# Lack of effort disgusts Brand



## Weasel (Oct 18, 2003)

http://www.latimes.com/sports/baske...721.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-nba-clippe



> Brand was disgusted with the effort of some teammates, who apparently were unaware the Kings would attempt to win the game.





> "If we don't make the playoffs, I guarantee you we're going to have guys in here next year who are going to fight if we're in this position again," Brand said. "Oh, yeah, definitely. I know that for sure.
> 
> "Management is not going to have this again. We're going to have guys who are going to fight and give that effort. It's not going to be like this again."





> "It's a team," Brand said. "It's more than just one guy. If one person is not giving that effort, somebody has to step up, and we didn't have it. It's just shocking."


I thought this deserved its own thread.


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## clips_r_teh_wieners (Nov 4, 2005)

i just read this article in another forum. and also another poster who said he attended today's game and witnessed, get this - chris kaman joking around. lay that mother****er out elton brand. i think everyone on here would like to see that. this is also a huge step for brand on his path to take his game to the next level. good for him. i hope he consistently takes control of this team next season. no one on this piece of **** team is worth deferring to - except cassell but he's pretty much done


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## RSP83 (Nov 24, 2002)

It's the Cassell curse.

Teams that had him always made it big in his first year, then the team would suck so bad the next year.

- Milwaukee didn't qualify for the playoff after they reached the ECF the previous year (2001)
- Minnesota didn't qualify for the playoff after they reached the WCF the previous year (2004)
- and now you guys might not make it to the playoff this year after a very successful season last year.


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## clips_r_teh_wieners (Nov 4, 2005)

RSP83 said:


> It's the Cassell curse.
> 
> Teams that had him always made it big in his first year, then the team would suck so bad the next year.
> 
> ...


that's pretty ****ing stupid. we wouldn't have made the playoffs last season without cassell's leadership. HE made the clippers good. it's unfortunate that his age finally caught up with him this season, but saying he set the clippers back is ridiculous.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

enough with the masked cursing already.

The guy posted facts. Bottom line. Why do people disregard facts so much? Sure, hes exaggerating when hes calling it a "curse." I doubt he thinks there is a such thing as a "curse." But the bottom line is the second year of a cassel led playoff team lately has not ended well. And its the truth...no one is blaming cassell for tanking or anything, at least not me. But the fact is this team needs a go to superstar player in crunch time to be successful. Last year we were successful without a ray allen or kobe bryant, because cassell was just like those guys in the 4th quarter...a poor mans superstar. This year, hes injured...without that for the whole year, you can see how the team suffered.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

Back on topic...no one knows who brand was referring to. But this is my ideas on it. I think he was referring to a general lack of effort by the perimeter players. If you noticed in the first half, the perimeter players were stinking it up big time. They were not boxing out their guys....the kings were getting the long rebounds on the offensive end, and clippers were letting the ball bounce right by them...then instead of getting in the face of the guy after they lose the rebound at least, they let sactown guards rain 3 pointer after 3 pointer. 

Maggette in the first half turned into the maggette of old, but i cant see how brand could single him specifically out after his nice run in the 3rd quarter. Hart was ok on offense, but perhaps didnt put in the deffensive effort brand would have liked to see. Cassell was pretty much dead out there, no idea why he was let play, but no way can i see brand calling out cassell under any circumstance, unless somethings going on that we dont know about. Thomas stunk it up most of the game, but then came on in the end. Ross played pretty good. Kaman missed a couple shots, but nothing most of the rest of the team didnt do more, Mobley had some brain farts in his game, but i really dont see him singling any one of those guys in particular.

It just "seemed" like there was a general i dont care effort in the first half by the entire back court of the clippers.


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## clips_r_teh_wieners (Nov 4, 2005)

yamaneko said:


> Back on topic...no one knows who brand was referring to. But this is my ideas on it. I think he was referring to a general lack of effort by the perimeter players. If you noticed in the first half, the perimeter players were stinking it up big time. They were not boxing out their guys....the kings were getting the long rebounds on the offensive end, and clippers were letting the ball bounce right by them...then instead of getting in the face of the guy after they lose the rebound at least, they let sactown guards rain 3 pointer after 3 pointer.
> 
> Maggette in the first half turned into the maggette of old, but i cant see how brand could single him specifically out after his nice run in the 3rd quarter. Hart was ok on offense, but perhaps didnt put in the deffensive effort brand would have liked to see. Cassell was pretty much dead out there, no idea why he was let play, but no way can i see brand calling out cassell under any circumstance, unless somethings going on that we dont know about. Thomas stunk it up most of the game, but then came on in the end. Ross played pretty good. Kaman missed a couple shots, but nothing most of the rest of the team didnt do more, Mobley had some brain farts in his game, but i really dont see him singling any one of those guys in particular.
> 
> It just "seemed" like there was a general i dont care effort in the first half by the entire back court of the clippers.


ya make excuses for everyone else to get kaman off the hook. he didn't just miss "some" shots, he missed more than he made.

and perhaps the other players didn't have a good first half, but one thing's for sure: chris kaman was sucking **** the entire game.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

Make excuses for everyone else? By the way, this is your last warning for this cursing tirade that you have been on the last couple of weeks. every now and then if youre going to include some asteriks, the moderators will overlook it but a great number of your recent posts have included very obvious cuss words, that brings down our board. Nothing wrong with putting your opinion, but try to do it in a way that does not include such language.

Back on topic. How was Kaman bad the entire game? Since when is 6 points and 6 rebounds in 21 minutes bad? if youre going to say someone sucked the entire game, why arent you mentioning cassell who played just as many minutes as kaman, yet had zero points and like 3 or 4 assists? Kaman was bad when he made those two jump shots when the rest of the clippers werent doing much? Kaman was bad when he was grabbing those rebounds? Kaman was bad when he only got scored on by his man twice in his 21 minutes? Kaman was no superstar in the game, nor was he dominant. But to say someone who had 6 points and 6 boards in 21 minutes sucked the entire game is quite a stretch. 

And remember, this topic is about effort. And what brand was thinking when he called MULTIPLE people out. Unless brand has a different sense of effort other than hustle, scoring, and rebounding, i stand why my opinion on it...that he was referring to the lack of perimeter boxing out and defense, that led to guards getting offensive rebounds, and then turning around and draining three pointer after three pointer.


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## cadarn (Feb 1, 2006)

yamaneko said:


> Make excuses for everyone else? By the way, this is your last warning for this cursing tirade that you have been on the last couple of weeks. every now and then if youre going to include some asteriks, the moderators will overlook it but a great number of your recent posts have included very obvious cuss words, that brings down our board.


OT: Actually the asterisks are added automatically by the board filter. Seems like something a moderator should know.


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## RSP83 (Nov 24, 2002)

yamaneko said:


> Sure, hes exaggerating when hes calling it a "curse." I doubt he thinks there is a such thing as a "curse."












"of course not, you silly"


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## PAIDNFULL23 (Jul 9, 2005)

yamaneko said:


> Make excuses for everyone else*? By the way, this is your last warning for this cursing tirade that you have been on the last couple of weeks. every now and then if youre going to include some asteriks, the moderators will overlook it but a great number of your recent posts have included very obvious cuss words, that brings down our board. Nothing wrong with putting your opinion, but try to do it in a way that does not include such language.*
> 
> Back on topic. How was Kaman bad the entire game? Since when is 6 points and 6 rebounds in 21 minutes bad? if youre going to say someone sucked the entire game, why arent you mentioning cassell who played just as many minutes as kaman, yet had zero points and like 3 or 4 assists? Kaman was bad when he made those two jump shots when the rest of the clippers werent doing much? Kaman was bad when he was grabbing those rebounds? Kaman was bad when he only got scored on by his man twice in his 21 minutes? Kaman was no superstar in the game, nor was he dominant. But to say someone who had 6 points and 6 boards in 21 minutes sucked the entire game is quite a stretch.
> 
> And remember, this topic is about effort. And what brand was thinking when he called MULTIPLE people out. Unless brand has a different sense of effort other than hustle, scoring, and rebounding, i stand why my opinion on it...that he was referring to the lack of perimeter boxing out and defense, that led to guards getting offensive rebounds, and then turning around and draining three pointer after three pointer.


You are overreacting, he used one curse word in his post and it wasn't directed at you or anyone else on this board. It seems like when someone slightly disagrees with your posts, you take it personal and threat them with your "power" as a moderator. If he was refuting someone else's post using the exact same language, you wouldn't have said anything about it.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

> OT: Actually the asterisks are added automatically by the board filter. Seems like something a moderator should know.


What makes you think i didnt know that? When i say "includes astricks" thats the same thing as saying "includes cuss words" since they are one in the same here on this board as you said. 



> You are overreacting, he used one curse word in his post and it wasn't directed at you or anyone else on this board. It seems like when someone slightly disagrees with your posts, you take it personal and threat them with your "power" as a moderator. If he was refuting someone else's post using the exact same language, you wouldn't have said anything about it.


Look at the other posts recently by him. Profanity laced. Dont tell me what i would and wouldnt do. If i see the same person constantly using profanity, they will be warned and/or edited. Everyone is free to disagree with me in posts, its not like im telling him to stop posting those things, just not to use profanity.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

By the way, if you STILL think im singling him out over others, let me know. Check his recent posts. 4 out of his last 5 posts regardless of who it was directed toward had one or two cases of profanity in it. 

And its been a pattern lately, look at his posts around the hornets game, youll see again multiple offenses. People arent singled out unless they are multiple offenders. I just gave a warning...sometimes if its really bad, moderators will just go and start editing as Qross did in one of the game threads recently where it was a big out of control.

As i said, i personally think profanity at any time is pretty immature and unnecessary. But now and then, you can have a few astricks (for those who dont understand, that means you can have some cuss words that are replaced by astricks), without us having a cow over it. But if you start having 80% of your posts having cuss words, that brings down the quality of the message board.


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## leidout (Jul 13, 2005)

yamaneko said:


> What makes you think i didnt know that? When i say "includes astricks" thats the same thing as saying "includes cuss words" since they are one in the same here on this board as you said.
> 
> Look at the other posts recently by him. Profanity laced. Dont tell me what i would and wouldnt do. If i see the same person constantly using profanity, they will be warned and/or edited. Everyone is free to disagree with me in posts, its not like im telling him to stop posting those things, just not to use profanity.


I cuss all the time in my posts, probably at least 40% of the time, yet you've never moderated or even warned me to my memory. So please don't single out people who you're currently debating with, it also makes you seem really petty to others when we see you using your status here to threaten posters.

PS, Kaman sucks balls.


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## bootstrenf (May 24, 2006)

well, back on topic...


brand's comments might have helped if he said them a few *months* ago...a day late and a dollar short...story of the clippers...


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## bootstrenf (May 24, 2006)

leidout said:


> I cuss all the time in my posts, probably at least 40% of the time, yet you've never moderated or even warned me to my memory. So please don't single out people who you're currently debating with, it also makes you seem really petty to others when we see you using your status here to threaten posters.
> 
> PS, Kaman sucks *donkey* balls.



fixed it for you...


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

> I cuss all the time in my posts, probably at least 40% of the time, yet you've never moderated or even warned me to my memory. So please don't single out people who you're currently debating with, it also makes you seem really petty to others when we see you using your status here to threaten posters.


I havent seen you cuss lately on the board, and certainly not at the rate of 4 out of your last 5 posts having cuss words. The only time ive seen a cuss word in your recent 10 posts or so in my recent memory was the one that you JUST did, AFTER you claimed you cuss 40% of the time...no doubt to try to help your argument as there really wasnt much reason to cuss in there. Start cussing 80% of the time like weiners, and yes you will start to be moderated by any moderator who sees it, i guarantee that.


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## cadarn (Feb 1, 2006)

> Originally Posted by *leidout*
> I cuss all the time in my posts, probably at least 40% of the time, yet you've never moderated or even warned me to my memory. So please don't single out people who you're currently debating with, it also makes you seem really petty to others when we see you using your status here to threaten posters.
> 
> PS, Kaman sucks balls.


:clap: 




> "If we don't make the playoffs, I guarantee you we're going to have guys in here next year who are going to fight if we're in this position again," Brand said. "Oh, yeah, definitely. I know that for sure.
> 
> "Management is not going to have this again. We're going to have guys who are going to fight and give that effort. It's not going to be like this again."


I'm still thinking about exactly what Brand meant here. Is he implying that management wants to get rid of some people, is he saying _he_ won't let this go by without demanding changes to the roster? I almost wish he would single people out.


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## beavertrapper (Oct 29, 2005)

Clipper fans vs Clipper fans??? Everyone is taking out their frustrations out on each other. Imagine what the Clipper locker room was like after the game???
:chill: The Clippers blew it this season since day one. Playing in Russia, extending Kaman's contract, extending Dumblevy's contract, shopping Maggette around, NOT trading Livingston, NOT starting Maggette earlier in the season, and finally raising the ticket prices for NEXT season!!! What a joke!


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## bootstrenf (May 24, 2006)

beavertrapper said:


> Clipper fans vs Clipper fans??? Everyone is taking out their frustrations out on each other. Imagine what the Clipper locker room was like after the game???
> :chill: The Clippers blew it this season since day one. Playing in Russia, extending Kaman's contract, extending Dumblevy's contract, shopping Maggette around, NOT trading Livingston, NOT starting Maggette earlier in the season, and finally raising the ticket prices for NEXT season!!! What a joke!



giving kaman his contract was the worst thing we could've done...with a guaranteed contract worth 50+ million, what incentive does kaman have to improve??? he lost concentration so easily the last few years...making him content was the worst thing we could've done...


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## Free Arsenal (Nov 8, 2004)

I don't think Cassell set us back, I think he was injured and couldn't speak up, in fact, I wouldn't go so far to say we've been set back just yet. The reason for this is because I think Brand is finally getting it, sure he was the work horse, quiet, lead by example type player for so long... but now he's finally getting the idea of a leader, and he learned from Cassell, last season, Cassell got up in Kaman's face when he missed, and scolded Mags when he made a bone head play.

It's obvious some of that has rubbed off on Brand.

We'll have to wait until next season to see if Cassell's influence was good or bad.


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## squeemu (Jan 25, 2006)

I seem to remember many people thinking that the Clippers would suck this year if Kaman wasn't re-signed. Hindsight is 20-20, but you can't blame people now for signing him a year ago. 

I seem to think that nobody is going to be complaining if the Clippers end up getting lucky like the Magic years ago and land the first pick :biggrin:


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## qross1fan (Dec 28, 2004)

RSP83 said:


> It's the Cassell curse.
> 
> Teams that had him always made it big in his first year, then the team would suck so bad the next year.
> 
> ...


This years struggle had nothing to do with Sammy, if anyone one player did caused most of the problems it was Corey and his little :curse:fit early in the season, which caused distractions and killed team chemistry. Sammy has done everything he can, but his age has just caught up with him.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

anyone else LOL when you got the email today about the "exclusive offer for clipper playoff tickets?"


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## squeemu (Jan 25, 2006)

yamaneko said:


> anyone else LOL when you got the email today about the "exclusive offer for clipper playoff tickets?"


I didn't laugh, but I was very shocked that it was sent out, though. I guess it makes sense, because on the off chance they do make the playoffs (there's still technically a decent chance) they want to make sure the games are to a full house.


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## Weasel (Oct 18, 2003)

yamaneko said:


> anyone else LOL when you got the email today about the "exclusive offer for clipper playoff tickets?"


I laughed as well when I got the email. The way things are going the tickets would be worthless, unless there is some miracle (ie Warriors lose, and Clippers win the rest of their games).


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## cadarn (Feb 1, 2006)

squeemu said:


> I seem to remember many people thinking that the Clippers would suck this year if Kaman wasn't re-signed. Hindsight is 20-20, but you can't blame people now for signing him a year ago.


Kaman wasn't exactly playing well when he got the fat contract.


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## yamaneko (Jan 1, 2003)

But too, lets remember, that contract or not, kaman was signed for this year....


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## bootstrenf (May 24, 2006)

squeemu said:


> I seem to remember many people thinking that the Clippers would suck this year if Kaman wasn't re-signed. Hindsight is 20-20, but you can't blame people now for signing him a year ago.
> 
> I seem to think that nobody is going to be complaining if the Clippers end up getting lucky like the Magic years ago and land the first pick :biggrin:



if anyone remembers, i never was happy with the contract that kaman got...i never was a big kaman supporter...


and about the lucky lottery....my worst fear is for us to land the first pick, then we pick someone like spencer hawes with our pick because he fits dunleavy's "style"...dunleavy can't be *that* stupid, right????


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## squeemu (Jan 25, 2006)

bootstrenf
and about the lucky lottery....my worst fear is for us to land the first pick said:


> that[/b] stupid, right????


The Clippers have basically always sucked at drafting, but they have pulled off some great trades. Maybe they'll make a good trade again this time? Or perhaps they'll actually draft someone worthwhile. A man can dream :yay:


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## bootstrenf (May 24, 2006)

squeemu said:


> The Clippers have basically always sucked at drafting, but they have pulled off some great trades. Maybe they'll make a good trade again this time? Or perhaps they'll actually draft someone worthwhile. A man can dream :yay:



give me conley or law and i would be happy...give me someone like thaddeus and i wouldn't be happy, but i wouldn't be terribly dissappointed either...all i want, is for us to *not* take a slow, unathletic, high b-ball iq player with a low ceiling...

no kamans or korolevs...for love of sweet baby jesus, let's draft an athletic player...


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## Darth Bryant (Feb 1, 2005)

The problem with this roster is it's set in stone. At least some of the problem areas. Kaman isn't going anywhere... I mean centers are hard to come by, but he hasn't been playing very well and there is no other team I can see taking on his new contract and giving back something work having in return.

Sam is Sam. He is aging, and we all knew there was a risk of this happening when you sign him. It happened. He got hurt. The backup got hurt as well. So theres nothing you can do about that? Livingston isn't going anywhere. They wont trade him because no one will want him now because of the injury, and now you have a hole at PG to fill. Hart has been playing excellent basketball. I mean I'm impressed, but could be start next season? I don't know.

Mobley has been playing solid, but not living up to his paycheck.

And Corey... With Mike D. desperate to unload him.. Will this change after he reminded all of us fans just how important a Corey/Brand combo is to the Clippers?

Theres a dark cloud over the Clippers right now, with no clear answers. But I just don't know what solutions you could do without unloading a couple contracts that I don't see any other teams wanting.


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## joe shmoe (Dec 16, 2005)

bootstrenf said:


> give me conley or law and i would be happy...give me someone like thaddeus and i wouldn't be happy, but i wouldn't be terribly dissappointed either...all i want, is for us to *not* take a slow, unathletic, high b-ball iq player with a low ceiling...
> 
> no kamans or korolevs...for love of sweet baby jesus, let's draft an athletic player...



elgin should decide on who to pick, keep dunleavy outta the picture please!:worthy:


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