# Is Team USA still the best basketball team?



## 013184

With the improvement of European and Asian Teams, is the USA still the best basketball team in the world? They have failed to win both the World Championships and Olympic Gold the past few years. Can it be said that Argentina is the new World power in international play?


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## NeoSamurai

in a 1 game, elimination style tourney, any of the elite international teams can win....however, imo, if they were to play in a best of 5/7 series, the US would still remain the team to beat...

the rest of the world has caught up however to the level of the US undoubtedly, but the fact still remains that the US is the nation that produces the deepest set of basketball talent in the world...


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## M-Blade

There is no doubt that the US has the greatest pool of basketball talent in the world but, because of the NBA's large focus on the individual performances of players, it is harder for the superstar players to gel as a team. As is true in all team competitions, if all the individuals all want to have their own personal successes then the team will suffer.

So, I believe it would be better if the US had an established national team (like soccer) so that the superstar players, with more chances to play alongside each other, would be successful as a unit. Of course I'd love to see a massive improvement in the talent of international teams so that the basketball World Championship is as entertaining as the soccer World Cup.


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## The Truth IV

The problem with USA basketball is that they pick players who they see as ambassadors for the sport (i.e. good for shoe sales) rather than a team that's hard to beat.

And why does the USA dole out the playing time and the shots democractically as if these were all-star games. Ride your best players for 37 minutes a game as you would in an NBA game. Pick a go to guy - is it Duncan? Kobe? Lebron? Let whoever it is take 20 shots. This is what the int'l teams do - they have no choice since they've only have a handful of good players. Pick bench players who you think will be able to come in and fill a role for a few minutes. 

The problem with USA basketball is that they don't want to ask a $90 million guy to take half his summer and watch from the bench. I'm from Toronto, and here in Canada, we used to do the same thing with our int'l hockey teams. Now we pick teams that will win and if nobody cares if guys get their feelings hurt, like the Olympic coach benching a player from his own NHL team which alienated the guy and paved the way for a free agent departure the next off-season.


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## Matej

I think USA should pick as a national team a good NBA team, which doesn't have a lot of international players in it's roster, for example Detroit, and this NBA team should play both the Olyimpics and the World Championships (the same Canada used to do in hockey - long time ago).


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## Skeet Skeet Skita

Easy answer...No...And yes, I'm loving it.


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## alexander

No, Serbia & Montenegro is the new (old) World power in international play


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## Nuzzo

alexander said:


> No, Serbia & Montenegro is the new (old) World power in international play


Aha after two embarrassments in a row(OG 2004 and Eurobasket 2005)


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## alex

Why don't ya guys ask the teams at the 2004 Olympic qualifying games, held in 2003?

The US brought the closest thing to a Dream Team, and they easily stomped on everyone, including a thirty point blowout win against Argentina. The US is clearly still the best producer of talent (the top ten NBA players are either nine-tenths American or fully American--Dirk Nowitski is the only top ten foreigne), and, even in Olympic ball, talent+balance=success. The US has had the talent recently (although it hasn't been overwhelming, 2003 is the exception), but it hasn't had the balance. 

An American team of good, tall athletes, shooters, distributers (sp?), and defenders is still easily unmatched.

Is any international team better then this?

PG-Chauncy Billups-size, strength, defense, and outside shooting
SG-Tracy McGrady-size, athleticism, overall a teriffic offensive player, versatile too 
SF-LeBron James-size, strength, athleticism,versatility . . . who can match up against him? (not the 2004 Olympic LBJ, the 2006 LBJ . . .)
PF-Kevin Garnett-he can do everything, too. Great intangibles, a glue-guy type player on a NT this loaded 
C-Tim Duncan-size, strength, polish, TD can stretch defenses with his midrange, but his post game is grrrrrrreeeaaatt! 

Reserves-bringing great size, athleticism, versatility, strength, outside shooting, defense, etc. Wow. Look at those names . . .

F-Elton Brand
F-Jermaine O'Neal
F-Carmelo Anthony
G-Dwyane Wade
G-Kobe Bryant
G-Michael Redd
G-Mike Bibby
C-Shaquille O'Neal


Who in the world can match up to these guys? If the US brings a balanced, athletic team, they have still by faaaaaaaaaaar the best National Team. It's not really close, either.


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## Matej

alex said:


> F-Elton Brand
> F-Jermaine O'Neal
> F-Carmelo Anthony
> G-Dwyane Wade
> G-Kobe Bryant
> G-Michael Redd
> G-Mike Bibby
> C-Shaquille O'Neal


Kobe and Shaq in the same team??? No, I don't think so...

Also US always had the best NT by names, but names don't make a champion... heart does

Qualification and Olympics - in qualification it's important to get a place at Olympics (which doesn't mean only 1st place), and at Olympics it's important to win a title. Argentina got both, what about USA... So you can't compare these two things.


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## alex

Matej said:


> Kobe and Shaq in the same team??? No, I don't think so...
> 
> Also US always had the best NT by names, but names don't make a champion... heart does
> 
> Qualification and Olympics - in qualification it's important to get a place at Olympics (which doesn't mean only 1st place), and at Olympics it's important to win a title. Argentina got both, what about USA... So you can't compare these two things.



Okay, take off Shaq and put Amare Stoudemire, who's even better. And I forgot to mention Chris Paul, who's probably gunna be the purest of points. 

I cited the Qualification tourney as an example of how the US could still thoroughly dominate the competition, including Argentina, IF they brought a talented, well-balanced team. Unfortunately, that was not the case at the Olympics. 

Matej, can Argentina (or any other team) beat a balanced "Dream Team", like the one that I listed? 

My guess is that if they played a hundred times, they might suffer one or two losses, but the US would win most games by at least twenty. 

A hungry, balanced, talented US team>the world's best


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## alexander

alex said:


> Who in the world can match up to these guys? If the US brings a balanced, athletic team, they have still by faaaaaaaaaaar the best National Team. It's not really close, either.


OK How about this

PG Marko Jaric
SG Milan Gurovic
SF Predrag Stojakovic
PF Predrag Drobnjak
C Zeljko Rebraca

Bench:

G Igor Rakocevic
G Aleksandar Pavlovic
F Vladimir Radmanovic
F Dejan Bodiroga
F Zarko Cabarkapa
C Nenad Krstic
C Darko Milicic
C Mile Ilic

That "Dream Team" you named can only sell shirts, like Matej said team play and heart make a champion in international play, those guys ( Wade,LB,Kobe...) CAN'T play team basketball, it's impossible 
Serbia and Montenegro will be the new (old) World Champion :greatjob:


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## alex

alexander said:


> OK How about this
> 
> PG Marko Jaric
> SG Milan Gurovic
> SF Predrag Stojakovic
> PF Predrag Drobnjak
> C Zeljko Rebraca
> 
> Bench:
> 
> G Igor Rakocevic
> G Aleksandar Pavlovic
> F Vladimir Radmanovic
> F Dejan Bodiroga
> F Zarko Cabarkapa
> C Nenad Krstic
> C Darko Milicic
> C Mile Ilic
> 
> That "Dream Team" you named can only sell shirts, like Matej said team play and heart make a champion in international play, those guys ( Wade,LB,Kobe...) CAN'T play team basketball, it's impossible
> Serbia and Montenegro will be the new (old) World Champion :greatjob:




Ironically, Serbia has imploded the last few times as well. Can they play as a team, or do they suffer from "Americanitis"? 

LBJ and DW are terrific team players, do you watch them play? They struggled in the Olympics because they were somewhat offensively raw. Their jumpers are much improved. As for Bryant, take him off and put Shawn Marion (Marion=shutdown defense on Stojakovic). 

Who said the US won't play with "heart"? They sure did in '03, and they completely destroyed the field. Serbia hasn't had much "heart" since their 2002 win at Indy, so I highly doubt that they'll be the "new (old) World Champion". 

The US with their best is sooooooo much better then S&M and their best. Individually, it's absolutely no contest, and if they actually played like a team, which they did during the first couple Olympics, they'd blow everyone out, including that Serbia team, by at least twenty points per.


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## Matej

> OK How about this
> 
> PG Marko Jaric
> SG Milan Gurovic
> SF Predrag Stojakovic
> PF Predrag Drobnjak
> C Zeljko Rebraca
> 
> Bench:
> 
> G Igor Rakocevic
> G Aleksandar Pavlovic
> F Vladimir Radmanovic
> F Dejan Bodiroga
> F Zarko Cabarkapa
> C Nenad Krstic
> C Darko Milicic
> C Mile Ilic


Serbian team has even bigger problems than Team USA - If I were Serbian coach I would throw out of the NT half of these players (for example Bodiroga, Rebraca, Gurovic, Drobnjak, Rakocevic). S&M has a lot of younger talents who would really left their hart on the court.



> Matej, can Argentina (or any other team) beat a balanced "Dream Team", like the one that I listed?


Argentina can't beat ''a balanced "Dream Team"'', but the team you listed can't be balanced. As I said USA should pick an NBA team to be it's NT - a team like Detroit, Miami,... this kind of team would be ''a balanced "Dream Team"'' not a team full of superstars and no workers. Every team needs workers as they need stars.


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## flip-flop

Matej said:


> Serbian team has even bigger problems than Team USA - If I were Serbian coach I would throw out of the NT half of these players (for example Bodiroga, Rebraca, Gurovic, Drobnjak, Rakocevic). S&M has a lot of younger talents who would really left their hart on the court.


(Mateju: Zame je Rakočevič daleč najboljš igralc od Srbije. Prej bi se znebiu Jariča k je biu baje najbolj problematičn.
Rebrača in Bodiroga sta se že sama upokojila za reprezentanco.  )

Aleskandar, that Serbia team you've just wrote down will never play together again. Do you believe that Rakocević and Jarić can still play in same team? No way. There ware too much problems and fights between them in last year, and also, Bodiroga and Rebrača are retired for NT. So there's no chance for this your lineup. 
Anyway, who will be Serbian new NT coach? A. Djordjevic?


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## tdk1984

No we're not. Yet, I think many teams are equal. We can thank the Dream Team for this parity. It opened the NBA up to players from all over the world. When they came here, they improved their individual play and return home to play in the World Championships, etc. In turn, they helped improve their teammates back home and the International play improved dramatically. That, coupled with our star players's indifference to representing the USA in international competition doesn't help us either.


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## Luca

I think that USA team is the best in the world,but as many other people said there are some problesms.Now Colangelo and other good people take care about NT and i think that with a team like this nobody could stop USA:
starting five
1)Billups
2)LBJ
3)T-Mac
4)Duncan
5)B.Wallace

and 

C.Paul,Wade,C.Anthony,D.Howard,Shaq,KG,Redd and Marion


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## Matej

sadam said:


> (Mateju: Zame je Rakočevič daleč najboljš igralc od Srbije. Prej bi se znebiu Jariča k je biu baje najbolj problematičn.
> Rebrača in Bodiroga sta se že sama upokojila za reprezentanco.  )


Just to translate - if anybody else want's to comment this...



> For me Rakocevic is the best player of Serbian NT. I would rather get rid of Jaric, who is supposely the most problematical. Rebraca and Bodiroga have had already retired


I don't know about the lockerroom but on the court Rakocevic is a guy who makes problems. I mean he can only play in a team where he's the main star, he is very selfish player and I think he's one of the reasons of Serbia collapsing at the European Championship.

Why guys like Radivojevic, Luka Bogdanovic, Dozet,... are not playing???

Drgač pa itak ni važno, sam da bo Slovenija kompletna na svetovnem, da ne bo nobenih poškodb ipd


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## alexander

the main reason for our disasters was coach Obradovic. Now, he is gone ,the new coach is coming(probably Pesic or even Slavnic), Stojakovic will be back, some other players will be back, Rakocevic and Jaric will make up,all problems will be solved and we will be stronger than ever

Matej
Radivojevic for NT, are you nuts??? The guy averages 10 turnovers per game and more than 10 missed shots per game, almost triple-double :biggrin: 

and by the way, Slovenia has a great team as well,with Nesterovic, Tusek, Nachbar, Smodis, Vujacic, Lakovic....you are not too far from the "Dream Team"


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## Matej

alexander said:


> and by the way, Slovenia has a great team as well,with Nesterovic, Tusek, Nachbar, Smodis, Vujacic, Lakovic....you are not too far from the "Dream Team"


Yeah, but we have problems with injuries and CSKA doesn't allow Smodis to play for NT - I hope they'll change they're mind for WC...



alexander said:


> Radivojevic for NT, are you nuts??? The guy averages 10 turnovers per game and more than 10 missed shots per game, almost triple-double


OK, maybe not Radivojevic, but you know that Serbia has a lot of young talents who would make a great contribution to serbian NT...i don't think rakocevic and jaric will make up,even if they do rakocevic is not a man for NT


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## Matiz

USA is not the best basketball team (actually most of NBA got in the wrong direction when it comes to teamplay), but US has by far the best individuals... now it all depends if they'll succed in making it at least a mediocre team from those players- that way anything but a gold medal would be out of the question.


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## pac4eva5

amare, kobe, AI, garnett, lebron

that team would murder anybody. dont even need subs...


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## pac4eva5

Luca said:


> I think that USA team is the best in the world,but as many other people said there are some problesms.Now Colangelo and other good people take care about NT and i think that with a team like this nobody could stop USA:
> starting five
> 1)Billups
> 2)LBJ
> 3)T-Mac
> 4)Duncan
> 5)B.Wallace
> 
> and
> 
> C.Paul,Wade,C.Anthony,D.Howard,Shaq,KG,Redd and Marion


no AI???


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## Wink

I think the team USA will look something like

PG - Billups, Paul, Arenas
SG - Kobe, Redick
SF - Lebron, Wade
PF - Amare, Brand, Marion
C - B. Wallace, Bosh

this is with T-mac, Shaq, KG, JO, and TD all saying no to the team(which they already have or are rumoured to do).


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## shookem

Yes, USA still has the best basketball team. It's like Canada and hockey, even if they don't win every tournement, Canada is always the best hockey nation.


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## Virtuoso

Wink said:


> I think the team USA will look something like
> 
> PG - Billups, Paul, Arenas
> SG - Kobe, Redick
> SF - Lebron, Wade
> PF - Amare, Brand, Marion
> C - B. Wallace, Bosh
> 
> this is with T-mac, Shaq, KG, JO, and TD all saying no to the team(which they already have or are rumoured to do).


Some notes, recently Dwight Howard revealed he will be on the team. Colangelo also spoke with Brad Miller recently who told him he is committed if called opon, Colangelo said something like "you need guys like that on a 12 man team." 

Billups has another child on the way during the summer... otherwise he would be on my team too.

2006 USA WC Team:

_*Guards:*_

Hinrich, Kidd 
Kobe, Wade, Redd

_*SF*_

LeBron, Battier

_*Front Court*_

Bosh, Amare _(if Amare can't play, I pick Elton Brand to replace him)_ 
Brad Miller, Dwight Howard, Chris Kaman


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## TM

Why in the world was Colangelo talking to Lamar Odom? I don't care what he did in the last Olympics. That guy doesn't come to play every night. And him and Kobe stuck with each other for 11months out of the year? That ain't gonna happen.


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## Yuck

This isn't even a great questions....If the US sent its actual 12 best players even if they weren't team players, the US Team would dominate. The rest of the world, though plays better as a team and has more experience playing with each other, the sheer physical superiority of the American players will overwhelm any opposition. And please God never let Larry Brown coach an Olympic team. He uses his own unflexible system instead of letting the team play to their strengths. Brown is not a good coach IMO. Overrated. Phil Jackson and Don Nelson over him any day of the week.
I also wanna add that the international referees are a joke to basketball, sports, and competition in general. They'd just do anything to keep the US down...Europeans...what a joke.


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## flip-flop

alexander said:


> the main reason for our disasters was coach Obradovic. Now, he is gone ,the new coach is coming(probably Pesic or even Slavnic), Stojakovic will be back, some other players will be back, Rakocevic and Jaric will make up,all problems will be solved and we will be stronger than ever


I somehow can't believe it. IMO, Rakocevic and Jaric won't play together again. And Serbia still have problems at center position (without Divac and Rabraca).
Alexandar, I thought your new coach is gonna be A.Đorđević...did he change his mind or what?


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## rebelsun

The US certainly hasn't been the best lately, but they should be. 

The thing is that the rosters haven't put together well, in terms of creating a team, rather than getting the most talented players that would agree to go. Also, some of these national squads have been playing for years together, so they're functioning better as a team.

Regardless, with Colangelo's leadership and direction, anything less than a gold will be a disappointment in '08.


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## Autodelta

I think USA could be the best everytime and there isn't a team that could beat the USA with the right Team....
National USA Teams unbeatable were the Original Dream Team and Team of Atlanta 96.... With the best players of the league---
The team of Sidney wasn't too strong and the Teams of Indianapolis and Athens lost a lot of games...
Colangelo now must choose not all the strongest players, but a mix of superstars and good NBA players to complete the Team...
I think that Ray Allen is better than Wade to play in Fiba System....

A good USA team could be...

Allen Iverson
Kobe Bryant (81...)
LeBron James 
Jermaine O' Neal
Shaquille O' Neal

Kirk Hinrich
Ray Allen
Swahn Battier
Chris Bosh
Brad Miller
TJ Ford
Al Harrington


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## alexander

sadam said:


> I somehow can't believe it. IMO, Rakocevic and Jaric won't play together again. And Serbia still have problems at center position (without Divac and Rabraca).
> Alexandar, I thought your new coach is gonna be A.Đorđević...did he change his mind or what?


I never heard that Djordjevic is gonna be our new coach, he is not ready for that kind of job, not yet. This time we don't need a good coach we need a good motivator and that's why i think Moka Slavnic would be a perfect solution for us.

weak at center positions?! I don't think so... Krstic, Milicic, Drobnjak, Koturovic are all decent centers


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## sai

the problem of the last us teams was that they didn't send elite players because officials thought they would easily win with guys like marbury on the team. also they just practice together for like 2 weeks whereas the european teams play together for years. i saw the us team here in germany against us and italy, they had some nice players on the team like wade,duncan,lebron oder iverson but we played better team ball.

they should play together more often and not send a new team to every tournament


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## pac4eva5

Autodelta said:


> I think USA could be the best everytime and there isn't a team that could beat the USA with the right Team....
> National USA Teams unbeatable were the Original Dream Team and Team of Atlanta 96.... With the best players of the league---
> The team of Sidney wasn't too strong and the Teams of Indianapolis and Athens lost a lot of games...
> Colangelo now must choose not all the strongest players, but a mix of superstars and good NBA players to complete the Team...
> I think that Ray Allen is better than Wade to play in Fiba System....
> 
> A good USA team could be...
> 
> Allen Iverson
> Kobe Bryant (81...)
> LeBron James
> Jermaine O' Neal
> Shaquille O' Neal
> 
> Kirk Hinrich
> Ray Allen
> Swahn Battier
> Chris Bosh
> Brad Miller
> TJ Ford
> Al Harrington


AI, kobe, and lebron on the same team is terrible. all 3 take the ball up the floor EVERY possesion. thats one selfish team. id put lebron on the bench. w/o the ball, i cant see lebron doing ANYTHING good...

and your player hatin on melo. i cant believe you have a ot of those guys over him. pretty rediculous actually! melo is VERY UNSELFISH and will ALWAYS be running down the court fastbreaking you to death. not to mention that when he does get the ball (1-4 possesions) he cant be stopped ANYWHERE on the court...


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## Matej

Here's an interesting article/blog (Can't Compare Kobe and MJ) by Scottie Pippen about NBA basketball in the past and today... He mentiones that basketball isn't so physical anymore, the defence is weaker, every touch is a foul,...
Maybe thats one of the reasons why USA is performing so bad against other NTs, the defense against them is stronger and the referees are allowing more physical game...what do you think?

http://www.nba.com/blog/blog30.html


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## Autodelta

pac4eva5 said:


> AI, kobe, and lebron on the same team is terrible. all 3 take the ball up the floor EVERY possesion. thats one selfish team. id put lebron on the bench. w/o the ball, i cant see lebron doing ANYTHING good...
> 
> and your player hatin on melo. i cant believe you have a ot of those guys over him. pretty rediculous actually! melo is VERY UNSELFISH and will ALWAYS be running down the court fastbreaking you to death. not to mention that when he does get the ball (1-4 possesions) he cant be stopped ANYWHERE on the court...


For USA Team is better to have 5 superstar and good players to complete the Team than 12 all star at the same level....
Melo is a strong player but in a team he couldn't be the third/fourth option in an offense system and for me in a team a player like USA a player Battier is better than Melo to exit from the bench during in the game....


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## pac4eva5

Autodelta said:


> For USA Team is better to have 5 superstar and good players to complete the Team than 12 all star at the same level....
> Melo is a strong player but in a team he couldn't be the third/fourth option in an offense system and for me in a team a player like USA a player Battier is better than Melo to exit from the bench during in the game....


that made no sense! what do you mean melo cant be the third/fourth option??? WHY NOT???


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## Zalgirinis

Actually the more Carmelos are in the team the better for other teams. Just remembering his attitude and screaming in every interview before Athens Olympics how USA will kick anyones *** and that he will stay in Europe if USA doesnt take gold etc etc. Such attitude gives bonus for other teams, so I wish Carmelo to make it again. And LOL at him being unselfish.


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## CrackerJack

this US team would easily win a world championship

Coach - Flip Saunders

C - Ben Wallace
PF - Rasheed Wallace
SF - Tayshaun PRince
SG - Rip Hamilton
PG - Chauncey Billups

Bench

Lindsey Hunter
Antonio McDyess
Dale Davis
Maurice Evans
Alex Acker
Amir Johnson
Jason Maxiell

they have skill and chemistry


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## 013184

I think that the american team that competed in athens could have easily won the gold! that lineup may not be the best that the americans could have formed, but they are still very capable of winning everygame in kick-*** fashion. how can a team with duncan, garnett, iverson, wade, anthony, and james lose. sure they were still young but thy are stil way to good for the competition. sure the european teams had nba superstar players in their teams like serbia and montenegro, but the american team unlike the other teams are just fully loaded with superstars. the problem is obviously team chemistry.the players didnt know how to put together their talents to use because they are relying on their one on one moves. international ball requires more than that. TEAM PLAY is obviously the key and the only way to achieve this is by playing together for a longer time. i commend colangelo for his efforts to fix this problem by creating a dream team 2 years prior to the ultimate goal... the beijing olympics in 2008. i can confidently predict that the usa will recapture their lost glory in the game of basketball.


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## Luca

sai said:


> they should play together more often and not send a new team to every tournament


i agree with you


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## s a b a s 11

The US certainly has the most individual talent, and thats the problem... you can't, on a whim, throw together 12 individual players and expect the team chemistry to just click. All this talk about putting together this team and that team and how they will dominate really is disrespectful to the international teams that have placed higher and beat the US in previous international competitions.

I mean, everyone before the World Championships *in* Indianapolis and 2004 Olympics were predicting they would dominate the Olympics. And when they didn't, the cry from the armchair coaches were "Well, we didn't bring our best players" which, if the US loses again this time, will be the same excuse - "well if we had Shaq and KG and Tim Duncan, we would have run the table by 30 points a game"

Step back for a second and give credit where credit is due.

Stuart


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## Scipio

Yuck said:


> This isn't even a great questions....If the US sent its actual 12 best players even if they weren't team players, the US Team would dominate. The rest of the world, though plays better as a team and has more experience playing with each other, the sheer physical superiority of the American players will overwhelm any opposition. And please God never let Larry Brown coach an Olympic team. He uses his own unflexible system instead of letting the team play to their strengths. Brown is not a good coach IMO. Overrated. Phil Jackson and Don Nelson over him any day of the week.
> I also wanna add that the international referees are a joke to basketball, sports, and competition in general. They'd just do anything to keep the US down...Europeans...what a joke.


Worst post I've read in a LONG time. Check back to this century and understand the difference between NBA and international basketball.

anyway US should be the best and should win every tournament they go to. They have the best individuals and it's just the matter of getting those individuals play as a team. Internationals teams wont be overwhelmed with anything and know they have a chance beating US so there won't be any blowouts against the best teams.


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## juanjo

alexander said:


> OK How about this
> 
> PG Marko Jaric
> SG Milan Gurovic
> SF Predrag Stojakovic
> PF Predrag Drobnjak
> C Zeljko Rebraca
> 
> Bench:
> 
> G Igor Rakocevic
> G Aleksandar Pavlovic
> F Vladimir Radmanovic
> F Dejan Bodiroga
> F Zarko Cabarkapa
> C Nenad Krstic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> C
> C Mile Ilic
> 
> That "Dream Team" you named can only sell shirts, like Matej said team play and heart make a champion in international play, those guys ( Wade,LB,Kobe...) CAN'T play team basketball, it's impossible
> Serbia and Montenegro will be the new (old) World Champion :greatjob:



Hello. The american team is a lot better than serbia . I wonder why none here talks about SPAIN when it was shown that spain was the best team in the last o g, with Pau gasol as the best player of the tournament. Serbia isn´t better than spain, and argentina neither. Maybe you have forgotten that spain has beaten serbia in the last five matches. Fair and square. Spain only lost one game in the last o g, ( spain defeated the winner , argentina , serbia and the italy).

Let´s see this

Calderón ( Raul López)
Navarro ( la Bomba)
Garbajosa 
Pau Gasol
Fran Vázquez
IKer Iturbe 
Felipe Reyes
Rudy Fernández
Etc....

The USA is definitely the best team in the world. But i find annoying that none here talks about SPAIN , when it´s a strong team, and has always been on top for the last 10 years. And we´ve a new generation of great players, like PAU GASOL an all star. Garbajosa one of the best players of europe. Navarro is also very well known in europe cause he´s great. Fran vázquez he deserves to play for a NBA team , and many other names.


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## juanjo

The gap beetween the european( foreign ) basketball and the NBA is short. But the USA is still the best national team in the world. I want to mention the quality of the spanish basketball, with names like Pau Gasol and Juan Carlos Navarro, spain is for me one of the best teams in the world right now. Serbia was the best, but not now. Spain is better than argentina or serbia. Sometimes you don´t have to win the gold to be better, cause spain is always playing good basketball , and it´s always on top amongst the five potences in the world. Playing with or without gasol, there are many good spanish players. Names like Fran Vázquez, every year there is another spanish talent, that is going to be picked by a NBA team. Thank you.


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## juanjo

alexander said:


> the main reason for our disasters was coach Obradovic. Now, he is gone ,the new coach is coming(probably Pesic or even Slavnic), Stojakovic will be back, some other players will be back, Rakocevic and Jaric will make up,all problems will be solved and we will be stronger than ever
> 
> Matej
> Radivojevic for NT, are you nuts??? The guy averages 10 turnovers per game and more than 10 missed shots per game, almost triple-double :biggrin:
> 
> and by the way, Slovenia has a great team as well,with Nesterovic, Tusek, Nachbar, Smodis, Vujacic, Lakovic....you are not too far from the "Dream Team"


RAKOCEVIC WHO? 
JUAN CARLOS LA BOMBA NAVARRO IS BETTER LOL


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## CSILASVEGAS

the loss in the indianapolis world championships, and the failure to win the gold medal in athens is not an indication that the usa has lost its luster as the powerhouse in the world. i mean look at their roster, iverson, wade, james, anthony, garnett, brand, duncan, just to name a few. what they showed was overconfidence. they thought that they can go through international competition by not putting on their a game. you can see that teams like, argentina, serbia and montenegro, and other european teams are giving every bit of effort when facing team usa while the latter just looks like they are playing pick up ball in their backyard.

with the coming beijing olympics in 2008, watch out as team usa will once again show the PRETENDERS who the real powerhouse is in international basketball. they have been caught off guard the past few years and its time to get "a little" bit serious.


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## jokeaward

If we could get the players Canada does in hockey to play...

By 2008
Younger - Howard, Stoudemire, James, Wade, Arenas/Paul (Oden)
Older - Duncan, Garnett, McGrady, Kobe, Iverson/Kidd (Pierce, Redd)

Think about having the Pistons and Shawn Marion as a possible backup-backup starting 5. What team could gel better with that level of talent, really? I like Prince but the Matrix would boost things further. They could win gold (though they might be extra tired by the summer). So even without what's left of Shaq, maybe Kobe, Duncan, Garnett, McGrady probably with the back, Kidd, and Arenas as a bad olympic fit...


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## alex

juanjo said:


> The gap beetween the european( foreign ) basketball and the NBA is short. But the USA is still the best national team in the world. I want to mention the quality of the spanish basketball, with names like Pau Gasol and Juan Carlos Navarro, spain is for me one of the best teams in the world right now. Serbia was the best, but not now. Spain is better than argentina or serbia. Sometimes you don´t have to win the gold to be better, cause spain is always playing good basketball , and it´s always on top amongst the five potences in the world. Playing with or without gasol, there are many good spanish players. Names like Fran Vázquez, every year there is another spanish talent, that is going to be picked by a NBA team. Thank you.


I dunno, unless the Spanish league is significantly better then the Italian league (which I doubt it is), then the NBA is waaaaaaaaay way waaaaay better. It's not even close. In Europe the three point line is three feet (one meter) closer, the tempo is is slower, the players are faaaaaar less athletic, they are also a good deal skinnier and shorter, it's just at a whole different level. I've followed Virtus Roma (a top five team in Italy) this year, and the mostly mediocre Milwaukee Bucks for the past ten seasons, and the gap is gargantuan. 

Roma will play Phoenix next season in September. If Phoenix will play this entire game as if it's game seven of the NBA Finals, and Roma matched that intensity, the final score would be about 140-60, And I'm not joking. . . 


You're Welcome :clown:


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## bombnavarro

> Phoenix will play this entire game as if it's game seven of the NBA Finals, and Roma matched that intensity, the final score would be about 140-60, And I'm not joking. . .



Haha ¡¡ , It´s a Joke? :biggrin: :clown: 
You remember the match Toronto Raptors- Maccabi ?? (With NBA rules,nba field..etc)
I think that teams like Baxkonia(TAU) , Panathinaikos, Unicaja,Maccabi,CSK Moscow,Climanio can win 3/10 plays against the worse teams in the NBA.


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## mo76

bombnavarro said:


> Haha ¡¡ , It´s a Joke? :biggrin: :clown:
> You remember the match Toronto Raptors- Maccabi ?? (With NBA rules,nba field..etc)
> I think that teams like Baxkonia(TAU) , Panathinaikos, Unicaja,Maccabi,CSK Moscow,Climanio can win 3/10 plays against the worse teams in the NBA.



ok, international basketball teams are better than NBA teams.
:stupid:


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## alex

bombnavarro said:


> Haha ¡¡ , It´s a Joke? :biggrin: :clown:
> You remember the match Toronto Raptors- Maccabi ?? (With NBA rules,nba field..etc)
> I think that teams like Baxkonia(TAU) , Panathinaikos, Unicaja,Maccabi,CSK Moscow,Climanio can win 3/10 plays against the worse teams in the NBA.



I'm not sure if you're joking, but I sure wasn't. Maccabi beat Toronto on a last second shot. Toronto is one of the three worst teams in the NBA, Maccabi is the two time defending Euroleague champion. Maccabi lost by about ten to Orlando, which isn't a very good team either. Now, maybe in a best of seven series the _best_ European teams could beat the _worst_ NBA teams once or maybe twice. However, observe the highlighted words . . .

Phoenix is one of the best teams in the league, with unparalleled athleticism. They would destroy any European team, especially one like Virtus Roma, a top five team in Italy that lacks great athleticism. 

And just to clarify, I'm not some blind NBA homer, I'm half Italian, and I would absolutely love it if European teams had the financial resources to compete with the NBA. But they don't, the best players remain in America. My hope though, is that basketball gets played enough to not have a new European axis dilute the NBA. So this would mean that there must be a heavy influx of European, Asian, and African players into the basketball market.


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## bombnavarro

> ok, international basketball teams are better than NBA teams.


Haha¡¡¡... :biggrin: :biggrin: 

¡¡¡NO¡¡¡ but, i think that the best´s teams in Europe(Europe´s teams,no international teams...) can win some matchs against the worse teams in NBA...

Maccabi roster (7) Bobcat´s Roster (7)

15 SOLOMON, WILLIE --------> Brevin Knight
5 BASTON, MACEO -------->Emeka Okafor
6 SHARP, DERRICK ------> Raymond Felton 
7 VUJCIC, NIKOLA ---------> Brezec
8 PARKER, ANTHONY -------> G.Wallace
10 BURSTEIN, TAL ----------> Rush
23 ARNOLD, JAMIE ---->S.May


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## bombnavarro

> I'm not sure if you're joking, but I sure wasn't. Maccabi beat Toronto on a last second shot. Toronto is one of the three worst teams in the NBA, Maccabi is the two time defending Euroleague champion. Maccabi lost by about ten to Orlando, which isn't a very good team either. Now, maybe in a best of seven series the best European teams could beat the worst NBA teams once or maybe twice. However, observe the highlighted words . . .


Ok, but, Can win Phoenix 100 -70 against Toronto...? (its very unusual), teams in europe can lose by Phoenix 110-65, 120-70...etc but 140 - 60 its very exaggerated.. (very unusual)


Roster of Tau Ceramica and Portland Blazers

Luis Scola--------- Randolph
Tiago Splitter----- Miles
Jacobsen--------- Khryapa (?)
Hansen----------- Dixon
Prigioni----------- Telfair

Pedrag Dronbjak ---- Przybilla
Roko Leni Ukic------ Lenard
Erdogan------------Jarrett Jack 
Vidal--------------- Skinner, Webster..?


This even one... :uhoh:


Sorry by my English


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## italianBBlover

Toronto-Treviso 86-83


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## Stockalone

I'd like to see how a game like Panathinaikos vs. New York would end. Although Maccabi is two time defending champion of the euroleague, they've lost their glamour, 'cause Saras is not playing for 'em yet.


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## Scipio

Jumping off-topic a bit but just started wondering what kind of team England could suit up in 2012 Olympics? It would all start from Deng and Gordon. Any other plaeyres born in England playing in NBA or College? And would these players play for England?


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## oggdog

I think maccabi beat toronto even without jaskevicius this last year and playing on an nba court with their rules. exibition game. 

It's interesting though because people like drobnnjak had decent to good numbers at center over here in the u.s. on the hawks but is a total bust/stiff in europe. Europe i think is better if you comebine all of the leagues. some really good players don't play in euroleague because they get more money in domestic leagues or fiba europe league. super a, etc. essentially take the size of the u.s. and the size of europe(the countries that acttually play and follow basketball mind you) and then pit the two together. I don't think usa would have it easy. 

think of the possibilites.

i don't think the below would even start except maybe nowitzki

sabonis, ilgauskas, 
nowitzki, gasol
kirilenko, ......
ginobili(he is of italian descent and did play in europe), nocioni
nash(he's a germanic canadain.), udrih, jasikevicius. 








Scipio said:


> Jumping off-topic a bit but just started wondering what kind of team England could suit up in 2012 Olympics? It would all start from Deng and Gordon. Any other plaeyres born in England playing in NBA or College? And would these players play for England?


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## bombnavarro

> sabonis, ilgauskas,
> nowitzki, gasol
> kirilenko, ......
> ginobili(he is of italian descent and did play in europe), nocioni
> nash(he's a germanic canadain.), udrih, jasikevicius.
> [/qoute]
> 
> 
> I don´t understand your list:
> 
> Sabonis... (doesn´t play)
> Ginobili?...(Argentina)
> ¡¡ Noccioni ? ¡¡¡(Argentina)
> Nash?...Mmm (Canadá)
> 
> ¿Udrih, Jasievicius? ----> PARKER..¡¡¡?


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## Gavrilo Princip

Serbia is the best basketball team in the world  :banana:


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## Nuzzo

Gavrilo Princip said:


> Serbia is the best basketball team in the world  :banana:


Yea...and they NEVER won the OG gold :clap: :clap:


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## Matej

Nuzzo said:


> Yea...and they NEVER won the OG gold :clap: :clap:


actually yugoslavia won gold medal in 1980 so you can count that (somehow...)


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## jworth

The USA basketball team is still BY FAR the best team in the world. I suppose all the questions will be answered when the US wins gold yet again in the 2008 Olympic Games.


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## MagnusPinus

Team USA is NOT the best team in basketball simply because is not a team... If they make a serious project with players that complement each other and play together for some time( and it seems like they're already doing it) there won't be much trouble to win every game because there is no nation in the world that has the talent of the Usa basketball team


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## jworth

MagnusPinus said:


> *Team USA is NOT the best team in basketball simply because is not a team*... If they make a serious project with players that complement each other and play together for some time( and it seems like they're already doing it) there won't be much trouble to win every game because there is no nation in the world that has the talent of the Usa basketball team


Last time I checked, when you put five guys on the floor, sit at least seven on the bench, and have a coaching staff, you're a basketball team. The USA basketball team may only be together for a limited amount of time, but when it is together it's the very best team in the world.


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## MagnusPinus

jworth said:


> Last time I checked, when you put five guys on the floor, sit at least seven on the bench, and have a coaching staff, you're a basketball team. The USA basketball team may only be together for a limited amount of time, but when it is together it's the very best team in the world.


And everybody has seen how the great "team" won every match and took home the 1st place.. C-mon..the last usa teams were just dozens of very talented players getting on the floor and trying and not managing to play basketball...U just can't choose 12 Nba stars and voilà win games..the quality of foreign nations has become too high..now is time for usa basketball to become a regular team.. If the project of Colangelo goes well I have no problems to admit Usa si gonna win, but wont' be easy in any case so a little bit of hubleness is gonna be required.


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## jworth

MagnusPinus said:


> And everybody has seen how the great "team" won every match and took home the 1st place.. C-mon..the last usa teams were just dozens of very talented players getting on the floor and trying and not managing to play basketball...U just can't choose 12 Nba stars and voilà win games..the quality of foreign nations has become too high..now is time for usa basketball to become a regular team.. If the project of Colangelo goes well I have no problems to admit Usa si gonna win, but wont' be easy in any case so a little bit of hubleness is gonna be required.


The great USA team has only come up short of gold once in the last several Olympic Games. There's more reason to believe the US will win in 2008 than not. After finishing third in the last Olympics the focus has already changed quite a bit with much more motivation coming to the table. It's not hard that hard to notice.

The US team has one bad Olympic Games and even still only two teams finish ahead of it. Go figure.


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## MagnusPinus

There is not only the Olympics, the team usa hasn't won the world championship too..so those are 2 clear signes something has to to change.. and of course the project of Colangelo seems good..We still have to see how it goes,if Nba stars will be humble enough to go and give their hearts for the team..and how they will accepts cuts...


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## DKaiser

Based on the Larry Brown debacle in Athens, I think Team USA will continue to fail expectations because: 

1) They don't choose the right players to do the job. Note that they're always missing a true dominant center and shooters (which are essential to play against the zone defense in the international game). Instead, they rely on undersized power forwards (like Elton Brand) and out-of-position players (like Lamar Odom) who couldn't shoot and ballhogs (like Iverson, Marbury, etc.) who dribble too much. Where are the Shaqs and the Ray Allens?

2) Players are repeatingly confused with international rules of play. They easily get called for travelling, palming the ball, goal-interference, tick-tack fouls, etc. And what's more is that they never learn. Why? Because they get away with it in the NBA and get paid more.

3) Coaches design a lot of one-on-one plays which a zone defense can easily cripple. This is why Team USA loses more opportunity to score than say Argentina or Lithuania. Team USA thinks they can fastbreak the international teams out of the building. Then they get into a rude surprise when the opponent grounds the game to half-court plays and execute fluid movement and slick passes that zip above their collective bald heads and end up swish through the net.

4) Coaches don't fully utilize their 12-man roster. They become too predictable with over-reliance of a core group of players that international teams figure them out easily after one game. Case in point: what was Amare Stoudemire and Lebron James doing on the bench during Athens?

5) Lastly, Team USA likes to run and picks players who can run. So they leave out the wide bodies who can create a lot of space in the trapezoid keyhole area. So don't expect them to lead the league in rebounding. In international play, rebound, fluid passing, and pin-point shooting is the name of the game.

NBA players got caught up by the rest of the world (Europe & Latin America) big time. And they don't really know what hit them.

Let's see how the new Team USA respond to their dismal showing since 2001. I like the fact that coach K is calling the shots and I also like Kirk Hinrich manning the point. Cerebral players are a good start...but where are the shooters and the dominant centers?


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## bball2223

jworth said:


> The USA basketball team is still BY FAR the best team in the world. I suppose all the questions will be answered when the US wins gold yet again in the 2008 Olympic Games.


They aren't the best team by far in the world. Argentina, Spain, and France are better than you think. The USA team is the best team but not by an astronomical margin.


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## DKaiser

Yup...Team USA still has a lot of work cut out for them. The recent nail-biter against Brazil showed exactly why. In fact, they would have lost had it not been for the 8 technical free throws awarded to them in the closing minutes of the game. So it wasn't really a Dream Team beating Brazil, but rather Dream Team + 1 (referee).

Kirk Hinrich was the only picture of composure at clutch time, sinking timely three-pointers and free throws. The rest looked so nervous that the ball in their hands probably felt like bricks. Clunkers after clunkers were thrown by so-called "star" players like Elton Brand, Gilbert Arenas, Chris Bosh, and Lebron James.

Meanwhile, Brazil got the right idea after a slow start and went on a 16-0 tear. They dismantled Team USA's defense with quick drives and well-planted shots by just about everyone on the team. The drive-and-score-or-kick-out execution seemed to have caught in Team USA flat footed.

Compounding Team USA's woes was Brazil's stifling defense. On one occasion, Team USA took a time-out after finding itself in trouble with Brazil's hounding defence. You'd think they'd run a play that would've gotten them a better look at the basket (especially when there was a good 10 seconds in the shot clock). The result: Chris Bosh letting fly a fadeaway jumper from the 3-point line which never found the iron.

After watching that game, you can clearly see how important it is to choose your players well. I mean, the target is not to give a good showing in the World Basketball tournament. For crying out loud, they're NBA's "elite" and paid by the millions of dollars. The target is re-claiming the World Championship and eventually the gold medal in the olympics...so fans can be rest assured that when they watch the NBA, they're watching the best of the best. If this was the objective, then the following players should've been left home: Elton Brand (too short), Chris Paul (too inexperienced, erratic, and lack shooting skills), Gilbert Arenas (too erratic, can't shoot free throws), Brad Miller (come on, we need aggressive 7-footers, not stand-on-the-perimeter ones), and Chris Bosh (always looked lost). In their place, they probably could try: Ray Allen, Rashard Lewis, Chauncey Billups/Mike Bibby, Eric Dampier/Rasheed Wallace, and Chris Webber.

Or Kobe Bryant could finally step up to the plate and show international basketball what he's got. It'd be interesting if he could be as effective against the zone defense and international rules. Speaking about rules, I couldn't help but notice how paralyzed Lebron James offense became after his hop-and-jump was always called for traveling.

Predicted order of finish: 3rd place


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## CSILASVEGAS

The travelling calls on James and sometimes on Wade have hampered their performance in international play. The NBA's leniency on such moves are taking a negative effect on the American style of play which is take it strong to the basket and score on a layup or in-your-face-dunk. 

I think that the zone defense is the strongest weakness of the American Team. The problem is they dont have lots of 3 point threats. The only reliable gunner beyond the shorter three point range is Kirk Hinrich,, which is by far my favorite player in team USA. Redd would have been a perfect weapon against the zone and so is Chauncey and Kobe. 

But despite their struggles, i can see them easily winning the Worlds and regain the lost supremacy in international play. They are just too loaded with talent that it would be almost impossible for them to drop a single game even against powerhouse teams like Argentina, Germany, France, and the like. The Brazil game was just a small hiccup which, on the bright side, has taught them a lot of lessons in executing plays and keeping their composure when things aren't turning their way.


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## futuristxen

Again...Joe Johnson, Brad Miller, Arenas, Jamison--USA has shooters. Today turnovers and missed free throws cost them. Otherwise they would have had 110 points against the zone.

If the rest of the world were held to the same impossible standard of the US they would all be considered failures. Argentina isn't expected to blow out all of their opponents by 40 points, but somehow they are considered far and away better than the US?

These are going to be games. The single game elimination format favors the upset. But if these teams played 7 game series, the US would win easily. But all it takes is one game where you go ice cold and the other team is red hot, and you are done, no matter who you are.


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## TM

CSILASVEGAS said:


> The only reliable gunner beyond the shorter three point range is Kirk Hinrich,, which is by far my favorite player in team USA.


Ya, we can tell. And that first statemtent is just ludicrous.



CSILASVEGAS said:


> Redd would have been a perfect weapon against the zone and so is Chauncey and Kobe.


But they're not there, so why even mention it? I've said it before - *every single player* on the roster has the ability to hit a 20' jump shot. The majority of the players on that team shoot that kind of shot with a man in their face or fading away when they play in the NBA. No more using the 3pt line as an excuse, please.


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## maradro

DKaiser said:


> 3) Coaches design a lot of one-on-one plays which a zone defense can easily cripple. This is why Team USA loses more opportunity to score than say Argentina or Lithuania. Team USA thinks they can fastbreak the international teams out of the building. Then they get into a rude surprise when the opponent grounds the game to half-court plays and execute fluid movement and slick passes that zip above their collective bald heads and end up swish through the net.
> 
> 
> 5) Lastly, Team USA likes to run and picks players who can run. So they leave out the wide bodies who can create a lot of space in the trapezoid keyhole area. So don't expect them to lead the league in rebounding. In international play, rebound, fluid passing, and pin-point shooting is the name of the game.


nice first post. 
I agree with most of what you said, but here you make it sound a little too easy. Right now everyone is rusty and getting into form, and really no teams are executing very well (Spain apparently is showing the best form?). Of course with the supposed depth of the US it is understandable to expect better. Its really a long term process to instill a permanent national team the way other countries do and its way too early to tell if they have finally fixed the problem. 

As far as the tournament its too early to tell. Argentina had a drought against this Brazil team, and our new coach decided to go small ball. they went on a 10-0 run (not as bad as 16 though, ha!). They need to adjust and get in shape. Of course its easier to believe they will when they've shown they can do it before. 

In basketball foreign teams cant really snub anybody because they dont have the depth, but in soccer, it often happens that some guys arent that good but they really show up for the national team, while more skilled super stars shrivel. As we would say here, the team usa jersey is too "heavy" for some players.


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## Matej

Where have you lost your we-have-to-dominate-every-single-quarter statements?


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