# Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged again!)



## roux (Jun 20, 2006)

*Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

According to Marc Stein and espn.com the Chandler for PJ Brown and JR Smith trade will more than likely happen soon, and that the teams are close to a verbal agreement. Small details and thow in players could still be included, such as malik allen

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2508889


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## ZÆ (Aug 1, 2005)

*Bulls close to trading Chandler*

on ESPN News they just said that the Bulls are close to making a deal that would send Chlander to the Hornets for Jr Smith and PJ Brown


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## ZÆ (Aug 1, 2005)

*Re: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

sorry Bulls mods roux2dope and I posted at the same time, o and I spent trading worng :biggrin: 

http://www.basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?t=285423


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## Lynx (Mar 6, 2004)

*Re: Bulls close to tradeing Chandler*



Hornets will get nothing in return.


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## ZÆ (Aug 1, 2005)

*Re: Bulls close to tradeing Chandler*



Lynx said:


> Hornets will get nothing in return.


ya, great trade for you guys


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## mw2889 (Dec 15, 2005)

*Re: Chandler To New Orleans more than likely to Happen*

That would be incredible, JR has huge upside, and is already better than chandler.


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## Ruff Draft (Nov 21, 2004)

*Re: Chandler To New Orleans more than likely to Happen*



mw2889 said:


> That would be incredible, JR has huge upside, and is already better than chandler.


Can you compare an unproven SG to an unproven PF?


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

That would be the worst trade in Bulls' history if we traded Chandler/Allen for PJ/JR. We'd damn well better get a 1st rounder too. Chandler is worth more than both of those guys together, plus Allen too...what a joke. JR had better REALLY improve a LOT if he comes to Chicago, cause he stunk to put it mildly, and PJ is worthless too...old as dirt and nothing great on top of that all.


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## animalthugism (Aug 23, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

What kind of contract is PJ currently under?...


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## Tooeasy (Nov 4, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



animalthugism said:


> What kind of contract is PJ currently under?...


1 more year for 8 million.


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## Ruff Draft (Nov 21, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



animalthugism said:


> What kind of contract is PJ currently under?...


He is written off the books next year for like $8m I think?


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## mizenkay (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...lsside,1,6318200.story?coll=cs-home-headlines



> Reached by phone in California, Chandler said he has heard rumors that he could be traded.
> 
> "I've been hearing a lot of stuff," he said. "It really doesn't bother me. I'm a Chicago Bull. As of right now, my focus is on getting better and working out this summer.
> 
> ...


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## HORNETSFAN (Jun 11, 2002)

*Re: Chandler To New Orleans more than likely to Happen*



mw2889 said:


> That would be incredible, JR has huge upside, and is already better than chandler.


You gotta be kidding! JR has athletic potential, but is a head case. He is immature and his wacky father follows him everywhere making demands. If he matures, he might develop, but at the rate he is going, he will be out of the league soon.


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## rwj333 (Aug 10, 2002)

*Re: Chandler To New Orleans more than likely to Happen*

I think Chandler will be regarded as better than Wallace as soon as next year. 

I hate this.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I seriously doubt that...


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## BG7 (Jun 25, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



mizenkay said:


> http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...lsside,1,6318200.story?coll=cs-home-headlines


Rip up the trade contract now, Tyson wants to be part of this championship potential team. I'd say he finally has a :fire:


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## FireCartwrightNow (Oct 30, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I have no idea what Paxson is doing right now...


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## Bullsky (Jun 11, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I'm sure this has been answered, but I'm to tired to go look into the threadzilla but...

Could we do this trade, drop Pargo and still have money to get...say...Wilcox or Harrington?

I think Al might take a pay drop if Big Ben is the house.


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## The ROY (Nov 11, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Wallace
Brown / Thomas / Sweetney
Deng / Nocioni / Khyrapa
Gordon / Sefolosha / Smith
Hinrich / Duhon

We still have some assets we could move for a GOOD back-up center.


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## darlets (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



The ROY said:


> Wallace
> Brown / Thomas / Sweetney
> Deng / Nocioni / Khyrapa
> Gordon / Sefolosha / Smith
> ...


I'm thinking Paxson realizes/thinks as well that Chandler and Wallace on the court at the same time won't be a great pairing.

Brown and Sweetney can play the body up role on big guys with Wallace doing what he does best, playing help D.

Brown play 31 minutes last year. Not sure whether we could grab Ely as well, sign him straight up.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



darlets said:


> I'm thinking Paxson realizes/thinks as well that Chandler and Wallace on the court at the same time won't be a great pairing.
> 
> Brown and Sweetney can play the body up role on big guys with Wallace doing what he does best, playing help D.
> 
> Brown play 31 minutes last year. Not sure whether we could grab Ely as well, sign him straight up.


Why is Wallace/Chandler any worse a pairing than AD/Chandler? Seems to me Wallace can do everything AD did and then some.


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Dont Dump Chandler!!!!!


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

We traded Curry to a mess in NY, but Chandler in New Orleans would be a different story. The best young PG in the game, a rugged post scorer in West, Peja to keep teams honest, Jackson and Mason to push the tempo, etc. Armstrong/Simmons/Chandler is quite the three headed defensive monster in the post. He could very well flourish there.


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## PC Load Letter (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Following up the signing of Wallace with this downright sickening trade would leave a horribly sour taste in my mouth. I mean, PJ Brown? Even if he was 25, he'd still be PJ Brown. But he's 36! We have to at least get one of New Orleans' first rounders to even make the trade in the vicinity of respectable.

Horrible, horrible, horrible...


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## draft tyrus (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

hahahaha... everyone always raps on Tyson but now that he's about to leave, everyone wants to keep him around?


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## ChiTownFan (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Where's all this Chandler love coming from?

Is it just me, or was it almost upsetting to the point of insanity everytime Chandler touched the ball last year, only to bring it down and have it swiped by Earl Boykins? 

My point is, Chandler has a huge, unwarranted contract, which NO is, for some reason, willing to absorb, and we get a proven (but not great) strong post player, and a guard just bursting with potential. If you all are comfortable with our 4/5 averaging (combined) 5 pts and 18 rebs, then keep Chandler. Otherwise, let PJ come in for a year, average 10/10 and then use the freed up cap room to make another move next year.


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## kulaz3000 (May 3, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



draft tyrus said:


> hahahaha... everyone always raps on Tyson but now that he's about to leave, everyone wants to keep him around?


Its because this trade for Brown is not for benefical reasons for the team, but moreso finacially when it comes time to reup the other core. Thats why people are flexed about it, trade Chandler for someone more legit and we'll be fine about it. Just the concept of this trade is ridiculous.


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## PC Load Letter (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



draft tyrus said:


> hahahaha... everyone always raps on Tyson but now that he's about to leave, everyone wants to keep him around?


If it's between that and trading him for Grandpa Munster, yes.


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## draft tyrus (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



kulaz3000 said:


> Its because this trade for Brown is not for benefical reasons for the team, but moreso finacially when it comes time to reup the other core. Thats why people are flexed about it, trade Chandler for someone more legit and we'll be fine about it. Just the concept of this trade is ridiculous.


so? I'd rather have Kirk, Luol, and Ben for five years than Tyson for five years. I don't get it.


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## kulaz3000 (May 3, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



ChiTownFan said:


> Where's all this Chandler love coming from?
> 
> Is it just me, or was it almost upsetting to the point of insanity everytime Chandler touched the ball last year, only to bring it down and have it swiped by Earl Boykins?
> 
> My point is, Chandler has a huge, unwarranted contract, which NO is, for some reason, willing to absorb, and we get a proven (but not great) strong post player, and a guard just bursting with potential. If you all are comfortable with our 4/5 averaging (combined) 5 pts and 18 rebs, then keep Chandler. Otherwise, let PJ come in for a year, average 10/10 and then use the freed up cap room to make another move next year.


With Wallaces new contract, and the probable(hopeful) extention of Hinrich this offseason to go, we won't have the cap to do anything else next off season in terms of big aquisition by free agency signees. Thats why to lose chandler for nothing after one season doesn't sit well with me. Because we're going to have to obtain a big once Brown leaves, when Wallace regresses further, then we're left with Tyrus who is still undersized with a bunch of 6'8 players around him. Then add a rookie centre next year? You think we can contend against the big shots with a rookie centre? Then to obtain that rookie centre we're going to have to break up and trade one of our core players, so in hindsight its not looking good in terms of keeping our core together..


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## PC Load Letter (Jun 29, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

**** cap space! We'd likely just be using the extra cash to sign our own guys, not even add anyone else. This organization should be committed to doing that, REGARDLESS of our salary cap position.


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## draft tyrus (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



PC Load Letter said:


> **** cap space! We'd likely just be using the extra cash to sign our own guys, not even add anyone else. This organization should be committed to doing that, REGARDLESS of our salary cap position.


but can we do that without the necessary space we would get by clearing Tyson's contract and acquiring PJ's?

I guess I don't understand the whole salary cap thing...


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

God bless Marc Stein.

Am I the only one a bit skeptical that George f'n Shinn is willing to add Tyson's salary to his roster... a roster that just drafted two young bigs in Simmons/Armstrong, has a proven big in need of a major raise in West, and having already committed 70 million over the next few seasons to Peja and BJax? 5 years and 54 million from Tysons deal, using my ghetto math, adds up to over 110 million in salary added over the next 5 years (not including Simmons/Armstrongs rookie deals, West's extension, and maxing out Chris Paul in 2 years)

Maybe its a done deal, maybe not. But if you were Shinn... dont' you think you give Simmons or Armstrong a real shot to pair with West in the post? As much as I love TC, he ain't a for sure thing and not at 50 million either. We shall see.


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## kulaz3000 (May 3, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



superdave said:


> God bless Marc Stein.
> 
> Am I the only one a bit skeptical that George f'n Shinn is willing to add Tyson's salary to his roster... a roster that just drafted two young bigs in Simmons/Armstrong, has a proven big in need of a major raise in West, and having already committed 70 million over the next few seasons to Peja and BJax? 5 years and 54 million from Tysons deal, using my ghetto math, adds up to over 110 million in salary added over the next 5 years (not including Simmons/Armstrongs rookie deals, West's extension, and maxing out Chris Paul in 2 years)
> 
> Maybe its a done deal, maybe not. But if you were Shinn... dont' you think you give Simmons or Armstrong a real shot to pair with West in the post? As much as I love TC, he ain't a for sure thing and not at 50 million either. We shall see.


If i was Paxson, id leave the scrub JR Smith in NO, and steal of their rookie bigs in Simmons/Armstrong. Preferably both even...


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## Salvaged Ship (Jul 10, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



DaBabyBullz said:


> That would be the worst trade in Bulls' history if we traded Chandler/Allen for PJ/JR. We'd damn well better get a 1st rounder too. Chandler is worth more than both of those guys together, plus Allen too...what a joke. JR had better REALLY improve a LOT if he comes to Chicago, cause he stunk to put it mildly, and PJ is worthless too...old as dirt and nothing great on top of that all.


Trading Tyson Chandler would be the worst trade in Bulls history???? The trade Krause made to get Chandler was one of the worst in NBA HISTORY. The Rose trade was miles worse. Look at what Paxson has done. Give him some slack. 

Every offseason people forget how bad Chandler is and focus on the "potential" thing. Because he said he is going to be an all star we should keep him? See he is in California, and planned on being back in Chi August 1. I thought he was staying in Chicago for the summer to work on his game? 

If we can clear space and give ourselves future flexibility to sign other free agents or not lose our young core, I say it is worth it. Brown for a year or two while Tyrus grows, thewn Tyrus is the man. You have to think that way. And where were Chandler's minutes coming from. 10 mil a year for 15-20 minutes a game tops?


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## draft tyrus (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



Salvaged Ship said:


> Trading Tyson Chandler would be the worst trade in Bulls history???? The trade Krause made to get Chandler was one of the worst in NBA HISTORY. The Rose trade was miles worse. Look at what Paxson has done. Give him some slack.
> 
> *Every offseason people forget how bad Chandler is and focus on the "potential" thing.* Because he said he is going to be an all star we should keep him? See he is in California, and planned on being back in Chi August 1. I thought he was staying in Chicago for the summer to work on his game?
> 
> If we can clear space and give ourselves future flexibility to sign other free agents or not lose our young core, I say it is worth it. Brown for a year or two while Tyrus grows, thewn Tyrus is the man. You have to think that way. And where were Chandler's minutes coming from. 10 mil a year for 15-20 minutes a game tops?


I totally agree. He's had his chances. I still don't get what people see in him. During the season everyone wants to unload him and now he's Michael all of a sudden.


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## Greg Ostertag! (May 1, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I agree with 'draft tyrus'. If Chandler stays on the books, after the rest of the 'core' is signed up (Hinrich, Gordon, Deng, Nocioni) you'll have 6 guys making 10 million + annually! Someone has to go. The chance to trade Chandler's contract like this may not come up ever again, and you end up losing one of the aforementioned 4 players and feeling like Detroit fans do today.

Not to mention you guys are severely underrating PJ Brown who has held down center in the West for 2 seasons putting up essentially a double double.

I'd be more concerned about JR Smith coming here and causing problems.


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## anorexorcist (Aug 3, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

let him go, people. it's for the best. 

unless you want me to bump threads from the season where certain members were ripping on TC like no other. and now are all oozing with love for him. sheesh.


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## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

PJ Brown really isn't that good. He's old, and he only averaged 9 and 7. Chandler could give us that too and for many more years.


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## TwinkieTowers (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Might as well put Tyus Thomas into the fire now. I bet he'll put up numbers similar to Tyson's in 2005, add a few more points. If he has that reckless dunking abandon that Amare had his rookie season, his intensity and athleticism may just make up for his raw skill.

An expiring PJ contract and dunk specialist full of potential JR? Count me in.


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## Greg Ostertag! (May 1, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



CiMa said:


> PJ Brown really isn't that good. He's old, and he only averaged 9 and 7. Chandler could give us that too and for many more years.


At the expense of Hinrich, Gordon, Nocioni or Deng.

Has anyone though through the long term implications of this? Sweet merciful crap. You can't have your cake and eat it too.


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## cima (Nov 6, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



Greg Ostertag! said:


> At the expense of Hinrich, Gordon, Nocioni or Deng.
> 
> Has anyone though through the long term implications of this? Sweet merciful crap. You can't have your cake and eat it too.


I'm more willing to part with Deng than Chandler. I always looked at Deng as the odd man out of the group. Plus he could bring us more back than a grandpa and a headcase.


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## superdave (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



CiMa said:


> PJ Brown really isn't that good. He's old, and he only averaged 9 and 7. Chandler could give us that too and for many more years.


Chandler averaged 5 and 9 in the East. DWest really blew up for New Orleans last season which was partially to blame for decline in averages. Anyone with Insider, which player had a higher PER last season? The season before? Just curious.


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## UMfan83 (Jan 15, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Maybe I'm drunk and all, but as much as I hated Chandler as a disapointing player, I really really liked him as a person. He was the heart of the Bulls, and when he came to play he came to play. I think the Bulls will really miss him if the trade indeed happens. Tyson, you are a good guy.

I'll never forget his wild celebrations. Big wins in the last 2 years at the United Center, which saw him flailing his arms around wildly in celebration and getting the crowd pumped up... more then anyone he could get the crowd pumped up. He knew what it was like to lose with our sad team, and how great it felt to rise above all of that and win again.


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## Greg Ostertag! (May 1, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

This board would explode if Deng was on the block, if we are comparing opinions on Deng and Chandler relatively speaking.

It seems most are still delirious from the Wallace signing and subsequent thrust into contendership. You should know to trust Paxson by now.


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## TwinkieTowers (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Could this become a Tyrus vs. Tyson debate?


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## kulaz3000 (May 3, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



TwinkieTowers said:


> Could this become a Tyrus vs. Tyson debate?


If anyone should be happy its Tyrus more than anyone on the bulls. With the signing of Wallace he just got a whole load of pressure lifted off him.


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## Mr. T (Jan 29, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

If we have to trade Chandler, how about to Dallas for Marquis Daniels and Desagna Diop?



What would it take to get Okur from Utah?

​


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## rwj333 (Aug 10, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



Greg Ostertag! said:


> I agree with 'draft tyrus'. If Chandler stays on the books, after the rest of the 'core' is signed up (Hinrich, Gordon, Deng, Nocioni) you'll have 6 guys making 10 million + annually! Someone has to go. The chance to trade Chandler's contract like this may not come up ever again, and you end up losing one of the aforementioned 4 players and feeling like Detroit fans do today.
> 
> Not to mention you guys are severely underrating PJ Brown who has held down center in the West for 2 seasons putting up essentially a double double.
> 
> I'd be more concerned about JR Smith coming here and causing problems.


Why does Chandler's presence on our payroll prevent us from resigning our other guys? Philadelphia and Dallas are much smaller, less profitable markets. Yet they can afford to pay the luxury tax and we can't? 

I can understand when a small-market team like Phoenix trades away draft picks for cash. They immediately start losing money when they cross the luxury tax threshold. But the Bulls do not.


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## Pay Ton (Apr 18, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I don't know if I like this move yet. Chandler was always one of my favorite players in the league (struggles or not), but this could potentially make our team better.

JR Smith is a good player when he's focused, which was little and rare last year.

PJ Brown is like...70. But he's still solid. Our team would definitely be top 5 in the East for sure I think, barring injuries.

But for how long? Two years? Then what? Will Pax be able to make the necessary moves to keep our team afloat in the East? I hope so.

There are many questions running in my mind with this trade, but I think Paxson in the end will prove his worth as a GM and make us better, for now and the long haul.


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## JPTurbo (Jan 8, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

This trade just doesn't make sense. Smith would be our third string SG. PJ would be our starting PF but is horribly old and isn't much of an upgrade. His offense is a little better but his defense can't be much better. The only thing that makes a little sense is the 8M expiring contract, but is it really worth it. Tyson has always shown that he wants to be a part of a winning Bulls team. 

Am I the only one that thinks this is rediculous?!? Can't Big Ben light a fire under Tyson?!?! Don't we already have enough pieces that we don't need to trade Tyson unless we are getting a superstar?!?!


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## TwinkieTowers (Jul 16, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



> Don't we already have enough pieces that we don't need to trade Tyson unless we are getting a superstar?!?!


Yes, because the Clippers would LOVE to get Tyson Chandler back for Elton Brand.


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## JeremyB0001 (Nov 17, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

It appears to me that a good deal of the posts in this thread are based upon a misunderstanding regarding the salary cap. The salary cap really only pertains to a team's ability to sign free agents for an anual salary greater than the midlevel exception of roughly $5 million per year. There is never a limit to the amount of money a team can spend _re_signing players except for rare cases when a player's original deal was less than three seasons (this is what happened in the past with 2nd round draft picks such as Boozer and Arenas who signed two year deals), only a luxury tax threshold that forces the team's owner to pay additional money out of his pocket once the team's salaray approaches a certain point. That means that Chandler's contract would never prevent the Bulls from resigning Hinrich or Nocinoi considering that the Bulls are allowed to outbid any other team in the NBA. 

Furthermore, I have yet to read an argument that the Bulls would trade Chandler for Brown's expiring contract for the purpose of sending the team back under the cap again next offseason so that it can sign another free agent (I am not sure under what cap circumstances, if any, this is possible in light of the expected resigning of Hinrich and Nocioni). It appears the only financial arguments in favor of swapping Chandler's remaining five seasons out for Brown's expiring contract are keeping payroll down and steering clear of the luxury tax for the sake of Jerry Reinsdorf's pockets. After finishing 5th, 3rd, 2nd, and 2nd in attendance the last four seasons with a moderately successful team, it strikes me that Reinsdorf should pony up whatever amount of money necessary for a championship contending team in the third largest market in the country. While J.R. Smith does have undeniable value it shocks me that anyone would sacrifice five seasons of a 23 year old 7'2 athletic freak with a PER (player efficiency rating) for the last three seasons of 14.21, 16.50, and 12.23 for one season of a 36 year old gritty veteran with a PER for the last three years of 16.33, 15.54, and 12.72.


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



JPTurbo said:


> This trade just doesn't make sense. Smith would be our third string SG. PJ would be our starting PF but is horribly old and isn't much of an upgrade. His offense is a little better but his defense can't be much better. The only thing that makes a little sense is the 8M expiring contract, but is it really worth it. Tyson has always shown that he wants to be a part of a winning Bulls team.
> 
> Am I the only one that thinks this is rediculous?!? Can't Big Ben light a fire under Tyson?!?! Don't we already have enough pieces that we don't need to trade Tyson unless we are getting a superstar?!?!


You're definitely not the only one who thinks this trade scenario is absolutely ridiculous. It's one of the most f***ing retarded trades I've ever heard of. It's called the owner is being a tight-a*s with his money, and isn't thinking of the best interests of the team. If we were trading him for something (player or 1st round pick) that MIGHT improve our team I'd be all for it, but there's no possible way that this is improving our team AT ALL.


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## step (Sep 19, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Paxson is cookin suttin, he doesn't pull this move straight away unless it was for a reason. He can hold onto Chandler for this season and then ship him off for an expiring contract before the extensions to Hinrich and Nocioni come into effect. And by the end of next season Tyson should of no doubt improved his trade value, meaning we could actually get something useful in return.

Rider for Scola
Brown to mentor Tyrus till the deadline when he is used in a consolidation trade.


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



step said:


> Paxson is cookin suttin, he doesn't pull this move straight away unless it was for a reason. He can hold onto Chandler for this season and then ship him off for an expiring contract before the extensions to Hinrich and Nocioni come into effect. And by the end of next season Tyson should of no doubt improved his trade value, meaning we could actually get something useful in return.
> 
> Rider for Scola
> Brown to mentor Tyrus till the deadline when he is used in a consolidation trade.


That is what they should do. Keep him here while his contract isn't hurting anything, and try to see what his value will be at the deadline, or next offseason. Tradin him now is asinine.


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## LegoHat (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



DaBabyBullz said:


> That is what they should do. Keep him here while his contract isn't hurting anything, and try to see what his value will be at the deadline, or next offseason. Tradin him now is asinine.


Unless Pax believes we can win a championship if we add PJ and JR Smith, I personally don't think so, and I'm sure most people agree.


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## Dornado (May 26, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

selling low on Chandler is a big mistake....

I wish someone would have told me back in the day that we were going to essentially be trading Elton Brand for PJ Friggin' Brown. At least then I wouldn't have gotten my hopes up....


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## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



LegoHat said:


> Unless Pax believes we can win a championship if we add PJ and JR Smith, I personally don't think so, and I'm sure most people agree.


I don't see how those 2 are an upgrade any which way you can look at it. The only benefit is that you might get another 5 Mill in cap space to sign a FA backup Center. Last time I checked Chandler would be a pretty decent backup Center, and a very good power forward. I just can't make any sense of this trade, and I'm really hoping it's just rumors that never come to life.


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## Dancon7 (Jan 13, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



Pay Ton said:


> PJ Brown is like...70. But he's still solid. Our team would definitely be top 5 in the East for sure I think, barring injuries.


Our team was a top 5 team in the East in '04-'05 when we went 47-35. This team took a step back last year in the regular season at least, and a big reason was that Chandler didn't do anything all summer and came in out of shape and unprepared to play the 5. That was so he didn't get hurt and screw up his contract situation though, and he didn't seem to exhibit a bad work ethic before last summer.

The only way that this trade makes any sense is if the Bulls have gotten word that Chandler is loafing again this offseason. I don't think that's the case. I'm pretty sure he's working hard. So then why do it? Is there some sneaky NBA fix in where we're going to get LaBron or Oden next summer and need the cap space? Why would you trade a young 7 footer for an older, shorter guy? Chandler was in 5th grade when Brown was a rookie.

Tyrus Thomas is 6'8", so is Wallace. PJ Brown is 6'11" but old. I thought the Bulls learned their lesson about being undersized but I guess not.

I'm hoping that Pax comes to his senses and gives Tyson a chance to play with Ben Wallace. The help defense between them would be amazing, and he'd be back to having the height advantage he had his whole career besides last season when he had to play the 5 out of neccessity.

Maybe it's just the Cub fan in me, but I think we're travelling down Lou Brock/Dontrelle Willis territory with this one if we get rid of Chandler. What's the point of drafting a high school guy, giving him 10 mil a year, and then giving up on him before he gets to play one game next to Wallace?


----------



## Rodman (Feb 5, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



step said:


> Paxson is cookin suttin, he doesn't pull this move straight away unless it was for a reason. He can hold onto Chandler for this season and then ship him off for an expiring contract before the extensions to Hinrich and Nocioni come into effect. And by the end of next season Tyson should of no doubt improved his trade value, meaning we could actually get something useful in return.
> 
> *Rider for Scola*
> Brown to mentor Tyrus till the deadline when he is used in a consolidation trade.


That's exactly what I was thinking! And it would be a major coup if Pax could get that one worked out. Tyson for PJ Brown and Scola.... great! 
here are Scola's stats from last season, looks pretty damn good if you ask me. And SAS was very interested in JR Smith just before the trade deadline. I can only hope that something like this happens, and just in case we could add another 2nd rounder again.


----------



## SausageKingofChicago (Feb 14, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



CiMa said:


> PJ Brown really isn't that good. He's old, and he only averaged 9 and 7. Chandler could give us that too and for many more years.


So could a lot of people and we don't have to pay $10M per

I like the trade but would like to send JR on his way maybe on to Milwaukee for Joe Smith 

Joe Smith is in the last year of his contract as well and with the salary differentials between Joe Smith and JR and our cap space we have left we could absorb him 

Joe Smith is a talented scorer upfront who as the 3rd wheel behind Ben and PJ could provide an awesome , productive , veteran front line if we intend contending for the East this year 

With a team like this I think we can :

*

Wallace
Brown
Deng
Gordon
Hinrich

bench

Smith 
Thomas 
Nocioni
Sefolosha
Duhon

Sweetney
Khyrappa
Pargo

*


----------



## kulaz3000 (May 3, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I still reluctantly would demand one of the rookie bigs if the trade goes through...


----------



## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

If this trade goes down JReinsdorf just sucks. Esentially we by making this trade we are trading Wallace, Brwon, and Smith for Chandler and cap. We could've gotten more with the cap than Brown and Smith. That leaves Wallace for Chandler, which is an upgrade but negates my special feeling about signing Wallace. If we trade Chandler why make the longterm center peice of the deal a guy that will get no minutes on this team(smith)?


----------



## LegoHat (Jan 14, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



kulaz3000 said:


> I still reluctantly would demand one of the rookie bigs if the trade goes through...


If Hilton Armstrong was included I would also be more positive about this deal, but I don't see Charlotte parting ways with him already. He has something resembling an offensive game, and he would develop very nicely behind Wallace and Brown.

I'm not as negative about Smith as a lot of you guys, if any coach could light a fire in him it would be Skiles. Scott is a terrible coach, he didn't even play his best shooter Macijauskas last season for God's sake. If this trade goes down, I think we will get something out of Smith, he certainly has all the tools necesary to be a decent NBA guard. I don't buy into the whole "E-Rob part 2" craze one bit.


----------



## TomBoerwinkle#1 (Jul 31, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I was ok with this deal when the rumor surfaced, but now that the Wallace deal is really happening, I am much more inclined to give Tyson 1 more year to prove himself.

We do still ned a big capable of scoring a few points, though.

Hopefully Allstar wannabe Chandler understands this.

I am disappointed Ty isn't back in Chicago until August, though.


----------



## unBULLievable (Dec 13, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



TomBoerwinkle#1 said:


> I was ok with this deal when the rumor surfaced, but now that the Wallace deal is really happening, I am much more inclined to give Tyson 1 more year to prove himself.
> 
> We do still ned a big capable of scoring a few points, though.
> 
> ...


Be assured the Bulls won't pay 65 million dollars for player to play 20 mpg coming from the bench.Also the Bulls drafted Tyrus Thomas to play 15 mpg.

This is just business. The Bulls have more to gain by adding PJ. 

If Tyson was signed for 30 million..then he'd stay...but owing him 50+ million.....backup player..that loses focus easily......forget about it.


----------



## Ventura (Aug 9, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

doesnt jr have pretty bad jib?


----------



## kulaz3000 (May 3, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



LegoHat said:


> If Hilton Armstrong was included I would also be more positive about this deal, but I don't see Charlotte parting ways with him already. He has something resembling an offensive game, and he would develop very nicely behind Wallace and Brown.
> 
> I'm not as negative about Smith as a lot of you guys, if any coach could light a fire in him it would be Skiles. Scott is a terrible coach, he didn't even play his best shooter Macijauskas last season for God's sake. If this trade goes down, I think we will get something out of Smith, he certainly has all the tools necesary to be a decent NBA guard. I don't buy into the whole "E-Rob part 2" craze one bit.


I don't think so. Though Skiles gives everyone a chance down the bench, he gives it to the people willing to put in work in practise, and this is the same JR Smith that would ask whether shoot around was optional. I really dont think that type of attitude would rub Skiles or even Paxson the right way, i have a feeling that if Paxson was to sign off on the deal he would one of their bigs either Armstrong or Simmons, i don't see him wanting JR Smith and risking not being able to trade him.

But back to the point i really don't see someone like JR Smith getting off Skiles bench...


----------



## Salvaged Ship (Jul 10, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Two weeks ago people were complaining how Pax got hosed when he signed Chandler to that long term big money deal, even though Pax was sort of forced to with Curry being traded. Now we have a chance to unload his big contract and people think we will live to regret giving him up. The guy is not a cerebral player. You think you can play him with Wallace? Two guys who can't hit free throws, therefore both shouldn't be in the game at the same time in the 4th quarter. Ben can justify his salary because he is a 4 time DPOY. Top 10 in steals, blocks, rebs. Chandler was so bad most of last year we all cringed when he got anywhere near the ball. Many times he just stood there doing nothing, a complete non factor Skiles has to sit. The only thing the guy could do decent is block shots off the ball, and even that declined last year. I don't see him as a good defender. He commits more stupid fouls than almost any player in the league.

You have a chance to dump the salary for a short term veteran and more cap space, I say do it. Won't we be under the cap next year if we do this trade? Heck, we could sign another this year. People are assuming the cap space will be used to re-sign our own players and save money. Maybe Reinsdorf will pay the luxury tax and we will go for another free agent next year. Nobody from the Bulls have said they will dump Chandler for cap space they will only use to re-sign players. The trade hasn't even happened yet!


----------



## kulaz3000 (May 3, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



Salvaged Ship said:


> You have a chance to dump the salary for a short term veteran and more cap space, I say do it. Won't we be under the cap next year if we do this trade? Heck, we could sign another this year. People are assuming the cap space will be used to re-sign our own players and save money. Maybe Reinsdorf will pay the luxury tax and we will go for another free agent next year. Nobody from the Bulls have said they will dump Chandler for cap space they will only use to re-sign players. The trade hasn't even happened yet!


They won't have cap space next year, thats just the facts. They will extend Hinrichs contract this summer, which will eat up whatever browns expired contract would leave. By this time next year, we would have 3 players to extend, in Noc, Deng and Gordon, and i don't see them adding more contracts amoungst that next year, beside the mid level.

So i don't buy the whole having cap space for next year. This is the only year that they will have it, with capspace coming to a team every blue moon, and they won't get it again for another decade.


----------



## anorexorcist (Aug 3, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



Ventura said:


> doesnt jr have pretty bad jib?


we may package him with sweets for someone else, i don't see him staying here past the summer.


----------



## BenDengGo (Feb 1, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



anorexorcist said:


> we may package him with sweets for someone else, i don't see him staying here past the summer.


ship with sweets to milwaukee for gadz


----------



## derf (Jul 2, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I can't see JR Smith as a Pax/Skiles target. Armstrong/Simmons seems a more logical target. Big man. Big school. Rookie contract that covers the four year Wallace contract. 

To work the salary cap you must moderate the big contracts, thus 15 mil (Wallace) needs a 2 mil (Armstrong) and a 600K (LUKE!!!) back up. PJ rotates out as Tyrus develops and Heinrich gets his extension. 

The Bulls (under Reinsdorf) traded Pippen for Roy Rogers, they are not afraid to let an asset go to keep the bottom line in order.


----------



## different_13 (Aug 30, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



derf said:


> The Bulls (under Reinsdorf) traded Pippen for Roy Rogers, they are not afraid to let an asset go to keep the bottom line in order.


That's the whole point though - they're letting an asset go for capspace, when the asset would help the Bulls win more games. Ok, they need post offence - but PJ Brown is a 1 year solution, and not even a very good solution. There will be no cap next year, except the MLE and LLE (i think?)
So unless Pax can get someone decent for Smith, there's not much help for the future. Maybe Smith and Songaila can get some post scoring, but Chicago needs a big body too - like Jackie Butler. May be able to sign him anyway though.

The Luis Scola deal would be good (Smith for Scola, or Smith n future pick for Scola n Barry)


----------



## derf (Jul 2, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I don't think the bulls want Smith. Thats the hang up.

The Hornets have placed an offer on the table. They want to move Smith. Zeke wanted to move Moochie Norris. Good luck with that.


----------



## Qwst25 (Apr 24, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I guess I'll add to the minority here and say I'm in favor of this trade. After five seasons Tyson is nothing more than a roller-coaster. He has never showed the consistency needed to be a focal point of a team. He can work out all he wants in California, but the problem is still in his head. He has the abilities, but he has something going on upstairs thats wreaking havoc with his game. 

I like the idea of adding Brown. We need veterans. We need leadership. He brings both of these qualities, plus he can still play. And if Tyrus Thomas has as much potential as everyone says he has, then adding Brown will only help in his development.


----------



## derf (Jul 2, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

I agree moving Chandler sucks and I think we will regret it later, But watching GM's juggle the cap is what makes it all so interesting.


----------



## ralaw (Feb 24, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



Qwst25 said:


> I guess I'll add to the minority here and say I'm in favor of this trade. After five seasons Tyson is nothing more than a roller-coaster. He has never showed the consistency needed to be a focal point of a team. He can work out all he wants in California, but the problem is still in his head. He has the abilities, but he has something going on upstairs thats wreaking havoc with his game.
> 
> I like the idea of adding Brown. We need veterans. We need leadership. He brings both of these qualities, plus he can still play. And if Tyrus Thomas has as much potential as everyone says he has, then adding Brown will only help in his development.


I agree, Chandler has passed the point of being considered a "project," and he is as good as he'll ever be. If Thomas is as good as a people expect him to be; Chandler would only get in his way.


----------



## theanimal23 (Mar 2, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Man, I can't wait for this deal to be done. I don't care if Tyson says he will be an all-star. Hell would have to freeze for it to happen next year, especially in the West Conf. 

I think he will have more success in NOK than here, but thank you, get outta here Tyson. I don't think Pax is stupid. He prolly knows how hard Tyson is working, and how soon it will take for Tyrus to ready. Plus, if we should have another high pick next year, as expected, thats less minutes for Tyson. Take it while we can. We won't get another decent deal for Chandelier.


----------



## all_aus (Aug 28, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

remember the wraps on tyson chandler all that time ago??


----------



## all_aus (Aug 28, 2005)

*Chandlers Response*

Reached by phone in California, Chandler said he has heard rumors that he could be traded.

"I've been hearing a lot of stuff," he said. "It really doesn't bother me. I'm a Chicago Bull. As of right now, my focus is on getting better and working out this summer.

"My thing is, regardless of what happens, I'm going to be an All-Star next year. I realize I had a tough year last year. I'm not going to allow that to happen again in my career.

"If I get traded, I'll be somewhere else with the same plan."

Barring a trade, Chandler said he expects to return to the Chicago area Aug. 1. In the meantime, he said he is working out near his Los Angeles home.
CHICAGO TRIBUNE.


----------



## Philomath (Jan 3, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

Do we have confirmation that Allen is the fourth player in this deal? Now we know why he got his contract so quick. 

I'm not sure trading two of our three biggest players off a woefully short team makes sense unless there's a move to follow.


----------



## Hustle (Dec 17, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



Philomath said:


> Do we have confirmation that Allen is the fourth player in this deal? Now we know why he got his contract so quick.
> 
> I'm not sure trading two of our three biggest players off a woefully short team makes sense unless there's a move to follow.


I really would find a Allen and Chandler for SMith and Brown trade hard to believe unless Pax plans on signing another FA or has a good Smith trade lined up. Allen would be a nice 4rth big, Sweets an alright 5th, but Sweets as a 4rth and what Luke Shensher a 5th no thanks.


----------



## theanimal23 (Mar 2, 2005)

*Re: Chandlers Response*

And Marbury is the best PG in the game. Tyson, stop being all talk. Unless you reach Big Ben levels on D, you will never be an all-star with 0 ppg.


----------



## Sham (Dec 2, 2002)

*Re: Chandlers Response*

Now, had Tyrus said that......


----------



## lgtwins (May 18, 2004)

*Re: Chandlers Response*

We have zero reason or proof that he will back up his word "I will be an allstar next season any way" talk. If he has shown anything in the past 5 years, it si that when he guarantee something, he usually never back it up.

I just don't understand that this many people still have a hope that he will fianlly get it and fulfill his "P"otential, which I sincerly doubt.

Just let him go.


----------



## JRose5 (May 4, 2003)

*Re: Chandlers Response*

That's good to hear from him. Right now, I don't know where I stand on trading Tyson.
If we're going to keep him, then that's the attitude I want him to have.

He's just going to have to prove he's not all talk.


----------



## Mark_R (May 1, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*

I'm at a loss for the misguided Tyson love. He is REDUNDANT with Big Ben here. His contract sucks. His injury history is still tarnished. He has shown zero offensive potential. Hey, he can rebound, block shots, get in foul trouble, and all that fun stuff. 

You'd think Tyson was the second coming of Moses Malone with the outrage here.

50 million doesn't buy what it used to...


----------



## mizenkay (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*

http://basketballboards.net/forum/showthread.php?t=255997


----------



## Bulls_Bulls_Bulls! (Jun 10, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*

Look, many people who are not enamored with Tyson still don't like this trade, because it's the Bulls being cheap, small time, Sterling-like. 

That said, if Pax (who has made amazing decisions otherwise!), deals Tyson for something that's reeks of decent value for his "asset" ( e.g,I don't mind a S&T for Al Harrington and Josh Smith for Tyson and Duhon: in fact, that would be highway robbery!). Or make the trade for PJ so we can acquire someone else with the existing cap room (Joel P., etc).

But as it stands, Tyson for PJ and JR Smith, standing alone, just plan reeks of salary dump!


----------



## RoRo (Aug 21, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*

tyson's hook shot = derek zoolander's magnum.
when he drops it on us it will be glorious.


----------



## 7RINGS? (Sep 28, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*

This would be a great deal for us!!! P.J. is a proven vet who is waaaaaayyyy more effective in games then Tyson.I'm sick of the next year Tyson will be good stuff.Ya Kwame Browns gonna blow up to!I'd take P.J. Brown over him anyday!!! Then we get J.R. Smith who gives us more atheltism and he can become a decent player .We have enough depth this gives us more!! Can't anyone see what Pax is trying to do??? I think some of these guys are going to be barganing chips for a major star!!! If not this season next season when we get another number 1 pick!!!! We got money and assets! If John Paxson was in the Wu-Tang Clan he'd be the " GZA-Genius "!!!!!


----------



## madox (Jan 6, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*



RoRo said:


> tyson's hook shot = derek zoolander's magnum.
> when he drops it on us it will be glorious.


Maybe with a tennis ball.


----------



## Qwst25 (Apr 24, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*



Bulls_Bulls_Bulls! said:


> Look, many people who are not enamored with Tyson still don't like this trade, because it's the Bulls being cheap, small time, Sterling-like.
> 
> That said, if Pax (who has made amazing decisions otherwise!), deals Tyson for something that's reeks of decent value for his "asset" ( e.g,I don't mind a S&T for Al Harrington and Josh Smith for Tyson and Duhon: in fact, that would be highway robbery!). Or make the trade for PJ so we can acquire someone else with the existing cap room (Joel P., etc).
> 
> But as it stands, Tyson for PJ and JR Smith, standing alone, just plan reeks of salary dump!


Paxson isn't trying to build a fantasy team here. He is trying to create a real team that will compete for the title. In order to do that he needs to find players who can complement what he already has. This team will be led by Ben Wallace, Kirk Hinrich, Andres Nocioni, Ben Gordon, and Luol Deng. That is a solid "5" right there. But he needs to find other players to fill in the holes and idealy they would be veterans. 

They have a strong young core and Paxson needs to surround them with veterans who will help them get even better. Remember they just drafted Thomas and Thabo and they should get another lottery pick next year. If they want to compete and rebuild at the same time they need more "role playing" veterans.


----------



## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*



Bulls_Bulls_Bulls! said:


> Look, many people who are not enamored with Tyson still don't like this trade, because it's the Bulls being cheap, small time, Sterling-like.
> 
> That said, if Pax (who has made amazing decisions otherwise!), deals Tyson for something that's reeks of decent value for his "asset" ( e.g,I don't mind a S&T for Al Harrington and Josh Smith for Tyson and Duhon: in fact, that would be highway robbery!). Or make the trade for PJ so we can acquire someone else with the existing cap room (Joel P., etc).
> 
> But as it stands, Tyson for PJ and JR Smith, standing alone, just plan reeks of salary dump!


I'd be all for the Harrington/Smith trade, but this one for PJ/JR just blows to put it mildly.


----------



## Chops (May 30, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*




RoRo said:


> tyson's hook shot = derek zoolander's magnum.
> when he drops it on us it will be glorious.


LOL.


----------



## paxman (Apr 24, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



mizenkay said:


> http://chicagosports.chicagotribune...lsside,1,6318200.story?coll=cs-home-headlines


still got love for chandler, but i remember the first time he said "next year my plan is to be an allstar"

that was his rookie year.

having said that, when he's not in foul trouble he's the best rebounder in the nba


----------



## KwaZulu (Jul 7, 2003)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*

Why all the Tyson love?
1. We don't want to admit we made a mistake and got little in return for trading Elton Brand
2. The "Fire Pax/Skiles" crowd have been cut off at the knees by the draft and the Wallace signing so they have to find something to justify their incessant whining, thus the reaction to trading Chandler. If he is traded then they can keep up their whining now using the Tyson trade as an excuse.
3. Some of us want him to succeed, and here. We want to give him one more shot because we see the potential. But as I tell couples I counsel in preparation for getting married, "what you see is almost always what you get."


----------



## RedBull80 (Jul 3, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*



7RINGS? said:


> If John Paxson was in the Wu-Tang Clan he'd be the " GZA-Genius "!!!!!


More like ODB (Old dead b-----) if yet we dump ANOTHER lottery pick for absolutely nothing. The ancient PJ Brown for Chandler is just insulting, and throwing in that other guy is adding even more insult.

I don't see why us Bulls fans should let the Bulls org. slide on so many of the BONEHEAD moves over these years. Yes, great, we sign Ben Wallace, 1 major move in how many years? We lost Elton Brand, Ron Artest, Brad Miller, Jamal Crawford, Eddy Curry, J wheels (bad luck) and now TC, FOR NOTHING? Come on, the Bulls should NOT give up TC for garbage. He should be used as part of a deal bringing in a superstar, or you simply hang on to him, as he hits his stride. Remember, he wasn't a 21 year old college groomed player entering the league, he was a high school player...TC is a taller version of Big Ben, and he will only get stronger (physically) and improve his game, IMO, his ceiling is high. I only see him traded for a Paul Pierce or a KG, maybe sign and trade with Harrington but that's about it. We should have some self respect (for our players) and some standards..


----------



## DengNabbit (Feb 23, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



paxman said:


> having said that, when he's not in foul trouble he's the best rebounder in the nba



i've been a Tyson supporter too, but the Wallace deal makes something really interesting out of this one point you make.


Tyson is a guy who cant stay on the floor. always has been. fouls and stamina issues have kept him a bench player. even when he's been a starter, he's been a secondary type guy. yes, you want him on the floor at the end of games.

Sweetney is the same way. cant stay on the floor. but he's doing that while filling a desperate need: low post scoring.

now when you get Wallace, you have a guy who plays beginning, middle and end of games... and does exactly what Tyson does. 


i understand why people are worried that we would just dump Tyson's salary for little. but this roster is complete, people. Sweetney is coming off his best play as a pro at the end of last year. he is entering a free agent year. if he's going to do it, it's this year. and he's going to be the Chandler role now... coming off the bench for a spark, etc. and now Sweets will be guarding the secondary frontcourt option on the other team, not the #1 option.


all of this bodes well for Sweets, but it also bodes well for a Tyson trade, even if it's for nothing. there arent enough minutes to go around, especially if we plan for Tyrus Thomas to be more than a rah-rah guy in year 1.


----------



## such sweet thunder (May 30, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



LegoHat said:


> If Hilton Armstrong was included I would also be more positive about this deal, but I don't see Charlotte parting ways with him already. He has something resembling an offensive game, and he would develop very nicely behind Wallace and Brown.


Armstrong is the only (reasonable) piece they could include that would place me in favor of the trade, but all reports don't have him on the block. Also, when was the last time a team actually traded a draft pick they selected for themselves this early? New Orleans drafted Armstrong becuase they were in position and becuase they believed he had more value than any other rookie available. They probably value Armstrong more than any other team.


----------



## fleetwood macbull (Jan 23, 2004)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*

What Owner in the NBA would easily risk paying Lux taxes? (besides Dolan) 

I repeat even Billionaires like Cuban and Paul Allen don't want to do that. 

So Reinsdorf is some oddball cheapskate? This is an unreasonable shot at Reinsdorf 

(and I can't believe I am posting defending Reinsdorf either, but he's earned it lately)


----------



## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*



fleetwood macbull said:


> What Owner in the NBA would easily risk paying Lux taxes? (besides Dolan)
> 
> I repeat even Billionaires like Cuban and Paul Allen don't want to do that.
> 
> ...


Even so, not much if any luxury tax would be paid next season if we keep chandler.


----------



## draft tyrus (Jun 29, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*

ok, maybe I just don't understand this...

I'd rather have Wallace, Gordon, Kirk, Luol, Noce for five years than Tyson for five. We blew our cap space by signing Ben and thus we had to do something to clear up space for it. And in removing Tyson we lose nothing but a headache.


----------



## step (Sep 19, 2005)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*



> Even so, not much if any luxury tax would be paid next season if we keep chandler.


Indeed, it's only after next season that we really have to consider it.


----------



## Mark_R (May 1, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler/ Chandler's Response (merged thread)*



RedBull80 said:


> More like ODB (Old dead b-----) if yet we dump ANOTHER lottery pick for absolutely nothing. The ancient PJ Brown for Chandler is just insulting, and throwing in that other guy is adding even more insult.
> 
> I don't see why us Bulls fans should let the Bulls org. slide on so many of the BONEHEAD moves over these years. Yes, great, we sign Ben Wallace, 1 major move in how many years? We lost Elton Brand, Ron Artest, Brad Miller, Jamal Crawford, Eddy Curry, J wheels (bad luck) and now TC, FOR NOTHING? Come on, the Bulls should NOT give up TC for garbage. He should be used as part of a deal bringing in a superstar, or you simply hang on to him, as he hits his stride. Remember, he wasn't a 21 year old college groomed player entering the league, he was a high school player...TC is a taller version of Big Ben, and he will only get stronger (physically) and improve his game, IMO, his ceiling is high. I only see him traded for a Paul Pierce or a KG, maybe sign and trade with Harrington but that's about it. We should have some self respect (for our players) and some standards..


This post makes almost zero sense. I hate those two great draft picks we got for Eddy Curry. Tyrus Thomas, like he'll ever amount to anything! All that cap space from Crawford which allowed us to get our current backcourt! Damn you pax! If we get Greg Oden, Young, Durant, Wright next year, gosh pax, CAN'T YOU SEE WE GOT EDDY CURRY FOR NOTHING!? 

Set some standards yourself. What has Tyson shown you that he'll get "bigger and stronger?" He's a string bean. Ahh, Al Harrington. Another big guy who shoots quite a bit from the perimeter. 

And how did the Bulls get NOTHING for Elton Brand when at the end of your post, you're pimping that Chandler (need I remind you we got him for Elton Brand, but I'm sure that you knew that and just weren't thinking clearly) get bigger, stronger, and things like that and think he should only be included a deal for an elite player. So is he nothing or is he something? Make up your mind.


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## doomraisin (Jun 23, 2006)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



DaBabyBullz said:


> You're definitely not the only one who thinks this trade scenario is absolutely ridiculous. It's one of the most f***ing retarded trades I've ever heard of. It's called the owner is being a tight-a*s with his money, and isn't thinking of the best interests of the team. If we were trading him for something (player or 1st round pick) that MIGHT improve our team I'd be all for it, but there's no possible way that this is improving our team AT ALL.


What you might consider doing is trying to get a job as a GM in the NBA. If Paxson does this trade, it pretty much proves you know more than he does about the job. Of course I don't know what sort of job you have, but from what I understand, being an NBA GM is a hell of a good gig.

I thought about it for about 1 second, and it strikes me as an excellent trade scenario. I think that by watching Chandler play, anyone who's watched any basketball at all can tell that he just doesn't have it, and he ain't never gonna have it. See, basketball is played in the brain. Yeah, it's just great to be over seven feet tall and all arms, but it doesn't do a damn bit of good if you don't have any game.

Right now, here's the deal: The Bulls are making the moves necessary to win a championship, and winning a championship is the only reason for a franchise to exist.


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## 7RINGS? (Sep 28, 2004)

*Looks like Chandler will be gone before Friday!!*

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/41310/20060705/chandler_trade_likely_before_friday/ 



The Times Picayune - The rumored deal between the Hornets and Bulls centered around Tyson Chandler will likely happen before Friday, according to Arn Tellem, who is the agent for guard J.R. Smith. 


The Times-Picayune is reporting that Smith's father, Earl, said he spoke with Tellem on Tuesday morning and was told the news. 

"It would be a fine move that I think is great," Earl Smith said by telephone Tuesday. "It would give J.R. a chance to redeem himself, and I think he would fit in perfect with those guys. They have a chance to contend in the East." 

Earlier this week, Earl Smith said his son would not play for the Hornets' summer league team in Las Vegas because of the possible trade. When the Hornets released their summer roster Monday, Smith wasn't on the list. [READ]

I know rumors are rumors but this sounds like a deal that is done!! I always had it out for Chandler something inside me says lets see how he works out with Ben but I seen how he played when Curry was in the line up and I don't think I would be missing much.He played good but he wasn't anything special plus he could never control all those fouls of his so he couldn't play anyways.I like the trade because when it goes through Pax will I think make another trade and get what he really wants for Tyson.I also like J.R. Smith he has more experience then the rookie we drafted at SG so It helps us more at that spot.He averaged about 7pts a game but only played about 18min.If he got more PT with us he could become a key piece for us,that is if we don't trade him.I can't really knock the guy yet he's only a kid.Tyson is not a kid however he's a man that playes like a kid and not like a man.P.J. is another vet we could really use.He reminds me a little bit of AD only with more size.Trust me Paxson knows what he's doing if we would have beat Miami in the playoffs I don't think we'd be having these threads. :clap: :cheers:


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## ace20004u (Jun 19, 2002)

*Re: Looks like Chandler will be gone before Friday!!*



7RINGS? said:


> http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/41310/20060705/chandler_trade_likely_before_friday/
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The trade can't even happen till the 12th...


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## mizenkay (Dec 29, 2003)

*Re: Looks like Chandler will be gone before Friday!!*



> "It would be a fine move that I think is great," Earl Smith said by telephone Tuesday. "It would give J.R. a chance to redeem himself, and I think he would fit in perfect with those guys. They have a chance to contend in the East."





from what i understand this cat earl is like eddy curry's mom on acid.


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## KirkHinrich#12 (Mar 4, 2004)

My question is, aren't we just going to draft Greg Oden most likely in the next NBA draft? Then why does it hurt getting PJ Brown for the short term. Sure the Knicks could have a better then expected season, but regardless getting Chandlers #'s off the books can't hurt for the future as well.


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## paxman (Apr 24, 2006)

KirkHinrich#12 said:


> My question is, aren't we just going to draft Greg Oden most likely in the next NBA draft?


niet


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## 7RINGS? (Sep 28, 2004)

*Re: Looks like Chandler will be gone before Friday!!*



ace20004u said:


> The trade can't even happen till the 12th...


Thats true but its offical now!!!


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## dogra (Nov 12, 2003)

KirkHinrich#12 said:


> My question is, aren't we just going to draft Greg Oden most likely in the next NBA draft?


You're kidding, right?


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## BULLSWON (Jul 5, 2006)

This is so good for the bulls i never really thought chandler would become a great player for them he never was consistent


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## transplant (Jul 31, 2002)

Bump (last). "Bulls trade Chandler!"

Kumbaya is dead. Overall, I'd say the reaction was negative when you remove the J.R. Smith fans (Smith was later traded for a bag of peanuts)

When I started on this archival task, I really didn't know what I'd find...I sometimes take breaks from the board, so I wasn't a "player" in most of these threads. What I found is that we probably have posters with whom we violently disagree, but there are very few hypocrites here. Personally, I admire consistency.

In the end, we can agree or disagree with the individual moves. The only true Kumbaya moment will come when the Bulls win a championship. This isn't a bad thing. As long as the defenders don't defend the indefensible and the critics don't criticize true excellence, the vast middle ground is fair game.


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## JeremyB0001 (Nov 17, 2003)

Really? I'm too lazy to read through the thread but I remember some people going as far to saying P.J. would produce more in one season that Chandler would in the next five combined.


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## kukoc4ever (Nov 20, 2002)

JeremyB0001 said:


> Really? I'm too lazy to read through the thread but I remember some people going as far to saying P.J. would produce more in one season that Chandler would in the next five combined.


LOL, that kind of stuff was in other threads.

And, you have to define produce. PJ brings a heaping helping of intangibles and wisdom, haven't you seen?


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## johnston797 (May 29, 2002)

I was firmly against trading Chandler for Brown. There most have been a dozen or more threads on this. IF this one is representative, there were actually more people opposed than I remember.


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

Pax looks like a genius for letting JR Smith get away for near nothing. What did he get, a 2nd round pick (or two)?

There were a lot of us who thought he was worth a shot as our big SG type. Smith would also make (at least) me say right now that trading Gordon for Gasol would be a good move.


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## ScottMay (Jun 15, 2002)

johnston797 said:


> I was firmly against trading Chandler for Brown. There most have been a dozen or more threads on this. IF this one is representative, there were actually more people opposed than I remember.


I didn't weigh in in this particular thread for some reason. I've linked below to expressions of my disbelief and disgust.

Of all the issues we (collectively) have argued on this board over the years, I don't think anything flummoxed me more than folks honestly taking the position that PJ Brown would be a better player for the Bulls in 2006-2007 than Tyson Chandler would have been.

http://www.basketballforum.com/showpost.php?p=3758874&postcount=30

http://www.basketballforum.com/showpost.php?p=3762239&postcount=19

http://www.basketballforum.com/showpost.php?p=4102571&postcount=66

http://www.basketballforum.com/showpost.php?p=4105577&postcount=166


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## SALO (Jun 6, 2002)

There was a much bigger thread than this containing daily updates from a Hornets Insider. He broke the news of the Chandler/PJ trade long before anyone else. He also predicted just about every other move the Hornets made in the offseason (Peja & Bobby Jackson signings, Cedric Simmons at the #15 pick and of course PJ/JR for Tyson). 

I wanted to give Tyson one more year (at least), but didn't mind trading him for the right deal. PJ Brown was NOT the right deal. I was more inclined to do it if Hilton Armstrong was involved (my original choice for our 16th pick, but he went earlier) but I always hated the trade. 



JeremyB0001 said:


> I'm too lazy to read through the thread but I remember some people going as far to saying P.J. would produce more in one season that Chandler would in the next five combined.


Haha. Yeah, I remember people trying to make that argument, at least for THIS season. They were saying how much better PJ was going to be for us... Intangibles!! futurisxten & Ron Cey to name a few. :clown:

God I hope we get Gasol... at least then PJ and his contract would have been somewhat useful. If we just let his deal expire and not get anything for it, I'll be pissed.


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## T.Shock (Feb 11, 2003)

DaBullz said:


> Pax looks like a genius for letting JR Smith get away for near nothing. What did he get, a 2nd round pick (or two)?
> 
> There were a lot of us who thought he was worth a shot as our big SG type. Smith would also make (at least) me say right now that trading Gordon for Gasol would be a good move.


Have you been following the Nuggets? Smith has been nowhere near his early season form. He's had some decent nights, but overall his production has been way down...

FG%
Nov-.453
Dec-.463
Jan-.408
Feb-.415

3PT%
Nov-.361
Dec-.458
Jan-.354
Feb-.385

Assist to TO ration
1.76 to 1.6

Rebounds
2.2 per game

His defense has been horrendous on the nights he actually decides to play it. I've mentioned Flip Murray's 2004 year as something similar to this. If you think Smith is going to approach this in the future, you are mistaken. See, I can barely take this board sometimes. Are we really blasting Pax for giving away J.R. Smith. Does he fit this team at all? What a lot of people fail to understand is that you need guys who fit the structure of the team. A no-defense playing, poor fundamental having gunner wouldn't even see the court on this team. Whatever. I'm sure I'll change no one's mind.


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## JeremyB0001 (Nov 17, 2003)

kukoc4ever said:


> LOL, that kind of stuff was in other threads.
> 
> And, you have to define produce. PJ brings a heaping helping of intangibles and wisdom, haven't you seen?


I finally read through this thread and almost post was opposed to that thread. That still greatly conflicts my recollection since I felt like a member of a distinct minority at the time. I wish I had the time to track down those other threads.

Edit: I hadn't seen the links Scott May posted above before now. I'll have to check those out.


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## johnston797 (May 29, 2002)

JeremyB0001 said:


> I finally read through this thread and almost post was opposed to that thread. That still greatly conflicts my recollection since I felt like a member of a distinct minority at the time. I wish I had the time to track down those other threads.
> 
> Edit: I hadn't seen the links Scott May posted above before now. I'll have to check those out.


Just for posterity. Here is my first post in the first "PJ for Chandler" rumor thread. 

http://www.basketballforum.com/showpost.php?p=3760271&postcount=91


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## DaBullz (Jul 15, 2002)

*Re: Stein: Bulls close to trading Chandler*



superdave said:


> We traded Curry to a mess in NY, but Chandler in New Orleans would be a different story. The best young PG in the game, a rugged post scorer in West, Peja to keep teams honest, Jackson and Mason to push the tempo, etc. Armstrong/Simmons/Chandler is quite the three headed defensive monster in the post. He could very well flourish there.


+1

Wow, how prescient. :clap:


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