# Who will be gone?



## grizzfan (Jun 25, 2002)

Alrite folks....after the trade, it seems pretty obvious that Ryan Humphrey will probably be cut. Though Theron Smith does not have a guaranteed contract, the grizzlies will definitely want him on the roster. However, Ryan Humphrey has a guaranteed 3 year contract remaining and it will be difficult to eat his salary. 

With the grizz almost being 3 deep at every position, at the SG we actually have 4 in posey, person, dickerson and dahntay jones. IMO the grizz will try to trade person or dickerson. There is no doubt that nobody would want dickerson, so I dont see why they wouldnt ask him to retire. The local newspaper reported that he is fine and healthy, but again they said that he is still not fit. He is still hurting and will kee on hurting. So, I think they should just go ahead and ask him to retire and let insurance pay his salary. It will be interesting to see what the Grizzlies will do o trim the roster down to 15.

Any opinions?


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## bdachakeya (Jun 10, 2002)

They talk very highly oF Theron so I think they'll just deal with swallowing Hump's money, especially if they're not able to trade somebody for a conventional pick in the near future.


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## talula (Jul 9, 2003)

I also think the Grizzlies will cut Ryan Humphrey. His contract is only worth around 2.5 million combined for the next two seasons, I'm fairly confident that 05-06 is a team option for him. The Commercial Appeal reported that the Grizzlies were going to cut Brevin if they couldn't find a trade, and his contract was worth about 5 million. That makes me think they'd be willing to buy out Humphrey's contract. Theron looked great during the Summer League games, much better than Ryan and Mike Batiste. I'm really hoping that he makes it.


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

Humphrey's 2005-06 salary _is_ a team option, which I'm positive the team will not pick up. The guy hasn't proved anything in the league, and from the action I've personally seen from him, I have no idea how he was a first-rounder. I wish we could have dumped him off to Phoenix, but they probably know he sucks, too.

I have not seen Theron Smith, and although I heard he wowed a few people in the Summer League, is he worth eating a $2.5 million salary over two years? Is it worth waiving Humphrey while still paying him, just to have a guy on the roster who probably won't play many minutes, if at all?

As much as I hate Humphrey, I'm leaning towards "No." If Smith was going to play over 10mpg, I might reconsider, but at this point with the Suns trade, we have enough guys to cover the positions Theron plays (SF/PF).

Then again, I haven't seen Theron play, but Grizz fans need to ask if he's worth it.


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## grizzhoops (Apr 16, 2003)

Why not waive Dickerson? When he passes waivers, the Grizzlies will still have to pay his contract (meaning that they still have his rights) and if they don't play him he will be forced to retire, won't he?


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## Potatoe (Jun 17, 2002)

While it may be a nice problem to have,,,,, this team is going to have serious playing time issues to deal with if they don't make a move.

The roster is just stacked with NBA talent but there is simply no way that all of these players can get enough playing time to keep them happy.

Everything is fine at the point where J-Will is likely to pay about 30 to 35 MPG leaving 13 to 18 for Earl Watson, after that however it is going to be a gong show.

There are 96 min's available at the 4 and 5 spot, Gasol will easily chew up about 36 of those minutes and Tsakalidis will "At Least" get 22 at the 5. That leaves only 40 mpg for Swift, Ren and Outlaw. They aren't going to let Bo rot on the bench and if he gets 10mpg that only leaves 30 more for Ren and Stro to share. That's a big problem and neither player will keep quiet for long.

It's just as bad at the 2/3. Miller is a lock for 35mpg and Posey has been guaranteed a starting spot and likely 25 to 28 mpg. That leaves 46 min's to be divided between Battier, Dickerson, and Person. The problem I see forming here is that with the added Bulk, I'm not sure if shane will be able to defend the 2 spot and thus he will be stuck behind Miller at the 3. I think that shane will have trouble getting any more than 20mpg next year and if Dickerson can go he may get less than that. What's the point of keeping shane if he's not going to get significant minutes.

I have a feeling that in about 2 months playing time will be a huge issue in Memphis.


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## talula (Jul 9, 2003)

Jerry and Hubie have said that they aren't going to encourage Michael Dickerson to retire, but really what else would they say about the situation? Its not looking good for Mike at all. He could only practice 30 minutes during the first day of training camp. He hasn't been able to participate at all since.


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## grizzhoops (Apr 16, 2003)

Maybe there will be a few trades in the weeks ahead and throughout the season. I can see us trading players to teams in the playoff hunt but in dire straights to fill a certain positional need.

In that situation, the Grizzlies can give a player and get a player of equal quality and a pick. I think that picks and cap space will be important come May with the expansion draft looming.

As for playing time. It will be a competition issue and matchups. The players performing the best will play the most. Plain and simple. Trades are probable as players fail to deliver in Hubie’s system and are found a new home. The team will improve.

The cool thing about the Grizzlies is that management is where they want to be and Jerry and Hubie can do it their way. Both are only interested in building up the franchise and they both believe in the old fashioned way, work hard, defense, and fundamentals to earn your keep.


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

Get something for Wesley Person while you can... send the needy Shane Battier and Theron Smith with him. Grizzlies are just too stacked to worry about a 'decent' talent such as Theron Smith. Battier's departure won't affect this Memphis team too much with the plethora of talent it has. I really like Dahntay Jones as an off- the-bench 2 guard who plays around 10 mpg this season, as Dickerson is just too unstable. 

What about the possibility of West doing this:

Memphis sends:
Wesley Person, Shane Battier, Lorenzen Wright, Theron Smith possibly Troy Bell and a conditional first rounder

Portland sends:
Rasheed Wallace

Even before the trade deadline, I don't expect Portland to get anymore than what is offered in this deal. Wright is an acceptable post presence for Portland and they won't mind his offensive prowess. Battier and Person give Portland some much needed wingers and this trade effectively allows Portland to do what they have been trying to achieve -- start "rebuilding" without crashing and burning ala Nuggets. 

Troy Bell could be a starting point guard soon enough in Portland as I can't see McInnis putting up big numbers or Stoudemire contributing consistently. Blazers lose their superstar... but it's a loss they're willing to take.

Now for the Memphis part...

Gasol and Wallace technically both play the PF but since both are extremely versatile, they could create huge mismatches switching up on offense. They have UNBLOCKABLE shots. We could see a big big post defense of Tsakadalis, Gasol and Wallace although Wallace will probably defend on the perimeter...

One thing this trade does is effectively kill the SG position for the Grizzlies, as Posey, Miller and Jones will be fighting for scrap time. But West really won't care as Wallace, Gasol and JWill can provide enough firepower on offense although team chemistry will be an obvious issue Hubie Brown will have to deal with.

Will Sheed resign with the Grizz? Who knows... but atleast they will start making waves in the packed West.

Just throwin out some ideas :grinning:


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>The Franchise</b>!
> Get something for Wesley Person while you can... send the needy Shane Battier and Theron Smith with him. Grizzlies are just too stacked to worry about a 'decent' talent such as Theron Smith. Battier's departure won't affect this Memphis team too much with the plethora of talent it has. I really like Dahntay Jones as an off- the-bench 2 guard who plays around 10 mpg this season, as Dickerson is just too unstable.
> 
> What about the possibility of West doing this:
> ...


I would *LOVE* that deal. A bunch of average players for a borderline superstar. I would ALWAYS pull the trigger on that. And then look what we would have.

Jason Williams/Earl Watson
James Posey/Dahntay Jones/Mike Dickerson
Mike Miller/Bo Outlaw
Rasheed Wallace/Stromile Swift/Ryan Humphrey
Pau Gasol/Jake Tsakalidis

After that, it wouldn't even matter who we sign -- they wouldn't play, anyways. Sign Ratko Varda and Luke Recker (who cares) to join Mike D on the IR, and then pick Theron Smith right back up (the Blazers will have to release _someone_.). That's a playoff team, without a doubt. Not only that, but Wright's bad salary is off our hands, and we can choose whether or not to keep Sheed. We get a lot of cap space to play around with if we let him walk...

West would be a genius to get that deal...


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## grizzfan (Jun 25, 2002)

West would be a genius??? Are you kidding me??? Everybody would hate him for doing such a deal. Let me give you some reasons:

1) Rasheed Wallace is overrated....and a borderline superstar....so he is not a superstar...plus all his legal problems!

2)Shane Battier is a fan favorite...there is no way West gives him up for anybody less than a superstar

3)We would now have 4 pf in gasol, swift, outlaw and wallace

And you still think that would be a good deal??? What have you been smoking????


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>grizzfan</b>!
> West would be a genius??? Are you kidding me??? Everybody would hate him for doing such a deal. Let me give you some reasons:
> 
> 1) Rasheed Wallace is overrated....and a borderline superstar....so he is not a superstar...plus all his legal problems!
> ...


1) Look. I know Sheed is overrated, but that's not to say he doesn't have some extraordinary basketball talent. Not only that, but he has a 17 million dollar expiring contract which would put us WELL under the cap next season, even with Dickerson's crappy deal. The casual fan might not like the deal at first, but when we're in the playoffs, I wonder what they'll be saying.

2) If you think we're getting a "superstar" for Battier, you're sadly mistaken. No one is giving up a superstar or even a potential superstar for Shane Battier (who is a nice player to have on and off the court -- but he's a role player, plain and simple). That "fan favorite" status for any player goes out the door quickly when the team is winning. Lorenzen is a fan favorite also, but if we traded him for a guy that would help us win, no one would care by the end of the season.

3) Outlaw CAN play SF. He's only 6'7", and we're not asking him to do anything other than defend people, which is what he's good at anyways. Bringing in Sheed would necessitate Gasol sliding to the "5" spot, even though we'd be going with a two-PF deal. Not to mention possibly the most athletic team in the NBA, with Stromile Swift coming off the bench. My depth chart irons out where who will play. Our bench is pretty depleted, but it doesn't matter much since everyone in that starting lineup except Posey will be playing 36+ minutes per game.

4) It's a known fact that whoever gets the best player in the deal wins. In this case, not only do we get the best player (for practically no one), but we also dump a bad contract, and get the biggest expiring contract in the league back.

Post this trade on the Blazers board and see if they like it...because you'll hear the same thing I'm telling you.


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

Jerry West is not looking to get under the cap. Not at all. Why else would Miller have been given a big extension? Why else would Bo Outlaw have been acquired? It's not about the expiring contract, Rawse, because even if Wallace opts out of staying with Memphis, they will only be $4 million under the cap.

Portland's reasons are obvious for this trade. Wow does Paul Allen want to get rid of the problem makers... unless he gets a super duper offer from any other team before the trade deadline... If West

grizzfan -

With the number of new guards Memphis has, we'll see how much longer Battier can remain a "fan favorite" or even make a respectable contribution. Posey is in... Battier is long gone.

Are you actually thinking that because of Bo Outlaw Jerry West will think twice about trading for Sheed? Like I said, the key with Gasol and Wallace is versatility and really with Miller, Jwill Posey the Grizz have alot of perimeter fire power, and awesome perimeter defense. 

Tsakalidis is gonna log 22 mpg for the Grizz, initial starter. As for Swift, this guy is a great talent but have we (have I) seen him do much else besides showboat on offense? Once he works up a consistency on defense and can work on some hook or jump shots, he will be quite a force. I think he's athletic enough to play backup C.. even though he's 6'9 or 6'10.


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>rawse</b>!
> Post this trade on the Blazers board and see if they like it...because you'll hear the same thing I'm telling you.


Please don't, because this trade suggests that Portland wants to rebuild. As much as we love our BBB.net Blazer fans they are quite adamant in their beliefs of keeping their core. They don't think they should rebuild. They think they are a championship calibre team and need some role players. That's all. Bonzi and Rasheed will resign, of course they will... the diehard fans are the toughest to convince, and your rating always takes a hit when you try :yes:


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## MikeDC (Jul 16, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Potatoe</b>!


OMG, it's a Potatoe sighting! :laugh:


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## Potatoe (Jun 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>Mikedc</b>!
> 
> 
> OMG, it's a Potatoe sighting! :laugh:




LOL,

Well after being stipped of my mod duties without so much as an E-Mail explanation, I figured I was done with this place, but with the Grizz making some strides this year, and me being a forgiving chap,,,,,,,

back I be (smile)

BTW,,,,

How the heck are ya Mike,,,

All must be well over in "Bull Land" that team looks ready to make some noise....

Take Care.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

I'm sorry, but I think that was a horrible horrible trade too. We have some pretty good PF's already. Gasol, Swift and Wright. Why trade for another?

As for Sheed being a star, well, he's old. He's past his prime.. And he can barely lead a team as stacked as the blazers into the playoffs, do you really expect him to help the Grizzlies do much better? I'd much rather keep our core of talented youth. Sheed was the man maybe a couple years ago, but not anyore. I say keep our youngsters and we'd be contending for the title pretty soon. Let's make the playoffs this year!


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## GNG (Aug 17, 2002)

> Originally posted by <b>c_dog</b>!
> I'm sorry, but I think that was a horrible horrible trade too. We have some pretty good PF's already. Gasol, Swift and Wright. Why trade for another?
> 
> As for Sheed being a star, well, he's old. He's past his prime.. And he can barely lead a team as stacked as the blazers into the playoffs, do you really expect him to help the Grizzlies do much better? I'd much rather keep our core of talented youth. Sheed was the man maybe a couple years ago, but not anyore. I say keep our youngsters and we'd be contending for the title pretty soon. Let's make the playoffs this year!


Outside of Gasol and Swift, we have no good PFs. Wright's marginal, nothing special.

Sheed _is_ a star, and he's only 29. By comparison, Jason Williams is one month away from 28. That may be starting on the downward slope, but by no stretch of the imagination is Wallace "old." He's one of the top defensive PFs in the league, he's an excellent scorer, he still runs the floor exceptionally. If Hubie got him to take advantage of his strength and go post up, he'd be incredible. Now...I know you're thinking..."yeah, that'll never happen..." BUT, even if that doesn't happen, we're only getting him for bench scrubs, not to mention we unload Wright's contract, and Battier might be the best player we give up in that deal...

I still like it...


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## The_Franchise (Mar 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by <b>c_dog</b>!
> Sheed was the man maybe a couple years ago, but not anyore. I say keep our youngsters and we'd be contending for the title pretty soon. Let's make the playoffs this year!


Seems to me you are in denial. Keep your youngsters and Memphis isn't going anywhere this year. Look at how tough the West is... you need big players to compete.

Lakers, Mavs, Spurs, Kings and Wolves are pretty much guaranteed playoff spots. Rockets and Suns look more than likely to slide into the 6 and 7. For that final playoff spot, Memphis competes with Portland, Seattle and even if they do get the 8th spot, I can't see this Memphis core going far into the playoffs. 

Remember, West's goal is winning the championship... not getting swept in the first round.


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## c_dog (Sep 15, 2002)

I'll respond to both posts here..

Gasol and Swift is all you need at PF. We have hardly enough PT for Swift, and by adding Sheed you'd just be taking more of it away.

I'm not in denial. I really like the core of this group now. If anybody likes to criticize the Grizzlie's core, it's me. I disagreed when they signed Posey to MLE, even at the Miller trade because I thought they gave up one player too many(Griricek), laughed when ppl suggested getting Stephania, blame losses on Pau for being soft and not playing up to his potential, JWill for poor decision making. Having said that, I think they have all their pieces together now, and you'd be backtracking by doing the Sheed trade. Sheed is hardly a star, IMO. He can put up the numbers, but so can Pau. He's also a headache. You don't want these children to be around someone like him. He's a cancer!

I say, keep these youngster, see where they can take us. It's only a matter of time one of them emerges as a star. I can see it happen to Pau and Miller. Both can be a Sheed like player(impact wise). Pau is still young, what's to say he won't surpass Sheed? By trading for Sheed, you're giving up depth, and right now, I LOVE the depth.

How do the Grizzlies make the playoffs, you ask? They are now deep to the last man. Sure they may not have someone quite like Ray Allen, Starbury, or Kobe, but they sure have a lot more depth.

I think JWill is gonna be key this season. Miller and Pau are important, but I think JWill is most important to this team's success. He has emerged as a top 5 PG(no exaggeration) and now he needs to take over the team. Be the leader. This is HIS team.

Stars aren't obtained through trades. They are developed. And right now Grizzlies' future looks bright.


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