# Will the Pistons make the playoffs?



## Basel

They're currently in 13th place at 11-23, but during this 6-game winning streak, they've gained ground in the standings. They're now only 3.5 games behind 8th place Miami (15-20). Teams currently ahead of Detroit are Charlotte, Boston, Orlando and Indiana. 

What do you guys think? The East is so bad that you're never really out of the playoff race (unless you're the Knicks or Sixers).


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## R-Star

Basel said:


> They're currently in 13th place at 11-23, but during this 6-game winning streak, they've gained ground in the standings. They're now only 3.5 games behind 8th place Miami (15-20). Teams currently ahead of Detroit are Charlotte, Boston, Orlando and Indiana.
> 
> What do you guys think? The East is so bad that you're never really out of the playoff race (unless you're the Knicks or Sixers).


I was going to make a similar thread. It's early enough in the season that I think they have a legitimate shot at pulling it off. I think either Indy or Detroit moves into 8th with the Bucks or Nets dropping out. 

The Pistons are a quality team, I was saying it prior to the season starting. They have one of the best starting front courts in the league. Everyone talks about how much dropping Smith helped that, but another little considered fact is that Jennings is now the lone defacto "crazy chucker" on the team. You can survive with one of those guys, not 2. He's looking fairly solid now that he doesn't have to share crazy time with Smith. 
And I actually really like KCP's game. I think he'll turn into a solid yet unremarkable starting 2 guard in this league.


I'd like to see them make it


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## Bogg

They've got a shot. I don't think Orlando's as good as their semi-hot start made them look, and Boston's going to drop in the standings some (just wait until they trade Wright, Jeff Green, and maybe Bass while buying out Jameer and Marcus Thornton). Probably only one of Charlotte and Detroit can really catch the playoff pack though.


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## Diable

I'd rather have Okafor as a Hornet fan. This season sucks


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## R-Star

Diable said:


> I'd rather have Okafor as a Hornet fan. This season sucks


Can't see them getting that high a pick. I think this is going to be a wasted season for them.


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## RollWithEm

I think they need to get to 35 wins (possibly 36) to make the playoffs. That's basically 24-24 down the stretch. All they have to do is play over .500 ball the rest of the way. That's totally possible, right?


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## bball2223

I'm going to wait another month or so before I dive into this objectively. However, they have the pieces to make the playoffs, we gotta stay healthy. 

Also, for all the heat Jennings deserves, he has been playing really well and within the team structure during our winning streak. 

I just want to see KCP/Drummond develop, the team stay healthy and if we make the playoffs to avoid the Bulls (if they are healthy). I don't think we could necessarily win a series, but we could steal a game or two from just about anyone else in the East.


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## Basel

Detroit won again tonight in Dallas? On a back to back? Wow.


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## RollWithEm

Jennings and DJ Augustin were truly unstoppable tonight. They absolutely lived in the lane for the entire game. Tremendous performance. 6 of the 7 wins in this win streak have been by double digits. They are killing teams.


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## R-Star

RollWithEm said:


> Jennings and DJ Augustin were truly unstoppable tonight. They absolutely lived in the lane for the entire game. Tremendous performance. 6 of the 7 wins in this win streak have been by double digits. They are killing teams.


Augustin is an amazing backup point. I was pretty sad when Indy let him go. 

Between him and Collison we've lost some solid backup point guards over the last few years. Although I can't complain too much about CJ Watson.


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## R-Star

On a side note, how much of a worthless piece of shit should Josh Smith feel like?

What an asshole cancer that ****ing guy is. This may be a hot streak for Detroit, but they had only won 5 games before this. They were 5-23. Now they're 12-23 since they cut his ass.

People can continue to tell me chemistry doesn't matter and talent always wins out, and I'll continue to think whoever says that is an idiot.


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## bball2223

I think his selfish nature rubbed off on everybody. Jennings has quit taking dumb shots, Drummond/Monroe are getting ample touches, the ball is moving quicker giving KCP/Meeks/Tolliver more open looks, everything is running at a high efficiency. I mean Houston was making a "low" risk move, but those who tried to argue Detroit was responsible for his downslide made me laugh. Josh cares about Josh, and Dumars giving him a fat contract made it worse. I don't have any ill will towards him, but getting him out of Atlanta/Detroit has proven to be pretty effective for both franchises.


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## RollWithEm

bball2223 said:


> getting him out of Atlanta/Detroit has proven to be pretty effective for both franchises.


It certainly has.


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## ChrisWoj

a. I think that Van Gundy showed everyone that its his way or the highway. And I think that the success following the release he given him a very very long leash with ownership. Obviously he already had that, considering they allowed him to let Smith go in the first place like that... but the success in the wake of it has likely really lengthened that leash.

b. Right now I think they're gonna pull it off. They look like last year's Suns or Raptors. Not insomuch that I think they're as good as those teams as presently constructed (though they've been playing that way of late) - but in the fact that they are a true surprise team. I think they sneak in at this point. If they can go 3-3 over the last six this month, they've got a favorable February. If the wheels don't come off I see them sitting in the 7 or 8 spot by the end of next month.


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## ChrisWoj

Forgot to also mention: the team's ATTITUDE has been wonderful. Watching Dre and Jennings benched for entire fourth quarters and just riding the wave loving every minute of it as their teammates kill it? Amazing. The Mavs game earlier this month was incredible. Van Gundy said he wanted to put them back in with 4 to go, and they refused, saying to let Monroe and the bench crew ride it out. 

They've gone from just miserable and depressing - to a must watch each night. I'm loving the way they're playing.


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## RollWithEm

ChrisWoj said:


> They've gone from just miserable and depressing - to a must watch each night.


This is what I like more than anything. This league can never have enough entertaining teams.


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## ChrisWoj

RollWithEm said:


> This is what I like more than anything. This league can never have enough entertaining teams.


Agree. If they'd been playing losing basketball but had some entertaining guys, were doing some fun stuff, getting out and running, gunning, whatever... then I can handle it. But they were stagnant, pissed off, and in general boring. Removing Smith from the equation just changed it all entirely. I think the biggest thing was neither Jennings nor Smith was happy, word I'm reading says they didn't want to play together, so you've got that playing out on the court and in the back...

Jennings now? Jennings is showing, honestly, why he really can be a great NBA point guard. The key is always hard work, with almost everyone. Jennings has speed and talent, and when he uses his scoring to set up his passing he's very effective. If Caldwell-Pope really emerges defensively his risk-taking style of on-ball defense will play well too. When he first signed last year I was really enjoying watching him play and then he just faded and faded all the way to the nadir that was the first 28 games of this season. Now? He's back to doing what he was doing at the start of last year, and he's in a better system with better players for it and I'm loving it. 

One thing is for sure - the Jennings-Knight/Middleton trade looked like a straight bad beat for the Pistons, and now its moving back toward a push.


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## RollWithEm

ChrisWoj said:


> If Caldwell-Pope really emerges defensively his risk-taking style of on-ball defense will play well too. When he first signed last year I was really enjoying watching him play and then he just faded and faded all the way to the nadir that was the first 28 games of this season. Now? He's back to doing what he was doing at the start of last year, and he's in a better system with better players for it and I'm loving it.


KCP is an interesting player. I'm not sure he really reminds me of anyone else in the league right now. He just needs to work on the consistency that comes with real NBA professionalism. He's got to show up with the same attitude game-in and game-out regardless of how many minutes he is getting. He's basically got to take the same approach Ben Wallace took when he came over to the Pistons from Washington. Just quietly play yourself into being indispensable.


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## ChrisWoj

RollWithEm said:


> KCP is an interesting player. I'm not sure he really reminds me of anyone else in the league right now. He just needs to work on the consistency that comes with real NBA professionalism. He's got to show up with the same attitude game-in and game-out regardless of how many minutes he is getting. He's basically got to take the same approach Ben Wallace took when he came over to the Pistons from Washington. Just quietly play yourself into being indispensable.


High level defender, potentially a defensive anchor on the perimeter, creative finisher with not-enough-touch, creative handle with a less-than-great first step, and a beautiful jumper that just doesn't fall often enough. That's the easiest way to describe him all around.


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## R-Star

RollWithEm said:


> KCP is an interesting player. I'm not sure he really reminds me of anyone else in the league right now. He just needs to work on the consistency that comes with real NBA professionalism. He's got to show up with the same attitude game-in and game-out regardless of how many minutes he is getting. He's basically got to take the same approach Ben Wallace took when he came over to the Pistons from Washington. Just quietly play yourself into being indispensable.


Considering the draft he was picked in, if he ends up being a viable, if nothing else unimpressive starter then you have to think it's viewed as a good pick for the Pistons.


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## RollWithEm

ChrisWoj said:


> High level defender, potentially a defensive anchor on the perimeter, creative finisher with not-enough-touch, creative handle with a less-than-great first step, and a beautiful jumper that just doesn't fall often enough. That's the easiest way to describe him all around.


But defensively he doesn't really have the natural ball skills. He's almost like a Bruce Bowen type but not exactly. Maybe more of a Mookie Blaylock-Nate MacMillan hybrid.

As far as finishing in the paint goes, I think he needs to go to the paint with ruthless intentions. He should study some Russ Westbrook game film.


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## ChrisWoj

RollWithEm said:


> But defensively he doesn't really have the natural ball skills. He's almost like a Bruce Bowen type but not exactly. Maybe more of a Mookie Blaylock-Nate MacMillan hybrid.
> 
> As far as finishing in the paint goes, I think he needs to go to the paint with ruthless intentions. He should study some Russ Westbrook game film.


Agree on both counts. He's smart and slides well, he doesn't play the ball as well as he plays position. And yeah - offensively that would do wonders. He tries to be "too creative" to make up for that slow first step.


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## RollWithEm

R-Star said:


> Considering the draft he was picked in, if he ends up being a viable, if nothing else unimpressive starter then you have to think it's viewed as a good pick for the Pistons.


He just doesn't jump out at me as the archetype of any other successful NBA players that I can think of. He's got a little bit of that Darius Miles kind of body language with some erratic shooting performances, and he cuts to the basket from less-than-optimal places sometimes. Maybe a more athletic Trenton Hassell? The scout in me is struggling to see what he will look like as a finished product.


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## RollWithEm

ChrisWoj said:


> And yeah - offensively that would do wonders. He tries to be "too creative" to make up for that slow first step.


In that way he reminds me of Evan Turner a little bit.


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## RollWithEm

...Evan Turner without all the over-dribbling.


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## R-Star

RollWithEm said:


> He just doesn't jump out at me as the archetype of any other successful NBA players that I can think of. He's got a little bit of that Darius Miles kind of body language with some erratic shooting performances, and he cuts to the basket from less-than-optimal places sometimes. Maybe a more athletic Trenton Hassell? The scout in me is struggling to see what he will look like as a finished product.


I think he'll end up settling into a Thabo Sefolosha type role if I had to pick. With a bit more rounded offensive game when everythings said and done development wise. Obviously he's got work to do, especially with the shooting. But that's where I see him going on the Pistons.


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## RollWithEm

R-Star said:


> I think he'll end up settling into a Thabo Sefolosha type role if I had to pick. With a bit more rounded offensive game when everythings said and done development wise. Obviously he's got work to do, especially with the shooting. But that's where I see him going on the Pistons.


I really don't know. He might be Thabo or Bruce Bowen or possibly even develop more into an offense threat with an in-between game like a Josh Howard-type.


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## R-Star

RollWithEm said:


> I really don't know. He might be Thabo or Bruce Bowen or possibly even develop more into an offense threat with an in-between game like a Josh Howard-type.


Josh Smith might be the best comparison either of us have come up with. He had some all around game before he went crazy.


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## RollWithEm

R-Star said:


> Josh Smith might be the best comparison either of us have come up with. He had some all around game before he went crazy.


Maybe Josh minus 3 inches and 30 pounds.


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## R-Star

RollWithEm said:


> Maybe Josh minus 3 inches and 30 pounds.


Sorry, meant Josh Howard. Hard to talk about a Josh and the Pistons without me thinking Smith right now.


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## RollWithEm

Another possible comp for KCP might be if Devean George had lived up to his potential.


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## ChrisWoj

RollWithEm said:


> Another possible comp for KCP might be if Devean George had lived up to his potential.


You hit it on the head when you said its hard to figure out a comp. The biggest thing for me is I want to see his shooting come around. He shot 32% last year, has shot 35% this year on already the same number of attempts. And his shooting just looks *so good* when he rises up. But that positive (32 to 35) takes a hit when you consider he shot 38% in Nov, 36% in Dec, and now he's down to 31% in Jan. Interestingly - his free throw and three point percentages were both at their highest when his attempts were at their highest. But at the same time - his overall FG% is at its highest now with his overall FGA at its lowest number all year.

So he seems to be a rhythm shooter, better numbers with more shots - but when he was getting those shots he wasn't finishing as well as he is right now inside the arc... I wonder how much of that inside work has to do with Jennings handling the ball more without Smith and getting him the ball in the right place, and how much of his high FGA/3PA/FTA numbers resulted from the players as a whole being more "me" oriented before the Smith release...

Lots of random ass variables with this group right now. I just hope KCP's shooting numbers start to catch up with the way his shot looks.


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