# Regular Season Game #9: Bulls V.S. Rockets



## Pimped Out

*Game 9: Bulls @ Rockets*

no one else wanted to do this? its going to be nationally televised on TNT. 7:00 today. i hope to be done with my test by 8:00 and get home to watch the end of this one. i dont feel like making fancy pictures or paragraphs.

i guess i will give a key to this game: dont choke it away!


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## OneBadLT123

*Re: Game 9: Bulls @ Rockets*

Thurs, Nov. 16, 7:00p.m. - Chicago Bulls @ Houston Rockets








TNT ​


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## paintingshade

*Re: Game 9: Bulls @ Rockets*

should be a good game! don't underestimate the bulls... they are a good team.


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## OneBadLT123

*Re: Game 9: Bulls @ Rockets*



paintingshade said:


> should be a good game! don't underestimate the bulls... they are a good team.


A lot of the Chi town guys are calling this a blowout win for the rockets. I dont see it being that kind of game. We lost Hayes, and we came off a horrible game 2 nights ago. I am actually looking forward to this game


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## PriceIsWright

*Re: Game 9: Bulls @ Rockets*

I'm betting every last point on the rockets so they better win hehe


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## Dean the Master

*Houston*







*(5-3)*





































*Chicago Bulls*







*(3-4)*





































*This game is on national coverage power by: *

Preview


> Chicago (3-4) at Houston (5-3) 8:00 pm EST
> 
> HOUSTON (Ticker) - The Houston Rockets and the Chicago Bulls both lost to a Western Conference contender on Tuesday. Two days later, the teams will face off.
> 
> The Rockets will look to avoid losing consecutive games for the first time this season when they take on the Bulls on Thursday.
> 
> Houston, a team on the rise looking to tie San Antonio atop the Southwest Division, led by as many as 19 points before dropping a 92-84 decision to the Spurs on Tuesday.
> 
> Tracy McGrady scored 26 points - 21 in the first half - for the Rockets, who shot just 2-of-17 in the final period to have their four-game winning streak snapped.
> 
> Yao Ming scored 20 points but shot just 7-of-21 from the field for Houston. He had scored 69 points in his previous two games on 26-of-40 shooting.
> 
> Chicago had trouble with another of the Western Conference's top teams, falling to the Dallas Mavericks, 111-89. Kirk Hinrich scored 25 points for the Bulls, who shot 46 percent (39-of-85).
> 
> After an 11-0 run by the Mavericks in the fourth quarter, Chicago responded with a 12-2 spurt to pull within 95-88 on Luol Deng's follow shot with 3:09 left, but the Bulls would get no closer.
> 
> Houston has won six of its last seven contests against Chicago.


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## OneBadLT123

Beware for my constant *****ing, or yelling or anger everytime Rafer, Tmac take retarded shots, or we make some sort of dumb bonehead playes.

All in love for the Rockets


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## paintingshade

true rockets fan ^


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## JuX

Why is Juwan starting?


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## AllEyezonTX

what's up guys? I'm ready to get that ugly win off out backs from the S.A. game (did anyone watch Omeka give it to them). I'm still looking for Tmac to keep it consistant, Yao will be fine. Praying Chuck Hayes will be better than ever when he comes back. Alot a shots from Yao on Big Ben, Ben will be aggresive early, but Yao should be able to calm that down w/ a steady flow of buckets. Let's Ball!


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## OneBadLT123

This pregame show made me sick


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## OneBadLT123

Juxtaposed said:


> Why is Juwan starting?


Chuck hayes is out with a hyper extended knee


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## kisstherim

When the hell will this foreplay thing stop and begin the real stuff?


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## CrackerJack

cant wait, hopefully no collapses today


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## CbobbyB

game time


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## OneBadLT123

here we go! Good Luck rockets!


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## OneBadLT123

where the heck is the foul?


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## kisstherim

they simply can't miss


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## OneBadLT123

they just wont miss


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## OneBadLT123

Man Yao looks sloppy out there


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## CbobbyB

Yao is tired


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## AllEyezonTX

6ptz is nothing for the Rockz to get back, but the way they are looking it can easily turn into 16ptz :curse:


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## Dream Hakeem

WTF!!!!

T-Mac to retire after his contract is done


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## CbobbyB

Dream Hakeem said:


> WTF!!!!
> 
> T-Mac to retire after his contract is done


lol

























...Rudy Gay


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## OneBadLT123

I am really getting sick of Tmac when he opens his mouth


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## AllEyezonTX

lol...nice 3 padg


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## AllEyezonTX

we are absolutly playing down to the enemy tonight...


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## OneBadLT123

here we go, hopefully we keep this momentum


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## OneBadLT123

What got in padgets wheaties


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## OneBadLT123

Man its quiet here tonight.


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## OneBadLT123

Ben Wallace has Yao in check. Man, he has put the clamps down on him


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## Yao Mania

I'm here but won't be staying long
we're whopping them on the board tonight, but somehow its still only a 1pt game. 

Looks like Head's really improved his play this season.


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## OneBadLT123

Padget for MVP!!


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## OneBadLT123

Yao Mania said:


> I'm here but won't be staying long
> we're whopping them on the board tonight, but somehow its still only a 1pt game.
> 
> Looks like Head's really improved his play this season.


Padget came to play tonight...Crazy


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## CbobbyB

We're 4th in the league behind the arc...Novak, where are you!?!


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## OneBadLT123

Padget leads the team with 11...

what the heck lol


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## chn353

whats yao doin .... his missing shots he always makes


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## Yao Mania

We really gotta take advantage of the Bulls bench. Yao shouldn't be having any problems with Sweetney and Thomas.


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## 4BiddenKnight

Yao with the stuff on Sweetney and the finish on the other end of the floor.


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## AllEyezonTX

I will tak 50 @ the half...Rocks have goo history w/ 50ptz, some bad history too....Nice block by Yao @ the end of the half


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## kisstherim

TMAC is hell better than Skip as a playmaker, he's just unbelievable doing the playmaker job


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## OneBadLT123

Ben has kept yao on lock down. But also the entry passes to yao have not been good.
Of all the shots he took, maybe about 3 or 4 tops were just shots he should have made.


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## Hakeem

They're playing Yao too close for him to shoot over them, but he's not taking advantage by making strong moves. 

T-Mac has been excellent.


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## Khm3r

Okay I have to vent on TNT the announcers and so called "experts" Barkley, Kenny, Reggie. First off you know they do not watch the rockets when they say rockets is not a running team this year. COME ON! I know its the beginning of the season, but come on! And Barkley, I agree with him that Yao should dominate against Wallace, but keep saying Shaq was hurt when Yao scored 36 on him. I don't know what to say anymore, Rockets just has no respect around the nation and it pisses me off. 

Thank you for letting me vent!


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## CbobbyB

LUCKY LUCKY LUCKY!!! KOBE, send me a PS3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Yao Mania

I think the expectation is that Yao should be dominating night-in-night-out, even if it is against one of the best defensive players in the league. He's not having a bad game by any stretch though.

Just had a hilarious visit to the Bulls board, I think the Padgett outburst really surprised them :laugh:


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## AllEyezonTX

Khm3r said:


> Okay I have to vent on TNT the announcers and so called "experts" Barkley, Kenny, Reggie. First off you know they do not watch the rockets when they say rockets is not a running team this year. COME ON! I know its the beginning of the season, but come on! And Barkley, I agree with him that Yao should dominate against Wallace, but keep saying Shaq was hurt when Yao scored 36 on him. I don't know what to say anymore, Rockets just has no respect around the nation and it pisses me off.
> 
> Thank you for letting me vent!



We are the only championship team that had to fight to get a Sports Ill. cover, so I'm use to that type of crazyness....


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## OneBadLT123

I love Battier


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## OneBadLT123

*This is Rockets ball! *


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## CbobbyB

T-Mac!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## ThaShark316

Let's hold on to it, guys!

T-Mac f'n over people...too easy for him.


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## OneBadLT123

TMac relying on the bank to make his deposits!


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## AllEyezonTX

WOW....crazy glass shot Tmac! Part 2 of the Tx triangle looking good...


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## kisstherim

TMAC is on fire :banana:


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## Yao Mania

ohhhh yeaaah! I think the Spurs game really woke up everyone on this team.

21pt lead!


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## OneBadLT123

Guys, this is what, the 4th game in a row where we have opened up a lead of 20 points or more?

*CRAZY*


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## OneBadLT123

Tmac is just on fire


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## AllEyezonTX

did Tmac look @ the Bulls bench while throwin' that pass to Yao...


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## CbobbyB

Tracy!!!!!!!


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## OneBadLT123

OneBadLT123 said:


> Tmac is just on fire


Quoting myself


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## sky_123

Tmac is coming back!
plus, thx to him , a lot of wide opens
cheers!


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## AllEyezonTX

Great Board, Mac!


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## kisstherim

This game is just……beautiful


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## Yao Mania

wow, 21pts within the 1st 6mins of the 3rd Q! 

I think Novak and Kill Bill will finally get some PT this game


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## AllEyezonTX

Block!


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## OneBadLT123

Oh That Was A Clean Block By Yao

Robbed!


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## CbobbyB

please don't blow this lead


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## yaontmac

There's still plenty of time folks.


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## CbobbyB

Skip!!!


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## OneBadLT123

CbobbyB said:


> please don't blow this lead


You had to say it! lol


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## AllEyezonTX

(skipping through post)...lol....


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## Yao Mania

As much as we've been hating on Skip this season, you gotta give him props for his improved 3pt shooting. He's shooting over 40% for the season so far.


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## AllEyezonTX

Deng had a look on his face like...... :whatever:


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## Yao Mania

Can we pleeeease maintain this lead so our bench guys can play??


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## DuMa

this team is fun to watch.


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## Yao Mania

DuMa said:


> this team is fun to watch.


I honestly can't remember the last time I heard that :laugh:

When T-Mac plays like this, then yes we're definitely fun to watch


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## OneBadLT123

CbobbyB said:


> please don't blow this lead



chicago on 10-3 run


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## DuMa

oh no we suck again!


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## OneBadLT123

Ok, no I am getting scared again


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## CbobbyB

omg


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## OneBadLT123

Wtf


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## CbobbyB

OneBadLT123 said:


> chicago on 10-3 run


14-4


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## OneBadLT123

Oh not again...

Please please not again


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## sherwin

*i Cant Believe This Crap Is Happening Again*


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## yaontmac

this team has got to practice lobbing the pass to Yao when a defender is fronting him.


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## ThaShark316

This isn't happening again...it isn't..

But I do see the issue...the lineups that we run out there with big leads are hampering the Rockets, it seems...


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## sherwin

JVG should be fired if this happens again. Not even kidding.


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## Hakeem

This is disgusting. Yao is playing like a wuss. And the guards aren't passing to him when he does get good position.


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## sky_123

damm it. i see the symptom


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## sherwin

yeah t-mac tried tio isolate but totally killed it


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## CbobbyB

c'mon Rockets


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## OneBadLT123

OMG what is going on!

this cant be happening!


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## CbobbyB

they should take advantage of all the dumb plays by Chicago


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## sherwin

chicago isnt the spurs, so they cant complete the comeback like the spurs did. but it still infuritates me that it happened again almost. (still time to lose)


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## CrackerJack

they better not **** this up


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## hi im new

rockets lead down to 8, someone has to catch on fire, like tmac did in the 3rd, but rockets cant go shot for shot again


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## sherwin

T-mac really sucks at freethrows. That is gonna kill us in the playoffs.


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## OneBadLT123

DAng, quit with the stupid fouls...


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## CbobbyB

im speechless...


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## Pain5155

damn, i thought the rockets had this win after t-mac hit that bank 3 to go up by 21, i come back and the bulls are rite in it.


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## OneBadLT123

Finally, some results


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## hi im new

head for 3!


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## CbobbyB

Novak


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## CbobbyB

put Novak in, damn.


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## OneBadLT123

this is getting ugly


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## sherwin

CbobbyB said:


> put Novak in, damn.


 seriously. JVG goes like 7 men deep max.


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## sherwin

wtf is wrong with yao the last 2 games? damn, what a tease.


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## OneBadLT123

Yao has not been shooting well at all


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## CrackerJack

these slumos are giving me the ****s, after the game is done JVG should get every single player to run for 48minutes


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## Hakeem

Yao looks exhausted 8 games into the season.


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## CbobbyB

...


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## Yao Mania

'bout time Yao made a shot...

I swear, 1 3pter from Chicago and they'll be right back in this one


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## CbobbyB

Im tired of seeing Tmac show up early on in games..but when we really need him most (4QT), he can't be found...


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## sherwin

Why Cant Yao Make Simple Layups


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## CbobbyB

we need somebody who can shoot.........





Novak


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## hi im new

rockets up 7 with 133 left to play,looks like the might just hold on


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## OneBadLT123

Yao, you have got to make those open layups!


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## yaontmac

they still need to pass to Yao cuz he's the best FT shooter


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## CrackerJack

well at least now we know why bonzi isnt playing and that houston still havent figured out theres still a game being played


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## Hakeem

That last layup by Yao wasn't even contested. He had beaten Wallace. How can a 7'6" guy not make an open layup?


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## Yao Mania

dammit we never gonna see Novak and Spanoulis :curse:


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## CbobbyB

omg


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## OneBadLT123

this game has been too close to handle


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## AZNoob

o god...down to 5


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## Yao Mania

pls T-Mac, prove to us you're clutch....


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## OneBadLT123

JVG just said "just ****ing told you not to foul"
anyone else hear it?


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## CbobbyB

Houston Rockets- lead blowers

JVG has to fix this.


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## AZNoob

There is nothing JVG can do...its the players mentality out there, not his...


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## The_Franchise

Worst offensive game from Yao in a while, it's possible that Hayes' mobility on the offensive end helps him get into to a rhythm (which he has not been able to establish the last 2 games).

Parts of this game have been unwatchable.


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## sherwin

god WE SIMPLY CANT CLOSE OUT GAMES!!!


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## sherwin

UGH dont give it to tmac. he cant make FT


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## CbobbyB

damn, Gordon is not MJ..stop his little ***!


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## AZNoob

Gotta pass it into Yao so Chi-town can foul him.


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## hi im new

wow, gordon for 3


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## sherwin

beng ordan is raping us


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## CbobbyB

CbobbyB said:


> damn, Gordon is not MJ..stop his little ***!


 :curse:


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## OneBadLT123

I just want to take a cold shower and cry


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## CrackerJack

holy **** ben gordon this is ****in bull****


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## AZNoob

OMG...this is so unbelievable close....


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## CbobbyB

can't even inbound the damn ball


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## hi im new

lol, i never knew u can travel out of bounds


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## yaontmac

why dont they just inbound to Yao?


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## OneBadLT123

WASTED TIMEOUTS

we got a break there, he traveled clearly


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## sky_123

my heart is beating up


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## CrackerJack

is inbounding the ball really too hard?


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## afobisme

what is jeff thinking.. first putting a 50% free throw shooter when you KNOW the bulls are gonna foul.

then for having a small point guard inbounding the ball?


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## AZNoob

It IS weird that Yao is having bad games. Perhaps someone touched on something when they said that Hayes is the key to Yao's success...


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## hi im new

and thats game


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## OneBadLT123

Its over if we make our FT's


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## AZNoob

kk....we just won!!


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## sky_123

cant afford to inbound the ball everytime by time out. wth. it kills us


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## AZNoob

Hope Gordon doesn't pull a T-Mac miracle out of his ***...


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## CrackerJack

finally a defensive stop


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## hi im new

lmao, these bulls are good


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## sherwin

this team just doesnt know how to close.

we won but this was still a *COLLAPSE*

choke city


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## CbobbyB

ugly game..not impressed with the Rockets.


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## OneBadLT123

*Back to back blown 20 point leads. Totally unacceptable. This team has got to close out these games*


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## AllEyezonTX

Book it! Took forever to get but "a win is a win" in this NBA....Now a upset S.Antonio waits....Bulls are going to remember this Tx trip! lol


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## AZNoob

omfg...we win by 1?!?!!


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## CrackerJack

holy crap i think im dead


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## AllEyezonTX

CbobbyB said:


> ugly game..not impressed with the Rockets.



you a fan right? They had to hit some big freethrows to hold that team off


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## CbobbyB

pathetic


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## yaontmac

Can a basketball expert please explain to me why they didn't just inbound the ball to Yao?


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## kisstherim

It's amazing we actually sealed this win


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## sky_123

happy ending, everyone :cheers:


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## CbobbyB

AllEyezonTX said:


> you a fan right? They had to hit some big freethrows to hold that team off


we shouldnt of been in that situation


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## AZNoob

HUGEE stress on the word happy, if happy means 'barely got by', then yeah...happy...


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## sky_123

yaontmac said:


> Can a basketball expert please explain to me why they didn't just inbound the ball to Yao?


thats what i am thinking......Yao is good and stable at free throws


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## hi im new

i wish the spurs game threads were like this =/


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## OneBadLT123

We should have NEVER been in this situation. 

This team seriously has to get with the program. We cant be blowing these kind of leads. 
WE NEED TO FINISH GAMES


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## ChiBron

Tough loss for MY team but kinda glad for you guys too. Back-to-Back losses of this sort would've been devastating. It still troubles me to see how T-Mac's 4th qtr performances haven't changed AT ALL from his Orlando days. He was nonexistant from mid 3rd qtr onwards.


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## sherwin

t-mac sucks in the 4th

yao sucks without chuck

jvg just cant prepare his teams


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## Pimped Out

yaontmac said:


> Can a basketball expert please explain to me why they didn't just inbound the ball to Yao?


i dunno. i found it really stupid. just like i think rafer in bounding the ball was stupid. he isnt a good decision maker and he cant lob the ball over the defense because he is small. it also amazing that in a FT situation, novak isnt in.


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## Pimped Out

we are 1-3 in games where i have done vbookie for the game (against the spread). no more of that since it sucks to pay out against y'all.


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## Hakeem

SPMJ said:


> Tough loss for MY team but kinda glad for you guys too. Back-to-Back losses of this sort would've been devastating. It still troubles me to see how T-Mac's 4th qtr performances haven't changed AT ALL from his Orlando days. He was nonexistant from mid 3rd qtr onwards.


I didn't watch him very much in Orlando, but he must have been godlike to put up those kind of numbers if he always disappeared in the 4th.


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## PriceIsWright

UM wtf Rockets won not Bulls. Fix the godamn vbookie


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## Hakeem

sherwin said:


> yao sucks without chuck


How many minutes was Chuck getting in Yao's 28-game stretch last season?


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## Pimped Out

PriceIsWright said:


> UM wtf Rockets won not Bulls. Fix the godamn vbookie


rockets failed to cover the spread



> HOW THE POINT SPREADS WORK
> 
> In any game, one team is the "favorite" to win, and the team expected to lose is the "underdog." But if just picking winners was all you had to do, it'd be real easy to pick the Spurs (favorite), for example, to win over the Hawks (underdog). To make it challenging, a handicap is placed on the favorite; the underdog is spotted points. So, using this example once more, to make it tougher to choose the winner between the Spurs and Hawks, the Hawks might be spotted 12 points. This means that if the Spurs win, but win by less than 12 points, the Hawks win the game for betting purposes. So the proposition becomes, "will the Spurs win by at least 12 points?" which is a much tougher call.
> 
> In the bets we post, the favorite is shown with some negative amount of points. This is the number of points spotted the underdog. The underdog is shown with a positive amount of points.
> 
> You can look at it either of two ways: Subtract the points from the favorite's score, or add the points to the underdog's score. Then you can determine the winner of the bet.
> 
> Game bets pay 1 point for each point bet, or 1:1. This means if you bet 100 points and lose, you lose all 100 points; if you win, then you get your 100 back and 100 more, or 200 total.
> 
> NOTE: After taking the spread into account, a tie means all bets are off; uCash points bet on either side are returned.


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## HayesFan

OneBadLT123 said:


> JVG just said "just ****ing told you not to foul"
> anyone else hear it?



Catching up on the posts from the game... lol but yeah I heard it and it made me giggle.


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## TManiAC

SPMJ said:


> Tough loss for MY team but kinda glad for you guys too. Back-to-Back losses of this sort would've been devastating. It still troubles me to see how T-Mac's 4th qtr performances haven't changed AT ALL from his Orlando days. He was nonexistant from mid 3rd qtr onwards.



Thats a lie. McGrady averaged 8+ points in the 4th quarter in 02-03. Before Kobe's scoring breakout last season, McGrady's 4th quarter avg in Orlando was the highest since 4th quarter scoring started getting recorded in 1997. McGrady was a crunch time scorer in Orlando so I really dont know where youre getting this from. 

Also, I swear reading somewhere that JVG wanted to use TMac in the first half to attack the basket and make opposing players sensitive to fouls. In the second half, JVG runs the offense through Yao who plays controlled against a softened defense in foul trouble. Maybe reason for why McGrady seems to disappear in the second half.


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## HayesFan

Hakeem said:


> How many minutes was Chuck getting in Yao's 28-game stretch last season?


The answer to that... Chuck and Yao didn't play together much last year. Most of the time, Chuck game in to give Yao a break.


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## ChiBron

Hakeem said:


> I didn't watch him very much in Orlando, but he must have been godlike to put up those kind of numbers if he always disappeared in the 4th.


Not really. He had that one ridiculous scoring season of 32 ppg(02-03) but stayed around 25-27 the rest of his Orlando years. Actually finished 2nd in 02-03 for 4th qtr PPG but his efficiency was terrible. And the less said abt his offense in the final 5 mins. of close games(neither team up/down by more than 5), the better. 

I've followed T-Mac as closely as possible since he signed w/ Orlando so I know his weaknesses better than almost any fan. The problem w/ him in the clutch is 1) Settling for jump shots on tired legs 2) Lack of mental toughness(u guys surely must've noticed this) and 3) The will to win. With the game on the line the clutch superstars get selfish and do everything in their power to assure victory. T-Mac on the other hand will GLADLY pass the ball off the second he sees a double team arriving(tonight's game a perfect example). He isn't that demanding of the ball either. You won't see Kobe, Wade and now LeBron EVER do this. I won't say T-Mac's got no heart but he simply isn't that passionate abt winning.

His uncreative ballhandling plays a part too. You'll almost never see him beating double teams or finding ways through collapsing defenses. He has a bad habit of picking up his dribble too early and the other reason is simply lacking that unshakeable confidence of a Wade/Kobe/MJ who think they can overcome anything and get it done.


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## Pimped Out

HayesFan said:


> The answer to that... Chuck and Yao didn't play together much last year. Most of the time, Chuck game in to give Yao a break.


i think it was a rhetorical question


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## HayesFan

Pimped Out said:


> i think it was a rhetorical question



ooops.. my bad! :angel:


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## Hakeem

SPMJ said:


> Not really. He had that one ridiculous scoring season of 32 ppg(02-03) but stayed around 25-27 the rest of his Orlando years. Actually finished 2nd in 02-03 for 4th qtr PPG but his efficiency was terrible. And the less said abt his offense in the final 5 mins. of close games(neither team up/down by more than 5), the better.


In '02-03, his clutch stats were 37.7 pts per 48 minutes on .476 efg%. Kobe's were 37.3 pts on .424.

I only started watching him regularly in Houston. And before this season, his late-game play hasn't been bad. In fact, last season his scoring went up by 6 points per 48 minutes with no decrease in efficiency. Kobe's scoring went up by even more, but in both of the past two seasons, he has taken a massive hit in clutch efficiency. His clutch efg% last season was .390. The season before that it was an abysmal .352.



> The problem w/ him in the clutch is 1) Settling for jump shots on tired legs


Last season, 79% of his shot attempts were jump shots, and this rose to 84% in the clutch. The season before, it went from 77% to 78%. Season before that, no difference in the clutch (80%). Season before that one, it went down from 74% for the game to 70% in the clutch. So it doesn't appear that he tends to settle for jump shots more in the clutch.



> 3) The will to win. With the game on the line the clutch superstars get selfish and do everything in their power to assure victory. T-Mac on the other hand will GLADLY pass the ball off the second he sees a double team arriving(tonight's game a perfect example). He isn't that demanding of the ball either. You won't see Kobe, Wade and now LeBron EVER do this. I won't say T-Mac's got no heart but he simply isn't that passionate abt winning.


If a player becomes selfish in the clutch, he is just that. Selfish. Nothing more. If it were good for the team for him to refuse to look for the open man, why not do that all game? It's not a good thing to take all the shots if you're scoring extremely inefficiently.


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## PFortyy

tmacs nearly back to his old form....he just needs to score a few more points and he will be back


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## Dean the Master

That's the sign JVG.


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## Legend-Like

What a scary game, I saw JVG stuick the middle finger at Kirk Snyder when fouled at the last minute.


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## HayesFan

Okay... I don't know how many of yall post over at Clutchfans, but I am seriously annoyed at some of the people there and their attitude. Anyway, I am going to copy a post here cause I know yall won't act like I'm an idiot and insult me when I ask my question. This is long cause I am putting in the responses off that board.



me said:


> In the third quarter of this game.. with about 8 minutes left.. I started yelling at the tv for JVG to make some substitutions. Yao looked exhausted. Tmac was wet with sweat and holding his knees between plays. Logically, my next thought was find someone to put in for them. Sub one at a time if you must, but at least get someone in there with fresh legs.
> 
> So I continued to watch, no subs until about 5 minutes left in the quarter. JVG puts Deke in, but leaves Tracy. Okay, at least Yao is getting a breather, I think. Then about 3 minutes or so later, he brings Yao back in for Deke, gives Juwon (who, was he on the court tonight) a break and leaves Tmac in.
> 
> From the 8 minute mark where I noticed the starters were tired, we scored exactly 3 jump shots and 3 free throws. 9 points in 8 minutes.
> 
> So that got me wondering, why would JVG leave them in if they were obviously struggling. He's seen this in three games prior, where they fell apart at the end of the 3rd and the entire 4th. I don't think he's a stupid man, maybe stubborn, but not stupid.
> 
> My thoughts then started to take me down the road. The goal is to win a championship. You do that with your best players on the court. Obviously, due to the 3 prior breakdowns this is an issue with your starters and your primary subs off the bench (ie Head and Snyder).
> 
> So you leave them in a little bit longer each time. In an attempt to make them stronger mentally ("I am not going to let us lose this game"), physically (when your muscles are warm is when you can build them up more easily) and increase their endurance so that they can sustain their playmaking on the court in the post season.
> 
> This team has so much potential and there's a long season ahead of us, but a coach knows what his team is capable of and maybe this is the way to modivate them. I mean, how long is Tmac going to let teams continue to come back on them. He showed improvement tonight over the Spurs loss. When the game was getting close he drove instead of trying to force outside shots. Do you really think Yao likes missing all those shots around the basket? This gives him an opportunity to watch tape and figure out what the heck was going on in there throwing his shot off. Inbounding the ball, you don't think each and every one of those players on the court aren't going to be forced to watch those plays to figure out why they were ineffective?
> 
> I am going to reserve judgement for sure, because I don't know enough about JVG to give him the benefit of the doubt. It was interesting however to try to rationalize the way that he proceeded with the player rotation in this game.


Here was the first response



arbpro said:


> All of this bashing of JVG because he allegedly leaves his starters in too much is total nonsense. He is using a standard 9 player rotation. And when Hayes and Bonzi are integrated, he will likely go to a 10 man rotation (probably dropping Padgett). The fact of the matter is that it doesn't matter what JVG does (he could play all 12 players every game) and idiots like ZBoy would still run his mouth. His hatred for JVG prevents any objective evaluation of the facts.


Then I replied back cause the guy just answered why people were bashing JVG and not the purpose for leaving them in the game when they were tired.



me said:


> I guess I will ask it this way. Those of you who don't hate JVG, Do you think he is leaving the starters in for so long because he has to? or because he is trying to get them to learn now while the season is still young?
> 
> It sort of reminds me of the Wargames thing where the computer had to play tic-tac-toe over and over again to get the message.
> 
> Do you think JVG is purposefully allowing things to progress as they have been in order to get his message (or messages) across to his team?


and this is where I was insulted for no reason what-so-ever



arbpro said:


> Perhaps you can't read. I said that JVG is using a standard 9 man rotation. Guys like Riley, Brown and Jackson have done the same and won championships. So JVG is doing what has a history of working in the NBA, and rather address that very basic notion, you instead cite an absurd comparison with a fictional Hollywood movie.


So... to make this long story short. Here's my last post about it.



me said:


> And you had to be snotty about answering didn't you. Ugh.
> 
> My question wasn't is what he's doing standard 9 man rotation and can it be compared to what other coaches have done in the past, *my question is do you think he's leaving them out there when they are obviously tired to teach them a lesson?*
> 
> Being nasty obviously makes you feel better about yourself. So if you think I'm so stupid let someone else answer.


so I am asking yall, do you think JVG knows that they are tired, is allowing the collapse to teach them a lesson, or do you think its bad substitution patterns on his part that is causing the players to get fatiqued at the end of the game.


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## Dean the Master

Good points HayesFan, I think this is the reason why we have 4th quoter struggles as we can't pull away the game easily. There is a reason why we have two superstars on the team so that they can take pressure off each others. When Tracy is tired, put in Head, Snyder, Novak, or Wells(?). The front office is trying to bring in the rotation players, and that what they are for. They are the helpers. Let them help the team. The luxury the Rockets have right now is they are versatile. I agree with you HayesFan, he needs to think about this question.


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## Hakeem

JVG leaves T-Mac and Yao in for so long because there is no one on our bench who can create. The Bulls made their comeback late in the third when Yao and T-Mac were on the bench. Forget Novak and Spanoulis. We need Bonzi.

However, I agree that Yao seems to tire in the fourth when he plays 38 mpg. 38 mins should be all right by the All-Star Break. Right now, it seems a bit much.


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## HayesFan

Hakeem said:


> JVG leaves T-Mac and Yao in for so long because there is no one on our bench who can create. The Bulls made their comeback late in the third when Yao and T-Mac were on the bench. Forget Novak and Spanoulis. We need Bonzi.
> 
> However, I agree that Yao seems to tire in the fourth when he plays 38 mpg. 38 mins should be all right by the All-Star Break. Right now, it seems a bit much.


So you think it was more out of necessity than any sort of character building. :biggrin: See that is the kind of answer I was looking for. 

Thank you Hakeem and DTM for answering!


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## PowerWoofer

Hey guys. Bulls fan here. Great game on Thursday night. I am one of those guys who secretly roots for the Rockets, unless they are playing against the Bulls. I haven't posted on THIS board too much, but I posted regularly on the Bulls board. I though I'd come and tell you guys that it was a great game. And I'm normally not the type to congratulate other teams for winning against the Bulls, so consider it an honor. :biggrin: Jk

Anyway, you can't deny that Gordon was killer last night. He almost single-handedly won the Bulls the game, and he did have a game-high 37 points to boot.

That was about as dramatic as I've seen a basketball game since the clutch games back in the 04-05 season for the Bulls, so I must say that Houston really did a good job in winning tonight. It wasn't easy, but you guys did it.

Anyway, have a great year. I love Yao and T-Mac, although I hope they start playing great team basketball, and can get out of the 1st Round, just like I'm hoping the same for my Bulls. 

Good luck, and go Rockets! (Bulls too!)


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## OneBadLT123

PowerWoofer said:


> Hey guys. Bulls fan here. Great game on Thursday night. I am one of those guys who secretly roots for the Rockets, unless they are playing against the Bulls. I haven't posted on THIS board too much, but I posted regularly on the Bulls board. I though I'd come and tell you guys that it was a great game. And I'm normally not the type to congratulate other teams for winning against the Bulls, so consider it an honor. :biggrin: Jk
> 
> Anyway, you can't deny that Gordon was killer last night. He almost single-handedly won the Bulls the game, and he did have a game-high 37 points to boot.
> 
> That was about as dramatic as I've seen a basketball game since the clutch games back in the 04-05 season for the Bulls, so I must say that Houston really did a good job in winning tonight. It wasn't easy, but you guys did it.
> 
> Anyway, have a great year. I love Yao and T-Mac, although I hope they start playing great team basketball, and can get out of the 1st Round, just like I'm hoping the same for my Bulls.
> 
> Good luck, and go Rockets! (Bulls too!)


great post, the feeling its mutual. Come by more often! 

rep


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## PowerWoofer

OneBadLT123 said:


> great post, the feeling its mutual. Come by more often!
> 
> rep


I'll try and post once in a while, because I really do like the team you guys have on the court.


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