# Bulls need to know if Gooden deal would be wise



## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

> *Bulls need to know if Gooden deal would be wise*
> 
> *By Mike McGraw*
> _*Chicago Bulls*_
> ...


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

If we trade gooden for duhon, we better get that 1st round pick of theirs. And/or another player. I just looked at duhon's stats and they are very good, but i wouldnt just want a 1 player for 1 player trade. gotta have more


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Gooden for Duhon makes a lot of sense for both teams. The bulls are hurting for a real PF and we need a young PG.

For the Cavs, Duhon would be a great defensive piece who runs the offense better then Snow or Jones. Only concern would be his 3pt shot.

Losing Gooden could hurt in the future as him and AV could be our frontcourt pairing for the future


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## Pioneer10 (Sep 30, 2004)

Nice avater btw Remy: Love Cowboy Bepop - one of the best anime series ever


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

On the Bulls Drew Gooden could be the primary scorer when Ben Gordon isn't playing. You have to remember, his current scoring average is without any plays run for him. Occasionally he gets the ball in the post, and the kid has a consistent hook and turn around move, in addition to some good footwork.

It's just that what the Cavs need more than that is the pure hustle and defense of Anderson Verejao, and the shooting of Donyell from the outside to spread the court.

The Cavs would definitely miss him this year if they made the trade. But remember they do have Anderson, Marshall, and Alan Henderson, two of which could easily start, and one of which could start, but is a more than adequate backup. The Cavs power forward spot is a lot like the Bulls PG spot.


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## KingoftheCourt23 (Jul 20, 2005)

If this is a straight up gooden for duhon deal I dont think I do it. Gooden has played very well offensively this year and AV hasnt shown a great deal of offensive skills other than rebounding. I agree with chknwang in that some thing else needs to come our way.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

I'd do it for Duhon and the Bulls second round pick this year. Remember, with Duhon or even Hinrich, your need for scoring from the four lessens, because you don't have the offensive liability of Snow, nor the defensive liability of Damon(though both of those guys have been a lot better). Also if we got Duhon or Hinrich, I would think Snow or Jones has to be traded somewhere. Perhaps Snow to the Knicks for Jerome James or Malik Rose? So that we get an extra big man for emergencies.

But probably the point to make is that the Cavs are in no rush. I'd rather wait till the offseason to deal Gooden, or just you know, re-sign him and address the point guard situation in another manner. It's not like Gooden has professed the desire to go elsewhere. Unlike Boozer, I think he likes to play here.


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

Im not shure if there is more of a upside with duhon rather then gooden. Too bad we cant traade jones and marshall for duhon


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## KingoftheCourt23 (Jul 20, 2005)

I like the combo of Gooden and AV. AV is the defensive guy and Gooden can give you points in bunches. I am not sure if i would pull this trade.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

What if instead the trade was for Gordon? The people on the Bulls board think the reason this isn't going through is because the Cavs are asking for Gordon and not Duhon.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> What if instead the trade was for Gordon? The people on the Bulls board think the reason this isn't going through is because the Cavs are asking for Gordon and not Duhon.


Who knows. If there was a chance to get Ben Gordon, there's no doubt Cleveland would make a run for him. Let's say the Cavs somehow (out in fantasy world) got a hold of Gordon. I guess that would spell the immediate end of Damon Jones (no PT for Jones if that happened). I always had the impression Cleveland was asking for Duhon only because they already knew Chicago wouldn't trade Gordon to them.


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## TyGuy (Apr 19, 2003)

I dont think we want Gordon, we want someone who can run the team and gordon can really only run stuff for himself. He is a nice three ball shooter but he also isnt the defender that Duhon is.


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## KingoftheCourt23 (Jul 20, 2005)

Right now after watching a great game by AV i would definately be tempted to jump on this trade. Gordon can score and that is a part that is missing right now. I think that if the Cavs can trade Gooden and get Gordon then I think they pull the triger and trade Gooden.


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## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

It depends on your philosophy. In the past, from the way we drafted and traded, you could tell we were going after positional needs. Like we passed up on certain better, more talented players for position, for chemistry and what not. Going after Gordon would be a shift from the way Cleveland has done things recently. We drafted Jackson over J.R. Smith, Telfair, J. Smith, and others. We have Damon Jones on our team, who fills a position and specific need better than the summer leaguer Kelenna Azubuike, who was probably more talented hands down. I wouldn't mind getting a fire plug like Gordon, assuming we don't have to lose AV in the process.


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## SPIN DOCTOR (Oct 31, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> What if instead the trade was for Gordon? The people on the Bulls board think the reason this isn't going through is because the Cavs are asking for Gordon and not Duhon.


OK, Ben just threw in 39 last night, so maybe the timing to do this with a straight face might be poor. Nobody on the Bulls board is worried about a Gordon / Gooden swap, the feeling is to wait until summer for FA, if its not Drew thats OK too. If its a trade for his bird rights, he costs the team a cap hold of 250% of his contract (10M for Drew), at that point the Bulls are leveraged by Gooden, and paralized in the FA period (despite capspace). + the lose a VERY good young point that has a reasonable contract for the next 3 years.

Would you make this deal??? 

You can see why Chicago would not.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

TyGuy said:


> I dont think we want Gordon, we want someone who can run the team and gordon can really only run stuff for himself. He is a nice three ball shooter but he also isnt the defender that Duhon is.


I'm not so sure. Having Hughes and Lebron may mean we don't need a clear cut point guard. The main question mark is Gordon's ability to defend. Can he defend at least as well as Damon Jones does? People hate on Damon's d, but the last few months he's been a really good team defender.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

SPIN DOCTOR said:


> OK, Ben just threw in 39 last night, so maybe the timing to do this with a straight face might be poor. Nobody on the Bulls board is worried about a Gordon / Gooden swap, the feeling is to wait until summer for FA, if its not Drew thats OK too. If its a trade for his bird rights, he costs the team a cap hold of 250% of his contract (10M for Drew), at that point the Bulls are leveraged by Gooden, and paralized in the FA period (despite capspace). + the lose a VERY good young point that has a reasonable contract for the next 3 years.
> 
> Would you make this deal???
> 
> You can see why Chicago would not.


I'm not proposing the trade. Several people on the Bulls board said that and suspected that was the hold up, probably rightfully so. Because a Duhon for Gooden swap, you wouldn't think would require a second thought from the Bulls.

Hinrich would probably be the best guy for the Cavs, but he's the one lobbying for Gooden, so I doubt he's on the block. But he'd be the happy medium between Gordon and Duhon.


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

I dont think we have a chance to trade for gordon. he is the bulls future. We also have no chance to get hinrich. We would only have a chance to get duhon, and duhon for gooden wouldnt be beneficial. All we would be doing is scoring from another position. I say that becuase right now we are getting around 12 points from gooden and like 4 from snow. If we make this trade, we will get around 12 points from duhon and 4 or 5 points from varajao. So basically we arent really improving the team, we are just getting smaller.

edit:
i wouldnt want to trade a double double man for a 2nd string point gaurd. He is talented, but not the talent of gooden


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## SPIN DOCTOR (Oct 31, 2002)

futuristxen said:


> I'm not proposing the trade. Several people on the Bulls board said that and suspected that was the hold up, probably rightfully so. Because a Duhon for Gooden swap, you wouldn't think would require a second thought from the Bulls.
> 
> Hinrich would probably be the best guy for the Cavs, but he's the one lobbying for Gooden, so I doubt he's on the block. But he'd be the happy medium between Gordon and Duhon.


Sorry I was not more clear in my post.

What I was attempting to say was that Drew RFA status puts a cap hold on his contract of 250% this summer or $10,000,000 againt the cap until he resigns or accepts the qualifing offer. So Chicago that has spent two years clearing cap space for this summer would be severly limited in their ability to tender offers in free agency, if they traded for Drew without a extension agreement.

That is regardless of who the players involved would be. Gordon threw in 37 again last night, so its very safe to say Chicago is not shopping him, and any offer would have to completely blow them away to trade Ben. Since being named a starter, he is rapidly moving towards star consistant star performances nightly, nice supporting pieces will not persuade the Bulls to trade Gordon.

My .02 on Duhon is that he is the best pure point on the Bulls and an excellent floor leader (he simply runs the team much better than Kirk). They would have to have major reservations about trading him to the Cav's and watching him flourish in their division for the next 10 years. He is not a 2nd string point guard, he has leadership capabilities far beyond that. I feel that in the right situation, he could lead a team through the playoffs, smart, great court sense, and very unflappable in big games. But the Bulls know this too.


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## rosenthall (Aug 1, 2002)

*Cavs financial future/Drew Gooden*

Greetings. I'm a Bulls fan, and as I'm sure you all know, there have been some rumours lately about the Bulls inquiring about Drew Gooden. I just wanted some perspective and insight from people who would know this team better than I. Some questions:

In your opinion......how does Drew Gooden forecast into your teams future? Integral part? A player you're looking to shed?? Good fit? Bad fit?? Is he a guy that Danny Ferry identifies as part of your core, or is more like Chicago and Jamal Crawford, where Pax recognized him as a talent, but didn't really like his game all that much, and was only interested in signing him if it was a contract that was very tradeable?

What kind of financial concerns does your team have, and how does Drew Gooden fit into that? You guys gave out a lot of money last year, and Lebron's FA is coming up. In your opinion, does that squeeze Drew Gooden out somewhat, or does Dan Brown not care?? What's the most you think the Cavs would be willing to pay him?

Do you think it's likely that he gets traded at the deadline, or will he last until the offseason? And if he gets traded, what team seems the most likey??



Thanks a lot!!


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

*Re: Cavs financial future/Drew Gooden*

Well his contract is up at the end of the year, and if we dont trade him, i would love to see him return. I personally think he is one of our crucial keys to success this year. He pretty much averages a double double. And players like that are hard to find. I think this has been his best all around year in the nba. Last year we didnt have as many players who could score, so he was sometimes trying too much. But this year he is playing more physical defense and getting those rebounds He has really focused on his role as the fundamental player for our team. He still gets his points tho.

I doubt we will trade him for just Duhon. At least i hope not. I would want more then that for gooden. I say that becuase we would pretty much get the same amount of points, but just from a different position. and we'd lose our size and depth at the PF spot


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

*Re: Cavs financial future/Drew Gooden*

Im hearing stuff about Al Harrington on the Hawks being traded to the Bulls for Ben Gordon


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

*Re: Cavs financial future/Drew Gooden*

I think Ferry would trade Gooden if it was a deal that would improve the team. But he won't make a lateral move just to get a point guard who may or may not end up being better than Eric Snow/Damon Jones.

But Dan Gilbert has shown the desire to pay the big bucks to change the culture in cleveland. So I think if Danny decides to keep Drew, Dan will pay most any contract. I doubt Drew gets offered anything too unreasonable. Probably have to pay him a little more than what Donyell makes. I think Drew would love to stay with the Cavs, so a long term deal might drive his asking price down.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

So what? Drew is close to the best big man that is going to be available in free agency. The Bulls cleared cap space for a free agency summer that is looking increasingly bare. Plus getting Gooden now, would help the Bulls make a playoff push, which one would think, would be worth the extra money.


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> So what? Drew is close to the best big man that is going to be available in free agency. The Bulls cleared cap space for a free agency summer that is looking increasingly bare. Plus getting Gooden now, would help the Bulls make a playoff push, which one would think, would be worth the extra money.


 ????

Iread your first post then your second and im confused now. lol


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## Mr. Hobbes (Jul 1, 2005)

Isn't Gooden 4th in the league in ORPG? I wouldn't trade him.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

CHKNWANG321 said:


> ????
> 
> Iread your first post then your second and im confused now. lol


My second post was from another thread that got merged into this one.


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

futuristxen said:


> My second post was from another thread that got merged into this one.


 o, ic


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## Larry Hughes for Retirement (Jul 5, 2004)

Gooden will get 30-40 million over 5 years or so after this year. He is young and actice and played really well last two years. Look at what people are getting paid in this market now a days, Gooden will get paid and i dont think Gilbert can dig deep enough to keep him here.

But if we trade for Duhon thats 3 point guards on our team. Snow/DJ would have to be moved after that.


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## futuristxen (Jun 26, 2003)

You don't think Drew will get paid 40-50 mill? That's semi-reasonable for the type of player he is. He's young, he is a big man, and he plays really well. I would think though that if he's not gone by the deadline then Danny and Gilbert plan to pay what it takes to keep him, because otherwise, why not make the trade so you get something out of him.


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

I think we should try to just trade Marshall and Jones to a team that needs some three point threats. Because if we could get a draft pick or money with a point gaurd for them; id be happy


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## Larry Hughes for Retirement (Jul 5, 2004)

futuristxen said:


> You don't think Drew will get paid 40-50 mill? That's semi-reasonable for the type of player he is. He's young, he is a big man, and he plays really well. I would think though that if he's not gone by the deadline then Danny and Gilbert plan to pay what it takes to keep him, because otherwise, why not make the trade so you get something out of him.



I think Gooden will get paid. But if we dont trade him, i still think he walks b/c we have to think about Lebrons contract in 2 years. I think we keep him based off of trying to win this year, if we trade him for Duhon than i think we take a step back this year.

Marshall cannot start he is too old for all the things needed by a Power Forward these days. And AV wont last the whole season with the way he plays if he started and played 35min a game. He would be hurt before the end of it. His energy would die off.


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## spongyfungy (Oct 22, 2003)

*Gooden rumors swirl*

Several media outlets reported that the Cavs and Bulls were in talks about a trade involving Drew Gooden on Monday. *League insiders said the Cavs have made calls around the league to gauge Gooden's value but they are not in any active trade thoughts.* Gooden, a restricted free agent at season's end, is the Cavs' most tradeable asset, and rumors will likely continue to emerge until the trade deadline later this month.









*
Trade rumors don't bother Gooden

*Cavaliers General Manager Danny Ferry does not comment on trade talk. The Chicago Bulls, looking for frontline help, reportedly are interested in Gooden and have tossed out point guard Chris Duhon as bait. 

Duhon, a second-round draft pick in 2004, is averaging 9.3 points and 5.5 assists in 32 minutes a game. He's a 37 percent 3-point shooter, hitting 68-of-184 from downtown. Like Ferry, he is a Duke graduate. 

With the recent emergence of 6-10 forward/center Anderson Varejao, the Cavaliers may look at making a Gooden-for-Duhon trade as a way to upgrade the point-guard spot while not creating a huge void at power forward.


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## CHKNWANG321 (Sep 3, 2005)

I still dont think Chris Duhon is enough to give gooden up. I dont like trades for the sake of making trades. Kinda like last year: 1st round pick for Jeri Welsch. And i dont even remember Welsch even making a shot last year


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## KingoftheCourt23 (Jul 20, 2005)

I dont think the Cavs should trade away Gooden for just Duhon. We need to get another player or a pick. I would like to see the Cavs keep Gooden but it seems like we have a lock jam at pf. I am interested to see how this whole trading season pans out though.


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## The OUTLAW (Jun 13, 2002)

CHKNWANG321 said:


> I still dont think Chris Duhon is enough to give gooden up. I dont like trades for the sake of making trades. Kinda like last year: 1st round pick for Jeri Welsch. And i dont even remember Welsch even making a shot last year


I'm pretty confident that Welsch did not make any shots last year. I've never seen a multiyear professional look that inept. I agree that trades for trade sakes really doesn't do any good. That being said, I can't see trading Gooden to Chicago at all. But more importantly I can't see trading him for Duhon only.


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