DetBNyce

A big key to the game will be our guard play, as well as Tayshaun Prince's play. I down feel like looking the exact numbers up, but it's been known for a long time that Rip and Chauncey have played horriblyy against the Pacers this season and what better way to come out of that slump than in front of a national audience.

I don't know what Prince's problem is... In the first game he scored 16 points and in the next to he only scored 8 points, but he only took 8 shots. He needs to be more aggressive on the offensive end and hopefully it'll make Ron Artest work that much more on the defensive end. If Prince isn't aggressive early on, we could see Corliss very early in the game.


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## jvanbusk

Should be a great game. I don't see any let up between these two teams. I fully expect a hard fought game with a huge playoff atmosphere. Expect the Palace to be rocking.

Keys to this game:

Slow down Jermaine O'Neal. You can't let him get going or it's going to be a long afternoon in the post. 

Crash the boards. Foster and O'Neal are good at getting boards, so we need to make sure we limit their second (and third) chances.

Make Ron Artest beat you. Flat out a great defender, but I can live with him jumpshooting to beat us. 

Chauncey and Rip have to play well. In all three games this year, their performance has been under par. If they can get it going, I think we'll have a very good shot at winning this ballgame.


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## MLKG

Just got a call from my cousin who has an extra ticket to the game so it looks like I'm going. Needless to say, I'm pretty excited.


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## PistonFAN81

Dude I am so jealous, I think that you should give your ticket to me. yeah good idea huh? oh yeah and does anyone know why the game was changed?(time wise)


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>PistonFAN81</b>!
> Dude I am so jealous, I think that you should give your ticket to me. yeah good idea huh? oh yeah and does anyone know why the game was changed?(time wise)


I believe it was to accomodate ABC.


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## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> *Matchups:*
> 
> Jeff Foster vs. Ben Wallace: *Pistons*
> 
> Jermaine O'neal vs. Sheed Wallace: *Pacers*
> 
> Ron Artest vs. Tayshaun Prince: *Pacers*
> 
> Reggie Miller vs. Rip Hamilton: *Pistons*
> 
> Jamal Tinsley vs. Chauncey Billups: *Pistons*
> 
> ---------------------
> 
> Bench: *Pistons*
> 
> Coaching: *Pistons*


Bench Pistons? Coach Pistons?

Campbell, Ham, Hunter, James, Milicic, Okur, and Williamson is not better than

Johnson, Harrington, Croshere, Jones, and Pollard

Coaching: Carlisle and staff were the Eastern all-star coaches and have the better record.

This game lost all hype to me after the Pacers clinched the East and since Tinsley and Bender are out injured.

My prediction: Pistons 86 - Pacers 83


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## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> Bench Pistons? Coach Pistons?
> 
> Campbell, Ham, Hunter, James, Milicic, Okur, and Williamson is not better than
> 
> Johnson, Harrington, Croshere, Jones, and Pollard
> 
> Coaching: Carlisle and staff were the Eastern all-star coaches and have the better record.
> 
> This game lost all hype to me after the Pacers clinched the East and since Tinsley and Bender are out injured.
> 
> My prediction: Pistons 86 - Pacers 83


lol yeah that's only a biased fan speeking. How can you think Detriot's bench is better when we have Anthony Johnson who has played solid, Austin Croshere who has played really well as og late and Fred Jones who when he is hot he plays very well. Oh yeah, and Harrington who might be NBA's 6th man of the year winner.

And coach?? Larry Brown over Carlisle? Are you kidding me???


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## Midnight_Marauder

This game should be interesting. Let the trash talk begin..........

and oh if you want to talk trash I think the thread for both the Pistons/Pacers fans should be on the Pacers forum since we have won the season series............


I live around Detroit and me and my friends have decided not to talk to each other tomorrow. A few things might get said in the heat of the game. ha ha I love this rivalry.


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## jvanbusk

I'd take the Pistons bench. But, I'm not going to get into it with too much detail, because it would just be a waste of time.


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## Midnight_Marauder

> oh yeah and does anyone know why the game was changed?(time wise)



Because they know this is a possible EC final preview. I think that the early games are usually the showcase game for the week.


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> I'd take the Pistons bench. But, I'm not going to get into it with too much detail, because it would just be a waste of time.


I feel the same way. It's like talking to a brick wall. I think many people around the league will agree with me that our bench is better and if you call me bias for thinking likewise, then so be it. I find it particularly funny that you call me bias for thinking Detroit's bench is better then you say Indy's bench is better and somehow that's perfectly fine... Oh, well...


EDIT: Not that ESPN or Marc Stein knows it all, but he seems to agree with me. He has Detroit's bench ranked 3rd in the entire league, behind Sacramento and Minnesota. Take note that two of the teams ranked in front of the Pistons and neither are your beloved Pacers.


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## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> EDIT: Not that ESPN or Marc Stein knows it all, but he seems to agree with me. He has Detroit's bench ranked 3rd in the entire league, behind Sacramento and Minnesota. Take note that two of the teams ranked in front of them aren't your beloved Pacers.


Did he do this article/ranking before or after the trade? I think our bench has been about 10x better since the trade was made.


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Did he do this article/ranking before or after the trade? I think our bench has been about 10x better since the trade was made.


After the trade... it's marked March 26th.


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## jvanbusk

http://www.freep.com/sports/pistons/pcorn3_20040403.htm

This article probes a little bit into the head of Rick Carlisle and discusses the race between Ben Wallace and Ron Artest for defensive player of the year.



> "I think his chances are great," Pistons point guard Chauncey Billups said of Wallace. "He hasn't done anything less than what he did last year. You're not going to find a better one-on-one defender as well as a team defender. I don't see why he wouldn't win it."


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## DetBNyce

*Oct. 29, 2003, at The Palace, Pacers 89, Pistons 87:* Pacers Coach Rick Carlisle received a standing ovation as he watched the Pistons hoist their second Central Division championship banner into the rafters. Then he watched as his new star, Jermaine O’Neal, scored 22 points, including the winner with 1:41 left. 

*Dec. 19, 2003, at Conseco Fieldhouse, Pacers 80, Pistons 75:*The Pistons collapsed in the fourth quarter, making five unforced turnovers and missing 14 of 20 shots. 

*Jan. 20, 2004, at Conseco Fieldhouse, Pacers 81, Pistons 69:* The Pistons began play riding a 13-game winning streak but were humbled quickly. They again found no answer for O’Neal, who had 28 points, 15 rebounds and four blocked shots. 




> “With Rasheed, we get some depth up front and that’s real important,” Pistons Coach Larry Brown said. “Rasheed gives us the same flexibility that they’ve used against us, in terms of going with bigger lineups or smaller lineups.”
> 
> Rasheed and Ben Wallace will guard O’Neal at various times. Whichever one is not guarding him will be able to slide over to help Prince with Artest. The Pistons didn’t have that luxury before. Rasheed Wallace also has made the Pistons a more effective trapping team and better able to defend the pick-and-roll, a staple of the Pacers’ offense.
> 
> On top of that, Corliss Williamson, who had played primarily at power forward in the first three games, now can be used at small forward to help neutralize Artest’s force.




Complete Article


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## froggyvk

> ``Sunday we play Detroit and they are the top team since the All-Star break and since the trade (for Rasheed Wallace),'' Carlisle said after the Pacers continued their quest for the NBA's best record with an 84-64 rout of Toronto on Friday.
> 
> ``Detroit is one of the top teams in all of basketball right now. It's a game that will have a lot of interest, especially since we haven't met since the trade.''


The Pistons are 15-5 since the trade for Wallace and James.


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## jvanbusk

Kind of wish this game was on UPN. I'd love to hear Billy's input throughout the game.


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> Kind of wish this game was on UPN. I'd love to hear Billy's input throughout the game.


I feel the same way.

And why isn't ABC showing the Pistons... they're showing Kings/Rockets.


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## froggyvk

I'm getting Rockets/Kings - wtf?


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## jvanbusk

That's better.

Pathetic.


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## froggyvk

Yay following it by Yahoo! Box Score

Indiana 6, Detroit 6

**** YOU ABC.


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## DetBNyce

I don't understand what's so hard about remembering to show Detroit vs. Indiana in Detroit. Stupid.


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## jvanbusk

Sit down Ron-Ron.


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## froggyvk

FINALLY!


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## DetBNyce

I love Ben as much as the next guy, but he either has to start making those easy layups or we have to stop going to him so much in the post.


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## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> I love Ben as much as the next guy, but he either has to start making those easy layups or we have to stop going to him so much in the post.


It's like he tried to throw the ball through the backboard on that layup. What was that?


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## PacersguyUSA

I don't understand how Ben Wallace can miss so much from so close with his size and strength. Nice to see Foster getting that reverse; that was sweet.



> I find it particularly funny that you call me bias for thinking Detroit's bench is better then you say Indy's bench is better and somehow that's perfectly fine... Oh, well...


It's called an opinion. I find it particularly funny that Piston fans can routinely come into the Pacers board and argue against the Pacers and it's perfectly ok, but when a Pacer fan comes to the Piston board and argues against the Pistons, it somehow wrong.


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## jvanbusk

I wish Ben Wallace didn't miss a dunk every game. Seriously, how hard can that be?


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> It's called an opinion. I find it particularly funny that Piston fans can routinely come into the Pacers board and argue against the Pacers and it's perfectly ok, but when a Pacer fan comes to the Piston board and argues against the Pistons, it somehow wrong.


Noone said he was wrong for arguing. It's not about arguing and it's not about me respecting his opinion. I never said anything to give off the aura that I didn't respect his opinion. He didn't respect my opinion and dismissed it as being biased. Yet he turned around and did the same thing, but that was perfectly fine and justified.

For some reason I think you are having problems comprehending what was written. Like I said before, oh well....


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## PacersguyUSA

lol, at the Palace booing at the obvious hook and the whole Pacers team doing the charge sign. By the way, I'm only posting here cause there is no game thread at the Pacers board.


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## PacersguyUSA

We need Tinsley to break the press. It still seemed like 4 seconds rather than 8 though.


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## DetBNyce

I expected a defensive battle, but neither team seems to be able to put the ball in basket as of right now.


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## jvanbusk

Rip is lighting it up. That's what we need.


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## PacersguyUSA

I would have loved to see Fred Jones posterize Ben Wallace on that break. JO with his 3rd block and Harrington with the 3!!!


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## jvanbusk

We are getting killed on the glass, once again.


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## jvanbusk

So after the first quarter my question is:

Does somebody, not named Richard Hamilton, want to step it up?


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## PacersguyUSA

That little "Stand Up" thing at the end of the 1st quarter was cool. Nice block by Big Ben too.


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## Midnight_Marauder

The game is playing out just as I thought it was going to. Defense, defense, defense. Freddie is making a few mistakes I wish he wouldnt. Al Harrington is showing up for a nationally televised game........


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## DetBNyce

I would love to see us continue to use the trapping defense in the second quarter and Rip needs to stay in the game, he's lighting it up with 11 points in the 1st quarter.

Corliss has to read the scouting report a little better and realize that Harrington has 3 point range now. In a game where points are going to be hard to come by, we can't afford to let guys shoot open threes.


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## jvanbusk

Hell of a play by Memo. Takes contact and sinks the shot for the 3 point opportunity.


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## DetBNyce

I really don't like this mass substitution LB has employed, especially considering he pulled Rip, but I guess that's why LB is the coach and I'm not.


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## PacersguyUSA

Artest says no to the Pistons D. That's why I like him so much. He's too strong that whenever he drives he's either going to get fouled or he'll get it in with the left hand.


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## DetBNyce

I'm really not understanding this lineup. We have one offensive threat on the court. Maybe 1.5...


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## jvanbusk

Memo for 3!

Bet Larry is pulling out his hair.

There's number 3 on Ron-Ron.


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## DetBNyce

Nice flop by Darvin, draws an offensive foul from Artest.


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## Midnight_Marauder

Nice flop Hamm.................


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## Midnight_Marauder

I like Eastern conference games better. I love this grind it out play.


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## DetBNyce

What do ya know? This lineupof Hunter, James, Ham, Okur, and Campbell is actually building a lead.


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## Midnight_Marauder

Ok we need to calm down and play our game...............we cant buy a bucket..........


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## PacersguyUSA

Is the Pistons defensive scheme to double team everybody?


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## jvanbusk

Elden Campbell 6 points and 3 rebounds off the bench. Good start.


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> Elden Campbell 6 points and 3 rebounds off the bench. Good start.


Elden Campbell must be having a flashback to his younger days. Reggie seems to be doing the same.


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## jvanbusk

Rebounds!

We've got to start getting them.


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## Midnight_Marauder

Why is Harrington the only one playing for us? Is Anderson gone after this year? I can only hope................

Oh and O'Neal....dont go to the three man come on........


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## PacersguyUSA

I like how that turned out. Billups throws away the easy 2 on 1 while Tolbert is complimenting Tinsley.


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## Midnight_Marauder

Yeah you can tell we are missing Tinsley.


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## DetBNyce

Billups didn't throw it away, Miller tipped it.

We need some rebounds, that's one negative that is sticking out for us.


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## jvanbusk

MAKE THE DUNK!!!


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## PacersguyUSA

> Billups didn't throw it away, Miller tipped it.


Miller was on the opposite end of the floor.


Big Ben has had some of the best missed dunks of the year.


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## jvanbusk

He's right, Miller was on the opposite end. It was Harrington that tipped it away.


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## Midnight_Marauder

Ben needs to make those...............

I dont mind if he misses them but still...........


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## DetBNyce

Oh, sorry. I thought I put Harrington, that's who I meant. Regardless Billups didn't throw it away.

Artest picking up 3 fouls was huge for us. He's a problem to matchup with. Princed is too weak and Corliss is a little too slow. We'll probaly see a lot of ham and Williamson on him in the second half. A big part of our strategy looked like it was aimed at getting Artest in foul trouble.


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## Seven

I am so pissed off the Miami market down here is not carrying the game ! :upset: They are playing freakin Rockets - Kings instead. Damnit !


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## jvanbusk

39-33 Pistons at the half.

I can live with that. We're not shooting the ball especially well, but either is Indiana. We're doing a pretty good job controlling Jermaine O'Neal (2-11 shooting), but we need to keep him and Foster off the glass. They are killing us, they have an 8-2 offensive rebound advantage. That's something we've got to work on for the second half, but I have my doubts. We've been getting outrebounded every game, and I can't quite put my finger on why. Rip Hamilton had a hot start with 11 points in the first quarter, finishing with 14 in the half. Elden Campbell and Memo picked up the scoring in the second quarter with a combined 14 points. We also need better play out of Billups, doesn't seem like he's controlling the play very well tonight as he did against Miami with that 31-7-7 night. Liked what I saw out of Darvin Ham when he was in for a little while. Interesting to see him get a little run.

Key for the second half is boxing out and getting control of the glass, while limiting the number of turnovers. If we do those two things, I think we will win this ballgame.


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## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>Seven</b>!
> I am so pissed off the Miami market down here is not carrying the game ! :upset: They are playing freakin Rockets - Kings instead. Damnit !


But it's Yao! Everybody wants to see Yao everytime there is a nationally televised game.


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## DetBNyce

Aside from being injured, O'neal could be having problems getting into a rhythm. We have thrown at least three guys on him in Ben, Sheed, and Campbell, and I'm pretty sure Okur will get his shot in the second half if he hasn't already.


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## Midnight_Marauder

> Originally posted by <b>Seven</b>!
> I am so pissed off the Miami market down here is not carrying the game ! :upset: They are playing freakin Rockets - Kings instead. Damnit !


Just another case of the East getting no respect. You would think with the Heat being an Eastern team they would show EASTERN CONFERENCE GAMES. Call and complain.


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## Midnight_Marauder

If Calvin Murphy did this he is sick..........


Watching the halftime show, sorry guys.


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> If Calvin Murphy did this he is sick..........
> 
> 
> Watching the halftime show, sorry guys.



LOL... It's quite alright.


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## PacersguyUSA

> Oh, sorry. I thought I put Harrington, that's who I meant. Regardless Billups didn't throw it away.


Sorry, I don't want to start anything cause this is a nice thread but I just want to say that if Harrington tipped it, it would have been the Pistons' ball.


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## MillerTime

Good game so far. I can live with the scoreline as it stands now. Pacers have 2 guys out and havn't played well. Someone needs to stop Hamilton, he is tearing us apart.

Someone needs to step up and take control of the game. Noone from Indiana has doen so. 

Detriot has stopped O'Neal, but Wallace's are combined for 2pts.


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## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> Sorry, I don't want to start anything cause this is a nice thread but I just want to say that if Harrington tipped it, it would have been the Pistons' ball.


I thought the Pistons got the ball back?

In any case, Chauncey Billups has been credited with 0 turnovers, so therefore it must have went off Hamilton's hand after it tipped Harrington.


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## DetBNyce

It was Detroit's ball after they came back from the commercial break.


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## PacersguyUSA

Wallace misses a dunk, maybe they should stick to layups.


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## DetBNyce

Nice start to the second half Stones... We missed an easy dunk, but we got it back with a three ball by Billups. 

Nice to see Tayshuan make an aggressive move after a dissapointing first half.


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## jvanbusk

11 point lead after the Billups 3, and then the timeout from Indiana. The lead would be 17 if we could convert dunks.


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> Wallace misses a dunk, maybe they should stick to layups.


Yea, I think he second guessed himself, while he was in the air causing him to miss the dunk.


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## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> Wallace misses a dunk, maybe they should stick to layups.


That seems to be a problem for Ben as well.


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## DetBNyce

Since the Wallace's aren't doing too much down low, we may want to explore the possibility of Billups posting up Anderson.


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## PacersguyUSA

I didn't know Tolbert played for the Pacers.


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## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> Since the Wallace's aren't doing too much down low, we may want to explore the possibility of Billups posting up Anderson.


We definetly need Tinsley back. Anderson has no idea what to do when he sees a good defense.


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## jvanbusk

Cheap foul on Prince.


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## DetBNyce

The Pacers have moved to what looks like a modified 3-2 defense or a 2-1-2 zone.

Edit: Ok, it looks liek a 2-3 now. I guess they're switching up everytime down the court.


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## MillerTime

Reggie is starting to get cocky and trying to take over the game. Memo to Reggie: Let Artest and O'Neal take care of buisness.


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## Midnight_Marauder

Artest is making the spark we need. The Palace is a little quiet...........


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## PacersguyUSA

Anderson is like a corner back. I like the Pacer position. When we're ahead we tend to blow the lead so it's better that we're comming from behind.


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## jvanbusk

Playing like crap the last few minutes. Rip forces a couple of threes, and we still can't seem to rebound.


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## mrfrodo

Terrible turnover and basket, cutting the lead to four :no:


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## Midnight_Marauder

These two teams are pretty evenly matched.


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## DetBNyce

I think now would be a good time to insert Memo into the lineup. The zone has been giving the Pistons problems initially, hopefully they can figure it out.


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> These two teams are pretty evenly matched.


Yea and neither team seems to be playing good basketball either. I assume that's due to the defense.


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## Midnight_Marauder

Man I love Artest's game...............


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## DetBNyce

Corliss, Rasheed, one of you have to establish something down low.

And grab a rebound.


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## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> Man I love Artest's game...............


You can tell who's the best player on the court today... Artest. He is playing awsome.

I am also liking the way Foster has played.


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## Midnight_Marauder

I miss the old Reggie that would hit a mid range jumper 9/10 times


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## PacersguyUSA

The Piston defense has really impressed me. They forsce so many tough passes.


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> You can tell who's the best player on the court today... Artest. He is playing awsome.


I think Rip would have a little to say about that.


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## jvanbusk

I hate to keep repeating myself but our rebounding is atrocious.

Big trey from Rasheed! Finally, he does something.


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## mrfrodo

Rasheeeeeeeeeeeeeed for threeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee


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## MillerTime

Artest needs help if we're going to win this game. Seems like the entire offense is going thru Artest now. We need O'Neal to start playing like he's sopposed to.


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## Midnight_Marauder

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> I think Rip would have a little to say about that.


:no:


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## Midnight_Marauder

We need to have a strong 4th qtr from O'Neal for us to win this............


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> 
> 
> :no:


Rip -- 16 and 4...

Artest -- 12 and 2...

:yes:


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## jvanbusk

Ben Wallace at the free throw line: It's always an adventure.


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## Midnight_Marauder

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> Rip -- 16 and 4...
> 
> Artest -- 12 and 2...
> 
> :yes:


I still say.........
:no: 


:laugh:


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## froggyvk

Coach Carlisle really doesn't allow the opposition to go on nice runs because he calls a timeout afte every 5-0 spurt. Seriously, it amazes me that he still has timeouts at the end of the game.

Our bench was great in the second. Finish this quarter out strong and have the bench repeat their quarter at the beginning of the 4th and we should be in pretty good shape. Perhaps I'm getting ahead of myself, but I would love to see Primoz Milicic today.


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## PacersguyUSA

I don't get it with Ben Wallace. He's so close, why can't he just put it in?! At least he's a great defensive player.


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## PacersguyUSA

> Coach Carlisle really doesn't allow the opposition to go on nice runs because he calls a timeout afte every 5-0 spurt. Seriously, it amazes me that he still has timeouts at the end of the game.


We have timeout left because we rarely allow teams to have 5-0 runs.


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## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> I don't get it with Ben Wallace. He's so close, why can't he just put it in?! At least he's a great defensive player.


Ben Wallace just schooled Scot Pollard. 

These annoucers are horrible btw. "This is a very important game for Indiana." .... it is?? lol


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## jvanbusk

Another 8 second violation. I'm loving the pressure we put on.


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## MillerTime

MY GOD! Is Anthony Johnson a rookie or something???? :upset:


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## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> Ben Wallace just schooled Scot Pollard.
> 
> These annoucers are horrible btw. "This is a very important game for Indiana." .... it is?? lol


I would say it's important to keep pace for homecourt throughout, plus you are playing Detroit. How could that not be big?


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## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> Ben Wallace just schooled Scot Pollard.
> 
> These annoucers are horrible btw. "This is a very important game for Indiana." .... it is?? lol


Well you guys seem to think that you're going to make it to the finals (rightfully so) and I would assume you guys want HCA. 

The quotes I've read from Indiana players recently seem to say the same. I think it's a pretty important game for you guys.


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

Anthony Johnson looked like a damn deer in headlights.............


OT:WTF is this Nick and Jessica variety hour? Oh my.....I give that show........a month before it gets cancelled. :laugh: :laugh:


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> I would say it's important to keep pace for homecourt throughout, plus you are playing Detroit. How could that not be big?


It's big, but it's not huge. If we lose this game, it wont make any difference. Not to who plays at home, not to who we play first round and not if it makes a difference in the playoffs.

The big thing going into this game for us was, can we play Detriot with Rasheed Wallace? And to be honest, he doesn't scare me. Atleast from what i saw today. 

Oviously i want to win, but i won't lose sleep if we lose. The same should go to Detriot. Even if we lose, we're still 3-1 against you. We can't sweep everyone!


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> These annoucers are horrible btw. "This is a very important game for Indiana." .... it is?? lol


I like the announcers because they seem to favor the Pacers and rightfully so.


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> Well you guys seem to think that you're going to make it to the finals (rightfully so) and I would assume you guys want HCA.
> 
> The quotes I've read from Indiana players recently seem to say the same. I think it's a pretty important game for you guys.


Detriot isn't catching us....... LOL


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> It's big, but it's not huge. If we lose this game, it wont make any difference. Not to who plays at home, not to who we play first round and not if it makes a difference in the playoffs.
> 
> The big thing going into this game for us was, can we play Detriot with Rasheed Wallace? And to be honest, he doesn't scare me. Atleast from what i saw today.
> 
> Oviously i want to win, but i won't lose sleep if we lose. The same should go to Detriot. Even if we lose, we're still 3-1 against you. We can't sweep everyone!


Cosign........

They have to prove they can beat us.......we have proved that we can beat them.............


----------



## PacersguyUSA

Come on AJ, gotta finish!


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> Detriot isn't catching us....... LOL


What are you talking about? I said home court in the FINALS...


----------



## Jermaniac Fan

Indiana at Detroit LIVE! 


- Indiana 50, Detroit 56 at halftime!
- O'neal shooting 3-14! Great!
- Artest lead pacers' scoring with 14 points
- Hamilton lead Pistons' scoring with 16

(0:00) End Period 
(0:00) [IND] Team Rebound 
(0:00) [IND] Jones Jump Shot: Missed 
(0:02) [IND] Jones Rebound (Off:0 Def:2) 
(0:04) [DET] Hamilton Running Jump: Missed 
(0:25) [IND] Artest Substitution replaced by Jones 
(0:25) [DET] James Substitution replaced by Hamilton 
(0:25) [DET] Wallace Substitution replaced by Billups 
(0:25) [IND] Team Turnover: 8 Second Violation ( TO) 
(0:32) [IND] Pollard Rebound (Off:1 Def:2) 
(0:33) [DET] Wallace Free Throw 2 of 2 missed 
(0:33) [DET] Team Rebound 
(0:33) [DET] Wallace Free Throw 1 of 2 missed 
(0:33) [IND] Pollard Foul: Shooting (2 PF) 
(0:48) [IND] O'Neal Substitution replaced by Pollard


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> 
> 
> Cosign........
> 
> They have to prove they can beat us.......we have proved that we can beat them.............


Exactly. This is a meaningless game late in the season, but it's more important to Detriot then Indiana, but not by much.

If Detriot won by say 8 points and Rasheed scored 25, then i'd be worried. But Rasheed isn't doing anything that you guys did in the first 3 games.


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> 
> 
> Cosign........
> 
> They have to prove they can beat us.......we have proved that we can beat them.............


Not with Sheed. Totally different team... you should know that, you stay in metro Detroit.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

Billups's free throw shooting is not impressing me.


----------



## mrfrodo

Anyone else watching the TV but listening to the radio? I got tired of the broadcasters and turned it on to 1130 and thankfully Blaha is on. Enjoying the game much more now


----------



## PacersguyUSA

Where's Kenny Anderson. Him or we should run the point through Artest.


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

Johnson is killing us......................


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> What are you talking about? I said home court in the FINALS...


We won't win out and neither will the Lakers. Like i said, i'm not worried.


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> Exactly. This is a meaningless game late in the season, but it's more important to Detriot then Indiana, but not by much.
> 
> If Detriot won by say 8 points and Rasheed scored 25, then i'd be worried. But Rasheed isn't doing anything that you guys did in the first 3 games.


So a minute ago it was big and now all of a sudden it's meaningless?!? C'mon with the excuses... It's a good game between the two top teams in the east.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

Happy 1000th game for Campbell!


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>mrfrodo</b>!
> Anyone else watching the TV but listening to the radio? I got tired of the broadcasters and turned it on to 1130 and thankfully Blaha is on. Enjoying the game much more now


These annoucers are horrible.

And yes, AJ is killing us. It doesn't seen he's ever played a good team before??


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

This isnt our game..........I dont see us winning this one............We got nothing going on offense


----------



## PacersguyUSA

I think we're throwing the game cause Brezec, that's right Primoz Brezec is in and it's not garbage time. I have officially turned the TV off.


----------



## MillerTime

OMG! Brezec is in the game.


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> Exactly. This is a meaningless game late in the season, but it's more important to Detriot then Indiana, but not by much.
> 
> If Detriot won by say 8 points and Rasheed scored 25, then i'd be worried. But Rasheed isn't doing anything that you guys did in the first 3 games.


Why is it more important to Detroit than Indiana? We are locked into #3 just like you are locked into #1.


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> OMG! Brezec is in the game.


Yup Pistons won........:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Why is it more important to Detroit than Indiana? We are locked into #3 just like you are locked into #1.


You could say that the Pistons need to prove that they can beat the Pacers, but it really isn't that important.


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> You could say that the Pistons need to prove that they can beat the Pacers, but it really isn't that important.


Don't the Pacers need to prove that they can beat the Rasheed Pistons?


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Why is it more important to Detroit than Indiana? We are locked into #3 just like you are locked into #1.


I meant slightly. I don't think Detriot would want to go into the playoffs being swept in the season series by Indiana. Maybe i'm wrong, but just my opinion.


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

I aint making excuses.......Detroit is playing better than us. It will be a good playoff series if we meet up............


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Don't the Pacers need to prove that they can beat the Rasheed Pistons?


Yeah... his 5pts and 6boards is really effecting this game? LOL please dude, you guys crack me up. I love you guys!


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Don't the Pacers need to prove that they can beat the Rasheed Pistons?


It's not the same thing cause we've beaten the Pistons twice. Doesn't matter what personal they have. It's a psyche thing.


----------



## mrfrodo

Looks like Brezec got taken out..........Im shocked:laugh:


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah... his 5pts and 6boards is really effecting this game? LOL please dude, you guys crack me up. I love you guys!


You have noticed no difference with our defense?


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

Does Campbell think it is 1994 again? Where is this coming from..........


----------



## jvanbusk

I'm not impressed with Jermaine O'Neal's shooting.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>mrfrodo</b>!
> Looks like Brezec got taken out..........Im shocked:laugh:


Thanks for telling me; I'll turn the TV back on now.


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> Thanks for telling me; I'll turn the TV back on now.




Dont.......you will see the score and get upset like I am right now..........


----------



## MillerTime

10pts for Detriot now.

Look like we're in deep trouple. Detriot is playing very good. But we all gotta remember, it's ONLY 1 game. And it's a meaningless game. If we were fighting for the divison still, then this would mean alot. 

But this game is just a game to Indiana. Detriot has a little bit more to prove plus their home and healthy. 

No excuses, facts are facts. There is nothing more we know about the future (playoffs) now then what we did before this game.

We'll prolly see each other in the East finals. Besides that, it doesn't mean a whole lot.


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 10pts for Detriot now.
> 
> Look like we're in deep trouple. Detriot is playing very good. But we all gotta remember, it's ONLY 1 game. And it's a meaningless game. If we were fighting for the divison still, then this would mean alot.
> 
> But this game is just a game to Indiana. Detriot has a little bit more to prove plus their home and healthy.
> 
> No excuses, facts are facts. There is nothing more we know about the future (playoffs) now then what we did before this game.
> 
> We'll prolly see each other in the East finals. Besides that, it doesn't mean a whole lot.


Sounds like excuses to me. :|


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> I'm not impressed with Jermaine O'Neal's shooting.


HUGE off-game by O'Neal. He definetly needs to get it stright for the playoffs or we'll be saying bye bye early again.


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Sounds like excuses to me. :|


Whats false in what i wrote?

Looks like you guys want to pick at something small and make it big.


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> HUGE off-game by O'Neal. He definetly needs to get it stright for the playoffs or we'll be saying bye bye early again.


Actually my comment was suppose to have a hint of sarcasm.


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

No its not excuses but O'Neal still isnt 100% you can tell.......we are missing Tinsley which means we get to see the master of the point guard postion Johnson.:upset:


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Actually my comment was suppose to have a hint of sarcasm.


But you were right..... he's playing like garbage today.


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

CRAP................

Ok turning TV off now...............


Thanks for having a good thread today Pistons fans.............I will catch you guys later.


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> CRAP................
> 
> Ok turning TV off now...............
> 
> 
> Thanks for having a good thread today Pistons fans.............I will catch you guys later.


You're going to miss Darko though!


----------



## DetBNyce

Still sounds like excuses to me. You guys are missing Jamal Tinsley, well we didn't have Rasheed Wallace for the first three games. Play with the hand you're dealt.


----------



## Jermaniac Fan

8min
3-3FG 
0-0 3pt 
5-6FT 
6reb 
11pts 

Cambell have played only 8 minutes, but he have 11pts plus six rebounds! that's pretty well


----------



## mrfrodo

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> No its not excuses but O'Neal still isnt 100% you can tell


Rasheed is not 100% either.......Looks like were starting a new under 70 streak


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> Still sounds like excuses to me. You guys are missing Jamal Tinsley, well we didn't have Rasheed Wallace for the first three games. Play with the hand you're dealt.


Right. So at the end of the day we're 3-1. You're point?


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>Jermaniac Fan</b>!
> 8min 3-3FG 0-0 5-6 6 1 1 11
> 
> Cambell have played only 8 minutes, but he have 11pts plus six rebounds! that's pretty well


Yea and a lot better than Scott Pollard, I might add.


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> Right. So at the end of the day we're 3-1. You're point?


Ok and we're 1-0 against you guys with our "new" team. I'm not the one looking for excuses here.


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> Still sounds like excuses to me. You guys are missing Jamal Tinsley, well we didn't have Rasheed Wallace for the first three games. Play with the hand you're dealt.



So the *excuse* for you guys losing the first three is because you didnt have 'Sheed? 

Say what you want but having your starting PG is very important when you go against a team with the defense of a Detroit team.

I am not saying you guys didnt play better than us today..........but losing one game does not ruin the season the Pacers have had.


----------



## Jermaniac Fan

we have made only 2pts at 4th quarter


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> Ok and we're 1-0 against you guys with our "new" team. I'm not the one looking for excuses here.


And we're 0-1 when we have 2 guys our injured. lol, you guys say we make excuses then you guys make your excuses just a few posts lower.

Indiana didn't show up today and it showed. We were outplayed. This game meant more to you and have were at home. 

So if you are going to keep telling me to "stop my excuses" how bout you guys don't post excuses either?


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> So the *excuse* for you guys losing the first three is because you didnt have 'Sheed?
> 
> Say what you want but having your starting PG is very important when you go against a team with the defense of a Detroit team.


All I'm doing is doing what you guys are doing... I never said the reason we lost the first three games was because we didn't have Sheed. We lost because we got outplayed, not because we were missing Rasheed. Fact is this was a good game and some Indy fans starting making excuses on why they were losing with 9 minutes to go in the game.


----------



## MillerTime

If you guys want to play the excuse game then we can play the excuse game, if not then that's ok with me. Either way, we're 3-1 vs you guys.

And once again, this LOSS means NOTHING to us. In two hours, our players won't even remember who we played. It's a meaningless game! My god. Why are Detriot fans treating a meaningless game like a playoff game??


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> *Play with the hand you're dealt.*


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> All I'm doing is doing what you guys are doing... I never said the reason we lost the first three games was because we didn't have Sheed. We lost because we got outplayed, not because we were missing Rasheed. Fact is this was a good game and some Indy fans starting making excuses on why they were losing with 9 minutes to go in the game.


I said this was a meaningless game when we were down 1...


----------



## Jermaniac Fan

We'll use Pistons-avatar next week!


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> If you guys want to play the excuse game then we can play the excuse game, if not then that's ok with me. Either way, we're 3-1 vs you guys.
> 
> And once again, this LOSS means NOTHING to us. In two hours, our players won't even remember who we played. It's a meaningless game! My god. Why are Detriot fans treating a meaningless game like a playoff game??


OK, let's neither of us play the excuse game.


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> If you guys want to play the excuse game then we can play the excuse game, if not then that's ok with me. Either way, we're 3-1 vs you guys.
> 
> And once again, this LOSS means NOTHING to us. In two hours, our players won't even remember who we played. It's a meaningless game! My god. Why are Detriot fans treating a meaningless game like a playoff game??


I would like to know, how the game went from being "big, but not huge" to being "meaningless" in your eyes in less than an hour.


----------



## jvanbusk

Darko!

Darko!

Darko!


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> Darko!
> 
> Darko!
> 
> Darko!


I supsect we'll be hearing those chants anytime now...:yes:


----------



## mrfrodo

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> If you guys want to play the excuse game then we can play the excuse game, if not then that's ok with me. Either way, we're 3-1 vs you guys.
> 
> And once again, this LOSS means NOTHING to us. In two hours, our players won't even remember who we played. It's a meaningless game! My god. Why are Detriot fans treating a meaningless game like a playoff game??


I seriously doubt that if the pacers won this game you would be saying it was meaningless, Maybe this is the only time we beat you this year but it is also at the end of the year.....when the games matter the most.

Also I doubt the absence of Tinsley made a 20 point swing in this game:no:


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> OK, let's neither of us play the excuse game.


Ok then. Congrats on todays win. You guys out played us and played much better defense and killed Anderson/Johnson. 

Hopefully we can play better next time we meet, which hopefully will be in the eastern conference finals. Good luck in your next game.


----------



## jvanbusk

Ron-Ron...T'd up!

And BEN WALLACE makes the free throw! :laugh:


----------



## Jermaniac Fan

O'neal shooting 4-15
Artest shooting 5-13

wow!


----------



## DetBNyce

Sit down Ron-Ron, before you get a couple games suspension.


----------



## mrfrodo

Artest with the T...........Could the Wild child be back in time for the playoffs 


J/K


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>mrfrodo</b>!
> 
> 
> I seriously doubt that if the pacers won this game you would be saying it was meaningless, Maybe this is the only time we beat you this year but it is also at the end of the year.....when the games matter the most.
> 
> Also I doubt the absence of Tinsley would make a 20 point swing in this game:no:


I even said earlier that if Detriot lost it wouldn't matter too much. I just thought this game meant more for Det then Indy because it's never good heading into the playoffs 0-4 against a team.

The games matter most now? Are you crazy? The first 3 games mattered MUCH more, because we were fighting for the divison. We're not fighting for anything anymore, besides LAL for home court.

This is a meaningless game but it's big to an extent because of Carlisle/Brown and the rivarly between the two teams. 

If you guys think this game means more then a 1 in the W column for Detriot and a 1 in the L column for Indiana, then you guys are more blind then i thought you guys were. I seriously expected more our of you guys.


----------



## mrfrodo

Darkos coming in..........................


----------



## PacersguyUSA

What the hell is up with Milicic's hair. He shouldn't be allowed to play in the game with that!

Also, what was up with that technical on Artest. Sheed was the one hitting the ground with his headband and cussing out the refs.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

Brezec hooped over Milicic!!!!!! That makes the whole game worth it. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> Brezec hooped over Milicic!!!!!! That makes the whole game worth it. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


What?

Looks more like he just got swatted.


----------



## jvanbusk

And we have a new inductee into the World Famous Club!


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> What?
> 
> Looks more like he just got swatted.


I wouldn't expect anything less from Brezec. He's the only guy in the Arena I hate more than Billups and Okur.


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> And we have a new inductee into the World Famous Club!


Another member of the under 70 club, our third 50 win season in a row, and Darko scores!!!

Great game.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Also I doubt the absence of Tinsley made a 20 point swing in this game


Probably would because you can automatically take away all the points Johnson cost us as well as the 4 pts he adds to our offense.


----------



## MillerTime

Let's forget about Tinsley, we all agreed not to talk excuses. I'd reather not talk excuses then to hear their excuses. It's only fair that both fan groups stay away from them.


----------



## froggyvk

Playing the Pacers in the Eastern Conference finals would make for two booooorrring weeks  

:laugh:


----------



## MillerTime

Anyways, it was a nice game day thread. Once again nice job on your victory today, good luck rest of the season and don't forget it's only one game  

Have a nice day everyone.


----------



## DaUnbreakableKinG

Good game by Pistons. In the end it will be either *Pistons* or *Pacers* in the Finals against the west. :yes:


----------



## Lope31

50 wins. Sweet. And what a team to get it against. Darko Milicic for Prime Minister. Sheed is a Machine! DPO4


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> Probably would because you can automatically take away all the points Johnson cost us as well as the 4 pts he adds to our offense.


You guys didn't need Tinsley at the beginning of the year so why do you need him now?


----------



## jvanbusk

This was a great game. The Pistons defense was absolutely stifling in the second half limiting the Pacers to 28 total points, 11 in the 4th quarter. Ben and Rasheed controlled the post on defense limiting Jermaine O'Neal to 9 points on 4-15 shooting. I'm a little disappointed in the way we rebounded, we got killed on the offensive glass. Big game for our guards, Rip with 24 points and Billups although his shot wasn't going 10 points and 7 assists with 0 turnovers. On the other side of the ball we forced Indiana into 19 turnovers. Our pressure defense is really clicking. Elden Campbell provided a huge spark off the bench. I think he could develop into a pretty large factor come playoff time. He certainly will be well-rested. It's nice to get a win against a very good team, which we have done in the last two games. I'm really looking forward to the playoffs, I think we can make a run.


----------



## PistonFAN81

Great game by the good guys, was very impressed by the whole game I know that I was yellin and gettin into da fun....GO stones all da way


----------



## Lope31

Jeff Foster is a heck of a player I would love to have him come off the bench for us. He sniped Ben on a couple of easy rebounds which was making me mad. Campbell was a machine and Okur was solid too. Is it just me or is Rasheed Wallace one of the most exciting players to watch in the league?


----------



## DetBNyce

I would like to say you brought up some great points.



> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> Ben and Rasheed controlled the post on defense limiting Jermaine O'Neal to 9 points on 4-15 shooting. I'm a little disappointed in the way we rebounded, we got killed on the offensive glass.



Besides O'neal being hurt, I would like to think our defense had a little bit to do with his poor night. We're able to throw 4 able bodies at him now and all four bring something different to the table. We didn't have this before we acquired Sheed and I think it will be very helpful come playoff time.

I have no idea why we have been getting killed on the boards.




> Big game for our guards, Rip with 24 points and Billups although his shot wasn't going 10 points and 7 assists with 0 turnovers.


One of the keys to the game that I and many of the Pistons fans alike pointed out. It was no secret that our guard play in the previous two games had been attrocious, but they both came to play today, epecially Rip who was the best player on the floor tonight.




> On the other side of the ball we forced Indiana into 19 turnovers. Our pressure defense is really clicking.


I really like the trapping defense we used. It seemed to bother them a little bit, evidenced by a couple 8 second violations we forced them into. Our length really presented some problems for the Pacers today.


----------



## rainman

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> This was a great game. The Pistons defense was absolutely stifling in the second half limiting the Pacers to 28 total points, 11 in the 4th quarter. Ben and Rasheed controlled the post on defense limiting Jermaine O'Neal to 9 points on 4-15 shooting. I'm a little disappointed in the way we rebounded, we got killed on the offensive glass. Big game for our guards, Rip with 24 points and Billups although his shot wasn't going 10 points and 7 assists with 0 turnovers. On the other side of the ball we forced Indiana into 19 turnovers. Our pressure defense is really clicking. Elden Campbell provided a huge spark off the bench. I think he could develop into a pretty large factor come playoff time. He certainly will be well-rested. It's nice to get a win against a very good team, which we have done in the last two games. I'm really looking forward to the playoffs, I think we can make a run.


nice win, i agree that campbell's contribution is big but memo needs more than 3 fg attempts, is he 100% healthy?. when he plays he seems to be shooting a high percentage. in the long run they are going to have to put up the points to beat the elite teams.


----------



## DetBNyce

> Originally posted by <b>rainman</b>!
> 
> 
> nice win, i agree that campbell's contribution is big but memo needs more than 3 fg attempts, is he 100% healthy?. when he plays he seems to be shooting a high percentage. in the long run they are going to have to put up the points to beat the elite teams.


I believe Memo is fine and he played pretty well today, but in today's game no one guy stood out on our team, except for Rip. Today was just Campbell's day off the bench.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>KABI</b>!
> 
> 
> You guys didn't need Tinsley at the beginning of the year so why do you need him now?


He has all these cheap tricks to get by people which would break the press. Also he has great court vision to find weaknesses in the Detroit defense. Detroit wasn't playing that style of defense in the beginning of the year.


----------



## Lope31

Sweet, I have always been a fan of Jamaal Tinsley. What happened to him at the beginning of the year? I am glad to hear he is doing better now but what is he doing different?


----------



## Tim Lebrach

Yep, Pistons are flat out better hence the Pacers best record in the league and 6 game (plus tiebreaker) lead over the Pistons.
The Pacers simply played a meaningless game, whereas the Pistons were as up for this game as any they played this year. Combine that with the fact that Jermaine O'Neal is only 60%, one of the top-5 pure point guards in the NBA Jamaal Tinsley was out, his back-up Kenny Anderson was also out the ;ast 3 quarters of the game leaving the Pacers with Anthony Johnsons at point *shudder*, Jonathan Bender, who can do everything Rasheed Wallace can do only better and on a bigger more athletic body, was out, Ron Artest played like a selfish ball-hog, Reggie Miller was shooting blanks, and the game was in Detroit yet still the game was close going into the 4th untill the Pacers decided to pack it up and rest the starters for more meaningful games (ie. playoffs).
The fact is, the 2 best players on either team both play for the Pacers, and the Pacers are deeper. So if anything, the Pacers are flat-out better than the Pistons. No offense Pistons fans, but thats just how it is. No shame being second to the team with the best record in the NBA right?


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>Tim Lebrach</b>!
> Yep, Pistons are flat out better hence the Pacers best record in the league and 6 game (plus tiebreaker) lead over the Pistons.
> The Pacers simply played a meaningless game, whereas the Pistons were as up for this game as any they played this year. Combine that with the fact that Jermaine O'Neal is only 60%, one of the top-5 pure point guards in the NBA Jamaal Tinsley was out, his back-up Kenny Anderson was also out the ;ast 3 quarters of the game leaving the Pacers with Anthony Johnsons at point *shudder*, Jonathan Bender, who can do everything Rasheed Wallace can do only better and on a bigger more athletic body, was out, Ron Artest played like a selfish ball-hog, Reggie Miller was shooting blanks, and the game was in Detroit yet still the game was close going into the 4th untill the Pacers decided to pack it up and rest the starters for more meaningful games (ie. playoffs).
> The fact is, the 2 best players on either team both play for the Pacers, and the Pacers are deeper. So if anything, the Pacers are flat-out better than the Pistons. No offense Pistons fans, but thats just how it is. No shame being second to the team with the best record in the NBA right?


Can't really argue with logic like that.:whoknows:


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>Tim Lebrach</b>!
> Yep, Pistons are flat out better hence the Pacers best record in the league and 6 game (plus tiebreaker) lead over the Pistons.
> The Pacers simply played a meaningless game, whereas the Pistons were as up for this game as any they played this year. Combine that with the fact that Jermaine O'Neal is only 60%, one of the top-5 pure point guards in the NBA Jamaal Tinsley was out, his back-up Kenny Anderson was also out the ;ast 3 quarters of the game leaving the Pacers with Anthony Johnsons at point *shudder*, Jonathan Bender, who can do everything Rasheed Wallace can do only better and on a bigger more athletic body, was out, Ron Artest played like a selfish ball-hog, Reggie Miller was shooting blanks, and the game was in Detroit yet still the game was close going into the 4th untill the Pacers decided to pack it up and rest the starters for more meaningful games (ie. playoffs).
> The fact is, the 2 best players on either team both play for the Pacers, and the Pacers are deeper. So if anything, the Pacers are flat-out better than the Pistons. No offense Pistons fans, but thats just how it is. No shame being second to the team with the best record in the NBA right?


You make no :twocents:
:naughty:


----------



## carver401

> Originally posted by <b>Tim Lebrach</b>!
> Yep, Pistons are flat out better hence the Pacers best record in the league and 6 game (plus tiebreaker) lead over the Pistons.
> The Pacers simply played a meaningless game, whereas the Pistons were as up for this game as any they played this year. Combine that with the fact that Jermaine O'Neal is only 60%, one of the top-5 pure point guards in the NBA Jamaal Tinsley was out, his back-up Kenny Anderson was also out the ;ast 3 quarters of the game leaving the Pacers with Anthony Johnsons at point *shudder*, Jonathan Bender, who can do everything Rasheed Wallace can do only better and on a bigger more athletic body, was out, Ron Artest played like a selfish ball-hog, Reggie Miller was shooting blanks, and the game was in Detroit yet still the game was close going into the 4th untill the Pacers decided to pack it up and rest the starters for more meaningful games (ie. playoffs).
> The fact is, the 2 best players on either team both play for the Pacers, and the Pacers are deeper. So if anything, the Pacers are flat-out better than the Pistons. No offense Pistons fans, but thats just how it is. No shame being second to the team with the best record in the NBA right?


Welcome to BBB.net and congratulations on one of the most unbelievable biased posts I've ever read


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Yep, Pistons are flat out better hence the Pacers best record in the league and 6 game (plus tiebreaker) lead over the Pistons.





> The fact is, the 2 best players on either team both play for the Pacers, and the Pacers are deeper.


Edit your post and leave that, delete everything else.


----------



## DetBNyce

I'm not going to go into long detail in this post, because that ridiculous post above me doesn't warrant it. But...


While I have to agree with the comment that the two best players may very well play for the Pacers. We have like 7 out of the next 9 players. Reggie Miller and Harrington are the only guys from the Pacers that are in the next 9 players. 

Rip, Billups, Prince, Wallace x2, Okur, Williamson...


----------



## Tim Lebrach

Not biased. I'm simply stating the *FACTS.*
Detroit is an average-to-above-average team. and when you "mail" games in against those kinda teams by playing your bench players 90% of the game, you're probably going to lose.
Believe me, once the playofss get here and the games start meaning something again (Pacers have best record in the L wrapped up so the rest of the regular season is exhibition really) and JO is 100%, JT11 is 100%, and "The Secret Weapon" Jonathan Bender is 100%, we'll see who's boss.
And remember, the East goes through Conseco not the Palace. You guys cant beat us at Conseco even if we do only play our bench.


----------



## Tim Lebrach

The top-10 players on either team right now:
1. J. O'Neal
2. Artest
3. B. Wallace
4. Harrington
5. R. Wallace
6. Reggie
7. Hamilton
8. Tinsley
9. Foster
10. Billups

and I'll even add in scoring. 10 points for #1, 9 for #2, etc.

Pacers = 36
Pistons = 19
Pacers win *EASILY!*


----------



## Brian.

Just because you have a better win lose record it doesn't automatically mean that you are the better team. The pistons had a better record than the nets last year but is there any doubt that the nets where the better team? Anyways had the pistons had Rasheed Wallace from the beginning of the year there is no doubt in my mind they would have had the better record.


----------



## thrillhouse

man 15 pages, its like we are on the bulls forum or something.
i didnt get to see the game but it sounds like it was pretty good.


----------



## DaUnbreakableKinG

> Originally posted by <b>thrillhouse</b>!
> man 15 pages, its like we are on the bulls forum or something.
> i didnt get to see the game but it sounds like it was pretty good.


yea man this is crazy. 15 pages would be like 15 games for us in the Kings forum. :sigh:


----------



## rainman

> Originally posted by <b>Brian</b>!
> Just because you have a better win lose record it doesn't automatically mean that you are the better team. The pistons had a better record than the nets last year but is there any doubt that the nets where the better team? Anyways had the pistons had Rasheed Wallace from the beginning of the year there is no doubt in my mind they would have had the better record.


i think its the general consensus right now that the pistons are playing the best ball in the east. my only concern is can they score enough to beat the elite teams(spurs,lakers,pacers) in a 7 game series. i think defense takes you only so far.


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> 
> 
> yea man this is crazy. 15 pages would be like 15 games for us in the Kings forum. :sigh:


Pacers/Pistons Game Threads are always long. Fans from both teams come in and chat. And usually argue so threads drag on and on, but that's what i love about this game.


----------



## irishfury

I don't care what anyone says meaningless game or not. I was worried about the pistong going 0-4 into the playoffs againts them with them having home court is not good no matter how you look at it...If pacer think it was meaningless it wasn't for me and I know alot of people in detriot thought so...and even J'Oneal Said it was a statement game...though it is nice to see two east teams that can make it a series againt's the west...I don't like the pacers but if they are in the finals againt;s the west I will be pulling for you plus I like Artest...


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> While I have to agree with the comment that the two best players may very well play for the Pacers. We have like 7 out of the next 9 players. Reggie Miller and Harrington are the only guys from the Pacers that are in the next 9 players.


That's for the most part true.

1. Artest
2. O'neal
3. R. Wallace
4. Ben Wallace
5. Harrington
6. R. Hamilton
7. Billups
8. Tinsley
9. Foster
10. R. Miller
11. Prince
12. F. Jones
13. Bender
14. Okur
15. A. Croshere
16. C. Williamson
17. A. Johnson
18. K. Anderson
19. Campbell
20. James
21. Hunter
22. Pollard
23. Ham
24. Brewer
25. Milicic
26. J. Jones
27. Fowlkes (frankly I haven't heard anything or know anything about him)
28. Brezec

This is as of this moment.


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>Tim Lebrach</b>!
> The top-10 players on either team right now:
> 1. J. O'Neal
> 2. Artest
> 3. B. Wallace
> 4. Harrington
> 5. R. Wallace
> 6. Reggie
> 7. Hamilton
> 8. Tinsley
> 9. Foster
> 10. Billups
> 
> and I'll even add in scoring. 10 points for #1, 9 for #2, etc.
> 
> Pacers = 36
> Pistons = 19
> Pacers win *EASILY!*


Now kids, this is your brain on crack!

Now from a sober standpoint

1. Jermaine O'Neal: He can score, rebound and defend. It will be tough finding anyone to disagree with this. *10*

2. Rasheed Wallace: One of the most exciting players to watch in the league. Long as hell and great on defence, a rebounding monstrosity, always hits timely three's and can dunk on anyone. *9*

3. Ron Artest: Excells in a 5th-grader-vs-3rd-grader sort of way. Dribbles like he has never seen a basketball in his life. Who knows how he made the all-star team but he did so he deserves to be this high. *8*

4. Ben Wallace: Didn't play too well today, shooting or rebounding but when focused can grab every board. *7*

5. Richard Hamilton: Reggie Miller but younger and more productive, without the long-range shot. *6*

6. Chauncey Billups: Can turn it on whenever he wants and lead the way on offence. If he felt like it he could dominate, it may not look to smooth or system-oriented but look at the scoreboard and that will answer any questions you may have had.*5*

7. Mehmet Okur: Rebounds, blocks and shoots three's. Can't create his own shot so he is down here. *4*

8. Al Harrington: Hits some timely jumpers but he comes off the bench for a reason. *3*

9. Reggie Miller: He can still shoot *2*

10. Corliss Williamson: An absolute horse in the paint, stronger then almost anyone but not as talented as some. 
*1*

Pistons 32
Pacers 23


----------



## froggyvk

Man I've always thought this was a joke but you guys keep saying it. Tinsley is no where near Billups. Billups could have been an All-Star this year and it wouldn't have been by fluke. Tinsley is....well, his assists are nice.


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>froggyvk</b>!
> Man I've always thought this was a joke but you guys keep saying it. Tinsley is no where near Billups. Billups could have been an All-Star this year and it wouldn't have been by fluke. Tinsley is....well, his assists are nice.


I like the part where the guy says Foster is 9th and Billups 10th! This is a funny movie, where'd'ya get it!?


----------



## PacersguyUSA

Billups did not make the all-star team so your post is null and void.

And I put Billups ahead of Tinsley anyway. 7 > 8


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> Billups did not make the all-star team so your post is null and void.


Neither did LeBron James. Is Jeff Foster better than him?


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>KABI</b>!
> 
> 
> Neither did LeBron James. Is Jeff Foster better than him?


That's not my point. I'm not even saying Tinsley is better than Billups. I'm saying foggy's logic is wrong.

Apparently yours is too.


----------



## fear the fro

I was at the game today, it was a lot of fun and a great victory. Great defense by the Pistons, not a pretty game on the other end but we did win by 18 so can't complain too much. The only thing I was really concerned with was why Larry Brown had the offense running through Ben instead of Rasheed. Why does he insist on posting up Ben instead of Rasheed? Ben is just not a good offensive player. When Ben is shooting 42% on the year that is a sign he is taking too many shots. And I think Rasheed only took two shots the entire first half! The Pistons will not be able to win many games if we treat Ben as our go to guy on offense, we really need to do a better job of getting Rasheed involved. 

This thread got a little out of control...Kind of funny that the one game the Pistons win (and win big) is meaningless. Sorry, no game is meaningless except occaisonally the last game of the season...like last year when the Pistons had nothing to play for and sat Cliffy out. Some of the stuff the Pacers fans said here was ridiculous, I hope there aren't any Pistons fans who do that on other teams' forums.


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> That's not my point. I'm not even saying Tinsley is better than Billups. I'm saying foggy's logic is wrong.
> 
> Apparently yours is too.


Since when is ranking Tinsley seventh to Billups' eigth *not* saying Tinsley is better?


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Dribbles like he has never seen a basketball in his life.


Then why don't the defenders steal it from him when he drives to the lane?


----------



## froggyvk

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> Billups did not make the all-star team so your post is null and void.
> 
> And I put Billups ahead of Tinsley anyway. 7 > 8


*could* 
*have*


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>KABI</b>!
> 
> 
> Since when is ranking Tinsley seventh to Billups' eigth *not* saying Tinsley is better?





> 1. Artest
> 2. O'neal
> 3. R. Wallace
> 4. Ben Wallace
> 5. Harrington
> 6. R. Hamilton
> 7. Billups
> 8. Tinsley


I say it again 7 > 8


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>froggyvk</b>!
> 
> 
> *could*
> *have*


Exactly, so "could have" Tinsley if enough people voted for him.


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> Then why don't the defenders steal it from him when he drives to the lane?


Because he's got the stiffest arm bar in the league seperating the D from the ball. The refs don't call it because they don't want to find a dead animal in their vehicle after the game. Ron Artest is crazy! :krazy:


----------



## froggyvk

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> Exactly, so "could have" Tinsley if enough people voted for him.


:uhoh:


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I say it again 7 > 8


Oh my bad. I read it wrong. lol I stand corrected.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>KABI</b>!
> 
> 
> Because he's got the stiffest arm bar in the league seperating the D from the ball. The refs don't call it because they don't want to find a dead animal in their vehicle after the game. Ron Artest is crazy! :krazy:


Could go under it. That's what I do during games.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>froggyvk</b>!
> 
> 
> :uhoh:


Exactly, you're catching on my son.:clap:


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> 
> 
> Could go under it. That's what I do during games.


Well what are you waiting for, sign this 10-day contract! I am sure you could out defend Lindsey Hunter and Mike James. Welcome aboard! :reporter:


----------



## PacersguyUSA

What I'm saying is it can't just be of his stiff arm cause that's easy to get by. You could even *gast* go from the other side.


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> What I'm saying is it can't just be of his stiff arm cause that's easy to get by. You could even *gast* go from the other side.


Yes, who needs to defend that silly net thing anyway.


----------



## rainman

this thread has rapidly deteriorated, let me ask a serious question.....if darko scored 2pts and had 1 block in two minutes would that mean if he played 30 minutes he would have 30 pts and 15 blocks.....do we know he wouldnt?


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>KABI</b>!
> 
> 
> Yes, who needs to defend that silly net thing anyway.


Pistons double team everybody who get the ball, so you'd think that out of 2 people, someone could get it.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>rainman</b>!
> this thread has rapidly deteriorated, let me ask a serious question.....if darko scored 2pts and had 1 block in two minutes would that mean if he played 30 minutes he would have 30 pts and 15 blocks.....do we know he wouldnt?


It doesn't mean anything. It means he c ould get 30/15 or he could not, which is why the Billups could have been an all-star argument uses flawed logic, which I don't understand why froggy was using it anyway cause I already put Billups ahead of Tinsley.

There's a run on sentence for ya!


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>rainman</b>!
> this thread has rapidly deteriorated, let me ask a serious question.....if darko scored 2pts and had 1 block in two minutes would that mean if he played 30 minutes he would have 30 pts and 15 blocks.....do we know he wouldnt?


I don't know for sure, but I would have to guess he wouldn't have 15 blocks (Elmore Smith did block 17 shots in one game). 30 points is questionable. I mean, I suppose it's possible, but I don't think so. I think he'd be huffing and puffing if he played 30 minutes.


----------



## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>rainman</b>!
> this thread has rapidly deteriorated


Okay man it's your turn to fend off these wacky Pacer fans I need a break.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

At least there aren't personal attacks of peoples' mamas...yet.


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> At least there aren't personal insults....yet.


Possibly, if you start baiting. If not I think everyone will be cool.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

It be a change of pace to get some baiting going on here.


----------



## rainman

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> I don't know for sure, but I would have to guess he wouldn't have 15 blocks (Elmore Smith did block 17 shots in one game). 30 points is questionable. I mean, I suppose it's possible, but I don't think so. I think he'd be huffing and puffing if he played 30 minutes.


i was just adding a little more levity to an overall good day(even the lakers lost). as for darko i dont study his meaningless stats but i think he gets a block about every 8 or 9 minutes. its safe to say that if nothing else he is going to be a premier shot blocker in this league.


----------



## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>rainman</b>!
> 
> 
> i was just adding a little more levity to an overall good day(even the lakers lost). as for darko i dont study his meaningless stats but i think he gets a block about every 8 or 9 minutes. its safe to say that if nothing else he is going to be a premier shot blocker in this league.


:laugh: I know, I was trying to come up with a witty response.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

The Pistons have so many good shot blockers.


----------



## rainman

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> The Pistons have so many good shot blockers.


they've got 5 guys(sheed,ben,edlen,memo,darko)that can stop somebody at the cup. i still worry about scoring though, especially against the spurs or the lakers.


----------



## PacersguyUSA

I don't get why the Pistons have trouble scoring. They've got Sheed, Hamilton, Prince, and *shudder* Okur. I think their problem is that they give it to Big Ben too much on the offensive end.


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>rainman</b>!
> 
> 
> they've got 5 guys(sheed,ben,edlen,memo,darko)that can stop somebody at the cup. i still worry about scoring though, especially against the spurs or the lakers.


If you're speeking about now, i wouldn't list Darko as a name. If Detriot plays Indiana in the playoffs, i highly doubt he will even see a minute.


----------



## rainman

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> If you're speeking about now, i wouldn't list Darko as a name. If Detriot plays Indiana in the playoffs, i highly doubt he will even see a minute.


i doubt darko will play against anyone in the playoffs but i was just pointing out that they have a lot guys on the roster with the length to send a shot back.


----------



## rainman

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> I don't get why the Pistons have trouble scoring. They've got Sheed, Hamilton, Prince, and *shudder* Okur. I think their problem is that they give it to Big Ben too much on the offensive end.


they score enough to get out of the east but teams like those at the top of the western conferance have guys who will score no matter how good the d is. as for okur, i think the lack of respect he gets from the coaches is a negative. the guy is an offensive threat.


----------



## Lynx

Helding Pacers to 32% FG is impressive and thumping stuff from Pistons. 

Only if you guys play great offense as you do defense, then I'd say you're in the list of winning the championship ring along with the Big dogs of Western Conference. I've to admit ever since Sheed came in the Palace, the whole look of Detriot has changed! :yes:


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>rainman</b>!
> 
> 
> they score enough to get out of the east but teams like those at the top of the western conferance have guys who will score no matter how good the d is. as for okur, i think the lack of respect he gets from the coaches is a negative. the guy is an offensive threat.


They do? When's the last time you got out of the East? I don't think you should be making comments like that until you actually prove that scoring that much is enough in the East.


----------



## rainman

> Originally posted by <b>MillerTime</b>!
> 
> 
> They do? When's the last time you got out of the East? I don't think you should be making comments like that until you actually prove that scoring that much is enough in the East.


you mean 89 and 90 dont count? the way the pistons have been playing, holding teams under 70 ppg on several occasions, i guess you could make the argument that scoring 70 per game would be enough.


----------



## MillerTime

> Originally posted by <b>rainman</b>!
> 
> 
> you mean 89 and 90 dont count? the way the pistons have been playing, holding teams under 70 ppg on several occasions, i guess you could make the argument that scoring 70 per game would be enough.


You gotta do it in the playoffs in a 7 game series or else it means nothing. That's just what i am saying. The way you said it is basicially a guarentee that you can score that much and win. 

In two of the other three games, you scored 75 and 69. And no, i don't think that would be enough to get out of the east.


----------



## MLKG

Great game.

To say it was meaningless to the Pacers is kind of silly because it obviously wasn't. Sunday game, national TV, division rivals, and the only tough game left on either teams schedule. To say it didn't mean anything is silly. If it didn't mean anything why did Jermaine play 37 minutes when Rick said he would only play 30 and why did Artest pick up a frustration tech at the end? The Pacers were banged up, but Tinsley's only really played against the Pistons once this year and Bender is yet to step on the court against Detroit, so it's not like those injuries were really anything new when you look at the other games this year.

I had some of my favorite seats. Upper deck, but first row, and directly behind the basket. I love watching games from the elevated up and down view. It's a lot easier to see all the little things that go on like the offensive sets and defensive rotations that you don't notice if you are watching the game side to side like on TV. This is the first time I've been to the Palace since we got Rasheed so I was pretty excited for the game.

Rip is amazing. You really have to watch him play live to appreciate how crazy he plays. The guy never stops running, ever. He is extremely quick and he cuts so fast. He juked Reggie out of his shoes on a couple plays running around without the ball.

It's funny how built up the Rasheed factor was for containing JO as it turned out, Ben was the one who did a fantastic job on him. And it wasn't just because Jermaine was playing hurt. Ben did a great job denying him the ball. O'Neal couldn't get into a rythem because he couldn't get touches. He swiped a couple entry passes and wouldn't let him get the ball anywhere near the paint.

Sheed didn't have a big game in the box score, but he is a very good defender. He never seems to be out of position for anything and can just lock guys down. Plus even on his off-games he commands a lot of defensive attention which forced Indiana to play the guards honestly and Rip was able to blow Reggie up all game.

I was also excited to see Artest live to see what all the fuss is about in terms of his defense. Once again he failed to impress me. Don't get me wrong, he's a great defender, but he's the same defender that he was last year and I really don't think he's distinctly better than guys like Bruce Bowen and Trenton Hassell. He's very good, but it's not like he's Jordan or Rodman. I think it's just a mental thing for guys. Artest gets physical with them and they would just rather pass the ball than deal with it. Tayshaun only took one shot today, but he more or less blew by Artest for a short little hook shot to score. 

His offense on the other hand impressed me a lot. He is very good with his left hand, both shooting and dribbling, and he knows how to use his strength to get inside. He was actually playing point guard for a good period of time in the second half when Indiana's guards were having the hardest time doing even the simples of tasks against the pitbulls, and the only time Indy's offense was really effective all game was when Ron was bringing the ball up the floor.

Best part of the game was after Artest's technical, Rip was at the free throw line getting ready to shoot when Chauncey ran up and took the ball from him and motioned Ben over to shoot it, the Palace exploded when he hit the shot. Something tells me that was Sheed's idea.

On another note, today was the first time I've gotten to see Darko play live. He is huge. He is without a doubt the tallest guy on the team. On the floor I didn't think he looked that bad. He's different from almost every European in that he actually is very physical. He fights hard for his positioning on offense and he's a physical defender as well. I can see where writers were coming from when they talked about his mean streak. If nothing else, he definately isn't soft.


----------



## Slasher

What I've been saying all season long has happened. The Pistons will own the Pacers in the playoffs. Go Pistons!!! :clap:


----------



## Midnight_Marauder

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> What I've been saying all season long has happened. The Pistons will own the Pacers in the playoffs. Go Pistons!!! :clap:




1 win in regular season= Pistons will own Pacers?

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


A little history lesson kid. The Pistons swept the season series with the Nets last year....then the playoffs came around............

I dont really worry about the regular season too much.


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## PacersguyUSA

> Originally posted by <b>Slasher</b>!
> What I've been saying all season long has happened. The Pistons will own the Pacers in the playoffs. Go Pistons!!! :clap:


All season long, you've said "the Detroit Pistons will beat the Indiana Pacers on April 4th 2004." 

What is the point in saying that all season long. I could see maybe at the most saying that a week before.


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## Slasher

> Originally posted by <b>reisedogg</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1 win in regular season= Pistons will own Pacers?
> 
> :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
> 
> 
> A little history lesson kid. The Pistons swept the season series with the Nets last year....then the playoffs came around............
> 
> I dont really worry about the regular season too much.


I don't know if you've been watching the Pistons for the past month kid, but they are one of the, if not the best, defensive teams in the league. On a consistent nightly basis they hold teams under 70 points. 

Since a lot of people compare the Pistons to the Pacers, I've stated my opinion that the Pistons are a better team, and should they meet in the playoffs, my prediction is that the Pistons will take the series.


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## Slasher

Boxscore: http://www.nba.com/games/20040404/INDDET/boxscore.html


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## jvanbusk

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> Great game.
> 
> To say it was meaningless to the Pacers is kind of silly because it obviously wasn't. Sunday game, national TV, division rivals, and the only tough game left on either teams schedule. To say it didn't mean anything is silly. If it didn't mean anything why did Jermaine play 37 minutes when Rick said he would only play 30 and why did Artest pick up a frustration tech at the end? The Pacers were banged up, but Tinsley's only really played against the Pistons once this year and Bender is yet to step on the court against Detroit, so it's not like those injuries were really anything new when you look at the other games this year.
> 
> I had some of my favorite seats. Upper deck, but first row, and directly behind the basket. I love watching games from the elevated up and down view. It's a lot easier to see all the little things that go on like the offensive sets and defensive rotations that you don't notice if you are watching the game side to side like on TV. This is the first time I've been to the Palace since we got Rasheed so I was pretty excited for the game.
> 
> Rip is amazing. You really have to watch him play live to appreciate how crazy he plays. The guy never stops running, ever. He is extremely quick and he cuts so fast. He juked Reggie out of his shoes on a couple plays running around without the ball.
> 
> It's funny how built up the Rasheed factor was for containing JO as it turned out, Ben was the one who did a fantastic job on him. And it wasn't just because Jermaine was playing hurt. Ben did a great job denying him the ball. O'Neal couldn't get into a rythem because he couldn't get touches. He swiped a couple entry passes and wouldn't let him get the ball anywhere near the paint.
> 
> Sheed didn't have a big game in the box score, but he is a very good defender. He never seems to be out of position for anything and can just lock guys down. Plus even on his off-games he commands a lot of defensive attention which forced Indiana to play the guards honestly and Rip was able to blow Reggie up all game.
> 
> I was also excited to see Artest live to see what all the fuss is about in terms of his defense. Once again he failed to impress me. Don't get me wrong, he's a great defender, but he's the same defender that he was last year and I really don't think he's distinctly better than guys like Bruce Bowen and Trenton Hassell. He's very good, but it's not like he's Jordan or Rodman. I think it's just a mental thing for guys. Artest gets physical with them and they would just rather pass the ball than deal with it. Tayshaun only took one shot today, but he more or less blew by Artest for a short little hook shot to score.
> 
> His offense on the other hand impressed me a lot. He is very good with his left hand, both shooting and dribbling, and he knows how to use his strength to get inside. He was actually playing point guard for a good period of time in the second half when Indiana's guards were having the hardest time doing even the simples of tasks against the pitbulls, and the only time Indy's offense was really effective all game was when Ron was bringing the ball up the floor.
> 
> Best part of the game was after Artest's technical, Rip was at the free throw line getting ready to shoot when Chauncey ran up and took the ball from him and motioned Ben over to shoot it, the Palace exploded when he hit the shot. Something tells me that was Sheed's idea.
> 
> On another note, today was the first time I've gotten to see Darko play live. He is huge. He is without a doubt the tallest guy on the team. On the floor I didn't think he looked that bad. He's different from almost every European in that he actually is very physical. He fights hard for his positioning on offense and he's a physical defender as well. I can see where writers were coming from when they talked about his mean streak. If nothing else, he definately isn't soft.


Surprising, I had upper deck behind the basket seats the last time I went and I hated them. Of course that could have been because I was almost all the way at the top. 

How was the atmosphere during the game? When it was still in doubt it seemed a little quieter than I would have expected, but I'm sure it was much louder in person. Seemed like it was the loudest when Darko went to check in.


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## DetBNyce

> "I think the pendulum definitely has swung their way," Reggie Miller said after the Pistons routed his Pacers, 79-61, before a national-television audience and a sellout crowd at The Palace.
> 
> "I know it's only one game,” he said. “But their effort today superseded anything they did previously. *It's a new Pistons team*."


This comment from Reggie Miller sums up my feelings pretty well.

Complete Article


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## froggyvk

I think most of the crowd noise (or lack thereof) was due to ABC drowning out the crowd. The "We Want Darko" chants are never that soft, and they especially wouldn't be with a crowd for an Indiana game.


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## Brian.

Some quotes from todays game

LB



> “(Defensively) we were good. The first quarter, I thought we played great. We had some turnovers where guys were trying to do things right. I think our ‘D’ keyed everything. I didn’t expect some of their (Indiana’s) starters to play as much, but that made me feel good. He’s (Elden Campbell) what our game is supposed to be like. People like Darvin Ham, Elden, Lindsey Hunter, they’re pros, they haven’t been given anything. He respects every minute he gets. I think when Joe (Dumars) signed him the whole point was that, come playoff time, you have a presence inside and a veteran guy. The more opportunities he (Ben Wallace) has in pressure situations, the better it is for us. I’m confident that he’ll make it (foul shot) when it matters."


Rick Carlisle



> “The Pistons are a great defensive team, and that’s no secret. We had some opportunities but you just have to give them credit for just playing a great game. We could have been a lot better offensively but they had a lot to do with our struggles. This is a completely different team (with Rasheed Wallace) , and along with Lindsey Hunter and James (Mike) they also have a strong second defensive backcourt. I’m hoping that we’ll get in position to have an opportunity to get to play them again, and that of course will mean we will have done well in the playoffs to get to that point. We have a long road to travel before we can even think about a third round playoff series.”


Jeff Foster



> “They are a very different team now. Obviously what they’ve done defensively over the last third of the season has been very impressive. We clearly struggled tonight offensively against one of the best teams in the NBA since that trade, and they proved that tonight.”


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## MLKG

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Surprising, I had upper deck behind the basket seats the last time I went and I hated them. Of course that could have been because I was almost all the way at the top.
> 
> How was the atmosphere during the game? When it was still in doubt it seemed a little quieter than I would have expected, but I'm sure it was much louder in person. Seemed like it was the loudest when Darko went to check in.


Yeah I've had behind the basket seats closer to the top before and I didn't like that much, but the first row up top really isn't that high. I've never really had that great of seats, but I would rather be behind the basket than at an angle in a corner seat.

I thought there was more crowd noise than usual, but it wasn't like a playoff game or anything. It was really noisy at the start, but kind of cooled down as it was a pretty sloppy offensive game, not a lot of plays to get real excited about with all the missed dunks and blown fast breaks. The crowd was on Artest constantly, chearing all his fouls and booing everything he did, expecially the tech at the end. But it was a low scoring game and their weren't a lot of runs, but when their were I didnt' think the crowd was bad, like it got pretty noisy in the 4th when Rip went off scoring or assisting on like 10 or 12 straight points.


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## Brian.

I think that if the pistons play the pacers in the ECF LB should think about some lineup changes. Prince has never done a damn thing against the pacers. Artest completely shuts him down and Prince can't guard him in the post. This is the lineup I would use

Okur/Campbell
B. Wallace/Williamson
R. Wallace/prince
Rip/James
Billups/Hunter

Rasheed can handle artest on defense and on the offensive side he is too big for artest to handle.


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## Brian.

My favorite picture from the game 












> Ron Artest sits on the bench with a towel over his head in the closing moments of the Pacers' loss to the Pistons. -- Paul Sancya / Associated Press


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## MLKG

> Originally posted by <b>Brian</b>!


That seems to happen a lot to guys we play.


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## nmuman

> Originally posted by <b>Tim Lebrach</b>!
> So if anything, the Pacers are flat-out better than the Pistons.


How do you figure? I see us beating the Pacers in 5 maybe 6 games now that we have Sheed.


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## Slasher

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> 
> 
> That seems to happen a lot to guys we play.


:laugh: true true......


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## PacersguyUSA

I've sat behind the basket in the highest part of the ground level section in a Pacers-Mavs game, and it was alright but the best is center court at club or closest balcony.


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## R-Star

Sorry for missing out on the thread guys. I've been pretty busy these days. I didnt get to catch the game, but it looks like you guys handed it to us pretty good. Am I worried? Yea, a little. Rasheed seems to have made you guys into a whole new threat. His stats didnt look overly impressive, but I didnt get to see the game so Im under the impression he played some real nice D and did alot of the little things. 

We havnt been the same team with Tinsley out, and have dropped a few we could have won with him running the point. I think we're going to meet in the finals, and it should be one of, if not the most interesting series of this year.

And to those who think either team can make it out in 4-5 games relatively unscathed, you need to pull the wool off your eyes and see just how close these two squads are.


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## Lope31

> Originally posted by <b>R-Star</b>!
> 
> We havnt been the same team with Tinsley out, and have dropped a few we could have won with him running the point.


You are not the first person to say this. Since when is Tinsley an integral part of this team? He was out for a bunch at the beginning of the season wasn't he? Why was that? How come all of a sudden you can't win without him? Either I have missed something regarding his re-emergence (which is a definite possibility) or I smell an...Excuse?


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## R-Star

> Originally posted by <b>KABI</b>!
> 
> 
> You are not the first person to say this. Since when is Tinsley an integral part of this team? He was out for a bunch at the beginning of the season wasn't he? Why was that? How come all of a sudden you can't win without him? Either I have missed something regarding his re-emergence (which is a definite possibility) or I smell an...Excuse?


I can understand why alot of people think its an excuse and that Tinsley doesnt realy make much of a difference. However, anyone whos watched alot of Pacer games now's that when he came back, the team flowed different, the ball was moved around better, and the team just all in all got a huge surge. Without Tinsley running the point, ball movement is sluggish and fast breaks are nonexsistant. 

I know alot of people dont like to belive us Pacer die hards when we say this, but its the truth. Tinsley is one of our key players. We realy suffer without him.


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