# Funniest take on the Carter to Portland rumor yet



## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

This is so true:



> They’re having a great time in Toronto, laughing at Portland for chasing Vince Carter. Toronto Sun columnist Ken Fidlin called Carter “Airball Canada” and said Portland is a place “where the perception of Vince Carter’s value apparently lags two years behind the reality.” … Fidlin adds: “Where (Carter) once dominated games by playing above the hoop, driving hard and drawing fouls, he’s become an ineffective outside presence.”


He's just not that good anymore, folks. I think we should hold on to SAR for a while longer and wait for a better offer. Who knows? Maybe the Sonics will crack when they go on their patented 7 or 8 game losing streak and ship us Ray Allen.

-Pop


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

He needs a change of scenery thats why his play has been so lackadaisical. He is not happy with where he is at right now. If you were unhappy with your job, wouldnt it affect the way you work


----------



## Terrible (Jan 3, 2003)

How can you be unhappy making millions of dollars a year, fans that "DID" love you, and the franchise built around you?

Oh yeah here's why, you got hurt, your game is above the rim and your now grounded and the team knows it and are getting ready to build around someone else.

Vince is not the player he used to be. He's unhappy cause the Raptors want him to be half man half machine and he can't be that anymore.

Why else do ya think he wants to end up in Miami, Detroit or Indi?

He needs help in a softer conference. The west would tear him up day in and out.


----------



## QRICH (Feb 2, 2004)

Great. This reminds me of Derek Anderson. In San Antonio he was a borderline All-Star who once played above the rim. He got hurt, signed with Portland and now we are stuck with a very ineffective jump shooter.


----------



## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SodaPopinski</b>!
> This is so true:
> 
> 
> ...


why do people think we'll get a better deal than Carter?

Seattle is not going to ship us Ray Allen, especially now that he's going nuts shooting.


----------



## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>QRICH</b>!
> Great. This reminds me of Derek Anderson. In San Antonio he was a borderline All-Star who once played above the rim. He got hurt, signed with Portland and now we are stuck with a very ineffective jump shooter.


cept that Derek ANderson always sucked as a shooter, and at least Vince has shot over 45% more than 36 games in his career.


----------



## Terrible (Jan 3, 2003)

You NAILED it QRICH!!!!!

This is exactly why I don't want Vince. The reality is he has never led the Raptors anywhere in a weak eastern conference. So let's bring him out to the mighty west and see what he can do 2 years past his prime.

Not smart!

Players that leave the west and go east do very well cause the games are easier. Shaq, Sheed, GP,Steve Francis just to name a few.

I think eastern conference players need some time to adjust to the style of big man hoops in the west.

I don't think Vince will make a big diffence in Portland for that reason, our coaching disaster and his injuries.


----------



## mediocre man (Feb 24, 2004)

I can't believe how many people in this forum are over inflating SAR. He is a nice player. You know what you are going to get with him. He's a great locker room guy, good scorer and rebounder and a smart player. what he isn't though is dominant in anything. He doesn't have the respect of the officials, he isn't a great defender, he hasn't appeared to put his team on his back for several games and he, by no fault of his own, has never played for a winner. 

The ONLY thing teams truly like SAR for is his expirering sallary, so I think if you can upgrade either one of our backcourt spots with SAR as trade bait you do it.


----------



## Swoosh (May 2, 2003)

*Re: Re: Funniest take on the Carter to Portland rumor yet*



> Originally posted by <b>Hap</b>!
> 
> 
> why do people think we'll get a better deal than Carter?
> ...


Exactly...I seriously doubt we will get any better offers for SAR (if this was ever actually on offer on the table anyway). If Nash can pull off some deal to get us someone that is better than Carter, then he will be the GM of the year. If Carter is actually available in some deal involving SAR, then you have to make the deal happen. At the very least he would help sell tickets and generate a buzz around this team that we haven't had for years.


----------



## Playmaker0017 (Feb 13, 2004)

Even as he currently stands, Carter is far better than I thought Portland could get for Reef.

I mean, what do you REALISTICALLY think any team is going to send?

Forget the dreams of Ray Allen. Never happen. They'll never send him inter-division ... not even if they were on an 82 game slide.

Forget Michael Redd. Too young.

Forget any superstar. There isn't a chance in hell that you get a true superstar the likes of Duncan or KG.. 

You MIGHT and I repeat MIGHT be able to get guys like Allen Iverson, Paul Pierce, Antoine Walker and Vince Carter. The guys that once used to have everyone in shock and awe ... but once they were removed from their other good players showed that they were just ESPN-made superstars ... also known as ball-hogs. They are just like Reef - able to put up stats but not able to take their team anywhere ... AND they require 20 shots a game to make their stats pretty.

Vince is about as good as it gets. Personally, I still think Wally would be better for the team. He shoots a lot, but he's not a ball hog. He's about as good as Carter on defense... and it doesn't cause the eventual internal struggle of "who is the real star of this team" that Carter/Randolph might cause.

Play.


----------



## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Terrible</b>!
> You NAILED it QRICH!!!!!
> 
> This is exactly why I don't want Vince. The reality is he has never led the Raptors anywhere in a weak eastern conference.


I think his team was a shot away from beating the 76ers and making it to the ECF's in the year that the 76ers were the best team in the EC.



> So let's bring him out to the mighty west and see what he can do 2 years past his prime.
> 
> Not smart!


How come Ray Allen, who's older, hasn't reached his prime, but Vince Carter, who's 27, has *2 years ago*?

A players scoring peak does not equal his peak as a player, otherwise Jordan peaked in his 3rd year in the league.



> Players that leave the west and go east do very well cause the games are easier. Shaq, Sheed, GP,Steve Francis just to name a few.


Um...Sheed actually didn't do better. His stats were better in Portland. Payton didn't do better in the East either. Nor has Shaq...

Francis has been in the east for what, 9 games? You're already deciding he's done better? When in actuality, his stats *aren't* better than his best stats in the west?



> I don't think Vince will make a big diffence in Portland for that reason, our coaching disaster and his injuries.


his injuries have been blown out of porportion really. Would you not take McGrady because of his history of back problems?


----------



## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

HOLY FLIPPIN COW!!!!!

Here we've been complaining that we need a SG, all summer and so far all season. We are talking about trading Shareef for Vince Carter, Granted he isn't the hi flyer he used to be.

This is a guy who prior to this season had a career average of 23ppg in 37.5mpg. 

This year 14.5ppg in 30.2mpg 19% less minutes.

He is still putting up better numbers than DA, add Jalen Rose in and we can stilll are complaining? 

What the heck do you think Shareef is worth? I was willing to take Rose for Shareef, but Carter and Rose for Shareef and filler from "the worst backcourt in the NBA" to get Jalen and Vince?

I can't believe my eyes.


----------



## Playmaker0017 (Feb 13, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>mediocre man</b>!
> I can't believe how many people in this forum are over inflating SAR. He is a nice player. You know what you are going to get with him. He's a great locker room guy, good scorer and rebounder and a smart player.


Completely agree. 

I think, especially after sitting the pine last year, his value couldn't be lower. GMs will use whatever excuse in the books to deflate a player's value ... it's their job. 



> what he isn't though is dominant in anything. He doesn't have the respect of the officials, he isn't a great defender, he hasn't appeared to put his team on his back for several games and he, by no fault of his own, has never played for a winner.


He does have the respect of the officials. Every year he used to be second or third in the league in FTs attempted. This year, the guy is averaging 10 shots and 3.5 FTs ... that's 2.85 shots per FT. Not bad. 

He is definitely not a great defender, but he's average to above average. This is an old knock on him that really doesn't hold true anymore. He's probably the best one on one defender of our starting lineup (not that this is a very hard thing to be). Think about it, the only competition is probably Anderson. He's a decent help defender. His biggest hole on defense is perimeter defense, but as a PF, how much does he have to do?

As for putting his team on his back, he has ... but the team hasn't responded. Look at Zach, for instance, he had a MONSTER game last night and the team just couldn't win because of dumb play. Reef's had that for 8 years now.

Let's be honest ... he's a very good to great player. The problem is that he doesn't have much value because of the situation and because he hasn't played for a winner and he isn't getting younger. 

The big problem with Reef is that he isn't a vocal leader and he isn't as aggressive as he should be. That is why teams back off of him.



> The ONLY thing teams truly like SAR for is his expirering sallary, so I think if you can upgrade either one of our backcourt spots with SAR as trade bait you do it.


At this point, that's true. He was signed for too much in Vancouver. 

If you can get Carter - you do it. If you can't you get Wally. Relying on broken Jason Kidd is ridiculous.

Play.


----------



## Terrible (Jan 3, 2003)

I think Vince does not fit the needs Portland has right now. We need a shooter who's consistent from outside. I don't need a name brand player Hap, I need a guy who can shoot better than DA and Damon every night. We need a guy who can see the court and help move the offense that just walks in place.

Vince isn't even in the big games anymore for his own team. He's not even the leading scorer. Unlike Ray Allen or Tmac!


----------



## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

You know what a better deal than acquiring Vince is?

Letting SAR come off the books at the end of the season. Either that or we may get an upcoming star when teams start to get desperate to unload salary or bring in veteran talent around the trading deadline. Look how we got Theo.

-Pop


----------



## Swoosh (May 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Schilly</b>!
> HOLY FLIPPIN COW!!!!!
> 
> Here we've been complaining that we need a SG, all summer and so far all season. We are talking about trading Shareef for Vince Carter, Granted he isn't the hi flyer he used to be.
> ...


Completely agree...I think if VC were to come to PDX we would see a rejuvinated VC. Definitely better than anything we currently have at the SG position. I also can't believe people honestly think we could do better in a trade for SAR. He just doesn't have the same value he had a couple years ago, let alone last year.


----------



## Terrible (Jan 3, 2003)

That's my thinking too. Let's not strap our team down with another big contract player. Let's rebuild and get our young guys going.

Vince will not change the fact that Portland will not be a threat in the playoffs this year.


----------



## Playmaker0017 (Feb 13, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Schilly</b>!
> HOLY FLIPPIN COW!!!!!


I know.

I just have to ask ... who here REALLY thinks that some team is about to offer Tim Duncan and Parker for Reef and Stoudamire... it just isn't happening.

Carter is still a threat. He's still one of the top SGs in the league.

Not just that ... but isn't this the same crowd that actually started to praise Nick Van Exel after ONE game???!?!?! He was injured and had one game and the next thing I read is that he is the answer and what we've been looking for and should start ... blah, blah, blah.

I tried to temper it, but to no avail.

And now Vince Carter shouldn't be on this team?

Bah.

Play.


----------



## Playmaker0017 (Feb 13, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Terrible</b>!
> Vince isn't even in the big games anymore for his own team. He's not even the leading scorer. Unlike Ray Allen or Tmac!


Are Ray Allen and TMac legitimate guys that Portland could get for Reef?

Come on...

So far, the offers are:
Kittles
Brokedick Kidd
Wally
Carter

At what point does this seem that Portland is about to get a GREAT player that is playing their best basketball?

Play.


----------



## Playmaker0017 (Feb 13, 2004)

Double.


----------



## Playmaker0017 (Feb 13, 2004)

Triple.


----------



## Swoosh (May 2, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>SodaPopinski</b>!
> You know what a better deal than acquiring Vince is?
> 
> Letting SAR come off the books at the end of the season.
> -Pop


How does that help? Letting SAR fall off the books for nothing in return??? Getting VC for SAR would definitley be a better option than just letting SAR's deal expire. We're not going to be under the cap either way, so we might as well get something in return.


----------



## blazerboy30 (Apr 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Swoosh</b>!
> 
> 
> How does that help? Letting SAR fall off the books for nothing in return??? Getting VC for SAR would definitley be a better option than just letting SAR's deal expire. We're not going to be under the cap either way, so we might as well get something in return.


Exactly........

Letting SAR come off the books at the end of the year does NOTHING for us. It might make Paul Allen feel a little better about not spending so much, but it does NOT put the team in any better position to aquire players. 

We will be over the cap whether we let SAR walk or not, so we might as well try to get a good player in return.

Its not our money....if Paul Allen is willing to make this trade, we should go for it.


----------



## Trader Ed (Jun 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SodaPopinski</b>!
> You know what a better deal than acquiring Vince is?
> 
> Letting SAR come off the books at the end of the season. -Pop



Please tell me what you think that will do for us? I am more than curious


----------



## PorterIn2004 (Jan 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Trader Bob</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> Please tell me what you think that will do for us? I am more than curious


I'm with ya, TB. I could see it if it seemed certain that Carter would be a money pit while being too broken to contribute but he seems to be a lot of what this team needs. Moreover, I'm at least as interested in Rose and I am Carter. Rose can play effectively at either the 2 or the 3, can help with distributing the ball, and can even play with some effectiveness at the point for small stretches. I'd say Rose by himself is an improvement over DA, Miles, or Patterson. Perhaps not a huge improvement but improvement nontheless. Considering that he's a secondary piece in this deal....

Of course by now any such deal is almost certainly dead so what's it matter?

Somewhat more optimistically, I'm still curious to see what'll happen as the trading deadline approaches. Having SAR as the main piece going out and anyone like T-Mac being the main piece coming in seems laughable to me but I could still see a total package that might look very good indeed -- perhaps a six or seven player swap with the T'wolves? I still wish the Z-bo and Redd trade had happened but alas....:sigh:


----------



## CelticPagan (Aug 23, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>SodaPopinski</b>!
> You know what a better deal than acquiring Vince is?
> 
> Letting SAR come off the books at the end of the season. Either that or we may get an upcoming star when teams start to get desperate to unload salary or bring in veteran talent around the trading deadline. Look how we got Theo.
> ...


No soda, we're over the cap anyway. So cap relief is irrelevant from a fans point of view. Randolph, Miles, Ratliff, and Anderson will eat up all our cap space by THEMSELVES.

Rose and Carter's contracts are not that bad. Damon, Van Exel and Rahim come off the books next year that's 42 million out! Carter and Rose are 30 million in! So we are getting cap relief no matter what.


----------



## O2K (Nov 19, 2002)

vince carter>sar


for the ticket sales alone


----------



## Ed O (Dec 30, 2002)

Gotta say that I agree with those who say getting VC for SAR would be a very good move... and if we can move DA for Jalen Rose, too, it makes it even better IMO.

Ed O.


----------



## RoseCity (Sep 27, 2002)

Rafer Alston, Chris Bosh and arguably Rose have been better than Carter this season. He is missing something. Whether it's due to past injurys, his disdain for the team/managment/coaching or what... Stat wise, he doesn't seem to be the same guy. I have yet to watch him play so it is hard to say. Can anyone comment on his play, that has actually seen him run this season?


----------



## Schilly (Dec 30, 2002)

Vinces line tonight

25 points 9 boards


----------



## Dan (Dec 30, 2002)

does anyone remember Clydes last season in Portland?

he was shooting horrible, not playing with much heart, and looked like he didn't care.

The minute he got to Houston, his shooting % went up, he was dunking again, and played great.

A lot of it has to do with where you play and your mentality because of that.


----------



## Helios (Nov 5, 2003)

I don't remember Clyde's last season in Portland but I understand he and Hakeem were old friends and it was kind of like a home coming. Plus Clyde is just a classy person and competitor, where as "I don't want to dunk anymore" is getting benched by Sam Mitchell. Someone else said it and I agree.. instead of Clyde we'd get Shawn Kemp.

Call me crazy but at this point I like Shareef way better then a potential chemistry problem. Reef is 18th in the league in field goal percentage(52%), VC is 18th in field goals _attempted_ (38%). If Shareef says now he wants to stay, then keep him!


----------



## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Helios</b>!
> I don't remember Clyde's last season in Portland but I understand he and Hakeem were old friends and it was kind of like a home coming. Plus Clyde is just a classy person and competitor, where as "I don't want to dunk anymore" is getting benched by Sam Mitchell. Someone else said it and I agree.. instead of Clyde we'd get Shawn Kemp.
> 
> Call me crazy but at this point I like Shareef way better then a potential chemistry problem. Reef is 18th in the league in field goal percentage(52%), VC is 18th in field goals _attempted_ (38%). If Shareef says now he wants to stay, then keep him!


...and do what with im? Sign him next season? Lose him for nothing?


----------



## SkywalkerAC (Sep 20, 2002)

Well, Vince looked pretty good in his game tonight. He wasn't playing inspired basketball but he was definitely impressive at times. Coming off screens for midrange jumpers he's money, 11 points in the first quarter (again). He also had 2 nice dunks (3 if you count dunks after the buzzer). He didn't take over in the clutch as he should have but Vince is FAR from washed up at this point.


----------



## Buck Williams (May 16, 2004)

i dont care what all u guys say Vince can still DUNK hes just not gonna dunk 4 toronto anymore hell dunk 4 portland


----------

