# Game #40: Lakers @ Clippers



## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

<center>









Los Angeles Lakers (22-17, 3rd Pacific) 

@









Los Angeles Clippers (19-22, 4th Pacific) 

Wednesday, 7:30pm
at Clippers
TV: NBALP, KCAL
Preview 
Radio: KLAC-AM 570/KWKW-AM 1330









Luke Walton's big night wasn't enough to seal a win on Tuesday. 

*TV/Radio Broadcasts*
  
  
  

Los Angeles Lakers

*Probable Starting Lineup*





































PG: Chucky Atkins
SG: Caron Butler
SF: Jumaine Jones
PF: Lamar Odom
C: Chris Mihm

*Key Reserves:*






















Brian Cook
Brian Grant
Luke Walton

Los Angeles Clippers

*Probable Starting Lineup*





































PG: Rick Brunson
SG: Quinton Ross
SF: Bobby Simmons
PF: Elton Brand
C: Chris Kaman

*Key Reserves:*






















Marko Jaric
Mikki Moore
Zeljko Rebraca

- Corey Maggette (Sore Left Foot) & Kerry Kittles (Sore Groin) sat out in their last game. Dunno if they are gonna play!

Last Meeting: 
December 11, 2004
LA Lakers 89, LA Clippers 87
LOS ANGELES (AP) -- Kobe's still too much for the Clippers. Bryant scored 37 points and had 10 rebounds as the Lakers extended their domination of the Clippers with an 89-87 victory Saturday night. 

Clippers Forum Game Thread
</center>


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## madskillz1_99 (Dec 5, 2004)

We've gotta win games like this, even without the Kobester.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

I read in the ESPN Lakers/Clippers Preview article that Maggette is listed as "probable" for tonight's game.:sigh:


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

i think that odom will shut down maggets. (if he plays) and we could get a win away..(so cheap might i add)


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## Hov (Aug 12, 2003)

Welcome back, Brian34Cook!


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

This team's true colors are showing. We're getting badly outplayed early and it looks like the second half of yesterday's game. We'll get down by 15-20 and lose this one by 10.

Mihm is a total pansy, we need to deal him for somebody tough before the deadline. Chris Kaman is killing him for goodness sake. Chris Kaman is one guy that any team should most definitely NOT have to worry about. REBOUND!!!


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

Losing to the Clippers is bad enough, but to get totally owned in the first quarter is horrible. Kaman even conceited the jump ball and we're still losing by ten.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

This is downright embarrassing. 

You know what? Trade Sasha. I really thought this guy was a smart player, but he actually might be one of the dumbest individuals I have ever seen on a basketball court. He can't do anything right. If we could trade his *** for Marcus Banks, I'd be pleased, especially since that would move Tierrible to third string.


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## Bartholomew Hunt (Mar 4, 2003)

Looks like we have our defensive lineup in to start the 2nd! Tierre, Sasha, JJ, Cook, and Medvedenko! Surely we will shut them down. I like seeing Sasha out there growing as a player, but playing him against Maggette isn't the best idea. I'm watching this on KTLA through League Pass. Who are the Clippers announcers? These guys are idiots!


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

OMG, if only I could have a clip of our last three possessions to post on this board. Tierre Brown really is a total moron. There's no other way to put it. He thinks he's a one man team for some odd reason and he just flat out sucks.

Wow, if you're watching this game, you know what I'm talking about. He has jogged into the paint and bricked three straight 7 footers fading away with 7fters in his face.


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## Hov (Aug 12, 2003)

Brian Cook looks like Kobe out there :laugh:


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

As horrible as we played in that half, as much as Brown and Vujacic embarrassed themselves for 5-6 minutes each, as stupid as our mistakes were.......we're only down by 5 points at halftime (48-43). I guess we really are playing the CLIPPERS.

If we start playing half decent, we might actually have a shot to win this piece of junk.

Cook and Jones both played very well on offense. Nobody's defense was good, though. We had a couple nice possessions, but the rest of it was crap.

Come oooooooooon guys.............


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Hov</b>!
> Brian Cook looks like Kobe out there :laugh:


:rofl: Dont say that :laugh: 

<pre>
Name Min FG 3Pt FT Off Reb Ast TO Stl Blk PF Pts 
Jones 19 3-5 2-3 0-0 1 3 0 0 1 1 1 8 
Odom 9 0-3 0-0 0-0 0 1 1 0 0 0 3 0 
Mihm 9 1-3 0-0 0-0 1 2 0 2 0 0 1 2 
Butler 17 1-5 0-1 3-4 1 2 2 1 1 0 0 5 
Atkins 18 5-11 0-4 4-4 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 14 
Vujacic 8 0-3 0-1 0-0 1 3 2 2 0 0 1 0 
Cook 15 5-8 2-2 0-0 2 4 0 2 0 1 1 12 
Grant 11 0-0 0-0 2-2 1 4 0 0 0 0 2 2 
Medved 4 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 
Brown 6 0-4 0-0 0-0 0 1 2 1 0 0 0 0 
Bobbitt 4 0-1 0-1 0-0 0 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 
Totals 120 15-43 4-12 9-10 7 23 8 9 2 2 10 43
</pre>

Yahoo Top Performers:










Who'da thunk it? 

The funniest thing.. As crappy as the Lakers have played they are down only 5.. Good job by Cook and Chucky keeping the Lakers in it.. Odom and Mihm are pathetic tonight.. Gotta turn it around!!


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## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

what the hell went up atkins butt that made him all of a sudden a decent scorer?


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

chucky is sooo hesitant to friggin shoot the 3


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

Gee, thanks a whole damn lot Odom. We were down by 3 with the ball and he throws it away! That sparked the big run which put this one away.


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

down by 11 going in to 4th i dont think they have the willpower to win this one


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

does chucky frigging atkins know how to make layups or what:upset: really pissing me off


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## HallOfFamer (May 26, 2003)

When I watch it on channel 9 we lose...when i switch to KTLA 5 we're winning.

Gonna stay on channel 5.


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

Kobe :upset: Where are you? :upset: Get back asap :upset: Stupid team :upset:


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

well ud better change the channel (cries)


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

:upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset: 

Does this team have ANY brains?!!!

Lamar Odom is playing like a damn scrub. Like I said earlier, Chris Mihm is indeed a bum. How many lay-ups did he miss tonight? Not only are we getting ***-raped by the Clippers, the Clippers are playing like crap and doing this to us.


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

i think the lakers could be like one of the worst teeams in the league right now im taking the damn bobcats to waste this la team


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## Fracture (Mar 31, 2004)

This team has absolutely no concept of *defense*, I wonder what they practice.


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

(mitch mupchuk on the phone with kevin mccale) "we heard ur looking to deal garnett and we are willing to give u all 3 guys that miami gave us in thee shaq deal (kevin mccale) sounds like a good deal (mitch hangs up) he just got raped on that deal (chuckles a bit) god hes stupid


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

i seriously wanna writee an email to the lakers saying how stupid they are....and that they should just trade everyone on there team


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

This team ****ing sucks without Kobe. 

We're about to lose like 6 or 7 in a row.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Fracture</b>!
> This team has absolutely no concept of *defense*, I wonder what they practice.


EXACTLY!!!

What the HELL do they practice in practice?!


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Damian Necronamous</b>!
> 
> 
> EXACTLY!!!
> ...


3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!!3's!! :laugh:


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## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Damian Necronamous</b>!
> 
> 
> EXACTLY!!!
> ...



talk to the media about what they need to do to win with out kobe


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

Btw just how idiotic was Odom getting thrown outta the building? Shows how mature the dude is!


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## Fracture (Mar 31, 2004)

Maybe Odom should stop playing the 4.


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

That's freakin hilarious (Actually it's sad).. Cook/Grant outplayed Odom/Mihm :rofl: :sigh:


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

i wouldnt be surprised to see odom and caron get shipped in the same package...everyone should wave goodbye to the playoffs


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

LOL, at the Clippers. They're up by 18 with 3 minutes left with all 5 best players still out on the court vs. our scrubs. Not only are they on the court, they are jacking up three after three and pressing the Lakers at the halfcourt line.

A-holes. It'll be fun beating the hell out of them when Kobe gets back. I mean, they let Slava get 9 points for the love of God.


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## Cris (Jun 18, 2003)

i think i just got a the case of the lotteriers


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Brian34Cook</b>!
> Btw just how idiotic was Odom getting thrown outta the building? Shows how mature the dude is!


It's not like it mattered, he had already fouled out and the game was over. He got fouled by a gazillion times tonight and it wasn't called, so he was just venting is frustration at that 200 year old zebra.

I'm kind of glad he got thrown out because that was the most emotion we saw from the whole team tonight.


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## Fracture (Mar 31, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Brian34Cook</b>!
> That's freakin hilarious (Actually it's sad).. Cook/Grant outplayed Odom/Mihm :rofl: :sigh:



Odom can't handle the 4's.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Brian34Cook</b>!
> That's freakin hilarious (Actually it's sad).. Cook/Grant outplayed Odom/Mihm :rofl: :sigh:


Well, actually...Grant probably played worse than Mihm.:sigh:


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## SoCalfan21 (Jul 19, 2004)

Well, actually...lakers suck and they wont make the playoffs unless kobe gets back soon or they get another superstar but if they stay with this team they will have a lottery pick..


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## Brian34Cook (Mar 26, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Damian Necronamous</b>!
> It's not like it mattered, he had already fouled out and the game was over. He got fouled by a gazillion times tonight and it wasn't called, so he was just venting is frustration at that 200 year old zebra.
> 
> I'm kind of glad he got thrown out because that was the most emotion we saw from the whole team tonight.


Alright I understand that.. But still.. He was frustrated and played like C-R-A-P all night against Brand.. I dont like what he did but I dont blame him for taking the frustration out on the refs. :uhoh:


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

LMAO at some of the thread titles and things being said over on LG.net, I love those guys.

"OK OK. Seriously... what the HELLLL is tierre thinking?"

"The Daily "Where the hell is Mihm" Thread Wed Jan 26th"

"Somebody put a contract out on Brown."

"Start Sasha Vujacic....no questions asked" - They are really letting this guy have it. :yes:

And a couple things the Clippers commentators said tonight:

"He (Bobby Simmons) is the most complete player in the league...and I'm not saying that because I announce his games."

"When he (Lamar Odom) goes left, he's almost unstoppable, He's either gunna miss it or make it." Uhhh.....WTF?:laugh: 

Reading some of the stuff said over there really cheers me up after a loss.


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## h8breed (Jun 25, 2003)

LAKERS FIGURE IT OUT PLZ im getting restless


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

I was worried about this happening. Lose a lopsided game and get on a slide you can't pull out of. 

The Lakers need Kobe back sometime before we dip below .500 or we're toast.

Hell the Clippers aren't even a good team and we got routed. 

What the hell is it gonna take for Rudy to put odom at 3. 

More questions than answers at this point.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

Hope all of you laker fans arent as ignorant as what i have seen in this thread:



> We've gotta win games like this, even without the Kobester.


Games like this? You mean games where the other team is way more talented than your team? 



> i think that odom will shut down maggets. (if he plays) and we could get a win away.


Since when does odom play SG on the lakers? Heck, last couple of games against the clippers odom has guarded the center, let alone PF, let alone SF...at least you didnt say he was going to shut down brunson at the PG spot. 



> Chris Kaman is killing him for goodness sake. Chris Kaman is one guy that any team should most definitely NOT have to worry about.


Are you kidding? A healthy Kaman is one of the top pure 7 foot centers in the league. Hes been semi healthy for like 2 weeks now this season...take a look at his stats the last couple weeks. Hes doing this on a team where brand is the main post up guy. 





> Maybe Odom should stop playing the 4.


Thats a good comment. In the western conference, i dont think odom should play the 4. Id rotate him between 1 2 and 3 until he picked his game up at one of those positions. Only problem is, lakers front court is so thin, they cant afford to move him to the perimeter. 



> LOL, at the Clippers. They're up by 18 with 3 minutes left with all 5 best players still out on the court vs. our scrubs. Not only are they on the court, they are jacking up three after three and pressing the Lakers at the halfcourt line.


First of all, at risk of exaggerating, without kobe and odom, it can be argued that almost anyone you put on the court is a scrub the way everyone played tonight. Also, the lead was not guaranteed at that point, and most importantly.....earth to you...this was a statement game to the lakers and to kobe. Clippers choked away the first two games that they should have won, and have lost like what 35 out of 40 to the lakers or something crazy like that? They werent trying to run up the score, but they definately werent going to just ease up and let the lakers make the final deficit like 6 or 7. Clipps didnt get a hardly a good look in the game tonight from outside until they left them open at the end, so why not take a 3. Also the game was a statement to kobe. Kobe: look at the team you chose over us...we, without 2 of our best players, plus kittles, a projected starter, domintated most of the game, when we werent even playing our best. Hope that extra 30 million was worth it! 

For those of you badmouthing the clippers announcers, who are two of the best in the game, its quite funny. Its obvious you dont watch all clipper games (not that i expect you to), and can understand their sarcasm and humor. 

Anyway, look forward to the next game. Id like to see what the clippers can do at full strength against the lakers at full strength.


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## Dynasty Raider (Nov 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Damian Necronamous</b>!
> Losing to the Clippers is bad enough ...


At what point will you realize --- this is NOT your father's Clippers?


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## Lakerman33 (Oct 16, 2004)

Dont worry Kobe is back soon but we will get 7th or 8.
Odom sheesh! grant tries 110% he should get more mins.
chucky is actually got my respect the guy has show us laker fans alot i hope we get him back next year. Just a ugly game tho.


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## Tyrellaphonte (Feb 21, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Dynasty Raider</b>!
> 
> 
> At what point will you realize --- this is NOT your father's Clippers?


at what point will you realize that it doesnt matter, we *BEAT* the clippers its just wat its supposed to be.


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## Tyrellaphonte (Feb 21, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>High School Dropout</b>!
> 
> 
> at what point will you realize that it doesnt matter, we *BEAT* the clippers its just wat its supposed to be.


wat i meant by that is that we should beat the clips. I do kno that we lost


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

Youre saying that the team the lakers had tonight should have beat the team the clippers had? How so, when the cilppers had the advantage at almost every position 1 through the entire roster? Even if the lakers were 100% healthy and the clippers were 100% healthy, on paper and on the court, the clippers are no doubt the superiour team. But again, thats what basketball is all about, the variables that can happen, and the fact that on any given night, anyone can beat anybody. But its definately a reach to say any laker team this year, tonight, or otherwise "should" beat the clippers, when the clippers have the advantage of the starters and backups at every position except kobe.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>yamaneko</b>!
> 
> Games like this? You mean games where the other team is way more talented than your team?


Where’d talent get the Clippers last season? Lottery. What about the season before that? Yeah, Lottery. Talent doesn’t get you squat. 



> First of all, at risk of exaggerating, without kobe and odom, it can be argued that almost anyone you put on the court is a scrub the way everyone played tonight.


This is a pretty pointless comment. You can say this about every single team in the league that has a bad night. 



> Also, the lead was not guaranteed at that point, and most importantly.....earth to you...this was a statement game to the lakers and to kobe. Clippers choked away the first two games that they *should have won,*


Clippers were supposed to be winning three years ago. 



> Also the game was a statement to kobe. Kobe: look at the team you chose over us...we, without 2 of our best players, plus kittles, a projected starter, domintated most of the game, when we werent even playing our best.


Wilcox and Livingston aren’t close to the Clippers’ two best players. Kittles is garbage at this point in his career, he’s an average SF at best with a horrible contract. And the Clippers didn’t even get close to dominating the whole the game. One quarter is not “most of the game”. 



> Hope that extra 30 million was worth it!


That $30M was definitely worth it, especially considering that he chose the franchise run by the owner committed to winning and not the owner committed to his bottom line. 



> Originally posted by <b>yamaneko</b>!
> Youre saying that the team the lakers had tonight should have beat the team the clippers had? How so, when the cilppers had the advantage at almost every position 1 through the entire roster? Even if the lakers were 100% healthy and the clippers were 100% healthy, on paper and on the court, the clippers are no doubt the superiour team. But again, thats what basketball is all about, the variables that can happen, and the fact that on any given night, anyone can beat anybody. But its definately a reach to say any laker team this year, tonight, or otherwise "should" beat the clippers, when the clippers have the advantage of the starters and backups at every position except kobe.


The Clippers have failed for years with talent. They have more talent than they've ever had this season, and they're below .500. Even for the West, that's just sad.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Dynasty Raider</b>!
> 
> 
> At what point will you realize --- this is NOT your father's Clippers?


Yes they are, they're the same pansy Clippers that couldn't beat the Lakers in their two previous meetings this season and who have sucked for years with the same core in Brand and Mag.


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

Lakers should start fining people who take 3's.

5,000 fine for every 3 that you miss. If you can't make it, stop jacking it up.


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## Truth34 (May 28, 2003)

*Gotta agree with yamaneko*

You guys act like losing to the Clippers is a shock.

You beat them by 2 points when their best player was suspended for a flagrant foul.

They slaughtered you last night.

The Lakers are a STONE-COLD, LEADPIPE LOCK to make the playoffs, at least at the 8 spot, but give me a break.

Chris Kaman is a guy no team should worry about? Chris Kaman is a freak! I wish we had him! He is twice as good as Mihm, and he's only in his second year in the league.

I think the Lakers are a good team, and it might have been closer if they had a healthy Luke Walton tonight.

I think they should play Walton more, and shoot less 3 pointers, but then I'm not the coach.


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## Locke (Jun 16, 2003)

If this game wasn't enough evidence that Lamar Odom shouldn't be playing the 4 then I don't know what it's going to take for Rudy or Mitch Kupchak to realize it. And why do we even have Chris Mihm if we're only going to play him in the 1st quarter?


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## jazzy1 (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>EHL</b>!
> 
> 
> Yes they are, they're the same pansy Clippers that couldn't beat the Lakers in their two previous meetings this season and who have sucked for years with the same core in Brand and Mag.


Please don't interject actual facts into the argument. Lakers fans might be called idiots for not admitting that we're the Clippers little brother.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

Here is the problem with Odom playing SF: 

I think that we can all agree that he's not the best defender at the PF position. He does alright against smaller, more athletic PFs but he can't handle anyone with size and strength. If we move him to the 3, I think we are going to have a similar problem with him. He'll be able to handle the bigger SFs but he'll struggle against the quickers 3's because of his size. I remember Lebron flat out torching him a couple of weeks ago. Maybe that was an abberation. Who knows? One benefit to Odom playing SF is that he'll improve our rebounding at that position. We're barely getting 5 rebs per game from Butler. I think that Odom will give us 7-8 boards per night at that position. Unfortunately, SF also happens to be the most stacked position on this team. What do we do with Butler if Odom is starting at SF? Caron is not a SG and will likely be relegated to bench duty. If that happens, what will become of Jones? Jumaine has played just as well as Caron this season and deserves to be a backup at the very least. We've also got George and Walton at that position. We need to make some moves if we want to move Odom to SF. 

Another aspect of Odom's game that might suffer with a move to SF is his offense. He's not a shooter or a set offense player. He's a guy that takes you off the dribble and attacks the basket. He's an ideal offensive player at PF because very few 4's in the league can handle his quickness. Even KG was struggling at defending him the other night. However, if we move him to SF, that quickness advantage that he has at PF will be negated. He's going to become a more perimeter-oriented player and that doesn't really play to his strengths. Maybe he'll become more of a force on the block and use his size to his advantage. So far, he hasn't really been much of a factor in that regard. I'm not saying the transition to SF won't work. I just don't think it's as easy as 1-2-3.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

> Where’d talent get the Clippers last season? Lottery. What about the season before that? Yeah, Lottery. Talent doesn’t get you squat.


Yes it does. Talent doesnt do you any good if you have key players get injured. Look at last year, look at this year...but even with the current injuries, the clippers are more talented than the lakers team last night. Talent doesnt guarantee victory, but it does mean that you cannot guarantee victory over a more talented team. That would be like saying the bobcats are sure to beat the mavricks. Could it happen? Yes. SHOULD it happen? No. 



> This is a pretty pointless comment. You can say this about every single team in the league that has a bad night.


Has nothing to do with having a bad night. Most of the players on the lakers not named kobe or odom or butler would have a hard time cracking the clippers, spurs, sonics, heck many teams rotations, let alone starting. So that guy said the scrubs were in...really it was the lakers back up point guard, and a player they had playing since walton was injured, and another player since odom was fouled out. It wasnt like tomjohnavich was putting in the end of the bench because he gave up with 3 minutes to play. And it wasnt like the clippers were running up the game with their starters. THey had the backup SG in, the backup PG. I think they only played like 8-9 guys the whole night due to injuries. 



> Clippers were supposed to be winning three years ago.


Has nothing to do with this thread, nor the game last night. THe clippers loosing when they killed themselves in the first two games definately was in the back of their mind though...



> Wilcox and Livingston aren’t close to the Clippers’ two best players.


Way to change words. Look at the quote that YOU QUOTED! I said two OF the clippers best players. Wilcox is the main backup center/PF, and even averaged double doubles when he was starting early in the year. Livingston was scheduled to take over the starting role at PG this season as well. "best players" means your top 8...those two guys are definately the clippers top 8, if not top 5



> Kittles is garbage at this point in his career, he’s an average SF at best with a horrible contract. And the Clippers didn’t even get close to dominating the whole the game. One quarter is not “most of the game”.


Kittles is not garbage, he averaged good points, and started on a team last year that went into the playoffs. Hes injured is all right now. Is kobe garbage because hes injured now? Kittles has a horrible contract? He has the BEST CONTRACT in the leauge! THere arent many teams who wouldnt want him on their team if they could. An expiring 10 million dollar contract? That means max money to throw at someone next year. A horrible contract is brian grant. Clippers were up the whole game, and every time the lakers made a run, they got the lead up. Maybe we have different definitions, but to me leading the whole game is dominating. Granted its not like a 120-80 phoenix domination, but its what it is. 



> That $30M was definitely worth it, especially considering that he chose the franchise run by the owner committed to winning and not the owner committed to his bottom line.


Lets see, he chose the franchise run by the owner committed to winning. Is this the same owner that let a punk kid dictate how is franchise is run, let him tell him to get rid of arguably the most successful coach of all time, and the most dominating player of all time, just to appease the guy? Kobe stayed because of the money, and because he couldnt have sterling and baylor sucking his left nut as much as at the lakers. He didnt do it to win, otherwise he would have picked the clippers, knowning he would have a much better chance to win with that lineup. 



> The Clippers have failed for years with talent. They have more talent than they've ever had this season, and they're below .500. Even for the West, that's just sad.


To you follow sports at all? Clippers have not had big time talent. They have had young athletic guys who do well in spurts. This year was going to be the year to turn it around now that brand and mags are seasoned veterens, and with a whole slew of great backups. But, if you followed sports at all, you would have seen that at no point have the clippers been at full strentgth this year, and for most of the year, they have been without 2 of their 8 best players, at times, up to 5 of their best 8, and still they are at .500.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

By the way, im not the only one who thought the word dominate was applicable in this situation. Here is a quote from the LA Times:



> they dominate the Lakers in a 105-89 victory.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>yamaneko</b>!
> 
> 
> Yes it does. Talent doesnt do you any good if you have key players get injured. Look at last year, look at this year...but even with the current injuries, the clippers are more talented than the lakers team last night. Talent doesnt guarantee victory, but it does mean that you cannot guarantee victory over a more talented team. That would be like saying the bobcats are sure to beat the mavricks. Could it happen? Yes. SHOULD it happen? No.


That still does nothing to address the issue that talented teams don't guarantee you anything, nor do they mean anything if you don't win. The Clippers have had talent for years and have consistently gone to the lottery. 



> Has nothing to do with having a bad night. Most of the players on the lakers not named kobe or odom or butler would have a hard time cracking the clippers, spurs, sonics, heck many teams rotations, let alone starting. So that guy said the scrubs were in...really it was the lakers back up point guard, and a player they had playing since walton was injured, and another player since odom was fouled out. It wasnt like tomjohnavich was putting in the end of the bench because he gave up with 3 minutes to play. And it wasnt like the clippers were running up the game with their starters. THey had the backup SG in, the backup PG. I think they only played like 8-9 guys the whole night due to injuries.


You said "The way everyone played tonight". I responded to exactly that. 



> Has nothing to do with this thread, nor the game last night.


It has everything to do with this thread. Some Clippers fans have been saying for years that the Clippers _should_ have won this or that. You're claiming the Clippers should have won the first two meetings against the Lakers. Since you're indeed a Clipper fan, my comment is totally relevant. 



> Way to change words. Look at the quote that YOU QUOTED! I said two OF the clippers best players. Wilcox is the main backup center/PF, and even averaged double doubles when he was starting early in the year. Livingston was scheduled to take over the starting role at PG this season as well.


Yeah that's what I meant, but they're not two of your best players. Jaric is better than Livingston at this point in his career, by a lot. Same with Brand over Wilcox. If they were two of the Clippers' best players they'd be getting more than backup minutes. 



> "best players" means your top 8...those two guys are definately the clippers top 8, if not top 5


What, top 8? There's no such thing as 7th and 8th string players that are also two of your best players. That's self-contradictory, players buried on the bench by definition don't have that great of an impact on the game.



> Kittles is not garbage, he averaged good points, and started on a team last year that went into the playoffs.


Starting on a team that makes the playoffs means nothing. There are plenty of scrubs that start on teams that make the playoffs that aren't any good. Besides, Kittles' knee has slowed his quickness/speed, previously one of his best attributes when he used to lock down players. He's also not better than Mag or Simmons this season, and he can't play starter minutes anymore. 



> Hes injured is all right now. Is kobe garbage because hes injured now?


Kobe didn't have microfracture surgery on his knee and isn't suffering ill effects from that surgery like Kittles is right now. Kobe sprained his ankle, that's not close to being in the same realm as a knee that's still losing cartilage after microfracture surgery. 



> Kittles has a horrible contract? He has the BEST CONTRACT in the leauge! THere arent many teams who wouldnt want him on their team if they could. An expiring 10 million dollar contract? That means max money to throw at someone next year. A horrible contract is brian grant.


Are you serious? Anyone who is paid $10M to do basically nothing during an NBA season is a vastly overpaid player with a horrible contract. The Kittles signing was further proof that all Sterling wants to do is get under the cap to save cash. You think he'll resign Simmons? Let's just say I wouldn't be shocked if he walked this summer. 



> Clippers were up the whole game,


Being up somewhere between 5-8 points for 3 quarters is no where near dominating. It's being outplayed, that's about it. Dominating a team is blowing them out halftime/3rd quarter. 



> Lets see, he chose the franchise run by the owner committed to winning. Is this the same owner that let a punk kid dictate how is franchise is run,


How's that? Did Buss tell you Kobe made him do things last summer? Otherwise all you're going on is ESPN-fed garbage, like the following...



> let him tell him to get rid of arguably the most successful coach of all time, and the most dominating player of all time,


Yawn, this has been rehashed a million times. Shaq demanded his trade. Shaq and Phil have both said they believe Kobe did not push them out. Buss was offering Shaq an extension that would make him the highest paid player in the league, ahead of KG, but _Shaq_ refused. In addition, Kobe was a day away from signing with the Clippers, and in fact broke a verbal promise to them to sign with the Lakers. 



> Kobe stayed because of the money, and because he couldnt have sterling and baylor sucking his left nut as much as at the lakers. He didnt do it to win, otherwise he would have picked the clippers, knowning he would have a much better chance to win with that lineup.


No, not even close really. Sterling has never been committed to winning, Buss has. You continue to ignore the obvious; Buss is willing to spend, is willing to be over the cap to field a contender. Sterling is not. There was no guarantee that Sterling would have kept the talent the Clippers have now, as his history is littered with salary dumps and money saving goals, among years of lottery. Probably most importantly, the Lakers are a far more attractive destination to play for FAs than the Clippers. 



> To you follow sports at all? Clippers have not had big time talent.


What's "big time" talent? Are you seriously going to sit there and deny that the Clippers haven't had young talent at multiple positions for years and have failed to do anything with it? That they have had the most talent of any lottery team the last few years? Come on now.



> They have had young athletic guys who do well in spurts. This year was going to be the year to turn it around now that brand and mags are seasoned veterens, and with a whole slew of great backups. But, if you followed sports at all, you would have seen that at no point have the clippers been at full strentgth this year, and for most of the year, they have been without 2 of their 8 best players, at times, up to 5 of their best 8, and still they are at .500.


No, they are in fact two games below .500. And no, MOST teams suffer key injuries during the season, it's hardly just the Clippers. The Lakers with Vlade and now Kobe. The Twolves with Cassell. The Hornets with Mashburn, Baron, and Magloire. Etc. etc. 

Injuries to backup players do not excuse the Clippers.


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## Starbury03 (Aug 12, 2003)

I cant believe the bull**** posted on here by Laker Fans. :uhoh:


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Starbury03</b>!
> I cant believe the bull**** posted on here by Laker Fans. :uhoh:


Meh, it's still better than anything you've ever posted.


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## Starbury03 (Aug 12, 2003)

:laugh::laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :sour:


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## Lynx (Mar 6, 2004)

Road games tough for this Laker team. :devil:


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## Locke (Jun 16, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Pinball</b>!
> Here is the problem with Odom playing SF:
> 
> I think that we can all agree that he's not the best defender at the PF position. He does alright against smaller, more athletic PFs but he can't handle anyone with size and strength. If we move him to the 3, I think we are going to have a similar problem with him. He'll be able to handle the bigger SFs but he'll struggle against the quickers 3's because of his size. I remember Lebron flat out torching him a couple of weeks ago. Maybe that was an abberation. Who knows? One benefit to Odom playing SF is that he'll improve our rebounding at that position. We're barely getting 5 rebs per game from Butler. I think that Odom will give us 7-8 boards per night at that position. Unfortunately, SF also happens to be the most stacked position on this team. What do we do with Butler if Odom is starting at SF? Caron is not a SG and will likely be relegated to bench duty. If that happens, what will become of Jones? Jumaine has played just as well as Caron this season and deserves to be a backup at the very least. We've also got George and Walton at that position. We need to make some moves if we want to move Odom to SF.
> ...


Those are some good points, and I agree with nearly all of it. But I think the main problem here is that Odom is getting into early foul trouble in almost every game trying to guard guys down low that are too strong for him to pysically handle. Everything else is negated because of this since he can't even be out on the floor long enought to be effective. I wish Rudy would at least give him a chance at the 3 for parts of the game while Brian Grant or Cook was out there with him. If it goes well, give him more time there and consider a permanent move. If not, then I guess they have to stick to using him at the 4 until they get another 4 in here who doesn't have busted knees and whose sole contributions aren't shooting 3s and long perimeter shots.

Odom is one of the most unorthodox players in the league. He's a decent shooter but not comfortable with spot-up shooting; he's tall but he's lanky, so his height makes coaches want to use him at PF when he really shouldn't be one defensively; his rebounding is plenty good enough at the 4, he's good off the dribble but isn't a strong finisher, meaning he shys away from contact instead of taking it right at people and drawing fouls. He needs the ball in his hands to be effective but can't get the coach to run enough plays that involve him handling the ball. And to top it all off, he doesnt' seem to have a superstar mentality, meaning, much like a Vince Carter, he'd rather take a back seat to someone else even though people see the talent him to be "the man."

If Butler has to come off the bench to make this work, then that's something he's going to have to deal with. We've been saying for months that we have too many SFs. Everyone knows it and Mitch has done nothing about it. So until he does, if he does at all, we're going to continue having these lineup problems.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>EHL</b>!
> 
> 
> Meh, it's still better than anything you've ever posted.


Haha, owned.:laugh: 

I am so tired of these wankers (I'm talking about the literal English meaning of the word, not the meaning that many people in the U.S. think the word has) coming in here saying "I'm so tired of Lakers fans, blah blah blah."

If you are tired of us, why do you come and read our threads?:whatever: :krazy:


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

> That still does nothing to address the issue that talented teams don't guarantee you anything, nor do they mean anything if you don't win. The Clippers have had talent for years and have consistently gone to the lottery.


Who is saying it does? Are you trying to make up arguments now? I never said talent guarantees anything. I said that you cannot guarantee victory AGAINST a team more talented. It just doesnt make sense. Clippers have not had a relatively talented team over the years play together for a year. Injuries have hurt the cilppers every year. THey have never had a superstar go to guy either. 



> It has everything to do with this thread. Some Clippers fans have been saying for years that the Clippers should have won this or that. You're claiming the Clippers should have won the first two meetings against the Lakers. Since you're indeed a Clipper fan, my comment is totally relevant.


No, it does not. who cares what people have said years ago, were talking about one game, and the other games this season. Look at the box score, and the tapes of the games. Clippers beat the clippers in those games with the turnovers, etc. Remember, talented teams should beat less talented teams every time. DOes it happen? No, But that does not mean that after lets say the clippers beat the mavricks, beacuse the mavs turn it over 25 times and cant shoot right in the game, you cannot say: the mavs SHOULD have beat the clippers. 



> Yeah that's what I meant, but they're not two of your best players. Jaric is better than Livingston at this point in his career, by a lot. Same with Brand over Wilcox. If they were two of the Clippers' best players they'd be getting more than backup minutes.


Youre still missing that i said they are two of our best players. 2 of our top 8. Theyd be getting more minutes? You do realize that they have been injured for the longest time, right? Most teams have 8-9 man rotations with their BEST 8-9 players (this isnt rocket science) manning that rotation. The clippers best players for their rotation (players who have and can start) are: Brand, magette, jaric, livingston, wilcox, kaman, kittles, simmons.



> Starting on a team that makes the playoffs means nothing. There are plenty of scrubs that start on teams that make the playoffs that aren't any good. Besides, Kittles' knee has slowed his quickness/speed, previously one of his best attributes when he used to lock down players. He's also not better than Mag or Simmons this season, and he can't play starter minutes anymore.


you must not know the game of basketball well. Starting on a team that goes to the playoffs year in and year out does mean something. It means you have playoff experience, something GM's covet, even on players who dont contribute much. But kittles is a contributor and started on a pretty good nets team. Hes not the player he was 4 years ago, but he would stillb e starting on many teams in the league. 



> Are you serious? Anyone who is paid $10M to do basically nothing during an NBA season is a vastly overpaid player with a horrible contract. The Kittles signing was further proof that all Sterling wants to do is get under the cap to save cash. You think he'll resign Simmons? Let's just say I wouldn't be shocked if he walked this summer.


Yet again you show off your lack of understanding of basketball. No one said he wasnt overpaid. But you had said that it was a terrible contract. Most teams int he league would kill to have his contract on the team to try to make a run at someone next year. Do you understand the salary cap? Also shows your lack of knowledge of the clippers as well. Kittles was not signed, he was traded for second round picks. second round picks for someone who could potentially start was in incredible deal. Sterling traded for someone who makes 10 million to save cash? If he wanted to save cash he would have resigned Q for a lot less. But no, he wanted to make sure he had the flexibility to get a max type player next year. Yes, i think he will resign simmons, unless simmons got greedy like kandi and asked for more than he was worth, or signing him would hinder the clippers on getting a max player. Other than that i do see him back next year.



> Being up somewhere between 5-8 points for 3 quarters is no where near dominating. It's being outplayed, that's about it. Dominating a team is blowing them out halftime/3rd quarter.


Well, its just a matter of perspective then. Myself and the la times disagree with you.



> How's that? Did Buss tell you Kobe made him do things last summer? Otherwise all you're going on is ESPN-fed garbage, like the following...Yawn, this has been rehashed a million times. Shaq demanded his trade. Shaq and Phil have both said they believe Kobe did not push them out. Buss was offering Shaq an extension that would make him the highest paid player in the league, ahead of KG, but Shaq refused. In addition, Kobe was a day away from signing with the Clippers, and in fact broke a verbal promise to them to sign with the Lakers.


Those were all corroborated by every news agency, and even without it it was pretty obvious. Ive seen the opposite quoted on what phil and shaq have said, and seen it in interviews. shaq was disrespected by the lakers because of kobe, so shaq wanted out, which is what kobe wanted anyway. WHat you said about the clippers was true though. Even with all the lakers tried to do, the situation was not very bright there, so he still was going to go to the clippers until the last minute. 



> There was no guarantee that Sterling would have kept the talent the Clippers have now, as his history is littered with salary dumps and money saving goals, among years of lottery. Probably most importantly, the Lakers are a far more attractive destination to play for FAs than the Clippers.


Lakers cant sign any FA's unless they make big moves because of grants salary. Sterling has kept talent here, look at brand and magette. Sterling lets people go who dont fit into the team, players who are on the decline of their careers, and players who ask for too much money, or to make room for a max player like kobe, allen, etc. 



> What's "big time" talent? Are you seriously going to sit there and deny that the Clippers haven't had young talent at multiple positions for years and have failed to do anything with it? That they have had the most talent of any lottery team the last few years? Come on now.


Means just what it is. Big time talent. a Go to guy, An ak47, kobe, allen, redd, iverson, garnett, dirk, etc. etc. etc. CLippers have had YOUNG talent, but that doesnt get you into the playoffs. Look at the suns, and what a difference a big time talent like nash makes. 



> No, they are in fact two games below .500. And no, MOST teams suffer key injuries during the season, it's hardly just the Clippers. The Lakers with Vlade and now Kobe. The Twolves with Cassell. The Hornets with Mashburn, Baron, and Magloire. Etc. etc.


Youre kidding right? Or are you just getting nit picky because you know your stand doesnt have much basis. 2 game below 500, 2 games above 500. Thats 500. Im not going to say its 475 or whatever the exact amount is to the hudredth percentage point. The loss of vlade is not a huge loss. Mihm in his place has played decently. Lack of depth is a problem though. Kobe is injured, and we are seeing now how the lakers do. But the clippers have been without wilcox and jaric for a month. livingston for 2 months, kaman for a month, kittles for most of the season, magette for a few games, brand has had nagging injuries until now, rebracawas out for a month, moore out a few games, etc. Those are all players who have started for the clippers, almost all key members. Twolves have been without one guy, and look how bad they are playing. Hornets minus 2-3 guys, and theyre the worst team in the league almost. Thats EXACTLY why im saying its quite impressive that the clippers have been around 500 (both above and below) throughout this time.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

This thread has run its course. I'm closing it before the insults get out of hand.


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