# Poll: What do you think will happen with Vin Baker this season?



## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

I'm curious to see what the consensus is on how Vinnie, or if Vinnie will perform this season. No wishful thinking here, guys; I want your HONEST opinion.

The Pride of Old Saybrook will:


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*If it was just that he was drunk...*

and the Celtics can get him physically, emotionally and mentally in shape.....who knows? So far this thing is pretty even. For those who put buyout...how much does he have left on his contract in the remaining years...like $44M right? How much do you think he would take?


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## el_raulin (Jun 5, 2003)

If Boston grabs a PF/C in the draft I don't think we will be seeing much from Baker. He is just not O'Brien type of player and I think there are plenty of things regarding his suspension that are not clear. I wouldn't mind though if he returns with a 10 ppg 6 rpg consistent effort in 25 minutes off the bench.

If he is not ready to start next season, don't expect him to be a factor at all.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Raulin*

I think you're right...He's gotta come out in training camp breathing fire or else O'Brien (who doesn't like him or trust him) will not put him on the floor.


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## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

My honest opinion is that if he can get decent back up minutes he's good for Rodney Rogers like production. I liked Baker quite a bit before he let himself go. He's really a sad story. I would predict about 11-12 ppg and 6 or 7 boards if he can manage at least 20 minutes a game. When it comes to O'brien i really don't know how much he'll play him. Baker really does have talent, its just he's so damn fat and lazy.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Baker getting Rogers numbers*

If he can rebound like that, we would all be pleased!!!

:gopray: :gopray: :gopray:


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## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

Rodney Rogers and Vin Baker are some what similiar. Both are very talented PF's who are held back by weight problems. I feel that Baker is actually more talented than Rogers, however he's also lazier too. When Baker played for the Bucks he was pretty darn good, but now that he's made his money, i think he really doesn't care anymore.


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## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

his last year in seattle he averaged 14 and 6 and in his prime he managed 21 and 10. He's due to rebound.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Welcome to NBA 2k3*

Where a guaranteed contract for a big man is a risky proposition...

See: Vin Baker, Sean Kemp, Pervis Ellison

Maybe that's why some people have voted buyout and one person has already voted that Vin will retire. I, however, remain hopeful he will be semi-productive.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

I am hoping for number 2


> Play 70-82 games, getting 6-10 ppg, 4-6 rpg


I expect him to play around 70-76 games (injury problems and personal) and for him to get like 10 ppg, and 6 rpg, heck maybe even 12 and 7. I would also like to see him at 5.9 at fouls not 9.4 where he is now. He makes a foul every second.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*So many fouls...*

Comes from lazy feet...and for some reason, Baker can't seem to get a break from the refs...Although, I heard a rumor that some refs smelled alcohol on his breath DURING games...I think he will draw less fouls this season and be clean and sober...If he crosses that line again the Celtics would jump at the chance to suspend him or void the deal.

If he produces like you say he could, that would help the C's immensely!


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

*Re: So many fouls...*



> Originally posted by <b>Truth34</b>!
> Comes from lazy feet...and for some reason, Baker can't seem to get a break from the refs...Although, I heard a rumor that some refs smelled alcohol on his breath DURING games...I think he will draw less fouls this season and be clean and sober...If he crosses that line again the Celtics would jump at the chance to suspend him or void the deal.
> 
> If he produces like you say he could, that would help the C's immensely!


I hope he does, but if he doesn't hell need like 26-28 minutes for that. I hope he improves on defense too, I like Vinny, and I saw that he tries his best when he's on the court. I have seen some GREAT BLOCKS this year. I was like


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*So Far, this thread is proving what I already thought....*

Which is that nobody really knows what is going to happen with Vin Baker next year....Everybody keep voting...I want to see if there is a consensus...


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

*Re: So Far, this thread is proving what I already thought....*



> Originally posted by <b>Truth34</b>!
> Which is that nobody really knows what is going to happen with Vin Baker next year....Everybody keep voting...I want to see if there is a consensus...


You have WAY too many options, and we don't have that many posters....


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## BleedGreen (Jun 24, 2002)

Go Vinny! I hope he has a breakout year and ends up starting. Wouldnt it be nice to get soem media attention in Boston? That never seems to happen. Even when we win. We're just the team that shoots too many threes.

Baker showed some flashes of brilliance(sp?) during the preseason and the beginning of the season. Maybe he can stay sober and get back on track. And if it doesnt work out, we can get him drunk, then get him to accept a buyout:grinning:


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## tdizzle (Apr 12, 2003)

I wish him only the best, it sounds like he was/still is going through some really hard times emotionally. I hope he can get the help he needs and get back on his feet and back out there playing in the NBA. I think if he can recover he could be a really solid player for the Celtics, remember it wasn't too long ago when he was on the USA team.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Vin on USA team...*

That seems like centuries ago....but I feel a lot better knowing that I'm not the only one who thinks he can come back and do SOMETHING....


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## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

The problem with Vin seem's to be a lifestyle problem. Alcohol problems are hard to kick. I had an uncle with a nasty one. Something serious is going to have to happen before he changes his ways. Its terrible to to think that things are going to have to get worse before they better. He needs a real wake-up call.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Wake Up Call*

I think having your right name up there with Jane Swift in Boston and getting suspended for half a season is a wake up call. If not, this guy is beyond help.


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>NorthSideHatrik</b>!
> The problem with Vin seem's to be a lifestyle problem. Alcohol problems are hard to kick. I had an uncle with a nasty one. Something serious is going to have to happen before he changes his ways. Its terrible to to think that things are going to have to get worse before they better. He needs a real wake-up call.


He has suffered public humiliation and has lost millions of dollars-- not only lost salary during the time he was suspended, but all of the endorsement money he could have earned had he performed well.If he isn't awake now, he never will be. 

Frankly, even if he recovers from his alcoholism, his physical abilities may have deteriorated to such an extent that he can never me more than a back-up center. I hope I'm wrong about that, because Baker does have basketball skills. For one thing, he is an excellent passer.


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## BleedGreen (Jun 24, 2002)

I was looking at the Celtics roster on Celtics.com earlier, and Vin Baker was not on it. Whats up with that? Or maybe I'm just too blind to see it.


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## aquaitious (Jun 11, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>BleedGreen</b>!
> I was looking at the Celtics roster on Celtics.com earlier, and Vin Baker was not on it. Whats up with that? Or maybe I'm just too blind to see it.


Because he's suspended. Or was, or you know whatever...

Beyond the Glory in 15 minutes.


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## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

I guess i missed most of Vin Bakers legal troubles, i'm not a huge boston follower so i must have missed it. I mean i knew he's fat, lazy and likes to drink, but i never knew it was this bad.


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

Baker had legal troubles too? Damn, didn't know that. 

I think at this point, if Baker was able to play in 70+ games, that would be an accomplishment. Hopefully, the fans will be supportive and just appriciate the fact that he's making an attempt. Atleast, I think he's making an attempt.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*That's a scary thought...*

That even if his heart and mind come all the way around, his body won't follow suit... :banghead:


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## NorthSideHatrik (Mar 11, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>agoo101284</b>!
> Baker had legal troubles too? Damn, didn't know that.
> 
> I think at this point, if Baker was able to play in 70+ games, that would be an accomplishment. Hopefully, the fans will be supportive and just appriciate the fact that he's making an attempt. Atleast, I think he's making an attempt.


When i said legal troubles, i meant the suspension, i miss spoke.


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## lochdoun (Jun 11, 2003)

My take is i'm not saying Vin is a bad player, i'm just saying that his salary is not worth his production. Maybe he can agree to a buyout/re-sign with the Celtics. Or just a straight-up buyout and he signs with another team. Unlikely but it would be nice.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Buyout*

Doesn't look like he's willing to take a buyout at this juncture. But if he has another nightmare of a season, I don't think he's going to like the booing, etc. from the home faithful. I think at the end of this year he would be more amenable to that option. He could sock away another 13 mil or so, and then he would be ready. At that point he would have 2 years left and like 28 million left. I think we could buy him out for maybe 15, which would cut our cap figure by 6-7 million the first year. 
Considering he's going to be here this year, though, I will root for him to produce. That would eliminate the buyout option, but if he doesn't play well, we could be seeing another early exit from playoffs, if we make it at all.


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

*Re: Buyout*



> Originally posted by <b>Truth34</b>!
> Doesn't look like he's willing to take a buyout at this juncture. But if he has another nightmare of a season, I don't think he's going to like the booing, etc. from the home faithful. I think at the end of this year he would be more amenable to that option. He could sock away another 13 mil or so, and then he would be ready. At that point he would have 2 years left and like 28 million left. I think we could buy him out for maybe 15, which would cut our cap figure by 6-7 million the first year.
> Considering he's going to be here this year, though, I will root for him to produce. That would eliminate the buyout option, but if he doesn't play well, we could be seeing another early exit from playoffs, if we make it at all.



If we make it at aLL? C'mon...ALL we need is a piece or 2 to fit into our puzzLe, a PG and a PF or Center, and we have a Legit shot at making it bak to the ECF........


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>lochdoun</b>!
> My take is i'm not saying Vin is a bad player, i'm just saying that his salary is not worth his production. Maybe he can agree to a buyout/re-sign with the Celtics. Or just a straight-up buyout and he signs with another team. Unlikely but it would be nice.


Vin Baker not worth his salary? You don't say....

Vin isn't a bad player and if he gets his head on right, he could be a pretty decent player. I think he started to go down hill when he had unreal expectations thrown upon him. Hopefully, showing up isn't an unreal expectation and Vinny can handle that.


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## mrsister (Sep 9, 2002)

From what I've heard, Vin is a really nice, likeable guy, so I have to believe he has a conscience and really does want to help the Celtics. Depression and alcoholism are serious matters and don't just go away overnight. If he sticks to a rehabilitation program while working on his game and physical training, who knows what will happen. Being a scapegoat in Seattle and having such high expectations in Boston could not have been good for him. I blame ownership and management for the whole Baker debacle. They screwed up because Baker had problems before he even got here. You don't trade for a guy with known problems at that salary and put that much pressure on him. It's got disaster written all over it, and that's what happened.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Mr. Sister is RIGHT*

This is the best analysis of Vin I have seen. I loved hearing Chris Ford and Paul Westphal saying they never got a phone call from Boston about Vin Baker. Nice to see Chris Wallace doing that research. And of course, all the pressure was on Vin. Pressure and alcoholism do not mix. I hope he gets it together this year, for his own sake. Forget the Celtics. Get your life together.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Early Results*

OK, so it goes something like this:

40% of Celtics Fans think Vin will contribute
40% of Celtics Fans think Vin won't contribute
20% of Celtics Fans think Vin will be bought out/retire


I hope the first or the third groups are right.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*No need to draft big?*

Looks like more Celtics fans think Vin will contribute something than be a hindrance this year. So you'll be OK if we draft two guards then....


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## el_raulin (Jun 5, 2003)

*Re: No need to draft big?*



> Originally posted by <b>Truth34</b>!
> Looks like more Celtics fans think Vin will contribute something than be a hindrance this year. So you'll be OK if we draft two guards then....


Even if Baker comes in revamped, we need to get a banger down low. Baby Shaq or Badiane are decent options for me. That will take some pressure of Baker and the 8 rebounds that we expected at first he would grab. He also may switch to PF and perform better.

But I do think a banger is a MUST.


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

*Re: Re: No need to draft big?*



> Originally posted by <b>el_raulin</b>!
> 
> 
> Even if Baker comes in revamped, we need to get a banger down low. Baby Shaq or Badiane are decent options for me. That will take some pressure of Baker and the 8 rebounds that we expected at first he would grab. He also may switch to PF and perform better.
> ...








Badiane or SOFO is a must...Or an equivaLent / better banger, yes........


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Draft Implications*

Well, they got a banger in Hunter, who has an outside chance of making the team. Now the C's have a decision to make: sign Mark Blount, sign another free agent, or go with Vinnie at backup C. Apparently, many of you (myself included) would like to give Vinnie that shot. But Blount was effective last year, and helped us against Indiana, too. Go Vinnie!


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Baker in Great Shape, Too?*

Today's Herald reports Vinnie may have turned the corner. Some of you Vinnie-haters may have to eat crow. Go Celtics!!!


www.bostonherald.com/celtics.html


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

*Re: Baker in Great Shape, Too?*



> Originally posted by <b>Truth34</b>!
> Today's Herald reports Vinnie may have turned the corner. Some of you Vinnie-haters may have to eat crow. Go Celtics!!!
> 
> 
> www.bostonherald.com/celtics.html


It's amazing how motivated a player can become when the paychecks stop coming lol.


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

*Re: Re: Baker in Great Shape, Too?*



> Originally posted by <b>Big John</b>!
> 
> 
> It's amazing how motivated a player can become when the paychecks stop coming lol.








LoL...That is for sure...This couLd be amazing, a Leaner WaLker and a Leaner Baker...Not getting my hopes up, but stiLL, nice to dream, right? :drool:


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

I cannot begin to fathom how vastly improved the Celtics would be if they had the Vin Baker that averaged 14 and 6 the season before last.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Agoo is dead on!*

It is amazing to think how good we could be if Vinnie started cleaning the glass and blocking shots.

The voting, though, seems to have turned against him.


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## KBrownFan (Jul 6, 2003)

*Baker could have had 14 and 6 last year...that's not his problem.*

Heh..

I think people have this Baker thing all wrong..
Look at his stats..

He scored 5.2 points per 18 minutes.. and 3.8 rebounds 

In seattle, he played nearly twice as long so he managed the 14 points and the 6 rebounds. So he rebounding was about the same and his shooting went down some. 

But he didn't have Gary Payton setting him up down low.
The Sonics played him alot and helped him pump up his statistics so they could unload him unto us. OB didn't work the offense around Vin, nor did he get a real point guard to feed him down low. I maintain that he was the same player Seattle sent us.

We all know Vin..he is slow but has some pretty decent inside moves WHEN he catches the ball. We didn't have anyone to feed him the ball and he needs a good feed. 

It's likely that he didn't slip at all from the Seattle days, he was just used differently. OB demands that the center switch and cover alot of guys, and Vin had trouble doing that, despite the fact he was supposedly in better shape then in Seattle. They HATED him in Seattle. Those 14 and 6 numbers are just a function of GP and minutes.

Vin can still score and he can still board., but the problem is do you sacrifice so much defense and shot blocking for his low post game? I am not sure OB will.

Pete


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## lochdoun (Jun 11, 2003)

The only reason why OB refuses to put him into a game is because OB practically begged Wallace not to make this trade, and to retaliate he's not been giving Vin any minutes.


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## Bad Bartons (Aug 23, 2002)

*Vin Baker is at the crossroads*

This is it for one of the most infamous disappointments in recent NBA history. He is at the crossraods of his career.

I think Vin is going into a better situation in some ways this year. The fans in Boston are going to give him a very hard time for awhile. He deserves this and he should expect it. However, expectations are much lower this year. He is accustomed to the system. He is off the booze. He has lost weight. We will see how all this translates on the court.

O'Brien went out of his way to keep Vin from quality minutes. I thought it was because he did not want Baker and therefore was not going to go out of his way to support him. I now think that O'Brien knew that Baker was drinking.

If Baker comes in clean and in good shape will Ob change his ways and play the guy?

Boston is investing a lot of money in Baker it would be prudent to use that investment to a productive end on the court.


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## Big John (Sep 11, 2002)

OB was supposed to be meeting with Baker today. I wonder what happened.

I don't believe in miracles. He was at the crossroads of his career last year and he took the wrong road. The team has to plan as if he will contribute nothing.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Vin's Workout*

O'Brien would not comment on the workout, but Ainge says it went well. I cannot wait until training camp!


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## theBirdman (Jun 20, 2003)

I am not going to get carried away by these reports! I will believe it when I see him! And even if he puts up 10pts, 6 rbs (highly unlikely) I am not going to be too excited. For his contract he should put up 20+pts,10+rbs,1,5+blk every night and be a superstar! I know he can improve us if he puts up decent numbers but that just isnt good enough for a max player. At least he would be tradable if he showed that he can still play a bit!


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## agoo (Jun 1, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>theBirdman</b>!
> I am not going to get carried away by these reports! I will believe it when I see him! And even if he puts up 10pts, 6 rbs (highly unlikely) I am not going to be too excited. For his contract he should put up 20+pts,10+rbs,1,5+blk every night and be a superstar! I know he can improve us if he puts up decent numbers but that just isnt good enough for a max player. At least he would be tradable if he showed that he can still play a bit!


He's not going to be worth his contract. Lets just hope he can do something and if he does, be happy about it.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Amen*

Anything is better than nothing at this point, and if he does show something, it makes him at least POSSIBLY tradeable, but not this year or next.


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## KBrownFan (Jul 6, 2003)

*Baker's Problems..not numbers.*

Hey,

Baker's problem isn't numbers..
He can still rebound well and score.

For Baker his problem is horrible defense and turnovers. His problems don't show up that much in a box score. Thats why OB didn't play him last year. His numbers were better then McCarty's.

That's what Seattle did to us..
They played him alot and said well your getting a 14+ point 7 reb guy. Think about it..those numbers are better then Brad Miller who only scored 13.1 points last year. But we all know Brad is much better then Baker since he can still move around.

Pete


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Vin Update*

Tebucky Jones reported to his new job in New Orleans this weekend, feeling he's been able to adjust to the intense heat and humidity after spending the winter in Florida. ''I moved my family from Connecticut to Fort Lauderdale,'' said Jones. ''I figured I needed to deal with the heat and humidity.'' 

Jones has had an interesting offseason. He said he had a chance to work out a bit with Celtics center Vin Baker, who grew up in the same circles in the Hartford area. ''It's the first time in his life he's worked out,'' said Jones. ''He looked slim for the first time that I can remember. Hopefully, he can get his career going again. It looks like he took things very seriously.'' 

 I believe in you, Vin.


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## rynobot (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: If it was just that he was drunk...*



> Originally posted by <b>Truth34</b>!
> and the Celtics can get him physically, emotionally and mentally in shape.....who knows? So far this thing is pretty even. For those who put buyout...how much does he have left on his contract in the remaining years...like $44M right? How much do you think he would take?


A box of Krispy Kream Donuts


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## Richie Rich (May 23, 2003)

*Re: Re: If it was just that he was drunk...*



> Originally posted by <b>rynobot</b>!
> 
> A box of Krispy Kream Donuts








Not funny.


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## rynobot (Oct 10, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: If it was just that he was drunk...*



> Originally posted by <b>CeLtZ in 04</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


YES IT WAS


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## BleedGreen (Jun 24, 2002)

*Re: Re: Re: Re: If it was just that he was drunk...*



> Originally posted by <b>rynobot</b>!
> 
> 
> YES IT WAS


:laugh: That was actually pretty funny. I hope Baker turns around but some humor is good too.

The Pats should have kept Tebucky He was my favorite player.:yes:


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## ThereisnoIinteam3 (Apr 19, 2003)

Vin Baker was not given a chance to prove anything last year. It was obvious O'Brian didn't want him on the team. The minute Vin started to show anything O'Brian would take him out.

I wish people would give Baker a chance to prove himself.


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