# Will Blake Griffin be better than Chris Bosh?



## gi0rdun (May 31, 2007)

Usually if you ask people to name an 'All-Next Generation team' they give you something like

PG - Paul
SG - Wade (Roy sometimes since he's younger)
SF - LeBron James
PF - Chris Bosh
C - Dwight Howard

With Chris Bosh being the worst of the group. Do you guys see Blake Griffin eventually taking over this 'best young PF' title?


----------



## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

nah I dont think so Durant and Beasley are more likely for that spot than Griffin even though they arent really PFs


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Bosh hasnt really accomplished a lot besides individual glory. If Blake lands on a good team he could achieve more


----------



## Chan Ho Nam (Jan 9, 2007)

i think Beaseley will be better than Bosh

Durant is better than Bosh already imo


----------



## Luthurcn (Mar 31, 2009)

um...i dont think so,who konws the future...


----------



## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

I think people are underrating Bosh just because Toronto hasnt played well this season he is still at least top 15 player close to top 10


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

weird comparison, but no i don't think griffin will ever be a better player than bosh.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

In 2-3 years time, Blake will be averaging 20/12 seasons.


----------



## MemphisX (Sep 11, 2002)

Bosh and Griffin had very similar freshman seasons. They are not similar players though and I think Griffin will be a similar level player in the NBA. So I guess it depends upon how you feel about Bosh. Seeing as how both Boozer and Bosh have had multiple years of fringe MVP consideration, I think Griffin will be a great prize for the team selecting #1 especially when the likes of KG, Duncan, Dirk, and Shaq slowing down.


----------



## southeasy (Jun 11, 2003)

cannot really compare the two, as both play completely different games.

i don't think he'll be as good as CB, and i don't think CB has been as good, yet, as he can be & will be.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

They play the same position, whats there not to compare? Playing style doesn't count. Thats like saying Yao and Shaq shouldn't be compared because they play differently.


----------



## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

HB said:


> They play the same position, whats there not to compare? Playing style doesn't count. Thats like saying Yao and Shaq shouldn't be compared because they play differently.


Exactly.


----------



## Blue (Jun 21, 2007)

Blake Griffin is a surefire NBA talent. Can he be better than Bosh? yes. Will he? idk.

His game is more power and Bosh is more finesse. Amare would be a better comparison, but idk if his leaping ability is AS nice as STAT. We'll see tho.


----------



## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

Only time will tell, Blake has some developing to do, he's gonna need better post work, and a nice jumper. he sure has the athletic ability to hang, but as far as polished skills, he can use some work. Who knows, if he works his *** off like Booz, and gets a midrange and a post arsenal, (lord knows Booze didn't look like that in college.) he can def. be up there with bosh and such.


----------



## Rather Unique (Aug 26, 2005)

HB said:


> Bosh hasnt really accomplished a lot besides individual glory. If Blake lands on a good team he could achieve more


Well in all fairness HB, team accomplishments shouldn't mean much IF hypothetically Blake's numbers are lower and has a worse visible all-around game then Bosh (unless he is lifting his overall team to the standards of Wade/Kobe/Bron/Timmy). But if they match up well and it's a close call, then sure I believe it's fair to compare team accomplishments.


----------



## bootstrenf (May 24, 2006)

gi0rdun said:


> Usually if you ask people to name an 'All-Next Generation team' they give you something like
> 
> PG - Paul
> SG - Wade (Roy sometimes since he's younger)
> ...


first of all, i think the 'All-Next Generation team' should be:

pg: paul 
sg: rose 
sf: durant
pf: lebron
ce: howard


----------



## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

bootstrenf said:


> first of all, i think the 'All-Next Generation team' should be:
> 
> pg: paul
> sg: rose
> ...


Why do you list Rose at the 2 and Lebron at the 4 ? Why do you want them playing out of position ?


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Why is Rose on that list? Is Wade still in the league?


----------



## Chan Ho Nam (Jan 9, 2007)

bootstrenf said:


> first of all, i think the 'All-Next Generation team' should be:
> 
> pg: paul
> sg: rose
> ...


that's funny, but seriously


----------



## Dee-Zy (Jan 12, 2006)

chairman5 said:


> i think Beaseley will be better than Bosh
> 
> Durant is better than Bosh already imo


WTF? Are you serious? I'm not sure Bease will be better than Bosh but Durant is not better than Bosh already.

He will, but he is not right now. Far from it.


----------



## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

Dee-Zy said:


> WTF? Are you serious? I'm not sure Bease will be better than Bosh but Durant is not better than Bosh already.
> 
> He will, but he is not right now. Far from it.


Bosh and Durant are on the same level right now, should be different next year although I also expect Bosh to play a little better again. I'm not trying to take anything away from Bosh, he is great in his own right.


----------



## The Krakken (Jul 17, 2002)

Bosh is highly underrated around here. I think that will change in 2 years when he moves back to his natural position at the 4, in Chicago, and plays with another franchise level talent in Derrick Rose.


----------



## DaBabyBullz (May 26, 2006)

I'd take Durant over Bosh every time. Just my 2 cents.


----------



## moss_is_1 (Jun 14, 2004)

Al Jefferson>Bosh


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

Griffin will absolutely be better than Bosh.

He's the most impressive power forward to come out of college basketball since Tim Duncan.


----------



## Luke (Dec 7, 2008)

I'm going with yes; Bosh has been in the league now for six years, and still hasn't shown anything on the defensive side of the floor. Sure, he's a terrific offensive player but unless he develops into a good defender I can see Griffin over-taking him in two to three years.


----------



## someone (Jul 17, 2007)

MLKG said:


> Griffin will absolutely be better than Bosh.
> 
> He's the most impressive power forward to come out of college basketball since Tim Duncan.


I heard that same mumbo jumbo last year with Beasley. I'll believe it when I see it.


----------



## Tom (Jul 15, 2002)

Blake will be way better than Bosh.


----------



## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

Tom said:


> Blake will be way better than Bosh.


Way better means that Griffin will be a Top 5 player, do you still agree with that projection ?


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

someone said:


> I heard that same mumbo jumbo last year with Beasley. I'll believe it when I see it.


No you didn't. At least not from anybody who knew what they were talking about.

Beasley had (and still has) size concerns for the 4 spot. Griffin is a physical specimen in a completely different catagory.


----------



## Luke (Dec 7, 2008)

:stupid:


----------



## jman23 (Aug 13, 2007)

griffin over rupaul anyday.


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

VanillaPrice said:


> I'm going with yes; Bosh has been in the league now for six years, and still hasn't shown anything on the defensive side of the floor. Sure, he's a terrific offensive player but unless he develops into a good defender I can see Griffin over-taking him in two to three years.


griffin isn't really much of a defensive prospect.


----------



## Tom (Jul 15, 2002)

croco said:


> Way better means that Griffin will be a Top 5 player, do you still agree with that projection ?


Bosh isn't a top five player


----------



## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

Tom said:


> Bosh isn't a top five player


Read my post again.

Bosh is a Top 15 player, you said Griffin will be way better than him which indicates that Griffin is going to be a Top 5 player.


----------



## moss_is_1 (Jun 14, 2004)

croco said:


> Read my post again.
> 
> Bosh is a Top 15 player, you said Griffin will be way better than him which indicates that Griffin is going to be a Top 5 player.


Bosh being top 15 is a stretch.

kobe
lebron
d-wade
cp3
Dirk
Duncan
KG
Deron williams
Dwight Howard
Yao ming
Brandon Roy
Carmello 
Tony Parker
Then you can argue guys like Durant, David West, Al Jefferson, Steve Nash, Boozer, Gasol, Granger, Billups,Iggy, Joe Johnson,Paul Pierce.


----------



## SheriffKilla (Jan 1, 2004)

you only mentioned 13 players and I would say Bosh >>Deron and Melo...
so basically Bosh or Parker for 11th best player in the league...so of course its arguable but him being a top 15 player is not a stretch at all 
Possibily even top 10


----------



## moss_is_1 (Jun 14, 2004)

fjkdsi said:


> you only mentioned 13 players and I would say Bosh >>Deron and Melo...
> so basically Bosh or Parker for 11th best player in the league...so of course its arguable but him being a top 15 player is not a stretch at all
> Possibily even top 10


I know how many players I listed, but I believe some of those guys that I said you could argue are better are actually better than Bosh.


----------



## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

I like how people are absolutely sure that Blake Griffin will be better. I mean really? You're that certain? By way better (not just arguably better or marginally better, way better means 25/12 or beyond) you are basically saying that Griffin will be the best power forward in the league in, let's say, 5 years. It's quite a bold statement to make and I'm surprised anyone would say something like that without putting a "maybe" or "theres a chance" in front of it.

I am going to say that they'll be about the same. Griffin has the physical tools to be better than Bosh but at the same time he has long ways to go from where he is right now as a player to what Bosh is right now. He will likely put up Beasley numbers in his rookie year(which is slightly better than Bosh's rookie numbers) and it's anyone's guess how much better he will be a few years from now.

Another thing is assuming Griffin goes to one of the top 5 teams, which are Kings, Wizards, Clippers, Thunder, and twolves, he won't be going into a team that allows him to be the franchise player(at least right off the bat). Bosh was lucky that VC left town a little over a year after he was drafted and the Raptors were able to build the team around him. Out of the top 5 teams, only the Kings have a roster that will give him a lot of touches in his rookie season. The Clippers are a mess and with those contracts it will take a long time for them to rebuild and I doubt they will be a winning team by the time Griffin's rookie contract expires. Thunder already have Durant as their main guy and Twolves have Al Jefferson.


----------



## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

Just to put things into propsective, heres a list of power forwards that Bosh played with in this era

PFs that are *way better* than Bosh

KG
Duncan

PFs that are considered better or arguably better than Bosh

Dirk
Amare

PFs that are about the same or worse than Bosh

Brand
Gasol
David West
Jermaine O'neal
Carlos Boozer

Since we're talking about "way better", we can eliminate the last 5 guys which leaves us with KG/Duncan/Dirk/Amare. Dirk won a MVP and Amare has been on nba first-teams. KG and Duncan are considered 2 of the best PFs of all time. Are you telling me that Blake Griffin will be in the same category as those 4 guys? Call me crazy but I don't see Griffin as that kind of a player. I mean you can knock on Bosh all you want but when you look at the guys that are actually better than him and what they have accomplished in their careers, you come to the realization that perhaps it isn't so easy to be better than this dude.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

Players aren't measured by numbers. His stats may not dwarf Bosh's, but he will be a better player. I've never looked at Bosh as the type of player teams fear. He scores and rebounds and all that, but he doesn't change the way the game is played for the other team.

There isn't a player like Griffin in the NBA right now. His combination of talent, hustle, and bruising physique hasn't been seen in awhile.


----------



## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

MLKG said:


> Players aren't measured by numbers. His stats may not dwarf Bosh's, but he will be a better player. I've never looked at Bosh as the type of player teams fear. He scores and rebounds and all that, but he doesn't change the way the game is played for the other team.
> 
> There isn't a player like Griffin in the NBA right now. His combination of talent, hustle, and bruising physique hasn't been seen in awhile.


That's why I gave you 2 types of measurement, see my 2nd post. By "much better" than Bosh you're pretty much announcing him to be a HOF player before he even step foot in the NBA. I don't see that to be reasonable and I don't know how anyone would make such a statement without some major bias.

Griffin's physical talents, while impressive, are not out of this world. As I said, he has a chance to be a great player, but theres nothing that I see out of him at this point that will make him a sure HOFer and the best power forward in the league in the near future.

Again, it's easy to knock on Bosh especially after a disappointing season from the Raptors. Just don't go overboard with the Bosh hate or you'll end up with some silly statements like the one you just made.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

^Most of what you have pointed out is correct except the phyiscal talents part. The only guy in the league with Griffin's physique and athleticism is Lebron James.


----------



## anru321 (Jul 13, 2002)

fjkdsi said:


> you only mentioned 13 players and I would say Bosh >>Deron and Melo...
> so basically Bosh or Parker for 11th best player in the league...so of course its arguable but him being a top 15 player is not a stretch at all
> Possibily even top 10


The 2nd best PG in the league (Deron) >>>> Finesse PF (Bosh)


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

HB said:


> ^Most of what you have pointed out is correct except the phyiscal talents part. The only guy in the league with Griffin's physique and athleticism is Lebron James.


wow. i never thought i'd see someone say something like that.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Whats so surprising about that?


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

seifer0406 said:


> By "much better" than Bosh you're pretty much announcing him to be a HOF player before he even step foot in the NBA. I don't see that to be reasonable and I don't know how anyone would make such a statement without some major bias.


Maybe I just think the difference between "Bosh" and "Hall of Famer" is much larger than you do.

And for clarity, I never said he would be "much better". I said he would "absolutely" be better, which means I have almost no doubt that he will be a better player.


----------



## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

MLKG said:


> Maybe I just think the difference between "Bosh" and "Hall of Famer" is much larger than you do.
> 
> And for clarity, I never said he would be "much better". I said he would "absolutely" be better, which means I have almost no doubt that he will be a better player.


Well, I guess that's where we differ in opinion. If you want to say someone is "absolutely better" they pretty much to be better by quite a margin. That's where my list come in, for someone to be clearly better than Bosh, they will pretty much have to be in the echelon of TD/KG/Amare/Dirk, that is the reality of the situation today. I wouldn't be surprised if 3 out of 4 makes it in the HOF with at least 2 of them first ballot.

When you get down to it, when it is all over Chris Bosh will average around 21/10 for his entire career. It's probably not going to get him into the HOF but I don't think it will take a whole lot more to at least be considered.


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

HB said:


> Whats so surprising about that?


it's not close to being true. and i don't think even blake griffin's parents would agree with it.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

seifer0406 said:


> When you get down to it, when it is all over Chris Bosh will average around 21/10 for his entire career. It's probably not going to get him into the HOF but I don't think it will take a whole lot more to at least be considered.


Elton Brand has averaged 20/10 his entire career. Is he even anywhere close to being a hall of famer? 

Would you have an issue if people said Griffin will definately be better than Jermaine O'Neal?

Bosh has done nothing yet to seperate himself from either of these players (in their respective primes). 

You're logic falls apart when you assume that just because Duncan/Garnett/Dirk/etc... are the only PF's better than Bosh, than any PF better than Bosh must be in that group. There is plenty of room in between.


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

MLKG said:


> Elton Brand has averaged 20/10 his entire career. Is he even anywhere close to being a hall of famer?
> 
> Would you have an issue if people said Griffin will definately be better than Jermaine O'Neal?
> 
> ...


i don't expect griffin to be better than prime brand or prime jermaine oneal. if he's not better than the versions of those guys who played this season, they he'll be a huge disappointment.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

rocketeer said:


> it's not close to being true. and i don't think even blake griffin's parents would agree with it.


You know it gets old when you argue for arguments sake, and you cant even accept when you are wrong, (cue the Brook Lopez thread)

Blake's just as big as Bron, not a skilled, but definitely as athletic as he is. Want me to bring vids where his head is basically at rim level. The guy's size and athleticism is only rivaled by one guy in the league...thats Bron! Blake also handles the ball really well for a big guy, he just doesnt have Bron's passing ability or outside shot.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

rocketeer said:


> i don't expect griffin to be better than prime brand or prime jermaine oneal. if he's not better than the versions of those guys who played this season, they he'll be a huge disappointment.


How do you know this? The guy's the overall number 1 pick for a reason, he is oozing with potential. Prime JO averaged what 20/10? Same goes for Brand...why cant Blake do that?


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

HB said:


> You know it gets old when you argue for arguments sake, and you cant even accept when you are wrong, (cue the Brook Lopez thread)
> 
> Blake's just as big as Bron, not a skilled, but definitely as athletic as he is. Want me to bring vids where his head is basically at rim level. The guy's size and athleticism is only rivaled by one guy in the league...thats Bron! Blake also handles the ball really well for a big guy, he just doesnt have Bron's passing ability or outside shot.


dwight howard.

you're wrong. and did you really just say the blake griffin is as athletic as lebron?

oh and i've admitted many times that brook lopez is better than i thought he would be.


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

HB said:


> How do you know this? The guy's the overall number 1 pick for a reason, he is oozing with potential. Prime JO averaged what 20/10? Same goes for Brand...why cant Blake do that?


he'll never be as good of a defender as either of them in their primes even if he is able to eventually put up 20/10.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Dwight Howard does not have the same physique as Blake. I am pretty sure if measured side by side, Blake is more along Lebron's height than Dwight, and yes do I have to spell it out, Blake Griffin IS as athletic as Lebron. What can Bron do athletically that Blake can't? 


As for Blake not being a good defender, dont get it twisted, HKF already explained it well, at OU he couldnt play as aggressively on defense because of foul trouble. The same wont apply in the NBA, where refs actually officiate big men properly.

Watch carefully how high he gets up

3kPyjOjsnx


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

HB said:


> Dwight Howard does not have the same physique as Blake. I am pretty sure if measured side by side, Blake is more along Lebron's height than Dwight, and yes do I have to spell it out, Blake Griffin IS as athletic as Lebron. What can Bron do athletically that Blake can't?
> 
> As for Blake not being a good defender, dont get it twisted, HKF already explained it well, at OU he couldnt play as aggressively on defense because of foul trouble. The same wont apply in the NBA, where refs actually officiate big men properly.
> 
> Watch carefully how high he gets up


i guess there is no point discussing anything with you.

griffin isn't in the same class of athlete as lebron or dwight howard. and yes dwight's physique matches up(not that it is really relevant to anything).

and you could say that about basically any good college player, that they don't play defense because they can't afford foul trouble, however some of them still manage to be good defenders. griffin isn't.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Griffin isnt the same class athlete as Dwight and Bron...thats it? No explanation, no nothing? You've gotta be kidding me. Obviously you have a reason to believe that, no? Again what can Bron do athletically that Blake can't

Again with the defense thing, you make this blanket statements, dont back them up and expect people to just take your word for it. Why? What makes Blake a bad defender? He's already an excellent help defender, matter of Blake and his brother were two of college ball's best post defenders last year. They have excellent lateral movement, they dont give up plays either.


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

HB said:


> Griffin isnt the same class athlete as Dwight and Bron...thats it? No explanation, no nothing? You've gotta be kidding me. Obviously you have a reason to believe that, no? Again what can Bron do athletically that Blake can't


everything. lebron is stronger, quicker, faster, jumps higher, has better balance. literally everything.

i didn't realize i needed to explain how lebron and dwight were better athletes than griffin. anyone who has watched the three of them play should be able to answer the question pretty easily.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Lol Lebron doesn't jump higher than Blake. Did you forget he dunked the ball so hard and jumped so high, he actually hit his head on the backboard. As for stronger, well Bron's been in the league what, 4 to 5 years now? He's seen the best nutritionists and training equipment in sports. Lets see how Blake does when he gets the same opportunities. Blake's also pretty quick for a big guy, Bron's probably quicker I'll give you that. As for Balance, thats also debatable especially since Blake's pet move is that quick spin or pirouette move he does so often. 

And seriously, watch games, better yet watch clips, Blake Griffin is insanely athletic. He can sky just as high as Bron and Dwight.


----------



## Gilgamesh (Dec 23, 2005)

These types of threads are always fun...and comical.

Griffin is a very good prospect but you have to be very brave to say he will definitively be better than Bosh. 22-10 is not an easy feat folks. Sure Bosh hasn't won anything but who does or did he play with? Is Bosh a superstar in the league? No. I believe you have to win and play big individually to achieve that status (so sorry to guys like Durant, Jefferson, and etc.). But Bosh is a perennial all-star caliber player. Does Griffin have this potential? Of course. The guy just finished off a monster season in college. But that is the problem we are talking potential and we are talking college stats (remember Adam Morrison?) so nothing should be definitive unless we are talking about a sure fire prospect aka Lebron and Duncan. But then again look at Oden (but injuries has a lot to do with that who knows if he will ever be 100%). 

I think Blake can be a 18-10 guy in the pros with potential to be a perennial 20-10 guy. I don't see superstar in this guy. No wait change that I don't see legend in this guy. Superstar is in his potential. I like Griffin more than Beasley but I still think Beasley is more skilled but Griffin is a true PF. He reminds me a little of Karl Malone without the jump shot and HB is right Griffin is an athletic specimen. Lebron and Howard are simply athletic freaks. Griffin is a notch under those guys which means he is just about 2 notches ahead of everybody else.


----------



## Gilgamesh (Dec 23, 2005)

HB said:


> Lol Lebron doesn't jump higher than Blake. Did you forget he dunked the ball so hard and jumped so high, he actually hit his head on the backboard. As for stronger, well Bron's been in the league what, 4 to 5 years now? He's seen the best nutritionists and training equipment in sports. Lets see how Blake does when he gets the same opportunities. Blake's also pretty quick for a big guy, Bron's probably quicker I'll give you that. As for Balance, thats also debatable especially since Blake's pet move is that quick spin or pirouette move he does so often.
> 
> And seriously, watch games, better yet watch clips, Blake Griffin is insanely athletic. He can sky just as high as Bron and Dwight.


Lebron had a standing 40 inch vertical coming into the league. That is amazing. Lebron is an athletic freak because of the combination of athletism the guy has. A guy that size that quick that fast that strong that can jump to the moon is incredible. Sure there are guys who are stronger, who are faster, who have higher verticals but who can possess high level of all of those things except Lebron? Honestly I can't even remember anybody I have ever watched since the 80s who can claim that type of athletic combination at high levels all around.

Also, do not forget that Blake might look ridiculously athletic against his college peers but Lebron looks ridiculous athletic against pros. 

No doubt that Blake is an athletic specimen though.


----------



## HKF (Dec 10, 2002)

Josh Smith is the best "athlete" in the NBA and Lebron is second, with Howard third.


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

HKF said:


> Josh Smith is the best "athlete" in the NBA and Lebron is second, with Howard third.


and blake grifin isn't in their league.


----------



## rocketeer (Oct 7, 2002)

HB said:


> And seriously, watch games, better yet watch clips, Blake Griffin is insanely athletic. He can sky just as high as Bron and Dwight.


do you even think before you post? watch games, wait better yet watch clips? are you serious?


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

^You might want to ask yourself that question. I mean how else do you judge athleticism if not by watching these players. To say Blake isn't even in their league is the most ridiculous statement on these boards. Blake is easily more athletic than 98% of the league.






Look how high he got in such a short distance






Please look at that last dunk, and how high he got. Not in Bron's league Puhhhleeaseee


----------



## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

MLKG said:


> Elton Brand has averaged 20/10 his entire career. Is he even anywhere close to being a hall of famer?
> 
> Would you have an issue if people said Griffin will definately be better than Jermaine O'Neal?
> 
> Bosh has done nothing yet to seperate himself from either of these players (in their respective primes).


I do not think you understand my point at all. If someone is "whole lot" better than Brand than yes, he would be in the HOF.

If you want to say someone that will "absolutely" be better than a certain player, he needs to be better than him by quite a margin. There are people who argues that JO and Brand are better than Bosh and vice versa, at the end of the day you just can't say with any certainty which player is actually better.



> You're logic falls apart when you assume that just because Duncan/Garnett/Dirk/etc... are the only PF's better than Bosh, than any PF better than Bosh must be in that group. There is plenty of room in between.


You really missed the point. I am listing those players because they are the guys that are considered better than Bosh at the moment. By looking at what they have accomplished, one should realize that it takes quite a bit to surpass Bosh as a player which in return makes the statement "Blake Griffin will absolutely be better than Chris Bosh" seem rather ridiculous. Let's put it this way, for Griffin to be even be considered in Bosh's league, he needs to be a perennial allstar and he will need a lot more to separate himself from Bosh. There are only a handful of guys that have entered the league in quite a while that deserves a prediction like the one you just made and I'm afraid Blake Griffin isn't someone that falls into that category.



> Would you have an issue if people said Griffin will definately be better than Jermaine O'Neal?
> 
> Bosh has done nothing yet to seperate himself from either of these players (in their respective primes).


That's why they fall in the same category in my list? And yes, I do have a problem if somebody comes out and say that he will be *a lot better* than Elton Brand or Jermaine O'neal. Because again, those prediction start with 20/10 and I don't see that being certain with Blake Griffin.


----------



## MLKG (Aug 25, 2003)

seifer0406 said:


> If you want to say someone that will "absolutely" be better than a certain player, he needs to be better than him by quite a margin. There are people who argues that JO and Brand are better than Bosh and vice versa, at the end of the day you just can't say with any certainty which player is actually better.


No. All it means is that person has no doubts about who the better player will be. I have no doubt that Chris Paul is, and always will be, a better player than Deron Williams, but that doesn't mean the seperation is huge.

Why can't you say which player is better. If you watch them play you should be able to have an opinion on that.



> That's why they fall in the same category in my list? And yes, I do have a problem if somebody comes out and say that he will be *a lot better* than Elton Brand or Jermaine O'neal. Because again, those prediction start with 20/10 and I don't see that being certain with Blake Griffin.


You are hung up on numbers. Who cares about 20/10? Clarence Weatherspoon almost put up 20/10 one year.

Rasheed Wallace is one of the best power forwards of the last decade and has never averaged 20 points OR 10 rebounds.


----------



## gi0rdun (May 31, 2007)

Griffin will be at a slight disadvantage since he won't be able to utilize his speed as LeBron does since he has a slight stutter in his dribble but no doubt one of the more underrated athletes for people who haven't really been paying attention to the draft.


----------



## seifer0406 (Jun 8, 2003)

MLKG said:


> No. All it means is that person has no doubts about who the better player will be. I have no doubt that Chris Paul is, and always will be, a better player than Deron Williams, but that doesn't mean the seperation is huge.
> 
> Why can't you say which player is better. If you watch them play you should be able to have an opinion on that.


Because he has never played in the NBA. You are comparing an unknown with a proven player, that's not the same as comparing 2 guys at the same level. I have already explained why it's unreasonable to be certain, however, you are entitled to your opinion, I'm just telling you why it's likely to be wrong.



> You are hung up on numbers. Who cares about 20/10? Clarence Weatherspoon almost put up 20/10 one year.
> 
> Rasheed Wallace is one of the best power forwards of the last decade and has never averaged 20 points OR 10 rebounds.


Numbers are an important part of critiquing a player. It is common knowledge that most PFs aspire to average 20/10 as it is considered a major milestone. Again, since nobody knows where Blake Griffin will end up and where he goes from there, numbers is pretty much the only way to rate him as a prospect. If Rasheed never went to Detriot his "greatness" would diminish drastically.


----------



## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

Lebron is easily the best all-round athlete in the NBA, it's not even close. What separates him from guys like Iguodala or Smith is the strength, his ability to finish in traffic, take hits and balance is uncanny.

Griffin doesn't have the same quickness and speed which makes him less dynamic. He will still be one of the best pure athletes in the league, Lebron is not a fair comparison for anyone right now.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Should speed and quickness be lumped under athleticism? I dont know, Vince was never the quickest or fastest player in the league and even at age 33, he's slower than most players in the league yet it would be hard pressed to find 10 guys that are more athletic than him on the court. There are things he can do athletically that Bron can't pull off.


----------



## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

What do you consider Usain Bolt, a car ?


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

A really fast guy or do you mean an athlete? Even Albert Haynesworth can be called an athlete.


----------



## croco (Feb 14, 2005)

HB said:


> A really fast guy or do you mean an athlete? Even Albert Haynesworth can be called an athlete.


Of course they are athletes, that's not even debatable. How could anyone exclude speed and quickness from the definition of athleticism ? Albert Haynesworth is a pretty darn athletic guy as well. He isn't some fat 350 lbs guy who happens to be reasonably tall and lucked into playing football.

Being athletic includes more than the ability to jump high or bench weights.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Well in that case, when I am comparing Blake to Bron athletically, I am talking about leaping prowess and finishing ability.


----------



## Jonathan Watters (Jul 20, 2002)

What about Tyrus Thomas? How is he not the most athletic player in the league?


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

He's definitely not more athletic than Bron, Dwight and Smith. He's in the Igoudala level of athleticism.


----------



## remy23 (Aug 15, 2002)

HB said:


> Lol Lebron doesn't jump higher than Blake. Did you forget he dunked the ball so hard and jumped so high, he actually hit his head on the backboard. As for stronger, well Bron's been in the league what, 4 to 5 years now? He's seen the best nutritionists and training equipment in sports. Lets see how Blake does when he gets the same opportunities. Blake's also pretty quick for a big guy, Bron's probably quicker I'll give you that. As for Balance, thats also debatable especially since Blake's pet move is that quick spin or pirouette move he does so often.
> 
> And seriously, watch games, better yet watch clips, Blake Griffin is insanely athletic. He can sky just as high as Bron and Dwight.


LeBron's head goes over the rim (yes over it). So while hitting your head on the backboard is nice, LeBron's done that plenty of the times but the time he actually hit his head on the rim > hitting it on the backboard.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Did you see the final clip I put up, where Blake was basically at rim level?


----------



## Tragedy (Dec 9, 2002)

HB said:


> In 2-3 years time, Blake will be averaging 20/12 seasons.


*golf clap*


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

Haha I was pretty much the first one on Blake's bangwagon.


----------



## HB (May 1, 2004)

This thread is full of guys who should be eating some serious crow right now.


----------

