# Michael Redd



## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

Someone on this board said that the Cavs were going to pursue Michael Redd as their #1 interest in the offseason. Can anyone confirm that they have said this?


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## Nevus (Jun 3, 2003)

I don't know about that, but I heard recently that Michael Redd is interested in going to the Cavs. He's an Ohio guy... and if they offer him the money, it seems he'd be likely to take it.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

Man Redd would be just what the doctor ordered to work with Lebron.


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## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Nevus</b>!
> I don't know about that, but I heard recently that Michael Redd is interested in going to the Cavs. He's an Ohio guy... and if they offer him the money, it seems he'd be likely to take it.


So he's not restricted?

How is your cap situation?


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## Nevus (Jun 3, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pan Mengtu</b>!
> 
> 
> So he's not restricted?
> ...


I'm not sure about Redd's situation, but if the Cavaliers can get Z to re-sign for a reasonable price, I am told that they can offer the max to somebody.


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## Tersk (Apr 9, 2004)

Wow, they would be instant title contenders (IMO)

PG: Jeff McInnis
SG: Michael Redd
SF: LeBron James
PF: Drew Gooden
C: Zydrunas Ilglauskas

Bench: Eric Snow, Luscious Harris, Ira Newble and Robert Traylor

Then if Dajuan, Varejo, Diop and LJ can make any progress, watch out


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

He's unrestricted and he can sign with anybody he wants although by the CBA the bucks can still offer him the most money.

Since both Z and McInnis are also unrestricted FA's as well. A lot of Cleveland fans and I are hoping we sign Redd first so we can offer him more money and then sign Z. We'll see if Mcinnis will take a reasonable contract at that point. If the Cavs can get Redd and Z back in the fold I doubt the Cavs could afford to give Jmac a huge contract especially since Snow is getting a lot of money and still has a lot of years on his contract


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## Drewbs (Feb 16, 2004)

If the Cavs get Redd without losing McInnis or Z, it would make their offense nearly unstoppable.


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## Benedict_Boozer (Jul 16, 2004)

I would consider letting McGinnis go if there was a real possibility of acquiring Redd.

Yes Jmac is invaluable to this team, but with Snow in the fold I think you would have to make that move. Redd is EXACTLY what this team needs for obvious reasons.


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## Wagner2 (Jun 29, 2002)

Wow would that be nice

That said, Z will ask for near max money. 7'3" center who puts up 16-18 ppg and 8 rpg. Those don't come a dime a dozen.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Wagner2</b>!
> Wow would that be nice
> 
> That said, Z will ask for near max money. 7'3" center who puts up 16-18 ppg and 8 rpg. Those don't come a dime a dozen.


But the Cavs could afford to give him a near max deal after Redd, correct? Because they would have his bird rights?

If worse comes to worse I think the Cavs can make do with Diop, Verejao up front with Gooden, since they have Lebron and Redd on the perimeter. Z is a luxury, but probably not a long term neccessity for the Cavs. Someone like Sam Dahlembert would be a better fit.


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## RP McMurphy (Jul 17, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>futuristxen</b>!
> But the Cavs could afford to give him a near max deal after Redd, correct? Because they would have his bird rights?


The Cavs would probably have a lot more cap room if they signed Ilgauskas first. If they wait to sign him until later, his cap hold would be enormous, but they can probably re-sign him starting for 10 million a year or so.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Signing Z first wouldn't work because they then wouldn't have enough money to sign Redd since they would be near the salary cap if Redd, as he should, ends up with a big contract.

The ideal situation would be sign Redd, Sign Z and then hope for the best with McInnis.

Losing McInnis to get Redd: worth it since we have Snow with a big contract already and he has been very competent so far this year.

Losing Z to get Redd: disaster as our since any gain we get in the perimeter would be lost by the loss of one of the few pure centers in this league


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## RP McMurphy (Jul 17, 2003)

I don't think you understand how the salary cap works. Ilgauskas still counts against the cap for 150 percent of his 2004-05 salary, until you either renounce him (and lose his Bird rights) or re-sign him.

If you let go of Jeff McInnis, I think you still might have enough money to sign Ilgauskas and Redd to near-max deals, but you'd have to sign Ilgauskas first for that to work.

And I agree, letting go of Ilgauskas to sign Redd would be a disaster. Haven't people learned by now that having two wing scorers on the same team doesn't work very well? I don't think the Cavs should pursue Redd, really.


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## TucsonClip (Sep 2, 2002)

So what happens if Redd asks for a max contract or close to it (which is likley)? 

The Cavs should think about singing Z for say.. 5 years front end loaded, so they have the cap room in a few years to offer LeBron the max.

If that happens, you do not need to worry about McInnis, because the PG class for the next 2 years is going to be loaded. With a 3 some of Redd, Z, and LeBron, you do not need McInnis.


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## RP McMurphy (Jul 17, 2003)

The Cavs won't have any cap room whatsoever until they decide what to do with Ilgauskas (either re-sign him or let him walk).


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## FutureDraftPick (Aug 7, 2004)

I wonder if Z would like to take a paycut for Redd to sign?:x


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

It's not necessarily bad at all to have two scoring perimeter players as long as they complement each other and they know their place: Jordan and Pippen: 6 titles, 'nuff said. Now Lebron and Redd might not be at that level but:

The Cavs need help shooting the ball which Redd does very well and if he comes here there's no question who the Top Dog as is it will be Lebron unless he pull a Vince Carter or something. Plus, Lebron is a gifted passer and almost too unselfish. Having Z, Gooden, Redd, and Lebron we would definitley be a title contender IMO not only because of talent but the pieces would fit together well


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## Nevus (Jun 3, 2003)

Redd is a very productive player who doesn't need the ball very much. He has an all around game but is willing to do whatever the team needs him to... I think he'd be pretty potent with LeBron.


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## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>RP McMurphy</b>!
> I don't think you understand how the salary cap works. Ilgauskas still counts against the cap for 150 percent of his 2004-05 salary, until you either renounce him (and lose his Bird rights) or re-sign him.
> 
> If you let go of Jeff McInnis, I think you still might have enough money to sign Ilgauskas and Redd to near-max deals, but you'd have to sign Ilgauskas first for that to work.
> ...


They play different types of games so it doesn't matter. I think Redd will be a perfect fit because LeBron is already so great at creating shots and Redd can hit them. But he can also create his own shot so LeBron doesn't have to wear himself out by doing everything on the offensive end, like he's doing now.

MJ and Pippen where two good wing scorers.


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## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

But I agree that signing Z is probably more important.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Nevus</b>!
> 
> 
> I'm not sure about Redd's situation, but if the Cavaliers can get Z to re-sign for a reasonable price, I am told that they can offer the max to somebody.


Z is not going to ask for much less than he's getting paid now, which is $14M per. The Cavs would be ecstatic to get Z to resign for $10M per. The Cavs would have to let Wagner and McInnis walk this summer to be able to sign Redd. Wagner is as good as gone. But do the Cavs want to resign McInnis with the MLE? They'd still be at or very close to the cap with McInnis at the MLE and Z signing a $10M per deal (if they're lucky). Remember, Redd is making $3M this year and has a player option next season that he will opt out. The Cavs can't keep McInnis because Redd will demand far more than the MLE. 

This is assuming HoopsHype has got the salaries updated as of today. Did the Cavs already use their LLE this past summer?


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pan Mengtu</b>!
> 
> MJ and Pippen where two good wing scorers.


MJ and Pippen were two of the top 10 best perimeter players for a decade in addition to being two of the elite scorers in the NBA. LeBron and Redd wouldn't be anywhere near as potent. Especially Redd.


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## RP McMurphy (Jul 17, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pioneer10</b>!
> It's not necessarily bad at all to have two scoring perimeter players as long as they complement each other and they know their place: Jordan and Pippen: 6 titles, 'nuff said.


Scottie Pippen's scoring wasn't anywhere near his most valuable contribution to those Bulls teams, his defense was. Pippen was an overrated scorer but he's probably the best perimeter defender of all time. Comparing that to what the Cavs would be with two matadors like LeBron and Redd just doesn't make much sense.

If Redd came to Cleveland he'd be reduced to a spot-up jump shooter. He's a good shooter, one of the best, but he still has the ball in his hands most of the time in Milwaukee. You'd be taking a lot away from his game if you signed him, after a couple of months the board would be full of threads asking what happened to Redd, or calling LeBron selfish for not being able to co-exist with him.

The Cavs are better off signing a spot-up shooter for cheaper, if Luke Jackson isn't getting the job done.


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## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>EHL</b>!
> 
> 
> MJ and Pippen were two of the top 10 best perimeter players for a decade in addition to being two of the elite scorers in the NBA. LeBron and Redd wouldn't be anywhere near as potent. Especially Redd.


What does that have to do with whether they can be effective playing beside each other?


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## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>RP McMurphy</b>!
> 
> 
> Scottie Pippen's scoring wasn't anywhere near his most valuable contribution to those Bulls teams, his defense was. Pippen was an overrated scorer but he's probably the best perimeter defender of all time. Comparing that to what the Cavs would be with two matadors like LeBron and Redd just doesn't make much sense.
> ...


You're going to wear the hell out of LeBron if you have him making everyone on his team's shot for them. He's not John Stockton, and if you try to make him John Stockton you'll be wasting his talent. He needs guys who don't have to be set up every time to score. Redd can do that. And I don't think he'd mind taking a back seat to LeBron. He doesn't seem like the type of guy who would.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pan Mengtu</b>!
> 
> 
> What does that have to do with whether they can be effective playing beside each other?


Because that's one of very _very_ few rare cases when wing players can be effective (I assume you mean playoff-effective) together. And those two players had to be extraordinarily talented.


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>RP McMurphy</b>!
> 
> 
> Scottie Pippen's scoring wasn't anywhere near his most valuable contribution to those Bulls teams, his defense was. Pippen was an overrated scorer but he's probably the best perimeter defender of all time. Comparing that to what the Cavs would be with two matadors like LeBron and Redd just doesn't make much sense.
> ...


Even when Jackson becomes good the Cavs simply don't have enough depth to be a championship level club. Except for Snow the bench is very weak and so another starter would be great. They also need a guy who can take some pressure of James.

I'm sorry but Pippen was a very good scorer before his back went out and the point is that not Lebron/Redd would be better then Jordan/Pippen (they won't be nearly as good) but they would coexist quite happily. In fact, the Bucks did their best last season when TJ ford had the ball in his hands and got the ball to Redd in good spots. Lebron is an extremely good passer and is unselfish so I'm not sure why they couldn't coexist. In fact when he gets better players around him, his court vision and not his scoring might be his most valuable assest with the Cavs. For example I don't think a combo of TMac/Redd would work nearly as well. Not that Tmac is a bad passer/selfish but he tends to have different mindset then Lebron

Other perimeter combo's like Dumars/Thomas, Rolando Blackman/Hubert Davis have worked out as well and this season I think Seattle with Lewis/Allen really doesn't fit your theory. Again the Cavs need to keep Z with Redd, but I don't think Redd would just be a jumpshooter with this team.


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## Pan Mengtu (Jun 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>EHL</b>!
> 
> 
> Because that's one of very _very_ few rare cases when wing players can be effective (I assume you mean playoff-effective) together. And those two players had to be extraordinarily talented.


I disagree that they were effective together because of their extraordinary talent. I think they were effective because of good chemistry and complementary games.

And I can name at least a couple of good SG-SF combos in the NBA today, like Johnson and Marion or Allen and Lewis. None of those guys are exclusively spot of shooters. They just work well together.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pan Mengtu</b>!
> 
> 
> I disagree that they were effective together because of their extraordinary talent. I think they were effective because of good chemistry and complementary games.


Come on Pan, they were successful together because they had talent. Not much more to it. 



> And I can name at least a couple of good SG-SF combos in the NBA today, like Johnson and Marion or Allen and Lewis. None of those guys are exclusively spot of shooters. They just work well together.


Neither combination has had all that much success, unless you're using the last month of basketball as your only proof.


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## takeanumber3333 (Apr 18, 2004)

I was the guy who said it, and I got my information on the Cavs insider board. There are a lot of capoligists(is that a word?) on there.


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