# Tyrus Thomas is good!!! haha



## caseyrh (Jun 10, 2003)

well he looks much better today hope this type of play continues.


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## fleetwood macbull (Jan 23, 2004)

may I suggest...lithium?


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## paxman (Apr 24, 2006)

IBTLMAO


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

17 pts, 11 rebs, 2 stls & 2blks in 25 min

BEAST


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Now the NBA just needs to stop calling some of those blocks goaltending. IMO, if its not over the cyclinder, its not goaltending!


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

The ROY said:


> 17 pts, 11 rebs, 2 stls & 2blks in 25 min
> 
> BEAST


Now that's what I'm talkin about. How were Sefo's #s?


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

sloth said:


> Now the NBA just needs to stop calling some of those blocks goaltending. IMO, if its not over the cyclinder, its not goaltending!


Did he get called for goaltending a few times or something?


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## Wynn (Jun 3, 2002)

DaBabyBullz said:


> Did he get called for goaltending a few times or something?


Several.

The kid gets serious height. At least one of his "goaltends" was a couple feet in front of the rim.


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## Electric Slim (Jul 31, 2002)

The sky is the limit for Tyrus. It all depends on how hard he works.

I still have no clue what his NBA position is or will be, but it might not matter. He still brings some things that the Bulls lack.

I think he's a year or so away, but there's definitely something there, and he'll definitely have his moments next season.

I hope that Tyrus and Thabo play some 1 on 1 in their free time till they pass out.

.

..

...

Perverts.


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## fleetwood macbull (Jan 23, 2004)

for people if they want to obsess about being a 3ish type in measurements. Well thats myopic.

Like Slim says, damn what you call him, he provides all those length and athletic attributes the Bulls lack. Thats filling a hole people. And dare I say, if these passing, shooting and ballhandling skills today have not fooled all you guys because they might be a mirage, you put that stuff on the end of that kind of athleticism and length package, and the Bulls have a player in Thomas that resembles _nothing_ they currently have.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

fleetwood macbull said:


> for people if they want to obsess about being a 3ish type in measurements. Well thats myopic.
> 
> Like Slim says, damn what you call him, he provides all those length and athletic attributes the Bulls lack. Thats filling a hole people. And dare I say, if these passing, shooting and ballhandling skills today have not fooled all you guys because they might be a mirage, you put that stuff on the end of that kind of athleticism and length package, and the Bulls have a player in Thomas that resembles _nothing_ they currently have.


Very true!


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

fleetwood macbull said:


> for people if they want to obsess about being a 3ish type in measurements. Well thats myopic.
> 
> Like Slim says, damn what you call him, he provides all those length and athletic attributes the Bulls lack. Thats filling a hole people. And dare I say, if these passing, shooting and ballhandling skills today have not fooled all you guys because they might be a mirage, you put that stuff on the end of that kind of athleticism and length package, and the Bulls have a player in Thomas that resembles _nothing_ they currently have.


He actually has good ballhandling skills that he demonstrated in the game? If what you say here is accurate, then it's sounding good. We've needed some guys with skills that are bigger for a while now. Someone posted something a while back that he plays like a 7 footer due to his arm length combined with his size, so perhaps he can get by with being smaller if he's that long and athletic, with skill to match?


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## darlets (Jul 31, 2002)

From what I saw and from the draftexpress recap, we were getting our butts kicked, then TT was swapped onto May and Thabo onto Morrison, who they proceeded to play very good D on.

There's going to be times when we play line ups of
PG Kirk/Duhon
SG Thabo/Kirk
SF Deng/Noc
PF Noc/TT
C Wallace/Brown

All very good defenders. And fingers cross Ben continues to improve on D.

O.K, I've edited this post, I started listed our defensive line up and realize that I was pretty much just listing most of our core that look like they'll get minutes this year, with the exception of Ben. Ben improved his D last year and I expect being a hard worker that will continue.


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## fleetwood macbull (Jan 23, 2004)

darlets said:


> From what I saw and from the draftexpress recap, we were getting our butts kicked, then TT was swapped onto May and Thabo onto Morrison, who they proceeded to play very good D on.
> 
> There's going to be times when we play line ups of
> PG Kirk/Duhon
> ...


To me, Ben Wallace has at least one probably 2 great years left in him. With Detroit, it was always that length, quickness to the ball and recognition that locked the opponent down.

The Bulls could have a similar effect. The Pistons did not have an athletic freak of nature, but Prince was the guy doing the job causing defensive mayhem. With the Bulls perhaps it may be Tyrus as soon as he is ready to get respect from refs.

You know Tyrus might get whistled a ton this season


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## Wynn (Jun 3, 2002)

darlets said:


> From what I saw and from the draftexpress recap, we were getting our butts kicked, then TT was swapped onto May and Thabo onto Morrison, who they proceeded to play very good D on.
> 
> There's going to be times when we play line ups of
> PG Kirk/Duhon
> ...


Did you mean to leave Gordon completely out of your line-ups?


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## jalen5 (Nov 19, 2004)

DaBabyBullz said:


> He actually has good ballhandling skills that he demonstrated in the game? If what you say here is accurate, then it's sounding good. We've needed some guys with skills that are bigger for a while now. Someone posted something a while back that he plays like a 7 footer due to his arm length combined with his size, so perhaps he can get by with being smaller if he's that long and athletic, with skill to match?



YES, he has good ballhandlings skills...YES, he plays like a 7 footer due to his AMAZING wingspan and reach and his ability to jump to heaven....YES, he can shoot the ball....

I've been telling yall this for awhile now....Some have agreed, some have not...Thank you to those who have believed me and have agreed...hopefully, the doubters have been shut up a little bit after his great performance tonight...HOWEVER, just as it was important to mention that this was just a SL game yesterday when he didn't play up to his talent level, it is equally important to remember that it was just a SL game after his GREAT performance...he's young and still very unexperienced so don't expect it every night. He stills needs to grow and learn as a player, but, as you saw tonight, he has the building blocks to be great...he has to continue to work hard and PUT on some MUSCLE WEIGHT and get in a little better game shape....everyone will really enjoy watching him play for the rest of his career...

I just wish he would have made that dunk when he drove from the top of the key and spun in the lane and went up to flush it; usually he makes that, guess it just slipped out his hand this time...I've seen him do it ALOT live and in person...oh, and IMO, he has the ability to hit the 3 as well; I can't tell you how many times I've gone in the LSU rec center and have seen him either playing or just shooting (w/ someone rebounding for him) and he was just drilling shot after shot from the volleyball line. I mean, don't expect him to make 5 a game (he won't even take 5 a game) or anything but he can make the occasional 3...


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

jalen5 said:


> YES, he has good ballhandlings skills...YES, he plays like a 7 footer due to his AMAZING wingspan and reach and his ability to jump to heaven....YES, he can shoot the ball....
> 
> I've been telling yall this for awhile now....Some have agreed, some have not...Thank you to those who have believed me and have agreed...hopefully, the doubters have been shut up a little bit after his great performance tonight...HOWEVER, just as it was important to mention that this was just a SL game yesterday when he didn't play up to his talent level, it is equally important to remember that it was just a SL game after his GREAT performance...he's young and still very unexperienced so don't expect it every night. He stills needs to grow and learn as a player, but, as you saw tonight, he has the building blocks to be great...he has to continue to work hard and PUT on some MUSCLE WEIGHT and get in a little better game shape....everyone will really enjoy watching him play for the rest of his career...
> 
> I just wish he would have made that dunk when he drove from the top of the key and spun in the lane and went up to flush it; usually he makes that, guess it just slipped out his hand this time...I've seen him do it ALOT live and in person...oh, and IMO, he has the ability to hit the 3 as well; I can't tell you how many times I've gone in the LSU rec center and have seen him either playing or just shooting (w/ someone rebounding for him) and he was just drilling shot after shot from the volleyball line. I mean, don't expect him to make 5 a game (he won't even take 5 a game) or anything but he can make the occasional 3...




Thanks for the info...


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## darlets (Jul 31, 2002)

Wynn said:


> Did you mean to leave Gordon completely out of your line-ups?


Naah, I was just listing some "Defensive line ups" and it became apparent that we've got alot of flexibility.

One thing people seemingly have over looked this off season is Paxson hasn't brought anyone in to be the primary focus of the offense. So I think the powers that be are giving Ben the thumbs up to be the man on offence.


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## Wynn (Jun 3, 2002)

darlets said:


> Naah, I was just listing some "Defensive line ups" and it became apparent that we've got alot of flexibility.
> 
> One thing people seemingly have over looked this off season is Paxson hasn't brought anyone in to be the primary focus of the offense. So I think the powers that be are giving Ben the thumbs up to be the man on offence.


I was also noticing the apparent total lack of interest in the offense. Then I realized that Kirk, Ben, and Noc all averaged 20+ against the Heats in the play-off. Deng and Du have been known to get hot on occassion, Big Ben and Tyrus ought to account for some offense just through rebounds and putbacks. Sef looks like another creator. Sweets and PJ can also get theirs in the paint when necessary. Looks like we'll be scoring by committee again, likely with L'il Ben as the "Go To Guy" when it matters.

Another thing I'm just considering about picking up PJ and Big Ben is some respect from the refs. Maybe, just maybe, having some established vet beef in the paint will get us some calls in our direction.


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## BDMcGee (May 12, 2006)

Tyrus definitely had a great performance tonight. He shot the ball really well except on the free throw line. I also loved to see that he pulled down 11 rebounds in 25 minutes of play. This guy's upside potential is just tremendous. He definitely has a shot to become the best player to come out of this draft. Thabo has also been a pleasant surprise. He's more polished than I thought he was and he appears to be a perfect fit for this team. Coming into the draft I thought that Carney and Brewer were better prospects than him, but it appears that he has a chance to be the second best shooting guard to come out of this draft after Brandon Roy.


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## paxman (Apr 24, 2006)

jalen5 said:


> I just wish he would have made that dunk when he drove from the top of the key and spun in the lane and went up to flush it; usually he makes that, guess it just slipped out his hand this time.


that move made me :eek8:
b/c he was actually a little far from the basket and most people would try 
to just throw it up. great to see his aggressiveness to jam it in there :clap: 
fwiw, he already has displayed more post moves than chandler :laugh:

thanks for the info jalen5


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## jbulls (Aug 31, 2005)

fleetwood macbull said:


> may I suggest...lithium?


What a difference a day makes. Here's hoping you don't treat us to these absurd posts after every summer league game.

(the thread starter fleetwood, not you :biggrin: )


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## MVPKirk (Dec 17, 2004)

He seems more like a 4 to me, plays very big.


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## 7RINGS? (Sep 28, 2004)

Yea him and the french dude played well I was impressed by both of then on "D"! Sofolosha? It sounds like he was holding Morrison in check in the second half and Tyrus owned Sean May on "D" TOO!!! Morrison may win ROY now but the future is bright for our two guys!! :biggrin: :clap:


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## jalen5 (Nov 19, 2004)

paxman said:


> that move made me :eek8:
> b/c he was actually a little far from the basket and most people would try
> to just throw it up. great to see his aggressiveness to jam it in there :clap:
> fwiw, he already has displayed more post moves than chandler :laughs:
> ...


yea, he's got crazy athleticism and hops...I can't imagine how crazy yall would have gone if he would have thrown it down...and he has better moves than most ppl have seen from him; always room to improve in that department tho...hopefully, he stays aggressive and active every game b/c if so, you will see this night in and night out...but he's gotta stay aggressive and active...and put on WEIGHT

OH, I just thought of a dunk that Tyrus did at LSU against Arkansas...ya'll might have already seen it but if not, I'ma try to find the link and post it...I was at the game of course since it was at LSU and it was the best dunk I have ever seen in person...


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## jalen5 (Nov 19, 2004)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rdclJJOaU8&search=tyrus thomas

here it is guys...when Garrett Temple (the guy that threw the alley oop to Tyrus) threw the ball up to him, I swear I was like "oh, that's goin over his head"....but then Tyrus goes UP and UP and UP and gets it...it was AMAZING...he was still goin up when he caught it!


...tell me what yall think of it...


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## darlets (Jul 31, 2002)

Wynn said:


> I was also noticing the apparent total lack of interest in the offense. Then I realized that Kirk, Ben, and Noc all averaged 20+ against the Heats in the play-off. Deng and Du have been known to get hot on occassion, Big Ben and Tyrus ought to account for some offense just through rebounds and putbacks. Sef looks like another creator. Sweets and PJ can also get theirs in the paint when necessary. Looks like we'll be scoring by committee again, likely with L'il Ben as the "Go To Guy" when it matters.
> 
> Another thing I'm just considering about picking up PJ and Big Ben is some respect from the refs. Maybe, just maybe, having some established vet beef in the paint will get us some calls in our direction.


I'm hoping/thinking we should get a few extra points a game through fast breaks triggered by good d and a few extra points for the vet calls.


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## paxman (Apr 24, 2006)

darlets said:


> a few extra points for the vet calls.



here here :cheers:


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

jalen5 said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rdclJJOaU8&search=tyrus thomas
> 
> here it is guys...when Garrett Temple (the guy that threw the alley oop to Tyrus) threw the ball up to him, I swear I was like "oh, that's goin over his head"....but then Tyrus goes UP and UP and UP and gets it...it was AMAZING...he was still goin up when he caught it!
> 
> ...


That was pretty awesome, looks like he hit the backboard, but couldn't tell for sure, definitely has some major hops. Looked like it turned into one hell of a game too lol.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

Thomas flashed a rather incredible set of skills today against Charlotte. I still think I want him to play at the 4, but there are a lot of 4's who spend some time on the perimeter. That's fine with me. I just think that I'd probably want him guarding the other team's 4 more than Deng or Nocioni, at least in the long term. We have three really talented young forwards, and none of them are very tall, but all are very talented.

The key to being a great player is being relatively consistent. I think Tyrus has great talent, but I hope he will really be able to keep his mind centered to harness it all. I think if he can hit the 12 foot jumper with some consistency and if he can take one or two quick dribbles around someone and throw down, he's going to be hard to defend.

Tyrus Thomas was 5th on my personal draft board. He was not "my guy." However, now that he's a Bull, I hope I was dead wrong about him.


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## RoRo (Aug 21, 2002)

jalen5 said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rdclJJOaU8&search=tyrus thomas
> 
> here it is guys...when Garrett Temple (the guy that threw the alley oop to Tyrus) threw the ball up to him, I swear I was like "oh, that's goin over his head"....but then Tyrus goes UP and UP and UP and gets it...it was AMAZING...he was still goin up when he caught it!
> 
> ...


too high? he caught the pass, and if ya watch it closely, he keeps going up with it for a couple more inches. scary!

thabo (or as the announcers called thabolfeshola lol) and thomas looked really good today. hope they continue the trend next game. and we might have a credible fast break attack this year. thomas looks like he knows how to board and start a break, he really looks to push the ball. and thabo looks very comfy driving and dishing.


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## lorgg (Dec 8, 2003)

darlets said:


> From what I saw and from the draftexpress recap, we were getting our butts kicked, then TT was swapped onto May and Thabo onto Morrison, who they proceeded to play very good D on.
> 
> There's going to be times when we play line ups of
> PG Kirk/Duhon
> ...


I think Noc. will get like 40 minutes a game.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

> Bulls
> 
> Tyrus Thomas
> 
> ...


taken from draft express's review


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

Okay, I didn't watch the game yesterday. But I just got done watching the video highlights. 

Tyrus Thomas showed some extremely impressive ball handling and passing skills in that game. Not to mention the long range shot (which I'd already seen) and his athleticism (same). 

It reminded me of the Bargnani video clips, except it was 5x more impressive. 

Oh, and Thabo sure can break down a defense (a summer league defense). Based on early returns, it looks like a great draft for Paxson. Again.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

Ron Cey said:


> Okay, I didn't watch the game yesterday. But I just got done watching the video highlights.
> 
> Tyrus Thomas showed some extremely impressive ball handling and passing skills in that game. Not to mention the long range shot (which I'd already seen) and his athleticism (same).
> 
> ...


where are the highlights?


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

The ROY said:


> where are the highlights?



http://yourchicagobulls.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=156

I found it here. I would like to see the whole game though if anyone has it.


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## Good Hope (Nov 27, 2002)

Ron Cey said:


> Okay, I didn't watch the game yesterday. But I just got done watching the video highlights.
> 
> Tyrus Thomas showed some extremely impressive ball handling and passing skills in that game. Not to mention the long range shot (which I'd already seen) and his athleticism (same).
> 
> ...


Same here.

You know, I want to say that I don't recall a rookie drafted in the past 8 years by the Bulls, (except Elton, of course), who looked as good and hopeful as these two have looked in these two games. 

Every year, whether it was Fizer and JC, the twin toddlers, Jay Williams, even Kirk, and then Ben and Luol (Although I don't recall the summer league for those two as well), things looked really rough. But these two have a spark that previous fellows have not had. 

Of course, it's summer league. But it's definitely a flash of some kind of skill level that goes beyond "grittiness" or even "potential". "Freakish potential?" Is that the word? 

I'm looking forward to seeing what these guys can do in the real games and with real teammates.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

Good Hope said:


> Same here.
> 
> You know, I want to say that I don't recall a rookie drafted in the past 8 years by the Bulls, (except Elton, of course), who looked as good and hopeful as these two have looked in these two games.
> 
> ...


Nocioni, Gordon, Deng & Hinrich are PERRRFECT for Thabo & Tyrus.

I'm glad we drafted those 2.


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## jbulls (Aug 31, 2005)

Ron Cey said:


> Okay, I didn't watch the game yesterday. But I just got done watching the video highlights.
> 
> Tyrus Thomas showed some extremely impressive ball handling and passing skills in that game. Not to mention the long range shot (which I'd already seen) and his athleticism (same).
> 
> ...


I agree. I think the "6'8'' Chandler" comparisons are way off base. I don't remember the last time I saw Chandler spin baseline for a dunk, knock down a 20 footer or go glass on a 15 foot jumper. Thomas might be raw but he's clearly got a little more offensive game than he showed at LSU, and a lot more offensive game than Chandler.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

If Tyrus does that spin/dunk move in a real game and makes it..he'll make alot of fans in chicago lol


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

jbulls said:


> I agree. I think the "6'8'' Chandler" comparisons are way off base. I don't remember the last time I saw Chandler spin baseline for a dunk, knock down a 20 footer or go glass on a 15 foot jumper. *Thomas might be raw* but he's clearly got a little more offensive game than he showed at LSU, and a lot more offensive game than Chandler.


The thing is, skill wise I don't think he is raw. Its his understanding of the game that will take time to develope. 

Just terrific to see. I'd previously predicted about 15 minutes a game for him this season. But that was too conservative.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

comparing him to Chandler is a slap in the face.

This kid isn't scared to shoot at all and he doesn't look like crap when he takes the ball up..AND he has handles

The clips showed him having range out to about 22 feet...


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

The ROY said:


> comparing him to Chandler is a slap in the face.


No one who saw him play even one game for LSU would seriously make that comparison.


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## jbulls (Aug 31, 2005)

Ron Cey said:


> No one who saw him play even one game for LSU would seriously make that comparison.


Many have. After his less than flattering DE interview the Tyrus Thomas bandwagon emptied incredibly quickly. The names Stromile Swift and Tyson Chandler were bandied about plenty.


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

Ron Cey said:


> It reminded me of the Bargnani video clips, except it was 5x more impressive.


Wow. Five times? 

Just curious -- is that even after taking into consideration the quality of competition? Those Bargnani clips came vs. actual opponents in actual games in the second-toughest professional league in the world. 

For the record, I liked what I saw out of Thomas yesterday, too. His first game, not so much. He's going to be very raw this year, and it sucks that he's not going to get many minutes at what appears to be his natural position, small forward.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

It seems difficult to gauge now, Tyrus plays like a PF but he also has the speed and skill of a SF. His shooting is pretty damn good, he can create his own shot plus he has handles. On the other end, he mans the paint like a seasoned 7fter. It will be exiciting to see which mold he fits, the Kirilenko/Josh Smith mold or the Amare/Kenyon Martin mold.

1 thing is certain, he's definintely better than Swift & Warrick.


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

ScottMay said:


> Wow. Five times?


Would three be more reasonable?


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

ScottMay said:


> Wow. Five times?
> 
> Just curious -- is that even after taking into consideration the quality of competition? Those Bargnani clips came vs. actual opponents in actual games in the second-toughest professional league in the world.
> 
> For the record, I liked what I saw out of Thomas yesterday, too. His first game, not so much. He's going to be very raw this year, and it sucks that he's not going to get many minutes at what appears to be his natural position, small forward.


Honestly, I'm not worried about him playing small forward or power forward. These days, a lot of power forwards take jumpshots, roam the perimeter, and handle the ball. I'll make a short list:

Nowitski
Antoine Walker
Garnett
Marion
Odom
Murphy (not so much handle)
Gasol
Jeffries
Villanueva
Bargnani
Sheed

Those are just 10 off the top of my head. Some of those guys really don't have any post skills at all, and they still play the 4. I still like the idea of Thomas at least playing the 4 on defense, as it will in general leave him closer to the rim to block shots and rebound. But as for on offense, there's no rule that you have to play on the block all the time to be a 4 these days. Thomas will get his chance to play on the perimeter if he is consistent enough. 

I still like him best at the high post or from the elbow in. I like that he can either rise up for the 12-15 footer or face up with a couple quick dribbles and dunk on you. That's a potentially deadly combination.


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## lorgg (Dec 8, 2003)

jbulls said:


> I agree. I think the "6'8'' Chandler" comparisons are way off base. I don't remember the last time I saw Chandler spin baseline for a dunk, knock down a 20 footer or go glass on a 15 foot jumper. Thomas might be raw but he's clearly got a little more offensive game than he showed at LSU, and a lot more offensive game than Chandler.


He made Chandler look silly. I wonder what TC would have done in this game?


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## DengNabbit (Feb 23, 2005)

still unbelievable that NOK took Tyson's contract


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

> Wow. Five times?


Six. Four. Three. Seven. Far more impressive. Not even close, in my opinion. 



> Just curious -- is that even after taking into consideration the quality of competition? Those Bargnani clips came vs. actual opponents in actual games in the second-toughest professional league in the world.


For the record, *I'm talking purely about video clips*. I'm certainly not saying that Thomas will be 5x better than Bargnani.

But those video clips of Bargnani were of him dribbling in the open court, running off of screens, and putting up largely uncontested jumpers on the perimeter. Notwithstanding the league, I don't know what team he was playing, how good that team is, who was defending him, how good that defender is, if it was garbage time, etc. 

The clips of Thomas showed him:

(a) scoring in close - including a spinning pivot in the lane for a blown dunk.

(b) hitting mid range and long range jumpers including a nice use of the glass.

(c) leading a fast break.

(d) Making timing passes including a feed to a back door cut on a very difficult angle.

(e) Getting up incredibly fast to block shots.

(f) elevating way above everyone for rebounds in traffic.

(g) showing a half court hesitation dribble and going behind his back on the perimeter; and

(h) showing of hops and speed that that make Bargnani look like he's standing in cement in his highlight videos.

Taking *what I saw in the clips*, and comparing them, Thomas looked a lot more impressive. 

Lets put it this way, if they were both from Europe and all we had was those two sets of clips leading up to the draft, you'd be hard pressed to find a Bulls fan that would have been pulling for Bargnani over Thomas. 



> For the record, I liked what I saw out of Thomas yesterday, too. His first game, not so much. He's going to be very raw this year, and it sucks that he's not going to get many minutes at what appears to be his natural position, small forward.


I maintain that he's a 4. Being able to handle, pass and run the open floor is just a plus. Much like it is a plus with Bargnani.


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## transplant (Jul 31, 2002)

Tyrus was not my choice for the Bulls' pick. I wanted Roy.

While I don't put much stock in summer league games, I gotta admit that the 7 minute highlight clip had me riveted. I knew Thomas could run, jump, rebound and dunk. I'd seen it in the tourney. The ballhandling and shooting was a little bit of a revelation for me. This kid looks much more skilled than I thought he'd be.

Obviously, the competition in the SL isn't anything like the league. Still, that 7 minutes has me thinking that TT ain't quite as much a project as I thought.

Oh yeah, and Sefolosha's play has just about gotten me over my Brandon Roy envy.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

O'Bryant is way more of a project than Thomas IMO.

Thomas hasn't shown any cluelessness since he's been playing. Just rust.

He might not give you the greatest numbers in his first year but he does a little bit of everything and very well, I might add.


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## theanimal23 (Mar 2, 2005)

We had the best draft. I know it's still summer league, but man, you get an idea of what these guys are capable. Thabo's D on Morrison was great. The guy is freakishly long, can slash (none of our guys do that) and can play the point well. Once he learns to shoot consistantly, this guy can be scary.

As for Thomas, all the tools are there to be a unique player. If he can add some bulk without losing his hops/speed, man, he will be lethal. The rust is showing. Pax is one hell of a talent evaluator. This goes back to him saying how he was accurate with most of last year's picks. 

Tyrus will be starting by next year. If PJ is around, PJ will likely start to maintain the Vet Leadership role.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

theanimal23 said:


> Thabo's D on Morrison was great. The guy is freakishly long, can slash (none of our guys do that)



luol


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

transplant said:


> Oh yeah, and Sefolosha's play has just about gotten me over my Brandon Roy envy.


It's really helping ease the pain for me too.


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

Ron Cey said:


> Six. Four. Three. Seven. Far more impressive. Not even close, in my opinion.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It doesn't seem like you saw all of the Bargnani clips (honestly). They featured lots of dunks, lots of opponents getting their shot blocked, plenty of mid-range Js off the dribble, post moves, nice pick-and-roll and pick-and-pop, etc. 



> Lets put it this way, if they were both from Europe and all we had was those two sets of clips leading up to the draft, you'd be hard pressed to find a Bulls fan that would have been pulling for Bargnani over Thomas.


I would have been one of them. Bargnani is 7-1, he has legitimate 25-foot+ range, and he has more of a knack for scoring. Thomas has a pronounced edge in athleticism, and in his second summer league game he displayed that he does have unusual skills for his size. But that's where competition matters, even within the context of "just the clips" -- Bargnani did it in real, actual, high-level pro games, although yes, in a lawyerly, technical sense, I suppose I can't conclusively rule out the possibility that his multiple distinct highlight clips were grafted from garbage time in blowout games against the two worst teams in Series A. I guess I would argue that the two worst teams in Series A are better than the majority of NBA summer league teams. Remember, Aaron Miles is the Orlando league MVP through two games.



> I maintain that he's a 4. Being able to handle, pass and run the open floor is just a plus. Much like it is a plus with Bargnani.


When my eyes say 3, when the two announcers assigned to cover his first summer league say without equivocation that he's a 3, and when the player himself says 3, he's probably a 3. The problem isn't necessarily offense -- hell, Jannero Pargo would make a freaking great 4 in that respect. Unless he bulks up significantly, I think he'll take too much of a pounding guarding 4s to do it successfully for the long haul. Bargnani has a much better base to be a 4 or even a 5.


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## Ron Cey (Dec 27, 2004)

> *It doesn't seem like you saw all of the Bargnani clips (honestly)*. They featured lots of dunks, lots of opponents getting their shot blocked, plenty of mid-range Js off the dribble, post moves, nice pick-and-roll and pick-and-pop, etc.


I don't doubt that. 



> I would have been one of them.


I don't doubt that either. 



> Bargnani is 7-1, he has legitimate 25-foot+ range, and he has more of a knack for scoring.


I agree with that. 



> Thomas has a pronounced edge in athleticism, and in his second summer league game he displayed that he does have unusual skills for his size.


Right. 



> But that's where competition matters, even within the context of "just the clips" -- Bargnani did it in real, actual, high-level pro games, although yes, *in a lawyerly, technical sense*, I suppose I can't conclusively rule out the possibility that his multiple distinct highlight clips were grafted from garbage time in blowout games against the two worst teams in Series A.


Its not lawyerly or technical. Its accurate. Being in a good league doesn't mean that your nondescript, pick the best of bundle, highlight clips were against good team or individual competition. I'm not saying they weren't against great individual or team defenders, I'm saying we don't know. Therefore, in analyzing highlight clips, the quality of the league doesn't mean all that much to me. 

Thabo shut down Adam Morrison in the second half. I'm sure there are videos equally impressive of Michael Pietrus across the pond "locking down" some euro-scrub who can't score to save his life. 

I'm looking at visible skills and athleticism. And I come away far more impressed with Thomas. This is not a slight on Bargnani. 



> I guess I would argue that the two worst teams in Series A are better than the majority of NBA summer league teams. Remember, Aaron Miles is the Orlando league MVP through two games.


Probably so. But when you are looking at video clips you are looking at slivers of time from those games without regard to who is on the court, what their skills are, and what the in-game circumstances are. 



> When my eyes say 3, when the two announcers assigned to cover his first summer league say without equivocation that he's a 3, and when the player himself says 3, he's probably a 3.


My eyes say 4. I don't put much stock in what the web-cam dudes think about it. And I've repeatedly written that I disagree with Tyrus himself on this point. Tim Duncan always steadfastly refused to label himself as a center. "I'm a power forward." But he plays more of a center's role than most power forwards do. Hell, more than some centers do. 

I consider Thomas a 4 with a lot of skills that would allow him to play the 3. Perhaps he'll get minutes at both spots. But I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts he plays the 4 almost exclusively for his first couple of seasons and that he'll eventually grow into that role. Though he most definitely will not play that position in the conventional Karl Malone/Chris Webber style. 



> The problem isn't necessarily offense -- hell, Jannero Pargo would make a freaking great 4 in that respect. Unless he bulks up significantly, I think he'll take too much of a pounding guarding 4s to do it successfully for the long haul. Bargnani has a much better base to be a 4 or even a 5.


I think Tyrus will bulk up. And I agree that Bargnani is without question more physically suited to play the 4 than Thomas is.


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## transplant (Jul 31, 2002)

I must have seen different Bargnani clips. Pretty much everything I saw was perimeter-oriented (but the clips were very impressive, nonetheless). Are there clips where Bargnani is banging?

Both Bargnani and Thomas look skinny to me. I've seen Bargnani listed at anywhere from 225 to 240...big difference. Bargnani's taller - Thomas has more hops, right?

From what I've seen, and admittedly, I've seen much more of Thomas, Tyrus looks like a guy who is more comfortable mucking and grinding inside, regardless of his fairly slight build.

We can continue arguing 3 vs 4 for both these guys if we really want to. It doesn't matter much to me. Thomas is going to get most of his minutes at the 4. The fact that he has a better shot and better handle than we thought is just all good.


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

Are the European Leagues really head and shoulders above the Summer leagues? What percentage of players from each league will play in the NBA? I can't imagine that the Euro league is much higher, given the fact that every NBA player plays summer league ball at somepoint but not every player plays Euroleague.


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

TripleDouble said:


> Are the European Leagues really head and shoulders above the Summer leagues? What percentage of players from each league will play in the NBA? I can't imagine that the Euro league is much higher, given the fact that every NBA player plays summer league ball at somepoint but not every player plays Euroleague.



yeah just about every euroleague team is MUCH more skilled than our summer league teams. Of course a lot of that has to do with playing together as a team for years as much as it does individual talent. Bargnani played for Bennetton Treviso which is one of the tougher euro divisions. Summer league is primarly composed of the good rookies that got drafted, guys who didn't get drafted and are praying and hoping on making a team, and guys like Amal Mcaskill who live for summer league play and 10 day contracts if they are lucky.


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## TripleDouble (Jul 26, 2002)

ace20004u said:


> yeah just about every euroleague team is MUCH more skilled than our summer league teams. Of course a lot of that has to do with playing together as a team for years as much as it does individual talent. Bargnani played for Bennetton Treviso which is one of the tougher euro divisions. Summer league is primarly composed of the good rookies that got drafted, guys who didn't get drafted and are praying and hoping on making a team, and guys like Amal Mcaskill who live for summer league play and 10 day contracts if they are lucky.


But are their individual defenders significantly better than the summer league defenders?


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

TripleDouble said:


> But are their individual defenders significantly better than the summer league defenders?


Thats a tough one. In a nutshell, some are and some aren't. Overall I would have to say euroleague defense is better than summer league because euro league teams are used to playing team defense and the whole team is basically guys who belong at the level their playing at, summer league teams are thrown together, barely coached, not used to playing together, and some of the guys playing will never see a real NBA jersey unless it is hanging in foot locker waiting for them to buy it. 

Individually it is just like everywhere else, some guys are good defenders like Sefolosha, others like Pasilic leave a little to be desired. Pretty similar with Summer league Americans too. Tyrus plays pretty good defense but Morrisson doesn't...and so on.


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## jalen5 (Nov 19, 2004)

jbulls said:


> Many have. After his less than flattering *DE interview * the Tyrus Thomas bandwagon emptied incredibly quickly. The names Stromile Swift and Tyson Chandler were bandied about plenty.


please explain...I don't know what you're talking about...


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

Are ya'll watching the Bulls vs Miami game!? Tyrus is draining 20footers and free throws like he's JJ Reddick


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## jalen5 (Nov 19, 2004)

The ROY said:


> Are ya'll watching the Bulls vs Miami game!? Tyrus is draining 20footers and free throws like he's JJ Reddick



hahah...sure am....and yes he is!


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## bullguy (Oct 4, 2005)

What did he finish from the field 4-17? He sure was lighting em up

If he plays like this, his *** will be firmly cemented to the bench.


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## jalen5 (Nov 19, 2004)

bullguy said:


> What did he finish from the field 4-17? He sure was lighting em up
> 
> If he plays like this, his *** will be firmly cemented to the bench.


His role on the SL team is the same as it will be when he plays w/ the real Bulls...and, also, he's young...he's not shoot well or play well EVERY night....ever seen IVERSON go 8 for 29 in a game, it happens..."oh, Iverson must not be as good as I thought he was"...please


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

holy p...p...p...project batman

But he shure do jump.


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

bullguy said:


> What did he finish from the field 4-17? He sure was lighting em up
> 
> If he plays like this, his *** will be firmly cemented to the bench.


Not if he still has 19 points, 12 boards, 2 assists and a steal without committing many fouls or turning it over he won't.

--

In the Tyrus Vs. Elton thread I had this post, which got no play amongst OT bickering, so I'll post it here just so I can be on-record about how I think TT is going to pan out:

Aside from being a little undersized but with long arms, I don't see the Elton comparison.

I actually think TT's best comparison is Kevin Garnett. From the little I've seen him play, and what I know about him, he just screams Kevin Garnett, actually.

*Body Type*
Elton, despite being short, is more of a widebody. Even after losing weight. TT, like KG, is defined (aside: Chandler's arms have always looked like my grandma's. TT is skinny and weak now, but at least he looks chisled), but he's all arms and legs.

KG was maybe an inch taller or two coming into the league, but I doubt he weighed a Big Mac's difference from TT. They have incredibly similar bodies IMO. And absolutely unreal athleticism. Obviously KG's not quite as quick as he was at 18 or 19, but remember him as a rookie.

Marion, IMO, isn't quite as good a comparison because he's got a little bit different body type altogether. He's probably an inch or two shorter than TT, but he looks quite a bit more muscular to me. He actually reminds me more of Elton in terms of body. A shorter, quicker, super in-shape Elton.

*Mindset*
TT, like KG, comes off as a super fiery, determined guy. Perhaps too emotional at some points, but a serious sort who's all business. Elton has a great personality and has generally been a hard worker, but I don't think he's anything like that. He's not always been in the best shape and he's known, generally, as one of the league's nicest guys. Nobody has ever called KG that, and I don't think anyone will call TT that either. Determined, yes, not nice.

*Skills*
This is really hard to tell, because you have to think back to when KG first came into the league, and you have to think about what he could and couldn't do. He didn't have half the skills he has now, but you could see glimpses. And you have to look at TT and look for clues about what's going to emerge.

When I see TT, I see a guy without polish, but I see:
* A guy who is capable of hitting a jumper already. He doesn't have a great one or anything, but he's flashed it.
* A guy with the vision to find guys and occasionally make some really deft passes.
* A guy with quick hands who can steal the ball.
* A guy with the athleticism to guard anyone except purely big lumbering guys who'll outmuscle him.

That all looks young KG to me. Other guys have more or less similar bodies (Wilcox, Josh Smith, Rudy Gay, Antonio McDyess), but they've got different skillsets and heads. The one TT reminds me most of is Garnett.

Obviously, how close he comes to Garnett depends on his head, but that's what I see. Even as a high schooler, KG might have had a little bit better basketball IQ than TT. And we need to see how much of TT's apparent dedication turns out to be real, and how much is talk. I'm hopeful, but that'll be a key thing to watch.

The other downside I see is that several guys with similar bodies have spent a lot of time being injured. They're Corvettes, and Corvettes run great when they work, but they also seem to spend a lot of time in the shop. KG is unusual in that he's an athletic string bean, but he's also been a veritable iron man.


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## Geaux Tigers (Apr 26, 2004)

HaHA at LSU Tyrus gave up like 30 points over the course of the season with goaltends. The kid goes up and gets em and he blocks waaaayy more than he goaltends so its all good.

I'm excited I finally get to share Tyrus with the rest of the world.


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

Mike, being as it was the pre-League Pass years, I didn't see a lot of Garnett his first couple of years -- just the games vs. the Bulls and the occasional national game.

I did have the good fortune to see Garnett play live four or five times his senior year in high school, though. He was a lot more skilled than you're giving him credit for. In the Public League semi vs. Westinghouse, e.g., he actually played a little bit of point guard, he was something ridiculous like 16/17 from the free-throw line, he completed three or four pinpoint alley-oop passes to Fields, one of them from the halfcourt stripe . . . every time I saw him play I was far more impressed with his skill than his athleticism (Fields got most of the acclaim in that department).

And he was pretty much a finesse/skill player the second he stepped into the league. Check out his rookie-year boxscores -- even after the Wolves started him and played him as many minutes as he could stand, he barely went to the line. He's always been predominately a jump-shooter, not a dunker/finisher. His passing skills were there from the jump, and by year three he was averaging 4 assists a game. 

I actually think Thomas is a much more explosive and powerful athlete than Garnett is/was, despite the similarity in their builds. He's got a quicker leap and a better first step. I don't think he's anywhere near as skilled, either scoring-wise or fundamentals-wise (Garnett blew my mind with how good of a "little things" player he was in HS -- great screen-setter, block-outs, defensive IQ, etc). But that's not to say he isn't skilled; he is. He's got a great base and I agree with you that his upside is enormous.

But I don't think he'll ever top out as good as someone like Garnett, and the reason why boils down to something Tyrus can do nothing about -- his height. Garnett's 6-11 listing is from his rookie year, and it's widely acknowledged to be inaccurate and/or he grew afterward. KG is at least 7-0 and maybe even 7-1. Let's assume that Thomas grows another inch (which doesn't always happen) and tops out at 6-10. That three-inch seems so inconsequential, but it's just hugely important -- I think KG's longevity owes as much to his height as it does his conditioning and attitude and luck. 

Unless he fills out quite a bit (which might negatively impact his leaping ability, but that's for another thread), Thomas is going to have to rely on athleticism to a degree that KG does not. This is not to say that KG isn't a great athlete, but I see him more as an endurance/strength guy, not an exploder. His height helps him dominate the glass without having to expend a ton of energy. His height helps him get that extra fifth of a second on all those jumpers. It helps him see the court better. It gives him just that little edge.

Thomas can definitely compensate with his athleticism, but as you point out, for how long? I wish I could find the link, but I read an article this year about how the Suns were worried that Marion was losing a lot of lift in fourth quarters. They did some workups on him and found that his calves and Achilles were getting too tight from all the work he was doing the first three quarters. So now he goes through these agonizingly painful hour-long or more stretching/massage sessions on game day, where they basically manipulate the tissue to break up the tightness and increase blood flow. That's just one example, and at the end of the day Marion's fine, but it seems to me the smallish high-flyer playing at a power position is only going to be able to do it for so long. It's not a coincidence that seemingly every time he opens his mouth, Marion is pleading to go back to the 3.

Garnett has made 9 All-Star appearances, 7 All-NBA first or second teams, 6 first-team All Defense, he's won an MVP and been runner-up (I think) twice, he averaged 20/10/5 for 6 seasons in a row . . . this is a pretty damn high bar. I think Thomas can be a great player, but I don't think he has the build or the skills to reach Garnett's level, even if a lot of the unknowns break his way.


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## El Chapu (Oct 23, 2004)

And Charles Barkley will never be a HOF since he is 6'5, 6'6 tops.


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

El Chapu said:


> And Charles Barkley will never be a HOF since he is 6'5, 6'6 tops.


Well, if you see Tyrus Thomas getting up to 260-270 pounds while remaining quick as a cat and not losing much of his leaping ability, you've made an excellent point here. 

Otherwise . . .


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## Sir Patchwork (Jan 12, 2005)

Just like I predicted, one bad game and he is NBDL material, one good game and he is a hall of famer. 

Seriously though I think he will be a good player in this league. In reality, his biggest struggle is finding a position and a role where he can be effective. This puts some responsibility on John Paxson. Of course we'll need to wait to see if Tyrus is worth it, but if he is, Paxson will need to find the right frontcourt player(s) to compliment him and cover weakness/magnify strength. 

I still think Andrei Kirilenko is the best comparison. Thomas has more raw athleticism, but Kirilenko is as quick as anyone in the league off his feet, and has great length, so he doesn't need to get extremely high to block shots, even though he does get good height. Kirilenko is also a good all-around offensive player. He is a gifted passer, shooter, scorer, ball handler and so on. He isn't great at anything on offense, but he is good. Personally, I think his man defense is overrated too. Kirilenko can't stay with small forwards because he is too big and lacks the lateral quickness, but is too small to guard power forwards. However, he makes everyone forget about all that with his ridiculous help defense. He has impecable timing on blocked shots and has the entire opposing team looking over their shoulder, which is very valuable because it creates hesitation and indecision. 

As goes with all comparisons though, they're just guidelines for the first couple years. I can't remember one player who didn't become a very different player than who they were compared to in their early years, even those players were the best comparisons. Players make their own way.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

Can a moderator please close this thread? The amount of Tyrus appreciation might catch up to Thabo if we don't put a stop to it.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

Tyrus is gonna be a star in this league, for a LONGGGG time. Maybe not this year but very soon.

I'm happy we drafted him.


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## TheDarkPrince (May 13, 2006)

People need to calm down this is a summer league most of the guys playing won't even be on NBA rosters next year.Heck wasn't Eddie Basden killing Adam Morrison most of the game.I think Eddie needs some love he's gonna be a beast next year. :banana:


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

TheDarkPrince said:


> People need to calm down this is a summer league most of the guys playing won't even be on NBA rosters next year.Heck wasn't Eddie Basden killing Adam Morrison most of the game.I think Eddie needs some love he's gonna be a beast next year. :banana:


no, Morrison was killing him.

Thomas performed at incredibly HIGH levels against some of the best teams in college in CLUTCH situations. Yeah, the SL games don't mean much but it does show Bulls fans who MAY not know much about him, what he CAN do.


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

TheDarkPrince said:


> People need to calm down this is a summer league most of the guys playing won't even be on NBA rosters next year.Heck wasn't Eddie Basden killing Adam Morrison most of the game.I think Eddie needs some love he's gonna be a beast next year. :banana:


No, Eddie did one move on Morrison that embarrassed Morrison. Morrison however dropped 25 points in one half on Eddie. Lets not praise Eddie, he sucks.


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## TheDarkPrince (May 13, 2006)

sloth said:


> No, Eddie did one move on Morrison that embarrassed Morrison. Morrison however dropped 25 points in one half on Eddie. Lets not praise Eddie, he sucks.


I was joking Sloth people just need to calm down it's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too early to tell how good Thomas can or can't be,IMO we won't really know for at least a few years.Just to prove my point there is another thread compairing Thomas to Brand?!Isn't that a bit much as of yet the kid hasn't even played a real NBA game yet.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

He can't shoot, but I do like the fact that he does fill a huge need on offense, in that he takes it inside and get to the line. And...makes his foul shots.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> He can't shoot


?

he shot the same shots the day before and shot a wayyy higher percentage...

he can shoot...but he isn't a shooter


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