# Cavs @ Wizards



## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

_*Game 20*_

 *VS* 

*Cleveland Cavaliers* *(9-10) @* *Washington Wizards** (8-9)*

_*Wednesday, December 5, 2007*_
*Time:* 4:00pm PT, 7:00pm ET
*TV:* FSOhio, *NBALP*
*Radio:* *WTAM 1100*
*Location:* *Verizon Center*, Washington, D.C.










*HEAD COACHES*


*Preview*​


> The Washington Wizards are playing better without Gilbert Arenas than the Cleveland Cavaliers are without LeBron James.
> 
> Both superstars will again be out Wednesday night when the Cavaliers visit the Wizards in the teams' first meeting since last season's playoffs.
> 
> ...


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

This sucks man. How much longer is LBJ gonna be out - we would have won 3 of these last 5 if he had been playing. 

No Larry, no AV, no LBJ, no Marshall ugh tired of all the injuries


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Hmm nice steal and breakaway dunk by Shannon B

Another nice play by Shannon on the pass...why the heck didn't Ferry pick up his cheap option?? It was like $1.8MM


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Great start by Gooden. He should get 25 shots tonight


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Anyone else starting to think maybe we just needed to give Shannon some minutes that actually matter?

You know, so he can focus on trying to help us win games, rather than trying to play for more of his own minutes?


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

What we need to do is keep pounding it into Gooden until he can draw a double team. All the passing around the perimeter is pointless.

Identify the mismatch inside and keep milking it so that we can generate some double teams


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Shannon is still a BAD ball-handler, though.

We have Gibson in the game and Shannon is bringing it upcourt. Brilliant.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Two bad turnovers in a row by Shannon B.

Hmm then nice entry pass to Z


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Great feed by Shannon to Z there.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Jesus, that was such a weak call against Z.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

What the heck is this lineup with Gooden at center and Newble at PF?

AV can't get here soon enough


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Haywood must be in a contract year, he looks much better out there


----------



## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

^ Let's hope that when Andy comes back, he has that contract hustle in his bones too. =)


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

We only have 2 scorers on the floor right now.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

It's painful to watch this team without Lebron. 

Some of our guys like Sasha just look completely useless. Z was playing like an all-star with LBJ but it's become obvious he was living off the space Lebron creates for him on the offensive board and open midrange shots he got for him.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Dwayne Jones = learn how to finish at the rim please


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Now we've moved to a lineup with 1 scorer.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Snow quietly has impacted this game. Great defense, smart playmaking


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

How on earth can Newble get that ugly piece of **** in the basket?


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Brandname said:


> How on earth can Newble get that ugly piece of **** in the basket?


I take back my Newble abuse. He has miraculously played well this year, contract year in our favor this time


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Benedict_Boozer said:


> I take back my Newble abuse. He has miraculously played well this year, contract year in our favor this time


lol. He's just not used to being played as a PF.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Man we really miss Lebron/AV on the boards - down 11/7 to the small Wizards team on the glass


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

This lineup Mike B. has out there is WAY too small, WTF is he doing


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

It's official. We're fielding a D-league team and Lebron James.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Seriously what is Mike Brown thinking with his lineups sometimes? I mean seriously?

He has Damon Jones, Snow, Dwayne Jones, Newble, Devin Brown out there at the same time. Does he not realize we are gonna get smoked with that group??


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Brandname said:


> It's official. We're fielding a D-league team and Lebron James.


Lebron should get 75% of the teams salary cap. I'm not even joking.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Benedict_Boozer said:


> Lebron should get 75% of the teams salary cap. I'm not even joking.


I'd go more along the lines of 90%, but I agree with you.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Z with 3. Damn.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Mike B. is getting exposed for his inability to game plan. This "offensive system" doesn't look so great either without Lebron setting everyone up and drawing 3 defenders every possession.

It's also becoming apparent how much Lebron means to our team defense


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

This is very, very scary. How can we be over the luxury tax and be so devoid of talent? Are we becoming the Knicks + Lebron?


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Shannon another nice drive. Can't use guys who can do that huh Ferry


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Giving up too many offensive rebs - Brown should have left Dwayne Jones in there


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

And Sasha's streak is over.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

This is absurd.


----------



## SamTheMan67 (Jan 4, 2004)

we could potentially have the bestbench in the league with gibson varejao sasha but instead that is our starting lineup lol


----------



## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

This is awful


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Embarassing.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Lebron does not look happy.

Nice athletic finish by Shannon B. again..


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

This is the first time I've seriously thought Lebron might leave when his contract is up.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Ferry is looking dumber and dumber not picking up Shannon Brown's option. 

And Mike B. looks dumb for constantly benching him when it's obvious at the very least he could give the bench a scoring boost


----------



## SamTheMan67 (Jan 4, 2004)

shannon looks good at least


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Brandname said:


> This is the first time I've seriously thought Lebron might leave when his contract is up.


Would you blame him?


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Benedict_Boozer said:


> Ferry is looking dumber and dumber not picking up Shannon Brown's option.
> 
> And Mike B. looks dumb for constantly benching him when it's obvious at the very least he could give the bench a scoring boost


Yeah, this team is not in a very good position right now.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

SamTheMan67 said:


> shannon looks good at least


Yeah and thats the 1 guy Ferry wants to dump in a trade


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Benedict_Boozer said:


> Would you blame him?


That's exactly why I thought that. If I were in Lebron's position, I'd definitely consider it. The amount of crap he has to take when the Cavs lose just wouldn't be worth it considering how much dead weight he has to carry. 

If we can't improve the roster in 3 years and he leaves, I don't know if I could blame him.


----------



## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

Well, at least Brown is making this.... somewhat okay to watch.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

remy23 said:


> Well, at least Brown is making this.... somewhat okay to watch.


Not really LOL...it just makes it more frustrating that he will be gone for nothing at the end of the year since Ferry didn't pick up his option.

All the dead wight on this roster and Ferry is dumping 22yr old 1st rd picks a year into the league with $1.8MM contracts. No one is gonna give us anything good for him in a trade because they know he is unrestricted this summer


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

We should do what the Denver Broncos do with their running backs. Have Lebron make players look a lot better than they actually are and trade them away for a lot more than they're worth.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Is it too late to extend a contract offer to Shannon?


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Boobie still hitting.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

So the Wiz without Arenas are 20+ better than the Cavs without Lebron. 

Sad.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

And the Cavs with Lebron are 4 games to 2 better than the Wizards with Arenas. Crazy.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Cavs making a run - lead down to 13


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Not getting my hopes up.

Newble just scored to cut the lead down to 11 with a chance to get within 10


----------



## SamTheMan67 (Jan 4, 2004)

i wish we had caron butler


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

When I try to think of a word to describe Antonio Daniels, the only word that comes to mind is '*****'. (begins with a b and ends with an 'itch')


----------



## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

The guys are showing some pride. Yay!


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Wiz up 11 with 6:30 left

Cavs showing some life. If we can get it to 4-6pts the Wiz might collapse


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Gooden has really made some bonehead plays down the stretch


----------



## SamTheMan67 (Jan 4, 2004)

at least we were almost competitive we shoulda won at least 3 outta the last 4 games if we had bron though


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

I would love them to give Daniels a T for flopping like a fish one of these times.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

How nice of Mike Brown to put Shannon back in during garbage time. *sigh*


----------



## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Brandname said:


> How nice of Mike Brown to put Shannon back in during garbage time. *sigh*


I don't blame Brown for that one: the lineup of Newble, Brown, Gibson, and Jones actually made a game out of this. These guys actually seemed to try to run plays instead of everything being one one one.

For the life of me I don't know why we don't try to run plays specifically for Gibson more.


----------



## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

Well atleast he didnt have Sasha on the floor, that guy has hit rock bottom. He is making larry hughes look like jesus shuttlesworth.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Pioneer10 said:


> I don't blame Brown for that one: the lineup of Newble, Brown, Gibson, and Jones actually made a game out of this. These guys actually seemed to try to run plays instead of everything being one one one.
> 
> For the life of me I don't know why we don't try to run plays specifically for Gibson more.


I'd still rather him not put Shannon back in when it became clear the game was over.

The kid thrives on confidence, and he's succeeding now that we put him in a position where he can contribute to winning games. The key is to not make him feel like a garbage time player.


----------



## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

What's amazing is all these guys have purposes when Lebron is out there: Brown brings in defense and occasional scoring, Sasha can shoot off Lebron's openings, Gooden gets to concentrate on boards and some offense when he's hot, Z makes a living off putbacks and those pick/roll jumpers. Take Lebron away and none of these guys are close to being well rounded to create offense for themselves.

Even Z who looked like an All-Star with lebron looks way off. I'd say if I was scouting this team that only Gibson looks like he can handle himself reasonably well without James


----------



## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Brandname said:


> I'd still rather him not put Shannon back in when it became clear the game was over.
> 
> The kid thrives on confidence, and he's succeeding now that we put him in a position where he can contribute to winning games. The key is to not make him feel like a garbage time player.


To be frank I don't think Brown has a future in this league until at least a few years. He's really a project: I do think he has the ability to turn himself into maybe even a starter calibre player but it going to take him awhile I have a feeling. His shot selection (he really does not make the secondary pass nearly ever from what I've seen) is really poor and his knowledge of defensive rotations is way off.

It was a just a mistake to draft this kid: he would have been much better served playing on fast pace team where he would be given consistent time and the chance to develop


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

I wonder if this stretch of games is going to prove that Lebron is the MVP, like it did for Nash three years ago. Probably not.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Pioneer10 said:


> To be frank I don't think Brown has a future in this league until at least a few years. He's really a project: I do think he has the ability to turn himself into maybe even a starter calibre player but it going to take him awhile I have a feeling. His shot selection (he really does not make the secondary pass nearly ever from what I've seen) is really poor and his knowledge of defensive rotations is way off.
> 
> It was a just a mistake to draft this kid: he would have been much better served playing on fast pace team where he would be given consistent time and the chance to develop


Normally I'd say the same thing. But look at our roster! He could provide something off the bench. I don't know if I ever see him being a starter caliber player, but I do think he could give a little punch off the bench. I definitely think he could provide more off the bench than say, someone like Ira Newble or Eric Snow. We're in desperate need of guys who can create a shot because we have a roster full of defensive specialists and Damon Jones.


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

HKF said:


> I wonder if this stretch of games is going to prove that Lebron is the MVP, like it did for Nash three years ago. Probably not.


I'm not sure we're going to end up winning enough games for Lebron to 'qualify' for the MVP race.


----------



## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

Here's how bad Cleveland's offense has been without Lebron:

The team has not broken a .400 FG% in any of the 3-1/2 games following Lebron's injury. They shot 40% against Detroit (but much lower in the 2nd half when Lebron was out). They shot 32% against Boston, 39% against Toronto, and 35% against New Jersey.

In 3-1/2 games, not a single player has exceeded 50% shooting in a single game on more than 4 field goal attempts.

They scored just 31 points in the second half against Detroit with Lebron out. They averaged 77 points a game in the following 3 games.

Someone posted that on another board. That's pretty embarrasing for Mike Brown/Ferry


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

Benedict_Boozer said:


> Here's how bad Cleveland's offense has been without Lebron:
> 
> The team has not broken a .400 FG% in any of the 3-1/2 games following Lebron's injury. They shot 40% against Detroit (but much lower in the 2nd half when Lebron was out). They shot 32% against Boston, 39% against Toronto, and 35% against New Jersey.
> 
> ...


:eek8:


----------



## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

Brandname said:


> How nice of Mike Brown to put Shannon back in during garbage time. *sigh*


Here is an interesting post from Scout forum:



> Is Mike Brown trying to tank games? Seriously.
> The Cavaliers make a nice little run but he leaves Damon Jones in the game despite Nick Young just blowing past him like he is a statue. Meanwhile, the obvious athletic matchup for Young in Shannon Brown has sat the first 8 minutes of the 4th.
> Z scores in the post and gets an offensive rebound for 2 more FTs but then Brown takes him out with Haywood still on the floor.
> Meanwhile, Gooden only passes the ball when he absolutely positively cant force up a shot and is nowhere to be seen defensively but yet he stays on the floor.
> ...


----------



## Brandname (May 24, 2006)

remy23 said:


> Here is an interesting post from Scout forum:


The one thing I was wondering about last night was the fact that Damon stayed in. I can appreciate, as Pioneer said, the idea of leaving the unit that goes on a run in the game. But Damon was contributing nothing on the offensive end, and he was getting blown by on defense. Shannon is by no means a lockdown defender, but I gotta think he's better than Damon at preventing penetration.

I guess I don't have enough faith in Mike Brown's ability to set proper rotations to get suspicious about this, but I wonder if he explained the line of reasoning in the press conference or anything. I'm just glad our guys showed some heart in the second half last night.


----------



## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

To be frank again: using the Scout criteria we could argue Mike Brown has been throwing games for years. Remember all the lineups like Snow, Jones, Newble together over the years we've seen?


----------

