# Official 2006 Draft Thread



## thaKEAF (Mar 8, 2004)

Well today's the day that pretty much everyone has been waiting for. Use this to discuss of course the 76ers and also the picks that other teams make tonight. I'm hoping that Philly takes Shawne Williams in the first round and a big man in the second round.


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## Sixerfanforlife (Jun 23, 2005)

Take Shawne Williams? The guy's so soft, we'll be pounded by perimeter defense for years to come. SHOULD HAVE STAYED IN SCHOOL IMO. Take the big man in the first, then go after the next Athletic beast, AKA Eric Hicks.


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

Sixerfanforlife said:


> Take Shawne Williams? The guy's so soft, we'll be pounded by perimeter defense for years to come. SHOULD HAVE STAYED IN SCHOOL IMO. Take the big man in the first, then go after the next Athletic beast, AKA Eric Hicks.


Eric Hicks is like 6'5. Not exactly a beast by NBA standards, college standards. I do not want Eric Hicks. I was hoping to deal A.I. for #7 but that deal is dead cuz the Celts just got Telfair (horrible trade by the Celts). Oh well, I have a feeling this isn't going to be good.


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## Sixerfanforlife (Jun 23, 2005)

Damn Right It Won't Be Good, Even If I Don't Have Cable, I'm Still Gonna Be Pissed.


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## Noob (Jan 21, 2006)

No Williams.

We got Thabo Sefolosha, a 6-6 Shooting Guard from Switzerland.

Looks like a promising defensive player, but other than that, I don't know much about him.

Anyone else?


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

Can someone tell me what we are getting from Chicago for this swiz guy???? I know we will be picking 16th but what else are we getting


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## Noob (Jan 21, 2006)

DieSlow69 said:


> Can someone tell me what we are getting from Chicago for this swiz guy???? I know we will be picking 16th but what else are we getting


Explain? I'm not watching the draft as I can't, just following it online as usual.


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

We will be getting Rodney Carney????????? I dont watch much college ball....so can someone tell me if this was a good move or what???....with this pick...It looks to me like we might be keeping A.I. :banana: :banana: :banana: ...yeah ROUTE-I76 I hope we get what me and you want :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

*A.I. 4 Life*


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## thaKEAF (Mar 8, 2004)

WOO! I'm happy as hell right now. When they picked that dude who sname I didn't know I was really pissed but we ended up trading him for Chicago's pick and getting Carney. I didn't think he'd fall to us so that's why I said lets get Williams but Carney is no doubt a good pick.


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

Noob said:


> Explain? I'm not watching the draft as I can't, just following it online as usual.



We gave up the swiz guys for chicago's 16th pick and I was wondering what else did we get from chicago????? I dont think you would trade down from 13 to 16th for nothing(for ****s and giggles)....I was thinking maybe we get a little something extra from chicago...


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

thaKEAF said:


> WOO! I'm happy as hell right now. When they picked that dude who sname I didn't know I was really pissed but we ended up trading him for Chicago's pick and getting Carney. I didn't think he'd fall to us so that's why I said lets get Williams but Carney is no doubt a good pick.



Can you elaborate on how good Carney is thaKEAF.......I don't watch college ball at all so I dont know anything about him???????????????????? AND DID WE GET ANYTHING ELSE FROM CHICAGO BESIDES A SWAP IN PICKS????


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## Noob (Jan 21, 2006)

DieSlow69 said:


> We gave up the swiz guys for chicago's 16th pick and I was wondering what else did we get from chicago????? I dont think you would trade down from 13 to 16th for nothing(for ****s and giggles)....I was thinking maybe we get a little something extra from chicago...


Ah ok, thanks buddy.

The Swiss guy didn't look all that bad. Don't know anything about Carney though.


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## thaKEAF (Mar 8, 2004)

He's crazy athletic, right up there with Iguodala or even more. Him and Iggy kinda have the same kind of game. Both are athletic like I said before and also good on defense but Carney is better from downtown. Carney was the C-USA player of the year and the only knock the ESPN dudes had on him is that he needs to improve from the midrange.


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

Damn where's all the Philly posters.....Beez, Coats, Allien, Redsdrunk, Route, Sixerfan4life, CornWallace.......


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## thaKEAF (Mar 8, 2004)

I guess they gave up on King before the draft even started.


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

Update fellas: We get a 2nd round draft pick in 2007 and cash considerations from chicago for trading the picks with them......That aint to bad to me


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## thaKEAF (Mar 8, 2004)

I hope King finds a way to get us a second rounder but I doubt it.

Alot of people on here wanted Marcus Williams. I wonder how they feel now that he's going to a division rival?


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## Sixerfanforlife (Jun 23, 2005)

How many of us wanted Marcus Williams? Well after evaulating the over-weight PG, on a scale to 1-10....2 and that's if we're lucky. And as for our origional pick of Rodney Carney, you 76ers fans have to be pissed, just think about the team. Rodney Carney, and maybe a few other guys worth 5 million and the same roster. Repeat after me: NO SIGNIFCANT CHANGES, NO FUTURE, JUST RODNEY CARNEY AND THE MLE.


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## RedsDrunk (Oct 31, 2005)

Sixerfanforlife said:


> How many of us wanted Marcus Williams? Well after evaulating the over-weight PG, on a scale to 1-10....2 and that's if we're lucky. And as for our origional pick of Rodney Carney, you 76ers fans have to be pissed, just think about the team. Rodney Carney, and maybe a few other guys worth 5 million and the same roster. Repeat after me: NO SIGNIFCANT CHANGES, NO FUTURE, JUST RODNEY CARNEY AND THE MLE.


^^^^as usual....Huh?


As for the pick....I'll take it. IGGY+Carney= some solid perimeter D and if nothing else we are going to see some crazy *** dunks nightly. So we get a little much needed D and a guy who can run and finish on the break. The selection of Carney instead of williams leads me to believe maybe AI could be staying*fingers crossed.* This draft has been crazy to watch. Trades everywhere.


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## Sixerfanforlife (Jun 23, 2005)

Did it occur to you that Chris Webber will negate any attempt to run with his sorry-*** legs. Maurice Cheeks perfers that all 5 guys get INVOLVED in the offense, end of story, Rodney doesn't fit here.


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## RedsDrunk (Oct 31, 2005)

Sixerfanforlife said:


> Did it occur to you that Chris Webber will negate any attempt to run with his sorry-*** legs. Maurice Cheeks perfers that all 5 guys get INVOLVED in the offense, end of story, Rodney doesn't fit here.



Cheeks also perfers that his players play defense which carney does. Ai, Iggy and Carney can all run...so can sammy if he stays. Even if webber is laggy behind thats more then enough options on the finish.


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

I actually agree with SixersFan4Life. The world is coming to a end. I would rather have had the Swiss guy than Rodney Carney. Carney is a athlete, that is about it. He is a ok defender, but the swiss guy is longer and considered a better perimeter defender. Carney has a decent jumper but can not really create off the dribble. His ball handling skills leave something to be desired. IMO, the Swiss guy is a better fit for a rebuilding team or Marcus Williams is better for a young team. Rodney Carney tells me we are not rebuilding, which means more mediocrity. I'm very upset right now. It would be better for A.I. and the team if he would've moved on tonight.


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## Sliccat (Oct 16, 2004)

DieSlow69 said:


> Damn where's all the Philly posters.....Beez, Coats, Allien, Redsdrunk, Route, Sixerfan4life, CornWallace.......


Thanks a lot.


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## Cornrow Wallace (Aug 22, 2005)

So what do you guys think of Bobby Jones? I haven't seen him play, but I guess he has great defense.

I think our defense has improved a little with these two picks.


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

I like Bobby Jones a lot. He'll play that Trenton Hassell, George Lynch, defensive stopper type roll. He is a good sized guy with good athleticism and a character guy. I wonder what this does for Kyle Korver, I think that these moves will make Wille Green back up the 2 guard exclusively but Kyle's minutes have definitely diminished with the moves made tonight. Good or bad thing? Depends on how you feel about Kyle. I think it is a very good thing.


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## Ras (Jul 25, 2005)

I haven't seen him play, but from what I've read Ronnie Brewer is intriguing. He's 6'7, can play the point, is very athletic and long, has all the skills to be a good defender; he seems very solid. Anyone know of anything about him I should know, or would he have been a solid choice?


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## Sliccat (Oct 16, 2004)

^I guess it would be a good thing for Korver to play less minutes, but only if they got reduced to the 10-20 type area. He's not good for extended minutes off the bench. Really, he's best as a starter, but he's not good enough to start, regardless of how hard he works.


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## melo4life (Jun 5, 2006)

i think there is going to be a lot more trades now that the draft is over will philly get rid of iverson or keep him here?


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

melo4life said:


> i think there is going to be a lot more trades now that the draft is over will philly get rid of iverson or keep him here?


Andy Katz just suggested that the Celtics are stockpiling assets in order to make a trade for A.I.. He mentioned Rondo, Telfair, D-West and so on. Obviously, the pieces are there for a trade. We need a PG, probably Rondo with the new defensive perspective BK has taken on, and some young guys and future picks for A.I.. It looks pretty clear that if Allen is going to leave it will most likely be to Boston.


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

I like the players they picked up, but I don't like the fact that they probably are going to stand pat with this team. Sure we needed perimeter defense but are defenders in Carney and Jones enough to put this team in contention for a title? I don't think so.

I hate to rain on parades, but I don't know. Good draft, but I'm not too happy about the signs it gives.


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## Kunlun (Jun 22, 2003)

Getting Carney gives me a sense that we are keeping Iverson. We seem to be loaded on swing men now, I wonder what this does to Korver's minutes.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

I'm loving what the 76ers now have on the wings. The overall athleticism can't even be measured. It's that far off the charts.

Iguodala
Carney
Bobby Jones

:eek8:

And Korver who can at least dunk in 2k6.


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

sliccat said:


> Thanks a lot.



sorry sliccatt.....damn I can't believe I forgot about you....will you except my apologies   lol :biggrin:


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

They need to try their best to sign Steven Smith.


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

Coatesvillain said:


> They need to try their best to sign Steven Smith.


I would love to have Steven Smith and actually thought about picking him up but I think the chances are minimal since we just drafted two swingmen in addition to the plethora of swingmen we already have. Pops Mensah-Bonsu, Curtis Withers, or some other post guys could be options. A PG could be a option but I can't think of any. 

Looks like we have obtained the rights to the number 56 pick also, according to ESPN. His name is Edin Bavcic and we gave the Raptors cash for him.

Link (blurb at the bottom)


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## Kunlun (Jun 22, 2003)

> *Raps deal Bavcic*
> The Raptors traded the rights to No. 56 Edin Bavcic to Sixers for cash.


I read that off an ESPN article. Anyone know anything about this guy?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2006/news/story?id=2503390


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

DieSlow69 said:


> We will be getting Rodney Carney????????? I dont watch much college ball....so can someone tell me if this was a good move or what???....with this pick...It looks to me like we might be keeping A.I. :banana: :banana: :banana: ...yeah ROUTE-I76 I hope we get what me and you want :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:
> 
> *A.I. 4 Life*


Im happy as hell right now, I was a Memphis fan the year be4 last be4 they showed they had the talent they did and Carney was one of the reasons. I was flippin when they said they drafted that Switz dude. I was like here we go all over again names left on the board and we take a nobody. So yah Die by my opinion this is def someone we will like. But if AI gets traded it will be come irrelevant bc i wont give a damn who we got in this draft. Also i want to mention that a reason we could of passed on Marcus Williams bc of the tryout with Jay Williams apparently it went pretty well and we are waiting til July 1st to offer him some of the MLE. So if that is truely our plan im glad we didnt look at a pg in the Draft. Again im VERY HAPPY with Carney, as long as AIs staying of course :cheers:


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## Noob (Jan 21, 2006)

Well it aint looking too good about keeping Iverson guys. 
Check this from the Philly Inquirer:

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/sports/14925179.htm

I'm pretty damn angry that we are now actively trying to shop him.


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

You devout Iverson fans will have to get over it. He is as good as gone. All the major columnists are reporting it and it's going to happen. You should be happy that A.I. will probably go to a better situation with more talent around him and the Sixers will get some young talent.


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

Mattjb34 said:


> You devout Iverson fans will have to get over it. He is as good as gone. All the major columnists are reporting it and it's going to happen. You should be happy that A.I. will probably go to a better situation with more talent around him and the Sixers will get some young talent.


No one has to get over anything and no one is as good as gone until it happens. They have been reporting **** like this every year prolly for the past 3 years at the least and prolly more. Although i will give you it has seemed a lot stronger this year then of years pasts, but like ive said many times be4 i will believe it when i see it. And no I shouldnt be happy that AI has to be forced out to a "better Situation" because some idiots dont know how to do their job and piece the right pieces around him to get it done, and then bc they dont know how to do their job blame it on Allen and say its his fault and no one works with him. GARBAGE. So come talk to me in 5 years when this so called young talent even develops into something half as good as what allen has done for this organization and then maybe i will be happy. But until then, Get Over it? I dont think so, the first thing we need to do is see if it actually happens because im telling you if boston is the only real option right now it most likely isnt going to happen


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

Route I-76 said:


> No one has to get over anything and no one is as good as gone until it happens. They have been reporting **** like this every year prolly for the past 3 years at the least and prolly more. Although i will give you it has seemed a lot stronger this year then of years pasts, but like ive said many times be4 i will believe it when i see it. And no I shouldnt be happy that AI has to be forced out to a "better Situation" because some idiots dont know how to do their job and piece the right pieces around him to get it done, and then bc they dont know how to do their job blame it on Allen and say its his fault and no one works with him. GARBAGE. So come talk to me in 5 years when this so called young talent even develops into something half as good as what allen has done for this organization and then maybe i will be happy. But until then, Get Over it? I dont think so, the first thing we need to do is see if it actually happens because im telling you if boston is the only real option right now it most likely isnt going to happen


Hey buddy, I'm just trying to soften the blow. If you are in denial, that is your own business. I guess you are looking forward to another .500 season (if that) so I hope you have a great time.


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

Mattjb34 said:


> Hey buddy, I'm just trying to soften the blow. If you are in denial, that is your own business. I guess you are looking forward to another .500 season (if that) so I hope you have a great time.


Looking forward to another .500 season of course not what i would like is for management to get off their asses and start making some moves that actually make sense to place around Allen instead of thinking an over the hill player with no knees was the best way for us to go.

And as for being in denial let me leave you with a qoute from Tony DiLeo our assistant GM 

"A lot of teams have called on him were going to evaluate the situation, were going to do whats best for the franchise but to say that now that Allen will not be with us next year I think thats very premature Allen is a great player and we think with a couple of the players we added in the draft and what we can do in free agency we can be a good team with Allen."

He also added to say that we dont like that his name is out there but if it was a real good deal for the team they would do it but if not they wont and keep a star player in allen iverson.

Now those qoutes dont exactly sound like qoutes about a player that is "as good as gone" do they Buddy?

but maybe your right I could be in denial not the first time i heard it lol :biggrin: :cheers:


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

Route I-76 said:


> Looking forward to another .500 season of course not what i would like is for management to get off their asses and start making some moves that actually make sense to place around Allen instead of thinking an over the hill player with no knees was the best way for us to go.
> 
> And as for being in denial let me leave you with a qoute from Tony DiLeo our assistant GM
> 
> ...


Whatever gets you through the day champ. I'm sure you probably know this but I wouldn't invest too heavily in what the GM or management of your own team says. A good percentage of the time they end up being a little hypocritical.


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

Mattjb34 said:


> Whatever gets you through the day champ. I'm sure you probably know this but I wouldn't invest too heavily in what the GM or management of your own team says. A good percentage of the time they end up being a little hypocritical.


and I dont Invest much in what any part of the Sixers management say or do. I am just investing on the fact that every year they say this is the year allens gone time to trade allen and it never happens, I was just using his qoute to say you cant really gauruntee him out the door right now. I have nothing against you or anyone else that thinks AI should be traded but I have my opinions too and for me AI will always be a Sixer seeing him anywhere else just wouldnt be right and anger me. and I dont like when ppl say i should get over it and be happy hes going somewhere else bc something like that would never make me happy. Its just for me AI should be a sixer for life, and i know im one of the very few on here that feel way with the exception to DIE and maybe a few others but still that opinion for me isnt going to change.


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

Route I-76 said:


> and I dont Invest much in what any part of the Sixers management say or do. I am just investing on the fact that every year they say this is the year allens gone time to trade allen and it never happens, I was just using his qoute to say you cant really gauruntee him out the door right now. I have nothing against you or anyone else that thinks AI should be traded but I have my opinions too and for me AI will always be a Sixer seeing him anywhere else just wouldnt be right and anger me. and I dont like when ppl say i should get over it and be happy hes going somewhere else bc something like that would never make me happy. Its just for me AI should be a sixer for life, and i know im one of the very few on here that feel way with the exception to DIE and maybe a few others but still that opinion for me isnt going to change.




I COSIGN THIS POST.........I still think we can build a team for later........and keep A.I.


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## Noob (Jan 21, 2006)

DieSlow69 said:


> I COSIGN THIS POST.........I still think we can build a team for later........and keep A.I.


Cosign.


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## Cagee7 (Apr 23, 2006)

Yeah the sixers had a great draft but i hope they keep ai


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

Route I-76 said:


> Looking forward to another .500 season of course not what i would like is for management to get off their asses and start making some moves that actually make sense to place around Allen instead of thinking an over the hill player with no knees was the best way for us to go.


You were screaming that this team was going to win the Atlantic in February. And now you're saying how bad the Webber trade was? Was the Webber trade bad in your eyes when it happened? Or are you playing hindsight analyst?



> And as for being in denial let me leave you with a qoute from Tony DiLeo our assistant GM
> 
> "A lot of teams have called on him were going to evaluate the situation, were going to do whats best for the franchise but to say that now that Allen will not be with us next year I think thats very premature Allen is a great player and we think with a couple of the players we added in the draft and what we can do in free agency we can be a good team with Allen."
> 
> ...


You have to be kidding me right? What front office person in their right mind would come out saying that a player is gone? Don't you know the moment someone comes out and says that to the press the player's trade value plummets? The reason for that is any leverage you have is sacrificed, and teams won't have to give anything worthwhile for him.

It's not about putting pieces around Iverson anymore, because you aren't going to win with him here. So why continue to try to appease a player when it's not helping the franchise?

The thing that drives me crazy about Iverson homers is that they always point the finger at the team, and never once at him. Ever.


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

Coatesvillain said:


> You were screaming that this team was going to win the Atlantic in February. And now you're saying how bad the Webber trade was? Was the Webber trade bad in your eyes when it happened? Or are you playing hindsight analyst?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


First of all I have not once lied about what i said yes i thought wed win the division, yes i thought the webber trade was a good trade when it happened, NO we didnt win the division, and NO the Webber trade wasnt a good trade. But Im not the General Manager, I dont get payed the money to make those Decisions, So im not the one that needs to be right about them they do. Obviously i know that a front office person cant come out and say a player is gone, but you would think if a player was for sure gone that those comments wouldnt be his choice of words to say.

The thing that kills me about the people who are constantly saying trade AI trade AI is you guys believe that if you trade him and blow the team up that magically everything will get better in a couple of years, and that when you rebuild the pieces overtime will just automaticly come together. Thats not going to happen. We will have the SAME management, and the SAME front office putting the team together. you still have to put the right pieces together so what in the world makes you think that by trading Iverson this SAME group of ppl is magically going to be able to build a winning team in the future. I just dont see it happening. Who are we even going to build the team around for the furture I havent even seen anyone mention that. You cant jus say lets rebuild and blow the team up and expect to have a winning team within 5 years, you have to have confidence that the personell you have can do that, Now who here can HONESTLY say they think they can?


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

Route I-76 said:


> First of all I have not once lied about what i said yes i thought wed win the division, yes i thought the webber trade was a good trade when it happened, NO we didnt win the division, and NO the Webber trade wasnt a good trade. But Im not the General Manager, I dont get payed the money to make those Decisions, So im not the one that needs to be right about them they do. Obviously i know that a front office person cant come out and say a player is gone, but you would think if a player was for sure gone that those comments wouldnt be his choice of words to say.


What I'm saying is don't change your tune now and act like you were calling the Webber deal bad the whole time. How can you criticize King for making it, when you were all for it? That makes no sense. 

Also if a player was for sure gone, they still wouldn't come out and say it.



> The thing that kills me about the people who are constantly saying trade AI trade AI is you guys believe that if you trade him and blow the team up that magically everything will get better in a couple of years, and that when you rebuild the pieces overtime will just automaticly come together. Thats not going to happen. We will have the SAME management, and the SAME front office putting the team together. you still have to put the right pieces together so what in the world makes you think that by trading Iverson this SAME group of ppl is magically going to be able to build a winning team in the future. I just dont see it happening. Who are we even going to build the team around for the furture I havent even seen anyone mention that. You cant jus say lets rebuild and blow the team up and expect to have a winning team within 5 years, you have to have confidence that the personell you have can do that, Now who here can HONESTLY say they think they can?


You don't get it do you? 

With Allen Iverson the Sixers have missed the playoffs two out of the last three seasons. He's playing his best basketball, but the Sixers' record is hovering around .500. He doesn't sacrifice any of his game for the betterment of his team. So he puts up pretty fantasy stats, gives up a lot of points on the other end of the court and the team misses the playoffs. Just fix it by putting these fantasy players around him that resemble the 2000-01 Finals team, right? Don't ask him to change a damned thing about what he does, it's great that he's more effecient but it doesn't help when he does the majority of the ball handling, majority of the shooting, and has the majority of the trips to the line.

This is what I don't get. How is it NOW that the Sixers haven't put any talent around Iverson, when at the beginning of.. in during the... near the end of.. the season you were talking about them winning the division. Apparently there was something about this roster that you liked. And then you switch your entire tune when what you thought was obviously wrong.

You say people haven't said anything about how they suggest the current group would rebuild, but on that same token you haven't suggested how to build the 2000-01 Sixers clone (which made it to the finals, thanks to the Pacers breaking their team up and an overall weak eastern conference).

My whole approach is, take a **** or get off the pot. If you're going to be good, be good, if you're going to be bad, be bad. Don't just be happy with the middle ground and move around a few parts in hopes that you'll strike lightning and get on a run. Maybe I'm different around these parts, I was a fan before Iverson, I'll be a fan after Iverson. That doesn't mean that I don't appreciate what Iverson has done for the team, but it means that I know you can't hold yesterday on the mantle and expect it not to dissapate.

I think this management has done their best work on draft night, and I want one of the gems from next year's draft. I believe Billy King is near the end of his rope, which ties perfectly with why he's scared to make a move right now because he believes he'll be left hanging by season's end.


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## SirCharles34 (Nov 16, 2004)

Coatesvillain said:


> I think this management has done their best work on draft night, and I want one of the gems from next year's draft.


I couldn't agree more. If we're gonna just hover around the middle and be average, then I'd rather just blow the team up and start over. Next year's draft class is gonna be GOOOD. I want a piece of that. 

2 things could happen if/when AI gets traded: 

BK could try and build a contender with the parts he gets from the AI trade (not likely to happen) OR he could get a bunch of expiring contracts that will only help push us to next yr's lottery and hope we strike it rich.


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## Sixerfanforlife (Jun 23, 2005)

I have to agree with Route-76, sure Billy King and our management did a pheneomonal job on draft night, addressing the defneisve end with effectiveness, however, is that to say he'll perfectly analyze an Iverson trade and allow it to be the best it could possibly be? Don't forget, this is the same guy that acquired a man with 1 leg for a good-post player in Corliss Williamson, A good-post-man in Brian Skinner who was ONLY traded because Jim O'Brien had a stubborn spirit. And how can we forget Kenny Thomas? The guy is putting up respectable numbers for Sacramento, and had a good-game 3 against the San Antonio Spurs and other flashes of goodness. I think the defensive and effort combination of a Corliss Williamson, Brian Skinner and Kenny Thomas is far more in value (especially with this new defensive group) then Webber. 


Do I trust Billy King? Yes and no, I trust that he understands the meaning of the words 'defense' because of his great draft yesterday night. But that's not to say I trust him completely, because he's always been horrible with contracts, he is so hasty in his decision making that he sometimes adds the wrong player. Alot like when a kid thinks he knows the answer to a math problem but is wrong, you know?

I wish I could trust that Billy King can make the right signings, proper trades and calculations to make us a contender, but I doubt it. If we want to rebulid,then we have to let the Allen Iverson and Chris Webber contracts expire. By that time, Samuel Dalembert, Kyle Korver, Andre Iguodala,Willie Green and Rodney Carney should be in their primes, we should be some-what under the cap. We should be able to bulid a contender. KEEP AI IN PHILLY.


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

Sixerfanforlife said:


> I wish I could trust that Billy King can make the right signings, proper trades and calculations to make us a contender, but I doubt it. If we want to rebulid,then we have to let the Allen Iverson and Chris Webber contracts expire. By that time, Samuel Dalembert, Kyle Korver, Andre Iguodala,Willie Green and Rodney Carney should be in their primes, we should be some-what under the cap. We should be able to bulid a contender. KEEP AI IN PHILLY.



Damn Sixerfan I COSIGN


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

So for those who don't trust Billy King to rebuild the team, you trust him in building a contender around Iverson?

Also the hindsight criticism on the Webber deal is riddiculous. I find it insane that people will rip it apart now, when they were cheerleading for it when it happened. That just irks me.

The Sixers still won the Webber deal, I'll still say that. Kenny Thomas was an average player who's stats contributed nothing to winning or losing. Brian Skinner is a bum who in his whole time has only had flashes. And Corliss Williamson was played way too many minutes, and was ineffective on defense and couldn't rebound (and will be out of the league this year). 

The only thing is Sacramento took the trade and used it to move forward, they acquired Ron Artest via trade and they are in much better shape than the Sixers. What's funny is that the Sixers passed on Artest because of his character, and to keep young players. Now this is where we sit.

Really when I think of the Billy King, I think the worst decisions have come with the deals he passed. At times he's been so afraid to make a move, that the team sat back. Maybe some of that comes from Larry Brown's urge to blow up the team and bring back Derrick Coleman after the 2000-01 season. But that would be giving King too much credit, as he made the situation worse by re-signing DC after his contract expired.


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

Mattjb34 said:


> I would love to have Steven Smith and actually thought about picking him up but I think the chances are minimal since we just drafted two swingmen in addition to the plethora of swingmen we already have. Pops Mensah-Bonsu, Curtis Withers, or some other post guys could be options. A PG could be a option but I can't think of any.


You most likely saw Steven Smith a lot more than I have, but from what I understand he can play the 4 as well. With that considered it would allow the team to play with the smaller lineups at times.


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## Mattjb34 (May 10, 2005)

Coatesvillain said:


> You most likely saw Steven Smith a lot more than I have, but from what I understand he can play the 4 as well. With that considered it would allow the team to play with the smaller lineups at times.


It's worth a shot. I would bet the bank that he would be more effective than Shavlik and Bradley. The LaSalle messageboard is reporting that he is playing with the Sixers in the Rocky Mountain League and with Golden State in the Las Vegas League. Hopefully he will make a good impression on BK. I think he could be a very good complimentary player at a couple positions.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

DieSlow69 said:


> Damn where's all the Philly posters.....Beez, Coats, Allien, Redsdrunk, Route, Sixerfan4life, CornWallace.......


 I just got back from Cancun today.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

I find it absolutely horrible that Steven Smith wasnt drafted at all. This guy was a borderline first round pick last year and couldnt even get his name called the other day. The GM's of today are plain and simply worthless. Hes going to make someones team and really stick it to so many other teams


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## Your Answer (Jul 13, 2005)

BEEZ said:


> I just got back from Cancun today.


I was there earlier this month great place aint it?


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

Route I-76 said:


> I was there earlier this month great place aint it?


 Gorgeous place, but sick all week. Just my luck.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

Rodney Carney, I guess, I would have rather had Brewer and Steven Smith. I was even shocked that Allan Ray's name wasnt even called. NBA GM's are horrible. I have never even heard of or seen a scouting report on the guy the drafted for the Bulls


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

I went back and watched the Washington/UConn game from the NCAA tourney, and I'm liking the Bobby Jones pick. He got into foul trouble (as did everyone on Washington in that game) but it seemed like everytime a play happened defensively it involved him. Very active, long, good agility, just a headache for the opposition.

Don't let him shoot though, especially from the perimeter. He's not too bad when driving the lane, but outside he's a mess. Makes Iguodala look like Reggie Miller from three.


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## Sliccat (Oct 16, 2004)

Coatesvillain said:


> So for those who don't trust Billy King to rebuild the team, you trust him in building a contender around Iverson?
> 
> Also the hindsight criticism on the Webber deal is riddiculous. I find it insane that people will rip it apart now, when they were cheerleading for it when it happened. That just irks me.
> 
> ...


I'd like to say first of all that I was never thrilled with the C-Webb trade, but I think you under-rate Kenny Thomas. He's a pretty good player, who's just not fit to play with AI. The thing is, Webber isn't either.

But, BK should be forgiven for the DC situation. People forget, he played brilliantly in 03(even if the contract was a little excessive). He tried the next year too, he just got injured too much.


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## Sliccat (Oct 16, 2004)

My biggest problem with King, really, is that he let both the Mashburn contract and the exception they got from Marc Jackson's trade expire.

But, he does seem to finally have a real plan for the team, so I'm cool with watching him work for a while.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

sliccat said:


> My biggest problem with King, really, is that he let both the Mashburn contract and the exception they got from Marc Jackson's trade expire.
> 
> But, he does seem to finally have a real plan for the team, so I'm cool with watching him work for a while.


 That frightens me more, that was the ultimate leverage he had with those 2 and was able to do nothing with it. Ineptness at its finest


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

sliccat said:


> I'd like to say first of all that I was never thrilled with the C-Webb trade, but I think you under-rate Kenny Thomas. He's a pretty good player, who's just not fit to play with AI. The thing is, Webber isn't either.


Kenny Thomas is a reserve forward who put up low-level double doubles. He had no impact on wins or losses, his stats were hollow. I was a fan at first, but after the contract and a year it became tiresome. It's not like he was anything worth of note defensively. I'll say not only is Webber better than what we got in return, his contract runs up sooner than Kenny Thomas'.

A thing is though, we've had a ton of players come through and the claim is they couldn't play with Iverson. I have a hard time believing talent around Iverson was the problem people make it out to be when you see former Sixers producing in different locales (ex. Matt Harpring).



> But, BK should be forgiven for the DC situation. People forget, he played brilliantly in 03(even if the contract was a little excessive). He tried the next year too, he just got injured too much.


No, I'm not forgiving him. DC was playing for a contract those years. The year after he put it in the tank. What's worse is that King was on the radio refusing to take blame for DC. They could've gotten out of DC's contract but instead he does a sign and trade involving Amal "Can't Ball" McCaskill and DC for Corliss Williamson, then re-signed Skinner, and then made the move for Webber.

To me his biggest problem is trying to fix a hole in the ground, by digging further. He's made a multitude of mistakes by trying to cover up mistakes. That said I still don't consider the Webber trade a mistake, it's just he had no vision for which to build a team to compliment the trade.

Right here I have to take up for Billy (as much as it pains me), their refusal to use the trade exception received in the Marc Jackson deal (I thought it expired at the end of this month?), and Jamal Mashburn is a clear sign of the ownership's refusal to pay the luxury tax. So basically they're your typical Philly sports franchise (sans Flyers, which are owned by the same damned people).

Proof of this reluctance is the fact they're only targetting players who must be acquired via sign and trade, and not players who will use up the MLE. If I could blame Billy King for that, I would, but I can't so I won't. 

Ed Snider said in the playoffs two years ago "We're paying players who can't play.." and King followed up using the amnesty rule on McKie, trading Marc Jackson for cash, a trade exception and the right to exchange second round picks. He paid Dalembert and Korver, but the team was actually sitting in a better cap situation than the year prior.


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## Sliccat (Oct 16, 2004)

> A thing is though, we've had a ton of players come through and the claim is they couldn't play with Iverson. I have a hard time believing talent around Iverson was the problem people make it out to be when you see former Sixers producing in different locales (ex. Matt Harpring).


Matt Harpring, Raja Bell... wow. Two young players developed. Not many people get better after AI(although, that's mostly because LB loved veterans) Who else? Jerry Stackhouse? That's just two young stars ****ing each other up.

It's a very specific type of player that meshes with AI. Pure shooters, and people who don't need the ball to create(whether offensively or defensively). Toni Kucoc, Van Horn, Robinson and Matt Harpring are streak shooters. Same for stackhouse. Larry Hughes was a rookie, and more of a Larry Brown issue.

The perfect team for AI would either be what they had in 01(four defensive players, scorer off the bench) or if you wanted to be a little more creative, add in a shawn marion. Shaq could play with AI(big deal). Who else? Jefferson, Amare, people of that nature. Chris Webber is a bad fit because he operates best as at least part of the main offensive route. He's not built to be a definate 2nd option.

If Billy King has a main fault, it would be that he repeats the same mistake over and over, again, thinking that the problem is the player, when its the philosiphy. AI doesn't need a second scorer, he needs a bunch of third/fourth options. Kucoc, Van Horn, Robinson, Jackson, Stackhouse, Coleman, Harpring, Webber... it's all the same! They've been doing the same thing for eight of his ten years, each time with a bigger name on the back of the jersey, because people kept buying into it. Put AI on the Suns, and they'll still get 50-60 wins. Give AI, i don't know... Josh Smith, Korver, Iggy, (a healthy) Marcus Camby, and Ben Wallace, or something along those lines, and you would've had championships.



> I thought it expired at the end of this month?


Nope, it expired in Febuary.


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

sliccat said:


> Matt Harpring, Raja Bell... wow. Two young players developed. Not many people get better after AI(although, that's mostly because LB loved veterans) Who else? Jerry Stackhouse? That's just two young stars ****ing each other up.


Matt Harpring didn't develop, he was practically the same player when he went to Utah but his numbers shot up the next season playing practically the same minutes. Bowen has proven to be a capable contributor on the Heat, and Spurs in his career. There's more than just the two you mentioned, as a lot of those players have stuck around in the league.



> It's a very specific type of player that meshes with AI. Pure shooters, and people who don't need the ball to create(whether offensively or defensively). Toni Kucoc, Van Horn, Robinson and Matt Harpring are streak shooters. Same for stackhouse. Larry Hughes was a rookie, and more of a Larry Brown issue.


And that's the problem. AI has never changed his game for the betterment of others, it's always the players needed to sacrifice for him. I think when Iverson finally sacrifices parts of his game for his team is when he'll see his most success.



> The perfect team for AI would either be what they had in 01(four defensive players, scorer off the bench) or if you wanted to be a little more creative, add in a shawn marion. Shaq could play with AI(big deal). Who else? Jefferson, Amare, people of that nature. Chris Webber is a bad fit because he operates best as at least part of the main offensive route. He's not built to be a definate 2nd option.


The thing is even if you put a team similar to the one from 2000-01 around him, that team wouldn't get to the Finals. Also, I'm not sure if he could play with Shaq because Shaq likes his touches. Could Iverson give him alley-oops? Sure. The thing with Shaq is, most of his offense comes from his pounding in the post and if he doesn't get that he'll start griping. Also to fit with Shaq, Iverson would have to sacrifice his game. Even though he works low post, Shaq is similar to Webber in that he also likes to be a facilitator and find the open man.

Chris Webber and Allen Iverson could work together, but they don't, it's more of a mental thing. It's the same reason I think a pairing of Iverson and Pierce wouldn't work as some think.



> If Billy King has a main fault, it would be that he repeats the same mistake over and over, again, thinking that the problem is the player, when its the philosiphy. AI doesn't need a second scorer, he needs a bunch of third/fourth options. Kucoc, Van Horn, Robinson, Jackson, Stackhouse, Coleman, Harpring, Webber... it's all the same! They've been doing the same thing for eight of his ten years, each time with a bigger name on the back of the jersey, because people kept buying into it. Put AI on the Suns, and they'll still get 50-60 wins. Give AI, i don't know... Josh Smith, Korver, Iggy, (a healthy) Marcus Camby, and Ben Wallace, or something along those lines, and you would've had championships.


You're wrong in including Toni Kukoc in there, as his purpose was never to be the second scorer, it was to be the three point shooter that that team didn't have. Marc Jackson was brought in to be that scorer off the bench that you said the team needs. Harpring wasn't brought in as a second scorer either, he was brought in to play his blue collar style and hustle.

Put AI on the Suns, and they won't be playing the same style they are now, and players such as Boris Diaw would suffer for it. Considering Boris Diaw was a huge reason for their success, I'm doubting the Suns would be just as good. Steve Nash allows those players to get the touches they need, and they prosper with them.



> Nope, it expired in Febuary.


No, trade exceptions expire a year after they are acquired. So it's impossible for it to have expired in February.


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## Sliccat (Oct 16, 2004)

> Matt Harpring didn't develop, he was practically the same player when he went to Utah but his numbers shot up the next season playing practically the same minutes. Bowen has proven to be a capable contributor on the Heat, and Spurs in his career. There's more than just the two you mentioned, as a lot of those players have stuck around in the league


I wasn't watching basketball when bowen was on the team. Name players post-lockout. But, from what I know, that's an extremely bad example, just from styles of play.



> The thing is even if you put a team similar to the one from 2000-01 around him, that team wouldn't get to the Finals. Also, I'm not sure if he could play with Shaq because Shaq likes his touches. Could Iverson give him alley-oops? Sure. The thing with Shaq is, most of his offense comes from his pounding in the post and if he doesn't get that he'll start griping. Also to fit with Shaq, Iverson would have to sacrifice his game. Even though he works low post, Shaq is similar to Webber in that he also likes to be a facilitator and find the open man.
> 
> Chris Webber and Allen Iverson could work together, but they don't, it's more of a mental thing. It's the same reason I think a pairing of Iverson and Pierce wouldn't work as some think.



First of all, a mental thing? Of course it is, everything in life is a mental thing. There is no reason why two players wouldn't mesh other than "a mental thing." Why do you think people play the way they do? It's their mentality. That's a ridiculous statement.

Second, Shaq and AI would work together, first of all, because the big man in the lane is AI's only natural passing target. He might not post up as much, but AI naturally gives centers easy baskets, he's just never had a big who was particularly great at it. A player like Shaq would get a good 10-14 ppg just off AI assists, and judging by CWebb's number of posessions, giving him the rest in post up plays would be no problem.



> You're wrong in including Toni Kukoc in there, as his purpose was never to be the second scorer, it was to be the three point shooter that that team didn't have. Marc Jackson was brought in to be that scorer off the bench that you said the team needs. Harpring wasn't brought in as a second scorer either, he was brought in to play his blue collar style and hustle.


Kucoc is a player, who along the same lines as those on the list, needs to have a good, constistant, feel of the ball. And did you watch the '04-05 season? How many passes did Jackson drop, and how many easy baskets did he **** up because he couldn't jump? If, hypothetically, Shaq were to play the same role as Jackson did, he might've averaged 17 a game.



> And that's the problem. AI has never changed his game for the betterment of others, it's always the players needed to sacrifice for him. I think when Iverson finally sacrifices parts of his game for his team is when he'll see his most success.


Yes, he does. He didn't at the beginning or the middle of his career, but he really has tried to work with Webber and Robinson. Not to mention he also gives the ball up to Iguadala a lot more than he would normally, Iggy just gives it back. He doesn't play the same way with webber as he did with Hill, Mutumbo, or Ratliff. He adjusts to players. His overall approach to the game might stay the same, but he comes nowhere close to being as inflexible as you (in your fierce sick-of-losing attitude) claim he is.


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

sliccat said:


> I wasn't watching basketball when bowen was on the team. Name players post-lockout. But, from what I know, that's an extremely bad example, just from styles of play.


Bruce Bowen was on the team post lockout. It's not a bad example either, he was a hard working defensive player who doesn't need the ball to make a difference in the game.



> First of all, a mental thing? Of course it is, everything in life is a mental thing. There is no reason why two players wouldn't mesh other than "a mental thing." Why do you think people play the way they do? It's their mentality. That's a ridiculous statement.


Not quite, their mentalities refuse to allow them to mesh. Their games would work together, but neither sacrifices anything.



> Second, Shaq and AI would work together, first of all, because the big man in the lane is AI's only natural passing target. He might not post up as much, but AI naturally gives centers easy baskets, he's just never had a big who was particularly great at it. A player like Shaq would get a good 10-14 ppg just off AI assists, and judging by CWebb's number of posessions, giving him the rest in post up plays would be no problem.


Just how you said Webber needs to be "atleast part of the main offensive route", that's why Shaq and AI wouldn't work. Shaq's not the type of player who gets the majority of his points directly off of assists, a good portion of his points come off of the re-post up. Again much like Webber, he likes being the facilitator, offensively. Shaq now requires a lot of touches.



> Kucoc is a player, who along the same lines as those on the list, needs to have a good, constistant, feel of the ball. And did you watch the '04-05 season? How many passes did Jackson drop, and how many easy baskets did he **** up because he couldn't jump? If, hypothetically, Shaq were to play the same role as Jackson did, he might've averaged 17 a game.


Were either Marc Jackson or Kukoc brought to be the second scorer? Was Harpring? No. And that's what you said, you're trying to change arguments mid stream. 



> Yes, he does. He didn't at the beginning or the middle of his career, but he really has tried to work with Webber and Robinson. Not to mention he also gives the ball up to Iguadala a lot more than he would normally, Iggy just gives it back. He doesn't play the same way with webber as he did with Hill, Mutumbo, or Ratliff. He adjusts to players. His overall approach to the game might stay the same, but he comes nowhere close to being as inflexible as you (in your fierce sick-of-losing attitude) claim he is.


Then why hasn't the amount of touches for Iverson dropped, but instead went up? His assist totals have risen thanks to how much he controls the ball offensively. I never said he couldn't/hasn't adapted, what I'm saying is in the process he hasn't given up one iota of his game for the betterment of his team on a prolonged basis. He hasn't, which you admit to, and that's my whole point regarding him.


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## DieSlow69 (Apr 18, 2005)

Coatesvillain said:


> And that's the problem. AI has never changed his game for the betterment of others, it's always the players needed to sacrifice for him. I think when Iverson finally sacrifices parts of his game for his team is when he'll see his most success.



Damn Coatesvillian why all the HATE for A.I. He has given this team everything and you bash him like he's a selfish *****. And how can you say he's never givin up any part of his game for others....Thats ridiculous....A.I. has never had players around him except for one year that compliment him....BOTTOM LINE...... Your Franchis Player rarely changes for the other players:

JORDAN: Best player to play the game....DID he sacrifice....No Management built a team around him.....and they owned!!!! 

Bird, Magic, Kareem, Moses, Dr J. hell all the greats had TEAMS...that managment built or bought.....

I THOUGHT IT WAS ALWAYS UP TO THE MANAGEMENT....TO GET A SUPERSTAR AND BUILD AROUND HIM....SO WHY ARE YOU BLAMING A.I.


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## Coatesvillain (Jul 17, 2002)

DieSlow69 said:


> Damn Coatesvillian why all the HATE for A.I. He has given this team everything and you bash him like he's a selfish *****. And how can you say he's never givin up any part of his game for others....Thats ridiculous....A.I. has never had players around him except for one year that compliment him....BOTTOM LINE...... Your Franchis Player rarely changes for the other players:


The core of the team that was with him for the Finals year were around him for at least two years prior, so obviously it couldn't have been one year that he had players around him that compliment him.

I'm not the biggest Iverson fan, but I don't hate him as a player. I think he has to be moved for this team to move in one direction or another, for the past five years they've tried putting a team together that would get over the hump to a championship and in those five years we've had five coaches, and missed the playoffs twice. 

I think Allen Iverson is a great player, and a definite Hall of Famer, but it's in both sides best interest to split up. I've been saying this for years now. Yeah, I guess it's great to see him put up great numbers, but when the team is treading water at best.. what's the point? 

I've been saying for a few years now that he would be a much more dangerous and valuable player, if he looked to get more of his points in the flow of the game while giving up some of the ballhandling. Give his teammates confidence, while altering his style. Everyone knows that he can score 50 on any given night, but that's not healthy for the team the way he does it. It's a similar situation with Kobe and the Lakers, how they were one way when Kobe dominated the ball.. but in the playoffs when he got points in the flow and set others up everyone thrived (eventually talent caught up). If Iverson would do that, I think the Sixers last year would've been a better team but really I don't think he'll sacrifice any part of his game like that while he's in Philly.

I mean, hell I spoke in the past how I think if he was traded to the Hawks, he would boost them into the playoffs. So what part of that is hate?



> JORDAN: Best player to play the game....DID he sacrifice....No Management built a team around him.....and they owned!!!!


Uh, Jordan sacrificed a lot when he finally bought into the triangle offense that Phil Jackson instilled. And management did build a team around him.



> Bird, Magic, Kareem, Moses, Dr J. hell all the greats had TEAMS...that managment built or bought.....
> 
> I THOUGHT IT WAS ALWAYS UP TO THE MANAGEMENT....TO GET A SUPERSTAR AND BUILD AROUND HIM....SO WHY ARE YOU BLAMING A.I.


Who says I haven't blamed management. People have this misconception that you have to blame one or the other, I've blamed all parties involved no one can wash their hands of this. It goes from Ed Snider down.


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## BEEZ (Jun 12, 2002)

I have honestly not responded much the last few days to see whats going on in this forum. There are few Sixers fans and many AI fans. I am probably one of the biggest AI supporters, but fans of the team would know that a trade is whats best for the team and AI both. I'm tired of hearing a team should be built around AI. Its impossible for that to happen because of him, and him not changing his game to fit others. Dieslow69 the fact that you said Jordan never changed his game shows that you were not very familiar with the early Jodan and the type of player he became. This isnt about being loyal to AI but this team, I refuse to spend another 8 grand for 2 season tickets for mediocrity and this team with AI is what we have had for like the last 3 seasons. You all may be ok with that but I'm not and a real fan wouldnt. gaudy stats and continual .500 or below teams is what most of you would rather have.


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