# every1 who thinks pistons fans are classless....



## s00pers0nics (May 24, 2003)

your all ignorant stupid *******s... ben wallace is the heart and soul of this team and the fans were just showing that they stand behind him fully.. everyone loves ben here and we've all waited to see him show that hes a badass.. the detroit fans are the reason we won the championship our fans bleed red white blue, i love how the fans supported our team and if i was there i would everything possible at artest, thats a shame cuz i was at the game before that in the perfect seats.. damn, anyways pistons fans are the best as always and pistons repeat this year baby


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## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

I think the Detroit fans are classless....so hooray! Next game in Indy, I hope some (we need a slur for Detroit people) Piston fans are there.


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## amd pwr (Jun 24, 2003)

Indy fans should pelt detroit players next time with beer and trash to show how much they care for their players. Best way to show your support for your team. :uhoh:


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## JoeD (Sep 2, 2004)

I was thinking about possibly going to a game in Indy later, but everyone will misplace their agreesion for the fat twins and take it out on me!! 

Thanks a lot you pudgy *******s :upset:


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## adomis82 (Aug 30, 2004)

I was in the process of writing a similar posts. A lot of you need to get off the retarded high horses your on so I can say **** you to your face.

Let's look at Artests foul on Wallace. Was he going for the ball? No he pushed him in the back for no reason, that was classesless. And Ben retaliated with about as much class and the foul was. 

Now let me explain something to you about Ben Wallace and Detroit baksetball. Ben Wallace is totally loved here in Detroit and after that foul the crowd was HOT. AS THEY SHOULA BEEN, THAT FOUL WAS BULL**** AND BENs REACTION GOT THEM MORE HOT. Now, what did the coachs and refs do....they lined up the Pacers and Pistons and just let them jaw at eachother.......You think that will help things, no that will incite the fans and the players.......DID YOU SEE STEPHEN JACKSON, he was talking **** to Rip, and whoever he could come close to, that dude was itching for a fight. 

So what happened next....Ron Artest layed down on our scorers table. 

And espn and you idiots say he was just chilling.....chilling huh.......that was totally disrespectful......he just pushed the Icon of Detroit, who Detroit loves more than any of you idoits love any sports player you've ever had.....and he's just lying on the scorers table likw WHAT.....I just hit Wallace and I'm about to lay down.....


That got me pissed......and Ron Artest is from Queenbridge....how do you think people in his neighborhood would have reacted to thier hero getting pushed and then getting taunted like that by lying on our scoretable



So he got his with a blue plastic cup......Hmmmmmm........so he ran into the stands and attacked someone who didn't throw it......Who's being the monster???? And everyone says thats called for!?!? WTF is wrong with you!! he was overeacting at the wrong person

so ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm **** you

then a guy throws a beer at Ron Artest attacking the wrong guy.......and Stephen Jackson beats his *** and things get out of control.


So Artest has attacked our Icon and layed out on our scorers table disrespecting our entire franchise.....AND HE DIDN'T EXPECT TO GET HIT BY SOMETHING!?!? And he did, and he went ape****


AND PEOPLE SAY THAT THE PACERS REACTED WITH RESTRAINT!?!?!




Some dudes went out on the court to get back at Artest for hitting our Icon and disrespecting our entire franchise and going into that stands to attack the wrong guy. That's Detroit for you *****es, they aren't pussies like all of you who can take being disrespected becuase the only pride you all have come from bull**** attacks like the ones you and espn is putting on these fans



Is throwing beers at players right? Hitting a ref in the face with a beer can right? Saying racial slurs right? absolutly not......Did Ron Artest come into the wrong city to be disrepecting, you better believe it



Now only because African American professional athletes have put up with terrible terrible cruel unrelentless heckling for years from Boston, Philly, New York, Indiana! and fans all over the country Detroit fans can let this slide. Artest, Jackson and Oneal struck back at the fans in detroit for what they've been putting up with for years so I guess two wrongs make a right in this case


But hitting Ben Wallace like that and disrespecting our franchise is asking for trouble and he got it.


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

I really hope no Piston fan on this board was at the game and participated in the classless violence against the Pacers players. As pathetic a display it was from Pacers players, it was even more pathetic of a display from Pistons fans, and I would be ashamed if anyone on this board participated in that. Guys, we just have to remember that this is JUST A GAME and it should never come to this. We also have realize that players are people too, and no person should be treated how Artest was treated. 

As for someone saying that that display by Pistons fans was not classless... Did you see the same fight I saw? Cuz the fight between Big Ben and Artest was OVER before fans got involved. They had no right, or reason to get involved. Yet they acted like elementary school kids by throwing everything in site, from cups of beer to a chair(which almost hit some of the Pacers). Honestly if yall can't admit that was the most pathetic, classless display by fans in sports history, then you are being stubborn and ignorant.

PS- I'm not saying all Pistons fans are bad, but any fan that participated in that riot last night, I have no respect for. I love the Detroit fans usually; they are loud, obnoxious and always behind their team, but this was just outrageous.


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## adomis82 (Aug 30, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>texan</b>!
> I really hope no Piston fan on this board was at the game and participated in the classless violence against the Pacers players. As pathetic a display it was from Pacers players, it was even more pathetic of a display from Pistons fans, and I would be ashamed if anyone on this board participated in that. Guys, we just have to remember that this is JUST A GAME and it should never come to this. We also have realize that players are people too, and no person should be treated how Artest was treated.
> 
> As for someone saying that that display by Pistons fans was not classless... Did you see the same fight I saw? Cuz the fight between Big Ben and Artest was OVER before fans got involved. They had no right, or reason to get involved. Yet they acted like elementary school kids by throwing everything in site, from cups of beer to a chair(which almost hit some of the Pacers). Honestly if yall can't admit that was the most pathetic, classless display by fans in sports history, then you are being stubborn and ignorant.
> ...


Of course I'm not saying fighting is right
I've never acted in a disrespectful way at a basketball game and I'm not a disrespectful person

A lot of wrong actions took place that night

I'm just trying to even the national media bias on this issue. The fans were wrong.......if I were a player who shoved nas or artest at a basketball game in queensbridge then layed out on the scorerstable clowning the situation....I'm getting stabbed and I know better

Artest shoulda known better


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>adomis82</b>!
> I was in the process of writing a similar posts. A lot of you need to get off the retarded high horses your on so I can say **** you to your face.
> 
> Let's look at Artests foul on Wallace. Was he going for the ball? No he pushed him in the back for no reason, that was classesless. And Ben retaliated with about as much class and the foul was.
> ...



You are so insanely biased, its not even funny. Artest's foul was ordinary. Not flagrant. Definitley not worthy of the Ben Wallace's actions that followed. Shouldn't he have kept his cool too? Or is it okay for him to get mad b/c Ron Artest is a punk and deserves what he gets? Then, the fight is over. Everyone is subdued and Artest is lying on the table calming himself down. I know for a fact that no one, especially not someone as unintelligent as Artest, is going to be able to think, "hey I'm gonna lay on their scoretable to piss them off." Um... he is just trying to calm himself down, not disrespect your entire franchise(honestly that makes no sense). He showed extreme restraint at that moment. Then idiotic, arrogant fans got involved. And at that point, I place all of the blame on them. The fight is over. There is no need to instigate something more. I bet you that fan is bragging right now to his family about how he kicked Ron Artest's *** or something and how he is such a badass. Well guess what he isnt. The fans are in the wrong here and I hope that guy gets persecuted to the full extent of the law. Not only did he throw the beer, but he instigated a full fledged riot within the stadium. He made other people think it was okay to throw stuff. It wasn't. And again, if you can't admit that was a pathetic display by Detroit Pistons fans, then I don't know what is wrong with you.


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## saugato (Aug 15, 2003)

Did you look at the Detroit fans..bunch of sissies. Shame on them. As far as standing behind their backs.. everybody stnds behind his teams back. That doesn't allow you to behave like a sissy...you sissies


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## adomis82 (Aug 30, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>texan</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> You are so insanely biased, its not even funny. Artest's foul was ordinary. Not flagrant. Definitley not worthy of the Ben Wallace's actions that followed. Shouldn't he have kept his cool too? Or is it okay for him to get mad b/c Ron Artest is a punk and deserves what he gets? Then, the fight is over. Everyone is subdued and Artest is lying on the table calming himself down. I know for a fact that no one, especially not someone as unintelligent as Artest, is going to be able to think, "hey I'm gonna lay on their scoretable to piss them off." Um... he is just trying to calm himself down, not disrespect your entire franchise(honestly that makes no sense).




No


Please believe me when i say that Artest's lying on the table and clowning around was taken as disrespectful by fans there after he hit 
Wallace.

To get specific are you going to tell me that Artest was going for the ball there when he pushed his two hand to push Wallace in the back?? Intentional foul at least....HTF can you think otherwise...please explain



The fight was subdued huh?


The players were lined up jawing at eachother clenching their fists....that's not subdued



It does makes sense, you might not agree but it makes sense


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## Lynx (Mar 6, 2004)

Some of the fans were trying to stop the brawl so no, generally, I don't think Piston fans are classless.

But those who threw beer, popcorn on the Pacers, came out on the court for fight should be ashamed of themselves.


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## adomis82 (Aug 30, 2004)

I repeat, of course I'm not saying the fans acted right.....

and by saying anything different than:

"Pistons fans are classesless losers"

I bet you all overreact and think I am saying it was right.


All I am saying is that was taken as being disrepectful....and it was in Detroit..... Artest should have known better. That's all


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>adomis82</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


He didn't get ball, but it wasn't a hard foul at all. Def. not enough to warrant an outbreak like that from Wallace. The fight was subdued... the Pistons and Pacers players were seperated and everyone was cooling down. Nothing else was going to happen. Artest was lying down(I still don't see how thats disrespectful) and Big Ben was walking away. Sure there was still tension but taht doesn't mean they were still fighting, and then the fans got involved....


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## adomis82 (Aug 30, 2004)

Look at the foul Artest did on Wallace again and repost 


And tell me were Stephen Jackson looked subdued......tell me he wasen't waiting for hitting someone


again, it was crazy, it was scary and it was wrong


but things happen and when fights happen in rivalries like this in can spill into stand easier than people think

Maybe I'm wrong, I've been wrong before but all I'm trying to say is that I could see something like a beer being thown at Artest after what he did to Wallace. Not because it's right, but I could see other people doing it, and Artest could see it happening, and I think he could have known better


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## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>saugato</b>!
> Did you look at the Detroit fans..bunch of sissies. Shame on them. As far as standing behind their backs.. everybody stnds behind his teams back. That doesn't allow you to behave like a sissy...you sissies


Thanks John Saunders.


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## Lynx (Mar 6, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Thanks John Saunders.


Yeah, he overreacted more than Ben Wallace. Using "Punk" word on national TV. COME ON....He needs to be professional, doesn't he?


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## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

I believe his (Saunders) first statement was something like:

"Detroit fans are sissies"

No preface that fans throwing stuff were sissies just all Detroit fans are sissies. It's the typical response Detroit fans are having to endure right now. It's a gross generalization, and he should know better than to do something like that on camera.


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## Lynx (Mar 6, 2004)

I am not sure I caught him using "sissies" but he did say "punks" before the Shootaround crew went on with their insights.

Whatever he said, he shouldn't said as a normal fan. He's paid to be a reporter, an anchor because he's professional.


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## adomis82 (Aug 30, 2004)

I could think of a number of words to describe the two regular fat dudes who faced up 6-5 professional athlete Ron Artest in the middle of the court.....sissies........not one of them


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## Kuskid (Aug 18, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>adomis82</b>!
> I could think of a number of words to describe the two regular fat dudes who faced up 6-5 professional athlete Ron Artest in the middle of the court.....sissies........not one of them


Here's some:
drunk
stupid
rioting
etc...


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## ToddMacCulloch11 (May 31, 2003)

The fans that were at the game aren't the only ones who did something wrong at the game, that is for sure. But there is no denying that what they did was totally wrong.


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

I looked at the foul over and over again. I repeat it wasn't a hard foul. Wallace's actions were not warranted. If anyone overreacted, it was surely him. The fight was over until the fans got involved. SUre Sjax might have wanted to hit someone, but he wouldnt have had that dumbass drunk ****en idiot of a fan didnt do what he did.


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## adomis82 (Aug 30, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>texan</b>!
> I looked at the foul over and over again. I repeat it wasn't a hard foul. Wallace's actions were not warranted. If anyone overreacted, it was surely him. The fight was over until the fans got involved. SUre Sjax might have wanted to hit someone, but he wouldnt have had that dumbass drunk ****en idiot of a fan didnt do what he did.


I feel an agreement to disagree is in the making here. After Ron Artest attacked the guy who didn't throw the plastic cup a guy next to him through the beer on the two of them and Jackson beat his ***, I don't know what call to make there, it could have been the innocent guys friend who wanted to do something to get Artest off the guy who didn't throw the cup so his dropped his drink on them and he got his *** beat because of it It could have been a lot of things


Artests foul on Wallace was intentional at the least....he made no attempt at the ball, just pushed/hit him in the back. Wallce wouldn't have reacted like he did if Artest didn' do such a ***** foul

Terrible situation any way one looks at it


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## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

Why does everybody assume all of the Detroit fans were drunk? I believe there is a two beer limit at the Palace. I don't think alcohol was as prominantly involved as some people think.

Ron Artest is not innocent in this. He wasn't lounging on the scorers table to extracate himself from the fight. He was doing it to make people's blood boil. That doesn't make throwing anything at him right, but he invited it.

Like it said in that Sports Illustrated article: It would be like Bill Laimbeer closelining Larry Bird in the Garden, and then ordering a hot dog. You EXPECT something to happen.

The fan was wrong for throwing his cup, Ron was wrong for going into the stands. What makes it even worse for Ron is he attacked the WRONG guy. You can't claim self defense if you beat up a guy who never did anything to you. You can't praise the Indiana Pacers players for banding together to fight fans and at the same time blame Pistons fans for banding together and fighting players. Some of those fans were legitamately defending themselves from out of control players.

As for all the stuff that got thrown when they were leaving. 20000 people watched Jermaine O'Neal and Ron Artest beat the living hell out of two fans ON the court. Right in plain view for everyone to see. And while those fans probalby deserved it for coming onto the court. How do you expect a crowd of people to react after witnessing that? That same thing would have happened in every arena in the country.


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## adomis82 (Aug 30, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> Ron Artest is not innocent in this. He wasn't lounging on the scorers table to extracate himself from the fight. He was doing it to make people's blood boil. That doesn't make throwing anything at him right, but he invited it.QUOTE]
> 
> I couldn't agree more, bottom line
> ...


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## IosimCash (Aug 6, 2003)

lets look at whats important...Indiana OWNED Detroit on the road. Detroit knows when healthy the Pacers are the better team, and would have been last year too.

All detroit can do is start ****, and their horse**** advertising of being the bad boys (when they clearly fail in comparison to indiana) causes them to bring in sissies to the games who think they are hard ****.

Ben Wallace and the Detroit fans are to be blamed completley for this situation. How many games artest gets suspended for...should be the ammount of games Detroit loses home games for.


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## IosimCash (Aug 6, 2003)

oh and here from another thread

"Next Pistons/Pacers game-Christmas Day.

I am a Pistons fan. HOWEVER - I was not drinking beer. I wasn't the one doing the punching. I'm not classless. At least, I don't think I am.

I'm ashamed.

The Pistons had "the greatest fans in all of basketball" (as quoted by many TV broadcasts, newspapers, magazines, etc.), and they completely **** up. Totally classless. What the hell were they thinking?

The thing that started this whole thing was a complete overreaction by Ben Wallace. It wasn't even a very hard foul, you idiot.

I'm boycotting the Pistons until further notice. "


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## rainman (Jul 15, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mike luvs KG</b>!
> Why does everybody assume all of the Detroit fans were drunk? I believe there is a two beer limit at the Palace. I don't think alcohol was as prominantly involved as some people think.
> 
> Ron Artest is not innocent in this. He wasn't lounging on the scorers table to extracate himself from the fight. He was doing it to make people's blood boil. That doesn't make throwing anything at him right, but he invited it.
> ...


plenty of blame to go around starting with the refs, who didnt defuse all the trashtalking at the other end of the court that led up to the blowup. my guess is wallace gets about 5 games and oneal,jackson and the mental one artest all over 20.


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## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

> who Detroit loves more than any of you idoits love any sports player you've ever had


Reggie Miller, enough said.


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## NYKBaller (Oct 29, 2003)

Detroit has hit a new low and thats hard for Detroit to do...


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## Vintage (Nov 8, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>PacersguyUSA</b>!
> I think the Detroit fans are classless....so hooray! Next game in Indy, I hope some *(we need a slur for Detroit people)* Piston fans are there.



Wow. 

Do you lack the intelligence to distinguish between some Detroit fans and the entire city?

Ignorant comment.


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## Vintage (Nov 8, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> I believe his (Saunders) first statement was something like:
> 
> "Detroit fans are sissies"
> ...


Don't worry.

Some of us can make the distinction between some Detroit fans who acted that way, and the rest of the Detroit Piston fanbase.


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Vintage</b>!
> 
> 
> Don't worry.
> ...


I have no respect for any of the fans who participated in the fighting or even threw stuff at the players last night. That being said, I have no problem with fans who weren't involved. There were plenty of fans that just wanted to get out of there(like that old lady) and I can sympathize with them. But once you pour something on players and start treating them like show animals you lose all my sympathy, no matter what team you root for. Detroit fans that didnt participate in last nights even, I have no problem with them. The other guys(there wer alot more than a few) deserve to be banned from sporting events for a long time.


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## Vintage (Nov 8, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>texan</b>!
> 
> 
> I have no respect for any of the fans who participated in the fighting or even threw stuff at the players last night. That being said, I have no problem with fans who weren't involved. There were plenty of fans that just wanted to get out of there(like that old lady) and I can sympathize with them. But once you pour something on players and start treating them like show animals you lose all my sympathy, no matter what team you root for. Detroit fans that didnt participate in last nights even, I have no problem with them. The other guys(there wer alot more than a few) deserve to be banned from sporting events for a long time.


I am not arguing against that.

There are some Pistons fans who should be held accountable, ie, criminal charges.

But unlike PacersguyUSA, I can distinguish between a few bad apples and an entire fan base.


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## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

Not all Pistons fans are classless... that's ridiculous, we have a lot of great Pistons fans <i>on this message board</i> for proof of that. Not all Pistons fans at the Palace are classless either, that's also ridiculous because at a stadium with a capacity of over 20,000 I'd assume most of them are normal, respectable human beings.

However, it would be a crime to say that any Pistons fan that threw beer or popcorn on the Pacers players as they were leaving to their clubhouse is a normal, respectable human being. Watching that was just plain disgusting. Throwing beer at Ron Artest was simply disgusting, and fans cheapshotting Pacers players from the back was also disgusting.

Personally I think any fan who was involved in either the fight or throwing food at the Pacers should be banned from the arena for good.


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## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Budweiser_Boy</b>!
> Throwing beer at Ron Artest was simply disgusting, and fans cheapshotting Pacers players from the back was also disgusting.


Was Jermaine O'Neal's cheapshot disgusting?


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## Crossword (Jun 7, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> Was Jermaine O'Neal's cheapshot disgusting?


Yeah it was, he also overreacted. But first of all, what the hell was the fan doing on the court in the first place? Add that to the fact that JO was basically sticking up for Ron.... but it was still bad judgment on his part. In fact, that probably should have gotten him a longer suspension than Artest.


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## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Budweiser_Boy</b>!
> 
> 
> Yeah it was, he also overreacted. But first of all, what the hell was the fan doing on the court in the first place? Add that to the fact that JO was basically sticking up for Ron.... but it was still bad judgment on his part. In fact, that probably should have gotten him a longer suspension than Artest.


That's fair.

But, the same things you said about on the court could be attributed to what was happening in the stands. With Artest attacking the fan, the other fans were sticking up for him. Unfortunate for James Jones, but if you are going to go into the stands surronded by an angry group of fans that don't know what your intentions are, you better be careful. Even still the guy throwing punches at the back of Jones' head should be facing legal trouble. But if that's the case, I don't know how you can absolve Jermaine O'Neal of his actions.

Personally, I'm more inclined to believe that the guy punching Jones' from behind was not looking out for the other fans and his own safety, but looking to start a fight.
Same with Jermaine O'Neal. He wasn't looking to help anyone out by clobbering a guy that was in a vulnerable position. He was looking for blood.


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## Midnight_Marauder (Dec 1, 2003)

I think that cop that tried to pepper spray Artest should be looked at by Auburn Hills police.....If you look closely there was a dude in gray pants coming at Artest while Person had him restrained....then that cop comes up and points the pepper spray at Artest.....umm officer.....he isnt the problem right now its the 20 fans on the court trying to get at him that are the problem......but you know a brother in Auburn Hills will never get a break from the police:laugh:


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## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

Dude Pistons fans are classless. There is no argument. There is absolutely no reason in hell why that jerk should have thrown anything at Ron Artest, who was just laying down on the scorer's table while Ben Wallace was jumping around like an idiot on drugs trying to kill Ron Artest.

And then you had idiots throwing chairs, beer, whatever they could find at Pacer players.

It was the most disgusting thing I've ever seen. I don't see how anyone can make an argument differently.










-Pop


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## Target (Mar 17, 2004)

Well Pop I don't think it's all Pistons fans but a large minority.

Fortunately they have video and can identify the worst offenders. 

NBA is becoming more and more brutal. IMO we will see more and more Ben Wallaces. Sort of like the 'enforcer' types in pro hockey. It won't be long until they break out pads and helmets and allow moving picks.

Then they can put up plexiglass barriers 6 rows up to keep the rowdie beer huckers contained.


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## PistonFAN81 (May 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>adomis82</b>!
> I was in the process of writing a similar posts. A lot of you need to get off the retarded high horses your on so I can say **** you to your face.
> 
> Let's look at Artests foul on Wallace. Was he going for the ball? No he pushed him in the back for no reason, that was classesless. And Ben retaliated with about as much class and the foul was.
> ...



wow couldn't have said it better


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## SodaPopinski (Aug 10, 2004)

> Originally posted by <b>Target</b>!
> Well Pop I don't think it's all Pistons fans but a large minority.


True. I don't mean to paint all of Detroit with such a broad brush. I'm sure the majority of them were disgusted by the actions of the other so-called "fans." What I don't like to see is other Pistons fans defending what the idiotic contingent of fans was doing on Friday night.

-Pop


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## Target (Mar 17, 2004)

I'm with you there.

These people that defend them would be standing at their side given the opportunity. 

If the fans get away with it in Detroit then the NBA might as well call the whole season like they called the game. 

Make this 'event' the low water mark. 

CALL ALL CONTACT.


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## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>SodaPopinski</b>!
> Dude Pistons fans are classless. There is no argument.





> Originally posted by <b>SodaPopinski</b>!
> 
> 
> *True. I don't mean to paint all of Detroit with such a broad brush.* I'm sure the majority of them were disgusted by the actions of the other so-called "fans." What I don't like to see is other Pistons fans defending what the idiotic contingent of fans was doing on Friday night.
> ...


You sure didn't do a good job of that.


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


he fessed up to his mistake of generalizing too much about Pistons fans. In his second post he came back and said it was just a couple and you have to get on his back about it? jus get off him..


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

From what I saw last season and this one the Detroit's fans seem to be the most "european" of the NBA as "heat" in the arena.

Anyway this episode has been too huge even for the european standards ...

Throw object on the floor was quite commong until 10-15 years ago, while right now there are quite severe fines.
And we never saw fans fight with players; usually the problems are between the fans of the opposite teams.

Grettings


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## italianBBlover (Mar 5, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>texan</b>!
> 
> 
> I have no respect for any of the fans who participated in the fighting or even threw stuff at the players last night. That being said, I have no problem with fans who weren't involved. There were plenty of fans that just wanted to get out of there(like that old lady) and I can sympathize with them. But once you pour something on players and start treating them like show animals you lose all my sympathy, no matter what team you root for. Detroit fans that didnt participate in last nights even, I have no problem with them. The other guys(there wer alot more than a few) deserve to be banned from sporting events for a long time.


Well, here in Italy the hottest fans (those that usually stay behind the baskets) can be banned out of the arena for the entire season by the Police after a bad episode.


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## DetBNyce (Jul 23, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>texan</b>!
> 
> 
> he fessed up to his mistake of generalizing too much about Pistons fans. In his second post he came back and said it was just a couple and you have to get on his back about it? jus get off him..


Who are you to tell me what to say and not say?

My post had a lot of sarcasm in it.


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## texan (Jul 10, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DetBNyce</b>!
> 
> 
> Who are you to tell me what to say and not say?
> ...


You never hinted at the sarcasm at all, and was there any reason to make that comment? Your right. I can't tell you what to say and what not to say; you should be able to figure that out yourself.


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## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>italianBBlover</b>!
> From what I saw last season and this one the Detroit's fans seem to be the most "european" of the NBA as "heat" in the arena.
> 
> Anyway this episode has been too huge even for the european standards ...
> ...


In the NBA throwing an object on the floor gets you automatically arrested. Which is what would have happened if Artest had just let it go.


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## Doggpound (Nov 1, 2002)

The mob mentality took over. Bottom line. The actions of Artest, and a few horrible fans turned a LOT of fans into wild animals.

Is it unfair if the next Pistons-Pacers game is played w/o fans? Nope. Punishing 19k ticketholders for one game compared to what happened to the Pacers side of the house isn't exactly equal. And yes, the Pistons fans and organization SHARE in the blame for this debacle. It's too easy to point at Artest and say "THAT'S THE BAD GUY"


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## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Doggpound</b>!
> The mob mentality took over. Bottom line. The actions of Artest, and a few horrible fans turned a LOT of fans into wild animals.
> 
> Is it unfair if the next Pistons-Pacers game is played w/o fans? Nope. Punishing 19k ticketholders for one game compared to what happened to the Pacers side of the house isn't exactly equal. And yes, the Pistons fans and organization SHARE in the blame for this debacle. It's too easy to point at Artest and say "THAT'S THE BAD GUY"


You guys that want the Pistons to play in an empty arena just don't get it.

Let's say for argument's sake that 500 people were throwing things in the Palace. I believe that number was more between 100 and 200, but anyway there were 22,000 people in attendance. 1/44th of total people were throwing things. 

On the other side, 4/15th of Pacers players were involved in the actual fight. 

You want to penalize all Pistons fans, even the innocent ones? Well, let's penalize all the Pacers players, even the innocent ones. I say however many games Detroit has to play in an empty arena, that's how many games that Indiana has to completely forfeit. Afterall, it's only "fair".


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## Doggpound (Nov 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> You guys that want the Pistons to play in an empty arena just don't get it.
> ...



Your numbers are actually too high. At that point in the game, it was a blowout. So a lot of fans had already left the arena.

Not trying to say the % of unruly fans would then go up, just pointing that out to you, lol.



But how would you suggest the Pistons/Palace front office be punished for what they allowed to spiral out of control? I'm curious what you think should happen to them. 

And the innocent Pacer players are already getting punished btw-their two best players are suspended for a loooong time.


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## jvanbusk (Jun 9, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Doggpound</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You let the law handle the guilty fans, since they are not employees of the NBA. Guilty parties should and will be prosecuted.

You fine the Palace and Pistons organization if the investigation reveals that their security was lax in comparison to the rest of the arenas in the NBA.

Punishing the vast majority of Pistons fans, by making them play in empty arenas or as others have suggested moving games out of the Palace is not the right course of action.

Don't think the innocent fans of Detroit are getting off so easy with this incident either. It's another black eye to the face of Detroit that will stick with this city for a long time. The ridicule that the city now faces, should be punishment enough for the innocent fan.


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## Zalgirinis (Feb 18, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> You fine the Palace and Pistons organization if the investigation reveals that their security was lax in comparison to the rest of the arenas in the NBA.
> 
> Punishing the vast majority of Pistons fans, by making them play in empty arenas or as others have suggested moving games out of the Palace is not the right course of action.


You are putting it wrong. Not the Pistons fans should be punished, but Pistons organisation for failing to secure "peace" (or how to say it) in the arena. In Europe punishment means banning arena for 1, 2 or more games. After it club is interested (right word?) that nothing same would happen. Was it 1/44th of fans or even less, it doesnt make much of the difference, club must be punished.


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## Doggpound (Nov 1, 2002)

Good points, I agree with most of them.

I'm confident this all will balance itself out over time, and the punishments will be handed out for those involved.

My reasoning behind the one-game w/no fans isn't only to punish the Pistons fans that crossed the line. It's more to help fans police themselves (out of fear of hurting their own team) and to deter future incidents like this by making an example out of them (same exact logic Stern used in his harsh punishment of the players involved). 

Teams can get penalized for the actions of their fans. In this case, I feel it's warranted.


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## DaUnbreakableKinG (Jun 28, 2003)

Everyone who thinks pistons fans are classless is him/herself classless. :twocents:


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## PacersguyUSA (Sep 1, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>jvanbusk</b>!
> 
> 
> You guys that want the Pistons to play in an empty arena just don't get it.
> ...


Like Doggpound said, the innocent Pacers are punished by the suspensions of the other Pacers. Of course the Pacers aren't going to win as many games.


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## TheHeff (May 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> Everyone who thinks pistons fans are classless is him/herself classless. :twocents:


 alot of detroit fans have tons of class but me...
As far as I'm concerned when artest came into the stands it was on...he should of never had anything thrown at him granted but once he came to hit some fan I would of rioted too.


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## Joker (Aug 7, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>DaUnbreakableKinG</b>!
> Everyone who thinks pistons fans are classless is him/herself classless. :twocents:


with all honesty, if it was ben wallace being hit by a cup in indiana, and him reacted the way artest did, would you not have said that their crowd is classless for getting in a fight after the whole thing is over?

the fan definitely thought he was invincible and could not be harmed when he threw the beer at artest, or else he's simply mentally retarded... i'm at least glad now fans know they can't be that obnoxious with regards to the players. its a shame this is the price the pacers had to pay for that.

the eastern conference is now a complete joke with only detroit and miami contending...


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