# The NBA and the Mafia Connection... SAD AND SERIOUS ISSUE



## 013184

I can confidently say that the Mafia has and is still very much involved with the outcome of NBA games. Being a former big time gambler in NBA games, and once a victim of this phenomenon, i can say that i have the credentials to talk about this topic. during the process, i have known numerous bookies which work these bets and they have personally told me that indeed, their "bankers" have very large influence on the NBA. 

in 2004, while betting in the nba playoffs, i lost, 240 grand in just 4 days!!! this has prompted me to quit my betting days which has started since 2000. after that, i have made my own investigation on how these games are being MANIPULATED by the MAFIA by talking more to my former bookies. 

for all of you who are betting, here are some tips which i gathered in over a year of investigating.... first, DURING THE WEEKENDS, the underdogs most often than not, lose the game but win the thread.. for example, [email protected] obviously, the consensus for this would be people would place their bets to detroit because of home court advantage and advantage in talent. with the mafia meddling with the game, the hawks would loose as expected, but only by 15 or 14 points. what just happened here is that the hawks as expected, lost big time, but not by what the thread indicates. as a result, the people who are not aware of the behind-the-scenes activity would not suspect that anything suspicious is happening since the underdogs lost.

the technique here is this, ask your bookie what team did most people bet on, and then, bet on the opposing side. as with my example, the bets on detroit was overwhelming so the mafia influenced some people to make the hawks loose only by 15 points which would make the mafia win the bet. bookies would give out this information regarding the consensus since they dont care if you win or not since they are assured of 10% of total bets entered no matter what the outcome is. 

during the WEEKENDS however, the mafia takes a break and does not touch the games. this would further lessen the doubts that they are involved and because probably more people are watching these games. 

in the playoffs, it is said that most of the time, the HOME TEAM wins GAME one. then aftewards, its a free-for-all affair until the first game of the next round.

i hope this helped shed some light on some of the dark secrets of the NBA.


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## the_mavsman

rubbish.


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## AnDrOiDKing4

So what Mafia are we talking about here ? And why do they take breaks on weekends, those lazy bums get paid vaction and they take weekends off ?


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## 013184

AnDrOiDKing4 said:


> So what Mafia are we talking about here ? And why do they take breaks on weekends, those lazy bums get paid vaction and they take weekends off ?


there are lots of mafia groups involved. recently, the chinese triad was said to be present in the league as well.. my bookies never really see the faces of these people. they just exchange money using money transfers.

they take breaks to lessen doubts that something is going on behind the scenes. and because more people are watching games on weekends so more attention might be given to the games thus greater chances of detection.


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## Spriggan

What's to stop "The Mafia" from tracking you down and silencing you now that you've put their dirty deeds out there for all to see?


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## 013184

Spriggan said:


> What's to stop "The Mafia" from tracking you down and silencing you now that you've put their dirty deeds out there for all to see?


this issue has actually been slowly gaining popularity since the late 90's and the mafia has not done anything to stop the spread of this news. one of the bookies said that they dont care if their works are revealed as long as they keep on winning and getting what they want from the NBA and other sports. the NHL before is even worse. at one time, 1/3 of all russian players had direct connection with the russian mafia.


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## futuristxen

AnDrOiDKing4 said:


> So what Mafia are we talking about here ? And why do they take breaks on weekends, those lazy bums get paid vaction and they take weekends off ?


It's the jewish mafia. "I don't roll on shabbas"


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## futuristxen

Also. You're out of your freaking mind. How did the Mafia influence say....Kobe's 81 point night. Was Kobe point shaving? Could he have gone for 200, but because of the Mafia, he only went to 81? Did the Mafia succeed where others have failed, and got Kobe to stop shooting?

How does this influence work? Unlike college players, NBA players are kind of expensive to buy every single night. And I would think threats of physical violence would after awhile not work. How many times can you threaten to break Allen Iverson's legs, before he sets his posse on you?


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## Spriggan

Vlade Divac must have Russian mafia ties. I always thought there was something fishy about his "accidental" tapping back of the ball to a "coincidentally" wide-open Robert Horry in that one meaningless game a few years back, but now I know for sure.


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## 013184

futuristxen said:


> Also. You're out of your freaking mind. How did the Mafia influence say....Kobe's 81 point night. Was Kobe point shaving? Could he have gone for 200, but because of the Mafia, he only went to 81? Did the Mafia succeed where others have failed, and got Kobe to stop shooting?
> 
> How does this influence work? Unlike college players, NBA players are kind of expensive to buy every single night. And I would think threats of physical violence would after awhile not work. How many times can you threaten to break Allen Iverson's legs, before he sets his posse on you?



the money involved per game can easily buy the best of the best. michael jordan was very well known to be involved in this during his early days in chicago. the mafia does not bet on every game. they just influence the ones where the consensus is very lopsided. with kobe's 81 points, we cant be sure if that game was influenced. probably the consensus was not so lopsided since duing that time the raptors were on a winning streak, which leveled the playing field in terms of nba odds in addition, its not only the players that these people contact. the referees are also a part of it. 

on the contrary, the game fixing in college, although is present, is waaaay less than in the nba.


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## futuristxen

Also just because there's an organized crime element involved in the organization of the betting does not mean they are fixing the games. For one, that's bad business, because who is going to want to place a bet with you, if they know you are controlling the result to your benefit? Where the manipulation occurs isn't on the fixing of games end. It's on the fixing of point spreads,and a lot of mathematical formulas. The Nerd Mafia is running things.


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## futuristxen

013184 said:


> the money involved per game can easily buy the best of the best. michael jordan was very well known to be involved in this during his early days in chicago. the mafia does not bet on every game. they just influence the ones where the consensus is very lopsided. with kobe's 81 points, we cant be sure if that game was influenced. probably the consensus was not so lopsided since duing that time the raptors were on a winning streak, which leveled the playing field in terms of nba odds in addition, its not only the players that these people contact. the referees are also a part of it.
> 
> on the contrary, the game fixing in college, although is present, is waaaay less than in the nba.


Actually Michael Jordan was not well known to fix/throw games in his early days in Chicago. Otherwise he would have been banned for life from the sport.

Can you give any concrete examples from games? Like examples where a player was throwing games, shaving points?


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## 013184

futuristxen said:


> Actually Michael Jordan was not well known to fix/throw games in his early days in Chicago. Otherwise he would have been banned for life from the sport.
> 
> Can you give any concrete examples from games? Like examples where a player was throwing games, shaving points?


michael jordan cannot be banned because of his marketing powers. jordan instead placed bets on personal stats odds. thats different from the game odds that are available in casinos. 

well.. everyday u can have a game or two thats probably influenced.. a recent example would be the lakers loosing to the bobcats. lots of people placed their bets on the lakers with the line approximately at [email protected]+4.5. with the lakers being a popular team, and a superior team compared to charlotte, the bets were overwhelmingly in favor of l.a. but then the bobcats "upset" the lakers.. nothing against the bobcats, but.. c'mon...


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## futuristxen

013184 said:


> michael jordan cannot be banned because of his marketing powers. jordan instead placed bets on personal stats odds. thats different from the game odds that are available in casinos.
> 
> well.. everyday u can have a game or two thats probably influenced.. a recent example would be the lakers loosing to the bobcats. lots of people placed their bets on the lakers with the line approximately at [email protected]+4.5. with the lakers being a popular team, and a superior team compared to charlotte, the bets were overwhelmingly in favor of l.a. but then the bobcats "upset" the lakers.. nothing against the bobcats, but.. c'mon...


Um. The Bobcats were giving hell to several teams leading up to that Laker game. And the Lakers tend to play down to the level of their competition. If you take away Kobe and Odom the bobcats are probably a better team. Just a few nights before that they gave the Cavs all they could handle. And they also have had the Bulls number this year. They are a scrappy scrappy team. I don't buy them beating the Lakers as a huge shock.

And again, doesn't that have more to do with the point spread? They lowered the spread to entice Laker fans to bet, after seeing that the Bobcats could hang with a team of similiar strength in the Cavs, plus it was a road game and the Lakers aren't great on the road. The low point spread is actually indicicative that a lot of people weren't betting on the Lakers for that game. It's kind of cool to see how they do the point spreads. I've seen documentaries on the guys who do it.


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## futuristxen

What it sounds like is that you are a bad gambler, trying to rationalize your losses, by externalizing your own failings into a grand conspiracy theory. If you do have legit proof for this, you should be doing more with it than posting on a message board.


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## 013184

futuristxen said:


> Um. The Bobcats were giving hell to several teams leading up to that Laker game. And the Lakers tend to play down to the level of their competition. If you take away Kobe and Odom the bobcats are probably a better team. Just a few nights before that they gave the Cavs all they could handle. And they also have had the Bulls number this year. They are a scrappy scrappy team. I don't buy them beating the Lakers as a huge shock.
> 
> And again, doesn't that have more to do with the point spread? They lowered the spread to entice Laker fans to bet, after seeing that the Bobcats could hang with a team of similiar strength in the Cavs, plus it was a road game and the Lakers aren't great on the road. The low point spread is actually indicicative that a lot of people weren't betting on the Lakers for that game. It's kind of cool to see how they do the point spreads. I've seen documentaries on the guys who do it.


i agree with you. the bobcats are a scrappy team and i dont take that away from them. the point spread there was not entirely based on the people betting against the lakers. they also based it on recent performances... the lakers, although better than the bobcats, are as you said a mediocre road team, and they were battling a scrappy team in charlotte. so the point spread cant be considered low. the popularity of the lakers enticed the people to bet for the lakers and the mob just TOOK ADVANTAGE of this by meddling with the game. 

btw, what documentary was that? i would love to watch that... thanks


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## 013184

futuristxen said:


> What it sounds like is that you are a bad gambler, trying to rationalize your losses, by externalizing your own failings into a grand conspiracy theory. If you do have legit proof for this, you should be doing more with it than posting on a message board.


haha! well i became careless.. i used to win all the time but i only placed small bets.. prior to the week where i lost 240 grand, i was up around 45 grand... as i said, i talked to a number of bookies and the things i wrote were based on what they said...


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## AnDrOiDKing4

futuristxen said:


> It's the jewish mafia. "I don't roll on shabbas"


:laugh::laugh::laugh:


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## lw32

What I'd like to know is how you come across $240,000 by the age of 22. I mean, I'm sure it's your amazing gambling skills which were not-so-great during that 4 day stretch of fixed games, right? If you've got any clues on how I can come across 240k, bet it all, lose it all, and still have enough money to live, pay my internet (as you must), etc., please let me know ASAP.

Also, you somewhat contradict yourself in the first thread I believe. Perhaps it's just the way I'm reading into it, but you say that during the weekends the Mafia fixes the games, with your example of the Hawks and Detroit, and the over-under line. And then you go on to say that during the weekends the Mafia takes a break and doesn't touch the games. So are they fixing them or not on the weekends?

Have you thought that, perhaps the reason why the home team wins the 1st game of the series in the playoffs is because A.) They did have the better overall record and B.) They are the home team with the fans, no travel, etc.. This doesn't really support your theory, as it makes sense that the home team wins the first game.

Isn't Gretzky in charge of all this too, or did he leave it to his wife?


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## GNG

013184 said:


> I can confidently say that the Mafia has and is still very much involved with the outcome of NBA games. Being a former big time gambler in NBA games, and once a victim of this phenomenon, i can say that i have the credentials to talk about this topic. during the process, i have known numerous bookies which work these bets and they have personally told me that indeed, their "bankers" have very large influence on the NBA.
> 
> in 2004, while betting in the nba playoffs, i lost, 240 grand in just 4 days!!! this has prompted me to quit my betting days which has started since 2000. after that, i have made my own investigation on how these games are being MANIPULATED by the MAFIA by talking more to my former bookies.


240K when you were 20 years old?

I think the better issue is who _your_ connection is.


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## 013184

Rawse said:


> 240K when you were 20 years old?
> 
> I think the better issue is who _your_ connection is.


well lets just say i was lucky that my parents and grandparents worked hard to get me and my family to where we are right now.. i mean after i lost that much, my parents paid for my debts and i went under a rehab program to get out of a gambling addiction... 

luckily, i got out of such things and let me tell you people out there to not get involved with it.. my cousin's friend was almost killed by a said chinese triad after failing to pay uo 500 grand in debts on schedule..


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## 013184

Lachlanwood32 said:


> What I'd like to know is how you come across $240,000 by the age of 22. I mean, I'm sure it's your amazing gambling skills which were not-so-great during that 4 day stretch of fixed games, right? If you've got any clues on how I can come across 240k, bet it all, lose it all, and still have enough money to live, pay my internet (as you must), etc., please let me know ASAP.
> 
> Also, you somewhat contradict yourself in the first thread I believe. Perhaps it's just the way I'm reading into it, but you say that during the weekends the Mafia fixes the games, with your example of the Hawks and Detroit, and the over-under line. And then you go on to say that during the weekends the Mafia takes a break and doesn't touch the games. So are they fixing them or not on the weekends?
> 
> Have you thought that, perhaps the reason why the home team wins the 1st game of the series in the playoffs is because A.) They did have the better overall record and B.) They are the home team with the fans, no travel, etc.. This doesn't really support your theory, as it makes sense that the home team wins the first game.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Isn't Gretzky in charge of all this too, or did he leave it to his wife?







like i said in one of the replies i made to another member, i was lucky that my family and parents had money to settle my debts.... please dont ever try this betting thing.. some of my friends are still hooked on it and they borrow money from me almost weekly to settle their debts. 

the hawks-detroit game is jyst an example... they fix the games USUALLY on weekdays because the perception is that less attention is given while on weekends, they "take a break" and USUALLY, they dont interfere.. the bookies i know are the ones saying this.. im just trying to share it to you people so that you wont make the same mistake as i did a few years back....


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## socco

Speaking of the atlanta-detroit game, ya, that kinda never happened. I'm sure you'll claim that's what you meant. But even if it is, it still proves nothing. You'd think a great gambling mind such as yourself would have multiple stories about games that were fixed, but that doesn't seem to be the case. The only example you gave was Charlotte beating LA. And if that was truly fixed, wouldn't LA have still won but not have covered the point spread? Your story doesn't add up my friend.


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## 013184

socco said:


> Speaking of the atlanta-detroit game, ya, that kinda never happened. I'm sure you'll claim that's what you meant. But even if it is, it still proves nothing. You'd think a great gambling mind such as yourself would have multiple stories about games that were fixed, but that doesn't seem to be the case. The only example you gave was Charlotte beating LA. And if that was truly fixed, wouldn't LA have still won but not have covered the point spread? Your story doesn't add up my friend.[/QUOTE
> 
> well... i respect ur opinion if you don't buy my claims/stories.. we're all entitled to it...
> 
> but from what i've experienced and what i've learned from my bookie friends, i know that these things happen almost every game day... i dont feel that i have to cite a specific game because we can't be sure what games they choose to interfere in.. we just have to observe closely on HOW THE GAME WAS PLAYED because there are signs if the manner that the game was played was influenced....
> 
> i just shared my stories to try to warn people of what goes on behind the scenes in the nba... that's why i try to answer every one of your posts here so that i can convince people not to fall into this trap of gambling in sports games.


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## BEEZ

013184 said:


> I can confidently say that the Mafia has and is still very much involved with the outcome of NBA games. Being a former big time gambler in NBA games, and once a victim of this phenomenon, i can say that i have the credentials to talk about this topic. during the process, i have known numerous bookies which work these bets and they have personally told me that indeed, their "bankers" have very large influence on the NBA.
> 
> in 2004, while betting in the nba playoffs, i lost, 240 grand in just 4 days!!! this has prompted me to quit my betting days which has started since 2000. after that, i have made my own investigation on how these games are being MANIPULATED by the MAFIA by talking more to my former bookies.
> 
> for all of you who are betting, here are some tips which i gathered in over a year of investigating.... first, DURING THE WEEKENDS, the underdogs most often than not, lose the game but win the thread.. for example, [email protected] obviously, the consensus for this would be people would place their bets to detroit because of home court advantage and advantage in talent. with the mafia meddling with the game, the hawks would loose as expected, but only by 15 or 14 points. what just happened here is that the hawks as expected, lost big time, but not by what the thread indicates. as a result, the people who are not aware of the behind-the-scenes activity would not suspect that anything suspicious is happening since the underdogs lost.
> 
> the technique here is this, ask your bookie what team did most people bet on, and then, bet on the opposing side. as with my example, the bets on detroit was overwhelming so the mafia influenced some people to make the hawks loose only by 15 points which would make the mafia win the bet. bookies would give out this information regarding the consensus since they dont care if you win or not since they are assured of 10% of total bets entered no matter what the outcome is.
> 
> during the WEEKENDS however, the mafia takes a break and does not touch the games. this would further lessen the doubts that they are involved and because probably more people are watching these games.
> 
> in the playoffs, it is said that most of the time, the HOME TEAM wins GAME one. then aftewards, its a free-for-all affair until the first game of the next round.
> 
> i hope this helped shed some light on some of the dark secrets of the NBA.


 You must be rich losing that much money at 20 years old.


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## Burn

I believe you. I've also had some problems with gambling. I know you don't know me, but if there's any way you could loan me 10 grand...if I don't have it by next week this loan shark will kill me, I know he's killed at least 2 guys already. Please, you'd be saving my life, I'm just like you man..please..


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## sherwin

Haha, you offer no concrete evidence or reason to believe your theory. 

They are not fixing games you bum. And when is the last time you saw a +16 underdog? 

And only a fool bets on the playoffs. Too unpredictable.

If you have discipline and treat betting like stock trading or something real, then it's good and pretty easy.


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## 013184

Burn said:


> I believe you. I've also had some problems with gambling. I know you don't know me, but if there's any way you could loan me 10 grand...if I don't have it by next week this loan shark will kill me, I know he's killed at least 2 guys already. Please, you'd be saving my life, I'm just like you man..please..


my parents have been watchn my bank account since the incident man... sorry bro.. my friends only borrow like 3 grand max..... 10 grand and the bank will note my parents... 

just give the loan shark something... like a downpayment of some sort... go to a pawnshop and sell ur stuff.. then quit gambling!!!! and start all over again.. sorry again man..


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## Banjoriddim

Burn said:


> I believe you. I've also had some problems with gambling. I know you don't know me, but if there's any way you could loan me 10 grand...if I don't have it by next week this loan shark will kill me, I know he's killed at least 2 guys already. Please, you'd be saving my life, I'm just like you man..please..


As I consider this post to be bad joke, I consider you a mean person...

And to thread creator: Whats your point? You have no proof, people who belive you have to be well... stupid... Now lets imagine that you are actually correct and one mobster goes to public with it... you see I don't belive you coz I know people tend to be greedy, stupid and want to be famous atleast most of us to some extent... now if we belive that jews run the world and mob runs the nba we have to belive thats its possible to count on people as if they would be robots. Now if you rethink and reread your post you should realize that there is chance that people think you are dumb...
I think you are tinking that you came up with "cool joke" and you are sore loser and wasted my time with this lame joke. So grow up! If otherwise go seek medikal help and hire personal teachers, I mean use your "money" wisely!


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## Mr. Hobbes

Link?


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## narrator

This is garbage. We all know Stern fixes things with and for his cabal of New York lawyers. (I'm sorry, I didn't mean that, please don't break my legs, Mr. Stern!)


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## Hibachi!

If I lost $240,000 in 4 days, I'd go crazy too... Hell, I'd rationalize that aliens abducted me and stole my money...


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## P-Dub34

This thread = classic.


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## Theoretic

personal attacks, especially of this magnitude, are not tolerated.

*- Premier*


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## Darth Bryant

Theoretic said:


> personal attacks, especially of this magnitude, are not tolerated.
> 
> *- Premier*



:laugh:

Seriously though, if this were true, the network size of such a mafia would be so large that keeping it under wraps would be close to impossible. And even though the author of the thread claims they are cool with people knowing about the system, the truth is the Mafia would probably want to keep as much law enforcement out of such a ring as possible.


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## HKF

CDRacingZX6R said:


> :laugh:


:laugh:


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## Darth Bryant

I wonder how long it will be, before Emplay writes his next hoopsworld article on this? Considering how any person with a computer and internet is a credible source to him.


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## Geaux Tigers

futuristxen said:


> It's the jewish mafia. "I don't roll on shabbas"


3000 years of beautiful *manipulation of NBA games* from Moses to Sandy Koufax...Your damn right Im living in the past...:wink:


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## Dragnsmke1

Im not saying hes right(the thread creator) but its becoming obvious alot of yall have no idea how powerful the mafias of the world are...


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## IbizaXL

they should make a movie out of this or something.

Allen Iverson and his posse in a gun battle against Chinese triads for not fixing a game? movie magic


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## bronx43

013184 said:


> I can confidently say that the Mafia has and is still very much involved with the outcome of NBA games. Being a former big time gambler in NBA games, and once a victim of this phenomenon, i can say that i have the credentials to talk about this topic. during the process, i have known numerous bookies which work these bets and they have personally told me that indeed, their "bankers" have very large influence on the NBA.
> 
> in 2004, while betting in the nba playoffs, i lost, 240 grand in just 4 days!!! this has prompted me to quit my betting days which has started since 2000. after that, i have made my own investigation on how these games are being MANIPULATED by the MAFIA by talking more to my former bookies.
> 
> for all of you who are betting, here are some tips which i gathered in over a year of investigating.... first, DURING THE WEEKENDS, the underdogs most often than not, lose the game but win the thread.. for example, [email protected] obviously, the consensus for this would be people would place their bets to detroit because of home court advantage and advantage in talent. with the mafia meddling with the game, the hawks would loose as expected, but only by 15 or 14 points. what just happened here is that the hawks as expected, lost big time, but not by what the thread indicates. as a result, the people who are not aware of the behind-the-scenes activity would not suspect that anything suspicious is happening since the underdogs lost.
> 
> the technique here is this, ask your bookie what team did most people bet on, and then, bet on the opposing side. as with my example, the bets on detroit was overwhelming so the mafia influenced some people to make the hawks loose only by 15 points which would make the mafia win the bet. bookies would give out this information regarding the consensus since they dont care if you win or not since they are assured of 10% of total bets entered no matter what the outcome is.
> 
> during the WEEKENDS however, the mafia takes a break and does not touch the games. this would further lessen the doubts that they are involved and because probably more people are watching these games.
> 
> in the playoffs, it is said that most of the time, the HOME TEAM wins GAME one. then aftewards, its a free-for-all affair until the first game of the next round.
> 
> i hope this helped shed some light on some of the dark secrets of the NBA.



Wait... tell us HOW exactly did the mafia "influence" the game? Especially in the situation you described with [email protected] To make sure that the score differential is around 14-15pts, think about how many people that would involve. Shoot, the entire game would have to be one big ruse. The officials have to be involved, the players, the coaches.... think about it, as good as NBA players are, they cannot guarantee that they can make a shot(especially in a guy's face). Therefore, this whole shpiel just sounds like a fictional ramble. If what you say is true, this gambling/influential network of the Mafia and NBA would have to be sooooo extensive and soooooo powerful that it is nearly impossible its cover hasn't been blown yet.


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## rynobot

v-bookie is rigged!!

OMG!!!

I lose 20,000 UCash


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## JuniorNoboa

My best advice to you is that now that you are "in" with your bookie friends, bet it all to win it back - one game, be a man and put it all on the line. 

(And that must be some "rehab" when you still associate with bookie friends)


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## Wilmatic2

Good thing I don't gamble. Hell, I don't even play poker.


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## Premier

If anyone can find a good reason to continue this thread, please PM me.


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## Premier

The thread has been re-opened in light of recent circumstances.


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## Tragedy

HILARIOUS! Bet a lot of people feel foolish now, eh?


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## GNG

futuristxen said:


> Also. You're out of your freaking mind. How did the Mafia influence say....Kobe's 81 point night. Was Kobe point shaving? Could he have gone for 200, but because of the Mafia, he only went to 81? Did the Mafia succeed where others have failed, and got Kobe to stop shooting?
> 
> How does this influence work? Unlike college players, NBA players are kind of expensive to buy every single night. And I would think threats of physical violence would after awhile not work. How many times can you threaten to break Allen Iverson's legs, before he sets his posse on you?


And with certain players, threats don't work for other reasons.

For instance, if you shot Raef LaFrentz in the kneecap, would it really make any difference?


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## Dee-Zy

I didn't bother reading much after I read "used to be a big time gambler" and saw you were my age.


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## essbee

I just wanna compliment all the sissy NBA players for toeing that corporate line so nicely with their statements.


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## futuristxen

Ahhh this is the thread I was looking for. Thanks!
Sigh...it's nice to look back and remember what it was like to still somewhat believe in the integrity of the league. It's like how I used to believe in Santa Claus.


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## futuristxen

Dee-Zy said:


> I didn't bother reading much after I read "used to be a big time gambler" and saw you were my age.


Look at when this thread was made. Aluminum hat boy had it all figured out, and we(I) were(was) too naive to believe.


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## Geaux Tigers

Wow...


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## MarioChalmers

I made a post like this a year ago, but I didn't have as much gambling experience as this man. But then, I can support what he's said -- even if it's quite obvious now. There have been weeks when we couldn't win a bet, and there have been weeks where we just kept on raking in the cash. Everyone in my school has been incredibly jaded and it seems like the game-fixing in the league is common knowledge, at least in my parts.


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## Kyakko

wow.. he called it. i think someone is owed an apology *coughsnitchcough*


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## BlakeJesus

Ha! That's all kinds of crazy.


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## Auggie

wow.. he really called it


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## Kobester888

futuristxen said:


> Look at when this thread was made. Aluminum hat boy had it all figured out, and we(I) were(was) too naive to believe.


Hey at least you admit that you were wrong. You sure gave that dude a hard time. Its all good though I probably would've done the same. We should have listened to him at that time and maybe make some money with the advice he was giving us.


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## leidout

Can you use your connections to help the clippers win the championship? Please? Just one year is all i ask :worthy: 

Really though, this has been going on since the inception of gambling on professional sports, but it's still funny to see how many people were in denial just a year ago. The games were rarely ever totally "fixed" but small differences in scores should be obvious to anyone who knows what the words "point spread" mean.


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## Tragedy

essbee said:


> I just wanna compliment all the sissy NBA players for toeing that corporate line so nicely with their statements.


You would be doing the same thing.

I also think its funny than people act like it's impossible to have 240k to blow on gambling at 22. Ever heard of trust funds?


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## One on One

I don't know if he was completely right though cause Suns-Spurs Game 3 was a Saturday, guess the Mafia don't take time off when it comes to the playoffs.


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## unluckyseventeen

This just sounds like a story of terrible betting.

Somebody is just feeding you conspiracy theories to give you some kind of false closure. Nobody is controlling the outcomes of the games. The referees don't make the ball go into the hoop. The referees don't tell a player when they can score and when they can't.

Duh, dude. We're not that dumb.


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## unluckyseventeen

Oh by the way - for anybody saying the NBA has dirty hands and rigs the game for marketing reasons.. ha. I laugh at you.

The WCF featured two of the three smallest markets in the NBA. If the NBA/refs/mafia.. whatever were really involved like is being alleged, then it would have been Golden State vs Phoenix, both far larger markets and I'm sure with more money on them, anyway.


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## Kyakko

unluckyseventeen said:


> This just sounds like a story of terrible betting.
> 
> Somebody is just feeding you conspiracy theories to give you some kind of false closure. Nobody is controlling the outcomes of the games. The referees don't make the ball go into the hoop. The referees don't tell a player when they can score and when they can't.
> 
> Duh, dude. We're not that dumb.


he didn't say ref's controlled who won or lose, just the point spread, and that's pretty easy to do for ref. just call fouls. players shoot around 70 percent freebies. i wish i was making this up, but it's been in the news that this was what Donaghy was doing, along with his alleged relationship with the mob. what the original poster said, in the light of new evidence, is perfectly probable.


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## Tragedy

What's so difficult to understand unluckyseventeen?

Refs can affect the flow of the game for one team or the other by calling fouls. Also he's not even saying they are controlling the outcomes of games, but rather the point spread, which would be far easier to control.

As for saying they don't affect the games because they would have had bigger market teams playing, that's a weak excuse that YOU are using to minimize what's happening.

It would take far too much to fix complete series', and the payoff wouldn't be enough for the amount of work needed. Not to mention it would take so much that it would start to get the attention of many people. 

It seems easier to take it as it comes, then "adjust" the games that are given to you. Far less work, and the payoff is still there.


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## Mateo

Everyone's a genius after the fact. If you would have posted this 2 weeks ago you might be looking smart right now.


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## cpawfan

Mateo said:


> Everyone's a genius after the fact. If you would have posted this 2 weeks ago you might be looking smart right now.


Trying checking the date of the first post in the thread and then apologize for being such an idiot.


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## essbee

Unfrozen Caveman Laywer said:


> Everyone's a genius after the fact. If you would have posted this 2 weeks ago you might be looking smart right now.


Let me explain dates to you...


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## 4BiddenKnight

Wow, does this guy that started the thread have the ability to see the future or something?


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## One on One

I have received confirmation that the guy who started this thread _is_ Tim Donaghy!


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## ElMarroAfamado

my sources tell me we are never going to hear the end of this


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## BlakeJesus

unluckyseventeen said:


> This just sounds like a story of terrible betting.
> 
> Somebody is just feeding you conspiracy theories to give you some kind of false closure. Nobody is controlling the outcomes of the games. The referees don't make the ball go into the hoop. The referees don't tell a player when they can score and when they can't.
> 
> Duh, dude. We're not that dumb.


That's pretty naive to think like that. There are a lot of ticky tacky calls a ref can make throughout a game. They can do little things that DO effect the outcome of games. For example the Bulls Warriors game where he touched Biedrins. Small thing that not many noticed, saved Warriors from a foul.

Little things can swing a game by a point or two. It's probably easier than you think to get a guy to the line so he has a chance to push you over the point spread by a point at the end of the game.


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## BlakeJesus

Mateo said:


> Everyone's a genius after the fact. If you would have posted this 2 weeks ago you might be looking smart right now.


I know people already said something but :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## gothambats

so this guy thinks hes ms cleo....


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## Eternal

gothambats said:


> so this guy thinks hes ms cleo....


He was stating what he knew, since he was involved in betting for games. He wasn't predicting anything.


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## BlakeJesus

gothambats said:


> so this guy thinks hes ms cleo....


Some people actually need to READ the thread before they comment on it, it would boos their knowledge on the matter by about 10000


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## osman

wow.. his opinion sounds pretty close to the truth....good call..by the way, check the date of the 1st post people.


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## osman

013184 said:


> the money involved per game can easily buy the best of the best. michael jordan was very well known to be involved in this during his early days in chicago. the mafia does not bet on every game. they just influence the ones where the consensus is very lopsided. with kobe's 81 points, we cant be sure if that game was influenced. probably the consensus was not so lopsided since duing that time the raptors were on a winning streak, which leveled the playing field in terms of nba odds in addition, its not only the players that these people contact. *the referees are also a part of it. *
> on the contrary, the game fixing in college, although is present, is waaaay less than in the nba.


lol..good call.


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## ChrisRichards

Hey people. Try CHECKING THE DAMN DATE OF THE FIRST POST.

Some of you making stupid comments. This thread was created in FEBRUARY...... of -2006- !!!!!!!!!!!!! A YEAR AND A HALF AGO.

The man was telling the TRUTH and we made fun of him for it. Now we all look stupid. He had it all figured out but he was all alone vs the forum mob, we even locked his thread.... 

About the gambling... we are all just hearing about it now...


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## dwade3

maybe it was the Mafia and Cleveland that made cleveland throwout the Finals, maybe the Mafia MADE Antonio Davis foul LJ for a 4point play....the mafia DO tamper with the NBA, but NOT on a player level, they are too smart for that, as weird as it sounds, they respect the players as a player, but not the game itself...thats why they are mafia...


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## dwade3

jeez lol, this was before the scandal....well get what about 95% of what ppl have said in this thread and throw that out the window...


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## One on One

If he just bet the over/under, is everyone still gonna be very upset?


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## BlackNRed

hah, great thread. i'm surprised the guy hasn't been back to say i told you so. i just hope he didn't get whacked by the mafia cause he couldn't pay the money he owed.


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## afobisme

my friend has been telling me the very same thing for the past 5 years. he tells me that college games are much less rigged too.

if i had seen this thread, i wouldn't have bashed the OP. seems like people were looking reasons NOT to believe the OP. even if he didn't offer concrete evidence, it didn't mean he was wrong.

i've been saying the NBA and most professional sports are rigged for the longest time (not on here though), and most people just scoff it off as if you're some conspiracy theorist.


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## Sliccat

the funny thing is, what's lost with all the "told you so" of these conspiracy theorists (ie: losers) is that this nearly proves that the NBA itself isn't fixed in the sense they were saying it was.


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## Kyakko

Sliccat said:


> the funny thing is, what's lost with all the "told you so" of these conspiracy theorists (ie: losers) is that this nearly proves that the NBA itself isn't fixed in the sense they were saying it was.


i don't understand what you're trying to say. he was pretty darn close. the OP said, ref's didn't control who won but fixed the point spreads by calling fouls. this is exactly what allegedly happened with donaghy's case. he said there was a 15 game stretch where the point spread was beaten. in donaghy's case, there was a 10 game stretch (2000 to 1 odds of that happening) where games beat either the over/under. the OP said there was mafia involment, and that' part's allegedly true also. i say that's pretty fixed to me. if only i'd believed him a year ago, i'd be laughing to the bank.


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## afobisme

im gonna be called a conspiracy theorist, but i think stern isn't as innocent as we all assume. he has a hand in it, probably not very traceable, but he has a hand in it.

of course, that's just my opinion. i have no proof.


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## Roscoe Sheed

afobisme said:


> im gonna be called a conspiracy theorist, but i think stern isn't as innocent as we all assume. he has a hand in it, probably not very traceable, but he has a hand in it.
> 
> of course, that's just my opinion. i have no proof.


I totally agree

the officiating has been very fishy for years now.


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## Blue

afobisme said:


> im gonna be called a conspiracy theorist, but i think stern isn't as innocent as we all assume. he has a hand in it, probably not very traceable, but he has a hand in it.
> 
> of course, that's just my opinion. i have no proof.


Same. I REFUSE to beleive that Stern was completely oblivious to this whole situation. After all, HE is the commissioner of the league, and HE should be on top of its officiating, if hes going to dictate to players and coaches what exactly they can and cannot say about it. He has failed our trust. He told us his security system was top notch........yet it failed pin-point a guy w/ a previous history of gambling and several other troubling red flags and off court antics. PLEASE. Either he knew and was trying to keep it under wraps, or he is just an idiot. Either way.....I want him gone.


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## CSILASVEGAS

hey 013184? what happened to you? haven't posted anything since the day you created this thread. wow! good call on the referees being a part of it! we're sorry we made fun of you! keep us posted on whats happening in in the underworld of nba betting!


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## Kyakko

CSILASVEGAS said:


> hey 013184? what happened to you? haven't posted anything since the day you created this thread. wow! good call on the referees being a part of it! we're sorry we made fun of you! keep us posted on whats happening in in the underworld of nba betting!


he's sleeping with fishes, pushing up daisies, taking a dirt nap... :biggrin: j/k


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## 4BiddenKnight

CSILASVEGAS said:


> hey 013184? what happened to you? haven't posted anything since the day you created this thread. wow! good call on the referees being a part of it! we're sorry we made fun of you! keep us posted on whats happening in in the underworld of nba betting!


Posts in the 1st page drove him away.


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## 013184

wow, just randomly decided to go back and read this thread. cant imagine it was 2 years ago! just wanna say no hard feelings to the people who refused to believe my story. i really can't blame you. this was a shady thing that was happening before and very few people have been through a similar experience. my goal for writing this thread before was to advice people to never make the same BIG mistake that i made. 

just to let you know i have never been involved in this kind of mess ever again.


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## ChrisRichards

013184 said:


> wow, just randomly decided to go back and read this thread. cant imagine it was 2 years ago! just wanna say no hard feelings to the people who refused to believe my story. i really can't blame you. this was a shady thing that was happening before and very few people have been through a similar experience. my goal for writing this thread before was to advice people to never make the same BIG mistake that i made.
> 
> just to let you know i have never been involved in this kind of mess ever again.


hey!!!

welcome back man. hope you stick around


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## bonddouble07

i believe the guy who started the thread. i have friends too who got really deep into this kind of gambling before and many of them suffered similar problems. they told me exactly the same thing about how the mafia somehow influenced some of the games in terms of point spread. i hope this year's NBA playoffs would be much cleaner than the TIM DONAGHY era. 

HOPING FOR ANOTHER LAKERS VS CELTICS (WITH KG IN THE LINEUP) Finals!! No LeBron in the Finals PLEASE!!


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## Bartholomew Hunt

I wonder if that's why Stern put in the awful no-touch rules. It's much easier to chalk something up as a foul now, thus easier to call a ****load of fouls without controversy.


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## bonddouble07

bulls over celtics sound fishy to anyone?! bulls had a + 8.5 spread in game 1. dallas also had like plus 6 on them. and the rockets are +5. update from my friends who placed their bets that the bets were overwhlemingly in favor of the cavs, celtics, spurs and blazers. LOL! mafia/triads had a field day! only cavs won the spread!


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## Chan Ho Nam

hey OP or any other gambler

did u guys make a killing in the 07 08 season or what cause i made a killing

with so many teams with good records the odds were big on every given night

did u at least bet on boston against houston at houston after their 22 game winning streak, the odds were like over 3 to 1 with win over 5 pts, they won by 20, i could have tripled my bankroll but i was playing other games too which i also won that night, which were phx at portland, and detroit vs denver


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## NorthSideHatrik

Just curious if any of you guys watch MMA? I have a good feeling about underdogs in UFC 101 in august. This is NOT inside information, just a hunch from a serious fan. The co-main event is BJ Penn defending his title against Kenny Florian and Forrest Griffin vs. Thiago Silva. Any opinions on this one? I just really think BJ Penn is over rated and Sidyotong has taken Kenny's striking game along way. And Forrest while having a better more rounded game, its probably dumb enough to stand and bang with Thiago... Which is a very bad move.


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## jokeaward

I thought this was gonna be about Darko.


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## Babir

looks like Mafia is threatining Lewis and Hedo, that is the only explanation of their sucking in the playoffs...


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## ChosenFEW

some of you are so closed minded omg.

OP isn't saying that the mafia decides who wins or loses on any given night or that they decide who has big games or bad games. What he is trying to say is that if it is close enough or if the game is played a certain way it can be influenced by a couple of points here and there without necessarily having players throwing games away you know. 

How that happens? if I knew i would know which teams to bet on and which not to..... to think that the tim donaghy incident is an isolated issue is being sort of naive


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## michelangelo

This is an interesting discussion, and I'm NOT willing to dismiss the OP out of hand. However, everyone here would like to see some EVIDENCE. You don't have to sing, but at least give a hint as to who is the source of info.

And yeah, anyone who thinks nba officiating has been on the level just isn't paying attention. :naughty:


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## Shady*

Epic Thread is Epic


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## simply_amazing

Anyone who believes that entertainment wrestling, nba playoff results, or regular season margins of victory aren't fabricated has their head up their ass. 

Donaghy stands to gain very, very little and is taking enormous risks by speaking out. 

Then again, I'm sure some of you believe Bush Jr was actually elected and that Obama's a U.S. citizen.


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## Pay Ton

Pointless bump.


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## Ron

simply_amazing said:


> Anyone who believes that entertainment wrestling, nba playoff results, or regular season margins of victory aren't fabricated has their head up their ass.


My argument to the above tripe is always the same: If you really believe this, then why watch?

The rest of your post doesn't deserve the dignity of a response.


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## Dre

There's no wiseguy issue but there is something pretty funny going on right under you guys' noses that I'm surprised noone's noticed yet. I'm not saying anything though cause last time I brought it up you tried to laugh me out. I'll just wait til the media picks it up if they ever do

As far as the real corrupting party in regards to the NBA it's these power brokers controlling these players with their own best interests in mind.


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## HB

Colluding?

I think Woj continually points it out though.


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## Dre

No, it's not a corruption thing


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## HB

Wrong choice of words but no he doesnt say the league is corrupt, well not in the way we describe corruption. But when he talks about folks like Wes and Rose etc etc and how much free reign Stern gives them....well


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## Ben

Haven't heard the word collusion used so much in a month before. Strangely enough Dre's in every thread its brought up in.. hmm

Waiting for Keaf to appear..


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## simply_amazing

But you responded anyway. And of course, you have no reasonable evidence or analysis to suggest that games are called cleanly, when even a 3 year old can figure out Sac LA was obviously rigged. 

You watch scripted tv and movies too: they're entertaining, but you don't have to be believe that Marlon Brando's a Sicilian mafioso to enjoy watching the godfather. 

What's up with this "dignity" bs? This is not Mr. Rogers' neighborhood. When games are bet on, people will figure out a way to cheat. What naive head in the sand bs response do you want?



Ron said:


> My argument to the above tripe is always the same: If you really believe this, then why watch?
> 
> The rest of your post doesn't deserve the dignity of a response.


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## Ron

Principally because the rest of your post was crap.

The supposition (and a reasonable one) is that games are legitimate. It's sports, not a TV show. It's real.

Sounds like you are a very bitter fan. Your attempt to marginalize the Lakers win over Sacramento (in 2002 [nine years ago!], get over it already) by pointing a finger at the officiating is thinly-veiled partisanship.

I would say nice try, but it wasn't. It was a lousy try.


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## simply_amazing

*** Unnecessary. *** sports games and especially spreads are easily manipulated by referees. This is easily documented and very easy to discover. Nice to know you have no argument but must resort to playground name calling. Fail.

*** No, you did it. See "unnecessary" above. ***



Ron said:


> Principally because the rest of your post was crap.
> 
> The supposition (and a reasonable one) is that games are legitimate. It's sports, not a TV show. It's real.
> 
> Sounds like you are a very bitter fan. Your attempt to marginalize the Lakers win over Sacramento (in 2002 [nine years ago!], get over it already) by pointing a finger at the officiating is thinly-veiled partisanship.
> 
> I would say nice try, but it wasn't. It was a lousy try.


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## Ron

Since you believe this is easily documented and easily discovered, perhaps you would like to give us such examples. And I don't mean just a few...you are arguing that this is universal.

You have the floor. Go for it.


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## simply_amazing

You need examples of people cheating? Seriously? Seriously???? You really, really believe *everyone *is honest when tens or even hundreds of millions of dollars are on the line??? Please, get your head out of your ass. No hate.


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## Ron

simply_amazing said:


> You need examples of people cheating? Seriously? Seriously???? You really, really believe *everyone *is honest when tens or even hundreds of millions of dollars are on the line??? Please, get your head out of your ass. No hate.


Yes, I need examples. Otherwise, your claims are spurious and without merit.


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## CosaNostra

Are people really still crying about the Sacramento/Lakers series nine years ago? Get a life...


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