# Time to trade Iverson?



## TomDeFiore (Aug 31, 2005)

I personally think it is time that Allen Iverson be traded. I know a lot of people may disagree with me, but you have to ask yourself will Iverson ever win a title? I don’t think anyone can honestly answer yes, and that’s the goal obviously for any NBA team. Let’s look at some stats. He averaged 24.24 shots per game, 7.9 assists per game, and 4.59 assists per game. So that is on average 36.73 possessions that on average begin and end with Iverson. I think that is entirely too many. His field goal percentage is not that good (42.4%) and is assist to turnover ratio is not that good (1.72). He claims to care about winning, yet he never volunteers to take a pay cut, or does any recruiting, such as talking to Michael Finley. Now maybe the team may take a step or two backwards, but I think that would be fine, because I don’t think with Iverson we will win a championship. 

Another reason why I think we should trade him is his durability. Now I know he is tough, but he is a little guy who gets banged around a lot. It’s beginning to take its toll. You can see it by the fact he’s been missing more and more games every year. He may not have that much time left. We should trade while he still has a little value.

Now, what should we trade for him? I’m not really sure, it wouldn’t have to be that much in my opinion. Somebody or some pick of any value. We can’t get that much for him. Because it seems to be quite obvious that nobody really wants him. Teams aren’t exactly breaking down the door with offers. So it would hard for me to say what we should trade for when I’m not sure what other teams are willing to offer. As I said before the trade may hurt us in the short-run but to have any chance of winning a championship in within the next couple of years, I think it is something that needs to be done.


My opinion has nothing to do with him being perceived as a thug, or supposed bad attitude or anything like. It is strictly based by what goes on, on the court . This is all of course assuming Iverson doesn’t change his ways, which I don’t think he will. Also this is just my opinion everyone is free to disagree with it, I’m just trying to express my views, for others to view, and express there own opinions.


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## musiclexer (Aug 30, 2005)

sadly I have to agree

We could use a young Big man

a trade like AI for Darko and Rip

iunno its a possiblity


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

TomDeFiore said:


> I personally think it is time that Allen Iverson be traded. I know a lot of people may disagree with me,



STRONGLY DISAGREE








TomDeFiore said:


> but you have to ask yourself will Iverson ever win a title?


Yes Yes YES he will win a championship be4 his career is over now I dont have the power to show the future as no one else can so all I can offer to back that is saying just watch see eventually the Sixers with IVERSON will win a championship weve already got close with him so just wait



And as for giving Iverson for Darko and RIP no offense but that just made me SICK and very dissapointing to think that if we ever did trade him which we never should that, that is all you think he is worth 


One last thing i would like to say is that when i first found this site i was excited being a big sixers fan that i am that i would have this forum to share that intrest and get excited about this upcoming season but lately all I see in this forum is negative thoughts and little hope where is the positive outlook? This is very depressing this being the SIXERS own forum yall can keep up the criticisim but as for me **** im ready for the ship this year ......looking for Iverson to have another Scoring Title year......Ready for Iggys D to step above even a level higher then it was last year and for him to develop some mid range shooting ........Im looking for Korver to be ready to make an impact in the playoffs instead of fading off in the background.....Thinking its Sammys year to show hes not a kid anymore.........And YES i am saying this im expecting WEBBER to come back and show he still can play the game and shoot and make a big impact for us next year

with that being said LETS GO SIXERS


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## musiclexer (Aug 30, 2005)

Rip is a great addition by hisself along with Darko


I like that deal we're actually getting the advantage.

none the less Im very happy with A.I performance over the past 5 seasons I have been a Sixers fans.

I do belive we can make it to the finals with this rosters

Im very excited about the addition of Stephen Hunter he'll be big for us this year I can feel it.


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

musiclexer said:


> Im very excited about the addition of Stephen Hunter he'll be big for us this year I can feel it.


I agree man just think when Jackson came off the bench helping us Hunter coming will be a lot better


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## musiclexer (Aug 30, 2005)

yeah and the best thing about him is hes a 7-0


we haven't had a 7-0 since Mutombo


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

musiclexer said:


> we haven't had a 7-0 since Mutombo


Yah and everyone knows where we went when we had a Mutombo :banana:


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## Sliccat (Oct 16, 2004)

Nope. Will AI win a title with the sixers? Probably not. Will the sixers win a title during the next 5 years(approx. AI's career span) if they trade AI? No. At least with AI theres(a very little) hope.


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## Ras (Jul 25, 2005)

TomDeFiore said:


> I personally think it is time that Allen Iverson be traded. I know a lot of people may disagree with me, but you have to ask yourself will Iverson ever win a title? I don’t think anyone can honestly answer yes, and that’s the goal obviously for any NBA team. Let’s look at some stats. He averaged 24.24 shots per game, 7.9 assists per game, and 4.59 assists per game. So that is on average 36.73 possessions that on average begin and end with Iverson. I think that is entirely too many. His field goal percentage is not that good (42.4%) and is assist to turnover ratio is not that good (1.72). He claims to care about winning, yet he never volunteers to take a pay cut, or does any recruiting, such as talking to Michael Finley. Now maybe the team may take a step or two backwards, but I think that would be fine, because I don’t think with Iverson we will win a championship.


I once again, refer someone to this thread. Click here. 



> Another reason why I think we should trade him is his durability. Now I know he is tough, but he is a little guy who gets banged around a lot. It’s beginning to take its toll. You can see it by the fact he’s been missing more and more games every year. He may not have that much time left. We should trade while he still has a little value.


Ignorance angers me, and plenty of people are ignorant about this topic; they speak out, but don't know the facts. Since when is Iverson's play "taking its tole"? He isn't missing more and more games every year, in fact, he's played over 70 games every year of his career except for 3 seasons; and only two were because of injury. Iverson isn't very injury prone like he's made out to be. If you take out that one really bad *03-04* season (and the lock-out season), he averages 73 games played each season for his career, and he played 75 last season, and 82 in *02-03*.


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## joshed_up (Aug 6, 2005)

Ras said:


> I once again, refer someone to this thread. Click here.
> 
> 
> 
> Ignorance angers me, and plenty of people are ignorant about this topic; they speak out, but don't know the facts. Since when is Iverson's play "taking its tole"? He isn't missing more and more games every year, in fact, he's played over 70 games every year of his career except for 3 seasons; and only two were because of injury. Iverson isn't very injury prone like he's made out to be. If you take out that one really bad *03-04* season (and the lock-out season), he averages 73 games played each season for his career, and he played 75 last season, and 82 in *02-03*.


no, hes not saying that AI is becoming less useful and everything. he's saying, AI is getting old, and his plays are bruising on that body of his. as u grow older, u become more prone to injuries on ankles and knees. even his back when he gets knocked down on layups. thats what he meant by 'taking its toll'.


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## joshed_up (Aug 6, 2005)

dude, nice thread. but i doubt he will be traded. he has the 'untouchable' status. like, the KG, TD, KB, all those kind of untouchables. Tmac too. they'll have rumours abt trades, which will nv happen. TMac and Steve Francis was a shock, but now, TMac wont be traded. AI's a cool guy, never liked him much, respected him ALOT.


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## TomDeFiore (Aug 31, 2005)

In regard to the number of shots he takes, there are a couple of problems, in my opinion, with that posters conclusion. First off, we are not talking about a huge difference in shots, it would be one thing if we lost a lot of games when Iverson shot 14 or less shots, and won a lot when he shot 24 or more or something like that. Second the number of games is too small. It looks like it was just from one season, Lastly, that is only referring to shots, as I said a little over 36 possessions begin and end with Iverson. They begin with him because he is the point guard, and it’s obvious how it ends with him. That is about half of the possessions. Way too many. Remember the game against Golden State, he had 12 turnovers but still managed to get off 24 shots. I mean something is wrong with that in my opinion. 

Also lets say we can’t win a title in the next 5 years with or without Iverson, which I think is likely. If we keep Iverson, the team is dooming its future after that. But if we trade him, maybe just maybe, we can get a good young player, or perhaps a high draft pick, that will help us past those five years. 

I don’t think there is any doubt about his injuries. Look at like this he is a small guy (by NBA standards) and gets banged around a lot. I mean something has to give. A human body can only take so much punishment. 

The pistons will never trade RIP for AI, I don’t even think they would trade Darko for AI. I mean why would they, AI would have to play, and this is a team that almost won it twice in a row, so why mess with that? The only team, in my opinion that may trade something of some decent value for Iverson is the Clippers, or perhaps another team with struggling attendance. Because Iverson does put people in the seats. 

This is all of course my opinion I could certainly be wrong, and I hope I am wrong, because it doesn’t look like he’s going to be traded and we sure could use a championship, 22 years since the last one… in any sport.


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## kamego (Dec 29, 2003)

No Rip and Darko for AI threads please lol as a piston fan I don't even want to go there right now. It was one thing a few years ago when we talked about Stack and some others for AI but at this point he doesn't fit what Flip is going to do. It would have made more sense while LB was still the coach.


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## Rayza (Jul 21, 2004)

I think alot of the 76ers fans are here because of Iverson. I am one of them, wherever he goes, I'll follow. I'll still be a 76ers fan, but I don't know if it will be my favourite club anymore.

I personally want to see him win a championship, but mostly I want him to win one with 76ers. He put his heart and soul into this franchise, and it wouldnt be right if he wins it elsewhere.

If we do trade him, I personally don't see who we can get in return that will be worth while. I really disagree that he is the reason why this team is not winning the championship, I don't know how anybody can say that. Don't worry about the stats, watch the game and you know how valuable he is to our team. 

Rip and Darko ? Please .....


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## bench5 (Aug 30, 2005)

i think that we should keep him because it would be hard to fill his shoes.


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## Ras (Jul 25, 2005)

TomDeFiore said:


> In regard to the number of shots he takes, there are a couple of problems, in my opinion, with that posters conclusion. First off, we are not talking about a huge difference in shots, it would be one thing if we lost a lot of games when Iverson shot 14 or less shots, and won a lot when he shot 24 or more or something like that. Second the number of games is too small. It looks like it was just from one season, Lastly, that is only referring to shots, as I said a little over 36 possessions begin and end with Iverson. They begin with him because he is the point guard, and it’s obvious how it ends with him. That is about half of the possessions. Way too many. Remember the game against Golden State, he had 12 turnovers but still managed to get off 24 shots. I mean something is wrong with that in my opinion.


First things first, one season? Did you even read it? It has *CAREER* in big, bolded letters, and I even have every season he has played listed there. Before you reply to the post, you should actually read it. Also, saying that it is not enough shots is wrong; it is very, very obvious that when he shoots more, the Sixers win more. If it wasn't enough difference in shots, why is the win percentage so durastically different?

As for the "only referring to shots" comment, well, how about this; I'll add on to that post and see total shots attempted, turnovers and assists, and see how the percentages come out. I'll be finished by the end of today or sometime tomorrow.



> I don’t think there is any doubt about his injuries. Look at like this he is a small guy (by NBA standards) and gets banged around a lot. I mean something has to give. A human body can only take so much punishment.


Well, until it happens, we shouldn't really say it's taking its tole, because as of right now, it isn't.


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## TomDeFiore (Aug 31, 2005)

The logic is inherently flawed in my opinion. Why doesn’t Iverson take every shot than? We should win every game. Also as he shot more the team got better, in terms of bringing in different players I don’t think it got better because Iverson shot more. While I can’t stand Larry Brown, he did do a good job, of getting the most out of the team, and giving the 76ers the best chance of winning. Now if I understand your post correctly you are saying that over an 82 game stretch the 76ers would go about 52-30 if AI were to shoot 30 or more shots. Or at least his career numbers would indicate that. If I’m wrong I am sorry. Even if we assume that is correct, if that’s the best we can do with Iverson were not going to win a championship. We’ll be an all right team. But not of championship caliber. This is nothing personal against AI, I only want the 76ers to become the best team they can. In my opinion, again I could certainly be wrong, they would be a better team without Iverson.


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

This is a great topic, and one that has to be touched on sooner rather than later for Sixers fans (since the longer the team waits, the worse shape they'll be in). The major question is.. will Allen Iverson win a championship as the first scoring option? The answer is no. As we know, as long as he's on the Sixers he'll be the first option especially considering the core of players the Sixers have around him.

With the goal being to win a championship, teams have to eventually let go of players who have meant a ton to their progress as an organization to make that next step. That's a move that loses fans sometimes, but a lot of times it's neccessary for the greater good of the organization.

I've held the belief for a while that if the Sixers don't win the championship this year (which is reality) it's time to move Iverson. The longer you wait, the less you'll get in return for him.


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

PhillyPhanatic said:


> The major question is.. will Allen Iverson win a championship as the first scoring option? The answer is no.


I Dont Understand how any of you can sit there so Boldly and say that like ya'll are Mrs. Cleo or some crap let me ask you something did we make it to the Finals with Allen Iverson as the first scoring option? The answer is yes. We did not have anybody else on that team that really stood out from what he have now besides maybe Mutumbo. If we got there once we can get there again. and if we can get there we sure as hell got a shot at winning. So from now on it would be better off if yall said "Your Opinion is No" Instead of Flat out saying it aint gonna happen bc thats garbage Also if the Sixers were to trade Iverson it would be the downfall of our Organization Especially if it was for Darko and RIP ity: who thinks otherwise


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

That year the Sixers had a great team around Allen Iverson, but the fact of the matter is the team didn't win the title. Close doesn't count in the NBA, close gets coaches fired, or forced out of their jobs.

I find it amusing how people can easily come out and say that other players can't win championships as the #1 option offensively, but if you suggest the same for Iverson they're up in arms. I don't get that.


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## TomDeFiore (Aug 31, 2005)

In 2001, yes we made the finals, but I mean we were at best the 5th best team in the league. We haven't seriously competed for a title in 20 years. Since the days of Dr. J and Moses. That’s exactly what I’m talking about. In my opinion the team might be ok with Iverson but will never seriously contend for the title. I mean I can;t imagine this current team getting anywhere near the level those teams were. I’ve heard from various sources, such as people with “inside information” calling in on 610 or daily news live that other teams consider us a joke. You know with the style of game we play with Iverson. Again I can’t vouch for the accuracy of this but that is just what I heard, take it for whatever you like. Again I want to make this clear I have nothing against the guy, my opinion has nothing to do with his supposed bad rep, it’s just in my opinion trading him would be best for the team.


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## Blazer Freak (Jul 11, 2004)

PhillyPhanatic said:


> This is a great topic, and one that has to be touched on sooner rather than later for Sixers fans (since the longer the team waits, the worse shape they'll be in). The major question is.. will Allen Iverson win a championship as the first scoring option? The answer is no. As we know, as long as he's on the Sixers he'll be the first option especially considering the core of players the Sixers have around him.
> 
> With the goal being to win a championship, teams have to eventually let go of players who have meant a ton to their progress as an organization to make that next step. That's a move that loses fans sometimes, but a lot of times it's neccessary for the greater good of the organization.
> 
> I've held the belief for a while that if the Sixers don't win the championship this year (which is reality) it's time to move Iverson. The longer you wait, the less you'll get in return for him.


I have to agree with this, and I have been thinking about how the Sixers are gonna fix this team once AI is gone.. And I've said to my friends, if teh 76ers don't get deep into the playoffs then they got to get rid of AI or else, like you said his value can only go down..


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## Sixerfanforlife (Jun 23, 2005)

kamego said:


> No Rip and Darko for AI threads please lol as a piston fan I don't even want to go there right now. It was one thing a few years ago when we talked about Stack and some others for AI but at this point he doesn't fit what Flip is going to do. It would have made more sense while LB was still the coach.


The only damn reason you got a championship right now is because Ai made Larry sick to his damned to hell stomach.

Do you think with Larry's illness, and Ai's stuborn attitude a title is going to head your way?

You should be glad, we didn't do that trade it was a stupid rumor and it wouldn't have helped both teams.

Unless you wanted a scoring title back then, in which case, I'll give you Keith Van Horn or something.

True that statement means nothing as Keith is no longer part of the 76ers' but what I am saying is that the Piston's wouldn't have the power or strength it has now if they had acquired Allen Iverson. 

I'll say this much, if your willing to accept Iverson, then give us Billups, and 2 first rounders.

Yea the Kg trade basically, only your not giving your big man tandem, but instead replacing it with an acceptable point guard.

He'll be around during the uncertain future, and we need all the players that can play at that age as we can get.


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## Vermillion (Mar 23, 2004)

Rayza said:


> I think alot of the 76ers fans are here because of Iverson. I am one of them, wherever he goes, I'll follow. I'll still be a 76ers fan, but I don't know if it will be my favourite club anymore.
> 
> I personally want to see him win a championship, but mostly I want him to win one with 76ers. He put his heart and soul into this franchise, and it wouldnt be right if he wins it elsewhere.
> 
> If we do trade him, I personally don't see who we can get in return that will be worth while. I really disagree that he is the reason why this team is not winning the championship, I don't know how anybody can say that. Don't worry about the stats, watch the game and you know how valuable he is to our team.


Damn man, I agree WHOLEHEARTEDLY.


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## lw32 (May 24, 2003)

PhillyPhanatic said:


> This is a great topic, and one that has to be touched on sooner rather than later for Sixers fans (since the longer the team waits, the worse shape they'll be in). The major question is.. will Allen Iverson win a championship as the first scoring option? The answer is no. As we know, as long as he's on the Sixers he'll be the first option especially considering the core of players the Sixers have around him.


I have to disagree with you here. Iverson could win a championship as the first option on offense, but *not* with the supporting cast that the Sixers have put around him. Honestly, who could you see being the first option on offense above Iverson? I can think of maybe 5 players in the League. If Iverson was put around a *solid* supporting cast with a legitimate 2nd offensive option I see no reason why he could not be the 1st option and win. For example, if Iverson was traded to Detroit for Rip Hamilton and Darko (as stated earlier) he would be the 1st option on offense over there no question. The difference between that team and the team the Sixers have would be the role players and supporting cast. Every position would be an upgrade over what the Sixers have.

I have to disagree that Iverson can't win a championship as a first option, because with the right supporting cast it's possible. It's unlikely that he'll ever win a championship, true (and pretty definite if he stays in Philly), but that does not mean he can't be a success first scoring option if surrounded by the right players.


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## TomDeFiore (Aug 31, 2005)

I have to disagree with the lack of supporting cast. We can argue about how good the current cast is forever, but to me there’s a little more to it. I mean he’s been here since ’96, and during that time the 76ers have had almost everybody in the NBA at one time or another (an exaggeration.) We have gone through complete roster changes. None of them have worked out. I mean how many people do you want him to play with? After awhile you have to ask yourself, “Where does the problem really lie?” To me the answer is Iverson but again that’s just my opinion. Yeah I know we made it to the finals, but as I said before we were at best the 5th best team in the league, not really a title contender.


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## Sixerfanforlife (Jun 23, 2005)

Better then '96 isn't it?


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## lw32 (May 24, 2003)

TomDeFiore said:


> I have to disagree with the lack of supporting cast. We can argue about how good the current cast is forever, but to me there’s a little more to it. I mean he’s been here since ’96, and during that time the 76ers have had almost everybody in the NBA at one time or another (an exaggeration.) We have gone through complete roster changes. None of them have worked out. I mean how many people do you want him to play with? After awhile you have to ask yourself, “Where does the problem really lie?” To me the answer is Iverson but again that’s just my opinion. Yeah I know we made it to the finals, but as I said before we were at best the 5th best team in the league, not really a title contender.


The Sixers have never had a low-post threat, nor another player who could score 20 points a game. Tim Thomas, Keith Van Horn, even Chris Webber are all jump shooting big men. We have not had a legitimate post guy who was worth 20 points night in night out.

If we had the supporting cast of the Pistions, minus Hamilton and Darko do you not think Detroit would have a real possibility of winning the championship?

The complete roster changes the Sixers have gone through have not been with solid players. Chris Webber is the biggest name the Sixers have brought in, since '96 but he is past his prime and is more of a jump shooter now. We have had Mutumbo, Van Horn, Thomas, Robinson, Hughes and more but none (besides Larry, who delivered last year) have been dissapointments or past their prime. And it's not as if they didn't succeed only in Philly, none have done anything outside of Philly either.

Sure, there are player's I'd want to lead the team over Iverson. But he is not a bad first option, and you can't say that the Sixers have had a championship-caliber supporting cast. Even the time the Sixers got to the Finals, that supporting cast was not great.


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## Sixerfanforlife (Jun 23, 2005)

No but it was sufficent, and this young core of players should they learn will be sufficent now and years to come. 

Louis Williams was the best point guard to come out of that draft, and secretly dominated the high school level and is going to remind you of Kobe Bryant.

I mean look at the stats here people, he averaged 27.6 ppg, 6.5 rpg, not to mention 4+ APG as well, not to mention the team went 103-16 in one season with him starting at the one.

And you mean to tell me he is a bust?

Short-term he may be, or he may be not, but from what I read and saw, Louis Williams was the best choice available then, and he was when Milwaukee had the first overall draft pick, Williams (Marvin) Nor Andrew Bogut will ever dominate the game better then a Louis Williams. 

The 76ers never had a low scoring threat? What about Toni Kukoc, his outside shot was often then, but during the 01' season he had plenty of showings in the low post, I would've love to have kept his outside shot, rebounding, and size in the city of brotherly love.

If anything the only thing you stated right was the fact that Iverson isn't a bad first option, but let me tell you something untill Louis Williams develoips the way I know he can, he won't be a good first option, he'll be there only option on offense for the next 5 or 6 yrs. 

Glenn Robinson dissapointed us but that was on his own accord, last year he was quite sucessfull and would've been more sucessful this year had he not be denied by coach O'Brien. 

Him Along side Dalembert, Motombo, Webber, And Hunter is a formiidble Front court that wouldn't have been mistaken had it come true. 

Kenny Thomas didn't dissapoint last year, let me remind you in a game against Chicago he posted up 19 pts and 12 boards, that was a practic double-double, okay sure they sucked that year, but they had potential and was difficult to rebound on.

He would've fared far better if not for O'Brien, have of the players we had last year there talent was reduced, or other wise destroyed because of Jimmy. 

Are you going to tell me Kevin Ollie sucks? Well he's old yes, but again Jimmy O'Brien didn't give him any playing time, as a matter of fact, he had Dale Davis calabar minutes in Detroit, which will most likely see the bench throughout the course of the season. 

Chris Webber is the biggest Name? Well I forgot that the sixers' organization wasn't just a team, it was a business. Otherwise I would've stated that names are not part of a sport activitie. 

Actually regardless of the activitie, it's still just a name Chris Webber is a SF I'll admit that, yes he shoots more jumpers then he does back down, but when he does back down he'll create chances for himself and his team mates and that'lll make a sixer team that's going to attack the paint fairly often alot more better.

NEXT!


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## SixersFan (Dec 19, 2004)

After last season my answer is not yet.


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## phillyfan99 (Sep 5, 2005)

traded iverson would be rediculous, i would not even think about it


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