# NBA: Christians vs. Muslims



## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

This is a spinoff of the "Howard: Mission from God thread." How do the players of different faiths fare in the NBA? Let's take a look.



> Originally posted by <b>Max Payne</b>!
> 
> 
> Are you implying that all Muslims are militant and merciless killers ?


Not at all. 

What I meant was, you just don't find devout Christians that lead teams to NBA championships. However, there are a couple star muslims, off the top of my head, that have led their team to the "promise land."

Christians in the NBA: *David Robinson*, *Allan Houston*, *Richard Jefferson*, A.C. Green, Jake Voskuhl, Avery Johnson, Chris Kaman, Derek Fisher, Lawrence Funderburke, Monty Williams.

Muslims in the NBA: *Kareem Abdul-Jabbar*, *Hakeem Olajuwon*, *Shareef Abdur-Rahim*, *Larry Johnson *, Mohammed Abdul-Rauf, Nazr Mohammed, Tariq Abdul-Wahad, Mamadou N'Diaye, Khalid El-Amin.

You look at the quality of players overall, and the majority of the Christians are role-players, save for Robinson. Houston is a great shooter, but that's about all he does - he has provent that he was vastly overpaid w/ that $100m contract of his. Jefferson is a good player, but he's not going to lead a team anywhere; he's a perfect complimentary player.

Now you look at the Muslims, and right in front you see two of the greatest of all time: Kareem and Hakeem. Shareef and LJ both had strong, dominant personalities, but did not (or haven't yet) led their team to a title. If you remember Abdul-Rauf (a.k.a. Chris Jackson, former Nuggets PG), he had that same personality, capable of leading his team.

What I'm getting at, is that if you look at the Christian players vs. the Muslim players, the Muslims have produced more leaders.

W/ Dwight Howard proclaiming his strong faith in Christianity, it begs the question, will he be able to lead? 

Will Dwight suffer the same fate as David Robinson, put up huge numbers and lead his team to the playoffs each year, just to fall short?

I would venture to say that Dwight will ever lead an NBA team to a championship w/ that level of Christian faith.


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## Max Payne (Mar 2, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>RebelSun</b>!
> 
> I would venture to say that Dwight will ever lead an NBA team to a championship w/ that level of Christian faith.


 Hey man, great post, one topic that I had never thought about really. I think you meant to say that Dwight will never lead his team to a championship right ? Just checking.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

*Re: Re: NBA: Christians vs. Muslims*



> Originally posted by <b>Max Payne</b>!
> 
> 
> Hey man, great post, one topic that I had never thought about really. I think you meant to say that Dwight will never lead his team to a championship right ? Just checking.


Thanks Payne.

I guess that last statement was a little specific, but my point was, that as long as he is an active Christian, I seriously doubt he will lead his team to an NBA title.


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## takeanumber3333 (Apr 18, 2004)

Why is that? Faith has nothin to do with your ability level, other than thats what God gave you. Im a pentacostal and I can tell you, there are some very loud and agressive Christians.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>takeanumber3333</b>!
> Why is that? Faith has nothin to do with your ability level, other than thats what God gave you. Im a pentacostal and I can tell you, there are some very loud and agressive Christians.


I'm just looking at the facts, man. There hasn't really been an aggressive, Christian NBA superstar that has led his team to the title.

I have nothing against the kid or Christianity. I hope he proves me wrong; I wish nothing but the best for him.

I'm just trying to provide what history says about Christian leaders in the NBA, that's all.


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## Snicka (Dec 29, 2003)

I'm not sure why, but I find this a little offensive. The kid's religion is of no impact on how he will play.

But I guess he needs to convert if he has any hope of a title.

Give me a break.


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## jmk (Jun 30, 2002)

> Jefferson is a good player, but he's not going to lead a team anywhere; he's a perfect complimentary player.


I am not even going to get into this comment, considering that I would have to go off on you for making a pretty foolish comment about a team you probably never see play.


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## jmk (Jun 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Snicka</b>!
> I'm not sure why, but I find this a little offensive. The kid's religion is of no impact on how he will play.
> 
> But I guess he needs to convert if he has any hope of a title.
> ...


I totally agree. Who cares what a player's religion is? It's not going to affect the way he plays.

Also RebelSun, I have trouble thinking that that short list you gave has all the NBA's Christian players. I'm guessing most of the players or atheist or Jewish then?:uhoh:


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jmk</b>!
> 
> 
> I am not even going to get into this comment, considering that I would have to go off on you for making a pretty foolish comment about a team you probably never see play.


I've seen NJ play often, and I watched RJ play at Arizona. I seriously question if he has the mentality to be a leader and want to dominate his opponent, not because of the fact that he is Christian, but as an individual.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jmk</b>!
> 
> 
> I totally agree. Who cares what a player's religion is? It's not going to affect the way he plays.
> ...


How about agnostic?


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## jmk (Jun 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>RebelSun</b>!
> 
> 
> I've seen NJ play often, and I watched RJ play at Arizona. I seriously question if he has the mentality to be a leader and want to dominate his opponent, not because of the fact that he is Christian, but as an individual.


Those comments show me that you don't watch the Nets often. Ask any NJ fan or someone that consistently sees the Nets, and they will say the total opposite of what you're saying. RJ has one of the biggest wills to win and improve in all of sports. I think you might be the only person that questions his mentality. RJ has one of the best work ethics and will to win in the league.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jmk</b>!
> 
> 
> Those comments show me that you don't watch the Nets often. Ask any NJ or someone that consistently sees the Nets, and they will say the total opposite of what you're saying. RJ has one of the biggest wills to win and improve in all of sports. I think you might be the only person that questions his mentality. RJ has one of the best work ethics and will to win in the league.


Maybe I have underestimated his drive, but the issue we were talking about is the ability to *lead*. No doubt RJ is a fine player, and has improved a great deal since entering the league. However, the question I offer, is can he lead a team. Can Richard Jefferson carry a team on his back to a title? 

Again, don't get me wrong, I have nothing against him or Christianity, I'm just stating what the history of the NBA has provided. I hope he, and Dwight Howard, prove me wrong.


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## :TorontoRaptors: (May 25, 2003)

FYI, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Larry Johnson were converts to Islam.

They both grew up in Christian environments.


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## bruno34115 (Apr 14, 2003)

Are you trying to tell me that there are only 10 christians in NBA history?


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## Yao Mania (Aug 4, 2003)

Everyone should convert to confuciusism like Yao, imagine how friendly the league will be :angel:


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## sov82 (Nov 5, 2003)

*Please*

I nominate this thread to be the most worthless thread of all-time.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

*Re: Please*



> Originally posted by <b>sov82</b>!
> I nominate this thread to be the most worthless thread of all-time.


Can I ask why?


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## Cam*Ron (Apr 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>RebelSun</b>!
> 
> 
> I'm just looking at the facts, man. There hasn't really been an aggressive, Christian NBA superstar that has led his team to the title.
> ...


How do you know that Shaq, Jordan, Bill Russell, etc aren't Christians?


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## Cam*Ron (Apr 13, 2003)

*Re: Re: Please*



> Originally posted by <b>RebelSun</b>!
> 
> 
> Can I ask why?


Come on, you gotta agree that this is pretty worthless.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Bunk 040</b>!
> How do you know that Shaq, Jordan, Bill Russell, etc aren't Christians?


Well, I'm just looking at guys that are open w/ their faith. If they are really proud of their faith, why not proclaim it?




> Originally posted by <b>Bunk 040</b>!
> Come on, you gotta agree that this is pretty worthless.


I'm not saying that Muslims are better than Christians, or that Christians can't lead.

All I'm saying is that history has provided that Christian stars have not had the same success as Muslims in regard to leading their teams to an NBA title. Nothing more.

I'm not saying this is the truth, but in the (relatively) recent NBA, it hasn't proven otherwise.

If anyone has any evidence to contradict these statements, I would very much like to see it, and if so, I'll change my opinion.


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## sov82 (Nov 5, 2003)

*Hi*

RebelSun

How about this? You call every NBA player that ever played the game. Ask them their religion. Ask them how seriously they practice their religion. Then run a regression comparing the stats to the religion and you tell me what that says. 

Thanks.


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## sov82 (Nov 5, 2003)

"Well, I'm just looking at guys that are open w/ their faith. If they are really proud of their faith, why not proclaim it?"


Not everyone cares to "proclaim" their religion. Some people actually enjoy privacy...especially for deeply personal things such as Family and Religion.


No more replies from me in this worthless thread.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

*Re: Hi*



> Originally posted by <b>sov82</b>!
> RebelSun
> 
> How about this? You call every NBA player that ever played the game. Ask them their religion. Ask them how seriously they practice their religion. Then run a regression comparing the stats to the religion and you tell me what that says.
> ...


That would be the test. Although I wouldn't have to call every player. If you'd read, you'd notice we're talking about only the leader of a championship team.

Maybe I will check that out.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>sov82</b>!
> "Well, I'm just looking at guys that are open w/ their faith. If they are really proud of their faith, why not proclaim it?"
> 
> 
> ...


If you fully embrace your religion, wouldn't you be proud of it? Why would you keep it a secret?


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## Cam*Ron (Apr 13, 2003)

*If you fully embrace your religion, wouldn't you be proud of it? Why would you keep it a secret? *


RebelSun, I'm sure you're a cool dude, just realize that this thread doesn't point out much and leave it at that.


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## Zach (May 11, 2003)

Hakeem is Muslim? I thought he just had an African name.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Akeem Olajuwon became Hakeem Olajuwon when he converted to Islam.

Shaquille O'Neal is also a Muslim by faith.

Kobe is a Christian. Could that be why they don't like each other? :uhoh: 


No Jewish superstars because they are all the ones who own the teams. Aint that right commissioner Stern?.. 

This thread is funny.

Oh and you can't leave out Charlie Ward. He said some anti-semitic stuff about Jews a few years back when he was playing for the Knicks. I don't know if there is a bigger Christian in the league than him.


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## sactownflava (Mar 22, 2004)

This is the most worthless thread ever. Rebel Sun that list you made up contains less than 1% of the Christian basketball players in the NBA. Many african american NBA stars are indeed christians. Many just dont proclaim their faith as much as David Robinson. You dont have a point. You dont have facts. Just go back to the gutter you came from.


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## Max Payne (Mar 2, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>sactownflava</b>!
> This is the most worthless thread ever. Rebel Sun that list you made up contains less than 1% of the Christian basketball players in the NBA. Many african american NBA stars are indeed christians. Many just dont proclaim their faith as much as David Robinson. You dont have a point. You dont have facts. Just go back to the gutter you came from.



That last comment was completely uncalled for. Rebelsun was trying to make a statement about players that are very OPEN about their faith. Maybe you should back to kindergarten where you can learn to read correctly.


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## takeanumber3333 (Apr 18, 2004)

This is not a worthless thread, you just dont care about the subject. Some of us would like to discuss it. Why even post in a thread you feel is usless?


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>sactownflava</b>!
> Just go back to the gutter you came from.


Do you really mean that? Yikes dude.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

Bottom line, it seemed like an interesting question to me, to see correlation between religion and level of player.

I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone, if I did, I apologize.

Trying to prove this would be pretty difficult. The idea that type of religion maybe somehow limited their success intrigued me, but I wouldn't say its true. It may have some effect, but you certainly can't say, because you are Christian, you cannot lead your team to a title, because I found some examples.

I found a website, christianitytoday.com, that lists lots of active Christian athletes.

ChristianityToday.com 

The best case to contradict this hypothesis is Kurt Warner. The guy is a devout Christian, and he was the leader of the Rams championship team. Also, they mention Jeff Gordon, of NASCAR fame, is a Christian.

So obviously, a devout Christian is capable of leading his team to a title. I know many of you think I sound rediculous w/ these statements, but I just wanted to find some examples. I'm not on a crusade to discredit the leadership abilities of Christians, I just wanted some evidence, that's all.

W/ that being said, I will now do you guys a favor and shut up about it.  

BTW, I didn't mean for this thread to turn hostile in any way. If I was ever out of line, I apologize. However, I don't think I ever made any direct, insulting comments to anyone, and didn't think any towards me were warranted. I keep my comments civil; I would hope for the same in return.


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## Kmasonbx (Apr 7, 2003)

I think the difference is between the devout Christians and Muslims, are many muslims switch over their faith halfway throught their life. The Christians have been Christians their entire life, Olajuwon and Abdur-Rahim are the only real stars who are muslim, Kareem was Lew Alcindor at the start of his pro career, Larry Johnson didn't become Muslim until he was basicaly finished as a player. 

Thats the main difference in religion producing more stars, many players of the Muslim faith didn't start out as Muslims. I mean like at Mahmoud-Abdul Raulf, he was a borderline star as Chris Jackson, same with Brian Williams before he became Bison Dele. Christianity isn't really a crossover religion, if your brought up a Christian you stay it, if not people rarely switch, unlike Muslims. Don't know if there is any correlation but it's just another way of looking at it.


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## benfica (Jul 17, 2002)

*Ticks me off*

That we keep losing so many good Black Christians to Muslims, which creates a larger pool for Terrorists to recruit from. Hakeem
seem more Christian like though, if only all Muslims were like Hakeem.


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## AMR (Oct 5, 2003)

*Re: Ticks me off*



> Originally posted by <b>benfica</b>!
> That we keep losing so many good Black Christians to Muslims, which creates a larger pool for Terrorists to recruit from.


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## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

*Re: Ticks me off*



> Originally posted by <b>benfica</b>!
> That we keep losing so many good Black Christians to Muslims, which creates a larger pool for Terrorists to recruit from. Hakeem
> seem more Christian like though, if only all Muslims were like Hakeem.


:krazy: Whoa.


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## Rockstone (Jan 21, 2004)

*Re: Ticks me off*



> Originally posted by <b>benfica</b>!
> That we keep losing so many good Black Christians to Muslims, which creates a larger pool for Terrorists to recruit from. Hakeem
> seem more Christian like though, if only all Muslims were like Hakeem.


Your comments here are so inappropriate. It hurts me to see so-called "Christians" behave this way. 

I would like to apologize to any Muslims on benfica' s behalf. Please do not get the impression that all Christian minds are as warped as his.

There are "good" and "bad" people from every religion, race and nation. Although I don't believe any person is actually "bad". (PM me if you have any questions about that opinion.)

In response to the topic of this thread...

Rebelsun's point is valid. Unfortunately, an open, devout Christian has yet to lead a team to a title. David Robinson didn't lead the Spurs to a championship.

Hakeem and Kareem have done it.

However, I personally don't think Dwight Howard's faith will make him any less of a leader, winner or competitor. I respect Dwight for his open proclamation. I hope that he maintains his integrity throughout his career and achieves great success.

P.S. The essence of Christianity is not that we're perfect, but that we acknowledge our imperfection.


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## Tristan (Jan 13, 2003)

Also btw, Antawn Jamison, Kobe, Tmac and Tim Duncan are also christians



> Originally posted by <b>Bunk 040</b>!
> How do you know that Shaq, Jordan, Bill Russell, etc aren't Christians?


Because if they were they wouldn't cuss at the tv or play their wives.

Anywho, people think Christianity is only believing that Jesus did die on the cross. Thats not what its all about....
Like Rockstone said "The essence of Christianity is not that we're perfect, but that we acknowledge our imperfection." and to love other people as much as God/Jesus loves you.

Why do you guys think that Dwight Howard can never make the nba finals? His religion shouldnt affect his ability and how he plays. 

Like Rockstone said "The essence of Christianity is not that we're perfect, but that we acknowledge our imperfection."

Over all, this thread is not pointless at all by any chance. Rebel wanted to know the opinion of the people, whats wrong with that?


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## Tristan (Jan 13, 2003)

Oh and BTw, Lebron James just thanks "The Lord Jesus Christ above" at the awards ceremony. Much props Lebron.:yes:


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## Kmasonbx (Apr 7, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Tristan</b>!
> Oh and BTw, Lebron James just thanks "The Lord Jesus Christ above" at the awards ceremony. Much props Lebron.:yes:


That doesn't mean much, that is basically the fashionable thing to do. When rappers win awards they thank God, eventhough in some of their songs they rap about killing.


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## OG (Aug 12, 2003)

I don't think it's so weird that LeBron thanked "The Lord Jesus Christ above" considering he went to St. Vincent-St. Mary - a Catholic School. That would suggest a very religious upbringing.

I'll stay away from this whole topic though, religion, racism, categorizing of any kind it's hard to draw a line about others. Only they can tell you, which I think is what RebelSun was going by (players open about their religion).


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>OG</b>!
> I don't think it's so weird that LeBron thanked "The Lord Jesus Christ above" considering he went to St. Vincent-St. Mary - a Catholic School. That would suggest a very religious upbringing.


Not necessarily, dude. I went to a Cathloic HS, and I am not religious.


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## hasoos (Jan 3, 2003)

*What does it matter*

Organized religeon is the basis for most of the wars in history, and now you want to start another one on the athletic playing field? Can't you people leave enough alone?


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## Rockstone (Jan 21, 2004)

*Re: What does it matter*



> Originally posted by <b>hasoos</b>!
> Organized religeon is the basis for most of the wars in history, and now you want to start another one on the athletic playing field? Can't you people leave enough alone?


You are mistaken. There is no war being started here. Just thought-provoking discussion.


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## takeanumber3333 (Apr 18, 2004)

> When rappers win awards they thank God, eventhough in some of their songs they rap about killing.


Yes but Lebron thanked the Lord Jesus Christ, which is saying a lot about faith as well. 

I was also in a Cathloic grade school as wasent really a Christian, but after i started goin to church and a Christian HS i have really grow and am now a real Christian.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Tristan</b>!
> Also btw, Antawn Jamison, *Kobe*, Tmac and Tim Duncan are also christians


I missed the part in the bible where it condones choking females during sex.


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## cherokeejack (Jun 29, 2003)

If you were to ask I would bet many NBA players would identify themselves as christians. This does not make them devout, which is what we are talking about. Most do not actively try to live a "Christian life". 

It is important to not that neither Abdul-Jabbar, Olajuwan, nor Robinson were serious in their religion to start their career. Olajuwan and Robinson were both born into their religion but neither was devout until he had already been in the NBA for a while. Abdul-Jabbar converted after years as Lew Alcindor. 

Abdul Jabbar was one of the most dominating college players ever and did not become magically better when he became a Muslim. Robinson didn't suddenly lose his game when he was "born-again", he was never the best center in the league even when he was a marginal Christian. I don't remember if Olajuwan rededicating himself to his religion led to his improvement as a player but even if it was, I think that improvement had more to do with an overall focusing of his life rather than any significant religious idea.

The problem with this question is that we only talking about three truly great players and in this case I would say it comes down to the two Muslim players just having different personalities, experiences, and talent than the Christian player. I don't think their differing religions had anything to do with their career paths. Even if they hadn't found religion I that they would have had similar trajectories as they did with it.


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## Tristan (Jan 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>RebelSun</b>!
> 
> 
> I missed the part in the bible where it condones choking females during sex.


You also missed the part where it says God forgives.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Tristan</b>!
> 
> 
> You also missed the part where it says God forgives.


Does God forgive everything?


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## KokoTheMonkey (Aug 4, 2003)

What? 



What kind of thread is this? You have got to be freakin kidding me. 



Since you are a Christian basketball player, you will not lead your team to a NBA championship. Sounds good to me. Actually, it doesn't. It's one of the most absurd ideas I've ever read, and I'm not even an extremely religious either. 



You mentoned David Robinson. Yeah, what a shame. His Christian faith only lead him to two NBA championships, and to one helluva career. Maybe if Robinson was Muslim, he would have been the modern-day Wilt Chamberlin. 


I'm sorry, but unless this is some sort of tacky joke, this is a terrible thread. I don't see anything productive coming from this at all. Unless you want to do a thorough investigation on this topic, this is absurd.


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## Rockstone (Jan 21, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>RebelSun</b>!
> 
> 
> Does God forgive everything?


Yes. :yes: 

.....as long as we are sincerely apologetic


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## AranhaHunter (Nov 28, 2003)

I think it's pretty obvious that Lebron is Christian by the way he talks. I dont think he goes to church every Sunday and is an Admiral type of Christian, but I'm pretty sure he's christian.

This is the worst thread in the history of message boards.

People have already said that Jabbar converted, and so did Hakeem, and the Admiral was born again after he entered the league. Those are the only superstars to have ever really come out and preach their faith.

By your rationale, the best athletes in sports are the christians, muslims whatever that don't practice the religion much. People such as MJ, Magic, Larry, Shaq, Kobe, TMac, TD, KG, JKidd, Isiah, Will Chamberlain, Bill Russell, Jerry West, etc........and if we go to a bigger scene and say sports, not basketball, we can include Pele, Maradona, Ronaldo, Zidane, ARod, Bonds, Pedro, Rocket, Schilling, Pujols, DiMaggio, Babe, Ray Lewis, Urlacher, Vick, McNabb, Sapp, Rice, Bailey, Payton, Emmit Smith etc.......

So again, by your rationale, the big winners are the people that don't practice much religion, which, surprise surprise it's the majority of the people in the world. I would guess 90% of the people in the world.

This thread sucks ***.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>AranhaHunter</b>!
> I think it's pretty obvious that Lebron is Christian by the way he talks. I dont think he goes to church every Sunday and is an Admiral type of Christian, but I'm pretty sure he's christian.
> 
> This is the worst thread in the history of message boards.
> ...


:no:

For the umpteenth time...

All I was getting at is that an openly devout Christian has never lead his team to an NBA championship.

BTW, if you had read the entire thread, you would notice that I had discovered instances of leaders of championship teams in other sports, who happen to be devout Christians, but failed to find one for the NBA.

I wasn't implying that Christians can't lead or that NBA players should be agnostic.

Read the whole thread before shooting off at the mouth.


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## butr (Mar 23, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Rockstone</b>!
> 
> 
> Yes. :yes:
> ...


"I'm so sorry I raped then murdered that little girl Lord. Let me come to live in eternal heaven with you and that girl I terrorised."

Now that is a just God!!


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## Sikatrix (May 8, 2003)

This thread does not belong in this forum


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## Rockstone (Jan 21, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>blowuptheraptors</b>!
> 
> 
> "I'm so sorry I raped then murdered that little girl Lord. Let me come to live in eternal heaven with you and that girl I terrorised."
> ...


Isn't God good?


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## AranhaHunter (Nov 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>RebelSun</b>!
> 
> 
> :no:
> ...



Don't be pissed at me cause you started the most insignificant thread ever. 

This thread is garbage and sucks and you swallow.


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## Tristan (Jan 13, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>blowuptheraptors</b>!
> 
> 
> "I'm so sorry I raped then murdered that little girl Lord. Let me come to live in eternal heaven with you and that girl I terrorised."
> ...


Thats the spirit!


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## mysterio (May 20, 2003)

RebelSun, I usually find myself agreeing with most of your posts, but when I checked the seed post on this thread, what was totally wrong was saying Dwight's chance of being a championship team leader is doubtful because he is a devout and open Christian. Yes you can say it hasn't happened before, but to use that as predictive evidence is a stretch... As for God forgiving everything? As long as you are sincere and intend never to repeat your sins, Christians say yes, and Muslims say yes, except that God will not forgive the worship of other Gods or associating any partners with him. That is why Muslims say Jesus was a messenger and only a man, not a God.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>AranhaHunter</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


More eloquence. :no:


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>mysterio</b>!
> RebelSun, I usually find myself agreeing with most of your posts, but when I checked the seed post on this thread, what was totally wrong was saying Dwight's chance of being a championship team leader is doubtful because he is a devout and open Christian. Yes you can say it hasn't happened before, but to use that as predictive evidence is a stretch... As for God forgiving everything? As long as you are sincere and intend never to repeat your sins, Christians say yes, and Muslims say yes, except that God will not forgive the worship of other Gods or associating any partners with him. That is why Muslims say Jesus was a messenger and only a man, not a God.


In retrospect, I may have overshot my statements. All I was getting at is that it seems to almost be a detriment to be Christian in terms of being a successful leader in the league. 

Regardless of any statistics, the NBA (or any pro sport for that matter, but especially the NBA) is not the most morally refined atmosphere, and (you would think) this would likely make a devout Christian somewhat uncomfortable.

I sincerely wish Dwight all the success in the world. I think it will definitely be a challenge w/ his faith going into the world he is about to enter.


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## Rockstone (Jan 21, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>RebelSun</b>!
> 
> Regardless of any statistics, the NBA (or any pro sport for that matter, but especially the NBA) is not the most morally refined atmosphere, and (you would think) this would likely make a devout Christian somewhat uncomfortable.


You got that right.



> I sincerely wish Dwight all the success in the world. I think it will definitely be a challenge w/ his faith going into the world he is about to enter.


It'll absolutely be a great challenge for him.  I too hope that he can stand up to the tests of the life he's about to enter.


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