# RMR Game 4



## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Tuesday afternoon on NBA TV and league ticket. 

Versus Denver


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## King Joseus (May 26, 2003)

i'll be watching...

on a side note, it sucks that Dali's leaving to play for Croatia - I was looking forward to seeing him play. he did have ten points in a game the other day i think...


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

bulls started this lineup. 

Baxter-C
Austin-pf 
Hassell-SF
Mason JR-SG
Hinrich-pg

Baxter is a bull down low. Doing anything he wants close to the basket. 

The team runs and pushes the ball at almost every play

Anthony DNP

Game is on NBA TV right now and NBA League ticket


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Bulls down 16-15. Just now put in a whole new fice guys. 

Before the players switched, Austin made a nice move down low for two and Mason hit a three in transition. 

Hinrich has not scored. Missed two fts. But he does push the ball. 
Hassell has a bucket also.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> The team runs and pushes the ball at almost every play


Now that sounds exciting! They're doing exactly what Paxson wants the Bulls to do during the regular season. Guess he really means it!
:greatjob:
:twave: 

BTW, what's happened to the website? It...is...so...fricking...slow...zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> Mason hit a three in transition.
> 
> Hinrich has not scored. Missed two fts. But he does push the ball.
> Hassell has a bucket also.


Hinrich doesn't need to score much as long as he's facilitating the fast break and getting the ball to players where they can score.

You mentioned Mason hitting a three in transition. Seems like he's looking for his perimeter shot more often than last year. What are your impressions true, of Roger turning into a real perimeter and 3 point threat?


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Bulls down 24-17 after one. Reason being they have Gregory at pg and he is not a pg. Denver pressed and Bulls having a hard time with it. 

Samake is rail thin! Tooth pick. Baxter is shorter but much bigger if you get my drift. Could the bulls be looking at Baxter as a back up center??? Or is it because Bagaric is not here.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Kismet</b>!
> 
> 
> Hinrich doesn't need to score much as long as he's facilitating the fast break and getting the ball to players where they can score.
> ...


He has hit another three. Then immediately stole the ball. 

He also hit a layup in transition. Roger can handle the ball. He has looked good.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Bulls down by two 41-39 halftime. Hinrich did not play much at all in the first half. 

Hassell is not a SF. 

Austin has 7 pts. Mason has more than that but im not surre how much more. 

Gregory played pt guard. Maybe they want to see if he can be a PG.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> 
> 
> He has hit another three. Then immediately stole the ball.
> ...


That's great news! I'd heard that this kid's the real deal if given the chance. Looks like Hassel might have some serious competition for an active roster spot. Trent's seriously turnover prone...Roger's got above average handles. Trent went MIA on offense last season...Roger's nailing threes and scoring in transition as well. And both are solid 6'5" defenders. I'd say that based on very preliminary reports, Hassell's got a real fight on his hands. And that can only be good news for the Bulls.


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## Qwerty123 (May 31, 2002)

Who is guarding Lonny? Do you think he can be this effective given more minutes during the regular season?


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## Chicago_Cow (Mar 5, 2003)

Puss Hinrich has another pitiful game by scoring zero points along with 3 fouls and a couple of turnovers. BTW, the boy also missed two crucial free throw which could tie the score right now.

Who are the punks that want to trade JC so Hinrich could start again? I don't want to name and I will if necessary but it's time to fess up. The guy is a career backup and he'll be lucky to crack the starting lineup on any team in this league. I don't care if this is the summer league but how can you suck four games straight against sub-par NBA competition.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

48-48 tie 6:00 in third. 

Austin got two very quick offensive fouls early and is sitting down with five fouls. 

Mason hit another jumper. Hassell did too. right now, Samamke at center and Baxter at pf. 

Hinrich still has not scored. But he hasnt shot it at all in the second half.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

We have to remember that winning games at the RMR is way down on everybody's list of priorities (except the players, of course). Teaching and evaluating are always more important there than who won or lost. 

Does Hinrich appear comfortable in the set offense (on those rare occasions when they have to run sets), or does he look like he's thinking out on the court? My guess is he's trying hard to follow orders instead of playing freely and creatively. I imagine we'll see more of his personal style when he starts to understand the intracacies of the triangle and the complexities of the Bulls system no longer seems so _complex_.

Oh and lets not forget that Bach and the Bulls have probably introduced all of them to new defensive schemes. Thats a lot to absorb over a short period of time. What is it Hassell said?

''He's saying some big words, man, and I don't understand some of them,'' Hassell said. ''So I have to pay close attention because it's usually what he says after those big words that I understand. 

But overall the players' learning curve will be very steep for a while. As Paxson reminded us:

"The [triangle] offense can be a little hard to digest, and the coaching staff throws a lot of other things at these guys,'' Paxson said. "But Kirk Hinrich has picked up things nicely. He's going to be real solid.


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## Qwerty123 (May 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> Puss Hinrich has another pitiful game by scoring zero points along with 3 fouls and a couple of turnovers. BTW, the boy also missed two crucial free throw which could tie the score right now.
> 
> Who are the punks that want to trade JC so Hinrich could start again? I don't want to name and I will if necessary but it's time to fess up. The guy is a career backup and he'll be lucky to crack the starting lineup on any team in this league. I don't care if this is the summer league but how can you suck four games straight against sub-par NBA competition.


I was and still am against the drafting of Kirk Hinrich, but you really have to cut the guy some slack. Our system is tough for rookie point guards to pick up, and for pete's sake, this is summer league. I can't recall how Jamal did in past summer league games, but to claim that Hinrich will never amount to anything after 3.5 summer league games while simultaneously praising Jamal is awfully forgetful. How long did it take Jamal to do anything again?


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

Mason and Baxter look good. Mason can shoot and handle. Hinrich hasn't really done anything except for playing solid defense.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Nene (he changed his name to one name) and Baxter have been fun to watch. They have battled the whole game. 

Samake made a good block on, Nikoloz Tskitishvili

I tell you guys, Mason is the real deal. Not a star, but he can play.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Hassell hit a three just now. Bulls up 60-52.


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## hps (Jul 23, 2002)

Hinrich was pretty umimpressive, but when he and Mason were on the bench early on, the importance of having someone bring the ball up court were evident. Kirk can do that. He also had a nice block.

Mason looks very solid, making his shots, handling the ball, and driving to the basket.

Hassell is defending well and his shot is falling.

Baxter continues his excellent play.

Austin looks good.

Nene is a physical specimen.

Bulls lead 67-55 through third quarter.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Sam vincent and the other announcer has talked about Denver, Kiki and all of the Denver players the whole game. Even Anthony. 

Gregory hit a three.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> Puss Hinrich has another pitiful game by scoring zero points along with 3 fouls and a couple of turnovers. BTW, the boy also missed two crucial free throw which could tie the score right now.
> 
> Who are the punks that want to trade JC so Hinrich could start again? I don't want to name and I will if necessary but it's time to fess up. The guy is a career backup and he'll be lucky to crack the starting lineup on any team in this league. I don't care if this is the summer league but how can you suck four games straight against sub-par NBA competition.


This is as clear an example of player hating as you can get. You can try to justify your remarks anyway you want. But drawing these kinds of conclusions so early in his career is not only extremely unreasonable, it smacks of some type of personal agenda that compels you to thoughtlessly condemn *anyone* on the Bulls who might compete with Jamal for minutes, be it now or down the road.

What you're doing is wrong, man. Like it or not Hinrich is on our side, he's one of our guys, and no one should be shooting him down like this before he's played his first regular season game. Calling Kirk a "puss" so soon is just plain wrong, and there's no other way to describe it.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> Nene (he changed his name to one name) and Baxter have been fun to watch. They have battled the whole game.


If you were watching both players for the very first time and didn't know anytrhing about either of them, who would you feel is the better player...Nene or Lonnie?


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## Chicago_Cow (Mar 5, 2003)

Plain wrong? The truth hurts but I am not spreading lies here. So far, his competition has been NBA rejects and he can't even hang with the best of them. My comment was to call out people that want to trade JC so we could start Hinrich at pg. You were one of them, Kismet, so maybe you have a personal agenda against JC. I am spreaking the the truth and the truth is that Hinrich will never be a starting pg for any team. The guy stays in college for four years so his potential has been tap. What you see is what you will see for the rest of his career and it isn't looking very hot as of right now.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

by just one game? I can't tell. the announcers talked about Nene the whole game but Baxter has matched him. Baxter is smaller but plays tuff. 

I would say both are even.


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## jimmy (Aug 20, 2002)

For those watching the game... who do you think is better? Mason Jr. or Hassell

One of these guys will be a backup SG and one will fall out of the rotation.

Even with the terrible play by Hinrich and the great play by Baxter, their roles don't change.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> by just one game? I can't tell. the announcers talked about Nene the whole game but Baxter has matched him. Baxter is smaller but plays tuff.
> 
> I would say both are even.


I know the question was very hypothetical. But your opinion tells me Lonnie's improved significantly from last year. We know from last season that Nene's a stud and a future star. So for Baxter to battle him straight up and more than hold his own says lots about Lonnie's work ethic and committment to improve. I'm glad he's one of ours!


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Kismet</b>!
> 
> 
> I know the question was very hypothetical. But your opinion tells me Lonnie's improved significantly from last year. We know from last season that Nene's a stud and a future star. So for Baxter to battle him straight up and more than hold his own says lots about Lonnie's work ethic and committment to improve. I'm glad he's one of ours!


I really think it's a shame that Lonnie is our 4th stringer. I've always thought it is his suprising play that could make Fizer or Marshall expendable if we wanted to upgrade at another position.


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## Qwerty123 (May 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> The guy stays in college for four years so his potential has been tap. What you see is what you will see for the rest of his career and it isn't looking very hot as of right now.


Tim Duncan, arguably the best player in the NBA, is still getting better. And oh yeah, he went to college for 4 years. Learn to pick your fights when it comes to Hinrich, and don't discredit yourself by scrapping for specious arguments. No one will take you seriously in the future when you have a good point.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> 
> 
> I really think it's a shame that Lonnie is our 4th stringer. I've always thought it is his suprising play that could make Fizer or Marshall expendable if we wanted to upgrade at another position.


It still might. The trade deadline isn't for another seven months. Anything can happen!


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

> The guy stays in college for four years so his potential has been tap. What you see is what you will see for the rest of his career and it isn't looking very hot as of right now.


Let's consider some stats from Last Year's RMR.

Even after a season in the NBA (or two in Crawford's case), our guys played crappy.

Chandler: 8ppg, 7rpg, 2tos
Crawford: .385 shooting, .273 from long range 2.7tos
Mason: .344 shooting
Curry: 4.7 rpg from our starting center.

And an overall record of 2-4 against a "bunch of scrubs" from our vaunted threesome of young stars- Curry, Chandler, and Crawford. Even though all three of these guys had at least a year in the system.

So either these guys all suck and "what you see is what you get", or this is a fallacious line of reasoning.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Qwerty123</b>!
> 
> 
> Tim Duncan, arguably the best player in the NBA, is still getting better. And oh yeah, he went to college for 4 years. Learn to pick your fights when it comes to Hinrich, and don't discredit yourself by scrapping for specious arguments. No one will take you seriously in the future when you have a good point.


*Specious*, now that's impressive, Qwerty! I had to look that one up. Very felicitous. Hats off!! :groucho:


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JAF311</b>!
> For those watching the game... who do you think is better? Mason Jr. or Hassell
> 
> One of these guys will be a backup SG and one will fall out of the rotation.
> ...


I wish I could be watching this, but based purely on seeing him in college (I didn't see enough of him last year to say anything), I'd go with a healthy and seasoned Mason if at all possible.

Mason was a tough defender himself in college, but I think what really sets him apart from Hassell is that Mason can really handle the rock. At best, I could see him being like a Derek Anderson or Brent Barry type player (guys I recently advocated trying to acquire  )- a guy who's not really a PG but would appear to be a good SG in the triangle.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

Bulls win 74-70. Hassell hit 3-4 fts to ice it. Samake got a big block. 

Bulls have about 6 or 7 offensive fouls in the fourth quarter just trying to astablish position! 

Bulls undefeated.


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## Qwerty123 (May 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Kismet</b>!
> 
> 
> *Specious*, now that's impressive, Qwerty! I had to look that one up. Very felicitous. Hats off!! :groucho:


Thanks, but you just one upped me with felicitous. Sounds like a show on the WB.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JAF311</b>!
> For those watching the game... who do you think is better? Mason Jr. or Hassell
> 
> One of these guys will be a backup SG and one will fall out of the rotation.
> ...


Hard to tell right now. Hassell had 17 points the last game. He showed some offense this game but so did Mason.


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## Chicago_Cow (Mar 5, 2003)

Here's Tim Duncan bio for anyone that's too lazy to even do some research before barking.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/tim_duncan/index.html?nav=page

He sure is getting better. His stat throughout his 6 NBA years are pretty much the same and solid.

As for Hinrich. the guy is 22 years old that blows against NBA scrubs. Chandler and Curry were young at the time but they show promises. Hinrich has been shooting at an average fg % of 25% and it's getting worse after this game. 

It's ridiculous that some of you said Summer League doesn't count but I beg to differ. Summer league is a good indication of what the player will do when the regular season comes and Hinrich doesn't resemble anything that's NBA ready from this league. Here's the line of reasoning for the Hinrich pick, "We pick Hinrich because he's the best available player available. The guy is smart and comes from a great system and knows how the shoot the ball, something that we lack."


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> 
> 
> I wish I could be watching this, but based purely on seeing him in college (I didn't see enough of him last year to say anything), I'd go with a healthy and seasoned Mason if at all possible.
> ...


I'd heard that he was an excellent shooter at Virginia. That's why I had to do a double take last year when he was finally activated and it seemed like all he could do was launch airballs. In fact, for the season he was 19-53 (35.8%). But now he seems to be letting his ability shine through. Amazing what a little time and experience can do for most players at the pro level. I'm really happy for Roger, and for the Bulls because I hear he's a real class act on the court and off. Any chance we might be looking at the Gilbert Arenas story all over again? Arenas _was_ a second round pick afterall, taken immediately after Trent Hassell, I believe. What a great development that would be:*Mason Becomes a Bigger, Stronger Version of Arenas!*


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> Here's Tim Duncan bio for anyone that's too lazy to even do some research before barking.
> 
> http://www.nba.com/playerfile/tim_duncan/index.html?nav=page
> ...


Gee, that's wonderful: reduce everything to numbers and nevermind everything else that contributes to a players greatness. Looks like we got ourselves an honest to goodness fantasy league player here, Boys and Girls. And we all know why they call them "Fantasy" instead of "Reality" Leagues, don't we? My Momma told me never to debate someone who isn't well grounded in the real world. Damn if she wasn't right again!!
:grinning:


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## Qwerty123 (May 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Kismet</b>!
> 
> 
> Gee, that's wonderful: reduce everything to numbers and nevermind everything else that contributes to a players greatness. Looks like we got ourselves an honest to goodness fantasy league player here, Boys and Girls. And we all know why they call them "Fantasy" instead of "Reality" Leagues, don't we? My Momma told me never to debate someone who isn't well grounded in the real world. Damn if she wasn't right again!!
> :grinning:


Thanks, Kismet. I had decided to heed similar advice, but I'm glad someone made the point that had to be made.


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## hps (Jul 23, 2002)

Chicago Cow - You're correct that Hinrich has sucked in the RMR. But to take that information, and draw the conclusion that he'll suck for the rest of his career, is weak at best.

There are tons of Summer league players who have had good and bad stats only to do the opposite during the regular season.

Like someone mentioned, Crawford sucked last summer, and put up all-star stats the last month or so.

And old friend Kwame Brown had a great summer league last year, and we know how the 2002-2003 season turned out for Kwame.

I'll wait for the body of work, not the first few splatters of paint. Please excuse my pretentious analogy.


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## RSP83 (Nov 24, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> Here's Tim Duncan bio for anyone that's too lazy to even do some research before barking.
> 
> http://www.nba.com/playerfile/tim_duncan/index.html?nav=page
> ...


Tim Duncan might not have an obvious improvement oh his stats since his rookie year, but improving is not all about increasing stats. 
There's also something other than stats "The understanding of the pro-game". Hinrich is playing one of the hardest position in the NBA, Point Guard. The last "system" guy who struggle to play the position for the Bulls is Duke's Jay Williams who is touted as very NBA ready. Their game in college does not translate well into the pro game. They probably need a season or two to learn the pro-game.

Talking about potential, if a senior means that they've reach their potential, than that means College teaches a player everything about the game that a player is flawless coming out of their senior season in college. I don't believe that Hinrich can't improve his game. He still have room for improvement. He's a good defender in college, now he has to defend the pros in the NBA. He'll suck at his first couple of seasons, but playing against the pros every week will improve his defense and even his whole game. Hinrich have not reach his potential yet as a pro baller. Wait 'til he understands the pro game. 

If you want stats as evidence... check out Steve Nash. He's a senior coming into the league and he wasn't a better prospect than Hinrich coming into the league. Look what he becomes now. 

Oh, and last... Tim Duncan has God-given talent. And he's smart to understand that he doesn't have to drastically increase his stats to take his game to a higher level. And he won the Chip for that.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>hps</b>!
> Chicago Cow - You're correct that Hinrich has sucked in the RMR. But to take that information, and draw the conclusion that he'll suck for the rest of his career, is weak at best.
> 
> There are tons of Summer league players who have had good and bad stats only to do the opposite during the regular season.
> ...


How about LEbron who started playing well in the Rookie league then has been not so great. I agree with you, i laugh when people think that if a player does bad in the summer league they will be bad for the rest of the year thats ridiculos. If that was true then Hinrich and James will have bad rookie years, and if it was the oposite then Lonny Baxter will become a top 5 PF.


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## jimmy (Aug 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Kismet</b>!
> 
> 
> Gee, that's wonderful: reduce everything to numbers and nevermind everything else that contributes to a players greatness. Looks like we got ourselves an honest to goodness fantasy league player here, Boys and Girls. And we all know why they call them "Fantasy" instead of "Reality" Leagues, don't we? My Momma told me never to debate someone who isn't well grounded in the real world. Damn if she wasn't right again!!
> :grinning:


What's so wrong about what Chicago Cow is saying? His numbers suck. Have you seen him play? Since very few have seen him play in the RMR then we have to rely on numbers. And he sucks. 

I agree that numbers don't tell the whole story, but how much intangibles has he done to cover up his terrible numbers? 

I didn't expect a 4 year senior out of Kansas, a 7th pick, and a Roy Williams product to struggle this much against 3rd stringers. How will he do against NBA 2nd stringers?

Shooting has nothing to do with being a rookie PG. The basket doesn't change, it's the same height, the same distance. 

He can't shoot and turns the ball over. He was drafted to do the exact opposite.

I'm not going to write him off, let's hope he improves.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> How about LEbron who started playing well in the Rookie league then has been not so great. I agree with you, i laugh when people think that if a player does bad in the summer league they will be bad for the rest of the year thats ridiculos. If that was true then Hinrich and James will have bad rookie years, and if it was the oposite then Lonny Baxter will become a top 5 PF.


What stats have you been reading? LeBron has been ripping it up, save one game. His propensity to score, rebound, and hand out assists is really something.


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## jimmy (Aug 20, 2002)

Are there player statistical rankings for the RMR?

I've seen them for the other leagues but not for the RMR.


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## 7thwatch (Jul 18, 2002)

Hinrich shoots poorly because his hair covers his eyes and he can't see the basket  

Its good to see that Trent, Lonny, and Mason are doing well. Maybe Mason could end our problem with backup sg.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> 
> 
> What stats have you been reading? LeBron has been ripping it up, save one game. His propensity to score, rebound, and hand out assists is really something.


Lebron after is 2 good games or 20 plus scoring only has averaged 15 points is shooting 36% and is shooting a horrible 15% from the 3 line, he has made some turnovers, and is only shooting 55% from the freetrow line. RIPPING IT UP?


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> Lebron after is 2 good games or 20 plus scoring only has averaged 15 points is shooting 36% and is shooting a horrible 15% from the 3 line, he has made some turnovers, and is only shooting 55% from the freetrow line. RIPPING IT UP?


So you're discounting his good games and only acknowledging the bad ones? He has only played in about 5 games. 2 good games is pretty good. And I would contend he's had more good games than that. It's not just about scoring when it comes to LeBron.

If you're Cleveland, you've got to be elated with how good this guy is playing. I don't even care about his stats. What I care about is that this guy is moving right in and playing the point guard position with aplomb. Add to that the fact that LeBron is showing flashes of absolutely absurd athletic ability and passing skills. I don't care if he's inconsistant right now. If he wasn't, I wouldn't be surprised if he could walk on water too. From what I've seen, the guy is going to be flat out ridiculous.

I know he's hyped beyond belief, but I am of the opinion that perhaps for once, the hype is deserved. LeBron is every bit the phenom we are told he is.


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## thebizkit69u (Feb 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Darius Miles Davis</b>!
> 
> 
> So you're discounting his good games and only acknowledging the bad ones? He has only played in about 5 games. 2 good games is pretty good. And I would contend he's had more good games than that. It's not just about scoring when it comes to LeBron.
> ...


i will talk about his 2 good games , hmmm well besides he scored well and had a good game, he could not defend the other players. i belive he has allowed 20 points to his defender also. But its no big deal cause this is just the summer league. FOR GODS SAKE Bo Outlaw is the Summer Leagues Hall Of Fammer.


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## Fizer Fanatic (Jun 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> The guy stays in college for four years so his potential has been tap. What you see is what you will see for the rest of his career and it isn't looking very hot as of right now.


Here (at the bottom of the page) are the season-by-season stats of the former NBA player that Hinrich seems to best represent in my opinion. That other guy seemed to improve dramatically during his first 4 NBA seasons despite having accumulated 4 year of NCAA experience before-hand.

Also, didn't Pippen put in 4 years at Central Arkansas? He somehow managed to show improvement over several seasons.


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## Machinehead (Jun 12, 2002)

What were Mason's stats for the game?

Anyone ??


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## Fizer Fanatic (Jun 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> Sam vincent and the other announcer has talked about Denver, Kiki and all of the Denver players the whole game. Even Anthony.


Funny how we're undefeated in RMR, but cannot get the respect of the announcers. Admittedly Nene and Carmelo are pretty high-profile players for the summer league, but still ...


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>thebizkit69u</b>!
> 
> 
> i will talk about his 2 good games , hmmm well besides he scored well and had a good game, he could not defend the other players. i belive he has allowed 20 points to his defender also. But its no big deal cause this is just the summer league. FOR GODS SAKE Bo Outlaw is the Summer Leagues Hall Of Fammer.


Why even put LeBron and Bo Outlaw in the same paragraph? Please let's not even compare their skillsets.  

Yes, you are correct. LeBron is not a good defender yet. But to my knowledge, no backcourt player/swingman has played good defense coming out of HS. Defense needs to be taught, and do you think LeBron's HS coach was ragging on him for lax D? Maybe he should have, but I'm not betting on it.

I say LeBron wins rookie of the year. I give him at least a 67% chance.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Fizer Fanatic</b>!
> 
> 
> Funny how we're undefeated in RMR, but cannot get the respect of the announcers. Admittedly Nene and Carmelo are pretty high-profile players for the summer league, but still ...


It really bothered me. There was more than one time in the game where one of the bulls players would be shooting free throws and Sam Vincent would take about some player from Denver or how Kiki is going in the right direction or how in another year or two all of these young players could be hard to deal with. In the meantime, the Bulls quietly won. 

Vincent did talk about Hinrich. Saying he should play more. 

Denver was 17-65.


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## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

Revenge is best served cold.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

I must say Vincent did talk some about Crawford. Said he should have been there. If for nothing other than the fact to play a little. 

Vincent never once mentioned Curry or Chandler or Fizer, but he talked about everyone on the Denver roster over and over again. Never mentioned Rose or Marshall.


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## Darius Miles Davis (Aug 2, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> I must say Vincent did talk some about Crawford. Said he should have been there. If for nothing other than the fact to play a little.
> 
> Vincent never once mentioned Curry or Chandler or Fizer, but he talked about everyone on the Denver roster over and over again. Never mentioned Rose or Marshall.


Well, not everyone is so uninformed. On my local ESPN radio New York affiliate, Brandon Tierney was talking tonight about how impressive Crawford is, as well as Chandler, Curry, Rose, and Pippen. Of course he was talking about the Knicks and the ramifications of their big trade, but he brought up teams like the Bulls who could leap over them this year.


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## GB (Jun 11, 2002)

For those complaining--perhaps Hinrich has just hit a _slump_? Happens. Sometimes takes more games than they'll play to shoot their way out of it.


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> For those complaining--perhaps Hinrich has just hit a _slump_? Happens. Sometimes takes more games than they'll play to shoot their way out of it.


I dont think he took a shot in the second half of the game. 

He is quick. He does play defense. He scraps.


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## jimmy (Aug 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>truebluefan</b>!
> 
> 
> I dont think he took a shot in the second half of the game.
> ...


Maybe he's too aggressive. He fouled out in this game and every game he seems to be in foul trouble.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> For those complaining--perhaps Hinrich has just hit a _slump_? Happens. Sometimes takes more games than they'll play to shoot their way out of it.


Good point. He might also just be suffering from tired legs or a jammed thumb or a million other things. Who cares? The important thing is that he's getting practical experience running the offensive sets and executing the Bulls defensive schemes.

Here's what's important: they're learning...and they're developing the kind of confidence that goes hand in hand with team success. What more should you expect from most of these guys three months before the start of the season?


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## truebluefan (May 27, 2002)

http://www.nba.com/media/jazz/denchi12.pdf

Box score


Baxter out played Nene. Nene had 14 pts three rebounds. 2 assists 3 steals. 

Baxter: 16 pts 9 boards, two blocks. One block was on Nene himself!

Samake 8 pts 8 rebounds two blocks in 20 minutes. 

Hirich in 16 minutes, did not score. 2 assists 1 block. 

Hassell 16 pts 6 boards. 1 steal 1 block

Mason, 14 pts 3 rebounds 1 assist and 3 steals. 

Austin, 12 pts. 4 rebounds and three steals. 

We shot 44%, had 23 turnovers.


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## Chicago_Cow (Mar 5, 2003)

What a great selection at 7th especially when you have a stud pg already lined up.

Here's Hinrich line against NBA *REJECTS*:

0-1 fg% 0 pts (DUH!!!) 2 boards, 2 assists, 2 *turnovers*, * 0-2 free throw *

Where was this great shooting stroke that Pax was raving about again? Everyone said that this guy is a shooter but the guy is shooting poorer than Trenton Hassel. I don't expect 20 pts and total domination from Hinrich but I expect at least a nice fg% along from the range of 10-15 pts along with great defense and a decent assist/turnover ratio.


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## jimmy (Aug 20, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> What a great selection at 7th especially when you have a stud pg already lined up.
> 
> Here's Hinrich line against NBA *REJECTS*:
> ...


That's what i was looking for too. Not points but shooting % and ast/TO. So far it hasn't been good.


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## thunderspirit (Jun 25, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>GB</b>!
> For those complaining--perhaps Hinrich has just hit a _slump_? Happens. Sometimes takes more games than they'll play to shoot their way out of it.


he's not allowed to slump. he's not allowed a learning curve at what's widely seen as the toughest position in the NBA to learn.

he's far too busy being 1) a white guard; 2) the perceived flop of the draft at #7, even though he's yet to play a real NBA minute; and 3) _not_ being the Second Coming, Jamal Crawford (who, as was pointed out by hps, didn't exactly light the RMR on fire last summer).


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## Electric Slim (Jul 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Chicago_Cow</b>!
> What a great selection at 7th especially when you have a stud pg already lined up.
> 
> Here's Hinrich line against NBA *REJECTS*:
> ...


Clarabell, I'm starting to get the impression that you don't like Hinrich? I could be just me though.


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## Kismet (Mar 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Electric Slim</b>!
> 
> 
> Clarabell, I'm starting to get the impression that you don't like Hinrich? I could be just me though.


Actually, I'm beginning to get the impression that this poster is actually Jamal Crawford's mom or dad. Anyone who may appear to be a threat to JC is automatically roasted. I imagine that had we signed Gary Payton, Clarabell would have dissed him, too.
:grinning: :laugh: :yes:


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## Butt Cheese (Jun 27, 2003)

> Clarabell, I'm starting to get the impression that you don't like Hinrich? I could be just me though.



OK Jamal, fess up. It's really you isn't it?


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