# Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Butler to Milwaukee



## kbdullah (Jul 8, 2010)

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 



> Eric Bledsoe and Caron Butler will go to the Suns, Jared Dudley and JJ Redick to the Clippers and 2 2nd-round picks to Bucks, sources tell Y


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



> @WojYahooNBA
> 
> Eric Bledsoe and Caron Butler will go to the Suns, Jared Dudley and JJ Redick to the Clippers and 2 2nd-round picks to Bucks, sources tell Y!


...


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## kbdullah (Jul 8, 2010)

*Re: Clippers-Bucks-Suns Three Team Trade*

Clippers get their SG in Redick...why did the Suns go after Bledsoe? Is he going to backup Dragic?


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Clippers-Bucks-Suns Three Team Trade*

Wow. Clippers looking nasty. Redick and Dudley will start for them.


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## Wade2Bosh (Mar 31, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Great deal for the Clippers.


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## kbdullah (Jul 8, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Don't get this for the Suns at all...why do they want Bledsoe when they have Dragic and what do they want with Caron?


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

OMG Clippers. Sick deal.


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



kbdullah said:


> Don't get this for the Suns at all...why do they want Bledsoe when they have Dragic and what do they want with Caron?


Caron is an expiring contract, no?


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



> Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 3m
> 
> In the sign and trade scenario, Redick will get a four year, $27 million deal with the Clippers, sources tell Y! Sports.


...


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Suns are proving to be one of the worst run franchises over the past few seasons. And I love Bledsoe.

Pretty good contract for Redick, too, especially the same day as that Webster deal.

EDIT: If Caron is expiring, I apologize to PHX.


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## Maravilla (Jul 6, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Hell yes bledsoe


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## FSH (Aug 3, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Wait all the Bucks get are 2nd round picks? Wtf? Why wouldnt they be the team getting Blesdoe? Im not getting this deal at all


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

OKC-LAC WCF, health-abiding?


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Judging by Dudley's tweets, he's a very happy man.


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## Maravilla (Jul 6, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Now we can move goran.... Again. Im down with this


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Jace said:


> OKC-LAC WCF, health-abiding?


Very possible.


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Wow!!!

Clippers!


J-Dud is a stud.


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## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

So Bucks give up JJ for 2 2nd rounders? Really?

Or was he a free agent anyway?


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## NOFX22 (Sep 28, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Idk how i feel about this


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## kbdullah (Jul 8, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



chilltown said:


> Now we can move goran.... Again. Im down with this


I'd take him in Dallas.


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

He was a UFA, I actually expected the Bucks would get something useful back...


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



> @*CoupNBA*  1m Paul-Redick-Crawford-Dudley-Griffin would be quite a bit of fun in reasonable doses. Perfect for Paul-Blake pick-and-rolls.


:drool:


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## Basel (Mar 31, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Dee-Zy said:


> So Bucks give up JJ for 2 2nd rounders? Really?
> 
> Or was he a free agent anyway?


He was a free agent, so this is being done in a S&T.


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## Maravilla (Jul 6, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



kbdullah said:


> I'd take him in Dallas.


Ill have my people call your people.


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## FSH (Aug 3, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I cant believe Suns pulled 2 really nice pieces for Jared Dudley. I mean he is a solid role player but a big expiring and Eric Bledsoe for him?


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Clips still have a pretty small ass lineup, hopefully they'll get a perimeter stopper and an actual decent big guy.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

This does a lot to fix two of the Clippers biggest holes. It would have been better if they could have gotten Gortat somehow. I would not be surprised if they tried to move Crawford for the right deal as well.


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## FSH (Aug 3, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



ZhugeLiang said:


> Clips still have a pretty small ass lineup, hopefully they'll get a perimeter stopper and an actual decent big guy.


DeAndre Jordan is a solid Big Guy. He will keep maturing and getting better the guy is only 24


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Diable said:


> This does a lot to fix two of the Clippers biggest holes. It would have been better if they could have gotten Gortat somehow.



Does nothing to help their 3-pt defense.

Is Reddick a good enough playmaker to play at PG alongside Crawford in the second unit?


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## doctordrizzay (May 10, 2011)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Damn Clips really got the best of this, wow


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



FSH said:


> Wait all the Bucks get are 2nd round picks? Wtf? Why wouldnt they be the team getting Blesdoe? Im not getting this deal at all


Because we are the worst run team in the NBA.. at least we netted two second rounders for Tobias Harris out of all of this.. **** John Hammond and Herb Kohl


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



FSH said:


> DeAndre Jordan is a solid Big Guy. He will keep maturing and getting better the guy is only 24



Guy's overrated on defense.

Javale >>> DJ.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

No idea why MIL acquired Redick in the first place. Looked brainless at the time. Worse now. Harris is good.

I do think you can get by with Redick/Crawford running the O when Paul rests.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Man the Clippers are going to be deadly off the pick and roll with Reddick and Dudley spotted up at the 3-point line. Caron couldn't shoot the 3 consistently at all.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Nothing was more uncomfortable to me than seeing Paul kick out to Butler and Barnes for their hitchy-ass 3s. Somewhat effective, but cringingly hitchy.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Haha, so the Bucks traded Tobias Harris so they could bring J.J. Redick off the bench for 30 games and get crushed in the first round?

Savvy.


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Hibachi! said:


> Man the Clippers are going to be deadly off the pick and roll with Reddick and Dudley spotted up at the 3-point line. Caron couldn't shoot the 3 consistently at all.



They're going to get bombed themselves on the three point line though.


Reddick is smaller than the average PG and pretty unathletic, and Dudley has shorter arms than Caron.

Resigning Barnes is going to be a HUGE priority.

So now they basically have two small PG guys chasing around taller, longer, and stronger guards.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Next move for LAC is to get a deal done with Barnes. Probably not much chance they can move Jordan unless they give up a bunch of picks. Redick ( one d) and Dudley are both above average defenders too. People who talk about Redick as if he were a terrible defender just aren't watching games.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Cinco de Mayo said:


> Haha, so the Bucks traded Tobias Harris so they could bring J.J. Redick off the bench for 30 games and get crushed in the first round?
> 
> Savvy.


You should read my rant in the redick-harris trade thread.. i called all of this.. i really should just move onto marquette basketball, the bucks are ****ing hopeless


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

lol people actually bashing the Suns when they do something right?

Nothing's set going forward with this group. Goran can start, Bledsoe back up for now. They can evaluate both. Goran can play some two at times or one can be moved as asset.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Yeah the Clippers are really going to struggle defensively that's for sure. They need Barnes back and they need to try to trade Crawford for a gritty defender.


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Dissonance said:


> lol people actually bashing the Suns when they do something, right?
> 
> Nothing's set going forward with this group. Goran can start, Bledsoe back up for now. They can evaluate both. Goran can play some two at times or one can be moved as asset.



2 PG lineups can be fun to watch, especially when they both can guard stretches of SGs.


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## Maravilla (Jul 6, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Way i see it is the suns moved a good role player for a guy with star pg upside and a big expiring contract. Ill take that every time with a rebuilding roster in mind.


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Hibachi! said:


> Yeah the Clippers are really going to struggle defensively that's for sure. They need Barnes back and they need to try to trade Crawford for a gritty defender.



Hope they can sign Allen for cheap, but he's undersized too.


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## Hibachi! (Sep 18, 2003)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



ZhugeLiang said:


> Hope they can sign Allen for cheap, but he's undersized too.


Yeah but he has a 6'9 wingspan. Allen deserves a decent paycheck for once in his life though. Unlikely the Clippers can give that to him.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



ZhugeLiang said:


> Hope they can *sign Allen for cheap*, but he's undersized too.


Lavoy Allen?

Malik Allen?

Allen Iverson?


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## NOFX22 (Sep 28, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Hibachi! said:


> Yeah but he has a 6'9 wingspan. Allen deserves a decent paycheck for once in his life though. Unlikely the Clippers can give that to him. Dude has been underpaid his whole career.


We still have mid level exception for five million but i think were going to use it for a big man like Landry or Milsap


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## Tom (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I guess the Clippers are more grounded in their approach this year.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



ZhugeLiang said:


> They're going to get bombed themselves on the three point line though.
> 
> 
> Reddick is smaller than the average PG and pretty unathletic, and Dudley has shorter arms than Caron.
> ...


Can't say I agree with much here. Redick is about 6-3, about or slightly above average were he a PG, and has grown into a solid defender. Dudley is a much better defender than Butler. 

Most teams' 2nd units feature dual-PG-sized players, anyway.


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## Bubbles (Nov 12, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



FSH said:


> Wait all the Bucks get are 2nd round picks? Wtf? Why wouldnt they be the team getting Blesdoe? Im not getting this deal at all


This.



roux said:


> Because we are the worst run team in the NBA.. at least we netted two second rounders for Tobias Harris out of all of this.. **** John Hammond and Herb Kohl


This.



Cinco de Mayo said:


> Haha, so the Bucks traded Tobias Harris so they could bring J.J. Redick off the bench for 30 games and get crushed in the first round?
> 
> Savvy.


This.

It's the gift that keeps on giving. I really hate being a Bucks fan sometime.


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## Bubbles (Nov 12, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*






Bucks FO = Charlie Brown​


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Bucks probably did it to conserve cap space to overpay certain players


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Dissonance said:


> lol people actually bashing the Suns when they do something right?
> 
> Nothing's set going forward with this group. Goran can start, Bledsoe back up for now. They can evaluate both. Goran can play some two at times or one can be moved as asset.


Like I've said before, Goran isn't part of this rebuilding equation. They should have traded him BEFORE this trade. Now everyone knows Dragic is available and they're going to offer nothing for him. Maybe Dragic for Gordon.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I don't think the plan is to move Goran right away anyway. Won't hurt his value either. Teams still in a need of PGs.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Dissonance said:


> Bucks probably did it conserve cap space to overpay certain players


**** you Diss :grinning:... when we give jennings 14 million a season i am going to lose my shit


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## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Dissonance said:


> lol people actually bashing the Suns when they do something right?
> 
> Nothing's set going forward with this group. Goran can start, Bledsoe back up for now. They can evaluate both. Goran can play some two at times or one can be moved as asset.


Exactly. When you have a bad team and you're rebuilding, you don't pick and choose your assets. When you have a chance to acquire Eric Bledsoe and Caron Butler's expiring contract for Jared Dudley you do it every single time and worry about piecing your team together later. It's not like they're planning on contending next year, you don't turn down a chance to acquire Bledsoe because you have Goran Dragic. "Team need" should really be a term used exclusively by contenders or teams that are trying to contend immediately. If you're rebuilding, your only "need" is talent and assets.


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## Bubbles (Nov 12, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Dissonance said:


> Bucks probably did it to conserve cap space to overpay certain players


They are looking for the next Drew Gooden, Bobby Simmons, and John Salmons.


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## l0st1 (Jul 2, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

How exactly is this a bad deal for the Suns?

We get rid of a role player in Dudley for a up and coming young PG that gives us more flexibility with Dragic. 

Rebuilding = rebuilding not holding on to the Jared Dudley's of the world.


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## bircan (Jul 17, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



chilltown said:


> Way i see it is the suns moved a good role player for a guy with star pg upside and a big expiring contract. Ill take that every time with a rebuilding roster in mind.


This. Suns and Clippers come away happy, but the Bucks? Like Diss said, possibly doubling down on Jennings/Ellis. Ugh.

I feel bad for Dragic though. He was wooed back, and now he will be competing with and likely losing his role to Bledsoe in due course. Maybe we can net a 10-20 range pick from next years draft from somebody.:whoknows:


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## l0st1 (Jul 2, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I don't get the talk about Clippers defense. Dudley is a very solid defender and Reddick actually isn't that bad if you watch him. Reddick works when he's on the court.


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Jace said:


> Can't say I agree with much here. Redick is about 6-3, about or slightly above average were he a PG, and has grown into a solid defender. Dudley is a much better defender than Butler.
> 
> Most teams' 2nd units feature dual-PG-sized players, anyway.



Redick's height is alright for a PG, but he has a wingspan probably below-average even for a PG, and he is weaker than most.

Dudley is definitely a FAR better defender than Butler, but if you're closing out Caron is probably a little better. Just a really small thing to note.

It'd hurt to see Redick guarding the better, larger SG's come playoffs time.


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



l0st1 said:


> I don't get the talk about Clippers defense. Dudley is a very solid defender and Reddick actually isn't that bad if you watch him. Reddick works when he's on the court.



He works hard and is definitely solid, I just question his ability to help the Clipper's shitty 3 pt defense with his height and wingspan.


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## NOFX22 (Sep 28, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Well we drafted Bullock from North Carolina who has a similar game to reddick and Dudley. He should help the clippers offensively and defensively


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Bucks never had Bledsoe on the table for them according to Woj. Suns got Bledsoe for Duds basically - who is better than Reddick. They weren't gonna keep Reddick either and S/Ted him without taking anything back. Can't fault em for it.

My comment was to elicit that type of response that roux had and I know how they're dreading a bad signings


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



NOFX22 said:


> Well we drafted Bullock from North Carolina who has a similar game to reddick and Dudley. He should help the clippers offensively and defensively



Not sure if he'll get many minutes.

A big shooter who isn't a defensive liability is a good thing to have though, but there must be a reason he was picked so late in a shit draft.


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## l0st1 (Jul 2, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



ZhugeLiang said:


> He works hard and is definitely solid, I just question his ability to help the Clipper's shitty 3 pt defense with his height and wingspan.


Him and dudley fighting through schreens and just staying with their man is the big improvement. No more missed rotations anf wide open threes. And you can't forget the offenaive opportunities they give the clippers.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

JJ was a free agent was he not? What type of deal did the Clippers give him?



Prince said:


> This.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


At least you guys have narek moderating your board.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

4 years 27 million for Redick.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Dissonance said:


> Bucks never had Bledsoe on the table for them according to Woj. Suns got Bledsoe for Duds basically - who is better than Reddick. They weren't gonna keep Reddick either and S/Ted him without taking anything back. Can't fault em for it.
> 
> My comment was to elicit that type of response that roux had and I know how they're dreading a bad signings


Speaking of bad deals sounds like we are offering korver 3/21... Absolutely mindblowing, dunleavy walks for 2/7 and we respond with this


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

That can't be right...No one could offer that sort of money to Korver when the market is half that


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## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Jennings-Ellis-JR Smith is going to be UGLY.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Oj mayo to the bucks


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Reddick is the best the Clippers can do for Bledsoe? They also threw in Butler, lmao! Wow…


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Reddick is the best the Clippers can do for Bledsoe? They also threw in Butler, lmao! Wow…


Butler's garbage, an expiring contract, and Dudley was the best current NBA player in that deal.


----------



## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Butler has been horrible on both ends the past two years, and Dudley is a great fit at swingman.


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



RollWithEm said:


> Butler's garbage, an expiring contract, and Dudley was the best current NBA player in that deal.


Expiring contracts are gold in the NBA. Dudley is ass craaaack. Bledsoe is more valuable than Reddick or Dudley to the trade block.


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Bledsoe, and Butler to the Pacers for Danny Granger. Then Indiana could let Butler walk so they could have more cap to resign George. Now you have an upgrade at PG, and you resigned George without breaking the bank.


----------



## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Expiring contracts are gold in the NBA. Dudley is ass craaaack. Bledsoe is more valuable than Reddick or Dudley to the trade block.


When is the last time you've seen Dudley play? He was an elite 3-pt shooter last season who also happens to defend his position well, pass the ball with accuracy, and post-up small players with consistent success. He's currently better than either Redick or Bledsoe in terms of total value brought to a team.


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



RollWithEm said:


> When is the last time you've seen Dudley play? He was an elite 3-pt shooter last season who also happens to defend his position well, pass the ball with accuracy, and post-up small players with consistent success. He's currently better than either Redick or Bledsoe in terms of total value brought to a team.


I doubt you even know who Dudley is. The guy is 6'7 so him posting up smaller players is a fib. Also he's not an elite 3pt shooter or was an elite 3pt shooter. The Clips could've done better than Dudley and Redick


----------



## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Size isn't all about height in the post. He's a girthy dude. Not to mention even if he's playing as the big wing, he can often be matched up against smaller guys when teams go small on the perimeter.

And he's been an elite 3-point shooter most of his career. What are you talking about?


----------



## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Butler is not garbage, but he's on his way there. He has been declining rapidly and he's no longer good enough to start. He is a tough guy and he plays hard, but he wasn't a good defender last year. The season before that he was pretty good, but the dude is done as a starting quality player on both ends of the floor.


----------



## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> I doubt you even know who Dudley is. The guy is 6'7 so him posting up smaller players is a fib. Also he's not an elite 3pt shooter or was an elite 3pt shooter. The Clips could've done better than Dudley and Redick


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Jace said:


> Size isn't all about height in the post. He's a girthy dude. Not to mention even if he's playing as the big wing, he can often be matched up against smaller guys when teams go small on the perimeter.
> 
> And he's been an elite 3-point shooter most of his career. What are you talking about?


Career 40% 3pt shooter is elite?


----------



## ZhugeLiang (Jul 2, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Diable said:


> Butler is not garbage, but he's on his way there. He has been declining rapidly and he's no longer good enough to start. He is a tough guy and he plays hard, but he wasn't a good defender last year. The season before that he was pretty good, but the dude is done as a starting quality player on both ends of the floor.



He can't create for himself at all anymore, and you can't really count on his open shots to fall consistently.


----------



## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Career 40% 3pt shooter is elite?


That's what Ray Allen's career 3 point percentage is.


----------



## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Career 40% 3pt shooter is elite?


**** yes it does. And that's with his horrible rookie season.


----------



## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Career 40% 3pt shooter is elite?


Yes? Dudley's career 3pt% is in the top 25 all-time, not to mention it's a shot he didn't even develop until he got to Phoenix.


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Career 40% 3pt shooter is elite?


Among qualifiers, Jared Dudley is tied with Brent Barry as the 23rd-best three-point shooter in NBA history, by career percentage.


----------



## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Is Pablo a troll? I feel like everything he's posted has been blatantly wrong.


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> I doubt you even know who Dudley is. The guy is 6'7 so him posting up smaller players is a fib. Also he's not an elite 3pt shooter or was an elite 3pt shooter. The Clips could've done better than Dudley and Redick


Jared Dudley is 13th amongst active NBA players in 3FG%. Ray Allen is 16th.


----------



## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> I doubt you even know who Dudley is. The guy is 6'7 so him posting up smaller players is a fib. Also he's not an elite 3pt shooter or was an elite 3pt shooter. The Clips could've done better than Dudley and Redick


Do you know who Dudley is? All he knew how to do in Boston college and horizon Christian hs is post up!


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Zei_Zao_LS (Apr 1, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

The idea that Dudley isn't a knock down three point shooter is pretty laughable.

He's a great locker room presence, and a generally amiable guy. He also plays solid on-ball defense and works well in a team defensive scheme (though he is prone to ball watching and gets hurt on back cuts because of it sometimes).

One thing that's somewhat underestimated out of wings is their ability to throw an entry pass. Now, he hasn't had much practice lately, but Duds makes great entry passes, spaces the floor on offense, and doesn't hurt you on defense. To take a term from Zach Lowe, 3-D (three point shooters who play defense) guys are at an all-time high in value amongst GM's, and he's really the big piece for the clippers, though I fully expect JJ Redick to play good minutes for them as well.

I'm just glad that it looks like the Suns are looking to the future by getting young guys instead of signing a bunch of mid-level mid-salary middle aged guys without much hope of building towards something bigger. It's about time.


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Zei_Zao_LS said:


> The idea that Dudley isn't a knock down three point shooter is pretty laughable.
> 
> He's a great locker room presence, and a generally amiable guy. He also plays solid on-ball defense and works well in a team defensive scheme (though he is prone to ball watching and gets hurt on back cuts because of it sometimes).
> 
> ...


As constructed the Clippers are no better than they were will they were up 2-0 on the Griz. They don't need shooters, hell Paul biggest complaints were they couldn't post, or they couldn't open they lanes because the bigs can't post. The trade with Pierce and Garnett brings much more than a bunch of spot up shooters. 

Dudley 7 seasons 3 different teams yeah he's a stellar player :twoguns:


----------



## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Dudley 7 seasons 3 different teams yeah he's a stellar player :twoguns:


How does that make Dudley a bad player? Maybe he just didn't like where he was playing the first time and didn't want to play there so he went to Phoenix? (you left out the part where Dudley actually played in Phoenix for five years. So yea sure when going by the 7 seasons 3 teams logic it might sound bad). And even then that doesn't really prove that Dudley isn't a great three point shooter, which you were trying to argue before.


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



XxIrvingxX said:


> How does that make Dudley a bad player? Maybe he just didn't like where he was playing the first time and didn't want to play there so he went to Phoenix? (you left out the part where Dudley actually played in Phoenix for five years. So yea sure when going by the 7 seasons 3 teams logic it might sound bad). And even then that doesn't really prove that Dudley isn't a great three point shooter, which you were trying to argue before.


Blame the teams he was on rather than blame his lack of progression. How does this move make the Clippers better? You guys keep bringing up spacing, but the Clippers were VERY bad in the paint area. Griffin and Jordan don't play the post, hence the reason why they don't get doubled.


----------



## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> As constructed the Clippers are no better than they were will they were up 2-0 on the Griz. They don't need shooters, hell Paul biggest complaints were they couldn't post, or they couldn't open they lanes because the bigs can't post. The trade with Pierce and Garnett brings much more than a bunch of spot up shooters.


Thanks to their insistence on using the media in an attempt to get Garnett & Pierce on the cheap the deal wasn't available to them. Also, getting bigs that can post sounds nice in theory, but unless they can talk Memphis into a Griffin for Gasol swap while simultaneously trading Jordan for a PF they were stuck in that regard. 

Last year they were running Butler & Billups out there at the SF/SG spots. I'm not sure in which universe Dudley & Redick isn't a major upgrade, but it ain't this one.



Pablo5 said:


> Dudley 7 seasons 3 different teams yeah he's a stellar player :twoguns:


I'm not sure what the one has to do with the other. Phoenix wanted him as part of the Jason Richardson deal and now LA wanted him as part of a return on Eric Bledsoe. Is he an all star? No. But who gives a shit? He plays solid defense at the SF spot, knocks down his open threes, and fills his role well. Which is all they need from him.


----------



## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Blame the teams he was on rather than blame his lack of progression. How does this move make the Clippers better? You guys keep bringing up spacing, but the Clippers were VERY bad in the paint area. Griffin and Jordan don't play the post, hence the reason why they don't get doubled.


So if you're trying to improve how well you score in the paint then why wouldn't you get three point shooters? With more three point shooters you have more spacing which can make it easier to score in the paint. Doesn't that make more sense?


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



XxIrvingxX said:


> So if you're trying to improve how well you score in the paint then why wouldn't you get three point shooters? With more three point shooters you have more spacing which can make it easier to score in the paint. Doesn't that make more sense?


Why are you clowns trying to rewrite basketball history? You win by playing INSIDE/out. There is a reason why Indiana was one of the toughest team in the playoffs. Despite running majority pick and rolls the Spurs gave the Heat fits in the paint. When you don't have a pressure of a big that can play the paint you will always end like the Dallas/Suns/OKC teams that will be beat in the playoffs all the time without a post presence.

Your Cavs with James best team in the east year after year, and what happened in the playoffs over and over again?


----------



## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Who was the Bulls post player?

Who was the Heat's post player?


----------



## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> As constructed the Clippers are no better than they were will they were up 2-0 on the Griz. They don't need shooters, hell Paul biggest complaints were they couldn't post, or they couldn't open they lanes because the bigs can't post. The trade with Pierce and Garnett brings much more than a bunch of spot up shooters.
> 
> Dudley 7 seasons 3 different teams yeah he's a stellar player :twoguns:


Next year KG will be on his 3rd team in 7 years!


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----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Hyperion said:


> Who was the Bulls post player?
> 
> Who was the Heat's post player?


That's easy man. They both had the best player in the world that commanded to be doubled anywhere on the floor. They also had another top 10 player in the game playing alone side them. Wouldn't you know all players also are two way players :twoguns:


----------



## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Jamel Irief said:


> Next year KG will be on his 3rd team in 7 years!
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Yeah he's a stellar player. :twoguns:


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Jamel Irief said:


> Next year KG will be on his 3rd team in 7 years!
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Dudley going on his 7th season, and KG will going into his 18th season. Hall of Famer, and in his prime was along the best in the NBA. What's Dudley excuse for being on the road to become a pure journeyman


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Why are you clowns trying to rewrite basketball history? You win by playing INSIDE/out. There is a reason why Indiana was one of the toughest team in the playoffs. Despite running majority pick and rolls the Spurs gave the Heat fits in the paint. When you don't have a pressure of a big that can play the paint you will always end like the Dallas/Suns/OKC teams that will be beat in the playoffs all the time without a post presence.


That would help explain why Al Jefferson's teams have always been amongst the best in the NBA while LeBron's have always struggled to reach .500.


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



E.H. Munro said:


> That would help explain why Al Jefferson's teams have always been amongst the best in the NBA while LeBron's have always struggled to reach .500.


The conversation becomes lazy when you mention Bron in the same subject as Jefferson.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I'd just like to reiterate how badly the Clippers screwed themselves leaking everything to the media trying to force a cheap deal and subsequently getting the deal blocked. Camping Redick-Dudley-Garnett on the perimeter would have given Paul _worlds_ of space to create off of pick and rolls with Blake. Now they'll have to run a small ball lineup with Blake at center and Dudley at power forward to get that same offensive flexibility.


----------



## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Why are you clowns trying to rewrite basketball history? You win by playing INSIDE/out. There is a reason why Indiana was one of the toughest team in the playoffs. Despite running majority pick and rolls the Spurs gave the Heat fits in the paint. When you don't have a pressure of a big that can play the paint you will always end like the Dallas/Suns/OKC teams that will be beat in the playoffs all the time without a post presence.


The primary job of big men is to play good interior defense and control the glass. Jefferson, while a pretty decent rebounder, is a rotten defender. If your bigs can give you offense as well, great, but it's not necessary. As long you're _getting_ the points, it doesn't matter where they're coming from.


----------



## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> As constructed the Clippers are no better than they were will they were up 2-0 on the Griz. They don't need shooters, hell Paul biggest complaints were they couldn't post, or they couldn't open they lanes because the bigs can't post. The trade with Pierce and Garnett brings much more than a bunch of spot up shooters.
> 
> Dudley 7 seasons 3 different teams yeah he's a stellar player :twoguns:


Shooters don't open up driving lanes? How are they not better when Redick and Dudley are both upgrades? Many good players have played in as many places in less time. That's not a barometer for a player's quality. You're now reaching.



Pablo5 said:


> Blame the teams he was on rather than blame his lack of progression. How does this move make the Clippers better? You guys keep bringing up spacing, but the Clippers were VERY bad in the paint area. Griffin and Jordan don't play the post, hence the reason why they don't get doubled.


Lack of progression? Again, look at his numbers. His jumpshot was a huge question mark coming out of college, and now he's one of the best in the league. Wow, man.

Post up offense is overrated, especially when you have an all-world creator in Paul, along with other guys who can get you buckets from the perimeter. Griffin and Jordan are still progressing, also. No one's saying this team is a finished product and ready to mow throw the playoffs, but they've clearly improved.



Pablo5 said:


> *Why are you clowns trying to rewrite basketball history?* You win by playing INSIDE/out. There is a reason why Indiana was one of the toughest team in the playoffs. Despite running majority pick and rolls the Spurs gave the Heat fits in the paint. When you don't have a pressure of a big that can play the paint you will always end like the Dallas/Suns/OKC teams that will be beat in the playoffs all the time without a post presence.
> 
> Your Cavs with James best team in the east year after year, and what happened in the playoffs over and over again?


:laugh:

It's called evolution, my friend. If we weren't allowed to evolve and update our initial views on subjects, slavery would still be a'ight.

The "inside" in "inside-out" doesn't have to start from the post. If you have guards who can get into the paint and kick out to shooters, it's essentially the same. The theory that your best talent has to play inside is a misconception.

The Spurs pick-and-rolls were helping them get paint looks, silly. And when they went to the post, it was to Duncan. Not many of hims in the league.

OKC made it to the Finals with a bunch of children at their core and lost to a player who will go down as top-5 all time. PHX came close to making the Finals during their run, but lost to great teams. Dallas won a title, so good example.

And so why when LeBron's teams don't lose, it's because he has no post presence on his team, but when they win it's because he's the best?


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Jace said:


> Shooters don't open up driving lanes? How are they not better when Redick and Dudley are both upgrades? Many good players have played in as many places in less time. That's not a barometer for a player's quality. You're now reaching.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Way to many holes in this pile of garbage


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Mhmm.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Way to many holes in this pile of garbage


Translation: "I have no argument."


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Way to many holes in this pile of garbage


Name them.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Why are you clowns trying to rewrite basketball history? You win by playing INSIDE/out. There is a reason why Indiana was one of the toughest team in the playoffs. Despite running majority pick and rolls the Spurs gave the Heat fits in the paint. When you don't have a pressure of a big that can play the paint you will always end like the Dallas/Suns/OKC teams that will be beat in the playoffs all the time without a post presence.


Explain Jordan's bulls team. All of them. 



Pablo5 said:


> Your Cavs with James best team in the east year after year, and what happened in the playoffs over and over again?


We lost over and over again for two reasons.

1: Lebron was our only consistent offensive threat.
2: Orlando's match ups completely destroyed us in every position.


----------



## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Has Dudley really been in the league 7 years? Christ I feel old.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Honestly WTF. Feels like last week I was watching BC footage of him and his awful cornrows thinking he'd bust out of the league after two seasons.


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I never thought he was athletic enough to make it, of course he was probably just overweight and not in good enough shape in college. Dudley is the best draft pick the Bobcats ever made and then they just threw him away for God knows what reason.


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## Floods (Oct 25, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

That wasn't meant to be a comment on his abilities, I just can't remember hearing his name in NBA talks before like 2010.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I know, it's just where my mind went when I thought about my first Dudley experiences.


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Diable said:


> I never thought he was athletic enough to make it, of course he was probably just overweight and not in good enough shape in college. Dudley is the best draft pick the Bobcats ever made and then they just threw him away for God knows what reason.


Didn't Steve Nash change Dudley's life by introducing him to a new diet/exercise regimen? Jared's probably more excited to live in the same city with Steve again than he is to play with Paul and Blake.


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Bogg said:


> I'd just like to reiterate how badly the Clippers screwed themselves leaking everything to the media trying to force a cheap deal and subsequently getting the deal blocked. Camping Redick-Dudley-Garnett on the perimeter would have given Paul _worlds_ of space to create off of pick and rolls with Blake. Now they'll have to run a small ball lineup with Blake at center and Dudley at power forward to get that same offensive flexibility.


Excellent point. I just worry that Pierce would have found his way to LA as well with Garnett, and they wouldn't have made this shrewd Bledsoe for Redick/Dudley deal that I like quite a bit.


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## l0st1 (Jul 2, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Way to many holes in this pile of garbage


Apparently you don't know any about Dudley. And can't seem to understand any other people being made.

Every single person in this thread is calling you out on your BS and you haven't responded. So either you're a troll or you can't admit you're wrong.


Clearly this trade makes the Clippers better. Sure they probably could of gotten a better talent then they did for Bledsoe and Butler's expiring but Dudley and Reddick are EXACTLY what they needed talent wise and youth wise(at those positions). Dudley is one of the best 3pt shooter in the league, he just isn't flashy with it. And reddick only got drafted because of his shooting. Dudley is a + defender at both SG and SF. Of course there are matchups that he can't handle but that goes for every defender not named Lebron. Reddick is a much improved all around player.

As others have pointed out, the Inside-out offense starting in the post is rarely utilized any more because the post player is becoming more rare. Inside-out has almost exclusively used with P&R and penetration from the wing and kicking out to shooters, rinse and repeat. Which wouldn't you know it the Clippers have a PG who may be able to penetrate and dish... not to mention a few others.


Every point you've made in this thread has either been fabrication or exaggeration and people have called you out on it. And this is your reply? Weak.


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



l0st1 said:


> Apparently you don't know any about Dudley. And can't seem to understand any other people being made.
> 
> Every single person in this thread is calling you out on your BS and you haven't responded. So either you're a troll or you can't admit you're wrong.
> 
> ...


The evolution of basketball is, and always will be that you can win multiple championships without having a ball dominate PG. Go look at every team that have won championships in the last 20 years and you can maybe find two team that you could argue had ball dominate PG's, the rest were teams that played in the paint efficiently. 

I'll wait…

Which is the most efficient shot in basketball? The closer the shot attempt to the rim is always and will remain always the most efficient shot in basketball


----------



## Maravilla (Jul 6, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

The game has evolved. Perimeter players run the NBA these days.

If you can't get behind this. You will be left behind.


----------



## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



XxIrvingxX said:


> Explain Jordan's bulls team. All of them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Lebron and nobody else in that series, and for that he deserved better. Orlando biggest match up problem was Howard, and then the size advantage around the perimeter. Go look at Howard's number to the tune of 30 ppg and 12 rpg.


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



chilltown said:


> The game has evolved. Perimeter players run the NBA these days.
> 
> If you can't get behind this. You will be left behind.


The team with the unfair advantage will always win and it continue next season


----------



## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> The team with the unfair advantage will always win and it continue next season


:cosby:

What the hell did you just say?



Pablo5 said:


> *The evolution of basketball is, and always will be* that you can win multiple championships without having a ball dominate PG. Go look at every team that have won championships in the last 20 years and you can maybe find two team that you could argue had ball dominate PG's, the rest were teams that played in the paint efficiently.
> 
> I'll wait…
> 
> Which is the most efficient shot in basketball? The closer the shot attempt to the rim is always and will remain always the most efficient shot in basketball


Do you know what "evolution" means?




Here's the problem with this argument: The penetrator doesn't have to be a PG.


Think about it.





I'll wait...



















Further, layups are inside looks, too. Didn't Denver lead the league in paint points? Who is their post player?


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Jace said:


> Do you know what "evolution" means?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I never mentioned a PG. I was shooting down his stupid logic. Further more, Denver led the league in transition points, but you saw in the playoffs when the game is more physical and set to a half court pace they got smashed. They don't have a post player, and for that they were smashed in the playoffs. Just as GS was smashed by the Spurs. Just as OKC was smashed by the Griz. Just as NY was smashed by Indiana. All in common was the interior post game of M. Gasol, Randolph, Hibbert, West, and Duncan…


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> I never mentioned a PG. I was shooting down his stupid logic. Further more, Denver led the league in transition points, but you saw in the playoffs when the game is more physical and set to a half court pace they got smashed. They don't have a post player, and for that they were smashed in the playoffs. Just as GS was smashed by the Spurs. Just as OKC was smashed by the Griz. Just as NY was smashed by Indiana. All in common was the interior post game of M. Gasol, Randolph, Hibbert, West, and Duncan…


"His stupid logic?" The only time he mentioned PGs was that LAC had one who could get into the paint and create high-percentage looks. You're the one who went off on a diatribe about PGs rarely leading teams to titles. Try to keep up. Review before posting messages if you need to.

You're cherry-picking examples that don't even validate your point when broken down. I mean, you threw in OKC without even mentioning Westbrook being out. How about Galinari being hurt? How about the Knicks just not being as good as Indiana? Or the Spurs being better than GS? 

I think I'm done with you. You're bringing nothing and clearly not understanding simple logic.


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Jace said:


> "His stupid logic?" The only time he mentioned PGs was that LAC had one who could get into the paint and create high-percentage looks. You're the one who went off on a diatribe about PGs rarely leading teams to titles. Try to keep up. Review before posting messages if you need to.
> 
> You're cherry-picking examples that don't even validate your point when broken down. I mean, you threw in OKC without even mentioning Westbrook being out. How about Galinari being hurt? How about the Knicks just not being as good as Indiana? Or the Spurs being better than GS?
> 
> I think I'm done with you. You're bringing nothing and clearly not understanding simple logic.


Logic is simple. Post players wins championship! Now you resorting to bringing up injured players, LMAO. You're done because you have no way of removing your foot in your mouth.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Lebron and nobody else in that series, and for that he deserved better. Orlando biggest match up problem was Howard, and then the size advantage around the perimeter. Go look at Howard's number to the tune of 30 ppg and 12 rpg.


Your first sentence doesn't make any sense. 

According to the theories of logic i should've stopped there, but I decided to read the rest anyways. Don't you mean Cleveland's biggest match up problem, not Orlando's? And i know what Howard's numbers were in that series. Regardless your point is mute when it comes to that series because better match ups are the reason the magic won that series, not because they were a better team (which they weren't)


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Logic is simple. Post players wins championship! Now you resorting to bringing up injured players, LMAO. You're done because you have no way of removing your foot in your mouth.


Post players did not win the Miami heat back to back championships. Post players did not give the bulls two three peats. Post players didn't do a Damn thing in the 2006 nba finals. They also weren't the reason the pistons spanked the lakers, whose best player did most of his offense from the post.

Post players are a good asset to have, but they are not needed to win, nor are they the most valuable player to have on a team. History has proven this numerous times.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> Logic is simple. Post players wins championship! Now you resorting to bringing up injured players, LMAO. You're done because you have no way of removing your foot in your mouth.


Good post players can help win championships, but they're not vital. I'm not "resorting" to anything. You cited lack of post players for the reasons teams with important players out due to injury lost. Any logical human would sooner look at the fact that they're missing important starters (a top-10 player in Westbrook) rather than a fundamental/philosophical issue. My foot is nowhere near my mouth. Might be in your mouth.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> I never mentioned a PG. I was shooting down his stupid logic. Further more, Denver led the league in transition points, but you saw in the playoffs when the game is more physical and set to a half court pace they got smashed. They don't have a post player, and for that they were smashed in the playoffs. Just as GS was smashed by the Spurs. Just as OKC was smashed by the Griz. Just as NY was smashed by Indiana. All in common was the interior post game of M. Gasol, Randolph, Hibbert, West, and Duncan…


Again, the MIAMI HEAT ARE THE NBA CHAMPIONS. They have no post player. Bosh is a stretch 4. As per your logic, every team with a big man down low pittered out of the playoffs because they couldn't keep up with the perimeter players. No team with a post player leading the team on offense has won the championships since 2006. See, I can make false logic too! The Suns lost because they got injured and the brilliant FO refused to get talent (selling all picks away) because Amare was a top level post player. The Nuggets lost because their opposing teams were more talented than they were. Turns out, that is the story for EVERY team that loses in the playoffs. The opposing team is better.


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## l0st1 (Jul 2, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> The evolution of basketball is, and always will be that you can win multiple championships without having a ball dominate PG. Go look at every team that have won championships in the last 20 years and you can maybe find two team that you could argue had ball dominate PG's, the rest were teams that played in the paint efficiently.
> 
> I'll wait…
> 
> Which is the most efficient shot in basketball? The closer the shot attempt to the rim is always and will remain always the most efficient shot in basketball



Where did I say you needed a ball-dominating PG to win a championship? I was pointing out how incredibly stupid YOUR logic is that you need a post presence to play Inside-Out offense, And just because the Clippers may or may not win a championship, it doesn't mean this was a bad trade.

Way to take something and completely flip and argue it. That's not going to work here.


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



l0st1 said:


> Where did I say you needed a ball-dominating PG to win a championship? I was pointing out how incredibly stupid YOUR logic is that you need a post presence to play Inside-Out offense, And just because the Clippers may or may not win a championship, it doesn't mean this was a bad trade.
> 
> Way to take something and completely flip and argue it. That's not going to work here.


If the Clippers brass never mentioned the KG/Pierce trade to the public they would've had the best starting 5 in the west, but since they're idiots they settled for a rebound trade which didn't make them better at all. It's a reason they want to trade Jordan, but i guess you didn't get the memo


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Hyperion said:


> Again, the MIAMI HEAT ARE THE NBA CHAMPIONS. They have no post player. Bosh is a stretch 4. As per your logic, every team with a big man down low pittered out of the playoffs because they couldn't keep up with the perimeter players. No team with a post player leading the team on offense has won the championships since 2006. See, I can make false logic too! The Suns lost because they got injured and the brilliant FO refused to get talent (selling all picks away) because Amare was a top level post player. The Nuggets lost because their opposing teams were more talented than they were. Turns out, that is the story for EVERY team that loses in the playoffs. The opposing team is better.


First of all the current Miami Heat has the best player in the world. Lebron is a mismatch for every team, and for that it's just like Jordan Bulls. Not to mention he also paired with D. Wade which is a top 5 player at his position, and Bosh whatever he plays is a top 10 player at his position. That's a fair advantage. 2007 Finals was won by Duncan (cough cough post player), and the San Antonio Spurs. 2008 Boston (KG), 2009-10 Lakers (Pau Gasol/Bynum).

As i said before you have a few teams that are an exception. 04 Pistons (even though Sheed gave the Lakers hell in the post), and the 11 Mavs.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> First of all the current Miami Heat has the best player in the world. Lebron is a mismatch for every team, and for that it's just like Jordan Bulls. Not to mention he also paired with D. Wade which is a top 5 player at his position, and Bosh whatever he plays is a top 10 player at his position. That's a fair advantage. 2007 Finals was won by Duncan (cough cough post player), and the San Antonio Spurs. 2008 Boston (KG), 2009-10 Lakers (Pau Gasol/Bynum).
> 
> As i said before you have a few teams that are an exception. 04 Pistons (even though Sheed gave the Lakers hell in the post), and the 11 Mavs.


So what you're saying is that you DON'T need a post presence to win a championship? Because that's what it's sounding like. 

And Duncan might have been the Spurs best player in 2007, but Tony Parker was clearly the MVP of that series. And three of the four games the Spurs won were close games that came down to the final possession. Tony Parker won the championship for the Spurs that year, not dominant post play or inside and out games.


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## Pablo5 (Jun 18, 2013)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



XxIrvingxX said:


> So what you're saying is that you DON'T need a post presence to win a championship? Because that's what it's sounding like.
> 
> And Duncan might have been the Spurs best player in 2007, but Tony Parker was clearly the MVP of that series. And three of the four games the Spurs won were close games that came down to the final possession. Tony Parker won the championship for the Spurs that year, not dominant post play or inside and out games.


You're making my point for me, LMAO. I said post players wins championships. Duncan clearly was the best back to the basket player in the NBA that season. Guess what Cleveland didn't have, a mature Lebron James, or a POST PLAYER. 

Damn man you guys are either young ass hell or just don't understand. Look at the Celtics the next season. CASE IN POINT the back to back Lakers who were shitty as hell years before added Pau Gasol who played in the paint, and a young hungry Bynum (whom everyone thought could be the best C in the NBA).


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## Maravilla (Jul 6, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I know 2 things.

1. In 2013 the NBA is perimeter player oriented and it is the new bread and butter. If you still think you NEED your best players to be post players to win titles in the NBA, then I'm sure you still believe that NFL teams need to ground and pound with tailbacks to superbowl championships as well.

2. There isn't even a post player involved in this thread. WTF is the derailing coming from? Can't we just bask in the glory of the first positive Suns move in 5+ seasons?


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> You're making my point for me, LMAO. I said post players wins championships. Duncan clearly was the best back to the basket player in the NBA that season. Guess what Cleveland didn't have, a mature Lebron James, or a POST PLAYER.


Actually I'm not. Your point is that post players win championships yes? How is bringing up a series where the Finals MVP was a point guard prove that point (no pun intended)? Duncan was the best player, yes, but from a scoring standpoint he didn't play like that at all. He shot below 50% from the field in that series and scored 14 and 12 in the last two games. And yet despite the scoring aspect of his game being lack luster, he was still excellent in other areas. So clearly, post plays did not win the Spurs a title that year, and if anything, I'm completely disproving what your point is because I'm proving that having great defense, rebounding, and excellent play in other areas wins championships (which I'm not trying to argue, but any one of those is more valuable than post players). 



Pablo5 said:


> Damn man you guys are either young ass hell or just don't understand. Look at the Celtics the next season. CASE IN POINT the back to back Lakers who were shitty as hell years before added Pau Gasol who played in the paint, and a young hungry Bynum (whom everyone thought could be the best C in the NBA).


Yes, the Lakers became good once Gasol arrived, but how does that prove that post players win championships? Gasol was just a great second hand all star that the Lakers needed to play alongside Kobe who happened to play the post. That doesn't mean that post players are needed in order to win a championship.

I could just as easily twist your logic around and say that 3 point shooters are needed to win championships. Proof? Once Ray Allen joined the Celtics in 2008 they suddenly become world champions? See! 3 point shooters win championships. 

Oh and speaking of which, what exactly do you mean by "look at the Celtics the next season"? Are you saying they're going to suck now because they lost KG? (who played for years as one of the best PF's in the NBA with the Timberwolves and failed to win a title or even go to the finals) If that's what you're saying then you're clearly a troll.

Edit: I really need to learn to read the comments below the one I'm responding to before actually responding to it :/


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Eric Snow was guarding Parker in the Finals that year wasn't he? That does not mean I agreeing with any silly argument that might have been made in this increasingly asinine thread btw.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Diable said:


> Eric Snow was guarding Parker in the Finals that year wasn't he? That does not mean I agreeing with any silly argument that might have been made in this increasingly asinine thread btw.


He did yes. It didn't work out very well. Lebron tried guarding him a few times as well, but since he wasn't the elite defender that he is now at the time Parker was able to get by him with ease.


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## Jace (Sep 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Pablo's a lost cause. I guess the rest of us are just stuck in "young ass hell." Sounds like heaven to me. We're too buried in booty to be enlightened by your glowing wisdom.


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## LA68 (Apr 3, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

One fact no one can argue and everyone should think about:

The final consisted of two teams with (3) Hall of Famers a piece. And all six had a big impact on the series positive or negative. 

When you have great players, it almost doesn't matter the positions. You just match up men and play. 

Great players win championships.l


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## l0st1 (Jul 2, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Pablo5 said:


> If the Clippers brass never mentioned the KG/Pierce trade to the public they would've had the best starting 5 in the west, but since they're idiots they settled for a rebound trade which didn't make them better at all. It's a reason they want to trade Jordan, but i guess you didn't get the memo


Way to continue to dodge and deflect. The kg and pierce trade has nothing to do with this. Just like your stupid post player topic. Just like your pg on championship teams topic. This trade makes them period. You are apparently to ignorant to see or admit why.

Parker was the main component of the last few spurs runs. Sheed was not a dominant post player. Kg was not the focal point for the celtics championshop team. Dirk is not a post player. The last post dominant teams to win a ring were early spurs teams or shaq lakers.

And yet again I repeat this all has nothing to do with this trade. Simply put everyone wins in this trade. Clippers did well though they probably could of gotten a better individual talent for bledsoe.


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## LA68 (Apr 3, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Actually, its not so much "post player" you need as much as a "post defender" that's necessary. 

The Heat's best post player is Wade. He was just hurt.


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## XxIrvingxX (Apr 23, 2012)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



LA68 said:


> Actually, its not so much "post player" you need as much as a "post defender" that's necessary.
> 
> The Heat's best post player is Wade. He was just hurt.


Agreed. When it comes down to it defense does more for you than offense. I'd rather have an excellent post defender than an excellent scorer from the post.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Wouldn't it be funny if the Bucks traded for Caron Butler? Sounds like its going to happen. Go Bucks.... 8 seed or bust!!!


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## Maravilla (Jul 6, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

That would be fantastic


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

I am just stunned that after we basically did everything we could so the Clips could get Redick and Dudley and the Suns get a steal in Bledsoe that we would swoop in 2 months later and trade for the worst player in the deal and make him our starting small forward. We are seriously the worst run team in all of pro sports.. the Oakland Raiders and Miami Marlins must laugh at the Bucks franchise


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## Maravilla (Jul 6, 2010)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Well, at least no pick is involved from you guys....


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## 29380 (Feb 23, 2009)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



> @paulcoro
> 
> A #Suns trade of Caron Butler to the Bucks for Ish Smith & Slava Kravtsov (no pick) should be finalized Thursday. Suns add $5.65M cap space.


Nothing more than a salary dump.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Ender said:


> Nothing more than a salary dump.


Funny, its nothing but a pointless salary add in my eyes


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## Diable (Apr 26, 2005)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



roux said:


> Wouldn't it be funny if the Bucks traded for Caron Butler? Sounds like its going to happen. Go Bucks.... 8 seed or bust!!!


 I'll put 50 bucks on bust


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## E.H. Munro (Jun 22, 2004)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



roux said:


> I am just stunned that after we basically did everything we could so the Clips could get Redick and Dudley and the Suns get a steal in Bledsoe that we would swoop in 2 months later and trade for the worst player in the deal and make him our starting small forward. We are seriously the worst run team in all of pro sports.. the Oakland Raiders and Miami Marlins must laugh at the Bucks franchise


No need to fear, you guys can turn Butler & filler into Gerald Wallace & Jordan Crawford!


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## RollWithEm (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



roux said:


> Funny, its nothing but a pointless salary add in my eyes


It is definitely pointless. That much we can say for sure.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



E.H. Munro said:


> No need to fear, you guys can turn Butler & filler into Gerald Wallace & Jordan Crawford!


I would laugh at this but it is probably true.. the Bucks love past their prime ex all star small forwards.. they dusta new one off every year... and the filler would probably be Henson knowing this team


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*



Diable said:


> I'll put 50 bucks on bust


I hope you are right, but this team will probably scrap their way to 35 wins and the 11th pick in next years draft.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Suns-Clippers-Bucks Trade: Bledsoe, Butler to Phoenix, Dudley, Redick to LA, Two 2nd Round Picks to Milwaukee*

Weird. Why didn't butler just go to Milwaukee in the original deal?


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

Of the 15 guys on the Bucks roster only 4 were with the team last year, and despite all that makeover we are no better or worse than we were 365 days ago


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## kbdullah (Jul 8, 2010)

I mean...w/ Boston and Atlanta getting worse, the Bucks might be the 6th best team in the East...Do they still have Delfino? 

Right now East is probably

Miami, Indiana Brooklyn Chicago, New York, Bucks Pistons Celtics Cavs. Commas separating tiers.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

kbdullah said:


> I mean...w/ Boston and Atlanta getting worse, the Bucks might be the 6th best team in the East...Do they still have Delfino?
> 
> Right now East is probably
> 
> Miami, Indiana Brooklyn Chicago, New York, Bucks Pistons Celtics Cavs. Commas separating tiers.



Knight/Ridnour/Wolters
Mayo/Neal/Delfino
Butler/Middleton/Antetokounmpo
Ilyasova/Henson/Udoh
Sanders/Pachulia/Raduljica

There is alot of youth and potential on this team to be a perfect tank candidate, but the veteran depth is really strong.. strong enough that we will probably win the same number of games as last year.. rebuild while remaining competitive is the Bucks motto this year.. or in idiot speak "8th seed or bust"


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## Bogg (May 4, 2009)

I think the big picture here is that Butler's salary gives Milwaukee the perfect building block for a Rondo trade in February. It's big enough that you aren't too far off from matching, but it isn't so big that you'd have a hard time tacking on one or two young guys (Knight, Henson) if the deal went that way instead of giving up first rounders. When's the earliest that Butler would be eligible to be traded in a package with other players now?


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## l0st1 (Jul 2, 2010)

This is both good and bad. Good because we really had no use for Butler and I'd really rather see him on a team that can compete in the playoffs now before he retires(not that the bucks are that team). 

Bad because ever since he got here he has shown nothing but positivity and leadership. He said he's going to make sure to push Bledsoe and make sure he's working to improve. He said he's going to take Beas under his wing and try and mentor him since he can relate to him on a different level(that being of a rough childhood).

Either way, I'll take the cap space in hopes that it helps facilitate a Gortat trade.


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## Jamel Irief (May 19, 2002)

roux said:


> Knight/Ridnour/Wolters
> Mayo/Neal/Delfino
> Butler/Middleton/Antetokounmpo
> Ilyasova/Henson/Udoh
> ...


When did you get ridnour and gary neal? The bucks reserve backcourt will probably finish more games than the starters.


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## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

Jamel Irief said:


> When did you get ridnour and gary neal? The bucks reserve backcourt will probably finish more games than the starters.


We signed Neal a few weeks ago and traded a Euro stash from the 2005 draft to Minnesota for Ridnour when they were clearing cap space to sign Kevin Martin.... and I absolutely agree with what you just said as well, especially in Ridnours case


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