# Management Potentially Dynamiting Team (again)



## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Shaq to Cleveland, Amare to somewhere... what are your thoughts?


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Blowing it up is just not gonna happen. Kerr/Sarver want to convince Nash to sign a 2-yr extension. I don't think blowing it up would convince him of anything, other than asking for a trade. More than likely we'll try to retool a bit. It's out there too, they just have to try. 

I think Shaq's gone, but definitely not Cleveland for that crap deal being talked about. They'd have to give up more or get a 3rd team. Gambo said it hasn't been discussed for weeks either. Apparently, Hornets and Dallas are interested, though I'm not really buying Dallas. But I'm really holding out hope that we can get something done with New Orleans. And if we move him, it's unlikely Amare goes unless we get blown away by something.


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## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

Seeing as there's nothing to gain from blowing up now with the draft pick gone (other than money).. I'd really like to see us keep Nash and Amare, and do whatever it takes with everyone else to put the very best possible defenders around them. Going out and getting Deng and Chandler would give us a lineup I'd be comfortable with, but then you have a frontcourt with a long injury history, so that's a risk..

But that's what I want, I feel almost 100% certain that both Shaq and Amare are gone before next season.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

What bothers me about this is that we weren't bad last year especially since we were relying on some mediocre backups and amare was out. Shaq is still good for 12 and 10, and without diaw to fill in at pf we really felt his absence. We won 46 last year which could have easily been 54 wins had we taken care of business against crappy teams and didn't endure five last second losses.

The wheels are set to fall off next season, I say we ride it out, retool for five seasons (most likely forever and become the western conference version of the 76ers) and hopefully contend


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## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

Hyperion said:


> We won 46 last year which could have easily been 54 wins had we taken care of business against crappy teams and didn't endure five last second losses.


Exactly. So many losses against completely inferior teams.

And that was with US fielding a completely inferior team compared to what we can do next year with the right moves. I mean, thinking about Nash and Amare - two of the best/most impacting offensive players in the league (even if Amare didn't show it while loafing through last season, we all know he is), but horrible defenders - you build around them with a guy who automatically makes you the most vulnerable team in the league against its most prevalent play (Shaq against the pick and roll), and another plethora of offensive players who outside of Hill are either incapable of playing good defense or don't care enough or whatever.. Is it any wonder that a scrub like Jared Dudley, a guy who can actually play a bit of defense, came in out of nowhere and we automatically looked better with him in the lineup? Blah. Horrible personnel decisions on Shaq and J-Rich, nothing against those guys because they're great, the makeup just doesn't work.

Just give Nash and Amare some dudes who can hit the 3 and play defense and we're gold for 55-60 as usual. Guys like Deng and Chandler are there for the taking, and THOSE are the kind of guys Nash and Amare need around them to be the most successful. And are we going to win a championship? Well, probably not - but I will say that I'm a HELL of a lot less scared of the Lakers and the other top teams going into next year than I was of the Spurs from 2005-2007, and if they make the perfect moves, who knows.


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Yeah, Chandler is almost perfect to put next to Amare, and that's why I've been praying and advocating we find a way to get it done. We need a big athletic C who can guard the bigs and play effective pick n roll defense. And it's worth the risk with our medical staff after what they've shown already. We'd have to get one of Daniels, Posey, MoPete, or Butler packaged with him, which makes it even better. But that taking on the 2-4 yrs for both of extra salary is what might kill the chance. Hopefully, they seriously realize it's not like we'll be big players in 2010 FA. Best way for us to retool/rebuild is by taking on those talented players who can come relatively cheap like this. Plus, we'd be in good position for 2011/2012 RFA/FAs or have that flexibility then though. 

I don't think we could get Deng unless the Bulls somehow want J-rich. Or deal involving Amare. But that defeats the purpose of Chandler. Honestly, though, I don't see Amare getting moved. His value is lower than it was at the deadline when we got offered crappy deals.

But yeah, had we fired Porter earlier in the season, there's no doubt in my mind we're a top 6 team in the West. I'd even expect us to do that well if we made no moves, but we'd get exposed very quickly.


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Meh the suns were too tattered to win the second half of the season. Maybe we can swing a 3 team deal with shaq to Cleveland Wallace to NO and chandler to us plus fillers


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## Dissonance (Jul 21, 2004)

Hyperion said:


> Meh the suns were too tattered to win the second half of the season. Maybe we can swing a 3 team deal with shaq to Cleveland Wallace to NO and chandler to us plus fillers


Huh? Going back to our old style, Gentry shot life into the Suns with those 140 pt performances and thereafter even without Amare. Plus, if he doesn't go down soon after he did take over, we make it as the 7th or 8th seed with the way Jazz and NO faded during the last 2 months. Porter is fired in Dec-Jan, we're a 5-6 seed at least.


NO is calling because they want Shaq to play in his home place and sell tickets. They also know it's 20M expiring. I can see in another yr or two, Paul wanting out or leaving via FA.


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## Arclite (Nov 2, 2002)

Organized Chaos said:


> I don't think we could get Deng unless the Bulls somehow want J-rich. Or deal involving Amare. But that defeats the purpose of Chandler. Honestly, though, I don't see Amare getting moved. His value is lower than it was at the deadline when we got offered crappy deals.


J-Rich was who I had in mind with a deal for Deng assuming we got something done with Chandler/Shaq, considering the Bulls seem to be on a honeymoon with Salmons and Ben Gordon's future is uncertain. At least I think it is.

The Bulls weakness has been low post scoring for a long time, and J-Rich showed us a pretty nice post game in limited opportunities. I think it could help both teams. I really have no doubt that Deng would have an offensive renaissance playing with Nash, and his defensive ability/versatility would be a huge boon for this squad.


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## bircan (Jul 17, 2005)

Sounds good - retool the team in a smarter way and we will be contending for a good playoff position. I like that Chandler and Deng idea. My only thing is if we trade Shaq, will he come back to bite us on the *** with the other team (if it's another Western Conf. team). 

Obviously, we need Nash to keep fit (like he always does) in the off-season and he probably has the capacity to come back ready and fresh. We still require a back-up PG to spell Nash more than Dragic has (still play Dragic though), so Nash can lower his average to 31-32mins. 

No point in dealing Amare at this stage. It is quite frustrating that he is out so much, despite us having a great medical team he has been susceptible. But with Amare rolling hard to the rim, Nash still on game and quality role player like Chandler (if he returns to previous year's form) and potential star in Deng, we will be very capable. If we keep Hill and Barnes, then that gives us quality vets along with Dragic, also Barbosa is still feisty from the SG - so losing JRich won't be terribly hard to compensate for. 

Even if Shaq does not get traded, he can still produce. JRich is not what i think this team needs, mainly with issues of who has the ball and who can do the most with it for less money. His contract is bad and he is the one that fits in the least IMO. Though in the Shaq and JRich trades, we would also need to recieve a role player SG. Not sure who that would be, but a younger Bell with more potential could be ideal.

One last shot - get a good mix of players, play to our offensive strength but motivate the team to become more active on the boards and defense. If we get Amare and Nash rolling like in the past, then I expect Amare will be more motivated to get the boards and play better defense. Like you said, no point in getting rid of Amare right now.


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## mo76 (Jun 13, 2003)

The suns were great and very entertaining at the end of the season. They should draft sam young or jrue holiday and play the way they did last year. You could really see them developing chemistry at the end of the year. Don't trade shaq!!!!!


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## Hyperion (Dec 5, 2006)

Organized Chaos said:


> Huh? Going back to our old style, Gentry shot life into the Suns with those 140 pt performances and thereafter even without Amare. Plus, if he doesn't go down soon after he did take over, we make it as the 7th or 8th seed with the way Jazz and NO faded during the last 2 months. Porter is fired in Dec-Jan, we're a 5-6 seed at least.
> 
> 
> NO is calling because they want Shaq to play in his home place and sell tickets. They also know it's 20M expiring. I can see in another yr or two, Paul wanting out or leaving via FA.


I meant that we didn't have enough talent to really win by the second half of the season as Amare went down and no one could fill his role as we had traded Diaw. However, I do feel that these Suns can win next year, as long as we don't play the Spurs.


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## bircan (Jul 17, 2005)

Yea, we were very susceptible to the weak teams and lost to those that we had no business losing to... I think there was a stretch in the after Gentry where we couldn't pull off many wins against the top 8 in the West, we lost a few and only won like against LA and NO/Utah or something... we also need become more ferocious and hungry against the top tier teams. 

Gentry really helped by freeing the players and resting all the talk by Nash and other players (I think can't remember) about Porter's system. Like the players became more comfortable/happy and since it's something they know, the spirit was higher. Got to capture that spirit and start harder. When we have Nash and Amare rolling, good things happen.


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