# Wade is the 2nd best rookie this year



## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

Wade is killing people---he gets no attention b/c they don't put the heat on national TV--even as one of the hottest teams in the league right now, we get no respect.

Wade embarassed Melo last night. He's shut down Marbury 2-3 times this year. He's put up sick dunks and showed his game in the Rookie-Soph game. 

But does he get the attention like Melo and LeBron? Nope. Everyone is sleeping on DWade...this kid is amazing and could eventually be a superstar. Wade should be named right there with the other guys for ROY, but without media hype every night and national TV exposure, he gets left out....


sad......


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## kcchiefs-fan (Oct 28, 2002)

Completely agree. I was skeptical at season's beginning, but I've been saying he's ahead of Melo for months now. He does it all, and he's shooting a great percentage. If he adds a little range to his jumper, watch out, this kid could be special.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

Melo and Lebron are ahead of Wade for obvious reasons, but Wade is a very good player. I dont think he'll ever be able to be a franchise player though.


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## VincentVega (Oct 12, 2003)

Agreed as well. I'm a HUGE fan of his. Have been since I first saw him at Marquette. He's a stud and a future star (maybe superstar).

Don't worry -- he'll get his props in due time. And then everyone and their dog will be on his bandwagon, and you can tell them to go to hell and pick another player. :grinning:


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## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

actually i thought wade would be ROY before the season started

but i was wrong
and while his numbers are what i expected
from the few times i've seen him play he is not that great
but i could be wrong
i think i saw the heat only 3 times


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## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

Anthony
19.7 ppg
6.20 rpg
2.8 apg
1.28 spg
.63 bpg
.423 fg%
Eff- +16.54

Wade
17.1 ppg
4.30 rpg
4.3 apg
1.28 spg
.69 bpg
.483 fg%
Eff- +16.18

extremely close #'s.... i dont see one obviously over another. Wade 48% shooting is what sets Wade apart...out of all starting nba guards(both pg and sg), this is the 2nd highest percentage in the league, which is truly amazing. Wade also has the better defense......


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## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

Which one of the big two has he displaced? Part of it is that L&C are 19, and Wade is 22. Where will Lebron and Carmelo be 3 years from now?

However, I do agree with you.. Wade (and subsequently Miami) is on a tear lately, but isn't getting much recognition. Here's to D-Dubya. :cheers:


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## JNice (Jul 13, 2002)

He's not getting recognition because he isn't getting the network exposure, but I think everyone knows he is playing well. I certainly don't think he has surpassed Lebron or Carmelo at this point, but he is certainly right behind them.


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## R-Star (Jun 13, 2002)

Hes not playing any better than LeBron or Melo, but like J said, hes right behind them. I think he'll have a quality career.


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## tpb2 (Oct 23, 2003)

Wade would win ROY many other years. He got my attention. 

I think the main reason Wade is not getting the media attention is because he has much more experience under his belt, and from what I've seen and heard, less potential. But your question is not dealing with the future it's about who is better this year. Still, Wade is very close to Anthony, but he's not quite there in the stats category.


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## hobojoe (Jun 20, 2003)

I'd say at this point, he's distanced himself from Hinrich and Bosh, but still remains on a level all by himself, in terms of rookies, a notch below LeBron and Carmelo.


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## Idunkonyou (Feb 23, 2003)

I think Lebron and Melo are better right now, with Wade and Bosh right behind them. 

All of these guys will be franchise players.


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

I think Lebron is on another level, with Wade and Carmelo a notch below him. If Wade had not been injured this year everyone would be saying he is as good as Melo. Wade is going to be better than Melo. I doubt you heard it hear first, but that's my hunch.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Sovereignz</b>!
> Which one of the big two has he displaced? Part of it is that L&C are 19, and Wade is 22. Where will Lebron and Carmelo be 3 years from now?


This is exactly the issue. Even if Wade were putting up identically good numbers to James or 'Melo (and he's not), he would and should still be behind them, in terms of impact, due to the fact that similar performance at a younger age is more impressive and points to greater heights.



> However, I do agree with you.. Wade (and subsequently Miami) is on a tear lately, but isn't getting much recognition. Here's to D-Dubya. :cheers:


Is Wade really getting little recognition? People keep talking about how great a draft this is, primarily due to Wade playing like a star behind the two phenoms. Maybe among casual NBA fans, he doesn't get much pub...but among the fans on this board, he gets talked about a lot.

I think the idea that he's being ignored is out there only because some Miami fans keep insisting that that's the case just because he doesn't get discussed *as* much as James and 'Melo.

But he shouldn't be discussed *as* much. He's "merely" a great rookie talent. The other two are two of the biggest prospects to hit the NBA in a number of years. Wade should be discussed a fair amount, and is, but James and 'Melo should be talked about more...and are.

In my opinion, anyway.


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## compsciguy78 (Dec 16, 2002)

I'm not so sure about that Minstrel. I think Wade is better than people were giving him credit for early on. I think Melo is more hyped than he deserves. These are just my 2 cents of course...

I believe Wade can be better than Melo...

but I doubt either of them can be better than Lebron...


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## VincentVega (Oct 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>compsciguy78</b>!
> I'm not so sure about that Minstrel. I think Wade is better than people were giving him credit for early on. I think Melo is more hyped than he deserves. These are just my 2 cents of course...
> 
> I believe Wade can be better than Melo...
> ...


Agreed.


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## KokoTheMonkey (Aug 4, 2003)

When you compare their numbers, Carmelo has the advantage. Plus, when you add their respective team's records into the equation, Anthony is still favorable over Wade. I love Wade as a player, and I really don't like Carmelo too much, but statistics certainly aren't in Wade's favor.


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## Damian Necronamous (Jun 10, 2002)

He certainly is underrated and not discussed nearly enough by the media. I wouldn't say he is the 2nd best, but he is miles ahead of the other rookies (besides LBJ and Melo, of course). He's also a lot better than many PGs in the league.

I'd say he's around top 50 in the league right now.

I'd say these are the top 50 players (not in order)...

Shaquille O'Neal, Kobe Bryant, Kevin Garnett, Tim Duncan, Tracy McGrady, Jason Kidd, Dirk Nowitzki, Peja Stojakovic, Sam Cassell, Baron Davis, Allen Iverson, Vince Carter, Jermaine O'Neal, Ron Artest, Ray Allen, Andrei Kirilenko, Paul Pierce, Michael Redd, Kenyon Martin, Steve Francis, Yao Ming, Chris Webber, Brad Miller, Pau Gasol, Ben Wallace, LeBron James, Carmelo Anthony, Stephon Marbury, Lamar Odom, Eddie Jones, Gary Payton, Antoine Walker, Steve Nash, Michael Finley, Karl Malone, Shawn Marion, Amare Stoudemire, Latrell Sprewell, Mike Bibby, *Dwyane Wade*, Jamaal Magloire, Jamal Mashburn, Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Zach Randolph, Elton Brand, Corey Maggette, Rasheed Wallace, Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Gilbert Arenas, Jerry Stackhouse


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## reHEATed (Jun 29, 2003)

how do the statistics favor melo greatly.....melo scores a couple more points a game and grabs a couple more rebounds. Wade shoots a much better percentage, gets more assists, gets more blocks, same in steals and efficiency is in Melo's favor, but are almost identical....Stats might be a little in Melo's favor, but defintly not much


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>compsciguy78</b>!
> I'm not so sure about that Minstrel. I think Wade is better than people were giving him credit for early on. I think Melo is more hyped than he deserves. These are just my 2 cents of course...
> 
> I believe Wade can be better than Melo...


Okay...I could see that happening. But I think 'Melo having slightly superior numbers *and* being 3 years younger gives 'Melo quite an edge.


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## tpb2 (Oct 23, 2003)

One more thing...

I think there's something to be said about the number of games Melo has played compared to Wade. I know it's about averages, but total statistical contribution to the team for the season goes to Anthony by far. Anthony was able to help in a much greater percentage of his team's games than Wade. Since Wade did miss a good number of games, I would say this is safe to assume.


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## tpb2 (Oct 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> 
> 
> Okay...I could see that happening. But I think 'Melo having slightly superior numbers *and* being 3 years younger gives 'Melo quite an edge.


....and having much less college experience and learning.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>tpb2</b>!
> One more thing...
> 
> I think there's something to be said about the number of games Melo has played compared to Wade. I know it's about averages, but total statistical contribution to the team for the season goes to Anthony by far. Anthony was able to help in a much greater percentage of his team's games than Wade. Since Wade did miss a good number of games, I would say this is safe to assume.


Yup, playing time matters in terms of value. Averages (modified for certain factors, age among them), over a significant sample size, point to talent level.

If two players put up the same per-game averages, but one played more games than the other, he was the more valuable player for that season.


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## Nevus (Jun 3, 2003)

> I think Lebron is on another level, with Wade and Carmelo a notch below him. If Wade had not been injured this year everyone would be saying he is as good as Melo. Wade is going to be better than Melo. I doubt you heard it hear first, but that's my hunch.





> I'm not so sure about that Minstrel. I think Wade is better than people were giving him credit for early on. I think Melo is more hyped than he deserves. These are just my 2 cents of course...
> 
> I believe Wade can be better than Melo...
> 
> but I doubt either of them can be better than Lebron...


I agree completely with all of this... I think Wade and Carmelo are on the same level right now, although Wade's efficiency is really striking. I think LeBron is on a level all of his own among rookies... he's already three quarters up the ladder to the top of the league already. That guy is a fast climber.

Carmelo is a great rookie and a very good player, and he deserves attention, but I think he does get more hype than he merits on his own skills... I think it's unquestionable that he benefits from being associated with LeBron, that the media is really attached to the idea of them being equivalent. I read in SLAM magazine the other day, where they were talking about LeBron and Carmelo not making the All-Stars, and they said something like "LeBron, on some nights, is the best player in his conference. You can say the same for Carmelo too." Sorry, but, no you can't. Not with Duncan and Garnett around. That's just hype out of control there  Neither LeBron or Carmelo or anybody else is as good as Duncan or KG on any night this season.

The bottom line is that the rookies this year are really good... however you rank them, it's a deep class. But I think it's going to take some time to see if any of them are franchise players other than LeBron. I'm not sold yet that Carmelo is one; I want to see that he's more than another scoring, rebounding small forward. And just making the playoffs doesn't make you a franchise player.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>wadecaroneddie</b>!
> how do the statistics favor melo greatly.....melo scores a couple more points a game and grabs a couple more rebounds. Wade shoots a much better percentage, gets more assists, gets more blocks, same in steals and efficiency is in Melo's favor, but are almost identical....Stats might be a little in Melo's favor, but defintly not much


For a winning team though. Melo is out in the west doing his damage there...while Lebron, Bosh, Wade, Hinrich, Ford are all in the east playing for teams that arent even as good record-wise as the Nuggets despite the fact their schedule is much easier.


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## tpb2 (Oct 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> For a winning team though. Melo is out in the west doing his damage there...while Lebron, Bosh, Wade, Hinrich, Ford are all in the east playing for teams that arent even as good record-wise as the Nuggets despite the fact their schedule is much easier.


W-L is not an individual stat


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>tpb2</b>!
> W-L is not an individual stat


so a high school player averages 30 points a game, that means he can do it in the pros too with the same percentage? Carmelo plays twice as many powerful western teams with elite shotblockers and big guys. Melo plays Shaq, Duncan, KG, Ming, etc twice as much. Competition MATTERS.


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## tpb2 (Oct 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> so a high school player averages 30 points a game, that means he can do it in the pros too with the same percentage? Carmelo plays twice as many powerful western teams with elite shotblockers and big guys. Melo plays Shaq, Duncan, KG, Ming, etc twice as much. Competition MATTERS.


Competition may matter. That's another issue. If the Nuggets were in last place in the West, and Melo had the same stats/peformances, he would still be facing tougher competition, and that is a valid point. 

The number one problem in the media is their failure to grasp the difference between player and team comparrisons. Comparing W-L is giving way too much credit (or discredit) to one player. There are so many variables involved in team play. Even a top player can be great at helping a team win, but he can only contribute so much to that win. You have to have the right combinations, talent level, and experience. KG has not changed that much, yet his team's performace has change a great deal. W-L is an attractive stat. People love to have the "winning is all that matters" attitude. It is all that matters for a team, not for comparing individual contribution (Team W-L would be the sum of individual contribution). You are counting so may things out of a player's control toward their individual comparrisons. This is the basis behind the study of statistics; isolating variables from others as best as one can. This has produced the most accurate results over years and years.


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## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> For a winning team though. Melo is out in the west doing his damage there...while Lebron, Bosh, Wade, Hinrich, Ford are all in the east playing for teams that arent even as good record-wise as the Nuggets despite the fact their schedule is much easier.


Its funny that u conveniently forgot to mention that Melo has BY FAR the best supporting cast out of all the rooks u just mentioned!!!

Do to injuries Wade has rotated between 2nd and 3rd scoring option and hes still putting up 17.1pts 4.3reb 4.3ast and 1.28stl!!!
If Wade had been our #1 scoring option from day one there is no question that he would be putting up 20+ppg!!!


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>tpb2</b>!
> Competition may matter. That's another issue. If the Nuggets were in last place in the West, and Melo had the same stats/peformances, he would still be facing tougher competition, and that is a valid point.
> 
> The number one problem in the media is their failure to grasp the difference between player and team comparrisons. Comparing W-L is giving way too much credit (or discredit) to one player. There are so many variables involved in team play. Even a top player can be great at helping a team win, but he can only contribute so much to that win. You have to have the right combinations, talent level, and experience. KG has not changed that much, yet his team's performace has change a great deal. W-L is an attractive stat. People love to have the "winning is all that matters" attitude. It is all that matters for a team, not for comparing individual contribution (Team W-L would be the sum of individual contribution). You are counting so may things out of a player's control toward their individual comparrisons. This is the basis behind the study of statistics; isolating variables from others as best as one can. This has produced the most accurate results over years and years.


Agree, but winning does matter. Some players have trouble being a part of winning teams because of the way they play. A guy like Stephon Marbury, who has to have the ball in his hands to be effective. He has to be the franchise player on any team hes on, yet hes not good enough to ever lead a team to a title. I think Wade is the same way, hes not someone you can build around. Thats why I'd rather have Hinrich than Wade, even though Wade is the better player. Hinrich fits perfect as a roleplayer, knows hes just that, and brings a gritty Joe Dumars type toughness to the game. Wade plays like a franchise player, but will never be a good enough player to actually be a franchise player on a contending team.


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Nevus</b>!
> 
> 
> Carmelo is a great rookie and a very good player, and he deserves attention, but I think he does get more hype than he merits on his own skills... I think it's unquestionable that he benefits from being associated with LeBron, that the media is really attached to the idea of them being equivalent.


Your making it sound as if the media hyped up Melo so that they can have a Bird for Lebron.

I think Melo earned his hype, by becoming the first freshmen to lead his team to the title. Melo's past accomplishments have led to his hype, not the media looking for someone to compete against Bron.

Whether Melo's skills project in the NBA is irrelevant, he created his hype not Lebron.


As for Melo vs Wade. I think it's basically even this year, Wade is one heck of a player. But with the 3 years grace for Melo, he is the better prospect IMO.


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## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

> Wade plays like a franchise player, but will never be a good enough player to actually be a franchise player on a contending team.


set down the magic 8 ball and walk away!!!


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

I agree. Melo has earned whatever attention he's getting. He earned that national championship.

His stats this month are great. I think behind Tmac and Kobe, he's third in scoring.

not to knock Wade but he's a little behind Melo right now. Let's just blame the media for matching Melo vs. Bron. Wade deserves as much hoopla since he took his team to the final four sorry but there's not much room for a 3 person rivalry.

Let's just call Wade the best kept rookie secret.


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## VincentVega (Oct 12, 2003)

I think it's a given that the LeBron craze and subsequent search for what can essentially be described as a running mate or sparring partner for King James has benefitted Carmelo's image and cultivated his hype.

Carmelo was an incredible college player and is a star at the pro level. This is obvious. But his being mentioned in nearly every sentence or media clip alongside LeBron is simply not warranted in light of the talent levels and (deserved) merits of each player on an objective level.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>HEATLUNATIC</b>!
> set down the magic 8 ball and walk away!!!


When was the last guy 6'5 or under to lead a team to a title? Now ask yourself, can Wade even be mentioned in the same breathe as that guy? I cant even think of one in recent history. Jordan was 6'6, Magic was 6'9, the rest have been big men.


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## VincentVega (Oct 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> 
> 
> Okay...I could see that happening. But I think 'Melo having slightly superior numbers *and* being 3 years younger gives 'Melo quite an edge.


Although short for the SG/combo spot, Wade has a vastly superior body type and athleticism. Carmelo has the height and bulk...but he won't have even the average athleticism he has now at age 30. Then again, Larry Bird didn't either.......

There are many angles for this debate, but athleticism is a key issue IMO. And Wade clearly owns this one.


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## VincentVega (Oct 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> For a winning team though. Melo is out in the west doing his damage there...while Lebron, Bosh, Wade, Hinrich, Ford are all in the east playing for teams that arent even as good record-wise as the Nuggets despite the fact their schedule is much easier.


What if LeBron, Wade, Hinrich and Ford played in the West, where the guards are not nearly as good as the guards in the East?


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

As far as Melo being overhyped, who was the last 19 year old to average 20 points a game for a team that actually has a purpose and is in the playoff race. I cant think of any really.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>VincentVega</b>!
> What if LeBron, Wade, Hinrich and Ford played in the West, where the guards are not nearly as good as the guards in the East?


Besides Hinrich, the other three rely on getting to the basket. They havent developed a reliable jumpshot and that would really bother them because its much harder to finish in the lane against most west teams than against east teams.


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## tpb2 (Oct 23, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> Agree, but winning does matter. Some players have trouble being a part of winning teams because of the way they play. A guy like Stephon Marbury, who has to have the ball in his hands to be effective. He has to be the franchise player on any team hes on, yet hes not good enough to ever lead a team to a title. I think Wade is the same way, hes not someone you can build around. Thats why I'd rather have Hinrich than Wade, even though Wade is the better player. Hinrich fits perfect as a roleplayer, knows hes just that, and brings a gritty Joe Dumars type toughness to the game. Wade plays like a franchise player, but will never be a good enough player to actually be a franchise player on a contending team.


Winning doesnt matter for individual comparrison. Theoretically, the true best player in the game could never win a game. So there is only a small correlation but no cause-effect. I know, this is very hard to grasp because the little voice inside of you is attracted to wins and the media.

And your example is no different. Wade, as you said, would be playing out of his role to the point where his individual contribution is not as great compared to if he took a different role. Do you see what I mean? The individual contribution is more than stats. It's everything a player does to help a team win. There is no stat for this (although some are attempting to come close), but W-L certainly would never be considered a top 25 individual stat (there are many outside the media) by a professional that looks at this stuff for their career.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>tpb2</b>!
> Winning doesnt matter for individual comparrison. Theoretically, the true best player in the game could never win a game. So there is only a small correlation but no cause-effect. I know, this is very hard to grasp because the little voice inside of you is attracted to wins and the media.
> 
> And your example is no different. Wade, as you said, would be playing out of his role to the point where his individual contribution is not as great compared to if he took a different role. Do you see what I mean? The individual contribution is more than stats. It's everything a player does to help a team win. There is no stat for this (although some are attempting to come close), but W-L certainly would never be considered a top 25 individual stat (there are many outside the media) by a professional that looks at this stuff for their career.


Attracted to wins and the media? The media praises players who play for non-playoff teams in the eastern conference. I am attracted to team basketball, defense, and winning yes. The media does very little to influence that considering they hype up good players on bad teams. 

MY point is that Wade would be a roleplayer for a contending team, not a franchise player. Will Wade ever be as dominant of a player as KG? TD? Shaq? No. Those players win titles, Wade will play a 2nd option on a contending team, or end up being the franchise player on a bottom feeding team.


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## kcchiefs-fan (Oct 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> 
> 
> Your making it sound as if the media hyped up Melo so that they can have a Bird for Lebron.
> ...


Granted Melo did accomplish a lot, but you're looking at things from a very ignorant perspective if you don't think he's benefitted by having Lebron come out in the same draft. The media IS hyping him up so they can have another Bird/Magic.


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## kcchiefs-fan (Oct 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> Attracted to wins and the media? The media praises players who play for non-playoff teams in the eastern conference. I am attracted to team basketball, defense, and winning yes. The media does very little to influence that considering they hype up good players on bad teams.
> ...


Are you saying Melo will be as dominant as KG, TD, or Shaq? The proposed statement was that Wade is better than Melo, not that Wade will become that best player in the league.


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## tpb2 (Oct 23, 2003)

> I am attracted to *team basketball*, defense, and *winning* yes.


Exactly. 

Quite different from individual isolation.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> When was the last guy 6'5 or under to lead a team to a title? Now ask yourself, can Wade even be mentioned in the same breathe as that guy? I cant even think of one in recent history. Jordan was 6'6, Magic was 6'9, the rest have been big men.


I can think of one. Isaiah Thomas.

Like Wade, Thomas was an athletic, scoring point guard.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> I can think of one. Isaiah Thomas.
> 
> Like Wade, Thomas was an athletic, scoring point guard.





> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> Now ask yourself, can Wade even be mentioned in the same breathe as that guy?


I dont think so.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> I dont think so.


Don't you think you're being inconsistant? When it comes to James, it's way too early to say where his career will go, according to you.

When it comes to Wade, it's obviously clear he'll never compare to someone like Isaiah Thomas.

I think you're dismissing Wade out of hand for some odd reason. Is it likely that he'll be comparable to a Hall of Famer? No, it's not likely for almost any player, but there's no particular reason to dismiss Wade before his rookie season is even done.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> Don't you think you're being inconsistant? When it comes to James, it's way too early to say where his career will go, according to you.
> 
> When it comes to Wade, it's obviously clear he'll never compare to someone like Isaiah Thomas.
> ...


Actually I think I'm being consistent in both cases. I'm not willing to just hand them comparisons to MJ or Thomas when they are obviously not even close to that point yet. 

I guess I'm not like most posters on this board, it seems if you think rookies being compared to all time greats is way premature, then you're dismissing them. I like Wade and Lebron a lot, but they are not even better than quite a few players in the league at their own position. Lebron gets the comparisons because of his age, and what he could be. I'd rather compare rookies to the next step up, and not the highest rung on the ladder. Thats setting expectations too high. Lebron should be getting comparisons to Tmac/Kobe who are obviously both a lot better than Lebron still. Wade should be getting comparisons to Iverson and other shorter players who have had success leading a team. Just understand the odds of leading a team to a title being a small guy, the fact theres only one guy whos done it in the last 15 years should show that Wade will have to be spectacular to get it done. Sorry if I dont think he will be THAT good.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> I guess I'm not like most posters on this board, it seems if you think rookies being compared to all time greats is way premature, then you're dismissing them.


No, you're dismissing Wade by claiming he can't ever be that type of player. I hope you're not saying he's not as good as a prime Thomas *now*, because that's so obvious as to not be meaningful. Thomas was no prime Thomas in his rookie season.

Nobody's saying Wade *is* Isaiah Thomas. But you're being dismissive if you claim there's *no* way he can reach that level, when he's only in his rookie season.

Don't drop back into the sarcastic position of, "Sorry if I don't claim he's the greatest player ever, guess I'm a hater." That's not what I'm saying at all, and I've never said such a thing.

But dismissing a very talented player's chances to be great *entirely* is also silly.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> No, you're dismissing Wade by claiming he can't ever be that type of player. I hope you're not saying he's not as good as a prime Thomas *now*, because that's so obvious as to not be meaningful. Thomas was no prime Thomas in his rookie season.
> 
> Nobody's saying Wade *is* Isaiah Thomas. But you're being dismissive if you claim there's *no* way he can reach that level, when he's only in his rookie season.
> ...


Of course Wade CAN be great, anybody can do anything with the right focus. Its whether or not they do it. I simply stated my opinion on what I think he will end up being, and people started looking at me sideways for it.


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## Derrex (Jul 21, 2002)

In my mind, wade and carmello are about the same level right now. Lebron is on a level by himself. Coming out of college, Dwayne Wade was definitely underhyped even though he carried his team to the final four with all the facets of his game. Carmello got a lot of hype and has lived up to it minus the ugly shooting percentage. James had a lot of unearned hype entering the nba but has proven to be worth every bit of it. Right now, I believe the rookie of the year is LeBron James. He has simply done so much not only on the court, but also for the league. Instead of getting mired in numbers, I'll say that LeBron James has had the most impact. Wade, without his injuries, would have gotten second, but this will go to Carmello. Wade needs to stay healthy.


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## RoddneyThaRippa (Jun 28, 2003)

Wade embarrassed Carmelo last night. Why? Because he has an all-round game that Carmelo doesn't desire to have. Lebron can do everything in all facets of the game. Carmelo really doesn't play much defense and doesn't hit the boards as hard as he could. Wade does these things and then some. Lebron is obviously the top dog but I see Wade doing things that Carmelo just doesn't do.


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## Jesus of CopyMat (Feb 14, 2004)

Call me crazy, but I think Anthony's been better than James.


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## Cap (Nov 5, 2003)

> Wade is the 2nd best rookie this year


No, Melo will likely end up being a better player, and has had a better year than Wade this season anyway. He will end up 2nd in Rookie voting.


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## MiamiHeat03 (Mar 28, 2003)

In my opinion i think that Wade is better than Melo.
but both are different players.Wade is a Guard and Melo is a Forward.
But in the end it will be Melo for 2nd rookie voting, it could have been Wade if he would have had stayed healthy.


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## The OUTLAW (Jun 13, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> Besides Hinrich, the other three rely on getting to the basket. They havent developed a reliable jumpshot and that would really bother them because its much harder to finish in the lane against most west teams than against east teams.


I think that this is a bit of a wash. While the west has better power forwards/centers the east for the most part plays better defense.


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## JerryWest (Jun 24, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> Agree, but winning does matter. Some players have trouble being a part of winning teams because of the way they play. A guy like Stephon Marbury, who has to have the ball in his hands to be effective. He has to be the franchise player on any team hes on, yet hes not good enough to ever lead a team to a title. I think Wade is the same way, hes not someone you can build around. Thats why I'd rather have Hinrich than Wade, even though Wade is the better player. Hinrich fits perfect as a roleplayer, knows hes just that, and brings a gritty Joe Dumars type toughness to the game. Wade plays like a franchise player, but will never be a good enough player to actually be a franchise player on a contending team.


You post makes no sense. Hinrich isn't exactly helping the Bulls win at all. He's a notch below in terms of defending and on the offensive end. A good player, but your pushing it.

Maybe its a defense mechanism because you don't want Wade compared to Melo 

I think wade is doing better then carmelo this yr. No one notes the addition of miller and camby on the nuggets, and seem to think melo is carrying the team to the top by his prescence alone.


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## VincentVega (Oct 12, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>KennethTo</b>!
> 
> 
> You post makes no sense. Hinrich isn't exactly helping the Bulls win at all.


Besides being quoted by Skiles as being the best player on the team, here's some numbers to ponder:
http://www.82games.com/0304CHI.HTM
http://www.82games.com/rolandratings0304.htm (#27; usually in the top 20)



> He's a notch below in terms of defending and on the offensive end.


Hinrich has already had multiple coaches say he's already one of the best defensive guards in the entire league, as well as several articles written expressly about his D. Not to say Wade isn't a great defender himself...but I don't think he's any better than Hinrich. Also, Hinrich has better range than Wade, but Wade is the superior scorer overall. Wade's slashing is absolutely beautiful to watch. 



> I think wade is doing better then carmelo this yr. No one notes the addition of miller and camby on the nuggets, and seem to think melo is carrying the team to the top by his prescence alone.


I agree. I love watching Wade play. He's a great mix of exciting athleticism/big plays and smart fundamentals. And he's just going to get better.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>KennethTo</b>!
> You post makes no sense. Hinrich isn't exactly helping the Bulls win at all. He's a notch below in terms of defending and on the offensive end. A good player, but your pushing it.


Look @ Vincents post, he explained it nice. Hinrichs defense is better than Wades, and so is his outside shot. 



> Originally posted by <b>KennethTo</b>!
> Maybe its a defense mechanism because you don't want Wade compared to Melo


The same defense mechanism you're using when Wade is compared to Hinrich. Wade is better than Hinrich, but Melo is better than Wade, quite easily. 



> Originally posted by <b>KennethTo</b>!
> I think wade is doing better then carmelo this yr. No one notes the addition of miller and camby on the nuggets, and seem to think melo is carrying the team to the top by his prescence alone.


I dont think anyone said hes carrying the Nuggets alone, but he is carrying them. He is their go to guy, and their franchise player. Melo is putting up better stats, on a better team. Heat have some talent too, Odom and Jones are very good players.


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## HEATLUNATIC (May 27, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> When was the last guy 6'5 or under to lead a team to a title? Now ask yourself, can Wade even be mentioned in the same breathe as that guy? I cant even think of one in recent history. Jordan was 6'6, Magic was 6'9, the rest have been big men.


In the last 15 years 4 players under 6'5 have taken their team to the ship and those players are Zeke,Payton,AI and Kidd!!!The only one that got the job done was Zeke,but being small guards isnt why they lost!!!They all lost to the best players in the league at the time aka M.J.,Shaq and Duncan!!!

Wade has the talent and potential to be as good as the 4 mentioned above!!!Hes not there yet but hes got the ceiling to get there!!!


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>HEATLUNATIC</b>!
> In the last 15 years 4 players under 6'5 have taken their team to the ship and those players are Zeke,Payton,AI and Kidd!!!The only one that got the job done was Zeke,but being small guards isnt why they lost!!!They all lost to the best players in the league at the time aka M.J.,Shaq and Duncan!!!
> 
> Wade has the talent and potential to be as good as the 4 mentioned above!!!Hes not there yet but hes got the ceiling to get there!!!


AI is really the best comparison, I would say Payton but Wade doesnt have the point guard skills that Payton does. Wade is more of an undersized 2 guard. I dont think Wade will ever get to that level of those 4 guys, but we'll see I guess. Its obviously possible. 

Also, thats my point on the last line you said. They lost to Jordan whos 6'6, and the greatest player ever...and they lost to Shaq and Duncan who are 7 footers. Its extremely hard to do it as a small guy.


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## kcchiefs-fan (Oct 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> AI is really the best comparison, I would say Payton but Wade doesnt have the point guard skills that Payton does. Wade is more of an undersized 2 guard. I dont think Wade will ever get to that level of those 4 guys, but we'll see I guess. Its obviously possible.
> ...


You're acting as if he's a cancer that will refuse to play alongside another star. Jordan didn't win until he got Pippen and a ton of surrounding talent, Shaq didn't win until he got Kobe and the right fit of supp. players around him............very few people can make an honest claim at being the sole reason a championship was won. 

What have you seem of him that gives you the idea he has to be "the man" on a team and won't play with another all-star in the low post? Wade is immensely talented and I think he'll end up better than Melo, but neither guy has a lick of a chance at a ring by themself. I doubt either will have trouble sharing the ball if they got another elite player to help catapult them to greatness, though.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>kcchiefs-fan</b>!
> You're acting as if he's a cancer that will refuse to play alongside another star. Jordan didn't win until he got Pippen and a ton of surrounding talent, Shaq didn't win until he got Kobe and the right fit of supp. players around him............very few people can make an honest claim at being the sole reason a championship was won.
> 
> What have you seem of him that gives you the idea he has to be "the man" on a team and won't play with another all-star in the low post? Wade is immensely talented and I think he'll end up better than Melo, but neither guy has a lick of a chance at a ring by themself. I doubt either will have trouble sharing the ball if they got another elite player to help catapult them to greatness, though.


If you read my previous posts, you'll see that I stated more than once that I think Wade would be the perfect 2nd option, a good Scottie Pippen to a Michael Jordan.

Its everyone else stating they think he'll be a superstar franchise player, and I'm not seeing that out of Wade.


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## kcchiefs-fan (Oct 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> If you read my previous posts, you'll see that I stated more than once that I think Wade would be the perfect 2nd option, a good Scottie Pippen to a Michael Jordan.
> ...


Previously you said you'd rather have Hinrich than Wade, despite admitting that Wade is better, because Hinrich fits the mold of a roleplayer perfectly whereas Wade wants to be a franchise player. First of all, you can be a franchise player and still have another stud helping you along the way. It all depends on your definitely of franchise player. 

Basically, I think Wade has the talent to be the best player on a team that can win a championship..........I'm not nearly as convinced in regards to Melo.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>kcchiefs-fan</b>!
> Basically, I think Wade has the talent to be the best player on a team that can win a championship..........I'm not nearly as convinced in regards to Melo.


I dont think Wade will be that good. He is not even the best player on the heat right now. Him and Odom both average 17 pts, 4 asts, but Odom averages 6 more rebounds a game and has been the go to guy in the games I've seen from them. 

Wade isnt even the leader of a an 8th seedin the eastern conference at the age of 22, and hes going to develop into a better leader than a guy whos 19 and IS the leader and go to guy of a playoff team in the WEST? Carmelos been a winner at every level. Hell, by the time Carmelos 22 he might have the Nuggets in a contender spot.


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## -33- (Aug 6, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> I dont think Wade will be that good. He is not even the best player on the heat right now. Him and Odom both average 17 pts, 4 asts, but Odom averages 6 more rebounds a game and has been the go to guy in the games I've seen from them.
> ...


Melo gets WAY WAY WAY (an understatement still) TOO MUCH CREDIT for the Nuggets turnaround


ANDRE MILLER anyone? adding a top 5 PG made no difference right?

NENE has improved.

role players like Jon Barry and Voshon Lenard are playing well.

Melo is a great player--but its like us saying Wade turned around the Heat by himself.

Odom, Haslem and Skip have had alot to do with our turnaround this year.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Caron_Butler</b>!
> Melo gets WAY WAY WAY (an understatement still) TOO MUCH CREDIT for the Nuggets turnaround
> 
> ANDRE MILLER anyone? adding a top 5 PG made no difference right?
> ...


Are any of those Nuggets players better than Melo? I never said hes the only reason, hes just the main reason as far as individual players. Wade is not the best player on the Heat, who are considerably worse than Nuggets. Carmelo is the best player on the Nuggets. Do the math. Not to mention Melo is 3 years younger.


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## RoddneyThaRippa (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> Are any of those Nuggets players better than Melo? I never said hes the only reason, hes just the main reason as far as individual players. Wade is not the best player on the Heat, who are considerably worse than Nuggets. Carmelo is the best player on the Nuggets. Do the math. Not to mention Melo is 3 years younger.


Carmelo is not the best player on the Nuggets and I'm tired of people saying that. I've watched every single game this year and Andre Miller is undoubtedly the best and most valuable player on the team. If Carmelo goes down Rodney White can fill in nicely. He's certainly not the caliber of player Carmelo is (although if he were getting as many minutes he would, per 48 minute-wise, be producing just as much) but the Nuggets still be a very good team. Take Andre Miller out of the picture and this team is completely screwed. Also, Camby is probably more valuable than Carmelo. Having a big man that can grab rebounds, block shots, and play great defense is more vaaluable in this league and to this team in particular than having a guy who can score. 

Again, Carmelo is not the best nor the most valuable player on the team. Trust me.


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## RoddneyThaRippa (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> Wade isnt even the leader of a an 8th seedin the eastern conference at the age of 22, and hes going to develop into a better leader than a guy whos 19 and IS the leader and go to guy of a playoff team in the WEST? Carmelos been a winner at every level. Hell, by the time Carmelos 22 he might have the Nuggets in a contender spot.


Again, I suggest you watch more Nuggets games before making these kind of assumptions. Carmelo is not the leader of the team. It can be argued that he's the best player or the most valuable, but he is in no way the leader of the team. 

Oh, and you seriously underestimate Wade. Who cares if he's 22? How many 22 year olds lead their team anyway? Besides, he does lead on the court. He plays hard on both ends and does whatever the team asks of him. That's leadership in itself.


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## rebelsun (Nov 25, 2003)

Wade has been great as a rookie, but LeBron and Melo have been better.


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## Natty Dreadlockz (Jul 21, 2003)

Wade's got a lot of help as well.. I'm with CB on this one.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>RoddneyThaRippa</b>!
> Again, I suggest you watch more Nuggets games before making these kind of assumptions. Carmelo is not the leader of the team. It can be argued that he's the best player or the most valuable, but he is in no way the leader of the team.


In the close games I've seen, Carmelo is the go to guy down the stretch, it can be argued that Miller is the leader but only because hes the point guard. Most valuable is what I'm talking about anyways. Nets fans say Kenyon Martin is the leader of the Nets because of his intensity, but we all know Kidd is the most valuable/talented. Melo is the most talented and valuable player on the Nuggets. 



> Originally posted by <b>RoddneyThaRippa</b>!
> Oh, and you seriously underestimate Wade. Who cares if he's 22? How many 22 year olds lead their team anyway? Besides, he does lead on the court. He plays hard on both ends and does whatever the team asks of him. That's leadership in itself.


How many 19 year olds lead their team? Man I never said 22 year olds SHOULD lead their team. I just noted that Wade isnt the best player on the team. Odom is better statistically, and has been the go to guy in the games I've seen. 

For a Nuggets fan, you sure underestimate Melo.


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## RoddneyThaRippa (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> In the close games I've seen, Carmelo is the go to guy down the stretch, it can be argued that Miller is the leader but only because hes the point guard. Most valuable is what I'm talking about anyways. Nets fans say Kenyon Martin is the leader of the Nets because of his intensity, but we all know Kidd is the most valuable/talented. Melo is the most talented and valuable player on the Nuggets.
> ...


How many Nuggets games have you actually watched?


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>RoddneyThaRippa</b>!
> How many Nuggets games have you actually watched?


5-10 this year.


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## RoddneyThaRippa (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> 5-10 this year.


Ok, I'm telling you right now that you haven't seen enough to make a fair judgement. Would you agree with that?


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>RoddneyThaRippa</b>!
> Ok, I'm telling you right now that you haven't seen enough to make a fair judgement. Would you agree with that?


No. 5-10 is plenty of games to make a fair judgement with the amount of minutes Melo plays. 

Are you saying Wade will be a better franchise player than Melo?


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## RoddneyThaRippa (Jun 28, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> No. 5-10 is plenty of games to make a fair judgement with the amount of minutes Melo plays.
> ...


Sorry, but five to ten games aint ****. I suggest you watch more before being so sure you're right. That's almost less than one-sixth of the games. I've watched them all. 

I'm not saying Wade will be a better franchise player than Carmelo. What I am saying is that he brings some things to the table that Carmelo doesn't, particularily defense and versatility. Is Wade as good of a scorer as Carmelo? Nah, but other than that what exactly does Carmelo do better than Dwayne? Carmelo gets more boards due to the position he plays but I don't see him being a better rebounding than Dwayen. In fact, Carmelo is quite lazy when it comes to rebounding. Carmeo is certainly not a better passwer than Dwayne and he's not a better defensive player. So again, why exactly does everyone say Carmelo is better than Dwayne? I think it's the media bandwagon, personally. 

In three years Carmelo may be head and shoulders above Dwayne, but I doubt it. Carmelo may very well be a franchise type player but I don't see why Dwayne can't either. Again, I just don't see what Carmelo brings that Dwayne doesn't other than scoring. The age difference is null and void and the team record argument is faulty. I just don't see why people think Carmelo is that much better than Dwayne.


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>RoddneyThaRippa</b>!
> Sorry, but five to ten games aint ****. I suggest you watch more before being so sure you're right. That's almost less than one-sixth of the games. I've watched them all.


A ton of Bulls fans who watched all the games last year ended up being wrong about things that people who only watched 10 games were right about. 5-10 is PLENTY to make a good judgement. How many games have you seen of Wade? 



> Originally posted by <b>RoddneyThaRippa</b>!
> In three years Carmelo may be head and shoulders above Dwayne, but I doubt it. Carmelo may very well be a franchise type player but I don't see why Dwayne can't either. Again, I just don't see what Carmelo brings that Dwayne doesn't other than scoring. The age difference is null and void and the team record argument is faulty. I just don't see why people think Carmelo is that much better than Dwayne.


So Carmelo is a better rebounder despite being "lazy" and hes a better scorer. Hes also 4 inches taller, you cant teach height. Hes also a better shooter. All that, and Melo is 3 years younger and is the best player (not leader) on a playoff team out west.


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## kcchiefs-fan (Oct 28, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>John The Cool Kid</b>!
> 
> 
> I dont think Wade will be that good. He is not even the best player on the heat right now. Him and Odom both average 17 pts, 4 asts, but Odom averages 6 more rebounds a game and has been the go to guy in the games I've seen from them.
> ...


It's all relative to potential, something that we can only speculate on at this point. But from what I've seen of each, and I've seen a pretty good amount, I'm a much bigger fan of Wade's upside.


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## Snicka (Dec 29, 2003)

If everyone needed to watch more then 10 games of a particular team to comment on them, no one on this board could open their trap about anything.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Snicka</b>!
> If everyone needed to watch more then 10 games of a particular team to comment on them, no one on this board could open their trap about anything.


Not that you can't comment on them, but you should be open to the idea that someone who watches *every game* of a player might have a better idea about them.

5-10 games is a small sample size.


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> 
> 
> Not that you can't comment on them, but you should be open to the idea that someone who watches *every game* of a player might have a better idea about them.
> ...


I disagree. Scouts are explicitly told (in hockey anyway, because I know a few) to limit how many times they watch one specific player. Overexposure to one player in comparison to others could result in skewed opinions. Professional scouts will usually not watch a player more then 10 times to form an opinion.

The problem is if you watch all of one teams games, you have likely still seen the rest of the league only a handful of times, so usually a biased opinion is reached.

And while the person in question may have seen Carmelo every game, if they have not seen Wade more then a few times, how are they in better position to make a comparison between the two then a normal Joe here.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> 
> I disagree. Scouts are explicitly told (in hockey anyway, because I know a few) to limit how many times they watch one specific player. Overexposure to one player in comparison to others could result in skewed opinions. Professional scouts will usually not watch a player more then 10 times to form an opinion.


It *might* be different with scouts, who are looking at raw ability and not performance (a strike out is "performance" but showing good pitch selection and having a balanced swing is "raw ability") and thus they might not be as succeptible to small sample sizes.

But, in general, small sample size observations are a very bad way to go. If you watch five games and catch five above average games, you go away from that sample with an inflated opinion.



> And while the person in question may have seen Carmelo every game, if they have not seen Wade more then a few times, how are they in better position to make a comparison between the two then a normal Joe here.


He's in no better position to make a comparison between *Anthony and Wade*. But watching every Nuggets game, he's in *far* better position to comment on who has most important to the *Nuggets*, who has played the best for the Nuggets and how well Anthony has played against the competition in general and what strengths/weaknesses he has shown (like whether he's "lazy" about rebounding).

That is all I was saying.


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

> Carmelo gets more boards due to the position he plays but I don't see him being a better rebounding than Dwayen. In fact, Carmelo is quite lazy when it comes to rebounding


Name the last small forward to average 10 rebounds a game in college? Drawing a blank? It's quite an amazing accomplishment, that shows a tremendous commitment or knack to rebounding.

6.2 boards a game, or 8.5 per 48 minutes is pretty solid for a small forward - its certainly average, and maybe slightly better then average.

And Melo must have been lazy tonight, given his * 11 offensive rebounds *

It's hard to get defensive boards when you play with Nene and Camby. But he gets over 2 off boards a game which is solid.


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## JuniorNoboa (Jan 27, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>Minstrel</b>!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Your right on that point except ... 

What if that person is a huge Rodney White fan who despises the fact that Melo is taking his minutes. That presents some credibility issues IMO.

Then again ignore my avatar and my sig


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## RoddneyThaRippa (Jun 28, 2003)

JuniorNobia and JohnTheCoolKid...

When you two actually watch a significant number of Nuggets games I'll consider your points valid. 

Until then...


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## Johnny Mac (May 6, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> I disagree. Scouts are explicitly told (in hockey anyway, because I know a few) to limit how many times they watch one specific player. Overexposure to one player in comparison to others could result in skewed opinions. Professional scouts will usually not watch a player more then 10 times to form an opinion.
> 
> The problem is if you watch all of one teams games, you have likely still seen the rest of the league only a handful of times, so usually a biased opinion is reached.
> ...


Exactly. 

And Minstrel, understand that he is just one Nuggets fan. I'm sure there are plenty of Nuggets fans who watch all the games who think Carmelo is the most important. If I'm a huge Qrichardson fan, and I watch every Clipper game and say that HE is the most important, and someone whos watched 10 games says Brand is the most important, than I'm automatically right because I've watched the games? You're not taking into account bias here. 



> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> Your right on that point except ...
> 
> What if that person is a huge Rodney White fan who despises the fact that Melo is taking his minutes. That presents some credibility issues IMO.


GREAT point. I kind of looked this off until I saw his name was RoddneyThaRippa. Makes too much sense now.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>JuniorNoboa</b>!
> 
> 
> Your right on that point except ...
> ...


To some extent. On the other hand, a player fan doesn't have to be a homer about the player. RtR strikes me as reasoned in his opinion, just as...



> Then again ignore my avatar and my sig


...you do, in your opinion of 'Melo.


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## Pinball (Aug 3, 2002)

Statistically, you can make a case for Wade being the second best rookie in the league. He's right up there with Melo in most categories. It'll be interesting to see how this plays out over the next few years. Melo is 3 years younger so you'd imagine that he'd improve more than Wade. You never know though. Wade could just take off. Although Melo is bigger and stronger, Wade is quicker and more athletic. I think he has a chance to be an All NBA defender in the not too distant future. I also think he has a chance to become a much better offensive player than he currently is. I'd love to see him move off the ball and play some SG. I know that he can play PG but I can see him being an explosive scorer as well. If the Heat can find a true PG, I don't think it's unrealistic for Wade to score 25 points per game. It probably won't happen next year but I wouldn't be shocked if it happened at some point in the future. I don't see Melo achieving that same level of success defensively. He's built perfectly as an offensive player but I don't think he's quick enough and agile enough to be a stopper on defense. He can improve, though. He'll probably become an even better rebounder in time. I think that the biggest area of his game that we'll see improvement in is his passing. Right now he just doesn't seem comfortable setting up others. As he becomes the focal point of his team I think he'll average close to 5 assists per game. He'll definately be among the league leaders in scoring. He'll be a terrific player as well. Lets see who improves more.


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## Minstrel (Dec 31, 2002)

I think Wade is very close to 'Melo. His defense could, in fact, put him ahead of Anthony, this season. I hadn't really considered defense, before.

I made the argument that Anthony's three years on Wade indicated the brighter future, but I'm quite receptive to the argument that Wade has the superior athleticism, which has its own developmental advantages.

All in all, this one is too close to call at the moment. Can't play this one on paper, we'll see who actually wins, in the end.


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## CrossOver (May 19, 2003)

Finally, Dwyane is getting some love from the media.

He's due man...he's due.

http://www.nba.com/milk_rookie/rankings_040223.html


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## The OUTLAW (Jun 13, 2002)

*Talk about filling out the stats sheet*

Wade had a near quadruple double

17 pts 9 rebs 7 assts 3 stls 10 turns and 5 fouls

Unfortunately you gotta take the bad with the good. When you hype a player people also start to notice the less than good games. But thats just how rookies are.


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## monkeyman44 (Feb 29, 2004)

wade is a phenomenal player, he was mainly overlooked in the draft because of lebron's hype, carmelo's run in the ncaa (which wade also had, leading marquette) and his height..


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